Natalee Case Discussion #741 3/7 - 3/10/08

[katrien]

http://www.crimesite.nl/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=6640

           Highlights of memorable ' Holloway-week '

**snip**

The above is rough tranny.

This is another funny, sarcastic piece.
They're reviewing the past week, what happened on all the Dutch TV-shows and Patrick's interview on TeleAruba.

Is it possible that the reporters of Nieuwe Revu, Poentje and perhaps some Trollen from Fok have contact with eachother?

[GBMW]

Why didn't Pontje go to the police with it right away instead of putting a teaser on the air for MOS to hear?  He is not any better.  DeVries showed ALE the tapes first, did Pontius Pontje?  What is his connection to Joran?
[/quote]

Poentje didn't show the material beforehand; and if he's so concerned about this case why didn't he RAN to the police with this tape / information himself? He's being negative about Patrick (for keeping this information to himself) but he's not any better indeed.

Poentje - Joran: no idea
Poentje - Patrick: have know each other for years (according to Peter R. de Vries)

[/quote]
Patrick does mention money for Daury in the car, isn't that how he gets info about him?
[/quote]

Maybe; or maybe Joran thought he could ask for money because Patrick talked about it?

[/quote]
When Pontje says he is not going to air it, why does he then tell what he is not going to air?  If you talk about it and don't show it, all that is told is your biased (he shows this on his zorpia site) opinion of someone you don't like and are trying to discredit.  Anyone smell a skunk?
[/quote]

Poentje is only going to leave out the 'dump the body' part because Hans Mos asked him this...and Poentje says he will do what the OM Aruba are asking him to do (to help the investigation)...but then he gives out the information. He did mention though he would check with his lawyer if it could be broadcasted in the Netherlands. He's not unwilling to show it himself; it's just that Hans Mos asked him to bleep out that part (because of the ongoing investigation)

OM Aruba has stated that none of the things Patrick has said changes anything concerning the statements / confessions Joran has made...they're seperate things.

[cubbeegirl]

O/T

Does anyone remember from before the crash(es), one of our monkeys signed up with and went on a search woth Texas ES?

Are there any monkeys who have done that and have posted about it?

TIA

I might be wrong but I thought it was SunnyinTX.

Yes, SunnyinTX and I think Beachwego went with her at the time.  Also more recently, Oldfart, Sam and others I can't remember at the moment went on search.  Everyone that has participated in a TES search has said how happy they did. 

Good morning monkeys.....I was trying to remember who it was that went with Sunny......

Klaas.... regarding the picture at CNC's that has been the subject of discussion the past couple of pages. Didn't we determine early on that the picture was taken during some kind of celebration of some kind and that they were playing a game of some sort during that shot??
Don't know, just got up and haven't even finished my first cup of coffee yet, and my head is pounding , I can't seem to get rid of this crud.
For some reason I seem to remember that maybe we found that picture on CNC's web page and there was an explanation that they were playing some sort of game or some such .........

[Rob]

O/T

Does anyone remember from before the crash(es), one of our monkeys signed up with and went on a search woth Texas ES?

Are there any monkeys who have done that and have posted about it?

TIA

I might be wrong but I thought it was SunnyinTX.

Yes, SunnyinTX and I think Beachwego went with her at the time.  Also more recently, Oldfart, Sam and others I can't remember at the moment went on search.  Everyone that has participated in a TES search has said how happy they did. 

Naomi Arnette IIRC in Illinois.

[katrien]

Poentje is only going to leave out the 'dump the body' part because Hans Mos asked him this...and Poentje says he will do what the OM Aruba are asking him to do (to help the investigation)...but then he gives out the information.

Not just bleep the names like the OM Aruba asked but leave out the "dump the body part" completely?

Jeah wright, I understand.

[Bearlyhere]

O/T

Does anyone remember from before the crash(es), one of our monkeys signed up with and went on a search woth Texas ES?

Are there any monkeys who have done that and have posted about it?

TIA

I might be wrong but I thought it was SunnyinTX.

Yes, SunnyinTX and I think Beachwego went with her at the time.  Also more recently, Oldfart, Sam and others I can't remember at the moment went on search.  Everyone that has participated in a TES search has said how happy they did. 

Thanks, Klaas.  I remembered the thread but could not for the life of me figure out what came after the S_ in her name.

[Jo-An]

I thought taping someone without them knowing it, was illegal in Aruba? 

[GBMW]

also Poentjes says: (hiding) in Germany? - and Patrick says yes.
but elsewhere Poentje says Patrick said hiding in The Netherlands.

but rumours were Joran was in hiding in Germany.
is Patrick only telling the rumours or does he know something himself?

When Joran was called in the Jensen show; the transfer of calling sounded normal. Normally when you call abroad the sound is different...but maybe I'm mistaken. Or he was in the Netherlands for visit to his grandma

[KarmaRoundUp]

Quotes from an interview with Poentje:

Concering the quotes around 'dumping the body': it will be left out of the broadcast of tomorrow. Poentje promised Hans Mos (Hans Mos asked him to bleep it out; Poentje said he would leave it out completely).

According to Poentje this is what Patrick claimed:
BEFORE the airing of the Peter R. de Vriesshow Joran called Patrick. Joran asked him for 2000 Euros. He needed that money to give it to the person who helped him with dumping the body. Patrick gave the money to Joran.

Patrick then start taling about that it's easy now...just follow where the money has been sent....besides I know who it is.
Poentje: Then Patrick says were he lives, in what part of Holland he lives.
The reporter asks Poentje: Does he (Patrick) mentions a name?
Poentje: he doesn't say a name; but he mentions where he lives.
Reporter: He knows him?
Poentje: He knows him very well. Patrick also says he's hiding with Joran in the Netherlands.

This is a little weird:
* If Joran has so much money for weed, gambling, lending money to friends etc. why would he ask for money?
* Why would Joran ask for money from Patrick at that time? Maybe he asked him AFTER he confessed but BEFORE he knew he was set up??

Maybe this is information that shouldn't have leaked? But if this was going on & the police now about this....why did it take so long before Patrick was at the OM in Aruba for questioning?
And I wonder if Peter R. de Vries knows about this? Because if these quotes are correct, if Patrick actually said them, then it's a bit weird that Peter R. de Vries is laughing it off with remarks concerning translation / interpretation etc.

Why didn't Pontje go to the police with it right away instead of putting a teaser on the air for MOS to hear?  He is not any better.  DeVries showed ALE the tapes first, did Pontius Pontje?  What is his connection to Joran?
Patrick does mention money for Daury in the car, isn't that how he gets info about him?

When Pontje says he is not going to air it, why does he then tell what he is not going to air?  If you talk about it and don't show it, all that is told is your biased (he shows this on his zorpia site) opinion of someone you don't like and are trying to discredit.  Anyone smell a skunk?

What if Patrick went on the air and said. "Joran said.......," and we never saw the tapes?  Isn't this what Poentje is doing?  Is this going to be heresay?

I had ears to hear and eyes to see Joran, all this smoke and mirors doesn't change a thing about Joran, imo.  He intended to make bucks selling drugs.  I think that is why he didn't mention any other names, he wanted to look like a tough guy so he could sell drugs in a big way.  Why did he even bother to apply to college, do you need a degree to sell pot now?

Another thing, if Joran didn't know what he was saying because he was high, then how does he know he didn't kill Natalee, wasn't he high then, too?

Pontje's connection to joran is his 17 yo relative named Marriene or something like that.

[Bearlyhere]

http://www.crimesite.nl/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=6640

           Highlights of memorable ' Holloway-week '

**snip**

The above is rough tranny.

This is another funny, sarcastic piece.
They're reviewing the past week, what happened on all the Dutch TV-shows and Patrick's interview on TeleAruba.

Jo-An, your contribution to the cage is immeasurable.  Thanks.

                   

[Jo-An]

also Poentjes says: (hiding) in Germany? - and Patrick says yes.
but elsewhere Poentje says Patrick said hiding in The Netherlands.

but rumours were Joran was in hiding in Germany.
is Patrick only telling the rumours or does he know something himself?

When Joran was called in the Jensen show; the transfer of calling sounded normal. Normally when you call abroad the sound is different...but maybe I'm mistaken. Or he was in the Netherlands for visit to his grandma

When you call a number in Germany the tone is the same as calling someone in Holland.
(I work for a German company, I make calls to Germany every day.  )
Calling to the UK and USA has a different tone (2 short tones instead of 1 longer one)

[katrien]

also Poentjes says: (hiding) in Germany? - and Patrick says yes.
but elsewhere Poentje says Patrick said hiding in The Netherlands.

but rumours were Joran was in hiding in Germany.
is Patrick only telling the rumours or does he know something himself?

When Joran was called in the Jensen show; the transfer of calling sounded normal. Normally when you call abroad the sound is different...but maybe I'm mistaken. Or he was in the Netherlands for visit to his grandma

Is Patrick telling rumours or is Poentje telling rumours?

That's the question. And if Poentje leaves complete parts out of the interview I think Poentje is the one who tells rumours.

[Rob]

Currently there appear to be four people that know who "daury" / "boat guy" really is. If this person really exists.

Joran
Patrick
Godfather Peter R
Poentje

and possibly now Mos.

As each day goes by, I am inclined to believe that no one is investigating this person. By now, I would think, that this person has been questioned.

When Daury Rodriguez was identified he was on TV in an instant. Joran said he made up that name. Rodriguez said “ I’m shocked and angry, I was in Rotterdam at school at the time. What Joran is saying is bullshit”.

So where is this person, and has he been interrogated?

It will not be long until the real name of this person is known. That's how the net works.

[Jo-An]

Poentje

"Poen" is slang for "money" in Dutch.
"tje" means little.

That's probably what he makes in a year, little money, with an audience of 15 per show. 

[Bearlyhere]

O/T

Does anyone remember from before the crash(es), one of our monkeys signed up with and went on a search woth Texas ES?

Are there any monkeys who have done that and have posted about it?

TIA

I might be wrong but I thought it was SunnyinTX.

Yes, SunnyinTX and I think Beachwego went with her at the time.  Also more recently, Oldfart, Sam and others I can't remember at the moment went on search.  Everyone that has participated in a TES search has said how happy they did. 

Naomi Arnette IIRC in Illinois.

Thanks, Rob.

[Bearlyhere]

Quotes from an interview with Poentje:

Concering the quotes around 'dumping the body': it will be left out of the broadcast of tomorrow. Poentje promised Hans Mos (Hans Mos asked him to bleep it out; Poentje said he would leave it out completely).

According to Poentje this is what Patrick claimed:
BEFORE the airing of the Peter R. de Vriesshow Joran called Patrick. Joran asked him for 2000 Euros. He needed that money to give it to the person who helped him with dumping the body. Patrick gave the money to Joran.

Patrick then start taling about that it's easy now...just follow where the money has been sent....besides I know who it is.
Poentje: Then Patrick says were he lives, in what part of Holland he lives.
The reporter asks Poentje: Does he (Patrick) mentions a name?
Poentje: he doesn't say a name; but he mentions where he lives.
Reporter: He knows him?
Poentje: He knows him very well. Patrick also says he's hiding with Joran in the Netherlands.

This is a little weird:
* If Joran has so much money for weed, gambling, lending money to friends etc. why would he ask for money?
* Why would Joran ask for money from Patrick at that time? Maybe he asked him AFTER he confessed but BEFORE he knew he was set up??

Maybe this is information that shouldn't have leaked? But if this was going on & the police now about this....why did it take so long before Patrick was at the OM in Aruba for questioning?
And I wonder if Peter R. de Vries knows about this? Because if these quotes are correct, if Patrick actually said them, then it's a bit weird that Peter R. de Vries is laughing it off with remarks concerning translation / interpretation etc.

Why didn't Pontje go to the police with it right away instead of putting a teaser on the air for MOS to hear?  He is not any better.  DeVries showed ALE the tapes first, did Pontius Pontje?  What is his connection to Joran?
Patrick does mention money for Daury in the car, isn't that how he gets info about him?

When Pontje says he is not going to air it, why does he then tell what he is not going to air?  If you talk about it and don't show it, all that is told is your biased (he shows this on his zorpia site) opinion of someone you don't like and are trying to discredit.  Anyone smell a skunk?

What if Patrick went on the air and said. "Joran said.......," and we never saw the tapes?  Isn't this what Poentje is doing?  Is this going to be heresay?

I had ears to hear and eyes to see Joran, all this smoke and mirors doesn't change a thing about Joran, imo.  He intended to make bucks selling drugs.  I think that is why he didn't mention any other names, he wanted to look like a tough guy so he could sell drugs in a big way.  Why did he even bother to apply to college, do you need a degree to sell pot now?

Another thing, if Joran didn't know what he was saying because he was high, then how does he know he didn't kill Natalee, wasn't he high then, too?

Pontje's connection to joran is his 17 yo relative named Marriene or something like that.

Thanks, Karma.  I read that after I posted.

Karma is coming, Joran and when it heads your way, you better duck!!!

[klaasend]

Karmaroundup wrote:

Pontje's connection to joran is his 17 yo relative named Marriene or something like that.

This is the first I've heard of a relationship betwwen Poentje and Joran, where did you see this?  Very interresting.

[Bearlyhere]

also Poentjes says: (hiding) in Germany? - and Patrick says yes.
but elsewhere Poentje says Patrick said hiding in The Netherlands.

but rumours were Joran was in hiding in Germany.
is Patrick only telling the rumours or does he know something himself?

When Joran was called in the Jensen show; the transfer of calling sounded normal. Normally when you call abroad the sound is different...but maybe I'm mistaken. Or he was in the Netherlands for visit to his grandma

Is Patrick telling rumours or is Poentje telling rumours?

That's the question. And if Poentje leaves complete parts out of the interview I think Poentje is the one who tells rumours.

[Bearlyhere]

Karmaroundup wrote:

Pontje's connection to joran is his 17 yo relative named Marriene or something like that.

This is the first I've heard of a relationship betwwen Poentje and Joran, where did you see this?  Very interresting.

It's a zorpia relative connection.  Going back in the thread...........................BRB

[Dayhiker]

Currently there appear to be four people that know who "daury" / "boat guy" really is. If this person really exists.

Joran
Patrick
Godfather Peter R
Poentje

and possibly now Mos.

As each day goes by, I am inclined to believe that no one is investigating this person. By now, I would think, that this person has been questioned.

When Daury Rodriguez was identified he was on TV in an instant. Joran said he made up that name. Rodriguez said “ I’m shocked and angry, I was in Rotterdam at school at the time. What Joran is saying is bullshit”.

So where is this person, and has he been interrogated?

It will not be long until the real name of this person is known. That's how the net works.

Morning Rob and all good Monks! Nice Dutch contingent in theis morning! Hello all!

Bruddah, in reference to your post, herein lies Hans Less' dilemma. He cannot prosecute Joran without prosecuting Paulus. They are intertwined in greater or lesser degrees (we don't know exactly how deep into the doodoo Paulus is) but both are guilty nonetheless.

Because Paulus is involved a whole new can 'o worms opens up with the involvement of Van der Straten, Jacobs, and Jannsen. Paulus has this over all their heads and surely many more.

So how can Hans prosecute just Joran? Others are involved. How deep can he go?