Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Let's hope 2007 brings Justice for Natalee

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/candleman2justice2007.jpg)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/JoranDance.gif)

ROFL!!! :lol:  :lol: No words. That's perfect!!!

I could have sworn you started a thread last night

OMG, Klaas!!!  :lol:  :lol: You just rared back and whacked my funny bone!!!

Joran's just tap dancing around the truth!!
I like to look at that and think of somebody shooting at his feet!  :lol:

This is so funny.

:smt044 OR he's trying to address a wedgie. :smt043

Klaas, Anna, Anyone,

Where can I find postings on the 4 AM ATM visit. When PVS was hit with that info during his lawsuit in what manner was that fact told or presented to him? Was it just that they knew he made an ATM visit becasue there had been activity on one of his accounts at that ATM at that time? Or did they have a security cam record of him at the ATM? :?

I did, but it turned into a photo evaluation thread so I changed the name of it  :wink:

From previous thread...Tamikosmom post:  My comments in red.

Benvinda de Souza - Family Attorney
Letter to Karen Jansen
June 23, 2005

<snipped>

Also understood by Claudio is that mr. Van Der Sloot said that he picked up Joran around 4:00 am close to McDonald’s.

<snipped>

What comes next is the questions that the family wanted answers to:

1) Has Mr. Groeneveld been interrogated about the times Probably didn't matter what he said, since no one asked him.

2) Has Mr. Eldridge been interrogated Most probably not.

3) Why hasn’t Jug Twitty been interrogated He did give a statement, or did they even ask him for one?

4) Did the police notice that the clothes were unsuitable for somebody who had just been in the casino? What clothes are we talking about here?  When?  The ones the maid had laundered or the ones on the casino video?

5) Has it been confirmed that Joran has been in the casino? This because a personnel of the casino had mentioned that he had seen Nathalee We now know the answer to this question. Yes he was there along with Papa.  Wonder who the "personnel" was?

6) Has Charles Croes been interrogated? You don't ask the person that has all cell phone records in Aruba any questions, too many answers you can't explain.

7) Is it true that Mr. Kalpoe owns a ‘koei’ [?! Maybe they mean a ‘kooi’, which is a cage?!] Which Mr. Kalpoe would this be? Deepak, perhaps?  Never heard this one. Anyone?

Cool Has it been established that Joran told his father in the presence of the grou that he was first in the Wyndham and then in the Raddisson and afterwards he went home?

9) Has there been any forensic evidence and if so, where? All evidence was sent to the Netherlands.  Doesn't anyone keep up here? LOL

10) What does the Justice Department base their reasonable suspicion on, other than statements of the suspects? Which Justice Dept are we talking about here?  U. S. ?  Didn't know they had actually made a statement concerning this case yet.

11) Are there other people that are considered suspects or is the Justice Department only focusing on these suspects? Again, which place?  Are they talking about Janssen's office?

12) It seems that Joran’s Headmaster said to Jug Twitty that Joran said that Nathalee had drowned . Have these people been interrogated I don't think the headmaster ever stated for the record that Joran said this.  I could be wrong. Anyone know?

Translation Credit - Arubagirl

I know there's a front page post on it.  I'll find it.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol: I hope both !  :lol:  :lol:

well it's monsoons and hail here right now, batten down the hatches those upwind from our parts, it's a comin !!!!!!!!

did lala's ever go to bed last night? she's still hard at work shango-ing  :shock:

I think you'll find most of that information here in the fp post on SM:

http://tinyurl.com/27xaf6

PAUL VAN DER SLOOT HAD TWO PERSONAL CONTACTS WITH NATALEE THE NIGHT SHE DISAPPEARED

ORANJESTAD(AAN) On the 13th of  February 2007, the Superior Court dictated sentence against Paul van der Sloot in the case that he appealed with regards to the damages that his person as well as his family members asked for, seeing that in the Primary Court (Court of First Instance) Paul van der Sloot alone (no one else in his family) got a reward of 40,000 guilders for damages and 1500 guilders to cover the costs of the lawyers, court clerks, etc.
 
The sentence of the Superior Court fell like a bomb on Paul van der Sloot and his defence attorney because, according to the attorney, the Court made use of informations that do not agree with the truth.
 
The Court dictated that Paul van der Sloot fetched Joran and Natalee at the McDonald Palm Beach branch and took the two of them to the Holiday Inn, according to declarations by witnesses and also informations obtained from a phone tap carried out by the police.
 
Until recently, this key information was not known in the press and apparently only by the Police and Dept. of Justice.
 
The whole case of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway gets a different twist now that the information has come out from no less than the Superior Court, and in which mention is made of the declarations of witnesses and a phone tap that show or give an indication that Paul van der Sloot had on two occasions personal contact with Natalee during the night that she disappeared.
 
Mention is made that, according to one or more official reports of the phone tap and also the declaration of Paul van der Sloot himself, that Paul fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald and took them to the Holiday Inn.
 
Based on this information, the judicial authorities and the police had at that time a justified basis to arrest Paul van der Sloot based on different suspicions.
 
According to the Superior Court, Paul van der Sloot himself is guilty, he made possible or caused (depends how every one interprets the grammar in the sentence of the Court’s) himself to be arrested and that Aruba cannot be held responsible for the damages that he suffered and for which he was demanding damages, which he won in First Instance, but appealed to get more, and now has lost everything.
 
In the sentence there are various points and aspects that brought a different view on the Natalee Holloway case and that in the coming days will be analyzed, but the most important information is the matter of fetching Natalee and Joran at the McDonald, Palm Beach, and also that Paul had on two occasions personal contacts with Natalee on the night that she disappeared.
 
The cardinal question now is: what did the police authorities hear on the tapped phone of Paul van der Sloot, and the next question is hotter still: at what time, under what circumstances, and where did Paul van der Sloot as the father of Joran van der Sloot  have contacts with Natalee Holloway the night she disappeared?
 
If the Superior Court says that in the official report mention is made that Paul van der Sloot fetched Joran and Natalee on the aforementioned night at McDonald Palm Beach, that is the first contact, but where did the second contact take place?
 
On the night of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, Paul van der Sloot met again with Natalee after he left Joran with Natalee at the Holiday Inn? If that is the case, then where and at what time did Natalee disappear that night?
 
In the declarations of Joran and the Kalpoe brothers there was a heated discussion amongst them, with formal denials as to whether they went with Natalee to the house of Paul van der Sloot on the night of her disappearance.
 
That’s why it is important to get clarity on the two occasions that Paul van der Sloot had personal contacts with Natalee on the night in question and where and under what circumstances they occurred.
 
The lawyer for Paul van der Sloot denies that Paul declared that he fetched Joran and Natalee at McDonald Palm Beach, and that he had contacts with Natalee the night she disappeared, but the Superior Court of Justice based its sentence on the information presented by the interim Attorney General of Aruba.

So who's lying?  The courts or Sloot man? Tylergal has always purported that she was carried to the HI.

Lala's - the courts are looking at "wire tap" evidence.  I suppose if PVDS was talking to someone about it he could have known his phone was tapped and was lying.  How will we know?

This is so true Klaas.  Because Joran says in one of his statements to Deepak about the phones being tapped.

just downright amazing, reading this makes me feel ill all over again

a lying officer of the courts yet there is no corruption?  :roll:

From the Police Car Transcript:

Joran: You said then via the telephone like, that I have the jackpot. You said now [?] through the phone , I have the fxxxing jackpot. You forget that the phone is tapped, right?
Satish or Deepak: Shut your trap [hou je bek]
Joran: You forget that, right +++++? Then you arrive home and you say how you arranged everything. You say "I have fixed it". Good for you [meaning your own fault]. because of you he is also in jail.
Deepak: Yeaaaaaaaaahhh! Yeahhhhhhhhh![/list]

Sometimes I wonder if Joran said this about the phones being tapped because they really didn't know they were tapped.  This way they can say we know the phones were tapped and we lied on purpose like everything else in this case of lies.

Didn't Deepak say in one of his statements he knew he was being monitored and he lied on purpose.

San-

I think they all knew and that Paulus had an insider giving him a heads-up on every step the ALE was taking

Thanks Klass for the link.

By wire tapped you mean phone tapped?

Ane everyone is sure it's tapped information, not taped as in taped conversation?
And I guess none of us know when the date of the tapped/taped conversation took place, correct?

I can't find in the link you sent me much information on the ATM visit. Only that PVS was told they have tapped information on him. I really am interested on what evidence there is about the ATM stop.

Ado

Yes, the phone was tapped.  I haven't seen real evidence on the ATM transaction.  There may be some and I haven't seen it.

Oh no we sprong a leak.

Uh OH! Break out the pots and pans  :wink:

(http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscartoons/cartoonists/tzu/lowres/tzun214l.jpg)

More like towels in my cabinet.

The following blog that was posted at Aruban Boycott site on April 10, 2007 pertains to the topic being discussed.

Janet

http://arubanboycott.blogspot.com/2007/04/paulus-van-der-sloots-detainment.html

PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT'S DETAINMENT JUSTIFIED

At the time of the writing of Benvinda de Souza letter to Karin Janssen ... June 23, 2005 ... Jug Twitty had not been questioned.

Janet


Jug Twitty
On the Record w/ Greta
September 28, 2005

TWITTY: I don’t know. I really don’t. I mean, I cannot understand why she can’t communicate with the family, I can’t understand why, you know, she doesn’t take and go back to the beginning and talk to the people that know the answers. There’s a lot of people there that first night. You know, why they didn’t take my statement until 33 days after?


Jug Twitty
'Scarborough Country'
August 11, 2005

TWITTY: I think, Joe, they need to go back to the beginning and question the people that were with me that night. We have already got conflicting stories now.

People have changed their statements from the very first night. Those people that were with me that night, had they taken our statements at least a week after it happened, we would have already had the answer. But when they take my statement 33 days later, and they take the other guys‘ statements that were with me and ladies that were with me, you know, like 19 days later, it‘s like they didn‘t want to find the truth.

From what I remember of the 4am pick-up is that Beth Holloway
could not reconcile why Paulus had said that he had picked Joran
up at McDonalds at 4am (the first night that she arrived and went
to his house in the wee-hours of the morning looking for Natalee)
and then changed the time to 11.  :shock:

It wasn't until the hearing pertaining to the false arrest that we
heard the he was arrested based on witnesses (the men that had
driven her to the Sloots) who said that they had heard him say that
he HAD, indeed, picked Joran up at 4am.  (I'm assuming he was
barefoot)  :wink:

Maybe they hadn't gotten their whole story down pat, earlier in
the day as they sat around the swimming pool and Paulus, the
mastermind in the COVER-up, MESSED up..... He He He   :lol:

Thanks Tamikosmom,

So, get this, at that site the translation says taped, not tapped. I wish I knew which it is. And I wish I knew when the tap/tape occured.
I know some at the morning scene disagree over 11 vs 4. I just want to know what was in the tap/tape, when it occured, and what evidence is there of an ATM visit and just when did the ATM visit occur.

Thanks Again - Ado

Patti,
In your opinion it was a taped witness interview, not a phone tap?

Ado

Perhaps it is because of things like this, specifically, the denial of
restitution for false arrest, that I think that we may still see justice.

The 4am pick-up is pivotal, in this case, in my opinion.

It is also my opinion, that something bad had already happened and
Joran, shoeless, was seeking out the help of an adult.... like his good
mommy taught him to do. :smt101

"Daddy, Somthing Bad Happened"

"Don't worry, Son, I'll FIX it for you"

But, first you must tell me where she is....

(Silence)

If there is no body, there is no crime...

(Silence)

How can I fix it if you don't trust me?

(Silence)

It was not until June 10th that Joran finally told where Natalee could
be found....

and... she's been MISSING ever since.

(that's my take)

It was confirmed with Jossy by us that it was taped phone conversations, or wire tapped phone conversations.    The information from the front page of SM is directly from Jossy from what he could find out about the court hearing where PVDS lost his case.

Yes, I think it was a witness interview... whether it was taped, I couldn't
tell you for sure.

Posted by RED on February 15, 2007:

There may have been a typo in today's FP article ... Sentencing of the Superior Court:

"With attention to the lying declarations that the son of Paulus, Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (hereafter Joran) gave about his last contact on the 30th of May 2005 with the disappeared Natalee Holloway, the suspicion is not unreasonable that he made himself guilty of a conduct that can be qualified as murder, manslaughter, or kidnapping that resulted in death.

The possible involvement of Paulus with that could then be deducted from the file with the official reports of witnesses, amongst which two people suggested a contact existed between Paulus and Natalee Holloway the night of her disappearance, and a tapped report (that was given by the Prosecutor in her final note 1 to the Court). The tapped information and his declaration that he picked up Joran and Natalee by the McDonalds Palm Beach and brought them to the Holiday Inn, are clearly understood by the Dept. of Justice, and could in the judgement of this Superior Court, be considered as an indication of the involvement of Paulus in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway."

"He" in this instance means Paulus.

Yes. That's what the Superior Court of Justice dictaminated. There were taps on Paulus' phone and his incoming and outgoing conversations were tapped and listened to. We understand from the sentence that the Prosecution is in possession of all those taps made on the phone(s) of Paulus.

So it was a taped interview....

But... He DIDN'T drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn.

In my opinion, the only one left, was Joran:  

Barefoot, with a black eye!

Patti - NO, not a taped interview.  It was wire tapped phone conversations.

Do we know the date of the taped tapped phone conversation? Was it the early morning of the 30th or later on in the case?

I'm still looking around trying to find where the ATM stop claim came from.

Ado

I don't think we know the exact date of the wire tapped phone conversations.  The only ATM reference I've seen about PVDS is in the blogs and no article or PV backup that I can remember.  PVDS does talk about going to the bank twice on 5/30 (I believe) in one of his statements.  He does not mention the ATM.

Okay.... my mistake.

But I thought that the man that had provided the investigators with
the information regarding the 4 am pick-up was one of the men that
had been with Beth the morning that she was driven to the Sloot's
house looking for Natalee... is that bogus, as well?

You know my memory isn't what it used to be... but I am sure that
Beth had written in her notebook that he had told her, in the presense
of her assistants, that he had picked "them" up at Mc Donalds and had
dropped Natalee off at the Holiday Inn at 4am; and that he later changed
his story to him picking them up at 11  (which in my opinion would also
have been a lie because Natalee wasn't with Joran at 11pm).

I'm not saying that is bogus, what I'm saying is that there are wiretaps on the VDS phone where Paulus is saying he picked up Natalee.  All I'm talking about is those wire taps.  The wire taps is a HUGE DEAL.  They had not become knowledge to any of us until Paulus court hearing in February 2007 where he lost his case.  Which implies that there may be more evidence in the way of wire taps that we are not aware of.

Patti - did you see the PHOTO EVALUATION thread?  It's stickied just below this thread.  Sleuth posted some stuff there for you.  She's still working on it.

Klaas,

It looks like the only mention of a 4 AM ATM visit is someone saying that 2 MB kids claimed they saw Paulus, Joran, and Natalee in a jeep at the ATM at 4.

It was discussed here back around Feb 14th in the 584 postings IIRC.

Ado

adoronron - correct on the ATM.  We don't have anything really but internet rumors as far as I know.

Early in the case there were some posters that were "posing" as MB kids that really weren't.  Some of the things posted by some people claiming to be from MB may or may not be true.  Until I see it in a PV or a declaration from ALE or that Beth and Dave have factual knowledge about it, I take it as rumor.

Thanks, Klaas....

That's why I've been checking in and out.

I wasn't aware of the thread.

(Fingers crossed).... (And TOES, too.)

OT
 But then again.. when arn't I ? lol

I belong to a support group online.  Its for the vocal cord problem BS.
 Anyhow every Sunday they meet online in a private chat for an hour. I really have nto been able to make it lately due to work. So there are a few new members. i went today since I was able to for a change.
  One of the members was talking about how she just went to Holland over Easter. Another member said OMG why would you go there after all thats been going on with the girl thats missing from Aruba.
 I almost fell off my chair here.  I spoke up and said I have followed the case as well.  Well this lady was sticking up for Aruba, and Holland and going on and on about corrupt govt's elsewhere. I asked her what exactly did she know about the case? I left a link for SM there and a link to the document threads.. said read it and weep and left.
  I had to leave , she was saying we don't like dutch?  I said thats not it at all. Could not make her get it. So I hope she reads the links I sent to her.
 It was just weird to be in that chat and have her go off about the case?
 :evil:

No kidding!  If you wanted that kind of argument you could just go post at RU, LOL  :lol:

 ROFL Klaas..
  This chat is about how others are coping with their vocal problems.. and it was all going fine til she mentions going to Holland?  Only myself and the other lady knew what she was talking about, others were like HUH?  lol
 I hope she reads the links I dropped , perhaps she will change her mind.

Even if she does look.. maybe the others will take a gander too.

Klaas:

There was, I assume a picture that was posted by Sleuth about which
she asked, "is this young lady or an old woman".... do you have a copy
of it?

Can you post it, here, or repost it there?   I would like to see it.

Good Job, Angie!!!!

 LOL Patti..
  Well I at LEAST hope the witchy woman that went to Holland looks at Sm at least. The other lady I am sure she will.. since she brought it up first.

It's still in that thread.  Here it is.  It's an illusion photo:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/oldlady.jpg)

 :thumleft:

She is probably still weeping :smt022

Maybe I'm missing something here.... All I see is an X - am I supposed
to open something?  If so, how?

Also.... what is an illusion photo?

:lol:  San

I don't get it....

Why would she have asked if it were a young or old woman?

(I assume that if we ever, really, see a good picture of the body at the
rocks, there will be some wrinkling of the skin... as well as slippage)

At this point, I am quite confused... is it that you don't want the picture
viewed?

Sleuth removed the links in the previous thread.  I don't want to start the same argument in this thread.  I think Sleuth was just pointing out we can see different things in photos.

I don't want to argue, either....

But, one of the reasons for her being here in the first place was to take
a look at the video and determine if there is a body in the bushes and
rocks that are behind the painter.

I know what I see, and I know in my heart that what I am seeing is
real.  That was the purpose of taking a closer look in the first place.

I hope that she will continue in her evaluation, and I hope that she
will confirm one way or the other, as it is a key part of the cover-up
and can be beneficial to the family... isn't that why we are ALL here?

This IS the sort of thing that could get the investigation back up and
running again.... to who's benefit would it be to NOT allow such infor-
mation to be confirmed?

I am already sick  but am traumatized and sicker yet  :shock:  :shock:
  Friends of hubby and mine have a 23 yr old son.  He sends an IM every so often and asks how my daughter and step daughter are.
 So he send sme an IM a little bit ago.. asks the same.. then proceeds to say I have a cool video to send I said ok.. , thinking its gonna be in email and I would forward on to the girls.. he dont have their email addy.
  Umm.. so on IM he sends it. I hit accept.. hes dancing.. then all of a sudden he whips it out  :oops:  I hit close.. told him his butt is gonna be in big time trouble. He says I have a crush on you?  :puker:
 OMG I wanna throw up. I am old enough to be this kids mother for God sakes.
  Do I call his mother and tell her what he did?   :oops:
 I am so grossed out.

Angie - Do you think he's high on something? I can't think any other reason why he would behave in such an outrageous way to a friend of his parents. He can't be thinking straight or he would realize how much trouble he could be in.

Angie  :lol:  :lol:

Sleuth's reason for being here since June 2005 is the same as all of ours, that's to help get Justice for Natalee.  Her reason is not to analyze photos or anything else unless she chooses to do so.   She was going to look at those screen shots as favor to you and others when she has the time to do it.

That's gross... and I am, often, confronted with the same problem.  There
are countless young men out there that have a yearning to have an older
woman.  I have been hit on by my daughter's friends numorous times.  I
have gone to pick my daughter up from school to find that the next day,
all the boys at school are telling everyone that Nikki's mom is HOT!  Only
a couple have, actually, had the nerve to confront me with their fantacies.

But, I have never had someone send a picture of their, you know what...

I don't know what I would do... I suppose that it depends on how good of
friends you are with his parents.  It is sure to ruin your relationship.   In,
which case, I would say confont him.

  Klaas.. I want to crawl under a rock and just die.   Acckkk.
   BT dunno if hes messed up?  
Patti it is gross.. and I .. OMG.. its .. Eweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
 I blocked him .. esp after he said age dont matter to me?  
   I blocked him from IM.. if he emails me then I may have to call his mom... :(  He must have gotten a new gadget to mess with. One of those camera thingys you put on your desk?   :shock:

Angie, you do NOT send your parents friends naked pictures of yourself. Something is definitely up with this kid. Do you still have the video?

Patti, I see the picture. An illusion photo is one where you see a couple of different things depending on how you look at it...I've seen several of them on email out there floating around. Actually I can't see the old woman in this one, I only see the young girl. But I think that illustrates Sleuth's point...

Mishy,

I've seen this one before, so I see both women in the picture. To see the old woman, look at the young woman's ear as if it is the old woman's eye, and I think it will fall into place for you.

BT, I've seen this one before too and I noticed the ear/eye immediately, but still can't see the old woman.  :oops:

Okay, try this.  :D

The ribbon around the young woman's neck is the old woman's mouth, and the young woman's nose is a wart on the old woman's nose. Does that help?

Re. the "two photos" picture - this has been around a long time; I have it and others saved somewhere.

At one glance, you might see a young girl, a sort of rear profile. Her hair is slightly pulled back. You don't really see her eye, and only a suggestion of a nose. She is wearing a black choker-type ribbon around her neck.

At another glance, you might see a much older woman, front profile. Her hair is hanging forward. You see one eye, and a large nose. Her MOUTH is the ribbon; prominent chin below it.

Good Evening, Monkeys,

I see both the old woman and the young one.  The one woman's nose is the young ones chin.  Her eye is the young one's ear.

Yes,  I think it is an example of how we can see different things in photos.

Be that as it may and no matter what we see, the resolution on the photos is not good enough to reopen an investigation especially with ALE.  The vids have been sent to the FBI as well as the photo.  I don't personally think Art Wood would lie to us.

I think perhaps a fake crime scene was made or being made to help in the framing of the security guards.  

Keep in mind what was stated by the videographer and posted by Klaas on April 10, 207, right here:

Quote:

This was one of the messages on the aru-bay site back in June 2005 prior to the site going down. This message is referencing the lighthouse/rock portion of the videos:

"Before rumors start we would like to mention that this site was here about a year ago allready..................... This is what we saw yesterday morning......it's mostly uncut video so tell EVERYBODY you can see for yourself what's going on in Aruba at www.aru-bay.com and more keeps comming...............but we had to copyright it (as you will notice when you watch the clips) to prevent them from being mis-used and we tried to blurr out the faces of local and international lawenforcement agents(IF they are but we rather be safe than sorry) .this footage is for personal use only........and due to the seriousness of the situation we did not add any music to these clips.............this footage was taped on the 11th of june 2005 in the early morning hours behind the lighthouse, were the tree suspects .....NOT THE BLACK SECURITY'S WHO WERE ACCUSSED BY THE INTERNATIONAL MEDIA (CNN FOX AND OTHERS)BUT this is the area the three who saw her last said they went and EVERYBODY + man's best friend were there on a very VERY low profile so draw your own conclusion......... BUT for official statements let's wait and pray for a positive outcome and why has nobody asked the official spokes people about the bottle of lysol I saw in the Aruba Today Daily News picture in the beginning of the week ???????does it have anything to to with this case?????????????????SO PLEASE .............GO DO YOU JOB WITH REAL FACTS AND INTELLIGENT QUESTIONS AND KEEPING HER LOVED-ONES FEELINGS IN MIND.........AND DON"T MAKE IT A RACIAL THING.............THERE ARE JUST GOOD PEOPLE AND BAD PEOPLE IN EVERY RACE AND COUNTRY.........SO IN CASE YOU DIDN"T KNOW...... NOW YOU KNOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!........... AND MAY GOD BE YOUR GUIDE BEFORE YOU EVER HAVE TO INFORM THE PUBLIC OF ANYTHING AGAIN............................."

The aru-bay site seems to be upset about the arrest of the security guards.

Incredibly, both females are wearing the same hat ...  :lol:

So her point is that two people can look at the same
picture  and see two different things... right?

I agree with that.

I hope that she continues looking at the video, because I am sure
of what I see... as much as Carpe believes in what he sees.

This Sleuth....

She's a smart lady!!!

Thanks, Mishy and B.T.  

(sometimes, I'm not so smart)

Hello Everyone

I finally got in SM on attempt no five and a year later :lol: You guys do some great stuff back here..Thanks for having me.. 8)

 Hell no
   I clicked off soon as he whipped out his peep.
 I just told hubby.. he thinks its funny?  :evil:  :evil:
 I always admired this kid too. smart kid.. good job.. great parents.. he ,, at least. I THOUGHT was a nice kid to my girls. And does this?  :?
  Hubby said not to call his mom and dad.  Let it go unless he does it again.  I am so embarassed..  :oops:  :oops:

Patti - whether you can see both women or not doesn't have anything to do with being smart (and I'm sure you are smart). It only has to do with how well you can cross your eyes.  :lol:

Welcome *******.

Hi ******* and welcome! :smt006

Block him from your email and your IM.

Either he is a nut or an idiot.  Pick one.

WELCOME!!!  Finally!  :lol:

ahhhhhhhhh, thanks BT  :wink:

Angie - I really think the kid is high on something. I can't think of any other explanation why he would do something so tasteless to a friend of his parents. If I were you, I would IM or email him and tell him if he EVER does anything like that again you're going to give the evidence to his parents.

 Hey ******* and welcome!!  :)

  Also in that illusion thing. I only see the young lady.. but. will have to loks again?

Fixing dinner, BRB

Be nice to ******* you guys, OK?  LOL  :lol:

******* - Welcome! Monkeys, this is one of the Boston show demonstrators. And a long-time FP poster.

Angie - It HAS occurred to you that you are living a very bad soap opera these days, hasn't it?  :lol:  

Seriously, though, I would keep a wary eye on that guy. ("Kid" is NOT the right word - you said he is 23?) I personally think that at very least, maybe your husband should talk to him RIGHT NOW. Tell him how wildly, inappropriately, over-the-top it was. And that you're SAVING the thing in case it or anything similar ever occurs again, with anyone.

Talking to parents probably no good. They would likely go into denial.

Welcome, *******!

I have read your posts on the Front Page many times.  Good to see you in the cage.  We are not always as on topic and to the point as the Front Page is but hope you will enjoy being part of our forum.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Greetings/Prayer%20Thanks%20Compliment/47vs1s6_th.gif)

As if you'd have to tell us to do that.  :smt110  :lol:

*******:

I'm glad you're here, too.


Mishy and B.T.:  

I saw the old lady after you pointed it out.... I just didn't know
the story behind the picture.  I wasn't aware of illusion photos
and didn't understand the reason for posting it....

but, now I do.

Thanks...

*******, glad to have you!!

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b358/mishyp/mazewelc1.gif)

Patti,

Here's another illusion photo. What does this guy have on his mind?
(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b358/mishyp/opticalillusions27.gif)

OK, I've just gone off on an illusion photo tangent on the internet and found this picture that I could swear was in one of the videos of the rocks, for I saw it in Carpe's screen shots last week. On this illusion site, it said this picture was made on the moon in the 70s. Anybody else remember it from Carpe's screen shots?

(http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b358/mishyp/opticalillusions39a.jpg)

Welcome, *******.  Glad you got in.

San, I hope your leaks will be fine and that your flooding will not be what they predict.  Ours was a nothing-burger.  Totally wrong and they continue saying it's the worst in 50 years.  BS, we had one 1000 times worse 5 years ago on April 26.

None, I hope you and all the Carolinians will be safe.  We have lots of friends in the Durham, Raleigh, Wilmington areas and quite a few in South Carolina and Virginia as well.  We will be thinking of you and San and wishing the best for you.

Angie, two words about this video - law enforcement.  This is a disturbed and potentially dangerous individual.

Patti, Beth never said that Paulus said he took them to the Holiday Inn as best I recall.  She said that he ''picked them up at 4 a.m."  (I asked immediately who was "them?"  Of course, that was later changed to him picking Joran up at 11 p.m. and Joran sneaking back out with the Car Pool Brothers.  

I always have and always will believe until someone can prove me wrong, it was the HI and the reason the girly man pissed his pants when Posner called him in and told him to make sure that story was changed immediately and Posner is the one paying the attorney for Guido.

I remember it.  I made a comment about Joran and his zits.

My hubby is an ass and thinks its funny..  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:
  Gonna drop it.  I'll deal with it accordingly..

  MISHY  ROFLMAO   Ummmmmmmm   :shock:

I agree, MsMarple. They could deny it all they wanted, til they actually saw the video  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  8) But it would probably be good if Ang's hubby would call the boy and ask him what's up with upsetting my wife?

The same thing as Angie's secret admirer.... sex (naked women)!

Whew Hooooo!!!

Got that one fast... the young woman, old woman was a lot harder.

Mishy, I don't remember that being in Carpe's screen shots, but I do remember when it was first published. People were saying that it was proof that there had been life on other planets because it was supposed to be a sculpture.

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/possibly_lee_b_1copya.jpg)

I do believe he's a potentially dangerous individual. Please watch your back...Sex is a major motivator to some...that's a really bold move he made...wonder who else he's exposing himself to uninvited? This is exhibitionism at it's heighth...

Tyler, good to see one of my favorite posters.  The leaks aren't too bad (towels did the job) but we have to do something about it.  I know what the problem is so now I have to call someone to fix it.

What do you make of this, San?

Well we know what's on your mind, Patti!! You dirty girl  :shock:

you know I'm kidding, don't you?

Is this a test :lol:

 

 yes it was BOLD.. and I about died.   It wasnt funny.   even after that.. I tryed to be nice and said you are so gonna get yourself in trouble by doing things like that.   :roll:

 MS. yes.. a soap opera. and it sucks and I wouldnt wish any of what I go through on anyone. :(

I am not San but this is the face on Mars photo taken 1976.  Scientific explanation and lots more photos at
www.msss.com/education/facepage.face.html

I'm not testing you, but I wonder if someone is testing us on the video...Can it be fauxtogrpahy just like the shopped pix of Natalee supposedly dancing on the bar at C'nC's?

That link does not work. Will go see where I messed up.

Thanks Tibro. That's what that optical site said...but why did I see it in one of Carpe's screen shots? Or am I going bonkers?

OK - try this :  www.msss.com/education/facepage/face.html

Thanks for the warm welcome everyone  :)

That's a pretty unique hairline that guy has. Makes me think of the Paulus clone sitting next to Natalee at the BJ table. :o

At this point, with everything that he said... I'd just ignore him.

When I told my ex-boyfriend about the those young'uns that came after
me, he told me to tell them that they aren't "BIG" enough for me.  At the
time I thought that was a bit egotistical on his part  :shock:   But, later,
I tried it and it worked.... sure turn off.

 :idea:   Try it next time... they may think that you are real beotch,
but, it works for me!   :D

Photo of PVDS when he got his "spanking" in front of his peers  :wink: :


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/PVDS.jpg)

Looks like his hair is combed forward to cover that balding spot on his left temple.

Thanks Tib!

Yep - that one works.  If computers are as clever as they try to tell us they are, how come they don't know what we mean to type?

Welcome to *******.  Nice to have you in the cage with us.  It gets wild on the FP sometimes and is usually calmer in here.

Thank you again monkeys for all your messages.  They have really helped. Will be leaving in a short while and I do drive carefully (well past the age of hooning around)  :wink:

I will leave a supply of small litter bags by the cage door. (No, they are NOT  barf bags) and if you just pop the banana peels in there that will make it so much easier for Lala's.
Will miss you guys.   Back Wednesday.

Mishy - Carpe posted it just to show how things can appear to be different than they really are.

I posted the pic and linked it to the site that explains it.

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast24may_1.htm

TIBRO

  Be safe and sympathy sent to you and hubby and the family  :(

oops - sorry Carnut.  Of course it was you in the middle of all Carpe's shots.

Definitely logging out  this time

Take care, Tibro. We'll miss you. See you Wednesday.

klaas & Monkeys - I have about a half dozen of these graphic illusions, in one Word file.

If we're interested? Can I email the document to klaas? I have problems thinking serially ... about how to get them from Word to SM.

One of them is the old/young woman we've already seen.

I was reading where I left off last night, and there was discussion about a white vehicle and some were wondering what it was.  I think it is a Mitsubishi.  Don't know how to bring things over from other thread-sorry...But wanted to comment on that.  There are cars and such that aren't imported to the U.S., or are sold under different names.

msmarple - I don't think that's necessary do you?  Any of us can google illusion photos and find some.  No need to post any more here, IMO.

(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/SunFreak2/VDSlootcar3.jpg)

Optical illusions?

here's another lady pic, only there's 3 faces in this one.

(http://eyetricks.com/0201.gif)

Boy this has to be one of the worst days in Paulus's life, called out by one of his peers saying basically "we all know what you and your son did and you should be very humble that you've been given a free pass, Don't make waves or we can make the tide very uncomfortable for you".

ahhhhh, thanks Tibro...always the voice of reason  :lol: Be safe in your travels....we'll miss you!!!!!! Hooning around, huh? I need to go look at  your Ozzie threads to see if I can find any slang references  8)

Hey *******.....I see you finally made it.  Nice to have you join us :lol: I would stay and chat but I am doing my last minute packing....I'll be back later.  Just wanted to welcome you.

Hi Mishy!!

Angie:

One more point that I want to make is that our men are usually the
last ones to come to the rescue in cases like this... Don't give him a
hard time about it.  THey always assume:

First,  that we are telling them about these things to make them jealous
and
Second, they expect us to handle our own problems of unwanted advances.  

For what ever reason, and maybe one of the guys know more about it
than I, they don't want to hear about it.

Again, My ex-boyfriend armed me well, in dealing with unwanted advances from "Little Boys" or those much younger...

Too bad that wasn't the first thing out of your mouth as I would imagine
that his concept of women getting weak in the knees at the very sight
would have vanished.

Signed:

Anne Launders.

Latest Jossy/Easy

Nothing to report about the Dutch team of investigators coming out of Aruba at this time and nothing expected over the weekend. Some believe their purpose in Aruba is a mixed one and involves the recent issues of bribery and corruption on the island. More should be learned in the following days and weeks.

DOH! Thanks Carnut...that's what I get for not being on here regularly!! Thanks for clearing that up  :wink:

Indy,

Yes, I believe he was even told he had no room to say anybody else had said something stupid considering the mess he had created with Natalee's disappearance.

I took that as a sort of thinly veiled threat or perhaps letting Paulus know that he does not lead a charmed life and it is only available to him as long as he keeps his mouth shut.  Don't make waves for us Paulus or you can be made to regret it is what I heard in that.

 :?

Hiay Hotshot -- and *******.  You guys are still hero's in my book. It takes a special person to actually come out from behind the keyboard and stand up for what they believe in.  Thank you both.

Hey buddy  :lol:

Thanks Iggy. I know we are all eager to hear something regarding these 10 investigators and their purpose in visiting the island...

Patty, great advice. Men who are secure in their relationship with a woman don't feel the need to show their machismo by confronting another male and feel like the woman can do just fine on her own...

Hope you have a great vacation Hotshot!

Thanks for the update, Igs,

Any shred of information is very appreciated.   And I assume we are talking about the bribery of the million florins that Jossy was talking about in his paper?  I wish it were corruption in the investigation of what happened to Natalee instead.

.

Hi Anna,
Yes I agree, I think the power structure was putting Paulus in his place that day.  I think the message was that PVDS has no more cards to play.

 Hey Indy, Thanks.  I am glad to see someone approves with what I/We did, there is a site out there that is given me a lickin about it.  Sad thing is, one of them even write on this board.

Thanks so much Klaas!!  I'll say Hi to Mickey for you.

Mishy,
Could also be they are just too lazy to get involved,lol!!

Just kidding, guys!

. :D

Disneyworld or Disneyland?

Disneyworld :lol:

Hotshot - well have a great time.  I've never actually been in Disneyworld, only Disneyland.

Have a great time, Hotshot!
 :D  :D  :D  :D

Hey Thanks!  How have you been?  I have missed you lately.  What is the whole crew here?  Wheres Richard?

Kathy have a great vacation.. I hope the weather is nice .

Howdy INdy

Patti.. not hubby is not jealous of a 23 yr old..  not at all.
 He is just a simpleton.. and thinks it all funny.  :roll:  :roll:

Really don't think it's funny, something ought to be done about it.

It's not like it's just your problem, you may not even be the first or the last to be confronted in such a way by the jerk.

Jerk really needs a reality check from someone.

Hots,
I don't think I'm the only one who approved, I think there's a grassroots-groundswell of supporters who are going to haunt the Aruban tourism-spin machine everytime they try to sell their smack here.
I'm curious about who here would find anything wrong with that?

So why does he get to just sit there? Is chastizing all 'the powers that be' can do about it?

Ahh thanks...Goin on Vacation eh?? You score on some tickets at the boston travel show or somethin?? I'M drooling over the scotland brochures myself 8)

Man these monkey's move fast back here I cant keep up..lol

Yo Angie!

I can't and wont mention any names, but let me say, It shocked the hell outta me.

LOL, no I didn't score at the show, plans were made way back in december.  We go every year, and the way things are going here at home, it may be the last year.  So I am going to enjoy every single minute I have while there.  OK, off to pack a bit more.  I'll see you guys a bit later...

  Kid needs bitch slapped IMO  :evil:
 On and BTW,. I figured out how to use my scanner..  had to load additional shit on my pc.  :roll:
  if the day comes you ever have to use VISTA Mr Carnut. please let me know, and what you think about it. Bet you hate it too. dont care how smart anyone is on a PC.. if you dont got it.. you dont know what a true pain in the ass it is.  :(

Angie - what did you have to load?  Just curious.

I'll just say this and let it go, it'd be nice to know and nice to let the other person give their position.  That's the way disagreements are settled.
I sometimes write some stupid responses and stay awake all night worrying about if I offended anyone.  
I think sometimes the friction here among us is just not being on top of our game when making a point.

 Klass I loaded the disc  for the printer.. and it said it wasn't working with VISTA.. sent me a link to a site where I had to load drivers and more software. I did all that..  I scanned a photo.. tat worked ..was gona try to email it for a test.. but NOW its not working with AOL or my dsl addy.
  :evil:  :evil:  :evil:  Says I need a MSN or hotmail addy?  grrrrrrrr
 Figure out one thing., and got another problem.

This meeting where he got "slapped" was about 30 after he lost his case in court where we heard about the wire taps.

Ok..I figured it was something like that.  So you needed to load the software disc that came with your scanner (should have been done by Best Buy) then you had to update the drivers for Vista (should have been done by Best Buy)

checking out friends, be back in the AM to catch up.  Thanks for having me.

Angie - that's probably something in the setup of the software disc you just loaded.  You might be able to go into the software and check in the setting area.

Nite Indy

 Yep.. you got it! They ripped me off IMO  :evil:  I so wanna swear bad right now.. but I am behaving..lol

 

 Night Indy..

Paulus is a rat.  He has made it known he would tell on certain people.  That's why he made that comment "a lot of people would get hurt".  That was his way of saying I got the good on you.

 The disc was loaded a week or so ago for the printer to work..lol
  I re loaded it again.. and it took me to a website to load the drivers and others things for the scanner/copier to work.  
 I guess there is alot of updates to follow up with .. still sucks IMO that this version of windows is out there and its not all up to date.  :evil:

 :shock:  :shock:

 HUH?   :shock:  I am lost now for sure?  WTH?

I don't think it's funny either, Carnut...like I said, I wonder who else he'll expose himself to unwelcomed? It's like a flasher...you don't ask for it...

I'd call the cops and show them the video.  Let them discuss it with him.  Next time it may be a seven year old or who knows?  But he has that video for a reason and I doubt this is the only time he will use it.

.

Anna,

You seem to remember most of the details. I was asking about he 4 AM ATM stop earlier today and the only thing I could find out was that it may have been a fabrication that came out of RU. Is that all it was? In other words, there is no proof of an ATM stop at 4 AM?

Ado

I am lost? so Hotshot is sayimg that someone from here on SM writes on a board?
  WHAT BOARD?

Hi everyone,

Angie, the way modern technology has been treating you lately, it's a wonder you don't pull the plug on all of it and move off to Idaho somewhere where no PC, cellphone, IM, what-have-you can ever hope to trace you down!

Yes, Anna and Tylergal are real good at remember those details from early in the case.  I think the ATM rumor may have been started at RWV though, not RU.

Anna, I know I would wanna do something that would scare the chit out of him to make him think twice about doing that again. He needs to be knocked down a few notches, as Carnut said. He must think he's all that showing people what he has/hasn't got...He needs to learn that responsible adults don't do that kind of stuff anymore and that there are consequences to behavior that is outside of societies social mores. It is anything but funny and certainly not harmless, IMHO. OK, rant over...gotta go get the kids ready for bed, shower, and have some "me" time...I'll try to check in sometime this week...Hugs and prayers for all the monkeys!!! Sleep well and keep the faith!!

Nice signature Dan 8) I was thinking about MD'S Dads post on the FP."The fascinating thing is that there has been someone on Aruba that actually wants Paulus hung for his crimes.."I couldnt help but day dream--Failed judge hung in Oranjestad for his crimes against his country and a american tourist. :twisted:

In all seriousness I think that was a warning that he has gone too far. I think they have a Van Der Sloot file filled with phone records,signed statements,wire taps,real evidence..etc..That was never given to the dutch. The MEP will keep it in a safe spot just in case they ever need to drop the ball on the sloots.

Yep, online flashing would seem to be as much of a crime as 'real' life flashing.

Heck if you can call the cops on the 'stalker girl' you oughta be doing the same for this 'flasher'.

I agree  :wink:

 
Id love to move trust me.
 And what happend tonight was gross beyond belief.
 Its upsetting to me that its a friend of ours son.. who we have known for years.  Thats the sick part. I dont even wanna think about it.. honestly.
  I have been biting my tounge.. and not calling his mom .
 

 I am still ost on what Hotshot posted about someone form here wriing on a board?   I must have mised something?

Ang, Hotshot is saying that someone on this forum disagrees with her visit to the Boston convention center a few weeks ago protesting Aruba's exhibit...

There is also a rumor that some of the MB guys remember seeing PVDS in the vicinity of MickeyD's at aound 4 AM. That, coupled with the Aruban Supreme Court statement and the possible ATM stop, is beginning to take on some weight of attestation. Coming from 3 sources like that, there might be a ring of truth there.

But it is all still just RUMOR, not proven by any means.

I really don't think it was necessary for PVDS to go anywhere near the beach area that night. I think it all went down near the VDS home.

Ah, if killing tourism and giving Aruba a bad name throughout the civilized world isn't enough to drop the ball on the sloots, what is?

Angie - did you say this kid is 23?  Unfortunately, he is an adult in the eyes of the law and so are you.  I actually doubt if you called the cops they would do anything.  Don't get me wrong, what he did was really sick, I just don't think there's alot you can do.  If he's still living with his parents, about the only thing you could do is let them know what he's doing from THEIR home.

Ado,
I will try to recall where that rumor came from but it predates RU and also the taking of statements from the MB kids, it was a very early one.  And supposedly not just one withdrawal but two and the ATM near McDonalds at that.

But from the fauxphotoing , we can see that by July, 2005, they were in full decoy form already.  It may be total fabrication but it was out there before any MB kids said they saw him.

Very odd how absolutely NONE of the video cameras seem to have been working that night and there is no video of anything, isn't it?  I'd fire my security firm for that.  Seriously, by the time Beth got around to asking for videos from all the various places, they had already recorded over or their cameras were mysteriously not working that particular night.

I have always found that odd, how many cameras supposedly did not work.  But Paulus banking records should address this question so we have to assume that ALE knows whether this was true or a decoy.

If I can recall where I first heard that, I will post it but know it was pre RU existence and before MB kids statements were taken.  In other words, true or not, it came from Aruba.

.

 Well that sucks.. Its awesome  that all 5 went there.
 So if someone wants to bitch about it and they post here? Why not have the nads to say it up front?  At keast they went..  how can someone make fun of that?

Angie, count me with those who think you need to tell someone about what he did. That was disturbing.

Is there any chance at all it was meant for your daughters instead of you (not that that makes it any better)?

The powers that be were not chastising Paulus for the sake of decency...it was all done for show.  They know that he holds all the cards still where they are concerned.  He has worked in the secret corners of their judiciary for years.  He knows things about people in the Netherlands as well as Aruba.  No one has a kid that has done the things Joran has done and continues to do without having the "goods" on a lot of people.  An underage boy can not gamble in a casino with a line of credit without the people in power allowing it.  That includes the casino owners and the government.  It goes to the corruption.  

Most people think I believe that the actual demise of Natalee was a complicated thing, but it wasn't.  I have stayed within the simple mindset about her death.  It was the circumstances and subsequent cover up that becomes the problem.  For the truth about what happened to Natalee to come out the world would need to see what other skeletons are buried in Aruba's closets.

Excuse my manners, hello everyone!

I am not sure that there aren't laws against using cellphones for transmission of obscene materials. Just like regular phones.

they get her into the car with a LIE about "oh we also are staying in the hotel, we are just visiting aruba also"   :roll:

go to somewhere, maybe the lighthouse area, or somewhere like that

they rape her, take pictures,  joran had his clothes off including the sneakers,

she passed out from the drugs

they panic... because they gave her the drugs

they bury her, using the sneaker as a GENERAL MARKER

the other sneaker was left in the K2 car, they still have it somewhere

they leave her,,,,  and k2 take the KILLER home

killer gets daddy sloot to help him..

pappa sloot drives to take care of the body...with joran killer at home on computer


it aint rocket science, the lies started too early and had to keep changing
as the story made no sense at every turn

 Yes Klaas.. he is 23.. same age as my daughter,  and an adult.
   and YES my kid has the stalker chicky after him.. alot different to who posted that.
     Alot of things dont bother me.. but this did. So.. once I calm done over it.. i will decide what to do.  His mom is sweet.. and if she sknows he is usig his web cam to send icky stuff.. I can bet she kicks his ass.. not only her.. but his dad.!

Angie
What if this guy starts doing this stuff with young boys?   Him being an adult, I would email him and tell him that you saved the video and he's now on notice that if you ever have any more problems with him...it's gonna be the police at his  door next time.


What is it with you?  Do you just attract weirdos? (Angie knows what I mean by this and it won't make her mad, trust me.  :wink: )

Sister Lalas - I agree with putting him on notice. He is an adult and should be responsible for his own actions. He needs to know that Angie isn't going to tolerate such behavior.

I think those who are corrupt are making just as much money without tourism and care far more about their own hides than the good of the island,  In my most humble opinion, naming names and crimes and bribes of members of MEP would be considered a far more serious misdeed in their eyes, things for which people could be fined and serve jail terms and such as that.  He is pretty safe since Aruba conveniently doesn't have in place any anti-corruption laws but in their stead those of Holland should apply.

If he were to name a few names, I would be all kinds of "real" evidence would start to surface.  Paulus will be very, very quiet if he is smart.

.

beech story was a LOAD of horse manure

Lala's I agree.  I have kept it simple on how Natalee died.  It was murder at the "hands" of Joran.  You are correct that it was everything that happened afterwards that made it big.

 
It may have been meant for my daughter or step daughter? I dunno?
  He dont have either one of their IM's since they bno longer reside here.
 They have mine. his mom and dad both ..and my hubbys.
Yes it was diturbing. I am sick anyhow.. and to have my firends son flash  his peep.. it was a web cam.. all real time. the dancing was funny.. but then the peep shot.. I saw that and clciked off.. and scolded him.
 I probaly shouldnt have posted  about it to begin with.

I agree that it was something similar to this but think at some point Natalee was at the Sloot residence.  But yeah, basically, that's what happened.

 :evil:

I remember reading about the ATM withdrawls as well back at RWV. The rumor was he used the ATM two times I beleave. I always wondered about Fransisco the witness who said he helped bury natalee and was locked up in a mental institute. Art said last week that his friends said he isnt crazy.Several stories came out about that night behind the Mariott involving two others. Either way hitting the ATM after 2.30 AM is suspicious. I certainly dont beleave for a minute that Joran won that much cash from a free tournament of texas hold em.

I never have seen one lick of proof of ATM transactions but we havent seen anything of substance from the investigation except for some bogus internet chat. Even the damn computer was tampered with.

I believe IF Natalee was ever at the beach, she was no longer alive.  They may have gone near the FH and disposed of her body temporarily in that area.  I think PVDS arranged to have it taken care of.  No body no case.

yepper
brought to the sloot hell hole thats why JERK MAN went and googled drugs and alcohol or somethign like that

I agree Klaas.

At this point in time all the lies that we have heard are for Paulus and Joran because I believe someone saw Paulus that night.

 No I am not mad at all  ROFL    :wink:
 BT and Lalas .. I will handle it. trust me.  
 If MY son did this crap to a freind of mines mom...  Id want to know.
   I wanna drop it.. I love you guys,, but.. it makes me sick to think about.  :(     If The kids face wasnt in the video.. I wouldnt think it was him.. but it was.. and.. web cam? Never had one., dont want one.

Well, at least your IM Video works with Vista.

hehehehehehehehehhehe 8)

Carnut, lol  :lol:

Welcome!  Glad you are here.

Concerning the ATM.  The only mention we have of two trips any place near an ATM was Paulus' two trips to the bank to deposit money.  There is always some smidgen of truth to the lies.

 I agree too.. IMO she was at the Sloot dump  :(

Angie
Are you feeling any better?  Did you get any sleep?

hell hole  8)

 

Oh yeah..  real fuc*ing funny ha ha ha.
 It was over AOL .. AIM .. Vista dont have crap to do with that at all.  :evil:   I shoulfdhave just STFU about it all.  Its sick.. period.

<------------not laughing any more


we love Angie  8)

I'm sorry to see you so upset Angie.  We love you.  Hugs to you!!

 A little bit Lalas to both.  I was a slug in bed all morning and part of the afternoon .  lol
 Hope all is wel with you.. and you beat that icky weather there.

Hi Monkeys,

Keep up the Good Works

Think I have the flu but not sure as body always hurts like the flu with Fibromyalgia so it's hard to know... remember when the words "head colds" were used?

Am 40 pages behind in my reading here and haven't checked my email... so know I'm not up to par.. just checking in to say hi and I miss you.

Love, IBE

look, i will do some stupid robot tricks

or tell some stupid robot jokes


 8)

Sorry to keep bringing up questions on items you've probably already covered, but her I come with two more.
How long would it take to drive from the Sloot place to this ATM?
What size shoes does Paulus wear?

Thanks,
Ado :?  :?

or then again maybe i wont, and then everyone will be happy  8)

I thought about you today and wondered if you were any better.  It takes time to kick that stuff.

Robots you are usually a pretty good egg.  Did you put your foot in your mouth this time or what?

I am fine.. upset yes. It s ok. I am a big girl and can handle it. :)
 Otherwise my butt would have signed off by now  :wink:

Just wanted to say hello to you, Tibro, and no "hooning" around.  Take care of yourself.  I have enjoyed reading about Australia.  Do you need any taxpaying citizens?  Some of us might be planning a leap across the pond in the next 2-3.

Angie-you have a heart of gold.  You've always been a good, caring monkey.

 Ado
 We have went over the shoes in the past?  IIRC it was a 10 1/2?
 Someone correct me if I wrong?  The shoe thingy was alot of topic on here!!  :)

IBE - I'm sorry you're feeling so badly, and I hope you feel better soon. Please take care.

PVDS shoe size = we don't know but my guess is 10.5

McDonalds and ATM - my guess is around 5-10 minutes depending on traffic.

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/arubamaphomes2.jpg)

hi muffy
naw,, i was just laughing at something carnut said,,, he was teasing angie

but she got mad, so im playing peacemaker
 8)

HUGS to you IBE - sorry you aren't feeling well.

youre tough  8)

Okay.  I like it when we all play nice :D  :D  :D

Speaking of Vista and IM...is there a fix for Yahoo IM that doesn't work with Vista?  Kid is having fits with hers. You were right Angie.

San, I hope it is not much work, although I am sure your insurance company would cover most of it if it was, it still is a lot to go through.  One thing calls for another.  Remember that leak I had from my roof last year, and they fixed it and they painted the great room, and then I realized that it made the rest of the house look crappy, so I just went about redoing the rest of it on my own dime.  DH was not happy but at least the roof is not leaking --- for now, anyway. :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

im a  good robot

most of the time

Hmmm.  When I bought my puter in November, I got a free upgrade for Vista, but have never installed it.  I've been waiting to see if any bugs shake out first.  Then, my son tells me there are puters such as mine that would just barely support vista.  So, I guess I will wait and see.

http://messenger.yahoo.com/windowsvista.php

Coming soon! Enter your email address below and we'll notify you as soon as Yahoo! Messenger for Windows Vista is ready. Note: Our current version 8.1 is compatible with Windows Vista.

Angie, good Lord, it just never ends.  I am so sorry about that problem with your vocal cords.  I read that you were having problems, but I thought it was just sinus related.  I hope you are not smoking.  If so, please try to quit.  I know how hard it is, but this will help.  Now, I did not mean to lecture you.  I just want you to take care of yourself.

You should never upgrade an existing system to Vista.

The only way to get Vista is when it comes with a new computer and you have not other choice.

Course, Ubuntu Linux solves the whole problem.

Paulus has a swope.  I wonder if it flies when he drives with the windows down and if so, does Anita find it sensual.

Thanks. Just sent her the link.

I bet they warned Paulus this would happen and to just sit there and be quiet.  This meant nothing to him.

What she should do is download version 8.1 then sign up on the email list for their new version that will be only for Vista.  But they are saying 8.1 does work with Vista now.

 Thanks Muffy Sweety..
 last night I made a bad typo and said night Mussy Bee   :lol:   :oops:

I agree again.  That's twice tonight :wink:

Night monkeys. (http://bestsmileys.com/dental/2.gif)

Sweet dreams everyone.  :smt058

Could it be, unlikely as it sounds that it is Paulus who wears the size 14 shoe and Joran the 10.5 as verified by the Dutch interrogators?

Could J2k have been parked at the RacquetClub as witnessed by the gardener while trying to figure out a way to dispose of Natalee in the muck in the pond and that is where Joran lost his shoes?  Is that why the Kalpoe car had to be washed out immediately?

Did they call and were they waiting for Paulus to pick up Joran and Natalee from there instead of at McDonalds?

Anything is possible.

.

I am just reading this and perhaps Anna has already answered by now, but RU was not even up and running at that time and I have never been able to find anything that reconciled the 4 a.m. ATM except what some Arubans who were posting on some boards at the time told us.  Maybe Anna has better information and will post, but that is all I know and I think you and I have posted on the same boards in the past -- no?

WAIT - did you ever hear more about the 911 operator's husband?

  LOl Robots..
 YES I am..  I can be nice and can be a total bitch if need be.  :twisted:
I prefer to be NICE.. I  do NOT like to argue with anyone.

Yes, I believe that rumor popped up about Mickey D and the MB guys about the time of the walnut salad that Paulus had bought for Natalee that was on the Snoots kitchen table, right?

It's possible, unlikely but possible.

Ah, Anna had already answered, and yes that is my same recollection.

Yep, Waldorf salad.  Had forgotten that as well.

.

They interviewed the sheriff on TV. He said the husband threatened to commit suicide. The sheriff, the man's sister, and his doctor went to the house - that's what all the hoo ha was about. The husband left with his doctor and that's the last anyone has heard about him. Apparently he said he was depressed because he was fired from his job and also because he says he doesn't know where his wife is.  :roll:

I totally agree with everything you have said.

The only time I heard someone mention the ATM transaction on TV was when Geraldo Rivera was a guest on the show The View.  Geraldo would have to know something to mention it.

  Darn it. BT..  you leave yet? Any news  that you have heard?
 Easy/Jossy  ?

Strange thing is, McDonalds was supposed to have closed early since it was Sunday night.  Also yet another case of the missing video.

Not one camera working or the ALE did not ask for video tapes pronto as that might constitute real evidence and that is always harder for them to make disappear.

Not much harder, however, just a little bit.

.

I think that since the Patriot Act and 911, there are boundries and I think our law enforcement keeps an eye out for unsolicited porno.  Do you recall the teacher who was convicted because it was on her computer and it was one of those things that could have happened to any of us.  I have clicked many porn sites since Natalee disappeared, somehing I had never done before, and now I am constantly barraged the garbage as a result.  Yes, I think law enforcement takes a dim view of unsolicited porno, wherever the transmission originated, but to an unsolicited person.

i know wimmmmmmens pretty well  8)
Meredith Brooks performs a song that can help men figure em out  8)  

most wimmmmmens are cool even when they get a little cranky


youre tough, tough is good
be tough

no sheep allowed  :wink:

No news at all Ang. Last night Easy said he had emailed Jossy and was waiting on a reply. I haven't heard from Easy today, so I don't think Jossy has had much to say about the investigators.  :(

  San,
  You are right.. cone to think of it. I watched  when Geraldo said  that about the ATM.. and ddin;t he say something then as well about videos?

Night BT. Smoochies!

   :wink:  Robots..  :)
  yes we wimmmmmens get cranky at times   :)
 I am not skeery. honest.

I have thought that could be the case.  They had a passed out Natalee and then realized they couldn't wake her up.  She may not have been dead, but was close.  Then when Paulus got there and found out what happened he sent the K2 to clean the car and took Joran and Natalee off.

 

Thanks  BT..   been checking his site out.. thought maybe you had some scoop   :wink:   Hope we hear some news soon!

I think this really happened and I think there were Arubans who saw either the deposit slips or video cam from that time and strangely enough that camera was not working by the time we heard of it.  I take "camera not working" chit with a grain of salt.  I think he made the deposits and I think he was caught by deposit slips and the lady who worked at the bank who died recently was the one who was aware of it and perhaps a witness, and Paulus went to the bank (maybe twice) the following day to see her, talk with her, make a deposit.  Why?  Why did he not wait in line for the next teller instead of insisting on seeing her and what did she die from?

I hope we hear something soon too, Angie. Maybe if Jossy does know anything about the investigation he isn't able to talk about it yet.

My understanding is that it is within a mile of the Sloot house and as far as the shoe size, we have been trying to figure that out for a long time, maybe a 10-1/2 or a 14.

In this photo from Joran's release, look at the size of Anita's foot next to Joran's.  Either Anita has an exceptionally large foot or Joran's isn't a size 14.  Anna - you could be right on!!!

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/feetcompare.jpg)

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Feetcompare2.jpg)

yes, at times  :wink:
i dont find you skerrrrrrrrrry at all,  :wink:


men and women are just differnet, not any better not any worse
just different
i like it that way, although some organizations try to make us all the same

i wont go off on a rant here... but maybe in another thread sometime
but the cold hard facts are we all need each other and thats the bottom line  8)

:smt045  Took her to the Sloot residence.

.

I don't remember anything about the videos.  I only remember that the board lit up when he mentioned that.  He said he hoped that Paulus would sue him so he could question him in court about the ATM transactions he made that night.

True BT,,  Thanks.. keep us posted :)

i thought we thought ANITA had sasquatch feet



 :smt005

yep

Think the dutch interrogator already pointed out JVDS was wearing a 10.5. during his interview.

Nite All. Going to hit the sack.

Thanks for the responses to my ATM related questions.
I have some ideas on what I think may have gone on that night, but still am looking for more information and don't want to throw my scenario out here yet until I have my puzzle pieces gathered.

I'll just thow this out for now and check for opinions in the morning. Who would Joran be covering for by claiming he wore size 14 shoes? Who wears a size 14?

Ado

[quote="robots i dont find you skerrrrrrrrrry at all,  :wink:


men and women are just differnet, not any better not any worse
just different
i like it that way, although some organizations try to make us all the same

i wont go off on a rant here... but maybe in another thread sometime
but the cold hard facts are we all need each other and thats the bottom line  8)[/quote]

 I agree 100% Robots!  :)   No time to argue with folks. !!

We are wondering if PVDS wears a 14.

Nite!

Tyler I agree.  I believe the bank transactions are one of many things that the ALE has on Paulus.  The transaction and the video are big.

The lady at the bank died from Paulitious.  It's called fear of drowning from a sweaty man.

Geraldo and his brother seemed to be digging up some pretty good stuff in Aurba and were called off the case.  Greta who seems to be Roger Ailes' favorite adversial commentator got it all hook, line and sinker and soon Geraldo was sent off to Fox-local and now Geraldo is back but does not seem to have exclusives on anything --- the prodigal attorney, Greta, seems to get it all.

I have three 6 ft plus sons and those are not Size 14 shoes just as his foot was close to the size of Greta's who is absolutely tiny, maybe not five feet tall.   I would guess her shoe size to be maybe a five tops.  That would mean his foot would have to be almost three times the size of hers and yet they appear the same size.

Some of it is camera angle distortion but that is not enough to account for it all.  

But then I see little heads on tables, too.  

 :smt036  :smt036  :smt036

Thought if he could get her to eat something, she might be OK.  Tried to feed her that Waldorf salad, big mistake.

.

10.5 next to a size 5

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/compareshoe.jpg)

Anita must have pretty large feet.  Judging by this picture looks like Joran may not have a size 14.  

Carnut - yes we know the Dutch interrigators pointed out the 10.5 but Joran still insisted he wore a 14.

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Feetcompare2.jpg)

Klaas in that photo you posted Anita is in front of Joran so you really can't tell if he has big feet or not.  At least I can't tell.

Angie,  I am seeing this a different way.  I think this 'kid' has a problem and he is a flasher or worse.   I would contact the police if you still have the video.  Show it to them, and let them handle it.  He could be sending it to 13 year girls too.  His parents should be alerted, but I would let the police do this.  He is a pervert in my eyes.

I am afraid that it is Anita who has big, huge, ugly boats. It is not really possible to make the comparison and gauge what Joran wears from that. I don't think 14's for him are out of the question.

so, where did the size 14 .5 come from ???


hmmmmmmmmmmmm  8)

From what I remember Geraldo and his brother had some good sources in Aruba.  I remember hearing him say from a reliable source and it wasn't Jossy.

I am 5 9 1/2 and wear a size 10 to 11 in a chicky shoe.

im 5 9 and wear size 9.5  8)

I would guess anita is about a size 9 shoe.  She has the body surface area for that, but then that is not always the way it works.  However, most women of that stature have big feet.  If she has big feet and Paulus has big feet, then it would stand to reason, the Sporter might have big feet.  His feet do look cramped in those shoes.

Anyone can wear a smaller size if they want to.  I wear a 6-1/2 and my friend told me when I was in a beauty pageant that my feet were too big in my swim suit for the size of my body, so she forced me to wear her 4's.  My feet were almost paralyzed by crowning time.  :lol:  :lol:

It was a size 14, and Dompig announced when they were draining the pond area that they were looking for a pair of size 14 k-swiss.  That Joran had left them behind or lost them.  It was like a big announcement in Aruba they even put up posters so people would be on the lookout.

AZ  TY for your advice.

OMG Tyler this is so funny.

OK, now imagine how much larger a Size 14 would have to be.  Would take a fun house mirror to distort that much.

Joran has small feet for his height.  Note the proportion of foot to ankle/knee for a gauge.  

.

GAH!  Now I'm gonna have nightmare's after looking at I-Need-A Van der Snoot so close to bedtime.   :shock:  :shock:

exactly ! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i knew you knew it, i was just wondering who might have fallen asleep on the job  :lol:

 8)

I always thought that the size of your shoe would correspond to the size of your structure... tall people, long shoes, etc.

My son is 6'6" and wears size 15

However, my ex-boyfriend is 6'4" or better, is a much bigger man
structurally and wears size 10.

I've come to the conclusion that foot size has nothing to do with body size.

Besides, 10 1/2 is plenty big.

lol  My hubby is the same height and wears the same size shoe too.

My hubbie is 6'2 and wears an 11 1/2 or 12.  His step son is 6 5 and wears a 12 1/2 or 13.  No way there is a 14 in this group unless it is paulas.  how tall is Paulas? Maybe it is Anita that wears a 14!  Oh my gosh...whole new picture!!

And that's because 'they' all knew that any missing shoes that might be found, were not gonna be size 14.

I remember all the shoe/shoe size discussions.  Shoes are such an issue with this case.  And how is this significant?  What is Joran's REAL shoe size?  I mean, couldn't someone get one of those shoe sizer thingys and measure it?  Is the shoe thing a red herring?  Makes me wonder if he kicked or stamped on Natalee, leaving footprints :evil:

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Nite San

 :lol:  :lol:

I remember it as Chief Roy Tromp who made the shoe announcement.  But Joran is not stupid--wait, yes he is!  But he still said a different size than he wore so if the shoe was found, they would discard it saying it was the wrong size and not likely test for DNA evidence.

 Night San  :)

whoops meant my husband's son wears a 12 1/2 or so.  

Yep it is Anita... flop flop flop flop :lol:  :lol:

im not sure if i mentioned this, but once when i was a little robots

i tried to convince my mother that i should be able to wear my
SKI BOOTS to school,,just thinking about this makes me laugh 8)

anyone that knows anything about ski boots knows that about 30 years ago they were very heavy and laced up,,no buckles and they were heavy
i think i was 7 years old...after much trying to convince my mother about how i should be able to wear them she finally said
"well, if you want to wear them to school, go ahead"

so, i got on the bus with my ski boots and almost tripped going up the bus steps... these shoes are ridiculous, they are heavy and awkward and just plain uncmortable especially getting on buses and off buses
not to mention walking in class with these things on

...needless to say it was a HUGE MISTAKE on my part to wear them

at age 7 i was walking around school like a robot

and im always reminded about the ski boot FIASCO

 :x

Robots-did you get blisters from wearing those ski boots to school?  You must have had some sore legs that night...

 :shock:

Yes a dutch interrogator did check JVDS shoes in an interview and said that 10.5 appeared to fit him ok.

So, if as some think shoes are a concern in the case, then maybe they do contain something that can be traced to Nat and maybe they are in the possession of some interested parties, in the event that they are needed for some reason.

My son is 6 ft 3.. wears a 13 shoe.. and weighs 165.

I heard that Paulus was in jail and borrowed a pair of size 14 shoes
because he thought that the investigator, fresh from Holland, would
ask him his shoe size.  That's where the size 14 came in.

Later, on another day, that same investigator was the one that
determined that a size 10.5 fit him well as he asked him to take
the shoe off and examined it and the fit.

How tall is Joran?

My tallest son wears the smallest shoe and a narrower one as well.  Height does not always translate into foot size.

The Dutch interrogator verified Joran was wearing a 10.5 and not complaining.

Yes, odds were that no one would find a Size 14 so no need to check for evidence.  Also I think Joran wanted to keep the shoes he was wearing or had Deepak retrieve or that Deepak had in his possession.

Then again, maybe the whole shoe is yet another red herring?

my feet were bleeding when i got home  :x


 :shock:

my mother was wise... she probably had enough of me "CONVINCING her what a great idea it was

some times parents need to let kids learn some things themselves

So, ya'll believe there is some incriminating evidence on the shoes, such as maybe Natalee's DNA?  Oh.  I remember when one of the pond's was supposed to be drained to look for a shoe :(

I really hate to do this, but I am intrigued by the injection of Waldorf Salad into the picture, and tonight is the first I've heard about it.

What's the story on it? Where did we hear about it?

Or... maybe I have it backwards.  There was an article about it as Jossy
thought that it was funny that Joran would say that he went to jail without
any shoes.

Don't remember where I read it....

so, when paulus put Natalee in the septic tank
that is where he lost his shoes

But if memory serves me, the pond draining seemed to be a way of taking attention away from the dump search.  Anyone remember that?

Ah yes, the Granny Toad theory

  ROFLMAO  ROBOTS! TY for a much needed laugh!
  I used to snow ski.. and walking in ski boots was hard!. They dont bend!
 I can see now why you  walked like a robot  :wink:

yep, at age 7 i was a genuis in my own mind  8)  :lol:

From Joran's June 14, 2005 statement:
http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=184


{snipped}

told Deepak that I left my shoes at the Marriot Hotel. Deepak told me not to worry that he would go back the next day and pick them up for me. I had left a pair of white and blue shoes of the make "K-Swiss", size "14" on the beach. These shoes I bought in the USA.

Paulus or Joran?  who borrowed the shoes?

I read two diffrent articles on the dutch measuring his feet and the other time they felt to make sure his feet fit the shoe. Both times stated his feet were 10.5

Somebody is lying there ass off about the size of his feet. Thats a big discrepency from 10.5 to size 14.

And they sent the ditzy Greta to do the job of an investigational journalist.  Roger Ailes should be ... San, where's your gun?   :lol:  :lol:

I am with you msmarple...I have never heard anything about this (that I remember) :oops:

I agree *******

he figured one of two things

they would look for a size 14 and of course they wouldnt find a size 14
with any of his DNA on them

cause they dont EXIST

if they find a size 10......they would not test

sorry JORAN you pig

i hate you

BINGO !

My DH got an e-mail from someone in Aruba very early on saying there was a shoe with Natalee's blood on it and that it took place at the HI.

The salad story is a new one on me as well.

 

 Yep Muffy.  !
   Sure hope these 10 investigators that went to Aruba are up to something good. IMO .. it does not take 10 people to close a case as some have speculted thats what may be happening. Something  else  IMO has to be going on, but thats just my feelings.
  Hope we hear some news  soon.

I still think that there might be something to this witness that has been
discredited and deported to Columbia.

He said that he had taken a couple things, after witnessing a rape and
murder.  He said that the man that had raped and killed this girl was
in the process of disposing of her body, when he took a couple things.

The more I think about it the more it seems logical that he might have
taken a shoe or two.  Why?   Because the man would be at a disadvantage without shoes to protect his feet.

There has to be  a reason for all the questions posed by the investigators
about shoes, and shoe size.  Maybe they were trying to tie Joran in with
the shoes.  Why else would it matter if he were barefoot or not.  This is
Aruba... warm most the time.... I'm sure that people walk barefoot some-
times and people think nothing of it.

My DH wears size 10 1/2 shoes and he's short compared to Joran. Anita has a large foot.  I wear a size 8 and my foot looks small.  Her foot is more like a 9 or even a 10.  Why don't they just measure those feet?  It is not that hard to find out if he wears a 14.  Maybe the shoes belonged to some big fat guy...let's see who could that be?  Koen?  Steve Croes?  The one that helped may have lost the shoe and they said it was Joran's as a cover.  Well, maybe that's a bit over the top...I will slink off to the corner for a bit.

Hi, *******,
Do you remember me from RWV?  I was Anna there and sometimes IMHO~Anna.  We have posted at the same sites for a very long time, no?   :D

You are exactly right, the Dutch interrogator measured the feet to the Size 10.5 fitting, etc. and firmly established that he did in fact wear a Size 10.5.  

I am sure if his shoes were four sizes too small, Joran would not hesitate to complain long and loud.  Not one to exactly suffer in silence that I can see.

I don't know why some continue to insist he wears a different size just because he says so.  I mean, it's not as though the boy never lies about anything and he just lied about the shoe size as well.

.

Could it be some kind of a fad with these peeps to wear shoes that are bigger than they need to be? Like maybe it will attract girls somehow that they are supposed to have big feet?

There was a, ahem, "theory" about that posed a while back. Not wanting to open that exact line of thought up too much...  :roll: but could there have been a reason WHY Joran wanted to wear big floppy shoes?

A dutch interrogator did check the size show JVDS was wearing in an interview, it was 10.5.

I think it was a cistern, which is like an underground water collection/storage, instead of a septic tank that some believe Natalee was put into on the Sloots property.  (You know the place.  The one that was supposedly searched, and then we found they only searched a small part of it.  Which is the same one that Paulus wouldn't let Equisearch check out.  Uh-huh...)

That's what I was thinking, Lala's.  I wonder who wore a size 14.  It might be they are sending signals to someone involved by mentioning the size "14."  I would like to know who that someone is.  The size 14 is not as much a red herring as it is a message to someone to shut up (the owner of the size 14).

What I mean is that if the man from Columbia had been seen and the
rapist had decided to take chase... wouldn't a man with shoes on his feet
be at a big, big advantage over a man without shoes.  Especially if it were
at an area that is similar to the rock area where there is a lot of brush and
rocky terrain.

Well, it has always been hypothesized that if you wore a big shoe, you would not need Viagra, so I suppose this could be a part of the bragadocious size 14.

You are posted what I was thinking, SB.  Maybe Joran does have small feet for his height.  I always heard big feet, big**** :)   So, with Joran, that would be small feet, small****.  Maybe that's why he was mean and abusive to Natalee as a female.  Dunno  Maybe he had a complex, sota speak

Yes, he did, Carnut.  Firmly established that Joran was most comfortably wearing a 10.5 shoe size in jail.

And since he played tennis, I don't think he could wear lose fitting shoes without getting blisters especially on the bottoms of toes.

.

i still say abandoned septic tank

they can be opened in 5 minutes very easily, as many have handles (2)

in case people dont know much about them

picture a man hole cover, and there is a holding tank usually made of concrete or cement holding several hundred gallons of water
 

easy and quick

Yep - TES was only able to search from the next door neighbors side.  PVDS would not allow TES on his property.

Let's say you are right...how do find this witness now?  Is he still alive?  How would anyone know?

I know what you mean.  My house is still on a septic.  I just thought the place that was discussed about the Sloots was a cistern.   Granny Toad from RWV had some interesting theories about it

Except this man didn't even come forward until approx a year later.   :wink:

 

 LOL SB  :wink:  I think I know where you are going with this.
 I dunno if anyone ever came to a real conclusion about the shoes.
  IMO thery are out there.. but where? who has them? Or even one shoe for that matter?  Kalpoes perhaps?   This shoe thingy had always been a mystery.

yep, sloots is a CESSPOOL,,, well at least most of the family is  8)  :twisted:

mine is also a septic system because i live in the sticks  8)  :wink:

I don't have a theory about the shoes, but I am pretty sure JVDS somehow lost/left behind a pair of shoes that night, and it is significant.

The following is from DK's 06/13/2005 statement, which he signed. There had been several references to JVDS mentioning being barefoot, retrieving shoes, etc.

But this is the part that sounds very "real" to me, like a genuine slip-up. DK is describing the entourage going to the HI after the driveway meeting.

What was the name of the bouncer who eviscerated himself in a cave after taking cocaine?   Was he not a big man!

Red posted this back in July 2006:

(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a118/kath8700/aruba164.jpg)

Yup, Red was there. As a matter of a fact ... Red took this picture.

The Search of Paul VDS’s neighbor’s property, Part II
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/08/04/pictures-from-august-04-2005/

They searched (Joe Huston) with Vision Stick

What is important to remember there was a sewer (which you are looking at here) and a water resevoir that was loacated.


This is the search of the well/water resevoir on neighbors property:

Texas EquuSearch Returns for further inspection of VDS’s Neighbors Property

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/08/02/pictures-from-the-reservoir/


Here is the post on the rest of the search that was done on the neighbor's property.

The one that should have been done on the VDS property.

EquuSearch searches Neighbor’s Property Next To Van Der Sloot House

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/08/02/van-der-sloot-house/

WELL, for one thing... if the investigators had, indeed, been questioning
Joran based on this eye-witness statements, then there would have to be a record of it, wouldn't there?  Under normal circumstances there would
be anyway.  Maybe it's in that box of stuff that was sent to Holland.

The one thing that I don't like about their witness statements is that it
doesn't include the investigators questions.  I think that if that were
included, we could have a better indication why he continually says things
in his statements like, "she wanted me to have sex with her, but I didn't
have a condom"... the mentioning of NOT having a condom, may be an
indication that the officer was questioning him about a condom as well.

I don't think Pitbull was as tall as Joran.  He was stockier, IMO

Evening Monkeys. Here to offer my opinion about Jorans shoe size. I think it is most likely that he does wear a size 14. My husband is 6'3" and wears a 13. My daughter is 5'9" and at 16 wears a girls 10.5. I think it would be anatomically disproportionally small for someone Jorans size to wear a 10.5 size shoe JMHO. 8)



(http://lambiek.net/artists/t/taras_martin/taras_babyhuey.jpg)

Hi, *******,
Do you remember me from RWV? I was Anna there and sometimes IMHO~Anna. We have posted at the same sites for a very long time, no?  


I do remember you..lol..Many people here I recognize from  RWV way back early in this nightmare. Boy did Dan Hate SM!! He went bonkers when the paypal link went up here..

I have never heard this to be the case. Is anyone else aware that Pitbull eviscerated himself? Then who cut of his legs, who cut off his privates, nailed him to a board and then set him on fire?

I knew what Muffy was saying... but there was no body to compare the
imprints with... there had to be another reason why those shoes were
so important.

O/T

Patti/Klaas? Do you have a "clean" avatar for Patti? If so, could you post it, please? TIA!

Typical arubacide.

The Arubans told us he killed himself with an overdose, do you not remember that and later we found that he had been amputated, eviscerated and and sat on fire?  It was a play on words; however, I guess I did not make myself clear enough.

Were you there the night he got the photographs?  The night he went bonkers over Red going to Aruba?  What a self-absorbed small person.

... and crucified ....

How tall is Joran, anyway? My son is 6ft 2in and wears a size 14 shoe. (He'd be a lot taller if so much of him weren't turned in-under).  :wink:

John wears a 10 and is only 5ft 10in.

I believe the article about the Dutch Interrogator verifying the shoe size as 10.5 appeared in Diario, was one of those first published there.

Klaas may remember exactly but it was very specific and the interrogator measured the foot as well just as ******* said.

I wonder why no more PV statements have been released.

.

Yes, and went on an anti-TES thing. That's when I stopped reading there. (I had never heard of TES at the time. But Dan's jealousy was palpable.)

I'm glad you said that Anna. The shoes are such an important component to this case: Joran has said that in so many ways!

I have always wanted to know if anyone measured his foot, and what size it was.

So - no one is going to explain the Waldorf Salad thingie?  :?

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/thWAVING120.gif)

He was into multitasking?

.

Waldorf Salad? Boy, I've missed something! What's the question?

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/joranshoes.jpg)

Oh, you are SO good! Thx, Klaas!!!!

msmarple - I'm lost with the Waldorf Salad too

Gonna call it a night. Y'all are posting SOOOOO fast! Been hard to keep up for about a week now with Monkeys posting from everywhere.

I realize no one is talking in Aruba..But I would like to hear from Pitbull's family. They went public because they were unhappy..Then the ALE came out with the suicide/drug overdose theory and we havent heard anything since. Except for the bar that he worked at burned down :shock: ..

Well, for me the real bonkers will always be his writing that front page article claiming that me, Frank and Seedyrum killed Natalee!  He later did a follow up one on me alone, too.  It's sort of funny now but at the time, since I couldn't post anything to defend myself, I really was upset for a bit.  Got over it.  Eventually.  Sort of.  I guess.

 :roll:

 

Maybe they had VISTA and their message got f'd up ?

I think Anna and I have said all we know about it.  In a post by an Aruban it was just asked about of Paulus and Joran and the poster was supposedly one of the kids who attended school with Joran, and he was not wont to answer questions, but just post things such as that.

I think that is the same one who told us about Joran sleeping in the aisles all day, about having scratches and the teacher taking pictures of them and Joran had the scratches in said picture.

:lol:  :lol:

 '


 Night SB and sweet dreams

Isn't it GRAND!  :smt041
It used to be even faster! Then you had to BEG folks to catch you up!  :lol:

Nite sb! Sleep well!

Yes, it was first published in Diario but we have that exact statement now posted here.  Remember when Diario published that we didn't have any of the suspect or witness statements.  I think Getagrip has the translation of that Diario article - I'll go find it.

Yep - scroll down for the article from Diario:

http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/

Even Deepak urged people to ask Joran what happened to his shoes!!!

(That should tell us something)

Well heck, what about the 2 TV connected folks who committed arubacide shortly after the DeVries special?

Heck, I'm sure it was just coincedental, but in aruba how do you know?

 :wink:  Tyler sweety !

I think I recall reading that he is 6'4"

Goodnight, Sb.  Angie, I hope you will try and get some rest.  The body heals when we are resting, it rejuvenates and good cells replace the bad ones, or something like that.  I can't find out all about it right now because I am not going to wake up a sleeping dog.  My grandmother always warned me to let a sleeping dog lie.  Sometimes it's a bear when it is awakened in the middle of the night.

Yup I heard all his bitching..He was very jealous..It is a shame as he did such a great job at the beginning. He was very hatefull of TES and I think that had to do with Red and Tom's relationship with them. I had enough after he posted his "Died of a orgasm threory"  :roll:

Excerpt:

Now, the question is: was Joran brought from the first day to KIA shoeless and had no shoes to wear that it was a fellow prisoner who had to lend Joran a pair of running shoes?

Van der Sloot’s parents couldn’t bring shoes for Joran to wear, and someone from the prison had to lend him some shoes, and to top it all off they were K-Swiss brand?

By the way, at KIA they have to register, as in the majority of prisons around the world, what shoes and other belongings each person comes in with, yes or no? On August 8, 2005, the same Dutch police officer asked Joran to take off his shoe, which was a K-Swiss brand running shoe.

Joran asked to see his lawyer and wanted to find his lawyer’s support, but his lawyer didn’t even look at Joran and started to write (in local dialect, you deal with your problems!) After the Dutch police officer insisted, Joran took off the running shoe and handed it over across the table.

The police officer asked Joran how in the supposed day that he was with Natalee on the beach, he had size 14 K-Swiss running shoes, then how was the one that Joran put on the table size 10.5?

After Joran put his running shoe back on, the police pressed on the tip of the running shoes, and observed that the shoes were a good fit on Joran, and Joran didn’t react!

The matter of the size 14 K-Swiss running shoes is ‘too good to be true’. Was it the shark that Natalee supposedly wanted to see at the North shore that left with Joran van der Sloot’s size 14 running shoes?

----------

So the 10.5 fit Joran nicely no matter whose husband/brother/uncle/nephew wears what size.

Joran wears a Size 10.5.

.

Yep, that's what did it for me  :roll:

 Night Tyler  :)  Hugs  and great to see you back posting!

 that theory was gross.. :(

*******,
Do you remember Selena?  I keep hoping she will surface again.  She was a wonderful researcher and the one who uncovered the Posner presence in Aruba.

Dan had some tremendous posters but started eliminating any he suspected might be smarter than he was or had more education like Professor and others.  He couldn't stand to be called on anything no matter what he posted late at night and deleted.

. :roll:

But I think it was his posters and not Dan that made that such a really good blog in the beginning of this investigation.  And then Dan lost his mind.  That pretty well brought things to a screeching halt.

.

Coincidently that was the same time and reason I left there.

And I was "banned for life"  :roll: like when I'm 80 years old I would be trying to post there.

Excerp:

The police officer asked Joran how in the supposed day that he was with Natalee on the beach, he had size 14 K-Swiss running shoes, then how was the one that Joran put on the table size 10.5?

____________

Joran must have lied in his earlier statement about what size shoe he
wore and subsequently lost the night that Natalee went missing.

Maybe they had a size 10.5 in their possession, and, when asked about
it earlier he said that it couldn't be his shoe because he wears size 14?

That's kinda what it sounds like to me....

I vaguely remember somethin about that. Thats crazy!!! What happened to seedyrum? I know he didnt like seedy at all. I think alot had to do with his jealousy. He was losin it big time as I also felt his wrath..lol

Has anyone seen Dan's reaction to the FP article here about that photo being shopped that is on the FP right now?

I assume he has seen it by now.  I wonder what he had to say about that.

.

That orgasm theory was when he hooked up with that nitwit from Hyscience.  What a group of money grubbers.  There are bad people everywhere and these were two examples.

I wonder if it was the Witch Glenda or the over-inflated scubajap who funded their blogs thereafter with AHATA and other Aruban funds.

JUST A P.S.  I posted some information in the Monkey Lounge regards more tainted Chinese food and it might not be just animal food that we are getting that is tainted.

:oops:
 so it RWV still up and running?

I'm going to say goodnight, too.

I have alot to do tomorrow.

Night, All...

Oh, yes, he has a fairly popular political blog.  But the NH Forum is by registration only and sort of hidden away.  I hope he is embarrassed by some of the stuff that has been posted there in later times.

.

P.S.

Hugs to Nemo!!!!

There's been another development as well. And that is today, for the first time, police are making a public plea to ask for anyone who might have seen a pair of sneakers, tennis shoes, size 14, described as white and blue and brand new.

http://tinyurl.com/ywgzkl
++++++++++

CANDIOTTI: Well, finally, confirmation that authorities are putting out a public request to be on the lookout, if you will, for a pair of sneakers that Joran, according to law enforcement authorities, claims that he might have lost the night that Natalee went missing, when he was on the beach with her, he said, at that fisherman`s hut area, which is near the Marriott and the Holiday Inn hotels.

Described as size 14, a pair of brand new sneakers. The brand is K- Swiss.

GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait. Size 14, K-Swiss, are those...

CANDIOTTI: White and blue in color, that`s right. And they`re looking for this pair of brand new sneakers that he told police, as they stressed to me, in one of his many statements, that he might have lost this pair of shoes.

http://tinyurl.com/2z9jry
++++++++++++++
ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) — Aruban authorities investigating the disappearance of Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway are looking for a pair of size-14 tennis shoes that suspect Joran van der Sloot might have lost, a police official said.

http://tinyurl.com/2aom8a
+++++++++++++
Aruban authorities said Monday they were looking for a pair of size 14 tennis shoes that van der Sloot might have had on the night Holloway disappeared.

http://tinyurl.com/2do4wy
+++++++++++++

KOSINSKI:  Police have been pretty tightlipped about this.  There have been rumors about them looking for a shoe in various places.  Today, we know from police they‘re actually looking for a pair of sneakers, K-Swiss blue and white striped sneaker. We even know the size, size 14.  So, they put out some detail there.

http://tinyurl.com/2w2jnu

*******,
Seedyrum decided to disappear evidently.  I used to hear from Mrs Jimi Hendrix once in a while.  Last I heard Dan had traced Seedy all over the country for she kept using an anonymizer to fool him.

If she is still around and posting, it is under a different name.

.

  Night Patti!!  Sweet Dreams to yah!

LOL!! Thats hilarious.. Well he had the email contact with Joran and he was at the right place at the right time. If they googled NH..RWV popped up. I remember selena,maria,dolores and tons of others that made his blog. We heard about the Chicago PI,ATM withdrawls and tons more that wasnt on MSM.

You are absolutely right about him.. I watched in amazement as he often attacked some of the people I liked best for no reason. He wasnt well thats for sure..He even went after me when I questioned NH leaving with deepak story. He told me he talked to MB student and he had the $900 phone bill to prove it.

THE BLOODY TENNIS SHOE

Beth Twitty
On the Record w/ Greta
December 6, 2005

TWITTY: You know Greta now that you mention it I was looking through my journal and there was an update from an FBI official and also from our family liaison that in one of Joran Van der Sloot's tennis shoes there was blood. I had written that down. I wish that I had been able to obtain more information as to what happened to that one shoe if that was truly blood in his shoe. You know Greta like I said we are just so limited in any type of information we can get.


Beth Twitty
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
December 9, 2005

TWITTY:  ...I mean, I think we need to stay focused on the bloody tennis shoe that was found...
 

Beth Twitty
NANCY GRACE
February 23, 2006

GRACE: ... Beth, why did he leave his shoes behind?

TWITTY: You know, that`s been a question all along, Nancy. And I really couldn`t figure out if there was one tennis shoe that he left behind or if it were both.

Yep, size 14..that's what they were looking for because that's what size Joran said his shoes were.  That would be a logical size for Joran to wear.  Then HOW is he comfortably wearing a size 10.5 when he's being interrogated?

  Thanks  Anna  ..!!!

That must have been one of his many purposeful lies, because when he was interviewed by Greta he clearly stated he wore size 14.

Good night, Patti.

Right.. Almost forgot about Mrs Jimi Hendrix..LMAO!!  I thought her and granny toad started there own blog?

He told me seedy would know everything about a case from top to bottom and use many diffrent names. SHe emailed me when dan lashed out at me..I think it made her feel better to see someone else face his wrath..LOL.I emailed her about the boston travel show but never heard back.

Yep, he's always said size 14.  Even Medleyrelay asked him and he told her size 14:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/joranshoes.jpg)

Nite Patti

Hey klaas.. Got to tell ya I admire the way you dig up these quotes and articles.. :wink:

I spent a hour today tryin to find David Kock's interview where he said they all stopped at a bar briefly after C&C. I wanted to know why they stopped at the bar as I forgot what he said. I couldnt find the transcript but I know he mentioned it in a interview in his office as I saw it on TV.

Two weeks ago I was tryin to find where De Vries said he talked to Paulus on the phone.. Paulus told him that they had lots more to tell but it would hurt too many people...Once again I know I saw him say it on TV but only could find his translation at RU

 
This shoe size thing is like OJ's bloody glove. Of course a bloodied and then dried glove is going to be tight and hence appear not to fit. This is alittle hard to do with a shoe.  Why not simply then alter the facts? The sneaker(s)
once reported missing were really a size 10.5, oh yea, that's right (NOT!). But it is pretty safe to say a 10.5 sneaker....even if found will never be traced to JVDS....because he doesn't own a shoe that size. Surely someone else may have lost one but not him.