Natalee Case Discussion #839 6/14/10 - 6/17/10

[klaasend]

Posted by Wonderwoman at RU:

http://diamondclarity.wordpress.com/2010/06/15/john-ludwick-claims-to-be-best-friends-with-joran-van-der-sloot/

[2NJSons_Mom]

More trap pics:

This is the actual diagonal of the trap




Some think they see a police cap

It may well be a police cap - I do not know.  I, personally, don't think it is, but others whose opinions I do not just discount feel it is.

Here is what Kyle had to say about that spot though:

Kyle Kingman:  “The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric.”

And what he had to say about the size of the fabric:

Kyle Kingman:  “In my opinion, the blue fabric is quite possibly Natalee's skirt. The divers found the denim where I suggested a week earlier (Dec 29th) to Tim Miller that there was likely Natalee's denim skirt under the sand.  Also in my opinion, the deni-like fabric is a match in terms of color, quantity, and structure to Natalee's skirt. It's not a lot of denim folded in the bag, but then again her skirt was rather small.”

Once again, I am a bit behind, but don't forget that picture of Jacob Lex on the Persistence with the bottom portion of his jean pant leg cut/torn.....it made me go 'hmmmmm'.  I think I have the picture but would have to look.. I don't think I saved it to photobucket...it's probably on the hard drive.

[TexasRick007]

But I have never seen any internet access to Aruban law anywhere.  We have looked many times.

They don't bother posting it because even if they did, you wouldn't understand.

[klaasend]

2NJ -

Here's that photo






While I was searching my hard drive for Jacob I found this one too, LOLOL

[TexasRick007]

Regarding this Ludwick character - I think he's just playing with the media.  Kind of like the guys that jump out of the stands at a ballgame and then 50,000 people are watching them for a few minutes. They get in the paper. Their 10 minutes of 'fame'.

Witness his comments - "I'm on Nancy Grace, woo hoo" or whatever it was he posted.  He's just a joker whose friends know he's just playing the media to get some (sick) laughs and attention.  I don't think he's worthy of our discussion here - it's a sort of joke.

Greetings to all from hot Texas!
Rick

[ozziesmom]

But I have never seen any internet access to Aruban law anywhere.  We have looked many times.

They don't bother posting it because even if they did, you wouldn't understand.

The only ones that understand thier laws are the criminals....go figure

[Ono]

Tyler, I think that was very well said; and so true.

I agree..Tyler I heart you...but you know that already!!

I heart all of you for filling me in on the politics of the game.   I'll never inquire of her again for fear of being accused of being a gossip from out of nowhere when I'm only wishing factual clarity & sunshine on the situation, of which I am in the dark!!!  lol   Yikes!

Ono......don't ever stop asking.....some of us are oldtimers and forget not everyone was here from the beginning.  I would not like to be in the dark!!

OK, here's a question from a poster who's been here from day 1.  Though I did take a small break.  I remember Capslockwizard, but I never saw who he really was, how he was related to the players in Aruba and how we figured it out?

OK. I will take a stab at answering this question.

During the time of the Persiastence searches, CAPSLOCKWIZARD emerged here and took a quick interest to the case.
He claimed to have intimate knowledge and asserted the ability to decode the ultra mysterious Shango/Simian riddles.

Over time, his IP addresses were tracked and it was learned that CLW was actually more than one person - four to be exact.
Furthermore, physical locations (through IPs) and login times narrowed identity even further.
After putting two and two together, several names of identity emerged. These people's identities are linked to Aruba.
One step further, they are linked to known disinformants, and collusionists within the cover-up and corruption.
Even further, the information provided by CLW turned out to be a mere distraction, amidst a critical point in the case, in most eyes.
That critical point was during the searches in the ocean as CLW swore up and down that the body could be found in a pond.
CLW also claimed to be on the inside with ALE and helped provide certain info to them, thru clandestined meetings, amidst these searches.
CLW even went so far as to right letters to Dave and was very curious about certain individuals on our board.

To a degree, his tactics worked somewhat until discovered and called out publicly here at SM.
During his tenure, though, most people were all ears as his posts containes some pretty unusual and specificly crypted information.
Hindsight always being 20/20, it was too good to be true that after all the time that had passed, a new poster came here,
piques the interest of many, acting like he had a magically omniscient power to solve all of the unknowns that SM posters
had so dilligently scoured over for years. Needless to say, it is a well known fact that CLW was just a well planted and deivsed diversion.

Hope that sums it up for you. That is my take on the matter, in as short and sweet of a manner as I can put iy.
Other posters will probably provide more specifics and a better summation than I have given.

BUCKSHOT:  Thank you explaining that for her as I had taken breaks myself off & on from Natalee's thread for awhile and when I returned found everyone interacting with this poster as if it was the real deal, which I doubted as it gave me 'red flag' feelings, as did the Shango stuff.  Glad to find out how it ended.

[crazybabyborg]

I don't know if this site is accurate but this is what it says about Aruban law.  Keep in mind that they will never charge Joran with murder in Aruba...just isn't going to happen.  Involuntary manslaughter maybe.

http://www.curacao-law.com/2007/11/26/aruba-criminal-law/

According to the Aruba Penal Code (Article 72) with respect to adults (18 years and older):

    * There is a 6 year statute of limitations on crimes with a maximum term of imprisonment of 3 years (involuntary manslaughter: max. 9 months imprisonment)
    * There is a 12 year statute of limitations on crimes with a term of imprisonment of at least 3 years (voluntary manslaughter: max. 15 years and murder: max. 20 years imprisonment)
    * There is a 18 year statute of limitations on crimes which result in a life sentence (e.g. murder committed by terrorists / kidnapping resulting in the death of the kidnapped person / killing someone to hide a crime: life sentence)

Hi Klaas! Hi Monkeys!!

I just can't see Aruba doing anything other than what they've done so far: cover up and give lip service. We ALL know they tipped off Joran about the extortion deal, and that's recent evidence of their true to form attitude. I hope I'm wrong but I gave up hope with Aruba long ago.

[klaasend]

Regarding this Ludwick character - I think he's just playing with the media.  Kind of like the guys that jump out of the stands at a ballgame and then 50,000 people are watching them for a few minutes. They get in the paper. Their 10 minutes of 'fame'.

Witness his comments - "I'm on Nancy Grace, woo hoo" or whatever it was he posted.  He's just a joker whose friends know he's just playing the media to get some (sick) laughs and attention.  I don't think he's worthy of our discussion here - it's a sort of joke.

Greetings to all from hot Texas!
Rick

I agree he is a joke but he has been hanging with Joran for the last couple months in Aruba so he might have some information.  I think the FBI would like to talk to him.

[2NJSons_Mom]

2NJ -

Here's that photo






While I was searching my hard drive for Jacob I found this one too, LOLOL

Thanks, Klaas!   

Sizable piece of denim, I would say...maybe not enough to make a skirt but it has some faded areas...bleached maybe...who knows....Oh, yeah, Jacobs of the frosted flakes might know....haha

[Northern Rose]

Joran van der Sloot awor kier haci negoshi cu curpa di Natalee Holloway; A cambio di un traslado pa Aruba

ORANJESTAD- Informacionnan den fin di siman for di Lima, Peru, ta mustra cu Joran van der Sloot, kende a wordo traslada diabierna ultimo pa e prison di alta seguridad, esta e centro Miguel Castro-Castro, lo tin masha miedo mes di ta den prison cu figuranan sumamente peligroso y kendenan a comete crimennan mayor. Segun informacionnan den diferente medio di comunicacion riba e caso aki, Joran ta teme pa su bida y lo no kier ta den e prison aki. Na mes momento Joran lo a avisa autoridadnan hudicial di Peru, cu e lo kier duna claridad den e caso di desaparicion di e studiante Mericano, Natalee Holloway, kende a desaparece misteriosamente dia 30 di mei di 2005,  despues cu e tabata den compania di Joran riba beach na Hadicurari. E desaroyonan aki ta crea e impresion cu loke Joran ta sigui kere cu e lo por negocia tur cos y lo ta cla pa negocia cu autoridadnan hudicial di Aruba, pa  asina yega na aclaria kico a pasa cu Natalee Holloway e anochi cu el a desaparece, y pa bisa  autoridadnan kico el a haci cu e mucha muher y cu su curpa despues.

Den pasado caba Joran a declara cu Natalee lo a bira malo riba  beach y cu e lo a muri y cu el a benta e curpa den laman, pero awor si e kier papia e berdad y kier aclaria e caso aki, pero ta lanta e pregunta, a cambio di kico. Joran no ta den posicion pa negocia nada pero si ta mustra cu e lo kier yega na acuerdonan cu autoridadnan hudicial di  Aruba of  di Hulanda, pa nan negocia pa e sinta su castigo den un prison na Hulanda of aki na Aruba, despues di su sentencia dor di Corte di Husticia Peruano. A cambio di esaki e lo kier coopera pa soluciona e misterio di Natalee Holloway y avisa autoridadnan policial di Aruba, na unda el a sconde, of kico el a haci cu e curpa di e studiante Mericano. Ta dificil pa kere cu Joran lo tin bon intencion awor aki si, awor cu el a bolbe mata, awor cu el a bolbe actua manera un asesino cu sanger frieuw, cu no tin nocion algun di respet pa bida humano. E forma con el a comete e asesinato riba Stephany Flores den su camber di hotel, ta mustra cu e ta un psicopata cu  ta kere cu e por supera tur obstaculo cu su mentiranan, y keriendo cu ta su persona ta defini rumbo di tur hende.

Den e caso di Natalee Holloway aki na Aruba, el a hunga cu tur hende, cu autoridadnan policial y hudicial, cu medionan di comunicacion local y internacional, y semper el a guia e rumbo di su actonan macabro, ya cu ningun hende por a prueba cu el a mata e studiante Mericano dia 30 di mei di 2005. Den caso di Stephany e no por a actua di mesun forma cu el a haci na Aruba na 2005 ya cu tur caminda tabatin camara ta grabando tur loke el a haci y con el a move y e lapso di temponan cu a graba e movecionnan di tanto su persona como esun di Stephany, ta pone den e camber como e unico asesino di e mucha muher. No ta prome biaha cu Joran kier bisa kico el a haci cu Natalee y na e alturanan aki, caminda e ta  contemplando mas cu 15 aña sigur den prison na Peru, di repente e   lo kier limpia su consenshi den caso di e hoben Meicano? Tur cos ta mustra cu e meta tras di e pensamento bondadoso aki, ta pa e negocia un posibel traslado den futuro pa un prison na Hulanda of Aruba, ya cu e no kier keda den prison na Peru, y siguiendo su pensamento diabolico cu el a mustra ultimo añanan, tin cu conclui cu e lo bai negocia esaki cu autoridadnan policial y hudicial di Aruba. Manera ta conoci, ta intencion di un delegacion hudicial di Aruba biaha pa Peru pa reuni cu autoridadnan Peruano, pa asina haya mas claridad den e informacionnan aki cu ta yega di Peru, y mira si enberdad Joran lo kier bisa unda el a dera of benta curpa di Natalee Holloway.

http://news.laprensacur.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=11131:joran-van-der-sloot-awor-kier-haci-negoshi-cu-curpa-di-natalee-holloway-a-cambio-di-un-traslado-pa-aruba&catid=23:aruba&Itemid=52

[TexasRick007]

Regarding this Ludwick character - I think he's just playing with the media.  Kind of like the guys that jump out of the stands at a ballgame and then 50,000 people are watching them for a few minutes. They get in the paper. Their 10 minutes of 'fame'.

Witness his comments - "I'm on Nancy Grace, woo hoo" or whatever it was he posted.  He's just a joker whose friends know he's just playing the media to get some (sick) laughs and attention.  I don't think he's worthy of our discussion here - it's a sort of joke.

Greetings to all from hot Texas!
Rick

I agree he is a joke but he has been hanging with Joran for the last couple months in Aruba so he might have some information.  I think the FBI would like to talk to him.

I think if Joran actually told this guy something of value, he'd have already sold the info to a tabloid, posted it on his Facebook page, etc.  This guy reminds me of that Washington DC gate crashing couple - anything to be in the spotlight, though this guy's style is more MTV Jackass versus a reality show...

[darleenofalabama]

Well, y'all, if that's a police cap in the fish cage, they probably dropped it while they were helping the murderer and his father dispose of Natalee's body.

[Northern Rose]

Endangered attorney does not withdraw Judge deals with lawful arrest

LIMA / LONDON - Next Friday will Joran van der Sloot will be brought before the court. It is expected the judge, the former anti-corruption magistrate Carlos Morales Córdova, decide whether the case of Van der Sloot will be extended. Because there by international experts have put question marks on whether the arrest and surrender from Chile to Peru legally expired, the court may also consider that question.
Van der Sloots Peruvian lawyer was under intense pressure in recent days. "The windows of his office were smashed and his family is seriously threatened," said the Dutch lawyer of the family, Mr. De Rooij.

According to him there is no question of the Peruvian defense attorney raise. "It is possible that he is not the case itself will do, but in that case, just someone from his office take over the case," de Rooij. Peru's attorney is on a hiding place. Public anger in Peru Joran is still the day. The family of murdered Stephany Flores shows himself fully to interfere with the proceedings. Her father is a wealthy businessman Ricardo, with excellent contacts in the Peruvian government.

Ricardo Flores said yesterday that the indictment must be motivated far more comprehensive. Furthermore, the role of three taxi drivers who helped Joran flights to Chile, yet underexposed. According to Joran, he would watch, money and clothes to them to issue, after she had said that he was wanted for murder. The taxi drivers deny this strongly. Joran appears in the Chilean police an entirely different reading have given. In doing so he and Stephany are attacked in their room by two men with a firearm and a knife. In the third lecture he gave her back after leaving the casino.

The security monitoring in his hotel, however, lie to any earlier version. Mentalist Uri Geller confirmed yesterday that he paid money to Joran as newspaper said Monday. According to him he paid tickets and several hundred dollars because he wanted to bring Joran like under hypnosis during a TV program. He denies that he has many thousands of dollars paid to Joran, as the police stated.

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/6961277/__Vraagtekens_bij_rechtmatigheid_arrestatie_Joran__.html?sn=binnenland

[Ono]

DAVE HOLLOWAYS ATTORNEY VINDA DE SOUSA



Vinda de Sousa is friends with Marlene Purcell
/http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5807.660




Vinda de Sousa is drinking buddy with Julia Renfro

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=6448.msg1050578#msg1050578


Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway

Page 136:  We're fortunate that one of the men from home here to help us is an attorney, so he personnally interviews several Aruban lawyers and decides Vinda de Sousa will be as good as any.  Her retainer is $5,000 up front.

Page 179:  During this time we add a new attorney, Helen Lejuez, who tells us she is confident that we can access official documents for us.  Her retainer is also $5,000 up front.  We give her copies of all the materials we've collected.  She gets started. 
And Vinda, the first attorney, quits, refusing to work on a team with Helen.  Vinda sends another bill, for $15,000, but we are not able to obtain an itemized invoice for this.

 

Friend by day...Foe by night. To think that critical info was placed into their hands -- WOW...
Wonder whose unwanted hands (namely, the perpetrators) and laps this information landed unto...

My description has always been this, when thinking about things, years later...

Beth came to Aruba in search of her deceased (murdered) daughter.
Little did she know, she was just like a gerbil in a labyrinth maze, seeking the cheese (her daughters remains<first> and justice <second>)
Everytime she got too close to the truth (cheese), the hand above lifted her (gerbil) and placed her back at the beginning.
Too many roadblocks were placed in her way too even count.

When important stuff was taking place on one end of the island, they had critical info that led her to the other side.
When (hired)investigators got too close, they threatened to arrest them, due to lack of permits.
While searching in the nasty, sweltering dump for countless hours, a mysterious fir occurred along with piling trash where they had cleared.
Searching on the beach was blocked by declaring national turtle mating season.
Their phones were tapped (I am sure) and they were followed around, same as within this past week with Dave.

How could Aruba know they were getting too close? Too close to what?
They must have known the truth in order to shield the family from things that led them closer to it.
Seems like a logically stated position, huh?

You summarized it beautifully!!!   I had forgotten about that silly turtle excuse.  They must have laughed their heads off playing their vicious mind games with the 'cowboys.'   Leopards don't change their spots-it's still the same old runaround.

[carpe noctem]

NG callers are such a hoot...Makes me want to throw my remote through the screen.

"Hey Nancy, thanks for taking my call. I noticed that when Joran leaves the room and pretends
to knock on the door, he already has his coffee in hand. Stephany was already dead at this point..."

NG: "You know, that is such an astute observation" I anxiously await for her to say "No shit, Sherlock Holmes"

We have discussed this for at least ten pages from about a hundred different posters and angles.
She needs to run a banner across the bottom of the screen that reads:
"For much, much more information about this case, visit SCAREDMONKEYS.COM"

It does seem they hand pick some of the dimmest protoplasm balls on the planet, huh?

Caller:

HI NANCYYYYYYYY, THIS IS WENDY FROM WALLA WALLA, I`VE JUST BEEN WONDERING FOR 5 YEARS AND IT JUST HIT ME TONIGHT!!!! DO YOU THINK ANITA ATE NATALEE?

Nancy: Very good question! Dr. Perper?

*Shot of Dr. Perper`s deer in the headlights look.

[crazybabyborg]

NG callers are such a hoot...Makes me want to throw my remote through the screen.

"Hey Nancy, thanks for taking my call. I noticed that when Joran leaves the room and pretends
to knock on the door, he already has his coffee in hand. Stephany was already dead at this point..."

NG: "You know, that is such an astute observation" I anxiously await for her to say "No shit, Sherlock Holmes"

We have discussed this for at least ten pages from about a hundred different posters and angles.
She needs to run a banner across the bottom of the screen that reads:
"For much, much more information about this case, visit SCAREDMONKEYS.COM"

It does seem they hand pick some of the dimmest protoplasm balls on the planet, huh?

Caller:

HI NANCYYYYYYYY, THIS IS WENDY FROM WALLA WALLA, I`VE JUST BEEN WONDERING FOR 5 YEARS AND IT JUST HIT ME TONIGHT!!!! DO YOU THINK ANITA ATE NATALEE?

Nancy: Very good question! Dr. Perper?

*Shot of Dr. Perper`s deer in the headlights look.

OMG...... warn a girl, will 'ya? Choked on that one!!

The "number 5" on the room, caller was my favorite. I think it was Destiny. Ohhhhhmmmm............

[Tylergal]

NG callers are such a hoot...Makes me want to throw my remote through the screen.

"Hey Nancy, thanks for taking my call. I noticed that when Joran leaves the room and pretends
to knock on the door, he already has his coffee in hand. Stephany was already dead at this point..."

NG: "You know, that is such an astute observation" I anxiously await for her to say "No shit, Sherlock Holmes"

We have discussed this for at least ten pages from about a hundred different posters and angles.
She needs to run a banner across the bottom of the screen that reads:
"For much, much more information about this case, visit SCAREDMONKEYS.COM"

It does seem they hand pick some of the dimmest protoplasm balls on the planet, huh?

Caller:

HI NANCYYYYYYYY, THIS IS WENDY FROM WALLA WALLA, I`VE JUST BEEN WONDERING FOR 5 YEARS AND IT JUST HIT ME TONIGHT!!!! DO YOU THINK ANITA ATE NATALEE?

Nancy: Very good question! Dr. Perper?

*Shot of Dr. Perper`s deer in the headlights look.

Dr. Perper:  Well, she does seem to be losing some weight recently after looking quite broad in Winter 2007.  You have a point there.

[cecilita]

The monster at least should fake a little bit of remorse after killing Stephany few days ago!!! and now he is playing cards with another killer!!!! unbelievable, the police should keep them separate, both are dangerous.
I really would like to know if this monsters has nightmares.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Before signing off for the night, I just wanted to add that I thought Greta's segment on Joran s*cked.  During her talk with the reporter (whose name I don't recall, sorry) on the street in front of the Atlantic City Casino, she said the extortion transactoin happened on 13th of May and Joran left for Peru the following day...or something close.  We've only read that the transaction occurred on the 10th to this point, if I'm not mistaken.