Natalee Case Discussion #762 6/30 - 7/6/08

[klaasend]

Things are usually black and white to me.  Either I believe the person or I don't.  That's how I am when I view things.  I feel the same way as ******* does about Patrick.  There are people who don't.  We all have different thoughts about the subject.

This has gone on since yesterday and I'm tired of reading about it and I don't want to see fighting.  I say let's move on a drop the subject.

That's your right...and nothing wrong with that at all.

It's easy for you to say drop the subject though...you're not the one that's been called a stupid, crazy, lying wheasel for no reason by a mod.

It is not easy for me to say drop the subject.  I said it after you defended yourself in a post. I'm tired of reading about this drama between you and *******.

I'm the one that's being called a liar etc. by a mod for no reason. I have every right to stand up for myself. If you don't like it....skip the posts. TIA

GBMW - San is also a Moderator here at SM and as a Moderator kindly asked you to drop it in this thread.  I, as Administrator am also asking you to kindly drop it in this thread.

Do not attempt again to tell a Moderator or Administrator to simply skip your post if they don't like it.

A moderator here called me stupid, crazy, was rude & implied I was a liar; without no foundation or good reason whatsoever...and that is acceptable? What kind of posterworld do you live in?
For the record: I didn't know San was a moderator. But I have a right to defend myself when I'm accused of such things. And guess what? I don't care whether a poster has a problem with me defending myself or a moderator. And a good moderator would have reacted differently...JMO.
 
Some here (and you in particular) seem to have a problem with me...I wonder why? Other posters get to post disgusting, way too disgusting posts without ever hearing a word & I get warnings from you over defending my own (or like the last time; asking a completely normal / decent question).
Don't worry; I've had enough. Please de activate my account. TIA

If you insist.  Yes GBMW it's widely known accross the internet what a horrible and unfair person I am. 

[Helen Back]

Hans van Deutekom represented Aruba at a Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, held in
Geneva, on May 7, 2007.


http://www.minbuza.nl/en/news/speeches_and_articles,2007/05/Introductory-Statement.html

That article is about the only thing I have been able to find on Mr. Hans van DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM.   Perhaps some of our Dutch posters can help us out with additional info on him.

 

[klaasend]

Hans van Deutekom represented Aruba at a Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, held in
Geneva, on May 7, 2007.


http://www.minbuza.nl/en/news/speeches_and_articles,2007/05/Introductory-Statement.html

That article is about the only thing I have been able to find on Mr. Hans van DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM.   Perhaps some of our Dutch posters can help us out with additional info on him.

 

Try searching for Frans van Deutekom instead of Hans 

[always 1]

Klassend, all of the Croes family tree can be found at (I hope I get this right) http://www.geocities.com/genaruba/

[caesu]

or

F. A. P. M. van Deutekom

[KarmaRoundUp]

I just think it would be wonderful if we started anonymously mailing DTKM bars of soap to wash his hands.  Do you think he'd get the message?   

 

I always wondered why Jossy had high regard for Karin "woman of the year" Janssen and Van der stratten.  In light of their blatant participation in the cover up, I just have not been able to understand this.
If what CLW says is true about DIRTYKOM, DEUTEKOM, placing restraints on the investigation and calling the shots, it would sort of fit with what we witnessed, and might explain Jossy 's support of these two.  Surely Jossy has been aware of DIRTYKOM/ DEUTEKOM.  What power could this guy have over other prosecutors?  Loss of job?  On Aruba, I would say that's no big loss....more like a ticket home.

Might explain the 180 we saw Mos do..............he came out guns blazing and had evidence of Natalee's death.  Then maybe he got the "memo".  Perhaps Mr. Hans van DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM made Mos give that stupid letter of exoneration to Julia.  How do Mr. DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM and Julia know each other? 

Maybe DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM is a big customer of the escort business.

I never understood that either.Maybe Deutekom is renSkank's babiessss daddy?

[MumInOhio]

From my notes…Lalo and Guisette are Betico’s daughters, Nizana and Armin are brother and sister and I am pretty sure Damilice is Jossy’s daughter…Came across the Coronel name twice this week and need to go back and find where and with whom it was connected…

Lalo Croes | FacebookNizana Solognier · Damilice Mansur Damilice Mansur
· Desiree Coronel Desiree Coronel · Dana Ber Dana Ber · Armin E.
Solognier Armin E. Solognier ...
www.facebook.com/people/Lalo_Croes/608906702 - 17k - Cached - Similar
pages

Lalo Croes is married to Michael Saladin, an American living in
Aruba, not sure if he is jail! And Lalo's sister Guisette and Michael 
Saladin are the vocalists in the Mi Dushi Band!!!

Lalo Croes, and Guisette Croes are Betico Croes' daughters. Is Armin related? (Armin’s mother’s maiden name is Croes/Croeze and have seen it spelt both ways.)

[Pita]

Hans van Deutekom represented Aruba at a Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, held in
Geneva, on May 7, 2007.


http://www.minbuza.nl/en/news/speeches_and_articles,2007/05/Introductory-Statement.html

That article is about the only thing I have been able to find on Mr. Hans van DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM.   Perhaps some of our Dutch posters can help us out with additional info on him.

 

Try searching for Frans van Deutekom instead of Hans 

LOL Klaas.  Can you correct my error please. ....I posted Hans instead of Frans in my post.   

[klaasend]

Klassend, all of the Croes family tree can be found at (I hope I get this right) http://www.geocities.com/genaruba/

Not sure if that's ALL of the Croes family.

[Pita]

Does anybody know what this says?

Siman pasa Sr. Michael Saladin a wordo aresta. For di famianan di Sr. Saladin nos por compronde cu e Embahada Americano na Curacao a comunica cu Fiscal Deutekom na Aruba tocante e caso di Sr. Michael Saladin. Sr Saladin, ta un ciudadano Americano, residencia na Aruba cu status legal. Pa 24 ora no ta conoci e detayenan exacto di e combersacion aki, pero si por bisa, cu e Embahador Americano, NO a wordo informa formalmente of informalmente tocante encarcelacion di e ciudadano Americano en cuestion, cual ta un obligacion di un pais según leynan Estado-unidense manera nos por compronde.

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:GmYzxUC2uRYJ:www.24ora.com/content/blogcategory/6/8/9/1251/+deutekom+aruba&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=30&gl=us

[klaasend]

Pita - I corrected your original post but not the quoted ones because then they won't make any sense.  I think people will figure it out once they get down to your post about correcting it, lol 

[always 1]

I have only read part of it Klassend, but I recognized part of the names.  It kind of reads like the Bible - so and so beget so and so....

[Pita]

http://solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=119

[caesu]

Thanks to Vms…posted in Shango…not sure if I can copy!  No!..LOL

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2886.msg396631#new


« Reply #749 on: Today at 10:28:19 AM »

FRANK CROES ELECTRO/AUTO PARTS & HARDWARE http://www.arubachamber.com/registry/registry_result.afp?KeyValue=19631

   

OK...now we are getting somewhere I think.So Frank is daddy Croes and rudy,hendrick and whoever are brothers.

very good find of Vms there!
i don't read that Shango thread much. i should read more there.

father of the Croes brothers is indeed Francisco.

Betico Croes was the greatest statesman Aruba has ever known. He was
born on January 25th 1938 in Santa Cruz, Aruba, from Parents Francisco and Maria Louisa Croes.

http://www.enjoyaruba.com/beticocroes/index.htm

and now i know that Hendrik Croes is Hendrik Seferino. i knew his initials were H. S.

and Mario Arcaldo, could that be an older brother? second from Betico?
doesn't necessarily all have to be brothers in that list. might be just Hendrik and Rudy (and late Betico).
but it would fit in the timeline of the birthdates if they al were brothers.
then there is also a Thomas Johannes and a female Regina Filomena.

i wonder what top-jobs they've all gotten.

[always 1]

Youre right though, Klassend, I should not have said "all" because I dont know that to be true. 

[Pita]

This article seems to tie in with Caps declaration of Deutekom being a behavior specialist.

April 17, 2007

Need di un Centre Orthopedagogico

snipped from article...

Na Aruba we know a group di hobennan cu serious problem due di na problemanan conduct of internal and external hard Hopi kendenan ta pa dune guide. Hobennan cu tin problema grave di conducta ta core peliger di bin den contacto cu husticia pa actonan criminal. Hobennan cu tin serious problem di ta conduct dangerous core di bin den contact cu husticia pa Acton criminal. Caracteristicanan di hobennan cu problema di conducta ta por ehempel: Caracteristicanan di hobennan cu problem di ta conduct by ehempel:

* actitud agresivo; aggressive attitude;
* mal comportacion den publico; comportacion den bad public;
* manera grafiti, haci uso di droga den publico, etc. graffiti waytoward         drug use di den public, etc..
* Formacion di gang; Training Di Gang;
* Hortamento; Hortamento;
* Joyriding; Joyriding;
* Vandalismo; Vandalism;
* Prostitucion; Prostitution;
* Abuso di droga of alcohol; Abuse of alcohol di drugs;
* Intimidacion di otronan. Intimidation Di otronan.

snipped....

Mr. Frans van Deutekom, Fiscal (pa hubentud)  di Ministerio Publico ta di opinion cu den caso di delincuencia hubenil, especialmente den casonan hopi serio, tin necesidad na yudansa profesional intramural den un setting structura, cual ta exactamente e tipo di ayudo cu un Centro Orthopedagogico lo brinda. Frans van Deutekom, Prosecutor (pa hubentud) Ministerio Publico ta di di di case reviews cu den hubenil crime, especially serious Hopi den Cason, tin need na yudansa intramural give a professional setting structure, which t exactly kind and helped ea di un Centro Orthopedagogico it provides.

Instancianan profesional y Ministerio Publico ta constata cu actualmente no tin suficiente servicio profesional. Instancianan professional and Ministerio Publico ta cu notes currently not enough tin professional service. Hobennan ta cana pariba pabou riba caya y ta mustra comportacion criminal. Hobennan ta cana Paribas pabou riba Cay and ta mustra comportacion criminal. KIA no ta un bon alternativa. KIA ta not a good alternative. Hobennan y comunidad ta keda desfuncional. Hobennan and community ta keda desfuncional.........

 http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.minszi.aw/04170701noticia.htm&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=4&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Ddeutekom%2Baruba%26start%3D100%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4GGIC_enUS209US212%26sa%3DN

[Helen Back]

Hans van Deutekom represented Aruba at a Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, held in
Geneva, on May 7, 2007.


http://www.minbuza.nl/en/news/speeches_and_articles,2007/05/Introductory-Statement.html

That article is about the only thing I have been able to find on Mr. Hans van DIRTYKOM/DEUTEKOM.   Perhaps some of our Dutch posters can help us out with additional info on him.

 

Try searching for Frans van Deutekom instead of Hans 

 ::MonkeyHaHa::Thanks, Klaas.  Yes we have been talking about Mr. FRANS van DEUTEKOM. 

I'm having a brain cramp and spreading MISINFORMATION!  I got my Hans and Frans mixed up.  Must've been thinking of SNL!

 

ps i hate this laptop

[Dihannah1]

Things are usually black and white to me.  Either I believe the person or I don't.  That's how I am when I view things.  I feel the same way as ******* does about Patrick.  There are people who don't.  We all have different thoughts about the subject.

This has gone on since yesterday and I'm tired of reading about it and I don't want to see fighting.  I say let's move on a drop the subject.

That's your right...and nothing wrong with that at all.

It's easy for you to say drop the subject though...you're not the one that's been called a stupid, crazy, lying wheasel for no reason by a mod.

HOW DOES THIS FIT INTO THE NATALEE THREAD?

My intentions were not start a fight.  Yes, I was emotional because I've seen so many people ran off here in the past several  months for people bashing those with there own opinions.  As RED said,  freedom of speech is our God given right.   This topic is important to the NH case, as it prevents people with many points of views from feeling comfortable to speak out, hence, defeating the purpose of why we are here.  All points of views should be welcomed and I for one appreciate GBMW for they contribute, such as other Dutch posters, whether you agree or not.  I happen to agree with GBMW about Patrick.  Yes everybody has been through alot and seen alot, so may have a distrust of some people.  But remember, no matter how much research we do, there is NOBODY who knows everything!  I have no doubt Beth and Dave know more than we do, and there feelings should be respected, as well as those who bring new ideas and observations here. The Dutch posters have brought something we NEVER had before, and that is thanks to Patrick's work.  Bottom line is,  the Dutch posters are here to HELP and Patrick was pantamount to exposing Joran, by any means.  People say they still love Peter, but they don't respect his decision to use Patrick for what he accomplished?  That is sort of speaking out of both sides of there mouths.

Take Destiny for instance,  we all love her because she has guts to make the calls and I greatly appreciate that and love her to peices!  But what if somebody else didn't agree with her?  She has an open enough mind to take others feelings into consideration, without the need to boost herself on a pedestal and put others down for there "lack" of work in the case. Would they get bashed or banned if they mentioned they disagreed with what she does?   Freedom of speech?  Why did people get banned for supporting the case, for offending a Mod?  We are ALL here for one GOAL, no matter how we get to that goal.  I would just like to see more respect, especially from Mods. I notice after Lisa and I stopped, Obs was allowed to continue defending himself on and on, again bashing others opinions.  Fair?   My problem is not with what Obs has done for the case, it's how he feels he is the most important, hardworking person here, seldom giving others credit.  In my opinio, the hardest working MOD is Klaas and though I am surprised she continues, I pray she never leaves, as she mentioned quitting.  Please don't go, you keep doing what your doing!  We love you!   This case has GOT to be solved and I have a great deal of respect for those who refuse to give up!

I love the MOnkeys and will continue to agree to disagree, but will never bash for others opinions, unless I see an unjustice by ANY Mod.  If you want respect, then you need to return it.  ONE last word,  it's sad that any one person tries to take ALL the credit when so MANY have worked SO hard!

[Destiny]

Ok will try to post this again...when I emailed my contact in Aruba regarding a question on Frans for Lala's...I was told in email back that FRANS van DEUTEKOM was a Prosecutor and a *FISCAL*....I never could figure out what a damn *fiscal* is...so I did a little internet romping and came up with this....might be totally off base...don't know...

Destiny

[PDF]
12-09-2007 Body 2.indd
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
Deportivo Frans Figaroa. na Noord, dianan 8 y 9. di September ultimo, a ...... y Fiscal Mr . Deutekom,. kier pa un di dos rapport. siquiatrico. ...
solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=242 - Similar pages
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ALSO ON FISCAL:

As from 1st July, 2003, Aruba introduced the New Fiscal Regime (NFR) which abolishes its offshore regime as such. See Offshore Legal and Tax Regimes and Domestic Corporate Taxes for a full description of the NFR.

Companies formed prior to the introduction of the NFR are 'grandfathered' into the NFR, with existing privileges continued until the end of 2007, meaning an effective tax rate of 2.4% to 3% for foreign-owned companies.

The NFR contains a specific exemption for the AEC (see below), although the exemption is disapplied in the event that the AEC generates profits from illegal activities, as defined under Aruba criminal law. In such case all of the AEC's profits earned from the day of incorporation will be liable to profit tax at the rate of 35%.

However, as from January 1, 2006, Aruba has introduced a revised tax regime for these companies, which offers three possibilities to AEC companies:

    * The AEC can continue its activities as a fully taxed corporation, subject to tax at the rate of 35%.
    * An AEC can remain exempt if it acts as a holding or financing company (but not as a bank) with foreign subsidiaries subject to a profit tax of at least 17.5% on at least 95% of dividends. Investment activities can also remain exempt, excluding real estate. Licensing of intellectual property is also permitted.
    * An AEC can elect to be a pass-through entity. The income of a “pass-through AEC” would accrue directly to the AEC’s shareholder(s) and would be subject to tax at the shareholder level. When electing for transparency status an AEC has to disclose the identity of its shareholder(s) to the local tax authorities, and has to file its financial statements with the tax authorities in Aruba within six months of the financial year-end.

[johan555]

Dihannah1: People say they still love Peter, but they do not respect his decision to use Patrick for what he accomplished?

Dihannah1 the only way to catch a criminal of this caliber is to use another criminal.
Then he will  talk, because they speak the same language.