Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/NH2008.gif)

 :2waver:

Hi Robots.   :lol:

 :D  HI!

Ouch!  I got that door slammed in my face.  Lost my post too.  :roll:

hi,  i let you guys WIN  :cool:


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :smt052

Robots I wanted to say I agree with your post in the previous thread.  Joran beat Natalee and Paulus is the one who let her die.  He is a murderer.

Whew I made it

Mrs Red, I think everyone on that rock who knows what happened is as guilty as the ones who cause Natalee to disappear. There is a special place in hell for all of them. MOO

Yeah!!

yep, i think there is NO LOGICAL explanation other than that

because here is the alternative

joran rapes her and he could always just say "oh it was consensual and she must have overdosed on the DRUGS she WAS DOING before i ever got to the BAR"

nawwwwwwwwwwww....raped and MURDERED because she could identify the RAPISTS


thats what i think happened... FIRST DEGREE MURDER

 :-x :-x :-x :-x :-x :-x :-x :-x
and MOS SUCKS

heheheheehehehehehe.............................. :smt052 :smt052 :smt052 :smt052

PREMEDITATED.

yep

Well I guess I will get in trouble for this post...I have been thinking about Lorenzo's possible connections...just listen.  I have watched that video that Kyle has up about the Persistence and I truly don't see how a boat the size of Koen's could go out to that location in the dead of night.  I don't know much about boats, but it sure looked rough out there at times to me.  I was thinking maybe Paulus knew he needed a boat that was accustomed to traveling that far out.  Maybe the rumors of drug cartels and Lorenzo would be the answer. That is pretty far out and I can't imagine those kids doing it all alone.  Is that too far fetched?  OK, maybe it is.  :roll:

which is exactly why I don't believe any BS about harming the "innocent" arubans with a boycott.... julia and her minions always spouted off about how everyone knew everyone's business.... boycott that hellhole till it ALL goes by way of the Natural Bridge, which I seem to recall they blamed on Beth :roll:

Lalas,

That doesn't sound so farfetched to me. You're right about the water looking rough. It would make sense that they would need help.

BT
Your sock cow is so adorable...I think that is your best avi yet.

It just seemed too far out even though you can see the lights in the distance on one part of the video..it still seemed farther than I thought it would be.  I just don't see those guys having the courage to venture out that far in the dark.  Maybe they did. Fear will cause you to do things you would not normally do.

Could the Tatoo have made it out that far?   Are they trying to throw us off by saying Steve was fired that night because he left the boat when he really didn't.

Actually, any of the boats could have made it out that far including Koens.

Yapperz posted in the last Thread:

Anna,
How can you be so sure Lorenzo wasn't involved? None of us were there & only have the word of islanders to go on. IMO no 2 tell the same tale.
I was told that Lorenzo was born in Holland & not on Aruba. I can't prove it. So it may or may not be true.
I find it quite strange that when anyone speculates about Lorenzo YOU accuse us of stalking him. We no more stalk him than any of the other persons of interest on the island. MOO
------------


Lorenzo has been discussed here for the last four days and I didn't say a word, not even when it was falsely claimed that Jossy confirmed his connection to this and relationship to Joran which is totally false per the link I already posted.

Why do you claim as have others that EVERY TIME someone posts about Lorenzo I do anything for that's just not true.  I seldom respond at all but boy, when I do am I ever attacked for it.

Why is that?  Why do I have to agree with your and other's opinion for my posts to be accepted?

San ... although my theory does not imply that Natalee was taken out to sea on the morning of May 30, 2005 ... I contend if she was ... she was taken out to sea on the Tattoo and ... this is the reason that Steve Croes enters the scenario.

Janet

I don't recall asking anyone to agree with me. It just seems everytime some talk about Lorenzo you get bent out of shape. If you know about the so called party, tell us. If you know who the Lorenzo was who was involved with the escort service, tell us.
Like you & everyone else here, I am entitled to my opinion & IMO Lorenzo can not be rules out.

I have been reading some of the very first FP posts tonight and I find it sad in many ways. The common Arubans had little knowledge of that dealings of the Dutch elite there on their own island.  It is really sad...they still do not have the courage to admit there is a problem. 

I agree Janet.  I don't believe she was taken out to sea either.

I totally agree Klaas.  Those boys were raised on the water.  They have
been running boats out to sea since they were little kids.

Anna, who is the other Lorenzo?

 :lol:  Now I don't feel so bad Klaas, for asking you about this a coupla weeks ago.  Klaas has a lot of boating experience, and let me know that the Gottenbos boat could easily go out that far. 

The question is about Paulus.  We know he was in on this from the beginning and certainly through the clean up phase.  Would a man who "would do anything to protect his son" just sit around while his pride and joy is out on the ocean in a small boat with his friends, trying to dispose of a body?  I just don't see it. 

I think it more likely that Paulus was on the ocean with them, or hired it done.

Many very small boats can actually go out fishing very far. I don't want to be on any though.  :shock:


http://www.aug.edu/~sbajmb/pictures/Best-of-Aruba-2004-Web/01.jpg
http://www.americatravelling.net/caribbean/aruba/images/fishing_boats.jpg
http://www.aruba-travelguide.com/trip-reports/2004/petra/photos/fishing_boat.jpg

Results 1 - 10 of about 190,000 for Aruba sucks

arubasucks.info            NUMBER 3 on page 1  :cool:

Yes exactly.  The search is only about 4 miles off shore (I believe).  I've been in a boat about the size of Koens 26 miles to Catalina. 

 :lol: :lol:

it is funny aint it  :P :cool:

i still want to know WHO reigstered  VANDERSLOOTS.com 

and what they will be doing with it

You really should do something with the other pages to that website.  :wink:

I have been from Key West to Dry Tortugas on a boat that size. 
It is around 40 miles.

YES i will

you think its ok to link to this site?

this site has a lot more info... YES _____   NO _______


 :cool:

The main difference in Lorenzo and Koen and Freddie is the fact that we have one police interview as a witness only, no detention as wrongly claimed, for Lorenzo and the rest is pure speculation and rumor.  Yet we have a whole thread dedicated just to trashing him.  Why? 

With Koen and Freddie, we have oodles of photos of them out pimping in the bars with Joran.  Where are the ones of Lorenzo doing that? Joran discusses them extensively in his book especially Freddie yet does not so much as mention Lorenzo yet we have Lorenzo trashed from here to hell and back based on nothing.

Freddie and Koen gave multiple statements and yet we don't go after them the same way we do Lorenzo.  Nor anybody else for that matter.  I am trying to maintain a bit of faith in Hans Mos and he says no one is involved other than the primary suspects.  Jossy confirmed that he could make no connection to Lorenzo in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway (not the drug arrest as was claimed Jossy meant) or that he is actually related in any way to Joran.  I believe if it were true, he could.

I have never claimed I was there and know what happened.  I wasn't and I don't but I think it is just as wrong to go after Lorenzo based on zilch as it is for the Rejects to go after the MB kids.  At least we know they were there for a fact.  We have no proof he even knew Joran.

I don't know.  Maybe Lorenzo did kill Natalee at a Rave Party in the tunnels under his house that go all the way well over five miles to the sea beside the armed guard posts after killing his father and making snuff and underage porn with Paul Brough and before selling Natalee into slavery with Colombian drug cartels and Arabs with yachts and using his alleged cigarette boat to dispose of her body and is the illegitimate son of Paulus van der Sloot.  He might also be from Mars.

Guess I just don't have enough imagination.  But before I accuse somebody of things like that, I just like to have an inkling, one shred of actual proof that he even knew these people.

I have yet to see it. 


But I am very weary of being attacked for not being in agreement with the majority here and also having it claimed that every single time someone mentions Lorenzo, I defend him.  That is a LIE.  Go back through the thread and see how many days he was discussed and I said absolutely nothing.  I don't until it starts getting too deep, the BS, that is.

Why am I attacked every time I say I don't find any proof of his involvement?  Instead of attacking me personally, show me the PROOF and I will gladly reconsider his involvement.



.

:smt052 :smt052 :smt052 :smt052 :smt052

Okay -- I have  just caught up.
It seems to me that we are all just a little linged un-hinged tonight. Maybe, just maybe the Persistence crew is about to give us a miracle.

killer on a bike

Anna, I am glad you spoke up and I respect that you did so. Lorenzo is mentioned so often, any information is appreciated. I never understood the Lorenzo interest. Things should be more clear cut, but nothing in this case is clear, except for the fact that Natalee left in the company of the 3 punks and has not been seen since.

killer on the loose

Tamikosmom's speculations ... speculations that include all formal suspects who were detained in the Natalee Holloway case as well as Freddy and Lorenzo ... speculations that are liable to change at a moment's notice.  :lol:

Other than Dave Holloway's implication in regards to Joran being picked up by the school bus on the highway near Lorenzo's home ... my backup for Lorenzo's role in the Natalee Holloway case is very limited .. it is all based on "rumors" posted on the internet in the days following Natalee's disappearance.

There was a "rumored" 6:30 AM call from the VDS' cell to Steve Croes on the morning Natalee went missing. Apparently the origins of this call was traced to the Santa Lucia area which is the area where Lorenzo lives and ..... then there was a "rumored" search of Lorenzo's home and car and ...... during that search some of Natalee's clothing were found in Lorenzo's basement. It is "rumored" that Lorenzo is Joran's half brother and …..in the intitial stages of the investigation Lorenzo was questioned and released ….. a connection is implied.  Also ... Dave Holloway claims that Joran was driven to a location on the highway near Lorenzo's home to be picked up by the school bus on the morning of May 30, 2005.

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++

OCKHAM'S RAZOR
"You must never fail to adopt the simplest idea as your working hypothesis. If necessity demands, you can dump it later when you have more data, but only because it is no longer the simplest idea" or "entities should not be multiplied beyond necessity."


1.  Freddy is waiting at the VDS' residence ... with his camera ... when Satish, Deepak and Joran arrive with a drugged Natalee after leaving Carlos 'N Charles'.


2.  Guido arrives in his own vehicle at the same time.


3.  In an attempt to escape a gang rape Natalee sustains a head injury.


4.  As the sexual assault ensues Natalee appears to pass out.


5.  The decision is made to take Natalee to the beach where she can sleep it off and ... make her own way to the HI in time to catch her flight back home.


6.  Guido leaves the scene.


7.  Joran, Deepak and Freddy ... enroute to the beach ... drop Satish off at home.


8.  Deepak drops off Joran, Freddy and a "passed out" Natalee at the beach.


9.  Deepak parks his vehicle a short distance away at the tennis club and returns to the beach on foot.


9.  In the meantime ... Freddy and Joran realize that Natalee is deceased.
 

10.  Leaving a deceased Natalee on the beach ... Joran, Deepak and Freddy run across the street to Deepak parked vehicle.  In the heat of the moment Joran ends up in the driver's seat.


11.  A panicked discussion ensues.  When it is considered that Joran, Deepak and Satish were observed leaving Carlos 'n Charlie's  ... the injury and the DNA evidence on Natalee's person could be very incriminating.


12.  Paulus is contacted.
 

13.  The gardener enters the picture.  He observes Joran, Deepak and Freddy in the parked vehicle.


14.  Paulus arrives and ... accesses the situation.


15.  Assistance in moving a deceased Natalee is required.  Geoffrey van Cromvoirt and Steve Croes are contacted.


16.  Deepak and Freddy leave the scene.


17.  A short time later Joran is sent home walking ... enroute he contacts Deepak on his cell.


18.  Paulus with draws from ATM.  Steve Croes and Geoffrey van Cromoirt require to paid for services rendered.


19.  Natalee is placed in a white pickup which GVC has access to through his employment with the Beach Patrol.


20.  Natalee is taken to Lorenzo's home and temporarily placed in the basement.


21.  On June 1, 2005 ... Natalee's remains are observed by Junior being taken from a white pickup and placed in the landfill ... covered by a child's plastic pool and ... then covered with garbarge.


22.   Junior conveys his observation to his brother who ... relays the account to the Aruban authorities.


23.  A short time laer ... the Aruban authorities remove Natalee's remains from the landfill and ... she is buried or ... taken out to sea or ... both.


24.  On July 27, 2005 ... Junior approaches Natalee's family and conveys the "exact" same account of his observation at the landfill ... the "exact" same account which his brother related to Aruban authorities two months earlier.


25.  A search of the dump is organized by TES and Dave Holloway.


26.  A child's plastic pool is located in the location in the landfill that Junior had specified where Natalee had been place.   

++++++++++++++++++++


Dave Holloway
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
February 23, 2006
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11541055/

HOLLOWAY:  Yes, it is hard to hear, and you know, it just tells me how these guys were.  You know, he probably—they probably did go to his apartment.  That's what I believe because his apartment is separated from the house.  You're not going to take a girl to the beach.  And I think something—if you'll recall, in some of the earlier statements that mentioned something bad happened.  And I think something bad happened with all three of them involved.  That's why we haven't had a break in the case.  They're all sticking together.  And they probably got her as close to the Holiday Inn as they could without anyone seeing them.  And the closest place was the beach north of the Marriott.  And then they went directly across the street, as confirmed by the gardener, and that's where they started making up their story, I believe.  And then after that, you know, we're not sure what happened.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11541055/

i just threw up in a my mouth a little bit  :cool:

Robots,

They have been picking on me about Lorenzo like they did us on the shoes.  Next they will be trying to make me eat a bug!

So I guess that is two subjects now that I am not allowed to post about.

Oh, make that three.  Not allowed to say Joran was at school on Monday, either!  Susie Gitman just confirmed it but nevermind.

The list of things I am not allowed to post about is growing and soon there won't be anything left, I guess.

I think that's the idea, however.  Agree or shut up.

.

There is Poppin' Fresh....haven't seem him in so long.

garbage carrying garbage

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah I guess it's OK..when in doubt ask Red  :wink:

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Anna
i think they love you and i think they like you and i think you feel the same way towards them
 and i think everyone is frustrated
i know i am and yet all of us here are on the same team and even great teams
get into little fights.... i will eat all the bugs for you and i will eat them all for everyone else
cause girls shouldnt eat bugs...

you are good , very good and everyone else here is very good

you know when i talk to you...when im typing i always call you Annabelle
i dont know why but i just do

send me over some grasshoppers before kermit gets here...he likes em too  :cool: :smt052

LOL

LOLLLL

I did, too, but for a very different reason, I am sure.

.

a real athlete
a real delicious sporter

he can drink 5 yards in under 2 minutes

he can rape 5 girls in 4 days

he can steal hundreds of dollars from his parents ina few short hours

he can kill 3 dogs in under 30 minutes

SUPER KILLER

 :-x :-x :-x :-x :-x

i want you to feel nice  :wink:

Anna, I am not picking on you. I just feel the fact that Lorenzo was questioned early on in the investigation means someone had to bring up his name. Because Dennis Jacobs doesn't feel he is important to the case is a BIG RED FLAG to me. Dave seemed to feel he was of interest in the case. His name came up way too fast to just be a coinky dink. Until I see proof he wasn't somehow involved I will stick with MOO that he knows plenty.

   :shock: :shock: :shock:  man boobs!

Robots,

Yes, you always eat the bugs for me.  Thank you!

But neither one of us should be having to do that in the first place.  I didn't say a word for four days while Lorenzo was discussed yet when I do, it's the same old same old of EVERY time somebody mentions Lorenzo, you blah blah blah.  No, I don't.

Well, go figure.  Why are some so worried about my posts anyway?  I think I should be able to post what I think the same as anybody else but apparently not.  I'm not real big on anybody that deflects from the Sloots right now and tend to believe Mos is correct in that regard.

Have been saying for several months that my list of suspects is shrinking all the time.  Michael Dompig said Paulus went out on Gottenbos boat around the time Natalee disappeared.  Maybe he wasn't lying.  Who knows.

Just hope the Perseverance is successful.  But even then what?  It would be wonderful to find Natalee AND some evidence of who put her there but not going to get on that roller coaster again.

People ask me for proof all the time but I am not allowed to do it back.  So many rules for me to remember, not sure it's worth it.

.

I think Lorenzo is such a popular topic because in the beginning many of the local Aruban posters were mentioning him and his parties and the drugs.  That to me makes him open for discussion.  If you believe Lorenzo was just a distraction because he was mentioned by posters such as Arubagirl and Native Lingo and AmericaninAruba and others as a distraction...I disagree.  He was into something sinister otherwise his name would not have come up so soon in this case.  Whether he is involved is still unknown.  It is the same as talking about any of the other people such as Mr. Pink or Boeti.  Their names came up and they are fair game...especially if they were questioned or provided an alibi.  What about that Menses guy...we don't much about his part in all this but we still asked questions and speculated.  I say Lorenzo is fair game in a discussion until it's proven he's not.  Otherwise, we need to end all discussion concerning Freddy.  He was only a witness also until they nailed him for the porn video charges and that went away also. For that matter let's not discuss Julia Renfro any longer she is not involved in this crime and neither is Tito.

Infact I remember reading in Dave's book that Lorenzo's name appeared on a chart on the wall in Jacobs office. When Dave reportedly asked about it........he was blown off. Why would it be there if it was not significant ?

Okay, dammit I'm gonna say it.  Anna, I respect and love you to death for your knowledge, concern, empathy, and detail to this case that you have given for 2 1/2 years. I don't think there is anyone who has put more into this than anyone (with the exception of maybe than Klaass and Red) who is not totally convinced that J2K and their immediate cohorts perpetrated this crime. Did Lorenzo have a role?? Good Lord -- I don't know, but his name certainly comes up a lot and I'm not willingly to dismiss him and his possible involvement simply because someone on the island states they "don't think so." Please don't get so offended when someone simply puts out an opposing opinion.

If you are talking to me, I NEVER said Lorenzo should not be discussed, just that some proof of his involvement would sure be nice once in a while and I think I should be able to state my opinion without being attacked which so far has yet to happen.

Why can only some state their opinion about him but not me?  Without being attacked, that is.

.

.

its worth it. :)
like i said, we need you and we need everyone to keep fighting.
we need everyone...
plus, if you were to leave then i might have to visit you and you might be skeeeeered of robots so we cant have that... so i  will jsut keep eating bugs for you  :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

"hope" is not a strategy

hope is not a strategy

but sometimes it all we got  :cool:

It seems to me that there are so many people inextricably linked in crime in Aruba, that I'm not sure anyone who has ever been considered a suspect should be totally dismissed at this point. I hate the term "think outside the box," but sometimes that's where the answers come from.

BT baby


i say
THROW the BOX AWAY  :cool:

Time for a game of Scrabble with hubby and ... then calling it a night.

Janet

HAPPY NEW YEAR MONKEYS!!!

Wreck,

Lorenzo was discussed here for four days and I didn't say one word.  Go back through the threads and see how many times he was discussed and I didn't open my mouth.

What are you accusing me of now?  Why can't I express my opinion same as anybody else?

Don't say I defend Lorenzo EVERY TIME somebody mentions him for that's not true.  You have said that before but it doesn't make it so.

I didn't say a word for days and usually don't but boy when I do, I should just shut up, right?

Sorry, not gonna happen.  I will state my opinion until I am banned from here whether you, Lala's or anybody else likes it.

I can't for the life of me understand why people go bonkers because I don't agree on this one person about whom we know absolutely nothing for a fact.

You have this very backwards.  I am the one with the dissenting opinion who is attacked every time I express it.

.

 :lol: :lol: :lol: :smt052

I was not talking to you... :roll:

Nite Janet

Oh, Wreck. You're a sweet talker! That's been on my mind and in my heart as well. Let's all be mindful of their efforts!  :wink:

Leave me out of this...I did not start this Lorenzo discussion last night and I refuse to take the blame for it.  I don't care if you disagree or not.  I have only addressed one post to you today so don't think everything I write is about you. I simply was simply trying to figure out why Lorenzo is such a hot topic and stated so in a post. You know I consider him only as a peripheral person in all this.  He was talked about early on and I think that is fair game to discuss his possible involvement.

I think all any of us are doing is stating our opinion about Lorenzo. I don't see it as attacking or jumping on anyone when I state MOO or ask questions.
We get asked to prove his involvement but NO ONE has proven to me he was not involved.

I will say it once more. Anna -- we are not attacking you for your OPINION. You are certainly welcome to it. Hell, you are probably right. It just seems you get a little bent when anyone expresses anything different. The only way we can ever get to the truth is for for all of us to keep an open mind. We need you here and your opinons!

Good.

How is not saying a word for four days getting a little bent, Wreck?

I didn't realize we had been talking about Lorenzo for 4 days now?  I thought it started last night.  Darn it! I missed something.  I thought we were talking about the 5th suspect being Freddy?  :roll:

Have had a gutfull of this nonsense for tongiht.

But I get the picture.  Either agree with the majority or shut up.

Good Night and Happy New Year!

.

if we throw out the WHOLE idea of joran ever being at the beach
(i never thought for a moment from the GET GO they were ever at the beach )
according to joran he didnt have a condom and yet that was the WHOLE reason he was trying to pick up girls.... oh and yes with all the people that JORAN SAYS were at the beach... he could have asked one of them.....

PUT A FORK IN THE BEACH STORY once for all  :cool:

No, that's when I started talking about him and all hell broke loose.  Go back throught the threads and you will see his name mentioned several times a day with no response from me at all.

Goodnight Anna, sweet dreams. 

i agree beach was a lie, condom a lie from another night another "pick-up" probably .....a pathological liar.

The beach story has never been confirmed by anyone other than J2K.  Not one single person, tourist, couple, security, fisherman, not one.

Baloney.  Stick a fork in that story Robots, once and for all!

yes BB
and why not just call the k2 brothes to just deliver him a condom, he was having them cart him all over the place anyway.........

see it makes  ZERRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOO sense  :cool:

They probably pass em out at C&C's as party favors!  In fiesta colors!

Anna,
When you see a post about Lorenzo maybe you could just
skip ober.  That is what I do with subjects that bother me.

yep OK

so, lets move forward and simply list the options
that could have happened

1. drove to another isolated area

2. sloot house of horrors

3. ?

4. ?

yep

I don't think they went to the beach either, but she could have been there for a while.
..
I also don't think that there were alot of ppl involved, just the three and then Paulus and Ben Vocking ( much later ).
..
Someone here last week mentioned a key to the restaurant where Deepak's mother worked. I believe it was for the meat freezer. What do I think of that ? That that was something else that had nothing to do with this case. Like having the key, taking a box of meat when the opportunity arose. You know, wanna buy  zzzzz ? where you know the stuff  ''fell off the back of a truck ?" kinda thing. What we have learned on this journey is that there are plenty of sleazy characters doing plenty of things. Maybe that's why we have so many sleaze balls to focus in on.   

Robots, I still have to wonder about a private party. It has never been disproven. MOO

Just as options, (I think the Sloot's)

The Lion's Den

The Light House

And what get me is the MSM still says at the beach...Greta has it down to a science and it always includes Boeti.  Even JQK has been known to say it on occasion.  I have to wonder about the beach story...Shango says it never happened. MOO

Robots wrote;


3. Party at Lorenzo's (   :smt096  :smt091 :smt084)

Back seat of the car (jogger witness)

 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Since we think she went to the Sloots, maybe there was a party there.  You know, with Freddy out by the pool.

I think Grater got the Boeti crap from her "sources" on Aruba. aka renho, tacojoe

the sloots had a pool ?   correct ??


anyone else

Great needs to pay attention to the story.  The only ones who ever told the beach story are J2K.
They also told the Holiday Inn story and the Security Guard Story.  end of story.

Whatever they did after they left C&C's had to include Paulus.  Why else would he lie to the ALE about having left the casino before Natalee and her friends were there?  We see you Paulus.

Why did you lie to the police?

I bet Freddy had one and probably a lot of people on Aruba that we have talked about lately.

Yep the sloot dump has a pool. Maybe Lorenzo's house had one too? Maybe the Gottenbos?

I wish just once that JQK would stop Greta right then and explain to her that even Dompig said they didn't go to the beach and that Boeti is not involved.  Just once.  That is something that needs to stop on her part.

I know! MSM basis that solely on Joran's word, I suppose. Heaven Forbid they should question that!

Not Great Greta!  That one always slides past spell check.  Bah!

Me too. I thnk that they, the they being the Joran supporters said :
OK, lets do an exercise consisting of : Joran, Deepak and Satish are telling the truth  :lol: :lol:, therefore, let us look at the sleazy charcters we know of who are capable of this, or who would have been around the back of the HI, and invent some scenarios for the ALE to look at.

Guido's house maybe?  Or GVC?  I would think a lot of the elite Dutch kids families had them..you know the Sloots didn't live as well as the other Dutch elite, wonder why?  MOO

hmmmm

do you think there were any ANTS in the K2 car or was it all a lie

the only thing i can think of if they were at the LANDFILL and actually did get some ants in the car

then again, the ants story could be a total lie

what you all think ?

yep

Lame ass excuse for cleaning the car in the middle of the night.

The only thing crawling in that car were the 3 who made sure Natalee was drugged.
Slimy Ba*tards, the lot of them!!

No ants!  though I did get little red spiders in my car once...but only a couple

i agree, but it might explain the ants being there because they were at the landfill which is full of GARBAGE which attracts insects and bugs

i think Natalee died that night and they also got rid of her body that night

BUT, i think PAULUS was the one that helped, because thats HOW PUKE BOY got home

4:00   

If it gets dry enough, I have seen ants in a car.

1. raped her

2. killed her

3. taken to the landfill

4. home before 4 30 am

No ants...made it up.  They had cleaned the car before for ants and that was as good an excuse as any to explain why they were out in the early morning hours cleaning that car.  I think they were cleaning vomit out of the car.  I have always thought that Natalee got sick from riding in the backseat and she threw up on Joran. Now, blood would need a complete redo...it's not that easy to clean with just plain water.

most cases like this are simple and not complicated


landfill search was no allowed for very long -  (i think )

very possible

Let's not forget that when confronted at the Sloot dump , the first contact, Joran denied knowing who Natalee was. Now he could have forgotten her name,
but didn't Paulus call him about the girl whose parents were at the house, that should have been a memory jog. It was deny, then get caught, then deflect. then make up another lie. Then blame the man in the moon. Or the security guys. Or the girl's mother who indeed was rather annoying and an Americano.
..
Anna, please don't get so upset. I didn't think there was an attack or attempt to hush you. We all have different opinions as we all have read different things and spoken to different people. 

My friend who was given the date rape drug threw up repeatedly for hours.

 I don't think they took her to the landfill. Not this time.

*******,
Where you been all day?  We have missed you.

That's the problem.  Curtailed the landfill search...permit violation, covered over what had been searched, fire, etc.

Curtailed the water search....divers not allowed into the water, Dompig too busy to make a phone call for Tim Miller to get equipment for deep water search.

On and on.  They didn't allow anything remotely helpful.

Very possible that Nat threw up in the car.

hmmmmmmmmm.... i dont think they hid her that night, i mean they could have
but i think paulus wanted to hide her somewhere.. the landfill was the fastest best way

but im open to all other ideas 

Think about this...I have always wondered about the statement of blood in the car...still it is like everything else...nothing but what someone says...so all we have to go on is chocolate and cleaning fluid. The family was told there was blood, but no proof.  So we are at a stalemate on that too.  There is a reason the FBI did not get anything from ALE.

what im trying to say... is that i think they put her in the landfill THAT night
they didnt hide her temporarily that night and try a more permament place later on

im split between the abandoned septic tank and the landfill

I bet she threw up, and I hope/bet she did it right on Jorans big galoot shoes.

I think they put her in the Sloot's potting shed until the next day
and then took her out to sea.

The first 48 hours are crtitical in these types of cases, the longer the time drags on, the less likely a good solution is found.
So, why would Mos start in about who or what is to blame ..
There was no competent investigation from the get go, anything that happened afterwards, months later could not have affected the first few days or week.   

J2K could have done the landfill thing without Paulus...no need for him.  Paulus did not take her to the landfill...too risky...she could be found there the next day with evidence on her body.  No Paulus needed to be sure that she was gone and would never be found.  He had to call in a favor from someone...he had to either get a boat.  You don't just drive over with a dead body and borrow a boat without someone knowing.  He didn't have his own boat. If he used a boat...it was a very close friend that would never, ever, ever tell. The person that loaned him the boat knows all.  Now, if he hid her away...where would that be?  Close to him so he could watch everything and move when the time was right.  If he went the incinerator route that person would have to be either paid off or just offed.  Too many loose ends.  I was intrigued by the suggestions of dumping her in one of the caves with the deep caverns only accessible by rappelling.  She was buried somewhere at sometime, that is why Joran made up that story...he knew she had been buried at one time.

Hi Magnolia,

It's Sunday and I am normally glued to the TV for football  :lol: Thx for the kind words..It's nice to be missed  :D

I think she told them she was getting sick on the way to the Lighthouse or the Sloots.  That is why they stopped for Deepak to pee.  She threw up or thought she was going to vomit and then got back in the car.  She knew something was wrong in a lot of ways.  You know, when you are sick to your stomach, everything else goes by the wayside.  You don't pay attention to anything but how you feel. She had no idea what was happening until it was too late.  Had she not been so sick and drugged she would have been more able to get away.  Deepak just let it happen and did nothing to help her. He was the oldest there and he could have stopped it all by taking her back to the hotel.  Beth knew it when she asked him if he tried to help Natalee...the look on his face said volumes to me.

Yes, we missed you.  If you had stayed gone another 24 hours we could have said we had not seen you since last year.

There were some good football games today.
Hope you enjoyed all of yours.

Thanks to the corrupt cover up perpetrated by Karin Janssen, the ALE, and the corrupt Justice officials, we don't know what happened next.  If only forensic evidence had been collected, we may have some idea.  The clothing that J2K were wearing that night would have told us much about where they were......but it was never collected.  The car could have told us much, as well.  A complete search of the residences could have told us much, but it did not happen.

The clean up was underway and the fix was in.....early on.

Shame on you Karin Janssen........the corrupt prosecutor, who was pursuing the security guards that she knew had no involvement.

We just have no idea what happened after they left C&C's, due to the cover up,

The Caribbean Court of Justice is a joke.  The Hague is a joke.

The looked the other way just long enough to clean everything up.  That is evident when Beth talks about her trip to the police station.  They were still trying to get their ducks in a row and they just looked the other way until it was done.  Jacobs is guilty of cover up. KJ is guilty of looking the other way too.  No telling how many more non Dutch are in KIA falsely accused as scapegoats for the Dutch elite.

It has occurred to me that the "I didn't have a condom" speech was to let everyone know he did not plan to have sex with NH, but since "she asked for sex" and he never does this without a condom, he couldn't have.  It would serve to protect him from premeditation.  It would also occur to me that people who rape would most likely not care if they had a condom or not.  Isn't he just the nicest boy?  gag.

The problem that I have with the potting shed is that there were two dogs at the Sloots. That would not have worked for long.
Maybe they took the two dogs back to the beach area at some point to find her again. Joran sounded like he was drunk, maybe he couldn't find the exact location where she was dumped. Perhaps in the mango grove, they sit in car, discuss, then decide if she is found they will find that shit and they will be implicated. Time to get Paulus involved. No body no case. 

yep

IMO, Paulus was already involved.  If not, why did he lie to the police about what time he left the casino?

LOL! Thx :)

I agree with all the last few posts,I also believe Natalee was sick and before they arrived at the destination she was out cold. She was fighting consciousness when Satish put that Porn DVD in and it was a clue what they had planned.  She was definetly at the VDS property,died and I believe moved to the shallow grave. Could be PVDS withdrew money to pay people to dig that grave,hush money or use of a boat or even  medical treatment/supplies.  When the media attention and searches started they moved her again. It's possible she was at the Landfill but I think they buried her out to sea. It's a tiny island surrounded by water and I think it's the best and easiest way to get rid of a body forever,besides cremation..

It's getting late for me, monkeys.  See you all tomorrow!

nite Helen, I see there are a few other "night owls" still here tonight.  I've been trying to get caught up.  Has there been an update from the search today?  I didn't find one on Kyle's site, did anyone talk to any of them today that's posted something?

Because Paulus is in up to his eyeballs in something else. I don't think the little kiddo was at home that night that early. He didn't have to go home to feed him, maybe he went somewhere else later. Maybe he too is a liar. Maybe he wanted to distance himself from the entire thing. And hope that if he just played his I can't remember game, it would all go away.
But, tonite is the first time it crossed my mind about coming back to the beach with two dogs to look for her. Further up the beach in a northerly direction.

I haven't seen any updates today. I would imagine they are only doing the ROV dives in daylight while they continue the sonar at night. The next few days are crucial in finding Natalee and if they find her they have camera's on that ROV and it will all be captured on film. I hope to god they are in the right area.
-----------------------------------
Paulus lying about what time he left the casino is very interesting. Did he lie to distance himself from Joran or was he up to no good?

I know exactly what you mean *******, I'm hoping they are in the right area too.  There has been so much going on in my mind about Paulus.....I'd not discussed the case with my husband's family much until Christmas day.  My father in law believes that she was chosen for someone prominent and was sold.  He said she was beautiful and perfect to bring a very high price.  I told him that I had heard early on that there was a Prince on the island during the time she was there if I remembered correctly but I thought that angle had been resolved.  I told him what I knew including about PVDS being in the casino...the atm transactions...etc..to see if he would agree with my belief that she is out there in the ocean.  He never would agree with me and is someone that I respect his opinion in most all situations so it's really had me thinking...  I still have faith that Tim Miller knows a lot more than I do and that they wouldn't be out there unless he truly believes that's where she is.  I am so hoping that they will find the answer out there.....and soon.

They all had pools.......

Excellent advice Magnolia.
I have to do that all the time with some subjects and some posters or I would be a candidate for a long sleeved white jacket.
 :cool:

So, I'm new to posting here, but I've been reading y'all for years (:sad:) now. It doesn't seem likely that this post will be recognized any more than my others, but I must rant.   I can't imagine coming here and not seeing posts by either Anna or Lala'sMom.  Each of you have given me, and most likely thousands of others, something to ponder, a new approach to old questions, a different perspective.  We all have a common goal and that goal has no hope if either of you aren't participants.  Please, put aside your differences, agree to disagree, snipe at each other in private, figure this out however you will, but most importantly, don't exclude us from your thoughts.  You each bring an unique perspective to the conversation that's significant because all we have are unanswered questions.  /rant off

I feel sorry for that boy...  :sad:

That looks like jizz on his shirt......how gross!!

I turned in early last night and this morning I am getting caught up. Back in the last thread someone asked when Lorenzo's dad died...many have seen this site before, but here it is again: Oct. 20, 2001
Rijn van,  Paul  Haarlem  27-12-1958   Astrid Traksel Aruba 20-10-2001
scroll down to near bottom>>
http://www.members.lycos.nl/bidprentjes/2001/2001r.htm

"Deepak came with 2 dogs" ...... ??  :idea:

texasmom....my DH believes that Natalee was sold. He has not followed the case, except to be blasted by the TV which I was constantly watching early on. Male opinion I guess?

The first week in June 2005, AM Digital kept announcing the three boys had sex, behind the lighthouse.  I believe there is some truth to the story.  The game was to have someone with you so the sex can be stated as consensual, which also came out in the early reports.

I believe Natalee was temporarily placed somewhere where they were worried she would be found and they were accounting for the DNA.  When she was permanently disposed of and the party line of the wild American wouldn't wash, they changed their story.

BY DAVE GOLDINER NEW YORK DAILY NEWS DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Cops in Aruba charged two hotel security guards yesterday in the mysterious disappearance of a vacationing Alabama high school beauty - as FBI divers prepared to join the search for her. The attorney general of the Caribbean island said the men met 18-year-old Natalee Holloway sometime after she was last seen at a bar during a graduation trip over the Memorial Day weekend.

"The [suspects] have a relationship with the disappearance," said Attorney General Caren Janssen. "There is a reasonable suspicion they may be involved."

Investigators earlier questioned three other men, who told them they had sex with Holloway after meeting her at the bar in the Caribbean paradise.
It was unclear whether those men, who were freed, pointed cops to the two latest suspects, aged 28 and 30, who work at a hotel near the Holiday Inn where Holloway was staying."

Quote from San:

Did you ever notice that Freddy is as almost as untouchable as Lorenzo.  Nothing sticks to Freddy.





I can find absolutely nothing on Freddy's Dad! Nothing! And found only a couple of things on the stepfather, that were a little weird. Don't recall exactly what it was now, so will have to go back and revisit.

Update

Mon 31-Dec - 1022hrs

The Persistence spent yesterday performing multiple dives with the ROV. The purpose of the dives is for collecting video of each sonar target. Typically, the sonar target is quickly identified and ruled out from the ROV video. The ROV operations lasted until dusk, where we resumed sonar survey operations through the night. Today, we are performing more ROV dives on targets of potential interest.

http://nholloway.blogspot.com

The equipment and the crew are absolutely amazing!!!
God Bless the crew of the Persistance!!! We are constantly praying for you!!!

Klaas,
Good morning!! May I ask a favor? You know me...computer illiterate!! :roll: I would like to e-mail to my address book the front page article on C&C's. Would you e-mail me a link to the article? I don't know how to capture it for an e-mail.
Thanks!

I just resent it to you.  If you are going to forward it to you address book use the 2nd one I sent OK?

Morning everyone.  Question...I should know this but I don't.  Of those that arrived with Beth and Jug that first day was there anyone associated with the FBI with them? I was reading some old stuff last night and was wondering whether true or not?  TIA

Some of the earlier posters just make me go  :shock: :shock:

Take this excerpt from a FP post of June 10, 2005:

now I might understand Jacob’s unhappiness with this bar to some extent- my sister has been to Aruba several times, I’ve been once and I will go again, regardless of this incident, the bottomline is you keep an eye on your drink at all times and don’t get into a car with 3 guys, without at least 3 girls, this rule applies in Canada, the US as well as anywhere in the Caribbean if you are female…..

however on her last trip, my sister befriended a Dutchman who worked at her hotel, now he was a perfect gentlemen - just that he was the water sports guy and drug dealer for that beach and she saw a seamier side of Aruba hanging around with this guy, it was also Carnavale weekend so the island was nuts, a lot of Columbians and Venezualans on the island and she found those men to be very aggressive……now she is not a naive person but she was taken aback by the amount of drugs flowing around everywhere…….it changed her perception of quaint little Aruba somewhat but she is still planning to go back, we were planning to in April but we thought the prices were still too high, we were looking for a deal……..

With all the lies that have been told from day 1, I just don't know who to believe!

 My personal opinion is that they did go to the beach but not sure how long they stayed.  I think this because Urine tried his best to put this off on the 2k's.

By the way, if you "know the truth but aren't ready to tell it yet but someday you will" is that not obstruction of justice?  If the 3 Stooges can't be held for murder, what about the other crimes that can be proven???

Morning!....I asked this a while back and a very helpfu Monkey, sorry I can't recall who, told me that Jody Bearman announced that she was an agent. I read later that this was at the Sloots and at the HI, but don't quote me on the HI.

Good morning monkeys!

Truthfully, I can't discount the theory of kidnapping and sale or trade of some sort.  Thanks to the corrupt Justice officials, ALE, and judges, We simply have no idea what happened to Natalee after she was kidnapped by Joran, Deepak, and Satish.  We do know now that these three, especially Joran, has a history of drugging girls and raping them, some local girls and some tourists.

As far as most prevalent illegal activities worldwide, human trafficking is tied for second with arms  dealing, right after drug dealing, still at number one.  It happens much more often than most of us are aware.

It's hard to believe that after all this time, we have no real evidence as to exactly what happened to Natalee.  The Chicago AruBay videos certainly look like a crime scene cover up, and Carpe has done tons of work on identifying the body in the basin. 

The Dirty Prosecutor Karin Janssen, and the Dirty ALE, and the corrupt Dutch judges and corrupt justice officials have done an excellent job at obscuring the truth about what happened to Natalee.

If she is in the ocean, the crew of the Persistence will find her.  I'm watching and waiting with them.

To my knowledge, the only place that was being reported was RU.  Their source is likely Renfro.  Take it with a bag of salt.

So there was an FBI agent on that plane the first night? hmmmmm

And after one post...we are back to don't know.  :roll:

Lala's - please read my post above.  I don't believe there was any FBI agent with the MB group.  It was only reported at Refugees, do you want to believe them?

Tamikosmom……Sorry for the long Post, but I know what a stickler for details you are!

Steve Croes was not questioned until 6/15 and arrested on 6/17. The article I posted yesterday was dated 6/11. (See below in blue)  IMO, I do not believe the arrest of 6/11 pertains to Steve Croes. I have included all the statement dates of both Steve and Freddy, that we know of. IMO, the arrest of 6/11/2005 could pertain to Freddy.

           -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Snipped from Nancy Grace transcript which aired 6/17/2005

But first, let`s go down to Aruba and CNN correspondent Karl Penhaul. Karl, an incredible development, yet a fourth suspect behind bars tonight. Why?

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The fourth suspect that has been arrested has been named as Steven Croes, Steve Croes. Police arrested him around dawn.

What the chief police commissioner, Jan Van Der Straaten, told me when I talked to him was that his name had come up during an interrogation of the three young suspects already in custody for around ten days. What we`re also hearing is that this arrest could have been based on some kind of electronic surveillance.

Steve Croes is a D.J. on the tattoo party boat. That`s 150-foot three-deck catamaran that sails just off the west coast of Aruba with partygoers on board, usually in the evenings. And he is the D.J. on that ship. But his boss, Marcus Williams (sic), has also told us that he is an experienced seaman, as well, Nancy.

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 15 June 2005 / 16:25  Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Luigi Croes
Description: witness statement

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 17 June 2005 / 07:40  Pages: 4
Writer/Initiator. Dennis Jacobs/Luigi Croes
Description: suspect interrogation  
Responsive to Request 41

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 18 June 2005 / 16:55
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Johny Erasmus
Description: interrogation as a suspect
Responsive to Request 41

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 21 June 2005 / 13:00
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiato: Shaniro Kelly / Clyde Burke
Description: interrogation of a suspect

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 29 August 2005 / 9:15
Pages: 6
Writer/Initiator: A.R De Ruiter/ CJM Burgwal
Description: interrogation of a suspect

Name: Steve Gregg Croes
Date: 31 January 2006109:45
Pages: 4
Writer/Initiator. Dennis Jacobs / Rolando Maduro
Description: interrogation of a suspect
Responsive to Request 41



This is snipped from the article I posted yesterday:

Another Arrest Made In Case Of Missing Ala. Teen
POSTED: 9:38 am EDT June 10, 2005
UPDATED: 9:34 am EDT June 11, 2005

ORANJESTAD, Aruba -- Police in Aruba investigating the disappearance of an Alabama teenager made another arrest early Saturday. It comes just hours after police said one of three men recently arrested admitted "something bad had happened" to Natalee Holloway.

Police aren't commenting on the latest arrest, which was the sixth since Holloway went missing May 30

              ----------------------------------------------------

It appears that the status of Freddy has changed on the entries for Karen and Carmen, IMO, as only suspects are listed this way in this document. IMO this is what Jossy was referring to about the media not being informed about Freddy being arrested early in the investigation.


Name: Freddy Alexander Arambatzis
Date: 12 June 2005 / 11:05
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs & Juan Boezem
Description: witness statement of Joran van der Sloot's neighbor/friend

Name: Freddy Alexander Arambaizis
Date: 13 June 2005 / 17:00
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator. Johny Erasmus
Description: witness statement

Name: Freddy Alexander Arambatzis
Date: 16 June 2005115:30
Pages: 8
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs & Marcelino Ras
Description: witness statement

Name: Freddy Zedan
Date:17 Juni 2005
Pages: 6
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs, Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement

Name: Freddy Alexander Zedan Arambatzis
Date:28 June 2005 / 14:25
Pages: 11
Writer/Initiator: Shaniro Kelly & Haydee Nadal
Description: witness statement

Name: Freddy Zedan Arrambatzis
Date: 1 July 2005
Pages: 9
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs & Haydee Azucena
Description: witness statement

Name: Freddy Zedan Arrambatzis
Date:20 July 2005
Pages: 4
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs, Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement


Name: Freddy Alenxander Arambatzis
Date: 10 February 2006/17:15
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs /Eric Soemers
Description: interrogation of a suspect
Responsive to Request 41



Name: Karen Martina
Date: 23 June 2005113:55
Pages: 6
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs / Juan Boezem
Description: witness statement by a friend of Van der Sloot and Arrambatzis


Name: Carmen Aurora Jacopucci
Date: 28 June 2005 / 15:55
Pages: 6
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs /Marcelino Ras
Description: witness statement by a fried of Van der Sloot and Araambatzis

Take it with a bag of salt.

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

I was just asking...I don't believe everything I read. Nothing sinister in my thoughts. It struck me as funny since it came from an old, old post I had read.  My first thought was...why does it matter who came with them...then I opened mouth and inserted foot. Sorry.

Hi Lalas! I am looking in Beth's book and the Jodi that was on the plane was the travel agent that booked the trip.

Quote from Beth's book:

"The others discuss who will accompany me on the plane. The decision is made. Jug, Jodi, and two fathers of other girls who were on the trip, Mat and Ruffner, will go with me."

Lala's...sorry...Jody Bearman was not an agent, she just announced she was.  I read yesterday, and will try and find it, that van der Straaton picked up one (1) agent at the airport. I believe it was a Nancy grace transcript. Will post if I find it.

thanks Marlee...Hi!


thanks Klaas...for my old clothes!

Mum
This goes back to status again...in Aruba they seem to say your are arrested even when they are just asking you about your alibi. You are detained..which is actually arrested...to give statements or provide shoe sizes or whatever.  It's a translation thing to me.  I am not sure the difference between witness and suspect other than the ability to lie and get away with it.  That is why it is confusing to a lot of people...they seem to all be witnesses down there and not suspects or maybe that's the other way around. I think you are almost there Mum, now let's say we all agree that Freddy was the 5th suspect.  Where does that leave us?  What good is it now?  Freddy needs to tell the truth.  So why haven't the Kalpoes made an effort to explain that?  It seems to me that would get them off the hook...if Freddy was involved...why would Joran be afraid of Freddy?  Did Freddy meet Natalee a few days before?  Just throwing that out there. 

And it is a crime for a witness to lie but not for a suspect?

Don't know if I believe all that Shango and Simian stuff but I agree when the 3 Stooges were in the police car they did say Freddie needs to tell the truth so I think he is up to his neck in this!

Yep, I agree he's either up to his neck or he knows the truth.

I don't think anything is a crime in Aruba.

Welcome 88...what you say?  LOL  Just kidding.  Yes you are right...but what does Freddy need to tell?  That is the question.

Well, sorry but another question...all the Pv's that we have here came from whom?  How did we get those? Having a senior moment...sorry.

I don't know but I can only guess.  It was said that the PV's could be had at a price.  Remember Greta had the PV's.  They probably filtered out from there.  I would not assume they came from the family.  That said, I really don't know.

Parents beware, the lure of Aruba is the PROMISE OF ALCOHOL AND DRUGS TO UNDERAGE TEENEAGERS ON A SAFE HAPPY LITTLE ISLAND. THEY FULLFILL THE FIRST TWO PROMISES TO CREATE PREY FOR THE SEXUAL PREDATORS ARUBA NURTURES. THE 3RD PROMISE IS A CRUEL JOKE. THE TRUTH IS THAT, AS DEPAK SO CANDIDLY AND OPENLY TOLD THE WORLD, THEY VIEW OUR DAUGHTERS AS SLUTS WHO DESERVE TO BE GANG RAPED AND ARE DISGUSTED BY THEM. WHOSE MEN AND BOYS CAN ONLY HAVE NON CONSENUAL SEX WITH COMATOSE WOMEN FOR SOME REASON, APPARENTLY SAVING THEIR ROMANTIC SEX FOR THEIR BOYFRIENDS THAT JOIN THEM IN THE GANG RAPES. THE SAFTEY OF THE TOURIST IS FAR FROM THE MIND OF THE LOCAL'S PARENTS, EVIDENCED BY ANUDDER VON SLUT. THEIR (TOURISTS) LIVES ARE WORTHLESS ACCORDING TO THEIR LEGAL INSTITUTIONS, EVIDENCED BY JUDGE PENCIL D*CK SMITH, RUDY GOATS *SS CROES, KARIN JOKE SEN, ETC. THAT THE ENTIRE ISLAND FEELS THE US IS SO FOCKING FOR STUPID FOR TRUSTING THE ISLAND WITH OUR YOUTH IN THE FIRST PLACE, EVIDENCED BY THE POSTERS AT THE VARIOUS HATE BETH SITES.

THE TRUTH IS THAT ARUBA IS A DISNEYLAND FOR COKE HEADS AND DRUG ADDICTS, BARBARIANS FROM SOUTH AMERICA, AND THE SEXUALLY DEPRAVED FROM HOLLAND WHOM THEY LURE BY THE PROMISE OF YOUNG AMERICAN TOURISTS BEING DRUGGED AND AVAILABLE TO THEM TO LIVE OUT THEIR WARPED FANTASIES.

And that's all I've got to say about that:)

Touchee, only it should be a crime to even go to Aruba:)

Mum
Found this for you to see...been looking for days for it...AG never answers him..she must have missed his last question since she began talking about the caves after that. I will keep reading.


Jerry on June 12th, 2005 10:08 am

What about the other one or two people arrested Saturday morning has anything been said about them. People of interest or what involved in the disappearance


#  arubagirl on June 12th, 2005 10:12 am

Sarah, I think it was said that she was in the back seat. I don’t know how solid that info is.

Good morning, Golden.

Jerry, yesterday’s arrest did not have anything to do with the case.

Nan, if that’s what happened, that’s not an accident. Even if she fell, hit her head and died, they’re still going to be prosecuted.

On another note, if I read the word ‘cover-up’ one.more.damn.time., I will become a troll.


# Jerry on June 12th, 2005 10:13 am

Aruba girl do you know anything about the last arrests Saturday morning

If they had wanted to, there were instances when witnesses, not suspects have lied, and various prosecutions could have been accomplished, that possibly could have resulted in the creation of new evidence. IF THEY HAD WANTED.

Mrs. Klaasend - I have explain my departure. I hope u are not mad what I have wrote. :-|
When it is not nice PLEASE change it.  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2486.msg323591#new

Thank you!

Don't know if I believe all that Shango and Simian stuff but I agree when the 3 Stooges were in the police car they did say Freddie needs to tell the truth so I think he is up to his neck in this!
[/quote]

Welcome 88...what you say?  LOL  Just kidding.  Yes you are right...but what does Freddy need to tell?  That is the question.
[/quote]

Thanks for the welcome!  Have been reading here almost every day since Natalee went missing and I found SM through a search of her but never posted until now!  Natalee has a special place in my heart as my 6 year old granddaughter's name is Natalie!

Don't know what Freddie needs to tell but they ALL need to tell the truth! 
Can we beat them down till they do???  Sorry that was just my personal opinion and I have a way of saying what's on my mind alot!
In the good old US you can be locked up for obstruction of justice and held in contempt of court for refusing to tell what you know!  I say bring the JK2's to the USA and let us take care of them!

I really don't know what good it will do. Maybe something we post about will help
Beth and Dave, as they sure know a lot more than we do!

Lala's, yesterday I posted what I thought was an interesting observation.

Both the Kalpoes mother and stepfather were questioned on 6/2 already. Why?

I had thought I had read that they weren't even home that night, but also recall something about a door being closed, so she knew if they were home. will have to go back on that one too.

Paulus questioned 6/14 and it appears Anita and Paulus on 6/15.

I believe the Kalpoes parents were 'questioned' by Jacobs to get the story straight.

I vividly remember reading an interview transcript by Nadira, which I have not been able to find again, that stated that Satish was pacing the floor waiting for Deepak to come home from work that night. We have Satish's timeline and recounting of that night that does not tie in with Deepak's and Joran's. And he started to not answer questions or choose which ones he would answer.

Darn, I wish I could find that transcript!


I believe, but MO only, that the PV's are listed as being from Aruban Consul, I saw something to that affect on there somewhere, I believe in one of the link addresses.

Aruba girl was a lot of help in the beginning, and I have to admit, posts like mine earlier helped to run her off

Welcome 88...what you say?  LOL  Just kidding.  Yes you are right...but what does Freddy need to tell?  That is the question.
[/quote]

Thanks for the welcome!  Have been reading here almost every day since Natalee went missing and I found SM through a search of her but never posted until now!  Natalee has a special place in my heart as my 6 year old granddaughter's name is Natalie!

Don't know what Freddie needs to tell but they ALL need to tell the truth! 
Can we beat them down till they do???  Sorry that was just my personal opinion and I have a way of saying what's on my mind alot!
In the good old US you can be locked up for obstruction of justice and held in contempt of court for refusing to tell what you know!  I say bring the JK2's to the USA and let us take care of them!
[/quote]


You are a much better "speller" than Beth:)   Natalee vs Natalie

No, that's all bullshit, just like the whole Aruban Dutch Law thing.  Joran lied as a witness without consequences and he lied as a suspect without consequences.  "Lying with consequences" is applied ad lib as the powers that be, see fit.

Beth has an aunt with a southern combination name with Lee as the second part is how Natalee came to be.

Then you have not been paying attention because we have learned that being the caring family member of any tourist who mysteriously disappeared in and/or around Aruba is criminal.  Other than that, pretty cavalier about crime.  I think it's called "hard work" in Aruba, what we consider crime in the USA.

When Freddy was arrested and the Kalpoes were
brought back in for detention....I think it was Aug 2005.
It was said that Freddy was arrested for sex with an
underage girl and filming the act and the Kalpoes
and Joran were also present.
What happened to those charges?

Did all four of them skate on those charges too?

Well to make it more confusing, as their status evolved from witness to suspect, does that absolve them from earlier lies told as a witness? The judge directs the investigation in Aruba, much more so than in the US, and a judge determined to extract the truth had the tools at his disposal to at least attempt to break the weakest link in the know. The judge, prosecutor, police chief, and defense attorney all colluded to act as the defense in this case. Mos is the first entry I believe of a real force for the state who by law represents Natalee since what was done to her is a crime against the state, supposedly.

Anna, you should be able to post here just like everyone else and if you do not like what someone says, please ignore it.  I have been ignored ad nauseum here as are many others, but that should not prevent you from posting as it does not prevent me fro posting.  In fact, I was thinking about changing my screen name to "ignored."

lol...I like tylergal much better!!!

I don't have the problem you all do with being ignored...since I always talk to myself...often out loud when my son is in school...I just answer myself when no one else does :shock:...lol
I know I am probably certifiable...but works for me...hahahaha
oh gosh..just set myself up for some comments from the refugees didn't I...
hey refs..its LD not ID when you start posting!!! lol

It appears everybody skated on everything!

I wonder if my local high school libraries would accept a copy of Beth's book?

Sometimes I enjoy posting something that I know will get the
RU bunch in a snit.
Tyler is much better than Ignore. :)

Monkeys ... there is a God in heaven and ... in His perfect timing ... there will be justice for Natalee and .. there be peace for her family.  Think about it ... if we comprehended with our finite understanding ... the ways of an Absolute God ... He would not be God.  Make sense?  A small child ... as impatient as he may be ... bottom line ... he has complete faith and trust in the ways of his earthly father.  We are called upon to to what is right but ... as children of God we must learn to put our faith and trust in the ways of our Heavenly Father.  He knows every chapter ... every word of the Natalee Holloway story ... He is the Divine author.

Keep the faith and ... as the Father's tool ... continue to do what is required in the persuance of justice for Natalee and ... He will take control of the outcome.

With love, Janet

+++++++++++++

Beth Holloway
LOVING NATALEE

Page 228/229 - At the top of her closet are some boxes, heavy ones.  I pull them down and open them to find Natalee's composition notebook, which is actually a journal from a high-school English class.  It's in her handwriting.  I have never seen this before.  As I open it, I instantly feel her with me right now at this mement, like a physical presence.  Overwhelmed with this warmth, I take the journal our and sit down on her bed to read what she has written about love and life.

"Jesus Christ is the basis of Christianity and is the most influential person in my life ..."

"A hero is someone who puts others before himself.  He or she is very selfless and cares about the well-being of others.  Heroes also accept life's challenges and remain strong through tough times.  They also have a stron sense of determination and stick to goals and morals ..."


Romans 8:28
We know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.


Galatians 6:9
Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.


Psalm 37:7
Be still in the presence of the Lord, and wait patiently for him to act.  Don’t worry about evil people who prosper or fret about their wicked schemes.

SILVERFOX

Can you tell us anything more about this?

A small island community off the southern tip of Luzon had a similar event. 15,000 people who know each other's names. No murder since WWII, and then the VCRs arrived in 1998, along with some porn. Some young men watched the porn, got excited, and murdered a young woman after kidnapping her and having their way with her.

LDStlou, I agree, just talk to oneself and if ignored, no one else gets his/her feelings hurt.

Janet, that made me cry when I read that.  We know what was in Natalee's heart based on that, although we had been witness to her hard work and determination, putting the big picture ahead of the little snapshots in life.

I for one love to follow Anna's posts. I certainly agree with the above and I thought I had posted in support of Anna's thought to a certain extent. I am sure some innocent people are being wrongly shrouded in innuendo, and there are some bad guys being brought up who though they may do some bad things, their "bad things" have nothing to do with this case. And it is regrettable for that to happen. But it is a result of the cover up that it is occurring, and it is by design, so I am not sure what can be done about it. It is also a shame that being reclusive in and of itself invites, wrongly, rampant speculation and gossip. Howard Hughes comes to mind. Being misunderstood is a very painful ordeal to go thru, but I don't know how we can expect the posters to make an exception to this one person who may have involvement.

I want to go on record as apologizing in advance for causing any innocent person, and by innocent I mean who has no direct involvement with this case, pain or discomfort, and regretting that the only means I see of keeping this case open is the applying of public pressure on the authorities in Aruba, and that to do that an open inquiry in the court of public opinion must be kept lively, broad, and as always in the case where no actual evidence is made available except to the courts, prosecutor, and defense attorney, based on information that cannot be credentialed (what a sentence, I am out of breath just reading it:)). And I for one look forward to the day when the courts of Aruba do their job and accurately administer the justice to those who are guilty.

And the people of Aruba are the only ones who can insist that that be done. We want to be friends with Aruba, or I do. The potential for a great friendship is there. The liberator of your country, Bettico Croes, sought exactly that for its citizens. Well, he was right. We are, I am, your neighbors, providing us tourism will provide you with a fine living and a great quality of life. My hand is always out for you. I am waiting for you to extend yours.

This is Saturday's Diario, which I did not access until today. (Wasn't up yesterday morning.)

http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/12/29/ (http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/12/29/)

First up is Jossy's recap of a grim 2007 for Aruba.


Online Pap translation:

year new

i am completamente in desacuerdo cu the exposicion of nel tocante the economia of aruba y the logronan of his gobierno; my will owing to bise of another manera: cu b.b.o. y the aumentonan of water, coriente y gasolene, the economia of aruba owing to achieve one retraso cu is bay acentua more during 2008, y the unique logro visible of his gobierno is the record cu past owing to impone in the world of escandalo, corupcion y nepotismo.
can will other, the viahenan for brazil, china y india not owing to produci nothing for we island, excepto gastonan exorbitante, y owing to dificulta one enfoke optimjsta cu in the future immediate cosnan will can change.

besides, this was one year in cual persecucion politico owing to see one auge without precedente; tatanan of family owing to abide in they presupuestonan debi at the medidanan impositivo cu owing to forza they power of compra till at the rand of one colapso; gobierno owing to sobrepasa all boundary of gastamento y not owing to place in practica none esfuerzo for clip his gastonan; politikeria of the worse sort owing to being play cu the imagen of betico; party owing to being haci cu terenonan of pueblo; bridge owing to being work cu coin of people for faborece famia; huurnan barbaro owing to continua without mengua; was have escasez of coin for inverti in education y turismo; ministerio publico owing to let one lesion deep in the funcionamento of husticia; or as cu all will anterior is form part of the sintomanan of the malnan cu is minando even the basenan of we democracia.

of we owing to stop become one island on cual one faction y his gobierno owing to consenti during more of cinco year for maldadnan cometi cu alevosia stay impune; infraccionnan of ley owing to being poni one near for deshaci of they cu the splicacion simplista y ingenuo of 'privacidad'; one sun ministro owing to trapa on ley at his desire, inventando herencia, trahando bridge cu coin of people, regalando pier cu do not of dje, pagando financiadornan cu terenonan property of people, prestando coin big of one empresa offshore without splicacion logico of his procedencia, y neither niether cumpliendo, till where cu can owing to averigua, cu the reglamentonan of banco central, ricibiendo one carta cu oferta of soborno without denuncie at the autoridadnan competente; enfin, one caso destina for ripley's "believe it or not"!

at year 2007 we see the resurgimento of one caso cu owing to cause aruba much damage, or as the desaparicion of one child muher tourist cu owing to come for of merca for djey somenta in the compañia of three sospechoso. after of one blunder of mark parent, today none of they're sospechoso more, y the caso is at candal. the damage cause owing to become more big, y god only know till where the is bay follow afecta-nos island. for agrega at dje, behold asaltonan on turistanan fast or behind they hotelnan owing to continua even in day cla, comosifuera we industry turistico can wanta more sla of the indole ey.

seguridad personal, or as the derecho on the integridad fisico of cada ciudadano, also owing to abide the embate of one delincuencia terible, cu is lantando cabez cu forza. ladronicia, asaltonan, atakenan on caya or at home, or in business, tiramento on police, peleanan of gang, in nightclub, on caya, is manteniendo all poblacion in zozobra. will come one end at they at 2008? as wait for cu police will being give the armanan adecuado for combati criminalidad in all his formanan, for so they can debolbe aruba one sense of paz y trankilidad cu today not tey more.

pakico draw one view so sombrio at end of year? because the unique form of exigi medidanan corectivo for of the autoridadnan competente is enfocando the for thing the is, without adorno. already owing to become time for gobierno asumi his paper conductor. nel can is one good or bad polit­ico, the door one good or bad leader of faction, but anything is cierto: is the have the batuta of command in his hands. now, if the not know con comanda respet y exigi seguimento of one plan for solventa the problemanan cu is afectando aruba for of his gabinete, the pase for another of his same faction, or of cualke another faction, cu if have the boluntad y the conocimentonan for trece the solucionnan urgentemente rekeri.

nel, owing to pesar of his 30 y pico añanan in politica, not owing to succeed demostra cu the can take one distancia prudente because; leader y first ministro of mep, for converti his self in one leader y first ministro of all aruba. of my the pocket the not can wait for never elogionan cu the not merece, y the have to is good at height cu my do not form part niether of the coro cosmopolita cu is ofrece adulation provided that cambio of please or permission. thing if i am desea is of see one resurgimento of aruba, one reconversion of one island infecta for tanto desastre, division, hate y rencor, for her oasis of unidad, paz y comprension cu the was anteriormente. in my pensamentonan y sentimentonan, aruba always owing to come in first lugar, y esey never will change. my confidence in the posibilidad of redencion for aruba owing to stay firme, owing to pesar of tanto year of • desperdicio of one gobierno mediocre.

i am desea all the habitantenan of aruba one feliz y prospero year new, complete of bendicion y of salud. as as confianza in god y in we self for enfrenta y soluciona thing as can present during 2008.

* * *

Follow-up on the attack on the 17-year-old female tourist, "H.B.". From the previous reports, she is Venezuelan but apparently lives in Miami. The attack apparently was a mugging-purse snatching; the assailant pushed or threw her against a wall.


Online Pap translation:

according relato of police

atracador owing to choca the lady tourist

oranjestad (aan): on diabierna, oficialmente by vocero policial suplente john larmonie, owing to give relao of the caso earnest, where one tourist young owing to worde ataca in area of one highrise timeshare resort.

presencia of patrol owing to worde solicita at once for atende the caso. is deal of one child muher naci at venezuela of inicialnan h.b. of 17 year, that the hour ey still was in shock of thing owing to happen cune.

according the bishitante owing to declara, the is march in the area of the hotel y one man desconoci owing to gare at his throat y owing to ordena for her “no grita” (expresa at language ingles).

but the denunciante owing to cuminsa bark, consecuentemente he owing to cuminza strike cabez of the tourist in wall. this owing to place the muher bark more strong y struggle cu he desconoci.

at dado instant the tourist owing to succeed leave for grab y core bay. in careda the child muher owing to let his bag cay, the individual owing to grab this y desaparece. in the bag according the tourist the have 100 dollar, articulo cosmetico, his visa credit-card, fuera one camera digital.

according descripcion suministra at police, cu is deal of one man delega, cu estatura of 1,80 metre, without flanel, dress cu short color dark.

do not exclui cu first y during y after of thing did take lugar cu can owing to capta via of camera he anti-social here.

assure locual did take lugar is one another golpi for we turism y the hotel the ncuestion his seguridad have of worde revisa y medidanan have of worde adapta.

all the time the caso have debido atencion of recherche..

* * *

I am posting this in regard to statements made here yesterday about Spencher Bacchus' involvement, lack of involvement, etc. 

As far as his looking guilty, I just don't see that and it is not my place to defend the congressman from another district, but as I stated earlier, just think about information he had that could have brought a former president down that he never shared until all the hullabaloo was over and done with, because he was more of a patriot and felt like during times of war or perceived near-war, it was better to keep information and I have learned just from watching TV that the Patriot Act trumps a rape or murder, which looms large in our eyes but the people who take office are sworn to the preservation and defense of this country and sometimes what we perceive as large, really is large, has to be considered smaller when it comes to defending millions of lives. 

 :smt038 me too on ru posts!! lol
Of course, lately they have been busy attacking their own posters!!! bhammom takes some serious hits!!! roflmao...now why would you keep posting on a board that tells ya to
 F-off??!! THAT is certifiable for sure!!! :smt101

Tamikosmom…I left you a post apage or two back.


Happy New Year everybody!

great post

Oh, you're right as always, Tylergal, just hard to ignore a post addressed to you telling you to get your facts straight when yours are and theirs are not!  Again.  But I shall certainly try!

And let me be the first to wish you


(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Greetings/Holidays/HappyNewYear2008.gif)


I can't believe we are still here another year later!

May this one be the one that brings closure to this tragecy.  And soon!  How I admire Janet and her patience.

.

Thanks Anna, May 2008 bring great blessings to us all!!
Keep posting Anna!! You know I love your ideas and knowledge girlfriend!!!

Anna ... my impatience may not always be revealed in my posts but ... believe me hon ... I am a work in progress.   :lol:

Happy New Year Anna!  Happy New Year Monkeys!

Janet

I admire Anna for making a decision and having the courage to stand by it.

OMG! Tylergal...you are so right...what was I thinking? :roll:

It was determined that no laws were broken:)

I think we are all in agreement on that and must keep our eye on the prize, that being Natalee.   :)

Sorry, I was ignoring you....just kidding.   :wink:

Well, thank you but wanted you to know I love the garnet dress and boa, it really is a "stepping out" kinda dress.

I dont' even mind if I am, Lala's.  It keeps me from talking aloud which makes my cats crazy.  :wink:

Aruba is touting Birminghams unsolved cases at one of their popular chattering holes. They are citing the wrong stats. Only in Aruba does the judge, prosecutor, chief of police, and defense attorney collude to protect the guilty while being cheered on by the citizens. This isn't an unsolved crime. That is not why we are upset.

When I talk to myself, my dogs always just assume I am talking to them and are delighted!

.

lol

Love you Monkeys!!! So glad to know I am not the only one who talks out loud to herself!!!!
I feel better!! lol

Now that Alvin Holmes is suing Auburn because he did not get "free" tickets to the Auburn-Alabama game, I guess it does sort of put us here (stateside) in the same league as Aruba. 

Private,

Boy, they've really got us now, lol!

No, they never understand that is it not the fact that a crime or even crimes happen but their total failure to even try to conduct an investigation by even the most minimal of standards that is upsetting.  They also don't realize among many other things that custodial kidnapping is included in our stats, something I am sure falls into that vague "domestic dispute" where they even tried to put the refinery worker's death.

But logic is just not one of their strong points, unfortunately.

.

Karin Janssen could not get it right ... not even once  ... in regards to suspicions that warrant pretrail detainment.  Despite Dutch law that states that strong/ serious suspicions are required ... all formal suspects (9) in the Natalee Holloway case as well as ... Freddie who was detained on "unrelated" suspicions ... are freely walking the streets of Holland and Aruba today ... walking the streets of Aruban and Holland as potential risks to "other" Natalees.

Janet

++++++++++++++++

Diana Emerencia - Freddy's Attorney
Decatur Daily News
August 31, 2005

Freddy Alexander Zedan-Arambatzis, a friend of van der Sloot and the Kalpoes, was arrested on suspicion of having unspecified "physical contact" with a female minor, said his lawyer, Diana Emerencia.

Zedan-Arambatzis, 21, is also suspected of photographing the girl in "tempting poses" and showing the images to other people, Emerencia said.

The Kalpoe brothers and van der Sloot are also suspected of involvement in the incident, which allegedly occurred before Holloway disappeared, she said.


+++++++++++

INITIAL ARRESTS - JUNE, 2005

1.  Mickey John:  first and second-degree murder and capital kidnapping.

2.  Abraham Jones:  first and second-degree murder and capital kidnapping.
 
3.  Joran van der Sllot:  Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder

4.  Deepak Kalpoe:   Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder.

5.  Satish Kalpoe:  Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder.

6. Steve Croes:   Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder.   

7.  Paulus van der Sloot:  complicity to pre-meditated murder, complicity to kidnapping and murder and kidnapping.


SUBSEQUENT ARRESTS - APRIL, 2006

8.  Geoffrey van Cromvoirt:  criminal offenses that may be related to the disappearance" of Natalee Holloway.

9.  Guido Weaver:  Assisting in the murder, heavy battery and kidnapping" of the teen


KALPOE BROTHERS - SECOND ARREST - AUGUST, 2005

Deepak Kalpoe:  Suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences and even more alternately, raping somebody and new suspicions.

Satish Kalpoe:  Suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences and even more alternately, raping somebody and new suspicions


JORAN - SECOND ARREST - NOVEMBER, 2007

Joran van der Sloot: Suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily hare that result in death.


KALPOE BROTHERS - THIRD ARREST - NOVEMBER, 2007

Satish Kalpoe:  Suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily hare that result in death.

Deepak Kalpoe:  Suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily hare that result in death.


++++++++++

DUTCH LAW - SERIOUS SUSPICIONS JUSTIFY DETAINMENT

Arlene Ellis-Schipper
NANCY GRACE
July 20, 2005

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: There is no grand jury in Aruba. It`s a different system.  You are arrested based on suspicion, on strong suspicion.


Noraina Pietersz - Defence Attorney
Associated Press
June 9, 2005

Under Aruban law, only serious suspicion from investigators — not solid evidence — is needed for a judge to rule that suspects can be held, Pietersz said.

DUTCH LAW - SERIOUS SUSPICIONS JUSTIFY DETAINMENT

Arlene Ellis-Schipper
NANCY GRACE
July 20, 2005

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: There is no grand jury in Aruba. It`s a different system.  You are arrested based on suspicion, on strong suspicion.


Noraina Pietersz - Defence Attorney
Associated Press
June 9, 2005

Under Aruban law, only serious suspicion from investigators — not solid evidence — is needed for a judge to rule that suspects can be held, Pietersz said.
 

So we can blame the judges for all this insanity then???  Letting the guilty walk free.....maybe he is dirtyhand!

At this point in time at which Freddy was brought in on these charges, were they not about the same time the "girls" were going to come forward with information on the PIMPS about being drugged and filmed, and some of the attorneys or law enforcement and/or both, intimidated these girls into withdrawing the stories and  it was made to look as though the girls were compliant and agreeable to these porn videos, or am I as usual forgetting something?

Tyler,

That's what I remember as well and even the one Freddie photographed was said to have only been wearing a bikini according to Anita.

I have come to the conclusion that no one can be charged with anything without the succint approval of Rudy Croes and if Rudy views it as being something detrimental to tourism or some of his monetary interests, then it is hawked by the Arubans and their lackeys at RU (paid for by AHATA), then those charges are either omitted or the victims abused verbally and threatened such that the victims are made to look like fools via the talking heads such as Tito, Rubin, Arleen, Julia Renfro, Joe Tacohead.

Back to working and lurking or will never finish around here. . . .

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Greetings/Holidays/th2008.gif)

Why does that "dirty word" (Anita) keep coming up???  I think Anita knows way TOO MUCH about alot of things!!!

I think Anita not only knows way TOO MUCH about alot of things, I personally believe she helped orchestrate some of it. 

PI ... some honestly do not get it.

The on-going controversy encompassing the Natalee Holloway case is not about an American citizen going missing on Aruban soil under suspicious circumstances.  Hey crime happens everywhere.  It is all about a corrupt investigation that has denied an 18 year old   American citizen justice in an attempt to distance their own from implication.  Other than her friends and family ... a just Aruban investigation would imply the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on Aruban soil would now be a distance memory.

The Natalee Holloway case was solved prior to Jug and Beth setting foot on the Island.  Then the coverup was put into motion ... the coverup that dictated that Joran and Paulus were to be protected.

Aruban justice prevailing was never an option and ... Dave, Beth and Jug recognized this fact very early on.

As Wreck stated a shile back ... "THE NATALEE HOLLOWAY CASE WAS CLOSED 2 1/2 YEARS AGO!"

Janet

+++++++++


Dave Holloway
NANCY GRACE
April 11, 2006

HOLLOWAY: Oh, the media was our best friend. If it hadn't been for the media this thing would have been swept under the table the very first day and we'd have been calling back to Aruba "Have you heard anything? Have you heard anything?" I truly believe that.


Beth Twitty
'Scarborough Country'
October 21, 2005

HOLLOWAY TWITTY: They never—they never wanted to implicate these three young men. They never wanted to implicate them from the beginning. And there is a list of reasons, you know, why we know that is true.


Jug Twitty
'Scarborough Country'
August 11, 2005

TWITTY: ... when they take my statement 33 days later, and they take the other guys‘ statements that were with me and ladies that were with me, you know, like 19 days later, it‘s like they didn‘t want to find the truth

She is the "Mother and Mate Of What's Wrong With Aruba" and thus all things bad lead to her::)))))))))))

A big thumbs up on that!

She makes my skin crawl worse than her sicko son and her husband!  Something is definitely wrong with that woman!

Hey everyone I posted this below under light a candle for Natalee but didn't get any replies and since everyone seems to be looking here anyway could everyone just do me a favor today and light a candle for Natalee and say prayer. . .after all it is my birthday! Thanks I appreciate it!


"Please continue to light a candle for Natalee and say a prayer for her, her family, and the angels out at persistence!  The candles only stay lit for 48 hours so we need to keep them going!  The new year always get me excited about new things, new hopes, new dreams and not just because today is my birthday!  What better time for Natalee to be returned to her family??"

Sorry forgot to add if ALL of us are prayer and lighting candles today just hink about that power!!!

Happy Birthday KG.

Thank you for the reminder.  I've lit candles and said a prayer for Natalee, her family and friends.  And of course for Tim Miller and the crew of the Persistence.  Happy Birthday to you kgwallace88  :smt113  I pray Natalee will have justice in the new year of 2008. 

Tyler...that is my nic name...you must fond another :lol:  but it doesn't keep me from posting....and thank goodness it doesn't keep you and others from posting.....I haven't been posting much due to being sick and the holidays....but I am caught up now and some of the posts I read were really well below the standards of SM..we are above that!..I realize we are all upset over the release of Natalee's killers.....but some of the posts were really, really bad....RU bad if you get my meaning! JMO

Janet, thank you

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,319250,00.html

The Unsolved Criminal Mysteries of 2007
Monday , December 31, 2007

Law-enforcement officials will have their hands full in 2008 trying to wrap up cases that left them stymied in 2007.

In Chicago, the search continues for two women missing from their suburban homes. Stacy Peterson, a 23-year-old mother of two from Bolingbrook, Ill., was reported missing on Oct. 29. Officials have named her husband, former police sergeant Drew Peterson, as a suspect.

Lisa Stebic, of Plainfield, Ill., disappeared on April 30. Her husband, Craig, has been named a person of interest in the case. He said he was working in the backyard and their two kids were out when Stebic vanished.

In Colorado, police have identified a suspect in the disappearance of an escort in Grand Junction. Lester Ralph Jones, an employee at an RV dealership, was named in connection with the disappearance of Paige Birgfeld, a 34-year-old mom of three. Birgfeld was reported missing on June 30. Authorities discovered her car burned a day later. Foul play is suspected.

The search continues for Kyle Fleischmann, a 24-year-old man from Charlotte, N.C., last seen leaving a bar on Nov. 9, as well as for Kara Kopetsky, a 17-year-old student from Belton, Mo., last seen at her high school on May 2.

Authorities in California have spent half a year searching for a 19-year-old college student last seen heading to a party at a convicted sex offender's house in West Los Angeles. Donna Jou, of Rancho Santa Margarita, disappeared June 23 when she left to attend a party at the rented home of John Steven Burgess, 35. He was arrested in July on a crack cocaine charge and has been named a suspect in Jou's disappearance.

In Baton Rouge, officials are looking for the killers of two graduate students from India shot execution style in an apparent home invasion on the Louisiana State University campus. Chandrasekhar Reddy Komma and Kiran Kumar Allam were killed on Dec. 13 in university housing. Police are searching for up to four black men believed to have traveled in a light-colored Oldsmobile Alero.

Internationally, though Aruban officials have closed their investigation into the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway, her family continues to speak out on behalf of the girl, who vanished on May 30, 2005. Her mother is considering appealing the Aruban prosecutor's decision to close the case.

And the mystery of missing toddler Madeleine McCann only deepens as police across Europe hunt for the girl, who disappeared in Portugal on May 3 while on vacation with her parents.

Anna...ignore, ignorance  :smt052  and a very Happy New Year to everyone from me as well....Hopefully 2008 will bring Natalee Home and justice for her as well.

private eye...so do I!! 

hi KG...we've not met...but Welcome...and Happy Birthday

I saw this on Tv and Natalee's case was #1

I admire each and Everyone of You Monkeys for sticking with this horrible crime for the last 31 months.....I believe You All are Outstanding People and I believe that You will All be Blessed For All of Your Efforts. God Bless You Monkeys and God Bless the Persistence Crew and Natalee's Family.

Peeking in from work to wish everyone a HAPPY NEW YEAR!

May 2008 finally bring Natalee Home!

Any plans on the forum for a Scared Monkey's New Year's Party??  :D

Gotta Duck back out............work is a 4 letter word.

BBL!

Happy New Year Monkeys!

Tomorrow is the first day of the year that we find Natalee!

Once she's found, we will all know more about what happened to her. 

Hang in there monkeys, a new year and a new time are on the way!

If you disagree with any of my posts or opinions, please just send your replies to Helen Back.  :)

Just Kidding. :lol:  Happy New Year Everyone!

Happy New Year to the Crew of the Persistence!  Heroes you all are, no matter the outcome.

Lighting a candle in my home for Natalee and her family.

After she's found may we also find:

Madeleine McCann
Stepha Henry
Stacy Peterson
Lisa Stebic
Jennifer Kesse
Max Devries
Amy Bradley........the list is long......

And all those who are missing and unaccounted for today.

Thanks MuffyBee for the birthday wishes!  I just thought that is everyone would be of one accord today that it would just be such a powerful prayer!

Just stopping by to wish

Happy Birthday!!!
Thanks for the reminder also. I lit a candle.

Candle is lit, and prayers have been said.  I want to say hello and welcome to all the new comers to SM.  Yes I probably scared them all away again, but, to Beth, Dave and the Persistance Crew and Tim, Happy New Year, and you are all in my heart!  Another Big Thanks to Klaas, Red, Dana, and Dugga for putting up with all of us for so long!

Kath

Just want to say thanks everyone for all the well wishes and making me feel welcome at SM!

Sometimes it takes time for the posters here to get used to each other, or for us to change.
My own example is Tamikosmom and the quotes from the Bible.
Two years ago, I think I was rolling the eyes up frequently, now I look forward to reading her quotes, and the other things she posts. I would never have looked therefore I would have never found the Gratefulness.com site where candles are lit. I have explored that site and many other that are along the same vein.
These things are becoming helpful to me as I think of my day to day life
and reflect at the end of each day.
There are many things that ppl have shared that I found ranging from funny to sad to uplifting.
 

WELCOME YERSELF. I AM THE ONE WHO NEEDS TO LEARN TO SPELL.
and a

‘cover-up’  ‘cover-up’  ‘cover-up’  ‘cover-up’  ‘cover-up’

Thank you Kat.  Your post made my day.

Well you are not the only one who rolls their eyes when Tamikosmom convey her thoughts.  Hubby and I are hosting a small New Year Eve's gathering tonight.  As youngest son and wife were making a quick stop here this afternoon anyways ... I had them pick up some goodies from the local bakery that I had preordered.  These two did not even have their coats off when I walked into the kitchen and saw them opening the bakery box.  :shock:  I yelled ... STOP!  They then begged (not a pretty sight) for "just one".  I yelled ... NO!  Anyways ... they just left the house rolling their eyes.  However ... I did get a quick hug while they mumbled ... Happy New Year.   :lol:

Janet 

And a Happy New Year to you Janet.
I am home alone this evening ( my choice ) as I am just beat. The kiddos and the baby went to a downtown hotel overnight to merry make as much as you could with a Baby ( although they are thinking of having another LOL ).
I was at work earlier ..  gag me will ya .. and saw the kiddos just an hour ago and got my kisses and well wishes.   

A silent witness but a witness who lives the scriptures she writes.

Silent!!!

Hey ... I would give up my life in a second for those two ... but not one of those precious goodies.   :lol:

Janet

HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL!!

Kat ... nothing overly exciting happening.  Hubby and I as well as five other couples from our church got together last year.  All twelve of us went out to dinner at the Old Spaghetti Factory ... movie and ... back to one of the couples home for dessert and board games ... dessert and coffee.  We did stop and bring the New Year's in with fireworks and a toast with something bubbly.

We all had a very enjoyable evening and ... decided to do the same thing this year.  However ... the gathering after the movie will be at our home.  Hubby has been busy all day making Sushi as an addition to the dessert that I did not spend all day baking.   :lol:

HAPPY NEW YEAR KAT!

Janet 

 

This is my take on this. KJ arrested everyone and charged them with different suspicions.  She knew damn well the charges were not going to stick but what she was doing was letting the world know who was involved and who did what.

Freddy's charge was for sex with an underage girl and filming the act.  What they really meant was that Freddy filmed Natalee while being raped.  Just like the charges against Paulus which were premediated murder and Guido's was Heavy Battery.  KJ was slick enough in her own way to let the world know who did what.  JMO.

From AMW - posted by PearlInUSA at BFN (good catch):

http://tinyurl.com/ypskro


An Important Clue?


Today, the crew and I went back with Dave Holloway to the makeshift memorial. To most people the cross might seem like a touching tribute to the missing  teenager. But the more Dave told me, the more I began to believe this cross might be an important clue in the search for Natalee.

Here's why: Just 300 yards away from the boat launch is a series of fishing huts that have become infamous on the island. In sworn statements, the three lead suspects in Natalee's disappearance -- Joran van der Sloot, Satish and Deepak Kalpoe -- told police that they left Natalee at those fishing huts the night of her disapperance.

But the news gets worse. According to police the huts were broken into around the time of her disappearence; a large knife and a huge steel fishing cage were stolen. Publicly, the police aren't linking the events. But they've asked Tim Miller to bring a deep sea search team to scan the entire coast near the boat launch -- keeping an eye out for a fishing cage.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Greetings/Holidays/th014.gif)

And Welcome to all our NEW MONKEYS!

.

I agree Tyler.

They deny ever saying it, they deny anything was stolen from the fishermans huts. They lie and they lie and they lie.  :roll:

I keep calling it a lobster or crab trap but it is in fact  FISH trap that went missing and is my understanding they are ever so much larger.

Maybe Robots or some of our Maine posters know about lobster traps, yum!  That is what I am hoping to have for special dinner.

i know all about em,

one of tha hardest jobs i ever did... i was cold everyday...and i mean ICE COLD
all the lobster i could eat and the pay was not very good

i had a blast, but i dont want to do it again

it was about 60 years ago. im 89  :cool:

nice to see you Anna  :wink:

Once upon a time, there was also listed a small boat anchor and a tarp maybe taken from yet a different hut, can't remember but someone said anchor recently so they must have also seen this.

Nut, yes, they did later say what trap, what fish?  Nothing missing here!

Tyler, you are right.  It seems nothing can happen in the judiciary without the approval of Rudy Croes whom you have said was behind it from the start.  Add to that that the Prosecutor doesn't prosecute unless deemed in the best interest of the public and I guess they will just never deem this to be so.  That is, in my opinion, a bad mistake on their part.  They seem to think that if they don't prosecute it will never be true what some of their fine young sons did to this unsuspecting tourist girl.  Just enough doubt to get them off the hook in their own eyes but we see it quite differently.

.

Robots

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/Greetings/Holidays/th20.gif)

Special New Years Greeting for you!


I would like the part about all the lobster you could eat but not the rest of it, lol.  Here we have shrimp but no lobster.  Nets, I think raised and lowered mechanically from the little shrimp boats.  Lobster is very expensive.  Of course, we have crawdads for free if you can stand to catch them!  They look like little lobsters and live in ponds and drainage ditches in the wild.  I don't eat them at all except commercially grown for restaurants but some people do.

Speaking of hard work, Bet that crew on the Persistence is tired!  They are our last best hope!  Even if they don't find her, at least the family will know she isn't there.

.

:wink:

we have little crayfish here and lots of lobsters.
i like lobsters, but i didnt when i was younger...

yea, the crew looking for Natalee are working hard im sure.  :cool:

Edit Perseverance to Persistence.

Well, they mean almost the same thing.

 :oops: :oops: :oops:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink:

I just googled "LargeFish Trap".  I was amazed.
They are the size of a large barrell and look like a barrell
with a couple of holes in them.  I don't recall ever seeing
one before.

I would like to know how many inmates there are in the KIA Aruba and in the other jails and what the inmates were convicted of since everything is legal there...no crime, no time ... dont'cha know.

Happy New Year Pita.

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HappyNewYear.gif)

They are convicted of not selling drugs and not drugging tourists.  After all you have to get those people off the streets they are bucking their corrupt system.

Here's a good example of some large fish traps:

http://www.livetrap.com/cgi/search.cgi?user_id=&database=dbase1.exm&template=products.shtml&2_option=1&2=Folding+Fish+Traps

(http://www.livetrap.com/shop/product_shots/cat_shots/foldfish.jpg)

 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026


 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026

I have a renewed sense of optimism about the water search today.
Just a good feeling.

Fioana, Shreck's woman, looks like Anita, but Fioana is way prettier.

Maybe they just arrest the victims.  They could scare plenty of people by threatening to keep them incarcerated on trumped up charges, etc.  Some of those people down there abuse their authority and should not be in a position to.  What a horrific way to live.  It really is a mess.  I would not put it past Vanderstratten to have taken NH into custody and hid her for the Vdsloots.    I guess that would be going over the line.  They were so far OUT of line with the coverup and all, it is not a far stretch for me to think of this.   Jack

Klass,...I forgot to put wire in my google search.  The ones I saw were
solid material.  I know that Persistence is looking for a wire one.

Hi monks!

Do we have any idea what the Persistence will do if they find her? Isn't Dateline NBC on board? Have they been there the entire time? I wonder if NBC will get exclusive news rights, or whatever.

I'm hoping it would be posted on Kyle's blog, but I bet the news would be withheld for awhile. Any ideas?

lousw posted this at BFN

Fioana is far too classy to be mentioned in the same breath with Anita:).

If they haul Natalee up from the bottom of the ocean in a cage like that I am going to be one p*ssed off guy, even though I am praying that they will. And if a tennis shoe is in it then Joran better give his soul to God because his *ss will be mine.

I could fit into that thing easily!

I take it no one knows? :smt102

I know P.I.  .....it just makes me ill to think of it :sad:

We don't know

I don't think they would announce it right away.  Kyle has been right quiet
on the blog for the last couple of days and I am hoping that is a good sign.
But who knows...certainly not me.

There was a reason he said he left his sneakers on the beach...that way he can blame someone else when they find her...he has his ass covered all around...an answer for everything. He makes me sick.

I apologize for my last post, but the reality of that cage just hit me. I understand that Beth has reached a decision as to what she is going to do, and she is keeping it to herself. And I understand that she said that even that decision is subject to change. Not much info but I think that is the truth.

that is why Sander's phone was stolen too  :cool:

Thank you for responding.

Is it true that NBC is on board?

I think it is more the callous disregard they had for her that the cage represents than anything. It is hard to explain, and I thought I had accepted it, but I guess not. I cannot imagine how Beth is going to be if they find her. It will definitely get worse before it gets better. I am kind of worried about how she will deal with it.

You never know what you'll do until you are faced with the situation.
That is why it is so wrong to say "I would have done this or that."
You just don't know until the occassion arises.

Dateline is on board.

Legally Lex said that they were.  So I reckon they are.

After all that has transpired, I can't believe I got ill looking at the cage of all things.

:sad:  I can't imagine

Have there been any signs of nervousness on the island in the last few days?

Sometimes the most unsuspected thing will tip the emotional scale.

That is very true.

Happy new year monkeys

Everybody has different scenes of poignancy from this case that are particularly painful to them, but for me the picture of Beth trying to slump to the ground only to be caught by I think Jug and someone else is mine. Her agony simply screams out of that photo. And for some reason, that cage is the next one. Anyway,,,,,


Sorry for the lapse. There is much alright in the world to celebrate, and watching this site is validation of that goodness:) You all are really special people. Beth is blessed to have all of you in her corner and I know she knows it.

Natalee's Freebirds have been silent for a while.....what's up with that. I so enjoy reading what they have to say.

Happy New Year Kermit.

Private Eye, every time I see that picture it tears my heart out!  The agony is apparent and I cannot imagine what she was going through but I really want to cry for her anew each time I see it!

Steve Croes - Mambo Jambo 12/29/07

(http://www.coolaruba.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=152553&g2_serialNumber=1&g2_GALLERYSID=0c3c60f1e61c627cd0cb9bb3d8af16e1)

I wonder.  If someone were able to have a list of the people in jail in Aruba.  What is their crime?  What was their sentence?  What was their ethnic group, their income?  Did they have proper legal representation?  Why are some people in jail and others not?  Is there a double standard?  How many Dutch are in prison?  Just askin'....

Maybe they are working on something that has to do with the deep water search?  I too really feel what they have to say is well researched and presented.

Look at this skank.  I hope someone chops his fingers off.

Time's fun when you're having flies.

......Kermit the Frog, is this true?!? :lol:

Good evening, San.  I see you are in fine form this New Year's Eve.   :lol: :lol:

We know you are venting only, dude.  But "don't taz 'em bro"  unless you use Old Sparky, that is.  LOL.  I would like a piece of that myself, but the dogs are not worth it.   Jack blue

That thing on his chin makes him look more like a goat's rear than Rudy does.

I had to get my last one in before midnight  :lol:

 :smt044 :smt044 :smt044 :smt044

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HappyNewYear5.jpg)

Happy New Year Everyone...With Respect and Admiration from Texas!!!!!

just wanted to pop in and wish all my monkey friends a blessed new year!!!

Looks just like a goat's beard!!  Ughhh!! And THAT MESS on top of his head !?!?  :shock: :shock: :shock:

Hey, cuz!  Happy New Year to you!!!

To the crew of the Persistence:  Happy New Year to all - you're heros !!!

We almost have a whole animal of same species, a goat's beard on Steve Croes, a goat's rear on Rudy Croes, goat's demeanor on Julia Renfro.

Hello and Happy New Year, Monkeys.  Here's a link to a few prison statistics for Aruba:
http://www.kcl.ac.uk/depsta/rel/icps/worldbrief/caribbean_records.php?code=58

I'll add more if I can find it.  Aruba is not known for keeping accurate and open records.  :lol:

My heart sinks ever time I see or even remember that photograph, PI. I have to agree with you, it is the most painful remembrance of this whole ordeal.

Yet Aruba celebrates that pain. I will never forgive them for that. Such a bunch of low bred, souless, nasty, incredulous, corrupt, cowardly, athiestic, worthless bunch of creeps. Hell awaits them.

CROAK! Happy New year Kermit. :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026

Actually, the number of foreign prisoners in Dutch prisons, including Aruba, is about 50%, a number I found astonishingly high.  Here is some more prison info if anyone wishes to dig into this further.  It takes some time and I don't have the time now, but you are welcome to the links:

COMMITTEE AGAINST TORTURE, Thirty-eight session, 30 April 18 May 2007
The Netherlands
http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/cat/docs/AdvanceVersions/CAT.C.NET.CO.4.doc

"Prompt and impartial investigations
13.  The Committee is concerned at the number of reports of assaults committed by Aruban law enforcement officials. It is also concerned that, as reported by the State party, of the forty-nine cases lodged at the Internal Investigations Bureau between 1 September 2005 and 21 March 2007, only two have been dealt with in court and did not lead to a conviction due to insufficient evidence.
The State party should take all appropriate measures to send a clear and unambiguous message to the Police Force and to prison staff that torture, violence and ill-treatment are unacceptable. Similarly, the State party should implement its obligation to investigate promptly, impartially and thoroughly all complaints submitted, to ensure that appropriate penalties are imposed on those convicted. The State party should also ensure that effective measures are put in place to guarantee that those who report assaults by law enforcement officials are protected from intimidation and possible reprisals for making such reports."


Report to the authorities of the Kingdom of the Netherlands on the visit to Aruba carried out by the European Committee for the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment (CPT) from 30 June to 2 July 1994
http://www.cpt.coe.int/documents/nld/1996-27-inf-eng-1.htm

"Ethnic Minorities and Criminal Justice in the Netherlands
http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0192-3234(1997)21%3C257%3AEMACJI%3E2.0.CO%3B2-T&size=SMALL&origin=JSTOR-reducePage#abstract
Several ethnic minorities in the Netherlands, relative to population, commit more crimes and more serious crimes than do Dutch offenders. There are indications that minority offenders who commit less serious or nonserious offenses seem to be punished more harshly than similar Dutch offenders. Relatively more ethnic minority members are placed in pretrial detention and sentenced to prison-partly because of different crime patterns, partly because many have no fixed residence, and partly because many are less likely than Dutch defendants to turn up at the trial and to plead guilty. Even taking account of these variables, minority membership continues to be a factor in explaining sentencing. Although ethnic stereotyping may play a role, disparities appear to result largely from the unfavorable economic, social, and legal position of ethnic minorities."

the story from the get go was full of lies, from all 3 that STOLE Natalee.

one can only surmise the beech story was a load of bull crap.

the sporter is a thief, he steals money and he steal lives. he steals because he is so weak

my take is - they took her in the car, NO BEACH

went for a ride for drugs to totally take effect which they slipped her in the bar.

went IMMEDIATELY to sloot house of HORRORS. not only was paulus THERE but a couple other higher ups

it all happened at the SLOOTS

when did someone look up DRUGS on the sloot computer.????? that night ? or later on

PAULUS was THERE......

Update:
Mon 31-Dec - 1132 hrs - New Year's Eve

"Come, wander with me she said into regions yet untrod. Read with me what is still unread in the manuscript of God." - Longfellow
The words return to me as they did in Louisiana almost a month ago. The assembling swaths of sonar data reveal the seabed to us as if it were a scroll from a mighty manuscript written by a mighty hand. The numerous ROV dives are the Rosetta Stone for reading the great manuscript.

The seabed tells a different tale at every scale of observation. The submarine terrain appears tired, bent, and worn- a stark yet welcomed contrast to our jagged expectations. The seabed is deeply pitted, torn, and scarred. It cryptically cries out in past neglect, ruin, and abandon. Sparkling coral and happy creatures thrive in the shallows blissfully unaware of the decay of their heritage laying just out beyond the reef. The water deepens and color fades to grey where predators roam. Deeper still, the seabed appears lifeless and void. As the ROV touches down onto the deep seafloor, a benthic nephloid cloud erupts, engulfing the remote intruder. As the silt settles in the darkness, polycheate worms withdraw into their delicate burrows. Now under immense pressure, the ROV is in total solitude, stillness, and cold. There is no margin for failure in the ocean. The seafloor speaks of past failure, where grim reminders of the lost and broken abound. It is a relief to be back on board the Persistence in relative safety.

The Persistence is amid uncovering the final planned quadrant of the search area. Once completed and ROV ground-truthed, we will assemble the data and read from the last scroll in this mighty manuscript.


http://nholloway.blogspot.com/2007/12/ix-dive-series-next-phase.html

Hello to all. Just popping in for a moment , it's not 2008 yet here, but I wish everyone a great year in our personal lives. 
And this past year was full of ups and downs for the Holloway Twitty families,
I truly hope that the Persistence finds Natalee and that this can be over for them in that regard. It will never be over, but I pray that they can live the rest of their lives and find some relief from the pain they have endured.
xx 00 xx kathi

Mrs Red and I just want to wish you all a very Happy New Year ... Thank you so much for all that you have done in 2007.

We look forward in 2008 to getting further answers for Natalee's family and the families of all missing persons.

We will soon be putting a New Years Eve post on the front page with some audio that I am sure all will find enjoyable.

Thanks to all. :)

Thanks Anna - I think I need a translation


The Persistence is amid uncovering the final planned quadrant of the search area. Once completed and ROV ground-truthed, we will assemble the data and read from the last scroll in this mighty manuscript.

Happy New Year to you Red and all the Monkeys!

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/newyear007.gif)

I wonder if Mos did in fact release the suspects as this is his self-imposed deadline, isn't it?

Has anyone heard anything about that today?  And if so, does it really mean anything as nothing is happening in that regard anyway.

.

Thanks to everyone who makes it possible for us to have this place to gather.

Happy New Year Monkeys!

Helen

I thought the suspects received a letter from Mos a couple weeks ago releasing them as suspects.

I have another 3 hours to midnight  :lol:

That was my understanding.

Happy New Years Monkey's
I hope you all have a wonderful year and that we all get answer
to where Natalee is and other missing from their families
May god bless all of the missing people and there families
and all of you monkeys


Ps.. we have a court hearing in cali Jan 3rd
Let see what happens next

Thanks Sue - Happy New Year to you too!  Thanks for the reminder on the court date on Jan 3

Yes, they did but I was wondering if he made some sort of public declaration or something official for public consumption.  Something like an official statement from the Office of the Prosecution since we can't read their letters.

.

It's not really New Year's here for another hour but once that ball drops, it's over for me!  Guess I am on what we call fast time locally tonight as I live near the time zone change. 

Natalee's Freebirds have done a great job at putting together everything Dr. Phil's attorneys need:

snipped:


 ARUBAN AUTHORITIES IMPLICATE MAIN SUSPECTS IN NATALEE HOLLOWAY CASE



As we await the outcome of the discovery process in the Kalpoe v. McGraw DEFAMATION lawsuit, we wanted to take a moment to reflect on an abbreviated version of a previous Freebird's publication which clearly demonstrates the original sources of the alleged defamation. HINT: Not Dr. Phil....

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2007/10/aruban-authorities-implicate-main.html

I'm sure it's been posted here before, but it's such great work, and points to the ridiculous nature of the Kalpoe suit.  Deepak and Satish defamed themselves, and then the Aruban authorities took over.  A great re-cap!

Goodnight monkeys!

It's New Years here in NY.  Happy New Year Anna.

In the South we eat black eye peas(We make Hoppin John)
and cabbage with scrubbed silver money in it and pork
What is the fare up North?

My children are in Arizona.  They just called, headed to the airport.  Wanted to say Happy New Year.  They will miss it this year.  Their plane will leave Arizona at 11 p.m. and they will be here at 2 a.m.  So they celebrated by phone with us from their taxicab ride to the airport.

Happy New Year everyone!!
I have written a poem for Natalee, and the Persistence and crew.

Oh, it was New Year for me when Auburn beat Clemson. 

Will you share it.

Do let us hear it Gabby, please.

I know this is OT, Magnolia, but I have never heard of the silver money.  I think that might be an interesting light story to tell.  I do make Hoppin' John but I have turnips since everybody likes them (except me) and I open a can of asparagus so I have something "green."

The leafy cabbage represents money.  I have two silver dollars that are
saved just to cook in the New Year cabbage.  That is one I learned from
some Jew friends.  The rest of the family picked right up on it. It is good
with Hoppin John.

Yes, I am happy to share my poem, I dont know what happened but somehow my post got sent before I intended to  :2doh:  Leave it to me   hahaha 

I will be posting the poem shortly, and thanks so much for wanting to read it!

Update:

Tues 01-Jan - 0032 hrs New Year's Day

"Come, wander with me she said into regions yet untrod. Read with me what is still unread in the manuscript of God." - Longfellow
The words return to me as they did in Louisiana almost a month ago. The assembling swaths of sonar data reveal the seabed to us as if it were a scroll from a mighty manuscript written by a mighty hand. The numerous ROV dives are the Rosetta Stone for reading the great manuscript.

The seabed tells a different tale at every scale of observation. The submarine terrain appears tired, bent, and worn- a stark yet welcomed contrast to our jagged expectations. The seabed is deeply pitted, torn, and scarred. It cryptically cries out in past neglect, ruin, and abandon. Sparkling coral and happy creatures thrive in the shallows blissfully unaware of the decay of their heritage laying just out beyond the reef. The water deepens and color fades to grey where predators roam. Deeper still, the seabed appears lifeless and void. As the ROV touches down onto the deep seafloor, a benthic nephloid cloud erupts, engulfing the remote intruder. As the silt settles in the darkness, polycheate worms withdraw into their delicate burrows. Now under immense pressure, the ROV is in total solitude, stillness, and cold. There is no margin for failure in the ocean. The seafloor speaks of past failure, where grim reminders of the lost and broken abound. It is a relief to be back on board the Persistence in relative safety.

The Persistence is amid uncovering the final planned quadrant of the search area. Once completed and ROV ground-truthed, we will assemble the data and read from the last scroll in this mighty manuscript.

http://www.nholloway.blogspot.com/

HAPPY NEW YEAR'S TO ALL OF YOU!

(twenty minutes away here in Texas!)

I truly hope we will have the answers in 2008.

I am going to do that.  I have some silver dollars  from grandparents and still some from the days of Las Vegas' silver dollar machines.

It works....you'll get lots of greenbacks.  The black eye peas are little money.
the cabbage is big money.

Natalee is somewhere waiting
in a place that's cold and dark.
And when she hears the Persistence
her soul will feel a spark!

Her body is somewhere waiting
but her soul is in another place.
She knows she's not forgotten.
Quietly she waits, with an angel's grace.

She heard her parents talking
about plans to bring her home.
She's waited such a long time,
counting days pass one by one.

But now she knows she's going home.
She'll be on home ground again.
There are wonderful people who are bringing a ship
she tells her Angel friends.

There are people coming to search for me,
they are already looking every day.
A sturdy ship, a caring crew.
God please let them find me, I pray!

Her face will glow with happiness,
and the Angels will sing their song.
She raises her voice to Him in prayer.
Thank you Lord...it's been so long!

She's ready and waiting, she'll know when they're near.
She'll know when they stop above her.
The Angels will sing and the Heavens will shine.
She's going home to her families who love her!

For the Persistence and crew, a New Year's boost of encouragement for your selfless efforts and dedication. God is with you all.
Wishing each of you a very Happy New Year, and many blessings.

GabbyG

Gabby,

Thank you for sharing your lovely poem with us!  And I second your wishes to the crew of the Persistence.

Beautiful poem Gabby

Gabby, Your Poem is Beautiful...Thank You for Sharing it with Us! 

Gabby, what a heartfelt and touching tribute to some very deserving and caring people, the Holloways, Twittys and the Persistence crew, all of them and all of those who share in this journey.

Beautiful poem, Gabby!

Thanks so much for sharing it with us.

Gabby, A lovely heartfelt poem.

Happy New Year to all monkeys.
I wish you all prosperity, health and happiness.
And I so hope that Natalee is found.
God Bless us everyone.

Magnolia, thank you for sharing that with us about the silver.  I am surprised I never knew that, with several Jewish people in my family.  Maybe I just never paid attention.  :roll:

This is so OT, but did you know that a red door is not only warm and welcoming, that it represents the blood of Christ, and warmth and hospitality should be found within and a blue porch ceiling scares away haints, thus, the reason some of the high-end paint stores now have a ceiling paint they call "Haint blue."

Such silliness and totally OT, but it's New Year's and I am feeling more uplifted about Persistence than ever before. 

 :shock: I covered the bizarre stories and Richard covered the politics..lol My first message was all about sports,travel shows and aruba but it got erased :( Good to hear everyones voices..  :lol: Happy New Year Monkeys!