Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Missing Persons - High Profile => Missing Persons - High Profile - Archives => Topic started by: MuffyBee on October 17, 2011, 03:18:31 PM



Title: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 - 10/27/11
Post by: MuffyBee on October 17, 2011, 03:18:31 PM
(http://kctv.images.worldnow.com/images/562544_G.jpg)

LISA IRWIN
MISSING SINCE OCTOBER 4, 2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Nut44x4 on October 21, 2011, 04:44:57 PM
oook, did I do it right? It's been a while.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Nut44x4 on October 21, 2011, 04:45:19 PM
oh yeah


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 04:46:57 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)

EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
FBI Cadaver Dog hit back on Monday inside #lisairwin #findbabylisa home according to our reporting partner the KC Star.
55 minutes ago

Eric Chaloux
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
According to reporting partners: PD dog got a "hit" in bedroom of #lisairwin house on Monday.#findbabylisa
1 hour ago

»
Eric Chaloux
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
#lisairwin parents' local attorney says in news release parents "want one thing:the safe return of their daughter."
1 hour ago

EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
#lisairwin billboards going up today. Follow @BetsyKCTV5 for more. #findbabylisa
3 hours ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 04:47:59 PM
oook, did I do it right? It's been a while.

Yes, you did it right.  Just like riding a bike.   ::MonkeyBike::  Thank you Nut!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 21, 2011, 04:50:29 PM
Any news from the lawyers yet?

??? 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 04:50:31 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)

CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Affidavit for Tues search warrant at #LisaIrwin house says FBI cadaver dog had positive "hit" for a deceased human in mother's bedroom.
1 hour ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 04:55:35 PM
I got lost.  ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 21, 2011, 04:56:24 PM
Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House

By CHRISTINA NG
Oct. 21, 2011

 A cadaver dog searching for evidence of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human" next to her mother's bed, according to a police affidavit released today.

 The affidavit was filed with a Kansas City court to request a search warrant of the family home. That search was carried out Wednesday and police left with several items, including a large portion of carpet.

 The court document also indicated that Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, restricted police access to the home. ::snipping2::

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 04:56:52 PM
The attorney for Lisa Irwin's parents said she is working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
by Karen Yancey/Staff 3:44 P

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bS4f2Eci


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 04:56:56 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)
CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Attorney for #LisaIrwin parents says she's working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
10 minutes ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 05:01:00 PM
http://www.fox2now.com/news/ktvi-search-warrant-cadaver-dogs-show-positive-hint-in-irwin-parents-bedroom-20111021,0,4010354.story
Search Warrant: Cadaver Dogs Show 'Positive Hint' In Irwin Parent's Bedroom
3:29 p.m. CDT, October 21, 2011
KANSAS CITY—

Court documents released on Friday show that a cadaver dog indicated a "positive hit" in the bedroom of Lisa Irwin's parents during a search of the home this week.  The search warrant return also indicated that police investigated "recently disturbed" dirt in the backyard.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 05:01:03 PM
Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


A cadaver dog searching for evidence of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human" next to her mother's bed, according to a police affidavit released today.

The affidavit was filed with a Kansas City court to request a search warrant of the family home. That search was carried out Wednesday and police left with several items, including a large portion of carpet.

<snipped>

The cadaver dog that searched the home on Oct. 17 with the parents' agreement "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed," the affidavit stated. The consistency and accuracy of cadaver dogs has been challenged in past cases.

The police request for the warrant said, "A more extensive and intrusive search needs to be completed at the property where the baby was last accounted."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 05:06:08 PM
(http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/6387/222uq.png)

Dogs don't lie.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 05:07:14 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 05:07:14 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Per court dox, police took blankets, toys, clothes, "rolls of tape" & "tape dispenser" from #LisaIrwin home.
1 hour ago
Peter Alexander
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Per affidavit, #LisaIrwin's mom initially told cops she didn't look behind house bc "was afraid of what she might find."
1 hour ago
Peter Alexander
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BREAKING Cadaver dog indicated a "hit" inside #LisaIrwin home, per police affidavit, in area of floor in mom's BR near bed.
1 hour ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 05:07:34 PM
It appears that a warrant was necessary as Debbie and Jeremy had restricted the previous search.

Janet

+++++

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

The court document also indicated that Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, restricted police access to the home.

"The only areas extensively processed for DNA and fingerprints during the consent were the baby's bedroom and possible points of entry," the document states.

"The extent of the search had been limited in nature with consent" of the parents, police stated in the request for the search warrant.

The cadaver dog that searched the home on Oct. 17 with the parents' agreement "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed," the affidavit stated. The consistency and accuracy of cadaver dogs has been challenged in past cases.

The police request for the warrant said, "A more extensive and intrusive search needs to be completed at the property where the baby was last accounted."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 05:07:39 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............



 ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 05:09:13 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............



 ::rhino::
::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 05:09:35 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 05:09:59 PM
(http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/1185/toysd.png)

(http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/5864/96601556.png)




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 05:12:08 PM
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/21/jeanine-pirro-reports-police-came-out-of-irwin-house-with-comforter-purple-shorts-toys-and-more/
4:29 pm ET October 21, 2011
Jeanine Pirro Reports Police Came Out of Irwin House With Comforter, Purple Shorts, Toys, and More
by Studio B Posted in: Baby Lisa, Deborah Bradley, Deborah Irwin, Jeanine Pirro, Jeremy Irwin, Lisa Irwin, Studio B, Trace Gallagher 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 05:13:12 PM
Yep! My thoughts, exactly.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 05:14:15 PM
Yep! My thoughts, exactly.

Sorry, that was supposed to be in response to everyone thinking they can get away with it since the Casey Anthony case. Forgot to hit "quote". My apologies.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: tcumom on October 21, 2011, 05:16:09 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)
CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Attorney for #LisaIrwin parents says she's working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
10 minutes ago
The only response needs to be:  The mother is turning herself in .   ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 05:19:22 PM
Inconsistent Statements

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

The document also contained a puzzling comment by Lisa's mother. "Bradley made the statement she did not initially look for her baby behind the house because she 'was afraid of what she might find,'" it said.

In addition, the police cited a "garden area with portions of dirt having an appearance of being recently disturbed or overturned."

The affidavit lists items that investigators took from the house, including a multicolored comforter, purple shorts, a Disney character shirt, a glow worm toy, a Cars-themed blanket, rolls of tape and a tape dispenser.

Bradley has previously told investigators that Lisa was wearing purple shorts and a purple t-shirt when she last saw her on the night of Oct. 3, the night Lisa vanished.

The document also revealed that inconsistent stories from the "people involved" may have hampered the early stages of the investigaton.

"Investigative interviews with the people involved revealed conflicting information for clear direction in the investigation," the affidavit said.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 05:22:17 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)
CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Attorney for #LisaIrwin parents says she's working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
10 minutes ago
The only response needs to be:  The mother is turning herself in .   ::MonkeyShocked::
Exactly.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 05:23:57 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)
CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Attorney for #LisaIrwin parents says she's working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
10 minutes ago
The only response needs to be:  The mother is turning herself in .   ::MonkeyShocked::
Exactly.

Sadly, the response is going to be attacking the accuracy of the dogs. That's where it always goes...sigh. :-( The only reason he's taking time to prepare it is so he can have time to look up data to support his attack. Blech!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 05:25:01 PM
Witnesses?

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

Earlier today, three witnesses in two Kansas City locations told "Good Morning America" they were convinced they saw a man carrying a baby matching Lisa's description the night she disappeared from her Missouri bedroom.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

It was shortly after 4 a.m. that Lisa's parents said they discovered she was missing.

"[At] 4 a.m., 45 degrees, baby don't have a coat or nothing and this guy is walking down the street and I thought it was kind of weird," Thompson said.

He thought the sight was so unusual that he recalled considering offering the man and baby a ride home, but couldn't because he was on his motorcycle. He later reported what he saw to police and told ABC News he is convinced the baby was Lisa.

Thompson described the man as around 5-feet-7, between 140 and 150 pounds and in his late 30s or early 40s.

A few hours earlier, a couple living three houses down from the Irwin family said they saw a similar sight. A woman and her husband said they saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby. They thought the situation was so unusual that they reported it to police on the morning of Oct. 4.

"It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anyone outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the woman told ABC News.

Bradley has said that Lisa was wearing purple shorts and a purple t-shirt when she last saw her, but the neighboring couple said they baby they saw did not appear to be wearing any clothing.

"We seen the little arm, the leg, it didn't look like the baby had on any clothes, just a diaper," she said.

The woman said police have interviewed her four times and police say they are still looking into the possible sightings.

"That is something that we've followed up on," said Kansas City Police Department Sgt. Stacey Graves. "We've haven't discounted it and we have no reason to believe that they didn't see what they said that they saw."

Graves said investigators plan on continuing to follow up on tips and leads today.

"Eyewitness testimony tends to be notoriously unreliable," said "Good Morning America" legal analyst Dan Abrams today. "With that said, the consistency of these two accounts is interesting."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 05:37:33 PM
Debbie and Jeremy definitely have some splain'in to to do.  It's not every day a cadaver dog hits positive on the scent of deceased human in the bedroom of a home.  I agree with Kermit, "dogs don't lie". 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 21, 2011, 05:37:41 PM
The attorney for Lisa Irwin's parents said she is working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
by Karen Yancey/Staff 3:44 P

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bS4f2Eci


Don't you know she is -- LOL.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 21, 2011, 05:42:59 PM
from lisa missing poster

Lisa has a birthmark on her right thigh. She was last known to be wearing purple pants
and a purple shirt with kittens on it.


i still cant find the interview,when DB described what lisa was wearing,but i thought
she said shorts,not pants

poster
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewPoster&caseNum=1180911&orgPrefix=NCMC&searchLang=en_US
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 21, 2011, 05:48:39 PM
wonder if the stuff LE took has a death scent too
another thought lisa prob has several,purple shorts and pants
but you cant get away from the carpet,shouldnt be long b4
LE makes an arrest,i wish we knew dads route from to starbucks


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 21, 2011, 05:52:26 PM
wonder if the stuff LE took has a death scent too
another thought lisa prob has several,purple shorts and pants
but you cant get away from the carpet,shouldnt be long b4
LE makes an arrest,i wish we knew dads route from to starbucks
Good evening Monkey's,

CW618,  I would like to know what shift, Sip's husband worked.  Mucho man looks fearless...mucho, mucho man....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 05:52:59 PM
wonder if the stuff LE took has a death scent too
another thought lisa prob has several,purple shorts and pants
but you cant get away from the carpet,shouldnt be long b4
LE makes an arrest,i wish we knew dads route from to starbucks

Good point. Wonder if they had the dogs check the company van? Did the mother have a car, too? Sorry, I can't recall. If so, wonder if the dogs checked that, too?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 21, 2011, 05:53:22 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

No doubt ...  it's sickening.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 21, 2011, 05:55:10 PM
 Witnesses Say They Saw Man Carrying Baby Resembling Lisa Irwin
12:38 PM ET
Share

 
Witnesses Say They Saw Man Carrying Baby Resembling Lisa Irwin

There were new reports Friday about witnesses who believe they saw a man carrying a baby resembling Lisa Irwin in her neighborhood on the night her parents say she disappeared from her home.

ABC’s “Good Morning America” reported that three witnesses saw a man in a t-shirt holding a baby wearing nothing but a diaper in the early morning hours of October 4. All said they found this unusual because of the cold weather in the area that night.

Lisa’s parents have said she vanished from her crib sometime between 6:40 pm on October 3, when mother Deborah Bradley put her to bed, and 4:00 am on October 4, when father Jeremy Irwin returned from work.

Around 12:15 am, a couple that lives a few houses away from the family spotted the man and baby. The female witness, who spoke to ABC, said she has been interviewed by police four times about what she saw.

Three miles away and nearly four hours later, around 4 am, Mike Thompson saw a man and baby fitting a similar description at an intersection off I-435. Thompson said the man was 5’7” or 5’8” and probably in his late 30s or early 40s. ::snipping2::

http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2011/10/21/witnesses-say-they-saw-man-carrying-baby-resembling-lisa-irwin/?hpt=ng_mid


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 21, 2011, 05:57:53 PM
What color shirt did Jeremy Irwin have on that night when Lisa went missing?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 06:05:54 PM
OCTOBER 21, 2011

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

The affidavit lists items that investigators took from the house, including a multicolored comforter, purple shorts, a Disney character shirt, a glow worm toy, a Cars-themed blanket, rolls of tape and a tape dispenser.

Bradley has previously told investigators that Lisa was wearing purple shorts and a purple t-shirt when she last saw her on the night of Oct. 3, the night Lisa vanished.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


OCTOBER 4, 2011

Baby girl feared abducted from crib in Kansas City
Tuesday, October 04, 2011 8:47 p.m. CDT


<snipped>

Police have spread the word about Lisa's disappearance through the media and on electronic bill boards above major highways in the area.

Lisa is described as having blue eyes and blond hair and was last seen wearing purple shorts and a purple shirt with white kittens  on it. Police are asking that anyone with information call the TIPS Hotline at 816-474-8477

<snipped>

http://wsau.com/news/articles/2011/oct/04/baby-girl-feared-abducted-from-crib-in-kansas-city/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 06:08:32 PM
 
 Just MAYBE the woman who saw a guy walking w a baby w dangling arms she says ... Was Debbies brother or ? Walking to bury the baby somewhere.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 06:09:02 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Spot on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
&*&^&%$^&^ wasting money, police and everyone involved in this case when they could of helped someone else...

I still don'think she was DRUNK.  She knew Le was coming for her sooner or later and used being drunk as a defense I bet....

How COULD both be on tv saying the child was taken ::MonkeyMad::

I am so proud of this team, Le and everyone they are doing a great job.

She's done, arrests will be soon...jmo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 06:21:23 PM
Just bringing forward the warrant document:

AFFIDAVIT FOR SEARCH WARRANT

STATE OF MISSOURI
ss.
COUNTY OF CLAY

I, Kimberly Shirley-Williams, Detective with the Kansas City, Missouri Police Department,
FIRST BEING SWORN UPON MY OATH STATE AS FOLLOWS, BEFORE THE
UNDERSIGNED JUDGE AUTHORIZED TO ISSUE WARRANTS IN CRIMINAL CASES:

My name is Kimberly Shirley-Williams. I have been employed at the Kansas City,
Missouri Police Department for over thirteen years. I am currently assigned as a
detective with the Kansas City Missouri Police Department Crimes Against Children Unit.

I am requesting a Search Warrant for the residence at 3620 N. Lister Drive, Kansas City,
Clay County, Missouri, the actual land, any and all vehicles (operable or non-operable)
and trailers located on the property, and the detached building located to the rear of the residence.

The property to be searched for and seized is described as follows: Any evidence
deemed to have evidentiary value to the relevant case ofa missing child, to include, but
not limited to DNA, fingerprints, cell phones and evidence of human decomposition.

On October 4, 2011 patrol officers with the Kansas City Missouri Police department were
dispatched to 3620 N. Lister on a reported missing child.

Upon arrival, contact was made with Jeremy Irwin who stated his 10-month-old
daughter (LI) was missing from their house. Officers entered the residence to search for
the baby. All rooms in the house and the basement were checked for the baby. An area
canvass was also conducted in the back yard, both yielding negative results.

Detectives obtained consent to search for the house beginning on October 4, 2011.
Detectives and crime scene personnel searched the home for any evidence of a child or
evidence to support an abduction of a child. Crime scene personnel recovered items
from the home, but due to initial information provided by the family, the only areas
extensively processed for DNA and fingerprints during the consent were the baby's
bedroom and possible points of entry.

Interviews with Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley, the baby's mother and father,
revealed the baby was missing along with three cell phones. Law enforcement
personnel searched the home and located a cell phone in the bottom desk drawer of the
computer desk. It was later determined that the cell phone located in the drawer was not
one of the missing cell phones in question. The three reported missing cell phones have
not been located and would include additional evidence. A search of the surrounding
area for evidence of the baby and/or cell phones has been met with negative results.

Investigative interviews with the people involved revealed conflicting information for clear
direction in the investigation. Bradley made the statement she did not initially look for
her baby behind the house because she "was afraid of what she might find." The extent
of the search had been limited in nature with consent although each search has
recovered evidence helpful to further progress the investigation. However, the type of
search needed at this time would not be conducive to being revoked at any time by the
owners and/or their attorney. A more extensive intrusive search needs to be completed
at the property where the baby was last accounted. There have been 585 tips/leads
investigated as of this date and none have revealed the whereabouts or deposition of
the baby. The items and evidence recovered as of this date supports the need for a
thorough, time consuming, and systematic search using additional techniques. The
search needed on the property may include hand-held tool excavation of the physical
land. The land includes a garden area with portions of dirt having an appearance of
being recently disturbed or overturned.

On October 17, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent
of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive "hit" for the scent of a
deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed.

The foregoing is true to the best belief and knowledge, further affiant saith not.

__________________
Det. Kimberly Shirley-Williams #4566



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 06:21:45 PM

 Just MAYBE the woman who saw a guy walking w a baby w dangling arms she says ... Was Debbies brother or ? Walking to bury the baby somewhere.


It was rumored that Debbie's brother lived in the basement of the Bradley/Irwin home.  Was there any affirmation?

Janet

+++++

Baby Lisa's Uncle Identified as Man in Surveillance Tape
Thursday October 13, 2011 03:25 PM EDT


The man seen on a surveillance tape shopping with Baby Lisa's mother has been identified as the woman's brother, according to a news report.

Deborah Bradley and her brother were purchasing wine for a family event at the Festival Foods near her home in Kansas City, Mo., family members tell KCTV5.

According to the station, police have interviewed the brother and determined he wasn't involved in the disappearance of 10-month-old Lisa.

<snipped>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20536781,00.html



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 06:23:55 PM
A receipt for the property taken, bringing forward:

RETURN/RECEIPT FOR SEARCH WARRANT  SUPP CRN 11-071958

I, Det. David Albers, #4542, being a peace officer in and for the county of Clay, State of Missouri, do hereby make Return/Receipt of the attached Warrant as follows:

That on the 19th day of October, 2011, and within 10 days after filing of the Application for Issuance of Search Warrant, I went to the person, place or thing described in said Warrant and searched the same for the property described, and that upon said person, place or thing I discovered the following property described in said Warrant which I then and there took into my possession: (list property taken)

- Multi-color comforter

- Purple shorts

- Multi-color Disney character shirt

- Glow worm toy

- "Cars" themed blanket

- Rolls of tape

- Tape dispenser

that I made this inventory in the presence of (possessor) the person from whose possession I took said property; that the owner of said property is Jeremy Irwin (that there was no person present from whose possession said property was taken); that I delivered to said possessor and/or owner a Receipt for the property taken, together with a copy of this warrant (that, there being no person in possession of said property present on said premises, I left a copy of this Warrant with a Receipt for the property taken, in a conspicuous place on said premises); that I have now placed said property so taken in the possession of the Court that issued said Search Warrant.

_____________________
PEACE OFFICER

Subscribed and Sworn before me this   day of  , .

_____________________
CLERK OF THE CIRCUIT COURT


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 06:25:11 PM
A tape dispenser makes a clicking sound if done slowly... hmmm...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 06:29:07 PM
Actually how long was Lisa dead is my question.
When was the last time anyone besides the adults saw her?

At this time, I don't believe anything she has said.
 ::MonkeyShovel::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 21, 2011, 06:29:59 PM
TY Itaryl Moosee,for the typed/copied text of warrant
hoping this case gets solved/someone arrested,while,im off to the
high school varsity playoff for state champ


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 21, 2011, 06:30:30 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............


I would love to be a fly on the wall wherever DB is right now......just saying  ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 21, 2011, 06:33:18 PM

 Just MAYBE the woman who saw a guy walking w a baby w dangling arms she says ... Was Debbies brother or ? Walking to bury the baby somewhere.


It was rumored that Debbie's brother lived in the basement of the Bradley/Irwin home.  Was there any affirmation?

Janet

+++++

Baby Lisa's Uncle Identified as Man in Surveillance Tape
Thursday October 13, 2011 03:25 PM EDT


The man seen on a surveillance tape shopping with Baby Lisa's mother has been identified as the woman's brother, according to a news report.

Deborah Bradley and her brother were purchasing wine for a family event at the Festival Foods near her home in Kansas City, Mo., family members tell KCTV5.

According to the station, police have interviewed the brother and determined he wasn't involved in the disappearance of 10-month-old Lisa.

<snipped>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20536781,00.html


No solid confirmations of where he resides.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 06:34:14 PM
From the Crime Stoppers TIPS Hotine: The Greater Kansas City Crime Stoppers TIPS Hotline, Kansas City, Missouri Police Department and FBI have received numerous inquiries in regard to the website www.lisa-irwin.com and want to make it clear to the public that this website is NOT affiliated with the official investigation, the TIPS Hotline, KCPD or FBI.
Further, the TIPS Hotline wants to warn the public that although the www.lisa-irwin.com site encourages the public “if you have any information about this case, please use the form below, even anonymous tips will be welcome:” it is unlikely that submissions are truly anonymous. The Crime Stoppers TIPS Hotline has software in place that keeps TIPSTERS anonymous and prohibits the tracking of IP addresses or cell phone numbers if the TIP is received via text message.
Anyone with information is urged to contact Crime Stoppers Greater Kansas City TIPS Hotline at 816-474-TIPS (8477), TIPS may also be submitted electronically at KCcrimestoppers.com, or by texting TIP452 and you information to 274637 (CRIMES). Information leading to an arrest in the case could be eligible for up to $1,000.00 in reward money.
by Karen Yancey/Staff 5:29 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bSSvzTpA


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 06:35:18 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............


I would love to be a fly on the wall wherever DB is right now......just saying  ::MonkeyDevil::
Me too........


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cadillac on October 21, 2011, 06:36:22 PM
What is the significance of taking a tape dispenser?  sorry if I missed something


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 06:37:38 PM
What is the significance of taking a tape dispenser?  sorry if I missed something

I'd like to know what kind of tape and dispenser? They have packing tape dispensers. And as someone above mentioned, that can make a sort of clicking noise while being used. And if they were wrapping a dead something, there might be DNA.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cadillac on October 21, 2011, 06:37:46 PM
watch the husband and his facial expressions (and lack thereof) and his eyes when the interviews are replayed.  That is not normal to me, anyway.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 06:44:28 PM
KCTVPhotog_Bill Bill Lindsay
by NimaKCTV5
The KCMO police helicopter just made 3 passes over the Irwin family home on Walrond and now it looks like it's headed to the Lister house.
13 minutes ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 06:45:58 PM
watch the husband and his facial expressions (and lack thereof) and his eyes when the interviews are replayed.  That is not normal to me, anyway.
I agree.  ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 06:51:21 PM

 Just MAYBE the woman who saw a guy walking w a baby w dangling arms she says ... Was Debbies brother or ? Walking to bury the baby somewhere.


It was rumored that Debbie's brother lived in the basement of the Bradley/Irwin home.  Was there any affirmation?

Janet

+++++

Baby Lisa's Uncle Identified as Man in Surveillance Tape
Thursday October 13, 2011 03:25 PM EDT


The man seen on a surveillance tape shopping with Baby Lisa's mother has been identified as the woman's brother, according to a news report.

Deborah Bradley and her brother were purchasing wine for a family event at the Festival Foods near her home in Kansas City, Mo., family members tell KCTV5.

According to the station, police have interviewed the brother and determined he wasn't involved in the disappearance of 10-month-old Lisa.

<snipped>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20536781,00.html


No solid confirmations of where he resides.

Thanks cartfly

Janet



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 06:58:08 PM
Actually how long was Lisa dead is my question.
When was the last time anyone besides the adults saw her?

At this time, I don't believe anything she has said.
 ::MonkeyShovel::


I'm speculating that Deborah put the baby in her bed with her and an inebriated mother suffocated her own baby.
Baby falls onto the floor or mother puts her on the floor and then disposes of body and creates baby kidnapped alibi.



 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 06:59:08 PM
watch the husband and his facial expressions (and lack thereof) and his eyes when the interviews are replayed.  That is not normal to me, anyway.
I agree.  ::rhino::

Not normal whatsoever!!!!
 ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:00:43 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

Yep now we see the fallout. Hope Baez burns in hell with Casey.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:01:45 PM
now lets' go over that timeline again Miss Bradley.............


I would love to be a fly on the wall wherever DB is right now......just saying  ::MonkeyDevil::

flies always have a way of landing on the poop



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:04:05 PM
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.


blonde hair

blue eyes

30-inches tall

weighs 26-30 lbs.

has two bottom teeth

a beauty mark on right outer thigh

currently has a cold with a cough and a small bug bite under her left ear.

last seen wearing purple shorts/pants with white kittens printed.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 21, 2011, 07:13:50 PM
Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House?  Oh dear, this does not look good.  I can only pray that it's the odor of DB's atrophied ladybits and not baby Lisa.

Does anyone know how soon a deceased body would start to give off a an odor?  Would it be immediately, minutes or hours?

I just saw this:
Investigator searches the memorial outside home of missing baby (http://www.seattlepi.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1688585&width=628&height=471)

Why would they search there?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:15:48 PM
What is the significance of taking a tape dispenser?  sorry if I missed something

fingerprints/hair/dna
used for perhaps wrapping around baby for body disposal


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 21, 2011, 07:16:24 PM
 ::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:16:30 PM
Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House?  Oh dear, this does not look good.  I can only pray that it's the odor of DB's atrophied ladybits and not baby Lisa.

Does anyone know how soon a deceased body would start to give off a an odor?  Would it be immediately, minutes or hours?

I just saw this:
Investigator searches the memorial outside home of missing baby (http://www.seattlepi.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1688585&width=628&height=471)

Why would they search there?

I have a stupid question I'm sure, but what are ladybits?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:17:07 PM
::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.

capris????



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 21, 2011, 07:21:34 PM
I have a stupid question I'm sure, but what are ladybits?

Not a stupid question.  Well, let's just say that if I told you, I'd probably be banned.  :lol:



capris????

Yes, that's it!  Good lord, as a former clothing designer you'd think I'd have known that.  Yes, those type of shorts/pants thingys usually come as a set with a long waisted top.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:26:18 PM
(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/316117_134636249975652_125929840846293_123404_1323983706_n.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:26:37 PM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Vk3kW13A1Rs/TpuKml6lwfI/AAAAAAAABNE/sk1Zr5I3_bc/s1600/lisairwin3.jpg)
this states purple pants


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 21, 2011, 07:28:07 PM
I have a stupid question I'm sure, but what are ladybits?

Not a stupid question.  Well, let's just say that if I told you, I'd probably be banned.  :lol:



capris????

Yes, that's it!  Good lord, as a former clothing designer you'd think I'd have known that.  Yes, those type of shorts/pants thingys usually come as a set with a long waisted top.

well dad nab it now I'm curious about ladybit, but I don't want you to be banned.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I know what you are talking about - I've seen those type of pants as a set for kids.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: sunshine12 on October 21, 2011, 07:29:20 PM
hey everyone, just wanted to comment on this case.  i have been following it but ever since the casey anthony case i haven't posted as much. 

i personally think that if the mom did roll over on lisa in bed and suffocated her that she would have called 911 and reported it. i think she intentionally killed her baby.  however, she is certainly taking "pre emptive" strikes at trying to set up a good defense for herself.  i unfortunately think we are going to see many effects of the anthony trial in further cases of parents killing their children. its sickening.  i don't know how certain lawyers (cough cough) sleep at night.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Stacey on October 21, 2011, 07:29:20 PM
What is the significance of taking a tape dispenser?  sorry if I missed something

fingerprints/hair/dna
used for perhaps wrapping around baby for body disposal

Oh just had a sad idea what if she had typed Lisa's little mouth like you know who did. ::MonkeyShocked:: OH crap this makes me sick to think about


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 21, 2011, 07:33:23 PM
::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.

capris????



 ::rhino::



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 07:46:20 PM
::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.

capris????



 ::rhino::



They are also called peddle pushers, that's from way back in time.  1940-50s


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 21, 2011, 07:47:03 PM
well dad nab it now I'm curious about ladybit, but I don't want you to be banned.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

How 'bout a clue then:  The definition of ladybits loosely rhymes with the medical term for chest pains.

BBM
hey everyone, just wanted to comment on this case.  i have been following it but ever since the casey anthony case i haven't posted as much. 

i personally think that if the mom did roll over on lisa in bed and suffocated her that she would have called 911 and reported it. i think she intentionally killed her baby.  however, she is certainly taking "pre emptive" strikes at trying to set up a good defense for herself.  i unfortunately think we are going to see many effects of the anthony trial in further cases of parents killing their children. its sickening.  i don't know how certain lawyers (cough cough) sleep at night.

That's a good point.  I believe she would call 911 too, IF she had been sober.  Rolling over onto your baby normally would be an unfortunate accident.  Rolling over while intoxicated could be considered child endangerment/involuntary manslaughter.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: tcumom on October 21, 2011, 07:48:47 PM
::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.

capris????



 ::rhino::



They are also called peddle pushers, that's from way back in time.  1940-50s
I'll chime in with *clam diggers*  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: wildmala on October 21, 2011, 07:51:17 PM
well dad nab it now I'm curious about ladybit, but I don't want you to be banned.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

How 'bout a clue then:  The definition of ladybits loosely rhymes with the medical term for chest pains.

BBM
hey everyone, just wanted to comment on this case.  i have been following it but ever since the casey anthony case i haven't posted as much. 

i personally think that if the mom did roll over on lisa in bed and suffocated her that she would have called 911 and reported it. i think she intentionally killed her baby.  however, she is certainly taking "pre emptive" strikes at trying to set up a good defense for herself.  i unfortunately think we are going to see many effects of the anthony trial in further cases of parents killing their children. its sickening.  i don't know how certain lawyers (cough cough) sleep at night.

That's a good point.  I believe she would call 911 too, IF she had been sober.  Rolling over onto your baby normally would be an unfortunate accident.  Rolling over while intoxicated could be considered child endangerment/involuntary manslaughter.

Yes, this is what I think, even though accidental, she might not call 911.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 21, 2011, 07:58:06 PM
A tape dispenser makes a clicking sound if done slowly... hmmm...


Yes it would.  I also considered someone was trying lighters in the house to find one that worked so they could burn evidence in the dumpster.

I believe what happened to Lisa was more of an assault instead of being smothered while sleeping.  Mom seems to be very guilty and if she was extremely tired and had spent a couple of hours trying to get her baby to quiet down, I believe she reacted in anger and killed Lisa, perhaps even as a result of putting tape over her mouth so she couldn't hear her cries.

She initially began to dig in the backyard but thought better of it.  Perhaps she carried Lisa's body to the woods and was crying loudly, hence the witness who heard a scream from the woods that night, but she could not bring herself to dispose of the body so she called someone to come help her, hence the phones are missing... she would not want those calls traced.  The 2:30 phone call coincides with the timing of the dumpster fire.  This Someone came (a smallish male, according to witness description, with no vehicle) and took Lisa's body. 

I wonder if witnesses saw a live baby in the arms of the man carrying her.  Maybe in the night shadows the man appeared to be black but is in fact a white man.  Someone carrying a deceased baby would not think it necessary to cover her with a coat or blanket. 

Her two boys should be interviewed again.  Would Lisa need to be charged for that to happen without her consent? 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 07:58:24 PM
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hi6de2tS1a3rjtRwfNB28lHr2OJw?docId=1246e8c904544656a34e35524a3d413f
Document: Cadaver dog 'hit' at missing baby's home
October 21, 2011

KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP) — An FBI cadaver dog reacted to the scent of a dead person inside the Kansas City home where a baby girl disappeared nearly three weeks ago, and investigators discovered soil in the backyard that had been "recently disturbed or overturned," police said in a court document released Friday.

The affidavit, filed earlier this week in support of a search warrant targeting the family's home, also stated that the girl's mother, Deborah Bradley, "made the statement she did not initially look for her baby behind the house because she 'was afraid of what she might find.'"

Those details and others in the affidavit, publicly released for the first time Friday, led to a daylong search Wednesday of the family's home, where the parents say then-10-month-old Lisa Irwin must have been snatched in the middle of the night as the mother and two other boys slept.  ::snipping2::

The affidavit stated that an FBI cadaver dog taken into the house Monday indicated a "positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed."

The FBI dogs, which often are used at both disaster and crime scenes, are trained "specially to recognize the scent of decaying, decomposing human flesh," retired FBI special agent Jeff Lanza said Friday.

"That can be the scent of an actual body decomposing, or residual scents after the body is no longer there," Lanza said.

Dr. Edward David, a deputy chief medical examiner for the state of Maine and co-author of the "Cadavar Dog Handbook," said that when a body is left in one spot for several hours, cells are left behind. They continue to decompose and create an odor, giving the dog scents to detect.


He said that while trained dogs may fail to detect the smell of human decomposition about 30 percent of the time, they generally don't alert when nothing is there. One exception is when human waste is present.

The court document also indicated police felt they needed handheld digging tools after an investigator noticed dirt in a garden area behind the home appeared to have been "recently disturbed or overturned." During Wednesday's search, investigators could be seen digging behind a shed in the backyard.

Among other revelations in the affidavit:

—Officers searched all rooms in the house and the basement after being called to the home Oct. 4. Officers sought evidence but because the parents said the baby had been abducted, the only areas extensively processed for DNA and fingerprints were the baby's bedroom and possible entry points.

—The parents had told police that three cell phones were missing. The affidavit said a phone had since been found in a desk drawer, but that phone wasn't one of those reported missing. The missing phones haven't been found.

—Interviews with people involved in the case revealed "conflicting information for clear direction in the investigation."

Another document released Friday revealed some of what police recovered from the home during Wednesday's search: a comforter and blanket, some clothes, rolls of tape and a tape dispenser.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 21, 2011, 08:02:56 PM
hey everyone, just wanted to comment on this case.  i have been following it but ever since the casey anthony case i haven't posted as much. 

i personally think that if the mom did roll over on lisa in bed and suffocated her that she would have called 911 and reported it. i think she intentionally killed her baby.  however, she is certainly taking "pre emptive" strikes at trying to set up a good defense for herself.  i unfortunately think we are going to see many effects of the anthony trial in further cases of parents killing their children. its sickening.  i don't know how certain lawyers (cough cough) sleep at night.

Sunshine, me too. Welcome back. I agree. Why not call 9-1-1. Unless there's something to hide. Something.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: theboyzmom on October 21, 2011, 08:04:25 PM
I have a stupid question I'm sure, but what are ladybits?

Not a stupid question.  Well, let's just say that if I told you, I'd probably be banned.  :lol:



capris????

Yes, that's it!  Good lord, as a former clothing designer you'd think I'd have known that.  Yes, those type of shorts/pants thingys usually come as a set with a long waisted top.

well dad nab it now I'm curious about ladybit, but I don't want you to be banned.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I know what you are talking about - I've seen those type of pants as a set for kids.



Lets just say the neatherlands . . .


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 21, 2011, 08:05:08 PM
::snipping2::
someone asked what Lisa was last reported wearing, this is from the original amber alert issued, but I noted that they say shorts/pants --- seems like a mom would know the difference between pants and shorts. Kind of odd.

I've seen baby/toddler pants that are not shorts or pants as the hem is just below the knee.  I have no idea what they're called.

capris????



 ::rhino::



They are also called peddle pushers, that's from way back in time.  1940-50s
I'll chime in with *clam diggers*  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Culottes

 ::MonkeyJnBox::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 08:05:40 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129
Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
October 21, 2011

A cadaver dog searching for evidence of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human" next to her mother's bed, according to a police affidavit released today.

The affidavit was filed with a Kansas City court to request a search warrant of the family home. That search was carried out Wednesday and police left with several items, including a large portion of carpet.

The court document also indicated that Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, restricted police access to the home.

"The only areas extensively processed for DNA and fingerprints during the consent were the baby's bedroom and possible points of entry," the document states.

"The extent of the search had been limited in nature with consent" of the parents, police stated in the request for the search warrant
.

The cadaver dog that searched the home on Oct. 17 with the parents' agreement "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed," the affidavit stated. The consistency and accuracy of cadaver dogs has been challenged in past cases.

The police request for the warrant said, "A more extensive and intrusive search needs to be completed at the property where the baby was last accounted."

 ::snipping2::
Earlier today, three witnesses in two Kansas City locations told "Good Morning America" they were convinced they saw a man carrying a baby matching Lisa's description the night she disappeared from her Missouri bedroom.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

It was shortly after 4 a.m. that Lisa's parents said they discovered she was missing.

"[At] 4 a.m., 45 degrees, baby don't have a coat or nothing and this guy is walking down the street and I thought it was kind of weird," Thompson said.

He thought the sight was so unusual that he recalled considering offering the man and baby a ride home, but couldn't because he was on his motorcycle. He later reported what he saw to police and told ABC News he is convinced the baby was Lisa.
 ::snipping2::
A few hours earlier, a couple living three houses down from the Irwin family said they saw a similar sight. A woman and her husband said they saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby. They thought the situation was so unusual that they reported it to police on the morning of Oct. 4.

"It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anyone outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the woman told ABC News.
The woman said police have interviewed her four times and police say they are still looking into the possible sightings.

"That is something that we've followed up on," said Kansas City Police Department Sgt. Stacey Graves. "We've haven't discounted it and we have no reason to believe that they didn't see what they said that they saw."

"Eyewitness testimony tends to be notoriously unreliable," said "Good Morning America" legal analyst Dan Abrams today. "With that said, the consistency of these two accounts is interesting."
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 08:07:39 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20539176,00.html
Baby Lisa Case: Cadaver Dog Picks Up Dead Body Scent in the Family Home
By Jeff Truesdell
Friday October 21, 2011 05:15 PM EDT



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/316117_134636249975652_125929840846293_123404_1323983706_n.jpg)


And Captain Steve Young has known it for a long time and wasn't about to give up.   

This is probably the rug from the parents' bedroom.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 21, 2011, 08:24:36 PM
(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/316117_134636249975652_125929840846293_123404_1323983706_n.jpg)


And Captain Steve Young has known it for a long time and wasn't about to give up.   

This is probably the rug from the parents' bedroom.
are those landscape lights on the bottom right of this photo? It looks like those solar ones from Home depot.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 08:29:13 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/video/29554334/detail.html
Details Of Lisa Irwin Search Warrant Released
POSTED: 5:16 pm CDT October 21, 2011
UPDATED: 5:18 pm CDT October 21, 2011


Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/video/29554334/detail.html#ixzz1bSw2w9jN


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 21, 2011, 08:34:15 PM
watch the husband and his facial expressions (and lack thereof) and his eyes when the interviews are replayed.  That is not normal to me, anyway.

I agree.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 08:36:35 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)

CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Prayer circle in front of #LisaIrwin home. Common occurrence, but Lisa's grandparents & other family showed up tonight. img.ly/9EoD (http://img.ly/9EoD)
33 minutes ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 08:38:52 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman (http://twitter.com/#!/heycameraman)

CliffJudy Cliff Judy
by Heycameraman
Prayer circle in front of #LisaIrwin home. Common occurrence, but Lisa's grandparents & other family showed up tonight. img.ly/9EoD (http://img.ly/9EoD)
33 minutes ago


(http://s3.amazonaws.com/imgly_production/2300239/large.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 08:39:58 PM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/21/41d773e8-c2d1-4d24-a803-40991e3b778d_400.jpg)
There was a prayer circle in front of Irwin house on North Lister Avenue. KMBC's Cliff Judy reported that this is pretty common occurrence, but two of Lisa Irwin's grandparents showed up tonight.
by Karen Yancey/Staff 7:31 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bSynoDeB


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 08:45:30 PM
I was wondering anyone know how long a cadaver dog can detect death?
Jeremys house is from 1958 so if someone died there b4 long ago,is that possible for dogs to pick that up?

I see human waste can be a false too. Guess thy can get the fluid samples maybe?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 08:46:08 PM
Sorry Muffy! Didn't mean to repeat the photo.   ::HelloKitty::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 08:48:05 PM
Sorry Muffy! Didn't mean to repeat the photo.   ::HelloKitty::

No worries.  ::bee::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 21, 2011, 08:59:21 PM
Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House?  Oh dear, this does not look good.  I can only pray that it's the odor of DB's atrophied ladybits and not baby Lisa.

Does anyone know how soon a deceased body would start to give off a an odor?  Would it be immediately, minutes or hours?

I just saw this:
Investigator searches the memorial outside home of missing baby (http://www.seattlepi.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1688585&width=628&height=471)

Why would they search there?
One of the best places to hide something is in plain sight, although it would be extremely brazen to hide evidence in a memorial.  I think it shows that LE is being thorough.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:01:07 PM
Im not sure you all seen this but here is a old friend of hers talking about DB
 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/20/deborah-bradley-baby-lisa-irwin-missing_n_1022905.html

I am wondering if they didnt kill Lisa earlier then Oct 3rd. But wondering why they would report now but then wonder if they arent into a cult and little Lisa was used as a sacrifice . So many questions and no answers yet


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: FishstickKitty on October 21, 2011, 09:04:07 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/download/2011/1021/29552279.pdf
The lawyers and parents statement

forgive me if this has already been posted.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Serenity on October 21, 2011, 09:04:44 PM
What is the brothers alibi from the time the neighbors saw a man carrying a baby and when the guy on the motorcycle saw what appeared to be the same guy with a baby. Seems to me if there were someone out there innocently walking with their baby at that same time that they would have already spoken up. It also seems to me that they would want to tell the world that he was just out walking his baby. Would made for a good news story.Very suspicious that the man has not spoken up.If the man on the cycle can recognize him then why don't police show him the brothers photo??


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 21, 2011, 09:06:02 PM
HLN- Dr Drew is having a segment regarding baby Lisa, his show is on now


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: FishstickKitty on October 21, 2011, 09:06:25 PM
I'm going out on a limb here and say I'm thinking the parents aren't guilty. Just a feeling.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: sunshine12 on October 21, 2011, 09:07:36 PM
watch the husband and his facial expressions (and lack thereof) and his eyes when the interviews are replayed.  That is not normal to me, anyway.

I agree.

i completely agree. it is very very freaky


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:14:30 PM
I was wondering anyone know how long a cadaver dog can detect death?
Jeremys house is from 1958 so if someone died there b4 long ago,is that possible for dogs to pick that up?

I see human waste can be a false too. Guess thy can get the fluid samples maybe?

I talked to a guy the other day about his dogs, he had used them in the Kelly Currin case in Oxford NC. Basically he told me that the dog is given something of the person who is missing and that dog follows that scent only. Its not like say 5 yrs ago someone died in my house then yesterday my son was killed in the same room the dogs wouldnt pay attention to the scent unless it matched the victim's . This guy was really interesting to talk to.b. I tried to think of questions to ask but to be honest the dogs just amazed me so much he had drug dogs body dogs and hunter dogs and about 5 other dogs that did cadaver stuff. He let us watch them go through a lesson. He even had a family shih tzu who went through the lesson and when that shih tzu got to the item he would just shake all over like he had just took a bath.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 09:15:51 PM
HLN- Dr Drew is having a segment regarding baby Lisa, his show is on now

Did I miss it?  Just turned it on, they will be talking about an 11year old.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 21, 2011, 09:17:03 PM
I'm going out on a limb here and say I'm thinking the parents aren't guilty. Just a feeling.

How so?  I am open minded and just want Lisa to come home.  There are lots of things that point to her parents so what gives you the feeling?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 09:17:30 PM
I'm going out on a limb here and say I'm thinking the parents aren't guilty. Just a feeling.

I'm thinking they are but I'll wait for more evidence to back up my feelings ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Puzzler on October 21, 2011, 09:21:32 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 09:22:34 PM
I was wondering anyone know how long a cadaver dog can detect death?
Jeremys house is from 1958 so if someone died there b4 long ago,is that possible for dogs to pick that up?

I see human waste can be a false too. Guess thy can get the fluid samples maybe?

I talked to a guy the other day about his dogs, he had used them in the Kelly Currin case in Oxford NC. Basically he told me that the dog is given something of the person who is missing and that dog follows that scent only. Its not like say 5 yrs ago someone died in my house then yesterday my son was killed in the same room the dogs wouldnt pay attention to the scent unless it matched the victim's . This guy was really interesting to talk to.b. I tried to think of questions to ask but to be honest the dogs just amazed me so much he had drug dogs body dogs and hunter dogs and about 5 other dogs that did cadaver stuff. He let us watch them go through a lesson. He even had a family shih tzu who went through the lesson and when that shih tzu got to the item he would just shake all over like he had just took a bath.

That's awesome! I'm so glad you talked with him and have this info!
I wanted to know for sure it was Lisa not someone else. That makes sense too!
 When will they arrest her I guess there giving time for labs ?

(Poor shih tzu- :) )





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 09:22:53 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/download/2011/1021/29552279.pdf
The lawyers and parents statement

forgive me if this has already been posted.
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6169/6268071738_2a48e52363_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6212/6268071762_870f812388_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 09:23:51 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 09:26:44 PM
Reminds me of statements Tacopina has made in the past about the innocence of his client Joran van der Sloot.  Also reminds me of the statements by Baez and the Anthony's early on in the Caylee Anthony case before Caylee's body was found.

In other words, that statement by the attorneys for Lisa's parents is worth less than the paper it's written on, IMO.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 21, 2011, 09:29:11 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Let's not forget sick and with a stranger?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 21, 2011, 09:29:43 PM
Quote
The police, however, have starved these parents by withholding information about the investigation.

How would they know that?  Are they implying that the parents have asked certain questions that have gone unanswered?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:29:43 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: sunshine12 on October 21, 2011, 09:30:56 PM
I'm going out on a limb here and say I'm thinking the parents aren't guilty. Just a feeling.

if they aren't involved then how do you explain the cadaver dog getting a hit in the parents bedroom?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:32:26 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
Not if the baby was already dead and parents trying to set up alibis


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 09:35:45 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Gypsy DD on October 21, 2011, 09:37:04 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

ITA..in the past three years we have seen more parents and so called caregivers try to hide/cover the fact they had abised and murdered their child..and they get more bizarre as we go along..each seems to gather momentum and tacitics from the last..

FTLOG..please people..if yoou do not want to parent anylonger take your child to a safe place/shelter and give them up..there are people who will take them in and care for them..there are families waiting to adopt children..why oh why when you can give birth doesn't it come with a heart.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Gypsy DD on October 21, 2011, 09:39:23 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::

How does that scenerio fir in with a cadaver dog hitting in the parent's bedroom..no one else in the family is dead..and unless someone from a previous owner died in that room..then we are left with one result.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 21, 2011, 09:39:25 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::

Maybe the cousin/boyfriend(?) helped her to get rid of the dead baby>?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:40:54 PM
This reaffirms for me the travesty of justice in the Caylee Anthony case.  Now everyone thinks they can get a way with it.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

ITA..in the past three years we have seen more parents and so called caregivers try to hide/cover the fact they had abised and murdered their child..and they get more bizarre as we go along..each seems to gather momentum and tacitics from the last..

FTLOG..please people..if yoou do not want to parent anylonger take your child to a safe place/shelter and give them up..there are people who will take them in and care for them..there are families waiting to adopt children..why oh why when you can give birth doesn't it come with a heart.
I been saying the same thing lately if you have a child that you do not want to be a parent to then please please put it up for adoption I dont care if its a newborn to 18 yrs old. But stop killing them to get money from movie deals donations from organizations etc


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Serenity on October 21, 2011, 09:41:24 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.msg1480472#msg1480472 Edit to add link back to Serenity's post MB

Posts: 62



View Profile
   
   
Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
« Reply #98 on: October 22, 2011, 12:04:44 AM »
   Reply with quoteQuote
Quote
What is the brothers alibi from the time the neighbors saw a man carrying a baby and when the guy on the motorcycle saw what appeared to be the same guy with a baby. Seems to me if there were someone out there innocently walking with their baby at that same time that they would have already spoken up. It also seems to me that they would want to tell the world that he was just out walking his baby. Would made for a good news story.Very suspicious that the man has not spoken up.If the man on the cycle can recognize him then why don't police show him the brothers photo??

Does anyone else think it's strange that this man walking with a baby has not spoken up yet? If it was just an innocent walk then there would be no reason not to speak up.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 09:43:08 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Let's not forget sick and with a stranger?
Yes or brother or lover ??


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 09:46:36 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 w
itnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy
Unless he was going to the woods to bury her?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 09:49:10 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
Court papers say cadaver dog got a hit in #lisairwin home.What does that mean?An expert search dog trainer answers on KCTV5 news at 10.
1 minute ago




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:49:19 PM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::

How does that scenerio fir in with a cadaver dog hitting in the parent's bedroom..no one else in the family is dead..and unless someone from a previous owner died in that room..then we are left with one result.
they were already setting the kidnapping story up and to do that they needed someone to walk different streets carrying the baby and hopefully a person or 2 would see them but wouldnt be close enough to give a description of the guy.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 09:51:08 PM
Wonder if they can get the time of death by dna evidence from the home? If so how it will fit with the timeline of the man walking w the baby w dangly arm leg. I think debbies older brother fits that description? Not saying he did it but if his phone txt hers maybe ..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 09:51:20 PM


http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
#lisairwin family at a vigil tonight.They talk about days new developments. @JeaneneKCTV5 has the story and a lot more at 10.
1 minute ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 21, 2011, 09:51:30 PM
Edit to add link back to Serenity's Post.  MB
Online Online

Posts: 62



View Profile
   
   
Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
« Reply #98 on: October 22, 2011, 12:04:44 AM »
   Reply with quoteQuote
Quote
What is the brothers alibi from the time the neighbors saw a man carrying a baby and when the guy on the motorcycle saw what appeared to be the same guy with a baby. Seems to me if there were someone out there innocently walking with their baby at that same time that they would have already spoken up. It also seems to me that they would want to tell the world that he was just out walking his baby. Would made for a good news story.Very suspicious that the man has not spoken up.If the man on the cycle can recognize him then why don't police show him the brothers photo??
Does anyone else think it's strange that this man walking with a baby has not spoken up yet? If it was just an innocent walk then there would be no reason not to speak up.
I agree - if it was innocent then say so; it is like a scene out of Raising Arizona


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Serenity on October 21, 2011, 09:51:31 PM
Sounds possible.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: crazybabyborg on October 21, 2011, 09:53:02 PM
Reminds me of statements Tacopina has made in the past about the innocence of his client Joran van der Sloot.  Also reminds me of the statements by Baez and the Anthony's early on in the Caylee Anthony case before Caylee's body was found.

In other words, that statement by the attorneys for Lisa's parents is worth less than the paper it's written on, IMO.

 ::rhino::
It's almost a form letter for defense attys in a high profile case. Lay out how helpful the family has been, state that all the suspect(s) want is the safe return of the missing and lastly, blame the police for not being fair.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 09:58:29 PM
ITA it is strange that the guy in question hasnt opened his mouth yet.
Thats why I say that it might of been the brother or friend carrying Lisa after Lisa was "killed",
Another thing that is strange is there was no pictures of baby Lisa after she turned around 8 months old, why bring out pictures of a 3 to 6 month old, babies change from day to day.













]


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 10:00:05 PM
Serenity - would you please just hit  quote or reply when you post?  Thanks!   ::piggy::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 10:05:18 PM
Reminds me of statements Tacopina has made in the past about the innocence of his client Joran van der Sloot.  Also reminds me of the statements by Baez and the Anthony's early on in the Caylee Anthony case before Caylee's body was found.

In other words, that statement by the attorneys for Lisa's parents is worth less than the paper it's written on, IMO.

 ::rhino::
It's almost a form letter for defense attys in a high profile case. Lay out how helpful the family has been, state that all the suspect(s) want is the safe return of the missing and lastly, blame the police for not being fair.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Well, they were cooperative. Sort of. Look why LE needed the search warrant:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.msg1480448#msg1480448
http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129
 ::snipping2::
The court document also indicated that Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, restricted police access to the home.

"The only areas extensively processed for DNA and fingerprints during the consent were the baby's bedroom and possible points of entry," the document states.

"The extent of the search had been limited in nature with consent" of the parents, police stated in the request for the search warrant.

The cadaver dog that searched the home on Oct. 17 with the parents' agreement "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed," the affidavit stated. The consistency and accuracy of cadaver dogs has been challenged in past cases.

The police request for the warrant said, "A more extensive and intrusive search needs to be completed at the property where the baby was last accounted."  ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 10:08:01 PM
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/how-significant-is-k9-hit-in-irwin-case#ixzz1bTIoTsfO
How significant is K9 'hit' in Irwin case?
Posted: 8:29 PM
Last Updated: 17 minutes ago

KANSAS CITY, Mo. - What does a “positive hit” by an FBI cadaver dog inside the home of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin mean for investigators?

Monday, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, Lisa’s parents, allowed an FBI K-9 evidence response dog inside the family’s home. That dog found something significant . According to a search warrant request, the dog indicated a “positive hit for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.”

“The dogs are, in most cases, they’re very, very accurate at what they uncover, whether it’s a body, the scent of a decomposing body, whether it’s a live scent of a person,” said Jeff Lanza, a retired FBI agent. “(The dogs) are very accurate in uncovering those things.”

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/how-significant-is-k9-hit-in-irwin-case#ixzz1bTKvwxGh



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: crazybabyborg on October 21, 2011, 10:11:13 PM
Exactly, Muffy!  ::rhino::

Thanks, Miss Bee!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 10:36:40 PM
NEW BLINK POST:

http://blinkoncrime.com/2011/10/21/disappearance-and-deception-turns-to-decomposition-dogs-smell-death-at-lisa-irwins-home/

Disappearance And Deception Turns To Decomposition: Dogs Smell Death at Lisa Irwin’s Home


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 21, 2011, 10:37:36 PM
Wonder if they can get the time of death by dna evidence from the home? If so how it will fit with the timeline of the man walking w the baby w dangly arm leg. I think debbies older brother fits that description? Not saying he did it but if his phone txt hers maybe ..

I thought the baby might be dead (the one not crying at 4 am in the cold in a diaper) and when I heard the descritption it reminded me of when I was 14, the 10 mos old I baby sat was killed when a stroller hit his car, when we arrived at the seen the paramedics were picking him up and I knew he was dead, he was limp and his legs were dangling.....that story made my mind go back 27 yrs and the first thought in my head was, dead baby :( Or, drugged BIG time...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 21, 2011, 10:41:11 PM
NEW BLINK POST:

http://blinkoncrime.com/2011/10/21/disappearance-and-deception-turns-to-decomposition-dogs-smell-death-at-lisa-irwins-home/

Disappearance And Deception Turns To Decomposition: Dogs Smell Death at Lisa Irwin’s Home


Thanks Klaas - facinating and devistating; Poor baby Lisa


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 21, 2011, 10:43:11 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.msg1480472#msg1480472 Edit to add link back to Serenity's post MB

Posts: 62



View Profile
   
   
Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
« Reply #98 on: October 22, 2011, 12:04:44 AM »
   Reply with quoteQuote
Quote
What is the brothers alibi from the time the neighbors saw a man carrying a baby and when the guy on the motorcycle saw what appeared to be the same guy with a baby. Seems to me if there were someone out there innocently walking with their baby at that same time that they would have already spoken up. It also seems to me that they would want to tell the world that he was just out walking his baby. Would made for a good news story.Very suspicious that the man has not spoken up.If the man on the cycle can recognize him then why don't police show him the brothers photo??

Does anyone else think it's strange that this man walking with a baby has not spoken up yet? If it was just an innocent walk then there would be no reason not to speak up.
It can't be ruled out that this was a fake story.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 10:50:04 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 21, 2011, 10:50:31 PM
https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
INTERACTIVE TIMELINE for #LisaIrwin: Details in the search for missing baby #LisaIrwin - #KCTV5: bit.ly/oGyJ67 (http://bit.ly/oGyJ67) via @AddThis
11 minutes ago
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15740872/timeline-detailing-the-search-for-missing-baby-lisa-irwin#.TqIrE37fRRc.twitter
TIMELINE: Details in the search for missing baby Lisa Irwin


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 21, 2011, 10:51:33 PM
Wonder if they can get the time of death by dna evidence from the home? If so how it will fit with the timeline of the man walking w the baby w dangly arm leg. I think debbies older brother fits that description? Not saying he did it but if his phone txt hers maybe ..

I thought the baby might be dead (the one not crying at 4 am in the cold in a diaper) and when I heard the descritption it reminded me of when I was 14, the 10 mos old I baby sat was killed when a stroller hit his car, when we arrived at the seen the paramedics were picking him up and I knew he was dead, he was limp and his legs were dangling.....that story made my mind go back 27 yrs and the first thought in my head was, dead baby :( Or, drugged BIG time...
Aww that's sad I'm sorry that happened and you saw that :(  just imagining that story makes my stomach week.
 I hope they find out who it was carrying the baby and that thy find Lisa soon


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 10:54:04 PM
One thing to remember is that the information (dog "hit", soil turned, etc...) in the Warrant is based on information that was gathered on Monday, the 17th of October, when they brought the dogs and searched the home.

The thorough search they did on Wednesday, the 19th of October, was done after LE got  the Warrant approved by the judge.

There is no detail of what they found on the 19th, and if the rug, XRays of the walls, or other things they took got any forensics that can help solve the case.

Just saying.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 10:56:13 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15768295/family-of-lisa-irwin
Affidavit says cadaver dog indicated positive 'hit' in home
October 21, 2011

 ::snipping2::
"On Oct. 17, 2001 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed," said the affidavit.

Items taken from the home on Wednesday included a comforter, purple shorts, a Disney character shirt, a glow worm toy, a blanket with characters from the movie Cars on it, rolls of tape and a tape dispenser.

The family's lawyer released a new statement Friday, insisting they had nothing to do with the baby's disappearance and chronicling all the ways they've cooperated, including offering DNA samples and consenting to multiple searches.  KCTV5's Betsy Webster tried reaching both NY attorney Joe Tacopina and Kansas City attorney Cynthia Short for a specific response to the new information.  Webster was told a written statement should be coming.

Police said in the affidavit supporting the request for the search warrant that the latest search was so thorough they did not want to run the risk of consent being revoked mid-search.

New York-based attorney Joe Tacopina said his clients are cooperating with police but the Kansas City Police Department said they aren't.
 ::snipping2::
Friday, police warned the public of a website that says its focus is on the baby Lisa case. Police said the website www.lisa-irwin.com is not affiliated with the official investigation, the TIPS Hotline, KCPD or FBI.  They also warn that, while the site says people can leave anonymous tips on it, they believe it is unlikely the submissions are truly anonymous.  Police said that, so far, they have followed up on nearly 700 leads, 65 from outside the metro.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 10:58:25 PM
TY Itaryl Moosee,for the typed/copied text of warrant
hoping this case gets solved/someone arrested,while,im off to the
high school varsity playoff for state champ

Enjoy the game!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 11:07:02 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6109/6255565217_b7c3ecda6e_o.gif)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 21, 2011, 11:07:54 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago

I wonder if Tacopino knew when he signed up for it, that it would turn ugly like it has.

I also wonder who shelled a couple of hundred thousand dollars to help the parents beat the rap.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 11:11:43 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6109/6255565217_b7c3ecda6e_o.gif)

Sung to the tune of the Village People Song "Macho Man"....
Taco, taco man
I've got to be, a taco man
taco, taco man (yeah, yeah)
I've got to be a taco!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 21, 2011, 11:27:45 PM
JoeT is doing this for one reason, publicity! 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 21, 2011, 11:30:39 PM
JoeT is doing this for one reason, publicity! 

ITA   ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: crazybabyborg on October 21, 2011, 11:35:13 PM
JoeT is doing this for one reason, publicity! 

ITA   ::rhino::

Ditto!  ::rhino::   ::rhino::

Personally, I think he and Baez should open a partnership.
The "Profit From Victims" firm.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cecilita on October 21, 2011, 11:35:24 PM
Hi all monkeys
What time the mom went to the grocery store? i think the baby was unattendant and she died by an accident.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Curly on October 21, 2011, 11:38:13 PM
I wonder if they brought in another cadaver dog to see if that one hits also?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 21, 2011, 11:44:37 PM
Well, this news of a dog hitting on decomp smell could explain some things.....                            1. JI's early comment about not wanting to interfere with the investigation by going to police station while DB was being questioned.  2. The interaction between the parents.  He seems to be uncomfortable around her.  She seems to be looking for him to defend her.  3. He parents abandoning the home immediately.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 21, 2011, 11:54:02 PM
Hi all monkeys
What time the mom went to the grocery store? i think the baby was unattendant and she died by an accident.


Around 4:40 tp 5ish, Lisa was supposely being watched by the father along with her brothers, He left at 5:20 to go to work DB puts Lisa to bed at around 6:40 then starts drinking (which I agree with several here that I dont buy her drunk story) I think she might of had 1 or 2 but I woud bet she didnt have many more then that. Cause she would of had to of known when she put the boys to bed and she went to bed to be accurate with the neighbor she was drinking with


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Puzzler on October 21, 2011, 11:59:28 PM
Two thoughts:

Does the description of the man scene at 12:30 am and at 4:00 am carrying the baby (both sighting by different people with basically the same description of the man), does that description of a male around 5 ft 8 in and 140-150 lbs. meet the description of Deb's brother?

Could someone have died in the house before baby Lisa's parents moved in the home and that would have been the smell that the dogs hit on?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 22, 2011, 12:18:39 AM
Two thoughts:

Does the description of the man scene at 12:30 am and at 4:00 am carrying the baby (both sighting by different people with basically the same description of the man), does that description of a male around 5 ft 8 in and 140-150 lbs. meet the description of Deb's brother?

Could someone have died in the house before baby Lisa's parents moved in the home and that would have been the smell that the dogs hit on?
Puzzler by my understanding when they bring in the dogs, they smell something personal of the victim's like a favorite blanket ,shirt they had on recently etc the dog will only track that scent of that person no matter if 5 people had died in the house,and while they are tracking that scent if they hit up on the death smell then they alert, I am also sure they brought more dogs in yesterday when they were doing the house they asked news crews not to photograph the dogs or tape the dogs.

I personally think someone did carry baby Lisa around in different areas that night but only after she was killed, and this was to start the kidnapping theory up. And I would say it was Lisa's Brother or a friend of his or maybe even a friend of DB. Now this is MOO.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 22, 2011, 12:26:55 AM
HOLD on to your PANTIES girls......
I thought I had seen it all....rofl. We need an icon thingy for this guy ::MonkeyHaHa::

 http://www.myspace.com/alonzo_washington/blog/544586077 (http://www.myspace.com/alonzo_washington/blog/544586077)
 ::snipping2::

October 21, 2011

Press Release/Baby Lisa Irwin Case Breaking tip:

KC,

I am pretty sure that the local press are going to try to leave all of my efforts out that helped make tips come in about the Baby Lisa Irwin case. I wonder will the national media do the same thing. My tips led to the big breaks in the Baby Lisa Irwin case & I think that the press & cops are not going to give me any credit like they always do. It's not easy being a Black crime fighter. Why do these people work so hard to cover up the truth? For news sources that are about the truth read this press release.

Peace,

Alonzo Washington
(913) 321-6764


PRESS RELEASE
__________________________________________________________________________________________
Topic: Activist's social media tips program turned up major evidence that may help solve the Baby Lisa Irwin case!

The big tip in the Baby Lisa case that led to a major search of the home of Baby Lisa Irwin has checked out. FOX NEWS is reporting that police dogs detected a scent of a dead human on the floor of Baby Lisa's parents room in the home. Activist, Alonzo Washington sent the Tips Hotline a tip asking them to re-search the home of Baby Lisa. The crime solving activist has been blogging about the case & asking for tips since the mystery begun. The KCPD contacted the local crime fighter to make sure that he was sharing all of his information & tips about the case with the police during the first week of the case.
Activist, Alonzo Washington contacted the Tips Hotline with what he described as the case breaking tip to have the police do a better search of the Irwin family home on Saturday 10-15-2011. He told them that the dogs may not have picked up the baby's scent for electrician reasons. However, the police scent dogs had never entered the property before his tip. The following Monday 10-17-2011 the dogs were dispatched to the home & picked up the scent of a dead human. Then on Tuesday 10-18-2011 the POLICE CAME BACK WITH A SEARCH WARRANT. The police found fleshly turned dirt like the activist asked the police to check for. The Police & FBI also found the shorts of the child that she was described to be wearing the night her mother put her to sleep.
The persistent anti-crime activist helped the KCMO Police Department & the FBI get the big break in the Baby Lisa Irwin missing child case. The FBI told the press that the major search was not prompted by a tip. However, that clearly is not true. Read the tip that activist, Alonzo Washington sent to the detective (Kevin Boehm) who is over the Tips Hotline & his response. The detective told Mr. Washington that he would forward the tip to the command post. Will the press lie once again about a big tip that Activist Alonzo Washington generated to help local law enforcement solve another criminal case? Mr. Washington will be at the crime scene of Baby Lisa's home to do more Youtube videos about the case in the near future. To reach him call: (913) 321-6764


Det. Kevin Boehm:
I received a tip that may be the case breaking tip. I have taken some time to research the possibility of the tip. It checks out. The tip states that Baby Lisa is in the home or on the property of 3620 Lister. I know that your people have searched that location. However, you have not search it the way it needs to be searched. In obtaining this tip I assumed that my source was of the same occupation of Baby Lisa's dad. After questioning him & doing some research about electricians. I learned a lot about their duties. They are known to read blue prints, they work with metals & plastic boxes & they go inside of walls houses on a regular basis. This would give them a great ability to hide a small body like a infant in places that most people could not find it. My tips are saying this child may inside the septic tank of the home or inserted in the walls of the home in a metal box or plastic box. If this is true the wiring, water & chemicals could have put your police dogs off of the scent of the baby. My tipsters are saying if this home & yard was taken apart like the other home you all searched the baby would be recovered. Electricians are also skilled in digging trenches. That's why the yard should be dug up also. I know that fire fighter have equipment that can see through walls. Perhaps, your department could get them to use that device to help locate boxes in the walls of the home. I also checked the stats of mothers killing their children by flushing them down the toilet. It was amazedly high. That's why the septic tank tip could be real. I also thought this tip could be real because the parents never wanted to return to the crime scene. Could that be guilt? Maybe, they can't stomach being where the slain child is. The parents have never asked the public to bring the baby home. They have always said drop it off somewhere safe. Fire Station, Church, etc. Could they be suggesting that their home is not safe. All of this makes me think that this tip may be very credible. I have been checking out all of my tips. THIS ONE SEEMS TO MAKE THE MOST SENSE. That's why I have sent it to you. I will also forward this to Major Hundley after I send it to you first. I think if the police would take Baby Lisa's home apart they will find her.

Regards,

Alonzo Washington
(913) 321-6764


 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Puzzler on October 22, 2011, 12:32:39 AM
Two thoughts:

Does the description of the man scene at 12:30 am and at 4:00 am carrying the baby (both sighting by different people with basically the same description of the man), does that description of a male around 5 ft 8 in and 140-150 lbs. meet the description of Deb's brother?

Could someone have died in the house before baby Lisa's parents moved in the home and that would have been the smell that the dogs hit on?
Puzzler by my understanding when they bring in the dogs, they smell something personal of the victim's like a favorite blanket ,shirt they had on recently etc the dog will only track that scent of that person no matter if 5 people had died in the house,and while they are tracking that scent if they hit up on the death smell then they alert, I am also sure they brought more dogs in yesterday when they were doing the house they asked news crews not to photograph the dogs or tape the dogs.

I personally think someone did carry baby Lisa around in different areas that night but only after she was killed, and this was to start the kidnapping theory up. And I would say it was Lisa's Brother or a friend of his or maybe even a friend of DB. Now this is MOO.

I believe dogs are trained to detect different things.

Scent dogs are trained for search for a person's scent - items worn by that person are normally used.

Cadeaver dogs are trained to detect human decomp.

It's being reported that the dogs in this search detected human decomp. 

The dogs cannot detect that it is human decomp from Lisa.  Just that it's human decomp.

Scent dogs can detect Lisa's scent - but they cannot detect human decomp.

One or the other.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 12:32:49 AM
 ::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 22, 2011, 12:39:08 AM
http://www.omega7.com/html/AlonzoBio.html

http://www.pitch.com/plog/archives/2008/11/13/stealing-time-midtown-miscreant-vs-alonzo-washington-arrowhead-addict-vs-jopo-and-big-sexy-life-in-sojoco-vs-toplikar (http://www.pitch.com/plog/archives/2008/11/13/stealing-time-midtown-miscreant-vs-alonzo-washington-arrowhead-addict-vs-jopo-and-big-sexy-life-in-sojoco-vs-toplikar)

(http://www.pitch.com/imager/stealing-time-midtown-miscreant-vs-alonzo-washington-arrowhead-addict-vs/b/original/2577306/0f29/alonzo.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 22, 2011, 12:39:49 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.

Hi KCJackie - what is your opinion on this case?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 22, 2011, 12:40:59 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.
maybe you could check on Deb, she might be out of wine again..... ::MonkeyDevil:: (I am sorry, I couldn't resist)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 12:45:16 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.

Hi KCJackie - what is your opinion on this case?

Hi klaas, truthfully I don't know much about it.  It's been a crazy couple of weeks for me.  Trying to catch up here. ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 22, 2011, 12:45:44 AM
well, with this new development I hate to say it but I believe this is another case of parent killing their child, getting rid of the body and yelling"kidnapper"  and its guys like Taco and Biaz that makes these parents think they can actually get away with it, and because of these two dirt bags several already have gotten away with it, its dicusting how they have no feeling for these poor children, they are only interested in jumping into the lime light and getting their name in headlines, they honestly make me sick, I shall pray that little Lisa's body will be found soon and her parents, whichever is guilty, is arrested and made to pay for whatever they did to this sweet baby girl!!!!:'(.........poor poor babies.....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 12:46:47 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.
maybe you could check on Deb, she might be out of wine again..... ::MonkeyDevil:: (I am sorry, I couldn't resist)

Lol, she is sickening isn't she?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 01:18:03 AM
They live so close to the Missouri river, unfortunately lots of bodies have been found there.  Every time I go over the bridge I wonder how many more are in there.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Lake Erie Princess on October 22, 2011, 01:18:12 AM
Just flying by and reading. The Ohio weather is killing my sinuses.

RE: Alonzo.....MOO ~ these child cases
seem to bring out all kinds of weirdos !

What do they do to occupy themselves "between" cases ? LOL  ::MonkeyMad::

Next time I feel "bad" I am going to drink wine, & plead the 5th !  ::MonkeyCheer4::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 01:39:06 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 22, 2011, 01:44:31 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 01:54:40 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 22, 2011, 01:58:55 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?
I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 02:04:56 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?
I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?

Just a little....anything in particular that your thinking? ::MonkeyKiss::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 22, 2011, 02:09:32 AM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::

How does that scenerio fir in with a cadaver dog hitting in the parent's bedroom..no one else in the family is dead..and unless someone from a previous owner died in that room..then we are left with one result.
they were already setting the kidnapping story up and to do that they needed someone to walk different streets carrying the baby and hopefully a person or 2 would see them but wouldnt be close enough to give a description of the guy.

Or the person who helped DB didn't have a vehicle.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 22, 2011, 02:13:09 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?
I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?

Just a little....anything in particular that your thinking? ::MonkeyKiss::
Maybe  ::MonkeyCool::.  You ever hear any rumors of tunnels under houses up there?  A comment made to me early on about the appearance of a family member along with some background on tacoJoe that Kermit posted a couple days back and the mention in the news that it was a family connection that brought both Stanton and tacoJoe to town has me wondering.  It seems so far-fetched, but nothing can be ruled out at this point.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KCJackie on October 22, 2011, 02:20:49 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?
I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?

Just a little....anything in particular that your thinking? ::MonkeyKiss::
Maybe  ::MonkeyCool::.  You ever hear any rumors of tunnels under houses up there?  A comment made to me early on about the appearance of a family member along with some background on tacoJoe that Kermit posted a couple days back and the mention in the news that it was a family connection that brought both Stanton and tacoJoe to town has me wondering.  It seems so far-fetched, but nothing can be ruled out at this point.

 ::MonkeyWink:: Ohhhhh, I will have to check that out - I wondered how taco got involved so fast - makes sense now.  I'll go back and find Kermits post!!  I really have only seen about 20 minutes total news on this - will have to check out some family member pics.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 22, 2011, 02:28:06 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?
I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?

Just a little....anything in particular that your thinking? ::MonkeyKiss::
Maybe  ::MonkeyCool::.  You ever hear any rumors of tunnels under houses up there?  A comment made to me early on about the appearance of a family member along with some background on tacoJoe that Kermit posted a couple days back and the mention in the news that it was a family connection that brought both Stanton and tacoJoe to town has me wondering.  It seems so far-fetched, but nothing can be ruled out at this point.

 ::MonkeyWink:: Ohhhhh, I will have to check that out - I wondered how taco got involved so fast - makes sense now.  I'll go back and find Kermits post!!  I really have only seen about 20 minutes total news on this - will have to check out some family member pics.
I will watch for your take on it! Here is a link to a reply I made to him http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12176.msg1478725#msg1478725 (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12176.msg1478725#msg1478725) I have to run now, I am exhausted.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 22, 2011, 02:41:04 AM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6109/6255565217_b7c3ecda6e_o.gif)

Sung to the tune of the Village People Song "Macho Man"....
Taco, taco man
I've got to be, a taco man
taco, taco man (yeah, yeah)
I've got to be a taco!

 ::MonkeyJnBox::

 ::MonkeyDance::

That song is gonna be stuck in my head all night!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 22, 2011, 02:43:24 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.


1. Find baby Lisa
2. Slap DB
3. Check if JI has a pulse


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: starshadow on October 22, 2011, 04:24:49 AM
A few things to remember so the media spin isn't blinding:
1) Cadaver dogs have a 10-20% false positive rate even in ideal circumstances,
2) Cadaver dogs will also hit scent of menstrual blood,
3) If amount of cadaver dog reaction was a sure thing, Madeline McCann's parents would have been put away a long time ago,
4) Neither dogs nor polygraphs are anything resembling reliable - at best, they might suggest a useful avenue of investigation to pursue; at worst, they're a red-herring that wastes a lot of time


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 07:35:01 AM
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/21/ddhln.01.html
DR. DREW
Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dog`s Positive `Hit`; Conrad Murray Courtroom Drama; Sex in Church
Aired October 21, 2011 - 21:00   ET

 ::snipping2::
PINSKY: You know, I mentioned a couple of nights ago that more to be revealed on this case. I just get the sense of real chaos here. And, again, substances, chaos, vortex, sounds familiar, doesn`t it? It`s like Casey Anthony all over again. We expect lies, distortion, and may be what we`re going to get here.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 07:37:28 AM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cheeky monkey on October 22, 2011, 08:29:07 AM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::
Along that line of thinking - what if the baby was dead by the time mom got back from the store and out of the house when dad left for work.  Does anyone know if the dogs checked the cars for decamp smell? I wonder if dads route to work was long and/or searched.





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 08:32:07 AM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 22, 2011, 08:41:25 AM
A few things to remember so the media spin isn't blinding:
1) Cadaver dogs have a 10-20% false positive rate even in ideal circumstances,
2) Cadaver dogs will also hit scent of menstrual blood,
3) If amount of cadaver dog reaction was a sure thing, Madeline McCann's parents would have been put away a long time ago,
4) Neither dogs nor polygraphs are anything resembling reliable - at best, they might suggest a useful avenue of investigation to pursue; at worst, they're a red-herring that wastes a lot of time

Good morning Monkeys---

Thank you Starshadow for pointing all of this out.  The people on cable news channels have practically become hysterical about the so-called "Hit."  Personally, I doubt that it means anything.  I believe that LE doesn't have a clue and wants to pin this on someone---anyone---just to give the impression that they are doing something. It wouldn't be the first time that this has been done.  I don't think this will ever be solved and I don't think that that precious baby will ever be found. It's going to be exactly like the Aisenberg case, IMO. Likely, Deborah will be accused and arrested on flimsy evidence.  Something like a wiretap transcript saying, "I do fear you have harmed our little baby daughter,"  just like the Aisenbergs, where a judge threw the whole thing out and could hardly keep from laughing at the ridiculous "evidence." The thought that anyone would be so willing to help dispose of a dead baby boggles the mind.  Walking down the street carrying a dead baby is even more mind boggling. Involving oneself in such a conspiracy is a hard one to swallow. I note that another day has passed and Deborah hasn't been arrested. So much for "gut" predictions. As for Deborah being connected to the Mafia, well, what can I say?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 22, 2011, 08:42:01 AM
I was wondering anyone know how long a cadaver dog can detect death?
Jeremys house is from 1958 so if someone died there b4 long ago,is that possible for dogs to pick that up?

I see human waste can be a false too. Guess thy can get the fluid samples maybe?


The CSI death dogs: Sniffing out the truth behind the crime-scene canines
In one study involving four dogs and their handlers, Jacobi says the dogs were able to detect remains at all stages of decomposition. Performance varied between dogs, but some could locate skeletonised remains buried in an area of 300ft by 150ft. "The few single human vertebrae I used in the study were well over 25 years old, and dry bone," Jacobi says. "This made the discovery of one of these vertebrae, which we buried in dense woods 2ft deep, by a cadaver dog pretty remarkable." ::snipping2::
http://www.biologycorner.com/anatomy/senses/crimedogs.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Miss Lacey on October 22, 2011, 08:45:26 AM
 ::MonkeyCheer4::
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?

I'm in JoCo too. Alonzo Washington is crying because he never gets any credit. Boo hoo. What about Lisa? Finding her is more important than Alonzo's "credit."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 22, 2011, 08:49:46 AM
I would think that a baby in 45 degree temp without clothes on would be crying
I would think so too and a sick freezing cold baby

Ok it is a possibility that it was Lisa and wouldnt be so far fetched of a thought, that all 3 witnesses claimed to seen a man walk with a baby only in a diaper. That man could of been the brother or bother's friend just walking so someone could get a look at the scene of a guy walking with a baby. I just dont believe if Lisa had been kidnapped that the kidnapper would walk in the middle of the night he might walk down the road get in a unmarked car but to walk a few miles is crazy

Could this guy been actually walking to his car that was parked a few blocks away from Lisa's house?
Then he drove and parked and walked a ways away from his car??

That spot at 4:30am the cops should take dogs there..
 ::MonkeyShocked::
::snipping2::
How does that scenerio fir in with a cadaver dog hitting in the parent's bedroom..no one else in the family is dead..and unless someone from a previous owner died in that room..then we are left with one result.
but some could locate skeletonised remains buried in an area of 300ft by 150ft. "The few single human vertebrae I used in the study were well over 25 years old, and dry bone," Jacobi says. "This made the discovery of one of these vertebrae, which we buried in dense woods 2ft deep, by a cadaver dog pretty remarkable."
http://www.biologycorner.com/anatomy/senses/crimedogs.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 09:15:40 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/44992690/ns/today-today_news/t/cadaver-dog-has-hit-inside-baby-lisas-home/#.TqLAM7I2yuI
updated 10/21/2011 9:52:15 PM ET
 ::snipping2::
The affidavit stated that an FBI cadaver dog taken into the house Monday indicated a "positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed."

The FBI dogs, which often are used at both disaster and crime scenes, are trained "specially to recognize the scent of decaying, decomposing human flesh," retired FBI special agent Jeff Lanza said Friday.

"That can be the scent of an actual body decomposing, or residual scents after the body is no longer there," Lanza said.

But Joe Tacopina, lawyer for the parents, told The Associated Press late Friday he considers the report meaningless. Tacopina noted that cadaver dogs are trained to detect decomposing flesh — and even if the baby had died, decomposition could not have happened so quickly.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 09:19:02 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/lisa-irwin-parents-home-searched-14792120
Lisa Irwin Parents' Home Searched
Suspicious evidence is found in the bedroom of Lisa Irwin's parents.
02:52 | 10/22/2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: supersleuth99 on October 22, 2011, 09:23:18 AM
Yuknowmenot??????  Do you live close by?
Yes, I am in JoCo

What's your opinion?


I think DB is responsible.  Big question for me is accidentally or intentionally, but I am leaning towards the latter.  I am also beginning to think she might have had "professional" help after the fact.  How familiar are you with the history of that part of town and the inhabitants of KC North?

Just a little....anything in particular that your thinking? ::MonkeyKiss::
Maybe  ::MonkeyCool::.  You ever hear any rumors of tunnels under houses up there?  A comment made to me early on about the appearance of a family member along with some background on tacoJoe that Kermit posted a couple days back and the mention in the news that it was a family connection that brought both Stanton and tacoJoe to town has me wondering.  It seems so far-fetched, but nothing can be ruled out at this point.

 ::MonkeyWink:: Ohhhhh, I will have to check that out - I wondered how taco got involved so fast - makes sense now.  I'll go back and find Kermits post!!  I really have only seen about 20 minutes total news on this - will have to check out some family member pics.
I will watch for your take on it! Here is a link to a reply I made to him http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12176.msg1478725#msg1478725 (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12176.msg1478725#msg1478725) I have to run now, I am exhausted.

The houses with the underground tunnels are North from the Irwins - in Sherwood Estates. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Puzzler on October 22, 2011, 09:27:55 AM
New blog article at The Hinky Meter:

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/22/lisa-irwin-case-search-warrant-and-people-details/

Lisa Irwin case: Search warrant and People details

Posted on October 22, 2011 by Valhall



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 09:29:59 AM
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/
Lisa Irwin case: Search warrant and People details
Posted on October 22, 2011 by Valhall


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 22, 2011, 09:35:49 AM


Cadaver dogs, how reliable are they at detecting death?
http://dogsdontlie.com/main/2008/12/cadaver-dogs-how-reliable-are-they-at-detecting-death/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 22, 2011, 09:39:47 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/44992690/ns/today-today_news/t/cadaver-dog-has-hit-inside-baby-lisas-home/#.TqLAM7I2yuI
updated 10/21/2011 9:52:15 PM ET
 ::snipping2::
The affidavit stated that an FBI cadaver dog taken into the house Monday indicated a "positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley's bedroom near the bed."

The FBI dogs, which often are used at both disaster and crime scenes, are trained "specially to recognize the scent of decaying, decomposing human flesh," retired FBI special agent Jeff Lanza said Friday.

"That can be the scent of an actual body decomposing, or residual scents after the body is no longer there," Lanza said.

But Joe Tacopina, lawyer for the parents, told The Associated Press late Friday he considers the report meaningless. Tacopina noted that cadaver dogs are trained to detect decomposing flesh — and even if the baby had died, decomposition could not have happened so quickly.
 ::snipping2::


Tacopina is an idiot.  Temp in KC Missouri on that day/night was fairly warm outside and no telling how warm inside the house:

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KMKC/2011/10/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA (http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KMKC/2011/10/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6161/6269247260_3a10bc2d55_o.jpg)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition)

 ::snipping2::
Once the heart stops, chemical changes occur within the body and result in changes in pH, causing cells to lose their structural integrity. The loss of cell structure brings about the release of cellular enzymes capable of initiating the breakdown of surrounding cells and tissues. This process is known as autolysis. Visible changes caused by decomposition are limited during the fresh stage, although autolysis may cause blisters to appear at the surface of the skin.[7]
 ::snipping2::


http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cadaver-dog.htm (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cadaver-dog.htm)

 ::snipping2::

In addition to being used to find whole bodies, cadaver dogs are also trained to react to any trace of human remains. This can be very useful in crime investigations, because a cadaver dog can indicate that a cadaver was in a particular location at one point, even if it is no longer there, and these dogs can also find traces of bodies which criminals attempted to conceal by destroying the evidence.





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 22, 2011, 09:48:28 AM
::MonkeyJnBox:: Just jumping in here.....This story is about 20 minutes away from me, if there is anything any monkey would like for me to do or check out, just let me know.

hi all jokes aside,would you know which starbucks is getting a rewire/refurbished
the one JI is working at
TIA


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 22, 2011, 10:02:27 AM
Good morning Monkey's,

Thank-you Muffy and Trimm for posting the October 2, 2011 photos of Baby Lisa.

http://www.kmbc.com/r-slideshow/29423242/detail.html

LI looks healthy, happy, and having fun in these photos. 

I question, if the baby was really sick, (on the following day) she looks in fine form, in the photo's. ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 10:02:29 AM
 

 I wanted to point out that the neighbor that saw the man walking w baby said the baby was ONLY wearing a diaper at 12am the oth guy at 4am just said no blanket coat nothin ..
I havnt seen an artical that he says same thing just DIAPER??



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 22, 2011, 10:22:46 AM
i live in a house where a girl,18 yr of age was murdered,in 98,im the first person
to lease this house since that time,i moved in, in 2002
the owners let it go/moved didnt come back,and a reality co. bought it,refurbed it
new bath,new kit,new flooring,wood and carpet,paint roof furnace,ect.
neighbor told me about it after id leased and moved in
short version,a bloody battle from bedroom,2nd floor to basement,and back to
another bedroom on 2nd floor,the she jumped out a closed window

my Q is could a dog still sniff out decomp at my house


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 22, 2011, 10:28:33 AM
i live in a house where a girl,18 yr of age was murdered,in 98,im the first person
to lease this house since that time,i moved in, in 2002
the owners let it go/moved didnt come back,and a reality co. bought it,refurbed it
new bath,new kit,new flooring,wood and carpet,paint roof furnace,ect.
neighbor told me about it after id leased and moved in
short version,a bloody battle from bedroom,2nd floor to basement,and back to
another bedroom on 2nd floor,the she jumped out a closed window

my Q is could a dog still sniff out decomp at my house

I'd say probably.  Some cadaver dogs are trained to find ancient burial grounds.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 22, 2011, 10:50:46 AM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 11:24:11 AM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone

CW, have you've looked into the history of your house?
Woow, creepy...

Guess we're not getting any updates today you think.....later.
 ::HelloKitty::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 22, 2011, 11:30:14 AM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone

That sounds kinda fun!  Next time you sense his presence, just say "Hello!  How ya doin' ?"   Maybe he's a nice ghost.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 11:35:25 AM
Witnesses?

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

Earlier today, three witnesses in two Kansas City locations told "Good Morning America" they were convinced they saw a man carrying a baby matching Lisa's description the night she disappeared from her Missouri bedroom.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

It was shortly after 4 a.m. that Lisa's parents said they discovered she was missing.

"[At] 4 a.m., 45 degrees, baby don't have a coat or nothing and this guy is walking down the street and I thought it was kind of weird," Thompson said.

He thought the sight was so unusual that he recalled considering offering the man and baby a ride home, but couldn't because he was on his motorcycle. He later reported what he saw to police and told ABC News he is convinced the baby was Lisa.

Thompson described the man as around 5-feet-7, between 140 and 150 pounds and in his late 30s or early 40s.

A few hours earlier, a couple living three houses down from the Irwin family said they saw a similar sight. A woman and her husband said they saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby. They thought the situation was so unusual that they reported it to police on the morning of Oct. 4.

"It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anyone outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the woman told ABC News.

Bradley has said that Lisa was wearing purple shorts and a purple t-shirt when she last saw her, but the neighboring couple said they baby they saw did not appear to be wearing any clothing.

"We seen the little arm, the leg, it didn't look like the baby had on any clothes, just a diaper," she said.

The woman said police have interviewed her four times and police say they are still looking into the possible sightings.

"That is something that we've followed up on," said Kansas City Police Department Sgt. Stacey Graves. "We've haven't discounted it and we have no reason to believe that they didn't see what they said that they saw."

Graves said investigators plan on continuing to follow up on tips and leads today.

"Eyewitness testimony tends to be notoriously unreliable," said "Good Morning America" legal analyst Dan Abrams today. "With that said, the consistency of these two accounts is interesting."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


BUMPED


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 11:42:18 AM
Missing Baby Lisa: Family Attorney Says Cadaver Dogs May be Misleading Officials
Oct. 22, 2011


The search for Lisa Irwin hit closer to home this week as cadaver dogs have picked up the scent of human remains next to the her parent's bed, according to a police affidavit.

But an attorney for the family said following the cadaver dog's nose may be misleading investigators.

"My understanding is that there are cold cases where dogs have hit on scents of decomposition that have been in the home for as long as 28 years," said Cyndy Short, in an exclusive interview with "Good Morning America." "This is an old home. 63 years old. There could be a lot of other explanations for that."

But Brad Garrett, an ABC News consultant and former FBI special agent, said cadaver dogs are typically accurate.

"In studies done of cadaver dogs where the dog has direct access to the scent and its reasonably fresh - its above 90 percent.

The affidavit, released on Friday, revealed that a cadaver dog searching for evidence for missing the 11-month-old "indicated a positive 'hit' for the scent of a deceased human" next to her mother's bed.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-family-attorney-cadaver-dogs-misleading/story?id=14790822
 



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 22, 2011, 11:43:55 AM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone

My hubby had one is old house, they were friendly.It took me a while to get to sleep over ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 22, 2011, 11:51:14 AM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

That is a real possibility, IMO. The pictures of the birthday party show a smiling Lisa, a happy Lisa. She could've had a cold, and still have fun... but usually a kid who has a cold also has a runny nose, red nose, teary eyes, and a reddish tinge under the eyes.

Maybe the mother told people Lisa had a cold, but maybe Lisa was really hurt. I still can't believe she harmed Lisa before going into the store. Her smile on the surveillance pictures shows a happy Deborah.

Maybe something happened during the day, maybe the mother convinced herself that it was nothing, that Lisa was coming up with a cold and that she would be alright, when in reality Lisa was badly hurt.

Liam Niesen's wife died of a simple hit on the head that seemed like nothing in the beginning. A simple hit on the head can create serious effects on a person, that will develop over hours, even days.

Maybe, maybe, maybe... too many maybes. I just wish Deborah or Jeremy would come out and tell the truth.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 11:54:57 AM
Witnesses?

Missing Baby Lisa: Cadaver Dogs Detect Smell of 'Deceased Human' in Irwin House
Oct. 21, 2011


<snipped>

Earlier today, three witnesses in two Kansas City locations told "Good Morning America" they were convinced they saw a man carrying a baby matching Lisa's description the night she disappeared from her Missouri bedroom.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

It was shortly after 4 a.m. that Lisa's parents said they discovered she was missing.

"[At] 4 a.m., 45 degrees, baby don't have a coat or nothing and this guy is walking down the street and I thought it was kind of weird," Thompson said.

He thought the sight was so unusual that he recalled considering offering the man and baby a ride home, but couldn't because he was on his motorcycle. He later reported what he saw to police and told ABC News he is convinced the baby was Lisa.

Thompson described the man as around 5-feet-7, between 140 and 150 pounds and in his late 30s or early 40s.

A few hours earlier, a couple living three houses down from the Irwin family said they saw a similar sight. A woman and her husband said they saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby. They thought the situation was so unusual that they reported it to police on the morning of Oct. 4.

"It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anyone outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the woman told ABC News.

Bradley has said that Lisa was wearing purple shorts and a purple t-shirt when she last saw her, but the neighboring couple said they baby they saw did not appear to be wearing any clothing.

"We seen the little arm, the leg, it didn't look like the baby had on any clothes, just a diaper," she said.

The woman said police have interviewed her four times and police say they are still looking into the possible sightings.

"That is something that we've followed up on," said Kansas City Police Department Sgt. Stacey Graves. "We've haven't discounted it and we have no reason to believe that they didn't see what they said that they saw."

Graves said investigators plan on continuing to follow up on tips and leads today.

"Eyewitness testimony tends to be notoriously unreliable," said "Good Morning America" legal analyst Dan Abrams today. "With that said, the consistency of these two accounts is interesting."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-cadaver-dogs-detect-smell-deceased/story?id=14786129


BUMPED


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 11:57:48 AM
Thanks for posting that Janet . I bolded some of the artical above. The couple gives no description of the man ..the oth witness doesn't say if the baby was ONLY in a diaper ..not enough info ..
Plus LE discounted the first sighting wonder why?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 22, 2011, 11:59:11 AM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

I thought of that,too!  She could have been next door at Sippy's :) with the baby monitor. ::rhino:: IMO




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 22, 2011, 12:08:10 PM
Sorry, I was in your box, Phar.
These are my speculation, opinion and wild ideas  ::MonkeyEek::

The evening was chilly, when she was drinking out on the stoop.  Perhaps she began drinking on the front stoop and
then later, took the box over to next door, (about 8:00 pm) when the four year old needed to go to bed.

She stayed a Sippy's, with the baby monitor... This is my guess, opinion what happened on that fateful evening :(


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 12:12:14 PM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

I thought of that,too!  She could have been next door at Sippy's :) with the baby monitor. ::rhino:: IMO



Bottom line, IF you have NOTHING to hide you don't change stories in midstream.
That's what is bothering me from the 3rd day and after of this investigation.

Just hope they find Lisa, so we would know what actually happened.
Also still think the cops should take the dogs to the last sighting of the guy with the baby.

 ::ghost2:: ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 12:15:13 PM
n/p sh, u can type in my box.....been there, done that too... ::ghost:: ::MonkeyWitch1::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 22, 2011, 12:15:45 PM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone

My hubby had one is old house, they were friendly.It took me a while to get to sleep over ::MonkeyShocked::

OT, but since we are at it...

I, too, had a "ghost" in a house I lived in. It would manifest itself at nights, after I turned off the lights and everything was pitch dark and quiet. The three tables in the living room would creek, sometimes all at once, the window curtains would move as if a breeze were blowing on them, but the house was closed. The TV would turn on in channels that had no reception, showing nothing on the screen, then the channels would switch as if someone were channel surfing. There was a small cloud or fog, that moved around the room leaving a moist film on anything it touched.

I thought on moving after three weeks, but I talked to a few people about it. One of them was a Native American guy. He told me he had a similar problem once, and said he would talk to someone about my problem.

So a Saturday morning he shows up with a Native American elder. The elder quickly told me to wait until the ghost manifested itself at night, then yell at the ghost, "I order you to get out!", and mean it. I thought he was joking.

He said that the ghost would listen, and know that I was in charge, that it was my home, and it would leave.

I did this that night, and it worked, the first time.

Of course, at the same time I bought a few night lights and put them in... just in case.

 ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 22, 2011, 12:20:18 PM
Tacopina is an idiot.  Temp in KC Missouri on that day/night was fairly warm outside and no telling how warm inside the house:

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KMKC/2011/10/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA (http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KMKC/2011/10/4/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6161/6269247260_3a10bc2d55_o.jpg)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decomposition)

 ::snipping2::
Once the heart stops, chemical changes occur within the body and result in changes in pH, causing cells to lose their structural integrity. The loss of cell structure brings about the release of cellular enzymes capable of initiating the breakdown of surrounding cells and tissues. This process is known as autolysis. Visible changes caused by decomposition are limited during the fresh stage, although autolysis may cause blisters to appear at the surface of the skin.[7]
 ::snipping2::


http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cadaver-dog.htm (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cadaver-dog.htm)

 ::snipping2::

In addition to being used to find whole bodies, cadaver dogs are also trained to react to any trace of human remains. This can be very useful in crime investigations, because a cadaver dog can indicate that a cadaver was in a particular location at one point, even if it is no longer there, and these dogs can also find traces of bodies which criminals attempted to conceal by destroying the evidence.

So much for the guy who said it was 45F degrees outside on that Monday night, and the baby had no blanket or coat. ?



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 22, 2011, 12:30:52 PM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

That is a real possibility, IMO. The pictures of the birthday party show a smiling Lisa, a happy Lisa. She could've had a cold, and still have fun... but usually a kid who has a cold also has a runny nose, red nose, teary eyes, and a reddish tinge under the eyes.

Maybe the mother told people Lisa had a cold, but maybe Lisa was really hurt. I still can't believe she harmed Lisa before going into the store. Her smile on the surveillance pictures shows a happy Deborah.

Maybe something happened during the day, maybe the mother convinced herself that it was nothing, that Lisa was coming up with a cold and that she would be alright, when in reality Lisa was badly hurt.

Liam Niesen's wife died of a simple hit on the head that seemed like nothing in the beginning. A simple hit on the head can create serious effects on a person, that will develop over hours, even days.

Maybe, maybe, maybe... too many maybes. I just wish Deborah or Jeremy would come out and tell the truth.



I want to know if Deborah took Lisa to the doctor or if she was even giving her some over the counter child's medication.  I somehow doubt that she took the baby to the doctor because if a child has a doctor visit and either dies or goes missing the next day, I think the police would have those records.  I'm really interested to know how she was treating the baby for her cold because a cough in a ten month old should definitely be checked out.

I also want to know who last saw Lisa and when, other than Deborah and Jeremy.  I want to know what the boys say about the last time they saw Lisa.  I don't understand why she is not letting the police interview them again.  The information about when Deborah and Jeremy last saw Lisa is coming from them and I think they are lying - it's been proven with Deborah.  I want to know if any neighbor or drinking buddy saw her that night. 

When Deborah suddenly changed the time she put Lisa to bed from 10:30 to 6:30 I immediately thought "why is she changing the time to subtract 4 hours?"  Maybe it's because no one saw Lisa during that time.

Too many coincidences - Jeremy working at night for the first time, Lisa being sick and "fussy", Deborah buying a box of wine and drinking with the neighbor, Deborah putting the fan on high in her room while her sick infant is in a room clear across the house from her.

At the very least, I think Deborah is one lousy mother.  I also think that the baby was harmed in some way, either accidentally or deliberately.  But for sure, I think these two are lying.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 12:31:15 PM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

That is a real possibility, IMO. The pictures of the birthday party show a smiling Lisa, a happy Lisa. She could've had a cold, and still have fun... but usually a kid who has a cold also has a runny nose, red nose, teary eyes, and a reddish tinge under the eyes.

Maybe the mother told people Lisa had a cold, but maybe Lisa was really hurt. I still can't believe she harmed Lisa before going into the store. Her smile on the surveillance pictures shows a happy Deborah.

Maybe something happened during the day, maybe the mother convinced herself that it was nothing, that Lisa was coming up with a cold and that she would be alright, when in reality Lisa was badly hurt.

Liam Niesen's wife died of a simple hit on the head that seemed like nothing in the beginning. A simple hit on the head can create serious effects on a person, that will develop over hours, even days.

Maybe, maybe, maybe... too many maybes. I just wish Deborah or Jeremy would come out and tell the truth.


::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 12:33:59 PM
Thanks for posting that Janet . I bolded some of the artical above. The couple gives no description of the man ..the oth witness doesn't say if the baby was ONLY in a diaper ..not enough info ..
Plus LE discounted the first sighting wonder why?

StarMonkey

I am not sure what to make of the observation by these witnesses.

I can't find it but it was my understanding that the neighbors' sighting intitially stated that the man carrying  the baby was black.

Why did the motocycle rider not come forward immediately.

+++++

Witnesses Say They Saw Man Carrying Baby Resembling Lisa Irwin
October 21st, 2011


Around 12:15 am, a couple that lives a few houses away from the family spotted the man and baby. The female witness, who spoke to ABC, said she has been interviewed by police four times about what she saw.

Three miles away and nearly four hours later, around 4 am, Mike Thompson saw a man and baby fitting a similar description at an intersection off I-435. Thompson said the man was 5’7” or 5’8” and probably in his late 30s or early 40s.

Initial media reports about Lisa’s disappearance mentioned that a man and baby had been seen on their street that night, but Thompson did not report his sighting to police until a week later.

A police spokeswoman confirmed Friday that they are still investigating the possible sightings.

<snipped>

http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2011/10/21/witnesses-say-they-saw-man-carrying-baby-resembling-lisa-irwin/?hpt=ng_mid




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 12:41:21 PM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/44997964#44997964
Baby Lisa missing two weeks now 10/22/2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 22, 2011, 12:42:01 PM
Thinking outside of the box.
What if Lisa was dead way before the morning call to police.

What if Lisa wasn't sick but dead, told Lisa's brothers she was sick and staying in bed with the door closed.

What mother would go next door to drink IF a child is sick and to the store ?

 ::MonkeyEek::

I thought of that,too!  She could have been next door at Sippy's :) with the baby monitor. ::rhino:: IMO



Bottom line, IF you have NOTHING to hide you don't change stories in midstream.
That's what is bothering me from the 3rd day and after of this investigation.

Just hope they find Lisa, so we would know what actually happened.
Also still think the cops should take the dogs to the last sighting of the guy with the baby.

 ::ghost2:: ::MonkeyEek::

You are right, But she got sippy, involved, prob, Mucho Man, (guess) and now she is in deep doo doo.  How many people are involved, in this cover-up?

She screwed-up.  Why did the dip-stick, husband (J.I.) go along with this?  He thought he would lose custody of his son, perhaps, if it was believed that his partner (DB) was neglectful.

IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 12:47:28 PM
what do you guys think of the "man walking a baby in a diaper" report?  legit?  (by the way I think Devil-rah did something definitely)  If the reports are legitimate and there was someone walking around at 4am with a baby barely dressed even it was much warmer than the attorney reported why hasn't he or someone he knows come forward saying "no not Lisa"? Embarrassed?  I don't know something about the couple a few houses down & the motorcyclist 3 miles away seeing that just doesn't ring true to me.  Why would a kidnapper walk in plain site with the baby not even wrapped up?   I can't imagine some idiot kidnapper just walking down the street with the baby for anyone passing by to see.  It's not like it is an extremely secluded area. Geez I don't know ........this case is causing me just as much stress as CA and though the circumstances are different I am feeling a sense of deja vu here.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 12:51:30 PM
Rambling Thoughts

1.  Starbucks security cameras provide an alibi for Jeremy who worked night shift for THE FIRST TIME and arrived home prior to the end of his shift.

2.  A neighbor provides an alibi for Debbie ... an inebriated Debbie who was not in any condition at 10:30 PM to have the mindset to disappear her daughter and the cellphones ... a Debbie who turned off the lights in the home prior to retiring.

Inquiring minds want to know ... when was the last time that ANYBODY seen baby Lisa?

Inquiring minds want to know ... did the neighbor actually see or hear 11 month old baby Lisa who was allegedly put to bed at 6:40 PM ... or could it be that the crib was empty.

In other words ... did something bad happen to baby Lisa prior to Debbie's evening of dringing wine?  Did something bad happen to baby Lisa prior to her father's departure to work?

Could it be that Debbie being captured on security video purchasing wine and diapers was part of a plan to put into play her drinking alibi while giving the impression that baby Lisa had not already met her demise?

Why was a polygraph not requested of Jeremy Irwin?  Jeremy may have an alibi for the night baby Lisa allegedly went missing but ... at the very least ... this guy could have had knowledge and ... at the very most ... he could have been a participant in the demise and the disappearance of his daughter in the hours prior to his departure to work.

A red flag!  Jeremy and Debbie's baby is missing but ... permission to the questioning of baby Lisa's siblings is not afforded.  Could it be that the boys witnessed an unfortunate incident in that household regarding their little sister ... an unfortunate incident that happened ... not during the night but the day before?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 12:53:54 PM
TY klaas,creepy,i have a ghost too,he goes in an out of house to the yard with me sometimes
he doesnt talk,just looks at me,when in the yard he goes behind the old shed,i look for him
and he is gone

wow, do you "sense" him or see him?  I've had a few incidents happen to me over the years that have turned me into a believer.  The most bizarre is my old hovering lady.....All my life people have seen an old woman hovering over me when I sleep (about 15 people in all - some strangers at the time).  I've seen her too.  My husband believes she was looking out for me - I reported my father for molesting foster children when my idiot family wouldn't do anything about it (and still supported him despite the 40+ kids they found).  That was almost twenty years ago and she's only been seen twice since then.  bizarre.    I keep hoping if Lisa is alive she has "someone" watching over her.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 12:55:26 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052198/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Parents-lawyer-hits-cadaver-dogs-reports.html
Smell of death picked up by police cadaver dog could be decades old, says lawyer for Baby Lisa's parents
By Daily Mail Reporter
Last updated at 5:12 PM on 22nd October 2011


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052198/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Parents-lawyer-hits-cadaver-dogs-reports.html#ixzz1bWwM5mYs


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 12:58:33 PM
Rambling Thoughts

1.  Starbucks security cameras provide an alibi for Jeremy who worked night shift for THE FIRST TIME and arrived home prior to the end of his shift.

2.  A neighbor provides an alibi for Debbie ... an inebriated Debbie who was not in any condition at 10:30 PM to have the mindset to disappear her daughter and the cellphones ... a Debbie who turned off the lights in the home prior to retiring.

Inquiring minds want to know ... when was the last time that ANYBODY seen baby Lisa?

Inquiring minds want to know ... did the neighbor actually see or hear 11 month old baby Lisa who was allegedly put to bed at 6:40 PM ... or could it be that the crib was empty.

In other words ... did something bad happen to baby Lisa prior to Debbie's evening of dringing wine?  Did something bad happen to baby Lisa prior to her father's departure to work?

Could it be that Debbie being captured on security video purchasing wine and diapers was part of a plan to put into play her drinking alibi while giving the impression that baby Lisa had not already met her demise?

Why was a polygraph not requested of Jeremy Irwin?  Jeremy may have an alibi for the night baby Lisa allegedly went missing but ... at the very least ... this guy could have had knowledge and ... at the very most ... he could have been a participant in the demise and the disappearance of his daughter in the hours prior to his departure to work.

A red flag!  Jeremy and Debbie's baby is missing but ... permission to the questioning of baby Lisa's siblings is not afforded.  Could it be that the boys witnessed an unfortunate incident in that household regarding their little sister ... an unfortunate incident that happened ... not during the night but the day before?


I agree to all.  There is NO reason why those kids should not be interviewed two three even four times.  There is not an innocent parent alive that wouldn't give their kids a big kiss & hug & say thank you for talking to the police just tell them the truth no matter what.  Not one innocent parent.  Guilty parents are a different story.

could they be hiding something that one of the older kids did?  Hit her or something?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: 4 Donks on October 22, 2011, 01:30:17 PM
http://search.isp.netscape.com/nsisp/boomframe.jsp?query=hinky+meter&page=1&offset=0&result_url=redir%3Fsrc%3Dwebsearch%26requestId%3Dac0973d63c94d9f4%26clickedItemRank%3D1%26userQuery%3Dhinky%2Bmeter%26clickedItemURN%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.thehinkymeter.com%252F%26invocationType%3D-%26fromPage%3DNSISPResultsT%26amp%3BampTest%3D1&remove_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thehinkymeter.com%2F

Lisa Irwin case: Search warrant and People details

Vals latest on Baby Lisa


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 01:40:28 PM
Ruling out nothing, I will search outside the box.

Can we assume JL belongs to the electrician's union? Was this night work at Starbucks a union job or under the table, making a few quick bucks? Wonder who owns that particular Starbucks. How long ago had that job been scheduled? Did JL finish the job quicker than anticipated and that is why he was home early? What time does Starbucks open? He had to finish before opening for the day.

Was this a one night job? Were other electricians working on this job? ANYone there that night other than JL? How do they describe his work and his behavior. Was he in a rush to get finished and get home?

How many dumpsters line the route from home to Starbucks?

Has JL done work for Starbucks before?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 02:25:11 PM
Ruling out nothing, I will search outside the box.

Can we assume JL belongs to the electrician's union? Was this night work at Starbucks a union job or under the table, making a few quick bucks? Wonder who owns that particular Starbucks. How long ago had that job been scheduled? Did JL finish the job quicker than anticipated and that is why he was home early? What time does Starbucks open? He had to finish before opening for the day.

Was this a one night job? Were other electricians working on this job? ANYone there that night other than JL? How do they describe his work and his behavior. Was he in a rush to get finished and get home?

How many dumpsters line the route from home to Starbucks?

Has JL done work for Starbucks before?

Here Vallhal says Jeremy was in a job he was supposed to be done at 10:00 pm
I'm not sure if he was on service calls? Or assigned jobs .. good questions
 http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/22/lisa-irwin-case-search-warrant-and-people-details/#more-8239



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 22, 2011, 02:26:10 PM
Ruling out nothing, I will search outside the box.

Can we assume JL belongs to the electrician's union? Was this night work at Starbucks a union job or under the table, making a few quick bucks? Wonder who owns that particular Starbucks. How long ago had that job been scheduled? Did JL finish the job quicker than anticipated and that is why he was home early? What time does Starbucks open? He had to finish before opening for the day.

Was this a one night job? Were other electricians working on this job? ANYone there that night other than JL? How do they describe his work and his behavior. Was he in a rush to get finished and get home?

How many dumpsters line the route from home to Starbucks?

Has JL done work for Starbucks before?

I believe LE has footage from Starbucks showing him working the time he said he was at that Starbucks. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 22, 2011, 02:34:51 PM
what do you guys think of the "man walking a baby in a diaper" report?  legit?  (by the way I think Devil-rah did something definitely)  If the reports are legitimate and there was someone walking around at 4am with a baby barely dressed even it was much warmer than the attorney reported why hasn't he or someone he knows come forward saying "no not Lisa"? Embarrassed?  I don't know something about the couple a few houses down & the motorcyclist 3 miles away seeing that just doesn't ring true to me.  Why would a kidnapper walk in plain site with the baby not even wrapped up?   I can't imagine some idiot kidnapper just walking down the street with the baby for anyone passing by to see.  It's not like it is an extremely secluded area. Geez I don't know ........this case is causing me just as much stress as CA and though the circumstances are different I am feeling a sense of deja vu here.

It's my opinion the 'baby' sighted was not 'wrapped up' so anyone seeing them would be sure to report a 'baby'...  Why?  Wow...  Too many possibilities to list. 

Also - do we even know it was a baby? Or a doll?

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: 4 Donks on October 22, 2011, 02:46:51 PM
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/22/lisa-irwin-case-search-warrant-and-people-details/#more-8239

Lisa Irwin case: Search warrant and People details

Val's latest


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 03:16:22 PM
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/breaking/132368633.html?cmpid=15585797
Posted on Sat, Oct. 22, 2011
Police: Cadaver dog 'hit' at missing baby's home
HEATHER HOLLINGSWORTH
The Associated Press

(http://media.philly.com/images/300*416/42568bc4-b5a2-4fbc-9f60-ddf8bd58fabc.jpg)
Orlin Wagner
A Kansas City Police crime scene investigator carries items from the home of missing baby Lisa Irwin in Kansas City, Mo., Wednesday, Oct. 19, 2011. (AP Photo/Orlin Wagner)
KANSAS CITY, Mo. - Police say an FBI cadaver dog reacted to the scent of a dead person inside the Kansas City home where a baby girl disappeared nearly three weeks ago, and investigators discovered soil in the backyard that had been "recently disturbed or overturned," according to a released court document.

The affidavit, released Friday after being filed earlier this week in support of a search warrant targeting the family's home, also stated that the girl's mother, Deborah Bradley, "made the statement she did not initially look for her baby behind the house because she `was afraid of what she might find.'"
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 03:50:33 PM
what do you guys think of the "man walking a baby in a diaper" report?  legit?  (by the way I think Devil-rah did something definitely)  If the reports are legitimate and there was someone walking around at 4am with a baby barely dressed even it was much warmer than the attorney reported why hasn't he or someone he knows come forward saying "no not Lisa"? Embarrassed?  I don't know something about the couple a few houses down & the motorcyclist 3 miles away seeing that just doesn't ring true to me.  Why would a kidnapper walk in plain site with the baby not even wrapped up?   I can't imagine some idiot kidnapper just walking down the street with the baby for anyone passing by to see.  It's not like it is an extremely secluded area. Geez I don't know ........this case is causing me just as much stress as CA and though the circumstances are different I am feeling a sense of deja vu here.

It's my opinion the 'baby' sighted was not 'wrapped up' so anyone seeing them would be sure to report a 'baby'...  Why?  Wow...  Too many possibilities to list. 

Also - do we even know it was a baby? Or a doll?

~ fanta
My 1st thought, why didn't the first hubby just wait and follow him to see if everything was ok.  Or at least talk to him.
People don't want to be involved.....I guess.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Wildingheart on October 22, 2011, 03:51:36 PM
I am not around that often, and am trying my best to keep my distance from this case...but when I am around...I am here reading. Even though I'm not a very faithful poster, I still admire you guys and all that you do.

I don't see how you stand it, and I know without a doubt the only reason you stay with it is because there is a chance you might do some good.

My heart is sick over this child...especially since it's coming on the heels of Caylee, Zahra and many other precious lives that have been so brutally cut short.

I am praying for Lisa and also all of you, because anyone who can do this day to day deserves prayers and praise.

I am literally shaking all over as I type this...I have no idea why it is affecting me this way. This isn't a healthy frame of mind, but I just can't seem to overcome it. Peace to you all and God Bless.

My Blog:
http://moonsmuse.blogspot.com/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 04:16:21 PM
what do you guys think of the "man walking a baby in a diaper" report?  legit?  (by the way I think Devil-rah did something definitely)  If the reports are legitimate and there was someone walking around at 4am with a baby barely dressed even it was much warmer than the attorney reported why hasn't he or someone he knows come forward saying "no not Lisa"? Embarrassed?  I don't know something about the couple a few houses down & the motorcyclist 3 miles away seeing that just doesn't ring true to me.  Why would a kidnapper walk in plain site with the baby not even wrapped up?   I can't imagine some idiot kidnapper just walking down the street with the baby for anyone passing by to see.  It's not like it is an extremely secluded area. Geez I don't know ........this case is causing me just as much stress as CA and though the circumstances are different I am feeling a sense of deja vu here.

It's my opinion the 'baby' sighted was not 'wrapped up' so anyone seeing them would be sure to report a 'baby'...  Why?  Wow...  Too many possibilities to list. 

Also - do we even know it was a baby? Or a doll?

~ fanta
My 1st thought, why didn't the first hubby just wait and follow him to see if everything was ok.  Or at least talk to him.

People don't want to be involved.....I guess. ::MonkeyNoNo::

I don't think so.  There was a baby obviously at risk.

If I were to see a man walking down iye street in the middle of the night in 42 degree temperature carrying an unclothed baby ... I probably would never suspect any wrongdoing but ... I would definitely know that something was wrong and ... doing something to assist would be my first reaction.

Janet


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 22, 2011, 04:17:13 PM
lye stree s/b our street


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 22, 2011, 04:30:24 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/EricKCTV5)
EricKCTV5 Eric Chaloux
The NY lawyer for family of #lisairwin speaks out on cadaver dog hit. More at 10 and on KCTV5.com
4 minutes ago


(http://media.kansascity.com/smedia/2011/10/17/15/10/8Qb3G.St.81.jpg)
Slip of tongue or attorney-client privlege?
“These are two parents who are grieving every day over the loss of their daughter,” he [Joe Tacopina]said.
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/17/3212350/mother-tells-today-show-she-was.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 22, 2011, 04:31:23 PM
Fort Bragg case offers eerie parallels to Lisa Irwin's disappearance
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/21/3222111/case-offers-eerie-parallels.html (http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/21/3222111/case-offers-eerie-parallels.html)

 ::snipping2::

Quote
Deborah Bradley, mother of Lisa, lived at a residence at Fort Bragg, N.C., a little over a mile away from the home where the other infant, Harmony Jade Creech, “disappeared.”

Bradley, the bloggers contend, must have known about the other case. After all, her husband then was a private in the 82nd Airborne, the same unit as the victim’s father.

“After reading the (Deja Vu) post, it sounds like it was a copy cat…,” opined one man, identifying himself as a relative of the North Carolina victim.

An eerie coincidence, yes, one that Kansas City police say they have not missed.


Hmmmm...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 22, 2011, 04:32:39 PM
I am not around that often, and am trying my best to keep my distance from this case...but when I am around...I am here reading. Even though I'm not a very faithful poster, I still admire you guys and all that you do.

I don't see how you stand it, and I know without a doubt the only reason you stay with it is because there is a chance you might do some good.

My heart is sick over this child...especially since it's coming on the heels of Caylee, Zahra and many other precious lives that have been so brutally cut short.

I am praying for Lisa and also all of you, because anyone who can do this day to day deserves prayers and praise.

I am literally shaking all over as I type this...I have no idea why it is affecting me this way. This isn't a healthy frame of mind, but I just can't seem to overcome it. Peace to you all and God Bless.

My Blog:
http://moonsmuse.blogspot.com/

thank u for stopping by - every prayer helps those who need it



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 22, 2011, 04:34:14 PM
Oct. 2nd baby seen in photos at grandparents house
Oct 3rd - Lisa, who will turn 1 on Nov. 11, has not been seen since Monday, Oct. 3.
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/lisa-irwin-family-to-hold-230-pm-news-conference#ixzz1bXjBsoED
Oct. 4th baby reported kidnapped


She said she didn't have more than 10 glasses. Bradley said she frequently drinks heavily at home but only after her children are safely in bed. She also said she takes anxiety medication and had taken a dose that day.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/17/baby-lisa-irwins-parents-joe-tacopina_n_1016594.html

this better not be a post-partum depression defense




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 22, 2011, 04:44:05 PM
jtacopina@tacopinalaw.com
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=7363.1620

 ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 22, 2011, 04:55:29 PM
Oct. 2nd baby seen in photos at grandparents house
Oct 3rd - Lisa, who will turn 1 on Nov. 11, has not been seen since Monday, Oct. 3.
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/lisa-irwin-family-to-hold-230-pm-news-conference#ixzz1bXjBsoED
Oct. 4th baby reported kidnapped


She said she didn't have more than 10 glasses. Bradley said she frequently drinks heavily at home but only after her children are safely in bed. She also said she takes anxiety medication and had taken a dose that day.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/17/baby-lisa-irwins-parents-joe-tacopina_n_1016594.html

this better not be a post-partum depression defense




I wonder what size (how many ozs.) the glass she was drinking wine from was?  Was she drinking from a wine glass that held 5 ounces?  Was she drinking from a larger glass?  Is she saying she knocked back an amount of wine that would equal 2 bottles of wine?  And what about mixing her anti depressant meds with all the alchohol?  Does that dilute or enhance the anti -depressant? 

http://www.winespectator.com/webfeature/show/id/Health-QA-How-Many-Ounces-is-a-Glass-of-Wine_3588
Robert J. Mills, of the American Medical Association, reports that in the United States, the medical community generally accepts these guidelines outlined by the Center for Disease Control and Prevention: "A standard drink is any drink that contains about half an ounce (13.7 grams or 1.2 tablespoons) of pure alcohol. Generally, this amount of pure alcohol is found in 5 ounces of wine." To put this in perspective, since a bottle of wine is 750ml, or 25 ounces, there are around 5 glasses of wine in a bottle.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 05:09:48 PM
This video must be when Jeremy and Deborah sped away after this. Jeremy looks distraught!
 http://m.bing.com:80/videos/watch?v=5a05737d-df60-4409-a394-61c7d730c273&mid=10006&form=VDXVAR

If you hit the back key after video theres more videos . One with the black car was Oct 7 I think.. parents were not coop would not talk to media. Jeremy sister made a statement Oct 6 or 7 For the family saying that they are cooperating. I don't believe they have since the 6th..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 22, 2011, 05:16:19 PM
This video must be when Jeremy and Deborah sped away after this. Jeremy looks distraught!
 http://m.bing.com:80/videos/watch?v=5a05737d-df60-4409-a394-61c7d730c273&mid=10006&form=VDXVAR

If you hit the back key after video theres more videos . One with the black car was Oct 7 I think.. parents were not coop would not talk to media. Jeremy sister made a statement Oct 6 or 7 For the family saying that they are cooperating. I don't believe they have since the 6th..

The link wouldn't work for me


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 22, 2011, 05:17:36 PM
I apologize if this has been posted already but here's a informative article about cadaver dogs:
http://dogsdontlie.com/main/2008/12/cadaver-dogs-how-reliable-are-they-at-detecting-death/ (http://dogsdontlie.com/main/2008/12/cadaver-dogs-how-reliable-are-they-at-detecting-death/)



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 05:34:17 PM
This video must be when Jeremy and Deborah sped away after this. Jeremy looks distraught!
 http://m.bing.com:80/videos/watch?v=5a05737d-df60-4409-a394-61c7d730c273&mid=10006&form=VDXVAR

If you hit the back key after video theres more videos . One with the black car was Oct 7 I think.. parents were not coop would not talk to media. Jeremy sister made a statement Oct 6 or 7 For the family saying that they are cooperating. I don't believe they have since the 6th..

The link wouldn't work for me
Sorry maybe because of app on my phone it worked for me.
I found another link
 http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DU5oPk8ebfLw&v=U5oPk8ebfLw&gl=US


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 22, 2011, 05:43:12 PM
I am not around that often, and am trying my best to keep my distance from this case...but when I am around...I am here reading. Even though I'm not a very faithful poster, I still admire you guys and all that you do.

I don't see how you stand it, and I know without a doubt the only reason you stay with it is because there is a chance you might do some good.

My heart is sick over this child...especially since it's coming on the heels of Caylee, Zahra and many other precious lives that have been so brutally cut short.

I am praying for Lisa and also all of you, because anyone who can do this day to day deserves prayers and praise.

I am literally shaking all over as I type this...I have no idea why it is affecting me this way. This isn't a healthy frame of mind, but I just can't seem to overcome it. Peace to you all and God Bless.

My Blog:
http://moonsmuse.blogspot.com/

Wildingheart, I just came back here recently myself since the Caylee Anothony case. I finally found the strength, even though I am still not completely over it. I cannot understand what is wrong with the world when parents not only kill their children, but it's worse to know Casey is walking free. Anyway, I just wanted to respond and say that I am glad you chimed in. :-)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Anna on October 22, 2011, 05:57:02 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 05:59:22 PM
Video at link shows footage from last night's prayer vigil.
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15768295/family-of-lisa-irwin
Affidavit says cadaver dog indicated positive 'hit' in home
Posted: Oct 21, 2011 1:12 PM CDT Updated: Oct 21, 2011 6:12 PM CDT




(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/thumb/10/29417453850.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/514422/4805959)

(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/thumb/10/29417551615.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/514444/9959862)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 06:23:18 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/nationworld/sns-rt-us-crime-baby-missingtre79l22f-20111022,0,3176654.story
Attorney discounts cadaver dog's alert in missing baby probe
Reuters
5:13 p.m. CDT, October 22, 2011

KANSAS CITY, Mo (Reuters) - A lawyer for parents of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin downplayed on Saturday the significance of a cadaver dog's alert that may have signified the scent of a dead body in the Irwin home.

Court documents showed on Friday that an FBI cadaver dog had picked up the scent of a deceased person in the bedroom of Deborah Bradley, the mother of the missing Missouri baby, earlier in the week.

Lawyer Cyndy Short told ABC's "Good Morning America" in an interview aired Saturday that smells from a dead body can remain in a location for many years.

"My understanding is that there are cold cases where dogs have hit on scents of decomposition that have been in the home for as long as 28 years," Short told "Good Morning America."

"This is an old home, 63 years old. There could be a lot of other explanations for that."
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 06:47:22 PM
Since Le took the bedroom carpet, I'm sure they can get dna from it and find out who's it is.
Did the wide mom give samples to do dna testing to the police?
 ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 06:56:37 PM
what do you guys think of the "man walking a baby in a diaper" report?  legit?  (by the way I think Devil-rah did something definitely)  If the reports are legitimate and there was someone walking around at 4am with a baby barely dressed even it was much warmer than the attorney reported why hasn't he or someone he knows come forward saying "no not Lisa"? Embarrassed?  I don't know something about the couple a few houses down & the motorcyclist 3 miles away seeing that just doesn't ring true to me.  Why would a kidnapper walk in plain site with the baby not even wrapped up?   I can't imagine some idiot kidnapper just walking down the street with the baby for anyone passing by to see.  It's not like it is an extremely secluded area. Geez I don't know ........this case is causing me just as much stress as CA and though the circumstances are different I am feeling a sense of deja vu here.

It's my opinion the 'baby' sighted was not 'wrapped up' so anyone seeing them would be sure to report a 'baby'...  Why?  Wow...  Too many possibilities to list. 

Also - do we even know it was a baby? Or a doll?

~ fanta
My 1st thought, why didn't the first hubby just wait and follow him to see if everything was ok.  Or at least talk to him.
People don't want to be involved.....I guess.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

yep, look at the toddler hit & run video from China - I cried when I watched the video & even more when I found out she died.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 07:00:14 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 22, 2011, 07:03:38 PM
I am not around that often, and am trying my best to keep my distance from this case...but when I am around...I am here reading. Even though I'm not a very faithful poster, I still admire you guys and all that you do.

I don't see how you stand it, and I know without a doubt the only reason you stay with it is because there is a chance you might do some good.

My heart is sick over this child...especially since it's coming on the heels of Caylee, Zahra and many other precious lives that have been so brutally cut short.

I am praying for Lisa and also all of you, because anyone who can do this day to day deserves prayers and praise.

I am literally shaking all over as I type this...I have no idea why it is affecting me this way. This isn't a healthy frame of mind, but I just can't seem to overcome it. Peace to you all and God Bless.

My Blog:
http://moonsmuse.blogspot.com/

Wildingheart, I just came back here recently myself since the Caylee Anothony case. I finally found the strength, even though I am still not completely over it. I cannot understand what is wrong with the world when parents not only kill their children, but it's worse to know Casey is walking free. Anyway, I just wanted to respond and say that I am glad you chimed in. :-)

HI Stayhomemommy, me too.  I had to stop watching the news I was so upset (still am) and disgusted with our justice system as well as parents.  Heck my own mother had to have known her husband was molesting foster children in their house.  Two kids told her.  I even told her and she refused to believe it.  Some people are just evil and some people are too weak to do anything about it.  It just infuriates those of us who are on the right "side". Nice to see your post (again)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 22, 2011, 07:16:08 PM
Wildingheart, I just came back here recently myself since the Caylee Anothony case. I finally found the strength, even though I am still not completely over it. I cannot understand what is wrong with the world when parents not only kill their children, but it's worse to know Casey is walking free. Anyway, I just wanted to respond and say that I am glad you chimed in. :-)

HI Stayhomemommy, me too.  I had to stop watching the news I was so upset (still am) and disgusted with our justice system as well as parents.  Heck my own mother had to have known her husband was molesting foster children in their house.  Two kids told her.  I even told her and she refused to believe it.  Some people are just evil and some people are too weak to do anything about it.  It just infuriates those of us who are on the right "side". Nice to see your post (again)

Beth, nice to see you, too. Yes, yes. I even downgraded my satelitte service so I don't even get headline news anymore. I just cannot follow anything as closely as I did the CA case. It is shocking how many people won't believe (or don't want to believe) when they are confronted with so much evidence (as in the case of your mother, so sorry, by the way). I had friend from junior high school who was being molested, and no one believed her, even the school counselors, for a LONG time. Finally, one believed her, and she got out. But went into foster care where she was further abused. It's awful. Just awful.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 07:52:12 PM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29
Bumping for a reminder.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 08:17:03 PM
 ::snipping2::

The argument already concocted by attorneys claim that scent dogs can hit on human decomposition as old as 28 years. That is quite true, attesting to the credibility of the use of these exceptional canines. However, these dogs are also trained to smell even the skin particles in the air.

Even though the home, which is 64-years old, could be the setting for crimes almost 30-years ago, it doesn't change the fact that this is an investigation and the dogs did in fact hit to the scent of a dead body. Furthermore, it isn't always "decomposition" that these dogs hit on -- not in the sense of a literally rotting body. Dead skin particles begin to decompose immediately and a dog's keen sense of smell picks this up with no problem.

http://news.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474980637561


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 22, 2011, 08:37:20 PM


The houses with the underground tunnels are North from the Irwins - in Sherwood Estates. 
Thanks for that info, although as I understand it the tunnel usage involved several neighborhoods.  Also that they were mainly used to avoid surveillance.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cecilita on October 22, 2011, 09:01:16 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 22, 2011, 09:06:55 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: alagary on October 22, 2011, 09:10:59 PM
Has anyone seen how long after death until a body gives off scent that he dogs can detect?
o/t for stayathomemommy and the rest of he cableless,most news channel links here work;
http://worldtvsite.net/usa.html
 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 09:12:01 PM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29
Bumping for a reminder.

Watching it now, between claps of thunder and lightning.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cecilita on October 22, 2011, 09:19:01 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 
If the baby was a dead Lisa, it is obvious that they didn't have a car. Propably they didn't want to connect anything with the house (plastic bags, towels, etc) if police find Lisa body....  I believe to carry a plastic bag with a body in it will look very suspicious if somebody see them walking early in the morning.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 09:24:58 PM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29
Bumping for a reminder.

Watching it now, between claps of thunder and lightning.



I agree with the discussion regarding weight given to decision to tell the world about drinking and not having a clue whether or not DB even checked on Lisa. "She is lying for a reason."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 09:33:30 PM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29
Bumping for a reminder.

Watching it now, between claps of thunder and lightning.



I agree with the discussion regarding weight given to decision to tell the world about drinking and not having a clue whether or not DB even checked on Lisa. "She is lying for a reason."


Taco: "When DB and JL realized Lisa was gone, JL went across the street to see if Lisa was there."

We have not heard that before. Up to this point, the story was, "JL went to a neighbor's house asking for help."


IF and that is a big IF, DB really was blotto, it would make sense JL might think Sippy Neighbor took Lisa home with her to make sure she was taken care of.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 22, 2011, 09:33:55 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 
If the baby was a dead Lisa, it is obvious that they didn't have a car. Propably they didn't want to connect anything with the house (plastic bags, towels, etc) if police find Lisa body....  I believe to carry a plastic bag with a body in it will look very suspicious if somebody see them walking early in the morning.

I think it's wied in the middle of the night too....Life is sure stranger then fiction.
Why would ANYONE do that???    ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 22, 2011, 09:34:42 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 
If the baby was a dead Lisa, it is obvious that they didn't have a car. Propably they didn't want to connect anything with the house (plastic bags, towels, etc) if police find Lisa body....  I believe to carry a plastic bag with a body in it will look very suspicious if somebody see them walking early in the morning.

I'm bringing this over, in case someone missed it from the previous thread:

Quote
Check the distance of the Randolph and 48th intersection from the Irwins' address. Just too far for someone to steal a 30 pound baby and carry it for miles.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=209942082992863047244.0004ae79b21a5bcdbda87&msa=0&ll=39.180535,-94.491906&spn=0.006387,0.016179

Map borrowed from http://www.websleuths.com


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 22, 2011, 09:39:13 PM
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 
If the baby was a dead Lisa, it is obvious that they didn't have a car. Propably they didn't want to connect anything with the house (plastic bags, towels, etc) if police find Lisa body....  I believe to carry a plastic bag with a body in it will look very suspicious if somebody see them walking early in the morning.
Just thinking.... but if God forbid I found my baby dead by accident or negligance and panicked then decided to stage a kidnapping I would think that I would probably wrap/swaddle my baby in one of her blankets.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 09:45:45 PM
Judge Jeanine Pirro Is Live in Kansas City, Missouri With the Latest on Baby Lisa Irwin..

The search for Baby Lisa continues and Judge Jeanine Pirro is live at the crime scene with insight, analysis and the latest in the investigation.

Plus, body language expert Tonya Reiman looks at Baby Lisa’s parents and reveals what they aren’t telling.

Catch a must-see Justice with Judge Jeanine, tonight at 9p ET.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/22/judge-jeanine-pirro-is-live-in-kansas-city-missouri-with-the-latest-on-baby-lisa-irwin/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29
Bumping for a reminder.

Watching it now, between claps of thunder and lightning.



I agree with the discussion regarding weight given to decision to tell the world about drinking and not having a clue whether or not DB even checked on Lisa. "She is lying for a reason."


Taco: "When DB and JL realized Lisa was gone, JL went across the street to see if Lisa was there."

We have not heard that before. Up to this point, the story was, "JL went to a neighbor's house asking for help."

Judge Janine: "They (DB and JL) told me three times, when asked if someone could have climbed through the window, "NO."

Twelve days later when asked the same question, DB said, "Absolutely not."

Wild Bill talks of a witness who continued to watch the house from 10:30 to 11:00 and that neighbor said lights remained out.


IF and that is a big IF, DB really was blotto, it would make sense JL might think Sippy Neighbor took Lisa home with her to make sure she was taken care of.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 09:46:26 PM
I put some maps in the map thread..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 22, 2011, 09:52:37 PM
I put some maps in the map thread..

Thank you JG


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 10:01:47 PM
I put some maps in the map thread..

Thank you JG

YW MuffyBee..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 10:11:30 PM
 ::ghost2::
I, too, wonder if it was a real baby or a doll that was seen out in the cold.  If it was a real baby, was the baby drugged so as not to cry in that cold?

Also, I would have thought police could speak with the two brothers without parental consent.  Seems totally odd to me that they can't.

You know I"m doubting whether they really saw what they're reporting.  I know in our neighborhood people were reporting kids in tshirts in the late fall running in streets.  I even saw them.  Turned out to be deer but because there were no street lights I saw them too & "assumed" it was kids.  yep we're all idiots lol
maybe the baby was already dead. If that day was cold why the man only had a t-shirt and not a jacket? it can be possible that they took off lisa's clothes and hide them somewhere before to dispposed her body.

If the baby was in fact Lisa, why would anyone carry her out in the open?  How hard would it have been to toss a towel or pillow case over her or something?  It's not making sense to me.  It would take only one reliable person to witness this, if it were Lisa being carried.  Why risk it? 
If the baby was a dead Lisa, it is obvious that they didn't have a car. Propably they didn't want to connect anything with the house (plastic bags, towels, etc) if police find Lisa body....  I believe to carry a plastic bag with a body in it will look very suspicious if somebody see them walking early in the morning.

I think it's wied in the middle of the night too....Life is sure stranger then fiction.
Why would ANYONE do that???    ::MonkeyShocked::

Maybe thy thought no one would see them?

If the dumpster fire had anything to do with it (which i think it did)maybe?
What would they have burned?
The dumpster fire was over an hour b4 Jeremy called 911 (he said he didn't witness anything)Wierd.
LE searched area 4 times near the dumpster and 3 at the landfill.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 22, 2011, 10:11:34 PM
If I remember correctly, the search turned up Lisa's purple shorts. That might explain the "nothing but a diaper" theory. DB said Lisa was wearing the purple shorts that last time she saw her. Wonder why a baby would sleep in uncomfortable clothing instead of pajamas/sleepers?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 22, 2011, 10:31:54 PM
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/22/3223385/prayers-continue-for-baby-lisa.html#ixzz1bZDgeEpt
Posted on Sat, Oct. 22, 2011 08:29 PM
Prayers continue for missing infant Lisa Irwin

In a circle around the front yard flagpole on North Lister Avenue early this evening, supporters of missing baby Lisa Irwin prayed once again for her family and for Lisa’s safe return.

About 20 people held hands and sang Kumbaya, swaying to the tune and the words, “someone’s crying, Lord” and “someone’s praying, Lord.”

“I picked those verses of the song because we’re all praying and we’re all crying,” said Edith Fine-Duskin, who led the group. She said those who gather every night in front of the Irwin home consider themselves “Baby Lisa’s angels.”

“If you can’t be here, we ask that you say a prayer every night from wherever you are,” Fine-Duskin said.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/22/3223385/prayers-continue-for-baby-lisa.html#ixzz1bZHRYyFc


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 10:36:34 PM
I am speechless after listening to Taco and Meathead on Justice with Judge Jeanine.. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: AZSunny on October 22, 2011, 10:40:50 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/nationworld/sns-rt-us-crime-baby-missingtre79l22f-20111022,0,3176654.story
Attorney discounts cadaver dog's alert in missing baby probe
Reuters
5:13 p.m. CDT, October 22, 2011

KANSAS CITY, Mo (Reuters) - A lawyer for parents of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin downplayed on Saturday the significance of a cadaver dog's alert that may have signified the scent of a dead body in the Irwin home.

Court documents showed on Friday that an FBI cadaver dog had picked up the scent of a deceased person in the bedroom of Deborah Bradley, the mother of the missing Missouri baby, earlier in the week.

Lawyer Cyndy Short told ABC's "Good Morning America" in an interview aired Saturday that smells from a dead body can remain in a location for many years.

"My understanding is that there are cold cases where dogs have hit on scents of decomposition that have been in the home for as long as 28 years," Short told "Good Morning America."

"This is an old home, 63 years old. There could be a lot of other explanations for that."
 ::snipping2::

And the carpet is 63 years old?  I don't think so.  Perhaps below the carpet, but they took the carpet.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 22, 2011, 10:42:19 PM
I was searching a little looking for recent news from today on baby Lisa, when I came across this article

Geraldo on Search for Baby Lisa Irwin: “It’s Virtually Impossible This Is Not an Inside Job”
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/14/geraldo-on-search-for-baby-lisa-irwin-%e2%80%9cit%e2%80%99s-virtually-impossible-this-is-not-an-inside-job%e2%80%9d/

Wonder if he is trying to redeem himself after CA  ::boxinggeraldo2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 10:43:41 PM
Who has a 63 yr old carpet!? Wow!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 22, 2011, 10:48:38 PM
I am speechless after listening to Taco and Meathead on Justice with Judge Jeanine.. ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyJnBox::      All we need now is Geraldo.   


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 22, 2011, 10:50:10 PM
Who has a 63 yr old carpet!? Wow!
Besides that house was built it 1958 he calc wrong.
You would think that thy can tell if its that old?

When you see the pic of it doesn't look stained on bottem?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 22, 2011, 10:57:14 PM
I was searching a little looking for recent news from today on baby Lisa, when I came across this article

Geraldo on Search for Baby Lisa Irwin: “It’s Virtually Impossible This Is Not an Inside Job”
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/14/geraldo-on-search-for-baby-lisa-irwin-%e2%80%9cit%e2%80%99s-virtually-impossible-this-is-not-an-inside-job%e2%80%9d/

Wonder if he is trying to redeem himself after CA  ::boxinggeraldo2::

He's shrewdly changing positions for the camera.  What is so galling to me is his smugness.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 22, 2011, 10:57:17 PM
I am speechless after listening to Taco and Meathead on Justice with Judge Jeanine.. ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyJnBox::      All we need now is Geraldo.   

No-o-o-o-o!!!   Not him!   I expect him any time, though.   ::boxinggeraldo2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jazzy on October 22, 2011, 11:01:04 PM
I am speechless after listening to Taco and Meathead on Justice with Judge Jeanine.. ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyJnBox::      All we need now is Geraldo.   

No-o-o-o-o!!!   Not him!   I expect him any time, though.   ::boxinggeraldo2::
Well looks like he has started talking about the case, and doesnt sound like its for the parents side either i just couldnt take reading anything that person says since CA's case  But looks like hes here


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 11:18:34 PM
O/T...

Posted: Oct 22, 2011 9:45 PM EDT Updated: Oct 22, 2011 10:46 PM EDT
Posted by Jessica Turri

DOVER, TN (WSMV) -

Police in Stewart County are searching for a missing 5 year old boy who was last seen playing outside near his home around 4:30 p.m.

Officials say Aidan Bennett was last seen near the 900 block of Link Road in Dover.

He has dirty blond hair, weighs 35 lbs., and was last seen wearing a blue and black long sleeve shirt, dark brown windbreaker pants, and no shoes.

Anyone with  information is urged to call the Stewart County Sheriff's Department at 931-232-5322.

http://www.wsmv.com/story/15786451/police-seraching-for-missing-boy


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 22, 2011, 11:21:41 PM
I am speechless after listening to Taco and Meathead on Justice with Judge Jeanine.. ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyJnBox::      All we need now is Geraldo.   

No-o-o-o-o!!!   Not him!   I expect him any time, though.   ::boxinggeraldo2::

LOL - he's timing his appearances I bet - waiting to spring!   Can our nerves take it is the big question.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 22, 2011, 11:28:16 PM
I'm still going with the two half brothers of Lisa's know the missing puzzle pieces.

I also tend to discount the validity of the "stranger carrying baby down the street in the night" stories.  Maybe these are
mis-guided friends of the Irwins trying to bolster the kidnapping scenario thinking they are helping ???


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: starshadow on October 22, 2011, 11:33:24 PM
Actual scientific study regarding cadaver dogs here: http://www.pawsoflife.org/Library/HRD/Oesterhelweg%201998.pdf

Accuracy varies from 75%-90%... meaning if this were a real-life situation, 10-25% of the time, the dog would be wrong.

And there's potentially far greater dog error in real-life situations, because in the study, the dogs only had two possibilities - scented-with-dead-person, or not-scented-with-dead-person.

There *are* other scents that yes, the dogs will smell - and they will give a false "positive" for, just as if they *were* smelling a decomposed body. Menstrual blood is one of these things. In that case, the dog isn't wrong - it IS identifying a scent. It's just close enough to what they've been taught to seek that they cannot differentiate.

I'd be curious to see real-life statistics of how often a hit is confirmed to be a true hit; problem is, law enforcement won't permit that to happen. They'd claim secrecy was necessary to preserve cases, of course, but really, they just wouldn't want to lose the power to pressure via public belief in questionable "science".


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 22, 2011, 11:38:04 PM
I'm still going with the two half brothers of Lisa's know the missing puzzle pieces.

I also tend to discount the validity of the "stranger carrying baby down the street in the night" stories.  Maybe these are
mis-guided friends of the Irwins trying to bolster the kidnapping scenario thinking they are helping ???

I agree.. Who is going to kidnap a child and be walking down a street with a child dressed in just a diaper in plain sight....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 22, 2011, 11:56:14 PM
O/T...

Posted: Oct 22, 2011 9:45 PM EDT Updated: Oct 22, 2011 10:46 PM EDT
Posted by Jessica Turri

DOVER, TN (WSMV) -

Police in Stewart County are searching for a missing 5 year old boy who was last seen playing outside near his home around 4:30 p.m.

Officials say Aidan Bennett was last seen near the 900 block of Link Road in Dover.

He has dirty blond hair, weighs 35 lbs., and was last seen wearing a blue and black long sleeve shirt, dark brown windbreaker pants, and no shoes.

Anyone with  information is urged to call the Stewart County Sheriff's Department at 931-232-5322.

http://www.wsmv.com/story/15786451/police-seraching-for-missing-boy
Thanks Jersey~
Good news for a change:
FOUND SAFE
::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::
Missing Stewart County boy found safe

Posted: Oct 22, 2011 8:45 PM CDT Updated: Oct 22, 2011 10:39 PM CDT
Posted by Jessica Turri - email
 
http://www.wsmv.com/story/15786451/missing-boy  (http://www.wsmv.com/story/15786451/missing-boy)
DOVER, TN (WSMV) -

Police in Stewart County have safely located the 5 year old boy who went missing near his home in Dover Saturday afternoon.

Aidan Bennett was last seen near the 900 block of Link Road in Dover around 4:30 p.m.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Anna on October 23, 2011, 12:02:52 AM
I'm still going with the two half brothers of Lisa's know the missing puzzle pieces.

I also tend to discount the validity of the "stranger carrying baby down the street in the night" stories.  Maybe these are
mis-guided friends of the Irwins trying to bolster the kidnapping scenario thinking they are helping ???


It's strange the police are not even questioning the other children who were present.  I don't recall ever seeing that happen before.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 12:07:33 AM
I'm still going with the two half brothers of Lisa's know the missing puzzle pieces.

I also tend to discount the validity of the "stranger carrying baby down the street in the night" stories.  Maybe these are
mis-guided friends of the Irwins trying to bolster the kidnapping scenario thinking they are helping ???


It's strange the police are not even questioning the other children who were present.  I don't recall ever seeing that happen before.
Parents won't let them.  LE has no choice.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 23, 2011, 12:36:06 AM
 https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/296089_2101178121358_1002580334_32163328_1448706288_n.jpg (https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/296089_2101178121358_1002580334_32163328_1448706288_n.jpg)

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/296089_2101178121358_1002580334_32163328_1448706288_n.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Gypsy DD on October 23, 2011, 02:39:41 AM
Actual scientific study regarding cadaver dogs here: http://www.pawsoflife.org/Library/HRD/Oesterhelweg%201998.pdf

Accuracy varies from 75%-90%... meaning if this were a real-life situation, 10-25% of the time, the dog would be wrong.

And there's potentially far greater dog error in real-life situations, because in the study, the dogs only had two possibilities - scented-with-dead-person, or not-scented-with-dead-person.

There *are* other scents that yes, the dogs will smell - and they will give a false "positive" for, just as if they *were* smelling a decomposed body. Menstrual blood is one of these things. In that case, the dog isn't wrong - it IS identifying a scent. It's just close enough to what they've been taught to seek that they cannot differentiate.

I'd be curious to see real-life statistics of how often a hit is confirmed to be a true hit; problem is, law enforcement won't permit that to happen. They'd claim secrecy was necessary to preserve cases, of course, but really, they just wouldn't want to lose the power to pressure via public belief in questionable "science".
[/b]

BBM
Now there'shere I must disagree with ypou.  LE are not the only people that use cadaver dogs..many times in the missing person cases here private individuals and groups ave used their dogs ..and they all seem to detect the same thing.  So just because these dogs are used by LE does not change the end result.  I trust the dogs..they are right.even by your stats.. more then they are wrong.  And they have been invaluable over the years in soving crimes and locating bodies..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 02:53:55 AM
Who has a 63 yr old carpet!? Wow!

Oh I needed that laugh this morning!  Thank you so much! 

*still chuckling*

Sad thing is after all this time we all need a little laugh.  This whole story is just so heartbreaking.

Hang in there everyone!

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 23, 2011, 03:06:33 AM
O/T...

Posted: Oct 22, 2011 9:45 PM EDT Updated: Oct 22, 2011 10:46 PM EDT
Posted by Jessica Turri

DOVER, TN (WSMV) -

Police in Stewart County are searching for a missing 5 year old boy who was last seen playing outside near his home around 4:30 p.m.

Officials say Aidan Bennett was last seen near the 900 block of Link Road in Dover.

He has dirty blond hair, weighs 35 lbs., and was last seen wearing a blue and black long sleeve shirt, dark brown windbreaker pants, and no shoes.

Anyone with  information is urged to call the Stewart County Sheriff's Department at 931-232-5322.

http://www.wsmv.com/story/15786451/police-seraching-for-missing-boy

I swear this world is going crazy!  Desperate for a kid?  go through infertility, adopt or get a puppy.  Mad at your spouse? Get a divorce.  Depressed? Meds  Weird "urges"? Castration.  Need money?  McDonald's is hiring.  Good grief.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: beth1970 on October 23, 2011, 03:08:07 AM
Who has a 63 yr old carpet!? Wow!

my mother in law!  It's actually from 1970.  She literally has it professionally cleaned every 6 months.  It's a beautiful orange/brown shag (no joke)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: starshadow on October 23, 2011, 03:33:49 AM
invaluable over the years in soving crimes and locating bodies..

They *can* be valuable in suggesting an area for further investigation, but they are by no means foolproof, and data - actual fact, as opposed to popular opinion - says that cadaver dogs are at best, embryonic science, and at worst, pseudoscience.

I appreciate the passion present here, but there isn't much in the way of hard facts to go on, and the facts are what counts.

When the best case scenario is that dogs are only wrong 1/4 of the time in ideal circumstances where there is no possibility of ambiguous scents, it's not reasonable to assume the answer has been found.

Also, if anyone has any details on what dog group it was that brought in at least one cocker spaniel, I'd be interested in hearing more details. I'm curious what they had that dog searching for, since so far, I haven't found anything to suggest that cockers are used as cadaver dogs - drug sniffers, food- product sniffers, even money sniffers - and I'm curious what else they were looking for.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: clarice on October 23, 2011, 05:06:15 AM
She says she is taking anti-anxiety meds. Then she tells us she is taking effexor. Effexor is an anti-depressant. I want to know which Benzo she is using. Which is it DB? ativan or xanax. She doesn't care to reveal that part.

One thing is for sure...no sane person would ever mix a benzo w/alcohol. It is like holding a gun to your head and playing Russian Roulette.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: clarice on October 23, 2011, 05:08:02 AM
She admits to having anxiety but she doesn't admit to depression. I want to know all the meds she has been prescribed...and I am betting there's a bunch.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 06:09:14 AM
There's a photo of Lisa and her father floating around.  Jeremy's holding Lisa and smiling - beautiful photo.  If you look close the refrigerator has a handful of prescription medication bottles on top of it - 4 I can see and it looks like more behind.

I want to know who those prescription bottles are marked for, what the medication is, what the dates on the bottles are and if it coincides with pill count, etc.

So much to know but I bet we'll not be told.  Unless they come up as evidence. 

I tried photoshop to see how close I could get to read the labels.  Impossible.

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 08:22:59 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844
Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage of Mystery Man
By CHRISTINA NG and ROB NELSON
Oct. 23, 2011


New surveillance footage of mystery man may support Lisa Irwin parents' claim that their daughter was abducted.

In video obtained exclusively by "Good Morning America," a man dressed in white is seen leaving a wooded area, at 2:30 a.m. -- the night of Lisa's disappearance.

The family claims Lisa was abducted and they point to key witnesses who saw a suspicious man that night, carrying a baby.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 08:43:22 AM
There's a photo of Lisa and her father floating around.  Jeremy's holding Lisa and smiling - beautiful photo.  If you look close the refrigerator has a handful of prescription medication bottles on top of it - 4 I can see and it looks like more behind.

I want to know who those prescription bottles are marked for, what the medication is, what the dates on the bottles are and if it coincides with pill count, etc.

So much to know but I bet we'll not be told.  Unless they come up as evidence. 

I tried photoshop to see how close I could get to read the labels.  Impossible.

~ fanta

Fanta - if this is the photo you are referring to, looks more like a Campbells Soup insignia to me:
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6232/6271945475_a47de93386_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6036/6271941543_c8b14cd714_o.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 08:47:56 AM
Rule Number One:

While in charge of babies & small children you do not get wasted.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 09:00:50 AM
There's a photo of Lisa and her father floating around.  Jeremy's holding Lisa and smiling - beautiful photo.  If you look close the refrigerator has a handful of prescription medication bottles on top of it - 4 I can see and it looks like more behind.

I want to know who those prescription bottles are marked for, what the medication is, what the dates on the bottles are and if it coincides with pill count, etc.

So much to know but I bet we'll not be told.  Unless they come up as evidence. 

I tried photoshop to see how close I could get to read the labels.  Impossible.

~ fanta

Fanta - if this is the photo you are referring to, looks more like a Campbells Soup insignia to me:
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6232/6271945475_a47de93386_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6036/6271941543_c8b14cd714_o.jpg)

No, there's another photo - same one but shows more of the fridge - it clearly shows 4 prescription bottles - brown with white caps - and another small bottle.  I'll see if I can find it again to post it.

Thanks
~fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 09:02:52 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844 (http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844)
Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage of Mystery Man

Quote
New surveillance footage of mystery man may support Lisa Irwin parents' claim that their daughter was abducted.

In video obtained exclusively by "Good Morning America," a man dressed in white is seen leaving a wooded area, at 2:30 a.m. -- the night of Lisa's disappearance.

The family claims Lisa was abducted and they point to key witnesses who saw a suspicious man that night, carrying a baby.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

Wow...

You can't see him carrying anything leaving the woods - so I'm not sure why this should give the family 'hope' - but we can still hope can't we!

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 09:09:30 AM
Fanta - you are correct.  Found the other photo you were referring to (thanks to Crankercrankerson's album).  Can't tell what meds they are but I see at least 3 bottles.  That said the meds could also be for Jeremy or the boys:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6116/6272536274_d11db842b5_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6041/6272536294_aae2761767_o.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 09:25:13 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844 (http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844)
Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage of Mystery Man

Quote
New surveillance footage of mystery man may support Lisa Irwin parents' claim that their daughter was abducted.

In video obtained exclusively by "Good Morning America," a man dressed in white is seen leaving a wooded area, at 2:30 a.m. -- the night of Lisa's disappearance.

The family claims Lisa was abducted and they point to key witnesses who saw a suspicious man that night, carrying a baby.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

Wow...

You can't see him carrying anything leaving the woods - so I'm not sure why this should give the family 'hope' - but we can still hope can't we!

~ fanta

Just the portion showing the surveillance video.  Doesn't look like he is carrying anything to me and this is at 2:30am:



Screen grab:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6228/6272574368_e2baa76ced_o.jpg)






Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 09:28:12 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844 (http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844)
Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage of Mystery Man

Quote
New surveillance footage of mystery man may support Lisa Irwin parents' claim that their daughter was abducted.

In video obtained exclusively by "Good Morning America," a man dressed in white is seen leaving a wooded area, at 2:30 a.m. -- the night of Lisa's disappearance.

The family claims Lisa was abducted and they point to key witnesses who saw a suspicious man that night, carrying a baby.

Mike Thompson told ABC News that he was on his way home from work around 4 a.m. on Oct. 4 when he saw a man in a t-shirt carrying a baby at an intersection about three miles from the Irwin home.

Wow...

You can't see him carrying anything leaving the woods - so I'm not sure why this should give the family 'hope' - but we can still hope can't we!

~ fanta

Just the portion showing the surveillance video.  Doesn't look like he is carrying anything to me and this is at 2:30am:

<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="600" height="460" data="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" classid="clsid:D27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000"> <param name="flashvars" value="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=89e34e5cce&photo_id=6272043897"></param> <param name="movie" value="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377"></param> <param name="bgcolor" value="#000000"></param> <param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" bgcolor="#000000" allowfullscreen="true" flashvars="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=89e34e5cce&photo_id=6272043897" height="460" width="600"></embed></object>


Screen grab:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6228/6272574368_e2baa76ced_o.jpg)

Thanks so much for posting the vid and screen shot - I've not quite figured that out yet.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 09:30:08 AM
Fanta - you are correct.  Found the other photo you were referring to (thanks to Crankercrankerson's album).  Can't tell what meds they are but I see at least 3 bottles.  That said the meds could also be for Jeremy or the boys:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6116/6272536274_d11db842b5_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6041/6272536294_aae2761767_o.jpg)

Yes surely they could be for the others - but that's what I'd like to know. 

Are they for Lisa?  Does she have a medical condition we've not been told about?

How many pills are left in each bottle - does it coincide with the refill date.

Are these prescriptions filled out to other people not in the house?  (Meaning someone else might have been staying there)???

SO MANY QUESTIONS those little bottle raise!  :)

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 09:34:30 AM
The 2nd half of the full surveillance video at the ABCnews link above shows their attorney walking thru the house after the LE search.  Keeping in mind I don't believe anything defense attorneys say but I did notice she walked into the kitchen and got a screen capture of the refrigerator agaon.  NOTE, the meds are gone now:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6272075893_57f913b732_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 09:34:44 AM
Who has a 63 yr old carpet!? Wow!

my mother in law!  It's actually from 1970.  She literally has it professionally cleaned every 6 months.  It's a beautiful orange/brown shag (no joke)
That sounds just like the carpet my grandmother had it was the style then!
She had a nice house too!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 23, 2011, 09:43:42 AM
The 2nd half of the full surveillance video at the ABCnews link above shows their attorney walking thru the house after the LE search.  Keeping in mind I don't believe anything defense attorneys say but I did notice she walked into the kitchen and got a screen capture of the refrigerator agaon.  NOTE, the meds are gone now:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6272075893_57f913b732_b.jpg)

Looks like a box of wine and the 4 pk of Campbell's soup are still there.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 09:47:29 AM
In the video of the man being seen coming out of the woods it could be anyone. It doesn't say where?
The witnesses that seen the man carrying the baby never says what color of t shirt!

I also have been wondering about Debbie and the neighbor drinking outside for Hours in the cold. Think it was around 40 degrees?why not in the house? If the neighbors daughter was in the house did her neighbor go inside? Did the neighbor see the baby? Why doesn't she talk to media?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 09:52:40 AM
IF the guy in the video was one carrying the baby he didn't have anything to bury her w in his hands,he's walking! It doesn't make sense.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 10:12:23 AM
 ::snipping2::
 Also there was a dumpster burning the night Lisa went missing. The guy who talked to the media, said that the flames were several feet in the air and some sort of solvent had been used.


 http://humbleopinionforum.net/2011/10/23/lisa-irwin-update-23-october-2011-man-seen-dumpster-and-the-carpet/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

(Why would someone use solvent) maybe they cam tie the solvent to Irwin home IF the fire had anything to do with it.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 10:13:03 AM
The Today Show 10/23/2011
http://www.myspace.com/video/565006329/lisa-irwin-today-show-10-23-11/108287102


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Jerseygirl345 on October 23, 2011, 10:14:39 AM
October 23, 2011
Exclusive: Irwin Family Attorney Responds to Cadaver Dog Hit.. Video

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justice-jeanine/index.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 10:19:05 AM
The 2nd half of the full surveillance video at the ABCnews link above shows their attorney walking thru the house after the LE search.  Keeping in mind I don't believe anything defense attorneys say but I did notice she walked into the kitchen and got a screen capture of the refrigerator agaon.  NOTE, the meds are gone now:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6272075893_57f913b732_b.jpg)

I didn't doubt for a minute the police would take note of those meds but it sure is good to see them gone.  Then again so is Lisa's family. 

Boy do I wish I knew what they were though!  I don't suppose you can pull that rabbit out of your hat?  No...  Well, thanks anyway so much! :) :) :)

~ fanta



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 10:52:03 AM
http://www.patriotledger.com/mobile/x804699188/WENDY-J-MURPHY-Understanding-the-Baby-Lisa-case-and-the-power-of-spin
WENDY J. MURPHY: Understanding the Baby Lisa case and the power of spin
GateHouse News Service
Posted Oct 23, 2011 @ 10:00 AM

 ::snipping2::
The lawyer for Lisa’s mother says we should pay no mind to the mother’s inconsistencies about when she last saw Lisa alive because traumatized people always make mistakes. This same lawyer told a jury in New York recently that a severely traumatized rape victim’s inconsistent statements proved she was lying about the crime.

So much for the effects of trauma.

He also criticized cops for being too tough on the parents even though in 99 percent of cases like this one, one or both parents is responsible and the child was killed, sold or given away to pay off a drug debt. In other words, cops have been tough on Lisa’s parents because they’d be idiots to waste too much time looking outside the family.

Most people find it hard to believe that a mother would harm her own sweet-faced little baby. They find it less hard to believe that a cranky-faced guy might be guilty, which is another reason to be mindful of why, IF the father is involved, the defense is likely to exploit the behavior of the mother when it comes to influencing our perception of reality.

We’ve seen enough of these cases to keep our eyes wide open this time. Lisa’s parents have a right to remain silent, but the Constitution says nothing about silencing those of us who believe that justice matters for a voiceless little girl.

Read more: http://www.patriotledger.com/archive/x804699188/WENDY-J-MURPHY-Understanding-the-Baby-Lisa-case-and-the-power-of-spin#ixzz1bcHg9ZxA




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: 4myjoey on October 23, 2011, 10:57:12 AM
Why would a anonymous benefactor chose this case?  Why Taco and Meathead?  Sadly there are other cases
of missing persons that have gotten media attention.  Why the Lisa Irwin case?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 11:11:01 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 11:38:19 AM
It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 11:39:42 AM
It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 



Ooops- meant :  " 8 x 10 "


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: mymonkey on October 23, 2011, 11:41:36 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011



Good Morning... ::ghost::


I have been reading but not posting..my thoughts....Could one of the boys dropped Lisa when Mom was outside and the boys panicked   and did not tell the mom and she found Lisa deceased..could that be why the boys will not be allowed to be questioned...I am curious if the boys are in school and are telling anything to school counselors.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 23, 2011, 11:48:04 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011



Good Morning... ::ghost::


I have been reading but not posting..my thoughts....Could one of the boys dropped Lisa when Mom was outside and the boys panicked   and did not tell the mom and she found Lisa deceased..could that be why the boys will not be allowed to be questioned...I am curious if the boys are in school and are telling anything to school counselors.

Good Morning Mymonkey

I believe if baby Lisa's demise was a result of an accident ... 911 would have been called.  However ... an act of wrongdoing implies a cover up.

Have a good Sunday all.

Janet
8:41 AM PT

+++++++

As with each day ....

Psalm 118:24
This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 11:53:59 AM
It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 



You are likely correct.  It didn't look like a carpet, looked like an area rug.  They may have had an area rug covering an older carpet.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 23, 2011, 11:58:09 AM
Has anyone seen how long after death until a body gives off scent that he dogs can detect?
o/t for stayathomemommy and the rest of he cableless,most news channel links here work;
http://worldtvsite.net/usa.html
 

Thanks Alagary!!!  ::MonkeyCheer4::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: starshadow on October 23, 2011, 12:23:19 PM
Re: Effexor

From this page:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000947/

Quote
"Venlafaxine extended-release (long-acting) capsules are also used to treat generalized anxiety disorder (GAD; excessive worrying that is difficult to control), social anxiety disorder (extreme fear of interacting with others or performing in front of others that interferes with normal life), and panic disorder (sudden, unexpected attacks of extreme fear and worry about these attacks). "

So yes, that specific medication is used to treat anxiety. It doesn't require or presume a diagnosis of depression.

Quote
"remember that alcohol can add to the drowsiness caused by this medication"

This does NOT mean "mixing alcohol and this medication will kill you"; it means "having this medication in your system while you are drinking means that the alcohol may make you sleepier than you normally would be for that amount of alcohol".
-----------------------
Re: the GMA video released this morning

The surveillance video is interesting, but the video inside the house with the lawyer is even more interesting.
Highlights:
- the carpet in the room where the dog supposedly hit was NOT removed.
- there appeared to be very little fingerprinting done
- the contents of the home were less disturbed than usual for a search, especially unexpected since the search was so lengthy
-----------------------
re: the Rx bottles

Heck, I have four on my desk right now, because I just refilled my fibro med and my painkiller. And if I had to leave the house and stay elsewhere, you can be sure they'd go with me. I'm fairly certain that there's still some vicodin and oxycodon left in the kitchen cupboard from the last time I broke myself while being clumsy. Now that I think about it, there might even be some Rx ibuprofen. Plus a full and a partial of my son's medication, and I think an empty or two might be living in there, too.

And if you looked in my craft cupboard, you'd find a baggie with a whole bunch of empties. They make great "rattles" (add beads, dried peas, beans, corn, whatever) to use inside crocheted baby toys.

So... four doesn't sound like many at all, not for a household of five.
-----------------------
re: the clothes, the purple shorts

When my daughter was that size, 95% of her wardrobe was pink, purple or both. (Unsurprising, especially after three boys!)

Having 3 or 4 purple shorts, and half a dozen pink ones, and about the same number in pants, wouldn't surprise me at all.
-----------------------
re: the alcohol

The logic is confusingly circular.

1. Because she drank alcohol and took her anxiety meds while she was the caregiver for her children, she's a bad mother.

2. Something happened to Lisa because DB was so drunk, whether it was accidental, or she was angry, or whatever.

3. Because DB had to be able to hide Lisa's body so well that LE can't find her, she must be lying about how much she drank - because to cover her tracks that well, she couldn't possibly have been incapacitated.

4. If she wasn't incapacitated, than #1 and #2 aren't valid anymore and we're back to where we started.
-----------------------
Other random comments and curiosities:
- How much did the neighbor have to drink that night?
- Has the neighbor allowed her child to be questioned?
- Have any of the nearby neighbors spoken out about their interactions with and impressions of the family?

- If you had done nothing wrong, and you'd had a terrible experience with law enforcement trying to extract a false confession from you, would you really allow them unlimited access to your child(ren) that are already traumatized by the disappearance of their sister?

- If law enforcement really felt that they needed to talk to those boys, they could ask a judge for it - thing is, that would entail lawyers and child psychology specialists and all that to be present to reduce trauma to the children - which, by the very nature of the situation, would make it difficult for law enforcement to influence the children's statements. I can see why LE would want unfettered access - it's too difficult to stack the deck if everyone is watching.

- If they're on TV asking for help about their missing child, they're attention whores that just want their 15 minutes. If they're not on TV, they don't care enough about their child to put themselves out there. Damned if you do, damned if you don't?

- It's common knowledge that it's appropriate and expected to lawyer up as soon as you are (or suspect you will be) accused of something, regardless of whether it's true or false. If you're innocent and don't lawyer up, you're a fool who is putting yourself at risk by not having someone knowledgeable about the system on your side. If you're innocent and do lawyer up, you're presumed guilty by the public. Again, no winner.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 23, 2011, 12:39:47 PM
I feel like I am an open minded person...I like to look at all angles of a story.  I have to admit my thoughts that the mom is likely guilty of something comes nothing from the long list that starshadow has provided (thanks starshadow).  I do want to clear up the possible sightings of a man walking a baby, though.  I would like to find out WHO spotted this man walking with a baby.  As far as the man coming from the woods...where was that location?  I guess I can go and look it up.  Was it close to the bar?  It doesn't look like a thickly wooded area...like there is a lot of activity around there BUT I cannot see it clearly AT ALL.  I pray Lisa is safe.  If it is NOT someone from inside the home that took Lisa then I would be scared if I were around the KC area!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 23, 2011, 12:44:30 PM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/In%20the%20News/baby.jpg)

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 12:44:33 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-representing-parents-discusses-latest-developments?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Local attorney representing parents discusses latest developments
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 23, 2011 10:55 AM CDT

Video at link.
 
 
KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

It has been quite a Sunday at the home where baby Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin have been staying.

The parents of baby Lisa have scaled back their media presence.

The local attorney representing the parents, Cynthia Short, is thankful that the parent's home was not destroyed during the search.

"Although that search was described as a search that was supposedly going to be invasive, I was concerned for the family that I would go in and see their home destroyed...one that they had worked on for a long time.  In fact, there is thankfully no destruction," said Cynthia Short.  "There are no walls torn out."
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 12:48:20 PM
http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2011/10/23/missing_baby_lisa_irwins_mother_we_hav
Missing Baby Lisa Irwin's Mother: 'We Have Absolutely Nothing To Hide'
October 23rd, 2011 9:00am EDT

(http://images.starpulse.com/news/bloggers/10/blog_images/people-magazine-3.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 01:19:21 PM
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1233416093001/are-baby-lisas-parents-telling-the-truth
Are Baby Lisa's Parents Telling the Truth?
Oct 23, 2011- 7:45 -
Body Language Tonya Reiman weighs in


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 01:20:07 PM
Question Please:

I've been looking through the posts and at the 'floor plan' of Lisa's house.  There is a 'dn' label on the staircase indicating what I would think to mean a 'down' staircase.

Why have we not heard anything about the 'basement' - or is there not a basement?  I'm a bit confused over this point.

Thanks in advance

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 23, 2011, 02:07:33 PM
The 2nd half of the full surveillance video at the ABCnews link above shows their attorney walking thru the house after the LE search.  Keeping in mind I don't believe anything defense attorneys say but I did notice she walked into the kitchen and got a screen capture of the refrigerator agaon.  NOTE, the meds are gone now:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6272075893_57f913b732_b.jpg)
Is that a wine box I see posed on the stove?  I don't trust any of these new pictures, surveillance footage, witnesses, and any "exclusive" information from ABC, that are coming out now.  It is much too convenient now that it is coming out after the lawyers and that whacko I mean wild Bill character have become involved.  Their job is to muck up things, not clear them up.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 02:12:27 PM
Right.  All that exclusive was, was the attorney going thru the house complaining about what LE did or didn't do.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 02:13:27 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
Local attorney: 'We might not get the happy ending that we want.'
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 23, 2011 1:01 PM CDT

KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

The parents of baby Lisa have scaled back their media presence, but their local attorney, Cyndy Short, representing them discussed the latest developments in the case Sunday.

Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17 hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Cyndy Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 02:21:14 PM
One of the things Im wondering bout is maybe the reason DB doesnt want the investigators to question the 2 boys is maybe because she is afraid that since this has all came out about "her drinking and pill taking" if maybe now the police might question the 2 boys about their life in that home in the previous years, maybe when they questioned the boys to begin with they probably just asked about the night in question when baby Lisa first came up missing, but now they would probably ask about how their lives have been all along, "did their Mother drink every night" how many times did they find her passed out in different places in the home, " how many times did they wake up and hear the baby crying in her crib and the Mother still asleep and they had to care for the baby......stuff like that.......then the other 2 boys would probably be removed from their care also, there is some reason she doesnt want them talking anymore with LE.......I believe that something did happen to Lise that night or day at that home and even if the boys didnt see anything they still could shed light on their everyday life there with DB........


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 23, 2011, 02:22:57 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-irwin-search-continues-14795707
Baby Lisa Irwin Search Continues
Former FBI Profiler Brad Garrett breaks down the new developments.
02:27 | 10/23/2011



Good Morning... ::ghost::


I have been reading but not posting..my thoughts....Could one of the boys dropped Lisa when Mom was outside and the boys panicked   and did not tell the mom and she found Lisa deceased..could that be why the boys will not be allowed to be questioned...I am curious if the boys are in school and are telling anything to school counselors.

That's a possibility I guess but I still want the boys re-interviewed because there is a little baby here who is either missing or dead.  I've been trying to get information about the rights of the police and the parents and it seems like it varies from state to state.  Here's a link that I've found so far but I'll keep looking for Missouri specifically.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20060612032130AABjJTl

"Police can detain witnesses including minors. In most states minors are considered children under 16. Minors can be questioned and detained for a "reasonable amount of time." Police can not take confessions from minors to crimes without a parents knowledge or consent but as long as the minor is not a suspect he/she can be detained, questioned, asked to give statements and probed for information about a crime."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 23, 2011, 02:26:43 PM
catching up and not sure if anyone has put up the map for where the gas station is
im glad somethings you can always recognize,its a bp station on the corner of
parvin and N brighton,that captured the vid

looking at bp
http://g.co/maps/bz9qe

turned around looking across from bp
http://g.co/maps/4jx8s

woods lower RH side
http://g.co/maps/u32k8

overview of home-green arrow below A,A is the bp, at 48th a little up/N is the
4am bike guy sighting,if you zoom in,the pk is called,hidden valley pk,looks
like a long pk way
http://g.co/maps/wjeak

captured the vid
http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844 (http://abcnews.go.com/US/baby-lisa-irwin-surveillance-footage-mystery-man/story?id=14795844)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 23, 2011, 02:26:54 PM
One of the things Im wondering bout is maybe the reason DB doesnt want the investigators to question the 2 boys is maybe because she is afraid that since this has all came out about "her drinking and pill taking" if maybe now the police might question the 2 boys about their life in that home in the previous years, maybe when they questioned the boys to begin with they probably just asked about the night in question when baby Lisa first came up missing, but now they would probably ask about how their lives have been all along, "did their Mother drink every night" how many times did they find her passed out in different places in the home, " how many times did they wake up and hear the baby crying in her crib and the Mother still asleep and they had to care for the baby......stuff like that.......then the other 2 boys would probably be removed from their care also, there is some reason she doesnt want them talking anymore with LE.......I believe that something did happen to Lise that night or day at that home and even if the boys didnt see anything they still could shed light on their everyday life there with DB........

Could be. Makes sense. So, then my question becomes, "Why can't Child Protective Services go in and question the boys? Isn't their "reasonable cause"?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 23, 2011, 02:27:21 PM
Finding out DB had anxiety attacks and meds for same, I am now wondering if their had been some sort of unpleasantness the day before at grandparents house, birthday, when "happy" photos were taken. Could something have been said to set off DB and it escalated into the following day's "Lisa disappears."

Also, the photo of dad JI, holding Lisa in kitchen; he is obviously thrilled at having this baby. More emotion shown in that photo than at any or all the time since her disappearance.

Anyone else notice the clear counters and stove top? How do you do that with a family of five, one of whom is an infant?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 23, 2011, 02:33:31 PM
One of the things Im wondering bout is maybe the reason DB doesnt want the investigators to question the 2 boys is maybe because she is afraid that since this has all came out about "her drinking and pill taking" if maybe now the police might question the 2 boys about their life in that home in the previous years, maybe when they questioned the boys to begin with they probably just asked about the night in question when baby Lisa first came up missing, but now they would probably ask about how their lives have been all along, "did their Mother drink every night" how many times did they find her passed out in different places in the home, " how many times did they wake up and hear the baby crying in her crib and the Mother still asleep and they had to care for the baby......stuff like that.......then the other 2 boys would probably be removed from their care also, there is some reason she doesnt want them talking anymore with LE.......I believe that something did happen to Lise that night or day at that home and even if the boys didnt see anything they still could shed light on their everyday life there with DB........



Could be. Makes sense. So, then my question becomes, "Why can't Child Protective Services go in and question the boys? Isn't their "reasonable cause"?
It's complicated because I can't find anything specific to Missouri.  This is very interesting though -

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Can_police_question_a_12-year-old_about_their_possible_involvement_in_a_crime_with_a_parent_being_present




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 23, 2011, 02:36:48 PM
It's very possible that the carpet taken by LE was actually a rug - as in 4 x 5, 8 x 19, etc.  If from the parents' bedroom, it could have been placed by the parents at some point in time over pre-existing wall to wall. 



if we are talking about that,grayish blueish,looking carpet,i dont think they took it,it looked
like it was rolled out in the drive,then they rolled it up and took it to the back of house,i think
it was a room carpet too,and prob that size,and it may have not been from the Ps Bdr
so maybe the scent was in the wall to wall carpet, anyone know where that footage is
seems like a csi carried out a bag that looked like it had a piece of rug in it


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 02:42:20 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 02:43:48 PM
Finding out DB had anxiety attacks and meds for same, I am now wondering if their had been some sort of unpleasantness the day before at grandparents house, birthday, when "happy" photos were taken. Could something have been said to set off DB and it escalated into the following day's "Lisa disappears."

Also, the photo of dad JI, holding Lisa in kitchen; he is obviously thrilled at having this baby. More emotion shown in that photo than at any or all the time since her disappearance.

Anyone else notice the clear counters and stove top? How do you do that with a family of five, one of whom is an infant?

Very good point.  Some of us know all to well what can happen when we put all our relatives together in one place on a 'happy day'...  Oh the horrors!

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 23, 2011, 02:47:47 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Something to toss out here.

Go back to the perfect wording of that information found here:

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf (http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf)

It reads:

Quote
On October 17th, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive ‘hit’ for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.

We're talking about the wording of a seasoned cop right?  If she meant 'carpet' I believe she would have said so. 

The wording above can be interpreted as something 'near' the bed - like anything on the list of items taken from the house.

Just sayin'.

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 02:50:31 PM
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::
[/quote]

Something to toss out here.

Go back to the perfect wording of that information found here:

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf (http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf)

It reads:

Quote
On October 17th, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive ‘hit’ for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.

We're talking about the wording of a seasoned cop right?  If she meant 'carpet' I believe she would have said so. 

The wording above can be interpreted as something 'near' the bed - like anything on the list of items taken from the house.

Just sayin'.

~ fanta
[/quote]exactly, the dogs could have picked up the scent from a blanket that was lying on the floor of the bedroom by the parents bed or on any clothing that was lying there!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 23, 2011, 02:54:03 PM
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Something to toss out here.

Go back to the perfect wording of that information found here:

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf (http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf)

It reads:

Quote
On October 17th, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive ‘hit’ for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.

We're talking about the wording of a seasoned cop right?  If she meant 'carpet' I believe she would have said so. 

The wording above can be interpreted as something 'near' the bed - like anything on the list of items taken from the house.

Just sayin'.

~ fanta
[/quote]exactly, the dogs could have picked up the scent from a blanket that was lying on the floor of the bedroom by the parents bed or on any clothing that was lying there!
[/quote]

since its not carpet,pretty dumb to leave that behind and in your Bdr to boot


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 23, 2011, 02:56:17 PM
One of the things Im wondering bout is maybe the reason DB doesnt want the investigators to question the 2 boys is maybe because she is afraid that since this has all came out about "her drinking and pill taking" if maybe now the police might question the 2 boys about their life in that home in the previous years, maybe when they questioned the boys to begin with they probably just asked about the night in question when baby Lisa first came up missing, but now they would probably ask about how their lives have been all along, "did their Mother drink every night" how many times did they find her passed out in different places in the home, " how many times did they wake up and hear the baby crying in her crib and the Mother still asleep and they had to care for the baby......stuff like that.......then the other 2 boys would probably be removed from their care also, there is some reason she doesnt want them talking anymore with LE.......I believe that something did happen to Lise that night or day at that home and even if the boys didnt see anything they still could shed light on their everyday life there with DB........



Could be. Makes sense. So, then my question becomes, "Why can't Child Protective Services go in and question the boys? Isn't their "reasonable cause"?
It's complicated because I can't find anything specific to Missouri.  This is very interesting though -

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Can_police_question_a_12-year-old_about_their_possible_involvement_in_a_crime_with_a_parent_being_present






The court, in Missouri, can appoint guardian ad litim's for the two boys and then have the boys questioned.

On the side.  If DB was the one in the military and not hubby, she could be brought up on charges of adultery and dealt with. As she only continues as a dependent of military personnel, she still can be dealt with IF she continues to receive government benefits.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 23, 2011, 03:00:14 PM
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Something to toss out here.

Go back to the perfect wording of that information found here:

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf (http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf)

It reads:

Quote
On October 17th, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive ‘hit’ for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.

We're talking about the wording of a seasoned cop right?  If she meant 'carpet' I believe she would have said so. 

The wording above can be interpreted as something 'near' the bed - like anything on the list of items taken from the house.

Just sayin'.

~ fanta
exactly, the dogs could have picked up the scent from a blanket that was lying on the floor of the bedroom by the parents bed or on any clothing that was lying there!
[/quote]

since its not carpet,pretty dumb to leave that behind and in your Bdr to boot
[/quote]




Very good point. There is so much material to cover so quickly. Something pops on this case, almost daily. Glad you caught this.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 23, 2011, 03:05:32 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::




Comforter, clothes and car themed blanket could have come from the floor in DB's bedroom. Those items could have ORIGINALLY come from Lisa's bedroom.

Multiple rolls of tape and dispenser. God, I hope it wasn't duct tape.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 03:06:08 PM
SHORT - Is a defense attorney.  Personally I don't believe a word she says.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 03:06:53 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
"When you are in crisis and one of the things that is withheld from you is information, it is devastating," said Short.  "They are on a roller coaster. They are doing the best they can and holding out hope. They love this little girl. They really did. And she was a precious little girl. So they are just hanging on doing the best they can.  And people are surrounding them and supporting them."
 ::snipping2::

Speaking in past tense........




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 03:07:29 PM
SHORT - Is a defense attorney.  Personally I don't believe a word she says.
I don't either. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 03:16:52 PM
SHORT - Is a defense attorney.  Personally I don't believe a word she says.
I don't either. ::MonkeyNoNo::
make that a "me either" .....defense  attorney............its in their job description to lie,,,,,,,,,,,,,,nope.....dont believe a word she says!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 03:35:08 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
"When you are in crisis and one of the things that is withheld from you is information, it is devastating," said Short.  "They are on a roller coaster. They are doing the best they can and holding out hope. They love this little girl. They really did. And she was a precious little girl. So they are just hanging on doing the best they can.  And people are surrounding them and supporting them."
 ::snipping2::

Speaking in past tense........



Never a good sign from family or family's atty.  They know this baby is deceased.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 23, 2011, 03:36:11 PM
Fanta - you are correct.  Found the other photo you were referring to (thanks to Crankercrankerson's album).  Can't tell what meds they are but I see at least 3 bottles.  That said the meds could also be for Jeremy or the boys:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6116/6272536274_d11db842b5_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6041/6272536294_aae2761767_o.jpg)

Yes surely they could be for the others - but that's what I'd like to know. 

Are they for Lisa?  Does she have a medical condition we've not been told about?

How many pills are left in each bottle - does it coincide with the refill date.

Are these prescriptions filled out to other people not in the house?  (Meaning someone else might have been staying there)???

SO MANY QUESTIONS those little bottle raise!  :)

~ fanta


As bottles were obviously not there after the search, I am wondering if DB and JI took them with them when they fled to the relatives house to stay. It is possible that LE never had them, although Lisa and DB's medical records were made available to LE.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 03:40:47 PM
I don't believe those meds were for Lisa.  She's only 11 months old.  She'd have been given meds with a dropper top. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 03:41:24 PM
Right.  All that exclusive was, was the attorney going thru the house complaining about what LE did or didn't do.

I know - lol.  It was silly.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 03:48:04 PM
I don't believe those meds were for Lisa.  She's only 11 months old.  She'd have been given meds with a dropper top. 

I agree, not Lisa's but the question was did they belong to someone else in the family besides Lisa's mom.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 03:48:06 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Thanks - I didn't catch that.   But they did take it.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 03:53:42 PM
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Something to toss out here.

Go back to the perfect wording of that information found here:

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf (http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf)

It reads:

Quote
On October 17th, 2011 an FBI cadaver dog was brought into the residence upon consent of Irwin and Bradley. The cadaver dog indicated a positive ‘hit’ for the scent of a deceased human in an area of the floor of Bradley’s bedroom near the bed.

We're talking about the wording of a seasoned cop right?  If she meant 'carpet' I believe she would have said so. 

The wording above can be interpreted as something 'near' the bed - like anything on the list of items taken from the house.

Just sayin'.

~ fanta
[/quote]exactly, the dogs could have picked up the scent from a blanket that was lying on the floor of the bedroom by the parents bed or on any clothing that was lying there!
[/quote]


Perhaps the "cars" themed blanket.   Must belong in the boys' room.   Didn't she tell PEOPLE magazine they had bunk beds?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 03:58:17 PM
SHORT - Is a defense attorney.  Personally I don't believe a word she says.

I don't think she does either - LOL.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 04:00:21 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
"When you are in crisis and one of the things that is withheld from you is information, it is devastating," said Short.  "They are on a roller coaster. They are doing the best they can and holding out hope. They love this little girl. They really did. And she was a precious little girl. So they are just hanging on doing the best they can.  And people are surrounding them and supporting them."
 ::snipping2::

Speaking in past tense........

 ::MonkeyEek::   Good catch!





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 23, 2011, 04:14:09 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Thanks - I didn't catch that.   But they did take it.

Yes they did...
Wonder if that carpet was moved after Lisa was missing.
That the 2 brothers could answer, Mom would lie I bet...jmo
 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 04:22:00 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want
 ::snipping2::
Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

 ::snipping2::

Thanks - I didn't catch that.   But they did take it.

Yes they did...
Wonder if that carpet was moved after Lisa was missing.
That the 2 brothers could answer, Mom would lie I bet...jmo
 ::MonkeyEek::
nah.............she wouldnt lie......lol....she would and has lied, and until they get proof of what happened to the baby she will continue to do so......just like Casey. imo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 04:22:29 PM
I don't believe those meds were for Lisa.  She's only 11 months old.  She'd have been given meds with a dropper top. 

I agree, not Lisa's but the question was did they belong to someone else in the family besides Lisa's mom.
Well, that leaves...
JL
JL's son
DB's son
? possibly DB's brother?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 23, 2011, 04:37:34 PM
The surviellance video of the mystery man in white doesn't phase me in the least.  That could be anyone.  In the video one arm can be seen swinging while he's walking so it's unlikely he is carrying a 25 pound child.

The rug carried away by investigators was bound around the edges so it was definitely an area rug.  Wonder which room it had occupied before it found its' way to the shed?

I cannot disregard so easily the sightings of a man carrying a baby because we have three different witnesses with two different sightings who all saw the same thing.  If an acquaintance had been roped in to helping DB after the infant child was murdered, that person could have been anybody... they could have been developmentally disabled or strung out on drugs or just very close to the baby, highly distraught, and unable to think clearly enough to not be seen with the baby walking around in the middle of the night.

I wonder if someone else was hanging out with DB that night besides just her neighbor?





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 23, 2011, 04:43:52 PM
The surviellance video of the mystery man in white doesn't phase me in the least.  That could be anyone.  In the video one arm can be seen swinging while he's walking so it's unlikely he is carrying a 25 pound child.

The rug carried away by investigators was bound around the edges so it was definitely an area rug.  Wonder which room it had occupied before it found its' way to the shed?

I cannot disregard so easily the sightings of a man carrying a baby because we have three different witnesses with two different sightings who all saw the same thing.  If an acquaintance had been roped in to helping DB after the infant child was murdered, that person could have been anybody... they could have been developmentally disabled or strung out on drugs or just very close to the baby, highly distraught, and unable to think clearly enough to not be seen with the baby walking around in the middle of the night.

I wonder if someone else was hanging out with DB that night besides just her neighbor?


IF all the sightings are correct, then someone was/is trying to setup a defense to try and get away with Lisa's disappearance, death.  And the barrel fire close to the house.
What are the odds all these things didn't have anything to do with this case?

 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 05:06:58 PM
Quote
Surveillance video obtained by ABC News comes from a BP gas station near the Irwin house. It shows a man emerging from the woods at about 2:30 a.m. although it doesn't appear he is carrying a baby.

Capt. Steve Young, Public Information Officer with the police department responded to the latest national news theory with the following email:

"I know you have to ask, but I cannot comment on details and don't want to even try keeping up with media freelance investigations."

ABCNews is now the old FoxNews, a tabloid. How can they look at the video and paste on their front page a huge picture and titles saying that the video is a "breakthrough" on the case? Did anyone look at the image? It can be anyone, even a woman, and NO BABY.

Quote
Police have interviewed witnesses who say they saw a man carrying a baby the night Lisa disappeared. One witness says she saw this shortly after midnight, three houses away from Lisa's. Another witness saw a man with a baby almost four hours later, more than three miles from the home.

The BP gas station is approximately three-quarters of a miles from the home.

I think these people reporting baby Lisa sightings are like those people who reported UFO abductions back in the 70s, it's their brains working overtime trying to find answers from something that's innocuous.

Quote
New York attorney Joe Tacopina addressed questions about Deborah's drinking.

"I don't think she has an alcohol problem," Tacopina said on Fox's Judge Jeanine Pirro Show. "She has wine at night."

She has half a gallon of wine at night... drinks to a blackout state ... while her kid is sick... on a MONDAY night.

<sarcasm coming> No she doesn't have a problem, Mr. TP. </sarcasm ending>

http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-theories-in-lisa-irwin-disappearance-20111023,0,7211386.story



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 05:34:12 PM
AmyKCTV5 Amy Anderson
by NimaKCTV5
Baby Lisa local family attorney is talking with KC media about the case. Tonight on KCTV5 @ 9 & 10. #LisaIrwin
17 minutes ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 06:11:22 PM
Few other developments in the case this weekend other than a tour of the house by the attorney representing baby Lisa's parents
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 5:01 PM

    Reply

KMBC's Marcus Moore: Another vigil for baby Lisa happening tonight
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 5:01 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1be4JK8Uf


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 06:16:03 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-will-irwin-bradley-talk-to-police-again-20111023,0,355334.story?track=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wdaf-news+%28FOX4KC+Local+News%29
Will Lisa Irwin's Parents Ever Speak to Police Again?
4:13 p.m. CDT, October 23, 2011
KANSAS CITY, Mo.—


Video at link.
On Sunday, Cyndy Short, the local defense attorney representing Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, agreed to an exclusive interview with FOX 4's Tess Koppelman.

Koppelman asked Short about the police assertion that Bradley and Irwin are no longer cooperating with the investigation and have gone silent, refusing to talk to police.

Short says it's true that the police and her clients cannot agree on the conditions for another discussion or interrogation.

"We were offering conditions under which we would sit down again and the conditions that they wanted and the conditions that we want right now haven't meshed," Short said.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 06:27:32 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-will-irwin-bradley-talk-to-police-again-20111023,0,355334.story?track=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wdaf-news+%28FOX4KC+Local+News%29
Will Lisa Irwin's Parents Ever Speak to Police Again?
4:13 p.m. CDT, October 23, 2011
KANSAS CITY, Mo.—


Video at link.
On Sunday, Cyndy Short, the local defense attorney representing Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, agreed to an exclusive interview with FOX 4's Tess Koppelman.

Koppelman asked Short about the police assertion that Bradley and Irwin are no longer cooperating with the investigation and have gone silent, refusing to talk to police.

Short says it's true that the police and her clients cannot agree on the conditions for another discussion or interrogation.

"We were offering conditions under which we would sit down again and the conditions that they wanted and the conditions that we want right now haven't meshed," Short said.
 ::snipping2::
see, this is what Im concerned about...this isnt some kind of off the wall interview, this is a missing child for crying out loud, why must there be "conditions"  they should always be up for a meeting with LE no matter the stupid "conditions"........HEllo, your child is gone here.....tell police whatever they want to know and help find your baby!!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 06:28:48 PM
About the video at the BP station...

I would think that a kidnapper, even a dumb kidnapper, would wear clothes to blend in with the darkness of the night. So, why dress in white?  He might as well had worn a neon sign with an arrow pointed at him saying "over heah!"

Is there a description to this blob of white? From the camera's viewpoint, it can be just about anyone, even a woman.

Hopefully the person in the video comes forward and all doubt is lifted off the blob being responsible for the kidnapping. If this person doesn't, the defense may have a field day... a mysterious "perpetrator" to pin the kidnapping on, if the case against the parents goes to trial.

Whoever this guy or gal is, he/she has just been "Kronked"... this case resembles Caylee Anthony's more and more by the minute.

One thing to ask is... does LE have a copy of the surveillance tape, and if not... why did ABCNews get it first? Why report it as a "breakthrough" in the case if it hasn't been confirmed by LE?

One thing to keep in mind is that any of these "sightings" could be real, though unlikely.

So, one has to keep an open mind.

To me, the real investigation of the statements and videos on the case should remain with the authorities handling the investigation... not the media. The media's responsibility is to report the facts, and let the people interpret those.

I'll get off my high horse now.

 ::ghost::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 06:44:40 PM
Copy of ABCNews.com surveillance picture, for reference.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 06:50:50 PM
This is just that part of the video which shows the man walking near the BP:



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 23, 2011, 06:52:49 PM
Copy of ABCNews.com surveillance picture, for reference.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)

Is that another person looking in the direction of the person supposedly walking out of the woods?  Or is that a part of the light...I really cannot tell.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Nut44x4 on October 23, 2011, 07:12:32 PM
I watched the video clip 3 times and IMO the arms of the person are swinging ever so slightly at their side...hence not carrying anything  ::MonkeyWitch1::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 23, 2011, 07:17:39 PM
I agree with you NUT, I don't think he's carrying anything at all. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:21:14 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
Family of #lisairwin making an appearance outside the home where their #BabyLisa went missing. twitpic.com/74vwmv (http://twitpic.com/74vwmv)
4 minutes ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

(http://s1-01.twitpicproxy.com/photos/large/431470327.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 23, 2011, 07:21:31 PM
This is just that part of the video which shows the man walking near the BP:

<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="600" height="513" data="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" classid="clsid:D27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000"> <param name="flashvars" value="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=89e34e5cce&photo_id=6272043897"></param> <param name="movie" value="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377"></param> <param name="bgcolor" value="#000000"></param> <param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" bgcolor="#000000" allowfullscreen="true" flashvars="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=89e34e5cce&photo_id=6272043897" height="513" width="600"></embed></object>


The new Kronk IMO, could be a man walking home from a bar for heaven's sake and it looks like he has long sleeves as opposed to the short sleeves the "wintesses" have mentioned seeing at midnight, 2 am and 4 am????? I call BS on all of it, and the last stmt about the parents not cooperating which in essence is what LE has stated from early on is the second time an atty for them used a past tense verb, IIRC one time they (could be tacojo) mentioned mourning the death/loss of their baby....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:24:08 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
As the person prays for the conviction of the person or persons responsible for #LisaIrwin, Deborah Bradley begins sobbing. #findbabylisa
47 seconds ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 23, 2011, 07:35:13 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
As the person prays for the conviction of the person or persons responsible for #LisaIrwin, Deborah Bradley begins sobbing. #findbabylisa
47 seconds ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

Okee Dokee, Deborah -- let's give it up ---  does this perhaps apply to you ?????


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:37:32 PM
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
Attendees at Irwin vigil now lighting candles via @ReporterJake: yfrog.com/es26eej (http://yfrog.com/es26eej)
13 minutes ago http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg532/scaled.php?tn=0&server=532&filename=26ee.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
@ReporterJake is outside Irwin home, where parents have joined in, wearing Find Lisa T-shirts, in a vigil: yfrog.com/kkez4myzj (http://yfrog.com/kkez4myzj)
18 minutes ago http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg740/scaled.php?tn=0&server=740&filename=ez4myz.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 23, 2011, 07:37:58 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
Family of #lisairwin making an appearance outside the home where their #BabyLisa went missing. twitpic.com/74vwmv (http://twitpic.com/74vwmv)
4 minutes ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

(http://s1-01.twitpicproxy.com/photos/large/431470327.jpg)
This and the video...smoke and mirrors IMO. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:41:13 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe  https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)
KC atty. Cyndy Short seen with Bryan McAllister standing at the prayer vigil. #lisairwin #kctv5 twitpic.com/74w6fy (http://twitpic.com/74w6fy)
1 minute ago
Nima Shaffe
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
twitvid.com/G0NPC (http://twitvid.com/G0NPC) - A family friend of #lisairwin prays at the vigil. Amazing Grace sang as candles are lit.
2 minutes ago
A family friend of #lisairwin prays at the vigil. Amazing Grace sang as candles
http://www.twitvid.com/G0NPC


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:43:22 PM
(http://s1-02.twitpicproxy.com/photos/large/431483038.jpg)
https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 07:47:30 PM
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/neighbors-continue-to-help-try-to-find-lisa-irwin
Neighbors continue to help try to find Lisa Irwin
Posted: 5:21 PM
Last Updated: 56 minutes ago
Video at link.
Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/neighbors-continue-to-help-try-to-find-lisa-irwin#ixzz1beSUMuWV



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 23, 2011, 08:19:51 PM
I need to clarify my smoke and mirrors comment, I meant the sudden participation of DB, JI and their attorneys not the prayer vigil itself.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 08:22:01 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
As the person prays for the conviction of the person or persons responsible for #LisaIrwin, Deborah Bradley begins sobbing. #findbabylisa
47 seconds ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

Okee Dokee, Deborah -- let's give it up ---  does this perhaps apply to you ?????
Guess she was convicted huh. Did she dye her hair and cut it?!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 23, 2011, 08:25:18 PM
I need to clarify my smoke and mirrors comment, I meant the sudden participation of DB, JI and their attorneys not the prayer vigil itself.

I am sure the atty made them go (all for pubic opinion ) IMO....but I am so pizzed about the negotiating to talk to LE , except certain detectives and who knows WTH their demands were..reminds me of Misty C and slore. They talk about being uncomfortable with the specific detectives WTF?????? What about their baby, but again IMO they already know she is gone so there is a huge lack of concern/willingness to cooperate.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 23, 2011, 08:32:23 PM
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
RT @PeterAlexander: #BabyLisa's parents at vigil right now for their missing baby daughter. yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj (http://yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj)
1 hour ago


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: crazybabyborg on October 23, 2011, 08:47:06 PM
Hi Monkeys!

For whatever it's worth, after multiple viewings, I don't think the guy coming out from the woods is carrying anything either.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 08:53:58 PM
Copy of ABCNews.com surveillance picture, for reference.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)

Is that another person looking in the direction of the person supposedly walking out of the woods?  Or is that a part of the light...I really cannot tell.

Looks like a light.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 08:55:36 PM
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
RT @PeterAlexander: #BabyLisa's parents at vigil right now for their missing baby daughter. yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj (http://yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj)
1 hour ago

Who is the guy to Deborah's right, the one with the black shirt. He holds hands with her in other pictures. Not implying anything, just curious as to who he is. 



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 08:57:11 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
As the person prays for the conviction of the person or persons responsible for #LisaIrwin, Deborah Bradley begins sobbing. #findbabylisa
47 seconds ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

Okee Dokee, Deborah -- let's give it up ---  does this perhaps apply to you ?????
Guess she was convicted huh. Did she dye her hair and cut it?!
It sure looks a darker brown to me.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 23, 2011, 09:06:27 PM
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
RT @PeterAlexander: #BabyLisa's parents at vigil right now for their missing baby daughter. yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj (http://yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj)
1 hour ago

Who is the guy to Deborah's right, the one with the black shirt. He holds hands with her in other pictures. Not implying anything, just curious as to who he is. 

He's her cousin.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 23, 2011, 09:07:01 PM
NimaKCTV5 Nima Shaffe
As the person prays for the conviction of the person or persons responsible for #LisaIrwin, Deborah Bradley begins sobbing. #findbabylisa
47 seconds ago https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5 (https://twitter.com/#!/NimaKCTV5)

Okee Dokee, Deborah -- let's give it up ---  does this perhaps apply to you ?????
Guess she was convicted huh. Did she dye her hair and cut it?!
It sure looks a darker brown to me.
it most certainly does look darker, maybe some red added and it does look shorter, maybe getting ready for her television appearance........or for the ride in the back of a patrol car.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 09:13:07 PM
(http://i604.photobucket.com/albums/tt126/jerseygirl12345/Deborah.jpg)(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

Hard to say for sure. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 23, 2011, 09:13:26 PM
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
RT @PeterAlexander: #BabyLisa's parents at vigil right now for their missing baby daughter. yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj (http://yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj)
1 hour ago

Who is the guy to Deborah's right, the one with the black shirt. He holds hands with her in other pictures. Not implying anything, just curious as to who he is. 

He's her cousin.

Thanks.

For a minute there I thought it was Cpt. Young, but this guy looks younger, and the holding hands threw me off... heh!

 ::MonkeyWitch1::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 23, 2011, 09:26:54 PM
her hair looks like a deeper shade of red to me..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: AZSunny on October 23, 2011, 09:39:48 PM
October 23, 2011
Exclusive: Irwin Family Attorney Responds to Cadaver Dog Hit.. Video

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justice-jeanine/index.html

I know this is not related, but WTH is Tacopenis wearing? 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 23, 2011, 09:43:09 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 23, 2011, 09:45:26 PM
I need to clarify my smoke and mirrors comment, I meant the sudden participation of DB, JI and their attorneys not the prayer vigil itself.

I am sure the atty made them go (all for pubic opinion ) IMO....but I am so pizzed about the negotiating to talk to LE , except certain detectives and who knows WTH their demands were..reminds me of Misty C and slore. They talk about being uncomfortable with the specific detectives WTF?????? What about their baby, but again IMO they already know she is gone so there is a huge lack of concern/willingness to cooperate.
::rhino:: To me that lack of concern/willingness translates into guilt and as time goes on it seems more and more impossible that this is all a coverup because of an accident.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 23, 2011, 09:52:23 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I thought the same thing: so inappropriate!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 23, 2011, 10:18:53 PM
(http://i604.photobucket.com/albums/tt126/jerseygirl12345/Deborah.jpg)(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

Hard to say for sure. 
(http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee509/Sallie1233/utf-8BZzI1ODAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMDA4NjYxMDE0NjlmMGJlYzVlZTlmYWE2YmJkNmU5ODhhMTM3ZjIxMmEuanBn.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 23, 2011, 10:18:58 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I thought the same thing: so inappropriate!

Totally agree.....I read he was her dad, can't remember where for the life of me though and her hair does look darker to me (although it could just be the light in which the pic's/videos are taken).


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 23, 2011, 10:21:10 PM
(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle (http://twitter.com/#!/Sam_Hartle)
Sam_Hartle Sam_Hartle
RT @PeterAlexander: #BabyLisa's parents at vigil right now for their missing baby daughter. yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj (http://yfrog.com/h8gg4eezj)
1 hour ago

Who is the guy to Deborah's right, the one with the black shirt. He holds hands with her in other pictures. Not implying anything, just curious as to who he is. 

He's her cousin.

Thanks.

For a minute there I thought it was Cpt. Young, but this guy looks younger, and the holding hands threw me off... heh!

 ::MonkeyWitch1::


In this pic deb looks Po'd.......
If it was me I would be calling the cops every day to see if they have found anything, instead of avoiding them.
 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 23, 2011, 10:22:06 PM
Actually all of them looked PO'd....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 23, 2011, 10:25:47 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyEek::

Link to her dad's FB, I think it might be him in the sinister shirt

https://www.facebook.com/media/albums/?id=1093506753#!/photo.php?fbid=1247145534108&set=a.1247145494107.2038212.1093506753&type=3&theater


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 23, 2011, 10:37:04 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyEek::

Link to her dad's FB, I think it might be him in the sinister shirt

https://www.facebook.com/media/albums/?id=1093506753#!/photo.php?fbid=1247145534108&set=a.1247145494107.2038212.1093506753&type=3&theater

Yea I think that is her Dad ... I think they look guarded rather than POd


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 23, 2011, 10:49:09 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-will-irwin-bradley-talk-to-police-again-20111023,0,355334.story?track=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wdaf-news+%28FOX4KC+Local+News%29
Will Lisa Irwin's Parents Ever Speak to Police Again?
4:13 p.m. CDT, October 23, 2011
KANSAS CITY, Mo.—


Video at link.
On Sunday, Cyndy Short, the local defense attorney representing Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, agreed to an exclusive interview with FOX 4's Tess Koppelman.

Koppelman asked Short about the police assertion that Bradley and Irwin are no longer cooperating with the investigation and have gone silent, refusing to talk to police.

Short says it's true that the police and her clients cannot agree on the conditions for another discussion or interrogation.

"We were offering conditions under which we would sit down again and the conditions that they wanted and the conditions that we want right now haven't meshed," Short said.
 ::snipping2::
see, this is what Im concerned about...this isnt some kind of off the wall interview, this is a missing child for crying out loud, why must there be "conditions"  they should always be up for a meeting with LE no matter the stupid "conditions"........HEllo, your child is gone here.....tell police whatever they want to know and help find your baby!!

So true!  Your post just cut to the heart of the matter and p'd me off even more about this whole thing.

I shared those concerns with Caylee/Casey and I have those same concerns with Kyron/Terri.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 23, 2011, 11:05:19 PM
The surviellance video of the mystery man in white doesn't phase me in the least.  That could be anyone.  In the video one arm can be seen swinging while he's walking so it's unlikely he is carrying a 25 pound child.

The rug carried away by investigators was bound around the edges so it was definitely an area rug.  Wonder which room it had occupied before it found its' way to the shed?

I cannot disregard so easily the sightings of a man carrying a baby because we have three different witnesses with two different sightings who all saw the same thing.  If an acquaintance had been roped in to helping DB after the infant child was murdered, that person could have been anybody... they could have been developmentally disabled or strung out on drugs or just very close to the baby, highly distraught, and unable to think clearly enough to not be seen with the baby walking around in the middle of the night.

I wonder if someone else was hanging out with DB that night besides just her neighbor?


IF all the sightings are correct, then someone was/is trying to setup a defense to try and get away with Lisa's disappearance, death.  And the barrel fire close to the house.
What are the odds all these things didn't have anything to do with this case?

 ::MonkeyEek::

The odds of three people seeing a man walking with a baby in the middle of the night on the same night a baby goes missing are astronimical.  I personally believe it is equally against the odds that three adults would lie about seeing a man walking with a baby on that same night.

For me the question is under what circumstances would someone do that?  You raise a good theory... they might do it to develop a kidnapping scenario.  Then comes the question WHO would risk that?  Because if you are correct, her accomplice is knowingly trying to protect DB and willing to risk getting caught to do so.

If the person wandering around really kidnapped Lisa I believe it's less likely they would want to be seen, which substantiates your theory even more.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 11:20:18 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I thought the same thing: so inappropriate!
I was thinking the same.  I decided he must be single 'cause no married man would make it out the door in that shirt under these circumstances.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Brandi on October 23, 2011, 11:34:33 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyEek::

Link to her dad's FB, I think it might be him in the sinister shirt

https://www.facebook.com/media/albums/?id=1093506753#!/photo.php?fbid=1247145534108&set=a.1247145494107.2038212.1093506753&type=3&theater

Yea I think that is her Dad ... I think they look guarded rather than POd

They look like the same person to me:

(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image37-2.png)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 23, 2011, 11:48:59 PM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyEek::

Link to her dad's FB, I think it might be him in the sinister shirt

https://www.facebook.com/media/albums/?id=1093506753#!/photo.php?fbid=1247145534108&set=a.1247145494107.2038212.1093506753&type=3&theater

Yea I think that is her Dad ... I think they look guarded rather than POd

They look like the same person to me:

(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image37-2.png)
Both pics show that big, gold necklace.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 01:23:38 AM
her hair looks like a deeper shade of red to me..
That is most definitely a new hairdo. I noticed that the moment I saw the photo.

DB:
"Gee, let me see.....It's October, fall is here, I need a makeover, maybe some "low lights", well, dang my daughter is missing....oh hell let me get a drink and think about this....." ::MonkeyMad::

 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 24, 2011, 02:16:45 AM
So strange that she would cut her hair at a time like this.  That would be the LAST thing on my mind if my child were missing.  In fact, I'd probably still be wearing the same stinky clothes from when she disappeared.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

That attorney, Strong, why does she keep referring to baby Lisa in the past tense?  Earlier I saw an interview in which she said something like, "The police have a hard job to do.  So it makes sense that they would search the home, the center of her life, where Lisa lived."

Is that just a figure of speech or does she suspect/know something we don't?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 06:30:12 AM
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/23/3225517/irwin-cases-frustrations-continue.html
Posted on Sun, Oct. 23, 2011 10:54 PM
Lisa Irwin case continues to frustrate KC police
By LAURA BAUER and SCOTT CANON
The Kansas City Star

 ::snipping2::
On Sunday, an ABC network news program reported it had obtained surveillance video from a gas station near the home showing a man leaving a wooded area at 2:30 a.m. the night Lisa disappeared. “Good Morning America” reported that police were investigating the tip.

The family says Lisa was taken from her crib and reported her missing at 4 a.m. Oct. 4.

A neighbor saw a man carrying a baby in the neighborhood a few hours earlier. Another man has told reporters he saw a man walking with a baby about three miles from the Irwin home around 4 that morning. He said he reported that information to police.

Kansas City Police Capt. Steve Young said he can’t comment on what media outlets are reporting or discuss what’s going on in the investigation.

“I really cannot comment on what the detectives know and have done,” Young said Sunday.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/23/3225517/irwin-cases-frustrations-continue.html#ixzz1bh4PjNdH




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 06:35:50 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/23/us/missouri-missing-girl/?hpt=ju_c1
Surveillance video from night girl disappeared turned over to authorities
By the CNN Wire Staff
updated 5:27 AM EST, Mon October 24, 2011

Kansas City, Missouri (CNN) -- Friends and family gathered Sunday for an emotional prayer vigil for a missing 11-month-old Missouri girl as new surveillance video surfaced from the night Lisa Irwin disappeared.

The video, taken from a BP gas station less than two miles from the home where Lisa was last seen, shows an unidentified person walking along the road around 2:15 a.m. October 4.

The station manager, Anuj Arora, said it's unusual to see anyone walking at that time of night in the region.

Arora, who shared the video with CNN on Sunday, said he also turned it over to authorities investigating Lisa's disappearance in hopes it will help in the search for the girl.

The FBI and Kansas City police declined to comment on the video, citing the ongoing investigation.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 08:45:56 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45014011#45014011
Missing baby: Cadaver dog picks up scent 10/24/2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cadillac on October 24, 2011, 08:54:31 AM
October 23, 2011
Exclusive: Irwin Family Attorney Responds to Cadaver Dog Hit.. Video

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justice-jeanine/index.html

I know this is not related, but WTH is Tacopenis wearing? 
Members Only?!?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 08:56:29 AM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 09:06:38 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45014011#45014011
Missing baby: Cadaver dog picks up scent 10/24/2011

Two things jumped out at me....

*reporter says that JI came home at 3:45 to the front door unlocked.  I thought JI was home at 4:20?
*Expert says that the smell of decomp starts 4 minutes after death and a cadaver dog should be able to detect that.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 24, 2011, 09:37:03 AM
Hi All - Question Please - I'm having difficulty finding information about Deb Bradley's mother that has passed on.  I was sure I read it here on Monkeys - but I can't find it.

Does anyone have a link or info I can go to?  I had heard Deborah's mother was dead - drug and alcohol related death - but I don't know if it was suicide or not, and, there was a report Deb was the one that found her mother???

Can anyone here shed some light on this please so I can sor fact from rumor?

Thank you!

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 24, 2011, 09:41:12 AM
The guy with the shades and the black shirt that reads, "Sinister" must not have much of a brain.  Why the heck would he wear that to a prayer vigil?  Whatever has happened to baby Lisa is no doubt sinister so why wear such a blatant reminder?   ::MonkeyNoNo::

There is NO sense of decorum these days.  Saw a young woman at church recently in halter top and daisy-dukes.  Yes, it was outdoor service for dedication of new building and blue jeans were acceptable, but I didn't know that butt-cheeks were ever appropriate for church attendance.   ::witch2::



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 24, 2011, 09:44:53 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45014011#45014011
Missing baby: Cadaver dog picks up scent 10/24/2011

Two things jumped out at me....

*reporter says that JI came home at 3:45 to the front door unlocked.  I thought JI was home at 4:20?
*Expert says that the smell of decomp starts 4 minutes after death and a cadaver dog should be able to detect that.

Who really knows what the actual facts are atm.
Does anyone live close to there on this board?
Are there any streams,rivers, ponds within a 5 mile radius?

IF I remember correctly, most ppl that r missing will be found within 5 miles from the point of abduction/moved.
 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 24, 2011, 10:03:56 AM


(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image37-2.png)

Oh goodness. He's wearing a "sinister" shirt in one, and what my hubby and I call a "wife beater" undershirt in the other. I know, we shouldn't pick on undershirts...but my hubby and I noticed that, for some reason, when movies portray abusive men, they always tend to wear those kind of undershirts.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: stayhomemommy on October 24, 2011, 10:05:50 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45014011#45014011
Missing baby: Cadaver dog picks up scent 10/24/2011

Two things jumped out at me....

*reporter says that JI came home at 3:45 to the front door unlocked.  I thought JI was home at 4:20?
*Expert says that the smell of decomp starts 4 minutes after death and a cadaver dog should be able to detect that.

Who really knows what the actual facts are atm.
Does anyone live close to there on this board?
Are there any streams,rivers, ponds within a 5 mile radius?

IF I remember correctly, most ppl that r missing will be found within 5 miles from the point of abduction/moved.
 ::MonkeyEek::

If I recall correctly, someone on this board who doesn't live terribly far from there did say the Missouri River (I think they said) wasn't far. Not sure, though, if that is walking distance or driving distance "not far". Either way. Not good.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 10:06:53 AM
http://www.nationalenquirer.com/celebrity/baby-lisa-what-mom-told-cops
BABY LISA: WHAT MOM TOLD COPS
-A +A
Published on: October 24, 2011
by JOHN BLOSSER,MICHAELGLYNN & ALEXANDER HITCHEN, THE NATIONAL ENQUIRER


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 10:26:51 AM
http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html
Images: Attorney Gives Tour Of Baby Lisa's Home
The attorney for Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley gave ABC's Matt Gutman an exclusive tour of the home investigators searched on Wednesday. These are images from the tour.

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html#ixzz1bi1x49AD


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 11:05:02 AM


(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image37-2.png)

Oh goodness. He's wearing a "sinister" shirt in one, and what my hubby and I call a "wife beater" undershirt in the other. I know, we shouldn't pick on undershirts...but my hubby and I noticed that, for some reason, when movies portray abusive men, they always tend to wear those kind of undershirts.

I am not sure what the T-shirts imply but it does appear that Debbie did have a disfunctional background.

It appears that many missing children cases discussed on the SM site involves an addictive environment.

Janet

++++


DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET


<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 11:09:10 AM
http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html
Images: Attorney Gives Tour Of Baby Lisa's Home
The attorney for Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley gave ABC's Matt Gutman an exclusive tour of the home investigators searched on Wednesday. These are images from the tour.

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html#ixzz1bi1x49AD


Thanks trimmonthelake

Could this be another avenue for defense attorneys to reap big bucks off the disappearance of a missing child?

Janet



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 24, 2011, 11:11:01 AM


(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image37-2.png)

Oh goodness. He's wearing a "sinister" shirt in one, and what my hubby and I call a "wife beater" undershirt in the other. I know, we shouldn't pick on undershirts...but my hubby and I noticed that, for some reason, when movies portray abusive men, they always tend to wear those kind of undershirts.

I am not sure what the T-shirts imply but it does appear that Debbie did have a disfunctional background.

It appears that many missing children cases discussed on the SM site involves an addictive environment.

Janet

++++


DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET


<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html

To me it seems that there is meaning behind that shirt...why pick that one?  Why not wear one with Lisa on it...he seems like a devoted grandpa?  Just interesting to me.  I know it says it is a brand...but still. 

sin·is·ter   /ˈsɪnəstər/ [sin-uh-ster] adjective 1.threatening or portending evil, harm, or trouble; ominous: a sinister remark. 2.bad, evil, base, or wicked; fell: his sinister purposes. 3.unfortunate; disastrous; unfavorable: a sinister accident. 4.of or on the left side; left.
5.Heraldry. noting the side of an escutcheon or achievement of arms that is to the left of the bearer
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sinister


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 11:11:16 AM
October 23, 2011
Exclusive: Irwin Family Attorney Responds to Cadaver Dog Hit.. Video

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/justice-jeanine/index.html

I know this is not related, but WTH is Tacopenis wearing? 
Members Only?!?

Good morning Monkeys--

"Members Only" is a brand of clothing.  Nothing sinister there, not a private club, just a brand of clothing.

http://www.buycheapr.com/us/result.jsp?ga=us15&q=members+only+jackets+men


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 11:13:28 AM
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/24/new-development-surveillance-video-in-baby-lisa-case-reveals-man-carrying-baby-on-night-irwin-went-missing/
10:23 am ET October 24, 2011
New Development: Surveillance Video in Baby Lisa Case Reveals Man Carrying Baby on Night Irwin Went Missing
by America's Newsroom Posted in: America's Newsroom, Baby Lisa, Lisa Irwin, Missing, Missing Baby, Missing Missouri Baby   


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 24, 2011, 11:35:48 AM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 11:36:26 AM
New Video May Support Claim by Parents That Missouri Baby Lisa Irwin Was Abducted
Published October 24, 2011


Surveillance footage from a gas station near the Kansas City home where baby Lisa Irwin disappeared shows a man exiting a wooded area shortly before the baby was reported missing.

The video, first reported by ABC News, shows a man dressed in white leaving the leafy area at 2:30 a.m. local time the night the baby was last seen. The footage may support the claim by the girl's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, that the 10-month-old was abducted from their home.   

Discovery of the video follows statements by at least three witnesses who reported seeing a man with a baby in that area on the night Lisa disappeared.

<snipped>

Witness Mike Thompson told ABC's "Good Morning America" that he was heading home on his motorcycle around 4:00 a.m. Oct. 4 when he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near the child's home.

"[It was] 4 o'clock in the morning, 45 degrees, the baby don't have a blanket or coat or nothin', and this guy's walking down the street," Thompson said. "I thought it was kind of weird."

Two other witnesses, who were not named, said they encountered a similar scene a few hours earlier.

"It was shocking because I couldn't imagine anybody outside walking with their baby in the cold like that with no clothes on," the female witness told ABC.

Former FBI agent Brad Garrett told the network that the timeline did not make sense.

"Are you going to logically abduct a child, let's say in the midnight area, then two to four hours later, you are spotted in the proximity of the neighborhood," he said. "I mean, that doesn't make any sense. It could be true, of course, but the logic of abducting a child is so you can take the child to some other location."

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/24/new-video-may-support-claim-by-parents-that-missouri-baby-lisa-irwin-was/?test=latestnews



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 11:50:11 AM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 11:53:39 AM
DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET

<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html

Guess what?  Back at you, Dr. Pinsky.

(Deuteronomy 24:16) - "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin."

(Ezekiel 18:20) - "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself."

I am aware that there are contradictory statements in the bible concerning the "Sins of the father."

I'm sorry.  I so try to stay away from this thread because I feel that much of it is  unfair.
 
I'm not defending Deborah Bradley.  I don't know if she did something to her daughter to cause her disappearance or not, but then I remind myself, "What if she is innocent?  What if all of this is thrown at her and she truly had nothing to do with it?"  If she didn't have her hair done, would someone say, "Look at her.  If I were going to be on TV, I'd do something about my hair?" I don't know. Does this prove anything? I find it all very disheartening.

Whatever happened to little Lisa, I fear and feel that she will never be found and that no one will ever be prosecuted for it.  And while I usually disagree with people, mainly defense attorneys who say, "The police never looked at anyone else," I feel that is the case here and frankly, if I were accused by the police of having done something illegal, I would hire a lawyer and follow that lawyer's advice.  I don't think that indicates guilt.  It might not. A perfectly innocent person in that position would be extremely foolish not to obtain the services of an attorney and follow his/her advice, part of which would be to not talk to the police without my attorney present.

I would like to know, but of course what I would like to know bears no relevance in this, if Deborah really failed a polygraph test.  LE has been known to tell a "suspect" that they failed when they did not fail. Even a well-know ex-detective said that on national TV.  Am I the only one who thinks the police have been suspiciously silent about a lot of this and most of what is in the public domain is speculation and innuendo generated by God knows what?

Look.  I don't know what is right for everyone else.  I only know what is right for me and what my own conscience will allow.  But I strive to be a fair and honest person.
IMO the most important person in this case is Lisa Irwin.  I believe she has been lost in this and it is she who deserves every consideration and chance.  As that silly crying judge in Florida said when speaking of Dannilynn Smith,  "Give the kid a break."

I only ask that you consider what I've said.  I have no right to tell any of you what to do.  And if I did, you certainly have a right not to do it.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 24, 2011, 11:54:56 AM
I still contend that the layout of the house is a clue that they "abduction" was not carried out by someone who randomly picked the house from the outside.

The driveway that goes to the back is something burglars look for.  They can use that driveway to get to the back of the house where there entry will be less noticeable. 

The same feature also makes me suspicious of JI's story that he noticed the front door unlocked as soon as he got home.  I think he would have parked his van in the back, where the garage is, and enter from the back.  He wouldn't have checked the front door until after he realized that other things were awry in the house. 

Just my humble two-bits   ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 11:58:09 AM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 12:05:21 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 12:05:23 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
no.  I'm thinking of a much older case.  Boy!  I'm getting old.  It just won't come to me.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: 4 Donks on October 24, 2011, 12:11:23 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


The warrant says there was a hit in the bedroom near the bed ...it never says it was the carpet. It could have been something else like one of the articles removed from the house that was near the bed on the floor.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 12:12:35 PM
DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET

<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html

Guess what?  Back at you, Dr. Pinsky.

(Deuteronomy 24:16) - "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin."

(Ezekiel 18:20) - "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself."

I am aware that there are contradictory statements in the bible concerning the "Sins of the father."

I'm sorry.  I so try to stay away from this thread because I feel that much of it is  unfair.
 
I'm not defending Deborah Bradley.  I don't know if she did something to her daughter to cause her disappearance or not, but then I remind myself, "What if she is innocent?  What if all of this is thrown at her and she truly had nothing to do with it?"  If she didn't have her hair done, would someone say, "Look at her.  If I were going to be on TV, I'd do something about my hair?" I don't know. Does this prove anything? I find it all very disheartening.

Whatever happened to little Lisa, I fear and feel that she will never be found and that no one will ever be prosecuted for it.  And while I usually disagree with people, mainly defense attorneys who say, "The police never looked at anyone else," I feel that is the case here and frankly, if I were accused by the police of having done something illegal, I would hire a lawyer and follow that lawyer's advice.  I don't think that indicates guilt.  It might not. A perfectly innocent person in that position would be extremely foolish not to obtain the services of an attorney and follow his/her advice, part of which would be to not talk to the police without my attorney present.

I would like to know, but of course what I would like to know bears no relevance in this, if Deborah really failed a polygraph test.  LE has been known to tell a "suspect" that they failed when they did not fail. Even a well-know ex-detective said that on national TV.  Am I the only one who thinks the police have been suspiciously silent about a lot of this and most of what is in the public domain is speculation and innuendo generated by God knows what?

Look.  I don't know what is right for everyone else.  I only know what is right for me and what my own conscience will allow.  But I strive to be a fair and honest person.
IMO the most important person in this case is Lisa Irwin.  I believe she has been lost in this and it is she who deserves every consideration and chance.  As that silly crying judge in Florida said when speaking of Dannilynn Smith,  "Give the kid a break."

I only ask that you consider what I've said.  I have no right to tell any of you what to do.  And if I did, you certainly have a right not to do it.




In the interest of correctness, I believe that what the Florida judge actually said  was "Give the kid a shot."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 24, 2011, 12:13:06 PM
DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET

<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html

Guess what?  Back at you, Dr. Pinsky.

(Deuteronomy 24:16) - "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin."

(Ezekiel 18:20) - "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself."

I am aware that there are contradictory statements in the bible concerning the "Sins of the father."

I'm sorry.  I so try to stay away from this thread because I feel that much of it is  unfair.
 
I'm not defending Deborah Bradley.  I don't know if she did something to her daughter to cause her disappearance or not, but then I remind myself, "What if she is innocent?  What if all of this is thrown at her and she truly had nothing to do with it?"  If she didn't have her hair done, would someone say, "Look at her.  If I were going to be on TV, I'd do something about my hair?" I don't know. Does this prove anything? I find it all very disheartening.

Whatever happened to little Lisa, I fear and feel that she will never be found and that no one will ever be prosecuted for it.  And while I usually disagree with people, mainly defense attorneys who say, "The police never looked at anyone else," I feel that is the case here and frankly, if I were accused by the police of having done something illegal, I would hire a lawyer and follow that lawyer's advice.  I don't think that indicates guilt.  It might not. A perfectly innocent person in that position would be extremely foolish not to obtain the services of an attorney and follow his/her advice, part of which would be to not talk to the police without my attorney present.

I would like to know, but of course what I would like to know bears no relevance in this, if Deborah really failed a polygraph test.  LE has been known to tell a "suspect" that they failed when they did not fail. Even a well-know ex-detective said that on national TV.  Am I the only one who thinks the police have been suspiciously silent about a lot of this and most of what is in the public domain is speculation and innuendo generated by God knows what?

Look.  I don't know what is right for everyone else.  I only know what is right for me and what my own conscience will allow.  But I strive to be a fair and honest person.
IMO the most important person in this case is Lisa Irwin.  I believe she has been lost in this and it is she who deserves every consideration and chance.  As that silly crying judge in Florida said when speaking of Dannilynn Smith,  "Give the kid a break."

I only ask that you consider what I've said.  I have no right to tell any of you what to do.  And if I did, you certainly have a right not to do it.




Babybear...I am definitely open to looking at this case from the angle of Deborah being innocent.  We really have to have that open mindedness when researching a case.  I hope that Lisa is found safe and if that is not God's will then I pray that they find her soon so that those involved will be prosecuted.  The longer it takes the more difficult it will be for LE.  I however do feel that LE is looking at other angles besides the parents.  It's odd that the neighbors aren't complaining about a kidnapper being on the loose.  Maybe they are and I haven't seen it though. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 12:15:22 PM
BonyenKCTV5 Bonyen Lee
Lisa Irwin's family attorney tried to outrun local reporters Sunday after giving networks a tour of the family home.
8 minutes ago http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 24, 2011, 12:16:08 PM
Who in the world would put the lights on in the house IF whoever is taking a child????
Does not make ANY sense whatsoever.

You don't want to bring attention, hey I'm taking a child.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 12:18:47 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: theboyzmom on October 24, 2011, 12:29:53 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

They may have closed for the renovation or the electricians could have been doing prep work before closing. I know if we have to close (normally we are open 24/7) we get as much done as possible before closing so that we can be closed as little as possible. Either way, I think the dad was at work when he said he was. But was Lisa alive when he left? That is the million dollar question. I do not believe that we have heard the drinking buddy say anything about seeing the baby during the time they were together.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: theboyzmom on October 24, 2011, 12:34:01 PM
DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET

<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html

Guess what?  Back at you, Dr. Pinsky.

(Deuteronomy 24:16) - "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin."

(Ezekiel 18:20) - "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself."

I am aware that there are contradictory statements in the bible concerning the "Sins of the father."

I'm sorry.  I so try to stay away from this thread because I feel that much of it is  unfair.
 
I'm not defending Deborah Bradley.  I don't know if she did something to her daughter to cause her disappearance or not, but then I remind myself, "What if she is innocent?  What if all of this is thrown at her and she truly had nothing to do with it?"  If she didn't have her hair done, would someone say, "Look at her.  If I were going to be on TV, I'd do something about my hair?" I don't know. Does this prove anything? I find it all very disheartening.

Whatever happened to little Lisa, I fear and feel that she will never be found and that no one will ever be prosecuted for it.  And while I usually disagree with people, mainly defense attorneys who say, "The police never looked at anyone else," I feel that is the case here and frankly, if I were accused by the police of having done something illegal, I would hire a lawyer and follow that lawyer's advice.  I don't think that indicates guilt.  It might not. A perfectly innocent person in that position would be extremely foolish not to obtain the services of an attorney and follow his/her advice, part of which would be to not talk to the police without my attorney present.

I would like to know, but of course what I would like to know bears no relevance in this, if Deborah really failed a polygraph test.  LE has been known to tell a "suspect" that they failed when they did not fail. Even a well-know ex-detective said that on national TV.  Am I the only one who thinks the police have been suspiciously silent about a lot of this and most of what is in the public domain is speculation and innuendo generated by God knows what?

Look.  I don't know what is right for everyone else.  I only know what is right for me and what my own conscience will allow.  But I strive to be a fair and honest person.
IMO the most important person in this case is Lisa Irwin.  I believe she has been lost in this and it is she who deserves every consideration and chance.  As that silly crying judge in Florida said when speaking of Dannilynn Smith,  "Give the kid a break."

I only ask that you consider what I've said.  I have no right to tell any of you what to do.  And if I did, you certainly have a right not to do it.




BabyBear - I agree with much of what you say - I really do not think that parents of missing children can get a fair break. No matter what they do some people look askance at them. Sad but true. In this case, I do think that either mom did something or caused something to be done to little Lisa. Too many things just do not add up.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 12:36:20 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

Since LE said there was no need to polygraph Mr. Irwin since they had video of his being at work, one can reasonably assume that had there been any suspicious activity shown on his part, they would have given him a polygraph since he volunteered to take one.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 12:37:57 PM
This may have already been discussed and I missed it but did Deborahs brother live with her or was he just there that day for a lil while?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Gypsy DD on October 24, 2011, 12:46:58 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html
Images: Attorney Gives Tour Of Baby Lisa's Home
The attorney for Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley gave ABC's Matt Gutman an exclusive tour of the home investigators searched on Wednesday. These are images from the tour.

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/slideshow/news/29569030/detail.html#ixzz1bi1x49AD


Thanks trimmonthelake

Could this be another avenue for defense attorneys to reap big bucks off the disappearance of a missing child?

Janet



ITA Janet..and it could be possible this is where Debbie's new makeover came from..included with the rights to a story ..who thinks like this when their infant child is missing?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 24, 2011, 01:08:03 PM
Who in the world would put the lights on in the house IF whoever is taking a child????
Does not make ANY sense whatsoever.

You don't want to bring attention, hey I'm taking a child.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Or be sure to wear white clothing in the night and walk under bright lights.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 01:18:26 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-family-attorney-questions-massive/story?id=14802367
Missing Baby Lisa: Family Attorney Questions 'Massive, Public' Search
By CHRISTINA NG
Oct. 24, 2011


An attorney for the family of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin questioned the motivations behind what she called the "enormous, massive, public" search of the family's Missouri home.

"It almost seemed as if that was more for the public's benefit than for the benefit of doing a thorough search of this house," attorney Cyndy Short told "Good Morning America."

"It was interesting to watch the activity outside of this house when they were conducting the search. There were so many crime scene people that were seen outside, and seen coming in and out of this house…carrying a rolled up rug," Short said. "It really gave the impression that there was a lot going to be removed from this house."
 ::snipping2::

 ::snipping2::
The six items removed from the home were a multicolored comforter, purple shorts, a Disney character shirt, a glow worm toy, a Cars-themed blanket, rolls of tape and a tape dispenser.

"The search itself lasted 17 hours. That's a very long time, and would suggest a very thorough search. But now having been in the house and seen how many items they took out of the house, it's frankly surprising," Short said.

Though suspicions have surrounded Lisa's parents, surveillance video footage obtained by ABC News over the weekend also fueled speculation that the toddler was snatched from her crib by a stranger.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 01:18:46 PM
FRAACIA WINE IN A BOX
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_69j7nVK5I7c/S8JQGi2VgdI/AAAAAAAAAIQ/BlC990WkcNI/s320/FranziaRefreshingWhiteWineLowRes.jpg)


"Deborah also said Monday that she’d had between five and 10 glasses of wine and that she was drunk the night Baby Lisa vanished"
http://www.examiner.com/missing-persons-in-national/baby-lisa-irwin-missing-developments-case-have-people-jumping-to-conclusions


(http://s-ak.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/terminal01/2010/4/6/14/enhanced-buzz-15060-1270577692-5.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Blonde on October 24, 2011, 01:32:49 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-eyewitnesses-speak-14785603

Missing Baby Lisa Irwin: Eyewitnesses Speak Out
 Two people claim that they saw a man carrying a baby in the middle of the night.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 01:34:42 PM
BonyenKCTV5 Bonyen Lee
As Deborah Bradley walks into house I asked her why she hasn't done local interviews. She said "because we're grieving". #LisaIrwin
5 minutes ago  http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5
 (http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 01:41:31 PM
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/24/video-megyn-kelly-reveals-copy-of-police-search-warrant-for-irwins-home-in-case-of-missing-baby-lisa/
1:26 pm ET October 24, 2011
VIDEO: Megyn Kelly Reveals Copy of Police Search Warrant for Irwins’ Home in Case of Missing Baby Lisa
by America Live Posted in: America Live, Deborah Bradley, Jeremy Irwin, Lisa Irwin, Megyn Kelly, Missing Missouri Baby   


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 02:17:11 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 24, 2011, 02:28:30 PM
FRAACIA WINE IN A BOX
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_69j7nVK5I7c/S8JQGi2VgdI/AAAAAAAAAIQ/BlC990WkcNI/s320/FranziaRefreshingWhiteWineLowRes.jpg)


"Deborah also said Monday that she’d had between five and 10 glasses of wine and that she was drunk the night Baby Lisa vanished"
http://www.examiner.com/missing-persons-in-national/baby-lisa-irwin-missing-developments-case-have-people-jumping-to-conclusions



For those who haven't done the math - one liter equals 34 ounces, so a box is around 100 ounces.  A glass of wine can vary by the type of vessel used to drink, but the standard is between 4 and 6 ounces.  If we take the middle of that, say 5 ounces per glass, and she drank 10 glasses, that is 50 ounces consumed, or half the box. 

Even in my younger days when I drank regularly and robustly, five glasses of wine would have me past the point of functional impairment.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 02:34:05 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
cartfly you crack me up !  ::MonkeyHaHa::
 ::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 02:35:35 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
cartfly you crack me up !  ::MonkeyHaHa::
 ::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::
oops got in your  box !....cartfly you crack me up!  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 02:37:48 PM
BonyenKCTV5 Bonyen Lee
As Deborah Bradley walks into house I asked her why she hasn't done local interviews. She said "because we're grieving". #LisaIrwin
5 minutes ago  http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5
 (http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5)

Following the Megyn Kelly interview ... Joe Tacopina stated that there would be no more interviews for the time being.

Considering Tacopina revealed that he had been in contact with Debbie and Jeremy in the past week ... it can be assumed that he was aware that the drinking binge was going to be revealed in that interview.

Was Debbie's admission all a strategy to establish a defence.

Janet

++++++

Debbie Blacked Out?

FULL INTERVIEW: Megyn Kelly Presses Parents of Baby Lisa Irwin on Disappearance, Asks If They ‘Sold or Killed’ Their Daughter
October 17, 2011


<snipped>

In part one of Megyn Kelly’s incredibly revealing interview, Deborah Bradley admitted to being drunk after consuming “several” glasses of wine on the night that Lisa disappeared. Bradley acknowledged that she drinks a couple of nights a week after putting her children to bed, saying, “I don’t see the problem with me having grown up time.”

While she conceded that it was a possibility that she blacked out, Bradley doesn’t believe she did anything to harm her baby

<snipped>

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/17/full-interview-megyn-kelly-presses-parents-of-baby-lisa-irwin-on-disappearance-asks-if-they-sold-or-killed-their-daughter/


One Week Contact

Holloway Suspect's Ex-Attorney Agress to Represent Missing Missouri Baby's Parents
By Marla Cichowski
Published October 17, 2011


<snipped>

Tacopina said he's been in contact with Lisa's parents over the phone since last week.

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/17/holloway-suspect-former-attorney-takes-case-missing-missouri-babys-parents/#ixzz1b67Ha4t8


No More Interviews

Baby Lisa's Parents Get Top Defense Lawyer Joe Tacopina
Oct. 17, 2011


<snipped>

Tacopina said that the couple will not be doing any more television or radio interviews for the time being. He expressed his belief that the focus needs to stay on finding Lisa.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-top-defense-attorney-representing-parents/story?id=14752818


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 02:42:37 PM
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lawyer-gas-station-video-could-be-key-to-baby-lisa-case-20111024,0,1376988.story
Lawyer: Gas Station Video Could be Key to Baby Lisa Case
Kathy Quinn, edited by Jason Vaughn
1:17 p.m. CDT, October 24, 2011

 ::snipping2::
"I think the BP video by itself doesn't mean a lot, but it means something when you look at the context of the sighting of the man with the baby, the location of those sighting and the dumpster fire - apparently a resident of that complex saw a man standing by the dumpster," said Short.

Short says while stranger abductions are rare, that's what she thinks has taken place in this case.

"That video is important and possibly relevant when you put all of those things together. By itself not so much, but together it may mean something big," said Short.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Brandi on October 24, 2011, 02:49:56 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

OMG!

 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 02:55:31 PM

DR. DREW
Aired October 19, 2011 - 21:00:00   ET


<snipped>

PINSKY: ... I actually spoke with a member of Deborah`s family this week, and he - again, there`s all kinds of things circulating around out there. But just to report what I had been told by a family member, was that Lisa`s family has a long, long history of multiple generations of severe abuse, abandonment, neglect, and guess what alcoholism and drug addiction.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/19/ddhln.01.html



Babybear

I agree.  Each of us ... not matter what our upbringing ... knows right from wrong and ... must take personal responsibility both spiritually and legally for our "choices" to do wrong.

However ... I also believe that children raised in an environment that respects the legal and moral boundaries established for the well-being of all are fortunate to be have been blessed with a foundation to derive wise lifestyle choices in later years.

Janet

+++++


(Deuteronomy 24:16) - "Fathers shall not be put to death for their sons, nor shall sons be put to death for their fathers; everyone shall be put to death for his own sin."

(Ezekiel 18:20) - "The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself."

<Respectfully snipped by Tamikosmom>



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 03:00:54 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 03:19:30 PM
Kansas City police are not commenting on surveillance video that shows a man walking out of the woods near the Irwin home. Read more: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 2:04 PM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/24/90fa9114-7707-4712-a92d-8a2d8c393c91_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bjDRRcoK


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 03:32:13 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 24, 2011, 03:40:46 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

Since LE said there was no need to polygraph Mr. Irwin since they had video of his being at work, one can reasonably assume that had there been any suspicious activity shown on his part, they would have given him a polygraph since he volunteered to take one.

Not necessarily.  If LE has any hint JI is covering for his wife, they might not want that 'proven' so quickly and put him on the defensive.  Their play would more likely be to wait and hope he tells what he knows.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 03:44:31 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


The warrant says there was a hit in the bedroom near the bed ...it never says it was the carpet. It could have been something else like one of the articles removed from the house that was near the bed on the floor.

It does,however say "Floor."  When one says floor, one usually means floor and not something on the floor, in which case it would say "Blanket (Or whatever) on floor near bed." It is an extremely salient point that a portion of the carpet was not cut out and taken.  After all, whatever might have been on the floor (If not the carpet) was on the carpet and might have contaminated the carpet.  I think it means what it says.  "Floor."
I also think that LE is purposely attempting to turn the public against Deborah Bradley and doing an efficient job of it


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 24, 2011, 03:46:49 PM
BonyenKCTV5 Bonyen Lee
As Deborah Bradley walks into house I asked her why she hasn't done local interviews. She said "because we're grieving". #LisaIrwin
5 minutes ago  http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5
 (http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5)

That's pretty brazen.  A man is seen with their baby by three witnesses after she is taken and they are 'grieving'?

They have no hope that she's still alive?  Why not?

That said I do want to say with regards to hair and make up, there are many innocent mothers of missing children who still take care of their physical selves.  Desiree Young, mother of Kyron Horman, comes to mind, but there are many others. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 24, 2011, 03:56:11 PM
BonyenKCTV5 Bonyen Lee
As Deborah Bradley walks into house I asked her why she hasn't done local interviews. She said "because we're grieving". #LisaIrwin
5 minutes ago  http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5
 (http://twitter.com/#!/BonyenKCTV5)

That's pretty brazen.  A man is seen with their baby by three witnesses after she is taken and they are 'grieving'?

They have no hope that she's still alive?  Why not?

That said I do want to say with regards to hair and make up, there are many innocent mothers of missing children who still take care of their physical selves.  Desiree Young, mother of Kyron Horman, comes to mind, but there are many others. 

IF this is true, ya right why would you be grieving??
Keep on talking, here's a  ::MonkeyShovel::

 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 03:58:14 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that Tushould mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

Since LE said there was no need to polygraph Mr. Irwin since they had video of his being at work, one can reasonably assume that had there been any suspicious activity shown on his part, they would have given him a polygraph since he volunteered to take one.

Not necessarily.  If LE has any hint JI is covering for his wife, they might not want that 'proven' so quickly and put him on the defensive.  Their play would more likely be to wait and hope he tells what he knows.
I agree with u. Any way u look at this scenario, this mother has brought on this scrutiny herself. We may be wrong about her having some guilt, but its clear to me why people are looking at her. How do u get confused about the time u put your sick child to bed by 4 hours? & how do u not check on that sick child at some point? As far as the makeover, people grieve differently, I know, but I cant imagine that my appearane would even cross my mind if my child were missing. I would be doing well to change my clothes once a week. Who gets their hair done? Dont care what excuse u try to make for that one, I wont understand it. What searching has this couple done? What have they done period? Oh, beside criticize law enforcement. Reminds me of the anthonys. Those tshirts are doing alot to find this poor baby, just like the caylee tshirts that her lying family wore. Im just waiting for deborah to tell the public to get off their a## & start looking for her child.. Like I said, she may be innocent, but so far she hasnt appeared that way to me. All just my opinion.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 03:59:45 PM
Hi All - Question Please - I'm having difficulty finding information about Deb Bradley's mother that has passed on.  I was sure I read it here on Monkeys - but I can't find it.

Does anyone have a link or info I can go to?  I had heard Deborah's mother was dead - drug and alcohol related death - but I don't know if it was suicide or not, and, there was a report Deb was the one that found her mother???

Can anyone here shed some light on this please so I can sor fact from rumor?

Thank you!

~ fanta

Hi Fanta~
Maybe this will help. (This is from the first thread that is now in the high profile archives subfolder.)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857)

Johnny Chiaravallotti:

In 2001 , My sister Lisa passed away from a suspicious 'accidental drug overdose'. Lisa was the mother of Debbie , the mother of this missing 10 month old. This missing baby was named after her deceased grandmother. I am the Uncle of the mother (Debbie) of this missing child. My sister Lisa had 3 kids and was estranged from her husband , who was thousands of dollars behind in back child support and was living in Delaware close to his estranged wife and his 3 kids. He did not like it on the east coast. He was from Kansas City. My 36 year old sister mysteriously died from what they called an 'accidental overdose'. After her death , her estranged husband who owed thousands in back child support and didn't like living in Delaware anyway , took his 3 kids and returned to Kansas City. Debbie , the mother of this missing child , is one of them 3 kids. Now here we are 10 years after the mysterious and suspicious death of my 36 year old sister Lisa ... and the 10 month old baby who was named after her is missing. I have no been in contact with them for a few years so I don't know what's been going on in Missouri. But I will say that I have always been suspicious about my sister Lisa's estranged husband and whether or not he was involved in her death. He had plenty of motive. And he left Delaware very fast. Lisa's death looked like an accident so it was ruled an accident. But I know my sister and she was smarter than that. And her death occurred on the 10th birthday of her youngest son who found her dead in bed on his birthday. Is the disappearance of this child and the suspicious death of my sister connected ? Is this just a coincidence ? We have one Lisa dead and another Lisa missing. I love my niece Debbie , the mother of this missing child. And I have no idea who her boyfriend is. Nor do I know what was going on in their lives in the past few years. But I do know that I lost my sister Lisa 10 years ago and I will always be very suspicious about her death. Now this poor child is missing. I am curious to know if her grandfather was around.
12 minutes ago · Like · 2 people

https://www.facebook.com/find.lisa?sk=wall
[/b]

And then this from Seahorse:

Quote
Thank-you Itaryl...
I checked google newspaper archives and this may be, not confirmed, my opinion I will try for an obit in the local paper
Edit to fix link.  MB

Kansas City Star, The :  http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎ (http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎)
$2.95 - Kansas City Star - Apr 13, 2001


 

Lisa was the daughter of the late John Chivalette Jr., who died in 1968. She is survived by her husband of 16 years, David L. Netz Jr., two sons, ...

A possible match.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504)



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 03:59:54 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 04:02:47 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB
h
Maybe because the Mother was not the caretaker of baby Haleigh when she came up missing, and....oh, never mind, this is baby Lisa's thread and Im not gonna talk about Haleighs case here!!
Edit to fix typo in name.  MB


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 04:03:33 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


The warrant says there was a hit in the bedroom near the bed ...it never says it was the carpet. It could have been something else like one of the articles removed from the house that was near the bed on the floor.

It does,however say "Floor."  When one says floor, one usually means floor and not something on the floor, in which case it would say "Blanket (Or whatever) on floor near bed." It is an extremely salient point that a portion of the carpet was not cut out and taken.  After all, whatever might have been on the floor (If not the carpet) was on the carpet and might have contaminated the carpet.  I think it means what it says.  "Floor."
I also think that LE is purposely attempting to turn the public against Deborah Bradley and doing an efficient job of it
I dont see that they have even released much info or made much for statements about anything they are investigating. I think her own words & actions turned the public against her.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Lake Erie Princess on October 24, 2011, 04:10:37 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 24, 2011, 04:16:56 PM
HLM is on now, with Vinnie...so far good show..
I watch free on my pc...... ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Amys Sister on October 24, 2011, 04:28:42 PM
Hi All - Question Please - I'm having difficulty finding information about Deb Bradley's mother that has passed on.  I was sure I read it here on Monkeys - but I can't find it.

Does anyone have a link or info I can go to?  I had heard Deborah's mother was dead - drug and alcohol related death - but I don't know if it was suicide or not, and, there was a report Deb was the one that found her mother???

Can anyone here shed some light on this please so I can sor fact from rumor?

Thank you!

~ fanta

Hi Fanta~
Maybe this will help. (This is from the first thread that is now in the high profile archives subfolder.)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857)

Johnny Chiaravallotti:

In 2001 , My sister Lisa passed away from a suspicious 'accidental drug overdose'. Lisa was the mother of Debbie , the mother of this missing 10 month old. This missing baby was named after her deceased grandmother. I am the Uncle of the mother (Debbie) of this missing child. My sister Lisa had 3 kids and was estranged from her husband , who was thousands of dollars behind in back child support and was living in Delaware close to his estranged wife and his 3 kids. He did not like it on the east coast. He was from Kansas City. My 36 year old sister mysteriously died from what they called an 'accidental overdose'. After her death , her estranged husband who owed thousands in back child support and didn't like living in Delaware anyway , took his 3 kids and returned to Kansas City. Debbie , the mother of this missing child , is one of them 3 kids. Now here we are 10 years after the mysterious and suspicious death of my 36 year old sister Lisa ... and the 10 month old baby who was named after her is missing. I have no been in contact with them for a few years so I don't know what's been going on in Missouri. But I will say that I have always been suspicious about my sister Lisa's estranged husband and whether or not he was involved in her death. He had plenty of motive. And he left Delaware very fast. Lisa's death looked like an accident so it was ruled an accident. But I know my sister and she was smarter than that. And her death occurred on the 10th birthday of her youngest son who found her dead in bed on his birthday. Is the disappearance of this child and the suspicious death of my sister connected ? Is this just a coincidence ? We have one Lisa dead and another Lisa missing. I love my niece Debbie , the mother of this missing child. And I have no idea who her boyfriend is. Nor do I know what was going on in their lives in the past few years. But I do know that I lost my sister Lisa 10 years ago and I will always be very suspicious about her death. Now this poor child is missing. I am curious to know if her grandfather was around.
12 minutes ago · Like · 2 people

https://www.facebook.com/find.lisa?sk=wall
[/b]

And then this from Seahorse:

Quote
Thank-you Itaryl...
I checked google newspaper archives and this may be, not confirmed, my opinion I will try for an obit in the local paper
Edit to fix link.  MB

Kansas City Star, The :  http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎ (http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎)
$2.95 - Kansas City Star - Apr 13, 2001


 

Lisa was the daughter of the late John Chivalette Jr., who died in 1968. She is survived by her husband of 16 years, David L. Netz Jr., two sons, ...

A possible match.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504)



Does this mean the man wearing the 'sinister' shirt at Lisa's prayer vigil is the same man suspected by DB's uncle to have possibly murdered his sister/DB's mother? 

We may be going way off base but it does add another dimension to the dynamics of this case and, frankly, the choice of shirt for the vigil was strange.  I initially thought it might mean he thought DB did something sinister with her baby and he was making a point of that publicly. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: seahorse on October 24, 2011, 04:31:34 PM
Good afternoon Monday's,

Thank-you Cartfly, for giving me credit for the obit. It was a tough one to find- I needed Lisa "Chivalette" Netz,
it would not come-up without her surname (maiden) in the middle.  I like to connect the dots.  JQ was chatting about
findagrave and mentioned what we already have. It is said, "one hand washes the other and they both wash the face"  :)

I was listening to Peter Hyatt's show (rerun) questions were raised where are the "bros"? We have heard nothing about
her bros, I wonder why? 

I am reposting, L.C.N. obit, I see she born in September, I wonder if this is what pushed DB (over the edge, IMO)
Sept 5, her mom was born, and Oct 3-4 the baby went missing. 


Birth:  Sep. 5, 1964
Death:  Apr. 10, 2001

Lisa Ann Chivalette Netz, 36, of New Castle, DE formerly of Delaware County.


Lisa was born in Chester where she was reared and educated in Chichester School District. She attended Delaware Technical School earning a certificate in the computer field. She was a self-employed house cleaner for the last 8 years. She has been a member of Alcoholics Anonymous for the last 8 years. She was the daughter of the late John Chivalette, Jr. who died in 1968.

She is survived by her husband of 16 years, David L. Netz, Jr.; 2 sons, Anthony and Phillip Netz both at home; 1 daughter, "Lil" Debbie Netz at home; her mother, Margaret Pretti Chivalette of Linwood; 2 brothers, John Chivalette of White Haven, PA and Vincent Chivalette of Linwood; 3 sisters, Cindy LeRette of Kansas City, MO, Debbie Shanko of Aston, PA and Kristin Mushinski of Linwood; many nieces, nephews and friends.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=23510022


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 04:31:46 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


The warrant says there was a hit in the bedroom near the bed ...it never says it was the carpet. It could have been something else like one of the articles removed from the house that was near the bed on the floor.

It does,however say "Floor."  When one says floor, one usually means floor and not something on the floor, in which case it would say "Blanket (Or whatever) on floor near bed." It is an extremely salient point that a portion of the carpet was not cut out and taken.  After all, whatever might have been on the floor (If not the carpet) was on the carpet and might have contaminated the carpet.  I think it means what it says.  "Floor."
I also think that LE is purposely attempting to turn the public against Deborah Bradley and doing an efficient job of it
Glad to see you back here Babybear. This is such a sad case.

The only person I have any concern for is this innocent baby, Lisa. I am probably wrong for judging DB but she was responsible for the well being of this child. And I guess allot of us are jaded because most of the time it turns out to be a parent that harmed the child.

I really believed DB in the beginning. But she lost me the minute she announced a 4 hour timeline change along with a revelation that she was "drunk" like it was nothing. (with a very defensive attitude, I might add) This speaks volumes to me. Why lie other than to cover her own wrong doing? Her lie was not to protect/find her daughter. That lie was to protect Debbie. I did not see the Mother I thought she was anymore. Why did she lie but now can remember an "oddball" time of 6:40 being the time she put Lisa down?

Why not say to LE and media in the beginning, "I was feeling stressed and wanted a little adult time so my neighbor and I sat outside and drank wine. I didn't mean to drink so much. I made a mistake, Oh, my God what have I done? Now my child is missing and please help find her for me......"

If DB had continued acting like an innocent Mother of a missing child, she wouldn't be facing the media scrutiny, imo.  I think her true colors showed up in that interview where she admitted to drinking and the "so what" attitude. Mother's all over the world were appalled at her demeaner.....

If she proves to be innocent in all of this (and I truly hope she is because this would leave hope that baby Lisa was alive) I will be left questioning my mother's intuition. All JMO  (respectively submitted)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 24, 2011, 04:32:58 PM

The video, recorded on the night that Lisa went missing, shows a man in the distance wearing WHITE PANTS. Why is this significant?
 ::snipping2::
 http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/24/new-development-surveillance-video-in-baby-lisa-case-reveals-man-carrying-baby-on-night-irwin-went-missing/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed:+FoxNewsInsider+%28Fox+News+Insider%29

 Two separate witnesses claim that they saw a man in white pants carrying a baby on the night Irwin went missing

(So is this true or bad reporting)?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 04:35:31 PM
 ::MonkeyWitch1::
HLM is on now, with Vinnie...so far good show..
I watch free on my pc...... ::MonkeyWink::
Im sorry, but u can get surveillance from 10 gas stations in 10 areas & theres a good chance it will pick up someone walking. What does this prove?!? What kind of idiot would kidnap a baby &then walk down a main road holding that baby, half naked @2 in the morning to draw attention to themselves? Im sorry, but that makes zero sense to me. nevermind the fact that these 2 witnesses of the man with the baby live in this area, heard the story of this abducted child the next day, yet didnt report this odd occurence for at least a week? &this abductor walked around for hours carrying a 30 pound half naked child in the chilly night air, in full view of anyone who happened to be around, WITH A KIDNAPPED CHILD? Really?
OT, but can someone please explain to jinkasaurus how to properly pronounce corroberate. Where is she getting that w from? That has driven me nuts since the CA trial.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 04:37:03 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that should mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

Since LE said there was no need to polygraph Mr. Irwin since they had video of his being at work, one can reasonably assume that had there been any suspicious activity shown on his part, they would have given him a polygraph since he volunteered to take one.

Not necessarily.  If LE has any hint JI is covering for his wife, they might not want that 'proven' so quickly and put him on the defensive.  Their play would more likely be to wait and hope he tells what he knows.

OMG--OK


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 24, 2011, 04:40:14 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 04:40:31 PM
Thanks Seahorse for the entire obituary. ::MonkeyAngel:: ::MonkeyAngel::

I have been looking high and low for it....... Cheers to you::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Lake Erie Princess on October 24, 2011, 04:42:01 PM
Hi All - Question Please - I'm having difficulty finding information about Deb Bradley's mother that has passed on.  I was sure I read it here on Monkeys - but I can't find it.

Does anyone have a link or info I can go to?  I had heard Deborah's mother was dead - drug and alcohol related death - but I don't know if it was suicide or not, and, there was a report Deb was the one that found her mother???

Can anyone here shed some light on this please so I can sor fact from rumor?

Thank you!

~ fanta

Hi Fanta~
Maybe this will help. (This is from the first thread that is now in the high profile archives subfolder.)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1474857#msg1474857)

Johnny Chiaravallotti:

In 2001 , My sister Lisa passed away from a suspicious 'accidental drug overdose'. Lisa was the mother of Debbie , the mother of this missing 10 month old. This missing baby was named after her deceased grandmother. I am the Uncle of the mother (Debbie) of this missing child. My sister Lisa had 3 kids and was estranged from her husband , who was thousands of dollars behind in back child support and was living in Delaware close to his estranged wife and his 3 kids. He did not like it on the east coast. He was from Kansas City. My 36 year old sister mysteriously died from what they called an 'accidental overdose'. After her death , her estranged husband who owed thousands in back child support and didn't like living in Delaware anyway , took his 3 kids and returned to Kansas City. Debbie , the mother of this missing child , is one of them 3 kids. Now here we are 10 years after the mysterious and suspicious death of my 36 year old sister Lisa ... and the 10 month old baby who was named after her is missing. I have no been in contact with them for a few years so I don't know what's been going on in Missouri. But I will say that I have always been suspicious about my sister Lisa's estranged husband and whether or not he was involved in her death. He had plenty of motive. And he left Delaware very fast. Lisa's death looked like an accident so it was ruled an accident. But I know my sister and she was smarter than that. And her death occurred on the 10th birthday of her youngest son who found her dead in bed on his birthday. Is the disappearance of this child and the suspicious death of my sister connected ? Is this just a coincidence ? We have one Lisa dead and another Lisa missing. I love my niece Debbie , the mother of this missing child. And I have no idea who her boyfriend is. Nor do I know what was going on in their lives in the past few years. But I do know that I lost my sister Lisa 10 years ago and I will always be very suspicious about her death. Now this poor child is missing. I am curious to know if her grandfather was around.
12 minutes ago · Like · 2 people

https://www.facebook.com/find.lisa?sk=wall
[/b]

And then this from Seahorse:

Quote
Thank-you Itaryl...
I checked google newspaper archives and this may be, not confirmed, my opinion I will try for an obit in the local paper
Edit to fix link.  MB

Kansas City Star, The :  http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎ (http://www.google.com/search?tbm=nws&hl=en&gl=us&as_q=lisa+netz&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_scoring=r&btnG=Search&as_qdr=a&as_mindate=9%2F9%2F11&as_maxdate=10%2F9%2F11&as_drrb=a&as_nsrc=&as_nloc=&as_author=&as_occt=any&tbs=ar%3A1bits‎)
$2.95 - Kansas City Star - Apr 13, 2001


 

Lisa was the daughter of the late John Chivalette Jr., who died in 1968. She is survived by her husband of 16 years, David L. Netz Jr., two sons, ...

A possible match.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504  (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12149.msg1475504#msg1475504)



Does this mean the man wearing the 'sinister' shirt at Lisa's prayer vigil is the same man suspected by DB's uncle to have possibly murdered his sister/DB's mother? 

We may be going way off base but it does add another dimension to the dynamics of this case and, frankly, the choice of shirt for the vigil was strange.  I initially thought it might mean he thought DB did something sinister with her baby and he was making a point of that publicly. 
I missed it. What was the "sinister" shirt ?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 24, 2011, 04:44:19 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

What a mess! I wonder if thy took baby Lisas last known diapers to see if thy culd sample for anything shed been given,or tell from last time she culd have been alive?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 04:44:33 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
ummmmm........I could say so much about this....but, I hope they have gotten somekind of evidense that will tell them where baby Lisa is and what happened to her!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 04:44:37 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
The bed looks about the size of a Queen size. The bed wouldn't leave much room if three people were to sleep in it, imo.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 04:49:05 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15788106/local-attorney-we-might-not-get-the-happy-ending-that-we-want#.TqWI9bppw9U.twitter
Baby Lisa’s parents’ attorney losing hope
Posted: Oct 23, 2011 10:10 AM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 9:29 AM CDT


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Short said that when she went into the house where baby Lisa went missing, she was stunned to find not much was actually taken or disturbed during the 17-hour search police conducted on Wednesday.

"There are no walls torn out. So whatever x-ray they did, did not confirm whatever it was that some dog thought it sniffed," said Short.

"My fear is that we have missed this critical time to find this baby," said Short.  "It really breaks your heart that we have been looking in the wrong direction, and as a result of that we might not get the happy ending that we want. That is what I'm sad about."

Items listed in the search warrant return indicated police took a comforter, two pieces of baby clothing, a toy, a "Cars" themed blanket, rolls of tape, a tape dispenser and a large roll of carpet which Short said didn't even come from inside the house like everyone presumed.

"The carpet that was paraded in and out that we were allowed to see actually came from the shed at the back of the house, and it was not inside the house at all. There is no carpeting that was removed from any portion of the house," said Short.

Police said in the search warrant that an FBI cadaver dog hit on the scent of a deceased human in Deborah's bedroom on Monday, and that is why a more intrusive search of the house was needed.

But Short was surprised the floor in that room was not removed to isolate and further test that evidence.

Short said one of the unfortunate things about the investigation is that the family has been deprived of information.

"I went into the bedroom fully expecting that I would see certain portions of the carpet cut out, because if your scent is evidence, just like any other kind of evidence. So if you have that evidence, you cut it out, you collect it and you preserve it and you list it on your search warrant return.  And you all have gotten a copy of that search warrant return so you know it's not there," said Short.
 ::snipping2::


The warrant says there was a hit in the bedroom near the bed ...it never says it was the carpet. It could have been something else like one of the articles removed from the house that was near the bed on the floor.

It does,however say "Floor."  When one says floor, one usually means floor and not something on the floor, in which case it would say "Blanket (Or whatever) on floor near bed." It is an extremely salient point that a portion of the carpet was not cut out and taken.  After all, whatever might have been on the floor (If not the carpet) was on the carpet and might have contaminated the carpet.  I think it means what it says.  "Floor."
I also think that LE is purposely attempting to turn the public against Deborah Bradley and doing an efficient job of it
Glad to see you back here Babybear. This is such a sad case.

The only person I have any concern for is this innocent baby, Lisa. I am probably wrong for judging DB but she was responsible for the well being of this child. And I guess allot of us are jaded because most of the time it turns out to be a parent that harmed the child.

I really believed DB in the beginning. But she lost me the minute she announced a 4 hour timeline change along with a revelation that she was "drunk" like it was nothing. (with a very defensive attitude, I might add) This speaks volumes to me. Why lie other than to cover her own wrong doing? Her lie was not to protect/find her daughter. That lie was to protect Debbie. I did not see the Mother I thought she was anymore. Why did she lie but now can remember an "oddball" time of 6:40 being the time she put Lisa down?

Why not say to LE and media in the beginning, "I was feeling stressed and wanted a little adult time so my neighbor and I sat outside and drank wine. I didn't mean to drink so much. I made a mistake, Oh, my God what have I done? Now my child is missing and please help find her for me......"

If DB had continued acting like an innocent Mother of a missing child, she wouldn't be facing the media scrutiny, imo.  I think her true colors showed up in that interview where she admitted to drinking and the "so what" attitude. Mother's all over the world were appalled at her demeaner.....

If she proves to be innocent in all of this (and I truly hope she is because this would leave hope that baby Lisa was alive) I will be left questioning my mother's intuition. All JMO  (respectively submitted)

Hi Cartfly---Your points are all well taken and I can see you could be right.  But sometimes we get mixed up while under stress and later have to correct something.  I don't know this was the case, of course, but I don't place as much emphasis on it as others seem to.

But there is something I think we can all agree on.  Deborah Bradley had no business whatsoever drinking to excess and becoming "drunk" when she was the sole caretaker of three young children, one an infant.  One glass of wine might be "Adult time." Five to 10 glasses is totally irresponsible. I don't drink alcohol at all so I can't speak to blackouts, etc.  (I don't object to social drinking, I'm just alergic to it and serve wine in my own home, but not from a box. LOL  ::MonkeyTongue:: Back atcha MB.)  But I can fully agree with those who say that Deborah is responsible for the disappearance of Lisa, although I don't see enough evidence to say she harmed her.  She failed in her duty as a mother and I can't think of any failure which is more dispicable.  Jackie Kennedy said, and I believe it to be true, that "No matter what you may accomplish in life, if you fail as a mother, nothing else matters."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: akmom on October 24, 2011, 05:04:20 PM
I see  a ridiculous amount of hazards........


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 24, 2011, 05:04:48 PM
ITA with you about social drinking Babybear.  Not that it matters, but we also serve wine from bottles to guests and drink bottled
 wine   ourselves and occasionally drink and serve boxed wine   ::MonkeyTease::  (back atcha babybear)  ::MonkeyDevil::  But there is one thing whether it's from a box or a bottle is that I wouldn't continue to serve a guest after  two drinks unless they were planning to stay the night, and we haven't had a sleep over in quite some time.  Five to ten drinks?  Way too much imo  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 05:14:10 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::

Whoaa!!!! I think Cartfly meant that as a joke, not to be taken literally.  Next we will hear it on Nancy Grace as a fact.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 05:17:30 PM
ITA with you about social drinking Babybear.  Not that it matters, but we also serve wine from bottles to guests and drink bottled
 wine   ourselves and occasionally drink and serve boxed wine   ::MonkeyTease::  (back atcha babybear)  ::MonkeyDevil::  But there is one thing whether it's from a box or a bottle is that I wouldn't continue to serve a guest after  two drinks unless they were planning to stay the night, and we haven't had a sleep over in quite some time.  Five to ten drinks?  Way too much imo  ::MonkeyNoNo::

MuffyBee--How does one put a box of white wine in a wine cooler?  Do you have to have a square one?  Do they come in silver? I'll take your word for it about the boxes.  Its just not something I've ever done, not to say I won't sometime in the future.  In fact, now after our discussions, I probably will.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 05:22:55 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB
h
Maybe because the Mother was not the caretaker of baby Haleigh when she came up missing, and....oh, never mind, this is baby Lisa's thread and Im not gonna talk about Haleighs case here!!
Edit to fix typo in name.  MB

Quite true, Higherhopes, perhaps I misunderstood the conversation but I thought it was about mothers getting their hair done when a child is missing, not a babysitter.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 24, 2011, 05:33:59 PM
ITA with you about social drinking Babybear.  Not that it matters, but we also serve wine from bottles to guests and drink bottled
 wine   ourselves and occasionally drink and serve boxed wine   ::MonkeyTease::  (back atcha babybear)  ::MonkeyDevil::  But there is one thing whether it's from a box or a bottle is that I wouldn't continue to serve a guest after  two drinks unless they were planning to stay the night, and we haven't had a sleep over in quite some time.  Five to ten drinks?  Way too much imo  ::MonkeyNoNo::

MuffyBee--How does one put a box of white wine in a wine cooler?  Do you have to have a square one?  Do they come in silver? I'll take your word for it about the boxes.  Its just not something I've ever done, not to say I won't sometime in the future.  In fact, now after our discussions, I probably will.

I can answer your questions in Musings.   ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 05:44:27 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::

Whoaa!!!! I think Cartfly meant that as a joke, not to be taken literally.  Next we will hear it on Nancy Grace as a fact.
Your right! :)
Too funny Babybear. ::MonkeyAngel:: Things do take on a life of their own huh? (LOL)

I do not drink that often either babybear but that is mostly because I am with kids 24/7 and have a really low tolerance. I wonder what was going on in DB's life, that she over did her drinking that night. In know way do I think DB intentionally harmed little Lisa. Lisa appeared to be very happy, well dressed and adored by her brothers.... that is what is so baffling. The sightings of someone carrying a baby is even more baffling..... :smt102
 





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 05:48:03 PM
I see  a ridiculous amount of hazards........
I was about to say the same thing...is that wall socket without the cover as it looks like or does it have white recepticals and a black plate ? Looks naked to me ...gee you would think that Jeremy would have one of those and could pop one on right quick being an electrical contractor and all?  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 05:49:49 PM
KMBC's Peggy Breit is interviewing the attorney representing baby Lisa's parents...she'll have a live report coming up on KMBC 9 News at 5.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 4:42 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bjpXCnGa


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 05:52:31 PM
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/local-attorney-for-family-of-lisa-irwin-sets-up-website-website-to-provide-information-about-case#ixzz1bjhTVfWV
Local attorney for family of Lisa Irwin sets up website website to provide information about case
Posted: 3:59 PM
Last Updated: 44 minutes ago
    By: Chris Hernandez

KANSAS CITY, Mo. - The local attorney for Lisa Irwin’s family, Cyndy Short, told NBC Action News a website has been set up to provide information about the case.

Short said there will soon be new flyers, t-shirts, and even wristbands passed out to try and keep a search going for the missing baby.
Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/local-attorney-for-family-of-lisa-irwin-sets-up-website-website-to-provide-information-about-case#ixzz1bjq4rVbj



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cecilita on October 24, 2011, 05:56:31 PM
I have been following this case and I just wanted to ask is there anyone anywhere that saw Lisa alive after the father went to work ? Anyone that is not family? I have been thinking that if dad leaves for work around 5 ish each day that he must work the 2nd shift so that Tushould mean that he is home during the day and the two boys would be at school leaving Jeremy and Deborah home with Lisa ...what if something happened to Lisa late Sunday night or even Monday during the day but they didn't report it immediatly. What if they just told the boys that Lisa was sick to be quiet and they had already gotten rid of her before the boys even came home from school? I would be very interested in knowing the whereabouts of both of them on monday during the day . Also a lot of electricians carry those large black canvas bags or if they are going to work a long shifrt they might take a large igloo cooler with lots of drinks and several meals. I would like to know if he was ever seen with anything like that ...Perhaps they bagged the baby and put her in one of those and he walked right out of the house with her then disposed of her on the way or even put her in the dumpster at the starbucks if he knew that the trash pick up would be by early that morning. I think I read that they did search the landfill but she is just so small seems that unless they used dogs there it owuld be hard to find her especially if she were concealed in something. So sad, just wished that we were privy to all of the info that PD has. God bless baby Lisa !

Apparently he doesn't "Leave at 5ish each day."  He is a contract electrician and this was his first night time job. He worked during the period of time that Starbuck's was closed. The job took him longer than he thought it would.  There is video of his working there during the time he said he did.   God bless baby Lisa, indeed.
I gues a contract electrician would have hours that vary so his shift could be different every day and perhaps periods of time in between jobs with a few days off. I do not think that Starbucks closes at 5 o'clock at least ours does not so if he had to work there after they closed where was he until then? Maybe it was a new starbucks that had not opened for bussiness yet? Never the less it is my understanding that this was the first time that he worked into the early morning hours. Since he was on video the whole night that he was working I wonder did the video ever show him answering his cell phone or leaving in and/or out of the back door at anytime that night? Anyone coming up there to see him? So many questions .

Since LE said there was no need to polygraph Mr. Irwin since they had video of his being at work, one can reasonably assume that had there been any suspicious activity shown on his part, they would have given him a polygraph since he volunteered to take one.

Not necessarily.  If LE has any hint JI is covering for his wife, they might not want that 'proven' so quickly and put him on the defensive.  Their play would more likely be to wait and hope he tells what he knows.
I agree with u. Any way u look at this scenario, this mother has brought on this scrutiny herself. We may be wrong about her having some guilt, but its clear to me why people are looking at her. How do u get confused about the time u put your sick child to bed by 4 hours? & how do u not check on that sick child at some point? As far as the makeover, people grieve differently, I know, but I cant imagine that my appearane would even cross my mind if my child were missing. I would be doing well to change my clothes once a week. Who gets their hair done? Dont care what excuse u try to make for that one, I wont understand it. What searching has this couple done? What have they done period? Oh, beside criticize law enforcement. Reminds me of the anthonys. Those tshirts are doing alot to find this poor baby, just like the caylee tshirts that her lying family wore. Im just waiting for deborah to tell the public to get off their a## & start looking for her child.. Like I said, she may be innocent, but so far she hasnt appeared that way to me. All just my opinion.
well the father was babysitting Lisa when the mother went to buy wine, "I believe that the father was sleeping" in order to work the hole night, right? what about if the father got mad at the baby for just being a baby when he was trying to sleep....we don't know how he was with the kids, it could be possible that he was an abusive father. Maybe he was rough with the baby that day and then later she died after he left work.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 05:57:22 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB
h
Maybe because the Mother was not the caretaker of baby Haleigh when she came up missing, and....oh, never mind, this is baby Lisa's thread and Im not gonna talk about Haleighs case here!!
Edit to fix typo in name.  MB

Quite true, Higherhopes, perhaps I misunderstood the conversation but I thought it was about mothers getting their hair done when a child is missing, not a babysitter.
Any way u look at it, its unfathomble to me ro think my thoughts would go to getting my hair colored with some low lights just two weeks after I lost my child, possibly forever, no matter what the circumstances were.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 24, 2011, 06:01:30 PM
KMBC's Peggy Breit is interviewing the attorney representing baby Lisa's parents...she'll have a live report coming up on KMBC 9 News at 5.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 4:42 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bjpXCnGa


There's link from the link above that has pic's of the house.

It appears the stairs to somewhere doesn't have railings.   
::MonkeyShocked::
Where to those stairs take you to, anyone know?
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l145/pharlap_9999/norailing.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 06:24:06 PM
KMBC's Peggy Breit is interviewing the attorney representing baby Lisa's parents...she'll have a live report coming up on KMBC 9 News at 5.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 4:42 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bjpXCnGa


There's link from the link above that has pic's of the house.

It appears the stairs to somewhere doesn't have railings.   
::MonkeyShocked::
Where to those stairs take you to, anyone know?
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l145/pharlap_9999/norailing.jpg)
My guess would be that the stairs are going to a basement...I lived in Mo. for a while and both houses had basements, but I do not know for sure.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: theboyzmom on October 24, 2011, 06:29:32 PM
KMBC's Peggy Breit is interviewing the attorney representing baby Lisa's parents...she'll have a live report coming up on KMBC 9 News at 5.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 4:42 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bjpXCnGa


There's link from the link above that has pic's of the house.

It appears the stairs to somewhere doesn't have railings.   
::MonkeyShocked::
Where to those stairs take you to, anyone know?
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l145/pharlap_9999/norailing.jpg)
My guess would be that the stairs are going to a basement...I lived in Mo. for a while and both houses had basements, but I do not know for sure.

Looks like basement stairs to me also - if so, the basement is finished - I see a drop ceiling in there. Basement steps often do not have railings - even if it is finished - makes it easier to move large objects up and down the steps - ours did not have railing when we moved in and the kids play down there. One of the first things I did is put spindles in the highest stairs that the kids could hurt themselves falling from while leaving the bottom ones open to move things up and down.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 06:56:27 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29574361/detail.html
Attorney Reiterates Innocence Of Baby Lisa's Parents
Stay With KMBC.com For Baby Lisa Updates
POSTED: 5:23 pm CDT October 24, 2011
UPDATED: 5:32 pm CDT October 24, 2011

Video at link.
KANSAS CITY, Mo. -- The Kansas City attorney representing the parents of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin spoke to the local media on Monday and reiterated her belief that her clients had nothing to do with the disappearance of the baby.

Attorney Cyndy Short told KMBC's Peggy Breit that she took the case after speaking with Lisa's family and believing they were innocent.

Short also explained that Lisa's parents, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin, declined to speak with reporters on Monday because they're afraid of the attention the missing baby case has brought to their family.

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/news/29574361/detail.html#ixzz1bk67ruBa




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 07:01:30 PM
::MonkeyWitch1::
HLM is on now, with Vinnie...so far good show..
I watch free on my pc...... ::MonkeyWink::
Im sorry, but u can get surveillance from 10 gas stations in 10 areas & theres a good chance it will pick up someone walking. What does this prove?!? What kind of idiot would kidnap a baby &then walk down a main road holding that baby, half naked @2 in the morning to draw attention to themselves? Im sorry, but that makes zero sense to me. nevermind the fact that these 2 witnesses of the man with the baby live in this area, heard the story of this abducted child the next day, yet didnt report this odd occurence for at least a week? &this abductor walked around for hours carrying a 30 pound half naked child in the chilly night air, in full view of anyone who happened to be around, WITH A KIDNAPPED CHILD? Really?
OT, but can someone please explain to jinkasaurus how to properly pronounce corroberate. Where is she getting that w from? That has driven me nuts since the CA trial.
too many episodes of Bugs bunny would be my guess  ::MonkeyWitch1::

Does anyone else remember in one of first videos the witness wife ("L. Parscale") described seeing what her husband said he saw while going to work. She (Ms Parscale) did not say that she witnessed the man with the baby too. Why is she saying she and her hubby both saw the same thing? I do not think she is fibbing or anything, but the way I remember it she was describing what her her husband told her. ~confused again~


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 07:06:22 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyDevil:: While a search is going on and a tat LOL......thanks Cartfly, I needed the levity

 ::rhino::




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cw618 on October 24, 2011, 07:09:54 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

that long pillow looks like my body pillow for my bad back


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:14:06 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)


" Bradley said. "I take good care of my kids. I keep my house clean, do their laundry....."
http://www.news-leader.com/article/20111017/NEWS11/111017002/UPDATE-Kansas-City-mom-admits-she-drunk-when-her-baby-vanished




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 07:14:11 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15863026/lisas-mother-we-are-grieving?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
SEARCH FOR LISA
Lisa's mother: 'We are grieving'
Posted: Oct 24, 2011 3:34 PM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 5:20 PM CDT

Video at link.
KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

It has now been almost three weeks since baby Lisa was last seen, and on Monday KCTV5 asked the child's mother why she won't talk to local media.

When Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley arrived back to the house on North Walrond, KCTV5's Bonyen Lee asked the parents of baby Lisa Irwin on Monday if it was true that they were getting paid to avoid local reporters.

"No, not at all," said Deborah Bradley, the mother of the missing baby.

When asked why they would not talk to local reporters, Deborah replied, "Because we are grieving."
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 07:14:28 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB
h
Maybe because the Mother was not the caretaker of baby Haleigh when she came up missing, and....oh, never mind, this is baby Lisa's thread and Im not gonna talk about Haleighs case here!!
Edit to fix typo in name.  MB

 ::rhino:: ::rhino::

ITA........when you are the ONLY parent in charge of 3 small children and one a sick baby, IMO you don't get slap ass drunk (I thinks it is a defense strategy after hearing the day before the atty for Riley Fox's dad state he was drunk and voila now she is too!)......plus, I think she brought scrutiny on herself.......right or wrong, I think going only on Nat'l interviews  ($$$$$ for pics) and the attitude of almost defiance "yeah I was drunk, what does that have to do with HER" smacked me in the face, but then again she may be innocent (although I SO doubt it), if so she needs to have a serious come to Jesus moment on her parenting skills. JMOO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:14:50 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/17/article-0-0E589FBA00000578-202_634x335.jpg)
Is that a cell phone or wallet in her hand?



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 07:27:46 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/17/article-0-0E589FBA00000578-202_634x335.jpg)
Is that a cell phone or wallet in her hand?


I can't tell for sure ....I saw on HLN that three cell phones were also missing...do we know who these cell phones  were suppose to belong to ?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 24, 2011, 07:32:26 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::

Whoaa!!!! I think Cartfly meant that as a joke, not to be taken literally.  Next we will hear it on Nancy Grace as a fact.
Your right! :)
Too funny Babybear. ::MonkeyAngel:: Things do take on a life of their own huh? (LOL)

I do not drink that often either babybear but that is mostly because I am with kids 24/7 and have a really low tolerance. I wonder what was going on in DB's life, that she over did her drinking that night. In know way do I think DB intentionally harmed little Lisa. Lisa appeared to be very happy, well dressed and adored by her brothers.... that is what is so baffling. The sightings of someone carrying a baby is even more baffling..... :smt102
 





Yes, Cartfly.  In every picture of Lisa, she looked healthy, happy and clean, well dressed.  She was obviously a child who was well taken care of.  It is baffling.  I checked with NOAA and the low temperature on Oct. 2 in Kansas City was 41 degrees, quite chilly.  Much too cold to be carrying a baby dressed only in diaper.  To me the thought of someone just willingly helping Deborah get rid of a dead baby is mind boggling.  I have no friends or family who would help me do a thing like that and I doubt that many people do. In fact, my family would probably have me committed.  The thought of walking around for a couple of hours carrying a dead baby is equally mind boggling, to the point of not possible.

One night Nancy Grace said that the going price for a baby was $80,000 in New York.  I hope that if Lisa were taken by a stranger, it was for this purpose, that she is alive and well and being taken care of by people who were desperate for a baby.  And I hope she is returned to her family.  You are correct in that it seemed the brothers adored her.  In fact, it seemed that her mother and father did, too.  Once in a great while you hear of a baby being kidnapped, raised as their own child by strangers, and only finding out about this as an adult. 

But I know that sometimes things are not as they seem. I pray she was taken by someone who will see that she's taken care of.  She is a beautiful, charming baby and deserves so much. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 24, 2011, 07:33:52 PM
http://www.blogher.com/justice-caylee-why-so-many-are-pointing-lisa-irwins-parents?wrap=blogher-topics/news-politics/current-events&crumb=106919
Justice for Caylee: Is That Why
So Many Are Pointing At Lisa
Irwin's Parents?
October 24, 2011 3:00 pm by JennaHatfield in News & Politics


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:37:53 PM
5:00 pm - Deborah buys box of wine at store
Jeremy Irwin goes to work Lisa starts drinking with neighbor box of wine and downs 5 - 10 glasses of wine

6:40 pm - last time Deborah Bradly saw Lisa.
OR
10:30pm - last time Deborah Bradly saw Lisa, neighbor goes home, Deborah &  her son and
the new kitten fell asleep in bed together
, Baby Lisa was put in her room, she closed the door to the baby's room and her other son was in his bed. The baby monitor was on.



12:15 am man is seen on gas station video tape (approx 15 min walk from Irwin home)

2:40 am man coming out of the woods.

4:00 a.m. Oct. 4 when Witness Mike Thompson said he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near the child's home
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/24/new-video-may-support-claim-by-parents-that-missouri-baby-lisa-irwin-was/#ixzz1bkCMz6OZ

Dad comes home and sees lights on, front door unlocked thinks something is amiss so he says he
goes to the boys bedroom and they are sleeping.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/06/police-say-parents-missing-missouri-10-month-old-girl-no-longer-cooperating/



WHO WAS IN BED WITH DEBORAH?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:39:27 PM
http://digitaljournal.com/blog/13400
Link about Deborah sleeping with her OLDER SON!




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 07:42:29 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15863026/lisas-mother-we-are-grieving?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
SEARCH FOR LISA
Lisa's mother: 'We are grieving'
Posted: Oct 24, 2011 3:34 PM CDT Updated: Oct 24, 2011 5:20 PM CDT

Video at link.
KANSAS CITY, MO (KCTV) -

It has now been almost three weeks since baby Lisa was last seen, and on Monday KCTV5 asked the child's mother why she won't talk to local media.

When Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley arrived back to the house on North Walrond, KCTV5's Bonyen Lee asked the parents of baby Lisa Irwin on Monday if it was true that they were getting paid to avoid local reporters.

"No, not at all," said Deborah Bradley, the mother of the missing baby.

When asked why they would not talk to local reporters, Deborah replied, "Because we are grieving."
 ::snipping2::
BBM 
Bet Taco Joe is telling her to keep her lips zipped from now on. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:45:21 PM
http://digitaljournal.com/blog/13400
Link about Deborah sleeping with her OLDER SON!

Dad comes home and sees lights on, front door unlocked thinks something is amiss so he says he
goes to the boys bedroom and they are sleeping.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/06/police-say-parents-missing-missouri-10-month-old-girl-no-longer-cooperating/


me thinks her size/weight and being drunk - she suffocated her own baby, baby fell on floor hence decomposition dog picks up..............







Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 07:46:46 PM
What makes NO sense to me is that a man was seen by random ppl at midnight, 2am and 4am.....WTF would you walk around in the cold with a baby that was kidnapped for 4 hrs??? Also, the man in the vid from the gas station is a red herring at the moment, first of he/she clearly wasn't holding anything and it could be someone walking home from a bar, a teen taking a short cut or anything....it makes no sense to me, and statistically the odds are 94.4 % that she was taken/killed by someone within or known to the family, IIRC that stats were 278 infants under 1 were missing and of that only 13 were taken by strangers and all but one were returned alive.

There is one crazy case where a woman stole a infant and took her as her own, then set a fire to cover her tracks (although I NEVER understood how the FD could say a baby was burned when there obviously was no baby in the crib).......about 5-6 yrs later bio mom is at a b-day party and recognizes the child and is 100% certain she is her daughter, takes hair from a brush and it was a DNA match......however, the mom in that case appeared to me to be distraught unlike DB, granted we all grieve differently but come on, not cooperating with LE until they agree to your terms, not letting them re-interview the kids only says one thing to me and that is she is concerned with herself and NOT Lisa.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:48:39 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)


Wonder where the baby monitor was?



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 07:48:54 PM
5:00 pm - Deborah buys box of wine at store
Jeremy Irwin goes to work Lisa starts drinking with neighbor box of wine and downs 5 - 10 glasses of wine

6:40 pm - last time Deborah Bradly saw Lisa.
OR
10:30pm - last time Deborah Bradly saw Lisa, neighbor goes home, Deborah &  her son and
the new kitten fell asleep in bed together
, Baby Lisa was put in her room, she closed the door to the baby's room and her other son was in his bed. The baby monitor was on.



12:15 am man is seen on gas station video tape (approx 15 min walk from Irwin home)

2:40 am man coming out of the woods.

4:00 a.m. Oct. 4 when Witness Mike Thompson said he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near the child's home
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/24/new-video-may-support-claim-by-parents-that-missouri-baby-lisa-irwin-was/#ixzz1bkCMz6OZ

Dad comes home and sees lights on, front door unlocked thinks something is amiss so he says he
goes to the boys bedroom and they are sleeping.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/06/police-say-parents-missing-missouri-10-month-old-girl-no-longer-cooperating/



WHO WAS IN BED WITH DEBORAH?


I understand letting a child sleep in your room........but IMO the wrong one slept in there according to DB, I would bring my sick child in and put them in a pack and play before another child, but that's just me and I was always a worrier when they were sick.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 24, 2011, 07:50:07 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/17/article-0-0E589FBA00000578-202_634x335.jpg)
Is that a cell phone or wallet in her hand?



Leaning towards phone but can't be certain

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6034/6277890949_d199743dd5_o.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:57:53 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/17/article-0-0E589FBA00000578-202_634x335.jpg)
Is that a cell phone or wallet in her hand?



Leaning towards phone but can't be certain

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6034/6277890949_d199743dd5_o.jpg)

Thanks Klassend. Looked like a phone to me too.
But I thought her phones had been turned off due to non payment?????



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 24, 2011, 07:59:52 PM
I understand letting a child sleep in your room........but IMO the wrong one slept in there according to DB, I would bring my sick child in and put them in a pack and play before another child, but that's just me and I was always a worrier when they were sick.

I agree many parents put a sick child in their room, but in this case we have Deborah telling us that it was the son, not the baby and the dad says the son was in his room sleeping when he came home........... discrepancy


LE needs to find the baby's body.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 08:01:56 PM
Apologies if this has been posted before. This is from one of the witness' of the man carrying a baby at 12 ish that night on his FB (also note that you should be able to see the comments to this picture if you click on the last link in this post):

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale
Baby Lisa house from my backyard
and

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale don't know them but their kids go to school with my kids
October 19 at 7:17pm

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/300336_262376500465443_100000792845229_658302_1863703139_n.jpg)

 https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall (https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater  (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 08:06:30 PM
Apologies if this has been posted before. This is from one of the witness' of the man carrying a baby at 12 ish that night on his FB (also note that you should be able to see the comments to this picture if you click on the last link in this post):

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale
Baby Lisa house from my backyard
and

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale don't know them but their kids go to school with my kids
October 19 at 7:17pm

[imghttps://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/300336_262376500465443_100000792845229_658302_1863703139_n.jpg[/img]

 https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall (https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater  (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater)

hmmm....seems he is struck by the oddity of DB's beauty maintenance at this time as well.
Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale
So let me get this straight, Baby lisa's mom is all tore up about her missing baby but yet she got fresh highlights in her hair. smh


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 24, 2011, 08:14:01 PM
In this video it appears to be a wallet.  Store surveillance starts at :35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8)

At first I thought it looked like a VCR tape as it's about the same size.  You can see it in her hand while she's in the wine aisle.  At the checkout, it appears that she shoves a receipt into it.  However, as she exits the store, there is nothing in her hand except that lovely box of wine.  Weird.  Did she give it to her brother to hold?  If so, why?  She clearly has an open hand in which to carry it.  Or, did she lose her wallet?  With her address and pics of baby Lisa in it? 

The footage where she exits the store is at 1:00.  He's holding a bag in one hand, his keys in the other.  She appears to only being carrying the wine.  Is there a way to confirm her right hand is empty?  Cuz it sure looks like it.  If she did lose her wallet it would make sense that someone would find it and then go to the addy on her ID card and kidnap the cute baby in the pics.  Or is this too crazy of a theory?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 24, 2011, 08:18:56 PM
In this video it appears to be a wallet.  Store surveillance starts at :35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8)

At first I thought it looked like a VCR tape as it's about the same size.  You can see it in her hand while she's in the wine aisle.  At the checkout, it appears that she shoves a receipt into it.  However, as she exits the store, there is nothing in her hand except that lovely box of wine.  Weird.  Did she give it to her brother to hold?  If so, why?  She clearly has an open hand in which to carry it.  Or, did she lose her wallet?  With her address and pics of baby Lisa in it? 

The footage where she exits the store is at 1:00.  He's holding a bag in one hand, his keys in the other.  She appears to only being carrying the wine.  Is there a way to confirm her right hand is empty?  Cuz it sure looks like it.  If she did lose her wallet it would make sense that someone would find it and then go to the addy on her ID card and kidnap the cute baby in the pics.  Or is this too crazy of a theory?
Tucked under her armpit maybe?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 08:19:13 PM
In this video it appears to be a wallet.  Store surveillance starts at :35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8)

At first I thought it looked like a VCR tape as it's about the same size.  You can see it in her hand while she's in the wine aisle.  At the checkout, it appears that she shoves a receipt into it.  However, as she exits the store, there is nothing in her hand except that lovely box of wine.  Weird.  Did she give it to her brother to hold?  If so, why?  She clearly has an open hand in which to carry it.  Or, did she lose her wallet?  With her address and pics of baby Lisa in it? 

The footage where she exits the store is at 1:00.  He's holding a bag in one hand, his keys in the other.  She appears to only being carrying the wine.  Is there a way to confirm her right hand is empty?  Cuz it sure looks like it.  If she did lose her wallet it would make sense that someone would find it and then go to the addy on her ID card and kidnap the cute baby in the pics.  Or is this too crazy of a theory?
Its not crazy, but im sure if it happened she would have told LE that. On the other hand, if she is as guiltu as she looks to me, I hope she doesnt read here &use that idea.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 08:19:34 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 08:23:31 PM
JVM is also showing pics of the bedroom and where the cadaver dog hit which is on the left side of the bed in front of a night stand (if you are standing at the foot of the bed facing it). Hopefully we can get a screen shot of those pics.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Brandi on October 24, 2011, 08:29:42 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/17/article-0-0E589FBA00000578-202_634x335.jpg)
Is that a cell phone or wallet in her hand?

(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Image64-5.png)

Blew the hand up 300%.

From the proportions, it looks like a cell phone to me.

Or a very narrow wallet.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 24, 2011, 08:33:19 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::

Whoaa!!!! I think Cartfly meant that as a joke, not to be taken literally.  Next we will hear it on Nancy Grace as a fact.
Your right! :)
Too funny Babybear. ::MonkeyAngel:: Things do take on a life of their own huh? (LOL)

I do not drink that often either babybear but that is mostly because I am with kids 24/7 and have a really low tolerance. I wonder what was going on in DB's life, that she over did her drinking that night. In know way do I think DB intentionally harmed little Lisa. Lisa appeared to be very happy, well dressed and adored by her brothers.... that is what is so baffling. The sightings of someone carrying a baby is even more baffling..... :smt102
 





Yes, Cartfly.  In every picture of Lisa, she looked healthy, happy and clean, well dressed.  She was obviously a child who was well taken care of.  It is baffling.  I checked with NOAA and the low temperature on Oct. 2 in Kansas City was 41 degrees, quite chilly.  Much too cold to be carrying a baby dressed only in diaper.  To me the thought of someone just willingly helping Deborah get rid of a dead baby is mind boggling.  I have no friends or family who would help me do a thing like that and I doubt that many people do. In fact, my family would probably have me committed.  The thought of walking around for a couple of hours carrying a dead baby is equally mind boggling, to the point of not possible.

One night Nancy Grace said that the going price for a baby was $80,000 in New York.  I hope that if Lisa were taken by a stranger, it was for this purpose, that she is alive and well and being taken care of by people who were desperate for a baby.  And I hope she is returned to her family.  You are correct in that it seemed the brothers adored her.  In fact, it seemed that her mother and father did, too.  Once in a great while you hear of a baby being kidnapped, raised as their own child by strangers, and only finding out about this as an adult. 

But I know that sometimes things are not as they seem. I pray she was taken by someone who will see that she's taken care of.  She is a beautiful, charming baby and deserves so much. 
I hate to state the obvious, but caylee anthony appeared happy, healthy & well dressed. She also appeared loved & happy in pics with kc. However, there is NOTHING anyone could tell me that would convince me that kc did not kill her child. I will never know if it was intentional or accidental, but I do know that even though she might have appeared to love her child to anyone that knew her, she clearly did not. Accidents happen to children,but normal people dont cover them up unless they r cold &heartless. If it is proven that this mother is innocent, I will eat crow, but I dont think it will happen. At the very most, we all may be left forever wondering. I dont think a kidnapper will be found tho.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 08:46:55 PM
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

So many Q's unanswered.......1-) What time did JI arrive home and who can validate this other than sippy mom, 2-) WHO other than JI & DB actually saw the baby that night, 3-) were they ever interviewed seperately by LE, 4-( who in the hell worried about getting their hair cut and or/colored......I picked out flowers in my PJ's , no shower and I don't even think I brushed my teeth come to think of it, my hair had horrible roots and was all matted but it didn't matter, it took all the energy I had to get out of bed and go pick out and order the flowers, so I can't imagine those getting all re-done ::MonkeyMad::  5-) where were the purple shorts and the rest of the property taken that are listed on the SW (I'd assume they'd have taken those the first night if they thought they were important........unless that is what the cadaver dogs hit on by the bed ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 24, 2011, 08:50:40 PM
Think I am going to call it a night...hope we get good news on baby Lisa soon.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 24, 2011, 08:55:27 PM
I have had a problem with the cell phone story from the beginning.  As I understand it, any cell phone - even those disconnected from regular cell service - can call 911.  http://www.911cellphonebank.com/ (http://www.911cellphonebank.com/)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 08:56:38 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.


Parscale is also describing the man as white shirt and sweat pants, she said something also about not much hair and being slender about 6 foot but again I am just paraphrasing. If LE has not polyed JI, I would be surprised. Surely, LE should poly everyone right? Somehow, I don't think DB could have disposed of a dead baby Lisa, but perhaps JI could.....just speculating....maybe he feared losing his other son that he fought so hard for.....?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 24, 2011, 08:59:35 PM
In this video it appears to be a wallet.  Store surveillance starts at :35

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6It6Z1sSHS8)

At first I thought it looked like a VCR tape as it's about the same size.  You can see it in her hand while she's in the wine aisle.  At the checkout, it appears that she shoves a receipt into it.  However, as she exits the store, there is nothing in her hand except that lovely box of wine.  Weird.  Did she give it to her brother to hold?  If so, why?  She clearly has an open hand in which to carry it.  Or, did she lose her wallet?  With her address and pics of baby Lisa in it? 

The footage where she exits the store is at 1:00.  He's holding a bag in one hand, his keys in the other.  She appears to only being carrying the wine.  Is there a way to confirm her right hand is empty?  Cuz it sure looks like it.  If she did lose her wallet it would make sense that someone would find it and then go to the addy on her ID card and kidnap the cute baby in the pics.  Or is this too crazy of a theory?
Its not crazy, but im sure if it happened she would have told LE that. On the other hand, if she is as guiltu as she looks to me, I hope she doesnt read here &use that idea.

That's what I was thinking.  And then I tried to think of any reason why I wouldn't tell LE about my missing wallet:

1)  Stash of drugs (a marijuana joint or some oxycodone pills)
2)  Incriminating receipts (motel rooms, duct tape)
3)  Stolen property (someone's credit card)
4)  Phone numbers of people she wouldn't want JI to know about


Tucked under her armpit maybe?

I looked but I just don't see anything.  There's another video that shows them close-up at the checkout and you can see it on the counter in front of her and it's definitely a wallet.  Clear as day.





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 09:01:55 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.


Parscale is also describing the man as white shirt and sweat pants, she said something also about not much hair and being slender about 6 foot but again I am just paraphrasing. If LE has not polyed JI, I would be surprised. Surely, LE should poly everyone right? Somehow, I don't think DB could have disposed of a dead baby Lisa, but perhaps JI could.....just speculating....maybe he feared losing his other son that he fought so hard for.....?

I thought the same thing as soon as I heard it, but wasn't he at work at 12:15??  I also need to go back and listen to Cpt. Young's answer about the poly not being needed for JI, IMO I don't care if you are on camera during the "alleged" kidnapping, if you are a family member or someone in that home you should be poly'd, for all we know Lisa could have died prior to his leaving for work and he could have decided to take care of it so he wouldn't lose the child he used the scorched earth approach in the custody battle....again, it reminds me so much of HaLeigh Cumming's case, damn :(


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 09:04:23 PM
Dr Drew is on now (HLN) talking about Lisa


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 24, 2011, 09:09:37 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.


Parscale is also describing the man as white shirt and sweat pants, she said something also about not much hair and being slender about 6 foot but again I am just paraphrasing. If LE has not polyed JI, I would be surprised. Surely, LE should poly everyone right? Somehow, I don't think DB could have disposed of a dead baby Lisa, but perhaps JI could.....just speculating....maybe he feared losing his other son that he fought so hard for.....?

I thought the same thing as soon as I heard it, but wasn't he at work at 12:15??  I also need to go back and listen to Cpt. Young's answer about the poly not being needed for JI, IMO I don't care if you are on camera during the "alleged" kidnapping, if you are a family member or someone in that home you should be poly'd, for all we know Lisa could have died prior to his leaving for work and he could have decided to take care of it so he wouldn't lose the child he used the scorched earth approach in the custody battle....again, it reminds me so much of HaLeigh Cumming's case, damn :(
Yes, supposedly he (JI) was at work.....makes no sense, just so frustrating. With all of this, I would think that if someone was just out walking their fussy baby that they would have come forward and said, "hey that was me" but we haven't heard anything......ugh Where is that baby girl?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 09:20:28 PM
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

I missed this too.....
 ::snipping2::

O’Brien, who was representing Bradley and Irwin during their last interview with police on October 8, said detectives suggested theories at the time that Lisa may have died in an accident in the home or from being shaken by one of the parents. According to O’Brien, police clearly believe the parents know more about what happened to Lisa than they have said.
 ::snipping2::

So, they were represented by atty's on the 8th, so when Young stated the LE had NO unimpeded (my word) interviews since the 6th, he was spot on....WTF?????? Wasn't that like 4 days later ::MonkeyMad::









http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2011/10/21/witnesses-say-they-saw-man-carrying-baby-resembling-lisa-irwin/?hpt=ng_mid


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 24, 2011, 09:24:47 PM
Dr Drew is on now (HLN) talking about Lisa ]
 ::MonkeyShocked::



Ok, that clip made her look even more guilty........not like she was greiving IMO, more defiant


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 09:33:43 PM
Was it the plan that Jeremy work his very first night shift at an establishment where a security camera could provide him with an alibi?  He would not be considered a suspect.  He could avoid a polygraph?

Was neighbor "Maria" unknowingly used to provide an alibi ... an alibi the implied lights in the Irwin/Bradley residence were turned off at 10:30 PM ... an that implied that an inebriated Debbie did not have the time or the mindset to plan the disappearance of her baby as well as the cell phones?

Did neighbor "Maria" hear or see baby Lisa on the evening of October 3rd while drinking with Debbie?

In other words ... was baby Lisa's crib already empty.  Did she meet her demise in the hours prior to Jeremy's departure to work?

Janet

++++

Mom of missing tot says she took lie detector test
updated 10/7/2011 12:20:45 PM ET 2011-10-07T16:20:45

 
<snipped>

Kansas City police spokesman Steve Young has declined to comment on any polygraph tests, citing the ongoing investigation.

Lisa's father, Jeremy Irwin, says he has offered to take a lie detector test, but that police say that's not necessary.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44811370/ns/local_news-wichita_ks/t/mom-missing-tot-says-she-took-lie-detector-test/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 24, 2011, 09:33:54 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB

agreed! and Crystal's mom also had a makeover the same night...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 24, 2011, 09:50:21 PM
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case (http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case)


From the article - a comment:


Ben Kern
the tree that the man looks like he is walking out of is the tree located in the gas station parking lot. This drives me nuts that the media doesn't take 3 seconds and research this before making this a HUGE news story.
 
Google Map the location: Parvin and Brighton Kansas City, MO
Look at the street view and rotate as necessary.
 
You will see the 'woods' is a grassy hill. He is more than likely walking on the side of the street which isn't too suspicious even at 4am. It's a fairly busy intersection.
2 Hours Ago
·

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case#ixzz1bknGbkwz


I put this together:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6101/6278721816_5f0de24583_o.gif)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: DayOldDonuts on October 24, 2011, 09:54:04 PM

Tucked under her armpit maybe?

I looked but I just don't see anything.  There's another video that shows them close-up at the checkout and you can see it on the counter in front of her and it's definitely a wallet.  Clear as day.



Maybe she threw her wallet in the bag.  I don't currently use a purse because I have everything in my diaper bag but if I'm running to the store without the kids then I just bring my wallet (or just my debit card) and when I check out, I toss it in the plastic bag.  A really bad habit but maybe that's what she did?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 09:54:22 PM

A red flag!  Jeremy and Debbie's baby is missing but ... permission to the questioning of baby Lisa's siblings is not afforded.  Could it be that the boys witnessed an unfortunate incident in that household regarding their little sister ... an unfortunate incident that happened ... not during the night but the day before?

++++++

Mother: I was drunk when Missouri infant disappeared
By the CNN Wire Staff
October 17, 2011 -- Updated 1735 GMT (0135 HKT)


<snipped>

Irwin and Bradley told NBC they have refused to let authorities re-interview Lisa's older brothers.

"They said they heard noises (the night Lisa disappeared)," Bradley said. "I don't know if that was before we went to sleep or after." She said she has not talked to her sons about it because she is reluctant to put them through "anything else."

<snipped>

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/10/17/justice/missouri-missing-girl/




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 10:21:08 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB

agreed! and Crystal's mom also had a makeover the same night...
and once again, neither Crystal nor her mother was the caretaker or even in the same town where Haleigh came up missing but again......not gonna get into this here, this is about Lisa....not HaLeigh so to me....2 different storis....Im done


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 10:24:45 PM

A red flag!  Jeremy and Debbie's baby is missing but ... permission to the questioning of baby Lisa's siblings is not afforded.  Could it be that the boys witnessed an unfortunate incident in that household regarding their little sister ... an unfortunate incident that happened ... not during the night but the day before?

++++++

Mother: I was drunk when Missouri infant disappeared
By the CNN Wire Staff
October 17, 2011 -- Updated 1735 GMT (0135 HKT)


<snipped>

Irwin and Bradley told NBC they have refused to let authorities re-interview Lisa's older brothers.

"They said they heard noises (the night Lisa disappeared)," Bradley said. "I don't know if that was before we went to sleep or after." She said she has not talked to her sons about it because she is reluctant to put them through "anything else."

<snipped>

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/10/17/justice/missouri-missing-girl/



reluctant to put the boys through anything else........wth....what about what baby Lisa is going through, I juust dont get this at all....sorry


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 10:26:45 PM
Considering security cameras at Jeremy's workplace provided him with an alibi  and ... a neigbour provides Debbie with an alibi ... who provides Debbie's brother with an alibi?

Were the images captured by a security camera in the store earlier in the evening of October 3rd of Debbie and her brother and ... the images captured by a security camera of a person emerging from the woods in the early morning of October 4th ... all part of a collaborated staging to further an abduction fabrication.

I feel I am back on the Holly Bobo thread. 

Janet

+++++

Man in tapes identified as baby Lisa's uncle
prlwctd on October 13 2011 17:37:54


<snipped>

A man seen in a surveillance tape with the mother of missing baby Lisa Irwin has been identified as the baby’s uncle.

Deborah Bradley and her brother were shopping for wine for a family event in Kansas City, MO. Her daughter, Lisa, disappeared hours after the Oct. 3 shopping trip.

Police have interviewed the brother and determined he has no involvement in the 10-month-old’s disappearance.

<snipped>

http://www.tothecenter.com/index.php?readmore=17748


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 24, 2011, 10:30:55 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB

agreed! and Crystal's mom also had a makeover the same night...
and once again, neither Crystal nor her mother was the caretaker or even in the same town where Haleigh came up missing but again......not gonna get into this here, this is about Lisa....not HaLeigh so to me....2 different storis....Im done

the point being is that ALL of these people got makeovers when their loved one was missing...the last thing on most people's minds would be to do makeovers when they have a child missing...just another opinion and point of view...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 10:37:22 PM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummings and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

I also remember when Haleigh's mother, Crystal, got herself all dolled up with her hair done in ringlets.  Crystal as I recall had her trailer decorated with marijuana plant hangings, whether real or artificial, I don't know.  I did and do think it strange that Misty would be criticized for her makeover, but for some reason Crystal was untouchable by Misty's critics.  They were all on drugs and one was no better than the other, IMO.  But I guess it depends on your point of view and what one considers an acceptable lifestyle.
Edit to fix name.  MB

agreed! and Crystal's mom also had a makeover the same night...
and once again, neither Crystal nor her mother was the caretaker or even in the same town where Haleigh came up missing but again......not gonna get into this here, this is about Lisa....not HaLeigh so to me....2 different storis....Im done

the point being is that ALL of these people got makeovers when their loved one was missing...the last thing on most people's minds would be to do makeovers when they have a child missing...just another opinion and point of view...
I understand the point trying to be made but thats the reason I said 2 differents stories.......Lisa's Mother was right there with her baby that night, and I do believe it was much longer after Haleighs dissapearance before Crystal got her so called 'makeover'.......but either way, I also believe Crystals 'makeover" was for a interview to talk about HaLeigh and DB's well dont know why she got one if she did.....she isnt talking to anyone but her attorney"s........imo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 24, 2011, 10:40:12 PM
a makeover is a makeover is a makeover in my mind. when you have a missing child..1 week, 1 day, 1 month...who does that when your child is missing whether you were the one in the house with the child or 50 miles away..a child is still missing and the last thing on my mind would be to make sure that I looked good when my kid is missing..but that is just me...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 24, 2011, 10:57:47 PM
I would Love to know more about what it was that the Dogs "hit" on on the bedroom. Is it possible that they may have had a diferrent carpet beside the bed and it was removed and put out in the shed and whatever may have been on it seeped through to the actual carpet by the bed and thats what the dogs "hit" on and thats why LE took the carpet from the shed? I ust hope and pray that something is found out about baby Lisa soon, this story is starting to worry me, its almost like a game now to some of these attorneys IMO......they see what works for the parents of other missing children or teenagers and they brings that knowledge to the parents of whatever child is missing at the moment and its not about the child anymore after that, its about saving the person they are representing....this is just sick, it should always be about the child .....the missing........I dont see how these atorneys can stand themselves and the money they make from these kinds of cases........IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 11:02:52 PM
The decomposition ordor detected by the dog implies that baby Lisa did not meet her demise between the time the neighour "Maria" went home (10:30 PM) and the time the neighbours (husband and wife) witness a male carrying an unclothed baby down the street (12:15 AM).  IMO

Janet


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 24, 2011, 11:03:36 PM
ordor s/b odor s/b smell


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 24, 2011, 11:21:08 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

This pictures taken AFTER the extensive search by police. So, we can expect the police to leave a huge mess behind.

I'm anxious to find out if that search got them some real evidence to proceed in the case.




" Bradley said. "I take good care of my kids. I keep my house clean, do their laundry....."
http://www.news-leader.com/article/20111017/NEWS11/111017002/UPDATE-Kansas-City-mom-admits-she-drunk-when-her-baby-vanished





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 12:00:05 AM
Fox news with Megyn Kelly is driving me nuts. I wish she would just air already the entire interview with DB and JI. Is this typical of FOX? I am still waiting to see the snippets that were on Megyn's show America Live last week. In that snippet DB is talking about the house (paraphrasing here) and something about the house being the "omen" house or cursed house. Ugh....

Anywho, at the link below (the first video box that comes up on the page/titled Full Interview) Debra says something about going into the boys room ask telling them they could sleep in her room.  It is around the 3:20 mark. Is she recalling a past event or that night. If that night, she contradicts herself. I never caught that before.....another inconsistency? Remember, she said one child (Michael?) and "stray kitten" were sleeping with her early on..... Does anyone else hear what I am hearing or am I misunderstanding?


http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/17/full-interview-megyn-kelly-presses-parents-of-baby-lisa-irwin-on-disappearance-asks-if-they-sold-or-killed-their-daughter/  (http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/17/full-interview-megyn-kelly-presses-parents-of-baby-lisa-irwin-on-disappearance-asks-if-they-sold-or-killed-their-daughter/)






Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 12:00:48 AM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.

OY!

Did she not change the story? This is what she is known to have said in a few inteviews in the beginning:

Quote

10/04/2011

By: Aaron Heintzelman

... A neighbor, who later asked NBC Action News that she not be named, said her husband was coming home around 12 a.m. Tuesday when he saw the man carrying a baby wearing only a diaper.

“He seen the guy act like he was going to go into a residence,” she said, “but then my husband drove off so we’re thinking that maybe he was just doing that so that my husband would leave.”

The woman said her husband saw the man walking on a street perpendicular to North Lister, where Lisa Irwin lives with her parents and brothers.

Police say Lisa’s father returned home from work around 4 a.m. to find the child missing and immediately started banging on neighbors’ doors asking if they had seen her.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/neighbor-says-husband-saw-man-carrying-baby-wearing-only-a-diaper



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 12:14:25 AM
::MonkeyNoNo::

I missed this too.....
 ::snipping2::

O’Brien, who was representing Bradley and Irwin during their last interview with police on October 8, said detectives suggested theories at the time that Lisa may have died in an accident in the home or from being shaken by one of the parents. According to O’Brien, police clearly believe the parents know more about what happened to Lisa than they have said.
 ::snipping2::

So, they were represented by atty's on the 8th, so when Young stated the LE had NO unimpeded (my word) interviews since the 6th, he was spot on....WTF?????? Wasn't that like 4 days later ::MonkeyMad::

This lawyer contacted the Irwins right at the beginning of the case. He's one of the top lawyers in the US, and included in the lists of the "Super Lawyers" by the bar publications. He's a law professor with a long career of helping the indigent who may be wrongfully convicted.

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/obrien.htm

He is member of the Midwest "Innocence Project", the lawyers that help free people innocently convicted.

http://www.themip.org/









http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/2011/10/21/witnesses-say-they-saw-man-carrying-baby-resembling-lisa-irwin/?hpt=ng_mid


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 12:20:44 AM
Sorry, messed up my two last messages, writing in the previous box. Guessing I need some shuteye, it's been a long day. Niters!



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 12:25:06 AM
Sorry, messed up my two last messages, writing in the previous box. Guessing I need some shuteye, it's been a long day. Niters!


Night Itaryl, I think I will look in to your post further (regarding the witness) tomorrow as my eyes are about to close too :) Thanks for the interesting info.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 12:42:38 AM


" Bradley said. "I take good care of my kids. I keep my house clean, do their laundry....."
http://www.news-leader.com/article/20111017/NEWS11/111017002/UPDATE-Kansas-City-mom-admits-she-drunk-when-her-baby-vanished

KC mom admits she was drunk on night baby vanished
updated 10/17/2011 9:01:18 PM ET


KANSAS CITY, Mo. — The mother of a missing Kansas City baby said Monday that she was drunk on the night her daughter disappeared, may have blacked out and actually last saw the child hours before the time she originally told police she checked on her.

<snipped>

Bradley told Fox News that she got drunk after she put her children to bed that night and may have blacked out. Asked how much she drank that night and whether it was more than five glasses of wine, she responded, "probably." She said she didn't have more than 10 glasses. Bradley said she frequently drinks heavily at home but only after her children are safely in bed. She also said she takes anxiety medication and had taken a dose that day.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44928182/ns/us_news/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 12:47:01 AM

KC mom admits she was drunk on night baby vanished
updated 10/17/2011 9:01:18 PM ET


<snipped>

Bradley told police she last saw her daughter, Lisa Irwin, when she checked on her at 10:30 p.m. But Monday, she told NBC's "Today" show she actually last saw Lisa when she put her to bed at 6:40 p.m. She gave no explanation for the modified times.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44928182/ns/us_news/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 12:59:29 AM
Safely in Bed?

KC mom admits she was drunk on night baby vanished
updated 10/17/2011 9:01:18 PM ET


<snipped>

Bradley told Fox News that she got drunk after she put her children to bed that night and may have blacked out. Asked how much she drank that night and whether it was more than five glasses of wine, she responded, "probably." She said she didn't have more than 10 glasses. Bradley said she frequently drinks heavily at home but only after her children are safely in bed. She also said she takes anxiety medication and had taken a dose that day.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44928182/ns/us_news/


Watching a Movie?

Deborah Bradley: I Was Probably Drunk When Baby Lisa Disappeared
By Jeff Truesdell
Monday October 17, 2011 06:30 AM EDT


<snipped>

She put Lisa down in her room around 6:40 p.m., she says. Only once more soon afterward did she check on Lisa, finding her standing in her crib before tucking her back in.

Then, as the other children of the two next-door-neighbor moms watched a movie inside, Bradley tapped the box of wine that she'd bought earlier that evening, and she and her friend spent much of the evening chatting outside on the front stoop.

<snipped>

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20537543,00.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 25, 2011, 01:34:12 AM
a makeover is a makeover is a makeover in my mind. when you have a missing child..1 week, 1 day, 1 month...who does that when your child is missing whether you were the one in the house with the child or 50 miles away..a child is still missing and the last thing on my mind would be to make sure that I looked good when my kid is missing..but that is just me...

I just had a thought as to why she may have cut her hair:  What is one of the major reasons women (mainly) opt for a makeover?  A lot of times it's to mark an event like a significant weight loss or perhaps after a bad breakup.  I've known many women who have changed their look after getting a new job or before going on vacation.  Also, some women will alter their appearance because they don't want to see the person that they were.  In DB's case, she didn't just go for a little trim, she went for a different hairstyle. 

So let's assume she's guilty in regards to her daughter's disappearance.  I would assume that she would not want to look in the mirror at "that person" anymore.  "That person" who is guilty of something.  I know this sounds like psycho-babble, but women really do change their looks when they are uncomfortable about something they've done.  Just as they change their look when they are happy about something they've done.

JMO and just another of my kooky theories.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 25, 2011, 04:06:39 AM
a makeover is a makeover is a makeover in my mind. when you have a missing child..1 week, 1 day, 1 month...who does that when your child is missing whether you were the one in the house with the child or 50 miles away..a child is still missing and the last thing on my mind would be to make sure that I looked good when my kid is missing..but that is just me...

I just had a thought as to why she may have cut her hair:  What is one of the major reasons women (mainly) opt for a makeover?  A lot of times it's to mark an event like a significant weight loss or perhaps after a bad breakup.  I've known many women who have changed their look after getting a new job or before going on vacation.  Also, some women will alter their appearance because they don't want to see the person that they were.  In DB's case, she didn't just go for a little trim, she went for a different hairstyle. 

So let's assume she's guilty in regards to her daughter's disappearance.  I would assume that she would not want to look in the mirror at "that person" anymore.  "That person" who is guilty of something.  I know this sounds like psycho-babble, but women really do change their looks when they are uncomfortable about something they've done.  Just as they change their look when they are happy about something they've done.

JMO and just another of my kooky theories.

Not 'kooky' at all - In fact I think it's right on! 

~ fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 25, 2011, 04:46:04 AM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

This pictures taken AFTER the extensive search by police. So, we can expect the police to leave a huge mess behind.

I'm anxious to find out if that search got them some real evidence to proceed in the case.




" Bradley said. "I take good care of my kids. I keep my house clean, do their laundry....."
http://www.news-leader.com/article/20111017/NEWS11/111017002/UPDATE-Kansas-City-mom-admits-she-drunk-when-her-baby-vanished

stains on the rug, laundry in the basket not put away & where would the baby monitor be at?

PLUS:


10:30pm - last time Deborah Bradly saw Lisa, neighbor goes home, Deborah &  her son and
the new kitten fell asleep in bed together,
Baby Lisa was put in her room, she closed the door to the baby's room and her other son was in his bed. The baby monitor was on.
http://digitaljournal.com/blog/13400

BUT


Dad comes home and sees lights on, front door unlocked thinks something is amiss so he says he
goes to the boys bedroom and they are sleeping.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/06/police-say-parents-missing-missouri-10-month-old-girl-no-longer-cooperating/


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.520



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 25, 2011, 04:51:58 AM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 25, 2011, 08:02:17 AM
a makeover is a makeover is a makeover in my mind. when you have a missing child..1 week, 1 day, 1 month...who does that when your child is missing whether you were the one in the house with the child or 50 miles away..a child is still missing and the last thing on my mind would be to make sure that I looked good when my kid is missing..but that is just me...

I just had a thought as to why she may have cut her hair:  What is one of the major reasons women (mainly) opt for a makeover?  A lot of times it's to mark an event like a significant weight loss or perhaps after a bad breakup.  I've known many women who have changed their look after getting a new job or before going on vacation.  Also, some women will alter their appearance because they don't want to see the person that they were.  In DB's case, she didn't just go for a little trim, she went for a different hairstyle. 

So let's assume she's guilty in regards to her daughter's disappearance.  I would assume that she would not want to look in the mirror at "that person" anymore.  "That person" who is guilty of something.  I know this sounds like psycho-babble, but women really do change their looks when they are uncomfortable about something they've done.  Just as they change their look when they are happy about something they've done.

JMO and just another of my kooky theories.

Not 'kooky' at all - In fact I think it's right on! 

~ fanta

makes perfect sense to me as well...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:19:29 AM
http://www.ksdk.com/news/article/282748/3/Lisa-Irwins-age-makes-her-harder-to-find
Lisa Irwin's age makes her harder to find
7:07 AM, Oct 25, 2011

By HEATHER HOLLINGSWORTH Associated Press

KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP) - The reported sightings have come from as far as California, people just certain they've spotted the blond-haired Kansas City baby whose cherubic face has been printed on fliers and circulated on national television programs since her disappearance three weeks ago.

Yet so far, the some 200 calls fielded by Kansas City police have only generated a string of false positives in the search for Lisa Irwin.

The problem, officials say, is that at her age - just 10 months when she went missing on Oct. 4 - countless babies match the same description, right down to the bright blue eyes and two bottom teeth. She does have a distinguishing birth mark on her right thigh, but that would hardly be noticed from a distance.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: goodnmad on October 25, 2011, 08:22:25 AM
So we are at 3 weeks in and nothing? More stories and sightings and men in the woods? This is getting crazy and it looks bad for Baby Lisa.  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I wonder what the cadaver dog hit on exactly --- on the floor near the bed. Not the actual floor? It creeps me out to think about this but the lady who owned my home before me died in the house. So, 11 years later and the flooring has been removed down to subfloor and replaced .. I wonder if a cadaver dog would still get a hit in that room?

Another day and another prayer for Baby Lisa to come home.  ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:24:42 AM
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/25/lisa-irwin-case-parents-grieving-defense-attorneys-work-overtime/
Lisa Irwin case: Parents grieving, defense attorneys work overtime
Posted on October 25, 2011 by Valhall


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:37:04 AM
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Hear from #DeborahBradley's estranged husband @TodayShow. Thoughts on Deborah, the case & 5yo son they share. #BabyLisa
2 hours ago http://twitter.com/#!/peteralexander (http://twitter.com/#!/peteralexander)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 25, 2011, 08:46:11 AM
Another reason someone in this situation would change their looks....so that potential witnesses couldn't positively identify them.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:47:01 AM
http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45028386#45028386
Baby Lisa search enters third week


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 09:44:21 AM
http://www.kmbc.com/r-video/29578952/detail.html
Irwin Attorney Tacopina Talks About Police Search
POSTED: 7:38 am CDT October 25, 2011
UPDATED: 7:39 am CDT October 25, 2011


Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/video/29578952/detail.html#ixzz1bnhpBrO9


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 09:47:38 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490
Handprints on the wall, a Scooby Doo outfit and Winnie the Pooh bear in her crib: Heart-breaking images inside Baby Lisa's bedroom
    Search for Lisa Irwin enters third week after she went missing in Missouri
    Parents Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin seen crying at vigil on Sunday
    Video footage shows man leaving woods near abduction site on that night
    Development adds weight to witness reports of man holding baby in area
    Police also investigating a dumpster fire which happened on same night
    News comes after cadaver dogs smelled 'scent of death' in family home
By Mark Duell
Last updated at 8:40 PM on 24th October 2011

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html#ixzz1bniVpcxX


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 09:51:07 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

I think that is a baby monitor on the little table.  ::rhino::
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/24/article-2052957-0E842BB700000578-768_634x353.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 10:09:30 AM
JVM is also showing pics of the bedroom and where the cadaver dog hit which is on the left side of the bed in front of a night stand (if you are standing at the foot of the bed facing it). Hopefully we can get a screen shot of those pics.
Got a shot from the video at this link.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

Peter Alexander indicated this is the area where the dogs hit.  ::HelloKitty::
(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/main/10/29710012668.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/518739/2405804)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 25, 2011, 10:28:57 AM
I vaguely remember a case with a missing child where the mom had a makeover afterward.  It seemed extremely inappropriate then.  It's the same now.  Who would be thinking of doing her hair at a time like this.  Frankly, I don't think I'd be taking the time to bathe much less sit and let someone do my hair.

I am thinking of Misty Croslin Cummins and her "granny."  I don't know how long Misty's lasted after she quit getting the networks to pay for her interview "look".  She has definitely lost it now after being in jail for a year, but look what she has gained! ::witch2::
::rhino::
Now all we need is a report that DB and JI are going get married in the front yard because it is what "Lisa" would want....... ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::
Are these nutcases fed "stupid" pills, or do they take them voluntarily ? ::MonkeyWitch1::

Whoaa!!!! I think Cartfly meant that as a joke, not to be taken literally.  Next we will hear it on Nancy Grace as a fact.
Your right! :)
Too funny Babybear. ::MonkeyAngel:: Things do take on a life of their own huh? (LOL)

I do not drink that often either babybear but that is mostly because I am with kids 24/7 and have a really low tolerance. I wonder what was going on in DB's life, that she over did her drinking that night. In know way do I think DB intentionally harmed little Lisa. Lisa appeared to be very happy, well dressed and adored by her brothers.... that is what is so baffling. The sightings of someone carrying a baby is even more baffling..... :smt102
 





Yes, Cartfly.  In every picture of Lisa, she looked healthy, happy and clean, well dressed.  She was obviously a child who was well taken care of.  It is baffling.  I checked with NOAA and the low temperature on Oct. 2 in Kansas City was 41 degrees, quite chilly.  Much too cold to be carrying a baby dressed only in diaper.  To me the thought of someone just willingly helping Deborah get rid of a dead baby is mind boggling.  I have no friends or family who would help me do a thing like that and I doubt that many people do. In fact, my family would probably have me committed.  The thought of walking around for a couple of hours carrying a dead baby is equally mind boggling, to the point of not possible.

One night Nancy Grace said that the going price for a baby was $80,000 in New York.  I hope that if Lisa were taken by a stranger, it was for this purpose, that she is alive and well and being taken care of by people who were desperate for a baby.  And I hope she is returned to her family.  You are correct in that it seemed the brothers adored her.  In fact, it seemed that her mother and father did, too.  Once in a great while you hear of a baby being kidnapped, raised as their own child by strangers, and only finding out about this as an adult. 

But I know that sometimes things are not as they seem. I pray she was taken by someone who will see that she's taken care of.  She is a beautiful, charming baby and deserves so much. 
I hate to state the obvious, but caylee anthony appeared happy, healthy & well dressed. She also appeared loved & happy in pics with kc. However, there is NOTHING anyone could tell me that would convince me that kc did not kill her child. I will never know if it was intentional or accidental, but I do know that even though she might have appeared to love her child to anyone that knew her, she clearly did not. Accidents happen to children,but normal people dont cover them up unless they r cold &heartless. If it is proven that this mother is innocent, I will eat crow, but I dont think it will happen. At the very most, we all may be left forever wondering. I dont think a kidnapper will be found tho.

You're right.  Caylee appeared healthy, happy and clean.  However, that wasn't Casey's doing.  That was done by Cindy, who fed, clothed, bathed, and did everything for Caylee.  Casey didn't even have a job to contribute financially to Caylee's wellbeing, even if she wanted to.  Apples and oranges.
You won't need to eat crow if Deborah is found to be innocent.  We are all entitled to our opinions and that's yours.  I don't see definitive evidence that Deborah harmed Lisa except by neglect.  I do not believe that she harmed Lisa.  That's mine.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 10:41:04 AM
Is that a little camera above the door?
(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/main/10/29710313471.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/518795/9698585)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: fatcatlurker on October 25, 2011, 10:41:27 AM
JMO - A 10 month old sleeping in a bed(w/no frame) with a parent is as likely to be smothered by the parent as a stranger coming into that same house and taking a baby.  Statistics support that both of these are highly unlikely.

Again JMO.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: BlueKYGirl on October 25, 2011, 10:51:02 AM
JMO - A 10 month old sleeping in a bed(w/no frame) with a parent is as likely to be smothered by the parent as a stranger coming into that same house and taking a baby.  Statistics support that both of these are highly unlikely.

Again JMO.



I agree. It *might* be slightly riskier for a newborn, but by the time a baby is 10 months old he or she is big enough to wiggle around and find a way to breathe.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: fatcatlurker on October 25, 2011, 10:52:34 AM
Is that a little camera above the door?
(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/main/10/29710313471.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/518795/9698585)

The front door?  Maybe not working at the time?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: alagary on October 25, 2011, 10:53:38 AM
Is that a little camera above the door?
(http://img1.UploadScreenshot.com/images/main/10/29710313471.png) (http://www.UploadScreenshot.com/image/518795/9698585)
Surround sound speaker?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 11:00:50 AM
What is wrong with this picture?

12:15 AM:  Witnesses observed a man wearing dark pants in the Irwin/Bradley neighborhood carrying a baby.

02:30 AM:  A gas station video capture a man wearing white not carrying a baby.

04:00 AM:  A witness observed a man 3 miles away from the Irwin/Bradley residence carrying a baby.

Could it be that the gas station video is not case related?

When the words of the witnesses are considered in regards to description ... could the male observed carrying a baby have been Jeremy Irwin?

Janet

++++++


ISSUES WITH JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL
Aired October 24, 2011 - 19:00   ET


<snipped>

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We couldn`t really tell the race at that time. It was dark and the lighting out there isn`t very good to tell somebody`s race. But we were able to see that he was kind of taller. I would say at least 5`8 or taller and he was really slender. He was wearing like dark- colored pants  and what we believe was a t-shirt, like a white t-shirt.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ijvm.01.html


NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And it was about 12:15 a.m. my husband was leaving for work. He was kind of looking down in the bushes and the next thing you know we see a gentleman walking up the street carrying a baby.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


Missing Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage Shows Man Leaving Woods [VIDEO]
October 24, 2011 4:42 PM EDT


<snipped>

Surveillance footage of a mystery man leaving a wooded area on the night of baby Lisa Irwin's alleged disappearance nearly three weeks ago was located at a gas station in Kansas City near Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin's home. The security camera shows a man dressed in white leaving the woods at 2:30 a.m. just two miles from baby Lisa's home.

<snipped>

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/236715/20111024/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-deborah-bradley-jeremy-mystery-man-kansas-city-missouri-cadaver-dog-surveill.htm


Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 11:05:06 AM
Attorney says Lisa Irwin's parents are troubled that the national attention on them maybe taking away from the search for their daughter. Read more: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 8:42 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/25/bc661da0-666e-40de-9634-febfac8d1c8c_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bo1EMQGb


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 11:07:43 AM
http://www.thehinkymeter.com/2011/10/25/lisa-irwin-case-parents-grieving-defense-attorneys-work-overtime/
Lisa Irwin case: Parents grieving, defense attorneys work overtime
Posted on October 25, 2011 by Valhall


 ::MonkeyCool::   Thanks!    Reading Val is as having a Bloddy Mary for brunch!!  Love it.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 11:18:15 AM
Attorney says Lisa Irwin's parents are troubled that the national attention on them maybe taking away from the search for their daughter. Read more: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 8:42 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/25/bc661da0-666e-40de-9634-febfac8d1c8c_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bo1EMQGb


Maybe some of the national attention is the result of all the paid interviews that Jeremy and Debbie have afforded the major networks/publications.

Janet


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 11:37:11 AM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.




Kermit ... the thought crossed my mind with the revelation of the witnesses.

When the description provided by the neighbour witness on Nancy Grace of the man she observed carrying a baby and ... then the words of the motorcycle rider in the following video ... could it be that Jeremy arrived home around 12:15 AM and ... found Lisa deceased beside her mother and ... in distressed state of mind wandered the streets for over three hours holding his daughter?

Janet

++++

12:15 AM

NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


04:00 AM

Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: MuffyBee on October 25, 2011, 11:38:00 AM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)

PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Hear from #DeborahBradley's estranged husband @TodayShow. Thoughts on Deborah, the case & 5yo son they share. #BabyLisa
5 hours ago




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 11:47:30 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/25/missing-baby-lisas-age-makes-her-harder-to-find/?test=latestnews#ixzz1bo9fDRRq
Police Look to Tip Line for New Leads in Case of Missing Missouri Baby Lisa Irwin
Published October 25, 2011
| FoxNews.com

KANSAS CITY, Mo. –  Kansas City police say they have received at least 200 calls and a dozen tips over the weekend in the case of missing baby Lisa Irwin -- who disappeared three weeks ago -- but so far they have only generated a string of false positives in the search for the 10-month-old.

Hundreds have reported seeing the missing Kansas City baby in places as far away as California, but officials say because of Lisa's young age, countless babies match the same description. She was just 10 months old when she disappeared. She has a distinguishing birth mark on her right thigh, but that would hardly be noticed from a distance.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/25/missing-baby-lisas-age-makes-her-harder-to-find/?test=latestnews#ixzz1boCoagNg



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 11:53:07 AM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

I think that is a baby monitor on the little table.  ::rhino::
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/24/article-2052957-0E842BB700000578-768_634x353.jpg)




No window treatments, no artwork on the walls and we've seen photos of a spotless, uncluttered kitchen.

These are signs of obcessive/compulsive behavior.

With two boys, a husband and a baby, I imagine the pressure was on DB.

With a history of anxiety and alcohol abuse I have a feeling it all caved in on her and she was having more than a little trouble handling it. Add to the already mounting tension, money problems and I think the Irwin/Bradley home was a pressure cooker.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 11:54:21 AM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)

PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Hear from #DeborahBradley's estranged husband @TodayShow. Thoughts on Deborah, the case & 5yo son they share. #BabyLisa
5 hours ago






Was that broadcast this a.m. or will it be at a future time?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 11:57:08 AM
Well ... to quote Val in today's well written article:  "These people are making me nuts!"

Among other things,

Now to attack public coverage of this case is bizarre.  Had it not been for all types of media, nobody outside of Kansas City would have ever heard of this tragic case.  If we are supposed to go with the kidnapping theory, then for Heaven's sake - the word needs to get out asap, big time - everywhere all the time!   If it is a genuine kidnapping ...





Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 12:00:32 PM
Well ... to quote Val in today's well written article:  "These people are making me nuts!"

Among other things,

Now to attack public coverage of this case is bizarre.  Had it not been for all types of media, nobody outside of Kansas City would have ever heard of this tragic case.  If we are supposed to go with the kidnapping theory, then for Heaven's sake - the word needs to get out asap, big time - everywhere all the time!   If it is a genuine kidnapping ...





Clarifying:
   
I should have said  "Among other things, this is making me nuts", etc. etc,


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 25, 2011, 12:02:28 PM
How many (if any) friends/family are 5'8 to 6' and skinny does this family know????
If so, got to look for pic's of them...

 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 12:04:51 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)

PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Hear from #DeborahBradley's estranged husband @TodayShow. Thoughts on Deborah, the case & 5yo son they share. #BabyLisa
5 hours ago






Was that broadcast this a.m. or will it be at a future time?

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45028386#45028386


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 25, 2011, 12:34:57 PM
How many (if any) friends/family are 5'8 to 6' and skinny does this family know????
If so, got to look for pic's of them...

 ::MonkeyEek::

Also why didn't the dog bark?
 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 12:41:42 PM
JMO - A 10 month old sleeping in a bed(w/no frame) with a parent is as likely to be smothered by the parent as a stranger coming into that same house and taking a baby.  Statistics support that both of these are highly unlikely.

Again JMO.



Thing here is that Deborah said she put the baby in the crib that night.

No wonder the LE is angry at the parents. In the beginning the police believed the parents and only checked those places in the home that had to do with the break in and the baby being taken from the crib... when they should've been checking other places of entry, and other things.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 12:43:00 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)

PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
Hear from #DeborahBradley's estranged husband @TodayShow. Thoughts on Deborah, the case & 5yo son they share. #BabyLisa
5 hours ago






Was that broadcast this a.m. or will it be at a future time?

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/26184891/vp/45028386#45028386


Thanks. I watched it. This is the first time we have heard anything from Sean. There appears to be big, nice furniture in living room, but no knick knacks...no decoration.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 12:46:19 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.




Kermit ... the thought crossed my mind with the revelation of the witnesses.

When the description provided by the neighbour witness on Nancy Grace of the man she observed carrying a baby and ... then the words of the motorcycle rider in the following video ... could it be that Jeremy arrived home around 12:15 AM and ... found Lisa deceased beside her mother and ... in distressed state of mind wandered the streets for over three hours holding his daughter?

Janet

++++

12:15 AM

NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


04:00 AM

Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369





Don't remember any bald heads. Did anyone else notice any?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 25, 2011, 12:53:45 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong, but weren't the NBC pictures taken very recently?  If so, then there is a good possibility that at least some of the shots have been staged.  Comparing them to the official photos, when they are released, could be enlightening.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 12:57:31 PM
About the witnesses seeing a man with a baby, or without a baby, on the night Lisa disapepared...

There seem to be more than three reports, as there was one incident witnessed at 1:00am, and one at 1:30am discussed in the beginning of the case. Those may have been reporter errors of the same 2:00am incident, but they were quoted on the news for a while.

The 2:30am surveillance tape at the BP station should be discounted, because the image is so bad that it only shows a blob of light, and it is hard to see if it's a man or a woman, and whether there's a baby being carried or not.

Of course, the tape brings hope to the defense. The attorneys for the Irwins keep claiming that the man in the picture could be crucial to the investigation, and we all know it could be a major factor in creating doubt on a jury, if the case goes to trial.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: WesleyBear on October 25, 2011, 01:04:36 PM
If Lisa was kidnapped, I think it was someone who knew the family really well....well enough to know this was the first night the dad worked the night shift. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 01:11:09 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.

OY!

Did she not change the story? This is what she is known to have said in a few inteviews in the beginning:

Quote

10/04/2011

By: Aaron Heintzelman

... A neighbor, who later asked NBC Action News that she not be named, said her husband was coming home around 12 a.m. Tuesday when he saw the man carrying a baby wearing only a diaper.

“He seen the guy act like he was going to go into a residence,” she said, “but then my husband drove off so we’re thinking that maybe he was just doing that so that my husband would leave.”

The woman said her husband saw the man walking on a street perpendicular to North Lister, where Lisa Irwin lives with her parents and brothers.

Police say Lisa’s father returned home from work around 4 a.m. to find the child missing and immediately started banging on neighbors’ doors asking if they had seen her.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/neighbor-says-husband-saw-man-carrying-baby-wearing-only-a-diaper



Just wanted to point out that in this story done within 24 hours of Lisa's disappearance, the woman says her husband was coming from work, and now she says her husband was going to work.

In the first she relates what her husband saw, and in this new one she saw it too.

Not sure what to believe, and if I believe this woman at all. It would be nice to hear what HER husband has to say, not her.

Then again, it could be another spin by the media.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 01:14:56 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.




Kermit ... the thought crossed my mind with the revelation of the witnesses.

When the description provided by the neighbour witness on Nancy Grace of the man she observed carrying a baby and ... then the words of the motorcycle rider in the following video ... could it be that Jeremy arrived home around 12:15 AM and ... found Lisa deceased beside her mother and ... in distressed state of mind wandered the streets for over three hours holding his daughter?

Janet

++++

12:15 AM

NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


04:00 AM

Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369



Don't remember any bald heads. Did anyone else notice any?


NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html




(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 01:44:05 PM
Listening to Mike Thompson on the following GMA video ... it appears that this witness may have identified Jeremy Irwin out of a line-up of police photos.

Janet

++++


Witnesses Claim They Saw Man Carrying Missing Baby Lisa
Updated: Friday, 21 Oct 2011, 10:27 AM CDT
Published : Friday, 21 Oct 2011, 10:25 AM CDT


(NewsCore) - Three Kansas City residents said Friday that they saw a suspicious man walking the streets with an infant on the night that 11-month-old Lisa Irwin disappeared.

Mike Thompson told ABC's "Good Morning America" that he was heading home on his motorcycle around 4:00am when he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near Baby Lisa's home.

"[It was] 4 o'clock in the morning, 45 degrees, the baby don't have a blanket or coat or nothin', and this guy's walking down the street," Thompson said. "I thought it was kind of weird."

Thompson claimed the infant -- who was only wearing a diaper -- resembled Baby Lisa and said that he would recognize the man if he saw him again.

He said he waited about a week to report the sighting to police because he did not immediately make the connection to Baby Lisa's disappearance.

<snipped>

http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/dpps/news/baby-lisa-witnesses-speak-dpgonc-20111021-fc_15585422


Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 25, 2011, 01:57:19 PM
Somehow I managed to miss two good posts on page 28:



 ::snipping2::'d because the video wasn't showing up in the preview post...
http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case (http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case)


From the article - a comment:


Ben Kern
the tree that the man looks like he is walking out of is the tree located in the gas station parking lot. This drives me nuts that the media doesn't take 3 seconds and research this before making this a HUGE news story.
 
Google Map the location: Parvin and Brighton Kansas City, MO
Look at the street view and rotate as necessary.
 
You will see the 'woods' is a grassy hill. He is more than likely walking on the side of the street which isn't too suspicious even at 4am. It's a fairly busy intersection.
2 Hours Ago
·

Read more: http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/region_missouri/northland/police-review-gas-station-surveillance-video-in-lisa-irwin-case#ixzz1bknGbkwz


I put this together:

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6101/6278721816_5f0de24583_o.gif)


That is awesome work you did there.  And yes, it does seem pretty silly that the media didn't check things out before blowing this sighting out of proportion.





Tucked under her armpit maybe?

I looked but I just don't see anything.  There's another video that shows them close-up at the checkout and you can see it on the counter in front of her and it's definitely a wallet.  Clear as day.



Maybe she threw her wallet in the bag.  I don't currently use a purse because I have everything in my diaper bag but if I'm running to the store without the kids then I just bring my wallet (or just my debit card) and when I check out, I toss it in the plastic bag.  A really bad habit but maybe that's what she did?

That's a very distinct possibility.  In the video you can see the clerk hand something to DB that looks like a receipt.  DB then hands something to her brother and then places the receipt into her wallet.  After that you can't see what happened to the wallet.  But yes, the brother certainly could have been carrying it in the bag he was holding.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 25, 2011, 02:05:33 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 02:09:57 PM
 ::MonkeyCool::    Blink has some very helpful & clarifying comments in answering some of the issues/questions made by her posters regarding this case:    www.blinkoncrime.com


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 25, 2011, 02:10:39 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

I think that is a baby monitor on the little table.  ::rhino::
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/24/article-2052957-0E842BB700000578-768_634x353.jpg)

Wow.  What a lovely, babyproof room.  Yes, that totally looks like a baby monitor.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 25, 2011, 02:13:54 PM
::MonkeyCool::    Blink has some very helpful & clarifying comments in answering some of the issues/questions made by her posters regarding this case:    www.blinkoncrime.com

Tks, great updates on stuff that's not been reporting correctly.
Tks again for the short post.
 ::monkeywine2:: ::witch2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 02:19:13 PM
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1237423257001/lead-in-baby-lisas-case/?playlist_id=87485
Lead in Baby Lisa's Case?
Oct 25, 2011- 4:16 -
Mystery man seen walking near infant's home


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cadillac on October 25, 2011, 02:19:16 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

I think that is a baby monitor on the little table.  ::rhino::
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/10/24/article-2052957-0E842BB700000578-768_634x353.jpg)

Wow.  What a lovely, babyproof room.  Yes, that totally looks like a baby monitor.
I do think it was said previously this photo was AFTER the police where there, wasn't it?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 02:20:05 PM
Could it be that the descriptions revealed by the witnesses in regards to the man who they observed carrying an unclothed baby throughout the streets in the early hours of October 4th is the smoking gun that will blow this case wide open ... descriptions that appear to be pointing at Jeremy Irwin?

Does Jeremy Irwin have some explaining to do ... explaining that may implicate Debbie Bradley in the happenings encompassing the demise of baby Lisa?

Janet

 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 02:20:24 PM
JVM just had the Parscale wife on to explain what she saw. (wife of first witness to see a man with a baby) She explained how she saw the man with the baby along with her hubby who was leaving for work at 12:15. I will post exactly what she said when the transcript comes available.

OY!

Did she not change the story? This is what she is known to have said in a few inteviews in the beginning:

Quote

10/04/2011

By: Aaron Heintzelman

... A neighbor, who later asked NBC Action News that she not be named, said her husband was coming home around 12 a.m. Tuesday when he saw the man carrying a baby wearing only a diaper.

“He seen the guy act like he was going to go into a residence,” she said, “but then my husband drove off so we’re thinking that maybe he was just doing that so that my husband would leave.”

The woman said her husband saw the man walking on a street perpendicular to North Lister, where Lisa Irwin lives with her parents and brothers.

Police say Lisa’s father returned home from work around 4 a.m. to find the child missing and immediately started banging on neighbors’ doors asking if they had seen her.


http://www.nbcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/neighbor-says-husband-saw-man-carrying-baby-wearing-only-a-diaper



Just wanted to point out that in this story done within 24 hours of Lisa's disappearance, the woman says her husband was coming from work, and now she says her husband was going to work.

In the first she relates what her husband saw, and in this new one she saw it too.

Not sure what to believe, and if I believe this woman at all. It would be nice to hear what HER husband has to say, not her.

Then again, it could be another spin by the media.


unless the NBC station got it wrong. In one of the videos (not the youtube one) the station was not supposed to broadcast the witness name yet in the video, "big as day", Lisa's name appears on the screen. She seems very believable but I agree it would be nice to hear from hubby also.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 02:28:51 PM
Could it be that the descriptions revealed by the witnesses in regards to the man who they observed carrying an unclothed baby throughout the streets in the early hours of October 4th is the smoking gun that will blow this case wide open ... descriptions that appear to be pointing at Jeremy Irwin?

Does Jeremy Irwin have some explaining to do ... explaining that may implicate Debbie Bradley in the happenings encompassing the demise of baby Lisa?

Janet

 
::rhino::
I think you may be right Janet. Somehow I can not see Debra disposing of her baby. A baby she obviously loved but "apparently" make a bad decision resulting in the child's demise. I believe her when she says she was a good Mother. But feel like she make a crucial mistake drinking into oblivion that evening when she had no one else to keep her children from harm. I think this would explain Jeremy's behavior, cold-odd as if he was in shock knowing he had the task of disposing of his daughter.

P.S. Thanks for bringing over the transcripts of JVM :)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Aurelia7 on October 25, 2011, 02:28:53 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?

**Warning - Wild imagination on the loose.**

Perhaps she put baby Lisa down at both those times?  She put her down at 6:40 and then got her drink on with the neighbor.  At around 10:30 the baby woke up, fussy and cranky and DB was too drunk to deal with her.  Perhaps she's taking painkillers as well.  Women who give birth are frequently offered Vicodin and some get addicted and continue to request it long after the baby is born.  Vicodin offers a euphoric feeling but after it wears off the user becomes very irritable because the high is gone.   Every little noise becomes amplified and unbearable.  Couple this mental state with 5 or so glasses of wine and you've got one very unstable and angry mofo.  If the baby was fussing she may have shaken the life out of her.  JMCO.  (Just my crazy opinion.)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 02:33:31 PM
Did anyone catch Stanton talking to Megyn (on FOX) about the stories of the man seen carrying a baby in the middle of the night? It aired about 30 minutes ago. I hope they replay it because he says something about how some people were even speculating that the man witness' saw could have been holding another MAN!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: (SERIOUSLY, I COULDN'T MAKE THIS STUFF UP) Like a man and his "MINI ME"......the nuts are coming out in full force~ Is there a Full Moon?
 ::MonkeyJnBox::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cadillac on October 25, 2011, 02:34:52 PM
Hubs just might be tops on my list.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 02:35:45 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?

**Warning - Wild imagination on the loose.**

Perhaps she put baby Lisa down at both those times?  She put her down at 6:40 and then got her drink on with the neighbor.  At around 10:30 the baby woke up, fussy and cranky and DB was too drunk to deal with her.  Perhaps she's taking painkillers as well.  Women who give birth are frequently offered Vicodin and some get addicted and continue to request it long after the baby is born.  Vicodin offers a euphoric feeling but after it wears off the user becomes very irritable because the high is gone.   Every little noise becomes amplified and unbearable.  Couple this mental state with 5 or so glasses of wine and you've got one very unstable and angry mofo.  If the baby was fussing she may have shaken the life out of her.  JMCO.  (Just my crazy opinion.)
I really think you are spot on....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cartfly on October 25, 2011, 02:39:08 PM
Hubs just might be tops on my list.
I am starting to think he was an accomplice too. Sadly, if true, all they had to do was call 911. If true, I am sure they are regretting a coverup. Missouri has the death penalty......not sure if it would apply here or not. If this was an accident, I would think the worst that could of happened would be manslaughter. But I guess DB would protect her "mother of the year" award at any cost.... ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 02:41:46 PM
Hubs just might be tops on my list.
::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 02:43:22 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-police-tough-questions-parents/story?id=14810300#.Tqb8rMPlUPw.twitter
Missing Baby Lisa: Police 'Need' Separate Interviews with Parents
By CHRISTINA NG
Oct. 25, 2011


Investigators want the parents of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwinto submit to separate interviews and answer a list of "tough questions" that detectives "need answered."

Kansas City Police Capt. Steve Young made his statement as the investigation into the toddler's disapperance entered its fourth week without any suspects or leads to the girl's whereabouts.

The focus of the investigation remains on the parents, Deborah Bradley, 25, and Jeremy Irwin, 29.

"We need them to sit down apart from each other, with detectives, and answer the tough questions detectives have for them concerning what they may or may not know about anything, who came and went [the night Lisa disappeared]," Young told ABCNews.com. "There's a whole list of things that they may know."

Young said he is "not disputing" family attorney Joe Tacopina's claims that the family has cooperated and answered other questions, such as specific questions regarding tips and leads. But that is not sufficient, he said.

"The bottom line is detectives need to sit down with them unrestricted and they need to answer questions that we need answered," he said.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 02:47:16 PM

From KMBC's Maria Antonia: Not much activity at the Walrond home, there is a person in the backyard appears to be on the phone. It may be the man related to the mom who came here from Texas.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 1:28 PM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/25/ae327901-5445-424e-a3ce-d7d1bbce88ca_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bovrKhZG


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 03:08:09 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/25/justice/missouri-missing-girl/
Attorney: Missing Missouri girl's family is 'stumped'
By the CNN Wire Staff
updated 2:47 PM EST, Tue October 25, 2011

(CNN) -- An attorney representing the family of a missing Missouri 11-month-old said the girl's parents are "stumped" as to what happened to her, but are "an open book" for investigators.

A prayer vigil held for Lisa Irwin on Sunday was important to parents Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley, as it showed them others in the community support them, attorney Cyndy Short told CNN Monday.

"They're on a journey that no one has a road map for," she said of the couple.
 
Lisa was reported missing at 4 a.m. October 4, after Jeremy Irwin arrived home from work to find the door unlocked, the lights on and a window that had been tampered with. Bradley said she last saw Lisa at 6:40 p.m. the night before.

Bradley said in an NBC interview last week that she was drunk the night Lisa disappeared and that she had last seen the baby about four hours earlier than initially reported.

Bradley, Short said, is "a young mother. She's 25 years old. She's, like all of us, making her way through life."

The couple's oldest son is Jeremy Irwin's, and their middle son is Bradley's son, Short said. "Lisa was the little girl that was going to hold this family together." She was wanted, looked forward to and "well-loved," Short said.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 04:02:22 PM
There willl always be the sayng " This baby was Loved " I dont think I have ever seen a missing childs board where this wasnt said over and over and it really doesnt mean anything, Im sure every child that has ever been killed or came up missing was Loved, but all it takes is that one mistake, that one slip up, and then is what we have, another missing child, and more then likely a dead child who's body has been hiden by the very ones that Loved her, I dont think any of the sightings have anything to do with baby Lisa, IMO, when something like this happens the first thing that the person thinks of is getting rid of the body, also I dont think DB's brother would help do this at all, not unless he was tto blame for the death in some way and then I dont think DB would have gone along with it if she wasnt directly involved.  I mean I have 5 brothers who have stood beside me no matter what, lied to kep me outta trouble when we were children and even took a whooping or two just so I wouldnt get one, but let me ask them to help me hide the body of a child that I had something to do with her death and uhhh, NO, dont see that happening, that would be going too far and although I Love them very much, the same goes for me if they ever asked me something like that...NO.........I think that if DB did neglect baby Lisa in some way and caused her death the only one that would help her is her boyfriend!  If that is the case then the baby is probably close to home....or on the route to where he worked.....This isnt something they planned and they would have wanted the body gone as soon as possible so.....Its around somewhere close or somewhere they traveled that night. I think this case will be solved soon, something will be found or someone will come forward IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 25, 2011, 04:44:05 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/25/justice/missouri-missing-girl/
Attorney: Missing Missouri girl's family is 'stumped'
By the CNN Wire Staff
updated 2:47 PM EST, Tue October 25, 2011

(CNN) -- An attorney representing the family of a missing Missouri 11-month-old said the girl's parents are "stumped" as to what happened to her, but are "an open book" for investigators.

A prayer vigil held for Lisa Irwin on Sunday was important to parents Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley, as it showed them others in the community support them, attorney Cyndy Short told CNN Monday.

"They're on a journey that no one has a road map for," she said of the couple.
 
Lisa was reported missing at 4 a.m. October 4, after Jeremy Irwin arrived home from work to find the door unlocked, the lights on and a window that had been tampered with. Bradley said she last saw Lisa at 6:40 p.m. the night before.

Bradley said in an NBC interview last week that she was drunk the night Lisa disappeared and that she had last seen the baby about four hours earlier than initially reported.

Bradley, Short said, is "a young mother. She's 25 years old. She's, like all of us, making her way through life."

The couple's oldest son is Jeremy Irwin's, and their middle son is Bradley's son, Short said. "Lisa was the little girl that was going to hold this family together." She was wanted, looked forward to and "well-loved," Short said.
 ::snipping2::

I find it odd that Deborah Bradley can be so sure of some things and so muddled about others.  Her statement in which she states that she doesn't "think alcohol changes a person enough to do something like that[hurt a baby]" is just absolutely preposterous and the type of thinking that an addict in denial would have.  There is a reason why Deborah Bradley does not have a driver's license, and it has to do with her lack of respect for the laws which restrict people who can't keep clean or sober from operating a vehicle legally. 

And if TacoJoe thinks that the profession of "love" for a child can provide insulation against evil acts, he needs to think again.  How many pregnant women refuse to give up their drug habit to protect the baby that they are carrying?  When social services takes the addicted newborn away, they wail about their maternal love, but it is too late by then. 

Call me jaded; call me judgmental, but there are far too many coincidences and inconsistencies in this case to allow me to give either of these parental units a free pass for the responsibility of their missing daughter.   ::witch2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 25, 2011, 04:59:13 PM
Has this been posted yet?

http://blog.eyesforlies.com/


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 25, 2011, 05:06:57 PM
Did anyone catch Stanton talking to Megyn (on FOX) about the stories of the man seen carrying a baby in the middle of the night? It aired about 30 minutes ago. I hope they replay it because he says something about how some people were even speculating that the man witness' saw could have been holding another MAN!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: (SERIOUSLY, I COULDN'T MAKE THIS STUFF UP) Like a man and his "MINI ME"......the nuts are coming out in full force~ Is there a Full Moon?
 ::MonkeyJnBox::

I don't know about a full moon, Cartfly, but I'm sure gonna check tonight.  If there isn't, there should be.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 25, 2011, 05:09:54 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?

**Warning - Wild imagination on the loose.**

Perhaps she put baby Lisa down at both those times?  She put her down at 6:40 and then got her drink on with the neighbor.  At around 10:30 the baby woke up, fussy and cranky and DB was too drunk to deal with her.  Perhaps she's taking painkillers as well.  Women who give birth are frequently offered Vicodin and some get addicted and continue to request it long after the baby is born.  Vicodin offers a euphoric feeling but after it wears off the user becomes very irritable because the high is gone.   Every little noise becomes amplified and unbearable.  Couple this mental state with 5 or so glasses of wine and you've got one very unstable and angry mofo.  If the baby was fussing she may have shaken the life out of her.  JMCO.  (Just my crazy opinion.)

And the evidence of Deborah taking Vicodin is?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 25, 2011, 05:17:22 PM
Attorney says Lisa Irwin's parents are troubled that the national attention on them maybe taking away from the search for their daughter. Read more: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 8:42 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/25/bc661da0-666e-40de-9634-febfac8d1c8c_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bo1EMQGb


Wonder if the LE department flip jw walk to of the guy at the gas station.
They might have a problem to define the person(maybe)
Didn't one of the people that saw the guy walking that night say the person didn't have a lot of hair?
J Irwin fixes the height description too.

Did someone work with J Irwin all the time that night?

Does the dog stay outside or inside?
Dog didn't bark, which puzzles me..
One of the news reporters said when he was by the house the dog bark a lot, loud.
 ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 25, 2011, 05:19:27 PM
Attorney says Lisa Irwin's parents are troubled that the national attention on them maybe taking away from the search for their daughter. Read more: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 8:42 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/25/bc661da0-666e-40de-9634-febfac8d1c8c_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bo1EMQGb


Wonder if the LE department can flip jw walk of the guy at the gas station and compare them to each other.
They might have a program to define the person(maybe)
Didn't one of the people that saw the guy walking that night say the person didn't have a lot of hair?
J Irwin fixes the height description too.

Did someone work with J Irwin all the time that night?

Does the dog stay outside or inside?
Dog didn't bark, which puzzles me..
One of the news reporters said when he was by the house the dog bark a lot, loud.
 ::MonkeyEek::


self edit...oops.. ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flamom on October 25, 2011, 05:23:07 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 05:42:06 PM
 ::snipping2::

[/quote]

Don't remember any bald heads. Did anyone else notice any?
[/quote]


NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html




(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
 
[/quote]





Very tall...very slender and...pretty durn bald.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 25, 2011, 05:44:08 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.




Kermit ... the thought crossed my mind with the revelation of the witnesses.

When the description provided by the neighbour witness on Nancy Grace of the man she observed carrying a baby and ... then the words of the motorcycle rider in the following video ... could it be that Jeremy arrived home around 12:15 AM and ... found Lisa deceased beside her mother and ... in distressed state of mind wandered the streets for over three hours holding his daughter?

Janet

++++

12:15 AM

NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


04:00 AM

Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369



I want to believe that the parents didn't do it, but my gut won't let me.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 05:45:57 PM
::snipping2::


Don't remember any bald heads. Did anyone else notice any?
[/quote]


NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html




(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
 
[/quote]





Very tall...very slender and...pretty durn bald.
[/quote]

HLN Vinnie Politan 5 minutes ago.   Discussion of photo shown to a witness of the man carrying a baby. Witness specified a photo looked like the man he saw.  Wonder if it was a photo of Jeremy? Or maybe Jersey.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 25, 2011, 05:46:46 PM
::snipping2::


Don't remember any bald heads. Did anyone else notice any?
[/quote]


NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html




(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
 
[/quote]





Very tall...very slender and...pretty durn bald.
[/quote]

Yowsa! Yoder you and Tamikosmom might be right.
That would explain his non emotional behavior - shock, stress and perhaps fear that he'd lose his whole family if
they called 911 and deborah went to jail.




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kermit on October 25, 2011, 05:47:36 PM
LE find that baby!!!!



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 05:51:37 PM
The Irwins stopped into the house on Walrond on Tuesday.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 4:07 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bpfxdnJe
Video at link.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 25, 2011, 05:55:54 PM
Does anyone know where the starbucks was Jeremy was working at?
Wonder how it fits on the map with the timeline ..


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 05:57:44 PM
http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/
No Comment from Police on Possible Eyewitnesses in Baby Lisa Case
October 25th, 2011
04:40 PM ET

Police would not comment Tuesday on the significance of surveillance video that appears to show a man walking less than two miles from Lisa Irwin’s home on the night she disappeared.

Kansas City Police Capt. Steve Young also declined to comment on eyewitness reports of a man seen carrying a baby wearing just a diaper in the area in the early hours of October 4. A couple living a few houses from Irwin’s parents saw a man and baby around 12:15 am, and another witness, Mike Thompson, saw a similarly-described man around 4:00 am about three miles away.
 ::snipping2::

 ::snipping2::
Attorney Joe Tacopina said in an interview on GMA Tuesday that it is “maddening” to hear a police spokesman suggest Bradley and Irwin are not being fully cooperative with investigators.

“They’ve done everything they’ve been asked to do…They have nothing to hide and they want answers,” Tacopina said.

Still, he did place one restriction on the parents sitting down to talk to police again. He said they would only agree to be re-interviewed “as long as the investigators doing the questioning are ones who have not previously determined guilt before having a stitch of evidence.”

He claimed that detectives accused Bradley of murdering Lisa just one hour after she was reported missing.
Tacopina also dismissed the cadaver dog “hit” in the couple’s bedroom described in a search warrant affidavit, saying the dog could have picked up the scent of a dirty diaper or toenail clippings. He maintained that is not necessarily evidence that a dead body had ever been there.

“You don’t hook your case on a dog wagging its tail in a bedroom,” he said.
 ::snipping2::

 ::snipping2::
Bradley’s estranged husband has now spoken out about the case to NBC News. On NBC’s “Today Show” Tuesday, a reporter quoted Sean Bradley as saying Deborah “has always been a good mom.”

Sean Bradley told NBC he has been interviewed by the FBI



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 25, 2011, 05:58:10 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

There's no link for this because it was just on Vinnie Politan.  Deborah was approached by a reporter yesterday for a comment and she said she's not giving interviews because she's "grieving".  I find that word so odd.  I never heard Beth Holloway or Kate and Gerry McCann use the word grieving because their children were missing.  People grieve when they know for sure that the child is dead IMO.  Deborah is beginning to remind me so much of Cindy Anthony, being snotty to reporters yet giving t.v. interviews.  They each allowed Caylee and Casey's bedrooms to be filmed.  So many similarities.

Another thing that strikes me as odd is that Deborah said that she told the boys that they could sleep in her room.  Lisa was the one who was sick and on the other side of the house.  I would want Lisa with me, just because of the fact that she was sick.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: kcrn on October 25, 2011, 05:59:54 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?

**Warning - Wild imagination on the loose.**

Perhaps she put baby Lisa down at both those times?  She put her down at 6:40 and then got her drink on with the neighbor.  At around 10:30 the baby woke up, fussy and cranky and DB was too drunk to deal with her.  Perhaps she's taking painkillers as well.  Women who give birth are frequently offered Vicodin and some get addicted and continue to request it long after the baby is born.  Vicodin offers a euphoric feeling but after it wears off the user becomes very irritable because the high is gone.   Every little noise becomes amplified and unbearable.  Couple this mental state with 5 or so glasses of wine and you've got one very unstable and angry mofo.  If the baby was fussing she may have shaken the life out of her.  JMCO.  (Just my crazy opinion.)

And the evidence of Deborah taking Vicodin is?
i dont think she said that she DID take it, it was just a what if scenario. thats pretty much what everyone does here is think of the possibilities.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 06:11:28 PM
The Question is

where was baby Lisa sleeping?

where were the boys sleeping?

cuz mom said the one boy was in her bed
dad says the boys were in their own beds

Which is it?

AND

if there was a baby monitor where is it at?


There appears to be a woman's purse on the floor, under that table is several what appears to be presents wrapped
mail/letters on the floor, electrical cord plugged in along with that light plugged in and a couple of diapers on the table..............I think.

Someone might be able to blow it up with resolution and see if there is a baby monitor.

I suspect the baby is who was in the bed and not the boy.

Dang good questions.  The question that I'd like answered most is why DB changed her story about what time she put Lisa down.  Why go from 10:30 to 6:40?  Was it because of the wine drinking?  If she started drinking early evening, she'd surely be drunk by 10:30 which would raise eyebrows that she was handling a baby in a drunken state.

Has she truly not offered an explanation for the time change?

**Warning - Wild imagination on the loose.**

Perhaps she put baby Lisa down at both those times?  She put her down at 6:40 and then got her drink on with the neighbor.  At around 10:30 the baby woke up, fussy and cranky and DB was too drunk to deal with her.  Perhaps she's taking painkillers as well.  Women who give birth are frequently offered Vicodin and some get addicted and continue to request it long after the baby is born.  Vicodin offers a euphoric feeling but after it wears off the user becomes very irritable because the high is gone.   Every little noise becomes amplified and unbearable.  Couple this mental state with 5 or so glasses of wine and you've got one very unstable and angry mofo.  If the baby was fussing she may have shaken the life out of her.  JMCO.  (Just my crazy opinion.)

And the evidence of Deborah taking Vicodin is?
i dont think she said that she DID take it, it was just a what if scenario. thats pretty much what everyone does here is think of the possibilities.
exactly  hence the words........(just my crazy opinion)..........its a theory!!! 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 06:14:24 PM
Apologies if this has been posted before. This is from one of the witness' of the man carrying a baby at 12 ish that night on his FB (also note that you should be able to see the comments to this picture if you click on the last link in this post):

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale
Baby Lisa house from my backyard
and

Quote
Honesto-Ono Parscale don't know them but their kids go to school with my kids
October 19 at 7:17pm

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/300336_262376500465443_100000792845229_658302_1863703139_n.jpg)

 https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall (https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000792845229&sk=wall)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater  (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=262376500465443&set=p.262376500465443&type=1&theater)




Seems to have a clear view of DB and JI driveway. Wonder if he noticed whether or not the family usually parked in the driveway and used the front door or parked in back of the house and used the backdoor?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 25, 2011, 06:23:49 PM
Could it be that the descriptions revealed by the witnesses in regards to the man who they observed carrying an unclothed baby throughout the streets in the early hours of October 4th is the smoking gun that will blow this case wide open ... descriptions that appear to be pointing at Jeremy Irwin?

Does Jeremy Irwin have some explaining to do ... explaining that may implicate Debbie Bradley in the happenings encompassing the demise of baby Lisa?

Janet

 
::rhino::
I think you may be right Janet. Somehow I can not see Debra disposing of her baby. A baby she obviously loved but "apparently" make a bad decision resulting in the child's demise. I believe her when she says she was a good Mother. But feel like she make a crucial mistake drinking into oblivion that evening when she had no one else to keep her children from harm. I think this would explain Jeremy's behavior, cold-odd as if he was in shock knowing he had the task of disposing of his daughter.

P.S. Thanks for bringing over the transcripts of JVM :)

The problem with suspecting that it was Jeremy who was walking around for several hours with a dead baby is that he claims to have been at work during this time and unless the police investigating this are complete idiots, they would have checked Jeremy's alibi.  While I haven't been impressed with LE in KC so far, if it were not true that Jeremy was working,  he would be under arrest by now.  As for the "Witness" saying the person carrying a baby was "Very tall," she said he was 5' 8" to 6'.  I am 5'8", quite tall for a woman, but I don't consider a man who is 5' 8" to 6' to be "Very tall."  Just average, actually.  "Very tall" would be 6' 5" or taller to me, anyway.  I don't want to say this woman is lying.  I don't know if she is or not.   But unlike most crimes, in this case for every argument, there is an equally valid counter-argument. 

Also commenting on the video of the inside of the house after the 17 hour search by LE, I note there is no fingerprint powder in evidence, they did not take a piece of carpet from the supposed area where the cadaver dog "Hit," and they only took six articles.  The carpet they were parading around with came from the shed and if it had been in the bedroom, I don't think it would have gone unnoticed had Deborah and Jeremy had the bedroom carpet replaced between the time Lisa disappeared and the time that the exhaustive 17 hour search took place.

If my baby had been stolen in the night, I can't say how I would act.  I don't know.  I know I would be frantic and inconsolable.  However, I think I can say with some certainty that if I were accused by detectives of having killed my baby and I had not done so, I would hire a lawyer and follow that lawyer's advice.  Further, I wouldn't speak to that detective again, although I might speak to a different detective. I just can't imagine being innocent of such a horrendous act and having LE accuse me and try to get me to confess to something I hadn't done.  As to not allowing the boys to again speak to LE, maybe the mother was accused to the boys while they were being questioned.  Maybe the experience was frightening and traumatic.  If that were the case, would you let LE have another go at them? I wouldn't.

Look.  I don't like this woman.  I think she is ultimately responsible for whatever happened to baby Lisa.  She is a poor excuse for a mother to be falling down drunk when she was solely responsible for three young children.  IMO That's bad enough.  I don't need to imagine even worse things.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Curly on October 25, 2011, 06:25:27 PM
Did anyone catch Stanton talking to Megyn (on FOX) about the stories of the man seen carrying a baby in the middle of the night? It aired about 30 minutes ago. I hope they replay it because he says something about how some people were even speculating that the man witness' saw could have been holding another MAN!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: (SERIOUSLY, I COULDN'T MAKE THIS STUFF UP) Like a man and his "MINI ME"......the nuts are coming out in full force~ Is there a Full Moon?
 ::MonkeyJnBox::

I don't know about a full moon, Cartfly, but I'm sure gonna check tonight.  If there isn't, there should be.

Pretty sure it's a new moon.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Brandi on October 25, 2011, 06:29:03 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander)
PeterAlexander Peter Alexander
#BabyLisa's family takes us inside home @TodayShow (Pic: BR where dog found scent) yfrog.com/o0q4aqj (http://yfrog.com/o0q4aqj)
10 hours ago

(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=q4aq.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)

This pictures taken AFTER the extensive search by police. So, we can expect the police to leave a huge mess behind.

I'm anxious to find out if that search got them some real evidence to proceed in the case.




" Bradley said. "I take good care of my kids. I keep my house clean, do their laundry....."
http://www.news-leader.com/article/20111017/NEWS11/111017002/UPDATE-Kansas-City-mom-admits-she-drunk-when-her-baby-vanished
<snipped>
stains on the rug, laundry in the basket not put away & where would the baby monitor be at?

Am a few pages behind, but I think the baby monitor shows up on the night stand in this picture from http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2052957/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Photos-Baby-Lisas-bedroom-handprints-wall.html?ITO=1490

(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/article-2052957-0E842BB700000578-768_634x353.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Itaryl Moosee on October 25, 2011, 06:44:16 PM
Someone showed a map of the BP station from an angle, I got one from another angle.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-mapofbp.jpg)

Not sure where's the camera sitting at, though.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 06:50:29 PM
Someone showed a map of the BP station from an angle, I got one from another angle.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-mapofbp.jpg)

Not sure where's the camera sitting at, though.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)


thats not alot of woods to be going into....and it wouldnt take a lot to search it either.....I dont think LE wood have a problem searching all around there if they thought what is showing up on that camera important........I dont really see anything important when I watched it, looked like a man, woman, teenager,senior........no way to tell for sure and I definaitly  didnt see this person carrying anything that would lead me to believe that it has any link to baby Lisa being gone...IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 25, 2011, 07:09:20 PM
Someone showed a map of the BP station from an angle, I got one from another angle.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-mapofbp.jpg)

Not sure where's the camera sitting at, though.

(http://i803.photobucket.com/albums/yy315/TomboyKetchup/scakeys-lisa12.jpg)



I posted this yesterday - same satellite view  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6101/6278721816_5f0de24583_o.gif)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 07:13:45 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/video/29585405/detail.html
Cadaver Dogs Debated In Baby Lisa Case
POSTED: 5:50 pm CDT October 25, 2011
UPDATED: 5:54 pm CDT October 25, 2011


Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/video/29585405/detail.html#ixzz1bq1A1sRh


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 25, 2011, 07:15:59 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 07:16:56 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
Yes she did.  ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:17:46 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

I agree!!!!!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 07:20:52 PM
http://www.examiner.com/crime-in-national/police-looking-for-73-year-old-who-went-searching-for-baby-lisa-irwin
Police looking for 73-year-old who went searching for Baby Lisa Irwin (video)
Cindy Adams
, Crime Examiner
October 24, 2011


Continue reading on Examiner.com Police looking for 73-year-old who went searching for Baby Lisa Irwin (video) - National Crime | Examiner.com http://www.examiner.com/crime-in-national/police-looking-for-73-year-old-who-went-searching-for-baby-lisa-irwin#ixzz1bq2uYnLN




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 07:22:07 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:23:56 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

There's no link for this because it was just on Vinnie Politan.  Deborah was approached by a reporter yesterday for a comment and she said she's not giving interviews because she's "grieving".  I find that word so odd.  I never heard Beth Holloway or Kate and Gerry McCann use the word grieving because their children were missing.  People grieve when they know for sure that the child is dead IMO.  Deborah is beginning to remind me so much of Cindy Anthony, being snotty to reporters yet giving t.v. interviews.  They each allowed Caylee and Casey's bedrooms to be filmed.  So many similarities.

Another thing that strikes me as odd is that Deborah said that she told the boys that they could sleep in her room.  Lisa was the one who was sick and on the other side of the house.  I would want Lisa with me, just because of the fact that she was sick.



Good points.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 25, 2011, 07:25:00 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

I agree!!!!!

Mark Lunsford was giving interviews every chance he got.  He withstood all kinds of criticism with one thought, to find his daughter. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:27:29 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 07:30:28 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:31:22 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

I agree!!!!!

Mark Lunsford was giving interviews every chance he got.  He withstood all kinds of criticism with one thought, to find his daughter. 

You are so right - God love him.  He withstood some of the worst redicule I have ever seen.  But bravely kept going forward.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:31:50 PM
Can you still call 911 from a cell phone if service is off due to non payment? JVM clipping of Deborah saying Jeremy told her to call 911 and when she went into the kitchen the phones were gone? service or no service?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:35:10 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!
It had a lot of details saying that she also bought mac and cheese when she got the baby food ,wine,and wipes. And if I am not mistaken this comes from her interview for this article. Any monkeys have the magazine? I should have tried to take a pic of the pages .


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:35:57 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Didn't see it, but I don't doubt her either,  as from the beginning, [ it's prolly just me ], but something is just fishy ...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 07:39:25 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!
It had a lot of details saying that she also bought mac and cheese when she got the baby food ,wine,and wipes. And if I am not mistaken this comes from her interview for this article. Any monkeys have the magazine? I should have tried to take a pic of the pages .
thats really interesting.....Id like to read that ...maybe someone will find it and post it if not I will look for it tomorrow........do you think that what they usually post in that magazine can be believed?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:46:45 PM
here is the magazine that it is in...you can read stuff from past issues it looks like...people magazine on line is People.com
Not sure how credible the magazine is or Deborah if she gave the interview .

Edit to add link:
https://subscription.people.com/storefront/subscribe-to-people/site/pe-4freesubtle0611.html?tcmid=NsTout&link=1001032


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:47:42 PM
here is the magazine that it is in...you can read stuff from past issues it looks like...people magazine on line is People.com
Not sure how credible the magazine is or Deborah if she gave the interview .
forgot the link lol
https://subscription.people.com/storefront/subscribe-to-people/site/pe-4freesubtle0611.html?tcmid=NsTout&link=1001032


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 07:47:43 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Didn't see it, but I don't doubt her either,  as from the beginning, [ it's prolly just me ], but something is just fishy ...
something is very fishy.......lies....changing stories...no talking to LE......something stinks with that woman and it aint the garbage..imo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:47:50 PM
Most of us are all so worn down from the Caylee Anthony case and subsequent trial, that more than likely, many of us would rather
just not become so involved and interested in yet another apparent travesty of justice against one more helpless and trusting young little person.  But, there is something so intrinsically compelling about this precious little face of Baby Lisa that begs for help - begs for justice.   What a precious little person ... she needed loving protection twenty four hours a day.   No excuse for an inebriated caretaker/mother.    I don't even buy that scenario anyway ...  What on earth happened to this angel?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 25, 2011, 07:51:36 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Didn't see it, but I don't doubt her either,  as from the beginning, [ it's prolly just me ], but something is just fishy ...
something is very fishy.......lies....changing stories...no talking to LE......something stinks with that woman and it aint the garbage..imo

In my view - the biological father is as peculiar as well.   


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 25, 2011, 07:53:55 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!

JUST SO HAPPENS, my DIL was here this weekend and had the new People magazine.  She left it here and I just got it out of our recycle bin.  I'll scan the article and post it  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:53:59 PM
looks like it is their version...
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-people-magazine-with-lisa-irwin-case-hits-store-shelves-20111022,0,199753.story


"What Happened to Baby Lisa?" is the title of the People magazine cover spread now on stands in stores.

The Kansas City missing baby case has gone national and international, and now with the new edition of People, even more people are aware of Lisa's disappearance.

In the article, Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin retell their version of the events they remember from Lisa's disappearance nearly three weeks ago and deny any knowledge of where their daughter is.  Bradley says, "Let them search all they want," about the recent intense search conducted at their home.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 07:55:22 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!

JUST SO HAPPENS, my DIL was here this weekend and had the new People magazine.  She left it here and I just got it out of our recycle bin.  I'll scan the article and post it  ::MonkeyCool::
Yes ! Yes ! Yes !!!! I love you !!! ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 07:55:39 PM
I don't know if anyoone has read the people magazine article but I was reading it today at work and it said that Jeremy left for work at 5:30 and that deborah  cooked chicken dinner for herself ,the boys,the neighbor, and the neighbors daughter and then put Lisa down at 6:40 because she was fussy. Then she put in a movie for the boys and the neighbor girl and then her and the neighbor drank.
Soooo....she was able to cook a chicken dinner , eat it , clean the kitchen spotless as seen in the video , and put lisa down and get her to sleep so that she could drink with the neihgbor ? That is all in an hour and 10 minutes ? wow!

Anyone else get to read the article?
I didnt , dang.......wonder if we can find it on line...Klaas has always been good about posting that kinda thing....me...not so much....I just learned how to post my own pictures..lol.....but yea...Id like to read that one myself!!

JUST SO HAPPENS, my DIL was here this weekend and had the new People magazine.  She left it here and I just got it out of our recycle bin.  I'll scan the article and post it  ::MonkeyCool::
yay...Thank You Klaas.......


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: fatcatlurker on October 25, 2011, 08:05:20 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuXiLkJ1jr4

local video's driving from dumpster fire location to Irwin's house.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:08:18 PM
http://thestir.cafemom.com/baby/127892/missing_baby_lisa_irwins_mom
Missing Baby Lisa Irwin's Mom Makes Us Question Drinking While Parenting
Posted by Sheri Reed
on October 25, 2011 at 7:12 PM


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: klaasend on October 25, 2011, 08:11:56 PM
New People magazine.  Not sure if it is the issue being referred to but it's what I have  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6094/6281234019_55fecd68a4_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6094/6281749784_2a3416d7e8_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6281234103_c99b97c9ae_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6118/6281749876_e50f7bb7ed_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6216/6281749924_78342896f8_b.jpg)

(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6233/6281234249_66abb66bb5_b.jpg)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 25, 2011, 08:13:45 PM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Didn't see it, but I don't doubt her either,  as from the beginning, [ it's prolly just me ], but something is just fishy ...

 ::HelloKitty::
Lisa Irwin: Issues 10/25/11 Part 1
From: Sierra1947  | Oct 25, 2011 
http://www.youtube.com/user/Sierra1947#p/u/1/oESIytKYpu0


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 08:21:22 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 08:35:14 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: my2cents on October 25, 2011, 08:43:28 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!

Oooooh what a tangled web ...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 25, 2011, 08:50:00 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 08:55:26 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: theboyzmom on October 25, 2011, 09:04:29 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....

And mommy was sleeping and did not hear a thing . . .


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 25, 2011, 09:08:37 PM
Hi Monks!
I am just dropping down to put my 2 cents in.... if my baby was kidnapped, I would have my mug on TV every night like Beth Holloway did, and I would be begging for my baby's safe return....
I wouldn't be grieving, because I would not know if my baby was dead or alive. I would be freaked out.. 
thank you very much for all of the pictures and links.. I read here every day and appreciate it!!

I agree!!!!!

Mark Lunsford was giving interviews every chance he got.  He withstood all kinds of criticism with one thought, to find his daughter. 
John Walsh and his family went thru h3ll.  But he talked with LE, had a poly, and did whatever he needed to do. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: StarMonkey on October 25, 2011, 09:28:12 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....

And mommy was sleeping and did not hear a thing . . .
I can't understand IF Deborah got rid of the baby and Jeremy came home and she was gone...
No it just isn't right because he lied to LE about when he came home 2 complete different stories.
He had to be ok with dumping his own baby but did he? Or Deborah got someone else to and he was OK with that?!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 25, 2011, 09:34:37 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....

And mommy was sleeping and did not hear a thing . . .
I can't understand IF Deborah got rid of the baby and Jeremy came home and she was gone...
No it just isn't right because he lied to LE about when he came home 2 complete different stories.
He had to be ok with dumping his own baby but did he? Or Deborah got someone else to and he was OK with that?!

http://blog.eyesforlies.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-missing-hotspots.html
JMO:  JI is so smitten with DB that he'd do anything.  If he comes clean he loses her and both boys... he seems too timid to stand up


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Brandi on October 25, 2011, 09:36:54 PM
Most of us are all so worn down from the Caylee Anthony case and subsequent trial, that more than likely, many of us would rather
just not become so involved and interested in yet another apparent travesty of justice against one more helpless and trusting young little person.  But, there is something so intrinsically compelling about this precious little face of Baby Lisa that begs for help - begs for justice.   What a precious little person ... she needed loving protection twenty four hours a day.   No excuse for an inebriated caretaker/mother.    I don't even buy that scenario anyway ...  What on earth happened to this angel?

Ono, I fall into that category completely.

Didn't want to get involved in another missing child, but started coming here to read and did my own research on missing Lisa, without posting, trying to keep a distance. But for some reason, I am compelled to post.

I don't think any caregiver responsible for children has the right to, as her mother said, "Have my adult time" if that means getting drunk and unable to care for the children. Upsets me to think she did this several times a week, as she stated. Then denied she had a drinking problem. Even snickered as she said, "No" when asked.

Poor Baby Lisa.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 25, 2011, 09:41:03 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....

And mommy was sleeping and did not hear a thing . . .
I can't understand IF Deborah got rid of the baby and Jeremy came home and she was gone...
No it just isn't right because he lied to LE about when he came home 2 complete different stories.
He had to be ok with dumping his own baby but did he? Or Deborah got someone else to and he was OK with that?!

http://blog.eyesforlies.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-missing-hotspots.html
JMO:  JI is so smitten with DB that he'd do anything.  If he comes clean he loses her and both boys... he seems too timid to stand up
and again...a similarity to the Haliegh case......exept turned around...Misty was too timid and  head over heals in Love with Ronald..........and yes, I agree.....JI is too timid and wouldnt go against DB.....IMO


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Catbert on October 25, 2011, 09:46:50 PM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
Very good point .. and the recording of the dispatch to LE said he also said "he didn't witness anything"


kinda also sounds like Ronald Cummings words...I was at work........Im not buying a word of anything they have to say.....

And mommy was sleeping and did not hear a thing . . .
I can't understand IF Deborah got rid of the baby and Jeremy came home and she was gone...
No it just isn't right because he lied to LE about when he came home 2 complete different stories.
He had to be ok with dumping his own baby but did he? Or Deborah got someone else to and he was OK with that?!

http://blog.eyesforlies.com/2011/10/lisa-irwin-missing-hotspots.html
JMO:  JI is so smitten with DB that he'd do anything.  If he comes clean he loses her and both boys... he seems too timid to stand up
and again...a similarity to the Haliegh case......exept turned around...Misty was too timid and  head over heals in Love with Ronald..........and yes, I agree.....JI is too timid and wouldnt go against DB.....IMO

Agree - Agree - Agree; and thus far everyone has gotten away with it ... makes me SICK ::witch2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 10:10:09 PM


(http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg620/scaled.php?tn=0&server=620&filename=gg4eez.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640)
 

If there is no witness or security video that can provide confirmation that Jeremy Irwin was at his workplace between the hours of 12:15 AM and 04:00 AM on the morning of October 4th ... I somehow believe that this case is going to move forward fast.

Think about it.  What are the chances that three witnesses descriptions could be wrong.

The video regarding the re-interview with Mike Thompson is a must see.

Janet

++++++

12:15 AM

NANCY GRACE
Aired October 24, 2011 - 20:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL:  ... Lisa, you claim you saw a man with the baby that night. Are you sure it was a man?

LISA, WITNESS WHO CLAIMS SHE SAW MAN WITH INFANT RESEMBLING BABY LISA: Yes, I am positive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: That is correct. You have no doubts that it was a man? How can you be so sure?

LISA: Yes. Correct. Based on the lighting. When it reflected off of the gentleman`s head, there was no long hair. To us it appeared as if the gentleman had a bald head.

<snipped>

LISA: The cops did offer to make a sketch for us. However, we didn`t have clear facial features to give them. We were able to describe the man, he was very slender. He was a tall gentleman. He was probably six-foot tall, maybe 5`8" to six-feet tall. So he was a really tall gentleman and he was very, very slender. He was wearing a white T-shirt and some sweat pants.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/24/ng.01.html


04:00 AM

Witnesses Claim They Saw Man Carrying Missing Baby Lisa
Updated: Friday, 21 Oct 2011, 10:27 AM CDT
Published : Friday, 21 Oct 2011, 10:25 AM CDT


(NewsCore) - Three Kansas City residents said Friday that they saw a suspicious man walking the streets with an infant on the night that 11-month-old Lisa Irwin disappeared.

Mike Thompson told ABC's "Good Morning America" that he was heading home on his motorcycle around 4:00am when he noticed the man, who was dressed in a T-shirt, on a street near Baby Lisa's home.

"[It was] 4 o'clock in the morning, 45 degrees, the baby don't have a blanket or coat or nothin', and this guy's walking down the street," Thompson said. "I thought it was kind of weird."

Thompson claimed the infant -- who was only wearing a diaper -- resembled Baby Lisa and said that he would recognize the man if he saw him again.

He said he waited about a week to report the sighting to police because he did not immediately make the connection to Baby Lisa's disappearance.

<snipped>

http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/dpps/news/baby-lisa-witnesses-speak-dpgonc-20111021-fc_15585422


Baby Lisa Witness Re-Interviewed Witness claims he saw a man walking with a baby the night Lisa Irwin vanished.
02:47 | 10/25/2011


Video:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-police-interview-key-witness-14808369



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: cookie on October 25, 2011, 10:18:53 PM
I heard on the radio tonight, Nancy Grace show I think with JVM..anyways, someone said something about the guy walking around could have been 'staged' with a doll to make the story of a kidnapping seem plausible..
not the exact wording but I hope you get my drift...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 10:34:40 PM
Could it be that the descriptions revealed by the witnesses in regards to the man who they observed carrying an unclothed baby throughout the streets in the early hours of October 4th is the smoking gun that will blow this case wide open ... descriptions that appear to be pointing at Jeremy Irwin?

Does Jeremy Irwin have some explaining to do ... explaining that may implicate Debbie Bradley in the happenings encompassing the demise of baby Lisa?

Janet

 

 ::rhino::

I think you may be right Janet. Somehow I can not see Debra disposing of her baby. A baby she obviously loved but "apparently" make a bad decision resulting in the child's demise. I believe her when she says she was a good Mother. But feel like she make a crucial mistake drinking into oblivion that evening when she had no one else to keep her children from harm. I think this would explain Jeremy's behavior, cold-odd as if he was in shock knowing he had the task of disposing of his daughter.

P.S. Thanks for bringing over the transcripts of JVM :)

YW cartfly.

When both the 12:15 AM and 04:00 AM sightings of a man carrying a baby are considered and when the descriptions are considered ... I speculate that Jeremy may have been contacted at work by Debbie after baby Lisa met her demise.  He returned home immediately and ... a distraught Jeremy walked the streets with his baby daughter attempting to figure out what to do.  Meanwhile ... Debbie disappeared the cell phones in an attempt to destroy evidence.

Considering the fuzzy image of a male in the 02:30 AM gas station security video appears to be wearing white pants and no baby is revealed ... could it be that this sighting may not be case related?

Janet

+++++

Missing Baby Lisa Irwin: New Surveillance Footage Shows Man Leaving Woods [VIDEO]
October 24, 2011 4:42 PM EDT


<snipped>

Surveillance footage of a mystery man leaving a wooded area on the night of baby Lisa Irwin's alleged disappearance nearly three weeks ago was located at a gas station in Kansas City near Deborah Bradley and Jeremy Irwin's home. The security camera shows a man dressed in white  leaving the woods at 2:30 a.m. just two miles from baby Lisa's home.

<snipped>

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/236715/20111024/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-deborah-bradley-jeremy-mystery-man-kansas-city-missouri-cadaver-dog-surveill.htm


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: grace-land on October 25, 2011, 10:54:07 PM
http://www.kctv5.com/story/15875010/missing-childrens-group-blankets-wal

Three weeks later, no signs of baby Lisa
Posted: Oct 25, 2011 7:08 PM CDT
Updated: Oct 25, 2011 8:59 PM CDT
By DeAnn Smith, Digital Content Manager - email

 ::snipping2::

The department's Crimes Against Children unit is overseeing the crime. The unit is within the Special Victims area. Capt. Mark Folsom is the unit's commander.

Folsom was the lead detective in the investigation of the Waldo area rapes that terrorized that neighborhood in 2009 and 2010. Folsom is known as a methodical and tireless detective who is camera shy. The department came under scathing criticism from Waldo area residents and even some council members for not making a quick arrest in the attacks and for seemingly having few leads.

While Folsom and his detectives focused on making an arrest, few details leaked about potential suspects before Bernard Jackson was arrested in May 2010 in connection with a series of Waldo area rapes in the 1980s. Jackson was convicted this summer and sentenced earlier this month to life in prison for those rapes. He is still awaiting trial in connection with charges involving the more recent Waldo rapes.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 25, 2011, 10:57:02 PM
Missing Baby Lisa: Police 'Need' Separate Interviews with Parents
Oct. 25, 2011


<snipped>

Police are still intent on interviewing the parents, Deborah Bradley, 25, and Jeremy Irwin, 29.

"We need them to sit down apart from each other, with detectives, and answer the tough questions detectives have for them concerning what they may or may not know about anything, who came and went [the night Lisa disappeared]," Young told ABCNews.com. "There's a whole list of things that they may know."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-police-tough-questions-parents/story?id=14810300


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 25, 2011, 11:03:01 PM
Missing Baby Lisa: Police 'Need' Separate Interviews with Parents
Oct. 25, 2011


<snipped>

Police are still intent on interviewing the parents, Deborah Bradley, 25, and Jeremy Irwin, 29.

"We need them to sit down apart from each other, with detectives, and answer the tough questions detectives have for them concerning what they may or may not know about anything, who came and went [the night Lisa disappeared]," Young told ABCNews.com. "There's a whole list of things that they may know."

<snipped>



http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-police-tough-questions-parents/story?id=14810300


There's a big key right there.  These two are stuck like glue to each other, joined at the hip.  That way, they can get the story straight.  I'd love to see each one interviewed separately and then I'll bet the discrepancies start flying.
 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 25, 2011, 11:42:20 PM
On local news, KMBC they reported that the boys will be re-questioned Friday and they will also be swabbed for DNA.  I don't see a story on KMBC.com yet to back that up.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: grace-land on October 26, 2011, 12:39:37 AM
Interviewing children and has information about the first interview with the small boys.

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/25/3229412/legal-dance-with-police-is-part.html

Posted on Tue, Oct. 25, 2011 10:59 PM
Legal dance with police is part of the system
By MARK MORRIS and CHRISTINE VENDEL
The Kansas City Star

 ::snipping2::

The parents also have refused to allow police to have specially trained social workers reinterview their older children from previous relationships, boys ages 6 and 8 who were at the home when Lisa disappeared.

As a general rule, police do not interview children who are witnesses. Instead, they refer them to a child protection center, where social workers talk to the children. Police are not allowed in the room.

In the Irwin case, social workers talked to one boy for 30 minutes and the other boy for 50 minutes the day Lisa vanished. Police have not been able to send the boys back to the center.

 ::snipping2::

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/25/3229412/legal-dance-with-police-is-part.html#ixzz1brK9r3Ui


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: islandmonkey on October 26, 2011, 01:48:24 AM
Missing Baby Lisa: Police 'Need' Separate Interviews with Parents
Oct. 25, 2011


<snipped>

Police are still intent on interviewing the parents, Deborah Bradley, 25, and Jeremy Irwin, 29.

"We need them to sit down apart from each other, with detectives, and answer the tough questions detectives have for them concerning what they may or may not know about anything, who came and went [the night Lisa disappeared]," Young told ABCNews.com. "There's a whole list of things that they may know."

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-irwin-police-tough-questions-parents/story?id=14810300


JMO~but the fact they refuse to be interviewed seperately is the BIGGEST red flag period (and in this case that is saying alot), isn't that investigation 101??? Surely they parents even DB drunk (if she was) would know this.....if you are innocent why not. Then again, why set conditions. I am sorry but nothing screams kidnapper to me and never has, the answers lie with the parents and the kids prolly know or overheard something too..this is why they refuse and also why they can't be ruled out. It's their fault, I am sorry if I offend anyone but I call it like I see it and they have guilt written all over them just from this one condition, it's SOP in every case I know about.  ::MonkeyMad:: ::MonkeyMad::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Fanta on October 26, 2011, 06:13:58 AM
I just can't find the answer. :(

Was the black garbage bag covered over the window and stuck there by duct tape something the parents did?  Or something the police/media did? 

That black plastic covered window in little baby Lisa's room is just too disturbing not to have an answer!

???

~fanta


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: tupelohoney on October 26, 2011, 07:08:41 AM
Yep thats the one !  thanks Klaas !
ok...I just read the entire thing and one thing that just stood out to me is the 911 call.....in this article Jeremy says when they noticed that the crib was empty and Lisa's bottle was on the floor they called 911 and everyone was running around crying and stuff...ok...but in the video of the 911 calls the first thing Jeremy says when he called 911 was that there had been a break in ......then after the dispatch called out that info, he then said that his 10 month old was also gone.................wth....reminds me of Misty Croslins 911 call........If my daughter was not in her crib when I walked in the room the first thing I would have done was call 911 and that would have been my first words...."my baby is gone"....not my house was broken into.......see...something just isnt right.............and also......did he call 911 on the house phone?......because all the cell phones were missing so how did he call 911 if they didnt have a house phone!
In the People Magazine article that Klaas posted, it states that the cell phones had no service due to non payment and Jeremy used a work phone to call 911.  If the phones were piled on the counter, and if there is an abductor, the phones may have been taken to delay a call for help.....maybe?   


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: alagary on October 26, 2011, 07:55:28 AM
Cell phones can call 911 regardless if activated or not.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 08:35:35 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/baby-lisa-parents-talk-14815791
Baby Lisa: Parents Won't Talk
Dan Abrams explains the conditions on which Lisa Irwin's parents will cooperate.
02:23 | 10/26/2011


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 08:37:05 AM
KCPD plans to re-interview the brothers of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin this week. "Good Morning America's" Dan Abrams talks about why this is important: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 7:22 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/26/230489fc-9e65-4be0-a6da-099f3ac3064b_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1btHIHo5o


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 08:38:35 AM
http://www.kmbc.com/video/29589387/detail.html
KCPD Plans To Re-Interview Missing Baby's Brothers
POSTED: 7:14 am CDT October 26, 2011
UPDATED: 7:17 am CDT October 26, 2011


Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/video/29589387/detail.html#ixzz1btHkDu4l


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 26, 2011, 09:46:13 AM
JVM HLN 5 minutes ago  video of DB's former friend, from Ft. Bragg. "She (DB) can turn that cry on. She is a con artist."
For some reason I really dont doubt what this woman is saying....IMO


Didn't see it, but I don't doubt her either,  as from the beginning, [ it's prolly just me ], but something is just fishy ...

 ::HelloKitty::
Lisa Irwin: Issues 10/25/11 Part 1
From: Sierra1947  | Oct 25, 2011 
http://www.youtube.com/user/Sierra1947#p/u/1/oESIytKYpu0

 ::MonkeyCool::   Thanks Trimm !!!


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 26, 2011, 09:51:47 AM
Most of us are all so worn down from the Caylee Anthony case and subsequent trial, that more than likely, many of us would rather
just not become so involved and interested in yet another apparent travesty of justice against one more helpless and trusting young little person.  But, there is something so intrinsically compelling about this precious little face of Baby Lisa that begs for help - begs for justice.   What a precious little person ... she needed loving protection twenty four hours a day.   No excuse for an inebriated caretaker/mother.    I don't even buy that scenario anyway ...  What on earth happened to this angel?

Ono, I fall into that category completely.

Didn't want to get involved in another missing child, but started coming here to read and did my own research on missing Lisa, without posting, trying to keep a distance. But for some reason, I am compelled to post.

I don't think any caregiver responsible for children has the right to, as her mother said, "Have my adult time" if that means getting drunk and unable to care for the children. Upsets me to think she did this several times a week, as she stated. Then denied she had a drinking problem. Even snickered as she said, "No" when asked.

Poor Baby Lisa.




 ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 26, 2011, 10:04:36 AM
On local news, KMBC they reported that the boys will be re-questioned Friday and they will also be swabbed for DNA.  I don't see a story on KMBC.com yet to back that up.

Interesting ...


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 10:05:16 AM
KCPD plans to re-interview the brothers of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin this week. "Good Morning America's" Dan Abrams talks about why this is important: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 7:22 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/26/230489fc-9e65-4be0-a6da-099f3ac3064b_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1btHIHo5o


Glade to hear, however if Deb told them to be quiet wonder if LE will get the truth....
Telling the boys, that night to stay in her bedroom rather then a sick baby is beyond me, not wanting to look outside(afraid what he might find, what's with that?) and the dog not barking.  I can't wrap my head around any of this.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Ono on October 26, 2011, 10:09:15 AM
KCPD plans to re-interview the brothers of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin this week. "Good Morning America's" Dan Abrams talks about why this is important: www.kmbc.com
by Karen Yancey/Staff 7:22 AM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/26/230489fc-9e65-4be0-a6da-099f3ac3064b_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1btHIHo5o


I'm so glad - maybe they can get some answers.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 26, 2011, 10:13:33 AM
It's a little late to question the boys, imo.  They've been under the influence of the adults in their lives hearing about how 'bad' LE has treated them and how LE is blaming their mom & dad.  These boys will have a fear of LE.  They aren't going to tell anything that could be seen as being disloyal to their parents.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 10:36:21 AM
It's a little late to question the boys, imo.  They've been under the influence of the adults in their lives hearing about how 'bad' LE has treated them and how LE is blaming their mom & dad.  These boys will have a fear of LE.  They aren't going to tell anything that could be seen as being disloyal to their parents.
I agree.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 10:39:24 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/
Half-brothers of missing Missouri girl to be interviewed
From Sara Weisfeldt, CNN
updated 10:11 AM EST, Wed October 26, 2011

 ::snipping2::
Lisa Irwin's brothers, who reportedly are ages 8 and 5, will be interviewed by a "child services specialist trained to interview kids," Kansas City police Capt. Steve Young said. The interview will be non-confrontational, he said, and a police officer won't even be in the room.

"Not an interrogation," he said. "They are kids, after all."


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 26, 2011, 10:43:35 AM
It's a little late to question the boys, imo.  They've been under the influence of the adults in their lives hearing about how 'bad' LE has treated them and how LE is blaming their mom & dad.  These boys will have a fear of LE.  They aren't going to tell anything that could be seen as being disloyal to their parents.

Maybe, but a well-trainied/experienced social worker can get info out of children which the children have been instructed not to ever tell.  This is especially true when they have to interview children who have been the victim or sexual, physial, or verbal assault.  Let's just hope the person doing the interviewing has the finesse needed to make the child comfortable enough to tell what really happened.

Speaking of social workers, is anyone surprised that the two boys have not been remove from the home based on the assumption that the parents might be involved?  TX CPS swooped in on the Dunn case and got her older brother to go live with a relative until the investigation hit a standstill.   ::CowboySmiley::



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 10:59:32 AM
http://www.kmbc.com/r/29589547/detail.html
KCPD Plans To Re-Interview Missing Baby's Brothers
Police Say They'd Like To Talk To Parents Again Separately
POSTED: 7:24 am CDT October 26, 2011
UPDATED: 7:46 am CDT October 26, 2011


Video at link.
 ::snipping2::
Attorney Cyndy Short told ABC News that police will talk to the boys on Friday, and that DNA samples will also be taken from them.

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/news/29589547/detail.html#ixzz1btr8rQqF




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: KittyMom on October 26, 2011, 11:11:12 AM
Has it ever been reported where in the house that LE found the clothing that Lisa was supposedly wearing that night?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Tamikosmom on October 26, 2011, 11:32:49 AM
Klaas ... thanks for posting the baby Lisa article and images from People Magazine.

The words in the People article have convinced me to move past my speculation that baby Lisa met her demise in the hours prior to Jeremy leaving the home at 5:20 PM for work.  It appears that the neighbor "Maria" can attest that Lisa was alive at 6:40 PM when Debbie put her to bed.

Janet

++++++

PEOPLE MAGAZINE

Gone Without a Trace


<snipped>

Bradley cooked a chicken dinner for herself, the boys, a neighbour and her neighbor’s 4 year old daughter.  Though initially told police that she checked on her daughter at 10:30 p.m., she says she put Lisa down about 6:40 p.m. – slightly early because the little girl had been fussy that day.  Then she and the neighbour sat and talked while the children watched a movie.

Bradley admits that she had several glasses of wine – enough that she felt drunk and may even have passed out.

<snipped>

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.680


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 12:00:26 PM
Bradley admits that she had several glasses of wine – enough that she felt drunk and may even have passed out.

<snipped>

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.680


I would think you know if you passed out, not may.  Jmo.
 ::witch2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Yoder1 on October 26, 2011, 12:02:13 PM
Klaas ... thanks for posting the baby Lisa article and images from People Magazine.

The words in the People article have convinced me to move past my speculation that baby Lisa met her demise in the hours prior to Jeremy leaving the home at 5:20 PM for work.  It appears that the neighbor "Maria" can attest that Lisa was alive at 6:40 PM when Debbie put her to bed.

Janet

++++++

PEOPLE MAGAZINE

Gone Without a Trace


<snipped>

Bradley cooked a chicken dinner for herself, the boys, a neighbour and her neighbor’s 4 year old daughter.  Though initially told police that she checked on her daughter at 10:30 p.m., she says she put Lisa down about 6:40 p.m. – slightly early because the little girl had been fussy that day.  Then she and the neighbour sat and talked while the children watched a movie.

Bradley admits that she had several glasses of wine – enough that she felt drunk and may even have passed out.

<snipped>

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12213.680




Chicken; how appropriate. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 12:02:48 PM
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/26/3230166/specialists-to-interview-lisa.html
Posted on Wed, Oct. 26, 2011 10:24 AM
Specialists to interview Lisa Irwin’s brothers on Friday

Two brothers of missing Northland infant Lisa Irwin will be re-interviewed later this week, Kansas City police confirmed this morning.

Kansas City police have said that the family has not allowed the boys to be interviewed since Oct.4, the day Lisa’s parents reported the then-10-month-old girl missing from the family home. The two boys reportedly were in the home the night she vanished.

Kansas City Police Capt. Steve Young said the interviews, scheduled for Friday, will not be conducted by police detectives. A specialist trained in child forensic interviewing will speak to the children in a non-confrontational setting.

Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/26/3230166/specialists-to-interview-lisa.html#ixzz1bu7AISrx
 




Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 12:11:16 PM
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/10/26/will-lisa-irwin%e2%80%99s-parents-agree-to-separate-interviews-with-police/
10:39 am ET October 26, 2011
Will Lisa Irwin’s Parents Agree to Separate Interviews With Police?
by America's Newsroom Posted in: Baby Lisa, Deborah Bradley, Jeremy Irwin, Lisa Irwin, Missing Baby, Missing Missouri Baby 


Video at link.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 12:17:25 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2053772/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Baby-Lisas-brothers-interviewed-police-DNA-tests.html
Baby Lisa's brothers who 'heard noises the night she disappeared' to be questioned by police
    Half brothers, aged six and eight, were reportedly in bed with mother Deborah Bradley when baby disappeared
    Will be questioned by officers on Friday and given DNA tests
By John Stevens
Last updated at 3:48 PM on 26th October 2011


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2053772/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Baby-Lisas-brothers-interviewed-police-DNA-tests.html#ixzz1buAbZgx3


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 26, 2011, 12:25:54 PM
Has it ever been reported where in the house that LE found the clothing that Lisa was supposedly wearing that night?

It seems like I have heard that they found the purple shorts during the search initiated by the warrant.  I thought I heard it on NG, but I have been through that last 10 days' transcripts and did not see it.

 ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 26, 2011, 01:14:15 PM
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/301930_10150384727643287_56641053286_8118515_1442819477_n.jpg)

From https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=10150351571969005&id=644809004&ref=notif&notif_t=wall#!/photo.php?fbid=10150384727643287&set=a.159500548286.116726.56641053286&type=1&theater


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: yuknomenot on October 26, 2011, 01:47:12 PM
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/301930_10150384727643287_56641053286_8118515_1442819477_n.jpg)

From https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=10150351571969005&id=644809004&ref=notif&notif_t=wall#!/photo.php?fbid=10150384727643287&set=a.159500548286.116726.56641053286&type=1&theater
I don't have facebook so I can't visit the link... does it say on there how old Lisa is in this photo?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 02:25:31 PM
From KMBC's Peggy Breit: Police tell us that Debbie Bradley's son and Jeremy Irwin's son will be doing a forensic interview at the police station on Friday. This will be the second forensic interview if the boys since the day 11-month old Lisa Irwin was reported missing from her crib. The first time, one boy was interviewed for almost an hour, the second boy, for nearly a half hour.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 1:19 PM

Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1buh8PLtl


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 02:32:58 PM
http://www.kansas.com/2011/10/25/2077915/legal-dance-with-police-in-lisa.html
Posted on Wed, Oct. 26, 2011
Legal dance with police in Lisa Irwin case is part of the system


Read more: http://www.kansas.com/2011/10/25/2077915/legal-dance-with-police-in-lisa.html#ixzz1buj1fqY6


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 26, 2011, 03:08:02 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 26, 2011, 03:48:54 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html
they are gonna keep right on refusing to talk to LE untill a Grand Jury puts one of their butts in jail....I say this in every missing childs board.......if you didnt do anything wrong then you should have no fear of being interviewed and if you tell the truth then they will only know the truth.....only one story when you do that....


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Kimmy53 on October 26, 2011, 03:59:15 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html
they are gonna keep right on refusing to talk to LE untill a Grand Jury puts one of their butts in jail....I say this in every missing childs board.......if you didnt do anything wrong then you should have no fear of being interviewed and if you tell the truth then they will only know the truth.....only one story when you do that....

 ::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 04:04:12 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20540037,00.html
Why Won't Baby Lisa's Parents Talk to Police?
By Jeff Truesdell
Wednesday October 26, 2011 03:15 PM EDT

(http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/111024/deborah-bradley-300.jpg)
Accused during police questioning in the disappearance of their missing daughter, the parents of 10-month-old Lisa Irwin want a new set of detectives to meet with them before they will agree to sit down for any further interrogation.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 26, 2011, 04:09:44 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20540037,00.html
Why Won't Baby Lisa's Parents Talk to Police?
By Jeff Truesdell
Wednesday October 26, 2011 03:15 PM EDT

(http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/111024/deborah-bradley-300.jpg)
Accused during police questioning in the disappearance of their missing daughter, the parents of 10-month-old Lisa Irwin want a new set of detectives to meet with them before they will agree to sit down for any further interrogation.
 ::snipping2::
guess they want new ones that wont know how much she has changed her story.......maybe now that she has it down pat she wants to talk to someone she hasnt talked to before so he wont know the lies thats been told already....blah......


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 26, 2011, 04:12:04 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20540037,00.html
Why Won't Baby Lisa's Parents Talk to Police?
By Jeff Truesdell
Wednesday October 26, 2011 03:15 PM EDT

(http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/111024/deborah-bradley-300.jpg)
Accused during police questioning in the disappearance of their missing daughter, the parents of 10-month-old Lisa Irwin want a new set of detectives to meet with them before they will agree to sit down for any further interrogation.
 ::snipping2::

A lot of body language can be observed in that picture.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 04:14:54 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/AmyKCTV5 (http://twitter.com/#!/AmyKCTV5)
AmyKCTV5 Amy Anderson
Baby Lisa's dad securing signs to tree. #LisaIrwin twitpic.com/765wy7 (#post_LisaIrwintwitpiccom765wy7)
1 hour ago
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/twitpic/photos/full/433616911.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJF3XCCKACR3QDMOA&Expires=1319660855&Signature=ocHkb7eR1n1%2FiMq5arRK0x61wzU%3D)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 26, 2011, 04:24:39 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20540037,00.html
Why Won't Baby Lisa's Parents Talk to Police?
By Jeff Truesdell
Wednesday October 26, 2011 03:15 PM EDT

(http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/111024/deborah-bradley-300.jpg)
Accused during police questioning in the disappearance of their missing daughter, the parents of 10-month-old Lisa Irwin want a new set of detectives to meet with them before they will agree to sit down for any further interrogation.
 ::snipping2::

Vinnie  Politan just said on Headline News that Deborah said the boys said they heard noises that night but she hasn't talked to them about it.  WTH?  Then what does she say when the boys say "Where's Lisa"?

I'm really getting fed up over the gills with their demands - won't let the boys be interviewed, won't talk to police separately, want a new set of detective before they'll talk to them, didn't look in the yard because she was afraid of what she might see.  The last time they talked to police was on October 8th.  That's crazy.

I wish Mark Klass could talk to them or the police would find something to charge them with because right now, they are really being treated with kid gloves.  They better enjoy it while it lasts because I believe sooner or later, they will be arrested.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 04:26:28 PM
From KMBC's Peggy Breit: This is a place that conducts forensic interviews of children in a child friendly neutral atmosphere. They conduct interviews for the police department in cases of sexual abuse, violence or even murder. While they won't talk about a specific case, they say they approach each interview in the same way. Make a child feel comfortable in a non-threatening environment. Police are in the next room listening and can prompt the interviewer to ask about certain things.
by Brian Foster - KMBC.com 3:08 PM
(http://images.scribblelive.com/2011/10/26/d48b2f85-9505-4eb2-bbd7-fdeecba933e7_400.jpg)
Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bvBJvabk


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: WesleyBear on October 26, 2011, 04:29:21 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: WesleyBear on October 26, 2011, 04:31:12 PM
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20540037,00.html
Why Won't Baby Lisa's Parents Talk to Police?
By Jeff Truesdell
Wednesday October 26, 2011 03:15 PM EDT

(http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/111024/deborah-bradley-300.jpg)
Accused during police questioning in the disappearance of their missing daughter, the parents of 10-month-old Lisa Irwin want a new set of detectives to meet with them before they will agree to sit down for any further interrogation.
 ::snipping2::

A lot of body language can be observed in that picture.

I agree, he isn't even touching her and she is leaning on him for support. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 04:33:42 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 04:35:11 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?

On HLM Vinnies show they said to rule the boys out for whatever the dog hit on.
Which is a good thing...
 ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 26, 2011, 04:36:31 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::

Can they really refuse to talk to police?  If so, there is something really wrong with the system (like we didn't know that already).


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: WesleyBear on October 26, 2011, 04:37:02 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?

On HLM Vinnies show they said to rule the boys out for whatever the dog hit on.
Which is a good thing...
 ::CowboySmiley::
But why would the dogs hit on them...?  They are obviously alive. 


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 04:38:53 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::
::rhino::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: higherhopes on October 26, 2011, 04:40:04 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?

On HLM Vinnies show they said to rule the boys out for whatever the dog hit on.
Which is a good thing...
 ::CowboySmiley::
But why would the dogs hit on them...?  They are obviously alive. 
they could also have found blood specks or something of that nature and they want to be sure who it came from.imo


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: flutter1 on October 26, 2011, 04:40:24 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?

On HLM Vinnies show they said to rule the boys out for whatever the dog hit on.
Which is a good thing...
 ::CowboySmiley::

That makes no sense.  The boys' aren't in a state of decomposition.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 04:42:15 PM
TaZzcutie Tina Hellums
#LisaIrwin seriously 12 signs in the yard and dad adds another. Try putting them where they can be seen. Not infront of the house for media
9 minutes ago http://twitter.com/#!/search/%23lisairwin (http://twitter.com/#!/search/%23lisairwin)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 04:47:53 PM
Why do you guys think they want to take DNA samples from the 2 boys?

On HLM Vinnies show they said to rule the boys out for whatever the dog hit on.
Which is a good thing...
 ::CowboySmiley::

That makes no sense.  The boys' aren't in a state of decomposition.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

True......doesn't make sense.
Just got up from a nap and heard, wasn't thinking straight. ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: pharlap on October 26, 2011, 04:48:55 PM
Maybe someone will put up that show on youtube...
 ::MonkeyBike::


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: fatcatlurker on October 26, 2011, 05:01:29 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html
snipped;

But the attorney representing Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley, parents of 11-month-old Lisa Irwin, said the couple is not opposed to separate interviews, but do not want what police requested -- an unrestricted interview with no attorneys present.

"Being questioned separately is not the issue," said attorney Cyndy Short. She said the couple has been cooperative and has previously been interviewed separately as well as together. They don't mind being interviewed separately as long as the detectives are fair, open-minded and non-accusatory, she said.



Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 05:30:58 PM
http://video.foxnews.com/v/1241831280001/cops-missing-babys-brothers-to-be-interviewed-again/?playlist_id=87485
Cops: Missing Baby's Brothers to Be Interviewed Again
Oct 26, 2011 - 7:07 -
Former LAPD homicide detective Mark Fuhrman reacts


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Pattianne on October 26, 2011, 05:36:03 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::

Can they really refuse to talk to police?  If so, there is something really wrong with the system (like we didn't know that already).

They have to be charged with something before police can force them to be interviewed.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 05:37:58 PM
ryankath Ryan Kath
RT @Sam_Hartle: Local attorney representing #LisaIrwin's parents just sent out press release saying they will send out daily press releases
41 seconds ago http://twitter.com/#!/search/%23lisairwin (http://twitter.com/#!/search/%23lisairwin)


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: labubske on October 26, 2011, 05:40:07 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::

Can they really refuse to talk to police?  If so, there is something really wrong with the system (like we didn't know that already).

They have to be charged with something before police can force them to be interviewed.

Thanks Pattianne...that makes sense.  Although, I would like to think that I would give whatever interviews that are needed if my child were missing.  Even if I was the accused.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 26, 2011, 05:44:34 PM
Police: Parents of missing Missouri girl refuse separate interviews

Read more -

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html

Oh, come on wth are they hiding.........
This indeed is turning into another @$#%% case.  ::MonkeyMad::
Can't bring myself to say the name. ::MonkeyDevil::

Can they really refuse to talk to police?  If so, there is something really wrong with the system (like we didn't know that already).

They have to be charged with something before police can force them to be interviewed.

Sorry, under no circumstances can LE force you to be interviewed.  It is one of the most cherished of Constitutional rights.  Remember the Miranda warning?  "You have the right to remain silent, you have a right to have an attorney with you, if you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed, etc."   In fact, they can't even take you into custody unless they are arresting you and they must tell you what they are arresting you for.  If you agree to be interviewed, you can say at any time that you want your attorney and they must immediately stop.  Surely no one thinks this is a flaw in our justice system.

I thank God that I live in a country where being forced to give evidence against myself is illegal.  In the old days they used to beat you with a rubber hose to make you talk.  Not any more.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: trimmonthelake on October 26, 2011, 05:49:44 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29589547/detail.html
KCPD Plans To Re-Interview Missing Baby's Brothers
Police Say They'd Like To Talk To Parents Again Separately
POSTED: 7:24 am CDT October 26, 2011
UPDATED: 4:19 pm CDT October 26, 2011

 ::snipping2::
KMBC's Peggy Breit reported that the first time police talked to the children, one boy was interviewed for almost an hour, the second boy was interview for nearly a half-hour.

Breit said the boys would likely be taken to a facility similar to the Child Protection Center.

"We conduct forensic interviews on children ages 3 to 17 in cases of alleged sexual abuse, physical abuse and children who may have witnessed a homicide or a serious act of violence," said Julie Donelon of the Child Protection Center.

The interview would be conducted in a room with specially trained interviewers whose backgrounds are in child development, social work and psychology.

"We gather information about what's going on in the home, in the family, what they may have seen, to gather as many details as we can so that law enforcement can then use that information to follow up on any leads that might come from that," Donelon said. "The most important thing is that it's a neutral information gathering, fact-finding interview in a neutral, child-friendly setting that's done by specially trained interviewers who know how to avoid suggesting and leading questions."

Read more: http://www.kmbc.com/news/29589547/detail.html#ixzz1bvWZ8ly4


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 26, 2011, 05:50:30 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/26/justice/missouri-missing-girl/index.html
snipped;

But the attorney representing Jeremy Irwin and Deborah Bradley, parents of 11-month-old Lisa Irwin, said the couple is not opposed to separate interviews, but do not want what police requested -- an unrestricted interview with no attorneys present.

"Being questioned separately is not the issue," said attorney Cyndy Short. She said the couple has been cooperative and has previously been interviewed separately as well as together. They don't mind being interviewed separately as long as the detectives are fair, open-minded and non-accusatory, she said.



Is there something wrong with detectives being fair, open-minded and non-accusatory?  Not in my opinion.


Title: Re: Lisa Irwin #4 10/21/11 -
Post by: Babybear on October 26, 2011, 05:55:04 PM
http://www.kmbc.com/news/29589547/detail.html
KCPD Plans To Re-Interview Missing Baby's Brothers
Police Say They'd Like To Talk To Parents Again Separately
POSTED: 7:24 am CDT October 26, 2011
UPDATED: 4:19 pm CDT October 26, 2011

 ::snipping2::
KMBC's Peggy Breit reported that the first time police talked to the children, one boy was interviewed for almost an hour, the second boy was interview for nearly a half-hour.

Breit said the boys would likely be taken to a facility similar to the Child Protection Center.

"We conduct forensic interviews on children ages 3 to 17 in cases of alleged sexual abuse, physical abuse and children who may have witnessed a homicide or a serious act of violence," said Julie Donelon of the Child Protection Center.

The interview would be conducted in a room with specially trained interviewers whose backgrounds are in child development, social work and psychology.

"We gather information about what's going on in the home, in th