Kyron Horman, 7 years old, PORTLAND, OR #35 11/11/10 - 11/21/10

[Gypsy DD]

ITA HelloKitty.

I just can't beat a wounded person..and all these people have been wounded...not to mention the extended families.  I would never want to have to be in their position.

They obviously keep giving interviews to keep Kyron's name and face out in the public. And hoping that someone somewhere will come forward with the info they need to solve this case.

I am fascinated by LE returning to search SI.  Don't know if they are there today..but I bet they are.  Makes me wonder besides the cell pings...if Terri ever mentioned anything to someone about water or SI in relation to her harming Kyron.

[no rose colored glasses]

ITA HelloKitty.

I just can't beat a wounded person..and all these people have been wounded...not to mention the extended families.  I would never want to have to be in their position.

They obviously keep giving interviews to keep Kyron's name and face out in the public. And hoping that someone somewhere will come forward with the info they need to solve this case.

I am fascinated by LE returning to search SI.  Don't know if they are there today..but I bet they are.  Makes me wonder besides the cell pings...if Terri ever mentioned anything to someone about water or SI in relation to her harming Kyron.

I asked that a few days ago, that maybe in one of those emails something was said that was suspicious about the island and the water.

[sebastian]

Sadly, I think this case is going to get uglier before it gets better. Poor Kyron. There are so many things about this case that is so different from another case that I watched up close and personal. The first odd thing to me, is that LE spent the first night that Kyron was missing with the Hormans. Why were they not talking to the media then, when the iron was hot? It has always been my understanding that the first 24 hours are the most crucial. Why were they not begging the media to put up his photo immediately? Did LE already know something that early on, that would negate going public? Secondly, I do not understand KH's immediate email to Intel employees. That would be THE LAST thing on my mind, if in fact, he was trying to do some sort of damage control? The ONLY thing on my mind would be to locate my missing child. Third, KH's attempt to control the media. Too many family members of missing kids would beg for any and all media attention and yet KH is kicking some of them out of press conferences. It makes little sense to me.

TH only cares about TH. That is a given. Her actions are deplorable. The fact that she still remains mum speaks volumes. I am still not 100% convinced of her guilt, but regardless, the woman makes me physically ill.

My heart breaks for Desiree. I think KH had something to hold over her head all of these years or else I think she would have taken KH back to court for custody of Kyron. The other alternative is that she knew KH would fight her tooth and nail and she did not want Kyron to be drug through the mud.

I feel for all of these parents, if in fact, none of them had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance. This is a horrific nightmare for anyone to go through. I just don't understand the reasons for too many of their actions. JMO

[Tracygirl]

cw, I see what you are saying with the word hostage, I still see it as being not the best choice of words to express yourself.

 "I’m not going to hold myself hostage for this event that happened to him"

IMO, IMO, IMO: Sounds disconnected, sounds selfish, sounds like Kaine is more concerned
about thinking about himself and how this is affecting Kaine than being concerned for the
"event" (strange word to use) that happened to him (can't even say Kyron...he didn't use
the word Kyron in his note to Intel employees either).

There is a disconnect.  It does seem strange.  It does make me think about his words.

Me too

[Tracygirl]

Kaine could not be thinking clearly. How could he ? Who could be in this situation ?
He needs to stop with his hammering on TMH in the divorce and elsewhere.
His function IMO is to keep the search alive, do the dirty laundry in the privacy of his own home and with his therapist. Taking snipes at TMH in public, well it just makes him look bad.
I have no clue what LE is doing, maybe they don't know either. That GJ  ?? they didn't make any arrest for the MFH, how long can that GJ sit with either a yes or a no ?
..
He has to think about a. ) why am I in front of this camera ?
KYRON.   
I don't even know if making any appeal to anyone who took this boy would do any good, but maybe someone has one piece of info that might ding something in their brain, like the details that are on the posters LE put up, the vehicle, where she was seen, etc.

Kat Gram  - your post has made me think of something - Have we ever hear Kaine make an appeal for who ever took Kyron to bring him home or to come forward?  (I'm sure there must be something....)

I remember in a presser he appealed for DeDe to come forward and give answers or he was going to take her to civil court.

But has he ever appealed to "the person who took Kyron"?

[Tracygirl]

Posting from my iPad is a challenge, I see.     I am having trouble quoting so I will just comment what I can remember. Lol.

In a nut shell I think that Kaine has always had little man syndrome and this may come from his family dynamics. He may have also been sexually abused as his brother claims to have been by the grandfather. 

While I never pretended to care for Kaine, I tried to give him some leeway because of this EVENT he has said has happened to Kyron. I see Kaine as a very controlling manipulating man who will not take orders or be one-upped by anyone and especially by a woman. His words were most likely an attempt to appear to not be personally affected by Desiree with her public admonishment of him. Also, if he were to admit feeling guilty in his mind that is exactly what Desiree wants him to feel. He also would be empowering Terri, because she
hoped to hurt him by harming Kyron( if she did as he claims). 

So if he does not admit to making stupid choices, then he doesn't accept the guilt and he WINS.  In his mind anyway. He will win at any cost.   Just my opinion but that's what I see.

If Kaine believes Terri is just trying to hurt him (or win) perhaps he can try saying, "I give up".

[Tracygirl]

GypsyDD there was another interview done, I think CBS, that Kaine says he will not be held hostage.

[Tracygirl]

Sadly, I think this case is going to get uglier before it gets better. Poor Kyron. There are so many things about this case that is so different from another case that I watched up close and personal. The first odd thing to me, is that LE spent the first night that Kyron was missing with the Hormans. Why were they not talking to the media then, when the iron was hot? It has always been my understanding that the first 24 hours are the most crucial. Why were they not begging the media to put up his photo immediately? Did LE already know something that early on, that would negate going public? Secondly, I do not understand KH's immediate email to Intel employees. That would be THE LAST thing on my mind, if in fact, he was trying to do some sort of damage control? The ONLY thing on my mind would be to locate my missing child. Third, KH's attempt to control the media. Too many family members of missing kids would beg for any and all media attention and yet KH is kicking some of them out of press conferences. It makes little sense to me.

TH only cares about TH. That is a given. Her actions are deplorable. The fact that she still remains mum speaks volumes. I am still not 100% convinced of her guilt, but regardless, the woman makes me physically ill.

My heart breaks for Desiree. I think KH had something to hold over her head all of these years or else I think she would have taken KH back to court for custody of Kyron. The other alternative is that she knew KH would fight her tooth and nail and she did not want Kyron to be drug through the mud.

I feel for all of these parents, if in fact, none of them had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance. This is a horrific nightmare for anyone to go through. I just don't understand the reasons for too many of their actions. JMO

I sebastian, nice to see you!

[can]

Sadly, I think this case is going to get uglier before it gets better. Poor Kyron. There are so many things about this case that is so different from another case that I watched up close and personal. The first odd thing to me, is that LE spent the first night that Kyron was missing with the Hormans. Why were they not talking to the media then, when the iron was hot? It has always been my understanding that the first 24 hours are the most crucial. Why were they not begging the media to put up his photo immediately? Did LE already know something that early on, that would negate going public? Secondly, I do not understand KH's immediate email to Intel employees. That would be THE LAST thing on my mind, if in fact, he was trying to do some sort of damage control? The ONLY thing on my mind would be to locate my missing child. Third, KH's attempt to control the media. Too many family members of missing kids would beg for any and all media attention and yet KH is kicking some of them out of press conferences. It makes little sense to me.

TH only cares about TH. That is a given. Her actions are deplorable. The fact that she still remains mum speaks volumes. I am still not 100% convinced of her guilt, but regardless, the woman makes me physically ill.

My heart breaks for Desiree. I think KH had something to hold over her head all of these years or else I think she would have taken KH back to court for custody of Kyron. The other alternative is that she knew KH would fight her tooth and nail and she did not want Kyron to be drug through the mud.

I feel for all of these parents, if in fact, none of them had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance. This is a horrific nightmare for anyone to go through. I just don't understand the reasons for too many of their actions. JMO

Maybe they spent the first night there in case it was a kidnapping and a call would come through. 
for all we know Terri might have put that out as a theory.

[sebastian]

Sadly, I think this case is going to get uglier before it gets better. Poor Kyron. There are so many things about this case that is so different from another case that I watched up close and personal. The first odd thing to me, is that LE spent the first night that Kyron was missing with the Hormans. Why were they not talking to the media then, when the iron was hot? It has always been my understanding that the first 24 hours are the most crucial. Why were they not begging the media to put up his photo immediately? Did LE already know something that early on, that would negate going public? Secondly, I do not understand KH's immediate email to Intel employees. That would be THE LAST thing on my mind, if in fact, he was trying to do some sort of damage control? The ONLY thing on my mind would be to locate my missing child. Third, KH's attempt to control the media. Too many family members of missing kids would beg for any and all media attention and yet KH is kicking some of them out of press conferences. It makes little sense to me.

TH only cares about TH. That is a given. Her actions are deplorable. The fact that she still remains mum speaks volumes. I am still not 100% convinced of her guilt, but regardless, the woman makes me physically ill.

My heart breaks for Desiree. I think KH had something to hold over her head all of these years or else I think she would have taken KH back to court for custody of Kyron. The other alternative is that she knew KH would fight her tooth and nail and she did not want Kyron to be drug through the mud.

I feel for all of these parents, if in fact, none of them had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance. This is a horrific nightmare for anyone to go through. I just don't understand the reasons for too many of their actions. JMO

I sebastian, nice to see you!

Hi Tracygirl!
I have missed you guys! I love your new avatar! Tooooo darn cute!

[no rose colored glasses]

That could be, the police at first thought it was a kidnapping. If that is the case wonder what evidence or statements that may have let the police to think that, if indeed that is what they thought. Otherwise wouldn't know why the police would have stayed at the house, maybe they thought Kyron had wondered away?

[Tracygirl]

http://www.katu.com/news/local/109138704.html?tab=video

".... But, I don't hold myself responsible and I am not going to hold myself hostage for this event that happend to him."

He was referring to "people" wanting to place some responsibility for this on him. He is rejecting the idea of any responsibility due to the fact that Terri hid real feelings from him and didn't show him the real Terri. He calls her a master at deception and redirection and there is no way he could have predicted this.

He is being defensive, in my opinion. He is down playing as he has done before Desiree's feelings and opinions. He is directing everything towards Terri.

The only thing I would like to know about the emails is, who did Terri write these emails to and what context was the email, meaning intention of the message of her alledged hatred towards Kyron. Was it to appeal for help, such as "help me I have these feelings and don't want to hurt him but know I will eventually do something to him", OR "I don't know what to do, I hate this child and I wish he would just disappear, I know someday I am going to just kill him" OR was it done to get as sisstance to help rid Kyron, such as "I hate this kid and want him gone, I need help disappearing Kyron".

[sebastian]

Sadly, I think this case is going to get uglier before it gets better. Poor Kyron. There are so many things about this case that is so different from another case that I watched up close and personal. The first odd thing to me, is that LE spent the first night that Kyron was missing with the Hormans. Why were they not talking to the media then, when the iron was hot? It has always been my understanding that the first 24 hours are the most crucial. Why were they not begging the media to put up his photo immediately? Did LE already know something that early on, that would negate going public? Secondly, I do not understand KH's immediate email to Intel employees. That would be THE LAST thing on my mind, if in fact, he was trying to do some sort of damage control? The ONLY thing on my mind would be to locate my missing child. Third, KH's attempt to control the media. Too many family members of missing kids would beg for any and all media attention and yet KH is kicking some of them out of press conferences. It makes little sense to me.

TH only cares about TH. That is a given. Her actions are deplorable. The fact that she still remains mum speaks volumes. I am still not 100% convinced of her guilt, but regardless, the woman makes me physically ill.

My heart breaks for Desiree. I think KH had something to hold over her head all of these years or else I think she would have taken KH back to court for custody of Kyron. The other alternative is that she knew KH would fight her tooth and nail and she did not want Kyron to be drug through the mud.

I feel for all of these parents, if in fact, none of them had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance. This is a horrific nightmare for anyone to go through. I just don't understand the reasons for too many of their actions. JMO

Maybe they spent the first night there in case it was a kidnapping and a call would come through. 
for all we know Terri might have put that out as a theory.

I always thought that there may have been a ransom note. It is the only explanation that makes sense. Unless Kaine has some super duper high security job at Intel and is holding treasured secrets, I don't know why they would expect a ransom without a note. Most kids are taken by perverts unless of course their parents are millionaires or public figures.

[islandmonkey]

I know everything appears to be pointing too Terri. But there is a part of me that wonders if a person they both know or a neighbor, who is a pedophile could have taken Kyron. Obviously they wouldn't have known this person was like that. From the beginning things just don't all add up for me. It would be interesting to see those emails that are being talked about, but I'm sure that won't happen, and shouldn't.

NRDG~There are times when I think someone else could have done this, especially in the beginning when no one from the family was talking, Kaine and Terri were working out at the gym, and before we had all the info about Terri (which IMO everything except the MFH IIRC came from Kaine and now the emails), I thought is was possible that some volunteer at the school, maintenence worker, janitor etc could have been responsible......then I do agree it could be someone known to Kaine and Terri, and ITA I have never felt this was wrapped up in a neat little package and am having doubts it ever will be What sticks out to me is LE and the tunnel vision and granted the vast majority of the time it is a family memeber involved, BUT what if this isn't the case this one time????? Granted Terri H looks guilty as the cat who ate the canary but one reason is the MFH, but that sting didn't work out the way they expected so it seems Kaine acting on what LE tells him or even on his own has gone to an extreme to decimate her character while wanting to protect his own (and let's be honest, nobody is an angel and he couldn't even admit that what he did when cheating on Desiree was wrong, he justified it and we know she was devastated by this first betrayal). So, again IIRC he skirted that issue about the affair until Desiree spoke and spilled the beans, he to my knowledge has never admitted how he and Terri met (so does silence imply guilt???) or going out on a weak limb here, what if she isn't involved but has already been tried and found guilty in the court of public opinion, I can in all honesty understand her silence........that being said I do think she is involved, but don't think he left the school with her. I was just posting  more what if's and show how IF she had nothing to do with the "event" that I can understand her behavoir in not testifying. It reminds me somewhat of the Danielle Van Dam case to a degree where the parents did have an alternate lifestyle (but I can't remember if they were upfront and honest about it), but IMO they let the monster in unwittingly, and while nobody is responsible but the moster that murdered her, I can only imagine the guilt and what ifs they must have felt by knowing if they locked the door, her murder might not have taken place

Also NRCG, her had to have known she had major issues since she was sleeping WITH him while he was married to Desiree and again IMO that is an affair and cheating morally and in the eyes of the law, I also remember his hand on her boob in certain pics, the wedding in bathing sits where she got trashed, yet he was a part of that too.......so, why the double standard like when they both went to the gym and she was crucified for it, it was almost like he wasn't even there, yet he was in gym/workout clothes and lastly he knew she was passing out and leaving Kitty awake after midnight with nobody watching her as Terri slept, so what kind of parent does that make him?? Sorry, it doesn't look like he was very involved, and I am certain he had no clue what she was capapble of but should have known that there was an accident waiting to happen with what we read in the sworn affadavit.

Right now Desiree is the only one I trust, but again she only knows what went on in the home from Kaine, and that Kyron didn't want to go back so I am sure she formed alot of opinions of what she thinks happened, but what does she know for certain other than the emails??

[islandmonkey]

hi monkeys... i have a questipm, did kein go to the gym in the first weeks of his dissapereance

Somewhere there is a picture of both Kaine and Terri by their car at the gym. I think it was very early on.

thank you, no rose, i was talking with my hubby about kyron and my 8 year old girl made a comment abot terry writting on fb about her kitty and then she going to the gym with the kid is missing..and then she told me that kaine was in the gym too....then she asked her dad if he will go to the gym if she is missing.. ......
i thought that kh didn't go to the gym...my kid was right....

The gym they went to that day was a collection point for the food and items being donated fro the searchers.  They may have been there to help with that and thank people.

Could be, but he was in workout clothes and IIRC carrying a gym bag......I can't imagine going to the gym with my child missing, but if LE told them to try and do this for some reason I can see that they would, but again the double standard that everyone knew Terri was there and so few remember Kaine was too...so, again why was only Terri criticized?

[islandmonkey]

http://www.katu.com/news/local/109138704.html  Here is the link to the article.

TY NRCG.

I watched both the GMA and CBS interview and I didnt hear him say he did not feel responsible anylonger.  I guess I heard differently then this reporter.

It's there, I don't hold myself responsible and won't be held hostage around 1 minute in the video........I think CBS has a longer interview. I agree it is possible about the PTSD, but I can't give a pass for the insensitivty to Desiree when she too is suffering, and has been betrayed (more than once), and she must feel guilt too, so that is my problem. I don't think it's about picking his words apart just to do it, for one it's about the contradictions in his interviews lately and the sworn affadavit and the family dynamics which could have led to Kyron's disappearance. At least for me it is.

[no rose colored glasses]

I know everything appears to be pointing too Terri. But there is a part of me that wonders if a person they both know or a neighbor, who is a pedophile could have taken Kyron. Obviously they wouldn't have known this person was like that. From the beginning things just don't all add up for me. It would be interesting to see those emails that are being talked about, but I'm sure that won't happen, and shouldn't.

NRDG~There are times when I think someone else could have done this, especially in the beginning when no one from the family was talking, Kaine and Terri were working out at the gym, and before we had all the info about Terri (which IMO everything except the MFH IIRC came from Kaine and now the emails), I thought is was possible that some volunteer at the school, maintenence worker, janitor etc could have been responsible......then I do agree it could be someone known to Kaine and Terri, and ITA I have never felt this was wrapped up in a neat little package and am having doubts it ever will be What sticks out to me is LE and the tunnel vision and granted the vast majority of the time it is a family memeber involved, BUT what if this isn't the case this one time????? Granted Terri H looks guilty as the cat who ate the canary but one reason is the MFH, but that sting didn't work out the way they expected so it seems Kaine acting on what LE tells him or even on his own has gone to an extreme to decimate her character while wanting to protect his own (and let's be honest, nobody is an angel and he couldn't even admit that what he did when cheating on Desiree was wrong, he justified it and we know she was devastated by this first betrayal). So, again IIRC he skirted that issue about the affair until Desiree spoke and spilled the beans, he to my knowledge has never admitted how he and Terri met (so does silence imply guilt???) or going out on a weak limb here, what if she isn't involved but has already been tried and found guilty in the court of public opinion, I can in all honesty understand her silence........that being said I do think she is involved, but don't think he left the school with her. I was just posting  more what if's and show how IF she had nothing to do with the "event" that I can understand her behavoir in not testifying. It reminds me somewhat of the Danielle Van Dam case to a degree where the parents did have an alternate lifestyle (but I can't remember if they were upfront and honest about it), but IMO they let the monster in unwittingly, and while nobody is responsible but the moster that murdered her, I can only imagine the guilt and what ifs they must have felt by knowing if they locked the door, her murder might not have taken place

Also NRCG, her had to have known she had major issues since she was sleeping WITH him while he was married to Desiree and again IMO that is an affair and cheating morally and in the eyes of the law, I also remember his hand on her boob in certain pics, the wedding in bathing sits where she got trashed, yet he was a part of that too.......so, why the double standard like when they both went to the gym and she was crucified for it, it was almost like he wasn't even there, yet he was in gym/workout clothes and lastly he knew she was passing out and leaving Kitty awake after midnight with nobody watching her as Terri slept, so what kind of parent does that make him?? Sorry, it doesn't look like he was very involved, and I am certain he had no clue what she was capapble of but should have known that there was an accident waiting to happen with what we read in the sworn affadavit.

Right now Desiree is the only one I trust, but again she only knows what went on in the home from Kaine, and that Kyron didn't want to go back so I am sure she formed alot of opinions of what she thinks happened, but what does she know for certain other than the emails??

I can't remember about the Van Dams, I know there was just vicious talk about the parents on the radio though, and they didn't do a thing to their beautiful little girl. There are so many sick individuals out there, that I'm not closing my mind to the possibility that a very sick and disturbed individual took Kyron. All I know is that if that was my spouse and he had a DUI he would never be driving my kids anywhere, nor would I trust him to watch the kids, but that is me.

[islandmonkey]

One more theory then I have to finish some work at home, I am thinking it's possible that after Kitty was born Terri could have felt overwhelmed partially due to PPD (IF she did indeed have it, but IIRC I thought KH stated she did), and her feeling overwhelmed by taking care of three kids and only 2 were hers made her resent Kyron even though that is illogical I am just tossing this theory out there, we know she wrote emails about hating Kyron, and talked to Desiree about taking Kyron to live with her, even having Kyron call her when he was upset........so, when she found out Kaine nixed this is it possible she concocted some elaborate kidnapping never meaning for any harm to come to him, but knowing it would have been enough to fuel Desiree to go to court and file for custody instead of just asking Kaine. It would certainly fall into a change in circumstance as she could say the school wasn't safe, etc etc etc.......but something went terribly wrong, and she (Terri) really doesn't know where Kyron is, just that she set a plan in motion. I know it sounds crazy, but am tossing out ideas and after learning what we did this week, this one popped into my head. Prolly not since I am a KISS (keep it simple stupid) type person myself but the KISSS theory didn't apply to Danielle VD, so what do y'all think?


KOKO's CAT~I live one Pensacola Beach, FL and we STILL have the A/C on, grrrr. While I don't like very cold weather as I get older, I would love a few weeks in the 60 degree range so I could open the windows ......

[no rose colored glasses]

I like to keep things simple as well, but sometimes it just isn't simple.

[Kokos Cat]

I agree monchichi about that website...my main point was the restraining order DY filed on KH...before custody and the divorce was resolved.

Yeah, that makes you wonder.  I don't know if that is a standard move in divorces/custody issues.

I have heard ppl say that before, but in TN it wasn't.....for me anyway. Once I learned a few more things after my POS moved out I got an injunction (or I should say my atty did for me) so he couldn't see Ave's, but not an RO. Maybe things are different in Oregon and since someone stated divorce files are public there it shouldn't be that hard to find out (here, believe it or not they are not public....even in the Sunshine state~go figure)

Hi guys, sorry this was pulled from waaaay back in the thread...

Restraining orders are not that easy to get in Oregon.  The spouse has to be afraid for THEIR life, or be beaten, etc.  You can't get a typical RO to protect your children, either.  I tried.  The judge told me flat out, that I could not, only if I was afraid for my own life.  When I asked him what I could do protect my daughter, he said, "File for divorce and get a custody order in place."

So... for DY to get a RO protecting her from KH?  There had to be some physical violence or threats of physical violence against her at Kaine's hand. 

Kokos Cat: You are confusing a restraining order (RO) with a protection order (FAPA). Only a FAPA RO requires the threat of abuse or physical harm. The restraining order is a routine filing with a divorce that prevents the removal of the children from the current home. It does not prevent contact with the children.

http://www.co.cowlitz.wa.us/clerk/dvprot.htm

Thanks Nicubird!