Natalee Case Discussion #833 6/2/10 - 6/4/10

[nonesuche]

Hi Monkeys!

Peeking in from work, but know there are lots of monkeys here that I haven't seen in a while. I didn't want to miss the chance to give everyone a hug!  HUGS!!!

I know Joran's not in Kansas/Aruba anymore, but I'll breath easier when he's caught to shut down any remote possibility that he'll get away this time! We should start a poll. My guess is that by days end, they'll have him!

Backatcha CBB!  (((hugs)))

mucho hugs

[Northern Rose]

Holloway Ally: Flores Murder Brings It All Back
Missing Persons Search Group Founder: Aruba Police Commissioner Said van der Sloot Responsible for Natalee's Death

(CBS)  Five years after Natalee Holloway went missing, the man who has previously been arrested riwce in connection with her disappearance, Joran van der Sloot, is now being sought in another killing, that of Stephany Flores, 21, whose body was found Sunday in Lima, Peru.

Van der Sloot Lawyer: Inconsistencies Already
Photos: Van der Sloot Wanted for Murder
Photos: Photos: Natalee Holloway, Paradise Lost

Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equusearch, a non-profit organization that searches for missing persons, has assisted with the search of Natalee Holloway from almost the beginning, and has become very close with the Holloway family over the last five years.

Miller spoke Natalee Holloway's father, David Holloway, on Wednesday. Miller said David sends his condolences to Flores' family in Peru.

Miller said, "(David is) talking about what a senseless death that was, that we feel as though the cover-up that went on in Aruba, with Joran van der Sloot never being arrested, that we need to hold a lot of people accountable for Stephany's death in Peru. I mean, a very, very sad time for everybody. And Dave is just trying to, I think, just digest what's really happening in his life again right now. And of course it brings it all back to Dave and Beth, I'm sure that it's like it happened like yesterday. So there's disappointment, there's anger, there's frustrations. And, again, Stephany, there's no reason she should be dead today. Somebody made some huge mistakes over there."

Miller also discussed an incident two years ago in Aruba in which he and David Holloway were pulled over by a police commissioner.

"We were actually digging in a landfill, and we went back to get the permits to continue digging. And Gerold Dompig actually took us to a little warehouse -- it was kind of like we were into do some drug deal like you see on TV -- and he says, 'You don't need to be digging in the landfill anymore,' he said 'Joran van der Sloot is responsible for this, that body was taken out to sea.' Gerald Dompig's words to us were that Joran van der Sloot was a sociopath, that he controlled the entire family, even his father was afraid of him. And it's unfortunate that more couldn't be done to have Joran locked up."

He continued, "The other question is, 'Where has Joran been for the last five years?' We know he's traveled all over the country. Where is his money coming from, who has he been involved with? And we hate to even think like that. Did he kill Natalee, did he kill Stephany, yes, but he's really responsible for his father's death dying way before his time with the stress he went through. So Joran van der Sloot single-handedly probably destroyed an island, destroyed two different families, and certainly his own family."

Miller's own daughter, Laura Miller, was murdered in 1984 when she was 16. He founded Texas EquuSearch in 2000 in her memory and has since aided in the search of many missing persons including Natalee Holloway, Haleigh Cummings and victims of the 2004 tsunami.

Miller said the Holloways are still planning to look for Natalee's body.

"She deserves that funeral, Miller said, "And, yes, they want that person in prison for the rest of his life. And I know that feeling. I went through 17 months where Laura disappeared. … So I know what they go through. I made a promise to God and to Laura I'd never leave a family alone if there was anything I could ever do to help. And unfortunately, there's too many families out there."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/03/earlyshow/main6544006.shtml

[jill]

morning, all.

are the news reports saying that he stole $5,000 from Stephany?

I have the same question Jill

Me too, one of the articles I read this morning made me think that.

Ashley Banfield is discussing it on the View right now.....not the funds but that her body wasn't found right away. Now Joy just called the Aruban police "idiots"

funny.

[texasmom]

http://www.diario.aw/wp-content/themes/diario/images/fb.jpg

Today's Diario Front Page

[Northern Rose]

"Joran van der Sloot committed suicide"

According to foreign media is Joran van der Sloot is found dead at the Peruvian border. He would have committed suicide. The message has not been officially confirmed.
 
Also on Twitter streams within the rumors about his suicide.
The Dutchman van der Sloot is being sought for the murder of Tatiana Flores Stephany Ramirez. The daughter of businessman and racing driver Ricardo Flores was killed Monday in a Peruvian hotel found. The hotel room was on van der Sloot's name. Hotel Employees, the two have seen together late last week.
The ditch was long the main suspect in the case of the notorious disappearance of Natalee Hollaway on Aruba.

http://www.zita.be/nieuws/buitenland/867350_voortvluchtige-joran-van-der-sloot-zit-in-chili.html

[jill]

Arica is right on the coast?

he could've backtracked up to Columbia by now by boat.

[Ono]

We heard on NG show last night the Joran and Stephany left the casino and went to her car and sat in it for 37 minutes before the car left the parking lot.

I read somewhere this morning that a friend of Stephany's said she would never go off with someone she had just met and that Stephany was very concious about not doing that.

We read that date-rape drug wrappers were found in Stephany's car.

Now...if Joran walked her to her car, got in to talk a few minutes, they had a drink...which he drugged...and he waited for the drug to take effect...wouldn't that take about 37 minutes?  Then Joran could drive the car away and take Stephany into the room.  She was drugged...that's why she went with a guy she just met IMO.

Makes perfect sense.

[seemeatthebeach]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/03/earlyshow/main6544006.shtml

NEW YORK, June 3, 2010
Holloway Ally: Flores Murder Brings It All Back
Missing Persons Search Group Founder: Aruba Police Commissioner Said van der Sloot Responsible for Natalee's Death

(CBS)   Five years after Natalee Holloway went missing, the man who has previously been arrested riwce in connection with her disappearance, Joran van der Sloot, is now being sought in another killing, that of Stephany Flores, 21, whose body was found  Sunday in Lima, Peru.

Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equusearch, a non-profit organization that searches for missing persons, has assisted with the search of Natalee Holloway from almost the beginning, and has become very close with the Holloway family over the last five years.

Miller spoke Natalee Holloway's father, David Holloway, on Wednesday. Miller said David sends his condolences to Flores' family in Peru.

Miller said, "(David is) talking about what a senseless death that was, that we feel as though the cover-up that went on in Aruba, with Joran van der Sloot never being arrested, that we need to hold a lot of people accountable for Stephany's death in Peru. I mean, a very, very sad time for everybody. And Dave is just trying to, I think, just digest what's really happening in his life again right now. And of course it brings it all back to Dave and Beth, I'm sure that it's like it happened like yesterday. So there's disappointment, there's anger, there's frustrations. And, again, Stephany, there's no reason she should be dead today. Somebody made some huge mistakes over there."

Miller also discussed an incident two years ago in Aruba in which he and David Holloway were pulled over by a police commissioner.

"We were actually digging in a landfill, and we went back to get the permits to continue digging. And Gerold Dompig actually took us to a little warehouse -- it was kind of like we were into do some drug deal like you see on TV -- and he says, 'You don't need to be digging in the landfill anymore,' he said 'Joran van der Sloot is responsible for this, that body was taken out to sea.' Gerald Dompig's words to us were that Joran van der Sloot was a sociopath, that he controlled the entire family, even his father was afraid of him. And it's unfortunate that more couldn't be done to have Joran locked up."

He continued, "The other question is, 'Where has Joran been for the last five years?' We know he's traveled all over the country. Where is his money coming from, who has he been involved with? And we hate to even think like that. Did he kill Natalee, did he kill Stephany, yes, but he's really responsible for his father's death dying way before his time with the stress he went through. So Joran van der Sloot single-handedly probably destroyed an island, destroyed two different families, and certainly his own family."

Miller's own daughter, Laura Miller, was murdered in 1984 when she was 16. He founded Texas EquuSearch in 2000 in her memory and has since aided in the search of many missing persons including Natalee Holloway, Haleigh Cummings and victims of the 2004 tsunami.

Miller said the Holloways are still planning to look for Natalee's body.

"She deserves that funeral, Miller said, "And, yes, they want that person in prison for the rest of his life. And I know that feeling. I went through 17 months where Laura disappeared. … So I know what they go through. I made a promise to God and to Laura I'd never leave a family alone if there was anything I could ever do to help. And unfortunately, there's too many families out there."

[EURobert]

A comment from Terror Jaap on his blog:

Dear readers of my blog,

Coverage in the Telegraph is wrong. My name is also mentioned. In this my response.

With shock I learned of the death of Tatiana Flores Stephany Ramirez in Peru. If broken man I write these words now because I feel very guilty that I was not previously succeeded Joran to convince his sentence to sit down and to undergo heavy therapy. Another victim, terrible.

The worst thing that could have been avoided if the elite had seriously listened and had conducted more research. Here I would suggest a book to cover everything, but for now I leave it here.

Last year I work with one of Joran's best confidants to Joran on track to get. We have taken numerous initiatives to Joran to convince his sentence to sit down and undergo intensive therapy for both the world get rid of all the uncertainty in the Holloway case and Joran so again after his sentence in the heel.

I Joran himself said last week before last. But Joran's friends Joran even said recently. Here he has this to say:

"I had to just before May 30, still in contact with Joran. He was in Peru, which was known. In Aruba became too much for him, the relationship with his mother deteriorated, he had gambled away money again. It continued its flight to Peru on. Just before the weekend it was clear that Joran is in financial distress, he was quite confused. Driven by hunger, fear not to pay his hotel. He had always wanted to get money, I've never Joran frustrated as experienced in that period.

He asked me several times to send money, and had (own words), in all states, and quite depressed. He said small amounts (to eat), and was quite angry when I refused to send. He actually said funny things to do, because nobody wanted to help.

It is an accumulation of frustration, for that moment (the lack of money in a distant, foreign country), but his total life. It was all too much to him.
I say to this, the quarrel and argument with the girl was probably about money. His priority at that time was nothing like sex, and he was irritated by the fact that nobody wanted to give him something.
Afterwards, I had spoken to him, he said "to have done something bad." He said no matter what, but it was pretty panicked.

It is still a mystery how he came to his money, and yet the country has to leave (perhaps she had something in his pocket). Based on my experience (and the contact for the weekend), so I have my suspicions. But I watch everything, because nothing is certain "

In the weeks before the murder was totally gone wrong with Joran. After the death of his father to live in Aruba Joran again. Joran had new plans for the future. He was in therapy and a social study programs continue to shape his life. A week after he would include this happened .....

A deeply tragic event in a deeply tragic complication of many factors.

May both girls rest in peace.

Jaap Amesz

http://tinyurl.com/2u2a264

[Treehouse]

Had a moment of doubt. Thought IF Joran went out and got 2 cups of coffee then returned to the room (as reported in one article), perhaps he didn't kill Stephany. After all, she did have $$ winnings on her and others would have seen that. They could have waited until Joran left, then attacked her to rob her. He comes back with coffee, panics, packs, gets out pronto.

However, that doesn't work for me. In another report, Stephany's friend says she was living a openly gay life. IMO, she didn't go to that room to have sex with Joran. So why did she? The date-rape drugs supposedly found in her car may explain why she went.

I'm thinking:
Set up: By Joran
Method: Coercion thru drugs
Purpose: Robbery and murder

IMO, he wanted her money. IMO, he wanted the thrill of the kill. He could have taken her money without killing her.

IMO, premeditated murder.


Justice for Natalee. Justice for Stephany.

[Searching]

JVS was raised to be a self centered, spoiled brat by a mommy and daddy who covered up all his misdeeds his entire life, thus teaching him that his behavior was acceptable. He was given what he wanted, when he wanted it obviously and I am sure his mommy and daddy stepped in to somehow make sure that in the event he was told no, that no became a yes, so now he expects everyone to always say yes or he will take what he wants. I believe that JVS is not capable of taking no for an answer as he never has had to and that is why Natalee and this young lady met the fates that they did, they were brave enough to say no to a monster like JVS. I would guess this young lady died before he could carry out his intended plan, the rape, or she was raped and to protect her honor, the press is denying the rape, either way, I do believe that he kills because he rapes those that have the courage to say no to him and kills them to keep them from talking. I would love to know why he left her to be found though, maybe he is still playing catch me if you can with law enforcement, it has become a game to him thanks to the authorities in Aruba. This young lady's blood is on their hands, I hope they suffer a curse for many years to come over what they have done. They protected that monster and turned him loose on society, shame on them. That is my rant for the day and thoughts on this. Praying for the families of both angels.

[Northern Rose]

Poker and murder

Yes, poker can be murder, but folks, please don’t take that literally.  Of course in Jordan Van Der Sloots case, this may just turn out to be proof that you can’t bluff twice with the same hand.

If the name Van Der Sloot sounds familiar, he was one of the suspects in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway from a school trip to Aruba in 2005.  He was even filmed by one investigator confessing to her murder in a pot-fueled brag session.  But the judge refused to allow that as evidence.

Well, Van Der Sloot is in the news again and being pursued for the murder of a 21 year old woman whose body was recently found in a Lima, Peru, hotel room registered to Van Der Sloot.  Stephany Flores Ramirez who was found brutally stabbed apparently appears in a video from a Lima casino with Van Der Slot. 

So, what does this have to do with poker.  Well, really, very little.  Except Van Der Sloot was apparently in the country for the Latin American Poker Tournament.  So, now the Dutch player may have dealt himself a losing hand.  Van Der Sloot is on the run from the law, which isn’t the best way to bluff yourself through a problem. 

But the gossip is also full of rumors about Van Der Sloots online poker handles.  It’s suspected that the played as AANOTILTKK on Party Poker and shows winnings of at least $13,000.  He may also have played as Joran88 on Titan Poker though there aren’t any winnings associated with that account.  Some are rumoring that he may have been making enough money off of poker winnings to support himself.  So, the question is — can you play online poker from a Peruvian poker cell? 

http://www.onlinepokertutor.com/blog/?p=629

[Blonde]

Glenda Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:07 am

It was initially reported that Stephany was stabbed to death, and that turned into a pool of blood and splattered blood all over the walls ~ when in the end, there was no blood at all. In no way do I disregard her murder, God bless this young woman, may she rest in peace and sincere condolences for her family and friends. Someone on Nancy Grace said that Joran will be caught because he doesn't speak the language in South America.... Just shows you the ignorance of the American Media. They make it up as they go along.

[seemeatthebeach]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/06/03/earlyshow/main6544006.shtml

NEW YORK, June 3, 2010
Holloway Ally: Flores Murder Brings It All Back
Missing Persons Search Group Founder: Aruba Police Commissioner Said van der Sloot Responsible for Natalee's Death

(CBS)   Five years after Natalee Holloway went missing, the man who has previously been arrested riwce in connection with her disappearance, Joran van der Sloot, is now being sought in another killing, that of Stephany Flores, 21, whose body was found  Sunday in Lima, Peru.

Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equusearch, a non-profit organization that searches for missing persons, has assisted with the search of Natalee Holloway from almost the beginning, and has become very close with the Holloway family over the last five years.

Miller spoke Natalee Holloway's father, David Holloway, on Wednesday. Miller said David sends his condolences to Flores' family in Peru.

Miller said, "(David is) talking about what a senseless death that was, that we feel as though the cover-up that went on in Aruba, with Joran van der Sloot never being arrested, that we need to hold a lot of people accountable for Stephany's death in Peru. I mean, a very, very sad time for everybody. And Dave is just trying to, I think, just digest what's really happening in his life again right now. And of course it brings it all back to Dave and Beth, I'm sure that it's like it happened like yesterday. So there's disappointment, there's anger, there's frustrations. And, again, Stephany, there's no reason she should be dead today. Somebody made some huge mistakes over there."

Miller also discussed an incident two years ago in Aruba in which he and David Holloway were pulled over by a police commissioner.

"We were actually digging in a landfill, and we went back to get the permits to continue digging. And Gerold Dompig actually took us to a little warehouse -- it was kind of like we were into do some drug deal like you see on TV -- and he says, 'You don't need to be digging in the landfill anymore,' he said 'Joran van der Sloot is responsible for this, that body was taken out to sea.' Gerald Dompig's words to us were that Joran van der Sloot was a sociopath, that he controlled the entire family, even his father was afraid of him. And it's unfortunate that more couldn't be done to have Joran locked up."

He continued, "The other question is, 'Where has Joran been for the last five years?' We know he's traveled all over the country. Where is his money coming from, who has he been involved with? And we hate to even think like that. Did he kill Natalee, did he kill Stephany, yes, but he's really responsible for his father's death dying way before his time with the stress he went through. So Joran van der Sloot single-handedly probably destroyed an island, destroyed two different families, and certainly his own family."

Miller's own daughter, Laura Miller, was murdered in 1984 when she was 16. He founded Texas EquuSearch in 2000 in her memory and has since aided in the search of many missing persons including Natalee Holloway, Haleigh Cummings and victims of the 2004 tsunami.

Miller said the Holloways are still planning to look for Natalee's body.

"She deserves that funeral, Miller said, "And, yes, they want that person in prison for the rest of his life. And I know that feeling. I went through 17 months where Laura disappeared. … So I know what they go through. I made a promise to God and to Laura I'd never leave a family alone if there was anything I could ever do to help. And unfortunately, there's too many families out there."

[Northern Rose]

Notes psychologist in human behavior, Manuel Arámbulo
Dutchman suspected murderer kills without remorse

 | CPN RADIO - 03 JUN | Dutchman The alleged murderer, Joran Van Der Sloot, suffering from a psychological disorder that allows you to commit crimes without remorse.

The estimated Hoy por Hoy CPN Radio psychologist in human behavior, Manuel Arambula, who considered that such cases are very difficult to rehabilitate, as they need to teach the "ABC of moral behavior."

He stressed that these peculiar features of behavior are not easily detected, and recommended to the young people to be more cautious and not get carried away by their impulses or appearances to avoid becoming victims.

He said that now many people have been exposed to other cultures where individuals are presented with high violence and crime, to which we are not used.

http://www.cpnradio.pe/html/2010/06/03/11/1317.htm

[cece]

Joran Van Der Sloot Commits Suicide in Peru Border Latest Update. Remember the latest news about Joran Van Der Sloot, and that he committed suicide? There’s no evidence yet that he really committed suicide and his death is said to be fake. Many news sites across the globe are saying that he is really dead, but no reputable news site confirmed his death.

His body wasn’t really found and sources said that this death is just fake so that authorities will stop looking for him! Oh my gracious goodness!

Good thing, right now, Joran van der Sloot is found dead in Peru! Oh yeah! But, as we all know, this death maybe a fake. Ok?

http://www.parantar.com/2010/06/joran-van-der-sloot-commits-suicide-in-peru-border-latest-update/1256

[klaasend]

Glenda Posted: Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:07 am

It was initially reported that Stephany was stabbed to death, and that turned into a pool of blood and splattered blood all over the walls ~ when in the end, there was no blood at all. In no way do I disregard her murder, God bless this young woman, may she rest in peace and sincere condolences for her family and friends. Someone on Nancy Grace said that Joran will be caught because he doesn't speak the language in South America.... Just shows you the ignorance of the American Media. They make it up as they go along.

Actually it shows AGAIN the ignorance of Julia Renfro aka Glenda!  Stephany's blood is on Renfro's hands as well.  She's a useless waste of air.

[texasmom]

From EURobert's link...

http://www.terrorjaap.nl/2010/06/03/joran_bekent_iets_ergs_te_hebben_gedaan.html

Google translation:

[Northern Rose]

Front page of Peru21

[KittyMom]

Poor Tim.  He tries so hard for these families.