Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #23 8/21/10 - 8/24/10

[hellokitty]

 

as far as whacking Kyron, it might have been out of sight of the teacher.  We had a case like that at school and the teacher reported as we are required to report if we have "reason to believe". 

It's hard to say what the teacher would have done if the parent reported as it is second hand info, but on our reporting form you put who witnessed it.  I wonder if the teacher ever reported? 

I know from  my first few times that I reported, nothing ever happened.  I learned to become extremely assertive.  Unfortunately, these kinds of jobs are under severe budget cuts as well, I bet.  The workers may be and I bet are, involved in huge issues and a whack would not get much attention.  Verbal abuse is the most difficult to go after.  There is an emotional abuse aspect to child abuse,but that's another toughy to go after.

If there are no marks, the child welfare does not investigate.  They might have a file they have started to see if anything adds up to enough to be looked at.

A parent may not want to get involved and would not report.

[Claycat]

"The comments of Harry Oakes SAR Coordinator are in no way accusatory of anyone. These are observations that bring up a lot of questions.

 

They are made from statements given to me by concerned parents who have volunteered along side our teams in the private search efforts for Kyron Horman.

I’ve also added my observations.
"

He says they are observations!  Isn't that what we do here?  Make observations?  Evidently parents who volunteered with him told him about the possible abuse.

Don't be too quick to discount what Harry says.  He was searching, and I'm sure he spoke to a lot of people. 

[no rose colored glasses]

Kyron repeatedly told anyone who would listen that his “Step mother is dead”.

Terri would then counter with” He’s talking about his real mother not me”.      That doesn't sound like a seven year old talking, now a teenager, yes.

[klaasend]

"The comments of Harry Oakes SAR Coordinator are in no way accusatory of anyone. These are observations that bring up a lot of questions.

 

They are made from statements given to me by concerned parents who have volunteered along side our teams in the private search efforts for Kyron Horman.

I’ve also added my observations.
"

He says they are observations!  Isn't that what we do here?  Make observations?  Evidently parents who volunteered with him told him about the possible abuse.

Don't be too quick to discount what Harry says.  He was searching, and I'm sure he spoke to a lot of people. 

I'm not discounting but I am curious as to why we are only hearing it from him.  You would think if any of the observations were true it would have leaked out before UNLESS, LE has told everyone in the school to zip it.

[Hiding Monkey]

Wow on Harry Oake's Myspace blog 

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=127939120&blogId=538423807

A parent whose child attended Skyline Elementary school stated that she saw Terri physically and verbally abusing Kyron repeatedly throughout the school year. Terri was seen striking Kyron, grabbing him, and call him names in front of the parents, teachers, and other kids.

Kyron repeatedly told anyone who would listen that his “Step mother is dead”.

Terri would then counter with” He’s talking about his real mother not me”.

 

It has been reported by parents who were at the Horman residence the day Kyron disappeared to lend their support to the Horman family that Terri removed all of Kyron’s personal belongings from his room and packed them up, and moved her two-year-old daughter’s stuff into Kyron’s room.

 

I have not been able to confirm this statement.

Read more: http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=127939120&blogId=538423807#ixzz0xNAB9IpJ

He also adds this:

Was this a well-planned set-up? A week before Kyron disappeared, Terri reportedly went around school talking to families she had never talked to before and asked them to keep an eye out for Kyron as he suffered from seizures and was prone to disappearing.
What’s wrong with her suggestion is to my knowledge, no medical doctor who has treated Kryon has ever documented Kyron having bouts of seizures. His own birth mother, stepfather, and birth father along with his teachers, friends, never saw Kyron have a seizure or wander off before. 



What I'd like to know is where he is hearing this from? It seems very plausible and ties into what we know about Terri's actions so far, but he could be using those same few facts and coming up with some likely guesses. I wonder if he'll be interviewed. Like Leonard Padilla. I hope he's got some actual sources, even if indirect, to at least SOMEWHAT support these "reported" claims.

Scatty-yesterday I posted a comment from Lynne Terry of the Oregonian.  I'll post it again here along with the link.  I think this goes along with Mr. Oakes statement of "was this a well planned set-up?"  Why was Terri now bringing up the statement of Kyron having autism?  Possible alibi for her to use as an excuse for him leaving the building? 
bisou73 -

The article does not mention anything about ADD/ADHD but rather Terri Horman suggested after Kyron went missing that he might have a form of autism, according to Kaine Horman and Desiree Young.
On the Facebook page, I follow a lot of blogs covering a range of views.

Lynne Terry
The Oregonian


http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman/4053/comments-7.html

IMO I wouldn't think Mr. Oakes would jeopardize his reputation by making these statements.  Could be wrong though.

[Brandi]

Monkey's,

Who is the photo?  #129

 http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8203.new#new

It looks like Terri, maybe, it is her mom & dad.

TIA

I think Kaine's Mom & Dad place in hawaii ?

Thank-you, Blonde,

I didn't know the parents had a place in HI. Cool.
"Monkey Amanda" mentioned Dad is who officiated the wedding ceremony. Is Mr. Horman a preacher or JP, please? TIA

As a family, the couple played video games and occasionally took trips, visiting Walt Disney World in Orlando, Fla., and traveling to Israel. Every other weekend, Terri, Kaine or Greg McCullough, Desiree's first husband, shuttled James, Kyron, and Desiree and Greg's son, Quinn, to Shari's restaurant in Springfield for a handoff. James stayed with the Tarvers in Roseburg and Kyron and Quinn went with Desiree to Medford, where she lives with her husband, Tony Young.

At the end of 2006, Kaine sold the Aloha house, and in January 2007 the family moved to rural Northwest Portland. Terri found the secluded, wooded property on Northwest Sheltered Nook Road, and Kaine bought the house.

Three months later, the couple got married in their bathing suits in a small ceremony presided over by Kaine's dad on a beach in Kauai, Hawaii. On Mother's Day, Kaine gave his bride a brand-new candy apple red Ford Mustang GT.

She put a vanity license plate on the car — RDSQRL — shorthand for her nickname, Red Squirrel.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html[/b]
Is the car in Terri's name if so does she get to keep it?

BBM

The "Aloha" house I believe was located in Aloha, OR. See map below.

[Scatty]

as far as whacking Kyron, it might have been out of sight of the teacher.  We had a case like that at school and the teacher reported as we are required to report if we have "reason to believe". 

It's hard to say what the teacher would have done if the parent reported as it is second hand info, but on our reporting form you put who witnessed it.  I wonder if the teacher ever reported? 

I know from  my first few times that I reported, nothing ever happened.  I learned to become extremely assertive.  Unfortunately, these kinds of jobs are under severe budget cuts as well, I bet.  The workers may be and I bet are, involved in huge issues and a whack would not get much attention.  Verbal abuse is the most difficult to go after.  There is an emotional abuse aspect to child abuse,but that's another toughy to go after.

If there are no marks, the child welfare does not investigate.  They might have a file they have started to see if anything adds up to enough to be looked at.

A parent may not want to get involved and would not report.

And since Terri volunteered at the school, there may have been a relationship with faculty that may have made teachers feel awkward making an issue about it if Kyron seemed healthy and normal for the most part. She may have verbally chastised him in front of teachers, but I sorta doubt that she'd strike him in front of people she wanted to impress. Unless she was overcome with trying to show how much control and power she had over her stepson.

[no rose colored glasses]

If this was happening in front of teachers, parents, and other kids, it would be amazing that nobody reported such a thing happening    Surely someone would have reported abuse such as this.

[seahorse]

It's possible that Kaine's father who did the wedding is a "mail order" minister.  We had 2 different ones for the weddings of 2 of my children.  I think in order to officiate a wedding, you have to be registered in that state to do weddings.  But maybe not??  I just don't know.

Hello Kitty

Hymm, I don't know we could ask "Monkey Amanda" for Mr.Horman's status is for JP.

http://paulding.com/forum/index.php?/topic/247271-kyron-horman-still-missing-in-oregon/

http://northwesttales.com/  The Father of Kaine is an Author which I find impressive.

I am interested in SM's, Birth Mother, possible maiden name "Kisiel", supposely, from Nevada, Grassy Valley, California.

THM said she is from a prominent family as her adopted Mother told her.  It would be interesting if bio-mom is prominent.

I spent 30+ years in the Sacramento Valley, and Grass Valley is just north.  Have property there.  IMO, bio-mom is not "prominent", if she's from Grass Valley as we've read has been researched out.  GV is just not ..... somewhere that "prominent" folks would be from.  lol  IMO.   

Wyks, since you are familiar with that area do you know if any oof the farms would use as a community for placement for unwed mothers?  Back at that time many wealthy familiies sent their daughters away to have their child.

Is there anyone there that remembers if a farm, or church or some other place in that area might have been used to place unwed mothers when they began to show?

Hi Monkey's,

 I found a Saint Mary's Convent who also sponsored orphans.

The convent is included in Walking Tour of Grass Valley (Navada, California)

I took the walking tour on the internet:)  The convent is now a museum and has changed names over time.

I will look for the link, the Link to the Walking Tour, I posted on Who's Who is not working today.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Saint_Mary's_Convent_and_Academy

TY Seahorse..I bet that is where her Mom stayed and had the baby.  That means she may have been from any of the larger surrounding towns..Neveda City, Sacremento, even San Francisco.

Gypsy, Your welcome, Thank-you for links and updates. This is a very busy group of Monkeys.

It is possible to find Bio-Mum, Kisiel is uncommon name, unless was shortened it from a polish spelling.

She may have been imported from Navada city, Sacramento or San Francisco. There also a few "Kisiel" brides I found:


http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?gl=ROOT_CATEGORY&rank=1&new=1&MSAV=0&msT=1&gss=angs-d&gsln=kisiel&_82000000-gpid=2155&_82000000_PInfo=7-%7c1652393%7c2%7c3249%7c7%7c2155%7c&_82000000__ftp=Nevada+County%2c+California%2c+USA&uidh=0

Link below is the surname Kisiel in California- Polish ancestry.  Do you think SM looks maybe Irish too? 
http://www.feefhs.org/members/pgs-california/psn/ksn.html

Genealogy department but they want three dollars or some fee.
http://new.mynevadacounty.com/library/index.cfm?ccs=603&cs=432&highlight=genealogy

[Wyks]

Wyks - I thought you spoke highly of Harry in the past.  What would make him post these accusations?

I dunno Klaas.  Yes, I spoke highly of Harry in the past.  And I believe 100% in his dogs and their abilities.  They have proven themselves time after time.  As for being any type of spokesperson for Harry, I have backed off.  Perhaps you didn't see my post on that some time back?   

If anyone has questions of Harry, they can simply go to his blog or email and ask him.  He doesn't need me or anyone else to defend him.  I just don't like to get "into it" with others online who already do not like him, no matter what anyone else tries to say.  That's one reason I've stepped back. 

If I were to up and go missing tho, I'd want my loved ones to contact our monkeys, Tim Miller and Harry Oakes... in that order... and all three immediately.  Oh yeah, and then the local LE.  hehe. 

 

[Scatty]

"The comments of Harry Oakes SAR Coordinator are in no way accusatory of anyone. These are observations that bring up a lot of questions.

 

They are made from statements given to me by concerned parents who have volunteered along side our teams in the private search efforts for Kyron Horman.

I’ve also added my observations.
"

He says they are observations!  Isn't that what we do here?  Make observations?  Evidently parents who volunteered with him told him about the possible abuse.

Don't be too quick to discount what Harry says.  He was searching, and I'm sure he spoke to a lot of people. 

I just wish he was a bit more specifice about where or from whom these things were reported. Not that I doubt him necessarily, but because it would satisfy curiousity, and confirmation is always good to have when dealing with folks who say "Poor Terri, victim of a witch hunt."  I fully believe Terri is capable of doing all that he says was reported. I agree with his conclusions too.

[Wyks]

TY WYKS..it looks like this is where her Mom came to have her.

You're welcome!  Sure could be!   

Wonder if they are still open and running.. with records and such?  Since Terri did a search of sorts at one point, and her birth last name is known, if the place is open, might still have those records.  Altho they'd likely only release further info to Terri herself. 

[seahorse]

Monkey's,

Who is the photo?  #129

 http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8203.new#new

It looks like Terri, maybe, it is her mom & dad.

TIA

I think Kaine's Mom & Dad place in hawaii ?

Thank-you, Blonde,

I didn't know the parents had a place in HI. Cool.
"Monkey Amanda" mentioned Dad is who officiated the wedding ceremony. Is Mr. Horman a preacher or JP, please? TIA

As a family, the couple played video games and occasionally took trips, visiting Walt Disney World in Orlando, Fla., and traveling to Israel. Every other weekend, Terri, Kaine or Greg McCullough, Desiree's first husband, shuttled James, Kyron, and Desiree and Greg's son, Quinn, to Shari's restaurant in Springfield for a handoff. James stayed with the Tarvers in Roseburg and Kyron and Quinn went with Desiree to Medford, where she lives with her husband, Tony Young.

At the end of 2006, Kaine sold the Aloha house, and in January 2007 the family moved to rural Northwest Portland. Terri found the secluded, wooded property on Northwest Sheltered Nook Road, and Kaine bought the house.

Three months later, the couple got married in their bathing suits in a small ceremony presided over by Kaine's dad on a beach in Kauai, Hawaii. On Mother's Day, Kaine gave his bride a brand-new candy apple red Ford Mustang GT.

She put a vanity license plate on the car — RDSQRL — shorthand for her nickname, Red Squirrel.
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html[/b]
Is the car in Terri's name if so does she get to keep it?

BBM

The "Aloha" house I believe was located in Aloha, OR. See map below.

Hi Monkey's,

Thank-you ,Blonde! The photo is so beautiful of the Horman family.  Kyron is so funny with his hat.

Photograph 134 - http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8203.120 -The last photo on the link.

Perhaps, the car insurance is in his name? He bought it for her so is he making the payments? 

[Wyks]

"The comments of Harry Oakes SAR Coordinator are in no way accusatory of anyone. These are observations that bring up a lot of questions.

 

They are made from statements given to me by concerned parents who have volunteered along side our teams in the private search efforts for Kyron Horman.

I’ve also added my observations.
"

He says they are observations!  Isn't that what we do here?  Make observations?  Evidently parents who volunteered with him told him about the possible abuse.

Don't be too quick to discount what Harry says.  He was searching, and I'm sure he spoke to a lot of people. 

I'm not discounting but I am curious as to why we are only hearing it from him.  You would think if any of the observations were true it would have leaked out before UNLESS, LE has told everyone in the school to zip it.

Well.. from what we've read/heard, everyone in the school has been told to zip it with the media.  Tanner and his grandma were the only two to stray, and gave an interview.  It was promptly after that when the school/LE backpedalled on what info they had shared.  A dismissive action toward Tanner because he had the nerve to talk?  I dunno.  Sounds to me like that is part of it. 

Believe the children, I say.  Why would they lie?  Most kids don't have the foresight to need an agenda of any kind.  IMO. 

PS.  Yes I know, I know.. there's always the one, two or three exceptions to that rule, I know. 
 

[Claycat]

Wyks - I thought you spoke highly of Harry in the past.  What would make him post these accusations?

I dunno Klaas.  Yes, I spoke highly of Harry in the past.  And I believe 100% in his dogs and their abilities.  They have proven themselves time after time.  As for being any type of spokesperson for Harry, I have backed off.  Perhaps you didn't see my post on that some time back?   

If anyone has questions of Harry, they can simply go to his blog or email and ask him.  He doesn't need me or anyone else to defend him.  I just don't like to get "into it" with others online who already do not like him, no matter what anyone else tries to say.  That's one reason I've stepped back. 

If I were to up and go missing tho, I'd want my loved ones to contact our monkeys, Tim Miller and Harry Oakes... in that order... and all three immediately.  Oh yeah, and then the local LE.  hehe. 

 

You and I are definitely on the same wavelength, Wyks!     

[KarmaRoundUp]

I am interested in SM's, Birth Mother, possible maiden name "Kisiel", supposely, from Nevada, Grassy Valley, California.

THM said she is from a prominent family as her adopted Mother told her.  It would be interesting if bio-mom is prominent.

I spent 30+ years in the Sacramento Valley, and Grass Valley is just north.  Have property there.  IMO, bio-mom is not "prominent", if she's from Grass Valley as we've read has been researched out.  GV is just not ..... somewhere that "prominent" folks would be from.  lol  IMO.   

Wyks, since you are familiar with that area do you know if any oof the farms would use as a community for placement for unwed mothers?  Back at that time many wealthy familiies sent their daughters away to have their child.

Is there anyone there that remembers if a farm, or church or some other place in that area might have been used to place unwed mothers when they began to show?

Back in the day, Grass Valley was a more rural, smaller area.  It was definitely on the 'outskirts' of town.  Not in a negative sense, but in an out-of-the-way, quiet, little traveled to, sense.  Perfect I'd say, if a young girl "found herself in trouble", as was said in those days, for towns/cities anywhere nearby. 

Also back in the day, am guessing the most likely place in that area for a 'single, unwed mother' would have been a salvation army sponsored home for unwed mothers.  Looking it up on google, this is what I found:  (there could have been others... dunno)

This 'could be' about seperate homes, or info regarding the same place:

GRASS VALLEY (IN NEVADA COUNTY)
SAINT VINCENT'S ORPHAN ASYLUM.
1923 CENSUS:
GRASS VALLEY ORPHAN ASYLUM,
NO ADDRESS;
CATHOLIC HOME FOR DEPENDENT WHITE CHILDREN;
ESTABLISHED IN 1864.
1922: ST. VINCENT'S ORPHAN ASYLUM, NO ADDRESS;
140 CHILDREN;
SISTERS OF MERCY.

 

Hi Monkeys
I ran across this from a site that was talking about the surveys that Terri did online.I don't know which survey this is from but the web page I got it from is linked below:

How did you meet 4? Carol Moulton
At Children's Home Society when I was 6 weeks old.

7th post from the bottom.

http://forums.radionewz.net/index.php?topic=137.135

[seahorse]

TY WYKS..it looks like this is where her Mom came to have her.

You're welcome!  Sure could be!   

Wonder if they are still open and running.. with records and such?  Since Terri did a search of sorts at one point, and her birth last name is known, if the place is open, might still have those records.  Altho they'd likely only release further info to Terri herself. 

Wyks 

I believe it was a closed adoption.     I watch-out for pranksters concerning Terri's genealogy.   
I am aware some are posting untrues to derail the investigative.  I copy and paste rather than click the links.


http://www.sfgenealogy.com/php/vitals/cabiindex.php

Free California Birth Search (1905-1995)

SM was the only "Kisiel" birth in Nevada in the ninety years.

[pfaubush]

Klaasend, I am new to scaredmonkeys, as you know.  I wanted to send you a private message about my account here, but I couldn't find out how to do it. 
Sorry for posting off topic, but I didn't see anywhere how to do this.

We don't have PM's here, haven't had them since October 2005.  You can email me at smklaas@hotmail.com

Most members that need to get in touch with each other get a throwaway (hotmail) email addy like mine.

Bat phones are popular these days too, or so I hear. 

[Wyks]

Wyks - I thought you spoke highly of Harry in the past.  What would make him post these accusations?

I dunno Klaas.  Yes, I spoke highly of Harry in the past.  And I believe 100% in his dogs and their abilities.  They have proven themselves time after time.  As for being any type of spokesperson for Harry, I have backed off.  Perhaps you didn't see my post on that some time back?   

If anyone has questions of Harry, they can simply go to his blog or email and ask him.  He doesn't need me or anyone else to defend him.  I just don't like to get "into it" with others online who already do not like him, no matter what anyone else tries to say.  That's one reason I've stepped back. 

If I were to up and go missing tho, I'd want my loved ones to contact our monkeys, Tim Miller and Harry Oakes... in that order... and all three immediately.  Oh yeah, and then the local LE.  hehe. 

 

You and I are definitely on the same wavelength, Wyks!     

 

[Justamama]

Justamama,  I'm glad you are okay!   

You truly are a sweetheart.  Thank you.  That was actually just the beginning of a long ridiculous saga with that doctor.  He's no longer there and the healthcare facility did a bit of an investigation on him.  I guess that's when I learned what I was really made of.

Thank you again.