Lively Case Discussion #483 6/29/2006

[blah]

Blah  - here's what I know.  Without naming the nickname of the poster I will say that she was a poster at SM.  She was "close" to Deepak and confided in me that Deepak was very upset with her over the FBI deal.  What it sounded like to me is that Deepak was very worried about the Gardener witness, that the Gardener may have actually seen them.  That's all I know.

do you still communicate with her?

No, haven't for months.

Dam.  It sure would be nice to know if the FBI interrogated her, or at least asked a few questions.

[Anna]

[
yeah, now add to that - the gardener is gone.  What happneed to him, does anyone even know?

Was he deported as an illegal?  Or ran away to keep from being jailed like the current Colombian?

[igsigs]

JQK on Greta tonight...

[blah]

[
yeah, now add to that - the gardener is gone.  What happneed to him, does anyone even know?

Was he deported as an illegal?  Or ran away to keep from being jailed like the current Colombian?

i'm pretty sure he was deported, but where to? Why? Has anyone contacted him since?  Can he still be brought back to aruba to testify if need be?

[Anna]

Blah,
I am sure the FBI took her statement.  They also did those of the MB students but ALE didn't even bother to read them for months.  Not until they decided they could be used to cast aspersions elsewhere and away from J2K.  Maybe no one has bothered to read what she said.

You have to want to build a case and be actually looking for information to find it.  

[SunFreak2]

Sunfreak,
Post that article you posted the other day about their descent into permissiveness!  It applies here and bears repeating, please.

.

This one?

Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 5:32 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Social & Domestic Issues
Replace Liberal with Morally Decayed
by Mike Thompson
Posted Jun 23, 2005

Fifty years ago, a decade after Europeans had been extricated from the hellhole of World War Two by their magnanimous American cousins, the Old World denizens again were enjoying the fruits of civility envisioned for them in their Maker’s original Garden of Eden.

Yet, British writer William Golding, eventual winner of a Nobel Price for literature, foresaw how easily barbarism again could vanquish the West’s inherent Christian decency. His Lord of the Flies, published in 1954, was the first of three allegorical novels that would explore fundamental challenges to human existence, survival and freedom. Lord of the Flies specifically describes the horrific slide into savagery by aband of young children following the crash of their plane on a small tropical island (not too unlike Aruba, in the southern Caribbean).
True to Golding’sprophetic vision, by the mid- 1960s Western Europe, including the redoubtable British Isles, had begun a hedonistic rear march into the hypnotic ancient land of Anything Goes. In the Netherlands (AKA Holland), the Dutch even would coin a word to describe their retreat to moral anarchy: gedoogcultuur, “the culture of permissiveness.” (Remember, these are the same people who a few decades earlier had contributed to English language the term “Dutch uncle,” that is, a stern, relatively decent mentor who tries to keep others on the straight and narrow path.)

Here, as Golding predicted with clarity, are some terminal, cancerous, liberal sores that today fester on Holland’s once-traditional and healthy body politic:

Scantily clad prostitutes laze about in urban storefronts so that sex-hungry passersby can window-shop for a steamy middle-of-the-day liaison. Meantime, the Sex Workers Union (blue-collar hookers) is pushing the Dutch government to allow the pimpish labor bosses to crank up in Amsterdam’s Schiphol Airport the fastfood-restaurant-sounding “YumYum Caviar Club,” which actually would be a bordello for horny in-transit travelers. (One of the Netherlands’ biggest imports has become “whordes,”so to speak, of attractive young East European women to replace the aging pool of native Dutch prostitutes.)
Local and tourist pedophiles, the most unrepentent of dirty old men, roam the land with impunity since the 1990 national “reform” legislation lowered the age of sexual consent to 12 (think of your own children and grandchildren when they were that age, one year shy of being even a teenager).
The grossest pornography available can be purchased in chain grocery stores, just down the aisle from tofu and skim milk, and graphic nudity is a big hit on “family hour” prime-time, through-the-air television.
Marriage is a legal right of homosexuals, even if it includes serial infidelity on both sides.
“Dutch treat” has become another perverted expression, no longer meaning that two people at the same table simply pay for their own share of the food or drink bill. The only Dutch “treat” today is physically, mentally and socially ruinous, and exemplified by 210 Amsterdam “coffee shops” that really are dens for foreign and domestic marijuana users, and 75 “bars” for hash heads. Holland has become the drug capital of Europe and is blamed by Britain and France for exporting at least 80% of the heroin marketed into those countries, and 100% of the trade in nightmarish psychedelic substance Ecstasy.Meantime, absorbed with systemic liberal guilt over its colonial past, the Netherlands has opened the floodgates for immigrants from Indonesia, the Islamic colony in Asia which the Dutch ruled for three
Meantime, absorbed with systemic liberal guilt over its colonial past, the Netherlands has opened the floodgates for immigrants from Indonesia, the Islamic colony in Asia which the Dutch ruled for three centuries. This has resulted in one million Muslims (6% of Netherlands’ population) living in little Holland (slightly larger than Maryland), whose four largest cities now count Muslims under age 14 as the majority of their youth. Such immigration also has resulted in an outbreak of deadly tit-for-tat terrorism between Indonesians and a handful of unapologetically militant Dutch nationalists.
All these sad details of Dutch decay are important because it goes a long way toward explaining what is happening, and not happening, in Dutch-owned Aruba, an island speck that is a world away geographically but only a heartbeat away culturally from the motherland.

No longer a colony but a full-fledged political division of the distant Netherlands, Aruba is a mélange of 70,000 multicultural souls on an island off the South American coast about the size of Washington, DC.

Like Mother Holland, Aruba boasts that its crime rate is “very low.” Also like Mother Holland, however, Aruba has a low crime rate in large part because so little tawdry and outright dangerous activity in its laissez-faire environment actually qualifies as a crime; furthermore, if such activity is criminal, the police tradition in many cases (based on the Dutch model) is to wink at the perps and head for the nearest Dunkin’van Donuts for a quick sugar-fix. In the wake of the highly reported May 20 disappearance of teenage American tourist Natalee Holloway, USA Today has reported this less-than-professional Aruban attitude toward crime statistics:

“Detailed crime statistics are hard to come by: In 2003, the most recent year with available data, there were 4,236 crimes, though no specifics on those against tourists. According to Aruba's attorney general, five homicides were reported last year. But police have not provided a breakdown of offenses since 1995, says Martijn Balkestein of the Central Bureau of Statistics.”

A more frightening portrait of Dutch/Aruban police incompetence in dealing with “noncriminal criminals” emerged in an Associated Press story that details how Natalee’skinfolk in Alabama, not the Karibbean Kops, nailed the prime suspect, the playboy son of an influential local official:

[thirdstrike]

Blah - to let you know how long it's been, the last time I communicated with her was when we still had the PM feature.  I will tell you that she did not live in Aruba but the US.

Was she a Super Hero?

[Anna]

.
Yes, Sunfreak,
Thanks!  That is a very good explanation of what is wrong with them and why they think we are also like they are.

 

[Jacqueline]

so no one knows anything about the dame that called the FBI and told them about Deepak trying to get her to lie for him?

Are you referring to the one that Skeeters talked to Deepak about in the taped conversation?

I dont know if it is the same girl or not.  Deepak called this girl after being in court to hear the testimony of the gardner witness.  Here is Beths quote:

"Nancy, go back to August, go back when the gardener`s statement was given before the judge of instruction, sworn testimony, the defense, the prosecutor, Deepak, Satish, and Joran.

And what happened was his statement was credible and Deepak panicked. He panicked that very day, made a phone call to a girl looking for an alibi. This young woman became very upset and concerned, made a phone call to the FBI. She did not want to be involved in it."

I find it interesting that she called the FBI instead of the ALE, expecially if she was in Aruba.  Did she know about ALE involvement and knew she couldnt go to them??

She contacted the FBI because she lives in the United States. At least that is what I presume given the fact she called them first.

[KatzHome]

I think we should forget about the "other" message boards (well, at least the "dirty" ones) from this point forward.  We represent the best of the best here.  They are simply jealous of that.  Ever notice that those sites are filled with our "banished ones"?  It rarely happens in reverse of that.  That says someting about the quality of content here.  We should ALL be proud of that fact...

Scared Monkeys truly is the very best site around ~ Red and Tom and Mrs. Red have Hearts of Gold for having this site for us.  Klaas is truly a class act ~ a Heart of Gold and the patience of a Saint ~ and artistic and funny to boot!  Red's Front Page Posts are read and quoted on Natalee boards everywhere.  And twice now the Monkeys have gathered together for a full day of prayer ~ and the second time even included people who don't even post here!

This place is a refuge for me.  Yeah, I'm sitting back and just mostly agreeing with the Monkeys ~ I mostly post OT stuff, some graphics and just say hello here ~ everything that can and should be said on the case has already been said by one of the other Monkeys.

BTW ~ the Monkeys are truly THE BEST POSTERS that I've ever had the pleasure of posting with.

I am so very thankful that I don't have to make posts defending Natalee or Beth or anyone in Natalee's family ~ thankful that I don't have to post in defense of the major players who are helping the family ~ thankful that I don't have to defend myself for boycotting Aruba and the Netherlands and the products that the Netherlands exports ~ thankful that I post with people who care enough to put a Natalee bumper sticker on their cars ~ and who are angry enough to put a Boycott Aruba bumper sticker on there too!

And truly thankful that those who do not support the family, who oppose all help for the family ~ will not find a home here.

Yeah, I post sometimes at BFN and now at PFN ~ but there really is no place like the Monkey Cage ~ and I can't even be bothered reading at any other sites ~ I don't even want their garbage to be filtered through my mind.

[Anna]

[
Was she a Super Hero?

Right out of Marvel comics??  

.

[klaasend]

JQK on Greta tonight...

Thanks for the heads up!!

[blah]

Didnt Jossy have some connection to the gardner witness? Maybe we could find out more from him.

[klaasend]

Blah - to let you know how long it's been, the last time I communicated with her was when we still had the PM feature.  I will tell you that she did not live in Aruba but the US.

Was she a Super Hero?

               

Heck no!!  NO WAY!  

[KatzHome]

Peaches has got it, I know I think Anita is the wiser here - where is San???

San like me thinks Anita knows a plenty  

make that three of us

Make that four +

[blah]

She contacted the FBI because she lives in the United States. At least that is what I presume given the fact she called them first.

so she lives in the US but just happened to be in Aruba the night they killed Natalee??

[Jacqueline]

She contacted the FBI because she lives in the United States. At least that is what I presume given the fact she called them first.

so she lives in the US but just happened to be in Aruba the night they killed Natalee??

Oh blah, i really don't know.

I just assumed reading these posts that if she called the FBI she was American. I could be way off base.

Just a hunch, that's all.

[blah]

She contacted the FBI because she lives in the United States. At least that is what I presume given the fact she called them first.

so she lives in the US but just happened to be in Aruba the night they killed Natalee??

Oh blah, i really don't know.

I just assumed reading these posts that if she called the FBI she was American. I could be way off base.

Just a hunch, that's all.

oh.  It would be pretty tough for her to provide an alibi for Deepak if she was in the US at the time.  Thats why I assumed she was an Aruban.

[KatzHome]

That is why I believe this happened at a motel/hotel or some place near the beach.  They may have gone to the VDS house but I just do not believe it happened there.  I think Paulus had found a room at a hotel/motel and it occurred somewhere near the HI, perhaps even the HI.  How do we know what those cameras showed or did not show ? If it showed them taking Natlaee there, you know the powers that be at HI, had that all deleted and redone by the time Beth arrived.  No way did they want their little house of horrors involved in this and thus, the nice gesture to let Beth stay so she would be less than wise to their goings-on.

I don't know.  I've never been of the belief that Paulus had any involvement deeper then helping to conceal the crime after the fact (and disposing of her body).  I just can't (for whatever reason) see him being directly involved with her rape and murder...

I almost completly agree with you there, Strike...

But ~ since we're not on the beach anymore ~ the most logical place for Natalee's death ~ at least to me ~ is the VDsloot compound.

And I think that Joran ran for Paulus while Natalee was dying ~ seeking his advice.

I think it was Paulus who decided that it was better for them to just let her die ~ to not take her for help.  That he would take care of getting rid of her body.

[Jacqueline]

She contacted the FBI because she lives in the United States. At least that is what I presume given the fact she called them first.

so she lives in the US but just happened to be in Aruba the night they killed Natalee??

Oh blah, i really don't know.

I just assumed reading these posts that if she called the FBI she was American. I could be way off base.

Just a hunch, that's all.

oh.  It would be pretty tough for her to provide an alibi for Deepak if she was in the US at the time.  Thats why I assumed she was an Aruban.

Yes, and i can see where you would go that way.
And i guess when i read FBI i just thought of USA.