Natalee Case Discussion #834 6/4/10 - 6/6/10

[msmarple]

So, I ventured over to one of the Peru news web sites (a link from somewhere here, no doubt). I decided to “send a message” among the all-Spanish comments. Behold, there were responses in English for me! (I’m msmarple there, too.)

BTW, there is a number-of-characters limit, so some comments are cryptic.

Here are my posts --

Sorry, I don't speak Spanish (just getting registered was a challenge!) I have followed the Natalee Holloway case for 5 years. Stephany's family has been so inspiring and graceful in this tragedy. I pray for comfort for them. Do Not Trust Aruba Law Enforcement. Tourism $$ is ALL Aruba cares about.

* * *

You all realize that Natalee's body was never found? "Why did they have to disappear her body?" So cruel. Thankfully Peru doesn't have an agenda apart from locking him up.

* * *

And regards to you, El Comentarista. Currently Aruba is speculating that the hotel staff did it. Aruba dragged Natalee and her mother, Beth, through the mud. So glad the shoe is on the other foot this time - the victim's family is influential, instead of Joran's. Stephany's family = Amazing Grace.

* * *

Here are the responses so far --

If in Aruba would have done justice, perhaps it could prevented Stephany's death. Regards to you, msmarple.

* * *

Hello, we know that Aruba is the most important tourism, but be sure that here in Peru will apply the full weight of the law and hopefully come to light evidence on the case of Natalee. Regards

* * *

It is sad that someone had to die before this guy goes to jail, but in the end justice will be done. Best of all, it will be in a peruvian jail (not a very nice place). This pretty boy is in for a BIG surprise....

* * *

You're absolutely right. Peruvian jails can be a hell for certain prisoners. Inside there's some sort of internal, "unwritten law" by which foreign murders of peruvian women are gonna get their ass kicked and raped every single day by local inmates. This is a nightmare scenario for Joran.

* * *

I hope that you lady read this,compare a jail in aruba or the states,lurigancho(name of the main prision in Peru)is one of the worst jails in the entire world and you can be sure that this murderer will suffer every single day for what he did to your daughter and sthepany.

* * *

msmarple, no worries mate!, I tell u that he is going to pay every bad things he did. Some people says that peruvian jails are the most dangerous in the world, thats not true, but trust me he is going to pay....

* * *

Peruvian law may not be the poster child for fairness and equality, but Ms. Holloway and the Flores famliy can rest assured that Joran will have an enjoyable stay at the Lurigancho Resort & Spa. Our prisoners will take very good care of him and wipe that smug grin right off his pretty lil face.

* * *

well it's well-known that if this murder goes to any other country than Peru he might be more "alive", let Peruvian justice keep him, isn't the greatest law but their prisions are tough enough for this son of the devil.

* * *

He will pay for his crimes and sick mind if they send him to Lurigancho Prison... there he will get what he deserves, once they see him and know what he did, let's say he will get ravished for every day of his stay in there. So relax @msmarple, sometimes the justice lates but it eventually comes...

* * *

I agree with remonio and noapologies, we hope that justice will be achive for Nathalee and Stephany in Peru... and probably the unwritten law of the jails that rapist will be punish by other inmates will make hell to this moron

* * *

[Buckeye]

At a time when all believed that Joran and the Kalpoes dropped Natalee at the Holiday Inn, Anita spoke of Paulus calling her, in the Netherlands,  with a problem..."Joran seemed to be the last person with Natalee".  She repeated this in two seperate interviews: LaBelle and Paul and Whitman.  Now why would she get that first call that Joran was the last with Natalee if everyone thought the three guys gave her a ride to her hotel??  Anita and Paulus knew from day one.

[Northern Rose]

Joran Van der Sloot is close to Lima
The Dutchman, alleged murderer of the young Stephany Flores, arrived this morning in Cañete guarded by several police units.

Joran Van der Sloot, chief suspect in the murder of the young Stephany Flores, goes to Lima to meet the crime. This morning the Dutchman came to Cañete with several police units shielding.

Unlike what happened in Chile, where the Dutchman's delivery to the Peruvian authorities was accomplished in record time, the Government continued the process by providing that moved in a police car outside the capital, on a trip of more than 10 hours.

TRACKS OF THE CRIME. The hypothesis that the motive had been robbery is thwarted. The Uruguayan Elton Garcia, who spent Sunday morning with the Dutchman and Stephany Atlantic City casino, denied that the student has earned $ 5,000.

Homicide Division has sent analyze the racket that was found in the room as they would be the weapon used by the criminal. "Apparently, she was not raped, but hit. He would have kicked in the legs and arms. A cerebral hemorrhage killed him, "said one expert.

Meanwhile, the video captured by the cameras of the hotel where he died Stephany shows the girl with her hair gathered, dressed in black-and entering the establishment quietly in the company of the Netherlands. Nor is it known why he did not heed the warning of the Panamanian singer Roberto Blades, who admitted to the European casino by the murder of Natalee Holloway.

http://peru21.pe/noticia/490128/joran-van-der-sloot-se-acerca-lima

[Serenity]

hey nut44,look at the video closely of him getting into the airplane,he has something on the back of his pants,a piece of material hiding where he s.it his pants..can someone post a closeup?????

[Northern Rose]

AREQUIPA | KILOMETER 48. Joran Andreas Petrus Van Der Sloot (23), alleged murderer of the young university Sthefany Tatiana Flores Ramirez (21), was taken by land to Lima amid tight security.

He entered the city of Tacna at 15:10 hours, brought by Chilean authorities after his capture in that country. The Chilean delegation headed by the prefect of the police inspector of Investigation (PDI) of Chile, Douglas Rodriguez, presented by the foreign citizen Peruvians returned to his peers, among whom was the head of Interpol in Lima, PNP Colonel Manuel Huaman Malagua , Tacna police chief, Colonel James PNP Ordinola Ruiz, the prosecutor for the Prevention of Crime, Sias Alberto Rodríguez, among others.

The Dutchman Joran Van Der Sloot (23) entered Peruvian territory in the van of the PDI plate BT-CW-90. She was serene, wearing jean shorts and black shirt, off the vehicle before they put a bulletproof vest.

Three Interpol agents are responsible for their transportation to the capital of the Republic.

Judge Monica Janeth Lastras, the Sixth Court of Lima ordered preventive detention for 24 hours for investigation of the alleged commission of a crime against life, body and health (murder, murder) perpetrated against Sthefany Flores.

The presence of the alleged murderer of two young people caused the rejection of people who shouted murderer!, To rot in jail.

The Dutchman started from Tacna to Arequipa in the IQR-904 police van, escorted by several police units. At approximately 2050 hours the convoy arrived at mile 48 in the division of the American South, where it was delivered on the staff of the Highway Police in Arequipa, which was responsible for his transfer to Ica. Gen. Felix Murga Eusebio led the operation. At approximately 21.33 hours the units, bringing the detainee, left bound for Ica, to be subsequently be taken to Lima.


http://www.correoperu.com.pe/correo/nota.php?txtEdi_id=5&txtSecci_parent=0&txtSecci_id=14&txtNota_id=366431

[Northern Rose]

It is executed by a flame game

Expressing their opinion about the guilt of the Dutchman Joran van der Sloot in the murder of the Peruvian Stephany Flores, a company in the country under launched yesterday (Friday) an online game that spits the flame still suspect in the fortress of Sacsayhuaman Cusco. Go to game.

In the curious game of Sense Studios, Van der Sloot is moved from side to side in front of a flame that the user moves also, side by side and must be pressed to determine the range of the spit of camel, which must fall Dutchman to score points.

With each successful shot, featured a smiling Peter Rudolf de Vries, crime reporter involved in the investigation against Van der Sloot for the murder of American Natalee Holloway, who encourages the player with both thumbs extended.

Peter Rudolf de Vries took great interest in the case of Joran and Natalee in 2006, when he accused the boy of murder for its agenda and continued two years after revealing the results of their research, becoming attacked by Van der Sloot after a television interview, when he threw a glass of red wine a journalist.



http://www.larepublica.pe/internacionales/05/06/2010/es-ajusticiado-por-una-llama-en-juego

[Northern Rose]

Joran van der Sloot Netherlands spend 30 years in jail
Stephany Flores told his friend who was at home, but his fate was the casino. Alleged murderer was expelled from Chile and was arrested by Peruvian police

Hours before his death, the young Tatiana Flores Stephany Ramirez (21) shared the last moments of life with his close friends and college classmates, Carola Gallo Sanguinetti and Carolina, according to a report from the Dirincri.

The document says Stephany left home at 3 pm Saturday May 29 in his truck to pick up Carol in San Isidro. With it went to a hotel on the block 41 of the Paseo de la Republica, in Miraflores, where he remained until 11:30 pm, he arrived Carolina.

An hour earlier, 10 p.m. Saturday, Stephany was communicated by telephone with his father Ricardo Flores "rifle" and said he was coming home late. Then the three girls went to the pub El Gringo de Barranco, where they remained until 2:30 am 30 May.

At that time are removed from the site. Stephany is home to Carolina Gallo in Chacarilla (Furrow), a few blocks from her home, while Carola Sanguinetti left on Avenida Las Begonias (San Isidro).

On parting, 3:20 am, Stephany Carola lies to tell him to go to his house when in fact headed to Atlantic City Casino Miraflores. Her friend Carol, who had just left, he called five minutes later, but Stephany did not answer. Just sent a text message that says "I'm going up the stairs to get to my bedroom."

The Dirincri Stephany stated that her friend lied because he did not like to attend the casinos for his fondness for gambling. In the casino, Stephany met Joran van der Sloot, who had had previous meetings by an international poker competition. Along with him was the Albanian Elton Garcia, who was staying at the hotel like Joran Tac.

TWO CUPS OF COFFEE
He stayed there until 5 am Sunday where Joran and Stephany are removed from the casino. A witness saw them leave in the truck. Stephany drove.

It is at 5:15 a.m. when the couple entered the hotel Tac. Three hours later, 8:10 a.m. Sunday, the Dutchman out of the hotel and goes to Wong in front of the hotel to buy bread and two cups of coffee. Then back to the room and out again at 9:30 am to address Stephany van, carrying in his hand a small suitcase and a backpack. In this period would have caused death.

PENALTY OF UP TO 30 YEARS
Luis Lamas Puccio's attorney explained that the crime of first degree murder of which is being investigated Van der Sloot has a sentence of 15-30 years in prison and will be evaluated as an aggravating the ferocity of the crime (beatings Stephany) and brutality (the alleged murderer had gained the confidence of the victim). He said the trial may last more than two years and extradition is not necessary until the completion of the sentence.

Joran van der Sloot, held on Thursday in Chile, now come by land to Lima after the Chilean authorities hand him over to Interpol agents traveled to Lima to Tacna for that purpose. The transfer of the alleged murderer of Stephany is ground in a police motorcade that left yesterday at 3:08 pm Tacna Once in Lima will be taken to the headquarters of the Dirincri, Avenue Spain, where he will be questioned.

http://elcomercio.pe/noticia/490131/holandes-joran-van-der-sloot-pasaria-30-anos-carcel

[sharon]

I don't think he wanted to get caught.  He's had ample opportunity, on many continents, to turn himself in.

He always felt he was the clever one.  He wasn't.  His network of enablers and helpers were the clever ones.  On his own, he ends up with orange hair.

Since he "went for coffee" at 8 and returned at 8:45, I hope they check area trash cans for that white shirt.  He had a Tshirt and shorts on, in the taxi.

Most travelers communicate using Skype.  They could check his, and his friends, Skype accounts.

Agree.

It does not take 45 minutes to get coffee anywhere in civilization.

He was doing something else.

imo

[Northern Rose]

from the last article

[sharon]

Can be possible that this monster will blame his father for Nathaly's dead?

He reportedly has already claimed he's innocent....depending on what transpires in the days/weeks to come, it would not be a surprise if he blames anyone/everyone but himself.  He's a disgusting LIAR.

I can't remember where I saw it -- my brain is already inundated -- but I read he said that 'he remembers meeting her in the casino, and then he remembers being apprehended in the taxi' -- implying that he remembers nothing in between.

This is Joran. He is busy spinning his web.

(Hope all is well by you)

[MisGivings]

http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/04/1663716/dutch-man-sent-to-peru-to-face.html

Dutch murder suspect back in Peru to face charges

By FRANK BAJAK and FRANKLIN BRICENO
Associated Press Writers

LIMA, Peru -- A Dutch suspect in the 2005 disappearance of an Alabama teenager in Aruba and the recent murder of a 21-year-old woman in a Lima hotel was en route to Peru's capital, where a preliminary warrant for his arrest was issued.

Wearing a bulletproof vest, Joran van der Sloot was taken away by Peruvian police Friday after being deported from neighboring Chile, where he was arrested the day before in a taxi headed from Santiago toward the Vina del Mar resort.

Peru's chief Cabinet minister, Javier Velasquez, told Radioprogramas radio that van der Sloot would arrive in the capital, Lima, on Saturday morning.

Van der Sloot told police in Chile that he did not kill Stephany Flores, who was found dead in his hotel room with her neck broken earlier this week. Chilean police spokesman Ricardo Flores said van der Sloot acknowledged, however, that "he met her and at some point they went to a casino."

The girl's father, Ricardo Flores, told The Associated Press that video cameras tracked the couple as they walked before dawn Sunday to van der Sloot's hotel from the casino in Lima's upscale Miraflores district where they met playing poker.

Flores said he doesn't want the death penalty for van der Sloot, only justice. In Peru, murder carries a prison sentence of up to 35 years.

"I haven't slept since Monday," Flores, his eyelids heavy and speech slurred, said in an interview at his Lima home. "I'm waiting for him to step foot on Peruvian soil." Then, he said, he'd take a sleeping pill or simply collapse from exhaustion.

Flores, a circus promoter and former race car driver, spoke as the 22-year-old Dutchman was being flown handcuffed to the border with Peru.

Van der Sloot remains the prime suspect in the May, 30, 2005 disappearance - five years to the day of Flores' murder - of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway on the Dutch island of Aruba.

The longtime fixture of TV true-crime shows also now faces criminal charges in the United States of trying to extort $250,000 from Holloway's family in exchange for disclosing the location of Holloway's body and describing how she died. U.S. prosecutors charged van der Sloot with the crime on Thursday, saying $15,000 had been transferred to a Dutch bank account in his name. In the Netherlands on Friday, prosecutors acting on a U.S. request raided two homes seeking evidence in the case, seizing computers, cell phones and data-storage devices.

The body of Stephany Flores, a business student with a sunny disposition, was found late Tuesday in the Lima hotel room where van der Sloot had been staying since arriving in Peru on May 14 from Colombia.

She was fully clothed, with multiple bruises and scratches on her body but no signs she had been sexually assaulted, the chief of Peru's criminal police, Gen. Cesar Guardia, told the AP.

A tennis racket was found in the room "that could have been the murder weapon but that's so far not been proven," said Dr. Cesar Tejada, deputy Lima medical examiner.

"My daughter resisted," Flores told the AP in a marble-floored interior porch of his home. "There was violence, resistance to being raped - and there's where she was murdered."

Flores said police wouldn't let him see his daughter's battered body. His oldest son, 35, identified her at the morgue, and the casket was closed at her funeral.

Peruvian police say they have video of van der Sloot and Flores together in the casino and on the street and say witnesses saw the two enter the Dutchman's hotel room about 5 a.m. and van der Sloot leaving alone some four hours later.

Flores, 48, buried his daughter Thursday but said he expected her to be exhumed for DNA testing.

"Under the fingernails of my daughter there are traces, evidence, that's why they didn't permit her cremation," he said.

Dr. Tejada confirmed that valuable evidence could be found under the girl's fingernails.

Flores said he hopes his daughter's death will help investigators solve not just the Holloway case but others of missing girls in which van der Sloot might be responsible.

Holloway was an 18-year-old celebrating her high school graduation on Aruba when she disappeared. Van der Sloot told investigators he left her on a beach, drunk. That's the last anyone saw of her. Van der Sloot was twice arrested in her disappearance - and twice released for insufficient evidence.

Two years ago, a Dutch television crime reporter captured hidden-camera footage of van der Sloot saying that after Holloway collapsed on the beach he asked a friend to dump her body in the sea. But judges in Aruba ruled it insufficient to re-arrest him. The same journalist, Peter de Vries, reported later in 2008 that van der Sloot was recruiting Thai women in Bangkok for sex work in the Netherlands.

A person answering the phone Friday at the home of the girl's mother, Beth Holloway of Mountain Brook, Alabama, said she was not there and hung up. The girl's uncle, Paul Reynolds, told NBC's "Today" show that the family hopes to see van der Sloot behind bars and the Aruba case reopened. He called the alleged extortion attempt "despicable."

A New York lawyer for van der Sloot, Joseph Tacopina, had no immediate comment on his client's predicament. He said he was not yet able to say whether a Peruvian lawyer had been obtained for the young man.

Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/04/1663716_p2/dutch-man-sent-to-peru-to-face.html#ixzz0pyeNQjJe

"Flores, 48, buried his daughter Thursday but said he expected her to be exhumed for DNA testing." I cannot believe the coroner didn't automatically take nail clippings off this poor girl before she was buried.
Man, o man, this is starting to look like Aruba with all their inadequacies.

[cecilita]

Joran van der Sloot Netherlands spend 30 years in jail
Stephany Flores told his friend who was at home, but his fate was the casino. Alleged murderer was expelled from Chile and was arrested by Peruvian police

Hours before his death, the young Tatiana Flores Stephany Ramirez (21) shared the last moments of life with his close friends and college classmates, Carola Gallo Sanguinetti and Carolina, according to a report from the Dirincri.

The document says Stephany left home at 3 pm Saturday May 29 in his truck to pick up Carol in San Isidro. With it went to a hotel on the block 41 of the Paseo de la Republica, in Miraflores, where he remained until 11:30 pm, he arrived Carolina.

An hour earlier, 10 p.m. Saturday, Stephany was communicated by telephone with his father Ricardo Flores "rifle" and said he was coming home late. Then the three girls went to the pub El Gringo de Barranco, where they remained until 2:30 am 30 May.

At that time are removed from the site. Stephany is home to Carolina Gallo in Chacarilla (Furrow), a few blocks from her home, while Carola Sanguinetti left on Avenida Las Begonias (San Isidro).

On parting, 3:20 am, Stephany Carola lies to tell him to go to his house when in fact headed to Atlantic City Casino Miraflores. Her friend Carol, who had just left, he called five minutes later, but Stephany did not answer. Just sent a text message that says "I'm going up the stairs to get to my bedroom."

The Dirincri Stephany stated that her friend lied because he did not like to attend the casinos for his fondness for gambling. In the casino, Stephany met Joran van der Sloot, who had had previous meetings by an international poker competition. Along with him was the Albanian Elton Garcia, who was staying at the hotel like Joran Tac.

TWO CUPS OF COFFEE
He stayed there until 5 am Sunday where Joran and Stephany are removed from the casino. A witness saw them leave in the truck. Stephany drove.

It is at 5:15 a.m. when the couple entered the hotel Tac. Three hours later, 8:10 a.m. Sunday, the Dutchman out of the hotel and goes to Wong in front of the hotel to buy bread and two cups of coffee. Then back to the room and out again at 9:30 am to address Stephany van, carrying in his hand a small suitcase and a backpack. In this period would have caused death.

PENALTY OF UP TO 30 YEARS
Luis Lamas Puccio's attorney explained that the crime of first degree murder of which is being investigated Van der Sloot has a sentence of 15-30 years in prison and will be evaluated as an aggravating the ferocity of the crime (beatings Stephany) and brutality (the alleged murderer had gained the confidence of the victim). He said the trial may last more than two years and extradition is not necessary until the completion of the sentence.

Joran van der Sloot, held on Thursday in Chile, now come by land to Lima after the Chilean authorities hand him over to Interpol agents traveled to Lima to Tacna for that purpose. The transfer of the alleged murderer of Stephany is ground in a police motorcade that left yesterday at 3:08 pm Tacna Once in Lima will be taken to the headquarters of the Dirincri, Avenue Spain, where he will be questioned.

http://elcomercio.pe/noticia/490131/holandes-joran-van-der-sloot-pasaria-30-anos-carcel

it was only 15 minutes trip from the casino to her hotel...

[Serenity]

OMG     Look at the video Nut44 posted and you'll see  where they tried to hide where Joran POOPED HIS PANTS with a piece of material...look closely where he turns around while getting into the plane,,,,,YIKES>>>

[Northern Rose]

Can be possible that this monster will blame his father for Nathaly's dead?

He reportedly has already claimed he's innocent....depending on what transpires in the days/weeks to come, it would not be a surprise if he blames anyone/everyone but himself.  He's a disgusting LIAR.

I can't remember where I saw it -- my brain is already inundated -- but I read he said that 'he remembers meeting her in the casino, and then he remembers being apprehended in the taxi' -- implying that he remembers nothing in between.

This is Joran. He is busy spinning his web.

(Hope all is well by you)

That was the statement he gave to police in Chile in perfect Spanish.  His innocence statement.

[klaasend]

OMG     Look at the video Nut44 posted and you'll see  where they tried to hide where Joran POOPED HIS PANTS with a piece of material...look closely where he turns around while getting into the plane,,,,,YIKES>>>

Can you give a clue as to what page this video is on?  TIA

[Nut44x4]

hey nut44,look at the video closely of him getting into the airplane,he has something on the back of his pants,a piece of material hiding where he s.it his pants..can someone post a closeup?????

lmao....I can't post close ups. Not sure I want to see it, lol. I do see what looks like a poo stain in his crack area, lol. Welcome to Hell Mr. Hanky...



http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20006846-504083.html?tag=latest

[2NJSons_Mom]

Can be possible that this monster will blame his father for Nathaly's dead?

He reportedly has already claimed he's innocent....depending on what transpires in the days/weeks to come, it would not be a surprise if he blames anyone/everyone but himself.  He's a disgusting LIAR.

I can't remember where I saw it -- my brain is already inundated -- but I read he said that 'he remembers meeting her in the casino, and then he remembers being apprehended in the taxi' -- implying that he remembers nothing in between.

This is Joran. He is busy spinning his web.

(Hope all is well by you)

Yes, I read the same, Sharon.  He can't claim innocence if he can't remember....hopefully, his web will be sucked into a Peruvian vacuum. 

(Hanging in here, hope the same for you)

[sharon]

Thanks Northern Rose. 

That's right! In Catalan (the very specific dialect of Barcelona).

[Serenity]

it's the last post on page 29 by Nut 44 where she says it looks like he is going to vomit in this video.
You can see it when he tries to get into the plane and he turns around and his butt faces the camera

[sharon]

Or did he give it in Spanish? And they only reported that he was fluent in Catalan? (it is a dialect of Spanish -- but don't say that to a Catalonian)

I was younger 5 years ago -- better memory then.