Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Natalee Discussions (2005 ARCHIVE) => Natalee Breaking News Archive => Topic started by: Catriana on June 21, 2005, 06:28:02 PM



Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Catriana on June 21, 2005, 06:28:02 PM
A new thread for news and discussions.

PLEASE visit the link below with Tom and Red's WEBLOG for summaries of the information gathered here.

www.scaredmonkeys.com
Please be sure to read the TROLLS announcement. Thank you.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A gentle reminder, that at times we get heated and angry over something we read. Perhaps something someone else says. When you feel yourself typing out things you would "never say to a person if they were standing in front of you", well.. that is the time to step away.

Get a coffee, watch some TV, hug your hubby/wife, take a walk, take a shower.... take a break. Go watch the sunset.

This is a highly emotional issue that has dragged on for weeks (and might go for weeks more).

Remember, we are all real people with real feelings. Sometimes, when we type out "words" they aren't taken in the same context that we meant them.

Give others the same latitude you would like them to give you. Don't assume the worst, look for how that person could have meant something other than the worst.

Life's too short. We are not lost... our loved ones know where we are.

Be thankful.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 06:31:14 PM
I think the person who wrote that translation program should consider a career change.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:31:17 PM
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:31:20 PM
lolol I had already tried pap, spainsh, portugese and for luck dutch on-line translators, and nothing came out any better than that....I figured we would have to wait for one of our Aruban friends


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: PoorPaulaNNJ on June 21, 2005, 06:31:26 PM
da wench wrote:
Okay, so what does THAT say??????


i have no idea.....but it made evryone shut up..hahahahahahaahaha
_________________
observations and dissertations
i cant believe i used my real name.....WTF?

Tooo Funny!!!!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 06:31:38 PM
Everybody is still figure that article out now?!! :lol:  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 06:31:48 PM
Why do they keep interviewing marianne croes, she repeats the same non-answer on every show


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 06:32:00 PM
it says something about ARUBA....and about NATALEE...and they asked if she could leave the island without her passport or any identification...and then asked if she could go to COLUMBIA or VENEZUELA...and he said probably not....blah blah...I have no idea...made my head hurt


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 06:32:45 PM
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:32:50 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


right i think you have that part right, I just think this is a boy who thinks he is a playa, playing with somone's life. I dont' think it has anything to do with the columbian neckties.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: littletxlady on June 21, 2005, 06:33:03 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
I think the person who wrote that translation program should consider a career change.

LMAO! my thoughts exactly!   :lol:  
Sure wish ther were better emoticons on here   :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:33:24 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


right i think you have that part right, I just think this is a boy who thinks he is a playa, playing with somone's life. I dont' think it has anything to do with the columbian neckties.



 and that is based on?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:34:28 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 06:34:57 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Just watched MSNBC news brief and they said there is now polygraph equipment on the island and if all parties agree, they may use it. Maybe this is old news -- apologies if it is. Gotta get back to work. <eom>


The FBI and polygraphs go hand in hand. From what I've read in news reports from Aruba with Aruban legal types, polygraphs are illegal. If the judge in the case finds out a polygraph was used then the case gets thrown out of court. :shock:


From http://www.riehlworldview.com/

Quote
Update
A source on the island tells me that he has confirmed that Joran was seen having a cream and wires attached to him in his location at the jail this evening and his interrogation continues while the two Kalpoe brothers have been taken to the prison, as has been previously reported.


This may well be true if the VdS' let Greta & BHT in for a 90 min chat. If the kid took a polygraph (and I'm making an assumption that since polys aren't used in the Dutch system, that the kid may not know they can be circumvented), it may have shown he's telling all he knows????????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:35:50 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


right i think you have that part right, I just think this is a boy who thinks he is a playa, playing with somone's life. I dont' think it has anything to do with the columbian neckties.



 and that is based on?


I guess, and that is what we are all doing who are not directly involved in the investigation, it is my hunch, my feeling deep in my gut. But then I thought mj molested boys...........lololol


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 06:35:59 PM
I am trying to catch up on my reading....but now I  am stuck on some "translation"... :?  :?:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 06:36:08 PM
tuberide wrote:
Quote
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks



I didn`t read that article tuberide but as far as I know the guards alibis checked already out. That`s why they are released.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Getagrip on June 21, 2005, 06:36:14 PM
I'll wait for someone who speaks papiamento to translate the article...
but the title reads something along the lines of "A crisis blown out of proportion"

Doesn't give me a good feeling at all  :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:36:16 PM
maybe joran accidentally drugged himself....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 06:36:17 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


-my point exactly, the newspaper article states that "both were seen in front of the hotels".....if they were no longer employed, how or why were they on the cameras?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 06:36:53 PM
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 06:37:07 PM
Pardon me.  What time will the Greta Mrs. Twitty VDS special be on tonight?  I am on the east coast.  :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Getagrip on June 21, 2005, 06:37:37 PM
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Pardon me.  What time will the Greta Mrs. Twitty VDS special be on tonight?  I am on the east coast.  :shock:

10 PM EST


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:38:53 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
maybe joran accidentally drugged himself....


well I bet there was some little sometin sometin being smoked.......or he could have even been doing some X


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:39:16 PM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


one thing x makes you stay up, not pass out.. so if he access to X, he has access to other underground party drugs, some of which can  kill in small doses. alotta those drugs are meant for animals....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 06:40:16 PM
Quote from: "Getagrip"
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Pardon me.  What time will the Greta Mrs. Twitty VDS special be on tonight?  I am on the east coast.  :shock:

10 PM EST


Thank you  :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:40:18 PM
right Rob, like special K...........ketamine


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: katya on June 21, 2005, 06:40:34 PM
Quote from: "Getagrip"
I'll wait for someone who speaks papiamento to translate the article...
but the title reads something along the lines of "A crisis blown out of proportion"

Doesn't give me a good feeling at all  :?


I can read the spanish part, and my take is the crisis out of proportion is people worrying about the tourist industry in Aruba, towards the end of the article he mentions how he studied in the US.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mbhs05 on June 21, 2005, 06:40:44 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


e thing x makes you stay up, not pass out.. so if he access to X, he has access to other underground party drugs, some of which can  kill in small doses. alotta those drugs are meant for animals....


But if it's mixed with alcohol? Does it still make you stay up?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:41:36 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
right Rob, like special K...........

right , you know...an underground drug culture would not like to be seen, however if there is a crime that has been committed, they may decide to off a coupke of witness, as to protect their business..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 06:42:09 PM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Just watched MSNBC news brief and they said there is now polygraph equipment on the island and if all parties agree, they may use it. Maybe this is old news -- apologies if it is. Gotta get back to work. <eom>


The FBI and polygraphs go hand in hand. From what I've read in news reports from Aruba with Aruban legal types, polygraphs are illegal. If the judge in the case finds out a polygraph was used then the case gets thrown out of court. :shock:


From http://www.riehlworldview.com/

Quote
Update
A source on the island tells me that he has confirmed that Joran was seen having a cream and wires attached to him in his location at the jail this evening and his interrogation continues while the two Kalpoe brothers have been taken to the prison, as has been previously reported.


This may well be true if the VdS' let Greta & BHT in for a 90 min chat. If the kid took a polygraph (and I'm making an assumption that since polys aren't used in the Dutch system, that the kid may not know they can be circumvented), it may have shown he's telling all he knows????????


I took a polygraph exam before, and there were no "cream or wires" :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:42:27 PM
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


e thing x makes you stay up, not pass out.. so if he access to X, he has access to other underground party drugs, some of which can  kill in small doses. alotta those drugs are meant for animals....


But if it's mixed with alcohol? Does it still make you stay up?


you would be able to drink more...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 06:44:08 PM
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


e thing x makes you stay up, not pass out.. so if he access to X, he has access to other underground party drugs, some of which can  kill in small doses. alotta those drugs are meant for animals....


But if it's mixed with alcohol? Does it still make you stay up?


I had a friend that did it once in college, we couldn't figure out what was wrong with her.  She was drinking as well.  She did not pass out from it.  I would describe her as acting more drunk, kind of slow, and moving her mouth constantly, but not passed out.  I would guess that you could have a bad reaction to it, but that's what I witnessed.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: littletxlady on June 21, 2005, 06:44:39 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


right i think you have that part right, I just think this is a boy who thinks he is a playa, playing with somone's life. I dont' think it has anything to do with the columbian neckties.



 and that is based on?

I was living in S.F. Haight Ashbury in the '60's and early '70's and I can attest to the fact a lot of us "kids" were "well connected" in circles that we had no idea how dangerous it was or what could happen. We just thought we were sooooo cool! Times have changed from then and now to be sure, it is a lot more dangerous now.....but kids still want to be "cool" That never changes. There is alot going on on these islands that are very dangerous whether linked to this particular case or not.
Not much is out of the realm that goes on on these islands. JMHO


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 06:44:51 PM
mbhs wrote:

Quote
But if it's mixed with alcohol? Does it still make you stay up?


As far as I know there`s a lot of "junk" X circle around also, and I`ve heard that when it is mixed with alcohol you are not up, but you could be very wel desorientated.

( by the way not my own experience but what I heard here in Holland  :) )


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 06:44:56 PM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 06:45:13 PM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Just watched MSNBC news brief and they said there is now polygraph equipment on the island and if all parties agree, they may use it. Maybe this is old news -- apologies if it is. Gotta get back to work. <eom>


The FBI and polygraphs go hand in hand. From what I've read in news reports from Aruba with Aruban legal types, polygraphs are illegal. If the judge in the case finds out a polygraph was used then the case gets thrown out of court. :shock:


From http://www.riehlworldview.com/

Quote
Update
A source on the island tells me that he has confirmed that Joran was seen having a cream and wires attached to him in his location at the jail this evening and his interrogation continues while the two Kalpoe brothers have been taken to the prison, as has been previously reported.


This may well be true if the VdS' let Greta & BHT in for a 90 min chat. If the kid took a polygraph (and I'm making an assumption that since polys aren't used in the Dutch system, that the kid may not know they can be circumvented), it may have shown he's telling all he knows????????


There is no "cream" involved in taking a polygraph.  The machine measures perspiration, blood pressure and breathing.  No electrodes or whatever that stuff is that you see in hospitals.

Oh, and BTW, they don't work!  I know from experience.  They are good tools against those that are guilty and can be pressured into a confession.  The reason that the rest of the world doesn't use them is because they know they are useless.  Two countries in the entire world use them, the US and Isreal.


Title: Don't know my drugs past a point
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 06:45:29 PM
Special K = ?
Ketamine?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:45:55 PM
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Title: translation
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 06:46:32 PM
THIS IS AS FAR AS I CAN GO RIGHT NOW.  SOUNDS LIKE PROPAGANDA.  IT IS ENOUGH TO GET AN IDEA.  NOT PERFECT.  WHAT A LANGUAGE.  I THINK IT IS CLOSEST TO LADINO, THE LANGUAGE OF THE JEWS EXILED FROM SPAIN BY THE INQUISITION, SOME OF WHOM ENDED UP IN THE ANTILLES.  

UN CRISIS FUERA DI PROPORCION!
A CRISIS OUT OF PROPORTION

Sin cu nos tabata kier ni a buske, Aruba a haya su mes den un luz basta negativo durante e ultimo dos simannan, pa motibo di un caso cu ta sigui mantene nos atencion claba riba dje.  WITHOUT WANTING OR LOOKING FOR IT ARUBA FINDS ITSELF IN A PRETTY NEGATIVE LIGHT THE LAST TWO WEEKS BECAUSE OF A CASE THAT CAPTIVATES OUR ATTENTION.  

E tin e apariencia di no ta bayendo ningun caminda, cu el a stanca, cu e speranza di haya Natalee cu bida ta menguando. Hopi hende, tanto local como stranhero, a buske tur caminda sin exito. A usa ekiponan sofistica y cachonan experto den localiza curpanan dera sin resultadonan positivo. E mucha muher ta sigui desapareci, el a somenta sin laga hueya, creando un misterio cu ta bayendo pa largo.

IT APPEARS IT IS NOT GOING WELL, THAT IT IS STAGNATED.  THE HOPE OF FINDING NATALEE ALIVE IS DISAPPEARING.  HOPE IS FADING BOTH LOCAL AND FOREIGN AS THE SEARCH GOES ON WITHOUT SUCCESS THAT THE SEACH IS WITHOUT SUCCESS.  SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT  AND DOGS THAT FIND BODIES ARE WITHOUT POSITIVE RESULT.  THE GIRL IS STILL DISAPPEARED WITHOUT A TRACE CREATING A MYSTERY THAT GOES ON TOO LONG.
   
Ta unda a keda nos pa buske? E lo ta scondi den algun cas, protegi pa algun amigo o conocido, of e ta ser reteni contra su voluntad pa cualke grupo iregular? E por a yega Merca? No ta importa si el a laga su pasaporte atras, pasobra Americanonan por sali di Aruba cu cualke carchi di identificacion manera rijbewijs, carchi di seguro social, o certificado di nacimento.

WHERE CAN WE LOOK THAT HAS NOT BEEN SEARCHED?  IS SHE HIDDEN IN SOME HOUSE, PROTECTED BY SOME FRIEND OR ACQUAINTANCE OR IS SHE BEING HELD AGAINST HER WILL BY SOME IRREGULAR GROUP?  IT IS NOT IMPORTANT THAT SHE LEFT HER PASSPORT BEHIND.  AN AMERICAN CAN LEAVE ARUBA ON ANY ID, DRIVERS LICENCE, SOCIAL SECURITY CARD OR BIRTH CERTIFICATE

E por ta na Venezuela o Colombia? E ta improbable, pero semper e posibilidad ey ta keda existi. Cu un lancha rapido bo por yega e costa mas cercano di Falcon den mey hora. Si e ta na bida ainda, di con no por a haye cu tanto esfuerzo cu a ser desplega y tanto voluntario cu a rondea den delaster pida mondi y costa na Aruba? Y si e ta morto, pakico no por a localiza ni rastro di su restonan?

IS SHE IN VENEZUELA OR COLOMBIA?  IT IS NOT PROBABLE BUT THERE  IS ALWAYS A POSSIBILITY.   A FAST BOAT CAN ARRIVE IN FALCON IN A HALF HOUR.  IF SHE IS STILL ALIVE, WHY CAN'T SHE BE FOUND WITH THE MASSIVE EFORT AND SO MANY VOLUNTEERS SEARCHING THE HILLS AND COAST OF ARUBA.  AND IF DEAD, WHY IS THERE NO TRACE OF HER REMAINS?  

Cu e caso aki por afecta turismo? Claro cu si, pero esey no ta nos preocupacion primordial. Loke tin nos angustia ta Natalee mes. Cualke caida den turismo nos por recupera, pero Natalee ta keda iremplazable! Ta e factor humano ta ocupa nos mentenan y curazonnan, pasobra e parti material, o sea turismo, nos por remedia. Ta e dolor di su famia nos ta comparti, ta e angustia di e mayornan a acapara nos compasion.

COULD THE CASE AFFECT ON TOURISM?  SURELY BUT THAT IS NOT THE MAIN CONCERN.  WE WILL RECOVER FROM ANY DROP IN TOURISM.  BUT NATALEE WILL REMAIN IRREPLACEABLE.  IT IS THE HUMAN FACTOR THAT OCCUPIES OUR MINDS AND HEARTS ABOVE THE MATERIAL CONCERNS, OR TOURISM, WHICH WE CAN REPAIR.  WE SHARE THE PAIN OF THE FAMILY AND THEIR AGONY CAPTURES OUR COMPASSION.  

ta conserva e opinion cu ni maske cuanto hende pinta Aruba preto na Merca, semper tin otronan cu ta defende nos isla pasobra nan conoce y nan sa cu Aruba ta keda un di e lugarnan mas sigur na mundo.  

THE FACT REMAINS THAT WHEN SOMEBODY PAINTS ARUBA BLACK IN THE MARKET, THERE IS ALWAYS ANOTHER WHO KNOWS ARUBA REMAINS ONE OF THE SAFEST PLACES IN THE WORLD.  

No ta e beyeza di nos beachnan so a yama e atencion di e turistanan cu ta bishita nos isla repetidamente y den gran cantidad, ta e calidad humano di nos poblacion a conkista nan curazonnan.

IT IS NOT JUST THE BEAUTIFUL BEACHES THAT ATTRACT ATTENTION  OF TOURISTS WHO VISIT OVER AND OVER AGIN AND IN LARGE NUMBERS BUT ALSO THE HUMAN QUALITY OF OUR POPULATION WHICH CONQUEST THEIR HEARTS

 Ta e trato cu nan a ricibi di nos hendenan a haya eco den nan sentimentonan, pesey awor nan ta recompensa nos cu nan palabranan cari¤oso; cu nan defensanan na fabor di nos isla; cu nan protestanan publico contra esnan cu sin conoce nos isla o nos pueblo ta asina dispuesto di expresa opinionnan negativo sin e aval di realidad.

THE TREATMENT THEY RECEIVE FINDS ECHO IN THEIR SENTIMENTS  AND IS COMPENSATED IN THEIR AFFECTIONATE WORDS WHICH DEFEND THE ISLAND AND PROTEST PUBLICLY AGAINST THOSE WHO WITHOUT KNOWING THE ISLAND EXPRESS NEGATIVE OPINIONS WITHOUT THE BACKING OF REALITY.  

Pasobra Aruba no ta un lugar unda criminalidad tin un incidencia halto, un caso manera esaki por a logra tanto atencion den exterior. E ta un incidente aisla, perpetra pa elemento(nan) aheno na nos cultura, na nos disposicion pacifico, na nos caracter amplio, abierto, y decente como Pueblo.

BECAUSE ARUBA IS NOT A PLACE WITH A HIGH CRIME RATE, ONE CASE LIKE THIS ONE CAN GRAB ATTENTION OVERSEAS.  IT IS AN ISOLATED INCIDEN  PERPETRATED BY ELEMENTS ALIEN TO OUR CULTURE, OUR PEACEFUL DISPOSITION OUR AMPLE CHARACTER, OPEN AND DECENT AS A PEOPLE

 
E ta ademas, un caso lora den nubianan di misterio cada vez mas denso, menos penetrable hasta pa e wowonan mas experto den e mundo policial y investigativo. Esaki ta un desaparicion cu no a laga evidencianan palpable, algo solido riba cual Polis por traha.

Fuera di esey, mi tin entendi cu e detenidonan no ta bisando nada adicional, sino simplemente cu nan a laga Natalee (cu o sin Joran) riba e tereno un tiki panoord di Marriott hotel. E storia aki nan ta sigui ripiti cu insistencia, aunke tin tambe varios discrepancia den nan declaracionnan.

Pa loke ta trata e eficiencia di nos cuerpo Policial, no laga ningun hende ga¤a nan mes: e ta di e mihornan den nos region, y sigur uno cu nos por bisa cu conviccion di ta hopi profesional.

Nos cu a sigui nan actividadnan durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan di cerca por bisa den voz halto cu ta trata di un cuerpo policial cu tin un integridad grandi, y esey ta descarta cualke posibilidad di un tapamento o un complicidad basa riba amistad cu un of otro familiar di cualke un di e detenidonan.

Den mi buki di tur e hechonan delictivo cu a tuma lugar riba nos isla durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan, e actuacionnan certero di e Cuerpo Policial di Aruba ta skirbi cu leternan di oro!

E caso di Natalee a pone nos den un crisis emocional grandi, y otronan cu no conoce nos isla y no sa con nos Pueblo ta razona, a convirtie den un crisis publicitario fuera di tur proporcion.

Na Aruba no ta existi criminalnan cu ta cana rond pa inventa maldad na cada paso; nos no tin e sicopatanan cu ta pasa man pa un revolver y ta cuminza dispara pa loco contra hendenan inocente; Aruba ta un isla trankilo, yen di humanismo y consideracion pa e bienestar di otronan.

Pesey, na nomber di tur loke ta husto, ta tempo pa e imagen negativo cu voluntariamente of involuntariamente a ser crea di nos isla pa algun medio di comunicacion cu no tabata sa mes unda Aruba ta keda, ser coregi.

Ta pesey tambe cu algun di nos a acepta pa duna declaracionnan na un of otro canal di television Mericano, no pa busca fama o crea un imagen cu lo desaparece hunto cu e regreso di e medionan ey, sino pa purba contraresta e da¤o cu a ser causa pa e misterio aki.

No ta kedami nada otro di bisa sino cu mi ta spera cu Natalee ta bibo y cu e lo haya e caminda di regreso pa su cas, su famianan y su amigonan na Birmingham, ciudad cu mi conoce bon, y e Pueblo di Alabama cu, segun mi experiencia personal na e Estado ey, ta igual na esun di nos den e grandeza di su curazon y su sentido di compasion.

Al fin y al cabo mi a studia y a gradua na Mobile, Alabama, y por papia cu cierto autoridad di e cualidadnan humano di su Pueblo. No ban yega na conclusionnan ekiboca tocante esey djis pasobra un canal sin importancia ni alcance nacional, a hinca den su cabez pa haci un yamado pa un boycot cu no ta bay haya oido ni acogida den e resto di e poblacion Americano, y cu no ta ahusta su mes tampoco na e concepto Americano di "fair play.”

http://www.diarioaruba.com/dialuna/editorial/index.html
Back to top


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mbhs05 on June 21, 2005, 06:48:01 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


But it was longer than that until they picked the boys up. I'm just wondering if they left her at the beach and this is someone else's doing...I just can't imagine a person that can go to school the next day after doing something really bad to a girl. But I guess they exist.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 06:48:17 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:
NOOOOO I WANT HER ALIVE....let's do THAT scenerio!!!!  K?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:49:06 PM
Quote
Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:



that is kind of the lines I am thinking Inspector, I just haven't jumped into the drug lord involvement yet.

What do you think about Natalee's mom saying Natalee was at Joran's house 3 am?


Title: Re: translation
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 06:49:31 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
i volunteer to translate this but it will take a while.  headline is crisis out of proportion  


Could someone please translate this editoral for me? It's from Diario Aruba:


It says, "This is rumor and speculation....don't bother reading"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 06:49:35 PM
Maybe if it was Joran who tried to commit suicide, then the wires had to do with him being monitored for his hart or something.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 06:50:29 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Hey Rob, youre okay. AND they answer your posts/questions.
Ive tried getting a rise about the sudden serious crime wave on crime free Aruba for days.
Maybe you could ask if there was ever any followups on the person being drug off  ( didnt seem willingly)the beach at approx 3am
 that night.
Hang in there !!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 06:50:47 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote
Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:



that is kind of the lines I am thinking Inspector, I just haven't jumped into the drug lord involvement yet.

What do you think about Natalee's mom saying Natalee was at Joran's house 3 am?


I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on.  Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:51:19 PM
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


But it was longer than that until they picked the boys up. I'm just wondering if they left her at the beach and this is someone else's doing...I just can't imagine a person that can go to school the next day after doing something really bad to a girl. But I guess they exist.


sadly sweetie, you could be onto something there. If these guys did something to her, and I think they did-----I bet he could go to school, just be freaked the whole day, wondering if someone found her or not. Then again if she was at his house, he could have hid her for quite some time.....hours I mean


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AnnieMW1 on June 21, 2005, 06:51:48 PM
I'm sorry...I'm about 13 pages behind.  My husband just told me that Natalee was in the Van Der Sloot home that last nite, per the meeting arranged with Greta Van Sustern and the VDS parents.  Does everybody already know about this?  [probably old news by now...]  I can't f'ing belive it!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:52:07 PM
Quote from: "mbhs05"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


But it was longer than that until they picked the boys up. I'm just wondering if they left her at the beach and this is someone else's doing...I just can't imagine a person that can go to school the next day after doing something really bad to a girl. But I guess they exist.


they do indeed.... my friend was murder while i was in aruba last year, he was here in pittsburgh. should have been in aruba with me...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04196/346094.stm


 but anyway, the group from the trip was in  the lobby at 5 am and didnt see natalee, hence she is not there, postive confirmantion that she does not appear in the lobby to leave. that leaves 3 am to 5 pm.. not much time


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 06:53:02 PM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:
NOOOOO I WANT HER ALIVE....let's do THAT scenerio!!!!  K?


I'm with ya on that waitingtoknow.  Beth seems confident that she is alive so I'll stick with her...I know it's a mother's love thing but it feels better.

:::sticking head in sand:::


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 06:53:49 PM
sorry about your loss Rob.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 06:53:56 PM
Quote from: "AnnieMW1"
I'm sorry...I'm about 13 pages behind.  My husband just told me that Natalee was in the Van Der Sloot home that last nite, per the meeting arranged with Greta Van Sustern and the VDS parents.  Does everybody already know about this?  [probably old news by now...]  I can't f'ing belive it!!!


We've been discussing this rumor too.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:54:42 PM
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Hey Rob, youre okay. AND they answer your posts/questions.
Ive tried getting a rise about the sudden serious crime wave on crime free Aruba for days.
Maybe you could ask if there was ever any followups on the person being drug off  ( didnt seem willingly)the beach at approx 3am
 that night.
Hang in there !!


i heard about it but just not too much, i m kinda in the dark on that one.. i know of the supposed incident, but not much more....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 06:55:02 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Dash said that she saw her when they were all leaving the bar...she said Natalee's eyes looked heavy....kinda wierd...but she was not drunk...

this tells me that either she was EXTREMELY TIRED...or had some type of DRUG in her....most likely it was put in her drink without her knowledge

RUMOR is ...that Joran is an X dealer....so makes me think that this could be some type of drug crime....obviously the crime of giving her a drug...but also, maybe one of his suppliers took her.....hence the RUMOR that she was taken against her will ....somebody said they saw that happening..RUMOR

dunno...head still hurting from the translation :?


Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:
NOOOOO I WANT HER ALIVE....let's do THAT scenerio!!!!  K?


I'm with ya on that waitingtoknow.  Beth seems confident that she is alive so I'll stick with her...I know it's a mother's love thing but it feels better.

:::sticking head in sand:::
A mother's intuition is VERY STRONG... I believe in it...and will stick by that as well....!! :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 06:56:01 PM
da wench wrote:

Quote
I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on. Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying



No offense but I can also imagine that thru grieve and anger your view can be sometimes different. But on the otherhand I think you are right that a mothers intuition is rarely wrong.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 06:57:00 PM
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Hey Rob, youre okay. AND they answer your posts/questions.
Ive tried getting a rise about the sudden serious crime wave on crime free Aruba for days.
Maybe you could ask if there was ever any followups on the person being drug off  ( didnt seem willingly)the beach at approx 3am
 that night.
Hang in there !!


May I ask where this item is from? I don't remember seeing this one before. Thanks.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Nicole on June 21, 2005, 06:57:02 PM
This is turning into a media circus and smells of sensationalism.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 06:57:21 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
sorry about your loss Rob.


i just want it resolved....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05125/499201.stm

thanks for your compassion


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 06:57:44 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
I think the person who wrote that translation program should consider a career change.


Like reading Yoda's version of papiamento, that was.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: pinemeadows on June 21, 2005, 06:57:54 PM
Quote
[But it was longer than that until they picked the boys up. I'm just wondering if they left her at the beach and this is someone else's doing...I just can't imagine a person that can go to school the next day after doing something really bad to a girl. But I guess they exist.


I can't either, but  there could be someone else involved who handled all this...thus he can't really confess if his dad stepped in to help.  Do you suppose she was at the house because they couldn't revive her?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 06:58:01 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
da wench wrote:

Quote
I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on. Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying



No offense but I can also imagine that thru grieve and anger your view can be sometimes different. But on the otherhand I think you are right that a mothers intuition is rarely wrong.


I dunno, my mom still knows when I'm getting into trouble...and she's 2000 miles away.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: bob_in_MD on June 21, 2005, 06:58:34 PM
Maybe I put too much emphasis on appearance alone, but I don't think any of those kids look like the type who would intentionally harm someone.  I saw the photos of them trying to look badass (like gangsters), but lots of kids do that stuff.

I'm leaning more toward the idea that, as one of them reportedly said, "something bad" happened to Natalee - probably while they were with her. I don't know what it could be.  Maybe she overdosed on something, maybe she fell into the sea accidentally (or got swept away while swimming).

I think those kids are just too scared to tell the Aruban authorities the truth because they fear that they'll be blamed for what happened.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AnnieMW1 on June 21, 2005, 06:58:44 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "AnnieMW1"
I'm sorry...I'm about 13 pages behind.  My husband just told me that Natalee was in the Van Der Sloot home that last nite, per the meeting arranged with Greta Van Sustern and the VDS parents.  Does everybody already know about this?  [probably old news by now...]  I can't f'ing belive it!!!


We've been discussing this rumor too.


And the details of this, assuming it's true, is that she was at the VDS home at 3a?  WHen did she leave?  And with whom? ANd how did she get there - via Deepak mobile?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 06:59:17 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
da wench wrote:

Quote
I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on. Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying



No offense but I can also imagine that thru grieve and anger your view can be sometimes different. But on the otherhand I think you are right that a mothers intuition is rarely wrong.
two cases that I have seen recently....one...a little boy near here went missing..the mother said on tv that she just knew her son was dead...some time later, he was found dead

another case is the boyscout...his mother said on tv that she knew he was alive....he was found today alive

I know that these are only 2 cases..but there are so many more...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 06:59:44 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 07:00:18 PM
Rob...sorry to hear about your friend...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 07:01:39 PM
Quote from: "amillerwvu"
Rob...sorry to hear about your friend...


thanks i apprciate it.....chad was an awesome person....excellent artist, and great sense of humor...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:02:03 PM
Quote from: "AnnieMW1"
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "AnnieMW1"
I'm sorry...I'm about 13 pages behind.  My husband just told me that Natalee was in the Van Der Sloot home that last nite, per the meeting arranged with Greta Van Sustern and the VDS parents.  Does everybody already know about this?  [probably old news by now...]  I can't f'ing belive it!!!


We've been discussing this rumor too.


And the details of this, assuming it's true, is that she was at the VDS home at 3a?  WHen did she leave?  And with whom? ANd how did she get there - via Deepak mobile?


Annie - Beth was supposedly there with Greta VanSustren,,,NOT Natelee


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 07:02:06 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
sorry about your loss Rob.


i just want it resolved....

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05125/499201.stm

thanks for your compassion


OMG! :shock: I bet you do, how horrible for all of those who loved him


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: bob_in_MD on June 21, 2005, 07:02:18 PM
Quote from: "Professor"

We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


The "panty boy" story????  What the hell is that?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 07:03:19 PM
thats why i get so involved when i hear someone is missing... chad was missing for like a week. and it was hell to get info when i was in aruba...he was found under 20 bags of concrete....


Title: Re: Don't know my drugs past a point
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 07:03:56 PM
Quote from: "Lausa"
Special K = ?
Ketamine?


Animal tranq used by vets. Can be cooked and ingested (snorted mostly, I think).  No personal knowledge - James St. James "Disco Bloodbath" and Owen's "Clubland" books about NYC's Michael Alig.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 07:04:03 PM
So Mr. VDS picked up Joran and Natalee at MCD's after they were "left"?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:04:33 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


thanks PROfessor, i was questioning the details of their alibis because of this reported video footage of them....anyone have link or details of mickey john and friends alibis?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 07:04:36 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
thats why i get so involved when i hear someone is missing... chad was missing for like a week. and it was hell to get info when i was in aruba...he was found under 20 bags of concrete....


Not much of a vacation for you...How horrible!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 07:05:16 PM
Quote
TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria


?!? I missed that one. Is this something that emerged subsequent to application of hot and cold rooms and cream and electrodes?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:05:22 PM
waitingtoknow wrote:


Quote
two cases that I have seen recently....one...a little boy near here went missing..the mother said on tv that she just knew her son was dead...some time later, he was found dead

another case is the boyscout...his mother said on tv that she knew he was alive....he was found today alive

I know that these are only 2 cases..but there are so many more...



I agree on that I know b/c my mother seems to know always what I`m up to.  But just as I say thru grieve and anger your vision also can be sometimes a little blurry. That does not mean that I think that that`s the case with natalee`s mom .


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 07:05:33 PM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "HannieC"
da wench wrote:

Quote
I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on. Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying



No offense but I can also imagine that thru grieve and anger your view can be sometimes different. But on the otherhand I think you are right that a mothers intuition is rarely wrong.
two cases that I have seen recently....one...a little boy near here went missing..the mother said on tv that she just knew her son was dead...some time later, he was found dead

another case is the boyscout...his mother said on tv that she knew he was alive....he was found today alive

I know that these are only 2 cases..but there are so many more...


I know I keep bringing up this girl, but Elizabeth Smart's family never gave up hope finding her alive either.  They kept saying they felt in their hearts she was alive...and lo and behold....


Title: Latest news from Arizona
Post by: martin connahey on June 21, 2005, 07:06:05 PM
This just in: All Comedy Radio in Arizona- 1480 AM - had a "special" today on the Aruba case. They reported that Gary Condit has NOT yet been questioned, but that as soon as Ted Kennedy sobers up, they'll ask him about nh (and several other missing girls).

Just emailed the authorities in Aruba with my suggestion that detainees be transferred to Gitmo. [That'll make 'em talk].

I've seen all sorts of stories here; insider chat, bracelet-sale promos, teary-eyed ribbon people cyber-hugging each other, etc, especially during slow news cycles. Will continue to call 'em like I see 'em, tho ( entitled to my opinion-- and, yeah, it's too bad I have to keep repeating that ).

And in resp to one post; No, we are NOT all here for the same reason. Some for news reporting, some to ask questions, ... as many reasons as posters perhaps. That's real diversity, my friend.  ( As opposed to fake PC diversity which abhors true difference of opinion ). Many types of people here, contradictory opinions, numerous ways of talking/writing/thinking, varied news sources, you-name-it.

More breaking news: There's a girl over at The Onion site who is selling Natalee Holloway STATUES for a hundred-buck a pop. Not sure if it's serious or not, but my dashboard could sure use some sprucing up!

May G-d bless the beasts and the children.

-MC


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 07:06:21 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
So Mr. VDS picked up Joran and Natalee at MCD's after they were "left"?


rumor..........rumor that daddy sloot picked up joran at mickeedee's at 3 am


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 07:06:31 PM
Quote from: "amillerwvu"
Quote from: "Rob"
thats why i get so involved when i hear someone is missing... chad was missing for like a week. and it was hell to get info when i was in aruba...he was found under 20 bags of concrete....


Not much of a vacation for you...How horrible!


if im asked to help, i ll help.. i will be in aruba jun25 and if they ask for help i will help.. i just dont want to get in anybodys way...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: rogers on June 21, 2005, 07:06:39 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


thanks PROfessor, i was questioning the details of their alibis because of this reported video footage of them....anyone have link or details of mickey john and friends alibis?

Perhaps their alibis checked out, but not in the manner we presumed.
i.e. they were at the HI, but not at a time possible for Natalee to have been there.  After all, now we know that she never came back to that spot.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:07:00 PM
Quote
TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria



Again??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 07:07:08 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


thanks PROfessor, i was questioning the details of their alibis because of this reported video footage of them....anyone have link or details of mickey john and friends alibis?


Look at the date. They were released on the night of the 13/14.


Title: Re: Latest news from Arizona
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 07:08:16 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
This just in: All Comedy Radio in Arizona- 1480 AM - had a "special" today on the Aruba case. They reported that Gary Condit has NOT yet been questioned, but that as soon as Ted Kennedy sobers up, they'll ask him about nh (and several other missing girls).

Just emailed the authorities in Aruba with my suggestion that detainees be transferred to Gitmo. [That'll make 'em talk].

I've seen all sorts of stories here; insider chat, bracelet-sale promos, teary-eyed ribbon people cyber-hugging each other, etc, especially during slow news cycles. Will continue to call 'em like I see 'em, tho ( entitled to my opinion-- and, yeah, it's too bad I have to keep repeating that ).

And in resp to one post; No, we are NOT all here for the same reason. Some for news reporting, some to ask questions, ... as many reasons as posters perhaps. That's real diversity, my friend.  ( As opposed to fake PC diversity which abhors true difference of opinion ). Many types of people here, contradictory opinions, numerous ways of talking/writing/thinking, varied news sources, you-name-it.

More breaking news: There's a girl over at The Onion site who is selling Natalee Holloway STATUES for a hundred-buck a pop. Not sure if it's serious or not, but my dashboard could sure use some sprucing up!

May G-d bless the beasts and the children.

-MC


why do i get the impression you write for the onion...?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 07:08:21 PM
regarding polygraphs

even if they are not admissible as evidence and I believe they are not admissible as evidence in some of the US states, they are still investigative tools to eliminate suspects........


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:08:38 PM
OK-to answer the Extasy ?'s

1. Mixing the drug with alcohol is a NO NO--it makes u super sick-like vomitting sick

2.  If u r in clubs or know someone on X they will drink plenty of water-u see them carrying water bottles around versus alcohol

3.  They are very hyper--walking around, talking-can not sit still.  Will chew on something

4.  Overall--this drug messes with your nervous system--they act very paranoid and hyper

Hope this helps.  I knew people who tried this before and found out after my cousins murder ("mob style") he was dealing and using :(

FYI--just heard on Fox:

The judge will not even listen to the Holloway families attorney they hired in Aruba until the suspects are formally charged where right now they are formally accused.

Also, JVDS father they said is only a "civil worker" (not sure if that is exact-I know CIVIL is righ)--not a judge or any kind of high status person


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 07:08:47 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria


?!? I missed that one. Is this something that emerged subsequent to application of hot and cold rooms and cream and electrodes?


Nope this one came out yesterday.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: watchingclosely on June 21, 2005, 07:09:44 PM
Wow!  I cannot keep up with this site.  I was posting under this name on hcgtv.com and while i cannot read all of your posts, i haven't seen anything to dissuade me from the conclusions i reach having been to Aruba on business several times, to that bar even more times, most recently about two weeks before this incident arose.  It would take me forever to figure out how to lift my conclusions from the other cite and post them here---maybe someone more savvy can do it, but i do think JVDS did it, maybe by accident and/or drug overdose, is used to getting his way and thinks the law does not apply.  I think daddy VDS helped intially at least buy some time to clean up evidence, nail down story, etc.  I do think Natalee is unfortunately sleeping with the fishes, either tied down or shark bait.  I think the sex slave trade stuff is BS in this instance.  What we have here is a punk that thinks he knows everything, is entitled, a sociopath, etc, etc.  Sorry if all i say is old news, but like i said i cannot keep up with this site---it moves too fast.  This case tugs at me having just been there and watching the sharks at work at C&C's in person!  Thanks.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 07:09:48 PM
Maybe I am behind...

CNN is reporting that Mrs. Twitty was invited into the Sloot house while passing out prayer slips.  No confirmation on the conversation, but they said she (BT) did look calm when she left.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:10:10 PM
Rob--so sorry to hear--I can definately sympathize with u..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 07:11:45 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Hey Rob, youre okay. AND they answer your posts/questions.
Ive tried getting a rise about the sudden serious crime wave on crime free Aruba for days.
Maybe you could ask if there was ever any followups on the person being drug off  ( didnt seem willingly)the beach at approx 3am
 that night.
Hang in there !!


i heard about it but just not too much, i m kinda in the dark on that one.. i know of the supposed incident, but not much more....


Wasnt Jorans latest story he left her asleep on the beach ?? ( Jerk if he did or maybe he picked up on that report and used it. He left her, two others seen dragging her off )


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 07:12:37 PM
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "Rob"
first of all, i know for a fact that there is an xtacy problem, so dont tell me that there is no one collecting the money. free xtacy.hahahahaha.. youre not paying attention....


Hey Rob, youre okay. AND they answer your posts/questions.
Ive tried getting a rise about the sudden serious crime wave on crime free Aruba for days.
Maybe you could ask if there was ever any followups on the person being drug off  ( didnt seem willingly)the beach at approx 3am
 that night.
Hang in there !!


i heard about it but just not too much, i m kinda in the dark on that one.. i know of the supposed incident, but not much more....


Wasnt Jorans latest story he left her asleep on the beach ?? ( Jerk if he did or maybe he picked up on that report and used it. He left her, two others seen dragging her off )


stories are changing hourly now....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: clevfan1234 on June 21, 2005, 07:14:11 PM
FYI, Alan Colmes is also LIVE in Aruba tonight, so watch Hannity & Colmes at 9pm Eastern as well on Fox


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 07:15:44 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Quote
TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria



Again??


From before:

DT  Location: Mississippi  Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:10 pm  
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote
americaninaruba wrote:
apparently some on sent infromation to TOP95 saying that a black man ,25years old, checked in to a hotel inNigeria with a girl undr the name of Natalee Holloway...we dont know if this is true its just a message that was sent to him thourgh the internet.....(doy ou think its possible?) OHMY!


Nigeria, don't think that it is possible.
 


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 07:15:46 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


And don't forget the supposed rumor "on the street" that the Holloways were defensive about taking a polygraphic examination. First, how would anyone on the street have access to the Holloways, and Second, why on earth would the Holloways be defensive about a polygraph? I would think they would welcome the introduction of polygraphic technology into this investigation. It just didn't add up.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Nicole on June 21, 2005, 07:16:50 PM
She can't be in Nigeria or anywhere else. She left her passport in her room.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 21, 2005, 07:17:13 PM
Quote from: "watchingclosely"
Wow!  I cannot keep up with this site.  I was posting under this name on hcgtv.com and while i cannot read all of your posts, i haven't seen anything to dissuade me from the conclusions i reach having been to Aruba on business several times, to that bar even more times, most recently about two weeks before this incident arose.  It would take me forever to figure out how to lift my conclusions from the other cite and post them here---maybe someone more savvy can do it, but i do think JVDS did it, maybe by accident and/or drug overdose, is used to getting his way and thinks the law does not apply.  I think daddy VDS helped intially at least buy some time to clean up evidence, nail down story, etc.  I do think Natalee is unfortunately sleeping with the fishes, either tied down or shark bait.  I think the sex slave trade stuff is BS in this instance.  What we have here is a punk that thinks he knows everything, is entitled, a sociopath, etc, etc.  Sorry if all i say is old news, but like i said i cannot keep up with this site---it moves too fast.  This case tugs at me having just been there and watching the sharks at work at C&C's in person!  Thanks.
Welcome to Monkeyland...I appreciate your post...don't agree with it all...but thanks for posting it.  (I think she is alive)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:17:52 PM
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:17:56 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.


And don't forget the supposed rumor "on the street" that the Holloways were defensive about taking a polygraphic examination. First, how would anyone on the street have access to the Holloways, and Second, why on earth would the Holloways be defensive about a polygraph? I would think they would welcome the introduction of polygraphic technology into this investigation. It just didn't add up.


Fugetaboutit...the polygraph...ain't gonna happen...shouldn't happen.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 07:17:57 PM
Also just reported on CNN.  The US has sent 2 behavioral specialists that will sit in on interrigations of the subjects.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 07:18:33 PM
Okay, monkeys, don't laugh.  Some of you remember that a couple of days ago I posted that I was contacting Sylvia Browne.  This is the response I got today:

Thank you for your email and compassion towards the situation with Natalee. Sylvia adheres to psychic etiquette which means, she does not offer psychic information to families of missing/murder cases unless she is asked by the immediate family or police working on the case.
Natalee's family is in such distress and grief Sylvia would in no way add to that by offering to help when the family does not ask or want a psychic's help.
We have added Natalee's family to our prayer list in hopes that they find closure to this horific situation they are in.
Blessings,
Vera


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:18:40 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "HannieC"
da wench wrote:

Quote
I don't know about anyone else, but I think a mother's intuition is right on. Beth Twitty has met these people in person and if she thinks they are lying, I think they are lying



It will be very intersting, if the information is released, what was talked about at the home:

A.  If NH was there at 3am-Did Mrs VDS see her-how did she look-how was she acting--this can end many speculations of NH(drinking/drugs)
B.  To find out what time she left
C. Who was all at the house
D. When left-how did she get back

But god--when I was 17 and it was a school night-my curfew was 10pm--I was in trouble with my parents and questioned when I was 21 why I would be coming home at 4-5am--after a night of dancing with the girls.  I am 28 and married and my mom STILL ?'s me on things I do--


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:19:15 PM
Quote from: "Nicole"
She can't be in Nigeria or anywhere else. She left her passport in her room.


dont be so naive...there are ways around almost everything in life


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:19:52 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


That story would be fine if the boys weren't lying from the beginning.  They lied because they fear the truth.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mitzid66 on June 21, 2005, 07:20:16 PM
Regarding X:

Does anyone remember the Andrew Luster story?  The Max Factor Heir?  He was using liquid x on the girls he picked up.  He did offer one water.  Maybe it was in the water.  When they found the videos he made of women he drugged, they appeared "dead" or "comatose" while he took advantage.  

Maybe what Dash observed was the later effects of this after the "hyper" portion subsides.  

And the polygraph should not  involve cream and electrodes.  Maybe we could all hope for electroshock therapy of some sort.  

Just my thoughts...

Thanks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 07:20:17 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "Nicole"
She can't be in Nigeria or anywhere else. She left her passport in her room.


dont be so naive...there are ways around almost everything in life


This is true, but they sure as hell would NOT have her check in under her own name....DUH!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:20:24 PM
this is so difficult to keep up with! you guys just started a new forum 3 seconds ago and you already have this many pages??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 07:20:29 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "amillerwvu"
Quote from: "Rob"
thats why i get so involved when i hear someone is missing... chad was missing for like a week. and it was hell to get info when i was in aruba...he was found under 20 bags of concrete....


Not much of a vacation for you...How horrible!


if im asked to help, i ll help.. i will be in aruba jun25 and if they ask for help i will help.. i just dont want to get in anybodys way...


Rob, will you be able to report to us from Aruba on your observations? You could use the Cyberzone internet café...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: rogers on June 21, 2005, 07:20:50 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "Nicole"
She can't be in Nigeria or anywhere else. She left her passport in her room.


dont be so naive...there are ways around almost everything in life

While that is true, they usually take time.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 07:21:04 PM
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:21:27 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "Nicole"
She can't be in Nigeria or anywhere else. She left her passport in her room.


dont be so naive...there are ways around almost everything in life


This is true, but they sure as hell would NOT have her check in under her own name....DUH!!


not saying it was plausible, ..only possible


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:22:09 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"
Also just reported on CNN.  The US has sent 2 behavioral specialists that will sit in on interrigations of the subjects.


:::falls down from loft:::

 :shock: Interesting. I was just making a comment today about something along that line but actually an FBI Profiler.

I would love to hear what an FBI profiler would have to say in this case after being able to review things.

(Things that make you go hummm)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AzRose on June 21, 2005, 07:22:55 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Okay, monkeys, don't laugh.  Some of you remember that a couple of days ago I posted that I was contacting Sylvia Browne.  This is the response I got today:

Thank you for your email and compassion towards the situation with Natalee. Sylvia adheres to psychic etiquette which means, she does not offer psychic information to families of missing/murder cases unless she is asked by the immediate family or police working on the case.
Natalee's family is in such distress and grief Sylvia would in no way add to that by offering to help when the family does not ask or want a psychic's help.
We have added Natalee's family to our prayer list in hopes that they find closure to this horific situation they are in.
Blessings,
Vera


Not laughing here, as I remember when you posted your intent to contact her.  Thanks for sharing the response with us.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:22:57 PM
hmmmm


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:23:03 PM
its starting to bother me how rehearsed micky johns tv interview seemed---the way he was going over what he "heard" while in his cell near one of the Kalpoes.  looked like he was reading a teleprompter in his mind or something.  i would like to see all details known regarding their employment/possibly new guards that replaced them at the Allegro resort/ and also their alibis


anyone?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:23:17 PM
Quote
That story would be fine if the boys weren't lying from the beginning. They lied because they fear the truth


Just my point ,if they hear suddenly that she is missing that explaines why they lied because they were afraid that they would be blamed then.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:24:09 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
this is so difficult to keep up with! you guys just started a new forum 3 seconds ago and you already have this many pages??


Wow Kerin what a purty eye you have! lol


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: luna on June 21, 2005, 07:24:56 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


When did Beth HT say Nat was at JvdS' house?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:25:26 PM
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 07:25:32 PM
Quote from: "PoorPaulaNNJ"
da wench wrote:
Okay, so what does THAT say??????


i have no idea.....but it made evryone shut up..hahahahahahaahaha
_________________
observations and dissertations
i cant believe i used my real name.....WTF?

Tooo Funny!!!!!!!


It said PLEASE don't watch Jennifer Wilbanks or buy her book..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 07:25:43 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Just watched MSNBC news brief and they said there is now polygraph equipment on the island and if all parties agree, they may use it. Maybe this is old news -- apologies if it is. Gotta get back to work. <eom>


The FBI and polygraphs go hand in hand. From what I've read in news reports from Aruba with Aruban legal types, polygraphs are illegal. If the judge in the case finds out a polygraph was used then the case gets thrown out of court. :shock:


From http://www.riehlworldview.com/

Quote
Update
A source on the island tells me that he has confirmed that Joran was seen having a cream and wires attached to him in his location at the jail this evening and his interrogation continues while the two Kalpoe brothers have been taken to the prison, as has been previously reported.


This may well be true if the VdS' let Greta & BHT in for a 90 min chat. If the kid took a polygraph (and I'm making an assumption that since polys aren't used in the Dutch system, that the kid may not know they can be circumvented), it may have shown he's telling all he knows????????


I took a polygraph exam before, and there were no "cream or wires" :wink:


yeah, that's what I thought to; it really is a setup used for a straight electrocardiogram...the boy having heart palpitations from the questioning going on  before leaving for the lux KIA prison


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 07:25:50 PM
CNN reported earlier that the reason Croes was in custody was that he corroborated the original story, saying he saw Natalee being dropped off at the H.I. Maybe that's all the further his involvement goes. So either he was telling the truth, or one of the trio (Deepak probably) put him up to it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:26:10 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


please get rid of it, it's disturbing


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 07:26:53 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "amillerwvu"
Quote from: "Rob"
thats why i get so involved when i hear someone is missing... chad was missing for like a week. and it was hell to get info when i was in aruba...he was found under 20 bags of concrete....


Not much of a vacation for you...How horrible!


if im asked to help, i ll help.. i will be in aruba jun25 and if they ask for help i will help.. i just dont want to get in anybodys way...


Rob, will you be able to report to us from Aruba on your observations? You could use the Cyberzone internet café...


I am so sorry, Rob. Let's make sure it doesn't happen again.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:27:23 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


LOL--I think I need to add another head in here..with all these details--the one attached to me HURTS!!!!!!!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AzRose on June 21, 2005, 07:27:25 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


If we start to see it close, do you want us to wake you up??   :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:27:39 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


please get rid of it, it's disturbing


yet yours is so lovely, huh?  :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 07:27:50 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
y
the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad


 Yes, this makes sense because it's the exact opposite of their stories and the last place they'd want to say she was.  

Quote

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too


 If a person has just committed a crime or is in a seriously bad situation, he doesn't let someone new in on it - unless he has to, imo.  So Croes had a purpose beyond a simple alibi or even advice on a drug to counteract (assuming drugs involved).  Otherwise, you wouldn't drag in a friend of a friend.

Quote

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????


 well, all that makes great sense, but I sincerely believe that if either of the boys weren't heavily involved one or both would have spilled every bit of what they knew about Joran by now.


Title: Chat Room Addiction
Post by: Bill on June 21, 2005, 07:27:56 PM
Chat Room Addiction???
Quote
"It seems misleading to characterize behaviors as 'addictions' on the basis that people say they do too much of them," says Sara Kiesler, PhD, a researcher at Carnegie Mellon University and co-author of one of the only controlled studies on Internet usage, published in the September 1998 American Psychologist.  "No research has yet established that there is a disorder of Internet addiction that is separable from problems such as loneliness or problem gambling, or that a passion for using the Internet is long-lasting."

What a relief!
 :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:28:33 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter.  I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:28:56 PM
Quote from: "AzRose"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


If we start to see it close, do you want us to wake you up??   :lol:

I think it is stuck open like that, Rose...seriously...my contacts are glued to my eyes


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 07:29:50 PM
if he was rehearsed it was because the cops likely went over his story several times and that was his official statement he had to make with the police, they say he and Deepak had to sign a statement about their conversation which is when Deepak apologized to Johns for getting him in trouble

come on the guy is a security guard, not a politician, he's been in jail for what seems like no good reason, he has American media falling over themselves to talk to him, he is likely nervous, you'd be, you forget they have big bright spotlights shining in your eyes and frankly his lawyer looked just as uncomfortable on camera

she is not Nancy Grace, she's likely never been on camera, certainly not international TV


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 07:29:56 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


please get rid of it, it's disturbing


I like it  8)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:30:08 PM
Do we really know these "Statements" or "confessions" that keep coming out are 100% reliable regarding any of the 3/4 saying them?

Kind of curious because if they can't share facts about the case for legal reasons then how do we know what has been used as a story?

Just a thought to make you go hmmm  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: rogers on June 21, 2005, 07:30:33 PM
Quote from: "luna"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


When did Beth HT say Nat was at JvdS' house?


Say what?   Make that 3 weeks and 2 hours and I'm with ya


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 07:31:09 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


please get rid of it, it's disturbing


yet yours is so lovely, huh?  :?



happy?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 07:31:10 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "HannieC"
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


That story would be fine if the boys weren't lying from the beginning.  They lied because they fear the truth.


It has yet to be proven that they are lying. Since by Dutch Law the Investigators cannot release information, all the alleged story changes are rumor/hearsay.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:31:15 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Do we really know these "Statements" or "confessions" that keep coming out are 100% reliable regarding any of the 3/4 saying them?

Kind of curious because if they can't share facts about the case for legal reasons then how do we know what has been used as a story?

Just a thought to make you go hmmm  :lol:


BINGO!!!! :::ding ding ding::::


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 07:31:30 PM
Quote
gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out


"strong" interrogations involving "electroshock therapy" are seldom helpful in obtaining information. However, if information regarding these strong techniques is titrated to a target population, it can affect behavior within that population.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 07:31:51 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "tuberide"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


please get rid of it, it's disturbing


yet yours is so lovely, huh?  :?


You guys are hilarious  :lol: .  Fox News Natalee update!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:31:57 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter.  I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


Well, I would believe that to be a huge human rights if not legal violation.

To be fair, if he was my son, I would have a problem with it since he is a minor.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: goon squad on June 21, 2005, 07:32:32 PM
From recent wire article:

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/news/local/11949664.htm

" ...[Beau] Barron [NH classmate on trip] said people who went on the trip aren't publicly discussing details of what happened in Aruba at the request of Holloway's family, which fears the publicity could hamper the investigation."


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:32:57 PM
Tube...seriously! Don't you shave????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 07:35:07 PM
I haven't heard any such case being thrown because of too much questioning, but then, I am not a lawyer.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 07:35:21 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Do we really know these "Statements" or "confessions" that keep coming out are 100% reliable regarding any of the 3/4 saying them?

Kind of curious because if they can't share facts about the case for legal reasons then how do we know what has been used as a story?

Just a thought to make you go hmmm  :lol:


Thank you


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 07:36:26 PM
I still think maybe all of the group should have been interrogated as well since we have reports of scuffles possibly over Natalee, how do we know one of the Mountainbrook boys wasn't involved somehow

again put this into perspective, if this had happened in Alabama you know each of those kids would have been intensely questioned

do we know if this was done by the FBI or Alabama law enforcement

still I think if I were the Aruban police, I would have made that group stay until I had a chance to interview everyone


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 07:36:41 PM
Quote from: "goon squad"
From recent wire article:

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/news/local/11949664.htm

" ...[Beau] Barron [NH classmate on trip] said people who went on the trip aren't publicly discussing details of what happened in Aruba at the request of Holloway's family, which fears the publicity could hamper the investigation."


Goon Squad great find


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:36:49 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Do we really know these "Statements" or "confessions" that keep coming out are 100% reliable regarding any of the 3/4 saying them?

Kind of curious because if they can't share facts about the case for legal reasons then how do we know what has been used as a story?

Just a thought to make you go hmmm  :lol:


BINGO!!!! :::ding ding ding::::


Honestly! lol All we can do is work with who was arrested and what we know which isn't much.

Let's go over the facts.. the only facts we know...

Joran - was at CnC with Natalee, had known Natalee about two days

Satish - was with brother, whereabouts before picking up Joran and Natalee at CnC is unknown. Reportedly was a passenger in his brothers car.

Deepak - was with brother, whereabouts before picking up Joran and Natalee at CnC is unknown. Reportedly owns the "silver/grey" honda and was driving.

Deepak and Satish were not seen at CnC. They have each other "coincidentally" as alibis regardless of what stories or rumors come about.

They drove up and Joran and Natalee were in their car around 1:30am.

What ever happened after that is speculation, rumor or "stories" other than the fact we have two freed guards, Joran, Deepak, Satish and Steve in custody with hidden hints from BH that more arrests will come.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:37:26 PM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "HannieC"
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


That story would be fine if the boys weren't lying from the beginning.  They lied because they fear the truth.


It has yet to be proven that they are lying. Since by Dutch Law the Investigators cannot release information, all the alleged story changes are rumor/hearsay.


You make a good point my mole friend, but the first story about dropping Natalee off at the HI was later contradicted by the released security gaurd.  Thus making it a changed story, hence my determination that they are lying.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 07:38:59 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
right Rob, like special K...........ketamine


The vet gave only 2.5 ccs of Ketamine and valium  to my African Serval and she was out for a day and a half..and she is 40#..so if a person took a large amout of Ketamine..they could and probably would pass out..and have very shallow breathing. Plus alcohol increases the effect of so many drugs.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sarah on June 21, 2005, 07:39:18 PM
Have they been showing any of the conversation between Beth H. and the VDSs yet or are they saving it for later?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: another monkey on June 21, 2005, 07:39:24 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out


"strong" interrogations involving "electroshock therapy" are seldom helpful in obtaining information. However, if information regarding these strong techniques is titrated to a target population, it can affect behavior within that population.


I think they were giving him an EKG - his heart was probably racing, maybe he was hyperventilating and said he couldn't breathe. Of course, anxiety would be there if he were guilty or innocent, after all he is only 17 and this is a horrible experience for anyone to go through.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 07:39:26 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
right Rob, like special K...........ketamine


The vet gave only 2.5 ccs of Ketamine and valium  to my African Serval and she was out for a day and a half..and she is 40#..so if a person took a large amout of Ketamine..they could and probably would pass out..and have very shallow breathing. Plus alcohol increases the effect of so many drugs.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 07:40:07 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote
Pretty much fits the theory I subscribe to. Only Croes is the dealer (that's his connection) Deepak slipped the rufie in Natalees drink. Natalee died from the drugs. :shock:



that is kind of the lines I am thinking Inspector, I just haven't jumped into the drug lord involvement yet.

What do you think about Natalee's mom saying Natalee was at Joran's house 3 am?



  Been away read back and stopped here to share my thoughts on this...
greta has prob come and gone during my h&p expedition but here is my take on it:  

maybe they were both really f'd up in jorans apartment and all 3 had already had sex with her when that craxy lorenzo guy came over to pick up or drop some x off...he wanted his share too...joran said no and the guy pulled out a gun and took off with her...the 3 had no idea what to do and split up maybe even ...at 630 am joran calls from sta lucia  cuz he is majorly screwed if she is not on that plane...said they thought she'd turn up at a crackhouse  and at the time they probably/maybe believed that.
scared they agreed to the lighthouse lie.   they figured they had time-at least 48 hours right??  bam!!! :!:  :!: Twittys at the doorstop...they did not know where joran was but tried to cover his ass...scene between parents..maybe they wouln't let the Twittys in to joans apt/whatever/being less than helpful...

Natalies disappearance was major so fast the lorenzo guy freaked out...somehow he is hooked into croes...she has a nightmare ordeal in lorenzoes basement and is so hysterical she can't be let go...she turned into a hot potato and was too screwed up and had along the way seen too much in being moved around..it is a small island..maybe she was being held in the beheaded guys house when his killer(s) showed up...they were maybe supposed to kill her too but they thought they had enough connections to get paid for the kill as well as sell the girl to someone they knew....Natalee was moved around..with increasingly dire consequence and international scrunity/media...From the beginning to now lots of other people have become involved to some degree...We continue tohope and pray that she is still alive.

What else is known about Lorenzo except that he is crazy???
Is he somehow related to vds?? Did daddy try even initially  (mc D.'s
near Loerenzoes maybe?) to cover one son and then shameful of it's nasty turn and international profile, nevermind at what consequence to
Natalee by the time he really knew the whole deal...by then it was too late and even he could not get her back..perhaps he did leave the country to get something (X)??$$$$??? and when he got back things were worse and his hands /politically/were tied...then someone was decapitated...

What is the story with Lorenzo?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:40:10 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Have they been showing any of the conversation between Beth H. and the VDSs yet or are they saving it for later?


you won't see their conversation. no cameras allowed. Only Greta's "account" on her show


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:40:11 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter.  I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


Well, I would believe that to be a huge human rights if not legal violation.

To be fair, if he was my son, I would have a problem with it since he is a minor.


I can honestly say that if he was my son.  I would have kicked his ass for not being up-front and respecting the mother of a young lady he was courting.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sarah on June 21, 2005, 07:42:24 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "sarah"
Have they been showing any of the conversation between Beth H. and the VDSs yet or are they saving it for later?


you won't see their conversation. no cameras allowed. Only Greta's "account" on her show


Have they said anything about it during the news today.  Any details?  Thanks.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Catriana on June 21, 2005, 07:42:35 PM
Quote
The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter. I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


I was thinking that just this morning.  If I were Natalee's parents, I wouldn't care about the Aruban's "case" against anyone, I would do whatever it takes to get those boys to tell WHERE NATALEE IS.

You are so right, for the family it isn't about the investigation, it isn't about the "legal" ramifications, it isn't about the "case"... it's about finding their missing daughter.

It's too bad that it doesn't appear to be about "finding Natalee" to those investigating.    I really can't believe that after all this time, they don't know exactly what happened and if that's true, why haven't Natalee's parents been told where Natalee is?

There should be only one goal, FIND NATALEE.   If the investigators have information that can help the family find Natalee, they should TELL (to heck with any court case).


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 07:42:50 PM
Ok I am not trying to sound cold, but this will come out that way.

What in the world does Greta, Beth and the VDS say to each other for 90 mins.

Question 1: Where is my daughter?
Question 2: Looks a lot like question 1.

What can the VDS say back that doesn't let the world know something is up?

90 Mins. thats longer than some feature films. More time than the clock in football or basketball.

A lifetime Natalee's lifetime. I couldn't spend 90 mins in there if I knew they were lying.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 07:43:32 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Wonder how Beth H-T knows Natalee was at Jorans at 3am???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 07:43:38 PM
Okay, we do know what the original statement was as it was made before this was really a criminal investigation, it pointed the finger at 2 security guards and they were arrested based on that story which was told before any of the boys were in custody and before there was such a "hush hush" on information.  The 2nd story came from Mickey John.  Did he have motivation to tell that story?  Yes.  Did he provide enough details about no only the story but also how police handled it (having he and Deepak sign documents...) to make me believe that he was telling the truth?  Well, I personally find Mickey believable.  That is ONLY my opinion.  So, I think that there have been two versions of the story out now that I think really have been told by the boys.  Anything else after that is just hearsay and speculation, but those first two IN MY MIND seem to have really been told.  Not that I believe either one of them, but I believe those are different versions told by the suspects.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:43:40 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "sarah"
Have they been showing any of the conversation between Beth H. and the VDSs yet or are they saving it for later?


you won't see their conversation. no cameras allowed. Only Greta's "account" on her show


Have they said anything about it during the news today.  Any details?  Thanks.


Sarah, just that Greta was able to get details from both moms (whatever that means)


Title: Interesting Link
Post by: martin connahey on June 21, 2005, 07:43:45 PM
Good coverage at this site, tho I only recently tripped over it:
http://conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=36&contentid=2285&page=2

Here's a juicy excerpt for those who don't want to chase links:
===From Conspiracy Planet===
The presence of numerous unregulated and unrestricted "gypsy boats" sailing in and out of Aruba and Curacao’s ports to market produce and "other commodities" from the South American mainland [some 19 miles to Colombia and 35 miles to Venezuela] provides the means to abduct women--even as high-speed Colombian cigarette boat drug-runners also ply Caribbean island waters and seaports heavily frequented by American families.

It used to be different--before the age of off-shore banking with recent and curious massive assumption of U.S. debt instruments by Caribbean banking centers, international political correctness and evidence of U.S. bank-laundered narco-dollars for congressional campaigns--derived from ill-gotten gains of lawless Caribbean and South American drug factories and bordellos.

Aruba’s Carlos and Charlie’s bar linked the two missing American women

Iva Bradley, mother of Chesterfield, Virginia’s Amy Lynn Bradley- missing from the Royal Caribbean Rhapsody of the Seas cruise ship off Aruba since 1998 and last seen in a house of prostitution by a U.S. Navy petty officer on the nearby island of Curacao in 1999--was interviewed Thursday by MSNBC host Dan Abrams.

"We came to find out that the same bar [Aruba’s Carlos and Charlie’s] that they [three men on her ship] wanted to take Amy to was the same bar as Natalee Holloway was in." [MSNBC, 6-9-2005]

Curiously, the Bradley-Holloway link is seldom mentioned, save for the Abrams Report and a CNN report at 5:45 pm Eastern on Friday which quoted the Bradley family as believing their daughter Amy is "being held in servitude" somewhere in the Caribbean.
===end story===

To Cancon; thx for compliment. If you can hook me up at either publication, lemme know. Tax accounting/auditing is getting pretty boring. Also doing stand-up on the side, which is like community service, the money's so great, as everyone knows.

-Martin C


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:43:49 PM
Saw this on Fox.com after listening to an update on Fox:

Go "On the Record" weeknights at 10 p.m. ET

Natalee Holloway's mother wants answers about what happened to her daughter and on Tuesday, she took action!

Tune in tonight for a special edition of "On the Record" live from Aruba (search) as Natalee's mother confronts the parents of Joran van der Sloot (search), one of the young men suspected in Natalee's disappearance. It's exclusive video that you won't see anywhere else!

Plus, Natalee's family members are ready to take legal action. We'll get the details from their Aruban lawyer, Vinda de Sousa.

We'll get the latest on the investigation from Jossy Mansur, managing editor of Diario, the largest paper in Aruba.

And, two of Natalee's best friends go "On the Record."

Only Greta takes you this close to the case

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 07:43:56 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Wonder how Beth H-T knows Natalee was at Jorans at 3am???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 07:44:00 PM
Quote from: "jac723"
OK-to answer the Extasy ?'s

1. Mixing the drug with alcohol is a NO NO--it makes u super sick-like vomitting sick

2.  If u r in clubs or know someone on X they will drink plenty of water-u see them carrying water bottles around versus alcohol

3.  They are very hyper--walking around, talking-can not sit still.  Will chew on something

4.  Overall--this drug messes with your nervous system--they act very paranoid and hyper

Hope this helps.  I knew people who tried this before and found out after my cousins murder ("mob style") he was dealing and using :(

FYI--just heard on Fox:

The judge will not even listen to the Holloway families attorney they hired in Aruba until the suspects are formally charged where right now they are formally accused.

Also, JVDS father they said is only a "civil worker" (not sure if that is exact-I know CIVIL is righ)--not a judge or any kind of high status person


That's why you sometimes see people with pacifiers on a lanyard around their necks...they chew the pacifier so they don't grind their teeth


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sarah on June 21, 2005, 07:45:30 PM
Does anyone else here feel as though the victim and the victims families have less rights than the suspects?  It's crazy.  The innocent is suppose to be protected.  The liars shouldn't be.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:45:58 PM
Quote from: "Catriana"
Quote
The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter. I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


I was thinking that just this morning.  If I were Natalee's parents, I wouldn't care about the Aruban's "case" against anyone, I would do whatever it takes to get those boys to tell WHERE NATALEE IS.

You are so right, for the family it isn't about the investigation, it isn't about the "legal" ramifications, it isn't about the "case"... it's about finding their missing daughter.

It's too bad that it doesn't appear to be about "finding Natalee" to those investigating.    I really can't believe that after all this time, they don't know exactly what happened and if that's true, why haven't Natalee's parents been told where Natalee is?

There should be only one goal, FIND NATALEE.   If the investigators have information that can help the family find Natalee, they should TELL (to heck with any court case).


Thank you Catriana...I think I can that just about EVERYONE here just wants Natalee home at any cost.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:46:05 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter.  I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


Well, I would believe that to be a huge human rights if not legal violation.

To be fair, if he was my son, I would have a problem with it since he is a minor.


I can honestly say that if he was my son.  I would have kicked his ass for not being up-front and respecting the mother of a young lady he was courting.


Really and what about Deepak, Satish and Steve? WHy is everything Joran Joran Joran.
Sorry but I am tired of hearing the fingered pointed at ONE. There are four no more no less so far. And we don't know that Joran ahsn't said anything because we aren't allowed to know.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:47:46 PM
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


Title: Re: Interesting Link
Post by: littletxlady on June 21, 2005, 07:48:01 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
Good coverage at this site, tho I only recently tripped over it:
http://conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=36&contentid=2285&page=2

Here's a juicy excerpt for those who don't want to chase links:
===From Conspiracy Planet===
The presence of numerous unregulated and unrestricted "gypsy boats" sailing in and out of Aruba and Curacao’s ports to market produce and "other commodities" from the South American mainland [some 19 miles to Colombia and 35 miles to Venezuela] provides the means to abduct women--even as high-speed Colombian cigarette boat drug-runners also ply Caribbean island waters and seaports heavily frequented by American families.

It used to be different--before the age of off-shore banking with recent and curious massive assumption of U.S. debt instruments by Caribbean banking centers, international political correctness and evidence of U.S. bank-laundered narco-dollars for congressional campaigns--derived from ill-gotten gains of lawless Caribbean and South American drug factories and bordellos.

Aruba’s Carlos and Charlie’s bar linked the two missing American women

Iva Bradley, mother of Chesterfield, Virginia’s Amy Lynn Bradley- missing from the Royal Caribbean Rhapsody of the Seas cruise ship off Aruba since 1998 and last seen in a house of prostitution by a U.S. Navy petty officer on the nearby island of Curacao in 1999--was interviewed Thursday by MSNBC host Dan Abrams.

"We came to find out that the same bar [Aruba’s Carlos and Charlie’s] that they [three men on her ship] wanted to take Amy to was the same bar as Natalee Holloway was in." [MSNBC, 6-9-2005]

Curiously, the Bradley-Holloway link is seldom mentioned, save for the Abrams Report and a CNN report at 5:45 pm Eastern on Friday which quoted the Bradley family as believing their daughter Amy is "being held in servitude" somewhere in the Caribbean.
===end story===

To Cancon; thx for compliment. If you can hook me up at either publication, lemme know. Tax accounting/auditing is getting pretty boring. Also doing stand-up on the side, which is like community service, the money's so great, as everyone knows.

-Martin C


I was living in S.F. Haight Ashbury in the '60's and early '70's and I can attest to the fact a lot of us "kids" were "well connected" in circles that we had no idea how dangerous it was or what could happen. We just thought we were sooooo cool! I probably know too much about these kinds of dealings, one of my girlfriends was a mule from Colombia and was murdered. Times have changed from then and now to be sure, it is a lot more dangerous now.....but kids still want to be "cool" That never changes. There is alot going on on these islands and other countries that are very dangerous whether linked to this particular case or not.
Not much is out of the realm that goes thru these islands.
JMHO


Title: Re: Interesting Link
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 07:48:02 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
Good coverage at this site, tho I only recently tripped over it:
http://conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=36&contentid=2285&page=2


I read that site. I thought it was pretty much lame speculation and innuendo, with a few mistakes and a couple of wild leaps. Of course, given the name of the site, that's to be expected. :wink:


Title: TRANSLATION
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 07:48:18 PM
THIS IS AS FAR AS I CAN GO RIGHT NOW. SOUNDS LIKE PROPAGANDA. IT IS ENOUGH TO GET AN IDEA. NOT PERFECT. WHAT A LANGUAGE. I THINK IT IS CLOSEST TO LADINO, THE LANGUAGE OF THE JEWS EXILED FROM SPAIN BY THE INQUISITION, SOME OF WHOM ENDED UP IN THE ANTILLES.

UN CRISIS FUERA DI PROPORCION!
A CRISIS OUT OF PROPORTION

Sin cu nos tabata kier ni a buske, Aruba a haya su mes den un luz basta negativo durante e ultimo dos simannan, pa motibo di un caso cu ta sigui mantene nos atencion claba riba dje. WITHOUT WANTING OR LOOKING FOR IT ARUBA FINDS ITSELF IN A PRETTY NEGATIVE LIGHT THE LAST TWO WEEKS BECAUSE OF A CASE THAT CAPTIVATES OUR ATTENTION.

E tin e apariencia di no ta bayendo ningun caminda, cu el a stanca, cu e speranza di haya Natalee cu bida ta menguando. Hopi hende, tanto local como stranhero, a buske tur caminda sin exito. A usa ekiponan sofistica y cachonan experto den localiza curpanan dera sin resultadonan positivo. E mucha muher ta sigui desapareci, el a somenta sin laga hueya, creando un misterio cu ta bayendo pa largo.

IT APPEARS IT IS NOT GOING WELL, THAT IT IS STAGNATED. THE HOPE OF FINDING NATALEE ALIVE IS DISAPPEARING. HOPE IS FADING BOTH LOCAL AND FOREIGN AS THE SEARCH GOES ON WITHOUT SUCCESS THAT THE SEACH IS WITHOUT SUCCESS. SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT AND DOGS THAT FIND BODIES ARE WITHOUT POSITIVE RESULT. THE GIRL IS STILL DISAPPEARED WITHOUT A TRACE CREATING A MYSTERY THAT GOES ON TOO LONG.

Ta unda a keda nos pa buske? E lo ta scondi den algun cas, protegi pa algun amigo o conocido, of e ta ser reteni contra su voluntad pa cualke grupo iregular? E por a yega Merca? No ta importa si el a laga su pasaporte atras, pasobra Americanonan por sali di Aruba cu cualke carchi di identificacion manera rijbewijs, carchi di seguro social, o certificado di nacimento.

WHERE CAN WE LOOK THAT HAS NOT BEEN SEARCHED? IS SHE HIDDEN IN SOME HOUSE, PROTECTED BY SOME FRIEND OR ACQUAINTANCE OR IS SHE BEING HELD AGAINST HER WILL BY SOME IRREGULAR GROUP? IT IS NOT IMPORTANT THAT SHE LEFT HER PASSPORT BEHIND. AN AMERICAN CAN LEAVE ARUBA ON ANY ID, DRIVERS LICENCE, SOCIAL SECURITY CARD OR BIRTH CERTIFICATE

E por ta na Venezuela o Colombia? E ta improbable, pero semper e posibilidad ey ta keda existi. Cu un lancha rapido bo por yega e costa mas cercano di Falcon den mey hora. Si e ta na bida ainda, di con no por a haye cu tanto esfuerzo cu a ser desplega y tanto voluntario cu a rondea den delaster pida mondi y costa na Aruba? Y si e ta morto, pakico no por a localiza ni rastro di su restonan?

IS SHE IN VENEZUELA OR COLOMBIA? IT IS NOT PROBABLE BUT THERE IS ALWAYS A POSSIBILITY. A FAST BOAT CAN ARRIVE IN FALCON IN A HALF HOUR. IF SHE IS STILL ALIVE, WHY CAN'T SHE BE FOUND WITH THE MASSIVE EFORT AND SO MANY VOLUNTEERS SEARCHING THE HILLS AND COAST OF ARUBA. AND IF DEAD, WHY IS THERE NO TRACE OF HER REMAINS?

Cu e caso aki por afecta turismo? Claro cu si, pero esey no ta nos preocupacion primordial. Loke tin nos angustia ta Natalee mes. Cualke caida den turismo nos por recupera, pero Natalee ta keda iremplazable! Ta e factor humano ta ocupa nos mentenan y curazonnan, pasobra e parti material, o sea turismo, nos por remedia. Ta e dolor di su famia nos ta comparti, ta e angustia di e mayornan a acapara nos compasion.

COULD THE CASE AFFECT ON TOURISM? SURELY BUT THAT IS NOT THE MAIN CONCERN. WE WILL RECOVER FROM ANY DROP IN TOURISM. BUT NATALEE WILL REMAIN IRREPLACEABLE. IT IS THE HUMAN FACTOR THAT OCCUPIES OUR MINDS AND HEARTS ABOVE THE MATERIAL CONCERNS, OR TOURISM, WHICH WE CAN REPAIR. WE SHARE THE PAIN OF THE FAMILY AND THEIR AGONY CAPTURES OUR COMPASSION.

ta conserva e opinion cu ni maske cuanto hende pinta Aruba preto na Merca, semper tin otronan cu ta defende nos isla pasobra nan conoce y nan sa cu Aruba ta keda un di e lugarnan mas sigur na mundo.

THE FACT REMAINS THAT WHEN SOMEBODY PAINTS ARUBA BLACK IN THE MARKET, THERE IS ALWAYS ANOTHER WHO KNOWS ARUBA REMAINS ONE OF THE SAFEST PLACES IN THE WORLD.

No ta e beyeza di nos beachnan so a yama e atencion di e turistanan cu ta bishita nos isla repetidamente y den gran cantidad, ta e calidad humano di nos poblacion a conkista nan curazonnan.

IT IS NOT JUST THE BEAUTIFUL BEACHES THAT ATTRACT ATTENTION OF TOURISTS WHO VISIT OVER AND OVER AGIN AND IN LARGE NUMBERS BUT ALSO THE HUMAN QUALITY OF OUR POPULATION WHICH CONQUEST THEIR HEARTS

Ta e trato cu nan a ricibi di nos hendenan a haya eco den nan sentimentonan, pesey awor nan ta recompensa nos cu nan palabranan cari¤oso; cu nan defensanan na fabor di nos isla; cu nan protestanan publico contra esnan cu sin conoce nos isla o nos pueblo ta asina dispuesto di expresa opinionnan negativo sin e aval di realidad.

THE TREATMENT THEY RECEIVE FINDS ECHO IN THEIR SENTIMENTS AND IS COMPENSATED IN THEIR AFFECTIONATE WORDS WHICH DEFEND THE ISLAND AND PROTEST PUBLICLY AGAINST THOSE WHO WITHOUT KNOWING THE ISLAND EXPRESS NEGATIVE OPINIONS WITHOUT THE BACKING OF REALITY.

Pasobra Aruba no ta un lugar unda criminalidad tin un incidencia halto, un caso manera esaki por a logra tanto atencion den exterior. E ta un incidente aisla, perpetra pa elemento(nan) aheno na nos cultura, na nos disposicion pacifico, na nos caracter amplio, abierto, y decente como Pueblo.

BECAUSE ARUBA IS NOT A PLACE WITH A HIGH CRIME RATE, ONE CASE LIKE THIS ONE CAN GRAB ATTENTION OVERSEAS. IT IS AN ISOLATED INCIDEN PERPETRATED BY ELEMENTS ALIEN TO OUR CULTURE, OUR PEACEFUL DISPOSITION OUR AMPLE CHARACTER, OPEN AND DECENT AS A PEOPLE


E ta ademas, un caso lora den nubianan di misterio cada vez mas denso, menos penetrable hasta pa e wowonan mas experto den e mundo policial y investigativo. Esaki ta un desaparicion cu no a laga evidencianan palpable, algo solido riba cual Polis por traha.

Fuera di esey, mi tin entendi cu e detenidonan no ta bisando nada adicional, sino simplemente cu nan a laga Natalee (cu o sin Joran) riba e tereno un tiki panoord di Marriott hotel. E storia aki nan ta sigui ripiti cu insistencia, aunke tin tambe varios discrepancia den nan declaracionnan.

Pa loke ta trata e eficiencia di nos cuerpo Policial, no laga ningun hende ga¤a nan mes: e ta di e mihornan den nos region, y sigur uno cu nos por bisa cu conviccion di ta hopi profesional.

Nos cu a sigui nan actividadnan durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan di cerca por bisa den voz halto cu ta trata di un cuerpo policial cu tin un integridad grandi, y esey ta descarta cualke posibilidad di un tapamento o un complicidad basa riba amistad cu un of otro familiar di cualke un di e detenidonan.

Den mi buki di tur e hechonan delictivo cu a tuma lugar riba nos isla durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan, e actuacionnan certero di e Cuerpo Policial di Aruba ta skirbi cu leternan di oro!

E caso di Natalee a pone nos den un crisis emocional grandi, y otronan cu no conoce nos isla y no sa con nos Pueblo ta razona, a convirtie den un crisis publicitario fuera di tur proporcion.

Na Aruba no ta existi criminalnan cu ta cana rond pa inventa maldad na cada paso; nos no tin e sicopatanan cu ta pasa man pa un revolver y ta cuminza dispara pa loco contra hendenan inocente; Aruba ta un isla trankilo, yen di humanismo y consideracion pa e bienestar di otronan.

Pesey, na nomber di tur loke ta husto, ta tempo pa e imagen negativo cu voluntariamente of involuntariamente a ser crea di nos isla pa algun medio di comunicacion cu no tabata sa mes unda Aruba ta keda, ser coregi.

Ta pesey tambe cu algun di nos a acepta pa duna declaracionnan na un of otro canal di television Mericano, no pa busca fama o crea un imagen cu lo desaparece hunto cu e regreso di e medionan ey, sino pa purba contraresta e da¤o cu a ser causa pa e misterio aki.

No ta kedami nada otro di bisa sino cu mi ta spera cu Natalee ta bibo y cu e lo haya e caminda di regreso pa su cas, su famianan y su amigonan na Birmingham, ciudad cu mi conoce bon, y e Pueblo di Alabama cu, segun mi experiencia personal na e Estado ey, ta igual na esun di nos den e grandeza di su curazon y su sentido di compasion.

Al fin y al cabo mi a studia y a gradua na Mobile, Alabama, y por papia cu cierto autoridad di e cualidadnan humano di su Pueblo. No ban yega na conclusionnan ekiboca tocante esey djis pasobra un canal sin importancia ni alcance nacional, a hinca den su cabez pa haci un yamado pa un boycot cu no ta bay haya oido ni acogida den e resto di e poblacion Americano, y cu no ta ahusta su mes tampoco na e concepto Americano di "fair play.”

http://www.diarioaruba.com/dialuna/editorial/index.html
Back to top
_________________
just the facts


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 07:48:18 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Ok I am not trying to sound cold, but this will come out that way.

What in the world does Greta, Beth and the VDS say to each other for 90 mins.

Question 1: Where is my daughter?
Question 2: Looks a lot like question 1.

What can the VDS say back that doesn't let the world know something is up?

90 Mins. thats longer than some feature films. More time than the clock in football or basketball.

A lifetime Natalee's lifetime. I couldn't spend 90 mins in there if I knew they were lying.

My guess is that it's more like Greta followed Beth around while she was passing out her prayer slips...they came to VDS home, Beth spoke with them for a few minutes.  90 minutes is probably the amount of time Greta was with Beth, IMO.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 07:48:28 PM
:shock:

WTH is going on???
BHT knows Natalee was at Jorans that night? Is this confirmed???

Sorry, I've been to bust today trying to save myself from getting fired all while buying a laptop so I can be mobile now.. i.e. sit on my azz watching Greta & posting at the same time LOL :oops:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sarah on June 21, 2005, 07:48:48 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


I think they are allowed to petition, but the court can say no.  I believe they actually did say no today.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 07:49:16 PM
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Wonder how Beth H-T knows Natalee was at Jorans at 3am???


I'm guessing she has information from the investigation not available to the public.  My guess would be one of the suspects gave this out in investigation, or they have some sort of email from joran saying this.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:49:32 PM
IF YOU ARE LYING THAT DOES NOT MAKES YOU A MURDERER!

IF THAT WAS TRUE 60%  OR MAYBE MORE OF THE WHOLE WORLD WOULD BE MURDERERS.

WHAT HAPPENS TO INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY???

WE CAN ONLY SPECULATE B/C WE DON`T KNOW ANYTHING UNTIL WE HEAR FROM THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT WHAT THEY HAVE


Sorry caps was on :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 07:49:41 PM
sarah, the theory behind suspects having rights is to protect innocent people like you, should you ever be falsely accused of a crime.

In order to ensure that you have that protection, those same rights are extended to accused people that you think are guilty.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:50:19 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


I think they are allowed to petition, but the court can say no.  I believe they actually did say no today.


thanks sarah


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 07:50:26 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


Your eyes !!!!   Im petrifierd of lightning and am planning on making
an appt to see if a hypnotherapist could help me. Maybe I can save a bunch of money by just staring at THAT eye. Intense !!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 07:51:00 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
...What is the story with Lorenzo?
Glad you asked!  I have been able to find nothing,  nada, nilch about this character.  Have we heard about Lorenzo from any source other than ArubaGirl or American in Aruba (I forget who), who reported it as "rumor"?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 07:51:03 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "Catriana"
Quote
The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter. I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


I was thinking that just this morning.  If I were Natalee's parents, I wouldn't care about the Aruban's "case" against anyone, I would do whatever it takes to get those boys to tell WHERE NATALEE IS.

You are so right, for the family it isn't about the investigation, it isn't about the "legal" ramifications, it isn't about the "case"... it's about finding their missing daughter.

It's too bad that it doesn't appear to be about "finding Natalee" to those investigating.    I really can't believe that after all this time, they don't know exactly what happened and if that's true, why haven't Natalee's parents been told where Natalee is?

There should be only one goal, FIND NATALEE.   If the investigators have information that can help the family find Natalee, they should TELL (to heck with any court case).


Thank you Catriana...I think I can that just about EVERYONE here just wants Natalee home at any cost.


As I hope the same but I think we are all frustrated and I hope anything they are keeping to themselves is because they are onto where she is. I can only pray.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 07:51:12 PM
[quotewhitney


      as far as father jvds i heard he was not a lawyer or a jodge but filled in on an occasional basis/ like a substitute teacher/  maybe he was hooking someone big/political up with major amounts of x?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:51:43 PM
Quote from: "Rosalie"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
LOL. I got tired of not being able to "see" you. I thought I would put my eye in the forum for 24/7 updates!  :D


Your eyes !!!!   Im petrifierd of lightning and am planning on making
an appt to see if a hypnotherapist could help me. Maybe I can save a bunch of money by just staring at THAT eye. Intense !!

LOL...sorry. and imagine what it was like for me when the flash went off!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 07:52:04 PM
Thanks iquitos for the translation :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 07:52:22 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter.  I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


Well, I would believe that to be a huge human rights if not legal violation.

To be fair, if he was my son, I would have a problem with it since he is a minor.


I can honestly say that if he was my son.  I would have kicked his ass for not being up-front and respecting the mother of a young lady he was courting.


Really and what about Deepak, Satish and Steve? WHy is everything Joran Joran Joran.
Sorry but I am tired of hearing the fingered pointed at ONE. There are four no more no less so far. And we don't know that Joran ahsn't said anything because we aren't allowed to know.


I imagine that they are all being leaned on fairly heavily.  Joran liked to be the center of attention, now he just happens to have everyone's attention.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 07:52:32 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "absolut"
Ok I am not trying to sound cold, but this will come out that way.

What in the world does Greta, Beth and the VDS say to each other for 90 mins.

Question 1: Where is my daughter?
Question 2: Looks a lot like question 1.

What can the VDS say back that doesn't let the world know something is up?

90 Mins. thats longer than some feature films. More time than the clock in football or basketball.

A lifetime Natalee's lifetime. I couldn't spend 90 mins in there if I knew they were lying.

My guess is that it's more like Greta followed Beth around while she was passing out her prayer slips...they came to VDS home, Beth spoke with them for a few minutes.  90 minutes is probably the amount of time Greta was with Beth, IMO.
No, I heard it said on Fox, Greta and BT where in the home for 90 minutes.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:53:44 PM
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 07:53:58 PM
about confessions

there have been many cases where someone has been interrogated for several hours without a break, youthful offenders and adults, and they will confess to anything just to make it stop

and then they recant their confession and say they confessed under duress

and in many instances it is later proven that they were in fact innocent

sometimes the confession is thrown out, other times not and sometimes an innocent person went to jail to be cleared later......

I think presence of counsel is another factor but I cannot imagine any lawyer allowing their client to be grilled for that long continuously


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sarah on June 21, 2005, 07:54:11 PM
Have the equine folks raised enough money yet to travel to Aruba?  Did John Travolta come through for us?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:54:43 PM
Quote from: "Whitney"
Quote from: "jac723"
OK-to answer the Extasy ?'s

1. Mixing the drug with alcohol is a NO NO--it makes u super sick-like vomitting sick

2.  If u r in clubs or know someone on X they will drink plenty of water-u see them carrying water bottles around versus alcohol

3.  They are very hyper--walking around, talking-can not sit still.  Will chew on something

4.  Overall--this drug messes with your nervous system--they act very paranoid and hyper

Hope this helps.  I knew people who tried this before and found out after my cousins murder ("mob style") he was dealing and using :(

FYI--just heard on Fox:

The judge will not even listen to the Holloway families attorney they hired in Aruba until the suspects are formally charged where right now they are formally accused.

Also, JVDS father they said is only a "civil worker" (not sure if that is exact-I know CIVIL is righ)--not a judge or any kind of high status person


That's why you sometimes see people with pacifiers on a lanyard around their necks...they chew the pacifier so they don't grind their teeth


Thanks for adding that--I was supposed to put they chew on something instead of grinding their teeth--another sign


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 07:54:45 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Have they been showing any of the conversation between Beth H. and the VDSs yet or are they saving it for later?


No cameras were inside the house.  We will have to rely on what Greta says tonight on her show at 10 pm EST.


Title: DUE PROCESS
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 07:55:13 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Does anyone else here feel as though the victim and the victims families have less rights than the suspects?  It's crazy.  The innocent is suppose to be protected.  The liars shouldn't be.


WHO GETS TO DECIDE WHO IS GUILTY AND WHO IS INNOCENT?
WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL DUE PROCESS TO GET AT THE TRUTH AND TO METE OUT APPROPRIATE PUNISHMENT.  IT IS CALLED DUE PROCESS.  THE ENTIRE JUDICIARY AND THE RESPECTIVE POLICE FORCES ARE IN PLACE TO PROTECT THE INTERESS OF SOCIETY (THE VICTIMS) WHILE AT THE SAME TIME MAKING SURE WE DON'T FALSELY ACCUSE AND PUNISH THE INNOCENT.   IT IS AN OLD PRINCIPLE WHICH DISTINGUISHES US FROM BARBARIANS.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 07:55:57 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Thanks iquitos for the translation :)


YES
INQUITOS DESERVES A MAJOR CYBER-RUB!!!!! :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:57:34 PM
has anyone seen DJTaylor? Did she have her baby?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 07:58:27 PM
As I hope the same but I think we are all frustrated and I hope anything they are keeping to themselves is because they are onto where she is. I can only pray

Caligirl, I think you're right.  Unfortunately if the reports of profilers (behavior specialists) is true,  I don't believe the outcome will be positive.  IMO, you'd bring them in to confirm truth or deceit of a story, (they're not always doing "predictive" profiling) and model what's likely to have happened.  Pending the outcome of that, then they'll confirm to the family what happened formally and decide charges.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 07:58:46 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


They are allowed but a judge has turned them down til the suspects are charged.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 07:58:47 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
yeah I guess volunteering to go to Aruba is tough for those cable hosts, though Greta is clearly not a sun person, the list for Baghdad looks empty though.....

if martin doesn't write for onion or scrabbleface he should, LOL

the plot does thicken, my own new theory is that either the Kalpoes in fact dropped N & J at his bachelor pad in the first place or they were telling the truth that they dropped them off at the Marriott and somehow N & J end up at the bachelor pad

but then where does Croes come in, disposal of the body later, or could it be as simple as Joran called Croes and says if anyone asks, because maybe Croes was at the C & C that night, we dropped that American chick off at the Holiday Inn and then he got the Kalpoes on side to lie for him too

maybe he said to the Kalpoes, I didn't kill that girl but I'll get blamed for it or worse he said we'll all get blamed for it or ooh, what if he said, if you don't lie for me, I'll say you guys did it, and look, when the brothers changed their story implicating Joran didn't Joran change his story implicating the Kalpoes???????

hmmmm

on riehl world they are reporting that Joran is being interrogated non stop today, gotta be careful though, confessions have been thrown out in cases where people have been interrogated for several hours without a break.....


I know this scenario has been discussed, but it certainly is one that's made more sense as all these casts of 4 characters are now in prison or jail.  The three boys are now reported in the KIA prison, and the infamous SGC is in his jail cell.

For those who've not read the story, here it is:  http://www.planethuff.com/darkside/


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 07:59:01 PM
Quote from: "goon squad"
From recent wire article:

http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/mld/ledgerenquirer/news/local/11949664.htm

" ...[Beau] Barron [NH classmate on trip] said people who went on the trip aren't publicly discussing details of what happened in Aruba at the request of Holloway's family, which fears the publicity could hamper the investigation."


How could anyone in the US discussing details of what happened in Aruba hamper an investigation that is taking place in Aruba? Help me out please because I don't understand that logic.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 07:59:25 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


They are allowed but a judge has turned them down til the suspects are charged.

thanks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 07:59:26 PM
Quote from: "sarah"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
OK...so someone may have posted this already but are the Holloways allowed by Aruban law to petition the court to be shown all the evidence?


I think they are allowed to petition, but the court can say no.  I believe they actually did say no today.


I saw and heard on fox-the judge already said they are not interested in the motion.  The suspects have to be charged where right now they are accused.  So the lawyer can not help the family with that right now.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 07:59:51 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
has anyone seen DJTaylor? Did she have her baby?


no idea...just got back...did you see how many letters/word i can put together if i really try???  

 :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: littletxlady on June 21, 2005, 07:59:52 PM
Quote from: "Terry"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "absolut"
Ok I am not trying to sound cold, but this will come out that way.

What in the world does Greta, Beth and the VDS say to each other for 90 mins.

Question 1: Where is my daughter?
Question 2: Looks a lot like question 1.

What can the VDS say back that doesn't let the world know something is up?

90 Mins. thats longer than some feature films. More time than the clock in football or basketball.

A lifetime Natalee's lifetime. I couldn't spend 90 mins in there if I knew they were lying.

My guess is that it's more like Greta followed Beth around while she was passing out her prayer slips...they came to VDS home, Beth spoke with them for a few minutes.  90 minutes is probably the amount of time Greta was with Beth, IMO.
No, I heard it said on Fox, Greta and BT where in the home for 90 minutes.


Greta met with BHT this am for an interview (I think) and she asked Beth how she was feeling this am, BHT said I'm angry. Greta asked why and BHT said she wanted to talk to the VDS'sand greta said let's go. She'll be on later with "the rest of the story"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 08:00:17 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Ok I am not trying to sound cold, but this will come out that way.

What in the world does Greta, Beth and the VDS say to each other for 90 mins.

Question 1: Where is my daughter?
Question 2: Looks a lot like question 1.

What can the VDS say back that doesn't let the world know something is up?

90 Mins. thats longer than some feature films. More time than the clock in football or basketball.

A lifetime Natalee's lifetime. I couldn't spend 90 mins in there if I knew they were lying.


I noticed in the teaser on Fox that Natalee's mother was carrying books of some type.  I'm wondering if it was albums of Natalee, or something like that.  She was trying to appeal to them as a parent, maybe?  Telling stories about her daughter, etc.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: monkeysMOO on June 21, 2005, 08:00:38 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


LOL, Kerin, maybe she had her producers do that while she was distracting them with her 90-minute interview?   :wink:

Maybe the garbage contents will be tomorrow's OTR 'scoop'...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:01:13 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
has anyone seen DJTaylor? Did she have her baby?


no idea...just got back...did you see how many letters/word i can put together if i really try???  

 :lol:

FOM..I am so proud of you! Your are growing up so quickly!!!  :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 08:01:14 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Wonder how Beth H-T knows Natalee was at Jorans at 3am???


I'm guessing she has information from the investigation not available to the public.  My guess would be one of the suspects gave this out in investigation, or they have some sort of email from joran saying this.


I don't know if anything came out on the pictures found--


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:02:35 PM
Quote from: "monkeysMOO"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


LOL, Kerin, maybe she had her producers do that while she was distracting them with her 90-minute interview?   :wink:

Maybe the garbage contents will be tomorrow's OTR 'scoop'...

Yeah Monkey, they will probably keep us hanging all day just to see a few banana peels and a used copy of People Magazine.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:02:46 PM
cancon wrote:

Quote
about confessions

there have been many cases where someone has been interrogated for several hours without a break, youthful offenders and adults, and they will confess to anything just to make it stop

and then they recant their confession and say they confessed under duress

and in many instances it is later proven that they were in fact innocent

sometimes the confession is thrown out, other times not and sometimes an innocent person went to jail to be cleared later......

I think presence of counsel is another factor but I cannot imagine any lawyer allowing their client to be grilled for that long continuously




That is absolutly true, it`s the same in Holland, the famous case is
that of 2 guys who been in prison for over 6 years b/c the confessed to a murder they don`t even commited only b/c of the pressure with the interrogation
They are free now and they sued the dutch state and won over that.

Here it isn`t legal to do some sort 'hard' interrogation here `this sort of interrogation is called; "de zaanse verhoormethode". I believe in the US this system it`s called the 'Reidtechnique".


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:03:04 PM
How could anyone in the US discussing details of what happened in Aruba hamper an investigation that is taking place in Aruba? Help me out please because I don't understand that logic.

CancunMole, it's inconceivable to me that it would hamper it, unless there are details which can be construed in a manner the Holloways don't agree with. That is a point of concern for me, and does make me slightly wary about the "whys" behind that statement.


Title: Re: DUE PROCESS
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 08:04:03 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"

WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL DUE PROCESS TO GET AT THE TRUTH AND TO METE OUT APPROPRIATE PUNISHMENT.  IT IS CALLED DUE PROCESS.  THE ENTIRE JUDICIARY AND THE RESPECTIVE POLICE FORCES ARE IN PLACE TO PROTECT THE INTEREST SOCIETY (THE VICTIMS) WHILE AT THE SAME TIME MAKING SURE WE DON'T FALSELY ACCUSE AND PUNISH THE INNOCENT.   IT IS AN OLD PRINCIPLE WHICH DISTINGUISHES US FROM BARBARIANS.

Thank you.


Title: INTERROGATION METHODS
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:04:35 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "Catriana"
Quote
The family isn't looking for justice...they are looking for their daughter. I wouldn't mind if he was interrogated 24hrs if he resulted in finding Natalee.


I was thinking that just this morning.  If I were Natalee's parents, I wouldn't care about the Aruban's "case" against anyone, I would do whatever it takes to get those boys to tell WHERE NATALEE IS.

You are so right, for the family it isn't about the investigation, it isn't about the "legal" ramifications, it isn't about the "case"... it's about finding their missing daughter.

It's too bad that it doesn't appear to be about "finding Natalee" to those investigating.    I really can't believe that after all this time, they don't know exactly what happened and if that's true, why haven't Natalee's parents been told where Natalee is?

There should be only one goal, FIND NATALEE.   If the investigators have information that can help the family find Natalee, they should TELL (to heck with any court case).


Thank you Catriana...I think I can that just about EVERYONE here just wants Natalee home at any cost.


As I hope the same but I think we are all frustrated and I hope anything they are keeping to themselves is because they are onto where she is. I can only pray.
 

AND IF SOMEBODY TELLS THEM WHERE NATELEE IS UNDER DURESS AND GOES SCOTT FREE BECASUE OF THE ILLEGAL INTERROGATION METHODS THEN THAT IS OK?   WE ARE TALKING LEGAL MINOR HERE FOLKS.  DO UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE THEM DO UNTO YOU.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:04:53 PM
UH OH....warning to our Aruban friends. Mrs. Holloway showed up at the VDS house again without an invitation. Just letting you all know before we get into the details of the meeting.


Title: Re: TRANSLATION
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:05:10 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
THIS IS AS FAR AS I CAN GO RIGHT NOW. SOUNDS LIKE PROPAGANDA. IT IS ENOUGH TO GET AN IDEA. NOT PERFECT. WHAT A LANGUAGE. I THINK IT IS CLOSEST TO LADINO, THE LANGUAGE OF THE JEWS EXILED FROM SPAIN BY THE INQUISITION, SOME OF WHOM ENDED UP IN THE ANTILLES.

UN CRISIS FUERA DI PROPORCION!
A CRISIS OUT OF PROPORTION

Sin cu nos tabata kier ni a buske, Aruba a haya su mes den un luz basta negativo durante e ultimo dos simannan, pa motibo di un caso cu ta sigui mantene nos atencion claba riba dje. WITHOUT WANTING OR LOOKING FOR IT ARUBA FINDS ITSELF IN A PRETTY NEGATIVE LIGHT THE LAST TWO WEEKS BECAUSE OF A CASE THAT CAPTIVATES OUR ATTENTION.

E tin e apariencia di no ta bayendo ningun caminda, cu el a stanca, cu e speranza di haya Natalee cu bida ta menguando. Hopi hende, tanto local como stranhero, a buske tur caminda sin exito. A usa ekiponan sofistica y cachonan experto den localiza curpanan dera sin resultadonan positivo. E mucha muher ta sigui desapareci, el a somenta sin laga hueya, creando un misterio cu ta bayendo pa largo.

IT APPEARS IT IS NOT GOING WELL, THAT IT IS STAGNATED. THE HOPE OF FINDING NATALEE ALIVE IS DISAPPEARING. HOPE IS FADING BOTH LOCAL AND FOREIGN AS THE SEARCH GOES ON WITHOUT SUCCESS THAT THE SEACH IS WITHOUT SUCCESS. SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT AND DOGS THAT FIND BODIES ARE WITHOUT POSITIVE RESULT. THE GIRL IS STILL DISAPPEARED WITHOUT A TRACE CREATING A MYSTERY THAT GOES ON TOO LONG.

Ta unda a keda nos pa buske? E lo ta scondi den algun cas, protegi pa algun amigo o conocido, of e ta ser reteni contra su voluntad pa cualke grupo iregular? E por a yega Merca? No ta importa si el a laga su pasaporte atras, pasobra Americanonan por sali di Aruba cu cualke carchi di identificacion manera rijbewijs, carchi di seguro social, o certificado di nacimento.

WHERE CAN WE LOOK THAT HAS NOT BEEN SEARCHED? IS SHE HIDDEN IN SOME HOUSE, PROTECTED BY SOME FRIEND OR ACQUAINTANCE OR IS SHE BEING HELD AGAINST HER WILL BY SOME IRREGULAR GROUP? IT IS NOT IMPORTANT THAT SHE LEFT HER PASSPORT BEHIND. AN AMERICAN CAN LEAVE ARUBA ON ANY ID, DRIVERS LICENCE, SOCIAL SECURITY CARD OR BIRTH CERTIFICATE

E por ta na Venezuela o Colombia? E ta improbable, pero semper e posibilidad ey ta keda existi. Cu un lancha rapido bo por yega e costa mas cercano di Falcon den mey hora. Si e ta na bida ainda, di con no por a haye cu tanto esfuerzo cu a ser desplega y tanto voluntario cu a rondea den delaster pida mondi y costa na Aruba? Y si e ta morto, pakico no por a localiza ni rastro di su restonan?

IS SHE IN VENEZUELA OR COLOMBIA? IT IS NOT PROBABLE BUT THERE IS ALWAYS A POSSIBILITY. A FAST BOAT CAN ARRIVE IN FALCON IN A HALF HOUR. IF SHE IS STILL ALIVE, WHY CAN'T SHE BE FOUND WITH THE MASSIVE EFORT AND SO MANY VOLUNTEERS SEARCHING THE HILLS AND COAST OF ARUBA. AND IF DEAD, WHY IS THERE NO TRACE OF HER REMAINS?

Cu e caso aki por afecta turismo? Claro cu si, pero esey no ta nos preocupacion primordial. Loke tin nos angustia ta Natalee mes. Cualke caida den turismo nos por recupera, pero Natalee ta keda iremplazable! Ta e factor humano ta ocupa nos mentenan y curazonnan, pasobra e parti material, o sea turismo, nos por remedia. Ta e dolor di su famia nos ta comparti, ta e angustia di e mayornan a acapara nos compasion.

COULD THE CASE AFFECT ON TOURISM? SURELY BUT THAT IS NOT THE MAIN CONCERN. WE WILL RECOVER FROM ANY DROP IN TOURISM. BUT NATALEE WILL REMAIN IRREPLACEABLE. IT IS THE HUMAN FACTOR THAT OCCUPIES OUR MINDS AND HEARTS ABOVE THE MATERIAL CONCERNS, OR TOURISM, WHICH WE CAN REPAIR. WE SHARE THE PAIN OF THE FAMILY AND THEIR AGONY CAPTURES OUR COMPASSION.

ta conserva e opinion cu ni maske cuanto hende pinta Aruba preto na Merca, semper tin otronan cu ta defende nos isla pasobra nan conoce y nan sa cu Aruba ta keda un di e lugarnan mas sigur na mundo.

THE FACT REMAINS THAT WHEN SOMEBODY PAINTS ARUBA BLACK IN THE MARKET, THERE IS ALWAYS ANOTHER WHO KNOWS ARUBA REMAINS ONE OF THE SAFEST PLACES IN THE WORLD.

No ta e beyeza di nos beachnan so a yama e atencion di e turistanan cu ta bishita nos isla repetidamente y den gran cantidad, ta e calidad humano di nos poblacion a conkista nan curazonnan.

IT IS NOT JUST THE BEAUTIFUL BEACHES THAT ATTRACT ATTENTION OF TOURISTS WHO VISIT OVER AND OVER AGIN AND IN LARGE NUMBERS BUT ALSO THE HUMAN QUALITY OF OUR POPULATION WHICH CONQUEST THEIR HEARTS

Ta e trato cu nan a ricibi di nos hendenan a haya eco den nan sentimentonan, pesey awor nan ta recompensa nos cu nan palabranan cari¤oso; cu nan defensanan na fabor di nos isla; cu nan protestanan publico contra esnan cu sin conoce nos isla o nos pueblo ta asina dispuesto di expresa opinionnan negativo sin e aval di realidad.

THE TREATMENT THEY RECEIVE FINDS ECHO IN THEIR SENTIMENTS AND IS COMPENSATED IN THEIR AFFECTIONATE WORDS WHICH DEFEND THE ISLAND AND PROTEST PUBLICLY AGAINST THOSE WHO WITHOUT KNOWING THE ISLAND EXPRESS NEGATIVE OPINIONS WITHOUT THE BACKING OF REALITY.

Pasobra Aruba no ta un lugar unda criminalidad tin un incidencia halto, un caso manera esaki por a logra tanto atencion den exterior. E ta un incidente aisla, perpetra pa elemento(nan) aheno na nos cultura, na nos disposicion pacifico, na nos caracter amplio, abierto, y decente como Pueblo.

BECAUSE ARUBA IS NOT A PLACE WITH A HIGH CRIME RATE, ONE CASE LIKE THIS ONE CAN GRAB ATTENTION OVERSEAS. IT IS AN ISOLATED INCIDEN PERPETRATED BY ELEMENTS ALIEN TO OUR CULTURE, OUR PEACEFUL DISPOSITION OUR AMPLE CHARACTER, OPEN AND DECENT AS A PEOPLE


E ta ademas, un caso lora den nubianan di misterio cada vez mas denso, menos penetrable hasta pa e wowonan mas experto den e mundo policial y investigativo. Esaki ta un desaparicion cu no a laga evidencianan palpable, algo solido riba cual Polis por traha.

Fuera di esey, mi tin entendi cu e detenidonan no ta bisando nada adicional, sino simplemente cu nan a laga Natalee (cu o sin Joran) riba e tereno un tiki panoord di Marriott hotel. E storia aki nan ta sigui ripiti cu insistencia, aunke tin tambe varios discrepancia den nan declaracionnan.

Pa loke ta trata e eficiencia di nos cuerpo Policial, no laga ningun hende ga¤a nan mes: e ta di e mihornan den nos region, y sigur uno cu nos por bisa cu conviccion di ta hopi profesional.

Nos cu a sigui nan actividadnan durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan di cerca por bisa den voz halto cu ta trata di un cuerpo policial cu tin un integridad grandi, y esey ta descarta cualke posibilidad di un tapamento o un complicidad basa riba amistad cu un of otro familiar di cualke un di e detenidonan.

Den mi buki di tur e hechonan delictivo cu a tuma lugar riba nos isla durante e ultimo 25 a¤anan, e actuacionnan certero di e Cuerpo Policial di Aruba ta skirbi cu leternan di oro!

E caso di Natalee a pone nos den un crisis emocional grandi, y otronan cu no conoce nos isla y no sa con nos Pueblo ta razona, a convirtie den un crisis publicitario fuera di tur proporcion.

Na Aruba no ta existi criminalnan cu ta cana rond pa inventa maldad na cada paso; nos no tin e sicopatanan cu ta pasa man pa un revolver y ta cuminza dispara pa loco contra hendenan inocente; Aruba ta un isla trankilo, yen di humanismo y consideracion pa e bienestar di otronan.

Pesey, na nomber di tur loke ta husto, ta tempo pa e imagen negativo cu voluntariamente of involuntariamente a ser crea di nos isla pa algun medio di comunicacion cu no tabata sa mes unda Aruba ta keda, ser coregi.

Ta pesey tambe cu algun di nos a acepta pa duna declaracionnan na un of otro canal di television Mericano, no pa busca fama o crea un imagen cu lo desaparece hunto cu e regreso di e medionan ey, sino pa purba contraresta e da¤o cu a ser causa pa e misterio aki.

No ta kedami nada otro di bisa sino cu mi ta spera cu Natalee ta bibo y cu e lo haya e caminda di regreso pa su cas, su famianan y su amigonan na Birmingham, ciudad cu mi conoce bon, y e Pueblo di Alabama cu, segun mi experiencia personal na e Estado ey, ta igual na esun di nos den e grandeza di su curazon y su sentido di compasion.

Al fin y al cabo mi a studia y a gradua na Mobile, Alabama, y por papia cu cierto autoridad di e cualidadnan humano di su Pueblo. No ban yega na conclusionnan ekiboca tocante esey djis pasobra un canal sin importancia ni alcance nacional, a hinca den su cabez pa haci un yamado pa un boycot cu no ta bay haya oido ni acogida den e resto di e poblacion Americano, y cu no ta ahusta su mes tampoco na e concepto Americano di "fair play.”

http://www.diarioaruba.com/dialuna/editorial/index.html
Back to top
_________________
just the facts


Thanks Iquitos, but can you finish the translation. Especially that last paragraph, where the writer talks about being a graduate student in Mobile, Alabama. Papiemento is really rough.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:06:48 PM
Per Greta on O'Reilly: BHT & AVDS enbraced when meeting after Beth was yelling over the gate and Papa VDS let Greta & BHT in


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:07:18 PM
but let me play devil's advocate for a moment, the family wants to find Natalee and who care's about the legal ramifications

but if Natalee is in fact dead, and the Aruban police screw up the investigation so that the perpetrators get off, then everyone is going to be screaming blue murder again,  because then they will want justice for the death of their daughter......this is exactly what happened in Bermuda, when that 15 year old Canadian girl foolishly hopped on a motorcycle with two guys, she and her friend were stranded after a concert at 4:00 am, there were no taxis around, and rather than call the one girl's parents [they lived on the island, Canadian girl was visiting] they hopped on motorcycles with three guys, now the one girl, her ride was a nice guy and dropped her off at her house, the other two didn't drop off their passenger, she was raped and murdered and found on a beach in the St. Georges section of the island

Bermuda rushed to judgment, they gave this Jamaican illegal a plea bargain before the forensics came back, turned out he was the one who raped her, the other guy just held her down, maybe, the Bermudian accomplice got off, the Jamaican guy got a  light sentence and there were a number of appeals, the girl's parents were pushing for some kind of justice and were bitterly disappointed.......

now if they find out Natalee was alive and there was a window of opportunity which was missed, then everyone is going to be screaming blue murder at the Aruban authorities again


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:08:21 PM
thanks Diva...I just wanted to put that part in about them going because I know it was a big discussion point the other night about them going unannounced.
Greta just said Mrs VDS said her son is being interrogated for up to 11 hours a day


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:08:53 PM
VDS believe in in Jorans innocence, but the 90 min meeting got very emotional, Beth asked some hard ?'s to the VDS, The Parents say they want to help BHT find Natalee also, Father VDS appeared nervous, wringing his hands... commercial


Title: Gretta Van Susteren's show
Post by: LouLou on June 21, 2005, 08:09:35 PM
O Really is stealing Gretta Van Susteren's thunder.  He's going to milk her for all the information in her report making her show OLD NEWS.

He's a jerk to do that.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:09:36 PM
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


Title: MRS VDS WAS IN HOLLAND!
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:10:22 PM
HEAR THAT?  JORAN'S MOM WAS NOT HOME WHEN NATALEE CAME CALLING!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 08:10:34 PM
Just because these two security guards were not the ones, that alone would not rule out the HI story.  Do we have evidence that the story has really changed to the Marriot?


Why would they go to the Marriot--better beaches?

This is one really strange case that probably has a simple truth--hidden somewhere in the tangle.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:10:56 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


News to me.

This makes JVDS the ultimate latch key kid.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:11:10 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
thanks Diva...I just wanted to put that part in about them going because I know it was a big discussion point the other night about them going unannounced.
Greta just said Mrs VDS said her son is being interrogated for up to 11 hours a day



{{{{Kerin & fellow Monkeys}}}}

This is SO hard, I can put myself in BHT shoes & AVDS, I imagine both hearts are beyond broken. I can't wait until GVS's show tonight...

 :cry: too bad I won't have my new laptop so I can post & watch at the same time. grrr.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sandy on June 21, 2005, 08:11:21 PM
Good evening everyone - just got in - have been out most of the day trying to pretend I have a real life.
Sped read through 8 or 9 pages - firstly - was an OR nurse in a previous life and was around in the early 70"s when they were test driving ketamine - it was hysterical in the recovery room - the patients were barking like dogs.
What is Greta doing - morphing into a social worker? She is becoming part of the story - isn't that a little dangerous?


Title: Re: MRS VDS WAS IN HOLLAND!
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:11:33 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
HEAR THAT?  JORAN'S MOM WAS NOT HOME WHEN NATALEE CAME CALLING!

correct Iquitos...only dad was home (if Natalee actually went there that is)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:11:49 PM
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


Title: Re: TRANSLATION
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 08:12:42 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
THIS IS AS FAR AS I CAN GO RIGHT NOW. SOUNDS LIKE PROPAGANDA. IT IS ENOUGH TO GET AN IDEA. NOT PERFECT. WHAT A LANGUAGE. I THINK IT IS CLOSEST TO LADINO, THE LANGUAGE OF THE JEWS EXILED FROM SPAIN BY THE INQUISITION, SOME OF WHOM ENDED UP IN THE ANTILLES.


A most interesting linguistical tidbit!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:12:45 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


She wears them here in DC in August with 100% humidity.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 08:13:09 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


Yes, and please, GRETA, do something with your hair, hon...bless your heart.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AzRose on June 21, 2005, 08:13:16 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


I just caught the tale end of that as well.  I personally have never heard that she was away in Holland when this all took place.  Mr. was at the home.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 08:13:33 PM
So would that explain the piece of foam at the beach..with teeth marks on it????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:13:43 PM
yes it is tough, Diva. Mrs. VDS would of course think her son is innocent and hey...she wasn't even in the country to know for sure!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 08:14:08 PM
So would that explain the piece of foam at the beach..with teeth marks on it????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:14:22 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


Yes, and please, GRETA, do something with your hair, hon...bless your heart.


She already did something to her face. On the subject of Greta we are missing a poster, I believe from Atlanta?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 08:14:40 PM
Quote
O Really is stealing Gretta Van Susteren's thunder. He's going to milk her for all the information in her report making her show OLD NEWS.

He's a jerk to do that.


Loulou, you snatched the words right off my fingers. Except I was going to call him something less polite. ;)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:14:42 PM
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
Quote from: "Rob"
if ms twitty is correct and natalee was at jvds house, then that narrows the time line to only 2 hours when natalee was unaccounted for....


Wonder how Beth H-T knows Natalee was at Jorans at 3am???


Maybe forensics or pics on someones camera??? *shrugs*


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:15:01 PM
Quote from: "RB"
How could anyone in the US discussing details of what happened in Aruba hamper an investigation that is taking place in Aruba? Help me out please because I don't understand that logic.

CancunMole, it's inconceivable to me that it would hamper it, unless there are details which can be construed in a manner the Holloways don't agree with. That is a point of concern for me, and does make me slightly wary about the "whys" behind that statement.


Thank you RB. The thing I'm not getting is that they're not happy that their not getting information from Aruba.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 08:15:48 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


Kerintx..please don't start tonight..or I am going to need a diaper LOL
Love your humor!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:15:50 PM
I don't bother with O Reilly anyway, stealer.......

wow if mama was away that day what about the rest of the kids too?

because you know when mama is away, daddy will often play ooh I just had a real kinky and sad scenario, what if daddy was in on the sexual hijinks, would Joran give up his old man that easily???? and is the old man the one manipulating all the friends??? does he have stuff on them maybe?

ok I'm going mad but hey it would make a great episode of L & O or CSI


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:15:57 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
yes it is tough, Diva. Mrs. VDS would of course think her son is innocent and hey...she wasn't even in the country to know for sure!!


Maybe thats why PapaSmurf was wringing his hands & evasive per Greta, he was the only one home that night??  :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 08:16:55 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


Kerintx..please don't start tonight..or I am going to need a diaper LOL
Love your humor!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:17:18 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
I don't bother with O Reilly anyway, stealer.......

wow if mama was away that day what about the rest of the kids too?

because you know when mama is away, daddy will often play ooh I just had a real kinky and sad scenario, what if daddy was in on the sexual hijinks, would Joran give up his old man that easily???? and is the old man the one manipulating all the friends??? does he have stuff on them maybe?

ok I'm going mad but hey it would make a great episode of L & O or CSI


I can just hear NBC's promo "RIPPED FROM THE HEADLINES; A NEW LAW & ORDER"  LMFAO


Title: PARENTAL TRAVEL
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:17:31 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


News to me.

This makes JVDS the ultimate latch key kid.


WE SPECULATED THE OLD MAN WAS IN HOLLAND, NOTHING ON THE MOTHER


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:17:53 PM
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
tonight must be the night Greta goes through the VDS's trash cans as I predicted earlier.


Kerintx..please don't start tonight..or I am going to need a diaper LOL
Love your humor!!!!


ok......
but Greta was out of line broadcasting from the doorstep of the Kalpoe home!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:18:10 PM
There were first rumours that dad vds was in Holland as I remember correctly.

Quote
KerinTX wrote:
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 08:18:16 PM
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 08:18:36 PM
Just listened to O'Reilly-that were talking with Greta-only video when first arrived and left-Greta said VDS did not want video of that

1. Was going to spend day with BHT just to see what she does. Greta asked what BHT would really like to do-she said to talk to the Dutch Boys parents, Greta said let'sgo
2. Yelling over fence at VDS house-dad let them in
3. Both moms see each other and emotional embrace
4. Mom VDS said she believes her sons innocense-she says he told her he and NH spent time on the beach by Marriott and then he left her there (???????????????)
5.  Dad could not respond to ?'s-he told BHT I can't help since I am not allowed to see my son-can't talk to him
6. Mom VDS is going to visit son again tonight
7.  When mom VDS goes to visit son-really can't talk-when anything is said from either mom or son-guards take him away
8. Mom VDS said they keep ?ing him 11 hours a day

It is said BHT feels JVDS knows something, still believes she is alive, she just wants JVDS to tell her where Natalie is-that she feels he knows. Told parents if JVDS tells her where NH is-she will get her and go home. It was said BHT was not emotional but mom VDS was very emotional in the meeting.

O'reilly said Aruba is still very angry with Media--also informed & warned reporters and journalists-they better not turn this against the country.

WHEW----that is everything--I am sooooo tuning into Greta--I think 8 or 9pm central time, right?  I am slow...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:18:43 PM
Thank you RB. The thing I'm not getting is that they're not happy that their not getting information from Aruba.

CancunMole,  they sort of understand the Dutch law, but I think they believe that their case should be handled by the Arubans and Dutch the way we do here - although I can tell you that in high profile cases (for example, the sniper case here in the DC area and several child abduction cases in Florida and California recently) the police can be very closedmouthed, even to the family.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:19:07 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?

NO, the MOM was in Holland that night.

 :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:19:08 PM
somebody get O"Reilly off the air!!! He is a big old news stealer!!!!


Title: NH has now been placed at VDS batchleor pad
Post by: LouLou on June 21, 2005, 08:19:20 PM
NH has now been placed at VDS batchleor pad (rumor).

 This reminds me of a post on the aruba board before it got pulled down.  that folkes should ask about, "what was in that drink at 3:15 am that night." and what about that 2 hour boat ride


Title: Re: PARENTAL TRAVEL
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:19:29 PM
Quote


WE SPECULATED THE OLD MAN WAS IN HOLLAND, NOTHING ON THE MOTHER


We know he had just returned, were they actually there together without the kids for the period of time right before this? Say in the days leading up to the disapperance, could she have been at the house before that night? No parents bring the tourist girl back to the pad?


Title: Re: PARENTAL TRAVEL
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:20:38 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote


WE SPECULATED THE OLD MAN WAS IN HOLLAND, NOTHING ON THE MOTHER


We know he had just returned, were they actually there together without the kids for the period of time right before this? Say in the days leading up to the disapperance, could she have been at the house before that night? No parents bring the tourist girl back to the pad?


Yeah, but for the longest time we were even asking about the Dad - where was he etc etc.  We saw Mom, but never Dad and now we discover Dad was around all the time?


Title: Re: PARENTAL TRAVEL
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:20:50 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote


WE SPECULATED THE OLD MAN WAS IN HOLLAND, NOTHING ON THE MOTHER


We know he had just returned, were they actually there together without the kids for the period of time right before this? Say in the days leading up to the disapperance, could she have been at the house before that night? No parents bring the tourist girl back to the pad?


:HMMMMMMM:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rubby on June 21, 2005, 08:20:54 PM
This is going to end up like the OJ case except we will never know what happen with NH.

Been over 3 weeks and no one is yet to break and I doubt very seriously if they will. In 3 months they will be set free and they know 3 months is better than life so they will not talk.

Only hope is too find NH and that will take some extremely good luck.

Looks like the bad guys win another one.

 :(


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 08:21:31 PM
OMG - I'm slammed at work, can't keep up with you guys too. Could someone please post bullet points periodically, so I don't have to scroll through everything?  PLEASE!  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 08:22:34 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?


Dad was in Aruba...the mother was in Holland.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 08:22:58 PM
Okay, I could swear that the mom said that the next day Joran told "US what had happened....". So, I'm guessing that she was referring to both herself and her husband, if that is what she said. And, of course, if it's true.
If either of them came from NL, they could have been up, since it would have been 9am Dutch time.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 08:23:02 PM
its starting to bother me how rehearsed micky johns tv interview seemed---the way he was going over what he "heard" while in his cell near one of the Kalpoes. looked like he was reading a teleprompter in his mind or something. i would like to see all details known regarding their employment/possibly new guards that replaced them at the Allegro resort/ and also their alibis


anybody??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:23:33 PM
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Just because these two security guards were not the ones, that alone would not rule out the HI story.  Do we have evidence that the story has really changed to the Marriot?


Why would they go to the Marriot--better beaches?

This is one really strange case that probably has a simple truth--hidden somewhere in the tangle.


According to Greta, just now on TV, J told his mother that he left NH on the beach. AVdS also said that when she visits him, if she tries to talk to him about the case, he is taken away. AVdS to visit him tonight


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 08:23:59 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
I don't bother with O Reilly anyway, stealer.......

wow if mama was away that day what about the rest of the kids too?

because you know when mama is away, daddy will often play ooh I just had a real kinky and sad scenario, what if daddy was in on the sexual hijinks, would Joran give up his old man that easily???? and is the old man the one manipulating all the friends??? does he have stuff on them maybe?

ok I'm going mad but hey it would make a great episode of L & O or CSI


I just think daddy has something to do with it, one way or another. Now this is interesting that momma wasn't home.........one less witness


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:25:02 PM
Minor point but that explains why Joran was allowed to be rude to Mrs. Holloway when she asked Joran "where is my daughter" while sitting in a car and clutching Natalee's photo.
Because I seriously doubt any mother would allow their son to be rude in that instance and not SLAP HIM UP SIDE HIS HEAD!!!  :twisted:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:25:27 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Did we all know that Mrs VDS was not at home when all this happened? She was in Holland. If I did, I must have forgotten.


News to me.

This makes JVDS the ultimate latch key kid.


Remember though all the speculation that the father was in Holland and that Joran and the father went to Holland and then came back. It was the mother!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AzRose on June 21, 2005, 08:25:32 PM
Am I correct that only the father was questioned this weekend and not the mother?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:25:34 PM
I would like to know the following.

VDS Mom and Dad where abouts during the whole time MB students where there.

Natalee's whereabouts each of the other nights during the trip.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:25:49 PM
Quote
4. Mom VDS said she believes her sons innocense-she says he told her he and NH spent time on the beach by Marriott and then he left her there (???????????????)




HannieC wrote:

Quote
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:27:02 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


She wears them here in DC in August with 100% humidity.


Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right? What if he were right when he said, "I have it from an impeccable source, an impeccable source. . ." And what if he was run off the island because his sources dried up? And what if Greta was brought in because she had better courtroom skills? You know how that works, you work hard to establish your credentials and to establish rapport, before asking the hard questions. And what if Greta has access to that same "impeccable source."
It will be something to see this bulldog get the marrow out of the bone.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Y'alls Psychic Detective on June 21, 2005, 08:27:36 PM
Interview with Beth Twitty coming up on CNN Headline (Nancy Grace Show)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 08:27:59 PM
Quote from: "AzRose"
Am I correct that only the father was questioned this weekend and not the mother?

Correct. Mother got to talk to Joran, but was not questioned.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AzRose on June 21, 2005, 08:28:25 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "AzRose"
Am I correct that only the father was questioned this weekend and not the mother?

Correct. Mother got to talk to Joran, but was not questioned.


Thanks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lee on June 21, 2005, 08:28:35 PM
" think those kids are just too scared to tell the Aruban authorities the truth because they fear that they'll be blamed for what happened."

 well, Bob......they ARE to blame.....

accidental or incidental or unintended......that point is moot.....

they lied from the gitgo and have changed their stories....

did you forget that there is one lonely crushed  mother waiting for answers and these nice "Boys" can't even give her that.....


Title: ROB
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:28:42 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "amillerwvu"
Rob...sorry to hear about your friend...


thanks i apprciate it.....chad was an awesome person....excellent artist, and great sense of humor...
ROB:

THIS IS TERRIBLE  MY MOST PROFOUND CONDOLENCES TO YOU.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sandy on June 21, 2005, 08:28:53 PM
Remind me again what geraldo stated as fact after saying he had it from an impeccable source.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 08:29:10 PM
Quote from: "lee"
" think those kids are just too scared to tell the Aruban authorities the truth because they fear that they'll be blamed for what happened."

 well, Bob......they ARE to blame.....

accidental or incidental or unintended......that point is moot.....

they lied from the gitgo and have changed their stories....

did you forget that there is one lonely crushed  mother waiting for answers and these nice "Boys" can't even give her that.....


Great post.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 08:29:25 PM
Quote from: "Y'alls Psychic Detective"
Interview with Beth Twitty coming up on CNN Headline (Nancy Grace Show)


OK, I'm outta here.  Gotta go home, feed the munchkins and get back here as soon as I can.  {{{{{{monkeys}}}}}}


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 08:30:45 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Quote
4. Mom VDS said she believes her sons innocense-she says he told her he and NH spent time on the beach by Marriott and then he left her there (???????????????)




HannieC wrote:

Quote
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


Now those 2 match up--that was what I heard Greta say mom VDS said about son. O'reilly said..OK the beach is for romance, making out or parties-why would a guy just leave the girl there...Greta also ?'d that and said either it was mutual or the guy is just a jerk.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Y'alls Psychic Detective on June 21, 2005, 08:30:56 PM
Quote from: "Professor"


Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right?


Without going into the rest of your post, I think these first two sentences show the plausibility!  :D

But seriously, we know Geraldo said a bunch of stuff that was crap.  He said Joran drove the fanciest car on the island for one.  Of course, Jaron wasn't even old enough to drive, didn't have a car, and his parents' cars weren't fancy (a jeep and a sedan, I believe).


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:31:53 PM
Quote from: "jac723"
Quote from: "HannieC"
Quote
4. Mom VDS said she believes her sons innocense-she says he told her he and NH spent time on the beach by Marriott and then he left her there (???????????????)




HannieC wrote:

Quote
Wasn`t there a rumour in the beginning that ; When the boys supposedly brought natalee to the HI they said; ' Natalee didn`t want any help with walking to the hotel b/c she could manage on her own'?


What if the story is true that they went to the beach and natalee had enough of the guys or joran she said; ' leave me alone' I don`t want to come with you anymore? And then joran or the brothers finally leave her alone? And then something happens to her afterwards?


Now those 2 match up--that was what I heard Greta say mom VDS said about son. O'reilly said..OK the beach is for romance, making out or parties-why would a guy just leave the girl there...Greta also ?'d that and said either it was mutual or the guy is just a jerk.

OR THE GUY IS A LIAR


Title: DISINFO
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:32:40 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.
 

PROF:  YOU FORGOT HER USE OF THE INTERNET ON 7 JUNE ASLO FROM THE RADIO


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:33:44 PM
Good evening monkeys..How is everyone tonight? I am sitting on pins and needles waiting for Greta......

Yall see Jennifer Wibanks with Katie Couric? I think if I were John Mason, I'd be the runaway groom.....Imagine waking to this  :shock:  every morning....LOLOL


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:34:04 PM
well, Bob......they ARE to blame.....

accidental or incidental or unintended......that point is moot.....

they lied from the gitgo and have changed their stories....

did you forget that there is one lonely crushed mother waiting for answers and these nice "Boys" can't even give her that.....


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:35:04 PM
I can imagen that if I was with a guy on a beach and maybe he wanted more than I would or I became angry over him for whatever reason,
I would also say to this guy go away leave me alone or something.

And maybe he tried to get her out of there b/c he didn`t thought is was  responsible to leave a girl alone. But if natalee is hardheaded she wouldn`t go anyway again with him i guess. So maybe after that he went away.


Title: Re: Latest news from Arizona
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:35:21 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
This just in: All Comedy Radio in Arizona- 1480 AM - had a "special" today on the Aruba case. They reported that Gary Condit has NOT yet been questioned, but that as soon as Ted Kennedy sobers up, they'll ask him about nh (and several other missing girls).

Just emailed the authorities in Aruba with my suggestion that detainees be transferred to Gitmo. [That'll make 'em talk].

I've seen all sorts of stories here; insider chat, bracelet-sale promos, teary-eyed ribbon people cyber-hugging each other, etc, especially during slow news cycles. Will continue to call 'em like I see 'em, tho ( entitled to my opinion-- and, yeah, it's too bad I have to keep repeating that ).

And in resp to one post; No, we are NOT all here for the same reason. Some for news reporting, some to ask questions, ... as many reasons as posters perhaps. That's real diversity, my friend.  ( As opposed to fake PC diversity which abhors true difference of opinion ). Many types of people here, contradictory opinions, numerous ways of talking/writing/thinking, varied news sources, you-name-it.

More breaking news: There's a girl over at The Onion site who is selling Natalee Holloway STATUES for a hundred-buck a pop. Not sure if it's serious or not, but my dashboard could sure use some sprucing up!

May G-d bless the beasts and the children.

-MC
 

MARTIN THANKS FOR YOUR UNORTHODOX VIEWS THAT COME AS CLOSE TO THE TRUTH.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:35:44 PM
as an aside I love Law & Order and speaking of another botched investigation, my favourite Law & Order episode is based on the Paul Bernardo/Karla Homolka case

[as a young female at that time it was very scary, there were four women abducted and killed in a short time frame, in the area where I live,  I remember driving down the highway when the search teams were scouring around the highway looking for one girl who had been abducted and her body burned and then I realized in a rare trip to Ottawa, we had driven past the spot where the one girl's body had been dumped and was found like the next day, that De Villier girl

two of the girls were abducted and killed by Paul Bernardo and his wife

[the poor mother of one of the girls, she had locked her daughter out of the house because she was consistently breaking curfew, and Bernardo picked her up in the middle of the night]

now they gave Karla a deal if she agreed to testify vs her husband but they found a videotape later that showed that Karla, far from being the battered wife she claimed, was not only a willing participant but she helped her husband rape her own sister (they videotaped the rape) and they had given her horse tranquilizer, and she vomited and choked, and Karla worked for a vet, she was the one who got the tranquilizer

now in Law & Order, good old McCoy got the plea bargain set aside because a condition of any plea bargain agreement is that you tell the truth and any lies about the material facts void the agreement, but in Canada they were too wussy to set aside the plea bargain and besides they still needed Karla to testify vs her husband to put him away for good.......

Karla baby is getting out soon....so if you are in Montreal, watch out for the vampire


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 08:35:47 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


She wears them here in DC in August with 100% humidity.


Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right? What if he were right when he said, "I have it from an impeccable source, an impeccable source. . ." And what if he was run off the island because his sources dried up? And what if Greta was brought in because she had better courtroom skills? You know how that works, you work hard to establish your credentials and to establish rapport, before asking the hard questions. And what if Greta has access to that same "impeccable source."
It will be something to see this bulldog get the marrow out of the bone.


impeccable source or unimpeachable source? and what did Geraldo know?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 08:36:00 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Good evening monkeys..How is everyone tonight? I am sitting on pins and needles waiting for Greta......

Yall see Jennifer Wibanks with Katie Couric? I think if I were John Mason, I'd be the runaway groom.....Imagine waking to this  :shock:  every morning....LOLOL


Hi Nikki (((hugs)))
No  :shock:  JW for me, I won't give her the ratings, ppl like her that will make ppl question REAL missing persons cases in the future JMO   :x


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 08:36:05 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
its starting to bother me how rehearsed micky johns tv interview seemed---the way he was going over what he "heard" while in his cell near one of the Kalpoes. looked like he was reading a teleprompter in his mind or something. i would like to see all details known regarding their employment/possibly new guards that replaced them at the Allegro resort/ and also their alibis


anybody??


Are/were they the only two people on Aruba with BLACK security uniforms.? Didnt they find a discarded black uniform ?


Title: Re: DISINFO
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 08:36:34 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"


PROF:  YOU FORGOT HER USE OF THE INTERNET ON 7 JUNE ASLO FROM THE RADIO


Iquitos, SOMEONE used the AOL account.


Title: Re: NH has now been placed at VDS batchleor pad
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:36:37 PM
Quote from: "LouLou"
NH has now been placed at VDS batchleor pad (rumor).

 This reminds me of a post on the aruba board before it got pulled down.  that folkes should ask about, "what was in that drink at 3:15 am that night." and what about that 2 hour boat ride


That post was traced back to an ISSP in the US that same night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:36:59 PM
cancon, I followed that story too. Karla is whack.


Title: Re: Latest news from Arizona
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:37:05 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "martin connahey"
This just in: All Comedy Radio in Arizona- 1480 AM - had a "special" today on the Aruba case. They reported that Gary Condit has NOT yet been questioned, but that as soon as Ted Kennedy sobers up, they'll ask him about nh (and several other missing girls).

Just emailed the authorities in Aruba with my suggestion that detainees be transferred to Gitmo. [That'll make 'em talk].

I've seen all sorts of stories here; insider chat, bracelet-sale promos, teary-eyed ribbon people cyber-hugging each other, etc, especially during slow news cycles. Will continue to call 'em like I see 'em, tho ( entitled to my opinion-- and, yeah, it's too bad I have to keep repeating that ).

And in resp to one post; No, we are NOT all here for the same reason. Some for news reporting, some to ask questions, ... as many reasons as posters perhaps. That's real diversity, my friend.  ( As opposed to fake PC diversity which abhors true difference of opinion ). Many types of people here, contradictory opinions, numerous ways of talking/writing/thinking, varied news sources, you-name-it.

More breaking news: There's a girl over at The Onion site who is selling Natalee Holloway STATUES for a hundred-buck a pop. Not sure if it's serious or not, but my dashboard could sure use some sprucing up!

May G-d bless the beasts and the children.

-MC
 

MARTIN THANKS FOR YOUR UNORTHODOX VIEWS THAT COME AS CLOSE TO THE TRUTH.



Ummm...ok


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AZsunny on June 21, 2005, 08:37:59 PM
Didn't one of the hotel secuirty video cameras pick up the picture of a girl looking like Natalee walking alone on the beach that night?  which hotel was that?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 08:38:28 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
I can imagen that if I was with a guy on a beach and maybe he wanted more than I would or I became angry over him for whatever reason,
I would also say to this guy go away leave me alone or something.

And maybe he tried to get her out of there b/c he didn`t thought is was  responsible to leave a girl alone. But if natalee is hardheaded she wouldn`t go anyway again with him i guess. So maybe after that he went away.


That certainly is plausible.  

It also places SGCroes in the proximity of NH...w/ or w/o Joran VDS.


Title: thoughts and theories
Post by: Scott on June 21, 2005, 08:38:47 PM
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 08:39:41 PM
Quote from: "RB"


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


Seems that the FBI has, and BHT has heard enough to satisfy her. Not sure what that means, precisely, but the friends and fellow students don't owe the public any explanation provided they've come forward with what they know to the authorities. What do you bet their stories haven't changed daily, either?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:41:17 PM
My sis was at the pool today with some friends...one friend started talking about how"the chaperones needed to be more watchful, who would let their kids go on a trip like that" etc..etc...my sis just sat there and watched the drama unfold..never said a word..a mom who's daughter went on the trip to aruba  just so happened to be at the poll..chillin'' and JUMPED HER CHIT...lol....sis said she sat back laughin'....talk about open mouth insert foot.....

I wish people would get off the whole chaperone thingy...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:41:39 PM
Quote from: "sandy"
Remind me again what geraldo stated as fact after saying he had it from an impeccable source.


The "impeccale source" allegedly said, "We can't invesigate the family of Paulus van der Sloot. They're our FRIENDS."


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 08:42:03 PM
The side scan sonar equipment that the EquuSearch guy is talking about on Nancy Grave is AWESOME. There was a lady who drove into the Mississippi about a year or so ago, and they searched and searched the river, but her car was never found. A guy used this sonar equipment on his boat and found her submerged car very quickly. Her family was so grateful to finally be able to bury her.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:42:27 PM
unimpeachable source, like Bill Burkett, in the CBS fake but accurate memo scandal, LOL


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:43:16 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "RB"


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


Seems that the FBI has, and BHT has heard enough to satisfy her. Not sure what that means, precisely, but the friends and fellow students don't owe the public any explanation provided they've come forward with what they know to the authorities. What do you bet their stories haven't changed daily, either?


Didn't say they did, however I did see a post earlier where in an article (I think goon posted it) that BHT didn't want the students to be interviewed with the fear it would somehow hamper the investigation. I'll bet they have changed and even grown over time with all the publicity this case has been getting; indeed we have 2 of Natalee's best friends speaking to Greta tonight.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:43:23 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
The side scan sonar equipment that the EquuSearch guy is talking about on Nancy Grave is AWESOME. There was a lady who drove into the Mississippi about a year or so ago, and they searched and searched the river, but her car was never found. A guy used this sonar equipment on his boat and found her submerged car very quickly. Her family was so grateful to finally be able to bury her.


when are the eqqusearch people getting there?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:44:30 PM
Quote from: "tuberide"
its starting to bother me how rehearsed micky johns tv interview seemed---the way he was going over what he "heard" while in his cell near one of the Kalpoes. looked like he was reading a teleprompter in his mind or something. i would like to see all details known regarding their employment/possibly new guards that replaced them at the Allegro resort/ and also their alibis


anybody??


There were guards for the Soul Beach Festival staying at the HI and they wore black uniforms.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:44:42 PM
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking about the chaperones.


Title: Re: DISINFO
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:45:03 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.
 

PROF:  YOU FORGOT HER USE OF THE INTERNET ON 7 JUNE ASLO FROM THE RADIO


Dr. Iquitos, I must offer an honorary PhD. You continually shame me with your investigative prowess.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 08:45:39 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "sandy"
Remind me again what geraldo stated as fact after saying he had it from an impeccable source.


The "impeccale source" allegedly said, "We can't invesigate the family of Paulus van der Sloot. They're our FRIENDS."


That must have been before they interviewed him for 4 hours!  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 08:45:59 PM
Quote from: "RB"

Didn't say they did, however I did see a post earlier where in an article (I think goon posted it) that BHT didn't want the students to be interviewed with the fear it would somehow hamper the investigation. I'll bet they have changed and even grown over time with all the publicity this case has been getting; indeed we have 2 of Natalee's best friends speaking to Greta tonight.


Any idea who they are?  Seems like everyone who has come forward (some with names of some without attribution in news articles) has said essentially the same thing about that night. It could hamper the investigation, because if they gave sensitive information to the FBI and then gave it to the public, it could cause the suspects to further change their stories based on whatever evidence might not be in their favor, I'm thinking.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:46:19 PM
Whitney wrote:

Quote
That certainly is plausible.

It also places SGCroes in the proximity of NH...w/ or w/o Joran VDS.


Maybe the brothers and Steve Croes were also at the beach, when joran leaves. w/ or w/o the brothers.

Maybe that`s why( if it`s true) was there the call to Steve Croes that morning at 6.30 to ask if natalee was brought to the hotel safe.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:46:55 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:47:03 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
My sis was at the pool today with some friends...one friend started talking about how"the chaperones needed to be more watchful, who would let their kids go on a trip like that" etc..etc...my sis just sat there and watched the drama unfold..never said a word..a mom who's daughter went on the trip to aruba  just so happened to be at the poll..chillin'' and JUMPED HER CHIT...lol....sis said she sat back laughin'....talk about open mouth insert foot.....

I wish people would get off the whole chaperone thingy...


So your sister is in MB?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:47:42 PM
Nope, LilOrphan, I don't know.  I do know that I can count on 1 hand and a coupe fingers the number of written and media (interview) accounts vouching for Natalee's integrity.  I see very little other than generalizations about the events of the night that really make sense.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lee on June 21, 2005, 08:48:05 PM
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 90
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
 Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 7:49 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
"IF YOU ARE LYING THAT DOES NOT MAKES YOU A MURDERER! "
.

WHAT HAPPENS TO INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY???

WE CAN ONLY SPECULATE B/C WE DON`T KNOW ANYTHING UNTIL WE HEAR FROM THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT WHAT THEY HAVE "


ah...no....

we can speculate as much as we want...

and don't forget that in Aruba, a person is GUILTY until proved innocent, so as far as I 'm concerned, its the 3 AMigos who need to be prove their innocence...

don't know anything?.....wrong...we know an 18 yro girl is not home in Alabama where she should be...

we know three guys were seen with her that last night...

we know three guys that all lied initially....and got two innocent guys arrested because of that lie....

I am trying to be fair and open, but please don't say "we know nothing" or "we can't speculate" because WE CAN.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 08:48:25 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
unimpeachable source, like Bill Burkett, in the CBS fake but accurate memo scandal, LOL


Hey, it doesn't matter if the documents are forged, just believe what we tell you!  :lol:  Dan Rather = Baghdad Bob. "These are not the pictures you are seeing" :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 08:48:29 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


She wears them here in DC in August with 100% humidity.


Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right? What if he were right when he said, "I have it from an impeccable source, an impeccable source. . ." And what if he was run off the island because his sources dried up? And what if Greta was brought in because she had better courtroom skills? You know how that works, you work hard to establish your credentials and to establish rapport, before asking the hard questions. And what if Greta has access to that same "impeccable source."
It will be something to see this bulldog get the marrow out of the bone.


impeccable source or unimpeachable source? and what did Geraldo know?


Do you think his or others possible sources are ending up dead ??  Dont know the timeline.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:48:32 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


My apologies...and for the record, I'm not a dude :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:48:42 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
My sis was at the pool today with some friends...one friend started talking about how"the chaperones needed to be more watchful, who would let their kids go on a trip like that" etc..etc...my sis just sat there and watched the drama unfold..never said a word..a mom who's daughter went on the trip to aruba  just so happened to be at the poll..chillin'' and JUMPED HER CHIT...lol....sis said she sat back laughin'....talk about open mouth insert foot.....

I wish people would get off the whole chaperone thingy...


So your sister is in MB?

yes..well, actually Homewood..about 5 miles or so away.... :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Y'alls Psychic Detective on June 21, 2005, 08:49:08 PM
What I don't understand with all the resources of the Twitty's and their community why the reward isn't raised to a million dollars.  There are a lot of people who may not flip on someone for $75K, but would in a second for a million...


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: RichinTx on June 21, 2005, 08:49:32 PM
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:49:38 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


My apologies...and for the record, I'm not a dude :)


my apologies for assuming you were..just thought only a man would make such a quick judgement... <ducking>


Title: Re: DISINFO
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 08:49:47 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "iquitos"


PROF:  YOU FORGOT HER USE OF THE INTERNET ON 7 JUNE ASLO FROM THE RADIO


Iquitos, SOMEONE used the AOL account.


right...anyone could log on and maybe a family member did while at the twiitys in the "war room" that must have vbeen immed established there.
ya think?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:49:57 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "RB"


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


Seems that the FBI has, and BHT has heard enough to satisfy her. Not sure what that means, precisely, but the friends and fellow students don't owe the public any explanation provided they've come forward with what they know to the authorities. What do you bet their stories haven't changed daily, either?


They don't owe us anything. I am just asking where Natalee was each of the preceding nights and what kind of hours they were all keeping. But your right not owed and I don't expect I ever know.


Title: Re: DISINFO
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:50:37 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
Quote from: "tuberide"
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


indeed both had alibis, in fact their employment contracts were over.


And if the alibis of these two checked out, then this report MUST be false. It seems we have a wide-spread and deliberate misinformation campaign going on here. We have DiarioAruba "car chase story," and the Panty Boy story, and the TOP95 report of Natalee Holloway in Nigeria, and now this AM Digital story that the two security guards alibis did NOT check out. Hmm.
 

PROF:  YOU FORGOT HER USE OF THE INTERNET ON 7 JUNE ASLO FROM THE RADIO


Dr. Iquitos, I forgot to mention your superior linguistic ablilities. I have a hard enough time with Spanish. I have an even harder time with Dutch. But Papiemento is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond me.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 08:50:44 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Nope, LilOrphan, I don't know.  I do know that I can count on 1 hand and a coupe fingers the number of written and media (interview) accounts vouching for Natalee's integrity.  I see very little other than generalizations about the events of the night that really make sense.


It stands to reason that all information is being withheld, in both countries. The difference probably being that BHT has all the info from the students given to the FBI, but less from Aruba LE.   What do you feel doesn't make sense?  From the perspective of partying kids, I'm still young enough to remember being that age and their accounts seemed to make sense to me. Also, have you seen the web acct by a mom of one of the students?


Title: Re: Latest news from Arizona
Post by: gaijin on June 21, 2005, 08:50:58 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
This just in: All Comedy Radio in Arizona- 1480 AM - had a "special" today on the Aruba case. They reported that Gary Condit has NOT yet been questioned, but that as soon as Ted Kennedy sobers up, they'll ask him about nh (and several other missing girls).

Just emailed the authorities in Aruba with my suggestion that detainees be transferred to Gitmo. [That'll make 'em talk].

I've seen all sorts of stories here; insider chat, bracelet-sale promos, teary-eyed ribbon people cyber-hugging each other, etc, especially during slow news cycles. Will continue to call 'em like I see 'em, tho ( entitled to my opinion-- and, yeah, it's too bad I have to keep repeating that ).

And in resp to one post; No, we are NOT all here for the same reason. Some for news reporting, some to ask questions, ... as many reasons as posters perhaps. That's real diversity, my friend.  ( As opposed to fake PC diversity which abhors true difference of opinion ). Many types of people here, contradictory opinions, numerous ways of talking/writing/thinking, varied news sources, you-name-it.

More breaking news: There's a girl over at The Onion site who is selling Natalee Holloway STATUES for a hundred-buck a pop. Not sure if it's serious or not, but my dashboard could sure use some sprucing up!

May G-d bless the beasts and the children.

-MC
 

I'm sorry, but I'm going to make this as intellectual, eloquent, condesending and revealing as the crap that Im been forced to scroll over from you since the few days that you've been on here...
find another site...

you're posts are meaningless...

I'm sorry, but HERE...we care about HER...

I dont hear that in you...

you...are a jackass..


sure it's more than one man's opinion...


Title: TX EquuSearch
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 08:51:17 PM
Like so many of you, my first thought is that she is still alive.  I hold out hope with her Mom and her family and friends.  If she is not, heaven forbid, than I pray that her Mom will still be able to take her home.

I can hardly wait for the TX EquuSearch team to arrive in Aruba (I think they are beginning tomorrow) and get to work.  It seems very likely that Natalee is in the water somewhere and from what I read earlier the sonar equip has been very successful at finding bodies in the water.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:51:30 PM
actually nikki I agree with you on the chaperones in that this kind of thing can happen any weekend at home when you are talking about teenagers

how many raves or bush parties or after hours parties do these kids go to,  strangers are always crashing these parties, because of the internet now the word really spreads, there were kids who called the cops on their uninvited party guests, the crashers did $100,000 damage to their house, but I digress.....

how many kids have died on their first E trip because they didn't know to keep hydrated, imagine taking E in hot hot hot Aruba, oh I forgot this kids are from Alabama so they are used to hot hot hot, I'm Canadian and I found Aruba hot in January.......

most girls are date raped by guys they go to school with and most say nothing


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 08:51:50 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


My apologies...and for the record, I'm not a dude :)


my apologies for assuming you were..just thought only a man would make such a quick judgement... <ducking>


I didn't see what you said about the pool - I must have missed it.  I'll go back and look, but understand all I saw was what LilOrphan and I had been posting and thought it had been misconstrued.  (It happens here, you know?) Only a woman would ask a guy who peed in his cornflakes though ;)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:53:30 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


My apologies...and for the record, I'm not a dude :)


my apologies for assuming you were..just thought only a man would make such a quick judgement... <ducking>


I didn't see what you said about the pool - I must have missed it.  I'll go back and look, but understand all I saw was what LilOrphan and I had been posting and thought it had been misconstrued.  (It happens here, you know?) Only a woman would ask a guy who peed in his cornflakes though ;)


Odd Saddam doesn't like Fruit Loops who would've thought.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 08:53:36 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


Agreed.  After wading through post after post after post after post, what Scott said is very right on track and makes more sense than anything I've read.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 08:53:51 PM
lee wrote:

Quote
ah...no....

we can speculate as much as we want...

and don't forget that in Aruba, a person is GUILTY until proved innocent, so as far as I 'm concerned, its the 3 AMigos who need to be prove their innocence...

don't know anything?.....wrong...we know an 18 yro girl is not home in Alabama where she should be...

we know three guys were seen with her that last night...

we know three guys that all lied initially....and got two innocent guys arrested because of that lie....

I am trying to be fair and open, but please don't say "we know nothing" or "we can't speculate" because WE CAN.....



Ofcourse you can speculate, b/c that`s it just speculations! Just as we all do here.
And in Aruba it isn`t it so that you are GUILTY until proven INNOCENT I don`t know how you came up with that idea?


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 08:54:22 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


I'll bet it's probably close to that but I would add - Croes is Deepaks connection. Deepak may have slipped the drugs into Natalee's drink without Joran's knowledge. I heard it was rufies not xtc. :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:55:02 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "RB"
Actually, nikki, I'm not talking abut the chaperones.


Chill out, dude..nobody said you were..i was referring to the lady at the pool and people from PAST POSTS who ask about the whereabouts of chaperones..dont know who peed in your cornflakes, man, but dont go jumping on people  until you realize exactly why youre jumpin'..had NOTHING to do with you.....


My apologies...and for the record, I'm not a dude :)


my apologies for assuming you were..just thought only a man would make such a quick judgement... <ducking>


I didn't see what you said about the pool - I must have missed it.  I'll go back and look, but understand all I saw was what LilOrphan and I had been posting and thought it had been misconstrued.  (It happens here, you know?) Only a woman would ask a guy who peed in his cornflakes though ;)



Ok, feel free to go back and read...no one was accusing you of anything...everything is ok...truce... :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 08:55:43 PM
Quote from: "Y'alls Psychic Detective"
Quote from: "Professor"


Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right?


Without going into the rest of your post, I think these first two sentences show the plausibility!  :D

But seriously, we know Geraldo said a bunch of stuff that was crap.  He said Joran drove the fanciest car on the island for one.  Of course, Jaron wasn't even old enough to drive, didn't have a car, and his parents' cars weren't fancy (a jeep and a sedan, I believe).


How do you know that Joran DIDN'T drive the fanciest car on the island?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 08:55:57 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote

They don't owe us anything. I am just asking where Natalee was each of the preceding nights and what kind of hours they were all keeping. But your right not owed and I don't expect I ever know.


The post wasn't in response to your comments, absolut - those were good specific questions and I bet you'll get answered eventually.  It just seems unfair to compare the deafening silence and/or changing rumors coming from suspects to the dearth of statements made by friends who have been allegedly told not to come forward.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 21, 2005, 08:56:16 PM
Quote from: "RB"
well, Bob......they ARE to blame.....

accidental or incidental or unintended......that point is moot.....

they lied from the gitgo and have changed their stories....

did you forget that there is one lonely crushed mother waiting for answers and these nice "Boys" can't even give her that.....


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


I agree. Until all the details are divulged, student trip accounts as well as the 4's accounts will the complete truth be known.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lee on June 21, 2005, 08:56:29 PM
"It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either."

RB....I agree with you....I may be the only one here that thinks the students should have been quizzed extensively before they even unpacked their bags.....

and ironically, we really know very little about our own American contingent that went there...who the "chaperones" were , who the students were, etc...

we do have at least two eyewitnesses though who were NOT students or chaperones that saw Natalee that night , get up and leave, not with JOran and his imbeciles, but with them in the vicinity....this from a tourist from Michigan.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 08:56:31 PM
Quote
BHT didn't want the students to be interviewed with the fear it would somehow hamper the investigation. I'll bet they have changed


The other kids who were there that were not expecting this. It was the last night of the big trip. It is not likely that they were carefully observing every single thing, and recording all the details and sequence and timelines. They were at a party bar, partying.

Then all of a sudden people want them to recollect every second that they saw one classmate, who was she with, there in the dark, where did she go from there, what time was it, who else saw her, then what, and over and over again.

And only a handful of them actually saw Natalee in the company of Joran, and the one young lady who was on last night said she knew it was Joran because he was tall and had dark hair. And she saw this, while she was in the company of another friend. Singular.  And there was a young man who said he saw Natalee in the bar dancing with Carlos and Charlie's. These are the ones who, as far as we know, saw the most relevant things, and those things that they did see were not alarming or frightening.

In fact, I have not heard any student who actually saw Natalee get into the car with the 3 boys, though there was one report of seeing her *in* a car, but whether that person could also identify all the 3 in that same car, who knows?

It was the final night big bash. They had no reason to focus on Natalee's every move, nor is it likely that Natalee was the only one who spent part of the last night dancing and spending time with another young person who had caught their eye and who was not part of their school group.

So it is not like all 130 of them will have a whole lot to say, to anybody, except they hope Natalee is reunited with her family soon.


Title: LEAVING ON A JET PLANE
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 08:56:53 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
I still think maybe all of the group should have been interrogated as well since we have reports of scuffles possibly over Natalee, how do we know one of the Mountainbrook boys wasn't involved somehow

again put this into perspective, if this had happened in Alabama you know each of those kids would have been intensely questioned

do we know if this was done by the FBI or Alabama law enforcement

still I think if I were the Aruban police, I would have made that group stay until I had a chance to interview everyone


WHY DO YOU THINK THE BEAT IT OUT OF DODGE EN MASSE?  THESE ARE NOT DUMB PEOPLE


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 08:57:13 PM
In respone to the ketamine conversation.  It is typically used in the veterinary clinic in a liquid form as a pre-surgical anesthetic.  There is a problem with theft of this "vit K" from veterinary clinics.  I don't think that addicts smoke it though, I think they are using the same liquid version that vets do and injecting it.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 08:57:38 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


I'll bet it's probably close to that but I would add - Croes is Deepaks connection. Deepak may have slipped the drugs into Natalee's drink without Joran's knowledge. I heard it was rufies not xtc. :shock:


May not have been any slipping. CNC's was really "jumpin" that night and most of the week is my guess. X is prolly like getting a piece of gum in that place.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 08:58:01 PM
good theory Scott except if Papa Van Der Sloot, knowing it was an accident, which could be proven by Natalee's dead body, ie if she had OD on X, would be jeopardizing HIS whole career by participating in a cover up, if it was truly an accident, calling the cops and letting there be an autopsy on Natalee would be the best thing to do for everyone, they would be rapped on the knuckles for the X would they not, this is a Dutch colony drug no big whoop......

if there was sex and it was consensual, they can usually tell and if it wasn't consensual they can usually tell

so I think Papa wasn't hiding any accident, he was hiding something else or he knows he is counselling this son in a way to beat the murder rap, which explains why they won't let him talk to the kid.......


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 08:59:05 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
actually nikki I agree with you on the chaperones in that this kind of thing can happen any weekend at home when you are talking about teenagers

how many raves or bush parties or after hours parties do these kids go to,  strangers are always crashing these parties, because of the internet now the word really spreads, there were kids who called the cops on their uninvited party guests, the crashers did $100,000 damage to their house, but I digress.....

how many kids have died on their first E trip because they didn't know to keep hydrated, imagine taking E in hot hot hot Aruba, oh I forgot this kids are from Alabama so they are used to hot hot hot, I'm Canadian and I found Aruba hot in January.......

most girls are date raped by guys they go to school with and most say nothing



I totally agree..I mean , I am ..ahem...i'll say it...30 something...32 to be exact, and i am a grown, very intelligent mother of two..i can chaperone myself, ya know? And I was given a date rape drug...wasnt raped..that i know of, thank GOD..but i was robbed...and woke up in a cab in my front yard..and this happened in lil ole south carolina in a sports bar..on a monday night..surrounded by friends...it can happen to anyone anywhere.....


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 08:59:34 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.



Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


Agreed.  After wading through post after post after post after post, what Scott said is very right on track and makes more sense than anything I've read.


I can't really buy this one. His dad, prepping to be a judge, 'believing it to be an accident' helped facilitate NH's disappearance?! You make these people sound like seasoned criminals. I'm not ready to take that step based on the information we have, which in reality is very little.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 08:59:52 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Whitney wrote:

Quote
That certainly is plausible.

It also places SGCroes in the proximity of NH...w/ or w/o Joran VDS.


Maybe the brothers and Steve Croes were also at the beach, when joran leaves. w/ or w/o the brothers.

Maybe that`s why( if it`s true) was there the call to Steve Croes that morning at 6.30 to ask if natalee was brought to the hotel safe.


HannieC at this point, wouldn't that be a pip? (as in irony)  "if it fits, you must acquit"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 09:00:19 PM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "tuberide"
its starting to bother me how rehearsed micky johns tv interview seemed---the way he was going over what he "heard" while in his cell near one of the Kalpoes. looked like he was reading a teleprompter in his mind or something. i would like to see all details known regarding their employment/possibly new guards that replaced them at the Allegro resort/ and also their alibis


anybody??


There were guards for the Soul Beach Festival staying at the HI and they wore black uniforms.


i'm not looking for the poster but yes that is what i heard-unoficially....

Bill Reillys over thank god! :!:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 09:00:20 PM
I don't know the screename of this posting, but I think whoever said that she was drugged at the bar, raped, overdosed, and disposed of with help from SC is exactly right.  

Also, regarding the response of those calling for a ban on Aruba.  I think anywhere you are is dangerous, but I would have to think twice before going there since it does not appear as if the Aruban police and government are doing everything they can/should be doing.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 09:00:27 PM
Lots of us from TX.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lee on June 21, 2005, 09:00:45 PM
cancun, RB.....Karla is more than wacked.....she is evil....

evil doesn't have to come in the form of a big hairy monster...

it can be insidious......like Karla....and IMO, like what the mother who gave birth to those two children of MJ....then let him have full custody.....

evil IMO....just evil....


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:01:01 PM
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away



*for what its worth......*


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:01:38 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
good theory Scott except if Papa Van Der Sloot, knowing it was an accident, which could be proven by Natalee's dead body, ie if she had OD on X, would be jeopardizing HIS whole career by participating in a cover up, if it was truly an accident, calling the cops and letting there be an autopsy on Natalee would be the best thing to do for everyone, they would be rapped on the knuckles for the X would they not, this is a Dutch colony drug no big whoop......

if there was sex and it was consensual, they can usually tell and if it wasn't consensual they can usually tell

so I think Papa wasn't hiding any accident, he was hiding something else or he knows he is counselling this son in a way to beat the murder rap, which explains why they won't let him talk to the kid.......


No body, no murder rap.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:01:40 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


I wouldn't be surprised if this turned out to be close to the truth, myself and others have been saying since the beginning that their was probably some sort of overdose or other form of accidental death.  The whole kidnapping/slavery deal seems to far fetched, and she doesn't seem like the sort of person who would run away.  One thing that is bothering me though is this: why haven't they cracked yet and told?  I wouldn't think that it would be that hard to get some teenagers to crack after interogating them in horid conditons for long periods of time.  But maybe I;m wrong.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 09:01:46 PM
Jumping back in...

On O"Reilly's talking points he just said..

The Natalee Holloway story should be on the TV of every home in the US with teens.

and that's true...

BBL

Ewww...Mark Fuhrman coming up.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:01:57 PM
It was the final night big bash. They had no reason to focus on Natalee's every move, nor is it likely that Natalee was the only one who spent part of the last night dancing and spending time with another young person who had caught their eye and who was not part of their school group.

So it is not like all 130 of them will have a whole lot to say, to anybody, except they hope Natalee is reunited with her family soon


Of course you're entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine.  I do recall, however, sharing my feelings with my girlfriends about the teacher I had been secreting dating while still a student for 4 months prior to graduation and having them all at my wedding 2 years later :) All I'm saying is I'm sure she had some good friends closer to her who know more than they've said - even one of the MB'ers on here last night alluded to them being there and that it wouldn't "be a good idea for a number of reasons" for them to be interviewed. Kinda makes you wonder just a tad...


Title: SCENARIOS
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 09:02:14 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
BHT didn't want the students to be interviewed with the fear it would somehow hamper the investigation. I'll bet they have changed


The other kids who were there that were not expecting this. It was the last night of the big trip. It is not likely that they were carefully observing every single thing, and recording all the details and sequence and timelines. They were at a party bar, partying.

Then all of a sudden people want them to recollect every second that they saw one classmate, who was she with, there in the dark, where did she go from there, what time was it, who else saw her, then what, and over and over again.

And only a handful of them actually saw Natalee in the company of Joran, and the one young lady who was on last night said she knew it was Joran because he was tall and had dark hair. And she saw this, while she was in the company of another friend. Singular.  And there was a young man who said he saw Natalee in the bar dancing with Carlos and Charlie's. These are the ones who, as far as we know, saw the most relevant things, and those things that they did see were not alarming or frightening.

In fact, I have not heard any student who actually saw Natalee get into the car with the 3 boys, though there was one report of seeing her *in* a car, but whether that person could also identify all the 3 in that same car, who knows?

It was the final night big bash. They had no reason to focus on Natalee's every move, nor is it likely that Natalee was the only one who spent part of the last night dancing and spending time with another young person who had caught their eye and who was not part of their school group.

So it is not like all 130 of them will have a whole lot to say, to anybody, except they hope Natalee is reunited with her family soon.


 LIKE I HAVE SAID BEFORE, NATALEE FELL THORUGH THE CRACKS.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 09:03:05 PM
Whitney wrote:

Quote
HannieC at this point, wouldn't that be a pip? (as in irony) "if it fits, you must acquit"



Just speculating :D  :wink:


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:04:29 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) ...*for what its worth......*


What the heck is that, WonderWoman?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 09:05:50 PM
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 09:06:46 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


I saved this from a couple weeks ago when there was some free wheeling  speculation about the GBH (liquid ex)...I wasn't aware of the 80% claim of ex's production from the Netherlands...

but...here's the URL:  http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/gbh.html

The whole reason we're still speaking about this, though, is not only the "blond girl"...but her "blond mother...Beth Holloway is on a mission-of-her-life"..


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: veme on June 21, 2005, 09:07:22 PM
Quote from: "DT"
One thing that is bothering me though is this: why haven't they cracked yet and told?  I wouldn't think that it would be that hard to get some teenagers to crack after interogating them in horid conditons for long periods of time.  But maybe I;m wrong.

I've wondered the same thing.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:07:28 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) ...*for what its worth......*


What the heck is that, WonderWoman?



Yeah, what the heck IS that?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:08:19 PM
WonderWoman's post looks like a statement. Plausible, perhaps.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:08:23 PM
Wonderwoman, I'm a little confused by your story because you are not saying who your "friend" is.  Have you reported this?  I take it you live in Aruba???  *a little confused*


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:08:57 PM
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?


We have actually heard all of that before just never in summed up like that. That is from Deepak I believe.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 09:09:24 PM
For all who are interested...the TX based EquuSearch team is a volunteer organization.  They accept donations at their website equusearch.org.  Their is a very long list of missing persons on their website.  This is a GREAT cause if any of you are looking for somewhere to make a donation.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:09:24 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote


I can't really buy this one. His dad, prepping to be a judge, 'believing it to be an accident' helped facilitate NH's disappearance?! You make these people sound like seasoned criminals. I'm not ready to take that step based on the information we have, which in reality is very little.


I agree.  If it did happen as an accident, they're all smart enough to realize that any cover-up would just make it worse, and now LE believes they've done 10x worse things than happened to be present when a girl died due to unforseen causes.  Even if Deepak gave Joran the drug to give her, that could likely remain unproven that either had been involved in how drugs got in her system.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:10:20 PM
quote]

I saved this from a couple weeks ago when there was some free wheeling  speculation about the GBH (liquid ex)...I wasn't aware of the 80% claim of ex's production from the Netherlands...

but...here's the URL:  http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/gbh.html

quote]
Dumb questions. Is there a hospital on the island? Have local hospitals been checked? (I know, probably the dumbest post I've made.)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:11:27 PM
Still waiting for WonderWoman to clarify what that post was.  :?:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:11:39 PM
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:12:43 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


umm..ya wanna quit being so vague, pretty please, and let us know what it is your e talkin' about exactly? thanks.. :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:12:43 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


I believe that as well.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:12:48 PM
nikki, oh my god how horrible

thank goodness you managed to survive that

they were interviewing some US college girls in Aruba this week and when asked about the date rape drug, oh it's very common on our campus, they said it so nonchalantly like it was a fact of life - gee what happened to just getting the chick drunk, I guess too many girls can outdrink the guys I guess......

add to it that some girls are taking GBH on purpose to get high?!?!? :(

man the drugs these days, now I missed the acid and LSD period, thank god, i still have a brain left, we all know the people who used too much acid and LSD and pot from those days, they are space cadets now, if they are still alive, our high school crowd mainly was underage drinking,

but I think the stuff the kids do today, are way more frightening, like crystal meth, crack, estasy, these roofies, kids taking antihistamines to get high, I'd rather they smoked pot frankly........but even the pot is like 100 times more potent than the old days......


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 09:12:54 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) ...*for what its worth......*


What the heck is that, WonderWoman?


I am wondering the same thing--the story u seem to be giving is one of the brothers story----when it came to the car part--OR that just means there are even MORE lies--UGH!!!!!!???!?!?!?!?!?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:12:57 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


What does THAT mean? You're being very cryptic.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:12:59 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


WW, who are you exactly?  

Ummmm, nooooooooooooooooooooo, not necessarily.  Have you said anything directly to the authorities or made a report just like the story you told here?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 09:13:22 PM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "RB"
well, Bob......they ARE to blame.....

accidental or incidental or unintended......that point is moot.....

they lied from the gitgo and have changed their stories....

did you forget that there is one lonely crushed mother waiting for answers and these nice "Boys" can't even give her that.....


It's my opinion that we haven't heard everything that happened up to the time Natalee got in the car from the students who knew Natalee best, either.


I agree. Until all the details are divulged, student trip accounts as well as the 4's accounts will the complete truth be known.


We may not ever know the COMPLETE truth, but we can really narrow down the list of prime suspects, and narrow down the possible scenarios, and they ain't pretty.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:13:24 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.



Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


Agreed.  After wading through post after post after post after post, what Scott said is very right on track and makes more sense than anything I've read.


I can't really buy this one. His dad, prepping to be a judge, 'believing it to be an accident' helped facilitate NH's disappearance?! You make these people sound like seasoned criminals. I'm not ready to take that step based on the information we have, which in reality is very little.


I agree, Chloe.  Due to the pain and sadness this case is clouded with I think we all want so badly to explain such a loss...in doing so many times we get off on tangents that are not based in much factual info.

Since confirmed info is so hard to come by, wild stories have been rampant.  There is very little we know for sure at this point.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 09:13:43 PM
Wonder, did the e-mail end there?  What else happened?


Title: Re: MRS VDS WAS IN HOLLAND!
Post by: Dallas Also on June 21, 2005, 09:13:53 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "iquitos"
HEAR THAT?  JORAN'S MOM WAS NOT HOME WHEN NATALEE CAME CALLING!

correct Iquitos...only dad was home (if Natalee actually went there that is)


So the dad should be under arrest for impeding the investigation of a missing person.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 09:14:03 PM
Quote from: "Whitney"
Quote from: "RichinTx"
Quote from: "Scott"
From all accounts, it seems JVDS hooked up regularly.  It didn't take him maliciously slipping something into girls' drinks for them to willingly have sex with him.  With the volume of international media exposure on this case, I have to believe, by now, that any American girl that JVDS drugged and raped would have come forward.  

What is the likelihood, however, of a girl reporting a rape if she knowingly, voluntarily took a drug like ecstasy while in his company?

80% of the world's ecstasy comes from the Netherlands and Belgium.  With daily flights from Amsterdam, the Aruban market is fully saturated with pure X, unlike what is sold in many cities in the US.

With NH's classmates on the trip remaining silent, and knowing that JVDS hung out at the HI for a good part of the week, and a large number of the kids pulled an all-nighter their last night in Aruba, it keeps open the possibility that a sizable number of kids were game to trying ecstasy.

Natalee, naive to the effects of both alcohol and ecstasy, at the encouragement of JVDS, may well have consciously decided to try X for the first time.  Even if she wasn't drinking to excess, the potential for overdosing increased exponentially.

Piecing the story together, it seem most plausible that JVDS got the X from DK, who got it from SGC.  NH overdosed on the beach w/ JVDS.  His guilt, and feeling the need to cover it up, likely stems not from him giving her the drug, but because they likely had sex; leaving him the primary suspect.  JVDS panicked, brought NH to his house.  PVDS, knowing the law, believing it was an accident, and not wanting his son's life to be ruined, helped facilitate NH's disappearance.

Remaining questions:

WHAT did NH drink at C&C's?
HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
WHAT did NH eat that day before going to C&C's?
Was NH at the bar when her drinks were ordered, or was she on the dance floor, or in the bathroom, and then handed the drinks by JVDS or another friend?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?
What was the shoving match between JVDS and NH's classmates about?


Scott,
I would be willing to bet large sums of money that you have just described almost exactly what has happened.  (Now that I think about it, it makes a whole lot more sense than all the other theories I've read and heard and even proposed myself)  JVDS may have had absolutely no malicious intent whatsoever but that doesn't mean that he is willing to come clean now.  Excellent assessment and all pieces seem to fit like a glove.


I saved this from a couple weeks ago when there was some free wheeling  speculation about the GBH (liquid ex)...I wasn't aware of the 80% claim of ex's production from the Netherlands...

but...here's the URL:  http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/gbh.html

The whole reason we're still speaking about this, though, is not only the "blond girl"...but her "blond mother...Beth Holloway is on a mission-of-her-life"..



Its GHB not GBH....and usually is taken in liquid form by the CAPFUL (think water bottle cap), it is SUPER easy to pass out from it ESPECIALLY with alcohol.....3 capfulls could easily knock a person drinking even a few drinks out like a light.....not to mention stop their heart....

i hope this is not the case...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:14:42 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
nikki, oh my god how horrible

thank goodness you managed to survive that

they were interviewing some US college girls in Aruba this week and when asked about the date rape drug, oh it's very common on our campus, they said it so nonchalantly like it was a fact of life - gee what happened to just getting the chick drunk, I guess too many girls can outdrink the guys I guess......

add to it that some girls are taking GBH on purpose to get high?!?!? :(

man the drugs these days, now I missed the acid and LSD period, thank god, i still have a brain left, we all know the people who used too much acid and LSD and pot from those days, they are space cadets now, if they are still alive, our high school crowd mainly was underage drinking,

but I think the stuff the kids do today, are way more frightening, like crystal meth, crack, estasy, these roofies, kids taking antihistamines to get high, I'd rather they smoked pot frankly........but even the pot is like 100 times more potent than the old days......


I know iT!!! The worst thing we did in school was drink a Bartles and Jaymes wine cooler...LOL..or grape mad dog...LOL...


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:14:47 PM
Quote from: "veme"
Quote from: "DT"
One thing that is bothering me though is this: why haven't they cracked yet and told?  I wouldn't think that it would be that hard to get some teenagers to crack after interogating them in horid conditons for long periods of time.  But maybe I;m wrong.

I've wondered the same thing.


Curious, perhaps they're not "cracking" because they don't believe they're guilty if she overdosed after maybe trying a drug for the first time. It's possible- how many people here in their youth have tried an illegal substance once in your life? Some of you might not have, but some have.  Be honest and raise your hands: Pot? Coke? x? Alcohol at below the legal age?

Look at all the press this case has, and the fact at least one of them has had interaction with the mother of the missing girl. Lots of pressure and no interaction directly with an attorney, I don't think.  I'm sure they've no idea what to do, and they've compounded it all by lying the first time, if that's what happened.


Title: DEPOSITIONS
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 09:14:53 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "RB"

Didn't say they did, however I did see a post earlier where in an article (I think goon posted it) that BHT didn't want the students to be interviewed with the fear it would somehow hamper the investigation. I'll bet they have changed and even grown over time with all the publicity this case has been getting; indeed we have 2 of Natalee's best friends speaking to Greta tonight.


Any idea who they are?  Seems like everyone who has come forward (some with names of some without attribution in news articles) has said essentially the same thing about that night. It could hamper the investigation, because if they gave sensitive information to the FBI and then gave it to the public, it could cause the suspects to further change their stories based on whatever evidence might not be in their favor, I'm thinking.

I WONDER HOW ALL THIS INFORMATION FROM THE FBI INTERVIEWS IN THE US IS GOING TO BE MADE AVAILABLE IN A DUTCH COURT OF LAW.  OR ARE THEY JUST COLLECTING IT TO ASSIST THE INVESTIGATION? DEPOSITIONS?


Title: Re: MRS VDS WAS IN HOLLAND!
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:15:31 PM
Quote from: "Dallas Also"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "iquitos"
HEAR THAT?  JORAN'S MOM WAS NOT HOME WHEN NATALEE CAME CALLING!

correct Iquitos...only dad was home (if Natalee actually went there that is)


So the dad should be under arrest for impeding the investigation of a missing person.


In the end he will be arrested for at least obstruction of justice.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:15:46 PM
GHB makes you stop breathing therefore you suffocate within yourself.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 09:17:07 PM
Nikki what is the latest theory?  Been sick.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:17:20 PM
WonderWoman - will you please explain your post. What is it, where did you get it and what is your purpose in posting it?

thanks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 09:17:23 PM
I'm still not buying that Natalee OD'd. Why would they (the boys in custody) not have just said so from the beginning and say where they last saw her TRUTHFULLY. They would have been in alot less trouble, so I still believe, between the 3 , 4 or 5 diff. stories between them, that they DID do something to her. JMO


Title: response to gaijin
Post by: martin connahey on June 21, 2005, 09:17:24 PM
My Dearest Gaijin:

First off, I absolutely LOVE the tone of your thought, which I imagine to be in a deep-southern drawl for effect, "You, suh, aruh a JACKASS." Priceless.

God bless you for being honest ( and eloquent ! ). I know you don't speak for everyone "here," so we'll just chalk up the majority of your emoting to wishful grandiosity. Eloquent grandiosity though it is !

I agree with your method, however, which is at odds with many who post here: Philosophy is-- "If I don't like it, I just scroll through it."

Noble. Objective. Adult. However, it doesn't mesh with the part where you get fed up and engage in name-calling. Rest assured, gaijin, I not only can take it, I thrive on challenge, discussion, debate, and softballs which get thrown my way.

Maybe you didn't see my post about the Nigeria connection. Interesting stuff. Definitely breaking news and all that. Read all my posts to find it, tho it was recent if that helps. Solid reportage, my man, if I do say so myself!

Hey, as you know I always like to try to inject a little humor in this crazy, hectic, and dangerous world we live in. So here's one just for you gaijin:
( in fact, your post reminded me of it !!! )

If you purchase $100-worth of Natalee bracelets, and $300-worth of Where's Waldo t-shirts, how much can you deduct at tax-time? Take a few minutes. I'll wait. ( ho-dee-hum-dee-dee-dee-dum {that's me waiting} )  Okay. Your answer is?

Correct answer is::: Probably nothing, unless the companies selling them are Federally tax-exempt 501c3 charities ( my guess is they aren't, and of course the joke only works if they indeed aren't ). But if they are, then you've got yourself something! I love those Where's Waldo games, don't you? I can NEVER find Waldo until right when I'm about to quit. Go figure.

Please priv msg me sometime and we can talk more. I don't want to grab too much bandwidth ( "HERE" as you call it ) away from the always important discussions about which level of Hell JVDS should occupy.

Take care, my friend. HONESTLY, you made my day.

Your Friend,

Martin Connahey


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:17:25 PM
ok..bbl..must go watch a bit of tv...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 09:17:59 PM
Rob, I am basing my opinion on my hunch that if Natalee's mother had even the slightest whisper of a notion that *anyone* who went on the trip had any information at all that could be of value, beyond having seen her in Joran's company, and possibly the Kalpoe brothers' car, that she would be all over it like Ariel Sharon on a buffet table.

My speculation is that the family prefers that the students stay out of the media because while the two that we have seen are exceptionally poised, well-spoken, and very clear and consistent with their recollections, which they state simply and without adjectives and interjections of personal opinion and twenty twenty hindsight, it would be very unfair to expect most normal kids to be able to handle the kind of media frenzy that is going on in this case, and I suspect another reason is because the parents of all those other kids are disinclined to throw their kids to that, and there may be a little mother to mother conspiracy going on there - if there are kids who do want to go be on Fox, and mom and dad think that's not a good idea, family discord can be avoided if it is also Natalee's mother's wish that they focus their efforts on supporting each other - and the Holloway family - in other ways.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 09:18:07 PM
JVS' father should absolutely be arrested.  I think it is actually obvious that he is helping JVS to cover up.  I pray so hard that JVS and the brothers will find it in themselves to be men and take responsibility and tell BHT where her daughter is.  They have to be some of the most selfish, low-down people I've ever heard of.  CYA is all they are thinking about!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:18:23 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
WonderWoman - will you please explain your post. What is it, where did you get it and what is your purpose in posting it?

thanks


It looks to me as a first person summation of all the facts from depaks perspective up to leaving CNC's.


Title: Re: DEPOSITIONS
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:19:24 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote

I WONDER HOW ALL THIS INFORMATION FROM THE FBI INTERVIEWS IN THE US IS GOING TO BE MADE AVAILABLE IN A DUTCH COURT OF LAW.  OR ARE THEY JUST COLLECTING IT TO ASSIST THE INVESTIGATION? DEPOSITIONS?


It's probably forming the beginning of a narrative against which Aruba LE can, if they choose, juxtapose the three boys statements and see how well they match or don't match. That could indicate a lot in terms of whether the Aruba LE believe the boys are being honest in their recollection. Just guessing, here, though.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:19:36 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Nikki what is the latest theory?  Been sick.


shell..go read wonder womans post a few pages back...WTF? also, watch greta tonight!! Interview with BHT AND the vander sloots..together....LOL


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:20:00 PM
martin, you're a mess.  And I really dig it :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:20:11 PM
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention but

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:20:24 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "chloe2"
WonderWoman - will you please explain your post. What is it, where did you get it and what is your purpose in posting it?

thanks


It looks to me as a first person summation of all the facts from depaks perspective up to leaving CNC's.

I know what it 'looks' like -- but why won't WonderWoman say more about it? I'm not going to make assumptions like that - it could be someone just making up their version of a supposed confession. But the poster refuses to say anything more about it. That alone makes it suspect.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:22:01 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Ok, now you're making more sense.  WW, everyone jumped because you didn't state that you were not the one who wrote the email.  It looked as though you wrote it yourself.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:22:16 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "chloe2"
WonderWoman - will you please explain your post. What is it, where did you get it and what is your purpose in posting it?

thanks


It looks to me as a first person summation of all the facts from depaks perspective up to leaving CNC's.



I have to say, you are VERY perceptive!!!  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:22:17 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.

Okay, thanks for explaining.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: heavyheart on June 21, 2005, 09:22:21 PM
Where are our MB friends tonight?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 09:22:24 PM
GHB is super easy to slip to someone, as well as have them confuse the effects if given while already drunk......maybe SCroes was an older friend and/or part time dealer and called because of previous experience with OD situations.....also, possibly Joran and NH had hooked up a good bit before she stopped breathing and he couldnt revive her - then he freaked realizing that his DNA was in/on her as well as traces of GHB in the system...would look EXACTLY like a date rape, whether it was or not


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:22:28 PM
It's impossible to get through all these posts after being gone for the day.

What's this about Natalee going to Joran's house?  Where did this come from?  Would someone explain? Thanks!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 09:22:52 PM
Remember that those on dial up take much longer to reply.  Things move so fast for those of us with high speed connections that we take that time factor as a lack of a reply.

Wonder woman will tell us more I am sure.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:23:17 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "chloe2"
WonderWoman - will you please explain your post. What is it, where did you get it and what is your purpose in posting it?

thanks


It looks to me as a first person summation of all the facts from depaks perspective up to leaving CNC's.



I have to say, you are VERY perceptive!!!  :lol:


I have been doing this awhile.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 09:23:33 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "veme"
Quote from: "DT"
One thing that is bothering me though is this: why haven't they cracked yet and told?  I wouldn't think that it would be that hard to get some teenagers to crack after interogating them in horid conditons for long periods of time.  But maybe I;m wrong.

I've wondered the same thing.


Curious, perhaps they're not "cracking" because they don't believe they're guilty if she overdosed after maybe trying a drug for the first time. It's possible- how many people here in their youth have tried an illegal substance once in your life? Some of you might not have, but some have.  Be honest and raise your hands: Pot? Coke? x? Alcohol at below the legal age?

Look at all the press this case has, and the fact at least one of them has had interaction with the mother of the missing girl. Lots of pressure and no interaction directly with an attorney, I don't think.  I'm sure they've no idea what to do, and they've compounded it all by lying the first time, if that's what happened.



I took naproxen-in alleve/ and almost died!!!
anaphylactic shock?? first i got all over little red bumps/within an hour/ then my tounge swelled so bad...I hate doctors visits in general so i went to er when i was90% unable to swallow...if there were no hospital near i would have died for sure..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:23:42 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.



Ummm. being a super hero and all, i think you should know that if that truly is an email from Deepak, and no one has seen nor heard it yet but us, then you need to take it to the proper authorities... WTF???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:23:42 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: gaijin on June 21, 2005, 09:24:08 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away



*for what its worth......*



sorry...dont buyit...three weeks later...we've got an outside eyewitness...
...this is cr*p...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CatDr on June 21, 2005, 09:24:12 PM
WonderWoman:
If this is actually written by Deepak I think you are compelled to give it to authorities on the off chance that they have not seen it.  Do you have an actual message with a stated date and time?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:24:30 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Ok, now you're making more sense.  WW, everyone jumped because you didn't state that you were not the one who wrote the email.  It looked as though you wrote it yourself.



absolut knew.......


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:24:32 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.



Ummm. being a super hero and all, i think you should know that if that truly is an email from Deepak, and no one has seen nor heard it yet but us, then you need to take it to the proper authorities... WTF???


The authorities have it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:24:59 PM
we used to drink these crap sparkling wines like Lonesome Charlie and Baby Duck, yuk!  I almost get diabetes thinking about it

and when I turned legal, I would drink Singapore  Slings and all I needed was 3 and I was happy

then I went to university where one's alcohol tolerance is greatly increased, oops........


Title: TO ALL: ?
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 09:25:36 PM
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?

The earlier email looks like the statement he wrote for police, and somehow has gotten out into emails, or maybe someone summarizing what we've all read in papers was his statement.  I've read that she yelled out of the cars at friends.  I would think her friends could verify if she lost that money in gambling, and if J then won any of it back.  Not that any of those facts would substantiate what happened after 1 am and before the next morning at 5: am when she still hadn't shown up at the hotel.  

I wonder if her friends really did yell to her to get out of the car, or if that was his way of injecting a piece of truth into the story.  Hell, she should have gotten out of the car.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:26:05 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....
TO ALL:
I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention but

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Is there a header on the e-mail somewhere identifying it as coming from deepak?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:26:27 PM
Quote from: "absolut"


quote]

The authorities have it.


And you know that how. . . ?


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 09:26:47 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) ...*for what its worth......*


What the heck is that, WonderWoman?
Wonderwoman, do you write fan fic in your spare time?  This was eerie.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:27:02 PM
gaijin, it could be real, but it's worthless where it is, unless it came from his machine.  If it did come directly to WW, I can bet you dollars to doughnuts (Krispy Kreme, my FAVORITE) the authorities already have it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:27:07 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "absolut"


quote]

The authorities have it.


And you know that how. . . ?


Because not one thing in that email is new news.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:27:09 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.



Ummm. being a super hero and all, i think you should know that if that truly is an email from Deepak, and no one has seen nor heard it yet but us, then you need to take it to the proper authorities... WTF???



don't act as if you would know exactly what to do, I assume they have it!
and it doesn't give a whole lot of info other than what we already know.  He could have just been trying out his "story", but i dont believe that  :(


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:27:18 PM
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Remember that those on dial up take much longer to reply.  Things move so fast for those of us with high speed connections that we take that time factor as a lack of a reply.

Wonder woman will tell us more I am sure.


Yes, I live way up a mountain on one of the best fly fishing rivers in the world! BUT, high speed is not available here....in fact, the fastest dial up is 28k....so, it's next to impossible to read all these posts easily.

I'm hoping Tom and Red are working to find an easier way to read here.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:28:19 PM
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) ...*for what its worth......*


What the heck is that, WonderWoman?
Wonderwoman, do you write fan fic in your spare time?  This was eerie.


It was only eerie because it is in first person.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:28:41 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:28:42 PM
nancy, they are.  Tom posted about it here earlier today.


Title: Re: TO ALL: ?
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 09:29:12 PM
Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?


It is BS people! :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 09:29:17 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.



Ummm. being a super hero and all, i think you should know that if that truly is an email from Deepak, and no one has seen nor heard it yet but us, then you need to take it to the proper authorities... WTF???



don't act as if you would know exactly what to do, I assume they have it!
and it doesn't give a whole lot of info other than what we already know.  He could have just been trying out his "story", but i dont believe that  :(



well, baby girl, give us an original header..tell us who you got it from...we'll help you figure it out.....


Title: Re: TO ALL: ?
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:29:52 PM
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?


It is BS people! :lol:


And you can disprove it how?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 09:30:45 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote


don't act as if you would know exactly what to do, I assume they have it!
and it doesn't give a whole lot of info other than what we already know.  He could have just been trying out his "story", but i dont believe that  :(


If any of this is true, it sure sounds like someone trying out a story, or writing their version in advance of pending trouble. But since we don't know anything - like who it was sent to, when it was sent, who the author is, there's not much we can do but speculate endlessly. I guess that's the purpose?

Traffic's clearing. I gotta go. Enjoy the speculation Monkeys.

That kid was found in Utah. Wish they could find Natalee.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:31:00 PM
Quote from: "gaijin"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Scott"


Remaining questions:


HOW were NH and JVDS dancing?
Did NH go to C&C's with JVDS, or did they meet up there?
When did DK, SK and SGC go to C&C's?


The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away



*for what its worth......*



sorry...dont buyit...three weeks later...we've got an outside eyewitness...
...this is cr*p...



GIAJIN, you know, this is the problem...just because this e-mail wasn't on FOX, doesn't mean it's contents are not real!!!!  I can assure you they are, and I am CERTAIN the authorities have it. (from his computer!)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:31:03 PM
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

WW, you only need permission "ethically" if you so desire.  You have nothing to fear from a legal perspective, because any email which is not appropriately marked with a disclaimer can safely be forwarded whereever.  It's one of the chances people take by sending email:  it can realistically be sent anywhere and the sender won't know and no one had to notify them that it's been done.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:31:36 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.



Maybe if the rest of it was posted and verified to be an actual statement. How did you come across it, if you don't mind answering.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:31:51 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.



Ummm. being a super hero and all, i think you should know that if that truly is an email from Deepak, and no one has seen nor heard it yet but us, then you need to take it to the proper authorities... WTF???



don't act as if you would know exactly what to do, I assume they have it!
and it doesn't give a whole lot of info other than what we already know.  He could have just been trying out his "story", but i dont believe that  :(



well, baby girl, give us an original header..tell us who you got it from...we'll help you figure it out.....


I wouldn't tell you who I got it from, I don't even know you or you me. As for the header its already trash. She did not recieve it from Depak.


Title: WW's post
Post by: harleymom on June 21, 2005, 09:32:15 PM
Funny deepak email uses US english teen talk...
"i waited for like 10 min "... etc
or maybe "like" is used like all the time like all around the world, like ya know?


Title: Re: LEAVING ON A JET PLANE
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 09:32:17 PM
Quote from: "iquitos"
Quote from: "cancon"
I still think maybe all of the group should have been interrogated as well since we have reports of scuffles possibly over Natalee, how do we know one of the Mountainbrook boys wasn't involved somehow

again put this into perspective, if this had happened in Alabama you know each of those kids would have been intensely questioned

do we know if this was done by the FBI or Alabama law enforcement

still I think if I were the Aruban police, I would have made that group stay until I had a chance to interview everyone


WHY DO YOU THINK THE BEAT IT OUT OF DODGE EN MASSE?  THESE ARE NOT DUMB PEOPLE


Pulllease people, get real!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:32:40 PM
hmmm, where could this email come from

well either Deepak emailed this to someone before he got arrested and some "friend" has been distributing this all over the net, perhaps in order to help him?

or there is someone leaking information out of the police department in Aruba (common in NA) and someone should be getting on that.......


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:33:04 PM
Quote from: "absolut"


The authorities have it.





TY!!   8)


wish I was on a porch overlooking the river......


I would have liked to discuss certain aspects of this letter, anyone interested, or no??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:33:30 PM
WW, where did you get that email from exactly?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rob on June 21, 2005, 09:33:32 PM
hey , my friend matt just joined and wants to talk about natalee... give him a real hard time... :twisted:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:34:06 PM
WW, feel free to discuss whatever you wish. However, note that you may be hit with some speculation :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:34:28 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "absolut"


The authorities have it.





TY!!   8)


wish I was on a porch overlooking the river......


I would have liked to discuss certain aspects of this letter, anyone interested, or no??


Yes lets discuss. What new facts do you think it brings?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:35:11 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.


1. Could be a total lie -- just covering his bohunkus. Just because Deepak writes it or says it, doesn't make it true.
2. If he'd written it on his computer, I'm sure authorities have it
3. If it originated in his e-mail on another computer, the authorities would have it
4. If there's no header from him anywhere on the e-mail, would think somebody's jerking your chain.
5. he's probably already told the LE this, but the person he sent it too many now fall under suspicion


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:35:19 PM
absolut, do you find all this "where did you get it from" as funny as I do? :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 09:35:41 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "absolut"


The authorities have it.





TY!!   8)


wish I was on a porch overlooking the river......


I would have liked to discuss certain aspects of this letter, anyone interested, or no??


Yes lets discuss. What new facts do you think it brings?


I'd like to know the end of this story....where is that part??? If only...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Y'alls Psychic Detective on June 21, 2005, 09:36:42 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention but

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


My thoughts on the letter:

-For someone who worked at an Internet cafe and supposedly spent so much time online, wouldn't Deepak know how to type better than that??  Would he even type a letter in English?

-I find it hard to believe that Natalee, by all accounts a shy girl, would be so aggressive with Jaron.  Of course, a lot of the account was what Deepak was told by Jaron and we know Jaron is a liar.

-Why would the email end there before the crucial part of the night??

-What is the origin of the email??


Title: Re: TO ALL: ?
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 09:36:57 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?


It is BS people! :lol:


And you can disprove it how?



because it is not officially proof...much why this is also rumors....some people have posted hearsay as well as hopeful outcomes.
take it for what its worth !


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:37:06 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "absolut"


The authorities have it.





TY!!   8)


wish I was on a porch overlooking the river......


I would have liked to discuss certain aspects of this letter, anyone interested, or no??


Yes lets discuss. What new facts do you think it brings?


Well, to play along, it shows that Joran lied to his friend Deepak, because he's on video hanging around Nat and her friends before the last day, according to many accounts including BHT's.  So he didn't "just meet her."

Oh, wait. You said new facts. ;)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:37:13 PM
Quote from: "RB"
absolut, do you find all this "where did you get it from" as funny as I do? :)


Yeah far more important is what we learn from it. And so far unless I missed something this is what we know to be fact up to the leaving CNC which is actually validated by dash and others.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:37:34 PM
WW, would you say one way to remember your story is by writing it down?


Title: Where is this frickin email
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 09:37:38 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.


Okay I give up where is this email you all are talking about?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lainey on June 21, 2005, 09:38:39 PM
On the supposed email from Deepak.  I don't recall that his English was that good on the blogs I had read he posted on.  Smells fishy to me....


Title: Re: WW's post
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 09:39:13 PM
Quote from: "harleymom"
Funny deepak email uses US english teen talk...
"i waited for like 10 min "... etc
or maybe "like" is used like all the time like all around the world, like ya know?


I think it's bullshit.  So....where's the REST of the story???  Just to weird for reality...IMVHO.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 09:39:21 PM
Quote from: "HannieC"
Whitney wrote:

Quote
HannieC at this point, wouldn't that be a pip? (as in irony) "if it fits, you must acquit"



Just speculating :D  :wink:


Got that..no wink...it's speculation...we still haven't accounted the lies that are purported coming from the 3 amigoes...correct?

None, here,  wants to convict a Joran that is tells the truth; but what we've heard from the Aruban press, sources, etc., there have been untruths told in the course of these 3 weeks...and, since the Netherlands system rules in this matter, we speculate with what we know.

What do you think of the Van Der Stools?  I'd like to know?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 09:39:27 PM
about the writing in English. It's pretty common for young people to talk in English.

I do it with most of my friends, not all the time, but a lot of the time.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:39:29 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.



Maybe if the rest of it was posted and verified to be an actual statement. How did you come across it, if you don't mind answering.


There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.


Title: Re: TO ALL: ?
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:40:08 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?


It is BS people! :lol:


And you can disprove it how?



because it is not officially proof...much why this is also rumors....some people have posted hearsay as well as hopeful outcomes.
take it for what its worth !


Ok lets try something different. Shoot down the statements in it with what we know now 16 days later. How do pieces from that not still fit?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:41:04 PM
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

There are always 2 sides to the story, WW.  I for one would welcome a different view.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:41:27 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.



Maybe if the rest of it was posted and verified to be an actual statement. How did you come across it, if you don't mind answering.


There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.


I don't have a "stellar picture" in my head of Natalee.  I have nothing in my head other than to wonder where she is all of the time.  Maybe you shouldn't post things of that importance if you are not going to post the whole thing.  Just drumming up more drama.


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:41:31 PM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
CAT DR:


Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


If it is an email from Deepak, the headers of the email would show it and it would already have been found, either on the computer, servers, or routers in which it passed. (Yes, you can techinically forensically pull such things, isn't that fascinating?) Unfortunately, unless the email was sent directly to you from that machine, the headers will display the last person who sent it to you, WW.


Exactly!!! which is why I am in no hurry to "turn it in"  I just thought it would help a bit in the theory department.....a fresh POV.


Okay I give up where is this email you all are talking about?


I think this email is a total hoax.  I doubt Depak would write such detail on a computer.  He worked at an Internet cafe, I'm sure he was tech savvy.

I'd like to see the header and track the numbers of the header.


Title: Re: WW's post
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:41:31 PM
Quote from: "harleymom"
Funny deepak email uses US english teen talk...
"i waited for like 10 min "... etc
or maybe "like" is used like all the time like all around the world, like ya know?


exactly. and if you look at all these guys sites on the web, all the messages are in papiamento. wouldn't this also have been in pap?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 09:41:36 PM
I DO NOT HAVE ACCESS TO THAT INFORMATION. . .

How many different spokesmen/spokeswomen is the Aruban government goint to trot forwad to the microphone to assure that "everything that needs to be done IS being done?"

Have you noticed that it's a different one, every night.

I'm wondering whether they've even pulled Reuben Trappenberg off the case, becase he's appeared twice.

And, when they are asked a difficult question, their answer is always the same.

I DO NOT HAVE ACESS TO THAT INFORMATION. . .

Well, gosh folks, I'm just a hillbilly, but it occurs to me to ask, "How do know that ever'thang is being done, when you don't know sh*t?"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:41:38 PM
well kids keep on keeping on I'm going to watch Greta now!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 09:41:55 PM
lainey wrote:

Quote
On the supposed email from Deepak. I don't recall that his English was that good on the blogs I had read he posted on. Smells fishy to me....



Yes an we all know how 'good'  the translation links work  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 09:42:37 PM
Quote from: "RB"
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

There are always 2 sides to the story, WW.  I for one would welcome a different view.


Post the rest....I think it would be interesting.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:42:51 PM
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:43:42 PM
Quote from: "RB"
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

There are always 2 sides to the story, WW.  I for one would welcome a different view.


I agree, and seeing as how he's being held for suspicion of murder right now, it would stand to reason his account would be less than flattering and, perhaps less than honest. So people would read into it whatever they wanted, I guess.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 09:44:07 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "CatDr"
Yes, WonderWoman.  Have you relayed this story to the authorities?



I believe they would have it if they took his computer, no doubt.

dated 6/5/2005   :?


WHATEVER IT RINGS TRUE DOWN TO THE SLIGHT ERRORS IN GRAMMAR OF A NON NATIVE SPEAKER.  I LIKE IT.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 09:44:11 PM
Does it really matter what happened up to the point they left C&C? Not in my humble opinion.  We have tons of witnesses to what happened before they left. The puzzle is what they're not telling about after they left.

This piece of email, with no header information alludes to NH being the force behind going along with them, which could be interpreted to the writer's belief that she was the sexual aggressor in whatever happened after 1:00 am when they left the bar.

Personally, I wouldn't care if she was, not that it would seem to be in her character, but so what?  The writer still leaves a gaping hole as to what happened after leaving the bar.  So why bother writing the email.  Except perhaps to divert blame to the girl.  I'd call him a pig faced liar and a coward just for that.  In fact I have a few choice words for him.  YBCS..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:44:14 PM
nancy, if you think the header is going to give you anything, you are dead wrong. Take my word for it - I'm in a much better position than you to know.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:44:21 PM
Quote from: "RB"
WW, would you say one way to remember your story is by writing it down?



Yes, I would  :P


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:44:38 PM
oh just one point before I go, if this email were true, it did prove that her friends tried to get her out of that car.......at least once, which makes more sense to me.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:45:33 PM
me bad, one last point

you could also say a good way to memorize your alibi is to write it down


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:45:35 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "RB"
WW, would you say one way to remember your story is by writing it down?



Yes, I would  :P


I'm getting good at this, aren't I?  Absolut must be rubbing off on me...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 09:45:37 PM
Quote
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Quote
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

I don't know if this is some kind of joke or a game but I for one do not intend to "play".  If it's not a joke and you suspect it is actually written by Deepak, then the right thing to do is turn give it to LE ( even though they may already have it). IMO


Title: Re: WW's post
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:45:38 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "harleymom"
Funny deepak email uses US english teen talk...
"i waited for like 10 min "... etc
or maybe "like" is used like all the time like all around the world, like ya know?


I think it's bullshit.  So....where's the REST of the story???  Just to weird for reality...IMVHO.



Your pic scares the shi** out of me, for the record!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 09:46:56 PM
Quote from: "Whitney"
Whitney wrote:[/b]
Quote


What do you think of the Van Der Stools?  I'd like to know?


I feel very sorry for Mama VDS because I know how it feels when your child is accused of something.  (My son stole a gun from my b/f and sold it for drugs).  It is a horrible sick feeling and I can only imagine how sick she must be feeling with her son being looked at for murder/kidnap/rape.  You want your child to be innocent, but you know that if they have committed a crime, they have to pay for it and it just breaks your heart.

As for Papa, I'm suspicious just because of his background.  If its his job to defend criminals (seems like his position has not really been clarified), hell yes he's going to do what he can to protect his own son.  Human nature, yes...but slimy just the same.

Baby VDS...hmmm, well, he's guilty as hell of something.

That's how I feel about the VDS clan, anyway.


Title: Re: response to gaijin
Post by: gaijin on June 21, 2005, 09:47:09 PM
Quote from: "martin connahey"
My Dearest Gaijin:

aah, and here I was afraid that I misjudged the ego and that you were going to ignore me...sorry I cant respond to all you grandious pontifications...but I scrolled through it. Had to laugh though that you sent two sceens to respond to two lines....but iwhat else do you have to do? And it aint the south. Its Queens. And you can beleive me,  if you were here, I'd already have my foot on your throat.
Out.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:47:14 PM
So how exactly did you get ahold of this email? or has this been already covered?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 09:48:07 PM
People. Y'all know where we learn our English from?

Movies and cable tv from..... The U.S. So, I'm not saying that it is his letter, but American slang is NOT a way to go about proving that it isn't his letter.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: cancon on June 21, 2005, 09:48:21 PM
ok last post for real you know what they say

the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:48:21 PM
Quote from: "DT"
So how exactly did you get ahold of this email? or has this been already covered?


It's been covered but she won't respond to the question.


Title: Re: WW's post
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 09:48:35 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "harleymom"
Funny deepak email uses US english teen talk...
"i waited for like 10 min "... etc
or maybe "like" is used like all the time like all around the world, like ya know?


I think it's bullshit.  So....where's the REST of the story???  Just to weird for reality...IMVHO.



Your pic scares the shi** out of me, for the record!!


My pic scares the hell out of you??  Oh, that's nice...thanx...you are so thoughtful.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KackyLacky on June 21, 2005, 09:48:43 PM
didn't Natalee and joran know each other before that night according to her friends?

and if this email is to be believed, then what happened after the cars leave each other?  Very convienent that is the end of the email


Title: Re: TO ALL: ?
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 09:48:46 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Dublin"
Quote
TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days,


Who are "All"?

What is "This"?

Why should I think this is by Deepak?

Why should I  think this isn't BS?


It is BS people! :lol:


And you can disprove it how?



Honey Child, we didn't just fall off the turnip truck!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:48:51 PM
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?


Dad was in Aruba...the mother was in Holland.


How could the mother have been in Holland when she was a teacher at the school and classes hadn't ended yet? There was a teachers' inschool day on Friday -- the day after Joran was arrested.

But I thought I'd heard the father flew in from Holland. but could be a RUMOR.

Anyway, I'm far behind because my phone lines got zapped by lightning a day and a half ago.

I'm with NancyDrew, what's this about Natalee going to Joran's house?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 09:49:12 PM
Surely the meny would be too smart to sent emails like that to each other--that date is while they still were implicating the guards.

Could have been sent to Steve.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:49:23 PM
Quote from: "cancon"
oh just one point before I go, if this email were true, it did prove that her friends tried to get her out of that car.......at least once, which makes more sense to me.....


Sometimes its not the shell, its the pearl no matter how small.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:49:31 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "DT"
So how exactly did you get ahold of this email? or has this been already covered?


It's been covered but she won't respond to the question.


oh thats convenient.  Why would deepak even right a story like this?


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 09:49:50 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"


I'd like to see the header and track the numbers of the header.




I am sure you would...Nancy drew


give me a sec and I will share the rest, I feel now that you all are being fairly open to the idea of his POV....just a minute and I will copy.


My intent is to go over certain statements in it, okay....


Title: Say what?
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 09:50:05 PM
Quote from: "lainey"
On the supposed email from Deepak.  I don't recall that his English was that good on the blogs I had read he posted on.  Smells fishy to me....


Your saying his blog English is worse?, and this email grammer is better..ughh.. I d expected a student from Colegio Arubano to write better then that email I just read.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:50:16 PM
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 09:50:27 PM
Wonder will you pm me the rest of the email?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:50:37 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
People. Y'all know where we learn our English from?

Movies and cable tv from..... The U.S. So, I'm not saying that it is his letter, but American slang is NOT a way to go about proving that it isn't his letter.


Arubagirl!
You're a southern babe now! Y'all!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:50:50 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "RB"
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

There are always 2 sides to the story, WW.  I for one would welcome a different view.


I agree, and seeing as how he's being held for suspicion of murder right now, it would stand to reason his account would be less than flattering and, perhaps less than honest. So people would read into it whatever they wanted, I guess.


Very True!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: pybird on June 21, 2005, 09:51:16 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "cancon"
I'll bet Geraldo is just turning green with envy, Greta has outscooped him again............

I like the fact that Greta takes you around the island so you can get a feel for the situation.........but that girl needs a fashion stylist, I cannot imagine wearing those preppy button down shirts in Aruba in June, HOT HOT HOT


She wears them here in DC in August with 100% humidity.


Not defending Geraldo here...can't stand the man.  Don't forget his new young wife is due to deliver his baby in @ 2 weeks.

Not sure this is related, but very possible.

Here's a wild theory. What if Geraldo was right? What if he were right when he said, "I have it from an impeccable source, an impeccable source. . ." And what if he was run off the island because his sources dried up? And what if Greta was brought in because she had better courtroom skills? You know how that works, you work hard to establish your credentials and to establish rapport, before asking the hard questions. And what if Greta has access to that same "impeccable source."
It will be something to see this bulldog get the marrow out of the bone.


impeccable source or unimpeachable source? and what did Geraldo know?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:51:18 PM
oh thats convenient. Why would deepak even right a story like this?

DT, to remember it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:51:43 PM
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


I sure as heck would!  With all due respect there is a MISSING GIRL out there and ANY information HELPS!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 09:51:52 PM
Compananzi, I can assure you that my English (good or bad) wasn't the result of being a Colegio student. Besides, there are U.S. teens who also write like that, and English is their first language!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 09:51:57 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
People. Y'all know where we learn our English from?

Movies and cable tv from..... The U.S. So, I'm not saying that it is his letter, but American slang is NOT a way to go about proving that it isn't his letter.


Arubagirl!
You're a southern babe now! Y'all!


We have been in intense training with her.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:51:57 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Wonder will you pm me the rest of the email?


Yes I would like to see it as well.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 09:52:01 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "DT"
So how exactly did you get ahold of this email? or has this been already covered?


It's been covered but she won't respond to the question.


oh thats convenient.  Why would deepak even right a story like this?


Only if wanted to cover his behind


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:52:25 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


TO ALL:

I just received this had it for a few days, and not quite sure what to do, so I was hoping "we" could pick it apart....I had originally thought to bring to someone's attention by

a) Whose? and wouldn't they have it(confiscated computer)
b) It was not written to me. ( so I feel I need owners permission?)

Yet, now I feel like HERE!!! Take it, anything that could POSSIBLY Help!!

so, I am letting you all in on it, and maybe we can, as an intelligent group, figure out what to do with it.


Quote
There are some quotes that I fear friends of Natalee's will not like, so I didn't want to post it all......you have all gotten so upset when things arent said that meet the stellar picture that you have of Natalee in your head, then again, it is Deepaks perspective, so it was the way he "saw" it.

I don't know if this is some kind of joke or a game but I for one do not intend to "play".  If it's not a joke and you suspect it is actually written by Deepak, then the right thing to do is turn give it to LE ( even though they may already have it). IMO


This is a great little forum.  However, in recent days there are so many "drive by" posters and total crap being written it really is hard for serious case watchers to discuss the case.

I'm hoping it changes...I very much enjoy the personalities and differences on this thread everyday. But, it might be getting too bogged down in muck to spend time here.

We might consider starting a new thread for serious case watchers to discuss the case.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: roxyluv on June 21, 2005, 09:52:41 PM
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


I read they were wild and loud and that they weren't the best behaved group. I read that in the Aruba Bulletin board when this first started.
But truth be told it doesn't matter if these kids and natalee were out of control, she is still missing and who ever did needs to pay.


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:52:55 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"


I'd like to see the header and track the numbers of the header.

I am sure you would...Nancy drew
give me a sec and I will share the rest, I feel now that you all are being fairly open to the idea of his POV....just a minute and I will copy.
My intent is to go over certain statements in it, okay....


Definitely okeeydokey. We're hanging on your every keystroke.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:53:06 PM
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


 Wonder if WW or whomever sent that email can get in trouble for both withholding it and publicly divulging it, if it really is an approximation of whatever statement he gave LE?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 09:53:21 PM
Wonder...could you PM me that entire email?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: littletxlady on June 21, 2005, 09:53:23 PM
ELIO  NICOLAAS!!!! He's on the ball!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:53:53 PM
Quote from: "RB"
oh thats convenient. Why would deepak even right a story like this?

DT, to remember it.


Possible, but it seems far fetched.  I don't think I've ever wrote a story down so I could remember it, especially when it only involves me indirectly.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 09:54:04 PM
My theory has her going to Joran's house, only a theory, but based on the DNA search for evidence at their house.

The police did a massive search of the house, and they wore the white garb associated with a DNA evidence search.  That was prompted by some evidence which led them to believe she'd been at the house.  They have since begun extended interrogations of the father. My theory is that the evidence from the DNA search is in, and shows she was in the house, which would mean papa slut was aware she was there at some point in the evening. This is then leading to the 5 hour then 3 hour interrogations of papa slut...

So, let's saysomething happened to her at the house; say she fell into the pool and hit her head, but papa is waiting for his judgship to come through, and decides he doesn't want a dead American in his backyard, so tells the kid to get rid of the body.... theory only


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 09:54:22 PM
The "Y'all" is thanks to my best friend who studied in TX. She got her friends stuck with it and when I said it the first time in front of my mom, she was like, WTF?

(See, I used 'like'. Our English, for better or worse, does imitate movies / tv)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:54:33 PM
Quote from: "roxyluv"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


I read they were wild and loud and that they weren't the best behaved group. I read that in the Aruba Bulletin board when this first started.
But truth be told it doesn't matter if these kids and natalee were out of control, she is still missing and who ever did needs to pay.


Roxy,

Americans are loud. sad, but true. we're just so... so... enthusiastic. Like a saint bernard.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:54:41 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "DT"
So how exactly did you get ahold of this email? or has this been already covered?


It's been covered but she won't respond to the question.


oh thats convenient.  Why would deepak even right a story like this?


They did everything online. Even at 2 am.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 09:54:46 PM
Quote from: "roxyluv"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


I read they were wild and loud and that they weren't the best behaved group. I read that in the Aruba Bulletin board when this first started.
But truth be told it doesn't matter if these kids and natalee were out of control, she is still missing and who ever did needs to pay.


Ding!  We have a winner!!!!  exactly


Title: Facts sux
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 09:54:53 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?


Dad was in Aruba...the mother was in Holland.


How could the mother have been in Holland when she was a teacher at the school and classes hadn't ended yet? There was a teachers' inschool day on Friday -- the day after Joran was arrested.

But I thought I'd heard the father flew in from Holland. but could be a RUMOR.

Anyway, I'm far behind because my phone lines got zapped by lightning a day and a half ago.

I'm with NancyDrew, what's this about Natalee going to Joran's house?



I read earlier news and posting that it was PVDS and his younger son came from Holland that Sunday.  Can you imagine you just step off the plane earlier and 7 hours later, all hell breaks loose?  Anyway so now its Anita that came from Holland...Someone throw me a bone, these stories changes so often.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: reese on June 21, 2005, 09:55:47 PM
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


maybe he was trying to tell someone how he was involed with all of this ( lieing or not) and the reason the e-mail was not finished is because he was interrupted by his arrest.


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 09:55:52 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"


I'd like to see the header and track the numbers of the header.

I am sure you would...Nancy drew
give me a sec and I will share the rest, I feel now that you all are being fairly open to the idea of his POV....just a minute and I will copy.
My intent is to go over certain statements in it, okay....


Definitely okeeydokey. We're hanging on your every keystroke.


I would be interested in seeing the rest too, but I guess I'll keep my mutha f*%$ing thoughts about it to myself to avoid person attacks from WW.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:55:54 PM
If you don't believe it, then skip the post WW makes.  I personally think it's interesting and would like to see the remainder.


Title: A plea....
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 09:56:07 PM
We don't have cable tv, so can someone PLEASE PLEASE PRETTY PLEASE post whenever they can during the Greta show??????

I wanna know what is said....PLEASSSSSSSSSEEEEE

Thanks!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:56:19 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


I sure as heck would!  With all due respect there is a MISSING GIRL out there and ANY information HELPS!


On this board?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 09:56:33 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "absolut"


The authorities have it.


Y!!   8)

would have liked to discuss certain aspects of this letter, anyone interested, or no??


Wonder:

Assuming that this is actually from Depak.  I don't understand how he has, word for word, Natalee and Joran's conversation and actions from the Holiday Inn, considering that he said he was not there.   It seems unusual for a teenage boy to be relaying entire conversations about their interactions with another teenage girl that was seemingly innocent.  Parts of the story make sense, but how on earth would DK exactly how much $$ Natalee lost in the casino, etc.  

This only makes sense to me if this is the story that they (DK and VDS) concocted together to make it seem like it was all innocent and that he had all of the facts, if that makes sense.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 09:56:36 PM
Where the story came from is not really important. I think probably between the kids on the trip and the suspects all the details in the e-mail (as now posted) are known and can/have been verified.

What's lacking is (as Paul Harvey would say) "the rest of the story".

Made for a good read after dinner I will say, WW!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 09:56:53 PM
Quote from: "RB"
If you don't believe it, then skip the post WW makes.  I personally think it's interesting and would like to see the remainder.


I'm not sure if I believe it, but I would like to see the rest.


Title: Re: A plea....
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:57:07 PM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
We don't have cable tv, so can someone PLEASE PLEASE PRETTY PLEASE post whenever they can during the Greta show??????

I wanna know what is said....PLEASSSSSSSSSEEEEE

Thanks!


Sure, whodunit.  You want a PM at commercials?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:57:15 PM
Quote from: "Dublin"
My theory has her going to Joran's house, only a theory, but based on the DNA search for evidence at their house.

The police did a massive search of the house, and they wore the white garb associated with a DNA evidence search.  That was prompted by some evidence which led them to believe she'd been at the house.  They have since begun extended interrogations of the father. My theory is that the evidence from the DNA search is in, and shows she was in the house, which would mean papa slut was aware she was there at some point in the evening. This is then leading to the 5 hour then 3 hour interrogations of papa slut...

So, let's saysomething happened to her at the house; say she fell into the pool and hit her head, but papa is waiting for his judgship to come through, and decides he doesn't want a dead American in his backyard, so tells the kid to get rid of the body.... theory only


So this is your speculation then. Got it.
Well, I mean just the fact that Joran was with her, they'd be looking for forensic evidence, maybe spray a little luminol to see if blood comes up on any of his clothes. You know the drill.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 09:57:16 PM
Quote from: "reese"
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


maybe he was trying to tell someone how he was involed with all of this ( lieing or not) and the reason the e-mail was not finished is because he was interrupted by his arrest.


Okay, don't take this the wrong way...but Ww said it was dated 6/5. He was arrested on 6/9.  That's a heckuva long time to be working on an email!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 09:57:20 PM
Quote from: "roxyluv"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


I read they were wild and loud and that they weren't the best behaved group. I read that in the Aruba Bulletin board when this first started.
But truth be told it doesn't matter if these kids and natalee were out of control, she is still missing and who ever did needs to pay.


There are NO facts to support a different view of Natalee!!!  Not one fact has been presented to call Natalee's character into question. I'd be the first one to take another look at her if I had even a smidgeon of fact to support it.  Right now, Natalee is not the bad girl here.  The last three to be with her lied through their teeth about their night with her.  It appears some/all of them are still lying.

There is absolutely NO reason to question Natalee, her family or friends given the circumstances and lies surrounding her disappearance.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 09:57:32 PM
Quote from: "RB"
If you don't believe it, then skip the post WW makes.  I personally think it's interesting and would like to see the remainder.


I'm in total agreement.  What happened to if you don't believe it then ignore it?????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 09:57:45 PM
Ruben Trapenberg just came on again. He was interviewed by Alan Coombs. And guess what he said, when he was asked a difficult question"

Pause.

Can you guess?

[Buzzer sounds.]

Time is up.

I'm sorry. The answer was "WE DON'T GET THOSE DETAILS OF THE CASE."


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 09:58:46 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "roxyluv"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, I can see why she wouldn't want to - we have people who basically swing a bat when any other view than Natalee was perfect (which in effect makes her more than human, I suppose) is presented.


I read they were wild and loud and that they weren't the best behaved group. I read that in the Aruba Bulletin board when this first started.
But truth be told it doesn't matter if these kids and natalee were out of control, she is still missing and who ever did needs to pay.


Ding!  We have a winner!!!!  exactly

Doesn't mean all were loud and obnoxious. If she was I am sure the bartenders and waitresses would ove to say so!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 09:58:51 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Where the story came from is not really important. I think probably between the kids on the trip and the suspects all the details in the e-mail (as now posted) are known and can/have been verified.

What's lacking is (as Paul Harvey would say) "the rest of the story".

Made for a good read after dinner I will say, WW!


How do you upload pics on here, I have one downloaded.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 09:58:58 PM
nancy, you're entitled to your view.  The rest of us are entitled to the possibilities.


Title: Dear RB,
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 09:59:16 PM
What's a PM?  Afraid to say I want one til I know what it is LOL.  I THINK I do....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: roxyluv on June 21, 2005, 09:59:17 PM
Quote from: "writenow"


Americans are loud. sad, but true. we're just so... so... enthusiastic. Like a saint bernard.



I was thinking more like a pittbull. J/K  :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 09:59:24 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
There are NO facts to support a different view of Natalee!!!  Not one fact has been presented to call Natalee's character into question. I'd be the first one to take another look at her if I had even a smidgeon of fact to support it.  Right now, Natalee is not the bad girl here.  The last three to be with her lied through their teeth about their night with her.  It appears some/all of them are still lying.

There is absolutely NO reason to question Natalee, her family or friends given the circumstances and lies surrounding her disappearance.


Agreed. And the three amigos have allegedly changed their story a few times. Umm... how about THIS one, ossifer?


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 09:59:34 PM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "heavyheart"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
So IF the dad was in Holland, he couldn't have been at McD at 3 am, huh?


Dad was in Aruba...the mother was in Holland.


How could the mother have been in Holland when she was a teacher at the school and classes hadn't ended yet? There was a teachers' inschool day on Friday -- the day after Joran was arrested.

But I thought I'd heard the father flew in from Holland. but could be a RUMOR.

Anyway, I'm far behind because my phone lines got zapped by lightning a day and a half ago.

I'm with NancyDrew, what's this about Natalee going to Joran's house?



I read earlier news and posting that it was PVDS and his younger son came from Holland that Sunday.  Can you imagine you just step off the plane earlier and 7 hours later, all hell breaks loose?  Anyway so now its Anita that came from Holland...Someone throw me a bone, these stories changes so often.


So Saturday night no VDS parents in Aruba.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 09:59:37 PM
For God's sake. We have thousands of drunk, rowdy tourists here. You really think that even IF and that's a big IF she was in this state, anybody would stop caring less? It does in no way justify something bad happening to her.

Drunk / Sober, the fact that is, that she disappeared into thin air.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 09:59:40 PM
Here comes Greta!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Is there anyway we can see the rest of the email?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 10:00:01 PM
luminol on his clothes??? He has his own apartment... they're searching his bedroom...


Title: Re: Dear RB,
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:00:26 PM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
What's a PM?  Afraid to say I want one til I know what it is LOL.  I THINK I do....


Private message...scroll to the top where it says FAQ, Search, Memberlist, etc.  Right below it is the "You have no new messages" or you have 1 message, etc.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:00:47 PM
Quote from: "RB"
nancy, you're entitled to your view.  The rest of us are entitled to the possibilities.


With the caveat that this could be nothing more than a feverdream created by some random emailing kid, American or Aruban, with too much time on his or her hands --- like really bad chain email.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:00:59 PM
The father seems polite on there.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:01:02 PM
Quote from: "RB"
nancy, you're entitled to your view.  The rest of us are entitled to the possibilities.


No one is saying that you are not.  We just disagree with you given our current info in this case.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 10:01:09 PM
When is Greta on?

I only can recieve Larry King and he talked about The Royals of england
pfff. :roll:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:01:44 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Wonder will you pm me the rest of the email?


Yes I would like to see it as well.



I really want to see this Greta expo, I will brb....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:01:46 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "RB"
nancy, you're entitled to your view.  The rest of us are entitled to the possibilities.


No one is saying that you are not.  We just disagree with you given our current info in this case.


Then we agree to disagree.


Title: RB, YES yesyesyes and TY!
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 10:01:46 PM
Thanks SOOOOOOOOOOOO much......I would be so happy!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:02:43 PM
Her mom looks like she seen a ghost after leaving the house.  I think it was nice of them.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:02:50 PM
anyone watching FOX? I have to say that's kinda uncomfortable watching Beth Holloway standing outside the VDS gate yelling "HELLO, IS THERE ANYONE HOME??" repeatedly.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 10:02:55 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
The father seems polite on there.


Yes, he does.  He also looks very distressed. :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:03:06 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "RB"
nancy, you're entitled to your view.  The rest of us are entitled to the possibilities.


No one is saying that you are not.  We just disagree with you given our current info in this case.


Then we agree to disagree.


Certainly, and don't I am not open to any possibility.


Title: Re: WW's post
Post by: JNC on June 21, 2005, 10:03:25 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Your pic scares the shi** out of me, for the record!!


I love the smell of TROLL in the morning...

The whole email wreaks of TROLL and I deeply regret that we have wasted so many keystrokes entertaining this crap.  HTH.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:03:31 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
For God's sake. We have thousands of drunk, rowdy tourists here. You really think that even IF and that's a big IF she was in this state, anybody would stop caring less? It does in no way justify something bad happening to her.

Drunk / Sober, the fact that is, that she disappeared into thin air.


Yes, it's time to BE REAL!!  Any room filled with 140 teenagers or even half that amount is loud and obnoxious!


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:03:39 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"


I'd like to see the header and track the numbers of the header.

I am sure you would...Nancy drew
give me a sec and I will share the rest, I feel now that you all are being fairly open to the idea of his POV....just a minute and I will copy.
My intent is to go over certain statements in it, okay....


Definitely okeeydokey. We're hanging on your every keystroke.


I would be interested in seeing the rest too, but I guess I'll keep my mutha f*%$ing thoughts about it to myself to avoid person attacks from WW.


I am not sure WW thought it was a personal attack. On my screen your pic is a person with a mysterious blue light behind you. Almost glowing or aura like.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:04:06 PM
Greta know something she better tell us!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:04:06 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


I sure as heck would!  With all due respect there is a MISSING GIRL out there and ANY information HELPS!


On this board?


Hey, absolut!
Arubagirl and Nativelingo and americaninaruba all give good info. As do the mnt. brook folks.

It's just the rest of us that have no clue what we're saying.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: veme on June 21, 2005, 10:04:22 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"


There are NO facts to support a different view of Natalee!!!  


I don't know NH so I don't  have any view of her.
I would find the rest of the WW post interesting.
Sounds so far like something a 14 yearold teenage girl  would write, not a young man. IMHO  :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:04:45 PM
Shell....you go to your profile and scroll to the bottom to the avatar section


Title: Yeah from an country
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 10:04:52 PM
and add unlimited amounts of booze and what do you have?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 10:05:09 PM
Why is everyone so "Troll" happy?  Discussions get heated and especially about a topic like this.  Let's try not to attack each other personally.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 10:05:33 PM
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
didn't Natalee and joran know each other before that night according to her friends?

and if this email is to be believed, then what happened after the cars leave each other?  Very convienent that is the end of the email



Hi everybody
Help I'm lost.  I had to go to a dinner meeting.  I can see that there has been speculation about NH being at the VDS.  I know that someone else has probably come up with this but its what about forensics from the search.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:06:19 PM
5/29 Joran calls dad to be picked up at McDonalds at 11pm
Then Joran sneaks out of house sometime after midnight and went to Carlos and Charlies
Father had no knowledge

Mother in Holland


Title: The timeline..?
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 10:06:34 PM
Can someone tell me these area of attractions in Aruba. I am trying to figure out a time line here...Please feel free to fill in any time gaps.

8am-10am          Breakfast?

11-3pm?.            Happy Hour Snorkel Sail with depalm Tours

5-9pm ?              Soul Beach Festival.

10pm - 1.30am?  Carlos and Charlies


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:06:53 PM
Kerin,

Stop staring at me. You're freaking me out.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:07:17 PM
Goooo Greta gooooooo!!!!!!!!!!  So he snuck out.  I use to do that all the time.  My parents never knew.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DAG on June 21, 2005, 10:07:24 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
didn't Natalee and joran know each other before that night according to her friends?

and if this email is to be believed, then what happened after the cars leave each other?  Very convienent that is the end of the email



Hi everybody
Help I'm lost.  I had to go to a dinner meeting.  I can see that there has been speculation about NH being at the VDS.  I know that someone else has probably come up with this but its what about forensics from the search.


Hi all, I'm lost also.  What is this e-mail and do I want a copy???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:07:30 PM
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
The father seems polite on there.


Yes, he does.  He also looks very distressed. :shock:


I agree.  I keep going back to the description someone gave here recently of the "dutch" personality.  It could be thought of as errogance.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:08:03 PM
Watching Greta

Who are these guys on with her. Very weird.

5 minutes of weird


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:08:09 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Kerin,

Stop staring at me. You're freaking me out.


sorry but I thought you needed to be watched  :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:08:21 PM
We all want this letter. Hint, hint.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:08:51 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
5/29 Joran calls dad to be picked up at McDonalds at 11pm
Then Joran sneaks out of house sometime after midnight and went to Carlos and Charlies
Father had no knowledge

Mother in Holland


Kerin,
Seriously. Why would a teacher leave the country before the school year was up, before exams, before her in-service day? You're a teacher. Would you leave school before it ended for the year? Doesn't make sense. I think she was still in Aruba.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:09:09 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
We all want this letter. Hint, hint.


She may be writing the rest of it...................that was mean just kidding.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:09:22 PM
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
Watching Greta

Who are these guys on with her. Very weird.

5 minutes of weird


what did you think of them being at the gate and yelling, Tom?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 10:09:50 PM
Beth looks crushed when she leaves the house.

Plus a different look on the Aruba interview supposedly made after that visit.

I am no sure she still thinks Natalee is alive.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:09:55 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
5/29 Joran calls dad to be picked up at McDonalds at 11pm
Then Joran sneaks out of house sometime after midnight and went to Carlos and Charlies
Father had no knowledge

Mother in Holland


Kerin,
Seriously. Why would a teacher leave the country before the school year was up, before exams, before her in-service day? You're a teacher. Would you leave school before it ended for the year? Doesn't make sense. I think she was still in Aruba.


I believe the parents.  If she was lying she would have already been in questioned.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:09:56 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Tila_Bean"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
The father seems polite on there.


Yes, he does.  He also looks very distressed. :shock:


I agree.  I keep going back to the description someone gave here recently of the "dutch" personality.  It could be thought of as errogance.


I was me - I worked with the Dutch for 3 years.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:10:10 PM
Okay...hope this isn't already old....Greta says that Papa VDS says he picked up Joran at MD's at 11 and Joran was to go to bed since it was a school night.  Joran snuck out and Papa doesn't know when he came home and didn't know he had snuck out until later.

Ok... so how did Joran get home?

Oh...hearing now that he's only a civil servant...not even a lawyer.


Title: Re: The timeline..?
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:10:24 PM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Can someone tell me these area of attractions in Aruba. I am trying to figure out a time line here...Please feel free to fill in any time gaps.

8am-10am          Breakfast?

11-3pm?.            Happy Hour Snorkel Sail with depalm Tours

5-9pm ?              Soul Beach Festival.

10pm - 1.30am?  Carlos and Charlies


When did she pack?


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:10:31 PM
Quote from: "da wench"


I would be interested in seeing the rest too, but I guess I'll keep my mutha f*%$ing thoughts about it to myself to avoid person attacks from WW.



I am so sorry, i just meant that blue light shining on your face....a little freaky...not your actual face!!  ~whew~


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:10:42 PM
They were yelling Tom???

Okay, time to go back into the Relocation program.

Sam


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 10:11:12 PM
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:11:22 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "da wench"


I would be interested in seeing the rest too, but I guess I'll keep my mutha f*%$ing thoughts about it to myself to avoid person attacks from WW.



I am so sorry, i just meant that blue light shining on your face....a little freaky...not your actual face!!  ~whew~


Can we see the rest?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:11:25 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
5/29 Joran calls dad to be picked up at McDonalds at 11pm
Then Joran sneaks out of house sometime after midnight and went to Carlos and Charlies
Father had no knowledge

Mother in Holland


Kerin,
Seriously. Why would a teacher leave the country before the school year was up, before exams, before her in-service day? You're a teacher. Would you leave school before it ended for the year? Doesn't make sense. I think she was still in Aruba.


No actually those are some of the most important days of the school year. Finals, grades to be finalized. I would probably lose my job if I didn't go in.  :D But we don't know WHY she wasn't there (if true). Was there an emergency in Holland? A death? Need to know!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:11:27 PM
Thank you Da Wench

Thank you thank you thank you.

Not a BLOODY judge.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:11:35 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "RB"
asdf, WW shouldn't answer that on this board.  I wouldn't.


I sure as heck would!  With all due respect there is a MISSING GIRL out there and ANY information HELPS!


On this board?


Hey, absolut!
Arubagirl and Nativelingo and americaninaruba all give good info. As do the mnt. brook folks.

It's just the rest of us that have no clue what we're saying.


I think the only person we know on here by name is Dash. (withholding real name)


Title: The e-mail
Post by: goon squad on June 21, 2005, 10:11:35 PM
Overall I think the story is largely BS, assuming he wrote it.  (Keep in mind that I've chosen a side in this situation).  Too easy to concoct something five days afterwards.  

Also, there's essentially the same time gap here, even with the story as told.

Potentially, the story builds up an "accident" scenario, with details of NH's extreme inebriation.

But there's one factual issue that's jumping out at me.  I recall that it was asserted that NH went snorkeling at some point in the day, then was at the Soul Beach Music Festival on 5/29, an event which ran from 7:00 - 11:00 PM.  An official statement from C&C's indicates that a "group of 40 Americans" arrived at the restaurant at 11:30 PM (http://carlosncharliesaruba.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=2&sid=25c2a13dde895fa701cb821d1f6dc8e2), which fits in neatly with the end time of the concert.  Meanwhile, you've got Joran playing a Texas Hold 'Em Tournament AND subsequently playing blackjack at a casino on Sunday night, at which point he meets up with an already slightly inebriated NH, which suggests that she had been there for a while (she also supposedly lost $360 playing, although that could be an aggregate for the trip).

To sum up - nail down the time the poker tournament (independently verifiable) occurred, and tack on the alleged subsequent blackjack playing (which had to have ended before 10 PM).  Then, try to nail down NH's departure time for the concert, and time spent there.  If you've got "blackjack time" occurring at a time when NH is at the concert, then the story is busted - either Deepak is part of the conspiracy to lie, or he is an unwitting repeater of Joran's lie.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:12:12 PM
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
They were yelling Tom???

Okay, time to go back into the Relocation program.

Sam


TOM!!! There was a comma there, sweetie!!!!!  :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: serenity2000 on June 21, 2005, 10:12:43 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
We all want this letter. Hint, hint.


She may be writing the rest of it...................that was mean just kidding.


:lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:12:47 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
We all want this letter. Hint, hint.


She posted she was going to watch some of greta.


Title: Re: Where is this frickin email
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:12:47 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "da wench"


I would be interested in seeing the rest too, but I guess I'll keep my mutha f*%$ing thoughts about it to myself to avoid person attacks from WW.



I am so sorry, i just meant that blue light shining on your face....a little freaky...not your actual face!!  ~whew~


Oh...ok...apology accepted  :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:12:49 PM
Absolut, how would my name convince you that I'm from Aruba. Not like it's 'Croes'. :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:12:53 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
The father seems polite on there.


He wants to look softer than what he is protrayed. Greta said he kept wringing his hands at the meeting. His wife was tearful and feels he is innocent. Father didn't say that according to Greta on OReilly. If they were innocent, there stories would match and not keep changing.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:12:55 PM
Thanks to wireless laptop and internet I'm sitting in front of my TV posting...when I saw the video of BHT calling in front of  JVDS house....I felt a chill....anybody else?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:12:55 PM
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:13:05 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
We all want this letter. Hint, hint.


She may be writing the rest of it...................that was mean just kidding.


:lol: heh


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 10:13:07 PM
Thank you all for your comments on Greta so i have also a little inside on it  :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Indyfreelancer on June 21, 2005, 10:13:28 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Her mom looks like she seen a ghost after leaving the house.  I think it was nice of them.


Shellbell, I totally agree - BHT did NOT look good leaving the VDS's.  Emotionally drained or a change in mother's intuition?  Hoping for the former...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:13:48 PM
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


I was good at it...even after my parents removed my avenue of "escape" :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 21, 2005, 10:13:51 PM
Mr. VDS seemed quite soft spoken and did not have to invite them in. Maybe none of the parents are bad guys?  VDS parents seemed pretty civil in all the footage.

I've visited the netherlands and worked with folks there - there's a reserved politeness that americans might take as arrogance but is really just good manners in their culture. And it must be hard for them since all parents believe the best of their kids to sit with the woman who is all over tv pointing the finger at their kid.

not judging who did what but it's the first genuine view we've had of the VDS parents and it sure doesn't match the speculation that's been floating around.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:14:04 PM
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Thanks to wireless laptop and internet I'm sitting in front of my TV posting...when I saw the video of BHT calling in front of  JVDS house....I felt a chill....anybody else?


I have to say it took some balls for Papa to invite them in, even w/o the cameras.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 10:14:37 PM
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:14:45 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "reese"
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


maybe he was trying to tell someone how he was involed with all of this ( lieing or not) and the reason the e-mail was not finished is because he was interrupted by his arrest.


Okay, don't take this the wrong way...but Ww said it was dated 6/5. He was arrested on 6/9.  That's a heckuva long time to be working on an email!



Good point...he did not know he would be arrested when he wrote this, and it was written to a friend of his in the US that saw Natalees pic on the news and asked him if he heard about it. Having said that I will re-post the whole letter, so there will be a big portion repeated...sorry


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 10:15:08 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
For God's sake. We have thousands of drunk, rowdy tourists here. You really think that even IF and that's a big IF she was in this state, anybody would stop caring less? It does in no way justify something bad happening to her.

Drunk / Sober, the fact that is, that she disappeared into thin air.


Yeah, but she wasn't in that state, at least when she left C&C. At least, that's the best information we have, from numerous witnesses who were on the scene.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:15:12 PM
not judging who did what but it's the first genuine view we've had of the VDS parents and it sure doesn't match the speculation that's been floating around.

Yep. It's rather cultural in nature, IMO.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:15:36 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Thanks to wireless laptop and internet I'm sitting in front of my TV posting...when I saw the video of BHT calling in front of  JVDS house....I felt a chill....anybody else?


I have to say it took some balls for Papa to invite them in, even w/o the cameras.


Wench....Agreed!! Maybe I'm following this too close but it was just strange...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:15:51 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


That's what I heard.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:15:58 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


When I was in hs I use to sneak out and get back, my mom woke me up for school, if she was ever gone, my dad left to go to work so early I had to set the alarm.  It was reported he was at school.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:16:56 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "reese"
CAT DR:
Yes it is an e-mail, from Deepak....


maybe he was trying to tell someone how he was involed with all of this ( lieing or not) and the reason the e-mail was not finished is because he was interrupted by his arrest.


Okay, don't take this the wrong way...but Ww said it was dated 6/5. He was arrested on 6/9.  That's a heckuva long time to be working on an email!



Good point...he did not know he would be arrested when he wrote this, and it was written to a friend of his in the US that saw Natalees pic on the news and asked him if he heard about it. Having said that I will re-post the whole letter, so there will be a big portion repeated...sorry



Thanks


Title: Rest of letter
Post by: Dublin on June 21, 2005, 10:17:04 PM
I suspect there won't be any "rest of story" and what was it we were supposed to "pick apart" in the first part anyway?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:17:07 PM
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that bus must have come damn early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:17:19 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Absolut, how would my name convince you that I'm from Aruba. Not like it's 'Croes'. :)


Your info convinces me you are. I don't know your name and I don't know where you live. So with that level of knowledge unknown, I probably would not forward you emails that I receive.


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:17:51 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away

*for what its worth......*


Repost of suspicious e-mail allegedly written by Deepak and sent, thru mysterious and unexplained ways, to our own WonderWoman.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:17:53 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:17:55 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote



Good point...he did not know he would be arrested when he wrote this, and it was written to a friend of his in the US that saw Natalees pic on the news and asked him if he heard about it. Having said that I will re-post the whole letter, so there will be a big portion repeated...sorry


You heard this firsthand from him, or was that part attached with the forwarded email? I ask so we can pin down facts from speculation....he basically confessed to being involved to a friend in the US?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kelly on June 21, 2005, 10:17:57 PM
i cant believe jorans mother told the media that joran told her that he left natalee on the beach alone...........i bet she was not supposed to say that, that really could have hurt things for them, and great for nat's case!  This is the fourth story............and that is why i guess the fourth suspect was held is bc he was voluntariy making a statment that he had seen them drop her off at the holidya inn, and when their stories changed again, the police realized that they ahd to bring this guy in for lying...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:18:11 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that damn must have come early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


What time do you think it came? 7:45 or so?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 10:18:43 PM
This may have already been posted, but this is a LEGITAMATE trust fund for Natalee & her family, I bank there. Here's the link

http://www.amsouth.com/special/natalee.asp


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:18:48 PM
Greta has new friends of Nat coming on. This is new.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:18:53 PM
Fair enough, absolut.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 10:18:58 PM
I sneak out also when i was younger for a long time. I always thought my mother didn`t know that. But a couple of years ago she said to me that she knew that . Talking about mother`s intuition :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:19:32 PM
anyone else got a headache??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 10:20:00 PM
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


Hello Tom
This is GutFeeling from New York.   I read your comment and wonder  Wasn't Joran out a the Casino late the next night with his fathers knowledge.  Why does he have to sneek one night and not the other.  Was it not really late the next night when the Holloway Twittys approached the VDS home?
Do I have my facts straight?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:20:12 PM
That's the latest if it would make it in time. It's one big traffic jam at that time, because that's when Aruban elementary and certain kinds of middle schools (MAVO) start.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:20:39 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.


Good advise from an attorney:  Answer all questions "I don't know" or "I can't remember"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: jac723 on June 21, 2005, 10:20:43 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
anyone else got a headache??


I do--and now I am checking here and running back to TV to watch Greta


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inquisitive on June 21, 2005, 10:21:19 PM
Hi All, I haven't been on in awhile, but I thought I remembered someone posting that JVDS's father was sighted at McDonald's at 3am the night of the dissapearence? Gretta says 10pm? Did you all ever beleive the first statement?
Thanks.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:21:45 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that bus must have come damn early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


Why would Joran and his brother take a bus if their mother teaches at the school???


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:22:10 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away

*for what its worth......*


Repost of suspicious e-mail allegedly written by Deepak and sent, thru mysterious and unexplained ways, to our own WonderWoman.


Call me crazy..but this not sound right...what is the source and what is the verification? Please send me the full e-mail in it's original form with e-mail addresses and IP numbers.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:22:10 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
anyone else got a headache??


Is it right over your eye?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:22:12 PM
All three would prob. take the same bus.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:22:20 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


Hello Tom
This is GutFeeling from New York.   I read your comment and wonder  Wasn't Joran out a the Casino late the next night with his fathers knowledge.  Why does he have to sneek one night and not the other.  Was it not really late the next night when the Holloway Twittys approached the VDS home?
Do I have my facts straight?


Are you correct, it is puzzling,


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:22:20 PM
Good advise from an attorney: Answer all questions "I don't know" or "I can't remember"

Or wench, the classic "what's the definition of "is"?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:22:23 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
anyone else got a headache??


No but my side hurts, doctor called today and I may have to have my gallbladder removed.


That is the girl in all the pictures.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:22:45 PM
so now it is called an "unofficial" graduation trip??

hmmm...we have 2 new friends of Natalee's on TV


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:22:56 PM
Heeee, RB


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 10:22:56 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that bus must have come damn early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


Why would Joran and his brother take a bus if their mother teaches at the school???


I don't think that is uncommon.  Most kids don't like hanging out with their parents at that age and maybe they left at different times.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CAMDOG on June 21, 2005, 10:23:30 PM
Gutfeeling, I am wondering the same thing.  According to PVDS, Joran snuck out without his knowledge and against the rules the night of the disappearance.  The next night, Natalee's parents arrive very late, go to Joran's house to talk to him, and PVDS tells them that Joran is out gambling.  As usual, it doesn't make sense.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:23:40 PM
YES!!!! Her friend just confirmed that she had never met him......before that night...he wasn't flirting, Natalee introduced HERSELF to him...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:23:45 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


Hello Tom
This is GutFeeling from New York.   I read your comment and wonder  Wasn't Joran out a the Casino late the next night with his fathers knowledge.  Why does he have to sneek one night and not the other.  Was it not really late the next night when the Holloway Twittys approached the VDS home?
Do I have my facts straight?


Also, I found it fascinating that Joran's parents asked him to shut up about the case because he was blabbling (my words) all over school.  Wonder what that was all about?  What was he saying at school?  I'm surprised they haven't hauled all those kids in...guess that explains Max Arends trip to the cop shop.

The mom said he wasn't errogant, but confident.  That may well be true.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:23:47 PM
Uh blackjack table?  Wonder Woman may have a story.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:23:52 PM
asdf, that could also be the case.

In either case, I do know that some teachers use that bus as well. If Anita v/d Sloot did it, have no idea.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:24:15 PM
getting to the letter....but have to see this....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:24:49 PM
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:25:07 PM
Quote from: "asdf"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that bus must have come damn early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


Why would Joran and his brother take a bus if their mother teaches at the school???


I don't think that is uncommon.  Most kids don't like hanging out with their parents at that age and maybe they left at different times.


MOM was out of town.....in Holland.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:25:46 PM
Okay, hold on. Jv/dS and NH met the first time in C&C? Is that what the friends are saying?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:26:23 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
anyone else got a headache??


Is it right over your eye?

yeah...can you "see" it??  :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:26:37 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, hold on. Jv/dS and NH met the first time in C&C? Is that what the friends are saying?


No at the casino but that day earlier.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:26:37 PM
This is unreal...did I hear a contradiction about whether or not Natalee actually met Joran prior to C&C?


Title: Re: thoughts and theories
Post by: Kelly on June 21, 2005, 10:27:05 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she kept asking him and he said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without our parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee seemed VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away

*for what its worth......*


Repost of suspicious e-mail allegedly written by Deepak and sent, thru mysterious and unexplained ways, to our own WonderWoman.




WHAT IS THIS? I READ IT TWICE AND CONFUSED...YOU ARE SAYIN THAT THIS IS FROM "DEEPAK" COME ON NOW..HOW WOULD THAT GET HERE..AND WHERE IS THE REST OF THE EMAIL..IM SO CONFUSED


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Hagie9 on June 21, 2005, 10:27:05 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, hold on. Jv/dS and NH met the first time in C&C? Is that what the friends are saying?


That's what I gathered......


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 10:27:06 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
anyone else got a headache??


Me Me Me! lol I have a raging one!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:27:21 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.


No flame, absolut, but hasn't that been one of the accounts already that they met at the blackjack table, etc?   I seriously don't recall, other than the fact that her friends said she did not make plans with him, which contradicts the letter, and that he said nobody goes out on Sunday so they were surprised to see him show up.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:27:50 PM
Oh, okay. So NH and Jv/dS met each other at the HI casino? Got it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mitzid66 on June 21, 2005, 10:28:07 PM
If mom of JVDS is a teacher, why would she already be in Holland when school was not out yet?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:28:08 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
YES!!!! Her friend just confirmed that she had never met him......before that night...he wasn't flirting, Natalee introduced HERSELF to him...


It was just confirmed by Nat's friend that she had NOT met him before that night and that SHE introduced herself to him.

hmmm....very interesting...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:28:13 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "absolut"
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.


No flame, absolut, but hasn't that been one of the accounts already that they met at the blackjack table, etc?   I seriously don't recall, other than the fact that her friends said she did not make plans with him, which contradicts the letter, and that he said nobody goes out on Sunday so they were surprised to see him show up.


Her close friends just destroyed a bunch of previous fact.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:28:22 PM
Quote from: "Hagie9"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, hold on. Jv/dS and NH met the first time in C&C? Is that what the friends are saying?


That's what I gathered......


Then one of them contradicted herself and said they'd met that DAY and that Joran told them the island was dead on a Sunday night, so they were surprised to see him at C&C.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:28:25 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.



WOOHOO!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 10:28:35 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.



Well, I thought about it at the time Greta said it and I thought about my ex-husband and what he would be like if I were out of town.  My kids are younger, but if they were older he probably wouldn't be real great about making sure they got up and probably wouldn't remember which morning was which and wouldn't be able to seperate one morning from another.  In my experience, and only MINE (not implying that all men are absent minded), men are just not as good at that sort of thing and don't have the memory about that stuff that women do.  I guess I can find his story believable.  Not sure I do believe it, but I can see a man not really knowing for sure.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:28:50 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
YES!!!! Her friend just confirmed that she had never met him......before that night...he wasn't flirting, Natalee introduced HERSELF to him...


It was just confirmed by Nat's friend that she had NOT met him before that night and that SHE introduced herself to him.

hmmm....very interesting...


Okay wonder woman is either psychic or has a letter!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:28:56 PM
Okay, now I'm confused.


Title: Please explain?
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 10:29:29 PM
Don't you have to be 18 to drink AND gamble?  How'd he get into the casinos and enter tourneys? Isn't J just 17?  Confused here....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:30:18 PM
What else could those young ladies tell.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 10:31:08 PM
anyone read this in the arubaam newspaper archive from 6/7/05 and remember any more news regarding what it stated?


http://www.arubaam.com/~victor/am07jun05.pdf
(top coulumn on page 1, right hand side with green background)

"The security tapes of the hotel indeed show the two guards, of the Allegro Resort, walking in front of the hotels..."

-anyone know if Mickey John and other detained guard or possibly other guards were working that night?

sorry if this is old news but just trying to start from the beginnning again...thnks


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:31:14 PM
whodunit, if you  look like 18, there's a good chance that you'll get in the casinos here.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 10:31:18 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.


Yes, I found that interesting.  They seemed to confirm certain details of the email that we either had wrong information about before or just didn't know.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:31:20 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


As I said before, the more of these "friends" who were closer to NH than perhaps those who have been interviewed before are out in the media, the more this story will change.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 10:31:23 PM
The newspaper guy who may or may not know what he is talking about said that talk is that Joran was out of control.  He mentioned the driving.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, now I'm confused.


How is this for a theory. You are with hot guy and your close friends leave you at the bar an hour before it closes because you are having the time of your life.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Dallas Also on June 21, 2005, 10:31:34 PM
Joran's parents played it to the tilt to attempt to illustrate their care and concern, and they attempted to look like parents of a "boy falsely accused", "another victim in this sad situation"....

Good grief, I'm sorry, but Joran's mom kissing Natalee's mom on the cheek was outrageous and staged to improve the image of the Van der Sloots, since right now their son is being tried in the media.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kelly on June 21, 2005, 10:32:07 PM
YEAH WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS EMAIL? seriously......someone is stating that they have an email? i read it and understand what is in it, just confused as to what this has to do with anything! I cant imagine how an email from one of the suspets would get out and if it was from one ofo these guys...then why did he stop at the end like that


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:32:10 PM
but there is a difference in the facts about whether Nat and VDS made plans to meet at C&C. E-mail says they did...friends said no.

BUT...girls do not always tell their GF's when they have made plans to "hook up" with a guy later.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 10:32:13 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:32:16 PM
Yes...I am crazy, but there is something that has been bugging me from day one and this may have already been discussed. I saw Natalees friends say on Greta's show just now there is no way they would have let her leave with 3 local guys....

Meaning..my thought is in the crowds of people leaving the bar....lots people..kinda drunk..some kinda wasted...laughing and such...and you see your friend getting into what looks like a taxi..but it's really not....

I think she was snatched in crush of the crowd...

any thoughts?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: blfit on June 21, 2005, 10:32:31 PM
The only information we had to go on before was that of the media.  No one had actually talked to her "close" friends until now.  Now it's a different story.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:32:32 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "Scared-Tom"
I would be remiss to say this, but a teenager sneaking out is not uncommon.

I may have done it once or twice, and I get the feeling that Joran probably got very good at it.

T


Hello Tom
This is GutFeeling from New York.   I read your comment and wonder  Wasn't Joran out a the Casino late the next night with his fathers knowledge.  Why does he have to sneek one night and not the other.  Was it not really late the next night when the Holloway Twittys approached the VDS home?
Do I have my facts straight?

Nice detective work


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 10:32:43 PM
OK, but why is his dad OK with him being in the casinos?  Isn't he supposed to be upholding the laws of the land??????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:32:44 PM
dragonfly, while I'm sure the other students interviewed were protecting NH's integrity, there's more here than meets the eye.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 21, 2005, 10:32:56 PM
GHB is super easy to slip to someone, as well as have them confuse the effects if given while already drunk......maybe SCroes was an older friend and/or part time dealer and called because of previous experience with OD situations.....also, possibly Joran and NH had hooked up a good bit before she stopped breathing and he couldnt revive her - then he freaked realizing that his DNA was in/on her as well as traces of GHB in the system...would look EXACTLY like a date rape, whether it was or not


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: veme on June 21, 2005, 10:33:21 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, now I'm confused.

Me too Arubagirl!
Time to go to bed & pick up on this in the morning.
Good night all. :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 10:33:21 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
YES!!!! Her friend just confirmed that she had never met him......before that night...he wasn't flirting, Natalee introduced HERSELF to him...


It was just confirmed by Nat's friend that she had NOT met him before that night and that SHE introduced herself to him.

hmmm....very interesting...


Yeah...okay I have come to one conclusion.. no one has one story.. sorry no offense to anyone from MB


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:33:28 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
5/29 Joran calls dad to be picked up at McDonalds at 11pm
Then Joran sneaks out of house sometime after midnight and went to Carlos and Charlies
Father had no knowledge

Mother in Holland


Kerin,
Seriously. Why would a teacher leave the country before the school year was up, before exams, before her in-service day? You're a teacher. Would you leave school before it ended for the year? Doesn't make sense. I think she was still in Aruba.


I believe the parents.  If she was lying she would have already been in questioned.


Ok. Wait. Did Anita v.d Sloot SAY she was in Holland that night? Or is this just speculation?
sorry, but i've been off the board since yesterday when white lightning zapped ma phone and made my internet access dead as a doorknob.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:33:31 PM
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


I totally agree, Red.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:34:44 PM
dated 6/5/2005


How are you i hope you and your family is fine.(NAME DELETED) is better i tell you the truth , before it will be a shock for you later, but i think it will be a shock for you rightnow.
The missing girl natalee hollaway,I spoke to her , sunday she left with me , my brother and a friend from carlos n' charlies , it was my car like the news said she got in to, I am one of the persons of intrest , i am one the the students they've questioned and released as they claimed in the news .
Let see where to start i don't even know where to begin these last days where so crazy for me i'm very tired haven't slept good in days : The story starts sunday night when a friend of mine was playing poker at a local casino (in the holiday inn) after he won the poker at the fourth place he decided to get up and play some blackjack so he went to the blackjack table and there was natalee (they were a lil drunk ) so my friend started playing blackjack and he was winning quite good , so then natalee approached him and introduced herself and said to him'' your a lucky guy , can you help me win some of my money back i lost $ 360 , of my fathers money'' so my friend said ok , why not . so he started playing and he won 100 $ for her back and he said hey thats the best i can do for you because i doubt it i can win more money for you so its better i quit so she said ok but at least let me buy you a drink so they went to the bar (in the casino ). so they took a drink and started talking etc. about school, the vacation etc.etc.afterwards my friend had to go and she said that ''today is my last day i will be in carlos n' charlies will you be there'' and my friend said well i have school tomorrow i don't think so . well she begged him and he still said yes i'll be there.So that was in the casino i was not present , i was at work so my friend called me and said hey i met some girls in the casino and her friends and they want us to meet them in carlos tonight do you have to work tomorrow morning i said no , so he said pick me up later then i said ok. so i got off my shift at 10 pm and went home took a bath had to fix something and then me and my younger brother went to pick up my friend was around 12.10 am so i came to his home and was talked for like 15 min and then left to go to carlos (we all went out without or parents knew) so we arrived like 12.30 am in carlos (carlos is closing 1 pm ) and headed straight for the bar and bought 3 drinks my friend paid for them, so besides the bar there is a stage and people were dancing and there was natalee dancing too (thats the first time i saw her )and she was calling my friend to get on the stage and dance with her  my friend laughed and refused so after the song was finished she came up to my friend and asked why he won't dance with her , i only heared that part because i was talking to someone else so i don't know what he responded(by then natalee was VERY drunk)so as i said i was talking to someone when i turned i had lost my brother , natalee and my friend. well they were announced that they were closing soon so i thought well maybe they' re waiting for me by the car its better i go there so i went to my car and nobody was there so i started playing music and was waiting on my brother and my friend.i waited for like 10 min and then i saw my brother stepping in the car and my friend who was with natalee. so i was surprised but anyways i started the engine and my brother was besides me and my friend and natalee were in the backseet so i started cruising in the area and asked my friend whats going on so natalee responded to me ''hey its no prob let us just drive around and have fun its my last night , she said you can drop me off later at holiday inn anyways right'' i said sure why not so as i was drove out of the carlos road and got on the mainroad there were natalees friends and she , pushed het head out of the window and screamed something i can't recall.so i was driving very slow to make a left to get in the next road and then one of natalees friend screamed for her to get out of the car , and she refused so then i stopped my car and i said natalee if your friends want you to go with them its better you go listen to them and go with them , she said no i will stay with you guys i will get a lift from you anways later, so she said bye to her friends and i drove away, so then we were just talking etc, in the car and then she said she wanted to see sharks ,it was by the lighthouse she saw them before that can we go , my friend said ok ,deepak lets go. so on my my to the lighthouse there was music playing and noone talking for a while when i looked in the backmirror my friend and natalee were kissing and touching (his hands etc was in her blouse but nothing nude or against natalees will ) so my brother siad just leave them for a while untill we get to the lighthouse, when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights) so after like 10 min my friend is telling me that natalee fell asleep i said you kidding just wake her up and tell ask her if its holiday inn for sure she is staying so my friend woke her up and confirmed with natalee she was staying at the holiday inn, so i drove to the lobby driveway of holiday inn and then we woke her up, she got out of the car and fell on the floor my friend said damn she fell and then rushed out of the same door natalee came out and picked her up immediately, after she stood up she pushed my friend and said leave me alone or something like that i can't recall , my friend offered to help het to her room she said no. she he stepped in the car and while i was driving away i saw natalee walking towards the lobby and a gentleman with a walkie talkie and black clothes approached her and i think they were talking and i had never seen natalee again sinds.(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby) it was around 2.15 am .monday i came to work normally 4- 11 pm after work i called my friend i said whats up he said ok i'm at the raddison casino meet me there , i said ok  so i went there we played poker , we had some drinks and chat and then we had enough and decided that this casino was booring lets go to whyndham hotel casino . so i drove to whyndham and as i was parking my friends dad called him and said the police is at his home with some family members its about the girl you guys went out with yesterday , so my friend said wait there i be there, so we rushed at my friends home and there was the police and nataless family and it was a nightmare sinds then. the police asked us if we knew this girl showed us a picture we said yes thats her , they said she was missing and eyewitness say she was the last seen with you guys . so they asked a few more questions and we said we don't understand we left her at holiday inn lobby drive way how could she dissapear and then natalees stepfather jumped and said ''yes thats because after she went with you assholes she lost'' and then my friends father jumped and said thats enough you can't talk to the kids like that this is not the us your out of you juristiction this is not the way i want you people out of my yard i know the law (my friends father is e judge) so afterwards another family member of natalee suggested to the police if we can id the security gard we said ok. we went there there was no suck security working there as we discribed. so then we were just standing in the lobby there were questions etc. asked by other members , and then me and my friend walked to the car natalees mom was sitting and we said mam you have to believe us we did not do anything with you daughter, she was crying and said i don't believe you 2 , i promise you i will make you life a living hell because of this . anwyas we said we were sorry again ans that we will help in any way possible.i went home 7 pm tuesday, i was then called 2 pm by the police for questioning i went gave a statement they said i was a witness no suspect the same went for my brother and my friend they were questionded and had to sign their statement also , the checked my car and i was clear to go , wednesday i was called again to show them how i drove the route that day ( i could refuse was my right i still decided to go , as did my brother and friend ) the drove us one by one and then we were free to go again.thursday morning my friend called me (he goes to aruba international school and his mother is a teacher there and he is a straight A student ) in panic and said there a re family members here at school and they are sharing flyers and the flyers said : GIRL KIDNAPPED ASK JORAN VANDER SLOOT (thats my friends name ) the principle asked them to leave and they did .so thats my part of the story yesterday and today it was quiet no treathen phoncalls what we got before and i won't mention the crazythings the newspapers etc. writes about us its to much to mention. at home my mom is losing it she is cryimg constantly , my dad bloodpressure got high also his hands are red , my friends home is a disaster also ,his mom is crying constantly also his dad is pretty cool he calmes us down and talks to us also not to worry , my brother is preety cool but on his face you see he is worried , my friend is pretty worried also. i'm pretty worried also , we have 2 lawyers one for my friend and one for me in case we get arrested and charched with something his dad can't defend hin he is a judge and he is too emotional attached .my friend has his graduation this thursday he has to go to the states in july he has a full scholarship. i had to go to vacation also end of this month.many politicians find we should be locked up rightnow.We heard a lot of false alarms that she was dead , she was seen with 2 guys , her hair is cut and is red now ,she was in a crackhouse etc, we were arrested and , my car is by the police we confessed to murder and rape, she went in a restaurant to buy food but none of those were true.So (name deleted) that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them
 
 
So (NAME DELETED) i will say goodbye now hope you believe me and i pray to god that they find natalee soon and find her well so that this nightmare ends  for all of us and they we prove we had nothing to do with this, i hope you pray for all of us say hi to everyone there hope to hear from you soon and may god bless.........
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:34:56 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, now I'm confused.


How is this for a theory. You are with hot guy and your close friends leave you at the bar an hour before it closes because you are having the time of your life.


Forgive my ignorance, but I don't see how anything they did prior to Natalee leaving with three guys who admit leaving with her has any bearing on what happened after that point. Am I missing something?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inquisitive on June 21, 2005, 10:34:58 PM
arubagirl, do you remember someone posting that there was a sighting of VDS's dad at Mc Donalds at 3am?  Or know how i could search the forum for it?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Chef_Hoovisan on June 21, 2005, 10:35:47 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Hagie9"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, hold on. Jv/dS and NH met the first time in C&C? Is that what the friends are saying?


That's what I gathered......


Then one of them contradicted herself and said they'd met that DAY and that Joran told them the island was dead on a Sunday night, so they were surprised to see him at C&C.


No contradiction...they said they met for the first time in the hotel casino. It was that night that they met again at C&Cs.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:35:57 PM
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


EXACTLY, Red. 2 different Natalee's have emerged here

ONE Natalee is the responsible person who is never missing or late to ANYTHING (that has been repeated by Dash and her mom)

SECOND Natalee now being told by her friends...saying they were not worried about her when she did not come home all night??

WHICH one is she?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:35:57 PM
I had already heard before that natalee met him the night before at the casino and not earlier, this was something that was being said long before tonight in the MSM? Or am I crazy?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: scared-tom on June 21, 2005, 10:36:32 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
Okay, now I'm confused.


How is this for a theory. You are with hot guy and your close friends leave you at the bar an hour before it closes because you are having the time of your life.


I hate to say for this, but it says I am looking for a hook up.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 10:37:53 PM
For those of you that may have missed it or had to run back & forth to the TV, a great friend of Scared Monkey, the Political Teen ...

Greta on Fox with Beth at the VDS's ...

http://thepoliticalteen.net/2005/06/21/1758/


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 10:38:22 PM
"So betty that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them"


Who is betty?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mitzid66 on June 21, 2005, 10:38:49 PM
It seems that Urine Va Der Sloot runs his household.  He has his own car before the legal driving age.  Gambles and drinks underage.  Has an apartment outside the main home.  Either from lax parents, or parents who are afraid of him.  

Who knows what to believe from any info Greta or anyone else gets from these parents.  

Sounds to me like it is worthless to talk to the VDS parents.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:38:49 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


EXACTLY, Red. 2 different Natalee's have emerged here

ONE Natalee is the responsible person who is never missing or late to ANYTHING (that has been repeated by Dash and her mom)

SECOND Natalee now being told by her friends...saying they were not worried about her when she did not come home all night??

WHICH one is she?


I heard them say she was level headed, didn't hear them say the second part.  Do you remember the exact quote? Regardless it seems that someone could be responsible and not come back to her room, like someone had said before she was popular and her friends might have thought she was in someone elses room.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Dallas Also on June 21, 2005, 10:38:49 PM
Quote from: "inquisitive"
arubagirl, do you remember someone posting that there was a sighting of VDS's dad at Mc Donalds at 3am?  Or know how i could search the forum for it?


inquisitive - here ya go:

mehill10



Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 47
Location: Gardendale,AL
 Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:45 pm    Post subject:    

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
i saw this on riehl world view



Posted on "The Troubling Puzzle" blog:

I'm in Mountain Brook and from the people who have recently returned from Aruba is that Van der Sloot's dad was seen at a McDonald's at 3 a.m. the night Natalee disappeared.

I don't think this has been reported in the mainstream media so hopefully this will help those of of you who are following this closely. This is my first post here and I'm posting something I think all of you might find significant.

Natalee goes missing at about 1 to 1:30 a.m. and the Van der Sloot's dad is seen at a McDonalds at 3a.m. I assume the dad has a job and would have to be at work the next day. There to me it is very suspicious.......

Posted by: samthebam | June 19, 2005 03:35 PM

interesting might explain why dad is being questioned


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 10:39:01 PM
Natalee's mom on CNN with Nancy Grace.  She is supporting the Aruban search.  She will not divulge the information discussed earlier with JVDS's parents.  She feels that the answers as to where her daughter is lies with those boys...as well as others.

Maybe you guys saw this, but I thought I'd post it... :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:39:27 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
but there is a difference in the facts about whether Nat and VDS made plans to meet at C&C. E-mail says they did...friends said no.

BUT...girls do not always tell their GF's when they have made plans to "hook up" with a guy later.


Hello! Sure do! Spill all!

Can somebody tell us what they're talking about on Greta? Some of us don't have cable!!! Did she ask them about the e-mail WonderWoman posted??? I'm confused!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:39:29 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.



Well, I thought about it at the time Greta said it and I thought about my ex-husband and what he would be like if I were out of town.  My kids are younger, but if they were older he probably wouldn't be real great about making sure they got up and probably wouldn't remember which morning was which and wouldn't be able to seperate one morning from another.  In my experience, and only MINE (not implying that all men are absent minded), men are just not as good at that sort of thing and don't have the memory about that stuff that women do.  I guess I can find his story believable.  Not sure I do believe it, but I can see a man not really knowing for sure.


i think he would remember if a desperate women was at his door looking for her child....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 10:39:57 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
but there is a difference in the facts about whether Nat and VDS made plans to meet at C&C. E-mail says they did...friends said no.

BUT...girls do not always tell their GF's when they have made plans to "hook up" with a guy later.


Wow, IMHO, I don't think that was a good interview...raises even more questions!

We were alreadu told in statements that she had been reported meeting him 2 days earlier...even by BH.

I need excedrin!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:40:41 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "absolut"
Her friends just confirmed the email. Flame me if you would like.


No flame, absolut, but hasn't that been one of the accounts already that they met at the blackjack table, etc?   I seriously don't recall, other than the fact that her friends said she did not make plans with him, which contradicts the letter, and that he said nobody goes out on Sunday so they were surprised to see him show up.


Her close friends just destroyed a bunch of previous fact.


Well that was very interesting about Joran saying Sunday night wasn't a fun night and they were surprised to see him.  If NH made plans to meet him out of earshot from her friends, she certainly would have said something about it to them later.  


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: medleyrelay on June 21, 2005, 10:41:34 PM
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GuyWdog on June 21, 2005, 10:41:39 PM
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

GuyWdog


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: arubagirl on June 21, 2005, 10:41:47 PM
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:42:01 PM
Quote from: "Kelly"
YEAH WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS EMAIL? seriously......someone is stating that they have an email? i read it and understand what is in it, just confused as to what this has to do with anything! I cant imagine how an email from one of the suspets would get out and if it was from one ofo these guys...then why did he stop at the end like that


Isn't that evidence tampering?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 10:42:02 PM
Quote
So betty that was my part of the story


You forgot to delete that instance of the recipient's name


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 10:42:20 PM
Some one help me out with this one.

Natalee's presumed 2 close friends just said that Natalee introduced herself to VDS at the black jack table? She is the one who made the introduction? Did I hear that correctly? Or did she do so after he may have said something to her? Would have been a nice follow up Greta, eh?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:42:33 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.



Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


EXACTLY, Red. 2 different Natalee's have emerged here

ONE Natalee is the responsible person who is never missing or late to ANYTHING (that has been repeated by Dash and her mom)

SECOND Natalee now being told by her friends...saying they were not worried about her when she did not come home all night??

WHICH one is she?


This makes sense to me.  The friends also said they just thought she was sleeping in another room.  If you recall dorm living it's typical kids move around from room to room, sometimes sleeping elsewhere. And this was even looser as it was a hotel.

Plus it was their last night there...Dash said she was talking around the pool all night.  It seems logical many of these kids stayed up very late or all night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:43:14 PM
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


 Agreed. But doesn't later testimony that they dropped Joran and Nat off at the beach and went home completely contradict that email? Also the alleged apology he gave to the security guard, etc?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:44:03 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

GuyWdog


I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Chef_Hoovisan on June 21, 2005, 10:44:51 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

GuyWdog


Many of the students did not even return to their rooms until 5AM, so they may not have even known that she didn't return.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nitjus4fun on June 21, 2005, 10:45:07 PM
CNN was reporting this morning that the DJ had been held due to 'Holes' that had developed in his story form the night she dissappeared.  Has any more info on this came out today??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:45:16 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


PRESSURE


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mitzid66 on June 21, 2005, 10:45:27 PM
People in hotels do not move room to room.  Girls are pretty particvulat about thier stuff.    Maybe in a dorm, but not a hotel.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 10:45:52 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.



Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


EXACTLY, Red. 2 different Natalee's have emerged here

ONE Natalee is the responsible person who is never missing or late to ANYTHING (that has been repeated by Dash and her mom)

SECOND Natalee now being told by her friends...saying they were not worried about her when she did not come home all night??

WHICH one is she?


This makes sense to me.  The friends also said they just thought she was sleeping in another room.  If you recall dorm living it's typical kids move around from room to room, sometimes sleeping elsewhere. And this was even looser as it was a hotel.

Plus it was their last night there...Dash said she was talking around the pool all night.  It seems logical many of these kids stayed up very late or all night.


Nancy Drew, a possible explanation (although what would they know about dorm living, not in college yet). More to the point, where was the question? These were her roomates.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:45:59 PM
Quote from: "nitjus4fun"
CNN was reporting this morning that the DJ had been held due to 'Holes' that had developed in his story form the night she dissappeared.  Has any more info on this came out today??


From what I understand CNN said he corroborated their original "dropped her off at the HI" story.  I think thats why they are holding him.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 10:46:37 PM
Quote from: "DT"
I had already heard before that natalee met him the night before at the casino and not earlier, this was something that was being said long before tonight in the MSM? Or am I crazy?


I was under the impression that they had met earlier in the week.  What about the scuffle with the MB boys.  Did that happen before he met NH?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Tila_Bean on June 21, 2005, 10:46:40 PM
There are too many inconsistancies (excuse my spelling) because alcohol and possibly drugs were involved.   :(


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:46:41 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

GuyWdog


Correct!

I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 10:46:52 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "absolut"
What else could those young ladies tell.


Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?


EXACTLY, Red. 2 different Natalee's have emerged here

ONE Natalee is the responsible person who is never missing or late to ANYTHING (that has been repeated by Dash and her mom)

SECOND Natalee now being told by her friends...saying they were not worried about her when she did not come home all night??

WHICH one is she?


No conflict. she's so responsible they don't worry about her. makes sense.
And why can't a girl flirt with a guy at a bar? Southern women learn to flirt before they can walk. It's a requirement.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:47:03 PM
Quote from: "mitzid66"
People in hotels do not move room to room.  Girls are pretty particvulat about thier stuff.    Maybe in a dorm, but not a hotel.


Whose to say they went to sleep at all, I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them stayed up the entire night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:47:10 PM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
"So betty that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them"


Who is betty?


Thanks for repeating it, I tried to delete all names and I apparently forgot one, edited too late!!  :(


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:47:32 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "Kelly"
YEAH WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS EMAIL? seriously......someone is stating that they have an email? i read it and understand what is in it, just confused as to what this has to do with anything! I cant imagine how an email from one of the suspets would get out and if it was from one ofo these guys...then why did he stop at the end like that


Isn't that evidence tampering?


That email was written, if you believe it, prior to Deepak's arrest, if it's his. Regardless, no it isn't evidence tampering - I can almost within 100% guarentee the authorities have a copy of it, if it's real.  I must say though, it combined with Greta, does change the story somewhat.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:48:10 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Do we actually know their stories changed from a FACTUAL source?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:48:20 PM
Quote from: "mitzid66"
People in hotels do not move room to room.  Girls are pretty particvulat about thier stuff.    Maybe in a dorm, but not a hotel.


I disagree.  From my experience there is alot of movement from room to room. Especially if the roommates were chosen with friends not together.  It was a beach, party, casino atmosphere...not a stuff hotel.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:48:30 PM
Now the question is do you send it to greta?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 10:48:32 PM
Quote from: "Rob"
hey , my friend matt just joined and wants to talk about natalee... give him a real hard time... :twisted:


real hard time

we oblige even, Rob


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:48:44 PM
Kerin, that's a wise wise question.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:49:11 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Do we actually know their stories changed from a FACTUAL source?


Nope but if they did PRESSURE


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:49:22 PM
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inquisitive on June 21, 2005, 10:49:39 PM
Dallas Also
Thank you for the reply, stepped away for a moment...sorry
DO you think this statement has any validity?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 10:49:43 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.



Well, I thought about it at the time Greta said it and I thought about my ex-husband and what he would be like if I were out of town.  My kids are younger, but if they were older he probably wouldn't be real great about making sure they got up and probably wouldn't remember which morning was which and wouldn't be able to seperate one morning from another.  In my experience, and only MINE (not implying that all men are absent minded), men are just not as good at that sort of thing and don't have the memory about that stuff that women do.  I guess I can find his story believable.  Not sure I do believe it, but I can see a man not really knowing for sure.


i think he would remember if a desperate women was at his door looking for her child....


You have a point, he may remember waking Joran up, but may really have no clue when and if Joran left for school.  And maybe he didn't even wake him up but doesn't want to say that he didn't wake him up and make sure he got to school because momma VDS might get upset or whole world will think "what kind of father forgets to wake up their son and get them off to school?"  He may have no idea if Joran was home in the AM or whether or not he went to school.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GuyWdog on June 21, 2005, 10:50:23 PM
Quote
DT- wrote-"Whose to say they went to sleep at all, I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them stayed up the entire night."


 and Not 1 KID asked "WHERE is Natalee?" If she was so popular then someone certainly would have known about her where-abouts. Or was concnerned when someone asked about her. Or would they ?

guyWdog


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:50:48 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.



Well, I thought about it at the time Greta said it and I thought about my ex-husband and what he would be like if I were out of town.  My kids are younger, but if they were older he probably wouldn't be real great about making sure they got up and probably wouldn't remember which morning was which and wouldn't be able to seperate one morning from another.  In my experience, and only MINE (not implying that all men are absent minded), men are just not as good at that sort of thing and don't have the memory about that stuff that women do.  I guess I can find his story believable.  Not sure I do believe it, but I can see a man not really knowing for sure.


i think he would remember if a desperate women was at his door looking for her child....


You have a point, he may remember waking Joran up, but may really have no clue when and if Joran left for school.  And maybe he didn't even wake him up but doesn't want to say that he didn't wake him up and make sure he got to school because momma VDS might get upset or whole world will think "what kind of father forgets to wake up their son and get them off to school?"  He may have no idea if Joran was home in the AM or whether or not he went to school.


Dutch time.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 10:51:11 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Do we actually know their stories changed from a FACTUAL source?


Aruban newspapers, American newspapers and BHT herself have stated it repeatedly.  Even Jossey (sp) and other Aruban authorities have alluded to it.
The first mention was within a day of them being taken into custody when their stories didn't match Joran's and then Joran changed his back to them both being dropped off alone at the Lighthouse.  No amount of pressure should be able to make an honest detailed account change, IMO.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: gaijin on June 21, 2005, 10:51:12 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "KackyLacky"
didn't Natalee and joran know each other before that night according to her friends?

and if this email is to be believed, then what happened after the cars leave each other?  Very convienent that is the end of the email



Hi everybody
Help I'm lost.  I had to go to a dinner meeting.  I can see that there has been speculation about NH being at the VDS.  I know that someone else has probably come up with this but its what about forensics from the search.


there was a CNN report this mgn that forensic evidnce was sent to the netherlands from the two cars..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 10:51:14 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


 Agreed. But doesn't later testimony that they dropped Joran and Nat off at the beach and went home completely contradict that email? Also the alleged apology he gave to the security guard, etc?


How do we know that the testimony changed? From blogs and unnamed sources or the police? I don't remember. ANd as far as the security guard story -- how do we know he's telling the truth. It's my turn to take a pull from the excedrin bottle. Pass it around please.


Title: Hats off to Greta
Post by: BarStine on June 21, 2005, 10:51:17 PM
Greta...she seems like the only TV journalist who can deliver any clear info about this crime.

Greta for President!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:51:21 PM
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DivaToo on June 21, 2005, 10:52:05 PM
:(  Geez, I must have been ghosted....
I'm outty.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 10:52:37 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
DT- wrote-"Whose to say they went to sleep at all, I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them stayed up the entire night."


 and Not 1 KID asked "WHERE is Natalee?" If she was so popular then someone certainly would have known about her where-abouts. Or was concnerned when someone asked about her. Or would they ?

guyWdog


How do you know they didn't ask the question?  They would probably just assume she was with one of the other friends.  Given that a lot of them were probably drinking and partying I really doubt they were that concerned.  

Did you happen to catch the cnn special where they showed the group from boston going to carlos and charlies? As soon as they left the bar they had lost all sign of their friends and mada no attempt to find them.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:52:42 PM
I'd send it to fox and let them verify.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Chef_Hoovisan on June 21, 2005, 10:53:01 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
DT- wrote-"Whose to say they went to sleep at all, I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them stayed up the entire night."


 and Not 1 KID asked "WHERE is Natalee?" If she was so popular then someone certainly would have known about her where-abouts. Or was concnerned when someone asked about her. Or would they ?

guyWdog


With 130 kids on the trip, I can easily see everyone either assuming she was with other friends or not even thinking her at all.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 21, 2005, 10:53:01 PM
About allowing JVDS to drink - in Holland, kids can drink beer and wine at 16, only for hard liquor do you need to be 18 (and you can't drive until 18).

If you look at some of the www pages from travel agents for these "unofficial graduation trips" they mention specifically that the drinking age in Aruba is 18 but that no one cards anyone (this is common in many resort areas elsewhere as well) and my guess is that the same is true for the casinos. Of course, when something bad happens, then all the proprietors say "oh, we card!" just as all the kids say "we only drank responsibly" - the travel packages also mention things like "30 hours of open bar" - yet target these trips to 18 yr olds who are not legal to drink here.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 10:53:02 PM
Quote from: "Red"
Some one help me out with this one.

Natalee's presumed 2 close friends just said that Natalee introduced herself to VDS at the black jack table? She is the one who made the introduction? Did I hear that correctly? Or did she do so after he may have said something to her? Would have been a nice follow up Greta, eh?



The friend actually said, "he wasn't flirting or anything" Natalee went up to him....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:53:24 PM
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


And right now, it's better hearsay than what we've seen.  All this up to this point has been speculation, even by the media somewhat because of Dutch law restricting information. This at least is a look at the possibilities of the other side.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:53:41 PM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
"So betty that was my part of the story what i said here is the same in my statement,people are saying they are bad guys lock them up , the family is going thru a lot righnow , but what they don't know how the other families feel and how they also have a reputation and carreers etc. because when this all is over they will still be talks that were the 3 guys that had something to do with the kidnap of natalee its a small island.they don't understand the pressure we are having also, if this girl turns up dead we have a problem we were the last seen with her . I lost a lot of friends who think we had to do something with this, many of my friends supported us also brought food etc. for us at home and know we are innocent, we are innocent also we promise i would NEVER hurt anyone in anyway, i would do every everything to help find her thats what we told eveyone also , i would take a bullet to save her and bring her back to her family if i had to so would my friend also.i would never never hurt anyone i'm a very happy and social person who likes to make friends with people and not hurting them"


Who is betty?


The person the email was sent to.  I believe WW failed to delete her name there.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:53:58 PM
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 10:54:42 PM
Quote
too many inconsistancies (excuse my spelling) because alcohol and possibly drugs were involved


and maybe because they are young kids on their graduation trip to a beach resort and not anticipating that they will be required to produce a minute by minute account of every single move their friend made?

I have to agree with the poster who pointed out that it really does not matter who met whom when, said what, drank what, who danced, who drank, etc etc.

There is no need to "defend" Natalee, or any of the other kids. Unless someone is suggesting that they may have committed a crime, and I don't mean recreational drug consumption.

The suspicion is that Natalee is the *victim* of a crime, and she would be no less a victim if she were a habitual procrasitnating  flibbertygibbet who was rude to her elders, inconsiderate to everyone she met, barely managed to get passing grades at school and left piles of clothes everywhere and used too much makeup.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 10:54:44 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Red"
Some one help me out with this one.

Natalee's presumed 2 close friends just said that Natalee introduced herself to VDS at the black jack table? She is the one who made the introduction? Did I hear that correctly? Or did she do so after he may have said something to her? Would have been a nice follow up Greta, eh?



The friend actually said, "he wasn't flirting or anything" Natalee went up to him....


I could buy this. :idea:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:55:13 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


June 5th, 4 days before jail.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 10:55:27 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


WW specifically relayed the email was set on or around June 5th, I believe. The boys weren't arrested until the 9th. If that's true, then there you go. Believe what you will.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 10:55:29 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Red"
Some one help me out with this one.

Natalee's presumed 2 close friends just said that Natalee introduced herself to VDS at the black jack table? She is the one who made the introduction? Did I hear that correctly? Or did she do so after he may have said something to her? Would have been a nice follow up Greta, eh?



The friend actually said, "he wasn't flirting or anything" Natalee went up to him....
I heard that too.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 10:56:12 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
too many inconsistancies (excuse my spelling) because alcohol and possibly drugs were involved


and maybe because they are young kids on their graduation trip to a beach resort and not anticipating that they will be required to produce a minute by minute account of every single move their friend made?

I have to agree with the poster who pointed out that it really does not matter who met whom when, said what, drank what, who danced, who drank, etc etc.

There is no need to "defend" Natalee, or any of the other kids. Unless someone is suggesting that they may have committed a crime, and I don't mean recreational drug consumption.

The suspicion is that Natalee is the *victim* of a crime, and she would be no less a victim if she were a habitual procrasitnating  flibbertygibbet who was rude to her elders, inconsiderate to everyone she met, barely managed to get passing grades at school and left piles of clothes everywhere and used too much makeup.


Well said!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 10:56:33 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Do we actually know their stories changed from a FACTUAL source?


Nope but if they did PRESSURE

So all this time when we have been speculating that the pressure had not gotten to them (specifically Joran), to get a confession, it appears it DID! But the pressure (remember Mom VDS said Joran has been questioned for up to 11 hours per day) has not gotten a confession, it has caused a change of stories. Which, based on the ages of the kids, would be very believeable.
"Change the story to what you think the police WANT you to say, and they will let you go home!"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 10:56:38 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
too many inconsistancies (excuse my spelling) because alcohol and possibly drugs were involved


and maybe because they are young kids on their graduation trip to a beach resort and not anticipating that they will be required to produce a minute by minute account of every single move their friend made?

I have to agree with the poster who pointed out that it really does not matter who met whom when, said what, drank what, who danced, who drank, etc etc.

There is no need to "defend" Natalee, or any of the other kids. Unless someone is suggesting that they may have committed a crime, and I don't mean recreational drug consumption.

The suspicion is that Natalee is the *victim* of a crime, and she would be no less a victim if she were a habitual procrasitnating  flibbertygibbet who was rude to her elders, inconsiderate to everyone she met, barely managed to get passing grades at school and left piles of clothes everywhere and used too much makeup.


But if she was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects or a different outcome altogether.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Vorpman on June 21, 2005, 10:56:44 PM
Wonderwoman

When did you receive the e-mail posted tonight? And was this email forwarded to LE?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 10:57:11 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
DT- wrote-"Whose to say they went to sleep at all, I wouldn't doubt that a lot of them stayed up the entire night."


 and Not 1 KID asked "WHERE is Natalee?" If she was so popular then someone certainly would have known about her where-abouts. Or was concnerned when someone asked about her. Or would they ?

guyWdog


Girls are pretty jealous and might have been mad he liked her....


Title: Re: Hats off to Greta
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 10:57:16 PM
Quote from: "BarStine"
Greta...she seems like the only TV journalist who can deliver any clear info about this crime.

Greta for President!


This was an outstanding show.  So glad they got Geraldo out of there and sent her in. She gives Fox a good name.

There was more information in this show than several days shows combined.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 10:57:16 PM
Quote from: "littletxlady"
ELIO  NICOLAAS!!!! He's on the ball!
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/article_13007.shtml so, you're saying it's really in the Twitty family?  

OK...it's hard to hear a declarative sentence in this one...but, that's what you mean, correct?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 10:57:23 PM
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


Actually I think I remember seeing excerpts of this from WW before today so I don't think it just came out right before broadcast.
DOn't remember the day but you could pull up all posts from memberlist.
It only now looks more like the real thing after Greta's show than before because certain things are now corroborated by NH friends.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 10:57:41 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


And right now, it's better hearsay than what we've seen.  All this up to this point has been speculation, even by the media somewhat because of Dutch law restricting information. This at least is a look at the possibilities of the other side.


RB agreed....but keep in mind, this is the web..nobody can truly hide!! This is digital technology and EVERYTHING is logged by IP address somewhere...plus other means.

Apologies to all but I'm in the technology industry, and no mail addys, no IP addreses and no domains is the equivilent of writing something up on wordpad and posting by copy and paste same as I'm typing this in a window.

We need verifiable facts!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rubby on June 21, 2005, 10:57:43 PM
maybe the security guards were lying when they said the guy apologized.

The mother did say Joran left her along at the beach.

Fact of the matter she let with Joran and he should have escorted to her room especially if she was so called drunk!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 10:58:53 PM
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

GuyWdog


I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Yes. Also, timelines with friends stories are also conflicting with other friends.

Since the day BH landed and found out the information, it has been 1:30, two groups of people, people seeing her with Joran, BH even admitting she was with him. *sigh* I am not flaming etc but I am sorry over time everyone's story is changing. Almost manicured ::ducks for cover:: I am sorry but there's something seriously more wrong now.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GuyWdog on June 21, 2005, 11:00:10 PM
Quote
How do you know they didn't ask the question? They would probably just assume she was with one of the other friends. Given that a lot of them were probably drinking and partying I really doubt they were that concerned.

Did you happen to catch the cnn special where they showed the group from boston going to carlos and charlies? As soon as they left the bar they had lost all sign of their friends and mada no attempt to find them.


 I could agree with you if this was the FIRST night of their trip to Carlos and Charlies, but this was the kids last night on the Island, surely these kids experienced the Chaos from the bar's closing many times before.

guyWdog


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:00:16 PM
Quote from: "chelsblu"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


Actually I think I remember seeing excerpts of this from WW before today so I don't think it just came out right before broadcast.
DOn't remember the day but you could pull up all posts from memberlist.
It only now looks more like the real thing after Greta's show than before because certain things are now corroborated by NH friends.


I can second that I have seen this email last week.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DAG on June 21, 2005, 11:00:39 PM
Quote from: "mitzid66"
People in hotels do not move room to room.  Girls are pretty particvulat about thier stuff.    Maybe in a dorm, but not a hotel.


Just to add a different view.........I took 15 highschool girls to the beach that same week and believe me, their clothes were everywhere.  Everybody wears everbodies clothes.  I brought back sacks of clothes for them to claim.  They did not seem that particular to me.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:00:50 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


What?? please explain your point here...so I may clarify


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Itawamba on June 21, 2005, 11:00:56 PM
Well, the posting of the email started out with a lie, so everything I read past that was just "whatever".

"I just got this email" "I've had it a couple of days"

Which is it?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 11:01:40 PM
I am sorry I messed up the link before to the Greta/Beth/VDS's meeting from Fox courtesy of teh Political Teen,

http://thepoliticalteen.net/2005/06/21/1758/


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:01:46 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

They looked like the party girls (I know)  they were probably drunk.  When I was on my senior cruise, someone got raped, we were out by the pool and were to drunk to even know until we were questioned.  Then we still didnt know anything, we couldnt remember.  On your senior trip your not suppose to remember.  Or mine anyway.

GuyWdog


I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Yes. Also, timelines with friends stories are not also conflicting with other friends.

Since the day BH landed and found out the information, it has been 1:30, two groups of people, people seeing her with Joran, BH even admitting she was with him. *sigh* I am not flaming etc but I am sorry over time everyone's story is changing. Almost manicured ::ducks for cover:: I am sorry but there's something seriously more wrong now.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:02:01 PM
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


And right now, it's better hearsay than what we've seen.  All this up to this point has been speculation, even by the media somewhat because of Dutch law restricting information. This at least is a look at the possibilities of the other side.


RB agreed....but keep in mind, this is the web..nobody can truly hide!! This is digital technology and EVERYTHING is logged by IP address somewhere...plus other means.

Apologies to all but I'm in the technology industry, and no mail addys, no IP addreses and no domains is the equivilent of writing something up on wordpad and posting by copy and paste same as I'm typing this in a window.

We need verifiable facts!!!


Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  Therefore, your argument is a stalemate:  what she's pasted is what it is. Don't believe it fine, but please don't mention  "facts" when there is really only the fact that Natalee is missing.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:02:03 PM
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 21, 2005, 11:02:32 PM
DT - that CNN film of the Boston group was quite something wasn't it? Did you see the second night when the one girls' parents watched it?

I was recently in Jamaica and saw a bit of the spring break scene there and it was the same - hordes of amazingly drunk kids partying all over the place. I'm sure they were all "good kids" too but the whole idea is to go have a wild time. It really scared me to see the kids on the booze cruises arriving across the water from my hotel - very very drunk and going cliff diving!  

My guess is that something rather mundane but very sad happened in all this and that there are no evil villains or white slavers or drug lords, just those dreadful mistakes that sometimes happen.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:02:38 PM
They looked like the party girls (I know) they were probably drunk. When I was on my senior cruise, someone got raped, we were out by the pool and were to drunk to even know until we were questioned. Then we still didnt know anything, we couldnt remember. On your senior trip your not suppose to remember. Or mine anyway


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:02:41 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.


Do we actually know their stories changed from a FACTUAL source?


Nope but if they did PRESSURE

So all this time when we have been speculating that the pressure had not gotten to them (specifically Joran), to get a confession, it appears it DID! But the pressure (remember Mom VDS said Joran has been questioned for up to 11 hours per day) has not gotten a confession, it has caused a change of stories. Which, based on the ages of the kids, would be very believeable.
"Change the story to what you think the police WANT you to say, and they will let you go home!"



maybe...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 11:02:44 PM
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
How do you know they didn't ask the question? They would probably just assume she was with one of the other friends. Given that a lot of them were probably drinking and partying I really doubt they were that concerned.

Did you happen to catch the cnn special where they showed the group from boston going to carlos and charlies? As soon as they left the bar they had lost all sign of their friends and mada no attempt to find them.


 I could agree with you if this was the FIRST night of their trip to Carlos and Charlies, but this was the kids last night on the Island, surely these kids experienced the Chaos from the bar's closing many times before.

guyWdog


I don't know I think that is stretching it, but I guess we'll just disagree.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:02:54 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


He's not saying he made a confession in jail . He's talking about the rumors that are going around. "We heard a lot of false alarms that she was dead , she was seen with 2 guys , her hair is cut and is red now ,she was in a crackhouse etc, we were arrested and , my car is by the police we confessed to murder and rape, she went in a restaurant to buy food but none of those were true"


Title: So, Beth Holloway has a guilty stripe in her thoughts?
Post by: Whitney on June 21, 2005, 11:03:50 PM
Quote from: "littletxlady"
ELIO  NICOLAAS!!!! He's on the ball!


Sorry...it's this guy you're talking about...forgot to send you the URL:  http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/article_13007.shtml

Amazing...so it's really the dynamic between Beth and Natalee?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 11:03:50 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:04:58 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:05:07 PM
Okee dokey..Let me start by saying that Greta is the Chit....what a show!!!!
Now, have we gotten to the bottom of Wonder woman's email?? sounds sorta credible, since alot from Greta's show was corroborating with the email...hmmmm..
Also, did anyone find it strange,or odd that Nat's friend Frances said, " we did not see her get into that TAXI..."

Help me out guys...Greta has had my attention since 10.....lol


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:05:45 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


June 5th, 4 days before jail.


At the end of the letter he states they think they have found a body, confession, etc....That was when they were in jail


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:05:56 PM
Back to the original story, as depicted in Deepak's e-mail:

What if the trio's original story is true?? What if they picked up the wrong security guards? Someone on here said earlier that guards for the Soul Festival were staying at the Holiday Inn... and that their uniforms were all black.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 11:06:22 PM
Have we ever heard FACTS ( a rarity I know) on how many males from MBHS went on this trip? (both students AND chaperones?)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:06:38 PM
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Well, the posting of the email started out with a lie, so everything I read past that was just "whatever".

"I just got this email" "I've had it a couple of days"

Which is it?



Meaning, I did not get it on 6/5!!  ~sheesh~   to be expected I guess..


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:06:47 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


June 5th, 4 days before jail.


At the end of the letter he states they think they have found a body, confession, etc....That was when they were in jail


The 2 guards were in jail.  The same gossip probably was flowing about them, too.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:06:49 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


Verify what cameras?  At the hotel?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 11:06:57 PM
Coco...

I saw the first night, but not the second.  What happened?  I was rather shocked that the kids seemed to take things so lightly...like they didn't learn something from N's experience.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:06:57 PM
I'm not buying deepak's email.

1. It was after the 3 amigos had been questioned by police the first time and he'd already told the guard he, satish and joran had sat around the pool getting this story together after they found out she was missing.

2. we already know they didn't take her to the Holiday inn because they're not on security cameras, plus he told the guard in jail they never went back there.

3. IF this really is from Deepak, it's his alibi which he's already told the police and is trying to stick to. Doesn't mean it's 100% true. There may be parts which are accurate, but I'm bet the ranch on it that he's lying lying lying.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:06:59 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Greta says Ma VDS says her son says he left NH on the beach.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:07:18 PM
Quote from: "DAG"
Quote from: "mitzid66"
People in hotels do not move room to room.  Girls are pretty particvulat about thier stuff.    Maybe in a dorm, but not a hotel.


Just to add a different view.........I took 15 highschool girls to the beach that same week and believe me, their clothes were everywhere.  Everybody wears everbodies clothes.  I brought back sacks of clothes for them to claim.  They did not seem that particular to me.


Heck, I remember moving from hotel to hotel on spring break. We got run out of one hotel because of too many people in the room, so we just went and found another where more friends were staying. Seems like I remember finally falling asleep in a bathtub....those were the days??? :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:08:15 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


I remember when Greta did her report where she showed us the lighthouse and stuff, she also went to the HI and walked in the lobby.  There were comments about what a big lobby entrance it is and how no one could be dropped off there without being seen because it's so big and open and there are employees in the lobby all night.  They really commented on how big the entrance was and how the cars pull right up to it.  They also looked around showing where cameras are hidden.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:08:20 PM
Quote
What if they picked up the wrong security guards? Someone on here said earlier that guards for the Soul Festival were staying at the Holiday Inn... and that their uniforms were all black.


I would be wary of the assumption that anybody wearing black and carrying a walkie talkie is a security guard.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:08:30 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
I'm not buying deepak's email.

1. It was after the 3 amigos had been questioned by police the first time and he'd already told the guard he, satish and joran had sat around the pool getting this story together after they found out she was missing.

2. we already know they didn't take her to the Holiday inn because they're not on security cameras, plus he told the guard in jail they never went back there.

3. IF this really is from Deepak, it's his alibi which he's already told the police and is trying to stick to. Doesn't mean it's 100% true. There may be parts which are accurate, but I'm bet the ranch on it that he's lying lying lying.


After watching Greta, the email seems more likely to be from Deepak, but I agree it's just setting up his alibi.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 11:08:35 PM
Friend story tells us that Nat met him that night at the Casino.  Group was talking about going out.  He said Sunday night was not exciting.

Said group was talking about going to C and C.  He might or might not have had and specific invitation.  But he would have known that was where they were  headed.

He shows up.

On leaving.

One girl only stayed one hour apparently then came back to the hotel.


The other girls story fits.  Remember that Dash said she was in the last small group--kind of checking to be sure no one was left.  There was a group of students from the school in front of them.  Nat and Joran were between the two groups, behind the others.  They could have left and not have seen Natalee to know she was with Joran.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RIBoy on June 21, 2005, 11:09:41 PM
Newbie here....I've been reading alot of the posts....nice to see so much care and concern for the girl.  it's too hard to read through every post and i have a question/Theory.

I think Joran and Croes are innocent and being held in prison for their own protection?  Not so sure about the other guys but they seem like they know more....possible they are in for their protection also.

I think a boat of smugglers drug/people was in the area and took advantage of all involved and took Natalee.

Joran looks like a punky kid(not uncommon nowadays) but my intuition is innocent.

Croes was told things and now he needs to be protected.

The 2 brothers....I can't get a feel for them yet but I'll keep reading.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:09:41 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Okee dokey..Let me start by saying that Greta is the Chit....what a show!!!!
Now, have we gotten to the bottom of Wonder woman's email?? sounds sorta credible, since alot from Greta's show was corroborating with the email...hmmmm..
Also, did anyone find it strange,or odd that Nat's friend Frances said, " we did not see her get into that TAXI..."

Help me out guys...Greta has had my attention since 10.....lol

Yes, my mouth dropped, I didn't think she was going to correct herself, took her a few. More of the same.... the things that make ya go hmmmmmmmmm


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:10:23 PM
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV. You an argue it all you want but seeing the bridge built on TV tonite, made me tear up.

I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved. It was the first time, I literally saw two people drop their differences and do something more people sould, show some love and compassion.

As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:11:00 PM
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.


GREAT post, don't want it to get lost.  A lot of what he says shows the mens rea factor -- or, as we Americans like to call it, CYA, CYA, CYA -- and trying to CYA before anyone's calling you on it is a sure sign of a guilty mind.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: TG on June 21, 2005, 11:11:03 PM
could someone fill me in on what the e-mail is that everyone is talking about?  just got home from work.  thanks.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 11:11:05 PM
Remember that they say the brothers car looks like the local Taxis.  More than one person has said that.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 11:11:08 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
I don't know...I'm just not buying the e-mail account...just before broadcast of Greta's show and dis-crediting NH...can you say dis-information??? It's an old trick...known to many...

I still would like to see full internet mail headers showing IP and e-mail addresses and domains. Without that data it's ONLY HEARSAY!!!


And right now, it's better hearsay than what we've seen.  All this up to this point has been speculation, even by the media somewhat because of Dutch law restricting information. This at least is a look at the possibilities of the other side.


RB agreed....but keep in mind, this is the web..nobody can truly hide!! This is digital technology and EVERYTHING is logged by IP address somewhere...plus other means.

Apologies to all but I'm in the technology industry, and no mail addys, no IP addreses and no domains is the equivilent of writing something up on wordpad and posting by copy and paste same as I'm typing this in a window.

We need verifiable facts!!!


Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  Therefore, your argument is a stalemate:  what she's pasted is what it is. Don't believe it fine, but please don't mention  "facts" when there is really only the fact that Natalee is missing.


RB..I have no doubts as to your capabilities....thanks. Yes Natalee is missing and that is a tragedy as this whole story gets more twisted as time goes on. Mix in what we see on this BB which is mostly unreliable and then whatever the MSM reports which as we all know is questionable at best. I still go back to my original argument that we need verifable facts of all this data from all parties.

Beyond verifable facts...all we have is speculation...nothing more!!!

Believe me...I want Natalie to come home alive and safe! I have a neice in Birmingham who resembles NH and I shudder to think how I would feel if this was happening in our family.

Thanks for your input...makes me think!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:11:20 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


I remember when Greta did her report where she showed us the lighthouse and stuff, she also went to the HI and walked in the lobby.  There were comments about what a big lobby entrance it is and how no one could be dropped off there without being seen because it's so big and open and there are employees in the lobby all night.  They really commented on how big the entrance was and how the cars pull right up to it.  They also looked around showing where cameras are hidden.


Also, Beth Twitty confirmed there are video cameras at the hotel.  She and her group viewed the tapes within a few hours of arriving in Aruba.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:11:23 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"

At the end of the letter he states they think they have found a body, confession, etc....That was when they were in jail


No, he said there were RUMORS and he lists all the rumors flying around before they were arrested.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:11:30 PM
Quote from: "RIBoy"
Newbie here....I've been reading alot of the posts....nice to see so much care and concern for the girl.  it's too hard to read through every post and i have a question/Theory.

I think Joran and Croes are innocent and being held in prison for their own protection?  Not so sure about the other guys but they seem like they know more....possible they are in for their protection also.

I think a boat of smugglers drug/people was in the area and took advantage of all involved and took Natalee.

Joran looks like a punky kid(not uncommon nowadays) but my intuition is innocent.

Croes was told things and now he needs to be protected.

The 2 brothers....I can't get a feel for them yet but I'll keep reading.



My intuition tells me the same thing abour Joran.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:12:32 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "medleyrelay"
The one thing I find interesting about wonderwoman's/Depack email is this - until tonite on Greta - we did not know that Joran snuk out, and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself - this email does seem to support those two facts - and this email appeared before Greta's show - that to me is rather interesting!


Did he write this in jail??? I should think not??? Otherwise how could he mention the confession that was made in jail, thought she was found???etc


June 5th, 4 days before jail.


At the end of the letter he states they think they have found a body, confession, etc....That was when they were in jail


That't true.  There was never any mention of any confession until the weekend after these 3 were detained.  They have not been out since.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mehill10 on June 21, 2005, 11:12:37 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Okee dokey..Let me start by saying that Greta is the Chit....what a show!!!!
Now, have we gotten to the bottom of Wonder woman's email?? sounds sorta credible, since alot from Greta's show was corroborating with the email...hmmmm..
Also, did anyone find it strange,or odd that Nat's friend Frances said, " we did not see her get into that TAXI..."

Help me out guys...Greta has had my attention since 10.....lol


I think some of MB kids think she might have thought she was getting in a Taxi


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 11:13:02 PM
I for one would hate to think that because of pressure from the United States/FBI/Holloways that these kids have been railroaded and that this entire time, another party is walking around out there with knowledge of either Natalee's murder or kidnapping.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 11:13:59 PM
Quote
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV. You an argue it all you want but seeing the bridge built on TV tonite, made me tear up.

I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved. It was the first time, I literally saw two people drop their differences and do something more people sould, show some love and compassion.

As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.


I agree with you Cali, and actually in Holland we give three  on the cheek
in general.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Another K in Texas on June 21, 2005, 11:14:15 PM
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.  Said that Mom for sure thinks son is innocent.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:14:18 PM
Quote from: "Terry"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Okee dokey..Let me start by saying that Greta is the Chit....what a show!!!!
Now, have we gotten to the bottom of Wonder woman's email?? sounds sorta credible, since alot from Greta's show was corroborating with the email...hmmmm..
Also, did anyone find it strange,or odd that Nat's friend Frances said, " we did not see her get into that TAXI..."

Help me out guys...Greta has had my attention since 10.....lol

Yes, my mouth dropped, I didn't think she was going to correct herself, took her a few. More of the same.... the things that make ya go hmmmmmmmmm


She corrected herself and said car


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:14:54 PM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
I for one would hate to think that because of pressure from the United States/FBI/Holloways that these kids have been railroaded and that this entire time, another party is walking around out there with knowledge of either Natalee's murder or kidnapping.
Me too.

I just don't know what to think anymore.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:15:11 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"

At the end of the letter he states they think they have found a body, confession, etc....That was when they were in jail


No, he said there were RUMORS and he lists all the rumors flying around before they were arrested.


Yes, but there were no rumors of confessions until after the 3 were detained.  There never were rumors of confessions with the security guards, only with Joran after he and Kalpoes were put in jail.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: gaijin on June 21, 2005, 11:15:19 PM
[ and we also heard from Natalee's friend tonite that Nat introduced herself -

I'm sorry..Im catching up....from what two friends do we know that Natalee intorduced herself to J, and not the other way around? is this confirmed by Dash o r others on the trip?


Title: night all
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 11:15:48 PM
well we have gotten a few more pieces.  joren was at mikki d at 11.  dad picked him up.  he had just met natalee at the casino.  he then sneaked out of the house and went to c and c (don't know how).  met Natalee and left with her. (where does satish say they went in the email.)  ended up at Marriott beach, don't know anything from there. room mates were very worried early the next morning and their worries were apparently not acted upon timely.  dad can't remember whther he was home in the morning or if he went to school that day.  He was obviously hard to control.  mom was out of town, dad was not doing a good job of babysitting.  dad is apparently absentee father away a lot at school.  So, i leave it to you all to parse this to death.  I am goint to take a break as this intense focus on one issue is not good for me.  I need some rest and envy some of you your energy.  May lurk awhile but won't post unless inspired to do so.  I think Greta's stunt was overplayed to draw viewers.  Hope we get some more substance from it.  

One point:  Arubans are Dutch citizens who travel on dutch passports.  They are thus Dutch nationals.  The Queen presides over the courtroom.    :roll:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 11:15:53 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
I'm not buying deepak's email.

1. It was after the 3 amigos had been questioned by police the first time and he'd already told the guard he, satish and joran had sat around the pool getting this story together after they found out she was missing.

2. we already know they didn't take her to the Holiday inn because they're not on security cameras, plus he told the guard in jail they never went back there.

3. IF this really is from Deepak, it's his alibi which he's already told the police and is trying to stick to. Doesn't mean it's 100% true. There may be parts which are accurate, but I'm bet the ranch on it that he's lying lying lying.


Touche


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:16:03 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "Terry"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Okee dokey..Let me start by saying that Greta is the Chit....what a show!!!!
Now, have we gotten to the bottom of Wonder woman's email?? sounds sorta credible, since alot from Greta's show was corroborating with the email...hmmmm..
Also, did anyone find it strange,or odd that Nat's friend Frances said, " we did not see her get into that TAXI..."

Help me out guys...Greta has had my attention since 10.....lol

Yes, my mouth dropped, I didn't think she was going to correct herself, took her a few. More of the same.... the things that make ya go hmmmmmmmmm


She corrected herself and said car
Yup, is what my post said, minus that she actually said car.  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:16:39 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


I remember when Greta did her report where she showed us the lighthouse and stuff, she also went to the HI and walked in the lobby.  There were comments about what a big lobby entrance it is and how no one could be dropped off there without being seen because it's so big and open and there are employees in the lobby all night.  They really commented on how big the entrance was and how the cars pull right up to it.  They also looked around showing where cameras are hidden.


Also, Beth Twitty confirmed there are video cameras at the hotel.  She and her group viewed the tapes within a few hours of arriving in Aruba.


We need to figure out where else at the HI she could be dropped off.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rubby on June 21, 2005, 11:17:04 PM
YOU DONT LEAVE A GIRL PASSED OUT ON A BEACH!

IF HE REALLY DID ONLY THAT AND HARM CAME WHICH IT DID THEN HE IS RESPONSIBLE AS WELL!!!!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: air23ac on June 21, 2005, 11:17:06 PM
ok.......if this letter is true......here are some details that may actually support it:

her friends just said on greta that she intoduced herself to joran, just as email stated

steven croes said natalie was dropped off at the HI, just as email stated


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: melrose on June 21, 2005, 11:18:08 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Red"
Some one help me out with this one.

Natalee's presumed 2 close friends just said that Natalee introduced herself to VDS at the black jack table? She is the one who made the introduction? Did I hear that correctly? Or did she do so after he may have said something to her? Would have been a nice follow up Greta, eh?



The friend actually said, "he wasn't flirting or anything" Natalee went up to him....


Wadn't there a post on here about a million words ago about Natalie trying to get cash from an atm machine for about 20 minutes the day before sehe left and was frustrated that she couldn't get any money?  If true the blackjack table scenerio with Joran seems believable


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: JimL on June 21, 2005, 11:18:35 PM
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.




Agree with the strangeness of all 3 points, but especially #3.  Why would he have noticed if there was a camera or not in the lobby??  Who pays attention to that detail??  People are really fishing.....

Also, aggreed on the point of, why would he stress that nothing was against Natalie's will???

Lastly the point where he mentioned that his friend was a straight A student.  Why would he say that??? Strange....

Too many strange things to mention.....not believable, otherwise, it is could be the real "fabricated" story by the boys, which could make it very interesting....because the e-mail seems very rehearsed and if that was the case then the boys compiled this e-mail together (not physically)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Kshe78 on June 21, 2005, 11:18:52 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.


GREAT post, don't want it to get lost.  A lot of what he says shows the mens rea factor -- or, as we Americans like to call it, CYA, CYA, CYA -- and trying to CYA before anyone's calling you on it is a sure sign of a guilty mind.


Thanks - that's exactly what I was trying to say, just didn't do it as succintly as you did.   :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Red on June 21, 2005, 11:19:07 PM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

...
GuyWdog


I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Yes. Also, timelines with friends stories are not also conflicting with other friends.

Since the day BH landed and found out the information, it has been 1:30, two groups of people, people seeing her with Joran, BH even admitting she was with him. *sigh* I am not flaming etc but I am sorry over time everyone's story is changing. Almost manicured ::ducks for cover:: I am sorry but there's something seriously more wrong now.


Agree with CaliGirl on this one. These were supposedly Natalee's best friends? Mrs Red is southern and no way would a friend not look out after their friend. How do your best friends lose track of you?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:19:11 PM
Another point about the email that I noticed, and it may not mean anything, but something I noticed is that in this email Deepak "says" that they went to Joran's home, they sat there and talked for about 15 minutes, then off to C&C.  He does not mention that Joran snuck out and I for one would not sit around talking with my friends at my house for 15 minutes if I were sneaking out.  He also says Joran would not get up and dance with Nat, but the boy interviewed with Dash on FOX said that he saw Joran and Nat dancing.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:19:17 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.


Just playing the Deepak advocate for a sec:

1. I'm sure he was hearing all the rumors and talk that the three raped Natalie, so he is reinforcing the fact that the makeout session between Natalee and Joran was consensual.

2.  This sounds like the version we heard before, that no one got out of the car at the lighthouse.

3.  Again, I'm sure he was hearing the reports that Natalee was not recorded on any hotel cameras, which made the three look very guilty, so he is bolstering his story by saying that there are no cameras in the driveway or lobby.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 11:19:21 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Greta says Ma VDS says her son says he left NH on the beach.

An according to the "alleged" Deepak email, they dropped her off the the HI?  I don't believe anyone!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:19:49 PM
Quote from: "JimL"
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway guys, have to go to sleep.

Good night.

.

Where do we actually KNOW that their stories EVER CHANGED?

They could have let the Guards go to watch them, as they did the Boys'


A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.




Agree with the strangeness of all 3 points, but especially #3.  Why would he have noticed if there was a camera or not in the lobby??  Who pays attention to that detail??  People are really fishing.....

Also, aggreed on the point of, why would he stress that nothing was against Natalie's will???

Lastly the point where he mentioned that his friend was a straight A student.  Why would he say that??? Strange....

Too many strange things to mention.....not believable, otherwise, it is could be the real "fabricated" story by the boys, which could make it very interesting....because the e-mail seems very rehearsed and if that was the case then the boys compiled this e-mail together (not physically)


Becuase I think he is reiterating what he told police, and I'm sure they asked questions like was it against her will?  etc...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:19:57 PM
Quote from: "Terry"
Quote from: "KerinTX"
I for one would hate to think that because of pressure from the United States/FBI/Holloways that these kids have been railroaded and that this entire time, another party is walking around out there with knowledge of either Natalee's murder or kidnapping.
Me too.

I just don't know what to think anymore.


It is a mess, and none of us knows anything - but Beth Holloway Twitty has to know much more than we do.  And she's convinced that these kids know more than what they're admitting. Frankly, so am I.  Their stories changed within a day or so of being taken into custody, and then Joran's changed a day after that. His mom's is different.  Steve Croes' story apparently doesn't match the latest.

I don't buy "pressure" being the reason. Anyone who was innocent over the age of 12 with such a detailed story would know that the truth is the only story you need, no matter what the cops say.  I know this firsthand, but will spare the details of how. :)

 Innocent people probably don't scrub their websites before being taken into custody,  either. All just IMO, of course.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Hagie9 on June 21, 2005, 11:20:07 PM
I certainly am not a troll and all I want to do is to see Natlee come home but.....

Either these boys killed her and they know enough to know not to tell where the body is or....

they didn't do it....

I am so confused.

I'm almost beginning to wonder why (after 3 weeks) young boys wouldn't crack. It almost seems to me that these boys don't know....Like I said, I certainly am not a troll and I DEFINITELY want to see a happy ending to this story but nothing makes sense......

All I wish is that Natalee's mother would be able to bring her daughter home.....no matter what that means....she deserves closure......


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: huntsy on June 21, 2005, 11:20:28 PM
The part of the e mail that scared me the most was when he said he had not been sleeping much. Why not? b/c he was guilty of something?

I think we are not being told all the evidence they have (Police). Let's say they did drop her off and she went for a swim and drowned, then why don't they just let the boys go. It seems clear to me that they know only one scenario could have happended. So what exactly do they have that they can hold the boys. Also WTF can't they find her.

Sorry if the post sounds dumb but holy crap poor Natalee's family must be 100 times more frustrated than me.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 21, 2005, 11:20:28 PM
Amillerwvu - agreed! those Boston kids were there as people were searching for Natalie and they were completely nonchalant about the whole thing. And they were all "good kids" - class prez, etc.

The second night they had the mother and father of the girl who talked about "I was drinking sex on the beach of course, makes you want to have sex on the beach" and who mentioned that she had no idea where her buddy was - you'll remember the one I bet.  So her mom and dad are shown watching the tape - mom looked like the young lady was not going to enjoy her homecoming, dad kept smiling - I couldn't tell whether he was just embarassed or what but he said that she's a great kid, going to good college next year, etc and has a great sense of humour, wouldn't ever do anyting wrong, etc etc.

It was pretty disturbing - and I keep thinking about it as I read comments here about the VDS's being "bad parents".


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 11:21:02 PM
I read earlier news and posting that it was PVDS and his younger son came from Holland that Sunday. Can you imagine you just step off the plane earlier and 7 hours later, all hell breaks loose? Anyway so now its Anita that came from Holland...Someone throw me a bone, these stories changes so often

On Valentijns (Jorans younger brother) site..Tickle..he said..I'm going to Holland..and his friends yelled back...be good in Holland

So I would say it was PVDS and Valentijn who went to Holland. I'm assuming that Valentijn was an undergradute and might not have had extra tests like a senoir (Joran)might have had.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:22:24 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
was dropped off at HI, she would be the victim of a different crime with other suspects


Agreed. But there has not been, to my knowledge any indication that anyone else who was on the trip can corroborate that she was dropped off at the HI or anywhere else. So while the recollections of the other kids may have a strong human interest appeal, I don't see them as relevant to what happened to her after they saw her last.


Maybe arubagirl can swing by the HI and look for cameras and very what is said in the email.


I remember when Greta did her report where she showed us the lighthouse and stuff, she also went to the HI and walked in the lobby.  There were comments about what a big lobby entrance it is and how no one could be dropped off there without being seen because it's so big and open and there are employees in the lobby all night.  They really commented on how big the entrance was and how the cars pull right up to it.  They also looked around showing where cameras are hidden.


Also, Beth Twitty confirmed there are video cameras at the hotel.  She and her group viewed the tapes within a few hours of arriving in Aruba.


We need to figure out where else at the HI she could be dropped off.


Why?  We have no reason to believe she was dropped off in the front, much less at another entrance.  Maybe I missed a part of this discussion, but there seems no apparent reason to introduce another scenario that is not supported by any information available.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RIBoy on June 21, 2005, 11:22:28 PM
Has anyone thought about the possibility that one of the bartenders at CnC slips something into Natlee's drink.....there are several people who are in on it at CnC's and they trail wherever Natalee will be going from there.....All these boys have been used and criminal ring who pulled this off is getting away with this.

Last calls at any bar can be very rowdy and lots of pushing and bumping for the last drink.  Easy for one of them to do something without anyone noticing.  These bartenders all need to be interogated and I've had a strong feeling about that since I heard the story of her leaving there.


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: kuaitzu on June 21, 2005, 11:22:54 PM
I read earlier news and posting that it was PVDS and his younger son came from Holland that Sunday. Can you imagine you just step off the plane earlier and 7 hours later, all hell breaks loose? Anyway so now its Anita that came from Holland...Someone throw me a bone, these stories changes so often

On Valentijns (Jorans younger brother) site..Tickle..he said..I'm going to Holland..and his friends yelled back...be good in Holland

So I would say it was PVDS and Valentijn who went to Holland. I'm assuming that Valentijn was an undergradute and might not have had extra tests like a senoir (Joran)might have had.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:22:59 PM
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Friend story tells us that Nat met him that night at the Casino.  Group was talking about going out.  He said Sunday night was not exciting.

Said group was talking about going to C and C.  He might or might not have had and specific invitation.  But he would have known that was where they were  headed.

He shows up.

On leaving.

One girl only stayed one hour apparently then came back to the hotel.


The other girls story fits.  Remember that Dash said she was in the last small group--kind of checking to be sure no one was left.  There was a group of students from the school in front of them.  Nat and Joran were between the two groups, behind the others.  They could have left and not have seen Natalee to know she was with Joran.


Wait a minute. Didn't Joran go to the soul festival on the beach that night, too? Remember we found that website of his with all the pictures of the soul festival which he'd posted after Natalee disappeared? The ones where he just kept shouting down women's lowcut tops? Why would the email make it sound like Joran was at home the whole night when he'd been at the soul festival? If he knew he was going to hook up at CnC's, he wouldn't go home just to come back. Doesn't make sense.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:23:20 PM
ok, i am ducking for cover..please dont attack me ok? I am about, for one second, to become someone i have often bashed...
I know that Nats friends are just kids by all accounts, and that they have never been on national TV, interviewed, gone through this, etc..
BUT, did anyone else, besides me, find it strange that they were almost laughing tonight?Big smiles...almost evasive?
If this were my best friend, I would be crying at the mention of her name...
I have all the respect of the MB kids..sometimes, however, things just seem odd with their demeanor...except for Dash..lol
<wiping tomatoes off face and other unmentionables that were just flung at me>


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:23:47 PM
Quote from: "RB"

Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  


I don't work for a more esteemed technology institution but I do work in the IT field.
If your using Outlook as your email client and you click View-Options I GUARANTEE it will list all ip addresses that the email took to get to you.
Unless this guy was doing ip spoofing (which I highly doubt) it will list the ip addresses so you are incorrect RB.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:24:37 PM
Quote
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.


Well, I kind of wonder if there might be a little conflict there in the household - while Anita was in Holland, Paulus (maybe as is his wont) was a bit less scupulous about Joran's comings and goings, as he said that Joran was not allowed to go out late, or something to that effect, although when Natalee's parents went to his house originally he said Joran was at the casino.

Anita might have spoken to him about that, and she also mentioned her husband's frequent absence in relation to Joran's anger management thing.

So there may be some fairly common domestic fluffles with mom trying to hold down the fort and set rules and not getting all the support from dad she would like to, and now this happens...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: AZsunny on June 21, 2005, 11:25:05 PM
I missed the link to the email.  can someone please provide?  

Also,  I felt the friends of Natalee were very intimadated by the cameras and being on TV,  but some of you so different people than i saw!

Also the girl that said she didn't see her getting into the "taxi" tried to correct her self, but she was cut off by the end of the interview.  she was I believe, going to say I meant car.  she said "i meant...."


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Itawamba on June 21, 2005, 11:25:11 PM
Bad news for our Texas cowboys tonight--they're NOT in the air.  Nothing has worked out--volunteers need to come from 7 states, so air travel is proving more complex.

Good news is that they hope to be able to leave Friday for Aruba--also hoping one of the corporate planes contacted can at least send Tim Miller or other main person and a few more to get started before the bulk can be transported with sonar and dogs.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:25:17 PM
Quote from: "writenow
Wait a minute. Didn't Joran go to the soul festival on the beach that night, too? Remember we found that website of his with all the pictures of the soul festival which he'd posted after Natalee disappeared? The ones where he just kept shouting down women's lowcut tops? Why would the email make it sound like Joran was at home the whole night when he'd been at the soul festival? If he knew he was going to hook up at CnC's, he wouldn't go home just to come back. Doesn't make sense.


He had to be home by 11 because it was a school night and that was the rule. But he snuck out later.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:26:15 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, i am ducking for cover..please dont attack me ok? I am about, for one second, to become someone i have often bashed...
I know that Nats friends are just kids by all accounts, and that they have never been on national TV, interviewed, gone through this, etc..
BUT, did anyone else, besides me, find it strange that they were almost laughing tonight?Big smiles...almost evasive?
If this were my best friend, I would be crying at the mention of her name...
I have all the respect of the MB kids..sometimes, however, things just seem odd with their demeanor...except for Dash..lol
<wiping tomatoes off face and other unmentionables that were just flung at me>


I think they were probably very nervous about appearing on TV.  They certainly didn't seem as "matter of fact" and as prepared as Dash has in her interviews.  I thought they look nervous and unprepared.  Maybe that isn't even the word for it...how about less mature than Dash.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lainey on June 21, 2005, 11:26:28 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
THe ISA students are picked up by their own bus, so perhaps it was Joran's responsibility to be ready when the bus came.

Also, that bus must have come damn early, if school starts at 8.30, with all the traffic from Montanja to San Nicolaas.


Why would Joran and his brother take a bus if their mother teaches at the school???


My Mom worked as a TA for two years and I still rode the bus and that was in elementary.  Had to be with my buds!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: HannieC on June 21, 2005, 11:26:39 PM
G`night all, now i`m having a headache :?

see y`all later byee


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 11:26:41 PM
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Lausa on June 21, 2005, 11:27:01 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:27:01 PM
Quote from: "RIBoy"
Has anyone thought about the possibility that one of the bartenders at CnC slips something into Natlee's drink.....there are several people who are in on it at CnC's and they trail wherever Natalee will be going from there.....All these boys have been used and criminal ring who pulled this off is getting away with this.

Last calls at any bar can be very rowdy and lots of pushing and bumping for the last drink.  Easy for one of them to do something without anyone noticing.  These bartenders all need to be interogated and I've had a strong feeling about that since I heard the story of her leaving there.


Bartenders have about an hours worth of work after closing time, at least here in the USA they do -- glass cleaning, restocking, cleaning.  If one scooted out right away and left the others to do the grunt work, it wouldn't go unnoticed.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:27:03 PM
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Bad news for our Texas cowboys tonight--they're NOT in the air.  Nothing has worked out--volunteers need to come from 7 states, so air travel is proving more complex.

Good news is that they hope to be able to leave Friday for Aruba--also hoping one of the corporate planes contacted can at least send Tim Miller or other main person and a few more to get started before the bulk can be transported with sonar and dogs.



awww, man...and i was waiting on that..wanted to wake up in th a.m. and find they were there and searching :cry:


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:27:11 PM
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
I read earlier news and posting that it was PVDS and his younger son came from Holland that Sunday. Can you imagine you just step off the plane earlier and 7 hours later, all hell breaks loose? Anyway so now its Anita that came from Holland...Someone throw me a bone, these stories changes so often

On Valentijns (Jorans younger brother) site..Tickle..he said..I'm going to Holland..and his friends yelled back...be good in Holland

So I would say it was PVDS and Valentijn who went to Holland. I'm assuming that Valentijn was an undergradute and might not have had extra tests like a senoir (Joran)might have had.


No, I think maybe valentijn was going to holland for the summer. maybe to stay with relatives. why would he cut out of school too when he also had exams?
I thought I had read that Paul v.d. sloot had been in holland on business and was just getting back. but it sounded like he'd gone alone. and i also read that he was gone for most of 5 years while he was getting training in the netherlands. maybe that's where joran got out of control. maybe he started seeing himself as the head of the household.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:27:24 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"

Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  


I don't work for a more esteemed technology institution but I do work in the IT field.
If your using Outlook as your email client and you click View-Options I GUARANTEE it will list all ip addresses that the email took to get to you.
Unless this guy was doing ip spoofing (which I highly doubt) it will list the ip addresses so you are incorrect RB.


Yes, you can choose the option to view "headers".  I use Thunderbird but Outlook is the same...even Yahoo and other free email clients offer the option.  Once you find the header you can view the ip numbers etc. You can look them up easily.


Title: Please tell me where to begin .... Yall move to fast :)
Post by: Kristy on June 21, 2005, 11:27:32 PM
Hi,

I just got on here and Im reading about a letter.  Can someone plz direct me to the very beginning of the posts about a letter.  Should I start at the beginning of #16 or before.

This forum moves so fast.  I wish someone was here to do a daily recap of all rumors and news that were posted on a daily basis.  That would be oh so helpful.   :D

'Preciate it   8)

Kristy


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:27:34 PM
On Valentijn's girlfriend's blog, she often mentions talking with Joran on the bus.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: sailorsmoon on June 21, 2005, 11:27:40 PM
Quote from: "JimL"
Quote from: "kshe78"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "arubagirl"
IF the letter is Deepak's, why the hell did their stories change?

Anyway
A few points/questions from the email:

1.  He mentioned that when VDS and NH were in the backseat that he noticed that they were kissing, etc.  and he specifically said "nothing against Natalees will." This seems like an odd thing to mention, why would one assume it was against her will, since by his account she had decided to go with them.

2.  "when i arrived at the lighthouse i said well here is the lighthouse they did not pay attention to me , so my brother said lets return (i did not stop anywhere not for a min only trafficlights)"   I'm confused here.  It sounds as if he is saying that they just sat in the car at the lighthouse, but it also sounds as if they left, then came back to get them.

3.  ."(holiday inn has no cameras in the driveway or lobby)"  Interesting statement.  We know that this is not true now, but if they (the boys) thought that, it would explain why they thought it best to say they returned her there, thinking that there was no way to actually verify the story.

He's just so detailed in his account that it leads me to believe that this was, in fact, a made up story.  Much information since then has made it seem like this was the original story but that it's changed.  However, if he wasn't hiding something, WHY would they have this great, detailed story.




Agree with the strangeness of all 3 points, but especially #3.  Why would he have noticed if there was a camera or not in the lobby??  Who pays attention to that detail??  People are really fishing.....

Also, aggreed on the point of, why would he stress that nothing was against Natalie's will???

Lastly the point where he mentioned that his friend was a straight A student.  Why would he say that??? Strange....

Too many strange things to mention.....not believable, otherwise, it is could be the real "fabricated" story by the boys, which could make it very interesting....because the e-mail seems very rehearsed and if that was the case then the boys compiled this e-mail together (not physically)


This is an interesting e-mail.  Some rings like a true account, but some parts are awkward.  If it is real and it was written AFTER these guys were questionned by police, that might explain why they go into detail about the cameras and the girls "will."  Maybe they are using some of the language that was repeated in the media. Or it is simply a HOAX.  Not a really bad one.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:28:02 PM
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:28:17 PM
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 21, 2005, 11:28:58 PM
Whodunit - the travel agents who sell these graduation trips to the kids and parents here in the US where the drinking age is 21 mention that they provide open bars and that no one cards in Aruba.

Looks like a similar issue to me - and now I'll duck the tomatoes.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:29:17 PM
Quote from: "Red"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "DT"
Quote from: "GuyWdog"
Quote
Red - Wrote---"Where was the Greta question of why were not you worried when she did not come home that night? These were her roomates and best friends, right?"


I agree Totally. this does NOT add up. So her friends see her at the closing of the Bar with Joran, and they they say THEY WOULD NEVER let her Leave alone wiith him. But why did they?

 And More IMPORTANTLY wjhy did they Not do anything when she didnt come home that night? That does NOT add up. lots of explaining to do from someone. We are most likely Not geting the True Story here. Anyone would Have to admit that there are way too many inconsistancies in these accounts of what happened that night.

...
GuyWdog


I thought they both said that they didn't see her at the closing of the bar. One said she wasn't there and the other said she left an hour earlier.


Yes. Also, timelines with friends stories are not also conflicting with other friends.

Since the day BH landed and found out the information, it has been 1:30, two groups of people, people seeing her with Joran, BH even admitting she was with him. *sigh* I am not flaming etc but I am sorry over time everyone's story is changing. Almost manicured ::ducks for cover:: I am sorry but there's something seriously more wrong now.


Agree with CaliGirl on this one. These were supposedly Natalee's best friends? Mrs Red is southern and no way would a friend not look out after their friend. How do your best friends lose track of you?


I agree with you Red.

I do understand (moreso from making so many friends from all over the US and wolrd on this board) that where I live things may also be different than everywhere else in the US. I will say this, I have always, cut back my drinks, watched my friends, mostly been the designated driver so I knew/know my friends return home safely. I have even been known to leave with a drunk friend who wanted to leave with a guy she just met for a party and make sure she returns home even if at 4am. I am also the girl at the bar, when friends are drunk, who has no problem whipping a high heel shoe off in a heart beat if a male so much as inappropiately touches a friend without warrant.

Most know I already keep an open line on my phone to go pick up drunk friends at any hour.

Maybe I am weird but I never let my friends our of my sight or let them leave my sight until I have them at their door when they are drunk.

Sorry, I am angry, hurt and disappointed right now in what I just heard/saw. Everyone has been slamming the suspects and their stories and now we have just as many from the victims friends. Although this does not change that Natalee didn't deserve anything to happen but I am down right speechless and rambling.. going to the loft


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:29:38 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"

Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  


I don't work for a more esteemed technology institution but I do work in the IT field.
If your using Outlook as your email client and you click View-Options I GUARANTEE it will list all ip addresses that the email took to get to you.
Unless this guy was doing ip spoofing (which I highly doubt) it will list the ip addresses so you are incorrect RB.


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:29:45 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, i am ducking for cover..please dont attack me ok? I am about, for one second, to become someone i have often bashed...
I know that Nats friends are just kids by all accounts, and that they have never been on national TV, interviewed, gone through this, etc..
BUT, did anyone else, besides me, find it strange that they were almost laughing tonight?Big smiles...almost evasive?
If this were my best friend, I would be crying at the mention of her name...
I have all the respect of the MB kids..sometimes, however, things just seem odd with their demeanor...except for Dash..lol
<wiping tomatoes off face and other unmentionables that were just flung at me>


I would think they would be pretty dry by now.


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: Itawamba on June 21, 2005, 11:29:49 PM
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
On Valentijns (Jorans younger brother) site..Tickle..he said..I'm going to Holland..and his friends yelled back...be good in Holland

So I would say it was PVDS and Valentijn who went to Holland. I'm assuming that Valentijn was an undergradute and might not have had extra tests like a senoir (Joran)might have had.


There's an even younger brother than that, too.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:30:32 PM
Quote from: "Hagie9"
I certainly am not a troll and all I want to do is to see Natlee come home but.....

Either these boys killed her and they know enough to know not to tell where the body is or....

they didn't do it....

I am so confused.

I'm almost beginning to wonder why (after 3 weeks) young boys wouldn't crack. It almost seems to me that these boys don't know....Like I said, I certainly am not a troll and I DEFINITELY want to see a happy ending to this story but nothing makes sense......

All I wish is that Natalee's mother would be able to bring her daughter home.....no matter what that means....she deserves closure......


I don't think you're a troll just because you are mature enough to think for yourself and question rumor and speculation -- even if, (hold on let me put on my kevlar) it means that they might actually not have anything to crack.


Title: Paul in Holland, Anita in Aruba
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 11:31:03 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.


Well, I kind of wonder if there might be a little conflict there in the household - while Anita was in Holland, Paulus (maybe as is his wont) was a bit less scupulous about Joran's comings and goings, as he said that Joran was not allowed to go out late, or something to that effect, although when Natalee's parents went to his house originally he said Joran was at the casino.

Anita might have spoken to him about that, and she also mentioned her husband's frequent absence in relation to Joran's anger management thing.

So there may be some fairly common domestic fluffles with mom trying to hold down the fort and set rules and not getting all the support from dad she would like to, and now this happens...


Anita was in Aruba, it was Paul that lef to Holland.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:31:15 PM
Quote
did anyone else, besides me, find it strange that they were almost laughing tonight?


not really. Greta was in Aruba, they were in Alabama, so they were being interviewed by a person on a monitor, questions in their earpieces, possibly a time delay, and as you point out, these girls are not professional spokesteens, they are just regular schoolgirls in a very extraordinary situation.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:31:16 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Quote
Although we are almost of the hook


Hmmmm.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:32:01 PM
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:32:07 PM
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Atlmetroguy on June 21, 2005, 11:32:10 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"

Both absolut and I work for one of the more esteemed technology institutions in the US, as Red and Tom can tell you.  Even if you had the headers from this forwarded email, you would not be able to trace the IP's all the way back to its original source, unless you forensically dissected each hard drive along the way, and there's no guarentee you'd get what you needed.  


I don't work for a more esteemed technology institution but I do work in the IT field.
If your using Outlook as your email client and you click View-Options I GUARANTEE it will list all ip addresses that the email took to get to you.
Unless this guy was doing ip spoofing (which I highly doubt) it will list the ip addresses so you are incorrect RB.


Thank You!! My point exactly!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 11:32:13 PM
Yeah, except that his dad is a COURT OFFICIAL, no?  You'd think he'd make HIS kids obey the laws, no?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:32:13 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Title: Re: Paul in Holland, Anita in Aruba
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:32:23 PM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.


Well, I kind of wonder if there might be a little conflict there in the household - while Anita was in Holland, Paulus (maybe as is his wont) was a bit less scupulous about Joran's comings and goings, as he said that Joran was not allowed to go out late, or something to that effect, although when Natalee's parents went to his house originally he said Joran was at the casino.

Anita might have spoken to him about that, and she also mentioned her husband's frequent absence in relation to Joran's anger management thing.

So there may be some fairly common domestic fluffles with mom trying to hold down the fort and set rules and not getting all the support from dad she would like to, and now this happens...


Anita was in Aruba, it was Paul that lef to Holland.


So you're saying ANita's lying? I'm confused


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 11:32:43 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Another point about the email that I noticed, and it may not mean anything, but something I noticed is that in this email Deepak "says" that they went to Joran's home, they sat there and talked for about 15 minutes, then off to C&C.  He does not mention that Joran snuck out and I for one would not sit around talking with my friends at my house for 15 minutes if I were sneaking out.  He also says Joran would not get up and dance with Nat, but the boy interviewed with Dash on FOX said that he saw Joran and Nat dancing.


i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:33:16 PM
Quote
Anita was in Aruba, it was Paul that lef to Holland.


Paulus may be away more often than Anita would like, but on the night that Natalee disappeared, it was Anita who was in Holland, and Paulus was at home.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:33:29 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.


Well, I kind of wonder if there might be a little conflict there in the household - while Anita was in Holland, Paulus (maybe as is his wont) was a bit less scupulous about Joran's comings and goings, as he said that Joran was not allowed to go out late, or something to that effect, although when Natalee's parents went to his house originally he said Joran was at the casino.

Anita might have spoken to him about that, and she also mentioned her husband's frequent absence in relation to Joran's anger management thing.

So there may be some fairly common domestic fluffles with mom trying to hold down the fort and set rules and not getting all the support from dad she would like to, and now this happens...


OK. Have I missed an earlier post with confirmation? How do we know Anita was in Holland then? Did she say that?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:33:40 PM
THANK YOU, Wonder Woman. I believe the e-mails are real.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: air23ac on June 21, 2005, 11:34:05 PM
i have been reading these boards toooo much...i am not even sure who to believe anymore...this is a total mystery. i am confused


i think I AM going to get a lawyer!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:34:08 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Another point about the email that I noticed, and it may not mean anything, but something I noticed is that in this email Deepak "says" that they went to Joran's home, they sat there and talked for about 15 minutes, then off to C&C.  He does not mention that Joran snuck out and I for one would not sit around talking with my friends at my house for 15 minutes if I were sneaking out.  He also says Joran would not get up and dance with Nat, but the boy interviewed with Dash on FOX said that he saw Joran and Nat dancing.


i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


He is a judge in training.  Maybe Joran just told kids he was a judge.


Title: Re: Facts sux
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:34:15 PM
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Quote from: "kuaitzu"
On Valentijns (Jorans younger brother) site..Tickle..he said..I'm going to Holland..and his friends yelled back...be good in Holland

So I would say it was PVDS and Valentijn who went to Holland. I'm assuming that Valentijn was an undergradute and might not have had extra tests like a senoir (Joran)might have had.


There's an even younger brother than that, too.


I thought they said the mother went to Holland.  Is that who you mean?  I thought her name was Anita? Wrong?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:34:23 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 21, 2005, 11:34:39 PM
Quote from: "air23ac"
i have been reading these boards toooo much...i am not even sure who to believe anymore...this is a total mystery. i am confused


i think I AM going to get a lawyer!!!!!!!!!!!!!


lol.  Maybe we all need to "lawyer up"!   :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: amillerwvu on June 21, 2005, 11:35:00 PM
Quote from: "AZsunny"
I missed the link to the email.  can someone please provide?  

Also,  I felt the friends of Natalee were very intimadated by the cameras and being on TV,  but some of you so different people than i saw!

Also the girl that said she didn't see her getting into the "taxi" tried to correct her self, but she was cut off by the end of the interview.  she was I believe, going to say I meant car.  she said "i meant...."


It took me a while to go back and find it.  Click on this link and scroll almost a quarter of the way down.  You probably already found it by now :?
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/Discussion/viewtopic.php?t=201&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=680


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:35:06 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
Gretta senses a difference in the Mom and the Dad.


Well, I kind of wonder if there might be a little conflict there in the household - while Anita was in Holland, Paulus (maybe as is his wont) was a bit less scupulous about Joran's comings and goings, as he said that Joran was not allowed to go out late, or something to that effect, although when Natalee's parents went to his house originally he said Joran was at the casino.

Anita might have spoken to him about that, and she also mentioned her husband's frequent absence in relation to Joran's anger management thing.

So there may be some fairly common domestic fluffles with mom trying to hold down the fort and set rules and not getting all the support from dad she would like to, and now this happens...


OK. Have I missed an earlier post with confirmation? How do we know Anita was in Holland then? Did she say that?


THink so . It's From Greta's show.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:35:54 PM
Quote
Did she say that?


According to Greta's account of the meeting between Natalee's mom and the VDS family, yes.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:36:03 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Uhhhh, how do we know that's why they are holding him?  Has this been confirmed?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 11:36:09 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.

So WW....are you Betty?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:36:10 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"


I agree with you Red.

I do understand (moreso from making so many friends from all over the US and wolrd on this board) that where I live things may also be different than everywhere else in the US. I will say this, I have always, cut back my drinks, watched my friends, mostly been the designated driver so I knew/know my friends return home safely. I have even been known to leave with a drunk friend who wanted to leave with a guy she just met for a party and make sure she returns home even if at 4am. I am also the girl at the bar, when friends are drunk, who has no problem whipping a high heel shoe off in a heart beat if a male so much as inappropiately touches a friend without warrant.

Most know I already keep an open line on my phone to go pick up drunk friends at any hour.

Maybe I am weird but I never let my friends our of my sight or let them leave my sight until I have them at their door when they are drunk.

Sorry, I am angry, hurt and disappointed right now in what I just heard/saw. Everyone has been slamming the suspects and their stories and now we have just as many from the victims friends. Although this does not change that Natalee didn't deserve anything to happen but I am down right speechless and rambling.. going to the loft


You seem to be a great friend. That is wonderful, hats off to you!! HUGS!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RichinTx on June 21, 2005, 11:36:25 PM
That email is a bunch of bullcrap. How conveniently it covers all the things we are wondering about.  It was obviously written by someone else in an attempt to stir up some shit.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:36:40 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.

So WW....are you Betty?
:shock:  :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:36:54 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


So one of the 3 people being held told the police, talk to croes, he saw us drop off Natalie and he said yes???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:37:04 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Thank you Nancy.
I do not cry. I am a tuff as nails kind of girl but this still has me in tears. How many people (none I can think of) come together and treat each other with so much respect and realize, they both have feelings and hurt.

If nothing ever get solved, I can at least remember the first moment of two truly classy people being human. One positive things has come about out of so many negatives.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:37:50 PM
and the last one.....

2 days prior to arrest, correct?

Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 23:33:21 +0000


 
How is everything there. Well they did not say anything yet about the bloody T -shirt. (she asked about the bloody mattress report)
But we are fine, everything goed normal. The only problem was that yesterday there were like 30 reporters at my friends gate. They thought we fled the country , what is ridiculous why would we leave,they were there for like 45 min but my friend stayed in his room did not come out the parents were talking to them they wanted to know my adress thank god they don't know it .
As for the guards i don't know anything yet about them did said they would decide today what they would do with them if they would charge them or something did not understand that part, and yes its in my statement that i am willing to try id the guard. We told the police about the guard so i think that helped the police a lot . But for now she is just vanished i don't understand how she could vanish like this .I never saw this before in my life , this same girl was sitting in my car spoke to me and now she is just lost.But anyways i'm going now , if i have any further information i will let you know, i was planning to go to vacation 30 th of june but if this is not solved i can kiss that vacation goodbye. Lets hope she will be found soon and found well
 
 
Take care :
 
Deepak


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 11:37:54 PM
So did WW post the full version of the email?  I read the one on page 36 and it didn't look like anything we didn't already know (at least in terms of the night in question).  I don't see why anyone cares if this came from deepak or not, their doesn't seem to be anything to important in there.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:38:19 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Uhhhh, how do we know that's why they are holding him?  Has this been confirmed?


Sorry, CNN reported that earlier today, so it's "confirmed" (as far as you can trust the MSM!)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:38:28 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 11:38:30 PM
Maybe this "email" is just being run past Monkeys so we can clean up all the flaws. . . (jk). :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 11:38:43 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Wait a second....... Did SC say that he believed the 3 boys dropped her off at the Holiday Inn or that he witnessed them dropping her off>  Just checking my memory.  And I think the answer to this in unofficial as well.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Itawamba on June 21, 2005, 11:38:56 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


I wondered the same thing.  Deepak knows Paul and has been around him--why would he think that Paul is a judge, when he's not?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:39:30 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Thank you Nancy.
I do not cry. I am a tuff as nails kind of girl but this still has me in tears. How many people (none I can think of) come together and treat each other with so much respect and realize, they both have feelings and hurt.

If nothing ever get solved, I can at least remember the first moment of two truly classy people being human. One positive things has come about out of so many negatives.


Cali,
I was really touched by anitas genuine look of caring tonight..i thought that was exactly what i needed to see....
no matter what has happened, who is to blame, etc etc...you cannot deny, from that piece, that there are two families in pain....
Now with that said, where is kerin??


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:39:41 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"

So WW....are you Betty?



No I really am not, is a friend of mine.....horrified as you can imagine.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 11:40:19 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
and the last one.....

2 days prior to arrest, correct?

Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 23:33:21 +0000


 
How is everything there. Well they did not say anything yet about the bloody T -shirt. (she asked about the bloody mattress report)
But we are fine, everything goed normal. The only problem was that yesterday there were like 30 reporters at my friends gate. They thought we fled the country , what is ridiculous why would we leave,they were there for like 45 min but my friend stayed in his room did not come out the parents were talking to them they wanted to know my adress thank god they don't know it .
As for the guards i don't know anything yet about them did said they would decide today what they would do with them if they would charge them or something did not understand that part, and yes its in my statement that i am willing to try id the guard. We told the police about the guard so i think that helped the police a lot . But for now she is just vanished i don't understand how she could vanish like this .I never saw this before in my life , this same girl was sitting in my car spoke to me and now she is just lost.But anyways i'm going now , if i have any further information i will let you know, i was planning to go to vacation 30 th of june but if this is not solved i can kiss that vacation goodbye. Lets hope she will be found soon and found well
 
 
Take care :
 
Deepak


I'll ask again......are you BETTY?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 11:40:44 PM
Has anybody read this story? :roll:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/ontiveros/cst-edt-sue111.html


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:41:19 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 


I thought her mother was crying and the step father cursed at them that night they came to Jorans house
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:41:23 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
That email is a bunch of bullcrap. How conveniently it covers all the things we are wondering about.  It was obviously written by someone else in an attempt to stir up some shit.



I have no reason to stir up shit(as you say)

just tired of keeping it to myself....it really hit home for us!! and we are in US!!  It's a small world isn't it!?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:41:29 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 21, 2005, 11:41:30 PM
From CNN:

A fourth person, Steve Croes, a 26-year-old party boat DJ, was arrested Friday.

All four face accusations of murder and kidnapping, a spokeswoman for the prosecutor's office said.

Croes initially was questioned only as a witness, two law enforcement sources told CNN.

At the time, he allegedly corroborated the version of events told by Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoes, who said they dropped Holloway off at the Holiday Inn where she was staying, the sources said.

But police said their story fell apart under questioning and that no evidence has been found to show that the girl ever returned to her hotel.

That and the fact one of them named Croes led authorities to detain him as a suspect, the two law enforcement sources said.

Croes is now cooperating with authorities, the sources said.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/21/aruba.holloway/index.html


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 21, 2005, 11:41:52 PM
Quote from: "GutFeeling"
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Wait a second....... Did SC say that he believed the 3 boys dropped her off at the Holiday Inn or that he witnessed them dropping her off>  Just checking my memory.  And I think the answer to this in unofficial as well.


That doesn't reall make sense.  He went in for questioning last thursday, and was arrested friday.  If he corroborated their initial story then why did they wait so long to arrest him?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: JimL on June 21, 2005, 11:42:51 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
and the last one.....

2 days prior to arrest, correct?

Date: Tue, 07 Jun 2005 23:33:21 +0000


 
How is everything there. Well they did not say anything yet about the bloody T -shirt. (she asked about the bloody mattress report)
But we are fine, everything goed normal. The only problem was that yesterday there were like 30 reporters at my friends gate. They thought we fled the country , what is ridiculous why would we leave,they were there for like 45 min but my friend stayed in his room did not come out the parents were talking to them they wanted to know my adress thank god they don't know it .
As for the guards i don't know anything yet about them did said they would decide today what they would do with them if they would charge them or something did not understand that part, and yes its in my statement that i am willing to try id the guard. We told the police about the guard so i think that helped the police a lot . But for now she is just vanished i don't understand how she could vanish like this .I never saw this before in my life , this same girl was sitting in my car spoke to me and now she is just lost.But anyways i'm going now , if i have any further information i will let you know, i was planning to go to vacation 30 th of june but if this is not solved i can kiss that vacation goodbye. Lets hope she will be found soon and found well
 
 
Take care :
 
Deepak



Mouth just dropped :o  :o  :o


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: golden on June 21, 2005, 11:43:01 PM
Actually I think I remember seeing excerpts of this from WW before today so I don't think it just came out right before broadcast.[/quote]

I don't post often.  To much drama in the house for me.  But WW has posted parts of this Email in other threads before tonight.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 21, 2005, 11:43:18 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:43:23 PM
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 11:43:33 PM
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.

So WW....are you Betty?


can someone remind me
which brother does mrs. twitty say
she met at jorans/ beating chest guy?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:43:53 PM
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


I wondered the same thing.  Deepak knows Paul and has been around him--why would he think that Paul is a judge, when he's not?


I'm a legal assistant and my kids have told their friends I was an attorney...completely by mistake when they were young and didn't know better.  Judge-in-training/Judge...to kids, what's the difference?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: klaasend on June 21, 2005, 11:43:58 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.

Are you saying you got them also?  Are you also a good friend of Betty?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:44:04 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.

I was under the impression that WonderWoman received them.
Unless we can see the header information there is now way you can verify the origin.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:44:34 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


He heard this, he did not say he had talked to the networks. Ill bet Dario does pay for info, why wouldn't the world bigger than him.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:44:55 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
THANK YOU, Wonder Woman. I believe the e-mails are real.


Yeah right!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:45:33 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Maybe this "email" is just being run past Monkeys so we can clean up all the flaws. . . (jk). :wink:



tee hee


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:45:40 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: columbo on June 21, 2005, 11:45:44 PM
Quote from: "RichinTx"
That email is a bunch of bullcrap. How conveniently it covers all the things we are wondering about.  It was obviously written by someone else in an attempt to stir up some shit.


Agreed....

Who is Wonder Woman and why is she receiving emails from one of the suspects? If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police). I'm sure the FBI could validate them.  Most of the information in the email checks out the boys story and what we only learned today from PVDS. Also, the security guards would need to be questioned again.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: katya on June 21, 2005, 11:45:50 PM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.

So WW....are you Betty?


can someone remind me
which brother does mrs. twitty say
she met at jorans/ beating chest guy?


Beating chest guy is joran, i think..


Title: asleep at the beach
Post by: iquitos on June 21, 2005, 11:46:06 PM
so mrs n/d s says to greta and beth joran left natalee sleeping on the Marriott? beach.  Hoe did they get there?  it is possible that some other shark at C&C targetted Natelee and drugged her in hopes of taking her from the bar and Joran showed up unexpectedly picked her up drunk and drugged nearly comatose by the time they reached the lighthouse.  nothing adds up.  If Joran was picked up at 11 ar mikkie d he would have been able to clean up and get out by 12, so deepak's 12:20 eta sounds right.  

Guess we will have to await the trial unless Beth gets Bush to send in the WMD search team to find Natalee.   Yuk


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 21, 2005, 11:46:10 PM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "Another K in Texas"
Jorans father looks destroyed, not attogant.

To me at least.

So much pain for both families.

Joran supposedly snuck out.


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.



Well, I thought about it at the time Greta said it and I thought about my ex-husband and what he would be like if I were out of town.  My kids are younger, but if they were older he probably wouldn't be real great about making sure they got up and probably wouldn't remember which morning was which and wouldn't be able to seperate one morning from another.  In my experience, and only MINE (not implying that all men are absent minded), men are just not as good at that sort of thing and don't have the memory about that stuff that women do.  I guess I can find his story believable.  Not sure I do believe it, but I can see a man not really knowing for sure.


i think he would remember if a desperate women was at his door looking for her child....


You have a point, he may remember waking Joran up, but may really have no clue when and if Joran left for school.  And maybe he didn't even wake him up but doesn't want to say that he didn't wake him up and make sure he got to school because momma VDS might get upset or whole world will think "what kind of father forgets to wake up their son and get them off to school?"  He may have no idea if Joran was home in the AM or whether or not he went to school.


WHAT !!!!!!  Hes old enough to drink, gamble and drive. Has his own apt, and has to have a parent WAKE him up for school.
Just thinking. Joran seems to come and go and do as he pleases. Yet, he keeps his grades up, plays great tennis. Tutors other kids in his school. Im sure he was far from perfect but he appeares to have been able to keep it together. Too bad he had to screw up and get himself in this mess.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chloe2 on June 21, 2005, 11:46:36 PM
Quote from: "writenow"
[.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING![/quote]

Not for the news. . . but there are plenty of other tabloid type shows that probably would,indeed, pay for interviews.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:46:37 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, i am ducking for cover..please dont attack me ok? I am about, for one second, to become someone i have often bashed...
I know that Nats friends are just kids by all accounts, and that they have never been on national TV, interviewed, gone through this, etc..
BUT, did anyone else, besides me, find it strange that they were almost laughing tonight?Big smiles...almost evasive?
If this were my best friend, I would be crying at the mention of her name...
I have all the respect of the MB kids..sometimes, however, things just seem odd with their demeanor...except for Dash..lol
<wiping tomatoes off face and other unmentionables that were just flung at me>


I would think they would be pretty dry by now.


A little like Stepford kids..not much compassion, acts younger than their years, maybe that is why they were too young to handle such a trip!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: GutFeeling on June 21, 2005, 11:47:15 PM
Quote from: "inspector_detector"
Has anybody read this story? :roll:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/ontiveros/cst-edt-sue111.html

Apparently they can't afford fact checkers at the Sun Times.
Thanks for sharing.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:47:26 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "writenow"
[.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Not for the news. . . but there are plenty of other tabloid type shows that probably would,indeed, pay for interviews.[/quote]

Uhm.  A Current Affair?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:47:39 PM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
From CNN:

A fourth person, Steve Croes, a 26-year-old party boat DJ, was arrested Friday.

Croes initially was questioned only as a witness, two law enforcement sources told CNN.

At the time, he allegedly corroborated the version of events told by Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoes, who said they dropped Holloway off at the Holiday Inn where she was staying, the sources said.

But police said their story fell apart under questioning and that no evidence has been found to show that the girl ever returned to her hotel.

That and the fact one of them named Croes led authorities to detain him as a suspect, the two law enforcement sources said.

Croes is now cooperating with authorities, the sources said.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/21/aruba.holloway/index.html


This would lead me to believe that one of the 3 being held pointed the police to him as a potential witness... ???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:47:48 PM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


I wondered the same thing.  Deepak knows Paul and has been around him--why would he think that Paul is a judge, when he's not?


I'm a legal assistant and my kids have told their friends I was an attorney...completely by mistake when they were young and didn't know better.  Judge-in-training/Judge...to kids, what's the difference?


Exactly. I believe this was explained on FOX already. He does hear limited cases. To me that's a judge either way.

That's like telling a Deputy District Attorney they aren't an "DA" because they are a deputy DA..so on and so on


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 11:47:48 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
Quote from: "Perforator"
I think a key here is this Croes guy.
How does he fit in? Why are they holding him?
He wasn't at C&C as far as we know.
Why did they decide to question him?
When does he come into the picture?


They are holding him because he said he saw the three drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn. So either 1) The original story was true or 2) Steve Croes is lying.


Uhhhh, how do we know that's why they are holding him?  Has this been confirmed?


I agree that the Croes arrest is puzzling. 2 posts I read on Croes. 1 was that Croes is a drug dealer fingered by Deepak as the one that supplied him with the drugs that killed Natalee. The other story is that Croes was a witness to the boys dropping Natalee off at the HI.

The fact that he's being held (Croes) as a suspect now leads me to believe the first account.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:48:01 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"


can someone remind me
which brother does mrs. twitty say
she met at jorans/ beating chest guy?



Joran...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DAG on June 21, 2005, 11:48:01 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 


I thought her mother was crying and the step father cursed at them that night they came to Jorans house
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Notice the contridiction  (in bold)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 11:48:05 PM
Keep this philosophy in mind the next time you either hear, or are
about to repeat a rumor.

In ancient Greece (469 - 399 BC) Socrates was widely lauded for his
wisdom. One day the great philosopher came upon an acquaintance who ran up to him excitedly and said, "Socrates, do you know what I just heard about one of your students?"

"Wait a moment," Socrates replied. "Before you tell me I'd like you to
pass a little test. It's called the Triple Filter Test."

"Triple filter?"

"That's right," Socrates continued. "Before you talk to me about my
student let's take a moment to filter what you're going to say. The first
filter is Truth. Have you made absolutely sure that what you are about to tell me is true?"

"No," the man said, "actually I just heard about it and..."

"All right," said Socrates. "So you don't really know if it's true or
not. Now let's try the second filter, the filter of Goodness. Is what you
are about to tell me about my student something good?"

"No, on the contrary..."

"So," Socrates continued, "you want to tell me something bad about him,
even though you're not certain it's true?"

The man shrugged, a little embarrassed.

Socrates continued. "You may still pass the test though, because there
is a third filter - the filter of Usefulness. Is what you want to tell me
about my student going to be useful to me?"

"No, not really"

Well," concluded Socrates, "if what you want to tell me is neither True
nor Good nor even Useful, why tell it to me at all?"

The man was defeated and ashamed. This is the reason Socrates was a
great philosopher and held in such high esteem. It also explains why he never found out that Plato was banging his wife


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:48:13 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.


I can't do that.  I've been at this a long time...AND, believe me in a case like this it's not rare to receive odd emails like this...unless the header info can be found...these aren't worth spending time on.  Sure there's a chance they are real...but, I highly doubt it.  Without verification this was emailed from Aruba and the dates,etc. it's worthless as a possible piece of evidence.


Title: Where is Natalee
Post by: Compananzi on June 21, 2005, 11:48:19 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


I found it strange that the Joran's parents agreed to an interview.  I do not think its a PR thing, but just a folksy, small town mentality saying sure why not.  I saw that piece and you know what I ve been thinking?  Im about to do a 180 turn, from believing that the Joran and Kalpoes did it to some other explanation.  The main reason is that so far no clear cut confession.  Long interrogation by police, visiting judge, and maybe under supervision of DEA and FBI.  I also saw where Jossy Mansur seem too eager to have this blow over and point the fingers to these suspect.  Earlier post I read that the Mansur family is not all that clean and squeeky.  I m sure the FBI knows the story.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Whodunit? on June 21, 2005, 11:48:20 PM
I think you are missing my point.  If Papa VDS is such a stand-up guy, why did he allow his son to drive and go to the casino?  It directly speaks to his character IMO. I would never be OK with my kids breaking laws, ESP if I were a rep of the court!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:48:23 PM
Quote from: "RB

Uhm.  A Current Affair?
Without a doubt.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:48:36 PM
Quote from: "writenow"


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Well the whole email is a lie.  That's the point, isn't it?  This email is Deepak enforcing his alibi (if it is in fact from him, of course).


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 21, 2005, 11:48:56 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "writenow"
[.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Not for the news. . . but there are plenty of other tabloid type shows that probably would,indeed, pay for interviews.


Uhm.  A Current Affair?[/quote]Without a doubt


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:49:20 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


Can we advise Betty that she might want to 'lawyer up' soon?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:50:12 PM
Quote
maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?...
Can't remember because he is protecting his son.


Or maybe because daddy tends to be the more lenient one, and maybe because daddy had a nightcap or two more than he usually would, since Anita was out of town...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 11:50:13 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


i am wodering if we really know shit.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:50:15 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


I wondered the same thing.  Deepak knows Paul and has been around him--why would he think that Paul is a judge, when he's not?


I'm a legal assistant and my kids have told their friends I was an attorney...completely by mistake when they were young and didn't know better.  Judge-in-training/Judge...to kids, what's the difference?


Exactly. I believe this was explained on FOX already. He does hear limited cases. To me that's a judge either way.

That's like telling a Deputy District Attorney they aren't an "DA" because they are a deputy DA..so on and so on



I understand that! I was working with the coroners office here..just as a nurse.. but, was called in at all hours, was in autopsies, at scenes, at the hospital pulling tubes out of dead people...telling families their child was dead...but i was not considered a "coroner"....LOL...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: inspector_detector on June 21, 2005, 11:51:08 PM
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


No, we just make up the laws as we go along!  :lol:

The problem with taking drugs especially while you are drinking alcohol is that the interaction can kill a person. With Natalee's small size 110lb's? It wouldnt take very much to overdose, which is probably what happened.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:51:36 PM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.


I can't do that.  I've been at this a long time...AND, believe me in a case like this it's not rare to receive odd emails like this...unless the header info can be found...these aren't worth spending time on.  Sure there's a chance they are real...but, I highly doubt it.  Without verification this was emailed from Aruba and the dates,etc. it's worthless as a possible piece of evidence.


That makes 2 of us and I am telling you the facts of the piece of evidence. You have decided to discount based on those facts and that is fine. I cannot squeeze blood out of this turnip, even if it did just fall off the truck.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 21, 2005, 11:51:44 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "writenow"
[.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Not for the news. . . but there are plenty of other tabloid type shows that probably would,indeed, pay for interviews.[/quote]

You're right they don't pay.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 21, 2005, 11:51:52 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


i am wodering if we really know shit.


I can say for a fact....and this is CONFIRMED....I DON'T know shit!  This case is so effin frustrating.  I'm having another drink!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:51:59 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


Can we advise Betty that she might want to 'lawyer up' soon?


ROFLMAO!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:52:10 PM
Quote from: "DAG"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 


I thought her mother was crying and the step father cursed at them that night they came to Jorans house
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Notice the contridiction  (in bold)



I believe he meant formally.....as in a conversation....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:52:15 PM
Quote from: "columbo"
If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police).


Who is to say they haven't already been forwarded to the FBI?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:52:33 PM
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


Can we advise Betty that she might want to 'lawyer up' soon?


Should be easy since she is an american. Read the facts.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 21, 2005, 11:53:06 PM
Quote
...wodering if we really know shit.


Sure! here's the shit we know.

A young girl has gone missing in Aruba.

The US government has taken a very unusual interest in the case.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nitjus4fun on June 21, 2005, 11:53:08 PM
Is there any part in the e-mail that any person couldn't write if they have been following this board..... I'm Calling BS!!!


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: sandinmytoes on June 21, 2005, 11:53:39 PM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
I found it strange that the Joran's parents agreed to an interview.  I do not think its a PR thing, but just a folksy, small town mentality saying sure why not.


I'm not sure the father even knew it was an "interview" of sorts. It seems Greta and Beth just showed up at the property and were surprised that the father asked them in. I think the father HIMSELF was surprised that he did.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: katya on June 21, 2005, 11:53:40 PM
Quote from: "Itawamba"
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i notice that jorans father is said to be a judge ....i thought we est. he is not a judge... why would this be included???


I wondered the same thing.  Deepak knows Paul and has been around him--why would he think that Paul is a judge, when he's not?


Because kids exaggerate? Joron seems like a boastful kind of kid; we really don't know how much contact the brothers had with  the VDS family. If J had told him "Hey my dads important, he's a judge" wouldn't D have believed him?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:53:53 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "columbo"
If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police).


Who is to say they haven't already been forwarded to the FBI?


Yep.  Or better yet, the Aruban police already have them due to FBI involvement.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:54:01 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.


I can't do that.  I've been at this a long time...AND, believe me in a case like this it's not rare to receive odd emails like this...unless the header info can be found...these aren't worth spending time on.  Sure there's a chance they are real...but, I highly doubt it.  Without verification this was emailed from Aruba and the dates,etc. it's worthless as a possible piece of evidence.


That makes 2 of us and I am telling you the facts of the piece of evidence. You have decided to discount based on those facts and that is fine. I cannot squeeze blood out of this turnip, even if it did just fall off the truck.

Love it!! He should be an actor!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:54:13 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "columbo"
If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police).


Who is to say they haven't already been forwarded to the FBI?


My bet is all LE involved has them, and has for several days.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:54:21 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I believe he meant formally.....as in a conversation....


WonderWoman, was the email you recieved from Betty forwarded to Betty from someone else?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writergal on June 21, 2005, 11:54:27 PM
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:54:30 PM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


i am wodering if we really know shit.



Probably not, because our sources are the fricken MEDIA!!! LOL


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 21, 2005, 11:54:36 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Keep this philosophy in mind the next time you either hear, or are
about to repeat a rumor.

In ancient Greece (469 - 399 BC) Socrates was widely lauded for his
wisdom. One day the great philosopher came upon an acquaintance who ran up to him excitedly and said, "Socrates, do you know what I just heard about one of your students?"

"Wait a moment," Socrates replied. "Before you tell me I'd like you to
pass a little test. It's called the Triple Filter Test."

"Triple filter?"

"That's right," Socrates continued. "Before you talk to me about my
student let's take a moment to filter what you're going to say. The first
filter is Truth. Have you made absolutely sure that what you are about to tell me is true?"

"No," the man said, "actually I just heard about it and..."

"All right," said Socrates. "So you don't really know if it's true or
not. Now let's try the second filter, the filter of Goodness. Is what you
are about to tell me about my student something good?"

"No, on the contrary..."

"So," Socrates continued, "you want to tell me something bad about him,
even though you're not certain it's true?"

The man shrugged, a little embarrassed.

Socrates continued. "You may still pass the test though, because there
is a third filter - the filter of Usefulness. Is what you want to tell me
about my student going to be useful to me?"

"No, not really"

Well," concluded Socrates, "if what you want to tell me is neither True
nor Good nor even Useful, why tell it to me at all?"

The man was defeated and ashamed. This is the reason Socrates was a
great philosopher and held in such high esteem. It also explains why he never found out that Plato was banging his wife


THat was priceless . Thank you :D  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:54:40 PM
Quote from: "nitjus4fun"
Is there any part in the e-mail that any person couldn't write if they have been following this board..... I'm Calling BS!!!


your choice - but i tend to believe that perhaps there's a possibility those are real.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 21, 2005, 11:54:50 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "LilOrphan"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


Can we advise Betty that she might want to 'lawyer up' soon?


Should be easy since she is an american. Read the facts.


She could be Peruvian for all I care. At this point, it seems there's a question as to whether or not she provided this as evidence to responsible parties and now there's a question as to posting it in a public place.  Is it a stretch to think that with all this "vee cannot comment because zee integrity of zee case" stuff that latter bit might be a problem for Betty, and others?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: georgiablues on June 21, 2005, 11:54:52 PM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?...
Can't remember because he is protecting his son.


Or maybe because daddy tends to be the more lenient one, and maybe because daddy had a nightcap or two more than he usually would, since Anita was out of town...



...and he had, after all, just arrived from a long transatlantic flight.  I've made the route from Amstrdam to Atlanta and it takes at least 36 hours to remember who I am, drinks or none.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: wantsanswers on June 21, 2005, 11:54:54 PM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "columbo"
If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police).


Who is to say they haven't already been forwarded to the FBI?


Yep.  Or better yet, the Aruban police already have them due to FBI involvement.


If they are half way intelligent and I think they are, they are still laughing at this garbage.


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: sailorsmoon on June 21, 2005, 11:55:14 PM
That was a great joke!  

Interesting comment someone just made about the editor of El Diario.  He had a very different attitude tonight than he had last night.  Last night he seem neutral and objective.  Tonight he was eager to keep the attention on JVDS.  Maybe it's just about selling papers and being on TV.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:56:13 PM
Quote from: "chloe2"
Quote from: "writenow"
[.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


Not for the news. . . but there are plenty of other tabloid type shows that probably would,indeed, pay for interviews.[/quote]

On a story like this.........they will pay.  Trust me.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 21, 2005, 11:56:27 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I believe he meant formally.....as in a conversation....


WonderWoman, was the email you recieved from Betty forwarded to Betty from someone else?


It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:56:37 PM
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


Agreed wholly.

I would hate to see what people wonder about me?  :lol:

All I know is since day one, I watched people pick apart (literally parts) Jorans life etc. Who are we to judge him and his parents. We have enough problems in our country with our own children.

People sat around labeling him because of his clothes, pictures, that unbelievable story that he was a drug pusher or pimp because he was holding money up with a goofy smile (it was only 70 bucks by the way).

I can speak ont he differences of our culture and other counties as well as some other Dtuch posters here. We are different.

I can speak to the truth that if you saw me in my work clothes, you would find me to be an innocently angelic career minded looking woman. But if you saw me in my off hours, all most people would do is label me "white trash" "wild girl" "insert any comment you like" because I have tattoos and piercings and I dress in midruff shirts and jeans and on and on and on.

Can not judge a book by it's cover. I am living proof and I always try to open peoples mind to not pass judgement until you know them, have met them or have all the facts about them.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:56:56 PM
OK..I am desperately trying to decipher if WW's emails are made up and she's just trying to stir the big ole steaming pot 'o chit that has been brewing..OR  if they actually have some creedence..I am torn and on the fence with this one and it is making my head hurt...
If by chance they are real, i am sure they have been turned over...BUT, if they havent, then i feel reaaally strange seeing them and knowing what they say... :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 21, 2005, 11:57:05 PM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "DAG"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 


I thought her mother was crying and the step father cursed at them that night they came to Jorans house
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


Notice the contridiction  (in bold)



I believe he meant formally.....as in a conversation....


this is b/s or mostly b/s to cover his ass for whatever something bad happened...he says they/both bro's had not met twittys...and what was
the something bad???  NH  falling down???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 21, 2005, 11:57:12 PM
absolut - You seem to know quite a bit yourself regarding this email/letter.   :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:57:20 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I believe he meant formally.....as in a conversation....


WonderWoman, was the email you recieved from Betty forwarded to Betty from someone else?


It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


I think the email is legit, if it is real.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 21, 2005, 11:57:32 PM
Quote from: "absolut"

It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Are you WonderWoman's spoke person?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 21, 2005, 11:57:37 PM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Thank you Nancy.
I do not cry. I am a tuff as nails kind of girl but this still has me in tears. How many people (none I can think of) come together and treat each other with so much respect and realize, they both have feelings and hurt.

If nothing ever get solved, I can at least remember the first moment of two truly classy people being human. One positive things has come about out of so many negatives.


Cali,
I was really touched by anitas genuine look of caring tonight..i thought that was exactly what i needed to see....
no matter what has happened, who is to blame, etc etc...you cannot deny, from that piece, that there are two families in pain....
Now with that said, where is kerin??


I hate to be the one to spoil a Kodak moment, but it would be really nice if Anita would take the next step and tell Joran to spill the beans.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 21, 2005, 11:58:21 PM
Quote from: "wantsanswers"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "columbo"
If these emails are real, they should be turned over immediately to the FBI (not Aruban police).


Who is to say they haven't already been forwarded to the FBI?


Yep.  Or better yet, the Aruban police already have them due to FBI involvement.


If they are half way intelligent and I think they are, they are still laughing at this garbage.


I don't know, wantanswers.  It appears to me that there is a possibilty they are real, and what I find funny is that we really don't have verifiable fact about any of these people involved in this (other than some general information): and that includes the Holloways.  All we're doing here is speculation for both sides.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: golden on June 21, 2005, 11:58:23 PM
Quote from: "columbo"
Quote from: "RichinTx"
That email is a bunch of bullcrap.


Agreed....

Who is Wonder Woman and why is she receiving emails from one of the suspects? .


Alot of you did'nt believe Dash when she first started posting....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 21, 2005, 11:58:45 PM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
6/6/2005

Date: Mon, 06 Jun 2005 15:26:12 +0000


 
Thank you for your wonderfull email you send me I really appreciate it.
Things are going better with me now , as you you know there has been 2 arrests i don't know if it comes because the information we gave or just another tip.They were 2 security guards for a hotel nearby the holiday inn where natalee was staying , but we don't have any further information . I would be willing to try making an Id by the police for the 2 suspects i only saw one of them in the news.My parents are doing better now , my friends parents are doing well as well. Although we are almost of the hook we still don't walk much on the streets a lot of fingers are being pointed etc. But the press Is like trying to locate us or something i don't know this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet. The local press however we won't give any interview they sad a lot of bad things about us they should be ashamed of theirselves.But for now its just from home to work for me , and in the afternoons i go by my friends house we order pizza etc. and watch the news whats going.
Anyways  i have to go now , if i have any ipdates i will let you know asap. the press is all over it so i don't think you will be missing any part of it .
As for for natalees parents we did not hear or see them personally yet , the police chief askes us if we would be willing to talk to them if they wanted to talk to us . We accepted that as long they would not talk aggressive to us as they did before.
 
Take care , Say hi to the others and I will mail you again
 
 
bye bye
 
Deepak.


OK. Now I KNOW he's lying. Networks like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, etc. DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Maybe the tabloids do, but not networks. He said NBC offered to pay him for an interview. LYING!


He heard this, he did not say he had talked to the networks. Ill bet Dario does pay for info, why wouldn't the world bigger than him.

He does not say he heard it. He says:
this morning my friend got a letter for nbc if we were willing to give an intervieuw for a very good price we did not respond to them yet , we don't know if we will give interview as yet.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 21, 2005, 11:58:48 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


Agreed wholly.

I would hate to see what people wonder about me?  :lol:

All I know is since day one, I watched people pick apart (literally parts) Jorans life etc. Who are we to judge him and his parents. We have enough problems in our country with our own children.

People sat around labeling him because of his clothes, pictures, that unbelievable story that he was a drug pusher or pimp because he was holding money up with a goofy smile (it was only 70 bucks by the way).

I can speak ont he differences of our culture and other counties as well as some other Dtuch posters here. We are different.

I can speak to the truth that if you saw me in my work clothes, you would find me to be an innocently angelic career minded looking woman. But if you saw me in my off hours, all most people would do is label me "white trash" "wild girl" "insert any comment you like" because I have tattoos and piercings and I dress in midruff shirts and jeans and on and on and on.

Can not judge a book by it's cover. I am living proof and I always try to open peoples mind to not pass judgement until you know them, have met them or have all the facts about them.



Well said, my point exactly!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mbhs05 on June 21, 2005, 11:59:02 PM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


Agreed wholly.

I would hate to see what people wonder about me?  :lol:

All I know is since day one, I watched people pick apart (literally parts) Jorans life etc. Who are we to judge him and his parents. We have enough problems in our country with our own children.

People sat around labeling him because of his clothes, pictures, that unbelievable story that he was a drug pusher or pimp because he was holding money up with a goofy smile (it was only 70 bucks by the way).

I can speak ont he differences of our culture and other counties as well as some other Dtuch posters here. We are different.

I can speak to the truth that if you saw me in my work clothes, you would find me to be an innocently angelic career minded looking woman. But if you saw me in my off hours, all most people would do is label me "white trash" "wild girl" "insert any comment you like" because I have tattoos and piercings and I dress in midruff shirts and jeans and on and on and on.

Can not judge a book by it's cover. I am living proof and I always try to open peoples mind to not pass judgement until you know them, have met them or have all the facts about them.


Agree 100%!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CaliGirl on June 21, 2005, 11:59:10 PM
Quote from: "Professor"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Thank you Nancy.
I do not cry. I am a tuff as nails kind of girl but this still has me in tears. How many people (none I can think of) come together and treat each other with so much respect and realize, they both have feelings and hurt.

If nothing ever get solved, I can at least remember the first moment of two truly classy people being human. One positive things has come about out of so many negatives.


Cali,
I was really touched by anitas genuine look of caring tonight..i thought that was exactly what i needed to see....
no matter what has happened, who is to blame, etc etc...you cannot deny, from that piece, that there are two families in pain....
Now with that said, where is kerin??


I hate to be the one to spoil a Kodak moment, but it would be really nice if Anita would take the next step and tell Joran to spill the beans.


Professor my dear, trust and believe, the beans have been spilled.

There are no more beans to spill..just Natalee to find.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 21, 2005, 11:59:30 PM
Thanks for sharing your information WW.  I know you didn't have to.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 21, 2005, 11:59:43 PM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "absolut"

It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Are you WonderWoman's spoke person?


WW has "lawyered up" her attorney? absolut... :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 22, 2005, 12:00:00 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK..I am desperately trying to decipher if WW's emails are made up and she's just trying to stir the big ole steaming pot 'o chit that has been brewing..OR  if they actually have some creedence..I am torn and on the fence with this one and it is making my head hurt...
If by chance they are real, i am sure they have been turned over...BUT, if they havent, then i feel reaaally strange seeing them and knowing what they say... :?



I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:00:16 AM
Quote from: "asdf"
absolut - You seem to know quite a bit yourself regarding this email/letter.   :shock:


I know it exist and read its contents with you right on the greatest forum on the net tonight SCAREDMONKEYS.COM


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 22, 2005, 12:00:35 AM
Hi all...been trying to catch up...NO LUCK...cause I still don't know POO!  ha ha...strange twists!!!  We will never be able to put the puzzle pieces together if they keep changing the picture on the box..sheesh


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:02:02 AM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"

Professor my dear, trust and believe, the beans have been spilled.

There are no more beans to spill..just Natalee to find.


CaliGirl, if the beans were truley spilled they would have Natalee's body, living or dead!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:02:32 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "absolut"

It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Are you WonderWoman's spoke person?


WW has "lawyered up" her attorney? absolut... :D


Nope.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 22, 2005, 12:02:36 AM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Thanks for sharing your information WW.  I know you didn't have to.



Thank you guys for not going off(maybe a little) :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: tuberide on June 22, 2005, 12:02:45 AM
i believe that i remember reading that the Tattoo's mooring is very close to the HI - anyone else??

possibly JVDS and the Kalpoe brothers attempted to have their friend, SteveCroes, verify their story because they knew he would been in the position to make this statement (and he was a friend)....and now we need to realize that, whether or not S Croes possibly lied for them, the "deepak letter" may not be a lie!   (of course, this is assuming Wonder Woman is not full of sh!t)

should all of this be true, coupled with the report in the Arubaam newspaper that stated that Mickey John and the other security guard were seen on the video from late that night walking in front of the hotel - (DESPITE the fact that they were no longer employed next door at the Allegro as securtiy guards) -- then i am again wondering about the truth in  Mickey Jhns seemingly scripted version of what he 'overheard' with a conversation across several jail cells ------ i would like to know the details of their alibis again for that entire night/morning ----- and even if their alibis add up, it is still possible that other individual/s could have been nearby



also like to add that IF all of the above is true,,,that i believe it is still possible/probable that she was drugged with GHB, X, roofies or whatever by someone at C & C....

whew...just a thought


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 22, 2005, 12:02:51 AM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK..I am desperately trying to decipher if WW's emails are made up and she's just trying to stir the big ole steaming pot 'o chit that has been brewing..OR  if they actually have some creedence..I am torn and on the fence with this one and it is making my head hurt...
If by chance they are real, i am sure they have been turned over...BUT, if they havent, then i feel reaaally strange seeing them and knowing what they say... :?



I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


I almost get the same feeling, providing they are real, as one would get when reading something a dead person had just written...almost like i felt when i was cleaning up a body from a car wreck and the guys pager went off..brrrrrrrrr!!!!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:03:08 AM
Thanks to you also!  I am sorry I did not believe it at first.  Seems like there are  more poasters that have info than we realized.  We should appreciate this. :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:03:49 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "absolut"

It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Are you WonderWoman's spoke person?


Not tonight cause I would have said "anything to do with the investigation can't be commented on." I never said that.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 22, 2005, 12:03:54 AM
I think the email is legit, if it is real.[/quote]

Say what??? Don't tell me -- you must be a politician.   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:04:09 AM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:04:30 AM
Quote from: "chelsblu"
I think the email is legit, if it is real.


Say what??? Don't tell me -- you must be a politician.   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:[/quote]

Republican


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 22, 2005, 12:04:46 AM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"


If the email is sent to you directly, yes.  Please note the use of forwarded emails in my description.  Those emails, forwarded, lose their header information from the prior person the email was sent to.

Yes but WonderWoman would have the original email and would be able to view and forward the header information. You can easily do a address to name lookup using whois or one of the European name lookup services to verify the validity.


Not if it's been forwarded 6 times or more before it got to her:)  You'd be tracing from computer to computer, and frankly some email servers and routers block the echo back with an "unknown" attribute.


So obviously we need WonderWoman to answer, was this email sent directly to you or was it forwarded? WonderWoman???


TO ALL: These emails were forwarded. WW is not the only person who got them. But they were all forwarded. There is no usuable header info in them. The facts of them are the dates and the content. Judge these based soley on that.


I can't do that.  I've been at this a long time...AND, believe me in a case like this it's not rare to receive odd emails like this...unless the header info can be found...these aren't worth spending time on.  Sure there's a chance they are real...but, I highly doubt it.  Without verification this was emailed from Aruba and the dates,etc. it's worthless as a possible piece of evidence.


That makes 2 of us and I am telling you the facts of the piece of evidence. You have decided to discount based on those facts and that is fine. I cannot squeeze blood out of this turnip, even if it did just fall off the truck.[/quote

Go track down the header info. That shouldn't be too hard.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 22, 2005, 12:04:57 AM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "absolut"

It was sent to Betty, WW has recieved it though unspecified means and fwds.


Are you WonderWoman's spoke person?


Not tonight cause I would have said "anything to do with the investigation can't be commented on." I never said that.


Lol.  Nice.  bwwwahahahahhahahaha.  No comment.........


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: Compananzi on June 22, 2005, 12:05:09 AM
Quote from: "sailorsmoon"
That was a great joke!  

Interesting comment someone just made about the editor of El Diario.  He had a very different attitude tonight than he had last night.  Last night he seem neutral and objective.  Tonight he was eager to keep the attention on JVDS.  Maybe it's just about selling papers and being on TV.


The Mansur is equivalent to the Kennedys...they made their fortune on cigarettes not booze tho.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 22, 2005, 12:05:39 AM
Quote from: "chelsblu"
I think the email is legit, if it is real.


Say what??? Don't tell me -- you must be a politician.   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:[/quote]


LMFAO  THANK YOU!!!!  LOL  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:05:39 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.


She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.


Title: STill missing point?
Post by: Whodunit? on June 22, 2005, 12:05:59 AM
Oh, I think we are all a little different IRL than our business/work personalities.  BUT if I were a police officer/judge/rep of the court etc.  I would make sure that I (and my family) followed the laws of our (small) nation.  It would be important for my credibility at work, no?

Some of my WILDEST friends are teachers. Do my police friends go around breaking the law in their off-time? DEFINITELY NOT.

That's all I am saying.....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Juvenal on June 22, 2005, 12:06:27 AM
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 22, 2005, 12:06:27 AM
Quote
We will never be able to put the puzzle pieces together if they keep changing the picture on the box


I think it is reasonable to assume that that is the intention.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:06:36 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.


She doesn't have to respond to you, Perforator. And her credibility isn't in question.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 22, 2005, 12:06:57 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.



Who is ignorant?  I will not respond to your hostility, that is CERTAIN!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: la_cavalière on June 22, 2005, 12:07:16 AM
On Greta's show, they were talking about how Joran was talking about it in school... but I'm foggy about what story he was telling. Anybody catch that part?


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: CancunMole on June 22, 2005, 12:07:20 AM
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


I found it strange that the Joran's parents agreed to an interview.  I do not think its a PR thing, but just a folksy, small town mentality saying sure why not.  I saw that piece and you know what I ve been thinking?  Im about to do a 180 turn, from believing that the Joran and Kalpoes did it to some other explanation.  The main reason is that so far no clear cut confession.  Long interrogation by police, visiting judge, and maybe under supervision of DEA and FBI.  I also saw where Jossy Mansur seem too eager to have this blow over and point the fingers to these suspect.  Earlier post I read that the Mansur family is not all that clean and squeeky.  I m sure the FBI knows the story.


I've asked this before and didn't rec'd an answer. Here is the FBI's "What we investigate" site: http://www.fbi.gov/hq.htm

Can anyone tell me what on this list applies to this case because I'm not seeing what is could be?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 22, 2005, 12:07:23 AM
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: georgiablues on June 22, 2005, 12:07:56 AM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Isn't it wierd that Papa VDS doesn't care that his 17 year old frequents the casinos?  Doesn't the law say you must be 18?  Isn't he supposed to uphold the laws of his country?????


Why does it matter? I haven't seen any info that indicates it was an everyday happening, anyway.

Just like even if Natalee was drunk and taking drugs by choice and picking up guys it doesn't make murder right.

I'm glad some of this information is coming out, I have been sceptical about all the demonization of Joran and bros, I live in a tacky tourist town and local guys who just want to get laid have no problem picking up hot tourist women, they don't have to kidnapp and force them.


I guess Americans never break the law????


Agreed wholly.

I would hate to see what people wonder about me?  :lol:

All I know is since day one, I watched people pick apart (literally parts) Jorans life etc. Who are we to judge him and his parents. We have enough problems in our country with our own children.

People sat around labeling him because of his clothes, pictures, that unbelievable story that he was a drug pusher or pimp because he was holding money up with a goofy smile (it was only 70 bucks by the way).

I can speak ont he differences of our culture and other counties as well as some other Dtuch posters here. We are different.

I can speak to the truth that if you saw me in my work clothes, you would find me to be an innocently angelic career minded looking woman. But if you saw me in my off hours, all most people would do is label me "white trash" "wild girl" "insert any comment you like" because I have tattoos and piercings and I dress in midruff shirts and jeans and on and on and on.

Can not judge a book by it's cover. I am living proof and I always try to open peoples mind to not pass judgement until you know them, have met them or have all the facts about them.



And, geez, have most of us forgotten our high school graduation week?  I haven't forgotten mine.  It was pretty much a week-long party.  8)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 22, 2005, 12:08:01 AM
Quote from: "georgiablues"
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?...
Can't remember because he is protecting his son.


Or maybe because daddy tends to be the more lenient one, and maybe because daddy had a nightcap or two more than he usually would, since Anita was out of town...



...and he had, after all, just arrived from a long transatlantic flight.  I've made the route from Amstrdam to Atlanta and it takes at least 36 hours to remember who I am, drinks or none.


I thought it was established that Anita was the one in Holland, not Paul.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 22, 2005, 12:08:03 AM
:::waving arms::::

and Nikki...I am here. I am just on the phone with my husband, (the owner of a wholesale internet company BTW), to give him some of the strange claims made on here regarding what can and cannot be traced. He is out of town (as usual) so it is taking awhile to explain since he has no idea my life has been 100% consumed by this story.  :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Lausa on June 22, 2005, 12:08:21 AM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
 I think the email is legit, if it is real.
 This is a little too ambiguous for me to wrap my mind around!   :?:  :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:08:36 AM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.



Who is ignorant?  I will not respond to your hostility, that is CERTAIN!

If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 22, 2005, 12:08:59 AM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.


She doesn't have to respond to you, Perforator. And her credibility isn't in question.


You're right. I believe she's credible.  The letter, however, may not be. And even if it is, again, it's the word of a person being held for suspicion of murder -- a word that has changed rapidly over time.  Finally, it doesn't address any of the things that make the boys suspicious (the stuff we know OR whatever information has convinced a judge to bind them over).
I call shenanigans - not on WW, but on Deepak's reputation for veracity.


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: da wench on June 22, 2005, 12:09:25 AM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


I found it strange that the Joran's parents agreed to an interview.  I do not think its a PR thing, but just a folksy, small town mentality saying sure why not.  I saw that piece and you know what I ve been thinking?  Im about to do a 180 turn, from believing that the Joran and Kalpoes did it to some other explanation.  The main reason is that so far no clear cut confession.  Long interrogation by police, visiting judge, and maybe under supervision of DEA and FBI.  I also saw where Jossy Mansur seem too eager to have this blow over and point the fingers to these suspect.  Earlier post I read that the Mansur family is not all that clean and squeeky.  I m sure the FBI knows the story.


I've asked this before and didn't rec'd an answer. Here is the FBI's "What we investigate" site: http://www.fbi.gov/hq.htm

Can anyone tell me what on this list applies to this case because I'm not seeing what is could be?


Kidnap????


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: mbhs05 on June 22, 2005, 12:09:39 AM
Hey ya'll...let's keep in mind that too much information is a dangerous thing. You never know...so just be careful what you write.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 22, 2005, 12:09:56 AM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "chelsblu"
I think the email is legit, if it is real.


Say what??? Don't tell me -- you must be a politician.   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


Republican[/quote]

hmmmm. that sounds more like something CLinton would say..as in...We didn't have sex, but if we did have sex it wasn't real sex.  :lol:  :lol:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:10:18 AM
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
 I think the email is legit, if it is real.
 This is a little too ambiguous for me to wrap my mind around!   :?:  :)


More creditable than what we mostly see in here (my posts included)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:10:33 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.



Who is ignorant?  I will not respond to your hostility, that is CERTAIN!

If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!


As is most things discussed here, including the student's varying accounts of what happened that night.  It's speculation and nothing more.  Having any additional information won't make WW content any less or more reliable.  If you wish to go track it down yourself, get a copy on any number of newsgroups.  I'm sure you know how to use one.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 22, 2005, 12:10:48 AM
Quote from: "Ting"
Quote
We will never be able to put the puzzle pieces together if they keep changing the picture on the box


I think it is reasonable to assume that that is the intention.
NO DOUBT! :?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: melrose on June 22, 2005, 12:10:50 AM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


i am wodering if we really know shit.


ditto


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: WonderWoman on June 22, 2005, 12:10:53 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.



Who is ignorant?  I will not respond to your hostility, that is CERTAIN!

If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!



then take it for what its worth.... have a great night!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Professor on June 22, 2005, 12:10:56 AM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


Thank you Nancy.
I do not cry. I am a tuff as nails kind of girl but this still has me in tears. How many people (none I can think of) come together and treat each other with so much respect and realize, they both have feelings and hurt.

If nothing ever get solved, I can at least remember the first moment of two truly classy people being human. One positive things has come about out of so many negatives.


If nothing gets solved, it was all fake.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: a Troll on June 22, 2005, 12:11:00 AM
Quote from: "la_cavalière"
On Greta's show, they were talking about how Joran was talking about it in school... but I'm foggy about what story he was telling. Anybody catch that part?


the important part was that the father admitted that he asked joran to stop talking, and thus was prevented from seeing joran due to the conversation being wiretapped.

So, this confirms the police were tracking the suspects after they let them go.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Ting on June 22, 2005, 12:11:07 AM
Quote
Anita was the one in Holland, not Paul.


that night, Anita was in Holland, the night that Natalee's mom went to their house. Maybe Paulus had recently returned, I don't know.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 22, 2005, 12:11:20 AM
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:11:22 AM
Quote from: "chelsblu"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "chelsblu"
I think the email is legit, if it is real.


Say what??? Don't tell me -- you must be a politician.   :lol:  :lol:  :lol:


Republican


hmmmm. that sounds more like something CLinton would say..as in...We didn't have sex, but if we did have sex it wasn't real sex.  :lol:  :lol:[/quote]
Yeah that was the democrat in him..just joking!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LadyBug on June 22, 2005, 12:11:38 AM
Perhaps Wonder Woman would copy the top of the email that will prove it came from Deepak's email account.   :?:

I am not quite ready to buy into the fact that this really is a letter from Deepak.

Also, wonder if Deepak has a computer at home?  I believe I heard on one of the news shows that he sometime went to the café to send/receive emails.  (Sorry, cannot remember the name of the café where the computers are located.)

Just my thoughts.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 22, 2005, 12:12:20 AM
Quote from: "KerinTX"
:::waving arms::::

and Nikki...I am here. I am just on the phone with my husband, (the owner of a wholesale internet company BTW), to give him some of the strange claims made on here regarding what can and cannot be traced. He is out of town (as usual) so it is taking awhile to explain since he has no idea my life has been 100% consumed by this story.  :D



WELL< what does the OWNER of the company have to say?? :D


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:12:32 AM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


You can look it up and find out.  Star Report was paid for.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:12:36 AM
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!



then take it for what its worth.... have a great night!


Which is absolutely nothing!
Thank you!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:13:19 AM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"

I did too NIKKI, very weird to have insight into someone we've only "heard "about!


WonderWoman, please respond to my question regarding the emails from Deepak.
Your continued ignorance only decreases your credibility.



Who is ignorant?  I will not respond to your hostility, that is CERTAIN!

If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!


As is most things discussed here, including the student's varying accounts of what happened that night.  It's speculation and nothing more.  Having any additional information won't make WW content any less or more reliable.  If you wish to go track it down yourself, get a copy on any number of newsgroups.  I'm sure you know how to use one.


Perf,
I guess you just wanted it spoon fed, some people had a 2 hour head start I suppose.


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: LilOrphan on June 22, 2005, 12:13:47 AM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote

I've asked this before and didn't rec'd an answer. Here is the FBI's "What we investigate" site: http://www.fbi.gov/hq.htm

Can anyone tell me what on this list applies to this case because I'm not seeing what is could be?


Click through the kidnapping section into the fbi missing/kidnapped list. You'll note at least one person born in 1972, clearly older than 18.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: SoccerDad on June 22, 2005, 12:13:48 AM
Quote


I thought I also understood Greta to say that PVDS "thinks" that he got Joran up that next morning, not sure if he went to school.  Did I hear that?  Did anyone else hear that?  That maybe daddy can't really remember if he woke Joran up for school or if he went to school?


Can't remember because he is protecting his son.[/quote]


Exactly my thoughts. When frantic parents arrive at your door, begging for information on their son's whereabouts the night before, it's human nature to make an indelible memory impression of that day's events. He knows exactly what happened that morning. It is burned into his memory. The brain moves such information from short term storage into long term storage at such crisis prompts.

When NH's friends realized she was missing, each of them did the same thing, with their last memories of Natalee...

Still, my heart goes out to all the parents...


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 22, 2005, 12:13:59 AM
Just my thoughts.[/quote]

i was just posting to find out what i am up to tonight.
sorry.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Shellbell on June 22, 2005, 12:14:01 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "WonderWoman"
Quote from: "Perforator"
If you cannot post the headers from your email then the credibility of your supposed email is just heresay!



then take it for what its worth.... have a great night!


Which is absolutely nothing!
Thank you!


You are being mean to her.  How do you know that it is not legit?  She could have valuable info that she could bring to this board.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:14:06 AM
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


You can look it up and find out.  Star Report was paid for.


were you aware that a current affair is i do believe, produced by nbc? :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: georgiablues on June 22, 2005, 12:14:24 AM
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "georgiablues"
 

...and he had, after all, just arrived from a long transatlantic flight.  I've made the route from Amstrdam to Atlanta and it takes at least 36 hours to remember who I am, drinks or none.


I thought it was established that Anita was the one in Holland, not Paul.


DW, you are probably right.  I am always behind on these posts.  But a few pages back there was a comment of him returning from the trip and just x hours later all this breaks loose.  My bad for skipping pages.  :oops:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 22, 2005, 12:14:35 AM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


You think? How can you be at the SBF and at a black jack table at the same time, same night? The two girls left C&C at 12. Who did NH go to C&C with? Joran was picked up by his dad at 11 then snuck out. I'd like to know alot more about that 'scuffle" at the Aruban bar after hearing the 2 friends.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 22, 2005, 12:14:43 AM
Quote from: "Juvenal"
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


I was rather shocked to see this on Dan's site.  Greta's blog is meant to be folksy and intimate. She writes from airplanes, airports, etc. I like it.  Dan also shares his emotions, and tells us in detail his challenges in covering this case on his blog.

I think he was off base on this one.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 22, 2005, 12:15:03 AM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


I know that there was rumor that cameras were not working that night at the HI, but Natalee's mom has said there were cameras, they did work, and she watched the videos.  She has said in interviews that she does not know when Nat met Joran and she doesn't care.  She saiid they are only trying to follow the story from when she left the bar and went missing.  Dash said on here and in her TV appearances that she had seen Joran around their casino but did not think that Nat had been "hanging around" with him until that night at C&C.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 22, 2005, 12:15:16 AM
Thanks for posting the emails Wonderwoman.

It sound like they may be from Deepak. And if they are, then it, unfortunately, convinces me even more that he's hiding something.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:16:24 AM
Quote from: "RB"
As is most things discussed here, including the student's varying accounts of what happened that night.  It's speculation and nothing more.  Having any additional information won't make WW content any less or more reliable.  If you wish to go track it down yourself, get a copy on any number of newsgroups.  I'm sure you know how to use one.


If we had ip addresses that pointed to a isp on Aruba it would not be speculation it would be fact but alas WonderWoman cannot provide that information so her letter is in the category of the Dario reporter who said he had people following a car in Venezuala, bullshit!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:16:32 AM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Juvenal"
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


I was rather shocked to see this on Dan's site.  Greta's blog is meant to be folksy and intimate. She writes from airplanes, airports, etc. I like it.  Dan also shares his emotions, and tells us in detail his challenges in covering this case on his blog.

I think he was off base on this one.


She might even post or read forums on the web.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Lausa on June 22, 2005, 12:16:48 AM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
  All I know is since day one, I watched people pick apart (literally parts) Jorans life etc. Who are we to judge him and his parents. We have enough problems in our country with our own children.

People sat around labeling him because of his clothes, pictures, that unbelievable story that he was a drug pusher or pimp because he was holding money up with a goofy smile (it was only 70 bucks by the way).

I can speak ont he differences of our culture and other counties as well as some other Dtuch posters here. We are different."  

Second all this.  After really studying picture after picture of him, his family, mostly from his brothers Valentijn's site,  Joran  never seemed like a cold-blooded killer, or a particularly evil teen.  Yeah, yeah, I know Ted Bundy looked normal too.  My instinct still tells me he did not kill Natalie Holloway.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writergal on June 22, 2005, 12:16:51 AM
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


    Yes, I know, I lived in Britain for four years. But I stand by my statement that sometimes regular networks will pay for interviews. You won't see those interviews on the regular news shows, but on the "magazine" shows.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 22, 2005, 12:17:07 AM
Quote from: "writenow"
Thanks for posting the emails Wonderwoman.

It sound like they may be from Deepak. And if they are, then it, unfortunately, convinces me even more that he's hiding something.


me too.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:17:36 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
As is most things discussed here, including the student's varying accounts of what happened that night.  It's speculation and nothing more.  Having any additional information won't make WW content any less or more reliable.  If you wish to go track it down yourself, get a copy on any number of newsgroups.  I'm sure you know how to use one.


If we had ip addresses that pointed to a isp on Aruba it would not be speculation it would be fact but alas WonderWoman cannot provide that information so her letter is in the category of the Dario reporter who said he had people following a car in Venezuala, bullshit!


You can choose to believe that.  What exactly would you do with an IP?  Not a damn thing. If it bothers you that much, I have told you where you can go find it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: columbo on June 22, 2005, 12:17:51 AM
She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.

I'm not trying to scare WW, but she is probably already in trouble for posting this letter. It could be considered  evidence in a missing person investigation and withholding its original source could be considered tampering. The content of this letter is not as important as the date on which it was sent (before arrests were made).


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: asdf on June 22, 2005, 12:18:23 AM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Juvenal"
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


I was rather shocked to see this on Dan's site.  Greta's blog is meant to be folksy and intimate. She writes from airplanes, airports, etc. I like it.  Dan also shares his emotions, and tells us in detail his challenges in covering this case on his blog.

I think he was off base on this one.


She might even post or read forums on the web.


I think you're onto something here.........


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 22, 2005, 12:18:37 AM
Quote from: "writergal"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


    Yes, I know, I lived in Britain for four years. But I stand by my statement that sometimes regular networks will pay for interviews. You won't see those interviews on the regular news shows, but on the "magazine" shows.


This is a simple enough follow-through - we can just call NBC's business offices and check if they offered Joran or the Kalpoe's $$ for an exclusive interview.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: golden on June 22, 2005, 12:19:12 AM
[[/quote] US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.[/quote]

You can look it up and find out.  Star Report was paid for.[/quote]

were you aware that a current affair is i do believe, produced by nbc? :)[/quote]

Slam dunk!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nikkibnurse on June 22, 2005, 12:19:25 AM
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....

Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:19:35 AM
Quote from: "columbo"
She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.

I'm not trying to scare WW, but she is probably already in trouble for posting this letter. It could be considered  evidence in a missing person investigation and withholding its original source could be considered tampering. The content of this letter is not as important as the date on which it was sent (before arrests were made).


Have no fear for WW her company on this forum and across the web is wide at this point. The origin of the first leak would be difficult past the first or second forward.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Juvenal on June 22, 2005, 12:19:43 AM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Juvenal"
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


I was rather shocked to see this on Dan's site.  Greta's blog is meant to be folksy and intimate. She writes from airplanes, airports, etc. I like it.  Dan also shares his emotions, and tells us in detail his challenges in covering this case on his blog.

I think he was off base on this one.


Nancy-

Maybe you're right. I should have mentioned that, since I obviously don't know Greta, his interpretation fits my general notion of what MSM types are like, not any one person.

I feel it's safe to say that, if he had said this about Whorealdo, it would be accurate.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: KerinTX on June 22, 2005, 12:19:49 AM
Here's what I think WW should say from here on out:

"No Comment"


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: chelsblu on June 22, 2005, 12:20:15 AM
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Juvenal"
Did anybody else catch Dan Riehl's critique of Greta's blog about the coverage from Aruba?

Damn! Pretty harsh interpretation, but an interpretation that fits my instincts about a high-profile MSM figure.

Apparently, he is not impressed at all about her show tonight.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/


I was rather shocked to see this on Dan's site.  Greta's blog is meant to be folksy and intimate. She writes from airplanes, airports, etc. I like it.  Dan also shares his emotions, and tells us in detail his challenges in covering this case on his blog.

I think he was off base on this one.


me too. Wonder if he's jealous because she scooped him? :wink:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:20:17 AM
Quote from: "columbo"
She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.

I'm not trying to scare WW, but she is probably already in trouble for posting this letter. It could be considered  evidence in a missing person investigation and withholding its original source could be considered tampering. The content of this letter is not as important as the date on which it was sent (before arrests were made).


I think she knows she's not in any trouble, because if they are real (and I have seen them elsewhere, or at least portions of them) I'm sure they have been obtained.  Hence why she would post the content.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Terry on June 22, 2005, 12:20:28 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....

Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....
Will do. God Bless, and good luck.


Title: Re: STill missing point?
Post by: katya on June 22, 2005, 12:21:03 AM
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Oh, I think we are all a little different IRL than our business/work personalities.  BUT if I were a police officer/judge/rep of the court etc.  I would make sure that I (and my family) followed the laws of our (small) nation.  It would be important for my credibility at work, no?

Some of my WILDEST friends are teachers. Do my police friends go around breaking the law in their off-time? DEFINITELY NOT.

That's all I am saying.....


Cops break the law all the time! The drive drunk, smoke pot and take bribes..everywhere in the world!!


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 22, 2005, 12:21:21 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....

Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....


Good luck. Hope all turns out well.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 22, 2005, 12:21:33 AM
Quote from: "georgiablues"
Quote from: "da wench"
Quote from: "georgiablues"
 
...and he had, after all, just arrived from a long transatlantic flight.  I've made the route from Amstrdam to Atlanta and it takes at least 36 hours to remember who I am, drinks or none.

I thought it was established that Anita was the one in Holland, not Paul.

DW, you are probably right.  I am always behind on these posts.  But a few pages back there was a comment of him returning from the trip and just x hours later all this breaks loose.  My bad for skipping pages.  :oops:

It only takes a minute to get behind sometimes.  Did you watch Greta tonight?  That was very imformative.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lainey on June 22, 2005, 12:21:35 AM
Quote from: "writenow"

3. IF this really is from Deepak, it's his alibi which he's already told the police and is trying to stick to. Doesn't mean it's 100% true. There may be parts which are accurate, but I'm bet the ranch on it that he's lying lying lying.


Sounds like a good scheme to me if he did write it.  Hmmm, I bet if I send my account of what happened to so and so then it is written down that I told the story to someone.......and that will help me look innocent...

Just throwing out ideas from a gal that could lie like a rug to cover her azz in the good ole days.


Title: Re: Where is Natalee
Post by: tuberide on June 22, 2005, 12:21:48 AM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "Compananzi"
Quote from: "nancy_drew"
Quote from: "Lausa"
Quote from: "CaliGirl"
All I care about at this moment homestly, is I truly believe that was probabaly the most beautiful moment I have ever seen on TV....I have always said there are many victims and have had feelings for all involved...As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.

Cali, this has me weeping.  Don't get FOX, the web video didn't show the kiss part.  I too have been saying all along that all the parents are victims.


You captured it beautifully. I think these are ALL loving parents in a heart breaking situation.  They have both lost their children.  No matter what the reason that has to be the most devastating thing to happen to a parent.

I got chills when the met at the gate.

It's too damn bad warring countries can't do the same.


I found it strange that the Joran's parents agreed to an interview.  I do not think its a PR thing, but just a folksy, small town mentality saying sure why not.  I saw that piece and you know what I ve been thinking?  Im about to do a 180 turn, from believing that the Joran and Kalpoes did it to some other explanation.  The main reason is that so far no clear cut confession.  Long interrogation by police, visiting judge, and maybe under supervision of DEA and FBI.  I also saw where Jossy Mansur seem too eager to have this blow over and point the fingers to these suspect.  Earlier post I read that the Mansur family is not all that clean and squeeky.  I m sure the FBI knows the story.


I've asked this before and didn't rec'd an answer. Here is the FBI's "What we investigate" site: http://www.fbi.gov/hq.htm

Can anyone tell me what on this list applies to this case because I'm not seeing what is could be?


hey Mole , from the FBI link you posted:

Mission Statement:

The mission of the Intelligence Program is to optimally position the FBI to meet current and emerging national security and criminal threats by:

- Aiming core investigative work proactively against threats to U.S. interests,
- Building and sustaining enterprise-wide intelligence policies and capabilities, and
- Providing useful, appropriate, and timely information and analysis to the national security, homeland security and law enforcement communities.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 22, 2005, 12:21:54 AM
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


You think? How can you be at the SBF and at a black jack table at the same time, same night? The two girls left C&C at 12. Who did NH go to C&C with? Joran was picked up by his dad at 11 then snuck out. I'd like to know alot more about that 'scuffle" at the Aruban bar after hearing the 2 friends.
You know you are right....unless she met Joran during the day...hell, I have no idea...somebody is not telling the truth...imagine that! :shock:


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Juvenal on June 22, 2005, 12:21:57 AM
Quote from: "writergal"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


    Yes, I know, I lived in Britain for four years. But I stand by my statement that sometimes regular networks will pay for interviews. You won't see those interviews on the regular news shows, but on the "magazine" shows.


writergal--

15 or 20 years ago, the U.S. MSM would defintely not pay for an interview. But, since they've found themselves more and more competing with "magazine" type shows--as well as actual magazines--I think they do pay on occasion now, for the really big ones. It's just something they don't talk about much.


Title: Re: STill missing point?
Post by: katya on June 22, 2005, 12:22:12 AM
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Oh, I think we are all a little different IRL than our business/work personalities.  BUT if I were a police officer/judge/rep of the court etc.  I would make sure that I (and my family) followed the laws of our (small) nation.  It would be important for my credibility at work, no?

Some of my WILDEST friends are teachers. Do my police friends go around breaking the law in their off-time? DEFINITELY NOT.

That's all I am saying.....


Cops break the law all the time! The drive drunk, smoke pot and take bribes..everywhere in the world!!


Oh and the lawyers kids were the worst, and BTW didn't one of the Bush daughters get busted for underaged drinking?


Title: Re: STill missing point?
Post by: Terry on June 22, 2005, 12:22:37 AM
Quote from: "katya"
Quote from: "Whodunit?"
Oh, I think we are all a little different IRL than our business/work personalities.  BUT if I were a police officer/judge/rep of the court etc.  I would make sure that I (and my family) followed the laws of our (small) nation.  It would be important for my credibility at work, no?

Some of my WILDEST friends are teachers. Do my police friends go around breaking the law in their off-time? DEFINITELY NOT.

That's all I am saying.....


Cops break the law all the time! The drive drunk, smoke pot and take bribes..everywhere in the world!!
Hello!! I know a few cops that break the law while they are on duty. gmafb.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: dragonfly on June 22, 2005, 12:22:47 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....

Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....


Your post is in the right place as far as I'm concerned because you are among "cyber-friends".  I will most certainly pray for you tonight and I wish you much luck tomorrow.  Good night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: coco on June 22, 2005, 12:23:15 AM
nikkibnurse - will keep you in my thoughts


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 22, 2005, 12:23:30 AM
Quote from: "Terry"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....
Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....
Will do. God Bless, and good luck.

Absolutely.  Good luck.[/color]


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: friend of monkeys on June 22, 2005, 12:23:44 AM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "columbo"
She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.

I'm not trying to scare WW, but she is probably already in trouble for posting this letter. It could be considered  evidence in a missing person investigation and withholding its original source could be considered tampering. The content of this letter is not as important as the date on which it was sent (before arrests were made).


Have no fear for WW her company on this forum and across the web is wide at this point. The origin of the first leak would be difficult past the first or second forward.


absolut.... i have a question...you have been here for days and not been shy about your knowlege or input...if this post is web-wide major then why did you wait for WW to bring it to this forum???


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:23:46 AM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


You think? How can you be at the SBF and at a black jack table at the same time, same night? The two girls left C&C at 12. Who did NH go to C&C with? Joran was picked up by his dad at 11 then snuck out. I'd like to know alot more about that 'scuffle" at the Aruban bar after hearing the 2 friends.
You know you are right....unless she met Joran during the day...hell, I have no idea...somebody is not telling the truth...imagine that! :shock:


Dallas or someone will post a new timeline, but she met him in the afternoon and on camera in the casino in HI and introduced herself.

Later they met at CNC after he snuck out.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Perforator on June 22, 2005, 12:24:07 AM
Quote from: "RB"
What exactly would you do with an IP?  


I would do a reverse-address lookup and find out where it originated from.
www.arin.net or www.lacnic.net would be a good place to start. :)


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: Rosalie on June 22, 2005, 12:24:08 AM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
ok, so WW is in aruba, correct?
 And, she is not betty, correct?
AND, her friend is betty, correct?
OK...so, where is betty? wonder if she'd be willing to come log on and post her thoights....


We shouldn't even know betty.


i am wodering if we really know shit.


Isnt it wonderful when we are all reading posts like crazy, trying to figure things out using mostly misinformation, that someone comes along and throws in some humor or quips. Throws a little oil on those wheels in are heads that are screeching.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: nancy_drew on June 22, 2005, 12:25:35 AM
Quote from: "writergal"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


    Yes, I know, I lived in Britain for four years. But I stand by my statement that sometimes regular networks will pay for interviews. You won't see those interviews on the regular news shows, but on the "magazine" shows.


Yes, you are correct.  The magazine shows do pay and sometimes they are sneaky in how they do it.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: lainey on June 22, 2005, 12:25:47 AM
Quote from: "CaliGirl"


As far as someone saying Anita did a fake or staged kiss, it is or at least I was raised in the dutch culture with giving a respectful kiss on  the cheek. That was the ULTIMATE show of respect to Beth on Anita's part.


I thought the kiss was genuine, as well.  Both Moms are distraught.  One has a missing daughter, one has a son in jail accused of knowing what happened.  In the end they are both Mom's who love their kids.  It ain't easy being either one about now.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: absolut on June 22, 2005, 12:25:57 AM
Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote from: "columbo"
She has posted the whole letter what more do you want her to do, without her getting in trouble.

I'm not trying to scare WW, but she is probably already in trouble for posting this letter. It could be considered  evidence in a missing person investigation and withholding its original source could be considered tampering. The content of this letter is not as important as the date on which it was sent (before arrests were made).


Have no fear for WW her company on this forum and across the web is wide at this point. The origin of the first leak would be difficult past the first or second forward.


absolut.... i have a question...you have been here for days and not been shy about your knowlege or input...if this post is web-wide major then why did you wait for WW to bring it to this forum???


First I knew of it was 2 hours ago. Never even occured to me to deepweb or newsgroup it as something that would be on the web. I never said I knew of it before or what should happen to it. Until it was discussed here.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writenow on June 22, 2005, 12:26:00 AM
Quote from: "RB"
Quote from: "Shellbell"
Quote from: "writenow"
Quote from: "writergal"
Sometimes, in some circumstances, legitimate news organizations do pay for interviews. It depends on what type of show it is. The BBC paid Monics Lewinsky for an interview about her relationship with Bill Clinton.


That's the BBC. Britain also charges about $150 for a household's TV license. You can't just buy a TV and watch it. They have TV police. You have to pay to watch.

US networks DON'T PAY FOR INTERVIEWS. Tabloids like maybe current affair might, but the big four don't pay for interviews.


You can look it up and find out.  Star Report was paid for.


were you aware that a current affair is i do believe, produced by nbc? :)


A current affair is not an NBC production. I have no idea what Starr report does, but I would be shocked to hear CNN paid for an interview. If so, then they're in worst shape than I thought.

Again, NBC, CBS, ABC (and to my knowledge FOX) DO NOT PAY FOR NEWS INTERVIEWS!!!!! EVER! Legitimate news organizations, no matter what we all think of them, have a journalistic ethics code which prevents them from paying to interview someone. Same for newspapers. And if the bosses ever found out a reporter had paid for an interview, they'd be fired in a heartbeat. Paying someone to interview them compromises what they're saying. It's not done in the legitimate American news organizations. Tabloid shows like A Current Affair make their own rules because they're syndicated.

Got it?


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: writergal on June 22, 2005, 12:26:01 AM
writergal--

15 or 20 years ago, the U.S. MSM would defintely not pay for an interview. But, since they've found themselves more and more competing with "magazine" type shows--as well as actual magazines--I think they do pay on occasion now, for the really big ones. It's just something they don't talk about much.[/quote]

 As we speak (more or less), The Runaway Bride's parent are "negotiating" with ABC.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: da wench on June 22, 2005, 12:26:01 AM
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
Quote from: "CancunMole"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


You think? How can you be at the SBF and at a black jack table at the same time, same night? The two girls left C&C at 12. Who did NH go to C&C with? Joran was picked up by his dad at 11 then snuck out. I'd like to know alot more about that 'scuffle" at the Aruban bar after hearing the 2 friends.
You know you are right....unless she met Joran during the day...hell, I have no idea...somebody is not telling the truth...imagine that! :shock:


Joran was seen on cam and by Nat's friends in the casino during the time the MBHS students were there but they didn't meet each other until that night.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: LilOrphan on June 22, 2005, 12:26:09 AM
Quote from: "absolut"
Quote


Dallas or someone will post a new timeline, but she met him in the afternoon and on camera in the casino in HI and introduced herself.

Later they met at CNC after he snuck out.


allegedly sneaks out Sunday night after 11, but father says is at casino on Monday at 1 a.m.  Odd, that.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: RB on June 22, 2005, 12:26:22 AM
Quote from: "Perforator"
Quote from: "RB"
What exactly would you do with an IP?  


I would do a reverse-address lookup and find out where it originated from.
www.arin.net or www.lacnic.net would be a good place to start. :)


Duh, you just had to do that, didn't you :)

Let me rephrase:  What exactly would you do with an IP?  Look it up?  And THEN what? That would validate everything?  I don't think so.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: waitingtoknow on June 22, 2005, 12:26:23 AM
Quote from: "nikkibnurse"
OK, amigos..I must go to bed
I also wanna jump off topic for i short sec, and ask a favor..
I am sure some of you will mock at this, tell me to start my own page, that i shouldnt be taking up space in the "rumors " section, etc..
but, as we all know, some of us have made friends on this site...like it or not..
However, for those of you that do care, i found a "lump" and am having tests done tomorrow to decipher just exactly what that is...if you would be so inclined, when you pray for Nat tonight, please say a short one for me....

Night monkeys...lets hope tomorrow brings Natalee home....just like Brennan....
will do Nikki....don't worry too much though...been there done that and am there again with another...have had many mamos, ultrasounds ect and they can't find anything on the first one...But it is still a very scary thing...and you are in my thoughts and prayers


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: CancunMole on June 22, 2005, 12:26:50 AM
Quote from: "dragonfly"
Quote from: "waitingtoknow"
FYI...in an interview....That Aruba editor (the american one)...Aruba live???  not sure..anyways...she said that the cameras at the HI drive entrance do not work...while she was saying this, they interrupted her...

Also, I am confused about them meeting (Joran and Natalee) in the Casino...wasn't it said that they met THAT NIGHT by the friends tonight??  I thought natalee's mom said that she saw video from the casino and that they had met a couple days before...I might be confused...who knows

Who had said that they had met a couple days before in the casino?


I know that there was rumor that cameras were not working that night at the HI, but Natalee's mom has said there were cameras, they did work, and she watched the videos.  She has said in interviews that she does not know when Nat met Joran and she doesn't care.  She saiid they are only trying to follow the story from when she left the bar and went missing.  Dash said on here and in her TV appearances that she had seen Joran around their casino but did not think that Nat had been "hanging around" with him until that night at C&C.


It has been stated on TV that the HI only has a camera at the front desk, none outside. At one time, it was sais that the outside camera was broken.


Title: RBN # 16 - 6/21 thru 6/22
Post by: DT on June 22, 2005, 12:27:36 AM
I tend to think WW is at least being honest.  The email itself may not actually be from Deepak, idk.  Even if it is we should take it with a grain of salt, seeing as he has already disregarded a lot of the details, that he would have no good reason