Natalee Case Discussion #679 8/26 - 8/31/2007

[Leslie]

Diario
http://www.diarioaruba.com/
Amigoe
http://www.amigoe.com/english/
BonDia
http://www.cspnv.com/
Solo di Pueblo
http://www.solodipueblo.com/
Aruba Today
http://www.arubatoday.com/
24ora
http://www.24ora.com/
Translator:
http://papiamentu.donamaro.nl

[Nut44x4]

That Zango pop up and the flashing ad crap to the right suck! DUGGaaaaaaaaaa, please make it go away. My pop up cop will take care of the tribal fusion garbage, but this Zango emotion thingy is driving me nuts. That flashing ad is bad for peeps w/ epilepsy also!! I don't have it, but I just may after reading here, arggggggg...sorry this is off topic.

[wreck]

That Zango pop up and the flashing ad crap to the right suck! DUGGaaaaaaaaaa, please make it go away. My pop up cop will take care of the tribal fusion garbage, but this Zango emotion thingy is driving me nuts. That flashing ad is bad for peeps w/ epilepsy also!! I don't have it, but I just may after reading here, arggggggg...sorry this is off topic.

Ads are what PAYS for this site. The onus is on us to use a browser that will block ads such as Maxthon or Firefox if they "annoy" you. 

[Dayhiker]

More from Deepak's June 11th Statement;

To your question as to where the story with the security guard came into the picture, I can say the following. I had made-up that part of the story.
To your question whether I had thought about telling the truth that night, I can say the following. I had not told the truth because in the first place Joran had asked me not to, he is my friend and I was afraid of the police because I thought that I would get into trouble with the police.

To your question as to how Joran was on the day that we went to “Carlos & Charlies”, I can say the following. He was sociable, not aggressive. In one word sociable. I do not know how much he had drank.
To your question how Natalee was that night in “Carlos & Charlies”, I can say the following. She danced beautifully, I had lied in my previous statement about her being unsteady on her feet when she stepped off the podium/stage. That was beside the truth. She had a steady walk. According to my opinion she was reasonably with it.

Thanks for posting Deepak's June 11 statement Klaas. Going back and reading it I realized he made many adjustments to his previous story. The parts where he recants that Natalee was not drunk, dropping Joran off at his house, etc.. It would be beneficial to compare his changes to those Joran and Satish made to theirs.

It is obvious the police were allowing them to share information duing this period, a definite taboo to good investigative technique. One more reason to suspect a highly corrupt ALE and prosecutor.

[klaasend]

From Satish's June 10th Statement:

How late did you arrive in Carlos & Charlies on Sunday May 29th 2005?

We had arrived at approximately 23.30 in Carlos & Charlies on that Sunday.

How did you meet/get to know the girl in Carlos & Charlies?

I have nothing more to state about that day.

Did Joran introduce the girl to you?

I don't know.

What did you (remark by the translator, you is mean plural here) when you were there?

I have no statement to make.

Till what time did you stay in Carlos & Charlies?

I have no statement to make.

Did the girl drink in Carlos & Charlies?

I have no statement to make.

What route did you take to the "Light House"? The Sasaki road or the road passing in front of Eagle Beach?

I have no statement to make.

How fast was your brother driving when he was driving towards the "Light House"?

I have no statement to make.

Are you 100% sure, that you dropped off the girl at the Holiday Inn?

I have no statement to make.

Why did you not help to try and find the girl after you had heard that she had gone missing?

I have nothing more to state.

At what time did you come home the night in question?

I have no statement to make.

When you had arrived home, what did you (remark by translator, plural) do?

I have no statement to make.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=190.0

[klaasend]

From Satish's June 11th Statement:

The statements I gave before were not entirely based on the truth.

I am now willing to make a statement in accordance with the truth.

On Sunday May 29th 2005, at approximately 21.45 hours I went to pick up my brother Deepak where he works. I went to pick up Deepak in Deepak's car. Deepak has a grey coloured car of the make Honda Civic. When I arrived at his place of work I waited for him. At approximately 22.10 Deepak got into the car. We drove from the Seaport Market Place to Taco Bell in Santa Cruz to buy something to eat. After we had bought something to eat at Taco Bell we drove home to eat. When we were sitting at home eating, my brother Deepak said to me that Joran had asked him if he could go to Carlos & Charlies. My brother told me that Joran had told him that he had on that day in the hours of the afternoon met a few girls in the casino, My brother did not tell me in which casino Joran had met these girls. I decided to go with my brother and Joran to Carlos & Charlies.

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

The father of Joran at that moment was sleeping inside the house. The mother of Joran was during that period still in the Netherlands. Joran said that his father did not know that he would be going out. On the way to Carlos and Charlies Joran told us that during that day in the afternoon hours he had met a few girls in the casino. Joran told us that he had helped a girl win back some of her father's money that she had lost. Joran had told us that she had lost three hundred something dollars of her father's money in the casino and that he had helped the girl win back a little over 100 dollars. Joran said that after the girl had won more than 100 dollars, he had told her that she should stop gambling. Joran said the girl had invited him to come to Carlos & Charlies. Joran did not mention the name of the girl.

[truthseeker2]

From Satish's June 11th Statement:

The statements I gave before were not entirely based on the truth.

I am now willing to make a statement in accordance with the truth.

On Sunday May 29th 2005, at approximately 21.45 hours I went to pick up my brother Deepak where he works. I went to pick up Deepak in Deepak's car. Deepak has a grey coloured car of the make Honda Civic. When I arrived at his place of work I waited for him. At approximately 22.10 Deepak got into the car. We drove from the Seaport Market Place to Taco Bell in Santa Cruz to buy something to eat. After we had bought something to eat at Taco Bell we drove home to eat. When we were sitting at home eating, my brother Deepak said to me that Joran had asked him if he could go to Carlos & Charlies. My brother told me that Joran had told him that he had on that day in the hours of the afternoon met a few girls in the casino, My brother did not tell me in which casino Joran had met these girls. I decided to go with my brother and Joran to Carlos & Charlies.

This is similar to what Jaime has said about a phone call from Joran.

[jackb]

More from Deepak's June 11th Statement:

To your question as to how I think about Joran making statements against me and my brother, I can say the following. I think he that he did this to blame the whole thing on us.

To your question as to what I think happened to the girl or what Joran did to her, I can say the following, I think that he raped her and is afraid to state that. I don't think he murdered her.

To your question as to why I think he has raped her, I can say the following. I think that because he doesn't want to tell the truth. That is the only reason I can think of.

To your question whether Joran could have been involved with a rape some time before, I can say the following. I do not know. My brother told me once that a girl had said that she had been impregnated by Joran. I do not know what happened after that.

To your question whether the statement I have just made is entirely in accordance with the truth, I can say the following. My statement is in accordance with the truth. I swear to you that this is the truth.

I believe at least one of the shoes is in the "bag picture" with her head resting on it.
jack/b

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

My brother Deepak parked the car behind the former Ritsz building. After my brother had parked the car, the three of us walked to Carlos & Charlies. I saw that on the right side, when you walk into Carlos & Charlies, a group of Americans. I knew that they were Americans because they were talking in English. This group consisted of approximately 60 to 70 people. We kept on walking and stood and watched near the podium. On the podium was a girl. When the girl saw us, she made it clear with hand gestures that she wanted Joran to come and dance with her. I saw that Joran made it clear with a hand gesture that he would not go and dance with her. We started walking again until we got to the bar. Joran had bought three Yard Whisky coke for us. After that we returned to the podium to stand and watch. While we were standing there watching the girl, who had wanted Joran to come and dance with her, came over to Joran. Joran and the girl started talking. I saw that my brother was talking to a boy. The boy with whom my brother was talking I know by face only, I do not know his name. I had seen him in Carlos & Charlies before. I saw that the girl took Joran by the hand and lead him to another bar. I followed them. My brother stayed behind because he was talking to this boy. I saw that the girl laid down on top of the bar. I had never seen this before. (BS you go to CnC regularly and you've never seen this before?)I asked Joran "What is she going to do." Joran told me that the girl wanted him to drink a bodyshot off of her. I saw that the girl poured a drink on her belly, after which Joran drank it (sucked it up). The girl had paid for the bodyshot (drink). According to me I had stood alone for a while. Joran came over to me with the girl and told me that the bar had closed. It started to get busier at Carlos & Charlies. I assumed that this had to do with the fact that the activity called "Soul Beach" had just ended.

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

We, Joran, the girl and myself, had walked over to another bar where we had earlier bought the Yard's.

I had not seen my brother anymore. I saw that Joran and the girl were about to drink a shot. At that point I received a "missed call". I did not hear the phone but felt that I was being called, this was because I had set my mobile phone to vibrate.

I saw that my brother had called me. I know that my brother didn't have any more credit on his mobile phone and had called him back. My brother answered his phone and asked where we were. I told him that we were still inside Carlos & Charlies. He had told me that he was already at his car. I told him that we would come to where he was. I said to Joran that my brother was already at the car and if we were leaving, because Carlos & Charlies was about to close. Joran said that it was OK that we would be leaving and that the girl would be coming with us. We, Joran, the girl and myself, then walked outside

Remember Deepak said Satish came out to the car by himself first, gave Deepak the keys, then went back inside and got Joran and Natalee.

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

My brother then drove on. We then drove by way of the city center towards the boulevard near where the Sonesta Hotel is. When we got close to the Sonesta Hotel he turned right and drove towards the hotels. When we got to the intersection west of Royal Plaza, we saw that the people where no longer standing at the intersection. We drove on in a westerly direction. We were driving on the boulevard where the gas station is when the girl said she wanted to go see the sharks in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Joran told the girl that there were no shark in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Then the girl said that the "lighthouse" was the only place on Aruba that she had not yet seen. The girl said that she wanted to see the "lighthouse". Joran then told my brother to drive to the "lighthouse" if the girl wanted to go and see the "lighthouse". My brother then drove towards the "lighthouse". While my brother was driving towards the "lighthouse" Joran and the girl were talking in the back of the car. I could not hear what Joran and the girl were talking about. The music in the car was on so loud that we could not hear what the people in the back of the car were saying. During the drive I had at one point heard that the girl had said the word "hitler". I had turned down the music a little. I then heard the girl saying that she was related to "hitler" and that her mother was the sister of "hitler" (BS). I also heard the girl saying that she was from Alabama and that her parents owned a plantation there that had slaves working on the plantation (more BS). Joran had told me later that the girl had asked him if we were his slaves. But I had not heard that.

[truthseeker2]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

We, Joran, the girl and myself, had walked over to another bar where we had earlier bought the Yard's.

I had not seen my brother anymore. I saw that Joran and the girl were about to drink a shot. At that point I received a "missed call". I did not hear the phone but felt that I was being called, this was because I had set my mobile phone to vibrate.

I saw that my brother had called me. I know that my brother didn't have any more credit on his mobile phone and had called him back. My brother answered his phone and asked where we were. I told him that we were still inside Carlos & Charlies. He had told me that he was already at his car. I told him that we would come to where he was. I said to Joran that my brother was already at the car and if we were leaving, because Carlos & Charlies was about to close. Joran said that it was OK that we would be leaving and that the girl would be coming with us. We, Joran, the girl and myself, then walked outside

Remember Deepak said Satish came out to the car by himself first, gave Deepak the keys, then went back inside and got Joran and Natalee.

This is what I was asking about yesterday.  This seems important to me but I don't know why.  Deepak and Satish have different stories here.  Seems like one of them may not have actually been there or one of them is lying.  Why tell this particular lie?

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

My brother continued to drive into the direction of the "lighthouse". When we had passed the traffic lights at Wendy's, I saw that Joran and the girl were kissing. Whilst my brother was driving in a northerly direction, I saw a car pull up aside of us and procede left in the direction of the Holiday Inn Hotel. We were still driving in a northerly direction. My brother kept on driving till we reached the "lighthouse". When we had arrived at the "lighthouse" my brother asked Joran if the girl wanted to see the "lighthouse". Joran then said that he didn't think she would want to see it because she had fallen asleep. At that moment I turned around and saw that the girl was lying on Joran's lap and that she was sleeping. Joran had awakened the girl. Joran then told my brother that he didn't think that the girl would want to see the "lighthouse".   The girl had been awake then. Joran then asked the girl if she was staying in the Holiday Inn hotel. The girl answered that she was staying at the Holiday Inn hotel. Joran then said to my brother that he should drive to the Holiday Inn hotel to drop off the girl. My brother then drove in the direction of the Holiday Inn hotel.

[San]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

My brother Deepak parked the car behind the former Ritsz building. After my brother had parked the car, the three of us walked to Carlos & Charlies. I saw that on the right side, when you walk into Carlos & Charlies, a group of Americans. I knew that they were Americans because they were talking in English. This group consisted of approximately 60 to 70 people. We kept on walking and stood and watched near the podium. On the podium was a girl. When the girl saw us, she made it clear with hand gestures that she wanted Joran to come and dance with her. I saw that Joran made it clear with a hand gesture that he would not go and dance with her. We started walking again until we got to the bar. Joran had bought three Yard Whisky coke for us. After that we returned to the podium to stand and watch. While we were standing there watching the girl, who had wanted Joran to come and dance with her, came over to Joran. Joran and the girl started talking. I saw that my brother was talking to a boy. The boy with whom my brother was talking I know by face only, I do not know his name. I had seen him in Carlos & Charlies before. I saw that the girl took Joran by the hand and lead him to another bar. I followed them. My brother stayed behind because he was talking to this boy. I saw that the girl laid down on top of the bar. I had never seen this before. (BS you go to CnC regularly and you've never seen this before?)I asked Joran "What is she going to do." Joran told me that the girl wanted him to drink a bodyshot off of her. I saw that the girl poured a drink on her belly, after which Joran drank it (sucked it up). The girl had paid for the bodyshot (drink). According to me I had stood alone for a while. Joran came over to me with the girl and told me that the bar had closed. It started to get busier at Carlos & Charlies. I assumed that this had to do with the fact that the activity called "Soul Beach" had just ended.

Was this ever confirmed about Joran drinking a body shot off Natalee.  Or is it just him saying this.  I remember the first time we heard anything about a body shot it was from the Kalpoes lawyer.

[msmarple]

There were a few comments on previous pages about abortion on Aruba. Abortion is illegal there. It is not illegal in The Netherlands. Occasional discussions on Aruba about changing this, at least in some cases, meet great resistance.

(For what it's worth - abortion probably is illegal in most Central and South American countries and throughout the Caribbean. I don't know that for a fact.)
 
Similarly - "gay marriage" has recently been an issue on Aruba. A couple that had a civil union in The Netherlands moved (or tried to move) to Aruba. The Netherlands insisted that the union must be recognized, but Aruba insisted not. I did not follow this closely so I'm not sure of the outcome. IIRC, they were females.

[klaasend]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

After we got home I immediately went to sleep. My brother had gone into his room. I do not know if he immediately went to sleep. On May 30th 2005 I had awoken between 11.00 hours and 12.00 hours. When I woke up I asked my brother if he knew how Joran had made it to his house. My brother told me that he had been called during the night hours by Joran. My brother told me that when he was talking to Joran, he could hear that Joran was breathing heavily. My brother told me that had asked Joran what he was doing at the time. Joran had told my brother that he was at that time walking home towards his house. My brother told me that he had asked Joran about the girl and that Joran had told him that he had left the girl at the beach. According to my brother Joran had told him that he had taken off his shoes and that he and the girl had gone into the water. Joran had then told my brother that after that he and the girl had gotten out of the water and that the girl had fallen asleep on the beach. Joran told my brother that he had then tried to wake up the girl but that she had not awakened. Joran told my brother that he had looked to find his shoes but that he couldn't find them. Joran told my brother that he had left the girl on the beach and that he had walked home barefoot.

[San]

More from Satish's June 11th Statement:

My brother then drove on. We then drove by way of the city center towards the boulevard near where the Sonesta Hotel is. When we got close to the Sonesta Hotel he turned right and drove towards the hotels. When we got to the intersection west of Royal Plaza, we saw that the people where no longer standing at the intersection. We drove on in a westerly direction. We were driving on the boulevard where the gas station is when the girl said she wanted to go see the sharks in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Joran told the girl that there were no shark in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Then the girl said that the "lighthouse" was the only place on Aruba that she had not yet seen. The girl said that she wanted to see the "lighthouse". Joran then told my brother to drive to the "lighthouse" if the girl wanted to go and see the "lighthouse". My brother then drove towards the "lighthouse". While my brother was driving towards the "lighthouse" Joran and the girl were talking in the back of the car. I could not hear what Joran and the girl were talking about. The music in the car was on so loud that we could not hear what the people in the back of the car were saying. During the drive I had at one point heard that the girl had said the word "hitler". I had turned down the music a little. I then heard the girl saying that she was related to "hitler" and that her mother was the sister of "hitler" (BS). I also heard the girl saying that she was from Alabama and that her parents owned a plantation there that had slaves working on the plantation (more BS). Joran had told me later that the girl had asked him if we were his slaves. But I had not heard that.

BS is right.

So when they first took Natalee they had the radio so loud that no one could hear her screaming.  Then when they felt it was safe (VDS Home) they lowered the radio so they would not bring attention to what was going on in the car.  This is where I believe Joran's neighbor came out and told him to lower the radio.   This all happened at the Paul Van der Sloot's home and no where else.

[msmarple]

Stand Up for Natalee:
Travel/Tourism Trade Shows Coming Up!

Atlantic City - October 30, 31

King of Prussia PA - November 17, 18

Ft lauderdale - November 17, 18

Luxury Travel Show in Vegas - December 4 - 6.

Tourism/Travel Show thread, current Page 9:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1003.160
(It would be good to read the entire thread if you are interested in participating. There are tips, reports, photos, etc.)

Email this address if you're interested, or to learn where to send donation for brochures, buttons, signs, etc.:
JusticeforNatalee@gmail.com

Notes re. these two shows, previously listed:

Chicago - Sept. 25 - 27 - No Natalee demo. The show is in the middle of the week, which probably involves too much time away from work or home for most Monkeys.

Minnesota - Oct. 27, 28 - Show was cancelled due to bridge collapse.

[igsigs]

Bon Dia / Arubagirl article @ RU

Decision to prosecute or not will be made in November.