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Stacy Ann Peterson missing & Kathleen Savio murdered - Illinois
> Topic:
Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
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Topic: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1 (Read 1035501 times)
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1400 on:
June 05, 2010, 06:48:53 PM »
twitter:
Joe Hosey
Police may or may not keep looking around. Will leave a "police presence" to stand guard.
2 minutes ago via txt
~~~
Hmmmmm... seems that LE has gone all mums the word again. May or may not.. <rolls eyes>
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cece
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1401 on:
June 05, 2010, 06:49:04 PM »
Aerial view of the site where authorities are searching for the possible remains of Stacy Peterson
http://www.youtube.com/v/iJuiuxG9VbE&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0&border=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJuiuxG9VbE
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Gypsy DD
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1402 on:
June 05, 2010, 06:50:41 PM »
Quote from: Wyks on June 05, 2010, 06:40:22 PM
From twitter..
joehosey
State police: the search for Stacy might go as long as a week.
2 minutes ago via txt
joehosey
No evidence found on first day of search. A forensic anthropologist has been digging with a shovel in a 10-by-10 area.
less than a minute ago via txt
So this seems like a credible lead. One thing I am confused on is one article says the cellmate told LE then lead them to the location Friday. Another article says that the cellmate told LE , who then went to an accomplice..who verified. So are the cellmate and the accomplice the same person? Who of Drew's old buddies might be in jail now..former LE, etc..that he would have called in 2007 to help move a body?
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"Commit a crime and the world is made of glass."
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1403 on:
June 05, 2010, 06:58:06 PM »
Cece, thanks! Looks like the helicopter finally got up in the air. lol
Gypsy, I dunno, but good points! Could be one and the same, could be garbled info. May take awhile to straighten out what is truly what.
Am wondering if this 'sudden about face' by the anthropologist etc, is just a ploy to throw media off so they'll leave. ?? They actually 'could have' found something and don't want media breathing over their shoulders. Dunno what else to think. Would they really have gone to all this trouble to just all of a sudden up and leave? I don't think so!!
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1404 on:
June 05, 2010, 07:04:36 PM »
Still a good 2 1/2 to 3 hours daylight left. I'm in central, same as Illionois, and it doesn't even start getting dark until after 9p. It's only 6p here. Wonder why they 'quit' for the day?
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trimmonthelake
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1405 on:
June 05, 2010, 07:19:22 PM »
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/06/05/Police-get-solid-leads-on-Stacy-Peterson/UPI-24231275778676/
Police get 'solid leads' on Stacy Peterson
Published: June 5, 2010 at 6:57 PM
PEORIA, Ill., June 5 (UPI) -- Investigators dug in a wooded area near Peoria, Ill., Saturday, working from what were described as "pretty solid leads" in the search for Stacy Peterson.
The fourth wife of former Bolingbrook, Ill., police officer Drew Peterson has been missing since October 2007. He is awaiting trial in the 2004 drowning death of his third wife, Kathleen Savio, and is a suspect in the disappearance of Stacy Peterson.
Searchers were digging at a property owned by David Alwan, who said county, state and federal investigators were at his farm Friday, the Chicago Tribune reported Saturday.
"They had pretty solid leads with specific coordinates," Alwan said.
As of Saturday afternoon, no remains had been located, the Tribune reported.
Celebrity news Web site TMZ reported Friday authorities received a tip from a prisoner who said Drew Peterson had described a place where Stacy Peterson's remains would be found. However, Will County sheriff's spokesman Pat Barry said police did not get a tip from an inmate and Drew Peterson's attorney, Joel Brodsky, said the former police officer "couldn't talk to somebody if he wanted to," the Chicago Sun-Times reported Saturday.
"I heard it's a friend of a friend of a friend -- there's nothing there," Brodsky said. "I think TMZ should stick to Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt."
Pam Bosco, a spokeswoman for the family of Stacy Peterson, said, "We've just been told it's a very good lead and they're very hopeful," the Sun-Times reported.
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Gypsy DD
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1406 on:
June 05, 2010, 07:31:23 PM »
I don't know what to make of it..maybe in the wooded areas, and under a tarp it is slow going. Maybe they want to bring different dogs back, different equipment?
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1407 on:
June 05, 2010, 07:50:14 PM »
Could be, Gypsy! Seems the ISP didn't want the media out there anyway. Could be they just need different tools and drier ground to work with. Maybe hoping that telling the media 'kk we're done, nothing to see here, move along now, move along', that the media won't stick around to watch, or come back tomorrow and the next day? lolol.. yeah right, like that's gonna happen. Not!
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flutter1
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1408 on:
June 05, 2010, 08:02:42 PM »
Some insight as to why the state and fed officials are running this investigation instead of locals.
http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/chicago-political-commentary/2010/05/riley-fox-killer-identified-six-years-after-will-county-illinois-screwed-it-up.html
Quote
Riley Fox Killer Identified Six Years After Will County & Illinois Screwed It Up
Three high-profile cases; Riley Fox, Lisa Stebic and Drew Peterson. All have captured national headlines and all have had investigative and legal hiccups along the way. It is not a comforting thought that we have to question the competence of our authorities. Matter of fact, it is downright disconcerting. As a taxpayer, I also do not like the prospect of large jury awards that will ultimately have to be paid by us.
Kevin Fox and his wife had been originally awarded a $15.5 Million jury award. It has now twice been appealed and whittled down to $8 Million. In the latest appeal, the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals agreed with the jury's decision that the Will County police framed Kevin Fox but lowered the award anyway. Judge Terence Evans, in a 52-page decision found that detectives lacked probable cause to arrest Fox given the "exceedingly weak evidence." The 7th Circuit also chastised the investigators on the case, implying that "their decision to quickly rule out the girls death as the work of a sexual predator was absurd...
One thing is for sure, everything is not always what it seems when it comes to crime solving in Will County. It does not give me a peaceful easy feeling!"
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Nut44x4
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1409 on:
June 05, 2010, 08:14:29 PM »
Police end the search for Stacy Peterson's body
June 5, 2010
Authorities have ended their search for the remains of Stacy Peterson today, and it appears they
did not find any evidence of her remains
.
A forensic anthropologist hired by police to help search for her remains in a wooded area near Peoria gave up his search shortly before 6 p.m., state police said this evening.
Police said there were no immediate plans to resume searching.
"We are pursuing some other avenues in reference to this lead and we will be back in this area," State Police Master Sgt. Tom Burek said. But he offered no timetable for a return.
A police source said nothing was found during the day-long search. Asked if he was optimistic the lead -- which reportedly came from a prison inmate -- was valid, the source said: "I'm not convinced yet, put it that way."
Acting on a tip, police began digging for the missing remains of Stacy Peterson, the fourth wife of ex-Bolingbrook cop Drew Peterson, in a muddy, remote wooded area near the Kickapoo River outside of Peoria.
“They must think it’s pretty credible ... they’re here,” State Police Master Sgt. Tom Burek said from near the digging site, which he described as a “very low remote area.”
“Obviously, because of the rain, it's very muddy right now. It's thick with timber. It's a muddy mess out there,” Burek said.
The area where authorities were digging was closed off by a wrought iron gate identifying the place as “Big Hollow Huntsman’s,” punctuated with pictures of deer and pheasants.
Peterson’s family members were not on the scene, said family spokeswoman Pam Bosco, but they were watching with hope they might finally get an answer to Stacy’s whereabouts.
State police didn't give the family details about the nature of the lead or where the tip came from, but were told "it’s a very good lead and they’e very hopeful,” Bosco said.
“They’ve been more positive on this than any of the leads they had in the past,” she added. “If it pans out, fine. If it doesn’t, we won’t be surprised. We’ve been down this road before, just like in Chanahon,” she said, referring to a body found in the Des Plaines River a year ago that was believed might be Stacy.
So where did the tip come from?
TMZ.com was reporting that it came from another inmate who said Drew Peterson told the fellow inmate where he buried his fourth wife. But both police and Peterson’s attorney scoffed at that report.
“The tip did not come from an inmate at the jail,” said Will County Sheriff’s spokesman Pat Barry. “The people I've talked with have no knowledge of anything.”
“Drew couldn’t talk to somebody if he wanted to,” said his attorney, Joel Brodsky. “I heard it’s a friend of a friend of a friend — there’s nothing there. I think TMZ should stick to Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt.”
Sources confirm that law enforcement, using dogs, first searched a hunting area near Peoria Friday. State Police and Will County State’s Attorney officials are back today. Stacy Peterson has been missing since Oct. 26, 2007. Peterson is considered a suspect in her disappearance. He has said he suspects she is still alive somewhere.
Peterson is about to stand trial, as soon as next month, in the 2004 drowning death of his third wife, Kathleen Savio. Her death was initally ruled an accident, but authorities reopened the case after Stacy Peterson disappeared. A new autopsy ruled it was a homicide, and Peterson was arrested and charged with murder.
He has denied any involvement in Savio's death or Stacy Peterson's disappearance. “Ever since Stacy disappeared, there have been numerous rumors about finding her body and about Drew. The one thing all of them have had in common is they always proved to be false,” Peterson defense attorney Steven Greenberg said Saturday.
“There's no real facts or evidence to back them up. In fact, there's never been a single piece of hard evidence in either Stacy's disappearance or Kathleen's death, that shows Drew is guilty of anything," Greenberg maintained.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/24-7/2358222,drew-peterson-stacy-body-dig-peoria-060510.article
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Nut44x4
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1410 on:
June 05, 2010, 08:15:29 PM »
Unbelievable.....
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Brothers and Sisters, I bid you beware/Of giving your heart to a dog to tear -- Rudyard Kipling
One who doesn't trust is never deceived...
'I remained too much inside my head and ended up losing my mind' -Edgar Allen Poe
Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1411 on:
June 05, 2010, 08:37:41 PM »
Illinois State Police with the help of a local anthropological team were searching since daybreak in a rural area outside Peoria where Stacy's body was believed to have been buried.
Officials planned to return later in the week with more "sophisticated equipment."
<more at link>
http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local-beat/Cops-Deny-Lead-on-Stacy-Petersons-Body-tmz-95683979.html#fb
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1412 on:
June 06, 2010, 12:53:16 AM »
Dang, maybe this is one reason why the ISP closed the search so abruptly, put the sides of the search tent down and left a bit after 6p. They got out of that area just in the nick of time!
BreakingNews
PJStar:
http://bit.ly/9eh7m5
Witnesses describe Elmwood, Il, as war zone as
15 tornadoes reportedly touch down near Peoria, Il
At least 15 tornados have touched down in the Tri-County Area between 7:45 p.m. and 9:15 p.m., and a tornado watch for much of central Illinois remains in effect until 11 p.m.
Two of those tornados hit Elmwood four minutes apart, causing what witnesses said looked like a war zone.
Officials there said there were no apparent injuries or fatalities as of 9:30 p.m.
Tornados also touched down in Peoria, Hanna City, Washington and East Peoria. Damage reports from those twisters were not immediately available.
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1413 on:
June 06, 2010, 01:58:06 AM »
An 'on the scene' report by a local, a member at WS, who posted these over there:
It's Not the Nanny
06-05-2010 11:11 PM
Sorry it's taken so long for me to get back on here!
My friend and I were on our way out to dinner and decided to drive by the property. Several police cars were at the end of the drive blocking it's entrance. You could not see any activity or how many cars/police were on the scene due to the woods and rolling hills. (you definitely couldn't see the blue tent from the road)
My friend and I drove a bit farther down from the driveway entrance they were blocking and parked next to a TV truck from Chicago 7. We befriended the camera guy and he said he really thought something was found by what they were hearing and how the LE were acting.
I asked where all the other news media crews were (no local media was there ... and only this one station out of Chicago). He said they were holding a press conference across town that was about to start at any moment.
After waiting around for a while (and listening to some funny stories about Geraldo and DP while staking out his house), a trailor carrying an excavator came down the driveway from the scene and drove away.
A few mins after that, 6-7 unmarked, marked, and what looked to be a CSI type van came driving down the driveway quite rapidly and took off into town. The helicopter from above followed them.
The news reporter and camera guy strongly felt they had found something and had distracted the media and observers with the press conference which was being held quite a distance away. They did a live broadcast for the 6pm news while we watched. (The Chicago Tribune interviewed us, too, while were waiting...maybe that will be in the paper tomorrrow?)
I'm on the fence as to whether or not they were creating a distraction or if they were really wrapping up for the day.
Of course, then, a horrible tornado came right through our area (and the actual location they were searching) so it's been a bit of a wild night!
A lot of people we talked to seem to think there is some connection with the gun/sportmen club on the property and DP.
~~~
It's Not the Nanny
06-05-2010 11:15 PM
Wanted to add:
The TV reporter from Chicago 7 and the camera guy thought the van that pulled away quickly was a coroner vehicle ... but I couldn't read anything on it.
~~~
It's Not the Nanny
06-05-2010 11:33 PM
it was a bit surreal to be able to go to the scene! (I follow Caylee's case quite closely) It was even weirder to be covering in the corner of a dept store while the tornados passed!
I hope the weather didn't disrupt any evidence at the location!!!!
I also found it odd that there was only 1 news truck/reporter and only about 6 people standing there watching.
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1414 on:
June 06, 2010, 02:04:12 AM »
A link for those with the stomach to watch this man, altho he's not his usual snarky self:
Fox Interview with Joel Brodsky
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwvaejtiCgM&feature=player_embedded
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Wyks
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1415 on:
June 06, 2010, 02:08:19 AM »
Link to another YouTube video interview, this guy makes it sound like the search isn't over yet:
Search for Stacy Peterson's remains outside Peoria
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cWskKeTK6Q&feature=player_embedded
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yuknomenot
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1416 on:
June 06, 2010, 04:33:44 AM »
Quote from: Wyks on June 05, 2010, 05:56:31 PM
From twitter...
joehosey
State plice and the owner of the property they searched are to hold a joint press conference in the property owner's new restaurant, the ... "309"
~~
no word yet on if this pc will be national or local, or just to the media.
I have become so cynical following some of these cases that I can't help but wonder if this is an instance of someone looking for some free publicity at Stacy's expense. She needs to be found and the person responsible for her disappearance needs to suffer for eternity.
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Green Eyes
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1417 on:
June 06, 2010, 07:59:28 AM »
Quote from: yuknomenot on June 06, 2010, 04:33:44 AM
Quote from: Wyks on June 05, 2010, 05:56:31 PM
From twitter...
joehosey
State plice and the owner of the property they searched are to hold a joint press conference in the property owner's new restaurant, the ... "309"
~~
no word yet on if this pc will be national or local, or just to the media.
I have become so cynical following some of these cases that I can't help but wonder if this is an instance of someone looking for some free publicity at Stacy's expense. She needs to be found and the person responsible for her disappearance needs to suffer for eternity.
I am praying this isn't the case. And that it will lead them to Stacy. But we have seen this happen in so many of the cases we have followed. Were we get our hopes up and it's nothing. After reading about the weather there yesterday maybe like Wykes said they had to stop for the safety of everyone.
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GOD BLESS AMERICA
trimmonthelake
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1418 on:
June 06, 2010, 10:16:43 AM »
http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewiStockNews/articleid/4183042
No sign of Stacy Peterson on Ill. farm
Sunday, June 06, 2010 8:17 AM
un. 6, 2010 (United Press International) -- Searchers say they may return to the central Illinois farm where they spent part of the weekend searching for the body of Stacy Peterson.
A jailhouse tip led investigators to the farm where they dug up a small area on Saturday but found no trace of Peterson, who disappeared in 2007.
"We've been down different paths before and there have been disappointments before," said Illinois State Police Master Sgt. Tom Burek. "I don't want to stand here and tell you this is the magical lead that's going to solve the case.
Police visited the 150-acre alfalfa farm outside Peoria after a jail inmate urged them to search near a gun club in downstate Illinois, a source told the Chicago Tribune. Authorities narrowed it down to the farm, which is owned by a man who said he did not know suspect Drew Peterson and was stunned when detectives contacted him.
Peterson, a former Bolingbrook, Ill., police sergeant, is in jail charged with killing his third wife, Kathleen Savio, in 2004. He has denied any role in the subsequent disappearance of his fourth wife, Stacy.
(Source: UPI )
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~241~ "The Longer You Love,The Longer You Live,The Stronger You Feel,The More You Can Give."
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trimmonthelake
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Re: Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
«
Reply #1419 on:
June 06, 2010, 10:19:26 AM »
http://www.newser.com/story/91486/search-for-stacy-petersons-body-called-off.html
Search for Stacy Peterson's Body Called Off
User Submitted) – Investigators searched a muddy stretch of remote central Illinois on Saturday for the remains of the fourth wife of Drew Peterson, the former suburban Chicago police officer awaiting trial for the murder of his previous spouse.Drew Peterson, 56, is a suspect in the disappearance and possible slaying of Stacy Peterson, who was 23 when she was last seen in October 2007. No one has been charged in the case, and her body has never been found.Drew Peterson is charged with first-degree murder in the 2004 death of his third wife, Kathleen Savio, whose body was found in a dry bathtub at her home. He's pleaded not guilty to the charges. Jury selection in the trial is set for next month. He's being held in isolation at the Will County Jail. Read the full article.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/06/05/following-new-lead-illinois-authorities-dig-body-stacy-peterson/?test=latestnews
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~241~ "The Longer You Love,The Longer You Live,The Stronger You Feel,The More You Can Give."
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Stacy Ann Peterson missing & Kathleen Savio murdered - Illinois
> Topic:
Stacy Ann Peterson 23, Bolingbrook IL - Missing 10/28/07 #1
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===> Michelle Loree Parker, Last Seen 11/17/11, Orlando, FL
===> Celina Cass, 11yrs old missing 7/25/11 New Hampshire
===> Aliayah Lunsford, 3yrs old, Weston, West VA, missing since 9/24/2011
===> Lisa Irwin, 10mo old missing since 10/4/2011 KC, MO
===> Robyn Gardner missing in Aruba August 2, 2011
=> Missing Persons - High Profile - Archives
-----------------------------
Virginia Area Missing and Murdered - possible connections
-----------------------------
=> Morgan Dana Harrington, 20yrs missing VA Tech 10/17/09(BODY FOUND)
=> Hannah Elizabeth Graham missing since 9/13/14 Charlottesville, VA
=> Alexis Murphy, missing since 8/3/13 Charlottesville, VA
=> Samantha Ann Clarke 19yrs. old Orange Va. Last seen 09/13/10
=> Dashad Sage Smith missing since 11/20/12 Charlottesville, VA
=> Cassandra Morton 23, Lynchburg, missing 10/10/09 body found 11/29/09
-----------------------------
High Profile Crimes and Trials (not missing persons)
-----------------------------
=> Jodi Arias trial - for the murder of Travis Alexander
=> Trial of George Zimmerman - 2nd Degree Murder of 17yr old Trayvon Martin
=> Scott Peterson Appeal of Murder Conviction
-----------------------------
Missing, Exploited and True Crime
-----------------------------
=> Missing Exploited and True Crime
===> Missing Persons Forum
=====> Missing Found or Presumed Deceased
=====> Missing Found Safe
=====> Missing Endangered Runaways
=====> Resourses, Search Groups and Fundraisers
===> Crimes Against Children, Elderly and the Disabled
===> Crimes of Passion/Anger
===> Serial Killers and Their Possible Victims
===> Unsolved Crimes
=====> Finally Solved
===> Haleigh Marie Cummings - Florida
===> Adji Desir - Florida
===> Somer Renee Thompson 7 yo, Orange Park FL 10/19/09(BODY FOUND)
===> Tracy Ocasio - Orlando/Ocoee, Florida
===> Shaniya Nicole Davis, 5 Fayetteville, NC Missing 11/10/09(BODY FOUND)
===> Holly Bobo, 20yrs old missing Parsons, TN 4/13/11
===> Hailey Dunn - 13yrs old - Colorado City, TX missing 12/27/10 (Body Found)
===> Elizabeth Olten - 9yrs, Jefferson City, MO missing 10/21/09 (BODY FOUND)
===> Lindsey Baum - McCleary, WA 6/26/09
===> Amber Leeanne Dubois 14yrs old - Escondido, CA(BODY FOUND)
===> Chelsea King, 17, Missing 2-25-2010 Rancho Bernadino CA (BODY FOUND)
===> Sandra Cantu, 8 years old - Tracy, CA(BODY FOUND)
===> Madeleine McCann - Portugal
===> Christine Marie Sheddy - missing since 11/13/2007 - Maryland(BODY FOUND)
===> Nevaeh Amyah Buchanan 5yr Monroe Michigan(BODY FOUND)
===> Gabriel Johnson 8 mo., last seen 12/26/09 Tempe AZ-San Antonio TX
===> Stacy Ann Peterson missing & Kathleen Savio murdered - Illinois
===> Zahra Clare Baker - 10yrs old Hickory, NC (Body Found)
-----------------------------
Natalee Holloway
-----------------------------
=> Natalee Holloway
=> Important Case Documents
===> Joran Statements/PV's
===> Paulus Statements/PV's
===> Deepak Statements/PV's
===> Satish Statements/PV's
===> Misc Statements/PV's
=> LCD Archive
=> Shango/Simian and other Codetalkers
-----------------------------
Current Events and Musings
-----------------------------
=> Monkey Musings / Open Discussion
=> Pop Culture Main
===> Hugely Popular TV Shows
===> Movies and Television
===> Social Media
===> Music
===> Books
===> Scared Monkeys Radio with Dana Pretzer
=> Health and Medical Issues
=> Food and Product Recalls
=> News of the Day
=> Business News
=> Sports
=> Political Forum
=> Religion (discussion and debate)
-----------------------------
The Monkey Lounge
-----------------------------
=> The Monkey Lounge
===> Fashion & Decorating
===> What's Cooking? Recipes
===> Games
=> Inspirational
===> Memorial - Gone but Never Forgotten
===> Gratefulness - Light a Candle in Prayer
===> Inspirational scriptures, songs, stories and prayers
-----------------------------
Natalee Discussions (2005 ARCHIVE)
-----------------------------
=> Natalee Holloway
=> Theory and Speculation
=> Links and References Only
=> Natalee Breaking News Archive
-----------------------------
General Discussions (2005 ARCHIVE)
-----------------------------
=> News Issues
=> Chit Chat
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