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Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
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Topic: Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006 (Read 111746 times)
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shadow
Monkey Junky Jr.
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Posts: 613
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #100 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:44:19 PM »
Quote from: "the big hammer"
Antonio Carlo
The conscience-plagued sloot attorney seems to have had second thoughts about his role in covering up a murder, and his own culpability, if his deviant and psychologically-tortured client happens to harm another girl.
The exchange descibed by De Vreis between Jannsen and Carlo, where Carlo evidently approached Jannsen w/ relevant information about the case, and indicates he is aware that jvds bears criminal responsibility for Natalee's disappearance (murder, rape, etc).
This is strange indeed. And borders on legal malpractice which could void any judgement against jvds in the future. And what does Jannsen do? She attempts to broker further info and Carlo says she'll have to find the "evidence" herself. And where do we end up?
Nowhere. Right where we were.
De Vreis attempts to interview Carlo re: these strange events, and Antonio does what all Dutch Arubans do best: he deflects and then runs away.
IMO, the De Vreis show accomplished much in terms of informing and educating Dutch audiences about the events surrounding the murder of Natalee.
I think one of the things accomplished also was the destruction of Karin Jannsen's career. She deserves it, and verily so, for her base and incompetent handling of this case, and by leading the false arrests of the security guards.
De Vreis should get this incompetent and dangerous woman ( who actually had the temerity and gall to write in a letter to the US Dept of Justice inquiring whether Beth Holloway Twitty was directly related to Adolph Hitler ) on his show next for a detailed interview.
Her record in this case should be broadcast, as warning to people everywhere who want or need to know the state of jurisprudence in the place formerly known as Aruba.
.
I agree 100%. and as far as . . .
Dutchlady on Trophy-Taking
From Scared Monkeys September 21, 2005:
IMO the video or images were taken and shared, but not shared via the internet, but via portable hard drive. I still feel there is a connection to Miami. Can anyone confirm that Paulus traveled to Miami shortly after the disapearance of Natalee? Maybe he is the Miami connection . . . anyone know if he traveled to Miami frequently?
I also have a supicsion regarding Satish and D not wanting him involved.
Evening Monkeys!
Logged
There is a basin in the mind where words float around on thought and sound and sight. Then there is a depth of thought untouched by words, and deeper still a gulf of formless feelings untouched by thought. - Zora Neal Hurston
shadow
Monkey Junky Jr.
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Posts: 613
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #101 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:47:05 PM »
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "AZLady"
Any word yet on whether the transcript of de Vries' show has been posted? I can't wait to read it.
In our De Vries thread I've posted a translation of part of the first 1/2 that was posted on another site (FOB). Mostly just background stuff we already knew.
Thank you Klass!
Logged
There is a basin in the mind where words float around on thought and sound and sight. Then there is a depth of thought untouched by words, and deeper still a gulf of formless feelings untouched by thought. - Zora Neal Hurston
yapperz1
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 1299
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #102 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:48:24 PM »
Evening Monkeys
There was a post in early July by someone who had just returned from Aruba. This person claims they saw Paulus at the airport in Aruba as they were leaving the island.
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I STAND WITH THE GIRL, NATALEE HOLLOWAY
ARUBA
Shizaru
Monkey Junky Jr.
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Posts: 728
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #103 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:50:10 PM »
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Shizaru"
From the tscript in DeVries thread:
Quote
The night before her disappearance Natalee started drinking alcohol at 10 am in the morning and had to be carried back to her hotel room at night by her roommates/friends.
Lee's statement was that Natalee was "escorted" back to her room by one person. Not carried by a group of people. Why did the program feel the need to exaggerate here?
Shizaru - don't forget this is being translated from Dutch to English. I think it's just something in the translation. I wouldn't make that much of it.
Maybe, let's see how Ramm translates it.
Of course the big question re: the DeVries program is why the **** is it that they couldn't give Natalee's family any advance warning about the allegations they were going to make against Natalee (and as of last night weren't responding to inquires from Natalee's family about those allegations), but they could give that information out to an Internet poster over the phone?
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memphis
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 1187
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #104 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:53:11 PM »
Quote from: "Shizaru"
From the tscript in DeVries thread:
Quote
The night before her disappearance Natalee started drinking alcohol at 10 am in the morning and had to be carried back to her hotel room at night by her roommates/friends.
Lee's statement was that Natalee was "escorted" back to her room by one person. Not carried by a group of people. Why did the program feel the need to exaggerate here?
Shizaru
, I saw a post where Ramm at BFN (I think) later corrected the "carried" part to "escorted".
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LilPuma
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 2922
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #105 on:
November 27, 2006, 06:55:53 PM »
Quote from: "Sue"
Quote from: "dkpen"
You know with this picture of Joran and Natalee is disturbing to me. I can't get it out of my head. ugh!
Taking or making of souviners from or of the victim(s) is evidence of fantasy at work. Joran has major issues.
GET THE BOY HELP NOW ANITA! Please, before another girl falls victim to your ill-begotten son.
she cant help her boy... she cant help herself
I've often wondered about Anita:
A. Is she covering for Joran and Paulus, knowing full well what they do, what kind of men they really are?
B. Does she "know" but not really know, and is in denial?
C. Is she truly clueless, believing her men are innocent of all charges?
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Our deeds are seeds and by them, we plant the world we will walk through tomorrow
dkpen
Monkey Junky
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Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #106 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:00:39 PM »
Quote from: "LilPuma"
Quote from: "Sue"
Quote from: "dkpen"
You know with this picture of Joran and Natalee is disturbing to me. I can't get it out of my head. ugh!
Taking or making of souviners from or of the victim(s) is evidence of fantasy at work. Joran has major issues.
GET THE BOY HELP NOW ANITA! Please, before another girl falls victim to your ill-begotten son.
she cant help her boy... she cant help herself
I've often wondered about Anita:
A. Is she covering for Joran and Paulus, knowing full well what they do, what kind of men they really are?
B. Does she "know" but not really know, and is in denial?
C. Is she truly clueless, believing her men are innocent of all charges?
B. Does she "know" but not really know, and is in denial?
I have to agree with
B
.
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memphis
Monkey Junky
Offline
Posts: 1187
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #107 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:00:44 PM »
Quote from: "memphis"
Quote from: "Shizaru"
From the tscript in DeVries thread:
Quote
The night before her disappearance Natalee started drinking alcohol at 10 am in the morning and had to be carried back to her hotel room at night by her roommates/friends.
Lee's statement was that Natalee was "escorted" back to her room by one person. Not carried by a group of people. Why did the program feel the need to exaggerate here?
Shizaru
, I saw a post where Ramm at BFN (I think) later corrected the "carried" part to "escorted".
I'm trying to find it...
Logged
Tylergal
Monkey All Star Jr.
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Posts: 9535
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #108 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:03:31 PM »
Quote from: "LilPuma"
Quote from: "Sue"
Quote from: "dkpen"
You know with this picture of Joran and Natalee is disturbing to me. I can't get it out of my head. ugh!
Taking or making of souviners from or of the victim(s) is evidence of fantasy at work. Joran has major issues.
GET THE BOY HELP NOW ANITA! Please, before another girl falls victim to your ill-begotten son.
she cant help her boy... she cant help herself
I've often wondered about Anita:
A. Is she covering for Joran and Paulus, knowing full well what they do, what kind of men they really are?
B. Does she "know" but not really know, and is in denial?
C. Is she truly clueless, believing her men are innocent of all charges?
Enabler who was called back from Holland to help coordinate stories, enabler of the first degree.
Logged
There is always one more imbecile than you counted on
Tylergal
Monkey All Star Jr.
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Posts: 9535
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #109 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:05:30 PM »
Anita knows all and makes the stories as she can be objective. She is the one who has given them the stories to tell. Why else would she call on Freddy to help her? Because she knows Joran will not tell her the truth and she wanted Paulus and Joran out of the room so she could hear everything; thus, she could help them coordinate the stories. If Joran is the spawn of Satan, what does that make Anita?
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There is always one more imbecile than you counted on
LilPuma
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 2922
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #110 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:10:25 PM »
Quote from: "Sue"
I really want to be a FLY on the wall of the investigators
in Holland that have taken over the case.. I really wonder
what they are thinking and what exactly they are doing
if anything
DeVries timing on this was perfect. Hopefully, if anyone wanted to just stamp it Cold Case and forgetaboutit, this show will have given them some info and motivation not to do so. (Now that I know we have an English teacher, I changed "not to" to "not to do so." That's better, right?)
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Our deeds are seeds and by them, we plant the world we will walk through tomorrow
klaasend
Administrator
Monkey Mega Star
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Posts: 74276
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #111 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:11:01 PM »
Here is a portion of the De Vries show made available by Daniel at FOB - you should be able to just click on the image and it will play:
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IBE
Monkey Junky
Offline
Posts: 3554
Thanks
«
Reply #112 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:16:47 PM »
Thanks
Hammer
for bringing
Dutchlady
back in.
It's too bad we couldn't raise the $$ for her, for she wished to go to Aruba to solve the case. Has anyone heard from her or about what she is doing now?
I remember following
her, Anna, Aruba girl and many others who are still dedicated on this post.
I followed them from Rheil World (sp) very early on and also in some travel site.
We must never give up until Natalee has come home in all sense of the word.
Keep up the Good Works, Monkeys! through thick and thin.
IBE
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Freedom is not free: it also takes ethics, character, accountability, responsibility and courage! Freedom for Scared Monkeys: donate to Red's legal fees.
LilPuma
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 2922
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #113 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:17:25 PM »
Quote from: "Tylergal"
Anita knows all and makes the stories as she can be objective. She is the one who has given them the stories to tell. Why else would she call on Freddy to help her? Because she knows Joran will not tell her the truth and she wanted Paulus and Joran out of the room so she could hear everything; thus, she could help them coordinate the stories. If Joran is the spawn of Satan, what does that make Anita?
I think Anita's in denial. She knows what her boys are up to but can't deal with it. Now she has Beth to blame, so life is better.
I haven't read the translation yet but did Jacobs really call Joran the Devil?
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Our deeds are seeds and by them, we plant the world we will walk through tomorrow
memphis
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 1187
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #114 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:18:15 PM »
Klaas
, the screen capture of Joran's and Kee's exchange is amazing.
Anyone, do you know when those pictures of Natalee and her friends were first posted at RU?
I'm reading Daniel's posts over at FOB.
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Buckeye
Monkey All Star Jr.
Offline
Posts: 5376
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #115 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:18:55 PM »
Klaas
Looks like you'll have to change the peeping through the blinds picture to the peeping through the curtains..
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klaasend
Administrator
Monkey Mega Star
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Posts: 74276
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #116 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:21:33 PM »
Quote from: "Buckeye"
Klaas
Looks like you'll have to change the peeping through the blinds picture to the peeping through the curtains..
That's the first thing I thought of when I saw that too!!
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klaasend
Administrator
Monkey Mega Star
Offline
Posts: 74276
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #117 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:23:09 PM »
Quote from: "memphis"
Klaas
, the screen capture of Joran's and Kee's exchange is amazing.
Anyone, do you know when those pictures of Natalee and her friends were first posted at RU?
I'm reading Daniel's posts over at FOB.
Others may remember better than I but I believe it was around the same time, January 2006.
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memphis
Monkey Junky
Offline
Posts: 1187
Lively Case Discussion #549 11/27 - 11/28/2006
«
Reply #118 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:23:14 PM »
The following is from FOB....
Posted: Mon Nov 27th, 2006 08:56 am
MoonShadows wrote:
de Vries implied Joran tried to "create false evidence" of a previous relationship with Natalee with the picture. It seems that's what Daniel is implying as well.
Daniel wrote: I don't think it was intended as evidence of anything in particular.
De Vries does not know why that photoshop job was done, or he would have used that information in his show.
Note that the original photo of Natalee and her girlfriend was not in wide circulation on the net yet when Joran had it photoshopped on Jan 25/26 of this year. Only a very small circle of trusted people had it.
I'm trying to get my mind around the implications here.
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IBE
Monkey Junky
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Posts: 3554
Earrings
«
Reply #119 on:
November 27, 2006, 07:24:09 PM »
On of the Monkeys mentioned that the earrings on Natalee we missing in Joran's photoshopped picture.
Would this have any psychological implications or wasn't there an earring supposedly shown to the mom?
Memory is vague. Help please?
I seem to remember a discussion of the earrings was important early on.
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Freedom is not free: it also takes ethics, character, accountability, responsibility and courage! Freedom for Scared Monkeys: donate to Red's legal fees.
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