Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Let's hope 2007 brings Justice for Natalee

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/candleman2justice2007.jpg)

I know its extremely difficult to judge his shoe size but I am looking at the shoe in perspective to his ankle. It just does not look like size 14.IMO..If I was sitting next to him I am almost sure my shoes would be bigger..I wear size 12.

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/Observer00000007/158069346_90d8aee97a.jpg)

thats because of the size  of his leg

he is a MONSTER

Joran's height.  This is a good indication of the height difference between Joran and his father.  This was taken at Sasha's birthday party which I believe was in March or April 2005:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/JoranMarch2005.jpg)

When Greta interviewed Joran, he said himself he is about 6'2" or 6'3", not 6'5" like everyone posted. So that would make a difference in the shoe size.

I have a cousin who is about 6'3" that wears a size 16 shoe. He has to have his shoes special made for him.

Height - Joran vs Koen - this photo was taken last time Joran was visiting in Aruba:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/JoranKoenNew.jpg)

I searched last night for another Pic of Koen and Joran in same pic and Koen was at least 2 inches shorter..This pic is probably accurate..Joran is at least 6'3 and Koen is at least 6'1 IMO

Bringing one of my comments over from page 49 of the previous discussions.

"Not only does it connect Paulus to Natalee...If you all noticed in the picture of Paulus at the gate speaking with Greta and Beth, Paulus is wearing the same "white" shirt he wore the night before. Guess in a hurry to get out front he just grabbed the first thing available to wear.
The bastage!"


Should of provided picture with this post.

(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b341/dkpen/paul_beth.jpg)

(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b341/dkpen/MVC-007S.jpg)

That was not the night before. That was days after when Greta was with Beth.

that pic of joran by the pool with his lap top his feet are fricken HUGE

Oops, sorry for blowing the margin. I did resize both pictures. Guess didn't get the pic on left small enough. Sorry Klaas.  :P

Ok, but still looks to be same shirt to me.

His feet just dont look long to me..

I know a guy who is 6'4 and he only wears an 11..very small feet for a guy that tall....I guess it just depends ....

Your right!! Looks like same shirt to me also..

dkpen ... same shirt ... excellent observation!

I hope the family is made aware of the comparisons between the casino segment and the photo of Paulus at his gate in regards to the hairline.  Also ... the shirt observation is also very telling.

Janet

Logically, Joran should wear larger than a size 10 1/2

However, Anna and others have a good point and it's more likely Joran claimed he wore a size 14 to throw off the investigation.

Red was going to send all that to Beth and Dave.

It must be VDS thing.  Joran like to wear the same shirt over and over and ... now it appears that Paulus does too.

Janet

Great!!

DKPen and Kermit- Thank you for the info on the last thread... very nice.

It all goes back to Beth's statement that 'she got what she wanted' from the VDS home visit.

Now, as for the phone taps...

I wonder if it is possible that the 'three kidnappers' are named on any of the wiretaps???

Someone has been listening to the VDS land lines before Natalee went to Aruba...jmo..

I think Beth's statement that Natalee did not make any phone calls is truthful... someone else may have made them... and by the looks of the KLPD only searching (that we know of) the VDS home.. it looks like they have ID'd that as the mystery site.

Now wrap this case up and get these CRIMINAL arrested.

I see we are talking about shoe size this afternoon, Afternoon Monkeys.

I have to say again that in the pic posted, the sneaker size looks much larger than a 12 when you consider the reported size/height (6"4")  of Joran. That is a good pic for looking at his sneaker size BTW when compared with a few other pics like the one at pool side, where his feet are closer to the lens/camera taking the photo, making them appear bigger.

In the comparison pics...not only does the shirt look the same, but the watches and same hairline, nose, chin. I'm telling you all it is Paulus. I saw a clip showing him standing up facing the dealer, smiling and talking. This comparison just more proof for everyone since no one else but IBE saw the video clip I am speaking about.

Klass ... I agree.

JI just rounded up a pair of my youngest son's sneakers ... he is 5' 11" and ... the sneakers are size 10 1/2 (US).

Janet

Infact dkpen in this Greta interview Joran says he is 6'3" or 6'4"

VAN SUSTEREN: How tall are you?

VAN DER SLOOT: Probably 6-4 or 6-3.

VAN SUSTEREN: How much do you weigh?

VAN DER SLOOT: Two-twenty, I think.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, so you're big.

I have a minor theory on the shoe size.

You know how a size 6 dress is now a size 4?

An XL shirt is now XXL?

I have a feeling that shoes are also sized the same..

I used to always wear a size 10.5.. now I wear an 11 or 11.5 or even once in a while, if the shoes are Italian, a 9.5.

Sizes for clothes and shoes seem to be totally up to the manufacturer's discretion.

I have shirts from Gold's Gym that are a medium...and I used to always wear a large dress shirt, but that to have some cut because my neck is 18.5 inches around. Now I have to always buy XL shirts no matter who makes them...and still have them cut.

Now if Joran says he wears a 14.. that could easily be a 12 or a 15... depends on the shoe and the manufacturer.

MBHS Voicemail Message

Kermit writes: "A Twitty family friend tells me that “I don’t know these people” was the code Beth had with her kids just in case."

Gerben said it was "inconclusive."  I don't know about that.

In the absence of accurate phone records, how can the code claim be disproven, by Tacopina, or Carlo, or any of them?

This is an important piece of the case.

.

I've looked everywhere for that complete clip and I can't find it.  It must have been on the original ABC show and not the GMA version.

The watch matches too

Woohoo Rob, pump it up!   :smt003

well, i think he wears a size 14 ish

and i think he scrunched his toes to fit into a size 10.5

ALE should have checked to see if his HEAL was in the back of the shoe

they are INCOMPETANT  :x

This pic was in 2002.

i bet the k2 brothers wear a size 10

he probably planted a size 10 on the beach

he has thrown the K2's away several times 8)

Not only are they incompetant, but they are liars who refuse to step up and tell the truth and stop with the cover-up.

One day the entire truth will be revealed. I just hope it's sooner than later.

he has aged TERRIBLY

im 4 times his age and look 10 times better  8)

im sure everyone is tired of it
but im still 100 percent confident the DUTCH are gonna get them all  8)

those shoes are bigger than his head
and we know his head is big


size 14

BET THE FARM  8)

Robots- He is closer to wearing a 12-13-14-15 than a 9.5- 10.5 or 115...imo...

yep  8)  :wink:

im serious they are LONGER than his head

 8)  

size 10....... nawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

I looked at the witness statements and it doesn't seem like Paulus was ever asked if he had met Natalee at the casino. Paulus was present at Joran's first statement athough no copies appear to have survived, and pages are missing from the PVDS interviews.

well, the germaphobic is going out to eat :x  :x  :x  :x

course, im not going to eat...im just going to sit there and pretend to be happy and hope to get out alive

YUCK   YUCK YUCK  :x  :x  :x  :x  :x

be back later

Spock.. doesn't one of Paulus' PV's go like page 1 - page 2 - page 3 missing page 4???????

It just stops altogether????

Yep, it's a mess, and when he was investigated as a suspect his answers are so ambigious as to be unbeliveable and unusable.

(http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/EasyWriter/MexicoCity.gif)

I do recall a statement from Paulus somewhere where he said he had never met the girl. It may have come from an interview and not from a police statement. Can anyone find him saying that?

I agree with you.  I wear a 13 and am 6' tall but my shoes look bigger than this pic

Joran was only about 14 yrs old in this pic. I'm sure his foot has grown since then.

I would guess that a size 14 shoe would be VERY hard to get in Aruba without special ordering it, especially if you want it in a specific style.  I wear a 13 and have a hard time finding shoes in the style I want and I live not too far out of Detroit!  I often have to settle for shoes that dont fit perfectly or styles that I dont exactly want.

I wear a 4 and am 5' tall.

Everybody's shoes look HUGE to me.  :lol:

I hate to say this... but my first thought when I saw that picture was ~'he looks like Marmaduke in that picture'.

I have been wearing a size 13 for the last 15 years at least.  Sometimes a wear a 12 depending on the manufacturer.  Never a 14.  I have a good friend that wears a 14 and it makes my 13 look small.

I used to wear a large shirt and now I wear an XL.  My pants also got bigger for some reason………   :?

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

You may be right, so hard to tell from a picture.  The thing is, its really not that important to figure out his shoe size, this is something that can easily be confirmed when the time comes for trial or whatever.  Its not like his foot is going to shrink or anything.  Its probably pretty much done growing too I would guess.

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

whenever you figure out whats causing it, let me know !! :wink:

I havent followed the whole shoe discussion but if I remember correctly - Joran told the detective that he wears a size 14 but when the detective asked him to remove his shoe, he found Joran was wearing a 10 or 10.5, right?

This makes sense if he really does wear a 14 but could only find a size 10 or 10.5 in the same style as the 14's he had to ditch on short notice.  I'm sure he probably has to special order size 14's in whatever style he wants.

That's the story as I remember it and some thought it was a very important piece of evidence.  Then nothing......

i dont think its that important really.  His shoe size can be confirmed when it needs to be.

I've been working and lurking but this made me LOLOL  :lol:  :lol:

Hey Blah...You have a picture of your size 13's?..It may be just me but I do not see his feet being long in any of the pics. I know I know..He should be wearing a size 14 being that tall I just havent seen it. Size 14 long as heck....

Your right..All of Aruba was looking for those shoes.. :?

Good Day Monkeys :)

Just peeking in to see what's UP.. and I get to see all these pics of Creep -O and  Mom's see thru top   :smt078 :twisted:

Bummer...

I dont have a picture but its going to be very hard to tell by looking at a picture anyhow.  I did just step on a tape measure though and it (my SHOE :smt018 ) measures ~12.75 inches.

I always thought it was a strange Ah Ha moment, but we were never told the whole story.

BTW...

Not that I give a hoot about shoes &  sizes   but they say for most people that your forearm (from indside of elbow to wrist) is same lenght as your foot   :shock:

lol  No one got my picture joke.  Over the weekend 18,000 people got naked for a photographer in Mexico City.  That particular pose hit me as funny and made me think about the guy that got stuck in the wrong row and column. lol lol

Ut Oh!   :shock:

Just goin through my Pics before I switch over to my PC. Here's a Pic of one of the ATA members in Boston. Cutey huh guys? When the conversation switched to Carlos and Charlies..I had to mention what Dennis Jacobs told Dave about watching her drink at that place..After that someone passed her a note...Probably telling her to shut up..lol

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/Observer00000007/IM000743.jpg)

I dont have a picture but its going to be very hard to tell by looking at a picture anyhow. I did just step on a tape measure though and it (my SHOE  ) measures ~12.75 inches.


You are right..However I just got done looking at Michael Jordans size 13..They look so much longer than Joran's feet..

OkOk..I will drop talking about shoe sizes for now.. :wink:

Maybe next time you can get a Mt Brook Alabama booth right across the hallway from the Aruba booth and post big pics of Natalee all over it.

Yesterday it was reported that a rash of 911 calls went out across the country during the afternoon.  The symptoms were all identical.  People were stuck in the shape of a pretzel with a tennis shoe in one hand and a mouse in the other.  No explanation was immediately known for this sudden outbreak of pretzelitus.

Thats a good idea.. :P Wish I had a extra 20,000 or whatever they payed for the small booth..

And our Sleuth had the worst case of it.  :lol:

His own mother?  Unbelievable!

nice to be photographed next to mama who is wearing a "see through"  righit?  NOT!

My son wears a size 14 shoe. I'll look for a picture and post it. They look like small boats.  :lol:

Did you ever read the article I posted from Jossy?  The Dutch interrogator took his hand and felt to see if there was plenty of room for Joran's toes.

In the article I posted, it clearly states, if you would bother to read it, that it was one of the special Dutch interrogators that were sent to deal with just Joran and not ALE doing anything with this shoe business.

I really think he would have noticed if the toes were scrunched and the heel at the back, etc.

He manually confirmed that Joran was wearing a 10.5 in jail and had been for some time and that it was a very nice fit.

There is no way to scrunch toes that cannot be felt through the shoe and he took his own fingers and confirmed there was sufficient room at the end of the shoe for the toes.

It doesn't matter what we think, Joran was comfortably wearing a 10.5 with room to spare.

Or Jossy made the whole thing up.

Can't be both ways.

.

Got here just in time

Oldfart
It's your turn to size and  picture foot and forearm.  Yesterday's thread covered the rest of us.  :lol:

PVDS...could have left the poker tourn...and then returned for some blackjack.

Haley was the name of a bad cop.  If I was the FBI and thought there was a "girls bottle" behind the bar...I might send someone undercover to see...

Most of the kids go to school in FL.  I bet even Max Arends (who happens to be on the island) has a FL area code on his phone. But would those phones be Setar traceable??

IMO

Oh great, now its the bee's.  What the heck are they gonna come up with next.

I'm so sick and tired of this "we are DOOMED" mentality, I just cant take this BS anymore.

Hey buckeye! Want an avatar?  :wink:
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/be4.gif)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/be4.gif

hehehe you are toooooo funny

Many will recall that on July 8, 1947, witnesses claimed that an

unidentified object with five aliens aboard crashed onto a sheep and

cattle ranch just outside Roswell , New Mexico . This is a well-known

incident which many say has long been covered up by the U.S. Air Force

and the federal government. In fact, there were many reported sightings

all over the country that night.



However, you may NOT know that in the month of March 1948, exactly

nine months after that historic day, the following "persons" were born:

Albert Arnold Gore, Jr.
Hillary Rodham
John F. Kerry
William Jefferson Clinton
Howard Dean
Nancy Pelosi
Dianne Feinstein
Charles E. Schumer
Barbara Boxer

See what happens when aliens breed with sheep...?

This sounds strange!  If they use the metric system on Aruba, why is he describing his height in feet and inches?  Unless he was coached to?

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=385


JORAN 08/08/2005 Dutch Interrigators Statement
(translated by Ramm at BFN)

We,

Jaquelline Josette de WINDT, head officer with the Korps Politie Aruba, attached to the section surveillance of Sint Nicolaas.

Antoon Ronanld de RUITER, sergeant of police in the Netherlands, region Utrecht, districht Utrecht South East and appointed by National Decision by the Governor number DWJZ 3473/05 dated July 27th 2005 as special temporary officer of the Korps Politie Aruba.

Clemens Johannes Maria BURGWAL, sergeant of police in the Netherlands, region Utrecht, districht Paardenveld and appointed by National Decision by the Governor number DWJZ 3473/05 dated July 27th 2005 as special temporary officer of the Korps Politie Aruba.

State the following.

On Monday August 8th 2005, at approximately 09.48 we, the reporting officers, questioned in the police station of Oranjestad in Aruba, the suspect

Joran Andreas Petrus VAN DER SLOOT
born on August 6th 1987 in the Netherlands and living at Montanja 19 in Aruba

for further information.
The interview was conducted by us, reporting officers de Windt and the Ruiter and in the control-room, I, reporting officer Burgwal followed the interview via an internally installed video-system. And by me, reporting officer Burgwal a summation was made regarding the interview.

For the description of the interview room and the control room I refer to a seperate police report made about this.

In the interview room was also present the lawyer of the suspect, named mr. O.R.G. Faarup.

Suspect made statements to questions put to him, in an abridged version, the now following:

Suspect was congratulated by the reporting officers for his birthday. He smiled.

Suspect was then informed that the District Attorney on Aruba had filed a deposition with the court with regard to extending so that the temporary arrest warrant would be extended to September 4th.

Suspect was onces again informed of the statements that were made by his friend Freddy and people close to Freddy.

He was also asked why his legal team was mis-informing the press with regard to the interviews in an appearant attempt to put the police in a bad light. In the press it was written that the lawyers were not given time to speak to the client and that on his birthday he was interrogated from the early morning to late at night.
The suspect did not answer.

The suspect was shown/informed that he had stated that he and the girl went for a walk. And that there was a statement of someone that saw Deepak Kalpoe's car at a location that was several hundred yards away from the Fishermans hut.
He was asked about the logic of this and other issues and whether he can explain why he was there with the other boys in that particular location.
The suspect did not respond.

He was again confronted with statements made by several of his intimate friends that he had screwed them/hung them out to dry by lying and having sexaul relations with the girlfriend of one of his friends. These boys say that he has been constantly fooling them and manipulating.
He was again confronted with the statement of the girl Martina, who was offered a beverage during the sexual relations that caused her lips to feel tingly.

The suspect did not respond.

After that there were several confrontations with regard to the date of giving statements by several witnesses, the omissions in the statements of the suspect and the omissions in the statements made by his fellow suspects and the timeline in which those statements were made.
The suspect did not respond.

Suspect was asked to take off one of his shoes. Suspect looked back and wanted to find support from his lawyer but his lawyer was not looking at him and was writing. He put it on the the table noisily/with a bang.

The reporting officers then asked him why he was wearing K-swiss shoes size 14 on the day in question when he now was wearing size 10.5 shoes.
After the suspect had put his shoe back on, I, reporting officer de Ruiter pressed down on the nose of the shoe and felt that the toes of the suspect fit straightly and properly in the shoe.

The suspect did not respond.

The interview was concluded at approxmimately 11.30.

Well, Blah- that certainly explains it.  :P  I had no other explanation and no one else did either!!!!

CBB

I usually wait for something big...but since you actually found a buckeye....thanks soooo much.   :smt007  :smt023

Here is the article by Jossy again.

Note it is NOT ALE that felt of Joran's foot in the Size 10.5 but one of the Dutch interrogators.  I assume this is one of the ones specially trained to deal with juveniles that were called in before.  Those are the only Dutch interrogators I know of being in Aruba before now.

Please read the article for it clearly states Joran was comfortably wearing the 10.5.

We seldom have anything even close to this kind of documentation of anything and I don't understand why it is still such a controversy after his foot was found to fit nicely into the 10.5.  I don't think a person who wears a 14 would go out and buy a new pair four sizes too small.Sun May 06, 2007 8:09 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Anna wrote:
Case of Natalee: report shows formal deceit
Joran van der Sloot’s feet grow and shrink almost 4 sizes from one day to the otherDIARIO Aruba
05/08/2006



ORANJESTAD (AAN) --- Those of a little advanced or respectable age can still remember the time where there was an alcoholic beverage that was called ‘foot sweller’.

This alcoholic beverage, it was said, that those who drank too much of it, their feet swelled and because of this they called the drink ‘foot sweller’, but who can believe that in the year 2005 there are people in Aruba whose feet really swell or grow almost 4 sizes from one day to the other?

This was the case of the suspect Joran van der Sloot, who is currently peacefully studying in Holland and Aruba itself is stuck with the case of Natalee, and in the US they are trying in every way to organize and implement all sorts of boycotts and acts that could harm Aruba in the wide sense of the word.



This is not an attempt to cast guilt on Joran van der Sloot in the case of Natalee, but the fact is that the majority of people in the community is very angry in regards to the case of Natalee causing a negative impact on the economic situation, the image of the people of Aruba and surely, for the island’s tourism.


Too many changing declarations, formal deceit by the suspects and the very strange way in which the authorities, who have to be competent, have proceeded have today stuck Aruba in a very bad situation in regards to Natalee’s case and those who know the truth remain quiet believing that in this way, they can evade guilt of any involvement or any violation of the law.

From the copies of different police reports, today readers themselves can read how Joran van der Sloot, who until today for inexplicable reasons ‘supposedly’ left his expensive brand name running shoes at the beach on the night he was with Natalee, according to the version he gave police.

Police came up with the matter of the running shoes or it was Joran himself who started talking about the running shoes of an expensive brand name, size 14? From the police report of June 14, 2005, readers can read how Joran himself declared that he took off his size 14 running shoes and left them on the beach.

On June 29, 2005, he again repeated to police that he left his size 14 running shoes on the beach. The strange thing is that on August 2, 2005, after so many interrogations had already taken place, Joran van der Sloot in a car heading back to KIA, told a Dutch police officer who came to Aruba especially to interrogate the suspects, that Joran had on some K-Swiss running shoes that he borrowed from a fellow prisoner.

At no moment did the Dutch police officer ask Joran something, it was Joran himself who started talking with the police officer, as can been seen from the police report.

Now, the question is: was Joran brought from the first day to KIA shoeless and had no shoes to wear that it was a fellow prisoner who had to lend Joran a pair of running shoes?

Van der Sloot’s parents couldn’t bring shoes for Joran to wear, and someone from the prison had to lend him some shoes, and to top it all off they were K-Swiss brand?

By the way, at KIA they have to register, as in the majority of prisons around the world, what shoes and other belongings each person comes in with, yes or no? On August 8, 2005, the same Dutch police officer asked Joran to take off his shoe, which was a K-Swiss brand running shoe.

Joran asked to see his lawyer and wanted to find his lawyer’s support, but his lawyer didn’t even look at Joran and started to write (in local dialect, you deal with your problems!) After the Dutch police officer insisted, Joran took off the running shoe and handed it over across the table.

The police officer asked Joran how in the supposed day that he was with Natalee on the beach, he had size 14 K-Swiss running shoes, then how was the one that Joran put on the table size 10.5?

After Joran put his running shoe back on, the police pressed on the tip of the running shoes, and observed that the shoes were a good fit on Joran, and Joran didn’t react!

The matter of the size 14 K-Swiss running shoes is ‘too good to be true’. Was it the shark that Natalee supposedly wanted to see at the North shore that left with Joran van der Sloot’s size 14 running shoes?


// posted by Getagrip @ 5/10/2006 04:17:00 PM

http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2006_05_07_archive.html


Until proven otherwise, I will have to go with Jossy on this.


.


So Joran is likely to grow until he is 21 as most males tend to do. He will then be 6'8" wearing a Size 20 shoe!

LOAD ALERT!!

He is prolly about 6'3" now. I have a son that height and since we seem to tend to believe what size shoe others wear more than what an examination of Joran's foot in a Size 10.5 showed, he wears an 11 narrow

Tall people with smallest feet do NOT topple over. They do tend to turn their ankles often which is fairly common.

I don't understand how if his foot was measured in the 10.5 and it was a very comfortable fit, so much so that he was wearing a brand new pair just that size, why this is still a big mystery.

His foot was measured inside a 10.5 and it fit nicely according to Dutch interrogator.Feet, nose and ears continue to grow. By the time Joran is 40, what size shoe will he be wearing?

And if he is 6'5" why isn't he very much taller than anybody else except for his short stocky mother? He isn't and neither does he wear a 14 shoe!

JMO

.
_________________

it all makes sense now huh?

 :wink:

This is a 16 year old with a size 14 shoe. They're baseball cleats and they're black, but they're size 14.
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/MMcopy.jpg)

Well, I do believe the Dutch interrogator noticed a somewhat short forearm, therefore testing his shoe, and decided it is a 10 1/2.

now if we could just get a Dutch detective to feel his toes.....




 :lol:

'Suspect was congratulated by the reporting officers for his birthday. He smiled. '

This one always makes me think WTF?!?!?!?!?

Ak, so Missster mudderah vapist girl disappeareh, Ve vish vu a very appy birthday and many more vonderful years in vour carveer as a mudderin vaptin psychopaf.

Vhat vood vu lik fa ya very very speciah day? Shoe are nice!

WTF!!!

If it helps with the perspective, My photo is of a much more muscular frame than Joran's. His legs are bulkier than Joran's.

Thank you Janet for posting that.

That statement may well be the source for Jossy's article that I have posted so many times.

I am very glad to know that it is in the official record and the shoe size confirmed for that at least even if some don't want to believe it.

 :roll:

.

Add my brother to the list ... he was born on April 1, 1948 ... it explains a lot of things.  As a kid I always told him he must have been adopted.

blah ... I cannot wait to relate this research to him.

Janet

Joran slammed the shoes on the counter when he was asked to remove them.  They were labeled.

For some reason, Joran was very upset.  His lawyer was present and refused to do anything to prevent them looking in his shoes and comparing the fit to his feet.

.

Yup..I havent seen any pics yet that Joran's feet are that big..14's are huuuge!!

BTW:I have worn about the same size shoe since I was 14..At most maybee 1/2 inch bigger.

Anna

I know.  I totally agree.  There is not much we know as fact but I do believe the kid (as big as he is) wears a 10.5 K Swiss.  For all I know Jacobs told him to say 14 or he changed a size 11 receipt to a size 14.

PROCES - VERBAAL

We, Dennis Dominico JACOBS and Eric Louis SOEMERS, On Saturday, August 6, 2005, around 16:50, we interrogated the witness, OSMAN
Farouk OSMAN, director of Automotive Enterprises.


Really makes you wonder, where that statement came from.

It's in the record as Janet posted that the Dutch (not ALE as erroneously stated by ROBOTS who refuses to read the article and statement posted by Janet from the record/dossier) confirmed the shoe size of Joran as 10.5.

No way around that.

I'd say he is the shortest height he admitted to being which would be the Great interview at 6'3".

Like everything else, he is exaggerating his height as he feels it in some way enhances his appearance.  After all, according to Joran, Natalee was the aggressor and really after him!  Sure she was, Joran--NOT!
.

It's hard to tell.....

(http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h122/EasyWriter/jclown.gif)

OT It seems the search is on going for the little abducted girl from Portugal. The police there feel they may have a description of the man who took the little girl from her resort room as she slept. [/b]
++++++++


Sousa said the hunt for a suspect, whose picture had been drawn on the basis of witnesses, was just "one of the elements of the investigation". He said he would not risk making an estimate about when the police could find Madeleine.

"We are treating it as the disappearance of a minor in circumstances that are still not been completely clear, but kidnap has not been ruled out as a possibility," Sousa said.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4052321a12.html

US Size,  Europe Size and UK size for K-Swiss
10.5             44.0                   9.5


14.0              49.0                 13.0

These are size conversions  

So If Joran wore a 14 US size but purchased somewhere else size on shoe
should be a 13  Possible UK size....

It certainly does Spock.

Sounds like somebody was going through her pockets to me as I don't think she was carrying a purse.

Denim skirts fit much like jeans.  You can't just ram a big hand down in the pockets any more than jeans and the fabric doesn't give that much.

So why was Deepak not asked how he knew this?

Because ALE didn't want to know.  Or he was asked and we just don't have the statement with his answers?

Do we have all the Deepak statements requested by Dr. Phil?

Has anyone checked that we do in fact have them and Deepak was not asked about how he knew this?

.

Be very careful, dont want him sending the mothership after you, they could turn you into this !!!!!

(http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g213/woodchuck123/ScaryHillaryClinton.jpg)

But why was he wearing a 10.5 that fit comfortably in jail?

I don't think it is the shoe size that matters but the fact that Joran claimed to have left a pair at the Fisherman's Hut which he may have taken from the racket club, not even his own shoes.  He was trying to place physical evidence at the beach to lead away from the real crime scene by claiming to have left his shoes.

It would appear he planted a pair or one Size 14 to try to establish that he was really at the beach.  Too bad he couldn't find a pair the size he actually wore.  And too bad no one found them where he had put them to be found, prolly somebody stole them instead of turning them in as he had planned.

l

I think this guy was told something and he might have repeated it.  The ALE wants it to go on record by his own admission that he knew nothing about it.

This reminds me of the rumor about the Sloots having two maids and one of them saying that there was sand all in Joran pants.  I always thought the sand she was talking about was really blood.  Why would sand be a big deal when you have an entire island full of it.  Like in this case the ALE brought in another maid saying nothing of another maid or something like that.

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?p=44698#44698

my 2 cents...

when joran was on greta and he pointed to his shoes and said "these are same type shoes i had on that night...and same size, too."

I KNEW HE WAS FULL OF IT

Dayhiker-
And I haven't seen anywhere Deepak answers those questions as to how he knew those items were on Natalee's possession and how the AE guy knew those specific details..

let's flash back ~ he is worried the first nite the phone is bugged and the computer is being monitored, yet he tells the AE guy these important details?

Something else is not right here.

Hi Monkeys.    We do not know where the shoes were purchased.  I think it is reasonable to conclude that Anita may have ordered shoes on the web for her sons and from both Mexico and/or the US.  

I think everyone is disregarding the shoe size chart that was posted a couple days ago.  It's at http://www.shoesizeguy.com/.    

On this chart, a Mexican size 12 1/2 is equivalent to a US size 14 (male).  The chart also states this size shoe is 11 1/4" long.

Now, here's where it gets interesting.  A Mexican size 10 is equivalent to a US 11 1/2 (male) and US 13 (female).  The chart states this shoe is 11" long--only 1/4" shorter than the US size 14 (male).

So, I can see why the shoe size is inconsistent.  Perhaps the shoes he wore the night Natalee disappeared new and were size 14 (male) purchased in US and bought a bit large as he is growing and shoes are expensive.  He would have liked those shoes!  

Perhaps the shoes he had on in KIA were his old ones, maybe a year or so old, that Anita had purchased from Mexico online, and they showed a size 10 1/5-- just a bit smaller than the new ones he wore on May 29 which were purchased in a size a bit large and from the US.

Me, too.  I think those were the very shoes he wore that night and he was gloating.

JMO

.

True, it is not the shoe size that matters, it's the lie. He perpetuated the size 14 K-swiss lie and eventually got trapped. Did anyone at the racquet club had their size 14 k-swiss shoes stolen as per Ado's theory?

I can prove he (Deepak) was there when she was either dead or unconscious. It's easy.

When Natalee was out, and maybe very out or dead, Deepak, and Joran looked at her license to see exactly who she was and where she was from... it's logical. And they knew right then, someone was going to be coming for her.

If you saw a person lying unconscious, the first thing you would do it see if the person is alive or dead. The you would look to see if the person has any ID.

It's natural. Every one would do the same thing.

I live in Alabama and my cell phone has a NY state area code.

Ado also suggested Lost and Found.

If it truly was only one shoe, maybe that is why.  There was only one in the Lost and Found section at the racket club, a place that wouldn't likely be locked and that he had access to as an intern there.

.

its a scientific fact that talking about shoes too much can do this to you...

(http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g213/woodchuck123/hillary_funny.jpg)

Why did she not ask him when/how did he get them back?  Stupid Greta could have nailed him to the wall on this but gave him a pass (and probably a little nookie too)

AZ, he also makes a statement to a Dutch Investigator that the shoes came from a fellow inmate... meaning the ones he was wearing... sounds like more BS.. what kind of inmate gives up his shoes. The last I heard of Joran jail time, it was marred by fight and kicking other inmates and he almost killed one.. from what I remember.

AZLady,
I am not ignoring the conversion chart for it is not a conversion issue but remember Deepak mentioned the SPORTS SHOES the very first night to one of the Alabama delegation.

Then he said he realized he should not have done that and told that person he was talking about something else.

I think they had already planted the Size 14 they got somewhere by the time the Alabama Delegation arrived.

This is the second part of their knowing they needed an alibi before Beth arrived.

That is what I think Joran had done with this walking to the casino in case somebody saw him there.  He may have been planting the shoes.  They were likely not even his so doesn't matter what size HIS feet are as those were not his shoes he planted to be found.  That was going to be his proof he left Natalee at the beach.

.

Uk Womens size 11 are Equal to US mens size 13
http://www.kswiss.com/kswiss/sizechart.html

Out of left fleld  like a lot of questions seem too ???
Are they implying Deepak knew on May 30th  or that Natalee went missing on May 30th ??

Hi gang.... Just Taking a short mowing break
Just a question ... What difference what size shoe Joran wears?
When  (in statements that we have) does it 1st come up that he left his shoes on the beach?
JMO ...but seemed as one thing more Joran could add to the beach story.  That would make the ALE expend time on.

Another reason to vacation in the US, Canada and Australia which I found while surfing.  This might be the one that Dr. Baden commented on once on Greta's show, but I'm not sure.  

Bermuda rejects new bid for Middleton trial  
Published on Monday, May 7, 2007


HAMILTON, Bermuda (Reuters): Bermuda's chief justice rejected last week a new attempt by the parents of a murdered Canadian teenager to bring charges against suspects in the 10-year-old crime.

Represented by Cherie Booth, the barrister wife of British Prime Minister Tony Blair, the family of Rebecca Middleton had sought to have two suspects charged with sexual assault, abduction, and torture since earlier attempts to try them for murder were bungled.

But Chief Justice Richard Ground agreed with a decision by public prosecutors that to re-open the case would violate the British mid-Atlantic island's double jeopardy laws, which forbid courts to try suspects twice for the same crime.

"I appreciate that that will be a bitter disappointment to the applicant and other members of Rebecca's family, for whom I personally feel great sympathy, but I have to declare the law as it is," Ground said in the judgment.

Middleton, from Belleville, Ontario, was raped, tortured and stabbed to death on July 3, 1996, when she was 17.

No one was ever convicted for the crime.

One suspect, Kirk Orlando Mundy, struck a plea bargain deal in which he admitted to being an accessory after the fact and was sentenced to five years. The deal was struck before police had completed forensic tests which found Mundy's semen inside Rebecca's body.
The case against another suspect, Justis Raham Smith, collapsed after a judge in Bermuda said there was insufficient evidence.

Canadian tourists boycotted the island of 62,000 people, 560 miles east of the US state of North Carolina, in protest and the family has unsuccessfully fought for years for a retrial. Last July, Bermuda offered compensation of less than $3,000 to the family.

A lawyer for the family, John Riihiluoma, said they would appeal Justice Ground's decision to the Bermuda Court of Appeal.

http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/news-1362--28-28--.html

If the Dutch are trying to do this right, I say give them a little time.  We've waited this long.

Yah Dayhiker- It ain't adding up on purpose!

He said oh, not these but a pair just like them that I left on the beach with Natalee.   :roll:

What I took away from the whole shoe size controversy was that ALE had a size 10.5 in their possession and Joran was claiming to wear a size 14.  The Dutch cop called him on it and caught him in another lie.  But, then what?  Nothing as usual……

Anna,
I agree 100%

Ado

did she check the size of the ones he had on?

I remember when the statement from the Auto guy was first published and I thought that was some very damning information, but then what?  Nothing as usual…..

I hate to say this, but there was a little sexual tension between her & Joran.  I did not want to say that, because I always hate saying things like that but I have seen that twice with an interviewer and interviewee, and once it was with that Rebecca Kohls, the landscape designer, and another designer.

LEAVING THE RACQUET CLUB

21. Joran van der Sloot statement June 14, 2005
At approximately 19.15 pm I left on foot for the Wyndham Hotel. I was alone. My tennis gear I had left behind the bar at the Raquet club. I had also removed my tennis shoes and left them in the bag behind. I had taken from my tennis bag a pair of slippers and walked away on those. From the clubhouse I walked in the direction of Salinja to the Marriot Hotel. I walked along the same route that Deepak had taken to drop off me and Natalee. At the beach of the Marriot I tried for a little while to find my shoes. They were nowhere to be found. I looked for about two minutes

I wonder if he slipped something in her water or whatever she was drinking

(snipped)
Suspect made statements to questions put to him, in an abridged version, the now following:

Suspect was congratulated by the reporting officers for his birthday. He smiled.
Suspect was then informed that the District Attorney on Aruba had filed a deposition with the court with regard to extending so that the temporary arrest warrant would be extended to September 4th.

Suspect was onces again informed of the statements that were made by his friend Freddy and people close to Freddy.

He was also asked why his legal team was mis-informing the press with regard to the interviews in an appearant attempt to put the police in a bad light. In the press it was written that the lawyers were not given time to speak to the client and that on his birthday he was interrogated from the early morning to late at night.
The suspect did not answer.

The suspect was shown/informed that he had stated that he and the girl went for a walk. And that there was a statement of someone that saw Deepak Kalpoe's car at a location that was several hundred yards away from the Fishermans hut.
He was asked about the logic of this and other issues and whether he can explain why he was there with the other boys in that particular location.
The suspect did not respond.

He was again confronted with statements made by several of his intimate friends that he had screwed them/hung them out to dry by lying and having sexaul relations with the girlfriend of one of his friends. These boys say that he has been constantly fooling them and manipulating.
He was again confronted with the statement of the girl Martina, who was offered a beverage during the sexual relations that caused her lips to feel tingly.

The suspect did not respond.

After that there were several confrontations with regard to the date of giving statements by several witnesses, the omissions in the statements of the suspect and the omissions in the statements made by his fellow suspects and the timeline in which those statements were made.
The suspect did not respond.

Suspect was asked to take off one of his shoes. Suspect looked back and wanted to find support from his lawyer but his lawyer was not looking at him and was writing. He put it on the the table noisily/with a bang.

The reporting officers then asked him why he was wearing K-swiss shoes size 14 on the day in question when he now was wearing size 10.5 shoes.
After the suspect had put his shoe back on, I, reporting officer de Ruiter pressed down on the nose of the shoe and felt that the toes of the suspect fit straightly and properly in the shoe.

The suspect did not respond.

The interview was concluded at approxmimately 11.30.

The above PV was written in August, 2005.  Joran was done talking.  If you read through the questions asked of him, the Dutch interrogators appear to be trying to get him to respond to them.  Toward the end of the interrogation, they even use the word "confrontations" as if they are pushing Joran to give them some response.  Lastly, the investigators asked him why he was wearing K-swiss shoes size 14 on the day in question .  They are telling Joran that we know what shoes you wore that day.  Are they insinuating to Joran that the Dutch investigators have one or both of his shoes worn on May 29 with the evidence on them?  Is this the significant part of this PV?   Joran is mad at this point as he slams his shoe on the table.  I don't think the significant part of this is the shoe size as the size varies as to the country of purchase and time of purchase.  The important part of this is that they have the shoes from May 29.

I agree Anna.  I always thought they were the shoes he had on that night.  Also they were old and dirty.  He was probably saving them for a special occasion :roll: .

Where are the statements where the police ask Deepak what investigation he was trying to mess up within minutes of leaving Joran and Natalee at the beach?  Where is the statement asking Satish what was wrong with the girl when he last saw her?  They've got these guys.  They know they're guilty.  I sure hope the Dutch get some physical evidence.  Could be that all they need is something to prove Natalee was there.  Maybe something that tells them they hid evidence.  Hopefully, they have evidence of the computers being tampered with.

I do not know much LAW... but got to wonder if if pleaded to a lessor charge... how could it be double jeporady  since we was not tried (??) for other crimes. ???  
or maybe they need to look at perjury charges, or someother's too

Dayhiker, yes, they have a boatload of evidence.  I've always believed that.  Coverup is the reason.  As Beth, Dave and others have stated, this is a "professional coverup."

Here's a comment about blood on a shoe, but there is no link and the comment is attributed to Beth: "I add this fact because Natalee’s mother was provided a positive statement that there was blood on one of Joran’s tennis shoes." http://www.perspectives.com/forums/...915&forum_id=38

It is extremely difficult to understand.  Just from the bits and pieces we have seen there was a case to be made and many follow-up questions to be asked.  But it just kept spinning its wheels for all this time.

I agree.  It's not the size that's significant.  But the shoes play into this mess somehow, we just don't know how.

Riight..But Dompig announced to the world that Aruba was looking for a size 14 :roll:

Kermit, I believe the PV I quoted above is evidence also that the investigators had the shoes Joran wore that night and that there is evidence on those shoes.  I think it is likely that Joran tried to deny owning that particular pair of shoes.

Have fun gang....
(Mower is not running itself  :(   )

Breathe In   ---  Breathe Out   and NO :smt064  other Monkey for something ALE did NOT Do

Easy- I don't think anyone following this case doesn't believe the ALE and Dutch investigators didn't have a multitude of avenues, they just choose not to pursue any of em.

In a normal investigation, you want more info not less. This is a first for LE anywhere and everywhere.

ALE 101 - How NOT to conduct an investigation.

ALE 201 - How to destroy statements and evidence.

ALE 301 - How to launch a propaganda campaign that will fool no one.

ALE 401 - How to CYA - Call the Dutch.

Why I believe you are correct. Perhaps they have one shoe.

:smt098  :smt098

yes,  i read it

it could be the investigator was an idiot  :shock:

i did not see where the investigator checked the HEAL  :twisted:

i can put on a size 15 and make my toes go right to the end  :shock:


you look great, but youre being cranky  :P  8)


running quickly away from Anna  8)

before she throws a SHOE at me  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

No, the investigators asked him why he was wearing K-swiss shoes size 14 on the day in question.  They knew what shoes he wore on the day in question and must have had at least one of those shoes in their possession.  Otherwise they would not have framed their question that way.  They were looking for a reaction from him.  By this time, he was angry and determined not to speak, but slammed his shoe on the table to just let them know he was angry.[/i]

VANITY FAIR ARTICLE: “Wood found Cumpa, whose name turned out to be Carlos, in the yard. "He tells me that on that night, May 30, he couldn't sleep," Wood recalls. "It was 2:30 and it was so hot—he didn't have air-conditioning—he said, 'I got up, I told my wife I'm going to my boss's house,'" which was air-conditioned.
According to Carlos, while driving to Eric Mansur's home a little before three that morning, he took a shortcut, a dirt road through a vacant lot beside the Marriott. To his surprise, he found a car blocking the road. Beside the car were two large mounds of dirt. When he peered into the car, Carlos said, he recognized Joran and the Kalpoes. He said they covered their faces. He then drove on. [He] claimed he had seen Joran and the Kalpoes digging.


Could Joran  have gone to the Racquet Club to dig up what he buried there the night before? - Perhaps the shoes.

Quick ?  for anyone...

Can Heavy Battery

charges also include

Vehicular Homocide?

 :?:

Maybe Dompig should have checked to see what size Joran was really wearing like the Dutch guy did.

Or a body. Beside the car were two large mounds of dirt.  While the term "large" is relative, this seems a lot of dirt in my interpretation for a pair of shoes.

He saw them at 2:30 am Monday...the night/early am Natalee was missing...not the next night.

Maybe they had one shoe with evidence on it, and they wanted to find the other shoe.  Perhaps it had even more evidence on it.  Dompig needed to look like he was doing something, so he put out the APB for the size 14 shoe, mate to the one they already had.

I don't think so Carpe-... that sounds like fists to me.. or a bat.. or something used to dish out a beating..

(http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/7494/arubaracquetclub29ve.jpg)
Picture by Claussen Investigators

That dirt looks mighty tuff to dig up.

Time for me to cook the dinner for the hungry peeps around here.  I'll be back...

I have seen the car in the morning of 30 May of Sunday on Monday. I went to Lorena on Monday night, then I went to work, told that I saw a car standing along the way

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=271

Didn't Deepak tell someone to ask Joran about his shoes?

Kermit ... I have been search but I cannot find a credible quote that implies that the stain on the shoe was tested and ... it came back positive.  However ... I did find a post that implied that the stain was tested positive for blood but ... the blood could not be associated with Natalee Holloway.

Janet
 

Beth Twitty
On the Record w/ Greta
December 6, 2005

TWITTY: You know Greta now that you mention it I was looking through my journal and there was an update from an FBI official and also from our family liaison that in one of Joran Van der Sloot's tennis shoes there was blood. I had written that down. I wish that I had been able to obtain more information as to what happened to that one shoe if that was truly blood in his shoe. You know Greta like I said we are just so limited in any type of information we can get.

Sorry Kermit

I understand what you meant now.  I definately think they returned to the scene of some crime, with their little "walk" the next night.

He [Joran] says he might have lost a pair of sneakers on the beach the night Natalee disappeared," said lead police investigator Roy Tromp. "That's what he claims in one of his many statements."
Tromp said the 17-year-old suspect described the shoes as white and blue and brand new.

one of my theories is pretty graphic but invloves using his foot to finish her or attempt to quiet her/knock her out at the sloot dump

You would think after all his training with the FBi,ALE,KLPD and in Israel he wouldn't make that mistake. :roll:

Yeah I agree with you.

Why did they ask about the boxing gloves and the bit about Joran's girlfriends boxing??

Great observation *******
 :pig: I found a Miss Piggy smilie and have to use it

I do remember this comment Kermit made by ALE, if not Dompig? I thought I recall it being said that one sneaker was found in his closet with a speck of blood on it, but the other shoe was missing, hence the call to the public  for the one missing sneaker. There was never any statement issued about who the blood might have belonged to, infact I also recall reading, that several weeks prior to Natalee going missing Joran tried to pick-up another tourist and followed her to the bathroom at C+C's where he pulled a knife on her and threatened her, and added "I can do whatever I want my father is a big lawyer on this island" (not verbatim). So the obvious fact is that Joran carried a knife.......he might have used it any number of times

I remember that too.
But I don't recall any DNA testing and/or results on the shoe with the blood.

In todays Diario - Easy...ask Jossy about this.  The headline translated by MF at FOB =Dutch Circus came and left, but the clowns stayed behind :

CIRCO DI HULANDA A BIN Y BAI PERO E PAYASONAN A KEDA ATRÁS
 
ORANJESTAD(AAN):Mayoria hende lo sa, cu tin investigacion di casonan penal cu por dura y a dura años. Awor ta keda algo si, y esey entre otro ta kico ta motiva y exigi di polis pa sigui cu un caso pa aña tras aña te ora e wordu resolvi.

Ademas di esey, bo tin di puntra bo mes ta kico un investigacion cu por dura tanto ta encera. Tambe nos conoce casonan caminda , cu den investigacion ta ripiti loke ya a wordu hasi un biaha caba. Pero ripiticion di un parti di e investigacion no ta encera cu ta tur cos por wordo haci di nobo.

Tambe ta depende si ta vale la pena ripiti partinan di e investigacion. Hopi hende no kier tende esaki, pero tambe ta posible cu tin casonan cu nunca lo wordo resolvi. Esey ta bida y loke por pasa den bida.

Ta skirbi aki en general y bisando cu tin caso cu nunca lo wordo resolvi y no ta mustrando dede riba e caso di Holloway. Ora nos wak kico ta pasando cu e caso di Holloway y e investigacionnan haci y ripiticion e ultimo siman nan, bo tin di puntra bo mes si esakinan ta algo serio of ta no mas pa laga pasa cu e macamba si lo por bini atrobe cu tur sorto di ekipo y fanfare y pretende cu ta nan sa miho y ta nan lo bin soluciona e caso door di bolter e cos aki y aya y bolbe Hulanda.

Ken nos kier satisface ? Ta e americanonan ? Anto si ta e americanonan, anto mester a scucha entre otro diasabra pasa anochi comentarionan di Merca riba e showcase di e macambanan. . Nos a hasi nos mes un biaha mas masha ridiculo.

Kico ta e resultado di e “poppenkast gedoe” aki ? Ken nos ta kere di a satisface cu esaki ? Aki por mira nada mas cu tabata un demostracion di kico Hulanda tin na ekipo. Hecho ta keda, cu segun indicacion e ekiponan ey no a demostra nada tampoco.

Ta asina, cu bo por tin e miho ekiponan, pero si loke bo tin di busca cu nan no tey ni tampoco ta existí, anto e ekiponan ey no tin balor. Cu dos comisario, un di Aruba y e otro di Hulanda ta cana casi cu man teni no ta nada mas cu un berguensa pa cuerpo policial y su recherche.

Loke nan a hasi, ta kibra moral di e cuerpo di recherche di Aruba, cu ya tin bastante problema cu e caso aki. Tur comentario tabata cu si e chens di por a recupera algo importante cu e investigacion tabata minimo , casi imposibel, no tabata tin mester di hasi e fanfare aki atrobe.

Awor ta puntra: no ta e mesun macambanan aki cu tabata envolvi den e investigacion den comienzo tambe no a hasi loke mester a wordo hasi di antemano ? Tur loke a pasa awor, ta cu esnan cu dos placa di sinti lo puntra cu nan lo ta kere cu e doño di e cas caminda nan a ramsak ( ?) ta hende asina kens o sea di e kens ey pa sinta warda nan bin haya algo despues di tanto tempo ?.

Laga nos ta realistico y admiti cu ta investigacion mes a hasi nan sabi y a siña nan con por tapa cos y defende nan mes. Awor tin algo otro, cu kizas no ta tene na cuenta. Esey ta e ley cu nos conoce na Aruba y esun cu tur hende mester respeta.

Ta cual leynan ta wordo usa den e caso aki ? Wel, nos por sigui skirbi te mayan di e caso aki pero no ta vale la pena mas. Tur hende ta spera cu di un moda of otro, lo bin claridad den e caso aki, cu por lo menos asina por drecha nomber di cuerpo policial atrobe.

Pero no keda straño, cu un di e dianan aki nan manda avionnan di carga Antonov cu ta esnan mas grandi cu tin , yen di porkeria y bin bashe riba Aruba. Ta esey so ta falta. Nos ta spera cu si esaki sosode, cu mayoria di e porkeria cai riba e ministro di husticia, cu ta permiti degradacion di cuerpo policial di Aruba.

http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/5/7/

I have not heard about that, is it in a statement?

I dont find it too odd though, me and my friends used to do a little back yard boxing when we were around dipshits age.  Although I dont remember any of the girls doing it.

It sometimes got a little too carried away so we didnt do it very often.

When Dompig issued the statement regarding the missing shoe, I don't recall his having any confusion about the shoe size. He said it was a size 14. Joran was reported to have tried to buy, and been looking for a size 14 sport shoe. The only time confusion regarding size seemed to come into play was when the police officer alleged that the 10.5  sneaker of another prisoner fit joran. I don't know if this is shoe size, or foot measurement, not do i take his word as to precise shoe size over what was heaard for the first approximate 10 months.

wow, my memory is really lousy but this is sounding real familiar...

Kermit wrote;


Neither do I, maybe they threw it into the box of forensic evidence collected....for future testing. :wink:

Deepak made an obscure reference to *sporting shoes* to somebody on posse night per his 6/9 PV. He says he was just joking...

Blah

To your question whether I saw Deepak fight, I answer you the following. I have seen him box at home in my place. I have two pairs of boxing gloves at home and I have seen Deepak box with Satish and Koen. Deepak is to weak to box. Satish wins at boxing with Deepak and Koen beats both Deepak and Satish at boxing. I box with Betto and with Koen. Usually we are equally matched between the three of us. Sometimes I let/allow my girlfriend "Flor" and her sister Amanda Metz to box. An Aruban girl named "Jilaila" lives with Flor and Amanda and she watched some of those fights.

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=166

Reason number 433 to think this was a coverup..However we have not heard of any arrests or anyone even questioning the ALE. All we know is the KLPD are working alone. Dompig himself was critical of this in last weeks Interview saying they should be working more closely with the ALE.

Still checking this one out, but.....

That the circus came to Aruba, meaning the Dutch, and left, and only the clowns remained. Whoever wrote that article doesn't know what he is talking about. I already called the reporter's attention that he should consult with me before writing anything about the Holloway case. It won't happen again, I assure you!

That is why I consider it important to research the very early comments made by these punks before the cover-up was pulled into place and Paulus made sure they understood they could be in big trouble if they dobbed in "wonder boy".

.
Hello Monkeys.  I have read ALL the comments thus far and now going to check Lala's roster as to who is to be the monkey behind the curtain today.

The important fact of course is that in all likelyhood Joran was only missing one sneaker, IMO. To have left or even lost 2 shoes might be forgetful, an accident ,an incured expense at best. But how and where....and why one would be running or located to have lost one [/b] shoe is the big question. Was the owner of the shoe carrying something along with 2 shoes that when one might have been dropped it it  was not noticed? If the shoes were in his gym bag at the racketball club....would anyone have stolen just one?[/b]?

Buckeye, thanks.  I think I remember this now.

Wow, so Jossy didn't write it.  MF claims Jossy did.  The question for Jossy is have the Dutch team left Aruba or not?

Very true....Deepak does not strike me as the jolly hardy-har-har type guy even under the best of circumstances. JMO

Who are the referenced circus and who the clowns?

From what I gather, Circus is Dutch, clowns are ALE

I don't think I can take anymore discussion of the shoes, where have been on that for sixty pages. :shock:

Clowns = ALE & all the cabinet Ministers etc..     JMO

He told me a couple of hours ago that they were still there.

16:17EDT

The Dutch are still here and show no signs of leaving soon. The only thing that bothers me is their silence. No one knows at his point what they are up to, nor what they may have found that is of interest to their quest.

Hope to find out more about this confusion.

Hmmm thanks Klaas .

The last paragraph of the article seems to make it clear that the search was some type of bashing of Aruba?

++++++++++
Pero no keda straño, cu un di e dianan aki nan manda avionnan di carga Antonov cu ta esnan mas grandi cu tin , yen di porkeria y bin bashe riba Aruba. Ta esey so ta falta. Nos ta spera cu si esaki sosode, cu mayoria di e porkeria cai riba e ministro di husticia, cu ta permiti degradacion di cuerpo policial di Aruba.


but not stay odd, cu one of the dianan here they send avionnan of carga antonov cu is esnan more big cu have come across, complete of porkeria y come bashe on aruba. is esey only is miss. we is wait for cu if this sosode, cu majority of the porkeria cai on the ministro of husticia, cu is permiti degradacion of cuerpo policial of aruba

Thanks for the update Easy .

Mentioning Aruba and circus clowns in the one sentence just fits so well, don't you think?   :clown:  :clown:  :clown:  :clown:

I don't think the size matters one bit.. I do think he is missing only one and that is suspicious. That's the only real reason I'm interested in them.

But I feel your pain... err I mean - vulcan death grip.

I'm with ya's and I havent even followed the whole thing

Nothing like shoe business!

Don’t you wish that one topic at a time could be resolved in this case and systematically checked off the list?  It just can’t happen though, because we can’t get straight answers to simple questions.

Two points of interest here, the sighting was made close to 3 am on the early morning of May 30th, just two hours after leaving C&C. The second point is that Joran called Deepak at 2:35 am asking for a "ride home' from the same location. I believe that call was actually more like:" she won't wake up, what do we do"?  IMO

Would they be asking that already if they drugged her?

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

SILENCE is GOLDEN



bet the farm, the truck and the TRACTOR


and the TRAIN
 8)

Already at 1:30 several statements are given describing her as slipping in and out of consciousness or as they more delicately put it "falling in and out of sleep" They had been with her since 12:30.

i want the DUTCH to be very quiet  8)


when they arrest them all again, there will be SCREAMS of pain
from some and screams of joy from US  8)

Two points of interest here, the sighting was made close to 3 am on the early morning of May 30th, just two hours after leaving C&C. The second point is that Joran called Deepak at 2:35 am asking for a "ride home' from the same location. I believe that call was actually more like:" she won't wake up, what do we do"? IMO


Would they be asking that already if they drugged her?

Already at 1:30 several statements are given describing her as slipping in and out of consciousness or as they more delicately put it "falling in and out of sleep" They had been with her since 12:30.


My Impression is..It was the first time they drugged a tourist and they weren't sure what to do with her..

None, if you're here:



I DID NOT take notes. I seem to remember that we were asked NOT to do that beforehand so I didn't come ready to do it.

Beth was there for the entire evening meeting. She sat next to Robin at the front of the room and they collaborated on answers to questions. They got along almost like sisters, from my view, laughing and agreeing with one another with their comments. There was absolutely not the slightest hint of any rift or coolness between them whatsoever.

This was the occasion I referred to last night when I talked one-on-one with Beth and she was almost exactly my height. Robin is somewhat shorter.

msmarples is correct about Beth's answer. In fact, I may have been the one who asked about the 3 AM phone call, if I remember.

But this is VERY significant, Igs!!

They were already planting evidence before Beth even arrived.

Now when the Dutch interrogator proved Joran was lying and only wore the 10.5 shoe, it meant he planted the size 14 because he didn't even wear that size!  He put it at the FH to be found to prove he was somewhere he wasn't.  He was too cheap to leave his own real shoes, too!  He could have said he eft a pair of pink high-heeled stilettos if he could have convinced people he was wearing them that night.

Was in in a PV or that silly email that Deepak mentions saying sports shoes the first night, anyone?

They had likely spent at least the whole evening planting stuff that was never found!

If ALE had something like this that is exculpatory, I think they would have to tell the defendants.

.
.

have the Dutch checked out the painted rocks.

Hiya Monkeys


DEEPAK 06/13/2005 STATEMENT
<snip>

During the conversation I had with him I had for one reason or another shot my mouth off and said something about the sporting shoes. The man asked me what I meant by sporting shoes. I then said to him that I was thinking about something unrelated/different.

 :D  :D  :D

Some people like shoes, some like Shango, some like the vids!  We all have our areas of interest and makes for pretty good research.

But I do feel your pain as it is how I feel when a certain topic is discussed.  Can't say what or I will get in Lalas book for misbehavior.

.

How about Guido?

Joran's 6/14 PV is a load of BS which leaves Guido out of the picture until 10:30 because Guido was *working*.

Joran's diary (and likely book also) has him spending all night with Guido. From about 7:45 forward.

Yep!  That's it.  Another nail in their coffin, sotaspeak.

.

Anna - What is your avatar doing?

I honestly had never thought of the shoes as an "evidence plant" until I saw Anna's post. It makes sense he would try to put himself on the beach if the VDS home was the actual crime scene.

She's smelling those flowers.

Is yours wearing lipstick?   :shock:

.

I'm going to bring up shoes (ducking and hiding behind a tree)

I think I answer my own question on the 1st references to the durn shoes!

Aruban police search for suspect's shoes, expect another interview with teen http://www.courttv.com/news/holloway/080205_ap.html
Updated Aug. 2, 2005, 10:25 a.m. ET

From Deepaks 6/11 interview

From Jorans 6/14 interview

Plus more lies on times/activities etc.

AND it is August when they search for them (??)

End-of-shoes  discussion for me.  too

changing her shoes every couple hours  8)



HIDING and RUNNING from Anna  8)  :lol:  :twisted:

he he he! LOL :lol:

No, I just have full red lips!  :P

Yours turns into a black box on my computer.  Must be my display memory.

Oh Eeeeasy, I have someone for you to meet........

(http://www.sockmonkeyfun.com/images/88_full_Sock_Monkey.jpg)

Gosh, I'd like to know where she buys her clothes - I'd love a sexy outfit like that!  :lol:

I would LOVE to discuss Guido but I don't know the first thing about him! Tito called him Lorenzo Wever at first and threw us for a loop and I think we stalked some unconnected person for months over it!

I'd be more than happy to discuss Guido and think that HEAVY BATTERY is a very heavy charge.

But I don't know anything about him other than that. And that his attorney announced to the whole world Guido was gay and that he had a modeling site at one time.

.

She wears size 4 shoes also. :lol:

Could someone run the article  through a papi translator. I think Jossy is ripping on the Dutch team and what they have done (rather, not done) so far. Could it be the Dutch team has left?

Well, according to Klaas, he's a really good ice skater.  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Anna wrote;


Seriously, it is very hard to imagine Guido modeling anything.

Then I'd better loan her some - the poor girl must have lost hers on the beach.  :lol:  :lol:

 :lol:  :lol:

Guess that's not mascara, either, then, huh?  Just extra long dark lashes?

I change my avatar's outfit often and probably will tonight so next one may not be animated.  It should be OK for you.

.

Easy said via Jossy that the Dutch team is still there in Aruba, but that their activities are not known at this time. I don't think Jossy wrote the article.

Kinda cute!  Is she from Aruba?   :)

Spock - I know you will catch up but Jossy didn't write the article, one of his reporters did and Jossy isn't too happy about it.

If Jossy doesn't know where the Dutch team is or what they are doing, how does he know they haven't left?

That article is sort of upsetting.

.

No one has been charged. Under the Dutch system, suspects are detained on suspision. Charges are a whole different matter. I think you knew that, just wanted to clarify.

I see Jossy didnt write it, but I have a feeling it is saying the Dutch have left Aruba for now.

And if he doesn know what they are doing who is feeding Paulus information.  He was quick to answer they found nothing on this property.  How would he know.

Without a Guido PV...it is difficult.

It is obvious, though, that Joran intentionaly excluded him early on. And Joran's 6/14 PV is the only one that covers monday in-depth.

Andre's PV (and probabaly Guido's) forced Joran to adapt his story.

If the diary story matches up with his book story then Joran now admits to spending all night with Guido. Including 7:45 to 11:00...a time frame filled with a whole lotta nothing.

A little more insanity from the perps:

Satish 6/24:
You ask me what I meant when I said to the police force Wednesday June 1, 2005: "then I saw this and I said to Deepak, Joran is crazy”, I can explain it following:
Joran and the missing girl that he just met that day was satisfying himself already with a French kiss with the girl. I found that normal and my brother did not indeed and told me that Joran was crazy[/b]  So who said the "crazy" part?  Deepak or Satish?  



Satish 6/24:
On your question if during getting out of the car,were Joran and missing little girl entirely dressed, I can explain the following:
Joran and the missing girl had everything still on that they had when they got into the car.
[/i]
Satish 6/30:
On your question of when Deepak, Joran and I were with Natalee on, May 30, 2005, in the nighttime hours, wasn’t it too dark in the car for Joran to see the color of the missing girl’s panties, I can only answer this:
There was enough light in the car of Deepak. Joran must have taken off the clothing of the girl so that he could see the color of the panties she wore.[/b] And an unconscious Natalee dressed herself again in the back seat before getting out of the car.  

Satish 6/24:
We arrived at the lighthouse and the missing girl was sleeping already. The missing girl lay with her head on the lap of Joran. My brother asked Joran if the missing girl would still see the lighthouse or not. Joran said to my brother, "I do not think so"
[/b]

According to Jossy, as of a couple hours ago there are still in Aruba.

I stand corrected...  Yapper's  nailed it
to add a little more from that statement
May 31 with Beth & company at the Holiday Inn


10 1/2 size shoe... where did that come from?   What size does Deepak wear??   Sorry :oops:

Lala's in another statement they asked Satish is Natalee was fully clothed and Satish said yes.  So which is it Satish.

Unless they have been trickling off the island slowly, I think their departure would have been noticed and reported.  But, I am still checking it out and will let everyone know what I learn.

Deepak, i guess. So...am i to understand that french-kissing is *crazy*? Was this before or after the Ks put on the *non-crazy* porn video?

Oops sorry Lala's I just read it again.  I see you saw that.  You red highlights I was reading.

Chapter 6 of Joran's book - as summarized by Ramm at BFN (also in the Important Case Document forum)

CHAPTER 6 - GAMBLING

page 1:

- during their cruising for hot girl in the hotels and swimming pools Joran and his friends on occasion also walked through the many casinos who were in a lot of the hotels. Joran liked the atmosphere there, especially the free drinks one can use to tank up on alcohol before going out to a club.

- as a minor Joran was not allowed in the casinos but due to his posture he was seldom asked for his ID and after a while he had become a regular at the casinos so he was not asked to produce his ID because most employees at the casino assumed that he had been found to be 18 or older by some other member of staff.

- Joran watched a lot of poker and quickly caught on. His best subjects at school were math and statistics. Poker is less of a gambling game than black jack and you can control the game much more with poker. You can bluff, you can throw your cards away immediately or fold later on.

- Joran observed the poker game for 2 weeks. One Sunday evening at a free tournament he entered for fun and was pretty good at it. He was a good bluffer because he had a system with which I played with the 2 cards open on the table and not always the ones in my hands.

page 2:

- if I saw a weakness in somebody I would visualize that I had the best possible hand and that I would play it a certain way. Usually that worked for me especially if you can read a person's weaknesses. I do not know if I am also easy to read but I try to remain as cool as possible. Up to a point I can guesstimate what kind of cards someone has, but then again, that person could also just be good at bluffing.

- by watching body language and the way someone looks at their cards or looks out of their eyes, I can read whether that person has a good or a bad hand. For example, if someone looks 4 times at their cards even before flop and is very quiet, then I am going to assume he has a strong hand. If someone hits the table to quickly get the possibility to play then that person usually has a bad hand. When you have a good hand, you are mostly a lot more patient. Sometimes I make great plays/calls or raises and sometimes I make very poor plays.

- someones eyes are the most telling. The more often I play the same person, the better I can learn their game. I will know who the bluffers are and who are not. There are people who leave a table after 3 hours but there are also people who will play you all night long.

- at some tournaments I played for 8pm to 3am. The casinos are open till 6am and they will order pizzas for you and give you drinks all nigh.

- the poker tournaments on TV and the Super Hype give off a certain image of poker players. They were dark sunglasses, earphones at the table. That is bullshit. There are those who wear big sunglasses and sit there with their i-pods but most are just regular people. Old or young, man or woman. Poker is a social game, in between hands there is a lot of chatter.

page 3:

- but you need to stay focussed, poker is a tactical game where it is important to keep your cool. The best feeling is winning when you have nothing in your hands.

- in the past I never bought back into a tournament after I had been eliminated because I thought it was a waste of money. Now if often buy myself back into the tournament or play in 10 dollar tournaments.

- with poker Joran has won 5,000 USD (according to Joran that is. It may not sound a lot but for a 17 year old that is a lot of money. Nowadays people win hundreds of thousands of dollars at poker tournaments, but Joran says because he is only in it for a few years. Joran saved part of the one to his savings account. That way he was able to buy a I-river.

- Joran had no job, he liked hanging out. He got 100 aruban florins. If he needed clothes or books his parents would buy it for them, etc.

- Joran says he had no time for jobs anyway, between all the things he had to do during the day.

- whenever his money was gone, he would just ask his parents for more.

= his father once offered him a deal, he would get 160 USD a month if  agreed to buy his new clothes and mom or dad would no longer pay for that.  

page 4 (and a bit page 5, last page of chapter):

- the deal with his parents cost him because it was a bad deal for him. Now he had to pay for his clothes and that meant spending a lot more than before and one pair of good pants could cost him a months budget.

- his parents thought he was not good with money. Joran at first disagreed. Maybe he did spend too much money when he went out, but what teen doesn't?

- participating in the poker tournaments on Sundays at the Holiday Inn cost no money but could bring Joran money. And that money could be used to boost his "going out fund".

- Joran's parents dislike/hate casinos. They thing gambling is a waste of money and they are afraid of addiction. They did not forbid me to go but they also did not like me going to the casinos to play in the tournaments. I had told them that i was participating in free poker tournaments. That I also played tournaments for money is something that I did not tell them. I can understand my parents not jumping for joy at the prospect of me doing this but I thought as long as my schoolwork does not suffer, what is the problem with me going out and gambling?

- at the time I was under the guidance/treatment of a psychiatrist. According to statements in the media I had to go there because I supposedly had a violent temper problem, that I was beating up my mother and my brothers, but nothing could be further from the truth. I was undergoing treatment at the psychiatrist, once every 5 weeks I had to go there, because I had stolen money from my mother and father and had lied about that. I used to lie about a lot of things in those days and I talked to the psychiatrist about that too.

- after 5 sessions, I was supposed to have the last session with him and my parents on June 14th 2005. The psychiatrist told my parents that I had finished the treatment and she was of the opinion that I have moved forward. She did say that she thought I am the kind of person that needs a clear structure. Joran says that he does not like psychiatrists and that he thinks it is a lot of nonsense, but hey, he had no choice but to go.

- it was one of the reasons my parents, when looking for a next school for me, opted for a small school with a lot of structure and guidance for me. After I had visited several universities with my mother in the US, they chose St. Leo's in Tampa Florida, also though partly because of the scholarship.

END CHAPTER 6

Good evening
Finally caught up .. now gonna sit back and lurk.. :)

Old Fart,
I post this at the risk of upsetting Spock who can't take any more shoe talk.  I'm sorry Spock and will gladly move on, just wanted to answer OF's Question.


Posted by Tamikosmom/Janet earlier this evening:
Mon May 07, 2007 6:06 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=385


JORAN 08/08/2005 Dutch Interrigators Statement
(translated by Ramm at BFN)

We,

Jaquelline Josette de WINDT, head officer with the Korps Politie Aruba, attached to the section surveillance of Sint Nicolaas.

Antoon Ronanld de RUITER, sergeant of police in the Netherlands, region Utrecht, districht Utrecht South East and appointed by National Decision by the Governor number DWJZ 3473/05 dated July 27th 2005 as special temporary officer of the Korps Politie Aruba.

Clemens Johannes Maria BURGWAL, sergeant of police in the Netherlands, region Utrecht, districht Paardenveld and appointed by National Decision by the Governor number DWJZ 3473/05 dated July 27th 2005 as special temporary officer of the Korps Politie Aruba.

State the following.

On Monday August 8th 2005, at approximately 09.48 we, the reporting officers, questioned in the police station of Oranjestad in Aruba, the suspect

Joran Andreas Petrus VAN DER SLOOT
born on August 6th 1987 in the Netherlands and living at Montanja 19 in Aruba

for further information.
The interview was conducted by us, reporting officers de Windt and the Ruiter and in the control-room, I, reporting officer Burgwal followed the interview via an internally installed video-system. And by me, reporting officer Burgwal a summation was made regarding the interview.

For the description of the interview room and the control room I refer to a seperate police report made about this.

In the interview room was also present the lawyer of the suspect, named mr. O.R.G. Faarup.

Suspect made statements to questions put to him, in an abridged version, the now following:

Suspect was congratulated by the reporting officers for his birthday. He smiled.

Suspect was then informed that the District Attorney on Aruba had filed a deposition with the court with regard to extending so that the temporary arrest warrant would be extended to September 4th.

Suspect was onces again informed of the statements that were made by his friend Freddy and people close to Freddy.

He was also asked why his legal team was mis-informing the press with regard to the interviews in an appearant attempt to put the police in a bad light. In the press it was written that the lawyers were not given time to speak to the client and that on his birthday he was interrogated from the early morning to late at night.
The suspect did not answer.

The suspect was shown/informed that he had stated that he and the girl went for a walk. And that there was a statement of someone that saw Deepak Kalpoe's car at a location that was several hundred yards away from the Fishermans hut.
He was asked about the logic of this and other issues and whether he can explain why he was there with the other boys in that particular location.
The suspect did not respond.

He was again confronted with statements made by several of his intimate friends that he had screwed them/hung them out to dry by lying and having sexaul relations with the girlfriend of one of his friends. These boys say that he has been constantly fooling them and manipulating.
He was again confronted with the statement of the girl Martina, who was offered a beverage during the sexual relations that caused her lips to feel tingly.

The suspect did not respond.

After that there were several confrontations with regard to the date of giving statements by several witnesses, the omissions in the statements of the suspect and the omissions in the statements made by his fellow suspects and the timeline in which those statements were made.
The suspect did not respond.

Suspect was asked to take off one of his shoes. Suspect looked back and wanted to find support from his lawyer but his lawyer was not looking at him and was writing. He put it on the the table noisily/with a bang.

The reporting officers then asked him why he was wearing K-swiss shoes size 14 on the day in question when he now was wearing size 10.5 shoes.
After the suspect had put his shoe back on, I, reporting officer de Ruiter pressed down on the nose of the shoe and felt that the toes of the suspect fit straightly and properly in the shoe.

The suspect did not respond.

The interview was concluded at approxmimately 11.30.

So Joran, being the true gentleman that he is, put Natalee's clothes back on her after he raped her. All in an enclosed car. Uh-HUH.

No sale. They were at VDS House. These statements are bad lies, unsupported and unsupportable.

Exactly igsigs.

They were saying he was crazy because Joran was hitting Natalee and one of the Kalpoes were upset.

Tommy Pooch commented in a magazine article or somewhere what a lousy poker player Joran is.

Now he is lecturing others on the finer points of the game? I think he really, really wishes he were a good player.
.

I'm going to call it an early night... I will have a post in the Prayer Thread and I am then heading out. I will see you good folks tomorrow evening if all goes well.  :wink:

Or aroused.   :roll:

.

O/T

From Blah's earlier post, a half alien baby

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Avatars/th213998nsurwem1.jpg)

BBLater. . .

Will check in on my way to the Monkey Bunkey and see if we hear any more about the Dutch team leaving.

.

- as a minor Joran was not allowed in the casinos but due to his posture he was seldom asked for his ID and after a while he had become a regular at the casinos so he was not asked to produce his ID because most employees at the casino assumed that he had been found to be 18 or older by some other member of staff.

Now just how does this explain the fact that the 17-year-old walked into a casion with his judge-in-traing dad and entered a poker tournament?

Jesus Christ!  This book is some type of strange joke!

Miami club impresario Tommy Pooch, who played next to Van Der Sloot for more than two hours, tells us the Dutch-born youth "was as nice as can be, but he was a terrible poker player.

"He kept buying back in, and finally he got knocked out when they stopped buy-ins," Pooch said. "He was a terrible bluffer . . . He was a young, excitable kid. He wore the sunglasses and the baseball cap like they do on TV, but even that didn't help."

Van Der Sloot must have had a habit of losing money in the poker room of the Holiday Inn-Aruba. "It seemed like everyone knew him there," Pooch said. "It was his hangout. He knew all the dealers by name. He was a local yokel."

- after 5 sessions, I was supposed to have the last session with him and my parents on June 14th 2005. The psychiatrist told my parents that I had finished the treatment and she was of the opinion that I have moved forward. She did say that she thought I am the kind of person that needs a clear structure. Joran says that he does not like psychiatrists and that he thinks it is a lot of nonsense, but hey, he had no choice but to go.


 Sounds to me that his DR needs a friggin Dr as well.. :roll:  he starts his book off by saying hes a liar and can't help it and still continues to do so?
  TY Klaas for posting  ... Read it and makes me ill. The whole chapter.. the bluffing.. of course hes good at it. WTF does he think this case is a poker game or what?

AngieX
Boy that figures.... I'm in the cage and you are just going to (hang around & lurk) (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/8b03b6c8.gif) & (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/629eb142.gif)


Klaasend
 thanks for the posting the book segment.
WHY.. just because it was illegal...that no biggie...  :twisted:
I do wish someone would look or at least as the correct people  why the hell NO one has been charged with the "minor crimes"
An atty that allows his son gamble illegaly and even takes him there  :twisted:  :twisted:

Anna  
thanks it was during Joran's statement and the shoes he was wearing

sinking down the tubes..........

this book is a nightmare

It SICK .. They had to have had known he was a minor. Its BS!

 Hi Oldfart.. :)   :wink:  You have a great poiny.. Daddy~O  goes with him.. knowing full well hes underage?

then Karen flipped. She and Melody went to the same school. Karen got into Melody's face and confronted her. When Joran picked Melody up from school that day and she told him that Karen had said they had been sleeping together.

He was probably driving as well..

after 5 sessions, I was supposed to have the last session with him and my parents on June 14th 2005. The psychiatrist told my parents that I had finished the treatment and she was of the opinion that I have moved forward. She did say that she thought I am the kind of person that needs a clear structure. Joran says that he does not like psychiatrists and that he thinks it is a lot of nonsense, but hey, he had no choice but to go.

 I just re read this.
  Guess he can't make up his minf if his Dr is a HE or a SHE??  WTH?

I was supposed to have the last session with him


The psychiatrist told my parents that I had finished the treatment and she was of the opinion that I have moved forward. She did say that she thought I am the kind of person that needs a clear structure.

 :roll:  :roll:  :roll:

If you or I did what Mom &  Pop   or even the k'2  we would be looking at contributing to the delinq. of a minor. at a minimum.

Wonder what charges &  $$$'s the bars and casinos would be looking at.

OH... That right... we do not understand their laws... AND they wonder why they have certain social problems :roll:

oran's parents dislike/hate casinos. They thing gambling is a waste of money and they are afraid of addiction. They did not forbid me to go but they also did not like me going to the casinos to play in the tournaments. I had told them that i was participating in free poker tournaments. That I also played tournaments for money is something that I did not tell them. I can understand my parents not jumping for joy at the prospect of me doing this but I thought as long as my schoolwork does not suffer, what is the problem with me going out and gambling?


If "Joran's parents dislike/hate casinos" why did Paulus go to the Casinos to gamble?  And even worse, he would be there with Joran.  Go figure...

My post was from Chapter 6-Gambling from Joran's book-sorry...

Does anyone know how many News papers are on Aruba and if any have a "Letter to the Editor" type section?

I would love to Ask  Why certain know illegal acts were never acted upon NO Matter how minor they seem & if time limits have expired ?

Evening Monkeys!  Just doing a drive by as I am working on a candlelight vigil for Jaycee.  

Klaas....if I send you an email will you forward it to Dana Pretzer for me?  TIA.

I will be back later! (that's a warning) :wink:

:oops:   I forgot to add...

I wonder if Rethos  rag would allow question like that to be published.?

:oops:   I forgot to add...

I wonder if Rethos  rag would allow question like that to be published.?

It is extremely hard to believe that no one stopped Joran from writing this book!  Some of these chapters should be enlarged, framed and sent to Taco Joe!!!!!!!!!!!

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/PauluslettertoJoran1.png)

OK

 Hey Crazy Ang!!  :)

Well gang...
I need to depart  and I'm getting too :smt076  thinking about what &  why things were not done

PS.
Is anyone else getting real tired of the ARUBA  commercials on the Word Poker Tournament segments?  They play there in Oct. (I think).

It would be great if we could convince one of the Top Players (or more) to wear a shirt with J4N on it.  Maybe nothing more just J4N in big letters front & back.
SeeeeYaaaByeeeeee

If you notice Satish says he told them on June 1.  Was this a casual conversation or what?  I don't recall a statement on that date by Satish.

Me too OF.. good nite everyone.

P.S.  No Body , No Case

Paul

Is everyone else having margin problems?  I can't figure out what is blowing the margins for me.  Thought it was Crazymoms signature line but I fixed that and still blown.

im blown out over here

 Goodnight Rob..

Well, I know you can't read it now but it was Rob's post.  I couldn't tell it was a screen capture.

Blown here too, but I refreshed page and back to normal again  :roll:

This book makes this kid and his family look even worse than we originally thought!  Is something hidden between the lines of all of this BS?

mine is good now  8)

It seems impossible to believe that Jorans father, a lawyer could not get him to refrain from  publishing  this book.  It seems to speak to the fact that Joran definately has an underlying psychological condition that makes him feel he knows more than anyone else, and can lie to everyone, and out-smart everyone.

Nite Rob

It was Rob's post.  I fixed his image and made it smaller, but now you can't read it, LOL  :lol:

More bullshit is all I can think of?  :wink:

thank you Klass

 
 I could read it with my face approx 3 inches from my monitor  lol

i better write this small..but just because the TAG in the sneaker says SIZE 10..that doesnt make it a size 10


as with everything in this case.. things are NEVER as they Appear


stepping off my shoebox


 8)

bb you are so correct.  And the book is certainly not destined to become one of the great milestones in English literature.

maybe thats why they wanted the sneakes BOUGHT....for the TAGS


next post might have to be smaller

 8)

Robots - you're cracking me up  :lol:

Pure bullshit!  But at least I can now understand how the Dutch could be sitting around the VDS property and laughing as they read this book.

What really amazes me is that none of the people in this family appear to be particularly smart.  In fact, they could teach a rock a few things about being dense.  So, who or what has kept them so untouchable for the past two years?

Didn't Joran tell Greta that he did not see a psychiatrist?

i am... ???

 im trying to use camoflauge color in the type


LOL

I think this so called book is giving us an inside look at just how "warped" this goon child really is.

YES

Not sure if it was Greta, but it was someone

there is always one in a CROWD that has to squuuuuuueeeeeeelll



 :wink:  :wink:  :wink:  :wink:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Robots - next time try code, lol

HEHEHE

The book has to be a blessing..It is almost as ridiculous as the Investigation has been...The dutch never had a greta or major media so they saw the very few facts. Now that De Vries and the Book have come out the Dutch are standing beside us in dibelief.

good idea

tank you very very very much  :wink:


the EAGLE has landed

the CROW flies at MIDNIGHT

Joran is eat up with the ME syndrome. He thinks the whole world revolves around him & what he wants. I can just see him in my mids eye when he is told No. Goes into a rage like a wild animal. All the more reason he should have been corrected as a child instead of getting his way. For this I blame his so called piss poor excuse for parents. JMO

HI Monkeys!!  And, he says this book writing is his therapy now, because he doesn't like psychiatrist.  :roll:

Joran's June 11, 2005 statement:

To you question as to whether I am under treatment from a doctor, I answer you that I am not. I am being treated by a dentist because I have toothache. I am also under treatment of a psychologist. This because I felt bad about the fact that the girl had gone missing. Before the girl went missing I was also under treatment of a psychologist. This was because I had taken 50 euro's from my dad and also took money from my mother and I used my brothers mobile phone without asking for permission and after that I had broken the chip from his mobile phone. I also once fought with my brother in Miami but we are good friends now. My brother is fifteen (15) years old and his name is "Valentijn". He is the one I would like to talk to.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Greta Interview March, 2006:

Interviewer: What's the anger management stuff, though? At some point, correct me if I'm wrong, that you were getting some sort of... you know, that... were you going to some courses or classes or something? Was there a problem with that?

Joran van der Sloot: No, I never went to any.

Interviewer: Nothing like that? Never been an anger issue?

Joran van der Sloot: No. Never. No.

Interviewer: That's just all made up?

Joran van der Sloot: Yes.

Interviewer: Totally... totally fiction?

Joran van der Sloot: Totally made up.

Interviewer: Ok.

Joran van der Sloot: Totally fiction.

Me too, I agree. His parents need parenting classes!

Boy, I can hardly wait to read mom and dad's diary notes. :roll:

 Amen YAP!!
  Hi sweety  :wink:

It was Greta.

Joran Van der Sllot
On the Record w/ Greta
March 6, 2006

VAN SUSTEREN: What's the anger management stuff, though? At some point, correct me if I'm wrong, that you were getting some sort of — you know, that — were you going to some courses or classes or something? Was there a problem with that?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, I never went to any.

VAN SUSTEREN: Nothing like that? Never been an anger issue?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. Never. No.

VAN SUSTEREN: That's just all made up?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: Totally — totally fiction?

VAN DER SLOOT: Totally made up.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK.

VAN DER SLOOT: Totally fiction.

Hiya Ang


Klaas I think this is what he meant:

after 5 sessions, I was supposed to have the last session with him and my parents on June 14th 2005. The psychiatrist told my parents that I had finished the treatment and she was of the opinion that I was a hopeless case & should have a rubber room built around me with no doors or windows.   :twisted:

Okay, this is bugging me.  Joran dictates a “book” completely of his own volition to someone and I assume he maintains complete editorial control until publication.  Yet, he can not keep his story straight from paragraph to paragraph, much less between chapters.  Plus, what has been written portrays a very manipulative, egotistical sociopath hell bent on telling of his nefarious exploits.

I rambled, but my question is how did ALE manage to spend all that time with him and not get answers?  All they had to do is ask him and he would have told them what a great accomplishment it was for him to rape and kill an American tourist.

Yes indeed! And probably didn't want to see him privately, because, being a psychiatrist she would have figured out a lot about this case by seeing him, and didn't want to get drug into court. IMO

You have to WANT to get answers. :wink:

I apologize bleachedblack .... I did not notice that you had already posted the Greta quote.

Janet

 :lol:

You just described some of the characteristics of a sociopath.  I don't know if they're born or bred, but I do think he's been allowed to do what he wants with little discipline.  But then again, even with discipline, he'd still have a self-centered personality that cares nothing about others, but he might have learned not to be destructive towards dogs, brothers and women.  The abuse of women thing......I just don't know what causes it.  Freudian.  Is it about mama or papa or is it learned from them?  I say lock him up and analyze it.

Paulus insulted quite a few people in the Netherlands as well by his arrogance. After talking about the specialized Equipment,Forensic units and Investigators in his back yard.

Our house was a sort of resort… They’d put tables outside… Chairs… Uh drinks… Uh lots of food… Uh… Making lots of pleasure… These uhh, these uhh, these boys and girls had the time of their lives and uhh… And I welcome it to them off course…

Certainly looks like a guy that is too smart for them. 23 months ahead of them and doesnt have to answer one question. The KLPD has to be frustrated.

if it is even possible... this BOOK makes the ARUBA LAW
UN-ENFORCEMENT look even more EVIL, STUPID

take your pick

EVIL or STUPID

it makes em look even WORSE

didnt think it was possible

this is why the DUTCH are gonna put a BOOT in joran, k2, paulus, and guido

Ain't that the truth!  I'm thinking this guy was running his mouth from the beginning and it was all about damage control.  It is obvious he doesn't know when to keep his mouth shut!

Robots, I don't know if she comes in different colors, but I'd like you to meet the Wakamaru Companion Robot:  

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/wakamarucompanion.jpg)

........then there were the specially trained psychological interviewers(sorry I don't recall theie official titles) that were sent to the prison to interrogate him, and then tooo the FBI was witnessing Jorans interrogations. It is a big question mark to me too. They must have recorded some of these interogations?  Even Dompig made the comment about Joran appearing to be "Gods gift to mother-in-laws". I also remember an FBI comment about him being one of the strangest people psycologically they have come across...does anyone remember that?

is she a good robot ????? 8)

Doesn't it though!~I wonder how they feel after reading his book, and thinking..."We couldn't get this guy."

Yeh...and that he rules the house.

I hope so.  

Do you think she's pretty?  
(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k304/LilPuma04/wakamarucompanion.jpg)

BB, I don't think the behavior specialists could figure out what made him tick. More proof to me that when he was born they threw out the baby & gave to Slootytoots the afterbirth.

  YAP  LOL!
I got behind.. So HOWDY to everyone that came in!

Don't know, just found her online.  Didn't even check Myspace.   :?

I was taught Sociopaths were born and could not be treated.The robot is cute.

Dompig said the FBI diagnosed pathological liar and sociopath.

The Dutch youth interrogators said...unusual...or unique...or something like that. I will have to look for that article.

If the Dutch do nothing, it will be a serious black eye for their investigative skills.  Are they willing to quietly let this case languish, or will they prove that they deserve the accolades some have given NFI?

LMAO! :lol:

beautiful robot  8)

From another site after googling

SNIP:Moreover, Dompig says, this summer F.B.I. profilers completed a detailed psychological evaluation. "He struck us, and the F.B.I., as a guy who can make you believe he's God's gift to mothers-in-law," Dompig says. "But if you look at his actions, he's anything but. The F.B.I. profiled him as a person who never has been corrected by his parents. He's the boss of what happens in that house. He's the boss in the family. He is allowed to do anything.… If a person like that is in a position where a person says, 'No,' well, that person may change completely. Maybe he blew a fuse when she wouldn't have sex with him, and something happened."
http://www.vanityfair.com/fame/featu...?currentPage=9

i still say the more time they take initially is good news

but thats just me  8)

dompig is a ZIG ZAG machine

one day its THIS

the next day its THAT

he is a loser

 Robots.. I am hoping you are correct....
 Hope this is the quiet before the storm sotospeak.  :shock:

Found it....the suspects behavior was so exceptional...

Wonder whatever happend to TTOWNMIKE?
Whatchatawkinbout?

 Im confused Igs?  exceptinal as to ???

I saw one time where sandrak was asking people if Easy =TTownmike LMAO!!

Something just seems very out of kilter in all of this.  It has to be larger than one missing girl.  Countries do not buckle to their knees over such cases.  There is something going on here that is not obvious……

So exceptional that ALE brought in the Dutch youth interrogators. Probably the exceptional = lying.

I agree, he talks out of both sides of his ....um....ass.

That's pretty funny........

+++++++++++++++++++++++

 ANASTASIYA BOLTON, WBMA REPORTER COVERING STORY: Nancy, officials in Aruba, Dutch specialists, interrogated Joran Van Der Sloot today. They started early in the morning and went all day until 5:00.

They`re called behavioral specialists. They specialize in noticing and analyzing behavior and how a person answers questions. We also know that the FBI participated in the interrogation, as well. They were seen walking into the downtown police department where Joran was interrogated all day carrying Natalee Holloway folders.

We understand that there`s also going to be an interrogation going on tomorrow. As far as the results of the investigation, and the interrogation from today, we do not know what, if anything, they may have found out.

Another development: A hearing is going to be held tomorrow. Joran Van Der Sloot`s attorney is protesting the FBI`s involvement in this case. So we expect a judge to make a decision on that tomorrow, possibly later in the week.

http://tinyurl.com/35ll55

  LOL  Elaine! I guess when I wrote sotospeak.. it reminded me of him!  :)

Yes, scarey..isn't it?!!

 I agree.. there is something more then just Natalee being gone. :(

I thought he was a good guy who cared a lot about this case.  :)

Looks like another accidental death or suicide in Aruba.
Man dies in police car  

WILLEMSTAD – A man that was arrested yesterday for robbery, died in the police car.  The police say that the man was probably under the influence of drugs.  The body of the 48-year old Gershwin La Croes that lived in De Savaan, is confiscated for autopsy.  

The police of Rio Canario received reporting of a robbery at a snack at the Rooseveltweg yesterday afternoon.  When they arrived at the location, they found a man that was acting very agitated.  They decided to take him to the cells in Punda, so he can calm down. When they arrived they realized that La Croes had died.  The police doctor certified the victim’s death. The body was confiscated and the investigation continues.

One of my theories for a long time has been that this whole mess goes WAY up the line -- all the way to the US State Department and The Hague.  
It became very clear to these two entities that the Aruban Government was in this up to their eyeballs.
You just can't go in and bring down the entire government of a country without a LOT of wrangling and planning by BOTH the U.S. and The Netherlands. Remember, Aruba is still very much teetering with their own Sovereignty issues. Throw in Chavez in the mix and you have a very precarious situation there.
While justice in the Natalee Holloway case is a concern -- unfortunately the whole Sovereignty issue is what is driving the involvement of the Dutch.
( my theory is this will all be resolved eventually -- but it will be HUGE in the aftermath)  :shock:  :?:  :shock:

 Me too~!!  He was funny.. :) I always said it was nice to see men posting about the case.. Still will  :)

Oh my gosh!

"Believe me, we were looking for anything to throw him, to keep him in jail," says Dompig. "The only thing he admitted to was that he was fondling [her] sexually, like kissing, touching her. And there was no sexual in terms of penetration or whatever, really having sex with her.”

After nearly two dozen lengthy interrogations, the police still had no confession and had found no body. So on Sep. 3, 2005, Joran van der Sloot was released to his parents.

"This young man, a 17-year-old-boy was able to withstand 90 days in prison, and undergo specialized interrogation, and they weren't able to get a confession from him," says attorney Arlene Shipper.

"What does that say ?" Roberts asks.

"It can mean two things — either he's innocent, he really doesn't know what happened, or he's a genius," she replied.

Joran van der Sloot has denied any wrongdoing, but he has done nothing to dispel Dompig’s suspicions.

Asked what FBI profilers told Dompig about van der Sloot's psychological profile, he says, "They use the word sociopath. And the fact that he was capable of lying about basically everything.


http://tinyurl.com/3bzhte

The body was confiscated and the investigation continues.
 I have heard fo weapons.. drugs.. alcohol.. etc being  confiscated.. but a  body?  geezeeeeeeeeee.  :shock:

Who are The police of Rio Canario , I wonder?

Easy ... I agree.

I contend that Aruba/Holland have hit a road block but there is no turning back ... the implications of solving the Natalee Holloway case are so far reaching.  The fallout is too huge to comprehend when you consider ... Paulus Van der Sloot … the sons of the elite … those at all levels of the Dutch/Aruban administrations who participated in the coverup; the judiciary as well as drugs … gambling … prostitution … pornography …money laundering …

IMO

Janet

Isn't Willemstad in Curacao?

  YEPPERS Janet  :)

I think the Dutch are putting together their case.  They're waiting for results from NFI to support their case.  They may be going over Joran's book and the diaries taken from the VDS residence and putting it together with what they and ALE have collected.  They could also be going over the hard drive they took, assuming they copied it before giving it back.  Could be they are talking to people but doing it quietly.  I can see them wearing floppy hats and flipflops and Hard Rock t-shirts so no one even knows who they are as they move silently around the island doing their work to take down the perps, the drug dealers, the corrupt officials.  The Queen could be getting a fax soon telling her which judge's robes need to be yanked.  With all the corruption and complicity on the island, they have to be very quiet and careful.

I think that after the night of the confession, Daddy got word to him to just sit tight and to shut up...and eventually he would get out.

THE CREASE IN THE RIGHT SLEEVE IS IDENTICAL ..............

THE WATCH IS ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE .............

THERE IS NO DOUBT .............

ITS PAULUS IN THE CASINO PHOTO ...........

 :roll:

I hope you are right! I do not care what the VDS are saying... they are sweating right about now.

 Awesome thoughts Puma~!!  We can only hope!

I watched that video last night..I noticed Paulus was hittin the drink quite a few times in the short clip. I wonder if Paulus was boozin it up that night?

Hiya Widget. How are the girls? Have they got you trained yet?  :lol:

I agree it is Paulus in the casino. If not (God forbid) he has a twin on that rock.

A mere speck floating atop the Caribbean Ocean becomes the focus of worldwide attention, because a young girl misses her flight home.  Nothing of consequence is done by the U.S. and the Netherlands stand back and claim their hands are tied due to a hybrid separation that took place years earlier.  What is the real reason both countries attempted to distance themselves from the case of Natalee Holloway?

Aruba has been in political turmoil for a number of years and the ruling party continues to vocally align themselves with Hugo Chavez’s regime only twenty nautical miles away.  Could this be the over-riding factor in the decisions made by both the U.S. and the Netherlands to remain aloof?

Hi yapperz1 ...........

We Are Getting Quite Good In Cricket ....LOL

They Are Growing Up Too Fast .............

 8)

Elaine, Angie, I'm hoping too.  I keep remembering the former FBI guy on Nancy Grace saying that these guys from NFI are as good as anyone you'll find at Quantico.  I remember Dr. Lee going to the room where George Smith stayed.  I wish Joey T had let Dr. Baden talk more.  

I agree that there's more to this case than 3 young men and a wannabe judge.   There are probably drugs involved and then the botched investigation and wire taps and where did Joran get the money and Guido wetting his pants and...... I'm out of breath.  But the Dutch investigators have more info than we do.  Boxes and boxes of it.  And DeVries thinks these guys are guilty (don't know if he said it though) and the Dutch probably do to but they have to PROVE it.

I agree, LilPuma.  Easy to imagine them posing as Dutch tourists and listening to all the island gossip about the case.  Who knows what gems of information they can pick up that way.

I will never forget Charles Croes remarks... "I hope we can all handle the truth."

 :lol:  I wouldn't doubt it.

Yap..
  You got mail.. nuttin important.. Talk to yah when I can  :wink:

  Elaine..  I recall that remark as well.   Maybe Janet has that saved?
Or anyone else??

If Puerto Rico screwed something like this up would we jump in?  Could we?

Hi Angie .........

Charles Croes Stepped Down From His Original Statement .............

He Was Told To Button His Lip ...............

 8)

I think that lil ole island is monitored a lot more than we think. Because of drugs, porn, prostitution, casinos, money laundering etc etc... I also have the opinion that a lot of my aforementioned is overlooked, intentionally....You rub my back , I will rub yours, but if you go down ...we all go down. If that makes sense.

 Hi Yah Widget..
 Somehow that don't shock me any..  :evil:
<Hope all is well with the Mrs and the girls  :) >

Exactly!  Like at a poker table or on the golf course.  Maybe on a catamaran or fishing boat.  If they're going to solve this case, and I'm still hoping and praying they truly want to, they know they have to look at the coverup.  They obviously know that there's corruption involved in this case or they wouldn't have insisted on separate offices from ALE.

I'm not certain Paulus is that well connected.  His case before the European Court of Human Rights back in 1992 list his siblings.

http://tinyurl.com/wtg7w

Yes, he sure did. But, we will not forget that he DID say it. :wink:

Yea!  Like Oduber's son is accused of raping a girl, but that's covered up and smoothed over and when he tells ALE to let the FBI in on Holloway someone whispers the girl's name in his ear.

Author: Charles (—.setardsl.aw)Date: 06-02-05 09:01There are issues in this case that can go beyond the obvious in their implications.It will take time for all the information regarding this lovely child to come out. Some of it will be hard to handle and some of it will be expected. With regards to the family of this missing child, my prayers are with you.I was with them on the first night they arrived to ARuba (looking for their daughter) from midnight until 5:30 AM and have kept in touch. In my opinion, this issue has far reaching implications for all those involved.I wish all of us strength

charles

arubafastphones.com.com

If the U.S. had made a deal with Puerto Rica that resembled anything like the “Status Aparte” achieved by Betico Croes in 1986, I doubt we would be very quick to rush in and tell them how to do business.

I cannot believe any publisher actually took a chance on Joran's book.  What we have seen so far leaves little doubt that he is a narcissistic out-of-control wannabe.  Beth Twitty was so right about letting him continue to talk!

So, what are his fans over at RU/FOB saying, now that they have seen more of their hero??  Or can they even recognize what a negative picture he paints of himself?

Boxer Hector "Macho" Camacho sent to jail following guilty plea
May 7, 2007

http://sports.yahoo.com/box/news?slug=ap-camachoplea&prov=ap&type=lgns
GULFPORT, Miss. (AP) -- Three-time boxing champion Hector "Macho" Camacho was sent to jail Monday after pleading guilty to a 2004 burglary charge.

Heres a lawyer for you..Camacho had bought a laptop from the business but had left it there for work on technical problems. He was trying to retrieve his computer, his attorney, David Morrison, said. The break-in was "a momentary lapse in judgment," he added.

Heres what really happened..Wayne Woodall, the Wheelers' attorney, claims Camacho fell through the ceiling, cut himself, urinated inside the office and left with seven laptops and about $5,600 in checks and cash.

 That link didn't work for me... for some reason?
 PVS and his siblings...

(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a206/Angiex911dsptchr/mvds.jpg)  (http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a206/Angiex911dsptchr/hans2.jpg)  (http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a206/Angiex911dsptchr/Paulus.jpg)

Marco the first pic.. brother hHns and sweaty ass himself..

Consider also that Aruba didn't even want to be part of the Netherlands Antilles..........They wanted complete autonomy.

  Thanks Yap!  :)

I am hugging Nemo for the night...just a quick request...please drop by the Lounge and look up the prayer requests of all our monkeys.  They need our help and a small prayer is never too much to ask.  Night all.

Niters Monkeys

  Night Lalas.. hugs to you too!!  Already posted at the prayer thread.
I will hug Nemo when I deprat as well.. :)

  Night YAP.. and Lalas.. I meant depart  :roll:    :wink:

I think maybe 1 or 2 whole people at those sites said they don't like the sound of the book. But, ashamedly, there are the diehards who think he is a nice boy who did nothing wrong  :roll:

Heading out on errands myself.  BBL but I guess you will all be snuggled up in the treetops by then.

Nite nite Monkey friends

 Hi Lexie.. have'nt read either place as of late.. dont have the time.. BUT some RU members seem to perhaps were having a change of heart is seemed :)

I don’t think that is right.  None of those people show up in the Allegonda VAN DER SLOOT and others against the Netherlands and registered on 10 October 1989 under file No. 15596/89

 Night Tibro  :)
 Have a great Tuesday  :) :)  At least we know tomorrow will come here in the US!  lol