Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Cold in SoCal too!   ::snowmanlaugh::

Made It!

Clean cage!!!! Goodnight!!  ::CowboySmiley::

Hi Cajun Miracle!   ::MonkeyDance::

Thanks for the new cage Klaas!   ::MonkeyCool::

Maybe we could have a snowball fight!

Good night wreck!  Stay warm!   ::CowboySmiley::

Hey to ya TM!

Nite all and stay warm.    ::ElfMonkey::    ::ElfMonkey:: ::ElfMonkey::

Speaking of snowball fight, I made this JibJab last year  ::snowmanlaugh::

http://aka.zero.jibjab.com/client/zero/ClientZero_EmbedViewer.swf?external_make_id=Tlb2uYjKAkQIapqilyxo6hdB&service=sendables.jibjab.com&partnerID=JibJab

Good night Cajun Miracle!   ::MonkeyAngel::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Good night!   ::MonkeyCool::

Hi Monkeys,
Well, at least I try to keep my avatar current with the season ... about all I can do these days.

Good to see texasmom still slugging away.

Hope everyone is staying warm (it's cold in Atlanta too). Happy shopping and blessings to all during this season!

Good morning msmarple  ::HelloKitty::  Your poinsettia's are lovely.  I agree with you about texasmom.  She just keeps on keepin' on.... ::MonkeyDance:: 

Posted at GM by GBMW:

Part of online Diary of Peter R. de Vries today:

Ik ben vandaag druk met de uitzending van aanstaande zondag, waar we weer eens aandacht besteden aan Joran van der Sloot. Er gaat bijna geen dag voorbij of iemand vraagt wel aan me hoe het toch met de hem en de zaak van Natalee Holloway staat. Welnu, daar komt zondag een antwoord op, met heel interessante beelden!


Today I'm busy with the broadcast of this coming Sunday which will address Joran van der Sloot again. Hardly a day goes by without someone asking me what's going on with him and Natalee Holloway's case. Well, you'll get an answer this coming Sunday, with very interesting footage!

Hopefully, Peter will give Aruba a nice (early) Christmas present, compliments of its prodigal (exiled) son.

Thanks Klaas.  And thanks to GB for keeping everyone informed.

I do hope we are able to obtain a good translation of the show!

Was thinking the show will be braodcast there while we're watching football and such on Sunday afternoon.  That is if my thinking is in order with the time difference.  It could be Monday or so before we see a transcript.

  ::MonkeyShocked::

Thank you Klaas.

1.  Considering GBMW's position regarding the non-involvement of Paulus van der Sloot and the Kalpoes in the happenings encompassing the morning of May 30, 2005 ...

2.  Considering GBMW's position regarding what others perceive as a corrupt investigation that has prevent justice from prevailing for Natalee Holloway ...

3.  Considering GBMW's position regarding who really should be to blame in regards that hardship suffered by the Aruban people as a result of the boycott ...

4.  Consider GBMW's position regarding a troll by the name of Charierat ...

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Janet

++++++++ 

GBMW
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #750 5/2 -
« Reply #753 on: May 07, 2008, 03:54:26 PM »

But I don't think Paulus was around the moment when something happened to Natalee....I believe Joran was around though. What did Paulus do that night according to you that would implicate him so much? You don't think he would have protected Joran no matter if he (Paulus) was involved or not?

Paulus has helped Joran to protect him from the legal consequences....yes. And because of this Paulus & Joran will be protected....Joran for his actions that night & Paulus for his actions after that night....since Paulus has got info on other people they will never allow for the complete truth ever to come out of what happened that night and how they tried to cover everything up. That's how I look at it at the moment....

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2819.msg379756#msg379756


GBMW
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #750 5/2 -
« Reply #264 on: May 05, 2008, 11:42:15 AM »

I'm also not that convinced about the involvement of the Kalpoe Brothers or the huge cover up as most SM posters are. Neither do I believe that Peter, Joran & Patrick worked together...that the confessions how was a cover up...and I'm not for a boycott.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2819.msg378915#msg378915


GBMW
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #758 6/14 -
« Reply #821 on: June 18, 2008, 05:28:07 PM »

I don't think the Dutch & Aruban officials are that corrupt.....I do believe they are doing the best they can. Of course not all of them...dishonest people are everywhere.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2918.msg390863#msg390863


GBMW
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #751 5/8 -
« Reply #815 on: May 15, 2008, 10:01:20 AM »

Beth hasn't been an angel in this case....100% understandable and I don't blame her...but it doesn't mean innocent people didn't get hurt enormously because of her.

I'm getting the feeling I'll have to go to RU and give a big fat apology for defending this forum.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2830.msg381577#msg381577


GBMW
Re: THE KALPOE'S INVOLVEMENT
« Reply #126 on: June 19, 2008, 12:05:48 AM »

Kick Charlierat in his nuts? Sorry...I like him so your thanks is a bit premature.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2823.msg391009#msg391009


GBMW
Re: THE KALPOE'S INVOLVEMENT
« Reply #128 on: June 19, 2008, 12:57:23 PM »

Why would I dislike him (Charlierat)? I don't know him that well and I don't always agree with his posts or the way he posts but he's been nothing but kind to me.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2823.msg391175#msg391175

Janet, are you thinking those are GB's words?  That it is GB who is working on the show?

Because those aren't her words, those are Peter's words.

??

Thanks jen.

What a relief!!

Janet

It is all Dutch to me.

 ::MonkeyTongue::

Janet

++++++

donderdag 10 december 2009, 09:44 uur
Peters DagboekJulio P., piloot des doods, of roddelslachtoffer? & beelden Joran van der Sloot

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/cover/julio-p.-piloot-des-doods-of-roddelslachtoffer-beelden-joran-van-der-sloot/

I truly hope that Peter has something earthshattering to expose about Joran.

If not, I am still grateful to Peter for keeping Joran's name in the news as the prime suspect in Natalee's death.

That is something that nobody else is doing these days. ::ElfMonkey::

Thank you Klaas! 
I appreciate GBMW's translation and think it is encouraging that people still hold such an interest in Natalee that a day rarely passes without someone asking Peter about it.   ::MonkeyCheer4::

Somebody from SBS Broadcasting in NL is interested in what monkeys have to say!

Isn't that Peter's company?

Scared Monkeys
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I agree! 

Thank you Magnolia!

Think I will take the opportunity to thank Peter and wish him and his family
Seasons Greetings!  ::DancingSantaMonkey1:: ::DancingSantaMonkey1:: ::DancingSantaMonkey1::

You're welcome!  ::MonkeySkate::

ENDEMOL PRODUCTIONS?

Disposed - Patrick vander Eem
 
Chapter 18:  ... The vacation ended far too soon and there I was back in the Netherlands.  Joran called me and said 'Hey, are we going to do something?  Am I going to see you?'  So I had arranged to see him on January 29.
 
The Range Rover we had used was brought back because apparently the place the crime show rented it from had sold it.  The gave us one that was, to say the least, different.  The slick black interior was now brown for a start.  How the hell was I going to explain this away to Joran?  I could always tell him that they were pimping my ride and this was a loaner.
 
This trip I had to focus on how Natalee died.
 
Daury?  Was that really his name or had Joran made that up to protect the real person who helped him?  I knew I had to stick to the script as much as I could this time.
 
... That night we hit the casino and the red light district in Arnhem.  It was really late when I decided to take him home we ran into a police checkpoint on the way out of the red light district.
 
I stopped the way I should and the officer asks for my driver's licence.  He asks if the car is mine and I say it's a rental because mine is in the shop.  Then he wants to see the paper work.  The rental agreement is listed to Endemol.  So I'm afraid the copy will say 'So you work for Endemol' with Joran sitting next to me.  I quickly step out of the car to talk with the police officer.
 
Another officer comes over and we all talk nicely and it gets straightened out.  No problems.  They let me go on my way.  Who knows, when they checked my documents they got a big 'leave this car alone' on their screen.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/13561414/Patrick-van-der-Eem-book

Yes, Peter works for Endemol.  I'm not sure if SBS owns Endemol?  Or if they collaborate on projects?  I haven 't looked into it.

I agree Magnolia, I'm grateful to Peter DeVries too!  And I hope to goodness that whoever was interested from SBS Broadcasting missed all the negativity and speculation about him that has been posted time after time over the past few months.  If they didn't miss it hopefully they looked around enough to see that we all don't see things that way.

2008 INTERNATIONAL EMMY® AWARDS WINNERS FOR NEWS AND CURRENT AFFAIRS CATEGORIES ANNOUNCED

Dutch crime reporter, Peter R. de Vries’ undercover camera report on the Natalee Holloway case, produced by SBS Broadcasting B.V/Endemol Entertainment won the Current Affairs category. De Vries investigated the disappearance and possible murder of a young American in Aruba.

http://www.iemmys.tv/news_item.aspx?id=66

Endermol is the production company and SBS is the broadcast company of the same operation.

That's how I read it.

SBS broadcasting has been around for quite sometime..I think you're selling them short TM.I believe they're aware of much more then we think!Time will tell what they choose to do with the information they gather....JMOO ::MonkeyCool::

Yep I think you're right.

So likely it was Peter himself, or a researcher of his.

I'd personally like to shake that man's hand.  Peter has done so much for Natalee and her family, and it seems he's not letting go anytime soon!

The measure of Peace he afforded Beth with his backing and airing of Patrick's project with Joran I'm sure is immeasurable for her.

Peter DeVries is a rare hero in this tragedy, and my Thanks go out to him!!

I totally agree! ::ElfMonkey::

Magnolia - Thank you for keeping your eye out.

There is much to be learned by watching that little meter.  And oh so much of it can be greatly encouraging and insightful!!

Another thing that peeked my interest many moons ago was why,someone from Venezuela,would be interested in Bastibro....... ::MonkeyShovel::

I agree!   ::CowboySmiley:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::CowboySmiley::

Ah.

I guess that would all depend on how many folks know who "bastibro" really is.  ::MonkeyCool::

Venezuela, huh?  Now that is rich!!!!!

IIRC Jen3560,i believe it was  Carabobo country...If that tells ya anything?

So, this is what has happened this week - in what I must say is a promising turn of events!

Hero Brinkman will be looking into the boat scenario from when Natalee went missing.

Peter DeVries also received that info, and either he or someone on his team were here today looking into some things.

Peter DeVries is airing a show 3 days from now, once again bringing this tragedy into the spotlight!

Justice For Natalee Holloway is long overdue - and I am so thankful to everyone who is still pursuing it!!

Keeping one eye on the ball constantly - as Bounce, Bounce, Bounce it goes  ::MonkeyCool::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: God Bless all Monkey's..Justice is where it's at..

Kyle said: "I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal

For those reading GM, RU, etc. -- is bastibo still around???????  ::CowboySmiley::

SBS broadcasting was checking this information on this thread a few months back.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4854.msg779000

Kermit,Jen3560.....


Domain Name   wau.nl ? (Netherlands)
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 ::MonkeyWink::

BNH
December 5, 2009 @ 1:50 pm
1 Staff Member, 4 Members, 27 Guests, 7 Invisible Users
medleyrelay, icehawk, bastibro, Lois, iquitos

In my opinion ... unless Peter Devries ... on Sunday evening ... concedes that the ONLY truth ... the only positive ... that emerged from the Range Rover recordings was the segment regarding the seizure Natalee Holloway experienced in the presence of Joran van der Sloot ... I contend this investigative reporter who has an in-depth knowledge of the case ... is furthering the Aruban cover-up agenda of distancing main suspects from participation in wrongdoing encompassing the morning of May 30, 2005.

In my opinion ... there was more light was shed on the the truth in the leaked recordings from the police van.

Devries has been silent for two years in regards to the Natalee Holloway case.  Why?

Janet

++++++++

THE SEIZURE

ACCORDING TO BETH HOLLOWAY
 
CNN Larry King Live - February 7, 2008
 
BETH HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER:  When he imitates how Natalee was suffering through the seizures, well, Larry, within 48 hours of Natalee's disappearance on the island of Aruba, a lead detective, Dennis Jacobs (ph), first and only medical question he asked me was, does Natalee have a history of epilepsy or seizures. And I said, no, why would you ask that?
 
And he only asked me that once, and from there forward, three other detectives asked Natalee's step father probably a dozen times, Larry. Jug had to come to me six times and ask me if Natalee had a history of epilepsy or seizure. And I kept saying no, why do you keep asking us that? Why? So, it brought it full circle for us.
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/lkl.01.html


Dateline - February 23, 2008

BETH HOLLOWAY:  The facts are within 48 hours of Natalee's disappearance, a lead detective asked me if she had a history of epilepsy or seizures. Two and a half years later, the main suspect himself, admits that Natalee -- he felt as if she suffered an epilepsy or seizure. And he even indicates how she's shaking. So, if we look at just that one-- just that one piece, that's one thread out of a lot. Then, I have to say yes, there definitely was some collusion and corruption going on in the early days of Natalee's disappearance. Absolutely.
 
However, according to the prosecutor's office it's standard procedure to ask if a missing person might have a seizure disorder.

Police and prosecution officials declined on-camera interviews, but have consistently denied that there was any corruption, collusion or mishandling of the investigation.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/6/


ACCORDING TO JUG TWITTY

NANCY GRACE - February 15, 2008

HOLLY HUGHES, GUEST HOST: Well, Jug, my heart goes out to you and your family. I`m so sorry for this tragedy. You mentioned a little earlier that you think this has been a cover-up and a conspiracy from the very beginning. Can you just let our viewers know a couple of examples that makes you feel that way?

JUG TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S STEPFATHER:  Well, I mean, I`ve said it several times, you know, to go over it again, but in the beginning, you know, they ask us questions about the epilepsy and everything, which you wouldn`t normally ask somebody that right out of the chute. So they knew like the second night that she probably wasn`t alive.

And then, just like all the stuff like when all the people that were there, all the people that came with me to help, they never even questioned us for two weeks. If they wanted an answer, they could have got a lot of the answers about the deal about the 4:00 in the morning when he said he picked him up at McDonald`s. There were a lot of those answers there that they could have had if they wanted them. And just I think they got in it early to, you know, cover up, and they just had to cover their tracks all the way through.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/15/ng.01.html


ACCORDING TO GEROLD DOMPIG
 
48 Hours Mystery - March 22, 2006

Wherever she was, police now think that while Natalee was with Joran, she died suddenly from an overdose of intoxicants.

"We feel strongly that she probably went into shock or something happened to her system with all this alcohol maybe on top of that other drugs which either she took or they gave her and that she just collapsed," says Dompig.

The crime, Dompig suspects, occurred when the body was illegally disposed of. The boys may have acted alone.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/22/48hours/main1430644_page5.shtml

November 28, 2006
Robert Jensen show

DEVRIES: Yes the police missed several changes to do things right: when they wanted to search the house the door was opened by Mr. Ben King, an assistant of the Procurements Gen. office, the highest justice-office on the island, and a friend of the family who wanted to support the VdSloots in these difficult times… So clearly the search of the house hadn’t been a surprise to the VdSloots. And the police had a warrant for the complete estate but a judge - Bob Wit - who was at the house as well said only Joran's room could be searched.

TxMom - it seems your hopes may have been dashed.  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I was informed that Bastibro is working with Ben Vocking

Gee - now why oh why would someone in Venezuela be interested in that duo??  ::MonkeyAngel::

I could be totally wrong....if so apologies....but I thought Peter did a show about Joran and the
sex slave traffic about a year ago.
When Joran is mentioned, Natalee is automatically brought to mind.

Thank You Kermit & Jen3560... ::MonkeyAngel::

http://proteinwisdom.com/pub/?p=2393

November 10, 2008

Reporter Peter De Vries has made a second hidden-camera expose on Dutch student Joran Van der Sloot, who was believed to be with Natalee Holloway when she vanished while on a senior trip to Aruba. De Vries won an Emmy this year for another report on Van Der Sloot, 21, in which the student admits to dumping Holloway’s body after she suddenly began shaking and died as they were kissing.

De Vries’ latest report, which was shown Sunday night on Dutch television, shows Van der Sloot telling someone posing as a sex-industry boss that he can get passports for Thai women and girls who think they are going to the Netherlands to work as dancers, DutchNews.nl reported.

Van der Sloot makes about $13,000 for every woman sold into prostitution in the Netherlands, De Vries claims.

“The pictures show how little respect this 21-year-old has for the lives of others,� De Vries told a Dutch newspaper. “The fact that he goes into the trafficking of women after the disappearance of Natalee is typical of him.�

You beating that dead horse again?   ::MonkeyMad::

Weren't they the guys who were on that sex site looking at for women?
Maybe someone in Venezuela wants to hook up with them.

 ::hohohosanta::

Thanks Kermit! ::DancingSantaMonkey1::

 ::MonkeyDevil::  Kermie!!!!!

 ::snowmanlaugh:: Another monkey may have already brought this movie up but,i thought it was very interesting to say the least,in regards to the possible M.O. of how they potentially lure unknowing women to the sex trade..If you haven't already watched TAKEN with Liam Neeson,it's a must watch...Very scary how they potentially operate!Reminded me of the Pimps & the elders in Aruba!!!!!

HA HA HA HA HA
 ::MonkeyReindeer::

I saw that film.

How many times did Joran say it worked before Natalee Holloway?Like 20.. ::MonkeyNoNo::

I saw the hat you knitted for Miss San in a department store the other day. I almost bought one for myself, but didn't want Miss Piggy to question me like a Cheat a.

I heard Tiger Woods endorsements might re-think their slogans now.
For example:  NIKE - JUST DO IT!

He was also involved with a new witness a year ago.  Never fear, Peter has not dropped the ball in this case, quite the contrary.  I firmly believe that just because we the public don't see/hear from him on a monthly basis - does not mean he's not on top of things, and digging just as hard as we are!!!


By Jen Hale | Reporter and weekend anchor
Published: November 19, 2008
Updated: November 19, 2008
There’s now word of a new witness in the case of missing Mountain Brook teen Natalee Holloway.
The Aruban Prosecutor’s Office says this new witness claims Joran van der Sloot confessed to her that he did indeed dump Natalee’s body into the ocean.
Natalee’s mom Beth Holloway says she believes this new witness is a girl NBC 13 introduced you to last week.

A woman named Celeste who first told her story to Dutch crime reporter Peter de Vries.

 

http://www2.nbc13.com/vtm/news/local/article/a_possible_new_witness_in_the_natalee_holloway_case/47534/

You are seriously killing me here, my friend!!!  ::MonkeyKiss::

Tiger has given me several giggles.  I'm sad for his beautiful wife and children...
but did you see the picture of the mistress from the Waffle House?  YUK! ::hohohosanta::

Me, too, TxMom.  It's so discouraging to send messages on that form on de Vries webpages, etc. only to have them discouraged from seeing what we have to say thinking we do not support and appreciate Peter de Vries and all he has done for Beth in all of this.

Not to mention how handsome at least I think he is.  I wish we got his program in this country because I would watch it faithfully even on other cases.

People in his profession live by their reputation and his is stellar in this regard.

And he didn't have to do anything to help! ::santawink::

That doesn't sound like someone "in-cahoots" with ALE!

Janet:

In my opinion ... there was more light was shed on the the truth in the leaked recordings from the police van.

---

Paulus had already warned J2K multiple times including at the meeting around the pool that they would be under surveillance and to watch what they said.

Joran for sure knew this and so I think in the police van he was saying things for the benefit of the recorder.  Kalpoes more or less but seemed more candid than Joran who was trying to get them to incriminate themselves even more.

I have never taken that recording to be any more than two sides each semi-threatening to blame the other.  Trying to make each other look bad for the sake of the recorder they suspected might be on.

After all, they were still in Aruba and it was very odd to place all three suspects in the same van at the same time so they had to have suspected the reason.

JMO

Does anyone else think that Peter R. de Vries just gets more handsome as he ages?  He is certainly doing so gracefully!

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

I wonder if he has a brother, one who is not married.

 ::DancingSantaMonkey1::

In a concession to Tiger -- they have agreed to change their name to "Nooky".  ::MonkeyWink::

Newp!  Not in the least.

Also serves as a good reminder on (Voc)King, Bastibro's buddy.  ::MonkeyCool::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::  Wreck!

Wreck! ::MonkeyShocked::   ::MonkeyHaHa::

Boy, I so agree with this:

You are telling me that John Charles CROES has stated that I wrote while I was chatting with him that I had written that the girl had put her hands in/down my pants, I can say the following. I did this to frustrate/mess up the investigation. I wanted to direct the focus of the police on myself and Joran because we were afraid that Satish would get the details wrong with regard to the "Holiday Inn" story. I was almost certain that our telephone conversations were being taped and I was certain that my computer was being monitored too.

On your question what made me think that the police would be monitoring our phones, I can say the following. I thought this might happen earlier and Joran had said the same thing to me on Tuesday May 31st 2005*. The purpose of the chat traffic was to help the police and the Office of the DA with regard to the investigation so that they could see that I was indeed home in the night from Sunday to Monday. But I have understood that they do not have the chat traffic from that night but that they do have the one from Tuesday. I know the technical procedure, so if they have the one from Tuesday than they should be looking for the one from Sunday to Monday.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=192.0

Hey, speaking of Bastibro, where's my bracelet!

We know he was promising to send a real one in real life otherwise he would not have needed my home address, right?



 ::DancingSantaMonkey1:: ::ElfMonkey:: ::DancingSantaMonkey1:: ::ElfMonkey:: ::DancingSantaMonkey1::

I forgot......he asked me to just knit you one! ::MonkeyDevil::

In my opinion ...

Patrick vander Eem's own words in DISPOSED reveal that authorities were aware from the get go of his plans to expose Joran van der Sloot.  Patrick vander Eem's own words in DISPOSED reveal that authorities were aware of the Range Rover recordings and provided input right up to the fifth ... the final ride.

Janet

+++++++++

AN ABSOLUTE PRINCIPLE

“Sharing information with people who work for people who are directly orchestrating the cover up, Rudy, or the Dutch, is the most irresponsible investigating I can imagine.”

Natalee Holloway's Uncle - March 13, 2008 - Scared Monkeys

Janet

+++++

ACCORDING TO PETER DEVRIES
 
Aruba:  no action yet against Dutch student
Sunday 03 February 2008
 
De Vries told the Nova current affairs show on Saturday evening that the Aruban authorities did not know everything about his new evidence.  'I do not have to report to them,' he said.
 
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/02/aruba_no_action_yet_against_du.php


ACCORDING TO PATRICK VANDER EEM
 
Disposed - Patrick vander Eem
 
Chapter 9:

... It took a week and a half for someone to contact me. As they say the waiting is the hardest part but there was nothing to be done about it since you can’t directly contact the CIE (Criminal Information Unit of the Dutch police which collects information on organized crime and big crime cases). They have to call you.

Frank had passed along that the information was pertaining to Joran van der Sloot. I told the man on the phone that I befriended Joran with the purpose of getting him to talk and that it might be interesting for them if we speak. Within a week I had an appointment to meet two CIE agents.
 

Disposed - Patrick vander Eem
 
Chapter 18:

... The vacation ended far too soon and there I was back in the Netherlands.  Joran called me and said 'Hey, are we going to do something?  Am I going to see you?'  So I had arranged to see him on January 29.
 
The Range Rover we had used was brought back because apparently the place the crime show rented it from had sold it.  The gave us one that was, to say the least, different.  The slick black interior was now brown for a start.  How the hell was I going to explain this away to Joran?  I could always tell him that they were pimping my ride and this was a loaner.
 
This trip I had to focus on how Natalee died.
 
Daury?  Was that really his name or had Joran made that up to protect the real person who helped him?  I knew I had to stick to the script as much as I could this time.
 
... That night we hit the casino and the red light district in Arnhem.  It was really late when I decided to take him home we ran into a police checkpoint on the way out of the red light district.
 
I stopped the way I should and the officer asks for my driver's licence.  He asks if the car is mine and I say it's a rental because mine is in the shop.  Then he wants to see the paper work.  The rental agreement is listed to Endemol.  So I'm afraid the copy will say 'So you work for Endemol' with Joran sitting next to me.  I quickly step out of the car to talk with the police officer.
 
Another officer comes over and we all talk nicely and it gets straightened out.  No problems.  They let me go on my way.  Who knows, when they checked my documents they got a big 'leave this car alone' on their screen.


ACCORDING TO ARUBAN/DUTCH MEDIA
 
Arubans wary of fifth car trip in Holloway case
Monday 25 February 2008
 
Dutch tv crime reporter Peter R de Vries set up a fifth car trip to try and get Joran van der Sloot to confess to murdering US teenager Natalee Holloway after the Aruban public prosecution department said the original four recordings did not contain enough evidence, the Volkskrant reported on Saturday.
 
Aruban officials told De Vries and his team at a secret hotel meeting that the tapes did not contain enough new evidence, the paper says in a reconstruction of events surrounding the tv programme which claimed to solve the mystery of her disappearance.

Aruban public prosecutor Hans Mos told the paper he did not want to have anything to do with the extra car trip because he was afraid it could be construed as entrapment and blow the case.
 
The final car trip with Van der Sloot and his 'friend' Patrick van der Eem took place on January 29 in a borrowed car which had been hastily kitted out with recording equipment, the paper said. The original had already been sold.

During that trip, Van der Sloot said he was not sure if Natalee had been dead when a friend dumped her body at sea ...

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/02/arubans_wary_of_fifth_car_trip

Whoa!

HUGE difference (not to mention the number of MONTHS that went by) between the Neth CIE and the Aruban prosecutor Peter met with after most of the recordings had been done.

Huge!

Details had already been revealed by Joran long before Peter ever met with Mos.

I would very highly doubt that the CIE hurried and called someone on Aruba after talking with Peter the summer before all this happened, in order to give Joran a heads up.

Not one of the statements you cite proves anything regarding Peter deVries.IMO

Private Eye was talking about the Persistence Crew and the evidence found in the trap/cage

Peter told NOVA that he did not have to report to them, because he didn't.  He was polite enough to
allow Mos to see a copy of his report before it aired.....common courtsey.

When Patrick contacted the Dutch Police CIE, they frankly told him that they could not assist him
but maybe Peter could.  It would have been entrapment if they assisted.

On the final trip, Joran implicates himself in murder.

Etc, etc, etc.

On December 7th the Duarry link was posted at SM and Magnolia discovered SOMEONE in Aruba seemed very interrested.

On December 8th, the Duarry link information was posted at BFN, maybe by Edward...I'm not sure.  Right after it was posted a NEW MEMBER posted at BFN by the name of FLORIS.  Floris proceeded to post about how they knew where Natalee was buried on the island.  Here are a couple of Floris's posts:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/FlorisBFN120809a.jpg)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/FlorisBFN120809b.jpg)

This would be the approximate area Floris was referring to:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/WestinBubaliMillResort.jpg)

FLORIS posted about 30 times before deleting their posts (sure sounds like REALITY). 

I have most if not all of the FLORIS posts at BFN but I'm not going to post them.  It appears to me that FLORIS (maybe Reality) was posting to change the subject away from Duarry.

I didn't copy and paste it because I thought I was being a little obsessive about the site meter. ::MonkeyHaHa::

Three others from Aruba came and read the Duarry info and then those same ones from Aruba googled and
went to the closeup of Lorenzo's property.  Maybe a coincidence?

Janet I searched to see your information in context....


AN ABSOLUTE PRINCIPLE

“Sharing information with people who work for people who are directly orchestrating the cover up, Rudy, or the Dutch, is the most irresponsible investigating I can imagine.”

Natalee Holloway's Uncle - March 13, 2008 - Scared Monkeys

_________________________________________________-

It is found at the link below, however it does not start with "AN ABSOLUTE PRINCIPLE"

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?action=search2 see reply #686

That's how I remember it, also.

Thanks Klaas!

Magnolia - wasn't I just saying that watching that site meter can be very insightful?   ::MonkeyTongue::

Klaas - do all of that person's posts  have the ending punctuation the same way as that first one you posted?  With a space in between the last letter, before the punctuation?

Over the years Reality's posts under his various nics have been studied closely - and most all of them are that way with the punctuation.  And of course, the immediate deletion of his own posts, as you said, is a dead give away.

Hmmm

So it looks like we had an Aruban visitor reading up on what was found, and then miraculously Reality creates a new nic and posts at BFN that Natalee is buried, and not at sea?

Coinky Dink?  I somehow doubt it!  ::MonkeyWink::

Gee - they are getting more and more transparent, aren't they?

I wonder what Robin Holloway thinks of her GOOD FRIEND Reality now?  I wonder if she even knows that he was spouting off stating he knew where her neice's BODY IS?  Did her GOOD FRIEND Debbie tell her?::MonkeyNoNo::

What a piece of work that guy is!

So I guess that tells us we've definitely hit a nerve - and Brinkman is now asking what could be the right questions?


 ::MonkeyGavel::

In my opinion ... Private Eye's words imply an absolute principle.  Collaborating with the enemy in any situation will not result in a positive outcome.

Janet

Jen

In my opinion ...

In all probability ... Paulus and Joran were given a heads-up following the first meeting that Patrick van der Eem had with the CIE ... the first meeting with the CEI when Patrick attempted to make a financial deal for secretly recording a FULL CONFESSION.

Jen ... do you sincerely believe that the authorities in Holland and/or Aruba would have with withheld this information from Paulus and Joran?  Do you sincerely believe that those who had adhered to the cover-up agenda to protect Joran and Paulus from implication were now on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway?

Janet

++++


ACCORDING TO BETH HOLLOWAY
 
On the Record w / Greta - November 14, 2005

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER: Well Greta, somebody is lobbying for Joran in the Hague in order to protect him ..... it has to be.


'Scarborough Country' - October 23, 2005

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER: They never—they never wanted to implicate these three young men.  They never wanted to implicate them from the beginning. And there is a list of reasons, you know, why we know that is true.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/9796403/from/RL.2/


ACCORDING TO JOSSY MANSUR

Nancy Grace - October 4, 2005

NANCY GRACE, HOST: … Jossy, regarding the connection, what I perceived to be a close connection between the judge, Paulus Van Der Sloot and the retired chief of police who initially handled Natalee`s case, Van Der Stratten, were they friends?
 
JOSSY MANSUR: Of course, they were friends. It stands to reason they were friends because Paul Van Der Sloot had many friends within the police department; he had many friends within the Department of Justice. And he had many friends with -- and he was friendly with all the judges in Aruba. He worked out of the same office as they did and did the same work.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/04/ng.01.html

One of the Aruban visitors that googled Johan's close up of Lorenzo's property
just said: Aruba......the provider and ISP were unknown.  Does that mean anything?

Janet,

No - I don't think that those who helped Paulus and Joran would hesitate to let them know about a sting operation.

But I've got some thoughts for you also.

Do you honestly believe that every single officer in the Netherlands was in on the cover up?  Do you honestly believe that even every single officer on Aruba was in on it?

I don't.  I can't paint two whole countries' law enforcement officials with the brush of corruption without proof.  IMO, we have seen nothing to prove that any officer in the Netherlands has helped Joran and/or Paulus cover anything up.  But we have seen that some officers in Aruba were NOT in on the cover up.  Remember Lt Tromp?

That's new.

Most say SETAR / SETARNET

Thanks Mere!
I had tried the other one.  This one is much better. ::MonkeyTongue::

I know!  That's why I found it suspicious.  I wondered if it was LE.

But Janet, don't you think it is important to distinguish your OPINION from a person's actual quote?  You are making that appear that PrivateEye said that was an absolute principle when that was YOU saying it.

Please don't do that.  I was wracking my brain trying to remember when Private Eye ever said any such thing.

It's totally confusing.

TIA

Maybe or some government office?  OM or justice?  Something official?

On December 7th the Duarry link was posted at SM and Magnolia discovered SOMEONE in Aruba seemed very interrested.

On December 8th, the Duarry link information was posted at BFN, maybe by Edward...I'm not sure.  Right after it was posted a NEW MEMBER posted at BFN by the name of FLORIS.  Floris proceeded to post about how they knew where Natalee was buried on the island.  Here are a couple of Floris's posts:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/FlorisBFN120809a.jpg)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/FlorisBFN120809b.jpg)

This would be the approximate area Floris was referring to:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/WestinBubaliMillResort.jpg)

FLORIS posted about 30 times before deleting their posts (sure sounds like REALITY). 

I have most if not all of the FLORIS posts at BFN but I'm not going to post them.  It appears to me that FLORIS (maybe Reality) was posting to change the subject away from Duarry.
[/quote]


FISHCLINT's phone must be turned off!
 ::hohohosanta::
 ::hohohosanta:: ::hohohosanta::

What was it Rob said about the internet and Oduber?  That some how the governemnt got control of it or something like that?

Anyone recall?

Following Patrick vander Eem revealing all at the CIE meetings ... an agent referred him to Peter Devries.

Think about Patrick vander Eem's character ... his criminal/addictive history.   Somehow I do not believe that the CIE or the ALE would be collaborating directly with this guy to further the Aruban cover-up of distancing Paulus van der Sloot and the Kalpoe's from implication.

Janet

HA HA HA

takes hole in one to a whole new level don't it.


 ::hohohosanta::

All just your speculation.  You would never get Joran to trust a squeeky clean guy. IMO

Given that Peter de Vries has outed several governemnt officials and makes a living making the law enforcement in the Netherlands look bad, I can't see them sharing anything with him, either.

I have heard that Floris' theory about seeing the site from the top of the Westin and the Bird Sanctuary before.
Can't remember where.

As for Peter de Vries arranging for the car not to be stopped, it would be a real good idea to do that since they were huffing and puffing dope in it.  While not totally illegal in the Netherlands, I do think it is much like alcohol in this country, sort of frowned upon while driving.

I'd think he would at least ask for police cooperation in that regard.  I know I would.

No I don't.

However ... considering the main suspects have not been held accountable ... justice has not prevailed for Natalee Holloway ... I believe that strings are being pulled in Holland to protect Paulus and Joran from implication.  IMO ... Beth Holloway is right on when she says "Somebody is lobbying for Joran in the Hague in order to protect him ..... it has to be."

Where is Roy Tromp today?  Following his words to the media ... silence!

 Janet

++++++++

LT. ROY TROMP

Aug 5, 2005 5:34 pm US/Eastern Judge Wants Aruba Witness In Court
Testimony Could Show Suspect's Statements Are Contradictory

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CBS) ―  A judge has asked for sworn testimony from a man who claims he saw a suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway driving with two friends on the night the U.S. teenager was last seen in public, the lead investigator in the case said Friday.

Authorities believe the testimony will support allegations that the suspect, Joran van der Sloot, has given contradictory statements about Holloway's disappearance two months ago, said Lt. Roy Tromp.

"The judge wants to hear his statement, take it under oath. Then the prosecution can use it," Tromp told The Associated Press.

Separately, a judge was expected to rule Friday on a petition by the defense to prohibit Aruban authorities from sharing information with the FBI, which gained access to material about the case at the urging of the island's prime minister.

It was not known when the potential witness, whose name has not been disclosed, would appear before the judge. The hearing would not be open to the public.

The investigator said the man told police that he saw van der Sloot, who is in police custody, driving near a pond by the Marriott Hotel around 2:30 a.m. on May 30, and that at the time he was with two Surinamese brothers who were detained and later released.

The account is significant because van der Sloot told authorities that he was already at home by 2:30 a.m. and that he had left the missing teen, unharmed, at a beach near the Marriott.

Based on the witness account, police partially drained the pond but found no evidence.

Another alleged witness, who claimed he saw men dumping a woman's body at a landfill on the Dutch Caribbean island, will not testify because authorities do not believe him.

"We've checked it out a few times and don't think the account is credible," Tromp said.

Holloway was last seen leaving a nightclub with van der Sloot and the two brothers on the final night of a high school graduation trip with 124 classmates to Aruba. Authorities and volunteers have made extensive searches of the island but found no trace of the missing teen.

CBS News Correspondent Mike Kirsch reports that Holloway's mother, Beth Holloway Twitty, remains steadfast in her belief that suspect Joran van der Sloot and his two friends, Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, know more than they're telling about the disappearance of her daughter.

"I don't know if they killed her. I don't know if they traded her. I don't know. I don't have any idea," she told Kirsch.

Although, it's been widely established that Natalee willingly left the nightclub with van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers, Kirsch reports that Twitty now says she thinks her daughter was tricked.

Tromp said investigators believe van der Sloot, who turns 18 on Saturday, is the prime suspect and that he had some assistance from his father, Paul, an apprentice judge on the island.

"We believe something went wrong with the girl, and the first person you are going to call is your daddy," said Tromp. "In this case, daddy would know exactly what to do."

Tromp, who declined to provide details about exactly what investigators believe happened to Holloway, said that Paul van der Sloot has also changed his account the night Holloway vanished.

"Why should you do that if you are telling the truth?" he said.

Paul van der Sloot, 52, was detained in June but released four days later. He has denied any involvement in the disappearance and has declined repeated requests for interviews.

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/Aruba.Natalee.Holloway.2.256295.html

Being that Patrick has been detained in Aruba...

How do you think he is being treated ?? Would be interesting to know...

Do they like him (for colluding) OR hate him (for exposing) ??

FISHCLINT's phone must be turned off!
 ::hohohosanta::
 ::hohohosanta:: ::hohohosanta::

[/quote]

Kermit,

It is very nice to see you here...

I thoroughly enjoy reading your posts. You seem ever so insightful...

This case has always seemed like:
When people get close to truths, the distractors come out in full force.

Unfortunately (for them), there patterns are way too transparent ...

"FOOL ME ONCE, SHAME ON YOU...FOOL ME TWICE, SHAME ON ME"

Thanks,
BUCKSHOT

Did not mean to single Kermie out, as I enjoy reading everyone's posts and opinions here at SM.

Freebirds did a doc on it.  "Controlling the Message"

Jen

I believe Lt. Tromp was a good cop.  I believe he was revealing the truth.  However ... those pulling the strings in the cover-up ...

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Janet

++++++

WITNESS STATEMENT - JUNE 14, 2005

Name: Paul van der Sloot
Date: 14 June 2005 / 21:10
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Roland Tromp
Description: witness statement


WITNESS STATEMENT - JUNE 18, 2005

Name: Paul van der Sloot
Date: 18 June 2005 / 18:30
Pages: 10 (1 Attachment)
Writer/Initiator. Roland Tromp/ Clyde Burke
Description: witness statement

Patrick spent a few days in custody after the arrest, but he was released.  As far as I know he is not in custody now.

He remains on free feet as the Aruban papers would say.

Again ... I believe that Paulus van der Sloot was given a heads-up by Dutch authorities following Patrick vander Eem revealing his plans to secretly record Joran van der Sloot.

Janet

++++++++

THE HAGUE

Scarborough Country - November 7, 2005

JOE SCARBOROUGH, HOST:  Another strange twist in the Holloway story tonight. Aruba authorities have sent a letter to Alabama Governor Bob Riley that may make a new investigation even harder to move forward with.

The letter says in part:

“The chief prosecutor leading the investigation and the General Prosecutor are appointed by the Kingdom Government in the Hague. Because of separation of powers, the government of Aruba has no authority to intervene in the investigation.”

Dept. of Foreign Affairs, Nov. 4
Source: Dept of Foreign Affairs, Aruba

SCARBOROUGH:  After all these months you and your family have been suffering, you find out that the Aruba authorities claim they have absolutely no say in this investigation?  Where do you go from here?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S FATHER:  Well, that’s really unbelievable that they take the wash their hands approach. We’re going to proceed on with The Hague, I guess. Also, our six page letter we were asked to provide to the Attorney General and we provided a carbon copy to the PM and Condoleezza Rice. We have not heard a response to that letter yet.

SCARBOROUGH:  Dave, I’ve been asking the question for months on people down on the ground down in Aruba who has the power to run this investigation? Who has the power to hire? Who has the power to fire? Who has the power to subpoena? Nobody seems to know. This really does look like a banana republic down there. Anytime anyone gets cornered down there, they just point the finger across the Atlantic.

HOLLOWAY:  Well, that seems to be the case. We’ve been running around in circles for five months now. When we reduce it down to writing, they put it back in writing and it’s obvious they are pointing the finger somewhere else now.


On the Record w/ Greta - November 9, 2005

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: All right, the idea of the boycott and Governor Riley how did this come about?

BETH TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER: You know, Greta, I was thinking about that. Aruba really has made us evolve to this position because, you know, what Aruba and The Hague have done to us is they've been dishonest from the beginning. If they would just have been forthcoming from the beginning to lead us to the proper authorities we would never be in this position right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: Can you identify one particular person, if we could sort of chisel away and find out who it is that we need to get to, to get information, so that we can sort of break this log jam who is that person?

TWITTY: Well, I think that's the $64 question and now we've got Aruba playing the blame game with The Hague. I mean I thought only the suspects were doing the blame game. It looks like Aruba and The Hague now are playing the blame game, Greta. It's hard to tell.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right and just so that the viewers, I understand what you're talking about, you got a letter in which it explained what the Arubans said to you that The Hague has been calling the shots, is that right, in the investigation?

TWITTY: Yes, they're saying, in the letter it states that the Aruban government has no authority to intervene in the investigation. Now then why have we been running around on the island submitting written and verbal requests for help from the governor, from the minister of justice, the prime minister? I mean the list is endless, Greta.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is there, I mean like where is most of your frustration? Is it directed at a particular person? I mean I know that fundamentally that you want information about your daughter. Every parent wants that. But is there someone who you think is standing in the way more than another?

TWITTY: I don't think it's someone. I think it's something. I think it's the dishonesty that has been coming out of that island since May 31st and all we have wanted for them to be as honest with us and be forthcoming and tell us and lead us in the proper direction. That's all we've asked. That's all we've asked of them.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,175101,00.html
 

 ::MonkeyRoll::

Again today the forum has been led away from meaningful discussion.

It is just like the poster at BFN trying to change the subject.

Sometimes I wonder whose side some of our posters are on.

I meant to say... Magnolia You took the words right out of My Mouth....I completely Agree!

Happy to see you Hotping. ::ElfMonkey::

Thank You Magnolia..... I have been super busy...We are having carpets cleaned here at home and its alot of work moving everything around......and getting it back in place....Almost done though...Thank Goodness!  ::MonkeyDance::

The carpets will be lovely for Christmas though. ::DancingSantaMonkey1::

I was thinking it too, thanks for saying it!   ::MonkeyCool::

Magnolia ... on this we agree and ... I find it so troubling.

Janet

Great to see you Hotping!   ::DancingSantaMonkey1::


I was just thinking last night, I need to clean my carpets too!   ::MonkeyWaa::

Sorry, I didn't mean to invade your box....

What was it that caused you to move to the dark side?  Maybe we can help you come back to
the side of justice for Natalee.

I do not mind being a lone voice regarding my speculations on a topic but ... being attacked for those speculations when the truth is still elusive is emotionally draining.  I had a reason for keeping on ... but I concede defeat.

I will no longer be posting on the Scared Monkeys Natalee Holloway discussion thread.  However ... I will continue to contribute to the topic threads as well as other missing person discussion threads.

Janet

++++++

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway

Page 189: ... I'm taking leave of the island, but not from the work yet to be done.

Don't miss Dana Pretzer tonight at 9pm ET:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/Pretzer121009.jpg)

I see it's a bit of a full moon everywhere  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I find it extremely interesting that the moment we started talking about Duarry, someone in Aruba is searching SM and Duarry and the next day, someone is posting they know where Natalee can be found at BFN.   The person FLORIS at BFN has the same writing style as REALITY and the same habit of deleting their posts.

I am not sure if anyone is aware of how quickly our posts are picked up on a google search.  I think it is more important that what we say about people is as true as we can make it. 

Janet's last post is there..... google Scared Monkeys and lone voice....

Janet's statement about An Absolute Principle is there....

We do not have the luxury to put words in someone's mouth.  I think we need to be clear when quoting another. 

Thank you.

“If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, it must be a duck” --Proverb

Does anybody remember the theory that the person at BFN is talking about?
I nearly know that I have heard that before.
Can see the site from the top of the Westin(name now) near the bird sancutary.
An old picture showed lots of woods or greenery around the bird sanctuary.
I just can't remember where I saw it.

I thought it sounded familiar too, Magnolia.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=3029.msg397192

#273 - is that the picture?

Yes it is interesting, and so obvious.   ::MonkeyRoll::

That is a great picture, but the one I am thinking of was an overhead.

I found this at RU. 
It was Scubajap posting that theory at FOB.  I used to read there everyday.

sunmoonstars Posted: Sat Mar 25, 2006 12:26 am   
Interesting post from scubajap on Freedom of blog

BTW-I saw some action around the Bubali Plas tonight. police cars and a firetruck and a team with shovels. I had noticed a bulldozer had been digging there a few days ago. I don't know if this has to do with the case, but I can't imagine any other reason for them to be digging around there in the night, could you?

I would have checked things out, but I did not have my camera and they were moving people along, so........ Will check it out in the morning. 

Here's the pic.

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/birdsanct.jpg)

Palm Beach high-rise hotel area. Westin hotel is in the forefront, behind RIU Aruba Palace hotel that is presently under construction. Image is taking at Bubali bird sanctuary.

http://travel.webshots.com/photo/2759665680100191119FJedxZ

2NJSons_Mom, MuffyBee, Magnolia, BoxerDawg, texasmom, Mere and 10 Guests are viewing this topic.

Magnolia, I seem to remember something, too.  Just can't nail it.

I just went back and read some of DISPOSED again:
(1)Patrick approached Netherlands first about getting Joran to confess.
(2)Joran gets arrested in Netherlands and extradited back to Aruba (with K2 in Aruba), then released, before recordings.
(3)Peter met Mos before final interview. Mos was aboard the Persistence. When do prosecutors help w/ searches (in USA)?
(4)Joran got transcripts of Mos/DeVries interview just before DeVries show aired. Prosecutor info gets to prime suspect. How?
There was ample time and opportunity for Joran to be tipped off. Just sayin'.
It is not inconceivable to me that Joran was narrating a script.
Not beating dead horse, but it IS possible that covert operation was infiltrated.
If infiltrated, parts still seemed very real to me. Convulsions and disposal at sea - definitely.

DeVries is a stand-up guy, in my opinion. His heart and intentions are in the right place, to me.
Nothing in this case would surprise me, though...Every day, every discussion gets us one step closer.

The recordings, as seen on TV, definitely gave the world a chance to view Joran (in his element). Carefree adolescent smoking weed, acting like a bigshot, unlike the innocent sporter image, his parents so desperately sought to portray. Sociopath...

About Daury...Someone in Aruba must be getting a little nervous. Disinformant posters have definite pattern and seem to fool no one here at SM. As stated before, as we near the truth, they seem to come out in full force.

I can see the picture in my head.  Somebody had made it from the top of the Westin
and the theory about Natalee being buried there.  I think it was a male, but can not
place it right now.

I had to say that..
I know it is a sensitive subject.
Needed to get off my chest.
I was not around when it was discussed (originally)..

While searching, I found a little Robots action:

#31, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2470.msg320576



Was the Westin the Wyndham?

I think it was.  I get all of those "Ws" mixed up. ::MonkeyHaHa::

IIRC

Bird Sanctuary was where they found the condoms and large flowered panties, maybe duct tape....could have been the "original" "planned" location???

I found this from our very own Kermit, who I am sure is a boy monkey. ::ElfMonkey::





 Re: Natalee Case Discussion #822 7/28/09 -
« Reply #376 on: July 30, 2009, 05:09:05 PM » 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: klaasend on July 30, 2009, 05:00:00 PM
The bird sactuary was one of the areas that they really didn't search well due to getting stuck in the mud.  It would be a perfect place to dispose of a body, IMO. 


One of the most telling things that indicates Joran did go to this area is:
Deepak called Joran and Joran said he was near the Wyndham
Then Joran was back at the Racquet Club where he says he left his bag & put on sandals to walk to the Marriott to look for his tennis shoes.
 
 
 
 

And to cast doubt about the upcoming de Vries program as well.

Just had to check with you guys.  While searching I found references to Westin, prevously the Wyndham......My memory isn't bad, but it's not perfection.

::MonkeyShocked::

Anyone remember if the bird sanctuary connects to the Spanish Lagoon?

I don't think so.  I think the Spanish Lagoon is down closer to the refinery.  I'll check.

The bird sanctuary is up near the hotels.  The Spanish Lagoon is down by Savaneta nowhere near the Palm Beach hotel area.

Good night, night crew......


Bed<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ::MonkeyBike::

Thanks, Klaas.  I thought that too but think it is the same kind of weedy water so thought maybe one ran into the other.

G'nite, Mere.  I'm not far behind you....still taking my meds for the sinus/bronchial infection...sleep is calling me.

Good night Mere!  Sweet dreams!   ::MonkeyAngel::

I hope you're all better soon 2NJ!   :smt056

12/11/2009 Awe Mainta Page 2

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%2014%20122009/12112009AweMaintaPg2.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:

patrick van der eem achieve culpable of posecion of drugs y owing to menaza one guardia of hotel cu dead patrick van der eem have to pay multa of 2000 guilder

yesterday morning in corte of first instancia owing to deal the caso penal cu ministerio publico owing to cuminsa contra patrick van der eem.

as is conoci at august van der eem owing to wordo deteni at aruba for posecion of drugs y owing to menaza one person.

the person is one guardia of seguridad of the hotel caminda patrick van der eem was stay. t’asina cu patrick van der eem not owing to come aruba for stop responsible for thing past owing to haci. past owing to let his advocate mr. the.schwengle defende.

fiscal owing to acusa patrick van der eem of posecion of cocaina among 16 y 24 of august 2009. also the is wordo acusa of posecion of marihuana on 16 of august 2009. t’asina cu in two hotel past owing to wordo achieve cu drugs. besides patrick van der eem is wordo acusa of owing to menaza one guardia of hotel in the period of 14 y 17 of august 2009. the will owing to tell the guardia cu the will mate. the guardia is r.v.

by cu patrick van der eem not owing to present, huez owing to tell fiscal p’e read his rekisitorio. fiscal owing to tell huez cu the is achieve all 3 acusacion prove. t’asina cu patrick van der eem owing to admiti cu the is one usado of drugs.

by cu patrick van der eem owing to smoke marihuana in bedroom of one hotel, one guardia of seguridad owing to bay wing his atencion y bis’e cu according maneho of the hotel the have to pay one multa of 200 dollar.

patrick van der eem owing to angry y owing to menaza the guardia of seguridad y after owing to leave of the hotel also. by cu the guardia of seguridad owing to haci denuncia of menaza, patrick van der eem owing to wordo deteni in one another hotel, caminda in the bedroom owing to come achieve drugs.

t’asina cu patrick van der eem will owing to menaza the guardia in one club noctorno also. besides the will owing to let know of owing to pay one person 500 dolar for maltrata the guardia of seguridad. patrick van der eem owing to declara at police cu the is using drugs, but the drugs achieve in bedroom of hotel do not of dje.

past owing to desmenti of owing to pay person 500 dollar for maltrata r.v. according van der eem the was angry y was mouth big, but none instant his intencion was for bay maltrata the guardia of seguridad.

fiscal owing to cuestiona the brutalidad of patrick van der eem y owing to tell cu anteriormente owing to arrive at one palabracion cu patrick van der eem, cu if the pay one multa of 2 thousand guilder, the caso penal will not follow.

by cu patrick van der eem not owing to haci this, the caso owing to come fast yesterday caminda fiscal owing to exigi 2400 guilder of multa y if patrick van der eem not pay the will have to bay 48 day close.

huez after of owing to listen the defence of advocate mr. schwengle owing to dicta sentencia of trip. huez is achieve prove cu patrick van der eem intencionalmente owing to menaza the guardia of seguridad y also cu the was in posecion of marihuana.

the part of cocaina huez not owing to achieve prove by cu not have one raport of laboratory cu is proof this. by cu the part of cocaina not owing to stay prove, huez owing to condena van der eem at 2000 guilder multa y if the not pay the will have to bay close 40 day.[/b]

 

Rudolph Vrojlic? ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::

Interesting huh?  And what it comes down to....all about $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$!

Yep! ::snowmanlaugh::

TMoM,
Will you venture a guess at what that article says?

patrick van der eem achieve culpable of posecion of drugs y owing to menaza one guardia of hotel cu dead patrick van der eem have to pay multa of 2000 guilder

I think that I can do the headline........

Patrick van der Eem has been found guilty of possession of drugs and trying to menace a guard at the hotel with
death threats.   van der Eem will have to pay a fine of 2000 guilders.

Patrick was not present in court.  He was represented by an attorney named Schwengle.

Patrick admitted using drugs and talking bad to the security guard, he was mad and had a big mouth but meant the guard no harm.

If I understand it correctly, although Patrick admitted using drugs he said the drugs that were found in the room were not his. 

He was accused of abusing or threatening guards at two hotels and the club nocturno.

He was charged with possession of cocaine and marijuana along with the menacing of the guards.

They did not present a laboratory test proving that the substance was cocaine, so the recommended fine of $2,400 was reduced to $2,000; and the days to serve if he doesn't pay reduced from 48 to 40.

If he pays the $2,000 guilders the case is over.  If he doesn't pay, he serves 40 days.

I think "multa" probably means "fine".

All just MY interpretation.

Remember when he was arrested, he supposedly had not paid his hotel bills.  No mention of that at all that I see. ::MonkeyWink::

His statement was read into the record, since he wasn't there.

I think he was accused of threatening to kill R.V.  ::MonkeyGavel:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Hmmmmm  ::MonkeyCool::

Very likely...JMO. 

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

I know it is bad to find that comical but he did say he meant no real harm.  And threatened another guard at another hotel as well?  Seems a sort of pattern with PvE.  Didn't that tv personality also claim PvE threatened him as well?  Must be just how he talks maybe.  He really racks up the arrests Imustsay!

Colorful character for sure.

Thanks Magnolia and TxMom for your opinions on trying to translate.  My mind is just too tired to even try today.

No online Awe Mainta for today too...so far this month that's two.

The 4th and the 10th.

I think that's interesting.

What's happening that they don't want us to see?

I think the pattern is that all of those lowlife's are jealous of his success (his legitimate business) and now his fame from working with Peter DeVries to show the real Joran Vandersloot to the world!  Poentje tried to get the same charges filed and didn't succeed.

RV and Poentje Castro are thisclose. 

I'm not saying he didn't do anything wrong, I'm saying he was probably baited into it so they could COLLECT.

JMO

I think they get pretty festive around the holidays and not much work of any kind gets done.

Speaking of which, off to bed or I won't get much done myself,

Goodnite, all.

Good night Anna!   ::MonkeyAngel::

Just can't picture it...sorry

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/CharlieRatTattoo3.jpg)

That's the twilight zone alright.  I think I may puke. 

Married in May, baby in August.  Wonder what the hold up was on that wedding?

IF there is a baby at all, maybe he's not showing pictures because he's figured out, IT'S NOT HIS!   ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::  On that note I'm calling it a night.  Can't wait for the others to wake up to this "news".

Edit to fix the stack!   ::CowboySmiley:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Wonder what Patrick was doing in Aruba?
Is he back into his smuggling operation?
Is he back to see his fellow "gangster" Joran to smoke some weed and sniff some cocaine?
How about his wife and children?
He loves selling hoses back in the Netherlands. Wonder if he is trying to expand his business...

Have you been to Aruba lately?

Maybe he was there to see family, gamble in a tournament, or any number of reasons others go there.  He grew up there.

Do you really think Joran is there?

Smuggling...with his notoriety?  Doubt it.

They do have a new Caterpillar company there, and I'm sure with all the development hoses break along the way...maybe he's considering opening a branch there?  Kinda doubt it though.

 JMO

Isn't/Wasn't arbeej = ----- Mom?   

As for the rest, I think this comes in handy         ::MonkeyShovel::

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek::


 ::MonkeyShovel:: ::MonkeyShovel:: ::MonkeyShovel::

I can honestly say it wouldn't surprise me in the least!!!!

Perhaps asking Patrick on his blog the full name of this R.V. would be a good idea?

Ewwww............Chuckles procreated?!?!?!?  ::MonkeyEek::

....................... I think that's up for debate.  ::MonkeyWink::

I don't think I believe it because I don't want it to be true.
Maybe he got a puppy. ::ElfMonkey::

Belated congrats to charlierat.

Sometimes, the best way to learn empathy for others, like parents, is shared experiences.

Ancient blessing goes something like this - 'May your offspring only give you half the pain and worry you gave your parents...'

Good Morning....!

Maybe there was an announcement of the wedding or the birth in the local Birmingham newspaper.

Gretawire:

December 11, 2009

Natalee HollowayThe Aruba newspapers are reporting that two Dutch TV shows are doing shows this weekend. One has also sold it's video to an American TV show. I think it may be video of van der Sloot taking a polygraph. I know that he got paid to take one a few months ago.

http://gretawire.blogs.foxnews.com/natalee-holloway-2/

You are thinking of "public interest" stories like that when a zoo animal gives birth. I wouldn't look under the "Vital Statistics" section.

Posted by Glenda at RU:

Peter de Vries on Sunday
http://www.antilliaansdagblad.com/images/stories/adnews/december/11-12-09/P03.pdf

Rough Dutch to English translation

Iinterrogation Recordings of Joran on TV

From our correspondent
Orange City / Hilversum - Video Recording of the interrogation of Joran van der Sloot by the police will be aired this Sunday night on Dutch Television.
Crime Reporter Peter R. de Vries has managed obtain exclusive images of Van der Sloot being interrogated by investigators as the main suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Case Holloway.
It is from the interrogation last year in the Netherlands after the hidden camera 'Car talks' with Patrick van der Eem.
The "Car talks" were arranged by Peter R. the Vries. The broadcasting of the recordings earned him an exception record of over 7 million viewers
also an Emmy Award. Video images will be aired this Sunday in a program from De Vries.
You will see how the suspect dressed in a thick jacket and with a woolen cap on his head as he enters the interrogation room and takes place on a chair behind a desk. Investigators hold him the question 'what is happened to your #ucking shoes?"
The question has to do with the fact that Joran on the night of Holloway's disappearance - May 30. 2005 - he lost his shoes, with or without intent to possible to suppress incriminating evidence.
Although the prosecution never has never been able to prove Van der Sloot knows what happened that night, the most likely scenario is broadly consistent with what he said in the car with Van der Eem: During a lovemaking on the beach near Fisherman's Huts the girl was probably by a combination lot of alcohol and possibly (party) drugs became unwell. Then became unconscious, after that Joran, in panic, dumped her body at sea. As he said, he receive some help from a friend.
The program of De Vries with the images of the interogation will be broadcast Sunday evening by SBS 6.

I've checked and haven't found wedding or birth announcements in the Ratcliff name.  Still looking.

I meant to put a  ::MonkeyWink::  !!

The Birmingham News doesn't print birth announcements any longer and only paid wedding announcements.

The guy is 53 or 54 years old and looks like he doesn't even like women.  Something is fishy IMO.

Are ya' kiddin' me???????????????? He looks awfully "Gangsta" to me!!!!

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/CharlieRatTattoo3.jpg)

I bet Tiger is working off his "scraps"!

Good morning Monkeys!   ::CowboySmiley::

I found his bowling scores!! ::MonkeyHaHa::

Community Sports: Bowling Report September 30, 2009 | Stories from ...

Sep 30, 2009 ... Feature stories and reports from The Birmingham News .... Chuck Ratcliff 268-- 615. Timothy Jackosn 222. LUNCH BUNCH Doran George 235 ...

http://blog.al.com/birmingham-news-stories/2009/09/community_sports_bowling_repor_2.html

http://www.antilliaansdagblad.com/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/12112009_Joran_AntilliaansDagblad_2.jpg)

Google translation:

Recordings interrogation of Joran on TV

From our correspondent

Orange City / Hilversum - Video Recording of the hearing of Joran van der Sloot by the police
are on Sunday night Dutch television. 

Crime Reporter Peter R. de Vries has managed to herd focus on unique images which to see and hear how Van der Sloot as a suspect in head the disappearance of Natalee Case Holloway by investigators being interrogated.

It is the interrogation that him last year in the Netherlands after he fell in with a hidden camera included 'Car talks' against Patrick van der Eem advise the to the mysterious disappearance of the American student.

"Car talks" were arranged by Peter R. De Vries. The broadcasting of the recordings earned him an exception record of over 7 million viewers also an Emmy Award at.

The Public Ministry was the 'confession' response to Van der Sloot again to be heard.

Video images of Sunday in the interview are the program of De Vries shown.

To see how the suspect dressed in a thick jacket and with a woolen cap on his head the interrogation room enters and takes place on a chair behind a desk. Investigators hold him the question 'what is happened to your f***ing shoes.

The question has to do with the fact that Joran in the night Holloway of the soil which seems gone - May 30 2005 - lost his shoes, with or without intent to possible to suppress incriminating evidence.

Although the prosecution never has gone was its convinced that Van der Sloot knows what happened that night the student has done. It most likely scenario is broadly consistent with
he in the car with Van der Eem said: During a lovemaking on the beach near Fishermens hut the girl was probably by a combination lot of alcohol and possibly (party) drugs unwell. They became unconscious after Joran panic in her body at sea has dumped. As he said he would have some help in received from a friend.

The program of De Vries with the images of the hearing will be broadcast Sunday evening by SBS 6.

That's where Tiger got the one from the Waffle House. ::MonkeyTongue::

I was looking, too, and thought of that.  Papers here have done the same.  Church bulletins still print this info about parishioners, though.

Yeah,.............. Tiger wasn't so "picky" was he!!!!  ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyShocked::

(that solidifies for me that he is a "sex addict")

If he has a wife, it had to be a mail order bride. ::MonkeyHaHa::

I can't find him in the Birmingham Law Registry any longer.  Wonder if he's moved?

 ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyAngel::

Natalee's Candles

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5700.0

My point exactly  ::MonkeyCool::

Magnolia,

I believe it was Nonesuche who posted quite a while ago that CRat wasn't on the law registry.....maybe his credentials aren't credible..... ::ElfMonkey::

 ::hohohosanta:: ::snowmanlaugh::

I have seen his creditials before.  He worked at a firm on Morris Avenue, did mostly bankruptcy.
Graduate of the Birmingham School of Law, which is a rinky dink night law school.
Morris Avenue has been the scene of a lot of crime lately.  Shootings and such.
 
My friend's son went to the Birmingham School of Law because he didn't have the grades to get into
Cumberland School of Law.(at Sanford Univ in Bham)  It took the boy 12 tries to pass the bar.

Well, that 's an interesting bunch. ::hohohosanta::

Wonder what they are cooking up?

Gretawire:

December 11, 2009

Natalee HollowayThe Aruba newspapers are reporting that two Dutch TV shows are doing shows this weekend. One has also sold it's video to an American TV show. I think it may be video of van der Sloot taking a polygraph. I know that he got paid to take one a few months ago.

http://gretawire.blogs.foxnews.com/natalee-holloway-2/

I had seen them, too....I was just playing with words & elfin' around. 

Do we think this is in anyway related to the "Jaap" polygraphs or is the actual "Law enforcement" interrogations?

Medley posted this at Scrux.  This may be what they are "up to"  ::MonkeyCool::  Sorry for blowing the margins  ::MonkeyCool::


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/Medley1.jpg)

Sorry 2NJ, it flew right over my head.  Hope you are feeling better today. ::ElfMonkey::

I think Greta has not done sufficient research. ::ElfMonkey::

There was talk of two shows.  One being the Boulevard show with Peter as a guest and the other being the
show on Sunday night that shows the interrogations in NL.

I have not seen anything anywhere that the Jaap polygraph is about to air.
Wonder which one has been picked up by American TV?

Now why would they be in such a state about a little ole boycott that hasn't hurt the
 island at all.....according to them.

Thanks, Klaas.   

Magnolia, I'm feeling better each day, but still have some congestion.  Getting there, though....thanks.

I guess what I'm asking is "are the Devries 'new' polygraph videos the same ones "Jaap" commissioned in a deal with Joran a few monts back?"

My understanding is that Peter DeVries has obtained some video of the actual police interrogations of Joran right after the Joran/Patrick conversations show aired.

The lie detector test is Terror Jaap's thing, and I don't think it has anything to do with Peter's show.

JMO

Charlie didn't run off with that monkey that used to post her, and stopped posting her a few years ago...did he?

I can't remember her name, but he posted about her in the lounge at RU.

from the gretawire comments -

There are some ugly posts at GW -


Johann555 "Joran in jail before Christmas ?"

I remember "Angie"  Charlie & Angie...

Did Angie have a baby?

sorry, my bad

"her" should be "here"

Someone should show this ignorant moron the picture of the 2 men holding Beth up after the FBI had given Beth the news that Natalee was most likely deceased.  These people really tick me off.

 ::MonkeyMad::

Try some Mucinex-DM to loosen that congestion.

I have no idea.  I cannot imagine anyone running off with CR.  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.alabar.org/directory/dirSelector.cfm

If interrogations or a polygraph are not done by our FBI I will never believe one word from any interrogation/polygraph that is done by someone from the Netherlands/Aruba.

JMO

Running FROM him maybe?

LOLOL. good one.  NO, the Charlierat and Angie thing was a JOKE.   ::hohohosanta::

Don't think Dutch LE is allowed to do polygraphs since they officially don't "believe in" them.

I think Greta didn't do her homework or ever who is saying that.  Could be Jaap's poly but I think it will just be police video of them questioning Joran.

Is this him Anna?  I remember Charlie was particularly fond of you. ::MonkeyDevil::

Charles C. RatcliffCharles C. Ratcliff is a Lawyer in Homewood, Alabama
Learn More

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Add To My Lawyers
AddressP.O. Box 590106
Homewood, Alabama, (Jefferson Co.)

Hi Anna good to see you.  Happy Holidays to you and your family.

I was referring to the Jaap poly he did with Joran.  We all know that was a big farce.

Yes, CharlieRat just adored me!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

I think one of his opening posts here was to call me names.


Surely that is him.  Don't tell me that there are more than one in B'ham area.  That would be an infestation wouldn't it?

San, I don't know and so far my emails to NL have been ignored.  Huumm. . .will send again this evening. 

I LIKE to think Peter would not associate with Jaap but he might to get the poly.  Just know the official LE is not supposed to do one.  At least that is my understanding.

And in that photo provided, it appears that Joran is trying to copy your knitted cap sytle!  He's just not original about anything is he?  He must have seen yours and become jealous but his was not made by our Magnolia!  Maybe Bastibro made one for him from goat's wool socks.

He has moved up the hill a little from Morris Avenue.

CHARLES C RATCLIFF LLC  Bessemer, AL   RATCLIFF, CHARLES C
(AGENT)
MARIAN LLC
ROSS PROPERTIES INC

WARRIOR RIVER BOATING ASSOCIATION
ALABAMA BOATING FANS, INC
GREEN & BIVONA, PC

Name
RATCLIFF, CHARLES C
Address
1703 11TH AVE SOUTH City-State-
ZIP Code
BIRMINGHAM, AL 35205
Appoint Date
Feb 11 2001
Commissioned Date
Feb 11 2001 Expiration Date
Feb 11 2005 Notary Type
STATE WIDE County
JEFFERSON
Probate Judge
REYNOLDS, GEORGE R Bonding Co.
EMPLOYERS MUTUAL CASUALTY CO

Now I may be wrong.......but I don't think the the Jaap lie detector test is in any way connected to
the DeVries show.

Jaap was looking for a production company to air his footage of the test and last I heard he had been
unsuccessful.  Everybody knew it was bogus.  (I would still like to see it)

Peter's show on Sunday is about the Dutch police questioning of Joran after the Range Rover recordings.

Thanks Hotping!

The 11th AVE South would be Homewood.

Didn't Angie post on an unmentionable forum a while back about having a GRANDchild?  May be what whisky was remembering.

A baby at Christmas time would be so much fun I think.  Not sure I will ever know, however.

Magnolia is like our own personal Birmingham GPS.    ::snowmanlaugh::

Never say never Anna.

Yes Angie is a proud Grandma.

Valero Energy, the largest American refiner, is taking another step towards building up its renewable fuel supplies. The San Antonio-based company on Friday agreed to a five-year deal with an Australian biofuel refiner to obtain biodiesel made from jatropha.

The deal also allows Valero to buy a 25 percent stake in the Australian company, Mission NewEnergy.

Mission will supply Valero with up to 60 million gallons of biodiesel per year, starting next year. Under the terms of the agreement, Valero can double that amount and extend the contract by an additional five years. The value of the contract could be as high as $3.5 billion, Mission said in a statement.

Jatropha is a family of oil seed plants that can grow on marginal soil without displacing land used for food supply. While there has been a lot of interest in the plant recently, efforts to develop biofuels from jatropha have been mixed.

For Valero, the deal is another step toward diversifying its fuel supplies. Earlier this year, the company acquired distressed assets from VeraSun, an ethanol refiner in the United States, including seven ethanol refineries.

http://greeninc.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/11/valero-bets-on-biodiesel-from-jatropha/



So it appears Valero has left Aruba far behind and more or less moved on.  Guess maybe now they wish they had kept the tax incentives.  And maybe not stolen 5 million from them?

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Beth%20%20Dave%20%20Family/17893946.jpg)

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66295.php

Google translation:

ARUBA

Patrick van der Eem sentenced

December 11, 2009, 12:39 (GMT -04:00)

ORANGE CITY - Patrick van der Eem was yesterday sentenced in absentia because of threats and possession of marijuana. He was imposed a fine of 2000 florin. For possession of cocaine, Van der Eem acquitted. The labrapport the outcome of the test was coke is not included in the file. The Public Prosecutor (OM) went only to 0.2 grams.

The prosecution had demanded a fine of 2,400 florin. Van der Eem was held on August 25 for cocaine and marijuana possession and threat of crime against life and of aggravated assault. At his arrest he had a quantity of hashish users and 2.4 grams of marijuana with him. The crime would have occurred under the OM between 14 and August 24. Van der Eem was in August of 2000 florin to the offer to pay for these violations. He paid it not, that Justice decided to prosecute him still.

Between 14 and August 17, Van der Eem an employee of the Westin hotel several times seriously threatened. The problems arose when he refused to pay $ 200 extra hotel charges guests who smoke in their hotel room. Van der Eem was then expelled the hotel, but came back with some regularity in order to threaten the employee. Van der Eem said the victim had told him he would kill or shoot. The OM had he expressed the following threat: "If I see you on the street, you notice something happening to you." Similarly, Van der Eem said: "Come to my car and then see what happens, I go shoot. "

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66292.php

Google translation:

ARUBA

Links with women journalists violence

December 11, 2009, 12:37 (GMT -04:00)

(http://www.amigoe.com/artman/uploads/11-pag-03-vn-conferentie-vr.gif)

Fifth UN Conference Information for Action

ORANGE CITY / ST. GEORGE'S - The idyllic bay surrounded by green hills of St. George's, Grenada, where 26 journalists from fifteen countries in the Caribbean region from the hotel look, is a sharp contrast with the topic being discussed these days on the fifth Conference Information for Action. This is organized by UNIC, the information center of the United Nations. Central, this time the violence against women that the UN has assumed pandemic are: 1 in 3 women worldwide has to do and the Caribbean is relatively leader.

by our reporter
Sharina Henriquez

Thus, the Caribbean region in percentage terms the highest number of rapes in the world. With the region in the Bahamas at number 1, followed by Jamaica and St. Vincent. Also presented are numbers of Jamaica, where 47 percent of the girls who first had sex, indicate that this 'forced' happened. Reliable figures are not, let alone full, say the organizers and they are therefore at the "tip of the iceberg". Women who are victims of violence, are also afraid and ashamed to declare it. The stigma is high on many islands, especially in sexual assault or rape. Moreover, police are not always helpful. "In a declaration of a robbery, you will not doubt your story or ask what you so late to the street, or what you wore. As so often happens in reporting of rape, "said Hilary Nicholson, regional coordinator of UNIC. Reliable figures are not as law enforcement violence against women not register separately or only recently started to do. Aruba is different it does not, only with the introduction of the new registration system, the police, for example domestic violence as a separate category to register. Before too long the police would also be able to produce figures of all reported violent crimes against women. Because the new system was first relationships being made between the records.

About linkages or left yesterday was a large part of the first day of the conference on UNIC. How can journalists their stories in separate incidents over links with violence against women? The organizers, consisting of UN staff and NGO representatives, want to lock in journalism from the conference that much more attention to the subject. As the kick was said: "You are the catalyst to change." That already makes any big discussion, because journalists are not generally hold to be told of what she should write, how serious the problem is . "We are journalists, not activists," said one journalist in Surinam. Yet during the workshops interesting dilemmas raised and also shows that it is a nice taboo topic alive. Not only among the population, including journalists in the Caribbean islands. "Why do we not ministers, who are known to abuse their spouses: Minister, save your wife? Why do not we, "asked a journalist from Barbados himself. Journalists also pay attention to women or violence, but as appeared at the conference, NGOs often only about one event. And that is usually in November as the International Day against violence against women occurs.

In the formation of the new Cabinet on Aruba were female violence is not the issue in interviews. They went back as usual especially on the economy. In previous elections it was also an issue for any party. While organizations such as Fundacion Hende Muhe den Dificultad for years called the violence a major, growing problem with all the consequences not only for women themselves but also for the development of children and even for the economic development of the country. Surveys in the U.S. example shows that the damage caused by women who are abused by their partners, nearly 2 billion U.S. dollars is.

The UNIC Conference in Grenada takes in any case until tomorrow morning. That it also be held in Grenada, not because the country itself is another example in the fight against female violence. In a brief conversation with Prime Minister Tillman Thomas yesterday, after he opened the conference, he said that in Grenada violence against women is a serious problem. "It is as bad as climate change and its impact on the earth where all attention is now." Asked whether his government than specific policy to do this challenge, gave the Prime Minister is no clear answer. Elaine Henry MacQueen of Grenada National Organization for Women, agrees that increased government should do. "The task now is something of NGOs."

Posted by Fierljepper at RU:

Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:36 pm         

Joran! Those shoes are made for walking...
I was triggered by that DeVries snippet from the police tape, that shows Joran being interrogated about his shoes. These detectives must have had good reasons to keep asking him about them.

Let's go back to the simplest scenario possible:

Premises:
1. More people involved = more complex
2. Natalee didn't make it back to the hotel alive (otherwise violates 1.)
3. K2 are innocent and have spoken the truth >6/12/05 (otherwise violates 1.)
4. The 2:26 call to Deepak was made in the vicinity of MacDonalds.
4. Natalee died in the presence of Joran ( no suicide/accidental drowning)
5. Body disposal in the sea is simpler than any form of land disposal.
6. Wind, tide and current that night could have taken the body into the ocean.

Based on these premises the simplest scenario seems to be:
* K2 dropped J. off at the beach and only joined the HI-lie to cover for a friend.
* N. fatally collapsed on the beach with Joran.
* J. pushed N.'s body a certain distance into the sea (make it look like drowning).
* J. had a good fall back lie in case the body would be found (I left her perfectly ok!?!).
* J. rushed home barefoot, called Deepak at 2:26 near MDonalds and went on his PC.
* Telling Deepak he'd left her "passed out" on the beach, is precisely the right thing to say (shifts responsibility for getting into the sea to N.)
* N's body was picked up by the current and disappeared in the wide ocean. That's why J. tells Patrick that he really 'got lucky'.
* No body, no case. Add a few simple smoke curtains and you're save.

But why tell Deepak about walking home barefoot?
J. must have gotten into trouble with his shoes one way or the other. There must have been some compelling reasons to compensate for a 4kms of barefoot discomfort and not simply taking a taxi. Losing one or both shoes during the sea disposal is a very good reason for his behaviors. His cloths were soaked and he couldn't be spotted by a witness and he was barefoot. What other options did he have in such a situation, than to sneak home all those 4kms?

So, why bring up the shoe story voluntarily to Deepak and ALE?
That is pretty simple in this scenario. His biggest fear was that the shoe(s) he had lost in the ocean would wash ashore (maybe even around the same time as the body and connections could be made). That's pretty difficult to explain (no car pick ups in his head then). Since he actually was walking home barefoot when he rang Deepak (and someone would ask questions about his expensive shoes sooner or later), he had to pre-emptively state that he left his shoes on the beach (e.g. the flood could have picked them up, somebody had thrown them in the ocean, loads of effective bullshit stories to explain why they found your shoes on the beach). At that moment he didn't know that neither his shoe(s), nor Natalees body would ever come ashore. Bu once the shoe-''genie" was voluntarily released from the bottle, it could never be reversed.

Was it a smart idea to dream up the HI-lie in this scenario?
At that moment in time, J. couldn't have known how lucky he would get with the current at that time. What if her body would be found on the beach the next day (most likely scenario in J.'s head)? Yes, then it still is a very smart idea to invent the HI-lie since it places yourself away from the beach and the HI-drop off also transfers your personal accountability nicely towards somebody else (MB-ers, hotel staff, security guards, etc.). This is precisely what happened (guards got arrested) and Deepak was happy (naive) enough to back up his friend, since contrary to J. he didn't have a clue that she had already died at that time (so it was an innocent lie from Deepak).

Was it smart to continue to incriminate the K2 until he got stuck on the 'Satish picked my up story'?
Yes, in hind sight it probably was. The simple fact that K2 had joined the HI lie made them a very easy target for J. to raise further accusations against them. J. tried everything to firstly keep himself away from the beach ("they drove off with her in their car") and when that was all falsified, his only option to not be totally alone in the case and on the beach was to incriminate the K2 (and this also kept him very nicely away from the risky "I walked home barefoot scenario".

Why did he tell Patrick that he kept his shoes and then threw them away in a sewer?
He told Patrick during the 'confession' that the shoes were really a non-event and that he actually walked home on them and never lost them. Joran could easily say this, since 4 years after the event he was pretty sure the shoes had indeed turned into a non-event and would never be found again. He must have realised himself that keeping them was a risky tweak in the bullshit story to Patrick and to bend it closer towards the truth, he decided to tell him that he'd thrown them away.

Are there bits of evidence to support this scenario?
1) A remarkable element of J.'s formal statement is that he carried Natalee for a while and that she asked him to put her down (it's a very save bet to say this if you have indeed carried a body to the sea and you're not yet 100% sure someone hasn't seen you doing that). He also told ALE that he went to the sea to wash his hands (make's sense if you need to explain your moves in case someone has seen you coming out of the sea after the disposal).
2) Joran told his headmaster already the next day (May 31st), that 'maybe she went for a swim and drowned'. This is also a scenario he puts forward in the 'what could have happened' chapter in DZNH. Why would that scenario be so prevalent in Joran's head the next day after she disappeared...? Why so fatalistic? Did American girls drown all the time on Aruba...

...or did Joran know Natalee's real fate and was he a little too eager to cover his ass as liers often do...?

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66296.php

Google translation:

The Aruban sought bankruptcy

December 11, 2009, 12:40 (GMT -04:00)

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ORANGE CITY - Trade FTA on behalf of the hotel staff of the hotel claimed bankruptcy. The union leader told Rudy Geerman morning this newspaper.

The employees who for several weeks at their biweekly salary guards, have been paid yesterday, 20 percent of this. "What happened to the remaining 80 percent going to happen is not yet known," said Geerman. Also, the hotel based on the union leaders have promised, next week to pay a small bonus.

The hotel is not only the workers owed money. The company also would be Geerman Elmar electricity and water company WEB together more than two million florin guilty. WEB yesterday the water of the hotel closed for a short time. Only through the government, got the hotel back water. Also according Geerman Elmar threatened with closure, but has through the government not put. Neither nor Elmar WEB like this comment. "We do not provide information of customers," said spokesman Kelvin WEB-Augustin.

This morning, lawyers were by The Aruban Resort along with representatives of the Minister of Tourism, Labor and Transport Otmar Oduber of the table to one another and discuss the situation with The Aruban Resort. Minister Oduber is especially concerned about the fate of employees and the impact any closure would have on the image of Aruba.

Last week Monday stopped a large portion of the staff of the hotel because of the lack of salary payments. It is not the first time that the working staff of The Aruban resign. Beginning this year, the Sales & Marketing concluded that 80 people lost their jobs. A few weeks later that the foreign hotel owners again reversed. It was also paying the salary already a stumbling block. Employees of the hotel laid a few months ago even a short time working and unhappy about the late payment of their salaries. However, the strike last Monday so far the largest. Reportedly made more than 80 percent of the staff in this business. Rudy Geerman of Clear union did this early last week, with more measures to come if the problem is not corrected. The hotel finds a long-standing financial problems because of U.S. banks, which for several million florin has borrowed money, bankrupt. The economic downturn has also made a drastic decline.

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66247.php

Google translation:

KLM return uncertain

December 10, 2009, 12:45 (GMT -04:00)

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ORANGE CITY - It's not 100 percent sure that airline KLM Aruba next year bond to its schedule of scheduled services. It says at least regional manager of the airline Simone Wickenhagen. This goes against the message Wickenhagen of the Dutch travel magazine Travel Revue yesterday reported that its scheduled service between the KLM Dutch Schiphol Airport and Aruba, resumed.

Today that KLM CEO Peter Hartman is not entirely correct and that there still quoted "no concrete steps" to put this change. Thus Wickenhagen to this newspaper. The travel magazine quoted Peter Hartman with a firm tone "KLM and Martinair will fly side by side on Aruba. There is enough demand for seats. The KLM regional manager has however the following Hartman 'exactly' said: "I seek the optimal operation of Aruba in 2010. Martinair flies certainly continue, but perhaps KLM Martinair addition, services will run. The question is whether there is enough potential, KLM and Martinair serve different market segments. "

The conclusion is therefore that it is not certain whether KLM Martinair can fly next. "There must be enough passengers," Wicke said Hagen. Although nothing appears to be sure, several local newspapers today brought the big news on the front page that KLM last summer abandoned scheduled Amsterdam - Aruba resumed in 2010. The Financieele Dagblad (FD) in the Netherlands has taken over the news. This quote Hartman with a quote showing that KLM "the viewing option. "If we transport a lot of airline Royal officials, who like to travel business class. That is one reason why we now see how we both KLM and Martinair both on the route to fly, "said Hartman in the FD. Government spokesman Manolo says Besselink also not aware of a final decision, but to know that the "very possible" that KLM this service is resumed. This response to the call that Premier Mike Eman (AVP) and Otmar Oduber (AVP), Minister of Tourism, Labor and Transport, the Netherlands have had with Peter Hartman, two weeks ago. "Their visit to the Netherlands has certainly helped, but I can not confirm the news," said Besselink.

Prime Minister to the Netherlands
Finally Besselink said this morning that he will ask for more information on the prime minister himself, but Eman it busy because a new visit to the Netherlands. "He flies to the Netherlands tomorrow for a mission." Why the Prime Minister in a short time visit to the Netherlands, the government spokesman did not report this morning.

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66323.php

Google translation:

Curacao

FOL-based view thorn in Chavez

December 11, 2009, 13:18 (GMT -04:00)

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PHILIPSBURG - The U.S. FOL based on Hato airport can not escape local and international discussion. That is being fueled mainly by the Venezuelan president Hugo Chávez, who recently reiterated uitliet negatively on the operations of the U.S. Air Force as close to Venezuela. The U.S. base stationed here in the past F-16 fighter planes. Today it is mainly specialized in aircraft gathering intelligence. Formally, these services are combating trafficking from Colombia. Venezuela are open to doubt and see the Americans here as a threat. The picture on the ground a Boeing RC-135 Rivet Joint surveillance aircraft with some regularity Hato state.

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_66283.php

Action plan FATF urgently required’

10 Dec, 2009, 07:33 (GMT -04:00)

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The committee FATF Aruba and the Central Bank of Aruba (picture) wants an action plan on short term for the combating of laundering and terrorism.

ORANJESTAD — Aruba must come up with a detailed action plan in order to comply with the recommendations of Financial Action Task Force (FATF) still, regarding laundering and terrorism combating before the next plenary meeting of the FATF in February.

That is the recommendation of, amongst others, de committee FATF Aruba and the Central Bank of Aruba (CBA) to the Permanent States-committee Economical Affairs. The States-committee had recently held conversations with a number of entities, amongst which Aruba Financial Center, the Public Prosecutor, Aruba Bankers Association and the tax department in order to chart the situation. The latter regards the publication of the Mutual Evaluation Report from FATF on Aruba, which had been published on October 14th.

Shortcomings
In this report, which was based on findings from the FATF-evaluation team that had visited the island in December 2008, a number of serious shortcomings are concluded regarding the combating of laundering practices and terrorism financing. To top that, of the sixteen FATF-nuclear recommendations, Aruba had had thirteen, which had been assessed as partially sufficient or even entirely insufficient. For example, the financing of terrorism is not a penal act on Aruba and certain crimes are lacking in the Penal Code as main criminal offence for laundering. The lacking of regulations on Aruba with regard to the identification and verification of the eventual concerned party with transactions is a thorn in the flesh of FATF. The same applies for the lacking regulation of and supervision on the electronic exchanges and brokers or advisors in stocks and insurances operational on Aruba. In addition, there are non-transparent and inadequate statutory regulations for trading partnerships that amongst others issue shares and make it impossible to discover the people behind the company.

Abu Dhabi
According to Juan David Yrausquin (AVP), Chairman of the Permanent States-committee Economical Affairs, there is a lot to be done. “It appeared from all conversations that the previous government had done little to nothing to improve the situation. They had clearly not given this priority.” However, Yrausquin is convinced that the Aruban delegation, which will be traveling to Abu Dhabi in the United Arab Emirates for the next plenary meeting of FATF during the first week of February, will present a plan of approach. This plan should be based on risk assessment at national level. In addition, the States-committee wants to present an explanation during the plenary meeting on everything that had been accomplished during the past months in order to comply with the so-called ‘40+9’ recommendations of the task force.

Aruba is a member of FATF through the Kingdom of the Netherlands. In addition, the island is a member of the Caribbean pendant of FATF, the CFATF. This group had also participated with the investigation, which had been carried out in December last year.

Thanks Klaas!  ::MonkeyCool::

Awww.  Maybe Ms Brennan could put herself to some good use for the island she loves so much?  Like maybe encouraging them to do right by Natalee and her family?

That would go a LONG way in righting a 4 1/2 year wrong.

Every day they don't, it just hurts them more.  Hopefully it won't take an island of 100% unemployment before they figure that out!

Hey Jan, here's a thought.  Why don't you and yours encourage the poor suffering souls on Aruba who know what these criminals did to Natalee to finally come forward and put their foot down regarding the coverup they were afforded?

Now THAT would be a wonderful project in thwarting a Boycott.

A person cannot help those who refuse to help themselves...

Please!!!  I don't mind if people develop scenarios regarding Natalee's possible demise....however...please exclude the accidental overdose and panic!

Joran, the sporter lived on an island.

Joran, the academic lived on an island with a high percentage of cocaine use.

Joran, the sporter was an intern at the Racquet club.

I surmise that Joran, the academic, sporter was well trained in CPR and care of the drug overdose. Joran was trained in CPR including calling for help.

The only reason, at the age of seventeen, to not perform as trained, is because the trained teen caused the death and did not want anyone to know.  If it was an accident, he would have performed as trained (it is a rote memory action).

Now the question is, what did he do to Natalee.  It must be worse than disposal or selling because he freely talks of those things.  Perhaps aspiration from something in her mouth or a head injury.  The hypoxia caused by either thing would cause seizure-like activity.  Perhaps GHB.

There is a reason the sporter did not act as trained.  Her survival would have been worse than her disposal.

or...he did act as trained and his father (the person he called) decided disposal was the best action. Either way "something bad happened" and it was not accidental.

WHERE IS THE "PUKING" AVATAR?   

This made me sick.   

(If it is true Congrats is in order) I have my doubts though.

I agree Buckeye.  This was an outright premeditated murder.  No accident.

We all knew this was a murder from day one.  We are all here because Aruba never did a damn thing for Natalee as far as justice.

Why?  Tourism? 


BECAUSE OF WHO WAS INVOLVED IN THE MURDER.

Good post Buckeye.  I totally agree.

Who is Fierljepper?
A known disinformant? Or a valid theorist?
Anyone????

He is a theorist, who posts at RU.  As for the validity of his theories, he is guessing, just like the rest of us.  IMO

This guy's been in jail for murder since July.  He was released today, maybe temporarily.  The victim was shot in the head.  If I understand it correctly some of the DNA evidence was negative but some is still under investigation.  And it seems that some witnesses are not sticking with their original statements?

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/14456/29/

(http://www.24ora.com/images/stories/news/2009/july/july19/wakata/IMGP0449.JPG)

eddie "wakata" ras his detencion not owing to wordo prolonga

friday, 11 december 2009 - 14:35

according vocero of ministerio publico, huez owing to suspende the detencion provisional of eddie "wakata" ras, that owing to stay deteni because; sospechoso of is responsible for asesinato of one man antiyano, fast of kooyman techniek at tarabana in month of july. click read more for more info...

according huez the pruebanan was sufficient for owing to as ras deteni till at the instant cu el'a leave pound. huez owing to tell esey cu enfasis because; reaccion on the ponencia of the advocate cu ras will is inocente. if provided that berdad ras is inocente, then will not owing to as in detencion, according ministerio publico. ministerio publico is follow tell cu the rapportnan of police is encera the investigacion of dna y the investigacion of the schiethanden. interesting is naturlamente the dna, cu owing to resulta parcialmente negative, but cu parcialmente is still in investigacion. dus the investigacion of dna still is andando for one part. the schiethanden owing to resulta negative. for thing is the declaracionnan, is so cu now here have testigonan is come back on they word. the investigacion is continua y on 12 of feburary the tratamento will take lugar. is more tanto one cuestion bewijstechnisch. ministerio publico is follow completamente convenci cu they have the sospechoso y cu is the, but have cu proof this convincentemente at huez. we will stay pendiente for her conclusion of the caso interesting here, as cu already owing to wordo anuncia, day 12 of feburary, this will continua.


Link to crime scene photos (WARNING: GRAPHIC!)

http://www.awe24.com/?main&id=1337&offId=0&offDate=2009-07

I'm glad you're getting better 2NJ...drink plenty of fluids!

I had a lot of distractions today and just noticed!    ::MonkeyDance::

I guess I should have said 10,000+ since it's already 10,004.   ::ElfMonkey::

This is an article from February 9, 2008 (right after the Joran/Patrick show aired).  I've posted a google translation of the article from Peter DeVries website.  There is also a translated version here that is a little different in parts.

http://tinyurl.com/peterrdevries-robinhood

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/peter-r.-de-vries/media/een-postmoderne-robin-hood-profiel-tv-detective-peter-r.-de-vries/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/PeterRDeVries_Article_RobinHood.jpg)

A postmodern Robin Hood "; profile TV detective Peter R. de Vries

Fri Netherlands

Byline: Marian Husken

By "solving" the disappearance of Natalee Holloway reached Peter R. de Vries, the self-appointed deputy of the Netherlands, last week his international breakthrough. What is his secret And where does research on journalism and vigilantism begins

Millions of viewers got the Sunday appalling confessions of Joran van der Sloot against an alleged friend (the undercover agent on behalf of Peter R. de Vries) to hear. She saw a boy who was proud of him until now police and judiciary had been outsmarted.

Peter Rudolf de Vries (52) and his team wrote crime history.
For days it was not only fascinated by the Netherlands announced the unveiling of crime journalist. In the United States was eagerly awaited the airing of the Dutch crime reporter who "examines, denounces, exposes and defends."

Where law enforcement failed, came to De Vries 'clear evidence'. He put an undercover operation at the truth. In previous cases he has recorded success with the use of hidden microphones and cameras, he has now hired an infiltrator into.

Database

De Vries describes in interviews are sounding results as "the happiness of the zealous." "All I can do, I will. Then I come to a certain feeling, a certain view and that appears to be generally correct. But nothing goes without saying. "

It is short for experience, intuition and hard work. "You should be curious and constantly busy with your profession." De Vries has over the last thirty years a huge and well-organized archive built. As a young reporter for The Associated Press he blinked every message that it was important. All criminal cases he has collected in plastic folders that go back hundreds of binders and boxes are numbered. And all that is later put into the computer. He did that long before the police this way of working introduced. The big advantage is that De Vries like no other linkages can explain facts and to remember that younger colleagues and investigators could not immediately find the digital search engines, which usually go back over some fifteen years ago. De Vries also has hundreds of police records on homicide, classified and put in alphabetical order. De Vries, in one of his books on the "treasure" of the journalist: "My store is holy, throw something bordering blasphemy."

De Vries has not only a great archive and a good memory, he has the best contacts in the lower and upper world, police, courts and the common man. And that takes time and effort. He read all letters, emails and also gives tips and answers. "The first thing I do when I come to the editor, the post view. Unopened letters exert a magical attraction for me, which is only broken when I read. "

He sends prisoners to contact him cards and books. "Sometimes the notes from the sudden strike gold."

He also speaks many people personally. His friend Cor van Hout, the Heineken-kidnapper, was not really any good sources in the crime scene, the first Dutch godfather Klaas Bruinsma knew him personally, and drug barons as "Hakkelaar 'and the Black Cobra.

De Vries is carefully compared with parents of missing and murdered children and victims to go visit if no long direct program is more important. De Vries in The Voice (1997): "Aftercare is the key to good contacts. You must give people the feeling that you have real interest and not just calling to one piece. "

So for years he maintained contact with the family of the decennial Petertje Oort from Purmerend in 1982 death was fished out of the ring canal. Murdered. The family went to grief under. The perpetrator was never found and the matter lapsed. But De Vries could not accept it. In the murder that he can not describe how he barred a rainy day for another matter in Purmerend and had had about half an hour. "I bought a beautiful plant and went to the tomb of Petertje. I put the pot on the tombstone, there was a card and wrote: "Petertje, I know you will always find the man who did this."

High demands

From the beginning of his career as a crime reporter De Vries put the bar high. As a journalist he starting hours on a eenkolommertje in De Telegraaf, but not long after he wrote crime stories and revealing detailed reports for the largest newspaper in the Netherlands. "Then I thought: what if I could write a book So shift your boundaries."

He was editor of the magazine Loc, wrote for the AD and now many published books: From the files of Commissioner Toorenaar to the mega-bestseller about the Heineken Kidnapping. His' skilful pen "was for him" a great lever "to the television world to come.
With his program came the national fame. In 2005 followed his failed affair with a political party. But the audience did not sit cannon be disappointed. That small crack in the hitherto shiny new coat was immediately scoops undone. In 2006, he explored the assassination of John F. Kennedy. Himself he thought he new light on this case international cast - but not everyone was convinced. In 2007 he came with an outstanding program of Gladio, a super-secret underground movement that was founded after the Second World War to the danger of a communist occupation to fight. De Vries revealed that criminals dealt with weapons from the depots of Gladio were stolen. He was furious that his blast caused no major revelation in The Hague.

And now he has his "daydream" which made, as he states on his website: he took "the bitter truth" surfaced in a case that every crime reporter in the world would like to solve - the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. A revelation that finally provides an international breakthrough.

People Entertainment

"De Vries is an ancient form of entertainment mode," said communication scientist Stijn Reijnders two years ago in his dissertation "Holland on the slope. The researcher examined many episodes of the program, Peter R. de Vries: Crime Reporter and compared them with nineteenth-century forms of popular entertainment in which crime is involved. De Vries has the same role as the singers of folk songs from the past murders, his program is similar to the "horror rooms" where traveling carnival rides with wax crimes were depicted. Like when it goes to Peter R. de Vries to true crime. The ultimate victims are young white women or children: the symbol of innocence. Who comes to them, is a beast, the personification of evil. And that should be fought by all means.

According to Reijnders De Vries is a connection between the legal system and the need for legal certainty and the associated moral. In his role as tort fighter leans on examples from De Vries (crime) fiction. Behind his desk as he sits in the studio, he recalls the literary Reijnders oerspeurder Sherlock Holmes. He analyzes the facts and use words such as "examine" and "do detective. De Vries played outside shooting during the American hard-boiled detective, said Reijnders. A fast guy in a leather jacket and jeans behind aanrent defendants to confront them with his "facts".

De Vries has the scientists in recent years emerged as the voice of the powerless. Television serves as a battleground. The crime reporter will not be too closely with the (legal) rules and can therefore do more than police and judiciary. He can direct an offender to get off and confront him with his "evidence".

He is not a storyteller like his historical predecessors, but a fighter against injustice. In the eyes of De Vries has a convicted murderer or not his right to anonymity and privacy lost.
Journalists, whether writer or broadcaster, have to abide by the so-called code of Bordeaux. They must present the facts as they are, and interviews apply. But there are no rules about obtaining information. Much material has been played in an inappropriate and improper way sometimes stolen. Sometimes it is necessary to undercover journalism business because abuse can not be otherwise exposed. Journalists have privilege. They may remain silent about their sources. In the shadowy world of cheaters, scammers and fraudsters and the murder and manslaughter cases that Peter R. de Vries is concerned, it is almost inevitable that sometimes unorthodox manner are required. De Vries as a television maker knows that a picture is worth a thousand words. Undercover operations and provide exciting images. But he was pissed when there is doubt as to his motives. For him the 'truth'.

And if the truth is achieved, confronts De Vries good journalistic use the liar with his facts. This is called giving reply. So that the viewer on the edge of their seat, is a bonus.

Reconstructions

Victims and survivors of unsolved crimes sometimes desperate search to help Peter R. de Vries. One of his methods is the reconstruction. This he calls attention to the facts that the investigators have missed. Critics believe that the crime reporter at the scene by putting sometimes painful detail "a sensation seeker" is: "A profiteer of emotions summoned by him."

These sounds were heard at a symposium in 2000. The statement reads: Peter R. de Vries: thrill seeker or national conscience Responses were recorded in Het Parool. The majority of those present appreciated the journalist that the crime justice and police constantly on the fingers tapping. "It is a macho, but we have this kind of unfortunately necessary if the government is too lax." And: "That he used this to media, is his right. And he thereby become a famous person, is fun for him. "

Self De Vries said that police and justice to him to find things to solve. And that's true. The former Amsterdam police spokesman Klaas Wilting example, praised the cooperation with De Volkskrant Vries: "He always comes after his appointments and always see both sides. I've never able to catch a hidden agenda. "

At the symposium brought Myjer Egbert, then professor of Human Rights and Deputy Attorney General of the Amsterdam public prosecutor, for an opposing force. "My biggest objection to programs like those of De Vries is that some police are taken. The follow question then is: who controls Peter R. de Vries still Unlike police and judiciary that lacks control. "

Also criminologist Hans Boutellier seemed less enamored of the role of crime reporter in the detection. "De Vries has the eyes of the journalist, the mustache (then still, MH) from the chin of a policeman and a criminal. In other words: Peter R. de Vries, the detective, the villain and the man who cares for the victims. De Vries is a postmodern Robin Hood in service ... well ... who really '

Criticism

New Revue in 2005 took out a story under the headline "The bad detective methods. It was about the "purveyor of Peter R. de Vries. Private Tech Michel Kraaij it claims that he jammed the business of crime journalist got rolling again. By using the phone how to pose as officials or colleagues. Kraaij cheated so many sensitive and confidential information about bank details and even entire criminal history which he then sold to interested parties. De Vries also, that he many scoop ( "Mabel Gate ') had helped, he said. De Vries, who was asked for a reply, did not specifically on the story of Kraaij, but confirmed that he sometimes uses detective agencies to difficult to get information on the table. "I think that I am free to anyone to turn to some research."
But a spokesperson for the Protection Board felt that it did not matter whether you are client or supplier. "In every case there is improper conduct. If you know that your orders for information to find out that no legitimate way to obtain, it is against the law. "

The Data Protection Act also applies to journalism, agreed the privacy spokesman, but not the control of the college.

Even in the case of Natalee Holloway, has criticized the way the crime reporter. Criminal lawyer Gerard Spong said in NRC Handelsblad last Saturday's even possible that De Vries 'unlawful' acted by an undercover agent who worked for him in the private sphere has made recordings. He has the privacy of the alleged perpetrator violated Joran van der Sloot. "There is about jurisprudence of the European Court of Human Rights."
But one thing is another.

Own Direction

While other investigative journalists stop De Vries goes through - that he calls himself, and his numerous articles, columns, books and television programs are the best proof. He found perpetrators such as Louis H. Corinne Bolhaar and who killed her two children. Baarnse he solved the murder mystery - still a cold case involving the perpetrator of a double murder was appointed. If he pleaded innocent free, as the two men convicted of Putten. Under pressure they had announced they had killed stewardess Christel Ambrosius. De Vries found much evidence that they had not done that the judges they should acquit.

In the eyes of De Vries, the end - 'the truth' - the means, now as an undercover operation in the Natalee Holloway case. De Vries has said in interviews that people who have done something terrible, no longer entitled to legal protection of their privacy. The suffering they have inflicted on victims and survivors, is too big.
It is a concept close to vigilantism aanschuurt (private justice). But he is not alone in there. That feeling of 'fault, then you should not do it "lives in a large part of Dutch society. This is understandable, but the suspects are involved - (still) not guilty - even though it is on television so compelling evidence yet. Netherlands is still a law where the judge decides, not the TV-looking people. The States should prudently deal with the privacy of suspects. In published rulings are names of convicts still anonymous. There are also rules for detection. A high level of direct infringement of one's environment is always prior permission from a judge. This is particularly true for undercover operations.

In America the Dutch debate about the use of an infiltrator to Joran van der Sloot to confess to persuade little stir. It is a detection method that is commonly used by U.S. police and judiciary. The Dutch authorities are much more regulated than their overseas counterparts.

Private justice and trial by media advancing. The debate over the legality of the undercover operation as De Vries who performed in the Holloway case, took place earlier in the United States. Even American crime alert the use of undercover reporters not. This includes the flow of money sometimes very wide. Dateline, the news section of NBC, in 2006 the citizens' committee paid Perverted Justice as one hundred thousand U.S. dollars for pedophiles to address, said The Washington Post. The members of the group occurred in a chat room for minors and tried to come into contact with adults for sex. The broadcast of To Catch a Predator attracted one million audience. Later came harsh criticism of these undercover operations. With help from the reporters and the public could identify the police pedophiles, but also proved to be innocent. Many questioned the programmers here not to. Here was finally the end justifies the means.
Back to Peter R. de Vries. He has more than four hundred murder cases examined. So far he has always neat things for each other. Democratic control of civilian investigators if he does not exist. But there are always (jealous) colleagues will not hesitate to tackle the TV detective when he dropped a stitch.



Last update: Monday, October 19, 2009, 20:30 hours

I can't wait for Sunday.... ::MonkeyCool::
urine, paulass.k2 should be scaaaaared....

Whatever Peter brings out...it is always good to put what happened to Natalee back in the spotlight....
And the last perps she was known to be with.... ::MonkeyMad::

I agree billb! 

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/Joran_PeterRDeVriesWebsite_12102-1.jpg)

What a nice article about De Vries complete with new and most handsome photo!

He seems to be the only person  in the world right now keeping the heat on Joran.  And through that, Paulus.

That is a handsome photo of Peter.  I'll bet he's a Taurus. ::ElfMonkey::

I have always felt that this FOL base afforded Aruba special treatment from our governemnt and likely prevented any formal travel warnings, etc.

I also think it was the card played by Aruba when they visited Congressman Bachus and he came out and only said "Wiretaps" that they threatened to not allow it if he and the State Dept did not back off.

And while Uncle Hugo is a tremendous buffoon, he does continue to warrant close observation as he does things like his recent deal to purchase $2 BILLION in arms from Russia and his chats with Iran for developing nukes of his own.

Yes, or Scorpio.  One of the two I would guess.

Yes he is, and I hope he continues to do it until we see justice!   ::MonkeyDance::

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/peter-r.-de-vries/biografie/

More pictures in the gallery on the right of the page.   

If you can't save them let me know, and I'll post them for you.  ::santawink::

Scorpio  November 14th

Peter Rudolf de Vries (born November 14, 1956) is a Dutch crime reporter with his own television programme.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_R._de_Vries


Which just happens to be my own most compatible sign, lol.  Gets worse and wose for me all the time.
 ::MonkeyDevil::

Anna was right....but she would be about Peter, wouldn't she?  He looks bullish to me. ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thank you, TxMom.  I can save them but am trying to resist the urge on my lappie.  I have a huge collection on my desktop PC and even screensavers.  Sort of embarrassing when one of my kids uses my computer. 

I tell them I admire his work with victims of crime and they laugh and laugh.

Those Scorpios are a handsome lot (I'm told).  ::MonkeyCool::

I did hear back from NL and have a couple watching the program Sunday night who say they will report back and give a synopsis of what he says, according to them.  Then I will post it here.

Is that what you are wreck? ::ElfMonkey::

Yes, that has been my experience as well, Wreck.  And with Cancer the Crab they are not only compatible but is supposed to be the strongest of all zodiac signs.  Something Scorpios might want to keep in mind as well.

Scorpios have to be looking at you to sting and do so when you least expect it.  That's what I am hoping Peter does to Joran and Paulus.

No SLoot, no Justice!

I can see why you would say that, Magnolia.  He does have a tendency to tear a new one.




 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyWink::

LOL!  Gotta be, Magnolia.  Remember every time we have said a male was handsome other than de Vries, the male posters used to post that he was gay and didn't take baths and stuff like that.  Was so funny and so predictable.  Johnny Depp comes to mind.

Halloween Eve  ::MonkeyShovel::

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

Thanks Sis!  I didn't get it, but now I do!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 I agree!    ::DancingSantaMonkey1:::

Thanks Anna!   ::CowboySmiley::

Sunday's going to be a long day...waiting...I hate waiting!   ::MonkeyDevil::

I notice the resemblance!

 ::MonkeyJnBox::

 ::santawink::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yes, definitely those Scorpios are a handsome lot, all of them.

 ::CowboySmiley::

I hope he does too Anna!   ::MonkeyGavel:: ::MonkeyJustice:: ::MonkeyGavel::

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Peter_Joran_Paulus_1.jpg)

Those fierce blue eyes are just an added bonus.

 ::MonkeyKiss::

(I don't think this is my "good" side)

And for a total shift in subjects, I don't have my copy of Beth's book around, lost in the shuffle of moving still, likely in storage so I can't look it up but someone likely knows from memory.

Didn't Beth say Theodore "Vader" van Loon was driving around pulling a little "rubber boat" with a blue barrel?  It's the rubber boat part that is interesting.  Maybe a Daurry by some chance?

I don't really believe van Loon involved and think he is just yet another scubajap decoy but the rubber boat seems to be somewhere nagging in the back of my mind.

Guess just to look at any and all loose ends?  But he seemed much too open to Beth to have been involved IMO.  Just another rubber boat to think about I guess.

It's so funny that you mention that, I've been thinking about that too.  IIRC his first words to Beth were that he was "sorry about Natalee" too!

And yes I do remember the part about the little rubber boat. 

Maybe Joran calls all little rubber boats Daurrys?

I always thought maybe he started to say Da-ddy and changed it mid-word.

So rubber boats wouldn't show up on radar very much if it was in fact even turned on.  And a small one would not make much noise which would also be a factor that late at night.  Wouldn't want a boat with big motor at that hour.  Van Loon's boat would fit but not much else about him would.  Don't think he has known connection to Joran and was older than the pimp creeps.

HT Klaas (pics)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/vadirvanloon2.jpg)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/vadirvehicle.jpg)

Loving Natalee page 84-85
snips
The tips are coming in steadily all day...One tip in particular keeps resurfacing---that Jeep...One caller says the driver is known as Theodore.  Another says his name is Vader.  A well-known drug runner on the island drives a bright yellow Jeep pulling a trailer with a small rubber boat on the back......In the little dinghy is an old oil barrrel.  This is the most difficult tip for me to listen to so far, as the callers are saying that the barrel in the boat on the back of this Jeep is where Natalee was put so she could be taken out to sea and dumped...

On the way to the print shop to have the new "KIDNAPPED" posters printed Beth spots the yellow Jeep with a small boat on a trailer and a barrel in the dinghy.  It's parked at a pizza restaurant.  The cab driver confirms that "It's Vader's Jeep."  He very bad.  Very bad.....Beth has the driver pull up to the Jeep and rolls down her window.

Loving Natalee Page 86
"Before I can speak, he sees me and offers, "I'm sorry about Natalee."
   That's weird, and his statement takes me aback.  I haven't even introduced myself.  So I ask him if he knows where she is and explain that there are reports that she has been seen in his vehicle.
   He replies, "What about the gray Honda?  I thought they were looking into that."  And before I can answer he volunteers, "The Coast Guard has already searched my boat."

I think Von Loon was a cousin of the van der Sloots cousin.

I don't think this is the same guy that's in the yellow jeep, but found it interesting.  You know how they liked to play the name games in the beginning.
 ::MonkeyRoll::


http://www.aruba.com/news/hotels/interval-international-nominates-theodorus-van-loon-of-caribbean-palm-village-for-arda-award/

(http://www.aruba.com/news/wp-content/phpNews/5_INTERVAL_I.jpg)

INTERVAL INTERNATIONAL NOMINATES THEODORUS VAN LOON OF CARIBBEAN PALM VILLAGE FOR ARDA AWARD

Hotels     February 28th, 2003

No comments (RSS 2.0)

Interval International recently nominated Theodorus van Loon, chief of maintenance at Caribbean Palm Village Resort in Noord, Aruba, Dutch Caribbean, for an American Resort Development Association (ARDA) Award, in the management and administration category for maintenance manager. Interval’s selection of Mr. van Loon for this nomination is in recognition of his numerous accomplishments as chief of maintenance for the resort.

“Mr. van Loon’s achievements in 2002 have been vital to the outstanding maintenance of the Caribbean Palm Village Resort,” said Marcos Agostini, Interval’s region director for the Caribbean and Latin America, Resort Sales and Service Department.  “The property has been able to uphold its superior quality standards due to his dedication and commitment.”

“We are honored that Interval International has chosen to nominate Theo for this esteemed ARDA award,” said Angelica Christiaans, general manager, Caribbean Palm Village.  “He has been a valuable asset to our property because of his strong work ethic and knowledge of the property.  His contributions have been instrumental to the overall success of the resort.”
ARDA is the Washington, D.C.-based trade association representing the vacation ownership and resort development industries.  Established in 1969 as the American Land Development Association, ARDA today has close to 1,000 members, ranging from privately-held companies to major corporations, in the U.S. and overseas.

The ARDA Awards Program is committed to recognizing the industry’s most remarkable talent in areas that include overall professional excellence, outstanding sales accomplishments, product design, advertising, and staff.

Pretty sure that's the father

Thanks Klaas!  That's what I was just about to ask!  In this pic Vadir looks younger to me than he does in the other one. 

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=203.msg456882

HT Klaas

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub7/vadirvanloon.jpg)

Thank you Anna!  I look forward to your friends report. ::MonkeyCheer4::

EEEEEEEEWwwwwwwwwww! VAD! Not a pleasant flashback  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I think it depends on the radar.  If you're aiming for the sky, that's what you see.

I saw a radar in action demonstration earlier this year.  The birds on the water, the fishermen on the shore, and all the buildings along with other water traffic all showed up. 

Learning to understand the blips is a skill that needs to be developed over time.

The demonstrator had many years of experience watching birds, small boats, and people on radar.

Why wouldn't Aruba see rubber boats on radar?  What exactly is that radar for?

I also remember someone, Dompig maybe, saying that they had such good radar, they saw all the people on the beaches at night.

What kind of radar do they have and what are it's capabilities?

First of all, regardless of the "quality" of Aruba's radar -- the fact is, it was "turned off" that night. Second of all, the radar question to me is moot, as I don't think the disposal happened that night anyways. Thirdly, no matter WHEN the body was disposed of -- a "daurry" will have a much smaller footprint than a larger motorboat or ship.

TopNewsReports.com
Articles

 
 

 
 
 Boats On Parade In Aruba


By Meri Ulrich
Mar. 31, 2006

During his little show on "48 Hours", Gerald Dompig showed the audience some computer screens that are housed at the police department where he conducts his business. We saw boats being tracked and he claimed that those were the boats that were tracked on the night that Natalee Holloway disappeared. He showed that every single boat that came and went out of Aruba on that fateful night was tracked on that screen.
 
He lied.
 
On May 30th, 2005, Aruba had NO working tracking system in place. It didn't exist.
 
Raytheon Canada to Install Coastal Surveillance Radars in Dutch Caribbean
Posted 30-Nov-2005 03:10
Related stories: Americas - Other, Coastal & Littoral, Contracts - Awards, Europe - Other, Radars, Raytheon
Also on this day: 30-Nov-2005 »
 
Raytheon Canada won a contract valued at approximately $12 million (EUR 10 million) from the Royal Netherlands Navy and the Coast Guard of the Netherlands Antilles & Aruba (CGNA&A) to build an integrated coastal surveillance radar network on the islands of Aruba, Bonaire and Curacao, including long-term maintenance and training.

Whole article here:http://www.topnewsreports.com/reports/article008.html
 

How small is to small?  How many boats were from the music festival?  I recall that some suggested here was a lot of boat traffic.

Would noise be a problem?  What of all the commerical fishermen?  Cruise ships in the early morning hours?  Drug traffic?

How would any Aruban 'clear' all the water traffic after the fact?  Days, weeks, or months later?

The 'fishermen' didn't see anyone that matched JVDS description.  JVDS...saw lots of people on the beach, but none have come forward to support his stories.  And, to this day, no one really knows which Kalpoe came with the taxi to pick him up and drive him home.

I wonder how often the radar goes off in Aruba.

Yup, that is what I remember, no working radar that night.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

I believe the Dutch and Americans have a presence on the island to help stop drug trafficing.  I wonder if they had working radar during that time?

It's hard to believe that they have no radar when they had cruise, drug, business, and pleasure traffic.  It's an island.  Good and services move by water.

What other radar was available on the island?