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Title: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - 12/24/08 Post by: Nut44x4 on December 13, 2008, 01:10:50 PM http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/Natalee2.swf JUSTICE FOR NATALEE Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Anna on December 17, 2008, 06:38:36 PM Maybe I'm first?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 06:38:44 PM Tim Miller: In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3249/2345840954_e00aee9854_o.jpg) Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th May 16 - Kyle posted: I think it is highly unlikely and completely inconsistent with numerous testimonies and other evidence that the pond (or anything but the ocean) contains Natalee's remains. The witness claims to have seen a muddy Joran coming out of the Monserat pond after disposing of her body. <snip> The 40+ investigators brought in from Holland never stepped foot in the pond John Silvetti's email to Kyle: The Polis did not drain that pond and they did not search it, period! JOHN SILVETTI TELLS CAPS THAT THE TRAP/CAGE IS A POSTOFFICE AND THE CAGE WAS EMPTY. MARCH 3, 2008 – John Silvetti meets with CapsLockWizard From an email sent from CapsLockWizard: “Yes, We did have the meeting today. It was a long meeting and we are all set to start the process of a permit to drain. Witness will gave statement to Lawyer (Helen), Lawyer will motion to drain the pond to OM. If Motion denied, will go to media and expose more dirt. John knows everything now and he will stay behind to help and protect. John state the cage was empty. it was full of these broken plastic bags that shows on the cam like skull, but he said to me it is the water doing tricks when picture was taken. He thinks also it is a postoffice. When I told him the story about the cage, he also understand now some things that he could not have question about. Like why is the Panter allways parked over the spot while there is notting anymore in he cage. The meeting end at 5:00 pm and was very good. About the Pipes. They will be checked. Also John thinks that the signs are there but need to drain the pond. Also Withness is 99% it was some one that came from the pond area that he saw, because it looks like a dutch man and was cover in mud from the chest down.” (http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/8683/image532fx0.jpg) Kyle stated: "This is a picture from Natalee standing on the beach and rotated and scaled to the image to matching the body form inside the trap. It matches the end of the skirt identically to what was seen in the cage." So if we look at Caps' email to Dave and then his posts, MUMinOhio is correct. Caps knew nothing and then he is somehow connected to a witness who magically appears and they go to John Silvetti and it turns John Silvetti from looking at the trap/cage and to looking at the pond, brings the witness to the states for a polygraph test and the evidence is gone from that trap/cage because no one knew except Kyle Kingman and that ROV unit that captured the last photos. Meanwhile John Silvetti is trying to set up an office in Aruba. And so Aruba masterminded the diversion away from any thing about the person's remains inside that cage/trap in the ocean as well as Joran created a media stir with his sit-down Greta interview that he sold Natalee into sex slavery, then the attention turned to Rudy Croes statement Jan van der Straaten was involved in covering-up but that was also brought out in 2006 Jan v/d Straatten was indeed investigated and had telephone conversations with people about the case that he should not have contacts with, or even talk about the case. and now as Hero Brinkman pointed out, if he knew of this, why did he wait 3 1/2 years to say something about it? No body - no case seems to have been the Aruba code word for CORRUPTION! #1468 on: May 07, 2008, 05:28:28 AM muminohio When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle. There is nothing wrong with that, I personally have spent a lot of time and posts sharing any information I had or could find. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.msg379700#msg379700 NOW LET'S FOLLOW CAPS, THE WITNESS/Shango/Simian, ARUBA COPS, KYLE KINGMAN and John Silvetti: Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining. He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. The vision was cryptic and actually contained a latitude which from what he claimed could have been anywhere in the world. The brother thought they were coordinates, but it was just a latitude. Oddly, the latitude was within a half mile from where we found the trap and centered on Arashi beach. Basically, if you stood on land and pointed straight to the trap and were right on the money... this is what the difference amounts to. Based on this latitude we payed a little more attention to the northern portions of the search grid near that Latitude. The trap was found shortly after, within the original search area, but very close to the provided latitude. I would have found the trap without the latitude, but it was very strange. None of us pressed the two for more information because they clearly were VERY uncomfortable. The brother of the detective came to us and was very persistent over the information. He was almost in tears and just had to "clear his conscience" about it. His brother, the detective came with him to 'validate him'. Personally, I think the detective was Simian. The guy kept his mouth shut for the most part but was obviously intelligent and knew a lot more than he led on. It didn't seem he immediately trusted us but gradually became more comfortable, enough to talk. I think he used his brother and gave us only the amount of information he felt we needed to come across the trap. Basically, by using his brother and claiming the information he shared was only based on a vision, it distances the detective from responsibility and makes it hard to point back to him should it be a problem later. I think the whole game was bogus and he knew almost everything but was helping how he was able and felt comfortable. I don't understand why he had to use his brother and claim a "vision". The implications of this are tremendous. If true, it means that the early investigators knew where and how Natalee was disposed and it was kept secret and covered up. Not wanting to be implicated but still wanting to help, he could shift the information to a vision of his brothers, perhaps still help a bit and claim no-involvement. However, this man was intelligent enough, cared about the case, yet was self implicated to a high enough level to want to be kept his knowledge a secret. He spoke well enough english and knew everything in my opinion. Perhaps I should find out his name. I never got it. We may never have. Kyle said: "Based on the little I know of Simian, there are striking similarities that stood out after I laid down on the evening I met with the detective and his brother.Perhaps Simian is the detective and Shango is the brother. Kyle said: "- IF a key detective's brother knew the latitude the trap was disposed at or very near, then it's probable the detective knew the same. - IF the detective knew the latitude, how did he come to this knowledge? - Who else knew this information? Since the trap was only in 90ft of water and the detective knew about the latitude, did the Polis already know if it's location prior to the search? The detective originally wouldn't meet with us and only wanted us to meet with his brother. We convinced him to meet along with his brother and made him feel as comfortable as possible. He reluctantly agreed but wouldn't talk. The brother did all the talking at first. It seemed to me the brother was acting out the "vision" scenario to protect the detective brother. It didn't feel like the brother was in any way corrupt or connected. Also, he wasn't that bright compared to the detective brother. After a while the detective started asking some questions and loosened up a bit. With the pointed questions he asked he proved he knew a lot, but we didn't press him. The reason I think the detective is Simian is that: - he is intimately connected to the case - forced into silence - both he and the brother seemed to want the case solved but the whole encounter was so CRYPTIC - he is condemned if his identity and knowledge were BOTH exposed. One or the other, he's still safe - He was intelligent and had a good enough command over the english language (not common over the rest of the bunch) - IF his brother was acting on his behalf with the whole 'I had a vision' act, then the detective's character supports pulling something like Simian off. - the detective was very internet and computer savy, which was unusual for the bulk of the Polis. - It seemed he knew who I was when we were introduced, and said something indicating he had been reading the blog. - his character was very cryptic; the way he moved, spoke, and asked questions was just not normal. "Caps is not Simian. He has indicated he knows who was either Shango or Simian. The person he thinks it is, is a cop. it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 06:39:12 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: San on December 17, 2008, 06:39:52 PM Tim Miller: In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3249/2345840954_e00aee9854_o.jpg) Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th May 16 - Kyle posted: I think it is highly unlikely and completely inconsistent with numerous testimonies and other evidence that the pond (or anything but the ocean) contains Natalee's remains. The witness claims to have seen a muddy Joran coming out of the Monserat pond after disposing of her body. <snip> The 40+ investigators brought in from Holland never stepped foot in the pond John Silvetti's email to Kyle: The Polis did not drain that pond and they did not search it, period! JOHN SILVETTI TELLS CAPS THAT THE TRAP/CAGE IS A POSTOFFICE AND THE CAGE WAS EMPTY. MARCH 3, 2008 – John Silvetti meets with CapsLockWizard From an email sent from CapsLockWizard: “Yes, We did have the meeting today. It was a long meeting and we are all set to start the process of a permit to drain. Witness will gave statement to Lawyer (Helen), Lawyer will motion to drain the pond to OM. If Motion denied, will go to media and expose more dirt. John knows everything now and he will stay behind to help and protect. John state the cage was empty. it was full of these broken plastic bags that shows on the cam like skull, but he said to me it is the water doing tricks when picture was taken. He thinks also it is a postoffice. When I told him the story about the cage, he also understand now some things that he could not have question about. Like why is the Panter allways parked over the spot while there is notting anymore in he cage. The meeting end at 5:00 pm and was very good. About the Pipes. They will be checked. Also John thinks that the signs are there but need to drain the pond. Also Withness is 99% it was some one that came from the pond area that he saw, because it looks like a dutch man and was cover in mud from the chest down.” (http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/8683/image532fx0.jpg) Kyle stated: "This is a picture from Natalee standing on the beach and rotated and scaled to the image to matching the body form inside the trap. It matches the end of the skirt identically to what was seen in the cage." So if we look at Caps' email to Dave and then his posts, MUMinOhio is correct. Caps knew nothing and then he is somehow connected to a witness who magically appears and they go to John Silvetti and it turns John Silvetti from looking at the trap/cage and to looking at the pond, brings the witness to the states for a polygraph test and the evidence is gone from that trap/cage because no one knew except Kyle Kingman and that ROV unit that captured the last photos. Meanwhile John Silvetti is trying to set up an office in Aruba. And so Aruba masterminded the diversion away from any thing about the person's remains inside that cage/trap in the ocean as well as Joran created a media stir with his sit-down Greta interview that he sold Natalee into sex slavery, then the attention turned to Rudy Croes statement Jan van der Straaten was involved in covering-up but that was also brought out in 2006 Jan v/d Straatten was indeed investigated and had telephone conversations with people about the case that he should not have contacts with, or even talk about the case. and now as Hero Brinkman pointed out, if he knew of this, why did he wait 3 1/2 years to say something about it? No body - no case seems to have been the Aruba code word for CORRUPTION! #1468 on: May 07, 2008, 05:28:28 AM muminohio When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle. There is nothing wrong with that, I personally have spent a lot of time and posts sharing any information I had or could find. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.msg379700#msg379700 NOW LET'S FOLLOW CAPS, THE WITNESS/Shango/Simian, ARUBA COPS, KYLE KINGMAN and John Silvetti: Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining. He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. The vision was cryptic and actually contained a latitude which from what he claimed could have been anywhere in the world. The brother thought they were coordinates, but it was just a latitude. Oddly, the latitude was within a half mile from where we found the trap and centered on Arashi beach. Basically, if you stood on land and pointed straight to the trap and were right on the money... this is what the difference amounts to. Based on this latitude we payed a little more attention to the northern portions of the search grid near that Latitude. The trap was found shortly after, within the original search area, but very close to the provided latitude. I would have found the trap without the latitude, but it was very strange. None of us pressed the two for more information because they clearly were VERY uncomfortable. The brother of the detective came to us and was very persistent over the information. He was almost in tears and just had to "clear his conscience" about it. His brother, the detective came with him to 'validate him'. Personally, I think the detective was Simian. The guy kept his mouth shut for the most part but was obviously intelligent and knew a lot more than he led on. It didn't seem he immediately trusted us but gradually became more comfortable, enough to talk. I think he used his brother and gave us only the amount of information he felt we needed to come across the trap. Basically, by using his brother and claiming the information he shared was only based on a vision, it distances the detective from responsibility and makes it hard to point back to him should it be a problem later. I think the whole game was bogus and he knew almost everything but was helping how he was able and felt comfortable. I don't understand why he had to use his brother and claim a "vision". The implications of this are tremendous. If true, it means that the early investigators knew where and how Natalee was disposed and it was kept secret and covered up. Not wanting to be implicated but still wanting to help, he could shift the information to a vision of his brothers, perhaps still help a bit and claim no-involvement. However, this man was intelligent enough, cared about the case, yet was self implicated to a high enough level to want to be kept his knowledge a secret. He spoke well enough english and knew everything in my opinion. Perhaps I should find out his name. I never got it. We may never have. Kyle said: "Based on the little I know of Simian, there are striking similarities that stood out after I laid down on the evening I met with the detective and his brother.Perhaps Simian is the detective and Shango is the brother. Kyle said: "- IF a key detective's brother knew the latitude the trap was disposed at or very near, then it's probable the detective knew the same. - IF the detective knew the latitude, how did he come to this knowledge? - Who else knew this information? Since the trap was only in 90ft of water and the detective knew about the latitude, did the Polis already know if it's location prior to the search? The detective originally wouldn't meet with us and only wanted us to meet with his brother. We convinced him to meet along with his brother and made him feel as comfortable as possible. He reluctantly agreed but wouldn't talk. The brother did all the talking at first. It seemed to me the brother was acting out the "vision" scenario to protect the detective brother. It didn't feel like the brother was in any way corrupt or connected. Also, he wasn't that bright compared to the detective brother. After a while the detective started asking some questions and loosened up a bit. With the pointed questions he asked he proved he knew a lot, but we didn't press him. The reason I think the detective is Simian is that: - he is intimately connected to the case - forced into silence - both he and the brother seemed to want the case solved but the whole encounter was so CRYPTIC - he is condemned if his identity and knowledge were BOTH exposed. One or the other, he's still safe - He was intelligent and had a good enough command over the english language (not common over the rest of the bunch) - IF his brother was acting on his behalf with the whole 'I had a vision' act, then the detective's character supports pulling something like Simian off. - the detective was very internet and computer savy, which was unusual for the bulk of the Polis. - It seemed he knew who I was when we were introduced, and said something indicating he had been reading the blog. - his character was very cryptic; the way he moved, spoke, and asked questions was just not normal. "Caps is not Simian. He has indicated he knows who was either Shango or Simian. The person he thinks it is, is a cop. it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 06:40:02 PM I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 06:41:39 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Blue Moon on December 17, 2008, 06:43:05 PM I am bringing this forward:
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #973 on: Today at 05:29:25 PM » I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 06:43:55 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 06:46:52 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Do we know what role Eduardo Mansur played on the Persistence "if" any at all? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 06:47:13 PM Looks like Caps last posted 12/13 in the early am hours...last logged on 12/14, fwiw.
CapsLockWizard Posts: 1042 (2.878 per day) Position: Scared Monkey Date Registered: December 20, 2007, 10:38:24 PM Last Active: December 14, 2008, 10:47:50 PM Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 06:49:11 PM I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: always 1 on December 17, 2008, 06:51:41 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 06:52:34 PM I'm an Victim's Rights Advocate. I try to help those that have no voice. Just as you all do. If I told you the SN's of some on the monkey board that victims themselves - your head would spin. Like Linda Blair's We all have our burdens to carry. When people like the crew of the Persistence can't even be trusted to do the right thing - we're all in trouble.
I'm thankful Kermit has the ovaries and mental fortitude to do the right thing, or we would never know. That takes class. REAL CLASS. How do you Define “Ethical Leadership”? “doing the right thing even when no one is watching,” Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 06:54:11 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Do we know what role Eduardo Mansur played on the Persistence "if" any at all? I'm sorry, you are addressing these questions to the wrong person. I juss dun know. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 06:57:19 PM I have no idea what the maze is - or if it exists. Babylon is not Aruba or the casinos - it is the whole of the Caribbean. I have found some references to it, even on TV, as far back as 2002.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 06:58:17 PM The Post Office
... March 01, 2008, 10:53:14 PM Remember My post before: The cage was there already, ... ... office has been exposed. Remember Dirty ... ... ...it had been done before... Post office has been exposed....translation.. ... ... .hmmm...a post office is used to *deliver* things... ... ... at this momment for those that uses the post office. Search the news on Panter boat. ... ******************** Re: Natalee Case Discussion #739 3/3 - by CapsLockWizard ... March 03, 2008, 10:21:38 PM Silverfox Post of the Day Just one thing though ... ... Persistence had accidently mapped a post office network: Given your hypothesis ... ... this post office network could help bring down ... ************************ Re: Natalee Case Discussion #775 11/16/08 thru by CapsLockWizard ... look at my findings carefully, [on the cage "it is Escudero Cage."] Colombia drug ... ... to one. --->. to confuse the issue. cage (400lbs) to havy for 2 people "AND" to ... ... for just a scull. "AND" area of he cage in the water too deep "AND" need a ... ... did leave a drug package in that large cage, who was the diver who went down to ... ... and leave Natalee's head in the same cage? Is this a possible scenario? ******************************* Re: Natalee Case Discussion #738 3/1 - by CapsLockWizard ... , 11:34:59 PM Caps is telling you that cage has been used to leave things for ... ... time a bird tells you about a large cage in water and you will say no way that ... ******************************** Re: Natalee Case Discussion #737 2/29 - by CapsLockWizard ... Ocean EX would interject himself in the cage as he did last night? Why is Joran ... ********************************* Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 06:59:07 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Is that your question Always1, or were you told to come here and ask? Just curious. ::MonkeyRoll:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 07:00:01 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Do we know what role Eduardo Mansur played on the Persistence "if" any at all? I'm sorry, you are addressing these questions to the wrong person. I juss dun know. Thanx Rob.I'll await further word from you regarding Tj..Again thanx for what you do! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 07:01:12 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? Tim Trahan was the "only" American diver on board the Persistence. I suspect that Tim Trahan and John Silvetti were a team in assisting the Arube in the GRAND FINALE TO THE GREAT ARUBAN COVERUP!! Janet +++++++ Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #783 12/6/08 - « Reply #701 on: December 08, 2008, 03:52:49 AM » John Silvetti and Tim Tehran were the project leads. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4216.msg571319;topicseen#msg571319 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: always 1 on December 17, 2008, 07:02:18 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Is that your question Always1, or were you told to come here and ask? Just curious. ::MonkeyRoll:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 07:03:23 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? Tim Trahan was the "only" American diver on board the Persistence. I suspect that Tim Trahan and John Silvetti were a team in assisting the Arube in the GRAND FINALE TO THE GREAT ARUBAN COVERUP!! Janet +++++++ Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #783 12/6/08 - « Reply #701 on: December 08, 2008, 03:52:49 AM » John Silvetti and Tim Tehran were the project leads. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4216.msg571319;topicseen#msg571319 Just tryin to keep his name in the mix.He is the one that seems to get lost in the shuffle so to speak.. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 07:12:41 PM Rob,
Have you talked to Carpe lately? I miss him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 07:15:18 PM Caps - rebuttel to Kermit
Kermit: why are you stir the monkey cage by lying....I never siad the Moko nor Montanja but the Monserat pond. If it was the Moko or the Montanja or the Soledad pond, he would have walk straigth home. and we would have not even know where he was since he would have been home and no one would have seen him. The cemetary is a plausable senario...but after more research that plousable scenario is still under investigation and to make that plausable, we have the search and all the logisctics to make it happend, but that require a lot of more inividual involved. on the issue of chop up and spread all over, that part of the result of several research. here is what has happend. 1. I do my own research with more capable individuals here in aruba that are part of the local daily night scene in Aruba. 2. it was the Maty apartment used that night. 3. some part of desposal was in several location in Aruba. The Pond was where he burried the last part of the body. 4. After all that blood, he washed off in the pond. 5. from there he took the service road running towards McDonnald. 6. was saw by an withness. 7. withness went to OM and give his statement. 8. OM give instruction to clean up the Pond but, the Santarosa group did not clean it up, since the ground was still muddy and it was posponed but then the rain came and is now full to the brim. Got new pictures. 9. the pond is now offlimited by a chain across the drive way entrance. 10. spoke to Selvetty and asked a lot of question... 11, on the opening a business in Aruba... no way true. Need an Arubian Partner and the Business law for AVV or ofshore business registered in Aruba is not benefecial. Another thing , I went to dive a week a go to the same location, and the Cage is still there. If the cage was evidance in a murder case, why is it still in the water. Another thing, from 2005 to 2008, we has gone through several mayor stroms that has pull sunken boat more heavy than the cage and in depth more than the cage to shore. The cage has an Owner and is not Aruban nor Venezuelan and not Dutch. it is from a Colombian person and the use has it purpuse. Other thing, I know the next move of the water Search team...... The man with fake diploma who did provide the cleaning is in a checkmate......perheps the end of the those higher ups is almost near. CAPS Natalee Holloway / LCD Archive / Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - on: December 03, 2008, 12:19:56 AM *************************************************************** The Post Office Natalee Holloway / LCD Archive / Re: Natalee Case Discussion #775 11/16/08 thru on: November 18, 2008, 11:51:14 AM Note: Drug is comming in into Aruba from Colombia and exported back to Holland but to risque for the USA, Unless higher-up involvement. FBI/DEA <---> MIU (dutch Militairy Intervention Unit) XTC is comming back from Europe to Aruba, bonaire..and then exported back to other parts like USA and south America. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: SunnyinTX on December 17, 2008, 07:25:08 PM I'm an Victim's Rights Advocate. I try to help those that have no voice. Just as you all do. If I told you the SN's of some on the monkey board that victims themselves - your head would spin. Like Linda Blair's We all have our burdens to carry. When people like the crew of the Persistence can't even be trusted to do the right thing - we're all in trouble. I'm thankful Kermit has the ovaries and mental fortitude to do the right thing, or we would never know. That takes class. REAL CLASS. How do you Define “Ethical Leadership”? “doing the right thing even when no one is watching,” hi Rob....I have to laugh every time some writes ovaries instead of balls! BYW - good to see you..I gther something wonderful has happened in your life and I am happy for you! Hey Snoopy.....see ya Monday!! Talk to you before that! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 07:30:08 PM All I want is Justice for Natalee. I'm not going to profess to know who is telling the truth and who is lying. If everything Kermit says is true then Silvetti is not to be trusted. Tim Miller as recently as last week was working with Silvetti on another MP case. If Silvetti is a bad person this has me worried for Tim Miller. I'm confused and not sure what I believe right now. I'd like to believe in Kermit and Caps.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 07:31:28 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Is that your question Always1, or were you told to come here and ask? Just curious. ::MonkeyRoll:: Or at Chatngrumble? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 07:33:53 PM This part of Caps post appears to me to be a blatant attempt to undermine the significance of the trap/cage. He fails to grasp ... or does he ... that the evidence is the contents which were retrieved from the trap/cage. The location of the cage/trap has been targeted ... it can be retrieved at any time.
This post of Caps which SS submitted above in full reveals that he is still desperately attempting to take the focus off the trap/cage. Janet ++++++++ CapsLockWizard Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #931 on: December 03, 2008, 04:19:56 AM » Another thing , I went to dive a week a go to the same location, and the Cage is still there. If the cage was evidance in a murder case, why is it still in the water. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564838#msg564838 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 07:34:52 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Is that your question Always1, or were you told to come here and ask? Just curious. ::MonkeyRoll:: Or at Chatngrumble? Klaas is reading my mind now! ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 07:36:00 PM I'm an Victim's Rights Advocate. I try to help those that have no voice. Just as you all do. If I told you the SN's of some on the monkey board that victims themselves - your head would spin. Like Linda Blair's We all have our burdens to carry. When people like the crew of the Persistence can't even be trusted to do the right thing - we're all in trouble. I'm thankful Kermit has the ovaries and mental fortitude to do the right thing, or we would never know. That takes class. REAL CLASS. How do you Define “Ethical Leadership”? “doing the right thing even when no one is watching,” That has been sorta my tagline since I came to thsi site. It's a good moto and you have applied it well in your statement! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 07:36:48 PM This part of Caps post appears to me to be a blatant attempt to undermine the significance of the trap/cage. He fails to grasp ... or does he ... that the evidence is the contents which were retrieved from the trap/cage. The location of the cage/trap has been targeted ... it can be retrieved at any time. This post of Caps which SS submitted above in full reveals that he is still desperately attempting to take the focus off the trap/cage. Janet ++++++++ CapsLockWizard Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #931 on: December 03, 2008, 04:19:56 AM » Another thing , I went to dive a week a go to the same location, and the Cage is still there. If the cage was evidance in a murder case, why is it still in the water. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564838#msg564838 Why not?They got what they want.Do we honestly think the ALE are going to retrieve it for evidentiary value??? ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: always 1 on December 17, 2008, 07:42:00 PM Where does ol' Tim Trahan fit into this Rob? you answer your own question wiff da question doncha? Is that your question Always1, or were you told to come here and ask? Just curious. ::MonkeyRoll:: Or at Chatngrumble? Klaas is reading my mind now! ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 17, 2008, 07:42:52 PM All I want is Justice for Natalee. I'm not going to profess to know who is telling the truth and who is lying. If everything Kermit says is true then Silvetti is not to be trusted. Tim Miller as recently as last week was working with Silvetti on another MP case. If Silvetti is a bad person this has me worried for Tim Miller. I'm confused and not sure what I believe right now. I'd like to believe in Kermit and Caps. I'm with Ya Klaas.....I would like to believe in them both.....and its all very confusing right now...... ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 07:43:05 PM Scared Monkey
Online Posts: 8607 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #925 on: Today at 04:28:25 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: truthseeker2 on Today at 04:00:03 PM If this cage/trap is used for a drug post office and has been used for that over the last 3 1/2 years...it is creepy as h3ll to think they did that with a body laying right there. If true, ... well, there are all kinds of creepy people in the world. Sorry, but the thought of that happening just creeps me out. If the trap was known as a post office is it possible that the diversion was the other way around? Could the 'cop and brother' have been the diversion? I'm not trying to stir up anything...just thinking and asking. truthseeker2 ... I cannot help but believe that something must be going on behind the scenes with the family, the FBI and John Q. Kelly in regards to the contents of the cage/trap ... in regards to the dynamics encompassing the Persistence search. We can only hope. Janet I hope you are right. I am hesitant to get my hopes up about anything. I'm sure all the monkeys know why. We have been "on the brink of getting some answers and/or action" so many times...and then nothing. I will still keep all options open and continue the research I am doing until something definitive is provided. Keeping Natalee and her family in my prayers. TS2 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 07:43:14 PM This part of Caps post appears to me to be a blatant attempt to undermine the significance of the trap/cage. He fails to grasp ... or does he ... that the evidence is the contents which were retrieved from the trap/cage. The location of the cage/trap has been targeted ... it can be retrieved at any time. This post of Caps which SS submitted above in full reveals that he is still desperately attempting to take the focus off the trap/cage. Janet ++++++++ CapsLockWizard Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #931 on: December 03, 2008, 04:19:56 AM » Another thing , I went to dive a week a go to the same location, and the Cage is still there. If the cage was evidance in a murder case, why is it still in the water. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564838#msg564838 I agree, Janet. They have gone to great lengths to redirect the focus away from the fish trap. I think the John Silvetti and company had their own agenda from the beginning. I fear that Caps is now part of that company. His words are just not true. Tim Miller has been in Birmingham and not with Silvetti. He made a statement almost identical to John Walsh's earlier this week. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 17, 2008, 07:48:09 PM All I want is Justice for Natalee. I'm not going to profess to know who is telling the truth and who is lying. If everything Kermit says is true then Silvetti is not to be trusted. Tim Miller as recently as last week was working with Silvetti on another MP case. If Silvetti is a bad person this has me worried for Tim Miller. I'm confused and not sure what I believe right now. I'd like to believe in Kermit and Caps. Me, too, Klaas. I don't believe even Kermit has claimed to know for a fact certain that Natalee's remains were in the trap. Only that whatever was retrieved was mishandled and ALE absconded with it pronto and it likely did not make it to the FBI. Is this correct, Kermit? Could have been Natalee but also could not have been. Also I can verify that Rob has said Colombians forever. We discussed over a year ago I think on this forum but no one paid any attention. TJ and maybe Art Woods both may know about these Colombians who are said to have been contracted for disposal. I even think Kyle went into this openly and honestly as may have Silvetti and others. They failed to heed the warnings about ALE and their penchant for making evidence disappear. So I don't know what to think at this point but am still trying to think the best of all parties involved. Hard at times. Going to watch Caylee reports and think about all of this. I can't imagine Kermit would have any reason whatsoever to misrepresent anything either. Deep down my gut feeling has always been that Natalee was still at the Sloot compound some how. They won't move for some reason even with all this adverse publicity and kids getting older, etc. Only one kid still at home now. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 07:50:48 PM Rob, Have you talked to Carpe lately? I miss him. I'm sorry, I have not. I miss him too. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 07:53:31 PM All I want is Justice for Natalee. I'm not going to profess to know who is telling the truth and who is lying. If everything Kermit says is true then Silvetti is not to be trusted. Tim Miller as recently as last week was working with Silvetti on another MP case. If Silvetti is a bad person this has me worried for Tim Miller. I'm confused and not sure what I believe right now. I'd like to believe in Kermit and Caps. Me, too, Klaas. I don't believe even Kermit has claimed to know for a fact certain that Natalee's remains were in the trap. Only that whatever was retrieved was mishandled and ALE absconded with it pronto and it likely did not make it to the FBI. Is this correct, Kermit? Could have been Natalee but also could not have been. Also I can verify that Rob has said Colombians forever. We discussed over a year ago I think on this forum but no one paid any attention. TJ and maybe Art Woods both may know about these Colombians who are said to have been contracted for disposal. I even think Kyle went into this openly and honestly as may have Silvetti and others. They failed to heed the warnings about ALE and their penchant for making evidence disappear. So I don't know what to think at this point but am still trying to think the best of all parties involved. Hard at times. Going to watch Caylee reports and think about all of this. I can't imagine Kermit would have any reason whatsoever to misrepresent anything either. Deep down my gut feeling has always been that Natalee was still at the Sloot compound some how. They won't move for some reason even with all this adverse publicity and kids getting older, etc. Only one kid still at home now. I paid attention, Anna. And I still do. Barranquilla by way of Santa Marta. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 17, 2008, 07:54:18 PM Quote from: CapsLockWizard on March 01, 2008, 11:53:14 PM
Remember My post before: The cage was there already, Post office has been exposed. Remember Dirty Cowboys. ________________________________ Re: Natalee Case Discussion #739 3/3 - by CapsLockWizard ... March 03, 2008, 11:21:38 PM Silverfox Post of the Day Just one thing though ... ... Persistence had accidently mapped a post office network: Given your hypothesis ... ... this post office network could help bring down .. ___________________________________________ Natalee Case Discussion #734 2/21 - 2/24/08 in LCD Archive by CapsLockWizard ... you have the correct term. Many early posters used that term when talking about ... ... to name a few. One of these people was posting as Checkme...trust me on this one. ... ... with Dutch Directors, Including the Post office. so to keep it in the ... . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 07:56:22 PM Always1
Yes Natalee is a real person and the only reason I am here as Admin of SM is because I made a promise to do my best to find justice for HER. I agreed to help Red with the site October 2005 after there was a problem with some of the Admin's and Mod's at the time. Same kind of problems we had with some that have been banned from SM and have started an invite only site. So please, no lectures. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 07:56:24 PM I'm an Victim's Rights Advocate. I try to help those that have no voice. Just as you all do. If I told you the SN's of some on the monkey board that victims themselves - your head would spin. Like Linda Blair's We all have our burdens to carry. When people like the crew of the Persistence can't even be trusted to do the right thing - we're all in trouble. I'm thankful Kermit has the ovaries and mental fortitude to do the right thing, or we would never know. That takes class. REAL CLASS. How do you Define “Ethical Leadership”? “doing the right thing even when no one is watching,” hi Rob....I have to laugh every time some writes ovaries instead of balls! BYW - good to see you..I gther something wonderful has happened in your life and I am happy for you! Hey Snoopy.....see ya Monday!! Talk to you before that! Hi Sunny, and thanks fer all the wonderful thoughts - they are soo appreciated by me. Yes, something wonderful DID happen and it's about to get even better. Thanks you soo much for the loving and caring wishes - happy holidays to you and your family. You're never far from my thoughts! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 07:57:03 PM I just cannot imagine that trap was being used for the last 3+ years as a drug post office with a body laying right there. Either it was a post office or it was a temporary resting place for some poor soul. I just can't see it being both.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 07:57:05 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 07:59:13 PM I've missed you Rob.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 08:00:55 PM I've missed you Rob. SS, I've missed you too... and I'm never far away. You are all like my family. I think about everyone all the time. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:01:21 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:04:12 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyWaa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:04:54 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. I agree SS.We all must understand as well that everybody's idealogy is not the same.That is the uniqueness of this Forum!You can't consider that as another poster said "He said,she said!"The problem i have continues to be the same.If people want to discuss stuff why not put it right here on the table??From my understanding former Monkeys have left and formed private sites which in my opinion is childish.JMOO.You don't like,or aren't hearing what you want so you leave,are smarter,more organized so you form an alliance like Reality TV.Scared Monkey's is about Transparency.For that i will always be thankful to the Forum,as well as the Mod's that do an absolutely fabulous job in a difficult position!We're all human and think diffirently.It'd be pretty boring if we thought alike. ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:05:48 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyWaa:: LOL. I was summarizing! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:06:54 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyWaa:: LOL. I was summarizing! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Me too!!! ::MonkeyTongue:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:08:32 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyWaa:: LOL. I was summarizing! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Me too!!! ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 17, 2008, 08:09:37 PM Always1 Yes Natalee is a real person and the only reason I am here as Admin of SM is because I made a promise to do my best to find justice for HER. I agreed to help Red with the site October 2005 after there was a problem with some of the Admin's and Mod's at the time. Same kind of problems we had with some that have been banned from SM and have started an invite only site. So please, no lectures. I for one thank you for making that promise. We would not be here because of that promise. Thank you Klaasend for all your time and effort. It is hard work and I don't know how you do it day in and day out. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:10:52 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. I agree SS.We all must understand as well that everybody's idealogy is not the same.That is the uniqueness of this Forum!You can't consider that as another poster said "He said,she said!"The problem i have continues to be the same.If people want to discuss stuff why not put it right here on the table??From my understanding former Monkeys have left and formed private sites which in my opinion is childish.JMOO.You don't like,or aren't hearing what you want so you leave,are smarter,more organized so you form an alliance like Reality TV.Scared Monkey's is about Transparency.For that i will always be thankful to the Forum,as well as the Mod's that do an absolutely fabulous job in a difficult position!We're all human and think diffirently.It'd be pretty boring if we thought alike. ::MonkeyCool:: I don't think so. I was often told by my eldest son when he was in his late teens ... "Mom ... it is either your way or the highway." He was right on! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:11:17 PM Always1 Yes Natalee is a real person and the only reason I am here as Admin of SM is because I made a promise to do my best to find justice for HER. I agreed to help Red with the site October 2005 after there was a problem with some of the Admin's and Mod's at the time. Same kind of problems we had with some that have been banned from SM and have started an invite only site. So please, no lectures. I for one thank you for making that promise. We would not be here because of that promise. Thank you Klaasend for all your time and effort. It is hard work and I don't know how you do it day in and day out. Klaas is the best zoo geeper EVER!! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:12:31 PM We are all really frustrated right now by the events that have transpired. Please, please let's not turn on each other right now. We all have the same goal. I agree SS.We all must understand as well that everybody's idealogy is not the same.That is the uniqueness of this Forum!You can't consider that as another poster said "He said,she said!"The problem i have continues to be the same.If people want to discuss stuff why not put it right here on the table??From my understanding former Monkeys have left and formed private sites which in my opinion is childish.JMOO.You don't like,or aren't hearing what you want so you leave,are smarter,more organized so you form an alliance like Reality TV.Scared Monkey's is about Transparency.For that i will always be thankful to the Forum,as well as the Mod's that do an absolutely fabulous job in a difficult position!We're all human and think diffirently.It'd be pretty boring if we thought alike. ::MonkeyCool:: I don't think so. I was often told by my eldest son when he was in his late teens ... "Mom ... it is either your way or the highway." He was right on! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet ::MonkeyLaugh:: Janet is like a fine wine.Get's better with age! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Edward on December 17, 2008, 08:17:03 PM We have been inundated with Propaganda designed to take you away from.
Stay out of that "attack" each other mode, as it means to the enemy they are winning. The cage is the only item with physical photographic evidence that says something and we own it. ::MonkeyWink:: Other then that none of these theories is even close to mine, I still read and try to comprehend all others and Joran is missing and the Thia Government is no place, as there appears to be no intended victims and the Dutch government continues to offer passive resistance and there political mumbo jumbo stories fly. All and All that trap may have been it. On the other side of that coin, ALE has all the evidence in there possession and it is prolly destroyed by now if that is so. Do not forget one thing EVERYTHING has been done by design by a crooked government and individuals to keep us away from the real truth. Hang in there friends.. After the new year they will try to let us down again.. If so.. No Mas Aruba !! Do not support DUTCH anything if that happens.. Do not buy Shell gasoline stay off there ships, research everything you purchase to make sure it ain't Dutch.. We want the truth.. We will except nothing less. Make them pay the price for their dishonesty. Anyways that is what I think.. Go back to sleep.. ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 08:18:01 PM 12/17/2008 Bondia
http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008BondiaPgA16.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:22:10 PM 12/17/2008 Bondia http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008BondiaPgA16.jpg) So is Paulus involved as a legal representative in the Luis Mansur case??What does this article say??Janet? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 17, 2008, 08:24:14 PM OE comments regarding the post office:
We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:28:48 PM OE comments regarding the post office: We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 So.What i gather is from Kyle's(OE) observations is that it was dropped in the water and nothing was disturbed inside the cage.Meaning "No Post Office".Correct me if i'm wrong!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:36:55 PM 12/17/2008 Bondia http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008BondiaPgA16.jpg) So is Paulus involved as a legal representative in the Luis Mansur case??What does this article say??Janet? Dutch? I do not have a clue. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:38:22 PM OE comments regarding the post office: We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 So.What i gather is from Kyle's(OE) observations is that it was dropped in the water and nothing was disturbed inside the cage.Meaning "No Post Office".Correct me if i'm wrong!! That's what it sounds like he is saying. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:38:45 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:40:45 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer? Janet.. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:41:57 PM OE comments regarding the post office: We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 So.What i gather is from Kyle's(OE) observations is that it was dropped in the water and nothing was disturbed inside the cage.Meaning "No Post Office".Correct me if i'm wrong!! That's what it sounds like he is saying. Would Caps and Kyle have not already had the conversation regarding the cage? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 17, 2008, 08:43:50 PM OE comments regarding the post office: We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 So.What i gather is from Kyle's(OE) observations is that it was dropped in the water and nothing was disturbed inside the cage.Meaning "No Post Office".Correct me if i'm wrong!! That's what it sounds like he is saying. Would Caps and Kyle have not already had the conversation regarding the cage? Or Caps and Silvetti. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 08:44:27 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer? The BONDIA paper is in Pap and not in Dutch. The Pap translator is pretty bad. Google has a pretty good Dutch translator. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:46:19 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer? Janet.. I don't think so. Klaas? Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 17, 2008, 08:47:38 PM Keepthefaith
That's what I think it says. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 08:49:43 PM Keepthefaith That's what I think it says. Are you talking about the Bondia article Buckeye?Be curious as to what it says and if PVDS is a council to a co-defendant in the Luis Mansur case so to speak! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 08:50:27 PM http://www.24ora.com/content/view/6828/6/#jc_allComments
Comments to the video of Hero Brinkman's comments on Greta's show. I didn't post them all, but included ones that looked very similar to some I saw posted earlier (from the front page of SM?). kadushi said: (google translated the first part from Dutch) Hero Brinkman, as the familiar he is worth his guests. Why do not you study in your own country, of all child murders that are unsolved. Why do not you research the pedo file movement in the Netherlands? The sex tourism to Asia, trafficking in prostitution, discrimination against foreigners. And Greta you know all those horribles things that happens in your own country. Why you do not investigate all the childrens that are killed in Afganistan an Irak. Why you do not show all the handicapped Americans that come back from the war. Its easy to try to demolish a small island like Aruba. Not Hero, nor Greta(also a Dutch) will succedc to damage the Arubian.Mr. Paul v.d. Sloot and Mr. van Straten are Dutch and not Arubean. The coruped are the Dutch living in Aruba? pinkpanter said: Increible con e macamba aki ta insulta henter e isla yamando tur hende pa corupto!!!!! hendenan cu no tin nada que ber cu e asunto di e macamba vies cu yama van de sloot y berdad ta cu Aruba ainda ta carga e hendenan aki manera cu nan ta hendenan drechi. Cada bes nan ta ser invita na fiestanan social y nan ta prome cu tey y anos cu ta saluda nan ta mescos cu nan bah......ami si no kier tin nada cu e Macamba nan aki pa nada danki na nan nos tur ta ser yama CORUPTO. Papiamentu translation: come across increible con the macamba here is insulta all the island yamando everybody for corupto!!!!! hendenan cu not have nothing que bear cu the asunto of the macamba vies cu calling van de sloot y berdad is cu aruba still is carga the hendenan here as cu they're hendenan right. cada times they're being invita at fiestanan social y they're first cu tey y us cu is saluda they're same cu they bah......ami if does not have nothing cu the macamba they here for nothing thanks at they we all is being calling corupto. come across whoaretoblame said: E MR. Hero Brinknam aki no ta mucho educa. Si Aruba ta corrupto anto ta e hulandesnan di Europa a corrumpi e isla aki. No shonnan Van der Straten NO a tapa pa Tata & joew van der Sloot sino ela tapa pa un otro MACAMBA(nan)? hopi mas poderoso y hopi DIABOLICO. Esaki ta mi opinion.No c*lpa hende sin cu bo sa kiko a pasa! VD STRATEN MOET NU PRATEN. Papiamentu translation: the mr. iron brinknam here do not mucho educa. if aruba is corrupto then is the hulandesnan of europa owing to corrumpi the island here. not shonnan van der straten not owing to tapa for father & joew van der sloot but ela tapa for one another macamba(nan)? much more powerful y much diabolico. this is my opinion.no c*lpa person without cu do you know what owing to happen! vd straten moet nu praten. come across J.V said: his day wil come,dont worry.......Pim fortuin pt 2.....His day will come!!! Why dont you and greta come here on vacation? beautifull beaches,peacefull people.....we are waiting on you guys.....bring that dog nancy grace too....You are more than welcome!! Arubans are peaceful people paying a hefty price for what some dutch guys did or didnt do.....Keep talkin long enough and the day comes you have to answer to all of it wheter you want to or not!!!! J.V said: KOM HIER OP VACANTIE MENEER BRINKMAN!!!!WE WACHTEN OP JE!!! JE BENT WELKOM Dutch translation: COME HERE ON Holiday BRINKMAN Sir!! WE WAIT ON YOU! YOU ARE WELCOME snip: This one in English: Adelina Croes said: Please send this message to Mr.Brinkman and Ms.Van Susteren -Most Arubans are decent people but, sorry to say so, not all of us; -Many Arubans are smart people but, sorry to say so, not the majority; -All adult Arubans have right to elect their political representants but, sorry to say so, the outcome always mirrors the former two lines. YOU as a smart reader though will understand that YOU will not condemn us ALL for these facts. Thank you for your consideration. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 08:51:15 PM OE comments regarding the post office: We've internally discussed the possibility of a "post office" of sorts while awaiting forensic testing results. The problems with this theory include: -little or no evident anchor scars from a boat or boats at or anywhere near the site which would support diving ops. -The trap shows no apparent evidence of human tampering one would expect from in situ placement and removal of objects inside the trap. The sand inside the trap shows no disruption. The soft growth on the trap shows no obvious scars, where something scrapes or slides on the trap during a placement or withdrawal. The potential issues of a Venezuelan fishing vessel passing through: - The location of the trap is significantly out of the way for passing through vessels. - The location of the trap is not in an area where fishermen fish with commercial traps. - There are no significant near by seabed obstructions which the trap would have gotten hung-up on to explain it's loss. - The trap is only in 90ft of water, which makes it easily recoverable by divers if accidentally lost. Other notes: - The location is in the lee of the island, which makes the location somewhat weather protected and therefore less likely to have been lost during a storm. - The trap appears to be in it's original location, as evident by an impact depression in the seabed clearly seen in the sonar. -It appears the trap hit the bottom very hard as in a free fall. One corner hit just before the others and the trap seemingly "bounced" a few feet and remained in its current position and orientation. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366270#msg366270 So.What i gather is from Kyle's(OE) observations is that it was dropped in the water and nothing was disturbed inside the cage.Meaning "No Post Office".Correct me if i'm wrong!! That's what it sounds like he is saying. Would Caps and Kyle have not already had the conversation regarding the cage? JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. +++++ KYLE KINGMAN'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM oceanexploration: "We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care. Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing. Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE." Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 17, 2008, 08:53:12 PM Keepthefaith That's what I think it says. Are you talking about the Bondia article Buckeye?Be curious as to what it says and if PVDS is a council to a co-defendant in the Luis Mansur case so to speak! No...OE's post regarding post office. As for Papiamentu...I don't even go there. I wait for texasmom to translate the translation. I do miss our pap translators. Can we petition google to add the language? If we did that, Aruba would probably declare a different language. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 17, 2008, 08:53:40 PM 12/17/2008 Bondia http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008BondiaPgA16.jpg) So is Paulus involved as a legal representative in the Luis Mansur case??What does this article say??Janet? Paulus is representing Mr. Leito. i don't know what the article says but it mentions the Supreme Court in The Hague. i would be a good thing to have the spotlight on Van der Sloot when he has to defend a case for the Supreme Court. i don't think many know that Paulus is still doing his job as attorney. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 08:54:17 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer? Janet.. I don't think so. Klaas? Janet For translating many languages (other than Pap) the Google translator is pretty darn good. You can even translate the entire page. Unfortunately, the only news publication in Aruba NOT in Pap is Amigoe. Google translator: http://www.google.com/language_tools?hl=en Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 17, 2008, 08:58:32 PM http://www.24ora.com/content/view/6828/6/#jc_allComments Comments to the video of Hero Brinkman's comments on Greta's show. I didn't post them all, but included ones that looked very similar to some I saw posted earlier (from the front page of SM?). J.V said: his day wil come,dont worry.......Pim fortuin pt 2.....His day will come!!! Why dont you and greta come here on vacation? beautifull beaches,peacefull people.....we are waiting on you guys.....bring that dog nancy grace too....You are more than welcome!! Arubans are peaceful people paying a hefty price for what some dutch guys did or didnt do.....Keep talkin long enough and the day comes you have to answer to all of it wheter you want to or not!!!! Now, I must say that these are some of the "peaceful" Arubans, that I have come to know. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 08:59:20 PM Keepthefaith That's what I think it says. Are you talking about the Bondia article Buckeye?Be curious as to what it says and if PVDS is a council to a co-defendant in the Luis Mansur case so to speak! No...OE's post regarding post office. As for Papiamentu...I don't even go there. I wait for texasmom to translate the translation. I do miss our pap translators. Can we petition google to add the language? If we did that, Aruba would probably declare a different language. ::MonkeyHaHa:: I know what you mean Buckeye, if we ever figure it out, they'll change it! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 09:01:29 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and
then through the Portuguese to English. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 09:06:02 PM 12/17/2008 Bondia http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 So is Paulus involved as a legal representative in the Luis Mansur case??What does this article say??Janet? Paulus is representing Mr. Leito. i don't know what the article says but it mentions the Supreme Court in The Hague. i would be a good thing to have the spotlight on Van der Sloot when he has to defend a case for the Supreme Court. i don't think many know that Paulus is still doing his job as attorney. I had the same thought Caesu! Let Paul go to the Hague and defend this. If I understand the article at the link below correctly, on appeal Paul's clients sentence was increased from 20 months to 41 months! I think I'd be begging for another lawyer to argue my case... http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=nl&u=http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%2520internationaal/archief%2520nieuwsbronnen%2520internationaal/2008/2008-12-nieuwsbronnen-internationaal/2008-12-nieuwsbronnen%2520internationaal.htm&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=5&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Melvin%2BLeito%2522%252Bvan%2Bder%2Bsloot%26hl%3Den Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 09:11:15 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and then through the Portuguese to English. Yes, that does help some. Still, Dutch is much easier don't you think? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 09:14:06 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and then through the Portuguese to English. Yes, that does help some. Still, Dutch is much easier don't you think? Dutch is much easier. I think Pap is terrible because so many languages are involved. I always admired Getagrip! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Hotshot on December 17, 2008, 09:15:33 PM I am bringing this forward: I know john only in speaking with him twice about the case. No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe. Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys. I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again. For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor. I have explained that also. I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken out of context. i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee. Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee. we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee. Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion. I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before. Why??? Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad. i think that was a chance of a lifetime. Mansure was on the boat, why? I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive...Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #973 on: Today at 05:29:25 PM » I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. I am off to sleep now. the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 09:17:21 PM I agree with Klaas, the Dutch articles are much easier to get translations for. I usually use Google translate too.
One problem I have with the Bondia articles is that I don't know if there's a way to grab the text from the articles (in the flipping book) that aren't included on the front page of the website. I have been typing out and running through the translator the ones that I'm really interested in. That's too much work for most of them. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 09:18:52 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and then through the Portuguese to English. Yes, that does help some. Still, Dutch is much easier don't you think? Dutch is much easier. I think Pap is terrible because so many languages are involved. I always admired Getagrip! Me too! I miss the translations! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 17, 2008, 09:23:04 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and then through the Portuguese to English. Yes, that does help some. Still, Dutch is much easier don't you think? Dutch is much easier. I think Pap is terrible because so many languages are involved. I always admired Getagrip! Getagrip has a great sense of humor and she is so bright. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 09:24:47 PM I am bringing this forward: I know john only in speaking with him twice about the case. No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe. Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys. I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again. For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor. I have explained that also. I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken out of context. i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee. Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee. we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee. Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion. I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before. Why??? Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad. i think that was a chance of a lifetime. Mansure was on the boat, why? I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive...Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #973 on: Today at 05:29:25 PM » I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. I am off to sleep now. the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all. What would it profit Kermit to quote Kyle out of context? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 09:28:02 PM It helps me if I run it through the Pap translator and then through the Portuguese to English. Yes, that does help some. Still, Dutch is much easier don't you think? Dutch is much easier. I think Pap is terrible because so many languages are involved. I always admired Getagrip! Getagrip has a great sense of humor and she is so bright. I agree, San. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Blue Moon on December 17, 2008, 09:30:18 PM I am bringing this forward: I know john only in speaking with him twice about the case. No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe. Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys. I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again. For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor. I have explained that also. I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken out of context. i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee. Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee. we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee. Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion. I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before. Why??? Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad. i think that was a chance of a lifetime. Mansure was on the boat, why? I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive...Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #973 on: Today at 05:29:25 PM » I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. I am off to sleep now. the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all. thanks hotshot for responding. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 09:30:48 PM I just thought you had a Translator from your computer? Janet.. I don't think so. Klaas? Janet For translating many languages (other than Pap) the Google translator is pretty darn good. You can even translate the entire page. Unfortunately, the only news publication in Aruba NOT in Pap is Amigoe. Google translator: http://www.google.com/language_tools?hl=en Thanks Klaas. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 09:39:06 PM So what's your take HotShot.Just some boat guys in over their head?I've asked this before.If they were not briefed before going into
aruban waters their not very smart.JMOO.The problem with that is there business is about being in water!One would assume after speaking with Dave Holloway John silvetti would NEVER trust the ALE,but from Kyle's own words the is quite the contrary!Not Logical to me!"IF" she was in that cage?Again.We may never know.Why?It's all in Kyle's own words.He tell's the story..Correct me if i'm wrong.As well i've always appreciated your responses as well as honesty.We don't have to all agree but continue to seek JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!Still waiting on those witnesses..KEEPTHEFAITH Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 09:39:24 PM ooohhh cripes already - those WERE Kyle's own words. Let's knock it off already - this is getting to be a huge pain in the arse and I'm starting to get really pissed that someone here is impugning Kermit. Knock it off Kath.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 09:43:19 PM Always1 Yes Natalee is a real person and the only reason I am here as Admin of SM is because I made a promise to do my best to find justice for HER. I agreed to help Red with the site October 2005 after there was a problem with some of the Admin's and Mod's at the time. Same kind of problems we had with some that have been banned from SM and have started an invite only site. So please, no lectures. I for one thank you for making that promise. We would not be here because of that promise. Thank you Klaasend for all your time and effort. It is hard work and I don't know how you do it day in and day out. :smt038 :thumleft: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 09:43:51 PM ooohhh cripes already - those WERE Kyle's own words. Let's knock it off already - this is getting to be a huge pain in the arse and I'm starting to get really pissed that someone here is impugning Kermit. Knock it off Kath. Rob.You are a Pirate of EPIC proportions.. ::MonkeyLaugh:: You and Capt.Sparrow on the open seas..Great visual.. ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 09:48:56 PM ooohhh cripes already - those WERE Kyle's own words. Let's knock it off already - this is getting to be a huge pain in the arse and I'm starting to get really pissed that someone here is impugning Kermit. Knock it off Kath. Thank you, Rob. ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 10:18:37 PM Here's the deal. Neither Kyle or Capslock have been banned. They are welcome to post rebuttles to anything Kermit is posting. I'm all for hearing both sides of the story. It's not like it's going to harm the investigation. After this long I doubt anything can hurt the investigation.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 10:18:53 PM So what's your take HotShot.Just some boat guys in over their head?I've asked this before.If they were not briefed before going into aruban waters their not very smart.JMOO.The problem with that is there business is about being in water!One would assume after speaking with Dave Holloway John silvetti would NEVER trust the ALE,but from Kyle's own words the is quite the contrary!Not Logical to me!"IF" she was in that cage?Again.We may never know.Why?It's all in Kyle's own words.He tell's the story..Correct me if i'm wrong.As well i've always appreciated your responses as well as honesty.We don't have to all agree but continue to seek JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!Still waiting on those witnesses..KEEPTHEFAITH The following words of Kyle kingman are not taken out of context. I knew when this post was submitted to SM ... a public forum ... SOMETHING WAS NOT RIGHT and ... the search effort had yet to begin. Logic dictated that a joint venture with the enemy to recover Natalee Holloway's remains could only be furthering the coverup agenda of Aruba. Janet +++++++ KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM oceanexploration Re: Natalee Case Discussion #715 1/25 - « Reply #103 on: January 26, 2008, 12:38:25 PM » Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it- To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help. They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust. Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time. We've helped each other however and whenever we can. They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right. I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning. Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2539.msg332457;topicseen#msg332457 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 17, 2008, 10:23:19 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM
I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 10:26:04 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: Good eyes!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 10:26:28 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: some people don't spell the word God out completely... only certain people do that ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: snoopy on December 17, 2008, 10:27:41 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: I think he always spells God like that. Don't know why. It's all good. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 17, 2008, 10:29:52 PM I don't know Kermit's reason to type G_d, but I have read the vowel is omitted out of respect by some Jewish.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 10:30:08 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: some people don't spell the word God out completely... only certain people do that ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 17, 2008, 10:31:34 PM I don't know Kermit's reason to type G_d, but I have read the vowel is omitted out of respect by some Jewish. Hi Muffy - and ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 17, 2008, 10:31:50 PM Here's the deal. Neither Kyle or Capslock have been banned. They are welcome to post rebuttles to anything Kermit is posting. I'm all for hearing both sides of the story. It's not like it's going to harm the investigation. After this long I doubt anything can hurt the investigation. I would like to hear from both of them (not others speaking for them), but I'm not counting on it. (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Greetings/smileys/sad.gif) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 17, 2008, 10:35:27 PM Here's the deal. Neither Kyle or Capslock have been banned. They are welcome to post rebuttles to anything Kermit is posting. I'm all for hearing both sides of the story. It's not like it's going to harm the investigation. After this long I doubt anything can hurt the investigation. I would like to hear from both of them (not others speaking for them), but I'm not counting on it. (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Greetings/smileys/sad.gif) I agree texasmom. Hi Rob :smt039 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 10:35:37 PM Then two months later when Kyle Kingman posted the following on SM ... a open forum ... I knew that my original negative feelings regarding a joint Persistence/ALE venture to locate Natalee Holloway's remain were right on. It was clear ... the search effort had everything to do with assisting THE FINALE TO THE GREAT ARUBAN COVERUP.
Janet ++++++ KYLE KINGMAN'S POST - SCARED MONKEY FORUM oceanexploration Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 - « Reply #201 on: March 19, 2008, 08:21:47 PM » We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care. Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing. Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.msg366857;topicseen#msg366857 BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST - SCARED MONKEYS FORUM private eye Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4 « Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM » If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245#msg372245 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 17, 2008, 10:38:15 PM If pond was a diversion,
Was pond witness (mud,one shoe,pickup by jeep) also a diversion? Both suggested by CAPS Pond witness passed polygraph tests, though. So, maybe not a diversion... ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 10:38:21 PM Quote from: Kermit on Today at 03:19:47 PM I hope the information helps in some way to bring Natalee home to her mother and father. G_d bless you all. G_d bless Natalee. Are the missing o's a cryptic message? ::MonkeyConfused:: some people don't spell the word God out completely... only certain people do that ::MonkeyWink:: Did I hear my name? ::MonkeyTongue:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 10:39:42 PM Here's the deal. Neither Kyle or Capslock have been banned. They are welcome to post rebuttles to anything Kermit is posting. I'm all for hearing both sides of the story. It's not like it's going to harm the investigation. After this long I doubt anything can hurt the investigation. I would like to hear from both of them (not others speaking for them), but I'm not counting on it. (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Greetings/smileys/sad.gif) I'm still tryin to logically understand how someone can defend someone when that persons own words contradict their belief???Does that make any sense?? ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: snoopy on December 17, 2008, 10:41:23 PM I don't know Kermit's reason to type G_d, but I have read the vowel is omitted out of respect by some Jewish. Really? I did not know that. I'll remember from now on. Thanks. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 10:44:31 PM I don't know Kermit's reason to type G_d, but I have read the vowel is omitted out of respect by some Jewish. Hi Muffy - and ::MonkeyWink:: I just looked it up to educate myself. Learn something new every day. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 10:47:54 PM I don't know Kermit's reason to type G_d, but I have read the vowel is omitted out of respect by some Jewish. Really? I did not know that. I'll remember from now on. Thanks. I was afraid that it meant "over and out". I hope not. Jews do not believe in closing out a web page with God's name on it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:01:39 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 11:04:07 PM If pond was a diversion, Was pond witness (mud,one shoe,pickup by jeep) also a diversion? Both suggested by CAPS Pond witness passed polygraph tests, though. So, maybe not a diversion... ::MonkeyConfused:: The "pond" witness may very well be the real McCoy. However ... I do not believe he stated he observed Paulus and Joran at the Monserat pond ... on driving in the direction of the Monserat pond. I believe that the gardener's testimony implies that it may be possible that Joran may have temporarily hidden Natalee's body in one of the ponds prior to contacting Paulus for assistance ... this is why he was muddy. Janet +++++++ Jossy Mansur DIARIO - PART 2 Key witness reveals what happened 4:05 am at Monserat Paulus and Joran were “looking” for something on the side of the road THE WITNESS’ STATEMENT On May 30th, 2005 he was sleeping in his room; when he was awaken by the alarming sound of barking dogs. He opened his eyes and checked his alarm clock; it was 4:05 am. He got up and listening to where the barking was coming from, he went in the living room and peeked thru the window to find out why the dogs sounded so alarmed. Under the street light, he saw someone walking towards his house, from the Nacional Soccer field, close to the Monserat pond and hotel area. While the person was walking under another street light, he could clearly see the person. It was undoubtedly a man, notably tall, slim, Caucasian, with short and dark hair, relatively young and he looked like a Dutch citizen. He could see his profile and one side of his face. He was wearing a red t-shirt and light colored pants. The witness noticed by the way the person was limping, that he was missing his right sneaker or shoe. He also noted that the person was breathing extremely hard, as if he just had been running very hard for a long time. His chest was heaving. WET AND MUDDY CLOTHES The witness stated (and probably also in the lie-detector test), that the person clothes were wet and that he also saw a muddy stripe on his chest, more or less about 5 centimeters above his chest. The muddy stripe on his chest clearly showed that he was completely wet. At first glance, the witness though that the person maybe had been in a fight with someone, and he was running not to get beat up. But his face showed no bruises or blood. But because he didn’t look back not even to check if someone might be following him and just kept walking fast with his head down, the witness thought he did something other that fighting. The person walked past his house, and kept walking, until he was out of sight, and he never raised his head or looked back, and just kept walking in the hotel’s direction. This happened in about one minute. NEW INFORMATION After the witness saw the person walk past his house and was out of sight, he sat down in his living room for about 5 minutes. He then noticed a car driving slowly, coming from the hotel area. Behind the wheel was a middle-aged, Caucasian man. Next to him, the witness saw the young man that was walking past his house a few minutes earlier. The witness said they were driving a red jeep, and that they were driving extremely slow. He stated to the American investigators that was clearly that the driver and the passenger were looking for something on the floor. He said that the car just keep going in the direction of the Monserat pond. http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/09/16/natalee-holloway-investigation-the-witness-was-afraid-to-come-forward-aware-that-paulus-van-der-sloot-had-powerful-connections-in-the-prosecutors-office/#more-6072 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 17, 2008, 11:05:01 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 17, 2008, 11:12:55 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I'm not sure if Kermit specified. It believe it came out later that Kyle may have made those posts either at Freebirds or in emails to Kermit. I'm not sure which one it was. I think it was in Freebirds. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 17, 2008, 11:15:25 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? Kermit did not reveal the private forum that Kyle had posted his concerns regarding the John S./ALE connection as well as the ROV images. However ... when you consider the revelation of the first set of ROV images that were posted by Robin Holloway on a "private" forum ... you would have thought Kyle would have learned that there is no such thing as a "private" forum. Janet ++++++++ oceanexploration Re: Natalee Case Discussion #736 2/27 - « Reply #525 on: February 29, 2008, 02:58:40 AM » I really didn't want to respond to all this but I feel I must. Please stop...and carefully think things through here. You know who I mean. WHAT do you think you are doing? What do you seriously think you are going to accomplish with the pics? Don't you even think to consider for a second that we the search team, who found the trap, supervised it's sampling, recorded that video and others... are ensuring the situation is in proper hands and being taken care of appropriately and completely? You are not helping anything by interfering with what you do not fully understand. Please let the authorities do their jobs without interference. Robin should never have posted those pics because of the stir they would cause. She trusted (mistakenly) people's ethics on a private forum. One of the reasons (among many) that this case has taken so long to solve is because of the Internet, media, and well intended partially-informed people's ambitions and agendas. Stay out of business you don't belong in. You all know I am an ally both in the field and on the net. I have done my best to both bring success to this case and to keep people informed and updated with what information should be provided. We the search team have worked extremely hard over a long time. Many of you have as well. Let's not let our frustrations get the best of us. Let us not let our emotions interfere with what we know to be true, and let us not forget who we are and what jobs we have to do. Let those who are responsible do their jobs. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2654.msg357200;topicseen#msg357200 exploration Re: Natalee Case Discussion #739 3/3 - « Reply #79 on: March 03, 2008, 05:47:47 PM » There were three ROV dive videos of the trap. Video 1 : 29th Dec - ROV visual inspection of the trap. (very small clip of this video on Dateline). Remember, the Dateline footage was taken over our shoulders by filming the ROV monitor. The footage is not the recorded ROV footage. Video 2: Dec 30th - ROV and Diver visual-only inspection of trap. This is the dive Dateline and Tim Miller witnessed, also the dive footage the screen captures I made came from that were posted by Robin at BNH. Icolor=red]I sent these 6 screen shots to the FBI and the FBI only. I was shocked to see them posted. I thought we had a security breach on the boat from my workstation or a leak from the FBI. Turns out the FBI gave them to Dave H. after he couldn't get them from me.[/color] After Tim Miller told Dave that we found her in a trap with 99.9% certainty (this is pre-diver inspection), Dave very reasonably requested them from me. I badly wanted to send them to him, but couldn't. Apparently, shortly therafter the FBI send the screen shots to Dave anyway, and therefore Robin had them. What you all really didn't know (nor Tim Miller when he said his statements to the press, neither Dateline NBC when they broadcasted their lovely special): Video 3: Jan 7th - ROV monitoring diver tactile inspection of the trap with sampling of items inside and outside of trap. The trap was not recovered. Recovered samples sent for forensic analysis. Neither Tim Miller nor the media were on board. The trap in Video 1-3 was found from the first conducted ROV dive. I found the target at 1:46 am on Christmas morning. It was my #1 ranked priority target and therefore the first of the ROV dive series. Several hours of footage were of other dives on other targets. None were of any relevance. Most targets were of peculiar coral pinnacles, man-made debris, and ship wrecks. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2668.msg360047;topicseen#msg360047 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:17:15 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 11:23:45 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? I don't know for certain, but I think that a lot of what Kermit has shared here is from emails between Kermit & Kyle. One of Kyle's last posts here said : "I am sorry I trusted you with so much as a greeting." Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:24:56 PM This for you Wreck....
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 17, 2008, 11:26:53 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Free birds.(OUR???????????? gee sh!! ::Monkeying:: ::Monkeys:: ) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 11:31:16 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? If anyone else had this information and didn't come forward it would be very sad to say the least! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 11:33:07 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? I don't know for certain, but I think that a lot of what Kermit has shared here is from emails between Kermit & Kyle. One of Kyle's last posts here said : "I am sorry I trusted you with so much as a greeting." Magnolia, I was under the impression that the quotes were from emails received by Kermit from Kyle. After they were quoted several times, and others mentioned the private forum, I was not certain. I still am not certain. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:34:23 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? If anyone else had this information and didn't come forward it would be very sad to say the least! I just recall that people were saying that Kyles statements were taken out of context which means that there are more people than just Kermit who knew what was going on. This isn't making sense to me. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 17, 2008, 11:34:28 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Free birds.(OUR???????????? gee sh!! ::Monkeying:: ::Monkeys:: ) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? That's why The monkey cage is such a blessing.It's transparent.NO SECRETS here.If any Monkey thinks i'm off the tracks.I trust in the fact that you'll let me know.TRUTH & JUSTICE is what Monkey's are after... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 17, 2008, 11:36:29 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? If anyone else had this information and didn't come forward it would be very sad to say the least! I just recall that people were saying that Kyles statements were taken out of context which means that there are more people than just Kermit who knew what was going on. This isn't making sense to me. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 17, 2008, 11:38:01 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? I don't know for certain, but I think that a lot of what Kermit has shared here is from emails between Kermit & Kyle. One of Kyle's last posts here said : "I am sorry I trusted you with so much as a greeting." Magnolia, I was under the impression that the quotes were from emails received by Kermit from Kyle. After they were quoted several times, and others mentioned the private forum, I was not certain. I still am not certain. Well, I am just as dumb as a box of rocks. ::MonkeyHaHa:: I thought the private forum was the "new one" with ******* and Destiny. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 11:43:50 PM Does anyone remember where Kermit said that Kyle was making all of those posts? Was it on freebirds? I don't think Kermit mentioned the forum, but it was speculated to be @ Freebirds.(OU???????????? geesh!! ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyHaHa::) I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? I don't know for certain, but I think that a lot of what Kermit has shared here is from emails between Kermit & Kyle. One of Kyle's last posts here said : "I am sorry I trusted you with so much as a greeting." Magnolia, I was under the impression that the quotes were from emails received by Kermit from Kyle. After they were quoted several times, and others mentioned the private forum, I was not certain. I still am not certain. Well, I am just as dumb as a box of rocks. ::MonkeyHaHa:: I thought the private forum was the "new one" with ******* and Destiny. No, no, I'm sure we can elect someone else to be that!!!....I believe Kermit quoted email with names removed, iirc, but there were many quotes that said 'kyle said', etc. Those were the ones I wasn't sure about. I guess you'd have to be there. Not saying I doubt Kermit, just acknowledging your post about emails from Kyle to Kermit. Just don't quite get it all...waiting for that light to go on!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 17, 2008, 11:45:12 PM Or maybe it's the Private PRIVATE FORUM? Or the Super Duper Private PRIVATE FORUM? Or the Hidey Hole, as some call it? Reminds me of when kids play and build forts and tree houses and you gotta have the secret password to get in. LOL
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:46:54 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:50:52 PM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything?
Norman has it all over Stillwater. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 17, 2008, 11:52:23 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 11:52:47 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? My memory tells me that it didn't come up. I thought Kermit had possession of things that Kyle knew about. It wasn't posted here, to my knowledge. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 17, 2008, 11:54:30 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)::MonkeyHaHa:: Good one. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:55:50 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 17, 2008, 11:58:33 PM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? My memory tells me that it didn't come up. I thought Kermit had possession of things that Kyle knew about. It wasn't posted here, to my knowledge. I'm sure that information wasn't posted here or in Shango or we would have remembered it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:00:18 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:00:48 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. [size6pt]How to get to Norman from OKC: Go South until you smell it, go east until you step in it![/size] Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:03:05 AM Season's Greetings, maybe?
12/17/2008 Solo di Pueblo http://solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&Itemid=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008sdpSashaRidpath.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 12:05:17 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? My memory tells me that it didn't come up. I thought Kermit had possession of things that Kyle knew about. It wasn't posted here, to my knowledge. I'm sure that information wasn't posted here or in Shango or we would have remembered it. I think it's pretty apparent in terms of who's on a private forum,as well as when they post on Scared Monkey's.I've not been on here consistently until after the Thailand stuff with Joran i believe.Since then i have been on pretty consistently do to owning my own business which affords me the time.Since the Persistence issue,as well as Kermit bringing forth those photos i've personally seen a pattern of a certain element of trying to discredit Kermit.Still.No one has giving me a logical reason,backed by facts,as to why they don't believe Kermit! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 12:06:34 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. [size6pt]How to get to Norman from OKC: Go South until you smell it, go east until you step in it![/size] You form OKC Wreck?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:09:01 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)Originally -- I now live in Dallas. I will be there for Christmas But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. [size6pt]How to get to Norman from OKC: Go South until you smell it, go east until you step in it![/size] You form OKC Wreck?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:09:54 AM Originally -- I now live in Dallas. I will be there for Christmas ::MonkeyConfused::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:10:10 AM Season's Greetings, maybe? 12/17/2008 Solo di Pueblo http://solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&Itemid=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/12172008sdpSashaRidpath.jpg) I tried typing it out and running through translator, may have had some typos... aruba, paseo, is the season for we all tin: peace, love, hope y comprencion for another, sasha ridpath reflexiona on the ana here, y corda the momentonan cheerful cu you have happen inside y if occasion owing to succeed for let another they feel happy. if are you think cu do you will desea for can owing to change the momentonan tristo, still do you por…. pesey have hope, ask comprension for her momentonan cu bop or owing to abort, y also compronde cu if the another owing to abort, could you pordone. give do you self love y peace, y cu is esey is thing you can ofreee. are you the person cu can goza of, paseo! come across Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 18, 2008, 12:10:47 AM 'Van der Eem assaulted girlfriend'
(http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/eem_188325h.jpg) http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2855553/Van_der_Eem_mishandelde_vriendin.html attacked her with a crowbar this weekend. briefly detained and also drivers license taken away because his driving was dangerous while the police were chasing him. OM has to decide what the next steps are. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 12:11:08 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. I don't know that others knew. Do you think they did? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 12:12:11 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 12:12:35 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)Originally -- I now live in Dallas. I will be there for Christmas But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. [size6pt]How to get to Norman from OKC: Go South until you smell it, go east until you step in it![/size] You form OKC Wreck?? O/T for i second.From Seattle so was seeing how the Thunder were going over down there??Back to Natalee... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:12:44 AM 'Van der Eem assaulted girlfriend' (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/eem_188325h.jpg) http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2855553/Van_der_Eem_mishandelde_vriendin.html attacked her with a crowbar this weekend. briefly detained and also drivers license taken away because his driving was dangerous while the police were chasing him. OM has to decide what the next steps are. ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek:: That's terrible! Is she o.k.? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 12:13:11 AM ::MonkeyNoNo:: Caesu, never a dull moment....geesh...
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 12:17:53 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. I don't know that others knew. Do you think they did? Well, if this information was discussed on freebirds or whatever other forum it was discussed on, why is Kermit swinging out there all alone like a pinata. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:19:31 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, did you see my post above? I'm pretty sure it was HOTSHOT (just this evening) that said that Kyle told HER this personally - not in a secret forum. I don't think anyone has alluded to what Kyle shared in a secret forum. (at least nothing I've seen) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 18, 2008, 12:20:10 AM 'Van der Eem assaulted girlfriend' (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/eem_188325h.jpg) http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2855553/Van_der_Eem_mishandelde_vriendin.html attacked her with a crowbar this weekend. briefly detained and also drivers license taken away because his driving was dangerous while the police were chasing him. OM has to decide what the next steps are. ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek:: That's terrible! Is she o.k.? it doesn't say about her condition. only says he hit her on her upper leg. and he has been stalking her over the phone. she managed to call the police. and then the police chased him. but they stopped chasing him as it became too dangerous. they arrested him the next morning. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 12:22:07 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. I am not TM, but Hotshot and ldstlou both said that they had conversed privately with Kyle and he had said that the Kermit's post were taken out of context. I do not believe they were. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:24:08 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? SS ... I just scanned Kermits posts (profile) ... I do not think he/she made that clear. The first set of ROV images were revealed around February 29, 2008 when they were posted on the SM forum. These images originated from a private forum that Robin Holloway posted at. This is the first I was aware that there were ROV images which were not turned over to the ALE. The second set of ROV images were posted by Kermit on November 24, 2008 along with Kyle's posts brought over from either a private forum and/or emails. This is the first I knew of a second set of ROV images that were not turned over to the ALE. Up until this time ... I was unaware that Kyle was posting anywhere other than BFN and SM. All my speculations were based on posts that Kyle Kingman posted on SM. Janet ++++++++ oceanexploration Re: Natalee Case Discussion #777 11/21/08 thru « Reply #820 on: November 23, 2008, 06:46:34 PM » Kermit, First, I have NEVER threatened you. The only thing I said to you is that I do not want to be sued by releasing information into the public that I was specifically told by OUR FBI as confidential. When I'm told not to comment by our FBI, I listen. You clearly do not understand this. I made a mistake trusting you with so much as a greeting. It was a gross misjudgement in character on my part. We all want the truth out in it's entirety. The truth will be told by Beth in her terms when SHE feels ready. It's not up to you or I. If you want the truth, ask BETH, not me. Your answers will come from her. As for me, I stand by Natalee. I'm sorry Kermit, my answer is NO. This is my last post at SM. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4159.msg554523;topicseen#msg554523 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 12:26:10 AM Does anyone recall if Kyle gave the second set of photographs to Kermit privately, or were they posted at freebirds? I THINK privately (it seems no one that posts here will even admit they belong to a private forum!) (they just seem to know everything posted in them though!!)But if others knew, why are we just learning about this now? Boomer sooner, boomer sooner. I don't know that others knew. Do you think they did? Well, if this information was discussed on freebirds or whatever other forum it was discussed on, why is Kermit swinging out there all alone like a pinata. The other(s) could have had their own correspondence with Kyle via email or whatever. Some have admitted it here. Seems Kermit was trying to get us to figure it out long before posting what was posted. The other(s) may not have ever been on the same page as Kermit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 12:27:11 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, did you see my post above? I'm pretty sure it was HOTSHOT (just this evening) that said that Kyle told HER this personally - not in a secret forum. I don't think anyone has alluded to what Kyle shared in a secret forum. (at least nothing I've seen) Yes, Wreck, I did. I am thinking back to not just today, but over the past few weeks at the dialogues that have gone back and forth and the battles. We are sitting here every night discussing a cover up, but what about cover up for cover up. I think this is a pretty significant question, but since I appear to have cleared the cage, I will step back. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:28:31 AM O/T to Keep: ( I went to highschool with Clay Bennet -- you're not gonna like what i say!! ::MonkeyCool:: )
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 12:31:06 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas).
As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:31:54 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, did you see my post above? I'm pretty sure it was HOTSHOT (just this evening) that said that Kyle told HER this personally - not in a secret forum. I don't think anyone has alluded to what Kyle shared in a secret forum. (at least nothing I've seen) Yes, Wreck, I did. I am thinking back to not just today, but over the past few weeks at the dialogues that have gone back and forth and the battles. We are sitting here every night discussing a cover up, but what about cover up for cover up. I think this is a pretty significant question, but since I appear to have cleared the cage, I will step back. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:33:42 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, just a reminder of what YOU posted in the context of the questions you are asking. I am not a member of the "Freebirds", so if a "chord has been struck"; that's not it. If there has been discussion here about some monkeys being members of "Freebirds" other than recently; I missed it. That's a possibility. Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? Quote I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:37:27 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. I believe that only Hotshot has stated that Kyles words were taken out of context and ... it is my understanding that she is in touch with Kyle personally. Janet +++++ Hotshot Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 « Reply #81 on: Today at 12:15:33 AM » know john only in speaking with him twice about the case. No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe. Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys. I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again. For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor. I have explained that also. I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken out of context. i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee. Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee. we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee. Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion. I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before. Why??? Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad. i think that was a chance of a lifetime. Mansure was on the boat, why? I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive... I am off to sleep now. the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg588902;topicseen#msg588902 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:40:04 AM SS
I am not a Freebird. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 12:41:00 AM 'Van der Eem assaulted girlfriend' (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/eem_188325h.jpg) http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2855553/Van_der_Eem_mishandelde_vriendin.html attacked her with a crowbar this weekend. briefly detained and also drivers license taken away because his driving was dangerous while the police were chasing him. OM has to decide what the next steps are. Figures ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:45:38 AM 'Van der Eem assaulted girlfriend' (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/eem_188325h.jpg) http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2855553/Van_der_Eem_mishandelde_vriendin.html attacked her with a crowbar this weekend. briefly detained and also drivers license taken away because his driving was dangerous while the police were chasing him. OM has to decide what the next steps are. ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek:: That's terrible! Is she o.k.? it doesn't say about her condition. only says he hit her on her upper leg. and he has been stalking her over the phone. she managed to call the police. and then the police chased him. but they stopped chasing him as it became too dangerous. they arrested him the next morning. Thanks Caesu, that's still terrible; but not as gruesome as I was imagining. Please let us know if you find any more information about her condition. I hope she's o.k., and that he is properly dealt with. A crowbar isn't a fair fight, unless she has a gun. And since he drove away, I'm assuming she didn't have a gun. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 12:46:31 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:46:33 AM GOOD NIGHT ALL!!!
Janet 9:45 PM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 12:49:15 AM GOOD NIGHT ALL!!! Janet 9:45 PM PT Good night Janet! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:50:32 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:53:15 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. I have only read one post that claims Kyle's words were taken out of context and ... that was Hotshot's post. Hotshot explains very clearly that she heard this claim from Kyle's own lips. I do not believe for one moment that Hotshot is a Freebird. I am off. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 12:53:27 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 12:56:28 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. I think silence speaks volumes.Always question,question,and question some more!What are you accomplishing by being on a private forum?Not you SS.Really ask the question of ones motives for being on a private forum?To attempt to control information.Why? 1.Are others not worthy of the information? 2.Does it make one feel grandiose? 2. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 12:57:55 AM GOOD NIGHT ALL!!! Janet 9:45 PM PT Good night Janet! ::MonkeyCool:: Good night texasmom. The dialogue tonight is sooo surreal. I feel like I am in a twilight zone. I do not have a clue why I stayed. I know ... hubby and friend are in the livingroom watch boxing. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:58:41 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:00:30 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. More than once it has been stated during the battles. Wreck, I hestitate to start pulling up posts because I don't want to refuel the battles. I have been reading back through some things here in the NAH forum and the "out of context" arguement has started jumping out at me. It has raised some questions for me and I am wondering why Kermit has to be the lonely warrior when I doubt that she was the only poster on freebirds. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 01:01:22 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. Could it be that Kermit was the only person that Kyle shared the photos of the trap with....via email? Do you have information that the pictures were posted at Freebirds? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 01:02:14 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. If SS would answer my question truthfully, I believe it would be all too clear where her questions are coming from. Again, JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:02:22 AM And I said from day one that Patrick is a scumbag.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 01:03:32 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. Could it be that Kermit was the only person that Kyle shared the photos of the trap with....via email? Do you have information that the pictures were posted at Freebirds? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 01:06:02 AM So much to take in after seeing Kermit's posts, and Rob's post today. I've be a big believer in Kermit (pictures say a 1000 words ::MonkeyCool::) and I have never questioned Rob's integrity. I want to believe CAPS had Justice for Natalee forefront in his investigations, and thought his theory of the events could somehow tell the "what happened to Natalee" while Kermit "uncovered the disposal". But, at first blush, it certainly does seem now that CAPS was a diversion and part of the aruba spin cycle...especially when tied to his meeting with John S. and how that was rolled out by CAPS and supported by others (With agendas). As for Persistence and kyle...I have to agree with Kermit.....American Traitors....kyle has had ample opportunity to defend himself....silence says volumes to me. Same for CAPS....silence... I've been losing faith that Holland and/or aruba will do anything wrt Justice for Natalee, but tonight I'm again energized reading Rob's posts that we will like what is about to be revealed.....I'll wait as that is all I can do.....But it is because of all you wonderful Monkeys that I can wait...with confidence, that there will be Justice for Natalee....I thank you all.... I have been a Caps supporter since the beginning. I also have the highest regard for Kermit. References have been made repeatedly that Kyle's statements were taken out of context. I am questioning how others besides Kyle knew that things were taken out of context. Why is Kermit on a kamkazee mission when it sounds to me like others are likely also aware of the information. The response that I got speaks volumes. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:06:31 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. If SS would answer my question truthfully, I believe it would be all too clear where her questions are coming from. Again, JMO What was the question? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 01:08:25 AM I'm getting a headache! ::MonkeyConfused:: Goodnight all!!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 01:09:24 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. Does it matter? The important thing is Kermit has exposed the dynamics encompassing the Persistence undertaking ... an undertaking ... that I suspected from one of Kyle's first posts submitted to the SM Natalee forum ... had nothing to do with justice for Natalee Holloway. SS ... I posted on one forum this summer when I took a sabatical from the SM Natalee Holloway forum. I joined the dialogue at the TOPIX site regarding the Jonbenet Ramsey case. Thats it! Other than TOPIX and SM ... I have not posted on another site since January, 2008. Good Night Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 01:12:24 AM 1. I have no idea where Kyle shared the information that Kermit is posting
2. Kyle has told me via email that some information has been taken out of context, I'm sure he's told others the same thing. 3. The only person here willing to document this issue appears to be Kermit 4. Some have rebutted Kermit's posts on either Kyle or Caps behalf. Why can't they post for themselves? 5. I don't know what the truth is in all this Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:12:35 AM I'm getting a headache! ::MonkeyConfused:: Goodnight all!! Go Sonics.Ohhh.I mean Thunder.... ::MonkeyLaugh:: Hope ya laughed Wreck..G-Night.. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 01:13:14 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, just a reminder of what YOU posted in the context of the questions you are asking. I am not a member of the "Freebirds", so if a "chord has been struck"; that's not it. If there has been discussion here about some monkeys being members of "Freebirds" other than recently; I missed it. That's a possibility. Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? Quote I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? Bump, maybe SS didn't see the question. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 01:15:40 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, just a reminder of what YOU posted in the context of the questions you are asking. I am not a member of the "Freebirds", so if a "chord has been struck"; that's not it. If there has been discussion here about some monkeys being members of "Freebirds" other than recently; I missed it. That's a possibility. Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? Quote I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? BUMP Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:16:33 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. If SS would answer my question truthfully, I believe it would be all too clear where her questions are coming from. Again, JMO TM - I don't know what your motive or your goal is here. I do belong to other forums, as do many SM members, although it really isn't any of your business. My questions tonight are coming from me and me alone. I am very devoted to this forum,the posters, TES, and Scared Monkeys. I am seeing things in posts that have raised questions for me. Now if you have something that is bothering you, don't take it out on me. I am very concerned about things that have been happening here, but that is not my issue tonight. My question is why Kermit has to be a pinata and taken all of this heat by herself. Now if you don't like my question, then scroll on by because you are harassing me at this point and you are out of line. I am asking a sincere question. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 01:18:52 AM 1. I have no idea where Kyle shared the information that Kermit is posting FWIW2. Kyle has told me via email that some information has been taken out of context, I'm sure he's told others the same thing. 3. The only person here willing to document this issue appears to be Kermit 4. Some have rebutted Kermit's posts on either Kyle or Caps behalf. Why can't they post for themselves? 5. I don't know what the truth is in all this I can't speak to 1 or 2 obviously. I totally agree with 3, 4, 5. Because of 4 (Why can't they post for themselves?) It enforces 3. I stand with the frog, and can (will) wait for the good news Rob has stated is coming...just hope it gets her sooner than later, as it implies that there will be good news for Natalee's family...and maybe Justice for Natalee!...mho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:19:44 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 01:21:16 AM SS...I'm not sure of your meaning in red above. In case you did not understand my meaning: I do believe now that CAPS has been a diversion (although I wanted to believe he was not a diversion). I have followed Kermit's posts with great interest, and now believe she is exposing what others in a position to expose have not. She waited for others that were on the front line (Persistence and Kyle) to expose the findings (pictures Kermit posted) and do the right thing for Natalee and her family. For whatever reason, Kyle and others did not bring the pictures forward, so Kermit exposed them......Seems simple to me...Am I missing something? YES!!! I remember Kermit telling us this. Apparently ... Kyle's intentions were honorable when he first returned to the States. He had planned to turn over the second set of ROV images to the family/FBI but ... somewhere along the way he had a change of heart and .... reached out to major networks to make deals. This is the reason that Kermit exposed all on the SM forum ... an open forum. However ... the family was informed first. I know the post that offered the explanation. I will look it up tomorrow. I am wiped. Whew!!! Thanks billb. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 01:22:12 AM SS I am not a Freebird. Janet Janet, even if you are, you are entitled to be a member of any forum that you find interesting. You posted this summer in other forums. I think that is fine, and I will not criticize anyone for membership anywhere. Membership in another forum is not my point. My point is that it has been discussed numerous times in this forum that Kyle was posting his information on freebirds. I have to believe that Kyle and Kermit were not the only posters on freebirds. Why is Kermit the only one who has come forward with this information. She must feel like a sacrificial lamb. If SS would answer my question truthfully, I believe it would be all too clear where her questions are coming from. Again, JMO TM - I don't know what your motive or your goal is here. I do belong to other forums, as do many SM members, although it really isn't any of your business. My questions tonight are coming from me and me alone. I am very devoted to this forum,the posters, TES, and Scared Monkeys. I am seeing things in posts that have raised questions for me. Now if you have something that is bothering you, don't take it out on me. I am very concerned about things that have been happening here, but that is not my issue tonight. My question is why Kermit has to be a pinata and taken all of this heat by herself. Now if you don't like my question, then scroll on by because you are harassing me at this point and you are out of line. I am asking a sincere question. I have stated what my goal here is on a regular basis. You're answer tells me that my information is correct, and the correct chord was struck. Thank you, SS. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:23:57 AM 1. I have no idea where Kyle shared the information that Kermit is posting FWIW2. Kyle has told me via email that some information has been taken out of context, I'm sure he's told others the same thing. 3. The only person here willing to document this issue appears to be Kermit 4. Some have rebutted Kermit's posts on either Kyle or Caps behalf. Why can't they post for themselves? 5. I don't know what the truth is in all this I can't speak to 1 or 2 obviously. I totally agree with 3, 4, 5. Because of 4 (Why can't they post for themselves?) It enforces 3. I stand with the frog, and can (will) wait for the good news Rob has stated is coming...just hope it gets her sooner than later, as it implies that there will be good news for Natalee's family...and maybe Justice for Natalee!...mho As a person that knows little.The only people i'm able to logically understand are Monkey's who back up there statements..If Kyle(OE), and or Caps can bring us the TRUTH i'll be happy to swing Naked in my Monkey suit. ::MonkeyDance:: Do i think it will happen?No.. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:25:12 AM SS...I'm not sure of your meaning in red above. In case you did not understand my meaning: I do believe now that CAPS has been a diversion (although I wanted to believe he was not a diversion). I have followed Kermit's posts with great interest, and now believe she is exposing what others in a position to expose have not. She waited for others that were on the front line (Persistence and Kyle) to expose the findings (pictures Kermit posted) and do the right thing for Natalee and her family. For whatever reason, Kyle and others did not bring the pictures forward, so Kermit exposed them......Seems simple to me...Am I missing something? YES!!! I remember Kermit telling us this. Apparently ... Kyle's intentions were honorable when he first returned to the States. He had planned to turn over the second set of ROV images to the family/FBI but ... somewhere along the way he had a change of heart and .... reached out to major networks to make deals. This is the reason that Kermit exposed all on the SM forum ... an open forum. However ... the family was informed first. I know the post that offered the explanation. I will look it up tomorrow. I am wiped. Whew!!! Thanks billb. Janet G-Night Janet..How bout a cartwheel for you.. ::cartwheel:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 01:26:42 AM SS...I'm not sure of your meaning in red above. In case you did not understand my meaning: I do believe now that CAPS has been a diversion (although I wanted to believe he was not a diversion). I have followed Kermit's posts with great interest, and now believe she is exposing what others in a position to expose have not. She waited for others that were on the front line (Persistence and Kyle) to expose the findings (pictures Kermit posted) and do the right thing for Natalee and her family. For whatever reason, Kyle and others did not bring the pictures forward, so Kermit exposed them......Seems simple to me...Am I missing something? YES!!! I remember Kermit telling us this. Apparently ... Kyle's intentions were honorable when he first returned to the States. He had planned to turn over the second set of ROV images to the family/FBI but ... somewhere along the way he had a change of heart and .... reached out to major networks to make deals. This is the reason that Kermit exposed all on the SM forum ... an open forum. However ... the family was informed first. I know the post that offered the explanation. I will look it up tomorrow. I am wiped. Whew!!! Thanks billb. Janet G-Night Janet..How bout a cartwheel for you.. ::cartwheel:: Janet, You're welcome. And a belated Happy Birthday! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 01:29:36 AM billb, you are such a nice calming influence. I appreciate that. ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:33:53 AM billb, you are such a nice calming influence. I appreciate that. ::MonkeyCool:: Question Mag?Why are Monkeys getting their Bananas in a bunch?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:33:57 AM Something isn't making sense. Why am I getting the feeling that there are other Monkeys who knew about the trap and didn't say anything? Norman has it all over Stillwater. Maybe it's from wherever you're "hearing" these things, maybe all the questions are best directed at who you're "hearing" these things from. JMO TM - I have my own mind and my own opinions. I am asking honest questions that have come from personal thoughts. We have all heard that there are members of SM that are members of freebirds, so I really don't understand the insinutation unless you're a freebird and I struck a chord. I don't know who the freebirds are and I really have no concern about anyone belonging to freebirds or any other forum. My question is that I have been reading responses to Kermit's statements on this forum saying that things were taken out of context. How do people know that things were taken out of context if they didn't see the original posts to begin with? My point is that there must be other people besides just Kermit who have had knowledge about Kyle's posts. And I am not defending Kyle. I am asking why only Kermit has come forward with the information. Others have obviously known what the rest of us are just now learning. SS, just a reminder of what YOU posted in the context of the questions you are asking. I am not a member of the "Freebirds", so if a "chord has been struck"; that's not it. If there has been discussion here about some monkeys being members of "Freebirds" other than recently; I missed it. That's a possibility. Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? Quote I have a question. I don't know anything about freebirds or the members, except that it is a private forum and I have heard that there are members of SM who are also members of freebirds. If Kyle was posting all of this information on freebirds last Spring, why has Kermit been the only one to come forward with this information? Bump, maybe SS didn't see the question. TM - I have the highest regard for Kermit and I believe that Kermit's words are truthful and her motivation is honest. My question is why she is the only honest one when others were apparently in the know. I have always asked questions on this forum and they haven't always been popular - ask Janet. I very much resent your statements to me tonight. Why you feel the need to do this, I don't know. You are attacking me which is against the SM rules. It seems to me that you have an agenda other than trying to find out what is going on with this cage. And yes, I do feel there were remains in that cage and I am angry that remains in that cage were handed over to ALE. How dare you question my motives for asking questions? Who do you think you are? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 01:37:17 AM billb, you are such a nice calming influence. I appreciate that. ::MonkeyCool:: Thanks Magnolia...I learned it from ROBOT when he was 99 years old ::MonkeyCool::When there is finally Justice for Natalee (there will be!), whether in the form of her remains being returned to the family and/or prosecution of the perps and/or prosecution of the cover up crew, I hope ROBOT does an encore..... I truly believe Red/Klaas/and all the good Monkeys have kept the door open for Justice for Natalee...It is inevitable....Because we BELIEVE!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 01:38:49 AM SS,
Texasmom asked you a question based on something she was told. I didn't perceive it as an attack. On the other hand, your responses to her were defensive, which stir up things. If you choose not to answer her question, then just say 'no', and let it go. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 01:38:54 AM billb, you are such a nice calming influence. I appreciate that. ::MonkeyCool:: Question Mag?Why are Monkeys getting their Bananas in a bunch?? Oh, I don't know. I guess it is because some who thought they knew more than us poor dumb moneys have discovered that they did not know so much afterall. They had been taken in by a couple of people and do not want to go quietly into the night. But that is just what I think. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 01:41:52 AM SS,
Go back and read the posts I've made tonight, and the posts you've made tonight. The attack is not coming from me. And I'm not aware of your being promoted to moderator yet. If I'm out of line by asking you the same question you asked me, Klaas or one of the other mods will let me know and I will apologize. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 01:42:09 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:42:51 AM billb, you are such a nice calming influence. I appreciate that. ::MonkeyCool:: Question Mag?Why are Monkeys getting their Bananas in a bunch?? Oh, I don't know. I guess it is because some who thought they knew more than us poor dumb moneys have discovered that they did not know so much afterall. They had been taken in by a couple of people and do not want to go quietly into the night. But that is just what I think. We're all here for JUSTICE FOR NATALEE..The only private forum i belong to is KEEPTHEFAITH..I do get tired of doing question and answer with myself sometimes... ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 01:44:17 AM SS, Texasmom asked you a question based on something she was told. I didn't perceive it as an attack. On the other hand, your responses to her were defensive, which stir up things. If you choose not to answer her question, then just say 'no', and let it go. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:45:02 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:46:27 AM Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true?
This is actually none of your business. How dare you even ask me about my memberships on a forum or off of a forum. You have a lot of nerve and you are completely out of line. How dare you even suggest that I am not formulating my own questions and concerns as I have done since I joined this forum. I am a very loyal member of SM. I see you as trying to start trouble all evening. First you launched into A-1 and now you have launched into me. It doesn't sound to me like your interest is in this forum at all right now, but rather in who has memberships and where those memberships are. You have been very manipulative tonight and I personally resent it. There are many members here who belong to multiple forums. (Klaas please correct me if I am wrong, but you as a mod have mentioned being in other forums.) As I see it, TM, you have twice tried to disrupt this cage with your contentious posts. Grow up. This isn't high school. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 01:48:35 AM I'm absolutely blown away on a daily basis of some of the great questions regarding this case that go down a million different roads.But when you hit the dead end.You go down another road.No ones ideas are any more important then the others!If you can't ask another Monkey the hard truthful questions what do you have??? ::MonkeyConfused::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 01:49:31 AM SS...I'm not sure of your meaning in red above. In case you did not understand my meaning: I do believe now that CAPS has been a diversion (although I wanted to believe he was not a diversion). I have followed Kermit's posts with great interest, and now believe she is exposing what others in a position to expose have not. She waited for others that were on the front line (Persistence and Kyle) to expose the findings (pictures Kermit posted) and do the right thing for Natalee and her family. For whatever reason, Kyle and others did not bring the pictures forward, so Kermit exposed them......Seems simple to me...Am I missing something? YES!!! I remember Kermit telling us this. Apparently ... Kyle's intentions were honorable when he first returned to the States. He had planned to turn over the second set of ROV images to the family/FBI but ... somewhere along the way he had a change of heart and .... reached out to major networks to make deals. This is the reason that Kermit exposed all on the SM forum ... an open forum. However ... the family was informed first. I know the post that offered the explanation. I will look it up tomorrow. I am wiped. Whew!!! Thanks billb. Janet G-Night Janet..How bout a cartwheel for you.. ::cartwheel:: Janet, You're welcome. And a belated Happy Birthday! ::MonkeyCool:: Hey ... you are not too late. In the Fraser Valley of British Columbia it is only 10:48 PM PT on December 17th. Thank you billb Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 01:51:57 AM Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? This is actually none of your business. How dare you even ask me about my memberships on a forum or off of a forum. You have a lot of nerve and you are completely out of line. How dare you even suggest that I am not formulating my own questions and concerns as I have done since I joined this forum. I am a very loyal member of SM. I see you as trying to start trouble all evening. First you launched into A-1 and now you have launched into me. It doesn't sound to me like your interest is in this forum at all right now, but rather in who has memberships and where those memberships are. You have been very manipulative tonight and I personally resent it. There are many members here who belong to multiple forums. (Klaas please correct me if I am wrong, but you as a mod have mentioned being in other forums.) As I see it, TM, you have twice tried to disrupt this cage with your contentious posts. Grow up. This isn't high school. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:53:27 AM SS, Texasmom asked you a question based on something she was told. I didn't perceive it as an attack. On the other hand, your responses to her were defensive, which stir up things. If you choose not to answer her question, then just say 'no', and let it go. I disagree 2NJ, she has been attacking me for a question that I ask about others possibly knowing what Kermits knows. She went so far as to tell me to ask my question of those in a forum that she obviously is opposed to. She accused me of asking my question because she was told that I belong to another forum. 2NJ, these statements are out of line and TM initiated the attack on me and addressed me directly with the issues that I just mentioned. My initial question was certainly not directed at TM. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:55:44 AM I'm absolutely blown away on a daily basis of some of the great questions regarding this case that go down a million different roads.But when you hit the dead end.You go down another road.No ones ideas are any more important then the others!If you can't ask another Monkey the hard truthful questions what do you have??? ::MonkeyConfused:: Thank you for this post KTF. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 01:56:54 AM Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? This is actually none of your business. How dare you even ask me about my memberships on a forum or off of a forum. You have a lot of nerve and you are completely out of line. How dare you even suggest that I am not formulating my own questions and concerns as I have done since I joined this forum. I am a very loyal member of SM. I see you as trying to start trouble all evening. First you launched into A-1 and now you have launched into me. It doesn't sound to me like your interest is in this forum at all right now, but rather in who has memberships and where those memberships are. You have been very manipulative tonight and I personally resent it. There are many members here who belong to multiple forums. (Klaas please correct me if I am wrong, but you as a mod have mentioned being in other forums.) As I see it, TM, you have twice tried to disrupt this cage with your contentious posts. Grow up. This isn't high school. Just as it was none of your business if I was a member of Freebirds or not, but you felt inclined to insinuate. I answered your insinuation, and asked my question. Turnabout is fair play, SS. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 01:58:37 AM SS, Texasmom asked you a question based on something she was told. I didn't perceive it as an attack. On the other hand, your responses to her were defensive, which stir up things. If you choose not to answer her question, then just say 'no', and let it go. I disagree 2NJ, she has been attacking me for a question that I ask about others possibly knowing what Kermits knows. She went so far as to tell me to ask my question of those in a forum that she obviously is opposed to. She accused me of asking my question because she was told that I belong to another forum. 2NJ, these statements are out of line and TM initiated the attack on me and addressed me directly with the issues that I just mentioned. My initial question was certainly not directed at TM. 2NJ - I am also angry that TM has revealed personal information about me that is none of her business. Where I spend my time when I am not logged on SM is of no concern to TM or anyone else. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 02:00:12 AM I'm sorry....had some computer problems a minute ago.
SS & Texasmom....end it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 02:00:18 AM Just so you know, I was told that you are a member of the forum that most of the questions about Kermit are coming from? Is that true? This is actually none of your business. How dare you even ask me about my memberships on a forum or off of a forum. You have a lot of nerve and you are completely out of line. How dare you even suggest that I am not formulating my own questions and concerns as I have done since I joined this forum. I am a very loyal member of SM. I see you as trying to start trouble all evening. First you launched into A-1 and now you have launched into me. It doesn't sound to me like your interest is in this forum at all right now, but rather in who has memberships and where those memberships are. You have been very manipulative tonight and I personally resent it. There are many members here who belong to multiple forums. (Klaas please correct me if I am wrong, but you as a mod have mentioned being in other forums.) As I see it, TM, you have twice tried to disrupt this cage with your contentious posts. Grow up. This isn't high school. Just as it was none of your business if I was a member of Freebirds or not, but you felt inclined to insinuate. I answered your insinuation, and asked my question. Turnabout is fair play, SS. I have no idea if you are a member of Freebirds and frankly I don't care. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 02:00:35 AM ENOUGH! How many forums a person belongs to is nobodys business. The only time any of that becomes my business is when because of the other forum THIS forum gets disrupted. It's also a strong possibility that some of the disruptions are intentional.
Right now I don't think anything intentional is going on. I think we are ALL simply trying to figure out what the heck has been going on. With that, I'm calling it a night. GOODNIGHT ALL! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 02:01:23 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 02:01:49 AM I'm absolutely blown away on a daily basis of some of the great questions regarding this case that go down a million different roads.But when you hit the dead end.You go down another road.No ones ideas are any more important then the others!If you can't ask another Monkey the hard truthful questions what do you have??? ::MonkeyConfused:: Thank you for this post KTF. The only thing i know is.I have the control to get on my knees everynight and pray to the lord, that we as Monkey's,can give a voice to those that no longer can speak for themselves! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 02:04:45 AM It's all good...No reason to get excited...stay cool Monkeys ::MonkeyCool::
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCwCBh0z3Hs Late night...just wanted t lighten things up a bit... Good night all ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 18, 2008, 02:06:36 AM ENOUGH! How many forums a person belongs to is nobodys business. The only time any of that becomes my business is when because of the other forum THIS forum gets disrupted. It's also a strong possibility that some of the disruptions are intentional. Right now I don't think anything intentional is going on. I think we are ALL simply trying to figure out what the heck has been going on. With that, I'm calling it a night. GOODNIGHT ALL! Thank you, Klaas Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 02:08:01 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet I have checked it out from time to time and they do have great information!What is the criteria for being a member?Who is the best information organizer?Who controls the Freebirds? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:09:31 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet I agree Janet. And from the work I've seen, the purpose of the Freebird's site is genuine and good. I think I would have been honored to have been invited there. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 02:09:33 AM It's all good...No reason to get excited...stay cool Monkeys ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCwCBh0z3Hs Late night...just wanted t lighten things up a bit... Good night all ::MonkeyDance:: As i'm a Seattlelite and Hendrix fan that was a good choice! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:11:43 AM ENOUGH! How many forums a person belongs to is nobodys business. The only time any of that becomes my business is when because of the other forum THIS forum gets disrupted. It's also a strong possibility that some of the disruptions are intentional. Right now I don't think anything intentional is going on. I think we are ALL simply trying to figure out what the heck has been going on. With that, I'm calling it a night. GOODNIGHT ALL! Goodnight Klaas! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 02:13:41 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet I agree Janet. And from the work I've seen, the purpose of the Freebird's site is genuine and good. I think I would have been honored to have been invited there. It will take a group effort from everyone to bring the EVIL of the Island to light.Why are people scared to admit that there a part of these private forums?Not that i care.Seems trivial..I do find a concerted effort to discredit Kermit and i,for one,don't know why?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 02:13:50 AM GOOD NIGHT AND GOD BLESS!!
Janet 11:15 PM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:15:37 AM It's all good...No reason to get excited...stay cool Monkeys ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCwCBh0z3Hs Late night...just wanted t lighten things up a bit... Good night all ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: I love it! Thanks billb! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:16:49 AM GOOD NIGHT AND GOD BLESS!! Janet 11:15 PM PT Good Night Janet, and God Bless you too! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 02:17:10 AM GOOD NIGHT AND GOD BLESS!! Janet 11:15 PM PT Good night Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 18, 2008, 02:22:58 AM Hi Spooky :smt006
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 02:24:26 AM Hi Spooky :smt006 ::MonkeyHaHa:: I was tempted to do the same... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 18, 2008, 02:27:25 AM Hi Spooky :smt006 ::MonkeyHaHa:: I was tempted to do the same... It's great seeing old friends. ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 18, 2008, 02:43:03 AM I went to sleep watching the Caylee Anthony coverage. Maybe it's just as well, lol.
I don't know what to think and hope something comes of the tapes of the Colombians that Rob told us about. I have often been accused of having an agenda because I don't subscribe to certain things I consider a diversion. Never been a freebird but have posted at BFN and even done battle at RU as have others. AFAIK, it was only speculated Kyle posted anything at Freebirds. Not said as a fact. I don't know. Several of our regular monkeys are not posting lately. I hope they are just busy with seasonal activities. We have a tremendous task to get this investigation going again and back on the rails. I hope all will be helping in that regard no matter what their personal thoughts and theories may be. Goodnight all and may tomorrow bring us unity in our efforts. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 02:46:30 AM Goodnight, Anna.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Mere on December 18, 2008, 02:46:58 AM Good Night Monkeys....some of us stay up in the rafters....but we read every word. ::MonkeyDance::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 02:49:17 AM Good Night Monkeys....some of us stay up in the rafters....but we read every word. ::MonkeyDance:: Goodnight, Mere...always good to see you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:53:00 AM I read Jesse Jackson was in Aruba (with his wife). I didn't understand enough of what I read to state what the exact purpose of the trip was. I have some thoughts, but I'll keep them to myself.
::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: finngirl on December 18, 2008, 02:56:21 AM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 03:27:34 AM Tim Miller: In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3249/2345840954_e00aee9854_o.jpg) Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th May 16 - Kyle posted: I think it is highly unlikely and completely inconsistent with numerous testimonies and other evidence that the pond (or anything but the ocean) contains Natalee's remains. The witness claims to have seen a muddy Joran coming out of the Monserat pond after disposing of her body. <snip> The 40+ investigators brought in from Holland never stepped foot in the pond John Silvetti's email to Kyle: The Polis did not drain that pond and they did not search it, period! JOHN SILVETTI TELLS CAPS THAT THE TRAP/CAGE IS A POSTOFFICE AND THE CAGE WAS EMPTY. MARCH 3, 2008 – John Silvetti meets with CapsLockWizard From an email sent from CapsLockWizard: “Yes, We did have the meeting today. It was a long meeting and we are all set to start the process of a permit to drain. Witness will gave statement to Lawyer (Helen), Lawyer will motion to drain the pond to OM. If Motion denied, will go to media and expose more dirt. John knows everything now and he will stay behind to help and protect. John state the cage was empty. it was full of these broken plastic bags that shows on the cam like skull, but he said to me it is the water doing tricks when picture was taken. He thinks also it is a postoffice. When I told him the story about the cage, he also understand now some things that he could not have question about. Like why is the Panter allways parked over the spot while there is notting anymore in he cage. The meeting end at 5:00 pm and was very good. About the Pipes. They will be checked. Also John thinks that the signs are there but need to drain the pond. Also Withness is 99% it was some one that came from the pond area that he saw, because it looks like a dutch man and was cover in mud from the chest down.” (http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/8683/image532fx0.jpg) Kyle stated: "This is a picture from Natalee standing on the beach and rotated and scaled to the image to matching the body form inside the trap. It matches the end of the skirt identically to what was seen in the cage." So if we look at Caps' email to Dave and then his posts, MUMinOhio is correct. Caps knew nothing and then he is somehow connected to a witness who magically appears and they go to John Silvetti and it turns John Silvetti from looking at the trap/cage and to looking at the pond, brings the witness to the states for a polygraph test and the evidence is gone from that trap/cage because no one knew except Kyle Kingman and that ROV unit that captured the last photos. Meanwhile John Silvetti is trying to set up an office in Aruba. And so Aruba masterminded the diversion away from any thing about the person's remains inside that cage/trap in the ocean as well as Joran created a media stir with his sit-down Greta interview that he sold Natalee into sex slavery, then the attention turned to Rudy Croes statement Jan van der Straaten was involved in covering-up but that was also brought out in 2006 Jan v/d Straatten was indeed investigated and had telephone conversations with people about the case that he should not have contacts with, or even talk about the case. and now as Hero Brinkman pointed out, if he knew of this, why did he wait 3 1/2 years to say something about it? No body - no case seems to have been the Aruba code word for CORRUPTION! #1468 on: May 07, 2008, 05:28:28 AM muminohio When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle. There is nothing wrong with that, I personally have spent a lot of time and posts sharing any information I had or could find. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.msg379700#msg379700 NOW LET'S FOLLOW CAPS, THE WITNESS/Shango/Simian, ARUBA COPS, KYLE KINGMAN and John Silvetti: Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining. He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. The vision was cryptic and actually contained a latitude which from what he claimed could have been anywhere in the world. The brother thought they were coordinates, but it was just a latitude. Oddly, the latitude was within a half mile from where we found the trap and centered on Arashi beach. Basically, if you stood on land and pointed straight to the trap and were right on the money... this is what the difference amounts to. Based on this latitude we payed a little more attention to the northern portions of the search grid near that Latitude. The trap was found shortly after, within the original search area, but very close to the provided latitude. I would have found the trap without the latitude, but it was very strange. None of us pressed the two for more information because they clearly were VERY uncomfortable. The brother of the detective came to us and was very persistent over the information. He was almost in tears and just had to "clear his conscience" about it. His brother, the detective came with him to 'validate him'. Personally, I think the detective was Simian. The guy kept his mouth shut for the most part but was obviously intelligent and knew a lot more than he led on. It didn't seem he immediately trusted us but gradually became more comfortable, enough to talk. I think he used his brother and gave us only the amount of information he felt we needed to come across the trap. Basically, by using his brother and claiming the information he shared was only based on a vision, it distances the detective from responsibility and makes it hard to point back to him should it be a problem later. I think the whole game was bogus and he knew almost everything but was helping how he was able and felt comfortable. I don't understand why he had to use his brother and claim a "vision". The implications of this are tremendous. If true, it means that the early investigators knew where and how Natalee was disposed and it was kept secret and covered up. Not wanting to be implicated but still wanting to help, he could shift the information to a vision of his brothers, perhaps still help a bit and claim no-involvement. However, this man was intelligent enough, cared about the case, yet was self implicated to a high enough level to want to be kept his knowledge a secret. He spoke well enough english and knew everything in my opinion. Perhaps I should find out his name. I never got it. We may never have. Kyle said: "Based on the little I know of Simian, there are striking similarities that stood out after I laid down on the evening I met with the detective and his brother.Perhaps Simian is the detective and Shango is the brother. Kyle said: "- IF a key detective's brother knew the latitude the trap was disposed at or very near, then it's probable the detective knew the same. - IF the detective knew the latitude, how did he come to this knowledge? - Who else knew this information? Since the trap was only in 90ft of water and the detective knew about the latitude, did the Polis already know if it's location prior to the search? The detective originally wouldn't meet with us and only wanted us to meet with his brother. We convinced him to meet along with his brother and made him feel as comfortable as possible. He reluctantly agreed but wouldn't talk. The brother did all the talking at first. It seemed to me the brother was acting out the "vision" scenario to protect the detective brother. It didn't feel like the brother was in any way corrupt or connected. Also, he wasn't that bright compared to the detective brother. After a while the detective started asking some questions and loosened up a bit. With the pointed questions he asked he proved he knew a lot, but we didn't press him. The reason I think the detective is Simian is that: - he is intimately connected to the case - forced into silence - both he and the brother seemed to want the case solved but the whole encounter was so CRYPTIC - he is condemned if his identity and knowledge were BOTH exposed. One or the other, he's still safe - He was intelligent and had a good enough command over the english language (not common over the rest of the bunch) - IF his brother was acting on his behalf with the whole 'I had a vision' act, then the detective's character supports pulling something like Simian off. - the detective was very internet and computer savy, which was unusual for the bulk of the Polis. - It seemed he knew who I was when we were introduced, and said something indicating he had been reading the blog. - his character was very cryptic; the way he moved, spoke, and asked questions was just not normal. "Caps is not Simian. He has indicated he knows who was either Shango or Simian. The person he thinks it is, is a cop. it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/CarpePicNatalee1.png) JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 03:28:31 AM Goodnight everyone! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: EURobert on December 18, 2008, 03:54:32 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!!
http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: EURobert on December 18, 2008, 03:58:12 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!! http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng And in the Telegraaf: http://tinyurl.com/4ogl9l ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: EURobert on December 18, 2008, 05:05:01 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!! http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng And in the Telegraaf: http://tinyurl.com/4ogl9l ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hmmm.... Old news, I see now... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 05:11:35 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!! http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng And in the Telegraaf: http://tinyurl.com/4ogl9l ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hmmm.... Old news, I see now... not old eu bert ,no problem ! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: EURobert on December 18, 2008, 05:22:50 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!! http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng And in the Telegraaf: http://tinyurl.com/4ogl9l ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hmmm.... Old news, I see now... not old eu bert ,no problem ! Well, caesu already had this news (from the AD) at page 8! http://tinyurl.com/42kk4d ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 18, 2008, 06:24:41 AM PATRICK VAN DER EEM ARRESTED FOR BEATING UP HIS WIFE!!! http://tinyurl.com/4ju3ng And in the Telegraaf: http://tinyurl.com/4ogl9l ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hmmm.... Old news, I see now... not old eu bert ,no problem ! Well, caesu already had this news (from the AD) at page 8! http://tinyurl.com/42kk4d ::MonkeyLaugh:: Thank you all for bringing the article to our attention. I knew Patrick was a POS from day one. A leopard doesn't change its spots. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 18, 2008, 07:01:16 AM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet I agree Janet. And from the work I've seen, the purpose of the Freebird's site is genuine and good. I think I would have been honored to have been invited there. It will take a group effort from everyone to bring the EVIL of the Island to light.Why are people scared to admit that there a part of these private forums?Not that i care.Seems trivial..I do find a concerted effort to discredit Kermit and i,for one,don't know why?? Keepthefaith...Maybe because they will be pounced all over here in an open Forum...Other than when I first joined SM I have never been scared to post my thoughts... ::MonkeyHaHa:: I am a member of 3 so called "Private" Forums. Anyone can register at them, which is in fact what I did at one. Another I was "invited" to...The reason I believe I was invited had more to do with having some private common ground with another member and nothing to do with the Natalee Holloway case. This Forum has an open area and A "Members area". This is where Members discuss things going on in their lives and if they want can post Private stories and pictures. Things that they would not post in an open forum. To my knowledge all of these sites are owned by Monkeys that are still Monkeys. I have never been a member of Natalee's Freebirds and did not know it was anything but a site that posted what we see here at SM until it was mentioned a couple of times a few weekends ago in relation to Kyle and Kermit. SM was the first Forum I joined and after reading here for a long time, I joined when the new format came in. I was concerned that it would end up like BFN, that only Members could read, so I finally summoned up the courage to register and then to post. So Yes there are long time Lurkers...and I can tell you I was scared to death, Heck I was even scared to Register. On days that I don't post much here, chances are I am not posting anywhere...I post when the discussions are about something I am particularly interested in, Or if I have questions or thoughts about another post.Since my DH is not working weekends anymore I do not post as much on the weekends. His changing work schedule dictates a lot of when I post. These are the reasons I post a lot on some days and sometimes not at all on others...Or may just pop in with a quick post. This post is all from my perspective and is not derived from the mind, thoughts or words of any other poster. And for the record, I am what most would consider a straight arrow, I call a spade a spade. I don't have any reason for posting other than to try and find the truth and get Justice For Natalee. I hope that answers some of your questions. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 18, 2008, 07:05:03 AM Good Morning-
billb - hey my friend, sorry if I gave you the impression what TJ and I are doing has anything to do with Natalee. It doesn't. It could in the future, but let's all hope it's over soon. This is something geared toward people like Natalee, but she is not someone we are going to be looking at in the immediate and near future. I'm not sure exactly how to say this, so I'll juss say it - Natalee was plenty of exposure and rightfully so. Natalee has forums dedicated to her, has face time on Greta and really there isn't much more we can do for her right now. That doesn't mean that it will never be a topic, juss that we are looking at some other things currently. Jennifer Kesse will be one such person and Marva Adams will be another. Like I said - juss because it's not on the radar right this second, doesn't mean that it won't be a serious topic in the future. We just don't know at this time. There is probably no one more knowledgeable than TJ on the subject of Natalee and he would be the correct person to undertake such a topic, he was hired by Jug and Beth after-all, so it's not because the knowledge or dedication isn't there, juss that we don't see what more we can do right now. I hope this explains a little bit about the how's, if's and why's. Anna - I'm not sure what will happen with those tapes. As you know, Greta has them and she will make the final decisions whether they get aired or not. I have no idea if they will or won't. I hope they do, but have no idea. Personally, I say aired them and let us all decide whether they have any validity. +++ Break +++ I'm glad I logged of last night before the malaise began. Private forums should really not be an issue in my option, I mean who really cares. Does it matter? Seriously? As for anyone else having the info Kermit does and why they don't speak up - does that really matter either? Do we need the rest of the people who could know to validate that info? Isn't the info validated on it's own merits regardless of who it brings. THE INFO SPEAKS FOR ITSELF. How this turned into a discussion on or about Kermit, to be honest, has me a bit concerned. Kermit is the messenger and made it perfectly clear that she was gonna expose that info if Kyle didn't do what was right and come forward on his own accord. Kyle didn't and in fact was rather rude about the whole episode. The fact that Kyle need a public prodding tells me what kind of person he really is. You draw your own conclusion as I would expect you too. In my opinion, what Kermit did was nothing less than stellar and has always had my respect. Kyle, on the other hand, was warned by ME and OTHERS publicly right here at SM to not trust the Aruban Authorities. Now Kyle has learned a lesson, a very valuable lesson. Life is about learning. Kyle had to learn a lesson the hard way. When Kyle said to Kermit that he made a mistake by trusting her, well, that should tell you all you need to know about his character. Kyle trusts the wrong people and needs to take a look at his moral compass. Sorry Kyle if that's harsh, but you needed to hear it. Remember, trust is earned and not given. I trust Kermit has done the correct and valiant thing in this area. I trust Kermit's inner fortitude and we can all take this as a lesson in doing the right thing when it's gonna be painful for you personally. That takes real inner strength and a person comfortable in their own skin, someone who knows them self very very well, and someone of real moral character. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: MumInOhio on December 18, 2008, 07:06:49 AM I am bringing this forward: I know john only in speaking with him twice about the case. No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe. Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys. I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again. For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor. I have explained that also. I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken out of context. i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee. Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee. we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee. Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion. I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before. Why??? Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad. i think that was a chance of a lifetime. Mansure was on the boat, why? I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive...Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #973 on: Today at 05:29:25 PM » I just sat down and throughly read Kermits post. Very disturbing. I am going to ask a question and it may not be very popular. Hotshot if you are reading would you try to answer this question for me? Did hotshot say she personally knew John Silvetti? Did hotshot put John in touch with Dave? How was John S. have so much knowledge that he could observe and declare that there were no remains in the cage and it was a post office? Is this where Caps got his info from on the cage being a post office? Natalee cannot win for losing. She is caught in a caught 22. USA cannot help her and Aruba will not help her. I am off to sleep now. the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all. OK...I'll bite...But you knew I would anyways... What happened to all the stuff you posted a couple of weeks back...You warned me off...Remember?? Big things, witnesses, arrests, You were in the know??? Now you have a theory?? We all have theories?? ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 18, 2008, 07:23:02 AM Kermit...Would you mind clarifying Caps' email in your post? Is this to you??
Also... I am also a little bewildered...Since this has all started with the trap, you have directed a riddle at me personlly, posted about things I have posted about on a couple of occasions the same day and now seem to be using my posts for your backup. In the beginning I thought this was because of my posts in Shango...Now I don't know? Why do I feel like I am being used? If I am reading anything into this that is not there, I apologize. I would appreciate your clarification on this Kermit. Thanks in Advance. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 18, 2008, 07:26:43 AM My thought for the day...
Since the words Script nd Diversion have been posted an awful lot lately... Think outside the box... Have a great day everyone! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 18, 2008, 07:38:23 AM billb - just to add to my earlier post we will also be looking at missing Pennsylvania Centre County Prosecutor Ray Gricar. I think this one is solvable and hope hopefully this coming spring we will be traveling there, once the ground thaws, with cadaver dogs and see what we can find. I have a few areas of interest and if we can check them we will. Either clear them or maybe find Ray.
This is a case that has many perplexed and I hope we can do something here. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 08:25:20 AM Make a screenshot and print ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/SMCUBE.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 09:09:32 AM Kermit
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #532 on: November 25, 2008, 07:06:45 PM » From Kyle: march 18, 2008: If you want, you can get Red from SM off my back. I really don't like that guy. He thinks he knows what's going on but doesn't have a clue. I first saw the pics on the SM home page and fired off an email to Red believing that he would be understanding and help provide answers. I quickly found out what happened on my own and dealt with it. I could not believe his response. ~Kyle http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #532 on: November 25, 2008, 07:06:45 PM » From Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #532 on: November 25, 2008, 07:06:45 PM » From Kyle: None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #532 on: November 25, 2008, 07:06:45 PM » From Kyle: May 8, 2008: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #888 on: Today at 02:43:35 AM » Jan. 7th picture Kyle said: "In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564718#msg564718 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #902 on: Today at 03:09:00 AM » Kyle said: "The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat." Kyle said: "They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th" Kyle said: " John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis" Kyle said: "John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word" Kyle said: "John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability" Kyle said: "John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again." June 10, 2008 = Kyle states: “He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564763#msg564763 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #903 on: Today at 03:12:23 AM » Kyle said: "Schafer is sue crazy." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564766;topicseen#msg564766 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #897 on: Today at 03:02:28 AM » Kyle: “I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564753;topicseen#msg564753 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #883 on: Today at 02:39:52 AM » Kyle said: " We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap.” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564707#msg564707 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #896 on: Today at 03:00:21 AM » Kyle said: "The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564748;topicseen#msg564748 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #896 on: Today at 03:00:21 AM » Kyle said: "We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564748;topicseen#msg564748 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #888 on: Today at 02:43:35 AM » Jan. 7th picture Kyle said: "In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564718#msg564718 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #532 on: Today at 07:06:45 PM » From Kyle: May 8, 2008: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #882 on: Today at 02:36:28 AM » Kyle said: "Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564701;topicseen#msg564701 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - « Reply #802 on: December 02, 2008, 05:16:26 PM » Kyle said: “The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4182.msg564125;topicseen#msg564125 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #642 on: November 25, 2008, 10:12:27 PM » May 8, 2008 = from Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. May 19, 2008 = from Kyle: "I couldn't get the logs from the Persistence. All things "Holloway" were stripped from the boat once it got back to Louisiana JUNE 10, 2008 = from Kyle: He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557914;topicseen#msg557914 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #779 11/24/08 - « Reply #635 on: November 25, 2008, 10:06:58 PM » from Kyle: "It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557906;topicseen#msg557906 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #781 12/3/08 - « Reply #663 on: Today at 09:55:44 PM » Kyle stated: "John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4186.msg566856;topicseen#msg566856 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #782 12/5/08 - « Reply #137 on: Today at 04:07:13 PM » Klye stated: " We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap." Kyle stated: "neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge." Kyle stated: "John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.120 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #782 12/5/08 - « Reply #275 on: December 05, 2008, 07:05:44 PM » Kyle said: "Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. - I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. - I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. - Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle said: “- I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.” http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.msg568246;topicseen#msg568246 Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #782 12/5/08 - « Reply #524 on: December 05, 2008, 11:59:23 PM kyle stated: "Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.msg568677;topicseen#msg568677 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Lifesong on December 18, 2008, 09:29:39 AM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 18, 2008, 09:43:59 AM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Lifesong on December 18, 2008, 09:53:26 AM Forgot to mention: I also think its possible that Kyle was completely talking out of his ass about John Silvetti. I believe in Tim Miller, he's no slouch, that one. While all humans have faults and weaknesses and I'm sure Tim is no different, I do not believe that being a poor judge of character is one of his faults. Not after all he's seen and been through. Kyle, on the other hand, well...I'm just not gonna really go there. I will say, Silvetti was his boss, fertile ground there for resentment. Who hasn't badmouthed their boss? Sometimes even assigning all different kinds of evil intent to their actions? I'll take Tim Miller's assessment of Silvetti over Kyle's every single day of the week. What I don't get is how one can defend both Kyle and Silvetti - not after reading Kyle's quotes as have been posted by Kermit, and compiled & re-posted by Janet & Blonde. Obviously others feel differently and that's ok too. JMO, again. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 18, 2008, 10:19:45 AM billb - just to add to my earlier post we will also be looking at missing Pennsylvania Centre County Prosecutor Ray Gricar. I think this one is solvable and hope hopefully this coming spring we will be traveling there, once the ground thaws, with cadaver dogs and see what we can find. I have a few areas of interest and if we can check them we will. Either clear them or maybe find Ray. Rob, Thanks for setting me straight on the upcoming news. Although I hoped it was specific to Natalee, I understand and do believe something will shake loose in the future for Natalee and her family.This is a case that has many perplexed and I hope we can do something here. It is a great thing that you do for those who can not stand up for themselves anymore. Keep charging! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 10:27:01 AM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 10:37:49 AM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO A rule I have tried to live by and regretted the couple times I didn't. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 10:41:44 AM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: Yes it happens like this time and time again. Sad for those not in the super secret areas of such private forums. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 10:56:49 AM Anyone else think the heated discussions of private forum/open forum sound like first graders on a playground? Let's collectively move on...Kiss and make up...
We have some further investigations to do... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Lifesong on December 18, 2008, 11:00:18 AM My whole problem with private forums is -- "who and why do you trust". I think people get flattered and go in blindly following those that "asked them". People here are sincerley wanting to help -- just too trusting in my opinion. I won't give my phone # to anyone I have not met in person. A rule I have tried to live by and regretted the couple times I didn't. I agree, Wreck. I probably should have clarified, anyone asked to join a "special, private" research group would predictably be flattered and jump at the chance to contribute in what they believed to be a meaningful way. IMO, that's the simple manipulation involved. It's how I ended up the PTA Fundraising Chair at my kids' elementary school years ago. If I had only known! Klaas - Agree there also. There are people I do know in person I still won't give my phone number to! :) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Helen Back on December 18, 2008, 11:14:37 AM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO A rule I have tried to live by and regretted the couple times I didn't. Ummmmmm, mine could use some help. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Morning monkeys. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 11:15:42 AM Good Morning Monkeys.
BRRRRR. Hubby and I have just returned from an early morning walk with our 15 year old Golden Retriever Brandi. It is very chilly in the Fraser Valley of British Columbia. Our below freezing temperatures that we have been experiencing for about a week finally warmed up. The snow that began yesterday is thishigh and ... schools have been cancelled. Thankfully the roads in our area were ploughed yesterday which made our walk possible. Have a good day all. Janet 8:12 AM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 11:24:34 AM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO Shoot, I can't remember my phone number half the time. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 12:21:13 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: crazybabyborg on December 18, 2008, 12:23:49 PM Morning Monkeys!
I read and read and read last night in the prior and this thread, until 5:00am. When I finally caught up, I didn't know what to post. Now, because of the discussion this morning, I do. I have never attempted to participate in any other forum. Somebody always brought over information that was useful and I always trusted the monkey doing the transfer; Klaas seemed to be the main one and Lord knows, I trust her! I do have a good sense of the common purpose that has always brought this unique group of posters together and what has kept us here. The single reason why that common purpose has been preserved is because of Klaas' and Red's judgement when it comes to identifying the source that veers from that purpose, and acting to purge the forum from the disruption. I've actually kidded Klaas about knowing before she does whose "posting life" is short. There's always been lots of different OPINIONS, AREAS OF INTEREST, APPROACHES, and SKILLS. It makes for a wonderful contribution toward: ONE PURPOSE . When a poster's purpose is not born in compassion and focused on justice for Natalee and her family, they simply don't last long. I believe there has been an orchestrated effort to bring a different purpose to Scared Monkeys. I believe, just by viewing the results, that whatever a laughably "private" forum's purposes are or was, that disrupting Scared Monkeys was among them. Personally, I appreciate Kermit's efforts and know the frog belongs here. Personally, I am very frustrated at the cryptic innuendo's of other posters. Natalee and her family deserve better, and I'd prefer that anyone who takes the stance that "I know big stuff, let me drop a hint" just go away. If they can't step up for what's right and speak plainly because it's the right thing to do, then they are as bad as those who have covered up the crimes committed on the Holloway/Twitty family. That's my opinion. I wanted to post this because I wanted to suggest that those who are discouraged just watch it play out. I trust Klaas; her record is impeccable. The truth has a way of bubbling up through the mire, and she holds the shovel to toss out the bottom sludge. Until Natalee's case has been closed with some semblance of justice, we'll be here. At the end, those who will join hands as we watch it happen will be of like heart. I'm so honored to have a place among you! {{HUGS, MONKEYS!}} Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 01:38:20 PM Morning Monkeys! I read and read and read last night in the prior and this thread, until 5:00am. When I finally caught up, I didn't know what to post. Now, because of the discussion this morning, I do. I have never attempted to participate in any other forum. Somebody always brought over information that was useful and I always trusted the monkey doing the transfer; Klaas seemed to be the main one and Lord knows, I trust her! I do have a good sense of the common purpose that has always brought this unique group of posters together and what has kept us here. The single reason why that common purpose has been preserved is because of Klaas' and Red's judgement when it comes to identifying the source that veers from that purpose, and acting to purge the forum from the disruption. I've actually kidded Klaas about knowing before she does whose "posting life" is short. There's always been lots of different OPINIONS, AREAS OF INTEREST, APPROACHES, and SKILLS. It makes for a wonderful contribution toward: ONE PURPOSE . When a poster's purpose is not born in compassion and focused on justice for Natalee and her family, they simply don't last long. I believe there has been an orchestrated effort to bring a different purpose to Scared Monkeys. I believe, just by viewing the results, that whatever a laughably "private" forum's purposes are or was, that disrupting Scared Monkeys was among them. Personally, I appreciate Kermit's efforts and know the frog belongs here. Personally, I am very frustrated at the cryptic innuendo's of other posters. Natalee and her family deserve better, and I'd prefer that anyone who takes the stance that "I know big stuff, let me drop a hint" just go away. If they can't step up for what's right and speak plainly because it's the right thing to do, then they are as bad as those who have covered up the crimes committed on the Holloway/Twitty family. That's my opinion. I wanted to post this because I wanted to suggest that those who are discouraged just watch it play out. I trust Klaas; her record is impeccable. The truth has a way of bubbling up through the mire, and she holds the shovel to toss out the bottom sludge. Until Natalee's case has been closed with some semblance of justice, we'll be here. At the end, those who will join hands as we watch it happen will be of like heart. I'm so honored to have a place among you! {{HUGS, MONKEYS!}} You are so sweet-I couln't have said it better. I am honored also to be a part of this. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 01:42:31 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull .
I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 01:45:39 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Edward on December 18, 2008, 01:52:10 PM Looks like sun glasses to me.. ::MonkeyTongue::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 01:54:03 PM Looks like sun glasses to me.. ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyCool::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:00:33 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) No what you see is also not the back of a skull,i have about 50 underwater skull pics here . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 02:09:19 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) No what you see is also not the back of a skull,i have about 50 underwater skull pics here . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:16:43 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) No what you see is also not the back of a skull,i have about 50 underwater skull pics here . That was my first impression also but what you see on the original pic is finaly not the back of a skull. So it is also not the front because you don't see the black eye/ nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 02:20:42 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) No what you see is also not the back of a skull,i have about 50 underwater skull pics here . That was my first impression also but what you see on the original pic is finaly not the back of a skull. So it is also not the front because you don't see the black eye/ nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:22:05 PM I found out that there is "something " in the cage but it is not a skull . What if you are looking at the BACK of the skull??I found a pic (skull) and that one was also found in the ocean . You clearly see the black holes > eyes and nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skull-last.jpg) No what you see is also not the back of a skull,i have about 50 underwater skull pics here . That was my first impression also but what you see on the original pic is finaly not the back of a skull. So it is also not the front because you don't see the black eye/ nose holes . (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Because the back of a skull has another shape Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 18, 2008, 02:22:06 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:27:16 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 02:30:36 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 02:30:41 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? That was my thought, Anna. Could even be crabs or any kind of sea creature. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:31:13 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) this one also (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/bret1lgkopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Edward on December 18, 2008, 02:34:11 PM A round rock used to hold something down ?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 02:38:13 PM Sorry if this is OT, but I've got to get back to work. I've just been catching up during my lunch. A couple of posts I read really stood out to me, Lifesong's and CBB's come to mind. I hope everyone knows what my purpose here is. I only want the answers to Natalee's disappearance, and to see her returned to her family. Justice for her and her family would be the icing on that cake. I am certainly having my doubts about some that have come here and I've trusted, believing that they genuinely wanted to help find the answers for Natalee and her family. I still hope that it's not as bad as it might seem right now in regards to that. Time will tell. I have been a part of other forums. This was the first right after Natalee's disappearance, and I hope I'll still be here when we all know all the answers. It is by far the best forum that I've ever participated in, and I'm very grateful to Red, Klaas, Dugga, and all the other mods and behind the scenes people that make it possible.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:41:13 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:42:32 PM Hay TM ::MonkeyWink::
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/SMCUBE.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 02:48:05 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 02:53:04 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? So you tell me now that what tim saw were high resolution pics ? It was video and the pics we have are screenshots of that video jmo Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 03:07:09 PM Tim Miller of Equisearch said after viewing LIVE pics of the cage: 'sure looks like a skull to me'! He has seen MANY in all types of conditions. When the John Silvetti/ALE connection is considered ... it is not difficult to understand why Tim Miller had become a liability. Janet +++++++ The search for Natalee Holloway TRANSCRIPT By Chris Hansen Correspondent NBC News updated 5:20 p.m. PT, Fri., Feb. 22, 2008 Tim Miller: I stepped on the boat and said “Natalee we're coming to get you.” Now we're finally coming to get you. And I still believe that from the bottom of my heart. She's out here and now we're on our way. Over the holiday season, the crew of the persistence worked day and night to survey the ocean floor and look for targets that could hold the key to finding Natalee. On Christmas Eve sonar pictures revealed what looked like a large trap, almost exactly where Tim Miller theorized it would be. And on Dec. 29 the crew dropped a remote operated vehicle, or ROV, into the water to get a closer look. Tim Miller: It looked like a skull. Still looks like a skull. ... In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ The search for Natalee Holloway TRANSCRIPT By Chris Hansen Correspondent NBC News updated 5:20 p.m. PT, Fri., Feb. 22, 2008 Dave Holloway: I got a phone call from Tim. Chris Hansen: And what'd he say? Dave Holloway: He told me, he said, "Dave, we found her." Chris Hansen: "We found her?" Dave Holloway: Yeah. I said, "Are you sure?" and he said, "I’m 99.9 percent sure." He said, "We hadn't gone down and dove under or anything. But the photographs--" he said, "I tell you, Dave." I-- he said, "That's what we're looking for. And that's gotta-- that-- that's it." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 18, 2008, 03:07:51 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? So you tell me now that what tim saw were high resolution pics ? It was video and the pics we have are screenshots of that video jmo The skull was not the only thing in the cage Johan. I found this pic very convincing(the hip socket) (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/verwant/hip_socket.jpg) I`m sure a skull would be, like Anna and Magnolia said, filled with coral, barnacles or sponges. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 03:09:33 PM Some photos of skulls under water:
(http://www.ngsprints.co.uk/images/M/438683.jpg) (http://www.oceans.com.au/main-top-image-skull.jpg) (http://www.archaeology.org/interactive/cenotes/gifs/skull.gif) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 03:10:02 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? That thought crossed my mind, too, Anna. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 03:11:10 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? So you tell me now that what tim saw were high resolution pics ? It was video and the pics we have are screenshots of that video jmo I really don't see much point in arguing, I guess we can just disagree. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 03:13:42 PM Janet, I know you will have this right at hand.....
Didn't Kyle say: If it wasn't her, it was one of the biggest WTF moments of my life......or something to that effect? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 03:15:56 PM Johan555,
I appreciate that both you and Klaas found underwater pics of skulls for comparison....thank you both for bringing them forward. ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 18, 2008, 03:19:25 PM I'm thinking that We do not know for sure if the skull in the trap was underwater since June 2005 or if it was placed there some tme later and if was placed there at a later date then it would not look the same as if it had been there for 3 years....The timing would affect the look of the skull...JMHO
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 03:22:53 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 03:23:22 PM Janet, I know you will have this right at hand..... Didn't Kyle say: If it wasn't her, it was one of the biggest WTF moments of my life......or something to that effect? THE FABRIC KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 03:24:22 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 18, 2008, 03:26:02 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 03:27:54 PM Janet, I know you will have this right at hand..... Didn't Kyle say: If it wasn't her, it was one of the biggest WTF moments of my life......or something to that effect? THE FABRIC KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. Thank you, Janet! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Lifesong on December 18, 2008, 03:32:22 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Johan555, I'm curious if you would source this picture with a link. It looks like a still from a movie or a soundstage/tank. TIA Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 03:36:11 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) in my opinion said tim : 'sure looks like a skull to me'! is that 99.7 % ? So you tell me now that what tim saw were high resolution pics ? It was video and the pics we have are screenshots of that video jmo The skull was not the only thing in the cage Johan. I found this pic very convincing(the hip socket) (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/verwant/hip_socket.jpg) I`m sure a skull would be, like Anna and Magnolia said, filled with coral, barnacles or sponges. Yes i saw also some bones on the screenshots ( on another pic ) But i have big doubts about the skull. And if it were human remains were are they Now ? Yes i saw also some bones on the screenshots (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Bone.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 03:41:03 PM What if the eye sockets and nose hole filled in with coral, barnacles or sponges growing inside the skull? I don't think so because all the (underwater) skulls i found are clean like the last pic. (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/skulkopie.jpg) Johan555, I'm curious if you would source this picture with a link. It looks like a still from a movie or a soundstage/tank. TIA i try to find it between the 50 skull pics Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 03:43:09 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 03:48:20 PM Sorry if this is OT, but I've got to get back to work. I've just been catching up during my lunch. A couple of posts I read really stood out to me, Lifesong's and CBB's come to mind. I hope everyone knows what my purpose here is. I only want the answers to Natalee's disappearance, and to see her returned to her family. Justice for her and her family would be the icing on that cake. I am certainly having my doubts about some that have come here and I've trusted, believing that they genuinely wanted to help find the answers for Natalee and her family. I still hope that it's not as bad as it might seem right now in regards to that. Time will tell. I have been a part of other forums. This was the first right after Natalee's disappearance, and I hope I'll still be here when we all know all the answers. It is by far the best forum that I've ever participated in, and I'm very grateful to Red, Klaas, Dugga, and all the other mods and behind the scenes people that make it possible. texasmom ... I agree with you 100%. When I consider the domino effect in regards to those who would have to be held to accountability in regards to the happenings on the morning of May 30, 2005 as well as the ensuing coverup ... I no longer believe that Natalee Holloway will receive justice in an Aruban or Dutch court. However ... if Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage ... there is a possibility that the family could bring her home to rest on American soil ... allowing a measure of closure. This is the reason that it is so important that the underlying dynamics regarding the ALE/John S. connection ... regarding the contents of the cage/trap ... must be an ongoing focus. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 03:49:30 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyShocked::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 03:53:24 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyShocked::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: sharon on December 18, 2008, 03:59:51 PM Sorry if this is OT, but I've got to get back to work. I've just been catching up during my lunch. A couple of posts I read really stood out to me, Lifesong's and CBB's come to mind. I hope everyone knows what my purpose here is. I only want the answers to Natalee's disappearance, and to see her returned to her family. Justice for her and her family would be the icing on that cake. I am certainly having my doubts about some that have come here and I've trusted, believing that they genuinely wanted to help find the answers for Natalee and her family. I still hope that it's not as bad as it might seem right now in regards to that. Time will tell. I have been a part of other forums. This was the first right after Natalee's disappearance, and I hope I'll still be here when we all know all the answers. It is by far the best forum that I've ever participated in, and I'm very grateful to Red, Klaas, Dugga, and all the other mods and behind the scenes people that make it possible. texasmom ... I agree with you 100%. When I consider the domino effect in regards to those who would have to be held to accountability in regards to the happenings on the morning of May 30, 2005 as well as the ensuing coverup ... I no longer believe that Natalee Holloway will receive justice in an Aruban or Dutch court. However ... if Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage ... there is a possibility that the family could bring her home to rest on American soil ... allowing a measure of closure. This is the reason that it is so important that the underlying dynamics regarding the ALE/John S. connection ... regarding the contents of the cage/trap ... must be an ongoing focus. Janet What about all of the other documented locations that needed follow up ? If in fact, this is not the correct location, what about all the remaining 'viable' targets?? I think there were about 100. I still worry about that documentation. If it fell into the wrong hands ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: I wonder if it already has ::MonkeyWaa:: I wonder where it is?? o/t -- Janet, I hope your birthday was cozy and calm. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 04:00:47 PM Well ... I will be gone from the Natalee Holloway forum until tomorrow evening. No ... I am not taking Ducky and tippy toeing to a private site.
::MonkeyTongue:: Hubby and I are off to the Eastern portion of the Fraser Valley to care for our four grandkids this evening while Mom and Dad are off to a Christmas party. After attending a Christmas program tomorrow morning at the school where the two younger munchkins attend ... we will be headed back home. Have a great afternoon Monkeys. Janet 1:00 PM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 04:03:18 PM billb - just to add to my earlier post we will also be looking at missing Pennsylvania Centre County Prosecutor Ray Gricar. I think this one is solvable and hope hopefully this coming spring we will be traveling there, once the ground thaws, with cadaver dogs and see what we can find. I have a few areas of interest and if we can check them we will. Either clear them or maybe find Ray. Rob I remember him, I thought someone took a picture of him sitting with a woman eating lunch on there cell phone.This is a case that has many perplexed and I hope we can do something here. I thought he just took off on his own? (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/In%20the%20News/images.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:03:23 PM (http://www.scubaduba.com/gallery/skull.jpg) http://www.scubaduba.com/gallery/nfskull.html http://www.nbc6.net/news/16749527/detail.html (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/skull.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 04:03:49 PM Enjoy, Janet...
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: pinkbanana on December 18, 2008, 04:08:25 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: I needed that right now. ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: pb Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 04:10:12 PM Sorry if this is OT, but I've got to get back to work. I've just been catching up during my lunch. A couple of posts I read really stood out to me, Lifesong's and CBB's come to mind. I hope everyone knows what my purpose here is. I only want the answers to Natalee's disappearance, and to see her returned to her family. Justice for her and her family would be the icing on that cake. I am certainly having my doubts about some that have come here and I've trusted, believing that they genuinely wanted to help find the answers for Natalee and her family. I still hope that it's not as bad as it might seem right now in regards to that. Time will tell. I have been a part of other forums. This was the first right after Natalee's disappearance, and I hope I'll still be here when we all know all the answers. It is by far the best forum that I've ever participated in, and I'm very grateful to Red, Klaas, Dugga, and all the other mods and behind the scenes people that make it possible. texasmom ... I agree with you 100%. When I consider the domino effect in regards to those who would have to be held to accountability in regards to the happenings on the morning of May 30, 2005 as well as the ensuing coverup ... I no longer believe that Natalee Holloway will receive justice in an Aruban or Dutch court. However ... if Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage ... there is a possibility that the family could bring her home to rest on American soil ... allowing a measure of closure. This is the reason that it is so important that the underlying dynamics regarding the ALE/John S. connection ... regarding the contents of the cage/trap ... must be an ongoing focus. Janet What about all of the other documented locations that needed follow up ? If in fact, this is not the correct location, what about all the remaining 'viable' targets?? I think there were about 100. I still worry about that documentation. If it fell into the wrong hands ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: I wonder if it already has ::MonkeyWaa:: I wonder where it is?? o/t -- Janet, I hope your birthday was cozy and calm. So many unanswered questions. So many self-serving movtives. Justice for Natalee Holloway never stood a chance. ::MonkeyNoNo:: o/t -- Sharon, I had a great but quiet birthday. It snowed all day. Sunday evening the family got together. We celebrated (?) my birthday at a local restaurant and ... then attended a wonderful Christmas program at one of the larger churches in our community. Thanks for asking. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 18, 2008, 04:11:46 PM Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 18, 2008, 04:13:50 PM billb - just to add to my earlier post we will also be looking at missing Pennsylvania Centre County Prosecutor Ray Gricar. I think this one is solvable and hope hopefully this coming spring we will be traveling there, once the ground thaws, with cadaver dogs and see what we can find. I have a few areas of interest and if we can check them we will. Either clear them or maybe find Ray. Rob I remember him, I thought someone took a picture of him sitting with a woman eating lunch on there cell phone.This is a case that has many perplexed and I hope we can do something here. I thought he just took off on his own? (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/In%20the%20News/images.jpg) Blonde - that pic was not him. That guy was using his left hand to eat - Ray was right-handed IIRC. In any event, it was determined that that person was not Ray. If he took off on his own, it's one of the best self disappearing acts ever. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:16:29 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot?
The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 04:17:43 PM Anyone else think the heated discussions of private forum/open forum sound like first graders on a playground? Let's collectively move on...Kiss and make up... We have some further investigations to do... Yes! Thank you! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:18:49 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) Blue area Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:20:31 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) Blue area Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 04:25:29 PM It is starting to look like Wreck's family reunion in here. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Too funny. Sorry, wreck, But I had to laugh at that one. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:25:54 PM i think this is their the property
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/HUISkopie-32.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:26:23 PM Johan - hold on and I'll post some pics for you. There are dirt roads not showing up in your google map pic.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:27:20 PM Johan - hold on and I'll post some pics for you. There are dirt roads not showing up in your google map pic. okiedokie !! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 04:27:23 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 04:28:03 PM Quote Access Exclusive: Former ‘Family Ties’ Actress Tapped To Play Natalee Holloway’s Mom LOS ANGELES, Calif. -- The tragic tale of Natalee Holloway is coming to Lifetime and actress Tracey Pollan has been tapped to play the mother of the teen who vanished during a trip to Aruba, Access Hollywood has confirmed. Pollan will star as Natalee’s mother, Beth Twitty, in the movie based on Twitty’s book, “Loving Natalee: A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith.” (snip) Based on the harrowing true story of Natalee which captured huge national media attention – an Alabama teen who vanished during her senior class trip to Aruba — the film will focus largely on Twitty’s relentless efforts to uncover the truth behind her daughter’s disappearance. “The Natalee Holloway Story” will air in April 2009 on Lifetime Movie Network. Production is slated to begin in South Africa in January. http://www.accesshollywood.com/access-exclusive-former-family-ties-actress-tapped-to-play-natalee-holloways-mom_article_12703 (http://www.accesshollywood.com/access-exclusive-former-family-ties-actress-tapped-to-play-natalee-holloways-mom_article_12703) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:28:26 PM Johan - you are wrong. The pic where Dana's truck is the sloot home. Next door is the neighbor with Mico the monkey. I know this is a fact because RED was there searching with TES in 2005.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 04:30:45 PM Johan - you are wrong. The pic where Dana's truck is the sloot home. Next door is the neighbor with Mico the monkey. I know this is a fact because RED was there searching with TES in 2005. I apologies to "Mico" !! ::MonkeyShocked::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:31:09 PM When you see this pics ,you can see that the white wall is disappeared
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/sloot3copy.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 04:32:11 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) In my mind, it looks like they knocked down/disappeared the house on the pool side of the VDS home. IIRC, this is the home that contained the disappearing blue wading pool. I always thought that a neighbor on vacation may have provided the 'place' for a lot of things in this case - porn film, storage of the body, evidence, etc. jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:33:33 PM Some pictures, one of the Sloot home and the TES searchers next door where the Monkey cage was.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/slootshouse.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:33:58 PM In this thread:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=255.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 04:42:25 PM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Yes we were all together and trusted each other untill my pictures got out. I sent them to Dave's tip line only. It was Dave's tip line he passed our tips out to a group of posters ::MonkeyShocked:: I miss you Finbar Poochy that was Mr X ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 04:43:54 PM When you see this pics ,you can see that the white wall is disappeared (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/sloot3copy.jpg) And is think the white wall is the wall behind Paul on this pic (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/joran3kopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 04:45:53 PM VDS home - Not even sure why I'm doing this as the location and identification of the VDS home is one of the few things I'm certain of in this case.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/VDSCompoundOverview.jpg) (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/vdsh6.jpg) From photos Red took while he was there searching with TES in August 2005: Driveway next to house where the Dana truck can be seen: (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/VDSRoad.jpg) The other side of the house: (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/vdsred1.gif) (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/vdsred2.gif) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 04:57:15 PM Johan - hold on and I'll post some pics for you. There are dirt roads not showing up in your google map pic. okiedokie !! ::MonkeyWink:: Johan I hhave a thread here somwhere of the whole yard looking now. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 05:04:23 PM (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/aruba122.jpg)
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/aruba123.jpg) (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/JoransPad.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 05:04:46 PM (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/slootlarge.jpg)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 05:08:32 PM (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/vds3.jpg)
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/vdswall.jpg) (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/The%20VDS%20Home/ThisanareabehindtheVDShouse.jpg) This is an area behind the VDShouse ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 05:10:05 PM When you see this pics ,you can see that the white wall is disappeared (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/sloot3copy.jpg) And is think the white wall is the wall behind Paul on this pic (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/joran3kopie.jpg) Thanks blonde for me is important why they removed that white wall And ............ when Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 05:15:30 PM If anyone is a member of a private forum can you tell me why be a part of something private?? ::MonkeyLaugh:: I didn't expect anyone to answer ::MonkeyLaugh:: The Natalee Freebirds is a private forum. Members compile research encompassing a particular topic related to the Natalee Holloway case into a well organized document and ... then that document is posted for all to read on their own blog. The Natalee's Freebirds also share each of their documents with the SM site. Klaas posts the Natalee's Freebirds document in the Corruption and Collusion Thread. I was once a member but made the decision to leave. I am not a very good team player. I have my own ideas. Something akin to what I shared earlier regarding what my eldest son would say to me when he was in his late teens ... "Mom, it is your way or the highway." Good Night Keepthefaith. Janet +++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0 http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ Janet Thank you Janet.But isn't that defeating the purpose of all Transparency?? I don't think so. A private research site gives members an opportunity to work together to create a document by focusing in a one particular topic without any distractions. The Natalee's Freebirds share the outcome of all their hard work. I just chose to leave for my own reasons ... it just was not my thing. I like an open forum. Keepthefaith ... click on the links I provided and ... read some of the Natalee's Freebirds' documents. I think you will be impressed. Janet I agree Janet. And from the work I've seen, the purpose of the Freebird's site is genuine and good. I think I would have been honored to have been invited there. It will take a group effort from everyone to bring the EVIL of the Island to light.Why are people scared to admit that there a part of these private forums?Not that i care.Seems trivial..I do find a concerted effort to discredit Kermit and i,for one,don't know why?? I do not see an attempt to discredit Kermit or anyone. I see disagreement among posters. What I see are observations, pictures, speculation, and a lot of unknown missing information and facts. Those that review these things, ponder them, form many different conclusions. Different ideas from different points of view. The only value in discussing the posters is to take the focus off Aruba. I stand with the girl, and the finger is still pointing at Aruba. Doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not! ::MonkeyCool:: jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 05:31:19 PM Whiskeygirl:
Quote I do not see an attempt to discredit Kermit or anyone. I see disagreement among posters. I do. Hotshot outright called a Kermit a fraud. I asked her to confirm that -- she said she in fact did. Hotshot has offered NOTHINg to support her claims. NOTHING.What I see are observations, pictures, speculation, and a lot of unknown missing information and facts. Those that review these things, ponder them, form many different conclusions. Different ideas from different points of view. The only value in discussing the posters is to take the focus off Aruba. I stand with the girl, and the finger is still pointing at Aruba. Doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not! jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 06:01:18 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound. IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool. There are windows that face outside the compound. There are all those roads and paths. I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house. What good would that do? So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed. Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties. Through the gate, window, or just over the fence. It doesn't look like there is much lighting. jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 06:03:27 PM http://www.accesshollywood.com/access-exclusive-former-family-ties-actress-tapped-to-play-natalee-holloways-mom_article_12703
Access Exclusive: ‘Family Ties’ Actress Tapped To Play Natalee Holloway’s Mom: LAST UPDATED: December 18, 2008 3:08 PM EST LOS ANGELES, Calif. -- The tragic tale of Natalee Holloway is coming to Lifetime and actress Tracey Pollan has been tapped to play the mother of the teen who vanished during a trip to Aruba, Access Hollywood has confirmed. Pollan will star as Natalee’s mother, Beth Twitty, in the movie based on Twitty’s book, “Loving Natalee: A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith.” Pollan, who is married to Michael J. Fox, is best known for her stint alongside her husband as his recurring love interest Ellen Reed on the 1980s sitcom “Family Ties.” She has also had guest spots on “Spin City” and “Law & Order: SVU,” for which she received an Emmy nomination. Pollan and Fox, who married in 1988, also shared the screen in the 1988 film “Bright Lights, Big City.” Based on the harrowing true story of Natalee which captured huge national media attention – an Alabama teen who vanished during her senior class trip to Aruba — the film will focus largely on Twitty’s relentless efforts to uncover the truth behind her daughter’s disappearance. “The Natalee Holloway Story” will air in April 2009 on Lifetime Movie Network. Production is slated to begin in South Africa in January. Copyright 2008 by NBC Universal, Inc. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Edward on December 18, 2008, 06:13:06 PM There is some money
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 06:13:16 PM I've done better lately at not commenting on all of this, but a few thoughts just won't leave me, so I'm going to put them out there. 1. People who have nothing to hide, hide nothing. Any member of any group, private or public, that is at all concerned with who gets the "credit" if this case is ever solved has completely forgotten why they got involved in the first place. 2. It seems to me that some posters are "innocently" asking questions in this public forum that they already know the answers to from a private forum. Whether this is happening in an effort to clear things up further, or to "trap" others with their answers, I do not know. I do know it's distracting. [See 1.] 3. Anyone - and I do mean anyone - who is more concerned with cliques, credit, a sense of self-importance, or any issue other than Justice for Natalee and Peace for her Family should take a break from this case for the sake of the Natalee and her family. Think about it. It's never been about us. Attorneys don't need internet groups to do their work for them. Yes - you might get lucky and help with a piece of information - but does anyone actually believe that JQK does not have the resources to bring to bear on this case what he can/needs to as things progress? He wouldn't have taken the case and Beth wouldn't have hired him otherwise. 4. Kermit - Thank you for your service to our country. I mean it, Thank You. Thank you for your sacrifice, your dedication, and your hard work throughout the course of your career. Every president we elect is my president. Thanks also on behalf of my 12 year old daughter for continuing to break down and hold open the doors for women to advance professionally. Equality is still elusive, but you've made lasting contributions and that should also be acknowledged. JMO GREAT POST!!! I concur 100% Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 06:24:12 PM Well it looks like Scared Monkeys has become 'As the Monkeys Turn.' More days than not these last few weeks it seems as two different Monkeys decide to act like children on the playground. Five year old children. Monkeys used to agreeably disagree and move on - not accuse, attack and barb each other for pages on end. What's happened? Yes, it can ber entertaining at times, but seriously, there is NO point other than to exhibit to the world your personal degree of insecurity and immaturity. Please catch yourself and don't bite when someone baits you.
::MonkeyNoNo:: If it means that much for someone else to have the last word, so be it. The reflection on you for 'letting it go' will be much brighter. ::MonkeyDance:: On a separate note, where did ******* and Destiny go? Last I knew ******* was spending time on one of the dutch sites (?) educating them on this case? Well, I'll go back to lurking. Always in the rafters even when I'm not logged in. Carry on. With civility, please and thank you. Miss Scarlet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 18, 2008, 06:24:43 PM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Yes we were all together and trusted each other untill my pictures got out. I sent them to Dave's tip line only. It was Dave's tip line he passed our tips out to a group of posters ::MonkeyShocked:: I miss you Finbar Poochy that was Mr X ::MonkeyCool:: Yup, good ole 'Mr X'. Blonde, what pics got out? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 06:26:03 PM anyone know where this is in Aruba?
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/555kopie.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 06:27:11 PM Whiskeygirl: Quote I do not see an attempt to discredit Kermit or anyone. I see disagreement among posters. I do. Hotshot outright called a Kermit a fraud. I asked her to confirm that -- she said she in fact did. Hotshot has offered NOTHINg to support her claims. NOTHING.What I see are observations, pictures, speculation, and a lot of unknown missing information and facts. Those that review these things, ponder them, form many different conclusions. Different ideas from different points of view. The only value in discussing the posters is to take the focus off Aruba. I stand with the girl, and the finger is still pointing at Aruba. Doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not! jmho My bad, I must have missed that post. When I look at the sites that many posters are openly associated with, I seem much to corroborate what they post here at ScaredMonkeys. IIRC, there is a poster associated with "Aruba Dirty Police" at http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/ (http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/) last post December 14, 2008. Lots of stuff here, no cage/trap stuff this month. Why not? Natalee's Freebirds http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ (http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/) last post September 24, 2008. No cage/trap research here. Why not? Zoltan Zion, IIRC is associated with "Rob" - last post @ http://www.zoltanzion.blogspot.com/ July 16, 2008. No cage/trap research here, no updates for many months. Why not? I think its simply different conclusions by different people. Different points of view. No evidence that I am aware of to support any version. In the realm of speculation and conclusions, sometimes, I just have to go with what I can verify. Nothing at the three sites I consider the "go to" places. Monkeys still rock, just don't always understand the ups and downs... ::MonkeyEek:: jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 06:36:31 PM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Yes we were all together and trusted each other untill my pictures got out. I sent them to Dave's tip line only. It was Dave's tip line he passed our tips out to a group of posters ::MonkeyShocked:: I miss you Finbar Poochy that was Mr X ::MonkeyCool:: Yup, good ole 'Mr X'. Blonde, what pics got out? I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 06:38:00 PM i think this is their the property (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/HUISkopie-32.jpg) Why do so many of the houses in Aruba look like glorified dog houses? At least they do from an aerial perspective. The add-on jobs are terrible too. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 06:40:40 PM Quote Access Exclusive: Former ‘Family Ties’ Actress Tapped To Play Natalee Holloway’s Mom LOS ANGELES, Calif. -- The tragic tale of Natalee Holloway is coming to Lifetime and actress Tracey Pollan has been tapped to play the mother of the teen who vanished during a trip to Aruba, Access Hollywood has confirmed. Pollan will star as Natalee’s mother, Beth Twitty, in the movie based on Twitty’s book, “Loving Natalee: A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith.” (snip) Based on the harrowing true story of Natalee which captured huge national media attention – an Alabama teen who vanished during her senior class trip to Aruba — the film will focus largely on Twitty’s relentless efforts to uncover the truth behind her daughter’s disappearance. “The Natalee Holloway Story” will air in April 2009 on Lifetime Movie Network. Production is slated to begin in South Africa in January. http://www.accesshollywood.com/access-exclusive-former-family-ties-actress-tapped-to-play-natalee-holloways-mom_article_12703 (http://www.accesshollywood.com/access-exclusive-former-family-ties-actress-tapped-to-play-natalee-holloways-mom_article_12703) I don't receive the Lifetime channel. ::MonkeyWaa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 06:52:14 PM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Yes we were all together and trusted each other untill my pictures got out. I sent them to Dave's tip line only. It was Dave's tip line he passed our tips out to a group of posters ::MonkeyShocked:: I miss you Finbar Poochy that was Mr X ::MonkeyCool:: Yup, good ole 'Mr X'. Blonde, what pics got out? I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) And Blonde do you think it is Paulas ? the " judge " ? ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 06:53:00 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive?
Please don't trash me for asking. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 06:54:49 PM Hay TM ::MonkeyWink:: (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/SMCUBE.jpg) Hey Johan! I love the cube! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 06:56:13 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 06:56:40 PM Well it looks like Scared Monkeys has become 'As the Monkeys Turn.' More days than not these last few weeks it seems as two different Monkeys decide to act like children on the playground. Five year old children. Monkeys used to agreeably disagree and move on - not accuse, attack and barb each other for pages on end. What's happened? Yes, it can ber entertaining at times, but seriously, there is NO point other than to exhibit to the world your personal degree of insecurity and immaturity. Please catch yourself and don't bite when someone baits you. ::MonkeyNoNo:: If it means that much for someone else to have the last word, so be it. The reflection on you for 'letting it go' will be much brighter. ::MonkeyDance:: On a separate note, where did ******* and Destiny go? Last I knew ******* was spending time on one of the dutch sites (?) educating them on this case? Well, I'll go back to lurking. Always in the rafters even when I'm not logged in. Carry on. With civility, please and thank you. Miss Scarlet Last I knew ******* was spending time on one of the dutch sites (?) educating them on this case? ******* is half Dutch now we educating Him ::MonkeyHaHa:: He is often on the dutch Fok forum Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 06:57:59 PM Well it looks like Scared Monkeys has become 'As the Monkeys Turn.' More days than not these last few weeks it seems as two different Monkeys decide to act like children on the playground. Five year old children. Monkeys used to agreeably disagree and move on - not accuse, attack and barb each other for pages on end. What's happened? Yes, it can ber entertaining at times, but seriously, there is NO point other than to exhibit to the world your personal degree of insecurity and immaturity. Please catch yourself and don't bite when someone baits you. ::MonkeyNoNo:: If it means that much for someone else to have the last word, so be it. The reflection on you for 'letting it go' will be much brighter. ::MonkeyDance:: On a separate note, where did ******* and Destiny go? Last I knew ******* was spending time on one of the dutch sites (?) educating them on this case? Well, I'll go back to lurking. Always in the rafters even when I'm not logged in. Carry on. With civility, please and thank you. Miss Scarlet They were both banned. Do me a favor, don't come in here and act like you are the boss of anyone here. You aren't. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 06:59:21 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Fair question.......................................... but I'm afraid not. IF (a huge IF) she was "sold off" -- she was too big a liability, too well known or recognizable to be kept alive. -JMOPlease don't trash me for asking. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 06:59:37 PM Destiny and ******* are currently moderators of an invite only forum, ChatnGrumble. Many current monkeys have been invited. I know who most of you are, you aren't fooling anyone.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 07:00:46 PM (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Animation2.gif)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 18, 2008, 07:01:24 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. Personally I believe she was either murdered by or died in the presence of Joran van der Sloot in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 07:03:43 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Fair question.......................................... but I'm afraid not. IF (a huge IF) she was "sold off" -- she was too big a liability, too well known or recognizable to be kept alive. -JMOPlease don't trash me for asking. I suppose you are right, but would it be prudent to follow that possibility, just in case? I mean, if she was sold off I sure as h3ll would like to know who took her off that island. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 07:05:32 PM I will say this re private forums: people can be duped into joining ... as I was we were "reruited" from various NH sites hindsight being 20/20, I'm pretty sure the sales pitches were tailored to each individual mine followed along the lines of "no idle chit chat/purely research" and "open forums do the work for defense attys" (ie: tipping them to everything discovered) we were encouraged to choose partners and research certain topics or persons on an as-needed/as-asked basis I met finbar there/some members post here now human nature being what it is: turns out there was a group-within-the-group (unknown to most of us, AFAIK) which summarized everyone's work and passed it along to factions w/in the H/T families (while claiming credit for the research) then the site closed w/ literally a few hours notice and all of our research poofed ... or so they tell me live/learn, I guess :cool: I recall that private site and my 'recruiting' sounded similar, if not word for word to yours Finngirl. In fact we were on that same private forum together but I had a different nic at that time. Just before he took it down we were researching a US politician who flew a plane and had some 'leg' issues! And then poof. Site closed down almost immediately. And from what I recall, wasn't there a private area within that private site!!!! I gave up private sites for lent ::MonkeyCool:: And it felt so good I gave them up permanently! Yes we were all together and trusted each other untill my pictures got out. I sent them to Dave's tip line only. It was Dave's tip line he passed our tips out to a group of posters ::MonkeyShocked:: I miss you Finbar Poochy that was Mr X ::MonkeyCool:: Yup, good ole 'Mr X'. Blonde, what pics got out? I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) And one thing that is so sad too, is her body language. She knew the right things to do. Look at both her hands. They are both covering so she isn't slipped anything. And more than likely, that is exactly what happened later in the evening. She even knew Paulus was scuzzy. She's recoiling. Ugh. Absolutely disgusting. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 07:06:17 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. Personally I believe she was either murdered by or died in the presence of Joran van der Sloot in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005. I know you do, Klaas. And it's okay with me if people do think that. I guess for me, as long as there is no proof, I just don't wnat to give up on her. Maybe it's a long shot, but I still hope for a good ending to all of this. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Miss Scarlet on December 18, 2008, 07:10:23 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. No, sorry but I do not believe she's still with us. If there had been only a kidnapping/sex worker intent in the beginning, she became a liability due to the high profile. Pretty girl too - and smart. The only good from this so far is that she is with the Saviour. Oh, and Beth's Smart Travels, or whatever the official name is - I don't recall. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 07:17:20 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. No, sorry but I do not believe she's still with us. If there had been only a kidnapping/sex worker intent in the beginning, she became a liability due to the high profile. Pretty girl too - and smart. The only good from this so far is that she is with the Saviour. Oh, and Beth's Smart Travels, or whatever the official name is - I don't recall. In my heart I feel that is true. But, logically, I still cannot see the proof. I often look at the same evidence everyone else here sees and feel there is no hope. Then other times I think...there's just no solid proof yet, so why give up? Either way, I keep her in my prayers. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 18, 2008, 07:48:38 PM Destiny and ******* are currently moderators of an invite only forum, ChatnGrumble. Many current monkeys have been invited. I know who most of you are, you aren't fooling anyone. it sounds like it's apply named ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 07:49:01 PM Uh Oh. Did I shut the thread down?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 18, 2008, 07:50:56 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. Personally I believe she was either murdered by or died in the presence of Joran van der Sloot in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005. I concur. Too much says she never left that rock alive. If anyone knew she was - they would have been looking fer her themselves, not watching their country turn into a 5th world hovel. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 08:00:26 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 18, 2008, 08:05:40 PM Destiny and ******* are currently moderators of an invite only forum, ChatnGrumble. Many current monkeys have been invited. I know who most of you are, you aren't fooling anyone. You know Monkeys Administrators know everything, and if by chance they miss something while there're sleeping someone emails them all kinds of info, to give then the heads up.I know this for a fact. I have been an Admin on four Natalee sites. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 08:05:49 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 08:06:16 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 08:07:11 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I think there are a lot of possibilities. One that comes to mind was that she was in a coma or unconscious for some time. Someone could have called 911 for help. She may have been at the Sloot compound, neighbors, or elsewhere. Perhaps she came to at some point in time, and was battered about the head, resulting in her death much sooner than from alcohol/drug poisoning or overdose. Someone could have called for help. Only thing someone admitted to calling was a boat. Why someone wouldn't call 911, I have no idea. jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 08:08:32 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I personally feel she was in that cage. It is the only thing we have seen as solid evidence. Everything else was destroyed and this may well have been also. MO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 08:11:10 PM (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Animation2.gif) Johan you are as good with pictures as Klaas is. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 08:11:45 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I personally feel she was in that cage. It is the only thing we have seen as solid evidence. Everything else was destroyed and this may well have been also. MO Why in a cage (not far from a shipwreck) were everybody is diving ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 08:17:19 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I personally feel she was in that cage. It is the only thing we have seen as solid evidence. Everything else was destroyed and this may well have been also. MO Why in a cage (not far from a shipwreck) were everybody is diving ? If she was put in the shipwreck then I would say Joran and friends put her there. With the cage I would think higher ups put her there for safe keeping. Shipwreck would be where young pimps would have put her because it is familiar territory to them. Cage would be a warning and reminder to anyone using it as a postoffice. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 08:19:22 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 18, 2008, 08:23:26 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. The other girls can testify that he was in the casino Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 08:35:44 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. The other girls can testify that he was in the casino Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 08:38:18 PM I also remember reading along the way that Michael Posner hired private investigators early in the case, when Natalee went missing. Somehow, the name "Ernie Rizzo" from the Chicago area comes up.
Rizzo worked on some famous cases, including those associated with Henry Hyde, Bill Clinton, & Michael Jackson. An old Hyscience quote I saved - Quote Another side issue surfaced from a notorious poster, Proudredneck, claimed that the Twitty-Holloway phone at the Holiday Inn was wiretapped. Though no one proved or disproved the revelation, it did come across as possible. The wiretapper was said to be a PI working for Michael Posner. After Natalee went missing, the poster, Proudredneck, claimed the PI worked for the van der Sloots. In my prior interface with Proudredneck, I found him abrasive; however, he did seem to know what he was talking about. I would not immediately discount what he is saying, other than to acknowledge some form of distant allegiance between him and the Twitty-Holloway group. http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2005/10/harrytho_1014_n.php (http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2005/10/harrytho_1014_n.php) Looking back, I wonder if Posner has more information that has not been shared with anyone. I used to disregard him, and other posters pointed the finger his direction. Maybe he has a greater involvement than I previously thought? jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 08:46:25 PM Helloe, Memphis. Haven't seen you around much lately. Things a little warmer, though wetter, today. Hopefully we wil see a little sunshine soon. ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:00:35 PM Helloe, Memphis. Haven't seen you around much lately. Things a little warmer, though wetter, today. Hopefully we wil see a little sunshine soon. ::MonkeyCool:: Truthseeker2! Hi! I'm not here much anymore. Not that I don't want to be, but life seems to get away from me if I spend too much time at SM. ;) In fact, I just read about those cage pics yesterday. Whoa. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:07:30 PM Whiskeygirl: Quote I do not see an attempt to discredit Kermit or anyone. I see disagreement among posters. I do. Hotshot outright called a Kermit a fraud. I asked her to confirm that -- she said she in fact did. Hotshot has offered NOTHINg to support her claims. NOTHING.What I see are observations, pictures, speculation, and a lot of unknown missing information and facts. Those that review these things, ponder them, form many different conclusions. Different ideas from different points of view. The only value in discussing the posters is to take the focus off Aruba. I stand with the girl, and the finger is still pointing at Aruba. Doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not! jmho My bad, I must have missed that post. When I look at the sites that many posters are openly associated with, I seem much to corroborate what they post here at ScaredMonkeys. IIRC, there is a poster associated with "Aruba Dirty Police" at http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/ (http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/) last post December 14, 2008. Lots of stuff here, no cage/trap stuff this month. Why not? Natalee's Freebirds http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ (http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/) last post September 24, 2008. No cage/trap research here. Why not? Zoltan Zion, IIRC is associated with "Rob" - last post @ http://www.zoltanzion.blogspot.com/ July 16, 2008. No cage/trap research here, no updates for many months. Why not? I think its simply different conclusions by different people. Different points of view. No evidence that I am aware of to support any version. In the realm of speculation and conclusions, sometimes, I just have to go with what I can verify. Nothing at the three sites I consider the "go to" places. Monkeys still rock, just don't always understand the ups and downs... ::MonkeyEek:: jmho I'm just catching up with all of this and I'm trying to take a step back and look at the big picture, sotaspeak. In response to the bolded blue above, I ask also, why aren't those 'new' crab trap pics posted at any of the above mentioned blogspots? Why aren't they on the front page here at SM? Heck, they don' even have their own thread. I find that puzzling. Those pictures (the one with the bags and the one with the Natalee overlay, especially) are jaw dropping to say the least. Astonishing may be a better word. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 09:09:34 PM Helloe, Memphis. Haven't seen you around much lately. Things a little warmer, though wetter, today. Hopefully we wil see a little sunshine soon. ::MonkeyCool:: Truthseeker2! Hi! I'm not here much anymore. Not that I don't want to be, but life seems to get away from me if I spend too much time at SM. ;) In fact, I just read about those cage pics yesterday. Whoa. Yeah, it's been a little crazy here lately. Those pic certainly make you sit up and take notice. Who knows what will come of it all? I hope you can find the time to visit more often. :) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:15:28 PM I've been reading the posts from around the end of December last year, trying to get an idea of what was being said.
I found some interesting ones, especially from PI. How do I quote old posts and bring them over hear? From the things he was saying, there is no way that they trusted ALE to do the right thing. PI talked about the blood to chocolate phenom. I find it very hard to believe that all that time, effort and money was spent and then ALE was allowed to collect the samples without the good guys. Could it be possible that Kermit misinterpreted the secrecy, for lack of a better word, of Kyle about the sample retreival? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 18, 2008, 09:18:07 PM Whiskeygirl: Quote I do not see an attempt to discredit Kermit or anyone. I see disagreement among posters. I do. Hotshot outright called a Kermit a fraud. I asked her to confirm that -- she said she in fact did. Hotshot has offered NOTHINg to support her claims. NOTHING.What I see are observations, pictures, speculation, and a lot of unknown missing information and facts. Those that review these things, ponder them, form many different conclusions. Different ideas from different points of view. The only value in discussing the posters is to take the focus off Aruba. I stand with the girl, and the finger is still pointing at Aruba. Doesn't matter to me if anyone agrees with me or not! jmho My bad, I must have missed that post. When I look at the sites that many posters are openly associated with, I seem much to corroborate what they post here at ScaredMonkeys. IIRC, there is a poster associated with "Aruba Dirty Police" at http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/ (http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/) last post December 14, 2008. Lots of stuff here, no cage/trap stuff this month. Why not? Natalee's Freebirds http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/ (http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/) last post September 24, 2008. No cage/trap research here. Why not? Zoltan Zion, IIRC is associated with "Rob" - last post @ http://www.zoltanzion.blogspot.com/ July 16, 2008. No cage/trap research here, no updates for many months. Why not? I think its simply different conclusions by different people. Different points of view. No evidence that I am aware of to support any version. In the realm of speculation and conclusions, sometimes, I just have to go with what I can verify. Nothing at the three sites I consider the "go to" places. Monkeys still rock, just don't always understand the ups and downs... ::MonkeyEek:: jmho I'm just catching up with all of this and I'm trying to take a step back and look at the big picture, sotaspeak. In response to the bolded blue above, I ask also, why aren't those 'new' crab trap pics posted at any of the above mentioned blogspots? Why aren't they on the front page here at SM? Heck, they don' even have their own thread. I find that puzzling. Those pictures (the one with the bags and the one with the Natalee overlay, especially) are jaw dropping to say the least. Astonishing may be a better word. Hi, Memphis....Blonde started a separate thread for those pictures plus other pertinent information. I cannot say why it's not on other blogs...and some of them have been posted on the front page. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 09:19:08 PM Aruba needs a water park?
Quote Aruba unveils the Caribbean’s largest water park 18 December 2008 Kids of all ages can have a splashing time at Aruba’s newest and wettest attraction, Morgan’s Island Water Park, the largest of its kind in the Caribbean. The new $14 million US dollar water park opened to the public on December 5 2008, and features the ‘Dragon Revenge’ tower offering six different heart-stopping waterslides, toboggan rides, two and four person water-tube rides and two wave pools. Coming soon is the ‘Buccaneer Tower’ which will boast an impressive 21-meter vertical drop and will be the second tallest, second fastest, single-person, free-fall waterslide in the world! Younger children can spend time at the dedicated water-playground featuring smaller slides and water spouts. After the excitement, families can refuel at the Black Pearl, a self-service restaurant, the Jack Sparrow Bar or Treasure Chest coffee shop. Entrance to the water park costs $57 US dollars (around £37) for adults and $47 US dollars (around £31) for children aged 2-12 years. For more information visit arubamorgansisland.com. http://www.easier.com/view/Travel/Attractions_and_Events/article-223278.html (http://www.easier.com/view/Travel/Attractions_and_Events/article-223278.html) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 09:19:27 PM I've been reading the posts from around the end of December last year, trying to get an idea of what was being said. I found some interesting ones, especially from PI. How do I quote old posts and bring them over hear? From the things he was saying, there is no way that they trusted ALE to do the right thing. PI talked about the blood to chocolate phenom. I find it very hard to believe that all that time, effort and money was spent and then ALE was allowed to collect the samples without the good guys. Could it be possible that Kermit misinterpreted the secrecy, for lack of a better word, of Kyle about the sample retreival? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 09:22:43 PM I've been reading the posts from around the end of December last year, trying to get an idea of what was being said. I found some interesting ones, especially from PI. How do I quote old posts and bring them over hear? From the things he was saying, there is no way that they trusted ALE to do the right thing. PI talked about the blood to chocolate phenom. I find it very hard to believe that all that time, effort and money was spent and then ALE was allowed to collect the samples without the good guys. Could it be possible that Kermit misinterpreted the secrecy, for lack of a better word, of Kyle about the sample retreival? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:40...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? LOL. Okay...self edit in red. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:22:53 PM IMO, they found Natalee. She was just where Tim Miller thought she would be.
I cannot beleive that the Arubans were allowed to clean the trap alone. I am hoping that there were good guy divers that went down before the bad guy divers. I'm really, really hoping that's the secret and Kermit detected incorrectly the collusion of the good guys. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 18, 2008, 09:24:02 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I personally feel she was in that cage. It is the only thing we have seen as solid evidence. Everything else was destroyed and this may well have been also. MO Since ALE totally absconded with the samples from the trap, how will we ever know? Just take their word for it? We know what that is worth. I feel Natalee is definitely deceased because vd Straten said so and said he had seen the evidence and the reporter hadn't. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 09:24:46 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. The other girls can testify that he was in the casino If that were anyone other than Paulus, Aruba would have paraded the person around with a banner on his head. Instead they just say that the person has never been identified. Of course it is Paulus! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:28:27 PM thanks 2NJSons_Mom
thanks truthseeker Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 09:32:22 PM Well, there has been so much going on in the cage with all the 'discussions' about traps and pics and human remains. And who is posting where and with whom. At the risk of being totally annihilated on this fourm... I would like to ask if there is anyone left posting in the cage that believes there is a chance that Natalee could still be alive...or, at least left that sorry rock alive? Please don't trash me for asking. I personally feel she was in that cage. It is the only thing we have seen as solid evidence. Everything else was destroyed and this may well have been also. MO Since ALE totally absconded with the samples from the trap, how will we ever know? Just take their word for it? We know what that is worth. I feel Natalee is definitely deceased because vd Straten said so and said he had seen the evidence and the reporter hadn't. There is so much more that we haven't seen - the case file, the entire collection of casino tapes, and the collection of cage/trap videos/tapes/etc. So, there is much that remains hidden. I wonder how much would make more sense if people released more of those tapes? Perhaps released some data on other targets that match the trap? Maybe there are other images of the contents that prove one way or the other what was really in there? imho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:34:56 PM OK, here is my crude attempt at copying an old post...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 03:50:41 PM This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me. What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found? Turn it over to the Aruban authorities? Turn it over to the FBI? Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate Quote from: klaasend on December 30, 2007, 04:00:18 PM I would turn it over to the FBI and let the FBI deal with ALE. I wouldn't risk it disappearing with ALE. Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:28:00 PM I assume Beth has been given advice, which she is hopefully keeping to herself, but I tend to agree with you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:38:30 PM OK, I really do know that i comes before e and that hear is different than here. ::MonkeyConfused::
Where's that edit button when you need it? ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 18, 2008, 09:39:21 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. I would love to know who was at that roulette table that Guido worked that night. My guess is that person is the key to this mystery. 4:05 PM Anonymous said... Grey Whisper Who was at the roulette table? and did Guido work that table? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 18, 2008, 09:44:31 PM A few other things come to mind regarding Posner and the casino -
~ Early in the case, there was rumor/speculation that Posner disappeared that Monday and the following week after Natalee disappeared. I don't remember what the conclusion was about that. Misdirection? ~ Rumor/speculation that Natalee was kept prisoner in a hidden room somewhere in a hotel, casino, or other building. These seem to go along with the mask, and videotaping stories. ~ There was also rumor/speculation that a room somewhere (don't remember where) was redecorated unexpectedly after she disappeared. Some linked that to Natalee. I don't remember if there was any conclusion about that. I wonder if Posner was seen as a convenient scapegoat, and he did his own investigation to find out who was responsible. Also early in the case, it was suggested that JVDS was being followed as part of some other investigation. From what I remember posters suggested that some mystery people had it out for the son of a judge, and were just waiting for him to misstep. Along that line, I've always wondered if there really was some kind of documentation/investigation of JVDS by someone other than ALE. This comes to mind because of the picture scandal, porn movie rumors, flask/tingling lips, and "we did this 20 other times". jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:46:29 PM I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Truthseeker, you still here? I'm slow at this. One of Kyle's 'posts' said, "we sampled the cage". Those are bones bagged up. How can Tim Trahan just give a thumbs down and that be the end of it. I don't believe it. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. I just hope that something bigger hasn't been compromised here. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: COLOMBO on December 18, 2008, 09:46:46 PM I taped the Casino video from TV then took a picture of it, with my Camera. We all worked on Palus head all night till 2:00 AM You can see the light coming through my Mini Blinds. I sent this to Daves Tip line only. The next day it was everywhere. (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Casino/Nattalking.jpg) I wish we could have seen more footage of that security tape. The resemblance to that guy and Paulus, from what we can see, is just too much not to want to be sure. It looks so much like him, and the fact that this guy is seen talking to Natalee just hours before she disappeared would make any real investigator want to have a few words with him. Are there any pictures of PVDS and JVDS together that night? Any video of PVDS and others? From an historical perspective, it would be interesting to know who else of the widening circle of family and friends was at the casino that night, the night before, and the night after. From the video of JVDS and PVDS together, what WAS PVDS wearing that night? IIRC, JVDS claimed dad had memory problems and wouldn't remember what he wore the night before. What did good old DAD have on the night Natalee went missing? It seems odd that JVDS would even make a comment like that. "I can't remember." ::MonkeyShocked:: How many witnesses/suspects would people be able to identify in those videos from the casino? Same question for C&C? How many interesting people were there that night? IIRC, Monkeys and others also compared the arm and gold watch of this person at the table with Natalee to PVDS. JMHO There were also other girls in the casino at that table . Can't they say who "that man" was? Not just the other girls - I recall that Beth saw and recognized PVDS from the casino videos. They saw the video before the Alabama group went to the VDS compound. See bold below. My summary - Beth recognized PVDS from the video. Jug thought she was identifying JVDS. I think this episode comes up somewhere else as well. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/03/ng.01.html Quote GRACE: Let me get this straight. This is 3:00 a.m. and Natalee was last seen about 25, 26 hours before that? J. TWITTY: Exactly. And so one of the guys that helped us, with Universal Air, came running in and saying we`ve found him, we found the house, we found the car and everything, and Beth and I were just coming down. So we go and get two uniformed officers. We stopped at the police station. We go in and sit there and wait about 15 minutes out in the parking lot. Finally the police officers come out. We go to his house, which is maybe a mile away from the police station. The police pull up to his house, turn the lights on, you know, shine the spotlight, and about 15 minutes later here comes a gentleman walking out to the fence. Beth goes, "There he is." I said, "Beth, that`s not him, that`s a 45- year-old man." GRACE: When we get back, we`re going to pick up right where we left off, where Jug and Beth meet for the first time Joran Van Der Sloot and his father, the judge, in Aruba. I would love to know who was at that roulette table that Guido worked that night. My guess is that person is the key to this mystery. 4:05 PM Anonymous said... Grey Whisper Who was at the roulette table? and did Guido work that table? Simian Says: June 22nd, 2005 at 4:50 pm Some people on the other side of the pond know more than what they are saying. There testimony, there’s security footage, there are witnesses. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 18, 2008, 09:49:57 PM Hello Fellow Monkeys!!
Klaas, I feel I owe you an apology. I posted last night and said something like "where is everybody". I did not mean anything by that comment. I know that Monkeys are dilligent about keeping this case alive and getting to the truth. As far as the private forums go, I am totally oblivious to that. I have never been invited to one, (no one likes me ::MonkeyWaa::) LOL I really don't care who does or who doesn't like me or my posts. I do not want to hurt someone's feelings intentionally though and for that I apologize if I did. Sooooooooo, enough with that. I will try to read and catch up when I really want you guys to give me an update!! LOL ::MonkeyRoll:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 09:50:05 PM In an honest investigation, most certainly a copy of the casino tapes would have been supoenaed by the prosecuting attorney. Seems elementary to me...
::MonkeyConfused:: :?: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 18, 2008, 09:54:14 PM Colombo - to your post above (too many nested quotes so thought I'd stop!)
One would think that Hero Brinkman would start with the witnesses in the Netherlands, right? Especially Guido Wever. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 09:58:55 PM Quote from: private eye on December 26, 2007, 10:42:00 PM
I need to get to bed, but it is hard to quit surfing for info:) Hopefully the Persistence will confirm or eliminate the water disposal method. There is a "normal" crematorium on the island, and not just a hospital incinerator I understand, and Renee operated both. Beth claims his wife is not incarcerated but I thought she was being detained. Didn't Renee also work at the refinery? If so he wasn't the piece of trash as the Aruban's dismissed him as upon his discovery. I will see everyone tomorrow:))))))))) PS They never could have forseen the Persistence and hence the water grave would seem fool proof at those depths Exactly. They never would have thought a Persistence would be sent. Also, those involved in the search knew they were looking for a crap trap and knew just about where it was. :smt102 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 18, 2008, 09:59:08 PM WhiskeyGirl:
I snipped this from your post>>> Also early in the case, it was suggested that JVDS was being followed as part of some other investigation. From what I remember posters suggested that some mystery people had it out for the son of a judge, and were just waiting for him to misstep. >>>>>>>>>>>>> I have wondered about this alot. In a previous conversation with Kermit I was asking about the tennis shoe and why would Kyle give the tennis shoe to the FBI. Kermit responded with "exactly, he is just a boatman". I have no idea what that all meant but it has always bothered me. Also, Kermit mentioned how better to keep someone from talking or blame someone than to leave evidence such as the shoe (implying it was JORANs) in the cage with Natalee. This still puzzles me. ::MonkeyEek:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 09:59:48 PM The other girls can testify that he was in the casino If that were anyone other than Paulus, Aruba would have paraded the person around with a banner on his head. Instead they just say that the person has never been identified. Of course it is Paulus! I agree !!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 09:59:55 PM I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Truthseeker, you still here? I'm slow at this. One of Kyle's 'posts' said, "we sampled the cage". Those are bones bagged up. How can Tim Trahan just give a thumbs down and that be the end of it. I don't believe it. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. I just hope that something bigger hasn't been compromised here. What is bigger than finding Natalee, Memphis? What could have been compromised? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 18, 2008, 10:01:05 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 18, 2008, 10:11:21 PM MumInOhio,
Your post was included, not to incriminate you or imply you were involved in any way, just more as your analysis was so right on, it was very good is all. Sorry if it offended you in any way. I just took notice of your post and put it in my post is all. Nothing more. MuffyBee was correct. The use of G_d's name is respect in the Jewish religion. I use it always. Although, I am not Jewish. SS, (http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/muppet/images/thumb/2/2f/MerylSheep.jpg/300px-MerylSheep.jpg) croak Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 10:12:33 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. Thanks, Kermit. I will get right on it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 18, 2008, 10:13:17 PM I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Truthseeker, you still here? I'm slow at this. One of Kyle's 'posts' said, "we sampled the cage". Those are bones bagged up. How can Tim Trahan just give a thumbs down and that be the end of it. I don't believe it. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. I just hope that something bigger hasn't been compromised here. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. Me either. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 10:13:27 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. THANK-YOU!!!! From Memphis: Quote OK, here is my crude attempt at copying an old post... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 03:50:41 PM This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me. What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found? Turn it over to the Aruban authorities? Turn it over to the FBI? Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate Quote from: klaasend on December 30, 2007, 04:00:18 PM I would turn it over to the FBI and let the FBI deal with ALE. I wouldn't risk it disappearing with ALE. Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:28:00 PM I assume Beth has been given advice, which she is hopefully keeping to herself, but I tend to agree with you. This tells me PI KNEW ABOUT THE TRAP on the December 30TH!!!! Klaas advised him NOT to trust ALE!!!!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 10:13:42 PM Are there methods and/or angles for another (more honest) law enforcement agency (FBI) to assist, compliant with jurisdictional issues? Aruba has fought tooth and nail to keep others out of this investigation. Most countries would welcome help...
By the way, thank you for your most insightful information !!! I am "all ears" when you speak. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 10:16:12 PM Kermit, Are there methods and/or angles for another (more honest) law enforcement agency (FBI) to assist, compliant with jurisdictional issues? Aruba has fought tooth and nail to keep others out of this investigation. Most countries would welcome help... By the way, thank you for your most insightful information !!! I am "all ears" when you speak. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 10:17:17 PM Thank you Kermit! I will be working on emails right away.
::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 10:17:31 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. It's about time. I was just getting ready to post if we want to start distributing these photo's and emails, info, etc gathered to WHO-Greta, Nancy, newspapers. Just did not know what to do. Would Beth and Dave be against this and would we be hurting anything they are doing? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 10:21:01 PM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. WHAT IS THE EMAIL ADDRESS TO SEND TO? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 10:22:17 PM Magnolia,
I've only been reading and trying to catch up since yesterday, so I may have missed some important tidbits, but there are only two conclusions that I can come to at this point. The first is that what Kermit is saying is completely true. Meaning that the ALE had sole access to the remains in the trap and turned in bogus samples to the FBI; that the search team (Silvetti, Kyle) was crooked and acted illegally; that all hopes for Natalee's family to have closure may have been dashed. The second option is that perhaps Kermit misinterpreted or misunderstood what was going on; that those involved with the search were on the up and up and finding Natalee was their focus; that those involved knew how ALE would handle the find (turn blood into chocolate) and retrieved proof that it was Natalee in the trap before the Aruba divers went down; that the remains were turned over to our FBI and for whatever purpose, this has been withheld from the public and from Aruba. I know I'm probably not communicating this as well as I would like. Kermit, is it possible that you misinterpreted something? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 18, 2008, 10:22:33 PM O.K. I am calling it a night (but before I do I have to post something so I can hit 1000 post mark ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: )
Thanks Kermit. I will set down and send a email. Good night. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 10:25:06 PM Special Agent in Charge
Carmen S. Adams Assistant Special Agent in Charge Charles E. Regan Birmingham Division History Birmingham Division Contact Information Address 1000 18th Street North Birmingham, Alabama 35203 Telephone (205)326-6166 Facsimile (205)279-1590 General information: birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Office Hours 8:15 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday 24 Hour Emergency Service How to Report a Crime or Provide Information For the location of a local FBI office, see our Jurisdiction page An FBI representative can be reached 24 hours a day by calling (205)326-6166 If you have been the victim of a crime or have information relating to a crime, please contact your nearest FBI office. All complaints are confidential. You can also email the Birmingham office at birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 18, 2008, 10:25:36 PM O.K. I am calling it a night (but before I do I have to post something so I can hit 1000 post mark ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ) Thanks Kermit. I will set down and send a email. Good night. Good night Blue Moon, and congrats on your first one thousand posts ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 10:27:37 PM Special Agent in Charge Great work Magnolia, thanks!Carmen S. Adams Assistant Special Agent in Charge Charles E. Regan Birmingham Division History Birmingham Division Contact Information Address 1000 18th Street North Birmingham, Alabama 35203 Telephone (205)326-6166 Facsimile (205)279-1590 General information: birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Office Hours 8:15 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday 24 Hour Emergency Service How to Report a Crime or Provide Information For the location of a local FBI office, see our Jurisdiction page An FBI representative can be reached 24 hours a day by calling (205)326-6166 If you have been the victim of a crime or have information relating to a crime, please contact your nearest FBI office. All complaints are confidential. You can also email the Birmingham office at birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 10:28:51 PM O.K. I am calling it a night (but before I do I have to post something so I can hit 1000 post mark ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ) Thanks Kermit. I will set down and send a email. Good night. Congrats on your 1000 Blue Moon Ky! I hope you're feeling better! Goodnight! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 18, 2008, 10:30:13 PM MumInOhio, Your post was included, not to incriminate you or imply you were involved in any way, just more as your analysis was so right on, it was very good is all. Sorry if it offended you in any way. I just took notice of your post and put it in my post is all. Nothing more. MuffyBee was correct. The use of G_d's name is respect in the Jewish religion. I use it always. Although, I am not Jewish. SS, (http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/muppet/images/thumb/2/2f/MerylSheep.jpg/300px-MerylSheep.jpg) croak MumInOhio. Any idea which post Kermit is referring to here? BUCKSHOT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 10:31:40 PM There's also another email address for Carmen Adams at this site. It's from a 2005 advisory board so I won't post the information in case it's obsolete. But if we don't get anywhere with the other one, it might not hurt to try!
http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/aln/lecc_advisory_board.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 10:33:10 PM OK, here is my crude attempt at copying an old post... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 03:50:41 PM This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me. What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found? Turn it over to the Aruban authorities? Turn it over to the FBI? Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate Quote from: klaasend on December 30, 2007, 04:00:18 PM I would turn it over to the FBI and let the FBI deal with ALE. I wouldn't risk it disappearing with ALE. Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:28:00 PM I assume Beth has been given advice, which she is hopefully keeping to herself, but I tend to agree with you. This tells me PI KNEW ABOUT THE TRAP on the December 30TH!!!! Klaas advised him NOT to trust ALE!!!!!!! [/quote] Right, Wreck, but in addition it seems to me that perhaps the family had been contemplating what they would do if she was found, and PI was throwing it out to us to see what we would say. My point being that the question of what to do if she is found was definately being discussed. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 10:34:51 PM I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Truthseeker, you still here? I'm slow at this. One of Kyle's 'posts' said, "we sampled the cage". Those are bones bagged up. How can Tim Trahan just give a thumbs down and that be the end of it. I don't believe it. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. I just hope that something bigger hasn't been compromised here. Yeah, still here. Just off doing some research. Trying to follow the money. I saw the post of Kyle's. I would like to hear more about what was happening onboard the ship at 15:40. Who saw that part of the ROV video on the monitors...60 seconds after the thumbs down? Did the Dateline people see it? Did Tim Miller see it? If that really looked like human remains at that point, how could someone have not spoken up right then? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 10:35:18 PM OK, here is my crude attempt at copying an old post... [/color]-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 03:50:41 PM This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me. What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found? Turn it over to the Aruban authorities? Turn it over to the FBI? Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate Quote from: klaasend on December 30, 2007, 04:00:18 PM I would turn it over to the FBI and let the FBI deal with ALE. I wouldn't risk it disappearing with ALE. Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:28:00 PM I assume Beth has been given advice, which she is hopefully keeping to herself, but I tend to agree with you. I THINK THIS IS REALLY PERTINENT -- PI KNEW ABOUT THE REMAINS BEING FOUND ON DEC 30TH!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 10:39:22 PM OK, here is my crude attempt at copying an old post... [/color]-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 03:50:41 PM This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me. What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found? Turn it over to the Aruban authorities? Turn it over to the FBI? Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate Quote from: klaasend on December 30, 2007, 04:00:18 PM I would turn it over to the FBI and let the FBI deal with ALE. I wouldn't risk it disappearing with ALE. Quote from: private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:28:00 PM I assume Beth has been given advice, which she is hopefully keeping to herself, but I tend to agree with you. I THINK THIS IS REALLY PERTINENT -- PI KNEW ABOUT THE REMAINS BEING FOUND ON DEC 30TH!! YES YES YES! He knew. They had a plan. They knew ALE turns blood into chocolate. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 10:41:08 PM I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? I don't know how to "bring a post over". I usually just copy and paste the test into the new thread. I still don't know what to think about all of this. I am still waiting for an answer to why we see a thumbs down at 15:39 on 12/30 and then a shot at 15:40 that could be human remains is seen. Those divers had to be looking at the same thing we see in the shot at 15:30...so why thumbs down? What did they see? I pretty sure one of those divers is Tim Trahan. If those were human remains...what should we think about Tim T.? Truthseeker, you still here? I'm slow at this. One of Kyle's 'posts' said, "we sampled the cage". Those are bones bagged up. How can Tim Trahan just give a thumbs down and that be the end of it. I don't believe it. I also don't believe that those pictures were written off by Dave, Beth, Jug, etc. as nothing. No way. I just hope that something bigger hasn't been compromised here. Yeah, still here. Just off doing some research. Trying to follow the money. I saw the post of Kyle's. I would like to hear more about what was happening onboard the ship at 15:40. Who saw that part of the ROV video on the monitors...60 seconds after the thumbs down? Did the Dateline people see it? Did Tim Miller see it? If that really looked like human remains at that point, how could someone have not spoken up right then? Kermit, can you answer this? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 10:48:06 PM private eye on December 30, 2007, 06:30:32 PM
They will have dateline onboard and I understand that they were involved in the Titantic so I assume they have the expertise to preserve any remains or artifacts and have a protocol. They can always find and locate it, call for assistance and then retrieve it. But that is my fear that they imediately turn it over to Aruba where her remains can become that of a large crab:) .......................................................................... The continued coverup by Aruba was anticipated. After all of the effort and expense of the search, and after Aruba's actions were anticipated, am I to believe that the search was thwarted and Aruba suceeded in covering up once again? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 11:04:49 PM Magnolia, I've only been reading and trying to catch up since yesterday, so I may have missed some important tidbits, but there are only two conclusions that I can come to at this point. The first is that what Kermit is saying is completely true. Meaning that the ALE had sole access to the remains in the trap and turned in bogus samples to the FBI; that the search team (Silvetti, Kyle) was crooked and acted illegally; that all hopes for Natalee's family to have closure may have been dashed. The second option is that perhaps Kermit misinterpreted or misunderstood what was going on; that those involved with the search were on the up and up and finding Natalee was their focus; that those involved knew how ALE would handle the find (turn blood into chocolate) and retrieved proof that it was Natalee in the trap before the Aruba divers went down; that the remains were turned over to our FBI and for whatever purpose, this has been withheld from the public and from Aruba. I know I'm probably not communicating this as well as I would like. Kermit, is it possible that you misinterpreted something? 1250 Natalee Holloway / LCD Archive / Re: Natalee Case Discussion #709 12/30 « Quote from: private eye on December 31, 2007, 07:37:36 PM I apologize for my last post, but the reality of that cage just hit me. I understand that Beth has reached a decision as to what she is going to do, and she is keeping it to herself. And I understand that she said that even that decision is subject to change. Not much info but I think that is the truth. Quote from: Magnolia on December 31, 2007, 07:42:30 PM You never know what you'll do until you are faced with the situation. That is why it is so wrong to say "I would have done this or that." You just don't know until the occassion arises. Quote from: private eye on December 31, 2007, 07:44:53 PM After all that has transpired, I can't believe I got ill looking at the cage of all things. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 11:07:17 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department
is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 11:09:22 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 11:10:48 PM Truthseeker,
FWIW, on December 31st, PI answered a question of mine with, "Dateline is onboard". ...................... Quote from: memphis on December 31, 2007, 07:41:33 PM Thank you for responding. Is it true that NBC is on board? Quote from: private eye on December 31, 2007, 07:42:43 PM Dateline is on board. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 18, 2008, 11:14:21 PM Well, goodnight everyone.
I for one hope that Kermit is mistaken. :( Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 18, 2008, 11:16:05 PM Well, goodnight everyone. I for one hope that Kermit is mistaken. :( Goodnight, Memphis. It was good to have you back in the cage! :) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 18, 2008, 11:16:31 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 11:36:04 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. I agree Magnolia. I went to the State Department Blog page and there was an article about her travels that asked where we would like to see her go for her final trip. I spent quite a bit of time making a request for her to go to Aruba and then decided to erase it and go look at newspapers. Like you, I think she just wants out of there; plus in my opinion she had a chance to help and I didn't see anything positive come from it. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 11:42:22 PM 12/18/2008 Bondia
http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12182008Bondia12-13a02.jpg) snipped this from the two page article: (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12182008Bondia12-13a03.jpg) Papiamentu/Portugese Translation: Holloway case and governor of Illinois also plays past owing to the topic of Natalee Holloway, and the form with media MERICAN owing to aruba illustrates, in one form unnecessarily negative, without less of the pain of the family feel is Motib Holloway is disappereance of the din an child. come across Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 11:42:34 PM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage..
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 11:43:01 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. I agree Magnolia. I went to the State Department Blog page and there was an article about her travels that asked where we would like to see her go for her final trip. I spent quite a bit of time making a request for her to go to Aruba and then decided to erase it and go look at newspapers. Like you, I think she just wants out of there; plus in my opinion she had a chance to help and I didn't see anything positive come from it. JMO Maybe a final plea to President Bush before he leaves office would be in order. It sure would look better for him than "Presidential Pardons". Maybe a a Public condemnation of Aruba and a "Travel Advisory". Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 11:44:19 PM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. I think Kermit covered that the other night with her postings on Posner and organized crime on Aruba.Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 18, 2008, 11:49:49 PM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. I think Kermit covered that the other night with her postings on Posner and organized crime on Aruba.Follow the money?They know how to not exist in Aruba.Via the internet.How to follow the money? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 18, 2008, 11:52:00 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. I agree Magnolia. I went to the State Department Blog page and there was an article about her travels that asked where we would like to see her go for her final trip. I spent quite a bit of time making a request for her to go to Aruba and then decided to erase it and go look at newspapers. Like you, I think she just wants out of there; plus in my opinion she had a chance to help and I didn't see anything positive come from it. JMO Maybe a final plea to President Bush before he leaves office would be in order. It sure would look better for him than "Presidential Pardons". Maybe a a Public condemnation of Aruba and a "Travel Advisory". Wreck, I've been considering writing Bush again too. It's ironic to me that the last time I wrote was pleading for assistance with the Persistence search so that it wouldn't be called off due to lack of funding. When Air Force 1 was spotted in Aruba shortly after, I felt sure I'd made an impact! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 18, 2008, 11:56:41 PM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. I agree Magnolia. I went to the State Department Blog page and there was an article about her travels that asked where we would like to see her go for her final trip. I spent quite a bit of time making a request for her to go to Aruba and then decided to erase it and go look at newspapers. Like you, I think she just wants out of there; plus in my opinion she had a chance to help and I didn't see anything positive come from it. JMO Maybe a final plea to President Bush before he leaves office would be in order. It sure would look better for him than "Presidential Pardons". Maybe a a Public condemnation of Aruba and a "Travel Advisory". Wreck, I've been considering writing Bush again too. It's ironic to me that the last time I wrote was pleading for assistance with the Persistence search so that it wouldn't be called off due to lack of funding. When Air Force 1 was spotted in Aruba shortly after, I felt sure I'd made an impact! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 12:01:46 AM The only email address that I can find for the State Department is: www.state.gov Maybe TM can find a better one. I checked Magnolia, the only thing I found was a link on the page where you could fill in the boxes and email. No address. It is a confusing page...to me. Maybe we should send to Condoleeza Rice, but I think at this point she just wants out of there. I agree Magnolia. I went to the State Department Blog page and there was an article about her travels that asked where we would like to see her go for her final trip. I spent quite a bit of time making a request for her to go to Aruba and then decided to erase it and go look at newspapers. Like you, I think she just wants out of there; plus in my opinion she had a chance to help and I didn't see anything positive come from it. JMO Maybe a final plea to President Bush before he leaves office would be in order. It sure would look better for him than "Presidential Pardons". Maybe a a Public condemnation of Aruba and a "Travel Advisory". Wreck, I've been considering writing Bush again too. It's ironic to me that the last time I wrote was pleading for assistance with the Persistence search so that it wouldn't be called off due to lack of funding. When Air Force 1 was spotted in Aruba shortly after, I felt sure I'd made an impact! ::MonkeyWink:: Thanks for the correction. ::MonkeyConfused:: Yes, I'd really hoped the same. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 12:24:34 AM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. WHAT IS THE EMAIL ADDRESS TO SEND TO? Address 1000 18th Street North Birmingham, Alabama 35203 Telephone (205)326-6166 Facsimile (205)279-1590 General information: birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Office Hours 8:15 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday 24 Hour Emergency Service http://birmingham.fbi.gov/ ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Puzzler on December 19, 2008, 12:30:01 AM Did you guys seet this posted on Gretawire tonight?
December 18th, 2008 10:45 PM Eastern Natalee Holloway Movie! by Greta Van Susteren Check this out!! a viewer / GretaWire blogger sent me this! a movie! (And no, I don’t know anything more about this movie than what I read in this article) Access Exclusive: ‘Family Ties’ Actress Tapped To Play Natalee Holloway’s Mom FIRST PUBLISHED: December 18, 2008 1:54 PM EST LAST UPDATED: December 18, 2008 3:08 PM EST LOS ANGELES, Calif. — The tragic tale of Natalee Holloway is coming to Lifetime and actress Tracey Pollan has been tapped to play the mother of the teen who vanished during a trip to Aruba, Access Hollywood has confirmed. Pollan will star as Natalee’s mother, Beth Twitty, in the movie based on Twitty’s book, “Loving Natalee: A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith.” Pollan, who is married to Michael J. Fox, is best known for her stint alongside her husband as his recurring love interest Ellen Reed on the 1980s sitcom “Family Ties.” She has also had guest spots on “Spin City” and “Law & Order: SVU,” for which she received an Emmy nomination. Pollan and Fox, who married in 1988, also shared the screen in the 1988 film “Bright Lights, Big City.” Based on the harrowing true story of Natalee which captured huge national media attention – an Alabama teen who vanished during her senior class trip to Aruba — the film will focus largely on Twitty’s relentless efforts to uncover the truth behind her daughter’s disappearance. “The Natalee Holloway Story” will air in April 2009 on Lifetime Movie Network. Production is slated to begin in South Africa in January. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 12:31:53 AM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. Paulass is a$$ deep in money laundering and fixing government contracts that allow posner to operate businesses in aruba.....Follw the money... ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 12:35:18 AM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. Paulass is a$$ deep in money laundering and fixing government contracts that allow posner to operate businesses in aruba.....Follow the money... ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 12:41:08 AM Goodnight everyone! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 12:42:40 AM US State Department
OVERSEAS CITIZENS SERVICES: Call 1-888-407-4747 (from overseas: 202-501-4444) for answers related to questions concerning the: * Death of an American citizen abroad * Arrest/detention of an American citizen abroad * Robbery of an American citizen abroad * American citizens missing abroad * Crisis abroad involving American citizens * After-hours number for an emergency involving an American citizen abroad To ask a question via email: http://contact-us.state.gov/cgi-bin/state.cfg/php/enduser/ask.php?p_sid=jxOHQJlj&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPSZwX3NvcnRfYnk9JnBfZ3JpZHNvcnQ9JnBfcm93X2NudD0xMTEsMTExJnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT1hbnN3ZXJzLnNlYXJjaF9ubCZwX3BhZ2U9MQ** Copy and paste the bold HTTP Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 12:44:20 AM Goodnight everyone! ::MonkeyCool:: Night all - as well! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 12:51:00 AM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. Paulass is a$$ deep in money laundering and fixing government contracts that allow posner to operate businesses in aruba.....Follow the money... ::MonkeyCool:: So we assume Paulus is the "Laundry Man"?Where did Paulus learn his trade?Gotta start his internship somewhere! ::MonkeyLaugh:: "If" Paulus,and or his good buddies are Posner's business partner..Be curious to who these Hotel owners business partners are "If" there not Aruban citizens?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 12:51:39 AM Goodnight everyone! ::MonkeyCool:: Night all - as well! Goodnight Wreck.Say hello to Clay. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 12:52:53 AM (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/ScreenShot003a.jpg) JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 12:59:39 AM Can I say one more thing? I know our numbers are dwindling here -- this is very frustrating for everyone. For the ones left here who haven't fled for other forums, I would sure like a word of wisdom from Red. Are we on the right path? You have been VERY quiet - I hope it is because you know things you can't discuss. If we are totally off base here -- please say so. It has been 3 - going on 4 years -- I feel like we are spinning our wheels. You know something? I'm a 50 year-old male who has NEVER got involved with something like this. I don't know why I was brought here ( and can't believe I'm STILL here ) but it is an obsession. It is totallly out of my character to be at this type forum. Anybody I have confided to that I follow this case think I'm nuts. I've been snapping at people here lately, and I don't like it. Please throw us a bone!!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 01:01:25 AM US State Department It was easy to submit a question on the site:OVERSEAS CITIZENS SERVICES: Call 1-888-407-4747 (from overseas: 202-501-4444) for answers related to questions concerning the: * Death of an American citizen abroad * Arrest/detention of an American citizen abroad * Robbery of an American citizen abroad * American citizens missing abroad * Crisis abroad involving American citizens * After-hours number for an emergency involving an American citizen abroad To ask a question via email: http://contact-us.state.gov/cgi-bin/state.cfg/php/enduser/ask.php?p_sid=jxOHQJlj&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPSZwX3NvcnRfYnk9JnBfZ3JpZHNvcnQ9JnBfcm93X2NudD0xMTEsMTExJnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT1hbnN3ZXJzLnNlYXJjaF9ubCZwX3BhZ2U9MQ** Copy and paste the bold HTTP My question: Secretary Rice met with the mother (Beth Holloway Twitty) of Natalee Holloway WRT her daughter's disappearance May 30th, 2005. Secretary Rice, after hearing Beth's account of the lack of investigation by the Aruban authorities, directed that the FBI take a closer look into the events surrounding her daughter's disappearance. Can you please provide an update of the actions our State Department, Secretary Rice, and the FBI have taken to ensure there is/will be Justice for Natalee Holloway, a US citizen? Thank you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 01:04:11 AM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. Paulass is a$$ deep in money laundering and fixing government contracts that allow posner to operate businesses in aruba.....Follow the money... ::MonkeyCool:: So we assume Paulus is the "Laundry Man"?Where did Paulus learn his trade?Gotta start his internship somewhere! ::MonkeyLaugh:: "If" Paulus,and or his good buddies are Posner's business partner..Be curious to who these Hotel owners business partners are "If" there not Aruban citizens?? I forgot to add: MHOO... ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 19, 2008, 01:04:58 AM Can I say one more thing? I know our numbers are dwindling here -- this is very frustrating for everyone. For the ones left here who haven't fled for other forums, I would sure like a word of wisdom from Red. Are we on the right path? You have been VERY quiet - I hope it is because you know things you can't discuss. If we are totally off base here -- please say so. It has been 3 - going on 4 years -- I feel like we are spinning our wheels. You know something? I'm a 50 year-old male who has NEVER got involved with something like this. I don't know why I was brought here ( and can't believe I'm STILL here ) but it is an obsession. It is totallly out of my character to be at this type forum. Anybody I have confided to that I follow this case think I'm nuts. I've been snapping at people here lately, and I don't like it. Please throw us a bone!! Wreck - I know Red isn't online right now. I took the liberty of emailing him the link to your post and let him know you directed a question his way. Hopefully he'll respond here in the forum after he reads your questions. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 01:07:58 AM Can I say one more thing? I know our numbers are dwindling here -- this is very frustrating for everyone. For the ones left here who haven't fled for other forums, I would sure like a word of wisdom from Red. Are we on the right path? You have been VERY quiet - I hope it is because you know things you can't discuss. If we are totally off base here -- please say so. It has been 3 - going on 4 years -- I feel like we are spinning our wheels. You know something? I'm a 50 year-old male who has NEVER got involved with something like this. I don't know why I was brought here ( and can't believe I'm STILL here ) but it is an obsession. It is totallly out of my character to be at this type forum. Anybody I have confided to that I follow this case think I'm nuts. I've been snapping at people here lately, and I don't like it. Please throw us a bone!! Wreck - I know Red isn't online right now. I took the liberty of emailing him the link to your post and let him know you directed a question his way. Hopefully he'll respond here in the forum after he reads your questions. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: finngirl on December 19, 2008, 01:14:30 AM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound. IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool. There are windows that face outside the compound. There are all those roads and paths. I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house. What good would that do? So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed. Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties. Through the gate, window, or just over the fence. It doesn't look like there is much lighting. jmho if that pic was wider (toward the right?) I think we would see Freddy's then-residence the condo/townhouse: 37 F or 39 F ... which AG looked for but couldn't find on the friday night Freddy was arrested Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 01:28:35 AM Can I say one more thing? I know our numbers are dwindling here -- this is very frustrating for everyone. For the ones left here who haven't fled for other forums, I would sure like a word of wisdom from Red. Are we on the right path? You have been VERY quiet - I hope it is because you know things you can't discuss. If we are totally off base here -- please say so. It has been 3 - going on 4 years -- I feel like we are spinning our wheels. You know something? I'm a 50 year-old male who has NEVER got involved with something like this. I don't know why I was brought here ( and can't believe I'm STILL here ) but it is an obsession. It is totallly out of my character to be at this type forum. Anybody I have confided to that I follow this case think I'm nuts. I've been snapping at people here lately, and I don't like it. Please throw us a bone!! Wreck....I have never been on any blog before Natalee Holloway....but was fortunately lucky enough to find SM early on.....What attracted me to this case? I'm not sure....but I am a 59 yr old male (Not to be confused with a 99 yr old ROBOT ::MonkeyLaugh::) I have three teenage daughters, the oldest (18 in 2005) of which campaigned hard with my dear wife and me to go to Aruba with a friend on spring break (Mar 2005). We said no at the time. [didn't think it was a smart idea to let her go--I'm an old navy submarine sailor and the thought of my daughter being on any island w/o her parents was a no-no-knowing what every (ok most) young men try to do with any young girl}. That said, when I heard of a missing American teenage daughter missing in Aruba in June of 2005, I was hooked on this case and have wanted Justice for Natalee and prosecution of the perps/and those that have covered up, ever since... This case opened my eyes to the real possibilities that harm may come to those we love in the seemly most safe places! My wife and I could have just as easily said yes to my daughter if she had been traveling to Aruba with her classmates and trusted chaperons...my heart and prays go out to Natalee's family always... I truly believe this time that Beth/Dave/JQK have a plan in place to demand Justice for Natalee. The silence from most of our trusted agents only encourages me more to that end. That is why I lurk every day (twice on Sundays ::MonkeyWink::) to follow the latest news..... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 19, 2008, 01:48:20 AM me again....
I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 19, 2008, 01:51:09 AM Well, goodnight everyone. I for one hope that Kermit is mistaken. :( Goodnight, Memphis. It was good to have you back in the cage! :) Obviously, I can't stay away tonight. ;) Thanks for the friendly shout out truthseeker2. It's always nice when you're not ignored by everyone. ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 02:02:05 AM Well, goodnight everyone. I for one hope that Kermit is mistaken. :( Goodnight, Memphis. It was good to have you back in the cage! :) Obviously, I can't stay away tonight. ;) Thanks for the friendly shout out truthseeker2. It's always nice when you're not ignored by everyone. ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: snoopy on December 19, 2008, 02:04:35 AM You are never ignored memphis. I'm jsut really multi-tasking. It's good to see you.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 02:08:09 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 02:20:01 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 02:25:03 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Was just trying to understand what Memphis was implying?Billb?Your thoughts Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 02:45:12 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Was just trying to understand what Memphis was implying?Billb?Your thoughts Memphis opened her post with: I'm so confused. WRT to the meaning of her post, I'm confused too. Giving her the benefit of doubt, maybe she is asking questions based on her catching up reading? I read most if not all of what she says she has been reading up on, and my conclusions differ from what her conclusions seem to be, based on her questions. Memphis, I know your are reading my reply, so I don't want you to take my comments as derogatory. Please clarify want you are implying. Thanks, billb Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 02:48:30 AM Well, goodnight everyone. I for one hope that Kermit is mistaken. :( Goodnight, Memphis. It was good to have you back in the cage! :) Obviously, I can't stay away tonight. ;) Thanks for the friendly shout out truthseeker2. It's always nice when you're not ignored by everyone. ::MonkeyWink:: You are never ignorned Memphis. I saw you post earlier and was going to say hello then I decided not to post and bother you. Everyone has such great thoughts, questions and contribute so much to the conversation that I just chose to read rather than replying. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 02:49:15 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Was just trying to understand what Memphis was implying?Billb?Your thoughts Memphis opened her post with: I'm so confused. WRT to the meaning of her post, I'm confused too. Giving her the benefit of doubt, maybe she is asking questions based on her catching up reading? I read most if not all of what she says she has been reading up on, and my conclusions differ from what her conclusions seem to be, based on her questions. Memphis, I know your are reading my reply, so I don't want you to take my comments as derogatory. Please clarify what you are implying. Thanks, billb Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 02:58:24 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Was just trying to understand what Memphis was implying?Billb?Your thoughts Memphis opened her post with: I'm so confused. WRT to the meaning of her post, I'm confused too. Giving her the benefit of doubt, maybe she is asking questions based on her catching up reading? I read most if not all of what she says she has been reading up on, and my conclusions differ from what her conclusions seem to be, based on her questions. Memphis, I know your are reading my reply, so I don't want you to take my comments as derogatory. Please clarify what you are implying. Thanks, billb I definitley understand the confusion!I would be more then willing to hear what Kyle has to say.That's my only hope in regards to the cage,as well as the contents.I pray that there were people on the Persistence that we are unaware of.At this point do i believe that?No.I hope i'm wrong.. ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 19, 2008, 03:04:18 AM Hey wreck,
The fact that this story is still in the news, with another morsel of hope to get something lit coming in January, is a success in reality. Every single person who has told another person about this story in any manner, whether they choose to write, speak, blog, join forums or whatever is contributing. And it's the Holidays, which have become more humbling since this crime has grabbed some of us, like you. But you know, it's possible that having hope is one of 2 options. The other is knowing the truth and finally putting this case to rest. But I think that is going to be a painful, much more painful experience than anyone can imagine. I mean you remember the Death Wish movies? Nobody is going to be applauding the end of this case. I just think the truth is going to be nauseating even beyond what we've seen. Tell those people who don't understand that at least your doing something about one thing, than nothing about everything. That attitude protects the criminals. And the reason I don't post anything about the cage is that from the beginning I always felt the dirty police, the cover up and what happened to Natalee while she was on the island was controlled by 3 people, Janssen, van der straaten and van der sloot. If that was Natalee in the cage it doesn't open that many scenarios. I want to know exactly when she left Aruba, dead or alive. I know it wasn't in the first 48 hours. You don't create a 10 cover up if Natalee was taken off the island right away. I mean if the dirty police need to give THEMSELVES 10 days, it must be bad, too many involved. The only way to stay in the story is to take breaks, and connect with others regardless of the forum. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 19, 2008, 03:05:47 AM Sunday, December 14, 2008 Alfonso Riveroll: Lost in Transition http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/ Frank, I'm always late to the diner table, hence the late response to your commentary... GREAT POST...Justice for Natalee! THANK YOU SIR.... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: crazybabyborg on December 19, 2008, 03:17:45 AM OK, caught up again! I just wanted to drop this off for Kermit to use when things get REALLY frustrating for her, ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Klowe on December 19, 2008, 04:06:43 AM Here's the deal. Neither Kyle or Capslock have been banned. They are welcome to post rebuttles to anything Kermit is posting. I'm all for hearing both sides of the story. It's not like it's going to harm the investigation. After this long I doubt anything can hurt the investigation. Klaas, It is very suspicious to me that both Caps and Kyle became so quiet after Kermit's exposure. Anyone who was reading/posting at the time Kermit posted the "secret" pics knows what a true revelation they were, and we all saw Kyles own posts about the situation, which proved that Kermit and Kyle had been in communications about these pics. We all read where Kyle was discouraging Kermit from posting THE TRUTH. We all saw Kyle post that it was his "last" post on this forum. That just made him look more guilty to me. I am pissed that we still have people trying to hide the truth, and protecting those that are guilty of murder and corruption. I am pissed that they use good honest people like Tim Miller to try to win our trust to further their own agenda or financial gain. It is very sad and sickening. I am pissed that some people start private cliques/forums, taking knowledge that they have gained from this forum, and actually thinking they know more than the most intelligent monkeys. Then they have the audacity to come to this forum to correct or rather discredit those same monkeys when it is obvious we are learning a lot of truths that they wanted to keep secret and hidden. They should give it up, we won't stop till we get to the truth and expose all of the corruption. I don't see how some people can honestly expect us to believe that they stand with the girl. Thanks to all of the pure hearts on this board for working so hard towards the truth. Red, Klaas, Kermit, and all the others who have put so much time and effort into research and putting that info on here for me and others to learn and read about this. It's all about Natalee and I hope in time we can see the family gain some kind of closure and find some peace. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 19, 2008, 04:21:07 AM me again.... I'm so confused. In the Search thread on Dec 04 at 11:20 am, Blonde has this posted from Kermit. private eye beth's brother March 20, 2008 Kyle I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, Kyle- I emailed Beth your concerns and have suggested to her that she contact the appropriate people on the Persistence, including yourself, and attempt to reconcile as best they can the material the crew saw recovered from the cage versus what they received. I specifically mentioned the blue denim and the fact that would be the material of which the skirt was made, and reminded her that the press release said that the material did not match her blouse. I also pointed out that in the December 30 photo there appeared to be a skull and in the January 7, it did not look at all like a skull. But I did think I noticed a second object in one of the zip lock bags that could possibly be the object that resembled a skull, possibly. I am a little amazed that the denim looks remarkably NOT deteriorated. Mostly I was trying to pique her interest to get her to contact the appropriate people. I think Dave worked closely with the owner of the boat, so he may well have already done this. But I know Beth appreciates the heads up, as do I. You are a good man. I did tell her my main concern was that you were concerned, and that I respect and trust your judgment enough for her to investigate this. Thanks. PI is seeing a picture with an object in a zip lock bag? Huh? I thought the picture with the bags was not seen by anyone until now. Please, someone fill me in if I'm mistaken. So you believe Kyle turned the photographs over in a timely fashion?Is that safe to say Memphis? Was just trying to understand what Memphis was implying?Billb?Your thoughts Memphis opened her post with: I'm so confused. WRT to the meaning of her post, I'm confused too. Giving her the benefit of doubt, maybe she is asking questions based on her catching up reading? I read most if not all of what she says she has been reading up on, and my conclusions differ from what her conclusions seem to be, based on her questions. Memphis, I know your are reading my reply, so I don't want you to take my comments as derogatory. Please clarify want you are implying. Thanks, billb Can't believe I'm still awake. I'm going out of town tomorrow, so I better answer now in case I don't have a chance for a while. I am just grabbling at the moment and haven't come to any conclusions, except that I believe that Natalee's remains were in that crab trap. I'm trying to think critically, but it's difficult when you only have bits and pieces. The only two options I see at this moment are, 1. that Kermit is on the money, or 2. that Kermit came to a premature and incorrect conclusion I am hoping that just maybe the crew outsmarted Aruba this time and sampled the cage themselves prior to ALE. The secrecy involved might have caused Kermit to come to the wrong conclusion. Does that make sense? Do I need to further elaborate? I'm not attacking or saying anything negative against Kermit, Kyle or anyone. I will admit that I am hoping that senario #2 above is the correct one, but I have not come to any conclusions at this point. Regarding the quote I posted, I understood that the picture with the "zip lock" bags holding evidence were not given to any in Natalee's family or the FBI. However, PI is commenting on them, so obviously he has seen some picture with the collected remains in the bags. Yes, I am pointing out that maybe Kermit was incorrect. I'm not trying to discredit Kermit, just hoping she/he is wrong. What conclusion have you come to BillB? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: memphis on December 19, 2008, 04:26:52 AM Trying to be as plain as I can, I am hoping that the family, in conjuction with the crew of the Persistance, decided on closure rather than evidence that leads to prosecution. I'm hoping that they choose to sample the cage and have it sent to our FBI without Aruba knowing. I am hoping that this was kept secret to prevent those who helped from getting into any kind of trouble and that the secrecy and shrouding appeared as something quite different and was misunderstood by Kermit.
Not saying it's so. Just hoping. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 05:39:29 AM A few other things come to mind regarding Posner and the casino - ~ Early in the case, there was rumor/speculation that Posner disappeared that Monday and the following week after Natalee disappeared. I don't remember what the conclusion was about that. Misdirection? ~ Rumor/speculation that Natalee was kept prisoner in a hidden room somewhere in a hotel, casino, or other building. These seem to go along with the mask, and videotaping stories. ~ There was also rumor/speculation that a room somewhere (don't remember where) was redecorated unexpectedly after she disappeared. Some linked that to Natalee. I don't remember if there was any conclusion about that. I wonder if Posner was seen as a convenient scapegoat, and he did his own investigation to find out who was responsible. Also early in the case, it was suggested that JVDS was being followed as part of some other investigation. From what I remember posters suggested that some mystery people had it out for the son of a judge, and were just waiting for him to misstep. Along that line, I've always wondered if there really was some kind of documentation/investigation of JVDS by someone other than ALE. This comes to mind because of the picture scandal, porn movie rumors, flask/tingling lips, and "we did this 20 other times". jmho WhiskeyGirl...Going from memory here...I believe it was a room in the Holiday Inn and have even seen it posted as Natalee's room. Please don't take this as gospel as I believe Beth stayed in Natalee's room. Also have seen it posted that Natalee's room was changed. Apparently, according to Posner's lawyer, he was not in Aruba that night. May have been a FP post...Will see if I can find it for you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 05:44:30 AM MumInOhio, Your post was included, not to incriminate you or imply you were involved in any way, just more as your analysis was so right on, it was very good is all. Sorry if it offended you in any way. I just took notice of your post and put it in my post is all. Nothing more. MuffyBee was correct. The use of G_d's name is respect in the Jewish religion. I use it always. Although, I am not Jewish. SS, (http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/muppet/images/thumb/2/2f/MerylSheep.jpg/300px-MerylSheep.jpg) croak Kermit...Whew!....Thank You...I am so relieved! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 05:53:56 AM MumInOhio, Your post was included, not to incriminate you or imply you were involved in any way, just more as your analysis was so right on, it was very good is all. Sorry if it offended you in any way. I just took notice of your post and put it in my post is all. Nothing more. MuffyBee was correct. The use of G_d's name is respect in the Jewish religion. I use it always. Although, I am not Jewish. SS, (http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/muppet/images/thumb/2/2f/MerylSheep.jpg/300px-MerylSheep.jpg) croak MumInOhio. Any idea which post Kermit is referring to here? BUCKSHOT Buckshot...This is it...From Kermit's post 12/17/2008 on Page 46 of the previous thread. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4239.msg588188#msg588188 #1468 on: May 07, 2008, 05:28:28 AM muminohio When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle. There is nothing wrong with that, I personally have spent a lot of time and posts sharing any information I had or could find. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.msg379700#msg379700 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 06:06:22 AM Why would Posner do Paulus such a favor as not allowing those videotapes to be reviewed?All those Hotels and Casino's should have a plethora of video footage.. Paulass is a$$ deep in money laundering and fixing government contracts that allow posner to operate businesses in aruba.....Follow the money... ::MonkeyCool:: So we assume Paulus is the "Laundry Man"?Where did Paulus learn his trade?Gotta start his internship somewhere! ::MonkeyLaugh:: "If" Paulus,and or his good buddies are Posner's business partner..Be curious to who these Hotel owners business partners are "If" there not Aruban citizens?? The Holiday Inn is owned by the Lionstone Group - Miami. They wanted to build the Ritz Carlton, which fell through. Not sure id that had anything to do with them building a Ritz in South Beach or not, but their partner in that venture was Flag Luxury Properties of New York. Not sure who the partner would have been in the Ritz Aruba. I found something a while back from Aruba's Department of Immigration and Naturaliztion, DINA, that after 10 years foreigners can buy businesses. So Posner could have had a US partner, or their may be provisions for developers. I recalled this after seeing that the casino's Registry item was updated in 2007. This would have been the 10 year time limit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:09:03 AM A few other things come to mind regarding Posner and the casino - ~ Early in the case, there was rumor/speculation that Posner disappeared that Monday and the following week after Natalee disappeared. I don't remember what the conclusion was about that. Misdirection? ~ Rumor/speculation that Natalee was kept prisoner in a hidden room somewhere in a hotel, casino, or other building. These seem to go along with the mask, and videotaping stories. ~ There was also rumor/speculation that a room somewhere (don't remember where) was redecorated unexpectedly after she disappeared. Some linked that to Natalee. I don't remember if there was any conclusion about that. I wonder if Posner was seen as a convenient scapegoat, and he did his own investigation to find out who was responsible. Also early in the case, it was suggested that JVDS was being followed as part of some other investigation. From what I remember posters suggested that some mystery people had it out for the son of a judge, and were just waiting for him to misstep. Along that line, I've always wondered if there really was some kind of documentation/investigation of JVDS by someone other than ALE. This comes to mind because of the picture scandal, porn movie rumors, flask/tingling lips, and "we did this 20 other times". jmho WhiskeyGirl...Going from memory here...I believe it was a room in the Holiday Inn and have even seen it posted as Natalee's room. Please don't take this as gospel as I believe Beth stayed in Natalee's room. Also have seen it posted that Natalee's room was changed. Apparently, according to Posner's lawyer, he was not in Aruba that night. May have been a FP post...Will see if I can find it for you. Since when do we believe a dirty rotton lying lawyer that his client who is a known murderer was not in Aruba. Now with that said I'm not saying Posner had anything to do with Natalee's disappearance because I feel the main suspects Joran/Kalpoes/Paulus were the cause of her death. Posner not being in Aruba well let's just say I think they are FOS. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:19:20 AM Have a great day everyone.
We are all here for Natalee. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 06:26:58 AM A few other things come to mind regarding Posner and the casino - ~ Early in the case, there was rumor/speculation that Posner disappeared that Monday and the following week after Natalee disappeared. I don't remember what the conclusion was about that. Misdirection? ~ Rumor/speculation that Natalee was kept prisoner in a hidden room somewhere in a hotel, casino, or other building. These seem to go along with the mask, and videotaping stories. ~ There was also rumor/speculation that a room somewhere (don't remember where) was redecorated unexpectedly after she disappeared. Some linked that to Natalee. I don't remember if there was any conclusion about that. I wonder if Posner was seen as a convenient scapegoat, and he did his own investigation to find out who was responsible. Also early in the case, it was suggested that JVDS was being followed as part of some other investigation. From what I remember posters suggested that some mystery people had it out for the son of a judge, and were just waiting for him to misstep. Along that line, I've always wondered if there really was some kind of documentation/investigation of JVDS by someone other than ALE. This comes to mind because of the picture scandal, porn movie rumors, flask/tingling lips, and "we did this 20 other times". jmho WhiskeyGirl...Going from memory here...I believe it was a room in the Holiday Inn and have even seen it posted as Natalee's room. Please don't take this as gospel as I believe Beth stayed in Natalee's room. Also have seen it posted that Natalee's room was changed. Apparently, according to Posner's lawyer, he was not in Aruba that night. May have been a FP post...Will see if I can find it for you. Since when do we believe a dirty rotton lying lawyer that his client who is a known murderer was not in Aruba. Now with that said I'm not saying Posner had anything to do with Natalee's disappearance because I feel the main suspects Joran/Kalpoes/Paulus were the cause of her death. Posner not being in Aruba well let's just say I think they are FOS. I agree San...Posner was there, way too convenient for me...Just posting that his lawyer said he wasn't. Maybe he did hightail it out of there the next day and that is how any of the video got out. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 06:41:22 AM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound. IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool. There are windows that face outside the compound. There are all those roads and paths. I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house. What good would that do? So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed. Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties. Through the gate, window, or just over the fence. It doesn't look like there is much lighting. jmho if that pic was wider (toward the right?) I think we would see Freddy's then-residence the condo/townhouse: 37 F or 39 F ... which AG looked for but couldn't find on the friday night Freddy was arrested Hi Fin...Strange she couldn't find it, wasn't it? Johan...Can you also add #62 as well. I am not sure when they moved, I think the 2005 Chamber records have 62, but will have to check and it will take me forever to find it in my stuff, as last I check they had removed those records. Thanks in Advance. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 06:45:19 AM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound. IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool. There are windows that face outside the compound. There are all those roads and paths. I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house. What good would that do? So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed. Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties. Through the gate, window, or just over the fence. It doesn't look like there is much lighting. jmho if that pic was wider (toward the right?) I think we would see Freddy's then-residence the condo/townhouse: 37 F or 39 F ... which AG looked for but couldn't find on the friday night Freddy was arrested Hi Fin...Strange she couldn't find it, wasn't it? Johan...Can you also add #62 as well. I am not sure when they moved, I think the 2005 Chamber records have 62, but will have to check and it will take me forever to find it in my stuff, as last I check they had removed those records. Thanks in Advance. add #62 ??? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 06:55:14 AM Hey wreck, The fact that this story is still in the news, with another morsel of hope to get something lit coming in January, is a success in reality. Every single person who has told another person about this story in any manner, whether they choose to write, speak, blog, join forums or whatever is contributing. And it's the Holidays, which have become more humbling since this crime has grabbed some of us, like you. But you know, it's possible that having hope is one of 2 options. The other is knowing the truth and finally putting this case to rest. But I think that is going to be a painful, much more painful experience than anyone can imagine. I mean you remember the Death Wish movies? Nobody is going to be applauding the end of this case. I just think the truth is going to be nauseating even beyond what we've seen. Tell those people who don't understand that at least your doing something about one thing, than nothing about everything. That attitude protects the criminals. And the reason I don't post anything about the cage is that from the beginning I always felt the dirty police, the cover up and what happened to Natalee while she was on the island was controlled by 3 people, Janssen, van der straaten and van der sloot. If that was Natalee in the cage it doesn't open that many scenarios. I want to know exactly when she left Aruba, dead or alive. I know it wasn't in the first 48 hours. You don't create a 10 cover up if Natalee was taken off the island right away. I mean if the dirty police need to give THEMSELVES 10 days, it must be bad, too many involved. The only way to stay in the story is to take breaks, and connect with others regardless of the forum. I totally agree...They needed to June 9th...Why! To get the cover-up in place. I believe she was at the van der Sloot's and that she was moved a couple of times. I also think we have too many possibilities - the shallow grave, the plastic bag, the rocks to name a few. I just don't know which ones are the right ones. Is it possible that the dogs got hits on another body, not Natalee's. Were the hits in the landfill on belongings with DNA? Makes me wonder if the radar and electricity going out on June 8th. was to add more confusion...the possibility that she was taken out to sea. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 07:02:22 AM Sorry Johan...We are trying to see where Freddy's house is in relation the Joran's. The Chamber records showed 39F or G? and 62.
We have been told repeatedly that Freddy lived at the back of Joran. The diagrams that Caps provided us in Shango didn't show it this way. That is why we would like you to see if you can spot these on a mp for us. I think we have tried this before and we couldn't get any where with it... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Nut44x4 on December 19, 2008, 08:03:37 AM checked in earlier, all quiet. Need to go out till about noon. Later.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 08:27:08 AM Sorry Johan...We are trying to see where Freddy's house is in relation the Joran's. The Chamber records showed 39F or G? and 62. We have been told repeatedly that Freddy lived at the back of Joran. The diagrams that Caps provided us in Shango didn't show it this way. That is why we would like you to see if you can spot these on a mp for us. I think we have tried this before and we couldn't get any where with it... here is a wider g shot (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/SLOOTkopie-1.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 08:40:58 AM Memphis,
It will take going back to ALL of Kermit's posts to look at the timeline. Basicly, Kermit is saying Kyle (and the Persistence crew) withheld the photos taken Dec. 29th through Jan. 7th until late March '08. Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: RoxiBalboa on December 19, 2008, 09:01:56 AM On E!, Monday 12/29 10pm est. "Final Hours: Natalee Holloway"
(tv guide denotes it as "new", but may be something we've seen before) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 09:04:10 AM On E!, Monday 12/29 10pm est. "Final Hours: Natalee Holloway" (tv guide denotes it as "new", but may be something we've seen before) Thanks, Roxi. Good morning to all. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 09:09:14 AM Memphis, It will take going back to ALL of Kermit's posts to look at the timeline. Basicly, Kermit is saying Kyle (and the Persistence crew) withheld the photos taken Dec. 29th through Jan. 7th until late March '08. Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. How do you know this? : Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. Or is it a rumour ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 09:18:23 AM Memphis, It will take going back to ALL of Kermit's posts to look at the timeline. Basicly, Kermit is saying Kyle (and the Persistence crew) withheld the photos taken Dec. 29th through Jan. 7th until late March '08. Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. How do you know this? : Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. Or is it a rumour ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 09:41:52 AM Was there a diver with a photocamera to make pictures in december ?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 10:10:04 AM Was there a diver with a photocamera to make pictures in december ? The first pictures were taken with a ROV. Actual Divers went down on the 29th for the "Dateline" special. I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV.Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 10:15:05 AM Was there a diver with a photocamera to make pictures in december ? The first pictures were taken with a ROV. Actual Divers went down on the 29th for the "Dateline" special. I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV.yes this is a ROV (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/ROV2_small.jpg) (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/sampler2_small.gif) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 10:16:27 AM Was there a diver with a photocamera to make pictures in december ? The first pictures were taken with a ROV. Actual Divers went down on the 29th for the "Dateline" special. I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV.yes this is a ROV (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/ROV2_small.jpg) (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/sampler2_small.gif) All data are logged on the surface systems and stored on DVD’s. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 10:24:53 AM Was there a diver with a photocamera to make pictures in december ? The first pictures were taken with a ROV. Actual Divers went down on the 29th for the "Dateline" special. I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV.yes this is a ROV (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/ROV2_small.jpg) (http://woodshole.er.usgs.gov/operations/sfmapping/images/sampler2_small.gif) All data are logged on the surface systems and stored on DVD’s. It is time consuming, but you really need to read ALL of Kermit's posts. The timeline, personal conversations between Kermit and Kyle, and pictures are all there. It is quite disturbing. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 10:43:33 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special?
To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 10:48:51 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special? "Dateline" is an American news documentary show that was ON the Persistence and documented the Persistence's serach. Have you not followed any of this? I can answer 1 question at a time, but you really need to get up to speed.To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 10:50:57 AM I ask this because the Persistence used the "Herculean side scan sonar"
And a sonar makes only "acoustic images" Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 10:50:59 AM Memphis, It will take going back to ALL of Kermit's posts to look at the timeline. Basicly, Kermit is saying Kyle (and the Persistence crew) withheld the photos taken Dec. 29th through Jan. 7th until late March '08. Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. How do you know this? : Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. Or is it a rumour ? Johan...there is a post by Kyle that he was on the east coast at he time of the Dateline show to try and sell them to raise funds for the Persistence. IIRC this was around February 22nd... I will see if I can find that post as I don't have my notes My internet is going in and out with all the weather between us and the server so it may take a while Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 10:57:26 AM Memphis, It will take going back to ALL of Kermit's posts to look at the timeline. Basicly, Kermit is saying Kyle (and the Persistence crew) withheld the photos taken Dec. 29th through Jan. 7th until late March '08. Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. How do you know this? : Kyle tried to SELL these photos to TV networks back in February. Or is it a rumour ? Johan...there is a post by Kyle that he was on the east coast at he time of the Dateline show to try and sell them to raise funds for the Persistence. IIRC this was around February 22nd... I will see if I can find that post as I don't have my notes My internet is going in and out with all the weather between us and the server so it may take a while ok thanks MumiOhio ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:03:14 AM If you don't want to search for Kermit's posts, look at Tamikosmom's posts -- she recaps and summarizes all of Kermit's posts and quotes from Kyle.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 11:03:15 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special? "Dateline" is an American news documentary show that was ON the Persistence and documented the Persistence's serach. Have you not followed any of this? I can answer 1 question at a time, but you really need to get up to speed.To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? I have followed it yes but i can't read everything . For me is important if there are any pics in high resolution . In my opinion you can't sell low res pics to a tv station or magazine Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 19, 2008, 11:05:52 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special? "Dateline" is an American news documentary show that was ON the Persistence and documented the Persistence's serach. Have you not followed any of this? I can answer 1 question at a time, but you really need to get up to speed.To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? I have followed it yes but i can't read everything . For me is important if there are any pics in high resolution . In my opinion you can't sell low res pics to a tv station or magazine I put all info here Pictures ROV links to Dateline http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:06:02 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special? "Dateline" is an American news documentary show that was ON the Persistence and documented the Persistence's serach. Have you not followed any of this? I can answer 1 question at a time, but you really need to get up to speed.To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? I have followed it yes but i can't read everything . For me is important if there are any pics in high resolution . In my opinion you can't sell low res pics to a tv station or magazine Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:07:00 AM Wreck and what is the "Dateline" special? "Dateline" is an American news documentary show that was ON the Persistence and documented the Persistence's serach. Have you not followed any of this? I can answer 1 question at a time, but you really need to get up to speed.To make pics with a normal video camera or photocamera ? I have followed it yes but i can't read everything . For me is important if there are any pics in high resolution . In my opinion you can't sell low res pics to a tv station or magazine I put all info here Pictures ROV links to Dateline http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 11:09:27 AM Wreck said : I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV.
But i think the photos we have seen are not acoustic images ,but they took them with a video camera ( stills ) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 11:10:49 AM Quote Memphis
am just grabbling at the moment and haven't come to any conclusions, except that I believe that Natalee's remains were in that crab trap. I'm trying to think critically, but it's difficult when you only have bits and pieces. The only two options I see at this moment are, 1. that Kermit is on the money, or 2. that Kermit came to a premature and incorrect conclusion I am hoping that just maybe the crew outsmarted Aruba this time and sampled the cage themselves prior to ALE. The secrecy involved might have caused Kermit to come to the wrong conclusion. Does that make sense? Do I need to further elaborate? I'm not attacking or saying anything negative against Kermit, Kyle or anyone. I will admit that I am hoping that senario #2 above is the correct one, but I have not come to any conclusions at this point. Regarding the quote I posted, I understood that the picture with the "zip lock" bags holding evidence were not given to any in Natalee's family or the FBI. However, PI is commenting on them, so obviously he has seen some picture with the collected remains in the bags. Yes, I am pointing out that maybe Kermit was incorrect. I'm not trying to discredit Kermit, just hoping she/he is wrong. Nice to see you...Thanks for your posts last night... There was a post of Hostshot's a little while back where she was asked if it was possible for both Kermit and another poster to be both right. She said "Yes". Sorry, I don't recall who the other poster was in the discussions.Maybe you could search Hotshot's posts for those discussions. Kermie...Is at all possible that you have followed the wrong path on this? Is there any room for misintepretation... The reason I ask...Yourself and some who have argued the other side of this have always been very respected posters here.We have posters strongly expressing that you are correct, when just a few months ago they were on the opposite side of the fence regarding Kyle and Caps and were strongly defending their positions at that time as well. They were sure they were right then...They are sure they are right now! ::MonkeyConfused:: Thanks in Advance... Good Morning! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 11:24:18 AM Wreck said : I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV. But i think the photos we have seen are not acoustic images ,but they took them with a video camera ( stills ) I think you may be correct. Some of the photos were taken from the Dateline video, iirc. Blonde may know for sure. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:27:59 AM Wreck said : I believe we have only seen photos taken by the ROV. But i think the photos we have seen are not acoustic images ,but they took them with a video camera ( stills ) I think you may be correct. Some of the photos were taken from the Dateline video, iirc. Blonde may know for sure. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MumInOhio on December 19, 2008, 11:33:14 AM Johan...[/b...Sorry lost the link and it will take me all day at this rate to find it... ::MonkeyWaa::
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #736 2/27 - « Reply #544 on: February 29, 2008, 12:28:32 AM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from: ******* on February 29, 2008, 12:14:22 AM Quote from: coolhand on February 29, 2008, 12:00:09 AM Maybe Mr Schafer can sell the television rights to the remainder of the search to one of the networks so they can raise enough money to finish the search, and possibly recoup his own money. Any thoughts? Welcome to the cage coolhand! I am sure Mr.Schafer,The Family and everyone involved by now has looked at all measures to conclude the mission but your idea is a good one. Hopefully a Ross Perot type as stepped up to the plate so the Persistence can finish what they started. [/quote Quote OE This is a very good idea. We've been working on that for a couple weeks. I've personally been handling the matter while I was on the east coast last week. Unfortunately, the Dateline story aired along with Greta and scooped up the remainder of what the press felt was immediately worth reporting on. I can't blame them. It's business. Definitely shot that down though. Move on. Deal with it. Stay the course. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 11:51:24 AM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his
posts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:59:33 AM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 01:37:07 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I think we were conned by Caps and at least John Silvetti. I think Tim Miller was conned as well. They needed Tim in the "new witness" story to make it seem believable. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 01:42:53 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I think we were conned by Caps and at least John Silvetti. I think Tim Miller was conned as well. They needed Tim in the "new witness" story to make it seem believable. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 01:43:53 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his posts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I tend to agree, Magnolia. I don't believe Joran chopped anybody into little pieces. I also dug up Lorenzo's entire driveway once having been assured that was where Natalee was as well. JUST KIDDING!!! But the stories have changed with information supplied HERE and not coming from Aruba, etc. too often. The Kalpoes parents don't own a motel, either. And Shango and Simian are like fortune cookies, they can be made to apply to just about anything. I think that was the idea from the beginning. Nothing has really changed from what we knew from the first two weeks, IMO. We don't know for a fact that is Natalee in that fish trap, either. While I agree the contents were mishandled, it may not have even been her in the first place. And we warned repeatedly that ALE would make anything disappear. They have consistently done that and it is well documented. So if the remains were not Natalee, it doesn't matter so much what happened to them. If they were Natalee, it is very crucial and the family has been wronged tremendously. I still see a blue service cap. I wonder if that is the only fabric that was in the trap because it is in the chest section of Natalee when superimposed over the contents of the trap. Kyle said the fabric he spoke of was in the area where the skirt would be leading me to think there were two sets of blue fabric recovered. Just to add to the confusion. . . . . . . . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 02:01:15 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his posts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I tend to agree, Magnolia. I don't believe Joran chopped anybody into little pieces. I also dug up Lorenzo's entire driveway once having been assured that was where Natalee was as well. JUST KIDDING!!! But the stories have changed with information supplied HERE and not coming from Aruba, etc. too often. The Kalpoes parents don't own a motel, either. And Shango and Simian are like fortune cookies, they can be made to apply to just about anything. I think that was the idea from the beginning. Nothing has really changed from what we knew from the first two weeks, IMO. We don't know for a fact that is Natalee in that fish trap, either. While I agree the contents were mishandled, it may not have even been her in the first place. And we warned repeatedly that ALE would make anything disappear. They have consistently done that and it is well documented. So if the remains were not Natalee, it doesn't matter so much what happened to them. If they were Natalee, it is very crucial and the family has been wronged tremendously. I still see a blue service cap. I wonder if that is the only fabric that was in the trap because it is in the chest section of Natalee when superimposed over the contents of the trap. Kyle said the fabric he spoke of was in the area where the skirt would be leading me to think there were two sets of blue fabric recovered. Just to add to the confusion. . . . . . . . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 02:03:35 PM I am not sure what my monitor is, Wreck. It is LCD, liquid crystal with the sort of soft screen?
Guess that would be digital? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 02:12:16 PM I am not sure what my monitor is, Wreck. It is LCD, liquid crystal with the sort of soft screen? Easiest way to tell would be the plug in the back -- is it a "DVI" adapter or "VGA" -- Your computer's video card would be the key. If it capable of "DVI" (that's digital)Guess that would be digital? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 02:16:24 PM It is Hansol Model H550. I don't know about all that stuff, Wreck. I think it uses NVIDIA GForce something or other for video? Supposed to play games well and is Media Center PC.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 02:19:36 PM I am not sure what my monitor is, Wreck. It is LCD, liquid crystal with the sort of soft screen? Guess that would be digital? My screen is old timey, but I can see what I believe to be a cap. I wonder if that cap might have been put in the cage to implicate the security guards, when Aruba was offering them up as the killers. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 02:24:30 PM NVIDIA, the NVIDIA logo, Digital Vibrance Control, ForceWare, GeForce, GoForce, MXM, Quadro, nView, NVRotate, PowerMizer, PureVideo, Quadro, Quincunx Antialiasing, SLI, SmartDimmer, and TwinView are trademarks or registered trademarks of NVIDIA Corporation.
Microsoft, Microsoft Windows, DirectX, and Direct3D are either registered trademarks or trademarks of Microsoft Corporation in the United States and/or other countries. OpenGL and the oval logo are trademarks or registered trademarks of Silicon Graphics, Inc. in the United States and/or other countries worldwide. PCI Express, PCI-SIG and the PCI-SIG design marks are registered trademarks and/or service marks of PCI-SIG. Conexant is a trademark of Conexant Systems, Inc. HDMI, the HDMI logo and High-Definition Multimedia Interface are trademarks or registered trademarks of HDMI Licensing LLC. That's all it says that I find. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 03:09:34 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands.
With that said..... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 03:11:16 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I think we were conned by Caps and at least John Silvetti. I think Tim Miller was conned as well. They needed Tim in the "new witness" story to make it seem believable. I agree with your post Magnolia. The only part I disagree with was being conned by Caps. I was never conned. Once I don't agree with what a poster is saying I basically don't follow what they have to say anymore. This is a fault of mine in life. I basically tune the person out. Others have strong feelings about him and the work he has done and that is fine. We can't all agree. I did the same thing when Patrick released the tape of him and Joran in the car. I never trusted Patrick and always thought he was a lowlife. This is just my opinion. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 03:13:22 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... San doesn't take to kindly to threats. You stay safe Kermit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 03:15:18 PM Kyle sent me this today
Kermit, You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB. Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted. Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum. The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case. I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding: I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired. I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record. Birmingham is not the office in charge. The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee. I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed. I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. Sincerely, Kyle From Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 From Kyle: May 8, 2008: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kyle stated: "neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.120 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 03:19:08 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... San doesn't take to kindly to threats. You stay safe Kermit. Thank you San. I will do my best. Very sad. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 19, 2008, 03:19:26 PM discussions on Aruba between the Dutch/Aruban/Antilles delegations from January 5th to January 9th.
http://www.tweedekamer.nl/nieuws/persberichten/parlementair_overleg_koninkrijksrelaties_2009.jsp no word yet on whether Aruba is going to allow Brinkman in or not. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 03:21:02 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... San doesn't take to kindly to threats. You stay safe Kermit. Thank you San. I will do my best. Very sad. Maybe if he sue's you Kermit we could find out his side of the story W/O him hiding behind the cloak of secrecy..Not that i'd want you to be sued Kermit.Kyle would then have to speak... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 03:52:12 PM PERHAPS KYLE VIOLATED THE COPYRIGHT HIMSELF
Kyle said: "She [BETH] needs to know exactly what we found in the proper timing. The way to do that would be through Tim Trahan and I. I can arrange any meeting with him. He represents the owner and the rights to the data, in this case, Louis S. I have everything but I don't want to go around him for chain of custody reasons, professional courtesy, and friendship." The next step: I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed. He certainly is a planner [edited to protect the individual] needs to be called and ask to request the removal of the post by either her or PI to Klaas. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 03:53:13 PM Kyle sent me this today Kermit, You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB. Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted. Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum. The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case. I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding: I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired. I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record. Birmingham is not the office in charge. The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee. I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed. I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. Sincerely, Kyle From Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 From Kyle: May 8, 2008: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kyle stated: "neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.120 The FBI told him to keep quiet and he still opened his fat mouth. So basically what he is saying the people he posted with in the private forum don't mean squat. Why is he worrying about people who don't mean squat to him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 19, 2008, 03:53:27 PM Pietersz is appointed PG. not care taker PG, but real PG.
so i guess Croes-Fernandes has her pension now. http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/2839183/__Nieuwe_procureur-_generaal_Aruba__.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 03:56:03 PM From Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Notice the date. SM Sunday, November 23, 2008 1:38 PM From:"Kyle Kingman" I have recently been in contact with the FBI (within the last two weeks). They do know what I know in full. This is in their hands and in the hands of Beth. I pulled out of SM because I don't want to cause any more problems, not because of you. I respect all that you have done thus far and don't want that to be jeopardized now. There's a lot of people who respect your opinions. Let's leave that intact. All the best, ~K This took place AFTER the evidence was given to the FBI and not by Kyle Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 03:59:44 PM God Bless you Kermit!Thank You... ::MonkeyDance::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 04:01:41 PM Klyes email: I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.
From Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 From Kyle: May 8, 2008: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4179.msg557660#msg557660 Kyle stated: "neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge." http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4209.120 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 04:02:30 PM God Bless you Kermit!Thank You... ::MonkeyDance:: Thank you for your kind words. It means a lot. It ain't easy being green. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Kermit on December 19, 2008, 04:03:09 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 04:05:33 PM God Bless you Kermit!Thank You... ::MonkeyDance:: Thank you for your kind words. It means a lot. It ain't easy being green. It's good to know that there are voices speaking for those who have no voice! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 04:10:29 PM Does anyone continue to get upset at this situation as i do??It's just beyond my comprehension as to why Kyle(OE),and or people aboard the Persistence could be apart of something like this.. ::MonkeyConfused::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 19, 2008, 04:14:07 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... Hi Kermie, tryin to lure the STEALTH OPERATOR outta her nook? ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Good Job, keep up the great work. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 19, 2008, 04:15:07 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... Hi Kermie, tryin to lure the STEALTH OPERATOR outta her nook? ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Good Job, keep up the great work. let's try that again- Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 19, 2008, 04:18:19 PM about this cage situation: i won't be make comments about that.
i found it way too disturbing, confusing and upsetting too. pictures of that cage i block in my browser immediately. i have the greatest respect for everyone who is doing research on that. but i just can't look at that without my stomach going weird. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 04:28:29 PM Kyle Kingman's words to a private site/emalils as well as the SM site confirm to a great extent what the ROV images appear to reveal. Hey ... Tim Miller was 99% sure of what he observed in the ROV images.
It appears to me that loyalty to Kyle Kingman is where where it is at ... protecting him from any legal/moral consequences of his actions regarding the withholding of evidence related to the Natalee Holloway case from the FBI/family for his own self-serving reasons. It appears that justice for Natalee Holloway has taken a back seat and ... that is so sad. Please read Kyle Kingman words very carefully. This young man held a very responsible position on board the Persistence. Monkeys ... Kyle's words posted on a private site/emails speak for themselves. The exchange on the SM site between Kermit and Kyle prior to the posting of the ROV images reveals that Kyle was furious that posts that he had submited to a private forum/emails were about to be brought to a public platform. According to Kermit ... when Kyle first came back to the States from Aruba ... his intentions were honorable. Kyle shared that is was planning on turning over the second set of ROV images to Beth/FBI. Howevever ... it never happened. Instead ... making deals with major networks was where it was at. Kermit waited months for Kyle to do the right thing prior to posting the ROV images at the SM site ... prior to posting Kyle's words at the SM site pertaining to the happenings on board the Persistence but ... after assuring that Beth and the FBI were informed. Kyle's own words imply a John Silvetti/ALE connection ... a connection which appears to reveal that justice for Natalee Holloway and ... closure for the family was never a consideration in regards to the Persistence undertaking. Monkeys ... justice for Natalee Holloway is never going to come from an Aruban or Dutch court but ... a measure of closure may be possible for her family if it is exposed that Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage. Janet ++++++++ KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th Kyle: None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: Schafer is sue crazy. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. Kyle: I couldn't get the logs from the Persistence. All things "Holloway" were stripped from the boat once it got back to Louisiana Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Klye: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM oceanexploration: "Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it-To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help. They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust. Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time. We've helped each other however and whenever we can. They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right. I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning. Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal." oceanexploration: "We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care. Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing. Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE." BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM Private Eye: If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed. THE ROV IMAGES Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #410 on: November 24, 2008, 04:01:55 PM » Photos given to the FBI sent to Dave and Robin posted on the internet are NOT the photos posted above. These were not given to the FBI until recently. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555621#msg555621 ++++++++++ Kyle Kingman Senior Geophysical Project Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Greater New York City Area Current Senior Geophysical Operations Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Past Manager at Kingman Geophysical Solutions Education Rutgers, The State University of New Jersey-New Brunswick Industry Oil & Energy http://www.linkedin.com/pub/b/65/464 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 04:29:58 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I think we were conned by Caps and at least John Silvetti. I think Tim Miller was conned as well. They needed Tim in the "new witness" story to make it seem believable. I agree with your post Magnolia. The only part I disagree with was being conned by Caps. I was never conned. Once I don't agree with what a poster is saying I basically don't follow what they have to say anymore. This is a fault of mine in life. I basically tune the person out. Others have strong feelings about him and the work he has done and that is fine. We can't all agree. I did the same thing when Patrick released the tape of him and Joran in the car. I never trusted Patrick and always thought he was a lowlife. This is just my opinion. Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey! ::MonkeyCool:: You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were hoping he was legit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 04:48:55 PM I wanted to believe Caps. I didn't do all of the research on his I'm with you. Caps was always trying to make Shango/Simian "fit" into his story. When we came up with contradictory evidence -- he would always change or alter his "theory". Caps is a diversion - IMOposts like Mum and SS and others did, but I followed what was posted everyday. I felt thankful that somebody from Aruba was finally willing to do something to help. I soon realized that Caps was using Shango/Simian to get a story across. He was not solving the riddle, he was making it up as he went along and his timing was suspect. Why did Caps wait till the Persistence search to begin posting? Kermit warned us to "Stay focused, Monkeys." Kermit sent the pictures that we have seen lately to Beth in early March. That is how PI saw them. When PI posted here about the denim. Kyle was clearly shocked and asked PI to contact him privately. Then after Kermit posted the pictures and Kyle's words here, Caps came on and said that Natalee was chopped up into little pieces. I do not think that was true, but was said by Caps because he was mad that the pictures had been exposed. JMO I think we were conned by Caps and at least John Silvetti. I think Tim Miller was conned as well. They needed Tim in the "new witness" story to make it seem believable. I agree with your post Magnolia. The only part I disagree with was being conned by Caps. I was never conned. Once I don't agree with what a poster is saying I basically don't follow what they have to say anymore. This is a fault of mine in life. I basically tune the person out. Others have strong feelings about him and the work he has done and that is fine. We can't all agree. I did the same thing when Patrick released the tape of him and Joran in the car. I never trusted Patrick and always thought he was a lowlife. This is just my opinion. Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey! ::MonkeyCool:: You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were hoping he was legit. You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory. I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: finngirl on December 19, 2008, 04:51:40 PM What exactly is the property of vd Sloot? Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.The red or blue area? (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Sloot-24kopie.jpg) When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound. IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool. There are windows that face outside the compound. There are all those roads and paths. I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house. What good would that do? So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed. Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties. Through the gate, window, or just over the fence. It doesn't look like there is much lighting. jmho if that pic was wider (toward the right?) I think we would see Freddy's then-residence the condo/townhouse: 37 F or 39 F ... which AG looked for but couldn't find on the friday night Freddy was arrested Hi Fin...Strange she couldn't find it, wasn't it? Johan...Can you also add #62 as well. I am not sure when they moved, I think the 2005 Chamber records have 62, but will have to check and it will take me forever to find it in my stuff, as last I check they had removed those records. Thanks in Advance. hey, Mum :cool: I'd like to see an aerial view of 39F and 232 Montanja in relation to the vdS home at 19 Montanja TIA to anyone who can provide that _ _ _ _ _ august 26, 2005 4:55 pm sunmoonstars: This press release came down from the prosecutors. This is the email from the prosecutor to MSNBC They are in custody based on the same suspicions as before. They are suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder. Alternately, together with other people murdering somebody. More alternately, rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences. Even more alternately, raping somebody. Aside from these suspicions against these two brothers, there are new suspicions which at this point the prosecutor is not commenting on. To arrest the Kalpoe brothers, there had to be new facts and circumstances, that is the case! 5:10 pm DT: The ex-girlfriend of Joran, Melody or whatever, is saying on RWV that the guy's name is Freddy Zedan. 5:11 pm DT: Someone said that he was Joran's doubles partner in tennis. 5:16 pm arubagirl: No person named zedan in the phone book, not that it means that he doesn't exist, just not in the phone book. 5:22 pm DT: Jossy: We don't know that he was arrested in relation to this case, though he was questioned about it at the beginning. We have heard that he had alibi that said he was with Joran that night. Dan Riehl said earlier that the Freddy guy is the same person who was staying at Joran's apartment that night. 5:24 pm fluffy monkey: Geraldo said that this guy was a fake alibi and faked that he stayed with Joran that night. 5:24 pm nancy drew: http://www.aeromodelers.sr.org/david/am28sep04.pdf 28 sept 2004 B-Doubles team Freddy Zedan/Joran van der Sloot beat Peter Villevoix/Lex Burgman in a surprise sweep 5:42 pm HannieC: if there is a 4th person arrested than i think it`s significant that nobody seems to know who that person is nor his initials or name...Makes me wonder who that is.....(and then i`m not thinking of Paulus).BTW... 5:44 pm bondia: Freddy Z. Freddy's middle name is Alexander and it is customary to never use somebody’s last name in Aruba until they have been charged. The rules were obviously broken in Natalee's case as it has been a free for all of accusations since the Beginning 6:00 pm Port Valerie: New Greta Wire emailed at 5:41 PM: What has caught my attention most is the timeline we have pieced together. From Satish's lawyer the other night on the show, we learned that someone was on the Internet at the Kalpoe residence from 2 a.m. to 3 a.m. Why did that person get off the Internet at 3 a.m.? Note that 3 a.m. is the exact time that Joran van der Sloot's second call went to Deepak's cell phone (the first was 2:40 a.m.) Stay tuned. We will have more tonight. 6:01 pm sunmoonstars: Catherine Crier/Friday Crier: Can you tell me anything about this Freddy? Jossy: We hear 2 versions: The official press release that the prosecution put out did not mention him at all People are under the impression that his arrest may be related to another case He was arrested in the beginning with relation to this same case There is no mention from the police in regards to this third man Third man is a friend of them, partied with them, many pics with him He was questioned in the beginning in regards to the Natalee case Do you have any info as to his whereabouts the night Natalee disappeared? Jossy: I hear his alibi is that he was with Joran 6:02 pm WonderWoman: ARAMBATZIS-RODRIGUEZ ALBERT, LILIAN REGINA, MONTANJA 39-F 6:02 pm AZLady: I found an ARAMBATZIS-RODRIGUEZ, ALBERT and LILIAN REGINA who live in MONTANJA. http://www.arubachamber.com/LC%20KLEIN%2005-06-2005.htm 6:05 pm NativeLingo: MONTANJA 39-F is a neighbor of Joran's allright! 6:21 pm bondia: As we have already told RED, SM usually knows what it going on before MSM and 99% of Aruba. Based on the Tennis match from AM Digital and the initials givin by the police F.A. (and usually most people in Aruba have at least 3 if not 4 initials in thier name) We were told that Joran has a friend named Freddy Alexander. Since Jossy was the one who found the girls with the rape accusations, we are sure that he has the right Name since it is his find. ARAMBATZIS in Montana sounds like a winner! Thanks for the Good work Monkeys. 6:25 pm DT: Aruban attorney: I doubt that it is a coincidence this guy was arrested at the same time and lived near Joran. 6:31 pm NativeLingo: DT, it wasn't a coincidence... 6:32 pm nancy drew: They said it on Abrams...the part about Freddy knowing about the disposal of the body... 6:38 pm Hat: Nancy, You mean Paulus recruited Freddy for the clean? Shades of Fagin. 6:42 pm sandraK: Freddy Cuz..Lissette' ...lives..in Usa.... her Mom maybe is... Rebeca Zedan (Female, 52) Location: Venezuela. his aunty?? or something? 6:43 pm tcumom: Does anyone remember Geraldo's comments looooong time ago about porn stuff and pics? Think I'm remembering correctly.....just a comment. 6:45 pm DT: Yeah I brought this up earlier, it would be insane if Geraldo turned out to be right. I can't think of one person who believed him when said this. 6:49 pm sunmoonstars: Abrams Friday Talking to Aruban attorney A: What do you make of the arrest of this friend Attorney: I agree with you that it is not coincidential. If you talk about separate charge, one of the separate charge is disposal of a body. Which is a separate crime. If this person who is a friend of Joran, I think the prosecution in the back of their mind want to crack him to see if he had something to do with the disposal of a body. Abrams: Do you know that or speculating? Attorney: No, there are many presumptions here. 6:51 pm writenow: If Freddy has been brought in and Freddy, Joran & Jaime Carrasquilla were all best friends, is Jaime next to be arrested? BTW Satish is now calling himself the King of bling bling on his tickle site. Good grief. Maybe he's getting the bling bling from selling pics of naked girls. 7:01 pm NativeLingo: No matter what, Aruba will always be the "One Happy Island". see you later......ciao 7:14 pm OneSillyMonkey: My understanding of today's news is that Freddy was arrested, along with the Kalpoes, for the same crime (premeditated murder, disposal of body, etc). They must have more on him than just being in possession of and taking nude photos of underaged girls 7:17 pm friend of monkey: but Vanderstraten does have a son jorans age? or not known? 7:18 pm arubagirl: Just called Native, she's not mad, she had to go. I couldn't find the house, I'm sorry guys, I found 39, but not 39-K. 7:18 pm HannieC: I believe his youngest son is 24 and the oldest 33 or 34 7:25 pm HannieC: If I'm not mistaken it was 39 F ag,.... 7:26 pm arubagirl: I didn't find any house that had a letter behind a number 39, Hannie. 7:31 pm sandrak: Rebeca Zedan (Female, 52) Location: Venezuela. Aunty ?? 7:33 pm bondia: WRITENOW said earlier that Jaime would be arrested! Are you part of the ALE or a clairvoyant of a Monkey PI. Who can spell his last name right? 7:37 pm sandrak: Jaime Carrasquilla 7:39 pm bondia: Good Try SANDRA K, but I have another spelling, but I have been wrong before. Rumors are strong that he will be picked up tomorrow. 7:43 pm bondia: The Rumor on Aruba was that four were arrested today, but the police confirmed only 3, possibly another tomorrow. We spoke to Jaime and he thinks it is about some pictures that were taken in April, but they were deleted after the girl asked them to. He said they weren't illicit, but she didn't like them. They have all continued a friendship relationship since and he is surprised that she would be complaining now. Jaime also lives in Montana. To make it clear, he didn't even know that anyone has made a complaint, but that is the only thing he could think anyone could complain about. Since then, the girl has remained friends with all of them - even been to family parties at Joran's house. 7:53 pm sandraK: bondia, Anyone with..."SA"..... as Nic? 7:55 pm writenow: You're funny bondia. Monkey ALE PI clairvoyant. My new title. I posed it as a question not a fact. You tell me -- are they going to arrest Jaime? he's tight with Freddy and Joran. Makes sense he's in this, too 7:56 pm bondia: Hi SANDRAK It was spelled out for us as Carasquia, but since he made his own tickle site, I will give him credit that he knows how to spell his own name, although... As for SA - we would need more details. 8:00 pm sandrak: Time will tell.... 8:15 pm writenow: Oh, one more thing. Jaime lives on the same street as the van der Sloots. Jaime Carrasquilla/Carrasquilla, Acuna Omar/Montanja 232 8:48 pm DT: Both Freddy and Jaime were present with the Van Der Sloots on Joran's 18th birthday at KIA 8:50 pm I hear shango: DT....yes, they were and Koen was also there. 8:58 pm mom2three: Father says the American media needs to lay off his son...told to Current Affair. He sort of threatened them to lay off. He told court that American media had invaded Joran's privacy by taping Joran. He helped the court set the $600K fine. 9:00 pm bluebob: PVDS HELPED the court set the fine? He is involved at that level? This is really bad news. 9:01 pm arubagirl: I highly doubt it. He probably demanded that sum and the court gave it to him, but it's not like he conferred with the judges and was like "yeah, one million, that's good, say that". 9:05 pm I hear shango: Helen Lejuez said Freddy....physical evidence regarding the car...... 9:06 pm nancydrew: Hannity and Colmes.... Helen: says this is considered a gang rape...Freddy was brought in due to the car (which car???) . Paul Reynolds: First time he's heard the term "gang rape" H/C: Is this a homicide? Paul Reynolds: Joran said Deepak raped, murdered Natalee Helen... 60 Days now for the boys brought in today. The prosecutor told her this has to do with murder and rape. She has more info not from the prosecutor, and it is quite secure. 9:08 pm arubagirl: So much for the gang-rape being 'secret', which my source told me it was. 9:10 pm justinsmama: Is that what you were going to reveal around the 4th? Or part of it, anyway? 9:10 DT: Do you know anything more about this? 9:11 pm arubagirl: no, this I heard today. 9:11 pm little miss: Secret from who? 9:12 pm arubagirl: No, nothing more, only about the gang-rape taking place. 9:13 pm DT: Does this involve all of the boys, or just the three? 9:14 pm friend of monkey: freddy lives behind jorans apartment...on FOX 9:14 pm arubagirl: All of them. 9:32 pm fluffymonkey: Larry King Live, Friday August 26, 2005 Dave Holloway : We were concerned about September 4 date coming up but now it looks like Joran is probably not going to be let go. FBI called and told us about Kalpoe brothers and Freddy. Prosecutor is very confident. 9:38 pm I hear shango: polis chief was not overhead saying how can i do this to my best friend's son....he was on national tv saying it...I saw it with my own eyes. 9:45 pm littletxlady: Geraldo told about the videos, gang rape and the best friend thing on the same night, in the very beginning of this case. 9:58 pm sunmoonstars: Current Affair We pulled several items off of Tickle.com These three guys, particularly Joran described themselves as having pretty healthy sex drives We learned of these before they were even arrested Hooking up with women, it was explicit They put their cellphones on the internet, we picked up the phone and called Joran in the very beginning 10:01 pm friend of monkey: early on a gang bang tape w/ joran and a 14 yr old was mentioned here.. 10:03 pm kackylacky: yes by Geraldo...............and we all scoffed. 10:28 pm crazybabyborg: Anyone know what the nature of the alibi was that Freddy supplied for Joran? 10:30 pm writergal: I think Freddie said he slept over at Joran's house on the relevant night 10:30 pm DT: From what I understand, he said he stayed at Joran's apartment that night, which is something he and other friends often do. He claimed Joran got home at a certain time, and that he said he had met an American girl, but that nothing sexual had taken place. 10:41 pm sleddogs: "At the beginning of the show they were talking about Freddy being linked somehow due to the car. Not sure which car...but, they referred to the info from the gardener... " If I remember right a while back when they first brought the gardener in wasn't there a problem with him not being able to identify one of the K2's? Maybe that was because the other person in the car that night was later identified as Freddy. 10:42 pm kackylacky: Jossy said on Abrams this afternoon, that freddy told ALE he was "with" joran that night...........and that was all that was said about it. The usual comments about that not being too smart was what followed.......no further detail. But I am thinking freddy may have tried to alibi joran for the time after the HI drop off.............which begs the question.........why did they arrest steve for giving deepak an alibi, but did not arrest freddy for doing the same for joran. Interesting............. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tibrogargan on December 19, 2008, 04:57:08 PM (snipped) Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey! ::MonkeyCool:: You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were hoping he was legit. You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory. I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I ::MonkeyHaHa:: San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice ::MonkeyCool:: After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 04:58:47 PM Kyle sent me this today Kermit, You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB. Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted. Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum. The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case. I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding: I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired. I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record. Birmingham is not the office in charge. The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee. I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed. I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. Sincerely, Kyle Thanks Kermit. The fact is ... confidentiality agreement of not ... the words of Kyle have been made public and ... those words expose that the Persistence undertaking was never about justice for Natalee Holloway and ... it was never about a measure of closure for her family. It was all about John John Silvetti assisting the ALE in THE FINALE TO THE GREAT ARUBAN COVERUP. Janet ________ JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed." Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 04:59:25 PM (snipped) Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey! ::MonkeyCool:: You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were hoping he was legit. You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory. I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I ::MonkeyHaHa:: San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice ::MonkeyCool:: After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book Hi Tibro nice to see you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tibrogargan on December 19, 2008, 05:22:26 PM (snipped) Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey! ::MonkeyCool:: You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were hoping he was legit. You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory. I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I ::MonkeyHaHa:: San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice ::MonkeyCool:: After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book Hi Tibro nice to see you. Thanks San. I am still around - mostly reading as a guest - waiting and hoping for answers and peace for Beth and Natalee's family. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 05:24:15 PM PERHAPS KYLE VIOLATED THE COPYRIGHT HIMSELF Kyle said: "She [BETH] needs to know exactly what we found in the proper timing. The way to do that would be through Tim Trahan and I. I can arrange any meeting with him. He represents the owner and the rights to the data, in this case, Louis S. I have everything but I don't want to go around him for chain of custody reasons, professional courtesy, and friendship." The next step: I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed. He certainly is a planner [edited to protect the individual] needs to be called and ask to request the removal of the post by either her or PI to Klaas. I agree. I cannot comprehend why Kyle would be posting on a private site if he had a confidentiality agreement with Louis Schafer. However ... I would have considered it honorable if Kyle had made the moral decision to shared with the FBI and/or John Q. Kelly and/or Natalee's family knowling that he faced a legal challenge from Schafer. Kyle it is not too late. A measure of closure for the family of Natalee Holloway dictates that a hero must step up to the plate and reveal the happenings on board the Persistence endeavor ... the happenings that you know from first hand observation imply that Natalee Holloway's remains could have been in that trap/cage. Think about it ... John Silvetti betrayed the hope of the family of Natalee Holloway and ... John Silvetti betrayed the trust of those who sacrificially donated to the endeavor. Sincerely, Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 05:36:18 PM In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say. The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see is beyond explanation and the fact that people would continue to protect the responsible parties is more than I can understand. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 05:42:40 PM In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say. The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see is beyond explanation and the fact that people would continue to protect the responsible parties is more than I can understand. I agree. ::MonkeyCool:: It's the most inhumane,as well as dispicable thing i can think of! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 05:48:55 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 05:52:41 PM Kyle sent me this today Kermit, You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB. Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted. Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum. The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case. I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding: I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired. I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record. Birmingham is not the office in charge. The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee. I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed. I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. Sincerely, Kyle Kyle If the "lead investigator" you are referring to is not an FBI agent ... then the "investigation" into the contents of the cage/trap is for naught. I do not think for one moment that either Mos or Richardson is going to take the fall for the coverup in regards to Natalee's remains. Sincerely, Janet _______ KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder Postbus 1163, Oranjestad, Aruba Havenstraat 2 Oranjestad Aruba To All media From The Public Prosecutor’s Office Date February 26, 2008 Pages 1 The Aruban Police requested the FBI Laboratory to process the cloth, because the Laboratory already had a sample of the exact match of the type of material of Natalee Holloway’s blouse. The FBI Laboratory received that material on the 22nd of January 2008. On the 25th of February 2008, the Prosecutors’ Office received the official report from the FBI Laboratory that showed that the two materials were not a match. THE ROV IMAGES Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618 THE FABRIC KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 05:54:08 PM In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands. With that said..... I agree 100% Kermit! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 05:54:42 PM In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say. The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see is beyond explanation and the fact that people would continue to protect the responsible parties is more than I can understand. The only reason I can think of is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. People turn on their own for this. My integridy means more to me than money. So if someone were to offer me a boat load of cash to tell a lie I could not do it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 05:54:54 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 05:57:31 PM In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say. The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see is beyond explanation and the fact that people would continue to protect the responsible parties is more than I can understand. I agree with you Magnolia. It's just sickening! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 05:58:59 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I do believe Kermit is right. It is Kyle Kingman who is in violation of a copyright agreement with Louis Shafer by posting the ROV images as well as his concerns regarding the John Silvetti/ALE connectin. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 05:59:20 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:01:20 PM Yes I know he posted information here at SM but we are a public forum. What he is claiming is that he posted specific information on a private forum that he didn't want made public.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 06:01:59 PM In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say. The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see is beyond explanation and the fact that people would continue to protect the responsible parties is more than I can understand. BINGO!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:02:10 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I do believe Kermit is right. It is Kyle Kingman who is in violation of a copyright agreement with Louis Shafer by posting the ROV images as well as his concerns regarding the John Silvetti/ALE connectin. Janet He is in deep doo doo. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:04:11 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. Exactly. He was not dumb or naive. He knew exactly what he was doing. When you play with fire you get burnt. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 06:06:21 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:11:08 PM He took pictures that were not owned by him and posted them on the internet. Did he own these pictures personally? You can't copyright it if you don't own it.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 06:11:48 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:13:31 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Kyle where did you get these pictures from? Umm, Umm I borrowed them ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 06:13:55 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Exactly! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 06:14:40 PM San! ::MonkeyHaHa::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 06:20:26 PM The other girls can testify that he was in the casino I contend that the first time that Paulus' face appeared in the media ... Natalee's friends who were at the Black Jack table were able to identify Joran's father as the person sitting with them. Think about it. Beth made the following statement to Rita Cosby six month prior to the revelation of the video recording. Janet +++++ Katherine (Madison) Whatley FBI Statement July 12, 2005 After swimming at the hotel on Sunday, WHATLEY and other classmates, including HOLLOWAY, ate dinner at a restaurant next to the hotel. After dinner they went to the casino at the hotel. A few classmates were gambling at a card table along with an "older man" and YURON VAN DER SLOOT. (Whatley 302) 'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for Sept. 19th updated 6:33 a.m. PT, Tues., Sept. 20, 2005 BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... I don‘t think there was ever a question that Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot had been in that Excelsior Casino, and, particularly, on the night of the 29th where he and his father met Natalee. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9407728/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 06:21:53 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Kyle where did you get these pictures from? Umm, Umm I borrowed them ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 06:24:47 PM The other girls can testify that he was in the casino I contend that the first time that Paulus' face appeared in the media ... Natalee's friends who were at the Black Jack table were able to identify Joran's father as the person sitting with them. Think about it. Beth made the following statement to Rita Cosby six month prior to the revelation of the video recording. Janet +++++ Katherine (Madison) Whatley FBI Statement July 12, 2005 After swimming at the hotel on Sunday, WHATLEY and other classmates, including HOLLOWAY, ate dinner at a restaurant next to the hotel. After dinner they went to the casino at the hotel. A few classmates were gambling at a card table along with an "older man" and YURON VAN DER SLOOT. (Whatley 302) 'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for Sept. 19th updated 6:33 a.m. PT, Tues., Sept. 20, 2005 BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... I don‘t think there was ever a question that Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot had been in that Excelsior Casino, and, particularly, on the night of the 29th where he and his father met Natalee. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9407728/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:26:12 PM If Kyle takes Kermit to court, all Kermit needs is a jury trial. I don't believe Kyle could ever win, with all the facts on the table. Kyle put the information out there first, and human decency would trump anything Kermit might have agreed to before being given the information. JMO Kyle where did you get these pictures from? Umm, Umm I borrowed them ::MonkeyHaHa:: It would be great to "copyright" material you don't own!!! ::MonkeyConfused:: Wouldn't we all be rich. These laws are very complicated. He has not done his homework. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 06:27:46 PM The other girls can testify that he was in the casino I contend that the first time that Paulus' face appeared in the media ... Natalee's friends who were at the Black Jack table were able to identify Joran's father as the person sitting with them. Think about it. Beth made the following statement to Rita Cosby six month prior to the revelation of the video recording. Janet +++++ Katherine (Madison) Whatley FBI Statement July 12, 2005 After swimming at the hotel on Sunday, WHATLEY and other classmates, including HOLLOWAY, ate dinner at a restaurant next to the hotel. After dinner they went to the casino at the hotel. A few classmates were gambling at a card table along with an "older man" and YURON VAN DER SLOOT. (Whatley 302) 'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for Sept. 19th updated 6:33 a.m. PT, Tues., Sept. 20, 2005 BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... I don‘t think there was ever a question that Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot had been in that Excelsior Casino, and, particularly, on the night of the 29th where he and his father met Natalee. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9407728/ I agree. They listend to what they were told. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 06:29:31 PM My prayer is that Kyle will release himself of the burden of his wrongdoing and ... will become part of the investigation into the contents of the cage/trap. In other words ... Kyle should reveal all to the FBI regarding the happenings on board the Persistence that implied justice for Natalee Holloway was not the objective of the undertaking and ... and closure for the family was not the objective of the undertaing.
Hey ... Kyle will surely face consequences and personal regret for his actions but ... the freedom that comes with doing right will make it all worthwhile. What a testimony to his faith!! What a role model to his daughter!! What a testimony to his character!! Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 06:33:46 PM [/quote] It would be great to "copyright" material you don't own!!! ::MonkeyConfused:: [/quote] That happened several years ago. Somebody checked copyrights on business logos. Charged the companies that had not copyrighted their logos huge amounts to get their logos back. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 06:39:51 PM [/quote] That happened several years ago. Somebody checked copyrights on business logos. Charged the companies that had not copyrighted their logos huge amounts to get their logos back. [/quote] I have heard that most of Stephen Foster's songs are not copyrighted. Maybe I will go for those? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 06:44:44 PM Kyle ... I will not let up on you. I will not back down until their is full disclosure forthcoming from you to the FBI and the family of Natalee Holloway regarding the happenings on board the Persistence that imply a coverup in regards to the contents of that cage/trap.
Considering that I do not believe that justice for an eighteen year old American citizen will come from an Aruban or Dutch court ... the ability for the family to bring their beloved home is my priority and ... if that is no longer possible ... the knowledge pertaining to the contents of that trap is where it is at. Kyle ... believe it or not I do care about you very much. There is nothing I have posted on this forum that I would not have said personally to either of my sons if they were in your place. With Love in His precious name. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 06:52:12 PM Magnolia, I also wonder if the service cap was put in the trap to frame somebody else or to keep them quiet.
Wreck, don't think it has much to do with monitor because I seldom see all the things in photos that others say they see. Just that one things is very clear to me especially when moving back from the screem about three feet which is always a good thing to do. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 07:19:50 PM Tracy Pollan will star as Beth Twitty in Natalee Holloway movie
(http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2008/12/large_Pollan.JPG) Tracy Pollan, Michael J. Fox's wife and his former co-star in "Family Ties," will star as Mountain Brook's Beth Twitty in the upcoming Lifetime Movie Network film about News File Beth Twitty Twitty's daughter, Natalee Holloway, Lifetime announced today. News File Beth Twitty Pollan also had recurring guest roles on "Spin City" and "Law & Order: Special Victims Unit," the latter of which earned her an Emmy Award nomination. Her feature film credits include "Bright Lights, Big City" and "Baby, It's You." Casting for the role of Holloway, who disappeared in Aruba while on a senior class trip in 2005, has not been announced. "The Natalee Holloway Story," based on Twitty's book, "Loving Natalee: A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith," will begin production in January and air on Lifetime Movie Network in April. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 19, 2008, 07:20:54 PM He took pictures that were not owned by him and posted them on the internet. Did he own these pictures personally? You can't copyright it if you don't own it. Wonder when the pictures were copyrighted? During the negotiations between the Persistence, ABC, Perer DV, etc.? I think the only reason to copyright the photos is to be able to sell them for money to a TV station, documentary, book deal etc. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 19, 2008, 07:48:23 PM He took pictures that were not owned by him and posted them on the internet. Did he own these pictures personally? You can't copyright it if you don't own it. Also My daughter is an artist, she has to go pay and get them copyright,and prove they are her work. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 07:59:55 PM 12/19/2008 Bondia
http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12192008Bondia04a.jpg) (I had to type this one out so there could be some errors) I also tried running the following translation through the Portugese translator but I had many, many "ass" words show up so I didn't post it. ::MonkeyWink:: Papiamentu translation: aruba is stay responsible for natalee holloway but not have to help esnan irresponsabel without dada some, we comunidad have one owe moral cu family of natalee holloway, the young student mericano, that owing to desaparece day 30 of half of 2005, one day first cu the have to owing to return his country, after of one vacacion cortico here at aruba. ananan will happen y the owe here will stay existi, till hour cu the caso stay soluciona y famianan of natalee achieve know kico owing to happen, y esun or esnan culpabel come across,paga for thing can owing to sosode cu the young here. is more cu claro cu we country will stay owe the family here one contesta, one splicacion cu they child muher owing to lose on the island diminutive here without let rastro some behind at where his curpa will can is. also will stay one mature, cu the person more named after in the caso here, esta joran van der sloot, will stay because; the first sospechoso y first responsible for clarifica the enigma here y if the is inocente or not, the have cu follow live cu the weight here, already cu the was genuinely the ultimo cu owing to see natalee at life. is hechonan cu none person can change till hour cu the enigma regrettable here stay aclerea but also is extremely regrettable cu hendenan cu not have art neither parte de culpabilidad of desparicion of natalee holloway, is wordo lastra, they credibilidad atacha, same cu the campananan negative cu is being haci at merca contra we island. is of lamenta, y is algo cu never have to owing to arrive so far, cu minister of husticia, is lance one insinuaction so earnest, contra one ex comisario of police, that “lo” owing to stroba y perhudica the investigacion of the caso of natalee. cualkier can as the razon cu minister of husticia can had for cuestiona the work of the ex comisario of police, the have to owing to atende the asunto here in form various, y assure if the menciona cu the have “prueba” of the desaroyo here, then the not owing to actua hour cu the have to owing to actua. the desaroyo here owing to arise still more doubt close esnan at merca, instancianan cu is see in the caso of natalee holloway one form for stay at life because; journalist, cu is using the discusion here at aruba, because; one siguranza for they ponencianan ridiculo. the caso of natalee holloway have three ana bicu, thing assure is much time for her family of the young here, but at self instant, the caso here do not uno solitario on his self, y in “cualkier” sistema hudicial fayonan can being cometi, without cu mesterbay overnacuestiona integridad of esnan cu owing to comete the fayonan here. for colmo the week here, one caso regrettable, uno extremely abysmal, caminda the young adam walsh of barely 7 ana owing to wordo soluciona, after of 27 ana. the boy here, owing to wordo secuestra y some day after, autoridadnan policial owing to come descubri cabez of the child here throw in one forest, while cu never owing to achieve remainder of his curpa. yesterday autoridadnan at merca owing to anuncia cu they're serca of soluciona the caso of carpachi y another wesonan cu they owing to achieve bury in one forest near of one caretera, cu probably will is pertenece at the criatura caylee anthony of 4 ana of edad, that his mother owing to give for perdi, casi one month after cu the child will owing to lose. the mother, casey anthony is deteni, sospecha of owing to kill his own child, in one caso abysmal while cu at merca self have cantidad of caso caminda crimennan cu simplemente is let everybody mouth open, menera among another of one abusador sexual of one criatura of cinco ana, that owing to bury the poor child in one saco of plastic, while cu still the criatura was at life. is crimennan cu all being human have cu condena, cu none society civiliza can acepta, but cu esnan responsible have cu atende y aclerea. not can have division in the struggle contra criminalidad, kizas diferencia of opinion, but none interest of none minister, of none oficial of husticia, can is stop on implementacion of husticia. natalee holloway is one caso cu will stay responsabilidad of we country, of we sistema hudicial y of we all, for soluciona y bringando cu another without sense, acusando another of cosnan without sense, acusando another of cosnan without sense y cu instead of help aclerea one crimen cometi for one “otro”, is haci because; sifuera is esnan trahando for soluciona the enigma, is esnan culpabel at desaparicion of the young holloway. the instant owing to arrive for gobierno, intensifica his responsabilidad diplomatico, inverti more time for atende cu interesnan of we country at merca y in all attempt cu is being haci for periodistanan mericano, take away one contra atake cu is serve interest of we country. not acepta cualkier locura cu various medio of comunicacion mericano is fabrica for stay the one level high of sintonia, but atende the interesnan of nols country at all instant, thing till at the momentonan here, do not the caso. john walsh, father of the boy adam, that owing to wordo asesina 27 ana happen, owing to declara cu the is believe cu natalee holloway is dead y cu the trues hobennan deteni in the casi here, owing to “get away with murder.” mustrando once more cu they're stay responsible for desaparicion of the young here, already cu they was the ultimonan for see natalee holloway. is of lamenta the ultimo desaroyonan here, y also the pasividad of govierno paloke is one campana more strong at merca for her caso here, while cu here at aruba if have suficente energy for ataca another, causando still more problem for reputacion of we island in exterior. caso natalee holloway is follow of is one asunto extremely delicado y earnest, cu is rekeri atencion earnest y responsible at all instant till hour cu the stay soluciona y aclerea. hour cu esnan encolvi in the caso here, ataca another, cuestiona another they funcionamento, already the responsabilidad cu we have cu carga because; country responsible for desaparicion of natalee holloway, is help esnan cu is irresponsabel in the caso here. the is less the enfoke for of esnan cu genuinely is responabel y cu now is so irresponsabel in the caso. come across Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 08:01:50 PM OEPS TM ::MonkeyHaHa::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 08:03:38 PM Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 08:05:18 PM I tried the original through the Portugese translator too, and came up the same! Every other word nearly was "ass". ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 08:06:10 PM I don't know the specifics of the article but find it interesting the name Van Der Sloot never appears. ::MonkeyConfused::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 08:07:36 PM I don't know the specifics of the article but find it interesting the name Van Der Sloot never appears. ::MonkeyConfused:: It does once, I believe....or it should have I know Joran van der Sloot was in it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 08:09:11 PM I don't know the specifics of the article but find it interesting the name Van Der Sloot never appears. ::MonkeyConfused:: 9th or 10th line of the translation...my eyes are running together now. ::MonkeyHaHa::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 08:11:33 PM I don't know the specifics of the article but find it interesting the name Van Der Sloot never appears. ::MonkeyConfused:: 9th or 10th line of the translation...my eyes are running together now. ::MonkeyHaHa::OK.got it.LOL. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 08:14:58 PM NANCY GRACE TIME!!!
Janet 5:15 PM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 08:15:44 PM OOPS!!!
Wrong forum ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: johan555 on December 19, 2008, 08:17:27 PM COLLECTOR'S ITEM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Envelopandstamp.jpg?t=1229735714) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 08:27:22 PM Well, I hate to sound like a broken record but how will we ever know if that was Natalee's remains in the fish trap or not?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 19, 2008, 08:36:02 PM He took pictures that were not owned by him and posted them on the internet. Did he own these pictures personally? You can't copyright it if you don't own it. Also My daughter is an artist, she has to go pay and get them copyright,and prove they are her work. Another way is to use the post office, snail mail a copy of the pictures/artwork/video/whatever to yourself registered mail, and when you sign and receive the package to yourself, DO NOT OPEN IT UP. Put it in a safe place. Then if you are sued, you can take the package to court, and a judge will open it up. It will have a date stamp and your signature of receipt. I had to do this with some artwork a few years back. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 19, 2008, 08:36:56 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. Might this phrase from the Kermit/Kyle post be the problem - "You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB."? Did Kermit breach this "confidentiality and nondisclosure" agreement? Might that be a problem for the FB Kermit? The SM Kermit? As technology changes, I have come to believe that the line separating the internet/www and the "office" or "business" network becomes blurred. How many software packages are accessed over the internet? Does that mean that anyone in an office may start posting and reposting confidential information? Was the information on FB considered confidential? That's two things I'd like to see - the stuff at FB and the stuff in the ALE file. If the Aruba government had internet access on computers, and an office/government network, does that mean all that stuff is available for people to copy from and post on places like SM? Maybe someone could start copying and posting all those statements? IIRC the Dutch/Arubans have some sort of encryption on their files. Maybe they could have an 'Open House" for the public? There a lot of stuff I'd like answers to. Does anyone know for sure that any remains were recovered from that cage/trap? Does anyone know for sure the images were not enhanced in such a way that made them look like a skull? What did the skull images look like from other ROV angles? I will continue to think the best of Kyle, the Persistence crew, and ALE. This sounds more like another "blame the American's that Natalee isn't returned to her family campaign" and I don't know why anyone would settle for anything less than Natalee's return. In my mind, the finger still points at Aruba. They have the ability to return Natalee to her family. They had that ability in 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, and will have that ability going forward. Do they have the will to return her? No matter what new conspiracy theories arise, I believe the opportunity remains for Aruba. Maybe some would like people to think the body was disposed of yet again? No need to keep up the fight? Everyone can go home and forget Natalee? The finger circles all over the place, but ends up pointing at PJ2K. The finger circles to include a number of others. I wonder if PJ2K will be charged with a crime in Aruba before year end? Maybe next year? Will someone use as an excuse that they cannot find JVDS? 2K? Will they at least put the paper out there? Maybe others? jmho Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 19, 2008, 08:44:35 PM Tracy Pollan will star as Beth Twitty in Natalee Holloway movie (http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2008/12/large_Pollan.JPG) Tracy Pollan, Michael J. Fox's wife and his former co-star in "Family Ties," will star as Mountain Brook's Beth Twitty in the upcoming Lifetime Movie Network film about News File Beth Twitty Twitty's daughter, Natalee Holloway, Lifetime announced today. News File Beth Twitty Pollan also had recurring guest roles on "Spin City" and "Law & Order: Special Victims Unit," the latter of which earned her an Emmy Award nomination. Her feature film credits include "Bright Lights, Big City" and "Baby, It's You." Casting for the role of Holloway, who disappeared in Aruba while on a senior class trip in 2005, has not been announced. "The Natalee Holloway Story," based on Twitty's book, "Loving Natalee: A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith," will begin production in January and air on Lifetime Movie Network in April. I want to know who will be PVDS, JVDS, Anita, Renfro and others. For PVDS, I nominate Alan Rickman. I think he can do a range on characters, evil, nice, sensitive... Anyone else? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 19, 2008, 08:47:03 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. Might this phrase from the Kermit/Kyle post be the problem - "You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB."? Did Kermit breach this "confidentiality and nondisclosure" agreement? Might that be a problem for the FB Kermit? The SM Kermit? As technology changes, I have come to believe that the line separating the internet/www and the "office" or "business" network becomes blurred. How many software packages are accessed over the internet? Does that mean that anyone in an office may start posting and reposting confidential information? Was the information on FB considered confidential? That's two things I'd like to see - the stuff at FB and the stuff in the ALE file. If the Aruba government had internet access on computers, and an office/government network, does that mean all that stuff is available for people to copy from and post on places like SM? Maybe someone could start copying and posting all those statements? IIRC the Dutch/Arubans have some sort of encryption on their files. Maybe they could have an 'Open House" for the public? There a lot of stuff I'd like answers to. Does anyone know for sure that any remains were recovered from that cage/trap? Does anyone know for sure the images were not enhanced in such a way that made them look like a skull? What did the skull images look like from other ROV angles? I will continue to think the best of Kyle, the Persistence crew, and ALE. This sounds more like another "blame the American's that Natalee isn't returned to her family campaign" and I don't know why anyone would settle for anything less than Natalee's return. In my mind, the finger still points at Aruba. They have the ability to return Natalee to her family. They had that ability in 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, and will have that ability going forward. Do they have the will to return her? No matter what new conspiracy theories arise, I believe the opportunity remains for Aruba. Maybe some would like people to think the body was disposed of yet again? No need to keep up the fight? Everyone can go home and forget Natalee? The finger circles all over the place, but ends up pointing at PJ2K. The finger circles to include a number of others. I wonder if PJ2K will be charged with a crime in Aruba before year end? Maybe next year? Will someone use as an excuse that they cannot find JVDS? 2K? Will they at least put the paper out there? Maybe others? jmho ALE can never be trusted.Kyle(OE).We're all willing to hear the rebuttal but for some reason i think it'll never come. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 08:47:07 PM On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such. I think you are right, Anna. Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin posted the first set of pictures to a "private site". He knew what could happen. If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information. When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher. The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures. Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex. Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement. Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance? Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia. By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web. The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving. For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce. Might this phrase from the Kermit/Kyle post be the problem - "You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB."? Did Kermit breach this "confidentiality and nondisclosure" agreement? Might that be a problem for the FB Kermit? The SM Kermit? As technology changes, I have come to believe that the line separating the internet/www and the "office" or "business" network becomes blurred. How many software packages are accessed over the internet? Does that mean that anyone in an office may start posting and reposting confidential information? Was the information on FB considered confidential? That's two things I'd like to see - the stuff at FB and the stuff in the ALE file. If the Aruba government had internet access on computers, and an office/government network, does that mean all that stuff is available for people to copy from and post on places like SM? Maybe someone could start copying and posting all those statements? IIRC the Dutch/Arubans have some sort of encryption on their files. Maybe they could have an 'Open House" for the public? There a lot of stuff I'd like answers to. Does anyone know for sure that any remains were recovered from that cage/trap? Does anyone know for sure the images were not enhanced in such a way that made them look like a skull? What did the skull images look like from other ROV angles? I will continue to think the best of Kyle, the Persistence crew, and ALE. This sounds more like another "blame the American's that Natalee isn't returned to her family campaign" and I don't know why anyone would settle for anything less than Natalee's return. In my mind, the finger still points at Aruba. They have the ability to return Natalee to her family. They had that ability in 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, and will have that ability going forward. Do they have the will to return her? No matter what new conspiracy theories arise, I believe the opportunity remains for Aruba. Maybe some would like people to think the body was disposed of yet again? No need to keep up the fight? Everyone can go home and forget Natalee? The finger circles all over the place, but ends up pointing at PJ2K. The finger circles to include a number of others. I wonder if PJ2K will be charged with a crime in Aruba before year end? Maybe next year? Will someone use as an excuse that they cannot find JVDS? 2K? Will they at least put the paper out there? Maybe others? jmho The question to me is did Kyle break someones trust. Whose pictures did he post. Did Kermit sign an agreement or did she just say ribbit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 19, 2008, 08:50:11 PM Mafia 'man of honour' denied full parole
By Paul CherryDecember 19, 2008 Quote Despite his stunning admission that he was a “man of honour” in the Sicilian Mafia while he conspired to smuggle large quantities of cocaine into Canada, Gerlando Caruana of Montreal has been turned down for full parole. Quote ...Caruana even admitted to being a so-called “man of honour,” or leader in the organization, while he, his brothers and other relatives, known as the Caruana-Cuntrera clan, shipped large quantities of cocaine around the world. Quote Caruana claims to lead a frugal life, living partly off his pension with his spouse in a small house in Laval. For years, police have speculated that Caruana still has a fortune in drug profits stashed away somewhere. Before the arrests in 1998, members of the Caruana-Cuntrera organization were believed to have hidden millions in drug money through real estate purchases in countries like Aruba and Venezuela. Caruana claimed that all his assets were lost when his partner in crime, Oreste Pagano, became an informant for the police. Can someone check those pesky property records in Aruba? I remember years ago when some suggested sinister things with regard to condos/timeshare in Aruba and various MB folks. What kind of properties are owned by people of these names? Caretakers? Lawyers? If Aruba requires a partner for foreign ownership, who is that Aruban partner? Their representative? How could the assets just be lost? ::MonkeyShocked:: http://www.montrealgazette.com/Mafia+honour+denied+full+parole/1096717/story.html (http://www.montrealgazette.com/Mafia+honour+denied+full+parole/1096717/story.html) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 08:50:58 PM Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum. It can't work both ways. Were lies uncovered.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 09:15:18 PM OK everyone post. I promise not to be in a bad mood anymore ::MonkeyHaHa::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 09:21:43 PM OK everyone post. I promise not to be in a bad mood anymore ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 09:22:08 PM Did Kermit breach this "confidentiality and nondisclosure" agreement? Might that be a problem for the FB Kermit? The SM Kermit? Yes ... I believe there might be some legal fallout for Kermit. However ... I do believe that Kyle ... a young man who held a responsible position on the Persistence ... may have breach a confidentiality agreement with Louis Shaefer when he posted the ROV images and shared inside information regarding the Persistence undertaking at a private site. I do not know the legal ramifications encompassing Kermit breaking with a confidentiality agreement he made with a poster on an internet forum but ... 1. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle was about to reveal images and information that implied the Persistence undertaking to recover Natalee's remains was a fraud? It was not about justice for Natalee Holloway. It was not about closure for the family. It was all about John Silvetti's self-serving motives. It was all about scamming unsuspecting donors. 2. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle was about to reveal info that implied that there was a real possibility that Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage and were retrieved and taken custody by the Aubans without a challenge from John Silvetti. 3. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks. I am thankful that Kermit went out on a limb fully aware that there could be consequences ... went out on a limb to expose John Silvetti's betrayal to the family ... John Silvetti's betrayal to the donors ... when he assisted in THE FINALE' TO THE ARUBAN COVERUP. In other words ... Justice for Natalee Holloway and ... closure for her family were Kermit's priority. Doing right is never wrong even if there is a personal price to pay. Janet +++++++++ JOHN SILVETTI KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability. Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. THE FABRIC KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. DEAL WITH THE NETWORKS KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: WhiskeyGirl on December 19, 2008, 09:26:30 PM Quote 'I wish this was true , ' Alfonso Caruana answered when the judge showed him a article claiming the Cuntrera-Caruana clan possessed 60 per cent of Aruba.Most observers agree the clan never owned that much of the island.Certainly , the records of the Chamber of Commerce fail to confirm such an allegation.On the other hand company-ownership or real estate property could well be hidden through the construction of Aruban off-shore limited liability companies offering strong secrecy provisions.With a chain of such companies on different Caribbean islands , it is almost impossible to track anything.In the Caribbean , the most insignificant island-states tend to compete with each other , offering the most unwarranted , unverifiable legal constructions of companies , trusts and off-shore banking regulations. 60% = Alfonso Caruana? http://www.zoominfo.com/people/Caruana_Alfonso_21479360.aspx (http://www.zoominfo.com/people/Caruana_Alfonso_21479360.aspx) Quote In 1993 the Italian daily Corriere della Sera reported that the Cuntrera-Caruana clan owned 60 per cent of the Caribbean island Aruba, part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. The first independent mafia state was born, according to the newspaper. That claim proved to be exaggerated, however.[1][13] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuntrera-Caruana_Mafia_family (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuntrera-Caruana_Mafia_family) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 09:27:18 PM San ... please edit my post.
3. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks. Thanks Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 09:33:18 PM San ... please edit my post. 3. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks. Thanks Janet Done. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 09:35:52 PM San ... please edit my post. 3. How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks. Thanks Janet Done. Thanks San. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 09:44:16 PM Another hanging suicide in Aruba, can't see pockets.
http://www.24ora.com/content/view/6845/8/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 09:44:32 PM Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum. It can't work both ways. Were lies uncovered. His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed. I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar. Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 09:48:49 PM http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_50696.php
Google translation: Finger-pointing democracy 19 Dec, 2008, 15:01 (GMT -04:00) Email this article Print this article AFTER THE ROADS OF voiced criticism on the police force, our Minister of Justice, Rudy Croes, Thursday, December 4, 2008, indicated that Van der Straten aware the investigation into the Natalee Holloway case has frustrated. That these allegations are true is recommended. Our Minister of Justice points the finger to the ex-Police, but argues it is not innocent. The Staff and the State scheme do not the ministers responsible for nothing. Especially when it comes to matters of which the Minister himself has indicated on the extent of it. If leader is now Rudy Croes once responsible for his officers. Even if it is established that these allegations are untrue, the minister accountable for his careless remarks. Whether he realizes that by itself is not the wide publicity surrounding his statements the international reputation of Aruba is affected, which could have adverse consequences for international trade and relations with other countries? Codified this principle of ministerial responsibility in Aruba problematic: only through the control of the parliament a minister can be held responsible. And everyone knows that the majority of the Aruban parliament not verify, but according purports. This is harmful for the truth, harms the public debate and damaging to democracy. Meanwhile, in theory, the full political responsibility of ministers. The ground looks more like a finger-pointing democracy, which is blamed everyone except the ultimate responsibility itself: the Minister. Our Minister of Justice is doing so well with its disapproval of the finger at the mirror to itself and a bottle of ministerial responsibility before uncorking old and new. JUAN DAVID IRAUSQUIN Vvoorzit Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 09:50:31 PM Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum. It can't work both ways. Were lies uncovered. His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed. I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar. Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. Potty mouth! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 09:54:17 PM I wish Private Eye would come by and tell us his thoughts. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 09:56:17 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON.
THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 09:56:54 PM Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum. It can't work both ways. Were lies uncovered. His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed. I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar. Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. Potty mouth! I couldn't think what it was until you said that ::MonkeyHaHa:: Then a light bulb went off. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 19, 2008, 09:59:58 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hi KYcat :smt039 I see you. And I hear you, loud and clear. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Some post at Scared Monkeys and also at private forums. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 10:00:22 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 10:00:29 PM Well, I hate to sound like a broken record but how will we ever know if that was Natalee's remains in the fish trap or not? Considering the revelation of the ROV images that the Arubans had no idea existed and ... considering it was an American endeavor that located the cage/images ... I believe the FBI should have some authority to put some pressure on Aruba to reveal what was retrieved. Also ... if Kyle Kingman were willing to step up to the plate and reveal to the FBI what he posted on a private site and the SM site regarding the events encompassing the chain of custody of the contents over to the enemy ... regarding John S.'s Aruban conflict of interest ... maybe ... just maybe ... I really don't know but ... I believe with all my heart that Persistence endeavor need to be exposed for it was ... a scam to assist the Aruban is the final coverup. Janet +++++ BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed." Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 10:01:13 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hi KYCat! Good to see you!!!!! ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:02:50 PM Okay. Thank You Muffy and Magnolia!! I guess It is sorta not a good idea to talk about so I won't.
But a GREAT BIG THANK YOU for my hello! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:03:50 PM Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum. It can't work both ways. Were lies uncovered. His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed. I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar. Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. Potty mouth! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Not so very potty but I did raise two sons, and I would have used one of their Dad's statements....... ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:04:03 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: Hi KYCat! Good to see you!!!!! ::MonkeyDance:: THANK YOU ... Good to see everyone. We won't give up on Natalee. ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:04:22 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. I can't I said I was going to be good for the rest of the night. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 19, 2008, 10:05:41 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. I can't I said I was going to be good for the rest of the night. ::MonkeyHaHa:: :smt040 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:06:29 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. I can't I said I was going to be good for the rest of the night. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Don't be bad San. I think I get it. No problemo. I won't mention it again. I felt..... kinda.... out of the loop..... LOL ::MonkeyTongue:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:07:25 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat, we always see you and others but don't always respond. I don't always have the eloquent skills that some here do. There are some SM members who have been invited to post at a forum which is private and by invitation only. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 19, 2008, 10:09:03 PM HELLO MONKEYS! I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE???? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS? NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE. ::MonkeyNoNo:: KYcat - I acknowledged your post last time and I'll do it again. Throughout the NH case there have been several different private invite only forums. They come and go. Some are good and some not so. I have not been a member of any of the invite only private forums. One of the good ones is Freebirds. They have put together some really great documents that we have posted here, some I've put to Youtube and some we have put on the front page of SM. Freebirds does good work. Freebirds is also where Kyle chose to post some of the information that is now being shared by Kermit. I don't have a problem with Freebirds except that there's always a problem with "private forums" in that information always leaks out. Another one of the invite only private forums is called ChatnGrumble. It was started by some members of SM that got mad for whatever reason. It is now moderated by two banned ex members of SM. Normally I could care less except that some blatant lies are being spread about SM and me. Evidentally there are alot of people with emotional problems and lack of rational thinking on the internet. Again, private invite only forums are always a problem as information from and about them always leaks out. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 10:10:16 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before
Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 19, 2008, 10:11:52 PM As a moderator, there seem to be three things that will empty the bench, and cause the crowds onto the field to fight:
1. religion 2. politics 3. private forums :smt075 :smt066 :smt067 :smt072 :smt071 :smt070 :smt068 :smt064 :smt091 :smt084 :smt062 jmho :batman: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:14:06 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? That's a good question. Hopefully Klaas will have an answer. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:15:04 PM I apologize Klaas, I missed your response. I don't contribute a lot I know but I am here to support Natalee and family. I care. I promise I won't mention it again.
SM is the best. You guys are intelligent, insightful, and truly caring. (am not sucking up, am not) ::MonkeyHaHa:: Love this place. I have to have daily fixes. I have one question??? Tamikosmom, regarding Kermit getting in trouble for divulging information, didn't she call Washington to get permission before she posted the crab trap photos? That may not be what you are talking about so if not just disregard. Hope she is not in trouble. ::MonkeyRoll:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:15:40 PM Private Forums:
Some ex members started a forum and are stiring the stink. Also, some members were posting here and on a private forum and a well respected Monkey on the private forum posted information on here which we happily thanked her for. OK OK I fell off the wagon ::MonkeyHaHa:: . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 19, 2008, 10:17:12 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:18:06 PM As a moderator, there seem to be three things that will empty the bench, and cause the crowds onto the field to fight: 1. religion 2. politics 3. private forums :smt075 :smt066 :smt067 :smt072 :smt071 :smt070 :smt068 :smt064 :smt091 :smt084 :smt062 jmho :batman: ::MonkeyLaugh:: Well, I know religion and politics bring out the worst in people. I'm as bad as anyone when I am on my soap box!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 10:18:21 PM Private Forums: Some ex members started a forum and are stiring the stink. Also, some members were posting here and on a private forum and a well respected Monkey on the private forum posted information on here which we happily thanked her for. OK OK I fell off the wagon ::MonkeyHaHa:: . I knew you couldn't be good the rest of the night. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 10:20:07 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Thank you, Klaas. Sorry I got the name wrong. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:21:03 PM DAMN.....sorry, I know o/t but I think there is a mouse in my house!!!!!
My dog is going nuts. BBL ::MonkeyEek:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:22:19 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Thank you, Klaas. Sorry I got the name wrong. ::MonkeyHaHa:: the name works for me. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:23:20 PM I spent some time earlier, researching internet copyright law & non-disclosure statements. I ended up finding a lot of forums where people had specific questions about posting emails on blogs, etc. I regret I didn't save the links, but it seems that Kyle would have to have all his posts and emails copywrited to pursue anything against Kermit. Of course, I am not an expert and my research was limited with this old POS (for San) computer.
As San said before, if Kyle posted things that were not his to begin with & things that were not complementary to his employer or others, then, there lies a big problemo....jmho.... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:25:27 PM DAMN.....sorry, I know o/t but I think there is a mouse in my house!!!!! My dog is going nuts. BBL ::MonkeyEek:: I just got up before and walked to the kitchen because I thought the same thing here after the snowfall we had today....aaaccck. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:25:39 PM I spent some time earlier, researching internet copyright law & non-disclosure statements. I ended up finding a lot of forums where people had specific questions about posting emails on blogs, etc. I regret I didn't save the links, but it seems that Kyle would have to have all his posts and emails copywrited to pursue anything against Kermit. Of course, I am not an expert and my research was limited with this old POS (for San) computer. As San said before, if Kyle posted things that were not his to begin with & things that were not complementary to his employer or others, then, there lies a big problemo....jmho.... I agree. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 19, 2008, 10:28:00 PM Goodnight Everyone.
But I do get up sometimes in the middle of the night and come back on so that could be a lie too ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:29:57 PM Goodnight Everyone. But I do get up sometimes in the middle of the night and come back on so that could be a lie too ::MonkeyWink:: Goodnight, San.....I saw you were up early, early this am.... I had a night like that a couple days ago....it was a battle night... ::MonkeyNoNo:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 10:30:10 PM DAMN.....sorry, I know o/t but I think there is a mouse in my house!!!!! My dog is going nuts. BBL ::MonkeyEek:: I just got up before and walked to the kitchen because I thought the same thing here after the snowfall we had today....aaaccck. I have a little lizzard in the house. He is climbing on the Christmas presents as I wrap them. Dog ignores him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 10:31:09 PM Goodnight Everyone. But I do get up sometimes in the middle of the night and come back on so that could be a lie too ::MonkeyWink:: Goodnight San! and come back later if you want to! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 10:34:09 PM Goodnight Everyone. But I do get up sometimes in the middle of the night and come back on so that could be a lie too ::MonkeyWink:: Good Night San. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: KYcat on December 19, 2008, 10:34:18 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh::
How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:36:05 PM DAMN.....sorry, I know o/t but I think there is a mouse in my house!!!!! My dog is going nuts. BBL ::MonkeyEek:: I just got up before and walked to the kitchen because I thought the same thing here after the snowfall we had today....aaaccck. I have a little lizzard in the house. He is climbing on the Christmas presents as I wrap them. Dog ignores him. Had a newt or whatever they called them a few years back in the summer months....pretty to look at outside, but geez, he ran across my living room like a snake. He died in a corner of my kitchen, sad to say, since we couldn't find him right away. Yes, we live in the country and have to deal with this stuff. Glad the bears are sleeping..they are scary. Sorry...OT is over. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 10:37:37 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 10:38:37 PM Well, I am sure my invitation to the new private forum got lost in the email! I know they are crazy about me!
::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 10:41:58 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 19, 2008, 10:42:12 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! I have a Riddex plugged into just about every room now. They seem to work, too. That last article about Rudy Croes, now it seems Aruba is mad not because of what van der Straten did but because Rudy Croes is saying he did it. Go figure! . Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 19, 2008, 10:42:14 PM Well, I am sure my invitation to the new private forum got lost in the email! I know they are crazy about me! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Mine too Anna ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 10:43:09 PM Well, I am sure my invitation to the new private forum got lost in the email! I know they are crazy about me! ::MonkeyHaHa:: No worries, Anna. My mom always told me I was lucky if I could count my friends on one hand, and it's about Natalee, so we don't have to count or think about it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 10:47:32 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Actually, you are supposed to spray it like a dog would pee, the fox is a predator of mice and that's why they RUN from any area the fox has claimed. Or that's what I read anyway! I make my husband spray it, I don't want to risk getting any on me! It's STRONG, from what he says. I promise that's my last post about fox pee! ::MonkeyTongue:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 10:51:13 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Was ChatnGrumble started by disgruntled Monkeys who were posting on the Caylee Marie forum. I was wondering where some of original posters from that forum disappeared to. Maybe I was the underlying reason for the formation of ChatnGrumble. My uncompromising speculations. Hey ... maybe I was the main reason for its formation. My ears were not ringing as a forged onward in my speculations but ... sometimes it takes me a while to clue in. Anyways ... I was not afforded an invitation. I was not afforded the opportunity to decline. ::MonkeyWaa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 19, 2008, 10:54:51 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! I would not want either. I would take ducky ... my computer and ... move out. Hubby could come and fetch me when the coast was clear. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 10:56:11 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! We use a product that is actually "fox urine" that we spray about once a month outside where they might come in. It works! I would not want either. I would take ducky ... my computer and ... move out. Hubby could come and fetch me when the coast was clear. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 19, 2008, 11:12:33 PM G'nite...see you tomorrow.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 19, 2008, 11:13:45 PM Okay, I'm back for a minute. Got to put out traps. That mouse has been eating well somewhere. Probably my cupboards!!! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Hi KYCat...If You are still reading...I wanted to tell You that We just had a small mouse in Our house and the exterminator told us to bait the trap with peanut butter and then to place a peanut or pecan or any kind of nut on top of the peanut butter....We did this and within an hour We heard the trap go off and waalaa We had Him and My Hubby took Him outside and gave Him to the cat.....Haven't seen anymore so hopefully that was the only one.....We figure He came in when We went on Our Thanksgiving trip.......Try it.. it works fast..... ::MonkeyWink:: How do they get in................. acck is right, 2NJ LOL little lizard. They are cute... but my dog would chase his tail. Goodnight San and Say goodnight to me, I'm off to find traps! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 11:19:45 PM G'nite...see you tomorrow. Goodnight 2NJSons! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 11:24:35 PM Yesterday Kermit posted the long post from Kyle about the cop
and the brother......was Kyle talking about Clyde Burke as the cop who was with his brother? I have read it several times and can't get the sense of it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 11:34:01 PM Yesterday Kermit posted the long post from Kyle about the cop and the brother......was Kyle talking about Clyde Burke as the cop who was with his brother? I have read it several times and can't get the sense of it. Good question Magnolia. I'm not sure either. Maybe I'll go bring it forward so we can look at it some more. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 11:35:20 PM Tim Miller: In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/ (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3249/2345840954_e00aee9854_o.jpg) Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th May 16 - Kyle posted: I think it is highly unlikely and completely inconsistent with numerous testimonies and other evidence that the pond (or anything but the ocean) contains Natalee's remains. The witness claims to have seen a muddy Joran coming out of the Monserat pond after disposing of her body. <snip> The 40+ investigators brought in from Holland never stepped foot in the pond John Silvetti's email to Kyle: The Polis did not drain that pond and they did not search it, period! JOHN SILVETTI TELLS CAPS THAT THE TRAP/CAGE IS A POSTOFFICE AND THE CAGE WAS EMPTY. MARCH 3, 2008 – John Silvetti meets with CapsLockWizard From an email sent from CapsLockWizard: “Yes, We did have the meeting today. It was a long meeting and we are all set to start the process of a permit to drain. Witness will gave statement to Lawyer (Helen), Lawyer will motion to drain the pond to OM. If Motion denied, will go to media and expose more dirt. John knows everything now and he will stay behind to help and protect. John state the cage was empty. it was full of these broken plastic bags that shows on the cam like skull, but he said to me it is the water doing tricks when picture was taken. He thinks also it is a postoffice. When I told him the story about the cage, he also understand now some things that he could not have question about. Like why is the Panter allways parked over the spot while there is notting anymore in he cage. The meeting end at 5:00 pm and was very good. About the Pipes. They will be checked. Also John thinks that the signs are there but need to drain the pond. Also Withness is 99% it was some one that came from the pond area that he saw, because it looks like a dutch man and was cover in mud from the chest down.” (http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/8683/image532fx0.jpg) Kyle stated: "This is a picture from Natalee standing on the beach and rotated and scaled to the image to matching the body form inside the trap. It matches the end of the skirt identically to what was seen in the cage." So if we look at Caps' email to Dave and then his posts, MUMinOhio is correct. Caps knew nothing and then he is somehow connected to a witness who magically appears and they go to John Silvetti and it turns John Silvetti from looking at the trap/cage and to looking at the pond, brings the witness to the states for a polygraph test and the evidence is gone from that trap/cage because no one knew except Kyle Kingman and that ROV unit that captured the last photos. Meanwhile John Silvetti is trying to set up an office in Aruba. And so Aruba masterminded the diversion away from any thing about the person's remains inside that cage/trap in the ocean as well as Joran created a media stir with his sit-down Greta interview that he sold Natalee into sex slavery, then the attention turned to Rudy Croes statement Jan van der Straaten was involved in covering-up but that was also brought out in 2006 Jan v/d Straatten was indeed investigated and had telephone conversations with people about the case that he should not have contacts with, or even talk about the case. and now as Hero Brinkman pointed out, if he knew of this, why did he wait 3 1/2 years to say something about it? No body - no case seems to have been the Aruba code word for CORRUPTION! #1468 on: May 07, 2008, 05:28:28 AM muminohio When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle. There is nothing wrong with that, I personally have spent a lot of time and posts sharing any information I had or could find. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.msg379700#msg379700 NOW LET'S FOLLOW CAPS, THE WITNESS/Shango/Simian, ARUBA COPS, KYLE KINGMAN and John Silvetti: Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining. He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. The vision was cryptic and actually contained a latitude which from what he claimed could have been anywhere in the world. The brother thought they were coordinates, but it was just a latitude. Oddly, the latitude was within a half mile from where we found the trap and centered on Arashi beach. Basically, if you stood on land and pointed straight to the trap and were right on the money... this is what the difference amounts to. Based on this latitude we payed a little more attention to the northern portions of the search grid near that Latitude. The trap was found shortly after, within the original search area, but very close to the provided latitude. I would have found the trap without the latitude, but it was very strange. None of us pressed the two for more information because they clearly were VERY uncomfortable. The brother of the detective came to us and was very persistent over the information. He was almost in tears and just had to "clear his conscience" about it. His brother, the detective came with him to 'validate him'. Personally, I think the detective was Simian. The guy kept his mouth shut for the most part but was obviously intelligent and knew a lot more than he led on. It didn't seem he immediately trusted us but gradually became more comfortable, enough to talk. I think he used his brother and gave us only the amount of information he felt we needed to come across the trap. Basically, by using his brother and claiming the information he shared was only based on a vision, it distances the detective from responsibility and makes it hard to point back to him should it be a problem later. I think the whole game was bogus and he knew almost everything but was helping how he was able and felt comfortable. I don't understand why he had to use his brother and claim a "vision". The implications of this are tremendous. If true, it means that the early investigators knew where and how Natalee was disposed and it was kept secret and covered up. Not wanting to be implicated but still wanting to help, he could shift the information to a vision of his brothers, perhaps still help a bit and claim no-involvement. However, this man was intelligent enough, cared about the case, yet was self implicated to a high enough level to want to be kept his knowledge a secret. He spoke well enough english and knew everything in my opinion. Perhaps I should find out his name. I never got it. We may never have. Kyle said: "Based on the little I know of Simian, there are striking similarities that stood out after I laid down on the evening I met with the detective and his brother.Perhaps Simian is the detective and Shango is the brother. Kyle said: "- IF a key detective's brother knew the latitude the trap was disposed at or very near, then it's probable the detective knew the same. - IF the detective knew the latitude, how did he come to this knowledge? - Who else knew this information? Since the trap was only in 90ft of water and the detective knew about the latitude, did the Polis already know if it's location prior to the search? The detective originally wouldn't meet with us and only wanted us to meet with his brother. We convinced him to meet along with his brother and made him feel as comfortable as possible. He reluctantly agreed but wouldn't talk. The brother did all the talking at first. It seemed to me the brother was acting out the "vision" scenario to protect the detective brother. It didn't feel like the brother was in any way corrupt or connected. Also, he wasn't that bright compared to the detective brother. After a while the detective started asking some questions and loosened up a bit. With the pointed questions he asked he proved he knew a lot, but we didn't press him. The reason I think the detective is Simian is that: - he is intimately connected to the case - forced into silence - both he and the brother seemed to want the case solved but the whole encounter was so CRYPTIC - he is condemned if his identity and knowledge were BOTH exposed. One or the other, he's still safe - He was intelligent and had a good enough command over the english language (not common over the rest of the bunch) - IF his brother was acting on his behalf with the whole 'I had a vision' act, then the detective's character supports pulling something like Simian off. - the detective was very internet and computer savy, which was unusual for the bulk of the Polis. - It seemed he knew who I was when we were introduced, and said something indicating he had been reading the blog. - his character was very cryptic; the way he moved, spoke, and asked questions was just not normal. "Caps is not Simian. He has indicated he knows who was either Shango or Simian. The person he thinks it is, is a cop. it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz bump Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 19, 2008, 11:36:00 PM Yesterday Kermit posted the long post from Kyle about the cop and the brother......was Kyle talking about Clyde Burke as the cop who was with his brother? I have read it several times and can't get the sense of it. Good question Magnolia. I'm not sure either. Maybe I'll go bring it forward so we can look at it some more. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 19, 2008, 11:37:33 PM Yesterday Kermit posted the long post from Kyle about the cop and the brother......was Kyle talking about Clyde Burke as the cop who was with his brother? I have read it several times and can't get the sense of it. Good question Magnolia. I'm not sure either. Maybe I'll go bring it forward so we can look at it some more. Please do. I think the main point is that the cop knew where the body was and passed it off as his brother's "vision". Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 19, 2008, 11:40:40 PM "Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining."
That is Clyde Burke, right? "He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. " Yes, I think that is what Kermit was telling us, Magnolia. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 19, 2008, 11:46:06 PM "Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining." I think so too!That is Clyde Burke, right? "He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. " Yes, I think that is what Kermit was telling us, Magnolia. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: cajun miracle on December 19, 2008, 11:48:12 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Can this site be accessed, to read, or is it NOT available? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Red on December 19, 2008, 11:49:25 PM Wreck,
I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:49:51 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Can this site be accessed, to read, or is it NOT available? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 19, 2008, 11:53:06 PM Wreck, Thank-you -- I appreciate that. I would never ask that you reveal anything priveliged. But a "reassurance" every once in awhile would be great!I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 19, 2008, 11:53:18 PM The mention of a Vision reminded Me of this post...
Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow? I give you the post again....Left on a blog called Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................ 8:41 pm anonymous said... It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: cajun miracle on December 19, 2008, 11:56:18 PM Wreck, I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Thanks Red!!!!!!!!! Yipppeeeeee & Merry Christmas. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 19, 2008, 11:59:31 PM I have a question....Did the Gab&Grumble site exist before Kermit made his revelations or did it start shortly after that time? Yes, from all indications ChatnGrumble was started more as an offshoot of the Caylee Anthony case in the beginning and it's inception has nothing to do with Kermit's revelations. Was ChatnGrumble started by disgruntled Monkeys who were posting on the Caylee Marie forum. I was wondering where some of original posters from that forum disappeared to. Maybe I was the underlying reason for the formation of ChatnGrumble. My uncompromising speculations. Hey ... maybe I was the main reason for its formation. My ears were not ringing as a forged onward in my speculations but ... sometimes it takes me a while to clue in. Anyways ... I was not afforded an invitation. I was not afforded the opportunity to decline. ::MonkeyWaa:: Janet I would say yes Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 12:00:46 AM Wreck, I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Thanks Red! ::MonkeyCool:: And thanks Wreck, for asking! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: MuffyBee on December 20, 2008, 12:02:05 AM Wreck, I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Thank you for the encouragement Red. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 12:03:38 AM Wreck, Thank You Red! ::MonkeyDance::I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 12:06:49 AM <SNIPPED? When Caps first started posting in the forum he knew very little about the case, or so it appears from his early posts. He asked us about the family, the friends, the private plane and the pimps. He asked about the suspects and about the people such as Julia and others that continually misinformed us. He needed our help and knowledge with these pieces of the puzzle ... <SNIPPED> It is not just Caps lack of knowledge of the Natalee Holloway case and the main players in his initial posts ... it was also his attempt to portray that he did not have a grasp of the English language. I hate deception and ... in my mind ... Caps was deception personified from the getgo. The time spent attempting to interpret Caps cryptic words and ... the time following his flawed research ... told me that he had placed himself or ... was placed by higher ups to distract from the contents of that cage. Janet ______ CAPS - JANUARY, 2008 CapsLockWizard Re: Natalee Case Discussion #715 1/25 - « Reply #384 on: January 27, 2008, 02:51:39 PM » need to know 2 things Did Natalee travel somewhere before he come to Aruba and and the parents tree Natalee is the doughter of ----- and --------- etc. I know that probably Dave Holloway has notting to do with this Case but the Twitty Wat is twitty to natalee? http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2539.msg332978;topicseen#msg332978 CAPS - DECEMBER 13, 2008 CapsLockWizard Re: Natalee Case Discussion #784 12/8/08 - « Reply #925 on: December 13, 2008, 06:18:09 AM » To seek Justice it has to come from the UN. No other place. it has to be done with the vigil eyes of either to Interpol or the FBI. This has to be resolved first. Te reaon for this is that The Justice Ldy is standing one leg in the US Law system and one leg in the Dutch Law System. But the Dutch Law and the US Law doe not meet eye to eye in terms of what is allowable or permissible in court. E.g. Drinking in the US is 21, Drinking in Aruba is 18. Driving us is 16 yr (student license), in Aruba is 18. in the criminal law there are differance to be resolved. What is not possible in the US is possible in the Dutch Law. To arbitraite between these two courts has to come form both side. If Aruba let the dutch Investige a Dutch Polis, how can they be fair...Now Aruba ALE can investige but in Aruba Court the Judge is a Dutch and the Prosecuters are Dutch...How fair can that be... If we look at Bonaire case. The Dutch girls was a victim of a crime and the Dutch came down in storms to defend the Girls and seek Justice and where happy to acuse the Locals. In the Case of Natalee , the process is reverse, this time we have a Dutch Perp...and a US girl Mising, What they did is to rotect this time the Dutch Perp at all Cost, by twisting the law to accomodate their own system to secure a safe haven for the boy. Now haw fair is that, If I use the Term " Cacho no ta come Cacho" meaning Dogs do not eat Dogs. The only way that it will work is that Natalee case go to the UN and there request a resolution to the facts and by this request an independant Body of Justice to do the Investigation... I did wrote this in February 2008 already. The is a provision in the International in the UN for that type of checkmate between to law despute. Even if Aruba do his own investigations, it can not be parcial since the OM are all Dutch and the police chiefs are all Dutch. the checkmate lock has to be broken by an independed UN appointed court. No other way, Rudy Croes can request that, but that also means goodby to his whish to have the New BES island cout in Aruba. eventough it is a lost case already. The dutch has spoken allready. CAPS http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4227.msg580535#msg580535 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 12:42:14 AM The more I read, the more questions I have!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 12:43:47 AM The more I read, the more questions I have! Ain't that the truth! ::MonkeyConfused:: ::MonkeyWink::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:00:29 AM Could it be that the detective knew the truth, wanted it to come out; so sends "brother" to the Persistence crew to tell about the "vision". But knowing how close attention is being paid to the Persistence search by the monkeys; asks a "friend" to come here and distract the attention away from the ocean?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 01:06:34 AM Could it be that the detective knew the truth, wanted it to come out; so sends "brother" to the Persistence crew to tell about the "vision". But knowing how close attention is being paid to the Persistence search by the monkeys; asks a "friend" to come here and distract the attention away from the ocean? Friend Equals Caps?Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:16:08 AM Could it be that the detective knew the truth, wanted it to come out; so sends "brother" to the Persistence crew to tell about the "vision". But knowing how close attention is being paid to the Persistence search by the monkeys; asks a "friend" to come here and distract the attention away from the ocean? Friend Equals Caps?I was told that a long time ago, but never knew for sure. Never asked Caps myself. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:21:28 AM Caps says the witness is going to give a statement to Helen. Clyde B. meets with Helen...is he the witness too? I know that's not the name Jossy said. It makes sense that a search of the pond wouldn't be allowed if the statement given had nothing to do with the pond.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:26:17 AM o.k., I'll be quiet. Somebody else....thoughts please.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 01:26:36 AM Caps says the witness is going to give a statement to Helen. Clyde B. meets with Helen...is he the witness too? I know that's not the name Jossy said. It makes sense that a search of the pond wouldn't be allowed if the statement given had nothing to do with the pond. Maybe Clyde is a witness.....no there would be no need to search the pond if He stated she was in the ocean.... ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyConfused:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 20, 2008, 01:32:49 AM Caps says the witness is going to give a statement to Helen. Clyde B. meets with Helen...is he the witness too? I know that's not the name Jossy said. It makes sense that a search of the pond wouldn't be allowed if the statement given had nothing to do with the pond. Maybe Clyde is a witness.....no there would be no need to search the pond if He stated she was in the ocean.... ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyConfused:: For the record I still don't know what to believe when it comes to Caps. I will say that I had believed long before Caps showed up that Clyde Burke was simian. So who met with Helen? What relation is Clyde to Caps? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 20, 2008, 01:36:31 AM GOODNIGHT ALL!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:39:16 AM GOODNIGHT ALL! Goodnight Klaas! ::MonkeyCool:: I think Clyde as Simian is a good possibility too! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:54:02 AM (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/CarpePicNatalee1.png)
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 01:54:42 AM Goodnight everyone! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 03:13:57 AM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. Magnolia followed up with contact info for Birmingham FBI... I followed up with State Department contact info and even posted my email to the State Department below...Has anyone else submitted emails to FBI or State Department? Just wondering and wanted to ensure Kermit's suggestions didn't go by the wayside. :) Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #426 on: December 18, 2008, 09:25:06 PM » Reply with quoteQuote Special Agent in Charge Carmen S. Adams Assistant Special Agent in Charge Charles E. Regan Birmingham Division History Birmingham Division Contact Information Address 1000 18th Street North Birmingham, Alabama 35203 Telephone (205)326-6166 Facsimile (205)279-1590 General information: birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Office Hours 8:15 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday 24 Hour Emergency Service How to Report a Crime or Provide Information For the location of a local FBI office, see our Jurisdiction page An FBI representative can be reached 24 hours a day by calling (205)326-6166 If you have been the victim of a crime or have information relating to a crime, please contact your nearest FBI office. All complaints are confidential. You can also email the Birmingham office at birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Posts: 161 View Profile Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #465 on: December 19, 2008, 12:01:25 AM » Reply with quoteQuote Quote from: billb on December 18, 2008, 11:42:40 PM US State Department OVERSEAS CITIZENS SERVICES: Call 1-888-407-4747 (from overseas: 202-501-4444) for answers related to questions concerning the: * Death of an American citizen abroad * Arrest/detention of an American citizen abroad * Robbery of an American citizen abroad * American citizens missing abroad * Crisis abroad involving American citizens * After-hours number for an emergency involving an American citizen abroad To ask a question via email: http://contact-us.state.gov/cgi-bin/state.cfg/php/enduser/ask.php?p_sid=jxOHQJlj&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPSZwX3NvcnRfYnk9JnBfZ3JpZHNvcnQ9JnBfcm93X2NudD0xMTEsMTExJnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT1hbnN3ZXJzLnNlYXJjaF9ubCZwX3BhZ2U9MQ** Copy and paste the bold HTTP It was easy to submit a question on the site: My question: Secretary Rice met with the mother (Beth Holloway Twitty) of Natalee Holloway WRT her daughter's disappearance May 30th, 2005. Secretary Rice, after hearing Beth's account of the lack of investigation by the Aruban authorities, directed that the FBI take a closer look into the events surrounding her daughter's disappearance. Can you please provide an update of the actions our State Department, Secretary Rice, and the FBI have taken to ensure there is/will be Justice for Natalee Holloway, a US citizen? Thank you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 03:21:17 AM Yesterday Kermit posted the long post from Kyle about the cop and the brother......was Kyle talking about Clyde Burke as the cop who was with his brother? I have read it several times and can't get the sense of it. Good question Magnolia. I'm not sure either. Maybe I'll go bring it forward so we can look at it some more. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 03:28:25 AM Wreck, Red,I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Thanks for the post....I would never presume to speak for wreck or any other dedicated Monkey searching for Justice for Natalee.... I look forward to whatever you can tell us over the weekend.....I believe in my heart that there will be justice, and I can say that with the utmost confidence: ONLY because of the hard work you and all the Monkeys have done to support Beth and Dave and Natalee and her extended family.. Thank you for all you do.... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 03:39:15 AM Seems like I always post just after everyone says goodnight! ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyWaa::
Oh well, maybe it will get picked up in the morning...nite all (reminds me of Paint your Wagon with Clint Eastwood....a musical no less: I talk to the trees..no one listens to me...) What a classic...Clint Eastwood in a singing role...he has got to be embarrassed every time that comes upl ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 03:55:53 AM Seems like I always post just after everyone says goodnight! ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyWaa:: Not kidding about Paint your Wagon...view the trailer...Oh well, maybe it will get picked up in the morning...nite all (reminds me of Paint your Wagon with Clint Eastwood....a musical no less: I talk to the trees..no one listens to me...) What a classic...Clint Eastwood in a singing role...he has got to be embarrassed every time that comes upl ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064782/ Soundtrack: http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/paintyourwagon/italktothetrees.htm ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 04:17:11 AM Seems like I always post just after everyone says goodnight! ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyWaa:: Not kidding about Paint your Wagon...view the trailer...Oh well, maybe it will get picked up in the morning...nite all (reminds me of Paint your Wagon with Clint Eastwood....a musical no less: I talk to the trees..no one listens to me...) What a classic...Clint Eastwood in a singing role...he has got to be embarrassed every time that comes upl ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064782/ Soundtrack: http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/paintyourwagon/italktothetrees.htm ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyDance:: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVKv6PdBR-I Just unwinding after a long week just before Christmas ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 04:25:05 AM ::MonkeyCool:: This is GREAT!!! Neither Klaas, Blonde, SAN, 2NJ_SONS nor any other past, present, future moderator can stop me now....I'm free ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 20, 2008, 04:28:03 AM ::MonkeyCool:: This is GREAT!!! Neither Klaas, Blonde, SAN, 2NJ_SONS nor any other past, present, future moderator can stop me now....I'm free ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: Gotta go...the wife found my meds... ::MonkeyWink::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 20, 2008, 08:31:44 AM Good Morning -
Clyde Burke - he was discovered by Grande through a time line that included links to the actual PV's and the info contained within. That is a fact and one we can't deny. When Simian posted it was determined without a doubt that the info often came within thirty minutes of one of the suspects making a statement. We all know that. It's a very convincing case and how often has Grande been wrong? Not often, if ever. We all know Grande's track record. Is Grande wrong? I'm not saying he is, but in order from Grande to be 100% correct you have to factor in some issues that most don't know about. First, Clyde Burke would have had to hack Armin Solongier's email account and that means that Armin is telling the truth that he made only a few posts as Simian and Merian. It doesn't seem at all likely that someone could hack TWO SEPARATE SM USER ID'S / ACCOUNTS. This means that Armin starts two separate SM accounts and Clyde Burke some how accesses BOTH accounts all the while know that neither is directly connected to Armin. What are the chances of that happening? Armin admits he posted on both accounts. Both accounts came from the the EXACT SAME IP ADDRESS. In my opinion, there is no way that could all happen, unless Armin started the accounts AND TURNED THEM OVER TO CLYDE. It's a very very small chance, but one none the less. Second, who fits the profile for Simian? A cop or a musician who works at a large bank in marketing? Armin's email address is connected directly to his love fer music and his band at the time. That email address was posted on Garage Bands dot com. This is all posted in the Shango / Simian threads. vms and I have developed an extensive amount of info that says without a doubt Armin is SIMIAN AND MERIAN. Armin uses a MAC and edited all of the videos from his band on that computer. Simian posted from a MAC. Armin is a literary buff and loves books, music and art. He is very talented, I know - cause I actually know him in REAL LIFE and I have told you all this before. At one time I considered him a good friend. I never thought he could be Simian or Merian until vms and I found A HUGE PILE OF PROOF. At each and every turn one link became two, two became four, four became eight. At some point, I just have to accept that where the info takes me. Armin tells you who he is in his posts and the person behind the keyboard fits like a glove. He is of french decent, highly educated, speaks many languages, and has a huge desire to protect Aruba. He tells you all who he is. I'm not trying to get Armin in an uproar this morning, cause I know he'll read this, he reads everything. He googles his name and what we say pops up and he gets pissed. But the truth is the truth. We have been over all of this before and he wrote me an email after vms contacted him and he was quite pissy about the whole sordid affair. In his email, he admits that he POSTED AS SIMIAN AND MERIAN. But says that his accounts were hacked. I explained that above. vms, I'm sure will verify everything I have said about Armin. Like I said - THE TRUTH IS THE TRUTH. If vms wants to post or repost all the info we have complied, I have no problem with that at all, I don't feeling doing it again cause it's all been covered and I am convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt Armin is Simian. There is always the chance that Clyde and Armin are friends and Clyde related all the info directly to Armin and he then posted it as Simian. We ALL KNOW everyone knows everyone. Who wrote the posts - Armin did. I'm sure. How did Armin get the info - Maybe from Clyde - I'm not sure at all. vms and I have the info stored and if she wants to repost it, that's certainly fine with me. She has access to it all. Also, not to take away from the others who helped compile info on Armin, you are not forgotten nor are your efforts. and No, I still don't know who Shango is. I suspect he is from the Chemaly family and lived in Florida, near Jossy, but do not know fer sure. There are still too many unanswered questions here fer me and although others here have shared what they have found and the links, I'm still not totally convinced who he is. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 20, 2008, 08:43:15 AM Good Morning - Thanks, Rob -- I never immersed myself in the Shango/Simian thread. While I understand the implications of their messages, it angers me immensley that these people could have put an end to all this 3 1/2 + years ago. Clyde Burke - he was discovered by Grande through a time line that included links to the actual PV's and the info contained within. That is a fact and one we can't deny. When Simian posted it was determined without a doubt that the info often came within thirty minutes of one of the suspects making a statement. We all know that. It's a very convincing case and how often has Grande been wrong? Not often, if ever. We all know Grande's track record. Is Grande wrong? I'm not saying he is, but in order from Grande to be 100% correct you have to factor in some issues that most don't know about. First, Clyde Burke would have had to hack Armin Solongier's email account and that means that Armin is telling the truth that he made only a few posts as Simian and Merian. It doesn't seem at all likely that someone could hack TWO SEPARATE SM USER ID'S / ACCOUNTS. This means that Armin starts two separate SM accounts and Clyde Burke some how accesses BOTH accounts all the while know that neither is directly connected to Armin. What are the chances of that happening? Armin admits he posted on both accounts. Both accounts came from the the EXACT SAME IP ADDRESS. In my opinion, there is no way that could all happen, unless Armin started the accounts AND TURNED THEM OVER TO CLYDE. It's a very very small chance, but one none the less. Second, who fits the profile for Simian? A cop or a musician who works at a large bank in marketing? Armin's email address is connected directly to his love fer music and his band at the time. That email address was posted on Garage Bands dot com. This is all posted in the Shango / Simian threads. vms and I have developed an extensive amount of info that says without a doubt Armin is SIMIAN AND MERIAN. Armin uses a MAC and edited all of the videos from his band on that computer. Simian posted from a MAC. Armin is a literary buff and loves books, music and art. He is very talented, I know - cause I actually know him in REAL LIFE and I have told you all this before. At one time I considered him a good friend. I never thought he could be Simian or Merian until vms and I found A HUGE PILE OF PROOF. At each and every turn one link became two, two became four, four became eight. At some point, I just have to accept that where the info takes me. Armin tells you who he is in his posts and the person behind the keyboard fits like a glove. He is of french decent, highly educated, speaks many languages, and has a huge desire to protect Aruba. He tells you all who he is. I'm not trying to get Armin in an uproar this morning, cause I know he'll read this, he reads everything. He googles his name and what we say pops up and he gets pissed. But the truth is the truth. We have been over all of this before and he wrote me an email after vms contacted him and he was quite pissy about the whole sordid affair. In his email, he admits that he POSTED AS SIMIAN AND MERIAN. But says that his accounts were hacked. I explained that above. vms, I'm sure will verify everything I have said about Armin. Like I said - THE TRUTH IS THE TRUTH. If vms wants to post or repost all the info we have complied, I have no problem with that at all, I don't feeling doing it again cause it's all been covered and I am convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt Armin is Simian. There is always the chance that Clyde and Armin are friends and Clyde related all the info directly to Armin and he then posted it as Simian. We ALL KNOW everyone knows everyone. Who wrote the posts - Armin did. I'm sure. How did Armin get the info - Maybe from Clyde - I'm not sure at all. vms and I have the info stored and if she wants to repost it, that's certainly fine with me. She has access to it all. Also, not to take away from the others who helped compile info on Armin, you are not forgotten nor are your efforts. and No, I still don't know who Shango is. I suspect he is from the Chemaly family and lived in Florida, near Jossy, but do not know fer sure. There are still too many unanswered questions here fer me and although others here have shared what they have found and the links, I'm still not totally convinced who he is. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 20, 2008, 08:47:00 AM Thanks, Rob -- I never immersed myself in the Shango/Simian thread. While I understand the implications of their messages, it angers me immensley that these people could have put an end to all this 3 1/2 + years ago. Good morning wreck, and I'm as angered as you my friend. Armin and I went around and around about THE info to the point where he said I'm not the person to give you that info. It all came down to protecting Aruba. Nothing more. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 20, 2008, 10:19:44 AM Good Morning - Clyde Burke - he was discovered by Grande through a time line that included links to the actual PV's and the info contained within. That is a fact and one we can't deny. When Simian posted it was determined without a doubt that the info often came within thirty minutes of one of the suspects making a statement. We all know that. It's a very convincing case and how often has Grande been wrong? Not often, if ever. We all know Grande's track record. Is Grande wrong? I'm not saying he is, but in order from Grande to be 100% correct you have to factor in some issues that most don't know about. First, Clyde Burke would have had to hack Armin Solongier's email account and that means that Armin is telling the truth that he made only a few posts as Simian and Merian. It doesn't seem at all likely that someone could hack TWO SEPARATE SM USER ID'S / ACCOUNTS. This means that Armin starts two separate SM accounts and Clyde Burke some how accesses BOTH accounts all the while know that neither is directly connected to Armin. What are the chances of that happening? Armin admits he posted on both accounts. Both accounts came from the the EXACT SAME IP ADDRESS. In my opinion, there is no way that could all happen, unless Armin started the accounts AND TURNED THEM OVER TO CLYDE. It's a very very small chance, but one none the less. Second, who fits the profile for Simian? A cop or a musician who works at a large bank in marketing? Armin's email address is connected directly to his love fer music and his band at the time. That email address was posted on Garage Bands dot com. This is all posted in the Shango / Simian threads. vms and I have developed an extensive amount of info that says without a doubt Armin is SIMIAN AND MERIAN. Armin uses a MAC and edited all of the videos from his band on that computer. Simian posted from a MAC. Armin is a literary buff and loves books, music and art. He is very talented, I know - cause I actually know him in REAL LIFE and I have told you all this before. At one time I considered him a good friend. I never thought he could be Simian or Merian until vms and I found A HUGE PILE OF PROOF. At each and every turn one link became two, two became four, four became eight. At some point, I just have to accept that where the info takes me. Armin tells you who he is in his posts and the person behind the keyboard fits like a glove. He is of french decent, highly educated, speaks many languages, and has a huge desire to protect Aruba. He tells you all who he is. I'm not trying to get Armin in an uproar this morning, cause I know he'll read this, he reads everything. He googles his name and what we say pops up and he gets pissed. But the truth is the truth. We have been over all of this before and he wrote me an email after vms contacted him and he was quite pissy about the whole sordid affair. In his email, he admits that he POSTED AS SIMIAN AND MERIAN. But says that his accounts were hacked. I explained that above. vms, I'm sure will verify everything I have said about Armin. Like I said - THE TRUTH IS THE TRUTH. If vms wants to post or repost all the info we have complied, I have no problem with that at all, I don't feeling doing it again cause it's all been covered and I am convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt Armin is Simian. There is always the chance that Clyde and Armin are friends and Clyde related all the info directly to Armin and he then posted it as Simian. We ALL KNOW everyone knows everyone. Who wrote the posts - Armin did. I'm sure. How did Armin get the info - Maybe from Clyde - I'm not sure at all. vms and I have the info stored and if she wants to repost it, that's certainly fine with me. She has access to it all. Also, not to take away from the others who helped compile info on Armin, you are not forgotten nor are your efforts. and No, I still don't know who Shango is. I suspect he is from the Chemaly family and lived in Florida, near Jossy, but do not know fer sure. There are still too many unanswered questions here fer me and although others here have shared what they have found and the links, I'm still not totally convinced who he is. Rob - Grande and I were working together on this. Maybe you should ask Grande who determined that Simian way Clyde :-) ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 20, 2008, 10:21:34 AM And yes, I sill believe Simian is Clyde and not Armin.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 11:09:45 AM Kyle said: "My opinion on Simian is that he is a detective/cop involved in the case since the beginning. My understanding is that there is only one of the originals remaining. He came to us during the search along with his brother who had a "vision" on where Natalee was disposed. The vision was cryptic and actually contained a latitude which from what he claimed could have been anywhere in the world. The brother thought they were coordinates, but it was just a latitude. Oddly, the latitude was within a half mile from where we found the trap and centered on Arashi beach. Basically, if you stood on land and pointed straight to the trap and were right on the money... this is what the difference amounts to. Based on this latitude we payed a little more attention to the northern portions of the search grid near that Latitude. The trap was found shortly after, within the original search area, but very close to the provided latitude. I would have found the trap without the latitude, but it was very strange. None of us pressed the two for more information because they clearly were VERY uncomfortable. <snipped> Aruba Case Appears Stalled ORANJESTAD, Aruba, June 12, 2005 Holloway's family rushed late Friday to an old stone lighthouse beside Arisha beach after Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that one of three young men in custody admitted that "something bad happened" to Holloway and was leading police to the scene of the alleged crime. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/06/10/national/main700829.shtml Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 20, 2008, 11:43:09 AM I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
That was a really tacky statement by Kyle, and if true, he couldn't even do as advised......he still wrote the letter to Kermit. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 11:51:19 AM I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. That was a really tacky statement by Kyle, and if true, he couldn't even do as advised......he still wrote the letter to Kermit. Exactly Magnolia. He either doesn't listen to authority or he was uncomfortable with the response he received. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 11:54:15 AM I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. That was a really tacky statement by Kyle, and if true, he couldn't even do as advised......he still wrote the letter to Kermit. He would not be worried about saving anyone embarrassment. He is worried about himself and himself only. Professional courtesy went out the window a very long time ago. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 20, 2008, 12:04:06 PM I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. That was a really tacky statement by Kyle, and if true, he couldn't even do as advised......he still wrote the letter to Kermit. He would not be worried about saving anyone embarrassment. He is worried about himself and himself only. Professional courtesy went out the window a very long time ago. And don't you think that if he(Kyle) had spoken to a lawyer, he would have had the lawyer write a cease and desist to Kermit? Kyle is POS. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 12:08:43 PM I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited. I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet. Kermit doesn't matter". So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case. I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top. That was a really tacky statement by Kyle, and if true, he couldn't even do as advised......he still wrote the letter to Kermit. He would not be worried about saving anyone embarrassment. He is worried about himself and himself only. Professional courtesy went out the window a very long time ago. And don't you think that if he(Kyle) had spoken to a lawyer, he would have had the lawyer write a cease and desist to Kermit? Kyle is POS. ::MonkeyHaHa:: I agree. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Red on December 20, 2008, 12:18:07 PM Tracy Pollan to Play Beth Holloway in Lifetime TV Movie, The Natalee Holloway Story … As Aruba Hides Head in the Sand of Cover Up
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/12/20/tracy-pollan-to-play-beth-holloway-in-lifetime-tv-movie-the-natalee-holloway-story-as-aruba-hides-head-in-the-sand-of-covver-up/ The shelf life of a TV Lifetime movie has a half life of a radioactive isotope ... Aruba will never shed itself of this story unless they stand up like men and provide justice. Quote Just when Aruba thought the Natalee Holloway story was going to go away, they will now have to face the fact that there will be a Lifetime movie directed by Mikael Salomon made of the events of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and the subsequent botched investigation and cover up. Justice for Natalee … the further exposing of the corruption and nepotism that went on in Aruba to this day in providing a family no answers or “Justice for Natalee”. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 12:30:52 PM Thank You Red.....Aruba just does not get it.....All Most of Us want is to Bring Natalee Home and Aruba can do that but instead They keep the lies coming after all this time....... ::MonkeyWaa::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 12:32:44 PM I agree that Kyle Kingman's own words on a private site imply that he has betrayed justice for Natalee and ... closure for her family when he did not immediately revealing to the family/FBI on his returned to the States ... the second set of ROV images as well his observations while on board the Persistence ... observations that imply that the undertaking by John S. was all about self-serving motives.
However ... a few of Kyle's posts to the SM site reveal that Kyle embraces a faith ... a faith that reflects my own. It is my sincere prayer that this faith will be the catalyst to a change of heart ... a change of heart that will reveal to the FBI/family the ENTIRE story regarding the hoax encompassing the Persistence endeavor. "Genuine" repentence paves the road to forgiveness. There will be related consequences but ... in the long run ... the lightened burden will make it all worthwhile and ... lessons learned will make it all worthwhile. Good Morning Monkeys. Good Morning Kyle. Janet 9:30 AM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 12:33:22 PM Thank You Red.....Aruba just does not get it.....All Most of Us want is to Bring Natalee Home and Aruba can do that but instead They keep the lies coming after all this time....... ::MonkeyWaa:: They don't get that we don't want her final resting place to be on their POS island. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: EURobert on December 20, 2008, 12:39:31 PM Tracy Pollan to Play Beth Holloway in Lifetime TV Movie, The Natalee Holloway Story … As Aruba Hides Head in the Sand of Cover Up http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/12/20/tracy-pollan-to-play-beth-holloway-in-lifetime-tv-movie-the-natalee-holloway-story-as-aruba-hides-head-in-the-sand-of-covver-up/ The shelf life of a TV Lifetime movie has a half life of a radioactive isotope ... Aruba will never shed itself of this story unless they stand up like men and provide justice. Quote Just when Aruba thought the Natalee Holloway story was going to go away, they will now have to face the fact that there will be a Lifetime movie directed by Mikael Salomon made of the events of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and the subsequent botched investigation and cover up. Justice for Natalee … the further exposing of the corruption and nepotism that went on in Aruba to this day in providing a family no answers or “Justice for Natalee”. Remember Dutch Parliamentarian (and Minister of Internal Affairs and Kingdomrelations in 2005) Johan Remkes last week voted against the Rijksrecherche doing a corruption-investigation at Aruba! And me sending him an email? Maybe it will open his eyes when he sees there will be a movie on Natalee’s disappearence soon that probably will be seen around the world and will exponentially damage tourism to Aruba. Maybe he’ll be inspired to do something (behind the scenes) to solve the Natalee Holloway-case when we all send him an email! j.remkes@tweedekamer.nl Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 12:55:43 PM Thank You Red.....Aruba just does not get it.....All Most of Us want is to Bring Natalee Home and Aruba can do that but instead They keep the lies coming after all this time....... ::MonkeyWaa:: They don't get that we don't want her final resting place to be on their POS island. I agree, and no matter how long it takes; WE'RE NOT GIVING UP! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 01:02:31 PM Thank You Red.....Aruba just does not get it.....All Most of Us want is to Bring Natalee Home and Aruba can do that but instead They keep the lies coming after all this time....... ::MonkeyWaa:: They don't get that we don't want her final resting place to be on their POS island. I agree, and no matter how long it takes; WE'RE NOT GIVING UP! ::MonkeyCool:: That is not an option. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 20, 2008, 01:06:28 PM Hey Red,
How can they stand up like men when they sit down to pee? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 01:12:07 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather realized very early on that a coverup in the investigation dictated that justice for his stepdaughter was not about to come from an Aruban or Dutch court. Jug Twitty's only request was that he could bring his Natalee home ...
If the contents of the cage/trap held Natalee Holloway's remains ... for the sake of a measure of closure ... the family needs to know. Surely Aruba could afford this one significant gesture. Janet ++++++ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 01:15:32 PM Hi Frank.
I have missed ya. I hope all is well. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 20, 2008, 01:28:01 PM found some interesting quotes from way back:
Karin Janssen was then interviewed on television and made this statement: "The suspicion for these two suspects (guards) range from murder, to homicide, to kidnapping with death as a result. We also have complicity or accessory to those two criminal acts." And this from Mickey John the guard: Van Susteren: Anything else you'd like to say? John: Well, like I said before, the justice system, the detectives, they're fools. They have to go back to school. And they were used, like, a scapegoat, used,like, a black person in society to cover their mess. And this: Attorney General Mariaine Croes: "Paulus Van der sloot is being held in suspicion of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, not the cover-up." Cover up? What cover up? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 01:33:34 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather realized very early on that a coverup in the investigation dictated that justice for his stepdaughter was not about to come from an Aruban or Dutch court. Jug Twitty's only request was that he could bring his Natalee home ... If the contents of the cage/trap held Natalee Holloway's remains ... for the sake of a measure of closure ... the family needs to know. Surely Aruba could afford this one significant gesture. Janet ++++++ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ NANCY GRACE Nancy Grace for June 9, 2005, CNNHN Aired June 9, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET BETH TWITTY, MOTHER OF MISSING GIRL: Our primary goal is to bring Natalee back home. We will do whatever it takes. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0506/09/ng.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 01:41:30 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather realized very early on that a coverup in the investigation dictated that justice for his stepdaughter was not about to come from an Aruban or Dutch court. Jug Twitty's only request was that he could bring his Natalee home ... If the contents of the cage/trap held Natalee Holloway's remains ... for the sake of a measure of closure ... the family needs to know. Surely Aruba could afford this one significant gesture. Janet ++++++ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ If Jug and his friends weren't there this whole thing would have been over. He was smart and wasn't about to be fooled by Straaten, KJ and Dompig. This is why in my opinion KJ couldn't stand him. He stood up to her and when he did she threatened him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 20, 2008, 01:47:35 PM I love the Mr. Deetch.
Dear Mr.Deetch, Thank you for your email regarding JetBlue's recent announcement of new service to Aruba. We appreciate you sharing your views and having the opportunity to respond to your concerns. It is tragic that an event so terrible could occur to a visitor to a foreign nation. JetBlue has been considering starting service to Aruba, as nearly all other major US airlines do, for several years. Our decision, based on numerous market and competitive factors, was unrelated to the terrible event there. In no way does JetBlue ascribe to the entire population of Aruba, or its government, the malicious and criminal behavior of a few. Each market JetBlue serves is one, we believe, in high demand by the traveling public and one where airfares are too high. In this regard, Aruba is no different. Again, we appreciate you taking the time to share your views with JetBlue. Sincerely, Sonja Customer Commitment Crew JetBlue Airways Crewmember 25784 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 02:16:08 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather realized very early on that a coverup in the investigation dictated that justice for his stepdaughter was not about to come from an Aruban or Dutch court. Jug Twitty's only request was that he could bring his Natalee home ... If the contents of the cage/trap held Natalee Holloway's remains ... for the sake of a measure of closure ... the family needs to know. Surely Aruba could afford this one significant gesture. Janet ++++++ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ If Jug and his friends weren't there this whole thing would have been over. He was smart and wasn't about to be fooled by Straaten, KJ and Dompig. This is why in my opinion KJ couldn't stand him. He stood up to her and when he did she threatened him. Jug and Beth made an excellent team in the days ... weeks ... following the disappearance of Natalee. Both said it how it was. Their collective insights were right on when they openly claimed that conflicts of interest were behind a coverup in the investigation ... a coverup that was prevent justice from prevailing. There were trolls ... there were those within the Aruban investigation .. who implied if Jug and Beth had been more cooperative maybe ... However ... Dave Holloway went a different route and ... where did it get him? Janet +++++++ Beth Twitty has to come give a declaration once more and explain what is happening with the emergency fund of millions of dollars, according to Dompig DIARIO Aruba 10/26/2005 ORANJESTAD(AAN): ... Dompig indicated that the mother has made her intention to boycott Aruba, while Natalee’s father has cooperated very well with the investigation. http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2005/10/beth-twitty-has-to-come-give.html Jug Twitty Lashes Out at the Prosecutor Wednesday, September 28, 2005 VAN SUSTEREN: The two of you got into it a little bit on the 28th, and she’s cut you off. But when she met with Dave, Natalee’s father, for four hours, did she talk about the investigation for Natalee, or did it go off on collateral issues? TWITTY: No. She talked about the issues as far as Natalee, you know, having problems with her family with Beth and I or with her father, or whatever. Of course, all this stuff was talked about way early on in the investigation. She talked about $1 million life insurance policy on Natalee, which is just crazy. She talked about my brother being in the banking business, being in money laundering. And I mean, I just don’t know where this stuff’s coming from, Greta. It’s like she’s not even trying to find out the answers, she’s trying to find out everything, you know, that could be wrong, as far as our family goes. You know, it drives me crazy. ... Yes, she basically tells me, you know, this is the same thing as Van Der Straaten. You know, you keep acting like this, Mr. Twitty, you know, we’re going to quit. And you know, I said, Well, that’s a great attitude to have. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,170678,00.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 02:29:25 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather realized very early on that a coverup in the investigation dictated that justice for his stepdaughter was not about to come from an Aruban or Dutch court. Jug Twitty's only request was that he could bring his Natalee home ... If the contents of the cage/trap held Natalee Holloway's remains ... for the sake of a measure of closure ... the family needs to know. Surely Aruba could afford this one significant gesture. Janet ++++++ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ If Jug and his friends weren't there this whole thing would have been over. He was smart and wasn't about to be fooled by Straaten, KJ and Dompig. This is why in my opinion KJ couldn't stand him. He stood up to her and when he did she threatened him. Jug and Beth made an excellent team in the days ... weeks ... following the disappearance of Natalee. Both said it how it was. Their collective insights were right on when they openly claimed that conflicts of interest were behind a coverup in the investigation ... a coverup that was prevent justice from prevailing. There were trolls ... there were those within the Aruban investigation .. who implied if Jug and Beth had been more cooperative maybe ... However ... Dave Holloway went a different route and ... where did it get him? Janet +++++++ Beth Twitty has to come give a declaration once more and explain what is happening with the emergency fund of millions of dollars, according to Dompig DIARIO Aruba 10/26/2005 ORANJESTAD(AAN): ... Dompig indicated that the mother has made her intention to boycott Aruba, while Natalee’s father has cooperated very well with the investigation. http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2005/10/beth-twitty-has-to-come-give.html Jug Twitty Lashes Out at the Prosecutor Wednesday, September 28, 2005 VAN SUSTEREN: The two of you got into it a little bit on the 28th, and she’s cut you off. But when she met with Dave, Natalee’s father, for four hours, did she talk about the investigation for Natalee, or did it go off on collateral issues? TWITTY: No. She talked about the issues as far as Natalee, you know, having problems with her family with Beth and I or with her father, or whatever. Of course, all this stuff was talked about way early on in the investigation. She talked about $1 million life insurance policy on Natalee, which is just crazy. She talked about my brother being in the banking business, being in money laundering. And I mean, I just don’t know where this stuff’s coming from, Greta. It’s like she’s not even trying to find out the answers, she’s trying to find out everything, you know, that could be wrong, as far as our family goes. You know, it drives me crazy. ... Yes, she basically tells me, you know, this is the same thing as Van Der Straaten. You know, you keep acting like this, Mr. Twitty, you know, we’re going to quit. And you know, I said, Well, that’s a great attitude to have. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,170678,00.html They did make a good team. In the very beginning they had a spokeswoman who did their talking. Then boom Beth took over and has never let go. I said to myself look how this woman handles herself. She was professional. This made the trolls in Aruba even more nuts because they were trying their hardest to dig up dirt on her and they couldn't. Every time someone would come up with a lie all Beth had to do is come on TV and prove them wrong. The trolls were FOS. You are spot on regarding Dave. It didn't get him anywhere. JMO Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 20, 2008, 02:31:50 PM Still to me, the single most amazing head scratcher is how a court in Aruba can make this judgement, this statement, and still call this a mystery? This decision in a legal setting that has done little in Natalee's interests, still clearly states what happened here and yet we are still being told there isn't evidence?
Premeditated Murder. That was the charge which Karin Janssen arrested Paulus van der sloot on. The court in Aruba in one of it's last decisions, seemed to agree. “With attention to the lying declarations that the son of Paulus, Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (hereafter Joran) gave about his last contact on the 30th of May 2005 with the disappeared Natalee Holloway, the suspicion is not unreasonable that he made himself guilty of a conduct that can be qualified as murder, manslaughter, or kidnapping that resulted in death. The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a tapped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.” Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 02:40:40 PM Still to me, the single most amazing head scratcher is how a court in Aruba can make this judgement, this statement, and still call this a mystery? This decision in a legal setting that has done little in Natalee's interests, still clearly states what happened here and yet we are still being told there isn't evidence? Premeditated Murder. That was the charge which Karin Janssen arrested Paulus van der sloot on. The court in Aruba in one of it's last decisions, seemed to agree. “With attention to the lying declarations that the son of Paulus, Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (hereafter Joran) gave about his last contact on the 30th of May 2005 with the disappeared Natalee Holloway, the suspicion is not unreasonable that he made himself guilty of a conduct that can be qualified as murder, manslaughter, or kidnapping that resulted in death. The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a tapped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.” When I heard the charge "Premeditated Murder" against Paulus I was shocked. After Marianne Croes made this blunder and I believe it was a blunder we never saw her again. She was not suppose to say the charge. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 03:13:17 PM They did make a good team. In the very beginning they had a spokeswoman who did their talking. Then boom Beth took over and has never let go. I said to myself look how this woman handles herself. She was professional. This made the trolls in Aruba even more nuts because they were trying their hardest to dig up dirt on her and they couldn't. Every time someone would come up with a lie all Beth had to do is come on TV and prove them wrong. The trolls were FOS. You are spot on regarding Dave. It didn't get him anywhere. JMO You are so right San!! Those who attempted to undermine Beth's words and actions were always left with egg on their faces time and time again.. Janet ++++ As missing-teen case cools, Aruba turns against family By Carol J. Williams Los Angeles Times Renfro says she was perplexed when Twitty immediately concluded that her daughter had been kidnapped and made no effort to check hospitals or police about accident victims. Within hours, Twitty had concluded van der Sloot was responsible, and within a couple of days she was telling TV interviewers that she knew her daughter had been gang-raped and murdered. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2003741183_aruba09.html NANCY GRACE Kalpoe Brothers Rearrested Aired August 26, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET HELEN LEJUEZ, TWITTY FAMILY ATTORNEY: I don`t think this has to do with a lot of wiretapping. I do believe it has to do with bringing forth the new evidence. It has to do with the case approaching the 60 days and that they are adding new evidence so they can have the case going. GRACE: OK, what new evidence, Helen? LEJUEZ: The rape case. GRACE: OK. You said new evidence. What "new evidence" regarding Natalee Holloway do you think prosecutors have? LEJUEZ: Right now, they`re talking about a gang rape. So when we talk about a gang rape, we talk about a gang. The gang consisted of three of them. Right? GRACE: Right. LEJUEZ: Even though -- even though maybe it`s not out that the other suspect that`s in jail right now will be added to the gang, he is part of the gang. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/26/ng.01.html Brothers arrested again in Aruba case Two held on suspicion of acting with others in teen's rape, killing Saturday, August 27, 2005 Posted: 0319 GMT (1119 HKT) (CNN) -- After being detained and then released last month in Natalee Holloway's disappearance, two brothers were arrested again Friday in Aruba on suspicion they acted "together with other people" in raping and killing the Alabama teen, the prosecutor's office said. Without elaborating on the evidence, the office said in a statement that "new facts and circumstances" led them to re-arrest Satish Kalpoe, 18 and brother Deepak, 21. "They are suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences and even more alternately raping somebody," the statement said. "Aside from these suspicions against the two brothers, there are new suspicions, which at this point the prosecutor is not commenting on." http://edition.cnn.com/2005/LAW/08/26/aruba.arrests/index.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 03:20:57 PM San ... I copied the open letter twice. Please delete one.
Thanks Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 03:32:57 PM San ... I copied the open letter twice. Please delete one. Thanks Janet I was saying to myself wow what a long letter ::MonkeyHaHa:: I think I did it right. Let me know if something is wrong. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 03:33:01 PM San ... please just delete post 747. I really messed up. Thanks
++++++++++ FLASHBACK TO ARUBA'S ONGOING ATTEMPT TO DISCREDIT BETH AND JUG BY WAY OF THE INTERNET! Janet ________ statinmyopinion2 Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2006 1:21 am OPEN LETTER TO BETH TWITTY. DEAR BETH... IT'S BEEN 425 DAYS SINCE YOUR DAUGHTER DISAPPEARED FROM ARUBA. For about 6 months straight, you were a staple on all the cable news stations. You have been able to state, without proof/evidence that your daughter was a victim of being drugged, kidnapped, gang-raped and murdered. You have shown no proof of these allegations, whatsoever. You painted a picture of your daughter, that has come to light, is not true. She didn't graduate with honors at Mt Brook High School, she was not accepted into a college on a full-ride medical scholarship, nor did she have the character, that your had to establish to the public at large. My question is why did you have to LIE about your own daughter? Proof is in pictures posted on the internet, and proof is the listing in the Birmingham paper, that your daughter was not an honor grad. She never received a full-ride medical scholarship to ANY college. Why does it seem that you needed to create this whole other Natalee, that wasn't?? There are rumors abound that Natalee participated in attention seeking behavior, in the past. Your own step son, George Twitty III, even stated in the Birminham press last june, that his first reaction of hearing that his step-sister didn't make her flight home, was "What has she done now". So did Natalee run away before? What did GT III mean by this statement? Is this why, the FAB 7 was all set to go? Was this just another in a long line, of group FAB 7 on another venture to get Natalee back? Have you and the Fab 7, done this in the past, that you thought all of you, could swoop down in Aruba, get Natalee and get home to the USA before her biological father found out she had gone "missing"? Why wasn't Dave Holloway contacted by you personally? Why was it he had to hear about his own daughters disappearance, late into the evening hours, after you were securely on your way to Aruba, by Matt? Why didn't you contact the man at all, when you landed or return his many frantic calls to you? Why did you leave him out of the loop? What were you in fear of him finding out? That Natalee has done this in the past? Who was the woman that changed Natalee flight for the next day? What kind of relationship did Natalee have with her father? Why didn't she see her father for a year, before her disappearance? Why did her father feel uncomfortable entering your home, a home that she had lived in for the last 5 yrs of her life? What was it that had Natalee crying so hard, that her dad got in a vehicle and drove to Mt Brook, only to find out everything was "fine" when he got there? Why didn't Dave ever come to that house in the past? What was the divorce like between you and Dave? Did Natalee and Matt suffer because the divorce was not amlicable? Did you use those children as pawns because you both couldn't work out your own divorce issues? Why after the disappearance of your daughter that you both couldn't seem to put whatever differences aside and work together to help find your daughter? What did your husband Jugs mean that he had to coach Natalee everday for 5 yrs after you and your children moved into his house? Did he coach Matthew the same way? How did Natalee react to this "coaching"? How did Natalee feel about Jug Twitty, her step-father? her step brother? What kind of feelings did Natalee have about moving from Mississippi to Alabama? Not only away from her biological father, but her only home she ever knew, school, her friends?? What kind of perfection was expected out of these children, by Jug Twitty? Why did Jug wait until AFTER you both were married to introduce you all to his children? Was Jug ever physically abusive to those children? To you? Why is it that you left MB, and havent really been back? Were you an abused wife? Are you trying to protect the fact that Jug not only was physically abusive to you, and the children, but emotionally...as well? If thats the case, don't you think it would better serve a purpose you speaking out for all victims of abuse? I would think that would be more advantageous then spreading travel information. Has Natalee ever been in counseling? Have you ever been in family counseling with the children? How come Matt stayed at friends home, while you're traveling the U.S., instead of with his step father? When upon hearing that Natalee missed her flight, your imediate reaction was "kidnapped". Why wouldn't you think she had an accident? Better yet, why didnt you just think that Natalee was out having a good time, lost all track of time, and just missed her flight? If you thought she had been kidnapped, WHY didn't you immediately contact the Aruban Authorities? You should know in a kidnapping situation the first 24-48 hours is crucial. YET YOU DIDN'T! That boggles my mind. Instead you contacted the FAB 7, got a private plane secured, posters made up and TOOK off to Aruba. Why wasn't there any hospitals called to see maybe if there was a JANE DOE taken to the hospital? Or if you felt your daughter was kidnapped, you made posters up ...........asking her to call you? Upon arriving in Aruba, did you first go to the police? No. That boggles my mind. You first went to the hotel, to watch security video's. Then you weren't concerned about seeing YOUR daughter on them, you wanted to see the the boy, that you already had the name of that your daughter left with. You weren't concerned with finding Natalee, in as much as you were concerned with WANTING to get to the boy, YOU thought she was with. Then upon seeing/hearing that Natalee was not with him, immediately you made the deduction, and have had it in your mind since, that this young man was the person that YOU were going to see pay for her disappearance, and you haven't wavered from that since day 1. What was behind the meaning of your statement, that when you seen all the Us Media decend upon Aruba, "that you new then, that you were in trouble"? What kind of trouble? Were you afraid, that the media might dig up some news that Natalee, had perhaps been a runaway before? That the "darling" you sold to the public, was not what she was about after all? Well it came out, through various internet sources...that Natalee was not the shy, never drank in Alabama, not a party girl, naive, etc, that you portrayed to the public. In fact, Natalee enjoyed drinking, partying, smoking, etc. That fact came out with the FBI statements given by those same "responsible" friends that Natalee hung out with. Amongst others back in Mt Brook, that were tired of the spin. You stated a medi-jet was sitting on the carmac for two days. Why? I have never heard of a medi-jet on stand by for 2 days, for something that MIGHT happen. I would love for you to produce a receipt for this "medi-jet". It seems that this medi-jet while standing by in Aruba, another person who was harmed and needed it, might not be transported. Did Natalee have a drug problem in the past, that you might think that it uprooted itself again while in Aruba? How does one ask for a medi-jet to be flown in, and sit on a tarmac for two whole days? What kind of connections do you people have? What was on that voice mail call to William at 4 am in the morning? Why did that phone call upset William so much, that had him crying on the phone to Charles Croes for 45 minutes? Why did you have a perfect stranger listen to a call that supposedly came from Natalee to William? Why didn't you share this with the police? Why, when asked what type of luggage your daughter took with her to Aruba, you stated it was irrelevant? EVERYTHING is relevant in a missng persons case. Why does the DUTCH TV RE-ENACTMENT show Natalee arriving in Aruba, with a blue suitcase? Yet everytime her room is shown, or the hotel room is shown, there is only a small purple knapsack shown as her luggage? Did Natalee have a checking account? ATM card? Has her bank account been checked out, for withdrawals of large amounts for the days leading up to her disappearance? Are any of her clothes missing that you know of? Was her computer taken and checked out? Did Natalee either text you messages or send emails to you during her stay in Aruba, or before she left? Did Natalee contact her brother while being in Aruba? Jugs? YOU say YOU never talked to Natalee,.but what about emails, text messages? How about leaving voice mails on the phone at home? Did she leave you a voice mail message on your cell phone? You say that Natalee's phone wasn't set up for international calling, but did Natalee have phone cards? Why wasn't her phone set up for international calling, when you knew this from Jug's sons trip from two years previous?And why is Joe Tapocina stating it as fact, that he has phone records that prove that what you were stating that there was no contact with Natalee, by you, or vice versa, not true?? There seems to be a discrepency in when you found out about Natalee's disappearance. FEB states she called your right away, at about 8 am that morning. Paul Lilly states he called you around 10:30. Jody Bearman states she called you at noon. You state you were driving down the road when you got the first phone call at noon. And you were still in Arkansas. That a Arkansas State Trooper pulled you over for going over 100 mph, and that you stated that your daughter had been kidnapped in Aruba and you needed help contacting the FBI. How did you make it back so quickly, from Arkansas to Mt Brook, make travel arrangements,secure a private plane, get a group of friends/family together, pack, and make posters and be down in Aruba by 11 pm that night? It's the timeline I have problems with. Can you clarify? Or was this already planned earlier. Did you get a phone call from someone earlier in the day, that Natalee had NO plans of coming back to Alabama? Maybe from Frances Ellen Byrd?? It still boggles my mind, and maybe you can help me understand, is WHY didn't YOU or JUG go immediately to the police station and file a report of a "kidnapping", or "missing persons" report? Why is it that there were several posters made, all with different phone numbers to contact?Why did you include a picture of YOU and Natalee on the poster? Wouldnt that confuse people? Maybe they were looking for you? Why is it you NEVER went on TV begging, pleading with the so called kidnappers to contact you? Why is it that it was only pleading for Natalee to contact you? Whatever it is, we can work it out? What is "it", that you were referring to? Did you know that Natalee was having some problems? Why was sitting down and answering any and all questions posed to you by the ALE, not acceptable to you? Why did you keep turning the other cheek when your husband was acting like a abusive asshole on that island, to people who were only trying to help? What are you worried about that Julia Renfro might know? Why was it you had to resort to calling her a bitch? What did she do to you, that made you do an about face with her? Or was she seeing through the "scam", getting a bit to close to some truths, so you immediately had to put that fire out...and start discrediting her. Why was it, do you suppose that Karin Janssen stated that she would not communicate with either of you directly, that any and all communication would have to go through legal channels, such as an attorney. Could it be that Jug and you BOTH were verbally abusive to her, when it seemed like you weren't getting your way. Just who do you think YOU are, to go to another country, a soveriegn country, and try to change their laws, their way of doing things, just for you? Demands, threats, were not, and did not get you any closer to what happened to your daughter. Writing letters, demanding a "regimine" change did not endear you to those who were working day and night to find Natalee. The arrest/release of 2 security guards, Mickey Johns and Abram Jones, you were almost gleeful these two were released. How do you know that they had nothing to do with your daughters disappearance? Apparently Natalee was seen on video speaking to Mickey Johns, THAT night. Is it true that there were items of the MB children, found in his home? That these said items were in fact traded for drugs? Apparently these two had a history, of trying to pick up young women tourists at the hotels. But yet again, IF anyone other that J2k, you dismiss as viable suspects, in your mind. Why did you align yourself with so many unsavory characters? First Jossy Mansur, then Joe Mannama, Jamie Skeeters, etc. Its YOUR credibility that comes into question...........when the public sees you standing by these types, and calling them your "hero's". Joe M, stood there next to you, spilling out that ONE American's life is worth MORE than 100,000 Arubans. Are you that self-aborbed, or so full of yourself that YOU think that YOUR daughter is the only one that matters in this entire world? Open your eyes, since Natalee has been "missing" there have been at LEAST 10 cases of missing persons, that we the public know about (through the media) that have gone unsolved, RIGHT here on OUR borders. How many missing persons are in Alabama, that those families do not have closure, who showed up at the Govenors Mansion...and speaking of that, didn't you or JUGS feel a little bit guilty that "love bowls" were only put out for you two, when there were other family members with missing loved ones, that don't have closure, and all they got was a "candle"? Why aren't you calling for a BOYCOTT of your own STATE, for those people? Why are the MB "children" and chaperones given a free pass by you? How can you say, with 100% certainty that none of them could of brought harm to Natalee? I am sure you know her closest personal friends, but there were 124 students total on this trip. With 7 chaperones and their spouses. How do you know that others, besides her bestest friends couldn't of brought harm to Natalee? Maybe someone she made angry? Someone that wasnt in her "clique"? Yet you don't want them questioned, or you never questioned them, why it was that NONE of them had your daughters back that night. To leave her alone in a bar, intoxicated, doing things that beyond "normal" for her, and not questioning or making her leave with any of them. I would be so angry at these so called friends! Why doesn't her bestest friends in the whole world, even talk about Natalee with any type of emotion. They speak about her, as something they "lost" in Aruba, like an I-pod, or a cell phone...are people that cold and unfeeling in the land of Mt Brook? Has it ever occured to you that Natalee might of caused some problems in Aruba, with other students? In cases of missing persons, the public usually hears from their siblings, teachers, employers. Why is everyone afraid to come out and speak about Natalee? What is with Matts statement, when asked about how he is coping with his sisters disappearance, his reply was "I try not to think about it". HUH? Why did you go into a classroom of kindergartners, that were kind enough to hold a prayer vigil for you and Natalee, and also offer to learn to make yarn bracelets for you to sell, ONLY for you to traumatize little girls, by telling them there is a "HORRIBLE young man on the island, that likes to harm little blonde girls like you"? Were you implying that Joran Van Der Sloot is/was a pedophile? What possible AGENDA did you have to traumatize innocent young girls? Were you hoping these young 5 year olds would go home, and tell their mommy and daddies of the big bad man? YOU, of all PEOPLE, who were a TEACHER! My god woman, have YOU no shame, no boundaries? Anyone would do, if it means hurting EVERY single citizen, even the most young and innocent, in Aruba? I would of kicked your ass out of the country for that. "Grieving mother" or not!! What did Marcia Twitty mean, by her statement, if it all gets out, we are all going down, INCLUDING Natalee? What was "it". The drinking, the bed hopping? Drugs? AmSouth bank, held a TRUST fund for Natalee. People were sending donations from all over the world, as far away as Jeruselum...its been reported. Yet, you told Tim Miller, the fund is broke. How can that be, when those donations that were being sent in, were to be used to for the "continue search for Natalee Holloway". Yet, nothing was paid out of those funds (tim miller states he wouldn't accept a penny from the family). Did you use those funds to start up the Save Yourself Foundation, that turned into Safe Travel Foundation, that is now being called International Safe Travels foundation? Do you feel perhaps that you took money that was to go to help finding Natalee, to help you fund a new career choice? And how do you explain it to the public that donated to the funds for the exact purpose of helping offset costs of searching for Natalee? And yet, 425 days later, there is NO viable searches being done by the family, for Natalee, whatsoever. Can you explain WHY? Tim Miller was on the Dana Pretzer radio show, just a couple of weeks ago, asking the PUBLIC to donate 5 dollars each. Why? Why should the public keep footing the bill to find YOUR daughter, when its apparent that neither biological parent, that have seperate "foundations, trust funds, profits from books, paid speaking engagements etc" aren't willing to foot the bill for ANY searches. Can you explain to the PUBLIC why THEY should feel the need to bankroll any more searches? Why haven't you or Dave been back down on that island? Don't you want to help get answers to where your daughter is? If you feel that you would be in danger, take some of that "speaking engagement money/book profit money" and hire body guards for you both. OR take your new found friend Bo Dietl with you, or the Felon in PA, Joe Mannama. Oh wait, he can't enter Aruba..he's a felon. My bad. I am sure that Jossy Manur has enough thugs on Aruba he can let you borrow to keep you safe. OR is it true that you can't go back to Aruba, for fear of being arrested? Charges such as, leaving the country w/o settling/paying lawyer fees. Obstruction of justice, for bribing a witness in an ongoing police investigation? Or possible lawsuits, from the Van Der Sloots, Kalope family..etc? So lets talk about those documents you state you have. You stated right on Geraldo's show, that you smuggled 5-7 SIGNED documents out of Aruba...........that states in fact, that Joran Van Der Sloot, along with Deepak and Satish Kalope, drugged and gang-raped your daughter. SIGNED by not only Joran Van Der Sloot, but by the 2 Kalope brothers as well, along with Police officer signatures. Why hasn't any news anchor, SEEN these documents that you supposedly had. I am sure Geraldo is still waiting. As is the public at large. Greta wanted to read them as well. .............yet at NO time has those "documents" been released so that the public can substantiate your allegations. Then a few months later, YOU changed the whole story regarding these documents, and stated that they were only translated to you at the lawyers office and you "took notes". See why some people who are following this case FOR Natalee, question your credibility? The Dr. Phil/Jamie Skeeters fiasco. We (the people that have been following this case FOR Natalee), know now for a fact, that you received a copy of Jamie Skeeters unedited/unmanipulated tape. Yet you sat on the Dr Phil show, while an edited/manipulated tape was played. Sitting there shaking your head yes, knowing full well, this was a manipulation to try to frame young men for a rape that was never committed. Why do you need to state your daughter was drugged and gang-raped when there is NO evidence to prove it? Why as a mother would you wish the most horrible acts upon a woman, there could be, for your daughter? I would understand had there been ANY evidence such a crime against Natalee took place, but there isn't. So what I would like to know is this, where the HELL are you coming from? Or was this a way to garner sympathy from the public, which turned into donations? Tell me, the Call for the BOYCOTT of Aruba, what answers has that exactly brought you? Are you any closer of finding out what happened to Natalee? Will the hotel workers, restaurant workers, the little people losing jobs, homes, not being able to feed their children, clothe their children, endear you more to the Aruban citizens? Those same Aruban citizens that could of brought you some closure? Do you think that anyone that might of had information, that maybe was to scared to come forward earlier, will now just say forget it? The government of Aruba will never fold on a Boycott. It's the very citizens of Aruba, that rolled out the red carpet for you, and your family/friends, that will be hurt. And now you state on National TV tonight, that those same wonderful people believe that Natalee is at fault? Are you outta your friggin mind? Do you really think bringing a civil lawsuit against Joran and Paulus Van Der Sloot, is going to help you attain answers? IF the suit is accepted in NYC, and Judge Kapnick will reside over it, do you realize that Joran and Paulus are not going to be the only persons deposed in this case? The burden of PROOF is going to be on your side. Joe Tapocina, in all his wisely lawyering, will depose everyone that was on that trip. That means the entire class of Mt Brook, the chaperones, their spouses, YOU, Jugs, DAVE, ROBIN, the entire family will be called to be deposed, everyone or anyone that EVER had contact with Natalee, will come under a microscope. And no, one can SAY (like they did with the FBI) I am not going to answer..any questions, then the JUDGE can ORDER them to comply or be held in contempt. You really want to put the whole town of Mt Brook under a microscope? And what IF those answers are not the ones you were seeking? In fact, what IF it is exactly what you have been trying to contain the last year, comes all out. YES all of it will come out............all the secret skeletons, the divorce of you and Dave, the divorce of Jug and Wendy, their children, everything.....................you may get those answers, but I am thinking they are not going to be to your liking! People are going to have to take the stand, and swear to tell the truth. Me think you opened up a can of worms..........................and yes, the world will be watching......... Back in September 2005, your husband, made an announcement on the cable news stations, that the WORLD is GOING to be SHOCKED, soon. What did he mean by this? Was this about the Skeeter tape? Yea, we were shocked! The public was shocked that you and Dr Phil along with Jamie Skeeters would sink so low, as to manipulate evidence to frame 3 young men for rape. Also, your husband stated that 7 of the people that went with you to Aruba that night, and were among the ones standing outside the Van Der Sloot home, were going to go to a federal judge in Alabama, and have sworn affidavits made, that they heard Joran Van Der Sloot, state emphatically that he sexually assaulted Natalee. Now where are those sworn affidavits? Why were none of these affidavits put in the lawsuit against Joran and Paulus?? So you say, that the Aruban Police Department should of budgeted more, to find your daughter. They spent 40% of their police budget on Natalee. Do you really think that IF Natalee went missing in the USA, say, Mt Brook, that the police there would be still conducting an investigation? Do you think they would of spent 40% of their budget looking for her? Do you think the state of Alabama, would of called on the Federal Government for 3 f-16 fighter jets to fly over mt brook in search of Natalee? Do you think that after 15 months that Natalee would be a priority to the MB police dept? Or would they have already moved it into a cold case file, and state, since there is NO evidence that even a crime was committed, she is only listed as a missing young woman? So far you have blamed Joran, Paulus, Deepak, Satish, the entire population of Aruba, Aruba's government, the ALE, everyone. Do you ever feel that you may hold some responsibility for sending, a shy, naive, virgin, that in your words, you didn't have long enough to teach basic common sense, to an all inclusive, drink, bed-hopping, un-supervised, teens gone wild week in an carribean Island destination? Do you feel that Natalee HERSELF holds any responsibility for getting up that morning, and choosing to drink all day long, and again that night, to where she was intoxicated enough to let strange boys lick belly shots off her, and dance vicariously on the bar, then top of allf that, further participated in risky behavior, by WILLINGLY leave a bar, with 3 island boys she had NO clue who they were? My last questions to you Beth is this....what in the last 425 days of your daughter missing, that YOU have done, to bring any type of closure to the disappearance of your daughter? How about in the last few days? Weeks? What exactly ARE you doing to help the ALE or FBI solve this case? Why aren't you actively searching for Natalee? Why aren't you down on that island.........................an island that YOU stated for a fact you would NEVER leave w/o Natalee, if it took 40 yrs, and you had to purchase a home there. So what are you, or Dave done in say the last month to help bring closure to Natalee's disappearance? Why aren't you paying for any type of searches, or paying a private eye to get answers? I know you go on TV, complaining, whining, bitching that ALE is not doing enough, but WHAT, as the PARENTS of NATALEE , are YOU and DAVE DOING?? I don't think that Natalee is in anywhere of the 50 united states, that you're traveling to. Your not going to find the answers by spreading travel fear, to young people...that isn't any kind of monument to Natalee that you're collecting 2 grand fee's for 45 minute speeches having to do with "knowing when an bar establishment closes", "having a CELL phone that works properly or is set up for international calling", or when out underage drinking, make sure you have a buddy system in place, and enforce it". What has THIS got to do with bringing Natalee back home to the USA? Oh and another thing, don't bother coming to Michigan. Most parents here are wise enough, not to send their barely 18 yr olds, on an all you can drink, teens gone wild, extravaganza, WITH no APPARENT adult supervision, trip to a carribean island, for a high school graduation trip! NOT one SCHOOL would endorse such nonsense. Even though it's been said that the school didn't sponsor this trip, the chaperones were all hand picked by the students on which teachers they wanted to go. I guess they picked the ones that they knew, they could get away with a bunch of carousing, drinking etc, because there are many pictures of the chaperones that were drinking right along with the students.(even the 17 yr old ones).among other things. And if you do come to Michigan, be aware that I'll be one sitting in the audience, waiting to ask you these very same questions, I have posed in this thread {EDITED BY SAN - I REMOVED THE LINK} Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 03:46:21 PM Kermit,
Was this information from Kyle? If not, please tell me where it came from if possible. "it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz" TIA Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 03:53:22 PM I removed the post Tamikosmom. I also removed the link to the website.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Slogger on December 20, 2008, 03:55:28 PM "And if you do come to Michigan, be aware that I'll be one sitting in the audience, waiting to ask you these very same questions, I have posed in this thread."
::MonkeyLaugh:: (" . . . but I need advance notice because I have to fly in from India!") Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 03:57:23 PM "And if you do come to Michigan, be aware that I'll be one sitting in the audience, waiting to ask you these very same questions, I have posed in this thread." ::MonkeyLaugh:: (" . . . but I need advance notice because I have to fly in from India!") ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 03:57:24 PM Kermit, Was this information from Kyle? If not, please tell me where it came from if possible. "it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz" TIA Texasmom ... I am also confused in regards to where Kyle's quote ends. Kermit ... HELP!!! Janet +++++++ Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - « Reply #901 on: December 17, 2008, 07:17:24 PM » <snipped> Kyle said: "- IF a key detective's brother knew the latitude the trap was disposed at or very near, then it's probable the detective knew the same. - IF the detective knew the latitude, how did he come to this knowledge? - Who else knew this information? Since the trap was only in 90ft of water and the detective knew about the latitude, did the Polis already know if it's location prior to the search? The detective originally wouldn't meet with us and only wanted us to meet with his brother. We convinced him to meet along with his brother and made him feel as comfortable as possible. He reluctantly agreed but wouldn't talk. The brother did all the talking at first. It seemed to me the brother was acting out the "vision" scenario to protect the detective brother. It didn't feel like the brother was in any way corrupt or connected. Also, he wasn't that bright compared to the detective brother. After a while the detective started asking some questions and loosened up a bit. With the pointed questions he asked he proved he knew a lot, but we didn't press him. The reason I think the detective is Simian is that: - he is intimately connected to the case - forced into silence - both he and the brother seemed to want the case solved but the whole encounter was so CRYPTIC - he is condemned if his identity and knowledge were BOTH exposed. One or the other, he's still safe - He was intelligent and had a good enough command over the english language (not common over the rest of the bunch) - IF his brother was acting on his behalf with the whole 'I had a vision' act, then the detective's character supports pulling something like Simian off. - the detective was very internet and computer savy, which was unusual for the bulk of the Polis. - It seemed he knew who I was when we were introduced, and said something indicating he had been reading the blog. - his character was very cryptic; the way he moved, spoke, and asked questions was just not normal. "Caps is not Simian. He has indicated he knows who was either Shango or Simian. The person he thinks it is, is a cop. it was Clyde Burke that went to the meeting with Helen Lejuz http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4239.msg588188#msg588188 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 03:58:37 PM "And if you do come to Michigan, be aware that I'll be one sitting in the audience, waiting to ask you these very same questions, I have posed in this thread." ::MonkeyLaugh:: (" . . . but I need advance notice because I have to fly in from India!") ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 03:59:51 PM I removed the post Tamikosmom. I also removed the link to the website. Thanks San. I will not promise never to bother you again when I mess up. Klaas knows I have broken that promise to her time and time again. If only I could be afforded the edit option. I promised her I would not tell the other Monkeys. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 04:04:44 PM I removed the post Tamikosmom. I also removed the link to the website. Thanks San. I will not promise never to bother you again when I mess up. Klaas knows I have broken that promise to her time and time again. If only I could be afforded the edit option. I promised her I would not tell the other Monkeys. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet You are never a bother. We would know you have the edit button because your name appears on the bottom. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 04:04:51 PM "And if you do come to Michigan, be aware that I'll be one sitting in the audience, waiting to ask you these very same questions, I have posed in this thread." ::MonkeyLaugh:: (" . . . but I need advance notice because I have to fly in from India!") ::MonkeyHaHa:: Hi Slogger. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Slogger on December 20, 2008, 04:19:41 PM Hello Janet, and good posters!
Kermit, the photos have kept me busy. Wreck, we (all) have times when we hold back, or blurt out. Red, I'm looking forward to something, anything--large, small. Most of us have been here (there, and wherever) trying our best to get Natalee home. I am thankful for each and every one who is trying to achieve this end. We have been on this, through births and deaths, through Holiday after Holiday. It is foolish to believe this will go away! Bring on the Pore Inspection! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 04:59:41 PM 12/20/2008 Bondia
http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12202008Bondia10a-1.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Hotshot on December 20, 2008, 05:35:43 PM OT.....haunting evidence is on with natalee holloway. Sorry if someone beat me to it, I just ran across it on the TV
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 20, 2008, 06:03:57 PM 5:00pm - 6:00pm, truTV (58)
Haunting Evidence : "George Allen Smith" The case of a newlywed lost at sea is investigated. Also: the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Original Airdate: October 25, 2008 TV14 (CC) Full Show Info Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 08:02:55 PM http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50740.php
Google translation Aruba '*******' Rob Pietersz will remain a solid pg 20 Dec, 2008, 13:56 (GMT -04:00) Rob Pietersz is appointed new Attorney-General of the Aruban prosecutor's office. ORANGE CITY-Robert "Rob" Pietersz Franklin (61) already since June acting Attorney-General (pg) on Aruba, remains at his place. The Empire of Ministers yesterday agreed to his appointment as' permanent 'pg of the Public Ministry (OM) by January 2009. "I'm already asked if my period as acting pg wanted to extend permanent pg, and find it worth the relationship to continue," Pietersz said in a response. "I was initially asked for a hand to help and six months pg to be acting." Pietersz was formerly pg of the Netherlands Antilles and has also previously agreed for a period of nine months pg been deputy of Aruba. He held the post since June, which was originally toebedacht to the Dutch former Attorney-General Dato Steenhuis, after acting pg Nico Jörg was gone. The Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes continued, however, publicly questioned the arrival of Steenhuis. This came a few years ago in the news because he would have his driver turned on the speed to perform and to get through safety barriers. In 1998 he was accused of conflict of interest, for which he received a reprimand. The appointment of fixed Pietersz puts an end to the search for a permanent replacement for the Aruban Attorney General Theresa Croes of Aruba-Fernandes, who long-time home Saturday because of a labor dispute with the government over its pension. Aruba wanted a salary based on her pension payment. Croes Fernandes-employment on January 1 would have ended this year, but the conflict saw them off. Only recently, through a settlement with Croes-Fernandes, the government has a solid respect for the office managed to arrange. In the Netherlands were the developments surrounding the appointment of the mid-pg this year followed closely by the Second Chamber Alexander Pechtold (D66) and Sybrand of Haersma-Buma (CDA). According to Pechtold was the appearance of justice in Aruba in the game. From Haersma-Buma was for law enforcement in Aruba extremely bad that there was no functioning pg. Pietersz do not want to respond to the history. "I have noted but the period is closed. We look forward to the future. "The new pg, the Royal Decree on his appointment has not yet seen, but he assumes that the next three years, until his retirement age, Attorney-General of the Aruban OM remains. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 20, 2008, 08:32:10 PM http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50740.php Google translation Aruba '*******' Rob Pietersz will remain a solid pg 20 Dec, 2008, 13:56 (GMT -04:00) Rob Pietersz is appointed new Attorney-General of the Aruban prosecutor's office. ORANGE CITY-Robert "Rob" Pietersz Franklin (61) already since June acting Attorney-General (pg) on Aruba, remains at his place. The Empire of Ministers yesterday agreed to his appointment as' permanent 'pg of the Public Ministry (OM) by January 2009. "I'm already asked if my period as acting pg wanted to extend permanent pg, and find it worth the relationship to continue," Pietersz said in a response. "I was initially asked for a hand to help and six months pg to be acting." Pietersz was formerly pg of the Netherlands Antilles and has also previously agreed for a period of nine months pg been deputy of Aruba. He held the post since June, which was originally toebedacht to the Dutch former Attorney-General Dato Steenhuis, after acting pg Nico Jörg was gone. The Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes continued, however, publicly questioned the arrival of Steenhuis. This came a few years ago in the news because he would have his driver turned on the speed to perform and to get through safety barriers. In 1998 he was accused of conflict of interest, for which he received a reprimand. The appointment of fixed Pietersz puts an end to the search for a permanent replacement for the Aruban Attorney General Theresa Croes of Aruba-Fernandes, who long-time home Saturday because of a labor dispute with the government over its pension. Aruba wanted a salary based on her pension payment. Croes Fernandes-employment on January 1 would have ended this year, but the conflict saw them off. Only recently, through a settlement with Croes-Fernandes, the government has a solid respect for the office managed to arrange. In the Netherlands were the developments surrounding the appointment of the mid-pg this year followed closely by the Second Chamber Alexander Pechtold (D66) and Sybrand of Haersma-Buma (CDA). According to Pechtold was the appearance of justice in Aruba in the game. From Haersma-Buma was for law enforcement in Aruba extremely bad that there was no functioning pg. Pietersz do not want to respond to the history. "I have noted but the period is closed. We look forward to the future. "The new pg, the Royal Decree on his appointment has not yet seen, but he assumes that the next three years, until his retirement age, Attorney-General of the Aruban OM remains. I am glad there was no conflict of interest in Natalee's case. ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 20, 2008, 09:00:49 PM Wow! I wonder what it takes to create a conflict of interest if not in Natalee's case.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 20, 2008, 10:47:24 PM I wanted to bring this forward:
Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 10:51:56 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 11:03:20 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 20, 2008, 11:06:15 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 Thank you Tamikosmom. I was searching and I couldn't find it. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 11:07:30 PM http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50740.php Google translation Aruba '*******' Rob Pietersz will remain a solid pg 20 Dec, 2008, 13:56 (GMT -04:00) Rob Pietersz is appointed new Attorney-General of the Aruban prosecutor's office. ORANGE CITY-Robert "Rob" Pietersz Franklin (61) already since June acting Attorney-General (pg) on Aruba, remains at his place. The Empire of Ministers yesterday agreed to his appointment as' permanent 'pg of the Public Ministry (OM) by January 2009. "I'm already asked if my period as acting pg wanted to extend permanent pg, and find it worth the relationship to continue," Pietersz said in a response. "I was initially asked for a hand to help and six months pg to be acting." Pietersz was formerly pg of the Netherlands Antilles and has also previously agreed for a period of nine months pg been deputy of Aruba. He held the post since June, which was originally toebedacht to the Dutch former Attorney-General Dato Steenhuis, after acting pg Nico Jörg was gone. The Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes continued, however, publicly questioned the arrival of Steenhuis. This came a few years ago in the news because he would have his driver turned on the speed to perform and to get through safety barriers. In 1998 he was accused of conflict of interest, for which he received a reprimand. The appointment of fixed Pietersz puts an end to the search for a permanent replacement for the Aruban Attorney General Theresa Croes of Aruba-Fernandes, who long-time home Saturday because of a labor dispute with the government over its pension. Aruba wanted a salary based on her pension payment. Croes Fernandes-employment on January 1 would have ended this year, but the conflict saw them off. Only recently, through a settlement with Croes-Fernandes, the government has a solid respect for the office managed to arrange. In the Netherlands were the developments surrounding the appointment of the mid-pg this year followed closely by the Second Chamber Alexander Pechtold (D66) and Sybrand of Haersma-Buma (CDA). According to Pechtold was the appearance of justice in Aruba in the game. From Haersma-Buma was for law enforcement in Aruba extremely bad that there was no functioning pg. Pietersz do not want to respond to the history. "I have noted but the period is closed. We look forward to the future. "The new pg, the Royal Decree on his appointment has not yet seen, but he assumes that the next three years, until his retirement age, Attorney-General of the Aruban OM remains. I am glad there was no conflict of interest in Natalee's case. ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: Me too. However ... Jossy is soooo suspicious. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Janet +++++++ NANCY GRACE Latest in Search for Natalee Holloway Aired October 4, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET GRACE: … Jossy, regarding the connection, what I perceived to be a close connection between the judge, Paulus Van Der Sloot and the retired chief of police who initially handled Natalee`s case, Van Der Stratten, were they friends? MANSUR: Of course, they were friends. It stands to reason they were friends because Paul Van Der Sloot had many friends within the police department; he had many friends within the Department of Justice. And he had many friends with -- and he was friendly with all the judges in Aruba. He worked out of the same office as they did and did the same work. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 11:08:39 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 Thank you Tamikosmom. I was searching and I couldn't find it. You are welcome San. I noticed that Magnolia had stepped away. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 11:09:09 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 11:14:17 PM I was looking, and found it; but Janet is faster than lightning! ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 20, 2008, 11:18:58 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 I was wondering what was going on hotping. I know you and I have Kermit's posts on the trap/cage topic memorized word for word. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Good Night. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 11:19:45 PM I was looking, and found it; but Janet is faster than lightning! ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 11:21:20 PM I wanted to bring this forward: Magnolia...When and where was this posted by Kermit..... ::MonkeyShocked::Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 I was wondering what was going on hotping. I know you and I have Kermit's posts on the trap/cage topic memorized word for word. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Good Night. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 11:26:26 PM Goodnight Janet! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 20, 2008, 11:30:58 PM Good night Janet! And Thanks Again! ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: snoopy on December 20, 2008, 11:40:28 PM I was looking, and found it; but Janet is faster than lightning! ::MonkeyDance:: Really!! I was searching Kermits post and was thinking......now by time I find this Janet will already have posted it plus I don't know how to do the linky thing. lol How does she do that? Amazes me every time. lol Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 20, 2008, 11:53:47 PM (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/persistence/PersistenceHansMosandRichardson.jpg)
http://zoltanzion.blogspot.com/2007/03/dirty-hand-revealed.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: billb's daughter on December 21, 2008, 12:00:09 AM Bump: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #709 on: Today at 02:13:57 AM » Reply with quoteQuote Quote from: Kermit on December 18, 2008, 09:01:05 PM Quote from: wreck on December 18, 2008, 11:21:13 AM Well, what do we do with Kermit's information? Kermit says she has given it to the FBI AND the family. I'm not sure as to what we here are supposed to do with this information. Kermit, what do you want/need US to do?? Are you confident that things are being done in the background (and I don't mean private forums!)? Send emails to the Birmingham FBI office - attention Carmen S Adams, and copy those emails to our State Department in Washington Include the pictures, and Kyle's words. Plead with them to put pressure on Aruba, and more importantly on The Hague for answers. Whatever happened to this? Kermit answered specifically to wrecks question of what we can/should do. Magnolia followed up with contact info for Birmingham FBI... I followed up with State Department contact info and even posted my email to the State Department below...Has anyone else submitted emails to FBI or State Department? Just wondering and wanted to ensure Kermit's suggestions didn't go by the wayside. Smile Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #426 on: December 18, 2008, 09:25:06 PM » Reply with quoteQuote Special Agent in Charge Carmen S. Adams Assistant Special Agent in Charge Charles E. Regan Birmingham Division History Birmingham Division Contact Information Address 1000 18th Street North Birmingham, Alabama 35203 Telephone (205)326-6166 Facsimile (205)279-1590 General information: birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Office Hours 8:15 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday 24 Hour Emergency Service How to Report a Crime or Provide Information For the location of a local FBI office, see our Jurisdiction page An FBI representative can be reached 24 hours a day by calling (205)326-6166 If you have been the victim of a crime or have information relating to a crime, please contact your nearest FBI office. All complaints are confidential. You can also email the Birmingham office at birmingham@ic.fbi.gov Posts: 161 View Profile Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #465 on: December 19, 2008, 12:01:25 AM » Reply with quoteQuote Quote from: billb on December 18, 2008, 11:42:40 PM US State Department OVERSEAS CITIZENS SERVICES: Call 1-888-407-4747 (from overseas: 202-501-4444) for answers related to questions concerning the: * Death of an American citizen abroad * Arrest/detention of an American citizen abroad * Robbery of an American citizen abroad * American citizens missing abroad * Crisis abroad involving American citizens * After-hours number for an emergency involving an American citizen abroad To ask a question via email: http://contact-us.state.gov/cgi-bin/state.cfg/php/enduser/ask.php?p_sid=jxOHQJlj&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPSZwX3NvcnRfYnk9JnBfZ3JpZHNvcnQ9JnBfcm93X2NudD0xMTEsMTExJnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9zZWFyY2hfdHlwZT1hbnN3ZXJzLnNlYXJjaF9ubCZwX3BhZ2U9MQ** Copy and paste the bold HTTP It was easy to submit a question on the site: My question: Secretary Rice met with the mother (Beth Holloway Twitty) of Natalee Holloway WRT her daughter's disappearance May 30th, 2005. Secretary Rice, after hearing Beth's account of the lack of investigation by the Aruban authorities, directed that the FBI take a closer look into the events surrounding her daughter's disappearance. Can you please provide an update of the actions our State Department, Secretary Rice, and the FBI have taken to ensure there is/will be Justice for Natalee Holloway, a US citizen? Thank you. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 21, 2008, 12:41:21 AM I sent mine, billb.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 05:52:10 AM Sometimes even the articles written in English make me say WTH. ::MonkeyConfused::
******* Amigoe English Trees as economic asses of Curacao WILLEMSTAD — Trees as the new economic asses of Curaçao and CO2 as a blessing from heaven. The Dutch farmer Pieter Hoff is convinced of that and he hopes and anticipates that during and especially after his lecture in the UNA, a pilot program of about 400 to 500 hectare is given flash and blood and this way can possibly start in 2009 already. http://www.amigoe.com/english/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 06:05:53 AM Como Woman y Man of The Year 2008....Magaly Brito y Freddie Rafine a haya nan reconocimento ayeranochi
(http://www.diario-aruba.com/images/2008/december/19/local/jossy.jpg) Friday, 19 December 2008 00:00 Local ORANJESTAD (AAN): Den un celebracion chikito y cu presencia di invitadonan na residencia di Nuhad y Jossy Mansur na Eagle gerente di DIARIO tabata tin entrega oficial di e reconocimento na dos persona cu a ser nombra como Man y Woman of The Year 2008. Esaki ta un nombracion cu a bay sin unanimente na DIARIO y awe por mira cu e nombracion di DIARIO a ser acepta tambe den e comunidad. DIARIO ta e corant cu ta para cu e verdad y sin ningun clase di miedo pa cualkier intimidacion. Esaki ta e motibo tambe cu DIARIO ta e corant mas grandi na Aruba cu e respet grandi tambe den henter e pueblo. Na momento cu ing Fredie Rafine y tambe Magaly Brito a ser yama dilanti naturalmente nan tambe a dirigi nan mes na esnan presente mustrando cu nan a para fuerte unda a base di prinicpio awe hopi biaha bo ta haya bo mes den problema cerca esnan cu no ta gusta pa e berdad bin dilanti. Jossy Mansur como gerente di DIARIO y tambe Jenny Cratz como man drechi di DIARIO a hiba palabra unda nan a repasa y splica mas riba e motibo di e nombracion cu a ser acepta 100% den comunidad. Pabien un biaha mas na Ing Freddie Rafine y Magaly Brito cu e nombracion di man y Woman of The Year 2008 http://www.diario-aruba.com/200812195270/Local/Como-Woman-y-Man-of-The-Year-2008....Magaly-Brito-y-Freddie-Rafine-a-haya-nan-reconocimento-ayeranochi.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 06:28:46 AM Winter recess for VvdS.
http://www.coolaruba.com/component/option,com_gallery2/Itemid,28/?g2_itemId=623113 ......same old same old..... http://www.coolaruba.com/component/option,com_gallery2/Itemid,28/?g2_itemId=622960 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blonde on December 21, 2008, 09:09:40 AM Still to me, the single most amazing head scratcher is how a court in Aruba can make this judgement, this statement, and still call this a mystery? This decision in a legal setting that has done little in Natalee's interests, still clearly states what happened here and yet we are still being told there isn't evidence? Premeditated Murder. That was the charge which Karin Janssen arrested Paulus van der sloot on. The court in Aruba in one of it's last decisions, seemed to agree. “With attention to the lying declarations that the son of Paulus, Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (hereafter Joran) gave about his last contact on the 30th of May 2005 with the disappeared Natalee Holloway, the suspicion is not unreasonable that he made himself guilty of a conduct that can be qualified as murder, manslaughter, or kidnapping that resulted in death. The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a tapped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.” Thursday, August 2, 2007 PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT The Buddy System? A clear picture has emerged in regards to Paulus van der Sloot and his connection to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The image appears to reveal that professional and personal relationships within all levels of the Dutch/Aruban administrations, as well as the judiciary, have resulted in preferential treatment - preferential treament which implies that a friend and colleague will never be held accountable for his participation in the events that occurred on Aruban soil during the early hours of May 30, 2005. A. CHRONOLOGY 01. DETAINED FOX NEWS - 06-24-05 The fifth man, Paul van der Sloot (search) — the father of 17-year-old Joran — was being held on suspicion of complicity to pre-meditated murder, complicity to kidnapping and murder and kidnapping. Under the Aruban system, complicity is a lesser charge. 02. RELEASED Amigoe - 11-12-05 ARUBA – ... Paul van der Sloot was detained from June 23rd up till the 26th in connection with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The examining-magistrate decided then that there was not sufficient evidence against Van der Sloot and released him. Translation Credit: Aruba Gretagrip 03. NO LONGER A SUSPECT 'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' - 11-14-05 COSBY: ... Late Friday, an Aruban judge said Paul Van Der Sloot is no longer a suspect in the search for the Alabama teen. In fact, Paul Van Der Sloot could even receive damages from the government of Aruba after being held for three days in an Aruban jail 04. AWARDED COMPENSATION - DETAINMENT NOT JUSTIFIED Expatica News - 08-03-06 AMSTERDAM — Dutchman Paul van der Sloot, father of the chief suspect in the Natalee Holloway disappearance case, has been awarded financial damages. A court on the autonomous Dutch island of Aruba ruled that Paul van der Sloot was arrested and detained for four days without due cause last year as part of the investigation. He was awarded 50,000 Aruban Guilders in compensation. This is equal to EUR 21,800 or USD 27,900. 05. COMPENSATION APPEALED FOX NEWS - 08-08-06 ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban prosecutors said Tuesday they will appeal an order to compensate a man detained in the disappearance of U.S. teenager Natalee Holloway. A judge on the Dutch Caribbean island ruled on July 28 that the prosecutor's office should pay $30,190 to Paulus van der Sloot, a former justice official in Aruba who was detained in the case for three days, for defamation and legal fees. "The public prosecutor's office does not agree with the amount granted, since this is much higher than usual," spokeswoman Mariaine Croes said. 06. GOOD CONDUCT DOCUMENT Bon Dia Aruba - 01-06-06 On the basis of this letter, the attorney told the judge that the prosecutor let it be known that the case against van der Sloot was over. The judge said in his decision that he is in agreement with the attorney. Given that the prosecutor herself said that Mr. van der Sloot is no longer a suspect, which according to the judge can be looked at as the prosecutor saying that the case is over, since the prosecutor will no longer pursue the case. This signifies that Paul van der Sloot will soon start working as a lawyer in Aruba and the case he brought forth against the Public Prosecutor will not go forward since he obtained his good conduct document, which is the document he was missing to be registered as a lawyer. Translation Credit: Aruba Getagrip 07. SWORN IN AS AN ATTORNEY Aruba Today - 01-18-06 Paul Van Der Sloot, once held in connection with the disappearance of an Alabama teenager was cleared on of suspicion in the case last November and has now been installed in the capacity of a lawyer on the island. Paul van der Sloot entered the courthouse yesterday to present his application to the “raad van toezict” (Supervisory Commission) and the members of the Aruban Lawyers Association. The commission, together with the lawyers association reviewed his application and attached documents, concluding that he satisfied the qualifications to be accepted as an active lawyer working on the island of Aruba. 08. JOINS ANTONIO CARLO'S LAW FIRM Expatica News - 02-17-06 Joran is represented by lawyer Antonio Carlo, who is also Paulus van der Sloot's boss on Aruba. Paulus van der Sloot joined Carlo's legal firm as a lawyer in January this year. 09. COMPENSATION DENIED - DETENTION JUSTIFIED Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba B. THE SUPERIOR COURT RULING The implications encompassing the rulings of the Superior Court in January, 2007 are very far reaching, and many questions are left unanswered. The ruling which denied Paulus van der Sloot compensation and the ruling which deemed that his detention was justified were based on Paulus' own declaration as well as incriminating wiretaps. 1. Was the Judiciary protecting Paulus van der Sloot? *Why was Paulus van der Sloot released after only three days of detention on suspicion of being involved in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway? *Why was Paulus van der Sloot declared in a ruling by the Aruban court to no longer be a suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway? *Why was Paulus van der Sloot initially awarded compensation for wrongful detention by the Aruban court? Inquiring minds want to know if the judge/s who ruled in these three court proceedings were unaware of the wiretap and declaration which were revealed by the Superior Court in January, 2007 or - was there preferential treatment involved? Also - was the judge/s unaware of interrogator Lt. Roland Tromp's contention that Paulus van der Sloot changed his declaration regarding his knowledge/participation in the events pertaining to the morning of May 31, 2005? 2. Was Karin Janssen part of the coverup? Karin Janssen's professional capacity dictated that she was in a position of knowledge when she wrote the letter of recommendation on Paulus van der Sloot's behalf - the letter of recommendation which was required if Paulus was to receive his accredidation as a qualified attorney. As the prosecutor for the Natalee Holloway investigation - Janssen had to have been aware of the evidence revealed by the Superior Court in January, 2007 which denied Paulus compensation for wrongful detention and also deemed his detention as justified. Also - when the letter of recommendation was submitted - the prosecutor of the investigation had to have been aware of interrogator Lt. Roland Tromp's contention regarding Paulus' changing declarations concerning the morning of May 31, 2005. Inquiring minds want to know why Karin Janssen bowed to the threat of a lawsuit for non-compliance and thereby composed the letter of recommendation. 3. Why does Paulus van der Sloots' non-suspect status as well as his attorney status remain unchanged? When the January, 2007 ruling of the Superior Court is considered - the rulings which deemed that Paulus' detention was justified based on his own declaration as well as incriminating wiretaps - inquiring minds want to know why the earlier court decision that ruled Paulus was no longer a suspect has not been reversed and ... why does this man continue to legally hold a position as a practicing attorney on the Island of Aruba? Jossy Mansur - Aruban Editor - NANCY GRACE - 10-04-05 GRACE: … Jossy, regarding the connection, what I perceived to be a close connection between the judge, Paulus Van Der Sloot and the retired chief of police who initially handled Natalee`s case, Van Der Stratten, were they friends? MANSUR: Of course, they were friends. It stands to reason they were friends because Paul Van Der Sloot had many friends within the police department; he had many friends within the Department of Justice. And he had many friends with -- and he was friendly with all the judges in Aruba. He worked out of the same office as they did and did the same work Lt. Roland Tromp - Interrogator - CBS NEWS - 08-05-05 Tromp, who declined to provide details about exactly what investigators believe happened to Holloway, said that Paul van der Sloot has also changed his account the night Holloway vanished. "Why should you do that if you are telling the truth?" he said http://64.233.169.132/search?q=cache:nlEfzdC_PWAJ:nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2007/08/paulus-van-der-sloot.html+Paulus+was+denied+compensation&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us Natalee and her family deserve justice, and we will not let up until they have it! Natalee’s Freebirds Posted by Natalee's Freebirds at 5:49 AM Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 10:44:04 AM >>>>SNIP
Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba ++++++++ Once again we are reminded of phone taps. Are these the same phone taps referred to by Senator Bacchus when he was speaking with Greta after having first met with the "delegation" sent to Washington? Likely so......Was Jan van der Straaten encouraging Joran to plead guilty to the entire crime-be the scapegoat for Paulus- and spend sometime in a psych ward for the crime? Hmmmmm Yep the judge (would be judge) orchestrated the disposal or removal- and that was how he knew there would be "no body". I guess it isn't likely that someone would place the body in a trap in 90 ft water after all-sorta easy to find? Probably was a skeleton in the trap/cage but it was likely someone else-that was why Aruba was left to take it- and deal with it. Now where is Natalee? Where did they take her? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 11:06:30 AM This is an unofficial transcript from Greta's interview with Bacchus, taken from a previous post of mine on another site. The question has been asked before, but were wire taps in place on the Sloots(DEA?) that allowed the last conversation regarding what happened to Natalee to be heard? Did the FBI know from the start that this was more than just a missing teen and therefore the large number of FBI sent to Aruba?
++++++ Greta Dec 16th (2005)partial still working on the rest Bachus: The FBI asked me not to say some things. Greta: About them or the meeting? Bachus: Both Greta: They weren’t at the meeting? Bachus: They asked me not to discuss it. The FBI does not meet. They told me they were going to meet with us. Then their policy later was they actually recommended a meeting between them and the group. Greta: Your gut reaction from the meeting? Do you feel confident this is the right team to be leading the investigation or would you like to see some changes? Bachus: It’s a small island and they are handicapped by their experience. But I was impressed with what they had done…at least the work product. I have seen cases…I’ve been to hired to prosecute murder cases where there is almost no file. I will say that the resources that have been devoted to this case are really probably more substantial than most murder cases here in the United States. Greta: Have there been any leaks that have possibly jeopardized the investigation? You don’t have to go into any details of the actual leaks but did they tell you…are you convinced that anything said so far hurt the investigation? Bachus: It is my understanding they were running wiretaps and it was disclosed… Greta: Would that be the initial first week before the initial arrest? Bachus: This was in the first weeks, that is what they’re telling me. Greta: Since that time there have been no other leaks they told you about that hurt the investigation? Bachus: I think if anything it is the news media. Your show and others that probably do result in more…inaudible Greta: Okay, thank you sir. Bachus: I don’t have any criticism of them...inaudible Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 11:37:43 AM Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:24 am Post subject: Do not confuse...
The Simian called out names like bifrons. Nobody else. Listen closely today. The Babylonians are grinning after a long while. The phones have been hacked. Dots on dish. The rotten package from The Hague. Choose sides now to avoid embarrassment. The checkmate is set again. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 21, 2008, 12:22:31 PM I wanted to bring this forward: ^^^BUMP^^^^Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. I missed this!!! hmmmmm ::MonkeyEek:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 21, 2008, 01:03:18 PM I wanted to bring this forward: ^^^BUMP^^^^Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. I missed this!!! hmmmmm ::MonkeyEek:: I took this to mean that the Aruban's were unaware of the pics of the zip lock bags. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 21, 2008, 01:07:03 PM This is an unofficial transcript from Greta's interview with Bacchus, taken from a previous post of mine on another site. The question has been asked before, but were wire taps in place on the Sloots(DEA?) that allowed the last conversation regarding what happened to Natalee to be heard? Did the FBI know from the start that this was more than just a missing teen and therefore the large number of FBI sent to Aruba? ++++++ Greta Dec 16th (2005)partial still working on the rest Bachus: The FBI asked me not to say some things. Greta: About them or the meeting? Bachus: Both Greta: They weren’t at the meeting? Bachus: They asked me not to discuss it. The FBI does not meet. They told me they were going to meet with us. Then their policy later was they actually recommended a meeting between them and the group. Greta: Your gut reaction from the meeting? Do you feel confident this is the right team to be leading the investigation or would you like to see some changes? Bachus: It’s a small island and they are handicapped by their experience. But I was impressed with what they had done…at least the work product. I have seen cases…I’ve been to hired to prosecute murder cases where there is almost no file. I will say that the resources that have been devoted to this case are really probably more substantial than most murder cases here in the United States. Greta: Have there been any leaks that have possibly jeopardized the investigation? You don’t have to go into any details of the actual leaks but did they tell you…are you convinced that anything said so far hurt the investigation? Bachus: It is my understanding they were running wiretaps and it was disclosed… Greta: Would that be the initial first week before the initial arrest? Bachus: This was in the first weeks, that is what they’re telling me. Greta: Since that time there have been no other leaks they told you about that hurt the investigation? Bachus: I think if anything it is the news media. Your show and others that probably do result in more…inaudible Greta: Okay, thank you sir. Bachus: I don’t have any criticism of them...inaudible I think this is the Aruban's trying to blame the US for the boys not being honest in their taps. Of course Deepak tells them that they were in "cover mode" from the get go, but my guess is that they didn't tell Bacchus. or The FBI had some taps going, after the fact...and did not mention it to ALE.... but someone did. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 21, 2008, 01:07:20 PM I wanted to bring this forward: ^^^BUMP^^^^Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. I missed this!!! hmmmmm ::MonkeyEek:: I took this to mean that the Aruban's were unaware of the pics of the zip lock bags. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 21, 2008, 01:32:57 PM (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Arias/ClubArias12212008.jpg)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: iris44 on December 21, 2008, 02:02:36 PM Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:24 am Post subject: Do not confuse... The Simian called out names like bifrons. Nobody else. Listen closely today. The Babylonians are grinning after a long while. The phones have been hacked. Dots on dish. The rotten package from The Hague. Choose sides now to avoid embarrassment. The checkmate is set again. The above seems very similar to how CAPS writes, except better English. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 21, 2008, 02:07:33 PM Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:24 am Post subject: Do not confuse... The Simian called out names like bifrons. Nobody else. Listen closely today. The Babylonians are grinning after a long while. The phones have been hacked. Dots on dish. The rotten package from The Hague. Choose sides now to avoid embarrassment. The checkmate is set again. The above seems very similar to how CAPS writes, except better English. Merian Ernest was Simian. Merian/Simian was Aruban. Caps is an Aruban so you can't really deduct anything from that IMO. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: iris44 on December 21, 2008, 02:17:09 PM Off topic, but are jumbo breast enhancements required for all women living in Aruba?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 02:18:45 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Poochy on December 21, 2008, 02:54:52 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! The second contact was when he said himself he picked her up w/Joran. I can't find that PV now. (Didn't some of Paulus' PVs have missing pages in them?) Then there was the 2am and 4am phone calls. Who had the authority to give Paulus the 'get out of jail' card? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 21, 2008, 02:56:07 PM Off topic, but are jumbo breast enhancements required for all women living in Aruba? ::MonkeyHaHa:: It does seem that way! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 03:04:44 PM I wanted to bring this forward: ^^^BUMP^^^^Kermit posted: It is Dolf Richarson who is in charge of the investigation. I know that he waited some time before he even sent what was called the material. So could he have switched it? I don't know. But look at Dolph Richardson and Hans Mos. AND the Aruban divers that were on board. BUT and I am going to say this ONLY ONCE. The Aruban divers, nor Hans Mos, nor Richardson were aware of what I may reveal to you. THEY have no idea. That is important because it reveals the cover-up. I missed this!!! hmmmmm ::MonkeyEek:: I took this to mean that the Aruban's were unaware of the pics of the zip lock bags. Buckeye ... on November 23, 2008 when Kermit posted the above ... she/he had yet to reveal the ROV images and Kyle's posts which had been submited to a private forum ... posst which exposed a John S/Aruban connection regarding the truth encompassing the Persistence hoax. Kermit made the revelation one day later. In other words ... the implication is the Arubans had no idea that any proof existed that exposed the contents of that cage/trap. Janet ++++++++ Kermit Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #20 on: November 23, 2008, 10:12:06 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg554827#msg554827 THE ROV IMAGES Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: natalfan on December 21, 2008, 03:06:20 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! Because they're corrupt as hell Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 21, 2008, 03:21:08 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! The second contact was when he said himself he picked her up w/Joran. I can't find that PV now. (Didn't some of Paulus' PVs have missing pages in them?) Then there was the 2am and 4am phone calls. Who had the authority to give Paulus the 'get out of jail' card? Yes Paulus' PV's had missing pages. Karin Janssen gave Paulus the get out of jail card but she was following orders the same way Mos is following the same orders. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 21, 2008, 03:30:07 PM ARUBA COVER-UP!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 21, 2008, 03:34:53 PM Who is the boss of them all, San?
Caps had said that Peterze was to replace Mos I thought, but we saw the article yesterday that he is replacing Teresa Croes. Is Mos really on the fast boat back to Holland? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 03:41:26 PM Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 03:45:44 PM What is the history of Ed Comemencia?How did he come to be in the position he his?Where is he from?Is he Aruban,Venezuelan,Colombian,Dutch?Does the Information Guru,Janet have a timeline of when and where "ED's" head seemed to pop up all the way until being aboard the Persistence.Who is Ed's boss?What is His relationship to Paulus?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 03:48:16 PM O/T.What a great day in Seattle!Favre,Holmgren,Snow.Bringin a lil of Lambeu to Qwest field for their Final meeting.. ::MonkeyDance::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 03:58:02 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! The second contact was when he said himself he picked her up w/Joran. I can't find that PV now. (Didn't some of Paulus' PVs have missing pages in them?) Then there was the 2am and 4am phone calls. Who had the authority to give Paulus the 'get out of jail' card? Yes Paulus' PV's had missing pages. Karin Janssen gave Paulus the get out of jail card but she was following orders the same way Mos is following the same orders. Yes, Janssen let him out of jail. And is probably following orders...or doing a 'favor' for a friend. So, what could they have done that was so bad that could be proven? So bad that they were willing to risk the best above board industry they have in order to cover for Paulus and Joran Van Der Sloot? If she truly died of a non-self induced drug overdose, there would be no way to prove that she had not taken the drugs herself. Granted, we would not believe it, but who could prove it? So why did they not let her body be found? 1. Evidence of more than drugs being involved in her death. 2. There is no body. She left the island alive. (no body, no case) 3. They were too stupid to think that her family would actually question their 'investigation', so they disposed of her in a manner that will not allow her to be found. Now, they are stuck with being under a spotlight that will never grow dim. (even if the search done by the Persistence did locate her remains, Aruba continues to cover up. Why are they letting this go on when they could easily convict Joran with those remains?) Why continue the cover up??????????? What truth could be so bad that they are willing to continue to harm the one legal industry on that island?????? We could accept that a 'few bad cops and politicians' initiated and maintained a cover up. Hell, we already know this and they KNOW we know it. So, why not end it now and tell the truth? And let Aruba begin to try and restore the tourist industry? Comeon, Aruba....it's past time to do the right thing by Natalee. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 04:00:14 PM O/T.What a great day in Seattle!Favre,Holmgren,Snow.Bringin a lil of Lambeu to Qwest field for their Final meeting.. ::MonkeyDance:: O/T question...R U a Seahawk fan? (I am a huge Farve fan, but not really much of a Jets fan) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 04:02:50 PM ALE can never be trusted. Kyle(OE). We're all willing to hear the rebuttal but for some reason i think it'll never come. Hi Keepthefaith I believe the words in Kyle Kingman's posts ... exposing to internet posters the underlying purpose of the Persistence endeavor ... an endeavor that had nothing to do with justice for Natalee Holloway ... an endeavor that nothing to do with closure for her family ... speak for themselves. I pray that that Kyle will have a change of heart and ... put aside his major network deals and ... make the personal decision to be a participant in exposing the Persistence hoax to the family and the FBI. His testimony regarding the happenings on board the Persistence is crucial. The family deserves to know if Natalee's remains were in that crab/trap. If Kyle choses to stay his present course ... he is has chosen to be one with those ... who from the getgo ... have prevented justice from prevailing for an eighteen year old American citizen. He has chosen to be one ... with those who from the getgo ... have put a family through a H--- on Earth. Kyle ... even at this late date ... Monkeys are waiting for you to post and reveal that you have made the decision to take the high road ... reveal the Persistence hoax and ... let the chips fall where they may. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:07:59 PM Aruba Diario - 02-14-07 The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared. Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn. Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions. Translation Credit: Diario Aruba This is the most interesting part of this declaration regarding the 'case against Paulus'. This says TWO OCCASIONS where he had personal contact with Natalee ONE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED. Two, yet this only reveals ONE. So, to think about the information from the phone tap...when did he state he picked them both up and took Natalee to the HI? 5/30, 5/31, 6/1...a few days after that? We KNOW that the Holiday Inn drop off story was told in the early morning hours of 5/31 to Natalee's family and friends, but Paulus was not included in that story. Before that moment when Deepak and Joran told that story, if the Van Der Sloot home phone was already tapped and Paulus is heard saying to someone, "I picked Joran and a girl up at McDonald's and he and I took her to the HI"...BAM. Paulus just gave himself away big as day. If Paulus made that statement over the phone after the early morning hours of 5/31, who in the hell was he saying that to? He had to know that the HI story told by Deepak and Joran did not include him, so why compound a lie to include yourself? Including yourself in what is already a lie does not protect your son since the polis already have their statements saying Deepak and Joran and Satish dropped her at the HI. So who would Paulus say such a thing to? Had they already had their meeting around the pool? If so, Paulus is one dumb SOB. If not, Paulus is still one dumb SOB! The second interesting thing about this snip from the article is that it stated that it has been indicated that Paulus had two occasions of contact with Natalee that night. So did they clearly identify Paulus as the man sitting at the black jack table from the casino security footage? If not, then where and when was the other occasion? If so, why isn't he still a suspect? Better yet, WHY AREN'T ALL OF THIS AZZHOLES STILL IN JAIL!!! The second contact was when he said himself he picked her up w/Joran. I can't find that PV now. (Didn't some of Paulus' PVs have missing pages in them?) Then there was the 2am and 4am phone calls. Who had the authority to give Paulus the 'get out of jail' card? Yes Paulus' PV's had missing pages. Karin Janssen gave Paulus the get out of jail card but she was following orders the same way Mos is following the same orders. Yes, Janssen let him out of jail. And is probably following orders...or doing a 'favor' for a friend. So, what could they have done that was so bad that could be proven? So bad that they were willing to risk the best above board industry they have in order to cover for Paulus and Joran Van Der Sloot? If she truly died of a non-self induced drug overdose, there would be no way to prove that she had not taken the drugs herself. Granted, we would not believe it, but who could prove it? So why did they not let her body be found? 1. Evidence of more than drugs being involved in her death. 2. There is no body. She left the island alive. (no body, no case) 3. They were too stupid to think that her family would actually question their 'investigation', so they disposed of her in a manner that will not allow her to be found. Now, they are stuck with being under a spotlight that will never grow dim. (even if the search done by the Persistence did locate her remains, Aruba continues to cover up. Why are they letting this go on when they could easily convict Joran with those remains?) Why continue the cover up??????????? What truth could be so bad that they are willing to continue to harm the one legal industry on that island?????? We could accept that a 'few bad cops and politicians' initiated and maintained a cover up. Hell, we already know this and they KNOW we know it. So, why not end it now and tell the truth? And let Aruba begin to try and restore the tourist industry? Comeon, Aruba....it's past time to do the right thing by Natalee. Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:10:14 PM O/T.What a great day in Seattle!Favre,Holmgren,Snow.Bringin a lil of Lambeu to Qwest field for their Final meeting.. ::MonkeyDance:: O/T question...R U a Seahawk fan? (I am a huge Farve fan, but not really much of a Jets fan) Live in Seattle Truthseeker.Yes!Seahawk fan,but want Favre to continue to win to stick it to Green Bay... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 04:13:12 PM O/T.What a great day in Seattle!Favre,Holmgren,Snow.Bringin a lil of Lambeu to Qwest field for their Final meeting.. ::MonkeyDance:: O/T question...R U a Seahawk fan? (I am a huge Farve fan, but not really much of a Jets fan) Live in Seattle Truthseeker.Yes!Seahawk fan,but want Favre to continue to win to stick it to Green Bay... Ah...I like the way you think! I have followed Farve since he was a collegiate QB at Southern Mississippi. Green Bay made a huge mistake, imo! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 21, 2008, 04:14:10 PM Who is the boss of them all, San? Caps had said that Peterze was to replace Mos I thought, but we saw the article yesterday that he is replacing Teresa Croes. Is Mos really on the fast boat back to Holland? I thought MOS was only their for a short time anyway. I think MOS is gone some time after the first of the year. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:16:31 PM ALE can never be trusted. Kyle(OE). We're all willing to hear the rebuttal but for some reason i think it'll never come. Hi Keepthefaith I believe the words in Kyle Kingman's posts ... exposing to internet posters the underlying purpose of the Persistence endeavor ... an endeavor that had nothing to do with justice for Natalee Holloway ... an endeavor that nothing to do with closure for her family ... speak for themselves. I pray that that Kyle will have a change of heart and ... put aside his major network deals and ... make the personal decision to be a participant in exposing the Persistence hoax to the family and the FBI. His testimony regarding the happenings on board the Persistence is crucial. The family deserves to know if Natalee's remains were in that crab/trap. If Kyle choses to stay his present course ... he is has chosen to be one with those ... who from the getgo ... have prevented justice from prevailing for an eighteen year old American citizen. He has chosen to be one ... with those who from the getgo ... have put a family through a H--- on Earth. Kyle ... even at this late date ... Monkeys are waiting for you to post and reveal that you have made the decision to take the high road ... reveal the Persistence hoax and ... let the chips fall where they may. Janet I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least!Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 04:19:59 PM Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. You would think they would have a handle on it by now, wouldn't you? It seems like the average Aruban has already been hurt by this, not to mention the laundering of money through the casinos. Maybe the laundering business is still working just fine? What a crappy place. Too bad I had never considered going there before. Kinda makes my boycott of that rock a zero effect. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 04:21:28 PM Who is the boss of them all, San? Caps had said that Peterze was to replace Mos I thought, but we saw the article yesterday that he is replacing Teresa Croes. Is Mos really on the fast boat back to Holland? I thought MOS was only their for a short time anyway. I think MOS is gone some time after the first of the year. That's the way I understand it too, Klaas. Seems he did his job, which was to keep the cover up going. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:26:32 PM Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. You would think they would have a handle on it by now, wouldn't you? It seems like the average Aruban has already been hurt by this, not to mention the laundering of money through the casinos. Maybe the laundering business is still working just fine? What a crappy place. Too bad I had never considered going there before. Kinda makes my boycott of that rock a zero effect. As we know they launder money.Would it not be even more evident as tourism dollars drop off.You can't continue to operate when a business isn't making money?The mafia is greedy and we all know that.How much money are they willing to lose on behalf of Paulus??His fingerprints must be on every dirty contract.I hope Kermit has the ability to research how many contracts,as well as which ones!I continue to go back to where is Paulus interjected into this Business on the island with his Jobs on the island?? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 04:31:38 PM Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. You would think they would have a handle on it by now, wouldn't you? It seems like the average Aruban has already been hurt by this, not to mention the laundering of money through the casinos. Maybe the laundering business is still working just fine? What a crappy place. Too bad I had never considered going there before. Kinda makes my boycott of that rock a zero effect. As we know they launder money.Would it not be even more evident as tourism dollars drop off.You can't continue to operate when a business isn't making money?The mafia is greedy and we all know that.How much money are they willing to lose on behalf of Paulus??His fingerprints must be on every dirty contract.I hope Kermit has the ability to research how many contracts,as well as which ones!I continue to go back to where is Paulus interjected into this Business on the island with his Jobs on the island?? All very good questions. If this coverup is a result of Paulus being able to bring others down if they let him and/or his son get convicted, then there has to be a very good paper trail some where. Without a paper trail, they could say everything Paulus would say was a lie. So who are these people? Posner? Riveroll? Both? Or others? And how many government officials are getting their cuts? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:42:10 PM Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. You would think they would have a handle on it by now, wouldn't you? It seems like the average Aruban has already been hurt by this, not to mention the laundering of money through the casinos. Maybe the laundering business is still working just fine? What a crappy place. Too bad I had never considered going there before. Kinda makes my boycott of that rock a zero effect. As we know they launder money.Would it not be even more evident as tourism dollars drop off.You can't continue to operate when a business isn't making money?The mafia is greedy and we all know that.How much money are they willing to lose on behalf of Paulus??His fingerprints must be on every dirty contract.I hope Kermit has the ability to research how many contracts,as well as which ones!I continue to go back to where is Paulus interjected into this Business on the island with his Jobs on the island?? All very good questions. If this coverup is a result of Paulus being able to bring others down if they let him and/or his son get convicted, then there has to be a very good paper trail some where. Without a paper trail, they could say everything Paulus would say was a lie. So who are these people? Posner? Riveroll? Both? Or others? And how many government officials are getting their cuts? Who does Paulus bank with in Aruba,The Netherlands,as well as anywhere else in the world?This very well may lead right back to the Hague,as well as "The Queen".You think she's gonna let Aruba wash hundreds of millions of dollars and not get a cut.With the round table is Aruba just asking for Laundered money back?Is the Netherlands not following their under the table aggreement so to speak?Let's think BIG Truthseeker..This has got to be BIG as to not bring down a small few for a horrific crime... ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 21, 2008, 04:42:15 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:44:20 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now. I agree Anna.So how do they "Cook" the books if the Airline books don't coincide with the Hotel books?Not that it matters.Just asking questions like usual.LOL Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 04:45:44 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now. I agree Anna.So how do they "Cook" the books if the Airline books don't coincide with the Hotel books?Not that it matters.Just asking questions like usual.LOL So who does the accounting for these hotels in Aruba?How do we locate who the accountants are?They probably don't exist..LOL Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 04:51:33 PM As of December 5, 2008 ... Hans Mos was still held the position of Aruban prosecutor but ... was not interested in questioning Joran van der Sloot in regards to his words in his interview with Greta ... in regards to his words implicating his father in the coverup encompassing the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. It was my understanding that a prosecutor is suppose to be an advocate for the victim. Joran and Paulus van der Sloot cannot lose. The have defence attorneys ... those within the Aruban and Dutch administration and ... the prosecutor all working on their behalf. Janet +++++++ Natalee Holloway's Mom: Aruba Investigators 'Not Following Up on Any Leads' Wednesday, November 19, 2008 VAN SUSTEREN: Karin Janssen was the original prosecutor and Hans Mos took over. When she left Aruba, did she call you and sort of tie up lose ends, or did she just sort of vanish from your radar screen? HOLLOWAY: ... So you know, that's always been an issue, just no communication from the prosecuting attorney's office. And you know, it just leaves you wondering, you know, where are you? And you hear all this information coming them, saying that they're following up on every lead. Well, you know, that's just simply not true. They're not following up on any leads. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,454527,00.html Holloway Attorney: Pleas for Arrest Met With 'Deafening Silence' Wednesday, December 03, 2008 GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: "Arrest them." That's what the lawyer for Natalee Holloway's family told the Aruban prosecutor. Joran van der Sloot told us "On the Record" that he sold Natalee Holloway on a beach in Aruba. He also named names, including his own father. Then Joran e-mailed us that he made the whole story up. Did he make it up, or did he send that email because he panicked after he realized what he told us on camera. Now the Holloway family lawyer John Q. Kelly wants action. In a letter to Aruban Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos, Kelly calls for the arrest of Joran van der Sloot. Joran's father Paulus and the Kalpoe brothers are also included. John Q. Kelly joins us. And John Q. Kelly, I hope you're not mad because we got the letter out of your client. JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY: That letter went out last Wednesday. VAN SUSTEREN: I know. I got my hands on it a day or two ago, or last week. KELLY: Sure. VAN SUSTEREN: It's your letter. What do you want from Hans Mos, and what have you heard from him? KELLY: Nothing but deafening silence out of Aruba. No, I haven't heard from him. The point of the letter was, and if you remember last year, Greta, with great fanfare and press releases, and, you know, just all kinds of dog and pony show, they arrested the Kalpoe brothers and Joran for absolutely no reason, no new evidence. Just picked them up and held them for a month. And now they have new evidence. You have a damning confession by Joran as to serious criminal conduct he engaged in, implicates others. And they haven't done anything with it. And everything Joran has said is consistent with the facts as we know them right now. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,460908,00.html Holloway Cover-up By Aruban Law Enforcement? Friday, December 05, 2008 GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: ... John, let's get some timing, first of all. When did you send that letter asking to have the arrest? When was that sent? JOHN Q. KELLY, ATTORNEY FOR HOLLOWAY FAMILY: Eight days ago. It would have been last Wednesday. VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Get a response? KELLY: No response to the letter. First phone call back was today, my cell phone. VAN SUSTEREN: All right. When did you get -- when did you last make a phone call to Hans Mos? KELLY: Yesterday morning. VAN SUSTEREN: Before -- yesterday morning? KELLY: Yes. VAN SUSTEREN: And I take it you said, Call me back, right? KELLY: Yes. VAN SUSTEREN: OK. So what was your voicemail that met you today? What'd you get? KELLY: Oh, I wouldn't call it nasty. I would say it was curt. He was clearly angry. And it was just basically two things. One, he said it was unfortunate, what I said about him on your show the other night, which, whatever it was, I stand by it 100 percent. And the second thing was, basically, Don't hold your breath on the letter you wrote me. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462349,00.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 21, 2008, 04:52:11 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now. I agree Anna.So how do they "Cook" the books if the Airline books don't coincide with the Hotel books?Not that it matters.Just asking questions like usual.LOL Some cruise ships like Royal Dutch still go there. I would imagine it is much harder to do so now with fewer airlines making flights but there is no way to keep tabs on how much gambling and losing what few tourists they do have might actually do. Just run it through the casinos. Remember the mafia used to run money through pizza parlors in this country. I know a shoe shine parlor that used to be a front for something. Never knew exactly what but knew not that many people in that neighborhood had shoes polished. Same with some candy stores. Fronts for something else. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 21, 2008, 04:53:35 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now. I agree Anna.So how do they "Cook" the books if the Airline books don't coincide with the Hotel books?Not that it matters.Just asking questions like usual.LOL So who does the accounting for these hotels in Aruba?How do we locate who the accountants are?They probably don't exist..LOL I don't think I want to phone Posner and ask, lol. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 21, 2008, 04:56:22 PM There haven't been any announcements about Mos going anywhere. Pieterz replaced Theresa Croes instead of Mos as we were told.
Their revolving door of officials certainly keeps things in a constant state of confusion with no one being ultimately responsible for anything. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 05:00:40 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 21, 2008, 05:03:16 PM Janet,
Under "their system" the prosecutor is supposed to be neutral party and an advocate for justice only. The law speaks for the victim and attorneys for the defendants. Mos is not technically an advocate for the victim but both parties and is to act in the interest of justice and the law only. That is why it is also his responsibility to prevent people from harassing Joran in Aruba, etc. If Aruba had no corruption laws as was posted on the Front Page here, I doubt they have any to reach into other countries like Thailand for doing anything to Joran for trying to sell girls. And prostitution is legal in Aruba anyway so am sure Joran would say the girls wanted to do that. But I had held out hope Thailand would lower the boom on him. Maybe they still will and will catch him in something really serious. That would still not address the need for justice for Natalee, however. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 05:04:24 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 05:10:33 PM I was always curious to who the "Fixer" was.Guess my question has been answered.I brought up the Movie with George clooney called "Michael Clayton"
Here's the summary.. Michael Clayton is Mr. Fix-It for his law firm, Kenner, Back and Odeen. A former District Attorney, Clayton uses his contacts in the police and the criminal justice system to bail out the firm's wealthy corporate clients. When one of the firm's senior partners, Arthur Edens, has a nervous breakdown while taking a deposition in a lawsuit against a major agrochemicals company, Clayton is dispatched to bring him home. What Clayton soon learns is Edens not only has doubts about defending the lawsuit but that the company may be acting on its own to ensure a positive outcome. So Ed does the "Fixing" for all the DirtyFingers as he is the DirtyHand??? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 05:13:16 PM Janet, Under "their system" the prosecutor is supposed to be neutral party and an advocate for justice only. The law speaks for the victim and attorneys for the defendants. Mos is not technically an advocate for the victim but both parties and is to act in the interest of justice and the law only. That is why it is also his responsibility to prevent people from harassing Joran in Aruba, etc. If Aruba had no corruption laws as was posted on the Front Page here, I doubt they have any to reach into other countries like Thailand for doing anything to Joran for trying to sell girls. And prostitution is legal in Aruba anyway so am sure Joran would say the girls wanted to do that. But I had held out hope Thailand would lower the boom on him. Maybe they still will and will catch him in something really serious. That would still not address the need for justice for Natalee, however. Is Joran really still in Thailand? What, no Christmas in Aruba for Joran...persona non grata? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 05:26:52 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Keepthefaith ... I have left it up to you to compile the quotes I have provided into chronological order. Janet +++++++ Aruban PM Seeks Answers Saturday , June 11, 2005 Police and volunteer land searches continued Wednesday with no results, while water searches, also unsuccessful, had been suspended "at this time," police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159006,00.html Aruba Missing Teen Posted: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Last Updated: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Reporter: Associated Press A volunteer group searching for a missing Alabama teenager dug through a landfill in Aruba for a third day today (Sunday) but found no clues. The search resumes tomorrow. An Aruban man said he was at the landfill dropping off trash when he saw men dump and cover the body of a blonde female, two days after Natalee Holloway disappeared. Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing. He said the witness recently approached Holloway's family, who asked for another search. http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html CNN LARRY KING LIVE Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases. So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/lkl.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 05:37:09 PM No, money laundering can happen just as well with pretend tourists as real ones. Just on the book occupancies, use dirty money to pay their stays and deposit it the same as though someone was really there. I have to wonder if this has not been happening for years now. I agree Anna.So how do they "Cook" the books if the Airline books don't coincide with the Hotel books?Not that it matters.Just asking questions like usual.LOL I think for that exact reason, other industries would have to be involved, that "pretend" tourists are not the case. They can't just appear there. I agree that tourism is one hand that stirs the dirty pot of money laundering down there. Hence more flights, cheaper flights, cheaper stays, "give aways", increased Venezuelan/South American tourists, music concerts, and lately I notice a push on weddings away. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 05:51:15 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press Thanx Janet! ::MonkeyDance:: One of the men behind the cover-up. ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Keepthefaith ... I have left it up to you to compile the quotes I have provided into chronological order. Janet +++++++ Aruban PM Seeks Answers Saturday , June 11, 2005 Police and volunteer land searches continued Wednesday with no results, while water searches, also unsuccessful, had been suspended "at this time," police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159006,00.html Aruba Missing Teen Posted: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Last Updated: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Reporter: Associated Press A volunteer group searching for a missing Alabama teenager dug through a landfill in Aruba for a third day today (Sunday) but found no clues. The search resumes tomorrow. An Aruban man said he was at the landfill dropping off trash when he saw men dump and cover the body of a blonde female, two days after Natalee Holloway disappeared. Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing. He said the witness recently approached Holloway's family, who asked for another search. http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html CNN LARRY KING LIVE Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases. So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/lkl.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 05:53:50 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press Thanx Janet! ::MonkeyDance:: One of the men behind the cover-up. ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Keepthefaith ... I have left it up to you to compile the quotes I have provided into chronological order. Janet +++++++ Aruban PM Seeks Answers Saturday , June 11, 2005 Police and volunteer land searches continued Wednesday with no results, while water searches, also unsuccessful, had been suspended "at this time," police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159006,00.html Aruba Missing Teen Posted: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Last Updated: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Reporter: Associated Press A volunteer group searching for a missing Alabama teenager dug through a landfill in Aruba for a third day today (Sunday) but found no clues. The search resumes tomorrow. An Aruban man said he was at the landfill dropping off trash when he saw men dump and cover the body of a blonde female, two days after Natalee Holloway disappeared. Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing. He said the witness recently approached Holloway's family, who asked for another search. http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html CNN LARRY KING LIVE Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases. So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/lkl.01.html Messed that last one up.LOL Thanx Janet! ::MonkeyDance:: One of the men behind the cover-up. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 05:57:49 PM I think we're all willing to hear kyle out.The continued protracted silence is disheartening to say the least! Did you see my questions regarding ED Comemencia?Is there an accurate chronolgy of when and where is head popped up? Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Keepthefaith ... I have left it up to you to compile the quotes I have provided into chronological order. Janet +++++++ Aruban PM Seeks Answers Saturday , June 11, 2005 Police and volunteer land searches continued Wednesday with no results, while water searches, also unsuccessful, had been suspended "at this time," police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159006,00.html Aruba Missing Teen Posted: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Last Updated: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Reporter: Associated Press A volunteer group searching for a missing Alabama teenager dug through a landfill in Aruba for a third day today (Sunday) but found no clues. The search resumes tomorrow. An Aruban man said he was at the landfill dropping off trash when he saw men dump and cover the body of a blonde female, two days after Natalee Holloway disappeared. Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing. He said the witness recently approached Holloway's family, who asked for another search. http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html CNN LARRY KING LIVE Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases. So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/lkl.01.html Keepthefaith The quotes I have compiled for you reveal that Edwin Comemencia was involved in the following aspects of the Natalee Holloway investigation. 1. Official search. 2. Mariott pond search. 3. Racquet Ball Club pond search. 4. Landfill search 5. Security Guards' detainment. Janet ______ EDWIN COMEMENCIA - SECURITY GUARDS Aruba's Government Asks for Help in Search Tuesday, June 07, 2005 Aruban police in unmarked cars accompanied by FBI agents made a pre-dawn raid at 5 a.m. Sunday, rousting two suspects aged 28 and 30 from their beds. An AP photographer watched as the rumpled men — one from the De Vuiyst housing project for poorer islanders and another from an average home in southeast San Nicolas — emerged without resistance, hands cuffed behind their backs. Police searched the homes and emerged with what looked like a metal safe deposit box and a garbage bag of clothing. Police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said that authorities had not ruled out the possibility that other people were involved. The two men in custody were not among three others described Saturday by police as "persons of interest." "I think there are more suspects ... we're going to arrest more" people in connection with the case, Comemencia told FOX News on Monday. Authorities declined to comment whether there was a relationship between the suspects and other three, earlier described as students — two Surinamese and a native of the Netherlands — who told police they dropped off Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. on May 30. Hotel employees, however, say that security cameras did not record her return. Comemencia also said that he didn't believe Holloway ever returned to her hotel. "The investigation looks like, that night, she never returned to her hotel," Comemencia told FOX News. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,158666,00.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 06:50:51 PM Can anyone recall if it was Edwin 'Papito' Commencia who owned Papito's towing as the company that towed the VDS jeep? I seem to recall this as having been discussed, and again puts 'Papito' back in the picture.
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/Observer00000007/Evidence-redvdScar.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 06:52:45 PM EDWIN COMEMENCIA
1. Security Guards' Detainment 2. Official Search. 3. Mariott Pond Search. 4. Duct Tape/Blond Hair Discovery 5. Racquet Ball Club Pond Search. 6. Landfill search _______ 1. SECURITY GUARDS DETAINMENT Aruba's Government Asks for Help in Search Tuesday, June 07, 2005 Aruban police in unmarked cars accompanied by FBI agents made a pre-dawn raid at 5 a.m. Sunday, rousting two suspects aged 28 and 30 from their beds. An AP photographer watched as the rumpled men — one from the De Vuiyst housing project for poorer islanders and another from an average home in southeast San Nicolas — emerged without resistance, hands cuffed behind their backs. Police searched the homes and emerged with what looked like a metal safe deposit box and a garbage bag of clothing. Police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said that authorities had not ruled out the possibility that other people were involved. The two men in custody were not among three others described Saturday by police as "persons of interest." "I think there are more suspects ... we're going to arrest more" people in connection with the case, Comemencia told FOX News on Monday. Authorities declined to comment whether there was a relationship between the suspects and other three, earlier described as students — two Surinamese and a native of the Netherlands — who told police they dropped off Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. on May 30. Hotel employees, however, say that security cameras did not record her return. Comemencia also said that he didn't believe Holloway ever returned to her hotel. "The investigation looks like, that night, she never returned to her hotel," Comemencia told FOX News. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,158666,00.html 2. OFFICIAL SEARCH Aruban PM Seeks Answers Saturday , June 11, 2005 Police and volunteer land searches continued Wednesday with no results, while water searches, also unsuccessful, had been suspended "at this time," police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159006,00.html 3. MARRIOT POND SEARCH Aruba Cops Search Dutch Suspect's Home Wednesday, June 15, 2005 A couple of Holloway's family members arrived on the scene Tuesday afternoon as police cordoned off several streets in front of the Marriott and investigators descended upon the swampy terrain next door. Asked why police searched the area, Comemencia replied, "We got some information we needed to check." He would not say if authorities were acting on what John said. He also declined to comment on whether any of the three young men still in custody had changed their versions of what happened the night the teen disappeared. There is a small pond, perhaps four to six feet deep, in the underbrush that was being searched. A large fire truck pumper truck was parked on the road. Earlier, what appeared to be a generator was dropped off by a flatbed truck. Reporters said they saw the pond being slowly drained. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159601,00.html Posted 6/14/2005 2:51 PM Updated 6/15/2005 10:09 AM Aruban police come up empty-handed in search for teen Police converged on a mangrove swamp near the Marriott Tuesday, a secluded area behind the beach dotted with fishermen's huts, to search for Natalee Holloway after being told that the young men who were last seen with her had lied about where they dropped her off. Workers used a firetruck to drain a pond in the middle of the swamp.(Map: Inside Aruba) "We didn't find anything," police spokesman Edwin Comemencia told the Associated Press. He said the search would not continue in the same area today but declined to say where police would go next. http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-06-14-aruba-search_x.htm 4. DUCT TAPE/BLOND HAIR DISCOVERY Blond Hair On Tape Found In Aruba DNA Testing To Be Done In The Netherlands, FBI Lab In Virginia ORANJESTAD, Aruba, July 18, 2005 (AP) Investigators said Monday they will conduct DNA tests on blond hair attached to duct tape that was found along Aruba's coast to see if it came from Natalee Holloway in a possible break to the six-week-old mystery. A park ranger found the duct tape while collecting trash Sunday on rocks at Boca Tortuga, an inlet near a series of caves on Aruba's northeast coast, said National Park Ranger Service spokeswoman Dilma Arends. Boca Tortuga is on the opposite side of Aruba from where the 18-year-old was last seen in public, and her father expressed little hope that the find would yield an important clue. "We've had a lot of information that turned out false," David Holloway said as he prepared to leave Aruba and return home to Meridian, Miss. The ranger who made the find, Mario Rasmijn, said there were several strands, each about 12 inches long, and that some were light blond and others were dark. The hair will be sent to the Netherlands for DNA analysis, said police spokesman Edwin Comemencia. Aruba, a Dutch protectorate, doesn't have a lab to conduct the genetic testing. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/07/18/world/main709813.shtml 5. RACQUET CLUB POND SEARCH Firefighters Drain Lake in Search for Natalee Tuesday, July 26, 2005 Associated Press ORANJESTAD, Aruba — Aruban firefighters were draining a lake Tuesday in the search for an Alabama teenager who vanished nearly two months ago while vacationing in the island. Edwin Comemencia, a police spokesman, confirmed that the draining of the lake across from the Marriott Hotel was part of the investigation into Natalee Holloway's (search) disappearance but would not comment further. A jailed Dutch youth has said he was with Holloway in the area the night she disappeared. The draining was expected to take up to 24 hours. Earlier Tuesday, Holloway's stepfather, George Twitty (search), said two new witnesses had come forward with information about the night she disappeared. One witness told investigators that he saw Joran van der Sloot (search), the 17-year-old who has been detained as the main suspect, driving to a nightclub across the road from the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. the night Holloway disappeared, Twitty said. The witness said van der Sloot tried to hide his face with his hands as he drove to the Racquet Club with two Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers were detained as suspects and later released. The stepfather said the account places the three individuals near the hotel beach where van der Sloot says he left 18-year-old Holloway alone the last night she was seen in public. "What's interesting is the time — 2:30 a.m. — when the three were supposedly on their way home," said Twitty, referring to their previous accounts to investigators. The witness, a gardener whose name was not disclosed, gave his account to investigators on Friday, Twitty said. The Kalpoe brothers first told police that they and van der Sloot dropped Holloway at her hotel around 2 a.m. the morning of May 30. Later, they said they had lied to protect their friend and that they had dropped the Dutch youth and American teen at a beach near the hotel. A second new witness told a private investigator hired by Holloway's family that she saw van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers drive into the Racquet Club three times that same night. The woman, who lives near the nightclub, has not yet spoken with investigators, he said. Aruban authorities did not comment on the stepfather's statements. An attorney for van der Sloot, Richie Kock, said authorities had not told him about the new witnesses. Lawyers for the Kalpoe brothers were not immediately available for comment. No one has been charged in the case, and van der Sloot is the only suspect still detained. Holloway vanished after an evening of eating, drinking and dancing at a nightclub which she left with the three young men, hours before she was to catch a flight home to Mountain Brook, Ala., at the end of a graduation trip with 124 classmates. http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,163750,00.html 6. LANDFILL SEARCH Aruba Missing Teen Posted: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Last Updated: 8:38 AM Aug 1, 2005 Reporter: Associated Press A volunteer group searching for a missing Alabama teenager dug through a landfill in Aruba for a third day today (Sunday) but found no clues. The search resumes tomorrow. An Aruban man said he was at the landfill dropping off trash when he saw men dump and cover the body of a blonde female, two days after Natalee Holloway disappeared. Police spokesman Edwin Comenencia said police searched the landfill after receiving the tip days after Holloway's disappearance May 30th, but found nothing. He said the witness recently approached Holloway's family, who asked for another search. http://www.wtvynews4.com/home/headlines/1756907.html CNN Larry King Live Latest in Natalee Holloway Investigation Aired July 29, 2005 - 21:00 ET TIM MILLER, DIRECTOR, TEXAS EQUUSEARCH: I -- I don't think he has anything to gain, for number one. I think he truly does fear. I think, you know, he's stuck to a story that he -- you know, I talked to the police commissioner this morning. The police commissioner says, you know, he's not one of the guys you'd probably want to hire to go to work for you or something like that, but he's sticking to that story. And we've interviewed him. We sent the FBI out there, you know, and no matter what his mental condition is or his IQ is, a lot of times, it's these type of people that see something that help solve cases. So anyhow, again, we've got a big task ahead of us. I think tomorrow also, we're going to be bringing in that gas detection device that we've got, to go back into the pond, and then we're using the ground penetration radar systems to be in another area. So we're going to be spread real thin tomorrow, but I think the area that we're focused on the very most, where we're going to have most of our people is at the dump. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/29/lkl.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bleachedblack on December 21, 2008, 06:59:31 PM Even if Paulus is in Bed with the Mafia that does business on the island wouldn't they have handle this themselves by now?As we know the foundation of this Island is Corruption,drugs,prostitution,as well as money laundering i don't think their to concerned with tourism.The only way that tourism will affect them is if the "REAL" worker's on the island start to lose their jobs in masses due to tourism dollars dropping off.The Mafia will not pay for this out of their own pocket.. You would think they would have a handle on it by now, wouldn't you? It seems like the average Aruban has already been hurt by this, not to mention the laundering of money through the casinos. Maybe the laundering business is still working just fine? What a crappy place. Too bad I had never considered going there before. Kinda makes my boycott of that rock a zero effect. As we know they launder money.Would it not be even more evident as tourism dollars drop off.You can't continue to operate when a business isn't making money?The mafia is greedy and we all know that.How much money are they willing to lose on behalf of Paulus??His fingerprints must be on every dirty contract.I hope Kermit has the ability to research how many contracts,as well as which ones!I continue to go back to where is Paulus interjected into this Business on the island with his Jobs on the island?? All very good questions. If this coverup is a result of Paulus being able to bring others down if they let him and/or his son get convicted, then there has to be a very good paper trail some where. Without a paper trail, they could say everything Paulus would say was a lie. So who are these people? Posner? Riveroll? Both? Or others? And how many government officials are getting their cuts? Who does Paulus bank with in Aruba,The Netherlands,as well as anywhere else in the world?This very well may lead right back to the Hague,as well as "The Queen".You think she's gonna let Aruba wash hundreds of millions of dollars and not get a cut.With the round table is Aruba just asking for Laundered money back?Is the Netherlands not following their under the table aggreement so to speak?Let's think BIG Truthseeker..This has got to be BIG as to not bring down a small few for a horrific crime... ::MonkeyCool:: One of his banks is C.M.B. Bank in Noord according to his June 23 2005 statement. But I imagine there are others. >>>>SNIPPED To your question if I tell you all the things I did on that Monday the 30th of May 2005, I can state the following. I went to work. The exact time I cannot remember but I think it was approximately 08.00 hours. I can also remember that around 10.00 hours I went to the C.M.B. bank. There were long cues at the bank so I left without having made any transaction and went back to work. I left my workplace at approximately 15.00 hours. I arrived at the bank at approximately 15.30. I had gone to the C.M.B. bank that is situated in Noord. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 21, 2008, 07:13:11 PM (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/vdSloot/jiuiuu33223.png)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 21, 2008, 07:36:43 PM OM receives new tips about Joran
http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 21, 2008, 07:41:46 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ How many more Tips do they need??We all know who is involved so what else do they need? ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance:: Another Vacation to try to figure it out... Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Blue Moon on December 21, 2008, 07:42:48 PM (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/vdSloot/jiuiuu33223.png) PRICELESS. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 21, 2008, 07:45:54 PM A REMINDER!!!
The contents of the cage/trap which the Persistence discovered and ... John Silvetti turned over to the enemy in exchange for his self-serving interest must remain a focus.. Kyle Kingsman can attest to this but ... will he do the right thing and reveal to John Kelly ... Natalee's family and ... the FBI what he shared on a private forum. Kyle's participation in the process has the ability to bring pressure on the ALE to what/who was in that cage/trap. Janet ______ KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th Kyle: None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: Schafer is sue crazy. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. Kyle: I couldn't get the logs from the Persistence. All things "Holloway" were stripped from the boat once it got back to Louisiana Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Klye: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM oceanexploration: "Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it-To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help. They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust. Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time. We've helped each other however and whenever we can. They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right. I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning. Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal." oceanexploration: "We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care. Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing. Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE." BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. ... The effort was superb, but the game was fixed." THE ROV IMAGES Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #410 on: November 24, 2008, 04:01:55 PM » Photos given to the FBI sent to Dave and Robin posted on the internet are NOT the photos posted above. These were not given to the FBI until recently. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555621#msg555621 ++++++++++ Kyle Kingman Senior Geophysical Project Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Greater New York City Area Current Senior Geophysical Operations Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Past Manager at Kingman Geophysical Solutions Education Rutgers, The State University of New Jersey-New Brunswick Industry Oil & Energy http://www.linkedin.com/pub/b/65/464 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 21, 2008, 07:46:24 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ New tips? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 21, 2008, 07:48:14 PM Can anyone recall if it was Edwin 'Papito' Commencia who owned Papito's towing as the company that towed the VDS jeep? I seem to recall this as having been discussed, and again puts 'Papito' back in the picture. (http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/Observer00000007/Evidence-redvdScar.jpg) I remember the discussion but do not recall it being confirmed. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 07:48:50 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ From reading the article do you get the impression that the 'new tips' are from Gteta's interview with Joran or from the information we have seen regarding the Monsaret pond area? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 21, 2008, 07:55:23 PM The Public Prosecutor (OM) on Aruba has recently received new tips about possible involvement of Joran van der Sloot in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
Principal Officer Hans Mos has for that reason the decision on whether Van der Sloot may or may not be prosecuted further postponed to next year. Originally wanted justice around the Christmas already taken a decision on further prosecutions in the infamous disappearance case. (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/Joran_Sloot_ABC_Nie_188621a.jpg) ,, We get a result of ever-new media attention still inside tips. To investigate, we need more time. We think in February to have enough vision to be able to take a decision on further prosecution,''explains a spokesperson of the OM. What the nature of the tips are wants the Public Ministry in the interest of the investigation will not be lost. Recently, new evidence emerged that statements about Joran gave to the police. The Dutch investigation has recently witnessed a new hearing. This friend of Joran van der Sloot said that he made allusions to his involvement in Natalee's disappearance. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 21, 2008, 07:56:36 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ From reading the article do you get the impression that the 'new tips' are from Gteta's interview with Joran or from the information we have seen regarding the Monsaret pond area? i doesn't say anything specific about the 'new tips'. just that the media attention led to these tips and the OM needs more time to check these. it does mention the recent information from Greta's interview, a girlfriend of Joran being questioned in the Netherlands, two witnessess who gave the police a statement and the PRdV - Thai trafficking program. but i doesn't say if that's related to these 'new tips'. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 21, 2008, 07:58:45 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ From reading the article do you get the impression that the 'new tips' are from Gteta's interview with Joran or from the information we have seen regarding the Monsaret pond area? i doesn't say anything specific about the 'new tips'. just that the media attention led to these tips and the OM needs more time to check these. it does mention the recent information from Greta's interview, a girlfriend of Joran being questioned in the Netherlands, but i doesn't say if that's related to these 'new tips'. correction Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 21, 2008, 08:02:13 PM The Public Prosecutor (OM) on Aruba has recently received new tips about possible involvement of Joran van der Sloot in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Principal Officer Hans Mos has for that reason the decision on whether Van der Sloot may or may not be prosecuted further postponed to next year. Originally wanted justice around the Christmas already taken a decision on further prosecutions in the infamous disappearance case. (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/Joran_Sloot_ABC_Nie_188621a.jpg) ,, We get a result of ever-new media attention still inside tips. To investigate, we need more time. We think in February to have enough vision to be able to take a decision on further prosecution,''explains a spokesperson of the OM. What the nature of the tips are wants the Public Ministry in the interest of the investigation will not be lost. Recently, new evidence emerged that statements about Joran gave to the police. The Dutch investigation has recently witnessed a new hearing. This friend of Joran van der Sloot said that he made allusions to his involvement in Natalee's disappearance. Thanks to you and caesu for posting this information. From your translation it sounds as though they could be talking about the girl that was shown on the last DeVries show. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 21, 2008, 08:03:57 PM The Public Prosecutor (OM) on Aruba has recently received new tips about possible involvement of Joran van der Sloot in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Principal Officer Hans Mos has for that reason the decision on whether Van der Sloot may or may not be prosecuted further postponed to next year. Originally wanted justice around the Christmas already taken a decision on further prosecutions in the infamous disappearance case. (http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00188/Joran_Sloot_ABC_Nie_188621a.jpg) ,, We get a result of ever-new media attention still inside tips. To investigate, we need more time. We think in February to have enough vision to be able to take a decision on further prosecution,''explains a spokesperson of the OM. What the nature of the tips are wants the Public Ministry in the interest of the investigation will not be lost. Recently, new evidence emerged that statements about Joran gave to the police. The Dutch investigation has recently witnessed a new hearing. This friend of Joran van der Sloot said that he made allusions to his involvement in Natalee's disappearance. Thanks to you and caesu for posting this information. From your translation it sounds as though they could be talking about the girl that was shown on the last DeVries show. Yes, this is about this `Celes` Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 21, 2008, 10:55:52 PM (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/vdSloot/jiuiuu33223.png) LMAO! Funny! Thanks I think We all need a good laugh these days! ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyWink::Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 21, 2008, 10:59:02 PM OM receives new tips about Joran I'm praying that these are new witnesses that will blow Aruba away and will get Natalee Home...... ::MonkeyWink::http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 21, 2008, 11:21:47 PM (http://i42.tinypic.com/ra7z0y.png)(http://i44.tinypic.com/whkweb.png)
can't read where it exactly is about. but it seems like a secretary for the Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba is accusing someone in the Aruba House, The Hague of sexual harrasment. http://awemainta.com nothing in the Dutch press about this yet. Quote The Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba (Dutch: Gevolmachtigd Minister van Aruba) represents the constituent country of Aruba in the Council of Ministers of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. The current Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba is Frido Croes. The Minister Plenipotentiary and his cabinet are seated in the "Arubahuis" (Aruba House) in The Hague. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_Plenipotentiary_of_ArubaAruba House http://www.arubahuis.nl/index.php Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: BUCKSHOT on December 21, 2008, 11:53:25 PM There haven't been any announcements about Mos going anywhere. Pieterz replaced Theresa Croes instead of Mos as we were told. Their revolving door of officials certainly keeps things in a constant state of confusion with no one being ultimately responsible for anything. I agree. Part of the strategy, in my opinion. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 22, 2008, 12:05:01 AM There haven't been any announcements about Mos going anywhere. Pieterz replaced Theresa Croes instead of Mos as we were told. Their revolving door of officials certainly keeps things in a constant state of confusion with no one being ultimately responsible for anything. I agree. Part of the strategy, in my opinion. I agree also. Every move Aruba does is part of their plan. If they see it isn't working they just switch gears and try something else. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Rob on December 22, 2008, 02:31:21 AM Hello Mr van der Kouwe,
I hope all is well in your life and that of your family. You are all in our prayers. Hang in there Sir. We all wish you the best holiday possible and that time heals your wounds. Your never far from our hearts. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 22, 2008, 05:37:02 AM Good morning Klaas ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 22, 2008, 09:32:06 AM (http://i42.tinypic.com/ra7z0y.png)(http://i44.tinypic.com/whkweb.png) can't read where it exactly is about. but it seems like a secretary for the Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba is accusing someone in the Aruba House, The Hague of sexual harrasment. http://awemainta.com nothing in the Dutch press about this yet. Quote The Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba (Dutch: Gevolmachtigd Minister van Aruba) represents the constituent country of Aruba in the Council of Ministers of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. The current Minister Plenipotentiary of Aruba is Frido Croes. The Minister Plenipotentiary and his cabinet are seated in the "Arubahuis" (Aruba House) in The Hague. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_Plenipotentiary_of_ArubaAruba House http://www.arubahuis.nl/index.php Interesting list of former occupants of this position: Frido Croes November 8, 2005 MEP Ella Tromp-Yarzagaray October 30, 2001–November 7, 2005 MEP Mito Croes September 1994–October 30, 2001 AVP Candelario Wever March 2, 1993–September 1994 MEP Ella Tromp-Yarzagaray March 8, 1991–March 1, 1993 MEP R.H. Laclé February 9, 1989–March 7, 1991 MEP John Merrywater January 10, 1986–February 11, 1989 PPA Merryweather was the guy who organized protests against Beth and had some connection to the person who said Joran killed his own dog, threw it's body in the quarry at Moko and then tried to blame it on someone else. Lacle - member of Tito's family??? Tito 'maybe she deserved it' Lacle spent a great deal of time trying to convince us that ALE was doing a good job. Cros, Wever and Tromp---could be related to everyone! Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:53 pm If Babylonian card sings ALL will fall Teepees and the house of Babylon Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:30 pm We need a sacrifice to appease the Arawaks and the Cowboys Teepees already swaying in strong babylonian wind House of Babylon does not want a sacrifice They do not care about Arawak Teepees only wrath of cobwoys Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: RoxiBalboa on December 22, 2008, 09:42:27 AM http://gretawire.foxnews.com/
by Greta Van Susteren See below ….from Radio Netherlands….could they be getting serious about an investigation there??? (finally???) (click here) “…The public prosecutor’s office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot’s possible involvement in Natalee Holloway’s disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 22, 2008, 09:48:10 AM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool::
http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 22, 2008, 09:50:59 AM http://www.arubahuis.nl/index.php
Babelfish Translation: Welcome confessed on the Internet site of the cabinet of the agent minister of Aruba, also as the Aruba house. The Aruba house is the official representation of the Arubaanse government in the Netherlands, in accordance with the statute for the kingdom. The agent minister has the general control and in this is supported by a director and several accounts of departments. The Aruba house became in 1983, opened as a representative of Aruba in the Netherlands. With obtaining the status separate on 1 January 1986 this office became the cabinet of the agent minister. The Aruba house looks after the interests of Aruba in the Netherlands and renders support and to Arubanen in the Netherlands. Moreover the Aruba house is responsible for looking after the interests of Aruba at the European Union. The agent minister represents the government at official agencies in the Netherlands or elsewhere in Europe. At the request of the government the Aruba house grants support to ministers, Statenleden and civil servants of departments at their activities in the Netherlands or elsewhere in Europe. Also the Aruba house acts as a point in the Netherlands for the states, the Council of Ministers and departments of Aruba. The Aruba house has an important task in collecting, information and recommending the government concerning facts and developments relevant for Aruba. As a representative of Aruba in the Netherlands the Aruba house supports cultural activities Arubaanse organisations to love as much as possible our cultural heritage in the Netherlands living. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 22, 2008, 11:41:37 AM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool:: Me Too Klaas! ::cartwheel::http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: blah on December 22, 2008, 12:17:29 PM OM receives new tips about Joran http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2862417/Justitie_krijgt_nieuwe_tips_over_Joran.html OM on Aruba received recently new tips about Joran's involvement in the 'disappearance' of Natalee. Mos says due the media attention they are receiving these tips. no word on the nature of these tips to not interfere with the ongoing investigation. decision to prosecute is now postponed to February 2009. --------------------------------------- continue contacting US / Dutch media, members of Dutch parliament, FBI, embassies, and more. http://www.tweedekamer.nl/kamerleden/commissies/NAAZ/ whatever happened to Thialand threatening to arrest him? I guess that was all just a big load of BS too eh? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: blah on December 22, 2008, 12:32:32 PM http://gretawire.foxnews.com/ by Greta Van Susteren See below ….from Radio Netherlands….could they be getting serious about an investigation there??? (finally???) (click here) “…The public prosecutor’s office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot’s possible involvement in Natalee Holloway’s disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April. This is probably all just complete BS. They are just keeping the case open so when the "investitigation of the investigation" starts, they can just say sorry we cant comment or cooperate because the case is still open and there is an ongoing investigation. Its all a load of crap. They do not investigate any tips or anything in Aruba. Hell, they wouldnt even take the evidence Greta offered up. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 22, 2008, 01:58:11 PM http://gretawire.foxnews.com/ by Greta Van Susteren See below ….from Radio Netherlands….could they be getting serious about an investigation there??? (finally???) (click here) “…The public prosecutor’s office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot’s possible involvement in Natalee Holloway’s disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April. This is probably all just complete BS. They are just keeping the case open so when the "investitigation of the investigation" starts, they can just say sorry we cant comment or cooperate because the case is still open and there is an ongoing investigation. Its all a load of crap. They do not investigate any tips or anything in Aruba. Hell, they wouldnt even take the evidence Greta offered up. Red Administrator Scared Monkey Offline Posts: 1962 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - « Reply #686 on: December 19, 2008, 10:49:25 PM » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wreck, I saw that you asked a question a while back and I will give you a more detailed response over the weekend. As much as I can. Please know that there is always things going on behind the scenes that the media does not know about and would only report when is made public. The media does not investiagte ... they do things for ratings. Now more than ever. Please know that there are things going on ... I will try and see what can actually be mentioned. Do not ever think that Beth gives up, she is too strong a woman to ever go that. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 22, 2008, 03:41:44 PM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Resigned at RU pointed out that there is a striking resemblance between Kathy Kinney, of the Drew Cary Show, and Anita van der Sloot. I didn't know how to bring the pictures, but it is a good match. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 22, 2008, 04:22:12 PM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Resigned at RU pointed out that there is a striking resemblance between Kathy Kinney, of the Drew Cary Show, and Anita van der Sloot. I didn't know how to bring the pictures, but it is a good match. ::MonkeyHaHa:: How about "Seattle Slew" for Greta? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: sharon on December 22, 2008, 04:57:49 PM Any ideas for who to play Julia? How about "Seattle Slew" for Greta? Hmmmmm.....thinking Cloris Leachman (no offense, Cloris) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: always 1 on December 22, 2008, 05:01:42 PM Kim Basinger ( on a bad day)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Nut44x4 on December 22, 2008, 05:08:46 PM Throw some bleach on Sandra Bernhardt's locks and ...poof...there ya have Julia's role covered ::MonkeyLaugh::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: kkate on December 22, 2008, 05:44:53 PM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Resigned at RU pointed out that there is a striking resemblance between Kathy Kinney, of the Drew Cary Show, and Anita van der Sloot. I didn't know how to bring the pictures, but it is a good match. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Kathy Kinney Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 22, 2008, 05:47:13 PM I know this has already been posted but still, I like to see it, lol: ::MonkeyCool:: http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/081222-holloway-clues New clues in Natalee Holloway caseRNW News 22-12-2008 The public prosecutor's office on the island of Aruba has received new tip-offs about Joran van der Sloot's possible involvement in Natalee Holloway's disappearance. In the light of the new information, Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos has decided to postpone a decision on whether Mr Van der Sloot will face renewed prosecution for his alleged role in the disappearance of 19-year old US teenager Holloway in 2005. The prosecutor's office is reluctant to divulge details about the new tip-offs. Revealing the content would endanger the investigation, officials say. "Tips are still coming in, and it takes time to follow all leads. I expect we can take a decision about renewed prosecution in February," a spokeswoman told the AD daily on Monday. Holloway telefilm Meanwhile the case of the disappeared woman has aroused interest in the film industry. The Lifetime Movie Network has signed actress Tracy Pollan to play Beth Twitty, the mother of Natalee Holloway, who untiringly tries to keep the affair in the public eye. Production of the telefilm is expected to begin in January, aiming at a premiere in April (http://www.radionetherlands.nl/images/assets/16725239) Actress Tracy Pollan, who is to play Beth Twitty in a 2009 telefilm Resigned at RU pointed out that there is a striking resemblance between Kathy Kinney, of the Drew Cary Show, and Anita van der Sloot. I didn't know how to bring the pictures, but it is a good match. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Kathy Kinney (http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMjA0MDIxMjcxM15BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwMjEwOTQxMQ@@._V1._SX95_SY140_.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 22, 2008, 05:54:57 PM I know who could be very well playing the role of Joran van der Sloot. John Mark Byers! ::cartwheel::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 22, 2008, 06:23:48 PM Another E-mail...
Dear , Thank you for your email concerning the justice system on Aruba and the case of Natalee Holloway. Within the Kingdom of the Netherlands, Aruba is an autonomous country and is responsible for Justice affairs in Aruba. The Netherlands provide assistance whenever requested by the Aruban authorities. The case of Natalee Holloway has for example been reviewed by an joint Dutch – Aruban police team. Unfortunately the case has, so far, not been solved. THE STATE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR AND KINGDOM RELATIONS, on her behalf, The director for Kingdom relations, G.E.A. van Craaikamp Ministry of Interior and Kingdom Relations Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 22, 2008, 06:39:26 PM Throw some bleach on Sandra Bernhardt's locks and ...poof...there ya have Julia's role covered ::MonkeyLaugh:: Oh, Nut, that is soooooo Julia Renfro. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 22, 2008, 07:05:09 PM RIGHT NOW!!!!
CNN HEADLINER JANE VALDEZ-MICHELL - NATALEE HOLLOWAY 4:00 PM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 22, 2008, 07:07:05 PM (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Scared%20Monkeys/ThreadLock4.gif)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 22, 2008, 07:11:20 PM hammering Joran and Aruba! Great to have Wendy Murphy on CNN.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Keepthefaith on December 22, 2008, 07:27:49 PM hammering Joran and Aruba! Great to have Wendy Murphy on CNN. Give me an update Frank!TIA. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 22, 2008, 07:35:26 PM RIGHT NOW!!!! CNN HEADLINER JANE VALDEZ-MICHELL - NATALEE HOLLOWAY 4:00 PM PT ::MonkeyDance:: I just got in so I'm hoping someone will report what was said!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 22, 2008, 08:00:34 PM Here is a little of what Wendy Murphy said:
It's a show about War on Women and they are talking about various cases. Natalee's case was first and they were talking about Joran and the DeVries and how Joran said Natalee died in his arms. Jane Valeze Mitchell said if this case were happening in the United States would that Joran be charged right now. Wendy Murphy said yes and what a nice guy I was shaking the B word OMG. She said you know this was a guy who was so arrogant about it you would think somebody might say even if we're going to lose lets just go forward. Because you don't want to send a message that women's lives are so devalued that an arrogant guy like this should be able to flaunt it and walk around free as if he's been spitting on the sidewalk. She said look there is a confession. I don't care if somebody wants to say well it's not a real confession and then he recanted. It's a confession and if that were the only thing we have I'd still be pushing. But we have what I call a confession plus in this case. Plus multiple inconsistent statements and he was the last one seen with her. If that isn't a strong case I don't know what is. But here is the point we don't value women enough in this country or in any other country. When you talk about an American woman's life her that's bad enough. An American woman's life in a foreign country please!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 22, 2008, 08:04:21 PM Thanks San!!!! ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 22, 2008, 08:05:39 PM Thanks San!!!! ::MonkeyCool:: There were other people talking and Wendy got into with another attorney but I didn't write that part. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 22, 2008, 08:10:58 PM Thanks San!!!! ::MonkeyCool:: There were other people talking and Wendy got into with another attorney but I didn't write that part. You did great, San. How many times does Joran have to confess? It is just stupid! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 22, 2008, 08:19:56 PM Jane Valdez Mitchel is not necessarily my favorite talk show host but ... she was right on when she implied that Joran van der Sloot's involvement with transporting Thai "dancing" girls to the Netherlands for the purpose of prostitution ... was just a extention of his involvement in the Natalee Holloway. Women are nothing to this young man. Women are not worthy of respect.
Maybe ... just maybe ... if Joran ... who was a 17 year old minor in 2005 ... had not been protected by his parents ... not been protected by the "powers that be" in the Dutch/Aruban administrations and ... had been forced to take personal and legal responsibility for his participation in the events on the morning of May 30, 2005 ... a valuable lesson in regards to accountability would have been learned and ... his path in life could have taken a different direction. Also ... the family of Natalee Holloway would have had a measure of closure a long time ago and ... would have been spared this 3 1/2 year nightmare. However ... the only lesson that Joran learned was that the moral and legal boundaries established by a civilized society do not apply to him. Therefore ... future "Natalees" who come in contact with Joran will continue to be at risk. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 22, 2008, 08:26:17 PM Jane Valdez Mitchel is not necessarily my favorite talk show host but ... she was right on when she implied that Joran van der Sloot's involvement with transporting Thai "dancing" girls to the Netherlands for the purpose of prostitution ... was just a extention of his involvement in the Natalee Holloway. Women are nothing to this young man. Women are not worthy of respect. Maybe ... just maybe ... if Joran ... who was a 17 year old minor in 2005 ... had not been protected by his parents ... not been protected by the "powers that be" in the Dutch/Aruban administrations and ... had been forced to take personal and legal responsibility for his participation in the events on the morning of May 30, 2005 ... a valuable lesson in regards to accountability would have been learned and ... his path in life could have taken a different direction. Also ... the family of Natalee Holloway would have had a measure of closure a long time ago and ... would have been spared this 3 1/2 year nightmare. However ... the only lesson that Joran learned was that the moral and legal boundaries established by a civilized society do not apply to him. Therefore ... future "Natalees" who come in contact with Joran will continue to be at risk. Janet Great post Janet! So true! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 22, 2008, 08:28:31 PM Thanks San!!!! ::MonkeyCool:: There were other people talking and Wendy got into with another attorney but I didn't write that part. You did great, San. How many times does Joran have to confess? It is just stupid! It is pathetic what Aruba is doing. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 22, 2008, 08:50:14 PM 12/22/2008 Bondia
http://www.bondia.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2 (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12222008Bondia20a-1.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: caesu on December 22, 2008, 11:08:30 PM Quote Aruba `Sexual intimidation in Aruba House' 22 Dec, 2008, 15:17 (GMT -04:00) Oranjestad - A secretary of the Aruba House in The Hague made submitted charges against the Aruban representation in the Netherlands because of sexual intimidation. The daily Awe Mainta has published this over the weekend on the basis of an anonymous source. The Aruba House has been closed because of the Christmas holidays and up to beginning of January is not available for comment. According to Awe Mainta furthermore it seems the Aruba House more and more has become like a social club house for the MEP where other improper practices take place instead of the actual embassy work that the Aruban staff in the Netherlands is supposed to carry out. These practices have something to do with consuming much alcohol on 'happy hours' in the 'rumshop' Aruba House. http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50798.php seems like the Aruba House has become known as the 'rumshop'. background info about Aruba House (embassy of Aruba in The Hague): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_Plenipotentiary_of_Aruba http://www.arubahuis.nl/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Buckeye on December 23, 2008, 01:35:50 AM I can never find the Murder and Crime Thread..sorry.
Translated from Amigoe Dec 22, 2008: SAN NICOLAS - A 46-year-old American tourist is Friday night in San Nicolas, near a bar in the B. Van Veen Zeppenfeldtstraat, robbed by strangers. This is his wallet, with money and credit cards, taken by the thieves. The tourist was injured during the robbery and was taken to hospital for treatment. The victim was one, also American, a friend in the evening 'Chocolate City' go steps. During the trip at some point split up to individual bars to visit. When the time later a woman came out, she saw her friend on street. He was currently unconscious and bleeding from his mouth. When he once appeared conscious that he was a cut on his lip, but the victim could not remember the incident. He knew the police have to tell that his wallet containing $ 200 in cash and two credit cards, had disappeared. The injured tourists were removed by ambulance for medical monitoring and treatment. http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50797.php Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 02:32:18 AM Will Joran go home for Christmas, (if he's not already there)? If so, how will those outside of the Vandersloot home respond? The post below was after the Peter/Patrick tapes, I wonder how the Aruban people feel after the latest story from Joran. And after the latest from Rudy Croes. The Joran/Paul/Jan conspiracy was printed in at least one Aruban newspaper back in September; but nothing much came of it. Now it's back and I don't think it's going away this time. I hope not anyway.
http://www.aruba-bb.com/viewtopic.php?t=54632 Author Message Eddy Post subject: Arubans feel betrayed by Joran van der SlootPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:06 pm Extra Helpful Expert Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2002 4:47 am Posts: 2597 Emotions Run High, Aruba Is Angry At Van Der Sloot February 7th 2008, Aruba. Arubans still feel attacked by the U.S. media. Many believe the pride of Aruba has been tarnished. ORANJESTAD-Hundreds of locals expressed their anger on radio shows and via e-mail to newspapers after watching the "confession-on-tape" on Monday evening. Arubans reacted massively against Joran van der Sloot, and that for the first time since the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on May 30th, 2005. For the past 2 years the public on the island gave Joran van der Sloot the benefit of the doubt, in that he was involved in the disappearance of Natalee. There was no blood, no body, and no evidence of a murder. Many on the island believed that Natalee was still alive, and was in hiding somewhere. Others believed that she may have accidentally drowned at sea, after she was left alone by Joran on the beach. At least 5,000 government employees were granted two days free, to help with the search for Natalee in 2005. Dutch F-16 planes were sent to scan the entire island for a body recently buried underground. Thousands of volunteers helped search for the missing teen without any result. There was a search every day for months. And the government was spending millions in the investigation. Arubans felt that they were constantly attacked by the U.S. media, and at times by the Holloway family. That did not help with having sympathy for the Holloway family, and it certainly did not help the case. In the contrary Arubans shifted in a defensive mode, and felt that their pride was being attacked by the media. Arubans felt nothing that they did to help find Natalee was appreciated. The Dutch crime reporter, Peter R. de Vries started to investigate the case at the beginning of 2007. De Vries has spent months studying the investigation reports, and interviewing those involved in the case. Patrick van der Eem –a 34 year old Antillean- approached De Vries in The Netherlands in the middle of 2007, he wanted to help out solving the case. De Vries hired Van der Eem as an undercover thug that would make Joran comfortable enough to tell exactly what happened that night. Joran told his story on different occasions while Van der Eem was driving, and it was all captured on hidden camera. Van der Eem is a businessman in Arnhem who loves Aruba, and wanted closure for the parents of Natalee. In addition, he was tired of the bad press Aruba has been getting. With the story of Joran on tape, De Vries added the pieces of the puzzle together and claimed he has solved the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. His program was broadcasted on Monday evening to the Aruban public. "Joran is a psychopath, he has lied to everyone on the island." said an angry water-sports businesswoman, who did not want her name to be made public. "I feel so sorry for Natalee, and her parents who had to go through years of uncertainty as to what happened to their daughter. Our island will suffer for a long time too, we will bare the consequences of the actions of one man. My colleague of Pennsylvania was told by his family, are you going again to that murder island? A person on CNN also advised tourists that they are better off in Bermuda.'' Management Consultant, Mathilde Robles said that she knew Joran van der Sloot by face. "He seems like a nice guy, and I did not want to pre- judge him. But now after watching the program on Monday, I am certain that he is behind the disappearance of Natalee, he himself has admitted it." Robles is shocked on Van der Sloot's comment, that he can not believe that this has happened to him. "If the judge does not punish this man, we the Arubans will," said Robles. Joran van der Sloot said on different occasions that he felt particularly sorry for the Aruban community. The image of Aruba as the safest country in the Caribbean has been tarnished ever since the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. According to the government, the case has cost the island tens of millions of dollars. Tourism from the U.S. fell by 9 percent during 2006. Aruba is 70 percent dependent on the U.S. generating market. There are barely arrivals from Alabama, the state of Natalee Holloway. The Governor of Alabama has imposed a travel boycott to Aruba. Public anger is also directed to the father of Joran, Paul van der Sloot, mainly because Paul has smuggled a cellular phone to his son in prison. Many on the island now believe that the family Van der Sloot is out for the money. Paul van der Sloot said earlier that he would sew the country of Aruba, because he was held as suspect in the disappearance of Natalee. On tape, Joran said he will also sew, and wants to cash in big time for a house in Spain. Emotions ran so high, there were a few people who expressed that the Van der Sloot family should be deported from Aruba. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 02:42:47 AM I doubt Joran will go back to Aruba now or ever.....I want to believe that the whole Sloot gang will pack up soon.... that is if Paulus isn't arrested...Wow wouldn't that be Great.....maybe they'll even figure out Anita's part in Natalee's disappearance and She can join Paulus in ajoining cells....lol....Well heck if You're going to wish You might as well wish big.... ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 02:44:45 AM Good Night TM and Guests! ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 02:46:34 AM Good Night TM and Guests! ::MonkeyCool:: I'm wishing big too, Hotping! ::MonkeyDance:: Goodnight! ::MonkeyCool:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 23, 2008, 08:35:02 AM I can never find the Murder and Crime Thread..sorry. Translated from Amigoe Dec 22, 2008: SAN NICOLAS - A 46-year-old American tourist is Friday night in San Nicolas, near a bar in the B. Van Veen Zeppenfeldtstraat, robbed by strangers. This is his wallet, with money and credit cards, taken by the thieves. The tourist was injured during the robbery and was taken to hospital for treatment. The victim was one, also American, a friend in the evening 'Chocolate City' go steps. During the trip at some point split up to individual bars to visit. When the time later a woman came out, she saw her friend on street. He was currently unconscious and bleeding from his mouth. When he once appeared conscious that he was a cut on his lip, but the victim could not remember the incident. He knew the police have to tell that his wallet containing $ 200 in cash and two credit cards, had disappeared. The injured tourists were removed by ambulance for medical monitoring and treatment. http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50797.php Good Morning, All! Buckshot, the Murder and Crime Thread Link is always in both mine and Ms Marple's signatures. Doesn't help much unless we have made a post when you need it but that's one place to find it. Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c I wish I had time to work on it more but hard to this time of year. Much appreciation for all who do. Anna Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 10:33:32 AM My translation: Police Divers recover items from robbery in Rooi Dam. The box was reported to contain 300 (more or less) poisonous pills of some kind so that's why it was so important to recover the box?
http://www.24ora.com/content/view/6870/5/ duikteam cu police owing to duik in dam of rooi afo tuesday, 23 december 2008 - 09:55 monday morning much person cu owing to happen near of dam of rooi afo owing to see algo inusual. was deal here of various acolyte of police y they duikteam. is so cu some month happen one box strong owing to wordo steal at santa rose. during the investigacion the ultimo simanan here owing to come haja one tip cu the box strong will is throw in the dam. in the box strong was have more or less 300 pill of one substancia much poisonous y for this was much important for haja the box strong bek. the duikteam was exitoso y they owing to succeed haja the box strong. apart from this they owing to come encontra cu various another articulonan more cu probably is procedente of ladronicia. will is interesting kizas for bay throw one view in the another damnan rond of aruba. click read more for more imagen. come across (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/1223200824ora01.jpg) (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/1223200824ora02.jpg) (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/MiscNews3/1223200824ora07.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 10:57:29 AM Will Joran go home for Christmas, (if he's not already there)? If so, how will those outside of the Vandersloot home respond? The post below was after the Peter/Patrick tapes, I wonder how the Aruban people feel after the latest story from Joran. And after the latest from Rudy Croes. The Joran/Paul/Jan conspiracy was printed in at least one Aruban newspaper back in September; but nothing much came of it. Now it's back and I don't think it's going away this time. I hope not anyway. http://www.aruba-bb.com/viewtopic.php?t=54632 Author Message Eddy Post subject: Arubans feel betrayed by Joran van der SlootPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:06 pm Extra Helpful Expert Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2002 4:47 am Posts: 2597 Emotions Run High, Aruba Is Angry At Van Der Sloot February 7th 2008, Aruba. Arubans still feel attacked by the U.S. media. Many believe the pride of Aruba has been tarnished. ORANJESTAD-Hundreds of locals expressed their anger on radio shows and via e-mail to newspapers after watching the "confession-on-tape" on Monday evening. Arubans reacted massively against Joran van der Sloot, and that for the first time since the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on May 30th, 2005. For the past 2 years the public on the island gave Joran van der Sloot the benefit of the doubt, in that he was involved in the disappearance of Natalee. There was no blood, no body, and no evidence of a murder. Many on the island believed that Natalee was still alive, and was in hiding somewhere. Others believed that she may have accidentally drowned at sea, after she was left alone by Joran on the beach. At least 5,000 government employees were granted two days free, to help with the search for Natalee in 2005. Dutch F-16 planes were sent to scan the entire island for a body recently buried underground. Thousands of volunteers helped search for the missing teen without any result. There was a search every day for months. And the government was spending millions in the investigation. Arubans felt that they were constantly attacked by the U.S. media, and at times by the Holloway family. That did not help with having sympathy for the Holloway family, and it certainly did not help the case. In the contrary Arubans shifted in a defensive mode, and felt that their pride was being attacked by the media. Arubans felt nothing that they did to help find Natalee was appreciated. The Dutch crime reporter, Peter R. de Vries started to investigate the case at the beginning of 2007. De Vries has spent months studying the investigation reports, and interviewing those involved in the case. Patrick van der Eem –a 34 year old Antillean- approached De Vries in The Netherlands in the middle of 2007, he wanted to help out solving the case. De Vries hired Van der Eem as an undercover thug that would make Joran comfortable enough to tell exactly what happened that night. Joran told his story on different occasions while Van der Eem was driving, and it was all captured on hidden camera. Van der Eem is a businessman in Arnhem who loves Aruba, and wanted closure for the parents of Natalee. In addition, he was tired of the bad press Aruba has been getting. With the story of Joran on tape, De Vries added the pieces of the puzzle together and claimed he has solved the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. His program was broadcasted on Monday evening to the Aruban public. "Joran is a psychopath, he has lied to everyone on the island." said an angry water-sports businesswoman, who did not want her name to be made public. "I feel so sorry for Natalee, and her parents who had to go through years of uncertainty as to what happened to their daughter. Our island will suffer for a long time too, we will bare the consequences of the actions of one man. My colleague of Pennsylvania was told by his family, are you going again to that murder island? A person on CNN also advised tourists that they are better off in Bermuda.'' Management Consultant, Mathilde Robles said that she knew Joran van der Sloot by face. "He seems like a nice guy, and I did not want to pre- judge him. But now after watching the program on Monday, I am certain that he is behind the disappearance of Natalee, he himself has admitted it." Robles is shocked on Van der Sloot's comment, that he can not believe that this has happened to him. "If the judge does not punish this man, we the Arubans will," said Robles. Joran van der Sloot said on different occasions that he felt particularly sorry for the Aruban community. The image of Aruba as the safest country in the Caribbean has been tarnished ever since the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. According to the government, the case has cost the island tens of millions of dollars. Tourism from the U.S. fell by 9 percent during 2006. Aruba is 70 percent dependent on the U.S. generating market. There are barely arrivals from Alabama, the state of Natalee Holloway. The Governor of Alabama has imposed a travel boycott to Aruba. Public anger is also directed to the father of Joran, Paul van der Sloot, mainly because Paul has smuggled a cellular phone to his son in prison. Many on the island now believe that the family Van der Sloot is out for the money. Paul van der Sloot said earlier that he would sew the country of Aruba, because he was held as suspect in the disappearance of Natalee. On tape, Joran said he will also sew, and wants to cash in big time for a house in Spain. Emotions ran so high, there were a few people who expressed that the Van der Sloot family should be deported from Aruba. Thank you texasmom Arubans knew the truth from the getgo but ... justice for an 18 year old American citizen was not a concern. Arubans just wanted the Natalee Holloway story to go away ... just wanted Beth Holloway to go away ... so the Tourist Industry could again thrive. Beth and Jug see through the facade. They have both publicly stated that they do not have any advocates on that Island except Jossy Mansur. The people of Aruba have no problem demonstrating in mass when it comes to wages or ... drug, choller and environmental issues. Also ... they are able to organize demonstration against an anquished mother who dared to call two suspects criminals ... two suspects who obstructed the investigation into her missing daughter with their lies. However ... in 3 1/2 years there has not even been one "tiny" demonstration by the "good people" of Aruba on behalf of justice for Natalee Holloway. Janet +++++++++++++ Jossy Mansur Dana Pletzer Show October 5, 2007 Mansur: People thought Beth caused bad publicity for the island, but Beth is not at fault, it is the three suspects.If there's damage to the island it should be on the shoulders of the three suspects. http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/2007/10/05/the-dana-pretzer-show-live-friday-october-5-2007-guests-include-jossy-mansur-and-ken-shepherd/ Beth Holloway Twitty CNN LIVE TODAY July 5, 2005 BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY’S MOTHER: It is now that I ask the world to help me. Two suspects were released yesterday who were involved in a violent crime against my daughter. These criminals are not only allowed to walk freely among the tourists and citizens of Aruba, but there are no limits where they may choose to travel. I am asking all mothers and fathers and all nations to hear my plea. I implore you, do not allow these two suspects, the Kalpoe brothers, to enter your country until this case is solved. Do not allow these criminals to walk among your citizens. Help me by not allowing these two to get away with this crime. It is my greatest fear today that the Kalpoe brothers will leave Aruba. I am asking the Aruban officials to notify the United States State Department in the event these suspects try to leave this island. I am asking all nations not to offer them a safe haven. I am asking this in the name of my beautiful, intelligent and outstanding daughter who I haven’t seen for 36 days and for whom I will continue to search until I find her. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/05/lt.03.html Beth Holloway LOVING NATALEE Page 157/158 No one is breathing. Or Moving. Reporters and camera people are crying. The media hve been here more than a month, and they’ve seen firsthand what we’ve experienced. They are moved by this plea. But some of the Arubans are not. Calling their local sons “criminals” offends them. Having just heard the prosecuting attorney tell us at least one of the Kalpoes could be involved in whatever happened to my daughter. I felt the term seemed appropriate. But it led to an abrupt change in the tide of support. … Not long after the “criminals speech,” some Arubans back off their prayer vigils for Natalee. A few protest in the streets against the barage of negative media. We’ve worn out our welcome at the Holiday Inn. And they let us know they’ve had it. The Aruban Tourism Authority (ATA), the Aruba Hotel and Tourism Association (AHATA), the Aruba Trade and Industry Association and a scattering of island officials establish the Strategic Communications Task Force to combat the negative media. And to combat us. Some Arubans angry at Holloway’s mom Calling brothers ‘criminals’ elicits resentment, statement from lawyer updated 6:56 p.m. PT, Wed., July. 6, 2005 ORANJESTAD, Aruba - A latent but growing resentment here became evident for the first time when more than 200 people, some wrapped in Aruban flags, said they were incensed by statements made by the mother of missing American teen Natalee Holloway. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8484217 John Merryweather ‘Scarborough Country’ July 6, 2005 JOHN MERRYWEATHER, FORMER ARUBA DIPLOMAT: I was not part of the organization, but I went there in support of our justice system. <snipped? SCARBOROUGH: No, what did Natalee’s mother say that offended so many people in Aruba? MERRYWEATHER: Well, you know, it—it—it offended me, also. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8498049/ Beth Holloway Twitty CNN - LAW CENTER July 8, 2005 ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) — The mother of Natalee Holloway apologized Friday for saying two released suspects were involved in her daughter’s disappearance. “The statements I made on July 5th were fueled by despair and frustration because of still not knowing where my daughter is,” Beth Holloway Twitty said in a statement to the media. “I think everyone, everyone can sympathize with that.” http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/07/08/missing.aruba/index.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 10:59:46 AM GOOD MORNING MONKEYS!!!
Just two more sleeps ... ::cartwheel:: Janet 8:00 AM PT Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 12:53:51 PM From ABC....Natalee's story is the most widely read Crime
& Justice Story of 2008 http://www.abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=6511338&page=1 Aruba....it's not going away! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: msmarple on December 23, 2008, 01:43:51 PM I can never find the Murder and Crime Thread..sorry. Translated from Amigoe Dec 22, 2008: SAN NICOLAS - A 46-year-old American tourist is Friday night in San Nicolas, near a bar in the B. Van Veen Zeppenfeldtstraat, robbed by strangers. This is his wallet, with money and credit cards, taken by the thieves. The tourist was injured during the robbery and was taken to hospital for treatment. The victim was one, also American, a friend in the evening 'Chocolate City' go steps. During the trip at some point split up to individual bars to visit. When the time later a woman came out, she saw her friend on street. He was currently unconscious and bleeding from his mouth. When he once appeared conscious that he was a cut on his lip, but the victim could not remember the incident. He knew the police have to tell that his wallet containing $ 200 in cash and two credit cards, had disappeared. The injured tourists were removed by ambulance for medical monitoring and treatment. http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_50797.php Thank you Buckeye. I posted this in the M&C thread. It's in "Important Case Documents" - after the Statements section of that Index. The Murder & Crime thread now has 94,373 views. I don't have much time these days, but I do try to skim through all of the Natalee posts. Sorry I haven't been able to contribute more lately. Thanks to all of you who watch for crimes, especially the violent ones, AND/OR those involving tourists, on Aruba. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: msmarple on December 23, 2008, 02:01:29 PM ... and I seem to have forgotten how to change clothes. (Since Thanksgiving.) I'm getting a message that says my photo is "too big, or not an avatar" (?? - I have used it previously).
Maybe a mod can grab my Christmas poinsettia from last year? Or, we can just jump ahead to last year's New Year's version, with the poinsettia and champagne. I hope all of our monkeys have a blessed Christmas. Stay safe and warm! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 23, 2008, 02:26:06 PM ... and I seem to have forgotten how to change clothes. (Since Thanksgiving.) I'm getting a message that says my photo is "too big, or not an avatar" (?? - I have used it previously). Maybe a mod can grab my Christmas poinsettia from last year? Or, we can just jump ahead to last year's New Year's version, with the poinsettia and champagne. I hope all of our monkeys have a blessed Christmas. Stay safe and warm! Klaas has the ability to put avatars in place as an admin. I'm sure she'll fix you up when she sees this. Happy Holidays, msmarple. Seems we're all busy with something these days. Blessings to you & yours. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on December 23, 2008, 02:34:11 PM (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Scared%20Monkeys/ThreadLock4.gif)
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 03:20:08 PM ... and I seem to have forgotten how to change clothes. (Since Thanksgiving.) I'm getting a message that says my photo is "too big, or not an avatar" (?? - I have used it previously). Maybe a mod can grab my Christmas poinsettia from last year? Or, we can just jump ahead to last year's New Year's version, with the poinsettia and champagne. I hope all of our monkeys have a blessed Christmas. Stay safe and warm! Merry Christmas to you too! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: msmarple on December 23, 2008, 03:34:17 PM Hi klaas! Thanks for fixing my avatar ... I was almost too late! (And too brain dead to figure out which link to use.)
Hope you are doing well. When I last was paying close attention, you were just out of the hospital and fininishing up a major home overhaul. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: bastibro on December 23, 2008, 04:10:30 PM Joran photographed after December 15 in Vang Vieng, Laos. (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/Laos/Joranneke_0004-2-1-1.jpg) According to the 24-year-old Dutch backpacker Martijn, who made the pictures, he was accompanied by 2 friends. (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/Laos/Joranneke_0002-1-1-1-1-1.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 04:25:12 PM Joran is so sick........Run Joran Run....but You can't hide.....The Monkeys can always find You..... ::MonkeyCool::
Here is alitte bit about Vang Vieng Laos Vang Vieng (population about 25,000) is located in central southern Laos about a 4 hour bus ride north of the capital city of Vientiane or about 7 hours south of the town of Luang Prabang. If you enter Vang Vieng by bus you will be dropped off on a huge gravel runway on the edge of town. A brisk several minute walk across the runway will find you in the main part of town. Signs for guesthouses or restaurants call out from almost every single building. You know you are in Vang Vieng when you see the dull rusted corrugated metal roofs of the buildings in stark contrast to the brightly colored 3 wheel Tuk-tuks lined up along the streets. This is a truly a backpackers city - businesses that cater to backpackers are everywhere. Internet cafes, guesthouses, bars, massage parlors & trekking companies all greet your arrival with welcoming arms. These are all fairly new establishments as backpackers haven't always stayed in Vang Vieng. It is only within the past 5 or 6 years that Vang Vieng has seen such an influx of tourists. There are people here from all over the world - you can't help but meet people! http://www.davestravelcorner.com/articles/vangvieng/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 04:58:09 PM Hi klaas! Thanks for fixing my avatar ... I was almost too late! (And too brain dead to figure out which link to use.) Hope you are doing well. When I last was paying close attention, you were just out of the hospital and fininishing up a major home overhaul. All behind me now thank goodness. Just busy with the holidays and this crazy forum ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 23, 2008, 05:00:58 PM Nice pix of Joran:
"I'll do anything to protect my son" Paulus van der sloot Yes, that's why he's not with you, premeditated Paulus. Paulus is the murderer and the one holding Natalee hostage, figuratively speaking. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Frank on December 23, 2008, 05:04:13 PM Jan didn't do it for the money, Karin didn't do it for the money. They did it for the Dutch, their Dutch friend, which only makes it more sick.
Loyalty to the Dutch. AMSTERDAM, 24/12/08 - Labour (PvdA) appears to want to take a different direction regarding the integration of immigrants. In a new memorandum on the subject, the party urges confronting intolerance. "The mistake that we should never again make is swallowing criticism of cultures or religions because of tolerance." The memorandum was drawn up by PvdA chairwoman Lilianne Ploumen, indicating it is a document from the entire party leadership including PvdA leader Wouter Bos. The memorandum, entitled "Divided past, shared future,' will be presented to the PvdA members at a congress next March and then, if adopted, become the new PvdA policy. According to the party chairwoman, the government should no longer try to encourage integration by information campaigns. The government should only provide the conditions in which integration can take place by itself. On the one hand, the law must be maintained and on the other, opportunities must be offered to everyone via education, youth guidance and activating labour market policy. Toleration has not done integration of migrants in the Netherlands any good, the memorandum concludes. The PvdA considers that in future, newcomers must opt for the Dutch society. "We all speak Dutch, know the basic forms of behaviour and the democratic constitutional state." Nonetheless, the PvdA wants to continue to tolerate headscarves in classrooms and mosques with an Arabic architecture. It will become somewhat stricter on wearing of burqas or refusing to shake hands with someone of the opposite sex; immigrants that do that should be told that it is abnormal in the Netherlands. Finally, there is a third category, setting explicit boundaries, under which the PvdA is thinking of female circumcision and violence to save damaged family honour. Ploumen terms this three-prong policy norm-setting, confrontation or tolerance. In the past years, tolerance has been over-emphasised, including tolerance of behaviour that was actually not acceptable, the chairman says. In the memorandum, she also calls on Muslims not to take on a victim's role any more. Ploumen gave an interview yesterday in De Volkskrant, traditionally a PvdA-minded medium. According to the paper, the PvdA sets out "a friendly but strong vision." "An iron fist in a velvet glove, beyond tolerance and cultural relativism." "The mistake we must never again make," says Ploumen in the interview, "is choking back criticism of cultures or religions for the sake of tolerance." For a long time, it was thought that "it would all eventually turn out well by itself." In practice, that meant looking away from problems. "Feelings of loss and worry were suppressed. And (..) these feelings were not recognised by government and politicians." The theme has been dividing the PvdA, Ploumen acknowledges. "Earlier reports identified the problems, but offered no solutions. There was no party view to guide local politicians. This there now is. (...) I assume that this resolution will get through at the congress in March." To De Volkskrant's question about whether the problems caused by children of Turkish or Moroccan parents are not actually already empathised too much, Ploumen answered: "No. It is sometimes painful, but it is necessary. We do have to make progress now. After the confrontation, the ultimate goal is acceptance. That everyone can respect one another." Among migrants, 80 percent have dual nationality. Ploumen says the "grip of countries of origin" on immigrants "must disappear." She considers that "to become Dutch, you must in principle give up your old nationality." But at the same time "loyalty (to the Netherlands) for me has nothing to do with nationality." Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 05:42:00 PM Joran photographed after December 15 in Vang Vieng, Laos. (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/Laos/Joranneke_0004-2-1-1.jpg) According to the 24-year-old Dutch backpacker Martijn, who made the pictures, he was accompanied by 2 friends. (http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj176/bastibro/Laos/Joranneke_0002-1-1-1-1-1.jpg) Anita and Paulus Was the outcome of protecting Joran from taking personal and legal responsibility for his participation in the happenings of May 30, 2005 worth it? Sincerely, Janet ++++++ IT IS CALLED "DENIAL"!! ANITA VAN DER SLOOT On the Record w/ Greta Transcript: Van der Sloots Speak Thursday, June 23, 2005 VAN SUSTEREN: Any drug use or alcohol use by him? ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: A hundred percent no. No. He is, like, Mom, I would not smoke or I would not use drugs because I am a sporter. I want to make something out of my future. If there would have been anything of that, I would have noticed. I'm a teacher. I work with kids between 12 and 18 years, the last 25 years. So you're used to so many things, problems that appear with your students. You're so alert. And I think you're even more alert with your own children. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html On the Record w/ Greta Transcript: Van der Sloots Speak Thursday, June 23, 2005 ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: … He said, The truth will come forward, and I know that I didn't do anything to the girl. And the truth will come forward. And he was so strong. And I believe in him. I believe so in him. ... I believe in him 200 percent. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT 'Scarborough Country' for August 1 updated 8:48 a.m. PT, Tues., Aug. 2, 2005 DAVE HOLLOWAY: Well, he knows what‘s going on. There‘s no doubt in my mind. You know, if my child would have done something like this, you know, as a parent, you would know about it and you would go to the authorities and that type thing. But you‘re dealing with a judge and you‘re dealing with somebody that has coached his son on a daily basis. You know, they go through the interrogation process. The next day, the father visits with the son and he coaches him. You know, this kid is an athlete, and he‘s used to coaching. And his dad—he depends very heavily on his dad‘s advice and coaching. And to go through the interrogation process and then turn around and have daily visits, you know, no wonder we‘ve not ever been able to get anywhere. ... He made a lot of statements to me that day. And one of the statements that I really remember, and it sinks in, is, he can understand my position as a father, but, as the father of Joran, he‘ll do anything to protect his son. And I believe that he will, unless he has a change of heart. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8798488/ NANCY GRACE Nancy Grace for August 1, 2005, CNNHN Aired August 1, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET DAVE HOLLOWAY: ... You know, you`ve got to stop and think. I went out to the prison and spoke directly with Paul Van Der Sloot, and you know, I don`t know whether I believe everything he said, but I did believe one thing, and that was that he would do everything he could to protect his son. And you know, these daily visits that he has, you know as well as I do, he`s going to be in there coaching and pumping his son, you know, just to, Keep on, keep on, and you`ll eventually get out. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/01/ng.01.html Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 06:44:12 PM A REMINDER!!!
The contents of the cage/trap which the Persistence discovered and ... John Silvetti turned over to the enemy in exchange for his self-serving interest must remain a focus. Kyle Kingsman can attest to this but ... will he do the right thing and reveal to John Kelly ... Natalee's family and ... the FBI what he shared on a private forum. Kyle's participation in the process has the ability to bring pressure on the ALE to what/who was in that cage/trap. Natalee Holloway's family deserves to know the truth one way or the other. Janet ______ KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th Kyle: None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat. Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again. Kyle: Schafer is sue crazy. Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best. Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap. Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal. Kyle: Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money. Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric. Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. Kyle: I couldn't get the logs from the Persistence. All things "Holloway" were stripped from the boat once it got back to Louisiana Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs). Klye: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap. Kyle: neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge. Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising. Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF. kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM oceanexploration: "Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it-To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help. They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust. Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time. We've helped each other however and whenever we can. They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right. I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning. Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal." oceanexploration: "We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care. Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing. Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE." BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. ... The effort was superb, but the game was fixed." THE ROV IMAGES Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM » http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 - « Reply #410 on: November 24, 2008, 04:01:55 PM » Photos given to the FBI sent to Dave and Robin posted on the internet are NOT the photos posted above. These were not given to the FBI until recently. http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555621#msg555621 ++++++++++ Kyle Kingman Senior Geophysical Project Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Greater New York City Area Current Senior Geophysical Operations Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc. Past Manager at Kingman Geophysical Solutions Education Rutgers, The State University of New Jersey-New Brunswick Industry Oil & Energy http://www.linkedin.com/pub/b/65/464 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 06:51:49 PM Great Post Janet! ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 06:56:56 PM Thank You Bastibro for the pics of Urine aka Joran! ::MonkeyCool::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 07:07:28 PM Great Post Janet! ::MonkeyWink:: Thank you hotping. I do not believe for one minute that justice for Natalee Holloway is going to come out of an Aruban or Dutch court. The implications in regards to accountability for the happenings of the morning of May 30, 2005 and ... the persuing coverup ... is so far reaching. However ... if it is revealed ... as the oceanographer (Kyle) on board the Persistence suspects ... that Natalee's remains were in that trap/cage ... the family will be allowed a measure of closure. If the family is afforded the opportunity to bring Natalee home to rest on American soil ... I will consider my time and effort researching this case for the past 3 1/2 years worthwhile. Either way ... I will bow and let go of my grasp on this case and ... leave accountability to the discretion of the Judge of all judges. Hotping ... Merry Christmas to you and yours. Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 07:18:07 PM Great Post Janet! ::MonkeyWink:: Thank you hotping. I do not believe for one minute that justice for Natalee Holloway is going to come out of an Aruban or Dutch court. The implications in regards to accountability for the happenings of the morning of May 30, 2005 and ... the persuing coverup ... is so far reaching. However ... if it is revealed ... as the oceanographer (Kyle) on board the Persistence suspects ... that Natalee's remains were in that trap/cage ... the family will be allowed a measure of closure. If the family is afforded the opportunity to bring Natalee home to rest on American soil ... I will consider my time and effort researching this case for the past 3 1/2 years worthwhile. Either way ... I will bow and let go of my grasp on this case and ... leave accountability to the discretion of the Judge of all judges. Hotping ... Merry Christmas to you and yours. Janet Janet, I am very thankful for all of your posts. I like the reminders Merry Christmas to you and all of your family and to all Monkeys. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 07:23:37 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 07:33:57 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: This Christmas will be a very special Christmas!!! hotping ... you and your family have been truly blessed. Janet http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4282.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 07:41:37 PM Great Post Janet! ::MonkeyWink:: Thank you hotping. I do not believe for one minute that justice for Natalee Holloway is going to come out of an Aruban or Dutch court. The implications in regards to accountability for the happenings of the morning of May 30, 2005 and ... the persuing coverup ... is so far reaching. However ... if it is revealed ... as the oceanographer (Kyle) on board the Persistence suspects ... that Natalee's remains were in that trap/cage ... the family will be allowed a measure of closure. If the family is afforded the opportunity to bring Natalee home to rest on American soil ... I will consider my time and effort researching this case for the past 3 1/2 years worthwhile. Either way ... I will bow and let go of my grasp on this case and ... leave accountability to the discretion of the Judge of all judges. Hotping ... Merry Christmas to you and yours. Janet Janet, I am very thankful for all of your posts. I like the reminders Merry Christmas to you and all of your family and to all Monkeys. Thank you Magnolia. I realize that every Monkey who is involved in the Natalee Holloway discussion has one objective ... Justice for an eighteen year old American Citizen and ... a measure of closure for her long-suffering family. I wish I understood God's timing. The waiting is sooo difficult. Nevertheless ... I do believe in The Devine Author of the Natalee Holloway story and ... I have faith that the last chapter will be revealed in His perfect timing. MERRY CHRISTMAS Janet ++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4282.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 07:59:20 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: This Christmas will be a very special Christmas!!! hotping ... you and your family have been truly blessed. Janet http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4282.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 08:01:08 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather recognized the coverup and came to the realization very early on that justice for his precious stepdaughter was not going to come out an Aruban or a Dutch Court. He had one request of the "powers that be" in Aruba ...
Janet ______ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: SS on December 23, 2008, 08:03:52 PM My best wishes to everyone for a very Merry Christmas.
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 08:07:53 PM My best wishes to everyone for a very Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas SS! Here's Wishing You a Very Blessed Christmas and A Happy New Year! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 08:11:39 PM I believe that Natalee Holloway's loving stepfather recognized the coverup and came to the realization very early on that justice for his precious stepdaughter was not going to come out an Aruban or a Dutch Court. He had one request of the "powers that be" in Aruba ... If We could Just get Natalee Home the Good Lord will take care of the Justice...God Bless Natalee's Family During this Holiday Season and Always!Janet ______ 'Scarborough Country' for July 14 updated 8:45 a.m. PT, Fri., July. 15, 2005 JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER: Beth and I have been through this emotional roller coaster. And all we want is Natalee, whether she's alive or dead. We want to bring her back to the United States, and we'll leave and they can do whatever they want to do. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8551824/ Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 08:15:15 PM My best wishes to everyone for a very Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas SS. Janet ++++++ http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4282.0 Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Tamikosmom on December 23, 2008, 08:18:31 PM GOOD NIGHT MONKEYS!! GOOD NIGHT ZOOKEEPERS!!
Janet Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 08:31:19 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: Congratulation, hotping. Babies are always such good news. Your gorgeous boy just wanted to be here in time for Christmas. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 08:48:19 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: Congratulation, hotping. Babies are always such good news. Your gorgeous boy just wanted to be here in time for Christmas. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Nut44x4 on December 23, 2008, 08:50:09 PM (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Scared%20Monkeys/ThreadLock4.gif) BUMP Probably won't happen till morning and I will be in early. Night all. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 23, 2008, 08:51:46 PM Merry Christmas Magnolia! I'm almost up to My elbows in Cornbread...lol...I have Dressing to make and pies to bake......I'll probably be back later to see what's happening! ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 08:59:25 PM Merry Christmas Magnolia! I'm almost up to My elbows in Cornbread...lol...I have Dressing to make and pies to bake......I'll probably be back later to see what's happening! ::MonkeyWink:: I love to make dressing.....it is always an adventure. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:05:20 PM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: Congrats, hotping!!! What a wonderful Christmas gift for your family! Just this time last year our family was celebrating the birth and coming home for our twin grandsons. I know how happy you must be!!!!!!! ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:06:39 PM Merry Christmas Magnolia! I'm almost up to My elbows in Cornbread...lol...I have Dressing to make and pies to bake......I'll probably be back later to see what's happening! ::MonkeyWink:: I love to make dressing.....it is always an adventure. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Same here! But, ya cain't have turkey without cornbread dressin'! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:08:29 PM I do have one Natalee-related question.
Does anyone know if Jaime's father is a docter? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: wreck on December 23, 2008, 09:09:34 PM Merry Christmas to all! I'm heading to Oklahoma, but will be checking in!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:11:48 PM Merry Christmas to all! I'm heading to Oklahoma, but will be checking in! Have a safe trip, wreck. Stay safe! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:28:12 PM Does anyone know where Jaime live(d)(s)?
Caceres Martinez Edgar V (doctor) Caya Frere Johannes 17 Caceres Mosquera Nubia Tanki Leendert 158 B Carrasquilla Acuna Omar Montanja 232 Carrasquilla Maria Del Pilar (sister?) Sabana Liber 75 A Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 23, 2008, 09:28:38 PM I know it is a little early to wish everyone a Merry Christmas but I also know people will be traveling tomorrow and I might not have a chance to say it to them. I want to wish all Monkeys and their families a Merry Christmas. (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/MerryChristmasMonkeys3.jpg) Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 09:46:51 PM Merry Christmas to all! I'm heading to Oklahoma, but will be checking in! Travel safely, Wreck, and have fun when you get there. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 09:49:35 PM Does anyone know where Jaime live(d)(s)? Caceres Martinez Edgar V (doctor) Caya Frere Johannes 17 Caceres Mosquera Nubia Tanki Leendert 158 B Carrasquilla Acuna Omar Montanja 232 Carrasquilla Maria Del Pilar (sister?) Sabana Liber 75 A According to Jaime's statement in the case Sabana Liber is the correct address. I removed the address before posting the statement. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 09:50:49 PM Does anyone know where Jaime live(d)(s)? Caceres Martinez Edgar V (doctor) Caya Frere Johannes 17 Caceres Mosquera Nubia Tanki Leendert 158 B Carrasquilla Acuna Omar Montanja 232 Carrasquilla Maria Del Pilar (sister?) Sabana Liber 75 A According to Jaime's statement in the case Sabana Liber is the correct address. I removed the address before posting the statement. Thanks. Klaas. I wonder of the one in Mantanja is a relative fo Jaime's? Has that ever been discussed before? Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Magnolia on December 23, 2008, 09:52:18 PM I know it is a little early to wish everyone a Merry Christmas but I also know people will be traveling tomorrow and I might not have a chance to say it to them. I want to wish all Monkeys and their families a Merry Christmas. (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/MerryChristmasMonkeys3.jpg) Merry Christmas, San. I have never seen the word "Monkeys" on a Nativity scene before. ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 09:55:05 PM Does anyone know where Jaime live(d)(s)? Caceres Martinez Edgar V (doctor) Caya Frere Johannes 17 Caceres Mosquera Nubia Tanki Leendert 158 B Carrasquilla Acuna Omar Montanja 232 Carrasquilla Maria Del Pilar (sister?) Sabana Liber 75 A According to Jaime's statement in the case Sabana Liber is the correct address. I removed the address before posting the statement. Thanks. Klaas. I wonder of the one in Mantanja is a relative fo Jaime's? Has that ever been discussed before? Not that I know of but anything is possible. If I remember correctly, Jaime's dad was still in Columbia I think. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 23, 2008, 09:55:27 PM I know it is a little early to wish everyone a Merry Christmas but I also know people will be traveling tomorrow and I might not have a chance to say it to them. I want to wish all Monkeys and their families a Merry Christmas. (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/MerryChristmasMonkeys3.jpg) Merry Christmas, San. I have never seen the word "Monkeys" on a Nativity scene before. ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: Well there is a first for everything. ::MonkeyHaHa:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 10:04:12 PM Does anyone know where Jaime live(d)(s)? Caceres Martinez Edgar V (doctor) Caya Frere Johannes 17 Caceres Mosquera Nubia Tanki Leendert 158 B Carrasquilla Acuna Omar Montanja 232 Carrasquilla Maria Del Pilar (sister?) Sabana Liber 75 A According to Jaime's statement in the case Sabana Liber is the correct address. I removed the address before posting the statement. Thanks. Klaas. I wonder of the one in Mantanja is a relative fo Jaime's? Has that ever been discussed before? Not that I know of but anything is possible. If I remember correctly, Jaime's dad was still in Columbia I think. He said in his statement that on 5/30 he picked his father up from work at the Wyndham. Which is about the time that Joran said Guido arrived at the Wyndham and they took a "circular walk" and then went to the Aruba Grand. Jaime: "At approximately 23.00, I had to pick up my father where he works. My dad works at the Wyndham Hotel. After I picked up my father from work we drove home." Joran: "At approximately 22.30, Guido arrived at the Wyndham Casino. Guido and myself went for a circular walk. After that Guido and myself walked to his car. His car was in the parking lot of the Wyndham Hotel. After that we drove to the Aruba Grant so that I could cash in my chips at the cashier. " I think Jaime may have more to do with this than we have been able to pin on him. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 10:14:16 PM Wonder why I thought his father was still in Columbia. One of them, either Freddy or Jaime had a bad homelife (mother or father) and Joran said he felt sorry for him. I don't remember which one it was now. Maybe Jaime and his mom?
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 23, 2008, 10:21:12 PM Jaime and Freddy - Joran's best friends for life
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: San on December 23, 2008, 10:22:56 PM Wonder why I thought his father was still in Columbia. One of them, either Freddy or Jaime had a bad homelife (mother or father) and Joran said he felt sorry for him. I don't remember which one it was now. Maybe Jaime and his mom? Jaime. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: truthseeker2 on December 23, 2008, 10:24:56 PM Wonder why I thought his father was still in Columbia. One of them, either Freddy or Jaime had a bad homelife (mother or father) and Joran said he felt sorry for him. I don't remember which one it was now. Maybe Jaime and his mom? I don't know which one that was. I see on Google Earth that Jaime lives about a mile from Joran and less than two miles from the Holiday Inn. By reading Jaime's statement he seems to indicate he did not know about Natalee's disappearance until 5/31. I think it's interesting that on 5/30/05 between 10:30 and 11:00 pm you could have found these people at the Wyndham: Joran Guido Andre Jaime Only Jaime was not gambling. He says he was there to pick up his father. Joran and Guido were walking around and then without telling any of the others, he and Guido leave and go to the Aruba Grand...for about 45 minutes, then they move to the Radisson. So within 2 hours there is contact between: Joran Guido Andre Deepak and possibly Jaime. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 11:18:45 PM Wonder why I thought his father was still in Columbia. One of them, either Freddy or Jaime had a bad homelife (mother or father) and Joran said he felt sorry for him. I don't remember which one it was now. Maybe Jaime and his mom? One of Joran's friends mother died at a fairly young age, I'm thinking it was Jaime if I remember correctly. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 11:28:28 PM Merry Christmas to all! I'm heading to Oklahoma, but will be checking in! Have a safe trip wreck, and Merry Christmas! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 11:35:56 PM http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1117.msg153794
From Joran's book; - Jaime's mother died due to an operation for which she needed medications and as a result a blood clot formed and she died - Joran liked Jaime's mom, always he could eat there, died before turning 50 - Joran says this was the first death he had ever experienced from close around him - he even went to say goodbye with Anita in the intensive care and all three went to the funeral - Jaime was 20 when it happened and lived with his mom, his life started to slip, poor grades, quit school, worked in a restaurant but failed there too. Now he lives with his married sister and has started school again Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 23, 2008, 11:43:53 PM I know it is a little early to wish everyone a Merry Christmas but I also know people will be traveling tomorrow and I might not have a chance to say it to them. I want to wish all Monkeys and their families a Merry Christmas. (http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/MerryChristmasMonkeys3.jpg) Merry Christmas San! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 12:31:20 AM Thank You Janet for another Fantastic Post.....And Merry Christmas to You and Yours Also! We got an early Christmas Present this Year....a New Grandson who was born three weeks early and is doing fine and is Simply Gorgeous! ::cartwheel:: Congrats, hotping!!! What a wonderful Christmas gift for your family! Just this time last year our family was celebrating the birth and coming home for our twin grandsons. I know how happy you must be!!!!!!! ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 12:39:03 AM Merry Christmas Magnolia! I'm almost up to My elbows in Cornbread...lol...I have Dressing to make and pies to bake......I'll probably be back later to see what's happening! ::MonkeyWink:: I love to make dressing.....it is always an adventure. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Same here! But, ya cain't have turkey without cornbread dressin'! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 12:53:07 AM Merry Christmas Magnolia! I'm almost up to My elbows in Cornbread...lol...I have Dressing to make and pies to bake......I'll probably be back later to see what's happening! ::MonkeyWink:: I love to make dressing.....it is always an adventure. ::MonkeyLaugh:: Same here! But, ya cain't have turkey without cornbread dressin'! Yes indeed! ::MonkeyDance:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 12:58:01 AM Hey TM.....I hope You got all Your shopping done.....and I want to wish You a Merry Christmas...because I probably won't get too because tomorrow We will leave to go on Our trip to see the Kids and Grandkids......Sooooo
Merry Merry Christmas! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 01:02:16 AM Merry Christmas to All Monkeys and Their Families....Please Have a Safe and Happy Holiday!
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:02:55 AM Maybe I'm reading this wrong...but I think this says that the island is viewed in a negative light because of the "mother", and regardless of whether or not they prosecute; it will be viewed in a negative light. If this is what it says; they need to wake up and smell the coffee (deadly as it may be) and put the blame where it belongs!
::MonkeyNoNo:: 12/24/2008 Awe Mainta (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12242008AweMaintaPg8-1.jpg) Papiamentu translation: mirando cu have various informacionnan y tipnan new cu will can is indicativo of the envolvimento of joran van der sloot in the caso of desaparicion of natalee holloway, ministerio publico did take the decision cu will posterga the decision if is persegui or not joran van der sloot. according can owing to compronde, the decision end will wordo take in month of feburary. can corda cu some month behind ministerio publico owing to anuncia cu for end of year will did take the decision, but mirando cu informacion adicion y testigonan new owing to come aserca, owing to dicidi of posterga this one some for can succeed investiga esakinan. is wait for cu finalmente arrive at one decision on the topico controversial here mirando cu still, after of 3 year we island is wordo poni in luz negative by of the desaparicion of the child muher mericano here, y while cu the caso not arrive at one end, as is persegui or not, aruba will follow in the luz negative here. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: Anna on December 24, 2008, 01:07:02 AM From ABC....Natalee's story is the most widely read Crime & Justice Story of 2008 http://www.abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=6511338&page=1 Aruba....it's not going away! I think this is VERY important as there are so many Arubans who contend that no one is interested in Natalee any more. They need to know that is just not the case. Those who tell them so are doing them a disservice as well. Now with the new TV Movie coming out, there will still be focus for many months to come. Aruba and The Netherlands need to get over the concept that we are going to just forget a U.S. citizen for whom they have systematically refused to give an adequate accounting. , Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:07:48 AM Hey TM.....I hope You got all Your shopping done.....and I want to wish You a Merry Christmas...because I probably won't get too because tomorrow We will leave to go on Our trip to see the Kids and Grandkids......Sooooo Merry Merry Christmas! Yes, it's done! Thank goodness!!!!! My feet feel like I've walked a hundred miles! Now to get them wrapped; and get started with the cooking!!! You didn't happen to make extra dressing did you? I could meet you on the road somewhere! ::MonkeyHaHa:: I'm going to try my mother in law's recipe this year. I'm ready for the "it's not as good as grandmother's" cause I know they're gonna say it! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Merry Christmas to you and yours! And give that sweet baby an extra kiss from me!!!! You're very lucky, but yes, I can wait a while to be grandma! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 01:08:36 AM Maybe I'm reading this wrong...but I think this says that the island is viewed in a negative light because of the "mother", and regardless of whether or not they prosecute; it will be viewed in a negative light. If this is what it says; they need to wake up and smell the coffee (deadly as it may be) and put the blame where it belongs! OMG... You have got to be kidding Me....They are Unbelievable....... ::MonkeyEek:: Hey Aruba All the Family wants is Their Daughter back.....Don't You think after 3 1/2 years You could at least do the right thing.... ::MonkeyNoNo:: If You are viewed in a negative way it is certainly not the Mother's fault... it is lots of people's fault but not Beth's..... ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: 12/24/2008 Awe Mainta (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/HollowayCaseNews1/12242008AweMaintaPg8-1.jpg) Papiamentu translation: mirando cu have various informacionnan y tipnan new cu will can is indicativo of the envolvimento of joran van der sloot in the caso of desaparicion of natalee holloway, ministerio publico did take the decision cu will posterga the decision if is persegui or not joran van der sloot. according can owing to compronde, the decision end will wordo take in month of feburary. can corda cu some month behind ministerio publico owing to anuncia cu for end of year will did take the decision, but mirando cu informacion adicion y testigonan new owing to come aserca, owing to dicidi of posterga this one some for can succeed investiga esakinan. is wait for cu finalmente arrive at one decision on the topico controversial here mirando cu still, after of 3 year we island is wordo poni in luz negative by of the desaparicion of the child muher mericano here, y while cu the caso not arrive at one end, as is persegui or not, aruba will follow in the luz negative here. Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 01:20:21 AM Hey TM.....I hope You got all Your shopping done.....and I want to wish You a Merry Christmas...because I probably won't get too because tomorrow We will leave to go on Our trip to see the Kids and Grandkids......Sooooo Merry Merry Christmas! Yes, it's done! Thank goodness!!!!! My feet feel like I've walked a hundred miles! Now to get them wrapped; and get started with the cooking!!! You didn't happen to make extra dressing did you? I could meet you on the road somewhere! ::MonkeyHaHa:: I'm going to try my mother in law's recipe this year. I'm ready for the "it's not as good as grandmother's" cause I know they're gonna say it! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Merry Christmas to you and yours! And give that sweet baby an extra kiss from me!!!! You're very lucky, but yes, I can wait a while to be grandma! ::MonkeyWink:: Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:23:50 AM Hey TM.....I hope You got all Your shopping done.....and I want to wish You a Merry Christmas...because I probably won't get too because tomorrow We will leave to go on Our trip to see the Kids and Grandkids......Sooooo Merry Merry Christmas! Yes, it's done! Thank goodness!!!!! My feet feel like I've walked a hundred miles! Now to get them wrapped; and get started with the cooking!!! You didn't happen to make extra dressing did you? I could meet you on the road somewhere! ::MonkeyHaHa:: I'm going to try my mother in law's recipe this year. I'm ready for the "it's not as good as grandmother's" cause I know they're gonna say it! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Merry Christmas to you and yours! And give that sweet baby an extra kiss from me!!!! You're very lucky, but yes, I can wait a while to be grandma! ::MonkeyWink:: I'm sure it will be delicious Hotping! Along with those chocolate pies! ::MonkeyWink:: I hope you have a safe trip; and a wonderful Christmas!!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:27:45 AM From ABC....Natalee's story is the most widely read Crime & Justice Story of 2008 http://www.abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=6511338&page=1 Aruba....it's not going away! I think this is VERY important as there are so many Arubans who contend that no one is interested in Natalee any more. They need to know that is just not the case. Those who tell them so are doing them a disservice as well. Now with the new TV Movie coming out, there will still be focus for many months to come. Aruba and The Netherlands need to get over the concept that we are going to just forget a U.S. citizen for whom they have systematically refused to give an adequate accounting. I agree, Anna. They will probably re-run Renee Gielen's crapumentary the day before the new TV movie debuts; that would be par for the course for Aruba! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: hotping on December 24, 2008, 01:30:53 AM Hey TM.....I hope You got all Your shopping done.....and I want to wish You a Merry Christmas...because I probably won't get too because tomorrow We will leave to go on Our trip to see the Kids and Grandkids......Sooooo Merry Merry Christmas! Yes, it's done! Thank goodness!!!!! My feet feel like I've walked a hundred miles! Now to get them wrapped; and get started with the cooking!!! You didn't happen to make extra dressing did you? I could meet you on the road somewhere! ::MonkeyHaHa:: I'm going to try my mother in law's recipe this year. I'm ready for the "it's not as good as grandmother's" cause I know they're gonna say it! ::MonkeyHaHa:: Merry Christmas to you and yours! And give that sweet baby an extra kiss from me!!!! You're very lucky, but yes, I can wait a while to be grandma! ::MonkeyWink:: I'm sure it will be delicious Hotping! Along with those chocolate pies! ::MonkeyWink:: I hope you have a safe trip; and a wonderful Christmas!!!!! Good Night Monkeys! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:33:09 AM Those will be priceless memories Hotping! Enjoy! And I'm sure they will be delicious!
Goodnight, and Merry Christmas! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: texasmom on December 24, 2008, 01:38:46 AM (http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/CarpePicNatalee1.png)
Face it Aruba; Natalee's mother is not alone in this fight! We want answers and we're not giving up! Ever! Justice for Natalee!!!! Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 24, 2008, 01:54:29 AM I'm going to go ahead and move to the new thread a little early. That way you night owls won't run past page 50 here ::MonkeyWink::
Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - Post by: klaasend on December 24, 2008, 01:55:23 AM (http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/moderator%20pics/MODLOCK1.gif)
Please move to NCD# 787 http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.0 |