Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Natalee Holloway => LCD Archive => Topic started by: MuffyBee on February 07, 2012, 10:40:16 AM



Title: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865 5/02/12 - 7/23/12
Post by: MuffyBee on February 07, 2012, 10:40:16 AM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/Case/NatbirdStephany2.gif)

JUSTICE FOR NATALEE AND STEPHANY!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 03, 2012, 12:18:26 AM
Justice Train to Birmingham - a work in progress......


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain24.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 03, 2012, 09:17:28 AM
 ::MonkeyDance::  Clean cage!!  Thanks Klaas ::MonkeyCool::

I'm just lovin' the Justice Train & Biplane ::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 03, 2012, 09:22:34 AM
Having the chollars in Aruba wear the wifi t-shirts should make the entire island a "hot spot"  ::MonkeyDevil::

awemainta.com

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/hotspotaruba.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Mere on May 03, 2012, 11:00:47 PM
Thanks Klaas....love the train and you have given me my identity back...!  I lost it two computers ago....Good
night all....Mere


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 03, 2012, 11:04:05 PM
Added Elaine and Hummingbird  ::MonkeyCool::  Had to dig up Hummingbirds old avatar and re-dress her, LOLOL  ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain25.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 03, 2012, 11:05:11 PM
Thanks Klaas....love the train and you have given me my identity back...!  I lost it two computers ago....Good
night all....Mere

I can dig up most of the old avatars, especially the original.  The only ones I don't have might be ones that CBB or Brandi did.  The original ones I have saved on my external drive  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 04, 2012, 02:20:56 AM
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY & STEPHANY FLORES

GOODNIGHT & GOD BLESS

KEEPTHEFAITH


 ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 04, 2012, 07:25:41 AM
Thanks Klaas....love the train and you have given me my identity back...!  I lost it two computers ago....Good
night all....Mere

You look mah-velous Mere!   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: SunnyinTX on May 04, 2012, 01:34:37 PM
Please add me to the Justice Train...it's been a long time coming!!  thanks


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 04, 2012, 02:37:25 PM
 ::MonkeyCool::   It's terrific, Klaas!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 04, 2012, 04:51:14 PM
http://aruba-daily.com/newspaper/?p=17290

Aruba Aloe beach tennis event ‘rocked’ Eagle beach!!
Posted by Aruba Daily on May 4th, 2012

The players battled in the deep sand and hot sun starting at 10 am in the morning with pool play and ending the day with finals around sunset!
 
Jossy Mansur finally got the ‘monkey of his back’ by winning the advanced men with JP Simon!

In Pro men Sergio Jie Sam Foek continued his domination winning all rankings sofar!
 
Emily Katz and David Sickmen from New York won the singles titles leaving the Aruban players in the dust.
 
Winners got gift certificates from Aruba Aloe to spent in one of their shops in Aruba Aloe products.
 
Senor Frogs served the food and kept the energy high with their entertainment, DJ, tents/shade, shower on the beach, icy cold Amstel Brights and spectacular beach tennis made this this the ultimate day to chill at the beach with family and friends!
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 04:56:18 PM
Please add me to the Justice Train...it's been a long time coming!!  thanks

OMG Sunny, how could I have miss you!  I was going thru the last couple years of posts and was trying to get everyone but somehow missed you.  You are on it now at the top on the bi-plane.  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain26.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 04, 2012, 04:56:32 PM
http://arubaherald.com/911/2380-four-detained-for-human-smuggling.html

Four detained for human smuggling
Friday, 04 May 2012 10:14

Four people were detained Wednesday night, when authorities acted on the suspicious behavior of the crew of the boat Didi, which left for Venezuela in the afternoon and returned the same night at 10:30 p.m.

The boat had three local men on board and upon their return when they went to declare their reentry, authorities decided to open the cabin, where they found a Venezuelan woman in hiding.
 
Authorities immediately detained the three men and the woman for interrogation. They were detained for intentionally committing human smuggling.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 05:21:27 PM
That's the thing, when people talk about Aruba/Venezuela and smuggling it's usually women being smuggled OUT of Venezuela INTO Aruba to work as prostitutes.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 06:59:01 PM
 ::MonkeyCool::
(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 04, 2012, 07:26:30 PM
::MonkeyCool::
(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27.jpg)


The Pervian extradition process for Joran van der Sloot begins  on May 8th.  How long will the entire process take?  When will the Justice Train be arriving at the Alabama station ... arriving packed with Monkey passengers?

Janet

++++++


Extradition hearing set for Joran van der Sloot in Peru
Published: Thursday, April 26, 2012, 1:02 AM
Updated: Thursday, April 26, 2012, 1:08 AM


LIMA, Peru — A Peruvian judge has set a May 8 hearing to consider a U.S. request to extradite convicted killer Joran van der Sloot so he can be tried for extortion in connection with the unsolved 2005 disappearance of Alabama teenager Natalie Holloway.

Lima's Superior Court said in a communique Wednesday that after the hearing the case will go to Peru's Supreme Court, then to the council of ministers.

The council will ultimately decide whether to extradite the Dutchman, who was sentenced in January to 28 years in prison for killing a Lima business student.

U.S. prosecutors say Van der Sloot extorted $25,000 from Holloway's family, promising then failing to lead it to her body.

<snipped>

http://blog.al.com/wire/2012/04/extradition_hearing_set_for_jo.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 08:09:17 PM
Not sure Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 10:17:15 PM
In case we need more room I added some bleachers  ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27a.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 04, 2012, 10:58:53 PM
That's the thing, when people talk about Aruba/Venezuela and smuggling it's usually women being smuggled OUT of Venezuela INTO Aruba to work as prostitutes.

That's correct Klaas.  From what I have read, human/sex trafficking is TO Aruba.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 04, 2012, 11:00:15 PM
 ::MonkeyDance:: Love it!  I can't wait to see his face when he gets hit by the Justice Train in that AL courtroom.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 04, 2012, 11:10:50 PM
Not sure Janet

Klaas and Janet, Altez thinks that the extradition process will take about three months.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/04/23/us/peru-van-der-sloot/index.html

Quote

According to court documents obtained through Altez, a Peruvian judge has approved a U.S. request for provisional detention. This is the first step in the extradition process between Peru and the United States. The document says a formal extradition request has yet to be submitted, but will follow.

Quote

The only hold-up to the extradition is van der Sloot's appeal, which should be finished in about a month, Altez said.

"I think he will be extradited within the next three months," said Altez. "He will go to trial in the United States. Once he is sentenced, he will return to Peru to finish serving his 28 years, and then go back to the States to serve whatever sentence he gets there."



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 04, 2012, 11:16:34 PM
Thanks Grace Land!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 04, 2012, 11:21:52 PM
That's the thing, when people talk about Aruba/Venezuela and smuggling it's usually women being smuggled OUT of Venezuela INTO Aruba to work as prostitutes.

That's correct Klaas.  From what I have read, human/sex trafficking is TO Aruba.

On an island that size if they truly wanted to put an end to it, they could. Well, if they weren't all corrupt they could.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 05, 2012, 12:03:13 AM
You're welcome, klaas!  ::MonkeyCool::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 05, 2012, 10:28:39 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba?start=20

Google translation:

In short

THURSDAY, MAY 3, 2012 9:50

Attempted robbery tourists Two elderly American tourists have bravely defended himself Wednesday against a mugger. Who was driving a small gray car at the bus stop for Alhambra. He got threatened with a piece of wood in his hand and demanded the purses. It was one of the tourists and broke a shoulder. A taxi driver saw the incident and came to the rescue. The robber ran off in the car.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 05, 2012, 10:37:11 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba?start=20

Google translation:

In short

THURSDAY, MAY 3, 2012 9:50

Attempted robbery tourists Two elderly American tourists have bravely defended himself Wednesday against a mugger. Who was driving a small gray car at the bus stop for Alhambra. He got threatened with a piece of wood in his hand and demanded the purses. It was one of the tourists and broke a shoulder. A taxi driver saw the incident and came to the rescue. The robber ran off in the car.
 ::snipping2::

You mean a small gray car like this?    ::MonkeyDevil::

(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa118/Observer00000007/KalpoeHondaCivic.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 05, 2012, 11:16:17 AM
 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 05, 2012, 12:53:03 PM
In case we need more room I added some bleachers  ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27a.jpg)


 ::MonkeyJnBox::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 05, 2012, 02:11:36 PM
Not sure Janet

Klaas and Janet, Altez thinks that the extradition process will take about three months.

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/04/23/us/peru-van-der-sloot/index.html

Quote

According to court documents obtained through Altez, a Peruvian judge has approved a U.S. request for provisional detention. This is the first step in the extradition process between Peru and the United States. The document says a formal extradition request has yet to be submitted, but will follow.

Quote

The only hold-up to the extradition is van der Sloot's appeal, which should be finished in about a month, Altez said.

"I think he will be extradited within the next three months," said Altez. "He will go to trial in the United States. Once he is sentenced, he will return to Peru to finish serving his 28 years, and then go back to the States to serve whatever sentence he gets there."



Thanks Grace.

An ongoing waiting game.  Something akin the the defamation trial.  I will be pushing up daisies by the time that event happens.

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Bearlyhere on May 05, 2012, 02:31:31 PM


Klaas, love your artwork.  You have done a great job on your design.  I can see the heart you have added to making it.  Can't wait to get mine.

I am so glad to see Peaches on the train along with 2NJ.  I know Natalee and Beth have friends in heaven.  Great job!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyHeart::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 05, 2012, 03:36:00 PM
Video at link

http://www.24horas.com.pe/elpanamericano/locales/105834-nueva-estrategia-legal-der-sloot-eeuu-extradite

Google translation

The new legal strategy of Van der Sloot for the U.S. to extradite him
Saturday May 5, 2012, 09:03 AM

On Tuesday May 8 at Piedras BBW, the Peruvian courts shall collect the information to decide whether a confessed murderer of Stephany Flores and suspect in the murder of Natalee Holloway should be extradited and tried in U.S. courts.
 
Meanwhile, the Pan spoke with Joran Vander Sloot's lawyer who said his legal strategy seek to maximize the benefits for your client. "Sooner or later the extradition proceed," he said.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 05, 2012, 07:22:30 PM
Added a few that haven't been around for a while.  Hope they don't mind.  

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27d.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Bearlyhere on May 07, 2012, 12:00:45 AM
Added a few that haven't been around for a while.  Hope they don't mind.  

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27d.jpg)

Glad to see Peaches and 2NJ.  I see Hat, haven't seen him in a while.  Time for all the old timers to stop in and say Hi!  Good to see so many new people.  Nice bunch of Monkeys!

 ::rhino::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Puzzler on May 07, 2012, 12:08:53 AM
I "love" the Justice Train and especially what it stands for!

I hope my avatar can make its place with the Justice Train.

I know I haven't posted much on this forum in quite a while, but I do keep up with what's going on and so appreciate all the good posts that are being made.

I want so much for Beth to see justice done in some manner wrt Natalee.

All of us would be so happy to see Joran have to meet justice in Alabama!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: San on May 07, 2012, 01:12:49 AM
Puzzler, you are on the bus right above Stephany.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 07, 2012, 01:13:29 AM
I "love" the Justice Train and especially what it stands for!

I hope my avatar can make its place with the Justice Train.

I know I haven't posted much on this forum in quite a while, but I do keep up with what's going on and so appreciate all the good posts that are being made.

I want so much for Beth to see justice done in some manner wrt Natalee.

All of us would be so happy to see Joran have to meet justice in Alabama!

You are already on it Puzzler!  Right in front above Peaches!

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27d.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Puzzler on May 07, 2012, 02:26:44 AM

I see it now - thank you!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: alagary on May 07, 2012, 02:31:59 PM
The way the US court system is Sloot might be a year away from trial after he gets here. A long hard year.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 07, 2012, 07:19:45 PM
The way the US court system is Sloot might be a year away from trial after he gets here. A long hard year.
And I hope he is skeeered while he sits waiting.

Wonder if we have rats in the Bama Slammer?



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 08, 2012, 12:48:46 AM
The way the US court system is Sloot might be a year away from trial after he gets here. A long hard year.

A....LOOONNNGGG...HARD...YEAR!! Literally, or figuratively alagary? OMG..Now that is funny.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 01:57:31 AM
http://www.bndestem.nl/nieuws/algemeen/buitenland/10997688/Hoorzitting-over-uitlevering-Van-der-Sloot.ece

Google translation

Hearing on extradition Van der Sloot
Tuesday, May 8, 2012 | 6:00

BACKGROUND - Many Peruvians still find that 28 years in prison is far too low for Joran van der Sloot, who in January was sentenced for the murder of Stephany Flores.
 
They would sometimes be at their beck and call, because the case Van der Sloot seems again to get a sequel. Today, in Piedras Gordas prison in Lima the hearing on the possible extradition of the 24-year-old Dutchman to the United States.
 ::snipping2::
Extradition to U.S.
The U.S. authorities have never made a secret of Van der Sloot that they want to try on our own soil. According to lawyer Jose Luis Jimenez, who stood by the Dutch during his trial, chances are it comes to extradition. "There is an initial agreement, although there are still a few elements of the application to be negotiated," says Jimenez, "but I consider it likely that the extradition is coming."

Complicated process
In the meantime, will there be a complicated process. Van der Sloot is appealing against his imprisonment, and this procedure must first be settled. The Peruvian Supreme Court probably affords more definite about this month. Only then can the American request to consider, first by the Supreme Court and a number of committees, and the final decision lies with the Peruvian Cabinet.
 
If the born Arnhem extradited, he will travel to the U.S. temporarily for trial in Alabama, which may take several months. Then he must first return to Peru to serve his sentence to sit for him in the U.S. ends up behind bars again. If he is in the extortion trial is convicted, he can get up to 25 years.

Holloway
In the most extreme case, Van der Sloot so only very old at liberty to come. Even then, his problems have not yet be over. The investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway may still, Van der Sloot is also in that case is still the prime suspect.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 11:12:24 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/05/08/van-der-sloot-could-face-us-jail-time-on-fraud-and-extortion-charges/

Several hurdles left to clear before US case begins against convicted murderer Joran van der Sloot
Published May 08, 2012
 
Joran van der Sloot may eventually face trial in the US on fraud and extortion charges, but there are still a number of hurdles to clear before the 24-year-old Dutchman serves any time in a US jail.
 
Van der Sloot was the last person to be seen with Alabama native Natalee Holloway on the island of Aruba in 2005. Holloway was on a class trip celebrating her high school graduation. Van der Sloot was arrested, but never charged with her murder. No body has been recovered and Holloway’s father went to court to have her declared legally dead last year.
 
Five years to the day after the disappearance of Holloway, van der Sloot was captured by security cameras in Lima, Peru, entering a hotel room with a 21-year-old Peruvian student, Stephany Flores. Flores was later found murdered in the hotel room. Van der Sloot was convicted and sentenced to 28 years in a maximum-security prison in the Andes.
 
In 2010, van der Sloot was indicted by an Alabama court for wire fraud and extortion. He had offered information to the Holloway family regarding the location of Natalee’s body in exchange for money. He received $25,000, but offered no information.
  ::snipping2::
 
He is currently appealing his murder conviction in Peru. Only after the appeal is decided will possible extradition to the US be considered. In Peru the request would go first to the Supreme Court, then to the Council of Ministers for a final decision.
 
If extradition for the wire fraud charges were approved, van der Sloot could face trial in Alabama. Peruvian officials say he would then be returned to Peru to continue serving out his murder sentence. He could serve time in a US jail, according to Peru’s Justice Minister, only after he completed serving his sentence in Peru.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/05/08/van-der-sloot-could-face-us-jail-time-on-fraud-and-extortion-charges/#ixzz1uI5IJky3


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: crazybabyborg on May 08, 2012, 12:13:40 PM
Added a few that haven't been around for a while.  Hope they don't mind.  

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27d.jpg)

Oh, Klaas!! I swear.......... that almost makes me cry!! It touches my heart that Peaches and 2nj are right there where they belong! I LOVE LOVE LOVE it!!! Thank you for your hard work. It is just AWESOME!!!  

Joran's back in court today!!  That train is rolling on down the tracks!!  ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: crazybabyborg on May 08, 2012, 12:27:57 PM
 ::snipping2::

May 8, 2012
Van der Sloot due back in court

Birmingham, Ala (WIAT)  Joran van der Sloot is reported by Peruvian media to be scheduled to be in a Lima, Peru courtroom today for a procedural hearing on efforts by the United States Justice Department to have him extradited to Birmingham to stand trial for wire fraud and extortion.

 ::snipping2::
 
http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Van-der-Sloot-due-back-in-court/oXug8QL030WRxn3dvNmpTA.cspx?rss=1659


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 02:15:25 PM
As I understand it, the lawyer for Joran will oppose the extradition.  The judge will continue the extradition process as required under Peruvian law.

http://feeds.univision.com/feeds/article/2012-05-08/peru-van-der-sloot-no

Google translation

Peru: Van der Sloot is not to be extradited to U.S.
The Associated Press | Date: 05/08/2012

LIMA (AP) - The lawyer defending Dutch Joran Van der Sloot, who was convicted in Peru to 28 years in prison for the murder of a young Peruvian, said Tuesday he will oppose the extradition of extortion and wire fraud requested by the United States.

"Extradition strongly affects Van der Sloot. Here in Peru if you meet one third of his sentence he may have probation, but if convicted in the U.S., everything changes," said his lawyer Max Altez told The Associated Press.

He explained that if extradited to the Netherlands and is sentenced in the U.S., Peru will end its 28-year sentence and then had to return to America to fulfill his second conviction.

"We agree that Van der Sloot go to America because they hate above all is why there are jurors biased. We will defend ourselves with all possible legal remedies," said the lawyer.
 ::snipping2::

In prison BBW Stone Lima, where he is serving sentence, Van der Sloot met with his lawyer with Judge Zenaida Vilca, who explained the reasons why the United States requested his extradition. The meeting was also attended by representatives of the embassies of the Netherlands and the United States in Lima.

The Dutch entered the court date dressed in jeans, gray shirt and handcuffs. He smiled at the officers who watched but did not respond to calls from reporters watched 25 meters away.

Under Peruvian law, the judge will submit a case to the Supreme Court to review the case and issue a resolution calling for the extradition to the Ministry of Justice and Human Rights, which in turn will submit its report to the Council of Ministers, which will eventually be which decide whether the extradition of Dutch.
 ::snipping2::

According to his lawyer "their stay in Peru can not be compared with the United States. There does not matter if you have little or much money, everyone is equal, here everyone knows that if you make a permanent solvency softer."


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 05:03:19 PM
http://peru.com/2012/05/08/actualidad/mi-ciudad/joran-van-der-sloot-se-niega-extraditado-eeuu-caso-natalee-holloway-noticia-62878

Google translation

Joran Van der Sloot refuses to be extradited to U.S. for Natalee Holloway case
Tuesday May 8, 2012 - 02:32

 ::snipping2::
Lima. The Dutch citizen Joran Van der Sloot refused to acquiesce to the request of the justice of the United States to be extradited to that country, where it is processed for alleged extortion of the mother of the girl Natalee Holloway, who disappeared six years ago and whose murder is possible attributes.

Van der Sloot announced its decision to the holder of 22 Free Prisoners Criminal Court of Lima, Zenaida Vilca Malpica, in whose office is handled this request for extradition.

The judge went to the prison of Piedras BBW I Ancon, where Van der Sloot is serving his sentence of 28 years in prison for the death of the Peruvian Stephany Flores to inquire whether paved or not the extradition order made ​​against him U.S. justice.

Van der Sloot took this decision considering that in the United States did not states the conditions to face a fair trial in this case, said his lawyer Max.

In response, the judge entered Vilca Malpica Dutch decision on the record that makes his office on the case, for transmittal to the Supreme Court, which will review the proceedings and issue a resolution that will send the request extradition to the executive branch, according to RPP.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Blonde on May 08, 2012, 05:10:27 PM
Can he refuses to be extradited to U.S.  ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 08, 2012, 05:17:21 PM
Can he refuses to be extradited to U.S.  ::MonkeyEek::


I don't think so Blonde.  He can say whatever he wants but the law is the law and he's no longer above the law.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 08, 2012, 05:20:44 PM
Can he refuses to be extradited to U.S.  ::MonkeyEek::


I don't think so Blonde.  He can say whatever he wants but the law is the law and he's no longer above the law.

 ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 08, 2012, 05:28:57 PM
Joran van der Sloot, suspect in Natalee Holloway case, to fight extradition from Peru

LIMA, Peru — The lawyer for Joran van der Sloot says his client will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he is charged with extortion and wire fraud

 ::snipping2::

Attorney Maximo Altez said after a Peruvian judge informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request that his client prefers to stay put in Peru, where he could be freed after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino.

Altez says that if his client were convicted in the U.S. he wouldn’t likely qualify for early parole in Peru.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/joran-van-der-sloot-suspect-in-natalee-holloway-case-to-fight-extradition-from-peru/2012/05/08/gIQAQUYFBU_story.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 08, 2012, 05:33:01 PM
Van der Sloot refuses to be extradited to U.S. by Holloway case

 (AP). The Dutch defense attorney Joran Van der Sloot, who was convicted in Peru to 28 years in prison for the murder of the young Stephany Flores, said Tuesday it will oppose the extradition of extortion and wire fraud requested by the United States.

 "Extradition strongly affects Van der Sloot. Here in Peru, if it meets one third of his sentence, he may have probation, but if convicted in the U.S., everything changes, "said his lawyer Max Highness the AP.

 He explained that if extradited to the Netherlands and is sentenced in the U.S., Peru will end its 28-year sentence and then had to return to America to fulfill his second conviction.

 "We agree that Van der Sloot go to America because they hate above all is why there are jurors biased. We will defend ourselves with all possible legal remedies, "said the lawyer.

 Altez said an Alabama state court judge asked the Dutch for extortion and wire fraud.

 ::snipping2::

In the prison of Piedras BBW, where he is serving sentence, Van der Sloot met with his lawyer with Judge Zenaida Vilca, who explained the reasons why the United States requested his extradition. The meeting was also attended by representatives of the embassies of the Netherlands and the United States in Lima

http://elcomercio.pe/lima/1411979/noticia-van-der-sloot-rechaza-extraditado-eeuu-caso-holloway


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 08, 2012, 05:33:09 PM
Joran van der Sloot, suspect in Natalee Holloway case, to fight extradition from Peru

LIMA, Peru — The lawyer for Joran van der Sloot says his client will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he is charged with extortion and wire fraud

 ::snipping2::

Attorney Maximo Altez said after a Peruvian judge informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request that his client prefers to stay put in Peru, where he could be freed after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino.

Altez says that if his client were convicted in the U.S. he wouldn’t likely qualify for early parole in Peru.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/joran-van-der-sloot-suspect-in-natalee-holloway-case-to-fight-extradition-from-peru/2012/05/08/gIQAQUYFBU_story.html

Boo hoo.....  you mean Joran would have to serve the entire 28 year sentence then whatever time in the US?  LOVE IT!  ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 08, 2012, 05:42:49 PM
Joran van der Sloot, suspect in Natalee Holloway case, to fight extradition from Peru

LIMA, Peru — The lawyer for Joran van der Sloot says his client will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he is charged with extortion and wire fraud

 ::snipping2::

Attorney Maximo Altez said after a Peruvian judge informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request that his client prefers to stay put in Peru, where he could be freed after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino.

Altez says that if his client were convicted in the U.S. he wouldn’t likely qualify for early parole in Peru.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/joran-van-der-sloot-suspect-in-natalee-holloway-case-to-fight-extradition-from-peru/2012/05/08/gIQAQUYFBU_story.html

Boo hoo.....  you mean Joran would have to serve the entire 28 year sentence then whatever time in the US?  LOVE IT!  ::justice2NJ::

That is how I read it.  Wonder who is paying his lawyer Max this time to fight this?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 08, 2012, 05:53:31 PM
Joran van der Sloot, suspect in Natalee Holloway case, to fight extradition from Peru

LIMA, Peru — The lawyer for Joran van der Sloot says his client will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he is charged with extortion and wire fraud

 ::snipping2::

Attorney Maximo Altez said after a Peruvian judge informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request that his client prefers to stay put in Peru, where he could be freed after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino.

Altez says that if his client were convicted in the U.S. he wouldn’t likely qualify for early parole in Peru.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/joran-van-der-sloot-suspect-in-natalee-holloway-case-to-fight-extradition-from-peru/2012/05/08/gIQAQUYFBU_story.html

Boo hoo.....  you mean Joran would have to serve the entire 28 year sentence then whatever time in the US?  LOVE IT!  ::justice2NJ::

That is how I read it.  Wonder who is paying his lawyer Max this time to fight this?

Medleyrelay?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MedleyHappyBook3.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 08, 2012, 05:55:18 PM
Joran van der Sloot, suspect in Natalee Holloway case, to fight extradition from Peru

LIMA, Peru — The lawyer for Joran van der Sloot says his client will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he is charged with extortion and wire fraud

 ::snipping2::

Attorney Maximo Altez said after a Peruvian judge informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request that his client prefers to stay put in Peru, where he could be freed after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino.

Altez says that if his client were convicted in the U.S. he wouldn’t likely qualify for early parole in Peru.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/joran-van-der-sloot-suspect-in-natalee-holloway-case-to-fight-extradition-from-peru/2012/05/08/gIQAQUYFBU_story.html

Boo hoo.....  you mean Joran would have to serve the entire 28 year sentence then whatever time in the US?  LOVE IT!  ::justice2NJ::

That is how I read it.  Wonder who is paying his lawyer Max this time to fight this?

Medleyrelay?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 08, 2012, 05:58:45 PM
From all the money she made from her online book noevidenceofacrime also known as medleyisafool  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 07:30:00 PM
You're too kind, klaas.  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 08, 2012, 07:39:49 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/

May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable

ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:
 
The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.
 
“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.
 
Altez spoke to ABC News after van der Sloot appeared in a jailhouse courtroom at Piedras Gordas prison, about two hours north of Lima.
 
Peruvian Judge Zenaida Vilca heard arguments by U.S. Justice Department officials pushing for the extradition while  Altez opposed the move on grounds his client could not receive a fair trial in a U.S. court.
 ::snipping2::
Van der Sloot, appearing nervous and thinner than in previous appearances, was marched by prison officials to the courtroom, handcuffed and refusing to answer questions posed by nearby reporters.
 
The maximum-security jail is in a sparsely populated area of rolling desert-like hills. On one of the mountains overlooking the facility is the slogan Cristo Vive (Christ Lives) in huge white block letters and below are the tents of some very poor squatters.
 
Altz spoke with ABC News after the court appearance and said van der Sloot was “very upset with the prospect of being extradited to the U.S. I haven’t seen Joran so down, so depressed since I took on his defense almost two years ago.”
 ::snipping2::
Although the judge and other Peruvian legal authorities claim van der Sloot will have to return to Peru to finish out his 28-year sentence, Altez thinks differently.
 
“Once he’s in the U.S. there are no guarantees that he would not be charged with Holloway’s murder although no such evidence exists,” he said.
 
The next step involves the judge sending her decision to Peru’s Supreme Court, expected within the next week to 10 days, and the high court then giving its stamp of approval to the extradition. At that point only government ministers or the president can stop the process, which is highly unlikely according to most observers.
 
“It’s not in our interest that Joran be judged in the U.S. because he is despised there. You could not find an impartial jury to try him,” said Altez, who said he will try to stop the extradition “by all legal means possible.”
 
“There’s not much you can do when you’re up against the most powerful country in the world,” he added.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 08, 2012, 08:58:24 PM
What are the odds Joran is in the USA at the same time the kalpoe- Dr Phil case possibly starts????? How delicious!! ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 08, 2012, 09:42:11 PM
Hearing on extradition Van der Sloot

BACKGROUND - Many Peruvians still find that 28 years in prison is far too low for Joran van der Sloot, who in January was sentenced for the murder of Stephany Flores.

They would sometimes be at their beck and call, because the case Van der Sloot seems again to get a sequel. Today, in Piedras Gordas prison in Lima the hearing on the possible extradition of the 24-year-old Dutchman to the United States.

 ::snipping2::


Extradition to U.S.
The U.S. authorities have never made a secret of Van der Sloot that they want to try on our own soil. According to lawyer Jose Luis Jimenez, who stood by the Dutch during his trial, chances are it comes to extradition. "There is an initial agreement, although there are still a few elements of the application to be negotiated," says Jimenez, "but I consider it likely that the extradition is coming."

Complicated process
In the meantime, will there be a complicated process. Van der Sloot is appealing against his imprisonment, and this procedure must first be settled. The Peruvian Supreme Court probably affords more definite about this month. Only then can the American request to consider, first by the Supreme Court and a number of committees, and the final decision lies with the Peruvian Cabinet.

If the born Arnhem extradited, he will travel to the U.S. temporarily for trial in Alabama, which may take several months. Then he must first return to Peru to serve his sentence to sit for him in the U.S. ends up behind bars again. If he is in the extortion trial is convicted, he can get up to 25 years.

Holloway
In the most extreme case, Van der Sloot so only very old at liberty to come. Even then, his problems have not yet be over. The investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway may still, Van der Sloot is also in that case is still the prime suspect.

http://www.bndestem.nl/nieuws/algemeen/buitenland/10997688/Hoorzitting-over-uitlevering-Van-der-Sloot.ece


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on May 08, 2012, 09:46:15 PM
What are the odds Joran is in the USA at the same time the kalpoe- Dr Phil case possibly starts????? How delicious!! ::MonkeyCool::


Joran and his lawyer sound a lot like Ber Rabbit...."Please, don't throw me in the
briar patch."   I think Joran is just itching for a nice vacation in a Alabamy jail.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: pinkbanana on May 09, 2012, 12:23:08 AM
 ::MonkeyAngel::  ::MonkeyAngel::

pb


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 09, 2012, 08:48:24 AM
What are the odds Joran is in the USA at the same time the kalpoe- Dr Phil case possibly starts????? How delicious!! ::MonkeyCool::


Joran and his lawyer sound a lot like Ber Rabbit...."Please, don't throw me in the
briar patch."   I think Joran is just itching for a nice vacation in a Alabamy jail.
Oh and a nice HOT Alabamy summer, at that.


You know the kind, mosquitoes, gnats, cicadas playing so loud that it is deafening, sun so high in the sky it burns your face.

Oh wait...he will be in a cell block.  Never mind.

I hope he does get slapped with a murder charge.  Mr. Poopy Pants all over again.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 09, 2012, 11:54:32 AM
 ::snipping2::

De Telegraaf reports that a Peruvian judge has visited Van der Sloot in prison. The paper says the Dutchman has no faith in the US justice system. According to de Volkskrant, the extradition request could take some months to process. The judge will make his recommendation to the Supreme Court. In the final analysis it will be the Justice Ministry in Lima which decides his fate.

http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/dutch-press-review-wednesday-9-may-2012

 ::justice2NJ::   ::justice2NJ::   ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: alagary on May 09, 2012, 12:24:11 PM
I haven't heard where he would be kept while waiting for trial in the US but I hope it's here;
  Jefferson County jail faces staff cuts amid overcrowding (slideshow)
 

"They are allowed one clean uniform a week, which doesn't stay clean long. They are given fresh bed linens less often than that. They rinse out their underwear in the cell block toilets"
http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2011/08/jefferson_jail_faces_staff_cut.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 09, 2012, 03:05:37 PM
I haven't heard where he would be kept while waiting for trial in the US but I hope it's here;
  Jefferson County jail faces staff cuts amid overcrowding (slideshow)
 

"They are allowed one clean uniform a week, which doesn't stay clean long. They are given fresh bed linens less often than that. They rinse out their underwear in the cell block toilets"
http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2011/08/jefferson_jail_faces_staff_cut.html
      Nah, that looks too nice to me.

I say Midnight Express...like Beth said.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: alagary on May 09, 2012, 03:30:20 PM
cadillac , read the Birmingham News . Those are not boy scouts that he will be bunking with.  ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 09, 2012, 08:33:44 PM
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT'S U.S. INDICTMENT at link
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-us-extradition_n_1503871.html

Joran van der Sloot Extradition: Once Peru Gets Rid Of Convicted Killer, U.S. Wants To Try Him For Murder, Expert Says
First Posted: 05/09/2012 5:10 pm Updated: 05/09/2012 5:19 pm

A Peruvian court will soon issue a decision on whether to allow convicted killer Joran van der Sloot to be extradited to the United States on charges of extortion in the case of Natalee Holloway.

The Dutchman may have far worse charges to fear, however, according to an international defense expert who said the extortion extradition is a ruse.

"With all the bad guys running around -- Al Qaeda and other international terrorists -- do you really think the U.S. is going to go after every guy who tries to extort money from a U.S. citizen? Absolutely not. The U.S. wants to get ahold of him and charge him with Holloway's murder," said Michael Griffith, senior partner at the International Legal Defense Counsel.
 ::snipping2::
While the confessions alone might not be enough, Griffith said authorities in the U.S. could target the Kalpoe brothers -- even though neither is considered a suspect or person of interest in the case.

"They could put pressure on them -- say to their lawyers, 'we want to serve you with a subpoena and we want their cooperation and we'll give them immunity from any charges. If you don't, we'll give their names to Interpol and have them added to the stop list.'"

Griffith added, "They could be the weak link in the chain. They were with him that night."

According to Peruvian media outlets, a decision on the indictment could take several weeks.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 09, 2012, 08:36:27 PM
cadillac , read the Birmingham News . Those are not boy scouts that he will be bunking with.  ::boxingjoran::
I hope he bunks with AL finest, Alagary.

But he is so high profile - don't ya think he will be isolated?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: terryd270 on May 09, 2012, 10:41:39 PM
Hi!  I haven't been on for sometime but would like to know the status of the lawsuit against Dr. Phil by the two brothers ( Deepak and Satish).. I have google and basically said the next court date was supposed to be Oct 2011 but that has passed and would like to know it its been dropped or still on hold.. I know its on the forum some place but looked for it but didn't find it..

Take care,
Terry


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 09, 2012, 11:15:09 PM
Hi!  I haven't been on for sometime but would like to know the status of the lawsuit against Dr. Phil by the two brothers ( Deepak and Satish).. I have google and basically said the next court date was supposed to be Oct 2011 but that has passed and would like to know it its been dropped or still on hold.. I know its on the forum some place but looked for it but didn't find it..

Take care,
Terry

Hi Terry.  It has been a while.  I hope all is well.

Janet

+++++++


klaasend
Re: Natalee Holloway Case Discussion # 864 2/07/12 -
« Reply #700 on: April 14, 2012, 04:18:20 AM »


Case Number: BC363201
DEEPAK KALPOE VS PHILLIP C MCGRAW

Filing Date: 12/13/2006
Case Type: Defamation (Slander/Libel) (General Jurisdiction)
Status: Pending

Future Hearings

05/15/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Status Conference (RE PRE-TRIAL MOTIONS/MOTIONS INLIMINE)

05/16/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Status Conference ((2ND DAY) RE PRE-TRIAL MOTIONS &MOTIONS IN LIMINE)

04/08/2013 at 08:32 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Final Status Conference

04/22/2013 at 09:00 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Jury Trial (10 WEEKS)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12630.msg1518640;topicseen#msg1518640


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on May 10, 2012, 12:37:11 AM
cadillac , read the Birmingham News . Those are not boy scouts that he will be bunking with.  ::boxingjoran::
I hope he bunks with AL finest, Alagary.

But he is so high profile - don't ya think he will be isolated?


That Eric Robert Rudolph was tried in Birmingham by the US Dept of Justice for the abortion clinic bombing.  He was held somewhere in the Jefferson County Courthouse and then immediately transferred to that supermaxx prison.   


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 10, 2012, 12:45:24 AM
Email me if I missed adding you or if you think of someone that should be added I didn't add.   ::MonkeyCool::

smklaas@hotmail.com

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain28.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: trimmonthelake on May 10, 2012, 06:56:40 AM
Klaas,the train is awesome!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: snoopy on May 10, 2012, 09:42:27 AM
Thanks for putting me on the train, Klaas.  It's good to see Peaches and 2NJ too.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 10, 2012, 03:57:14 PM
Thanks for including me on the JUSTICE TRAIN!

I'd like to think that the Kalpoe Bros would turn states evidence against Joran for immunity and assylum in the USA. Whoopee!  Justice - cowboy & bama style!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 10, 2012, 07:58:52 PM
Email me if I missed adding you or if you think of someone that should be added I didn't add.   ::MonkeyCool::

smklaas@hotmail.com

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain28.jpg)
  Can you email this to Joran?

He might like to see all his friends and welcoming committee when he gets here?  jk


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 10, 2012, 08:18:51 PM
Added Trimm - didn't see her on it (up by the tail of the plane)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain30.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jammsnana on May 10, 2012, 09:37:11 PM
Added a few that haven't been around for a while.  Hope they don't mind.  

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain27d.jpg)

I want to be on the Justice Train too! Please!!! Thanks, Jamms


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 11, 2012, 12:21:01 AM
Jammsnana - got you down by the benches.   ::MonkeyCool:: 

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: alagary on May 11, 2012, 10:45:37 AM
Sorry about using Radar Online but, are the bolded parts correct?
  Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money to Extradite Joran to U.S.
  The longer the confessed killer and his legal team can drag the procedure out, the more chance he has of avoiding being deported at all, as the statute of limitations for the fraud charge which was filed in 2010 is three years.

  [/font]
   “The other issue is that wire fraud and extortion in Peru are considered ‘a violation,’ with a maximum sentence of one year. The U.S. has to sentence him according to Peruvian law because of the extradition agreement
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-lawyer-waste-money


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 11, 2012, 01:51:58 PM
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/11/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS43572957320120511

Joran van der Sloot's Extradition to US Not a Done Deal
By Stephanie Rabiner, Esq. at FindLaw.com
Fri May 11, 2012 12:39am EDT

 ::snipping2::
In court on Tuesday, van der Sloot told a judge that he would rather serve out the remainder of his 28-year murder sentence in Peru than be sent to the U.S. Rumor has it his jailed lifestyle is significantly more cushy than it would be in a federal prison.

Despite his objection, most agree that van der Sloot will be extradited at some point in the following months. Per the the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty, an extradition request must be granted if the individual has been charged with an offense punishable by at least a 1-year jail sentence in both countries.
 ::snipping2::

Because the judge approved van der Sloot's provisional detention, it's been implied that extortion and fraud are higher-level crimes in Peru.

Granted, it's still possible that Peru's Supreme Court or government ministers will stop Joran van der Sloot's extradition. His lawyer claims he will not receive a fair trial in this country and that the U.S. will not return him once here, reports ABC News. However, the general consensus is that no one is willing to step in.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 11, 2012, 07:51:47 PM
Sorry about using Radar Online but, are the bolded parts correct?
  Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money to Extradite Joran to U.S.
  The longer the confessed killer and his legal team can drag the procedure out, the more chance he has of avoiding being deported at all, as the statute of limitations for the fraud charge which was filed in 2010 is three years.

  [/font]
   “The other issue is that wire fraud and extortion in Peru are considered ‘a violation,’ with a maximum sentence of one year. The U.S. has to sentence him according to Peruvian law because of the extradition agreement
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-lawyer-waste-money
I think many people don't understand the concept of "statute of limitations." It does not mean (in this case 3 years) from the actual crime -- it is from the time LEGAL PROCEEDINGS are initiated. The US government initated legal proceedings way before 3 years were up from the crime date. Statute of Limitations is moot.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 12, 2012, 01:32:03 AM
Original article about the shooting posted April 29th...victim died...five bullet wounds...shot on his front porch...drugs found on him.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12630.msg1520995#msg1520995

They have made an arrest in the case.

http://www.24ora.com/local-mainmenu-5/47137-recherche-di-noord-a-detene-john-freddy-sospechoso-di-asesinato-na-bubali

Papiamentu translation:

recherche of north owing to detene john freddy sospechoso of asesinato at bubali

friday, 11 may 2012 22:48

the recherche of north not owing to sosega very by cu the asesinato at north did take lugar. hour cu owing to likida he amaya cu blood frieu at bubali autoridad owing to cuminsa work at once. the victima cu owing to arrive dead hospital was have cierto cantidad of cocaina on his pañanan. the drugs owing to being happen for her unidad crimen organiza cu is haciendo the investigacion for her drugs.

all the time on the caso self recherche of north owing to work of day y night for finalmente place hand on one sospechoso very dangerous self. here is deal of one colombiano john freddy that now is sospechoso in the asesinato. seems cu husticia at aruba conoce much good self y the was close end recientemente for delitonan pisa also.

john freddy y another man more owing to being grab in one barco cla for bandona aruba some day happen. the is illegal at aruba. the wanted owing to leave scondi but recherche of north owing to ask all esnan trahando at platform y aeropuerto for throw good view on esnan cu is leave. principalmente barconan will is good for they wordo listra first cu they leave. esey owing to give his fruto also because abordo of one barco colombiano owing to achieve the two hombernan scondi entrenan john freddy.

the was close for her personal of keep we costa but diabierna hour cu the was cla for bandona aruba the recherchenan of north owing to arrive y detene at once. the is one djaca old cu kizas will not copera very but the recherchenan of north owing to prepara they self much good first cu owing to go over at detencion. good trabao haci y this once more is thanks at the dedicacion cu owing to being haci on the caso here trahando oranan largo.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 12, 2012, 09:51:56 AM
There is a John Freddy Montoya in Aruba.  What are the chances it's the same person?  NOPE, wrong initials.  JFPO

http://www.awe24.com/20120511/10687/Sospechoso_di_asesinato_na_Bubali_ta_den_man_di_autoridad

(http://ba2.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/10687/1_1336776036.jpg)





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 12, 2012, 11:38:10 AM
There is a John Freddy Montoya in Aruba.  What are the chances it's the same person?  NOPE, wrong initials.  JFPO

http://www.awe24.com/20120511/10687/Sospechoso_di_asesinato_na_Bubali_ta_den_man_di_autoridad

(http://ba2.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/10687/1_1336776036.jpg)


From the article, looks like he spent four years in jail in Aruba for drugs.  So if he wasn't there legally, did they deport him and he came right back to keep doing the same thing?  And now he's accused of murder...

Yep, one happy island!   ::MonkeyRoll::

http://www.awe24.com/20120511/10687/Sospechoso_di_asesinato_na_Bubali_ta_den_man_di_autoridad

Papiamentu translation:

sospechoso of asesinato at bubali is in hand of autoridad

23 hora happen come across, 11 of half 2012 12:11

recientemente autoridad owing to place hand on the sospechoso j.f.p.o. that is the sospechoso of owing to asesina the colombiano eduardo fiallos amaya 2 week happen at bubali. informacionnan extra-oficial is indica cu the will owing to being captura on lama in one boat huyendo for colombia. the sospechoso here owing to being deteni at 2007 relaciona cu drugs y owing to leave pound after of 4 year. but apparently now the is go back envolucra his self in the low world.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 12, 2012, 02:53:40 PM
May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

Altez spoke to ABC News after van der Sloot appeared in a jailhouse courtroom at Piedras Gordas prison, about two hours north of Lima.

Peruvian Judge Zenaida Vilca heard arguments by U.S. Justice Department officials pushing for the extradition while  Altez opposed the move on grounds his client could not receive a fair trial in a U.S. court.

The Dutch national is currently serving a 28-year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores, a Peruvian woman whom van der Sloot admitted to strangling in his Lima hotel room two years ago.

He is also the main suspect in thedisappearance of Holloway in 2005 on the Caribbean island of Aruba where van der Sloot had lived most of his life.

Van der Sloot, appearing nervous and thinner than in previous appearances, was marched by prison officials to the courtroom, handcuffed and refusing to answer questions posed by nearby reporters.

The maximum-security jail is in a sparsely populated area of rolling desert-like hills. On one of the mountains overlooking the facility is the slogan Cristo Vive (Christ Lives) in huge white block letters and below are the tents of some very poor squatters.

Altz spoke with ABC News after the court appearance and said van der Sloot was “very upset with the prospect of being extradited to the U.S. I haven’t seen Joran so down, so depressed since I took on his defense almost two years ago.”

The extortion and wire fraud charges relate to payments allegedly made to van der Sloot by the Holloway family for information on the whereabouts of their daughter’s body.

In court U.S. legal officials argued that there is evidence that will show that van der Sloot arranged for and accepted those payments. Altez says that van der Sloot was lured into taking those payments and that it wasn’t on his client’s initiative.

Although the judge and other Peruvian legal authorities claim van der Sloot will have to return to Peru to finish out his 28-year sentence, Altez thinks differently.

“Once he’s in the U.S. there are no guarantees that he would not be charged with Holloway’s murder although no such evidence exists,” he said.

The next step involves the judge sending her decision to Peru’s Supreme Court, expected within the next week to 10 days, and the high court then giving its stamp of approval to the extradition. At that point only government ministers or the president can stop the process, which is highly unlikely according to most observers.

“It’s not in our interest that Joran be judged in the U.S. because he is despised there. You could not find an impartial jury to try him,” said Altez, who said he will try to stop the extradition “by all legal means possible.”

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/

s.t.





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 12, 2012, 02:56:32 PM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 12, 2012, 03:28:50 PM
It appears that Joran would rather be held in a Peruvian lockup over detention in the U.S.

Janet

+++++

Joran van der Sloot's Extradition to US Not a Done Deal
Fri May 11, 2012 12:39am EDT


In court on Tuesday, van der Sloot told a judge that he would rather serve out the remainder of his 28-year murder sentence in Peru than be sent to the U.S. Rumor has it his jailed lifestyle is significantly more cushy than it would be in a federal prison.

Despite his objection, most agree that van der Sloot will be extradited at some point in the following months. Per the the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty, an extradition request must be granted if the individual has been charged with an offense punishable by at least a 1-year jail sentence in both countries.

<snipped>

Granted, it's still possible that Peru's Supreme Court or government ministers will stop Joran van der Sloot's extradition. His lawyer claims he will not receive a fair trial in this country and that the U.S. will not return him once here, reports ABC News.  However, the general consensus is that no one is willing to step in.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/11/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS43572957320120511

s.t.




 



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 13, 2012, 10:09:58 AM
It appears that Joran would rather be held in a Peruvian lockup over detention in the U.S.

Janet

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 13, 2012, 11:38:40 AM
It appears that Joran would rather be held in a Peruvian lockup over detention in the U.S.

Janet

+++++

Joran van der Sloot's Extradition to US Not a Done Deal
Fri May 11, 2012 12:39am EDT


In court on Tuesday, van der Sloot told a judge that he would rather serve out the remainder of his 28-year murder sentence in Peru than be sent to the U.S. Rumor has it his jailed lifestyle is significantly more cushy than it would be in a federal prison.

Despite his objection, most agree that van der Sloot will be extradited at some point in the following months. Per the the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty, an extradition request must be granted if the individual has been charged with an offense punishable by at least a 1-year jail sentence in both countries.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/11/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS43572957320120511



Van der Sloot faces prisons known for harsh conditions
June 8th, 2010 10:46 PM ET


<snipped>

A 2009 U.S. State Department report on Peru's human rights record noted that while the South American country's government generally respects the human rights of its citizens, prison conditions were harsh for the country's 44,800 inmates - 17,297 of whom were awaiting sentencing as of December 2009, according to the report.

Among the areas of serious concern highlighted were overcrowding, poor sanitation and inadequate nutrition and health care. The San Juan de Lurigancho men's prison held 9,874 prisoners in a facility designed for 3,204 and incidences of tuberculosis and HIV/AIDS were reportedly at near-epidemic levels, according to the report.

"Prisoners with money had access to cell phones, illegal drugs and meals prepared outside the prison. Conditions were poor to extremely harsh in facilities for prisoners who lacked funds," the report said. "Inmates had intermittent access to running water, bathing facilities were inadequate, kitchen facilities were unhygienic, and prisoners slept in hallways and common areas for lack of cell space."

Corruption and professional incompetence were also reported in some of the nation's 71 prisons, 56 of which are operated by The National Penitentiary Institute. The National Police of Peru has jurisdiction over the rest, according to the State Department report.

"There were deaths of inmates in prisons, most attributed to fellow inmates, but some were due to negligence by guards. Guards received little or no training or supervision. Corruption was a serious problem, and some guards cooperated with criminal bosses who oversaw the smuggling of guns and drugs into prisons."

Conditions are especially harsh in the country's maximum security prisons, which are extremely isolated geographically.

One of them, the Challapalca Prison, is in the Andes near the Bolivian border, at an altitude of 15,000 feet above sea level, about 211 kilometers from the nearest city of Puno - a six-hour ride down a dirt road, depending on conditions, according to a 2003 report on the facility by the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights.

There is no regular electricity or running water, and temperatures most of the year hover around 33 degrees Fahrenheit in the day and as low as 4 degrees below zero at night, the report said.

<snipped>

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/08/perus-prisons-overcrowded-unhygienic-at-15000-feet-above-sea-level/

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 13, 2012, 11:48:02 AM
Ricardo Flores' anticipated press conference did not happen ... the anticipated press conference exposing special privileges afforded to Joran van der Sloot from the getgo while being detained in a Peruvian lockup.

Nevertheless ... it is my hope that Stephany Flores's father will take advantage of his unimaginable heartbreak ... take advantage of his influencial position in Peruvian society ... to be a voice for his daughter by exposing what he perceives as corruption within the Peruvian Justice System.

Janet

+++++

Van der Sloot Gets 28 Years for Murder in Peru
Jan 13, 2012 6:15 PM EST

 
<snipped>

After the conviction, the victim’s father, Ricardo Flores, and older brother, Enrique, held a press conference. “We’re about to conclude an investigation, and we hope we’ll be able to release the information on Monday regarding the excess privileges this man has had from the first day of his seclusion,” said Mr. Ricardo Flores.

Flores’s attorney took the microphone and demanded: “How can it be that a person that is in prison is more comfortable than if he were free? We will hold a press conference to present all the irregularities in this man’s imprisonment on Monday.”

“Mr. Flores wants peace for his family. The damage is done and it is beyond repair,” he continued.

<snipped>

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/01/13/van-der-sloot-gets-28-years-for-murder-in-peru.html



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 13, 2012, 12:01:11 PM
MAKING A DIFFERENCE

Others Might Learn

Loving Natalee
A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 189:
    It's the proverbial, Biblical conflict between good and evil.  It's very, very hard to fight evil because it constantly changes form and you never know who your enemies are.  And evil is always two steps ahead. From the outset we never had a chance.  But we didn't know it.  I'm taking leave of the island, but not from the work yet to be done.
 
Page 200:  My child.  My beautiful daughter.  I can't save her.  It's too late.  Natalee is gone. And second to the great tragedy of losing her is if we fail to learn from what has happened.  I could be any parent in the world.  And no parent should ever go through this experience.  Natalee could be anyone's daughter.  And in these thoughts a new path is made clear.  There is something I can do.  Many people reached out to us, and I can now reach back to them.  It might be too late to save Natalee, but it's not too late to save others.  And it's time now to make good on my pledge. It's time now to make good on my pledge to stand before high-school and college students, law enforcement professionals, victims' rights groups, travelers of all ages, and anyone interested in personal safety to share Natalee's story and our hard lessons, so that others might learn from them.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 13, 2012, 12:13:52 PM
Beth

You have moved beyond the unimaginable pain of losing your only daughter and ... given unselfishly of yourself to others.  Natalee would be proud of her mother.  Embrace this special day that our Lord has made and ... rejoice in precious memories.

Natalee would be proud!

Happy Mother's Day

Janet

++++++


Natalee's Hero

Loving Natalee
A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


As I read on in the journal, I discover that one of the most moving entries is her desription of a hero.  Natalee writes:

A Hero is someone who puts others before himself.  He or she is very selfless and cares about the well-being of others.  Heroes also accept life's challenges and remain strong through tough times.  They also have a strong sense of determination and stick to goals and morals.  I believe that heroes uphold morals and try to encourage others to live life morally correct.  Heroes are not only just people called in times of physical danger, but individuals that can both emotionally and physically help people get through rough times.  A hero should always show respect for other people as well as respect for himself.

Instantly I realize that Natalee is poignantly describing the people who have reached out to help her family get through this "tough time."  It's almost as if she is thanking everyone herself by recognizing the importance of selfless people.  And I am amazed at her profound words here.  I sit and read the entire journal


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 13, 2012, 12:14:38 PM

(http://www.acc-tv.com/images/globalnews/ppl_hollowaynatalee_1107.jpg)




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 14, 2012, 02:42:38 PM
Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


The prime suspect in the unsolved 2005 disappearance of American Natalee Holloway, Joran Van der Sloot, told a judge on Tuesday that he will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he faces extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

Van der Sloot faces an indictment in the U.S. for allegedly accepting $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead Holloway's mother's lawyer to the body after her disappearance in Aruba.

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

If he stays put, Van der Sloot could be released on parole after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino in May 2010, said Altez.

But if he were convicted in the U.S. he likely wouldn't qualify for early parole in Peru. Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

<snipped>

In an interview with ABC news, Altez stated his belief that in the end Van der Sloot will lose his fight to stay in Peru.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” he said

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 14, 2012, 06:13:38 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/110854-joran-resists-extradition-to-us-

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/05092012_Joran_ExtraditiontoUS.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 14, 2012, 07:02:31 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/110854-joran-resists-extradition-to-us-

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/05092012_Joran_ExtraditiontoUS.jpg)

The trial is scheduled for 2015.

Wow! If extradited in 3 months, and trial scheduled for 2015, that means that he will be in AL jail for almost 3 years prior to trial!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on May 14, 2012, 09:52:52 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/110854-joran-resists-extradition-to-us-

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/05092012_Joran_ExtraditiontoUS.jpg)




Note the sentence Joran is facing in the U.S. is 25 years and not the year or so his attorneys try to make it appear.

Joran doesn't seem to want to come to Alabama!  I can't imagine why!  I'm so hurt by his rude attitude.

 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 14, 2012, 10:06:26 PM
Joran van der Sloot's Extradition to US Not a Done Deal

Despite claims otherwise, Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the U.S. is not yet set in stone. Though a Peruvian judge approved his "provisional detention" last month, the convicted murderer has indicated that he intends to fight his extradition.

In court on Tuesday, van der Sloot told a judge that he would rather serve out the remainder of his 28-year murder sentence in Peru than be sent to the U.S. Rumor has it his jailed lifestyle is significantly more cushy than it would be in a federal prison.

 ::snipping2::

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/11/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS43572957320120511


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Frijole on May 14, 2012, 10:15:50 PM
Come on Joran, about time you were shown some good old fashioned southern hospitality!   ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 15, 2012, 01:12:11 AM
Although i've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 15, 2012, 01:16:35 AM
Although i've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 15, 2012, 01:21:03 AM
Although i've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::

Interesting takes Wreck, but you could be right. I would love to see him get charged with murder, but think it is a long shot, unless there was something found on that laptop that we are unaware of. Either way, as long as we can stay nice and friendly with Peru, politically that is, Urine is going to be in prison for the rest of his life.  ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 15, 2012, 01:31:28 AM
Although I've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::

Interesting takes Wreck, but you could be right. I would love to see him get charged with murder, but think it is a long shot, unless there was something found on that laptop that we are unaware of. Either way, as long as we can stay nice and friendly with Peru, politically that is, Urine is going to be in prison for the rest of his life.  ::boxingjoran::

Food for thought................................................. all of a sudden (about Jan or Feb '12) Dr. Phil's team stopped fighting the Kalpoes for trial delays and started agreeing to postponing the trial another year. That really never made much sense to me ----- maybe there were ulterior motives!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 15, 2012, 01:47:04 AM
Although I've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::

Interesting takes Wreck, but you could be right. I would love to see him get charged with murder, but think it is a long shot, unless there was something found on that laptop that we are unaware of. Either way, as long as we can stay nice and friendly with Peru, politically that is, Urine is going to be in prison for the rest of his life.  ::boxingjoran::

Food for thought................................................. all of a sudden (about Jan or Feb '12) Dr. Phil's team stopped fighting the Kalpoes for trial delays and started agreeing to postponing the trial another year. That really never made much sense to me ----- maybe there were ulterior motives!

I hope so. I never really thought of that. Once on American soil and in a Alabama prison, Urine may be willing to talk. Being in Alabama with American prison inmates is going to be an entirely different form of pressure that I don't think Urine has come close to feeling, yet.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: can on May 15, 2012, 08:48:53 AM
Although I've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::

Interesting takes Wreck, but you could be right. I would love to see him get charged with murder, but think it is a long shot, unless there was something found on that laptop that we are unaware of. Either way, as long as we can stay nice and friendly with Peru, politically that is, Urine is going to be in prison for the rest of his life.  ::boxingjoran::

Food for thought................................................. all of a sudden (about Jan or Feb '12) Dr. Phil's team stopped fighting the Kalpoes for trial delays and started agreeing to postponing the trial another year. That really never made much sense to me ----- maybe there were ulterior motives!

Hmn.  That is food for thought.  Good observation! ::justice2NJ:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 15, 2012, 10:00:41 AM
Although I've been very impatient with how long it has taken for justice to be doled out to the pride of Assruba, I've learned in the past couple of years that there probably has been a lot going on through back channels. We saw that with the extortion attempt by Urine. John Q. Kelly and Beth were waiting for Urine to become complacent and slip up. Guess what? Urine is Coming to America.....Sorry Eddie and Arsenio  ::MonkeyCool:: This extradition stuff also can be very slow, as countries have to work to respect another countries legal process.
Yep -- he's coming here alright!! I agree with the "back channel" thing. 2 things may be in the works ...(1) he may be conveniently here to testify in the Dr Phil case .. (2) he my just get hit with a murder charge for Natalee -- maybe wishful thinking, but I would not be at all surprised!  ::CowboySmiley::

Interesting takes Wreck, but you could be right. I would love to see him get charged with murder, but think it is a long shot, unless there was something found on that laptop that we are unaware of. Either way, as long as we can stay nice and friendly with Peru, politically that is, Urine is going to be in prison for the rest of his life.  ::boxingjoran::

Food for thought................................................. all of a sudden (about Jan or Feb '12) Dr. Phil's team stopped fighting the Kalpoes for trial delays and started agreeing to postponing the trial another year. That really never made much sense to me ----- maybe there were ulterior motives!

Hmn.  That is food for thought.  Good observation! ::justice2NJ:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran::


Maybe, the best is yet to come!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jammsnana on May 15, 2012, 11:40:19 AM
Jammsnana - got you down by the benches.   ::MonkeyCool:: 

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


THANK YOU!!!!! Jamms


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 15, 2012, 12:32:59 PM
My understanding.

Considering a crime happened against an American citizen while she was on American soil ... jurisdiction will not be a cause for an American judge to dismiss the charges brought against Joran van der Sloot for the extortion of Beth Holloway.

However ... jurisdictional issues may stand in the way of Joran van der Sloot being tried in an American court for his participation in the happenings encompassing the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on Aruban soil.

IMO

Janet

+++++


THE NEW YORK LAWSUIT - DISMISSED!
 
Jurisdiction - A Procedural Ruling


NANCY GRACE
Judge Dismisses Holloway Suit
Aired August 11, 2006 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

JIM MORET: Natalee`s family filed a civil lawsuit in New York against Joran Van Der Sloot, the prime suspect in this case, and his father, Paul, claiming that Joran imprisoned and sexually assaulted their daughter, and also that Paul enabled his son`s delinquent behavior.

Basically, what happened is the judge said New York was the wrong place to file this lawsuit. The exact words were, "It`s an inconvenient place to file the lawsuit." Joran, you may recall, said that there was no nexus, there was no connection between New York, Natalee`s disappearance and any of the activities in Aruba. And basically, the judge agreed, saying the case is therefore dismissed.

<snipped>

MORET: Joran Van Der Sloot is saying that New York -- through his attorney, saying New York was the wrong place to bring this case. All of the activities that were alleged happened in Aruba. Joran is not a U.S. citizen. Natalee did not live in New York. Therefore, it was the wrong place to bring this case.

Natalee`s family brought the case in New York because they said that a number of witnesses lived in and around New York, it was a convenient location to bring this lawsuit. And also, they claim to have another woman who was allegedly assaulted by Joran Van Der Sloot, and she was only going to testify in New York. But basically, the judge didn`t agree with any of those claims.

<snipped>

GRACE: Beth, thank you for being with us. It seems that no matter how hard you struggle for justice in your daughter`s disappearance, you get swatted down every which way you turn, now including an American court. Beth, what did you want to gain in this lawsuit?

TWITTY: Well, Nancy, first, I`d like to say that, you know, it`s not just Natalee and it`s not just Natalee`s last shot at justice. What we have, Nancy, we have millions and millions and millions of Americans who travel internationally every year. And what we are learning from Natalee is that, you know, the challenges that you will face should you find a loved one a victim of a crime in a foreign country. Your United States constitutional rights do not apply in other countries, and it`s been a hard life lesson for us to learn. There is no recourse. We faced jurisdictional issues, extradition every -- every step of the way. And it`s just hard to know the right turns to make. I mean, we`re doing the best that we can to see what can be done for an American citizen who`s a victim of a crime in a foreign country.

<snipped>

TWITTY: We know these are the original three suspects into her disappearance, and we are on the right track to pursue that, you know, but it`s just hard to find the venue. It`s just hard to know -- as I said, you know, there`s just not a handbook on this.

GRACE: Why are you so convinced, Beth, that these guys know what happened to your girl?

TWITTY: Well, the facts still remain that those are the last suspects known to be seen with Natalee alive. And everybody knows of their repeated lies that they told the authorities, even their father, Paulus Van Der Sloot. That`s why he was arrested. There was a reason that he was arrested in Natalee`s disappearance. It was not unwarranted whatsoever.

And you know -- and being dismissed in New York, it was on a procedure ruling. Here again, jurisdiction. We have faced that issue since May 30 of 2005. Jurisdiction and extradition have hit us in the face every time.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0608/11/ng.01.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 15, 2012, 02:28:05 PM
My understanding.

Considering a crime happened against an American citizen while she was on American soil ... jurisdiction will not be a cause for an American judge to dismiss the charges brought against Joran van der Sloot for the extortion of Beth Holloway.

However ... jurisdictional issues may stand in the way of Joran van der Sloot being tried in an American court for his participation in the happenings encompassing the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on Aruban soil.

IMO

Janet


1. Joran will hopefully be extradited to the USA to answer charges of extortion and wire fraud, for which he has already indicted.

2. As for charging him for any crimes against Natalee, so far that is only wishful thinking on our part.  However, the Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction may enter into any future charges against Joran.  It looks to the nationality of the victim to determine jurisdiction, holding that a state may assert jurisdiction over persons and events outside a state's territory on the basis that its citizen has been harmed.

Edit - term correction per jamcakes.  MB


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 15, 2012, 07:59:39 PM
DON'T MISS THE DANA PRETZER SHOW, TONIGHT AT 9PM ET:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/Pretzer051512.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 15, 2012, 08:14:58 PM
My understanding.

Considering a crime happened against an American citizen while she was on American soil ... jurisdiction will not be a cause for an American judge to dismiss the charges brought against Joran van der Sloot for the extortion of Beth Holloway.

However ... jurisdictional issues may stand in the way of Joran van der Sloot being tried in an American court for his participation in the happenings encompassing the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on Aruban soil.

IMO

Janet


1. Joran will hopefully be extradited to the USA to answer charges of extortion and wire fraud, for which he has already indicted.

2. As for charging him for any crimes against Natalee, so far that is only wishful thinking on our part.  However, the Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction may enter into any future charges against Joran.  It looks to the nationality of the victim to determine jurisdiction, holding that a state may assert jurisdiction over persons and events outside a state's territory on the basis that its citizen has been harmed.
Edit - Term correction per jamcakes.  MB

Yes......... I think it has been documented here that the US Government can prosecute any crimes committed against a US citizen on foreign soil (particularly if justice had not been administered in the country where the crime was committed). While the US cannot enter a foreign country to nab said suspect -- if they get him somehow to enter the United States -- all is fair!! ............................ well now they are going to get Joran here -- legally!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 15, 2012, 08:37:24 PM
Beginning at 11:59pm ET tonight, we may be down for 15 minutes or so for a network firmware upgrade.  There is like a 2 hour window when they will be working on the servers and we could be down for a few minutes any time between 11:59pm ET tonight and 2:00am ET. 

Just wanted you to know if we happen to be down, that's why
::MonkeyCool:: 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 16, 2012, 12:45:16 AM

1. Joran will hopefully be extr adited to the USA to answer charges of extortion and wire fraud, for which he has already indicted.

2. As for charging him for any crimes against Natalee, so far that is only wishful thinking on our part.  However, the Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction may enter into any future charges against Joran.  It looks to the nationality of the victim to determine jurisdiction, holding that a state may assert jurisdiction over persons and events outside a state's territory on the basis that its citizen has been harmed.
Edit - to correct term.  MB

Excuse me, please.  I'm having brain stutters today.

It should be Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction
Edit - sp.  MB

 ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 16, 2012, 12:47:51 AM

1. Joran will hopefully be extradited to the USA to answer charges of extortion and wire fraud, for which he has already indicted.

2. As for charging him for any crimes against Natalee, so far that is only wishful thinking on our part.  However, the Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction may enter into any future charges against Joran.  It looks to the nationality of the victim to determine jurisdiction, holding that a state may assert jurisdiction over persons and events outside a state's territory on the basis that its citizen has been harmed.
Edit - fix term per jamcakes.  MB

Excuse me, please.  I'm having brain stutters today.

It should be Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction
Edit sp. MB

 ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::


LOL.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Passive Personality Principle of Jurisdiction.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Keepthefaith on May 17, 2012, 02:32:41 AM
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY & STEPHANY FLORES

GOODNIGHT & GOD BLESS

KEEPTHEFAITH



 ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 17, 2012, 08:15:11 AM
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY & STEPHANY FLORES

GOODNIGHT & GOD BLESS

KEEPTHEFAITH



 ::MonkeyAngel::

 ::HelloKitty::  ::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 18, 2012, 09:26:07 PM
Photo at link.  Peter R. de Vries receives the 2012 Forget-Me-Not Award.

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/nieuws/peter-ontvangt-unieke-vergeet-me-niet-award/

Google translation

Friday, May 18, 2012, 15:51 hours
News
Peter receives unique Forget-Me-Not Award
Corrie van Buuren praises Peter for his years of dedication

Friday was Peter from the hands of Corrie van Buuren and Missing presenter Jaap Jongbloed the Forget-Me-Not Award 2012 awarded. Peter received this award for his energetic, tenacious attitude in numerous murder and missing cases.
 
"Thanks to you, by your determination, we have the place where Marion and Romy found buried," said Corrie van Buuren in an emotional speech. "After all these years a very special working relationship. Even after the discovery of Marion and Romy have you done much for us. We are very grateful for you. "
 
Unforgettable moments
Peter called it a "great surprise" that he just got the prize awarded. "I'm very proud of this award," he responded. "It has extra meaning for me that just handed Corrie van Buuren this. We have many memorable and touching moments with each experienced in the time I was working with the disappearance of her daughter Marion and her granddaughter Romy. We still have regular contact and it makes me so much that she spoke to me so beautiful. Then you just have a lump in your throat. This price will absolutely a beautiful place in my home. "

"I find it great fun to 'Missing' awarded me this prize," continued Peter. "Twenty years ago my television career began with Jaap Jongbloed, when we were together the first crime magazine" Crime Time ". I'm there with a lot of fun back then and it is natural that its special program gives me this award. "
 ::snipping2::
Eleventh award
Each year they award Corrie van Buuren, as an ambassador of the Missing Foundation, the award from. The Award, which in 2002 was first issued, serves as encouragement for those who make themselves useful in detecting and preventing disappearances. Since 2002, the Forget-Me-Not Award eleven times awarded. Images of the ceremony on 25 May in the broadcast of Missing screened, around 21:30 in the Netherlands 1.
 
Marijke Kuin
Editorial Peter R. de Vries


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on May 18, 2012, 09:49:43 PM
What a nice award for Peter deVries!  A pretty good photo at that link, too.

 ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 18, 2012, 09:53:48 PM
I thought you would enjoy it, Anna.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 18, 2012, 09:55:02 PM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 18, 2012, 10:26:53 PM
Peter Devries - In His Own Words

Paulus van der Sloot - That's a Sin

Dutch Crime Reporter Peter De Vries Goes Inside Joran van der Sloot's Explosive Tape
Friday, February 08, 2008


<snipped>

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Do you think -- a lot of viewers send me e-mails. I have a -- we have a blog here, Gretawire.com, and they send a lot of comments. They're very suspicious that Paulus Van Der Sloot has more of an involvement than simply just the father of the man who was caught on tape. Do you have any information that in any way incriminates Paulus Van Der Sloot?

PETER DE VRIES, DUTCH CRIME REPORTER:  Well, Joran told on tape that his father smuggled a mobile phone, a cell phone in the prison when he was the first time arrested. And he was a judge at that time, so that's -- that's a sin.

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html


The Kalpoe Brothers - Completely Innocent

How a sensational hidden camera operation
solved the Natalee Holloway case


<snipped>

Peter:  Jorans friends Deepak and Satish, who have been arrested for this case several times, are completely innocent. Joran declares with pride that he has abused them to create an alibi for himself. He calls them “very stupid boys’”.

http://www.peterrdevries.com/complete-story.htm


The Kalpoe Brothers - They Bought Him to the Beach

NANCY GRACE
Joran Submits to Questioning by Aruban Investigators in Holland
Aired February 7, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GRACE: Peter, where do the Kalpoe brothers fit into this whole thing?

DE VRIES: Well, they brought him to the beach.

GRACE: Yes.

DE VRIES: They dropped him there, and Natalee, of course, and then they went home. And Joran was asked by Patrick, the insider, What do they know? And then Joran said -- and you have to notice his body language at that moment, No, they know nothing. They -- I told them nothing.

GRACE: So they just got dragged into this unwittingly?

DE VRIES: Yes.

<snipped>
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/ng.01.html


Anita van der Sloot - Good Mother

Dutch Crime Reporter Peter De Vries Goes Inside Joran van der Sloot's Explosive Tape
Friday, February 08, 2008


VAN SUSTEREN: What prompted him to toss that wine in your face on that TV show? Did you say something to him, or what was that all about?

DE VRIES: Oh, he was frustrated about me because I was asking questions all the time, and I was saying -- I was telling the audience that Joran lied several times, that he couldn't answer simple questions, and that he was always keeping silent to the police. And well, that frustrated him

<snipped>

VAN SUSTEREN: Did Joran's parents say anything to you at that point or even after the show?

DE VRIES: After the show, they apologized for what their son did. And I think his mother is a good mother. She loves her son, but she doesn't know what he is doing, I think.

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 18, 2012, 10:42:42 PM
Case Number: BC363201
DEEPAK KALPOE VS PHILLIP C MCGRAW

Filing Date: 12/13/2006
Case Type: Defamation (Slander/Libel) (General Jurisdiction)
Status: Pending

Future Hearings

08/22/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/15/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMEN AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

08/23/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/16/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMINE AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

04/08/2013 at 08:32 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Final Status Conference

04/22/2013 at 09:00 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Jury Trial (10 WEEKS)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 18, 2012, 11:00:48 PM
What a nice award for Peter deVries!  A pretty good photo at that link, too.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Wouldn't it be neato burrito if Peter came to Alabama for the trial so Anna could have a photo op and perhaps Miss Anna could talk him into movn' to America!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 18, 2012, 11:03:46 PM
Case Number: BC363201
DEEPAK KALPOE VS PHILLIP C MCGRAW

Filing Date: 12/13/2006
Case Type: Defamation (Slander/Libel) (General Jurisdiction)
Status: Pending

Future Hearings

08/22/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/15/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMEN AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

08/23/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/16/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMINE AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

04/08/2013 at 08:32 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Final Status Conference

04/22/2013 at 09:00 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Jury Trial (10 WEEKS)

Thanks Klaas.

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 18, 2012, 11:40:06 PM
(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg694/scaled.php?server=694&filename=deepaktitorubentickelfr.png&res=landing)


gov't official, news reporter and Deepak ....



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 18, 2012, 11:41:59 PM
Case Number: BC363201
DEEPAK KALPOE VS PHILLIP C MCGRAW

Filing Date: 12/13/2006
Case Type: Defamation (Slander/Libel) (General Jurisdiction)
Status: Pending

Future Hearings

08/22/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/15/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMEN AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

08/23/2012 at 08:30 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012 (was 5/16/2012)
Status Conference (RE MOTIONS IN LIMINE AND PRE-TRIALMOTIONS)

04/08/2013 at 08:32 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Final Status Conference

04/22/2013 at 09:00 am in department 89 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Jury Trial (10 WEEKS)

filing 2006
    trial 2013

lucky 7



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 19, 2012, 10:40:37 AM
THE INVOLVEMENT OF DEEPAK KALPOE

Peter Devries

Cracking the Holloway Case?
Feb 7, 2008 7:00 PM EST


De Vries spoke to NEWSWEEK's Catharine Skipp about the case and his role in it to date.

<snipped>

NEWSWEEK: Do you believe that the Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were involved in any way?

No, not at all.  On the tapes Joran calls them stupid.  I don't believe they were involved.

<snipped>

http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260/page/3


Beth Holloway

NANCY GRACE
Aired August 26, 2005 - 20:00:00   ET


BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, MOTHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: We`ve known from day one Deepak and Satish Kalpoe are way deeply involved in this.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/26/ng.01.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 11:48:32 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 12:11:03 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563135080&ref=pb

Valentijn van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274729_563135080_1291115583_n.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201204-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 12:43:19 PM
Photo at link.  Peter R. de Vries receives the 2012 Forget-Me-Not Award.

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/nieuws/peter-ontvangt-unieke-vergeet-me-niet-award/

Google translation

Friday, May 18, 2012, 15:51 hours
News
Peter receives unique Forget-Me-Not Award
Corrie van Buuren praises Peter for his years of dedication

Friday was Peter from the hands of Corrie van Buuren and Missing presenter Jaap Jongbloed the Forget-Me-Not Award 2012 awarded. Peter received this award for his energetic, tenacious attitude in numerous murder and missing cases.
 
"Thanks to you, by your determination, we have the place where Marion and Romy found buried," said Corrie van Buuren in an emotional speech. "After all these years a very special working relationship. Even after the discovery of Marion and Romy have you done much for us. We are very grateful for you. "
 
Unforgettable moments
Peter called it a "great surprise" that he just got the prize awarded. "I'm very proud of this award," he responded. "It has extra meaning for me that just handed Corrie van Buuren this. We have many memorable and touching moments with each experienced in the time I was working with the disappearance of her daughter Marion and her granddaughter Romy. We still have regular contact and it makes me so much that she spoke to me so beautiful. Then you just have a lump in your throat. This price will absolutely a beautiful place in my home. "

"I find it great fun to 'Missing' awarded me this prize," continued Peter. "Twenty years ago my television career began with Jaap Jongbloed, when we were together the first crime magazine" Crime Time ". I'm there with a lot of fun back then and it is natural that its special program gives me this award. "
 ::snipping2::
Eleventh award
Each year they award Corrie van Buuren, as an ambassador of the Missing Foundation, the award from. The Award, which in 2002 was first issued, serves as encouragement for those who make themselves useful in detecting and preventing disappearances. Since 2002, the Forget-Me-Not Award eleven times awarded. Images of the ceremony on 25 May in the broadcast of Missing screened, around 21:30 in the Netherlands 1.
 
Marijke Kuin
Editorial Peter R. de Vries

So glad to see this, he deserves it!   ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/nieuws/peter-ontvangt-unieke-vergeet-me-niet-award/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/05192012_PRDV_ForgetMeNotAward.png)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/05192012_PRDV_ForgetMeNotAward2.png)

 ::MonkeyHeart::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 12:53:28 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563135080&ref=pb

Valentijn van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274729_563135080_1291115583_n.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201204-1.jpg)

Central Park?

No mention of working as an intern for ESPN or whatever it was.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 01:28:43 PM
Boston

http://www.planetware.com/picture/boston-us-ma468.htm

No shrubs around it in the recent picture but I think it's the same statue.





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 19, 2012, 02:29:56 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563135080&ref=pb

Valentijn van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274729_563135080_1291115583_n.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201204-1.jpg)

Central Park?

No mention of working as an intern for ESPN or whatever it was.

Talent & Specials Department at Comedy Central


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 02:40:59 PM
Boston

http://www.planetware.com/picture/boston-us-ma468.htm

No shrubs around it in the recent picture but I think it's the same statue.





Yep, that's it.  Boston..makes sense.  Is he taking classes still?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 02:41:35 PM
Jamcakes - yeah, Comedy Central..that's it


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 02:55:55 PM
Boston

http://www.planetware.com/picture/boston-us-ma468.htm

No shrubs around it in the recent picture but I think it's the same statue.





Yep, that's it.  Boston..makes sense.  Is he taking classes still?

This graduation would have been his undergraduate, no idea if he will go into a graduate program now in his field or not.  If not, I guess he's finished with classes.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 05:09:31 PM
Koen's new girlfriend. 

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=729896308

In a Relationship with Katie Grace Bryant
March 31, 2012

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Gottenbos/05192012_Koen_KatieBryant.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/katie.g.bryant

2011   
Graduated from Virgil I. Grissom High School

Studying Communications at Young Harris College
Lives in Young Harris, Georgia
From Huntsville, Alabama
Religious Views: Methodist

From her photos:

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Gottenbos/05192012_Koen_KatieBryant2-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 05:35:43 PM
Koen has been putting on the pounds.  Katie looks like a nice girl.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 05:58:57 PM
Koen has been putting on the pounds.  Katie looks like a nice girl.

Yes she does, maybe she doesn't know who he is? 

I've wondered if Joran's murder conviction didn't have something to do with his losing his last girlfriend.  They were together a long time.  I've been thinking maybe he didn't tell her the truth about his friendship with Joran, if he acknowledged it at all?

 ::MonkeyNoNo::





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 07:00:29 PM
I wanted to test it out first to make sure it looked ok.  Looks pretty good on the smaller mug (I ordered one) although hard to see avatars due to how tiny they are.  This is the small mug.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup1.jpg)


Here is the store  ::MonkeyCool::  I hope I haven't missed anyone but I can always modify the photo if necessary.  What do you think?  Zero markup on these. 

http://www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 19, 2012, 07:13:48 PM
I think it's awesome, Klaas!   ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 19, 2012, 10:48:39 PM
Thanks, Klaas!  It looks beautiful!  ::MonkeyCheer4::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 19, 2012, 11:00:11 PM
Glad you like it!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 20, 2012, 12:15:28 AM
Guess we missed out on the boa derby on One Happy Island.   ::MonkeyCool::

http://arubaherald.com/local/2518-one-hundred-thirty-eight-boas-caught.html

One hundred thirty-eight boas caught
Saturday, 19 May 2012 15:53

Arikok National Park organized a "boa derby" from April 16 through May 16. The park reports 138 boa constrictors were brought in, which is triple of what they received last year. They paid Afl. 10 per live boa received. Park employee Salvador Franken explained that people island-wide brought in the snakes and the park was considering to host another derby in October/November.
 
The person who brought in the most snakes is Timotheo Koolman. The man, who lives in Maria Maai brought in one snake more than last year for a total of 27 boas, including the largest boa, which was 2.20 meters long. Mr. Thomas from Noord brought in19 snakes and Mr. Philip, also from Noord, brought in 12 snakes. Mr. Koolman explained that he has caught almost 400 snakes since they began showing up around his house in 2005.  ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 20, 2012, 12:55:55 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/111852-verzoek-tot-getuigenverhoor-in-domino-zaak

Google translation

"Request for witnesses in Domino case '
Saturday, May 19, 2012 9:01

ORANGE CITY - The Tuesday paroled Luis Mansur next week should a request for a preliminary examination of witnesses. He wants to key figures in his case heard under oath. He focuses on (former) ministers, MPs and the Public Prosecutor (OM). Mansur in 2008 was sentenced to seven years in prison for his leadership in the Domino case (drug trafficking).

He has served two thirds of his sentence and probation this week left. Mansur would give a press conference Monday, but left by lawyer James Martin & Associates know that he first requested to submit a so-called witnesses. In a first reaction late acting Attorney General Peter Blanken Amigoe that about two weeks ago, a letter of complaint received Mansur, but that the abuses mentioned in the letter is factually incorrect.
 
In the press release from the law states that "Mansur will request key figures in his case - including (former) ministers, parliamentarians and members of the OM - under oath. In this way, Mansur 'the truth to light "about his case in the so-called Domino case. The case involved an extensive criminal network that bulk drugs to Aruba and other countries in the region smuggled and trafficked. Mansur believes that during the investigation in this case, which took place between 2005 and 2007, legal rules have been violated and that this is an increasingly common phenomenon on the island.
 
'In fact incorrect'
Acting Attorney General Peter Blanken late this morning that the new press release for him. He said two weeks ago that he has received a complaint letter of Mansur, who argues that former prosecutor French Deutekom of the investigation against him would be launched to dubious reasons. From Deutekom would have been family friend of the then Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP) and in 2005 his research have been mandated to start. That would have been after Mansur had refused to pay money to the partijkas of MEP. Whites: "I saw him two days later responded that the allegation is factually incorrect. From Deutekom took the case because only in 2007 Amalin Flanegin officer who retired. Deutekom of the file then had about five to six months in the hands. The study in 2005 by another Dutch public prosecutor launched, based on an earlier study, "said Whites. "I find it bizarre that he is now with such accusation.  ::snipping2::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 03:01:04 AM
Amalin Flanegin - Koen Gottenbos, was thinking about that today...

Frans van Deutekom - Luis Mansur, not sure I even want to go here.  Was/IS Deutekom really "Dirty Hand", good friend of Paulus, Ben King, and ALSO Nelson Oduber?  Or does this recent news in some way explain why we were being told all of that?  Considering Joran's status at this point, and Paulus - no more; I'm not sure I even care enough to try to figure it out.  If it was and/or IS, they will all get theirs in due time.  It does seems odd to me that Luis Mansur waits until he is getting out of prison to say anything about it! 

Didn't Paulus represent one of the suspects in the Domino case?

I know I remember him arguing against the wiretapping...at some point.

 ::MonkeyConfused:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

jmo 

If anyone's interested, this is one of the articles about the Domino case from the Murder & Crime thread

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=188.msg384525#msg384525




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 20, 2012, 03:02:07 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.


 ::snipping2::



The blonde girl is Jorans cousin Natalie Den Boer.

Woman in pink jacket on left is an Aunt I think - she was at airport when Joran was first released from KIA.
(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg853/scaled.php?server=853&filename=joraninholland.jpg&res=landing)





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 20, 2012, 03:05:25 AM
I wanted to test it out first to make sure it looked ok.  Looks pretty good on the smaller mug (I ordered one) although hard to see avatars due to how tiny they are.  This is the small mug.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup1.jpg)


Here is the store  ::MonkeyCool::  I hope I haven't missed anyone but I can always modify the photo if necessary.  What do you think?  Zero markup on these. 

http://www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Klassend I love it so much I'm going to order some.




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 20, 2012, 03:06:42 AM
Anita looks like she is going to a luau.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 05:40:50 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.


 ::snipping2::

The blonde girl is Jorans cousin Natalie Den Boer.

Woman in pink jacket on left is an Aunt I think - she was at airport when Joran was first released from KIA.
(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg853/scaled.php?server=853&filename=joraninholland.jpg&res=landing)


I think the one in the pink jacket is Anita's mother, and the other woman with glasses is Anita's aunt Hanni Peters-den Boer; the man is her husband Berry Peters. 
Hanni and Berry are the parents of Anita's cousin Maiko Peters.

https://www.facebook.com/berry.peters

(Not sure about this, but I think Hanni may be a sister of Anita's mother, Trudie Hugen?)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8176.msg1175754#msg1175754
(http://i438.photobucket.com/albums/qq107/HOPE8789/VDSkidsGrandma.jpg)

I don't know who the blonde girl is, but I don't think it's Natalia Den Boer.  jmo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 05:42:21 AM
Anita looks like she is going to a luau.


Yes, she does.   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 05:43:22 AM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Natalee_2005.jpg)


Justice for Natalee!  

 ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 20, 2012, 08:08:26 AM
Anita looks like she is going to a luau.


Yes, she does.   ::MonkeyHaHa::



I see her on a big platter with an apple in her mouth, luau style   ::piggy:: 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 20, 2012, 10:56:05 AM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)

Klaas

The mugs are are great!!  What about a Monkey Justice Train poster?

Janet




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 20, 2012, 11:41:23 AM
Added a couple of small posters and a framed tile:

www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 20, 2012, 11:59:21 AM
Added a couple of small posters and a framed tile:

www.cafepress.com/justicetrain

 ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 20, 2012, 03:09:37 PM
texasmom, you may be correct. This is the photo I have marked as Natalia den Boer and it was in my folder of Joran's facebook so I can't remember, but I must have copied it when I was in his fb. I do recall that she posted to him on his fb as well as he remained friends with koen.


(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg577/scaled.php?server=577&filename=nataliadenboer.jpg&res=landing)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 20, 2012, 03:23:25 PM
btw, Miss Texasmom,
you never fail to impress with your investigative ability and piecing the pieces together.

 ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 03:30:50 PM
Looking for something else...came across this.

From February 2010

The day after Paulus died, three and a half months before Stephany was brutally murdered.

I know we've talked about at least one of the comments here, but not sure how much of the conversation was posted. 

It still makes me mad to read it.   ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyMad::

https://www.facebook.com/julliarenfro

Julia Renfro
February 11, 2010
Nasty Grace is awful!
52 Comments · Share
7 people like this.

Julia Renfro she is such a liar
February 11, 2010 at 7:01pm · Like

Julia Renfro Beth Twitty is a liar and she knows I know!
February 11, 2010 at 7:02pm · Like

Marlene Nichols so glad I don't have cable and have to listen to her! Please tell me she is not bashing "p" already!
February 11, 2010 at 7:11pm · Like

Julia Renfro Yes, and Ms. Beth lying through her teeth about him. :(
February 11, 2010 at 7:12pm · Like

Marlene Nichols that is so not Cool!
February 11, 2010 at 7:14pm · Like

Renée Gielen Nancy Grace - CNN Headline News (Tonight)
Breaking News! Could the death of the former main suspect's father finally lead to answers in the Natalee Holloway case? Joran van der Sloot's biggest defender, his father Paul Van der dloot, died yesterday. Without his father's protection, will Joran van der Sloot finally tell the truth about the night he was last seen with Alabama girl Natalee Holloway? Nancy Grace has the latest details every night at 8 & 10 PM E.T. on HLN.
http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/nancy.grace/
February 11, 2010 at 7:49pm · Like

Jeffrey L. Nolen I believe in olden days Nancy Disgrace would steal the coins off a dead person's eyes, there is no excuse for this ignorance,
February 11, 2010 at 7:53pm · Like

Peter J. Smit Julia, back on track?
February 11, 2010 at 7:53pm · Like

David Cousins Now I'm curious... What 'lie' did Beth tell???
February 11, 2010 at 8:23pm · Like

Julia Renfro Everything she said was a lie, I was there and she knows that I know she is lying. Phooey
February 11, 2010 at 8:25pm · Like

David Cousins You were there??? ..... Where???.... C'mon, tell me.
February 11, 2010 at 8:29pm · Like

Jeffrey L. Nolen So in the liar liar pants on fire department, Natzi Disgrace's pants are burning in hell right now,
February 11, 2010 at 8:33pm · Like

David Cousins She's (was) a lawyer!! What else is new?
February 11, 2010 at 8:37pm · Like

Wendy Terry Does David not know the lies?
Is Nancy disGrace dragging the innocent into this?
And yes I do mean Paulus's family beside Joran... I am so glad I cannot be plastered to a TV right now. Oh ugh.
February 11, 2010 at 9:26pm · Like

Julia Renfro Wendy.... Many people believe what the see.
February 11, 2010 at 9:27pm · Like

Wendy Terry Girl, trust me I know. ENOUGH OF THE BS ALREADY lmfao
February 11, 2010 at 9:46pm · Like

Julia Renfro Heard that one before Wendy!
February 11, 2010 at 10:17pm · Like

Jill Thornton can't stand the woman!!!!!
February 12, 2010 at 12:10am · Like

David Cousins Well.... i'll ask again... What Lies??.... I mean, actually tell me one that she (Beth or Nancy) said... And BTW I don't care for Nancy Grace at all!...... (and generally, yes, I do believe what i SEE... not everything I hear....or Read...You know..."seeing is believing")
February 12, 2010 at 2:12am · Like

Wendy Terry Seeing on TV? Is not believing!! ;)
February 12, 2010 at 4:41am · Like

Julia Renfro Dave.... Ms. Beth lied straight out saying that Paul lied about the events of the night Natalee went missing. Paul never changed his statement from his first words until his last. She made that up to cast an air of guilt upon him and the US media ate it up. Paul was investigated and exonerated from any participation in the N.H Case other than being the father of Joran.
February 12, 2010 at 6:14am · Like

David Cousins There were a whole shitload of lies from what I remember coming from Paul's (RIP) "Punk ass" son Urine, and the authorities here followed everything he told them, starting with picking up 2 random innocent guys in San Nicholas and unjustly plastering their faces all over the news even after the hotel video proved that it was a lie! And he changed his story ump-teen times and they were led around by the 'nose' pretty much by everything that punk told them.
And Wendy, If I see that N.Grace is wearing a red dress on tv, then I pretty much 'believe' that it's a red dress...I don't necessarily believe the crap i 'hear' coming out of her mouth, or the words they splash on the screen... Therein lies the difference between 'SEEING', and hearing or reading
February 12, 2010 at 10:30am · Like

Wendy Terry Sounds about right to me David ...
February 12, 2010 at 10:38am · Like

Charles Croes Well well David, I am amazed at your insight. By the way, were you here? Did you see what was happening? did you ride around in the car with the family for countless hours and listen to truckloads of informaton. Are you the one that was interogatted 7 SEVEN count them 7 seven times? Was that you Mr. Cousins? Must be because it then explains the elequent manner in which you share your insight. I(t is possible to be insulted by some of the comments that we read, however good-ole-country-boy David and I are above that. We walk on an etheral level that allows us to use words attatched to the description of others such as "Punk-Ass" URINE. As I look up to you, I realize you are on a podium and I (in the friendliest manner possible) suggest that you come on down - pleasde don't trip. This world is a better place for you being in it.
CHARLES CROES GOOGLE it David - GOOGLE it.
February 12, 2010 at 3:16pm · Like

Charles Croes Paul died of a heart attack. The worse kind you can have. Most probably not of fatty foods or of smoke and drink but he died of a heart attack... or is it heart failure ... or perhaps a broken heart. Know this - he died long before his heart did and I for one feel very sorry for him. May your god give you the peace that your own blood did not give you here.
Charles Croes
February 12, 2010 at 3:22pm · Like

Julia Renfro Dave... I love you! I'm going to agree with Charles. I can't defend Joran for what he has done or said, but I'm sure you've pulled a "It wasn't me" on more than one occasion. There is not one shred of evidence that Joran harmed N.H. But I can tell you for a fact that Ms. Beth and one of her X husbands named Jug... Lied through their teeth many, many times. And have earned millions of dollars off the hearts of the people from "One Happy Island".
February 12, 2010 at 3:23pm · Like

Charles Croes Wanna keep a show on the air, well then, steal a baby, sell a baby, kill your child, shoot the other students in the school and say - "Well shucks mom, get me outta prison. I just am so sad" Then - and only then will the red dressed Grace of God come down and find you interesting. After the blood saxcrifice, you are a mere memory on a pile of junk. BUT in our case, some good old folks decided that sacrificing a tiny little island wasn't all that bad. Well Guess what, all that bad press pushed our name into the limelight and it has given me the opportunity to say (whenever I travel) Yes I am from Aruba and can you believe all that hype they made? Ahh well, from all of us, we truly and honestly hope you come down and visit us because we all know that a civilization does not pay the price for the crime of one man. If it were so, then BMW and mercedez would not exist. Think about it.

JULIA - you and I are in a rather unique position. No one will know what we went through - you are a nutty and intelligent gal - but man you were the best in a time of crisis. god bless you lady.
Charles
February 12, 2010 at 3:33pm · Like

Julia Renfro Thanks Charles, so true. One day the truth will come out. :( In my eyes 2 days too late.
February 12, 2010 at 3:43pm · Like

Taylor Brown Totally true Charles...When I moved back to the states from Aruba, people were always harassing me because I lived in Aruba. Some people even thought I was involved.
February 12, 2010 at 3:43pm · Like

Wendy Terry They were saying the entire island was involved, ie covering for Joran. I hope that shit doesnt start again.
February 12, 2010 at 3:46pm · Like

Taylor Brown That shit better not start again...We might as well say that when a murderer in the United States gets free, that the entire people of the United States are covering for that person.
February 12, 2010 at 3:48pm · Like

Charles Croes Taylor, do not miss the opportunity to let them know that you are involved. You were fortunate enough to live on a spit of land that is multi racial, multi lingual, has tourism, has industry, the schools teach 4 languages as mandatory and on top ot that, we have the manners to listen to people place inproper blame on us and say - I understand. Di berdad - Mi ta compronde... Tell them that Taylor Brown and hold yourself tall when you do
February 12, 2010 at 3:48pm · Like

Charles Croes Maybe 2 edays late is the right thing. I love the exposure we are getting. It beats that dumb commercial about Aruba. Man, this is action stuff!! Kind of like Miami Vice or something along that line.
Revel in the exposure and laugh at the inane lies.
February 12, 2010 at 3:50pm · Like

Taylor Brown Charles, I always stand up for myself. I do not allow anyone to disrespect my home town and all my "90,000" friends of Aruba.
February 12, 2010 at 3:51pm · Like

Wendy Terry You go girl
February 12, 2010 at 3:58pm · Like

Charles Croes Wendy, this is the scene they saw in their minds:
90,000 people meet in a cave on the North coast of the island and work out an elaborate plan on how to fool an equal amount of cops, dogs, jets and god knows what else. the plan is .... Keep it simple and don't tell anyone. then they all took an oath of silence and all 90,000 have not said one word and have sworn their new born children to the same. the person heading the meeting was the GRACE of GOD herself and she explained that this was needed so that her ratings would not plummet. Her sponsors gave everyone a free cookie (keep the natives happy)
February 12, 2010 at 4:05pm · Like

Charles Croes Never fails - the private messages numbers are rising and most are not friendly.
Be well all and have a safe carnival week-end
charles
February 12, 2010 at 4:11pm · Like

Charles Croes Got your message Wendy. Thanks very much and keep on supporting us.
c
February 12, 2010 at 6:08pm · Like

David Cousins Whoa! what did I miss!!!..... Hey Charles, I was asking about what lies (Specifically) & I still got no answer. I then pointed out the fact that "Yoran" ( i spelled it "Urine" before, sorry no offense to anyone else) sent the authorities to San Nicolas to pick up 2 innocent people with a LIE! He had a chance to "Man-up" and do the right thing, but he "Punked out" with a string of lIES! (correct me if i'm wrong) And Mr. Croes, It's nice to know that you think i, along 'with you', "walk on an etheral level", but...sorry, you're wrong. i simply walk on the planet....That leaves just you i guess..... People, when someone goes missing, there takes place what's known as an "investigation" that is where people get "interrogated". And usually if you ONLY get interrogated, (be it one or seven times) and not convicted, then consider your self lucky!
And, anyone that misconstrues what i say as 'Anti-Aruba' then you are totally 'delusional', as i have lived here for the better part of 17 years...why??... because i LOVE it! Plus the fact that there's nothing that I've said to imply that! ( those "Anti- Aruba people are delusional themselves)
People, everyone lies! But what's getting lost in the shuffle is the fact that 2 people are gone.
My compassion goes out to the families of Paul Van Der Sloot & Natalie Holloway...May god rest their souls.
And Charles, I am NOT on a podium!!! I'm on Facebook!!! Like you :-) peace to everyone!
February 13, 2010 at 11:27am · Like

Charles Croes
thanks David. I will sleep tonight kowing this.
c
February 14, 2010 at 12:52pm · Like

David Cousins Ahhh!!! the juicy sarcasm continues.....
February 14, 2010 at 1:01pm · Like

David Cousins BTW, Charles, you haven't accepted my 'friend' request yet!!!!.... C'MON!
February 14, 2010 at 1:09pm · Like

Julia Renfro The two security guards were not arrested in VAIN. They were suspicious... Ask them yourselves, they know exactly why they were detained. . I'm not going to relive this, but David... You are very much mistaken if you are accusing the Police for Arresting two black men to take the fal, you are being led by the nose by the medial. WE ARE NOT IN AMERICA BABY!
February 14, 2010 at 1:18pm · Like

David Cousins Julia, if you've read my prior posts, then you know i'm not accusing the police of anything!! I pointed out the fact that the main 'suspect' Joran, LIED to the police which sent them to pick up 2 INNOCENT PEOPLE!!!!.... That's what i said.... I NEVER one time mentioned RACE...NEVER...(It's sad that YOU had to go there). Joran gave them that description. The police simply had to follow all leads, as i mentioned before, (if you read it) that's what happens in an investigation!
This is ARUBA BABY.... That much i know... Now please, this still seems to be a delicate subject with alot of strong and passionate opinions, which can (apparently) bring out the worst in people.... Maybe we should drop it???
February 15, 2010 at 12:14pm · Like

Julia Renfro Consider it dropped! :) Party on.......
February 16, 2010 at 11:01am · Like

Charles Croes Damn Julia, you dropped it on my foot
charles
February 17, 2010 at 2:20pm · Like

Julia Renfro Sorry CC... Feel free to carry on. Stand for something, or you will fall for anything! I rode out the storm, I'm still standing.
February 17, 2010 at 3:05pm · Like

Renée Gielen stand on Julia, it is not over
February 17, 2010 at 5:42pm · Like

Julia Renfro I'm still standing on what I know to be true... I will not allow these idiot television shows to change my mind for one second. Nancy Grace said to me one night on TV, what would you know about racism... "Julia, You are white..." Pot calling the kettle black to say the least.
February 17, 2010 at 5:48pm · Like

Jan Brennan She is one of the most disgusting people in the world. She needs to be muzzled.
February 17, 2010 at 6:02pm · Like

Jan Brennan by the way I was speaking of Nancy disGrace, just to be clear.
February 17, 2010 at 6:12pm · Like

David Cousins Un-Dropped ??
February 17, 2010 at 8:03pm · Like


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 03:38:50 PM
texasmom, you may be correct. This is the photo I have marked as Natalia den Boer and it was in my folder of Joran's facebook so I can't remember, but I must have copied it when I was in his fb. I do recall that she posted to him on his fb as well as he remained friends with koen.


(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg577/scaled.php?server=577&filename=nataliadenboer.jpg&res=landing)


Yes, that's Natalia Den Boer. 

And from my observations she does seem to change her hair color at times.

The blonde in the pictures at Val's graduation just doesn't look like her to me. 

But that's jmo.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 20, 2012, 03:40:32 PM
btw, Miss Texasmom,
you never fail to impress with your investigative ability and piecing the pieces together.

 ::CowboySmiley::

awwww, Thank you!   ::MonkeyKiss::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 20, 2012, 08:07:48 PM
Beth Holloway - Paulus van der Sloot's Changing Stories

Loving Natalee
A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 147-151:  The mission of meeting people and handing out the Ecclesiastes prayer cards and the beautiful colourful bracelets gives me a reason to get up and keep going.  FOX anchor Greta Van Susteren wants to come along, as many of the network reps have done over the past few weeks.  We’re going to the other end of the island today, near the van der Sloot neighbourhood, to ask for information.  And help.

As I reach to put a prayer card into the van der Sloot mailbox, I see someone on the side of the house and call out, “Anybody home?  Hello! You’ve go company! Knock, knock!  Anybody home?”

A man is behind the shrubs against the house.  “I see you there in the bushes.”  He freezes.  “I’m Natalee’s mom.  I just want to give you a prayer card.”

Paulus van der Sloot has to be coaxed out of the bushes like a dog in trouble.  He appears from behind the shrubs and comes to the gate.  I hand him one of Natalee’s prayer cards over the fence.

Surprisingly, he says, “Come in, please.  Stop the cameras, okay?  Stop the cameras.”

<snipped>

No one could have predicted that this encounter would take place.  And if Greta Van Susteren had not been there, I would not have gone inside.

A few days later Paulus is arrested and questioned by Aruban police after they say he changed his story about what time he picked up Joran on the night Natalee disappeared.


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for March 21
updated 3/22/2006 11:28:13 AM ET


<snipped>
 
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, MOTHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY:  ... He had initially told the witnesses that he himself had picked up Joran Van Der Sloot at 4:00 a.m. on the night of the 30th.  But he later changed it about three weeks into the investigation that he did not pick up Joran at 4:00 a.m. on the 30th.  So that was the reason why Paulus Van Der Sloot was arrested.

<snipped>
 
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11959619


Lt. Roy Tromp - Paulus van der Sloot's Changing Stories

February 11, 2009 7:14 PM
Judge Wants Aruba Witness In Court


A judge has asked for sworn testimony from a man who claims he saw a suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway driving with two friends on the night the U.S. teenager was last seen in public, the lead investigator in the case said Friday.

Authorities believe the testimony will support allegations that the suspect, Joran van der Sloot, has given contradictory statements about Holloway's disappearance two months ago, said Lt. Roy Tromp

<snipped>

Tromp, who declined to provide details about exactly what investigators believe happened to Holloway, said that Paul van der Sloot has also changed his account the night Holloway vanished.

"Why should you do that if you are telling the truth?" he said.

<snipped>

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/08/05/world/main763210_page2.shtml


Paulus Van der Sloot - Witness Statements

Name: Paul van der Sloot
Date: 14 June 2005 / 21:10
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Roland Tromp
 Description: witness statement

Name: Paul van der Sloot
Date: 18 June 2005 / 18:30
Pages: 10 (1 Attachment)
Writer/Initiator. Roland Tromp/ Clyde Burke
Description: witness statement

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 20, 2012, 08:08:42 PM
Klaas/Mods

Please delete my post 164.  I messed up on the highlighting.

Thanks

Janet

***got it! (klaas)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 20, 2012, 10:15:58 PM
Thanks for the rebroadcast of that conversation Texasmom. With all the years gone by to serve as a new point from which to view everything.

Still, I see nothing has changed with Julia & Charles. It is who they are... it is how they think.

The best thing Julia could do is hang herself from her porch. Even she has to be tired of hearing herself speak by now.

Charles still comes off as a arrogant misery. Quite the bore. ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 20, 2012, 10:16:10 PM
Hi Carpe!  ::HelloKitty::  I see you up in the rafters.  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 20, 2012, 10:19:01 PM
Hi Carpe!  ::HelloKitty::  I see you up in the rafters.  ::MonkeyCool::

Hey MB! Long time, no see.  ::HelloKitty::  Hope you are well!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 20, 2012, 10:27:20 PM
Hi Carpe!  ::HelloKitty::  I see you up in the rafters.  ::MonkeyCool::

Hey MB! Long time, no see.  ::HelloKitty::  Hope you are well!

I guess we were posting at the same time.  I figure you're never really far away, and you keep an eye on Natalee's thread for any news and new developments.  It's good to see you post.  All is well with the bee.   Thank you for asking.  ::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Dihannah1 on May 21, 2012, 11:09:06 AM
Justice Train to Birmingham - a work in progress......


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain24.jpg)

Too cool!  Since your runnin out of space and I wanna go, Tink can fly next to the plane  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Bearlyhere on May 21, 2012, 11:36:51 AM
I wanted to test it out first to make sure it looked ok.  Looks pretty good on the smaller mug (I ordered one) although hard to see avatars due to how tiny they are.  This is the small mug.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup1.jpg)


Here is the store  ::MonkeyCool::  I hope I haven't missed anyone but I can always modify the photo if necessary.  What do you think?  Zero markup on these. 

http://www.cafepress.com/justicetrain

Great job!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Nut44x4 on May 21, 2012, 05:24:08 PM
Please add me to the Justice Train...it's been a long time coming!!  thanks

OMG Sunny, how could I have miss you!  I was going thru the last couple years of posts and was trying to get everyone but somehow missed you.  You are on it now at the top on the bi-plane.  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain26.jpg)

lol I found me!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Nut44x4 on May 21, 2012, 05:24:47 PM
NICE mug!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 21, 2012, 05:31:33 PM
Justice Train to Birmingham - a work in progress......


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain24.jpg)

Too cool!  Since your runnin out of space and I wanna go, Tink can fly next to the plane  ::MonkeyWink::

You're already on it.  Let me look for a minute and I'll show you were.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 21, 2012, 05:34:39 PM
Dihannah - I added you before I finalized and put you on one of the bench (welcoming committee  ::MonkeyCool:: )  This was the final one:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 21, 2012, 05:35:54 PM
NICE mug!

NUT
- glad you found yourself!  Yours doesn't show up well but it's there.  Had to use one of your older ones or it wouldn't have showed up at all.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 21, 2012, 05:37:13 PM
Thanks everyone!  There are several different items available (at cost) in the store.

www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Blue Moon on May 21, 2012, 06:50:44 PM
I wanted to test it out first to make sure it looked ok.  Looks pretty good on the smaller mug (I ordered one) although hard to see avatars due to how tiny they are.  This is the small mug.

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup2.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cup1.jpg)


Here is the store  ::MonkeyCool::  I hope I haven't missed anyone but I can always modify the photo if necessary.  What do you think?  Zero markup on these. 

http://www.cafepress.com/justicetrain

Cool!   Great job Klaas!    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 22, 2012, 12:59:28 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.

 ::snipping2::

Wonder if this might be the blonde girl?

Val's cousin, Marianne Vandersloot?

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=7185.msg1078406#msg1078406

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_a-1.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA2.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 22, 2012, 02:43:20 AM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 22, 2012, 08:41:00 AM
TM - that looks like a match!  Marianne Vandersloot..


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 22, 2012, 10:51:35 AM
TM - that looks like a match!  Marianne Vandersloot..

Although Marianne van der Sloot, looks quite similar, the girl in the photo looks to be around Val's age.  MvdS looks to be about 10-15 years older, to me.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 22, 2012, 12:32:43 PM
If Sebastian carried less weight he would almost be Urine's twin.  Let's hope he doesn't shed any pounds.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: alagary on May 22, 2012, 12:48:38 PM
Send him a gift, make him feel welcome;
(http://images.footballfanatics.com/productImages/_138000/FF_138425_s.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 22, 2012, 06:28:21 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.

 ::snipping2::

Wonder if this might be the blonde girl?

Val's cousin, Marianne Vandersloot?

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=7185.msg1078406#msg1078406

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_a-1.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA2.jpg)

BUMP   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 22, 2012, 07:20:04 PM
TM - that looks like a match!  Marianne Vandersloot..

Although Marianne van der Sloot, looks quite similar, the girl in the photo looks to be around Val's age.  MvdS looks to be about 10-15 years older, to me.

She's seven years older than Valentijn.

http://www.cdjabrabant.eu/brabantstalent/kandidaten.html

 ::snipping2::

(http://brabantstalent.nl/kandidaten/mariannevds.jpg)

Marianne van der Sloot, plaats 2!
's Hertogenbosch

Naam: Marianne van der Sloot
Geboortedatum: 27-03-1982
Functie: Adviseur bij Public Impact, Kandidaat-raadslid 's-Hertogenbosch, plek 2
Slogan/motivatie: Voor een veilige, zorgzame en bruisende stad, DAAROM CDA!


Google translation:

Marianne van der Sloot, place 2!
's Hertogenbosch

Name: Marianne van der Sloot
Date of birth: 03/27/1982
Function: Consultant at Public Impact, Councillor Candidate 's-Hertogenbosch, location 2
Slogan / Motivation: For a safe, caring and vibrant city, THEREFORE CDA!



http://books.google.com/books?id=8Qob31JGGaMC&pg=PA57&lpg=PA57&dq=Valentijn+van+der+Sloot%2B1989&source=bl&ots=L2v0PMTAWJ&sig=DoOzNXIufgWmjbvqS4yvG9iNys8&hl=en&sa=X&ei=HR28T8_5Gumc2QXC5KSWDw&ved=0CFkQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=Valentijn%20van%20der%20Sloot%2B1989&f=false

Valentijn was born in 1989


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 22, 2012, 07:25:38 PM
If Sebastian carried less weight he would almost be Urine's twin.  Let's hope he doesn't shed any pounds.

It's creepy isn't it.   ::MonkeyEek::

All of the boys were heavier at one time or other when they were younger.

Regardless of his weight, I think he carries just as much, and more than likely the same type  "baggage" as Joran.

He's scary.

jmo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 22, 2012, 08:00:25 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 22, 2012, 09:05:58 PM
If Sebastian carried less weight he would almost be Urine's twin.  Let's hope he doesn't shed any pounds.

It's creepy isn't it.   ::MonkeyEek::

All of the boys were heavier at one time or other when they were younger.

Regardless of his weight, I think he carries just as much, and more than likely the same type  "baggage" as Joran.

He's scary.

jmo
::rhino:: very scary and creepy.  And I believe you are correct about the "baggage", they were raised by the same parents.  IMO, Val might have lucked out with all the attention on Urine, he probably raised himself without much input from his parents.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 22, 2012, 09:13:25 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 22, 2012, 09:46:24 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran

It is my hope that Sebastian and Val have emerged strong from the environment that they were raised and ... are now travelling down a different path in life than their brother ... a different path that is both beneficial to their well-being and the well-being of others.  I pray that good people enter their lives ... good people whose influence is positive.

Imagine what these two young men have experience in the past almost seven years.  There is the baggage that comes from having Joran as a brother as well as the heartbreak that comes from experiencing the death of their father.  Paulus was scum but ... to Sebastian and Val ... he was their beloved father.

Janet
 

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 22, 2012, 10:57:54 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran
Yes he usually does, but there are a few shots of him with some light in his eyes.  No telling what he's seen, heard, or participated in during his most formative years.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on May 22, 2012, 11:45:56 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran
Yes he usually does, but there are a few shots of him with some light in his eyes.  No telling what he's seen, heard, or participated in during his most formative years.
Seabass has always reminded me of "Private Pyle" from "Full Metal Jacket" -- I think the jury is still out on Val. In his old pics -- he was every bit on the way to being as HUGE as Sebastian. I wonder if Val was majorly affected by what he saw the night Natalee was murdered.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on May 23, 2012, 01:25:08 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran
Yes he usually does, but there are a few shots of him with some light in his eyes.  No telling what he's seen, heard, or participated in during his most formative years.
Seabass has always reminded me of "Private Pyle" from "Full Metal Jacket" -- I think the jury is still out on Val. In his old pics -- he was every bit on the way to being as HUGE as Sebastian. I wonder if Val was majorly affected by what he saw the night Natalee was murdered.
I've not really seen the movie, but if Private Pyle is who I think he is, you mean he could snap at any time, a physical resemblance, or both?  Val wasn't affected enough by what he saw since he has had plenty of time to do the right thing and hasn't.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 23, 2012, 02:04:22 AM
How old is Sebastian now?

If the story of Joran severely beating Sebastian is true, I have major reservations regarding the mental stability of Seabass. jmo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 23, 2012, 09:19:52 AM
I think Sebas is 16 or17 now.

Joran:

(http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.185583!/img/httpImage/image.jpg)


Private Pyle:

(http://www.chessville.com/images/Full%20Metal%20Jacket%20i%20DOnofrioVincent.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Puzzler on May 23, 2012, 01:59:09 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 23, 2012, 02:10:14 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)

 :smt078


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 23, 2012, 07:26:34 PM
http://www.24ora.com/internacional-mainmenu-6/47637-gary-giordano-gara-ta-haci-sex-den-garage-na-maryland-#comments

Gary Giordano gara ta haci sex den garage na Maryland    Print    E-mail
Tuesday, 22 May 2012 23:47

(http://www.24ora.com/cache/multithumb_thumbs/b.175.125.16777215.0...images.stories.news.2012.mei.22.giordano_s640x350.jpg)

Gary Vincent Giordano, kende a keda deteni aña pasa aki na Aruba pa casi 4 luna, mientras cu autoridadnan tabata investiga e desaparicion di Robyn Gardner, a wordo culpa di exposicion indecente hunto cu un muhe despues cu polis a haya nan sunu parti patras di un Cadillac Escalade, segun polis na Maryland diamars.

Carol Ann Bock, di 45 aña di edad, procedente di Tennessee, tambe a wordo acusa despues cu polis a wak’e cu su pecho robes mientras cu e tabata drumi den e parti patras di e auto, mientras cu Giordano tabata completamente sunu, di acuerdo cu e Departamento di Polis di Annapolis.

E SUV tabata para riba e di dos nivel di e parking garage Noah Hillman den e districto di Annapolis y polis a ricibi kehonan di un posibel actividad sexual den un auto den e garage, segun e rapport. E incidente a sosode diabierna atardi laat, segun polis.

“Mientras nos ta reconoce cu Sr. Giordano tin un reputacion infame, e aresto na Annapolis tabata un simpel hecho di trabao policial efectivo respondiendo na kehonan di ciudadano”, e comisario di Annapolis, Michael Pristoop a bisa. “Oficialnan a tuma accion rapido y apropia bao di e circunstancianan. Exposicion indecente y otro conductanan ofensivo ta intolerabel.

Dos persona a keha na empleadonan di e garage riba e SUV y ora cu e empleado a localisa e vehiculo, el’a observa e pareha ta brasa, cu e homber cu nada di paña bisti, segun e rapport.

Polis a haya e pareha parcialmente cubri cu un clechi drumi riba un corchon patras den e auto, un di e agentenan a lusanan pa asina haya nan atencion, segun e rapport.
Comentarionan (5)Add Comment
min/maxMustra/Kita comentarionan

COMMENTS:
...
Scirbi pa OMG, May 23, 2012
E guy ki mester ta brother di Joran Van der Sloot.. Danki Dios cu polis a garana sino Dios sa kiko lo a para di e muhersmilies/cry.gif

    report abuse
    +6
    vote down
    vote up



...
Scirbi pa OMG, May 23, 2012
E guy aki ta gewoonweg SICKsmilies/angry.gif

    report abuse
    +5
    vote down
    vote up

...
Scirbi pa Mahalia, May 23, 2012
Double reverse facepalm. E hecho cu e homber aki lo haci su cosnan den un SUV den un parking garage ta papia hopi di su character. E muhe no ta mucho sabi tampoco.

    report abuse
    +3
    vote down
    vote up

...
Scirbi pa Machete Skerpi, May 23, 2012
Nan a ofrecele su propio reality soap. Mi ta kere cu esey ta e mihor cos cu na por haci pe. He knows what makes women tick. Pone drama Garu, go Gary go!

    report abuse
    -1
    vote down
    vote up

...
Scirbi pa Anna Gomes, May 23, 2012
Mi no tin comentario riba e pareja ya cu tin e dicho " del bagaso poco caso " pero si mi ta haja perfecto.... ta cu prensa hora di duna noticia. sea quien sea , nan nomber completo ta wordo scirbi. Mi no ta comprende pakiko nan ta pone
solamente initial,pensando bon... a lo mejor algun que otro lo pensa bon prome cu hasi algo indebido.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on May 23, 2012, 07:44:05 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)
how old is he? having sex in a car in a  garage on a mattress...speaks volumes about him.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 23, 2012, 09:26:17 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)
how old is he? having sex in a car in a  garage on a mattress...speaks volumes about him.

The article says he's 51.  He's beyond disgusting.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 23, 2012, 10:10:20 PM
Aruba has the highest income tax rate in the world  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.kpmg.com/global/en/whatwedo/tax/tax-tools-and-resources/pages/individual-income-tax-rates-table.aspx


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 23, 2012, 10:24:58 PM
Aruba has the highest income tax rate in the world  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.kpmg.com/global/en/whatwedo/tax/tax-tools-and-resources/pages/individual-income-tax-rates-table.aspx

Canada is catching up.

 ::MonkeyNoNo:: 




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 23, 2012, 11:17:06 PM
What a nice award for Peter deVries!  A pretty good photo at that link, too.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Wouldn't it be neato burrito if Peter came to Alabama for the trial so Anna could have a photo op and perhaps Miss Anna could talk him into movn' to America!



Yes!!!    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 23, 2012, 11:27:53 PM
I think it's awesome, Klaas!   ::MonkeyDance::

It's all terrific, Klaas!!!   Love the tote, tile, and tote as well ... looks wonderful.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 24, 2012, 12:22:59 AM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)
how old is he? having sex in a car in a  garage on a mattress...speaks volumes about him.

Well, yes. He is a gigoondo nut bar... I remember.  ...but what is even more intriguing to me, he found a "date".

He was in the spotlight for weeks upon weeks. Where did this woman come from? She won the Darwin for 2012!!!! ::MonkeyDance::

Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee... COME ON DOWWWWWWN!!!!

She needs to make a little speech.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 24, 2012, 12:28:49 AM
I think it's awesome, Klaas!   ::MonkeyDance::

It's all terrific, Klaas!!!   Love the tote, tile, and tote as well ... looks wonderful.

Yes, Klaas! I've been meaning to compliment you on the art design. It looks like it took some time. Fantastic job!!! ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 24, 2012, 12:52:09 AM
Thanks Carpe!  Thanks Ono!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on May 24, 2012, 02:58:27 AM
What a nice award for Peter deVries!  A pretty good photo at that link, too.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Wouldn't it be neato burrito if Peter came to Alabama for the trial so Anna could have a photo op and perhaps Miss Anna could talk him into movn' to America!



Yes!!!    ::MonkeyCool::


 ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: crazybabyborg on May 24, 2012, 03:01:38 AM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/274336_759158169_1910391010_n.jpg)

IMO Sebastian has the same dead eyes as Joran

 :smt045 and when he's not squinting, one is even wonky like Joran's.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 24, 2012, 03:58:38 PM
What a nice award for Peter deVries!  A pretty good photo at that link, too.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Wouldn't it be neato burrito if Peter came to Alabama for the trial so Anna could have a photo op and perhaps Miss Anna could talk him into movn' to America!



Yes!!!    ::MonkeyCool::


 ::MonkeyDance::

He'd prefer living down here near our gorgeous sugar sand beaches & sky blue waters ... just sayin' ... LOL ... Anna can come visit.    ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 24, 2012, 04:53:56 PM
I think it's awesome, Klaas!   ::MonkeyDance::

It's all terrific, Klaas!!!   Love the tote, tile, and tote as well ... looks wonderful.

Those posters are neat for matting & framing ...   ::MonkeyCool::   Perfect in little black frames ... near the computer.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 24, 2012, 06:25:04 PM
How old is Sebastian now?

If the story of Joran severely beating Sebastian is true, I have major reservations regarding the mental stability of Seabass. jmo


(http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg51/scaled.php?server=51&filename=12152010sebastianporn.jpg&res=landing)
They are all just like their dear old dad.




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 24, 2012, 06:26:23 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)
how old is he? having sex in a car in a  garage on a mattress...speaks volumes about him.

Well, yes. He is a gigoondo nut bar... I remember.  ...but what is even more intriguing to me, he found a "date".

He was in the spotlight for weeks upon weeks. Where did this woman come from? She won the Darwin for 2012!!!! ::MonkeyDance::

Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee... COME ON DOWWWWWWN!!!!

She needs to make a little speech.

ROFLMAO! Carpe!!!

I dunno, she looks a little like Mark Purcells new wife if ya ask me.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 24, 2012, 06:33:24 PM
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/05/22/article-0-133C74C6000005DC-108_306x423.jpg)


(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/05/22/article-2148347-133C6934000005DC-13_634x466.jpg)

When Mister Girodano exited the car his black underwear fell to the ground
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2148347/Gary-Giordano-Only-suspect-Robyn-Gardner-disappearance-arrested-having-sex-parking-garage.html


leaving his little expenditure exposed! HA HA HA HA HA



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on May 24, 2012, 06:47:20 PM
Aliases:
Carol A Bock  |  C Bock  |  Carol A Guntow  |  Carol Ann Guntow
Randy Keith Bock
215 Sanctuary Ct
Springfield, TN 37172-5329
Address History
1 in Springfield, TN
1 in Bumpass, VA
2 in Beltsville, MD


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 24, 2012, 07:29:04 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)

 :smt078

Is Carol Ann Brock a prostitute?

Does the mattress imply that Carol Ann Bock is not the only woman who has had sex in the back of Giordano's vehicle following a pickup?

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 24, 2012, 08:02:49 PM
SELF EDIT - MY LAST POST

Carol Ann Bock is not the woman s/b Carol Ann Bock is not the only woman


Fixed = San


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Blue Moon on May 24, 2012, 08:06:02 PM
Aliases:
Carol A Bock  |  C Bock  |  Carol A Guntow  |  Carol Ann Guntow
Randy Keith Bock
215 Sanctuary Ct
Springfield, TN 37172-5329
Address History
1 in Springfield, TN
1 in Bumpass, VA
2 in Beltsville, MD


OMG, not far from where I live---Really, she is not the "norm" for people in this part of the country.   ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 24, 2012, 10:50:46 PM
I'm not sure that you've seen this before or even if it belongs in this thread (but I know you guys would find this amusing/disgusting):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/22/gary-giordano-robyn-gardner-aruba-indecent-exposure-maryland_n_1537602.html?ref=topbar

Gary Giordano, Robyn Gardner Disappearance Suspect, Charged With Indecent Exposure
Updated: 05/22/2012

(snip)  Around 6 p.m. last Friday, Gary Giordano, 51, was arrested in Maryland when police found him naked in his Cadillac Escalade, the Gaithersburg Patch reported. Giordano and his female companion, 46-year-old Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee, were apparently engaging in sexual activity on a mattress in the car while it was parked in an Annapolis garage.  (snip)
how old is he? having sex in a car in a  garage on a mattress...speaks volumes about him.

Well, yes. He is a gigoondo nut bar... I remember.  ...but what is even more intriguing to me, he found a "date".

He was in the spotlight for weeks upon weeks. Where did this woman come from? She won the Darwin for 2012!!!! ::MonkeyDance::

Carol Ann Bock of Tennessee... COME ON DOWWWWWWN!!!!

She needs to make a little speech.

 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on May 25, 2012, 01:22:43 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/112338-gary-giordano-arrested-for-immoral-behavior-

Gary Giordano arrested for immoral behavior
Wednesday, 23 May 2012 11:30

ORANJESTAD/MARYLAND — Gary Giordano (51), who is still the main suspect in the disappearance and probable death of Robyn Gardner last year, was arrested in the United States last week for ‘immoral behavior’. The police had caught him naked in a car in a parking garage while performing sexual acts with a woman. Both were arrested.The American media made the most of this story.
 ::snipping2::
The American Giordano attracted publicity in August 2011 when his traveling companion Robyn Gardner disappeared without a trace during a holiday on Aruba. He was arrested and detained for several months on suspicion of involvement with her disappearance but was eventually released owing to lack of evidence. This case is still unsolved and Giordano remains the only suspect. Especially in the American media Gardner’s disappearance was linked to the disappearance of another white and blond American female on our island, namely Natalee Holloway, in 2005.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 25, 2012, 10:16:35 AM

(http://www.acc-tv.com/images/globalnews/ppl_hollowaynatalee_1107.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 25, 2012, 10:18:38 AM
I DROVE AWAY WITHOUT KNOWING

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 14-15:
  On Thursday May 26, 2005, Natalee came into my bedroom at three o'clock in the morning to tell me it was almost time to go. Everyone was gathering at a friend's house for the ride to the airport. My job was to pick everyone up at the airport when they returned on Memorial Day, Monday, May 30, 2005.

While Natalee was going to be out of town, Jug was going to his lake house to visit with his family and friends. In our marriage, the second for both of us, we rarely vacationed together. My son, Matt, had made his own plans with friends for the weekend, so it was the perfect time for me to take a much-needed, overdue trip to my family's lake house in Hot Springs, Arkansas. I had not been there in a very long time. Birmingham is about nine hours away, so it was just too long a drive since moving here to make the trip on a regular basis. I was very much looking forward to visiting with my family. Everyone's plans were made.

In the wee hours on this Thursday morning Natalee and I loaded her things in the back of the car and headed off to her friend's house. It was very dark at that hour, and we were both only half awake. But we did talk some. Small talk. We reviewed what she had packed, going through a mental checklist of passport, cash, camera, sunscreen, and the like. When we arrived at her friend's house, she came to life. The adventure she had been excitedly awaiting for months was finally about to begin. She jumped out of the car and bounced to the back to get her bag. I got out and walked around the car to help her. She gathered her things and looked up long enough for me to kiss her on the cheek.

"I love you! Have a great time!" I told her.

She replied, "Bye, Mom! Love you!" and slung her purple duffel bag over her shoulder.

The bag made her walk slightly bent to its opposite side. I got back in the car as she made her way up the long walkway to the front door. Turning the car around to leave, I stopped and looked back over my shoulder to see her go inside. The front door of the house opened just wide enough for her to slip in. I saw her silhouette in the beam of light that shone from inside. The light narrowed as the door closed, then disappeared completely. It was pitch-black again. I drove away not knowing that would be the last time I would ever see Natalee.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 25, 2012, 10:19:44 AM
THE PROVERBIAL DREADED PHONE CALL

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 23:
  Rested and refreshed, we leave Memphis late Monday morning with Linda driving and Marilyn up front with her.  I take the backseat.  We sail along, chatting like we alway do, talking about our plans for another road trip one day soon.  Marilyn and I are happily speculating about what our daughters' reactions will be when they open their presents to find a set of extraordinary Wizard of Oz figures.  Natalee will gasp with excitement when she sees these.  Before we know it, we've crossed over into Mississippi.  Somewhere amid our conversation, between the chuckles and the small talk, my cell phone rings. I don't recognize the number, but answer it anyway, which I usually don't do.

It's a young girl.  "Mrs. Twitty?  My mom ... umm ... my mom, she umm ... wants to talk to you."  It's the daughter of Judi, the travel agent.  She developed appendicitis right before the trip, so she and Jodi didn't get to go to Aruba.  They are in Birmingham.  It seems like an eternity before Jodi takes the phone.

"Tell me what's going on," I say in a voice much firmer than the one I usually hear coming from my mouth.

She simply says, "Natalee didn't show up this morning to get on the plane."

And instantly I know.  It's more than a mother's intuition.  It's certainty.  Something terrible has happened.  I have just answered the proverbial dreaded phone call that no mother or father every wants to receive.  The one we fear from the moment our children are born.  The one that changes a parent's life forever.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 25, 2012, 10:20:35 AM

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Beth_Sept2010_NyPost.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 25, 2012, 10:33:20 AM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8601.msg1237615#msg1237615

Quote from: carpe noctem on September 27, 2010, 10:41:06 PM

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Beth_Sept2010_NyPost.jpg)

Quote
Wubs ya, Beth!

Just keep on doing what you believe to be right.

This case was so full of tin men, cowards, and scoundrels.

Let them continue to self-destruct and fall.

...and you keep on going!


The question was simple...

It's as clear today as it was on day #1.

WHERE'S MY DAUGHTER?

 ::rhino::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 26, 2012, 02:27:12 PM
http://www.abc3340.com/news/stories/0510/741129.html

Talking To Beth Holloway Five Years After Natalee's Disappearance
05/30/10 1:45 pm   |   reporter: Ebony Hall   posted by: Ebony Hall

(http://www.acc-tv.com/images/globalnews/ppl_hollowaynatalee_1107.jpg)

Mountain Brook, AL - It was a story that made headlines across the globe. The search for missing Mountain Brook teenager Natalee Holloway. The story that dominated the airwaves- also took over Beth Holloway's life. She is Natalee's mother, and five years later, she is still looking for answers and hoping Aruban prosecutors can close this case.

"I'm not sure if there is anything new, but they are processing all the leads and the tips that they have received."

Natalee is now presumed dead, but no one knows how she died or why.
We've really tried to be so careful and not to speculate as to what happened an just stick with the known facts."

We do know that Natalee was last seen alive with Dutch teen Joran van der Sloot at Carlos n' Charlie's. Over the years, van der Sloot has told many stories of what happened that night. All the while Beth listened to each of these tales hoping to find a thread of truth.

"I think there was one where he said he sold her alive.I think there was another where he said she fell of a balcony in a swamp. I think now it's become so muddy for me that no my journey for justice is not ended."

It's been five years since Natalee disappeared. Legally, her family could now file for a death certificate in Alabama, but they have not thus far since Natalee disappeared abroad.
"We know that Natalee is no longer alive. I know we had talked about that earlier, few years ago,but it is not something that we have done yet."

Over the years, Beth and her family have learned how to deal with the pain of losing Natalee, but it is still an open wound. In March, a Pennsylvania couple thought they may have taken a picture of a body- maybe Natalee's body- on the ocean floor. News like that- always makes the family hopeful.

"You know I got caught up for a just- you get taken in. But as I said, there is a quicker recovery time where I am able to compartmentalize it and focus on what I can do..."

She is now focused on her new life's work which was born out of the death of her daughter.

"Tragedy creates an opportunity to make a difference."

Making A Difference
Beth Holloway thought she knew exactly who she was more than five years ago.

"My life was defined with two children, a marriage, job and home. When a tragedy strikes, you lose everything."

During the Memorial Day weekend of 2005, Beth's life changed forever. With Natalee missing, she was now the mother of one- not two. She would later divorce her then husband Jug Twitty. So she was no longer a wife. Her life "definition" changed- and with it so did her life's purpose.

"I received the call that all mothers and fathers dread from the moment their children is born- that my daughter was missing."

So now her mission is to help others. Beth tells the story of Natalee's disappearance to high school and college students round the nation as part of her work with the Natalee Holloway Resource Center,which launches in D.C. on June 8.

"The Natalee Holloway Resource Center is focusing on education and crime prevention, and in the event that a loved one goes missing we have the resources and the contacts to assist the families."

Beth says she had no idea who to contact in Aruba when Natalee went missing. She also knew nothing about the Dutch system of Justice or who was in charge. Out of her frustration a new global security and assistance company was born. It's called Mayday 360.

"When I present to these high school and college students, I could give them the personal safety and travel safety message, but I really felt like I couldn't equip them with a real tangible resource. And I feel with Mayday 360, I can because that is real time, real security assistance, 24 hours a day, seven days a week."

She says her definition of herself continues to evolve, but everything she does now can be traced back five years to Aruba- the place where paradise met tragedy. The place that gave birth to her new life's work and hope that..

"No one will ever experience what I did heading home from a family vacation on Memorial Day."







Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 26, 2012, 02:30:44 PM
Seven years has come and gone since Mother and Daughter's final goodbye.

Could it be that a concience will emerge from one who was aboard the Persistance ... one who witnessed the betrayal of Natalee Holloway's family when the ship's Project Lead afforded unchallenged the contents of the trap to the Aruban enemy ... the Aruban ememy who has prevented justice from prevailing since the morning of May 30, 2005?

Janet

++++++

At Any Give Moment

Beth Holloway's Story
The Oprah Winfrey Show  |  March 14, 2008


<snipped>

Despite what authorities have said, Beth says the case of her daughter's disappearance remains open for her family. "We've never really relied on an investigative approach to finding an answer," she says. "I think what we've relied on more heavily is at any given moment something unexpected could happen, and we really feel like someone could talk at any moment."

<snipped>

http://www.oprah.com/world/Beth-Holloways-Story/3

s.t.
Edit-fix typo.  MB


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 26, 2012, 06:09:27 PM
SELF-EDIT - MY LAST POST

unchanged s/b unchallenged
Fixed it.  MB


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 26, 2012, 06:47:29 PM
Thanks MuffyBee

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 26, 2012, 06:48:59 PM
Thanks MuffyBee

Janet

YW Janet.  ::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 26, 2012, 08:47:09 PM
WOW! Memorial Day Weekend 7 years later!

Prayers for Natalee's loved ones!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 26, 2012, 10:20:58 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba?start=20

Google translation:

In short

FRIDAY, MAY 25, 2012 9:02

Too late in a house in a man tried Angochi LA (38) Wednesday to hang himself, but he was found by family members still alive. Despite help from the ambulance and other emergency services, was A. later declared clinically dead.
 ::snipping2::

http://www.awe24.com/20120523/10819/Na_Angochi_famia_a_bin_haya_homber_cu_a_purba_pone_fin_na_su_bida_y_nan_a_kite

Papiamentu translation:

at angochi family owing to come achieve man cu owing to try place end at his life y they owing to kite for of the tree

3 day happen come across, 23 of half 2012 21:46

diaranzon night algo rato first cu 9 or owing to enter informe cu one person owing to try place end at his life at angochi, at once owing to dirigi tanto police because; ambulance at the sitio. at arrival of the patrol owing to come compronde cu one person masculino of 39 year of surname owing to.l. owing to try place end at his life door horca his self bao of one kill, but familiarnan owing to haye at y at once owing to place abao provided that espera of ambulance. but debi cu not was have ambulance available owing to ask the hour ey esun of san nicolas cual was the first for desocupa for bay at the sitio. at arrival of ambulance they owing to achieve they self work enough rato cu the victima first cu owing to transporte cu urgencia for hospital mirando in what situation the victima was. slachtofferhulp also owing to present at the cas! according we can owing to compronde of personal of ambulance cu during cu they was give asistencia ne victima, familiarnan was haci problem y till even wanted owing to fight cu they. ambulance is present for accomplish cu they duty of save life of person y not for molestia y mucho less for make problem. this is assure one caso of lamenta y condena. for locual is the servicio of ambulance they're haci all locual is at alcanse for give one mihor servicio but the minister responsable for salubridad cual is more abroad of aruba cu at aruba self owing to stay stick in time cu aruba was have 50000 inhabitant cu 2 post of ambulance, while aruba owing to casi triplifica in the cantidad of person. minister "wake up" y aggrandize the cantidad of ambulance at keep because so only can save life of person. or life of person not be worth?. come across


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 27, 2012, 09:40:16 AM
1.  No ambulance available?
2.  50k inhabitants?  I thought it was 90k?  Did 40k leave?  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on May 27, 2012, 10:52:58 AM
1.  No ambulance available?
2.  50k inhabitants?  I thought it was 90k?  Did 40k leave?  ::MonkeyCool::

The 40k may be hiding making donkey bone chachkies and leaving them all over the island   ::piggy::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on May 27, 2012, 11:09:03 AM
1.  No ambulance available?
2.  50k inhabitants?  I thought it was 90k?  Did 40k leave?  ::MonkeyCool::

BBM
ARUBA

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/aa.html
 ::snipping2::
Population:
   Field info displayed for all countries in alpha order.
107,635 (July 2012 est.)
country comparison to the world: 190
note: estimate based on a revision of the base population, fertility, and mortality numbers, as well as a revision of 1985-99 migration estimates from outmigration to inmigration, which is assumed to continue into the future; the new results are consistent with the 2000 census
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: nonesuche on May 27, 2012, 12:37:41 PM
I DROVE AWAY WITHOUT KNOWING

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 14-15:
  On Thursday May 26, 2005, Natalee came into my bedroom at three o'clock in the morning to tell me it was almost time to go. Everyone was gathering at a friend's house for the ride to the airport. My job was to pick everyone up at the airport when they returned on Memorial Day, Monday, May 30, 2005.

While Natalee was going to be out of town, Jug was going to his lake house to visit with his family and friends. In our marriage, the second for both of us, we rarely vacationed together. My son, Matt, had made his own plans with friends for the weekend, so it was the perfect time for me to take a much-needed, overdue trip to my family's lake house in Hot Springs, Arkansas. I had not been there in a very long time. Birmingham is about nine hours away, so it was just too long a drive since moving here to make the trip on a regular basis. I was very much looking forward to visiting with my family. Everyone's plans were made.

In the wee hours on this Thursday morning Natalee and I loaded her things in the back of the car and headed off to her friend's house. It was very dark at that hour, and we were both only half awake. But we did talk some. Small talk. We reviewed what she had packed, going through a mental checklist of passport, cash, camera, sunscreen, and the like. When we arrived at her friend's house, she came to life. The adventure she had been excitedly awaiting for months was finally about to begin. She jumped out of the car and bounced to the back to get her bag. I got out and walked around the car to help her. She gathered her things and looked up long enough for me to kiss her on the cheek.

"I love you! Have a great time!" I told her.

She replied, "Bye, Mom! Love you!" and slung her purple duffel bag over her shoulder.

The bag made her walk slightly bent to its opposite side. I got back in the car as she made her way up the long walkway to the front door. Turning the car around to leave, I stopped and looked back over my shoulder to see her go inside. The front door of the house opened just wide enough for her to slip in. I saw her silhouette in the beam of light that shone from inside. The light narrowed as the door closed, then disappeared completely. It was pitch-black again. I drove away not knowing that would be the last time I would ever see Natalee.


Thank you for posting this Janet, it is every parent's nightmare and this holiday weekend must be unbearable each time it passes for this family. I don't think I could survive it.

It's just so poignant..........

One has to wonder if Anita and Aruba ever lost a moment to caring one iota for the loss, only for their own sorry hides.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 27, 2012, 04:09:02 PM

Thank you for posting this Janet, it is every parent's nightmare and this holiday weekend must be unbearable each time it passes for this family. I don't think I could survive it.

It's just so poignant..........

One has to wonder if Anita and Aruba ever lost a moment to caring one iota for the loss, only for their own sorry hides.

Hi none

 ::HelloKitty::

I realize that Beth has been on a personal mission since departing from the Island in August, 2005 ... a mission to rise from "victim to victor" over her circumstances but ... each anniversary which marks that defining point in time when her life changed forever has to be sooo difficult.

Anita van der Sloot?  What can I say other than that woman does not get it.  Even when it about her son's victims ... it is about her.

Janet

++++

Nothing has Remained Intact

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 2
:  Nothing of my life before Natalee disappeared in Aruba has remained intact.  Not my career.  Not my home.  Not my marriage.  My husband, Jug, and I are divorcing after six years.  My son, Natalee's younger brother, Matt, and I are moving in two days.  I have a lot to do.


Anita van der Sloot

Jo-An
Re: JORAN VAN DER SLOOT MURDERS AGAIN?
 « Reply #265 on: June 19, 2010, 09:34:10 AM »


Interview with Anita van der Sloot - De Telegraaf - June 19th 2010

Anita: I now believe that Joran might have done something to Stephany in Peru. Maybe an act of rage? I don't know. I'm very saddened that that businessman Flores lost his daughter, and I my son. That's the way it feels like."

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8032.msg1164835#msg1164835


Transcript: Van der Sloots Speak
Thursday, June 23, 2005


ANITA VAN DER SLOOT, MOTHER OF DUTCH SUSPECT: It's extremely tough. He's in custody now for 13, 14 days, I think. I have lost count. And I love my child. I believe in him 200 percent. And it's just like a big nightmare. We don't know how to deal with it because you can't deal with it. We think about the family a lot because their life is a nightmare but our life is a nightmare, too.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 27, 2012, 05:17:30 PM
I Will Press On

Loving Natalee: A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
by Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Pages 230/231:
  I can't say for sure if we'll ever know that answer to whether my daughter is alive or not.  I know it doesn't look good.  But just as that old metal spiral staircase rose from the ashes when our lake house burned down, so too faith stands strong in the remains of this devastating loss.  And just as my Dad built another house around that staircase, I will build another life around hope and faith.  It won't ever be the same.  But I pray that it will, at the very least, be useful.

The hope that filled Natalee's heart fills mine, and I will press on.  Faith got me up this morning, and faith will see me through tomorrow.  And the next day.  And the next.

Page 232:  Without hope we are hungry. And on a very deep level, desperate. But no one has to be. What's so amazing is that we can feed each other. We can help each other. We have the power to give resilience to others who are fading. We can nourish each other's spirits and save one another from defeat and despair. Every one of us possesses this power to "love thy neighbor," and we need to use it every chance we get.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 27, 2012, 05:24:33 PM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/



www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Frijole on May 27, 2012, 09:32:22 PM
7 years.  Who would have thought?  No justice for Natalee yet but at least he is in prison and there is hope he'll be forced to visit Birmingham.

Happy 7th anniversary monkey friends. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 27, 2012, 09:40:49 PM
7 years.  Who would have thought?  No justice for Natalee yet but at least he is in prison and there is hope he'll be forced to visit Birmingham.

Happy 7th anniversary monkey friends. 

Natalee Holloway's Mom: Aruba Investigators 'Not Following Up on Any Leads'
Wednesday, November 19, 2008

<snipped>

BETH HOLLOWAY: And Greta, I was just wanting to say that, you know, like I said, it's been a long time, but it's never too late for justice. And I'd be good with a "Midnight Express" prison anywhere for Joran.

<snipped

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,454527,00.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 27, 2012, 10:14:23 PM
1.  No ambulance available?
2.  50k inhabitants?  I thought it was 90k?  Did 40k leave?  ::MonkeyCool::

I think they were saying that there were only 2 ambulances when there were only 50,000 inhabitants; and since that has (tripled?) the minister should wake up and realize that they need to increase that number to save lives; or are the lives not worth it?

Quote
in time cu aruba was have 50000 inhabitant cu 2 post of ambulance, while aruba owing to casi triplifica in the cantidad of person. minister "wake up" y aggrandize the cantidad of ambulance at keep because so only can save life of person. or life of person not be worth?.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 27, 2012, 10:16:48 PM
7 years.  Who would have thought?  No justice for Natalee yet but at least he is in prison and there is hope he'll be forced to visit Birmingham.

Happy 7th anniversary monkey friends. 

There's still HOPE for some justice!   ::MonkeyGavel:: ::justice2NJ::

Happy anniversary to you too Frijole!   ::MonkeyCool::

 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kat_Gram on May 27, 2012, 11:26:52 PM
Seven years ? I am surprised ! Thanks for putting my blinkie kitty there !


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Bearlyhere on May 28, 2012, 01:59:14 AM
7 years.  Who would have thought?  No justice for Natalee yet but at least he is in prison and there is hope he'll be forced to visit Birmingham.

Happy 7th anniversary monkey friends. 

Thanks, Frijole.  What an unhappy event that brought us all together.  But together we stand side by side, warts and all (sorry Kermit).

 ::teddybear::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: sharon on May 28, 2012, 06:59:09 AM
 ::justice2NJ::


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5700.0


Please light a candle remembering Natalee and her family's quest for answers.  Since two were created, you may use one or both.

http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=NAH

http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=Nat%27s

 ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: AZSunny on May 28, 2012, 10:43:47 AM
I just realized I have had the same bumper sticker on my car for almost 7 years.  It just says "Find Natalee." and says Aruba with a red cross slash through it.   I have never had a sticker on my car before, but if I have made one person aware of the circumstances, then it was worth it.  I have had many ask me what it is about.   


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 11:01:43 AM
I just realized I have had the same bumper sticker on my car for almost 7 years.  It just says "Find Natalee." and says Aruba with a red cross slash through it.   I have never had a sticker on my car before, but if I have made one person aware of the circumstances, then it was worth it.  I have had many ask me what it is about.   

Hi AZSunny!

 ::HelloKitty::

I still have two rubber Natalee bracelets.  I have not worn them in years but they are precious nevertheless.  About three years ago my then 7 year old grandaughter was rummaging through my jewelry box.  She dropped one of the bracelets and ... our golden retriever Brandi who was lying next to the table must have thought it was people food.  Lickity split she had swallowed it.  Momentarily I was inwardly angry at both of them.

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Nut44x4 on May 28, 2012, 11:54:58 AM
I still have my Natalee bracelet and a monkey mug from way back, although they are packed in storage until (IF) I ever get out on my own again. :(


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 28, 2012, 01:04:46 PM
1.  No ambulance available?
2.  50k inhabitants?  I thought it was 90k?  Did 40k leave?  ::MonkeyCool::

I think they were saying that there were only 2 ambulances when there were only 50,000 inhabitants; and since that has (tripled?) the minister should wake up and realize that they need to increase that number to save lives; or are the lives not worth it?

Quote
in time cu aruba was have 50000 inhabitant cu 2 post of ambulance, while aruba owing to casi triplifica in the cantidad of person. minister "wake up" y aggrandize the cantidad of ambulance at keep because so only can save life of person. or life of person not be worth?.



They only need two. One is for pictures on pamphlets and the other is for driving to get take out food!

Hey Mericano, I'd really like to save you... but first things first: HOW MUCH MONEY YOU GOT? - Dennis Jacobs aka Frosted Flake

Rooba is still Rooba.

The players change - the logo gets redesigned - the awards and ribbons have the new year stamped on them...

...but the song remains the same! We got their number. ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:24:42 PM

(http://www.acc-tv.com/images/globalnews/ppl_hollowaynatalee_1107.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:24:53 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

THE PROVERBIAL DREADED PHONE CALL

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 23:
  Rested and refreshed, we leave Memphis late Monday morning with Linda driving and Marilyn up front with her.  I take the backseat.  We sail along, chatting like we alway do, talking about our plans for another road trip one day soon.  Marilyn and I are happily speculating about what our daughters' reactions will be when they open their presents to find a set of extraordinary Wizard of Oz figures.  Natalee will gasp with excitement when she sees these.  Before we know it, we've crossed over into Mississippi.  Somewhere amid our conversation, between the chuckles and the small talk, my cell phone rings. I don't recognize the number, but answer it anyway, which I usually don't do.

It's a young girl.  "Mrs. Twitty?  My mom ... umm ... my mom, she umm ... wants to talk to you."  It's the daughter of Judi, the travel agent.  She developed appendicitis right before the trip, so she and Jodi didn't get to go to Aruba.  They are in Birmingham.  It seems like an eternity before Jodi takes the phone.

"Tell me what's going on," I say in a voice much firmer than the one I usually hear coming from my mouth.

She simply says, "Natalee didn't show up this morning to get on the plane."

And instantly I know.  It's more than a mother's intuition.  It's certainty.  Something terrible has happened.  I have just answered the proverbial dreaded phone call that no mother or father every wants to receive.  The one we fear from the moment our children are born.  The one that changes a parent's life forever.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:25:09 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

THE LONGEST HOUR OF MY LIFE

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 30 – 31:  We screech to a halt in front of the house and run inside, when I learn friends have secured a private plane.  We need to get to the airport in an hour.  In the bedroom I put a few things in a bag.

People are gathering at the house, but I don’t really notice.  I go into the kitchen and sit on the floor in a corner.  My back is against the glass French doors that lead out to a wooden deck, knees pulled up to my chest.  Macy the dog is right beside me.  She knows something is wrong.  I’m aware that people are staring at me, but unaware how focused I realy am on thinking about what to do.  Now that I don’t have the driving to concentrate on, it’s apparent that I’m in a very unique and unfamiliar state, a very trancelike, deep-thinking zone.  I’m all by myself, but not alone.

Tears roll slowly down my cheeks.  I sit in silence.  Praying.  Praying.  The sounds around me are like the “white noise” on those machines some people use to help them sleep.  I don’t talk.  The others discuss who will accompany me on the plane.  Waiting to go to the airport is the longest hour of my life.

On the way out the front door I grab Natalee’s beautiful senior portrait from the small sideboard in the foyer and reach over and take the one of her in her dance-team uniform off a table in the living room.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:25:29 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

"HELLISH" IS THE ONLY WORD THAT COMES TO MIND

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 31 - 35:  Clutching both portraits, Jug and I drive to the private hangar at the far side of the Birmingham airport.

Having this transportation made available to us so that we can get to the island so quickly is a blessing and a godsend.  If not for this extraordinarily generous gesture, we would have to wait until tomorrow to leave for Aruba.

I have never been on a private plane before.  As we approach the aircraft and walk up the few steps on the ladder and into the cabin I don’t even notice if it’s pretty or special or anything.  I go straight to the back and take a seat away from everyone else.  I don’t want to talk.  Have to think.

No one says much at all on the four-hour flight.

A small radar at the front of the plane shows we’re passing the Bahamas.  Passing Haiti.  The Dominican Republic.  Finally we inch toward a landmass that looks as it it could be the island.  Aruba looks very tiny.  We can do this, I think.  But first we have to find the right authorities.  How hard can that be?

My thoughts begin rushing uncontrollably.  Guilt, second-guessing the decision to let her go on this trip, horror at the thought of where she is and what is happening to her, fear, regret for not adhering to my apprehensions.  These emotions consume me all at once.  It’s frightening.  And paralyzing.  A parent just knows when something is wrong.

What has happened?  My thoughts are unclear, jumbled.  I’m on the edge of panic.  “Take some breaths,” I tell myself.  Mustering my strength, I suck it up and regain mental control.

It’s around eleven o’clock on Memorial Monday night when the island comes into full view.  I’m shocked by its land size.  I had imagined a small exotic island with a few tiki huts bordered by beautifu beaches.  I really don’t know anything about the place of what to expect.  It looks and feels like we’re approaching Atlanta at night.  How will we find Natalee down there?  It's much bigger than what I envisioned.  Overwhelmed and discouraged, again I must quickly refocus.  All the while holding on very tightly to her portraits.

We land, and the door opens.  The heat and the humidity hit me hard in the face even at this hour.  Like opening the oven door and getting that big hot blast.  The wind is whipping.  My hair is all over the place.  I can hardly see the steps to go down.  I soon learn this is how it always is here: very hot and very windy.  “Hellish” is the only word that comes to mind



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:25:50 PM

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Beth_Sept2010_NyPost.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:38:43 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

I FEARED THE WORST BUT PRAYED FOR A MIRACLE

Aruba: The Tragic Untold Story of Natalee Holloway and Corruption in Paradise
By Dave Holloway

Excerpts

Page 6:
  On Monday, May 30, Natalee's trip came to an end, and she was due to fly home to Alabama.  But late in the afternoon, I received a call from Matt telling me that Natalee had missed her flight and that Beth was getting on a plane to Aruba.

Page 7:  Beth had flown out of Birmingham on a friend's private jet as soon as she learned that Natalee had missed her flight.  I contacted a commerical airline and booked the next flight out for 5:30 a.m. the following morning.

Later that night, Matt called again to tell me that Natalee's flight had been rebooked, and she would be coming home the next day.  Someone from Delta Airlines had confirmed that a female had called and changed the flight.

I cancelled my flight, but I was still concerned because no one had heard from Natalee.

The next morning, I started making more calls.  I could not reach Beth, and I was unable to get a member of the Aruban police force to talk to me on the phone about Natalee.

By noon I learned that Natalee was not getting on the plane.  I found out that it had been a chaperone from Natalee's group who had changed her flight in the hopes that she would reappear.  It was then that I knew something tragic must have happened.  I feared the worst, but prayed for a miracle.  I hung up the phone and broke down .....


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 01:38:52 PM
(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l266/californialighthousepics1/j4nbirdi.png)

Carpe - Scared Monkeys



Freebird

If I leave here tomorrow
Would you still remember me?


Lynyrd Skynyrd


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 28, 2012, 01:57:37 PM
I use to write "Boycott Aruba" and "Justice for Natalee Holloway" on all my (dollar) bills.  I wonder if any are still in circulation.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 02:27:31 PM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/



www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 28, 2012, 06:33:08 PM
7 years.  Who would have thought?  No justice for Natalee yet but at least he is in prison and there is hope he'll be forced to visit Birmingham.

Happy 7th anniversary monkey friends. 

Natalee Holloway's Mom: Aruba Investigators 'Not Following Up on Any Leads'
Wednesday, November 19, 2008


<snipped>

BETH HOLLOWAY: And Greta, I was just wanting to say that, you know, like I said, it's been a long time, but it's never too late for justice. And I'd be good with a "Midnight Express" prison anywhere for Joran.

<snipped

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,454527,00.html



Medical mystery tour brings (Beth) Holloway to Okoboji
Saturday, June 11, 2011


<snipped>

"For me, I have a perpetrator in prison, so I can't ask for anything more right now,"  Beth Holloway said. "That's where he belongs and now I'm able to focus and move onward in the help that I can do for others who have missing loved ones -- maybe they don't have recovery of their loved one's remains or they don't have a perpetrator in prison, so my hope is to shed enough light and to help them."

<snipped>

http://www.spencerdailyreporter.com/story/1735599.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Blonde on May 28, 2012, 06:52:05 PM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Natalee/MVC-009Sc-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on May 28, 2012, 11:06:55 PM
At least Joran is now behind bars.  He is terrified of coming to this country because we have the death penalty and he is afraid that some how some way he might end up facing something like that.  He is afraid of something being done to him like he as done to others.

Joran is in one of the worst prisons in the world, living in dread and fear.  Paulus is dead and in an early grave.  It feels like a kind of justice to me.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on May 29, 2012, 01:12:54 AM
At least Joran is now behind bars.  He is terrified of coming to this country because we have the death penalty and he is afraid that some how some way he might end up facing something like that.  He is afraid of something being done to him like he as done to others.

Joran is in one of the worst prisons in the world, living in dread and fear.  Paulus is dead and in an early grave.  It feels like a kind of justice to me.

 ::MonkeyCool::

Oh, Anna...

How I always love to see that in writing. I have seen some pretty surly nappy bastards in my time on this earth. Paul made most of them look like Little League coaches and Boy Scout troop leaders. That lousy sob was one wormy rotten egg.

May Joran follow him. A coward dies 1,000 deaths - it's like dying nine hundred and ninety nine times, you are so miserable & tired by the end, that a little fuzzy tennis ball can knock you right over.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

See ya - would not want to be ya, Van der sloot. ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 29, 2012, 10:47:34 AM
At least Joran is now behind bars.  He is terrified of coming to this country because we have the death penalty and he is afraid that some how some way he might end up facing something like that.  He is afraid of something being done to him like he as done to others.

Joran is in one of the worst prisons in the world, living in dread and fear.  Paulus is dead and in an early grave.  It feels like a kind of justice to me.

~ As always, stated so eloquently, Anna ...

In my view, his most intense fear from the very beginning moments seven years ago, has been the thought of answering to a court in Alabama.   All else, has emanated from this ...   :(


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 29, 2012, 12:42:13 PM


In my view, his most intense fear from the very beginning moments seven years ago, has been the thought of answering to a court in Alabama.   All else, has emanated from this ...   :(

I agree, with a slight exception.

Joran's greatest fear is Beth Holloway.  She has already proven many times just what she is capable of.

 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 29, 2012, 01:38:32 PM

Oh what a tangled web we weave,
When first we practise to deceive

Sir Walter Scott (1771-1832)


From the Moment I Arrived on the Island

Beth Twitty: 'My Daughter Has Been Kidnapped'
Published June 24, 2005


<snipped>

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, MOTHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY:  I think I have made it clear that I have some pretty strong feelings, from the moment I arrived on this island, 11:00 p.m. on May the 30th. In addition to that, May 31st, in the early morning hours between 1:00 and 4:00 a.m., I had even stronger feelings.

<snipped

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160612,00.html


May 30, 2005 - 11:00 PM

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Excerpts

Page 30 -39:
  The students say Natalee got into a silver or gray Honda with a young man who had befriended some of her classmates.  One of Jug’s nephews, Thomas, says he actually met the guy Natalee was seen leaving Carlos ‘n Charlie’s with.  Thomas says this young man’s name is “Gerran or Juran or something like that.”  The last information communicated from the students before they board their plane is that this Joran guy is a tourist from Holland.  And he is staying at the Holiday Inn.

It's around eleven o'clock on Memorial Monday night when the island comes into full view.

We land and the door opens.

We arrive at the Holiday Inn, get out of the van, and go inside the open-air lobby of the hotel.  The coach and DEA agent are to our left, and we turn to walk toward them.     

Following our brief conversation, we all walk immediately to the front desk to ask about someone named Joran who is staying in the hotel and plays in the casino here.  The Holiday Inn night manager, Brenda, knows him by name.  "Oh! yes ... yes ... Joran.  He gambles in the Excelsior Casino here.  He likes to prey on young female tourists.  Especially the blonds.   He is tall.  Good-looking boy.  Like a Dutch marine."   My mouth drops wide open.  "Where is he from?" I ask her.  She replies.  "He lives in Aruba."  I stutter.  "He's ... he's not a tourist just here for the summer?"  "Non, non," she says.  It takes a few moments to absorb this information.  The supposed tourist who befriended some of Natalee's classmates and who told them he was staying at their hotel lied to them.  He isn't a tourist.  He isn't staying here.


May 31, 2005 - 3:00 AM

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts

Page 44 - 47:
  Alberto and Claudio went to the location, looked over the fence, and there it was.  A silver-gray Honda with big tailpipes and fancy features, just as the students had described.  They wrote down the license plate number and address.

At Noord it takes almost half an hour to get uniformed officers to accompany us to the van der Sloot home.

The silver Honda is not there anymore.

The officers sound their horns and sirens for about five minutes before a man answers the door.  He is Joran’s father, Paulus van der Sloot.  He has his cell phone in his hand.  The police ask to see Joran.  Paulus responds that he isn’t home and calls his son to find out where he is.  He tells the police that Joran says he is in a poker tournament at the back of the casino at the Wyndham Hotel.

Again we load up, adding Paulus to this madcap possee riding in convoy with the police to the Wyndham.  The police lead the pack.

We arrive at the Wyndham, and the car barely stops rolling before I jump out …

I run to to the back where Joran told his father he would be and return to the front.  There is no sign of him.

I turn around to see Paulus on his cell phone again.  He tells us that his son is back at their house now.

Everybody is running and running to the cars.  Few Words are spoken.  We arrive to see people standing in front of the house.  They are Deepak Kalpoe and Joran van der Sloot.

Joran and Deepak have supposedly returned from a night of gambling at the Wyndham.  It’s about three o’clock in the morning.  It’s a school night.  They aren’t dressed as if they have been to a casino.  They are in grubby T-shirts and shorts.  I make a mental note that I will ask to see the casino footage from the Wyndham later on.  Just to see if they were really there tonight or, rather, this morning.

Page 121:  And finally we learn from the Wyndham Hotel manager that Joran and Deepak do not appear on their security videos at the time the two claimed to be at the poker tournament there – the same time we were stand in the van der Sloots’ front yard in the wee hours of May, 31.


s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 29, 2012, 02:54:12 PM

There was a time I was under the impression that "intuition" and "hinky feelings" emerged out of a vacuum.  Now I am convinced otherwise.  There are clues ... clues that the mind may not immediately reveal but then a light bulb shines.

Beth's clues?  Natalee's mother shares in her book that she authored with Sunny Tillman ... the book entitled "Loving Natalee: A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Fait.".

Janet

+++++

More than an Intuition

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 23
:  It seems like an eternity before Jodi takes the phone.

"Tell me what's going on," I say in a voice much firmer than the one I usually hear coming from my mouth.

She simply says, "Natalee didn't show up this morning to get on the plane."

And instantly I know.  It's more than a mother's intuition.  It's certainty.  Something terrible has happened.  I have just answered the proverbial dreaded phone call that no mother or father every wants to receive.  The one we fear from the moment our children are born.  The one that changes a parent's life forever.


The Clues

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 34:  A parent just knows when something is wrong.  Natalee has never in her eighteen years exhibited any behaviors that even remotely resemble missing a scheduled time.  I let her go on the trip because she earned it.  She promised to be careful.  Maybe she was too volunerable and naive.  But she is so responsible.  She makes good decision.

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on May 29, 2012, 03:15:19 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/113285-politie-zoekt-twee-vermiste-personen

Google translation:

Police looking for two missing people         

TUESDAY, MAY 29, 2012 10:02

(http://www.amigoe.com/images/stories/thumbnails/images-stories-2012-05-29-1104564-350x220.jpg)
Ernest Ludwig 'Tico' Petronia (74, left) is missing since Sunday afternoon. Jason Patrick van Heyningen (19) ran away from home last Friday.

ORANGE CITY - Ernest Ludwig 'Tico' Petronia (74) is missing since Sunday afternoon and Patrick Jason van Heyningen (19) since Friday. Both people have run away from home. Petronia had attached a suicide note behind.

The stepdaughter of Petronia, Maureen Dirks, announces that he is depressed. This afternoon, a search site including Search and Rescue Foundation Aruba (SARFA), police, friends and family. Previous searches yielded nothing so far. Petronia lives on the Wabistraat 9. When the family Sunday no contact with him was, they warned the police. This found an empty house, and closed with the lights on. The man left a suicide note behind and left without phone and personal belongings such as passport, said Dirks. A neighbor gave him around three o'clock in the Wabistraat seen running away. Subsequently he was last around five hours in Paradise Neighborhood seen near the Maranatha church. In this environment, therefore the search this afternoon. Dirks, who works with the police, says that anyone who participates in the search this afternoon around half past three come together in near downtown Playa Pabao and then start the quest.

On the day of departure Petronia wore a white checkered shirt with color. He is a welcome guest in Paris Manuelitos restaurant and Bar. Police and family are calling for anyone who Petronia after Sunday has seen or knows anything more to contact. This can be with the police by calling 100, Dirks by calling 593-4273 or by calling 594-3194 Nelson Petronia.

Tiene r

The teenager Jason Van Heyningen Friday, May 25 ran away from home. It is not known what he wore on the day of departure. He lives in Primavera 10 by his parents and sits on the afternoon MAVO. The police let further know that Van Heyningen three times arrested and drugs. He speaks Papiamento, Spanish, English and Dutch. Who knows more about him after the Van Heyningen or deliberate on Friday has seen, can also contact the police by calling 100. Calling his father Pedro van Heyningen (565-0952) or mother Piola van Heyningen (732-2466) can also.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 29, 2012, 05:36:17 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/113285-politie-zoekt-twee-vermiste-personen

Google translation:

Police looking for two missing people         

TUESDAY, MAY 29, 2012 10:02

(http://www.amigoe.com/images/stories/thumbnails/images-stories-2012-05-29-1104564-350x220.jpg)
Ernest Ludwig 'Tico' Petronia (74, left) is missing since Sunday afternoon. Jason Patrick van Heyningen (19) ran away from home last Friday.

Tiene r

The teenager Jason Van Heyningen Friday, May 25 ran away from home. It is not known what he wore on the day of departure. He lives in Primavera 10 by his parents and sits on the afternoon MAVO. The police let further know that Van Heyningen three times arrested and drugs. He speaks Papiamento, Spanish, English and Dutch. Who knows more about him after the Van Heyningen or deliberate on Friday has seen, can also contact the police by calling 100. Calling his father Pedro van Heyningen (565-0952) or mother Piola van Heyningen (732-2466) can also.

I wonder if Jason is related to Rene van Heyningen, the guy who was beheaded in the cemetery on the day Paulus was first interviewed as a witness.

HEYNINGEN, Rene Michel van   – partially decapitated man found at cemetery on 6-18-05. Rumored to run the incinerator at the Refinery. It is also reported that he ran the incinerator at Oduber Hospital.  Yesenia Castillo, his wife(?) is reportedly being held in KIA in conjunction with his murder.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on May 29, 2012, 07:33:56 PM
Don't miss the Dana Pretzer show at 9PM ET tonight!

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/Pretzer052912.jpg)



Click on the link below to listen:

http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/radio.m3u


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 29, 2012, 08:48:09 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

Hope Comes and Then Goes

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 35 - 36:  We land, and the door opens.  The heat and the humidity hit me hard in the face even at this hour.  Like opening the oven door and getting that big hot blast.  The wind is whipping.  My hair is all over the place.  I can hardly see the steps to go down.  I soon learn this is how it always is here: very hot and very windy.  “Hellish” is the only word that comes to mind.

We walk a few feet into the processing area to show our passports and go through customs.  It's a small unimportant looking structure with a porch connected to the front of it.  The owner of the plane has arranged for "handlers" to meet us here to assist with customs and ground transportation, common practice when private planes arrive in Aruba.

An official-looking American woman in the processing area draws my attention.  Her badge identifies her as a U.S. Homeland Security Office representative, and I hone in on her like radar.  The sight of her is our fist real sign of hope.  I walk over to her and have to restrain myself from grabbing her by her lapels and pulling her into a hug to thank her for being here for us.  All the calls made to the FBI and the U.S. Embassy by Natalee's brother and our friends must have paid off.  That's why this official person is here to help us.  I get very close to her and begin to tell her about Natalee and what has happened.  Talking a mile a minute, I explain about Natalee's disappearance and our desperate situation.  I ask for her help in figuring out where to start and what to do.

She never changes her stance, remaining in an "at ease" position with her hands behind her back.  She has very little to say; volunteers no information.  The encouraging thoughts that lifted me when I first laid eyes on her are quickly extinuished as I learn that she is always here.  The Aruba airport is her post.  She isn't here for us.  She can't do a single thing to help Natalee.  She has no special powers.  No authority.

This is the first of hundreds of times along this impending tragic journey that hope would dissolve almost as quickly as it would appear.  It would wash over us like the tide, then ebb.  Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to presson in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kat_Gram on May 29, 2012, 10:16:56 PM
Prisons in Peru are ugly places, Alabama must have better conditions.
His friend Mary could visit him, Joe T could be the lawyer and visit him, Mary pays Taco.
But then, he wouldn't be able to have a big screen tv or be able to gamble and pay people to be his friends.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on May 29, 2012, 11:04:59 PM
Prisons in Peru are ugly places, Alabama must have better conditions.
His friend Mary could visit him, Joe T could be the lawyer and visit him, Mary pays Taco.
But then, he wouldn't be able to have a big screen tv or be able to gamble and pay people to be his friends.

Hi Kat_Gram

 ::HelloKitty::

The following article reveals why it would be beneficial for Joran to fight extradition to the States.

Janet

+++++

Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


The prime suspect in the unsolved 2005 disappearance of American Natalee Holloway, Joran Van der Sloot, told a judge on Tuesday that he will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he faces extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

Van der Sloot faces an indictment in the U.S. for allegedly accepting $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead Holloway's mother's lawyer to the body after her disappearance in Aruba.

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

If he stays put, Van der Sloot could be released on parole after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino in May 2010, said Altez.  But if he were convicted in the U.S. he likely wouldn't qualify for early parole in Peru.

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

<snipped>

In an interview with ABC news, Altez stated his belief that in the end Van der Sloot will lose his fight to stay in Peru.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” he said

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on May 30, 2012, 07:57:27 AM


In my view, his most intense fear from the very beginning moments seven years ago, has been the thought of answering to a court in Alabama.   All else, has emanated from this ...   :(

I agree, with a slight exception.

Joran's greatest fear is Beth Holloway.  She has already proven many times just what she is capable of.

 ::MonkeyCool::

Steel Magnolias are blessed with great courage & noble inner strength.     ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: crazybabyborg on May 31, 2012, 09:16:23 PM


In my view, his most intense fear from the very beginning moments seven years ago, has been the thought of answering to a court in Alabama.   All else, has emanated from this ...   :(

I agree, with a slight exception.

Joran's greatest fear is Beth Holloway.  She has already proven many times just what she is capable of.

 ::MonkeyCool::

Steel Magnolias are blessed with great courage & noble inner strength.     ::MonkeyCool::

The above posts make me SMILE and NOD!!   :smt040 :smt045

Beth is such an example of what love can do!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on May 31, 2012, 09:21:40 PM

Joran's greatest fear is Beth Holloway.  She has already proven many times just what she is capable of.

 ::MonkeyCool::

Steel Magnolias are blessed with great courage & noble inner strength.     ::MonkeyCool::

So true.

Beth is one CLASS  ACT!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 01, 2012, 12:50:32 PM
Bubba is looking forward to your stay in AL.

(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w402/jamcakestoo/joranwo.png)



He who laughs last, laughs best.


Bwaaahahaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!


 ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 01, 2012, 09:58:25 PM
And Bubba's a whole lot bigger and 'way tougher than Joran!

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yes, the death penalty in this country scares those born into countries without it terribly.  Since 9/11 there have been laws passed concerning U.S. citizens abroad that have not really been tested so much internationally.  They are still sort of murky as to how and when they apply.  Joran is right to be scared.  Extortion alone carries 25 years so there is no way he is going to see the outside again maybe ever in this lifetime.  Hard to live that long with his personality.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: AZSunny on June 02, 2012, 12:46:38 AM
Bubba is looking forward to your stay in AL.

(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w402/jamcakestoo/joranwo.png)



He who laughs last, laughs best.


Bwaaahahaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!


 ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::

and he is quite literally a man with no balls....welcome to the USA!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 02, 2012, 11:23:22 AM
 ::justice2NJ::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cam.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 02, 2012, 11:27:49 AM
::justice2NJ::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/cam.jpg)

 ::justice2NJ:: ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 12:04:47 PM
Hope

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 145-146: French Philosopher Pierre Teilhard De Chardin is quoted as saying, "We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience." This intuitive and deep reflection of who we are and why we're here on this earth stays with me throughout the course of this tragedy.  And it helps me make some sense out of the madness in this world.  9/11.  War.  The death and loss of children.  A lot of people have a lot of pain to endure.  And one person's life is no more important than another's.  The philosopher's statement reminds me that we're just passing through on this human journey, that that is the hard part, and that there is a promise of more to come.

I think about the sermon delivered by Rabbi Jonathan Miller at Temple Emanu-El in Burmingham regarding Natalee's disappearance.  He said, "Hope is the belief that things can be made right again."  I agree.  It may not be in this lifetime, but one day things will be made right.  And my pain and the pain suffered by all people will end.  I'd have no hope at all if I believed that this human existence was all there was.

  :smt049


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 12:29:08 PM


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/



www.cafepress.com/justicetrain

Welcome to Birmingham Joran!  They will all be there to meet you.  The Holloways ... The Reynolds and ... the Twittys.

Janet

+++++

Joran van der Sloot

'I wanted to get back at Natalee's family - her parents have been making my life tough for five years.'

October 2010

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Van-der-Sloot-true-story-book/zMY1TGGVkU2Kc8LMCiU6pA.cspx

 
Beth Holloway

'If he thinks I've been pestering him for the past five years, he hasn't seen anything yet.'

November 2010

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/archief/de-confrontatie-tussen-beth-en-joran/

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 01:42:19 PM
http://www.rnw.nl/africa/bulletin/peru%E2%80%99s-top-court-oks-joran-extradition-us


Peru’s top court OKs Joran extradition to US

Published on 2 June 2012 - 5:21pm

Joran van der Sloot may, in due course, be extradited to the United States, Peru’s Supreme Court has ruled.

Mr Van der Sloot is currently serving a 28-year prison sentence in Peru for the murder of Stephany Flores, though an appeal against the ruling is still pending. He is wanted in the United States in connection with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, who went missing in Aruba in 2005, and alleged attempts by the Dutchman to extort her mother.

Peru’s Supreme Court stipulated, however, that Mr Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. Peru’s government has yet to make a decision on the matter.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 02:00:41 PM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

Hope Comes and Then Goes

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 35 - 36:  We land, and the door opens.  The heat and the humidity hit me hard in the face even at this hour.  Like opening the oven door and getting that big hot blast.  The wind is whipping.  My hair is all over the place.  I can hardly see the steps to go down.  I soon learn this is how it always is here: very hot and very windy.  “Hellish” is the only word that comes to mind.

We walk a few feet into the processing area to show our passports and go through customs.  It's a small unimportant looking structure with a porch connected to the front of it.  The owner of the plane has arranged for "handlers" to meet us here to assist with customs and ground transportation, common practice when private planes arrive in Aruba.

An official-looking American woman in the processing area draws my attention.  Her badge identifies her as a U.S. Homeland Security Office representative, and I hone in on her like radar.  The sight of her is our fist real sign of hope.  I walk over to her and have to restrain myself from grabbing her by her lapels and pulling her into a hug to thank her for being here for us.  All the calls made to the FBI and the U.S. Embassy by Natalee's brother and our friends must have paid off.  That's why this official person is here to help us.  I get very close to her and begin to tell her about Natalee and what has happened.  Talking a mile a minute, I explain about Natalee's disappearance and our desperate situation.  I ask for her help in figuring out where to start and what to do.

She never changes her stance, remaining in an "at ease" position with her hands behind her back.  She has very little to say; volunteers no information.  The encouraging thoughts that lifted me when I first laid eyes on her are quickly extinuished as I learn that she is always here.  The Aruba airport is her post.  She isn't here for us.  She can't do a single thing to help Natalee.  She has no special powers.  No authority.

This is the first of hundreds of times along this impending tragic journey that hope would dissolve almost as quickly as it would appear.  It would wash over us like the tide, then ebb.  Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to presson in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.


 ::MonkeyTears::


Perus top court OKs Joran extradition to US
02/06/2012


Joran van der Sloot may, in due course, be extradited to the United States, Peru’s Supreme Court has ruled.

Mr Van der Sloot is currently serving a 28-year prison sentence in Peru for the murder of Stephany Flores, though an appeal against the ruling is still pending. He is wanted in the United States in connection with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, who went missing in Aruba in 2005, and alleged attempts by the Dutchman to extort her mother.

Peru’s Supreme Court stipulated, however, that Mr Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. Peru’s government has yet to make a decision on the matter.

http://www.expatica.com/nl/news/dutch-news/perus-top-court-oks-joran-extradition-to-us_231431.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 02:09:17 PM
http://peru21.pe/2012/06/02/actualidad/aprueban-extradicion-van-der-sloot-eeuu-2026952

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Case%20Related%20Misc/06022012_JVDS_Extradition1.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 02:17:49 PM
If I understand correctly, if Joran is transferred now to the U. S. and is convicted of the crimes he's charged with; he would more than likely have to serve his entire sentence in Peru.  He wouldn't be eligible to be released in the approximate 9 years that's been talked about in relation to his conviction for Stephany's murder.  That's why IMO they don't want him transferred until he's "completed" his sentence in Peru.

But from what I understand from the article...maybe it's not over yet? 

Can the government decide to extradite him now despite what the Supreme Court stipulated?

 ::MonkeyCool::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 02:31:31 PM
http://elcomercio.pe/lima/1422768/noticia-joran-van-der-sloot-cumplira-condena-luego-extraditado-eeuu

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Case%20Related%20Misc/06022012_JVDS_Extradition2.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 02:31:52 PM


The following article reveals why it would be beneficial for Joran to fight extradition to the States.

Janet

+++++

Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


The prime suspect in the unsolved 2005 disappearance of American Natalee Holloway, Joran Van der Sloot, told a judge on Tuesday that he will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he faces extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

Van der Sloot faces an indictment in the U.S. for allegedly accepting $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead Holloway's mother's lawyer to the body after her disappearance in Aruba.

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

If he stays put, Van der Sloot could be released on parole after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino in May 2010, said Altez.  But if he were convicted in the U.S. he likely wouldn't qualify for early parole in Peru.

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

<snipped>

In an interview with ABC news, Altez stated his belief that in the end Van der Sloot will lose his fight to stay in Peru.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” he said

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 02, 2012, 02:37:21 PM
I am thinking that it would be prudent to extradite him here to Alabama to stand trial for extortion sooner, rather than later, due to time constraints involving all witnesses, etc.  How the legal technicalities of the exchange process will evolve remains to be seen.

Best wait for an official announcement ... ?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 02:39:05 PM
June 2, 2005

The Tapes Play Out

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts

Page 96 - 97:
Jug and I are in the hotel room only a few minutes when there is a knock on the door.  A hotel employee says they have the video footage of the lobby from the night Natalee disappeared ready for me to look at downstairs.  Immediately a second wind comes with this four o'clock news.  We rush downstairs to a small room near the main front desk.  There's no sign on the door, very nondescript.  We're advised to go inside.  Slowly I open the door.  As it widens, the opening reveals police officials, one after the other after the other, a dozen or more of them standing around in this small room.  At four o'clock in the morning.  Waiting for us.  There's a desk and computer screen.  It's the security room.

The tapes play out.  The night passes, and Natalee never appears at the hotel where Joran and Deepak so elaborately demonstrated they left her.  She never came back.  She never got out of that car and stumbled and bumped her head like they told me.

There is silence in the little crowded room.  Eventually the quiet is broken as police officers and detectives who witness the same evidence we do in the wee hours of Thursday morning begin to speak very softly, almost whispering to one another in Dutch and Papiamento.  I don't know what they're saying, but they are very subdued.

The all see for themselves that Joran, Deepak, and Satish never brought Natalee back to the Holiday Inn.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 02:50:24 PM
http://www.larepublica.pe/02-06-2012/joran-van-der-sloot-cumplira-condena-en-peru-y-luego-sera-extraditado-eeuu

Google translation:

Joran van der Sloot comply sentence in Peru and then be extradited to U.S.
Saturday, June 2, 2012 | 7:37 a.m.

The relatives who would be his first victim required showing the location of the remains of the girl Natalee Holloway.

Joran Van Der Slot , tried in the country for the murder of Stephany Flores , return to the U.S. at the end of his sentence in Peru to answer for the murder of a young American woman occurred several years ago.

The Permanent Criminal Chamber admitted the information request extradition from the Alabama court, which would force the murderer sentenced to 28 imprisonment in our country meet the requirements of U.S. justice.

The family of Natalee Holloway , a girl who disappeared on May 30, 2005 shortly after meeting Van Der Slot , expect the subject to identify the area where you would find the girl's body and so can crack the case that has even inspired the creation of a film.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 02:57:53 PM
If Joran van der Sloot were not to qualify for credit reduction for good behavior which some believe would never happen ... then 28 years later implies many involved in the happenings encompassing the happenings leading up to the "sting" may not be available for testifying.

How old is John Kelly?

It appears the Peruvian justice system has given Joran van der Sloot a free pass in regards to standing trial for the extortion of Beth Holloway.  Why?  What happened to the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty?

Janet

+++++


Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


The prime suspect in the unsolved 2005 disappearance of American Natalee Holloway, Joran Van der Sloot, told a judge on Tuesday that he will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he faces extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

Van der Sloot faces an indictment in the U.S. for allegedly accepting $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead Holloway's mother's lawyer to the body after her disappearance in Aruba.

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

If he stays put, Van der Sloot could be released on parole after serving a third of his 28-year sentence for killing a Lima woman he met at a casino in May 2010, said Altez.  But if he were convicted in the U.S. he likely wouldn't qualify for early parole in Peru.

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

<snipped>


http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 02, 2012, 03:19:12 PM
If I understand correctly, if Joran is transferred now to the U. S. and is convicted of the crimes he's charged with; he would more than likely have to serve his entire sentence in Peru.  He wouldn't be eligible to be released in the approximate 9 years that's been talked about in relation to his conviction for Stephany's murder.  That's why IMO they don't want him transferred until he's "completed" his sentence in Peru.

But from what I understand from the article...maybe it's not over yet? 

Can the government decide to extradite him now despite what the Supreme Court stipulated?

 ::MonkeyCool::



I thought it was if he was convicted of a felonious crime in another country it would nullify the credit reduction and he would have to serve the full term in Peru.


Maybe the US can try him in absentia??!! It's been done before!

Guess we'll have to wait and see.....


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 02, 2012, 03:21:47 PM


How old is John Kelly?


JQK was born in Jul 1953, making him almost 59 years old.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 02, 2012, 03:47:21 PM
If I understand correctly, if Joran is transferred now to the U. S. and is convicted of the crimes he's charged with; he would more than likely have to serve his entire sentence in Peru.  He wouldn't be eligible to be released in the approximate 9 years that's been talked about in relation to his conviction for Stephany's murder.  That's why IMO they don't want him transferred until he's "completed" his sentence in Peru.

But from what I understand from the article...maybe it's not over yet? 

Can the government decide to extradite him now despite what the Supreme Court stipulated?

 ::MonkeyCool::



I thought it was if he was convicted of a felonious crime in another country it would nullify the credit reduction and he would have to serve the full term in Peru.


Maybe the US can try him in absentia??!! It's been done before!

Guess we'll have to wait and see.....

I think you may be on to something..................................... or maybe the early interpretation of the Peruvian Supreme Court's statement is incorrect. Perhaps the US CAN try Joran now, but not actually serve any sentence until he has finished serving for his Peruvian crimes.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 04:12:20 PM
Could it be that Joran van der Sloot will qualify for for extradition to the Netherlands to serve his Peruvian sentence?  Does the extradition agreement between the Netherlands and Holland include extortion charges?  In other words ... would the Netherlands be compelled to extradite Joran to the US at the end of his Peruvian sentence?

The family of Natalee Holloway must be experiencing so many emotions in regards the underlying implications regarding unanswered questions encompassing todays decision by the Peruvian Supreme Court.  It has been an ongoing roller coaster of hope and despair since May 30, 2005.

Janet

++++++


Hope Comes and Then Goes but ...

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to press on in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.


Peru, Netherlands Agree Extradition Treaty

THE HAGUE, 14/05/11 - The Netherlands and Peru have agreed an extradition treaty. As a result, Joran van der Sloot may be able to serve his sentence in his own country.

Foreign Minister Uri Rosenthal and his Peruvian opposite number Jose Antonio Garcia Belaunde signed a treaty on the transfer of sentenced persons and the enforcement of criminal judgments on Thursday. "The treaty allows residents of the Kingdom of the Netherlands who have been sentenced to prison by final and irrevocable judgment in Peru" to serve their sentence in the Netherlands, said Rosenthal.

Peruvians who are in prison in the Netherlands are also entitled to invoke the treaty. Both countries are under obligation to grant a detainee's request. The treaty will enter into force as soon as both parliaments have approved it.

The two ministers discussed, among other things, human rights, cooperation in efforts to stop drug trafficking, promotion of mutual investment and knowledge exchange in the areas of water management and cooperation in judicial and defence matters.

The foreign ministry says there are currently 117 Dutch nationals in Peruvian prisons. In 113 cases, they have been convicted of a drugs offence. The most well-known Dutch prisoner is Joran van der Sloot, in jail for the murder of a Peruvian girl.

Van der Sloot's case is not yet concluded. Depending on the sentence his client receives, his lawyer Maximo Altez does plan to make use of the new regulation.

<snipped>

More:
http://www.nisnews.nl/public/140511_4.htm

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 04:23:42 PM

(http://www.acc-tv.com/images/globalnews/ppl_hollowaynatalee_1107.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 04:23:52 PM

Medical mystery tour brings (Beth) Holloway to Okoboji
Saturday, June 11, 2011


<snipped>

"For me, I have a perpetrator in prison, so I can't ask for anything more right now,"  Beth Holloway said. "That's where he belongs and now I'm able to focus and move onward in the help that I can do for others who have missing loved ones -- maybe they don't have recovery of their loved one's remains or they don't have a perpetrator in prison, so my hope is to shed enough light and to help them."

<snipped>

http://www.spencerdailyreporter.com/story/1735599.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 04:26:02 PM
http://news.visitaruba.com/news/expo-at-the-westin-art-gallery-ahead-of-2012-aruba-wine-food-and-art-festival/

Expo At The Westin Art Gallery Ahead Of 2012 Aruba Wine, Food And Art Festival

Published on: May 27, 2012

By: Carib Media

courtesy of: The Morning News
By Rosalie Klein

The bi-annual Aruba Wine, Food & Art Festival hosted by the Westin Resort in Palm Beach is rapidly approaching at the beginning of June and art aficionados can enjoy a preview of this year’s collection of art, now on display at the Westin Art Gallery until July.

The group exhibit of 25 works by 24 artists approach the theme of the festival, a celebration of the senses, from some very unique vantage points; many are homage to fine wine or food, others, like Margriet Blanken’s abstract piece, or Nigel Matthew’s “Aftermath,” leave it entirely up to the imagination of the viewer.

The gala opening on Saturday evening, May 19, attracted a diverse audience appreciative of art and culture, the exhibit curators Eduardo Valbuena and Michiko Takatsu expressed their satisfaction with this year’s collection of works, with some new names joining the roster.

Other exhibiting artists include: Adolfo Valbuena, Agaath van Vliet, Anita Hugen, Anita Seuren, Annemiek van Vliet, Carole Habibe, Deisy Gutierrez, Desiree Rep-Sporkslede, Edith Creutzberg de Haak, Edmond Tujeehut, Elvis Tromp, Frank Croes, hendrik Shouten, Irene Peterson, Joseph Miklojcik, Maria Teresa Martinez, Mavalda Tromp, Michiko Takatsu, Mirella Koolman, Miriam de L’Isle, Pablo Portugal and Timothy Charles.

 ::snipping2::

https://www.facebook.com/artloversaruba

Art Lovers Aruba
Yesterday
Untitled Album (21 photos)
Images of the Pre-opening Wine, Food and Art Exhibition 2012. The Opening of the Current Wine, Food and Art Festival will be tonight, Friday, June 1, 2012

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/179740_387206254647893_1911013381_n.jpg)

(Anita is third from left)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 02, 2012, 04:31:15 PM
http://news.visitaruba.com/news/expo-at-the-westin-art-gallery-ahead-of-2012-aruba-wine-food-and-art-festival/

Expo At The Westin Art Gallery Ahead Of 2012 Aruba Wine, Food And Art Festival

Published on: May 27, 2012

Other exhibiting artists include: Adolfo Valbuena, Agaath van Vliet, Anita Hugen, Anita Seuren, Annemiek van Vliet, Carole Habibe, Deisy Gutierrez, Desiree Rep-Sporkslede, Edith Creutzberg de Haak, Edmond Tujeehut, Elvis Tromp, Frank Croes, hendrik Shouten, Irene Peterson, Joseph Miklojcik, Maria Teresa Martinez, Mavalda Tromp, Michiko Takatsu, Mirella Koolman, Miriam de L’Isle, Pablo Portugal and Timothy Charles.

 ::snipping2::

https://www.facebook.com/artloversaruba

Art Lovers Aruba
Yesterday
Untitled Album (21 photos)
Images of the Pre-opening Wine, Food and Art Exhibition 2012. The Opening of the Current Wine, Food and Art Festival will be tonight, Friday, June 1, 2012

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/179740_387206254647893_1911013381_n.jpg)

(Anita is third from left)

Not so surprising.

Aruba has always shown its poor taste and worse decision making skills!

 ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Red on June 02, 2012, 05:56:53 PM
Peru’s Supreme Court OK’s Joran Vander Sloot’s Extradition to US for Extortion in Connection with the Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/02/perus-supreme-court-oks-joran-vander-sloots-extradition-to-us-for-extortion-in-connection-with-the-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
Joran Van der Sloot is back in the news …

Peru’s Supreme Court has ok’d Joran Van der Sloot’s  extradition to the United States to face extortion charges in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway in Aruba in 2005 by attempting to extort Beth Holloway. It was long suspected that Peru’s court would approve the extradition.  Peru’s top court stipulated, however, that Joran Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. The Little Dutch boy is presently serving a 28 year sentence in prison in Peru for the murder of Stephany Flores.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Red on June 02, 2012, 05:58:46 PM
Peru’s top court OKs Joran extradition to US

http://www.rnw.nl/africa/bulletin/peru%E2%80%99s-top-court-oks-joran-extradition-us

Quote
Joran van der Sloot may, in due course, be extradited to the United States, Peru’s Supreme Court has ruled

Peru’s Supreme Court stipulated, however, that Mr Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. Peru’s government has yet to make a decision on the matter.
::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 02, 2012, 06:04:56 PM
Peru’s top court OKs Joran extradition to US

http://www.rnw.nl/africa/bulletin/peru%E2%80%99s-top-court-oks-joran-extradition-us

Quote
Joran van der Sloot may, in due course, be extradited to the United States, Peru’s Supreme Court has ruled

Peru’s Supreme Court stipulated, however, that Mr Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. Peru’s government has yet to make a decision on the matter.
::snipping2::

All hope is not lost that it will take 28 years for Joran to face extortion charges in the States.

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 02, 2012, 06:40:07 PM
We will have to wait and see what arrangements are made for Joran's trial in the U.S.  Of course it is not practical to wait 28 years to try him and I am sure this sort of thing has been done in the past satisfactorily.  Remember we are only getting a reporters version of the ruling and not anything official.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 02, 2012, 10:03:52 PM
I think this may be the report that the other articles are based on.  If something wasn't "lost in translation", it seems to me that the possibility of Joran's extradition after his appeal is completed is still a possibility.  JMO

http://www.americatv.com.pe/portal/noticias/actualidad/aprueban-solicitud-de-extradicci-n-de-joran-van-der-sloot-estados-unidos

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Case%20Related%20Misc/06022012_JVDS_Extradition_AmericaTV1.jpg)

Approve request for extradition of Joran Van der Sloot to the U.S.
Friday, June 1, 2012

Joran Van der Sloot, sentenced to 28 years in prison for the murder of Stephanie Flores , will be extradited to the USA, after the Supreme Board approve the request by the Federal Court of Alabama . However, the transfer could take place when the process culminates in Peru or turns his entire sentence.

 ::snipping2::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 02, 2012, 10:11:20 PM
Don't worry folks -- this was NOT a  ::CowboySmiley::victory for Joran.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: crazybabyborg on June 03, 2012, 12:24:03 AM
Don't worry folks -- this was NOT a  ::CowboySmiley::victory for Joran.

Agreed, Wreck. I think Joran is fresh out of "victories" ever again.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 03, 2012, 04:13:14 AM
 The U.S. wants to get ahold of him and charge him with Holloway's murder," said Michael Griffith, senior partner at the International Legal Defense Counsel.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-us-extradition_n_1503871.html


MOORDENAAR -DUTCH translation means MURDERER!!

(http://i656.photobucket.com/albums/uu290/freebirdjustice/Murderer/murdererpic1.jpg)
Joran: "Things seem to be going even better than I hoped."
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2008-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2009-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=8



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 03, 2012, 04:16:17 AM
 Dos Leprechauns might be comn to America sooner then they think.






Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 03, 2012, 10:00:22 AM
Dos Leprechauns might be comn to America sooner then they think.






(http://a57.foxnews.com/images/325759/450/350/2_22_suspects450.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 03, 2012, 10:10:04 AM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

Hope Comes and Then Goes

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 36:  Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to presson in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.


 ::MonkeyTears::


Perus top court OKs Joran extradition to US
02/06/2012


Joran van der Sloot may, in due course, be extradited to the United States, Peru’s Supreme Court has ruled.

Mr Van der Sloot is currently serving a 28-year prison sentence in Peru for the murder of Stephany Flores, though an appeal against the ruling is still pending. He is wanted in the United States in connection with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, who went missing in Aruba in 2005, and alleged attempts by the Dutchman to extort her mother.

Peru’s Supreme Court stipulated, however, that Mr Van der Sloot can only be extradited to the United States after serving his sentence. Peru’s government has yet to make a decision on the matter.

http://www.expatica.com/nl/news/dutch-news/perus-top-court-oks-joran-extradition-to-us_231431.html



Several hurdles left to clear before US case begins against convicted murderer Joran van der Sloot
Published May 08, 2012


Joran van der Sloot may eventually face trial in the US on fraud and extortion charges, but there are still a number of hurdles to clear before the 24-year-old Dutchman serves any time in a US jail.

<snipped>

He is currently appealing his murder conviction in Peru. Only after the appeal is decided will possible extradition to the US be considered. In Peru the request would go first to the Supreme Court, then to the Council of Ministers for a final decision.

If extradition for the wire fraud charges were approved, van der Sloot could face trial in Alabama. Peruvian officials say he would then be returned to Peru to continue serving out his murder sentence. He could serve time in a US jail, according to Peru’s Justice Minister, only after he completed serving his sentence in Peru.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/05/08/van-der-sloot-could-face-us-jail-time-on-fraud-and-extortion-charges/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 03, 2012, 10:22:20 AM
Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


The prime suspect in the unsolved 2005 disappearance of American Natalee Holloway, Joran Van der Sloot, told a judge on Tuesday that he will fight extradition from Peru to the United States, where he faces extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

<snipped>

In an interview with ABC news, Altez stated his belief that in the end Van der Sloot will lose his fight to stay in Peru.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” he said

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 03, 2012, 02:14:06 PM
Good thing her injuries were not life threatening!   ::MonkeyNoNo::

http://arubaherald.com/911/2579-tourist-injured-at-natural-pool.html

Tourist injured at Natural Pool         
Sunday, 27 May 2012 17:53
 
Saturday afternoon, while a couple was admiring the scenery at the Natural Pool (Cura di Turtuga or Conchi), the rough waters pushed the woman from the rocks. She suffered a bad cut and scratches to her body. The helicopter was not available and she had to be transported by SUV to Shete where paramedics were waiting to take her to the hospital.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on June 03, 2012, 03:07:02 PM
So if I have this correct in my head, Joran will be extradited to AL to be tried on federal charges of some sort. When he is convicted he will have to return to Peru to serve the entire 28 years rather than the shortened version.  If he is still alive he will then return to the US and enter a federal prison (Leavenworth would be good unless there is somewhere worse by then) where he should spend the rest of his existence.  My concern is that if he somehow escapes a life, or death, sentence here the US judge will allow his time served in Peru to count towards time served here.  Or even run the US sentence concurrently rather than consecutively.  Surely that can't and won't happen, he deserves so much worse than he will ever possibly get from the justice system.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 03, 2012, 06:24:42 PM
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Truth or Deception?

Janet

+++++

Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money To Extradite Joran To The U.S.’Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money To Extradite Joran To The U.S.’
Posted on May 10, 2012 @ 11:00PM
 

After Joran van der Sloot appeared in a Peruvian court Tuesday to fight an extradition order that could send him back to the U.S. to face new charges, RadarOnline.com is exclusively reporting that his attorney believes it is a waste of tax-payers’ money to have him stand trial in America.

“This week I am going to present a motion with the Inter-American Commission of Human Rights on behalf of Joran van der Sloot to halt the extradition of him from Peru to the U.S.,” explained one of attorneys Aldo Cotrina. “I believe it will be successful because our claims against Peru for human rights violation are strong.”

As RadarOnline.com previously reported, the Dutchman, who confessed to the murder of 21-year-old Stephany Flores in May 2010, appeared before a judge and prosecutor and stated that he would prefer to finish serving a 28-year murder sentence there, rather than travel to America to stand trial for extortion and wire fraud charges in connection with the mysterious disappearance of Natalee Holloway in Aruba.

<snipped>

“He is trying to avoid extra prison time,” said Cotrina, who explained that the Supreme Court in Peru still has to make a decision about his murder conviction and Joran wants to be in the country to appeal that ruling.

The longer the confessed killer and his legal team can drag the procedure out, the more chance he has of avoiding being deported at all, as the statute of limitations for the fraud charge which was filed in 2010 is three years.

In June 2010, a federal grand jury in Alabama indicted van der Sloot on charges that he tried to extort $250,000 from Holloway's mother, Beth Holloway. Van der Sloot offered to provide what turned out to be bogus information about the whereabouts of Holloway's remains in exchange for the money, according to the indictment.

<snipped>

“They want to bring him over as soon as possible, before the statute of limitation has passed. We just have to delay it for a year then they can’t charge him,” revealed his attorney.

While many hope that once van der Sloot is in the country, he will ultimately be charged with the murder of the Alabama teen (he was arrested twice during the original investigation but never charged), Cotrina claims that will not happen because of a document signed between the U.S. and Peru in 2002 regarding the extradition of any individual between the two countries.

“America has to take into consideration that they can only charge with him with what is stated on the order. They can’t add any additional charges afterwards,” he revealed.

<snipped>

He can only be charged with wire fraud extortion, not with murder,” he told RadarOnline.com.

“The other issue is that wire fraud and extortion in Peru are considered ‘a violation,’ with a maximum sentence of one year. The U.S. has to sentence him according to Peruvian law because of the extradition agreement."

Ultimately, “The U.S. is going to spend a lot of money to get him there for nothing!” Claimed Cotrina, who is traveling from Lima to Washington DC to file the legal motion against Joran’s transportation on May 18.

“People assume once he is on American soil they can charge him with murder, but we are going to be sure that the U.S. has to respect the extradition agreement and make sure that doesn't happen.”

The 24-year-old Dutchman is currently being held in Peru’s maximum security prison Piedras Gordas but hoping to return to the relative luxury of Castro Castro.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-lawyer-waste-money


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 03, 2012, 07:16:40 PM
Dos Leprechauns might be comn to America sooner then they think.






(http://a57.foxnews.com/images/325759/450/350/2_22_suspects450.jpg)

"intentionally, negligently, wantonly...unlawfully conducting themselves" in a way that brought about fatal injuries

http://www.eonline.com/news/ex-holloway_suspects_sue_dr_phil/53983#ixzz1wm5GDTFv


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 03, 2012, 07:20:23 PM
::MonkeyNoNo::

Truth or Deception?

Janet

+++++

I'd say more like attorney's desperation is all that is. Just cuz he says it doesn't make it so. We are dealing with
THE USA now - a whole different ballgame.

Count on it!









Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 03, 2012, 08:29:48 PM
The U.S. wants to get ahold of him and charge him with Holloway's murder," said Michael Griffith, senior partner at the International Legal Defense Counsel.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-us-extradition_n_1503871.html


MOORDENAAR -DUTCH translation means MURDERER!!

(http://i656.photobucket.com/albums/uu290/freebirdjustice/Murderer/murdererpic1.jpg)
Joran: "Things seem to be going even better than I hoped."
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2008-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2009-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=8




This is Joran's greatest fear and was also that of his parents.  Joran is terified this will happen and he will be given the death penalty for his prolonged torture of the family.

This is used so rarely and is so new that I don't think anyone has any idea how it works, probably not even the courts.

But it is the heavy that hangs over Joran's head every day  of his life and has since he murdered Natalie Holloway.  Federal executions are rare but they have happened.

But even without this, the federal extortion charge carries a maximum of 25 years which should be enough. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 03, 2012, 10:35:57 PM
The U.S. wants to get ahold of him and charge him with Holloway's murder," said Michael Griffith, senior partner at the International Legal Defense Counsel.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-us-extradition_n_1503871.html


MOORDENAAR -DUTCH translation means MURDERER!!

(http://i656.photobucket.com/albums/uu290/freebirdjustice/Murderer/murdererpic1.jpg)
Joran: "Things seem to be going even better than I hoped."
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2008-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2009-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=8




This is Joran's greatest fear and was also that of his parents.  Joran is terified this will happen and he will be given the death penalty for his prolonged torture of the family.

This is used so rarely and is so new that I don't think anyone has any idea how it works, probably not even the courts.

But it is the heavy that hangs over Joran's head every day  of his life and has since he murdered Natalie Holloway.  Federal executions are rare but they have happened.

But even without this, the federal extortion charge carries a maximum of 25 years which should be enough. 
Anna, you are absolutely right!! Joran will never be free again. He is already in Hell. Let's hope he spill the beans before his demise.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 04, 2012, 12:45:10 PM
http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2694/Internet-Media/article/detail/3265744/2012/06/04/Wat-was-er-nou-zo-goed-aan-die-show-van-Peter-R.dhtml

Google translation

What's so good to show that Peter R.?
By: Thijs van Soest - 04/06/12, 14:21

Besides his outstanding work as a crime reporter, Peter R. de Vries especially an excellent marketer. Days before it was broadcast on roaring way you made ​​it clear that the show next Sunday "really could not miss." That Peter R. De Vries then often disappointed, his great merit. After 17 years, yesterday was his last show by more than a million viewers. One last look back: the Top 5 according Volkskrant.nl:.
 
1) Joran
The hidden camera action from 2008 where Joran De Vries was unmasked as the murderer of Natalee Holloway drew fewer than 7 million viewers. It is still one of the most watched Dutch TV programs ever. The images of the undercover operation in a car packed with cameras Joran "friend" Patrick also went around the world.
 ::snipping2::
----------------------
http://www.televizier.nl/artikel/10121/laatste-uitzending-peter-r-de-vries-misdaadverslaggever

Google translation

Last broadcast Peter R. de Vries Crime Reporter

After tonight, stop 'Peter R. crime reporter De Vries' final. Televizier Peter looks back on five unresolved topdossiers. Readers of Peterrdevries.nl the five unsolved cases considered below topdossiers. Peter himself finds it difficult to make a selection: "Lots of things for me are right, you can not compete there, although many of the killings of children and youth in me. I come easily to about 30 cases where people have me awake at night may make when they know the solution, even after the last broadcast. I quit the program, but after a long break I just go back to work as a crime reporter. "
 ::snipping2::
4. Natalee Holloway
When Peter is solid bite in the disappearance of American Natalee case on the island of Aruba, did research that brought him international fame and an Emmy Award. Despite his efforts, including undercover investigation, the main suspect Joran van der Sloot was never known, nor Natalee's remains ever found.
 ::snipping2::
last Episode
A murder case is solved tonight, however. In the last episode travels to Lebanon to Peter on the murderer of the Rotterdam Fanchette van den Tol to identify and to confront the family of the murdered woman in 1992. From 21.30 Peter and his team looks back on 17 years reporting on crime with a special backstage television broadcast which is given a look behind the scenes of the crime program. Affscheidsaflevering This promises to be quite emotional. Even the usually stoical Peter R. leave it untouched.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 04, 2012, 02:14:53 PM
Considering the Kalpoes' attorneys have submitted a transcript/video of Joran's own words from the Range Rover recording as evidence in the defamation lawsuit ...  Joran's own words regarding the non-involvement of the Satish and Deepak in the events encompassing the demise/disappearance of Natalee Holloway ... I hope that the judge in the defamation lawsuit does not agree with Peter Devries contention and he thinks once ... thinks twice ... regarding the truth of Joran's claim prior to rendering his judgement.

Is Peter Devries on record as a witness for the Plaintiffs?

If the judge embraces Joran's Range Rover "confession" as gospel ... the implication is he/she believes that Joran acted completely alone with the assistance of an unknown accomplice after the Kalpoes dropped Natalee and him off at the beach.

Janet

++++++


The Range Rover "Confession" and the Defamation Lawsuit Connection

Judge allows lawsuit to proceed against Dr. Phil
Date: Wednesday Feb. 6, 2008 10:12 AM ET


LOS ANGELES — A California judge refused to dismiss a defamation suit Tuesday against CBS and television psychologist "Dr. Phil" McGraw brought by two brothers who were questioned in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.

William Cremer, lawyer for Surinamese brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, praised the decision by Superior Court Judge Edward Ferns. "I'm going to take Dr. Phil down," he said outside the courtroom.

The ruling came a day after ABC's "20/20" aired a secretly recorded conversation involving Joran van der Sloot, who also has been interrogated by Aruban authorities on Holloway's May 2005 disappearance. In the tape, van der Sloot claims Holloway died on the beach while they were kissing and he tried to revive her but failed. He said the teen's body was dumped in the ocean and would never be found.

Joseph Tacopina, a lawyer for van der Sloot, said his client was not responsible for the Alabama teenager's death and the tapes do not amount to a confession. Last week, van der Sloot said he was lying in those conversations and denied he had anything to do with Holloway's disappearance.

The Kalpoes, who have maintained they had nothing to do with Holloway's disappearance, sued in December 2006, claiming the "Dr. Phil" talk show altered portions of a taped conversation between Deepak Kalpoe and a private investigator to "create false, incriminating, and defamatory statements that the plaintiffs engaged in criminal activity against Natalee Holloway."

The brothers also contend the TV show implied they helped kill Holloway and disposed of her body. Their suit claims defamation, invasion of privacy, emotional distress, fraud, deceit and civil conspiracy.

Cremer said the taped remarks by van der Sloot, which were secretly recorded by a Dutch crime reporter, help his clients' defamation case.

"It pretty much exonerates my boys, doesn't it?" Cremer said.

<snipped>

In June, another judge dismissed a wrongful-death case against the Kalpoes by Holloway's parents, ruling the Los Angeles Superior Court did not have jurisdiction. The parents maintained the brothers conceded jurisdiction when they sued CBS and McGraw in Los Angeles.

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20080206/dr_phil_080206/


Peter Devries - The Non-Involvement of the Kalpoes

Cracking the Holloway Case?
Feb 7, 2008 7:00 PM EST


De Vries spoke to NEWSWEEK's Catharine Skipp about the case and his role in it to date.

<snipped>

NEWSWEEK: Do you believe that the Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were involved in any way?

No, not at all.  On the tapes Joran calls them stupid.  I don't believe they were involved.

<snipped>

http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260/page/3


How a sensational hidden camera operation
solved the Natalee Holloway case


<snipped>

Peter:  Jorans friends Deepak and Satish, who have been arrested for this case several times, are completely innocent. Joran declares with pride that he has abused them to create an alibi for himself. He calls them “very stupid boys’”.

http://www.peterrdevries.com/complete-story.htm


NANCY GRACE
Joran Submits to Questioning by Aruban Investigators in Holland
Aired February 7, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GRACE: Peter, where do the Kalpoe brothers fit into this whole thing?

DE VRIES: Well, they brought him to the beach.

GRACE: Yes.

DE VRIES: They dropped him there, and Natalee, of course, and then they went home. And Joran was asked by Patrick, the insider, What do they know? And then Joran said -- and you have to notice his body language at that moment, No, they know nothing. They -- I told them nothing.

GRACE: So they just got dragged into this unwittingly?

DE VRIES: Yes.

<snipped>
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/ng.01.html

s.t.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 04, 2012, 03:09:00 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/peru-court-says-dutchmans-van-der-sloot-can-be-extradited-only-after-murder-sentence-served/2012/06/04/gJQAJuZiDV_story.html

Peru court says Dutchman Van der Sloot can be extradited only after murder sentence served
Updated: Monday, June 4, 1:03 PM

 ::snipping2::
Altez told The Associated Press that the Supreme Court’s decision follows a pattern in Peru “because there are various people in the same situation and they will all be extradited when they finish their sentences. There’s no reason Joran van der Sloot should be different.”

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter.

Altez said his client would resist that.

 “At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political,” he said.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 04, 2012, 03:22:57 PM
Considering the Kalpoes' attorneys have submitted a transcript/video of Joran's own words from the Range Rover recording as evidence in the defamation lawsuit ...  Joran's own words regarding the non-involvement of the Satish and Deepak in the events encompassing the demise/disappearance of Natalee Holloway ... I hope that the judge in the defamation lawsuit does not agree with Peter Devries contention and he thinks once ... thinks twice ... regarding the truth of Joran's claim prior to rendering his judgement.

Is Peter Devries on record as a witness for the Plaintiffs?




<snipped>
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/ng.01.html

s.t.



Secret recordings attained without a court are generally inadmissible in a US court of law.  And since this recording was made secretly, without a court order and in a FOREIGN COUNTRY, its admissibility
is highly doubtful.

The issue in this lawsuit is whether Dr Phil defamed the Kalpoe bros when he broadcasted the shortened version of Skeeters recordings. I'm not an attorney, but I would think that deVries recordings are not only inadmissible but irrelevant.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 04, 2012, 03:26:38 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/peru-court-says-dutchmans-van-der-sloot-can-be-extradited-only-after-murder-sentence-served/2012/06/04/gJQAJuZiDV_story.html

Peru court says Dutchman Van der Sloot can be extradited only after murder sentence served
Updated: Monday, June 4, 1:03 PM

 ::snipping2::
Altez told The Associated Press that the Supreme Court’s decision follows a pattern in Peru “because there are various people in the same situation and they will all be extradited when they finish their sentences. There’s no reason Joran van der Sloot should be different.”

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter.

Altez said his client would resist that.

 “At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political,” he said.
 ::snipping2::


If Joran's appeal is sucessful ... the implication would be that there would be no justice for Stephany.  Do I have that right?

If Joran's appeal is unsucessful ... the implication would be that Joran would not be extradited until he has served his Peruvian sentence.  Do I have that right?

What about the three year statute of limitations for fraud charges?

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Janet

+++++

Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money To Extradite Joran To The U.S.’Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer: ‘It’s A Waste Of Money To Extradite Joran To The U.S.’
Posted on May 10, 2012 @ 11:00PM
 

The longer the confessed killer and his legal team can drag the procedure out, the more chance he has of avoiding being deported at all, as the statute of limitations for the fraud charge which was filed in 2010 is three years.

<snipped>

“They want to bring him over as soon as possible, before the statute of limitation has passed. We just have to delay it for a year then they can’t charge him,” revealed his attorney.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-lawyer-waste-money



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 04, 2012, 03:49:43 PM


If Joran's appeal is sucessful ... the implication would be that there would be no justice for Stephany.  Do I have that right?

If Joran's appeal is unsucessful ... the implication would be that Joran would not be extradited until he has served his Peruvian sentence.  Do I have that right?

What about the three year statute of limitations for fraud charges?


A statute of limitations is an enactment in a common law legal system that sets the maximum time after an event that legal proceedings based on that event may be initiated.

Joran is already indicted, meaning legal proceedings have gone beyond initiation, they are active.  There is a formal request for extradition so that legal proceedings may continue.

As far as Joran's appeal being successful, it appears as if there is some confusion as to an all or nothing outcome.  There could be a simple reduction of years anywhere from 1 - 28 years.

As far as an unsuccessful outcome to the appeal, and that limiting extradition to the US, we will just have to wait and see what Peru decides.  All we really know, it that Peru has agreed to the extradition, but with some restrictions pending the outcome of his appeal.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 04, 2012, 04:44:06 PM
http://twitter.com/#!/PeterRdeV (http://twitter.com/#!/PeterRdeV)

http://twitter.com/PeterRdeV/status/194360629056897024 (http://twitter.com/PeterRdeV/status/194360629056897024)

http://twitter.com/PeterRdeV/status/194360420558045184 (http://twitter.com/PeterRdeV/status/194360420558045184)

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/04232012_PRDV_JVDS.png)

 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 04, 2012, 05:10:52 PM
http://nos.nl/artikel/379890-laatste-aflevering-peter-r-de-vries.html

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Peter%20DeVries/06032012_PRDV_LastShow.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 04, 2012, 06:47:11 PM
I heart DeVries for the greater good he did do... he made Joran's life not worth living.

I will never believe the Kal-dopes were innocent. They were in it for whatever they could get... because they are miserable useless guys with nothing better to do with their time. Joran played them later like the tools they are... because he could. Joran's dog had a higher IQ than
the Kalpoes. Did Satish graduate yet? Is he on the 10 year plan or what?  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 04, 2012, 06:59:10 PM
Did Satish graduate yet? Is he on the 10 year plan or what?  ::MonkeyHaHa::
He hasn't graduated from PennFoster.edu yet?

Bwahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 04, 2012, 08:53:23 PM
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605

Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
By Andrew Chow, JD at FindLaw.com
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

Van der Sloot, convicted of murder in Peru, faces U.S. charges in connection with the disappearance of Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway in Aruba. "At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," his attorney told the AP.

The political process is rooted in the extradition treaty between the United States and Peru. The treaty allows a person who's convicted of a crime in Peru to be extradited to the United States to face prosecution for a separate crime.

If convicted and sentenced in the United States, the person would be sent back to Peru to finish his sentence, then extradited again to the United States to serve time there.


But Peru's Supreme Court apparently wants Joran van der Sloot to first serve out his Peruvian prison sentence before standing trial in the United States on lesser charges related to the Holloway case.

As other Peruvian prisoners are "in the same situation," the Supreme Court felt "[t]here's no reason Joran van der Sloot should be different," van der Sloot's lawyer told the AP.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 04, 2012, 09:35:27 PM
I heart DeVries for the greater good he did do... he made Joran's life not worth living.

I will never believe the Kal-dopes were innocent. They were in it for whatever they could get... because they are miserable useless guys with nothing better to do with their time. Joran played them later like the tools they are... because he could. Joran's dog had a higher IQ than
the Kalpoes. Did Satish graduate yet? Is he on the 10 year plan or what?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::rhino::

Absolutely.   ::MonkeyGavel:: ::justice2NJ::

 ::boxingjoran::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 05, 2012, 02:15:48 AM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Natalee_2005.jpg)


Justice for Natalee!  

 ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Red on June 05, 2012, 08:32:12 AM
MSM Finally Reports that Peru Court Approves Joran Van Der Sloot Extradition to US on Extortion Charges in Connection with Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/05/msm-finally-reports-that-peru-court-approves-joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-to-us-on-extortion-charges-in-connection-with-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
As Scared Monkeys reported last Saturday, the MSM has finally decided to report that Peru courts have approved Joran Van der Sloot’s extradition to the United States on extortion and wire fraud charges.However, according to the court’s decision, Van der Sloot must first serve his 28 year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores before he can be extradited to the US on extortion charges.  Before the decision is made final, it must be approved by Peru’s justice minister and Cabinet.
::snipping2::

MSM, better late than never I guess.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 12:02:09 PM
I heart DeVries for the greater good he did do... he made Joran's life not worth living.

I will never believe the Kal-dopes were innocent. They were in it for whatever they could get... because they are miserable useless guys with nothing better to do with their time. Joran played them later like the tools they are... because he could. Joran's dog had a higher IQ than
the Kalpoes. Did Satish graduate yet? Is he on the 10 year plan or what?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::rhino::

There are others besides the Kalpoes that Joran distanced from implication in the Range Rover recordings ... others that most Monkeys believe participated in the events encompassing the morning of May 30th. 

In the recordings Joran:

1.  failed to implicate himself in nothing more serious than the disposal of a body following Natalee's demise from a seizure.

2.  failed to implicate his father in nothing more serious than affording him a cell phone while detained.

3.  failed to implicate the Kalpoes in nothing more than dropping Natalee and him off at the beach.

4.  failed to implicate the sons of the elite who were detained as suspects in the Natalee Holloway case.

5.  failed to implicate any within the corrupt Natalee Holloway investigation with wrongdoing in regards to a cover up.

6.  failed to include a trap in his account pertaining to the disposal of a deceased Natalee.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 05, 2012, 12:08:49 PM
Agree, Red, MSM has finally picked up on the story.  I even heard a radio program host talking about it yesterday and news reports on the radio.  It will probably be a bigger news item for MSM when the Peruvian government makes the final decision on the extradition process. 
 
Justice for Natalee!  ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 12:27:36 PM

Dutch CIE Agents and Aruban Authorities were Aware

In his book "Disposed" ... Patrick Vander Eem reveals that Dutch agents and Aruban authorities were at the very least aware from the getgo of the sting to obtain a confession from Joran van der Sloot regarding his participation as well as his knowledge of the events encompassing the morning of May 30th.

Considering most believe that those within a corrupt investigation have had an agenda that was established on May 30, 2005 to protect Joran and Paulus from implication ... could it be that father and son received a heads-up pertaining to the impending sting and ... that heads-up was used to their advantage and Aruba's advantage.

Janet

+++++

Disposed - Patrick Vander Eem

Chapter 9:
  It took a week and a half for someone to contact me. As they say the waiting is the hardest part but there was nothing to be done about it since you can’t directly contact the CIE (Criminal Information Unit of the Dutch police which collects information on organized crime and big crime cases). They have to call you.

While I waited for this contact, I had time to think about what exactly I wanted out of all of this.  In my daydreams I put together the package deal to get three hundred thousand Euros.

I told the man on the phone that I befriended Joran with the purpose of getting him to talk and that it might be interesting for them if we speak. Within a week I had an appointment to meet two CIE agents.

Chapter 18: That night we hit the casino and the red light district in Arnhem.  It was really late when I decided to take him home we ran into a police checkpoint on the way out of the red light district.
 
I stopped the way I should and the officer asks for my driver's licence.  He asks if the car is mine and I say it's a rental because mine is in the shop.  Then he wants to see the paper work.  The rental agreement is listed to Endemol.  So I'm afraid the copy will say 'So you work for Endemol' with Joran sitting next to me.  I quickly step out of the car to talk with the police officer.
 
Another officer comes over and we all talk nicely and it gets straightened out.  No problems.  They let me go on my way.  Who knows, when they checked my documents they got a big 'leave this car alone' on their screen.

Chapter 20:  Shortly after the promo aired a hacker got into the system of the program’s website due to a mistake of the internet provider who left a port open. He found and posted a portion of an interview Peter R had with prosecutor Hans Mos and the leading investigator Adolph Richardson in Aruba.


Arubans wary of fifth car trip in Holloway case
Monday 25 February 2008


Dutch tv crime reporter Peter R de Vries set up a fifth car trip to try and get Joran van der Sloot to confess to murdering US teenager Natalee Holloway after the Aruban public prosecution department said the original four recordings did not contain enough evidence, the Volkskrant reported on Saturday.
 
Aruban officials told De Vries and his team at a secret hotel meeting  that the tapes did not contain enough new evidence, the paper says in a reconstruction of events surrounding the tv programme which claimed to solve the mystery of her disappearance.

Aruban public prosecutor Hans Mos told the paper he did not want to have anything to do with the extra car trip because he was afraid it could be construed as entrapment and blow the case.

<snipped>
 
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/02/arubans_wary_of_fifth_car_trip


The Principle is Absolute

private eye
Discussion #742 3/10 -
« Reply #686 on: March 13, 2008, 06:38:07 PM »


But sharing information with people who work for people who are directly orchestrating the cover up, Rudy, or the Dutch, is the most irresponsible investigating I can imagine.

What I pray that Kyle and the crew of the Persistence will determine, is that regardless of how hard working the man that they are working with appears to work, his work belongs to Rudy, and Rudy belongs to the local dutch.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2689.msg364750#msg364750


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 12:33:38 PM
Considering the Kalpoes' attorneys have submitted a transcript/video of Joran's own words from the Range Rover recording as evidence in the defamation lawsuit ...  Joran's own words regarding the non-involvement of the Satish and Deepak in the events encompassing the demise/disappearance of Natalee Holloway ... I hope that the judge in the defamation lawsuit does not agree with Peter Devries contention and he thinks once ... thinks twice ... regarding the truth of Joran's claim prior to rendering his judgement.

Is Peter Devries on record as a witness for the Plaintiffs?

If the judge embraces Joran's Range Rover "confession" as gospel ... the implication is he/she believes that Joran acted completely alone with the assistance of an unknown accomplice after the Kalpoes dropped Natalee and him off at the beach.

Janet

++++++


The Range Rover "Confession" and the Defamation Lawsuit Connection

Judge allows lawsuit to proceed against Dr. Phil
Date: Wednesday Feb. 6, 2008 10:12 AM ET


LOS ANGELES — A California judge refused to dismiss a defamation suit Tuesday against CBS and television psychologist "Dr. Phil" McGraw brought by two brothers who were questioned in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.

William Cremer, lawyer for Surinamese brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, praised the decision by Superior Court Judge Edward Ferns. "I'm going to take Dr. Phil down," he said outside the courtroom.

The ruling came a day after ABC's "20/20" aired a secretly recorded conversation involving Joran van der Sloot, who also has been interrogated by Aruban authorities on Holloway's May 2005 disappearance. In the tape, van der Sloot claims Holloway died on the beach while they were kissing and he tried to revive her but failed. He said the teen's body was dumped in the ocean and would never be found.

Joseph Tacopina, a lawyer for van der Sloot, said his client was not responsible for the Alabama teenager's death and the tapes do not amount to a confession. Last week, van der Sloot said he was lying in those conversations and denied he had anything to do with Holloway's disappearance.

The Kalpoes, who have maintained they had nothing to do with Holloway's disappearance, sued in December 2006, claiming the "Dr. Phil" talk show altered portions of a taped conversation between Deepak Kalpoe and a private investigator to "create false, incriminating, and defamatory statements that the plaintiffs engaged in criminal activity against Natalee Holloway."

The brothers also contend the TV show implied they helped kill Holloway and disposed of her body. Their suit claims defamation, invasion of privacy, emotional distress, fraud, deceit and civil conspiracy.

Cremer said the taped remarks by van der Sloot, which were secretly recorded by a Dutch crime reporter, help his clients' defamation case.

"It pretty much exonerates my boys, doesn't it?" Cremer said.

<snipped>

In June, another judge dismissed a wrongful-death case against the Kalpoes by Holloway's parents, ruling the Los Angeles Superior Court did not have jurisdiction. The parents maintained the brothers conceded jurisdiction when they sued CBS and McGraw in Los Angeles.

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20080206/dr_phil_080206/


Peter Devries - The Non-Involvement of the Kalpoes

Cracking the Holloway Case?
Feb 7, 2008 7:00 PM EST


De Vries spoke to NEWSWEEK's Catharine Skipp about the case and his role in it to date.

<snipped>

NEWSWEEK: Do you believe that the Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were involved in any way?

No, not at all.  On the tapes Joran calls them stupid.  I don't believe they were involved.

<snipped>

http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260/page/3


How a sensational hidden camera operation
solved the Natalee Holloway case


<snipped>

Peter:  Jorans friends Deepak and Satish, who have been arrested for this case several times, are completely innocent. Joran declares with pride that he has abused them to create an alibi for himself. He calls them “very stupid boys’”.

http://www.peterrdevries.com/complete-story.htm


NANCY GRACE
Joran Submits to Questioning by Aruban Investigators in Holland
Aired February 7, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GRACE: Peter, where do the Kalpoe brothers fit into this whole thing?

DE VRIES: Well, they brought him to the beach.

GRACE: Yes.

DE VRIES: They dropped him there, and Natalee, of course, and then they went home. And Joran was asked by Patrick, the insider, What do they know? And then Joran said -- and you have to notice his body language at that moment, No, they know nothing. They -- I told them nothing.

GRACE: So they just got dragged into this unwittingly?

DE VRIES: Yes.

<snipped>
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/ng.01.html

s.t.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 05, 2012, 12:34:18 PM
According to the information cited from the extradition treaty in the article, both parties to the treaty "may" postpone extradition.  So...it is not must postpone because the Supreme Court made the recommendation?

http://www.myfoxmemphis.com/dpps/news/peru-court-us-can-extradite-joran-van-der-sloot-after-prison-dpgapx-20120605-fc_20485638

Peru Court: US Can Extradite Joran Van Der Sloot After Prison
Updated: Tuesday, 05 Jun 2012, 7:55 AM CDT
Published : Tuesday, 05 Jun 2012, 7:54 AM CDT
CARLA SALAZAR,Associated Press

 ::snipping2::
Federal prosecutors in Birmingham, Alabama, where Van der Sloot is charged, declined to comment on the court's decision. Kelly said he had no immediate comment.
 
Altez told The Associated Press that the Supreme Court's decision follows a pattern in Peru. "There are various people in the same situation and they will all be extradited when they finish their sentences. There's no reason Joran van der Sloot should be different," he said.
 
A copy of the decision obtained by the AP cites the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty, first signed in 1899 and an additional 1990 agreement, as specifying that both parties may postpone extradition until after a condemned criminal has finished serving his or her sentence.
 
The decision cites three recent cases involving convicted criminals wanted by Spain, Argentina and the United States as precedents.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 01:06:00 PM
I am anticipating the reaction of Birmingham prosecutors and John Kelly to the decision of the Peruvian Supreme Court in regards to extradition.  Extradition 28 years down the road does not make sense when it comes witness testimonies.

Then again ... maybe ... just maybe ... in the year 2040 a 93 year old Monkey named Tamikosmom will be following two trials ... the extortion of Beth Holloway and ... the defamation of the Kalpoe brothers.
 
Janet

++++

Peru court: Can extradite Dutchman after prison
June 4, 2012, 2:55 p.m. PDT


LIMA, Peru (AP) — U.S. prosecutors who want to try Joran van der Sloot for extortion related to the 2005 disappearance of U.S. teen Natalee Holloway will have to wait until he finishes serving a murder sentence in Peru, this nation's Supreme Court has ruled.

Van der Sloot's lawyer, who was notified of the decision Friday, said Monday that he expects his client will be made to serve at least two-thirds of the 28-year sentence.

The court's May 23 decision on extradition is not final, however. Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must endorse it, said the lawyer, Maximo Altez.

Van der Sloot, 24, faces extortion and wire fraud charges in Alabama in connection with Holloway's unsolved disappearance in Aruba exactly five years before he killed Peruvian college student Stephany Flores after meeting her in a Lima casino.

<snipped>

The Dutchman, who was raised in Aruba, remains the prime suspect in the Holloway disappearance on the Caribbean island, and the U.S. charges stem from his alleged acceptance of $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead her mother's lawyer, John Q. Kelly, to the body.

Federal prosecutors in Birmingham, Alabama, where Van der Sloot is charged, declined to comment on the court's decision. Kelly said he had no immediate comment.

Altez told The Associated Press that the Supreme Court's decision follows a pattern in Peru. "There are various people in the same situation and they will all be extradited when they finish their sentences. There's no reason Joran van der Sloot should be different," he said.

A copy of the decision obtained by the AP cites the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty, first signed in 1899 and an additional 1990 agreement, as specifying that both parties may postpone extradition until after a condemned criminal has finished serving his or her sentence.

<snipped>

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence, and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter. Altez said his client would resist that.

"At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," he said.

He contends Van der Sloot could not receive a fair trial in the United States "because he's been satanized by the press. He is seen as a demon in the United States and would be judged by a jury made up of common people who are influenced by the press and would surely give him the maximum sentence."

<snipped>

http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf/story/peru-court-dutchmans-extradition-after-sentence/ba9b5f9caa344925992cde4daa18c76f


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 03:28:39 PM
MSM Finally Reports that Peru Court Approves Joran Van Der Sloot Extradition to US on Extortion Charges in Connection with Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/05/msm-finally-reports-that-peru-court-approves-joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-to-us-on-extortion-charges-in-connection-with-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
As Scared Monkeys reported last Saturday, the MSM has finally decided to report that Peru courts have approved Joran Van der Sloot’s extradition to the United States on extortion and wire fraud charges.However, according to the court’s decision, Van der Sloot must first serve his 28 year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores before he can be extradited to the US on extortion charges.  Before the decision is made final, it must be approved by Peru’s justice minister and Cabinet.
::snipping2::

MSM, better late than never I guess.


The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 05, 2012, 04:57:51 PM
MSM Finally Reports that Peru Court Approves Joran Van Der Sloot Extradition to US on Extortion Charges in Connection with Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/05/msm-finally-reports-that-peru-court-approves-joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-to-us-on-extortion-charges-in-connection-with-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
As Scared Monkeys reported last Saturday, the MSM has finally decided to report that Peru courts have approved Joran Van der Sloot’s extradition to the United States on extortion and wire fraud charges.However, according to the court’s decision, Van der Sloot must first serve his 28 year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores before he can be extradited to the US on extortion charges.  Before the decision is made final, it must be approved by Peru’s justice minister and Cabinet.
::snipping2::

MSM, better late than never I guess.


The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


What on earth makes you say that?  Why do you think the case will be compromised and charges dropped?  That doesn't make sense.  I fully expect in 9 years for Joran to be extradited to the US for trial.  Hopefully he'll then get life in prison and begin serving his life term in Federal Prison.  I'm not worried one bit. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 05:20:44 PM
MSM Finally Reports that Peru Court Approves Joran Van Der Sloot Extradition to US on Extortion Charges in Connection with Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/05/msm-finally-reports-that-peru-court-approves-joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-to-us-on-extortion-charges-in-connection-with-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
As Scared Monkeys reported last Saturday, the MSM has finally decided to report that Peru courts have approved Joran Van der Sloot’s extradition to the United States on extortion and wire fraud charges.However, according to the court’s decision, Van der Sloot must first serve his 28 year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores before he can be extradited to the US on extortion charges.  Before the decision is made final, it must be approved by Peru’s justice minister and Cabinet.
::snipping2::

MSM, better late than never I guess.


The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


What on earth makes you say that?  Why do you think the case will be compromised and charges dropped?  That doesn't make sense.  I fully expect in 9 years for Joran to be extradited to the US for trial.  Hopefully he'll then get life in prison and begin serving his life term in Federal Prison.  I'm not worried one bit. 

Klaas

I am.

IF Joran qualifies for full reduction credits ... in 9 years all witnesses involved in the sting may not be available for varying reasons to testify on behalf of the Beth Holloway.  If he does not qualify ... in 28 years ... the number of witnesses will be reduced substantially.  IMO

Anyways ... why did the Peruvian Supreme Court rule against immediate extradition of Joran to the States to face extortion charges once there was a ruling on the appeal of his sentence?  Joran would have been returned to Peru to finish his Peruvian sentence at the completion of the trial.  In the name of justice for Beth Holloway ... an immediate trial would have made so much more sense.  IMO

Janet
 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 05, 2012, 05:31:36 PM
MSM Finally Reports that Peru Court Approves Joran Van Der Sloot Extradition to US on Extortion Charges in Connection with Death of Natalee Holloway

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/06/05/msm-finally-reports-that-peru-court-approves-joran-van-der-sloot-extradition-to-us-on-extortion-charges-in-connection-with-death-of-natalee-holloway/

Quote
As Scared Monkeys reported last Saturday, the MSM has finally decided to report that Peru courts have approved Joran Van der Sloot’s extradition to the United States on extortion and wire fraud charges.However, according to the court’s decision, Van der Sloot must first serve his 28 year sentence for the murder of Stephany Flores before he can be extradited to the US on extortion charges.  Before the decision is made final, it must be approved by Peru’s justice minister and Cabinet.
::snipping2::

MSM, better late than never I guess.


The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


What on earth makes you say that?  Why do you think the case will be compromised and charges dropped?  That doesn't make sense.  I fully expect in 9 years for Joran to be extradited to the US for trial.  Hopefully he'll then get life in prison and begin serving his life term in Federal Prison.  I'm not worried one bit. 

Klaas

I am.

IF Joran qualifies for full reduction credits ... in 9 years all witnesses involved in the sting may not be available for varying reasons to testify on behalf of the Beth Holloway.  If he does not qualify ... in 28 years ... the number of witnesses will be reduced substantially.  IMO

Anyways ... why did the Peruvian Supreme Court rule against immediate extradition of Joran to the States to face extortion charges once there was a ruling on the appeal of his sentence?  Joran would have been returned to Peru to finish his Peruvian sentence at the completion of the trial.  In the name of justice for Beth Holloway ... an immediate trial would have made so much more sense.  IMO

Janet
 

All of the witnesses have already given their statements it's not like they will forget what happened.   Why would Peru let loose of Joran to come to the US when he murdered one of their own?  Murder trumps extortion IMO (even though we believe he also murdered Natalee).  What we want and what is the expected are two different things. 

Yes, I would love for Peru to let Joran come to the USA for a trial then go back to jail in Peru after but I would have been shocked if it happened that way.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 05, 2012, 05:34:22 PM

The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


There aren't any forces behind the scenes protecting Joran.

Joran got lucky in Aruba b/c his Daddy knew people in a corrupt society who were willing to do anything to protect their precious island and therefore their own lifestyles.  Daddy is DEAD.

Joran screwed up and got caught at killing Stephany and extorting Beth.  Now he has to pay for his crimes.  He was convicted of the murder of Stephany and received a 28 year sentence in a Peruvian prison with horrendous living conditions.

He was indicted in the USA for his extortion of Beth and wire fraud. His extradition to the USA has been approved.

Doesn't sound to me like he has friends in high places protecting him.  There is nothing to be read between the lines, no conspiracies, no requests from the Netherlands for extradition, no protection for Joran.  Joran is frightened to come to the USA and miserable in Peru, as well he should be.  He is just beginning his paybacks!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 05:51:11 PM

All of the witnesses have already given their statements it's not like they will forget what happened.   Why would Peru let loose of Joran to come to the US when he murdered one of their own?  Murder trumps extortion IMO (even though we believe he also murdered Natalee).  What we want and what is the expected are two different things. 

Yes, I would love for Peru to let Joran come to the USA for a trial then go back to jail in Peru after but I would have been shocked if it happened that way.

Klaas

If God's wills.  It is a good possibility that I could be pushing up daisies in nine years.  In 28 years in all probability I will be pushing up daisies.

Are statements sufficient in a court of law?  Do defence attorneys not have the right to cross examine a witness?

Klaas ... less than one month ago Joran's own attorney believed that the extradition of Joran was imminent.  I am anticipating John Kelly's reaction and ... the Birmingham prosecutor's reaction.

Anyways ... I am so disappointed in the Peruvian Supreme Courts ruling.  my heart breaks for Beth.  The emotional roller coaster of hope and dispair must be h---.

Janet

++++++

May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


ABC News’ Joe Goldman in Lima, Peru, reports:

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 06:05:49 PM
Why did the Peruvian Supreme Court not honor the U.S.Peru Extradition Treaty?

Janet

+++++

Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

<snipped>

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 07:19:47 PM

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/MonkeyJusticeTrain31.jpg)


The next wave?  My sincere hope is that the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet will overrule the Peruvian Supreme Court decision and ... following Joran's sentencing appeal he will be immediately extradited to Birmingham to face extortion charges and ... Beth Holloway will not have to wait 9-28 years to hear the words "GUILTY AS CHARGED".  In otherwords ... the Monkey Justice train will not be delayed.

It is not about extorted money as far as I am concerned.  It is about the emotional h--- that Joran bestowed on Beth when he afforded her the hope of bringing her precious daughter home after five long years to rest on American soil and then negated.  Joran is despicable!  He does not empathize.  He does not possess a conscience.

Janet

++++


www.cafepress.com/justicetrain


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 07:23:34 PM
The Next Wave

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave  to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to press on in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 05, 2012, 07:29:11 PM
Why did the Peruvian Supreme Court not honor the U.S.Peru Extradition Treaty?

Janet

+++++

Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

<snipped>

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/

Court systems in other countries all interpret things differently -- not because of corruption, but because they are just plain different. We don't have to like it. I just read that the "Canadian Homosexual Cannibal" would only get 25 years in Canada for his crimes -- that's less than Peru gave Joran!!  Go figure.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 07:37:36 PM
Why did the Peruvian Supreme Court not honor the U.S.Peru Extradition Treaty?

Janet

+++++

Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

<snipped>

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/

Court systems in other countries all interpret things differently -- not because of corruption, but because they are just plain different. We don't have to like it. I just read that the "Canadian Homosexual Cannibal" would only get 25 years in Canada for his crimes -- that's less than Peru gave Joran!!  Go figure.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

The scales of justice do not balance in any system if he/she who premeditatively takes a life is not legally required to forfeit his/her life.  Anything less is devaluing the life of the victim.  IMO

Janet


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 08:04:43 PM
Judicial System

Individual Corruption


The Peruvian judicial system is tainted with corruption and official pressure, according to the US Department of State 2010. Similarly, Freedom House 2011 reports that corruption in the judiciary remains rampant. Also Transparency International's Global Corruption Barometer 2010 points out that the judiciary is among the most corrupt public institutions in Peru. According to the report, well over half of the surveyed households consider it as 'extremely corrupt', while more than a quarter reports having paid a bribe in 2009. Also, in the Proética Fifth National Survey on Corruption 2008, the surveyed citizens consider the judiciary to be among the most corrupt institutions in Peru. User surveys also indicate that unofficial payments affect both the speed and the final outcome of judicial processes.

<snipped>

http://www.business-anti-corruption.com/country-profiles/latin-america-the-caribbean/peru/corruption-levels/judicial-system/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 05, 2012, 08:44:46 PM

The Peruvian Supreme court has effectively afforded Joran van der Sloot a pass in regards to the extortion charges waiting in the States.  Even if Joran receives full reduction credits and is released in 9 years ... the Birmingham case against this psychopath ... in all probability ... will have been compromised and ... the charges dropped.  IMO.

When the furthering of justice is considered ... the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling and simple logic do not equate.  IMO.

If the the

Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet rule likewise ... could the implication be that there are forces behind the scenes protecting Joran van der Sloot. 

Janet


There aren't any forces behind the scenes protecting Joran.

Joran got lucky in Aruba b/c his Daddy knew people in a corrupt society who were willing to do anything to protect their precious island and therefore their own lifestyles.  Daddy is DEAD.

Joran screwed up and got caught at killing Stephany and extorting Beth.  Now he has to pay for his crimes.  He was convicted of the murder of Stephany and received a 28 year sentence in a Peruvian prison with horrendous living conditions.

He was indicted in the USA for his extortion of Beth and wire fraud. His extradition to the USA has been approved.

Doesn't sound to me like he has friends in high places protecting him.  There is nothing to be read between the lines, no conspiracies, no requests from the Netherlands for extradition, no protection for Joran.  Joran is frightened to come to the USA and miserable in Peru, as well he should be.  He is just beginning his paybacks!!


Well said, Jamcakes, and I agree.  ::rhino::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 09:45:31 PM
Judicial System

Individual Corruption


The Peruvian judicial system is tainted with corruption and official pressure, according to the US Department of State 2010. Similarly, Freedom House 2011 reports that corruption in the judiciary remains rampant. Also Transparency International's Global Corruption Barometer 2010 points out that the judiciary is among the most corrupt public institutions in Peru. According to the report, well over half of the surveyed households consider it as 'extremely corrupt', while more than a quarter reports having paid a bribe in 2009. Also, in the Proética Fifth National Survey on Corruption 2008, the surveyed citizens consider the judiciary to be among the most corrupt institutionsin Peru.  User surveys also indicate that unofficial payments affect both the speed and the final outcome of judicial processes.

<snipped>

http://www.business-anti-corruption.com/country-profiles/latin-america-the-caribbean/peru/corruption-levels/judicial-system/


Consider the truth originating from a credible source remains elusive ... speculating is where it is at.  I could be wrong but I suspect that San's prediction never happened because Joran is being appeased to assure his silence?

1.  According to Stephany's father ... privileges Joran has received since "day one" implies he "lives like a king" in the Peruvian lockup.

2.  Rather than a life sentence ... Joran received a 28 year sentence which translates into 9 years with credit reductions for a murder beyond brutal.

3.  According to Joran's attorney the Peru-Netherland prisoner exchange agreement implies Joran may qualify to serve his Peruvian sentence in the Netherlands.

4.  The Peruvian Supreme Court ruled against the immediate extradition of Joran to the States to face charges pertaining to the extortion beyond cruel of Beth Holloway.

Janet

+++++++

San
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #841 6/22/10 -
« Reply #1553 on: June 26, 2010, 12:47:13 AM »


I just have a feeling something even bigger is going to happen.  I have a feeling that Joran is going to throw people under the bus and start naming names.  Joran is mad and he will turn his anger towards Aruba for not helping him.  Everyone get ready to run.

People like:

Van der Straaten
Rudy Croes
Nelson Oduber
Karin Jannsen
Rick Smid
Bob Witt
Ben King
Michael Posner
Julia Renfro

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8145.msg1170391#msg1170391


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 05, 2012, 09:58:15 PM
Do we have an ignore button? Repeating the same old thing over, and over, and over does not change the fact that NO ONE in Aruba or the Netherlands has an iota of influence in what happens in Peru.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 05, 2012, 10:06:54 PM
 :smt060


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 05, 2012, 10:20:05 PM
Do we have an ignore button? Repeating the same old thing over, and over, and over does not change the fact that NO ONE in Aruba or the Netherlands has an iota of influence in what happens in Peru.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

LOL!!  Where's the "beating the dead horse" icon?

SSDD



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: cadillac on June 06, 2012, 10:06:45 AM
Been reading everyone's comments about whether Joran will be coming to Birmingham, and when.  I am one of those common people of Birmingham and I have to have faith in the FBI here.  I know some of them socially, not privy to their work, but folks, believe in them.  The FBI does not fool around and Natalee is "their daughter" too.  Trust me they will handle this.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 06, 2012, 10:37:28 AM
It was definitely to Joran van der Sloot's benefit that that the Peruvian Supreme Court ruled against immediate extradition to the States to face extortion charges.

Hopefully the ruling of the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet will overrule the Supreme Court's decision and the Monkey Justice Train will roll into the Birmingham Station as originally anticipated ... sooner than later.

Janet

+++++


Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

The political process is rooted in the extradition treaty between the United States and Peru. The treaty allows a person who's convicted of a crime in Peru to be extradited to the United States to face prosecution for a separate crime.

If convicted and sentenced in the United States, the person would be sent back to Peru to finish his sentence, then extradited again to the United States to serve time there.

But Peru's Supreme Court apparently wants Joran van der Sloot to first serve out his Peruvian prison sentence before standing trial in the United States on lesser charges related to the Holloway case.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605


Van der Sloot Extradition Delayed
June 6, 2012


<snipped>

The extradition ruling is important to Van der Sloot because it could affect how much time he spends in prison in Peru. Under usual circumstances, he could serve about one-third of his 28-year sentence before being released, less than 10 years.

But if he were to be extradited to the U.S. and convicted of another crime, that could lengthen the time he serves on his Peruvian sentence.

<snipped>

http://crime.about.com/b/2012/06/06/van-der-sloot-extradition-delayed.htm


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 06, 2012, 11:01:35 AM

Been reading everyone's comments about whether Joran will be coming to Birmingham, and when.  I am one of those common people of Birmingham and I have to have faith in the FBI here.  I know some of them socially, not privy to their work, but folks, believe in them.  The FBI does not fool around and Natalee is "their daughter" too.  Trust me they will handle this.

cadiliac

I am anticipating the reaction of the Birmingham prosecutor as well the reaction as John Q. Kelly to the Peruvian Supreme Court ruling.  Maybe there will be no comments until the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet announce the final ruling regarding the terms of Joran's extradition.

When all is said and done ... I would much rather afford "a jury made up of common people" to administer a just ruling than a panel of appointed (elected?) Peruvian judges.

Janet

++++++

Peru court: Can extradite Dutchman after prison
June 4, 2012, 2:55 p.m. PDT


<snipped>

The Dutchman, who was raised in Aruba, remains the prime suspect in the Holloway disappearance on the Caribbean island, and the U.S. charges stem from his alleged acceptance of $25,000 in early 2010 in exchange for an unfulfilled promise to lead her mother's lawyer, John Q. Kelly, to the body.

Federal prosecutors in Birmingham, Alabama, where Van der Sloot is charged, declined to comment on the court's decision. Kelly said he had no immediate comment.

<snipped>

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence, and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter. Altez said his client would resist that.

"At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," he said.

He contends Van der Sloot could not receive a fair trial in the United States "because he's been satanized by the press. He is seen as a demon in the United States and would be judged by a jury made up of common people who are influenced by the press and would surely give him the maximum sentence."

<snipped>

http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf/story/peru-court-dutchmans-extradition-after-sentence/ba9b5f9caa344925992cde4daa18c76f


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 06, 2012, 02:21:56 PM
Been reading everyone's comments about whether Joran will be coming to Birmingham, and when.  I am one of those common people of Birmingham and I have to have faith in the FBI here.  I know some of them socially, not privy to their work, but folks, believe in them.  The FBI does not fool around and Natalee is "their daughter" too.  Trust me they will handle this.

Agree.     ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 06, 2012, 05:51:47 PM
Been reading everyone's comments about whether Joran will be coming to Birmingham, and when.  I am one of those common people of Birmingham and I have to have faith in the FBI here.  I know some of them socially, not privy to their work, but folks, believe in them.  The FBI does not fool around and Natalee is "their daughter" too.  Trust me they will handle this.

Agree.     ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks cadillac and Ono.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 06, 2012, 06:12:15 PM
O/T

For anyone that's interested...

RE:  James Edward Hogan US Vice Consul who disappeared in Curacao in Sept 2009

I checked on the case against Abby Hogan last night, and there has been a plea agreement.  She entered a guilty plea to count 5 of the indictment (obstruction of justice), and the government will move for the other six counts in the indictment to be dismissed at sentencing.  She faces a maximum of 20 years.  IIRC originally she faced about 90 years if found guilty of all charges.  Sentencing is scheduled for August 8th.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=6197.msg1528202#msg1528202



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 07, 2012, 12:30:24 AM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Natalee_2005.jpg)


Justice for Natalee!  

 ::justice2NJ::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 07, 2012, 12:33:31 AM
 ::CowboySmiley::  WAAAAY off topic --how 'bout them Thunder?!?!  ....... apologies to KTF ( I know this pains you  -- rumors are you will get a team back soon - I hope so!)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 07, 2012, 02:59:40 AM
Do we have an ignore button? Repeating the same old thing over, and over, and over does not change the fact that NO ONE in Aruba or the Netherlands has an iota of influence in what happens in Peru.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

LOL!!  Where's the "beating the dead horse" icon?

SSDD




SSDD   - love it  ::koaladancing::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 08, 2012, 04:33:08 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/114520-new-evidence-in-murder-case-poentje-sent-to-nfi

New evidence in murder case Poentje sent to NFI         

WEDNESDAY, 6 JUNE 2012 15:02

ORANJESTAD — The Public Prosecutor have asked the Dutch Forensic Institute (NFI) to research new evidence in the murder case of Poentje Castro. The Public Prosecutor doesn’t wish to elaborate on the evidence.Apparently this is new evidence besides the Blackberry from Castro that had been researched earlier in the Netherlands. “This evidence hadn’t been sent to the Netherlands before”, spokesperson Ann Angela said before the Amigoe. The Public Prosecutor expects to receive the results in two to three months. On being asked why it had taken so long before the evidence was sent to the Netherlands, Angela replied: “We needed time to place it in a legal framework, to see what was possible from a technical point of view and to formulate the research question.” For instance, an examining magistrate on Aruba is to appoint an expert in the Netherlands who is to research the evidence. Moreover, Angela explained that this evidence came to light during the current investigation. It only became clear later on that this evidence ‘required further research’.

TV-presenter and research journalist Poentje Castro was found dead in his garden on the morning of December 23rd 2010. From the autopsy it appeared he had been shot twice around eleven o’clock the evening before. A Team Large-scale Operation (TGO) was deployed because there were very few leads from the beginning of the investigation. This often happens with serious penal acts (such as murder or kidnapping) when it’s not clear who the perpetrator is. Until now, nobody has been arrested for the murder.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 08, 2012, 04:43:33 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/114227-james-murray-arrived-on-curacao-

James Murray arrived on Curaçao         

TUESDAY, 5 JUNE 2012 11:17

WILLEMSTAD — James Murray, who was sentenced to life-imprisonment in 1980 for the murder of Darly Lai (6), arrived on Curaçao yesterday afternoon. He is on the island for a psychiatric and psychological examination prior to his case coming up for trail on provisional release.Murray (originally from Aruba) committed the offence on Curaçao, where he lived at the time. However, for the past seven years, he’s been serving his time at the KIA on Aruba. According to the new penal code, after twenty years those sentenced to life-imprisonment could qualify for provisional release to consider whether the life imprisonment still serves the purpose. It’s the first time that such trial is held. Although the murder of Darly Lai was committed thirty-three years ago the community still remembers. The news on the trial shocked the community and led to a storm of indignation. More than 21,000 people had signed the petition against Murray’s release.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 08, 2012, 11:26:52 AM
Memorial Day - May 30, 2005

Hope Comes and Then Goes

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts


Page 35 - 36:  We land, and the door opens.  The heat and the humidity hit me hard in the face even at this hour.  Like opening the oven door and getting that big hot blast.  The wind is whipping.  My hair is all over the place.  I can hardly see the steps to go down.  I soon learn this is how it always is here: very hot and very windy.  “Hellish” is the only word that comes to mind.

We walk a few feet into the processing area to show our passports and go through customs.  It's a small unimportant looking structure with a porch connected to the front of it.  The owner of the plane has arranged for "handlers" to meet us here to assist with customs and ground transportation, common practice when private planes arrive in Aruba.

An official-looking American woman in the processing area draws my attention.  Her badge identifies her as a U.S. Homeland Security Office representative, and I hone in on her like radar.  The sight of her is our fist real sign of hope.  I walk over to her and have to restrain myself from grabbing her by her lapels and pulling her into a hug to thank her for being here for us.  All the calls made to the FBI and the U.S. Embassy by Natalee's brother and our friends must have paid off.  That's why this official person is here to help us.  I get very close to her and begin to tell her about Natalee and what has happened.  Talking a mile a minute, I explain about Natalee's disappearance and our desperate situation.  I ask for her help in figuring out where to start and what to do.

She never changes her stance, remaining in an "at ease" position with her hands behind her back.  She has very little to say; volunteers no information.  The encouraging thoughts that lifted me when I first laid eyes on her are quickly extinuished as I learn that she is always here.  The Aruba airport is her post.  She isn't here for us.  She can't do a single thing to help Natalee.  She has no special powers.  No authority.

This is the first of hundreds of times along this impending tragic journey that hope would dissolve almost as quickly as it would appear.  It would wash over us like the tide, then ebb.  Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in, and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to press on in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.


Following the January trial ... Beth Holloway's attorney was anticipating it would not be long before Joran van der Sloot would be facing a judge in a Birmingham courtroom.

Following the March court hearing with Peruvian Judge Zenaida Vilca ... Joran van der Sloot's attorney was not optimistic.  It was his perception that his client would be extradiction to States in the near future.

How could both John Q. Kelly and Maximo Altez have been so wrong in regards to the ruling that would be arrived at by the Peruvian Supreme Court.

If the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet do not overrule the Supreme Court's decision it will be another "faded hope" for Beth Holloway and ... other "big win" for Joran van der Sloot.

Janet

+++++
   
Beth Holloway's Attorney

Joran Van Der Sloot Gets 28 Years in Peru, Now US Wants Him
Jan. 13, 2012


Joran van der Sloot was sentenced today to 28 years in a Peruvian prison for strangling a woman there, and American officials are now expected to bring him to Alabama to face charges in connection with the disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway.

The attorney for Holloway's mother, John Q. Kelly, said after today's sentencing that he hopes van der Sloot will be extradited to the U.S. within "a couple of months."

Van der Sloot is charged with extorting $25,000 from Holloway's grieving mother Beth Holloway in exchange for information about the location of Natalee's body. After receving the money, van der Sloot admitted lying about where the girl's body was buried.

"We anticipate that U.S. authorities will move quickly to bring him to Alabama to face pending federal charges and to answer for his past conduct in Aruba," Kelly had said prior to the sentencing.

The U.S. District Attorney in Birmingham, where the case against van der Sloot will be prosecuted, did not immediately return calls for comment. They had previously told ABC News that they had made arrangements with Interpol to have van der Sloot extradited to the U.S.

Any sentence he might receive in the U.S. would be served in conjunction with the 28 years he was sentenced in Peru, Kelly said.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/joran-van-der-sloot-28-years-now-us/story?id=15353765


Joran van der Sloot's Attorney

May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

Altez spoke to ABC News after van der Sloot appeared in a jailhouse courtroom at Piedras Gordas prison, about two hours north of Lima.

Peruvian Judge Zenaida Vilca heard arguments by U.S. Justice Department officials pushing for the extradition while  Altez opposed the move on grounds his client could not receive a fair trial in a U.S. court.

<snipped>

Van der Sloot, appearing nervous and thinner than in previous appearances, was marched by prison officials to the courtroom, handcuffed and refusing to answer questions posed by nearby reporters.

<snipped>

Altz spoke with ABC News after the court appearance and said van der Sloot was “very upset with the prospect of being extradited to the U.S. I haven’t seen Joran so down, so depressed since I took on his defense almost two years ago.”

The extortion and wire fraud charges relate to payments allegedly made to van der Sloot by the Holloway family for information on the whereabouts of their daughter’s body.

In court U.S. legal officials argued that there is evidence that will show that van der Sloot arranged for and accepted those payments. Altez says that van der Sloot was lured into taking those payments and that it wasn’t on his client’s initiative.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 08, 2012, 02:29:27 PM
http://www.dutchcaribbeanlegalportal.com/news/movers-shakers/79-a-new-challenge/2060-officier-stemper-voortijdig-weg-vervanger-al-aangenomen

Google translation

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Aruba%20Misc/06072012_LarsStempher-1.jpg)

I don't know if the Alex Mathew case has anything to do with his leaving or not, but this is part of an article from April...

http://www.amigoe.com/english/107068-om-no-drugs-were-found-in-mathews-residence

OM: ‘No drugs were found in Mathew’s residence’         
MONDAY, 2 APRIL 2012 11:36

 ::snipping2::

As main suspect in the Strea-case, Mathew made accusations against case-officer Lars Stempher last Thursday. Stempher had supposedly told Mathew that he could let someone else run Foxy Lady because he still has the permits for the strip club. Furthermore, the OM supposedly obstructs Mathew’s defense by withholding documents and hindering the access to witnesses. Blanken denies these imputations. “There is no question of obstruction whatsoever. The fact is that some people are difficult to trace. At the moment, we still have two or three requests for legal assistance pending to hear witnesses.” Blanken states that Mathew’s lawyers handled all requests to hear witnesses.

All witnesses were heard by the examining judge (RC). “During the hearing of witnesses, both the OM and the defense had asked questions”, says Blanken, and the examining judge made sure that both sides were given the opportunity to ask questions. “If any questions were dropped then it’s for the sake of efficiency. Moreover, the session judge monitors the examining judge. If the session judge decides that the examining judge has not done a good job, the hearing procedure is to be followed again from the bottom up. As far as I know, until now the session judge saw no need to intervene in this case.” Blanken emphasizes once again that all complaints from Mathew had to be raised during the pro-forma sessions. “This is also the place to raise complaints.”


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 09, 2012, 09:36:06 AM
June 6, 2012

 ::snipping2::

Under Peruvian law, and under the country's extradition treaty with the U.S., Peru's justice minister and the Peruvian Cabinet must also approve the court's decision.

"At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," his attorney, Maximo Altez said.

 ::snipping2::

http://crime.about.com/b/2012/06/06/van-der-sloot-extradition-delayed.htm


I wonder how much political clout the US has with Peru. Does Peru owe the US any favors, and would the US be willing to cash in on it to get Joran here?

One can only hope.  This ain't over yet!!!!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 09, 2012, 09:58:36 AM

FLASHBACK: JUNE 5, 2005 - JUNE 9, 2005

The Arrests of the Security Guards - The Arrests of Joran, Deepak and Satish


Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Excerpts:

Page 120:
  One week ago this day Natalee was making plans with her friends to spend her last night in Aruba at Carlos ‘n Charlies.  She left there with Joran van der Sloot and hasn’t been seen since.

Early this morning two dark-skinned native Aruban security guards from the Allegro Hotel are arrested in connection with Natalee’s disappearance.  Surely a result of yesterday’s room-by-room search of that hotel.  Their clothes were taken.  Their cars are impounded.  Potential evidence is removed from their homes.  They are handcuffed and perp-walked to police cars and taken away. These security guards are labelled on the news as suspects in Natalee’s disappearance.

Apparently it’s not difficult to get a search warrant for these two.  But one certainly could not be obtained last week as we stood in the front yard of Joran van der Sloot’s house as he told of his sexual encounter with Natalee.  His father, Paulus, refused to let anyone inside their house, including the police.

Natalee never returned to the Holiday Inn. We had seen the tapes with a room full of police officials.  These two security guards also do not appear on the Holiday Inn security videos that we were shown.  So why these arrests?  Islanders are outraged.  And so are we.  It’s blatant discrimination.

Page 121:  As we continue to move yet further away from the young men with whom Natalee was last seen, we are well aware that valuable evidence that could have been gathered that first morning is slowly and tragically being lost.  Police didn’t take the clothes from van der Sloot.  They didn’t search his house.  They didn’t arrest him after he lied to police right there in his front yard about taking Natalee back to the Holiday Inn.  They haven’t labelled him or the Kalpoe brothers as suspects.  The car belonging to Deepak Kalpoe has not been impounded.  And forensic tests have not been done.  There might be evidence there.  Everywhere.  But we can’t get the police to focus on the obvious.

And finally we learn from the Wyndham Hotel manager that Joran and Deepak do not appear on their security videos at the time the two claimed to be at a poker tournament there – the same time we were standing in the van der Sloots’ front yard in the wee hours of May 31.

“Something’s wrong,” I half whisper to Jug, following the arrests of the two security guards, and ask him to find an office supply store so we can have notebooks, paper, and pens to document these bizarre events.  I’ve been taking scrap notes all along, but now begin to write down in a notebook every single thing that happens, word for word, from this day forward.

Page 122:  The arrest yesterday of the two security guards is so obviously a move in the wrong direction.  My cursing is fluid and intense.  I’m challenging God and His power to help me.  Jug asks me to pray with him.  “I’m not praying, Jug.  You pray.  Because it isn’t working.”  He is so sad.  Feeling helpless, totally helpless ….

Page 124:  I don't tolerate painkillers well.  And I'm so close to losing control that I'm afraid taking these pills will make me even worse.  So I don't take them.  I want to remain alert for Natalee, in case a call comes in.  In case there's news.  Just in case.

The only things that help are the beautiful messages of hope starting to stream in.  People send their favorite scriptures ...

Romans 5:1-5
Therefore since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we not stand.  And we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.  Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces endurance, and endurance produces character, and character produces hope ...


Page 126:  Then finally, ten days after Natalee's disappearance, our prayers are answered.  The police move in the right direction.  They arrest Joran van der Sloot and Deepak and Satish Kalpoe on suspicion of kidnapping and murder.  The suspects had ten days to cover their tracks.  Ten days to corroborate their stories.  And ten days to lawyer up.

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 09, 2012, 12:16:29 PM
Could it be that the Birmingham prosecutor and John Kelly are behind the scenes demanding answers or ... maybe their current silence implies they are waiting patiently for the the final decision by the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet?  I can only assume that they are not pleased with the Peruvian Supreme Court's decision.

It makes sense that the decision of the the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet will not happen until there is a ruling forthcoming regarding Joran's appeal of his sentence.  Maybe not.

Janet

+++++

Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

"At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," his attorney told the AP.

The political process is rooted in the extradition treaty between the United States and Peru. The treaty allows a person who's convicted of a crime in Peru to be extradited to the United States to face prosecution for a separate crime.

If convicted and sentenced in the United States, the person would be sent back to Peru to finish his sentence, then extradited again to the United States to serve time there.

But Peru's Supreme Court apparently wants Joran van der Sloot to first serve out his Peruvian prison sentence before standing trial in the United States on lesser charges related to the Holloway case.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605


Peru court: Can extradite Dutchman after prison
June 4, 2012, 2:55 p.m. PDT


<snipped>

Federal prosecutors in Birmingham, Alabama, where Van der Sloot is charged, declined to comment on the court's decision. Kelly said he had no immediate comment.

<snipped>

http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf/story/peru-court-dutchmans-extradition-after-sentence/ba9b5f9caa344925992cde4daa18c76f


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 09, 2012, 01:24:37 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/english/114652-public-prosecutor-investigation-into-shoot-out-renaissance-almost-finished

Public Prosecutor: ‘Investigation into shoot-out Renaissance almost finished’         

THURSDAY, 7 JUNE 2012 11:12

ORANJESTAD — The judicial investigation into the shoot-out on the parking lot of Renaissance Marketplace on February 22nd last is in the final stage. Late this week or early next week the family members involved and the public will be informed on the outcome. The Public Prosecutor stated this before the Amigoe on being asked.By our reporter

Alex Laclé

Two Columbian drug suspects were killed during the shoot-out in broad daylight. During an attempt to arrest the suspects, the arrest team from the police opened fire on the suspects’ vehicle for unknown reasons, thus killing the two suspects. The public in the busy shopping center panicked and sought cover and nobody was injured.

In the vehicle the police officers discovered approximately 11 kilograms of cocaine. A third suspect, 32-year old W.G.A.H., was arrested elsewhere shortly after the incident. Twelve kilos of coke was also discovered while conducting house searches related to this case. The American Drug Enforcement Administration (DAE) was involved with the investigation and requests extradition of the third suspect. However, inquiry with the Public Prosecutor reveals that this suspect is still in custody on Aruba. As the suspect is resisting extradition, the process could easily take one year. “The court is yet to handle the request and a date for such hasn’t been given,” said spokesperson Angela.

Unarmed

Under command of the National Criminal Investigation Department, Justice began an investigation into the shoot-out. The suspects who had been shot were namely unarmed. 

::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 09, 2012, 01:34:07 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba?start=15

Google translation

Police dive for dumped safes

FRIDAY, JUNE 8, 2012 9:45

ORANGE CITY - A police diving team search the coast of Malmok at the bottom of the sea to safes. This would have been dumped there by a group of burglars who was recently arrested by the police. The thieves were reportedly more than twenty houses have been robbed and a total of more than 100,000 florins and have captured several fine and costume jewelery. Justice has now about ten burglars arrested. Research showed that the broken vaults by the burglars ...
Read more ...

Family doubts cause of death suspect

FRIDAY, JUNE 8, 2012 9:45

ORANGE CITY - The family of Sandro Giovanni Quandt (42), who in the night of Wednesday to Thursday after a police chase was killed, doubts about the actions of the officers involved. When family yesterday the body was identified, they were shocked by the injuries that Quandt had suffered.
Read more ...


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 09, 2012, 01:35:54 PM
Does the Supreme Court ruled on Joran's sentence appeal.  I could be wrong but I get the impression that there is a real possibility that the 28 year sentence that translates into 9 years could be overturned.  In other words ... no justice of Stephany Flores.

Janet

+++++   

Peru court: Van der Sloot's extradition after sentence
Must serve out his 28-year prison sentence

Updated: Monday, 04 Jun 2012, 1:15 PM CDT
Published : Monday, 04 Jun 2012, 11:28 AM CDT


<snipped>

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter.

Altez said his client would resist that.

"At the end of the day, the decision on whether to extradite Joran is political," he said.

He contends Van der Sloot could not receive a fair trial in the United States "because he's been satanized by the press. He is seen as a demon in the United States and would be judged by a jury made up of common people who are influenced by the press and would surely give him the maximum sentence."

<snipped>

http://www.kxan.com/dpps/news/international/peru-court-says-van-der-sloots-extradition-after-sentence-wd12-jgr_4195028

s.t.





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 09, 2012, 03:37:15 PM
Thanks, TxMom--sounds like a real crimewave in Aruba with the cops running amok!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 09, 2012, 03:41:46 PM
Been reading everyone's comments about whether Joran will be coming to Birmingham, and when.  I am one of those common people of Birmingham and I have to have faith in the FBI here.  I know some of them socially, not privy to their work, but folks, believe in them.  The FBI does not fool around and Natalee is "their daughter" too.  Trust me they will handle this.

Agree.     ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks cadillac and Ono.   ::MonkeyCool::

Then there are trials "In absentia" such as the one that conviced Manuel Noriaga.  Could have a nice sentence already awaiting Joran upon his release from Peruvian prison.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Northern Rose on June 10, 2012, 12:31:39 AM
Newton South Grad Starts Foundation, Raises Funds for Women's Safety
June 5, 2012

When news headlines fade and a terrible event falls into "yesterday's news," it doesn't always mean the story has ended. In fact, sometimes it means a new story is just beginning.

Such is the case with Newton South graduate Lily Konowitz, and her story of survival.

While in Aruba on spring break in April 2011, Konowitz was attacked by a stranger who was hiding in a restaurant bathroom. Konowitz, who was 18 at the time, was able to fight off her attacker using skills she learned in a Rape Aggression Defense (RAD) program with the Newton Police Department.

 ::snipping2::

http://newton.patch.com/articles/lily-konowitz-gala-in-defense-of-self-defense


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 10, 2012, 01:17:23 AM
I'm so glad she escaped and is now helping others.

Bless this young woman!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 10, 2012, 01:20:59 AM


Then there are trials "In absentia" such as the one that conviced Manuel Noriaga.  Could have a nice sentence already awaiting Joran upon his release from Peruvian prison.

Bubba will be waiting and he won't care how old you are!!

Bwaaahahaha......

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 10, 2012, 11:18:11 AM
Newton South Grad Starts Foundation, Raises Funds for Women's Safety
June 5, 2012

When news headlines fade and a terrible event falls into "yesterday's news," it doesn't always mean the story has ended. In fact, sometimes it means a new story is just beginning.

Such is the case with Newton South graduate Lily Konowitz, and her story of survival.

While in Aruba on spring break in April 2011, Konowitz was attacked by a stranger who was hiding in a restaurant bathroom. Konowitz, who was 18 at the time, was able to fight off her attacker using skills she learned in a Rape Aggression Defense (RAD) program with the Newton Police Department.

 ::snipping2::

http://newton.patch.com/articles/lily-konowitz-gala-in-defense-of-self-defense

I remember this, Klaas and I posted about articles it (links below) from the U. S. and Aruba.

As usual there were those who questioned whether or not her story was true...or if she was just trying to "soil" Aruba's reputation!

 ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyMad::

April 2011 Amigoe article

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=9630.msg1332066#msg1332066

After it finally hit the U. S. press in July

Several posts about it on these pages...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=9791.490

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=9791.500


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 10, 2012, 12:43:39 PM
https://picasaweb.google.com/115074869061240201166/WineFoodArtFestivalTheWestinResortCasinoAruba8June2012#5752000797709140754 (https://picasaweb.google.com/115074869061240201166/WineFoodArtFestivalTheWestinResortCasinoAruba8June2012#5752000797709140754)

Wine Food & Art Festival - June 8, 2012

FREDDY ZEDAN ARAMBATZIS

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/DSC_0041.jpg)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/freddy060812.jpg)

FREDDY - June 8, 2010


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/Freddy060810.jpg)

FREDDY - August 12. 2005 in Joran's back yard


(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/Freddy08012005.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: sharon on June 10, 2012, 01:38:18 PM
Freddy knows  ::MonkeyMad::

 ::justice2NJ:: ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 10, 2012, 01:42:54 PM
Freddy knows  ::MonkeyMad::

 ::justice2NJ:: ::justice2NJ::

 ::rhino::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 10, 2012, 01:50:30 PM
Freddy knows  ::MonkeyMad::

 ::justice2NJ:: ::justice2NJ::

He's filled out and then some..... must be the worrying!  Looks like a lot of the PIMPS have put on extra weight.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 10, 2012, 02:06:39 PM
Freddie is beginning to look like Dompig!  Can the Dennis Miller (was that the name of the super fat LE?) be far behind?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: sharon on June 10, 2012, 02:21:28 PM
Freddie is beginning to look like Dompig!  Can the Dennis Miller (was that the name of the super fat LE?) be far behind?

Dennis Miller = says he's a comedian (he used to be funny)

Dennis Jacobs = cornflake king of aruba, brings new definition to the term 'large bones'.

Hiya Anna  ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 10, 2012, 02:21:50 PM
Freddie is beginning to look like Dompig!  Can the Dennis Miller (was that the name of the super fat LE?) be far behind?
I think you mean Dennis Jacobs!!  ::MonkeyCool::  ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 10, 2012, 02:51:01 PM
Dennis Jacobs 2005

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/jacobs22.jpg)



Dennis Jacobs 2010 (I think)

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/jacobs2.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 10, 2012, 03:31:34 PM


Dennis Miller = says he's a comedian (he used to be funny)


Dennis Jacobs = cornflake king of aruba, brings new definition to the term 'large bones'.

Hiya Anna  ::MonkeyAngel::

Miller was funny when he stuck to comedy.  Now, he is THE JOKE as a political commentator.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 10, 2012, 07:25:27 PM
THE FRUIT FLIES


(http://ufdcimages.uflib.ufl.edu/CA/03/40/00/01/00205/00331.jpg)
Dennis Jacobs
back row standing 2nd man to the left.


(http://www.diario.aw/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/polisnan.jpg)
Dennis Jacobs receives award


Dennis Jacobs
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=591013864
Born on December 20, 1956
FRIENDS
Daniel Jacobs
Alex Boekhoudt
Works at Korps Politie Aruba
Andre Geerman
Politieambtenaar at Korps Politie Aruba
Julia Renfro
Edric Soemers
Colegio Arubano
Edwin Geerman
Lili Fonseca
Eric Soemers
Jair Oduber
Korps Politie Aruba


Jennifer Geerman
Works at Korps Politie Caribisch Nederland
John Koolman
First Officer at Insel air Aruba

HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!! GOD BLESS YOU, TOMORROW I GO TO ARUBA, DON´T FORGET THE DRINK!!!
December 20, 2011 at 10:42am near Chía, Cundinamarca ·

Dennis Jacobs Ok baby
December 20, 2011 at 10:49am

Lili Fonseca very fast!!!
December 22, 2011 at 2:49pm

Lili Fonseca thank you!!
December 22, 2011 at 2:50pm
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=591013864&sk=wall

Clyde Burke
Pabien y hopi anja mas Macobs
December 20, 2011 at 7:26am ·

Dennis Jacobs Danki bitch
December 20, 2011 at 12:46pm
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=591013864&sk=wall

Paul Seute
Happy bday may you grow old and toothless
December 17, 2011 at 6:53pm ·

Dennis Jacobs Masha danki Paul
December 20, 2011 at 4:28am
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=591013864&sk=wall

Dennis posted a link to Eric Soemers's Wall.


http://www.facebook.com/eric.soemers
ERIC SOEMERS
Eric Soemers
Worked at Korps Politie ArubaMarried to Linda E. SoemersBorn on September 7, 1958


Family

Elvin Soemers
Son

Urslyn Soemers
Daughter
19 years

Edric Soemers
Son
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1347671074
HIS WIFE: Linda E. Soemers
Born Sept 4, 1960
About Linda   I'm a driving instructor for almost 7 years now. I love my job. And love my students.
Relationship Status   Married to Eric Soemers
Annhttp://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1347671074
iversary   December 21, 1979
Family

Myrna V Henriquez
Sister

Jonathan Henriquez
Brother

Domingo Henriquezbob
Brother

Vicento Henriquez
Brother

Hyacintha Henriquez
Sister

Juanita Semerel
Sister

Elvin Soemers
Son

Urslyn Soemers
Daughter
18 years

nephew of Eric & Linda Soemers is
Daniel Vrolijk

http://www.facebook.com/daniel.vrolijk

He is an Engineering at Marriott HotelS studied Finance at E.P.I



Marcelino Vrolijk
Works at Korps Politie ArubaStudied at POI ArubaIn a relationshipBorn on January 5, 1987
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1167316031


Shaniro Kelly
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=706288198&sk=friends&v=friends
friends with Max Arrends


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 10, 2012, 07:32:09 PM
Well, they knew what they were looking for and such good English too.


[<<]  [>>]
Domain Name
(Unknown) 
IP Address 77.40.126.# (OJSC VolgaTelecom)
ISP OJSC VolgaTelecom
Location Continent:Asia
Country:Russian Federation  (Facts)
State/Region:Mariy-El
City:Yoshkar-Ola
Lat/Long :56.6369, 47.8711 (Map)
Language Russian (Russian Fed.)
ru-ru Operating System 
Microsoft WinNT Browser Firefox 
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:12.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/12.0
Javascript version 1.5
Monitor Resolution:1360 x 768
Color Depth : 24 bits
Time of Visit Jun 10 2012 6:53:09 pm
Last Page View Jun 10 2012 6:53:09 pm
Visit Length 0 seconds
Page Views 1
Referring URL http://www.google.ru...bFiZ35Aw&usg=AFQjCNG
Search Engine google.ru
Search Words night talk radio live
Visit Entry Page http://scaredmonkeys...rview-dave-holloway/
Visit Exit Page http://scaredmonkeys...rview-dave-holloway/
Out Click
Time Zone UTC+3:00
Visitor's Time Jun 11 2012 2:53:09 am
Visit Number 31,352,797
 http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/10/01/sunday-night-talk-radio-dana-pretzer-interview-dave-holloway/



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: KittyMom on June 10, 2012, 08:45:37 PM
That Dennis Jacobs guy looks like he's got a shrunken head. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 10, 2012, 08:53:23 PM
From his facebook:

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/70666_591013864_855480420_n.jpg)

http://www.facebook.com/dennis.jacobs.714?sk=wall (http://www.facebook.com/dennis.jacobs.714?sk=wall)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 10, 2012, 09:05:07 PM
That Dennis Jacobs guy looks like he's got a shrunken head. 

Looks like a gay woman to me ..... ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 10, 2012, 09:46:25 PM
It appears that the attorney of Stephany Flores family has been denied a voice in regards to the charges the Peruvian Prosecutor filed against Joran van der Sloot ... the charges that a panel of Peruvian judges upheld as well as the perception the murderer of Stephany Flores has been receiving preferential treatment since the getgo while being detained in Peru.

Janet

+++++

Flores, Holloway families await van der Sloot's trial
1/13/2012


<snipped>

Stephany Flores’ family is still holding out hope they can convince the court to increase the charges to include a possible life sentence. Stephany’s father, Ricardo Flores, claims Van der Sloot has lived “like a king” while the Flores family mourns.

Prosecutor Miriam Castellares is asking for 30 years in prison, on charges of murder and simple theft; however, Flores’ family is asking the public prosecutor to amend the charges to “robbery followed by murder.”

According to Edwar Alvarez, the Flores family’s lawyer, with different charges Van der Sloot could receive life imprisonment.

"We aim to present evidence during the trial that will lead the prosecutor to change the classification of the crime, so that it becomes robbery followed by murder. This will not be 30 years in prison, but life imprisonment,” he told the Lima newspaper El Comercio.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Flores-Holloway-families-await-van-der-Sloots/KxiEyoDHDEypHoVG4yN6Sw.cspx


Van der Sloot Gets 28 Years for Murder in Peru
Jan 13, 2012 6:15 PM EST


<snipped>
 
After the conviction, the victim’s father, Ricardo Flores, and older brother, Enrique, held a press conference. “We’re about to conclude an investigation, and we hope we’ll be able to release the information on Monday regarding the excess privileges this man has had from the first day of his seclusion,” said Mr. Ricardo Flores.
 
Flores’s attorney took the microphone and demanded: “How can it be that a person that is in prison is more comfortable than if he were free? We will hold a press conference to present all the irregularities in this man’s imprisonment on Monday.”

<snipped>

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/01/13/van-der-sloot-gets-28-years-for-murder-in-peru.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 10, 2012, 10:15:32 PM


'Scarborough Country' for Oct. 24th
updated 7:06 a.m. PT, Tues., Oct. 25, 2005


<snipped>

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, MOTHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: ... I have told Prime Minister Oduber that I will do this, I will be the voice of Natalee for the next 40 years. And I hope I have that long, because I will do it as long as I can.

<snipped>

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9813596


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 10, 2012, 10:17:57 PM

Joran van der Sloot

'I wanted to get back at Natalee's family - her parents have been making my life tough for five years.'

October 2010

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Van-der-Sloot-true-story-book/zMY1TGGVkU2Kc8LMCiU6pA.cspx

 
Beth Holloway

'If he thinks I've been pestering him for the past five years, he hasn't seen anything yet.'

November 2010

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/archief/de-confrontatie-tussen-beth-en-joran/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 10, 2012, 11:37:20 PM

Flores, Holloway families await van der Sloot's trial
1/13/2012


<snipped>

Stephany Flores’ family is still holding out hope they can convince the court to increase the charges to include a possible life sentence. Stephany’s father, Ricardo Flores, claims Van der Sloot has lived “like a king” while the Flores family mourns.

Prosecutor Miriam Castellares is asking for 30 years in prison, on charges of murder and simple theft; however, Flores’ family is asking the public prosecutor to amend the charges to “robbery followed by murder.”

According to Edwar Alvarez, the Flores family’s lawyer, with different charges Van der Sloot could receive life imprisonment.

"We aim to present evidence during the trial that will lead the prosecutor to change the classification of the crime, so that it becomes robbery followed by murder. This will not be 30 years in prison, but life imprisonment,” he told the Lima newspaper El Comercio.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Flores-Holloway-families-await-van-der-Sloots/KxiEyoDHDEypHoVG4yN6Sw.cspx


Was Joran van der Sloot's guilty plea all about preventing the attorney of Stephany Flores' family from putting forth a case during a trial to raise the bar in regards to the prosecutor's charges ... the prosecutor's charges that implied a 28 year sentence rather than a life sentence ... a 28 year sentence that translated into less than 10 years.

Was appealing the sentence part of the plan prior to the the judge's ruling ... appealing the sentence with the anticipation of lowering the bar even further?

Janet

+++++


ISSUES WITH JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL
Joran Van Der Sloot Pleads Guilty to Murder
Aired January 11, 2012 - 19:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I think he should get life, as does the family of Stephany Flores. But why does this all seem contrived and orchestrated to me? Why does this all feel like some kind of play where everybody knew what their role was today?

JON LEIBERMAN, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Because it was, Jane. I mean, I`ve been doing this a long time and I`ve never seen somebody confess to a murder and manage to re-victimize another family while they`re confessing to the murder of another woman. It was sickening.

I mean, to use the words that he was persecuted and -- you know, by the Natalee Holloway attention that he got and that he was triggered to kill somebody because of the intense media scrutiny from Natalee Holloway in that case? That was absolutely sickening.

<snipped.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Last Friday Joran got in trouble for his courtroom antics and the judge had to tell him cut it out. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): Will the defendant please stand up? Stand up. You are in a court of law. You have to behave appropriately. You have to sit appropriately.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Look at this guy. He is smiling, grinning from ear to ear today. And this is him last Friday yawning. He fell asleep at one point. There he is. Take a look at that. Yes, he`s having a nap in court. His future at stake. And he`s napping.

You`re charged with murder, Joran, and you can`t stay awake? And then the giggling, the laughing.

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1201/11/ijvm.01.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 10, 2012, 11:39:15 PM
https://picasaweb.google.com/115074869061240201166/DriftingBushiriKarting10June2012#5752572691162902706

Alwin Rasmijn>drifting @ bushiri karting 10 june 2012>Photo 64 of 64

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-XdJ0-DH3CKQ/T9U-YllgsLI/AAAAAAADTkw/omIWx308BvU/s640/DSC_0159.JPG)

Freddy and Jessica


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 11, 2012, 02:41:18 AM
I wonder what kind of product one takes to only lose weight in their head. Fascinating!

Old Cornflakes even got his dimples back.

(http://www.diario.aw/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/polisnan.jpg)

Come to the light!!!!! Come to the LIGHHHHHHT!!!!! - Poltergeist
::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 11, 2012, 03:16:37 AM
Has he been pumping estrogen shots or something? He is going a bit Priscilla Queen of the Desert or something. Wow - that's a trip!

I know Aruba is a weird place... but man, somebody make it stop. ::MonkeyKiss::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 11, 2012, 04:05:42 AM

Flores, Holloway families await van der Sloot's trial
1/13/2012


<snipped>

Stephany Flores’ family is still holding out hope they can convince the court to increase the charges to include a possible life sentence. Stephany’s father, Ricardo Flores, claims Van der Sloot has lived “like a king” while the Flores family mourns.

Prosecutor Miriam Castellares is asking for 30 years in prison, on charges of murder and simple theft; however, Flores’ family is asking the public prosecutor to amend the charges to “robbery followed by murder.”

According to Edwar Alvarez, the Flores family’s lawyer, with different charges Van der Sloot could receive life imprisonment.

"We aim to present evidence during the trial that will lead the prosecutor to change the classification of the crime, so that it becomes robbery followed by murder. This will not be 30 years in prison, but life imprisonment,” he told the Lima newspaper El Comercio.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Flores-Holloway-families-await-van-der-Sloots/KxiEyoDHDEypHoVG4yN6Sw.cspx



Was appealing the sentence part of the plan prior to the the judge's ruling ... appealing the sentence with the anticipation of lowering the bar even further?


Yes, it was discussed prior to trial by many, including the defense, that Joran pleading guilty would prevent a trial and thus prevent the possibility that the prosecution could introduce evidence that would lead to greater charges.  Joran knew in advance that he could appeal the sentence but not his conviction if he plead guilty.  It was stated again during the trial by Joran and/or the defense attorney.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 11, 2012, 04:08:21 AM
Has he been pumping estrogen shots or something? He is going a bit Priscilla Queen of the Desert or something. Wow - that's a trip!

I know Aruba is a weird place... but man, somebody make it stop. ::MonkeyKiss::

That was what I said - he looks feminized, except I said he looked like a gay woman.  I swear I saw some boobage!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 10:51:57 AM
An oxymoron!

When the Peruvian Supreme Court's ruling is considered ... how would  a successful appeal of Joran's sentence result in an immediate extradiction?

Could it be the final decision of Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet is known but has not been revealed?.  In other words ... the Monkey Justice Train may be rolling into Birmingham sooner than later.

Janet

++++++


Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


<snipped>

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605


Peru court: Van der Sloot's extradition after sentence
Must serve out his 28-year prison sentence
Updated: Monday, 04 Jun 2012, 1:15 PM CDT
Published : Monday, 04 Jun 2012, 11:28 AM CDT


<snipped>

Van der Sloot is appealing his sentence and the Supreme Court said that if the appeal is successful he could be extradited immediately thereafter.

<snipped>
 
http://www.kxan.com/dpps/news/international/peru-court-says-van-der-sloots-extradition-after-sentence-wd12-jgr_4195028


Joran Van Der Sloot Pleads Guilty to Murder
Aired January 11, 2012 - 19:00   ET


<snipped>

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I think he should get life, as does the family of Stephany Flores. But why does this all seem contrived and orchestrated to me? Why does this all feel like some kind of play where everybody knew what their role was today?

<snipped>

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1201/11/ijvm.01.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 11:12:04 AM
Is it standard procedure for the Peruvian Dutch embassy to immediately provide their  citizens who are detained in Peru with a private attorney?

Janet

+++++


carpe noctem
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #836 6/8/10 -
« Reply #916 on: June 10, 2010, 12:57:31 AM »


Those rusty Dutch buggers just can`t keep their hands off that boy, can they?

It`s built in to their DNA.

As was learned, the Dutchman would have the advice of a private lawyer had been hired by diplomats from the embassy.

http://www.ojo.com.pe/ojo/nota.php?txtSecci_id=25&txtNota_id=368861


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8078.msg1153576#msg1153576




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 11, 2012, 01:30:42 PM
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=759158169

Sebastian van der Sloot

(https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/370967_759158169_1442362950_n.jpg)

(enlarged)
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201203.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1362656400

Hanni Peters-den Boer

(resized)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055843078762&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4055850798955&set=a.4055842998760.172494.1362656400&type=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201202-1.jpg)



http://www.emerson.edu/commencement/event-schedule

 ::snipping2::

Monday, May 14, 2012

One Hundred and Thirty-Second Undergraduate Commencement, 11:00 am–1:00 pm
(Free, Ticket Required) Citi Performing Arts Center (The Wang Theatre)
270 Tremont Street, Boston General seating. Doors open at 10:30 am.

Undergraduate Commencement Reception 1:15–2:45 pm, weather permitting
(Free, Ticket Required) Tents on Boston Common
Celebrate the graduates at a reception in their honor. Tickets available at the Commencement Office.

 ::snipping2::

Wonder if this might be the blonde girl?

Val's cousin, Marianne Vandersloot?

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=7185.msg1078406#msg1078406

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_a-1.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/Toon%20Van%20der%20Sloot/MarianneVanderSloot_CDA2.jpg)

I was wrong, it wasn't Marianne Van der Sloot.

Apparently Valentijn has a new girlfriend.

Hillary Hawkins

https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=3247848590954&set=a.1410612221193.2052205.1109100119&type=3

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH05-1.jpg)



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 11, 2012, 01:33:50 PM
https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

Hillary Hawkins
Studying Marketing Communication at Emerson College
Lives in Boston, Massachusetts
In a relationship with Valentijn van der Sloot
From Sarasota, Florida

In a Relationship with Valentijn van der Sloot
March 4, 2012

Hillary Hawkins became friends with Valentijn van der Sloot.
August 30, 2011

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH01.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH03.jpg)

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH03.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 11, 2012, 01:36:09 PM
She must be about two years younger than he is.

https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

Graduated from Out Of Door Academy
2010
High School


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 11, 2012, 01:41:44 PM
https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

 ::MonkeyRoll::

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH06.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 01:54:46 PM
Is it standard procedure for the Peruvian Dutch embassy to immediately provide their  citizens who are detained in Peru with a private attorney?

Janet

+++++


carpe noctem
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #836 6/8/10 -
« Reply #916 on: June 10, 2010, 12:57:31 AM »


Those rusty Dutch buggers just can`t keep their hands off that boy, can they?

It`s built in to their DNA[/color].

As was learned, the Dutchman would have the advice of a private lawyer had been hired by diplomats from the embassy.

http://www.ojo.com.pe/ojo/nota.php?txtSecci_id=25&txtNota_id=368861


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8078.msg1153576#msg1153576




FROM THE GETGO

Joran van der Sloot - Peru makes evidence public
Published on : 7 June 2010 - 5:33pm


<snipped>

The foreign ministry is still considering whether it will give an official reaction to how the case is being handled. A spokesperson for the ministry told Radio Netherlands Worldwide: "I have asked at the ministry how we should deal with this."
 
Generally, the Netherlands never interferes with legal processes in other countries, but there may well be reason to protest in this case.

<snipped>

http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/joran-van-der-sloot-peru-makes-evidence-public


Van der Sloot remains jailed as murder investigation continues
June 6, 2010 9:39 p.m. EDT


<snipped>

Carlos Neyra, an official with the Peruvian National Police criminal investigation division, said van der Sloot, the sole suspect named in the case, has not been formally charged

Neyra added that van der Sloot now has a lawyer. The Netherlands Embassy says it is working with local authorities in the case, but it is not paying for a defense attorney.

The Embassy has told Peruvian authorities that it is not comfortable with the way van der Sloot has been presented to the media, Neyra said. The Peruvian interior minister is asking authorities not to talk about the case without his authorization.

Van der Sloot arrived Saturday at the Lima police headquarters. Handcuffed and wearing a protective vest, he was escorted through a news conference held by Peruvian authorities as photographers snapped photo after photo.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/06/06/peru.murder.case/index.html?hpt=Sbin


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 11, 2012, 01:57:34 PM
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=2292061296869&set=a.1410612221193.2052205.1109100119&type=3

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH08-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 11, 2012, 02:03:07 PM
https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

 ::MonkeyRoll::

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH06.jpg)

Yuck on Anita's comment, " and in a relationship with me". 

I always thought the girl in the graduation photo was not the cousin.  Though similar in coloring and facial features, the cousin's face is too "old" looking. 

I'm hoping the girl knows of the depravity in the vdS family and that Val has but a trace if any of it.  Val seems to have risen above the stigma of his famous family.  Maybe he is their "black sheep" if you know what I mean (like Marilyn was to the Herman Munster family ...LOL)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 11, 2012, 05:34:01 PM
https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

 ::MonkeyRoll::

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/06112012_VVHH06.jpg)

Yuck on Anita's comment, " and in a relationship with me". 

I always thought the girl in the graduation photo was not the cousin.  Though similar in coloring and facial features, the cousin's face is too "old" looking. 

I'm hoping the girl knows of the depravity in the vdS family and that Val has but a trace if any of it.  Val seems to have risen above the stigma of his famous family.  Maybe he is their "black sheep" if you know what I mean (like Marilyn was to the Herman Munster family ...LOL)

But he carries those Sloot genes.   If I were her parent, I would be worried.   I wouldn't
want my grandchildren to carry the Sloot gene.  ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 11, 2012, 07:07:48 PM

I'm hoping the girl knows of the depravity in the vdS family and that Val has but a trace if any of it.  Val seems to have risen above the stigma of his famous family.  Maybe he is their "black sheep" if you know what I mean (like Marilyn was to the Herman Munster family ...LOL)

But he carries those Sloot genes.   If I were her parent, I would be worried.   I wouldn't
want my grandchildren to carry the Sloot gene.  ::MonkeyShocked::

ooops, forgot about the bad seed.

Some women are weird that way.....look at the ones who flock to the prisons to the men on death row!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 11, 2012, 07:12:50 PM
I wouldn't want the Sloot gene in my family either.  Sometimes we forget about that!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 11, 2012, 09:05:30 PM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

Oh, the ARTISTE. She always looks like a dressed up Easter egg to me. She has a knack for tack, imo.

I am not Joe Fashion or anything... but dayum.

> Dress by PAAS -- Even Ronchi winced. ::HelloKitty::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 09:11:34 PM
ANOTHER "BIG WIN" FOR JORAN VAN DER SLOOT

1.  The Peruvian Prosecutor's Charges

Date set for van der Sloot murder trial
Published: 11/25/2011 9:44
am
Updated: 11/26/2011 8:25 am

<snipped>

In September, the victim's family asked a three-judge panel for a more stringent charge akin to aggravated murder, which carries a maximum sentence of life in prison, but the panel of judges ruled on the prosecution's side.

Van der Sloot's defense attorney Luis Jimenez Navarro told CNN'S In Session this was a big win for his client.  If Van der Sloot is found guilty and sentenced to the maximum penalty, under Peru's jail reduction credits, he may only serve a third of the time.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Date-set-for-van-der-Sloot-murder-trial/J1Yl6nagmkmRXf0qcfRMXA.cspx


2.  The Peruvian Supreme Court's Birmingham Extradition Ruling

Joran van der Sloot challenges extradition to U.S. From Mayra Cuevas
May 9, 2012 -- Updated 1225 GMT (2025 HKT)


CNN) -- Joran van der Sloot told a judge and prosecutor Tuesday that he would prefer to finish serving a 28-year murder sentence in Peru rather than be extradited to the United States to face charges related to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, his Peruvian lawyer said.

Representatives from the U.S. Embassy and the FBI attended the extradition hearing, which was not open to the public, Maximo Altez told InSession on Tru TV.

A conviction in the United States could affect van der Sloot's chances of being paroled in Peru, said Altez. He noted that a long-standing extradition treaty between the two countries means that van der Sloot will likely be extradited, despite his stated preference about remaining in Peru.

Peruvian judges in January sentenced the Dutchman to 28 years in prison for the murder in 2010 of Stephany Flores. He is also the prime suspect in the disappearance of Holloway. U.S. authorities want to try van der Sloot on charges of extortion and wire fraud in the Holloway case.

"I think he will be extradited within the next three months," Altez said last month. "He will go to trial in the United States. Once he is sentenced, he will return to Peru to finish serving his 28 years, and then go back to the States to serve whatever sentence he gets there."

<snipped>

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/05/08/us/peru-van-der-sloot/index.html


June 4, 2012 3:22 PM
Joran van der Sloot will be extradited to US after serving sentence in Peru, judge says


(CBS/AP) LIMA, Peru - Family members of American teen Natalee Holloway may have to wait decades to see the suspect in her disappearance face trial in the United States.

Peru's Supreme Court has approved confessed murderer Joran van der Sloot's extradition to stand trial in the United States but only after the confessed murderer has served out his 28-year prison sentence in the South American nation, his attorney said Monday.

<snipped>

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57446873-504083/joran-van-der-sloot-will-be-extradited-to-us-after-serving-sentence-in-peru-judge-says/


THE NEXT WAVE

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 36: Hope comes, then goes.  But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in,  and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to press on in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.

 ::MonkeyTears::


Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


<snipped>

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 11, 2012, 09:13:49 PM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

Oh, the ARTISTE. She always looks like a dressed up Easter egg to me. She has a knack for tack, imo.

I am not Joe Fashion or anything... but dayum.

> Dress by PAAS -- Even Ronchi winced. ::HelloKitty::
You never fail to make me chuckle out loud!!  ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 09:15:06 PM
THE PERUVIAN JUDICIAL SYSTEM - TAINTED WITH CORRUPTION

Judicial System

Individual Corruption


The Peruvian judicial system is tainted with corruption and official pressure, according to the US Department of State 2010. Similarly, Freedom House 2011 reports that corruption in the judiciary remains rampant. Also Transparency International's Global Corruption Barometer 2010 points out that the judiciary is among the most corrupt public institutions in Peru. According to the report, well over half of the surveyed households consider it as 'extremely corrupt', while more than a quarter reports having paid a bribe in 2009. Also, in the Proética Fifth National Survey on Corruption 2008, the surveyed citizens consider the judiciary to be among the most corrupt institutionsin Peru.  User surveys also indicate that unofficial payments affect both the speed and the final outcome of judicial processes.

<snipped>

http://www.business-anti-corruption.com/country-profiles/latin-america-the-caribbean/peru/corruption-levels/judicial-system/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 11, 2012, 09:22:22 PM
I don't believe Joran Van Der Sloot has had any "big wins" lately.  He's still cooling his heels in a Peruvian Prison.  JMHO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 11, 2012, 09:29:23 PM
I don't believe Joran Van Der Sloot has had any "big wins" lately.  He's still cooling his heels in a Peruvian Prison.  JMHO


LOL!!!!  To continue the gambling metaphors.....

Joran was dealt the losing hand at birth, and hasn't played with a full deck since.

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 11, 2012, 09:31:39 PM
I don't believe Joran Van Der Sloot has had any "big wins" lately.  He's still cooling his heels in a Peruvian Prison.  JMHO
Couldn't agree more!!  ::MonkeyMad::

Remember --- "behind every silver lining -- there's a black cloud"!  -- George Carlin


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 09:43:52 PM

Flores, Holloway families await van der Sloot's trial
1/13/2012


<snipped>

Stephany Flores’ family is still holding out hope they can convince the court to increase the charges to include a possible life sentence. Stephany’s father, Ricardo Flores, claims Van der Sloot has lived “like a king” while the Flores family mourns.

Prosecutor Miriam Castellares is asking for 30 years in prison, on charges of murder and simple theft; however, Flores’ family is asking the public prosecutor to amend the charges to “robbery followed by murder.”

According to Edwar Alvarez, the Flores family’s lawyer, with different charges Van der Sloot could receive life imprisonment.

"We aim to present evidence during the trial that will lead the prosecutor to change the classification of the crime, so that it becomes robbery followed by murder. This will not be 30 years in prison, but life imprisonment,” he told the Lima newspaper El Comercio.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Flores-Holloway-families-await-van-der-Sloots/KxiEyoDHDEypHoVG4yN6Sw.cspx


Joran van der Sloot's guilty plea implied that the attorney of Stephany Flores' family's last chance of raising the bar to a life sentence went down the toilet.

Stephany Flores' father appears not to possess the political influence in Peruvian society that had been anticipated ... the political influence that would assure that real justice would prevail for his precious daughter.

What entity has Joran van der Sloot's back?  The Flores family appears to be riding on the same emotional roller coaster from h--- as the family of Natalee Holloway.

Janet

++++++


Excessive Privilege Since Day One

Van der Sloot Gets 28 Years for Murder in Peru
Jan 13, 2012 6:15 PM EST


<snipped>
 
After the conviction, the victim’s father, Ricardo Flores, and older brother, Enrique, held a press conference. “We’re about to conclude an investigation, and we hope we’ll be able to release the information on Monday regarding the excess privileges this man has had from the first day of his seclusion,” said Mr. Ricardo Flores.
 
Flores’s attorney took the microphone and demanded: “How can it be that a person that is in prison is more comfortable than if he were free? We will hold a press conference to present all the irregularities in this man’s imprisonment on Monday.”

<snipped>

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/01/13/van-der-sloot-gets-28-years-for-murder-in-peru.html

s.t.




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 11, 2012, 09:55:10 PM
With the rare exception for the crime of Treason --- there are no life sentences in Peru and certainly no capital punishment. 30 years was the max he was ever going to get -- he got 28 years because he actually confessed. Nothing hinky going on -- just Peruvian everyday "justice".


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 10:05:01 PM
I don't believe Joran Van Der Sloot has had any "big wins" lately.  He's still cooling his heels in a Peruvian Prison.  JMHO

,,,, but for how long.

MuffyBee ... I don't think one Monkey on this forum would believe that anything less that a life sentence would be considered justice if Stephany was his/her daughter ... let alone a 28 year sentence that translates into 9 years for a murder beyond brutal.

Then there is the impending sentence appeal.  My worst fear is the appeal will be successful and ... Joran's sentence will be reduced further.

My heart breaks for the family of Stephany Flores.

Janet

+++++

June 14, 2010 11:00 AM
Joran van der Sloot Confession Transcript: "There was Blood Everywhere"


LIMA, Peru (CBS/AP) Joran van der Sloot slammed Stephany Flores in the face with his right elbow, strangled the 21-year-old Lima woman for a full minute, then took off his shirt and suffocated her with it, according to transcripts of his signed confession released by Peruvian authorities.

"There was blood everywhere," the Dutch national said according to transcripts obtained by CNN. "What am I going to do now? I had blood on my shirt. There was also blood on the bed, so, I took my shirt and put it on her face, pressing hard, until I killed Stephany."

<snipped>

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20007595-504083.html?tag=contentMain;contentBody



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 11, 2012, 10:11:11 PM
I'm happy he got the 28 years.  I'm happy that he will eventually be extradited to the US.  We can't ask for much more than that, IMO.  ::justice2NJ::

The Serenity Prayer


God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 10:11:49 PM
With the rare exception for the crime of Treason --- there are no life sentences in Peru and certainly no capital punishment. 30 years was the max he was ever going to get -- he got 28 years because he actually confessed. Nothing hinky going on -- just Peruvian everyday "justice".

If a life sentence was not a possibility ... I don't think the attorney of Stephany Flores' family would be pushing for it.  I don't think the judge would have instructed the prosecutor to "beef up the charges" if a life sentence was not on the table.  IMO

Janet

+++++++

Peru to beef up Joran van der Sloot charges
Published on 17 September 2011 - 3:38pm


<snipped>

At the first public hearing, on 12 September 2011, Mr Van der Sloot was charged with murder and robbery. The Public Prosecutor called for a 30-year jail sentence and damages of 50,000 euros.

The lawyer for the victim’s family said the charges should not be “murder followed by robbery” but “robbery followed by murder”, which carries a life sentence. He also rejected the 50,000 euro compensation as insufficient.

<snipped>

http://www.rnw.nl/english/bulletin/peru-beef-joran-van-der-sloot-charges

ty


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 11, 2012, 10:18:39 PM
Look up "Life Sentences in Peru" -- you'll find that there are none except 3 or 4 people for Treason.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 11, 2012, 10:28:26 PM
Look up "Life Sentences in Peru" -- you'll find that there are none except 3 or 4 people for Treason.
...and those were from Military Tribunals ..................... not the judicial system. You can't take what a defense lawyer spouts off and take it as fact.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 10:33:41 PM
I'm happy he got the 28 years.  I'm happy that he will eventually be extradited to the US.  We can't ask for much more than that, IMO.  ::justice2NJ::

The Serenity Prayer


God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

 ::snipping2::


Somehow ... I do not think that Beth Holloway believes it is over until it is over.

Could it be that the Birmingham prosecutor and John Q. Kelly are behind the scenes putting diplomatic pressure on the Peruvian justice minister and cabinet to overturn the Birmingham extradition ruling?

Janet

+++++

Joran van der Sloot challenges extradition to U.S. From Mayra Cuevas
May 9, 2012 -- Updated 1225 GMT (2025 HKT)


CNN) -- Joran van der Sloot told a judge and prosecutor Tuesday that he would prefer to finish serving a 28-year murder sentence in Peru rather than be extradited to the United States to face charges related to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, his Peruvian lawyer said.

Representatives from the U.S. Embassy and the FBI attended the extradition hearing, which was not open to the public, Maximo Altez told InSession on Tru TV.

<snipped>

A conviction in the United States could affect van der Sloot's chances of being paroled in Peru, said Altez. He noted that a long-standing extradition treaty between the two countries means that van der Sloot will likely be extradited, despite his stated preference about remaining in Peru.

<snipped>

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/05/08/us/peru-van-der-sloot/index.html


Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


<snipped>

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605


Peru court: Can extradite Dutchman after prison
June 4, 2012, 2:55 p.m. PDT


<snipped>

Federal prosecutors in Birmingham, Alabama, where Van der Sloot is charged, declined to comment on the court's decision. Kelly said he had no immediate comment.

<snipped>

http://www.oregonlive.com/newsflash/index.ssf/story/peru-court-dutchmans-extradition-after-sentence/ba9b5f9caa344925992cde4daa18c76f



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 10:46:37 PM

THE NEXT WAVE

Loving Natalee
A Mother’s Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 36: Hope comes, then goes. But it's the constant waiting for the next wave to roll in,  and reaching for each new sign of hope that will keep us going, as it brings with it the energy and encouragement needed to press on in our search for Natalee, even if only for a few moments at a time.

Page 232:  Without hope we are hungry. And on a very deep level, desperate. But no one has to be. What's so amazing is that we can feed each other. We can help each other. We have the power to give resilience to others who are fading. We can nourish each other's spirits and save one another from defeat and despair. Every one of us possesses this power to "love thy neighbor," and we need to use it every chance we get.


The Decision is not Final

Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


<snipped>

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605


 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 11, 2012, 11:18:54 PM
Who said anything about it being over? 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 11, 2012, 11:46:19 PM
I'm happy he got the 28 years.  I'm happy that he will eventually be extradited to the US.  We can't ask for much more than that, IMO.  ::justice2NJ::

The Serenity Prayer


God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

 ::snipping2::

Klaas

I can ask for much more from the Peruvian Justice System.

With all my heart ... on behalf of the Flores family ... I want a Peruvian sentence betowed upon Joran van der Sloot for the murder beyond brutal of Stephany that does not translate into 9 years.

With all of my heart  ... I want the immediate extradition of Joran to Birmingham to stand trial  for the 2010 extortion beyond cruel of Beth Holloway.  I do not want Natalee's mother to have to wait 9-28 years for the justice she deserves.

As I stated previous ... the families of Stephany Flores and Natalee Holloway are riding the same emotional roller coaster from h--- compliments of the Peruvian Justice System.

IMO

Good Night

Janet

+++++++


Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


<snipped>

Under the U.S.-Peru extradition treaty he would be returned to Peru to finish out his sentence. Then, if he were convicted in the U.S., he would be sent there to serve the second sentence.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 12:00:39 AM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Van%20der%20Sloot/0519201201-1.jpg)

Oh, the ARTISTE. She always looks like a dressed up Easter egg to me. She has a knack for tack, imo.

I am not Joe Fashion or anything... but dayum.

> Dress by PAAS -- Even Ronchi winced. ::HelloKitty::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 12, 2012, 12:06:23 AM

<snipped>

I don't think one Monkey on this forum would believe that anything less that a life sentence would be considered justice if Stephany was his/her daughter ... let alone a 28 year sentence that translates into 9 years for a murder beyond brutal.

My heart breaks for the family of Stephany Flores.

Janet

+++++

June 14, 2010 11:00 AM
Joran van der Sloot Confession Transcript: "There was Blood Everywhere"


LIMA, Peru (CBS/AP) Joran van der Sloot slammed Stephany Flores in the face with his right elbow, strangled the 21-year-old Lima woman for a full minute, then took off his shirt and suffocated her with it, according to transcripts of his signed confession released by Peruvian authorities.

"There was blood everywhere," the Dutch national said according to transcripts obtained by CNN. "What am I going to do now? I had blood on my shirt. There was also blood on the bed, so, I took my shirt and put it on her face, pressing hard, until I killed Stephany."

<snipped>

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20007595-504083.html?tag=contentMain;contentBody



quote author=Kermit link=topic=7645.msg1146278#msg1146278 date=1275636693]
KEEP STEPHANY'S PARENTS IN YOUR PRAYERS

(http://www.dlcache.indiatimes.com/imageserve/09n2gUK37H6bv/350x.jpg)


(http://www.dlcache.indiatimes.com/imageserve/010leBscRH2O5/350x.jpg)

[/quote]


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 12:24:08 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 12, 2012, 12:48:29 AM
Another suicide in "paradise":  ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://ba1.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/10996/1_1339466652.jpg)

Dama di 31 aña haya sin bida na Juliana Van Stolbergstraat, probablemente aki ta trata di un suicidio


7 hora pasa , 11 di juni 2012 17:33

Dialuna atardi a drenta informe di cu a bin descubri un dama di 31 aña benta abao sin bida na un cas na Juliana Van Stolbergstraat, mesora a dirigi polis na e sitio. NA yegada di e patruya a bin descubri e curpa abao benta y banda di dje un botter di veneno, mesora a solicita presencia di tur autoridad competente. Tin un investigacion andando pa logra saca afor si aki ta trata di un suicidio of un crimen.
 ::snipping2::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 12, 2012, 01:28:57 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.

You are confused?  I feel like I am in the Twilight Zone.

Janet

++++


The Charges

Joran was a winner when he received a 28 year sentence from the Peruvian justice System ... a 28 year sentence which translates into a 9 year sentence rather than a life sentence for a murder beyond brutal?.

Jamcakes?  It makes sense that the Flores family does not believe that justice was served for Stephany?

+++++++

Date set for van der Sloot murder trial
Published: 11/25/2011 9:44 am
Updated: 11/26/2011 8:25 am


<snipped>

In September, the victim's family asked a three-judge panel for a more stringent charge akin to aggravated murder, which carries a maximum sentence of life in prison, but the panel of judges ruled on the prosecution's side.

Van der Sloot's defense attorney Luis Jimenez Navarro told CNN'S In Session this was a big win for his client. If Van der Sloot is found guilty and sentenced to the maximum penalty, under Peru's jail reduction credits, he may only serve a third of the time.

<snipped>

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Date-set-for-van-der-Sloot-murder-trial/J1Yl6nagmkmRXf0qcfRMXA.cspx


The Birmingham Extradition

Joran van der Sloot was a winner when the Peruvian Supreme Court ruled against an immediate extradition to Birmingham to face extortion charges beyond cruel against Beth Holloway?

Jamcakes?  It makes sense that Beth Holloway is not thrilled with the ruling that implies she will be almost 80 years old when she will be testifying against Joran in a Birmingham court room?
______

Joran Van Der Sloot Gets 28 Years in Peru, Now US Wants Him
Jan. 13, 2012


Joran van der Sloot was sentenced today to 28 years in a Peruvian prison for strangling a woman there, and American officials are now expected to bring him to Alabama to face charges in connection with the disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway.

The attorney for Holloway's mother, John Q. Kelly, said after today's sentencing that he hopes van der Sloot will be extradited to the U.S. within "a couple of months."

Van der Sloot is charged with extorting $25,000 from Holloway's grieving mother Beth Holloway in exchange for information about the location of Natalee's body. After receving the money, van der Sloot admitted lying about where the girl's body was buried.

"We anticipate that U.S. authorities will move quickly to bring him to Alabama to face pending federal charges and to answer for his past conduct in Aruba," Kelly had said prior to the sentencing.

The U.S. District Attorney in Birmingham, where the case against van der Sloot will be prosecuted, did not immediately return calls for comment. They had previously told ABC News that they had made arrangements with Interpol to have van der Sloot extradited to the U.S.

Any sentence he might receive in the U.S. would be served in conjunction with the 28 years he was sentenced in Peru, Kelly said.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/US/joran-van-der-sloot-28-years-now-us/story?id=15353765

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 12, 2012, 02:13:33 AM
I don't think that the 28 year sentence will automatically turn into a 9 year sentence.
There is a small possibility that MAY be the case.  As I recall Joran never thought he
would receive the harsh sentence of 28 years. and there is no gurantee that he will
finish his sentence in 9 years.  That is just wishful thinking on the part of Joran and
his attorney


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 12, 2012, 02:28:13 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Give jamcakes a basket of bananas.

Post of the Year IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 04:55:49 AM
Another suicide in "paradise":  ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://ba1.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/10996/1_1339466652.jpg)


I love the lime green paint scheme on the house.

Another suicide? Gee, living on the "Happy Island" can't be so grand if so many people keep offing themselves.  Or is this another Arubacide labeled as a "sui" instead of a "homi" just to protect the statistics/reputation of the Happy Island?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 12, 2012, 09:09:19 AM
Looking at that bright paint in the hot Aruban sun all day would drive me crazy.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 12, 2012, 09:23:42 AM
Cause of death: Lime Green Overdose

It never surprises me how lax Aruba is. One guy is a cop - the other dude looks like he is ready to weed whack the yard.

...and nobody is wearing any gloves. Aruba is just one notch above the Middle East where they just go fetch a dead guy off

the side of the road, by his legs, and toss him in the back of a Nissan. They did manage to cover this soul... so, maybe

they're improving?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: sharon on June 12, 2012, 09:49:37 AM
Still interesting how we all interpret differently.

I have no confusion on this thread for 6 years :-(

However, as I read posts on several other threads where victims and their families (NOT POI'S) are trashed, criticized and straight out disrespected, I admit I have to check to see if I'm at RU

 ::justice2NJ::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Nut44x4 on June 12, 2012, 10:47:03 AM
She must be about two years younger than he is.

https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

Graduated from Out Of Door Academy
2010
High School


She has 1,490 Friends, lmffaooooooooooooo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 11:12:48 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO


Survival tip:

Sometimes it helps to think about the Rawhide theme as you scroll.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!  ::CowboySmiley::

I miss Hotping, that always reminds me of her.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 11:14:00 AM
She must be about two years younger than he is.

https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

Graduated from Out Of Door Academy
2010
High School


She has 1,490 Friends, lmffaooooooooooooo

Relationship Status   In a relationship with Valentijn van der Sloot
Anniversary   March 4, 2012

~~~~~~~~~

Gee, 3 months and a week......must be serious!!    ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 11:35:41 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO


Survival tip:

Sometimes it helps to think about the Rawhide theme as you scroll.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!  ::CowboySmiley::

I miss Hotping, that always reminds me of her.   ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks TexasMom and Tibro too.

It's nice to know that I am not seeing/feeling this by myself.  It is kind of astonishing how 1 mind can come up with all of it.....  ::MonkeyEek::  ....although most of the time it just appears regardless of what the topic at hand is.

Thanks for the tip on "Scrolling, scrolling, scrolling - Rawhide".  I guess I'll be  doing a lot of giggling at the computer screen from now on.  LOL

Too bad there isn't an ignore feature or a set of like/dislike buttons.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 12, 2012, 11:37:13 AM

<snipped>

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

<snipped>


My "contentions" are based on Ricardo Flores' "contentions.

Janet

+++++

Woman's family wants speedy trial for van der Sloot
August 17, 2011


The family of a slain Peruvian woman is urging prosecutors to file their case against murder suspect Joran van der Sloot, warning that he may be released by December unless the case goes ahead.

"We are worried because Peruvian law says that if a suspect's trial doesn't begin within 18 months after his arrest, authorities are obligated to set the suspect free," Ricardo Flores, the dead woman's father, told CNN.

<snipped>

Investigators delivered their case file to prosecutors in June for a decision on charges. Ricardo Flores said the prosecutor in the case, Miriam Riveros Castellares, is "not moving with the speed that a case of this magnitude merits."

"We're asking that either the prosecutor file charges or that authorities remove her from this case and name somebody else," he said.

There was no immediate response to the family's concerns from the prosecutor's office.

<snipped>

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-08-17/justice/peru.van.der.sloot_1_stephany-flores-sloot-lima-hotel-room?_s=PM:CRIME


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 12:09:27 PM
Cause of death: Lime Green Overdose

It never surprises me how lax Aruba is. One guy is a cop - the other dude looks like he is ready to weed whack the yard.

...and nobody is wearing any gloves. Aruba is just one notch above the Middle East where they just go fetch a dead guy off

the side of the road, by his legs, and toss him in the back of a Nissan. They did manage to cover this soul... so, maybe

they're improving?

ROTFLMFAO

Carpe, I love your sense of humor and your posts!!  Hee Hee!   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 12:20:03 PM
She must be about two years younger than he is.

https://www.facebook.com/hillarymhawkins

Graduated from Out Of Door Academy
2010
High School


She has 1,490 Friends, lmffaooooooooooooo

Relationship Status   In a relationship with Valentijn van der Sloot
Anniversary   March 4, 2012

~~~~~~~~~

Gee, 3 months and a week......must be serious!!    ::MonkeyAngel::

That anniversary date is just when it became "Facebook" official.  I think they've been together at least a few months longer than that.  But I can't blame them for waiting a few months after the brother's  "guilty of murder" verdict that was televised internationally to make it FB official.

 ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

I would think at least some of her almost 1500 facebook friends are saying...WTH???

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek::

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12718.msg1528948#msg1528948

Hillary Hawkins became friends with Valentijn van der Sloot.
August 30, 2011

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20091206/ARTICLE/912061017?p=4&tc=pg
Formal ball introduces year's new debutantes

By ABBY WEINGARTEN Correspondent
Published: Sunday, December 6, 2009 at 1:00 a.m.
Last Modified: Friday, December 4, 2009 at 6:05 p.m.

 ::snipping2::

Hillary Margaret Hawkins is the daughter of John and Kate Hawkins of Sarasota. She attends The Out-of-Door Academy, where she is a member of the National Honor Society and plays varsity volleyball. She is involved in Invisible Children, Relay For Life, Sarasota Chamber of Commerce Youth Leadership Program, Forty Carrots Parenting Center and the Church of the Palms.
 ::snipping2::

I think this is Hillary's mother's Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/catherine.a.hawkins

Catherine A Hawkins became friends with Valentijn van der Sloot.
October 22, 2011

Catherine A Hawkins became friends with Anita Hugen.
December 28, 2011

Hillary posted "love." on this picture from Nov 2011 too.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12718.msg1528958#msg1528958


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 12:50:35 PM

Relationship Status   In a relationship with Valentijn van der Sloot
Anniversary   March 4, 2012

~~~~~~~~~

Gee, 3 months and a week......must be serious!!    ::MonkeyAngel::

That anniversary date is just when it became "Facebook" official.  I think they've been together at least a few months longer than that.  But I can't blame them for waiting a few months after the brother's  "guilty of murder" verdict that was televised internationally to make it FB official.

 ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

I would think at least some of her almost 1500 facebook friends are saying...WTH???

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek::

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12718.msg1528948#msg1528948

Hillary Hawkins became friends with Valentijn van der Sloot.
August 30, 2011

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20091206/ARTICLE/912061017?p=4&tc=pg
Formal ball introduces year's new debutantes

By ABBY WEINGARTEN Correspondent
Published: Sunday, December 6, 2009 at 1:00 a.m.
Last Modified: Friday, December 4, 2009 at 6:05 p.m.

 ::snipping2::

Hillary Margaret Hawkins is the daughter of John and Kate Hawkins of Sarasota. She attends The Out-of-Door Academy, where she is a member of the National Honor Society and plays varsity volleyball. She is involved in Invisible Children, Relay For Life, Sarasota Chamber of Commerce Youth Leadership Program, Forty Carrots Parenting Center and the Church of the Palms.
 ::snipping2::

I think this is Hillary's mother's Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/catherine.a.hawkins

Catherine A Hawkins became friends with Valentijn van der Sloot.
October 22, 2011

Catherine A Hawkins became friends with Anita Hugen.
December 28, 2011

Hillary posted "love." on this picture from Nov 2011 too.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=12718.msg1528958#msg1528958

Thanks TexasMom.

I guess it must be serious then, if she continued with Val during and after Joran's trial. And after meeting Anita and the doughboy brother.  Ugghhh, I cannot imagine having Anita as my boyfriend's mother (and potential MIL) claiming to be in a relationship with me. Gag me.   :smt078

I shudder at the thought of another generation of vdSlooty's running around.   :gaah:


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 01:16:11 PM
Reminder

With Joran's guilty plea, the trial was over.  With that the possibility of proving with testimony and evidence that Joran was indeed guilty of the more serious crime that would have made a life sentence possible; was over too.

The guilty plea, with a maximum possible sentence of 30 years was acceptable to Ricardo Flores.  It would save his family more pain, stress, and worry from a lengthy trial and allow them to mourn and try to find peace after the loss of their beloved Stephany.

With the antics displayed by Joran in the few days in the courtroom that ended with the guilty plea and 28 years sentence, when I think of a full trial and what tricks may have been pulled out of the VDS hat; I think this was the best and least painful path for Justice for Stephany and her family. 

There were no guarantees of that possible life sentence, and there are no guarantees that 28 years will equate to 9 either.

jmo

http://peru21.pe/2012/01/06/actualidad/padre-stephany-flores-sentencia-le-dara-mi-familia-paz-2006340

Ricardo Flores 'Plea Agreement will give peace to my family'

Friday January 6, 2012 | 3:20

Father of Stephany Flores spoke of the possibility that Joran Van der Sloot is found guilty of murdering his daughter. If the Dutch do, the trial would end 48 hours later, said the defense of the affected part.

The father of Stephany Flores , Ricardo Flores, said that an early termination of the trial against Joran Van der Sloot , the alleged murderer of his daughter, will allow your family have peace.

Flowers made ​​these statements after the trial was suspended until Wednesday 11 January at the request of the defense of the Dutch, who evaluates eligible for early termination figure of the process. Accept the charges of murder but not aggravated robbery.

"I'm not surprised by conformity to be raised in accepting the prosecution. Sensed that this would happen. It is good that this ends quickly (...). I think this will allow my family can have some peace and dedicate ourselves to save and mourning, " said the girl's father killed in a press conference.

ONLY 48 HOURS
If the Dutchman Joran van der Sloot decides to make the figure according to the indictment, the trial for the death of the young end up in only 48 hours, said today the affected attorney, Edward Alvarez.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 12, 2012, 01:33:32 PM
 ::HelloKitty:: Hi TexasMom! 

 ::boxingjoran::

::bee::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 01:51:24 PM
::HelloKitty:: Hi TexasMom! 

 ::boxingjoran::

::bee::



Hi MuffyBee!  ::bee::

 ::HelloKitty:: ::CowboySmiley::

Hey, could someone please turn the heat down a little out there!   

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::boxingjoran::

Is winter coming soon in Peru?    ::MonkeySkate::

::MonkeyDevil::

 ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 12, 2012, 03:01:15 PM
It's called acceptance of a situation when it is realized that despite giving it your all ... the outcome is what the outcome is.  IMO

Janet

+++++

The Serenity Prayer

God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference
.


Holding Out Hope

Flores, Holloway families await van der Sloot's trial
1/13/2012


<snipped>

According to Edwar Alvarez, the Flores family’s lawyer, with different charges Van der Sloot could receive life imprisonment.

"We aim to present evidence during the trial that will lead the prosecutor to change the classification of the crime, so that it becomes robbery followed by murder. This will not be 30 years in prison, but life imprisonment,” he told the Lima newspaper El Comercio.

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Flores-Holloway-families-await-van-der-Sloots/KxiEyoDHDEypHoVG4yN6Sw.cspx

 
The Damage is Done

Van der Sloot Gets 28 Years for Murder in Peru
Jan 13, 2012 6:15 PM EST


After the conviction ...

<snipped>

Flores’s attorney took the microphone and demanded: “How can it be that a person that is in prison is more comfortable than if he were free? We will hold a press conference to present all the irregularities in this man’s imprisonment on Monday.”

“Mr. Flores wants peace for his family. The damage is done and it is beyond repair,” he continued.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/01/13/van-der-sloot-gets-28-years-for-murder-in-peru.html


I Stay Focused

Natalee Holloway: Lost in Paradise
TLC – 2010-01-17


Beth Holloway

'What I can do is hopefully share some life lessons and prevent this tragedy from happening to another family.  I stay focused on what I can do rather than what I cannot.  I cannot get justice for Natalee.'

http://tlc.discovery.com/tv-schedules/special.html?paid=2.1213.56293


Others Might Learn

Loving Natalee
A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman


Page 189:    It's the proverbial, Biblical conflict between good and evil.  It's very, very hard to fight evil because it constantly changes form and you never know who your enemies are.  And evil is always two steps ahead. From the outset we never had a chance.  But we didn't know it.  I'm taking leave of the island, but not from the work yet to be done.
 
Page 200:  My child.  My beautiful daughter.  I can't save her.  It's too late.  Natalee is gone. And second to the great tragedy of losing her is if we fail to learn from what has happened.  I could be any parent in the world.  And no parent should ever go through this experience.  Natalee could be anyone's daughter.  And in these thoughts a new path is made clear.  There is something I can do.  Many people reached out to us, and I can now reach back to them.  It might be too late to save Natalee, but it's not too late to save others.  And it's time now to make good on my pledge. It's time now to make good on my pledge to stand before high-school and college students, law enforcement professionals, victims' rights groups, travelers of all ages, and anyone interested in personal safety to share Natalee's story and our hard lessons, so that others might learn from them.

ty


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 05:03:45 PM
::HelloKitty:: Hi TexasMom! 

 ::boxingjoran::

::bee::



Hi MuffyBee!  ::bee::

 ::HelloKitty:: ::CowboySmiley::

Hey, could someone please turn the heat down a little out there!   

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::boxingjoran::

Is winter coming soon in Peru?    ::MonkeySkate::

::MonkeyDevil::

 ::boxingjoran::


Hee hee.....I hope they have a record cold winter!

In the Peruvian prison, does the toilet water flush the other way in the bowl?  Oh wait, do they even have flush toilets in the Peruvian prison?

I hope when the Appeals court has made their decision about Joran's sentence, the prison system will go ahead and "CHALLAPALCA him."

 ::MonkeyDevil::  ::MonkeyCool::  ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 12, 2012, 05:08:14 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/115212-toerisme-uit-vs-en-europa-daalt-opnieuw

Google translation

Tourism from USA and Europe drops again         

TUESDAY, JUNE 12, 2012 9:48

ORANGE CITY - Aruba's main tourism market North America does it again less well. In May the number of tourists dropped by 1.9 percent. In the U.S. alone were 1.1 percent fewer tourists compared to last year. And Europe remains less well. According to figures from the tourism agency ATA. It says in collaboration with partners working hard to "weaknesses in the various markets' to tackle. This is extra money aside.

ATA is not entirely clear about the reasons for the decline of the U.S. market. "Several factors play a role in this fall and the air service is one of them." In previous posts about the disappointing tourism figures for this market gave ATA also reasons as a 'mild winter' in the U.S. and the economic downturn in that country. In any case, says the tourist office even though some time to work hard on the air link. Since the cancellation of flights by American Airlines Aruba is eagerly looking for alternatives. Recently, the tourism office could be the good news that Delta mid december daily from JFK (airport in New York) before flying.

The quarterly figures who last month became available, it appeared that the North American market is under pressure (-2 percent) compared to last year. With the latest figures for May that is not improved. Especially in the Western U.S. region (-11.4 percent) were less tourists. Also from Canada decreased tourism by 15.9 percent.

Declining numbers are also seen in the number of tourists from Europe. In May is about 7.5 percent fewer tourists than last year. And that is in line with the figures from the first quarter of this year, where there was an overall decrease of 3.3 percent. In May, fewer tourists came mainly from the Netherlands (0.6 percent) and Italy. From the southern European country flies because no more charter to Aruba. Also, fewer British tourists (-17.8 percent) and ATA again blames the recession in that country. Being positive is the increasing numbers of German tourists (45.3 percent) and Belgium (21.5 percent). Exact numbers not provided the tourist office.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 12, 2012, 07:35:09 PM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO


Survival tip:

Sometimes it helps to think about the Rawhide theme as you scroll.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!  ::CowboySmiley::

I miss Hotping, that always reminds me of her.   ::MonkeyCool::

Amen! It's not just a few of us who think so.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 12, 2012, 07:59:58 PM
DON'T MISS THE DANA PRETZER SHOW AT 9PM ET TONIGHT!

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/Pretzer061212.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 12, 2012, 09:46:07 PM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO


Survival tip:

Sometimes it helps to think about the Rawhide theme as you scroll.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!  ::CowboySmiley::

I miss Hotping, that always reminds me of her.   ::MonkeyCool::

Amen! It's not just a few of us who think so.

I AMEN that too.   Thanks TM for saying it so well.  ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 12, 2012, 10:44:55 PM
"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!    (CBB has a pithy version of this which I sing to myself often in this thread)

Yes we had that TV series out here and programmes like that as well as movies that convinced us that all Americans rode horses and said Y'all, just as Australian movies have convinced the rest of the world that we all say G'day Mate, and have kangaroos hopping down the main streets of our cities.

But Natalee's case has melded people in both our countries in a way that had not happened before.   There have been many attempts to upset our collective apple cart and try to divide and conquer but the machinations of one such in our midst is particularly hard to comprehend.  As Texasmom has outlined it is very reminiscent to me of CapsLockWizard's attempts by several people under one heading.  That deception was uncovered  by our monkey sleuths and I am sure any current and future attempts to use this method to derail threads will meet the same fate.

The continual flogging of a dead horse was also one of the reasons so many monkeys took up the invitation to join a forum elsewhere.  Some of those monkeys no longer frequent the other place, which is all but defunct on the surface,  but continue to read here at SM as guests.  They choose not to post here because of the above constant regurgitating of posts and wild theories. Such a pity that we cannot get back to the sharing of ideas and camaraderie that was once a highlight of this thread.

I am so thankful that Klaas opened my Australian thread and I can potter about and post new items when I consider them relevant or interesting.  After reading at another forum (not the one mentioned above) and seeing how new members from Australia were treated when they dared to post in their own way of speaking and using everyday words and phrases peculiar to us it made me remember how welcome I was made here and how my Aussie lingo was tolerated.  Instead of my posts being poofed or edited, I was asked what I meant many times and because of that we all learned a lot about our different countries.  Fun days.  Thank you mods and monkeys.

And no, this is not a farewell post, although it does tend to read like one on the preview.

 ::koaladancing::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 12, 2012, 10:51:33 PM
"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!    (CBB has a pithy version of this which I sing to myself often in this thread)

Yes we had that TV series out here and programmes like that as well as movies that convinced us that all Americans rode horses and said Y'all, just as Australian movies have convinced the rest of the world that we all say G'day Mate, and have kangaroos hopping down the main streets of our cities.

But Natalee's case has melded people in both our countries in a way that had not happened before.   There have been many attempts to upset our collective apple cart and try to divide and conquer but the machinations of one such in our midst is particularly hard to comprehend.  As Texasmom has outlined it is very reminiscent to me of CapsLockWizard's attempts by several people under one heading.  That deception was uncovered  by our monkey sleuths and I am sure any current and future attempts to use this method to derail threads will meet the same fate.

The continual flogging of a dead horse was also one of the reasons so many monkeys took up the invitation to join a forum elsewhere.  Some of those monkeys no longer frequent the other place, which is all but defunct on the surface,  but continue to read here at SM as guests.  They choose not to post here because of the above constant regurgitating of posts and wild theories. Such a pity that we cannot get back to the sharing of ideas and camaraderie that was once a highlight of this thread.

I am so thankful that Klaas opened my Australian thread and I can potter about and post new items when I consider them relevant or interesting.  After reading at another forum (not the one mentioned above) and seeing how new members from Australia were treated when they dared to post in their own way of speaking and using everyday words and phrases peculiar to us it made me remember how welcome I was made here and how my Aussie lingo was tolerated.  Instead of my posts being poofed or edited, I was asked what I meant many times and because of that we all learned a lot about our different countries.  Fun days.  Thank you mods and monkeys.

And no, this is not a farewell post, although it does tend to read like one on the preview.

 ::koaladancing::




 ::MonkeyKiss::   ::americaflag:: ::australiaflag:: ::koaladancing::  ::bee::   ::CowboySmiley::   ::MonkeyCool::   ::MonkeyJnBox::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 12, 2012, 10:56:55 PM
It once appeared that Joran would escape any form of justice and now he is not only behind bars but in one of the worst prisons in the world according to National Geographic.  I will take their well researched word for it.

Beth said she would be happy with Joran in some "Midnight Express" prison and there he is!  I think they shorten sentences because no one would survive to be released otherwise.  The stench and air bourne disease has to be dreadful and a constant danger.

I doubt that Joran is released in 9 years but if he is, just that much sooner he would be available for his extortion trial.  Those things move unbelievably slow any way being federal.  He even confessed!!!  That's how he got the 30 years instead of life.

The Flores family were spared a trial.  Beth is happy Joran is in such squalor.  And no amount of bribes can make it something it is not.  I don't even care if Joran bribes with his little stipend from the Dutch government because that's just that much more for the prison guards who are likely underpaid.

And when his time in that hellhole is finished, he comes to Federal Court to face a 25 year charge for extortion.

It really deosn't get any better than this in real life given the circumstances.

I declare total victory over Joran for Beth and the Flores and will drink to that!

 ::monkeywine2::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 11:13:37 PM


I declare total victory over Joran for Beth and the Flores and will drink to that!

 ::monkeywine2::



 ::monkeymargarita::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 12, 2012, 11:21:17 PM
"Scrollin' scrollin' scrollin' RAWHIDE!    (CBB has a pithy version of this which I sing to myself often in this thread)

Yes we had that TV series out here and programmes like that as well as movies that convinced us that all Americans rode horses and said Y'all, just as Australian movies have convinced the rest of the world that we all say G'day Mate, and have kangaroos hopping down the main streets of our cities.

But Natalee's case has melded people in both our countries in a way that had not happened before.   There have been many attempts to upset our collective apple cart and try to divide and conquer but the machinations of one such in our midst is particularly hard to comprehend.  As Texasmom has outlined it is very reminiscent to me of CapsLockWizard's attempts by several people under one heading.  That deception was uncovered  by our monkey sleuths and I am sure any current and future attempts to use this method to derail threads will meet the same fate.

The continual flogging of a dead horse
was also one of the reasons so many monkeys took up the invitation to join a forum elsewhere.  Some of those monkeys no longer frequent the other place, which is all but defunct on the surface,  but continue to read here at SM as guests.  They choose not to post here because of the above constant regurgitating of posts and wild theories. Such a pity that we cannot get back to the sharing of ideas and camaraderie that was once a highlight of this thread.

I am so thankful that Klaas opened my Australian thread and I can potter about and post new items when I consider them relevant or interesting.  After reading at another forum (not the one mentioned above) and seeing how new members from Australia were treated when they dared to post in their own way of speaking and using everyday words and phrases peculiar to us it made me remember how welcome I was made here and how my Aussie lingo was tolerated.  Instead of my posts being poofed or edited, I was asked what I meant many times and because of that we all learned a lot about our different countries.  Fun days.  Thank you mods and monkeys.

And no, this is not a farewell post, although it does tend to read like one on the preview.

 ::koaladancing::




 ::australiaflag::   ::MonkeyCheer3::  Yeah, Tibro!



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 12:23:08 AM
Thanks wreck and magnolia for the amen's!   :smt052   ::CowboySmiley::

Tibro, thank you for the reminder about CBB's version...I remembered someone coming up with a verse but couldn't put my finger on who it was, lol!  Thank you also for the reminder about those who choose to stay in the rafters but are still here for Natalee and Stephany.  That's what it's all about, justice for them and their families.  We still have miles to go, but I know we'll get there together eventually.

 ::MonkeyCool:: ::justice2NJ::

I think MuffyBee summed it up perfectly. ::bee::  ::rhino::

Anna, very well stated and I'll drink to that too!   ::monkeywine2::


 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: KittyMom on June 13, 2012, 12:26:17 AM
I'm just waiting on Urine to get worms.
 :smt019    ::MonkeyJustice::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 12:46:18 AM
 ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 12:47:14 AM

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Natalee_2005.jpg)


Justice for Natalee!  

 ::justice2NJ::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 12:53:13 AM
Thanks wreck and magnolia for the amen's!   :smt052   ::CowboySmiley::

Tibro, thank you for the reminder about CBB's version...I remembered someone coming up with a verse but couldn't put my finger on who it was, lol!  Thank you also for the reminder about those who choose to stay in the rafters but are still here for Natalee and Stephany.  That's what it's all about, justice for them and their families.  We still have miles to go, but I know we'll get there together eventually.

 ::MonkeyCool:: ::justice2NJ::

I think MuffyBee summed it up perfectly. ::bee::  ::rhino::

Anna, very well stated and I'll drink to that too!   ::monkeywine2::


 
I think 99.9% of us want Joran to be in hell the rest of his short life. Aruba is never going to punish him, so I think 28 years in a Peru hell hole is about as good as we can expect. (I still think he doesn't make it another year anyways.) Peru will protect him until his appeals run out -- then the general population will take him out. Do I hope we can bring him to the US for a trial --YES!! Do I think we will ever get the truth about Natalee out of Joran?? -- sadly NO.  Joran will lose his appeal, he will die shortly thereafter. -- IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 01:22:07 AM
31,359 total posts

14,895 posts asking to delete previous post because of "mistake" or "mis-copy & paste"

16,458 posts regurgitating of quotes from past 7 years we have all seen and discredited.

6 original opinions

"Monkey Mega Star"


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 02:00:49 AM

I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.   ::snipping2::

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO
 ::snipping2::

I've got to ask, but I feel the need to preface the question with the statement that I'm not advocating or agitating for anything.  I haven't been a member that long, so maybe I don't have the right to ask, but I will.

Why has management allowed all the above for so long?  It certainly is distracting, disruptive, detracting and as you said, discouraging to the other SM readers/posters.  Their message just doesn't seem to jive with what others post, or the tone of SM in general, imo. 





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 02:02:30 AM
31,359 total posts

14,895 posts asking to delete previous post because of "mistake" or "mis-copy & paste"

16,458 posts regurgitating of quotes from past 7 years we have all seen and discredited.

6 original opinions

"Monkey Mega Star"

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyCool::

If this is accurate, it wouldn't surprise me at all.  My guess is that it would be close.

But I'd rather pull my toenails out one by one than even consider checking to find out!   

The patience of our wonderful Admin and marvelous Mods amazes me.   ::MonkeyAngel::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 02:04:30 AM
ooops, sorry Magnolia, I was trying to trim the quote stack, and accidentally attributed my post to you. So sorry.

Moderator, will you fix this as soon as possible.  Thanks!

I wrote the following:
I've got to ask, but I feel the need to preface the question with the statement that I'm not advocating or agitating for anything.  I haven't been a member that long, so maybe I don't have the right to ask, but I will.

Why has management allowed all the above for so long?  It certainly is distracting, disruptive, detracting and as you said, discouraging to the other SM readers/posters.  Their message just doesn't seem to jive with what others post, or the tone of SM in general, imo. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 02:12:31 AM
31,359 total posts

14,895 posts asking to delete previous post because of "mistake" or "mis-copy & paste"

16,458 posts regurgitating of quotes from past 7 years we have all seen and discredited.

6 original opinions

"Monkey Mega Star"

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyCool::

If this is accurate, it wouldn't surprise me at all.  My guess is that it would be close.

But I'd rather pull my toenails out one by one than even consider checking to find out!   

The patience of our wonderful Admin and marvelous Mods amazes me.   ::MonkeyAngel::

Wreck - ROTFLMAO - brilliant

TexasMom - Ditto on the above

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 13, 2012, 10:05:28 AM
31,359 total posts

14,895 posts asking to delete previous post because of "mistake" or "mis-copy & paste"

16,458 posts regurgitating of quotes from past 7 years we have all seen and discredited.

6 original opinions

"Monkey Mega Star"

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyCool::

If this is accurate, it wouldn't surprise me at all.  My guess is that it would be close.

But I'd rather pull my toenails out one by one than even consider checking to find out!   

The patience of our wonderful Admin and marvelous Mods amazes me.   ::MonkeyAngel::

Wreck - ROTFLMAO - brilliant

TexasMom - Ditto on the above

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Oh Lawdy!  and Greetings monkeys......I haven't signed in for quite some time.

WOW!  A beautiful breeze of TRUTH is finally blowing through this place, and it feels good.

I had to stop posting because I couldn't find the exploding monkey head icon.

  ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks to all for having the patience to continue.   ::justice2NJ::

Amen and Amen, and dear Lord, please make the drivel stop.  Thank you.



 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Dihannah1 on June 13, 2012, 11:10:20 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Give jamcakes a basket of bananas.

Post of the Year IMO

My thoughts are that since we have been here for so long, watching Joran get away with everything, we have all became jaded.  Like always waiting for the next shoe to drop, as it has so many times in the past.  I believe everybody has good points and I though I am thrilled he is finally doing time in a horrible Peruvian prison, though I don't like the rumors of his being provided comfort. He is no longer able to kill again, but the questions remain.  Do we or Beth really need to wait 28 years for Natalee's justice and will he really only get 9 year?  We have been brainwashed into everything that happens good on his behalf.  So I have mixed fellings. IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 11:19:34 AM
31,359 total posts

14,895 posts asking to delete previous post because of "mistake" or "mis-copy & paste"

16,458 posts regurgitating of quotes from past 7 years we have all seen and discredited.

6 original opinions

"Monkey Mega Star"

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyCool::

If this is accurate, it wouldn't surprise me at all.  My guess is that it would be close.

But I'd rather pull my toenails out one by one than even consider checking to find out!   

The patience of our wonderful Admin and marvelous Mods amazes me.   ::MonkeyAngel::

Wreck - ROTFLMAO - brilliant

TexasMom - Ditto on the above

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Oh Lawdy!  and Greetings monkeys......I haven't signed in for quite some time.

WOW!  A beautiful breeze of TRUTH is finally blowing through this place, and it feels good.

I had to stop posting because I couldn't find the exploding monkey head icon.

  ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks to all for having the patience to continue.   ::justice2NJ::

Amen and Amen, and dear Lord, please make the drivel stop.  Thank you.


Hi Helen Back!   ::HelloKitty::

So good to see you, I've missed you!   ::MonkeyKiss::

 ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: sharon on June 13, 2012, 11:37:54 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Give jamcakes a basket of bananas.

Post of the Year IMO

My thoughts are that since we have been here for so long, watching Joran get away with everything, we have all became jaded.  Like always waiting for the next shoe to drop, as it has so many times in the past.  I believe everybody has good points and I though I am thrilled he is finally doing time in a horrible Peruvian prison, though I don't like the rumors of his being provided comfort. He is no longer able to kill again, but the questions remain.  Do we or Beth really need to wait 28 years for Natalee's justice and will he really only get 9 year?  We have been brainwashed into everything that happens good on his behalf.  So I have mixed fellings. IMO

 ::rhino::

 ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 13, 2012, 11:53:21 AM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Give jamcakes a basket of bananas.

Post of the Year IMO

My thoughts are that since we have been here for so long, watching Joran get away with everything, we have all became jaded.  Like always waiting for the next shoe to drop, as it has so many times in the past.  I believe everybody has good points and I though I am thrilled he is finally doing time in a horrible Peruvian prison, though I don't like the rumors of his being provided comfort. He is no longer able to kill again, but the questions remain.  Do we or Beth really need to wait 28 years for Natalee's justice and will he really only get 9 year?  We have been brainwashed into everything that happens good on his behalf.  So I have mixed fellings. IMO

 ::rhino::

 ::justice2NJ::

A reminder: 

Brainwashing is generally accomplished by the repetitive drumming of the same information, over and over and over.....Drip...Drip.....Drip.

Resist brainwashing!  Scroll!  ::MonkeyBike::

Hey Texasmom!  I have missed you too!   ::HelloKitty::  Thanks for holding down the fort for Natalee and Stephany.  You are a veeeeeery strong woman!   ::MonkeyKiss:: :salut:



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 13, 2012, 12:31:37 PM
Good to see you Helen!  LTNS!

And I agree that the constant repetition is to accomplish brainwashing and bring others over to the negative side of things.

We have won!  Beth has what she stated she would be happy with--seeing Joran in a Midnight Express type prison.  There is no way on earth to make that place anything other than a hellhole no matter what we are constantly being told.  I don't think there is electricity in the individual cells and we know there is no heat and it is cold there.

I would think TB and Hep C and B and so forth have to be rampant as they are in many prisons even here and I think worms are a given.  One of my kids got worms in Bolivia twice and he was traveling with a physician.

Look at that photo of Joran in the green tee shirt for proof of his misery and it has only gotten worse the longer he is there.

So don't fall for the Joran cheering.  It is totally impossible for him to be living like a king and that's just an expression anyway even if he has a stipend to use for bribes.  I don't think anybody would want to be there no matter how they could bribe and he likely only has that government stipend now and as the EU economny tanks, even that may be cut.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 13, 2012, 12:36:24 PM
I have a little RSS feed on a sideboard on my Desktop.  It notifies me when somebody posts here.  I can't tell you of the times I have dashed over thinking there was some new information only to have it be some irrelevant post from five years ago and totally negative at that!  Usually distorted as to meaning to start with also.

It's insulting to other posters' intelligence to assume they don't know these old basic facts or don't have the sense to know what to make of them and they need to be told what to think!



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 01:24:30 PM
I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.  The powers that be save Joran, and afford Joran perks, and Joran gets special treatment by the Dutch embassy.  Good grief - is someone pro-Joran, fallen under his spell, playing a bad joke, or trying to set themselves  up with the weird hope of saying "I told you so" later?

Joran is finally in prison, in a particularly harsh prison in Peru, where he cannot do to any more young women and their families what he did to NAH and SR. He was sentenced to 28 years which is a stiff sentence by Peruvian standards. He's been approved for extradition to the USA at some point in the future where he will face charges bearing another possible 25 years.

Natalee's and Stephany's families seem satisfied with this, and trusting in the legal process.  If they are happy, then so am I.  Afterall, I'm here to support Natalee's and Stephany's loved ones, and not be a cheerleader for Joran.


Give jamcakes a basket of bananas.

Post of the Year IMO

My thoughts are that since we have been here for so long, watching Joran get away with everything, we have all became jaded.  Like always waiting for the next shoe to drop, as it has so many times in the past.  I believe everybody has good points and I though I am thrilled he is finally doing time in a horrible Peruvian prison, though I don't like the rumors of his being provided comfort. He is no longer able to kill again, but the questions remain.  Do we or Beth really need to wait 28 years for Natalee's justice and will he really only get 9 year?  We have been brainwashed into everything that happens good on his behalf.  So I have mixed fellings. IMO

Hi Dihannah1!   ::teddybear::

It's good to see you, I hope all is well!   ::MonkeyKiss::

I agree with the always waiting for the next shoe to drop, it happened so many times in Aruba...so many disappointments...almost too much to bear at times.  It's hard not to still have a little lingering feeling that there may be more of that to come.  IMO all we can do is hope and pray for the best, and for what is right to come to pass.  There are no guarantees but without hope, why continue?

I do believe as Beth has said that justice comes in many forms.

Paulus van der Sloot died over two years ago, February 10, 2010.  He was only 57 years old.  He'd lived almost five years after the crimes against Natalee, and never saw fit to do the right thing.  He will forever be remembered as the father that used his influence to protect his self entitled son (and himself imo) from the consequences of the crimes against Natalee Ann Holloway, denying her a proper burial and justice. 

Joran is not in Aruba anymore, that was his choice.  He went back to Aruba after Paulus' death to be with mommy dearest, chose to gamble to survive instead of getting a job.  Then he decided to extort money from Natalee's family with the promise of finally doing the right thing by leading them to her remains...so he could continue to gamble and not get a job.  Although he had tortured them for almost five long years, he would do it one more time.  He took the down payment from his extortion of Natalee's family and went to Peru to gamble.  When he'd lost all he had, and no one was willing to give him money to survive, he robbed and brutally murdered Stephany Flores.

Joran is still in Peru.  Although he escaped into Chile in an attempt to avoid prosecution in Peru, he was caught within days of Stephany's murder and they took his azz right back to Peru.  None of his attempts to wheel and deal to get back to Aruba or to Holland were successful. 

Joran is not in Aruba anymore.

Joran's has made many attempts since June 2010 to escape justice in Peru.  They've all failed.  He didn't need a translator but he tried to say the right one wasn't provided.  He tried to say his arrest in Chile and expulsion back to Peru wasn't legal, that didn't work either.  He tried to get his (partial imo) confession to Stephany's murder thrown out, no soup for you again Joran!  He even acted like a spoiled rotten brat at his trial.  He delayed the proceedings to "think about" what he'd already had a year and a half to "think about".  He was rude and completely disrespectful of the court.  That got him nowhere.  He was not in Aruba anymore.  For years, Joran's mother defended him concerning Natalee's disappearance.  She enlisted a group of friends to lie about Natalee and her family to protect him, to make him and their family appear to be the victims...while Natalee never came home.  No family member attended Joran's trial in Peru, Anita said she didn't want the media attention.  Joran even used Mary Hamer to keep him comfortable and try to make others sympathize for him, and although he may have been comfortable in prison for a while; ultimate epic fail!  It remains to be seen what will happen in the appeal process.  Hopefully, it will follow the same path as all his other attempts to escape justice in Peru.

Soon after Stephany was murdered, her father Ricardo Flores spoke about justice not only for her but for Natalee as well.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-06-05/news/27066308_1_van-der-hotel-room-peru

Peru cops grill Joran Van der Sloot; Security video may show last moments of Stephany Flores' life
BY LARRY MCSHANE
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Saturday, June 05, 2010
 ::snipping2::
Ricardo Flores, who buried his daughter Thursday, said he hoped Stephany's slaying can resolve the Holloway mystery. "My daughter was an instrument for (Natalee), so that there can be justice," he said yesterday.
 ::snipping2::

As wreck said, I don't have much hope of Joran ever telling the whole truth about Natalee either.

But I still believe that justice comes in many forms.  And Joran being in a Peruvian prison burning up in the summer, freezing in the winter, with the rats and disease, without the comforts and favors of home...and his ever longing to be back in Aruba.  That is justice, not only for Stephany but for Natalee as well imo.

A trial in Alabama, whenever...will be icing on the cake.

It's all in how you choose to look at things, is the cup half full or half empty?  I choose to remain positive, and accept the justice that does come in whatever form.  I continue to hope for the ultimate, and refuse to ever become jaded to the point of considering Joran van der Sloot the big winner as long as he is incarcerated as punishment for his crimes.

JMHO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 02:20:27 PM

I agree with the always waiting for the next shoe to drop, it happened so many times in Aruba...so many disappointments...almost too much to bear at times.  It's hard not to still have a little lingering feeling that there may be more of that to come.  IMO all we can do is hope and pray for the best, and for what is right to come to pass.  There are no guarantees but without hope, why continue?

I do believe as Beth has said that justice comes in many forms.

Paulus van der Sloot died over two years ago, February 10, 2010.  He was only 57 years old.  He'd lived almost five years after the crimes against Natalee, and never saw fit to do the right thing.  He will forever be remembered as the father that used his influence to protect his self entitled son (and himself imo) from the consequences of the crimes against Natalee Ann Holloway, denying her a proper burial and justice. 

Joran is not in Aruba anymore, that was his choice.  He went back to Aruba after Paulus' death to be with mommy dearest, chose to gamble to survive instead of getting a job.  Then he decided to extort money from Natalee's family with the promise of finally doing the right thing by leading them to her remains...so he could continue to gamble and not get a job.  Although he had tortured them for almost five long years, he would do it one more time.  He took the down payment from his extortion of Natalee's family and went to Peru to gamble.  When he'd lost all he had, and no one was willing to give him money to survive, he robbed and brutally murdered Stephany Flores.

Joran is still in Peru.  Although he escaped into Chile in an attempt to avoid prosecution in Peru, he was caught within days of Stephany's murder and they took his azz right back to Peru.  None of his attempts to wheel and deal to get back to Aruba or to Holland were successful. 

Joran is not in Aruba anymore.

Joran's has made many attempts since June 2010 to escape justice in Peru.  They've all failed.  He didn't need a translator but he tried to say the right one wasn't provided.  He tried to say his arrest in Chile and expulsion back to Peru wasn't legal, that didn't work either.  He tried to get his (partial imo) confession to Stephany's murder thrown out, no soup for you again Joran!  He even acted like a spoiled rotten brat at his trial.  He delayed the proceedings to "think about" what he'd already had a year and a half to "think about".  He was rude and completely disrespectful of the court.  That got him nowhere.  He was not in Aruba anymore.  For years, Joran's mother defended him concerning Natalee's disappearance.  She enlisted a group of friends to lie about Natalee and her family to protect him, to make him and their family appear to be the victims...while Natalee never came home.  No family member attended Joran's trial in Peru, Anita said she didn't want the media attention.  Joran even used Mary Hamer to keep him comfortable and try to make others sympathize for him, and although he may have been comfortable in prison for a while; ultimate epic fail!  It remains to be seen what will happen in the appeal process.  Hopefully, it will follow the same path as all his other attempts to escape justice in Peru.

Soon after Stephany was murdered, her father Ricardo Flores spoke about justice not only for her but for Natalee as well.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-06-05/news/27066308_1_van-der-hotel-room-peru

Peru cops grill Joran Van der Sloot; Security video may show last moments of Stephany Flores' life
BY LARRY MCSHANE
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Saturday, June 05, 2010
 ::snipping2::
Ricardo Flores, who buried his daughter Thursday, said he hoped Stephany's slaying can resolve the Holloway mystery. "My daughter was an instrument for (Natalee), so that there can be justice," he said yesterday.
 ::snipping2::

As wreck said, I don't have much hope of Joran ever telling the whole truth about Natalee either.

But I still believe that justice comes in many forms.  And Joran being in a Peruvian prison burning up in the summer, freezing in the winter, with the rats and disease, without the comforts and favors of home...and his ever longing to be back in Aruba.  That is justice, not only for Stephany but for Natalee as well imo.

A trial in Alabama, whenever...will be icing on the cake.

It's all in how you choose to look at things, is the cup half full or half empty?  I choose to remain positive, and accept the justice that does come in whatever form.  I continue to hope for the ultimate, and refuse to ever become jaded to the point of considering Joran van der Sloot the big winner as long as he is incarcerated as punishment for his crimes.

JMHO

Standing  Ovation  :smt041 :smt041 :smt041 :smt041

Magnificent!!!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Golden Oldie on June 13, 2012, 02:42:00 PM
I have been living in the rafters for sometime following several cases, which started with little Caylee Anthony.   Natalee's case has been very difficult to follow for a long time, now, because I find myself having to scroll more than read.  However, that doesn't stop me from checking-in for "newsworthy" info.  Wish there were a way to permanently put an ignore button on someone who takes up a lot of space continually regurgitating quotes.  I don't read them, so I don't even know what they're about.  I just start scrolling whenever I see that particular poster's name.  "Thanks" to the rest of you for keeping me informed.  Now, back up to the rafters.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 03:22:01 PM
I have a little RSS feed on a sideboard on my Desktop.  It notifies me when somebody posts here.  I can't tell you of the times I have dashed over thinking there was some new information only to have it be some irrelevant post from five years ago and totally negative at that!  Usually distorted as to meaning to start with also.

It's insulting to other posters' intelligence to assume they don't know these old basic facts or don't have the sense to know what to make of them and they need to be told what to think!



Agree.    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 03:31:46 PM

I get so confused reading here ........ sometimes I think I'm reading at RU instead of SM. When I see posts that tell me Joran is the big winner, that Joran will win his appeal and Stephany will have no justice, I close my eyes and reopen them hoping I did not just read that at SM.   ::snipping2::

It went beyond confusing and became infuriating a long time ago for me jamcakes.

In order to continue, I scroll on by as has been instructed many times.

The claims of "devil's advocate" and coating the obvious with undying support for Beth to counter it don't change what it is imo.

I don't remember now if you were here when the contention was that Joran would be released before the trial for Stephany's murder even took place!  That went on, and on, and on too.

  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::

The same type thing happens in other threads as well; whole family conspiracies to murder and cover up, self righteous contempt for victim's families, excessive repeating and bumping of their own posts, constant off topic "life outside the computer room" info, etc. has convinced me that what it boils down to is highlighted in blue above.  I shudder to think how many times that has probably crossed the minds of others reading here at SM.  I really think the goal is to drive away long time members of this forum and discourage those who might think of joining here.  There is a purpose behind the seeming madness, and I truly believe the profile of one elderly lady with her cuppa tea is not doing it alone.  There's not enough time in the day for one person to come up with all this (crapola a lot of the time imo) and package it all up so neatly to post over, and over, and over again.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

JMHO
 ::snipping2::
::snipping2::

I've got to ask, but I feel the need to preface the question with the statement that I'm not advocating or agitating for anything.  I haven't been a member that long, so maybe I don't have the right to ask, but I will.

Why has management allowed all the above for so long?  It certainly is distracting, disruptive, detracting and as you said, discouraging to the other SM readers/posters.  Their message just doesn't seem to jive with what others post, or the tone of SM in general, imo. 


I hope you didn't think I was ignoring your question jamcakes, it was just one that I wanted to take some time to decide what to say about it.  Still not sure I've thought about it long enough but here goes!

I would never speak for Klaas or the mods, but I can tell you what some of MY thoughts about it over the last few years have been.

Klaas and the mods have a huge task here.  There are many threads to keep up with, and they can't just focus on one thread; they have to check in everywhere to keep things running smoothly.  And they are all here as volunteers.  They do have lives outside of the SM forum.  Whether or not the "offending" posts are actually even read completely by any of those in charge I don't know, I do know that I certainly wouldn't want the task of reading all of a certain poster's posts. 

I'm not going to go back and find this, I'm going from memory so if I'm not remembering correctly, please someone find the incident point it out to me and I will correct my error here.  I recall a moderator asking said poster to stop adding their own subtitles (those usually in blue or bold or both) to posts because that tends to indicate the main idea of the supporting articles or other information that may not be what the actual author intended, or even what others reading here would consider the main idea of the material provided.  The argument was made by said poster that those subtitles came directly from the text of the article, but I was able to almost immediately point one out that was not.  Regardless, that activity continued and has only progressed.  I don't know if they have been accurate as to the content of the articles cited or not since then, as I have scrolled on by most of those posts.  My point in even bringing this up being, the request by the moderator should have been honored imo.  As wreck's summary of posts last night indicated, even though it may not be exact anyone who reads here knows that said poster likely makes more requests of the Admin and moderators than any other poster here, but refuses to honor the request from a moderator of them?  That just didn't sit well with me at all, and I have often wondered how that made the moderator feel when the activity continued and progressed. 

Unless you are one that reads every post and/or spends a lot of time in a certain thread, you might not notice the extremes that have been gone to at times.  That would also make it very hard to understand the frustration that has built with some and at times reached the boiling point.  This is one thing that I have had to remind myself of a lot.

A different opinion on things usually provokes discussion and gathering of information on each side.  It's done all the time here all over SM, and usually in a manner that both sides of the opinion may learn more about the subject, sometimes leading to agreement; and other times (maybe even after fighting it out) simply agreeing to disagree.  It has gone beyond that in this case imo, with one seemingly trying to overpower or frankly just wear everyone down with the pounding of regurgitation's often supported with out of context snippets that IN CONTEXT were obviously not intended as they are being used.  Wreck and Anna have touched on this subject as well, and I appreciate their comments about it.  This is a discussion forum, and the continual re-posting of things that have been discussed, and ultimately discredited without any new discussion provoking information, is imo disrespectful.  However, everyone here has a right to their opinion so unless you have seen the whole picture; it might be hard to see or understand how we feel about that.

For as many of us that agree enough is enough, there will be those that will not agree.  We may never know about some of them that aren't willing to post their feelings regarding this here, but Klaas will certainly have to deal with them all.  My sincere apologies to her for any grief I have caused her.  She is an extraordinary woman, one that I admire and respect greatly.  I don't have the patience, or even the desire or willpower to do what she has done here for so many years.  She does many things behind the scenes that many here don't even know about.  Plus she has a family and job!  Even if she comes in here and gives me the biggest smack down ever about all of this, my feelings about her and what she does here at SM will not change.  I KNOW in my heart that she tries to be fair to everyone.  She's had the guts to ban members here (years ago now, and rightfully so btw) that still cause her to be disrespected and lied about to this day.  She takes so much that many of us simply couldn't handle...in stride; and keeps on keeping on.  I truly admire that. 

I have the same admiration and respect for the mods that work tirelessly to support and help Klaas keep things running smoothly here.  And I will forever miss 2NJ.

I've previously stated what I honestly believe is and has been going on with said poster for a while now.  Surely they expected problems at some point, so possibly as much time and effort has been put into the defense of these activities?  We shall see, I guess.

Whatever comes, I feel better to have shared some of my frustrations and appreciate all who were willing to speak out as well.

Sorry for another really long post everyone!   :oops:  Maybe I'll go get some housework done now.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyCool::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 03:37:17 PM
texasmom, Ono and 41 Guests are viewing this topic.

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek::

Wow, did something happen I don't know about?   ::HelloKitty::

If so, someone please do tell!   ::MonkeyCool::





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 03:53:46 PM
I have a little RSS feed on a sideboard on my Desktop.  It notifies me when somebody posts here.  I can't tell you of the times I have dashed over thinking there was some new information only to have it be some irrelevant post from five years ago and totally negative at that!  Usually distorted as to meaning to start with also.

It's insulting to other posters' intelligence to assume they don't know these old basic facts or don't have the sense to know what to make of them and they need to be told what to think!



I agree, Anna.   I also think that some of the robo-posting is done just to be hateful.
The Robo-poster knows that it infuriates so many of us and many just stay away rather than deal with her.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 13, 2012, 03:59:49 PM

Sometimes when we understand others and why they do what they do, it helps us gain patience and/or tolerance.
We are not all perfect, especially me, as a frog I can tell you mistakes happen all the time, but hopefully
lessons are learned and with that I hope we all read this post and gain insight....that may help us gain
understanding & insight  I know it did for me a long time ago.
ribbit




Tamikosmom wrote:
Peaches ... I can relates to all your emotions.

Quote
In 1990 I had major brain surgery to remove a tumor the size of an egg. I had never had any symptoms ... not even a headache.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=21.1660




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 13, 2012, 04:03:51 PM
carpe,

You are the most talented writer & voyeur
I always look forward to what you come up with next
and I sit at my desk and howl with laughter at the magical way
you bring sanity to this whole tragedy.

Keep up the good work man - you have an incredible mind and wit.

ribbit



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 04:31:49 PM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 04:47:11 PM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!

 ::rhino::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 13, 2012, 04:51:10 PM
::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 05:28:32 PM

I hope you didn't think I was ignoring your question jamcakes, it was just one that I wanted to take some time to decide what to say about it.  Still not sure I've thought about it long enough but here goes!

I would never speak for Klaas or the mods, but I can tell you what some of MY thoughts about it over the last few years have been.

Klaas and the mods have a huge task here.  There are many threads to keep up with, and they can't just focus on one thread; they have to check in everywhere to keep things running smoothly.  And they are all here as volunteers.  They do have lives outside of the SM forum.  Whether or not the "offending" posts are actually even read completely by any of those in charge I don't know, I do know that I certainly wouldn't want the task of reading all of a certain poster's posts. 

I'm not going to go back and find this, I'm going from memory so if I'm not remembering correctly, please someone find the incident point it out to me and I will correct my error here.  I recall a moderator asking said poster to stop adding their own subtitles (those usually in blue or bold or both) to posts because that tends to indicate the main idea of the supporting articles or other information that may not be what the actual author intended, or even what others reading here would consider the main idea of the material provided.  The argument was made by said poster that those subtitles came directly from the text of the article, but I was able to almost immediately point one out that was not.  Regardless, that activity continued and has only progressed.  I don't know if they have been accurate as to the content of the articles cited or not since then, as I have scrolled on by most of those posts.  My point in even bringing this up being, the request by the moderator should have been honored imo.  As wreck's summary of posts last night indicated, even though it may not be exact anyone who reads here knows that said poster likely makes more requests of the Admin and moderators than any other poster here, but refuses to honor the request from a moderator of them?  That just didn't sit well with me at all, and I have often wondered how that made the moderator feel when the activity continued and progressed. 

Unless you are one that reads every post and/or spends a lot of time in a certain thread, you might not notice the extremes that have been gone to at times.  That would also make it very hard to understand the frustration that has built with some and at times reached the boiling point.  This is one thing that I have had to remind myself of a lot.

A different opinion on things usually provokes discussion and gathering of information on each side.  It's done all the time here all over SM, and usually in a manner that both sides of the opinion may learn more about the subject, sometimes leading to agreement; and other times (maybe even after fighting it out) simply agreeing to disagree.  It has gone beyond that in this case imo, with one seemingly trying to overpower or frankly just wear everyone down with the pounding of regurgitation's often supported with out of context snippets that IN CONTEXT were obviously not intended as they are being used.  Wreck and Anna have touched on this subject as well, and I appreciate their comments about it.  This is a discussion forum, and the continual re-posting of things that have been discussed, and ultimately discredited without any new discussion provoking information, is imo disrespectful.  However, everyone here has a right to their opinion so unless you have seen the whole picture; it might be hard to see or understand how we feel about that.

For as many of us that agree enough is enough, there will be those that will not agree.  We may never know about some of them that aren't willing to post their feelings regarding this here, but Klaas will certainly have to deal with them all.  My sincere apologies to her for any grief I have caused her.  She is an extraordinary woman, one that I admire and respect greatly.  I don't have the patience, or even the desire or willpower to do what she has done here for so many years.  She does many things behind the scenes that many here don't even know about.  Plus she has a family and job!  Even if she comes in here and gives me the biggest smack down ever about all of this, my feelings about her and what she does here at SM will not change.  I KNOW in my heart that she tries to be fair to everyone.  She's had the guts to ban members here (years ago now, and rightfully so btw) that still cause her to be disrespected and lied about to this day.  She takes so much that many of us simply couldn't handle...in stride; and keeps on keeping on.  I truly admire that. 

I have the same admiration and respect for the mods that work tirelessly to support and help Klaas keep things running smoothly here.  And I will forever miss 2NJ.

I've previously stated what I honestly believe is and has been going on with said poster for a while now.  Surely they expected problems at some point, so possibly as much time and effort has been put into the defense of these activities?  We shall see, I guess.

Whatever comes, I feel better to have shared some of my frustrations and appreciate all who were willing to speak out as well.

Sorry for another really long post everyone!   :oops:  Maybe I'll go get some housework done now.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyCool::




WOW, TexasMom, I didn't mean to put you on the spot with my question.  I thought I was aiming it at the admin, but as I reread it just now, it was inadvertantly directed at you.

First I want to thank you for taking the time to answer me at all, and then with such tact and diplomacy!  Your answer explained a lot to me about the respect each of you has for each other (well, most). Scrolling on by is a left handed form of respect as well as of self preservation.  LOL.  I admire the respect for the mods and Klaas as well.

Maybe since this issue, respectfully, comes up from time to time, that the admin will revisit it and address it again.

I feel better having brought it up and supported by many who have endured it a lot longer than I have. Thank you again for all your long posts, and for not blowing me off.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on June 13, 2012, 05:30:43 PM
I have mixed emotions about Urine coming to the U.S. for prosecution. On the one hand I wish that day was now and that he get the ultimate justice for Natalee, her family & friends, and everyone who cares.  On the other hand I wish for him a long, lingering, painful death in the hellhole Peru prison.  I can't imagine our worst prison being nearly as bad as where he is now and I don't want him to have even a millisecond of comfort or relief.  He doesn't deserve it and neither do his family/partners in crime.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 13, 2012, 05:32:34 PM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!

 ::rhino::

 ::rhino:: Me three.  Greetings and love to all the monkeys.  It's good to see everyone.

Kermit, you are so right about patience and tolerance.  Even the worst of our experiences hopefully brings us to a place of compassion for others. 

Patience, tolerance, compassion........that's a two-way street.  IMHO, MUCH of that has been practiced here for a long time.  Those attitudes should be afforded to all who post and read here.  I think the frustration comes from a feeling of no such reciprocal consideration.  Perhaps that can change.

I love knowing that Joran is miserable and stuck in the worst kind of hell-hole. Just knowing that he longs for his old prison buddies and the scam he had going before, makes me smile.  I do believe we will find out more about Paulus and Joran one day, and what actually happened to our beloved Natalee. 

I hope Joran is covered in scabs and has bugs for breakfast, lunch and dinner....until he tells the truth.   ::MonkeyHaHa:: 



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 13, 2012, 05:39:04 PM

Sometimes when we understand others and why they do what they do, it helps us gain patience and/or tolerance.
We are not all perfect, especially me, as a frog I can tell you mistakes happen all the time, but hopefully
lessons are learned and with that I hope we all read this post and gain insight....that may help us gain
understanding & insight  I know it did for me a long time ago.
ribbit




Tamikosmom wrote:
Peaches ... I can relates to all your emotions.

Quote
In 1990 I had major brain surgery to remove a tumor the size of an egg. I had never had any symptoms ... not even a headache.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=21.1660




Thanks Kermit but ... its OK.  My brain tumor was benign and following a rough six month recovery period 22 years ago that put my family through a h--- on earth ... deafness in one ear is all I have to deal with.  I asked God to afford me ten years so I could be a mother to my then seven year old surprise package son.  When son graduated from high school ... I had another talk with God.  Could it be that in 2040 there will be 93 year old Monkey named Tamikosmom riding the Justice Train as it rolls into Birmingham.

Anyways ... my posting style has been my posting style since the getgo.  It involves the submission of a speculation and the submission of a related quote/article that I based my speculating on.  Reading back ... at one time my input ... speculations and reminders ... was appreciated but ... two years ago that abruptly changed.  The sudden backlash is not a good feeling particularly because it is not understood but ... bottom line ... I KNOW that Beth is appreciative of my efforts and for the pas two years I have attempted to convince myself that is all that matters.

Ribbit!

 ::MonkeyAngel::

Janet


   


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 13, 2012, 05:55:13 PM
I have mixed emotions about Urine coming to the U.S. for prosecution. On the one hand I wish that day was now and that he get the ultimate justice for Natalee, her family & friends, and everyone who cares.  On the other hand I wish for him a long, lingering, painful death in the hellhole Peru prison.  I can't imagine our worst prison being nearly as bad as where he is now and I don't want him to have even a millisecond of comfort or relief.  He doesn't deserve it and neither do his family/partners in crime.

yuknomenot

My understanding is that the immediate extradition of Joran van der Sloot would be to face extortion charges in a Birmingham court.  After the verdict ... he would be returned to Peru to served a sentence of 9-28 years ... depending on the outcome to his sentence appeal.

It makes sense that Beth Holloway and John Q. Kelly do not want to be testifying against Joran in a Birmingham court at the ages of 78 and 88 respectively.

Janet

+++++

Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

The political process is rooted in the extradition treaty between the United States and Peru. The treaty allows a person who's convicted of a crime in Peru to be extradited to the United States to face prosecution for a separate crime.

If convicted and sentenced in the United States, the person would be sent back to Peru to finish his sentence, then extradited again to the United States to serve time there.

But Peru's Supreme Court apparently wants Joran van der Sloot to first serve out his Peruvian prison sentence before standing trial in the United States on lesser charges related to the Holloway case.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 06:00:14 PM
I do not for one minute believe that Beth appreciates the bashing of Peter DeVries that
has occurred repeatedly on this forum.  I believe that Beth is appreciative of Peter's
efforts to help her bring justice for her daughter.  I believe that Beth considers Peter
to be her friend.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 06:53:53 PM
I would venture to say that Beth probably doesn't have the time to read here or at many other blogs.  There may be readers who keep her informed, though.  I would think they would shield her from unpleasantness and controversy even if she is so informed. I would think many of the posts she is shielded from would include posts that appear pro-Joran like as in Joran will be released from jail before his trial, Joran is the "big winner", Joran's sentence will be thrown out, Joran won't ever serve his full 9 years b/c of the powers that be or Joran will be extradited to the NL. Or the constant drum beats of the betrayal and the swindle on the Persistence.  And the vilifying of Peter deVries.

IMO, these posts are NOT respectful to Beth, and I find it hard to believe that Beth actually knows about them, let alone appreciates them.

For me, most of the time, when I read your premise, I don't understand it, or follow how it was deduced.  Most of the time, I'm like wha? huh?  A lot of the time I don't understand how it relates to the discussion at hand.

I'm not trying to attack you, bash you or disrespect you.  It seemed as if you were asking for some feedback, and i thought I'd let you know what I see and think.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 13, 2012, 06:56:58 PM
I do not for one minute believe that Beth appreciates the bashing of Peter DeVries that
has occurred repeatedly on this forum.  I believe that Beth is appreciative of Peter's
efforts to help her bring justice for her daughter.  I believe that Beth considers Peter
to be her friend.

Friends do not always agree with friends but they are friends nevertheless.  When I post Peter Devries words while providing backup .... I do not consider it bashing.

Janet

+++++


1.  Peter Devries contends that Deepak and Satish were not involved in the happenings regarding the events encompassing the morning of May 30th, 2005.  Along with most Monkeys Beth believes in the Kalpoes involvement.

2.  Peter Devries contends that Paulus van der Sloot was not involved in the happenings regarding the events encompassing the morning of May 30th, 2005.  Along with most Monkeys Beth believes in the involvement of Joran's father.

3.  Peter Devries contends that Anita van der Sloot is a "good" mother who is being deceived by her son.  Along with most Monkeys Beth does not.

Loving Natalee - A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith - By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

++++++

Peter Devries  - In His Own Words

Paulus van der Sloot


Dutch Crime Reporter Peter De Vries Goes Inside Joran van der Sloot's Explosive Tape
Friday, February 08, 2008

<snipped>

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Do you think -- a lot of viewers send me e-mails. I have a -- we have a blog here, Gretawire.com, and they send a lot of comments. They're very suspicious that Paulus Van Der Sloot has more of an involvement than simply just the father of the man who was caught on tape. Do you have any information that in any way incriminates Paulus Van Der Sloot?

PETER DE VRIES, DUTCH CRIME REPORTER:  Well, Joran told on tape that his father smuggled a mobile phone, a cell phone in the prison when he was the first time arrested. And he was a judge at that time, so that's -- that's a sin.

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html


The Kalpoe Brothers

Cracking the Holloway Case?
Feb 7, 2008 7:00 PM EST


De Vries spoke to NEWSWEEK's Catharine Skipp about the case and his role in it to date.

<snipped>

NEWSWEEK: Do you believe that the Surinamese brothers, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were involved in any way?

No, not at all.  On the tapes Joran calls them stupid.  I don't believe they were involved.

<snipped>

http://www.newsweek.com/id/109260/page/3


How a sensational hidden camera operation
solved the Natalee Holloway case


<snipped>

Peter:  Jorans friends Deepak and Satish, who have been arrested for this case several times, are completely innocent. Joran declares with pride that he has abused them to create an alibi for himself. He calls them “very stupid boys’”.

http://www.peterrdevries.com/complete-story.htm


NANCY GRACE
Joran Submits to Questioning by Aruban Investigators in Holland
Aired February 7, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET


<snipped>

GRACE: Peter, where do the Kalpoe brothers fit into this whole thing?

DE VRIES: Well, they brought him to the beach.

GRACE: Yes.

DE VRIES: They dropped him there, and Natalee, of course, and then they went home. And Joran was asked by Patrick, the insider, What do they know? And then Joran said -- and you have to notice his body language at that moment, No, they know nothing. They -- I told them nothing.

GRACE: So they just got dragged into this unwittingly?

DE VRIES: Yes.

<snipped>
 
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/07/ng.01.html


Anita van der Sloot

Dutch Crime Reporter Peter De Vries Goes Inside Joran van der Sloot's Explosive Tape
Friday, February 08, 2008


VAN SUSTEREN: What prompted him to toss that wine in your face on that TV show? Did you say something to him, or what was that all about?

DE VRIES: Oh, he was frustrated about me because I was asking questions all the time, and I was saying -- I was telling the audience that Joran lied several times, that he couldn't answer simple questions, and that he was always keeping silent to the police. And well, that frustrated him

<snipped>

VAN SUSTEREN: Did Joran's parents say anything to you at that point or even after the show?

DE VRIES: After the show, they apologized for what their son did. And I think his mother is a good mother. She loves her son, but she doesn't know what he is doing, I think.

<snipped>

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 07:27:53 PM
I do not for one minute believe that Beth appreciates the bashing of Peter DeVries that
has occurred repeatedly on this forum.  I believe that Beth is appreciative of Peter's
efforts to help her bring justice for her daughter.  I believe that Beth considers Peter
to be her friend.

I've never heard or read anything to the contrary from Beth regarding him either Magnolia, and the constant negativity (same old stuff, much out of context iirc) that is posted every time his name is mentioned is uncalled for imo.  After 35 years of crime reporting Peter has helped many including Natalee, and there are many families who are grateful to him for his assistance in their respective missing persons cases.  Although I couldn't understand what was being said, that was very evident in the sincere messages sent to Peter when he was given the Forget Me Not award recently.  If you haven't seen it, it's worth watching. 

Peter stayed with Natalee's case when others had simply given up.  I believe he would have gone to the ends of the earth if he thought the answers Beth and the rest of Natalee's family and loved one's needed to find peace and Justice for Natalee were there.  He was a constant thorn in the flesh for Joran, for which I am grateful and can't help but believe that Beth probably feels the same way.  jmo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36tgjNHxJtY

http://www.youtube.com/v/36tgjNHxJtY?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0

Also, I don't know Beth personally, but from what Red has reported back to us on many occasions, and from listening to her on Dana's show; I'm confident that Beth appreciates all of the support she and Natalee's family and the Flores family receive from all of us at Scared Monkeys. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 07:36:24 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 07:40:49 PM
texasmom, Ono and 41 Guests are viewing this topic.

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek::

Wow, did something happen I don't know about?   ::HelloKitty::

If so, someone please do tell!   ::MonkeyCool::





 ::MonkeyJnBox::    Don't ask me -- I'm just an innocent bystander.  LOL


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 07:46:41 PM
I do not for one minute believe that Beth appreciates the bashing of Peter DeVries that
has occurred repeatedly on this forum.  I believe that Beth is appreciative of Peter's
efforts to help her bring justice for her daughter.  I believe that Beth considers Peter
to be her friend.

 ::MonkeyCool::   I agree -- I think he has been a source of great strength to her.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 07:47:17 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 07:48:40 PM
texasmom, Ono and 41 Guests are viewing this topic.

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyEek::

Wow, did something happen I don't know about?   ::HelloKitty::

If so, someone please do tell!   ::MonkeyCool::


 ::MonkeyJnBox::    Don't ask me -- I'm just an innocent bystander.  LOL

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 07:58:23 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::


I got a picture of baby puppy "Wreck" in an email this week....He is a grown boy now and
he is adorable.   I would post it, but I don't know how.  Maybe TM will do it for me???
You will be proud, Wreck   And they say he is a really sweet and smart boy.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 13, 2012, 08:01:06 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::


I got a picture of baby puppy "Wreck" in an email this week....He is a grown boy now and
he is adorable.   I would post it, but I don't know how.  Maybe TM will do it for me???
You will be proud, Wreck   And they say he is a really sweet and smart boy.

Magnolia - if you like you can email to me and I'll post it  ::MonkeyCool::  smklaas@hotmail.com


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 08:02:59 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::


I got a picture of baby puppy "Wreck" in an email this week....He is a grown boy now and
he is adorable.   I would post it, but I don't know how.  Maybe TM will do it for me???
You will be proud, Wreck   And they say he is a really sweet and smart boy.

Magnolia - if you like you can email to me and I'll post it  ::MonkeyCool::  smklaas@hotmail.com


Coming your way now!!   thanks!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 08:05:38 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::
nothing in particular --- just an example


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 08:11:16 PM
Well -- to return to matters at hand:   I am thinking Joran will be arriving in Alabama-The Beautiful sooner rather than later, and that's just the ticket, and in my view he has been dreading this possibility, frantically & almost neurotically, since May 2005.  No doubt he thinks Alabamians do not wear shoes, do not attend school, and live in huts.   It's the status image he finds abhorrent.
He's such a sporter, you know ... What a preppy ... He's too good to be held accountable for his actions in Alabama.  That's my opinion of what he thinks and what he fears first & foremost.  The humiliation is too much for him...  His legal brain is just too brilliant to be outdone in Alabama.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 13, 2012, 08:15:21 PM
WRECK 4/10/2010  ::MonkeyAngel::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/PeterMarvinWreckNola.jpg)


WRECK AKA ROSCOE - ALL GROWN UP 6/2012   ::MonkeyWink::  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/wreckakaroscoe.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 13, 2012, 08:19:11 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 08:21:19 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: MuffyBee on June 13, 2012, 08:24:08 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::


 ::rhino:: ::dogwag:: 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 08:24:26 PM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!

 ::rhino::

 ::rhino:: Me three.  Greetings and love to all the monkeys.  It's good to see everyone.

Kermit, you are so right about patience and tolerance.  Even the worst of our experiences hopefully brings us to a place of compassion for others. 

Patience, tolerance, compassion........that's a two-way street.  IMHO, MUCH of that has been practiced here for a long time.  Those attitudes should be afforded to all who post and read here.  I think the frustration comes from a feeling of no such reciprocal consideration.  Perhaps that can change.

I love knowing that Joran is miserable and stuck in the worst kind of hell-hole. Just knowing that he longs for his old prison buddies and the scam he had going before, makes me smile.  I do believe we will find out more about Paulus and Joran one day, and what actually happened to our beloved Natalee. 

I hope Joran is covered in scabs and has bugs for breakfast, lunch and dinner....until he tells the truth.   ::MonkeyHaHa:: 



I wish I could be positive about the "change" part, but unfortunately I don't see that happening.  This is not the first time it has come to this, and it's always the same.  No different.  Just more empowered, and more robo posting of SSDD.  It's already resumed.  

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

If you read the entire Greta interview that snippets were posted of as "back up", it's interesting especially when Paulus was one of the people addressed.  I don't believe the last comment here was included.  And if speculation is where it's at, could the first part below have been in reference to Paulus too?

Peter DeVries told Greta he would not speculate.  We all know in his position that is for good reason.  He is not an average citizen in a forum talking about missing persons cases.  At that time there was probably more than one lawyer for the Van der Sloot's, Kalpoes, and any others involved in Natalee's disappearance hanging on every word he said, just hoping he would say something actionable!

But he did say this, and note that part of it is no where to be found in the "back up" to the Peter bash posted earlier. (after second snip)

 ::snipping2::

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, there's a lot of rumors coming out of Aruba, as you might imagine. One thing I'm hearing tonight, that we had Daury Rodriguez on last night, who was the person who's actually identified on the tapes. But now there's a suggestion that there might be another Daury. Do you know, if there's another Daury?

DE VRIES: Yes, Daury Rodriguez is not the guy mentioned by Joran. It's another guy. He's in the news. I know that. But he's not the guy who was mentioned by Joran.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Where is this other guy mentioned by Joran, who helped, according to Joran, dispose of the body?

DE VRIES: Well, we don't know. The police investigators are looking for him. But I'm not quite sure if Daury is really Joran's helper because the first day, when he was talking about his helper, Joran said, I will never, ever mention his name. I will take that into my grave. And then the next day, when our man, Patrick, was pushing a little bit on that and telling him, Well, who was it, you can trust me, then he mentioned the name Daury. But I think he's protecting somebody else.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And do you know who that somebody else is? I mean, do you have any sort of -- besides just sort of a gut reaction, do you have anything independent to suggest who it might really be?

DE VRIES: Well, that's hard to say. Then I'm starting speculating, and well, I might not do that.


 ::snipping2::


DE VRIES: After the show, they apologized for what their son did. And I think his mother is a good mother. She loves her son, but she doesn't know what he is doing, I think. And well, his father, I have some special thoughts about him.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And I hope you'll come back, Peter, as you develop more information on those special thoughts, if, indeed, you get some more information on them. Peter, you're always welcome back here. So thank you, Peter.

DE VRIES: OK. You're welcome, Greta.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html#ixzz1xikSYcLC


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 08:27:23 PM
I can't believe I'm being dragged in again............................................. what someone says their opinion is in Feb '08 doesn't mean they have the same opinion in Mar '08. Everyone's opinions evolve. People I listened to  4 years ago -- I might not listen to now.

Not sure exactly what you're referring to, but I think that is probably true for a lot of us.

We live and learn, I know I've learned a lot.

 ::MonkeyCool::


I got a picture of baby puppy "Wreck" in an email this week....He is a grown boy now and
he is adorable.   I would post it, but I don't know how.  Maybe TM will do it for me???
You will be proud, Wreck   And they say he is a really sweet and smart boy.

I'm sorry I didn't answer Magnolia, I was in the middle of about three different things...one of them I just posted!  Of course I would have posted the picture for you had I been paying attention to what was going on!

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thanks Klaas for posting it!   ::MonkeyKiss::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 08:29:06 PM
I love grown up wrecks tilty head pose.....so adorable.

Ono, I agree with you.  I think Joran will arrive in Alabama sooner than later - very sooner.

If Joran can have powers that be behind the scenes, so can Natalee's loved ones!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 08:32:39 PM
WRECK 4/10/2010  ::MonkeyAngel::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/PeterMarvinWreckNola.jpg)


WRECK AKA ROSCOE - ALL GROWN UP 6/2012   ::MonkeyWink::  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/wreckakaroscoe.jpg)

He is beautiful Magnolia.  I just want to cry, I'm so happy to see him.  He doesn't even look like the same little boy we loved when he was born, and grieved for after he went to his new home.

Thank you so much for sharing!   ::MonkeyKiss::

Now I wish we could see PRDV....I wanted to adopt him myself!   :sad:

If I hadn't already had seven dogs, I would have!   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 08:34:40 PM
Correction, I think I may have even had eight dogs at that time...and one was pregnant!

Life in the country.   ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 08:46:53 PM
WRECK 4/10/2010  ::MonkeyAngel::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/PeterMarvinWreckNola.jpg)


WRECK AKA ROSCOE - ALL GROWN UP 6/2012   ::MonkeyWink::  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/wreckakaroscoe.jpg)

He is beautiful Magnolia.  I just want to cry, I'm so happy to see him.  He doesn't even look like the same little boy we loved when he was born, and grieved for after he went to his new home.

Thank you so much for sharing!   ::MonkeyKiss::

Now I wish we could see PRDV....I wanted to adopt him myself!   :sad:

If I hadn't already had seven dogs, I would have!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

I did cry when Kim sent me the picture.   I really loved those pups.
They were a joy to me.   I couldn't have raised them without all the help from
you all.  I didn't know anything about baby puppies.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 08:55:50 PM
You did a wonderful job with those puppies, Magnolia!
You loved them, took excellent care of them, and grieved for them when they were gone.
No puppy could ask for more.
Just look at that big boy Wreck aka Roscoe!
He's healthy and happy because of you, and your compassion.

(((HUGS)))


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: yuknomenot on June 13, 2012, 08:59:28 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::
Sometimes a good O/T is a necessity  ::dogwag::.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 09:02:45 PM
WRECK 4/10/2010  ::MonkeyAngel::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/PeterMarvinWreckNola.jpg)


WRECK AKA ROSCOE - ALL GROWN UP 6/2012   ::MonkeyWink::  ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/wreckakaroscoe.jpg)

He is beautiful Magnolia.  I just want to cry, I'm so happy to see him.  He doesn't even look like the same little boy we loved when he was born, and grieved for after he went to his new home.

Thank you so much for sharing!   ::MonkeyKiss::

Now I wish we could see PRDV....I wanted to adopt him myself!   :sad:

If I hadn't already had seven dogs, I would have!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

I did cry when Kim sent me the picture.   I really loved those pups.
They were a joy to me.   I couldn't have raised them without all the help from
you all.  I didn't know anything about baby puppies.
I still don't know what I did to deserve such an honor!!! What fine looking dogs -- you did great job Mags!!!  ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyCool::  ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 13, 2012, 09:14:27 PM
Handsome and smart, just like you Wreck!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 13, 2012, 09:18:27 PM
Well -- to return to matters at hand:  II am thinking Joran will be arriving in Alabama-The Beautiful sooner rather than later, and that's just the ticket, and in my view he has been dreading this possibility, frantically & almost neurotically, since May 2005.  No doubt he thinks Alabamians do not wear shoes, do not attend school, and live in huts.   It's the status image he finds abhorrent.
He's such a sporter, you know ... What a preppy ... He's too good to be held accountable for his actions in Alabama.  That's my opinion of what he thinks and what he fears first & foremost.  The humiliation is too much for him...  His legal brain is just too brilliant to be outdone in Alabama.

Ono

That is my hope also.

Could it be that at this point in time John Q. Kelly and the Birmingham Prosecutor are applying diplomatic pressure on the Peruvian Justice Minister and Cabinet to overturn the Supreme Court's decision and rule in favor of immediate extradition..

Janet

+++++

THE EXTRADITION PROCESS

Joran Van Der Sloot Gets 28 Years in Peru, Now US Wants Him
Jan. 13, 2012


Joran van der Sloot was sentenced today to 28 years in a Peruvian prison for strangling a woman there, and American officials are now expected to bring him to Alabama to face charges in connection with the disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway.

The attorney for Holloway's mother, John Q. Kelly, said after today's sentencing that he hopes van der Sloot will be extradited to the U.S. within "a couple of months."

Van der Sloot is charged with extorting $25,000 from Holloway's grieving mother Beth Holloway in exchange for information about the location of Natalee's body. After receving the money, van der Sloot admitted lying about where the girl's body was buried.

"We anticipate that U.S. authorities will move quickly to bring him to Alabama to face pending federal charges and to answer for his past conduct in Aruba," Kelly had said prior to the sentencing.

The U.S. District Attorney in Birmingham, where the case against van der Sloot will be prosecuted, did not immediately return calls for comment.  They had previously told ABC News that they had made arrangements with Interpol to have van der Sloot extradited to the U.S..

Any sentence he might receive in the U.S. would be served in conjunction with the 28 years he was sentenced in Peru, Kelly said.

<snipped>
 
http://abcnews.go.com/US/joran-van-der-sloot-28-years-now-us/story?id=15353765


Joran Van der Sloot to Fight US Extradition from Peru
Published May 09, 2012


<snipped>

Judge Zenaida Vilca informed Van der Sloot of the U.S. extradition request during a closed door meeting at Piedras Gordas prison just north of Lima. The 24-year-old Dutchman told the judge he would fight extradition, his lawyer, Maximo Altez, said.

<snipped>

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2012/05/09/joran-van-der-sloot-to-fight-us-extradition/


May 8, 2012 6:55pm
Joran Van Der Sloot’s Lawyer Says U.S. Extradition Inevitable


<snipped>

The extradition of Joran van der Sloot to the U.S. on charges of wire fraud and extortion in connection with the death of Natalee Holloway will likely take place this summer, his lawyer told ABC News today.

“The power of the United States will assure that Joran has to face a U.S. judge and I think the extradition will happen probably in two or three months,” Maximo Altez  said in an exclusve interview with ABC News.

Altez spoke to ABC News after van der Sloot appeared in a jailhouse courtroom at Piedras Gordas prison, about two hours north of Lima.

Peruvian Judge Zenaida Vilca heard arguments by U.S. Justice Department officials pushing for the extradition while  Altez opposed the move on grounds his client could not receive a fair trial in a U.S. court.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/05/joran-van-der-sloots-lawyer-says-u-s-extradition-inevitable/


Van der Sloot's Extradition to US Must Wait
Mon Jun 4, 2012 9:46pm EDT


<snipped>

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to the United States will not happen until after he serves his sentence for murder in Peru, the country's highest court has ruled. That could be as long as 28 years.

But the decision by Peru's Supreme Court is not final, as Peru's justice minister and Cabinet must also approve it, van der Sloot's lawyer told the Associated Press.

<snipped>

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/05/tagblogsfindlawcom2012-blotter-idUS236043756920120605

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 09:22:37 PM
Handsome and smart, just like you Wreck!  ::MonkeyCool::

Indeed!! ::rhino::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 09:30:09 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyDevil::   

What a precious doggie!!!  What a great face.    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 09:32:16 PM
I can't remember if I heard it on local news or read it on the net, but it was
said that negotiations were going on between the Peruvian and American Embassies,
and even went as high as the White House as to Joran's extradition.
I don't have any quote stacks to offer.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 13, 2012, 09:51:51 PM
Like most of you, I get Natalee Holloway breaking news alerts via email.  Mostly I dismiss them because they are nothing more than repeats of the same thing over and over again.  Also, most of the articles are quoting Joran's attorney and I don't put much credence into what he says.  He's been proven to be mostly FOS. 

I am content to wait for new actual news and not reworded Maximo quotes  ::MonkeyCool::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 09:57:53 PM
Well -- to return to matters at hand:   I am thinking Joran will be arriving in Alabama-The Beautiful sooner rather than later, and that's just the ticket, and in my view he has been dreading this possibility, frantically & almost neurotically, since May 2005.  No doubt he thinks Alabamians do not wear shoes, do not attend school, and live in huts.   It's the status image he finds abhorrent.
He's such a sporter, you know ... What a preppy ... He's too good to be held accountable for his actions in Alabama.  That's my opinion of what he thinks and what he fears first & foremost.  The humiliation is too much for him...  His legal brain is just too brilliant to be outdone in Alabama.

I think you're probably pretty close with your opinions on Joran's thoughts and fears about Alabama justice.  Wish I could have "Sweet Home Alabama" piped into his cell blaring...or maybe on low volume so he'd wonder if he was really hearing it!

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyDevil::

And I hope you're right that it will be sooner than later.   ::MonkeyCool::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 10:01:00 PM
Handsome and smart, just like you Wreck!  ::MonkeyCool::

Absolutely!   ::rhino::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 10:03:36 PM
I can't remember if I heard it on local news or read it on the net, but it was
said that negotiations were going on between the Peruvian and American Embassies,
and even went as high as the White House as to Joran's extradition.
I don't have any quote stacks to offer.

Thanks Magnolia!  I hope that's good news!   ::MonkeyGavel:: ::justice2NJ::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 13, 2012, 10:08:56 PM
Handsome and smart, just like you Wreck!  ::MonkeyCool::

Absolutely!   ::rhino::


Ah, now I want to see all the pups!  Wreck is magnificent!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 13, 2012, 10:15:05 PM
I'm sure every effort will be made to extradite Joran in a timely manner and if that isn't possible, I will remind once again that he can be tried in absentia as Noriega was.

Being in that harsh of a prison will take a toll on Joran and his health if he even survives it.  He will never be the same.  And if he is released an old and broken old man, I really don't care and doubt Beth would either.  He will lose the best years of his life at the very least and never be the same again.

IMHO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 10:23:27 PM
I'm sure every effort will be made to extradite Joran in a timely manner and if that isn't possible, I will remind once again that he can be tried in absentia as Noriega was.

Being in that harsh of a prison will take a toll on Joran and his health if he even survives it.  He will never be the same.  And if he is released an old and broken old man, I really don't care and doubt Beth would either.  He will lose the best years of his life at the very least and never be the same again.

IMHO
Joran is only still alive because he is high profile and his appeals are not final yet. Joran is never going to tell all about Natalee until he is completely out of any leverage and has finally exhausted every avenue. Unfortunately, he won't grasp he is at his final end until it's too late --- he will be off-ed sooner than later. -IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 13, 2012, 10:25:36 PM
I think Senor Flores has been very patient in waiting for the judicial system to take
it's course.   I think that if he thinks Joran will be released, he has the means and
the know how to make his own justice happen and I don't doubt that he will use
any means necessary.   

 ::justice2NJ::I know that I would!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 13, 2012, 10:30:17 PM
I think Senor Flores has been very patient in waiting for the judicial system to take
it's course.   I think that if he thinks Joran will be released, he has the means and
the know how to make his own justice happen and I don't doubt that he will use
any means necessary.   

 ::justice2NJ::I know that I would!!
I totally agree! He CERTAINLY has clout in Peru.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Mere on June 13, 2012, 10:31:14 PM
It is nauseating to come back here tonight and see that not only has the
roboposting returned with vigor but I would guess that it is a delight for
her to do so.  She is empowered.  A massive slap in the face everytime she
picks old posts and rehashes. 

Do any of you know how many monkeys are sitting on the sidelines waiting for
something to happen......so that this thread can be like it used to be....a
place to welcome each other and have enjoyable discussions....no matter how
difficult the subject.

Heaven forbid you want to find another thread of interest....it can also be
taken over.

Sorry for the above but it has been a long time coming.....



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 13, 2012, 10:48:59 PM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!

 ::rhino::

 ::rhino:: Me three.  Greetings and love to all the monkeys.  It's good to see everyone.

Kermit, you are so right about patience and tolerance.  Even the worst of our experiences hopefully brings us to a place of compassion for others. 

Patience, tolerance, compassion........that's a two-way street.  IMHO, MUCH of that has been practiced here for a long time.  Those attitudes should be afforded to all who post and read here.  I think the frustration comes from a feeling of no such reciprocal consideration.  Perhaps that can change.

I love knowing that Joran is miserable and stuck in the worst kind of hell-hole. Just knowing that he longs for his old prison buddies and the scam he had going before, makes me smile.  I do believe we will find out more about Paulus and Joran one day, and what actually happened to our beloved Natalee. 

I hope Joran is covered in scabs and has bugs for breakfast, lunch and dinner....until he tells the truth.   ::MonkeyHaHa:: 



I wish I could be positive about the "change" part, but unfortunately I don't see that happening.  This is not the first time it has come to this, and it's always the same.  No different.  Just more empowered, and more robo posting of SSDD.  It's already resumed.  

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

If you read the entire Greta interview that snippets were posted of as "back up", it's interesting especially when Paulus was one of the people addressed.  I don't believe the last comment here was included.  And if speculation is where it's at, could the first part below have been in reference to Paulus too?

Peter DeVries told Greta he would not speculate.  We all know in his position that is for good reason.  He is not an average citizen in a forum talking about missing persons cases.  At that time there was probably more than one lawyer for the Van der Sloot's, Kalpoes, and any others involved in Natalee's disappearance hanging on every word he said, just hoping he would say something actionable!

But he did say this, and note that part of it is no where to be found in the "back up" to the Peter bash posted earlier. (after second snip)

 ::snipping2::

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, there's a lot of rumors coming out of Aruba, as you might imagine. One thing I'm hearing tonight, that we had Daury Rodriguez on last night, who was the person who's actually identified on the tapes. But now there's a suggestion that there might be another Daury. Do you know, if there's another Daury?

DE VRIES: Yes, Daury Rodriguez is not the guy mentioned by Joran. It's another guy. He's in the news. I know that. But he's not the guy who was mentioned by Joran.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Where is this other guy mentioned by Joran, who helped, according to Joran, dispose of the body?

DE VRIES: Well, we don't know. The police investigators are looking for him. But I'm not quite sure if Daury is really Joran's helper because the first day, when he was talking about his helper, Joran said, I will never, ever mention his name. I will take that into my grave. And then the next day, when our man, Patrick, was pushing a little bit on that and telling him, Well, who was it, you can trust me, then he mentioned the name Daury. But I think he's protecting somebody else.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And do you know who that somebody else is? I mean, do you have any sort of -- besides just sort of a gut reaction, do you have anything independent to suggest who it might really be?

DE VRIES: Well, that's hard to say. Then I'm starting speculating, and well, I might not do that.


 ::snipping2::


DE VRIES: After the show, they apologized for what their son did. And I think his mother is a good mother. She loves her son, but she doesn't know what he is doing, I think. And well, his father, I have some special thoughts about him.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And I hope you'll come back, Peter, as you develop more information on those special thoughts, if, indeed, you get some more information on them. Peter, you're always welcome back here. So thank you, Peter.

DE VRIES: OK. You're welcome, Greta.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html#ixzz1xikSYcLC

Yikes, TM!  Well, if there had been any doubt, it's erased.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

They have always been particularly defensive about Paulus.  Perhaps that's why they don't enjoy Peter DeVries as much as we do. 

Nighty Night, monkeys.







Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 10:50:11 PM
::snipping2::
Wish I could have "Sweet Home Alabama" piped into his cell blaring...or maybe on low volume so he'd wonder if he was really hearing it!

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyDevil::
 ::snipping2::


ROTFLMAO


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 13, 2012, 11:15:28 PM
I would love to see a current pic of Joran to see how he looks after just 5 months in a Peruvian hell hole prison without all the perks.  I bet he still cries into his pillow every night.

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 13, 2012, 11:25:34 PM
For our Australian friends who have never seen this program (a repeat)!  ::koaladancing::

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/arts/television/vanished-with-beth-holloway/story-fncnk810-1226395140455

Vanished with Beth Holloway
From:The Australian
June 14, 2012  8:59AM

THE murder or disappearance of one's child is an unimaginable tragedy that inevitably shapes life from that point on.

Often, parents become campaigners for justice in a bid to help others avoid a similar fate. John Walsh, whose son Adam was abducted and murdered in 1981 (you may remember the 1983 telemovie Adam), became an anti-crime campaigner and went on to host America's Most Wanted.

Alabama woman Beth Holloway, whose daughter Natalee disappeared on a high school graduation trip to the Caribbean island of Aruba in 2005 (and had a telemovie of her own), is also heading down the TV path with this show about people who have disappeared. She's not a particularly natural interviewer but she's passionate about the topic.
 
The first half of this episode recaps Natalee's story. A half-hour is not nearly enough time to do justice to the bizarre series of confessions and recantations from prime suspect Joran van der Sloot in the years since her disappearance.  ::snipping2::

Vanished with Beth Holloway, Saturday, 8pm, Ci


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 13, 2012, 11:36:38 PM
It is nauseating to come back here tonight and see that not only has the
roboposting returned with vigor but I would guess that it is a delight for
her to do so.  She is empowered.  A massive slap in the face everytime she
picks old posts and rehashes. 

Do any of you know how many monkeys are sitting on the sidelines waiting for
something to happen......so that this thread can be like it used to be....a
place to welcome each other and have enjoyable discussions....no matter how
difficult the subject.

Heaven forbid you want to find another thread of interest....it can also be
taken over.

Sorry for the above but it has been a long time coming.....



Hi Mere!   :smt006

It's always good to see you!

Believe me, I understand how you feel and your frustration.

I don't really know how many monkeys are not active because of this, but my guess
would be A LOT. 

And I've experienced the same in other threads too. 

Nothing for you to be sorry about imo.

Thank you for signing in and sharing your thoughts. ::MonkeyKiss::



 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 13, 2012, 11:47:47 PM
Well -- to return to matters at hand:   I am thinking Joran will be arriving in Alabama-The Beautiful sooner rather than later, and that's just the ticket, and in my view he has been dreading this possibility, frantically & almost neurotically, since May 2005.  No doubt he thinks Alabamians do not wear shoes, do not attend school, and live in huts.   It's the status image he finds abhorrent.
He's such a sporter, you know ... What a preppy ... He's too good to be held accountable for his actions in Alabama.  That's my opinion of what he thinks and what he fears first & foremost.  The humiliation is too much for him...  His legal brain is just too brilliant to be outdone in Alabama.

I think you're probably pretty close with your opinions on Joran's thoughts and fears about Alabama justice.  Wish I could have "Sweet Home Alabama" piped into his cell blaring...or maybe on low volume so he'd wonder if he was really hearing it!

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyDevil::

And I hope you're right that it will be sooner than later.   ::MonkeyCool::




Great idea --- the musical cell-piping.    ::MonkeyCool::    We could alternate with: "Yea, Alabama, Crimson Tide" ...


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:05:40 AM
Well -- to return to matters at hand:   I am thinking Joran will be arriving in Alabama-The Beautiful sooner rather than later, and that's just the ticket, and in my view he has been dreading this possibility, frantically & almost neurotically, since May 2005.  No doubt he thinks Alabamians do not wear shoes, do not attend school, and live in huts.   It's the status image he finds abhorrent.
He's such a sporter, you know ... What a preppy ... He's too good to be held accountable for his actions in Alabama.  That's my opinion of what he thinks and what he fears first & foremost.  The humiliation is too much for him...  His legal brain is just too brilliant to be outdone in Alabama.

I think you're probably pretty close with your opinions on Joran's thoughts and fears about Alabama justice.  Wish I could have "Sweet Home Alabama" piped into his cell blaring...or maybe on low volume so he'd wonder if he was really hearing it!

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyDevil::

And I hope you're right that it will be sooner than later.   ::MonkeyCool::




Great idea --- the musical cell-piping.    ::MonkeyCool::    We could alternate with: "Yea, Alabama, Crimson Tide" ...

Sounds good to me!   ::MonkeyDance::

 ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 14, 2012, 12:21:13 AM
I would love to see a current pic of Joran to see how he looks after just 5 months in a Peruvian hell hole prison without all the perks.  I bet he still cries into his pillow every night.

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Don't you just know he had the jail house pallor. ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:23:06 AM
I think Senor Flores has been very patient in waiting for the judicial system to take
it's course.   I think that if he thinks Joran will be released, he has the means and
the know how to make his own justice happen and I don't doubt that he will use
any means necessary.   

 ::justice2NJ:: I know that I would!!
I totally agree! He CERTAINLY has clout in Peru.

He does have clout, and according to him...he had offers to do just that.
I admire his stand on the subject.  I'm just not sure I could have been that strong in his position.

http://nbclatino.tumblr.com/post/15586683744/reporters-notebook-lilia-luciano-on-joran-van-der

Reporter’s Notebook: Lilia Luciano on Joran Van der Sloot Trial in Peru
 09 January, 2012

Fear, rage and sadness…It’s hard to keep emotions aside when a story begins with a tragedy.

When I met Stephany Flores’ father in September, I couldn’t look him in the eye—There we were, walking into his home, moving his furniture around and asking him piercing questions about the violent death of his only daughter. If she hadn’t been murdered, Stephany would be exactly my age. But this man immediately offered one of the kindest smiles I had ever seen; “Estan en su casa”, he said politely and went on to bring us water and bananas.

Ricardo Flores is an admired race-car driver and a respected businessman who once ran for president in his country. Throughout our interview, Ricardo continued to break us with a bright smile and resilience to hold back his tears. He said he will only allow himself to mourn his daughter’s death when Peruvian justice dictates a sentence for Stephany’s killer; “Then I will be able to cry,” he said.    

 ::snipping2::

When the hearing commenced, the Dutchman walked into the courtroom wearing a bulletproof vest. I immediately remembered when Ricardo Flores told us during our interview that people had approached him on several occasions to offer “their own kind of justice” against Van der Sloot. He said that was inconceivable and that he would never even think of such a thing. “I have a clean conscience and I must be able to face my family and god with peace of mind.”

 ::snipping2::

On his way out from Luringancho Ricardo Flores said, ”Whatever the sentence may be, I trust it will be a fair one” and that all he wants is for this long painful process to be over.

Perhaps Ricardo will then shed his tears…



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:28:09 AM
Are there Shaman's in Alabama? 

http://nbclatino.tumblr.com/post/15586683744/reporters-notebook-lilia-luciano-on-joran-van-der

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxjv9xDfez1r1767o.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 14, 2012, 12:38:31 AM
Are there Shaman's in Alabama? 

 ::snipping2::

Probably, and a lot of nightmarish people who do more than go "bump" in the night!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: AZSunny on June 14, 2012, 12:38:51 AM
I support you all, and very often look for the "like" button to push, when I am not scrolling, scrolling, scrolling.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 14, 2012, 12:43:40 AM
Maybe there is room for them on the Justice Train!   ::MonkeyDevil::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 14, 2012, 12:48:05 AM
I support you all, and very often look for the "like" button to push, when I am not scrolling, scrolling, scrolling.  ::MonkeyWink::


Good to see you AZSunny!  ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 14, 2012, 12:55:08 AM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 

WILLEMSTAD — In a letter to the Dutch outgoing minister of Kingdom Relations, Liesbeth Spies, Institute Pro Pueblo appeals to ‘do everything necessary to rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime so that we may realize our self-governing status within the Kingdom in a dignified way.The letter is dated tomorrow, the day that Pro Pueblo will hold a protest action at Wilhelminaplein. The intention is enclose a petition. The protest action will begin at five p.m. Spies will arrive on Curaçao Wednesday morning and will then have a talk with the governor. She will meet with Premier Schotte (MFK) and the government on Thursday.
 ::snipping2::
“Since their installation, the government and the supporting parties have attacked all basic institutes of the democratic constitution and eliminated such systematically”. The institute produces another list that mentions the shutdown of the intelligence service after the minister-president had frustrated the screening of the ministers; the interference in the current criminal case of the Public Prosecutor whereby the Minister of Justice repeatedly lied about his role in such and in which case the advisors of the ministers are also the lawyers of the suspect; the dispute between the minister-president and the minister of Finance on the one hand and the Central Bank on the other hand; the premier’s threat to install monitoring equipment in the offices of the :Public Prosecutor; and the government systematically ignoring judicial decisions. The list also mentions ‘the actual limiting of the freedom of the press’.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 14, 2012, 12:57:37 AM
Wire fraud and extortion are federal offenses.  Would Joran be housed in a federal, state or local prison/jail once he is extradited but awaiting his trial?  Assuming he is convicted, and when it comes time to serve his sentence, will he be sent to a minimum, medium or high security federal prison for his offense (and/or to protect him)?  There are no high security fed prisons in AL right now, but Atlanta has a notorious one. Heh, heh!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Just day dreamin about Joran's future!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 01:57:22 AM
I support you all, and very often look for the "like" button to push, when I am not scrolling, scrolling, scrolling.  ::MonkeyWink::


Hi AZSunny!   ::HelloKitty::

So glad you came by!   ::MonkeyKiss::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 02:01:14 AM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 

WILLEMSTAD — In a letter to the Dutch outgoing minister of Kingdom Relations, Liesbeth Spies, Institute Pro Pueblo appeals to ‘do everything necessary to rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime so that we may realize our self-governing status within the Kingdom in a dignified way.The letter is dated tomorrow, the day that Pro Pueblo will hold a protest action at Wilhelminaplein. The intention is enclose a petition. The protest action will begin at five p.m. Spies will arrive on Curaçao Wednesday morning and will then have a talk with the governor. She will meet with Premier Schotte (MFK) and the government on Thursday.
 ::snipping2::
“Since their installation, the government and the supporting parties have attacked all basic institutes of the democratic constitution and eliminated such systematically”. The institute produces another list that mentions the shutdown of the intelligence service after the minister-president had frustrated the screening of the ministers; the interference in the current criminal case of the Public Prosecutor whereby the Minister of Justice repeatedly lied about his role in such and in which case the advisors of the ministers are also the lawyers of the suspect; the dispute between the minister-president and the minister of Finance on the one hand and the Central Bank on the other hand; the premier’s threat to install monitoring equipment in the offices of the :Public Prosecutor; and the government systematically ignoring judicial decisions. The list also mentions ‘the actual limiting of the freedom of the press’.


I've been reading about this and also about a huge corruption case in Spain where some of the defendants have bank accounts in Curacao that the Prosecutor has been unsuccessful in getting the records of.  I started to post something about it the other night but got sidetracked.  I'd really like to research all the players in that one and see if I can find any connections...

IYKWIM   ::MonkeyWink::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 02:03:38 AM
Are there Shaman's in Alabama? 

 ::snipping2::

Probably, and a lot of nightmarish people who do more than go "bump" in the night!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::



 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::justice2NJ::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 02:09:23 AM
Sorry, Kermit....I just don't get your drift.   Most of us here have suffered some
adversity and health issues...including a brain tumor.   Yet we can refrain from
the mass and repetitive postings.   I just don't think that is an excuse.
But I love you anyway!!

 ::rhino::

 ::rhino:: Me three.  Greetings and love to all the monkeys.  It's good to see everyone.

Kermit, you are so right about patience and tolerance.  Even the worst of our experiences hopefully brings us to a place of compassion for others. 

Patience, tolerance, compassion........that's a two-way street.  IMHO, MUCH of that has been practiced here for a long time.  Those attitudes should be afforded to all who post and read here.  I think the frustration comes from a feeling of no such reciprocal consideration.  Perhaps that can change.

I love knowing that Joran is miserable and stuck in the worst kind of hell-hole. Just knowing that he longs for his old prison buddies and the scam he had going before, makes me smile.  I do believe we will find out more about Paulus and Joran one day, and what actually happened to our beloved Natalee. 

I hope Joran is covered in scabs and has bugs for breakfast, lunch and dinner....until he tells the truth.   ::MonkeyHaHa:: 



I wish I could be positive about the "change" part, but unfortunately I don't see that happening.  This is not the first time it has come to this, and it's always the same.  No different.  Just more empowered, and more robo posting of SSDD.  It's already resumed.  

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

If you read the entire Greta interview that snippets were posted of as "back up", it's interesting especially when Paulus was one of the people addressed.  I don't believe the last comment here was included.  And if speculation is where it's at, could the first part below have been in reference to Paulus too?

Peter DeVries told Greta he would not speculate.  We all know in his position that is for good reason.  He is not an average citizen in a forum talking about missing persons cases.  At that time there was probably more than one lawyer for the Van der Sloot's, Kalpoes, and any others involved in Natalee's disappearance hanging on every word he said, just hoping he would say something actionable!

But he did say this, and note that part of it is no where to be found in the "back up" to the Peter bash posted earlier. (after second snip)

 ::snipping2::

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, there's a lot of rumors coming out of Aruba, as you might imagine. One thing I'm hearing tonight, that we had Daury Rodriguez on last night, who was the person who's actually identified on the tapes. But now there's a suggestion that there might be another Daury. Do you know, if there's another Daury?

DE VRIES: Yes, Daury Rodriguez is not the guy mentioned by Joran. It's another guy. He's in the news. I know that. But he's not the guy who was mentioned by Joran.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Where is this other guy mentioned by Joran, who helped, according to Joran, dispose of the body?

DE VRIES: Well, we don't know. The police investigators are looking for him. But I'm not quite sure if Daury is really Joran's helper because the first day, when he was talking about his helper, Joran said, I will never, ever mention his name. I will take that into my grave. And then the next day, when our man, Patrick, was pushing a little bit on that and telling him, Well, who was it, you can trust me, then he mentioned the name Daury. But I think he's protecting somebody else.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And do you know who that somebody else is? I mean, do you have any sort of -- besides just sort of a gut reaction, do you have anything independent to suggest who it might really be?

DE VRIES: Well, that's hard to say. Then I'm starting speculating, and well, I might not do that.


 ::snipping2::


DE VRIES: After the show, they apologized for what their son did. And I think his mother is a good mother. She loves her son, but she doesn't know what he is doing, I think. And well, his father, I have some special thoughts about him.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. And I hope you'll come back, Peter, as you develop more information on those special thoughts, if, indeed, you get some more information on them. Peter, you're always welcome back here. So thank you, Peter.

DE VRIES: OK. You're welcome, Greta.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329847,00.html#ixzz1xikSYcLC

Yikes, TM!  Well, if there had been any doubt, it's erased.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

They have always been particularly defensive about Paulus.  Perhaps that's why they don't enjoy Peter DeVries as much as we do. 

Nighty Night, monkeys.


Good night Helen Back! 

So sorry I missed saying it earlier.

 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 14, 2012, 02:46:12 AM
As I am usually running late in most discussions owing to having a real life outside my computer room added to the time difference I just want to add a couple of observations to the previous pages of posting.

I am intrigued by Kermit's reference to the past surgery some 20 plus years ago.  Now I do have a close encounter with brain surgery as my DH underwent two major brain surgeries with the second one only 3 months after the first.  I understand the long weeks of recovery and medications to prevent possible seizures, and in some cases the need for rehabilitation, although fortunately the only repercussions in my DH's case is a slow deterioration of his eyesight owing to the sites of the two aneurysms. Thankfully he improved and is now back to a normal lifestyle and there has been no sign of any mental deterioration.

I also know that two of our long standing monkeys have undergone major brain surgery and are back to full health and mental acuity.  Possibly there are more of our members who have also faced a similar life changing event.

So why is this an issue?

Posting with such total disregard to the feelings and respect due to all other monkeys is to me an act of defiance and if it becomes extreme could even be considered a form of bullying.  We are all here for the same reason and that is to watch a callous murderer get his just desserts.  Now it appears that this will come to pass but if it is not to the extent that most of us would wish for, my beliefs console me with the fact that there is a special place in Hell for such as he and others who have committed such  heinous crimes.

I am more than happy to let God take care of it for He sees all, and knows all,  and His wisdom is above all else.

 ::MonkeyAngel::


Now I am in awe of Beth as a mother and as a woman.  She has handled herself with grace and intelligence.  I have a copy of Beth's book which she personally inscribed to me with her appreciation for my support. I treasure this book and refer to it often.  This does not lead me to believe she thinks of me as anything other than an interested Australian monkey.  I would never contact her or presume anything as to what she thinks or believes.  I have had the opportunity to chat with one of her close relatives and they spoke often of their admiration and appreciation for the devotion of ALL the monkeys.  No one was singled out or thought more highly of than any other, and that is exactly as it should be. 

Beth has moved on.  The family has moved on.  We need to move on. 

No one is being asked to cease posting only just to refrain from hashing and rehashing material that has long since outlived it's usefulness.  There are threads in this case and other major cases where information and data are recorded for reference and refreshing details, and these would be a boon for newer or returning monkeys.  None of us are simple minded and we can find what we need or we are also able to ask for help or information.  Roboposting does nothing for any of us except to irritate and certainly does not assist Beth in her search for the truth.  I agree with other monkeys that I doubt she or any of the family read here any longer.  They certainly no longer post here.

It has been an eye opener to me to see how many monkeys have posted here in the past day or so.  Hopefully we can all move forward from this and regain the respect and tolerance we all had for each other in times past.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 14, 2012, 02:52:55 AM
For our Australian friends who have never seen this program (a repeat)!  ::koaladancing::

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/arts/television/vanished-with-beth-holloway/story-fncnk810-1226395140455

Vanished with Beth Holloway
From:The Australian
June 14, 2012  8:59AM

THE murder or disappearance of one's child is an unimaginable tragedy that inevitably shapes life from that point on.

Often, parents become campaigners for justice in a bid to help others avoid a similar fate. John Walsh, whose son Adam was abducted and murdered in 1981 (you may remember the 1983 telemovie Adam), became an anti-crime campaigner and went on to host America's Most Wanted.

Alabama woman Beth Holloway, whose daughter Natalee disappeared on a high school graduation trip to the Caribbean island of Aruba in 2005 (and had a telemovie of her own), is also heading down the TV path with this show about people who have disappeared. She's not a particularly natural interviewer but she's passionate about the topic.
 
The first half of this episode recaps Natalee's story. A half-hour is not nearly enough time to do justice to the bizarre series of confessions and recantations from prime suspect Joran van der Sloot in the years since her disappearance.  ::snipping2::

Vanished with Beth Holloway, Saturday, 8pm, Ci


grace-land thank you so much for the heads up here and in my Aussie thread for this programme which has finally reached our television network.  Ci (Crime and Investigation) is one of the channels on our Foxtel/Austar pay TV network. 

On Saturday they are showing Natalee Holloway : Lost in Paradise at 7.30 pm AEST and then following with Vanished with Beth Holloway at 8.30 pm.

They are repeating the Vanished programme only on Sunday at 10.30 am.

I have upgraded my Austar service to include this channel in readiness for Sat/Sun.

Again many thanks 

 ::monkeywine2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 14, 2012, 03:01:20 AM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::

Magnolia thank you for sharing Wreck's picture.  He is a handsome boy!

I remember the night those pups arrived and all the advice you received.  By the way I hope Hunter is also in good health.

 ::dogwag::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 14, 2012, 03:05:09 AM
Are there Shaman's in Alabama? 

 ::snipping2::

Probably, and a lot of nightmarish people who do more than go "bump" in the night!

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::



 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::justice2NJ::


I believe there could be some very interesting people living in the bayou areas     ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 14, 2012, 09:23:57 AM


It has been an eye opener to me to see how many monkeys have posted here in the past day or so. 
Hopefully we can all move forward from this and regain the respect and tolerance we all had for each other in times past.

As a relative newbie, I have been impressed by the number of monkeys of senior status (judging by their post counts) that have swung in from the rafters to comment on and support the issue of reasons to "scroll".  Judging by their posts, it seems that they would be more inclined to post and discuss once again if they didn't have to scroll so much. I hope everyone can reach a state of balance, and the senior monkeys will begin posting more often. A wealth of knowledge and wisdom is missing.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 14, 2012, 10:26:51 AM
Are there Shaman's in Alabama? 

http://nbclatino.tumblr.com/post/15586683744/reporters-notebook-lilia-luciano-on-joran-van-der

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxjv9xDfez1r1767o.jpg)

 ::MonkeyHaHa::   There may be a few at Mardi Gras ... LOL


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 14, 2012, 11:24:02 AM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 

WILLEMSTAD — In a letter to the Dutch outgoing minister of Kingdom Relations, Liesbeth Spies, Institute Pro Pueblo appeals to ‘do everything necessary to rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime so that we may realize our self-governing status within the Kingdom in a dignified way.The letter is dated tomorrow, the day that Pro Pueblo will hold a protest action at Wilhelminaplein. The intention is enclose a petition. The protest action will begin at five p.m. Spies will arrive on Curaçao Wednesday morning and will then have a talk with the governor. She will meet with Premier Schotte (MFK) and the government on Thursday.
 ::snipping2::
“Since their installation, the government and the supporting parties have attacked all basic institutes of the democratic constitution and eliminated such systematically”. The institute produces another list that mentions the shutdown of the intelligence service after the minister-president had frustrated the screening of the ministers; the interference in the current criminal case of the Public Prosecutor whereby the Minister of Justice repeatedly lied about his role in such and in which case the advisors of the ministers are also the lawyers of the suspect; the dispute between the minister-president and the minister of Finance on the one hand and the Central Bank on the other hand; the premier’s threat to install monitoring equipment in the offices of the :Public Prosecutor; and the government systematically ignoring judicial decisions. The list also mentions ‘the actual limiting of the freedom of the press’.


I've been reading about this and also about a huge corruption case in Spain where some of the defendants have bank accounts in Curacao that the Prosecutor has been unsuccessful in getting the records of.  I started to post something about it the other night but got sidetracked.  I'd really like to research all the players in that one and see if I can find any connections...

IYKWIM   ::MonkeyWink::



Hey TM and good day all!

I feel sure that if anyone can find some connections, you can!  Now that is something I would be very interested to see.  As the banking rat's nest continues to come unraveled all around the world, I think we will see some familiar names shake out.

I know Aruba claims that tourism is their main industry, but we all know it's really money laundering, offshore secret banking, tax evasion and drug and human trafficking.   

::MonkeyCool::

The crooks may run out of places to hide their money. 

Hang tough, monkeys! The powers that were are falling like a house of cards, and the truth will come out one day.








Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 14, 2012, 11:33:02 AM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 
 ::snipping2::

I've been reading about this and also about a huge corruption case in Spain where some of the defendants have bank accounts in Curacao that the Prosecutor has been unsuccessful in getting the records of.  I started to post something about it the other night but got sidetracked.  I'd really like to research all the players in that one and see if I can find any connections...

IYKWIM   ::MonkeyWink::



Hey TM and good day all!

I feel sure that if anyone can find some connections, you can!  Now that is something I would be very interested to see.  As the banking rat's nest continues to come unraveled all around the world, I think we will see some familiar names shake out.

I know Aruba claims that tourism is their main industry, but we all know it's really money laundering, offshore secret banking, tax evasion and drug and human trafficking.   

::MonkeyCool::

The crooks may run out of places to hide their money. 

Hang tough, monkeys! The powers that were are falling like a house of cards, and the truth will come out one day.


I bet Judge Rick Smid's name pops up!

SMID, Rick  – Reportedly a friend of PVDS who stayed at VDS home.  Judge who released J2K in September 2005.  Dutch judge in Curacao.  As a public prosecutor in the NL, participated in the Carribean Financial Task Force as expert on money laundering.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: RoxiBalboa on June 14, 2012, 12:06:59 PM
Hello Monkeys!

Loooong time no post for me but I still read everyday. I would like to add to the recent conversation and tell you how I have coped with my frustration with certain postings. (IMOO, someone just loves drama, and when things slow down needs to start something).

Anyway, I think of certain posts as ADS. When you read webpages do you stop to read the Ads they have in the middle of the page. Heck no, you keep reading what you are attempting to read. So just see these posts as Ads in the middle of the page and skip on by. Once you just get your brain to accept its an Ad it's like those posts weren't even there.

That dog is beauitful!!

God Bless


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Mere on June 14, 2012, 12:14:12 PM
Hello Monkeys!

Loooong time no post for me but I still read everyday. I would like to add to the recent conversation and tell you how I have coped with my frustration with certain postings. (IMOO, someone just loves drama, and when things slow down needs to start something).

Anyway, I think of certain posts as ADS. When you read webpages do you stop to read the Ads they have in the middle of the page. Heck no, you keep reading what you are attempting to read. So just see these posts as Ads in the middle of the page and skip on by. Once you just get your brain to accept its an Ad it's like those posts weren't even there.

That dog is beauitful!!

God Bless

RoxiB.....I am sitting here laughing and enjoying your thoughts on ads.

A friend wrote last night....one who has gone to lurking and finished with a cute
sentence...referring to SM....." I wish they'd put cushions in the rafters. gettin blisters on me bum".

TM....sorry I did not wish you a good night.  Thanks for your response.  There are nice
people in those rafters.  Now going to check on other threads.  Hugs.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:28:23 PM
As I am usually running late in most discussions owing to having a real life outside my computer room added to the time difference I just want to add a couple of observations to the previous pages of posting.

I am intrigued by Kermit's reference to the past surgery some 20 plus years ago.  Now I do have a close encounter with brain surgery as my DH underwent two major brain surgeries with the second one only 3 months after the first.  I understand the long weeks of recovery and medications to prevent possible seizures, and in some cases the need for rehabilitation, although fortunately the only repercussions in my DH's case is a slow deterioration of his eyesight owing to the sites of the two aneurysms. Thankfully he improved and is now back to a normal lifestyle and there has been no sign of any mental deterioration.

I also know that two of our long standing monkeys have undergone major brain surgery and are back to full health and mental acuity.  Possibly there are more of our members who have also faced a similar life changing event.

So why is this an issue?

Posting with such total disregard to the feelings and respect due to all other monkeys is to me an act of defiance and if it becomes extreme could even be considered a form of bullying.  We are all here for the same reason and that is to watch a callous murderer get his just desserts.  Now it appears that this will come to pass but if it is not to the extent that most of us would wish for, my beliefs console me with the fact that there is a special place in Hell for such as he and others who have committed such  heinous crimes.

I am more than happy to let God take care of it for He sees all, and knows all,  and His wisdom is above all else.

 ::MonkeyAngel::


Now I am in awe of Beth as a mother and as a woman.  She has handled herself with grace and intelligence.  I have a copy of Beth's book which she personally inscribed to me with her appreciation for my support. I treasure this book and refer to it often.  This does not lead me to believe she thinks of me as anything other than an interested Australian monkey.  I would never contact her or presume anything as to what she thinks or believes.  I have had the opportunity to chat with one of her close relatives and they spoke often of their admiration and appreciation for the devotion of ALL the monkeys.  No one was singled out or thought more highly of than any other, and that is exactly as it should be. 

Beth has moved on.  The family has moved on.  We need to move on. 

No one is being asked to cease posting only just to refrain from hashing and rehashing material that has long since outlived it's usefulness.  There are threads in this case and other major cases where information and data are recorded for reference and refreshing details, and these would be a boon for newer or returning monkeys.  None of us are simple minded and we can find what we need or we are also able to ask for help or information.  Roboposting does nothing for any of us except to irritate and certainly does not assist Beth in her search for the truth.  I agree with other monkeys that I doubt she or any of the family read here any longer.  They certainly no longer post here.

It has been an eye opener to me to see how many monkeys have posted here in the past day or so.  Hopefully we can all move forward from this and regain the respect and tolerance we all had for each other in times past.

Thank you Tibro, many good points.   ::MonkeyKiss::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:30:10 PM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::

Magnolia thank you for sharing Wreck's picture.  He is a handsome boy!

I remember the night those pups arrived and all the advice you received.  By the way I hope Hunter is also in good health.

 ::dogwag::

Tibro, did you mean Hudson?  He's the wonder dog, love him!   ::dogwag::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:47:19 PM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 

WILLEMSTAD — In a letter to the Dutch outgoing minister of Kingdom Relations, Liesbeth Spies, Institute Pro Pueblo appeals to ‘do everything necessary to rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime so that we may realize our self-governing status within the Kingdom in a dignified way.The letter is dated tomorrow, the day that Pro Pueblo will hold a protest action at Wilhelminaplein. The intention is enclose a petition. The protest action will begin at five p.m. Spies will arrive on Curaçao Wednesday morning and will then have a talk with the governor. She will meet with Premier Schotte (MFK) and the government on Thursday.
 ::snipping2::
“Since their installation, the government and the supporting parties have attacked all basic institutes of the democratic constitution and eliminated such systematically”. The institute produces another list that mentions the shutdown of the intelligence service after the minister-president had frustrated the screening of the ministers; the interference in the current criminal case of the Public Prosecutor whereby the Minister of Justice repeatedly lied about his role in such and in which case the advisors of the ministers are also the lawyers of the suspect; the dispute between the minister-president and the minister of Finance on the one hand and the Central Bank on the other hand; the premier’s threat to install monitoring equipment in the offices of the :Public Prosecutor; and the government systematically ignoring judicial decisions. The list also mentions ‘the actual limiting of the freedom of the press’.


I've been reading about this and also about a huge corruption case in Spain where some of the defendants have bank accounts in Curacao that the Prosecutor has been unsuccessful in getting the records of.  I started to post something about it the other night but got sidetracked.  I'd really like to research all the players in that one and see if I can find any connections...

IYKWIM   ::MonkeyWink::



Hey TM and good day all!

I feel sure that if anyone can find some connections, you can!  Now that is something I would be very interested to see.  As the banking rat's nest continues to come unraveled all around the world, I think we will see some familiar names shake out.

I know Aruba claims that tourism is their main industry, but we all know it's really money laundering, offshore secret banking, tax evasion and drug and human trafficking.   

::MonkeyCool::

The crooks may run out of places to hide their money. 

Hang tough, monkeys! The powers that were are falling like a house of cards, and the truth will come out one day.


Thanks Helen Back!  I don't know when or if I will have time to spend researching it all, but I would really love to.  I think it could be interesting. 

 ::MonkeyWink::

This is a recent article about the case in Spain I mentioned.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/114939-pvda-urges-for-co-operation-in-spanish-anti-corruption-case

PvdA urges for co-operation in Spanish anti-corruption case         

FRIDAY, 8 JUNE 2012 20:54

THE HAGUE — The political party PvdA urges the Netherlands to co-operate with the so-called Gürtel-case, a large-scale anti-corruption investigation in Spain that supposedly involves important Spanish politicians. Several suspects supposedly have bank accounts on Curaçao.


According to the Spanish newspaper El País, for three years the Netherlands has refused to provide bank data and other information on the Curaçao bank accounts from several suspects although the Spanish Public Prosecutor had requested such repeatedly. A request was made to the Dutch government in February 2009 and on May 26th 2010 to obtain information on suspected companies on Curaçao. El País quotes sources within Justice, who refer to the offshore-activities on Curaçao.

“Is it true that all other countries – including Switzerland, the US, Morocco and France – that had received a request for co-operation from the Spanish judicial authorities were prepared to co-operate? If so, why is the Netherlands refusing to co-operate with a trial that is clearly focused on prosecuting corruption in high political circles in Spain?” Lower Chamber member Frans Timmermans (PvdA) wrote in a letter to the Dutch ministers of Justice and Foreign Affairs.

The refusal to co-operate creates the impression that the Netherlands is attempting to keep corrupt politicians from being prosecuted by judicial authorities, Timmermans wrote. It’s not clear whether the Spanish Public Prosecutor also sent a direct request for information to the Curaçao government.

The Gürtel-case is about bribing officials in getting permits and orders in the period 2001 to 2009. Millions of euros are involved with the bribery. The case is named after one of the suspects, Francisco Correa, whose last name is Gürtel in German (which means girdle). By order of the then Spanish president José Maria Aznar, Correa organized meetings for the centre-right Partido Popular. A former secretary of Partido Popular is also one of the suspects


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 12:52:00 PM
Hello Monkeys!

Loooong time no post for me but I still read everyday. I would like to add to the recent conversation and tell you how I have coped with my frustration with certain postings. (IMOO, someone just loves drama, and when things slow down needs to start something).

Anyway, I think of certain posts as ADS. When you read webpages do you stop to read the Ads they have in the middle of the page. Heck no, you keep reading what you are attempting to read. So just see these posts as Ads in the middle of the page and skip on by. Once you just get your brain to accept its an Ad it's like those posts weren't even there.

That dog is beauitful!!

God Bless

Hi RoxiBalboa!   ::HelloKitty::

Thanks for the suggestion, good to see you!   

::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 14, 2012, 01:01:26 PM
Hello Monkeys!

Loooong time no post for me but I still read everyday. I would like to add to the recent conversation and tell you how I have coped with my frustration with certain postings. (IMOO, someone just loves drama, and when things slow down needs to start something).

Anyway, I think of certain posts as ADS. When you read webpages do you stop to read the Ads they have in the middle of the page. Heck no, you keep reading what you are attempting to read. So just see these posts as Ads in the middle of the page and skip on by. Once you just get your brain to accept its an Ad it's like those posts weren't even there.

That dog is beauitful!!

God Bless

RoxiB.....I am sitting here laughing and enjoying your thoughts on ads.

A friend wrote last night....one who has gone to lurking and finished with a cute
sentence...referring to SM....." I wish they'd put cushions in the rafters. gettin blisters on me bum".

TM....sorry I did not wish you a good night.  Thanks for your response.  There are nice
people in those rafters.  Now going to check on other threads.  Hugs.



 ::MonkeyHaHa::

No worries Mere, I've gotten out of the habit too. 

Hugs backatcha!   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 14, 2012, 04:55:56 PM
Not Aruba--but still a serious situation close to it.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/115245-rescue-curacao-from-the-power-of-organized-crime

Rescue Curaçao from the power of organized crime’       
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 11:33 
 ::snipping2::

I've been reading about this and also about a huge corruption case in Spain where some of the defendants have bank accounts in Curacao that the Prosecutor has been unsuccessful in getting the records of.  I started to post something about it the other night but got sidetracked.  I'd really like to research all the players in that one and see if I can find any connections...

IYKWIM   ::MonkeyWink::



Hey TM and good day all!

I feel sure that if anyone can find some connections, you can!  Now that is something I would be very interested to see.  As the banking rat's nest continues to come unraveled all around the world, I think we will see some familiar names shake out.

I know Aruba claims that tourism is their main industry, but we all know it's really money laundering, offshore secret banking, tax evasion and drug and human trafficking.   

::MonkeyCool::

The crooks may run out of places to hide their money. 

Hang tough, monkeys! The powers that were are falling like a house of cards, and the truth will come out one day.


I bet Judge Rick Smid's name pops up!

SMID, Rick  – Reportedly a friend of PVDS who stayed at VDS home.  Judge who released J2K in September 2005.  Dutch judge in Curacao.  As a public prosecutor in the NL, participated in the Carribean Financial Task Force as expert on money laundering.

 ::rhino::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Helen Back on June 14, 2012, 05:14:11 PM
Thanks, TM for the heads up on the Gurtel case in Spain.  Veeery interesting.  The judge in the case was prosecuted for "wiretapping" some of the defendants and their attorneys.   ::MonkeyEek::

I expect it won't be too long before the criminals start falling out of the bank mess.  I think it will be a lot like musical chairs.....when the music stops, the last one without a chair will start squawking.   ::MonkeyDevil::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 15, 2012, 12:22:52 AM


 ::lookie::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 15, 2012, 12:25:05 AM


 ::lookie::
I know -- but it's peaceful!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 12:43:12 AM


 ::lookie::
I know -- but it's peaceful!!!

Yes it is...



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 15, 2012, 12:48:06 AM


 ::lookie::
I know -- but it's peaceful!!!

Yes it is...





And my blood pressure hasn't risen a single time today. ::MonkeyCool::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 12:55:37 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/115514-verbod-op-thuis-slaan-van-kinderen-op-komst

Google translation:

Ban on smacking children coming home         

THURSDAY, JUNE 14, 2012 10:03

ORANGE CITY - Justice Minister Arthur Dowers (AVP) says that a ban on smacking children in the home. How fast this ban is coming, is not known. It is not clear whether this ban corporal punishment in general punishable. This is still not the case in Aruba, while our country has signed the Child that prohibits violence against children, including corporal punishment therefore.

Dowers announced the news after the meeting of the Human Rights Council of the United Nations (UN) in Geneva, Switzerland. He was a member of the Kingdom Delegation. "Aruba has a well-beaten figure," concludes the minister himself. Based on reporting by governments and the (critical) findings of non-governmental organizations, the human rights situation in the four countries of the Kingdom reviewed by the UN Human Rights Council. The High Commissioner for Human Rights (OHCHR) uses this information for a summary report of the human rights situation in each country. This is done periodically for all UN Member States and is intended to improve human rights.


A year ago the UN was still quite critical of the Kingdom, because there is still much to improve human rights. As an example, corporal punishment in Aruba said. The UN called the Kingdom even to do research into domestic violence and to work for a ban on corporal punishment in our home in Aruba. That seems to be so now, given the notice of Justice Minister Dowers.


Verbo d

NGOs call on Aruba for years the criminalization of violence against children. Especially after Aruba more than ten years ago and signed the CRC decided to enter. The UN Committee expressed several times (in 2004 and 2009 and also last year) its concern that corporal punishment is not an offense had been given. It is also to corporal punishment in general. So not only save parents by example, but also in schools. Minister Dowers says that the current legislative abuse of children and store in schools and institutions have already banned. "But store within a family is not prohibited. On the latter, we now introduce a ban. "

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 12:57:21 AM

And my blood pressure hasn't risen a single time today. ::MonkeyCool::


Mine either.   :smt052


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 15, 2012, 02:27:45 AM
carpe,

You are the most talented writer & voyeur
I always look forward to what you come up with next
and I sit at my desk and howl with laughter at the magical way
you bring sanity to this whole tragedy.

Keep up the good work man - you have an incredible mind and wit.

ribbit


::MonkeyCool::
Thanks so much, Kermit! Also - thanks Wreck & Jamcakes for the recent compliments.
I don't feel like I deserve it - but it is nice to be appreciated.  ::MonkeyAngel:: Again, thank you.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 15, 2012, 02:39:30 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/115514-verbod-op-thuis-slaan-van-kinderen-op-komst

Google translation:

Ban on smacking children coming home         

THURSDAY, JUNE 14, 2012 10:03

ORANGE CITY - Justice Minister Arthur Dowers (AVP) says that a ban on smacking children in the home. How fast this ban is coming, is not known. It is not clear whether this ban corporal punishment in general punishable. This is still not the case in Aruba, while our country has signed the Child that prohibits violence against children, including corporal punishment therefore.

Dowers announced the news after the meeting of the Human Rights Council of the United Nations (UN) in Geneva, Switzerland. He was a member of the Kingdom Delegation. "Aruba has a well-beaten figure," concludes the minister himself. Based on reporting by governments and the (critical) findings of non-governmental organizations, the human rights situation in the four countries of the Kingdom reviewed by the UN Human Rights Council. The High Commissioner for Human Rights (OHCHR) uses this information for a summary report of the human rights situation in each country. This is done periodically for all UN Member States and is intended to improve human rights.


A year ago the UN was still quite critical of the Kingdom, because there is still much to improve human rights. As an example, corporal punishment in Aruba said. The UN called the Kingdom even to do research into domestic violence and to work for a ban on corporal punishment in our home in Aruba. That seems to be so now, given the notice of Justice Minister Dowers.


Verbo d

NGOs call on Aruba for years the criminalization of violence against children. Especially after Aruba more than ten years ago and signed the CRC decided to enter. The UN Committee expressed several times (in 2004 and 2009 and also last year) its concern that corporal punishment is not an offense had been given. It is also to corporal punishment in general. So not only save parents by example, but also in schools. Minister Dowers says that the current legislative abuse of children and store in schools and institutions have already banned. "But store within a family is not prohibited. On the latter, we now introduce a ban. "

 ::snipping2::

This is the exact tripe that spawned the likes of Joran & the Kalpoes. Impotent parents with no controlled discipline in the home.
They say they want to outlaw violence --- but they also mean controlled discipline, like controlled spanking that doesn't cause permanent harm.

Joran turned into something straight out of Children of the Corn. Aruba says I want more of that, huh? ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 15, 2012, 03:23:14 AM
Anita's and Paulus's method of dealing with an unruly child - toss them out of the house to live in their own bachelor pad on the parent's property. Give them money to gamble and drink, and allow them free roam on a tropical island corrupted with drugs, prostitution and money laundering.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 15, 2012, 03:54:38 AM
Anita's and Paulus's method of dealing with an unruly child - toss them out of the house to live in their own bachelor pad on the parent's property. Give them money to gamble and drink, and allow them free roam on a tropical island corrupted with drugs, prostitution and money laundering.

Right Jamcakes - and then when these kids get into trouble and roam the world murdering innocent young women the parents express surprise, and denial that their child could be at fault, and blame the victims.

 ::MonkeyMad::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 15, 2012, 04:06:58 AM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::

Magnolia thank you for sharing Wreck's picture.  He is a handsome boy!

I remember the night those pups arrived and all the advice you received.  By the way I hope Hunter is also in good health.

 ::dogwag::

Tibro, did you mean Hudson?  He's the wonder dog, love him!   ::dogwag::

Oh dayum  .... I got Hudson's name wrong.  I knew it started with "H"   ::dogwag::

I do hope Magnolia will forgive me and also give Hudson an extra pat from me.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 15, 2012, 04:24:53 AM
Thanks, TM for the heads up on the Gurtel case in Spain.  Veeery interesting.  The judge in the case was prosecuted for "wiretapping" some of the defendants and their attorneys.   ::MonkeyEek::

I expect it won't be too long before the criminals start falling out of the bank mess.  I think it will be a lot like musical chairs.....when the music stops, the last one without a chair will start squawking.   ::MonkeyDevil::



This is something that interests me also.  The number of banking and financial head honchos that have resigned or taken early retirement or have been dismissed is enormous in the past few months.  Some have also died and in a couple of cases in mysterious circumstances.  Way too many in such a short time for it to be coincidental.

Even some of the Vatican finance officers have been implicated. No one is now above investigation and I am sure more will be named and shamed in the months to come.  Time for a massive clean up of a lot of our money moguls.

There are blog sites on the internet that name these high flyers according to country and most people would be amazed at how widespread it is.

I am sure Aruba is right in the midst of all those money grubbing countries that welcome and allow money laundering and internet gambling as a means to hide the real activities of these financial fat cats.



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 15, 2012, 09:23:28 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/15/massive-los-angeles-county-court-layoffs-set-to-begin/?test=latestnews (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/15/massive-los-angeles-county-court-layoffs-set-to-begin/?test=latestnews)

Massive Los Angeles County court layoffs set to begin

Published June 15, 2012

Squeezed by state budgets cutbacks, the Los Angeles County court system is launching massive job layoffs, pay cuts and transfers, court officials said Thursday.

Cutbacks that will be implemented Friday will affect 431 court employees and 56 courtrooms throughout the nation's largest superior court system.

Presiding Judge Lee Smalley Edmon bemoaned the loss of longtime employees as well as the impact on public services.

"We are laying off people who are committed to serving the public," she said. "It is a terrible loss both to these dedicated employees and to the public."

The union representing state and municipal employees called Friday's action a "freeze on justice in Los Angeles" and warned that the county would experience "an end to timely justice" with cases being delayed for years, particularly in civil courts.

 ::snipping2::

This could very well affect the Kalpoe vs. Dr. Phil case  ::MonkeyCool::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 04:29:31 PM
Wonder if the Vandersloot's attended this one too...

http://aruba-daily.com/newspaper/?p=19448

Oriella Mansur Celebrates her Quincenera 15-year old wows her guests with a wonderful show
Posted by Aruba Daily on June 14th, 2012

Oriella Mansur became a beautiful quicenera this past weekend, celebrating with many guests at the Westin grand ballroom.  The party was decorated around a spectacular candyland theme by designer Gareth Tromp. Oriella started the evening with a grand entrance with her father, with Angela, a violinist, performing a beautiful song which was a gift from her guitar teacher, Jose Gonzalez.  Later, the Princess Oriella danced with her father to a lovely waltz composed by her Aunt, Damilice Mansur.

 ::snipping2::

(http://aruba-daily.com/newspaper/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Oriella-Mansur-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 04:47:10 PM
http://aruba-daily.com/newspaper/?p=19448

June 15, 2012

(http://aruba-daily.com/newspaper/wp-content/gallery/front-page/page-01_2.jpg)

http://www.z24.nl/bedrijven/artikel_56865.z24/Aruba_onderzoekt_activiteiten_Stanford.html

Google translation:

Aruba investigates activities Stanford
Dutch play key role in empire billionaire
02.21.2009 | Posted 1:30 p.m.
02/22/2009 | Last update 0:01

Allen Stanford, the billionaire accused of fraud, was also active in Aruba. The Central Bank of Aruba Aruban has evidence that his abilities attracted small business without a license. The bank is investigating. According to research of Z24. Two Dutch also play key roles in Stanford's financial empire.

Fugitive businessman Stanford traced
Thursday billionaire Allen Stanford was handed a subpoena by the FBI. The U.S. regulator SEC suspects the Texan billionaire, one in America and the Caribbean well known entrepreneur and benefactor of fraud. He would have $ 8 billion (6.3 billion) in bonds not, but have invested in real estate. Investors were appeased with consistently high rates - which eventually were baseless.

The American authorities are now trying to unravel the network of Stanford. The empire includes a series of banks and consulting firms in the U.S., Central and South America. Banks in Panama and Venezuela have been brought under control by the authorities, after depositors en masse attempted to take their money.

It is still unclear what role each component played and who was aware of the actual fraud.

The fact is that Stanford also drew power from Aruba. He did so with the Stanford Group Aruba, controlled by the Belgian French-Dutch Finger Hoedt. The financial consulting firm that only a few employees, is not a lender and does not fall under the supervision of the Bank of Aruba (CBA).

That also means that no power of less than 100,000 florins (40,000 euros) may attract. The CBA, however, indications that the office does not comply with that provision has been taken, said main control P. Mungra against Z24.

"They know with high interest rates and amazing offers to tempt the people," said Mungra. "If it appears that the Stanford Group Aruba indeed amounts under 40,000 euros has attracted, we return to the OM. And then Mr. Finger Hoedt punishable as president."

The CBA has now opened an investigation.

Incidentally, the Aruban newspaper reported Friday that the pension fund Mainta Awe of the tourism industry in Aruba a significant amount inlaid at Stanford component.

Management Functions
French Finger Hoedt is demonstrated for many years in executive positions for Allen Stanford to work. Like another Dutchman, Harry van Bergen.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 15, 2012, 05:30:12 PM
IIRC, the Caribbean Financial Task force on money laundering that Judge Rick Smid took part in, had a lengthy section on money laundering through real estate. I'm looking for my copy of the task force report, but I think it's in my defunct desk top computer.  Anybody have that report saved?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 15, 2012, 10:04:25 PM
Posted by Resigned at RU.  What I like about Resigned is that he was able to change his mind about Joran and what he was capable of. 

Quote
Post by resigned » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:17 am
Joran van der Sloot's days of making deals is history. Birmingham will await him to make certain he never justs walk out of that Peruvian prison gate a free man in any lesser amount of time than his sentence for murdering Stephany Flores.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 15, 2012, 11:07:54 PM
Posted by Resigned at RU.  What I like about Resigned is that he was able to change his mind about Joran and what he was capable of. 

Quote
Post by resigned » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:17 am
Joran van der Sloot's days of making deals is history. Birmingham will await him to make certain he never justs walk out of that Peruvian prison gate a free man in any lesser amount of time than his sentence for murdering Stephany Flores.

Yes I agree, I also like that he has stuck it out at RU and dishes it right back to those that were too drunk thickheaded stubborn, too close to the Sloots (or both) to do the same.

 ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 16, 2012, 12:31:47 AM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::

Magnolia thank you for sharing Wreck's picture.  He is a handsome boy!

I remember the night those pups arrived and all the advice you received.  By the way I hope Hunter is also in good health.

 ::dogwag::

Tibro, did you mean Hudson?  He's the wonder dog, love him!   ::dogwag::

Oh dayum  .... I got Hudson's name wrong.  I knew it started with "H"   ::dogwag::

I do hope Magnolia will forgive me and also give Hudson an extra pat from me.


Shoot, Tibro....Hudson doesn't care what you call him as long as you call him for dinner.
 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 16, 2012, 12:34:54 AM
Posted by Resigned at RU.  What I like about Resigned is that he was able to change his mind about Joran and what he was capable of. 

Quote
Post by resigned » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:17 am
Joran van der Sloot's days of making deals is history. Birmingham will await him to make certain he never justs walk out of that Peruvian prison gate a free man in any lesser amount of time than his sentence for murdering Stephany Flores.

Yes I agree, I also like that he has stuck it out at RU and dishes it right back to those that were too drunk thickheaded stubborn, too close to the Sloots (or both) to do the same.

 ::MonkeyWink::

I am foolish about Resigned and he/she is so smart. IMO Outwits them all.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 16, 2012, 12:41:25 AM
Refresh my memory -- who started RU?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 16, 2012, 12:59:25 AM
Refresh my memory -- who started RU?

Refugees Unleashed was originally CeeTV Refugees as it was started in late 2005 by JOY and some others after being banned by Court TV message boards.  Then it started to be a refugee place for anyone banned from anywhere including from SM and Websleuths.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 16, 2012, 01:22:09 AM
Refresh my memory -- who started RU?

Refugees Unleashed was originally CeeTV Refugees as it was started in late 2005 by JOY and some others after being banned by Court TV message boards.  Then it started to be a refugee place for anyone banned from anywhere including from SM and Websleuths.   ::MonkeyCool::
Thanks! That rings a bell!


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 01:59:17 AM
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=3777819316638&set=a.1580927515716.85522.1011539209&type=1&permPage=1

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Aruba%20Misc/06082012_Mansurs1.jpg)

Oriella Juliette Mansur
Two of the greatest men on Earth! :) — with Jossy Mansur and Jossy E Mansur.
Share · June 8


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 02:00:26 AM
Jossy doesn't look well...   :sad:


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 04:03:26 AM
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Natalee/Natalee_2005.jpg)


Justice for Natalee!  

 ::justice2NJ::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 16, 2012, 04:33:41 AM
Jossy doesn't look well...   :sad:

I thought the same thing......  ::MonkeyShocked::

I sure hope his health improves!  Jossy was such a boon to NAH's family. What a dear, dear man.

His granddaughter is beautiful.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 16, 2012, 09:24:54 AM
Beautiful picture of the three of them.  Appreciation and blessings to Jossy -- he really was a great comfort to all of us here at Scared Monkeys longing for truth, solutions, and answers.    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 16, 2012, 10:07:11 AM
Boy Jossy doesn't look good, he's lost so much weight.  Odd he's wearing a hat as well.  Sad.

October 2005

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_kNWmfKARQ_I/STh9Zmh3q0I/AAAAAAAADGk/IDw2gzOQSws/s400/jossy.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 12:07:52 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8341.msg1223604#msg1223604

http://www.diario.aw/2010/09/un-anochi-di-elegancia-pa-oriana-su-15-ana/

From Oriana Mansur's Quincenera at the end of August 2010

(http://www.diario.aw/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/oriana-mansur2.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 12:18:39 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=6341.0
Edit to add additional link per TexasMom.  MB  http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/2008/02/13/monkeys-media-reminder-beth-holloway-peter-r-devries-on-dana-pretzer-show-on-scared-monkeys-radio/

DANA PRETZER SHOW FEB 13, 2008 WITH BETH HOLLOWAY, PETER R. DEVRIES, AND MORE!

 ::snipping2::

Dana:  I’m going to throw out some names to you and I know you’ve done this line of questioning before from other show hosts but I’m curious to see what you have to say.  When I mention the name Jossy Mansur...

Beth:  Oh absolutely heroic, what a man, what a father, what a husband he is too... I mean my goodness.  What a business man he is...integrity.  And you know I will stand by Jossy because this is an individual that stepped forward for me, for human rights, and for justice.  And gosh what he did for me was he took such a burden off of me during the month of July of 05 when I felt as if I was kind of out there on the forefront by myself going against these perpetrators until Jossy Mansur stepped forward I felt like I had no other ally.  So you know he did the most amazing thing, and he went out on a limb and he you know for no reason other than doing the right thing and as I said being about professionalism, integrity, and respect for others human rights so absolutely what an amazing man.  

 ::snipping2::

Dana: Absolutely, I figured you would just use the word corrupt.  You know when you look at the media coverage of the story and you see that 99.999 percent of those that watch listen and read about this story care and want to see the answers, want to see your family get the justice that you all deserve.  Your take on how the media have handled all of this Beth.

Beth:  Well I think it’s been remarkable.  And I have gosh as I said you know my only allies in Aruba were the media and Jossy Mansur.  So I think they rank very high.  I mean and what a remarkable resource for parents or families to be able to mobilize when they’re faced with a crisis whether it’s a missing or murdered loved one they can be very powerful and they were just a great ally to me on the island of Aruba so I’m very grateful for them.  They were always very respectful too.

 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 12:24:36 PM
Sorry, meant to add this link too!   :oops: Added it.  MB

Additional link for Dana's show that I posted from a transcript of above:

http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/2008/02/13/monkeys-media-reminder-beth-holloway-peter-r-devries-on-dana-pretzer-show-on-scared-monkeys-radio/


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 12:41:15 PM
I agree jamcakes and Ono!   ::MonkeyCool::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 12:41:45 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2010/06/03/sm-exclusive-jossy-mansur-of-diario-aruba-comments-on-joran-van-der-sloot-murder-allegations-suspect-in-death-of-stephany-flores-ramireznatalee-holloway/

Jossy Mansur of Diario Aruba Comments on Joran Van der Sloot Murder Allegations & Suspect in Death of Stephany Flores Ramirez/Natalee Holloway

If the media wanted to get factual comments from Aruba media and not state run spin, they need not have contacted Aruba Today and Julia Renfro … what they should have done is contacted Jossy Mansur of Diario Aruba for the answers as Scared Monkeys did.

The following is Jossy Mansur in his own words regarding the bizarre similarities of the two murders that Joran Van der Sloot has been accused of, Natalee Holloway in Aruba and Stephany  Flores Ramirez in Peru.

“The story came as a shock, not because it was unexpected, but because another girl became the victim of this very sick young man. His actions are clearly those of a psychopath. He should be taken off the streets so he cannot cause any more pain to other families, including his own. The thought that comes into my mind is that if the Prosecution in Aruba had pressed charges against him and he was taken to court and sent to jail, this other girl might still be alive. There are consequences to actions (or lack of them) that speak louder than any amount of words.

The coincidences are also mind-boggling: during a poker tournament, he meets a girl in a casino, like he did Natalee; the girl appears dead in a room that he rented in an upscale hotel; he is seen with the girl at the hotel by the personnel present; the girl appears dead two or three days later, on the 29th of May going into the 30th of May, exactly on the same date and possibly hour that Natalee was killed. And on the fifth anniversary of Natalee’s death! It is practically unbelievable!” (Jossy Mansur)


 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 16, 2012, 01:29:37 PM
I would love to see a current pic of Joran to see how he looks after just 5 months in a Peruvian hell hole prison without all the perks.  I bet he still cries into his pillow every night.

 ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil:: ::MonkeyDevil::

Don't you just know he had the jail house pallor. ::boxingjoran::


Look closely at that little photo in Jamcakes signature and he already looks that way!  Pallor and seems to have aged tremendously and badly.  At the risk of repeating myself too often, there is no way to make living in that place tolerable for someone who has lived such a life of privilege as Joran.

Now he is in the more remote one where goods and services are going to be more expensive and rare.  And I do believe that if he should be going to walk before Sr Flores is ready for him to, Flores would/could exercise all his options should that be the route he might chose to take.

I want what the families want.  When they feel justice, I feel justice.  I do not think I have the same rights as they in this regard.  When Beth says Midnight Express and Joran gets it, that's good enough for me.  Joran is very young and stupid.  I think as Christians both Beth and Dave (who has said so) would rather he seek God than get revenge on him if only he start by telling the truth.  And to someone that young (yes, I can remember even back that long ago) even a year can seem like eternity.  Time only flies for those of us on up in our years. 

But everything from here on out is a bonus as far as I am concerned because Joran is on his own Midnight Express and one I hope takes him right into federal court in Birmingham.  I agree with Ono that he finds it particularly disturbing that it is Alabama where his trial will be held.  But one of these days, Joran will realize he is not immortal and not getting any younger and that some day he will meet his Maker.  His own love of himself may at some point entice him to do the right thing.  I won't ever lose total hope of that.  Maybe then he might even decide to tell the truth at long last, who knows!

Good to see all the monkeys who have been here of late. 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 07:19:09 PM
They should have taken her to the hospital to make sure she was o.k. and hadn't been given a date rape drug or something!

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

http://www.awe24.com/20120616/11031/Polis_a_topa_cu_dama_completamente_sunu_benta_abao_banda_di_stadion

Papiamentu translation:

police owing to come across cu lady completamente sunu throw abao near of stadion, probably viola!

12 hora happen come across, 16 of june 2012 06:32

saturday morning early agentenan attentive during they patrol owing to notice one lady completamente sunu throw abao near of compleho deportivo guillermo prospero trinidad, at once they owing to bay atende cu the lady cu was enberdad completamente sunu all at sand blanco y his cloths throw one near. police owing to try talk cu lady but this was completamente bao influencia of alcohol y/of drugs. police owing to try saca afo where the live but at the adresnan ey the not was cuadra. not owing to stay nothing another cu hibe at keep of police for so one visiteuse succeed saca afo that the is hour listra in his pertenencianan or hour the recobra his tino y come bij corda that the is, where the was y cu that the was. mirando the estado of his mind y curpa y the cantidad of sand blanco stick at his curpa probably the will can is one victima of violacion sexual.

(http://ba2.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/11031/8_1339849880.jpg)

(http://ba1.sim-img.net/awe24_archive/11031/3_1339849877.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 07:37:15 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba?start=20

Google translation:

Giordano wants 3.5 million deaths Gardner

FRIDAY, JUNE 15, 2012 9:01

ORANGE CITY - Gary Giordano wants $ 3.5 million of insurance company American Express because of the death of Robyn Gardner. U.S. media reports that at least. Gardner disappeared last year while on holiday with Giordano on our island. From the U.S. was no trace found, despite extensive searches and media attention. Justice assumes that they are no longer alive and Giordano suspected of involvement. Partly because he was only two days after her disappearance ...
Read more ...


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 16, 2012, 07:44:04 PM
Gary Giordano - another slime ball with the morals of an alley cat.  I wonder if he's a distant relative of the vdS's.

 ::MonkeyMad::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 07:46:52 PM
Thanks for adding the link MuffyBee!   ::MonkeyKiss:: ::bee::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 16, 2012, 07:49:24 PM
Gary Giordano - another slime ball with the morals of an alley cat.  I wonder if he's a distant relative of the vdS's.

 ::MonkeyMad::

I think he's just a slime ball that admired what Joran and others have gotten away with in Aruba.  I'm afraid there are probably many more.

 ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyMad::

jmo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 16, 2012, 09:06:28 PM
I hope that slime ball never gets his nasty hands on any of that insurance money on Robyn.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: San on June 16, 2012, 10:02:32 PM
Jossy doesn't look well...   :sad:

He looks very sick.  Not good at all.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 16, 2012, 11:08:15 PM
IIRC, the Caribbean Financial Task force on money laundering that Judge Rick Smid took part in, had a lengthy section on money laundering through real estate. I'm looking for my copy of the task force report, but I think it's in my defunct desk top computer.  Anybody have that report saved?


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

Mr. Smid noted that Casinos are attractive to money launderers for a variety of reasons. One reason that Casinos are attractive to money launderers is because they offer a broad range of financial services including the issuing of credit, transfers of money into and out of bank accounts, currency exchanges services, issuance of checks and the acceptance of deposits.

be paid out in the form of a check or transferred to a bank account. While large deposits or withdrawals may cause unwanted attention, this may not be the case if such deposits or withdrawals are structured into smaller amounts. Money Launderers can also utilise Casinos to legitimise large amounts of proceeds by claiming they are gambling earnings.
www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 16, 2012, 11:09:10 PM
Kermit, rjdeer and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

 ::MonkeyFootball::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 16, 2012, 11:12:55 PM

REMEMBER..........

In Aruba, our Caribbean Mercantile Bank collected NAF 12 million in exchange tax,
which it pays to the Central Bank of Aruba for the Aruba government

http://www.mcb-bank.com/extra_pages/AnnualReport2005.pdf
page 16/50



THIS IS HOW IT WORKS

Paulus went to the Caribbean Mercantile Bank on Monday two times, deposited
money the second time that it is still unexplained where it came from
Paulus has MONEY and he needs to get rid of it - OFF TO THE BANK TO
GET IT LAUNDERED!

Once that money is deposited, it will go undetected as
it makes its way into the next hand -

maybe Mary Mary Quite Aruban, who needs
to have change for her daily T-shirt business to the Tourists down by the dock
when the ship rolls in.

Then Mister and Mrs. from the USA taking a Caribbean cruise for the
first time in their lives buys a T-shirt that says I love Aruba and they go to dine at
Carlos n' Charlies for lunch and head back to the ship by sunset and take pictures to upload to Webshots
and now they have dirty laundered cash in their hands. When they reach the next
morning's port, they go to the exchange booth (easy enough to find,( I know I have done this while traveling in in Luxembourg etc) and Mister hands over the dirty money that Paulus deposited
at CMB bank the morning before and that money is now in the hands of the  exchange bank booth.

See how easy it is. And if you are looking at 72 million visitors to Aruba, then you got a lot of washing routes to follow.






Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 16, 2012, 11:33:50 PM
Gürtel case


The judges have lamented that one European country is not collaborating with another as the Netherlands Antilles is refusing to do. They note the Antilles may be an off-shore tax haven,
http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_34912.shtml






Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 12:26:36 AM
IIRC, the Caribbean Financial Task force on money laundering that Judge Rick Smid took part in, had a lengthy section on money laundering through real estate. I'm looking for my copy of the task force report, but I think it's in my defunct desk top computer.  Anybody have that report saved?


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

Mr. Smid noted that Casinos are attractive to money launderers for a variety of reasons. One reason that Casinos are attractive to money launderers is because they offer a broad range of financial services including the issuing of credit, transfers of money into and out of bank accounts, currency exchanges services, issuance of checks and the acceptance of deposits.

be paid out in the form of a check or transferred to a bank account. While large deposits or withdrawals may cause unwanted attention, this may not be the case if such deposits or withdrawals are structured into smaller amounts. Money Launderers can also utilise Casinos to legitimise large amounts of proceeds by claiming they are gambling earnings.
www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf


Thanks, Kermit, that's the report!  Unfortunately, the link doesn't take me to the full report.  I can get to the website, but not to the report with the typology exercises.

Anybody have the full report saved?


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 12:35:13 AM
I still believe that Judge Rick Smid was anything but honorable.  He knew extensively the ins and outs of money laundering in the Caribbean having been the NL expert on it.  And Paulus was his good buddy.  When I put 2 and 2 together, I come up with dirty math.

 ::MonkeyMad::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 17, 2012, 12:52:36 AM
IIRC, the Caribbean Financial Task force on money laundering that Judge Rick Smid took part in, had a lengthy section on money laundering through real estate. I'm looking for my copy of the task force report, but I think it's in my defunct desk top computer.  Anybody have that report saved?


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

Mr. Smid noted that Casinos are attractive to money launderers for a variety of reasons. One reason that Casinos are attractive to money launderers is because they offer a broad range of financial services including the issuing of credit, transfers of money into and out of bank accounts, currency exchanges services, issuance of checks and the acceptance of deposits.

be paid out in the form of a check or transferred to a bank account. While large deposits or withdrawals may cause unwanted attention, this may not be the case if such deposits or withdrawals are structured into smaller amounts. Money Launderers can also utilise Casinos to legitimise large amounts of proceeds by claiming they are gambling earnings.
www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf


Thanks, Kermit, that's the report!  Unfortunately, the link doesn't take me to the full report.  I can get to the website, but not to the report with the typology exercises.

Anybody have the full report saved?

I get the 404 message which to me means that some sites are being deleted or edited on the internet.   Not surprising with all the investigations going on behind the scenes into the financial world.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 17, 2012, 12:55:25 AM
Sorry for the O/T  ::MonkeyDevil::

Not really O/T.  They were born here in this thread. ::MonkeyJnBox::

Magnolia thank you for sharing Wreck's picture.  He is a handsome boy!

I remember the night those pups arrived and all the advice you received.  By the way I hope Hunter is also in good health.

 ::dogwag::

Tibro, did you mean Hudson?  He's the wonder dog, love him!   ::dogwag::

Oh dayum  .... I got Hudson's name wrong.  I knew it started with "H"   ::dogwag::

I do hope Magnolia will forgive me and also give Hudson an extra pat from me.


Shoot, Tibro....Hudson doesn't care what you call him as long as you call him for dinner.
 ::MonkeyCool::


 lol Magnolia - Hudson and his "Mom" are welcome to dinner any time.

And thank you TexasMom for setting me straight.

 ::CowboySmiley::




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tibrogargan on June 17, 2012, 01:11:31 AM
Jossy doesn't look well...   :sad:


How sad to see Jossy looking so ill and frail.

He must have have bitter sweet thoughts at his grand-daughter's quinceanera celebrations and remembering all he went through to try to find answers about Natalee.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 17, 2012, 02:34:27 AM
Jossy doesn't look well...   :sad:


How sad to see Jossy looking so ill and frail.

He must have have bitter sweet thoughts at his grand-daughter's quinceanera celebrations and remembering all he went through to try to find answers about Natalee.

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Aruba%20Misc/06082012_Mansurs1.jpg)

I know what you guys are saying. Father Time is a merciless pain in the booty. It looks like his illness has caused hair loss and he is trying to hide it.  ...but old man Joss sure looks good to me. I respect the man for refusing to be a coward and speaking out.

What a beautiful granddaughter he has --- pretty as a flower. Jossy is a very blessed and decent man. I am happy when I get to see him, no matter the condition. ::MonkeyDance:: Keep on keepin' on, Jossy! ::MonkeyAngel::



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 17, 2012, 03:30:05 AM
Jossy is a hero, even though you'll never get him to admit it.

He did the right thing because it was the right thing to do.

It didn't win him a popularity contest in Aruba, either.

... but to this day, he still stands on his own to feet. (head held high - shoulders back)

He very well could die from standing on his own two feet, someday.

However, Paulus lived a life on his knees, and quite possibly, on all fours with his bum inclined - if the stories are true. (They are)

It's very hard to collapse from your knees. Most people collapse to their knees!

So, Paulus, like so many times in life --- just like in death.

You fell short, because you were a knock-kneed, sniveling, groveling, impotent, MORALLY BANKRUPT punk.

How did that court taste, Paulus? :smt016

 ::justice2NJ::

Jossy - STILL STANDING.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 03:40:32 AM
What is the full or first name of the Wever woman who died and was buried close to the time Natalee went missing?

I looked on the Aruban Who's Who thread, but for some reason the alphabetical listings stopped with "s".   ::MonkeyWaa::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: carpe noctem on June 17, 2012, 03:47:13 AM
What is the full or first name of the Wever woman who died and was buried close to the time Natalee went missing?

I looked on the Aruban Who's Who thread, but for some reason the alphabetical listings stopped with "s".   ::MonkeyWaa::

JALITZA WEVER #05-137


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 08:19:12 AM
Joran, I hope you rot in prison for the rest of your miserable life, for what you did to Natalee's and Stephany's fathers.

Happy Father's Day to Dave Holloway and Ricardo Flores - may the special memories of your beautiful daughters sustain you today and everyday.

 ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran:: ::boxingjoran::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 08:22:16 AM
What is the full or first name of the Wever woman who died and was buried close to the time Natalee went missing?

I looked on the Aruban Who's Who thread, but for some reason the alphabetical listings stopped with "s".   ::MonkeyWaa::

JALITZA WEVER #05-137

Thank you, Carpe.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 17, 2012, 12:58:45 PM
http://www.rtl.nl/components/actueel/rtlnieuws/2012/06_juni/17/buitenland/vs_heeft_eigen_joran_iers_meisje_vermoord_in_japan.xml

Google translation

RTL News | June 17, 2012, 08:28
U.S. now has its own Joran

An American teenager in Japan suspected of the murder of an Irish girl in a hotel room. The case shows similarities with that of Joran van der Sloot, the Dutchman who murdered a girl in Peru, including a hotel room.

The intention was that the 19-year-old musician Richard Hinds in Memphis on June 20 after performances in Japan would go back to the U.S.. But it came not. He was arrested for the murder of 21-year old Irish student Nicola Furlong, in her hotel room in Shinjuku.

Strangled to death after night out
Furlong on May 24, strangled in the Keio Plaza Hotel after a night out with friends. According to police, she was found by a maid that had gone off screaming. Besides the body of the girl was Richard Hinds. According to ABC News, he has known, but "he did not kill her."

Provisionally in the cell
The probability that he is acquitted is small. "In Japan, 99.9 percent of defendants convicted," says a lawyer from ABC News. "So if you get arrested for such serious offenses, you are normally solid year." In Japan, the death penalty, but it is unlikely that gets Hinds. Normally you have more murders.

Nicola Furlong graduated in Takasaki, about 90 kilometers northwest of Tokyo. Her alleged killer is a well known musician in Memphis. He was in Japan as a background dancer in a Japanese R & B artist.
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 17, 2012, 01:03:01 PM
http://www.spitsnieuws.nl/archives/raar/2012/06/amerikaanse-joran-copycat-in-japan

Google translation

American Joran copycat in Japan?
R. Fox | 06/12/17 | 9:59

The American teenager Richard Hinds is suspected of the murder of an Irish girl in a hotel in Shinjuku. The 19-year-old musician from Memphis, was arrested for the murder of Nicola Furlong (21), an Irish student. The case bears some resemblance to the murder of Stefany Flores in Peru by Dutchman Joran van der Sloot. 
 ::snipping2::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 17, 2012, 01:28:51 PM
jamcakes this is the entire article that I originally copied, but I see it is no longer on line.


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997

The Nature and Extent of Money Laundering in the Casino and Gaming Industry Hon. Tennyson R.G. Wells, AG and Minister of Justice-The Bahamas
Mr. Rick Smid, National Public Prosecutor-Netherlands

Mr. Smid noted that Casinos are attractive to money launderers for a variety of reasons. One reason that Casinos are attractive to money launderers is because they offer a broad range of financial services including the issuing of credit, transfers of money into and out of bank accounts, currency exchanges services, issuance of checks and the acceptance of deposits.

be paid out in the form of a check or transferred to a bank account. While large deposits or withdrawals may cause unwanted attention, this may not be the case if such deposits or withdrawals are structured into smaller amounts. Money Launderers can also utilise Casinos to legitimise large amounts of proceeds by claiming they are gambling earnings. It is also possible that regulations can be relaxed for important customers; indeed casino employees may even be tempted into assisting customers deposit their funds without notice. Furthermore if a casino company operates gaming establishments in several jurisdictions, it can transfer funds among this establishment to obscure the origins of the funds and thereby assist in the layering of illicit proceeds. Furthermore, under certain circumstances customers can play anonymously in Casinos. In analysing the money laundering risks to the Casino industry, Mr. Smid suggested that a schematic by applied with two scenarios, one in which the casino management is involved and the other where the management is not involved. According to Mr. Smid, large scale money laundering is only possible if the casino management/ownership is involved. It is therefore vital that the ultimate beneficial ownership of the casino be established and to check on the integrity of the management of the casino and its staff. and this however is not often easy. Even when management is not involved in money laundering in casinos, problems can occur. In reviewing preventive measures, Mr Smid commented that in the Netherlands casinos are obligated to report unusual transactions and that these reports are both of a repressive and a preventative nature. Preventative measures include determining the ultimate beneficiary ownership of casinos, insuring the integrity of the management, efficient and effective internal administrative procedures, customer identification procedures, and unusual or suspicious transactions reporting requirements. Mr. Smid continued by delineating several examples of money laundering through casinos in the Netherlands. Mr. Smid described a situation where a customer approached a bank with a large amount of cash to deposit claiming the source of the cash to be casino winnings. These statements are difficult to verify, in the Netherlands there is, however, a reporting requirement for these types of unusual transactions as well as a requirement for customer identification. Mr Smid reiterated the difficulty for law enforcement and other authorities to determine beneficial ownership of some casinos when there is a link to bank secrecy jurisdictions. Indicators for unusual transactions reporting for Casino 4 objective and two subject indicators. The objective indicators for reporting are cash deposits of over 25,000 Dutch Guilders, wire transactions of over 25,000 Dutch Guilders, Selling of chips for cheques or foreign currency in excess of 25,000 Dutch Guilders. Subjective indicators incorporated other transactions which appear to be related to money laundering and structuring below the 25,000 Dutch Guilders. Mr Smid then presented a summary analysis of disclosures from received from Jan 1995- Nov. 96, 1861 Unusual Transactions by 336 persons 50% were Dutch nationality. 95% were cash transactions 192 by 54 persons were referred to Pub Prosecutors as Suspicious and 80% of these were cash transactions.

www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 17, 2012, 01:32:40 PM
jamecakes, this is another article I found a long time ago and it may not be available anymore either. It's rather lengthy




This is very interesting.

JUDGE SMID (the Judge who let the suspects free) is part of this
group: the National Colalition for Drug Policy change


   Help Support Erowid with a $10 Paypal Donation


From: Jim Rosenfield
Newsgroups: talk.politics.drugs
Date: 18 Feb 94 19:53 PST
Subject: Signers of the "Hoover Resolution"
Message-ID: <1484000476@cdp>

National Coalition for Drug Policy
Change

Resolution for a Federal Commission on Drug
Policy

January 8, 1994



Table of Contents


Resolution   1
Introduction   2
Public Officials   3
Organizations   6
Medical Profession   8
Law Enforcement and Social Services   14
Media and Entertainment   18
Members of the Clergy   19
Legal Profession   21
Educators   23
Business   29


Note:  The list of concerned citizens / taxpayers who have signed the
Resolution is not included in this list.  The list of concerned
citizens / taxpayers numbers in the thousands.




Resolution



   Whereas, the overall situation regarding the use of
drugs in our society and the crime and misery that
accompanies it has continued to deteriorate for  several
decades; and
   
   Whereas, our society has continued to attempt, at
enormous financial cost, and loss of civil liberties, to
resolve drug abuse problems through the criminal justice
system, with the accompanying increases of prisons and
numbers of inmates; and

   Whereas, the huge untaxed revenues generated by the
illicit drug trade are undermining legitimate governments
world-wide; and

   Whereas, the present system has spawned a cycle of
hostility by the incarceration of  disproportionate numbers
of African-Americans, Hispanics, and other minority groups;
and

   Whereas, the number of people who have contracted AIDS,
hepatitis, and other diseases from contaminated hypodermic
needles is epidemic under our present system; and

   Whereas, in our society's zeal to pursue our criminal
approach, legitimate medical uses for the relief of pain and
suffering of patients have been suppressed.

   Therefore be it resolved that our society must recognize
drug use and abuse as the medical and social problems that
they are and that they must be treated with medical and
social solutions; and

   Further be it resolved that an objective commission be
immediately empowered by the President and by Congress to
recommend revision of the drug laws of these United States
in order to reduce the harm our current policies are
causing.




Introduction

   On February 26, 1993 a group of concerned citizens met at the
Hoover Institution on the campus of Stanford University and
unanimously passed a resolution which recommends that our country
investigate the possibility of change in the way we handle our drug
problem. The Resolution, which recommends that these medical and
social problems be treated with medical and social solutions, is
attached hereto.   It further recommends that one final blue ribbon
commission be immediately empowered by the President to recommend
revisions of the drug laws of these United States to reduce the harm
caused by this drug problem.  The original signers of the Resolution,
who are known as the National Coalition for Drug Policy Change, are
as follows:

Dr. Milton Friedman
Nobel laureate; Professor Emeritus of
Economics, University of Chicago; Senior
Research Fellow, Hoover Institution,
Stanford, CA

Dr. Joseph D. McNamara
Former Police Chief of San Jose; Fellow,
Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Herbert Berger, M.D.
F.A.C.P.;  F.C.C.P.; Internationally
recognized authority on drug treatment,
Staten Island, NY

Judge James P. Gray
Orange County Superior Court, Santa Ana,
CA

Katherine H. Smith
Founder, Group Resolving Anti-Social
Problems (GRASP), Anaheim, CA

S. Clarke Smith, M.D.
F.A.A.F.P.; Board of Directors,
California Academy of Family Physicians,
Anaheim, CA

Clifford A. Schaffer
Author; Computer Consultant, Canyon
Country, CA

Frederick H. Meyers, M.D.
Professor of Pharmacology, University of
California at San Francisco; Chairman of
the California Research Advisory Panel on
Drugs

Harvey L. Rose, M.D.
Author of California's "Intractable Pain
Treatment Act"; Family Practice,
Carmichael, CA

John J. McCarthy, M.D.,
A.B.P.N.
Psychiatrist, Executive Director, Bi-
Valley Medical Clinic, Sacramento, CA

Gary Davis, M.D.
Diplomate in Psychiatry, A.B.P.N.,
American Board of Psychiatry & Neurology,
Citrus Heights, CA

Benson B. Roe, M.D.
Professor and Chief Emeritus of
Cardiothoracic Surgery, University of
California at San Francisco, CA

Stephen A. Fisher, M.D.,
Diplomate in Psychiatry, A.B.P.N.,
American Board of Psychiatry & Neurology,
Berkeley, CA

Reverend Leonard B.
Jackson
First A.M.E. Church of Los Angeles, CA

Reverend J. D. Moore
First A.M.E. Church of Los Angeles, CA

Donald McNamara
Investment Consultant, New York, NY

Richard Arthur
Educator; Former Principal of Castlemont
High School, Oakland, CA;  Author of
Gangs and Schools, Richmond, CA

Richard "Gibb" Martin
Owner, Marbros Construction Co., Garden
Grove, CA

Howard Lavine
Office of the Mayor, Baltimore, MD

*Kurt L . Schmoke
Mayor, City of Baltimore, Maryland

*George Shultz
Former Secretary of State; Fellow, Hoover
Institution, Stanford, CA

*Unable to attend due to prior commitments



   Since that February 26 meeting the Resolution has been signed by
large numbers of people around the country.  A list of those people
who signed the Resolution before August 4, 1993 was hand delivered in
Washington, DC, to Dr. Lee P. Brown, who is President Clintons Drug
Policy Director (Drug Czar)
, on August 4, 1993.  Those who signed
the Resolution after August 4 are listed in the document below the
row of asterisks, and a list of these signers was hand delivered in
Washington, DC to Ms. Kristine Gebbie, RN, who is President Clintons
AIDS Policy Director (AIDS Czar) on November 19, 1993.  The list of
signers is as follows:

Public Officials

Frank Jordan
Mayor, City of San Francisco, CA

Susan Hammer
Mayor, City of San Jose, CA

Elihu Harris
Mayor, City of Oakland, CA

Robert R. Nolan
Mayor, City of Upland, CA

Assemblyman John
Vasconcellos
Chairman, Committee on Ways and Means,
California State Assembly

Senator Rebecca Q. Morgan
California State Senate

Representative Greg R.
Buckwalter
M.P.H., Hawaii House of Representatives

Senator Joseph Galiber
New York State Senate

Marc Martin
Fire Chief, Fullerton Fire Department,
Fullerton, CA

Arlo Smith Esq.
District Attorney, San Francisco, CA

Harriett M. Wieder
County Supervisor, County of Orange, CA

Emma Bonino
Deputy Speaker, Italian Chamber of
Deputies; Secretary, Radical Trans-
National Party, Rome, Italy

Judge Whitman Knapp
Senior U.S. District Judge, Southern
District of New York

Judge James C. Paine
U.S. District Court, Southern District of
Florida

Justice Charles W.
Froehlich, Jr.
California Court of Appeal, Fourth
Appellate District

Justice William A. Newsom
California Court of Appeal, First
Appellate District

Judge Vaughn R. Walker
U.S. District Court, Northern District of
California

Judge Robert W. Sweet
U.S. District Court, Southern District of
New York

Judge James L. Smith
Orange County Superior Court, Santa Ana,
CA

Magistrate Judge Ronald
R. Rose
U.S. District Court, Central District of
California

Judge Lawrence Storch
Superior Court, County of Ventura, CA

Judge Leighton Hatch
(Retired)
Municipal Court, County of Sacramento, CA

Judge Bert L. Swift
Municipal Court, County of San
Bernardino, CA

Judge Reid M. Spencer
General District Court, Norfolk, VA

Judge Russel A. Bostrom
(Retired)
Municipal Court, County of Orange County,
CA

Judge Steve Fleck
(Retired)
Director, Kiwanis Club of Capistrano
Valley, CA

Alan H. Dodds
Foreign Service Officer (Retired), U.S.
Department of State

James J. Gormley
Foreign Service Officer (Retired), U.S.
Department of State

Jim Toledano
Former Regent, University of California

J. Tilman Williams
Councilman (Retired), Garden Grove, CA

Daniel H. Ninburg, M.D.
Commissioner, Orange County Human
Relations Commission, Orange County, CA

Mike A. Nisperos, Jr.,
Esq.
Director, Mayor's Office of Drugs and
Crime, Oakland, CA

Ellen Lorman
Deputy City Attorney, Children and Family
Services, San Francisco, CA

*********************************************************************
*******************
Senator Marian Bergeson
California State Senate

Thomas F. Riley
Orange County Board of Supervisors,
Orange County, CA

Senator Robert Presley
California State Senate

Assemblyman Bill Morrow
73rd Assembly District, CA

Anne Rudin
Former Mayor, 1981-1993, Sacramento, CA

Donald M. Fraser
Mayor, Minneapolis, MN

Illa Collin
Sacramento County Supervisor, Sacramento,
CA

Senator Enrique Gomez
Colombian Senate, Bogota, Colombia

William Von Raab*
Former Commissioner of Customs under
Presidents Reagan and Bush, Orange, VA

Dr.  Cynthia P. Coad
Trustee, North Orange County Community
College District, Orange County, CA

Harriet S. Walther
Vice-President, Saddleback Community
College District, Mission Viejo, CA

Judge Robert P. McDonald
Municipal Court, San Diego Municipal
Court, San Diego, CA

Gordon K. Blunt
City Commissioner, Claremont, CA

William R. Kincaid
Chairman, Fullerton Library Board of
Trustees

Roger H. Rathburn
Asst. Chief, Piffard, NY Fire Department

Edward J. Stovosik
Postmaster, US Postal Service, Piffard,
NY

Judge Richard W. Van
Dusen
Rio Hondo Municipal Court, El Monte, CA

Judge Henry K. Nelson
Mt. Sanhedrin Municipal Court, Ukiah, CA

Judge Donald W. Ryan
North San Diego Municipal Court, Vista,
CA

Judge William F. Levins
(Retired)
Municipal Court, Oakland-Piedmont-
Emeryville Judicial District, Oakland, CA

Judge William B. Burleigh
Monterey Municipal Court, Salinas, CA

Michael Moore
Member of Parliament, Australian Capital
Territory Legislative Assembly, Canberra,
Australia

Judge James R. Ross
Superior Court, Orange County, CA

Judge Phillip R. McGraw
(Retired)
No. Orange County Municipal Court,
Newport Beach, CA

Judge Dallas Edgar
(Retired)
Hayward-San Leandro Municipal Court,
Hayward, CA

Judge William R. Phelps
(Retired)
Shasta County Superior Court, Redding, CA

Judge Gilbert C. Alston
(Retired)
Los Angeles Superior Court, Los Angeles,
CA

Robert Van Der Hoeven
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

M. Witteveen, Ph.D.
Bureau of Public Prosecution, Rotterdam,
The Netherlands

E. A. Laneijer
Bureau of Public Prosecution, Rotterdam,
The Netherlands

Edward Koning
Bureau of Public Prosecution, Rotterdam,
The Netherlands

J. Wittop Koning
District Attorney, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

Rick Smid
Oberstaatsamwalt, Dept. of Justice,
Rotterdam, The Netherlands


L.Yonge
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

A. J. P. Van Essen
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

H. J. Mosaal
District Attorney, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

M. C. Kaptein
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

L. A. M. Steiyt
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

Elizabeth C. Koekman
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

Mrs. S. A. J. van Hiel
Public Prosecutor, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

Judge Steven Van Dissel
Rechtbank, Rotterdam, The Netherlands

Judge A. G. Van de
Grampen
District Court, Rotterdam, The
Netherlands

Referee Agatha Hoff
San Francisco Municipal Court, San
Francisco, CA

Judge Martin Hildreth
Municipal Court, Rancho Cucamonga, CA

Judge Francisco Firmat
Orange County Superior Court, Santa Ana,
CA

Commissioner Bobby
Vincent
San Bernardino Superior Court, San
Bernardino, CA

Judge Ward O. Mathews
(Retired)
Municipal Court, Rialto, CA

Judge H. Walter Steiner
(Retired)
Orange County Superior Court, Santa Ana,
CA

Judge Eleanor Provost
(Retired)
Tuolomne County Justice Court, Sonora, CA

Miriam Kaywood
Member, Anaheim City Council (Retired)
Anaheim, CA

Judge Sheila F. Pokras
Superior Court, Long Beach, CA

Judge Howard R. Broadman
Superior Court, Visalia, CA

Judge Charles Egan Goff
(Retired)
San Francisco Municipal Court, San
Francisco, CA

Judge Robert K. Barber
(Retired)
Superior Court, Berkeley, CA

Col. W. H. Longenecker,
Jr.
USAF Retired, Indio, CA

Judge Sara Kleban Radin
(Retired)
Superior Court, Los Angeles, CA

Judge Robert J. Soares
(Retired)
Ventura County Superior Court, Ojai, CA

Judge Gerald E. Ragan
(Retired)
San Francisco Superior Court, San
Francisco, CA

Maryann Mahaffey
President, Detroit City Council, Detroit,
MI

Marshall Phillips
Foreign Service Officer (Retired) Long
Beach, CA

Judge Alan Goldhammer
California State Bar Court, San
Francisco, CA

* signed with edits




Organizations

**Central Conference of
American Rabbis

Contact: Rabbi Joseph B. Glaser, New
York, NY

California Democratic
Council
Rita Hodgkins, President, Sacramento, CA

The Libertarian Party of
America
Washington, DC

San Francisco Drug Advisory Board, San Francisco, CA


     Wendy Goldberg,
President


     Marylouise Adlo-Robinson,
Vice-President


     Eric Brizee,
Executive Officer


     Michelle Aldrich


     John James
Entwistle, Jr.


     Iris Garcia


     Stefano Hillman


American Civil Liberties
Union, Los Angeles
Chapter
Ramona Ripston, Director

Advocates for Self-
Government, Atlanta, GA
Carol Ann Rand, President, Atlanta, GA

New Mexico Libertarian
Party, Alamogordo, NM
Kay Stone, Chairman

Drug Policy Foundation,
Washington, DC
Arnold Trebach, J.D., Ph.D., President;
Kevin Zeese, Esq., Vice-President

Family Council on Drug
Awareness, Los Angeles,
CA
Chris Conrad, President,

Center for Independent
Thought, New York, NY
Andrea Rich, President

Harold Washington New
Generation Democratic
Club
Sabrina Saunders, Co-Chair, San
Francisco, CA

Illinois Marijuana
Initiative, Chicago, IL
Mike Rosiny, Coordinating Director

Criminal Justice Policy
Foundation, Washington,
DC
Eric Sterling, President

Save Our Liberties, San
Rafael, CA
Eric Harlow, President

Religious Coalition for a
Moral Drug Policy
Father Joseph Ganssle, President

California Drug Policy
Reform Coalition, San
Francisco, CA
Joey Tranchina, Dale Gieringer, Co-
Directors

ACAJAHMEM Indigenous
People of Orange County,
CA
Don Juan Pablo Serrano-Nieblas, Shaman

People for a National
Health Program, Leisure
World, CA
Theodore Rosenbaum, President

Orange County Hemp
Council, Orange, CA
Kenneth R. Tigner, Council Member

Business Alliance for
Commerce in Hemp (BACH),
Los Angeles, CA
Robert Deitch, Director

Families Against
Mandatory Minimums
Brenda Grantland, Chair

Medical Marijuana
Initiative, El Monte, CA
Brian J. Cosner, Natalie Michelle Cosner,
Representatives

Arizona Libertarian
Party, Phoenix, AZ
Richard Tompkins, Chairman

Libertarian Party of
Orange County, CA
Geoffrey Braun, Secretary

National Organization for
the Reform of the
Marijuana Laws (NORML),
Washington, DC
Richard Cowan, President

Shared Living Resource
Center
Berkeley, CA

Mainliners, London,
England
John Mordaunt, Director

New South Wales Drug
Users and AIDS
Association, New South
Wales, Australia
Dave Burrows, Co-Coordinator

** signed Resolution without the phrase "and loss of civil liberties"
*********************************************************************
*****************
Berkeley City Council
Berkeley, CA

American Civil Liberties
Union, New York, NY
Ira Glasser, Executive Director

American Civil Liberties
Union, Pittsburgh Chapter
Witold J. Walczak, Esq., Executive
Director

Cannabis Action Network
Etienne Fonton, Coordinator, Berkeley, CA










Medical Profession

Anna Halverstadt Freud,
M.D.
Psychiatrist, Amsterdam, The Netherlands

Freek Polak, M.D.
Psychiatrist, Amsterdam, The Netherlands

Erik Fromberg, Ph.D.
Neurophysiologist, Dutch Institute for
Alcohol and Drugs, Eutrecht, The
Netherlands

Board of Directors, California Academy of Family Physicians


     Barbara Kostick,
M.D.


     M.F. Harris, Jr.,
M.D.


     Robert C. M. Bourne,
M.D.


     Renee Armstrong,
Medical Student


     Mary E. Frank, M.D.


     Norman J. Rosen,
M.D.


     Ingeborg B. Shaffer,
M.D.


     Paulette J. Adams,
M.D.


     Jean L. Ray, M.D.


     Warren F. Brandle,
M.D.


     John P. Crivaro,
M.D.


     Richard E. Katz,
M.D.


     Alexandra Korin,
M.D.


     Robert A. Pedrin,
M.D.


     Merritt S. Matthews,
M.D.


     Kenneth B. Reed,
M.D.


Jonathan Mann, M.D.
Harvard Medical School, Harvard
University

Phillip L. Gausewitz,
M.D.
Chairman and CEO, Pathology Medical
Laboratories, San Diego, CA

John O. Strong, M.D.
Past President, California Society of
Plastic Surgeons, Corona Del Mar, CA

Christopher Lyon, M.D.,
Ph.D.
Lyon Eye Institute, Newport  Beach, CA

Jeffrey Kaufman, M.D.
President, Orange County Urological
Society, CA

James K. Lightfoot, M.D.
California Department of Health Services

John Magrann, M.D.
Member, Board of Directors, Peer
Assistance League, La Palma, CA

J. S. Cummings, M.D.
Ophthalmologist, Anaheim, CA

Maureen Womack
Nurse Evaluator II, California Department
of Health Services

Lolita N. Yabut
Registered Nurse, California Department
of Health Services

Ralph J. Turner, M.D.
California Department of Health Services

Bobbie Johnson
Registered Nurse, California Department
of Health Services

Barry Solomon
Pharmaceutical Consultant, California
Department of Health Services

Sonia Santiago
AGPA, California Department of Health
Services

Qunitina Carreon
OA II, California Department of Health
Services

Emily Horn
OSSI, California Department of Health
Services

Neal Kaufman, M.D.
Director, Primary Care Pediatrics,
Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, Beverly
Hills, CA

Harold Amer, M.D.
Director, Pediatric Critical Care,
Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, Beverly
Hills, CA

Corinne Armer
Registered Nurse, San Francisco, CA

Fritzi Werner
Registered Nurse, Program Supervisor in
Drug Abuse, Siskiyou General Hospital,
Yreka, CA

Lenora M. Lawrence
Pharmacist,  Siskiyou General Hospital,
Yreka, CA

Linda M. Koopman
Pharmacy Clerk, Siskiyou General
Hospital, Yreka, CA

Andrea Rubin
Medical Assistant, Siskiyou General
Hospital, Yreka, CA

Susan Walpert
Medical Assistant, Siskiyou General
Hospital, Yreka, CA

June Rene Fox
Registered Nurse, Siskiyou General
Hospital, Yreka, CA

Ruth McBride
Registered Nurse

William Schwied, M.D.
Orange County Health Care Agency, Orange
County, CA

Brian Fitch, M.D.
University of California at Irvine
Medical Center

John M. Zasadny, D.P.M.
Podiatrist, Torrance, CA

Alex Go, M.D.
President, Garden Park Medical Clinic,
Anaheim, CA

Gasto De Carlo, M.D.
Colonel, USAF (Retired), Wadsworth, OH

Charles S. Grob, M.D.
Director, Psychiatric Residency Program,
Director, Child Adolescent Psychiatry
Unit, University of California at Irvine

Theodore C. Smith, M.D.
Claremont, CA

Thomas Coad, D.D.S.
Member, Republican Central Committee,
Garden Grove, CA

Alice Murphy
Registered Nurse, Long Island, New York

Joanne Morris
Registered Nurse, Fresno, CA

Thomas F. Ednie, M.D.
Sandpoint, ID

Lawrence A. Plumlee, M.D.
Bethesda, MD

Ward Dean, M.D.
Pensacola, FL

Jeri Rose, DC
Doctor of Chiropractic, Altadena, CA

Ronald Hutchings, DC
Doctor of Chiropractic, Altadena, CA

Robert M. Solow, DDS
Woodland Hills, CA

Michael Robertson, DDS,
DMD
Woodland Hills, CA

James D. Tovey, M.D.
Benicia, CA

A. Bergsma, M.D.
Anaheim, CA

Matthew R. Zeturner, M.D.
Anaheim, CA

John Isherwood, M.D.
Napa, CA

Henry L. Foucher, M.D.
Anaheim, CA

Andrea Morrison, M.D.
Tarzana, CA

Jack Connole, O.D.
Newport-Balboa Rotary Club, Newport
Beach, CA

Fred Raleigh, Pharm.D.
Atascadero, CA

Robert Fromer
Director, Fromer Psychological Center,
Upland, CA

Patricia B. Fromer
Business Administrator, Fromer
Psychological Center, Upland, CA

Brenda J. Hopley
M.F.C. Intern, Fromer Psychological
Center, Upland, CA

Maureen Kappler
Registered Nurse, Tucson, AZ

Susan M. Judy
Registered Nurse, Huntington Beach, CA

Athena Miller
Registered Nurse, University of
California at Irvine

George K. Fuller, M.D.
Oakland, CA

Herman Siegel, M.D.
Los Angeles, CA

Pravin Kansagram, M.D.
Orange County Mental Health, Orange
County, CA

William Grant Loomis,
M.D.
Community Mental Health, Orange County,
CA

Steven J. Marcus, M.D.
Beverly Hills, CA

Gerald B. Whitman, M.D.
Beverly Hills, CA

Harry B. Dickinson
Laboratory Consultant, California
Department of Health Services - Audits
and Investigations

Gordon Labedz, M.D.
Los Angeles, CA

H. Fong
Pharmacist, Altadena, CA

Arthur A. Walton, D.P.M.
Newport Beach, CA

Marilynn J. Pratt, M.D.
Founder/Director Women's Institute and
Health Center, Los Angeles, CA

Bob Cuyler, D.D.S.
Corona Del Mar, CA

Gary Alford, M.D.
West Hills, CA

David M. Davis, M.D.
Santa Ana, CA

Charlene A. Richards
Registered Nurse, Appointee - California
Democratic Party - 36th Congressional
District

Gary L. Hardegen, M.D.
President, Anaheim Skin Medical Center,
Anaheim, CA

E.T. Moran, M.D.
Newport Beach, CA

Brian Robertson, M.D.
Arroyo Grande, CA

Clifford B. Widmark, M.D.
Orange, CA

Dennis L. Randall, M.D.
Orange County, CA

Carl K. Pearlman, M.D.
Orange County Public Health and Clinical
Professor Emeritus, University of
California at Irvine Medical School

Robert N. Akeley, M.D.
Oakland, CA

Paul F. Reardon, M.D.
University of California at Irvine

Michael W. Kistler, M.D.
Palm Springs, CA

Irwin D. Zim, M.D.
Hillsborough, CA

Steven Auer, M.D.
Malibu, CA

Thomas A. Sazani, M.D.
Member, American College of Physicians,
Las Vegas, NV

Andrew Rose
Tri-City Health Center, Fremont, CA

Micky Daxbury
Tri-City Health Center, Fremont, CA

Jan Falk
Executive Director, Center for Human
Development, Pleasant Hill, CA

David Franks
Tri-City Health Center, Fremont, CA

Daniel Liebowitz, M.D.
Director of Medical Education, Sequoia
Hospital, Redwood City, CA

David M. Duffy, M.D.
Torrance, CA

Stephen Mutchsenbacher,
M.D.
Studio City, CA

Dr. McDonald Robinson
Goleta, CA

Khai Quach, Psychiatric
Technician
Cypress College, Santa Ana, CA

Mardi Wally
Administrative Assistant, Health Care,
Sacramento, CA

Tina Acciltola
Health Care Professional, Sacramento, CA

Sally A. Wright
Health Care Professional, Folsom, CA

Louise Maestretti
Health Care Professional, Sacramento, CA

Ernest Drucker, M.D.
Department of Epidemiology & Social
Medicine, Montefiore Medical Center,
Bronx, NY

L. W. Epsen, M.D.
Redwood City, CA

*********************************************************************
*******************
Joel Fort, M.D.
Former Director, National Instiute on
Mental Health

Mario Lap
Netherlands Institute on Alcohol and
Drugs

Nia Van Oosten
Netherlands Institute on Alcohol and
Drugs

Frans Jansen
Netherlands Institute on Alcohol and
Drugs

Melvyn L. Sterling, M.D.
President, Orange County Medical
Association, Orange, CA

Frank Amato, M.D.
Past President, Orange County Medical
Association, Orange, CA

Margaret Shannon, M.D.
Costa Mesa, CA

F. Jack Warner, M.D.,
FAAP
Fullerton, CA

Richard Raczka, M.D.
Anaheim, CA

Paula M. Jones
Senior Staff Nurse, LA County Sheriffs
Department, Los Angeles, CA

Marjorie H. Cherry
District Chief, Jail Mental Health
Services, Los Angeles County Department
of Mental Health

Dale W. ONeal, Ph.D.
Psychologist, Laguna Beach, CA

Georgia L. Nelson, CAS
Certified Addiction Specialist, American
Academy of Health Care Providers in the
Addictive Disorders, San Clemente, CA

James D. Boyce, M.D.
Garden Grove, CA

Manuel Q. Arjona, M.D.
California Rehabilitation Center,
Department of Corrections, Norco, CA

Nancy E. Greene, Ph.D.
Clinical Psychologist, San Diego, CA

Faye J. Gersh, Ed.D.
Psychologist, Past President, San Diego
Psycho-Law Society, San Diego, CA

Clifford J. Straehlen,
III, M.D.
Fair Oaks, CA

Jerri Accettola
Health Care Professional, Sacramento, CA

Randall C. Stenson, M.D.
Bi-Valley Medical Clinic, Sacramento, CA

Neil Flynn, M.D.
University of California at Davis Medical
Center, Davis, CA

Tim Crump, F.N.P.
Multnoma County Health Department,
Portland, OR

Karen Kern
Dietician, Multnomah County Health
Department, Portland, OR

Robert S. Erickson
Director, Department of Health Services,
County of Lake, CA

Alex Vilomsons, Ph.D.
Psychotherapist, Sherman Oaks, CA

Patricia Barrett
Community Health Nurse, Multnomah County
Health Department, Portland, OR

Toby Hyman
Clinical Dietitian, Tucson Medical
Center, Tucson, AZ

Barbara A. Rosen
Clinical Psychologist, Tustin, CA

Edward Dutton, M.D.
Anaheim, CA

Richard M. Bentley
Chief Sanitarian (Retired) Los Angeles
County Health Dept., Los Angeles, CA

Marit Braemer, R.N.C.
Inside Edge, Costa Mesa, CA

Leslie Jo Gault, R.N.
Manhattan Beach, CA

Phil White, D.P.M.
Garden Grove, CA

Rita L. Wright
Los Angeles County Mental Health
Department, Los Angeles, CA

Kelsea K. Baggett, R.N.
Registered Nurse (Retired) Los Angeles
County Sheriffs Department Medical
Service, Los Angeles, CA

James T. Hamilton, M.D.
Newport Beach, CA

Pamela Marie Walters,
R.N.
Roche Professional Services, San Diego,
CA

Suzanne Sollman, R.N.
Roche Professional Services, San Diego,
CA

Marilynn J. Pratt, M.D.
Womens Institute and Health Center,
Inc., Los Angeles, CA

Gary A. Chase, M.D.
Parole Outpatient Clinic, California
Department of Corrections, Los Angeles,
CA

K. Stojanovich, M.D.
California Department of Corrections, Los
Angeles, CA

Pamela R. Jackson, M.D.
Parole Outpatient Clinic, California
Department of Corrections,   Los Angeles,
CA

Fred Afrasiabi, M.D.
Staff Psychiatrist, Parole Outpatient
Clinic, California Department of
Corrections, Los Angeles, CA

Jeane Haining, Ph.D.
Staff Psychologist, Parole Outpatient
Clinic, California Department of
Corrections, Los Angeles, CA

Kenneth Baum, M.D.
Parole Outpatient Clinic, California
Department of Corrections, Los Angeles,
CA

Leisha W. Howell, Ph.D.
Clinical Psychologist, Parole Outpatient
Clinic, California Department of
Corrections, Los Angeles, CA

Jean F. Segall, M.D.
Staff Psychiatrist, Parole Outpatient
Clinic, California Department of
Corrections, Los Angeles, CA

Bernadette S. Corpuz
Senior Medical Transcriber, Parole
Outpatient Clinic, California Department
of Corrections, Los Angeles, CA

Robert D. Gruener, M.D.
Parole Outpatient Clinic, Camarillo State
Hospital, California Department of
Corrections, Camarillo, CA

Ira M. Frank, M.D.
Parole Outpatient Clinic, California
Department of Corrections, Los Angeles,
CA

Edward Rudin, M.D.
Sacramento, CA

Joey Upland, R.N.
Registered Nurse, Santa Clara Valley
Medical Center Main Jail, Burlingame, CA

Lester Grinspoon, M.D.
Harvard Medical School, Wellesley, MA

Lawrence C. Kolb, M.D.
Professor Emeritus, Columbia University,
New York, NY

Henry N. Blansfield, M.D.
Member, Alcohol/Drug Education Committee;
Member, Committee on Physician Health;
Member, American Society of Addiction
Medicine, Member, Danbury AIDS Task
Force; Member, Section on Chemical
Dependency; Danbury CT

Lorraine L. Blansfield,
R.N.
Registered Nurse, Danbury, CT

Jayne Brannon, R.N.
Registered Nurse, Elmwood Mens
Correction Facility, Los Gatos, CA

Linda Lee Wilson, R.N.
Registered Nurse, American Correctional
Health Services Association, San Rafael,
CA

Rachel L. Anderson
Research Associate, UCD Medical Center,
Sacramento, CA

Dennis R. Ding. R.N.
Registered Nurse, Citrus Heights, CA

Clifford J. Straehley,
III, M.D.
Fair Oaks, CA

Roger Walsh, M.D., Ph.D.
College of Medicine, University of
California at Irvine, CA

Dr. Shawn I. Harrington
Lake Oswego, OR

Dr. Ghazarian
Palm Desert, CA

Dr. Meddick Sarty
Los Angeles, CA

Dr. J.B. Kiehlbauch
Riverdale, GA

Dr. Albert Rothman
Livermore, CA

Robert Chisholm
Medical Tehnician Assistant, California
Department of Corrections, San
Bernardino, CA

Ward Dean, M.D.
Center for Bio-Gerontology, Pensacola, FL

David F. Duncan, Ph.D.
Research Fellow, Brown University School
of Medicine

Christina Chisholm LVN
Licensed Vocational Nurse, San
Bernardino, CA

Pamela G. Heredia
Assoc. Exec. Director, Orange County
Foundation for Medical Care, Santa Ana,
CA

Luis Sandoval
Psychiatric Technician, University of
California at Irvine Medical Center,
Irvine, CA

Lisa S. Menen, R.N.
Registered Nurse, Orange, CA


Edward S. Friedrichs,
M.D.
Addictionologist, Milwaukee County Mental
Health Complex, Milwaukee, WI

Dr. Allan Olson
Staff Physician, Marquette-Alger
Community Mental Health, Marquette, MI

Daniel Weiss, M.D.
Beachwood, OH

Mona K. Stern, M.D.
Gary, IN

Jerome Schachter, M.D.
Isle Palms, SC

Carl K. Pearlman, M.D.
Clinical Professor Emeritus, University
of California at Irvine, CA

Jose A. Mijares, M.D.,
F.A.C.S.
Tampa, Florida

Bart Majoor
Clinical Psychologist, Head of Department
of Training and Development, Institute on
Alcohol and Drugs, Utrecht, The
Netherlands.





Law Enforcement and Social Services

Anthony Ribera
Chief of Police, San Francisco, CA

Lou Cobarruviaz
Chief of Police, San Jose, CA

Bob Nichelini
Acting Chief of Police, Oakland, CA

Michael Hennessey
Sheriff, City and County of San
Francisco, CA

Nicolas Pastore
Chief of Police, New Haven, CT

Alfred Blumstein, Ph.D.
Carnegie-Mellon Foundation; Pres. Amer
Association of Criminologists

Robert G. Le Conte
President, National Association of
Veteran Police Officers, Austin, TX

**
Richard Christie, Esq.
Deputy District Attorney, Los Angeles, CA

William B. Rumford, Ph.D.
Chief of Security, Golden Gate Bridge,
San Francisco, CA

Alissa Riker
Program Director, San Francisco, CA

Michael S. Hebel
Captain, San Francisco Police Department,
San Francisco, CA

Vincent Schiraldi
Executive Director, Center on Juvenile &
Criminal Justice, San Francisco, CA

Jodi Schwartz
Administrative Director, Center on
Juvenile & Criminal Justice, San
Francisco, CA

Marsha Rosenbaum, Ph.D.
Sociologist, Institute for Scientific
Analysis

Patricia Jones
Director, Child Abuse Prevention Program,
Family Services Agency, San Francisco, CA

Kathleen Baxter
Director, San Francisco Child Abuse
Council, San Francisco, CA

Lynn Friar
Educational Coordinator, San Francisco
Child Abuse Council, San Francisco, CA

Lori Dix
Family Support Services, San Francisco,
CA

Daniel K. Blue
Alternative Family Services, San
Francisco, CA

Mai-Win Ho
Executive Director, Asian Prenatal
Advocates, San Francisco, CA

James N. Speros
Sergeant, San Francisco Police
Department, San Francisco, CA

Kathleen Connolly
Program Case Worker, San Francisco, CA

Kenneth L. Christie
San Jose Police Department, San Jose, CA

Martha Rodetts
Training Coordinator, Child Welfare
Project, San Francisco State University,
San Francisco, CA

J. Mark Robinson, Ph.D.
Clinical Psychologist, Orange County
Health Care Agency, Orange County, CA

Shirley Collins
Program Director, Women's Alcoholic Unit,
San Francisco, CA

Gary L. Frucan
Senior Social Services Supervisor,
Department of Social Services, San
Francisco, CA

Lynda M. Frattiani
Maternal and Child Health, San Francisco
General Hospital, San Francisco, CA

Pamela C. Brett
Licensed Clinical Social Worker, San
Francisco Department of Public Health,
San Francisco, CA

Robert L. Slaughter, Esq.
Captain (Retired), San Diego Police
Department, San Diego, CA

Clark W. Baker
Police Officer, Los Angeles Police
Department, Los Angeles, CA

David M. Lawrence
Deputy Probation Officer, Riverside
County, CA

Ann DeMarco
Deputy Probation Officer, Orange County,
CA

Earl R. McClure
Sergeant (Retired) San Jose Police
Department; Instructor in Narcotics, De
Anza College,

Daniel B. Jeffs
Chief Investigator, County Public
Defender, San Bernardino, CA

Karl B. Hutchinson
Law Enforcement Coordinator, Sacramento
Public Safety Center, Sacramento, CA

Mary Kay Rudolph
Corrections Coordinator, Sacramento
Public Safety Center, Sacramento, CA

Tiffany Johnston
Group Counselor, Probation Officer,
Orange County, CA

Paul D. Muntz
Probation Director, Los Angeles County
Probation Department, Los Angeles, CA

Doris Waterman
Volunteer Probation Officer, Orange
County Probation Department, Orange
County, CA

Kenneth Kingsbury
MS, MFCC, Fullerton, CA

Shirley Melnicoe
Executive Director, Northern California
Service League, San Francisco, CA

John J. "Jack" Gutowski
Program Director, Boys and Girls Clubs of
San Gabriel Valley, CA

Billy J. Parrott
Former Director, Community Connection
Resource Center, San Diego, CA

Abn Qadir Al-Amin
Director, SLP, San Francisco, CA

Keith Harris
Clinical Psychologist, San Bernardino
County Department of Mental Health, San
Bernardino, CA

Robert H. Silverman, Sr.
Deputy, Orange County Marshal's
Department

Lynnette Shaw
Marin County Advisory Board on Alcohol
and Other Drug Problems, Marin County, CA

Clarence Lee Brooks
LCSW, San Bernardino County Department of
Mental Health, San Bernardino, CA

Ruthann Simmons, Ph.D.
Supervisor, Counseling & Medical Center,
Montclair, CA

Carmen A. McNamara
Giordano
Licensed Marriage, Family and Child
Counselor, Mission Viejo, CA

Kelly L. Holt
Community Employment Trainer, Orange
County Association for +++++++ Citizens,
Orange, CA

Crystal Marie Knox
Community Employment Trainer, Orange
County Association for +++++++ Citizens,
Orange, CA

Sheri Y. Marsh
Community Employment Trainer, Orange
County Association for +++++++ Citizens,
Orange, CA

Catherine Rupp Bell
Assistant Program Manager, Orange County
Association for +++++++ Citizens,
Orange, CA

Angela M. Garcia
Social Worker, New Life For Children, San
Ysidro, CA

Ann Alper, M.A.
MFCT, Marriage, Family , Child Therapist,
San Diego, CA

Marc Kern, Ph.D.
Director/Psychologist, Addiction
Alternatives, Santa Ana, CA

Joseph N. Feinstein
MFCC, Van Nuys, CA

Hugh M. Tate
Methadone Maintenance Program, Fullerton,
CA

** signed Resolution without the phrase "and loss of civil liberties"
*********************************************************************
*******************
Michael L. Sorg
Former Police Chief, San Clemente, CA

R. H. Hessing
Chief of Police, Rotterdam, Holland

Nancy Foutts
(Former) Supervisory Patrol Officer, US
Customs Service, Orange County Grand
Jury, Garden Grove, CA

Gregory L. Morgon
Lieutenant, Los Angeles County Sheriffs
Department, Los Angeles, CA

Sidney Mills
Captain (Retired) Los Angeles County
Police Department, Los Angeles, CA

Ted Hunt
Police Officer, Los Angeles County Police
Department, Los Angeles, CA

Robert K. Sager
Laboratory Director (Retired) US Drug
Enforcement Administration, Salmon, WA

Diana Jo Leigh
Social Worker, Shaker Heights, OH

Richard M. Sullivan
Social Worker, Certified Alcohol and Drug
Counselor, Clarence, NY

Lois D. Sullivan
Social Worker, Clarence, NY

Barbara J. Frank
Chief Probation Officer, San Bernardino
County, CA

Claude M. Potts
Deputy Chief Probation Officer, San
Bernardino County, CA

Sandra Klapp
Group Counselor, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Bernardino, CA

Darrel Day
Supervising Group Counselor, San
Bernardino County Probation Department,
San Bernardino, CA

Alan Hutton
Supervising Probation Officer, San
Bernardino County Probation Department,
San Bernardino, CA
When youve spent 24+ years
arresting & jailing druggies, its
difficult to adopt a new position. 
But Ive been involved in this
activity in lean times & times with
lots of money & programs & our
system just doesnt work.

Cathy Ortiz, N.S.I.
San Bernardino County Probation
Department, San Bernardino, CA

Fred Esber
Group Counselor, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Bernardino, CA

Byron Saldana
Group Counselor, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Bernardino, CA

Fred R. Speidel
Probation Director II, San Bernardino
County Probation Department, San
Bernardino, CA

C.W. (Bill) Simington
Probation Officer, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Bernardino, CA

Frank E. Schlesinger,
M.F.C.C.
San Bernardino, CA

Laura L. Hoffman
Probation Officer II, San Bernardino
County Probation Department, San
Bernardino, CA

Rebecca Michelson
Child Care Counselor, American Indian
Family Healing Center, Berkeley, CA

James T. Casey,
C.P.P.C.A.
San Jose, CA

Walter L. Glaser
Night Supervisor I, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Bernardino, CA

Deborah Mosby
Social Worker, Roseville, MN

Michael A. OConnell, MSW
Everett, WA

Kathleen Cassil
Director, Golden Hills Community Services
District, Tehachapi, CA

Gary V. West
Supervising Probation Officer, San Mateo,
CA

Jasmin S.K. Jackson
Deputy Probation Officer, Upland, CA

Marcia Gradin
Deputy Probation Officer, San Diego, CA

R. Scott DeuPree
Supervising Probation Officer, Santa
Maria, CA

Lawrence M. Baker
Retired Psychologist, Frankfort, MI

Dawn Day
Sociologist, Princeton, NJ

Adrienne Moore
Supervising Clerk I, San Bernardino
County Probation Department, San
Bernardino, CA

Richard Eaton, ADPO II
Parole Officer, San Diego County
Probation Department, San Diego, CA

Barbara Drew, MFCC
Program Chief, Lake County Mental Health,
Lakeport, CA

Janeen Karraker
Coordinator, Criminal Justice Consortium,
Oakland, CA

Madelyn Burley-Allen
Dynamics of Human Behavior, San Mateo, CA

Sam Torres
US Probation Officer, Adjunct Professor
of Criminal Justice, Long Beach State
University, Long Beach, CA

Robin L. Soule
Secretary, San Bernardino County
Probation Department, San Berardino, CA

Cheryl A. Lobbestael-
Griffin
Social Worker, Marquette, MI

Rex G. Dillon
Senior Probation Officer, San Mateo
County Probation Department, San Mateo,
CA




   
Media and Entertainment

Hugh Downs
ABC News, New York, NY

Janis Paige
Actress/President, Ipanema Music Corp.,
Hollywood, CA

Danny Glover
Actor, Hollywood, CA

Jacob Sullum
Editor, Reason Magazine, Los Angeles, CA

Kip Konwiser
Producer, Shadow Hill Entertainment,
Santa Monica, CA

Rudy De Luca
Writer, Brooks Films, Hollywood, CA

Gail H. Evans
CNN, Atlanta, GA

Phyllis Avery
Author, San Diego, CA

Susan Toffler
CNN, Atlanta, GA

Stephen Adams
Editor, California Family Law Report,
Sausalito, CA

Brian Kelleher
Publisher, Flush Rush Quarterly, San
Diego, CA

Shane N. Smith
Comedian, Anaheim, CA

Alan W. Bock
Senior Columnist, Orange County Register,
Santa Ana, CA

James Greer
Radio Talk Show Host, Albuquerque, NM

Lonnie Bee
Artist/Illustrator, Orinda, CA

Peter Jon Shuler
KQED, Inc., San Francisco, CA

Patricia Soberanis
Editor and Publisher, American Voices,
San Francisco, CA

Ralph A. and Natalie
Kennedy
Editors, Fullerton *******, Fullerton,
CA

Thomas R. Daly
Publisher, Georgetown Gazette,
Georgetown, CA

Donald E. Armstrong
Cartoonist, Redlands, CA

*********************************************************************
*****************
Eldridge Cleaver
Author, Soul On Ice

Maralys Wills
Author, Santa Ana, CA

Buddy Nadler
Director, Directors Guild of America

Ken Von Helmolt
Technical Editor, General Media, Canoga
Park, CA

Tobie Helene Shapiro
Columnist, Phoenix Journal, Berkeley, CA

Amy Franklin
Music Director, KWUC, Orange, CA

David F. Castasno
Publisher/Editor, Screamer Magazine, Los
Angeles, CA

Nick Boicourt, Jr.
Producer/Director, Garden Productions,
Fullerton, CA

Daniel Eastwood
Editor, Spletter Magazine, Los Angeles,
CA

Neil Gido
Writer/Photographer, Wild Ones Magazine,
Los Angeles, CA

Lawrence B. Fenton
Reporter, S.F. Weekly, San Francisco, CA

Barbara Faye Swain
Author, Pasadena, CA

K.E. Grubbs, Jr.
Editorial and Commentary Director, Orange
County Register, Santa Ana, CA






Members of the Clergy

Reverend Bruce Larson
Co-Pastor of the Crystal Cathedral,
Garden Grove, CA

Father Joseph Ganssle
OFM, President, Religious Coalition for a
Moral Drug Policy, Denver, CO

Pastor Andrew L. Gunn
President, Clergy for an Enlightened Drug
Policy, St. Luke's United Methodist
Church, Washington, DC

Reverend David S.
Sandberg
Senior Pastor, First Congregational
Church, Berkeley, CA

Rabbi Haim Asa
Temple Beth Tikvah of North Orange
County, CA

Reverend Grayson Atha
Minister, Mt. Zion United Methodist
Church, Cincinnati, OH

Rabbi Alan Frehling
University Synagogue, Los Angeles

Rabbi Steven Carr Rubin
Vice-President, Board of Rabbis of
Southern CA, Los Angeles, CA 

James W. Prescott, Ph.D.
Director, Institute of Humanistic
Science, San Diego, CA

Reverend Thomas L.
Sheridan
S.J., St. Peter's College, Jersey City,
New Jersey

Reverend Jonathan
Tetherly
Protestant Chaplain, Hampden County
Correctional Center, Massachusetts
Justice Network, Chicopee, MA

Reverend Alexander A. Di
Lella, OFM
Professor of Biblical Studies, Catholic
University of America, Washington, DC

Rabbi Rav A. Soloff,
Ph.D.
Lansdale, PA

Sr. Francis Joseph Egan,
O.P.
Mt. St. Mary Convent, Newburgh, NY

Father William J. Patrick
Priest Chaplain, St. Jude Hospital,
Fullerton, CA

Reverend William Wallace
Finlator
Southern Baptist Minister (Retired)
Raleigh, NC

Father Joseph P. Kane,
S.J.
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections 

Reverend Gabriel Camacho
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Sister Marion Defeis
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Salimov Djabi
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Charles Dunston
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Ann Dub Hare
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Abij Hasan
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Sister Marie A. Henry
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Sister Marie Hermann
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Malik A. Kareem
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Sister Constance Kennedy
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Anas Khalid
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Rufino
Lecumberri
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Jane H. Leggett
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Maria Lopez
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Lawrence E.
Lucas
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Father Walter Mitchell
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Askia Muhammad
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

S. Mary O'Connor
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Francis J.
Passenant
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Rabbi Herbert Richtman
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Father John Soles
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

John H. Wilkinson
Chaplain, New York City Department of
Corrections

Reverend Alan Albert Snow
Independent Humanist Ministers, Balboa
Island, CA

Reverend Joan Torribio,
M.A.
Washington, DC

Reverend James K. Babcock
Pastor, Holy Cross Melkite-Greek Catholic
Church, Fullerton, CA

Farris Lee Huff
Ministerial Service, Jehovah's Witnesses,
Compton, CA

Marian Gallagher
Sisters of St. Joseph of Corondelet, Los
Angeles, CA

Sister Bernadette
Floersch
Sisters of St. Joseph of Corondelet, Los
Angeles, CA

Sister Margaret Reilly
Sisters of St. Joseph of Corondelet, Los
Angeles, CA

Cecilia Nevin
Sisters of St. Joseph of Corondelet, Los
Angeles, CA

Reverend Dr. David J.
Jamieson
Conference Minister, United Church of
Christ, San Francisco, CA

Paul J. Masquelier, Jr.
Executive Presbyter, The Presbytery of
San Jose, San Jose, CA

Reverend Connie White
Salinas, CA

Reverend Deborah Haffner-
Doll
San Rafael, CA

*********************************************************************
******************
Bishop Felton E. May
United Methodist Church, Harrisburg, PA

Dr. Patrick W. Grace
Conover
Policy Advocate, United Church of Christ,
Washington, DC

Donald P. Buteyn
Senior Pastor, First Presbyterian Church,
Bakersfield, CA

Joseph Moss
President, Men of Bethel A. M. E. Church,
Los Angeles, CA

Harold Wilke
UCC Minister, The Caring Congregation,
Claremont, CA

Ms. Jerald L. Scott
Program Director, The United Methodist
Church, Washington, DC

Reverend Arthur E.
Harrington
Retired Minister, United Methodist
Church, Claremont, CA

Virginia Wheeler
Methodist Minister, South Laguna, CA

Ralph H. Lightbody
Senior Pastor, Gardena Valley Baptist
Church, Claremont, CA

Jon S. West
Pastor, Morningside Presbyterian Church,
Fullerton, CA

Kenneth E. Crouch
Minister, Casas Adobes Congregational
Church, Tucson, AZ

Frances H. Bray
Missionary (Retired) United Methodist
Church, Claremont, CA

Reverend William D. Auld
Minister (Retired) Claremont, CA

Philip A. Anderson
Minister (Retired) United Church of
Christ, Claremont, CA

Kirk A. Ballin
Minister, Unitarian Universalist Church,
Roanoke, VA

Pierce Johnson
Minister, United Methodist Church,
Claremont, CA

Reverend Lincoln B. Wirt
Pastor (Retired) United Church of Christ,
Claremont, CA

David M. Held
Retired Clergyman, Claremont, CA

Stanley H. Conover
Minister (Retired), Claremont, CA

Ray Gibbons
Retired Clergyman, Claremont, CA

George Aki
Retired Clergyman, US Army Chaplain,
Claremont, CA

Reverend Dr. Marcia Ball
Claremont, CA

Elaine Asa
Temple Beth Tikvah, Fullerton, CA

Father Paul F. Murke
Los Angeles, CA

David J. Jamieson
United Church of Christ, San Francisco,
CA

Carolyn A. Portanova
Executive Director, Catholic Family
Center, Rochester, NY






Legal Profession

Rufus King, Esq.
Washington, DC

Jean Wilcox, J.D.
San Francisco, CA

David M. McCarthy, Jr.,
Esq.
Mansfield, MA

Leona L. Lauder, Esq.
San Francisco, CA

Robert S. Rivkin, Esq.
San Francisco, Ca

Kate M. Schreuers, Esq.
Orange, CA

Marilynn Mika Spencer,
Esq.
National Lawyers Guild, San Diego, CA

Kay Palmer Gray
Court Reporter, Superior Court, Santa
Ana, CA

Jay S. Bloom, Esq.
Beverly Hills, CA

John T. Dzialo, Esq.
Orange, CA

Bertrand E. Cottle, Esq.
Orange, CA

Charles L. Olobri, Esq.
Santa Ana, CA

Jerry Manpearl, Esq.
Beverly Hills, CA

Jan Goodman, Esq.
National Lawyers Guild, Beverly Hills, CA

Larry Cole, Esq.
Tennessee Department of Mental Health,
Memphis, TN

William R. Mitchell, Esq.
Tustin, CA

Michael Pancer, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Kevin M. O'Connell, Esq.
Royal Oak, MI

Donald Peters, Esq.
Newport Beach, CA

Barbara Jo Peterson
Senior Paralegal, Encino, CA

Jeannie S. Rinner
Legal Secretary, Orange, CA

Marque Rubinn
Paralegal, Los Angeles, CA

James E. Biava, Esq.
Malibu, CA

Craig J. Bolton, Esq.
Tempe, AZ

Charles H. Carreon, Esq.
Ashland, OR

Terry Phillips
Paralegal, San Diego, Ca

Don Wyle, Esq.
Agoura Hills, CA

Alan J. Chaset, Esq.
Alexandria, VA

Robert A. Merring, Esq.
Newport Beach, CA

Sharon Campbell
Court Reporter, Glendora, CA

Barbara Evans
Judicial Secretary, Orange County
Superior Court, Fullerton, CA

Hal Gunning, Esq.
Los Angeles, CA

Allen Friel, Esq.
Los Angeles, CA

Roger C. Hope, Esq.
Cambria, CA

Peter Hirsch, Esq.
New York, NY

Heather MacKay
Pelican Bay Legal Services, San Quentin,
CA

John Mullen, Esq.
Sacramento, CA

Laurence A. Young, Esq.
Santa Ana, CA

Jeff Thomas, Esq.
Public Defender, San Diego, CA

Stephen R. Ledoux, Esq.
San Francisco, CA

Eugene G. Iredale, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Ronald H. Gill, Esq.
Oxnard, CA

James E. Biana, Esq.
Malibu, CA

Morris J. Kushner, Esq.
Culver City, CA

Leah Singer, Esq.
Deputy Public Defender,Chula Vista, CA

Jack Hochman, Esq.
Public Defender, San Diego, CA

Katherine Mattes, Esq.
Deputy Public Defender,Chula Vista, CA

*********************************************************************
*****************
Garvin F. Shallenberger,
Esq.
Costa Mesa, CA

Robert V. Wills, Esq.
Tustin, CA

Mark A. Hiller, Esq.
Irvine, CA

Alex Landon, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Charles K. Houry, Esq.
Wilton, NH

Elizabeth A. Missaikian,
Esq.
San Diego, CA

Rodney J. Beede, Esq.
Davis, CA

DeVon W. Flaningam, Esq.
Crawfordsville, IN

Robert L. Bean, Esq.
Fullerton, CA

Nancy L. Ahlering, Esq.
Fullerton, CA

Ted L. Travis, Esq.
Los Angeles, CA

Jon Feder, Esq.
Irvine, CA

Michael Hannon, Esq.
Los Angeles, CA

Kay L. Sunday, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Edward M. Cauprynski,
Esq.
Essexville, MI

Marshall Krause, Esq.
Larkspur, CA

James E. Gerach, Esq.
Oak Lawn, IL

Jeffrey T. Haley, Esq.
Bellevue, WA

Ellen L. F. Strauss, Esq.
Weston, CT

Jeffrey Flynn
Investigator, San Diego Public Defenders
Office, San Diego, CA

Jeannette C. Holm, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Stephen J. Perrello, Esq.
San Diego, CA

Rodney L. Beade, Esq.
Davis, CA

Karen A. Lash
The Law Center, University of Southern
California Law School, Los Angeles, CA

Melvin S. Hirshowitz,
Esq.
New York, NY

Michael Letwin, Esq.
President, Association of Legal Aid
Attorneys, New York, NY

R. Dufour, Esq.
Hemsteede, The Netherlands

Carlos Arguello, Esq.
Deputy Public Defender, San Diego, CA

David L. Wilkirson, Esq.
Santa Ana, CA





Educators

Dr. James Doti
President, Chapman University, Orange, CA

Father Paul Locatelli
President, Santa Clara University, Santa
Clara, CA

W. Norman Johnson
Rear Admiral, U.S. Navy (Retired), Dean
and Vice-President of Boston University

Dr. Harry L. Hamilton
Senior Vice President and Provost,
Chapman University, Orange, CA

Dr. Peter Duignan
Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Dr. Melvin Krauss
Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Dr. William Ratliff
Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Dr. Thomas Moore
Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Dr. William Evers
Fellow, Hoover Institution, Stanford, CA

Celia C. Anaya-Conboy
Psychotherapist/Diversion Counselor,
Orange County Center for Health, Anaheim,
CA

Charles T. Tart
Professor of Psychology, University of
California at Davis

Mary Sauer
Teacher, (Retired), Santa Ana, CA

Linda Avanzino
High School Teacher, Santa Ynez, CA

Stephanie Bolling
Teacher, Berkeley Adult School, Berkeley,
CA

James Kopp
Senior Tutor, Laubach Literary Council,
El Reno, OK

Mitch Palmer
Master Tutor, Laubach Literary Council,
El Reno, OK

Judith Cohen
Advocate, Learning Disabilities
Association, San Diego, CA

Lester Cohen
Professor (Retired), San Diego State
University, San Diego, CA

Marius A. Robinson
Institute of Noetic Science,University of
California at Irvine

William L. Mikulas
Professor of Psychology, University of
West Florida

Sam Young, M.A., M.S.
Teacher/Assistant Professor, Magnolia
High, National University, Santa Ana, CA

Michael H. Horn
Professor, California State University at
Fullerton, Fullerton, CA

Neil Rosen
School Counselor, Placentia, CA

Bruce Henderson
Associate Professor, Fullerton College,
Fullerton, CA

Mark Bockstahler
Licensed Educational Psychologist, Irvine
Unified School District, Irvine, CA

Rosalinda Guzman
Psychotherapist,  Orange County Center
for Health, Anaheim, CA

Robert E. Williams
Sr. Fellow, Loker Hydrocarbon Research
Institute, University of Southern
California, Los Angeles, CA

Cheri Gilmour
Loker Hydrocarbon  Research Institute,
University of Southern California, Los
Angeles, CA

Stephen Blumentahl
Educator, Los Angeles, CA

Pamela Webster
Teacher, Rossier School, Orange, CA

Stephanie Harris
Sign Language Interpreter, Los Angeles
Unified School District, Los Angeles, CA

John H. Engler
Coo


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 17, 2012, 01:35:35 PM
My apologizes that the post is so long, but some of these things from the beginning of the case are no longer to be found...so maybe we need to have it saved here someplace at mods/admins discretion.

Hi-ho.





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 01:43:01 PM
jamcakes this is the entire article that I originally copied, but I see it is no longer on line.


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997



www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf


Thanks Kermit. I was looking for Typology Exercise III, which dealt with laundering money using Aruban Real Estate ventures.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 01:47:09 PM
jamecakes, this is another article I found a long time ago and it may not be available anymore either. It's rather lengthy




This is very interesting.

JUDGE SMID (the Judge who let the suspects free) is part of this
group: the National Colalition for Drug Policy change


Thanks Kermit.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 17, 2012, 03:20:18 PM
jamcakes this is the entire article that I originally copied, but I see it is no longer on line.


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997



www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf






Thanks Kermit. I was looking for Typology Exercise III, which dealt with laundering money using Aruban Real Estate ventures.

Could this be it?

http://www.fiu.gov.tt/content/CFATF_Typologies_Report_2008_English.pdf


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 05:14:51 PM
jamcakes this is the entire article that I originally copied, but I see it is no longer on line.


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997



www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf






Thanks Kermit. I was looking for Typology Exercise III, which dealt with laundering money using Aruban Real Estate ventures.

Could this be it?

http://www.fiu.gov.tt/content/CFATF_Typologies_Report_2008_English.pdf

Thanks Klaas, but that's not it either.  The one I'm looking for was from 1997, dealt transactions.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 05:19:14 PM


Thanks Klaas, but that's not it either.  The one I'm looking for was from 1997, dealt transactions.

Ooops....

s/b The one I'm looking for was from 1997, dealt with Aruba, and the third exercise dealt with money laundering using real estate transactions.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 17, 2012, 06:45:57 PM
jamcakes this is the entire article that I originally copied, but I see it is no longer on line.


Caribbean Financial Action Task Force CFATF Typology Exercise II: Casino Regulatory Conference Aruba - July 16-17, 1997



www.cfatf.org/eng/typoexe/casino/index.pdf






Thanks Kermit. I was looking for Typology Exercise III, which dealt with laundering money using Aruban Real Estate ventures.

Could this be it?

http://www.fiu.gov.tt/content/CFATF_Typologies_Report_2008_English.pdf

Thanks Klaas, but that's not it either.  The one I'm looking for was from 1997, dealt transactions.

I have to run out but see if this is it:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:vvPABWbUSLoJ:www.cfatf-gafic.org/reports-a-documents/doc_download/12-annual-report-1997-1998.html+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESj2VVx3b0x5QjGPsTbdmJXm0SDaHgLtNdBD55KUAMGt6Oc7iS5TkrRjaYhPiaP5_690WUb4-Q5hXOkwiSILMuJXiHn3inKF1I-LSH8_K_1QQsnSTJpRZLFOGBCf-dTw_1CUzLc2&sig=AHIEtbRuTYYVVPJ51y0BXqtzbfe6AN4Kcw&pli=1 (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:vvPABWbUSLoJ:www.cfatf-gafic.org/reports-a-documents/doc_download/12-annual-report-1997-1998.html+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESj2VVx3b0x5QjGPsTbdmJXm0SDaHgLtNdBD55KUAMGt6Oc7iS5TkrRjaYhPiaP5_690WUb4-Q5hXOkwiSILMuJXiHn3inKF1I-LSH8_K_1QQsnSTJpRZLFOGBCf-dTw_1CUzLc2&sig=AHIEtbRuTYYVVPJ51y0BXqtzbfe6AN4Kcw&pli=1)


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: grace-land on June 17, 2012, 10:17:19 PM
Same story as found in the articles from the NL posted above.

Video at link
http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Memphis-teen-Richard-Hinds-confesses-to-Nicola-Furlongs-Tokyo-murder-159239015.html

Memphis teen Richard Hinds confesses to Nicola Furlong’s Tokyo murder
Published Saturday, June 16, 2012, 6:18 AM
Updated Saturday, June 16, 2012, 6:18 AM

Richard Hinds has confessed to the murder of 21-year-old Irish exchange student Nicola Furlong in Tokyo on 24th May.

Richard Hinds (19) from Memphis, Tennessee was arrested on Thursday for strangling the County Wexford student who was on a university exchange in Japan. The American musician insists he did not mean to kill her.

The Japanese police say they believe Hinds killed Furlong when she refused his sexual advances, according to the Jiji Press. The accused said he pressed his hands around her neck but did not mean to kill her.

CCTV footage from the Keio Plaza Hotel, in Shinjuku, shows Hinds wheeling Furlong into his room in a wheelchair. Furlong appears to be unconscious. Police believe her drink may have been spiked. They are currently awaiting toxicology results.

Furlong’s body was found by a hotel employee near the bed in her room. Hinds was found standing close by. Kyodo news agency reported that there were no signs that anyone else had entered the room
 ::snipping2::

Read more: http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Memphis-teen-Richard-Hinds-confesses-to-Nicola-Furlongs-Tokyo-murder-159239015.html#ixzz1y6fLAz5n


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 10:57:31 PM



I have to run out but see if this is it:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:vvPABWbUSLoJ:www.cfatf-gafic.org/reports-a-documents/doc_download/12-annual-report-1997-1998.html+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESj2VVx3b0x5QjGPsTbdmJXm0SDaHgLtNdBD55KUAMGt6Oc7iS5TkrRjaYhPiaP5_690WUb4-Q5hXOkwiSILMuJXiHn3inKF1I-LSH8_K_1QQsnSTJpRZLFOGBCf-dTw_1CUzLc2&sig=AHIEtbRuTYYVVPJ51y0BXqtzbfe6AN4Kcw&pli=1 (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:vvPABWbUSLoJ:www.cfatf-gafic.org/reports-a-documents/doc_download/12-annual-report-1997-1998.html+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESj2VVx3b0x5QjGPsTbdmJXm0SDaHgLtNdBD55KUAMGt6Oc7iS5TkrRjaYhPiaP5_690WUb4-Q5hXOkwiSILMuJXiHn3inKF1I-LSH8_K_1QQsnSTJpRZLFOGBCf-dTw_1CUzLc2&sig=AHIEtbRuTYYVVPJ51y0BXqtzbfe6AN4Kcw&pli=1)

Thanks again, Klaas, but not it either.  Oh well, guess I'll have to do without.  I checked on some other NAH related sites and nada, but found some other interesting info on Smid.  It's unrelated to NAH, but goes to proving Smid's degree of corruption (which we already knew).


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 17, 2012, 11:13:31 PM
My apologies ...... but, jamcakes  -- were you here all along under a different name? You are very well versed in the case!!  ::MonkeyCool::  ::CowboySmiley::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 11:26:29 PM
My apologies ...... but, jamcakes  -- were you here all along under a different name? You are very well versed in the case!!  ::MonkeyCool::  ::CowboySmiley::

I am well versed b/c I've followed the case from the beginning.  I read at many NAH sites through the years, but never joined any b/c I was so busy in my career and personal life.  But things change, and I decided I would like to join SM (the best, imo) prior to Joran's trial in Peru.  And here I am.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 17, 2012, 11:28:15 PM
My apologies ...... but, jamcakes  -- were you here all along under a different name? You are very well versed in the case!!  ::MonkeyCool::  ::CowboySmiley::

I am well versed b/c I've followed the case from the beginning.  I read at many NAH sites through the years, but never joined any b/c I was so busy in my career and personal life.  But things change, and I decided I would like to join SM (the best, imo) prior to Joran's trial in Peru.  And here I am.
Were glad you are here!!!  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: wreck on June 17, 2012, 11:28:48 PM
We're


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 17, 2012, 11:39:26 PM

Were glad you are here!!!  ::MonkeyWink::


Thanks...I'm glad to be here and be welcomed.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 18, 2012, 12:00:06 AM
Oh, and Wreck - thanks for the compliment, saying I'm well versed in the case.  And for thinking that I'm another monkey. (that's a real compliment too)  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 18, 2012, 12:50:20 AM
Jamcakes - if you haven't already, read through this thread:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 18, 2012, 01:24:12 AM
Jamcakes - if you haven't already, read through this thread:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=615.0

Thanks, Klaas.  I skimmed through and saw more evidence of Smid's corruption.  I will go back and read the whole thread more thoroughly.

Here are links to 2 articles regarding rulings by Smid on human trafficking and money laundering.  Apparently, Smid isn't a "tough" judge in regards to either of these issues.

Judge reduces sentences in human trafficking case

http://www.stmaartendivers.com/index.php/Island-News/judge-reduces-sentences-in-human-trafficking-case.html

Woman convicted of money laundering, friend acquitted
  (sentence suspended)
http://aml-cft.blogspot.com/2007/01/woman-convicted-of-money-laundering.html



Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 18, 2012, 05:43:13 PM
Nice to know our gov't is still watching.....

Location       
Continent    :    North America
Country    :    United States  (Facts)
State    :    District of Columbia
City    :    Washington
Lat/Long    :    38.8933, -77.0146 (

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/05/09/amigoe-carnival-takes-aruba-off-their-list-of-destinations-aka-its-not-you-its-me/



even if they do watch their own .....
        [<<]  [>>]
Domain Name       house.gov ? (U.S. Government)
IP Address       143.231.249.# (Information Systems, U.S. House of Representatives)
ISP       Information Systems, U.S. House of Representatives
Location       
Continent    :    North America
Country    :    United States  (Facts)
State    :    District of Columbia
City    :    Washington
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2010/05/25/president-barack-hussein-obama-takes-another-vacation-skips-laying-wreath-at-arlington-national-cemetary-on-memorial-day/





Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Kermit on June 18, 2012, 05:45:29 PM
jamcakes, here is another article for you on Smid



RICK SMID- ARUBA’S DIRTIEST JUDGE
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2007/12/rick-smid-arubas-dirtiest-judge.html


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 19, 2012, 05:55:17 AM
jamcakes, here is another article for you on Smid



RICK SMID- ARUBA’S DIRTIEST JUDGE
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2007/12/rick-smid-arubas-dirtiest-judge.html

Thanks Kermit.

and Aruba said, we will get a fair impartial judge from Curacao......yeah, right....just like the business at the rocks was a young boy found a year earlier.....

Too bad, one country can't sue another country for lying/fraud.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 19, 2012, 09:19:30 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/19/california-superior-court-judge-reported-missing-by-family/#ixzz1yDbeMLpb?test=latestnews (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/19/california-superior-court-judge-reported-missing-by-family/#ixzz1yDbeMLpb?test=latestnews)

California Superior Court judge reported missing by family


Published June 19, 2012

FoxNews.com

LOS ANGELES –  The Los Angeles Police Department is searching for a local Superior Court judge who has not been seen since leaving for work Monday morning.

Police say 71-year-old Linda Kay Lefkowitz was last seen leaving her home in West Los Angeles to go to work in nearby Santa Monica. Her family grew concerned when she failed to return home and they were unable to reach her.

The family says they are extremely concerned because it is very out of character for Lefkowitz to vanish without contacting anyone, according to police.

Lefkowitz's daughter Terri Chapman tells The Associated Press her mom has been taking chemotherapy after being diagnosed with breast cancer and seemed scattered on Sunday. Chapman says her mother does have a cell phone but it isn't turned on.

 ::snipping2::

Not the same judge as in the Kalpoe case but I think the same courthouse




Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 19, 2012, 10:35:59 AM
I agree jamcakes and Ono!   ::MonkeyCool::



Jossy has such kind eyes.    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Ono on June 19, 2012, 10:57:27 AM
My apologizes that the post is so long, but some of these things from the beginning of the case are no longer to be found...so maybe we need to have it saved here someplace at mods/admins discretion.

Hi-ho.






 ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: jamcakes on June 20, 2012, 07:57:05 AM
I wish we would hear something soon on Joran's sentencing appeal, and then on the extradition.

Word has it that Bubba in Alabama is becoming anxious.  ::MonkeyDevil::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 20, 2012, 06:18:45 PM
Natalee Holloway's mother sues National Enquirer


http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2012/06/natalee_holloways_mother_sues.html

BIRMINGHAM, Alabama -- Natalee Holloway's mother today filed a federal lawsuit against the National Enquirer, claiming the publication published "false headlines, articles and statements" about the Mountain Brook teen's 2005 disappearance in Aruba.

In the filing, Beth Holloway also claims the tabloid magazine and its owner, American Media, Inc., invaded her privacy in an attempt to "profit off the tragic and still unresolved disappearance."

"Defendants' conduct in publishing these false statements and accompanying photographs has been so outrageous in character and so extreme in degree, as to go beyond all possible bounds of decency, and is to be regarded as atrocious, and utterly intolerable," the suit continued.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 20, 2012, 06:21:34 PM
I wish we would hear something soon on Joran's sentencing appeal, and then on the extradition.

Word has it that Bubba in Alabama is becoming anxious.  ::MonkeyDevil::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

I wish we'd hear something too! 


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: texasmom on June 20, 2012, 06:22:36 PM
Natalee Holloway's mother sues National Enquirer


http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2012/06/natalee_holloways_mother_sues.html

BIRMINGHAM, Alabama -- Natalee Holloway's mother today filed a federal lawsuit against the National Enquirer, claiming the publication published "false headlines, articles and statements" about the Mountain Brook teen's 2005 disappearance in Aruba.

In the filing, Beth Holloway also claims the tabloid magazine and its owner, American Media, Inc., invaded her privacy in an attempt to "profit off the tragic and still unresolved disappearance."

"Defendants' conduct in publishing these false statements and accompanying photographs has been so outrageous in character and so extreme in degree, as to go beyond all possible bounds of decency, and is to be regarded as atrocious, and utterly intolerable," the suit continued.


Thanks Anna!   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Anna on June 20, 2012, 06:24:47 PM
There is a link in the article that says "Click here to read the filing." but when I click there I get an error message.  If anybody else gets through to it, maybe you could post it as I don't think there are copuright laws about court filings.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Magnolia on June 20, 2012, 07:21:21 PM
There is a link in the article that says "Click here to read the filing." but when I click there I get an error message.  If anybody else gets through to it, maybe you could post it as I don't think there are copuright laws about court filings.

I couldn't access the court filing either, Anna.
But what I read lead me to believe that what she's sueing about is the Steph Watts
story claiming to have the map to Natalee's burial spot in the bird santuary.
That led to the Beth Basing radio show after Steph was in Aruba in the house with
lots of steaks with Tim and Dave.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: klaasend on June 20, 2012, 08:24:43 PM
There is a link in the article that says "Click here to read the filing." but when I click there I get an error message.  If anybody else gets through to it, maybe you could post it as I don't think there are copuright laws about court filings.

Nope it's a bad link and I haven't been able to find a good one yet anywhere.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 20, 2012, 08:32:20 PM
Natalee Holloway's Mother Sues National Enquirer
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. June 21, 2012 (AP)


The mother of Natalee Holloway is suing The National Enquirer, saying the tabloid published untrue stories to profit from her daughter's 2005 disappearance in Aruba.

Beth Holloway said in the lawsuit filed Wednesday that the magazine and its publisher, American Media Inc., published "false headlines, articles and statements" for nearly seven years.

The lawsuit mentions several articles including one that claims Joran van der Sloot had a "secret hand-drawn" map to Holloway's grave.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/natalee-holloways-mother-sues-national-enquirer-16615957


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 20, 2012, 08:32:54 PM
Will Natalee's Father Find Her?
Jun 28, 2010 2:39 AM EDT


<snipped>

Natalee Holloway’s father Dave believes that his daughter’s remains are somewhere in these thick wetlands. Joran van der Sloot, the primary suspect in Holloway’s disappearance, now in jail in Lima, Peru after confessing to the murder of 21-year-old Stephany Flores, drew a map last February, showing exactly where he and the Kalpoe brothers left her body in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005. Van der Sloot drew the map for Jaap Amersz, Holland’s most famous reality television star, who spent months cultivating a close friendship with Van der Sloot, who loved the idea of befriending someone so famous and readily fell for the trap. Amersz then sold the story and the map to the Dutch tabloid Der Telegraaf which refused to run the piece and instead turned the damning information over to Aruban authorities, who chose to ignore it as “fantasy.”

Now Holloway’s father has the map. He is in Aruba with Tim Miller, the head of Equusearch, a private firm based in Texas that specializes in finding missing persons—dead or alive. But the Aruban authorities are prohibiting Holloway from conducting his own private search. Aruban prosecutor Peter Blanken said that the police are worried that Holloway will “jeopardize” their continuing investigation or that evidence might be “contaminated” if it is not collected by the authorities.

<snipped>

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2010/06/28/natalee-holloways-disappearance-and-search-for-her-body.html

s.t.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: Tamikosmom on June 20, 2012, 10:22:54 PM
Natalee Holloway's Mother Sues National Enquirer
BIRMINGHAM, Ala. June 21, 2012 (AP)


The mother of Natalee Holloway is suing The National Enquirer, saying the tabloid published untrue stories to profit from her daughter's 2005 disappearance in Aruba.

Beth Holloway said in the lawsuit filed Wednesday that the magazine and its publisher, American Media Inc., published "false headlines, articles and statements" for nearly seven years.

<snipped>

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/natalee-holloways-mother-sues-national-enquirer-16615957



Two Years of Emotional Distress

Loving Natalee
A Mother's Testament of Hope and Faith
By Beth Holloway with Sunny Tillman

Page 224:
After more than two years of being battered by the tabloids, articles about Natalee still appear in these papers.  What makes me as sick as the anguish and suffering I have endured over these articles is the realization that these magazines and their outrageous stories about Natalee appear all over the world.  I even saw them in stores in Aruba.  Well-meaning individuals who want to express their concerns about these articles send me the tabloids.  But this means that even my home is invaded with these distressing and outlandish materials.  Even in my dining room -- my sanctuary -- I can't escape them.  And to think that mllions and millions of readers worldwide actually believe these stories is more than I can bear.  There seems to be no end to this attack, and the emotional distress felt by my son and me is irreparable.

Page 225: Then there are the bloggers against Natalee and her family who continue to dream up all kinds of bizarre scenarios, like suggesting that she secretly left the island on that medical evacuation plane that was in Aruba for three days when we thought she was going to be brought out of a crack house.  Destructive remarks about my daughter are very hurtful.


Title: Re: Natalee Holloway/Stephany Flores Case Discussion #865
Post by: SuzieQ on June 20, 2012, 10:28:42 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/aruba/116287-om-naar-vs-voor-fbi-overleg-zaak-gardner

ORANGE CITY - The Public Prosecutor (OM) will soon be in the United States with the FBI talking about the case Robyn Gardner. "There is the FBI deported a number of research which we will have," said Chief Peter Blanken the Amigoe. The FBI has questions about the status of the investigation and the results that the OM has been made. The forthcoming visit to the U.S. authorities has nothing to do with the recent requirement of the prime suspect Gary Giordano said the OM. "Coincidentally, the visit of the OM is this together," says spokesperson Ann Angela. Giordano complained to the insurance