Natalee Case Discussion #791 1/6/09 - 1/9/09

[caesu]

Dutch Justice Minister
denounces intimidation

THE HAGUE--Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin denounced any form of threats against any person and stated on Tuesday that the security of Dutch Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman of the Party for Freedom PVV had his attention.

In a letter to the Chairperson of the Dutch Second Chamber, responding to questions by PVV leader and Member of Parliament (MP) Geert Wilders, the Minister said he had taken note of the quotes in various media about the threat against Brinkman by a senior government official in Aruba.

Aruba’s Chief of Protocol Eric Brete told Brinkman on Monday that he had to restrain himself not to beat up the Dutch Member of Parliament. Brinkman had called Aruba’s government “corrupt as hell” in an interview with the American TV channel FoxNews. Aruba’s Justice Minister Rudy Croes stated in response that Brinkman deserved a “smash in the face.”

Hirsch Ballin said he could not trace whether the quotes in the media were correct. But, he added, “Threatening with violence is unacceptable, no matter who voices this threat.”

Wilders had asked about protection for Brinkman who was in Aruba to attend the Parliamentary Consultation of the Kingdom POK. Hirsch Ballin said Brinkman’s security situation had his attention, but he didn’t specify how the MP would be protected.

Answering Wilders’ question whether the Dutch Government would consider demanding the resignation of Rudy Croes, to whom the PVV leader referred as a “dangerous fool,” Hirsch Ballin said the appointment or resignation of an Aruban Minister was an “internal affair.”

Hirsch Ballin explained that within the Kingdom of the Netherlands there were three autonomous countries: the Netherlands, the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba. The Netherlands doesn’t become involved the appointment or resignation of members of government in Aruba.

Referring to Wilders’ question about whether the Dutch Government was willing to break all ties with the Government of Aruba as long as Croes was in public office, Hirsch Ballin stated that he saw “no reason to curb Aruba’s government, let alone break the relations.” He also distanced himself from the words “dangerous fool” and “mafia government” as expressed by Wilders.

http://www.thedailyherald.com/news/daily/l197/answer197.html

[Anna]

Monkeys knew and monkeys said all along that evidence in the hands of ALE is evidence compromised.  This has always been a known fact and there is nothing new or "conspiratorial" about it.

From Dennis Jacobs throwing away the belt to the park ranger on film tossing a piece of fabric to the wind, we have known this.

It was a mistake for them to ever be allowed sole custody of the contents of the trap and something about which we forewarned.

Natalee's entire family have all said so as well.  At least Beth, Jug and Dave have indicated that this is the case. 

So why is it suddenly OK for the crew of the Persistence to give absolute control of the contents of the trap to ALE?  I don't believe ALE has changed at all during the last 3.5 years and claims to the contrary do not impress me.  It has always been a big mistake to allow ALE sole access to any evidence.

If the crew of the Persistence did this with the three and a half years warning, then shame on them.  What a waste of effort!

[Tamikosmom]

If all this Persistence/Kyle conspiracy theory stuff is the real deal, why is the family, the media, etc. not jumping all over it?  The more I read all Kyle's "statements" the more he reminds of when my son was 14 and had his own website.  I think Kyle the ocean exploring geek has a little make believe world going on, and you're all going along for the ride.  If nobody has any real evidence here (no, Kyle's words are not evidence), I think it's time to get off this subject, especially if it is hurting the family.  I would bank on the fact that the family, DeVries, Tim Miller, Greta, etc. all have a better idea of the real facts of the case than Kyle does.  Re-read the end of Beth's book for her theory, re-watch the Dateline show and see the dedication on the faces of everyone working together on the Persistence.  This Kyle stuff is nothing but conspiracy theory.  You are losing some of the smartest monkeys because most of you are locked onto this one theory, and some are being mean to those who oppose "the" theory!  And aren't the snarky posts talking about other posters off-topic? 

Iris ... Kyle Kingman is not a 14 year old kid.  Kyle Kingman is an adult.  Kyle Kingman has a profession career in oceanography.  Kyle Kingman owns his own company.  Kyle Kingman is a husband.  Kyle Kingman is a father.  Kyle Kingman held a professional position on board the Persistence.

I am a believer in Kyle's own words ... words that exposed that the Persistence endeavor had nothing to do with justice for Natalee Holloway and ... had everything to do with John Silvetti assisting the ALE in the finale to the great Aruban coverup in exchange for benefits that furthered his own self interests on the island.

Now that Kyle Kingman' own words are not going to go away and ... those who have up until now upheld both Kyle and John Silvetti realize there is a conflict and ... a choice needs to be made in regards to alliance.

1.  If Kyle Kingman's words are the truth then ... John Silvetti is a scam artist in regards his claims regarding the objective of Persistence undertaking or ...

2.  If Kyle Kingman's words are outright lies then ... there is no proof that John Silvetti's intentions were nothing but honorable.

Iris ... if your post is any indication ... I do believe that Kyle Kingman is going to be thrown under the bus with the implication that he is a liar and ... John Silvetti will emerge the hero of the Persistence endeavor.

Hey ... maybe a negotiated agreement betwee Kyle Kingman and John Silvetti will have Kyle  conceding that his own words posted to the Natalee's Freebirds and Scared Monkey sites were fabricated.

Iris ... I have a question.  Do you have any connection to John Silvetti?

Thank you.

Janet

[Anna]

Could someone please post the "one theory" that we all believe?  I must not have gotten the memo.


I don't usually get personal, but I didn't like the comment about Beth being good woman "but".....  There could be other family members influenced by people with an agenda...MIP6 etc. I believe, by Alabama law, Beth made the decisions regarding Natalee and had for a long time.

 I too am glad Dave changed his number, and feel way too many have called him.  I feel like I lost a good friend not being able to chat with him.....Hello...If you were considered a good "friend", you would have received the new number. Are you one of the "too many"?

 I just wonder how many of the "connected" are not connected...Because someone answers a phone, does not make someone a confident...

Jug Twitty needs to change his phone number next.

Yes, he does, especially from the twisted version of events I have seen posted here, claims the family had the remains and were concealing that fact when this was NEVER stated by one person at SM, etc.

It is probably a good idea for all the family to change their phone number to get away from the crackpots at this point in time.

Real information and clues can always be filtered through the FBI and that would eliminate the gossip reports of which they must be very weary by now.

MO

[Anna]

Aren't the threats against Brinkman proof exactly of what he is saying?

In Aruba we will smash you in the face if you say we are thugs?  Doesn't that just say it all?

Also, maybe Hero is collecting a set of the wine glasses and only needs a couple more to complete the set, hahahahahha

Just kidding but that's what one is led to believe from their silliness.

.

[Keepthefaith]

Good Morning from Seattle Monkey's.If not snow.Flooding. It's not affecting myself.Amen!

1:30pm in Aruba.Just got to the store.Has any Major player been arrested?I think the Monkey's would have posted it!

[Anna]

Day four of arrest week is now upon us.I'm still waiting for the arrest of the Major Player!2 days left.Will a Major player be arrested?

Yes, it must happen today or tomorrow.  Arrest is imminent.  And Joran is back in the NL and hasn't been home to Aruba in quite a while so maybe it will afford him another free trip to see mom and dad.  But something tells me Mos is not anticipating any arrest at all.  But then we were told he was out and no longer in charge so I wonder why he is still the spokesperson for OM.   

I changed my avatar as that must be why no one is responding to my posts this morning.  Has to be, right?   

LOL!

[Keepthefaith]

Day four of arrest week is now upon us.I'm still waiting for the arrest of the Major Player!2 days left.Will a Major player be arrested?

 

Keepthefaith ... in your world CAPS is never going to live this misinformation down ... if it is misinformation.
 
 

Good morning all!!

Janet
8:10 AM PT

 

[Keepthefaith]

Day four of arrest week is now upon us.I'm still waiting for the arrest of the Major Player!2 days left.Will a Major player be arrested?

Yes, it must happen today or tomorrow.  Arrest is imminent.  And Joran is back in the NL and hasn't been home to Aruba in quite a while so maybe it will afford him another free trip to see mom and dad.  But something tells me Mos is not anticipating any arrest at all.  But then we were told he was out and no longer in charge so I wonder why he is still the spokesperson for OM.   

I changed my avatar as that must be why no one is responding to my posts this morning.  Has to be, right?   

LOL!

Hello Anna!Just got to work in the Rainy Northwest.Caps said that an arrest of a Major player was gonna happen so i thought i'd keep the running dialogue.Sorry if it is annoying.It will end on Friday.

[Anna]

Fool me once, shame on you.

Fool me twice, shame on me!

Just saying. . . . OK, off to work.


.
 

[Keepthefaith]

Fool me once, shame on you.

Fool me twice, shame on me!

Just saying. . . . OK, off to work.


.
 

Much agreed.!Have a great day!

[blah]

Monkeys knew and monkeys said all along that evidence in the hands of ALE is evidence compromised.  This has always been a known fact and there is nothing new or "conspiratorial" about it.

From Dennis Jacobs throwing away the belt to the park ranger on film tossing a piece of fabric to the wind, we have known this.

It was a mistake for them to ever be allowed sole custody of the contents of the trap and something about which we forewarned.

Natalee's entire family have all said so as well.  At least Beth, Jug and Dave have indicated that this is the case. 

So why is it suddenly OK for the crew of the Persistence to give absolute control of the contents of the trap to ALE?  I don't believe ALE has changed at all during the last 3.5 years and claims to the contrary do not impress me.  It has always been a big mistake to allow ALE sole access to any evidence.

If the crew of the Persistence did this with the three and a half years warning, then shame on them.  What a waste of effort!

Do we know for absolute certain that they didnt take anything?  If they did, would they admit it here?  Should we really be bashing them without all the facts?

[Tamikosmom]

Klaas

Would you please delete my post 532.  I think that almost seven months no coffee is taking its toll.

 

Thanks

Janet

[klaasend]

Klaas

Would you please delete my post 532.  I think that almost seven months no coffee is taking its toll.

 

Thanks

Janet

Done

[Tamikosmom]

Klaas

Would you please delete my post 532.  I think that almost seven months no coffee is taking its toll.

 

Thanks

Janet

Done

Thanks

Janet

[cajun miracle]

Thank you SS. It's nice to hear because I like making them. I've been trying to hide out in there to finish the avatar thread, but I can't resist news of Natalee. Caylee's heating up too.

In a weird way, I'm so proud of Natalee. Look what she has brought to light, and who knows what she has prevented by perhaps someone making a decision NOT to vacation in Aruba because of her case.

CBB, Could you dress me for Mardi Gras? Please and thank you.

[Keepthefaith]

Could someone please post the "one theory" that we all believe?  I must not have gotten the memo.


I don't usually get personal, but I didn't like the comment about Beth being good woman "but".....  There could be other family members influenced by people with an agenda...MIP6 etc. I believe, by Alabama law, Beth made the decisions regarding Natalee and had for a long time.

 I too am glad Dave changed his number, and feel way too many have called him.  I feel like I lost a good friend not being able to chat with him.....Hello...If you were considered a good "friend", you would have received the new number. Are you one of the "too many"?

 I just wonder how many of the "connected" are not connected...Because someone answers a phone, does not make someone a confident...

That exemplifies what a great person Dave is.I for one,would not have entertained calls as long as he apparently has.God bless you Dave and changing your phone # was the right thing to do.JMOO!

[crazybabyborg]

Thank you SS. It's nice to hear because I like making them. I've been trying to hide out in there to finish the avatar thread, but I can't resist news of Natalee. Caylee's heating up too.

In a weird way, I'm so proud of Natalee. Look what she has brought to light, and who knows what she has prevented by perhaps someone making a decision NOT to vacation in Aruba because of her case.

CBB, Could you dress me for Mardi Gras? Please and thank you.

Hi Cajun. Can you meet me in the thread at the link in my signature line? Thnks! 

[2NJSons_Mom]

Janet,

It was not my intent to be short last night.  I was overtired due to being awakened at 4am by son & DH discussion about the ice storm we'd had and the horrible conditions here.  Neither was able to make it into work, yesterday. 

Anyway, when I spoke of who may have brokered the Persistence undertaking, I was thinking more of benefactors or associates in big businesses, with similar interests & goals.  I was not questioning everyday people like ourselves who donated to the venture (regarding your referencing a scam). 

[Tamikosmom]

Dutch Justice Minister
denounces intimidation

THE HAGUE--Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin denounced any form of threats against any person and stated on Tuesday that the security of Dutch Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman of the Party for Freedom PVV had his attention.

In a letter to the Chairperson of the Dutch Second Chamber, responding to questions by PVV leader and Member of Parliament (MP) Geert Wilders, the Minister said he had taken note of the quotes in various media about the threat against Brinkman by a senior government official in Aruba.

Aruba’s Chief of Protocol Eric Brete told Brinkman on Monday that he had to restrain himself not to beat up the Dutch Member of Parliament. Brinkman had called Aruba’s government “corrupt as hell” in an interview with the American TV channel FoxNews. Aruba’s Justice Minister Rudy Croes stated in response that Brinkman deserved a “smash in the face.”

Hirsch Ballin said he could not trace whether the quotes in the media were correct. But, he added, “Threatening with violence is unacceptable, no matter who voices this threat.”

Wilders had asked about protection for Brinkman who was in Aruba to attend the Parliamentary Consultation of the Kingdom POK. Hirsch Ballin said Brinkman’s security situation had his attention, but he didn’t specify how the MP would be protected.

Answering Wilders’ question whether the Dutch Government would consider demanding the resignation of Rudy Croes, to whom the PVV leader referred as a “dangerous fool,” Hirsch Ballin said the appointment or resignation of an Aruban Minister was an “internal affair.”

Hirsch Ballin explained that within the Kingdom of the Netherlands there were three autonomous countries: the Netherlands, the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba. The Netherlands doesn’t become involved the appointment or resignation of members of government in Aruba.

Referring to Wilders’ question about whether the Dutch Government was willing to break all ties with the Government of Aruba as long as Croes was in public office, Hirsch Ballin stated that he saw “no reason to curb Aruba’s government, let alone break the relations.” He also distanced himself from the words “dangerous fool” and “mafia government” as expressed by Wilders.

 

http://www.thedailyherald.com/news/daily/l197/answer197.html

The words of Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin relates in a nutshell that the Aruban and Dutch administrations are thisclose and ... any verbal oppostion (Wilder/Brinkman) to the the corruption abounding in Aruba may be tolerated to a point ... it is all for naught.  Until the people of the Netherlands elected a government headed by Wilder, Brinkman or a politician with an aligning ideology ... the status quo will be where it is at.

Janet