Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKL0954405620070514?&src=051407_1113
_TOPSTORY_parents_still_positive

CHRONOLOGY-The disappearance of Madeleine McCann

May 3 - The girl goes missing from her bedroom between 9.30 and 10 p.m. while her parents Kate and Gerry are dining just 100 yards away at the Mark Warner Ocean Club holiday resort in Praia da Luz. A window and shutter are open and she is presumed to have been abducted.

May 4 - McCann family members and British media criticise local police for what they call a slow initial response, failure to take the disappearance seriously at first, failure to notify ports and borders in time, and failure to secure the crime scene, which may have led to vital clues being lost.

May 5 - Police say they have put together a sketch of a suspect and confirm they believe Madeleine is still alive and being held within three miles of the crime scene. Media reports say the sketch is vague and only features the back of a man's head.

May 7 - Kate McCann makes an emotional appeal for her daughter's safe return

May 8 - Police say they have investigated 350 suspicious incidents but still have no idea where she might be.  Continued...

May 9 - Family issues statement saying they are grateful to all those helping in the search.

May 10 - The search around the resort winds down. Attention focuses on a blonde woman seen acting suspiciously before the girl's disappearance and the possibility that Madeleine might have been snatched by British abductors.

May 11 - Scottish businessman Stephen Winyard offers a one million pound reward. "There but for the grace of God, go all of us," he says.

Former England soccer captain David Beckham makes televised appeal for information.

May 13 - Businessman Richard Branson, author J.K. Rowling and footballer Wayne Rooney are among those to have contributed to rewards now totalling 2.5 million pounds.  Continued...

May 13 - Half a million pilgrims attending the 90th anniversary of the first appearance of the Virgin Mary at the Sanctuary of Fatima pray for Madeleine's return.

May 14 - Her parents say they will not return home until they have found her but say they think she is safe.


Two things that need to be dealt with later - the Portuguese police being inept and the parents being irresponsible - I know that last one seems harsh, but they left these children alone, I don't care that it wasn't that far - have never left my kids alone, ever - and they are both doctors, should no better, BUT that is neither here nor there at the moment - I'm sure they are kicking themselves enough right now (assuming they have no involvement, another harsh statement, but hey, human nature has let us down many times before on this, unfortunately) The criticism of the Portuguese police at this time is probably counterproductive, to a point - the parents are stressing that they are being very helpful (sound familiar, Natalee? Beth?) That's the one thing that leads me to believe the parents probably aren't involved, because they want to keep the peace and not piss off the Portuguese police - I understand, that with some pressure, they might look a little harder, but too much criticism, may lead nowhere.  What's done (or hasn't been done) is done - they can be dealt with later-

Hope they find this adorable little angel.  Were the 2 year olds in the same room?  I know they are young, but did they see anything that they could articulate?

Police searching for the missing four-year-old Madeleine McCann tonight focused their hunt on the house of a British woman whose son had been helping the media as a go-between and translator with the Portuguese police.

The man, who lives with his widowed mother in a villa 150 metres from where Madeleine went missing, is understood to have been taken to a police station in Portimao, although police tonight said no-one had been arrested.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2079691,00.html?gusrc=rss&feed=
networkfront

Madeleine's parents didn't want to leave her with a stranger
Last updated at 15:24pm on 10th May 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann left their three children alone in their apartment every night of their holiday because they did not want a stranger to babysit, it has emerged.

But, tragically, the routine may have allowed whoever abducted their daughter the chance to build up a picture of their movements while he planned his crime.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=453801&in_page_id=
1770

Oh, my - they unwittingly set this child up to be abducted - the same way a robber makes note of the comings and goings of their victim, so does a predator - he watched and noted that they left these children alone every evening - Poor Madeleine - but, if there is anything positive in this, it is that those 2 year olds are still safe - hopefully Madeleine will be found safe too, but......

I just want to note that apparently Portugal has many pedophiles due to lax sex laws (I believe that is what I read)  Also, I read an unrelated article regarding the pilgrims going to the Shrine of Fatima (Portugal) being handed maps with the Virgin Mary on one side and sex ads, sex toy sales on the other.....what is going on over there?  Is Portugal a safe haven for pedophiles?  I wonder statistically (if we could even find out) how many are supposedly in the area -

I might have to rethink the whole, going easy on the Portuguese police thing, after leafing through news articles - they seem as though they have given up already!!!!  It's a little early in the game for that, isn't it?

Where were those 2 year old twins?  They look big enough to see/relay information.  Wasn't the door locked?  Please tell me they were locked in at least.  forced entry and the twins didn't waken - were they in cribs???  If you're a pedophile, do you take the 3, nearly 4 year old and leave the 2 year old?

It is a very relaxed, very British-focused place, English-speaking staff - many of them have professional child-care qualifications

Mark Warner describes the Ocean Club as offering individual villa-style accommodation, set around a series of private areas with their own pool and bar, cafe, and restaurant facilities.

Its childcare services include a creche with an outdoor play area, and nannies who organise supervised activities for children.

There is also babysitting, and a "dining-out" creche service in the evenings for children aged four months to nine years - parents eating in the resort's restaurants drop the children off and pick them up later.



Why, why, why, then.....

This was taken from a caption of a photo:


The McCanns with their twins, Sean and Amelie, who were sleeping next to their sister when she was taken.


I know they are 2, but they neither can say anything, Are they traumatized?, one of them, at least, must have awakened.  If they were all in bed together.

Another caption:

Gerry and Kate McCann are from Rothley, Leicestershire. They were on holiday with eight other couples and their children when Madeleine was snatched


This is getting weirder (for me at least) - Did the 8 other couples leave their children unattended while they dined OR did they use the babysitting facilities? and if they did, why didn't the McCann's?  Sorry, but 8 other couples?!!!!  If they didn't trust people, couldn't they share the babysitting responsibilities - 4 couples go out tonight, the other 4 babysit and switch - these are supposedly intelligent people - MDs - I am going to start on my doctorate tomorrow, I mean, I have to now, obviously I'm not that stupid.

Oh boy, shades of Aruba.....


(another caption)

Three British specialist police officers were sent to the Algarve to assist the Portuguese police, who are bound by law to keep many details of their investigation secret.


Here is the link to the page of the Times Online (UK) that you can then access this photo gallery (15 photos in total)

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article1790430.ece

How could a kidnapper have got into the apartment?
There are three likely routes. The bedroom where she was sleeping has a window with a plastic shutter, and a door leading on to a narrow car park and a quiet residential street. This side of the apartment cannot be seen from the bar. At the back of the apartment, which can partially be seen from the bar, are french windows. These were the doors the parents were using when they checked the children. They may have been left unlocked.

Were the doors or window forced?
Family members said the shutter on the street window was forced. Police have dusted the shuttefor fingerprints. But the Mark Warner holiday firm has said there was no sign of a forced entry. A kidnapper could have come through the street window and left via the street door. It is unlikely he or she would have entered or left via the french windows as they face the bar and the complex.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2075299,00.html


Could they really have left the door unlocked?

Madeleine McCann Search: Police Name Robert Murat Formal Suspect
By Staff
May 15, 2007
Madeleine McCann Suspect Named - The police in Potugal have identified a suspect in their investigation of the kidnapping of four-year-old British girl Madeleine McCann.

"There is a suspect," a spokeswoman for the judicial police said without elaborating.

Police reportedly questioned a British man that lives just 100 yards or so from where the McCann family was staying when their daughter disappeared.

Police questioned Robert Murat over the kidnapping Maddy McCann amid hopes of a breakthrough in the case. Murat was taken to Portimao police station, but the chief said he had not been arrested.  In Portugal police can identify a suspect without arresting the person.

Portuguese police searched the Murat's mother's house, 'Casa Liliana.' Murat had been quizzed along with two others about the disappearance of Madeleine.

The Suspect

The Sun’s Julie Moult considers the evidence. And delivers a piece entitled “stories of a fantasist”. “He always seemed so eager to get involved in the police investigation,” says the Sun’s woman–on-the-scene. “Robert claimed he had a daughter just like Madeleine and said he felt compelled to do anything he could. But to me he seemed like classic fantasist.”

The Sun introduces Martin Brunt, the crime news correspondent from its sister organ, TV’s Sky news.

He says Murat told him he’d been taken inside the McCanns’ apartment by police.

Sky news correspondent Ian Woods says he asked Murat to help him speak with locals.

“I met him and had a conversation with him. I tried to find out as much as I could about him,” says Woods, who checked out Murat’s details. “They did check out, and I left it at that for the time.”

The Mail’s Neil Sears also spots Murat. In “My encounters with a man ‘who just wanted to help’”, Sears tells Mail readers, “There was something more to the friendly expat who called himself ‘Rob’ than met the eye.”

Murat made Sears “feel slightly uncomfortable”.

But it was the Sunday Mirror’s Lori Cambell who alerted police to Murat’s behaviour, she saw as “creepy”.


http://www.anorak.co.uk/news/tabloids/173352.html


So, is he just an "odd" guy helping out? or something more.....

He helped McCanns 'and joked of being No1 suspect'

http://news.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=750832007

Three questioned on Madeleine McCann disappearance


Three people have been questioned by Portuguese police officers in relation to the disappearance of four year old Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz holiday resort 12 days ago.

While the leading police officer in the case Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa declined to identify those interviewed or state if they were suspects in the case, a Portuguese TV channel has reported that one is a German women and another is a Portuguese man. The third interviewee was identified as British Robert Murat, 32...

http://www.gibfocus.gi/details_todaysnews.php?id=2253

Man Questioned, Released In Missing Girl Case

http://www.postchronicle.com/news/breakingnews/article_21280778.shtml

festa....thank you for all your information and links....

this is SkyNews and, if you go to bottom of page, you can click on their live news of the case....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/

Mere

Madeleine McCann: New Twist Connects Maddy To Suspect Robert Murat
By Staff
May 15, 2007

Madeleine McCann Case - An interesting twist in the case of Madeleine Maddy McCann could link suspect Robert Murat to the missing 4-year-old little girl. Portuguese police, who were forced to release Robert Murat due to lack of evidence to file charges against him, are investigating the case very closely, and this link provides some sort of a reason for why Murat would kidnap her, if he did.

Robert Murat, 33, a recently released suspect in the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, has a young daughter of his own who is about the same age as Maddy - and she was snatched away from him during his early fatherhood experience. It's the typical tragic family tale - the marriage breaks down after a child is born, and one of the parents takes the child, commonly being the mother. This story, however, is slightly different.

Murat's wife Dawn didn't just leave town when their marriage fell apart - she returned to her native Norfolk, just 4 months after moving to Portugal with Robert. Dawn left Robert because she became homesick, and she took the 'apple of his eye' with her. While they maintained their relationship in the beginning, things soon fell to pieces.

The couple's daughter was somewhat of a miracle child, seeing as how it took 8 years for Dawn to fall pregnant. Gareth Bailey, a close friend and former colleague to Robert, says the suddenly-isolated husband tried to visit his daughter regularly:

"At first, he kept his relationship with Dawn and kept flying back to the UK to spend time with her and their daughter."

"He was going backwards and forwards between Portugal and here all the time, often only staying a couple of days before going back there. In the end, their relationship just fizzled out."

Friends say Robert's daughter was "his life".

http://www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_21280927.shtml


Could he have taken the little girl because he missed his own daughter so much?  If he did, perhaps, she is still alive.  I hope they find this little girl soon.

McCanns hope to gain a special result from high-profile night

The aunt and uncle of abducted four-year-old girl Madeleine McCann yesterday appealed directly to the tens of thousands of Spanish football fans arriving in the city for the Uefa Cup final tonight.

Philomena McCann and her brother John - the brother and sister of Gerry McCann, Madeleine's father - visited the media centre in Glasgow where scores of journalists from across Europe were gathering ahead of the match between Sevilla and Espanyol and posed with the cup itself, which had yellow ribbons tied to it for the occasion.

The family have said they believe it is possible Madeleine may have been taken over the Portuguese border into Spain, which is why they have been keen to raise awareness in the neighbouring country.

http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.1400702.0.0.php

Madeleine police 'search Russian man's home'


Portuguese police investigating the abduction of Madeleine McCann are this evening searching a property in Praia da Luz, 100 yards from a church where her parents have been praying for her safe return.
    
It is believed to be the home of a Russian man who is friends with Robert Murat, the expat Britain who is the only named suspect in the case.

Earlier in the day it emerged that police wanted to interview a Russian in relation to the case. It is not yet clear whether they have been able to track him down or question him.

Meanwhile there were further questions today over the police investigation. It emerged that a British architect who built the villa where Murat lives was ignored when he called police about a hidden basement within the property.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/05/16/wmaddy316.xml

Maddie suspect: Ex-wife speaks out

...Mrs Murat and their four-year-old daughter and her son were taken to a secret location by police on Monday night after news broke that Mr Murat was being quizzed.

Tonight she released a brief statement through Norfolk Police.

Mrs Murat said: “This is a very difficult time for my family.

“I am aware of the significant levels of press interest being generated by the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and I am assisting the police in any way I can.

“At this time I have no comment to make about the inquiry or my previous relationship with my estranged husband.

“I have been very saddened by the disappearance of young Madeleine and like everyone else, sincerely hope the search for her ends with a positive outcome.”

----------------------
His friend Tuck Price said: “Under Portuguese law he's not allowed to say anything. He wants to get his story out.

“He wants to get the focus back on to Madeleine and away from him...


http://new.edp24.co.uk/content/news/story.aspx?brand=EDPOnline&
category=News&tBrand=EDPOnline&tCategory=news&itemid=
NOED16%20May%202007%2017%3A40%3A40%3A790



After first reading this, it stuck out that the ex-wife didn't make any statement indicating that her ex-husband, Robert Murat, could not be involved in something like this.  Even though they are divorced, you would think she might say, he couldn't possible hurt a child......but maybe the police (UK or Portuguese) have asked her not to for legal reasons.

Police swoop on web designer's home


Police are investigating a web designer linked to the key suspect in the Madeleine McCann investigation.
Detectives swooped on the home of 22-year-old Sergey Malinka, who designed a website for suspect Robert Murat, in Praia da Luz.


http://www.lincolntoday.co.uk/viewarticle.aspx?articleid=
2883261&sectionid=4068


I hope this isn't what it appears they are looking for - but realistically who would take this little girl and for what purpose -
 :cry:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23396467-details/Madeleine:%20Police%20swoop%20on%20computer%20expert's%20flat/
article.do



This is a link to a page which has an illustration of the reported "chamber" that is built beneath Robert Murat's home.  If the police already have search warrants for this home, hopefully they have/are checking this hidden room - the circumstantial evidence is piling against Murat -

Acting suspiciously enough to warrant journalist to alert police

Possible hidden room beneath house (if there is, he better not say he didn't know, he was raised in Portugal and he is in the real estate business there)

The young Russian man who lives nearby - made web pages for Murat - what kind????

I'm jumping the gun here, but if Murat is involved somehow with Madeleine's disappearance - this may be bigger than just this one girl's disappearance - with reported lax laws for pedophiles in Portugal - could we be looking at a major pedophile ring here - Although Murat is supposed to be in the real estate business, people say he hasn't been working for some time - Yeah, maybe not in a legit business that people would know about -

This is getting scary - hope they find Madeleine before it is too late -

Madeleine McCann Report: Robert Murat Russian Pal Quizzed Over Porn
By Nancy Streets
May 17, 2007    

Madeleine McCann Case update - A computer expert, Sergey Malinka, linked to British suspect Robert Murat was being quizzed last night over missing Madeleine McCann.  Police had confirmed they were to question a Russian male who had a 'close' business association with Murat. And yesterday morning police cars screeched up outside an apartment block and seven uniformed officers carried out a dramatic raid on the rundown fourth-floor flat owned by Malinka’s parents, Express UK reports.

That report claims that several links to pedophile websites, encrypted emails and messages were found on three computers removed from Murat's home during a dramatic police raid on Monday.  It was also claimed that video tapes showing depraved sexual acts and bestiality were also found at the Villa Liliana, where Murat lives with his elderly mother Jennifer.

***

The UK Daily Mirror reports that Sergey Malinka, 22, helped Murat, 33, set up a website, and Murat made a phone call to Sergey Malinka shortly after Madeleine McCann disappeared, it was claimed last night. Portuguese state TV said they found out about the conversation after checking local phone records.

The investigation appears to have centered on Malinka, whose parents’ apartment is only yards from the church where Madeleine’s parents Kate and Gerry have prayed for her safe return. Moments after yesterday morning’s raid where police grabbed the Russian for questioning, eight other officers arrived and cordoned off the immediate area. Malinka’s parents refused to comment on what they knew about the operation but did confirm that their son was 22-year-old Sergey.

***

Admitting that he helped set up a property website for Murat, 33, he said: "I don't know what you mean. It's definitely not me.  "I've just had my residency papers approved and checks are always made for criminal convictions. I've none whatsoever. I did do some work for Robert. He wanted a website created and I got it together for him."

Tuck Price, a friend of Murat, described Malinka as a "sweet kid" who fixed "everybody's computers" in the Portuguese resort of Praia da Luz.
He said: "He set up Robert's website. Why police are searching him I don't know, but it's still distressing to Robert. It just points out they're not looking elsewhere."


as far as the Russian goes:

Portuguese police release Russian after questioning in case of missing British girl

I'm not familiar with Portuguese law, but it seems to be their practice to catch and release - I guess somewhat like our arrests - the police can hold you for questioning, but for a limited time, must have to have evidence by  a certain point after bringing you in - So just because Murat and the Russian were released doesn't necessarily mean they are free and clear -

Must say, pedophile websites on the computer, bestiality videotapes don't paint a pretty picture of Murat.  I bet his ex-wife has a lot she'd like to say.  Sure took her child far away from him.

festa

I'm not liking what may be going on with this guy at all.

Madeleine "sighted"
A red van with fake number plates hunted by authorities as Madeleine is sighted
   
Kidnapped Madeleine McCann was reported to be sighted in a red van with fake number plates, Portuguese authorities said.

Sky News reported that the red van had been spotted in a southern suburb of Lisbon.The areas being searched are Almada, Moita and Montijo.
The latest development comes hours after Portuguese media revealed that Madeleine suspect Robert Murat and Russian witness Sergey Malinka talked more than once on the night the four-year-old she was went missing.


The daily newspaper Correio da Manha reported that detectives discovered there were "several" telephone calls between Mr Murat and Mr Malinka on the night Madeleine went missing.
Correio da Manha has also reported that the two were photographed together by investigators in the days following Madeleine's disappearance.

“Just a witness”
On Thursday Mr Malinka, 23, insisted he was innocent and said: "This has destroyed my life and career."
Asked about ths phone calls he said: "I'm afraid I can't tell you. That's privileged information, I can't share it with anybody. They have been questioning everybody in his phone book."

The computer expert, who created a website for Mr Murat and his girlfriend Michaela Walczuch, said:

"I am innocent. I am not a suspect in this case. I am merely a witness questioned like eight or nine others.
"Everything that has been said about me is lies. There have been claims in the press that I am some kind of sexual maniac or paedophile. It is nonsense and I am going to take everybody who has made these claims to court."

Malinka added: "The police were convinced I was somehow linked to Robert, but I told them that our relationship was simply through business. All I did was set up a website for him. He is not a friend of mine."
He insisted he has a "cast iron alibi" for the night of 3 May, when four-year-old Madeleine disappeared from the Mark Warner complex in the Praia da Luz resort in the Algarve.

I sure do hope they find her soon.

Madeleine McCann Arrest: Sergey Malinka Named Suspect, Arrested

Madeleine McCann Arrest Update - Sergey Malinka became the second suspect in the case of missing Madeleine McCann. The difference between Malinka and Robert Murat is that Malinka has been arrested in Praia Da Luz, Portugal...





Minutes after being interviewed, Malinka was taken into custody by detectives and it was learned that he had prior convictions for sex offenses, The Sun reported.

The Daily Express reports that officers later emerged carrying two desktop computers and what appeared to be a laptop computer.

The Daily Express also reports that several links to seedy pedophilia websites, encrypted emails and messages were found. The paper also claims that video tapes showing depraved sexual acts and bestiality were also found at the Villa Liliana.

Police are reportedly conducting a search of Malinka's home and another property in nearby La Goa. It is also believed that Malinka moved to another flat above his computer shop that has yet to be searched.


http://www.postchronicle.com/news/breakingnews/article_21281375.shtml

Madeleine McCann Suspect Robert Murat Wanted Car, Russian Released


Madeleine McCann Report - A Russian man, Sergey Malinka who had been reportedly arrested in the Madeleine McCann case has been released.  UPI reported the man as being arrested yesterday...

...Robert Murat, the only suspect in the case, was reportedly ansy to rent a car two days before he was first questioned by police, because he had claimed his own was needed by those involved in the search for Madeleine McCann.

It is being claimed that Murat telephoned a Praia da Luz company just after 12:00 on Saturday and ordered a vehicle "in a hurry". Murat indicated that he knew he was being trailed by undercover officers at that time, the UK Telegraph reports...




http://www.postchronicle.com/news/original/article_21281425.shtml

Mobile phone mystery in Madeleine hunt


Inconsistencies have allegedly emerged in a witness’s account of his relationship with the only formal suspect in the abduction of Madeleine McCann.
    
Mobile phone mystery in Maddy hunt
The McCanns have received letters from well-wishers across the world

Russian computer expert Sergey Malinka, 22, reportedly said this week it had been a year since he spoke to Anglo-Portuguese Robert Murat, 33, the only person named by police as a suspect in the case.

But Mr Murat’s mobile phone records allegedly show he called Mr Malinka at 11.40pm on the night Madeleine went missing, according to the Evening Standard.

The Russian IT specialist allegedly told the paper he had not spoken to Mr Murat for 12 months - but he told another reporter he had not seen him for three months.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/05/18/
wmaddy318.xml



Lying is never a good sign - AND 11:40 at night is a little late for a business call to someone who you supposedly don't have a lot of dealings with -

Madeleine McCann Suspect Branded Sexual Predator, Proclaims Innocence

Madeleine McCann Report - A Russian computer expert at the center of the hunt for Madeleine McCann is going to be questioned again by police over boasts that he had sex with an underage girl.

The latest witness in the Madeleine McCann case has insisted he is innocent and has no idea where 4-year-old Madeleine McCann may be, Sky News reported via FOX News.

Malinka denied reports that he has past convictions for sexual offenses and said his relationship with the main suspect, Robert Murat, is "strictly professional."

The U.K.'s Daily Star reports that two women who worked with Malinka, 22, had branded him a "sexual predator" who preyed on young girls.

It has been 15 days since the Madeleine McCann was snatched from her family's vacation home in Praia Da Luz, Portugal, while her mother and father, Kate and Gerry McCann, were dining at a nearby Tapas bar.

According to the Star, detectives were last night probing a series of reported phone calls between Malinka and Murat. Malinka is said to have called Murat just 30 minutes after she was abducted.



These two better starting talking -

I have to apologize for the way I am posting LINKS - I know some of them are too long and have shortened many of them to fit on the page by entering them on 2 lines, but that does not allow you to directly link to the page -
sorry I was being too lazy to tinyurl them -

I'll play devil's advocate for a moment - although reports coming from abroad paint an ugly picture of Murat and Malinka - I'm not sure how accurate they may all be - some of the publications, from the UK may be "tabloids" and reports coming from Portugal may be getting confusing and Portuguese laws are different - case in point:

Mr Murat strenuously denies any involvement in Madeleine’s abduction, but faces jail under Portuguese law if he speaks out to clear his name.


Still evidence (although circumstantial) does not look very good - especially the phone calls - if true - Malinka calling Murat roughly 30 minutes after Madeleine's approximate abduction - and Murat calling Malinka at 11:40pm that same evening - could be innocent, but why did Malinka supposedly claim to police he hadn't spoken to Murat for 1 year and telling reporters he hadn't spoken to him in 3 months (language difference misunderstanding) - Murat claiming he needed a rental car because his own was needed by the search - porn on the computers -

So we can give the benefit of the doubt, but the lying is troublesome....

RESIDENT EXCLUSIVE: "She is still in the Algarve"
(note: The Resident is a newspaper for expatriate residents in Portugal)

IT’S RARE for a case on a missing child to spark so much theory and speculation. In the absence of major pieces of evidence and reports of several different police leads, an air of ambiguity surrounds Madeleine’s disappearance.

The Resident discovered a clearer and different insight into the police investigation when speaking with former Scotland Yard commander, John O’Connor, who firmly believes that Madeleine is still in the Algarve.

“It’s a very unusual case,” said O’Connor who spent over 30 years working in Scotland Yard, the headquarters of the Metropolitan Police in London.

O’Connor is certain that there was no forced entry into the apartment, which leaves only three scenarios of how Madeleine could have escaped: someone had obtained a key to the apartment and let themselves in; Madeleine had let herself out and wandered off, or the house was not left securely locked.

Whatever the case may be, O’ Connor is adamant that Madeleine will still be within, or in close proximity to, Praia da Luz.

“Abductions like this only ever happen in quiet and remote places,” said O’Connor, referring to the Soham murders in 2002.

O’Connor described how he believes that if Madeleine had been abducted, the likelihood that her abductor would travel out of the country is very unlikely in these circumstances. “It’s more likely that her abductor has her in quarters very close to the crime and cannot escape due to the high profile and activity surrounding her disappearance,” he said.

Speaking about the role of Scotland Yard and British investigators in this case, O’Connor said that they will only be supplying information and intelligence about previous offenders and highlighting common behaviour patterns of these people.

He also pointed out that there is still no certainty that Madeleine was in fact taken by someone and the fact that no one knows the exact time of her disappearance further complicates matters.

“There is no trace to follow and no CCTV in the area,” said O’Connor. “The dogs picked up a scent down the road, which then stopped, suggesting that at this point she could have been taken away in a car, however, this scent could easily be from previous days.”

The former commander stated that looking in remote places is ineffective. If Madeleine is abandoned somewhere, it will be in an area of easy access such as next to a road, therefore giving the abductor a quick and easy escape.

“The police will now have a list of offenders and will be eliminating them one by one, however there is always the possibility that this is a first time offender,” stated O’Connor. He further emphasised that the first 48 hours of an investigation are crucial and the chances of a successful outcome do diminish after this period.

Despite this, O’Connor spoke of the high quality detective work in Portugal and believes that they will solve this case. He spoke of the competency and professionalism of the Portuguese police, dismissing any accusations they have faced. He outlined that they were initially responding to a missing child and not a crime and, therefore, did not think that their initial response should be criticised.

“The UK has far more crime, therefore has contingency plans in place to deal with such circumstances. Although this is not the case in Portugal, O’Connor does not believe that the police were too slow to put the borders on alert. “It is not possible to control the border such as the one between Portugal and Spain.” He also dismissed any claims that a member of the McCann family was a suspect.

“In the absence of major information, they have many lines of enquiry and leads that they must follow up. Small pieces of evidence become considered major leads,” said the former Scotland Yard commander.


No one wants to cast a poor light on the parents at this difficult time, but they did leave the children unattended, albeit they were a short walking distance away and their claims have been that they took turns looking in on them every 30 minutes (which I feel is probably not the case, why bother if one has to leave the table every 30 minutes) I think that quite possible they left the door unlocked, perhaps by accident or convenience - there was no forced entry - so this a quite possible -

Parents of Madeleine McCann Release Their Last Photo of Her

http://tinyurl.com/33m9r2

The Official Website to Find Madeleine McCann:

http://bringmadeleinehome.com/

Here is an interesting twist:

"Police in Missing Madeleine U-Turn"

http://tinyurl.com/yr82ry

Maddy's parents had to seek intervention to get information released that may help find their daughter.  Sounds like a certain case in Aruba...

Why We Should Continue to Focus on Madeleine

http://tinyurl.com/2v3w4q

I have heard commentary and seen articles about why the case of Natalee Holloway got so much attention, implying that if she hadn't been white, blonde and with affluent parents, she never would have gotten an extra line in the news anywhere.  There are so many people missing of all colors and origin, and I realize that.  I don't think Natalee has gotten more than her share of news.  I personally think her case has raised a big awareness of missing people.  I know it has with me.  That is what I am going over here on these threads.  We all need to work together to help find them, to bring them home to their families if we can.  If not, to at least bring them justice.  So, no, I don't believe little Maddy McCann is getting too much news.  It means the others are not getting out into the news like they should be.  How many people are missing each day, month and year?  Some have been missing as long as a year before EVEN being reported, as in one case of a little girl I read about.   :(  :(

Hey There my friend Festa - been a long time.  I see you don't have your avatar either.   :(   Be that as it may - they just aired a clip on GMA (Good Morning America) about Madeline and they have a website;

www.findmadeline.com  - please check my spelling before trying to jump there.  Supposedly they discuss the events at that website.  

I too, unfortunately fault the parents in this case, you are on vacation in another country.  YOU DO NOT LEAVE YOUR CHILDREN ALONE.  PERIOD!!!
Sure everybody needs a break - but I think they had many other options, that they did not try.  

I too hope they find this beautiful little girl - unharmed.

My prayers each day include Madeleine, her parents and those searching for this beautiful little girl.

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/In%20the%20News/0000dd4b10dr.jpg)
Paper gets letter about Madeleine McCann
 Wednesday, 13 June 2007 19:33
A Dutch newspaper has received an anonymous letter and a map claiming to show where missing four-year-old Madeleine McCann's body is buried.

Police in Portugal say they are investigating the information which identified a location 15km from the Algarve resort from which Madeleine disappeared on 3 May.

The letter strongly resembles another received by the newspaper last year, accurately pinpointing where two missing Belgian girls were buried.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0613/mccannm.html

HI SLEEKS -

It's difficult to fault these parents at this trying time, but people need to realize what a world we live in nowadays - also, there were with other couples they were with, did everyone leave their children unattended?  (why didn't they share babysitting duties) how many children were left unattended at this resort?  at European resorts? at resorts?   how common is this practice and perhaps this needs to be addressed - Do hotels/motels/resorts etc. have policies prohibiting leaving children unattended?  (BTW, I believe this resort states it has babysitting available on the premises - they didn't want to leave the children alone with a stranger -  :cry: ) and these are both professional people, doctors - I don't know?...I guess they thought is was safe and they were checking but...maybe I'm a worry wart, but never did this, always thought how quickly a child could have a accident when alone...

but unfortunately, for Madeleine it may be too late a lesson...

I am confused by this article. Is it saying the letter(s) received are from some type of psychic?

Scrubland search for Madeleine ends
ITN - 35 minutes agoThere are no plans to further search the scrubland where a letter said missing Madeleine McCann could be buried, Portuguese police have said.


An anonymous letter in a Dutch newspaper said the four-year-old's body could be found "under branches or stones" nine miles from the Algarve resort where she disappeared from her bedroom on May 3.

Seven police searched the area described in the letter, according to reports.

Police chief inspector Olegario de Sousa said: "For now, we have no concrete plans to enter the terrain (again)."

A spokesman for the local GNR police, which handles day-to-day policing, said they had received no request from the investigative team for help or to bring sniffer dogs to the area.

Clarence Mitchell, a spokesman for Madeleine's parents, said police are examining the letter to verify whether it was authentic.

The police have received countless leads in their investigation, including a possible sighting of Madeleine in Morocco.

So far they have made no arrests and have identified only one suspect - Briton Robert Murat - in their case.

Ch Insp De Sousa said a group of journalists had hired sniffer dogs to search the area. He said: "These people are people who have no police training and who are walking around the bush looking for a scoop."

Madeleine disappeared from her bed while her parents dined at a nearby restaurant in the small Praia da Luz Algarve resort.

Her parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, have launched a high-profile campaign to draw attention to her disappearance, including meeting with the Pope in Rome and winning support from personalities such as David Beckham.

Gerry McCann said in the diary he publishes online (www.findmadeleine.com) he was upset by the Dutch paper publishing the letter, saying it should have been passed on to Portuguese police before publication.

He said: "We were extremely disappointed in the publication of the anonymous letter in the Telegraaf claiming to know where Madeleine is buried."

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/itn/20070614/twl-scrubland-search-for-madeleine-ends-41f21e0_1.html

New evidence in Madeleine McCann

Portuguese police are interviewing two Dutch newspaper reporters who have found a towel in the area identified as the possible burial location of four-year-old British girl Madeleine McCann in a tip-off from a Dutch source.
 
According to their newspaper De Telegraaf, another tip-off has come in from a different source claiming that a man was seen carrying a child wrapped in towels near the place where Madeleine disappeared. Five Portuguese detectives accompanied the Dutch reporters to the spot where they found the towel, followed by a Portuguese TV camera crew.

http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/mcC070614nws


bleachedblack, maybe I'm missing something while skimming the articles, but I didn't see any reference to a psychic - do you have that statement?
I am confused as the sequence of events regarding searching - Are all searches called off in this area? even after this supposed finding a towel?
Police are talking to these Dutch reporters, are they meddling too much and interfering, possibly destroying evidence? OR do police suspect they might be planting things to create a story?

It seems to me that if they received a letter similar to one they received last year and they found those girls bodies AND now they received this one concerning Madeleine, this would be credible enough for an extensive search - AND it would also imply that these are connected and there is a serial child killer in this area - how many missing girls within this age range in this area over the past few years?

Hmmm, as I continue reading the posts Blonde has up, I see that the person suspected in the 2 Belgium girls deaths is awaiting trial - so not involved here, so if this info is credible (although they have not found Madeleine) this would be a copycat - AND why would someone contact a DUTCH newspaper?  in the 2 Belgium girls disappearance I can see, large Dutch speaking population in Belgium, but Madeleine is British - seems someone might be messing around, quite sad...and very hurtful if true.

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/In%20the%20News/untitled.jpg)
Yesterday, there was a towel found by the Dutch report donor, from de Telegraaf. The towel to see in a picture below, is for search by the Portugese police.

Petitioners want McCann inquiry  
 
The McCanns are continuing to make appeals across Europe
An online petition is calling for the parents of abducted British four-year-old Madeleine McCann to be investigated by social workers.
It calls on Leicestershire County Council to look into the circumstances which saw Madeleine and her younger siblings left alone in a hotel room.

The council said it was "discharging our duties in... a full and professional manner".

The family has declined to comment on the petition.
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/leicestershire/6740315.stm


Well, this goes to Sleeks and my point regarding why those children were left unattended - it is a difficult call - on the one hand, my feeling is they were negligent in leaving those very young children unsupervised, especially when other options were available, ex: onsite babysitting, other couples they were with could have helped, they could have stayed in or taken the children with them for a early supper - and they are suffering more than we can imagine, but how much is Madeleine suffering? or did she suffer? sure this haunts them daily - I think they need to be left alone for now, and have to focus on their daughter, and later on they could serve some good in making people aware of the dangers in our society.

Police spokesman Olegario Sousa said the second swab was taken because the first sample may not have been large enough, may have been contaminated or even LOST.


Oh boy, they are talking about Robert Murat's DNA sample, they took another one about a week ago and are awaiting the results - they might have LOST the 1st one?? they also took samples from the McCanns, but I don't see that they took any from the Russian man - is he cleared?  wasn't there child pornography on his computer? on Murat's computer?  no laws against that?

Sleeks and Festa... I am so glad to see you both... if you go in the lounge, there is a thread for the avartars on holiday or so and CBB or Klaas will fix you up if you wish... ( I don't know how or I would do it myself... )


Thank you all for bringing all if this information in here... I don't have a good feeling about this story and I don't understand the parents, but looking back on it, my parents used to leave us in the room and go out when we were on vacation, but we were 13 or so... I think the world is different now and I wouldn't even let my kids play outside without supervision (if i had kids)....

I have to wonder if there is a serial killer at work , or a copy cat or both?  This letter is bizarre!

O/T

Sleeks and Festa - Avatars need to be located on the internet for them to work now.  If you have photobucket, upload your avatar there and then copy the link, without the URL tags and paste into the THIRD option in your profile for avatars.

Sleeks - I found this for you if you want it

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/shark_and_diver-animated.gif)

Well hello to Mrs. Red and Klaasend.  Fhew - I am feeling like my old self with my old avatar back!!!   :lol:  

And Klaasend - I have seen that one before - I may use that one also one of these days.  Thanks! :D

Any more updates on Madeleine???  Have to see what I can find.

I need to do some looking around...  I truly appreciate all the information that y'all bring in here though, it is what keeps me updated, sorry to say...I always get the news from y'all.... and Red of course!

WOW - I remembering reading yesterday (sorry now that I didn't post it) that they were NOT going to search.  Well I am happy to hear they are.  Even if they find nothing - at least it will one less place to look.

I just pray for this little girl.

This photo came from DUTCHLADY - it appears she is doing some work on this case:

Dutchlady wrote:

This is one of the images we took in Praia da luz, and is the door and window she is believed to have been taken from

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/McCannApt.jpg)

Thank-you Klaas, I am glad to know DL  is on the case, and that she still reads here.

Yes, Thank you Klaas.  

I agree, it is nice to see DL is still around.

BB & Ms Vada-

Dutchlady and I have continued to be in touch, she has moved on to work on other cases. Her group went to investigate and to chart the events of the evening during which Madeline disappeared. Their review raised a few questions to include the chance that she might have wandered out of the apartment as well? I think that is at this juncture just one of two theories, the other being kidnapping. Even if she did wander out it also would ultimately have become a kidnapping, but I am glad many eyes are involved in the review. If she has further updates I will share.

Thank-you Nones very glad to hear .

2 Arrested but this little girls is still missing. :cry:


http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/06/28/missing.mccann/index.html

Sleeks

I read that too.  They said something about doing it for ransom.  Does that mean because they never speculated either way, that she could be alive still?

The Italian man was arrested on an international warrant issued from France, where he was wanted for alleged association with a crime group, the police statement said.


He had served an 18-month sentence in France for child mistreatment, specifically his daughter, it said. A Spanish police spokeswoman said the warrant itself had nothing to do with the McCann case.


The Portuguese woman was detained due to her association with the Italian man, and there was no warrant for her arrest, the spokeswoman said.

http://tinyurl.com/2772h7


I'm not sure they were actually involved in taking Madeleine, I think perhaps they were offering information for reward money - I'm not sure that "information" was valid, just greedy people taking advantage of the situation, BUT the 18 month sentence he served for child "mistreatment" is disturbing, so...I guess we wait and see what this is all about.

At least they are doing something on this...

Here is an article I found regarding the status of the two that were arrested... seems like, as y'all said, they just were trying to scam money.

http://www.charter.net/news/read.php?id=13814095&ps=1012&_LT=HOME_LARSDCCL2_UNEWS

http://www.bringmadeleinehome.com/

[list]Day 74 - 16/07/2007

The campaign to find Madeleine received a a massive boost today from JK Rowling. The author of the massive selling Harry Potter books has asked all retailers to display a specially designed poster of Madeleine when the sixth and final book Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows goes on sale on Saturday 21st July. Ms Rowling, who lived in Portugal for several years, has offered amazing support in the search for Madeleine. As well as offering a large reward for Madeleines safe return she has also added information on Madeleines abduction on her own site with a link back to our homepage. Try and find the iinformation at www.jkrowling.com, I will give you a clue that it is under links! A huge thank you to JK Rowling and her publishers Bloomsbury for their support.

The new poster of Madeleine has been designed in conjunction with the International Centre for Missing and Exploited Children (ICMEC) and this is one of the things we have been working on in the last couple of weeks. ICMEC promote awareness of missing children globally and aim to prevent child sexual exploitation and abduction. The poster features 3 pictures of Madeleine with the advice to contact the local police if you see her. ICMEC, their logo and both theirs and our websites are also on the poster. The distribution of this poster will enhance the awareness of Madeleines disappearance, which we are advised increases the chances of finding her, and the plight of other missing children.

With the announcement of the poster Kate and I also did a short interview for the press. A lot of photographs were taken of us with the poster so I suspect some of these will make it in to the newspapers in the next few days.

Day 73 - 15/07/2007

Travelled back to Portugal today on an early morning flight. It was heartening to see various posters of Madeleine up at all the check-in desks especially with the busy holiday season underway. The flight itself was quiet for Kate and I as the twins fell asleep shortly after take-off. My mum and sister have also come out to for a few days so we managed to see a lot of family this weekend. [/list]


She's still missing

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1276070,00.html

Suspect Quiz Delay After New Evidence
Updated: 13:35, Thursday July 19, 2007

Police may delay further questioning of the main suspect in the hunt for Madeleine McCann after new evidence emerged.
 
Murat to be quizzed againOfficers were due to call in expat Robert Murat, 33, to police headquarters in Portimao this week.

But police sources told Sky News Online they may now have to push this back following new information from locals, who were quizzed by officers ealier this week.

Police are now compiling the new information before they re-interview Mr Murat, who lives near the apartment where Madeleine vanished in Praia da Luz on May 3.

"In view of the outcome of the secondary interviews, there may not be time to do it this week. It may now be next week," a police source said.

Portuguese newspaper reports say some of the witnesses interviewed this week spotted a man matching Mr Murat's description outside the flat where Madeleine disappeared.

 
Madeleine vanished on May 3It follows claims from McCann family friends who say they saw the suspect near the apartment shortly after the four-year-old was taken.

The three friends - Fiona Payne, Russell O'Brien and Rachael Oldfield - were allowed to grill the British expatriate in a five-hour session at a police station.

Some of the neighbours had been interviewed in the first week of her disappearance, and were being requestioned by officers.

Others had not been around at the time, and were giving evidence for the first time.

Mr Murat - who is considered an "arguido", the Portuguese police term for a suspect - claims he had a quiet night on May 3 and had not left his mother's house.

A police source said: "We will interview him as many times as necessary."

Police insiders have said the investigation is at a "critical" stage but have not elaborated on what that means

Sound familiar :wink:

Madeleine McCann Suspect Robert Murat's Car Rental Again Questioned

http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272615076.shtml

Now I have to ask what's this about.....

Now a report from Anorak notes that he used his ex-wife address to rent the car.  Police reportedly has Murat under surveillance at the time.  The rental contract has now been placed online.  It is hand written.  One report says that the car was driven "quite a lot" but it is unknown exactly how many miles Murat put on the car or if he was the one driving it.

The report notes that the renting contract only has the number of miles the car had registered when it was taken by Robert Murat. The Auto Rent III agency at Praia da Luz doesn't have a computer system and documents are handwritten.

....first of all, what are they too lazy to calculate out the mileage???  If five other people rented it after him, I am sure they too had to record what the mileage was when the car was rented.  :?  Maybe I am missing something.  I understand they don't have a computer and such.  But don't all these rental companies work the same way even if they are writing it out???  And just the fact that this guy used his ex-wife's address to rent it, none of it sounds good!!!

Madeleine McCann Witness Fights Back Against Allegations, Devastated
http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272615138.shtml

Madeleine McCann ‘Cracker detectives in too late’ say police
http://tinyurl.com/25ne9h

  Re: Lively Case Discussion #672 8/2 - 8/3/2007
« Reply #366 on: Today at 07:27:37 PM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: Angiex911dsptchr on Today at 07:04:56 PM
Quote from: NYC_lover on Today at 07:02:17 PM
BRB, just looking around for a while on the internet.



 Was wondering what your opnion is on Guido and the other supsects in the case?? 


Sorry friends, I was just look on the last news of the McCann case.
Belgium is involve with the searching to Madeleine McCann. There is a new face of interesting of the disappeared of Madeleine McCann.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTw2nnMSiLk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzOuiKM6gFY

Police Probe New Madeleine Sighting
Updated: 12:13, Friday August 03, 2007

Police in Belgium are investigating a possible sighting of Madeleine McCann and have released an identikit drawing of a man she may have been seen with.
Man was seen in restaurant with girl looking like MadeleineA woman told detectives she saw an English-speaking woman with a Dutch man and young girl at a restaurant in the Belgian town of Tongeren, near Maastricht.
The witness, a children's therapist, telephoned police but when she returned to her table the three had disappeared.
A Tongeren police spokesman said they were treating the sighting "very seriously".
They have taken a soft drink bottle the girl had been drinking from for analysis.
Results of the tests are expected next week, when scientists will see if there is enough DNA to create a "profile" before going on to see if there is a match to Madeleine.
A spokesman said: "The woman told us the little girl bore a striking resemblance to Madeleine McCann and was behaving nervously.
"She said she got up to call us as soon as she saw the girl, but when she returned to her table all three of them got into a car and left.
"She was 100% sure it was Madeleine and is a trusted witness. She works with children and noticed something unusual, that is why we are taking it seriously."
It is the second reported sighting of Madeleine in Belgium since the four-year-old was snatched from her hotel room in the Portuguese resort of Praia da Luz three months ago.
A Belgian couple told police they saw the youngster outside the Cathedral in Liege on June 1.

But what about Robert Murat that has change this alibi about the evening that Madeleine was disappeared?
Very stupid, when you change your alibi, when you police is still not sure, if this is correct.
Change your alibi, makes you, mostly suspect number one!
And what about Robert Murat, that there was found children porn on this computer.
Two sentence ingots facts committed and the Portugese police, does not nothing again them. This case, makes to things interesting, is the Portugese police involved or is the law from Portugal, that they not can arrested Robert Murat, on this two sentence ingots facts.

It would be wonderful if Madeleine is still alive. I am hoping this sighting was actually of the right child, and that the DNA is hers.

Wow this is good news. I hope the DNA pans out.

Me too BB,  holding onto the hope its her....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1278599,00.html

Police Search Suspect's Home
Updated: 14:51, Saturday August 04, 2007

The home of Robert Murat - the only named suspect in the Madeleine McCann inquiry - is being searched again.
 
Madeleine disappeared on May 3Two British police officers are at the scene in Portugal - where undergrowth is being cleared and trees cut down - along with around eight from the local force.

It is thought the operation could last four days.

The development comes just after a woman in Belgium insisted she saw the missing four-year-old in a cafe with a couple who were acting strangely.

She said the child was with an English-speaking woman and a Dutch man in the Flemish town of Tongeren.

 
Murat denies any involvementPolice are carrying out forensic tests on a drinks bottle used by the girl.

Murat, a 33-year-old Brit who has been twice questioned by police and maintains his innocence, shares the house in Praia da Luz with his mum.

He is not currently at the house.

The residence is near the holiday apartment from which Madeleine vanished and had previously been searched by officers, with a number of items removed.

Murat - who has not been arrested - insists he was at home on May 3, the night Madeleine disappeared, and his mother backs his alibi.

He is considered an "arguido" - the Portuguese police term for a suspect.

IMO the information regarding the possible sighting of Madeleine in a restaurant in Belgium should be info the police keep quiet. If it were true, it serves only to turn up the heat on the abductor(s)and possibly cause him to eliminate her, or at best stay in hiding with little chance for further sighting.

Having said my piece in the above post........(http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2007-08/04/xin_12208040412254371653931.jpg)

An artist's impression, released by Belgian police August 3, 2007, shows a man who had been seen with a small girl sitting at the terrace of the roadside cafe "De Pauze" in the eastern town of Tongeren near the Dutch border. Belgian authorities are conducting DNA tests on a bottle and a straw after a possible sighting of missing British four-year-old Madeleine McCann last weekend.

An artist's impression, released by Belgian police Aug. 3, 2007, shows a man who had been seen with a small girl sitting at the terrace of the roadside cafe "De Pauze" in the eastern town of Tongeren near the Dutch border. Belgian authorities are conducting DNA tests on a bottle and a straw after a possible sighting of missing British four-year-old Madeleine McCann last weekend. (Xinhua/Reuters Photo)

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2007-08/04/content_6471726.htm

This reminds me of the Shasta Groene case, only the waitress was able to get the police there before the child was gone. But she recognized Shasta right away.
Madeleine has very distinctive eyes, so she would be hard to miss. I hope this witness is correct, and that Madeleine is at least alive.
I agree bb.....why not keep it quiet, and make the kidnappers confidence grow. Then they might make another mistake, and the child could be recovered before they kill her.

pdh3 I worry that if it was Madeleine and she was seen, maybe she is getting too "hot" to hold onto, and I'm afraid they may harm her or imprison her in some way. 

Open your eyes police in Portugal!



Change alibi and has child porn on this computer!
No documents for arrested him!
Sure something to do with the law, to don't can arrested him!
Hmhm I see also CORRUPTION in Portugal.


Suspect's Mother: 'He'll Be Cleared'
Updated: 14:15, Monday August 06, 2007

The mother of Madeleine McCann suspect Robert Murat has again insisted he is innocent amid suggestions that he may be formally eliminated from the inquiry.
Robert MuratA fresh search by police officers, including two from Britain, of Mr Murat's Praia da Luz villa at the weekend has apparently failed to find any trace of the four-year-old.
Sky News correspondent Greg Milam, who is in the Portuguese holiday resort said: "Police aren't talking about the search, but Robert Murat certainly appeared much more relaxed this morning."
Today, as she left the villa, Mr Murat's mother Jenny declared: "He's going to be cleared, he is innocent."
Portuguese authorities are remaining tight-lipped about the results of their search, as they are about newspaper reports that a second suspect is subject to round-the-clock surveillance by an undercaover team.
Meanwhile, police in Belgium are still investigating a possible sighting of Madeleine in the Flemish town of Tongeren after a customer at a restaurant said she was "100% sure" she had seen the youngster.
DNA tests on a cup that the girl used could be released as early as Wednesday, revealing whether it really was Madeleine.
Regrets: Kate McCannChild therapist Katleen Sampermans alerted police after seeing the girl she believed to be the McCanns' daughter in the company of a Dutch man and an English-speaking woman.
The group had left by the time police arrived and Ms Sampermans says she is haunted by the thought that she could have done more.
She told the Daily Express newspaper: "I wish I had just grabbed her while I had the chance. I was hesitating.
"The day after I felt so sick I had to go to the doctor."
The latest developments came as the child's mother, Kate McCann, spoke for the first time of her regret at leaving her daughter on the night she disappeared.
"We are just so desperately sorry," she said. "Every hour now, I still question, 'Why did I think that was safe?'
"If I had had to think for one second 'Should we have dinner and leave them?', I wouldn't have done it.
"It didn't happen like that. I didn't have to think for a second, that's how safe I felt."

 Police 'find blood on walls of Madeleine abduction flat'
06.08.07

 Police are said to believe the discovery of blood points to Madeleine dying at the flat, possibly in the course of being abducted. The newspaper Jornal De Noticias reported:

"This evidence locates Madeleine's death inside the apartment, but the investigators are still not certain it was murder, despite the fact that forensic experts have revealed that somebody did try to erase the blood traces.

"The theory most favoured by detectives to explain Maddy's death - now taken as almost certain - is that it involved an accident.

"The investigators are convinced that the blood belongs to Madeleine, but they are still holding back the detailed results of the tests until their suspicions are confirmed."

The latest discovery has re-focused the investigation on the McCann's apartment and the group of friends with whom they were holidaying at the time of Maddy's disappearance.

Today forensic experts returned to the room to carry out extensive tests using ultra-violet lights to scan the room for further clues.

>>>>>>The Complete Article

http://tinyurl.com/2efwng

This latest article mentions that now 3 months after the disappearance that blood spattering is found on the wall! WTH? Portuguese police have not told us about the DNA results of this blood. The article does however state:

"This evidence locates Madeleine's death inside the apartment, but the investigators are still not certain it was murder, despite the fact that forensic experts have revealed that somebody did try to erase the blood traces."

"The theory most favoured by detectives to explain Maddy's death - now taken as almost certain - is that it involved an accident."

Are we to believe that someone injured this little girl to the extent that blood spattering was left on the wall, yet they still snatched her ?......and no droplets or blood evidence was found elsewhere?

The Portuguese police seem to be. for all appearances ,following up on leads such as the recent sightings of Madeleine in Belgium. However this blood spatter "evidence" is for all intent and purpose to shift the eyes of the public and police back to the apartment and hence to the parents. This I don't believe. This case is beginning to smell of cover-up to me.

Soso, very and very good Portugal! The police has found blood!

They spoken about a link between a disappearance case in Switzerland and Portugal.
Spain News : Costa Blanca  Last Updated: Aug 4, 2007 - 7:40 PM
Police check possible links between Madeline McCann and the Swiss girl, Ylenia Lenhard.

Who has told this? Portugal sure???

(http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/media/images/307/315384.jpg)

A 67 year old Swiss resident of the Costa Blanca could be implicataed in the disapperance of the Swiss child.
The five year old Swiss girl disappeared on Tuesday near the scene of an attempted murder and the discovery of the body of the man.
The Alicante newspaper, Información, reports on a possible connection in the Marina Alta with the disappearance of a young girl in Switzerland this Tuesday.
Just five and a half years old, Ylenia Lenhard is believed to have been kidnapped, and was last seen at a swimming pool in Appenzell, Switzerland.
Police later found her rucksack and other possessions near the scene of a shooting which took place in nearby woods later that day, where a 46 year old man was injured. He’s now in intensive care and is not yet fit enough to be questioned by police.
The body of a 67 year old Swiss man resident of Benimantell in the Marina Alta since 1990, was found close by on Wednesday, together with some of the missing girl’s possessions.
He has been named as Urls Hans Von Aesch and is thought to have been involved in a shoot-out with another 46 year old man last Tuesday July 31 – the same day that the Swiss child disappeared. His body was found on August 1 in Saint Hallen in Switzerland.
The 46 year old is now in intensive care after being shot in the head, with police waiting to question him to see if he knows anything about the disappearance.
The Alicante Civil Guard are investigating in the Marina Alta at the request of the Swiss police, and have already questioned the dead man’s wife.
Possible links to the disappearance of British girl Madeline McCann in Portugal are now also reported to be being followed up.
 


 

Hate to agree with you bleachedblack but I do think you're right.  Sounds allot like Natalee to me.  :-x  Look here and look there, but?!?!?!  Still nothing in other words.  And although I may not agree with the parents in this particular case, it still doesn't mean that the police should not be doing there job. 

News by Dutch tv station
http://www.rtl.nl/(/actueel/rtlnieuws/)/components/actueel/rtlnieuws/2007/08_augustus/07
/buitenland/0807_1430_ouders_madeleine_verdacht.xml (ftp://http://www.rtl.nl/(/actueel/rtlnieuws/)/components/actueel/rtlnieuws/2007/08_augustus/07
/buitenland/0807_1430_ouders_madeleine_verdacht.xml)

Newspaper: parents Madeleine under suspicion the Portuguese police force examines if the parents of the four-year British little girl Madeleine are involved in its disappearance. Dead An anonymous source around the research says that in the Portuguese newspaper Diário the Notícias. The police force goes out of it's that of Madeleine (4). It is unclear if the parents become suspicious of failure or of killing Maddie on purpose.

Portugese newspaper Diário the Notícias.
The Portugese full story: http://www.portugaldiario.iol.pt/noticia.php?id=840750&div_id=291 (ftp://http://www.portugaldiario.iol.pt/noticia.php?id=840750&div_id=291)

Overturn in the inquiries 2007/08/07 | 13:30 PJ concluded has one month that Maddie died in the apartment of the Ocean Club. Judiciary it admits new inquirações the people next to the child. Everything depends on the analysis to the joined blood Multimédia: Photographs MORE: PJ knows that Madeleine was deceased "a dog detects what to want" The spokesman of the Judiciary Policy for the Madeleine case today admitted the probability of new inquiries, but she emphasized that the quality where some involved people in the process will be heard depends on the results of the perícias carried through in the last days. "It is possible that some people are called, but the quality where they will be heard depends on the result of the examinations", affirmed Olegário Sousa. PJ knows that Maddie is deceased has one month The inquiry around the disappearance of the English child of the Beach of the Light seems to arrive now at a crucial point: after abandoning the thesis of abduction, and vestiges of blood to have been joined in the room of the Ocean Club, the hypotheses of accidental death or homicide gain force. according to Daily of Notice, the PJ knows that Maddie was deceased, conclusion to which arrived has one month, in proper day 3 of May, to the night, in aparthotel Ocean Club, the Beach of the Light. The detected marks of blood in the walls of the apartment of the McCann extend the number of suspicious, including of the Ocean Club and the circle of familiar friends and of Madeleine employee. An information, advanced for on source to the process, guarantees that the attentions now center in the family circle and friends of the British couple. The McCann couple modified, by the way, slightly the habitual routine, not leaving the gémeos in the infantário of the Ocean Club and preventing the press. In the Joined Kingdom, the periodicals come back to criticize the Portuguese policy severely. More than to speak of new suspicious, the periodicals ask because it took as much time, three months, to find indications of blood in the apartment of the Ocean Club. Accidental death or homicide? In the monday edition, the Periodical of Notice advances that the girl of four years can have died for accident in the room of aparthotel. However, according to ventilated information today, the sample of blood could not be enough to carry through conclusive tests of ADN. Questioned on these notice, the inspector head Olegário Sousa said to the Lusa that "she has a line of the inquiry that continues in open", although to excuse itself to only detail which, adding that, in elapsing of the inquiry, some hypotheses had been gaining force, while others had lost. How much to the alleged relation pedófilo enters the Swiss suicide of one that according to The Teamses will have been in the Algarve in the height of the disappearance of the girl and the Madeleine case, Olegário Sousa says to be unaware of that the authorities of that country have communicated something to the judiciary one. "If the Swiss authorities to understand that it has indications will make to arrive this information at the Portuguese policy through the Interpol".

Parents still believe she is alive......

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/07/europe/EU-GEN-Portugal-Missing-Girl.php

Personally, I don't know what to think, other than there is a LOT of SPECULATION going on.  One day, they release a pic of a suspect who may have had her in Begium,  and 3 MONTS LATER, they find blood spatter in the flat she was last seen in?  WTF is an understatement.  How can they determine she is dead by "spatter"  It did not appear to be a LOT of blood.

I think they are grasping at straws here.....I still hold out hope that Maddie is alive and continue to pray for strength for her family.

I hear ya Ms.Vada - too much nonsense, reminds me of Natalee.  We have someone of interest; oh not really, oh we do - oh maybe not.  Too much time and too much back and forth.  And what really upsets me here also, is the wonderful LE.  If that woman (friend) reported seeing someone immediately, then it truly is LE's fault they did not act right away.

I am not trying to be graphic... but wouldn't rape cause a splattering of blood? She could be alive, but I can't really believe that she is.

What is up with these countries always thinking the parents are out for insurance or did I read the article posted by NYC wrong?

No DNA Match To Madeleine McCann
Updated: 10:34, Wednesday August 08, 2007
A DNA test on a drinks bottle used by a young girl in Belgium does not match that of missing Madeleine McCann.
Sighting claim in Belgium A child therapist had said she was "100% sure" she saw the missing four-year-old at a restaurant in the Flemish town of Tongeren, not far from the Dutch border, on July 28.
The witness said the girl was with a couple, a Dutch man and an English-speaking woman, who were acting strangely and not like "normal parents".
Belgian Police say the DNA found on the bottle was that of a man not a girl.
Correspondent Greg Milam, who is in Belgium, said that the inconclusive nature of the result means police are still desperate to trace the couple and the youngster and have not yet ruled out the possibility that it is Madeleine.
"There has been huge publicity here and yet they have still not come forward and their car, which had Begian number plates, hasn't been traced," he said.
Sightings of four-year-old Madeleine have been reported
all over Europe and further afield since she was snatched from her family's holiday
apartment in Portugal on May 3. In a radio interview Madeleine's mother, Kate McCann, said that although there was no positive news she was encouraged that people were still looking for her daughter.
"It says to us that people are still looking and that is really important and we would encourage that," she said.
"I probably have more hope now than I did at the beginning."
She added: "We haven't had any news to the contrary that Madeleine isn't alive, and that's very important."
Portuguese newspapers  have claimed detectives suspected the girl was not abducted, but died in her family's holiday flat in the Algarve village of Praia da Luz.
Blood specks found in the apartment are now in the UK for testing to see if they came from Madeleine.
It is thought the police investigation is moving away from Robert Murat, 33, the only official suspect in the case.
On Saturday, it will be 100 days since Madeleine went missing.

Thanks NYC for bringing this here.  I am sorry the dna from the straw wasn't Madeleine.  I was so hoping it was. 

At least people are out there keeping their eyes open for any possible sightings.  I'd rather have people call in and it turn out to not be the missing one, than to have nobody looking at all.

Praying for Maddie to come home soon.

Ms.V

The longer this case goes on, the more striking the similarities between Madeleine and Natalee's disappearance. A beloved child taken from her parents, a police department under media/ world scrutiny not used to such cases and coverage, heartbroken parents at first embraced by the country where they last saw there daughter, that country concerned more with economic issues when it should be concerned with doing the right thing,and now........

   
Madeleine parents 'should leave Portugal'


Last Updated: 2:44pm BST 09/08/2007
The parents of Madeleine McCann today came under renewed attack as it was claimed that residents in Praia da Luz want them to "leave Portugal".

Kate and Gerry McCann have hit back in recent days at a smear campaign in the Portuguese media which has turned suspicions on them and their friends over the disappearance of their daughter.
    
Madeleine McCann, Gerry and Kate McCann deny they are suspects
Gerry and Kate McCann want to stay in Portugal until Madeleine is found

But they were hurt by further slurs today by the lawyer for Robert Murat, the only suspect in the case.

Francisco Pagarete said: "Some people in Praia da Luz say, 'These bloody McCanns should just go away and leave this town. They are giving it a bad name'.

"This used to be a quiet place and people have businesses to think about. They rent houses and it is a question of bad publicity.

"People are thinking this is not a safe place to bring their children and have cancelled holidays here."

>>>>>>The Full Article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/09/wmaddy109.xml

'They Are Giving The Town A Bad Name'
Updated: 16:38, Thursday August 09, 2007

Madeleine McCann's parents should leave Portugal and go home, according to the lawyer for the only official suspect in the case of the missing four-year-old.
Under attack: McCanns not leavingFrancisco Pagarete said people in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz want the couple to go because they are suffering financially from a dip in tourism.
He said locals think the McCanns "should just go away and leave this town. They are giving it a bad name".
Mr Pagarete, who represents suspect Robert Murat, also criticised Kate and Gerry's "strange" behaviour in leaving the youngster alone on the night of May 3 - when she disappeared.
The McCanns have recently come under pressure from the Portuguese media, who say police now think she was not abducted but died in their holiday apartment.
The couple have now ended their daily routine of taking their two-year-old twins Sean and Amelie to the creche at the Ocean Club resort.
It comes after concerns about photographers taking pictures of their children and disturbing holidaymakers using the child-minding facility.
Madeleine McCann Kate McCann has insisted her family will not leave without Madeleine.
Mr Pagarete said he thought it was weird that the McCanns would leave their children alone in a foreign country.
The couple, who were dining with friends nearby at the time, have defended their actions, saying it was safe to leave them alone and they were "at worst" naive.
Mr Pagarete told the Evening Standard: "I think it's not normal for someone to leave their kids alone. It's not attacking the McCanns in any way, but it's not the normal thing to do."
Meanwhile, police no longer think that Murat was involved, according to the reports.
DNA analysis of blood traces found in the holiday apartment is now being carried out at a Birmingham laboratory.
One paper has even suggested police "intercepted" emails and phone calls between parents Kate and Gerry McCann and the friends on holiday with them when Madeleine vanished.
Family friends have said they are disgusted about what they said was a smear campaign against them.

Hmhm Mommy McCann...... does she knows more???  

Mother McCann said Tuesday August 07, 2007
'We Believe Madeleine Is Still Alive'
And she changed her story, 2 days later. To this:
Madeleine McCann's mother was close to tears yesterday as she dismissed suggestions that her daughter was killed in her bedroom on the night that she disappeared from the family's apartment while they vacation in Portugal.   

British Police to Question Madeleine McCann's Parents

MADRID, Spain — Madeleine McCann's mother was close to tears yesterday as she dismissed suggestions that her daughter was killed in her bedroom on the night that she disappeared from the family's apartment while they vacation in Portugal.

Kate McCann and her husband, Gerry, are expected to be interviewed again by detectives after reports that blood was found in their daughter's bedroom and evidence that it had contained a body.

The focus of the police investigation has shifted to the couple and the British friends who were with them in the Praia da Luz resort.

Police sources are reported to have abandoned the theory that Madeleine has been abducted and may still be alive. Officers are now convinced that Madeleine died in her bedroom as a result of "negligence or murder," claimed the Diário de Notícias newspaper. The McCanns, however, insisted that they still believed that Madeleine was alive when she was taken from the apartment 97 days ago.

"Last week when we met with the police they said, 'We are looking for a living child'. And they've said that a lot," Kate McCann said.

The couple refused to discuss reports that a speck of blood had been found by a British cadaver dog in the bedroom where the 4-year-old was sleeping, although Kate McCann was visibly upset when questioned. The blood sample will be sent for DNA analysis to see if it matches the girl or a kidnapper, but it may be too small to carry out the test.

"Kate and I strongly believe Madeleine was alive when she was taken from the apartment. Obviously what we don't know is what happened to her afterwards, who's taken her and what the motive is," Gerry McCann said.

"We're not naive, but on numerous occasions the Portuguese police have said they are looking for Madeleine alive and not Madeleine being murdered. I don't know of any information to have changed that," he added.

The couple are to be shown the photograph of a child snatcher who was in the area of Praia da Luz when their daughter disappeared. Urs Von Aesch, 67, killed himself last week while being hunted after abducting Ylenia Lenhard, a 5-year-old Swiss girl who looks like Madeleine.

Officers in St. Gallen, Switzerland, close to where Ylenia disappeared, have also reopened files on five other girls who disappeared in the area before von Aesch moved to Benimantell, which is near the Spanish coast.

A Swiss citizen, he was jailed in the 1960s after trying to blackmail a businessman by threatening to kidnap his young son. He went on to become a successful businessman before moving to Spain with his Spanish wife in about 1990.

The McCanns will be shown his photograph while they are questioned separately at the headquarters of the Polícia Judiciária in Portimão as part of a review of the entire investigation. They have already been interviewed twice at the headquarters.

A Renault car that had been used by the couple and their friends after Madeleine disappeared is still being investigated by police officers and forensic scientists. Tests have also been carried out on a car belonging to Robert Murat, the only official suspect in the case. The cars of his mother, his girlfriend, her estranged husband and Sergei Malinka, a web designer who had worked for Murat, have also been tested.

Gerry McCann said that he and his wife expected to be treated with the same thoroughness as anyone else in the investigation. "We wouldn't expect it any other way," he said. "The same high levels will be applied to us as would be applied to anybody else, and that's only right and proper."

Madeleine was not seen alive by anyone apart from her parents for almost four hours on the night that she disappeared while sleeping in a room with the McCanns' 2-year-old twins, Amelie and Sean, it was claimed yesterday. She was put to bed at 6 p.m. and Gerry McCann said that he saw her an hour before his wife reported her missing at 10 p.m. Other friends in the group had checked on the apartment but had not entered the bedroom.

Portuguese police are reported to be concerned about inconsistencies between the statements given by the McCanns and their friends, three other couples and a single woman. The couples are Russell O'Brien and Jane Tanner, both 36, from Exeter, Fiona Payne, 34, and her husband, David, from Leicester, and Rachel Oldfield, 36, and her husband, Matthew, from London.

British and Portuguese police have been monitoring at least one of the friends and a worker connected to the Ocean Club resort, where the group stayed, although police have previously said that nobody in the group was a suspect.

A source close to the investigation said that the McCanns and their friends would be interviewed as part a routine review of the investigation being carried out with the help of British police officers. He said that possible traces of blood in Madeleine's ground-floor bedroom could have come from any of the hundreds of people who had stayed in the apartment in recent years.

Experts also cast doubt on claims that a British dog trained to track bodies had detected a scent in the bedroom. The body would have had to be in the room for at least several hours before leaving a detectable trace.

Murat has already been re-interviewed and a search of his home and garden over the weekend using British dogs and sonar equipment failed to reveal any trace of Madeleine. Murat, who previously lived in Hockering, Norfolk, with his wife and young daughter, denies any involvement in the kidnapping.

Completely sounding like Natalee now...

we botched the investigation so, we will make up stories surrounding how it could be the parents... :roll:

'Portuguese police are reported to be concerned about inconsistencies between the statements given by the McCanns and their friends, three other couples and a single woman. The couples are Russell O'Brien and Jane Tanner, both 36, from Exeter, Fiona Payne, 34, and her husband, David, from Leicester, and Rachel Oldfield, 36, and her husband, Matthew, from London.

British and Portuguese police have been monitoring at least one of the friends and a worker connected to the Ocean Club resort, where the group stayed, although police have previously said that nobody in the group was a suspect.'

I have to say this particular part disturbs me quite a bit, however, I would agree with Mrs. Red - it does remind me allot of Natalee.  When you don't know what else to do, do whatever.  Arrest and/or question several people.  But let's not really get to the bottom of this, it just may cost us our jobs.  

you have got to be kidding NYC...didn't you learn this lesson thru Natalee and Beth?! If the police bungle the investigation and it begins to cost us money and tourists, what should we do? BLAME THE PARENTS. Gawd, that first sentence made my stomach churn!!!

So...these parents killed Madeleine,cleaned up the crime scene, and disposed of her body efficiently, since it hasn't been found, and then casually went to dinner with their friends? And no one noticed a thing? Yeah, right.

Missing UK Girl's Dad Sees Probe Shift
LONDON -

The parents of a 4-year-old British girl who disappeared in Portugal said they believed their daughter is still alive but suggested that Portuguese authorities may fear otherwise.

In an interviews broadcast Friday, Madeleine McCann's father said Portuguese investigators appeared to have changed their focus.

"There's definitely been a shift. They haven't said that she's dead - on multiple occasions they (said they) believed they were looking for a missing child - but there's been a shift," Gerry McCann told the British Broadcasting Corp. television.

Recent media reports have said that previously undiscovered traces of blood have been found in the hotel room in Praia da Luz, Portugal, from which Madeleine disappeared while her parents ate in the hotel's restaurant.

British police are reportedly still testing the substance to determine if it is blood, but the find has prompted speculation that the child was murdered in the room. Portuguese police have insisted Madeleine's parents are not suspects.

Gerry McCann said he knew of no evidence to suggest his daughter was dead.

"I want to see the evidence which has caused their shift because it's so important to us as parents that if there is evidence, we need to know about it," he said.

Saturday will mark the 100th day since Madeleine's disappearance in May. The McCanns have mounted a dogged campaign to keep their daughter's name in the news in the run-up to the anniversary.

The McCanns are also helping promote a new section of the video sharing Web site YouTube, launched Friday to help find missing children.

The 'Don't You Forget About Me' channel hosts videos of missing children and is managed by the International Center for Missing and Exploited Children in Washington.

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/08/10/ap4008731.html

100 Days: Madeleine 'Might Be Dead'
Updated: 17:36, Saturday August 11, 2007

Portuguese police are considering the possibility that Madeleine McCann might be dead, the chief inspector investigating the case has said.

Sad milestone for family Olegario Sousa has said that new findings have forced them to consider the possibility.

"In the past few days there have been some developments, some clues that have been found that could point to the possible death of the little child," Mr Sousa told the BBC.

He added that police have increased the intensity of their investigation into the possible death of Madeleine - but all lines of inquiry remain open.

Mr Sousa also said Kate and Gerry McCann were not being considered as suspects despite reports in Portuguese papers this week suggesting the contrary.

The news came as Madeleine McCann's parents attended a special church service in Praia da Luz to pray for her on the 100th day since the four-year-old disappeared.

The sad milestone has been marked amid claims of tensions between Portuguese police and the four-year-old's parents.

There has been a distinct hardening in the attitude of detectives towards Gerry and Kate McCann this week, according to one source.

On Monday, Mr McCann met senior officers in the case at the British Consulate in the Algarve for a routine briefing.

When he and his wife next spoke with detectives two days later, the meeting took place at the police station in Portimao and the tone was much more formal, the source said.

There has been no suggestion from the police that the McCanns are now suspects, but the couple are understood to be apprehensive about the change.

It coincided with some Portuguese newspapers claiming detectives are checking if she died in the family holiday flat and even that the McCanns were suspects.

Father Keith Tomlinson, the local priest in the McCanns' home town, said there was "no excuse" for Gerry and Kate to be treated as suspects.

"I take it as an excuse to cover the fact that there has been no success," he told Sky News.

"Your heart goes out to them and the agony they are still suffering. One hundred days is a long time."

Responding to the "very hurtful" newspaper reports, the McCanns said they would not be "bullied" into leaving Portugal by the growing backlash.

They are spending today in Praia da Luz with their two other children in defiance of claims by Robert Murat's lawyer that many of the town's residents want them to leave.

Meanwhile, back in the UK, the 100th day without Madeleine is being marked by a series of events, including prayer services, publicity videos at sporting events.

In Glasgow, a lone piper played a specially written lament dedicated to Madeleine at the opening of the International Pipe band competition.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1279568,00.html

McCanns' Anger Over Police Interview
Updated: 04:09, Sunday August 12, 2007

Madeleine McCann's parents were not told by Portuguese police that the man leading the hunt for the missing girl would go public with his belief that the youngster was dead, it has emerged.
 
Police insist McCanns are not suspectsA family friend said it was "extraordinary" the police had "not had the decency" to tell the couple they now believed Madeleine could be dead before giving interviews to the media.

Speaking on the 100th day of Madeleine's disappearance from an Algarve hotel, Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa said he believed the four-year-old may not be alive.

The acknowledgement threatens to open up a rift between the McCanns and police.

The senior officer's comments appear to contradict the message that the McCanns, from Rothley, Leicestershire, have been receiving from investigators.

Mrs McCann on Tuesday said police had told her only the previous week that they were "looking for a living child".

But Mr Sousa said new evidence suggesting Madeleine was killed was being investigated with "intensity".

"In these past few days, there have been some developments, and some clues have been found, that could point in a possible death of the little child," he said.

Sniffer dogs last week discovered blood specks on a wall in the McCanns' holiday flat in the resort of Praia da Luz.

The samples have been sent to Britain for DNA tests, which are expected to be returned early this week.

Mr Sousa also said the McCanns and the seven friends with them on holiday when Madeleine disappeared on May 3 were not considered suspects.

That contradicted unconfirmed reports in Portuguese papers last week suggesting they were now under suspicion.

The McCanns yesterday attended a poignant service for Madeleine and other missing children in the church of Nossa Senhora da Luz in Praia da Luz.

Clutching her daughter's favourite soft toy, Mrs McCann made an emotional appeal for people to keep supporting her and her husband through their "journey of hope".

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?storyID=8144
Phone intercepts ‘confirm Maddy’s death’

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22226920-2,00.html
Article from: The Sunday Telegraph

Doesn't this sound familiar ?
Of course they have to look at the parents in any case like this. That would have been done first. Sounds to me like the Portugese Police have run out of new things to do and they have now come back to the people who were there. The Portugese Police were and maybe still are under fire for their inept investigation.

Missing Madeleine Rivets Britons as Portuguese Patience Frays
August 15

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601102&sid=a4nKWktOjruA&refer=uk

I have to say that I am with y'all on this.... shades of Aruba and Natalee....

ITA as well. It's very unfortunate.

Scientists dispute report over missing British girl

Posted 5 hours 16 minutes ago

Blood samples from a holiday apartment in Portugal where four-year-old British girl Madeleine McCann disappeared in May do not belong to the missing youngster, a London newspaper reports.

But the claims that the blood probably came instead from a white man "from the north-east European sub-group" were immediately rejected by the British laboratory testing the samples.

"This is an ongoing investigation and we can't make any comment. However, we are surprised at The Times piece," a spokeswoman for the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham in central-west England, told AFP.

A spokesman for the Portuguese police said they had not received any results from scientists and would not say when they were expected.

AFP understands from a source close to the investigation that tests are not finished on a wide range of swabs and other samples, including blood, and that no firm conclusions have been made.

The newspaper, which said its report was based on four pages of technical results, said the blood tests would give fresh hope to Madeleine's parents Gerry and Kate McCann that their daughter was still alive.

The Portuguese police spokesman also denied reports in a number of British newspapers that investigators were convinced Madeleine died on the night she was last seen.

Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa said on Saturday they have not ruled out the possibility that Madeleine may be dead but all lines of inquiry were open.

Madeleine vanished from a bedroom in a holiday flat in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz on May 3 while her parents were at a nearby restaurant.

http://abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/08/16/2007349.htm?section=world

'Strong Theory' Madeleine Is Dead
Updated: 18:05, Thursday August 16, 2007

One of the most senior police officers in Portugal has said it is a "strong theory" that Madeleine McCann is dead.
 
Madeleine McCannAlipio Ribeiro, national director of the Portuguese judicial police, said forensic test results on blood traces from the holiday flat are due "imminently".

He told Spanish newspaper El Mundo: "Even though it's a strong theory and there is always a possibility, we cannot say that she has died.

"It is the theory that we have to work with."

Speaking about forensic tests, he said the quality of traces of blood found in the Praia da Luz apartment were "not very good" and it was possible they would be inconclusive.

Mr Ribeiro refused to speculate on what would happen if it did turn out to be Madeleine's blood, but said the results would be significant.

He said he was "optimistic" about getting to the bottom of the "very complex" case.

Asked if her parents were suspects, he said: "No. The parents have never been suspects. Never."

Asked if his force had any idea where Madeleine was, he said: "No. We have no idea where Madeleine could be."

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1280211,00.html

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1280398,00.html

Girl In Belgium 'Not Madeleine'
Updated: 15:28, Saturday August 18, 2007

A young Belgian girl thought last month to have been missing British four-year-old Madeleine McCann has been confirmed as the daughter of a Belgian man.
 
Madeleine: Missing since May 3A woman alerted police last month after spotting a girl she believed was Madeleine at a roadside cafe in the eastern Belgian town of Tongeren with a Dutch-speaking man of about 40 and an English-speaking woman of around 25.

But it is reported today that prosecutors have confirmed that, following a DNA test, the girl was not Madeleine, but Sjanneke, the four-year-old daughter of a Belgian man from the town of Hoogstraten.

Madeleine went missing on a family holiday to Portugal on May 3, since when there have been a number of possible sightings from Morocco to Argentina.

None has been confirmed and Portuguese police have said she may be dead.

This must be a crushing blow to her parents. As much as they probably tried not to hope too much, I'm sure they did anyway.

I am beginning to fear that this beautiful child really is dead. And it looks like the Portuguese police can't find her, and don't really want to.

This case is too similar to David Westerfield  who kidnapped & murdered 7-year-old Danielle van Dam.

The mother and father went out, left the children alone - the neighbor entered the home and kidnapped the 7 yr old child from her bed, took her in his motor home to the desert and molested her, then killed her and  her body was found by a body of water.

I thought the Dad was at home, but was stoned, or passed out, and left a door unlocked? I know the Mom was at a bar with friends.
Either way, it is similar.

Ahhh....so Dad had been out too? I just remember that he had been smoking pot that night or something and was so stoned he didn't secure the house. I'm not blaming the parents exactly, but why not take extra precautions when we know that there are evil people who will come into childrens' rooms and take them away and do them tremendous harm? Unfortunately, that's the world we live in.

What a mistake of a child therapist!
Dark blond, and blond.
Blue eye and brown eye.

Madeleine: New Development Expected
Updated: 12:13, Monday August 20, 2007

A new development in the Madeleine McCann case is expected within the next few days, Sky News has learnt.
 
Madeleine now missing for 109 days.
Crime correspondent Martin Brunt understands detectives may want to question a man who was in the Algarve holiday resort of Praia da Luz on the night the four-year-old disappeared.

He believes the development could tie in with alleged inconsistencies in the statements of those who were with Gerry and Kate McCann on May 3.

It follows reports in the local Portuguese media that police may be about to arrest a second British suspect.

Brunt says increased activity surrounding the case rings true with recent suggestions from Portuguese police that developments are likely within the next few weeks.

Mistaken identity: Sjanneke Hofstede
Police leave has been cancelled and officers have been granted a number of new search warrants which they are expected to execute within the next 48 hours.

"Certainly there is renewed activity in the case," Brunt said.

"More searches are about to begin and there could be a new suspect. It all suggests there is a new impetus to the investigation."

The latest developments in the case come as investigators wait on DNA test results on specs of blood found inside the McCanns's Algarve holiday home.

Madeleine has now been missing for 109 days. She vanished from the flat as her parents dined nearby.

Meanwhile, Belgian police have ruled out a possible sighting of Madeleine at a cafe last month.

The four-year-old in question, Sjanneke Hofstede, was spotted at the cafe with her father.

http://www.anorak.co.uk/news/madeleine-mccann/176048.html

Indeed....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1280780,00.html

Madeleine Police Boss Feeling 'Positive'
Updated: 17:05, Tuesday August 21, 2007

The Portuguese detective leading the hunt for Madeleine McCann says he has a "positive feeling" about the inquiry.
 
Madeleine: missing for 110 daysChief Inspector Olegario Sousa also indicated that a clearer picture may be emerging of what happened to the child on the night she vanished.

Mr Sousa was speaking as detectives awaited the results of tests on specks of blood found in the Praia da Luz holiday flat from where the four-year-old disappeared on May 3.

The spokesman for Portugal's investigative Policia Judiciaria said: "We have already said that all the lines are still open.

"...We haven't enough information to make the picture of what happened that night. But we are with a positive feeling on this."

Pressed on whether a clearer picture of what had happened to Madeleine was emerging, he said: "Yes, you might say so.

"But we are not with all the information at the moment - we are putting together information."

Mr Sousa's latest comments come amid renewed police activity in the Algarve resort town.

All police leave has been cancelled and officers have been granted a number of new search warrants which they are expected to execute over the next few days.

It is now 110 days since Madeleine disappeared from her family's apartment as her parents, Kate and Gerry, dined nearby with friends.

Anglo-Portuguese ex-pat Robert Murat, 33, is still the only official suspect in the case.

Madeleine McCann's Parents Tell Spanish Papers They Think Their Daughter is Alive in Spain
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,294120,00.html

In EU laws on sex offenders and crimes against children!!! Oh really????? And that after almost 4 months! Muy bueno!

McCann Campaign May Force Law Change
Updated: 08:43, Thursday August 23, 2007

The campaign to find Madeleine McCann may force a change in EU laws on sex offenders and crimes against children.
 
MEPs back changes to lawMEPs overwhelmingly support creating an EU-wide sex offenders register - and politicians across Europe want crimes involving children to be treated the same way in all member states.

The views were aired as part of a survey commissioned by the campaign to find Madeleine McCann, who was snatched from her parents' holiday flat in Portugal 112 days ago.

Numerous sightings of the four-year-old have been reported across Europe and North Africa, including in Belgium, Malta and Morocco.

Almost every MEP surveyed (97%) agreed there should be an EU-wide sex offenders register, and 95% said police should treat serious crimes involving children exactly the same across Europe.

Nearly nine out of 10 MEPs would support the introduction of a common EU policy on child abduction cases.

The research also looked at attitudes of British MPs, 84% of whom believed sex offenders should be tracked as they move across Europe and forced to register with local police.

 
McCanns call for more discussionsAlmost nine in 10 MPs felt that the UK's Child Rescue Alert - an emergency scheme to publicise suspected child abductions within hours - should be extended across the EU.

Madeleine's parents Kate and Gerry, from Rothley, Leicestershire, have travelled around Europe to publicise their daughter's disappearance.

They said she could have been taken to another country by abductors taking advantage of the EU's porous borders.

Mr McCann said "We are pleased to see that elected members of both the UK and European parliaments agree that changes to legislation and greater consistency across the European Union are needed.

"Kate and I would like to encourage further debate on how Europe can best manage serious crimes such as child abduction."

:: Populus surveyed 50 UK MPs selected to be representative of all the political parties at Westminster between July 9 and 25.

CommunicateResearch surveyed 105 MEPs selected to be representative of all the major EU member states and political groups in the European Parliament between July 19 and August 2.

Spanish police investigating reported sighting of missing British girl Madeleine McCann

The Associated Press
Published: August 23, 2007

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/23/europe/EU-GEN-Spain-Missing-Girl.php

The longer Maddy is missing the more similarities between this case and the handling of the Holloway case come to light. Now we are at the "blame-the-parents" stage. Blame them, anger them until perhaps to others they might look to have anger management issues? Maybe they will look as though there is anagenda? They will try to carry on as long as they can in the search for their precious child.......but in the end they will go home without her. They will try to go on with their lives everyday feeling that hollow void
and remembering........

+++++++++++++
Madeleine McCann overdose claim angers McCanns

August 26, 2007 05:28pm
THE family of missing English girl Madeleine McCann are furious after a Portuguese newspaper report which said police believed she was killed by her parents.

The four-year-old's father Gerry  was accused, along with his wife Kate, of accidentally killing Madeleine with an overdose of sedatives.

It is 114 days since Madeleine vanished from her bed in the McCanns' holiday apartment in Praia da Luz, while her parents were at a nearby restaurant.

The McCanns, both 39, have remained in the Algarve with their two-year-old twins Sean and Amelie, clinging to the hope that Madeleine would be found alive.

Portuguese newspaper Tal & Qual ran a front-page picture of Mr and Mrs McCann and the headline: "Police believe parents killed Maddie".

Inside, the paper alleged Madeleine died as a result of an overdose of sedatives given to help her sleep, the British Press Association reported.

The McCanns denied giving her such medication.

Tal & Qual claimed Portuguese detectives "are almost absolutely certain that Madeleine was killed by accident by her parents".

The paper attributed its story to an anonymous source close to the investigation and even speculated about the prison sentence someone might get for the crimes of homicide by negligence and hiding a body.

"It's incredibly hurtful and incredibly untrue. Even if somebody could think that, there is just absolutely no evidence pointing in that direction," Mr McCann said.

"Without anything else, what that implies is that we somehow did it, we did it together, managed to dispose of Madeleine without a car, without anything, that the whole group was involved, that there must have been other people involved.

"It is just so absurd, it is just not credible. But we will come through it. We will not stop and it will move on. My opinion of what happened has not changed in 16 weeks."

Mr McCann attacked anonymous police sources who have been feeding allegations to the Portuguese press, apparently in breach of the country's laws preventing details of investigations being made public.

"I am disappointed that so much information is in the public domain in a country that supposedly has judicial secrecy," he said.

The journalist who wrote the story, Catarina Vaz Guerreiro, said: "I can't reveal my source, but I have complete trust in them.

"I strongly believe the person who told us this information is telling us the truth."

The story was dismissed by Portuguese polic

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22308860-663,00.html

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1282178,00.html

Madeleine's Parents To Sue Newspaper
Updated: 16:03, Friday August 31, 2007

The parents of missing Madeleine McCann have confirmed they are suing a Portuguese newspaper that claimed they killed their daughter.
(snipped)

Morning Monkeys - I cannot believe they are trying to lay this trip on the parents.  I guess that is what you call 'go in that direction when we don't know where else to go.'   :-x  Did that LE ever hear of 'keep looking.'  ???

Although I think the parents used poor judgement in leaving the children alone and I think they said the doors were unlocked. Hindsight is 20/20. They probably wish the same thing.

 A few years ago our son and daughter in law snuck out of the hotel room while children were sleeping. A 3 year old and a 7 year old. Parents were gone about 15 minutes but evidently the 3 year old woke up and went out the door , 7 year old also woke up to 3 year old leaving. She too went out the door. Now they are both in the hallway and can't get back in the room. The 3 year old now is confused about which door is theres. Pounding on the wrong door. Thank God the person in the room was not a pedophile or worse. He called security so when son and DIL came back to room security was coming from the opposite direction.

They never made the same mistake again . Again Thank God.

Here is an interesting article I found on the internet today:

"Madeleine: one fact, many lies, endless grief"
It’s now 124 days since Madeleine McCann disappeared. Our correspondent charts a story that became global, lurid and often invented – and hears how the McCanns learnt to think positively after imagining the darkest scenarios and suffering uncontrollable grief"

http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/families/article2379833.ece

Police failed to tell McCanns of possible breakthrough

05/09/2007 - 5:19:40 PM

Portuguese police failed to tell the parents of missing Madeleine McCann about a possible forensic breakthrough that could end their agonising wait to learn what happened to their daughter.

Kate and Gerry McCann only heard about the apparent development after a newspaper report today that tests at a British laboratory had produced “significant new information”.

Experts at the Forensic Science Service (FSS) in Birmingham have spent the past month analysing samples taken from the McCanns’ holiday apartment in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.

http://www.eveningecho.ie/news/bstory.asp?j=15021944&p=y5xzy99x&n=15022032

MADELEINE MCCANN: 'BLOOD ON THE WALLS'

Madeleine McCann's blood has been found on the walls of the holiday flat where she slept, according to fresh reports in Portugal.

Police say attempts were made to clean it off, making it likely that the four-year-old was killed, either by accident or design, in the holiday complex in Praia da Luz .....

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/?storyID=8102

Also SKY news:

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1282926,00.html

Madeleine: Forensic Results Returned
Updated: 17:35, Wednesday September 05, 2007

Police hunting missing Madeleine McCann have finally received the results of forensic tests from a laboratory in Britain.
Sky News crime correspondent Martin Brunt has learned that the results are expected to lead to a significant development.

Phone intercepts ‘confirm Maddy’s death’

Intercepted telephone calls and emails between the McCanns and their friends have "confirmed the death of Madeleine" say police, according to one Portuguese newspaper today. The intercepts are said to have been made in a joint operation conducted by Portuguese and British police officers....

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?storyID=8144

I hadn't realized until today that they say their was definately blood on the walls, and it was definately Madelines.  That is sad to hear. 

I'm curious to the new developments on the case as far as the forensics go.....Maybe the parents do know more than they want everyone to believe.   :sad:

I apologize.

The two articles I provided from "The First Post" were actually posted on August 6th and 8th respectively and ... reposted today. Klaas considers this publication nothing more than a tabloid.

However ... considering the articles in other media outlets today regarding the pending revelation concerning the forensic tests conducted in Britain ... I believe something is about to break.

Janet

Madeleine: Forensic Results Returned
Updated: 18:48, Wednesday September 05, 2007

Police hunting missing Madeleine McCann have finally received the results of forensic tests from a laboratory in Britain ....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1282926,00.html

MsVada I didn't know until today either that there was definitely blood on the walls and it was definitely Madeleine's.  I had read a couple weeks ago blood was found on the walls, but that it was supposedly a tourists from a different stay.  (and a man's blood, no less)   Here is the link to that: http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=1590&id=1296452007  Maybe we were misled until all the tests could be made and more investigation completed before the information that it was Maddy's was released.  I'm wondering if it is all a part of a strategy from the police to find the killers.  I understand from another news article the parents and their friends on the trip are to be requestioned. It appears Madeleine isn't of this world any longer and it pains me to realize that.  I hope whomever harmed her and took her young life will answer for it.  Poor little angel, if she is indeed gone.

Madeleine police 'handed forensic evidence'
By Caroline Gammell in Praia da Luz

Last Updated: 7:21pm BST 05/09/2007
Detectives investigating the disappearance of Madeleine McCann have been handed significant forensic evidence which could lead to arrests in the case ....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/05/nmaddy105.xml

MADELEINE ARREST (misleading headline)

POLICE who are hunting for missing Madeleine McCann are expected to make an arrest in days.
The news comes after a long-awaited forensic breakthrough.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/18384/MADELEINE-ARREST-


Hummm!

"But they are also expected to provide detectives with vital information about a new suspect they have been monitoring, allowing them to move in and make an arrest."

Carpe just posted this link in the NH forum: :sad:

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=9546&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

mexx

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 741

 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 12:37 am    Post subject: Correio da manha 6 September   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
http://www.correiomanha.pt/not.....&p=200

http://www.correiomanha.pt/not.....&p=200


Biological fluids of Maddie had been found by the laboratory of Birminghan in the samples sent pe it Judiciary Policy for England.

The cm knows that these vestiges - by rough estimate found not perceivable residues of naked blood in the apartment of the Oce-an Club and in the car rented for the McCann - already if find in the ownership of the PJ and will have to determine immediate developments of the case. Most important she will have to be a new interrogation to the parents of Madeleine and to some of the friends of the couple who if found of vacation in the Algarve when the child disappeared.

These developments based on the results of the biological samples today are also notified by some English periodicals that point with respect to the accomplishment of detentions in next the 48 hours. The samples most important, of the sets of ten that had been sent for England, must have been the collected ones in the apartment of the Mc-Cann in the Beach of the Light, in particular in the soil and a closet in the house where later the family if installed and in the car that had rented after the girl having disappeared. These samples had been collected after the English pisteiros dogs having signaled biological vestiges of blood and corpse odor in clothes of Kate McCann.
 

From the Mirror forum as translated by someone who speak Portuguese:

rbarreira

Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 554

 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 1:05 am    Post subject:     

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Yes, it's the word chão (floor). A good dictionary would have it for sure.

I don't feel like doing a word for word translation, but as people have gathered already, the main points are:

- Maddie's blood found in the Ocean club apartment and in a car rented by the McCanns
- There'll likely be a new interrogation of the McCanns and some of their friends
- Some samples were recovered on the floor and in a closet of the APARTMENT THEY MOVED TO AFTERWARDS (not ocean club). [sorry for the caps, bold doesn't work]
- these samples were recovered after the english dogs signalled blood and corpse scent in clothes belonging to Kate McCann.
 
 

Another full translation in the same forum of the article in the Portuguese paper:

plastikheart

Joined: 25 Aug 2007
Posts: 71

 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 1:12 am    Post subject: Re: re   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Translation


Biological fluids of Maddie have have been found by the laboratory of Birminghan in the samples send by Policia Judiciária to England.

The cm knows that these traces - Blood traces not visible to the normal eyesight found at the Ocean Club apartment and in the car rented by the Mcann’s - are already back and were received by the PJ and should determine immediate developments in this case.
Of outmost importance will be the new interrogation/questioning of Madeleine’s parents and of some friends of the couple that were on holidays in the Algarve when the child disappeared.

These developments based on the results of the biological samples have been on the news of today’s several British newspapers pointing to the accomplishment of detentions in the next 48 hours. The most important samples, (of the several more than ten collected), must have been collected in the apartment of the Maccann’s in Praia da Luz, more specifically on the floor and in a closet in the house where the family moved in latter and in the car they have rented after the girl disappeared.
These samples were collected after the English dogs have signalled biological traces of blood and of a scent of a corpse in clothes belonging to Kate Maccann
 

 :shock:

SO do we know if it's true... was it really the parents?  I would have the hardest time believing that ...

i have been saying it from the get go  :shock:

it has not been proven YET, by any means

All we know is one paper is reporting this.  Sky news has not reported as much detail.  Sky news has only said the results are back and the investigation"

Madeleine: Forensic Results Returned
Updated: 18:48, Wednesday September 05, 2007

Police hunting missing Madeleine McCann have finally received the results of forensic tests from a laboratory in Britain.
 
Madeleine McCannSky News crime correspondent Martin Brunt has learned that the results are expected to lead to a significant development.

The tests were carried out on a large volume of material taken from the holiday apartment in Praia da Luz, Portugal, where the McCanns were staying when Madeleine was kidnapped on May 3.

Forensic scientists in Birmingham, who carried out the tests, have been looking for evidence of the four-year-old's blood, saliva and hair.

They have also been looking for evidence of other people who could be linked to the investigation.

Sky's Martin Brunt said: "It could identify new suspects, it could affect the status of the only suspect in the case, Robert Murat.

(snipped)


So we really don't know for sure yet.  I'm hoping the Portuguese paper is FOS.

I did a search of the news and will post this because the date showing is Sept. 6. It indicates that the results of the tests are not complete.

http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.1667912.0.0.php

Will the blood found next turn into chocolate and cleaning fluid? 

If the story or rumour is that the parents accidently overdosed Madeleine, why would her blood be anywhere in the room? Just curious. I don't want to believe that her parents are involved in this in any way, but want the truth more than anything else.

If it is indeed the parents, I think it was the mother and not the father. What do you think? Both parents? And the big question is why?

CBB, what would they overdose her with?

I don't know, Louise. My understanding is there is something out there (rumour at this point, I suppose) that they overdosed her with sleeping medication and accidently gave her too much.

MADELEINE: DNA IS FOUND
EXCLUSIVE Arrest expected 'in 48 hours'

By Martin Fricker & Jon Clements 06/09/2007

The dna of a potential suspect in the Madeleine McCann case has been found by British scientists.

It was discovered among fragments of forensic evidence taken from Kate and Gerry McCann's holiday flat and sent to the UK for analysis. Last night sources said Portuguese police were now expected to make new arrests within 48hours.

The DNA is said to have been found in an area of the Praia da Luz flat where the individual should not have been.

Madeleine's parents were furious last night after Portuguese police failed to tell them about the test results.

Advertisement
 FULL STORY: PAGES 4 & 5

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2007/09/06/madeleine-dna-is-found-89520-19741892/

WOW!!!  :shock:  Certainly hope the parents aren't involved.  I can safely say however, I have believed in different people over the years and they have completely surprised me. 

What I don't understand is, why would there be blood in their rental car???  It is bad enough that (maybe) it is her blood in the room. 

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1282955,00.html

McCanns Being Quizzed Separately
Updated: 14:30, Thursday September 06, 2007

Madeleine McCann's mother Kate has arrived at a police station in Portugal to be re-interviewed by detectives investigating the four-year-old's disappearance.
 
Mrs McCann was driven to Portimao by her husband Gerry from their rented house in Praia da Luz.

He dropped her off at the entrance and gave her a goodbye kiss.

Mr McCann will be questioned separately tomorrow.

Sky News Crime Correspondent Martin Brunt said police wanted to re-interview the McCanns as witnesses.

But he added: "According to the McCann family it appears to be more formal."

Portuguese police called Mr McCann on Monday to request the interviews, specifying that Mrs McCann should be questioned first.

It is only the second time she has been formally interviewed by police, the first being on May 4, the day after Madeleine went missing.

Detectives have already questioned Gerry McCann twice.

 
It is expected that Mrs McCann's interview will be longer than the one she gave officers in May, which lasted between three and four hours.

The development comes after officers leading the investigation were given DNA test results.

Sky News has learned vital clues from the results are expected to lead to a significant development.

Experts at the Forensic Science Service (FSS) in Birmingham have spent the past month analysing samples taken from the McCanns' holiday apartment in the Algarve resort of Praia da Luz.

The evidence recovered includes blood flecks found by British sniffer dogs on the wall in Madeleine's bedroom, where she vanished on May 3.

 
A source has confirmed that information gathered by the FSS had been "regularly fed back" to investigators in Portugal, although the official line remains that tests are "ongoing".

An FSS spokeswoman would not comment on the specifics of the case, but said: "There has been a lot of speculation. The tests are ongoing.

"There has been no change in that, despite what the reports say. It's a live investigation and we are working with the police."

The only official suspect in the case, 33-year-old ex-pat Robert Murat, believes the Portuguese authorities will shortly clear him formally.

His spokesman Tuck Price said he had not been told about any developments in the case.

"Why are they holding him in limbo?" he added. "That is still a concern - unless they are using him as cover so that they can continue investigating somebody else...

"It's still very frustrating - it's been five weeks since they went back in there again (to search Mr Murat's house for a second time), and we thought this would all be sewn up."

In August ... the McCanns were "requested" not to leave Portugal as the investigation was going in another direction. However ... the fact that they chose not to leave and return to Britain definitely is something for those to consider who speculate that the parents are in some way involved in their daughter's disappearance.

My neighbour has been following the case and ... one of her "speculations" implies that "possibly" one of the McCanns' friends may have played a role ... at the very least ... in the coverup.  The foundation of her speculation is based on media reports that a friend who was dining with the McCanns left the table for a period of time to attend to his sick child.  My neighbour cannot comprehend why a parent would leave a sick child alone for any period of time. 

Janet


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave

By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

Police have told the parents of Madeleine McCann to abandon plans to leave Portugal amid new hopes of a breakthrough in the case.

Kate and Gerry McCann last week admitted for the first time they have considered a return to Britain, more than three months after their daughter disappeared in Praia da Luz.

But a senior police source revealed last night that they have advised the McCanns that now is “not the right time” to leave, because of a “change” in the direction of the investigation.

Detectives now believe that abduction is no longer the main lead, and that Madeleine died in the apartment on the night she disappeared.

The source said: “There is nothing to stop the McCanns going home - they are not suspects - but we have told them that it is not good timing because the investigation has changed. It is active now in assuming that Madeleine is dead.”

<snipped>

”Dr (Russell) O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick. It is understood he shared duties with his partner Jane Tanner. Rachael Oldfield, another friend who was dining with them, said: “It is just ludicrous. He is a lovely bloke. This is a total smear.”

In an interview with a Spanish newspaper, Mr and Mrs McCann were asked if they had any suspicions of their friends. Mr McCann immediately and firmly said “no". Mr McCann added: “We trust our friends.”

CNN is now reporting on this.....

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/09/06/madeleine.mccann/index.html?iref=mpstoryview

Well, I just don't know what to think.  This little girl seemed one that could turn out to be alive.  Regardless of who is responsible, the chances of that are beginning to look very slight.

   

Madeleine McCann's mother questioned again
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/06/nmaddy206.xml
*Snipped*
The McCanns have employed the services of top Lisbon lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu, who arrived in Praia da Luz this morning.

He has made a formal application to the district attorney in Portimao for the couple's status to be changed from "witness" to "assistant" in the investigation.

If this is approved, it means the couple will be allowed greater access to information about the case.

 McCanns 'fear being named suspects'
http://ukpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5jIFoi_xzFo0VqZN2wg1Mp4m9ndEw

Like Robots, I thought it was the parents at first, too. But then they seemed like such nice people and they even had that audience with the Pope, which led me to believe they couldn't be guilty. After all, who's going to lie to the Pope?

Wasn't there a news report in June that said they were giving up hope and ending the search? (It was around June 10, a little over a month after Madeleine went missing). I did find this suspect, as giving up after a month seems like a short amount of time, and I can't imagine a parent ever abandoning hope of finding his or her child--or at least learning the truth about what happened.

This case is so sad. Anyone who's ever spent any time around a 3- or 4-year-old knows how vulnerable and trusting they are.

News from Dutch news paper DE TELEGRAAF.
http://www.telegraaf.nl/buitenland/70342271/Lijkengeur_aan_jurkje_moeder_Maddie.html?p=1,2

Lijkengeur aan jurkje moeder Maddie
AMSTERDAM - Nieuwe feiten in de Maddie-affaire: een politiehond heeft lijkengeur geroken aan een jurkje van de moeder van Maddie. De ouders van de 4-jarige vermiste Maddie staan weer volop in de aandacht. Eerder vandaag werd bekendgemaakt dat ze ieder afzonderlijk van elkaar zouden worden verhoord. Nu weet een Portugese krant te melden dat een politiespeurhond een lijkengeur heeft geroken aan het jurkje van moeder Kate McCann.
Hiermee wordt steeds waarschijnlijker dat het kleine meisje niet meer in leven is. Het Britsje meisje verdween ruim vier maanden geleden uit een vakantieappartement in de Algarve.


Corpse / dead body scent on dress of Mother Maddie.
AMSTERDAM - New facts in the Maddie-affaire: a police dog has found corpse / dead body scent smelled on the dress of the mother of Maddie.          The parents of the 4-years old missing Maddie resist in abundance in the attention.
It was announced earlier today that them everyone would be interrogated separately of each other. Now knows a Portugese newspaper to communicate that a police dog / bloodhound a corpse / dead body scent has smelled on the dress of the mother of Maddie. Becomes always more probable that the small little girl is no longer in life. The Britsh little girl disappeared more than four months suffered from a holiday apartment in the Algarve.

 :shock:

YIKES

i had a gut

THIS IS WHAT WOULD HAVE HAPPENED TO BETH IF SHE HAD BEEN IN ARUBA WHEN NATALEE DISAPPEARED

I don't trust it at ALL. That evidence could very easily have been planted. This is an attempt to blame it on the family circle (Brits) and deflect attention from the true perps. The Portuguese are just doing it a lot more smoothly than the Arubans did.

Breaking News

Kate McCann Quizzed As Witness
Updated: 02:43, Friday September 07, 2007

The mother of missing four-year-old Madeleine McCann has left a police station in Portimao, after 11 hours of questioning.

Kate McCann looked drawn and tired as she emerged from the headquarters of the Policia Judiciaria alongside her lawyer and her sister-in-law Trisha Cameron.

She is still being treated as a witness, according to her lawyer Carlo Pinto de ...

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,91210-1283132,00.html

In Portugal - if you are a witness they can ask you any questions they want, as a suspect you can refuse to talk.  Sound familiar?

I'm glad the McCann's have hired an attorney.  He is probably really expensive though.  I saw that when the McCann's were going to sue a newspaper (I think), the same attorney was working pro bono.  I wonder if the money that has been gathered through the website and other means will now be a defense fund?  I think bringing in an attorney,whether you are guilty or not is a very sound practice in a case like this.  I am trying to imagine what it would be like to be questioned for 11 hours.  Whew.  And the meter for the attorney was running the whole time.  And Mr. McCann goes in for questioning tomorrow... Kate McCann looked just worn to a frazzle.

I agree sb. Just as the Ramsey's were railroaded so are the McCanns IMO. When the PA can't find the guilty party and the pressure is on to solve the crime they seem to make the scenario fit despite the facts. I don't think for a second that the parents are guilty of anything. How could they have disposed of their daughters body and they body is still not found? Wouldn't they have needed a significant window of opportunity that should be easily accounted for? .........and people questioned why the Ramsey's hired lawyers if they were not guilty when their daughter was murdered?

Report: Portugese Police to Name Mom as Suspect in Madeleine McCann Disappearance

Friday , September 07, 2007


The mother of a British girl who disappeared four months ago in southern Portugal is to be named a formal suspect in the case Friday, a family spokesman said, a shocking twist to a case that has gripped much of Europe.

Kate McCann was questioned for almost 11 hours on Thursday, and is due back at a police station in Portimao, a town in Portugal's Algarve region, later Friday morning, family spokesman David Hughes told The Associated Press.

When asked about reports that McCann would be named a suspect in her 4-year-old daughter's disappearance, Hughes said: "They told her last night that it would happen today. That's definite."

Hughes, the family spokesman, said the police have 22 questions that they want to ask Kate McCann, which require her to be made a formal suspect. Under Portuguese law, the legal move grants certain protections to the suspect, but allows police more latitude in questioning.

Kate McCann and her husband, Gerry, have spearheaded an intense media campaign since Madeleine went missing from a holiday apartment in the Algarve region where she was sleeping with her 2-year-old twin siblings.

The parents were having dinner in the hotel's pool-side restaurant with friends and said they checked on their children at regular intervals.

The McCanns toured Europe with photos and stuffed animals of Madeleine, even meeting with Pope Benedict XVI at the Vatican. Celebrities such as J.K. Rowling and David Beckham made public appeals that helped the family raise more than $2 million.

The intense publicity has helped lead to numerous reported sightings of the girl, from as far away as northern Europe and Morocco.

The decision to re-interview the McCanns has disrupted the couple’s plans to return to England with their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, although it was not clear exactly how much longer the family would remain in the Algarve.

The interviews come after Portugal’s Polícia Judiciária received a new batch of results from tests conducted on samples taken from the McCanns’ holiday apartment in Praia da Luz.

Analysis of these samples, which included flecks of blood found on Madeleine’s bedroom wall by British sniffer dogs, has raised the prospect that the investigation is entering a new phase.

Experts at the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham have spent the past month analysing the samples, and have attempted to identify the child’s DNA as well as establish whether anyone else was in the room on the night she went missing.

A police source said that the British laboratory had regularly relayed information to the Portuguese detectives, but speculation is growing that the latest results, which have not been made public, may lead to arrests.

McCann family representative Martin Brunt said tests have also been carried out on a car the McCanns hired five weeks after Madeleine's disappearance.

"They weren't using it at the time she went missing," he told SKY News.

Brunt added that McCann is "horrified to be under suspicion".

"She is shocked and surprised in several ways. First of all that such an accusation could be made against her. And obviously she is concerned that such a line of investigation can become a distraction from further attempts to find Madeleine," said Brunt.

Gerry's brother John McCann said the prospect of Kate becoming a suspect was "unbelievable".

"We just want to see exactly what the Portuguese police are saying," he said.

"We cannot believe the line that they are going down - we just find it unbelievable."

McCann, a 39-year-old GP, was driven to the police station in Portimão by her husband at about 2pm yesterday. Before entering the building, she issued a direct plea to her daughter’s abductors to “do the right thing” and return the child or call police.

“We came to Portugal an ordinary family of five,” she said. “We just want to know what happened on May 3 and want to be able to go home one family, reunited.”

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296018,00.html

Portugese Police Name Kate McCann, the Mother of Missing Madeleine McCann as Suspect in Girl’s Disappearance

http://missingexploited.com/2007/09/07/portugese-police-name-kate-mccann-the-mother-of-missing-madeleine-mccann-as-suspect-in-girls-disappearance/

Let me just add this ... dogs are in no way perfect.

There have been situations where search dogs walked within 20 feet of a dead victim and picked up no scent.

It is really hard to believe that the McCann's would have done off the PR and meetings with dignataries across the world in efforts to find their daughter.

When parents are involved in a crime, they may ask for help, but they usually never try to make themsleves such high profile.

"Madeleine McCann's blood was found in a car her parents rented 25 days after they reported her disappearance, family spokeswoman Justine McGuinness told CNN."

I'm not going to rush on the parents did it bandwagon - at first glance at this, it doesn't look good (if true) - but 25 days???  the child's blood in the car they rented 25 days after her disappearance?  they never had that car prior?  Let's assume she was was dead immediately after disappearance reported, blood after 25 days?  does something not seem right with that?  The Portuguese police seem to have suspected them from early on, and I can't say I didn't feel that they might be a possibility, (more of an accident, perhaps when they were left alone) but I need to see more evidence here.  What got to me early on, was 2 physicians not knowing any better than to leave 3 small children alone in a hotel room, I don't care about where they are from or that they were not far away, or they continually checked on them, these were 2 seemingly intelligent people, anything can happen with small children even while we are in the room, but left alone...in a split second...doctors don't understand that?

I wonder what information we will have today about this?  Wow.

I am so glad you answered this one Red.  I was thinking the exact same thing myself.  I have an older hunting dog.  I know there are times when I throw him some sort of food, and he is all hyped up, he has no clue.  And he is a smart dog.  So YES they do miss things.

I couldn't agree with you more,  It doesn't make much sense.  Just exactly when did these cadaver dogs pick up a dead body scent off of Mrs McCann's dress anyhow?  Months later after it was washed?  Makes no sense at all.

Who rented the car before the McCann's?  How many rental cars are available there? Who in the world would have checked for blood in a rental car rented 25 days after a child disappears? Strange.

Report: Portuguese Police Name Madeleine McCann's Mom a Suspect
Friday, September 07, 2007

VIANA DO CASTELO, Portugal —  The mother of Madeleine McCann, whose disappearance sparked a global search, was formally named as a suspect by Portuguese police Friday, Britain's Press Association news agency reported.

The news agency quoted an unnamed family friend as saying Kate McCann had been declared a suspect under Portuguese law. Earlier, family friend and former spokesman Clarence Mitchell told The Associated Press that police had told Kate McCann and her husband Gerry that they would both be named as suspects ....

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296018,00.html

This is from the same article Tamikosmom just posted:

*snipped*
Hughes, the family spokesman, said the police have 22 questions that they want to ask Kate McCann, which require her to be made a formal suspect. Under Portuguese law, the legal move grants certain protections to the suspect, but allows police more latitude in questioning.

I don't know the laws in Portugal, but this seems pretty  darned signifcant.   I believe I also read this morning elsewhere that if you are named a suspect, then you can refuse to answer questions. 

Okay.  Here is the source of where I read that if you are a suspect you can refuse to talk :2doh: 

*snipped*...Gerry McCann is due to be re-interviewed at 2:00 p.m."
http://madeleinemccann.blogspot.com/

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/09/07/madeleine.mccann/index.html

Portuguese Law
Formal suspect called "arguido" or "arguida" for a woman

An "arguido" has more legal rights than a witness, including right to remain silent and have a lawyer

Some people request to be declared "arguido" to get this protection

Police must declare a witness an "arguido" before asking certain questions or making an arrest

Courts may restrict movements of an "arguido"

An arrest or charge does not always follow someone being named an "arguido"

Thank you for clarifying "aruido".  I have also looked at some time lines concerning this case.  Has anyone reviewed any of these? 

That's "arguido", no aruido...spell check doesn't help with words like this...

"Suspects," said the Mirror headline. The Sun reports that police asked McCann whether she had sedated "Maddie." According to the Sun, the McCanns may have accidentally given Madeleine an overdose of a sedative. The McCanns are both physicians.

Of course, this is coming from British tabloids - but I suppose the implication is that the McCanns (being physicicans) had access to and were somewhat knowledgeable of sedatives and perhaps gave them to Madeleine (and maybe the other children) prior to going out for the evening with Madeleine suffering some sort of complication - purely speculative (on my part regarding what transpired) - not sure what evidence is backing this up, if any...

seems they have waited quite a while to come up with this...but again, IDK, what testing needed to be done or new evidence has appeared...

Kate McCann Named a Suspect
Parents of Missing Madeleine Quizzed by Portugal Police
*snipped*
McCann is the second suspect in the case, along with Robert Murat, 33, a Briton who lives in Portugal. Murat was not charged or arrested.

McCann was released today without charges. The police are now said to be focusing on Gerry McCann.
http://abcnews.go.com/International/Story?id=3571302&page=2

The above article also says Kate McCann was booed when she returned to the police station for questioning.

If there was accidental sedation, why blood?

Which makes me wonder also - how much blood was actually found???

I guess we are all wondering that...
From what I've been able to read and figure, it was said there was small drops or spatter on the wall and curtain and something in the rental car.  I am wondering if through forensics, they can figure out spatter patterns.  I did see in one case where a person was missing and when the LE decided to luminol a bedroom, there were some small spatters found higher up on the wall and a bit on the ceiling, which led them to believe it wouldn't be any kind of accident for that to happen.  I have read too, that sometimes when enough blood is found, the LE can about figure that the person wouldn't survive a loss with that amount. 
I think we are getting bits and pieces, some rumors with some facts, and it's causing a lot of questions to arise, that's for sure.

Portuguese police make mother formal suspect in Madeleine McCann case
09.07.07, 1:53 PM ET

LISBON (Thomson Financial) - Portuguese police on Friday made the mother of British toddler Madeleine McCann a formal suspect in her disappearance and believe that she accidentally killed her daughter, a family spokesman told AFP.

Earlier the police declared a new formal suspect after questioning Kate McCann, but in line with legislation that bans the release of identities, police did not name the new suspect.

'All I can tell you is that there was one suspect in this investigation and now there are two,' police spokesman Olegario Sousa told AFP by telephone from Portimao ...

http://www.forbes.com/afxnewslimited/feeds/afx/2007/09/07/afx4093917.html

Missing Madeleine
The Official Website to find Madeleine McCann
From the website:
Madeleine McCann
Missing for 127 days
Latest Update - Gerry's Blog/Diary

Day 126 - 06/09/2007
*snipped*
Everyone will know that Kate attended for interview as a witness with the Portuguese police today. This is only the second time Kate has been interviewed and although it was a long day, going on past midnight, this was shorter than my second interview which lasted 13 hours! The suggestion that Kate is involved in Madeleines disappearance is ludicrous. Anyone who knows anything about the 3rd May knows that Kate is completely innocent. We will fight this all the way and we will not stop looking for Madeleine.
http://www.findmadeleine.com/

During yesterdays interrogation, Kate McCann was offered a deal to confess. Two years in prison in exchange for an accidental murder.

The police must not have the goods to close this case or why offer a deal?

I'm more skeptical than ever now.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,70131-1283158,00.html

Madeleine: Mum 'Offered Deal To Confess'

Updated: 19:41, Friday September 07, 2007
Kate McCann has been named as a formal suspect in the "death" of her missing four-year-old daughter Madeleine.
A family member has claimed she was offered a deal by police - that she would serve only two years in prison if she admitted accidentally killing her daughter.

Rob - I agree.  I think they were just trying to get her to confess.  I do wonder about the evidence they have back now. 

Hi Klaas, yes it so obvious now. I *suspect* it all started a few weeks ago with the interview of their associate (The Doctor) in Britain. This seems to be the starting point. They interviewed him in England and then the whole thing with the phone taps started.

Now they are following a script. They decided to try and get Kate to confess (she's obviously the target here) yesterday and if that did not work they would then have Gerry all ready to go next. I suspect he is being offered some type of deal.

It was all so obvious when I saw this headline the other day - ARRESTS EXPECTED IN 48 HOURS
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2007/09/06/madeleline-dna-is-found-89520-19741892/

So apparent who the ARRESTEES were going to be!

Get ready because the McCanns (I believe) will be charged.
The police and investigators had better have more than a dog as their main forensic technician.

Klaas just to add. Yesterdays interrogation was to ask 22 questions. How did it deteriorate in to a plea deal?

This thing stinks to high heaven!!!!

Kate McCann 'being framed by Portuguese police'

snipped

Kate McCann is being set up by Portuguese police to take the blame over Madeleine, it was claimed today.

The husband of a woman serving 16 years in another missing child case in the Algarve said: "I am worried Kate will be framed for a crime she did not commit, the way it happened to my wife."

The warning comes as pressure mounted on the McCanns after Portuguese police said Madeleine, who was three when she disappeared, died in her bedroom following the discovery of specks of blood on the wall.

Three years ago Leonor Cipriano was convicted of murdering her nine-year-old daughter Joana although her body has never been found.

The detective leading the hunt for Madeleine has been charged with criminal offences in the Joana case amid claims that a confession was beaten out of Cipriano.

(http://i6.tinypic.com/47xomls.jpg)
Goncalo Amaral was accused of beating Leonor Cipriano

Link (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=473964&in_page_id=1811&ct=5)




Madeleine officer charged over another missing girl
June 11, 2007

snipped

The investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann was in chaos last night after the detective coordinating the hunt for her abductor was charged with criminal offences over another notorious missing child case.

Goncalo Amaral and four other Portuguese police officers were charged over the weekend with offences relating to the inquiry into the disappearance of Joana Cipriano from a village seven miles from where Madeleine was abducted.

The nine-year-old girl has not been seen since her disappearance three years ago but her mother and uncle were convicted of murdering and dismembering Joana because she caught them having an incestuous relationship. Joana’s mother, Leonor, has alleged that she was beaten into a confession during a police interrogation that took place without her lawyer or the knowledge of the public prosecutor.

Portugal’s Ministerio Publico, the district attorney, confirmed last night that it had charged three police officers with torture, a fourth with omission of evidence and a fifth with falsification of documents. It did not reveal who had been charged with which offence.

Despite the charges, Mr Amaral, the co-ordinator of the Policia Judiciaria in Portimao, has not been suspended from working on the Madeleine investigation, which started 39 days ago.

Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, were informed of the charges by a Foreign Office representative yesterday. A spokesman for the family said: “They do not remember meeting Goncalo Amaral face to face but naturally they were concerned to hear of the charges.”

Police sources said that Mr Amaral was “very angry” about the allegations and was considering taking action against the Ministerio Publico. “He is very professional and has had a lot of success in solving cases,” the source said. “He is very upset because reporters never speak of these successes.”

In echoes of the Madeleine case, the investigation into Joana’s disappearance got off to a false start when the Republican National Guard failed to seal off the house where Joana was last seen. Mr and Mrs McCann, from Rothley, Leicestershire, have also expressed frustration at delays in the early stages of the investigation into Madeleine’s disappearance.

Link (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article1913175.ece)

Thank you vms.

The picture just may be getting clearer.

YW, I thought the same... :shock:

vms....my mouth is wide open....I cannot believe this....this woman was badly beaten....I hope the McCanns have very good legal representation.  I would be afraid to spend one night in that jail...!

I know. Now I am really afraid for Madeleine's parents. I have to confess my ignorance, though, about British news organizations. Is either reputable?

I personally believe at this time the McCanns are being framed. There are other children missing in Algarve and the police don't seem to concerned that there could be a serial pedophile on then loose for the last 5+ years.

So far the 'evidence' that I know of does not appear to convict anyone, let alone one or both of the McCanns.

I would like to know more about this 'phantom' syringe the police claim to have found in the apartment.

I would also like to know where the theory of the McCanns drugging their children originated.

For a police force that supposedly 'compiles' with the Portuguese secrecy law they sure seem to get their side of the events out there. And their accomplices in the Portuguese media just gravel at the feet of the PLE like a dog looking at the butchers window, waiting to spread their next unfounded rumor against the McCanns.

CNN is also reporting that Portugese Police are trying to get her (Kate) to confess.  My question is if Maddy is no longer with us, where is the body???  I thought they searched so thoroughly.

Spin the bottle blame.

im sticking with the parents.......are involved in this DEEP

too suspicious that
they went to dinner and she disappeared


just my opinion, im not ready to hang anyone

YET

Rob ... I have my feet firmly planted on both sides of the fence in regards to my speculations on this topic.

On one hand I ask the question:

If the McCann's played a role in the disappearance of their daughter ... why did they not return home to Britain in the past four months?  They had the opportunity to avoid questioning ... arrest ... prosecution.


On the other hand I ask the question:

Where would the "powers that be" in Portugese investigation obtain Madeleine's DNA to plant in the apartment for the British forensic team to discover and ... where would the "powers that be" in the Portugese investigation obtain Madeleine's "dried" DNA to plant in the vehicle rented by her parents for the British forensic team to discover??

This wannabe detective reserves judgement on this one.

Janet

Sleeks, for a moment if you will, only a local could hide a body so well that no one can find it. Tourists do not know where to dispose of a body so well that it will not be found. The PLE seem to believe Maddy is in fact dead. I do not know how they have arrived at that conclusion.

No body no crime?????  ??????   ?????      ?????? This is one case where a lacking body represents that Maddy may in fact be alive.

If you can, go back to the nite in question. On that nite the McCanns are dining with friends and they are not seen to be in a position to have removed Madeleine and secured her permanent disposal. The police were at the flat by 10pm, after a delay they (the police) created themselves and arrived at their leisure. They did not rope off the scene. Robert Murat and others were allowed access to the flat. For whatever reason this was NOT considered a crime scene from the very earliest moments. More bungling -

Richard Edward article of 6.1.2007
15 KEY BLUNDERS

1 Police were at the scene quickly but officers played down suggestions that Madeleine had been abducted and believed she had just wandered off. The crime scene in and around the hotel was not taped off, ruining prospects of obtaining vital forensic evidence.

2 There was a lack of specialist fingertip searching in streets around the hotel meaning more opportunities to find forensic evidence were lost. A former senior British detective working for the media called the scene "the worst preserved" he had witnessed in his career.

3 Officers failed to make early house-to-house inquiries when potential witnesses were still likely to be in the resort. Only on the Saturday, more than 48 hours later, did they start searching some local apartments and a full list of guests was obtained on Sunday. Staff at Mark Warner's complex were only questioned 60 hours after Madeleine disappeared.

4 There are still people in the same apartment block as Mr and Mrs McCann who have never been questioned. Empty properties yards from where the child was taken have never been searched.

5 Police failed to inform Spanish border authorities of Madeleine's disappearance until the morning after she was taken - giving the abductor the chance to flee the country.

6 CCTV on the main road out of Praia da Luz, going towards Spain, was not checked by police.

7 Early witness descriptions created confusion. At one stage there were six different E-fit images being shown to local people.

8 On the morning of May 7, Gerry and Kate McCann issued a televised appeal direct to the abductor. Six hours later, a police chief said at a press conference: "We are not 100 per cent certain she was abducted."

9 Detectives could not issue information on the investigation due to strict Portuguese laws on "judicial secrecy". However the law includes two exceptions, both of which apply in the case of Madeleine.

10 It meant no direct appeal for help was made and police failed to give a clear description of Madeleine. There were no posters put up in the early days. It was left to Madeleine's parents to describe what she as wearing on the night she disappeared.

11 An appeal for a suspect was finally issued 22 days after Madeleine went missing, together with a description. However police made another blunder by issuing two different height descriptions - the result of a mistranslation.

12 On May 9 the search was scaled down \u2026 searches were not very visible, helicopter not used much.

13 There was a delay in calling in specialists. Two British child abduction experts were flown in a week later, mobile phone tracker technicians who helped in the Soham investigation came in last week.

14 Leaks have hampered the inquiry. On May 16, Portuguese newspapers reported that police were "on the trail" of a Russian friend of Robert Murat, the formal suspect in the case. He was only detained for questioning after he had been traced by journalists.

15 Madeleine's favourite toy could have been a crucial key in tracking her down. She took it to bed with her every night including the night she was taken. The abductor could have left some trace of DNA evidence on it, but police did not check and Mrs McCann has had the pink soft toy with her ever since. One specialist said scientists would have needed to examine it for at least several days. He said: "Now it's probably too late. It's an absolute glaring error."

>>me speaking-
after looking at this case over the last 4 months on a daily basis, I believe that an abductor is involved. An unknown to date abductor.

A seasoned pedophile will strike when the opportunity is presented, and after watching the McCanns for several days he / she decided that the time was right and absconded with Madeleine.

The apartment directly over the McCanns was also burglarized. Who did that and where are the police on that one?

If Kate or Gerry did this, I would be totally shocked. Too much points in other directions. And if they are charged and tried, any competent attorney will instantly call in to question the poor investigation techniques preformed by the PLE.

This is a circumstantial case and rises to a level beyond reasonable doubt....imo...

Hi Janet, Always so nice to see you!!!

I am not sure how the PLE has accomplished anything to date. They seem to trip over their own feet. If in fact this is truly Maddy's DNA.. several things could have occurred.

Body was recovered a long time ago and the PLE is unsure who did what and decided to see who implicate them self.

There is no DNA and the PLE is playing one of the patented games and shaking the tree again.

The fact that the British have been involved in the DNA examination allows me to conclude that this is most likely Maddy's DNA.

The remaining fact is - how did DNA from a missing person end up in a rented car 25 days after Maddy went missing and the chance that the McCanns would rent that particular car is now in question. Follow me???

This would be a kin to me buy a used car with the DNA of my future wife in the drivers seat who I have not yet met.

Well now the BIG news is that Gerry is admitting that Kate may have given Madeleine Calpol.  Isn't Calpol nothing more than a cold medicine?  Sure, it could make Madeleine sleepy but I really don't see anything sinister in giving her Calpol.

Janet, the first part of your post I agree with. There is no logical reason for them to have remained in Portugal if either parent had anything to do with the childs death.

The rental car that showed a trace of blood/DNA should mean nothing. If there was a large amount of blood , then maybe I would be suspicious. But I can think of times on vacation when our family has rented car in which one of my kids had thrown up. Another time my daughter cut her foot on a shell on the beach and there was blood in the car, oh yea and then there was the 3 inch splinter from the board walk....a little blood. I guess you all get the point.

Klaas and Janet -  I'll spell it out. The PLE believes that Maddy was accidentally killed, her body hidden and the McCanns then at a later date retrieved the body in that exact car. Her body was either hidden by Gerry, Kate or their Doctor friend that returned to Britian. He told them where to retrieve the body and then they permanently disposed of Maddy.

How this was all accomplished while they were under intense media and police scrutiny is beyond me at this time.

I have no idea at this time how this puzzle is being fitted by the PLE.

Sympathy and suspicion — the case so far

snipped
"Madeleine was reported to have been hugging her Cuddle Cat soft toy when she went to sleep, but it was found on a ledge beyond her reach after she vanished. This was taken to suggest she was abducted alive by an adult.
and:
What has prompted the latest questionings?

At first, it was assumed that results of tests taken on traces of blood, hair and fibres found in the apartment prompted the Portuguese police to reinterview the couple. Experts at the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham have spent a month analysing samples found by British sniffer dogs in Madeleine's bedroom. Some reports now suggest that forensic tests on a car hired by the McCanns 25 days after Madeleine disappeared raise new questions. There are unconfirmed claims that blood stains, possibly linked to Madeleine, were found in the boot and on the key fob. There have been suggestions that a syringe was found in the flat, leading to rumours that the child might have been sedated"

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article2410363.ece

The above post could be all rumors.  I just don't know.  It's very sad no matter what. :sad:

Here is an article I found when searching, using "Calpol overdose":

   

Are we using too much Calpol?
snipped
"I've never seen an overdose of Calpol," says Dr Wayne Lenney, a consultant paediatrician. "The only liquid overdoses in children occur when teenagers drink too much alcohol."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/main.jhtml?xml=/health/2005/02/16/hcal16.xml

I take that to mean that she feels that the investigators are crooked.

I was floored today when I heard the turn of events. As some have previously stated, I also am straddling the fence on this one for now.

I know that some are wondering how blood could be found, if indeed this was an "overdose" of a sedative. I may be able to shed a little light on how it could happen. Just a theory. When Anna Nicole Smith's son Daniel died, some say he vomited blood right before he passed away. His death was from an overdose. I have heard that this can happen. I am not saying that is what happened. Just trying to make sense of it all.

beachedblack ... the vehicle was rented by the McCanns 25 days after Maddie disappeared.

My original questions stand:

Where would the "powers that be" in Portugese investigation obtain Madeleine's DNA to plant in the apartment letted by the McCanns for the British forensic team to discover and ... where would the "powers that be" in the Portugese investigation obtain Madeleine's "dried" DNA to plant in the vehicle rented by her parents for the British forensic team to discover??

Janet

Rob ... maybe after over three weeks the scrutiny was not that intense ... maybe an opportunity presented itself.  Hey ... the "dried" blood in the rented vehicle came from somewhere.

Nevertheless .. the following excerpt from an article in a British publication implies that Dr Russell O’Brien ... the McCann's friend ... had the opportunity to be a participant to some capacity in the events encompassing the disappearance of Maddie.

Janet


Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

<snipped>

Mr Sousa also played down reports that a new suspect was about to be arrested in Britain, dismissing them as old speculation.

It referred to Dr Russell O’Brien, a friend of the McCanns, who has become the latest victim of a smear campaign in a Portuguese newspaper, which claimed he would be arrested yesterday in connection to the disappearance.

He hit back and told friends: “I will robustly defend my reputation. I have not been contacted by the Portuguese police and there has been no mention of any impending arrest or need to return to Portugal. The allegations made in Portuguese press are completely without foundation.

”Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick ….. "

<snipped>

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml
 

 Experts Stymied by Latest McCann Twist

By JOCELYN NOVECK – 1 hour ago

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hMsiOja-9taj6aZI7sfCqVQHf8iw

Yes Janet -  that is the connection and theory.

I'm unable to believe at this time that these three have committed what the police have alleged based on their (PLE) rumors alone. I need hard evidence that this is the correct hypothesis. I realize that the Doctor was interviewed and he and his wife have both proclaimed their innocence.

Janet- the PLE has been back and forth between the McCanns, an unknown abductor, the McCanns friends and Robert Murat and his associates over the last few months. It is all so cyclical. Next week they may be back to Mr. Murat.

Until I see what they have, I am still supporting Kate and Gerry. And even then I may support them as I do not trust the PLE one bit. They have had everyone running in circles for over 4 months... that's no way to run an investigation.

The PLE blew this from day one and are trying to back track their own mistakes at the expense of a grieving family.

This was truly a mickey mouse investigation... why does anyone think it changed all of a sudden? As the British said last night in regards to the DNA - where the PLE goes with it will be up to them.

Klaas ... if Madeleine was administered Calpol ... the McCanns are both physicians ... they should have known better.

Janet

++++++++++++++


NANCY GRACE
August 23, 2005

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/23/ng.01.html

GRACE: The he she is referring to is a 1-year-old baby boy, Dane Heggem.  Now, I know millions of you watching tonight take your kids to daycare.  This little baby boy was taken to Tiny Tots Day Care in Montana. One day, he did not come back alive. Prosecutors now allege the owner of the day care force-fed the children, in day care, cold medicine, for no other reason than to make these infants, these children, shut up and take naps.

<snipped>

GRACE: I want to go to Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, forensic scientist. What is Diphedryl? What is the main ingredient? Is it like Benadryl?

KOBILINSKY: The chemical is called diphenhydramine. And there are a number of companies that manufacture it. And usually, it`s in combination with some other things that relieve symptoms of colds.

It`s obviously used to block the symptoms of allergies. But it`s also used to promote sleeping.

What`s critical here is that there`s really no safe dosage for children under the age of 6. In fact, the poison control centers have done a study that showed that 27 children a year die from overdoses of this medication.  It`s a central nervous system depressant, and it blocks -- it slows down respiration. And in an overdose, it can stop it altogether and result in a cardiac stop -- you can stop the heart from beating, as well.  

Rob I would tend to agree with you. It does appear that the police are trying to make something happen like a bluff. Side so there doctor friend also left a child back in another room? Pretty disturbing.

Where, indeed!  You can have blood smears from a corpse if the skin is broken, say during transportation, or contact with sharp objects or edges that would lacerate the skin.  Since the heart would not be pumping, it would be minimal amounts but certainly there.

I don't know what to think.  Need more information.  Maybe the PLE are just saying all this to try to trick the parents into confessing.  But they would not have blood/DNA samples to plant to be found later.

The only remote possibility I can think of is who had the rental car just before the parents rented it, at the time Madeleine went missing?  Could the person who took her have rented the car just prior and they be responsible for the blood in the car?

Grasping at straws but I do not want to think the parents are guilty of any wrong doing, just too awful to think about.

Just to add ... when the PLE had nothing they got the Dutch and their psychic foundation involved - this filled the vacuum while the PLE was jerkin everyone around.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,294571,00.html

LONDON  —  A firm of private detectives that hired psychics to help the hunt for Madeleine McCann is being investigated by police for allegedly breaking Portuguese laws on criminal cases.

The company, Strongwood, claims that it is being funded by donations from more than 100,000 people to carry out inquiries into the disappearance of Madeleine from her bed in the resort of Praia da Luz 114 days ago.

However, Portuguese detectives have contacted officers in the Netherlands complaining that the company has broken laws that mean that only police can investigate criminal cases.

Strongwood, which is registered with the Dutch Ministry of Justice as a private investigation company, said that it had received donations totalling more than a team of three private detectives, an expert in children with a “special disorders” and a person with “special abilities” to Praia da Luz at end of last month.

A report of its findings concluded that Madeleine could have died before 7p.m. on the night that she went missing. Madeleine’s parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, have insisted that she was alive at 9 p.m. The company also claimed that the child was killed in her apartment before being taken to a beach in a white van where her body was dumped.
<snipped>

me speaking here - I hope this all is not predicated on the words of Dutch psychics. We all know the Dutch track record in these matters.

Tamikosmom wrote;

But I wonder if this is the truth?

Next  we will hear is that PLE has appointed a narcotics cop to take over investigation of the case. :shock:

Hi Kiwi - nice to make your acquaintance. Right, three doctors, three from England's most prestigious schools and not one has the forth-sight to save their reputation, job, and family?

I don't get it. This is a huge gamble on the part of the PLE if they are incorrect. They will never be taken seriously again should this all collapse on them.

They bluffed Kate, the target, and she apparently did not blink. I think after 128 days if someone was guilty they would crack. These are not professional killers and would have told the authorities if indeed they were involved.

Hardcore or innocent -  you decide.

The father of missing British toddler Madeleine McCann has been named a suspect in her disappearance, his Portuguese lawyer says

http://www.cnn.com/

Okay. The Portugese cops think that while undergoing very close scrutiny by the police, friends and the press the parents were lugging a corpse around with them through all those airports and then loaded the corpse into a car 25 days after the killing.

Next theory please?

(http://static.sky.com/images/pictures/1583090.jpg)

Gerry McCann has been declared an arguido, or formal suspect, by police investigating the disappearance of his daughter Madeleine, his lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu has said.

Both the parents of missing Madeleine McCann are now formal suspects in her disappearance.

Full Story

http://news.sky.com/skynews/home

Klaas, I hope I am wrong, but I believe the request for the Doctor to return from Britain is next.

This is prolly already in the works.

Rob - tell me more about this doctor, I haven't followed the case close enough.  Was this someone that was on vacation with their group?

I don't think they did it. But the only way to avoid the above scrutiny would be to move the child the day before, and I don't know who was the last to see her? or when?

Yes he was. As Janet point out, he was with the McCanns and is an close associate. His name is Doctor O'Brien if I am not mistaken. He is the person alleged to have been wiretapped and self implicated. He denies all charges and implications. He insists he is innocent and stayed in Portugal to offer moral support for the McCanns, his good friends. The McCanns appear to be 10 -15 years younger than the Doctor. He seems to be a mentor to Gerry or Kate, not sure which one. All Doctors have mentors.

Greta just said she believes the plea deal is bogus... why offer Kate 2 years if they have the evidence to convict. Greta on BOR.

moved earlier...  :wink:

I just requested Carpe to capture Greta is he is able.

Unfortunately, moving anything earlier seems to help the bad folks.

Posted in the Mirror UK forum:

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=10485

PTLW78

Joined: 08 Sep 2007
Posts: 1

 Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 12:25 am    Post subject: Legal Comments   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
I’m a Portuguese citizen. Incidentally, I am also a lawyer. While trying to remain unbiased, neutral and dispassionate, I thought it could be helpful to throw some light on:

i) the allegation that PJ has offered a deal to Mss. McCann in exchange of a confession; and
ii) the fact that no charges have been brought against Mr. and Mss. McCann

For the sake of objectivity and neutrality, facts are in ALL CAPS, my opinion in normal caps, so that you can distinguish the text of the law from my views on the case.

1 – PJ HAS NOT LEGAL POWERS TO SETTLE OR OFFER DEALS WITH CRIME SUSPECTS. IN FACT, NOR EVEN THE PUBLIC PROSECUTOR HAS SUCH POWERS. ONLY THE MAGISTRATE THAT JUDGES THE CASE IN A COURT OF LAW CAN DETERMINE THE PUNISHMENT /PENALTY APPLICABLE. I UNDERSTAND THIS TO BE QUITE DIFFERENT TO THE COMMON LAW JURISDICTIONS, NAMELY THE UK AND THE US.

This is common knowledge in Portugal. One of the first things taught in law schools is that our criminal system is not like in the (American) movies. The police do not cut deals. Nor the Public Prosecutor has the power to offer deals and settle with suspects. Only the Judge can determine the penalty. It is actually quite common for the judge to deviate from the accusation and proposed penalty presented by the Public Prosecutor (for example, the Public Prosecutor charges someone with murder and asks for a 20 years jail penalty but the Judge, while finding the defendant guilty, condemns him/her to serve only 18 years).

This is such a basic principle that no detective would try to pull this stunt with a lawyer present.

2 – ONLY THE CONFESSION MADE DURING A COURT HEARING IS LEGALLY VALID (SECTION 314 OF THE CODE OF CIVIL PROCEDURE).

It seems unlikely that the PJ would push for a confession that it is not legally valid. Of course that a confession would be a huge breakthrough in the investigations as it would rule out other scenarios and allow the police and the Public Prosecutor to build a case, but if Mss. McCann later (i.e., during the court hearing) denies what she has confessed, the originally confession cannot be considered by the Judge.

On a side note, this is why the questioning at the PJ is not recorded. Contrarily to what a British gentleman was saying this afternoon on SkyNews, the reason for not recording the interview is not archaism or lack of technical means – it is actually to protect the suspect against something he/she may later regret.

3 – PJ DOES NOT HAVE THE POWER TO CHARGE MR. AND MSS. MCCANN. THE PJ ROLE IS TO CONDUCT AN INQUIRY AND PUT TOGETHER THE FACTS. BASED ON THE FACTS GATHERED BY THE PJ, IT IS UP TO THE PUBLIC PROSECUTOR TO CHARGE (OR NOT TO CHARGE) THE SUSPECTS. THE PUBLIC PROSECUTOR HAS BETWEEN 6 AND 12 MONTHS (DEPENDING ON THE SPECIFIC CIRCUMSTANCES OF THE ALLEGED CRIME) FROM THE MOMENT ON WHICH THE SUSPECT IS NAMED “ARGUIDO” TO DECIDE IF IT PRESENTS OR DISMISS CHARGES – SECTION 276 OF THE CODE OF CIVIL PROCEDURE.

It seems that the focuses being placed on the fact that no charges have been brought against Mr. and Mss. McCann is deliberately trying to pass the message that the evidence is weak. Well, I don’t know if the evidence is weak or strong. What I do know is that from a procedural point of view there could never be charges at this stage of the process.

*

Personal feelings now. I am trained to and effectively believe that anyone is innocent until proven guilty and I am therefore applying this principle to my personal assessment of this case. I also have no problems admitting ,not I feel ashamed or inferior to acknowledge, that the British police is technologically more advance that the Portuguese and probably more experienced – it is a matter of scale. What I would expect from a serious corporation such as SkyNews – on which I have relied on many different occasions for information – is neutral coverage of the story. I would expect SkyNews to investigate Portuguese law before giving any credibility to the hysteric reaction and false accusations made by the members of Mr. and Mss. McCann family. They went to the point of cutting the Portuguese lawyer out the air.

The sister of Mr. McCann is lying. Such lye seems to be an attempt to make the PJ look desperate. Having been on the other side of PJ interviews many times before, I can assure that they never get desperate.

As a lawyer, I found the gentlemen that commented on this case for SkyNews during the afternoon unprofessional and incompetent. As a man, I think they are plain i*****.

I am not an English native speaker and I apologize for the grammatical and language errors, but I hope this helps clarifying the legal implications of what happened today.
 

But it is a British team with a British Spaniel Cadaver Dog collecting the evidence where it was examined in a British lab. 

How did the Portuguese Police get these British technicians to do these things?

I am going to hold my nose and watch Greta for the first time in ages to get more information.

Must have more information before any conclusions can be drawn.

.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=TYAWILQEBSASFQFIQMFSFFOAVCBQ0IV0?xml=/news/2007/09/07/nmaddy1007.xml

Kate and Gerry McCann named as suspects

By Caroline Gammell in Portimao and Gordon Rayner
Last Updated: 1:27am BST 08/09/2007

Kate and Gerry McCann could be charged with the "accidental" killing of their daughter Madeleine after Portuguese police challenged them directly whether they were behind the toddler's disappearance.
# The claims and the case for the defence
# Shocked response from friends and family
# Full coverage: The search for Madeleine McCann

In an extraordinary twist, Mrs McCann's family said detectives now believed she caused the four-year-old's death in their holiday apartment, then hid the body before returning a month later to dispose of it.
    
Shortly after midnight, Mr McCann emerged from the police station with his lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu who read out a short statement.

He said: "Kate and Gerry McCann have today both been declared arguidos with no bail conditions and no charges have been brought against them. The investigation continues."

Mr McCann stared straight ahead as his suspect status was announced and refused to answer questions from awaiting journalists. A crowd which had been attending a concert in the town square earlier listened to the announcement and several people gasped audibly.

A family spokesman David Hughes said Mr McCann had been asked the same questions as his wife but he refused to comment on when the couple would return to Britain. Mr McCann was driven away in a silver Audi to return to his wife.

It was claimed that police had offered Mrs McCann a "deal" of a two-year jail sentence if she confessed and told them where the body was.

The astonishing developments followed the discovery of blood in a car the McCanns hired four weeks after Madeleine's disappearance 128 days ago, which police believe proves Mrs McCann killed Madeleine.

The allegation was dismissed as "ludicrous" by Mrs McCann's husband Gerry, while her parents said the police investigation had become "a joke".

Mrs McCann was declared a formal suspect, or "arguida" by police, who spent a second day questioning her in the Algarve town of Portimao before releasing her without charge five hours later.

Mrs McCann has been warned by her lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu to be prepared for the fact she might now be arrested and charged.

A family spokeswoman, Justine McGuinness, revealed that Mrs McCann had been asked outright if she had killed her daughter, and was "shocked and angry" at the allegation, which she emphatically denied.

Miss McGuinness said: "They believe they have evidence to show that in some way she's involved in the death of her daughter, which of course is completely ludicrous.

"They have suggested that blood has been found in a hire car that they hired 25 days after Madeleine was taken. How on earth could you hide a body for that long? We are in a hot climate.

"When this was put to Kate she was very taken aback. It was the first time she had heard the allegation and she actually swore at police."

Mr McCann's sister, Philomena, later revealed the plea bargain offered by detectives.
    
She said: "They tried to get Kate to confess to having accidentally killed Madeleine by offering her a deal through her lawyer, which was 'if you say you killed Madeleine by accident and then hid her and then disposed of the body, then we can grant you a two-year jail sentence or even less. You may get off because people feel sorry for you'."

According to one report, the police asked Mrs McCann, a doctor, whether she had sedated her daughter, leading to speculation that detectives think she may have accidentally given Madeleine an overdose.

Mr McCann, 39, expressed his own frustration in his blog on the Madeleine campaign website, saying: "We will fight this all the way."

Police had told Mrs McCann before she went for questioning that they had 22 "difficult" questions to put to her further to the information she had given them during 11 hours of questioning on Thursday.

Whistles and jeers mingled with shouts of support as she arrived at the police station today carrying Madeleine's favourite toy, cuddle cat.

Rob ... this article from a British publication implies that as of August 24, 2007 ... Dr Russell O’Brien had left Portugal and ... returned to Britain.

Also ... the close relationship that this man has with the McCanns could possibly explain a possible connection ... a possible connection after the fact.  The opportunity did present itself when Dr. O'Brien left the tappa bar for "part of the evening" and ... then there are the alleged wiretaps.

Hey ... I do not know if the the McCanns are involved in the the disappearance of their daughter but ... the McCanns were the last known persons with Maddie which implies that ... in the process of elimination ... they should not be above suspicion ... they must be investigated.

Is this not the reason that the majority on this forum becomes enraged when the ALE attempts to distance Joran van der Sloot from implication in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and ... focus suspicion on Beth ... Jug ... MB Students ... security guards?  None of these persons were the last persons observed leaving Carlos' and Charlies' with the 18 year old American citizen ... the 18 year old American citizen who was never seen again.

Janet


Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007  

<snipped>

Mr Sousa also played down reports that a new suspect was about to be arrested in Britain, dismissing them as old speculation.

It referred to Dr Russell O’Brien, a friend of the McCanns, who has become the latest victim of a smear campaign in a Portuguese newspaper, which claimed he would be arrested yesterday in connection to the disappearance.

He hit back and told friends: “I will robustly defend my reputation. I have not been contacted by the Portuguese police and there has been no mention of any impending arrest or need to return to Portugal. The allegations made in Portuguese press are completely without foundation.

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick …..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick …..




hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.............. part of the evening AWAY

UH OH

In this country, it is the prosecutor who would offer a "deal" but it has to be approved by a judge FIRST in order to plea bargain.  This seems to be poorly understood by foreign understanding of our legal system.  Not that different from theirs.

Maybe TV programs fail to give clarity to this aspect of the judge approving any plea bargaining that goes on.  No DA is going to offer a deal he can't get past a judge.

Same for prosecutor is the one to bring charges, not law enforcement.  But they usually work so seamlessly as it may appear one unit when in fact there are two.

Obviously PTLW78 is an exceptionally educated man. However, I must disagree. I have been watching this closely, and staying awake too late and getting up way too early to get all the details.

I believe a deal was offered. It may not have been a legitimate deal, but none the less one was offered. Most likely to see what shakes out as the PLE is stumped as has been for over four months.

I would not make that claim unless I sincerely believe it. I have been watching the PLE bumble around this entire time. I certainly wish they had not been bumblin' around, but they certainly were.

Each and every day there was a new allegation against someone. A new revelation and arrests were around the corner. I was getting dizzy trying to follow who was a potential arguido and who was not. It was an everyday affair.

We have heard it all before.

I have written extensively on my blog about this inept investigation and the corruption that seems so apparent to me personally.

I have no axe to grind with Praia Da Luz, I simply want the truth. I have seen nothing in the last 4 months that is back up by any evidence at all.

Show me the evidence and I'll become a believer. Until then, I'm on Gerry and Kate side... and most of all Madeleine's side.

My theory remains the same - pedophile. Right after Maddy was abducted the entire continent was shaken loose to see what turns up... all the usual pedophiles were rounded up...look back and see for yourselves all the pedo rings that were busted. (which leads me to this, why does some one have to be missing to bust these rings up?)

I believe this is an international pedophile ring and until someone can show me otherwise, I'm sticking to my theory.

Too many bogus sightings were called in, and they were most likely part of the same ring. These people (ahh I mean animals) are quite sophisticated. They use the net like only you wish you could. Their skills are mucho grande. They hide, and are not easily found.

Been reading this thread... along with Robs blog and the Mirror site..
 Its all so confusing...

One question I have.. if they are naming Kate and Gerry as suspects, will they show the supposed evidence they have gathered? May sound like a dumb question.. Sorry.   
 

 :wink: :cool:

Klaas ... I apologize.  In a previous post ... I was grouping Calpol in the same category as cold medications which are meant for adults.  Calpol is a cold medication recommended to children.

Janet

Children and paracetamol

The dose for a child depends on their age and weight and is clearly given on the medicine's container. On a doctor or nurse's advice, you can give paracetamol to young babies after they have had vaccinations, but otherwise it's not recommended for babies under three months old. Syrups containing paracetamol (eg Calpol) can be easier for younger children to take. The children's version of paracetamol syrup contains 120mg of paracetamol per 5ml (teaspoon). Sugar-free versions are available.

Janet- I have seen all the same info... I just do not believe that Dr. O'Brien is involved. I believe at this time that the PLE is looking at the wrong area. If they have the evidence... show it. There is worldwide speculation and it needs to stop one way or the other. again - just my opinion...

Maybe I'm wrong... I'll be the first to admit I was WRONG!!!  Right now, I believe from what I have read, seen and witnessed, the PLE is off track..

Convenience does not prove motive nor allegiance.

The way the PLE is conducting the investigation leaves a lot to be desired by even citizens of Portugal.

 Hi Yah Robots..   :cool:   I guess I am reserving judgement here about the parents. I would hate for them to have been involved .  :(   
  I guess I am like Janet.. riding the fence so to speak.  I dont get DNA evidence in a rentged car 25 days later.. or whatever it was.. Corpse smell on Jates clothing..  or is the PLE FOS?   :2doh:

well, i have not been following the case as long as people like Rob and others...
who obviously know a lot about the case.

but, was there a break-in at the place they were staying ????


was it a hotel ??

did anyone see anyone strange there ???

something aint right here........i say the parents are involved BUT im not ready to HANG anyone yet

YET  :cool:

 Robots. I have been reading for awhile.. other sites plus here at SM.   Something isnt right at all.. I agree..
 I recall reading about Gerry and a suitcase and a shovel??   I dunno if thats true?  ROB????  Is it BS??

Carpe will be capturing Greta.. I'm sure he'll post it in this thread somewhere. :D

Hi Angie

I do not know the answer to your question and ... it is not a dumb question but ...

"Hi Angie ... I hope you are having a good day".

 :smt052

Janet

here is the question a ROBOTS would ask

if there were KIDNAPPERS and PEDOPHILES
why did they jsut take the one girl ?????????

HUH ?????????????????????????????????????????????

WHY, just the one ???????????????????????????

always a ROBOTS around when you need one  :smt033 :smt033 :smt033

it might JUST be the MOST IMPORTANT question

Robots, yes there was a break in at the apartment above theirs the same night.

I do not believe the parents are involved.  They tried desperately to have children, and all of the children were conceived by Invitro, or that is my understanding.   I think the below quote speaks volumes to the situation.

In the McCann case, the family says police told Kate McCann they'd found blood traces in the couple's car — rented 25 days after Madeleine disappeared. They also suggested Madeleine may have been killed accidentally, and offered McCann a plea deal, the family said.

That sounds odd to Lita Linzer Schwartz, a professor emeritus of psychology and women's studies at Penn State, and co-author of "Endangered Children."

"After 25 days the child would have been spilling blood?" she asked. "It seems rather strange."
"From what I have seen and heard in the news, this doesn't follow the typical kinds of patterns one sees" in cases where parents are guilty, she says.

"The truth of the matter is that we simply don't have enough information to be able to come up with a theory," Schwartz says. "Was there something going on we don't know about? Are police sitting on information?"

"It does seem more likely that a third party came in," she says. "But, anything's possible

Robots, there was a break-in directly above the McCanns apartment before the arrived. I do not recall what what was stolen or who was involved. I know there was a police report was filed. It's on record.

 Hello Janet.. Ty and not good days lately.. But IMO I would imagine IF they were being named as suspects.. evidence of that would have to be produced? Maybe I am wrong..

mmmmmmmmmmmm.....

good question ROBOTS

why not get kidnap em all

UH OH.... robots the CAN OF WORMS opener  :cool:

thank you, i knew someone would know

maybe the break in was a set up............. :cool:

I can't see, I'm gonna turn on the outside light....me blind!!! :D

I have several ideas why -
1 too many kids to carry
2 too many kids to feed
3 car not big enough
4 came on motorcycle and had Maddy on his back, like luggage
5 targeted Maddy specifically

Two things from Jack B:  One: Look into the child's eyes.  I do not see happiness.

No. Two:  Would you leave a 100 carat diamond exposed alone in a room on a bed?  I would not.   The child is more valuable.  I cannot get past the parents.  Never could.  Jack b.       

 ROB  do you think she is STILL alive then?

possible, YES - certainly

but if a pedophile
 seems like the more they can get the better

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/06/15/wmaddy215.xml

check that -  they seem to be talking about this on the UK sites right now... I had this on my site and that is where they are getting it..it's about the blanket that was found and the Dutch Newspaper site.

http://forums.mirror.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=10358&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=105

i would like to know what the waiter or waitress had to say about how they were acting as they ate their meal  :cool:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=480660&in_page_id=1770&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=picbox&ct=5

The 17 key questions detectives may have asked Madeleine's mother
By SAM GREENHILL - More by this author »
 
Last updated at 01:43am on 8th September 2007
 
During 15 hours of questions, police put a series of key points to Kate McCann in their attempt to solve the Madeleine mystery. Sam Greenhill examines some of the likely demands detectives would have made of the 39-year-old GP in the interview room.


Did you kill your daughter?
Mr and Mrs McCann have long been aware that they were the subject of rumour and suspicion but this is the first time the police have put it to them. Her friends and family cannot believe that the "imbecile" police have the nerve even to ask it.


Did you sedate Madeleine?
The couple have repeatedly denied using sedatives on their children to help them sleep at night while they went out. They have strongly rebutted accusations they accidentally gave her an overdose. There has been persistent speculation over why the couple's twin son and daughter slept soundly throughout the abduction and subsequent commotion once Madeleine was discovered missing. The McCanns say they have never used any kind of sedative on their children and never would.



Did you have any syringes in the apartment?
An astonishing claim in a Portuguese newspaper alleged that police think there could have been a tranquilliser kit used on Madeleine. Mrs McCann is believed to have fiercely rejected this, and the couple have stated there was no syringe in the apartment.



How much did you drink on the night?
Some reports have suggested the McCanns and their friends sank 14 bottles of wine at dinner that night, but they insist they got through no more than three bottles between nine adults.



Did you ever leave Madeleine all evening to go into town?
It was reported that a barman claimed he had seen the McCanns one evening in the town of Lagos, five miles away, although they insist they ate every night at the Ocean Club restaurant in Praia da Luz, and none of their friends has disputed this.


Who checked on the children and at what times, exactly?
Confusion has always surrounded the exact timings because no one was supposed to discuss the case or give a timeline in detail. From clues and comments pieced together over the past months, it appears the McCanns and their friends agree that Gerry checked at 9.05pm, friend Matthew Oldfield at 9.30pm (but he did not actually go into Madeleine's bedroom) and then Kate at 10pm. But detectives are interested in the period from 8pm when it is understood that no one apart from the McCanns saw Madeleine.



Did you ever leave her unattended for much longer than you claim?
Statements from witnesses near the apartment allegedly claim that in the evenings before her disappearance, Madeleine was heard crying for her parents for long periods. The McCanns deny this, saying they checked on their children regularly and are responsible parents.



Does your husband know about it?
Mrs McCann is likely to be invited to implicate her husband. The McCanns have always stood strong together and say the crisis has strengthened the bond between them, although Gerry did storm out of a TV interview recently leaving his wife behind when he was asked about the investigation.


Does anyone else know? Do your friends know?
The idea that any of the McCanns' seven companions, some of them doctors, could have been involved in such a huge conspiracy and then convincingly maintained the secret is one of the most puzzling aspects of what appears to be the police's theory. Yet officers are focusing on alleged discrepancies in their statements.



Why did you shout: 'They've taken her, they've taken her!' after returning from Madeleine's room on the night of her disappearance?
These were the words Mrs McCann was reported to have screamed as she ran back to the restaurant table in a panic. The police were intrigued by her use of the word "they".



Why did a dog detect the smell of a corpse on your clothes?
A British dog trained to find dead bodies is alleged to have smelled something on Mrs McCann's jeans and T- shirt, and also on Madeleine's toy Cuddle Cat. Mrs McCann is believed to have replied that she came into contact with at least six dead people in her work as a GP in the period leading up to the holiday. Could Cuddle Cat, which she always holds close to her, have been contaminated from her clothes?


Why did you hire a car?
The McCanns did not hire a car until 25 days after Madeleine went missing. Until then, they did without one, apparently remaining in Praia da Luz or being driven around by police, embassy staff or friends. But in recent weeks, Mr McCann has regularly talked about using the hired silver Renault Scenic to ferry visiting friends and relatives to and from the airport in Faro.



Why did you hire it the day before going to see the Pope?
Detectives are puzzled why the McCanns needed to hire a car the day before they knew they would be leaving Portugal to fly to Rome. They did not need it to reach the airport as they were driven there by an aide. Yesterday the McCanns' spokesman said there was no significance in the date. The couple had arranged to hire a car and that was the day it had come through.



Did the hire car contain any of Madeleine's belongings?
If forensic evidence of Madeleine was found in the car, such as a hair, is there a legitimate explanation? Perhaps something belonging to her was later put in the car, for example when the McCanns moved to their new villa.



Could Madeleine have bled on something which was later put in the hire car?
Madeleine did slip and bang her leg, filmed on a family mobile phone video, as she boarded the holiday aircraft. Could she have shed blood on to some clothing which the McCanns later moved in the hire car?



Did you move Madeleine's body in your hire car?
Forensic evidence apparently points to Madeleine in the car. Mrs McCann strenuously denies any suggestion she moved any body.



Tell us what you did with her...
Mrs McCann was asked this directly, according to her husband's sister Philomena. Her reply was said to be: "You must be insane to think we'd put ourselves through this."

(http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/04_03/2MadelineMcCannPA_468x546.jpg)

I do not know you. I will say this... people who go on vacations seem to think that nothing bad will happen to them and they do all kinds of stupid stuff. For some reason they are lulled into a false sense of security.

We have seen reports of all of the stupid things that you can mention in a lifetime posted here on SM. If your goal is to bring up the McCann's neglect you made your point...

next item please!

thank you Angel of the Net, but why hold back the other b5... what is sooooooo damming about those questions asked by the vaunted PLE?????

Rob - not sure what you mean?  I'm only posting articles I've found.  You act as though I'm asking those questions of the McCann's and I'm not.

Prayers For Maddy..

I'll come back another time when perhaps I wont be ignored.  TY Robots for at least answering me.   :smt052
Again I hope Kate and Gerry had nothing to do with this all.. but.. it don't look good for them :(.
 Guess its another wait and see WTH happens next.    :(

Jack, I see nothing but happiness and glee in this child.  She is very expressive and open.  Look at the playground pictures for instance.   

I would never have left my children alone for 10 minutes, let alone to have dinner, but this is not an abused child. 

Sunny ... Rob can correct me if I am wrong but ... I believe the theory/speculation is that the body of Madeleine McCann was hidden for over three week and ... then was moved in a vehicle rented by her parents.  The authorties ... at some point in time ... were tipped off ... possibly wiretaps and ... British forensic experts were requested to conduct a forensic check of the rental vehicle as well as the apartment from which Maddie went missing.

Don't bite me ... I am only the messenger.   :)

Janet

Kate McCann: The claims and case for defence
By Gordon Rayner, Chief Reporter
Last Updated: 7:40pm BST 07/09/2007

Until today, salacious reports of blood spots, intercepted phone calls and child sedation were dismissed as nothing more than libellous slurs by the McCann family.

<snipped>

Traces of dried blood, said to be Madeleine's, have allegedly been found in a car hired by the McCanns 25 days after Madeleine's disappearance.

The blood is said to have been found in the boot of the Renault Scenic hire car after sniffer dogs were brought in by British police as part of a review of the investigation ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/09/07/nmaddy807.xml

Who are you to critique my work?   Who are you to say to anyone:  Next point to anyone.  I made a point for whatever reason I made it and my point was not to be put down by you.          jackb

 Klass.. I know what you mean ..I  gotta sign off here. I followed this case.. read all that I could.. I guess some of us are not in the KNOW as others are. 

Again prayers sent out to the poor kid..


 Rob,.. why get mad at anothers  post?  others have opinions too..  :( 

  Unless you have a secret source ???

Later..

That's to logical.......we get to hear  supposition and innuendo.

stick around Bunny baby  :cool:
lets do some de-bunking

Yes, I know!!!... I am remarking to - why are they holding back the other 5 questions... take no offense please!!! not your fault they didn't release the last 5 question...

<<<<---- never shoots the messenger.... unless the messenger is from bondia!

 I agree with you Jack.. you have every right to post your thoughts..   This thread shouldnt turn out to be an argument thread IMO.. seems its heading that driection.. and I want no parts of it.   going now for sure.. 

Sorry Janet, I simply do not believe it.  I guess I need to wait to be shown the evidence.  With all of the scrutiny, I do not think something like that is possible.  There has been no release of the findings,an I believe this is all put forward by the Portugal police to cover their poor investigation.  I don't belive the British police have released their findings either.  jMO

 :wink:

I just thought it was interresting, if true, to see the questions the McCann's were being asked.

I don't know what happened to Madeleine.  I have to say I will be shocked if it turns out the McCann's are involved in any way.  Having said that, I've been shocked many times in my life.

Janet said
Sunny ... Rob can correct me if I am wrong but ... I believe the theory/speculation is that the body of Madeleine McCann was hidden for over three week and ... then was moved in a vehicle rented by her parents.  The authorties ... at some point in time ... were tipped off ... possibly wiretaps and ... British forensic experts were requested to conduct a forensic check of the rental vehicle as well as the apartment from which Maddie went missing.

this seems pretty accurate to moi!

how they decided to find a vehicle 25 days later that had the scent of a corpse in it and that corpse being Madeleine, is beyond me. 25 day later????

WE were all over them... no way!!!

I stopped doing updates at number 36... and still did a few here and there... I just don't believe this and they have a faulty dog.

We had a very faulty dog here.... and there were 25 convictions over turned on drugs because of this.

i hate to even try to put myself in a position to think like a pedophile

but............if there was a chance to GRAB 3 kids instead of just 1


i think pedophiles would RISK it..



 :-x :-x :-x

I don't think they did it... I agree with Kimbery G... Natalee part 2...

this case makes me think of a combined two movies, flight plan and man on fire...

it's like a kidnapper watched both and decided to combine and take her...

I also think if the parents did this eventually one of the other kids would have said something??

I didn't know you were known for your work... where might I read it when I have time ????

speaking of Shocks....

i got tazered the other day

on purpose..........


NEVER AGAIN  :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

skerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry

i think the other kids are smaller ???

yes ??

Your ribs must be healed....you have moved on I see?  :lol:

Robots - I believe the twins are 2yrs old

my friend is a cop  :lol:

he encouraged me :lol:

he had to have it done to him
ribs are still a problem..but feeling better  :cool:

O/T FYI - interresting post regarding computer time on the VDS computer posted by FierlJepper at Scrux:


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2103.msg277196#msg277196

thats what i thought....they could have been sleeping

thank you klass

This is a quote but I am not sure it makes sense?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=480632&in_page_id=1770
They did not use a listening device to monitor their twins Sean and Amelie, two, and Madeleine, three.

I think the other kids were 2--kind of small to remember details.

I've been lurking on here for awhile--it's getting heated tonight. My take is the McCanns are so likeable and I want to believe them, but I think it's strange that they left their children in the first place, and there are certain details I'm just not sure about.

I've always wondered why the other two children were left, too.

yep,
it has been haunting me

WHY WHY WHY just the one kid

burglars that break in to stores...dont take one necklace or one diamond ring
or just 1  $100.00 bill

they take all they can


naw..................it stinks to me

let's all hope that a real investigation yields real results and this is not a witch hunt.

I do hope that--the last thing anyone wants is for people who seem as nice as the McCanns to be falsely accused.

But, to me, some of it just doesn't add up.

Realistically, it is not as though the McCanns had dinner, went home and then didn't report their daughter missing until the next morning. I just don't think it likely they hid her
body and yet still called the police right away. I think if this had been the case, PLE would have focused on the parents from the start. JMO

the child may have been taken by the parents BEFORE they went to dinner

perhaps  :wink:

Missing Girl's Parents Named Suspects
snipped
Under Portuguese law, formal suspects gain certain legal protections, but police also have more latitude to question them. Police also have to show suspects any evidence against them.

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/09/07/ap4095407.html

I think this is interesting.

That's true, but what if everything happened before dinner? And then there's the matter of the friend who left for a period of time during dinner to check on his sick daughter.

I don't want it to be true; I'm just saying there are reasons to be suspicious.

Jack ... I am not qualified to comment on #1 but ... I do not perceived from photos that Maddie was abused.

However ... I agree with you on #2.

My daughter has four children between the ages of 4 and 9 and ... as overwhelmed as she becomes sometimes ... each one of those kids are never beyond earshot of Mom, Dad or a responsible adult.

The McCann's precious children were 100 yards away from their parents.  Tonight Nancy Grace defined that distance as the size of one large football field.  I find this so difficult to comprehend ... those precious little babes were left unprotected ... were left defenseless in the face of unforeseen dangers.

In Canada ... it is illegal to leave a child in a vehicle for any length of time ... even to run in and out of a store.

This action was planned by the McCanns on the night Maddie disappearance and ... they admitted they had done the same thing on previous evenings at the resort.  In other words ... it was not a spur of the moment indiscretion.

Enough said.

Janet

Then, I guess you was not invited.        jack b

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

right... but anything is possible...

a bunch of priests, if they had the chance probably would have lied their TAILS off
to the Pope

if you know what i mean

  Oh,, I know what you mean.. SAD to say...   :-x :-x

 Rob,, TY for being so ON TOP of this case too.. What would we all do without you?   :cool:

 :wink:

I just got home a bit ago and was hoping someone had an update.  Was this story covered on Greta tonight and if so does anybody know what was said?

Several links from this article:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20070907/McCann_mother_070907/20070907?hub=CTVNewsAt11

Nothing much new, however, that I see.  So is it not illegal to leave children under the age of 12 unattended?  Here that might well result in the younger children being removed from the home.

I do not know what the polis in Spain have on the parents, if anything.
I feel a child predator would take only one child. Lots easier to get away with one versus 3 or 4.
In Europe, people leave their babies in a carriage on the sidewalk while they dine or have a drink. I don't think we can judge the parents for the lifestyle they have always known.
I agree the parents need to be questioned. BUT To me this reeks of Aruba. If Beth or Dave had been in Aruba when Natalee went missing they would be in the same boat. We have seen where they tried to blame the Mountainbrook students for Natalee's disappearance/demise.
IMO these parents are being railroaded due to the negligence of the Spain ALE. I will maintain this opinion until I see further proof the Spain ALE are not on a fishing expedition.

Greta was a re-run?  The nerve of that woman when there is news, she does a re-run?

The three crucial hours before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing
By NEIL SEARS

The three hours before Madeleine was reported missing at 10pm
on May 3 are now at the heart of the police inquiry.


Kate and Gerry McCann have never publicly revealed their exact
movements over that evening, saying this is barred by Portugal's
strict laws of judicial secrecy.


For the same reason, the Portuguese police have disclosed virtually
nothing about their understanding of what happened - whereas British
detectives would probably have publicised any details likely to encourage
witnesses to come forward.


But based on reports and statements from other parties, it is possible to say
with some accuracy what seems to have happened in those fateful hours before
Madeleine went missing.

Doctors Gerry and Kate McCann were nearing the end of their Mark Warner holiday
in Praia da Luz.


As had become their custom, they had put their three children to bed in their flat at
7pm before going to a nearby tapas bar half an hour later.

They did not use a listening device to monitor their twins Sean and Amelie, two, and
Madeleine, three.


But as they were sitting no more than 70 yards from the rear door of their ground-floor
flat, they felt confident that their established childcare arrangements were sufficient.


With them at dinner were the seven friends from England who had gone on holiday with
them. Three of them are also doctors and one is a top medical research fellow.


Each couple were responsible for checking their own children, but other members of the
group occasionally took turns to check all the children were sleeping soundly.


It is unclear what happened between 7.30pm and and 9pm, but Mr McCann has said
that he went on a checking trip at 9.05pm - and noticed a door which he thought had
been left shut in the flat was ajar.


He thought nothing of it, however, as his children were fast asleep.


Another member of the group, Jane Tanner, took a turn around ten minutes later.
She has told police that as she returned to the bar she saw a dark-haired man aged
around 35 carrying a child. Again, she thought nothing of it.


Then, at 9.45pm, Dr Matthew Oldfield went on a checking trip.


It has been speculated some of the checks did not involve the group actually
seeing the sleeping children, but that they simply listened from outside.


There have been claims that Dr Oldfield either simply listened at the McCann
children's bedroom door or that he looked into the room and believed he saw
Madeleine there.

According to the latter claim, he is also said to have reported that light was coming
in as if the shutters had been opened.


Finally, at 10pm Mrs McCann went to check - and within seconds had emerged
screaming that her daughter had gone.


She is understood to have been certain that Madeleine had been taken, rather than
that she had wandered off, or hidden, because her favourite soft toy, Cuddle Cat,
which had been with her in bed, had been placed on a high ledge.


That is as close to the McCann group's statements to the police as it is possible to get.


And it is clear that by this account there are a number of windows of opportunity in
which Madeleine could have been whisked away - either by an abductor, or, according
to the theory Portuguese police are seemingly exploring, by her own family after a
terrible accident.


It has already been suggested that other statements have clashed with the accounts
of the McCanns and their friends.


One tapas bar worker suggested that only one man in the group left their table all evening.
And a teacher who went to chat with the McCanns that night claimed that no one left the
table between 9.30 and 10pm.


A further detail from the evening is that the McCanns' friend Dr Russell O'Brien, 36, is
understood to have left the table at some time after 9pm, to attend to his own ill daughter.


It has been widely assumed the McCanns had either been stalked by a kidnapper who observed
their behaviour and knew when to strike, or that a chance attacker saw an opportunity and seized it.


But the Portuguese police now evidently believe that clarifying exactly what happened in the
hours before Madeleine disappeared could offer a startlingly different solution.

Link (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=480632&in_page_id=1770&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=picbox&ct=5)

vms, excellent article - a lot of info I was not aware of - after reading this, here are the thoughts I come away with, Initially I questioned the McCanns' judgement in leaving Madeleine and the twins alone no matter how far they were and how often they checked, especially given they are both physicians, NOW to learn that many people they were dining with were physicians ALSO leaving their children alone is even more disturbing, AND that one's child was also ill that evening, HUH? IDK, what they were thinking, but regardless - I have a hard time believing they harmed, before the thought that perhaps it was an accident was possible, but now - now it seems you have to involve all these people in a conspiracy to cover up - I just don't see at this time, with this info, how they could have taken Maddie and disposed of her body and went back to dinner - does not make sense, they were not alone - and there is no reason for these people to lie and jeopardize their careers and lives - IF there were an accident, someone in that group must have wanted to do the right thing and notify the police - not create a huge conspiracy amongst all of them - AND the accidental overdose with splatters of blood does not make sense - neither does finding blood in a car they rented 25 days after the disappearance - The fact that they went after the mother first suggests (to me at least) that they were hoping to break her, perhaps they felt the female would give into extreme questioning and confess (even if she was not guilty) and they could close this case and have the world stop breathing down their backs...

Yap I agree with everything you said.  I too will wait and see what happens.  I will not pass judgement on these parents.

The Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien connection is very interesting ...

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++

Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

<snipped>

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick. It is understood he shared duties with his partner Jane Tanner ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

it seems like that LAST time anyone saw the girl was at 2 30 in the afternoon


at least that is what i read somewhere.... there is a picture of her by the pool

but even that is in doubt

hmmmmmmmm.....  something aint right

Yapper

I am reposting a previous post that I submitted to this thread just in case you missed it.  The words express my position regarding why the discovery by the British forensic team of Maddie's DNA (blood) in the apartment and vehicle which were both letted by the McCanns.  I cannot comprehend how this DNA (blood) could have been planted.  Where would the "powers that be" in the Portugese investigation obtain this forensic evidence.

Janet


I do not know if the the McCanns are involved in the the disappearance of their daughter but ... the McCanns were the last known persons with Maddie which implies that ... in the process of elimination ... in the pursuant of justice for Maddie ... they should not be above suspicion ... they must be fully investigated.

Is this not the reason that the majority on this forum becomes enraged when the ALE and posters with an obvious Aruban agenda attempts to distance Joran van der Sloot from implication in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and ... focus suspicion on Beth ... Jug ... MB Students ... security guards?  None of these persons were the last person observed leaving Carlos' and Charlies' with the 18 year old American citizen ... the 18 year old American citizen who was never seen again.

This is yet another example of how these secretive investigations just don't work.  If the police were more forthcoming with evidence, witnesses might be much more free to contribute.

No one wants to be the only person who claims to have seen something when a life is at stake.  If they knew others had also seen this, they might be more free to contribute.

The Dr O'Brien/Jan Tanner aspect is also rather odd behavior.  Were their rooms searched immediately?  Still too little known to even try to think of logical and likely possibilities or offer anything to an investigation.  Yet another negative for these secretive proceedings still carried out in some countries.  Why they do that is beyond my comprehension.

But I use a baby monitor for my Scottie puppies and I can hear the clock ticking in their room at the distance these parents were.  They cost about $30.  They have a light that will light up, several of them, the number that light up is directly related to the volume of noise in the room so they can be monitored with the sound actually turned off/down.  I have no small children nor grandchildren and know about these things so I am sure parents of small children do as well.  Maybe they don't work as well in congested areas.  Don't know.

The sad part is this is sounding like the PLE have reason to believe Madeleine is no longer alive.  What if she is?  Is no one looking for her now because of this turn in the investigation?

I have known of parents giving their children Benadryl to make them sleepy so this is done but is a form of abuse.  I do hope nothing like that was done to insure the children remained asleep.  7 p.m. is still daylight in most parts of the world and so rather early for a five year old to be sleeping soundly.  Could Madeleine have awakened and wandered away looking for her parents on her own and been abducted that way?

Just not enough known.

.

"At the moment it is their intention to stay here. However, they would very much like to go home," the friend told Reuters.

Declaring the McCanns as suspects indicates police believe they may have been involved in a crime but does not necessarily mean they will be detained.

No conditions were imposed on the McCanns, which according to the couple's defense lawyer in Portugal means they are free to travel abroad.

"They can travel whenever and wherever they like," lawyer Carlos Pinto de Abreu told Reuters, adding that the McCanns could remain at their home in England if they chose to do so while the investigation continues.

-----------------

But Abreu said he had no idea how long the Madeleine case would take to be concluded in a country with serious bureaucratic problems and delays in its justice system.

Portuguese weekly Expresso on Saturday cited legal experts as saying it could take at least one year.

Police changed their line of investigation after receiving results this week of forensic tests on evidence collected by Portuguese and British experts from various sites including the holiday apartment from which Madeleine vanished.

McGuinness said Kate had told her that police found blood in a car hired by the couple but there was no confirmation that it was Madeleine's.

http://tinyurl.com/2w3gm3

NYC ~  I didn't know about an anonymous letter.  Do you have any other information on that?  Thank you-Muffy.

It would be appreciated if someone could tell me what "the boot of the car" refers to.

Thank you.

Janet

++++++++++

Parents face kill charges
Charles Miranda in London
September 09, 2007 12:00am

Police claim the McCanns hid Madeleine's body for 25 days before using a hire car to dispose of the body.

Madeleine's DNA, including blood, was allegedly found in the boot of the car, on Mrs McCann's clothes and in the apartment ...

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,22384393-954,00.html

Janet,

Isn't the boot of a car the trunk in British English?  The back part where you put luggage or groceries is what I mean.

And I think they call the hood the bonnet?  This is the part where the motor is located except on Volkswagens I believe.

Just from reading Agatha Christie I think this.

.

Do we already have a link to the BBC coverage?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6984836.stm

you are correct  :cool: :wink:

Thanks Anna

My family roots are in England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales.  I do believe I have heard that expression at sometime in my growing up years.

Thanks again.

Janet

Good Afternoon everyone...

I have had this piece here on my mind for quite some time. Technorati linked it when it was on my site and I still can not get this outta my mind. I expect there to be DNA from all kinds of sources in a rented flat, but for some reason this is a big sticking point for me..

http://news.independent.co.uk/europe/article2606477.ece
 Mystery DNA found in Madeleine's bedroom
By Caroline Gammell, PA Chief Reporter in Madrid
Published: 02 June 2007

DNA from a mystery "sixth" person was found in the bedroom where Madeleine McCann was abducted, it was claimed today.

The Portuguese police, Policia Judiciara (PJ), have handed the sample to the national forensic laboratories, the Instituto Nacional de Medicina Legal, according to local newspaper 24 Horas.

It does not match the DNA of Mr and Mrs McCann or their three children, the paper said.

Neither does the DNA match that of the only named suspect in the case, property developer Robert Murat, the paper added.

It quoted a source from the laboratory who said: "There is a new suspect, there is DNA which does not correspond to the family.

"It is an important step in the investigation but the truth is that the DNA collected does not have a name.

"In other words we cannot make any connection between the material collected and the suspects which we already have."

The newspaper said the DNA would be compared to all the evidence gathered by the PJ to see if a match could be found.

But, the source continued: "This does not mean that Robert Murat could not be incriminated but there is a person who was in the room who as yet it is not possible to identify.

"There are a lot of things already concluded but there are a lot of things still to do."

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2007/09/08/maddy-the-possibilities-89520-19753205/

Maddy: The possibilities
Peter Kirkham, senior investigating officer on more than 20 murders, looks at four possible scenarios surrounding Maddy's disappearance.
By former Scotland Yard Detective Chief Inspector Peter Kirkham 08/09/2007


THEORY ONE

Madeleine was killed, her body hidden before being moved in the boot of the McCanns' silver Renault Scenic

DCI Kirkham: This is what police will have been quizzing Kate about. You don't have some one in for 11 hours to check a few points. Portuguese police apparently believe Madeleine was killed by accident. That fits with the suggestion that her body could have been hidden for a while. If murder is pre-meditated, the killer has worked out what to do with the body. If it happens without planning, most people panic and either run, cover up how the death happened or hide the body. Small bodies can easily disappear down holes and even if you do not know the area you will not have to go far to find somewhere to dump it. Later, if you think you are getting away with it, there may be a temptation to return and dispose of the body before the search widens or somebody stumbles across it.

THEORY TWO

Kate and Gerry are being framed by the Portuguese police for the death, as several close relatives have claimed

DCI Kirkham: This is highly unlikely. Although Portuguese police made early mistakes, it is big leap to accuse them of fit ting up the McCanns. The crucial evidence is the DNA recovered by British police and tested in a British laboratory. If Madeleine's body had been found it would be possible for somebody to take her blood and plant traces to implicate somebody. But without a body where is the supply of blood cells from Madeleine?

THEORY THREE

The samples found in the Renault Scenic are from cross-contamination or accidental transfer, possibly from the McCanns' belongings

DCI Kirkham: This would be possible if the DNA samples were so small they could be identified as coming from a particular cell - blood, hair or sweat. A police officer could have picked up Madeleine's DNA on gloves during one search and not changed them immediately after placing the sample in the evidence bag. However there is a big "But" here. If the British scientists found blood cells and enough of them to know it was significant, it makes it very unlikely they are there by chance. Blood is very strong circumstantial evidence especially with a DNA match when it's found where it shouldn't be.

THEORY FOUR

Madeleine was abducted and her attacker used the same hire car which the McCanns later hired

DCI Kirkham: This is the million-to-one defence which someone who has all the evidence stacked against them would use. The Portuguese police should be checking who had that Scenic before, tracing them and inter viewing to make sure they had no explanation for having Madeleine's blood. If I was in charge of this investigation I would do it, but only to double and triple-check the case.

Rob ~  the question about blood found on the wall and being announced as belonging to a man was discussed a bit here earlier.  Here is the post and there is a link to an article:
    
Re: British girl, Madeleine McCann, 4 in Portugal
« Reply #138 on: September 05, 2007, 02:35:31 PM »
   Reply with quoteQuote
Quote from: MsVada on September 05, 2007, 01:21:52 PM
I hadn't realized until today that they say their was definately blood on the walls, and it was definately Madelines.  That is sad to hear.

I'm curious to the new developments on the case as far as the forensics go.....Maybe the parents do know more than they want everyone to believe.   Sad

MsVada I didn't know until today either that there was definitely blood on the walls and it was definitely Madeleine's.  I had read a couple weeks ago blood was found on the walls, but that it was supposedly a tourists from a different stay.  (and a man's blood, no less)   Here is the link to that: http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=1590&id=1296452007  Maybe we were misled until all the tests could be made and more investigation completed before the information that it was Maddy's was released.  I'm wondering if it is all a part of a strategy from the police to find the killers.  I understand from another news article the parents and their friends on the trip are to be requestioned. It appears Madeleine isn't of this world any longer and it pains me to realize that.  I hope whomever harmed her and took her young life will answer for it.  Poor little angel, if she is indeed gone.

Hi, Robots,

Long time no see!

I wish we had access to the forensic reports in this case.

Thank you Muffee!

There sure is a lot of DNA involved in this case... it's just hard to know what DNA is the right DNA and what is overlapping from earlier.

If the McCanns did in fact rent a car and that car had DNA of missing Madeleine in the boot, I wonder why they were not arrested and charged last night?

That seems to make it a slam dunk, should that all be true. Something must be missing here that we have no idea about.

The PLE either has a serious trump card waiting to be played, or they are scratching their heads wondering if Kate and Gerry may be in fact innocent...

something is not adding up - at least to me.

Rob ... do you know whether Dr. O'Brien or his partner Jane Tanner  were questioned in the process of elimination ... in the pursuant of justice for Maddie?  Do you know if their apartment was searched?  When you consider that it was Dr. O'Brien who left the the tappa bar for "part of the evening" and ... Jane Tanner who claimed she saw "a dark-haired man carrying a child" ...

Janet

++++++++++++++++

The three crucial hours before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing
By NEIL SEARS
Last updated at 15:30pm on 8th September 2007

Another member of the group, Jane Tanner, took a turn around ten minutes later. She has told police that as she returned to the bar she saw a dark-haired man aged around 35 carrying a child. Again, she thought nothing of it.

A further detail from the evening is that the McCanns' friend Dr Russell O'Brien, 36, is understood to have left the table at some time after 9pm, to attend to his own ill daughter …..

Link


Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

<snipped>

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick. It is understood he shared duties with his partner Jane Tanner ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

Janet- thank you so much for raising this point.

I do not know if their flat was searched, however they were interview multiple times. Tanner believes that she saw Maddy being carried by an unidentified male, wrapped in a towel or blanket.

O'Brien seems to be lacking an alibi for his alleged departure from the Tapas.

Here's what I find very interesting, according to info, McCann friends - possibly Tanner and O'Brien - it has not be disclosed which 'friends' - and Robert Murat were called to the police station about a month ago and they had a sit down with the PLE, apparently, according to widely available reports, a shout match erupted as the 'friends' pointed the finger at Murat as claimed he was spotted outside the apartment on the night in question.

The police now seem to believe Murat. I don't know why.

Tanner has been consistent in her account. I am not sure what O'Brien has said as he has pretty much remained silent.

I find it hard to believe that Tanner and O'Brien are involved. How they have managed to remain under the radar and not cracked seems like a good stretch for me to accept.

Your thoughts???

 

This recent article implies that a connection has been established to a particular person in regards to the DNA detected in the McCann apartment that is not related to members of Maddie's family.

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++++

New arrests expected in Madeleine McCann case
Thursday, September 06, 2007

Portuguese police could reportedly be set to make new arrests in the Madeleine McCann case within the next 48 hours.

Reports this morning say the DNA of a potential suspect has been identified from samples taken inside the holiday apartment where the missing four-year-old was staying with her parents.  

The DNA is understood to have been found in an area where the individual should not have been.

Madeleine disappeared from the apartment in the Algarve 126 days ago.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/breaking-news/world/europe/article2936723.ece

Madeleine McCann's Parents Want Out Of Portugal
Family Friend Says The Suspects Want To Clear Their Name
 CBS News Interactive: Out Of Sight, Missing Kids
AP) PRAIA DA LUZ, Portugal The parents of missing 4-year-old Madeleine McCann want to leave Portugal as soon as possible and return to Britain to clear their names after Portuguese police named them as suspects in their daughter’s disappearance, a family friend said Saturday.

Clarence Mitchell said Gerry McCann told him that he and his wife expected clarification of their legal status within 48 hours. Their lawyer said late Friday police had declared the parents suspects in the girl’s May 3 disappearance.

“They are in broad agreement that they should get out as soon as they can,” Mitchell told The Associated Press by telephone from Britain. Whether Portuguese police allow them to leave is another matter, though their passports are not believed to have been seized up until now.

Mitchell said Kate and Gerry McCann had previously intended to leave southern Portugal, where they have stayed since their daughter vanished from a hotel room during a family vacation, on Sunday night.

“They are determined to prove this is a travesty ... and clear their names,” Mitchell said of the police allegations about their possible involvement.

http://keyetv.com/topstories/topstories_story_251101736.html

check this one out - seems to point to an abductor and the police know this.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=477430&in_page_id=1811&ct=5

The full details of what happened on the night Madeleine McCann went missing are revealed today.

An investigation has pieced together the events on the night the four-year-old vanished from the family's apartment in Praia da Luz in Portugal almost four months ago.

It shows that the abductor is most likely to have struck between 9.05pm and 9.15pm. But her disappearance could not have been discovered until 10pm, because her family and friends did not enter the bedroom where she was sleeping until that time.

Gerry McCann checked on his daughter at 9.05pm and then neither he nor his wife Kate checked on their children again until 10pm when they discovered Madeleine was missing.

Although the McCanns always monitored their children every 30 minutes, the night Madeleine vanished a friend of the family Matthew Oldfield offered to check for them at 9.30pm.

But instead of entering the bedroom, it is understood he listened at the door, heard nothing and assumed everything was fine. In fact, Madeleine had almost certainly been snatched by then.

Fifteen minutes earlier, at 9.15pm, a friend of the McCanns, Jane Tanner, who had gone to check on her children, saw a man walking away from the Ocean Club resort carrying a small child. Ms Tanner later described the pyjamas the girl was wearing - matching the description of those worn by Madeleine on the night.

Mr Oldfield's failure to check inside the bedroom may have cost vital time in the search for the little girl.

The Mail's sister newspaper, the Evening Standard, has spoken to a series of sources close to the McCanns and their friends who have revealed details of the events on the night.

They have also revealed that the McCanns have been frustrated over not being allowed to speak publicly about the events on the night - because of Portuguese rules preventing witnesses talking about a criminal case.

But they have also expressed surprise that so much information has leaked out, apparently through Portuguese police.

They are adamant Madeleine was abducted and are angered by vicious smears - published by the Portuguese media - that the McCanns and their friends are somehow complicit in her disappearance.

One source says he believes Madeleine was taken between 9.05pm and 9.15pm and that the patio windows at the rear of the apartment had been shut but unlocked on the night so the McCanns could check on their children more easily.

He said: "It could not be anything other than abduction. There is no doubt in anybody's mind that the girl Jane Tanner saw being carried away was Madeleine."

Almost four months after Madeleine vanished police in Portugal appear to have little idea what happened.

A series of leaks claim Madeleine died in the apartment and that she may have been murdered or killed by accident, with the friends of the McCanns somehow implicated.

But the source is adamant that none of the dining companions was away from the table at the tapas bar long enough not only to kill the little girl but then to dump the body.

The source said: "If it was one of the friends then it would have to be all of them to ensure a cover up. That's just plain nonsense."

Friends now believe that Madeleine was targeted during the course of the week at the resort. She was taken on the sixth night of the McCanns' stay at the Ocean Club, allowing her abductor to observe the family's routine - easily achievable since the McCanns stuck to the same arrangements.

Each evening, said the source, they and their friends dined at the tapas bar about 100 yards from the holiday apartment, and they always checked on their children every 30 minutes - almost like clockwork.

The table at the tapas bar was booked every night at 8.30pm after the children had all gone to bed. There were nine diners each night - the McCanns, Rachael and Matthew Oldfield, Ms Tanner and her partner Russell O'Brien, and David and Fiona Payne and her mother Dianne Webster.

Anybody watching the McCanns' movements would have known that as soon as Mr McCann had left the apartment after the first check, there would have been half an hour in which to snatch the child.

On 3 May, said the source, the friends arrived at the restaurant later than usual after participating in a tennis event.

The McCanns were the first to arrive at the tapas bar at about 8.40pm - previous reports had falsely suggested they had been there since 7pm and that the group had drunk several bottles of wine. The source insists no more than three bottles had been drunk by the nine adults.

Mr McCann left the table at around 9.05pm to check on Madeleine and her siblings, returning a few minutes later. Each set of parents was responsible for checking their own children but at 9.30pm when the McCanns were to check again, Mr Oldfield offered to check on them instead.

Madeleine was not discovered missing for another half an hour.

Re DNA found in hotel room....I can promise you that hotel rooms contain much DNA that does not belong to the current occupants.  In a recent stay in four hotels, I could almost "see" the DNA...which included cigarette butts in an ashtray on a closet shelf...fingerprints on the coffee maker and the hair dryer...and forget using the glasses that I know were just rinsed and put back....I could go on, but I do not want to nauseate you.  Before you ask, the hotels are not Motel 6 or that category.

have you guys seen this photo?

(http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149/Morgan2112_2006/PLAYGROUNDPERSONMADELEINE1.jpg)

(http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149/Morgan2112_2006/PLAYGROUNDPERSONMADELEINE3-1.jpg)

Who is the person in the photo Rob?

Mere, no one knows... those two heads you see are Maddy and one of the twins. This person is looking at them directly. Also, he is on the playground and dressed very uncomfortably for a hot day in Portugal. He appears to be out of place.

 There are some good photographs in this article and it has some bits of information I hadn't read yet elsewhere:

Kate McCann 'fears she will be charged today' as police push for confession
08.09.07
snipped ~
Dozens of British detectives have been drafted into the inquiry in recent weeks. Sources said 55 officers were now working on the case.

It is believed they are carrying out urgent inquiries on behalf of the Portuguese police into the background of the McCanns.

It can also be revealed that Portuguese police have been deliberately leaking details of their inquiry to local media as part of an investigative strategy to put more pressure on the McCanns in recent weeks.

It has never been established when Madeleine was last seen in public and it may even be the case that she was alone with her family from earlier than 5pm.

Madeleine was photographed at the poolside that day at 2.29pm but there is no evidence to suggest she was seen in public after that.

If a fatal accident had occurred some time that day, the McCanns could have had more than three hours to hide or move the body and to plan their actions.

http://tinyurl.com/37uhz3

If a fatal accident had occurred some time that day, the McCanns could have had more than three hours to hide or move the body and to plan their actions.



and then casually show up at a restaurant and join friends for dinner, and appear normal??  No way! Impossible!! 

Sorry if this has already been posted, saw this link @ RU and thought it was interesting;

Madeleine McCann: The evidence
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6984836.stm

Sunny ... according to the McCann's friend the interrogators told Kate that her daughter's DNA was found in the vehicle ... the vehicle that was rented 25 days following Maddie's disappearance.  How do think that is possible?

Janet


From The Sunday Times
September 9, 2007
Police video clue to Madeleine mystery

Jon Corner, a friend of the family, said: "They kept coming back to the hire car and kept showing Kate the video of sniffer dogs. They also told her that Madeleine's DNA was found in the car."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article2414735.ece

Parents of Missing British Girl Madeleine McCann Want to Leave Portugal
Saturday, September 08, 2007


Until Friday, suspicion had centered on Robert Murat, a British man who lived near the hotel from which Madeleine disappeared, and who was the only formal suspect.

But police said new forensic tests done on evidence gathered months after the girl vanished found traces of blood in the couple's car, said Justine McGuinness, a spokeswoman for the family.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296150,00.html

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article2414735.ece

September 9, 2007

Police video clue to Madeleine mystery

PORTUGUESE police tried to pressurise Kate McCann into admitting killing her daughter Madeleine by repeatedly showing her video footage of sniffer dogs allegedly finding the scent of a body in the family's hire car.

During 16 hours of interrogation she was shown the footage of the dogs clambering over the Renault ScŽnic car in the hope that she would break down and confess. She was yesterday said to be distraught and exhausted by the ordeal.

The dogs' reaction was a key reason why the police suspect her of killing Madeleine. Officers told Kate they had found her daughter's DNA in the car even though it was hired three weeks after her disappearance.

Kate and her husband Gerry are said to be mortified that the investigation team — with whom they have co-operated throughout — have apparently turned against them. "We are being absolutely stitched up," Gerry told a friend. "We are completely f*****. We should have seen this coming weeks ago and gone back to Britain."
Madeleine: one fact, many lies, endless grief

It’s now 124 days since Madeleine McCann disappeared. Penny Wark charts a story that became global, lurid and often invented

Police hoped to force a confession from Kate after she was formally declared a suspect on Friday and subjected to further questioning.

Jon Corner, a friend of the family, said: "They kept coming back to the hire car and kept showing Kate the video of sniffer dogs. They also told her that Madeleine's DNA was found in the car."

Another friend said: "The suggestion being put to Kate was that if she had somehow killed Madeleine in an accident, then used a hire car to dispose of the body three weeks later, she should confess and the judge would look at it in a lenient light and offer three to four years in jail. It's absolute nonsense."

As it emerged that the family are considering approaching David Miliband, the foreign secretary, Portuguese detectives last night faced questions about the value of the evidence which they hoped would force Kate to break down. The family claim it is ambiguous and flawed.

They were supported by British forensic scientists who have also been surprised by aspects of the investigation. They said that the rental car — still in the possession of the McCanns — would have been automatically impounded as a central piece of evidence if it was a British police inquiry. The family point out that Kate has carried Cuddle Cat, Madeleine's soft toy, since her disappearance, which could explain the presence of her DNA in the rental car. British forensic experts also said that footage of agitated dogs would be of limited value in the law courts.

A Leicestershire police official is said to have told Gerry that the sniffer dog alone was not sufficient to consider someone a suspect, but was usually used as a basis for further intelligence gathering.

The Portuguese investigation team will face severe criticism from the McCanns' family and friends if it stakes its case solely on its forensic work. "The crime scene was completely desecrated after Madeleine's disappearance," said Philomena McCann, Gerry's sister.

"Literally hundreds of people went in that apartment after Madeleine was abducted. It was pandemonium. It was at least two days before any sort of fingerprinting was done."

The police are unlikely to change the focus of their investigation. Portuguese newspapers were yesterday reporting that Kate was suspected of homicide, negligence and "preventing the corpse from being found". According to the reports, one police theory is that Kate accidentally gave Madeleine a fatal dose of sedatives. It has been strenuously denied by representatives of the McCanns that they gave any of their children sedatives. There was also speculation that Kate could face charges within a few days. Despite the threat of an impending prosecution, the McCanns are now anxious to return home. A court could put restrictions on their movements and the couple have said they will not leave without consulting the police.

"They really miss Madeleine and they really want everyone to concentrate on the fact that she is still missing," said a friend. "They feel that after the events of the past few days no one is carrying on with the search." The McCanns have been liaising with the Foreign Office in the hope that Miliband would be able to obtain more information on the state of the police inquiry.

Miliband said yesterday: "Firstly we must remember above all else that this is about a missing girl. Secondly, obviously we have been and will continue to give extensive consular support to the family. And thirdly, in respect of the independent judicial process, we must let that take its course."

The declaration of the couple as suspects will raise questions about the future care of the two-year-old twins if they are charged. It is understood that other members of the family would act as guardians if the authorities moved to take custody of the twins.

Kate and Gerry were interviewed by police on Thursday and Friday after detectives are thought to have obtained the results of tests conducted by

the Forensic Science Service in Britain. It is understood that Kate faced questions over whether she had given her daughter sedatives, why Madeleine's DNA was found on her clothing and in the rental car and why sniffer dogs found the scent of a body on her clothes and in the rental car.

Hugh White, a Home Office pathologist, said he could not understand why the car was held by the police for just two days. "In this country the car would have been stripped down into tiny pieces and the forensics team would be crawling all over it," he said. Other forensic scientists said the information revealed so far was far from conclusive. Keith Borer, a retired forensic scientist, said: "What they seem to have found makes good questions for a police interview, but evidentially it seems pretty weak."

I notice that the above article does indicate that the police have made the McCanns suspects based on a dog.

Is it possible that this rented car contained a corpse at one point, and it was not Madeleine?

Is it possible that the cadaver dog is faulty and not reliable?

I still don't understand how that car possessed the DNA of Madeleine 25 days after she disappeared.

This was posted on the Mirror forum without a link. But I do remember the article. It is accurate.

From the Daily Mail 15 August 2007.



Meanwhile a British holidaymaker whose hire car was seized by police hunting for Madeleine McCann yesterday angrily denied any involvement in the case.

Jim Gorrod, 34, a solicitor from Exeter, was on holiday in Praia da Luz on the Algarve with his pregnant wife Charlotte and toddler son when the four-year-old went missing.

The Gorrods, who knew one of the couples on holiday with the McCanns, joined the search for Madeleine in the hours following her disappearance in May.

But three months later, the solicitor found himself under investigation and his Portuguese rental car being impounded for examination.

This led to speculation that a 'mystery' Briton might be linked to Madeleine's disappearance.

But Mrs Gorrod described the speculation as "ridiculous" and said detectives had cleared them of any involvement.

Her husband is said to have come under suspicion at a car hire office when he returned his vehicle two days after Madeleine went missing.

It is understood staff at the Sixt car hire office at Faro Airport thought it odd that a man on his own was returning a car with a rented baby seat.

The staff's concerns were farcical and could easily have been checked out, say the couple, because Mr Gorrod had dropped his family and luggage at the entrance to the busy airport before returning the car.

But the hire firm reported its concerns to police and waited to be contacted.

Astonishingly, it took three months for police to ask for the blue Opel Corsa, which had been rented out to at least six more customers since then, to be examined.

Yesterday, Mr Gorrod was revealed to be the mystery British driver being sought for questioning by the Policia Judiciaria.

He immediately issued a statementproclaiming his innocence and insisted a British detective had told him he had 'nothing to worry about'.

He said: "A British police officer directly liaising with the Portuguese investigation team recently contacted me to eliminate the vehicle I hired for the holiday.

"The car has been identified and I have been told by the British police officer that he has no plans to interview me or my family.

"We are of course deeply saddened by Madeline's disappearance and hope for her safe return."

Mr and Mrs Gorrod already knew two of the McCann group, Dr Russell O'Brien and his partner Jane Tanner because they live two streets away in Exeter and have a child of the same age.

But the Gorrods said they did not know they would be in the same resort and they did not travel with the Mark Warner holiday company or stay at the Ocean Club apartments.

During the week in Praia da Luz, they are said to have 'occasionally' bumped into their friends but never met Gerry and Kate McCann.

When Madeleine went missing, James Gorrod joined other holidaymakers in helping search for the child before taking his family home to Devon.

Then a week ago, during a review of the case by British detectives, the family's hire car was finally seized and examined by Portuguese police.

I suppose if somone had dried blood on their shoe it could fall off into the vehicle?  Or dried blood on anything that was put into the car.  It could be just a flake of blood.

Klaas ... according to the spokesperson for the MacCanns ... Kate was told by interrogators that it was "Maddie's blood" that was detected in the vehicle that was rented 25 days following her disappearance.  How is that possible unless ...

Janet

++++++++++++++++++==


Parents of Missing British Girl Madeleine McCann Want to Leave Portugal
Saturday, September 08, 2007

Until Friday, suspicion had centered on Robert Murat, a British man who lived near the hotel from which Madeleine disappeared, and who was the only formal suspect.

But police said new forensic tests done on evidence gathered months after the girl vanished found traces of blood in the couple's car, said Justine McGuinness, a spokeswoman for the family.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296150,00.html


By Charles Miranda in London
September 09, 2007 12:00am

Police also suggested the toddler may have accidentally broken her neck. The couple, police claim, then hid their daughter's body for 25 days, before using a hired Renault Scenic car to dispose of the body somewhere.  
http://www.news.com.au/mercury/story/0,22884,22379573-923,00.html