Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

A new thread for news and discussions.

PLEASE visit the link below with Tom and Red's WEBLOG for summaries of the information gathered here.

www.scaredmonkeys.com

Please be sure to read the TROLLS announcement. Thank you.

I thought that there was mention of that theory but then he cleared it up by saying it was a different Steve and therefore couldn't play into the overall theory.  I read it earlier and that's what I remember.

Thanks Catriana!

DJ, I know that when I lived on the border with Mexico, as a local, we all just pretty much crossed back and forth with little bother.

Do the people of the three islands move that freely?

I think Dan's speculation about the teeth marks and the  shark area was posted here by other people days ago.  Let's hope that Dan is just a little  behind and this doesn't turn out  to be true.

Right, I can't imagine Dan would use this as part of his possible theory if it was ruled out.  But, was it completely ruled out?

Yes, we spent time on that much earlier.

This is from the theory on his site and I took it to mean that he knows it's a different Steve and you can factor that into the rest of the story:

My interest in the two Croes pictures was this - the small picture is taken from an earlier link to a book review by a not very articulate steve croes - the book was for EMT training.  Who would you call if a woman went under from an accidental or illegal drug over dose? However, it seems to be another steve croes altogether and that fact can be incorporated into this speculative report.

yes i myself used to go to curacao to bonaire on my jetski, also my cousine came in his kayak(but that not to be recomendid ahahah) from curacao to aruba, there are many boates that come and go FREELY

Kpster,

Even if it was Natalee's teeth marks, we would not know until everything is solved because they can't tell us anything.

I don't think peices of foam with teeth marks are "normal" for Aruba therefore, you have to think it's something important.

When I read that again, it seems as if he has the information that it is most likely a different Steve, he is leaving it open for speculation in case it does turn out to be the same Steve.

a light bulb just went off...

Theory:  Father VDS was in the casinos a lot.  Therefore, it would follow that he just may owe someone some money.  How was he planning on paying it bak?  By giving favors from his new Judge position.  Dangerous - but still a plan.  Or maybe he was entrapped by the mafia - sure we'll let you gamble - have fun!  But then once he was in pretty deep, they called in the chips and told him how it was going to go down - he was going to be a bought judge.

Enter NH and son VDS - they slip her a mickey, she gets sick and starts convulsing, they rush to VDS home and ask what to do.  Daddy sees an opportunity...He can pay off his debts and be even with the crime/casino lords by offering this virgin sacrifice.

He tells the boys the story they should tell, then he hides NH away somewhere.

THEN, he is called in Yesterday Afternoon for questioning.  The crime/casino lard knows this and also has been made aware of, or has already accepted NH as payment for his debts.  He (crime lord) believes VDS (father) may give him up so he has guy decapitated, as a warning to VDS (father) and also gets rid of the driver who delivered NH to him so he can't talk either.

As far as the media saying that the decaitation has no relationship to the NH case - hogwash!  Remember:  Aruba doesn't have any crime.  It cannot "just be a coincidence" that the murder happened on Saturday afternoon just as VDS was taken in for questioning

I found that infromation and sent it to Dan. He did not have time to write about it because of his trip and interview. That would be why it's now being posted.

I have the scan of the newspaper in Aruba it was front page on.

Just read the interview with DASH - at the very end she refers to the group's bus driver in Aruba acting as their unofficial tour guide - he encouraged them to go to C&C - I hope they interviewed him - my experience with bus drivers on tours has been that they know absolutely everything that is going on - who is interacting with whom - usually you aren't directed to someplace - even as much of a tourist magnet as C&C - without the driver being on the take a bit, setting it up in advance.

Focusing way to much on the van der sloots. The brothers, have more motive and more to gain in this situation.

Think of it this way, Joran doesn't have to work to get what he has but the brothers do. In a late night, early morning FOX interview it was finally said that Deepak had been working extra hours etc to save up to go to college in Florida. Seems these brothers, either don't come from money or somehow don't have a lot of help from their faimly which is interesting and leads me back to why is his family NOT there now?

Side note.. Deepak's "female friend" was on FOX last night, he would NOT say he was innocent. I found that VERY interesting.

I think his mom sells food--sounds like a catering business run from home--that is what someone said way earlier.

I had the same thought the first time I heard her say that. It made me wonder if he wasn't one of the people who led the parents to Joran in the first place (they talked to taxi drivers, etc.)  I imagine if he had any real knowledge, they would have brought him in for questioning.

So DJ, a local with a boat going to another island for the day, especially in that first day before much of an issue, would not get much of a look?

Uhhhhhh, I'm not following you here. From all reports these brothers come from a financially secure family.  I know lots of families with money whose kids work and save money.  How do you know his parents aren't there?  I've never heard that.  Perhaps they are understated and private people?

I just keep going back to Law 101, who benefits from the crime. Who has the most to gain.

I have to lean to two brothers who are having to work their butts off to get things but yet they hang out with well to do kids who have everything. The brothers seem to bring the shady friends into the picture, which would make sense being as they seem to "try" to fit in with the "in crowd of popular well-to-do" younger kids in Aruba.

'understated and private' usually doesn't get a pass from FOX and CNN

I think they said mom sold suriname food to a hospital and that thees is a step dad.

You're taking quite a few leaps there.  Shady friends?  Which shady friends?  More to gain?  Sexually? Financially?  In crowd?  Rich friends?  Joran's not rich...but middle class. How do we know the brothers are poor?

Is there a transcript of that interview?  I missed it.

Nancy I haven't heard anything about their parents. Been asking those questions about them for weeks. I do know it to be "different" being they are from Suriname, for parents to have their kids working. Generally the culture I have seen the parents have their children focus on education and make sure they continue it and get a career.

I don't know but I just think the brothers have their hands just as dirty if not more than Joran.

Fox is reporting that VDS  parents just left the police station.

Parents left police station out the back door.  Were in there a couple of hours.

Annie, not sure let me look. It was on about 1am Pacific time. TTownMike and I were watching it.

Posted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 12:46 am    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Another K in Texas wrote:
I keep wishing we knew more for sure about the brothers.

Are they tied at all to the man of the same name who owns Suriname Airlines. It could be a uncle or something if not a parent.

I ask because the internet shows a connection to Air Holland and that has a major connection to international drug smuggling. We think of getting her off the island in a boat, but would not an airliner do as well?

Plus I find it strange that with all the focus on Nats two sets of parents and the VDS parents, the parents of these two stay a mystery.



No NO NO..i found out today that the Kalpoe brothers the motehr has a "take away" at her home with surinamse food and she delivers typical surinam food for the hospital cafeteria also..they live w/. their step father and he works their also (that wasnt confirmed) and the older brother works at the Cyber cafe at seaport and goes to night school ant the younger Kalpoe goes to school

Hey everyone, been a little busy to day.

Happy Father's day to all the dad's out there.

Just a reminder, not sure if it was posted, Dash did an interview with us, part 1, can be seen here, ... http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1160
Interview With Our Own “DASH” on Aruba trip and Natalee Holloway, Part I

TTownMike, I think thats why she wasn't on much yesterday ... doing some homework.

Will be on off and on.

Here is a thought...  Croes was questioned one evening then...next morning house raided and arrested.  He originally went the to police station volutarily the night before his arrest.

Perhaps he told the police that he knew some stuff...but that he needed the police to arrest him to ensure his safety.

Happy Father's Day, Red.  It was posted. Read the interview. Nice to have it out front for the folks who are new to the site.  :lol:

Dad owns a rental car business.

so is anything known about the partially headless guy, and the missing guy?

You know, I've wondered too if all 4 men are being held as suspects or if some of them aren't actually being protected.

Or obstruction of justice.

Red, Happy Fathers Day to you and Tom!  :D

Cancunmole,

You're right. I was looking at hotels farther down the strip. But also wouldn't it depend on what road you took back to the hotels, the one along the beach or the one more inland which passes near Noord? Do you have a choice of the two roads from CnC?

I'm not sure it's been established that he went to the police station of his own volition. It has been reported both ways -- one way makes it sound like he suddenly decided he might have info and went to the police station, the other makes it sound like they showed up and asked him to come with them to answer some questions . . . which he did, voluntarily.
Oops -- left off the rest of this thought.
So maybe he told them things that they knew to be false, which would be why they arrested him the next morning.

She teaches at the International School where Joran went.

I had heard that the police called him and he came down volutarily that night...questioned and released.  Next morning arrested at 6AM.

Kerina nd TTownMike sorry I missed your PMs! I answered them!  :lol:

that's Jorans mom

The brother's mom?  That is who we are talking about.

I thought that was Joran's mom?  The brother's mother also taught at the school?

Hey Guys, What was the thing about the insurance policy? I went back some pages to read it and I got locked out.
Thanks

Anything new on the 'high level meeting' that was being held today - and was it in the police station - would the VDS parents be in on it?

Joran's mom is a teacher at the International School

Kalpoe's mom sells food

Nancy

Croes is Deepaks friend.. looks shady. Ax boy is really looking shady. The picture they had pictures with before  their sites had pictures mysteriously removed were shady. "Female friend" on FOX late last nite being interviewed..shady looking and that's the nicest thing I can say about her. She looked like a poster-child for herion use.

I did have a chance to look through over 450 plus pictures of Joran and his group of friends. Didn't really see anyone that didn't look like an "all american kid" at all.

Just an observation. I just think people need to look at all involved not just keep putting Joran under fire.

Any info on the right Max.  Whose friend is he?

Please don't misinterpret this, but has anyone else wondered about FOX news coverage of Nat's disappearance?  While we feel the case is quite deserving of tons of coverage, I know that major television stations count air time in dollars--big dollars.  FOX has spent an enormous amount of time re-running the same show and clips over the past week or more.  Every night this week, I've seen O'Reilly at least twice--same hour show--and then Hannity and Coombs runs the same show, repeating the clips.  While the other networks cover the story in a two or three minute update segment once or twice a day, FOX is spending hours and big bucks.  What bothers me is that they are the only network doing this.  If it were a news story that brought in advertising dollars, all the stations would be on it like flies on honey.  I can't help wonder if Nat's family or our own government have managed to purchase this much news time and, if so, why?  It just seems odd to me and I can't think of another situation that has had so much one-network coverage.  Someone please tell me I'm wrong--or why.

just two rumours weird things I heard yesterday, I'm reviewing the forum starting from most recent and catching up on yesterday's posts so forgive me if this is old news

someone from my hometown was telling me they heard that Natalee had been corresponding with Joran by email BEFORE the trip to Aruba which explained her trust level, anyone hear anything like that?  the person told me that some of her friends were reporting this

and one of the editors of Diario was on Fox News last night and he seemed to be saying they had a lead that Natalie was alive, being held hostage by some Venezuelans, now it looks like Diario has alleged some false leads already but I thought it jived with the information the blogger that alleges their brother is in FBI that they think this will have a good outcome????

Dutch site was listing some of the outrageous speculations they had heard -- including one that Nat's parents had a $5million insurance policy on her. Bogus stuff.

Afternoon Monkeys!!!! I have been grocery shopping with my 2 year old...ughhhhh..whats new, and what is this I hear about teeth marks?????

:::woondering if we all posted our pics on here, how many would be deemed "shady looking":::

(just kidding Cali!!!)

Why would they look "all-america"? They are teenagers in aruba and some them party long hours.

AZ lady I agree with you, Fox is really stretching this

I tune into Fox yesterday and today and they say we have breaking news that another suspect has been arrested so I figure oh they've got a fifth person and then they report on the 4th suspect,

HELLO THAT IS NOT BREAKING NEWS..........THAT IS OLD NEWS.....

I know, even following most of the links from Joran's site you just get fun loving, partying, kids who seem to have a zest for living.  But none of them look dangerous at all.


Before someone says this is racial--his friends are widely diverse.  Few looked Dutch.

When you go to the brother's site there are a couple of rough looking characters.

LMAO Kerin!

::wonders if Kerin has an axe:: JK LMAO Hmmm

After Dan posted the EMT/Amazon theory yeterday I warned him the EMT Steve is a different guy. Emanonsc Steve's Zorpia website has a very different picture.   One of his friends from the site, Roel, also posted that he is not the guy under arrest but one of the Red Cross people involved in the search.  Dan chose to ignore these and other posters on his site who agreed they are not the same guy.  Here is this Steve's website.  Look at the picture and post your opinion.   I have asked Roel to post here too.  We are in touch.  

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:SCchOeSdilUJ:216.55.182.166/emanonsc+%22Steve+Croes%22&hl=en

Ditto, ditto, ditto. We need more on the Kalpoe brothers.

Word in the industry is that Fox has had little to no trouble since last weekend with access in Aruba. They were the only network who took a hit from the Arubians by name for reporting what was eventually retracted. Looks like negotions after that ordeal gave Fox access, cnn and msnbc did not recieve.

To your first point, I believe her friends who visit here discounted this claim.

To your second point, apparently there was some bizarre story on Fox last night in which the Diario editor or reporter was claiming they were following a car/van with Natalee in it. The story was not repeated and nothing more has been mentioned, to my knowledge.

When I use the word "all american" I mean a somewhat cleancut looking like most kids today running around in the US.. but then again I am in SoCal what I deem to be "all american" normal may not be what the rest of the US views as such.

No axe...just a few big knives
(think Lorena Bobbitt)  :twisted:

Fortunately, in our country, and I hope Aruba, you can't be convicted for looking "shady".  In addition, I wouldn't expect any of them to look "All American"...they're NOT American!

I just found the following post from Friday evening from a mother who knows the brothers.  I found it a very loving and honest post.

ad mom



Joined: 17 Jun 2005
Posts: 1
Location: Aruba
   
PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:04 pm    Post subject:    Reply with quote

Like most Arubians (whether native or not) I feel very sad, concerned etc. about the disappearance of Natalee H. I wish her family and friends all the strength and support they need right now and in the future.

At this moment I'm not thinking about the consequences for Aruba's economy. We'll deal with that, for whatever the media suggests: Aruba is a very safe place to live. As I've lived in many different countries I do have some experience!

As for the three boys: I've never met J. van der Sloot, but I do know the "two brothers" as they're often referred to. Those two boys wouldn't heart a fly as far as I'm concerned. I know this sounds naive, because you never know, not even about your own children!
That's why I also wish the families of the suspects all the strength and support they need right now.
As Natalee's mom said: Natalee is everybody's daughter; I want to add: each of those boys could be everybody's son!
They went out to have a good time like most teenagers do.

I hope and pray that Natalee will be found alive and as a lot of people on the island do: we'll continue to keep our eyse open wherever we go and help searching for her.

When indeed "something bad happened to her", we expect the people who are responsable will be punished accordingly.

I totally agree Caligirl - I think way to much empahsis is being put on the van der sloot family and Joran - case in point when Cruese was brought in for the first 12 hrs or so all the media said he was a friend of Joran's - in fact he was the Calpoe brothers friend - and I still have not heard that emphasized at all. These two brothers would have more muscle to have taken care of a body or whatever than Joran alone on the Marriott beach area. And who knows maybe it is none of these 3 - maybe that is why there is no more leads because they know no more. I remember thinking what Greta van Sustern said the other nite about all the shady characters she found in the Holiday Inn casino - and she hoped the police were looking not just in one direction with this case.

I would surely think that if the foam etc was relevant they would have DNA tests back by now.  Course they may not tell us!

HEY Y'ALL, WAIT TH F___ UP!

Imperative...

I've been following this story and through the peoples last names I've been able to piece together a series of events...

Catrina please do not delete from here people need to see this..

As the heading of this post says 'rumors' of breaking news...

here is what I beleive to have happened...

you better sit down if you have weak legs, cause this one's gonna knock you down...(everythings hitting the fan now)
people of aruba take cover

these kids the 3 joran, surinamese brothers that are in jail
are in "protective custody" they are being moved to the prison
I believe that they have threats on their life if they talk

they got in some trouble with drug dealers..
they 'owed' them they couldn't pay it back they said
'you gotta give us 'somethin' "

if you don't we'll kill one of you

I think it's one of the surnimese brothers
Joran is protecting his 'friend'
the guy that got decapitated is a 'message' sent

the drive by at the hotel.
not sure
but related I think
I need more help to piece the last part together
for a location

Is/was there anybody named 'king' last name whatever
related to this case?????
 
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/Discussion/viewtopic.php?t=22

Why do you think the "Diario Editor's" story was immediately cut off and not mentioned again?

We have ample sources on the voluntary appearance, CNN, his uncle, his employer, MSNBC .  he went in weds night and was arrested friday morning.  I guess I remember too much to remain sane on this site.   So much wheel reinventing ....    

Is this just a language difference thing, or does she know nothing bad has happened to Natalee, yet?

[/quote]

I have said all along and I will stand by, Joran had some part in it but his status is the perfect patsy to involve. His father is someone well known. Who better than to involve in a crime and have leverage to keep the crime quiet.

Plus, dead bodies and missing people, shootings and such are coming about.

thanks chloe

and one last point to clarify

the father had been granted to access to his son and then it was overturned, I believe,

did the father appeal that decision or do I take it the position of the Arubian authorities as of now is not to let the father see his son Joran

I find that very very interesting, that the prosecution is quite adamant that Paul Van Der Sloot not have access to his son, I think it is about more than just the appearance of "propriety"

Fox has not rereported the decapition or the Dario reporter story. They may have been told not to and then given more access to the head of police during the Sloots questioning last night and today.

Could have been false. We already know from the Black & White article that the 'editor of the local newspaper' set up the Twittys with a lead to a ransom drug/deal that was unrelated to Natalee. Not sure which 'local newspaper' it was, but this new knowledge makes me skeptical of these leads being reported.

Michael22 - this could very well be the case! Interesting theory - I wonder why none of the Fox, MSNBC or CNN news have mentioned anything about any of the other horrific things supposedly going on on Aruba right now??!!

I believe Natalee will be found soon.  There is just too much going on and too many people coming out for someone not to tell the legitimate story of what happened.

So, because FOX retracted the misinformation, they now have access where the other stations do not?  Do I understand that correctly?  Does this imply that the other stations are not welcome on the island or in reporting on this case?  I find that hard to believe.  This still doesn't explain, however, the amount of airtime given to the story and the repetitive stories that seem to just be aired to keep the story in the news.  I still wonder if someone with a great deal of influence/money is working with FOX to keep this in the public eye for a while longer.  Perhaps the DEA/FBI or perhaps her parents, and for their own reasons.  I'm glad of the coverage, and just wondering if it is a spotlight that is much needed to expose a more complex situation than we first imagined.  Or maybe to allow the investigators to work away from the spotlight to bring her home.

Iquitos,

Roel is on Axe guy's Tickle list of friends.

Axe guy's Tickle page:
http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=eKVs3MVT3lDV3wPJ

Roel's Tickle page:
http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=UQoij.UPBU5mllra
(with Red Cross uniform pic)

I realize the island is small...but these guys seem to be related through the same circle of friends.

Care to give us some insight, Roel? :)

Or,

Police questioned Croes and released him (boss said he was late for work that day) because they wanted to see where he went and who he called (remember they're checking phone logs). Then they arrested him. So maybe the calls he made or visits led them to other places/people.

I don't doubt it!  Papa, "influential father", "BIG FISH"?!

By the bye Deep',  saw you on TV.  Not bad for 91 yrs old!  :P

As much as people have become "haters" or what not as Joran and his family, as a mother, I think and reply of one. He's still a human, a person, someone's beloved son. Of course as a parent you are going to love your child no matter what. I do and will always for my daughter.

Natalee if the biggest victim but everyone is making more victims. Their families. They have feelings and children they have lost at the moment. I am not sticking up for them but just making a point. I would be heartbroken to hold a position that withheld me from seeing my son. I see nothing wrong or out of the ordinary that his father wants to see his oldest son!

Fox news did report the decapition story last night

Fox has no access that is not available to other news outlets. It's simply that they're spending more time on it, though I think it's not as disproportinate as the previous poster thinks it is.

I don't think that the extra attention was "bought," by the government. If they are able to "buy" the attention on Fox, they can certainly buy it on CNN, etc. I don't think Natalee's family is so incredibly wealthy that they can buy as much coverage as Fox is giving to this, either.

The explanation is that Fox is simply more sensationalistic than most of the other major news outlets. This is nothing new. Most of the posters in here have already noticed and commented on it. They spend a lot of their time trying to exploit interest in the case, promising new information when you tune in. When you do tune in, however, it's just a rehash of old news most of the time.

Fox News did report on the decapitaion last night.

First the other networks are not reporting from the island. Fox is. 2nd. The Govt blasted Fox in the press last weekend. Then geraldo heads down. Then fox gets the PM and everyother govt rep all week long on every primetime show they have.

Your wonder is a good possibilty. Alabama, Mountain Brook Red state and on and on. Look for Fox on Monday night to have some combination of Hannety, Greta, Bill in Mountain Brook

one of  own theories is the boys may have innocently taken Natalee to what they were calling an underground party and that some drug dealer or criminal type decided they wanted Natalee, whether to settle a debt or just because the guy wanted her, they are afraid to testify because they've been told they are dead or worse, they will their families if they say anything

on the other hand if the cops had all their phones tapped since the first night, it would seem the boys would have mentioned this at least once

another version of the theory might be the boys participated in a gang bang where poor Natalee was the victim, there may be a videotape, again some drug dealer or gangster type is holding Natalee and using the videotape as blackmail along with the other threats to keep their mouths shut....

Has anybdy checked to see if Natalee has a Tickel account in her name?

From interview I read prev.' Beth insinuated the taxi driver may have known where he lived and told her!

They have not RE Reported it. It was on once at 8:15pm EST.

I posted this two hours agao:

Here's some cold, hard logic about Paulus Van der Sloot.

We know that he has helped his son "lawyer-up." Thus, we know that he isn't telling his son to come clean with what he knows about the disappearance of NH.

That leads to three possibilities:

1. He knows that NH is dead, and he is just trying to help his son beat the rap.

2. He knows his son is innocent. (Not credible. Because then there would be no reason to stonewall, or to give false stories and then to change them.)

3. He believes that NH is still alive, but he doesn't care if she is ever found.

But now I am adding alternative #4.

4. He was involved in a cover-up, or in the disposal of evidence, and so he is not just protecting his son's skin, but his own as well.

Take your pick. But under NONE of these scenarios does he come out as a loving father, driven solely by honorable motives. So, we can put that notion to bed for good.

Hey- any word from Arubagirl-  I'll bet she discoverd some more info last night

But Cali dear, I think the three amigos were and still are all in this thing tigether.  Whatever it turns out to be!

I also think many people do not realize the close association the media networks have with government and governmental agencies.  Media is a powerful force, and those who govern have known this for a very long time.

There was a press release from the prosecutor that he was arrested.   His uncle told cnn the same thing that they came to the house early am and got him.  His employer on camera said he went in on wedsvoluntarily  to talk and did not show for work on Friday.  I think that is enough to believe this.  

the reason why aruba wasn't talking they didn't want to advertise they're drug problem

the reason the kids aren't talking..they fear for their life
if they get out they'll be killed.??

the reason the fbi/investigators aren't talking they dont' want the people who have Natalee know that they know.....

Most definately Mike! I can not argue with you there!

BH is right they know what happened, we all know they are guilty in that area. Problem is finding out wtf happened, and what degree they were involved. I truly believe this goes beyong the 3. I believe they are the starting point but not the ending point because Natalee has to be alive.

I said negotiation, not bought not money. Possible please present us in a fair and balanced light to the american people, Etc. (Not saying that is what fox does. Just what the gov't wanted.)

If the PM and others only go on fox that would be access the others wouldn't have.

Even though we don't find their news to be NEW news. For the majority of the population Fox is all over this and breaking new stuff 2 to 3 times a day. For MSM that is a ton.

Wouldn't you 'lawyer up' if your son was in jail?  Honestly, I don't think we can try and convict the parents in one fell swoop as you clearly want to do. We really don't know anything.

Also, don't forget: Under Dutch law, none of the officials is allowed to give out much information. A guilty suspect might well walk if they talk about the evidence against him.

AGAIN, Professor, you don't know these things are FACT.  I would agree the intense focus on Joran, his family, etc. TENDS to make us ASSUME he is in this big time.

BUT, you really don't know any of this stuff is true!  Even if I knew my kid was guilty I would sure as hell make sure he had a lawyer!  I would want to make damn sure he had a fair trial, etc.  Especially on an island where the pressure to solve this crime is huge.  And, given the security guard examples I'd be very worried about a fair prosecution!

Making sure your kid has a lawyer is not a sign of guilt.

Because the authorities don't want the kidnappers to know they are on to them. That's the reason for this whole news black out. :shock:

Suriname Airlines????  Are you speculating here or do you know of this connection? And, I don't see it as easy to take a kidnapped girl out of cntry on "airliner"!

I believe the brothers dropped Natalie and Joran off near the Marriot.  Something happened there and Joran called the 26 year old for help.  They took Natalie to Joran's apartment.  Dad helped to dispose of Natalee and sent Joran off while he did it so that Joran would have no info if questioned.

Professor, I am leaning more towards your 4th options there as far as the father.

Arubagirl said she was going to volunteer at the Donkey place today and had to get up early.  Maybe she'll log on later today.

Absolutely - the first thing anyone - most especially a 17 year old should do is Lawyer UP!!! No one should ever talk to the police without a lawyer - this would be the dumbest most stupid thing anyone could ever do.  Also the fact that there is no plea bargaining in Aruba could certainly be causing a huge problem

And this is splittered gov't at best. Arubian and Dutch.

Fox only seems to have REAL access to the Arubian piece.

i saw this on riehl world view



Posted on "The Troubling Puzzle" blog:

I'm in Mountain Brook and from the people who have recently returned from Aruba is that Van der Sloot's dad was seen at a McDonald's at 3 a.m. the night Natalee disappeared.

I don't think this has been reported in the mainstream media so hopefully this will help those of of you who are following this closely. This is my first post here and I'm posting something I think all of you might find significant.

Natalee goes missing at about 1 to 1:30 a.m. and the Van der Sloot's dad is seen at a McDonalds at 3a.m. I assume the dad has a job and would have to be at work the next day. There to me it is very suspicious.......

Posted by: samthebam | June 19, 2005 03:35 PM

interesting might explain why dad is being questioned

Thanks- look forward to hearing what she has heard-

You talkin  bout me??

That has been dismissed as not the same person (who owns dealership)!

But "lawyer up" is a little different in Aruba.  That lawyer can't help you during interrogation because he's not allowed to be in there.  All he could possibly do is to tell his client not to talk.  But sometimes that could be very difficult for a young man being interrogated for hours on end.  Much easier for the father, I'm sure, with experience in the system.

Agreed--the amount of coverage FOX is giving this is, for MSM, a ton!  That's what makes me wonder about it.  The people who run these networks have a bottom line and they seldom miss coming out in the black.  They cover stories like this for a reason--to make a profit.  That's why they are so competetive and always together at really big stories.  I am not insinuating that someone bought air time with dollars.  I'm talking about negotiations -- one hand washes the other.  Do us this favor now, and we'll owe you one.  I'm wondering why such a big favor of all this airtime was given in this case.  Someone important is involved, no doubt.  We may never know who.

Amen Chloe! I would do it for my child! Parents natural instinct is to protect their children.

That is TOTAL BS, go read the Black & White article!  This guy is a freak looking to sell papers!  Believe me, there is NO media outlet willing to engage in a "news blackout" !!!   Media and Journalists don't engage in such things...only rarely in war and such where there's International security at stake..and even then it's very, very, rare!

The guy is a freak, he's played games with the family in the past...and he's trying to do it with the public now.

ROFLMAO!!  <<visual of unkempt women, unshaven men in days-old pjs sitting here now after countless hours glued to SM forum>>

Me too! I wish Dash were here, she might be able to confirm.

Presumably, if true, his would have been after the confrontation with the Twitty's...and after Joran drove back to the HI with the parents [not necessarily in same car] to show them where he dropped Nat off

They called him and he went in.  Neaxt day they went and got him!

As for the "car chase" reported by Hubart Teal (Thiel) of DiarioAruba on Fox last night, we have heard nothing so far. For an island that is 6 miles wide and 20 miles long, that is one looooooooooong car chase. In any case, they ought to be about running out of gas by now. Don't you think?

And please, don't try to convince me that they're keeping it under wraps today, so as not to endanger NH. If they were in "hot pursuit" 12 hours ago, there would be a shootout by now, or an arrest, or some other resolution.

I thought dad and little brother were in the "homeland" when this took place and only got back the day the boys were actually questioned.  I could be wrong here, but I thought that had been established early on.

I want to add a scenario #5 here:

5. He believes Natalee is alive, but has some inkling or understanding of who has her and what they can do... and he knows that Joran is somewhat mixed up mixed up in the mess, so to protect his son, he wants it all kept quiet.

LMAO Georgia!! True true! Don't forget eyes bugging out from reading so much!

Well, an arrangement like that makes more sense, but I can't see how Fox is holding up its end of the deal, if there is such a thing.

Fox is constantly bringing in legal and law enforcement experts to talk about what a disaster the investigation is. If your deal with the Aruban goverment is true at all, look for a complete dearth of government officials on Fox. All the other cable news outlets (Headline News and MSNBC, particularly) are doing the same thing, and reaching the same conclusions about how the investigation is going.

A far more likely explanation is that the Aruban government people are making themsevles available to whomever will give them time.

Only Fox has persisted in bringing them on to say absolutely nothing. CNN has gotten tired of this game and moved on, therefore no Aruban politicos on CNN. No conspiracy, just the way the media works.

Does anyone know if Joran's dad has a job that keeps him out till the wee hours or one that takes him to work in the early hours?  This seems to be an odd coincidence to me.

lol.  I don't even remember what color my hair is.  Or even what it looks like with a brush run through it!   :shock:

This fox coverage mirrors their coverage of Wilbanks and Hacking.

Hey, can anyone send me a link, or tell me what the deal is with the "teeth marks"? I missed something somewhere I think....

SB I agree with your #5. I think he came home and told his father what happened and the fact that Joran wasn't sent away by his father (I mean his father had more than ample time to send him to another country and really stall the investigation) makes me believe Jorans had part but there was someone bigger in the picture.

If the casinos were open, he just could have been stopping for coffee and food on the way home.  

Do they open on Sunday?

http://www.riehlworldview.com/

Scuse me Mayam!  I jes don lack de looka dat guy!

Thanks Caligirl youre awesome!

Re: Max Arends vs. Maxito Arendsz. Not buying that it's two different people. Website for Max has links to same circle of friends, seems to be another 50Cent aficionado. Same school...

For what it's worth, I've seen Dutch patronymics like Arends, Barends, Pieters, etc., spelled with the extra z in references to the same individuals in historical documents from New Amsterdam (New York). And Maxito is just a diminutive for Max.

Someone may be trying to protect a friend...and have a little fun at our expense.

I think maybe Fox is trying to help out by keeping this in the news and going down other leads ( as the three kids) , maybe  they have info about the Kidnapping, and have been asked to keep quiet.
The Reporter did not even seem surprised and did not even question the Diario guy. It was if someone was in her ear shouting "cut....cut"

Welcome Nikki. Just trying to do my part!

I posted this already on Riehlworld.

McDonald's closes here at 1am.

The casinos here are open 24/7 and I know that Excelsior is for sure (used to work there a few years back. )

Did ya'll read on Dan's site that the Twitty/Holloway's went to Joran's house and the dad sent them to the casino to find Joran?  Seems like I read this and then I read somewhere that this happend at 6:30 in the morning.  What would a kid be doing at a casino this early in the morning--and a Monday morning at that.

I feel FOX just feels there is big news here and them udder ppl jes don git it! Knowwhudamean?

What school is Max(ito) Arends going to?

No, Juvenal.  I mean a negotiated agreement with the AMERICAN government agencies--the FBI and DEA.  For some reason, I think the FBI and DEA want this case spotlighted and held in the public's eye.  They want FOX to keep reporting, even when there is no new news.  I think the Aruban government is simply an easy target for criticism.  When there is no news, then criticize what is going on.  That's their modus operandi.  I think the American government and investigative agencies want what is happening in Aruba to stay in the spotlight.  I find this odd because the FBI and DEA generally work outside the spotlight.

All of you guys know you have done this sometime or another. You ask someone a question that you already KNOW the answer to, in order to make them THINK you don't know the answer, and to confirm or fill in the blanks of your knowledge.

Ponder that inr relation to Beth AND the authorities here.

To Nancy Drew: Lawyering up is not a sign of guilt, but we have every reason to believe that JVDS is stonewalling, at this point. After all, this is day 18 and still no Natalee. I understant that there is no such thing as a plea bargain under the Dutch system of justice, but there is such a thing as showing a "good faith" effort to aid the investigation. If Natalee were alive, or if there was any possibility of finding her alive, then this stonewalling would be beneath contempt.

aruban law is largely civil with some common law and if you don't think media engage in blackouts you are mistaken. in the UK (a common law country) they have what are called D notices. the gov't slaps them on for all sorts of things patents, news stories, information in general. don't kid yourself.

the embedded reporters are under restriction, does anyone seriously believe that if there is a credible possibility of finding natalee alive some idiot journalist will jeapordize her safety  -- well the standards at FOX are pretty low, but even they wouldn't stoop that far into the gutter.

Same as Jorans. They were both on the honour roll from a school newsletter I found online. I'll post the link here when I find it.

link to html version of the ISA newsletter that features both Max and Joran (http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:8FoKGuoTsB8J:www.isaruba.com/breeze/documents/BreezeApril292005.pdf+%22Max+Arends%22+Aruba&hl=en&client=firefox-a)

You got it.  The Roel I am corresponding with is indeed named Roel Gomez.  The Roel on Steves website is RoelJamil and I cant get at his picture or Zorpia site.  I did goofle him and he is ems too.  no picture.  Is the tickle Roel the same as the Zorpia Roel friend of Steve Croes, the one who is not under arrest?  Did you look at the site link i sent?

lol well, you can see me at the local drive thru's that are open all night. I have must feed my late night cravings! lol

Since I believe his judicial status would possibly be like an attorney.. 3am and McD's isn't really out of the ordinary. They keep odd hours reading, briefing, studying.

NO!  Beth was asked that and said no way!

I haven't really been following too closely the past couple days. I heard before that Joran and dad tried to leave the country some time between Natalee's disappearance and Joran's arrest.

Is there any truth to that story, or has it been definitively debunked?

Oh yeah--I get it.  The thing is that TV networks don't spend this much money on no news.  And the other networks don't see the news.  So, how come FOX sees something the others don't?  Someone show them?

HEY! I RESEMBLE THAT REMARK! QUIT IT!

Agreed and many of the correspondants fox is using currently in aruba are in the aruba local media. Similar D notices being broken by them in this case would finish their careers.

I'm so sick of this whole situation I could vomit. It's too freakin ridiculous and upsetting. I can't even read blogs or watch the news or posts anymore or anything... it's so frustrating and needlessly so.

I was watching on Fox this afternoon and the anchor (not sure which one it was) was interviewing someone who I guess was a detective or cop or something from here in the states and they were literally laughing at the way the situation is handled down there right now and how the FBI  isn't allowed to do their part.

Complete b.s.  I feel sooo incredibly bad for Beth Twitty.

I still think torture interrogation would be my method of discussion. LOL

We're reading the same book, just not sure of the page. But I would "bet the farm" on the Diario's info.

I believe that innocent people have very good reasons to "lawyer up".  The two security guards who were questioned needed lawyers to make legal notions on their behalf.  Court proceedings are bewildering, a lawyer can break things down for you and advise you.

We're reading the same book, just not sure if  we are on the same page. But I would "bet the farm" on the Diario's info.

How many McDonald's are on Aruba and where are they located?  Could someone have used their dumpsters?

Thanks again for all your information, arubagirl.

Someone please answer this, did Natalee's parents go to the Sloots home at 6:30 on Monday morning but were told that Joran could be found in the casino.

Round where I come from we call that "zest" alkeehol!  :oops:  Just saying!

Naresh Kalpoe from Surinam Airlines, not related to Kalpor bros. as reported yesterday in Scaredmonkeys.

Hey Arubagirl! You back from donkey duty already?
Do you have any news/clarifications about all the strangeness we heard last night - the decapitated guy, the drive by shooting, the missing man?

Any local news you can share?

Thanks

Find out of Father VDS knew the decapitated guy or the brothers and you will have solved the mystery

ChytownEd,

According to a woman on webleuths, the Max Arends they are talking about is indeed another by the name of 'Maxito Arendsz". And is 'Max Arends' her little brother who is a classmate of Joran but he has nothing to do with it !

It is quite possible that Fox is going after the demographic's here, think about it, CNN is a southern company (Atlanta), and by Fox giving so much coverage to this story, I am sure they are gaining viewers (me for one), especially in the South.

Iquitos,

the Roel pictured on Zorpia is the same Roel on the Tickle site I linked. Same exact picture of him features in both pages. Jamil is likely his middle name.

Not the same!  There are 2 pics of the detainee avaiable round here sommers!

To clarify, the FBI spokesperson has made several statements that they are observing, not because Aruba won't let them help but because Aruba asked them to come there and help them. The FBI has helped. They were on the scene helping with the evidence collection because Aruba does not have experience in collecting evidence.

There is one McDonald's in the Renaissance Mall (sp?), it is walking distance from Carlos & Charlie's.
The other McDonald's is in the high rise hotel area. You'd have to walk towards the Hyatt, cross the street there and walk till the end of the next street. It's a bit far to walk from Holiday Inn, but it's very possible.
I'm not sure if there is a McDonald's in San Nicolaas or not.

Shoot, I'd lawyer up if I was one of those security guards... here in the states we call that defamation of character, slander, and unlawful arrest... civil suits rock!  :lol:

if he works in the 'judicial system'
then it's their hours (day I would imagine)

If you watch Fox News,,,they always spend lots of time on stories that the public is interested in..that is why their ratings are so high..they will stay on a story. Also, at night after Greta,,they have reruns....FYI

2 Mcdonalds on Aruba.

Anything new from the radio today?

Amy, I saw that. They should'vementioned that we have no other choice than to let the Arubans handle this and that the FBI can only get involved when they are specifically asked to.

But from a purely law-enforcement standpoint, there have been way too many foul ups in this case which may well keep it from being solved, and I think both the guest and the anchor were fair about it. And I didn't see them laugh.

here's a very telling statement from FRIDAY'S interview between Greta and NH's stepdad:

VAN SUSTEREN: What did you think of when you saw other missing young women and men in this country, their parents on TV? Did you understand the agony that now you and Beth are going through? I mean, can you in any way...
GEORGE "JUG" TWITTY: No, I did not. Now I do understand. And this one's even tougher because there's no clues. I mean, there's no evidence, you know? So we have hope. You know, every day, we have hope that Natalee is still alive.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159899,00.html

So I think this does away with any association with the items found near the Marriott, eg the shirt, the lysol, styrofoam etc.

Jug (stepdad) says in the interview they have daily briefings with the FBI and that the FBI are very involved in the case.

The statement I quoted above was near the end of the interview and it seems to be very spontaneous, and true.

I kind of like sarah's speculation (3:43) about something going wrong and Pop VDS being involved in the coverup.

Remember when someone posted the very thorough timeline a few days ago?  Beth and family found out the evening that Natalee went missing who Joran was and they, and the police, went to the VDS home about midnight  (NOT 6:30 as someone mentioned above).  Pop VDS told them where the son was and the family, police etc found him at the casino.

Either that night or the next night (I think it was the next night), the family and authorities returned to the VDS house and found one of the Kalpoe bros and Joran leaning against a car talking.  somehow the Dad came out, and the convo became heated (some insuation that the Dad became angry), and the officers suggested they disperse.

I think it's weird Joran's Dad became angry....could have just been defending his son.....but also could show he was involved in cover-up....hence the seizing of the two family cars.

Maxito Arendsz is also a street racer in Aruba

Max Arendsz
Zim Racing
93 Mustang LX
302 N2O
Manual
MT Slicks
10.68
129.7
April 2003

I realize this was already asked and answered but someone at Threat #9 mentioned that this wasn't the first trip to Aruba by this high school

how do we know someone from last year went on the trip, met Joran and was talking on and on about this cool guy Joran and even some of the girls this year were purposely going to look him up.....just an angle that occurred to me

for example, my sister went to Aruba and met one of the locals and if we'd gone the next year we would have looked him up.....

Actually I think it was a freind of Deepaks who's mother has a catoring business.  I think in an interview he said that Sateesh once yelled at his mother when he came to buy food from her and she had none left.

That's the way I saw it too. I mean , if Fox thought the Diario guy was full of sh*t, why have him on in the first place? Or why not poke holes in his story? They sure's Hell have nothing else to report. That was the most interesting thing they've had on so far. They keep repeating these same stupid boat trip stories and the interviews with the family and nothing basically.

link to html version of the ISA newsletter that features both Max and Joran (http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:8FoKGuoTsB8J:www.isaruba.com/breeze/documents/BreezeApril292005.pdf+%22Max+Arends%22+Aruba&hl=en&client=firefox-a)

I noticed that Joran got accepted to a number of universities including at least two in Florida.....

You are the best, arubagirl!

Aruba Today reporter is saying on fox that satish and steve might be let go soon.

Did anyone else hear this?

see the link Getagrip just posted

forgive me what is the significance of McDonalds?

Just as they won't release info to us because of the legality of evidence, they would not release very much to her parents also.

It's my pleasure, Maggie.

Unbelievable - I just heard him say that, too.

BBL all ((hugs everyone)) ((Mike, Kerin))

I have a sudden craving for Mickie D's lol jk

about that Diario guy, he must be nuts, if there was any truth to his lead, that Natalee was being held by some Venezuleans who are trying to move her off the island

the very last thing you do is broadcast this on Fox News!!!

it is the same thing I want to yell to all the fools asking for a plan and timeline on leaving Iraq, hello, if there is a plan and timeline, you keep it quiet and don't announce it to the enemy, duh, until the very last moment

Maybe the two brothers are going to become the focus of the investigation.

niether of the pictures up on riehl is the emt guy.  he is emanosc, this guy:  

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:SCchOeSdilUJ:216.55.182.166/emanonsc+%22Steve+Croes%22&hl=en

It was reported that some of the MBHS students had said they saw PVS at McDonalds at 3:00am the morning Natalee disappeared.  However, according to Arubagirl, McDonalds closes at 1:00pm.

As Beth Twitty was overheard mentioning Steve's name to Fox, if I were the investigators would be a bit weary to give her too much information. I do think that she has the right to know EVERYTHING, but if she is divulging info to MSM, I don't think that's such a good idea.

And let the onslaught of "give the woman a beak" and "if it wasn't for the media no one would care" begin.

in fact if there were any truth to that guy's lead, opening up your mouth could lead to someone getting killed, as in Natalee, because the crooks figure there is too much heat

When we hear the word "chase", we think of white Broncos and "Cops". I think this Hispanic man probably meant to say somethink like "we are trying to track the movements of" and used an inaccurate word.

CaliGirl....seems to me that Jug would know if there was SOME evidence....even if he didn't know what, cus they haven't told him.

But to state flatly that there's "no evidence or clues" I think is very telling, coming from someone that close to the investigation.   If there was evidence, I think he would have said "so little", not "none."

 

Leave us not fergit, the 3amigos are in fact the 3amigos.  They do know each other don't they?  Just cause they are fingering each other dont mean they don't all know many same people on this little island.  And too, Urine is a purty big feller, and would not have much trouble with the physicality of toten heavy stuff! KnowwhutImean?

They went to the Sloots home at 1a....before the 6:30a call from the other end of the island [ on Joran's cell phone]

So true.  So does that make the Diario guy a nutcase, or what?  Nuts for saying something that isn't true?  or nuts for saying something that is true but could get someone killed?  what a choice

AnnieMW1....the 6:30 am call was the morning of Natalee's disappearance, not the next morning.

thanks klaasend

now young uns around here will often hang out in the Parking lots of restaurants and plazas after hours, with their souped up Hondas usually but I can't imagine Paul Van Der Sloot would be, then again what kind of father go gambling and drinking with his underage son

I suspect Dad is player if you know what I mean

old Joran had that line from one of the rapper's song at his website

don't hate the player hate the game

which is just a jive ass way for men to excuse their promiscious and hurtful womanizing behaviour

I've been researching the Kalpoe parents for almost a week.  I think it's incredible that the media and everyone else has focused so intensely on Joran's parents, Natalee's parents (which is understandable to a certain degree...but there's been a focus on what her parents do for a living, their decision to allow her to go on this trip, and their general background) and the chaperones...yet, there has been no mention whatsoever of the Kalpoe parents.

We know more about Lorenzo and Steve Croes--who have not been arrested--than we know about the Kalpoe's background.  It is absolutely shocking to me that no one has done a story about these two brothers.  From early on in this mystery, I've always thought they were more guilty than Joran.  Keep in mind that Deepak's attorney is the only one who hasn't claimed his client's innocence.  And now his friends won't even defend his innocence according to the FOX interview last night.

I don't think Joran has known Satish and/or Deepak for very long.  From what I've found, I don't think both of the brothers have been in Aruba for a long period of time.  One may have been there longer than the other.

Satish apparently attended this school in 2002-2003:
http://www.nehalennia.org/examens/uitslagvmbo.html

Because I don't want to slander anyone who might not actually be the parent of Satish and Deepak, I'm not going to post anything related to what I have found about the Kalpoes in Suriname.  However, this might be a good starting point for some US media to begin doing research on Google...

I don't think anyone is going to find information about their parents from Aruba sources.  There is some interesting stuff out there about wealthy Kalpoes who work for a large, well-known corporation that has operations in Suriname.

Yes that is what I heard also.

Arubagirl- did you smoke out your friends cheating boyfriend

http://www.bwcitypaper.com/

On the WS board, one of the aruban posters said there are indeed two people and the one we're interested in has "maxito" as his first name. Incidentally, the former person is claimed to be the poster's brother and is bedeviled by MSM for an interview

You're the best! No complaints here!

1. What's the latest on the murdered guy with the Colombian necktie?

2. Who's the missing guy?

3. Any word on Van Rijn?

4. Did you read the interview with the Diario reporter? :roll:

Wouldn't that be 1am the following morning.  I thougth that call was made the very morning the MB students were getting ready to leave, long before Nat's mom would have made it to the island.

Better not let Papa in cuse theres enough in public that all know xcept urine.  Papa dont need to bring him up to speed..Wouldn't have to say much to damage the invest'g!

I don't think he said "chase" I think he said "followed"

And at that point in time, how would anyone from MB know what the father looked like?

Interesting fact there.  I just jumped on, so the connection could have been made a bit in the past, but on the site where we first saw Steve Croes picture it lists him as "the craziest driver" or something to that effect.

Did he race too?

FOX replayed the phone called several time on into the wee hours this am!  But it will be interesting to see what if anything we hear of that again! Sotaspeak!

And didn't the one article say they were there talking/arguing with the v.d. sloots until about 3 or 3:30 am at his house?

See Dan Riehl's timeline:

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/06/details_of_the_.html

quote]FOX replayed the phone called several time on into the wee hours this am!  But it will be interesting to see what if anything we hear of that again! Sotaspeak![/quote]
LOL. Well, that should put an end to the speculation that Fox stopped reporting this 'lead' because it was so important.

1a the night of Natalee's disappearance, when her mother arrived and tracked down the Van Sloot's

Apparently, the cell phone call was made the previous morning...although I have not read any facts about that and had also heard it was supposedly made "the morning after".  Any links confirming/denying on the phone call?

First time I ahve seen this photo.  Definetly not the same guy!!!!!  I feel bad for this guy...his reputation is being tarnished.

They replayed Big Story as the always do UNEDITED.

What do we know about Lorenzo van Rinj other than he's rumored to be son of Paulus Van der Sloot, born before Van der Sloot married current wife Anita?

Re: Max Arends

Well, high school kids here do a lot of street racing. But isn't the legal driving age in Aruba 18? In that case, you're right and I'm dead wrong, unless Max really is 20 as he says on his Web site. But how could he be if he's just graduating from high school now? So - unless there's some mistake in the age, you're right and I owe you a beer!

When did the kids say they saw the dad at McDonald's? And why would a kid like Joran and his father cover for the brothers if he was not guilty too. I certainly wouldn't take someone else's heat.

They are talking Natalee on TOP FM 95.1.

The name they gave on Fox was specifically "Max Arrends", and said he was a school friend of Joran's.  He was listed in school documents and on the school website. While Fox can (ha) be wrong...I tend to believe names given in situations like this because they are one of the few things released to the public.

Also, it's really important we differentiate fact from fiction.

I still don't know which Steve is which and which one is in jail right now.

Sounds like they may release Satish and Steve (whichever one it is)

Thought I'd repost this for anyone who hadn't read it...this was originally posted by sunmoonstars

This is to the best of my rewind and type fast ability the conversation between the Diaro reporter and Fox news!


He told Fox reporter:
We have been working on this case since the first day, since then have picked up every piece of material, so they can have everything to put together this story. Tonight again we are on the road cause the team is following some suspect cars that we need for this story. Looks like we are going to have a nice finish for this story asap. His sources say they have moved already from where they were and they want to know exactly where they are going.
She asks who do you think is moving Natalie and is he saying that he thinks she is alive?
He says yes, of course. We are going in a group of 2 ladies, 3 gentlemen. One gentlemen knows a person who knows how to deal with drugs (not from Aruba) maybe from Venezuela or Columbia. The plan was to drive Natalee to columbia, but the latest news we have right now is that because the plan has failed 3 times already, they may try to reach Columbia before Venezuela.
She asked what kind of condition he thinks she is in.
He says that the police have their investigation going on, the press does too. We are going to all steps we can, we have put together a group to follow a car that we think are involved in this. We are working on a tip. Have not notified her family, we are working with the police.

Info bulletin on Top

Happy Father's day

Natalee is a mystery until now. Yesterday night Mr. v/d Sloot has been asked to visit the polic station to give a statement. And it was repeated this morning for 2 hours, so that he could sign his statement made yesterday. He is not a suspect, but a 'witness' (=testigo).
He can give info on when his son came home, etc.

Volunteers are still looking for NH, definitely her family, but other people as well.

Today the interrogation of Joran v/d Sloot continues, he constantly under interrogation, and after certain days the boys will be taken to KIA, but if the police needs you for interrogation, you don't have to be send to KIA (KIA is main jail). They think Steve Croes is in Oranjestad.

Edmond says that as he understands it, the three (four?) don't HAVE to go to KIA after x number of days.

edit: nevermind I thought you said talking to natalee.

Someone had asked earlier about whether Joran had exams later that Monday that Natalee disappeared.
There are the dates at the end of this.
Final exams were June 3-8. Last day of school was June 9 (when Joran was arrested). Graduation June 10.

I wonder if it was arranged to let Joran finish school before he was arrested.  

I read on dan's site where aruba girl stated that mickey d's on the island closes at one..this is just a rumor about the 3 am thingy...arubagirl is awesome!!

Where is Dash? She can tell us when the Foxnews convoys hit Mountain Brook.

If both Max(ito) Arends went to ISA, it's prob. the same guy. The school isn't that big.

Arubagirl...I wonder what they mean by that?  Is it no longer a mystery?

Sorry, I meant it is still a mystery.

Joran had already applied and been accepted to some colleges in the US based upon his graduation.  If he had been arrested before final exams, which are probably required in order to graduate, he may have missed his opportunity for those colleges.  I'm sure his parents are very proud of Joran being accepted into those schools, I believe I read somewhere that he even planned to play college soccer.  Looks like they may have covered up something for Joran to save his bright college future in the US.

No links to any story about Natalee/Aruba are on CNN.com header/lead area as of 4:30 PM EST

Have to scroll to the US section halfway down the first page.

Thank you, I thought it might be something like that.

Just checked Max Arends' Tickle site again, and some of the photos I saw there yesterday or the day before have been removed. I think they were under "Chillin with ma homeboys." There were some showing the hand signs being thrown, and one of Max in a tough pose in a white "wifebeater" tank - a rap look.

Aleksandr, the boy Joran has a tie or leash around in the horseplay photo, is on the site, too, but you can't see his face. The torso and shoulders look like the same kid, though.

Judge for yourselves before the whole site is taken down.

Whether or not he's one and the same as Maxito Arendsz, he definitely moves in some of the same circles as Joran. (That doesn't necessarily prove anything, of course, since they're graduating from the same school. But it's interesting.)

Arubagirl - What happened with the cheating boyfriend last night?

Is anyone else curious as to why Dash/Alana is the only one  (other than the guy on O'R) has said anything about this openly? How many others were on this trip? And I'm sure there are others who are much closer???

When O'Reilly interviewed the radio guy representing the chaperones, O'R stated that the FBI had been contacted and had not told them to keep quiet?????

In otherwords here we sit trying to figure who is 1) Guilty 2) Guiltier 3) Guiltiest?  Am I right ?  (jes kiddin) :?

Could anyone please tell me the address to Joran's personal web page?

we have local fox tv station

Link for his site:

http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?_=aaaaaiaaaaEUMaaaaAAilsETGkGjOsMIkcOcI2Wd.

I thought it was very interesting that the reporter said Satish may be let go and that Joran and Depak are still at the jail because they need to have them close to each other for intense interrogation.

I think he said Satish's attorney told him this.

Did anyone get this written down?  I doubt they have a transcript of this.  Maybe they do.

arrabba, we found him...cheating. His girlfriend (I'm thinking exgirlfriend right about now) almost went apoplectic with rage.

Nevermind :)

From Riehl:

Arubagirl, thanks for the info. I'm just repeating what I've heard in the hopes that the people here will find it helpful. Since McDonald's closes at 1 am, myabe he was at another fast food joint at 3 a.m. and maybe he was at McDonald's even though it was closed. I don't know. But this info was given to me by a family member and FWIW, the fact that father was out that late is why he is not being allowed to see his son in prison. His behavior that night is considered to be very suspicious.

Posted by: samthebam | June 19, 2005 04:15 PM

---------

If someone was helping in a cover up, etc. it would be an odd time for a Big Mac attack.  Think dumpsters for this theory to be plausible.

Thought I would paste this for reference...

Transcript from Fox report.

He told Fox reporter:
We have been working on this case since the first day, since then have picked up every piece of material, so they can have everything to put together this story. Tonight again we are on the road cause the team is following some suspect cars that we need for this story. Looks like we are going to have a nice finish for this story asap. His sources say they have moved already from where they were and they want to know exactly where they are going.
She asks who do you think is moving Natalie and is he saying that he thinks she is alive?
He says yes, of course. We are going in a group of 2 ladies, 3 gentlemen. One gentlemen knows a person who knows how to deal with drugs (not from Aruba) maybe from Venezuela or Columbia. The plan was to drive Natalee to columbia, but the latest news we have right now is that because the plan has failed 3 times already, they may try to reach Columbia before Venezuela.
She asked what kind of condition he thinks she is in.
He says that the police have their investigation going on, the press does too. We are going to all steps we can, we have put together a group to follow a car that we think are involved in this. We are working on a tip. Have not notified her family, we are working with the police.

As posted previously from TA:

natalie's
US  Posted on: 10:52 pm, yesterday

That phone call was made on Sunday morning, not Monday morning from the cell phone

natalie's
US  Posted on: 2:29 am, Jun 15, 2005

I wasn't on the trip, but I really wish I had of been. She was my neice and my friend and I really miss her. You would have liked her

Ibliev lawyers are not allowed to be present during interrogations!  Arubians???  Am I right? (I mean Arubians here?)

I dont wanna hang the boy before he's actually found guillty..HOWEVER..looks guilty as sin, doesnt he?Accepted to Colleges here in the US, huh??Looks like we caught him just in time..as many women he was "around" in Aruba, US would be a smorgasbord for him...

arubagirl    if they are going to release Satish  can make the guess that he has talked and told everything that happen

Wow, caught him in the act. You should pursue a career as a private investigator.  You seem to have a knack for it.

Back...whew only 3 pages to catch up on! lol

By the way.. whoever was asking about final exams.. Joran took his the morning Natalee disappeared in case you didn't catch that. That was established a long time ago.

1. It's been confirmed that the Kalpoes do NOT own a car rental company in Aruba.

2.  It's been confirmed that the Kalpoe brothers' are not the son of the Kalpoe at Suriname Airlines.

Confused about the Max Arends/Arendsz and whether they are indeed the same person.

Here are two racing reference to Max Arends (didn't understand anything on the 2nd link):
http://arubadrag.com/index.php?pg=archx&yr=2003&art=mustang_shootout
http://www.racejunkies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=872&page=1&pp=15

Same page as 1st link above, Arendsz spelling:
http://arubadrag.com/index.php?pg=archx&yr=2003&art=toyota_bigbonus

Same page as 2nd link above, Arendsz spelling:
http://www.racejunkies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1181

Other racing pages with Arendsz spelling:
http://boostunit.com/top30/index.php?table_name=Top30&function=search&where_clause=&page=&order=Driver&order_type=ASC

Thanks for slapping that one down.  This was Sunday night, not Monday night, when the Twiggys arrived at the Van der Sloot home.  The MB kids were no longer on the island on Monday night so could not have seen him at the closed McDonald's that night.  Lets put the McDonalds sighting of Mr VDS in the ddisinformation category.    

If I just understood Fox right, they are saying that Steve may be released tomorrow, also that Satish was only questioned by authorites yesterday for about two hours. He may also be released? They compared how long he was questioned to how long Deepak and Joran were.

To Arubagirl- Could Natalee still be on the island and the locals not know with all the attention she is getting? Wouldn't someone what to tell them in so the economy wouldn't suffer?

All that is confirmed is we know nothing about them. lol Sorry had to be funny!

And, could someone be hiding her in a Hotel room?

Let's hope he didn't try to say he was at McDonald's at 3 AM ;)

Speaking of 50Cent, there used to be a listing of Favorite....this and that on the TIckle site. As I remember, he listed four rap artists, including 50Cent.

Someone has definitely cleaned up the site.

Someone with the password has visited it within the past two days.  Figures.

Yes, that's what I got too.

It would appear, if this report is correct, that the two statements by Joran and Depak are still different and Satish and Steve were/are possible material witnesses to help clear up the discrepancies.

I'm guessing they're doing intense, major grilling right now of Joran and Depak.

That is, if this report is correct.  
(I don't trust newspapermen giving reports on this!)

Keep in mind, there has been some sort of confirmation through one of the Aruba radio broadcasts or something like that that Satish was confirmed home and on the computer by around 2am or somewhere around that time.  But it was never confirmed that Deepak was.

Hi Everyone!  Checking in--
Can anyone tell me what "Max" has to do with this case?  Sorry, out of the loop for a few hours--please 'splain!

Thanks!

Hello, my crazy monkees!

Ayacaruba, has there been a lot of wacky reports coming out.  I'm finally caught up and have a few comments...

I've read a lot of opinions where people think that Jaron is innocent or mostly innocent.  However, if that were the case, than why is it that the investigation still seems to be revolving around him?  In the past week, they've searched his house, impounded the family cars, and questioned both parents.  On the other hand, we haven't heard anything about searches of the Kalpoe's house, questioning the parents, etc.

On the other hand, *if* Natalee was taken prisoner with plans to take her to South America, Jaron would have to be a complete moron to hang out with the MBHS students before that night, then be the last to be seen with Natalee.  If he was involved in her disappearance, I have to believe it either wasn't pre-meditated or was limited to slipping something in her drink.

The report about the possible release of Satish is interesting, especially if they just transferred him to prison today.  Arubagirl (you're the best, btw!), do you know if plea bargaining in exchange for information is legal or common in Aruba?

I don't think it was confirmed.  It was what one of the security guards said.  I wouldn't call that confirmed.  And, it included both brothers, not just one.

no kalpoe owns surinam airways because it is solely owned by the government of surinam.  please cut the disinformation

About Nat. being on the island and locals not knowing. There are lots and lots of rumours going around. So, what is true and not? No idea. I think that it is possible, because the cops cannot search every house. I wish they did, though. Everybody who has nothing to hide would have no problem opening their doors to the cops.

Being held in a hotel room, mmmphmm, I suppose that's also possible, but at some point the hotel will want its room back and then what? I think it's an easier thought than being in a house, what with neighbours and the like.

Max was reported to have been brought for questioning and released 2? days ago.

I thought it was Deepak who talked to Mickey or Abraham in the jail cell and said that he went home and went online.

And I am still hoping to find out how the rumors of Lorenzo being Mr. VDS's son came up. Are the two friends?

My question is who supposedly reported him at McD's at 3am.  If it was one of the students or chaperones how on earth would they even know who he was before they even knew Nat was gone?  This doesn't even make sense.  Especially considering the McD's was closed at that time.

Even if the police searched every house, Natalee could be moved from an unsearched house to a searched house while the searches were going on.

Mike?? Do you remember the name of Deepak's friend that was on FOX early this morning? Anerlina something hmm gotta go look through the posts I think because I posted it so I could remember lmao

It's not common for a criminal who has confessed to be let go. He can get a more lenient sentence, yes, but his ass wil stay in jail until trial. Then the judge can sentence him to time already served, but it's not like they're letting the guy go before the trial.

Satish might not want to go home, i wouldn't if more people are involved.

arrabba, I forgot to add the curfew part. No one is allowed to be on the road.
I know, I know, wishful thinking

How long is it generally between charges and a trial in Aruba?  A trial is decided by a judge and not a jury, correct?

arubagirl if they are going to release Satish can we make the guess that he has talked and told everything that happen

Well, you tell me....how many ppl have been all over this here innnet about this story and why?  I think its a BIG story, don't you?  I see it on newspapers all over the US and the world.  Sounds big to me!  I think the others jes dont git it!

What time is the Curfew? 2 or 3am?

or not. Wasn't there a case a few weeks ago of a little girl in Florida US who was being held a couple of houses away from her own, while police conducted what was referred to an extensive search of the entire area, and if I am not mistaken, had begun searching surrounding states.

Exactly. Ladies beware.

You mean the seniors had a different exam schedule from the rest of the school? Because the school has the exams running June 3-8.

I think that the story was both brothers went online but I have only heard confirmation of the younger brother being logged on and online, no mention of Deepak.

We can also make the guess that for whatever reason, his story checks out - for him anyway.  He may not know any more than just what he said, and independent confirmation confirms where and what he was doing.

For argument's sake, there's been rumors that one or the other of the trio was online after coming home.  That can be validated thru the ISP they use, and if you used anything like IM from your home computer, your IP address and account will reflect it.

I know this is late but so am I!  




No!  The reference is to the night Nat got snatched.  The Twitty's saw him 24 hrs later!

absolut, I was thinking of a curfew like Venezuela implements when they're conducting a census. You're not allowed out of the house, all day.

As I said, wishful thinking.

Wait. what?

There's a curfew? Explain please arubagirl.

writenow, no curfew. They tried to get it once, but there was an outcry and didn't happen.

All I ever heard about that was that it was finals week, not that he took his that particular day.

Natalee goes missing on Monday early AM.  Twiggys arrive Monday evening and track down VDS residence with cops by about 1 AM Tuesday.  Mr. VDS goes with them to look for Joran at Casino.  He is not there.  Joran dad on cell to say he is home.  They go back and find Joran and the Surinamer leaning on the car.  This is early Tuesday morning, 24 hours after Natalee is last seen (by anybody but the suspects).  

How about a manager/casino owner/someone with influence coudl I believe keep someone in a hotel...just thinking...????

(http://tried to post a pic but don't know if it worked.One more thing re Dan's riehlworldview.com post this a.m.....I think the info about the shark feeding area is the most important thing he posted.When NH first went missing, the first thing I thought was, if she was killed or died accidentally, that her body would have been disposed of in the ocean (duh...it's an island) .  But that didn't make sense, cus it would wash back up onshore.However, with the convenient driveup cliff overlooking the shark feeding area (see pix on Dan's site).....and a local Arubian person saying she and her friends thought of that place the very first thing, seems like this is what happened to Nat to me.  Altho I will say I'm still holding out hope of some obscure, convoluted drug related kidnap scheme.)

I don't think that the owner of the hotel would cover for someone else. Unless he believes his life or his inmediate family's life is in danger.

But I really doubt that's the case here.

Like someone else referred, the boys ain't jes sippin foofoo drinks on the beach, there out there gittin it fer sure!  KnowwhutImean?

Maybe Fox got burned with some disinfo.    

AG: here's a post from "Adella"  from Aruba on websleuths yesterday i believe.  It adresses the two max situation.

Hold your horses!!!!

I've been trying to keep up with the posts because I left of yesterday before part 6 was even closed....but when I got to post 101 I was shocked! And I started to quickly glance over everything to post an update already!!!

I have to say, YOU GUYS ARE FAST@! This Max Arends is my brother! He's at home, chillin' all freaked out because you already know him! He is actually Joran's class-mate and exactly the person I was mentioning in part 6 that CNBC is desperately trying to contact for a 'simple' interview. He didn't want to participate since they want to question him by himself and they want a possitive side of Joran, I think as well as he think that they will EAT HIM ALIVE if he does that!

Anyhow, he's not the Max Arends that being arrested, this is another Max Arends who I happen to know as well, his name is actually not Max Arends, but Maxito, and his last name is Arendsz. I'm not sure what's happening to him right now, but I already have someone trying to find that out.

Again, my borther is not arrested and has anything to do with this.

I don't remember, will try to find in previous posts, but I think it was on the radio that there was confirmation that Satish was at home online that morning around 2am, proof that could have been obtained from ISP's but there was no mention of that for Deepak.  Maybe the younger brother was taken home and Deepak and Joran still dealing with Nat.  I don't know, but I found that interesting that they had been able to confirm that story for Satish but not Deepak.

Cali,

You said it was Angelina Reppas.

But no one had any contact with Satish while in jail. Mick JOhn with Deepak. Abraham Jones (who hasn't spoken since getting out) was with Joran.

Link to the article in the Birmingham News this AM
http://www.bwcitypaper.com/1editorialbody.lasso?-token.folder=2005-06-16&-token.story=129206.112112&-nothing

Getagrip, thanks for the links. That was fast work!

Interesting that one of the other racers was Maikel Croeze. Wonder if this could possibly the Maikel who shows up on some of the kids' Tickle sites? Probably not, as Croeze or Croes or other variants is reportedly the Smith or Jones of the island. But I thought it was interesting. There's a Greg, too. Isn't Steve Croeze's middle name Greg?

Well, I'm on my way to the family get-together for the dads among us.

Thanks and enjoy your own Father's Days, all.

no x it, if that's true, then I was totally wrong. Damn, two max arends at the same school? Geez.

Arubagirl, I'm not so sure about that, actually. That's an open question, unless you're telling us you personally know the guy? Furthermore, even if not related to NH, the slight beheading of an individual, and one missing almost makes it seem as though *nothing* is out of the realm of possibilities at the moment.

but he still know what happen to NH  and he has talked ????

With a beheading and a drive by shooting at a hotel. Then you have 2 disappearances. Life in danger in Aruba seems to now be commonplace.

RB, I don't know any Max(ito) Arendsz. I do know EMT Steve Croes, though.

Arubagirl - do you know anything about this Sergio Gomez person that is missing?

the drive by shooting at the hotel, that one has already been solved, and the hotel, well, I don't think it will earn four stars anytime soon. It ocurred in the *really* seedy part of the capital.

Well, it kinda was exam week because june 3 was that Friday. the 8th was the following wednesday.

I thought it was a guy.
I saw him in an interview on cnn

dragonfly, what's weird about that is you know, what if one of the brothers was online, and the other went to bed? Imagine being the other brother....what confirmation could be supplied that you were in bed asleep, unless it's from your brother who got hauled into jail with you?

Then again, they could have more on Deepak, either by his own admission or conflict with Joran's statements.

Prof -- This link is posted on the front page of Scared Monkeys today. I have posted it about 4 times already in this thread too.

Exactly.  From the beginning, the story about the lighthouse and HI drop off was told and the Kalpoe brothers tried to cover with "we were at home online".  Then the story changed to them dropping Joran off with Nat at beach and they went home when Deepak talked to Mickey.  But I have only heard of confirmation that younger brother was confirmed to be online.  Maybe that was intended to be cover for Deepak too, but brother was logged on and no proof that Deepak was.  I'll go look for that story about the brother being confirmed online.

Thanks cancunmole! I knew I had heard, if not seen, at least one interview about Deepak saying he went online.

But I don't think the ISP could tell anything except that there was a login and how long on for a particular account.

In other words, that would not be an iron-clad alibi. Someone else could have logged in using the account, and since the arrests, several people have indicated that it looks like someone has logged into some of their myspaces and tickles and whatnot...

klaassend, I didn't even know his name was Sergio Gomez, thanks for the info.

I think there's only one Arends and he is(?) Adella's brother, and goes to school with Joran.  The other guy, presumably the one we seek, spells his name (I)Arendsz(/I).  Can you confirm this??

If she was thrown to the sharks are speculated, then why have they not looked for her there in the beginning. I know it is hard, but they could have made a small attempt. Even the guys who feed the sharks could have made a special diving trip...

Well, I think the problem would be that neither said they went home and to bed.  They tried to use online activity as an alibi for both but that can't be proven.  Why not say "I went to bed and Satish was online"?  Probably because Satish was online proving he was home and the boys thought that could cover both of them.

good work concerned.  the school is in the Netherlands  

rth

Did you see the links I provided about Max Arends/Arendzs? What are the odds of having two guys with such similar names, racing for the same team (ZiM).

I'm sensing we are being fed some disinformation here by the 'sister'.

r u listerning to dag now???
oreilly is bashing the chaperones for letting things
be such a party
i saw this on fox earlier today too

If either of the brothers stories changed over time from what they originally told police, I cannot see how either gets out of jail before this is solved and even then if they were not involved.

If they changed their story they are guilty of obstruction of justice.

NO RELEASE until trial.

Arubagirl (or anyone else who knows),

What does Oranjestad mean? Like Los Angles=Angels, Boca Raton=rats mouth.

I don't believe the feeders dive in.

:D

Rim shot!

Quite possible.  This makes my head hurt.

Did anyone hear or see this video of Emily Jones, who vacationed in Aruba two weeks before Natalee, saying some really creepy things about Johns the security guard. Hmmm interesting I missed it!

http://www.nbc13.com/missinginaruba/index.html

Arends / Arendsz is also a very popular last name and the 'z' at the end does not mean that it's a completely different family. As you can see below, one of my hobbies is genealogy and how I have cursed that 'z'. I suppose that it IS possible that there be two guys going by that name, but what are the odds?

And racing for the same team? Wow. The coincidences are mindblowing.

Again, I don't know the guy(s), don't know anything about them, so can't help you there.

He graduated in 2003 from the basic vocational training course, technical sector.  He lived in Middleberg so he is fresh of the boat if it the same guy.  May be a little young to match though.  

Geslaagd: VMBO 2002-2003 Gefeliciteerd!

VMBO Basisberoepsgerichte leerweg, Sector Techniek
Sebastian Beekman, Middelburg; Nathan den Besten, Middelburg; Walter Brakman, Middelburg; Emile Broekema, Middelburg; Martijn de Bruijne, Middelburg; Peter de Bruijne, Vlissingen; Jesse van Dam, Oostkapelle; Rouchdi El Kharbouchi, Oost-Souburg; Anakim Foe, Middelburg; Eddy Groen, Terneuzen; Edwin Hoogendoorn, Vlissingen; Annelies van den Hummel, Koudekerke; Dimitri Jakobsen, Middelburg;

Satish Kalpoe, Middelburg;

Luken Kenter, Vlissingen; Ricardo Kievit, Middelburg; Joël Klap,Vlissingen; Daniël Koenen, Middelburg; Manuel Kramer, Middelburg; Scotty Latumeten, Middelburg; Mark van der Lee, Arnemuiden; Daniël Loriaux, Oost-Souburg; Pascal van Maanen, Middelburg; Jeffrie Matthijs, Middelburg; Davie McNelly, Middelburg; Madelëne de Nood, Oost-Souburg; Harry van Outheusden, Middelburg; Lennart Padmos, Haamstede; Ruud Riemens, Westkapelle; Wouter de Roo, Kloetinge; Mike dos Santos Galhetas, Vlissingen; Tim Schrier, Koudekerke; Rafaël Verbrugge, Vlissingen; Frans Westerink, Middelburg; Veysi Yurdem, Middelburg; Niels van Kortenhof, Oost-Souburg; Pascal Meerman, Arnemuiden.

wantsanswers:  exactly how does one "look for her" in the shark feeding area?

The water are really rough ( see pix on Dan's site and text as well).  You'd have to kill all of the sharks, empty their stomachs and do DNA testing....

So in Aruba where there is very little crime and no homicides, a drive by shooting at a hotel wouldn't make another owner/manager a tad fearful for his life? There is always the beheading to worry about as well.

I am almost certain (even though middle age is setting in) that the report was that both boys went home and got online. AND, I think we're using the word "confirmed" rather loosly lately.  I don't think we have any of Depak's story confirmed.  The report came from the security guard's lawyer...did it also come from the boy's lawyer...Don't think so.

It's their story...maybe true....maybe not...but, it has NEVER been confirmed to the public.

Nawww, maybe a bank shot.  I know divers who feed sharks or like to be in the water when sharks are feeding (sounds nuts I know, but no different than, say, going to see Grizzlies in Alaska without being on a tour.)  Based on what I know from diving in the Caribbean, I'd say it'd be the currents that you have to worry about.

Oranjestad means Orange City. That's because the family name of the Royal Family is Oranje (=Orange). So if you see a soccer match with Holland involved, they will be wearing Orange as their color.

 I don't believe a word of it......she got her 15 mins.

I can ASSURE you that no one ever swims there. I mean, have you seen those rocks?

Actually, yes I have.

Has there been anything on the radio today that was interesting?

RB, would you swim there, then? :)

I sure as hell would not.

yes, I did, and I thought that whichever station had her on (forget which one) was really reaching.  In any resort area, men, local and fellow tourists do talk to and flirt with and say lame things to women. In fact, this happens even in non-resort areas.

My impression was that the only person who would be really upset by this would be Mickey's significant other, and I am sure if she saw the report she will have talked it over with him.

I do they had that rep already sounds very true to me since the minute their photos were on TV she came forward.

Wasn't it mentioned that the current is so strong that anything dropped in that water ends up in Panama?

CaliGirl:

Do you know if there's a text version of this interview?  I'd like to read it because I swore I read a story like this!!!  I started to think I was dreaming!  Does it say he got aggressive with her? That's what I recall I read.
I can't listen to audio very well on a dial-up.  But, would love a recap of this story or a transcript.
Thanks!

Arubagirl,

Once the prosecutor has everything he/she needs and case is resolved, how long would it normally take a case to come trial in Aruba?

if it ever comes to trial  no body no crime

writenow, not long. 2-3 months. And they will stay in jail during that time.

Mehill is right, in that respect.

What you do is anchor far enough away you dive (underwater) which is far different than just swimming from shore. Currents under the surface can be vastly different (or even non existent) the further down you dive.  Sport diving, for example, has a safety limit of 140 ft. I will tell you that in my 3 years in the Caribbean, I heard that end of the island mentioned more than once.

No. In fact, she herself described him as friendly. All he did was a couple of really lame pickup lines on a couple of mornings when she went out to jog and he was passing by.

You guys need to change some laws there then.....

Nancy, no text. I barely found this ONLY news13 in Georgia seemed to pick it up. I found that odd too! He almost stalked her, and I know that guard was known to have had reports of him doing that.

I don't think it was 15 minutes of fame, I think it was more of what she was saying.. OMG I recognize this guy because he bothered me..more of a shock. or relief that she got away from him that day.

Well stated, Absolut.  I was trying to phrase this 'objectively', with no leaning to any one MSM outlet over another.  You found the right words.

Nancy, it was from a translation from one of the radio broadcasts from just yesterday or day before.  I am looking for it now.  Their "sources" telling them that it had been confirmed that the younger brother had logged on and was on the internet around 2 or 2:30am but nothing for Deepak.  It was one of those "Sources tell us that it has been found that Satish was on computer and online around 2am on the morning in question".  I am looking for it now but it will take forever.

I wonder how he did on those finals!  I'd struggle to concentrate all things considered!

Doubt it, littletxlady.

I thought the story was about Joran and another girl tourist.  I didn't realize it was the security guard.  Guess I dreamt the story about Joran and another girl.

TTownMike, he did graduate. Don't know how important those finals were in order for him to graduate.

NFW unless you are f'n out of your fom! :roll:

Me too....lol

I thought the story was about Joran and another girl tourist.  I didn't realize it was the security guard.  Guess I dreamt the story about Joran and another girl.[/quote]

I remember a story like that too....that there were rumors about Joran and other tourists...can't remember where though.

I heard the people on Fox talking about  no body no crime  that was the was it was in the USA for about 225 years  they said that  they have charge people in holland  with out a body  it happened about 10 years ago   they are not for sure if it can be done in aruba

But how do we know it was "him" logged on? lol jk But all this site tickle etc stuff being moved around, at this point I honestly would not be surprised if Satish phoned the easter bunny to log on for him (joke sorry lol)

So, let's say Satish and Croes are released.  What does this suggest?

1. Joran's story of being dropped off first is still under suspicion

2. Boys' story of dropping Joran off w/Nat at Marriott could be true - and Deepak dropped Satish home and came back for the "after-party".  What's the driving pattern/time on this scenario?

3. Could the two men yanking the woman off the Marriott beach that was reported have been Joran & Deepak?  Wasn't that reported around 2a?

4. If Deepak came back, perhaps he placed a call to Croes to come help with Natalie?  Or Joran could have called his dad to come help?

I'm setting aside all other theories [ drug ring, etc ] for now...

No, don't search.  My point is only that I wouldn't consider that an official confirmation.  Since reports are that high ranking government officials aren't even getting specific info on evidence...I doubt there's an official confirmation on something like this.

I just think for the sake of a fair discussion it's good to use the word "confirm" in the right way.

Thanks CaliGirl - good digging. Sounds like he was just flirting with her, albeit somewhat aggressively, and she didn't think much of it, but she had second thoughts after she saw him on the news.

Watch DADDY VAN DER SLOOT RUN !!!

"CNN: Judge questioned in Aruba case"


http://nataleeholloway.tripod.com/

If you would like to email thoughts to the "Wall of Hope" in MB,
   natalee@inline.com

Remember:  Aruba doesn't have any crime.  It cannot "just be a coincidence" that the murder happened on Saturday afternoon just as VDS was taken in for questioning[/quote]

coincidences happen all the time
and we do not know anything "offical"
unless i missed somethin guy

Not really. How many John Smiths are there at a US school? And we don't know that Maxito Arendsz went to Joran's school. We only know he was a FRIEND of his. big difference.

There are 2 pages of Arends in the phone book and about 20 Arendsz. consider the population of Aruba and Arends/Arendsz sounds like it's a somewhat common name.

http://www.arubayp.com/whitebook.html?PageNumber=9

Nice talking to everyone, I'm going to do some errands.

You can be convicted in Holland if there is no body but then there must be evidence that points to your guilt.

great link!!!! Thanks!

But how do we know it was "him" logged on? lol jk But all this site tickle etc stuff being moved around, at this point I honestly would not be surprised if Satish phoned the easter bunny to log on for him (joke sorry lol)[/quote]

no shit...as long as your comp is on, u cld be calling to santa claus right?

Hi All,


I have been following this case for some time now and what I really dont dig is that the case recieves small attention in the netherlands ( I am a dutch citizen ). The judge is employed by the ministery of justice . If in the Netherlands a judge is involved in a case it is front page news.

 

OK gang, scratch Max off our list and put him on the list with the EMT guy.  Bet he will think trice about putting his mug out on the ether again!

no shit...as long as your comp is on, u cld be calling to santa claus right?[/quote]
lol FOM< I track him online on the NASA site at Christmas for my daughter lmao

Maybe someone from Aruba would know but do they have blackberry's or internet capable cell phones there..?? Could always log on while anywhere.

same way in the USA  has to be some evidence that someone is dead

If it wasn't for Fox it wouldn't get anything but small coverage at this point in America either.

truth is,my ex did go scuba by old pet cem with my friend when we visited years ago.  It was rough and dark...lots of coral.  they lost me fast and i went back in....NFW   and after my "friend" tolds about sharks there.

no shit...as long as your comp is on, u cld be calling to santa claus right?[/quote]

~~~~~~
My post starts here...guess I just found out you can edit someone else's post!  Yikes.

Yes, they can tell exactly where the computer is, etc.  Being able to tell it was Satish is another story.  One they would for sure try to confirm in the timeline.  

It's one of the reasons I tend to believe at least part of their story, being online can be tracked and proven.

FYI

THER DUTCH LAW PROCEDURES IN ENGLISH

http://www.justitie.nl/english/

YEAH, THANK YOU SO MUCH!

Sorry but I'm e-years behind(duh I ain't had time to finish Evlyn Woodhead yet) .  No, I know the woman you speak of but can't remember the name!  So sorry!

IF ANYBODY BORDERS TO READ IT, QUITE BORING

There are 2 pages of Arends in the phone book and about 20 Arendsz. consider the population of Aruba and Arends/Arendsz sounds like it's a somewhat common name.

http://www.arubayp.com/whitebook.html?PageNumber=9[/quote]

no shit
look how many croes and the like

I can't find the Code of Criminal Procedure, is there something like that here?

yes my friens somtimes go ta an internet cafe
i have never been.

Okay I am going back to the loft. I MUST find this interview Mike, FOM and I saw on FOX early this morning with Deepak's "female friend".

lol FOM< I track him online on the NASA site at Christmas for my daughter lmao

Maybe someone from Aruba would know but do they have blackberry's or internet capable cell phones there..?? Could always log on while anywhere.[/quote]

Even if you have a blackberry or other PDA,  you can log on, but the transmission from such items can be distinquished from your home computer.

Yes, please. Go get 'em Caligirl  :lol:

You can't log on anywhere anonymously. They can easity tell where you are and how you log on.

6pm CNN has Natalee step dad live I believe.

Hey y'all, as I catch up to my own posts I see the overwhelming need to apologize for some of them.  And no I ain't drinking, its prescription drugs.  Sorry, please don't think less of me.

Respectfully submitted,

TTownMike

The first story was they went to the lighthouse and had sex with natalee and then dropped at the holiday inn (this from the first AP dispatch) where the security guards entered the scene.  Two security guards were arrested.  When they got out, one, I think Mickey, who was in a cell near Deepak, announced that Deepak told him it was all a lie and that in fact they went to the lighthouse then dropped Joran and Natalee at the Marriott and then went home and then Deepak went back when Joran sent him a text message.  The other guard was near Joran and said that Joran told him they dropped him off at home then took Natalee presumably to the hotel.   So, there are two hearsay versions.  Now Joran's lawyer is being dsiciplined for talking to one of these guys to get information from him on the case.  Did Joran's lawyer put him up to broadcasting Joran's alibi?

caligirl, when I saw the female friend on tv, I had remembered seeing another interview with her several days ago. If I remember right, in the interview from several days ago, the news had referred to her as his employer.  And at that time she said the same thing. So I am sure this is his employer from the internet cafe.

Do you think the ministry of justice is covering up something?

For the simpletons who said feeders don't dive in, I fed the sharks in Belize and we (the ones who weren't chicken)  swam with them. So did the guides.....

I don't remember Depak's story ever mentioning going back to meet Joran.  I think we speculated.  But, as far as I remember the story STOPPED with the call or text message from Joran.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law

Here you are Nancy :wink:

From http://www.bwcitypaper.com/1editorialbody.lasso?-token.folder=2005-06-16&-token.story=129206.112112&-nothing

[/b]

This is new. Everything that I've seen posted indicated that there were MB students out by the pool, not in the lobby.

Simpletons (good way to alienate people.)

Max Arendsz @ Aruba Speed Shop

http://boostunit.com/specialthanks.html

:: Special Thanks ::

:: The ones that helped / or are still helping me one way or another with this project ::
Mom and Dad, who tollerate the mess in the garage.
Brother Ilan, who helped me with troubleshooting electronic problems and the polishing work.
Statio Baker and Carib Racing Crew in Daytona Beach, Florida.
Rayon Koolman
Marlon Maduro
Marlon Dubero
Lito Kock
Marvin Maduro
Manuel Cristo. Engine paint job and stock body moldings.
Jean Carlo Reyes "Puchi" @ King's Care Garage, Pos Chikito.
Ryan Bareno, Parts delivery in Miami.
Max Arendsz @ Aruba Speed Shop.
Orlando Bello @ Aruba Speed Shop.
Rigo Croeze
Gerald Rasmijn
Clinton Kock " Chino "
Jarzino Arendsz " Echie " *RIP Bro*
Urbine Donata " BinBin "
Eddie Kelly @ El Viejo Shan Racing.
Shaniro Kelly @ El Viejo Shan Racing.
Shandre Kelly @ El Viejo Shan Racing.
Cecil Bronswinkel " Checho " @ Match & Go Racing.
Kenny Theysen
Adrian Moen Orlando, FL.
Rayon Kelly
JJ Dayananni

there was but i do not dare try to report it given the uproar it caused yesterday.  someboy should monitor that.  same review of events as yesterday, they played the O'Reilly segments with the vicarious chaperone interview and with Alana and Steve.  Actually, they liked the O'rielly take on the nonchalant chaperones and the silencing of the Alabama contingent.  They say that is all putting the media focus on Aruba and the pressure is too much.  There is a story to be told in Alabama too.  

Well the ap retracted part of that story, specifically the part about them having sex with Natalee.  It was later clarified that Natalee and one of the boys(joran) made out at the lighthouse, before they went back to the HI.  This came from two of the suspects own statements.

His female friend cried for he was not able to be at hi s grad.'n

no body no murder charges but maybe kidnapping?  

We still love ya, Mikey -- even when you're loopy.

I don't remember any version of this story indicating Depak went back to meet Joran.  I could very well be wrong, but I remember in discussions here we commented that his story stopped with the cell/text message from Joran.

In the US we call it "not politicaly correct"!

FOX reporting Anita van der Sloot just visiting Joran today, not getting questioned.

Jug Twitty on FOX in a couple of minutes

He is doing CNN as well in this hour.

Jug Twitty on FOX:  Nothing of consequence has happened in the last couple of days with the investigation.

Sorry, it is the Twittys.  Been at this too long.  

t

And, they reported Joran and Depak are now undergoing INTENSE questioning in separate locations.  

My gut tells me they've gotten the info they need from the outside to now go after one of these stories.  If they're gonna break em' I suspect it's today.

Regardless....how would "swimming with them" help them "look for"  Natalee??

Jug Twitty has hired a lawyer.

Twittys hired a lawyer.

Twitty family has hired a lawyer and probably a P.I.
They believe the Father knows something as well.

Maybe here the call it; 'Not jumping to conclusions before any evidence is out"!  TTown :wink:

What I wouldn't give to be a fly on the wall of the interrogation room(s)... :mrgreen:

FOX just reported that the Holloway's have hired their own attorney.

OBNOXIOUS SLIMBALL WAHHHHOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

Can't wait to hear who the lawyer is...that should be interesting. Did they give a name?

"Obnoxious slimeball!"  That Bama man tells it like it is!

Who are you guys referring to? I'm not watching TV, just glued here....

Jug Twitty:  Calls Paul vsn der Sloot is an "obnoxious, slimeball guy".  Jug believes he knows more than what he has told authorities about the case.

Cover up????

I wonder why the Twitty's hired a lawyer -
a. To sue the Van Der Sloots
b. In response to the chaperones hiring their own lawyers?
c. To protect their interests in Aruba - not sure US lawyers would have any jurisdiction, etc to "represent" in Aruba??

Gotta love that Jug!!!!!

Notably (or not), we've never heard a word directly from guard #2.  Whats up with that?

DUH... If I was the parents of a missing child I would have had an attorney and a PI on the case on day 1.  Did they just turn on the lightbulbs?

Twiddy should grab him and make him talk if the authorities don't. I hope they arrest him this time. His arrogance is what caused his son to think he could get away with murder.

They would hire an international lawyer no doubt

That's right, she's his boss!

Jug on CNN in the next 15 minutes.

She's the one who said she couldn't really vouch for him being squeaky clean?

Whoa, I missed the report.  Jug Twitty called him "an obnoxious slimeball"!!!  Amazing.  The Twitty's must know more than they're saying!

No, just said it was time to do so  because of the differences in law between the US and Aruba, and conflicting advice they are getting.

Jug said it is to help understand the aruban judicial system.

Did Jug say that or the reporter? That is great. And I agree, they know more than they are saying. Hope it is half good. Cause it can't be all good.

I wouldn't think to hire anyone if my child was missing. I would be in shock for about a month. You think you can trust people to find criminals. You don't expect this type of treatment.  Right now I would hire a mercenary.

As I see it, Jug has quit pulling his punches!  "Obnoxious Slimeball", That's what i been sayin'!  Go Jug!

That and probably a dozen other reasons! You know a ga-zillion international lawyers are chomping at the bit to represent them PRO BONO!

I agree I would have hired a lawyer ASAP if my daughther went missing in another country.

Thanks for all the updates everyone!

He said the family hadn't been watching a lot of the news reports but had just decided that they would begin to watch them more.  When he saw the picture of Papa VDS running to his car, he was tickled and thought he'd never seen such an obnoxious slimeball guy in his life ..... referring back to meeting Papa the night they went to the VDS house ... hilarious!!!

I see!! LMAO!!

Retracted?  AP never retracted it.  They just stopped running the sex part, perhaps out of politeness.  remember the boys were not arrested yet at this point and may have been the source.  Or maybe it was the lawyers for the guards or the cops.  But don't say it was not reported that way.  It  was.      

Aww gorsh thanks! :oops:  :oops:

WHO YOU CALLIN LOOPY?  :x

We Southerners shoot it straight...lol..GO JUG!! Anyway, I was thinking, if joran thinks that he stays tight lipped and doesnt say anything, you know the "no body no case" theory, then he his about stupid...lol..doesnt he realize that when he gets out people will have his head? Jug, first on the list...lol

Yeah we did:

Story posted to BNN 6/13/2005 9:02:08 AM
Breaking News by Dan Riehl
Unconfirmed but from regular reader Mimi. Consider the source, even if true. Looks like two against one scenario could be playing out.

Who would believe anything they would say? I don't think she made out with anyone! I think she was drugged and couldn't think for herself!

Jug!

Hey Arubans, is there such a thing as wrongful death suit there?

Jug did not look good.  I suspect the PI guns have been in on this since the gitgo.  remember Mrs. Twitty's reference in her interview to three international business people (Kroll, Control Risk) stationed on aruba helping her get to the security tapes of the casino and to Joran?  Who is the lawyer?  

 .  ;

check this out

http://video.msn.com/video/p.htm?t=1&p=News_NBC%20News&i=221999f2-7922-4211-92e2-855d30a73bdf&rf=

They would hire an international lawyer no doubt[/quote]

how else would you begin to understand the laws therre?/

  More and more we see that victims need lawyers too!  Especially in this deal!

Just for a second, hear me out before you flame me.  (If you flame me, make it hot - I like spicy)  I'd like to say I take Jug Twitty' comment only at face value and have a good reason for it. While I understand the Twittys' frustration, the VS's are not from the gracious South like the Twittys.  

Let me just say that having worked with the Dutch and travelled to the Netherlands several times early in my career, one might take the "obnoxious slimeball" comment as an example of cultural differences between the Twittys and the VS's.  I can tell you that upon first blush being a Southerner and working with my Dutch counterparts, I found them dry, arrogant and conceited and can imagine pretty well how Jug perceived them.  

After getting used to the way the Dutch think, I changed my mind and realized they just didn't have the same pleasantries I was accustomed to and as I got to know some of them better, I found I dug the way they thought and did things.  I learned not everybody thinks like an American, especially those Southerns who value such hospitable attitudes and warmth.

If this situation had happened in the South and the VS's were Southern, one would expect that if the VS's showed up at the Twitty's door at 1am, the Twitty's would have done whatever they could to help. They *expected* the VS's would be that way, and they weren't.  Hence some of the frustration Jug Twitty displayed.

I don't know we seem to believe that J said "something bad happened to her", yet every thing else in the 6 hour period was retracted. Confession, leading them to a body, her dad identifying her at crime scene and and we no longer talk about rely on as fact. So tomorrow we won't believe the lighthouse story either. Either version.

Jug may be callin in the Bama Good OleBoys by now!

how else would you begin to understand the laws therre?/[/quote]

They could have hired  a local lawyer.....duh

silly question,.. but who would believe anything that "they would say"
meaning     who :?:

 
Yes, as she made reference to how you don't know serial killers too!

They could have hired  a local lawyer.....duh[/quote]

Bet they didn't. I wouldn't - I'd hire someone out of the Netherlands not based in Aruba. That way, I'd bring the motherland to the island from a media perspective and give this the top billing it deserves there.

I so appreciate your comments on this.  We're dealing with so many cultural diferences it's really important to know tings like this.

Luna you are looney. Divers can be looking for her body parts on that side of the island. They wouldn't be swimming for fun? What part of looking for her can't you understand?

Point of information:  Peple in Alabama are very good judges of character.

They could have hired  a local lawyer.....duh[/quote]

maybe this local lawyer woould be fathers friend....that would be
a great idea....   u must be brain surgeon?

Wantsanswers,

Your responses are insulting and not necessary in that tone.

Bet they didn't. I wouldn't - I'd hire someone out of the Netherlands not based in Aruba. That way, I'd bring the motherland to the island from a media perspective and give this the top billing it deserves there.[/quote]

my thoughts exactly

nancy, no problem.  This is why sometimes our esteemed Commander-In-Chief is misunderstood by the Europeans overall.  The "culture differences" thing goes both ways....

sorry for the edits,  bad typos, bad fingers, etc

Jug live on CNN.

"Like father like son" Jug Twitty

YOU GO JUG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   :lol:

Jug Twitty on CNN:

Paul van der Sloot , "he is sickening to me".

Jug is calling VDS dad a chicken and is sickening in his opinion.

Well of course they aren't going to publish an official retraction for just a small part of the article, they just simply removed it.  Not a single MSM is reporting they all had sex now, everyone is only reporting that natalee and joran made out in the backseat at the lighthouse.  That is the extent of our information.  The lawyer for one of the security guard made this clear in a lot of different interviews.  And Rick Leventhal from Fox news, corrected Sean Hannity who made the claim that they had sex, by saying that this was a misunderstanding and that they had only made out.  Believe me, the AP wouldn't have taken the statement out due to respect for the family, they took it out because it was just a rumor or simply false.

Well yeah, sept for that! :oops:

RB...I can understand your take on cultural differences between Southerners and Dutch....in a normal business setting.

However, remember the timeline that was posted a coupla days ago?

It said that when the Twittys, Arubian authoriities, and Pop VDS (thanks for clearing that up someone), arrived at the VDS house late at night the day Nat was reported missing....the Dad became "irate" or words to that effect.  I think it said the convo became heated....and the police said the meeting should disperse.   So that lead me to think Jug may have more cause for his statement....could be wrong of course.

But I always thought it odd that the Dad became upset....maybe he was sayin stuff to protect Joran..no doubt.

Bet they didn't. I wouldn't - I'd hire someone out of the Netherlands not based in Aruba. That way, I'd bring the motherland to the island from a media perspective and give this the top billing it deserves there.[/quote]

RB: I appreciated that insight into the Dutch. We, as Americans, tend to think everyone will react as we would.

Jones' attorney Lejuez seemed pretty sharp to me but that probably would be a conflict of interest.

Jug Twitty on CNN:

"There are several things that took place that are different than what he stated that night."

In reference to talking to Paul van der Sloot the night after Natalee's disapperance.

how else would you begin to understand the laws therre?/[/quote]And that's what Beth thinks Nat might want to make her major when she gets back!

Luna, coming to a Dutch house at 1am uninvited (whether business or not) is considered rude.  They're lucky he opened the door.

friend of monkeys
I meant the boys themselves. People keep repeating what they have said about her and I think they need to just not keep talking about their lies.

I wonder if the Twitty's have been thoroughly questioned about their exchange with the Van Der Sloots that 1st evening...I'd be shocked if they hadn't...but then again...they could become material witnesses

I don't care how rude it is.  If your son was the last person seen with my missing daughter you better bet your a-- I'll be knocking on your door as soon as I find out where you live no matter what time it is.

No matter what culture, you understand when a family is looking for their daughter. Consider what  they would feel like if it was their son!

To RB (no quotes here): Jug Twitty's comment was two-fold. First, he said that Paulus Van der Sloot was "THE most obnoxious slimeball he had ever met." Let's get the whole quote in here. And Second, he said that he had an opportunity to question PVDS and that he was convinced -- from the very beginning -- that PVDS knew more than he was letting on. Further, Jug Twitty has his sources, and knows more than we do, and would have had ample opportunity to change his mind in the last 20 days.

Rude when accompanied by the police because their son was the last person seen with their missing daughter??

Quote:
Moreover, friends who waited for Natalee in the lobby until 5 a.m. said she never even arrived at the hotel.


CancunMole responded:  This is new. Everything that I've seen posted indicated that there were MB students out by the pool, not in the lobby.


Mole, there were students all over the hotel property, inside and out.  There was a group of 10-20 students mingling, coming and going, out by the pool from before 1:30 a.m. til after 5 a.m.   A great many students did not go to bed at all that night but moved in small groups here and there.  

The pool group's story was posted so often because their presence seemed to contradict the boys' story of dropping Nat off near the pool area.

I agree with you entirely RB!  And therein lies the underlying point, hes an "OBNOXIOUS SLIMEBALL"!


Thanks for pointing that out!

 

http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050618/NEWS01/50618004/1002

CancunMole, you're welcome - I expected flames and explosions.  Someone else mentioned that they wondered why Daddy VS got irate and it's very simple, really.  Provided he really isn't hiding anything, he probably felt he'd already ignored the rudeness by talking to the Twittys, and under the stress of their daughter missing, the Twittys probably because getting frustrated and, perhaps, slightly accusatory.  That would take the "rudeness" to a whole new level, and Daddy VS probably was irate at his "graciousness" being, as he's perceived it, taken advantage of.

Speculation of the scenario, of course.

The Twitty's were with the authorities. Opening the door to the police at 1 is considered rude?
If my teenager was out of the house and the authorities showed up I'd be opening that door in a second fearing something had happened to my child, that is unless I knew why they were there.

:roll:
they should put heads together thenand tell truth
b4 they have no heads??  i'd be crying too if something reaally bad
happened...

Understood, dragonfly.  I'd do the same thing - just trying to place this in context is all.

If I had information that could help a family find their missing daughter, I would not even look at a clock, I would help them.  I would not think the parents were rude, I would think that they were caring, loving people, in a fight against time.

me 2

The family must know some things that we don't.  They have controlled their rage till now, but there is a reason they can't control it any longer.

Whatever the result, I just wish everyone would tell the truth and get this resolved.

The culture does make a difference.  But I don't think it is all culture.

RB...the story is (as someone pointed out up above...thanks) that the Twitty's et al. went to the VDS house the evening Nat went missing...Pop left with them to take them to a casino where he thought Joran was.  Joran wasn't there but Pop got a cell phone call saying J was home.

So they all went back to the VDS house....

Seemed as if he was helping initially, then the conversation became heated.
_______________________
And wantsanswers:

If you feel the need to insult, go right ahead.  Since my name's not luna, doesn't bother me!  I just truly don't understand how they could search for anyone in roiling, very dark, shark invested waters with lots of rock and coral.  The idea is that the shark eat what's fed to them....correct?  Short of opening up the sharks, I just don't understand how anyone can be found.  My impression, gruesome as it is, is that all the body parts would be eaten.

Please point me to a link that specifically states they went with authorities.

RB: I appreciated that insight into the Dutch. We, as Americans, tend to think everyone will react as we would.

Jones' attorney Lejuez seemed pretty sharp to me but that probably would be a conflict of interest.[/quote]Yeah, from Holland!  That could work!  Good idea!

The pool group's story was posted so often because their presence seemed to contradict the boys' story of dropping Nat off near the pool area.[/quote]


u know they were all too wasted

I think RB is stating that to be the culture??? Not something they are used to. I don't think he/she is defending anybody.

Also I would wonder why my son was not concerned and trying to help  find this young lady.

http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050618/NEWS01/50618004/1002

Yeah Drag tellem bout it!

A part found on the surnimam police website about the case .

Judge BoB de Wit stated yesterday that they are going to keep the three young suspects for 8 more days

ORANJESTAD — Rechter-commissaris Bob Wit verklaarde gisteravond dat de bewaring van de drie jonge verdachten wordt verlengd met opnieuw acht dagen. Advocaat Ariean de Bie wilde geen toelichting geven op de inhoud van de zaak.

The hearing in the case was from early morning to 21.00 The three suspects were present at their hearing .And where fully questioned by judge de Wit. Satish kalpoe was the first , followed by his brother. And in the late afternoon they started with Joran. The prosecuter of Justice karen Jansen stated aftewards whas happy about the result.


De behandeling van de drie zaken duurde van ‘s ochtends vroeg tot negen uur ‘s avonds. De drie jongens waren bij de behandeling van hun zaak aanwezig en werden door rechter Wit uitgebreid ondervraagd. Satish Kalpoe zou als eerste aan de beurt zijn geweest, gevolgd door zijn broer Deepak. Pas aan het eind van de middag werd begonnen met de verlenging van de voorlopige hechtenis van Joran van der Sloot. Officier van Justitie Karin Janssen sprak na afloop van de drie zaken haar tevredenheid uit over het resultaat.

It was her job to convince The Judge why the three suspects should be detained  further . The Judge can order to retain suspects on bases od 3 principles
1. Risk of detanee escaping ,
2. Risk of detanee communicating with the other suspects in the case .
3. For importance of the investigation.

Obvious is that the points 2 and 3 where the most important reasons
Het was haar taak om de rechter-commissaris ervan te overtuigen dat het drietal langer vastgehouden moest worden. Daarvoor zijn in principe drie gronden mogelijk, te weten vluchtgevaar, risico voor onderling overleg tussen de personen in kwestie en het belang van het onderzoek. Duidelijk is dat vooral de laatste twee aspecten een belangrijke rol hebben gespeeld.

source http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/archief%20nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005/2005-06-nieuwsbronnen-internationaal/2005-00-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal-actueel.htm


Please note the second point that by law detanees suspected in the same case are not allowed to communicate which each other during the investigation . So that shines a differtent light on the statements made the security guards.

maybe he knew where she was and never expected them so soon to ask?

Good point.

From:  http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/06/details_of_the_.html   (Dan Riehl's site)


Cut and pasted from site above: The taxi driver provided more detailed information about Joran and the group decided to approach the police with the information they had gathered.  After discussing the information with the local police, the group, accompanied by two officers headed to the Van der Sloot home. The officers honked the horn repeatedly every few minutes in front of the house prior to the emergence of Joran's Father at approximately 12:30 am.

The taxi driver provided more detailed information about Joran and the group decided to approach the police with the information they had gathered.  After discussing the information with the local police, the group, accompanied by two officers headed to the Van der Sloot home. The officers honked the horn repeatedly every few minutes in front of the house prior to the emergence of Joran's Father at approximately 12:30 am.  

Joran was not home and his father told the group that he could be found playing poker at one of the casinos in the Palm Beach area of Aruba.  The group, including the father, headed off to locate the boy.  Upon arriving at the casino, the police, security guards, along with Natalee's parents are said to have "swarmed" onto the floor and at least one report states the police had their weapons drawn.

The young Van der Sloot was not located in the casino. Soon thereafter, Joran Van der Sloot placed a call to his Father's cell phone and informed him that he was at home.

Above information from:

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/week24/index.html

because him knew what happen to her

Does anyone know what Jug Twitty does for a living, where we works? My reason for asking this is being that they live in a very upscale, influential section of Birmingham I'm sure that through his work or people he knows they would be able to hire a very good lawyer through acquintances or work.

Personally, I would much prefer a lawyer that I knew or that I knew of to represent by best wishes.

I thought they went without authorities.  I read the authorities didn't get involved until later.  Right?

littletxlady

The police accompanied the Twittys - they were not privy to conversation, or Jug Twitty would not have said in his CNN interview a short while ago that he hadn't "shared" his conversation with Daddy VS with the police.

Regardless, you have to understand if there was a question about Joran Van der Sloot's involvement, Mr Van der Sloot would have expected all of this to come through the "normal" channels.  I'm not defending the VS's, I'm just saying I can see how this could get perceived in the manner it is by Jug Twitty.

Well, most Americans aren't used to people coming to their house at 1 AM either. :D   However, if it's a police matter, that's obviously a different story.  Now for someone in that situation to give misinformation to the police and the family in that situation is, well, sleazy.

No, authorities did go with them to the house of VDS their first night there looking for Nat.

It was not a police matter and police did not go to the door. Hence the honking of the horn. The told the party that if any of VDS came out they could speak to him but this was not a police matter because she had not been missing long enough.

wow you guys see this..?

An Aruban blogger from another site wrote that some of Natalee's belongings were found at Van Rijn's house...

http://www.nataleeholloway.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=43&PN=1

any resident from aruba can you confirm this..?

manager at a metal in birmingham i think  i forget the name

Nope!  Don't think you're right!  The Twitty's were very under control.  In fact Beth stayed in the car.  She didn't want to be close to him.  Yep, SLIMEBALL!

yeah-
and if i were joran , that guy would be my dad :wink:

That's not what I heard.  What I heard was that he wouldn't share details of that conversation with the media because it is part of the ongoing investigation.

I agree with your perspective.  I know the Dutch too and am not that enamoured of them.  I find them odd.  I could see how Dutch and Southerners might be like oil and water.  I too reflected on how a suspicious Dutch lawyer/bureacrat guy might react in the middle of the night if the cops and some gringos showed up and started grilling his kid.  Remember Dan reported a confontation.  "Jug" won't talk about it.  Van der Sloot probably started lawyering on him when the questions got too intrusive that night.  Van der Sloot is probably prohibited from speaking to the press for reasons of profesional discipline.  As to the scene of him running from cameras, what do you do when ambushed by the press as you are headed out and you can't talk?  You scurry off.  "Jug" called him a chicken.  "Jug" said he turns his stomach.  "Jug" gets all his media face time on his terms, with the right setting, the right background, etc.  He is a victim.  He has cast Van der Sloot as the villian.   Did you hear "like father Like Son"?   Poor van der sloot has to take it all silently like a man.  But then "jug" let on that he thinks this could be bigger than the three kids though they are not telling all they know.  By the way, "Jug" has  brother "Jar".  Are these indicative of parents in the white lightning business?  In any case, "Jug" has dropped his mask of good old boy southern charm today and showed he is real pissed.  I attribute it to culture shock.  He may not be used to prolonged stays foreign and he is distraught becasue of the loss of his stepdaughter.    

Aruba girl said last night that this was what she had been hearing, but could not confirm other than that is was local talk.

Either Arubagirl or Americaninaruba brought this up yesterday.  I don't believe it's confirmed yet.

which one is van rijns?

In raising 4 kids I've made my share of calls to other parents late at night.  I've never felt bad as I'd expect them to do the same.  As parents we all know how scary not knowing where your kids are is.

It's sort of a code of honor among parents.

Oh Yeah, the took the cops!

It'll be on again - but I distinctly heard him say he hadn't shared "that" (and I'm quoting him) conversation with police.

Lorenzo

Lorenzo Van Rijn.  He's the one who is crazy.  His father committed suicide by hanging 3 years ago.  Speculation that he is actually the illigitemate son of Paulas Van Der Sloot.

Where is that information coming from?  I have always had the impression that the police were with the parents during this confrontation.

Jug is a plant manager at a steel manufaturing plant in Bham

Comes from all the articles. It was not a police matter.

Thanks, absolut.