Natalee Case Discussion #733 2/17 - 2/21/08

[JE]

http://www.blikopdewereld.nl/economie/de_zaak_koch.htm

Officier van Justitie Janssen en onderzoeksrechter W.-Bruinsma zijn in het voortraject volgens Moszkowicz opmerkelijk vriendelijk voor Koch geweest. ,,Wat weten we van zijn ziekte? Alleen wat hij zelf zegt. Ik heb nooit een medische onderbouwing gezien. De indruk zou kunnen ontstaan dat er tussen de verdachte en het Openbaar Ministerie een overeenkomst is gesloten, om Koch zo ver te krijgen hen op een andere manier van informatie te voorzien,'' stelde de raadsman. Officier van Justitie K. Janssen reageerde niet op deze aantijging.

Karin Janssen and Moszkowicz have been om opposite sides in court before....

This was in the biggest investement scam (about 145mil guilders +/- 65mil Euros)  in Holland to date
It involves a german guy named Koch

Short Translation of the above:

Karin Jansen "officer of justice" (srry don t know the english term) and judge Bruinsma have according to Moszkowicz been remarkably friendly to Koch (Janssen and Bruinsma claimed he was to sick to be interrogated)
Moszkowicz: What do we know about this illness? Only what Kock himself says. I have never seen any medical evidence of illness. The impression could arise that the suspect and the Openbaar Ministerie have made some sort of deal. Karen Janssen chose not to react to this accusation of Moszkowicz

Oh and... Karen Jansen never witnessed the end of this case cuse she was sent to Aruba.

[Tylergal]

O/T

Does anyone else's SpellChek try to change Joran to Koran?  I am always afraid I will do that using SpellChek and offend some Muslim extermist group that will issue a fatwa against me or something.

.

Don't worry about that!

We got your back!

Well, #1 we have gunslinger here and #2 they have not issued one against Obama yet and he is using a Muslim name and claiming Christianity, so I doubt they would go after you on that, but on second thought, I would not want Joran converted to Holy Bible. 

[Maggie]

I don't think you have to adhere to only one format; you can present several, each one going in more depth.
1. Maybe start with Who's Who in the Zoo, and include pictures and connect them with both relations and jobs (or do two charts, one of government, the other of relationships)
2. Next, a chronological presentation of short quotes (w/small picture or caricature?) Right under the quotes could be the source.
3. Finally the whole thing filled in, a long documentary of events.

This would allow the reader to get "hooked" while they are in short attention span mode.

Just another idea.

[EURobert]

O/T

Does anyone else's SpellChek try to change Joran to Koran?  I am always afraid I will do that using SpellChek and offend some Muslim extermist group that will issue a fatwa against me or something.

.

Don't worry about that!

We got your back!

Could you keep an eye on my back too? I've just placed the 'Mohammed-with-a-bomb-in-his-turban-cartoon' on my blog yesterday. I get the shivers every time the doorbell rings now...

[Anna]

O/T

Does anyone else's SpellChek try to change Joran to Koran?  I am always afraid I will do that using SpellChek and offend some Muslim extermist group that will issue a fatwa against me or something.

.

Don't worry about that!

We got your back!

Thanks!  I may need that.  Can't be too careful these days.

.

[Frank]

sorry if this has been posted already:

Monday, February 18:
• Breaking news in the Natalee Holloway case — 'On the Record' has the latest!

[Debra]

Since it was a weekend...how late would Moomba's be open?  Maybe until 2:00 AM or so?  Someone was there cleaning up at least.  CnC was open until 1:00 AM.  A bar near a hotel resort would probabaly stay open later...Joran had a friend there...he walked up to the Marriott...not to use the phone...but to get help...not to help Natalee...but to cover his butt...MOO

Im not sure how much of this fact or satire
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-suspect-emerges-in-aruba-murder.html

I always felt there was something to do with the fact Mark Jr, Joran, & friend
(Alex or Lorenzo?) are all together at C&C wearing the same shirt, closely shaved heads....Some sort of "club"?  Even SC was there and others?  It was as though the "predator game" was in effect.  Joran says "I wanted to party more & Natalee wanted to come with us." They probably did drive around for the next party. I wonder why Joran stops at his house?  Drugs, condoms? They most likely met up with GVC and Guido at Arashi Beach & headed for Moomba's...Which wasd open late that night.  This would put them all near the Marriott/Holiday Inn. Where "something bad happened" first. I also believe the report of a girl being taken to a white vehicle (The vehicle following Deepak?) The "party" most likely moves south to Colony Beach where some evidence may have been found.

Had MIP6, Reality, Renfro and others had kept themselves off the forums with their vivicious attacks on Natalee and her family....Things would not be pointing to them & WHO they are protecting. JMO.

[Lala'sMom]

Each of Joran's successive stories were designed to include information he discovered along the way. He only tells stories that have partial truths, knowing that, tells me something in what he says about walking to the Marriott has some truth in it.  He either truly made a phone call from that phone to his buddy "Daury" or he knew there was a possibility of someone seeing him in the area and he is placing himself there deliberately in order to deflect the truth in some way....didn't Scott Peterson do that too?

[caesu]

sorry if this has been posted already:

Monday, February 18:
• Breaking news in the Natalee Holloway case — 'On the Record' has the latest!

wonder what's that's going to be.
breaking news, but we'll have to wait till her show at 10pm... not that breaking i guess.
maybe it's just that patrick has a book coming.

[Lala'sMom]

Since it was a weekend...how late would Moomba's be open?  Maybe until 2:00 AM or so?  Someone was there cleaning up at least.  CnC was open until 1:00 AM.  A bar near a hotel resort would probabaly stay open later...Joran had a friend there...he walked up to the Marriott...not to use the phone...but to get help...not to help Natalee...but to cover his butt...MOO

Im not sure how much of this fact or satire
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-suspect-emerges-in-aruba-murder.html

I always felt there was something to do with the fact Mark Jr, Joran, & friend
(Alex or Lorenzo?) are all together at C&C wearing the same shirt, closely shaved heads....Some sort of "club"?  Even SC was there and others?  It was as though the "predator game" was in effect.  Joran says "I wanted to party more & Natalee wanted to come with us." They probably did drive around for the next party. I wonder why Joran stops at his house?  Drugs, condoms? They most likely met up with GVC and Guido at Arashi Beach & headed for Moomba's...Which wasd open late that night.  This would put them all near the Marriott/Holiday Inn. Where "something bad happened" first. I also believe the report of a girl being taken to a white vehicle (The vehicle following Deepak?) The "party" most likely moves south to Colony Beach where some evidence may have been found.

Had MIP6, Reality, Renfro and others had kept themselves off the forums with their vivicious attacks on Natalee and her family....Things would not be pointing to them & WHO they are protecting. JMO.

Would Joran have had the courage to take daddy's car when he stopped at the house?   They went to the house, because it's in the PV's...they knew someone may know this and thus a story to cover "the reason we stopped at Joran's".

[JE]

Since it was a weekend...how late would Moomba's be open?  Maybe until 2:00 AM or so?  Someone was there cleaning up at least.  CnC was open until 1:00 AM.  A bar near a hotel resort would probabaly stay open later...Joran had a friend there...he walked up to the Marriott...not to use the phone...but to get help...not to help Natalee...but to cover his butt...MOO

Im not sure how much of this fact or satire
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/2006/11/new-suspect-emerges-in-aruba-murder.html

I always felt there was something to do with the fact Mark Jr, Joran, & friend
(Alex or Lorenzo?) are all together at C&C wearing the same shirt, closely shaved heads....Some sort of "club"?  Even SC was there and others?  It was as though the "predator game" was in effect.  Joran says "I wanted to party more & Natalee wanted to come with us." They probably did drive around for the next party. I wonder why Joran stops at his house?  Drugs, condoms? They most likely met up with GVC and Guido at Arashi Beach & headed for Moomba's...Which wasd open late that night.  This would put them all near the Marriott/Holiday Inn. Where "something bad happened" first. I also believe the report of a girl being taken to a white vehicle (The vehicle following Deepak?) The "party" most likely moves south to Colony Beach where some evidence may have been found.

Had MIP6, Reality, Renfro and others had kept themselves off the forums with their vivicious attacks on Natalee and her family....Things would not be pointing to them & WHO they are protecting. JMO.

Would Joran have had the courage to take daddy's car when he stopped at the house?   They went to the house, because it's in the PV's...they knew someone may know this and thus a story to cover "the reason we stopped at Joran's".

Good point i always wondered why they would go there for no reason

[Blue Moon]

I was just browsing through the RTL.NL site and found a set of 20 photos in the case.  Some from early in the case I hadn't seen.  Also this photo of the pay phone Joran alegedly used:



RTL.NL photo set

http://tinyurl.com/yqbctc

that phone looks awfully new to have been there in the hot sun and wind for 32 months or more.  has anyone checked to see if that's the same phone or kind of phone or even if there was a phone there when natalee was?  jvds spent time at the marriott in 2006  with his dutch girl friend, he could have just seen it then or even a later trip there, since the marriott seems to be another of his hangouts.
dennisintn

Good point, Dennis.  I also would like to know what sway over the Marriott the wonky eyed Joran has that he could stay there in summer rather than at his parent's home with a girlfriend who comes from abroad.  Did he pay for all that? I feel quite sure he was not paying in cash.  Was he "laundering money?"  Or is there someone at the Marriott who in conjunction with Joran has done "some stuff together."

Let's be honest here, NO ONE rapes and kills a girl out in the open.  My guess is he took her inside the Marriott where all his pimps were waiting on them.  If not there there he did take her back to the VDSloots home for the entertainment.

[dennisintn]

sorry if this has been posted already:

Monday, February 18:
• Breaking news in the Natalee Holloway case — 'On the Record' has the latest!

i haven't seen it before.  any clue what it's about?
dennisintn

[Debra]

Possibly....But it's Deepak that "slips" & describes Guido & GVC's cars.

Why hadn't MIP6 said "Oh, yeah...that's my kid hanging out at C&C's?"


What I'm seeing is possibly the pimps "bait & switch" game
A tourist girl really could not ID them positively

Mark Jr is one "wild & crazy" guy
He probably met Natalee earlier

[Blue Moon]

amigo quote---clipped
"According to his lawyer Bert De Rooij, “Joran van der Sloot is not well off.  He is in hiding and is constantly being threatened. Whether that is in the Netherlands or in Aruba, is not known.  The lawyer said that he is not hiding for the police, but for the people’s tribunal.  He has serious reasons to believe that he won’t make it across the street if we let him go free.” Where are the keeping him?  it is like he is locked up some place

Crime journalist Peter R. de Vries is of the opinion that by not arresting Joran van der Sloot, he is being rewarded for undermining the police investigation.  He also does not understand that the Court does not want to arrest him because the Court is under the impression that Joran is a consistent liar.  “The fact that a person constantly lies in a case of life and death, is precisely a motive to keep him/her locked behind bars.”
Peter is the only one making any sense in this investigation.

He is probably in a mental institution just like VD Straaten told him.

[Debra]

IMO the house stop with Natalee & 2K was just to find the next party
Possibly Freddy was already there
The stops along the way were to get the pimps together
Most likely SW beach
Odd evidence found
6:30 am call FROM Santa Lucia-last stop-Joran calling Paulus
My guess is: Rancho Daimari area (cucunu house/apts)

Daury could be Mark Jr...He fits the description
Why wasnt this "pimp" ever questioned? Everyone else was.

[Blue Moon]

Wasn't Mark Purcell Jr a bartender at Moomba (sp).  Maybe that is the second bar they stopped at instead of Chose A Name as they said.  Protecting their source?  He had lots of some date rape drug and said it was for his own use, right?  And in true Aruban tradition, his mother backed him up and said he needed it to masturbate of all things!  At least that is what was reported.

Since when does a young male need aids for THAT???

Then Mark Sr was director of facilities at Mariott.  Mariott is sure to have a boat.  Where did Purcells dock their boat I wonder.  Mark Sr speaks often of his aversion to birds and toads meaning me and Granny Toad for some odd reason as I have never done anything to him.  Neither has she.

Just inserted himself into this in such a big way and also has irrational hated for Beth. 

Like defensive.

Or something. . . .

careful what you say--you will get an email from "someone" on that site reprimanding you for something you did not say

[Debra]

Santa Lucia: "Hidden in plain view"

[FaithMS]

Possibly....But it's Deepak that "slips" & describes Guido & GVC's cars.

Why hadn't MIP6 said "Oh, yeah...that's my kid hanging out at C&C's?"


What I'm seeing is possibly the pimps "bait & switch" game
A tourist girl really could not ID them positively

Mark Jr is one "wild & crazy" guy
He probably met Natalee earlier

Which guy are you thinking is Mark Jr?

IMO no one in those pics are Mark Jr.

[MumInOhio]

From the PV’s about cars and drivers….

From Deepak PV…6/13
To your question whether Joran is able to drive a car, I can say the following.

I know that he is able to drive a car. One time Joran drove my mother's car from the Marriot Hotel to my house. My mother has a Daewoo Nubira modell 1999. He also told me once that he had to drive for his mother, because his mother's foot had been hurting.

To your question what car the parents of Joran drive, I can say the following.

Joran's father has a red jeep and Joran's mother has a dark blue Hyundai jeep.

Satish 6/30
On your question if Joran can drive a car, I can explain to you the following:
I am certain that Joran can drive a car. Joran has in the month of March 2005, driven my mother’s car. Joran drove the car on that day from the parking place at the Marriott hotel to my house in Hooiberg. Then Joran was the only one in the car and he was drunk. (see note below)

On your question if Joran drove the car of its parents, I can explain to you the following:
I have never seen Joran drive the cars of his parents. You must ask Freddy if Joran drove the cars of his parents. The parents of Joran have two cars and they are a dark blue "Hyundai" jeep and a red car of which I now no longer remember what kind.


On your question if I know the name of Joran’s second brother, I can only give you the following answers:
Joran has two (2) younger brothers but I don’t know their names.  I think that Joran’s brother is fifteen (15) years old.

On your question if the fifteen-year-old brother of Joran can drive a car, I cannot answer that question.

On your question who can tell the truth to you, with the exception of Joran, Deepak and I, I can tell you the following:
Freddy is the person Joran confides in and he can tell you the truth.

On your question how often Joran has driven my mother’s car, I will explain the following:
Joran has only driven my mother’s car (1) time. I can say to you that I saw he did it well. I’m not aware of how Joran learned to drive a car.