Caylee Marie Anthony, 2, Missing 6/16/08 Orlando FL (Remains Found) #87

[eternal0void]

Hi Fuzzball, your post are ALWAYS interesting.  However, the trust fund that was set up called "Help Find Caylee Marie" trust has the money in there from donations to bury Caylee. 

This is the link to the four page trust http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2937600/HELP-FIND-CAYLEE-MARIE-ANTHONY-TRUST-AGREEMENT

It will not let me copy and paste so I am referring to the link above, page 1...listed under #2.

Also, in reference to "no money in the trust fund"  please see page 3 of the above link, listed under #9.  That the Trust can be terminated IF the balance falls below $5,000.  I am not aware of the trust that I am referring to being terminated. 

The wording is "may be terminated if the balance falls below $5,000", not "will be terminated if the balance falls below $5,000".  Using the old MSDOS system of "cut and paste" (i.e., "remember and retype") from the four page trust:

9. TERMINATION.  This Trust and Agreement shall be irrevocable but may be terminated at any time by the Trustee(s) at such time as the purposes hereof shall have been fulfilled or should the balance in the trust account fall below $5,000.00 then the Trustee(s) is/are authorized to terminate the trust and hold the funds for the benefit otherwise stated herein.

The fact is that due to the language of the Trust, we cannot assume, because the Trust has not been terminated, that a balance over $5,000 is present in the Trust.  The Trustee(s) may have simply not terminated the Trust with its potentially sub-$5,000 balance, as it is entirely up to the Trustee whether or not to terminate the Trust on even, say, a $100 balance.

I can think of a good reason why the Trustee(s) may not want to terminate the Trust (again with the 1980s "remember and retype" method of "cut and paste"):

2. PURPOSES.  The primary purposes of the Trust Fund will be to pay general expenses relating to the location and recovery of Caylee Marie Anthony, as well as general expenses of the burial and estate administration of Caylee Marie Anthony, should she be deceased.  Any funds remaining in the Trust Fund upon completion of the purposes designated herein, will be donated to the organizations that have assisted in the search and locations processes for Caylee Marie Anthony, such as the "Kid Finders Network" and the "Never Lose Hope Foundation", or to any other such organizations such as the Trustee(s) deem appropriate and consistent with the designated purposes as stated herein.

"Never Lose Hope Foundation" sold a bunch of $20 raffle tickets for a new Ferrari back in September, and was due to have a live drawing on their website on October 1st, 2008.  Two weeks prior to October 1st, the NLHF website went "The site is under construction being updated" and is currently "being parked FREE by GoDaddy.com" (see "P.S." at the end of this message for more info).  The raffle tickets themselves did not contain contact information to find out the results of the raffle from an alternative source, so anyone who purchased a raffle ticket got conned out of $20 by the NLHF (ironically making many lose hope that they will ever get their money back).

"Kid Finders" seems to spend its time raking in donations and angrily confronting searchers who are looking for the kids on their advertising posters.  They were founded by folks with long criminal histories, including "impersonating a police officer".  Children they "help find" are never found.

They seem to be organizations which latch on to these high-profile cases (and VERY vulnerable families), ride the gravy train (raffles, shirts, bracelets, donations, etc.), and hop off undetected.  If terminating the Trust means handing out the money to these shady, almost "Travelers"-type organizations, there's a big incentive for the Trustee(s) to keep the Trust going indefinitely even if the Trust balance dips below $5,000.

So frankly I don't think that its certain that the Trust has a balance in excess of $5,000.

P.S.  The Never Lose Hope Foundation website address ("parked FREE on GoDaddy.com") currently contains links to advertising partners of GoDaddy.com, including a direct, permanent link to "The Sexy and Seductive GoDaddy Girls - Danica and Candice" and Candice's photo gallery (Candice was featured in "Playboy's" April 2006 issue).  Not exactly what I'd consider an appropriate choice for an organization which claims to want to protect children...

Thanks for posting.  I was in elementary school during the "remember and retype" years so I was clueless to what you were referring to.  I am guessing you typed everything out. Thanks for mentioning that. 

However, my post had ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation.

You brought up the language of the Trust in your post, and in fact directly pointed us to #2 in the Trust, which contained the references to "KidFinders" and "Never Lose Hope Foundation".

I am referring to the link above, page 1...listed under #2.

2. PURPOSES.  ... such as the "Kid Finders Network" and the "Never Lose Hope Foundation",

I considered your emphasis on #2 in the Trust to mean your post had something to do with the language in #2 in the Trust, which included the mention of "KidFinders" and "Never Lose Hope Foundation".  Please be more clear in the future if you emphasize a portion of a document but do not mean to be referring to the portion of the document you emphasized.

I was referring to the specific items in the trust agreement for the purpose of MONEY ISSUES FOR CAYLEE'S BURIAL ONLY.  Please do not "pick" with me about harmless things that I have mentioned about the trust.

The additional stuff about KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation was to point out how the balance in the Trust could be quite low and yet the Trustee(s) still were choosing not to terminate the Trust.  You appeared to be claiming that the Trust had more than $5,000 in it because it had not been terminated, yet this is clearly not supported by the language of the Trust.

From the Ants decision to use that particular funeral home, there may not be very much money in the Trust, and the Trustee(s) may be loath to terminate the Trust when the beneficiaries of the Trust funds (KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation) are such lowlife scum.  Their scamming techniques make them anything but "harmless".

None of us know how much money is in that Fund, all i'm saying is it can and should be used to bury that baby.  That's it. 

I was simply pointing out that the language of the Trust both did not make certain that a balance of more than $5,000 currently existed in the Trust, and that the language of the Trust in #2 (which you pointed to first, in your original post) gave good reason for the Trustee(s) to keep the Trust going indefinitely, even if the balance hit $1.

[no rose colored glasses]

I think they should have someone in the room while the Anthony's are at the funeral home viewing Caylee's remains. People take pictures of the dead all the time at funerals. Usually the funeral director's aren't present much when family is viewing a body though so it would be possible that they could take pictures. Would the Anthony's be able to view the remains whenever they wanted?

I just did not know that people take pictures of the dead at funerals. I have never even given it a thought. But Caylee's remains are just bones, I cannot understand why one would take pictures of this, and what would be the interest of selling pics of just bones.

No Rose, most people don't do it anymore, but taking pictures of dead people in their coffins at the wake by the family and particularly dead baby pix was a tradition with the Scots-Irish. The dead baby pix were often displayed above the mantel and were the "centerpiece" in the LR. W PA was settled by the Scots-Irish and it is hard to go to an antique auction at a homestead that has remained in the family in most of the small farming towns (wide spots in the road) that doesn't have at least one dead baby in the coffin photo, maybe some photos from Grandpa's wake too.

Thank-you, I just didn't know this, and I was surprised, something like that was never done in my family.

[Lucinda]

Hi everyone, i have no idea of the latest updates.  Can someone in a quick nutshell tell me? Has the As been arrested yet?  Love Lucinda

[perriwinkle]

Oh jeez....  Another hold-up.

[QuietMonkey]

FOR ANYONE INTERESTED, TRUTV HAS BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE CASE AND MORE INFO IS COMING UP!!!!


And Sea, I LOVE Elvis!!! More about that later!!!!! 

  Mornin' Monken ! 

OMG! SeaSearcher you changed clothes! I almost didn't recognize you! You decided to come back on shore, where's your captains hat? You need a monkey somewhere in that pic with Elvis.

[NewfieMonkey]

O/T

JodyO - You have solved a family mystery.  My ancestors were from Glasgow ... we have all these pics of deceased ancestors that have been handed down for generations.  We younger generations had kind of decided that our ancestors were just off their rockers!  I'm calling all my sibs and cousins this weekend to let them know ... ancestors were sane ... we're okay!   

[kitkat53]

I think they should have someone in the room while the Anthony's are at the funeral home viewing Caylee's remains. People take pictures of the dead all the time at funerals. Usually the funeral director's aren't present much when family is viewing a body though so it would be possible that they could take pictures. Would the Anthony's be able to view the remains whenever they wanted?

I just did not know that people take pictures of the dead at funerals. I have never even given it a thought. But Caylee's remains are just bones, I cannot understand why one would take pictures of this, and what would be the interest of selling pics of just bones.

No Rose, most people don't do it anymore, but taking pictures of dead people in their coffins at the wake by the family and particularly dead baby pix was a tradition with the Scots-Irish. The dead baby pix were often displayed above the mantel and were the "centerpiece" in the LR. W PA was settled by the Scots-Irish and it is hard to go to an antique auction at a homestead that has remained in the family in most of the small farming towns (wide spots in the road) that doesn't have at least one dead baby in the coffin photo, maybe some photos from Grandpa's wake too.

Thank-you, I just didn't know this, and I was surprised, something like that was never done in my family.

We are Irish so maybe that is why I am used to seeing these kinds of pictures and used to seeing it being done at funerals of loved ones.

[JodyO]

I think they should have someone in the room while the Anthony's are at the funeral home viewing Caylee's remains. People take pictures of the dead all the time at funerals. Usually the funeral director's aren't present much when family is viewing a body though so it would be possible that they could take pictures. Would the Anthony's be able to view the remains whenever they wanted?

I just did not know that people take pictures of the dead at funerals. I have never even given it a thought. But Caylee's remains are just bones, I cannot understand why one would take pictures of this, and what would be the interest of selling pics of just bones.

No Rose, most people don't do it anymore, but taking pictures of dead people in their coffins at the wake by the family and particularly dead baby pix was a tradition with the Scots-Irish. The dead baby pix were often displayed above the mantel and were the "centerpiece" in the LR. W PA was settled by the Scots-Irish and it is hard to go to an antique auction at a homestead that has remained in the family in most of the small farming towns (wide spots in the road) that doesn't have at least one dead baby in the coffin photo, maybe some photos from Grandpa's wake too.

Thank-you, I just didn't know this, and I was surprised, something like that was never done in my family.

I've seen people at auctions rummage a box of old photos and frames, pick up the dead baby one which at first glance appears to be a sleeping child, and absolutely freak when they realize the "sleeping" child is eternally asleep in a casket!

[Shan1628]

Hi Fuzzball, your post are ALWAYS interesting.  However, the trust fund that was set up called "Help Find Caylee Marie" trust has the money in there from donations to bury Caylee. 

This is the link to the four page trust http://www.docstoc.com/docs/2937600/HELP-FIND-CAYLEE-MARIE-ANTHONY-TRUST-AGREEMENT

It will not let me copy and paste so I am referring to the link above, page 1...listed under #2.

Also, in reference to "no money in the trust fund"  please see page 3 of the above link, listed under #9.  That the Trust can be terminated IF the balance falls below $5,000.  I am not aware of the trust that I am referring to being terminated. 

The wording is "may be terminated if the balance falls below $5,000", not "will be terminated if the balance falls below $5,000".  Using the old MSDOS system of "cut and paste" (i.e., "remember and retype") from the four page trust:

9. TERMINATION.  This Trust and Agreement shall be irrevocable but may be terminated at any time by the Trustee(s) at such time as the purposes hereof shall have been fulfilled or should the balance in the trust account fall below $5,000.00 then the Trustee(s) is/are authorized to terminate the trust and hold the funds for the benefit otherwise stated herein.

The fact is that due to the language of the Trust, we cannot assume, because the Trust has not been terminated, that a balance over $5,000 is present in the Trust.  The Trustee(s) may have simply not terminated the Trust with its potentially sub-$5,000 balance, as it is entirely up to the Trustee whether or not to terminate the Trust on even, say, a $100 balance.

I can think of a good reason why the Trustee(s) may not want to terminate the Trust (again with the 1980s "remember and retype" method of "cut and paste"):

2. PURPOSES.  The primary purposes of the Trust Fund will be to pay general expenses relating to the location and recovery of Caylee Marie Anthony, as well as general expenses of the burial and estate administration of Caylee Marie Anthony, should she be deceased.  Any funds remaining in the Trust Fund upon completion of the purposes designated herein, will be donated to the organizations that have assisted in the search and locations processes for Caylee Marie Anthony, such as the "Kid Finders Network" and the "Never Lose Hope Foundation", or to any other such organizations such as the Trustee(s) deem appropriate and consistent with the designated purposes as stated herein.

"Never Lose Hope Foundation" sold a bunch of $20 raffle tickets for a new Ferrari back in September, and was due to have a live drawing on their website on October 1st, 2008.  Two weeks prior to October 1st, the NLHF website went "The site is under construction being updated" and is currently "being parked FREE by GoDaddy.com" (see "P.S." at the end of this message for more info).  The raffle tickets themselves did not contain contact information to find out the results of the raffle from an alternative source, so anyone who purchased a raffle ticket got conned out of $20 by the NLHF (ironically making many lose hope that they will ever get their money back).

"Kid Finders" seems to spend its time raking in donations and angrily confronting searchers who are looking for the kids on their advertising posters.  They were founded by folks with long criminal histories, including "impersonating a police officer".  Children they "help find" are never found.

They seem to be organizations which latch on to these high-profile cases (and VERY vulnerable families), ride the gravy train (raffles, shirts, bracelets, donations, etc.), and hop off undetected.  If terminating the Trust means handing out the money to these shady, almost "Travelers"-type organizations, there's a big incentive for the Trustee(s) to keep the Trust going indefinitely even if the Trust balance dips below $5,000.

So frankly I don't think that its certain that the Trust has a balance in excess of $5,000.

P.S.  The Never Lose Hope Foundation website address ("parked FREE on GoDaddy.com") currently contains links to advertising partners of GoDaddy.com, including a direct, permanent link to "The Sexy and Seductive GoDaddy Girls - Danica and Candice" and Candice's photo gallery (Candice was featured in "Playboy's" April 2006 issue).  Not exactly what I'd consider an appropriate choice for an organization which claims to want to protect children...

Thanks for posting.  I was in elementary school during the "remember and retype" years so I was clueless to what you were referring to.  I am guessing you typed everything out. Thanks for mentioning that. 

However, my post had ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation.

You brought up the language of the Trust in your post, and in fact directly pointed us to #2 in the Trust, which contained the references to "KidFinders" and "Never Lose Hope Foundation".

I am referring to the link above, page 1...listed under #2.

2. PURPOSES.  ... such as the "Kid Finders Network" and the "Never Lose Hope Foundation",

I considered your emphasis on #2 in the Trust to mean your post had something to do with the language in #2 in the Trust, which included the mention of "KidFinders" and "Never Lose Hope Foundation".  Please be more clear in the future if you emphasize a portion of a document but do not mean to be referring to the portion of the document you emphasized.

I was referring to the specific items in the trust agreement for the purpose of MONEY ISSUES FOR CAYLEE'S BURIAL ONLY.  Please do not "pick" with me about harmless things that I have mentioned about the trust.

The additional stuff about KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation was to point out how the balance in the Trust could be quite low and yet the Trustee(s) still were choosing not to terminate the Trust.  You appeared to be claiming that the Trust had more than $5,000 in it because it had not been terminated, yet this is clearly not supported by the language of the Trust.

From the Ants decision to use that particular funeral home, there may not be very much money in the Trust, and the Trustee(s) may be loath to terminate the Trust when the beneficiaries of the Trust funds (KidFinders and Never Lose Hope Foundation) are such lowlife scum.  Their scamming techniques make them anything but "harmless".

None of us know how much money is in that Fund, all i'm saying is it can and should be used to bury that baby.  That's it. 

I was simply pointing out that the language of the Trust both did not make certain that a balance of more than $5,000 currently existed in the Trust, and that the language of the Trust in #2 (which you pointed to first, in your original post) gave good reason for the Trustee(s) to keep the Trust going indefinitely, even if the balance hit $1.

You are correct.  Thanks for pointing out my mistakes. 

[klaasend]

Zenaida's attorney is arguing his points, why she deserves to clear her name and not wait.

[3babiesmommy]

I think they should have someone in the room while the Anthony's are at the funeral home viewing Caylee's remains. People take pictures of the dead all the time at funerals. Usually the funeral director's aren't present much when family is viewing a body though so it would be possible that they could take pictures. Would the Anthony's be able to view the remains whenever they wanted?

I just did not know that people take pictures of the dead at funerals. I have never even given it a thought. But Caylee's remains are just bones, I cannot understand why one would take pictures of this, and what would be the interest of selling pics of just bones.

No Rose, most people don't do it anymore, but taking pictures of dead people in their coffins at the wake by the family and particularly dead baby pix was a tradition with the Scots-Irish. The dead baby pix were often displayed above the mantel and were the "centerpiece" in the LR. W PA was settled by the Scots-Irish and it is hard to go to an antique auction at a homestead that has remained in the family in most of the small farming towns (wide spots in the road) that doesn't have at least one dead baby in the coffin photo, maybe some photos from Grandpa's wake too.

Thank-you, I just didn't know this, and I was surprised, something like that was never done in my family.

Sorry but this may sound creepy.  I grew up in the funeral home business.  My GP's and uncles were morticians and owned a local funeral home.  Many familes did take photos, mostly the older relatives.  It was not uncommon to see that.  If the photos were taken, it was from those that looked well preserved. If the A's did take any pics, there is some serious pathology going in the sick little minds.

[NewfieMonkey]

Hi everyone, i have no idea of the latest updates.  Can someone in a quick nutshell tell me? Has the As been arrested yet?  Love Lucinda

Hi Lucinda ~ goodness are you up in the middle of the night?  I never know what time it is there!

No arrests yet ... Monkeys are all watching the hearing on FOX Orlando right now.

[Sassycat]

O/T

JodyO - You have solved a family mystery.  My ancestors were from Glasgow ... we have all these pics of deceased ancestors that have been handed down for generations.  We younger generations had kind of decided that our ancestors were just off their rockers!  I'm calling all my sibs and cousins this weekend to let them know ... ancestors were sane ... we're okay!   

That's funny!!

I wish I had an explanation for some of the nuts in my family's history!

[Sea Searcher]

Zenaida's attorney is arguing his points, why she deserves to clear her name and not wait.

Do you have a video link that works...I tried WFTV but it won't load for me 
TIA

[Golden Oldie]

IMO, you're 100% correct.  Last night, it was pointed out on Greta's show that there is no crime in knowing where a body is and not telling anybody.  That would mean that in this case, someone(s) had their hot little fingers in the pot.
[/quote]

Greta is incorrect (like thats a big surprise) that it is not a crime to know where a body is and not report it, and specifically that it is not a crime in Florida to know where a body is and not report it.

Florida State Statute 406.11 and 406.12.

406.11  Examinations, investigations, and autopsies.--

(1)  In any of the following circumstances involving the death of a human being, the medical examiner of the district in which the death occurred or the body was found shall determine the cause of death and shall, for that purpose, make or have performed such examinations, investigations, and autopsies as he or she shall deem necessary or as shall be requested by the state attorney:

(a)  When any person dies in the state:

1.  Of criminal violence.

2.  By accident.

3.  By suicide.

4.  Suddenly, when in apparent good health.

5.  Unattended by a practicing physician or other recognized practitioner.
...
...
8.  In any suspicious or unusual circumstance.
...
...
10.  By poison.
...
...
406.12  Duty to report; prohibited acts.--It is the duty of any person in the district where a death occurs, including all municipalities and unincorporated and federal areas, who becomes aware of the death of any person occurring under the circumstances described in s. 406.11 to report such death and circumstances forthwith to the district medical examiner.  Any person who knowingly fails or refuses to report such death and circumstances, who refuses to make available prior medical or other information pertinent to the death investigation, or who, without an order from the office of the district medical examiner, willfully touches, removes, or disturbs the body, clothing, or any article upon or near the body, with the intent to alter the evidence or circumstances surrounding the death, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

It would take a complete idiot (or a co-conspirator in a murder) to assume that the death of an otherwise healthy child, whose dead body is inside a cooler or plastic trash bag, was not the result of "1.  criminal violence", "2.  By accident", "4.  Suddenly, when in apparent good health", or the catch-all "8.  In any suspicious or unusual circumstance" (such as "shortly after having been declared missing, presumed kidnapped").

The punishment in Florida for a first degree misdemeanor is "up to 1 year in prison" and "a $1,000 fine.".  Since the family had run through Cindy's life savings already, Lee had lost his job, and George was/is equally unemployed, these penalties are substantial.


[/quote]

Thanks for the "correct" info.  Now, I'm beginning to wonder if I misunderstood Greta & her two attorney guests.  Klass said she was going to watch it.  Maybe she can verify what was said.    Again, Thanks!       

[klaasend]

Zenaida's attorney is arguing his points, why she deserves to clear her name and not wait.

Do you have a video link that works...I tried WFTV but it won't load for me 
TIA

Try here - the picture is no good but the sound is great:

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=7943664&version=19&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

[JodyO]

O/T

JodyO - You have solved a family mystery.  My ancestors were from Glasgow ... we have all these pics of deceased ancestors that have been handed down for generations.  We younger generations had kind of decided that our ancestors were just off their rockers!  I'm calling all my sibs and cousins this weekend to let them know ... ancestors were sane ... we're okay!   

Since the Scots-Irish are just Scots transplanted to N. Ireland, it only makes sense that they brought with them the tradition of photographing their dead and then brought it to this country with them. I have no idea why they were obsessed with funerals and their deceased relatives, but, it's a fact they were. Thank goodness, the creepy tradition has "died" with current generations.

[Shan1628]

Zenaida's attorney is arguing his points, why she deserves to clear her name and not wait.

Do you have a video link that works...I tried WFTV but it won't load for me 
TIA

it's on http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=7943664&version=19&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

[Sea Searcher]

OMG! SeaSearcher you changed clothes! I almost didn't recognize you! You decided to come back on shore, where's your captains hat? You need a monkey somewhere in that pic with Elvis.

Brandi only had time for a quickie last night...I didn't want to pressure her for more and I'm grateful for what I got... 

[seemeatthebeach]

Zenaida's attorney is arguing his points, why she deserves to clear her name and not wait.

Do you have a video link that works...I tried WFTV but it won't load for me 
TIA

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=7943664&version=19&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1