Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

You all know the rules

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/InHonorofNatalee.jpg)

H'OKAY.

Ok, give me a bit to create this new map.  I need to look up some stuff first.  :wink:

Is there anyway we can determine if Julia Renfro is scientologist or if she was just a scientific experiment born of Roswell.

No problemo.  Thanks Klaaas.

Smooth, Klaas.  Can you let Red in on your secret?   :lol:

I vote a failed experiment.   :!:

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Yep, One big Hempy Island.   :roll:

.
It is 100 degrees with heat index of 106 officially.  Usually this is a few degrees lower than my digital thermometer says.  Going out to change the Scottie's water and wading pool to try to get it cooler water a they get too hot being black with thick coats and they refuse to be inside for they will miss something important they think.   :?

BBLater but will look for any more statement analysis.  Deepak's was not finished I don't think.

.

Ouch!

BBL2

Now wouldn't that be an interesting turn of events if Ren Froe was also a Scientologist?

Hi Monkeys ~ just a quick pop in to say hello...  What's up?

Tylergal,

Dang you know I would have to add something about Julia.. I have heard that Air travel for Julia is out of the question. Under the care of the animal behavioral specialist Julia is packed in a custom steel shipping container designed for violent primates and sent by truck or ship when she comes to the States... It was made in Rwanda and was once used to transport rabid silver back gorillas. None of those pet carrier from PetsRUs are no good as she required one where although she must remain crouching the animal can completely turn around in it. With the cost to drop ship her and rent the container (AND clean it afterwards--PHEW!)..  She also likes to stay at hotels that says RATES BY THE HOUR and the daily rate was in the center of a heart. Don’t ever stay in a motel where the price is in the heart of the city..  Byeeee, its hard to break bad habits, I'm working on it..

Anyone have a link or two to the statement analysis that I see mentioned?

Who else is one?

Go to page #23 of last thread, and read, read, read.  There is a lot to be read and digested.

:lol:  :lol:

Greta.

Don't bother... priceless.

I'll pop back to see if there are any answers posted after I get up from my hour or so nap before work....  laters everyone!

You'all were very much in my thoughts and in my prayers at Mass today...  Even if I'm not here ~ you know that I don't forget anyone...

Besides reading through the previous threads I have the statements in their own thread:

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=160

Terry, you crack me up!   :lol:   Mister, you have a devilish sense of humor that tickles my fancy!

Thank you very very much Tyler ~ I'll pull the page up now for reading when I wake up ~ thank you so very much again!  {{{hugs}}}  Tyler!

Greta.

She is a mutation... back to Ramirez.. ) I always think of the Night Stalker ). One of the nice Aruban posters's godfather is Mr. Ramirez.
Angela from the Cyberzone is way too old ( 30 ) to be a child of Nadira.
( guessing about just over 40 ish )

 :roll: Oh yeah  ~ that is true...  I wonder if there's a link....  interesting if there was...

Thanks Ono!

Thank you very much Klaas ~ I'll pop open that page too and leave them both in my "dock" for later reading...

Angelina's birth records indicate she is 30.  Looks like she has been rolled hard... never mind. :wink:

Kat, I thought I read that Angelina was "like a sister" to the Kalpoes.  Perhaps a stepsister, but not Nadira's daughter.

You're welcome Katz...don't know very much about that cult but what I do know is disturbing.

Before the Kalpoe's stepfather purchased the Internet Cafe, did Angelina own it or just manage it?  Anyone remember?

I just saw the stamps and stuff...

Wow ~ we can design our own postage stamps!!!!!!!!

Way cool ~ thank you for making those, Klaas....

 :D I might just be sending out more mail .....

And there is that big load of Christmas Cards that we all send out...  cool beaners!

Thanks Kat... info on the Karpool Brothers is hard to get.  Re Angela of Cyberzone... I'm not saying sister --- I'm saying related somehow.  Did this nice Aruban poster share any more about Mr. Ramirez?  Remember early on it was discussed that he owned an auto import place... we later thought this might be how Deepak could have switched out the headliner in is Karpool Mobile during the 10 day headstart given by ALE.  TIA

And yeah, Beaners ~ you're cool too!  {{{hugs}}}

Okies ~ I just got back from hanging out with my neice and my nephew's girlfriend in the pool...  I really do need a nap before work tonight...

Bye everyone!

You know, Frijole, I'm suspecting that Deepak switched out the whole car.  Don't know exactly how or when, but I think when the evening got "messy," they were not driving Deepak's car but another silver Honda.

What about hotels that rent by the quarter hour. ? And then change the sheets daily means that they change them with the sheets in the next room ? I stayed in a place like that once. There was a fierce storm and we had to get off the road. I remember there was a bare lite bulb
hanging down. Everything was really yukky. But it wasn't raining in the room which was not much bigger than my bathroom.  :o

Ramirez is much younger than Nadira, so I am thinking it is yet another illegitimate child of Nadira or her mother's late-life illegitimate child.

Seems to me she just managed it and didn't Hammer discover or comment on the fact that the owner before Ramierz was an American ???

Thanks Katz.   8)

I think the whole car was switched out too.  Maybe a Nissan ?????

ARUBA, la maison de prostitution et dope en atmosphère extérieure.l

Could be.. who knows?!!  I"m just finding it very weird that Deepak mentioned cleaning his car out before going out that night.  

1.  Strange time to clean a car
2.  Even stranger to be sure to mention it in a police interrogation

Seems convenient... why bother if it wasn't his vehicle?

ZLADY, s'il vous plait, please return to former thread and read from 23-39 (I am groveling) and offer your opines.

You can say that again! :lol:

Klaas, I wonder if you could start a thread where we could put all the things Jordan actually said (not was said about him but actually came out of his mouth from this statement and his TV interviews).  I wonder if you could do it for:

The Pus2s
The K2s
Mama Sloot

5 Individual threads, then we could compare them to their own statements and others statements.

I think this would really help but I know it's a lot of work.

So, you think Angelina might also be Nadira's child?  That would be a stepsister of Kalpoe's, perhaps with different father.  Interesting.  Does she live in the same home with Nadira and Ramirez and the 2K's?

I think we have their new advertising slogan!

I can see cleaning before going out but after returning that same night is way too suspicious in a normal setting.

No, they hardly saw them after the marriage. It is odd how he managed to stay out of the limelight. At first, and this is just blog stuff, it was reported that he had a car import / export business. One thought that came to my mind was that someone could have been put in a trunk of a vehicle and left the Island that way.

ROTFL! :lol: I love it.

What about a child of the stepfather or the k2s father?

Okay, since you ask so nicely and in French!  I was hoping to just be lazy and jump in right here, but I'll read back.  See ya all in bit.

I think this also ties in with the sand Joran said he got in the car.

My understanding is that both Karpool brothers have different fathers and that a younger child, the "sister", is the product of Nadira's current relationship with Ramirez (marriage, if you will).  Is it possible that Angelina of Cyberzone is yet another child of Nadira?  It is interesting that Satish stayed so long in Surinam with Nadira's mother.  Was that another surprise to Mr. Ramirez once locked in, in holy matrimony. :roll:

Have we ever seen Deepak's stepfather?

I believe he was the one protesting his "grounds" (home) be interrogated by TES, and was on TV with Greta around that time.

I remember him one time at the house early on..standing outside... no other memory...

I don't find the cleaning of the car that unusual, I do the same with mine.. I have a lot of habits that I do that others might find odd.. I keep my tollet lid down, I make my bed every morning and I have cleaned my house in the middle of the night, so I could goto sleep in a clean house.. I think maybe thats one of the reason that my current girlfriend and I don't see each other, I wouldn't let her eat in my car..  I do live with a large yellow lab but she is pretty clean except her hair that she leaves everywhere..

No wonder Joran seemed popular, he could get kids in a club for free, even younger ones, after all, he said he asked that 16 yo to go with him that night but her dad said no.

I can't imagine why a dad would say no to that, after all, she is underage and it is a school night.  I wonder what his opinion of Joran was?  Maybe someone can interview her and her dad.

OK - so would you clean the car before AND after going out? Remember midnight-ish is before and 2 to 3 am is after?  Curious...

terry, if you ever need a place to stay, and you're in my area.....

So when I hear stuff about Deepak cleaning his car, I think thats kinda normal for me.. I would never be someones taxi or allowed another friend to pickup someone so he could makeout in the back seat of my car, even when I was younger..

Drats...I missed it.  Who does he resemble in the face? Angelina ?

It may just be internet rumor, but Lorenzo is supposed to have an import/export company.  Most likely the goods are drugs, but I remember the company was alleged to be located at the port.

Did you get a good look at his facial features?  Maybe Angelina is his sister?

Well, I used to be fanatic about my house, and then I underwent psychiatric treatment for that after I realized three boys, one man, a male cat and a male dog were not as fastidious as I was about it.  In fact, right now I cannot sit on my patio for looking at the mess my husband has in the breezeway and I refuse to clean it, but will hire my gardener to clean that mess up.  He has coopted my beloved French gardening bench as a tool bench and has decided the garbage can container that I Had built so garbage cans could be neatly tucked away in their own house out of public view, can be used to store trunks of crap that no one will ever use or want to see again.  I need another visit with the psychiatrist or he does, not sure which one of us.

Its really scary when you remove the facade of Aruba and look at the real Aruba.. I think most American's that have been there must now know why they always had their hair on the back of their neck raised, it wasn't the cool ocean breeze...

Well, perhaps not, but Deepak later tells us this is not the first time he has taxied around Joran's American tourist pick-ups.  So, does he cherish the car or does he cherish Joran's crumbs from the sexual encounters, or is he just a voyeur?

Okay, so you're a Virgo...LOL!  But, Terry, after a night out 'on the town' do you clean your car at 2:30 a.m. (or whenever) if nothing unusual happened inside that car?  Wouldn't you wait until the next day?

TylerGal,

My wife used me to get my daughter to clean her room.. If you don't clean your room, I'm going to let daddy clean it..

Yeah Terry?  And I'm a Virgo too --- my house shows it... but not my car.  lol

I'm off for a bit as I have to watch Big Brother to see what the Evil Will manages to get away with tonite... will be back later to see what else we can disect from these statement.  It's been fun all.

Ono,

True story, a friend bought a new boat and we all were excited because we could go diving off of it.. Well he didn't like us getting water in his boat so after we would come out of the ocean, he made us used the towel to dry up the water we dropped in the boat.. It was kinda funny, we all just looked at each other and wonder if he really knew he had a boat..

Ummm....a person having a much younger husband is not necessarily a bad thing. :oops:  :oops:

My parents used to have a lot of houses that they used to rent and my Mother was kinda the business person when a renter would come by about a house.. While my Mother talked to the person my Father would look inside their car to see if they kept it clean, well if it was clean then my Dad would give the OK to rent to these people..  They figured if they didn't keep their car clean, they wouldn't take care of their renter property..  I understand about kids but there is different clutter...

Oh, Lord...hahahaha ~  I wonder if he is still that way now?

Deepak's route had them driving around the block two or three times then up West straat seeminly towards the VDS residence:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RouteSatalite20.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RouteSatalite14.jpg)

Joran's route has them going around the block but then going past Karma and turning right..then turning right again towards the hotels.  I guessing on the KARMA location:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RouteJoran1.jpg)

Remember in Deepaks spoke of driving past La Cabana and putting the porn video in the DVD player.  Natalee didn't like it.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/arubamapHolidayInn.jpg)

It actually makes more sense based upon both Deepak's and Joran's statements that they did not head towards the VDS house but drove up LG Smith towards the hotels passing by La Cabana.

 :lol: This is hilarious.

I'm beginning to think Satish had more to do with this then Deepak.. Deepak is a pooser and has zero class.. I think he might even be a little mentally slow because of some of the stuff he says..  I think we gave him more credit than he deserves..  He relies on validation from others for his self worth.. "He looked over to Satish, to see what he should do? Satish just looked back and said just drive"..  

Satish is someone that needs to be looked at more..  Him and Joran might be the main players here..

Terry, I feel the same way about cars, if your car is cluttered and messy, so is your house.  Of course, I do exempt mothers who are running a home from a car who transports kids back and forth to school, to play, etc.  I always had lots of odd shoes or socks, empty potato chip bags, etc., in my car either from one of my own or one who was riding to football, baseball, swim meet, library, or wherever.

Yes and maybe a little worsed..  This was only a few years ago.. Very hyper...  I try to stay away from him as much as possible..

Do we know who is going to be on Dana's show?

Well, for one thing, right off the bat, Deepak circling the block even once was just totally weird, just for starters....and anybody can quickly fasten a seatbelt in the blink of an eye....seatbelt/police excuse pretty lame.  Maybe he was trying to make up his own mind as to whether or not he wanted to be implicated in Joran's kidnapping fiasco that night and was thinking about bailing out, so he runs around the block several times deciding?? Maybe they were all arguing in Dutch or the other language?

BTGirl,

I know we are supposed to have something on Fox Line Up tonight..

Oh. no...he hasn't chilled out ?? He IS a case...no fun.

Thanks, Terry. :D

Joran tells they were speaking in Dutch or Papiamento, but I believe Dutch, and that Natalee could not understand them.  I think had it been Papiamento with her understanding of Spanish, she would have been able to understand a good bit of that, so I prefer to think it was Dutch.

That first of all was very rude, criminal implications aside.  Just speaks to the lack of manners by this big roughian who looks like Frankenstein.

I thought I read that he was going to have someone from someone's blog in addition to the George Reeves story, but I can't find that again.

Right now he is running a re-play of the bank shootout from last week.

Yes, the similiarity between Spanish and Papiamento/Portugese is truly easy to detect and translate.  I agree...they used Dutch for the nitty gritty stuff...Wonder if they first tried the Papiamento and she caught on ??  Very RUDE to converse in another language in front of people who speak English...I hate that.

As far as I know only the George Reeves story.  The blog thing you read was incorrect.

Ono, I am still thinking about the "white rental car" that was following them, as being the reason they "kept driving around."  Did the white rental car indicate some of their friends from another place, perhaps Columbia or Venezuela was following them and partaking in this, as it would be necessary for someone from those parts to "rent a car," as they could not drive it through the Caribbean.  How could you tell from looking in your rearview mirror that a car is rented.  I believe that was changed back in the 1990s when ne'er do wells were able to detect tourists by the "rental sticker" and all car companies went to a smaller way of recognition.  As we rent Enterprise cars when we travel, I can say the sticker is quite small, placed on the rear bumper with a very small "e" on it, so that it can be recognized by perhaps someone traveling behind it up very, very close but not from a distance.

Evening Monkeys....

Is Beth on the LINE UP tonight?

Special shout out to BT...

How you doing girl?

I just have to tell you about this post from another site from MR..

"Medley can only share this -- Deepak is back at the Cyberzone and seems to be doing well - he was very nice to me. I also met his mom who is working for a secruity firm - she was very nice also. I think they are doing better now - but I also hear it was very rough for them. "

Ok this lady was fired for padding the checks from customers and now they have her working at a security firm..  ONLY IN ARUBA does that make sense..

Don't you have to be bonded to even be a rental cop??? The more I learn about that island, the more I just have to shake my head and think that there are a lot of lucky Americans that have escaped and hopefully there will be less Americans that go to that corrupt little island..

Hi Jacqueline. I'm doing good, thanks, except for working to hard.

How about yourself?

Great, thanks...... :lol:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/CarPlatesAruba.jpg)

You have three main suspects still telling different stories and yet they are totally innocent.. ONLY IN ARUBA.. I walked, Deepak picked me up, Satish Picked me up, Paulus picked me up..  So all the above are true in Aruba...

CyberZone Seller To Ramirez

Ono writes: "Seems to me she just managed it and didn't Hammer discover or comment on the fact that the owner before Ramierz was an American ???"

1.  Seller to Ramirez was Lloyd Selwyn Hickinson.  At time of sale, Hickinson lived in Seroe Blanco neighborhood on Aruba.  There was speculation on thread when first ID's last September, that Hickinson was British, based on his name and the way it sounded, though this was never confirmed.

2.  The sale was registered w/ Aruba Chamber of Commerce on August 29, 2005.  Based on date and previous listing in C of C registry, it is clear that Hickinson was owner of Cyberzone throughout 2005 (until sale) and before.  Therefore, he remains an extremely important person to talk to, as he would have to know what was being transmitted from the servers that are on premisis and/or accessed.

3.  Cyberzone is and was a Digicel WIFI hotspot.

4.  Transaction Value: Without benefit of balance sheet and therefore no visibility re: debt and book value, I had long ago attempted to ascertain a range of sale price.  This was based on detailed analytics attached to CyberZone business which included (primarily) providing Web access to tourists, developing marketing and other communications for local buisness, providing print and re-pro services, providing web-design, and finally providing confectionary.  Based on seats and desktops available and determining  from business hours as posted, and using access $rates posted, and factoring available staff as manpower to handle other business needs.  I had estimate Cyberzone would turn approx $400K per annum.  Based on this, and not necessarily an ideal way to estimate, we can use revenue multiple as sale range factor.  I used 0.5 to 0.6, as merely a retail store front w/ few hard assets (machines are likely leased) and zero intellectual property.  Sale was estimated at $250k before deducting for debt and other encumberances.  (ALL of the above presumes there was no hidden asset problem, or liability, attached to transfer and is based on a straight revenue assumption -- therefore, there could of course be numerous items which could significantly reduce (debt, eg) or increase (long term contracts w/ big clients, eg) sale value and price.)

5.  Bondia posted after my posts re: above and indicated transaction was a "cashless sale."  I posed then it was an "asset swap out" which drew no reply.

6.  Standard due diligence process on sale of most smaller businesses reuires lead time to review documents and track business results and execution to ensure nothing is hidden that would represent a great unknown liability to a legit buyer.  Typical process is 75-90 days (about the same time to close on residential home purchase).  Working backward from sale register date at Aruba C of C of 8/29/05 and using 90 day lead time, you arrive at 5/29/05.

.

Hey Tylergal and all Monkeys!  How are you?  In Aruba you can tell if a car is a visitor or a local as the rental cars license plates begin with V and license plates from cars from locals begin with an A.

But would you be able to see this in your rearview mirror at night?  Is the license plate with that indication located on the front of the car?

Aruba rental cars:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RentalCar1.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RentalCar2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RentalCar3.jpg)

MissinNat, thank you for the information.  Good to see you.  Is that tag located on the front of the vehicle, the back or both?  Thank you.  Hugs to you.  Been Missing MissinNat.

Hi Tyler!

That is true, I don't know if you could see it at night.  It is probably on the front and rear license plates.

Good observation!

Missin

Thanks, Klaas.  In other words, it's just a rolling disaster, awaiting some local or interloper to mug and rob tourists.

Thank you, Tyler!  I lurk but often don't speak.  A lot of the rental cars, have nothing on the side doors, etc.  

Good to see you too!

Missin Nat & Tyler. lol

I think that John Q. Kelly has a lot of questions to asked when he get to the Happy Little Hooker Island.. I'm going to watch some tv and do some work but the happy little face on Aruba seems to be falling off and its from the research that you guys do..  I know at first we didn't want the ALE to bring to court against these suspects but I wish they would.. I know about double jeopardy but I believe it will be the only way of getting the information that Natalee's family want.. I don't believe they ever was going to bring this to court, unless you mean the one where they pay off the killers..  At least Aruba bring this case to court and show what you have or don't have.. The suspects are already free, I'm sure they can't be any more so..  

Then maybe John Q. Kelly can get some of the records, I'm not sure even if they closed the case if he can get them.. I think he might have a better chance if the case goes to court, even if they lose the case.. It can't be any worse than it is now.. Just my opinion..

Tyler, my house is neat and clean,and today before I picked my son up from a sleep over I stopped to vaccum out my car. I found in the back seat: numerous potato chip and candy wrappers, several empty power ade bottles. Two pair of cleats, about 3 dirty socks, a baseball belt and an athletic cup.... and I do not mean the kind that you drink from..... :roll:
And my car went to be washed, and detailed last weekend, so I can attest to the truth in this..... :wink:

Hey I know about kids so I think there is a different type of clutter with kids then someone that just tosses old beer cans, cigarettes vs baseball gloves, tennis shoes, school books and etc..  Different clutter, I had a kid and when she comes, her clothes is everywhere..  I tell her to keep it in one room and she does, I blame it on the dog.. I tell her Starla will eat her clothes if she leave them where she can find them.. Poor Starla..

Cubbee, I Had a friend my same age who waited until she was almost 40 to have daughter.  Never was a hair out of place, or a dish unwashed.  Five to six years after she had her daughter, she admitted:  "I used to wonder how you could lose so much stuff, like shoes and socks, shirts, etc, at your house and now I know.  We have looked for a new pair of shoes that our daughter wore one time to dance lessons, had them on when she got in the car, and we have never seen them since and been through our cars, her friends' cars and our garbage.  Where do these things end up?"

I told her, "sometimes in other people's cars who throw them away accidentally, because we mothers and children live in our cars more than our homes nowadays but in my experience I have found that washers eat socks."

Well...maybe they made that story up in hopes that somehow they could link that 'mystery car' to the pretend mystery villians who supposedly found Natalee after Joran left the beach shoeless ? He thought that he could somehow weave a mystery stalker/via car into the mix in order to save his skin? I'm inclined to not believe that bit about the white car.  And the 'rental' description is peculiar.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:
My son always says that you can tell he does not litter, just look in his room and he is right.... :wink:

 :lol: I don't even believe that.

I've always thought the 'rental' car was just a 'white herring'.

Hey , I have one of those sock monsters. We do live out of our cars, in fact last week when my a/c went out it was not a big deal during the day as we were mostly in the car during that time.....

I think it is in a way, a white herring, Ono & Carnut, but there was a specific reason for the car being white and rented.  Not sure what the significance of that is, but I would like to find out who had a white rental unit that night.  I think there is someone onto which they are trying to place blame, someone specific.

Wasn't something said once about a "white Jeep"?

It appears that the majority of rental cars available there are Jeeps, which kind of makes sense given the terrain.

One of the plethora of witnesses or possible witnesses was supposed to have seen a White Jeep at the beach, or something like that.

It can't be any MB kids because there is no way, even in Aruba, that a rental company lets someone under 25 behind the wheel.

My first thought was that they were going to insinuate Mountain Brook students rented the car.

To quote Lala's, "are you my Doppleganger?"

Ya know, Pickup trucks are usually rode hard and put away wet.

Here's a coupe of shots of the interior of my 77 Chevy Pickup that I bought new in 77.

Took the pics a couple of years ago and it was about the dirtiest it's ever been.

Interior Pic (http://carnut.com/cgi-bin/_image.pl?/iown/77pkup/77pkup2.jpg)

another  Interior Pic (http://carnut.com/cgi-bin/_image.pl?/iown/77pkup/77pkup3.jpg)

Hammer:

Thank you very much for that information...it's very vital to this picture I think.  Yes...that name does sound as though he is a Brit...(I was close..LOL!)

Okay, Tylergal, I didn't get far reading, but I started to my own analysis.  Here you go.
============================================

On June 9th 2005, at approximately 12.00 hours, we the reporting officers interviewed as suspect in this the man named: Joran Andreas Petrus van der SLOOT, born in Arnhem, Netherlands on August 6th 1987, no profession student (International School of Aruba) and living on Montanja number 19 on Aruba.

His statement was made in dutch and was transcribed by me, JACOBS, and goes as follows.

Before we, the reporting officers, started the interview, I, JACOBS, informed the suspect that he was not obliged to make a statement and that this interview would be recorded on tape.

Although I have been informed by you that I under no obligation to make statements, I am still willing to make a statement in accordance with the truth.

On Sunday, I do not remember the date any more, I went at approximately 16.00 hours, to the "Excelsior Casino" at the Holiday Inn Hotel to play "Texas Hold'm poker". (with this the suspect is talking about May 29th 2005). I went with my father named "Paul van der SLOOT" to the casino. I went to play "Texas Hold'm Poker" with my father. It is a poker game in which you get 7 cards and you have to make a card combination with your best (5) cards. You get 500 U.S. $ of fake money and with this money you play. Joran is careful to tell us he was not technically “gambling.”  This is a detail he was coached to include.  I was done sooner than my father and I went and hung around in the casino. When it was half time of the game my father wanted to go home to go and babysit my ten year old brother. We know this is a lie as the boys were with Anita.  He’s covering for his father.  At my father's request I sat in for him and played "Texas Hold'm poker. I am not sure as to when half time was but I think it was between 19.00 and 20.00 hours. I kept on gambling until I lost too. This was according to me until 21.30 to 22.00 hours. I went to walk around in the casino and after that went to the "Blackjack" table to play blackjack. He offers many details when lying but when telling the truth (I went to play blackjack) he does not supply the detailed description.  While I was sitting at the table the girl "Natalee" that is missing now to the blackjack table together with her friends. When the English speaking girls came to the blackjack table they introduced themselves. I do not remember the names of the girls anymore but they were from the same group of students that Natalee belonged to. This actually happened, but he doesn’t supply details, and claims he can’t remembers names.  According to me the friends of Natalee played blackjack but Natalee didn't. A girl that was sitting at my left side on the table asked me in English if I could help her play blackjack because she had lost U.S. $ 360,= of her father's money. The girl bet U.S. $ 20,= in the game and I helped her win U.S. $ 100,= with it. After the girl had won U.S. $ 100,= I advised her to call it quits but she wanted to continue. I told her again that she should stop and her friends also said that she should stop. Probably the girl after that went to cash in her chips for money. The girlfriends of the girl asked me if I was going to "Carlos & Charlies" that night. I told them that I couldn't do that because I had school tomorrow. The girls kept insisting that I should meet them at "Carlos & Charlies" because it was their last night on Aruba. After they kept insisting I agreed to meet with at "Carlos & Charlies". I don't know that name of the girl but I remember her from a photo in the newspaper on which Natalee was printed on the left side of her friends and the other girl was on the right side of the friends. This girl is the same girl that sat at my left side at the blackjack table. After this I told the girl that it was OK and that I would do my best to go to "Carlos & Charlies". This is a great deal of attention and detail to a casual exchange of probably two or three sentences between them.  I suspect this is elaborated or actually made up.  After that the group of girls walked to the Sportsbar. In the Sportsbar I also saw to two acquaintances who were watching baseball. Apparently Joran followed the girls to the Sportsbar.  I greeted my two acquaintances and told them that I was doing fine too and that I would be going to "Carlos & Charlies" that night. My two acquaintances are named "Luis" and "Joshua". I regularly meet them at Carlos & Charlies. The last name of Luis is "BETANCOURT". I do not know the last name of Joshua. Luis BETANCOURT is a Venezuelan and according to me Joshua is Colombian but I don't know that for sure. Joran’s attention to nationalities seems to be a way he establishes status. After that I walked next to the group of girls and they said to me that I should not forget to go to Carlos & Charlies. I told that that I would do my best. The girl who stood printed on the right side in the newspaper told me that she was going to take a shower and that she would then go to Carlos & Charlies. I did not make an agreement with the girl as to how late I would meet them at Carlos & Charlies. Again, an unusual amount of detail about a conversation that was probably no more than 30 seconds. Joran seems determined to create the impression that the girls want or desire to be with him.  After that I walked outside through the casino and when I got outside I called my father from my mobile phone which has the number "REMOVED" on the mobile phone of my mother. My mother has a mobile phone with the number "REMOVED". I called my father on that phone because my mother was outside of the country and my father had her phone in his possession. When I called my father it was approximately 23.00 hours. I told my father that I was ready and if he could come and pick me up at "Mc Donalds". After that I had called my friend "Jaime CARASQUILLA" on his mobile phone. I do not know his phone number from memory but I have programmed his mobile phone number in the memory of my mobile phone under the name "Beto". I asked Beto what he was doing and whether he wanted to accompany me in going to Carlos & Charlies. Beto answered me that he was doing nothing but that he could not accompany me to Carlos & Charlies because he had to go to work the next day. Beto works with a transport company but I do not know the name of that company. After that I called Deepak KALPOE and asked him what he was doing and if he wanted to come with me to Carlos & Charlies. Deepak told me he was closing up "Inex" and that he would accompany me to Carlos & Charlies because he didn't have to go to work the next day. Joran has communicated with four separate male friends to join him at C&C’s that night.  Was he taking advantage of the fact that this was the American girls’ last night?  Is this what he was communicating to his friends?  We know they pick up Americans at C&C’s for raping on their last night on Aruba.  It sounds as if Joran is issuing invitations to an impromptu party.  Deepak told me that he would be going home first to take a bath and that after that he would come and pick me up at my place. Deepak's nickname is "Tupac". Deepak has a mobile phone with the number "REMOVED". I walked through the Hyatt parking lot where they have a Coca Cola vending machine and there I bought a can of coke. After that I walked to Mc Donalds and had bought a Mc Flurry there. At 23.00 hours my father came to pick me up at Mc Donalds. I am not sure about the time because I never wear a watch. This is Joran’s excuse or explanation for not getting the time right in his many stories.  It saves him from accountability.
To your question as to where my mobile phone is, I answer that it is at home. My mobile phone is on my desk in my room.

To your question whether I have a girlfriend, I answer to you that I had a girlfriend. After this happened I told my girlfriend what had happened and she wasn't happy about it. My girlfriend's name is "Elaine" but I do not remember het last name now. I do not know the address where Elaine lives but I can point out her house to you. Elaine is Aruban and she studies at the Colegio Arubano Oranjestad. A few weeks ago she and her fellow students went to Venezuela. She now is in class V-4 on the Colegio Arubano and she is 17 years old. Elaine has a mobile phone, but her name is under the nickname "Fishy" in the memory of my mobile phone. This is obviously a “new” girlfriend as he doesn’t even know her last name.  I don’t think this is a relationship in the sense we think of boyfriend/girlfriend, but simply the last girl with whom he had sex.

I have to say that I have another girlfriend now. Her name is "Florencia METZ". She just graduated from the Mavo and lives behind "Codemsa". Her friends and acquaintances call her "Flor". I do not know the number of her house but I can point it out to you. Flor has a mobile phone with the number "REMOVED". Flor is from Argentina and I talk dutch with her. Why does he bring this up?  Is he asked about a new girlfriend?  If so, then I wonder about the line of questioning.  If not, then he is attempting to build his image, his machismo, to the police officers.  This new girlfriend is from Argentina which most likely provides a higher status on Aruba than an Aruban girlfriend would have. He appears to be portraying himself as someone the girls all want and like.  He goes into great detail to explain how the American girls are practically begging him to go to C&C’s, but he doesn’t know their names.  These two girlfriends are obviously not relationships, but social accessories, as he doesn’t know much about them.  The details included are superficial and don’t indicate a personal relationship with either “girlfriend.”  The kid has a real problem with depersonalization of others and a serious need to promote his own social status.

After my father came and picked me up at Mc Donalds we drove home. I took a shower. After that I had gotten dressed again and according to me at approximately 24.00 hours, Deepak and Satish came and picked me up at home. Before they came and picked me up I had called Deepak to ask where he has and he told me that he was on his way. At approximately 00.15 hours the three of us left for Carlos & Charlies. (with this Monday May 30th is meant; comment Jacobs). I have to say that I also called Flor and asked if she wanted to come to Carlos & Charlies. She answered that she wasn't allowed to go from her dad. Flor is 16 years old.  However, he told us his “girlfriend” on May 30th was Elaine. So why call Flor?  Was she supposed to act as the bait for the American girls much like Stefy did on Bailey Ann’s last night in Aruba?  This is a well-practiced routine and calling Flor to help was a part of it.  However, luckily for Flor, her Dad wouldn’t let her out that night.

To your question as to what clothes I was wearing when I was picked up by Deepak and Satish, I can answer the following. I wore a white/blue shirt, a blue/white jeans trouser or a three-quart black trouser and a couple of white shoes or crème coloured boots. I do not remember now what underwear I was wearing. I do not remember how Deepak and Satish were dressed. Details are not significant to Joran unless he is making them up to suit his own purpose or to communicate his superior social standing.  Whenever we read details that Joran has interjected, it is generally a lie and created for a reason.  I didn't tell my father that I was going to Carlos & Charlies with Deepak and Satish. I hadn't asked my father for permission because he would most likely refuse and usually I ask permission from my mother. This is interesting because it indicates that Joran and his father are not close, and Joran expects his father to deny him permission.  However, this is not a significant issue to Joran.  It's interesting to me that Joran is protecting his father after he is arrested, but he has little regard for his father as an authority figure.  In fact, he tells us here that he just goes around his father as an authority, either by appealing to his mother or simply ignoring his father.To your question with whom I regularly go to Carlos & Charlies, I answer you that I regularly go there with "Freddy ZEDAN" and "Jaime CARASQUIA". Freddy is a Venezuelan and Jaime is a Columbian. The boy named "Koen GOTENBOS" also regularly goes out with us. The names of my three friends are in the memory of my mobile phone. Freddy is under the name "Fefi" and Koen under the name "Cul". These are the rest of the pimps—the boys who regularly go to C&C’s to pick up, drug and rape American women.  Again we see Joran’s identification with nationality as a way to classify people.  I think it is a status thing to these people, and Joran sees American and Dutch at the top of the status chart, with these other nationalities ranked somewhere below.  Continual mention of the nationality of a person places Joran in the social stratus of the island, reminds him of his perceived superiority and other’s inferiority.  Joran has a real problem with status.
After that we drove straight to Carlos & Charlies. Deepak was the driver but I cannot remember now who was sitting beside him. I do not remember now if it was Satish or me. I estimate that we arrived at Carlos & Charlies between 00.15 and 00.30 hours. Deepak parked his car on the parking lot behind Carlos & Charlies and after that we walked into the building of Carlos & Charlies. I don't have to pay because I have a VIP pass. With my VIP pass Deepak and Satish were also allowed in.  Social status reference, again.

To your question as to who gave me the VIP pass to Carlos & Charlies, I answer you that I got it through the office of Carlos & Charlies. I do not remember with the help of who I got the VIP pass. I got to Carlos & Charlies about one to three times a week. He knows exactly how he got the pass and who gave it to him, but he also knows enough not to tell.  He’s communicating that to the police, also.  He’s saying “I have contacts and I know the code of silence, so don’t bother trying to get me to talk.”

When we entered Carlos & Charlies I was greeted by the girl who is printed on the picture. When we got in I saw that Natalee was dancing on the stage/podium. I saw that Natalee wasn't holding a drink. The friend of Natalee said to me to go and dance with Natalee because she fancied me. I took her word for it that Natalee was interested in me. Natalee made hand gestures for me to come and dance with her. I also did not see Natalee with a purse/handbag. She did this about seven to eight times. After I had refused to dance with Natalee Deepak, Satish and myself walked to the bar. Notice the details he includes here.  This is building his own social status.  There we bought a "Yard Whisky Coke". Such a drink costs U.S. $ 12,-. It is a plastic cup and it comes in different colours. I payed for all three drinks. Again, details that relate his social imminence.  He says exactly how much he spent and that he bought all the drinks.  This shows he has money and social status.  I got a red cup but I do not remember now what colour cups Deepak and Satish got. Then the three of us walked back to the stage/podium. While I stood there Natalee saw me again. When she saw me she got down from the stage/podium and walked over to me. She grabbed my hand and asked me if I would go to the bar with her. On the way there she said to me that I had to drink a Jellyshots (handwritten with an arrow pointing to this section of the statement, it says "or body shot") off of her. I at that moment in time did know what a Jellyshot was but I did not know that she went and laid down on the bar and that I had to drink the Jellyshot from her belly button. He is trying to portray himself as innocent here of knowing what and how a Jellyshot is taken.  I also notice that the verb tenses become confused when he tries to explain that he knows what a jelly shot is but not from where he will lick the shot.  It might be the translation, but he doesn’t have this confusion in other areas of this report, so I have to think this is a lie he trying to float at the moment of telling this and attempting to portray himself as an innocent youth.

When we arrived at the bar Natalee asked for a Jellyshot. Natalee then went and laid on top of the metal bar. The bartender handed me a small plastic container/cup in which was the Jellyshot that I placed on her belly button. After I had done that I sucked the Jellyshot from her belly button. Jellyshot is a jello with alcohol in it. I do not know what kind of alcohol is in it. When Natalee got onto the bar I thought that she was drunk. I could clearly tell that Natalee had been drinking. I could smell this from the smell that came out of Natalee's mouth. I also have to say that when I saw Natalee dancing I also noticed that she had been drinking. While I was talking to Natalee Satish stood beside me the entire time.
He’s attempting to build a case for Natalee being drunk, obviously.  Notice the bartender hands him the jellyshot and Joran places it where he wants.  This is a fairly common routine in bars like C&C’s that feature drinking “games” as entertainment.  Joran previously said he goes to C&C's about three times a week.  I don't believe he doesn't know how a jellyshot is intended to be drunk when he's seen it done there at least three times a week.

Ono, I think we are thinking just alike.  It would be interesting to know when this white car was "thought up," and if it was about the same time as the "Alabama kid wanted my cup."  Those two statements are lies dead on their face, but I am thinking that the old maggot patrol was early on going to try to blame it on Natalee's friends.  Of course, that was only possible in the minds of the sick and perverted friends of Anita.

 :lol: Nope..I'm just me.

So true...also tells me that they didn't want Natalee to know what they had in store for her....didn't wanna tip their prey off... :evil:

Evening Monkeys.  I won't even comment on the kids room talk...you should see my daughter's room.  She's trying to move back to college and there isn't a clear spot on the floor.  

What are we talking about tonight?  I am still tired from the late shift.  :lol:

OOPS! Didn't go down far enough to post.  Thanks for the info.

Tyler, you gotta let 'em know who to target!  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:  :shock:

Hi Monkeys.... is anyone else having issues listening to Dana's show?

where are the sneakers?

i do not know BUT

well, i can tell you this in my opinion

the sneakers were used when they were tied to a cage or a body with a
cage or a body that was sunk with something as a TEMPORARY  LOCATION.

joran swims out at night and puts the body out somewhere in the water..not necessarily on the BEACH he says he was on.
but you see, he needs to be able to ALERT the people (PAULUS or others
where the BODY is ) so they can GO and retreive the body later on that night or the next night or the next day. the SNEAKERS are the >marker<
so people will be able to LOCATE the BODY


SNEAKERS FLOAT  8)

What's his topic tonight?  I need to tune in.

Lala's, you worked hard enough in that length of time to last a lifetime.  Great thinking.

AzLady, thank you for that.  I am trying to move some of these great analyses to Klaas' thread.  I finished yours.  I am going to work on Bearly, Anna and Lala's after I feed my husband.  I have to put food I made for lunch on a plate, cover it with paper towel and push the "heat button."   :roll:

LOL.  My Dad insists that you dry the shower stall or tub with the towel after your bath.  My house is clean enough to be healthy and dirty enough to be happy!  I have too many dogs for it to be spotless every day!

http://mms://streams.oncomputers.info/ctalk

Mrs. Red, this link above works.  I'm listening to Dana's show now--he's playing music now.

Don't you wonder why they can't do that for themselves?  My husband can't seem to master that trick, either.

Oh...YES...right off the perverbial bat they were going to do their darndest to try to implicate the Mountain Brookers...easiest and first basic instinct and thought right out of their mental chute.  Still trying..to no avail.

That language trick can backfire LOL.  

A friend of mine told a story recently about how she and a former roommate were standing in line at a store somewhere, with 2 Mexican guys behind them. Her roommate was from El Paso, Texas, and spoke Spanish fluently, but both looked about as American as it gets. The 2 guys proceeded to give a rather lengthy and explicit discourse on the ahem, relative merits and assets of the 2 young women, and concluded with an agreement that each one would "take" a certain one of the girls, according to individual preference. All in Spanish. The girl waited until they were done, then turned aound and greeted them "Hola" and began speaking to them in Spanish. They were so embarrassed that they left the line and took off.

Dadgum, I ordered 2 medium beef pizzas during the Brickyard 400 and now eating the second one and it's just a cheese.

So heartbroken and disgusted.

Hi there, just in case no-one answered this one yet, the licence plates on rental cars all have a big "V" before the numbers on the plate.

How would you know if a white car was following you if you were in traffic?  Wouldn't the same car be behind you all the time?  How would you make a decision to go around again if someone was following you, if they weren't actually following you yet?  Is he the amazing Kreskin?

Didn't Michelle from Michelle says so and Boycott Aruba say she was going to be a " guest ", but Dana didn't confirm that ?
I am going to listen anyway as I like the radio and I always enjoy Dana's show regardless.

Especially at night with it's lights on.

You ever identified what color a car was behind you at night in your rearview mirror? Heck, it's hard enough when they have the flashing lights on top.

Hi again everyone!   :oops: I overslept...  guess I needed it...  so I can't hang out ~ but, thank you all again for telling me about the stuff I missed ~ I'll be reading it either tomorrow morning, when I get home from work ~ or later on, when I wake up...

Have a great night everyone!

AZLady:

You're so right on about Joran's perception of his social status/persona/importance...Just look at all the pictures of him with his arms around everyone as though he is the only key to their social happiness and acceptance for the evening.  It's too bad his hospitality is so perverse.

I am wondering if we don't have a "dead drop" situation here.

It's a setup. They follow Joran. Joran leaves her at the beach and the "unknown" occupants of the car come after him and take her to the "party. Where Joran awaits, or the other Lions. It is a means of deniability... Natalee never really knows who took her off, maybe by the time they get to the "rave" place, house, whatever, everyone has on a mask. She could not have pointed a finger at Joran  if she lived to tell the tale, or the K2 either.

"I don't know these people" makes a LOT more sense in a context like that.

Yes, I believe you are correct, Carnut.  Paulus always did favor a MB connection and even suggested such at one time.  Perhaps the implication is that some of the students rented a car. That mysterious male student with the crush on Natalee that only manifested itself in Aruba??  

 Don't think they can rent a car at that age in this country but this is Aruba after all where no one can accuse them of being "ageists" and anything goes, the younger the better.  

.

Wasn't this white car following them in the reenactment? Someone here once wondered if it was connected to GVC...

Thanks AzLady.... I don't know why I had it in my head that Dana's show was going to be on at 9:00....

Or did he need the laces of the sneakers to tie something up?

I'm back.  My stupid modem keeps dropping me.  I'm listening to Dana now.  Show is just beginning.  He's talking about George Reeves, Superman, whether his death was suicide or otherwise.  Taking a break now, playing some Elvis.

Good point Bearly, although if one up to no good they might be a little paranoid and imagine they are being followed....

Jossy is going to be on after.

The white car following them probably was the rest of the pimps.  Remember, Joran told us in his statement that he told the two guys at Sportsman bar that he was going to C&C's that night.  Then, he called another friend (forget name), in addition to Deepak.  He also called Flor to get her to go to C&C's, too.  He was setting up a little gang bang party and it's no surprise that the occupants of the white car were waiting until C&C's closed and followed Deepak's car to the afterparty.

That phone call haunts me....

Maybe they were "paranoid" thinking of what they were about to do, driving around the block until they were sure no one was following them.

Cubbee, if this ever gets to a real court of law, that phone call is the best evidence they have of kidnapping.  You know the FBI can identify whose voices are on that call.

possible, YES

maybe used the sneakers for BOTH purposes

SNEAKERS FLOAT  - they would make a nice BUOY  :evil:

Or, maybe they were driving around the block several times looking for the white car and its occupants.  In addition to giving the drug time to take effect, they were hooking up with the rest of the gang to then proceed to the after pary.

I agree, sadly that is a big IF at this point. It haunts me to imagine the terror Natalee must have been feeling. :cry:

I'm not.

Jossy will be on later to talk about the civil suit.

Wow, if we think the same things, why didn't ALE?

Evening AZLady and all Monks

Thanks for your analysis of this statment.....I think you are right on target.

I agree.  Koen, Sander, Freddy, Jamie.

 :D Hi Lala's!

"Natalee went inside and she returns about 30 minutes later being led by Deepak."  Did Deepak see the white car, which was his cue to now take Natalee to the car ? Did he give her that last drink or drug to encourage her?  "It was so easy, you would be surprised how easy it would be that night."

You know how we used to cruise Central or Main St. looking for our friends?  Wouldn't they be cruising around C&C's looking to hook up with the rest of the gang and then follow each other to the gang-bang?  They also needed to let the drug take effect, you know.  When Joran and the 2K's were talking to each other in Dutch they were most likely referring to spotting the other guys, the drug taking effect, how to kill time until it did, etc.

Hi Mrs. Red...I just go here and put Dana on...but no problems so far.

THE LINE UP...

DID I MISS SOMETHING???

I agree....

Sunfreak, I have Dana's show fine now... I am excited that Jossy is going to be on!

That's for sure.  :cry:

Do we know if this call was really made?

Nothing on the Line Up yet

Yeah, my latest clue.

I don't know if we are sure or not.... but it seems like most of the monkeys think it's a fact that it was made...I don't know how we know for a fact though...

BOC checking the weather! :wink:

If sporter really left her on the beach and told Deepak via email or phone! I would think Deepak came back and took  advantage of what he only got to watch earlier! Maybe killed her and told Joran she was dead. Both DNA samples could be found in her, so in the beginning they had sex with her and after she was disposed of they did not have sexual relation with her! Deepak could have killed her and told Joran that she ODed!

How does that work out with the time line??

He said a server was down. I went to C-Band Talk radio and am listening on option 4. of his page.

Good Night all....

JMHO, but if they had sex with her and Joran left her, and Deepak came along and killed her, Deepak would be serving time nor or lynched for indicating the VDS in this whole affair.  No, DNA would prove that Joran was the main player here.  Otherwise, Paulus would be shouting from the highest rooftop in Aruba Joran's innocence, his son who had a romantic encounter with a beautiful American girl and this thug interloper came along and killed her out of jealousy.  No, does not fit with my theory at all.

Nite Sunny

Bye my sweet Texas Sunny friend.  I wish you good evening and hope to see you again soon.

I agree Tyler.

Jossy disappointed in the NY Judge attorney as well.

Joran has told one lie after another.  He is a habitual liar.  It doesn't help that the system in Aruba doesn't care if he lies.

Go Jossy, he's talking about the liar.

Hey Sunny.  Are you behaving?

Go Jossy!  He says this guy is a pathetic and habitual liar!  Jossy talking about how the ALE just didn't ask the right questions of Joran.

I think the sporter is the guilty one!!The only option I see were he is not is the one I suggested! He had to make Joran  think he is the quilty one no matter what! Only way Paulus would do the coverup!

Jossy said this guy is a pathetic habitual liar.

Jossy raises a good point... Joran admits that they buried the girl...then tried to lead them to a site... so why isn't that proof of guilt?  why does dompig come out mos. later and say she did drugs?  This is such shxt.

Jossy says the family will not get a fair hearing in Aruba.  It would just be another song and dance, especially if we get that same judge or another one of the same mentality.

If you watch the interaction on TV between the VDS family and the Karpools, it is interesting.

Joran comes out and almost says that Deepak went back.  Then Anita comes on denying they have been friends for long.  Nadira seems to be angry.  Then Anita comes back and says they were good friends and she does not hold the K2 responsible.  Next, one of the VDS family seem to imply Satish is the one who killed her and then you see Anita hedging her bets in that direction, only to be followed by one more interview in which they are "lovely people" and had nothing to do with Natalee's demise.

It appears the VDS want to blame the Kalpoe's but the Kalpoe's are holding the ace in the hole.  It could be a video, it could be a shoe, it could be a necklace. The Kalpoes have something that has saved them from prosecution.  Otherwise, they would be doing time now because they definitely are not in the VDS socioeconomic circle, as AZLady has pointed out so well, Joran holds himself as the very epicenter of their social lives, all things Aruban.  He is the elitist Dutch geek/sporter who knows his way around the USA and Holland, and is only gifting Aruba by his presence.

Jossy said it seemed to be a prepared plan to put an end to this case by this one judge.

JOSSY ON NOW.

Jossy just admitted that the family has no chance succeeding with the same judges on this case.  Can you spell C O R R U P T?

Gosh!  I can't get Dana tonight for some reason...keep me updated, please.

Jossy said with the new police chief it will be more of the same.

HIt the 3rd spot..

Lalas... I couldn't either but try the 4th option... it worked for me.  Someone posted it.... thanks!!!

.
What is the phone number should Dana ask for calls for Jossy.  We should call.  I already have.  But we should not allow Dana to ask for calls for Jossy and no one call in.

We all have plenty of questions.  That's for sure!

.

LMAO... gotta luv Jossy saying Joe Taco is blowing hot air.   :P  :P

Jossy says Joe T is blowing hot air, has been blowing hot air since the beginning  :lol:

Jossy said Joe T. has been blowing hot air from the beginning.  He is trying to make Joran into a saint.

Jossy expects the prosecutor will be back soon.  Dana asking about the new chief of police.  Bernardina plans to leave the corps anytime now.  Something about working as security chief for a big hotel in Aruba.  

Jossy thinks new chief will be more of the same, more or less.  The lack of overtime and number of people does not bode well for them spending more time on this case.

Pictures of Joran and blonde on beach, Dana asks what does the average Aruban feel about seeing Joran thumbing his nose and doing what he wants.  Jossy says he's back to his old habits.  It doesn't look good for him.  He should be more careful, but he's not.

Taco has been open about saying the civil suit dismissal proves Joran is innocent.  Jossy's comments?  Evidence does point to Joran.  He thinks Taco is blowing hot air.  Those of us who know Joran know he has lied his head off, has mislead the police, and we on Aruba have a very different picture of Joran.

.
Heh, heh!  Jossy called Joran a "brat"!

Jossy said he thinks tourism is down between 17-25%.

Jossy confirms that the boycott is working.... and he also confirms all we know about jvds... that the entire island knows he is a corrupt little sob....

Not Jossy's words, I am paraphrasing...

Jossy says he is back to his old tricks, and nothing wrong with that but it reinforces how people feel about him.  

Dana mentioning TacoJoe, saying that the civil suite being dismissed proves Joran's innocence and him having nothing to do with it.  Dana agrees that the answers are still out there, wants Jossy to comment on the guilt, etc, of K2 and J2. Is Taco blowing hot air.

Jossy says Taco is blowing hot air, and anyone from Aruba who knows this boy, no innocent 17-year-old boy, who has misled the police, lied and things that he does do not speak well of a healthy, sane 17-year-old boy.  Arubans have a different picture of Joran which does not comport with Taco's picture of Joran he paints.

Dana wants to know what the negativity has had on tourism.  

Jossy says tourism has been affected, down between 17 and 25%.  He says these figures are closer to the truth but not what government is saying and the reason is because of the way the government has behaved, not wanting to investigate or do anything about the case.

No election, will be 3 more years, theirs are every 4 years like ours.

Have there been any calls for Obuder, governing officials to resign.

Jossy says yes, but not related to the case, increasing duties, taxes, some by 100%.  The general population is starting to feel the sting.  Let it sting, Baby let it sting.  Aruba stinks so sting is good.

Jossy--tourism has been effected seriously and is down 25%.  Has there been a call for the government to resign? A lot of pressure is being put on them related not so much to the case but to other things they've done.  They've raised import taxes, etc.

Did you notice that little slip, too?   :lol:

I love Jossy.  He tells it like it is and doesn't spin the facts.  He knows Joran and has seen his behavior.  There is no sugar coating here.

No offense here as my favorite food next to Mexican is Italian, but do you think when Tacopino blows hot air, it has a smell of garlic.

Good summary, Tyler.  I couldn't type that fast.  I have a toothache tonight and headache, too.  I'm going to call dentist tomorrow.  Anyway, that's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it.

No --- I think it smells like what it is... caca!   :lol:

I am so sorry about both but I would just as soon have burr holes made in my head as a root canal. :lol:

A heavy whiff of something rotten, is my perception.  Garlic, onions, sweat, and lies.

Well I believe you :lol:  :lol:

Thank you AZLady and Tyler for your transcripts.

I can always count on Frijole :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Yes, so when y'all don't think we make a difference - think again... we just have to keep putting pressure on....

and thanks Dana... I love Ray Charles!

More like the acrid stench of burning petroleum products.

I don't know, Tyler, what would someone's breath smell like that kisses butt?

We aim to please.   :wink:

Well, no one is rooting around in my tooth canals.  I'll have the durn thing pulled first.

Larry Garrison.

It's not over until it is over. It is a sad day in hell when the case is thrown out due to jurisdiction.  He will not give up nor will Steph Goode, and he will keep going until someone talks and the trust comes out.

Definitely not a direct quote, but best I could do while trying to drink my Diet Coke and eat my left-over chicken casserole, asparagus, etc.

JOE T is a LOAD of HORSE MANURE  8)

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

what frijole said...

Ray Charles, one of my favorites.  Thanks Dana.

BTW did I hear Jossy call Joran a brat?  Way to go, Jossy.  Sink little island, sink....

ditto, I'm sure...

See I told you I read your posts robots :lol:

I thought he said Dave, too.

I got to the point about one that was canal'd, crowned, pull and had an implant.  Finally, I gave up and had a partial for that one tooth.  I did not want to but after spending enough for two semesters of college tuition or new furniture and days on end in a dentist's chair, I asked my half brother just to pull it.  Of course he did not want to but he agreed to.

LOL, Dana called him Joe Taco.  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Reason #10 why we like Jossy.  :D

Beans is much faster than me!   :lol:

:lol:  :lol:

My ears must be  stopped up...did Dana just call him Joe Taco??

Well, I suppose Aruba won't need to worry about cleaning up those many trash dumps if Hugo is moving in soon.  Their buddy, Fidel, is checking out, but Hugo is waiting to take over.  If they think trash is a problem now, wait until they are known as "Arubatina," Argentina's little playground.

yeppers!  lmao

 :lol:

Dana getting down on Greta.  Woo hoo, whoo hooo.... "it was a conversation..."  "not an interrogation."  Greta saying Joran is credible, is to Greta as she believes him but the evidence points otherwise.  Many of you agree with me.

hi, my name is TACO JOE
and
"i love JORAN"  "i would marry him if i could"



what a LOAD JOE T is

 8)

I think Dana likes Sinatra too.   8)

O/T.... Fidel and his brother need to go....


but anyway.... SAN... it's DEAN!  LOL

and I am glad that Dana said he does not agree with Greta's assessement that she is inclined to believe jvds..... someone needs to give her a wake up kick!

Joe is going to be lined up behind Greta.

SOMEONE GIVE ANNA THE PHONE NUMBER TO DANA.  I WANT HER TO CALL. HURRY!!! ANNA, CALL, CALL CALL.

With Joran's chest size, I think of them as T & A.

Taco Joe and Joran are both so impressed with themselves that I wonder how they can stand to be in the same room.

Robots... may I ask if you are male or female?


and that made me LMAO...

.
Some of the Arubans and the Dutch seem to think it is almost illegal to have a poor opinion of them unless our governement tells us what to think.  That is the mentality that got them into this mess.

I wonder how they would feel if they were Americans and could see muslims en mass, as far as the eye could see, hundreds of thoursands of them chanting Death to America!!  Death to Israel!!  Death to America!!

And we just take it in stride and consider the source.  Aruba, on the other hand, seems to take so personally even the suggestion that they might improve their LE and judiciary and try applying the law equally.

And Dompig is mostly concerned that Beth is not as impressed with him personally as she should be!!  Aruba and Holland need to grow up and "grow a brain"!  They need to grow up and get over themselves.  This is not about Aruba or the Netherlands, it is about justice for our citizen.

Tourism down 25% is good but we can do better.  I hope the mail campaign is going to improve this number.  50% is an acceptable goal to me.

.

oops... that was me!  Sorry Dean.

maybe JOE T can fix up his daughters with JORAN the SAINT  :roll:

Goofy me... I thought that was Dean Martin...

Yes it is mrs. red.  I love Dean.

CALL IN MONKEYS

Dana is taking questions.

HURRY ,SOMEONE GIVE ANNA THE NUMBER.


LOL, I LIKE DEAN MARTIN ALSO. :lol:

POST THE NUMBER, SOMEONE FAST.

Well now that we really know the boycott is working..
the pressure must be put on harder, we all need to make those
mailing labels , stamps what ever it takes..

Klaas if you could mail me that template i would appraciate it
I am the manager of a small movie theatre and I pay all the bills
I cant wait to put labels on all the envelopes to Paramount, Buena Vista
Sony and all the others I pay bill too.. pepsi-cola bottling company
Sheesh I am getting enjoyment just thinking about this :lol:

SOMEONE, ANYONE POST THE F******* PHONE NUMBER.

Joe Taco is all about media.  He took this case because it paid good money and gave him media exposure.  He doesn't even know who he is defending.  Joe Taco is only interested in promoting his own self and his business--period.  Joran is not a person to him--he's a client, a paycheck, a road to fame.

THANKS, KLAAS...........DON'T BAN ME.

Tyler, remember your blood pressure, dear!   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Calm down sweetie, I am trying to call right now. But the line is busy.  :lol:

Call Monkeys.... call...

DOES EVERYONE HAVE THE NUMBER NOW :lol:  :lol:

ANNA>>> you gotta call!

Number, what number?

Not sure... I think it is:  

306-842-7884

 :wink:  :wink:

no, what is it ???


 :twisted:  :twisted:  :twisted:  :twisted:








 8)
just kidding

If anyone gets through, please tell Dana about the stickers for mail and the postage stamps.  We need to continue to advertise and spread the word about Natalee and boycott Aruba.

306-842-7884

So, what do you guys want me to ask Dana? If I get through.

Anna is on, now!

Ask him about the possiblity of the FBI or an international police force becoming involved in this investigation.  Is it possible?  How coudl it happen?

She has the sweetest voice.

She sounds so good!

Anna you are great.

doesn't she?

Go Anna.  She's making a great point that Joran seemed stunned by service in NY.

Great job Anna!

Anna's sweeter than a bunch of bananas!

who is next?  

oh who cares what Greta thinks about Bo 's service???  I don't....

after all she is a defense attorney!!

Dana said too bad if they didn't like how Bo served the documents.

There was an investigation into the corruption in the ALE last year as to their connections with organized drug trafficking.  There was supposed to be an investigation of this investigation, but we haven't heard of anything.  Isn't there an international police force that can be called in when corruption surfaces in local police forces?

Klass send me the stamp to make stickers with! Please! 8)

Right???  who cares what she thinks....


 I have heard (before this show).... that Hollywoodland is supposed to be a great movie.....  so I hope he is on soon...

Somebody CALL!!  He is easy to talk to.  I didn't even have anything to say or ask--just call and say something about the NY decision.

BOC - go to this thread and send me an email request. I set up a special email for it.

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=157

I brought that up the other day AZ... sure haven't heard anything from this gal.. she was from Curacao.  That is an excellent question and worth pursuing.  Maybe a great question for Dana!

Somebody else call... dang, I always call..... he is very easy to talk to!!

.
Ask about the article in Diario about the rape and photo of 16 years old girl recently.

Is this happening more or what's the deal?

Who is this now... great points!!

okay,someone else's turn.

Maybe we should show DANA this picture of Joran from 8/2/2006

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/JoranJaimeCnC080206a.jpg)

Man Boobs  :lol:

Thanks, Mrs. R.

Was that you?

You were great.

sheesh the ass has been out everynight of the week just partying away
makes me sick

That was you?  Excellent!  You sounded great!!

Especially the one between his shoulders :lol:

No, he is the tits part of T & A, Taco is the A.   :lol:

It was very hard for me to hear him on the phone.  I had just ran up the stairs after running down to grab the phone.

that was great of DANA>.. get off your fat wallet and don't make stupid statements like you are going to go down there and solve this thing....

y'all are getting a taste of how Red really sounds around the house...  :lol:

Is that Red?

Yep, that's Red  :lol:

Red is passionate about this case and about justice for this family.  It comes out in his voice.

RED is on a RANT  ! ! !

YOU BETTER BE GOOD !! MRS. SCARLETT RED

Yes   - he really hates tacky joe.... with a passion! obviously...

What did Greta say today that they both are not happy about?  I missed it.

Absolutely and I am so proud of him, Mrs. Red, Tom & Klaas.  They work so very hard.  I am as proud of Dana, too, who has been very passionate about this and so fair.  Just a few of my heroes, but significant heroes.  1000 points of light.

Right?  He is extremely passionate about all of this.... I am very proud of that passion though!

Hi everybody!!  I got speakers.  I can finally hear Dana.  Red is doing an awesome job!!   :D

I hope someone slips truth serum in his drink tonight while he is out partying for his birthday.  Maybe someone will put Visine in his drink which gives pretty near instant diarrhea.   :lol:

Believing Joran

What was the myspace address?

Me, too.  We need more people willing to stand up and take a position for what is right and honest and ethical.  There is a right way to live and behave.  Yes, we know what that way is, and all the blathering about legalities and other crap is just that --crap.  Red is standing up for all that is right and good in our society--justice, honesty, and doing the right thing.
I'll stand beside him any day.

Would not work I think my system has too much virus protection!

Tacopina is such a high priced attorney that he ducks interview confrontations from little 'ole me.

Yea, you much just be something in court. Afraid of confronting someone who knows the facts better than you? Hmmm.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Wouldn't that be a gas???

Has anybody sent any of the boycott sites the link to the boycott aruba stamps? Or BFN? We need to get as many people using them as possible, no? I'm thinking about getting some for my boss to use...She's all about boycotting Aruba!!  :wink:

Sunfreak, when I was in second grade (my family owned a grocery store) I got tired of kids asking me for chocolate candy all the time (remember that was not long after the war so it was a real treat) and I decided to take Ex-Lax to school and give to them as my candy supply had run out.  Well, my fellow second graders never forgot that.  They laughed about it at our last get-together in spring, but I can tell you there was a lot of toilet tissue used at our school that day.  I wish that on Joran, that someone slip him a drink with Visine so he can feel that same way.

Somebody call Dana and tell him about our stamp and sticker campaign.

What is his email address??

Klaas, send him your artwork for this.

she made a flip little comment that she and tacky joe and jqk should just go to aruba and solve this thing....

and she believes the boeti story... :roll:

Thank you TYLER!

Always a good thing to have some convictions and empathy.

Red, lawyering is not about doing what's right.  It's about making the buck and playing the game (as I'm sure you know).  He who plays the game the best, wins.  Our legal system has become a chess game and sometimes the game is rigged.

What is Dana's email address?

The link from Dana's show
http://www.myspace.com/helpfindnatalee

One of my own brothers said when I asked them about his clients, "hell, they're all guilty, just hope I get enough money before they get out and blow it."

Greta is in no position on the air to be flippant about something as serious as a missing, most likely dead young woman.  Very unprofessional.

I've had lawyer friends say essentially the same to me.  Their best advice is to avoid getting involved in the legal system or courts.  Avoid courts and judges and lawyer because no one wins.

greta 8)  is a LOAD

I agree, however, I am talking about him being a pundit.

He wants to go on TV and spin, but god forbid he be confronted with the truth or an opposing view.

Funny how he always manages to go last and unopposed. Why is that? Because he demands it or he wont go on the show.

I wonder if Garrison is going to tell in his book the story about Terry Shivavo and the Greta connection. :shock:

ohh... do tell.... I don't know what this is....

Dana said Joran looks like a spoiled rich boy.

Don't you get the impression that Taco Joe has a yen to be a TV or movie star?  He's starstruck.  He wants to be a Greta or Nancy Grace.  It's the attention he wants.

Who was that?  great call....

Me again, someone else go.

Tacopino looks like an old Chicago gangster from the J. Edgar days.

Why you are doing so good :wink:

He does!  

Someone call in....

Tyler.  LOL.  Be glad that was back then, you'd probably get sued for it today!!  I had an accident in 2nd grade myself with exlax.  We had a substitute teacher that day, and she didn't believe me when I said I had to go to the bathroom immediately.  LOL.   Then I threw up too.  LOL.

Don't let him drop Natalee, GO!

I would be recognized if I call again because some people have Yankee accents.

I would send email if I had the address.  Next time will put in my address book permanently.

Dana should give his email address out from time to time.  I don't have the webpage open, just media player.

Tacky Joe fancies himself a handsome TV star.  Easier than lawyering and appearing in court and writing briefs and doing all that tedious research.  He wants to be in front of a camera, being made up and admired.  He reminds me of a teenager with a passion to be a model, photographed and admired for being beautiful.  Someone needs to tell him he's not the next Nancy Grace, by a long shot.

email her. i do, but i am over my quota. someone might think i was a nutter

It's ok... you sound good and don't ramble like I do!  I wish CBB was here to call... she and Slueth do a great job too!

Anna his email is dpretzer@yahoo.com

my name is TACO JOE

"i love JORAN
i call him LOVERBOY"

 :twisted:  :twisted:  :twisted:  :twisted:  



how does he man sleep at night  :evil:

www.myspace.com/helpfindnatalee

Instead of counting sheep he counts his money.

Well you can email me for the label template if you want, or you can create one yourself  :wink:

Third times the charm   :wink:

Email him if you don't want to talk out loud.

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:

www.joetaco.iluvjoran.com

Dana says his phone number too fast!  I can't hear that fast!

I tried twice to do his website thingie and both times, I just happened to pick up my coke and by the time I set it down, he was finished.  He speaks in Yankee and I write in Southern. :lol:

You need to drink the coke with the caffeine in it.   :wink:

 :lol:  :lol:

I liked Garrison's written comments.   :lol:

even though Justinsmama says that I sound very northern, I still hear southern..... LOL... I think I have gotten a southern yankee accent after livivng up here! YOu would not believe how many times I say... DO WHAT???

So did I...

Dana is a "real person."  He is not a slime ball like Tackypeno.

Why don't you write something in an "Ask Dana" thread and a monkey can read it.  It will be monkey see, monkey do!    8)

Good calls Monkeys

Hi monkeys. Forgive me for just jumping in but I just got back from the Carlos Mencia show at the Stardome!!! It was soooo funny! And he signed autographs afterward so I got a t-shirt signed and I got a picture with him. Anybody that watches his show will know the little midget guy Brian. He was there too and I got a photo with him.  They were both really nice. Pics are on  Dad's camera phone so as soon as we figure out how you send a pic to my computer I will email it to ya'll!
Now I gotta go back and read.....

for the life of me I cant connect to his show

Great call from all, including the head monkey. :wink:

I tried to call, busy signal ?
He mentioned Peter Whitmore, the child predator that was recently arrestd in Canada. The lawyer for Whitmore says that the Crown Attorney had to sign a statement saying that they would not persue the dangerous offender designation  ! ! He did that because one kid was still in there. This guy is s manipulator and it is beleived that the younger kid was lured in by the other kid. I know some people who are from Kipling and know the family and who had some contact with this creep while he was in the town. The only reason that he didn't get very far was because he did not have enought money to get much further.

Not sure I understand that one. lol

That's very interesting, Kat.  Oh, that is horrible that the younger kid was lured in.  I am so glad few child predators have a lot of money but I guess there are some who do and that might be why we do not know about them.  I expect this sickness does not check the social register or D&B reports.

If you can't call, write it and another monkey can read it on the air.  You write such good stuff.  I would love to hear your thoughts on the air.

You were good. Get worked up much about this ?
I do too.

Thanks, Yapperz1!!

I would rather email than call in and will put in address book  I also got the one from his website.

Think I will add the phone number as I called a wrong number first and told some stranger I wanted to speak on the air to Dana, LOL.   :?

Kat... that is scary stuff.  THose poor kids!


Ok Monkeys, I need to head out, Monday comes way to early!!!

Be Well Monkeys .... and

Keep the Faith!!!  

Nite!

Jossy Mansur must be one rare breed on the island of Aruba.  He tells it like it is even when it ain't good.

Anna, you have a great voice on the air.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

I like when you call in Anna.

Nite, Mrs. R.

I've called Dana before, but I am not much of a phone person and I do prefer the written word.

I think Barely and Anna were both great, as was Red.  Monkeys are fine folks.

So was Michelle on the show, Heard she might be
from Boycottaruba web site
i still cant get the right link for the damn show keep getting a
old shows

He was trying to get the car dealership guy to almost give him tires.
How did they catch him ? An observant person was driving down the hiway and saw a vehicle that matched the description that was broadcast. phoned the RCMP. Who got their man. But, there are very many po'd ppl in Sask who are planning to start a campaign to put some pressure on the politicians regarding our stupid laws that favor predators. I intend to get involved as many of these ppl work in our branch office in Sask. And this creep came thru here. Too close to home for us.

You can be our Cyrano.   :D

Good for you to get involved, Kat.  We all should.

Hi Snoopy and Spooky.  Good to see you here.  Snoopy, I hope you have had a great vacation.  Spooky, sounds like you had a great afternoon.

See, I didn't get you two mixed up this time.  I am doing better!

lol  I wrote Dana and Jossy before the interview, wanting to get their feedback on the statements that have been circulating here and on BFN.  They were not aware of them and there wasn't enough time for them to read the statements and respond.

That's what I can't understand about Aruba, isn't this close enough to home for them?  Their daughters are dating suspects in a crime.

This perp had a really good lawyer before, but if it goes thu Sask Legal Aid and it will because it will be tried in Sask, they won't give him ( the creep ) the pick of who he wants. Not that there are not good lawyers in Sask, but there are lawyers who make your skin crawl and this guys sure did when he spoke of honoring the agreemnt to not persue the dangerous offender designation.

You mean about the child whose classmates not only watched but photographed her raping and then her parents decided not to seek legal action.

Kat, I think most laws now do favort the perpetrators and it makes you scratch your head, that the good people and the children do not merit equal protection under the law.

I agree Tyler they were great.

If I ever called in you would probably hear a big boom and that would be me hitting the floor from fainting because I would be so nervous. :lol:

That's what I can't understand about Aruba, isn't this close enough to home for them? Their daughters are dating suspects in a crime.

Dating ? Is that what is is called on Aruba ?
The type of mentality that is rampant on Aruba is just more to happen.
It must be late, can't spell, can't write a sentence.

 :lol:  Hey Tyler

No, the June 9, 2005 statements from Joran, Deepak and Satish.  Those seemed to be very indepth, contradictory and incriminating in my opinion.  Nothing we have not heard before, but reading it just made it all seem that much more ridiculous to me.  Why any of these punks ever walked is beyond me.

I do, and yes, the call was made to the Twitty answering machine/voicemail.

Thanks Easy.  Maybe Jossy will get the answers for next time.

Well, we elect the politicians. They come to our doors when they want our votes. They want our money for their campaigns. I do believe that people in North America are fed up with this SXit. The Lunsfords, the Destiny Norton and on and on.

San,
He is soooo nice, you would not be nervous.  Just talk to him as you would a friend or enighbor.  I try really hard to sound more alert and not so sleepy-headed as I know I do sound that way, too calm and am trying for more animated.  LOL, impossible, I am just not excitable person.



EASYWRITER!
You must call because we can't let there be more Yankee accents than Alabama ones calling in.  It won't do!!

Red does NOT sound southern.  With a name like Red, seems he might at least a little bit.  LOL!

Next time, have all those ??? thought about and written out.  I am going to as I was not even sure I made my point with Dana but was not completely agreeing with him on disappointment of dismissal in NY.  Would never have worked IMHO because almost all would be depositions, etc not a good way to conduct a trial but was not a total loss as Joran got told what lots of us think of him thanks to Bo.

I would like to hear commentary on that from either/or Dana/Jossy.  I have enjoyed all the analyses done by our own Monkeys.  Some great thoughts.

That was Red at 30% worked up ... imagine what poor Mrs Red must deal with?

It is insulting for some to make sound bites instead of actually putting their money where their mouth is. If anyone has ever spoke with a parent of a missing child or an abused one, you will understand the fire within.

These people, parents, etc put up a strong face but they are human. The pain that they go thru every day is beyond any of our worst days. Being a victims advocate is a no brainer for me.

Some times its the fire and the passion that gives a family a little boost when they feel down. If thats the least I can do at times, then I consider that a success.

The families, all families of missing children need our help.

I hopefully will be able to provide more info in the not too distant future.

That is why I am proud of all of you and the others out there for caring about missing people

Lay down on the floor and then call.   :idea:  :lol:

Thanks, Justins.  Was it made that night she went missing?  Not the phone call that Dave says was a wrong number, right?

 :lol:  :lol:

Okay, next time I know in time, I will call in.  I will have my questions prepared and a place where I can pat my foot.  Some will understand that.

Justinmama and I heard it talked about on TV.  Call was 3 a.m. approximately on May 30.

.
Did Satish get out to open the gate, Joran got out to hold the dogs and Deepak was driving the car leaving Natalee in the back seat with Joran's phone?  Is that why the sound of the car is so loud, the car door is not closed well?  And the monkey is screeching?

Worry about that, Joran! Think about it every day of your life and wonder when it might be played for the world to hear.

.

RED, thanks to you, Tom, Mrs Red & Klaas for providing us a forum. It makes a difference, a BIG difference.

Thanks, Red.  What was the original fire that got you all lit up?

The wee hours of the morning they snatched Natalee.

Kudos, Anna, great thinking.

Do you know who said it?  Maybe we can find a link and put it to rest once and for all.

Called In, But Missed Jossy

I want to know why the 3 have been immune from prosecution for "lying as witnesses" when it is clear under Aruban law this is a criminal offense.

There is NO DENYING they lied as witnesses.

Where is prosecution?

Explained same to Dana off-air.

The principle is simple and obvious and further used by LE the world over: criminals are very often prosecuted for lesser crimes in order to pressure them to admit to more serious crimes.  In the case of sloot, I can see 3 separate prosecutions, which includes the "LYING AS WITNESS" crime.

Bring them in and apply the pressure.

.

I wish they would do just that.

Oh, no, Big Hammer!  They weren't witnesses.  They were "PERSONS OF INTEREST" only.  Guess in Aruba that means you can lie.  But they did not have official witness status and that is why their early statements can apparently be disappeared.

This system is just like jello, it will conform to any shape they want it to conform to.

.

Amen Southern Sister!!!

Spook- Fat Phil said Hi!!

BOC final sweep!

I'm just passing thru..  

What would be the best path to go now to get information for Natalee's family?

Do we want a trial, even though we know that the suspects will be found innocent?  I believe it would be better to have a trial and forget about the double jeopardy, they are free no matter what..  

Do we file a civil suit over in Aruba, will that allowed more information?  Depostions are in a written form, basically a take home quiz..  

Do we push for them to closed the case and will that bring a better chance of getting the information..

I don't believe we will see justice, I just hope that Natalee's family gets some answers...


Good night..

BEARLY, thanks a bunch to you for all you do.

HAMMER, you do not understand their law.  None of us do.  Arleen told us time and time again.  She neglected to say the reason we do not undertand it is because it is 'play and pay as you go.'  

I have come to believe their law is such a sham and a mockery of Dutch law, that it is almost non-existent.

Hello all!! Just got done painting front porch of rehab!! Goes on market tomorrow!! WOOHOO!!!
What did I miss today? Anyone see latest on Jennifer Moore story...broke my heart this morning!!! Don't believe in death penalty...but this case could sway me to change my mind!!!

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Oh, and convicting them is like nailing jello to the wall.  I get it now.

Hello SB (and all Monkeys),

Just a coincidence that you are seeing Jeeps as the rental cars.  There are a lot of jeeps, but I don't think they are the majority.   At first blush you would think the Jeeps are the best with the terrain, but then think of all the dust you eat with the Jeep  :wink:

I know that Jug talked about it.

the statements on BFN...are they all new? No one has scene them before? and if so...how did they surface now.

Hi Slueth, you missed Dana call in.  We always look forward to hearing your calls.

Oh, I guess eating dust is better than what Beth & Co have been forced to eat from Aruba.   :wink:

Good night, sweet Terry.  Good questions.  I also wonder what would be the best course for Natalee's family to find resolution.

I would be willing to bet that is JQK's and Beth's assignment for the next few weeks.

I thought I heard Beth talk about it once and she said no--but it was a roundabout no, so I thought there might be something she wasn't saying.

I thought I heard Dave say something about a wrong number and kids playing on the phone.

Thanks to all Monkey transcribers & callers.

25% tourism drop?  WOW!

Sloots are running up the tab. Time to rip up their VIP cards.

I admit, I missed Dana tonight and will need to catch the podcast.  Any new revelations from the program tonight?

.
Bearly,
For Dana's next show, I'll bet you would call him and read a list of Monkey questions, right?  We could just post in the thread already started for Jossy I think and you could print them all out and call in and read them for us or ask them.  You did a very good job and I tried to get you some back up but these monkeys won't call.

CBB was going to read the statements and comment and she never posted back, did she?  She must be busy as she is good to call, too.

Those statements are time consuming.  Maybe she will post her thoughts on them later for Late Nite Crew or something.

That phone call had to do with one that occurred in September-October last year immediately after Hurricane Katrina.  It was a call that said something to the effect, "Mama, I am still here."  I believe the origins of the phone call were said to be Aruba.  I do know how that could have occurred and could have been a "crock" made up by the dark side, but I will not discuss that here since I am kind of supposed to not do that at the request of a family member of my own.

Does Jug mention it in his book?

Nuttin' Honey.

Just don't have ice cubes in your mouth when calling in - he picks up the line quickly and you are directly on the air.  I swallowed a large ice cube whole once when he answered before what I thought was even the first ring - tough time trying to talk and get the darn ice cube to melt at the same time   :lol:

Tylergal - that rose is absolutely stunning.    A bright spot in a sad week...

I don't think Jug has written a book.  That was Dave's book in which so much was discussed.  CrazyBabyBorg has done a good analysis of it.  I wish she was able to return.  I know her life has been topsy-turvy for a while, but she was really good at those back-seat conversations, like you, Lala's, San and Anna were with the transcripts from the PIMP statements.

We need to get back on track with that again.  I hope her family and her heart will be healed soon and she can return.  I also miss APPEALS very much as I do BEACHWEGO AND ARTCOLLEY among many, many others.

ok...feeling lonely...I'll sign off....

I will do whatever it takes to bring Natalee home, including reading them in the nude on the 11:00 news.   :lol:  :lol:

Thank you, Sweet one.

Gosh, and I forgot to mention, AZLady's great analysis of the statements as well, which I posted on the thread.

I am going to try to get them all copied into some kind of document...some day.  Lord help my computer or nerves don't crash first. :)

Ldstlou, we are not ignoring you, just trying to discuss the latest events.  I guess there is a lot to be read and digested over the last 24 hours.

That is a beautiful Rose Tyler.

Have a good night everyone.

 :lol:  :lol:

I know what you mean, Sleuth, I ran downstairs and grabbed the phone and then ran upstairs and dialed with my heart pounding and trying to catch my breath as he said hello, you're on the air.   :lol:

I meant Dave. (head-banging icon).

ldstlou, get back here and roll up your sleeves and get in on the conversation.  We are here for Natalee, come join us!

Nite, San.  Hope you are feeling stronger.

A reason thet Jeep's IE: Wranglers like mine are used for so many recreational aeras rentals is that they are easy to drive  and are convertabels (Open air ) and they can go almost anywhere .
 #2 is they are easy to repair if something gets wreacked
 you can put a whole Jeep body on one in about 4 hours the whole body can come as one unit just a matter of hooking things up .
 also Jeep has a great program for rental companys to lease them for a season and then turn them back to jeep and get a batch of new ones every year  .
  Hope this explains a little  and besides most everyone likes to putt around in a sporty lil Jeep on vacation sorta like Golf carts on an island but more power and speed .
 

where are we?  i read over transcrpts of police reports this morning...

I felt I could make a real difference. I had gone to Aruba for 30 years. It was not just as a tourist, knew and met many Arubans, some in the govt. I knew exactly how the island worked. What was to be expected.

If anyone asks Beth or Dave they will say ... man Red had this pegged from the beginning. Along this difficult journey for truth I have told them what they will expect and what most likely will happen. Whether it was how the case would be handled or how the tourism would fall. Was never going to happen over night. It was going to be a slow drip and before you know it the basement is flooded and the house is a mess.

The true reality set in last year at this very time. This is when I was in Aruba digging in the landfill. I cannot even put into words how difficult it was to dig and unbury pile after pile of garbage right next to Dave Holloway. We wanted to find her, but there was no way I was ever prepared to. What would happen if we did? I can't imagine the scene. Nor could I imagine a father's grief finally finding his child.

It was gut wrenching and even more so knowing the BS obstacles that we were presented with by Aruba.

Wanting to help people is the key. No one asks for this celebrity of being a parent of a missing person. They help of providing someone you have never met before is the key. That is a selfless act. We all need to remember  in our lives the words "selfless."

If this is how I can help people now and in the future, then there was a reason for all of it. It certainly is not easy to juggle the life I lead. But it is worth it to me. And obvious worth it to the many people who involve themselves with these cases.

It means people care. That is important. It says something about our humanity.

Helping those who need our help who we have never met. Along the way we make some life long friends and meet people we never thought we would. Creating a last bond of caring ... that is what is important in life.

What are your thoughts?  I thought it was helpful to go line by line so nothing was missed.  What about you?

SLEUTH !!!  :D

Red, your response is very well articulated.

Sleuth, that hurt.  I have done that before. It is very painful. Ouch.

Wow Red!! Glad I came back just to read these words!! What a man you are!! What a man in every sense of the word!! The world needs more people like you and your wife and Klaas...and the dedicated people on this site!! I have always said...if I ever have a problem with my child...and I KNOW i WON'T!!! bit if I did...I know you all would back me!! Hope you know I'd back you all too.
My question is Red...isn't there anyone you know on the island that could help us besides Jossy? SOMEONE!!! that could mingle and help find answers?!

I have not seen Lala's back on since she went to make a call.  Did she fall in the floor and faint or was it the garlic breath we were talking about?  Lala's, call out to my monkey friend.

More BOYCOTT ARUBA labels-

I made these last night.  They fit on Avery 8293 labels, 1 1/2" round.  I sent the template to Klaas, so she could send it out to anyone who wants them.  Here is a sample (larger than actual size) of the label.

(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/SunFreak2/75f5cf05.jpg)

I love it great job

Red, that is one of the most beautiful things I have ever read, and I could tell it came from the very soul of your being.

You had something to lose by this, you gave up your trips to Aruba after 30 years.

Thanks for juggling.  I can imagine it's really hard.  Mrs. Red is an angel to give of her time with you, also.

Geeze, someone pass the tissues!

Lot of differences in Joran's testimony in car and Deepak's...but thing that really struck me...as I saw mentioned here...is the seeming PANIC!! Deepak had coming back from lighthouse after "Natalee had fallen asleep". Think there was a lot of sunconscious truth in his statements!!
Like "how could that be" "where is she staying" and sudden acceleration in speed...even talking about how loud the car was. I always thought the crime happened in car by pond...even more convinced now it happened in the car!!

Box for you and a box for me!! I mean it!!

Very nice, SF.  Everyone brings a different talent to the table.   :D

My connections on Aruba have probably long passed. It is not the same place I went to when I was Natalee's age.

As you can kind of tell, I am a bit of a rebel. When I was NH's age I used to go to Aruba by myself, stay with families there. I always hung out with Arubans, never the tourists.

It was a much different place. There were some dangerous places, but the kids did not act like they do today. One had to worry about the Columbians and Venez in Club Scaramouch ... not the PIMPS.

I will tell you all what I told Beth. The difference is that Aruba has a greater % of gang, Pimp, crack nonsense than is normal. Sure it goes on everywhere, but the place has under 100K population. We read about the crack addict problem all the time in Aruba. We don;t make this up, it exists.

Its almost like an inner city mentality has taken over the island. How many tourists like to visit the inner city?

You mean Cacapina breath?

FANATASTIC!!! Met a lady in line at grocery store...we were talking about us both being on diest and how much weight we had lost...this was yesturday...then she said her motivation was she and her hubby were taking a trip to Aruba in 3 weeks...told her I am boycotting the island and why...she was well aware of what was happening...I think everytime she did an internet search Natalee's story came up!! Told her no hard feelings and good luck...she thought they would be safe...not teenagers...then I told her about hell family is going through and story of e-mail from married couple that circulated. Didn't want to send her off depressed abour her trip...she had lost A LOT OF WEIGHT!!!...but think she was depressed about her trip!! LOL

Red - well said.  We can't even imagine what it would have been like to be looking for Natalee but wondering how one could even handle it if she were found.  It would be both physically and emotionally draining.

I know exactly what you are talking about Red...I wrote weeks ago about Youngstown Ohio...same mentality!! Feds had to come in and clean up the Police Dept. Hard to believe it exists today...but smaller and more tight knit communities...with limited opportunites!! IT HAPPENS!!

I have never been to Aruba, but from what I have read from their own publications and have heard out of the mouths of their own people, I would not go.

Natalee and her family only shone a light on what was already there.  No doubt they have saved others.

Unlike what really happens when you shine a light on vermin, they didn't scatter, they thrived on the attention.

Sleuth, do you remember the day they found the barrel in the water and Dave went diving for that in hopes (I guess against hope as well) that Natalee was in that barrel.  It matched the barrels at the VDS house.  My heart sank and I think I cried for two hours about that.  I was following the case but not posting much back then.  My husband was following it closely and we felt the same way.  I was out of town but saw it on TV and that night I called him and asked how he would have felt.  He was almost in tears.  I was.  That touched me so that I will never forget it, so I can "almost" understand how Red felt, but not really, to be there searching with Dave hoping against hope and hoping maybe not that Natalee would be found.  These are the heart wrenching moments.

One more thing Red...I live in City...we have community dumpsters in our allies....there are days smell is so bad...I gag lifting up lid!!! Especially in our heat!! Cannot even FATHOM!!!! the stench you all experienced!! GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!

Hey, Sleuth, there were some good things on the podcast.  Jossy told us what Joran really acts like (even slipping in the word brat), and Jossy, Dana, and Red had words for the Tacopina's of the world.

It really took a long time to get over, although there are parts that I will never really fully get over. The fact of failing did not set too well either. No one who searches wants to fail. Your job is to find what you are looking for to provide some form of comfort to the families.

I can honesty say I never thought I would ever find myself digging in a toxic landfill for a missing girl. I do not think my lungs ever planned on it either. Its something one does because they know its the right thing to do.

There were so many times I thought we had it. Looking back on it one year later, in many respects I think we were played. That is why I do not shed a tear over the loss of tourism. There is a price to be paid for screwing with an investigation and the decency of helping a family simply find their daughter to bring her home to bury her.

For that ... interfering in such a manner ... no penalty they face is good enough. Someone in Aruba is going to have to figure it out that their tourism is never going to get better. Beth Twitty is not going away. Every speech she makes is another nail in the Aruban tourism coffin. At any time they can come clean and just tell us where Natalee is.

ok...still feeling lonely...so will hit the sack...but so glad to hear your heartfelt story Red!! and glad I was here to respond!! Again MAY GOD ALWAYS BLESS YOU!!! you are a great human being!! and thank you again for you time, effort and this blog!! You have created something truely miraculous!!

Nite, ld.

Besides the Pus2s and K2s, who do you think can tell the family what they need to know to find her?

You have searched, you have interviewed, you have read, you have studied, you have listened, you have acted, you have invested time, effort, money, and yourself.  What do you think happened to her that night?

I think Red has ranted enough for one nite.

Everyone have a good nite. Always remember its never over ... keep in mind  and important comment I made to Beth this past week.

Do not ever look at something as a set back or failure ... look at it as a way of directing us to the right path to find answers.

Nite all.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

I was furious with a comment she made on Court TV last Friday, so I decided to send her an e-mail.  I received an interesting response from her.  I have not kept up with this case as much as many people have, is this crazy woman always like this?

Tylergal - I do remember the day they dragged on the barrel now that you mention it.  It was very sad, hoping that it was Natalee but then hoping that it wasn't.

Thanks to the monkeys that called in tonight, and to those that transcribed.

Nite, Red!

There are those among us who question her propriety.  She used to post here, but was not my favorite poster, I must say.  She has long been gone, thank God and other divine interventions.  

By the way, welcome aboard!

Good night, ldstlou

Good night, Red

Which crazy lady?  The chameleon with multiple personalities?

:cry:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/barrel1.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/barrel2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/barrel6.jpg)

.
Welcome, Celestecp,

Over the course of this tragedy and subsequent investigation, that individual has been known to make some very over the top remarks and claims, many if not most of which have later been proven false.

I assume you have seen the forum The Refugees Unleashed?  Many believe this is more or less a forum to support her and her antics.  Some believe she posts there as Glenda the Good Witch who appeared the day after Beth called Julia a witch.

She once posted here as Bon Dia and was a source for quite a bit of disinformation.

Anna

Klaas, did you find that as sad as I did?

Hi Celeste!  Welcome to Scared Monkeys!

What did Julia Renfro say to you?  Yes, she is crazy  :wink:

Yes, but so many things have been so sad.  I don't know which is worse.  This or the landfill.

It looks like there were Arubans helping also.

Bearly, I cannot remember under what circumstances this was found but I was thinking it was TES.  Klaas, do you remember?  That part of my memory is dimmed but the part about Dave when I saw him swimming out in the water just broke my heart.

.
The landfill was the saddest for me to see Dave digging there and then when the Arubans filled in all their progress, I cried on that one I was just so angry I couldn't stand it.

And some criticized Beth for not digging in the landfill as well but no mother on the face of this earth should have to dig for their own child in a garbage dump that is totally unregulated (see donkey legs sticking up!) and contains hospital waste and the germs of the tourist industry, etc.

Odors sometimes make me gag and actually barf and I know I could not have done that even if looking for a set of lost keys.   :roll: And I was afraid what would happen to Dave if he actually found her there.  I know he is a big strong man but that might undo him completely for life.

It was too dangerous without equipment.  No wonder they all got sick.  It is a miracle they did not get things like Hep C or TB especially in tropical climate where it is never cold enough to kill any germs.

.

I think a tourist noticed it and told TES about it.

OK, I thought somehow someone else was involved aside from TES, and I am sure your memory is correct.  That was a reality moment for me, or something.  It just seemed horrible.  Yes, the land fill and stench that had to be dug in, in Aruba to find her was horrific.  There cleanliness must be somewhat similar to Somalia or very near it.

.
Klaas,
Sorry for the duplicate post.  IE told me it needed to send the information again and made a duplicate.

Guess it's time for me to go and dump my cookies for today and run a thousand scans.   :roll:

I deleted it  :wink:

I wonder why the "environmentalist," "tree'hugging" Anita never made any effort to do anything about all the dead animals, mistreatment of animals, landfills, toxic waste.  Oh wait.  That was not profitable I guess.

Oduber's government has been bleeding the island of Aruba dry.  Now that they are loosing tourists, they are sinking fast.  They won't have an environment to worry about soon.

Klaasend, a few corrections for your map.....

1.  Karma is higher and to the right on your map.
2.  The Renaissance Marina Hotel and Casino is in the area where you have Karma - see the pool - that is the Renaissance Marina pool.  Just change that Karma star to the Ren Marina..
3.  Where you have the Renaissance Marina, if you move the star one set of buildings to the left (toward the water) you will be at the CyberZone.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/RouteJoran1.jpg)

Ah HA! Cant wait to see him in October :wink:

Thanks Sleuth - I knew you'ld help me out with this.  When you say Karma is higher and to the right, do you think I have that street correct?  would they have driven a little further down that street and turned a block or 2 later?

I'm just trying to figure out how they would go past Karma, turn right, then turn right again and be heading towards the hotels.

Sleuth, I'll redue the map tomorrow and have you look at it again.  I'm just trying to make sense out of Joran's statement.

Klaas - here is a quick pic  just so you can see and change yours...


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a335/my_photos_/RouteChange.jpg)

G'nite, Klaas.  Thanks bunches for everything.

Nite Klaas.

I'm out for the night as well. Good night monkeys.

Klaas - I have not been to Karma, but it is in the Aventura Mall, which is on the street behind where the Renaissance Marina is and farther to the right (outside of the path that you currently have).  

I'll try to make sense of their recount tomorrow as well.

Still running my log off scans.   :roll:

We never did finish Deepak's statement but that too will have to wait until tomorrow.  Was hoping Lalas or somebody would come back and work with Bearly and disect the entire thing.

Well, there is always tomorrow.  :?

Goodnight, Monkeys, those still here.

.

When asked about the photos I took of Joran at our hotel with a new blonde girl, she said I must have been "star-stuck".  I was furious to hear her say that, so I sent her a lenghty e-mail on Friday and got this response:

Dear Celeste,

There are approximately 75 members of the press here on Aruba, and not one followed this young man around with a camera. He has every right to be on the beaches of Aruba and enjoy his summer vacation with his friend, who was also a paying guest at the Marriott. There is absolutely no evidence against Joran van der Sloot that he harmed Natalee in anyway other than being the last known person to be with her on the beach.

We believe in the justice system of Aruba, and I also know that the Aruban Authorities not only beat this kid in an effort to get him to “confess” to harming Natalee, but they unlawfully arrested his father and many of his friends to pressure him into signing a confession. Joran spent 90 days in Jail with threats that he would spend the rest of his life there unless he confessed to what he did to Natalee.

I understand that the US media has portrayed him to be a predator, rapist, etc…  There is absolutely nothing to substantiate those claims and if there was he would still be in Jail.

Taking pictures of Joran and selling or giving them to the media without his permission is illegal in Aruba.

Sorry that I offended you.

Regards,
Julia Renfro

God Bless Natalee and I can assure you that Aruba is still working hard to find the answers for her family.

Celestecp-

It could take hours to detail the various deceits and even offenses by Julia Renfro in the internet campaign launched to smear Natalee and her family over this last year. Also know she has no true journalism credentials, she's just the only reporter on Aruba hungry enough to play by hook or crook to get her face on the US channels. She has connections to Anita VDS as her friend, she also led Beth Twitty on many wild goose chases to divert her attention away from a bonafide search for Natalee.

Larry Garrison also broke on Rita Crosby or Greta's show, can't remember which, that Julia was writing a book on the story but with the plot line that Natalee was pregnant with her stepfather's baby and ran away.

So know her motives are quite dishonorable and I am unsure if her emails are fit for potty paper, much less anything else.

Celeste, thank you providing us with this.  I was probably the first or most vocal detractor of hers, here at SM.  It was a while before some of the others came on board.  I think Noneusche was always with me. :wink:  

It was a contorted view of reality that she presented here and after her many conflicting statements, it was not long before even the most tolerant Klaasen was up to her ears (I am not sure, but Klaas is so good natured, I suspect after a while, even Klaasen tired of her and that is not easy, Klaas is the best).

Celeste, I just have to add, "everything in Aruba is illegal, except murder of an American," according to Ms. Renfro.

(http://bestsmileys.com/cheering/3.gif)

WELCOME TO CELESTE.  

Had to remark on the neat and orderly vs slob conditions.

Pre-Justion: My home was neat and organized. Biggest problem was cat fur, which was regularly vacuumed. I knew to a penny how much was in my checking account, and plotted out and followed a budget of what was paid and when it was paid. I wore dress clothes, that I ironed, to work, and regularly polished all of shoes (100 or so). Dry cleaning was done on a regular basis. Regularly shaved my legs, and wore cosmetics. My home was quiet. I listened to music all the time. I could locate anything in a heartbeat. I was never late to anything. My vehicle has always been somewhat messy, however.

Post-Justin: I can now never find anything without a tremendous amount of time and energy involved in a search. My house is cluttered with toys, books, kid magazines, video games and equipment, food packaging and crumbs, dishes laying about, and shredded pieces of paper (an ADHD thing). If I wear mascara at all, it is on the run (while driving  :shock: ). My clothing is now mostly cotton (easier to clean and less expensive to pitch when stained~ the latter happens often), and is rarely ironed. My shoes are a mess. My home is noisy, I have no idea how much money I have/do not have or what has been paid and what has not. I am lucky to know my own name. I am chronically late to everything.

In ten years time, I have resigned myself to the reality that I can only do so much, and that my life will return its former order when Justin moves out at the age 45 years. Sigh...

Forgot to add that my poor car is completely trashed all of the time.  :cry:

Sounds EXACTLY like my life before and after Nicholas...isn't it fantastic!! lol!!! Wouldn't go back to the days before Nicholas for anything!! however I do now and again reminicse on the clean house, manicured toes and nails and perfect make-up and hair...but life MUCH happier now...dustballs, dirty dishes and all!!  :D

Diario
http://www.diarioaruba.com/
Amigoe
http://www.amigoe.com/english/
BonDia
http://www.cspnv.com/archivo/pdf/August/
Aruba Today
http://www.arubatoday.com/
Solo di Pueblo
http://www.solodipueblo.com/

Translator:
http://papiamentu.donamaro.nl/

From Diario -   Saturday, August 7, 2006

TE HASTA MINISTRO DI CURACAO TA CUESTIONA DAÑO  Y
PERHUICIO PA PAUL VAN DER SLOOT

ORANJESTAD (AAN)  -- Na Curacao e informacion encuanto e caso di daño y perhuicio di 50 mil Florin pa Paul van der Sloot a cay manera un bom y specialmente cerca esnan cu a bira victima di erornan grandi di e aparato hudicial na Antiyas.
  Ta pesey tambe reaccion di nada mas y nada menos cu ministro David Dick kende tambe tabata victima di eror di husticia tabata uno duro y directo.
  Ministro di husticia David Dick a bira victima di eror di husticia tempo cu e tabata diputado di gobierno di Curacao relaciona cu acusacionnan falso den su direccion encuanto escandalo di aeropuerto.
  E tempo ey el a baha como diputado y entrega su puesto como diputado y a bay sera pa algun dia pa despues keda un aña y pico sin entrada.
  Despues David Dick tambe a bay busca su derechonan y a gana su caso pero e recompensa cu el a haya como daño y perhuicio ta ilustra awe un biaha mas e discrepancia grandi cu tin den husticia di clase na Antiyas y Aruba pasobra señor Dick a haya solamente 1250 Florin y asina tin mas caso na Antiyas y Aruba unda cu sumanan miserable a worde duna na ciudadanonan cu inhustamente a worde deteni y perhudica door di erornan cometi den aparato hudicial / policial.
  Awor Paul van der Sloot si ta bay haya 50 mil Florin di daño y perhuicio y e informacion ey a cay den masha mal tera mes na Antiyas y Aruba tambe pasobra keto bay tin entre otro varios mayor pendiente pa e caso di detencion cu forza bruto di e supuesto gang di Dakota cu lo tabata peligroso y arma cu te hasta handgranaat.
  Te cu awe ni ministerio publico ni polis por a bin cu pruebanan duro pa mustra cu e muchanan, mayoria menor di edad, cu a worde deteni door di team di aresto di polis cu a bay na tur e casnan y basha porta abao, hisa hende benta abao y te hasta hende di edad avansa a worde mentalmente y fisicamente maltrata, tabata forma parti di loke polis tabata sospecha di tabata un organizacion criminal.
  Mientras e caso di gang di Dakota no keda soluciona, no ta keda nada otro cu saca e conclusion cu autoridadnan kier a score cu publicidad durante e temporada di carnaval pa mustra pueblo cu accion duro lo garantiza un temporada di carnaval trankil y sigur pa tur hende.
  Si realmente tabata tin armanan di candela y handgranaat den wega y esnan deteni tabata envolvi den un organizacion criminal cu tabata forma un peliger pa tur hende durante temporada di carnaval y despues e ora ey autoridadnan tabata tin tur derecho pa por a actua manera nan a actua anto asina mes bo tin cu puntra bo mes si un grupo di homber grandi fuertemente arma mester a bay cu forza extremadamente bruto pa detene algun mucha cu cualkier polis cu experiencia por a detene haciendo uzo di loke nos grandinan tabata yama un bon canti man educativo.
  Si Paul van der Sloot cu a worde deteni na un forma suave por haya 50 mil Florin di daño y perhuicio anto ta cuanto famia di esnan cu a worde inhustamente deteni den caso di gang di Dakota lo por haya anto?
  Ningun team di aresto a bay basha porta di cas di famia Van der Sloot abao y hisa tur  miembro di famia Van der Sloot benta abao, pone nan den handboei y tapa nan cabes pa despues hiba nan bay sera pa simannan largo.
  Pero den e caso aki pasobra ta trata di un hulandes europeo kende tabata forma parti di e aparato hudicial na Aruba y Antiyas pesey su mesun ex coleganan a percura pa e haya un daño y perhuicio asina desproporcional compara cu loke Arubianonan y Antiyanonan a yega di haya?
  Cu tipo di sentencianan asina, husticia na Antiyas y Aruba mes ta percura pa credibilidad di husticia en general worde cuestiona door di pueblo.

That should read Saturday, August 5, 2006.  To access the Saturday edition of the newspaper - scroll down to the bottom of the the screen to use the drop down menu and choose Diasabra. [/b]

MONKEYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good Morning!

Where is everybody!

Unreal stuff on the front page!

Poor Beth....and Dave.. so heartbreaking. :cry:

So what is the best way for this case to go?  

Criminal Trial in Aruba -

Civil Trail in Aruba -

ALE closes case in Aruba -

ALE Keeps the case open -

Is there a difference between a closed case vs a cold case -

How is some of the transcripts getting to the public while others are not -

PS

I know when you have kids that all bets are off about keeping the car and house clean.. Before I had my daughter, I made a statement that I would keep playing tennis, racquet ball, fishing and etc..  like I normally did.. Well after my daughter was born all that stopped for a long time and it was my choice.. So its easier to make statements like clutter vs clean when your single and have no kids..  I put pets in the same class as kids..So don't take anything I say too seriously, I don't...

Hi FlyingMermaid, how are you this morning?  I'm having some coffee before I dive into the pool of life..

I guess its time to go, there's coffee left in my mug today.

Terry!!!!!!!!!!!!  I am having my coffee iced this morning!

But I wish I had a muffin............. :D

We spent alot of time in the pool this weekend.  It was nice!

Terry I just don't know how the case should proceed.  

Let's face it the Arubans are going to pick the easiest way out.

If I were Beth I would feel very let down by the Govt and FBI.

Shouldn't they try to help more.

Good Morning Y'all!!

morning Mrs.

How are you  today?  I am so tired this morning... coffee isn't even helping!

Has anyone seem MeMere?  Is she ok??

Celeste - sorry I missed your post last night.  That letter from Julia Renfro does not surprise me at all.  She has posted under the name of Bondia/Glenda/Scoop and who knows what other names on these messages boards.  Most of what she says are lies.  It took a long time for me to realize that but this is now what I think of her:   :wink:  :lol:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/JuliaWitch2.gif)


GOODMORNING ALL!

Good morning.  Glad to hear it's not just me.  I do wear mascara always.  Especially now that my eyelashes are growing back in.  I try not to be late to things but stuff happens..... usually while I'm waiting for the teenage daughter.

Peaches, Justins etc.

I have the same problems but I fear Mr. Mermaid will never grow up nor move out.   8)

Arubagirl translation of Jossy Editorial Aug 7th - from Refugees posted at RU by SMS

Editorial by Jossy Mansur

Natalee’s Case Is Raising Its Head Again!

When we believed that the case left the magnetic publishing field in which it was a captiv, and the police and prosecutors could do their work in more tranquility, the sentence in the case of Paulus van der Sloot and the rejection of the Judge to take the case in New York, served as a combustion to feed the flames of passion on both sides. One could hear an optimistic Tacopina (only God and he know why!) in interviews after the New York ruling, without contributing anything new to the case. Just a reptition of ineffective things. He didn’t answer the cardinal questions (for example, how did Joran reach his home that night, and why did he lie so much and made up so many stories to lead the police astray).

In the meanwhile, in Curaçao the sentence awarding Paulus a sum of 50,000.00 florins was not well received by a Minister and the Police officials who have been in the same experience of a temporary detention, but who were awarded by insignificant amounts such as afl. 700.00 or afl. 7,000.00 while Paulus received the gift of afl. 50,000.00 from the pocket of the Aruban People!. The completely unequal sums again fired up emotions that in Aruba there is a justice of class; that if you are a Dutch person born in the Netherlands, all doors are open to you, but if you are a Dutch born in Aruba or in whichever other island, doors are hermetically sealed in the passageways of justice!*) Fair or not, those thoughts are still alive, instead of disappearing together with the colonial era that is behind us.

The case in New York is understandable because since a beginning experts of American law said that the Judge was going to dismiss the case by reason of territorial competency. The United States is not Aruba, and in the United States the Justice system is very different to the one that functions in Aruba. In addition, one of the fundamental arguments is that the case did not take place in New York, but in Aruba, which is a foreign island to the American justice system. For all practical purposes it is an understandable sentence. But, the one in Aruba left a lot of people astonished.

Now the case of Natalee is surging again. At DIARIO we work hard to continue with the investigation, because the three suspects still have not told us what happened with Natalee when she was in their company. No other person came forward to declare that they were with Natalee after Joran left her on the beach, as he himself declares. That reduces the mystery to the participation of of the three suspects, because only they declared that Natalee was with them when she disappeared.

Joran’s lies are many, and not, like a lawyer in the U.S. declares, because he is young, he got scared and he temporary lost his head. If he only told one lie, or at the maximum two, we could agree with Tacopina, but there are a lot of them that are documented by the Police. Let us review some of them briefly so that nobody stays with the image of purity that his lawyer wants to create for him.

1) Joran declared that he left Natalee at the Holiday Inn, where she stumbled and fell, and that one or more security guards came to help her enter the hotel to go to her room (this lie caused the guards various unnecessary days of detention).
2) Joran declared that Natalee asked him to look at the sharks behind the lighthouse
3) Joran declared that he was with Natalee on the beach, where the young girl fell asleep and that he left her lying on the beach.
4) After that he changed this declaration to which he said that Natalee became sick and he left her in that condition on the beach.
5) Next he declared to to the police that Deepak went back to Natalee on the beach, and that he believes that Deepak raped and killed Natalee (documented by 4 police officers!).
6) He declared also that he suspects that Deepak buried Natalee close to the first fisherman’s hut, and even went to there to the police, but nothing was found.
7) Joran declared to a Dutch interrogator who came to help with the case, that his shoe size (the one that he lost on the beach) was a 14, while in official statement to the police he said that it is 11.
8.) Deepak declared that Joran would face 15 years in prison if the girl would be found.
9) Joran declared that he is willing to go to the police to tell them how Satish hit a girl with a car.

In any case, there are so many of these declarations that I don’t understand how a lawyer (and a good lawyer, I’ve been told) can say happily that he lied because he was 17 years old and scared. However, in the same tape recorded in the police car he told Deepak and Satish that he doesn’t care going to jail because he can resist as long as necessary in jail. A healthy 17 year old boy does not make these kinds of declarations!

Besides all the previously mentioned lies, and many more, the case remains stuck. It doesn’t occur to anybody to go deeper to the bottom of all the documented declarations by Joran, Deepak and Satish, and the other interrogated witnesses? These statements were simply taken for what they were and were left lying on papers all this time. Like this you will not solve the case and it will go on creating problems for Aruba.

And now I have a question for the Government: why don’t you file a case against the three suspects and Paulus van der Sloot for all the damage that they caused Aruba? They were the ones who left with the girl in the late hours, in their company she disappeared; they themselves accused each other of doing something bad to Natalee, they themselves created all the stories and lies to lead the police astray! Why were local lawyers not consulted to start a case against Paulus and against the three suspects for all the material damage that they caused our island?

They are principally responsible for the bad reputation that Aruba and our justice system received in the exterior! I am of the opinion that there must be somewhere in the Law to persecute people who destroy the good name of a place, and cause considerable financial problems for its entire population.

Diario August 7, 2006, page 3

http://www.diarioaruba.com/dialuna/editorial/

WOW!  Thanks Klaasend for bringing that over here...


GO JOSSY!

Mrs. Do you have reason to think something is wrong with MeMere?

Mrs. Red - did you see that Celeste posted an email she received from Julia Renfro last night? If not you should read back a couple pages.

I think MeMere was going to visit some people.  I'll have to look through my emails.

I don't know... I just haven't seen her... and I just have a nagging feeling... maybe she just is on vacation. I am going to see if I can email her....

Thanks Klaasend... I couldn't remember if she was ok or not...

I did see that email from julia to Celeste..... and someone should tell aruba that julia only makes their tourism numbers worse!!  Oh, and I need to get some of those stamps, I will email you later...

I am going to look on her chat thread she started in the lounge - I think she mentioned some sort of vacation or plans or something...........

I was just reading my last email from her.  She was going Louisiana to visit with relatives for a few days, that was on 7/29.  She's probably just not back yet.

GOOD!!!  I was worried.    Thank Klaasend... I should have just asked  you first :lol:  :lol:

8) MeMere is the best!  

But then again so are many Monkeys!

It's so true!!!