Lively Case Discussion #531 10/11 - 10/15/2006

[San]

Well I wonder where Johns and Abrams are? Are they working? I could envision a pay-off within a job as well?

Last FOM said... was that they weren't working and couldn't find a job...

How do we know if FOM is being told the truth.

[mrs. red]

Well I wonder where Johns and Abrams are? Are they working? I could envision a pay-off within a job as well?

Wouldn't you be happy with a Payoff and Job Security.  Notice how we have never heard from the other guard.  Only one was doing the talking.

I remember MJ's comment one evening saying they will all burn for what they did.  If I'm not mistaken is said hot lava burn .

did he say this on Greta??

[nonesuche]

For such a small island, why is it so hard to gather current information? It's like some big cloak lays over it and everyone keeps secrets?

hence my happy meal analogy....

remember when julia, AG and NL used to come on here and say that everyone on that island knew everyone else and they all knew about each other's business.... I think that may be the one shred of truth that we have heard.  It's why I no longer feel sorry for the "innocent Aruban people"... they all know, each and everyone of them what happened and they stand by and allow it... IMO

oh yes I remember and you're completely correct about that one. I remember feeling jerked around with one mind game right after another, it seems to be that group's speciality. Reminds me of my ex, believe what I say and not what I do?

[mrs. red]

Well I wonder where Johns and Abrams are? Are they working? I could envision a pay-off within a job as well?

Last FOM said... was that they weren't working and couldn't find a job...

How do we know if FOM is being told the truth.

Excellent point.. we all know "big people lie"

[San]

hot lava burn  

Let's change this topic then ! YIKES !

O/T but here is a youtube of Streisand's "moment" that CBB witnessed, no need to turn up the sound, her voice carries  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izF5Z-l-FOM

I would have said the same thing.

[San]

Well I wonder where Johns and Abrams are? Are they working? I could envision a pay-off within a job as well?

Wouldn't you be happy with a Payoff and Job Security.  Notice how we have never heard from the other guard.  Only one was doing the talking.

I remember MJ's comment one evening saying they will all burn for what they did.  If I'm not mistaken is said hot lava burn .

did he say this on Greta??

I think he might have mrs. red.  I just remember the comment.  Heck even my sister remembers what he said because every time she talks about Aruba she say remember what that man said

[nonesuche]

hot lava burn  

Let's change this topic then ! YIKES !

O/T but here is a youtube of Streisand's "moment" that CBB witnessed, no need to turn up the sound, her voice carries  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izF5Z-l-FOM

I would have said the same thing.

yep with a pistol for emphasis too  

[Angiex911dsptchr]

hot lava burn  

Let's change this topic then ! YIKES !

O/T but here is a youtube of Streisand's "moment" that CBB witnessed, no need to turn up the sound, her voice carries  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izF5Z-l-FOM

I would have said the same thing.

 ROFL San.. I can hear yah now!!  

[klaasend]

Does anyone have the license plate number for Deepak's car handy?  I know it's A-20xxxxx  ?

Want to check something, TIA.

[mrs. red]

Well I wonder where Johns and Abrams are? Are they working? I could envision a pay-off within a job as well?

Wouldn't you be happy with a Payoff and Job Security.  Notice how we have never heard from the other guard.  Only one was doing the talking.

I remember MJ's comment one evening saying they will all burn for what they did.  If I'm not mistaken is said hot lava burn .

did he say this on Greta??

I think he might have mrs. red.  I just remember the comment.  Heck even my sister remembers what he said because every time she talks about Aruba she say remember what that man said

I wonder if anyone has that transcript?? If anyone does, can they please post it???? TIA...

[nonesuche]

Well I'm off, have so much to do on Friday the 13th   going to try NOT to drive however  

Take care all !

[LilPuma]

Unfortunately, I don't see any nightmares in any of their futures.  I have seen no remorse, no expression of guilt nor any surprise.  The loss will not keep them awake.  They express anger and resentment.  Natalee is a nobody to them.  I do think they will feel fear.  They know we know.  They are proud of being clever and "winning".  But, they know people know.  Hopefully, they will always have to look over their shoulders....but it won't be from a guilty conscience.  IMO

I agree, Buckeye.  I don't think their consciences will "punish" them.  But knowing that many people either know they're guilty, believe they're guilty or at least know they were accused, will be a problem.  They will become the "usual suspects" if anyone ever disappears, if ever charges of rape and/or date rape drugs are made.  The smart women will wonder if it's true and keep their distance.  They'll be left with an occasional skank. (Can I use that word?)   The worst part is the powers that be in Aruba - whether government or criminal - know that these guys wreaked havoc on the island through stupidity and arrogance, and Paulus and his Slooties made it worse.  The economy - legal or illegal - has been hurt and the spotlight that's been put on them has been brutal for both the honest and dishonest people of Aruba.  People will remember them for that, even if publicly blaming Beth and Americans in general.  I only hope their lack of respect for Americans in this case has come through and US tourism will never again grace Aruba with it's US$$

[NM]

Has anyone seen the visit Aruba commercial on TV in the last few days?  Please, please, if you see it, take the time to look up the info for the program, the channel and the network (cable, satellite) and call or email to complain.  The best contact is the advertising dept., but the important thing is to just do it.  I have not received ANY return calls as promised in my quest to find out whether the commercials are national, which I suspect.  But I WILL be following up.

Susebear,
I just saw my 1st ones last night. On the Biography channel, during their Notorious series (notorious murders, guess an ad for aruba is fitting) and during the next show psyhic detectives.  I will be writingcontacting the Bio. channel which I think is part of A&E.  

morning Monkeys.

[LilPuma]

Has anyone seen the visit Aruba commercial on TV in the last few days?  Please, please, if you see it, take the time to look up the info for the program, the channel and the network (cable, satellite) and call or email to complain.  The best contact is the advertising dept., but the important thing is to just do it.  I have not received ANY return calls as promised in my quest to find out whether the commercials are national, which I suspect.  But I WILL be following up.

I have not seen one commerical that references Aruba... except for Capital One... and I haven't even seen that lately....

up here in the NE.. most ppl are traveling to Europe or Puerto Rico, the Dominican... Aruba hasn't been mentioned in a while there either... and I never allow anyone within my earshot not hear that it's one murdering island...

I've seen Aruba commercials on HGTV several times in the last week.  FYI.  I will shoot off an e-mail.

[LilPuma]

Well I'm off, have so much to do on Friday the 13th   going to try NOT to drive however  

Take care all !

I drove yesterday.  I was sitting at a stoplight and thought the little white things falling gently onto my windshield were there because there were window washers on the building to my right.  Thought the wind was blowing some suds.  I turned the corner, drove about two blocks and those darn suds were not only still hitting my windshield, but mucking up the street.  Then I got on Lake Shore Drive and started cursing those window washers because the suds were blowing and whirling and made the pavement wet and slippery.  Darn window washers.  

[klaasend]

Does anyone have the license plate number for Deepak's car handy?  I know it's A-20xxxxx  ?

Want to check something, TIA.

Nevermind - I found it, A-21917.  Not what I was looking for.

[msmarple]

Does anyone have the license plate number for Deepak's car handy?  I know it's A-20xxxxx  ?

Want to check something, TIA.

Nevermind - I found it, A-21917.  Not what I was looking for.

You running a title search - in Aruba?   Seriously, wonder if they have something like DMV ...

[mrs. red]

Well I'm off, have so much to do on Friday the 13th   going to try NOT to drive however  

Take care all !

I drove yesterday.  I was sitting at a stoplight and thought the little white things falling gently onto my windshield were there because there were window washers on the building to my right.  Thought the wind was blowing some suds.  I turned the corner, drove about two blocks and those darn suds were not only still hitting my windshield, but mucking up the street.  Then I got on Lake Shore Drive and started cursing those window washers because the suds were blowing and whirling and made the pavement wet and slippery.  Darn window washers.  

I thought you were going to say it was snowing...

Friday the 13th is a lucky, lucky day for me... (is that weird??)

[SunFreak2]

Every time I read that Paul spent 3 years in Holland studying to be a judge and then failed to become one, it just doesn't sound right and  I wonder:
1.  Why wouldn't the entire family move back to Holland during that time?  Anita had been a teacher in Holland - why did she and the boys remain in Aruba?  It seems most of their relatives are still in The Netherlands and they have no family in Aruba so what was the real reason for Paul to abandon them?
2.  Why would a person need to go to Holland to learn about becoming a Judge in Aruba?  Where does one go to class ?   How could a lawyer who was familiar with Dutch law and practiced and taught law in Aruba, for over 10 years, fail to become a judge?  I thought that judges were appointed, based on their performances as lawyers, served a brief apprenticeship then became the omnipotent bearers of justice in a country with no jury system and no in-court reporting.
3.  How could Paul be a substitute judge in the Aruban court if he was away studying in Holland and had not achieved the knowledge required to be a full judge? What kind of wacky legal system does Aruba have that a lawyer can preside over a court of law and render decisions when he is not qualified to do so?  
4.  Why would Paul know that he failed to become a judge and keep that
information from his own wife knowing that she was on TV declaring he was one after their son is implicated in a possible murder?  How honest does that make Paul look?   How ridiculous is Anita's claim that Paul is a man of integrity if he could not even admit the truth of his failure to his own wife when the eyes of the world were upon them and their son was being branded a liar?
5. Why was Paul sworn in as a lawyer in Aruba in late 2005, if he was a practicing lawyer already? What job did Paul have before May 29, 2005?
It isn't possible that a substitute judge in Aruba, could not be a practicing lawyer in Aruba, is it?
6.  Why do the VDS supporters fail to explain these oddities and overlook Paul's huge lie?   There must be a simple explanation that would make sense of all this conflicting data and make Paul look like the honourable man they claim him to be.

ANSWERS
1. The training program for a judgeship is 3 years.  During this time they function as a justice of the peace and are allowed to marry people and adjudicate simple matters like traffic court.  The judges-in-training
only go to the NL for 1 year.  Paulus was in Holland for only 1 year.  I imagine that the kids didn't want to move especially Joran for his "senior year" in HS.
2.  The Netherlands controls the judicial system in Aruba.  The Queen appoints the Judges.  Although Paulus went to law school in the NL, it is a different school system than our traditional law school (as far as I could tell in my research back when). I think the main reason they have the judge training program is b/c their law school is so different.
3.  Like I said he was a justice of the peace while in training.  Perhaps that is what they an alternate judge.
4. Paulus received his notice of failure to progress in his training program in March 2005 which is supposedly when he returned home from the NL.  Knowing Anita, she probably knew he failed out back then.  But like she lives in her own little cocoon world of unreality, she choose to beleive that her hubby was still a judge, just like she believes her sporter is a delicious boy.
5.  Although Paulus was a lawyer thru his schooling, he had always worked in the justice ministeries offices.  I don't believe he had ever practiced law independently.  He started out in Aruba doing something (I can't remember), and they weren't satisfied so they stuck him with writing & reading the legal contracts for the island.
6.  SPIN, SPIN, SPIN - Aruba the big washing machine.

[LilPuma]

Every time I read that Paul spent 3 years in Holland studying to be a judge and then failed to become one, it just doesn't sound right and  I wonder:
1.  Why wouldn't the entire family move back to Holland during that time?  Anita had been a teacher in Holland - why did she and the boys remain in Aruba?  It seems most of their relatives are still in The Netherlands and they have no family in Aruba so what was the real reason for Paul to abandon them?
2.  Why would a person need to go to Holland to learn about becoming a Judge in Aruba?  Where does one go to class ?   How could a lawyer who was familiar with Dutch law and practiced and taught law in Aruba, for over 10 years, fail to become a judge?  I thought that judges were appointed, based on their performances as lawyers, served a brief apprenticeship then became the omnipotent bearers of justice in a country with no jury system and no in-court reporting.
3.  How could Paul be a substitute judge in the Aruban court if he was away studying in Holland and had not achieved the knowledge required to be a full judge? What kind of wacky legal system does Aruba have that a lawyer can preside over a court of law and render decisions when he is not qualified to do so?  
4.  Why would Paul know that he failed to become a judge and keep that
information from his own wife knowing that she was on TV declaring he was one after their son is implicated in a possible murder?  How honest does that make Paul look?   How ridiculous is Anita's claim that Paul is a man of integrity if he could not even admit the truth of his failure to his own wife when the eyes of the world were upon them and their son was being branded a liar?
5. Why was Paul sworn in as a lawyer in Aruba in late 2005, if he was a practicing lawyer already? What job did Paul have before May 29, 2005?
It isn't possible that a substitute judge in Aruba, could not be a practicing lawyer in Aruba, is it?
6.  Why do the VDS supporters fail to explain these oddities and overlook Paul's huge lie?   There must be a simple explanation that would make sense of all this conflicting data and make Paul look like the honourable man they claim him to be.

These are all good questions Leslie.  Something is not right here.  I have always wondered why he was sworn in when he was a lawyer already.

I think Joran said he had lived in Aruba his whole life, so I'd guess that the Sloots just wanted to stay in their little island paradise, nice weather, small town environment, and they can get away with murder because they have friends in the police department, prosecutor's office and judiciary.  They are probably involved in some of the illegal dealings down there and earning extra cash.  

Re:  Paulus - IIRC, you don't have to be a lawyer to be a judge.  Doesn't make much sense to me but they believe in that system.  So he may have finished law school and he did get the judge training, even if he didn't get the "proper recommendations" to become a judge.  He didn't tell his wife because he's scum.  Dishonest scum, which is even lower.   As for Anita, she's one of many women in the world living in denial, as are those who ignore the dishonesty, however big or small, and defend One Ugly Island and it's inhabitants.  For me, I'd take any of the donkeys on the island over any of the Slooties.