Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/SMglobexmas1.gif)

Wishing everyone a Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah
Happy Holidays, Peace and Joy

(http://www.artie.com/christmas/arg-christmas-newyear-bnr.gif)

:::lands gracefully on pads of paws:::

:::stretches:::

Whew!  Made it.

San wrote:


When I had my surgery, my husband came to pick me up.  I had to call him first to come get me and I could barely open my eyes.  They did hurt but from what I understand the pain and sensitivity to the light differs from one person to another.

When I got home I slept for about 2 hours and after that hardly any pain and I COULD SEE!!

I think San is talking about dilating and checking optic disks, etc.  I have to have that done twice yearly and so does my DH because he has had glaucoma for a number of years which is now much better  :shock:  than when he was younger, believe it or not (even his ophthalmologists find that hard to believe) and because I have MS but our doctor always gives us sunglasses and reminds us to bring someone with us to drive us home.  I think San's boss did not get the right information from his doctor or ignored it.  It is dangerous to try to drive after having a funduscopic exam.

My #3 son is considering this surgery, but keeps postponing it each time he schedules it.  He has always had such poor vision, even as a child.  I suppose he is afraid to risk it not working, or only working for a short  period of time.  He cannot even shower or walk to the bathroom without glasses or contacts, lest he run into a wall.

He definitely didn't know that was going to happen Tyler.  At one point when he was sitting there a co-worker came into his office and said hey why do you have the light off and before we could say don't put the light on she hit the switch :lol: .  It was sort of like when a vampire sees daylight :lol: .

San, I think I would absolutely scream if someone turned on a light right after I have it done.  I have very little optic nerve left and turning on the light would cause such a shock to that nerve I would just about go into orbit.  I can hardly stand that Tonopen measurement with the purple light at the opthalmologists' office.  That just about sends me into orbit.  I cannot stand that.  Does not bother DH but it not only irritates me but hurts my eyes and I am a really bad patient at that point.

Klaas and San ~ For some reason I thought they maybe did one eye at one appointment, and then the other one a few days later....are y'all talking about both eyes at the same appointment?

Tyler ~ Our son wants to do this surgery......he is in law school (1st year), and wears his contacts for about 18 hours a day with all the reading he has ...... says his glasses just don't help anymore, even tho' it's a current prescription.  I just know it has to be bad for him wearing the contacts for such long periods of time.....it makes me very nervous.

I think San is talking about the preop workup exam where they dilate the eyes and check the pressure measurements, etc., to make sure about all their landmarks before doing the actual surgery.  Maybe I a wrong.  and Klaas is talking about the surgery itself.

It depends upon how you want it done.  I had both eyes done at the same time.  Had it done on a Friday and I could have gone to work on Saturday with no problems.  I had alot of burning and light sensitivity immediately following the surgery but within 3 hours I was fine.

Thanks, Tyler ~ didn't have my glasses on while reading San's comment  :wink: now I see where she said pre-op tests or whatever ~ eye stuff gives me the willies ~ sure wish I had the nerve to do that lasik surgery ~ it would mean freedom!

I can empathize with him.  I not only have very poor vision but lived with a child who did all those years.  He kept telling me when he was in undergrad school that as soon as he graduated he wanted the surgery.  I kept my insurance paid up on him so he could get it and then he went on to grad school and from there to independence from us and never got it done.  There was a time when BCBS would have an open season on it (in Alabama) and pay for a two-week period at a time for people to have it.  That was back in the 1990s and the doctors' offices would work around the clock getting them done.  Those practices here with 10+ ophthalmologists were getting rich.

They've come a long way with Lasik surgery since I had it done.  It took me a while to get up the courage so I know what you mean.  :wink:

I know this is going to be hard for some to believe, even my DH ophthalmologist found it hard to believe but it happened.

He had glaucoma back to his 30s.  He started getting surgery for glaucoma as soon as they started doing laser surgery and every few months would have a "bleb" created.  One day he was weed-eating the garden and took his goggles off to wipe perspiration but did not turn the weedeater off.   Something from the weedeater hit him in the eye.  We took him to the ER and they patched it and gave him some drops.  He went to see his opthalmologist the next week (it happened on Saturday).  Opthalmologist was concerned about infection so just treated that.  Once the infection had subsided (a week or so), his eye pressure had lowered and within a month, he no longer had to use drops for glaucoma and now his eyes are fine, but they keep a check on him.  He does not even wear glasses except to read anymore.  They think whatever hit him opened up that valve that increases the pressure the same way doctors try to open it up with laser surgery but the rock or whatever did it permanently, and we  were so worried about what that "rock" was going to do to his eyes and yet it turned out to be the best thing that ever happened to him.

LEP - good to see you back but sorry to hear about your mom, I know it's hard for you.  {{HUGS}}

Welcome back LEP.

Can't stay long, as I must get some things done and have an appt later...may peak in once in a while.

Tyer, My DH's cousin, who has an identical twin, was dx'd with glaucoma.  Turns out it was a false dx, only found out by getting several opinions.

Edited to correct Tyler...

LEP!!!!!! :arrow:  

MISSED U!

i don't think u missed much in the case tho.....
so far still like pulling teeth......in Aruba

and here....well ---we were discussing lasik eye surgeries....lol

Glad to see you back LEP!! And so sorry to hear about your mother. I remember that you had posted about her deteriorating condition awhile back  :cry:

It is possible to misdiagnose it.  I am sure my DH's was not misdiagnosed, however, as he had been to some of the finest cinics in the country over the years.  Having said that and told you about the pressure, there is another case similar to his where a man in England had had glaucoma for years and he was hit by some objects from a falling building and his glacauoma also disappeared as a result of the injury.  In fact, an ophthalmologist at UAB who I see once a year told me about it when I was telling him about my DH.  He was asking why DH no longer comes to see him.  I asked him if he had not gotten a letter from our local guys.  He said he had not and then I told him the story and he told me about that case in London.

Happy New Year, LEP.  Glad you are doing better but wanted to warn you, the Mucktards are still on the loose. :wink:

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  8)

LEP, my heart breaks for you  :cry:

{{{HUGS}}}

Hi LEP.  We haven't met, but I'm sorry to hear about your mom.  Glad you're getting back into the swing of things.  

Monkeys, don't forget to send healthy, happy, healing thoughts and prayers for Peaches - Chemo today.  I promised I'd remind everyone to try and make it easier for her!  

Here are three kitties and I was hoping someone could dress them up for new years celebrations.  Maybe fireworks or something.  Please?  

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/catntail.gif)

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/dancingkitty.gif)

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/kitteninjar.jpg)
This one I found on Webshots.  Too cute not to share!  

:oops: I only need one dressed up for New Years.  But if you want to do more than one and offer them to others, that would be ok.

Love and prayers to our Fuzzy Wuzzy Girl!!

LEP, right on!!!

Tylergal, if getting hit in the eye or head could fix my eyes or other ailments, that would be a miracle.  Just like Natalee's case, there's been some cyber debris flying around, and if it would just hit the right fan, it would be a miracle.

BBL

Amidst all this, let's remember to pray for Beth, Natalee and Peaches.

I found this and thought it was pretty funny.  Hope you will find it silly as I did as well.

http://www.newhousenews.com/archive/lileks122706.html

Hi Everybody!!
Can't stay just wanted to tell L.E.P. ot's soooo good to see you.  You've been on my mind, and I was just thinking about you today.

Leslie  you and your family are in my prayers.

Another Suicide

http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/

PRODUCTOR DI PROGRAMA NA TELEARUBA A COMETE SUICIDIO
(http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/noticiadidia/productorte.jpg)

ORANJESTAD (AAN): Mundo di prensa audiovisual ta na luto na Aruba, ora cu un conocido productor di TV local a comete suicidio, Diamars merdia na su cas na Macuarima.

   Tabata algo banda di 3’or, cu e informe a drenta cu na Macuarima tin un persona ta horcando su mes e momento ey.  Pero ora cu Polis y Ambulans a yega ya caba ta laat.  Den patio net riba un cura di popchi, e dama Brigitte Christine Katelaan a comete e acto tristo aki, y asina autoridad a bin haye.

   Polis ni Ambulans por a haci nada mas.  Pero demas autoridad halto a ser yama, y Departamento Tecnico di Polis a bin haci su investigacion.  Banda di 3:30’or, Docter Brouwer a constata morto di e dama aki, kende a nace dia 3 di Mei 1970 na Hulanda.

   E dama di 36 aña aki ta trahando como Productor di programa na TeleAruba.  Anteriormente el a yega di funciona tambe na ATV, y prome cu esey tabata traha na Curaçao.

   E tin un yiu muher kende ta studiando actualmente na Hulanda, y sigur e noticia aki ta dal henter famia como un shock.

   Ningun hende a mira Brigitte den mal humor ultimo dianan aki.  Semper e tabata un persona energetico, cu yen plan pa bida, y yen di idea di creatividad pa su programanan.  TeleAruba mes a bay den luto desde Diamars atardi caba.

   Kico a pone Brigitte comete lo extremo aki?  Ningun detaye ta existi si acaso tin problema na trabao.  Pero ta varios storia a circula Diamars atardi y anochi, sinembargo e so sa di con el a haci esaki.

Tin indicacion cu el a laga un carta atras, pero autoridad no por a confirma esaki pa DIARIO.

   Na su famia, y coleganan di TV, Matutino DIARIO ta expresa su mas profundo palabra di condolencia.
 
(http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/noticiadidia/produ1.jpg)

Well I'll just include this as another murder.  I don't believe a word they say.

Can anyone read enough to be able to determine how she was supposed to have committed suicide?

At least in their photo they covered up most of the body this time.  :roll:

LEP,
Good to see you posting again!  

Monkeys,
What is that photo at the end of the article on the Arubacide?  Is
that supposed to be the body and what is it showing?  Did this young
woman supposedly hang herself and that is what this gruesome, grotesque photo is about?  This is one of the most morbid things they
have published yet if that is what it is.

.

Looking at that second picture, looks like she hung herself from a tree??

LEP - was playing around with your avatar, trying to make it ready for New Years:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/LepFireworks2007.gif)

Do you want me to delete that photo?

Based on photos we've seen in the past, I'm surprised they didn't show the poor woman's face to illustrate the effects of hanging. :roll:

LEP sorry about your loss!

BOC on a fly by!

Klass will this close at 50? :?

She stabbed herself in the back, tied herself up and got into the trunk of car after turning on the gas and closing the trunk.

I'm surprised they didn't say tree runs after woman and hangs her :roll: .

 :lol:  :lol:

Well, they would have said that if it weren't for the fact that all deaths on Aruba are totally the fault of the suicidal victim.  :roll:

Ouch, she forgot to eviscerate herself like that guy burned in the cave.

NO, Klaas,

I don't want you to delete it even though it is upsetting because it is
a part of the "Aruban experience" and Reason 93 not to go to Aruba.  
If anything happens to you, they will take gruesome photos of your body
and publish them in the newspapers.   :evil:

What a sad story and why on earth with such an attractive young woman!  I just wonder if there will be an adequate investigation.

And thanks for the article about the body on the beach, forgot
it was the weekend down there.   :roll:

If anyone missed the other body in the news,

here is a link.
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/


It mentions cocaine and Colombia but can anyone translate any
other parts?  I think it says the family has yet to be located and
notified, no name given.  Shows a black car as well so I wonder if
the car belonged to the victim of whatever.

Appears a young man so think we can rule out natural causes.

.

Klaas, I wonder if we could summon Sandy to help us with the translation. God bless Sandy, so sweet to do this for us.

With the Twitty-versus-Kalpoe suit heating up, it makes you wonder what these two knew and when did they know it.

Unfortunately, I don't have any way to summon her.

From what I understand, the guy on the beach died from a cocaine OD and he was a Columbian.

Right the old cocaine OD death.  There seems to be a lot of them on that island and they always wind up on the beach too.

I guess jumping from buildings got old, so now they are OD'ing.  Surprisingly neither found their way to a cave.  I thought that was the new trick.

Where is our little Boston Terrier?  Can we find out through your writer friend, what his writer friend knows about this, BT Girl?

I was actually e-mailing with him when you posted this, LOL. He says he hasn't heard anything from him since Dec. 23.  :(

I'm waiting for the day when I see Paulus hanging from a tree and Joran dead on the beach from a cocaine OD.  Then I will believe those deaths were a suicide.

Thank you a bunch, BT.

I wish we had started an Arubacide Thread as well as the Murder and Crime Thread.  It will receive its 7000th view within the next few hours.  I did post a link at BFN as WorldJournier, with whom I have posted since almost Day 1 in various capacities, posted that AHATA newsletter whining
about crime being reported when it happens in Aruba.

As San pointed out, seems they mind the reporting of it more than
the actual crime.

But if you will recall, there are far far too many deaths of very young people in 2005.  What were those all about?  AIDS?  Auto accidents?  Arubacides?  A whole rash of deaths of very young folks for that year.  I wonder what the suicide rate on One UnHappy, Crappy Island was for 2005.

How could we locate these stats by their version of events?  Not that I believe it but still, I would like to know what they had to say about all those deaths we saw posted by that one mortuary.

BTW, did all of you know that at one point in time, "someone" asked that WorldJournier's huge timeline of events in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway be taken down from the internet.  Contacted his ISP and asked that he be deleted, etc.   :roll: Nice try, huh?  Didn't work.  Thankfully.

.

We have beach area in Alabama, sugar white sands and all but I don't think I have ever heard of anybody heading for the beach to OD on cocaine.  Aren't most victims of cocaine OD's found in places like bed and bathrooms?  

What I am getting at is that is one is going to consume large amounts of an illegal drug, doesn't one tend to seek privacy to do so in violation of the law for fear of arrest, etc.?  

Therefore, since this is counter-intuitive behavior, I am sure the very
first thing LE would look for would be signs of death occurring elsewhere, right?

Do the hotels or individuals transport these bodies to the beach to avoid being connected with these unfortunate deaths?  Assuming, of course, they even are accidental OD's in the first time which is being very
generous.

.

O/T

We just got the annual Christmas card/letter from hubby's multibazillionaire cousin. This is the house where she lives now. Must be nice.

(http://www.petershamvillage.co.uk/images/Montrose%20House%20Small%20Web%20view.jpg)

Sure is nice.

It wasn't quite up to their standard when they bought it. They had to add some little personal touches like indoor swimming pools and such.  :lol:

Did hubby write her back and tell her she was his favorite cousin :lol: .

I'm glad it went well Sue.  Remember don't rub your eyes.

Actually, hubby hasn't seen her in years and years. I've never even met her. (I think I'm too poor.  :wink: ) She said we could go see her house when we were there in October, but she had stuff to do and wouldn't have been there to see us. We declined the gracious invitation.  :lol:

O/T
BT,
No. 1 Son and new DIL are leaving tomorrow to go to London for the New Year's.  I am a little uneasy considering all the fog but assume the airlines will exercise due caution and all that.

I guess going to Times Square no longer terrorizes me enough so he thought this might.   :roll: Says he wants to see London before too many changes and it is unrecognizable, too.  Pessimistic sort.

He likes to see New Years in different places.  They will return 2nd or 3rd of January, forgot which.  He also said London is very expensive, one of most expensive cities in the world right now for travel.


.

Sue - I'm so happy for you. Congratulations!

Sue,
Please be careful and do not strain your eyes yet!

I want a full report in a few days as I have two sons who are very near-sighted and I have been pushing this to both of them who refuse to cooperate.

I want them to have this surgery while young so they will have the benefit for a lifetime but they don't see it that way for some reason.  Not even when one of their best friends praises the procedure.

Don't know what it will take to convince them.

.

London is definitely expensive. Everything there costs at least twice as much as it does here. I love to go, though. We only got to spend one day there this last trip, but we had lots of fun.

It's been my experience that the airlines are very cautious about the fog. I've been on flights that were delayed due to fog, so it's probably going to be pretty safe for your son. Do you know which airport - Gatwick or Heathrow?

thank you San and BT and san I wont rub my eyes im being good girl  :)

I will let you know how things are in a few days it was rough waking up my eyes were really sore after numbing drops wore off and valium but as soon as i started bawling it lubed my eyes up and i can open them now
other then that except for these very dark glasses that dont make me look like a rock star this is great.. im already seeing things i could never see without my glasses

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/BleachedBlackNY2007.jpg)

 :lol:  :lol:

That's adorable!

Sue - by tomorrow you will hardly feel any pain at all, just maybe a little scratchiness.  You will be amazed how well you will be able to see!

No, BT, I don't know which airport and don't have Flight Numbers or anything like that any more.  He used to give those sometimes as he has to travel a lot internationally but I guess the new mother in law has those.   :roll: She lives near them and I don't.   :roll:  :roll:  :roll:   In fact, he didn't even call me today as he said he would.   :roll:

I have goofed off today and now have to do some work but will be lurking as I do it. . . . .


,

Anna, I see a definite need for some butt beating in that young man's future.  :lol:

Good Lord, Anna, our kids must be related.

Oh, darn, he is sounding like he is married.  I get the same thing from two of mine, but one DIL keeps me posted everytime she hears from son, where he is going, when he is returning and what he says when he calls (or the parts she wants me to hear).  I wish I had more DIL's like that one.  It really helps. I guess if they were not married, I never would hear from them, so at least their wives do call occasionally.  One of ours is going to the VI for their holiday.  Yep, they did Times Square and London once since 9/11.  Don't you love it when they are so careful to protect themselves, Anna?  I swear, we may have kids that are related.

Where's the Garage?

Heh, heh, I'm a pre lasik guy, I had RK done back in 91 on my blind eye.

When it comes to eyes doctors I'm kinda lucky mines one of my buddies.

I helped setup a lot of computers for him and kept him up to date on all the latest technologies through the years, so he treats me very well with the eye stuff.

wish I could have dont that, but at least i didnt have to sleep with the guy
to get a discount :lol:

Bringing this post forward to say I agree about that picture! That is awful to show, her foot is purple......Hi Monkeys!

Hi Elaine

You're right, that's a terrible picture. All those articles about deaths on Aruba are so gory.  :(

Well, not related by biology but by location, background, father's same occupation, so guess the results are similar.  Who knew it would produce such brats at times!   :D

.

Well, that showing of pics is just a cultural thing.

Check out all the newsreals from back in the 20's/30's of all the dead gangsters photos and newspaper front pages with pics of the bodies.

Used to be public hangings were popular, not sure why they've had to go private.

Guess aruba still hasn't changed as much as the US has on that sort of thing.

Actually might consider it more of our problem than theirs, think we've gotten  a little squeamish at facing reality.

Then again I guess there's as many definitions of respect around the world as there are cultures.

Evening Monkeys, just getting started reading.......any news to report?

Maybe they will photograph Saddam's hanging then

I've helped a lot of ladies with their computers over the years, seems they always just wanted to pay in case. Not real sure why.

One more suicide and another OD via cocaine on the beach in Aruba.  Other than that no news:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/BleachedBlackNY2007.jpg)

Was kinda wondering if it would public or not.

Carnut - I'm sure a video of it will turn up on the internet.

So who thinks that 2007 will be the year that Natalee's family gets their answers? I have to beleive this, anything else would not be fair.

Dad gum, brother brought over the requisite chocolate fudge for Christmas but apparently made it with some sort of sugar substitute and it tastes awful.

Guess he musta kinda figured that would be the case because he also brought some peanut butter fudge and it tastes great.

Thanks, I am trying to see where you are looking in Diario. Is the suicide the person on the beach with the 2 people looking at him?

Bleached

I love the stunning new hat Klaas made for you. It goes so well with your beautiful hairstyle.

OH Klaasend what A Happy Hat! Makes me want to party.....Oh that's the idea HUH? I am going to try and get it. Thank-you

You took the words right out of my mouth  :lol:

YIPPEEEEEEEEE

Gorgeous, dahling, just gorgeous.

Oh, yeah!  Aruba is a real example of "facing reality" huh?  I don't think so.  I think this is pure sensationalism, something of which they always accuse our own media.  I also think it is possibly a cultural thing and a lack of sensitivity and respect for any deceased body.  They claim their "culture" is not that different from our own and claim to have up-to-date Western values.  

More like morbid curiosity for it serves no purpose to display a corpse.

It might sell a few papers, however.  Same deal with their thinking it nothing much for Dompig to go on international TV and discuss digging up Natalee's corpse and moving it all about, reburying, relocating, etc.

This sort of fascination with the dead is not universally considered normal.  Yes, all Latin American newspapers show gruesome photos but I don't believe to this extent.  At least I never saw multi-page spreads featuring corpses there but guess I could have just missed them.

There seems to be even more callous treatment in Aruba than even in most countries that display these things.  At least it seems that way to me.  But I do not consider it anything like facing reality.  Some realities do not require that we face them to get the full impact.  I don't think showing the corpse of a suicide victim like that is usually done for instance because of consideration of the family and it is considered a private affair, not a matter of public concern.

Yes, to us it is gross and crude and atavistic but we have discovered many aspects of Aruban culture are just that despite their claims to the contrary.

.

Cocaine OD on beach headline:

Pasco mainta a haya mas cu 20 kilo di cocaina cerca eybanda... HOMBER HAYA MORTO NA BOCA ANDICURI DIAMARS MAINTA

Suicide of TeleAruba producer (she):

PRODUCTOR DI PROGRAMA NA TELEARUBA A COMETE SUICIDIO

A plain normal hat like mine didn't seem right.  Had to find something more whimsical for you  :lol:

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:

I thought I was reading here it was a dead woman? The PAP translator seems to say it was a man who "achieved dead".

pasco morning owing to achieve more cu 20 kilo of cocaina close eybanda... man achieve dead at mouth andicuri tuesday morning come across

Yes, MAN on the beach cocaine

Woman, TeleAruba producer suicide

Edited to add - both dead

Bleachedblack,

Klaas posted both articles in the Murder and Crime Thread, just in time for the 2006 grand total!   :?

See link below in my signature.

.

Both obviously arubacides.

Just passin' thru.  Hope you all had a very merry, I did.  Even though on vacation, still got a housefull but wanted to HI.
Got my cafepress order today - very nice - very pleased.

LOL  , you are right! Can't put a serious hat on funny hair.. :lol:   :lol:

Someone just pointed out something very interresting to me.  You always see dead bodies in the Aruban papers.  Why then would they cover the woman who committed suicide (TeleAruba producer) with a blanket?  Is it because she is Dutch?  How many bodies of dutch people have we seen?  I don't remember any.  Only Arubans or Columbians.  :shock:

Very Interesting indeed.

But they are not prejudiced over there... :roll:  :roll:

Wow....that womans suicide is very strange to me. I have never believed the
alleged story about LVR's father supposedly committing suicide by hanging himself.......it seems even less likely to me that a person.....a woman is going to hang themselves out on a porch or veranda? WTH?

And we thought aruba couldn't get any weirder.

The arubans aren't it's just the Dutch rulers that are.

Let us not forget that it is possible there to tie your hands behind your back and set yourself on fire in caves.

I'm glad you said this because I never believed it either.

Actually I was taken aback a bit when someone posted one of the 2K's myspace profiles and under languages it said he spoke pap and Afrikaans, not just Dutch but Afrikaans.

Jessica Fletcher could get Aruba straightened out in a heartbeat.  :wink:

Humm, so Jossy isn't a Jessica?

Welcome back, LEP.

:D

Talk about weird...remember this guy in the Caymen Islands  who supposedly commited suicide and was found hanging in a closet?.....only problem was the closet was shorter than he was ....he would have had to crouch down to stand in it? How do you hang yourself in something like that?  

http://tinyurl.com/sb2cf

I missed that one Carnut

I thought the only place Afrikaans was spoken was in South Africa.

http://www.curacaodrag.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=92

 Ready to go On Air: Do*****entary Drag Race Aruba-Curacao
Posted byadmin on Friday, September 09 @ 09:59:08 CDT
Contributed by bri


Brigitte Katelaan from Aruba has been making a do*****entary about the history of Drag Races on the island of Curaçao & Aruba.

This do*****entary is ready and is going ON AIR starting next week...
**DATE CHANGE**
 
[Message From Brigitte] Hello friends,

Yes, after a half year hard work, we did it!!
The do*****entary about drag racing Curacao and Aruba is ready!! We would like to thank all the racers for there cooperation and the media.
It will be broadcast by TeleAruba on the cable (Aruba) and on TDS channel 13 (Curacao) starting every TUESDAY at 9pm!!
Be there !!
-------------------

[Webmaster]
This is for sure a must-see 10 episode do*****entary, 1 HOUR each!!

Oh my gosh is this the woman who hung herself?

Elaine - yes

HHHHHHHHHMMMMMMMMMMMMM  now who do we know of that is involved with drag racing?

bleachedblack
Peeps, Max, Lorenzo (maybe)...who else?

Yup my thoughts too.

Wow!! She sure had a lot going for her too! I wonder if that article was posted this September? I went and looked at the site klaas posted, it doesn't give the year (that I saw) If it was this year than that was pretty recent, very sad.

This was 2006:

http://www.setar.aw/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=375&Itemid=69

(snipped)
E ganadornan cu no tabata presente den studionan di Telearuba pa e anochi final por pasa busca nan premio na Telearuba cerca Sra. Brigitte Katelaan. Nan lo ricibi un saco cu un regalito di Mayor League Baseball. E ganadora di e sorteo final di ‘Go to World Series 2006’ a resulta di ta Sra. Milagros Alarcon di Ponton cu ta un ganador cu a haci su compra na Valero.  Ela bai su cas cu e premio cu tabata un pasashi ida y vuelta pa World Series pa 2 persona, hotel, plus zakgeld. Pabien na tur e ganadornan!

This IS starting to seem shady!! This "suicide"

I bet she was Shango.

Stoned again.....

http://www.diario-aruba.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=297&pos=10

http://www.diario-aruba.com/gallery/albums/22december2006/carlosandcharlies/carlosandcharlies6.jpg

Shaniro Baldrik KELLY.  I wonder if this woman had footage of these people.

I agree....nobody is going to hang themselves ON THEIR FRONT PORCH!

Think that might be a subtle message to anyone?

Seems to be a lot of suicides taking place on these islands, especially Aruba.  Wonder why Aruba has such a high suicidal rate and such a low homicide rate?

Carnut behave!

You got me!  It's such a "happy island" and all you'ld think suicide would be rare, but it's not. Maybe the drugs take a toll?

LMAO! Some things will never change

Well, it might also just be a case of misclassifcation.

Depending on what image one is trying to protect some things might classified as one thing to protect the image, thus arubacides might be misclassified murders.

Carnut

(http://thedaisysistahs.forumup.us/images/smiles/oregonian_slap.gif)

You first have to eviscerate yourself, overdose and then tie yourself up and set yourself on fire, run to a cave where you can hide.

I wonder if Jerry, Steve Croes buddy or realitive really has down syndrome?  It is hard for me to tell, by looking at his pictures, although I usually can identify immediately. Let me say that I NEVER would make fun of anyone with a disability. Especially down syndrome, as my sister has it too! I just cannot even imagine them letting him go to bars to drink and stick his middle finger up at everyone if this is true! He also has myspace, he IS very intelligent if he does indeed have downs syndrome!Usually people with downs syndrome are very short in stature, they have short stubby fingers etc, as I say my sister has it.

Carnut wrote;


misclassified? ....as in don't know the difference between ?

Aruba Blows

Just my 2-cent worth but I believe this is why Lorenzo has great security.  I do not think he is the demon we have been told he is.  I think the people on the island do not like him and wanted to make him out to be the villain in this, hoping perhaps there would be some vigilante justice from Natalee's family and that he would take the fall for what the sporter has done.  I think Lorenzo is as afraid of these nut cases as any sane person could be.  I think Guido is our guy who is ruthless along with the K2, Surinamese and JVDS family.

No, as in misclassified on purpose to protect an islands reputation.

Lorenzo and one of the Arens, Arenz, Arendz, Arends people.  A boy named Max.

You left out burying yourself (twice).

I was told that either the Surinamese or the Columbians, the ones who are mean there and do the dirt for the others, and cannot remember which ethnicity or what, but either The Surinamese or the Columbians, kill dogs and throw them on your front porch so you get the message.  Maybe she had a dead dog on her porch last week, but was going to proceed with her story anyway and  :shock:

I beleieve, that if the truth comes out in this case, that Guido, as you say will show to be ruthless. We must remember he was the only one who was arrested and charged with suspicion of heavy battery. That has always bothered me, He DID something and does have SOME involvement in this case, regardless of what his tacky parents would have all beleive.

Guess that beats the 'black spot' on paper or a wrapped dead fish.

I think you may be making too much of the charges on Guido, I suspicion if the ALE or Pros had known as much about the case back when they charged the 3 amigos and Papa, that the charges would have been substantially the same.

NEWSFLASH   ---------   NEWSFLASH

Rumor Control reports that joran wants to be an actor


possible roles ????

im thinking EVIL PINOCCHIO

please enter your selection below

1.

2.

3.

4.

5.

thank you for your cooperation

Well, He had been questioned early on in this case, then he went to Holland in a hurry. Maybe it took the Ale and prosecution a lot of time to come up with more evidence(more people talking)....who knows BUT why arrest him at all then, and charge him with conspiracy to premeditated murder, and Heavy Battery etc?

Lorenzo and one of the Arens, Arenz, Arendz, Arends people.  A boy named Max.[/quote]


How about the member of Aruban LE who recently won a race in his division?

How about the law suit against the Aruban government in this country which resulted in the $19 Million Dollar judgment against the govt of Aruba for failure to provide the race track as agreed?

I don't think Lorenzo is involved in racing, only friends with those who are, don't think he actually drives car in race is what I mean.

How about Sandra van der Sloot, female racer in the EU.

.

Robots, you crack me up! :lol:  :lol:

GUIDO is involved up to his EYEBALLS


he is going down

hi elaine

good thing your not an egg  8)



well, i mean you are  a very good egg, but only in human sense  :wink:

perhaps

"i am a murderer"

autobiography by joran van der sloot




i hate him

"i am a selfish PIG"

written and composed by joran van der sloot


im so skeeeeeeeeeered of joe tacocrap that im going to sign this

robotico

that way he wont be able to sue me


hahhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


what an EVIL MAN you are TACO

Hey Monkeys,

Just stopping in to catch up.  I hope everyone had a Merry Christmas and that the New Year brings you good fortune and health.

Can anyone tell me how to post a picture.  I have several pictures of Jaycee Hardin that I want to post in the Crimes Against Children.

Klaas....I saw in the Lounge that there is an article regarding a drunk 2 month old....can we move this....if it is ok with Jacquline to the Crimes Against Children thread?  TIA.

JOE TACOPINA


youre kids must be really proud of you


NOT


robotico  :twisted:

hi crazy  8)

Yeah, maybe he will be the next one with an "almost book" entitled ...."If I did Kill her, how I would have done it"  I would NOT put it past him at all, he is crazy as hell

he is

and thats why momma sloot moved him away from the others

thats from a reliable source  :twisted:

Hello crazymom!! Happy New Years to you and your family!

Hello Monkeys!

I'm going back in a minute to catch up, but wanted to wave to you!

Speaking of babies, some woman in New Jersey went out to put trash in the dumpster today and found a newborn bay a couple of hours old only. They DO think that the baby will be ok, thank God!

ooops mean newborn baby not bay .....geesh

Hiya CBB!

 :lol:  :lol:

Klaasend, you have mail, when you can check it out.  

Hi, everyone...trying to catch up...behind a few pages.

Any word on Joran's book?  Has the deal been tanked?

last i heard, no one was interested in
"the latest tales of a MAD LIAR"

 8)

I just posted a picture in the CAC thread of Jaycee. Please help write letters and emails.  Her sisters are still in the home and they need to be brought to safety.

Thanks friends.

crazymom, I made a post in the lounge under the topic called testing trying to explain how to post a picture.

The author said he was going to give his vision of what might have happened to Natalee.  I'd like to see how creative he is.  I'm wondering if he'll blame Columbian drug dealers, some MB boy who was jealous of Joran, or if he'll go with the runaway theory.

He will never blame a Dutch person.  He will say someone (beach bum/drug dealer) came by when he left her on the beach raped and killed her and then took her body out to sea.  He will say she got killed because she fought back so he will try to explain the injuries that he did along with his friend Guido.

Calling Lala's, Shaniro has a "ring" to it.  (http://bestsmileys.com/hello/1.gif)

There are more forms of prejudice than just racial.  That is the most misogynistic place I have seen in recent times.  Oduber and Dompig are certainly prejudice as can be.  There is tremendous prejudice against American tourist and anything that happens to one they attribute to their own behavior as a form of prejudice.

The Arubans are even prejudice in favor of the Dutch.  I see prejudice in every segment of society there.

It was far more than the Dutch who demonstrated against Beth and more than the Dutch who show prejudice against not only Americans but females in general.

.

How about the member of Aruban LE who recently won a race in his division?

How about the law suit against the Aruban government in this country which resulted in the $19 Million Dollar judgment against the govt of Aruba for failure to provide the race track as agreed?

I don't think Lorenzo is involved in racing, only friends with those who are, don't think he actually drives car in race is what I mean.

How about Sandra van der Sloot, female racer in the EU.

.[/quote]

You know, Anna, I am glad you brought this up.  I had forgotten that name.

Dana is going to have Clint Van Zandt on tomorrow night.  So put your cell phones in their little monkey case next to your puters.  We know you have opinions, we know you have questions, we know you know how to talk on the phone.  So call him.  It's interesting to hear what people have to say and Dana's comments on it.  

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/cellphonemonkey.jpg)

I take it you are not much of a fan of my Murder and Crime Thread, Indy.   :( Aruba does NOT have a low homicide rate, it is in fact higher based on per capita than that of the U.S.

BOTH the murder rate and the suicide rate are very high.  


.

Regarding the pretty young woman's suicide....reminded me of something posted back in September regarding an altercation at Bahia.  This incident involved a drag racing team.   It may or may not be related, but because the post was from September & Klaasend posted an article from the same month I thought it might be good for discussion.

 :arrow: http://bb.visitaruba.com/showthread.php?p=57544#post57544

Thanks San! I am excited because I figured it out before you told me.  I think I am learning valuable tools on SM!! :lol:

Hi, monkeys.  I see you, CBB, 2NJMom, Crazy and Li'L Puma.  Good to have you here.  Any news on Peaches or Sunfreak?  Justinmama, is Momma ok?

Anna, if we could just get that Diario article translated, because there is something in it about Curaco, if I can read correctly.  I wonder why the Dutch boys have not translated it over at the other site.

I wonder if Telaruba has ties to Setar, the internet service provider as in Internet Cafe.

I don't think females hang themselves as it is painful and ugly and most are more vain than that.  There is also the matter of the evacuation of bladder and bowel content which is an unpleasant consideration most females wish to avoid, particularly on their front porch.  She would certainly have to be very distraught.

.

Anna, had you seen this before?

http://www.shadowscope.com/archives/2005/06/crime_in_aruba.php

Yes but I had forgotten about it.

Wish we had done an Arubacide Thread as well as M&C one.

.

Well, maybe my avatars are problematic...will check in tomorrow to revisit this.   :lol:  :)  

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

On Monday Sept. 3rd 2006 I and my partner with 3 ladies were there and I was beaten by the bouncer and 5 other patrons who were hitting on the 3 girls and did not like it. I asked one of the patrons to stop hitting on the girls for they like girls not boys. To my suprise I was attacked by the patrons and a bouncer. The patrons kicked my feet out from under me and proceeded to kick me to the ground were they and the bouncer kicked the left side of my body braking 3 ribs and fracturing my left shoulder. I need help locating the patrons. They are supposed to be from the Island of Curisel with a drag racing team and frequent the island of Aruba often.


To my knowledge the police have arrested the bouncer but can not locate the other perpetrators. If any one has any information about this please let me know or call the Aruba Police.

Thanks
I would also like to know of an attorny so I can sue the all parties involved.

Actually, it is a black hand print and not a spot.  I have often suggested that Dirty Hand was in fact the mafia presence but did not strike a chord with any fans of Shango.  The Black Hand is what one branch of the Sicilian mafia has always been called.  Get it, Black Hand/DirtyHand but evidently it does not meet some Shango criteria or other.

.

Yeah, my black spot harkens back to the Pirates and Long John Silver.

Hi everyone!

O/T
I do hope everyone had a wonderful, relaxing and festive Christmas. I spent mine with family and enjoying everyones company and overly induldging myself with all the fantastic food. LOL

I learned my brother has several blocked arteries and will possibly need an angioplasty to unblock them. The doctors want to try a new medication in hopes it will help before doing any kinds of surgery. Please keep my brother in your prayers all will be ok. He is only 50 yrs old. My father past away at age 44 yrs. with 85% blockage to the main artery of his heart and had what they called a widows maker. One heart attack and it took his life early. We don't want the same thing to happen to my brother.



I read about the womens suicide and it seems very fishy to me. Most women do not hang themselves in a suicide. They usually OD on drugs, slit their rist or sit in a car running in a garage.

It is so odd how so many suicides are in Aruba. Or claimed suicides. I guess it's how they keep their murder rate down on that Unhappy Island.

Oh, Anna, I always thought Dirty Hand, Rudy Croes, who has heavy Mafia involvement according to TNS.

Organized crime has been a part of Aruba for a very long time and will probably continue for years and years to come. It's the way of the island. The money is more important than the lives of the people who live there. Satan has a strong hold on that corrupt island and God will condem them all.

Oh, speaking of black spot cards, here's mine.

(http://carnut.org/bio/spade1.jpg)

(http://carnut.org/bio/spade2.jpg)

Pirates?


(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/thth0e9d8421.png)

Where is Carpe?

More like Robert Lewis Stevenson.

He's been posting on the front page.  I don't know why he's not posting in the forum.

Well, I adore Robert Louis Stephenson, too, and gave all three of my children A Child's Garden of Verses.  Such phrases as "long ago and far away" have always had special meaning for me since I was a child.

That would be just too much, those looks with Stephenson's command of language.   :D

Been thinking that aruba is just a modern day Pirates haven.

Anna your little doll in her New Years gown and confetti is adorable.   :D

Thanks, DK, only wish I had the real Christmas stuff all put away in real life.

.

Gee, Carnut, does that mean I have to stop volunteer at the VA Hospt??? :lol:  :lol:   Neat card.

Hanging oneself it a pretty terrible, dramatic way to go, I agree.

I don't usually take my Christmas tree and decor down until the day after New Years.

I'm hoping Beth and Dave can get the case taken to the International Court of Justice and have another investigative team go in. Perhaps Scottland Yard or another European team or FBI. One of their choice.

It may be too late to find evidence but it's never to late to find out the truth and bring those responsible to justice who rightly deserve it.

I guess we all have to do something to make it all work.  Well, I miss Carpe, but if he is happy on the Front Page, then I will acquiesce to his need to be "front page" news.

DKpen - could you make your picture in your signature line a little smaller please?  It's huge, lol  :lol:

Maybe he's forgotten his password to the forum, lol  :lol:   Or maybe he feels more comfortable on the front page? I miss him posting in here too.

Well, I ran across Puma's request and didn't realize she already had her avatar. When I started, she still had her cat with Santa Hat!  :lol: I couldn't do anything with the pics she poated, so I tried with this one. I had trouble getting it to turn out, but wanted her to know I tried!


(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/catdnc.gif)

Well, it's slow tonight.  I saw CBB but I expect she is tired.  She spun around so much yesterday, that she was probably dizzy.

TCU Mom stayed up late with us, but I so enjoyed her presence.

Justinsmama must be taking care of her mama.

None has been nowhere near today.

Carpe has gone over to the front page.

Peaches is getting chemotherapy.

Bleached is probably getting her hair ready for New Year's.

Anna and I have been in and out all day.

San is probably taking care of her doggy and minding the ornaments.

SunnyinTX must be sunning elsewhere.

AZSunny was here earier I think but left.

2nJmom has to get all that toilet tissue rolled up before 2007.

AZLady and Yappperz are cruising.

I miss Mrs. Red and hope that her family situation is much better and her father is in better health and spirits.  Sad news near Christmas.

SB has not shown up today.  I hope he and his family are working things out.

Whatever happened to the rest of the monkeys, has happened to the best of me.

Hi Tyler! I was struggling with a cat!  :lol:

TOMORROW - I'm going to be gone in the morning and won't be home until noon or so.  Kindof depends......we are going to one of the local Indian casinos  :lol:  :lol:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/Slot.gif)

A kitty out of control, now who could that be? I think it would be cute for anyone.

Klaas, there's a reservation not too far from me, and Mom LOVED to go play Bingo there! She even organized charter bus trips there! It's in Cherokee, near Gatlinburg.
Have a great time!

Klaas, have fun and win lots of money, but not so much so that you take off and leave us.  We wub you and want you to be rich, but rich with us.

Uh, if you get rich, take Papiamento lessons, or maybe not.   :lol:

Thanks, we will!   :lol:  This is a Harrah's although it's on indian land.  It's a nice one and only about an hour away.  We haven't been anywhere in months so it will be fun!

Speaking of "cat", has she/he been around today? Cat seemed to take the news of Ford's passing pretty hard.

I told Red and Tom that if I win big I'll email them a picture from my cellphone  :lol:

No, she hasn't been around today.

If you win big, I want that pic on the front page! You know how to obscure your face, I'm sure!  :wink:

How's Mrs. Red? Like Tyler, I miss her.

Last I heard she was fine but her dad wasn't doing well.  I'm sure she's probably visiting with him now.  I haven't heard from her in a few days.

Yeah, money shouldn't change anything, I know if I was rich, I'd still be here posting away exactly as I am now, perhaps with a few blondes around the house for house keeping.

It's a hard time for her, and I keep her in my thoughts and prayers. When you do get a chance, please send her our love!  :wink:

I've got an early day tomorrow, and should turn in. Night Tyler, and Klaas, and Carnut!

Have a peaceful sleep all, and Klaas, I'm keeping my fingers crossed you walk out of Harrah's with a boat load!!!

Tyler, I'll see you tomorrow!  :lol:  :D

Hold the fort, Carnut!  :wink:

Let's see if this made it smaller.

Yep, that worked.


1am here. Going to head to bed myself.  Please keep my brother in your prayers everyone. TIA

God bless~

Nite dkpen - I'll keep your brother in my prayers.

Thanks for making your sigline smaller.

yep

LOADSVILLE  8)

Goodnight, All!


.

gnight mate  8)  :lol:

Tylergal,

You forgot me. I'm here every day and read almost everything. I love your posts.

Louise

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/RobotsNY2007.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/RobotsNY2007.gif

Robots - I thought you'ld like to get in the New Years mood  :lol:

Time for me to call it a night as well!

GOODNIGHT ALL!

tanks
yep, i like it  8)

It was not that Adam ate the apple for the apple's sake, but because it was forbidden. It would have been better for us--oh infinitely better for us--if the serpent had been forbidden.
- Mark Twain's Notebook



 8)

If the man doesn't believe as we do, we say he is a crank, and that settles it. It mean, it does nowadays, because now we can't burn him.
- Following the Equator





 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Hi Monkeys, I've been lurking but sort of out of the loop; not spending much time on the computer.

Below is part of a post I just did on the Murder & Crime thread.

hi msmarple  8)

Hi robots - got your days and nights upside down too?

I do so agree with Mark Twain and your sig line.

yea, i like twain a lot  8)



yea, upside down

i work some nights now and then

and after that my sleep schedule gets turned around like a tornado on caffeine

i kind of like it... its a nice feeling
in a way  :lol:

When I am king, they shall not have bread and shelter only, but also teachings out of books, for a full belly is little worth where the mind is starved.
- The Prince and the Pauper


twain is so damn funny at times  8)

I have his complete works in a single volume, and have read it several times from cover to cover. A delicious dry wit, and an artistic writer.

yepper

i get a kick out of him  8)

How are you my pretty friend?  I had thought you might be out celebrating the holidays.  You look lovely and just perfect for a celebration.

"After all these years, I see that I was mistaken about Eve in the beginning; it is better to live outside the Garden with her than inside it without her." -- Adam's Diary by Mark Twain.

Murder & Crime thread - 7002 as of 4:58 a.m. 12/28/2006.

Klaas - What exactly constitutes a "View" ???

Wondering if this will be listed as another sucide and if the person in the 2nd article is the same person

Aruba
Dead man on range Andicuri
Subscriber Article
ORANJESTAD - on the range of Andicuri on second kerstdag the inanimate body was found of the person whose birthday it isperson whose birthday it is person whose birthday it is Carlos Arturo Moreno.
27 Dec, 2006, 17.15 (GMT -04:00)
www.amigeo.com

COAST GUARD INTERCEPT OF ONE TON OF COCAINE LEADS TO FEDERAL DRUG CHARGES AGAINST FOUR INDIVIDUALS
       R. Alexander Acosta, United States Attorney for the Southern District of Florida, Rear Admiral D. Brian Peterman, Commander 7th Coast Guard District, Jesus Torres, Special Agent in Charge, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), Jonathan I. Solomon, Special Agent in Charge, Federal Bureau of Investigation, and Mark R. Trouville, Special Agent in Charge, Drug Enforcement Administration, announced today that defendants, Abel Pardo Salguedo, Alberto Cortes, Dionisio Velez Tarquino, and Carlos Arturo Moreno, were charged by criminal complaint with possession and conspiracy to possess with the intent to distribute five or more kilograms of cocaine, in violation of Title 46, United States Code Appendix, Section 1903(a) and (j).  If convicted on these charges, the defendants face a mandatory minimum sentence of ten (10) years’ imprisonment and a maximum of life.

http://miami.fbi.gov/dojpressrel/pressrel06/mm02162006.htm

He is in my thoughts and prayers, dkpen. My father passed at age 44 years also. Advanced heart disease. Hope the meds fix your brother's condition.



It is bizarre for a woman to hang herself. Woman usually do not use that type of plan. They most often overdose.

Wonder if the lady who hanged herself might have worked or be working for DeVries?

Good morning monkeys. I was just reading an article that backs up what everyone is saying about women and suicide.

Women attempt suicide three times more than men. Yet, men kill themselves three times more than women, in part, because they use more violent means of killing themselves (women tend to use overdoses with pills while men tend to either shoot or hang themselves) and men are generally less connected to others than are women. Disconnection from others increases the risk of completed suicides.

http://www.doctorhugo.org/brain4.html

Diario
http://www.diarioaruba.com/
Amigoe
http://www.amigoe.com/english/
BonDia
http://www.cspnv.com/
Solo di Pueblo
http://www.solodipueblo.com/
AweMainta
http://www.awemainta.com/
Aruba Today
http://www.arubatoday.com/
Translator:
http://papiamentu.donamaro.nl

Good question.

Good morning!  

Company is leaving today.  Chemo was yesterday.  Thanks for remembering.  Feeling pretty good today.  Nice to see y'all.  Working and lurking and trying to shovel off my desk..........

Glad to see you here ~ hope everything went well yesterday.  We've been thinking about you.

Peaches,it is good to see you back.I did take my fellow Eagle,Jerry Ford's death hard.He was a great man,CBB.Are you the DancingBorg I saw at Cherokee.I was the one Dancing with a bear.I have gone it that area many times,I was born in that area.   The woman did not hang herself,from those pictures.cat

Re: The woman who committed suicide.  It reminds me of a personal experience.
About 5 years ago, I was having a phone conversation with my sister-in-law/lifelong friend and asked her about a woman we both know.  This mutual friend was saddened by the death of another friend who had been found hanged in her garage by her husband.  The husband had rushed her to the hospital where she was pronounced dead.  This woman, who had died, had no history of depression but her husband had told the hospital staff that there had been problems in the marriage.
My SIL and I got into an argument, during that phone call, when I insisted that it sounded very odd and suggested that it might be murder instead of suicide. After the call ended, I reseached females committing suicide on the internet and saw that most women do not choose a violent ending.
Months later, I was listening to the car radio, and the news came on that the husband had been arrested for murder of the "suicidal" wife and the hospital was on to him after viewing the bruises on the woman's body.  He thought he had fooled the doctors when he explained that her body had hit the garage floor when he tried to cut her down.
He had beaten her up, after she asked for a divorce, and hanged her body in the garage.  He is in prison now.
I wish I could remember the name or find a link.

Found it!
Montreal jury convicts man who claimed wife hanged herself
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2005/03/04/montreal-050304.html

Click link for a picture of the woman, whose husband beat her to death and then told hospital staff and the police that she had committed suicide because of her "poor self image".
http://www.members.shaw.ca/remembertanya/

I believe a view is any time someone clicks on that thread and it opens up.

Goodmorning all - here for just a little bit this morning.

I guess you didn't notice my tongue lodged firmly in my cheek with this post.

Me too, dk, that's the official time to take down Christmas decorations.  It's a rule.   :)

Thanks Terri.  If it is the same person, I wonder why he was in Aruba and not in jail.  I can't pull up that first link, but it could be an Arubacide for Anna and Ms.Marple.

Morning Monkeys all.  Is anyone here today or did everyone go back to work?

Thank you, CBB.  I actually like this one, but she's moving a little fast; like someone wants to give her a bath or a pill or something.   :lol:

This is so sad, such a beautiful woman.  I think the abusive husband might have wanted to give her a poor self image, sounds like he is projecting his wishes onto the situation.   :evil:

Glad the hospital was not fooled and was on the alert.  And I do hope you pointed all this out to the SIL, not to be a know-it-all at all but because so many people take things at face value and do not question even when they should.

How in the world hanging would be worked into this with someone even IF they were concerned with their self image is just ludicrous.  

Women are more sensitive to pain than men despite rumors to the contrary linked to childbearing, etc. and few of us are willing to suffer greatly if we can accomplish the same results without the pain.  Guess this is why we do not participate in contact sports even with other females.
 
And I know from rearing three boys that they are nowhere near as sensitive to pain as I am or ever have been.  What they think is funny hurts me like heck!  Seemed to start around puberty with them for I found I could no longer even pitch ball to them or interact physically in any way because they were naturally just too rough and didn't get that it did in fact cause me pain when they would play like that.

Also women tend to not like disfiguration or being made ugly or nasty as would happen with hanging and evacuation of bodily functions.

Certainly no young attractive women I know would do this no matter how depressed, they would find alternative method not so gruesome.

As for working for deVries, if she was, this would really, really bring the heat on One UnHappy Island.  Normally, I would say no way would they do anything so overt and stupid but this is Aruba so all norms are off.


.

People struggle and void when they hang.Look at the pictures and there is no sign.Her hands were not bound,so as she became desperate,she would have clawed at her clothes,shoes were still on,etc.It was a murder.I'm back,so to speak.We call our casinos,the revenge of the natives.My Kate has been a wild beast today,and my mate is getting better.I haVE been cursed in several languages today.If you want to learn Papimiento,Georgtown Univ.Has the books andtapes/disks.The SOJ is famous for collections in this area.CAT

She was beautiful!
The hospital staff and Montreal police are the heros in this story;   this man thought he had convinced everyone that Tanya had hanged herself so he let his guard down and the police watched him and checked out his lie about coming home and finding her.  His alibi and explanations didn't check out and after the funeral, he did not act like a grieving husband.
The hospital had no doubt that she had been beaten to death but acted as if they believed him.
I have a theory that more women commit suicide by drug overdose because doctors prescribe them to women on demand and not-so-much to men.   I also have a theory that most women know that being the instigator of ending a relationship can cause violence (too many incidents come to mind) so they will stay and act badly so the man will break up with them.

I really hate that about your beautiful friend.  Her husband sounds like a relative of Scott Peterson, creeps.

That is what hospital employees are supposed to do.  Listen to the story and not talk, just listen and then report findings to police.  If employee interjects or asks questions, it is obvious that they are "taking mental notes."  Therefore, perpetrator does not talk and as you see ,the more they talk, the worse off things get for them, i.e., Scott Peterson & The Sporter.

My husband had a female relative commit suicide.  She had terminal cancer, very pretty lady.  She had undergone bone marrow transplants and had been to various very reputable facilities and was told there was no hope.  She discussed suicide with her minister a few days before she died, but it was in the context of a friend, not herself.  She shot herself.

I had a friend who also shot herself.  She was a very pretty lady with children with a terminal illness.  She cleaned her house very well, but she always did but this day she not only cleaned the house but baked several meals that she placed in the freezer, that would be easily heated and served, paid all the bills and drove to an isolated area and killed herself while the children were in school.  

However, most women attempt or commit suicide by overdoses.  Many are also cutters and sometimes succeed.  We did know a lady who asphyxiated herself in her car.  One of her 4-year-old twin sons slipped out and drowned in a nearby pool while she was caring for her three-week-old infant.  Given the postpartum depression and loss of a child, that suicide was not shocking.

Cat is right in that bodily waste is expelled during hanging, involuntary loss of bowel and bladder, coupled with signs of a struggle, such as marks to her own flesh from her fingernails, etc.  Even when someone wants to die, when the subconscious takes over, it tries to save itself.

Also it is easy to determine if injuries were inflicted before or after death as a bruise requires circulating blood to form.  Husband = NOT

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/thth40b9b5bc.gif)

.

I have to write quick,the sun beams are calling.I have seen a hanging and they are ugly scenes.Thank you Klass for the info.Hey CBB,a little less caffiene,or more synthetic oil would be in order.It is nice to see all up and at em,I am sorrrry,nap time and the bionic spouse is calling.I have found out a lot about women lately,like it ain't easy to shave legs,especially when they are moving.CAT

I guess you didn't notice my tongue lodged firmly in my cheek with this post.[/quote]


THANKS, INDY,

No, I didn't and am not always quick to catch that sort of thing and tend to take things literally, sorry!   :oops:

And I certainly agree that Aruba is very eager to rule something a suicide.  I guess they think that lets them off the hook and they can
blame the victim, never thinking far enough ahead to realize folks just might wonder why some would rather kill themselves than live there.

I think suicide is just as big a deterrent to tourism as murder in many ways and do wish we had an Arubacide Thread.

I think I will just start to casually collect these incidents for later just in case we muster the oomph to start one.

.

TERRY

I don't know if that is the same Carlos Arturo Moreno or not nor do I know how to find out.

You may recall the very odd thing of three witnesses all being named Carlos Ramos.  I always wondered if that was yet another of their little jokes on us.  Very strange.

Also I do not know if this is the recent body that washed ashore.  There are just so many it is difficult to get any details on one before another one appears.

Off to work. . . . . .

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

I think we have this recent OD's date of birth. Maybe somewhere in our Dept. of Justice, we have the convicted guy's DOB.

I think the Amigoe article is trying to say that the deceased's DOB was 12/27, and that apparently is the day he died ... although of course I may be mistaken.



Meanwhile, the case of the guy with the same name, arrested on cocaine transporting et al, I think in February 2006 - is in the jurisdiction of the United States Attorney's Office, Southern District of Florida.

Maybe one of our Florida folks can check it out? I couldn't get anywhere on the Internet with it (not sure where to look), but there should be a public record of the case and its status. It might not have gone to trial yet. I doubt that bail would be an option in a case like this (or with a suspect who is flight risk).

If not the same person, could be the same family - and this Arubacide might be something the US Attorney's Office would be interested in knowing.

I suspect, though, that "Carlos Arturo Moreno" is a fairly common name in Central and South America.

MsMarple,
It would seem that it is a far more common name combination than it would appear at first.  There are literally dozens, many of whom are relatively famous.  One Carlos Arturo Moreno is a labor leader, another a renowned physician and still another a famous Hispanic entrepreneur.

I have encountered other names like the Carlos Ramos of all three witnesses that are used similarly.  Ricardo Bustemante is yet another that is a bit overused as well, lots of them evidently.

So I would guess that these are two different individuals despite having the same name.

.

It could however be the same person. I hope we can find out. The thing that makes me beleive they are one and the same is the link to cocaine....the one being mentioned as being convicted of trying  to sell cocain and possesion of more than 5 kilos. Then this guy (with the same name) od s on cocaine . Perhaps he was out on bail. Aruba is known to be a transport stop over. He knew too many connections in Aruba, that he could "take down" in court, so they did him in. Someone in Aruba probably gave him a "hotshot"....which is his cocaine being tainted with battery acid or some other lethal ingredient. Pow, another one bites the dust!

Sorry if I sound cynical about this Carlos thing. It is just that on one happy island, I do not trust that anything that happens is normal.

This is my view of things....18 months ago, Aruba said they had "no murders" on their island....In Aruba's mind this is true, as ALE does not report certain deaths as murders, ALE does not report all assaults, rapes....It's not on paper.

Carlos in Fla was looking at 10 years in jail...it could very well be that he was the man that OD'd on Aruba...In the past 18 months, there have been a few men that have "OD'd" on the beaches....

As for Brigitte, IMO...it is an obvious murder...She was a reporter from Curacao living in Santa Cruz, Aruba doing documentaries about prostitution & the International Raceway...is quite a popular "draw"...
Happy, healthy women just don't hang themselves outside their home to be "seen" like that....What did she find out in her investigations?

[/b]good afternoon monkeys ! i am just reading and lurking.

This is what I was wondering.  This girl has information she uncovered and they didn't want to take the risk of her letting what she knows made public.

If I was going to commit suicide it sure wouldn't be for the public to view.  This was an outright murder.

Reminds me of the actress recently murdered in her NY apartment.  They found her hanging in the shower.  They knew she didn't commit suicide and arrested a contstruction worker who was working on another floor.  He tried to make it look like a suicide.

Monkeys, I just saw something that bothered me.

I have the TV on the background, and a commercial came on for some site called "Yo Mama." It advertised a number you can call to get signed up for yomama jokes. The example they used was, "Yo mama is so stupid she brought a spoon to the Super Bowl."

They're advertising a site that's designed to insult people's moms?  :?

Anna,I was going to say something,but CRS hit me.I notice the ad for aruba,a place for the depressed to find peace.Cat

oh and klass and others,the coffee mug looked and worked well.It was great with my cream,and the 2 legs black, hot suff.Time for a nap,the 2 leggers are watching football,again.Cat

Aruba's Stiching International Raceway
Where Brigitte had just done a documentary
Between Savaneta and the Guaririki Caves
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b223/NYSusan/MapArubaSouth22-2.jpg)

Found this on our State Department site, probably all old news, but just in case:

ARUBA    
Date of Death Place of Death Cause of Death
July 6, 2003 SEROE COLORADO, ARUBA Other Accident
July 12, 2004 ARUBA Drowning
July 12, 2004 ARUBA Drowning
January 26, 2005 ORANJESTAD, ARUBA Other Accident
February 8, 2005 HORACIO ODUBER HOSPITAL, ARUBA Drowning
March 12, 2005 WYNDHAM ARUBA BEACH RESORT, ARUBA Drug-Related
June 8, 2006 HORACIO ODUBER HOSPITAL, PALM BEACH, ARUBA Veh. Accid.-Aut

These are all American citizens who died while in Aruba.  Safest place to vacation, huh?

You see, this is a good example of how a man who has commited murder and tries to pass it off as suicide will select a method by which a man would take his own life (unless he was knowledgable about the gender differences).

MOM IS OUT OF ICU! WOOHOO!!!

That's great news Justins.

O/T - NORTH CAROLINA STATE BAR FILES ETHICS COMPLAINT AGAINST DUKE RAPE CASE PROSECUTOR MIKE NIFONG

**Watch FOX News Channel or go to http://foxnews.com for more

Woo Hoo!!!!!!!!!

This is wonderful news!!!  I would bet she's a much happier camper now.


HELLO to all you magnificent Monkeys.  I hope all our Monkeys had wonderful holidays.  

I came home from Christmas to find a blown monitor on my computer.  Good reason to get bigger & better but, it took me until today to get a new one.  Meanwhile I was having Internet withdrawals again.  Arrrrggghhhhh!!!!!   :lol:  :lol:

I see where there was yet another mysterious death or 2 on Aruba.  They need to change their slogan to "One Deadly Island."   :roll:

I'm catching up, but wanted to add to Tyler's comments that, at least in this area, when there is a "suicide by gunshot" committed by a female, there is an automatic criminal investigation. Women choose that method of suicide so rarely that it is assumed homicide, until disproven.

Hi Monkeys!

OK, I'm lost. Less caffeine??

Gotcha................LOL! I can slow her down when I get home. Actually, I've learned something with that one. When one layer is animated, the other shouldn't be..........  :shock:

THANKS, INDY,

No, I didn't and am not always quick to catch that sort of thing and tend to take things literally, sorry!   :oops:

I think suicide is just as big a deterrent to tourism as murder in many ways and do wish we had an Arubacide Thread.

.[/quote]
My faulty actually, I should have inserted a bunch of winky-smiley faces. I've only been posting in the forum for a couple of months so not everyone gets my sarcasm yet.  :lol:
It is interesting though that every unnatural death on Hell's Island is immediately labeled a suicide.

Good Evenving Monkeys,
Just kinda checking to see what is new... & try out the new look Klaasend did for Me..
 :wink:
justinsmama
So glad that your Mom is out of ICU....

Hi Monks... Happy Holidays.. and Happy New Year to You All!  :D

Hi Rob...
thought I'd broke the board  :lol:
Hope you had a Happy Holiday Season...

CBB,  I admire your courage to even try playing around with these avatars.  :wink:  I certainly am not pc savy enough to even try it.
I love the cat, even if she does look like she's been into the caffeine!

My Old Friend...How ya been Old Fart? Nice to see you again...

If the board is broke.. blame me... LMAO!!!

Hi Sunfreak

Good to see you.  I got a new flat panel monitor for Christmas.  I'm still getting used to it as it is much bigger than my old p.o.s. that I had before.

Me.. same oldFart  more or less.
I love my family (what I have left of it) but at sometimes they can be  um...ah...um  too much..
Hope things have been good for you.

OF

Thats a great avatar you have for the New Year

Old Fart, Im always thinking about my ole friends at SM this time of year...

When we lose loved ones, it makes life hard.. but its part of God's plan...and the ones that are still around drive us nuts... :D

I hope you had a great holiday season also.. and all the monks..

I see some have been having some difficult times...my thoughts and prayers are with all of you going through tuff times...

Peaches hang in there....

Happy Hannuka

 Ms.D.  
Yes I think Klaasend did a great job... given what she had to work with (me)

Thank you Muffy.. my fav bee...

And Merry Christmas and Happy New year to you too... :)

OK, she's crashing.......... :lol:

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/catdnc1.gif)

Whoops.  I meant Hannukah

me knows what you meant... and I thank you. LOL

cbb I love your Betty Boop.  My MIL used to work for Max Fleischer, who did the Betty Boop cartoons.  Her name was Betty too, and she was an artist

Rob
Not sure if it is the artist's Name, or more the tone of the music but  your  avatrar pops into mind when I hear this midi...
http://www.cool-midi.com/midi/r/rob_thomas-this_is_how_a_heart_breaks.mid

Take care..

If you'd like a New Year's avatar, you're welcome to the dancing cat, high on caffeine or crashing!  :wink:

There are also some to choose from in the Monkey Lounge; "New Year Avatars Here".
Let me know if I can help.  :wink:

It was required that an autopsy be performed on my sister because she was alone when she died of apparent natural causes.  No signs of foul play at all but an autopsy was required simply because her death was not attended by anyone else.

We tend to take a lot of things for granted I think.  But I don't understand why a couple of the Arubans posting on the Front Page seem to think our concern is disrespectful and an invasion of privacy.

Disrespectful is gawking at remains as evidenced by the photos in their many newspapers.  And given our experience with ALE and suicides such as Pittbull, I can only hope we would at least question these very strange circumstances and not must meekly accept what we are told as Arubans tend to do when dealing with not only their LE but their judiciary as well.

Concern is not disrespectful and neither is wanting to know the truth and make sure this was by this young woman's own hand as it is not a common method for taking one's own life for females.  Her doing so on her front porch might indicate that she did not want privacy but just the opposite, IF in fact it should be a suicide and seems it would be more of a kindness to find out why.  More so than disrespect or an "attack" as one called it.

Guess these are more of those cultural differences but I do think Arubans might benefit from questioning a few of the things they are told by their so-called officials themselves.  What do you call that, trust but verify?

Too often by the time the red flags are seen, it's too late and usually if you think something is amiss, the first impression is often the correct one.  

There is something very wrong with this death.  I don't know what it is but something does not add up.  Not a feeling but a fact.

.

.

Hmmm, Old Fart your link wasnt linkable...LOL...

Merry Christmas Anna and CBB.. :)

Thank you Muffy! I'm just learning, but that one was inspired by OF, and Dihanna had links to still images of Betty! I have a much harder time beginning with animations.........but I think I just learned something. I've got to run it by Klaas. She's a GREAT teacher!

And Happy New Year to you!  :wink:  :D

Thank you, Rob!

Wishing You a Very Happy New Year, Too!   :D

We are saddened and mystified by the reported suicide of a very young attractive TV producer in Aruba today.   :(

And just awaiting the court cases in California but no, we haven't solved anything.  

-------



Mrs. Darth, I put lots of avatars in the Lounge in the Testing Thread as well.  You might like one of them and CBB would maybe add some streamers or festivities.

oldfart - you look great! I think Klaas did you proud!  :D

 :oops:  :shock:  :?
When I click on it... it says it can't open ... but about 15 sec. later my windows media player start playing it  :?  :shock:  :lol:  :lol:

I'm working and will check back in with you guys shortly!  :wink:

Old Fart,
Almost time for Auld Lang Syne music, a song I dearly love but that never fails to make me cry!   :D

Also makes me feel a hundred years old thinking back through all the New Years past.

.

yeah Anna.. life is so strange.. and young woman is dead...A life gone so young...every life is so precious...and so unique.

That poor woman is unfortunately dead...when I saw that yesterday morning, I said a prayer. Suicide or Arubacide is never pretty. After all this time, I am never at a loss as to what Aruba really is.

Sometimes...it really is a suicide. Suicide is the leading cause of un-natural deaths on the island and not everyone is happy. I admit hanging is strange for a woman, and this woman seemed to be an investigative reporter... God Rest Her Soul. Aruba has a suicide prevention program and a suicide prevention month to raise awareness.

Anna
I'm not going to post a link to any Song that makes you feel 100 years old :shock:   Makes ya cry.... maybe. :wink:

<=== lurvz Auld Lang Syne.  :D

Anna
I'v been meaning to tell you  ... that silver gown is a knock out ...

So, are we going to have an Arubacide thread?

Anna - What OF said - it looks like you're catching all those stars falling on Alabama!

Hi Rob. Go read our Murder & Crime thread (see my sig line), only start at the beginning. Verrrry interesting. Nice to see you.

CBB or klaas - it's a little late in the game, but I wouldn't mind having either a fizzing champagne bottle or couple of glasses thereof, OR some mild fireworks behind my poinsettia. (Nothing spastic, though!) I tried to do this in Paint but got absolutley nowhere. No biggie; poinsettia is ALWAYS fine as is.

Thank you Tyler Gal...

I ve been keeping up on everything going on.

And its nice to see and speak to you again.

I have a question for you. Who do you think killed Natalee?

Can someone tell me please if tonight is Dana's show with Clint van Zandt? TY

Oh.. Jeezz.. I see what looks like Tylergals Roses and it was MsMarple.. So Sorry .. me sooo stupid...LOL...

I must need glasses or new eyes... :D

BT
Future Shows
29 December:
The Dana Pretzer Show - December 29th, 2006 Special Guest Clint Van Zandt (9:00 pm)

Is what I found ??? :?

Maybe JUST a bigger Monitor ...?

Been back from the casino for a while...NOPE, we didn't win but had fun anyway.

msmarple - you can use this one if you want:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/msmarple2007.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/msmarple2007.gif

Tomorrow night :wink:

I got BT's missing laptop... Merry Christmas BT and Klassend.

You mean they quit calling them bitches and hoes and quit selling anything to insult southerners and blonds. :wink:

Happy Holidays to you too Rob.  
 :wink:

Good find, Appeals.  I wonder how much money each one had on them at the time of their respective deaths.

I can't remember ~ has Clint mentioned lately the chat he had with Deepook in the internet joint?  If he hasn't, I think *someone* or *anyone* should ask him about it.....it's been months since we hashed over that  :? .

Also, maybe we should ask him if he thinks the furniture movers should be questioned ~ just his opinion, of course  :wink: .

I was asking about you.  I am glad that it was only a blown monitor.  I was afraid you were back in the hospital.

BT's new LapTop missing  :shock:  :shock:
I told her to put Monkey Decals all over it.... Even If it did have finger (paw / digit) print security  :roll:

Right back at you.  Take any ovens apart recently. :lol:

They might be posting that, Anna, for the same reasons that any good Russian would not question it, because they were threatened if they did not.  I am sure the Aruban government is into as bad or worse than our old KGB friend, but they lack the means to blow us up for questioning them.

Happy Holidays, Rob. Nope, you didn't get my missing laptop, cause UPS found it on the shelf in their office where it had been sitting for days.  :lol:

Merry Christmas Tylergal.

Just so you all know.. the deaths on 7-12-2005 were drownings over at the beach neat KIA.. I know because I got to Aruba the next day.. It was a guy and his son that tried to save another son that got caught in the under-tow. The son survived and the father and other son died. That beach should have a no swimming sign, it ripped the bathing suit right off of me. I have seen others over there almost killed.

Some of the other deaths really are just unfortunate circumstances, and I could get all the info if you want me to.

Finally, not sure, but do think Guido, Paulus and Joran involved at different times.

BT are you sure.. this one came in a box that said.. Love Simon... :D  :D  :D

I thank ya'll for everything.I have learned alot.we have gone a replacement of a hip,then i will work on jnees and ankles.Then I will go for a walk in the woods.i find a place like aruba dispicable...I will not ever say any thing good about,until the vermin are eliminated.What next,Putin in charge of ethics. I spent a few nights in the woods With Ford,a long time ago.You to know someone then   Cat

OMG... I was just thinking about Reggie the other day... :D Thank you for reminding me of him..

Thanks for the info on Dana, oldfart.

No, my laptop isn't missing any longer. UPS kept saying they didn't have it and that it never got shipped. Finally, hubby talked to someone there who found it sitting on the shelf where it had been the whole time. It took us about a week to get it, but it's safe here in my hands and I ain't lettin' it go.  :wink:

Yours must have come from that guy on American Idol.  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Taco come and get me...Im waiting...

Paulus killed Natalee.

J2K were at the racquet club when Natalee made the call.. only paulus was still in the house. Unless there are friends he doesnt want known.. and to date I have heard of none.

Natalee called at 3 am... Gardener sees joran in the front seat and deepak in the passenger seat.. person in back is unidentified...2:30-3am...

paulus is home alone with Natalee.

That is why they fought tooth and nail to keep that main house from being searched and the FBI outta the investigation...

The Truth Was Always There.

Paulus is the killer.

There is no reason to have a propaganda campaign like this if paulus isnt the killer...

paulus ~ premeditated.

Yes, "I always did everything for my parents."

"Your own father, unbelievable."

I think that pretty much says it all.  Paulus was not crying for Natalee when he told Dave he would do anything for his son.  He was crying because he had gotten his son into this mess, since "the lamb" was taking the fall for the "goat."

Unless there are friends he doesnt want known.. and to date I have heard of none.

Rob: Which he are you referring to?

Evening Monkeys, anything new? Reading back a few pages......... :)

klaas - Oh, thanks, but I mean to have my poinsettia as well. (Not easy, am I ...  :wink:  )

Tyler-

paulus -I ll do anything to protect my son.

paulus had to get into KIA to tell joran to change his story away from the lighthouse / rock area. He knew that something was found down there. He saw with his own eyes. His body crew saw the heat coming and uncovered   Natalee and took her to the rock area to be found...enter Van Cromvoirt and paulus' last shot.

Dave ~ I ll do anything to find Natalee. paulus ~ good luck with that.

paulus plays golf with a judge while everyone is looking for Natalee.

joran to anita ~ this wouldnt have happened if you were home.

anita ~ they should have left her WITH ADULTS...no crap..and away from your husband.

Wow, I went from a double espresso to a cappucino!  I love my happy celebrating kitty.  Thanks, CBB!  And thanks, Klaas, I thought Thursday was Dana night and was gearing up for it.  Gotta go now, will read and catch up later.

paulus Florida...he is the HE

Hi Monkeys,
 Nice to see you here Rob. We have missed you.

I am not sure who killed Natalee but I do know JK2 are somehow involved in her death or disappearance. Just as I believe in the incompetance or coverup from the ALE.

WHERE ARE SAN AND ROBOTS> They know> LOL

I also question the suicide by hanging of the female reporter. In my mind that is a warning to some by her hanging being in plain sight. Just as I have always thought the murder back in the early days of Natalees case where the supposed murder of the guy by his wife and the Colbian necktie bit was a warning. JMHO

So if Paulus was googling Alcohol and drugs at 10:30pm (or so) on the night of May 30th he may have planned on drugging Natalee.  JK2 took Natalee to Paulus and possibly others.  So JK2 could be guilty of kidnapping and sexual assault and Paulus guilty of premeditated murder.

Rob - Can you find out what the charges are going to be in the case of the death of "Baby D" (Dijkhoff - how's that for a familiar name popping up again?).

Also, Rob, per all of the H-T family, there were no calls from Aruba that pertain to Natalee. I think all involved tried very hard to make that something that had happened, but professional investigation didn't bear it out.

The call that C Croes listened to was the "William" call. There was no human articulation on it. Lots of strange noises including screeching that could have been birds (or even monkeys) - but the call originated from a Florida number and was a fluke/mis-dial. It WAS investigated HERE in the U.S.; possibly by the FBI but I am not sure what entity.

"I don't know these people" et al - just rumors.

That is what the H-T family is saying.

yep... pretty simple when you say it like that huh...Klaas, anita knew paulus was capable of this and did it before... she stays with him and protects him for her 'kids'...she thinks she needs that monster to make a family...Good Lord... thats sick...she knows what we are all finding out. No one on this planet is gonna keep the truth from coming out...

Sam nice to see you too...

Well Rob ... I think we need a Theory & Speculation thread again
Paulis the person behind the cover-up.?.. You bet your bippy...
Was Natalee deceased when they arrived at Joran's house or just barley alive because of the drugs ?

As Joran stated (do not have quote) If Mom had been at home.. this would not be happening.

Given Paulis's legal knowledge and contacts which is easier to keep quiet/hidden    an alive victim of a drugging or a deceased one.

It seems that one one of the K2's s stated something to the effect that it  was an average night of going out ...partying... and leaving with girls to "have fun" but something went worng... they went to Joarns place for help  and then  Paulis took over..

JMO  of course  (and the least violent conditions I can come up with)

msmarple - how is this?

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/msmarpleNY2007.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/msmarpleNY2007.gif

Durn  you are good Klaasend.
If I was having a New Years Party... that would be on My table as a center piece  setting :wink:

you rang  8)

Wanted to wsh you guys a Happy New Year if I dont get a chance..:)

Hey guys.  Just dropping in a minute to say hello..been on vacation - so to speak...Hope all are good.

Thanks Oldfart - waiting on msmarple's approval, lol  :lol:  She may not think the poinsettia is big enough..ha ha

Same to you Angie!

You too Sistah Fluffa!  

Happy New Year's to the rest of my monkey friends as well!  Hope Santa was good to you all.

Hi Kimmy!  Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you!

Evening monkeys, what's up in the cage tonight?  Do I need to read back or am I up on the gossip already?

I hope you have a great New Year, Ang.

Thanks Klaas and  Bean,, (hope your job is going well for yah~!)

Angiex (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/woohoo.gif)
How have you been?  A good Holliday season for you I hope?

(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/flirt.gif)

Lalalalalalassss  I didnt even read the word Shango~!! and here you are!

Did I see Rob?  Be still my heart!!!

  Thanks BT and Howdy there OF... :)  My holiday was ok.. Hope you had a great one. :wink:

I have Angie intuition.  Didn't you know? :roll:

Very good Robots, You are just like LalasMom except with her you have to mention Shango. LOL

klaas - Thanks! Avatar is just fine, perfect ...

I love you too Lalas  LOL  :)

It was Ok.  
Gandson was into everything  :lol:  :lol:  esp. the play tent...
Thought they were going to have to fold him up in it when it was time to go... :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Whew, I passed the msmarple scrutiny test  :lol:  You're welcome!

Happy New Year to you too Angie!! :D

Hi Everybody!!

Rob  Good to see ya man!

LOL Oldfart~!!  :) :)  Gotta love little kids at Christmas time!

Hey Kimmy!!  Hope ya had a great vacation!!

Snoop Dawgy Dawg..  :)  
I read when I can and keeping your sis and other ill folks in my prayers.

Howdy Lala's!! Hi Beans!!

K.  Gotta question for ya'll.  I agree with the theory about Paulus, but where does Guido figure in?  Any ideas?  Was he the white car following them?  Do you even think there really was a white car?

Lala's
Did you happen to see this in the Lounge Test thread posted by Jobie
Maybe someone can replace the old bald guy  with your avatar &  and change the book title to Monkey News or Problem Monkeys
 :wink: (http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/40auonr_th.gif)

Thanks Angie.  Ya'll will never know how much it is appreciated.  Won't be much longer now.

Waving to Snoop! (http://thedaisysistahs.forumup.us/images/smiles/oregonian_wavey.gif)

Hi ya sweetpea!!  :D

Gosh!  I feel like a family reunion tonight.  How ya been?  I have missed you.

Oh that is a wonderful idea!!  Klaas???  Oh Klaas?  Can you please make this one mine. Please, please with sugar on top?

Angie , Lalas Mom, Frijole, Snoopy,Oldfart,MsMarple Klaasend, Tyler, Anna , Rob and Robots, BT girl and Kimmy And any of the other Monkeys I missed , Happy New Year to all the Monkeys.

It sure is good to see everybody, and to be in real time too.  I'm usually way behind.  I'vemissed you too.  :wink:

Hi Snoopy,

This is just one of my theories.  I believe Natalee wasn't dead and I think she was severely injured. I think her injuries were from Joran and Guido (Heavy Battery).  Paulus was the one who decided not to help Natalee and he either killed her or let her die from her injuries (Premeditated Murder).  Paulus could not risk Natalee identifying the people who were present at his home.  The Kalpoes are guilty of kidnapping and rape.

Snoopy
We are here for you.  You know we love you, don't you?

Same to you Sam!  :D

back at yah Sam!

Happy New Year to you too Sam :D .

Happy New Year to you too Sam.

See ya all later.  Gotta go.

You guys are very high maintainence  :lol: Just give me one revishing hair style and a jaunty little crown and I"M HAPPY!.

Happy New Year to you too.

supposed to be ravishing..... :oops:

That does make a lot of sense.

Yeppers I know Lala's.  Thanks.  This is kinda funny.  Today my sister Joyce was having a few good moments.  And I was kinda cuttin up with her, and next thing I know she informed me that SHE was Daddy's little girl.  I was like  :shock:  huh, and then I said yes I know you was.  Cracked me up.  Where did that come from.  Of course I still am the baby.

Angie - would you like to get ready for New Years Eve too?

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/AngieNY2007.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/AngieNY2007.gif

I LIKE the looks of that BIG bottle of bubbly!  :lol:

 :shock: I did something maybe good for a change  :shock:
 :? :shock:  :?   You want Klaasend to replace the yellow bow with sugar (cubes or granuals)  :?  :shock:
and are do want the 2007 glasses ?(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j178/dodie_photos/lalamomny2007.gif) or put it on the book :wink:
Just wondering

I suppose you want it decorated too, lol  :lol:  :roll:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/lala2List.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/lala2List.gif

  ROFLMAO~!!  Thanks Klaas.. you didnt have to.. HA HA
Looks like me thinking at work adding up numbers.. !

"He did not answer the phone.  Why did the phone ring so long?  If he was home, why did he not answer the phone?"

Yes, I think Natalee got off a call and I then Beth, when she was at the house, recognized Paulus' voice as the voice in the background.  I never thought it was the monkey and I think all this was pressed into the background at the insistence of a smart lawyer name JQK.

ARE You giving MY Fireworks to Angie ???
If Not please do... :lol:  :lol:

msmarple - Linda on the front page answered a question you had regarding the 4yr old boy that died:

P.S.  Excuse Linda's language but I think in this case it's warrented:

Linda wrote:
ms marple..that asshole only got 9 years jailtime..he really just killed his son..because he was crying to much..just hit him in the head..in these situations I really want your system..death sentence..but we have to do it with the stupid dutch law system..9 years and probably out in 5 for good behavior..just makes me sick..

Right back at you, Angie.  Thank you.  Take care.

I have been watching ballgames and trying to post.  It's Frijole's fault.  :lol:  :lol:

Hi Snoopy, sorry was tending to dogs.   :lol:  :lol: Good to see you too!

Well, I want me behind the book and not the bald guy. Sorry, I am complicated.  I guess you can't do that, huh?

You missed the link between the "suicide victim" and Shango last evening.  I called but you were not listening.

Let me see what I can do.  Not sure if I can.

Hi, Snooper doggie, how are you.  Happy new year.

I love the New Year's avatars!

Hello everybody!

Reading back a few pages, MsMarple wrote about the reported phone calls from Natalee the night she disappeared.  There was nothing found on the phone call to indicate that it was from Natalee.  Natalee's voice was not heard.

What could have been the sounds of monkeys was heard.  It should be noted that at the Wyndham Hotel (which is near the Bird Sanctuary) there are monkeys.  However the call did not originate from Aruba.

You know Tyler I never thought of Beth recognizing Paulus' voice.  I will have to agree with you there.  We were always concentrating on the sounds that the monkey made when she went to that hell hole of a house.

 :lol:  :lol: Sure Tyler, blame it on me, I can handle it.. LOL

I caught it this morning...I am still thinking on that one.  I guess I had my muffs on last night... :oops:

Tyler,  wasn't all this before JQK came in the picture??

 LMAO  you stole my party hat!!  :)

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/LaLaBookNY.gif)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/LaLaBookNY.gif

ROFLMAO  :lol:  :lol:

OMG that is so good. :lol:

G'nite Monkeys
Nice seeing so many here...
And as so Many say ... Its Bath /  bed time (& heating pad for the back tonight for me)

I happened on this AND no way is this  me...


IT just  reminded me of so many monkeys saying they are headed  off  for a nice bath  :oops:

(http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/bathtime.jpg)

SeeeYaaaByeee  Gang

Klaas,  you are really incredibly talented!! that is so funny!

Nite Oldfart!

um...do you think we all look like this oldfart?

Well, that can't be me OF - I don't see a single scorpion anywhere in that picture.  :lol:  :lol:

San sistah~!!!  :)  Like your New year look!!

Your party hat ?
Hey Klaasend gave me mine 1st !!

OMG! You guys have been busy while I was gone! Klaas, that's great!  :lol:

Angie, you are decked out!!!!

Has anyone taken care of Kimmy?  :lol:

Maybe Kimmy's not a very good dancer, but she'll loosen up as the night goes on!  :wink:

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/Disco.gif)

 :shock: Klaasend (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/4a82dab5.gif)

Thanks Klaas made me my new hat :lol: .  You look good too.

I chose a blue hat to show off your big blue eyes.  Also, gave you a noise maker.  Had to change the color of the tassles on the noise maker though.  Originally they were yellow and you looked like you were barfing

 :lol:  :lol:

 :lol:  Me either.

Oldfart - If it makes you feel any better, your fireworks are bigger than Angies  :lol:

 :lol: If you asked my sister she would tell you I don't need a noise maker :lol: .  I like the hat a lot.  I was thinking if you could play around with it after the new year and either take the 2007 off or maybe a new hat.  Bye the way my eyes are really that blue.

 Hey CBB and San sistah!!

brb in a few  :)

ahh ... yes...   Of course I do..

and it not the person in the photo that got to me
but the serenity & elegance that it I saw in the photo
Hope this make since...
SYB

Donald Trump is on Greta talking about Rosie.

I mean really! Females are SUPPOSED to have HIPS! Right?

Boobs and Hips! That way we don't get mistaken for a cross-dresser. right??

PLEASE somebody, say I'm right?  :shock:

I could loose this extra 10, oh, ok, 15 pounds and STILL would look like a different gender than that girl!  :lol:

I could fit into it, but only because I'm dwarfish.  :lol:  :lol: