Natalee Case Discussion #693 11/25 - 11/26/2007

[igsigs]

Igsigs - was it posted somewhere that Gielen was being ripped in Dutch press? By a Dutchie?

Yep, fierljepper at BFN. Then Pearl with a babblelized article.

[Dayhiker]

Bump

Gielen ripped in Dutch press.

As it should be 

I know she had another TV special planned as a follow-up to her latest article. I would be surprised if it aired...

Igsigs - was it posted somewhere that Gielen was being ripped in Dutch press? By a Dutchie?

Post that puppy if you have it Igsigs. TIA!

[Kermit]

sometimes we would rent a hotel room. I happened that three guys were in the same room having sex with girls. I was given a blow job on a balcony once by an American girl while Deepak was in the bathroom with a girl and Freddy was in the room proper with a girl too. But we did never share a girl or did threesomes. That was going way too far for me. We did however make topless pictures of a girl in a hotel room once.
(source: Joran's book Page 4 & 5 (only a bit to page 5, the last page of this chapter):

Deepak had put on a DVD with music video's. One of them was Benny Benassi's video for Satisfaction. It was an x-rated version and had explicit sex-scenes in it. (Joran's book: Chapter 8 continued:page 11 + 12)

[klaasend]

Terwijl ik deze column tik, zie ik vanuit mijn hotelkamer in de verte het cellencomplex waar Joran van der Sloot sinds gisternacht zit opgesloten. Een politiecel op Aruba heeft weinig comfort. Ik kon dat enkele jaren geleden met eigen ogen constateren toen ik vanwege een reportage voor deze krant een nachtje meedraaide met een speciale eenheid van de Arubaanse politie en de Spartaanse kerkers bezocht. Dit schrijft John van den Heuvel vandaag in De Telegraaf.

Wat zou er nou door het hoofd van die jongen omgaan, vraag ik me af. Vermoordde hij werkelijk Natalee Holloway en berekent hij nu zijn kansen om een jarenlange gevangenisstraf te ontlopen? Of ligt Joran vol wanhoop op zijn stenen bed omdat hij niets met de verdwijning van de Amerikaanse blondine van doen heeft?
       
Tweeënhalf jaar geleden interviewde ik op Aruba de moeder van Natalee. Het was kort na de verdwijning van haar dochter en tijdens het gesprek flikkerde voortdurend paniek op in de ogen van moeder Beth. Ze kon zich op dat moment nog niet voorstellen dat ze haar dochter waarschijnlijk nooit meer zou terugzien. Onvoorstelbaar wat deze vrouw de laatste twee jaar moest meemaken.
       
Je dochter verliezen en dan ook nog eens zo met modder worden besmeurd, zoals vorige week door een Nederlandse ’onderzoeksjournalist’. Deze op Curaçao woonachtige Renee Gielen zegt in een documentaire dat ze vanaf dag één achterdochtig is over de verdwijning. Ze zag ook iets heel anders bij Natalees moeder. „Toen ik haar in haar ogen keek, wist ik dat er iets niet klopte. Ik wist wel dat ik géén verdrietige moeder tegenover me had. Nu weet ik wat ik toen zag: een moeder in grote problemen.”
       
Volgens Gielen zou Natalee zelfs in een afkickkliniek zijn beland vlak voordat ze naar Aruba kwam. Renee Gielen ontleent het ’bewijs’ van Natalees veronderstelde verslaving aan een interview dat de producente op band heeft staan, met een Arubaanse taxichauffeuse.
       
Nou ken ik Renee Gielen een beetje en weet toevallig dat zij kind aan huis is bij een aantal Antilliaanse en Arubaanse ministers, die natuurlijk dolblij zijn met haar ’onafhankelijke’ reportage. Gielen gaat daarom waarschijnlijk helemaal voorbij aan de blunders in het politieonderzoek en de vele tegenstrijdige verklaringen en leugens van Joran van der Sloot.

Ze suggereert zelfs onverbloemd en volkomen onbewezen dat de familie Holloway zelf wel eens de hand kan hebben gehad in de verdwijning van Natalee. „Bij mij hebben de leugens in het boek van Beth Holloway en heel veel andere twijfelachtige beweringen en gebeurtenissen in de afgelopen 2,5 jaar de vraag opgeroepen: wilde Beth wel dat Natalee zou worden gevonden?” vraagt Gielen zich af.
       
Moeder Beth Twitty wilde volgens Gielen maar één ding: Natalees laakbare gedrag en wijze van verdwijning verdoezelen. En daarvoor had ze een zondebok nodig. Dat werd Joran van der Sloot, de jongen die het laatst met haar was gezien, aldus Gielen.
       
Het zal je maar gebeuren als ouder. Je dochter verdwijnt op mysterieuze wijze, de drie verdachten liegen aantoonbaar en worden daarom zelfs opnieuw gearresteerd. Dan duikt er ene Renee Gielen op, die zonder enige feitelijke onderbouwing een jong meisje dat zich niet meer kan verdedigen, genadeloos neerzet als een drugsverslaafde lellebel die haar dood aan zichzelf heeft te wijten.
       
Een wanhopige moeder die begrijpelijkerwijs tot het uiterste wil gaan haar dochter terug te vinden, krijgt ook nog eens een trap na. Natalee Holloway en haar familie hebben misschien fouten gemaakt, maar dát hebben ze niet verdiend.
       
Reacties of tips? jvdheuvel@telegraaf.nl

This is a column written by a Dutch crime journalist that appeared in the Telegraaf today. His name is John van der Heuvel and he is more or less the successor of Peter de Vries with that newpaper (he's less cute tho)

In this article "Desparate mother stabbed in the back" he attacks and despites the behavior of Renee Gielen. John is actually on Aruba now and he can see Joran's prison in the distance. He quotes elements of Renee Gielen's article about Natalee's alleged drug addiction and Beth's role in the media trying to turn her child into a triple AAA teenager. John basically spits on all of Renee's allegations.

He says f.i.:
"I happen to know Renee Gielen a bit and do know that she's very close with a few Antillian and Aruban ministers, who of course welcome her "objective" report. That's why Gielen probably completely ignores the bloopers made in the police investigation as well as the many contradicting statements and lies of Joran van der Sloot."

No new further details about the case in this article.

[Lala'sMom]

Hello everyone,

I'm not the sharpest tool in the drawer, but it seems that this evidence must be about the three suspects on the night of the murder. (manslaughter)

It must be new evidence. So, it's probably some physical evidence of the victim from the Sloot home which was a crime scene.

The necklace that Natalee was wearing in the last pictures of her and her friends:  is it missing?

You have asked that several times...I just really don't know the answer.  Does anyone else know?

[Dayhiker]

AHATA is a "private" group of hotel, casino, restaurant, tourist related industries, etc. HOWEVER, there is only a fine line between them and the government/taxed based Ministry of Tourism. They DO get government money to sponsor their agenda.

Didn't Cohen say he was getting paid by ATA/AHATA/Defunct Communications Task Force and the Aruban government? Thin line is right, Wreck. BTW, there is very little difference between ATA and AHATA. Think of ATA as Daddy Warbucks and AHATA as the red headed stepchild they send out to do their dirty work.

[Lala'sMom]

Joran was on a watch list
Paulus phones were tapped
DEA Agent told Beth, "Wait and I'll go with you to the judges house" (seems the DEA Agent knew about Paulus)
The phone call - big mistake!

Yes.  There is more too...the DEA agent knew enough about the island to ask the women to remain in the cars...this guy knew a lot more than we think...hmmmm.

[SunnyinTX]

Hello everyone,

I'm not the sharpest tool in the drawer, but it seems that this evidence must be about the three suspects on the night of the murder. (manslaughter)

It must be new evidence. So, it's probably some physical evidence of the victim from the Sloot home which was a crime scene.

The necklace that Natalee was wearing in the last pictures of her and her friends:  is it missing?

You have asked that several times...I just really don't know the answer.  Does anyone else know?

I don't...I remember this was questioned a long long time ago too...but do not remember anything was ever substantiated

[robots]

BBL..
back on page 9 Robots quoted me... but did NOT even add a smiley  .. so I'm lost and need a nap...
SeeYaByeeee

hi, i kept hitting the wrong button

sorry OF

here ya go

 

[Anna]

Here is the entire article posted by PearlinUSA at BFN on a thread she started entitled Joran Taken Straight to Prison.


rough trans. of dutch:
Several articles on crimesite of nl.  Per one article Joran was taken straight to the KIA Prison.  Also noted that Fox News had video today that did show Joran inside the fenced area of KIA with 2 guards and appeared to be waiting to be let inside.  Same clothes on as shown in Curacao airport pictures.

This article about Renee Gielen:

In its column in the telegraph John of pine write hillock concerning ' journaliste ' Rénee Gielen, which passes back and forth a very remarkable and dubious role in the reporting Natalee Holloway and it is a lot bitten especially on Natalee's mother. I have there also sometimes concerning written.That sell isuch ladies freaked out there walk around which n local Caribbean flutkrantjes their brain tenon awl, alla.  But that a heading if network leaves reportages by this way someone make says a lot of concerning certain characters at network (unfortunately, because they do also goeie things). The column of John is only for telegraph abonnees, but he also stands on www.crimesite.nl (they will have for that authorisation?)

http://misdaadjournalist.web-log.nl/misdaadjournalist/

This one questions Joe Tacapino as a lawyer working in Aruba to defend Joran:
·   
If it frequently concerns Joran of of the ditch and Natalee Hollway, gets I berichtjes, questions and observations of an American who reads a beetje. Yesterday he asked: Sorry to bother you again but I property a question. There are no US case pen thing against Joran, however; his old attorney, Joe Tacopina (WHO is known in the States ash representing "the mob"), still claims to be Joran's attorney. He says he will travel to Aruba for the Monday hearing. He does not seem to be well versed in Dutch law (or well versed, in general). There a mob/cartel risky with Paulus of of the ditch are?

Briefly said: there no charge against Joran runs in the US, but its old lawyer is of plan to Aruba, set off whereas he has no verstand of the Dutch legislation. In America he stands confessed because of its work for the mafia. There is a link between the mafia and the father of Joran? It did not think.

Second mailtje: According to Eric Mouthaan, Dutch news correspondence clerk, the evidence are Joran incriminating himself. He said Joran has talked while speaking to ppl on the phone about Natalee's death/how she died. They property this on tape. Sorry if any channel already brought this news and/or if it already has leg posted. Therefore: according to correspondence clerk Eric Mouthaan Joran itself by means of the tel. something has accused passes on concerning the way Natalee would be died, which stands on link. Sorry as everyone it already weet. I not, however, that there talk of was that Natalee be maltreated. Therefore that could be correct. Itself has I no high cap of this new action: it was rapidly this way ready as klontje that the affair was eavesdropped on, you can already complete something from the link jerk and that as proof to use. I hope that there is more…..hendrik Jan

from:  http://www.crimesite.nl/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=5527

This one tells of being taken to KIA

Joran of of the ditch permanently on Aruba Joran of of the ditch, suspected of involvement at the disappearance and dead of the American teenager Natalee Holloway, Saturday morning has arrived round four hours Dutch time on Aruba. That communicates eye witnesses on the fly field. The boy has been transported directly to the prison. Shortly after four hours three blended private cars with high speed left the poorten of the fly field. According to beveiligingsmensen on the spot zat of of the ditch in one of the carriages. Journalists on the Antilles communicate that the Dutchman two had incurred hours delay because he has been changed on Curacao of plane. The Public Prosecution Service (OM) on Aruba was not contactable for comment. According to the expectations of of the ditch Monday to the rechter-commissaris on Aruba is taken before, which will interrogate him further. Possibly thus the lengthening of the provisional detention comes up for discussion. (DUTCH PRESS AGENCY

This one says interrogations started right away ..

Police force interrogates Joran of of the ditch
Update 25-11 a team of Dutch and arubaanse inspectors have started Saturday immediately with interrogating the 20 person whose birthday it is Joran of of the ditch. That has confirmed the Public Prosecution Service.

 The boy who suspected becomes of doodslag or heavy maltreatment, has vannacht arrived on Aruba. America's most Wanted spend wide attention on the new developments around Joran of of the ditch c.s.. Of of the ditch, which is again questioned concerning the disappearance of the American teenager Natalee Holloway, each contact with the outside world has been denied. He cannot teleview, newspapers read or visit and post to receive. , to him restrictive measures have been imposed '', said to public prosecutor capsule crumb. , he can only speak with its lawyer.' ' Jorans father, Paul of of the ditch, which could him speak as a lawyer, according to her has not submitted an application as a verdediger.

 Interrogate be according to crumb necessary for the file which is submitted Monday to the rechter-commissaris who decided concerning lengthening of the preservation. , for that we must come with more material on table. How further in the process, how we must more.' ' Friday the judge the voorarrest of the two medeverdachten, the brothers D. and S. K.met have extended eight days. The brothers were heard on several locations on Aruba prevent that there is some contact that of influence can be on their declarations. see also: ' after a couple months will talk you, however, ' Here Article reads arubaans offensive in matter holloway Here Article reads Joran by means of sneak route on Aruba

This one mentions drugging and having sex with girls +

' Joran have to explain many '

Joran of of the ditch have to according to justice sources explain ' much '. The Dutchman will be interrogated firmly concerning its role in the vermissing of Natalee Holloway. To its body Monday is gezocht. American two years disappeared suffered.

The new search, which starts Monday, is an initiative of father Dave Holloway, who has been tested-fly after head hoofdverdachte Joram Friday evening was brought by justice to Aruba. This the press communicates today.

 An inspector who has been involved in the new study into the role of Joran of of the ditch says Sunday in the telegraph that the Dutchman has ' on a number of important points still as lot of to explain '. As the data which have been now listed, also already during first arrest confessed products, then he had been never put by the judge on free feet. There zat other inspector say in the file then we to dachten.

"Een much more in the newspaper that rather ex-vriendinnetje will have violated Joran. The little girl will have confessed that at a therapeut, but wild then no declaration lets do because they was still amorously on Joran to research teams earlier to the matter let twinges fall. Thus was not well kept on asking and were not covered of tel.-tapering entirely developed, thus the inspector in the telegraph.

Then concerning a certain conversation in the warrant it was put there that had not been not litterally reflected relevant and for this reason. Now we a number of listens to conversations again, we - in combination with the new research data - let us see really new suspicions oprijzen."Politie and justice goes there from that Joran and is friends Deepak and Satish K. had thought more earlier sex with little girls after they had doped them according to the Dutch Public Prosecution Service depend it of the declarations of Joran and the brothers K. the coming days or they are brought for the judge.

 If they do not continue be silent that their matter according to Om-woordvoerder Hans mos of it also stronger on maken'. of the ditch will arrive Friday evening under enormous medium interest on Aruba. Also two friends Deepak and Satish K. are is heard. Three can absolutely no contact prevent more with each other have to that they coordinate again declarations the 20 person whose birthday it is of of the ditch, which was arrested Thursday in arnhem, Monday is taken before. Public Prosecution Service says proofs have that Natalee in life is no longer. Them was seen for last on 30 May 2005, then they in the company of three suspected a bar left

http://www.crimesite.nl/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=5531



 
 http://blogsfornatalee.com/forum/index.php?topic=7874.msg291479;topicseen#new

[SunnyinTX]

renHo has crawled out of her hole


Glenda Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 8:30 am   

Bubbles wrote:


dunno if she is there today but she'll be there on Monday. *taking aobut Greta


And the only one to followed and stalked...  says renHO

[Anna]

It had nice color coding that didn't copy for some reason.

[Dayhiker]

       
Reacties of tips? jvdheuvel@telegraaf.nl

This is a column written by a Dutch crime journalist that appeared in the Telegraaf today. His name is John van der Heuvel and he is more or less the successor of Peter de Vries with that newpaper (he's less cute tho)

In this article "Desparate mother stabbed in the back" he attacks and despites the behavior of Renee Gielen. John is actually on Aruba now and he can see Joran's prison in the distance. He quotes elements of Renee Gielen's article about Natalee's alleged drug addiction and Beth's role in the media trying to turn her child into a triple AAA teenager. John basically spits on all of Renee's allegations.

He says f.i.:
"I happen to know Renee Gielen a bit and do know that she's very close with a few Antillian and Aruban ministers, who of course welcome her "objective" report. That's why Gielen probably completely ignores the bloopers made in the police investigation as well as the many contradicting statements and lies of Joran van der Sloot."

No new further details about the case in this article.

[/quote]


Thanks for posting that Klaas. Bet Renee had to chug a big glass of Pepto Bismal after reading that.

[klaasend]

It had nice color coding that didn't copy for some reason.

Anna - You can use the quote function at BFN and copy that (then back out of it at BFN) then paste it here.  Same forum software.

[Helen Back]

Bump this too from ******* on page 10:

BTW, thanks to all the monkeys who bring information here to make this a definitive news source for us all.

This one questions Joe Tacapino as a lawyer working in Aruba to defend Joran:
·   
If it frequently concerns Joran of of the ditch and Natalee Hollway, gets I berichtjes, questions and observations of an American who reads a beetje. Yesterday he asked: Sorry to bother you again but I property a question. There are no US case pen thing against Joran, however; his old attorney, Joe Tacopina (WHO is known in the States ash representing "the mob"), still claims to be Joran's attorney. He says he will travel to Aruba for the Monday hearing. He does not seem to be well versed in Dutch law (or well versed, in general). There a mob/cartel risky with Paulus of of the ditch are? Briefly said: there no charge against Joran runs in the US, but its old lawyer is of plan to Aruba, set off whereas he has no verstand of the Dutch legislation. In America he stands confessed because of its work for the mafia. There is a link between the mafia and the father of Joran? It did not think. Second mailtje: According to Eric Mouthaan, Dutch news correspondence clerk, the evidence are Joran incriminating himself. He said Joran has talked while speaking to ppl on the phone about Natalee's death/how she died. They property this on tape. Sorry if any channel already brought this news and/or if it already has leg posted. Therefore: according to correspondence clerk Eric Mouthaan Joran itself by means of the tel. something has accused passes on concerning the way Natalee would be died, which stands on link. Sorry as everyone it already weet. I not, however, that there talk of was that Natalee be maltreated. Therefore that could be correct. Itself has I no high cap of this new action: it was rapidly this way ready as klontje that the affair was eavesdropped on, you can already complete something from the link jerk and that as proof to use. I hope that there is more…..hendrik Jan

from:  http://www.crimesite.nl/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=5527

It seems that folks in the Netherlands join us in wondering why Joe T. is on FOX and everywhere he can weasel his way in, representing himself as VDS attorney.  His rep as a "mafia" attorney is helping draw a connection between him and Paulus as having "mob connections".   

[Rob]

Thanks Igs....

Dayhiker-
His FREEEEEEE paycheck is about to run out and I bet he's not happy. Not only that - but he looks like his Ritalin prescription has been depleted over the last few days.

I received an email earlier that clearly stated that the NY Times claims Dave Holloway is in Aruba - when he is clearly NOT. There is a lot of misinformation coming out of Manhattan. Wonder who is responsible all that?

The only thing missing over the last few days were his barking dogs.

[SunnyinTX]

It had nice color coding that didn't copy for some reason.

thanks for posting it Anna...good read

[Lala'sMom]

renHo has crawled out of her hole


Glenda Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 8:30 am   

Bubbles wrote:


dunno if she is there today but she'll be there on Monday. *taking aobut Greta


And the only one to followed and stalked...  says renHO

So is sweet Glenda implying that Greta should be followed and stalked?  hmmmmm

[Anna]

It had nice color coding that didn't copy for some reason.

Anna - You can use the quote function at BFN and copy that (then back out of it at BFN) then paste it here.  Same forum software.

I just did copy and paste.  Next time I will try that Quote thing.

Some of that we have posted before but note the part about Joran drugging girls!!!

Everybody KNOWS!

..

[Lala'sMom]

Helen
I love that connection....

MOB+Joe T.+Joran=Paulus+ Mafia= Corruption

That sounds like 2+2=4.