Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #8 7/20/10 - 7/23/10

[doubledecker]

Hi Monkeys!

Thanks for all the articles, links and insights. It's JMO, but I wish somebody would just string Terri up by her thumbs until she told what she knows about Kyron's disappearance.
I just can't extend myself to afford her compassion or understanding until Kyron is found, and I'm convinced she has, AT LEAST, information that can help locate him.

Again.................. JMO.

I think they might be stringing up others by the thumbs at this point in time, hoping they might know something and tell them what it is... I think at this point LE probably thinks friends of terri's know something, have been told something etc... and so now they are going after the friends. 

Yup.  Has anyone else besides me wondered if Terri's, "hitting the gym" was code for something?

oh yes, I thought that as soon as I read it... but I always look for things like that. 
it is very possible she was in contact with someone and trying to leave them messages. 
I believe LE thinks she probably told someone something.  or at least what she talked to them about contradicted what she told LE... they are looking for whatever terri has said to anyone, is what I think... and hopefully that info will come out... I want to know what she said to others...that will help me decide more things.. of course I am a nobody and I don't deserve to know anything, but does not stop me from wanting to know so I can make up my mind.  I like to be informed LOL... Especially, when I know a little bit and it would be better to know a lot. 

[klaasend]

OMGosh.  Kaine spents 3 hrs with investigators and TH supporters are making something of it.  The man's child is missing.  LE informs him of a hit on his life.  LE tells him his wife didn't pass her polys.  LE tells him of an affair she had after Kyron went missing.  Gee, wonder what they could've spent 3 whole hours talking about????  I'd bet that Kaine wants to be as involved in the search for Kyron as possible and I'd also bet that LE are trying to include him as much as possible to help keep him focused.  IIRC, they have gotten 3000 tips and are asking for more funds to continue the search.  Maybe Kaine is answering questions about the tips, getting ideas on how to raise money for LE or even telling LE what he's found in the home since he returned.

I've known families of missing persons.  3 hr meetings with investigators are no surprise. 

Hi KittyMom,  A well taken look at Kaine.  I do believe he was not involved in the actual disappearance of his son.

That leaves what I haven't said, that there must have been signs of disquiet in the home, things he noticed {as he said he noticed at how she changed after the birth of the baby girl 18 mos ago}.  How did he address this?   Did he notice Kyron was unhappy around her?  The devotion Kaine showed to Kyron, was it obvious if we could go back and see the family dynamics?  What about her concentration on the baby with the camera always on the shot of her?

We can't say in retrospect.  But I have lived enough to know that feelings are real, and children are the best receptors.  If each parent was doting too much on their 'natural' child, not looking at the reality of how it affected the family dynamics, maybe he did not see the hatred she must have had for him and how she would be capable or using another person he truly loved to bring him to his knees.

Just a thought.  And so he chose to take another lover.  It just doesn't add up to all that he should have been for Kyron IMO.

He's appears in photos to be a devoted dad.

From Kiara's first birthday:





May 2010



Mothers Day 2010



June 2010

[KittyMom]

Hi Monkeys!

Thanks for all the articles, links and insights. It's JMO, but I wish somebody would just string Terri up by her thumbs until she told what she knows about Kyron's disappearance.
I just can't extend myself to afford her compassion or understanding until Kyron is found, and I'm convinced she has, AT LEAST, information that can help locate him.

Again.................. JMO.

I think they might be stringing up others by the thumbs at this point in time, hoping they might know something and tell them what it is... I think at this point LE probably thinks friends of terri's know something, have been told something etc... and so now they are going after the friends. 

Yup.  Has anyone else besides me wondered if Terri's, "hitting the gym" was code for something?

oh yes, I thought that as soon as I read it... but I always look for things like that. 
it is very possible she was in contact with someone and trying to leave them messages. 
I believe LE thinks she probably told someone something.  or at least what she talked to them about contradicted what she told LE... they are looking for whatever terri has said to anyone, is what I think... and hopefully that info will come out... I want to know what she said to others...that will help me decide more things.. of course I am a nobody and I don't deserve to know anything, but does not stop me from wanting to know so I can make up my mind.  I like to be informed LOL... Especially, when I know a little bit and it would be better to know a lot. 

hmmm....hitting the gym = hitting the Jim?

j/k...I have no idea.  I can't understand how a brain like that works.  I've had times I've wanted to pinch my husband but I've never tried hiring a gardener to do it for me.  I just don't get that kind of thinking.

[Scandi]

Hi Dear DD, I think you are way too kind in looking at Kaine.  I do believe his manner is controlling and have seen it in this case.  That would be good if he was pure in heart and history.  I rather doubt that.  Yes. he is an innocent victim here IMO, and not involved in Kyron's disappearance.  I do believe however that he must have seen something brewing between Kyron and
Terri. Also that he was also sexually promiscuous in his marriage and have heard the RUMORS that swinging was an activity he also indulged in along with her.

I guess I am saying he is not beyond the pale IMO.  Had he been more in tune with his son and what was happening under his roof he might have taken protective measures to distance Kyron from Terri, protecting him from her unstable personality . . . maybe sending him for a time to be with his Mom.

He would possibly still be here now, as we speak.

Rumors are silly things, but they can be used for such nefarious purposes and can do so much damage. It's a very cowardly practice IMO. And anyway, what does anyone's sexual habits (besides sexting when your child is missing) have to do with this case? And why on earth would anyone be spreading rumors about Kaine that have no bearing on this case (besides being ridiculously puritanical imo)? The only person that could possibly benefit would be Terri, so I think it would be her or her cohorts starting these rumors and hoping bloggers will spread them.

Well, I see your point Scatty.  It could be RUMOR or real.  Whatever, the fact it is out there doesn't speak well for raising children in such a home.  The affair on the part of Kaine was stated in some legal document I believe.  It is true the swinging aspect mighf be be a nefarius ploy on someone's part.  Again, whatever.   Don't children deserve more than being exposed to something of this nature?  His affair alone leaves me doubtful as to his integrity as a married man no matter what his wife was into.  IMO

The only legal document that I am aware of deals with infidelity on the part of Terri.  The rumor about Kaine having an affair was started by some psychic that is supposedly friends with Terri's mom.  Consider the source!

Oops, I might have to go to work now.     Ya Ya     I do remember tho that it was written in a link {a document to my memory} that it was about 6 mos before Kyron went missing that Terri approached a LS to hire him to kill her husband when she became so 'hurt', learning that Kaine was having an affair with another lady.

Okay, that was what the landscaper was told by Terri.  Of course that was never substantiated.

Yea,  I guess that is true.  Like Klaas said, it is hard to believe anyone who would approach someone with a MFH deal as being truthfull, eh? 

The only over riding feeling I have about that is LE seems to accept what the LS said.  I didn't hear them discount it. 


Personally I think both of them were more concerned with themselves than the children or they would not have been living the lives they possibly were.  If they really were, that is.  Something was rotten in the State of Skyline that day or Kyron would never have disappeared IMO.

Whose advantage was it to have him out of the picture?  Who was threatened in some way that his being gone forever would solve their own problem of future happiness, living life as that person envisioned it forever.  He must have been an obstacle to that person's future lifestyle IMO.

[Daydream]

http://www.katu.com/news/local/98981009.html


Sources: Terri Horman vague on Kyron’s doctor appointment date

By Anna Song KATU News and KATU.com Staff



Story Published: Jul 21, 2010 at 7:11 PM PDT

Story Updated: Jul 21, 2010 at 7:11 PM PDT
Sources: Terri Horman vague on Kyron’s doctor appointment date

PORTLAND, Ore. - There was no expectation on the part of Skyline School that Kyron Horman would be in class after the science fair the day he disappeared, according to multiple sources.

Prior to his June 4 disappearance, Kyron Horman’s stepmother, Terri Horman, informed his teacher he had a doctor’s appointment on Friday, the sources said, and it was why there was no expectation Kyron would be in class after the science fair. Once class began at 10 a.m., his teacher marked him absent.

According to sources, investigators believe Terri Horman was vague about which Friday she was referring to when she gave notice to the school Kyron would be gone and only after he was missing did she clarify that the doctor’s appointment was on June 11, the Friday after the science fair.

Portland Public Schools spokesperson Matt Shelby told KATU News, "Two teachers were the last school staff to see Kyron at Skyline. His own teacher and another teacher saw him inside the school with his stepmother, and there didn't appear to be anything out of the ordinary.”

Kim Holm’s son, Kurtis, who Terri Horman photographed with his science project around the time she took a picture of Kyron that morning, said her son knew about the appointment too.

“And the teacher said, ‘I thought he left with his mom,’ because they thought they had a doctor appointment,” Holm said. “And then at lunchtime, Kurtis ate lunch with him every day, he wasn’t there at lunchtime. And then I got a call at 4:30ish, saying he didn’t get off the bus, I guess. And Kurtis said, ‘Oh yeah, I knew he was already gone all day Mom.’”

At 1:21 that afternoon Terri Horman posted the science fair photos on her Facebook page. At 3:30 she went to meet Kyron’s school bus, which he never boarded. Then came her 9-1-1 call, and the search for Kyron began.

The issue of the doctor appointment is among several questions KATU News has submitted to Multnomah County Sheriff Dan Staton. He is expected to answer those questions, in writing, sometime in the next couple of days.

Terri Horman has not been named a suspect or person of interest in Kyron’s disappearance and there have been no arrests made in the case.

Did the doctor's office confirm that Kyron had an appointment on June 11, 2010 as Terri claims.

Thanks

Janet

My guess is the DR appt. was part of the plan to trip up the school.  T had to know what would happen in Kyron's classroom if the teacher thought he had a DR appt.  Remember the statement by T's friend or mother where she said, "I think Kyron's teacher is hard of hearing."  This was all planned out by someone that knew a lot of details about the teacher, the school, and the routines of everyone in Kyron's life.

[Wyks]

So according to the school, they were under the assumption that Kyron had a doctors appointment and wouldn't be in school AND Kurtis thought the same thing.

This is where I think Terri's volunteering at school and her chumminess with the staff came in handy. She didn't need to provide something in writing, so she could be vague and just say Friday appt. I wonder if the appt. on the 11 was made with just that purpose in mind. Since the school was expecting Kyron to be gone on the 4th, no red flags were raised early on.
I think she may have thought she had all bases covered, but I'm trusting in the fact that she's not as bright as she thought she was. I think LE is close on her heels with more questions she can't answer.

I have thought from day one she planned this all out.  Why in the world would a teacher lie when a child's life is on the line.  I'm not buying the theory the school was CYA.  I'm naive like that, though.

If it was thought that Kyron went for water or to the bathroom...why did someone not question why he never returned to the classroom?

If the teacher supposedly knew ahead of time that Kyron had an appt and would not be in classroom (as the super of school has just announced)....  then why did the teacher supposedly say that Kyron might be getting a drink of water or in the bathroom?  Wouldn't it have been easier to have just said, 'he has an appt today'. 

IMO.

[Scandi]

OMGosh.  Kaine spents 3 hrs with investigators and TH supporters are making something of it.  The man's child is missing.  LE informs him of a hit on his life.  LE tells him his wife didn't pass her polys.  LE tells him of an affair she had after Kyron went missing.  Gee, wonder what they could've spent 3 whole hours talking about????  I'd bet that Kaine wants to be as involved in the search for Kyron as possible and I'd also bet that LE are trying to include him as much as possible to help keep him focused.  IIRC, they have gotten 3000 tips and are asking for more funds to continue the search.  Maybe Kaine is answering questions about the tips, getting ideas on how to raise money for LE or even telling LE what he's found in the home since he returned.

I've known families of missing persons.  3 hr meetings with investigators are no surprise. 

Hi KittyMom,  A well taken look at Kaine.  I do believe he was not involved in the actual disappearance of his son.

That leaves what I haven't said, that there must have been signs of disquiet in the home, things he noticed {as he said he noticed at how she changed after the birth of the baby girl 18 mos ago}.  How did he address this?   Did he notice Kyron was unhappy around her?  The devotion Kaine showed to Kyron, was it obvious if we could go back and see the family dynamics?  What about her concentration on the baby with the camera always on the shot of her?

We can't say in retrospect.  But I have lived enough to know that feelings are real, and children are the best receptors.  If each parent was doting too much on their 'natural' child, not looking at the reality of how it affected the family dynamics, maybe he did not see the hatred she must have had for him and how she would be capable or using another person he truly loved to bring him to his knees.

Just a thought.  And so he chose to take another lover.  It just doesn't add up to all that he should have been for Kyron IMO.

He's appears in photos to be a devoted dad.

From Kiara's first birthday:





May 2010



Mothers Day 2010



June 2010

I do agree with that Klass, he appears to have been a devoted Dad.  God Bless him for that. 

At her first Bday he already had noticed a change in Terri's well-being from what we have read.  After her birth is when he noticed a change in Terri. 

It is so easy to sit here and say he should have realized this or done this to protect his children.  He was in love with his wife, and as I read what I have in the case, as she changed he might have tried to save the relationship by trying other ways to save or strangthen it.

Lordie,  I don't know.  Nothing is ever totally altruistic IMO.  I hope everything will work out for Kaine in the end because we all make mistakees and sometimes fail to see what is happening around us.  I just want so bad for Kyron to come back home that I close my eyes and hope this is the day it comes to pass.  xox



It is invigorating to see you posting on a case like you are here Klaas.   xox     

[d in texas]

So according to the school, they were under the assumption that Kyron had a doctors appointment and wouldn't be in school AND Kurtis thought the same thing.

This is where I think Terri's volunteering at school and her chumminess with the staff came in handy. She didn't need to provide something in writing, so she could be vague and just say Friday appt. I wonder if the appt. on the 11 was made with just that purpose in mind. Since the school was expecting Kyron to be gone on the 4th, no red flags were raised early on.
I think she may have thought she had all bases covered, but I'm trusting in the fact that she's not as bright as she thought she was. I think LE is close on her heels with more questions she can't answer.

I have thought from day one she planned this all out.  Why in the world would a teacher lie when a child's life is on the line.  I'm not buying the theory the school was CYA.  I'm naive like that, though.

If it was thought that Kyron went for water or to the bathroom...why did someone not question why he never returned to the classroom?

If the teacher supposedly knew ahead of time that Kyron had an appt and would not be in classroom (as the super of school has just announced)....  then why did the teacher supposedly say that Kyron might be getting a drink of water or in the bathroom?  Wouldn't it have been easier to have just said, 'he has an appt today'. 

IMO.

Do we remember who said the teacher said that?  I am going looking but it seems to me the mother of Tanner said her son had said that.....

[doubledecker]

falling asleep, hopefully, tomorrow some news.. will let you know if I hear anything.

[Wyks]

d in texas ~ 

here's that article

--------------

Horman's desk mate says substitute noticed Horman missing
Last Update: 6/11 9:19 am

Eight-year-old Tanner Pumala says the first person to notice Kyron Horman missing was a substitute teacher who was taking a head count as the second and third grade class was re-assembling after visiting other classrooms for a science fair at Skyline School last Friday.

"And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left, " says Tanner Pumala.

But, Portland Public School spokesman Matt Shelby said the account can't be true: "There were no substitutes at the school that day (the day Kyron disappeared)," he said.

Shelby thinks Pumala may be confused because all week after the disappearance a subsitute teacher has been at the school to help with the stress of the Horman case.

Tanner is Kyron's deskmate in their combined second-third grade classroom. Tanner says Kyron was in school for at least an hour Friday morning and that he saw Kyron's step-mother leave the school without Kyron.

F-B-I agents interviewed Pumala, and Multnomah County Sheriff Dan Staton visited with Pumala Wednesday afternoon according to Pumala's grandmother Wendy Fuhrur.

Upon hearing the substitute teacher noticing that Kyron was not present in the classroom, Pumala says the regular teacher said Kyron had probably gone to get a drink of water or to use the bathroom. It wasn't until the bus ride home from school, says Pumala that he noticed Kyron was not on the bus. Kyron's step-mother notified school authorities of her son's not being on the bus at around 3:45pm Friday afternoon.

Pumala's grandmother says F-B-I agents and Multnomah County investigators have asked Pumala and his grandmother not to speak with the media, for reasons they did not divulge. Fuhrur says she decided to allow her grandson talk, in part to keep the missing boy in the public eye.

Separately several dozen more ground searchers arrived in Portland Wednesday night to intensify their ground search Thursday.

http://www.koinlocal6.com/content/news/topstories/story/Hormans-desk-mate-says-substitute-noticed-Horman/TVY3YTREG0SyCP3tb3MkZg.cspx

[d in texas]

Wow this is the best post I have read in a long time in relation to Kyron and really hit home:

http://www.katu.com/news/local/98981009.html

I find myself hunting down news stories, with any scrap of Kyron-related information, which is so unusual for me. Then I realized why; I don't feel the personal need to read Terri Horman's facebook page, to debate Kaine/Desiree's life choices, or to dissect every tiny part of their personal lives. I WANT ANSWERS. I want to know where he is, and why he was put there! I am a parent too, and even pondering the idea of one of my kids being taken from me is so horrifying, so gut-wrenching, that I keep hoping it comes to an end soon. I want this dear little boy found, so very badly. And I think (even though it's not likely), I want to make some sense of it all somehow- to at least know why he's gone, because it's harder to go about my "normal" life when something so twisted is ongoing. Prayers for Kyron, and for Kaine and Desiree too!!

[Scandi]

I know what I'd like to do.  Sit down with a few newscasters like Kohr Harlan, Mike Donahue and Alisa Kenyea {sp}.  They have been out there wherever the news crew have camped out.  Listening, hearing what is going on, watching and getting a sense of what the story is.

An inside view.  That is what I would love to hear right about now !!!

Night peeps, see you in the morning  ;}

[Jersey Girl]

I wonder if the reason for the continuous funding for the search is because a school is involved. A school holds responsibility for the safety of the students once they are on school property during scheduled times as Kyron was. Students are not supposed to just disappear without a trace.
Interesting about the 3 hour meeting. Wonder what that was about. 

That could be. One question I have is even if Desiree and Kaine believe that Terri is responsible for Kyron's disappearance, are they still able to file a law suit on the school since they are responsible for the well being of all the kids?

IMO even if they had total proof that Terri did something to Kyron, the school is still partially liable because they are the reason that the search did not begin until roughly seven hours after he went missing.  LE always says how the first few hours are crucial in a missing child case.  I don't care if the school did not have an automated dialer for absentee kids, I think they should have a responsibility to make a phone call.

It's ridiculous.  I think I read somewhere that the whole school only consisted of what, 300 kids?  It's not like we're dealing with a teenager who might be skipping, this is a 7 year old!  Unless the office got a call saying he would be absent, they should have called home.  No matter who took him, or what happened to him, LE would have stood a much better chance of finding the truth if they had been able to start searching within the first hour.

One thing this has taught me, when school starts up again in the fall and one of my boys is sick, I'm not going to call their school.  I'm going to wait to see how long it takes them to call me.   


Sorry guys! I was way behind when I posted this....that's what I get for posting when there are still 10 pages to read!

[Scandi]

falling asleep, hopefully, tomorrow some news.. will let you know if I hear anything.

I hope so too DD.  Good news, eh?  ;}

[d in texas]

I want to post a link but really think I should send it for approval first.  Anyone?

[Jersey Girl]

Did the recent interview with Kaine at the Wall of Hope happen before or after that pic of him leaving the 3 hour meeting with LE?

[d in texas]

Did the recent interview with Kaine at the Wall of Hope happen before or after that pic of him leaving the 3 hour meeting with LE?

after....

[pdh3]

Scandi said:

Yea,  I guess that is true.  Like Klaas said, it is hard to believe anyone who would approach someone with a MFH deal as being truthfull, eh?

The only over riding feeling I have about that is LE seems to accept what the LS said.  I didn't hear them discount it.


I don't think it means that LE is accepting that Kaine had an affair. What they are accepting is that Terri said he had an affair. That was her reason for wanting to have her husband killed. She was manipulating the LS into feeling bad for her so he'd do what she wanted. LE is accepting what happened between Terri and the LS as a plausible event because they apparently have the cell phone records.

And for the record, Kaine has denied having an affair. I'm sure LE has checked that out also, so they know who's been truthful and who hasn't.
One of Terri's former husbands said that she cheated on him during that marriage, so apparently she's never been trustworthy in any relationship, and she's used to manipulating people. I think she borrowed from her own actions, and turned them around on Kaine because she thought it would be effective.

[pdh3]

I know what I'd like to do.  Sit down with a few newscasters like Kohr Harlan, Mike Donahue and Alisa Kenyea {sp}.  They have been out there wherever the news crew have camped out.  Listening, hearing what is going on, watching and getting a sense of what the story is.

An inside view.  That is what I would love to hear right about now !!!

Night peeps, see you in the morning  ;}

Hey Scandi - are these local reporters?  Do you feel they are holding back on things for some reason? That would be a fascinating conversation.....

[Brandi]

So according to the school, they were under the assumption that Kyron had a doctors appointment and wouldn't be in school AND Kurtis thought the same thing.

This is where I think Terri's volunteering at school and her chumminess with the staff came in handy. She didn't need to provide something in writing, so she could be vague and just say Friday appt. I wonder if the appt. on the 11 was made with just that purpose in mind. Since the school was expecting Kyron to be gone on the 4th, no red flags were raised early on.
I think she may have thought she had all bases covered, but I'm trusting in the fact that she's not as bright as she thought she was. I think LE is close on her heels with more questions she can't answer.

I have thought from day one she planned this all out.  Why in the world would a teacher lie when a child's life is on the line.  I'm not buying the theory the school was CYA.  I'm naive like that, though.

If it was thought that Kyron went for water or to the bathroom...why did someone not question why he never returned to the classroom?

If the teacher supposedly knew ahead of time that Kyron had an appt and would not be in classroom (as the super of school has just announced)....  then why did the teacher supposedly say that Kyron might be getting a drink of water or in the bathroom?  Wouldn't it have been easier to have just said, 'he has an appt today'. 

IMO.

That's a good question, Wyks. Was it the teacher or the adult volunteer that mentioned the bathroom?