Natalee Case Discussion #748 4/17 - 4/24/08

[Silverfox]

GAWD how I hate it when short memories prevail...

Any more all I can think of are a short list of facts with a little speculation (cuz in this case it is allowed since the case is NOT yet solved).

1. (no brainer) Nat is still missing and unaccounted for.
2. (no brainer) The video tape shows Nat next to Paulus at the casino table.
3. (no brainer) Paulus made an interesting ATM transaction the morning in question.
4. (no brainer) Paulus sweated like a man with a heavy conscience at the meeting with Beth and Greta.
5. (no brainer) Paulus is the one the official transcripts list as saying basically "no body, no crime)
6. (no brainer) Paulus is the one who convinced his good friends -- the judge and OM to restricct the search of his personal residence.
7. Joran has always basically felt safe from prosecution...
8. Joran always appears to be protecting someone who he admires and respects...
9. Paulus is the one who said I would do anything to protect my son.

based upon the above facts and gut instinct I feel that:

1. Joran is the one who would do anything to protect his father...making him the scapegoat and the sacrificial lamb.
2. This entire affair has many involved (including those who hold much power -- economic and political) and centers around raves which Paulus and the pimps were part of...along with other high powered island "elders"...
3. Paulus is the one who had Joran and the Kalpoes bring him a special treat (Nat) to an after hours Rave party and whatever else happened...
4. The reason Joran has always been so self confident is that it was not him, but his father who was with Nat that fateful time.  Otherwise why would they ever lie about the casino video...l
5. It is the casino video that is damning against them... there is other evidence, I am sure, but someone made sure that the casino video got leaked because it was the one thing that brought down the house of cards...it proves there was contact -- not just between possibly Nat and Joran -- but more so between Paulus and Nat.  And if yo9u look at the video closely it appears Nat is repelled by Paulus and tries to move away from him...
6. There are other thoughts as well -- such as the idea of a US government clandestine operation going on at the same time that captured most of the real evidence in this case -- that in the interest of national security and the war against drugs, etc. etc. explains most of this away...

In a nutshell it is Paulus who is the one who needs to be put under the microscope...If you doubt it review the casino video and his assertions that the video is not of him...

It is the video that fits...the combination of the video plus his and Joran's obvious lies make one wonder why?  Unless, of course, the reason is right under our nose the entire time...

jmho...now back to my hole

[GrannyToad]

When Beth arrived at the house of VdS he did not let her inter the house.

I find that also more than weird.

Far weirder was Paul's rant that they/Jug was OUT OF HIS JURISDICTION.

The direct implication of that is that Paul thought they were there to arrest Joran and/or himself on the spot!

[MumInOhio]

Klaas......Can you help in Carolyn's thread please...TIA

[klaasend]

Klaas......Can you help in Carolyn's thread please...TIA

Taken care of 

[briany]

20 times before and nothing bad ever happened? What went wrong with Natalee?

Joran's book

P 46

My friends and I lied many times that we were on holidays ourselves as well. Girls are a little suspicious about the local boys, the so-called ‘beach bums’. They believe that these boys only try to get them into bed, but if you say you’re on holiday as well, you’ve already taken that hurdle. The more often you do it, the better you know what exactly the best manner is to do it. Most of the time I did say that I had lived on Aruba when I was young and that we still had a house on the island. This immediately explained why we were so familiar with the best clubs and bars.

That's exactly what Natalee's mother told. Joran told one of the nephews and some students that he was a tourist, like Natalee.
Before Beth arrived on the island, she knew already, by having phonecalls with the students and the nephew, that Natalee left with a Dutch guy, who told he was also a tourist on the Island.

Why are Renee Gielen and those fortunetellers keep writing Beth is a liar?
Beth is not a liar, Renee Gielen is the one who spreads lies and rumours. 

So Natalee went with Joran in the car, probably because she was thinking that he gave her a lift to the Holiday Inn.

This is one of the proofs that Beth did not lie.

[GBMW]

Peter De Vries
On the Record w/ Greta
November 27, 2006

VAN SUSTEREN: What about the search of the van der Sloot property? Was that ever done, and was, you know--including, sort of, the cabana area where Joran lives?

DE VRIES: Well, the search in the home address of the family van der Sloot was very strange because the search warrant was made by head prosecutor Karin Janssen, and contained an allowance to search the whole address, “Montanja nineteen.” So, the gardens, the buildings--everything. But, when the police was on the spot, another high-ranking employee of the Justice office--it was Mr. Bob Wit--reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran--and that was very strange.


Beth Twitty
MARTHA MCCALLUM
November 28, 2006
 
TWITTY: Well I think they will always have to look at there were two personnel involved from the Aruban Justice Department and that is why we do not have any evidence and that is what Joran’s attorney will have to be reminded of. It is because of Bob Witt and Ben King stopped the search warrants. It was made to initially search the entire area of Mon. 19 - the garden, the buildings and everything but on the spot a high ranking employee of the Justice Office, Bob Witt, reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran so that’s why we do not have any evidence because of involvement of the obstruction from the Aruban Justice Department personnel.


Gerold Dompig
On the Record /w Greta
October 9, 2005

Reporter: Okay, let me ask you about the search of Joran Van der Sloot house. Apparently this kid lived in an apartment that was connected to or sort of adjacent to his parents house.

Dompig: That is correct

Reporter: And the police only searched his apartment, deputy chief?

Dompig: That is correct. The fact is that we as a law enforcement agency always try to get the maximum. Meaning that we want to search as much places as possible. We were not granted by the judge a search warrant for the complete house, we only received the warrant for the apartment.

Reporter: But what about after Paul Van der Sloot was arrested, couldn’t you get a warrant to search the house then?

Dompig: It was also denied, we were a bit disappointed with that. The judge was coming from another island I must point out. He said we didn’t make a good enough case to get a warrant.
Transcript: SMS/Sleuth

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/10/10/beth-twitty-credibility-1-nay-sayers-0/

Janet: As  far I can recall Peter R. de Vries got this information out of a policefile. And it was an important segment of his show; I doubt he would have aired it the way he did without the back up evidence for it. He didn't exactly bring it as a rumour....

If Karin Janssen requested it for the whole address at the time it would be weird if a judge would deny it (certainly at that point in the investigation)....as if that sweet innocent 17 year old ONLY lived in his own little appartment....
And they must have had other evidence (maybe collected later?) connected to the house...otherwise they wouldn't have been allowed to go through their garden in 2007.

When you consider that the Dompig claimed in October, 2005 that the search warrant was only for Joran's apartment and ... recently Wit refutes Devries claim that the search warrant was for the entire VDS property ... I wonder why Devries has never refuted Wit's claim on his blog ... in the many recent recent talk show interview.

Devries recent silence on this issue or any issue regarding a perceived coverup in the investigation of Natalee Holloway ... concerns me.

GBMW ... since Wit's recent public denial that he never reduced the scope of the search warrant ... I have been waiting for Devries denial.

Devries publicly claims that he has solved the case by implicating "only" Joran.

Janet

Peter R. de Vries is probably not doing this because in Jorans confession there is no mention of things that have happened near / in his house...so it doesn't add up with his storyline 

Maybe Paulus didn't know in the beginning what was going on and had started getting doubts about Joran....so he cut down the search just to be sure.

It's still beyond weird they didn't search that house from top to bottom though....and if you're innocent you would want the police to come and get every little trace they could possible find...so there can be no mistake about that later on. But that could be me   

[MumInOhio]

Klaas......Can you help in Carolyn's thread please...TIA

Taken care of 

I see...Thank you!

[Rob]

Peter R. de Vries is probably not doing this because in Jorans confession there is no mention of things that have happened near / in his house...so it doesn't add up with his storyline 

Maybe Paulus didn't know in the beginning what was going on and had started getting doubts about Joran....so he cut down the search just to be sure.

It's still beyond weird they didn't search that house from top to bottom though....and if you're innocent you would want the police to come and get every little trace they could possible find...so there can be no mistake about that later on. But that could be me   
[/quote]

Hi GBMW, I started to make a comment on this yesterday and at the last second decided not to post it. I thought it sounded stoopid, so I never posted it...

but anyway, I'll say it now.

I believe the Sloot house has now been cleared. Sorry to say. The KLPD searched the house and took samples and dirt from the garden and took that back to Holland and to the NFI... I just guess those samples did not do anything to move the case forward. I also imagine that over the last year, since the KLPD was at the Sloot home, they have had ample time to competently view those samples and correlate any evidence one way or the other.

The fact that this all occurred a year ago tells me the Sloot house is now cleared... jmo... 

[GBMW]

Peter R. de Vries is probably not doing this because in Jorans confession there is no mention of things that have happened near / in his house...so it doesn't add up with his storyline 

Maybe Paulus didn't know in the beginning what was going on and had started getting doubts about Joran....so he cut down the search just to be sure.

It's still beyond weird they didn't search that house from top to bottom though....and if you're innocent you would want the police to come and get every little trace they could possible find...so there can be no mistake about that later on. But that could be me   

Hi GBMW, I started to make a comment on this yesterday and at the last second decided not to post it. I thought it sounded stoopid, so I never posted it...

but anyway, I'll say it now.

I believe the Sloot house has now been cleared. Sorry to say. The KLPD searched the house and took samples and dirt from the garden and took that back to Holland and to the NFI... I just guess those samples did not do anything to move the case forward. I also imagine that over the last year, since the KLPD was at the Sloot home, they have had ample time to competently view those samples and correlate any evidence one way or the other.

The fact that this all occurred a year ago tells me the Sloot house is now cleared... jmo... 
[/quote]

Yeah you're probably right. But not finding evidence around the premises would have been more valid (at least to me...don't know if that's even a correct assumption) if that happened in june 2005

[Lala'sMom]

Did we ever determine who owned the Indo?   

[hotping]

UNBELIEVABLE!

Aruba Travel: The Island's Best Beach
Where: Aruba
4/21/2008 at 1:00 PM
Tags: Aruba-Travel-Map, Beaches, Islands (all tags)


 

 

Forget Natalee Holloway. Yes, the 2005 disappearance of the Alabama high school student was tragic, but Aruba's endured a bad rap for long enough. It's time to rethink this Dutch island just off the coast of Venezuela and give it the respect it deserves.

Like any good trip to the Caribbean, yours should begin on the beach--more specifically, Palm Beach, part of Aruba's finest stretch of powdery white sand.

 

Considering many of Aruba's beachfront hotels are located on Palm Beach (or just south on popular Eagle Beach), it's likely you won't have far to look for this superior shoreline. But beachgoers take note: There's much to do and days spent lazing can easily turn into days wasted.

Start yours with a windsurfing lesson from Aruba Active Vacations. The company keeps a beach shack at the northern tip of Palm Beach, in front of the Marriott Hotel. It's where you'll find the island's finest windsurfing spot, with strong westerly breezes and a shallow sea floor.

On the southern end of Palm Beach, families and photography buffs should consider a trip to the Butterfly Farm--a screened-in tropical garden teeming with over 35 species of butterflies from around the world. In addition to learning about the insect's life cycle, you'll have a close up view of some of the world's most colorful creatures.

Finally, no day on Palm Beach is complete without a sunset sail. Head to Pelican Adventures on the Pelican Pier, where for $40 you'll be treated to open bar and a stunning view from the outfit's catamaran.

Related Stories:
· Aruba Active Vacations [Official Site]
· Butterfly Farm [Official Site]
· Pelican Adventures [Official Site]
· Aruba Travel coverage [Jaunted]



 1 Comment - Add Yours by David LaHuta


 

Add YoursComments
Comments on Aruba Travel: The Island's Best Beach
 

NewsBreaker
Jaunted Member BOYCOTT ARUBA!! (none / 0)
Forget Natalee Holloway. How dare you! Aruba is still covering up a murder of an American woman. In my opinion, Joran and the Kalpoe brothers killed her with Paulus aiding dumping her in the ocean. As Joran just stated-We dumped her in the ocean with a friend (Paulus?) and she may still have been alive.  There is so much corruption that we uncovered, that I would never want anyone to go there. Hope your child goes to Aruba and you find out how uneducated you are!!!

Boycott Aruba!!

Larry Garrison
The NewsBreaker and co-author of "ARUBA-THE TRAGIC UNTOLD STORY OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY AND CORRUPTION IN PARADISE" with Dave Holloway and R. Stephanie Good.   

http://www.jaunted.com/story/2008/4/21/101840/030/travel/Aruba+Travel:+The+Island's+Best+Beach

[GBMW]

Peter De Vries
On the Record w/ Greta
November 27, 2006

VAN SUSTEREN: What about the search of the van der Sloot property? Was that ever done, and was, you know--including, sort of, the cabana area where Joran lives?

DE VRIES: Well, the search in the home address of the family van der Sloot was very strange because the search warrant was made by head prosecutor Karin Janssen, and contained an allowance to search the whole address, “Montanja nineteen.” So, the gardens, the buildings--everything. But, when the police was on the spot, another high-ranking employee of the Justice office--it was Mr. Bob Wit--reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran--and that was very strange.


Beth Twitty
MARTHA MCCALLUM
November 28, 2006
 
TWITTY: Well I think they will always have to look at there were two personnel involved from the Aruban Justice Department and that is why we do not have any evidence and that is what Joran’s attorney will have to be reminded of. It is because of Bob Witt and Ben King stopped the search warrants. It was made to initially search the entire area of Mon. 19 - the garden, the buildings and everything but on the spot a high ranking employee of the Justice Office, Bob Witt, reduced the search warrant to only the room of Joran so that’s why we do not have any evidence because of involvement of the obstruction from the Aruban Justice Department personnel.


Gerold Dompig
On the Record /w Greta
October 9, 2005

Reporter: Okay, let me ask you about the search of Joran Van der Sloot house. Apparently this kid lived in an apartment that was connected to or sort of adjacent to his parents house.

Dompig: That is correct

Reporter: And the police only searched his apartment, deputy chief?

Dompig: That is correct. The fact is that we as a law enforcement agency always try to get the maximum. Meaning that we want to search as much places as possible. We were not granted by the judge a search warrant for the complete house, we only received the warrant for the apartment.

Reporter: But what about after Paul Van der Sloot was arrested, couldn’t you get a warrant to search the house then?

Dompig: It was also denied, we were a bit disappointed with that. The judge was coming from another island I must point out. He said we didn’t make a good enough case to get a warrant.
Transcript: SMS/Sleuth

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/10/10/beth-twitty-credibility-1-nay-sayers-0/

Janet: As  far I can recall Peter R. de Vries got this information out of a policefile. And it was an important segment of his show; I doubt he would have aired it the way he did without the back up evidence for it. He didn't exactly bring it as a rumour....

If Karin Janssen requested it for the whole address at the time it would be weird if a judge would deny it (certainly at that point in the investigation)....as if that sweet innocent 17 year old ONLY lived in his own little appartment....
And they must have had other evidence (maybe collected later?) connected to the house...otherwise they wouldn't have been allowed to go through their garden in 2007.

When you consider that the Dompig claimed in October, 2005 that the search warrant was only for Joran's apartment and ... recently Wit refutes Devries claim that the search warrant was for the entire VDS property ... I wonder why Devries has never refuted Wit's claim on his blog ... in the many recent recent talk show interview.

Devries recent silence on this issue or any issue regarding a perceived coverup in the investigation of Natalee Holloway ... concerns me.

GBMW ... since Wit's recent public denial that he never reduced the scope of the search warrant ... I have been waiting for Devries denial.

Devries publicly claims that he has solved the case by implicating "only" Joran.

Janet

I checked the segment on the Peter R. de Vries Show: Karin Janssen confirmed in a letter (a reply to the long letter that Peter R. de Vries sent her since the ALE wouldn't answer questions on camera) that de Wit changed the search warrant.

[Kermit]

From what I understand Betico was wonderful and Rudy is the evil one.

I forget what Hendrik looks like.  Does anybody have a picture?

He doesn't wear the goat beard like the other 2

Thanks for the picture.  He doesn't look like the other.  Has Hendrik driven into anybody this week?

SS
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Kermit]

Rudy's beard is so silly looking. He should just shave it off.  He looks like the Papa Smurf figure that my son had many years ago.

LOL! I agree,but that is Betico Croes who is deceased and a legend in Aruba..This is the evil one giving a speech in September 2005 about how incredible Beth's attitude is..

Reminds me of the recently departed Charlton Heston and his famous line..The Damn Dirty Apes 

 

[Kiwi]

Personally a search warrant would have been nice at the start of the case, but unless they found Natalee's drivers license sitting on the washing machine nothing they collected would have mattered. One fact with the evidence remains, they were stopped from taking DNA from the suspects. Without it they can't even prove what car Natalee got into that night. Basically, except for the fact that they admit that they drove her in a car there isn't any DNA to verify the car used. They should have used the DNA from the suspects just to verify the car as a base line to rule out unknown DNA. Simply, no DNA  of Joran and Natalee then its the wrong car or its been altered. Note for the police did they alter only the back seat area ie cleaning fluid or chocolate. Who had the chocolates in the back seat? Where is that persons DNA sample? The real cover up is using 100 year old scientific investigating techniques rather then whats available now.

[GBMW]

Personally a search warrant would have been nice at the start of the case, but unless they found Natalee's drivers license sitting on the washing machine nothing they collected would have mattered. One fact with the evidence remains, they were stopped from taking DNA from the suspects. Without it they can't even prove what car Natalee got into that night. Basically, except for the fact that they admit that they drove her in a car there isn't any DNA to verify the car used. They should have used the DNA from the suspects just to verify the car as a base line to rule out unknown DNA. Simply, no DNA  of Joran and Natalee then its the wrong car or its been altered. Note for the police did they alter only the back seat area ie cleaning fluid or chocolate. Who had the chocolates in the back seat? Where is that persons DNA sample? The real cover up is using 100 year old scientific investigating techniques rather then whats available now.

Sorry; don't get that....could you explain that to me? 

[Buckeye]

I checked the segment on the Peter R. de Vries Show: Karin Janssen confirmed in a letter (a reply to the long letter that Peter R. de Vries sent her since the ALE wouldn't answer questions on camera) that de Wit changed the search warrant.

You do mean the Judge Wit, and not the police commissioner, deWit...correct?

[GrannyToad]

Midnight Jogger Bulletin
DIARIO Aruba
8/22/2005

Police got an anonymous tip from a person who regularly jogs very early in the morning hours, in the area of Rooi Santo and the Aruba Racquet Club.

This person is male and now his information is considered very valuable to Police.

The Police requests that the jogger get in contact with the Police spokesperson, Papito Comencia by telephone at 583-3483 or 582-4000

As of yesterday, this person has not reacted to the request. DIARIO doesn't know if there was someone there to answer the phone. An American journalist tried calling live, but one of the numbers was a fax machine and the other, no one answered.

It is known that this person (witness) possibly saw a very suspicionsly parked vehicle in the early morning hours. This would corroborate the other witness who said that he saw this vehicle, with the suspects Deepak, Satish and Joran.

http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2005_08_21_archive.html

--snip--

That event was mainly a lie according to scubajap (not the part about unmanned line). There was a Colombian recently out of KIA (for abusing a female) who did jog along through there; the cops were trying to get a call either from or about him but he was long gone.

[Buckeye]

20 times before and nothing bad ever happened? What went wrong with Natalee?

Joran's book

P 46

My friends and I lied many times that we were on holidays ourselves as well. Girls are a little suspicious about the local boys, the so-called ‘beach bums’. They believe that these boys only try to get them into bed, but if you say you’re on holiday as well, you’ve already taken that hurdle. The more often you do it, the better you know what exactly the best manner is to do it. Most of the time I did say that I had lived on Aruba when I was young and that we still had a house on the island. This immediately explained why we were so familiar with the best clubs and bars.

That's exactly what Natalee's mother told. Joran told one of the nephews and some students that he was a tourist, like Natalee.
Before Beth arrived on the island, she knew already, by having phonecalls with the students and the nephew, that Natalee left with a Dutch guy, who told he was also a tourist on the Island.

Why are Renee Gielen and those fortunetellers keep writing Beth is a liar?
Beth is not a liar, Renee Gielen is the one who spreads lies and rumours. 

So Natalee went with Joran in the car, probably because she was thinking that he gave her a lift to the Holiday Inn.

This is one of the proofs that Beth did not lie.

My guess is that Renee is sleeping with one of the Ministers.  There have been numerous facts to refute her (psychic) visions.  There is also an FBI 302 statement, from one of Natalee's friends, that said that Joran introduced himself as a 19 yr. old Soccer player from Holland. Sorta makes the whole "I had to get home to get to sleep for my big test" story a bigger concoction than even originally thought.

[jackb]

Well Today I have spend my time on decoding the Merien Ernest Post and she knows.

I need to find the cousins of the parlamentair Robert Maduro.

Who do you think the Whisperer is?

Also anyone have any word of Virginia Page or whatever her name might be today.

Also I need the old friend FBI man that was good friend of Dompig, He was in Aruba at the time in question, he saw everything and knows,  need a Name?

Got to go.
 
More Later

Are you speaking of Eric Williams the "agent" who was on scene with Beth.  Also Fred Maduro, wasn't he the man over the prison when the young girl interviewed and went to joran's cell and they put him doing something else or fired him?  JackB