Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

And The Winner* Is ... *Really we're pretty sure this time.

This is the cover of Time Magazine dated May 19.

48 delegates to go. 

Oh Lord,

I'll have to resize that pic.

Let me try again.

rumours are that next week after the last primaries remaining superdelegates will turn to obama and hillary drops out.

 ::MonkeyDance::

on the issues obama can defeat mccain easily.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

but the GOP is known for dirty campaigning.
putting unfounded B.S. out, fear mongering - all that kind of things.
that may work for the less educated.

but maybe this time will be different.
i've got a lot of respect for mccain. maybe he won't allow a dirty campaign.

A political strategist who was on CNN the other day indicated that it would be to McCain's advantage if Obama won the Democratic Primaries.  A random poll indicated that if Hillary won ... Obama support would go to Hillary.  However ... if Obama won the majority of Hilliary support would go to McCain.  McCain may be Republican but he is very close to the center.

Thoughts?

Janet

general campaign hasn't really started yet.
so we'll have to see.

but i think after a couple of weeks when the hillary crowd calmed down a bit and accepted their loss.
they will rally behind obama.


and CNN was until a week or so ago pro-hillary. so that's maybe why that strategist said that.

speech Obama is going to make later on about McCain getting it wrong again on Iraq.


http://thepage.time.com/obamas-remarks-at-great-falls-montana-town-hall/

 ::MonkeyDance::

i bet mccain keeps on digging his self-created hole.
instead of acknowledging his mistake.

I rec'd an email that Obama will or has won.

Now, the real fighting will start.

(http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a272/LouiseVargas/Obama-scan0001copy.jpg)



And The Winner* Is ... *Really we're pretty sure this time.

This is the cover of Time Magazine dated May 19.

Mama LV,  You know I love and respect you no matter what, but God help us if he becomes president.   I know you were worried about the thought of wearing a burka,  well, if he wins, we are much closer to that than you think.  He is going to destroy our country by attempting to 'befriend' Al-Queda and other Mideast, American hating countries.   You need to realize, they WANT TO DESTROY US and ISRAEL under any circumstance!  They will rejoice if he wins and brings our troops home.  All those sacrafices to be made in vain.   I know you live on moderate means, as most of us do.   Are you looking forward to higher taxes?   I can't afford them!   We won't go into his church, and past now, but it isn't pretty.  He's not a uniter, but a divider.  Charisma isn't the only qualification for presidency.  I can use the word "Change" over and over again, but does that make me qualified?  And what does that change really mean?  Can you provide specifics, cause, I've yet to see what and how.   I'd appreciate your input on what his "Change" is...

With Love,

Di

   Louise, for goodness sake, you are hailing the praiser of Islam......do you really, as a Jew no less, care so little for Israel????? Listen to the sermons BHO has for the last 20 years........his whole congregation hates Jews more than other white people.....they can't wait for the Palestinians (and I'd like to know the origin of that word) to destroy Israel.  I have friends with family there....Israelis are good people, who have had to fight continuously for their little patch of desert.....a place where the Holocaust survivors was given by England, when NOBODY, yes nobody would take those poor souls.  And they cultivated it and made a beautiful country or state as it is called.

     They must live in fear of bombs and kidnappings every day, yet when they fought with Syria, they dropped warnings down to civilians, warning them to get out.  When were the Jews ever warned, given such hyman compassion??? Never!!!

      OT, but speaking of Israelis, have you ever read any of Naomi Ragen's books? She's wonderful and gives (in some of her books, insights into life in Israel and the plight of the women born of the Hassidem.

My mother was a white woman who just loved black people, loved the civil rights movement. She'd tell me how Harry Belafonte was the best-looking man on the planet. So I had all these positive images. My father was a Harvard-educated man. He was Kofi Annan, except taller. So the whole notion that blacks were inferior never came up at the dinner table." (p.23 Barkley)

Baracks mother and father divorced and his mother remarried. Until he was 6 years old he lived in Hawaii then they moved to Indonesia


Baracks mother worked in the embassy in Jakarta. The head of the embassy there was a black guy.

Barack loves Jews.

31 delegates at stake in Montana and South Dakota.
so if he gets half of that he only needs another 20 superdelegates.

only today already 7 superdelegates commited to Obama.

 ::MonkeyDance::

Considering nobody responded to my above post ... I do believe that I will have a dialogue with myself.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

+++++++++++

Angry Clinton supporters tell party leaders: 'Let's go McCain!'
Posted: 11:20 AM ET

From CNN Associate Political Editor Rebecca Sinderbrand

WASHINGTON (CNN) – Democratic leaders hopeful that a deal to seat delegates from Florida and Michigan would mark an end to the deep division the controversy has brought to the party got some instant – and less than encouraging – feedback as they finalized the measure Saturday evening.

As members of the Democratic National Committee's Rules and Bylaws panel voted in favor of the measures, some supporters of Hillary Clinton's White House bid rose from their seats and began to shout “Don’t steal my vote!” and “Let’s go, McCain!”

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/01/angry-clinton-supporters-tell-party-leaders-lets-go-mccain/#more-7460

I apologize caesu.  I just read your response to my post.  Considering ... you did not quote my post ... I did not clue in.

Anyways ... you could be right considering Hillary supporters arriving at a place when they will stand behind Obama but ... I pray they do not.

However ... if Obama's ideology reflects the racist, anti-American, Marxist "company he has kept" for the past twenty years ... his ideology may be too far left to expect the support from Hillary supporters ... especially if the media ...  the McCain campaign makes this information an issue.

It will be an interesting summer.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Janet

interesting it will be indeed. i think we all can agree on that.
the whole world is watching, more than earlier elections i think - because so much is at stake.

also turnout in the primaries was exceptionally high. for the democrats for sure.
so the democracy is working. that is a good thing.

i only hope that it will be a clean and honest campaign.
no fearmongering or playing into prejudices. from both sides that is!
maybe the candidates want to play it fair.
but there are always groups not approved by the candidate who resort to dirty tactics.

mccain himself was victim to that in the 2000 primaries against bush in south carolina of course.

Barack Obama has already set the stage for issues/questions that can be raised in the Presidential campaign in regards to the racist, anti-American, Marxist "company" he has associated with throughout the past twenty-years.

Janet

+++++++++++++++


CNN NEWSROOM
Covering the Campaigns
Aired February 17, 2008 - 14:00   ET

SEN. BARACK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  We have heard another argument that Obama hasn't gone up against the Republicans. They will tear him up. I've got to explain I'm from the South Side of Chicago. I'm skinny but I'm tough.

And I am looking forward to a debate with John McCain. John McCain is a good man. He's an American hero. And we honor his service to this nation. But he's made some bad choices about the company he keeps ...

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0802/17/cnr.01.html

Barack Obama has enough delegates to clinch Democratic presidential nomination, CNN projects.

Barack Obama has become the first African-American to secure a major U.S. party’s presidential nomination, CNN projects.

 ::cartwheel::

A McCain victory come November!!!!

Today at around noon AP (Associated Press) reported Obama has enough delegates to become the Democratic Nominee.

VIDEOS

Obama
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/06/03/sot.obama.clinton.cnn

Clinton
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/06/03/sot.clinton.no.decisions.cnn

McCain
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/06/03/sot.mccain.obama.record.cnn

Obama Clinches Democratic Presidential Nomination
by FOXNews.com
Tuesday, June 3, 2008

Barack Obama clinched the Democratic presidential nomination Tuesday, becoming the first African-American to run for the nation’s highest office as the standard bearer of a major political party.

<snipped>

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/06/03/ap-obama-clinches-democratic-nomination-with-superdelegates/

I'm very curious now who the VP's are going to be.  I believe that is going to play a large part in the final outcome.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/06/04/opinion/polls/main4154051.shtml

(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/photo/2007/11/01/PH2007110101368.jpg)

(During WWII) British terminology used '"Palestine" for the part west of the Jordan River and "Trans-Jordan" for the part east of the Jordan River.

The British Mandate enacted English, Hebrew and Arabic as its three official languages. The land designated by the mandate was called Palestine in English, Falastin (فلسطين) in Arabic, and in Hebrew Eretz Yisrael ((פלשתינה (א"י).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine

It can be used to refer to the area within the boundaries of what was once British Mandate Palestine (1920-1948), an area which included the Transjordan until the establishment of the Kingdom of Jordan in 1921.  When the British Mandate took effect, the area was divided up. Israel was given to the Jews,  Jordan has its kingdom, and Transjordan was given to the former "Palestinians."

Today ... there are no "Palestinians" as there is no country called Palestine. People use the term all the time.

polls are slightly in favor of obama.
on average a 2.5% lead against mccain.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

but this is still before hillary's endorsement.
if the hillary crowd turns behind obama i think his lead wil increase.

of course some disgruntled hillary supporters will turn to mccain.
but i doubt that will have much inlfuence on obama's lead.

i can't wait for the first debates.

              My question was really Rhetorical, Louise......I am just so sick of those who wish to take Irael away from the Jews and give it back to the "Palestinians", the so-called "rightful owners"!!!!   Believe what you want, who is intitled to Israel.......it is the Jews, was given to Holocaust survivors.......and the Hebrews have been there for milliniums!!!

                     God Bless and Save Israel!!!  My heart and prayers are always with you!!!!!

Way back on March 31, 1977, the Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with Palestine Liberation Organization executive committee member Zahir Muhsein. Here's what he said:  

The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.

Please read entire article at:
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=28222

(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/photo/2007/11/01/PH2007110101368.jpg)
[/quote]


        PREVIEW OF THINGS TO COME???????   Hmmmmm........LOOKS LIKE SEGREGATION MIGHT JUST BE IN THE FUTURE!!!!!

THE LAND

Genesis 12:1-3

Now the LORD had said to Abram, Depart from your country, and from your kindred, and from your father's house, to a land that I will show you:
 
And I will make of you a great nation, and I will bless you, and make your name great; and you shall be a blessing:

And I will bless them that bless you, and curse him that curses you:

+++++++++++

Genesis 12:7

And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto your seed will I give this land: and there he built an altar unto the LORD, who appeared unto him. 

+++++++++++

Genesis 13:14-15

And the LORD said unto Abram, after that Lot was separated from him, Lift up now your eyes, and look from the place where you are northward, and southward, and eastward, and westward:
 
For all the land which you see, to you will I give it, and to your seed for ever.

+++++++++

Genesis 15:18

In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto your seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates: 

+++++++++++++

Genesis 17:8-9

And I will give unto you, and to your seed after you, the land where you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.
 
And God said unto Abraham, You shall keep my covenant therefore, you, and your seed after you in their generations.
 
+++++++++++

HAPPY 60TH ANNIVERSARY ISRAEL!!!

Sixty years ago ... God was faithful to His promise and ... provided a way for Jews to return to the land that He had set aside for them as per His covenant with Abraham.

Genesis 28:14-15

And your seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and you shall spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in you and in your seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed.
 
And, behold, I am with you, and will keep you in all places where ever you go, and will bring you again into this land; for I will not leave you, until I have done that which I have spoken to you of.

+++++++



 

remember Mike Gravel? he was also a democratic candidate.


Gravel: Obama is foolish and dangerous

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpiy2E242bo

caesu

I believe that many Democrats are leary of the extreme far left ideology of the individuals and organizations which Barack Obama's has associated with throughout the past twenty years.  This is the reason that many Democrats are claiming that they have no choice but to cross the Party line and cast their ballot for McCain ... a cadidate who is just right of center.  In other words ... it is all about what is for the good of America ... not the Democratic Party.

Hey ... if this captial "C" Conservative was American ... she would cross the Party line and vote for Hiliary Clinton if ... the Republican candidate embraced a far-right ideology and ... had a twenty-year association with the KKK ... even if he claimed he had not been listening to the message.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

+++++++++

It's gross hypocrisy
Mike Gravel rates Democrat opponents
January 10, 2005

Transcript:

JAY: So, then, what do you make of Obama's promise of change and all the rhetoric that's been going along with his campaign?

GRAVEL: It's foolish. Foolish. Dangerous. Dangerous, because he doesn't even recognize that he can't deliver. That's dangerous. I would rather - Hillary. At least she knows what she's talking about. He doesn't.

JAY: Edwards?

GRAVEL: Edwards? He probably knows better, what he's talking about, than Obama. Obama of the three is the most dangerous, because he raises greater expectations of the youth and can't deliver. And the worst thing a leader can do is raise expectations, and they don't happen. You create a whole new generation of cynics. And that's what he's doing. And he’s used the line [inaudible] reason out what he's saying. You know, the statement I like that I've heard from young people: there's no ‘there’ there. And listen to the words. Make a speech and use the word change ten times—what specifically are you going to change? You're going to change the health care system? Not really. You're going to change the military-industrial complex? Not really. He wants another hundred thousand more troops. Are you going to change anything about your relationship with Iran? Not really. Nukes are on the table. Are you going to change anything with respect to Israel? Not really. He's supported by AIPAC. Are you going to change anything for education? He's on the education committee. He's supported by the NEA. Where's change? I don't see any change. But he doesn't say any of those things. He lets you figure out what the change is. So it's like an actor. What does an actor do? He gives you a scene, and you read into it what the scene means to you. And that's what he's doing. It's terrible, because what you read into it isn't what's going to happen, 'cause he's going to have the reality. The simplest one of all is we have a $50 to $70 trillion fiscal gap. There's no money to do anything, never mind this imperialism, which is why there's no money to do anything. Here. You recall that Hillary, Edwards, and Obama all said, when asked by Tim Russert, would you have the troops out of Iraq by the end of 2013? And all three of them equivocated, weren't sure that they could do it. And then you heard just last night, oh, yeah; I'm going to start withdrawing them immediately. What are they talking about? Say one thing; say another thing. You know, withdrawing immediately, what does that mean? We'll withdraw ten this month, and then I'm going to change my mind next month? It's gross hypocrisy - is really what it is.

Didn't Abraham have several sons?  I remember this being a hot topic at one time.  All inherited from the father?

The Promises made by The
One God to Abraham and
his Descendants through Isaac and Jacob

The covenant promises would come through Abraham's wife (who had not yet produced a child at age 90).

Her name was to be changed to Sarah (noblewoman) to reflect this honour. Ones name is changed when ones relationship with God is altered

God promised a son, to be called Isaac, exactly one year later, and through him would the promises go.

More:
http://www.ccg.org/_domain/abrahams-legacy.org/promises-made.html

there are more candidates than just Obama and McCain.

Constitution party, Libertarian party, Green party.

recent polls show not that many democrats cross party line and vote for McCain now.

in the new Rasmussen poll Obama is already leading 7 points. Obama 50%, McCain 43%.

http://rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll

Obama’s bounce is the result of growing unity among the Democratic Party. Eighty-one percent (81%) of Democrats say they will vote for Obama over McCain. That’s the highest level of party support ever enjoyed by Obama.

Obama’s bounce can be seen in his favorability ratings as well. Fifty-eight percent (58%) of voters now give the Illinois Senator positive reviews. Just 41% have an unfavorable opinion. Those totals include 36% with a Very Favorable opinion and 27% with a Very Unfavorable opinion. Today’s results are the highest ratings yet recorded for Obama.

you just revealed your true motivations.

... and the WINNER is?

I think that we will have to endure a long hot summer on this thread before a WINNER can be predicted and ... maybe the polls will indicate the race is to close to predict and ... we will have to wait until the votes are counted on election night.

 ::MonkeyWink::

Janet

+++++++++++
 
June 9, 2008
Grumbling Clinton supporters make Democrats nervous

In a message sent to the Arizonan's supporters after news broke that Clinton was suspending her run, the Democrat-turned-independent highlighted McCain's "very good working relationship with Sen. Clinton."

"The phones at the campaign headquarters have been ringing with disaffected Democrats calling to say they believe Sen. McCain has the experience, judgment, and bipartisanship necessary to lead our country in these difficult times," Lieberman wrote. "Many of these supporters are former supporters of Sen. Clinton."

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/06/09/clinton.supporters/index.html

caesu

I believe that your comment to Auntiem was unfair.  I was also taken back by this picture.

The photo along with the racist ideological foundation of the church which Obama attended for twenty years ... appears to be sending of message in regards to the "change" that may be forthcoming under an administration with Obama as the Commander-in-Chief.

Janet
___________

VISION STATEMENT - TUCC
 
... "The vision statement of Trinity United Church of Christ is based upon the systematized liberation theology that started in 1969 with the publication of Dr. James Cone’s book, Black Power and Black Theology."

http://www.tucc.org/talking_points.htm

++++++++++

Black Theology & Black Power (Paperback)
 
First published in 1969, "Black Theology & Black Power" provided the first systematic presentation of black theology. Relating the militant struggle for liberation with the gospel message of salvation, James Cone laid the foundation for an original interpretation of Christianity that retains its urgency and challenge today.

http://www.amazon.ca/Black-Theology-Power-J-Cone/dp/1570751579

+++++++++

QUOTES - "BLACK POWER & BLACK THEOLOGY"

"Christ is black therefore not because of some cultural or psychological need of black people, but because and only because Christ really enters into our world where the poor were despised and the black are, disclosing that he is with them enduring humiliation and pain and transforming oppressed slaves into liberating servants." James Cone
 
"Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community ... Black theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love." James Cone

"In the New Testament, Jesus is not for all, but for the oppressed, the poor and unwanted of society, and against oppressors ... Either God is for black people in their fight for liberation and against the white oppressors, or he is not." James Cone

    Are you addressing me or Obama???  Do you not see something strange about this picture?  The half African-American President of the United States, which is made up of many different cultures forsees himself as the leader of ONLY African-Americans?  Only THEY will be the future college professors, and Military leaders???   And then, he will be proud enough of his country to place his hand on his heart and salute our Flag????

   I believe, that YOU  revealed YOUR motives and what you are hoping are Obama's!!!!



    ( Ah, yes, as the saying goes..."A picture is worth a thousand words".   Your's tells it all!!!)

      And the young soldier in the picture appears to be barely old enough to be finished with "Basic Training"......WOW....he sure is highly decorated!!

you really got some nerve to compare Obama's attempt at the White House to segregation.

i bet you dream of the time when the Jim Crow laws were still in place - so that photo wouldn't even be possible.

Obama by the way gets his supporters from all races all over America.
he broke with that reverend and church. better late than never.
he himself never advocated black liberation theology
(maybe if you misquote him, or take all his quotes out of context - like often is done in those smear campaign emails or on right wing copy-paste blogs)
read his speeches or his books (in full!), how he is uniting America, not dividing like his predecessor.

so get over it!
the country has moved on now and is not living in the 18th, 19th or the early 20th century anymore were one race could oppress the other.

and you got even more nerve to question that decorated soldier. how very dare you! shame on you!
or does supporting the troops for you only applies to one group?

caesu ... please think about this from a perspectisve of logic.

If it was revealed that McCain had a twenty-year membership with the KKK and its leader and ... McCain only distanced himself from the organization when it was revealed by the media while he was on the campaign trail.

Would you give him a free pass if he implied that he had no idea what the racist ideology of that organization stood for?  Would you give him a free pass if he implied that he had never heard a racist speech from the podium?

Hey ... I am a capital "C" Conservative and ... I would not give McCain a pass ... I would not be that naive ... gullible.  I would have crossed the Party line and ... cast my ballot for Hilliary Clinton without a second thought.

Anyways ... in his own words ... Obama reveals knew from the getgo what the Rev. Jeremiah Wright was all about and ... he join TUCC anyways and ... remained a member for over twenty years.  Obama outright lied to the the American people when he implied otherwise.

Janet

++++++++

Obama 'Appalled' By Ex-Pastor's Comments
Wright's Comments A 'Show Of Disrespect To Me'
UPDATED: 5:24 pm EDT April 29, 2008
 
Calling the Rev. Jeremiah Wright "not the same person I met 20 years ago," Sen. Barack Obama said Tuesday he was "appalled" by his former pastor's comments Monday at the National Press Club.

http://www.nbc10.com/politics/16060061/detail.html


Audacity of Barack Obama and Rev. Wright
March 18, 2008 01:00 PM EST
 
In Senator Obama's first book, titled Dreams of My Father and published in 1995 (after he had been elected president of the Harvard Law Review but before he had been elected to public office), Senator Obama wrote at length about Rev. Wright and his moving "Audacity of Hope" speech.
 
In Dreams, Senator Obama explained how he met Rev. Wright[, whom he mentioned had been "dabbling with liquor, Islam, and black nationalism in the sixties."
 
He acknowledged that Rev. Wright immediately had given him fair warning that he was controversial, by quoting Rev. Wright as having said: "Some of my fellow clergy don't appreciate what we're about. They feel like we're too radical. Others, we aren't radical enough. Too emotional. Not emotional enough."
 
He also acknowledged that Rev. Wright let him know at their first meeting that he looked unfavorably on America and expected to continue to do so, by stating, "Life's not safe for a black man in this country, Barack. Never has been. Probably never will be."
 
Senator Obama left with one of Rev. Wright's "Black Value System" brochures.

When Senator Barack listened to Rev. Wright's "Audacity of Hope" sermon, September 11, 2001 was years away, but, Senator Obama admitted in Dreams, Rev. Wright castigated America.
 
Senator Obama put it this way: "Reverend Wright spoke of Sharpsville and Hiroshima, the callousness of policy makers in the White House and in the State House. As the sermon unfolded...the stories of strife became more prosaic, the pain more immediate...."

So it's hard to believe that Senator Obama was not familiar until very recently with Rev. Wright's position on the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
 
It's even worse for Senator Obama and Rev. Wright.
In Obama: From Promise to Power, by the Chicago Tribune's David Mendell, Mr. Mendell relates (pp. 159-160) a meeting between Senator Obama and Rev. Wright when Senator Obama was deciding whether or not to run for the United States Senate:
 
"'My name should be out there,' Obama told his pastor. 'but Carol Moseley Braun won't say what's she's going to do, and I'm not gonna run against a black woman. If she's gonna run, then I'm out. Until she says yes or no, I can't say anything."

http://www.theconservativevoice.com/article/

i would not give McCain a free pass in that case.
but there are important differences with the KKK and TUCC.

the TUCC has had some legitimacy due to the fact that black were oppressed brutally for the majority of the history of the USA.
note: i use the past tense here.

the KKK is an outright racist organisation, opposed desegregation, did a great deal of deadly bombings, assassinations, lynchings and more. and in southern states KKK members did get elected democratically or became governor.
imagine how powerless that must have felt for black people in those states during that time.

apart from a few outrageous statements (protected by freedom of speech / religion) you can't say the above of the TUCC.

i agree that Obama made a mistake getting affiliated with the TUCC and Rev. Wright.
i am not giving him an entirely free pass on that one.

but that's what all politicians do, they go to AIPAC for the Jew vote, or to the NRA for the gun owner vote.
or seek the endorsement of a pastor. same goes for McCain.

20 years in that church is unfortunate. but better late than never to break with that church.
apparently he didn't listen that closely to the sermons.

or, what i think is more likely, Rev. Wright didn't preach every Sunday with such outrageous sentences.
those short clips endlessly played on TV (g*d d*mn America), are of course not representative for all what is being said there.

if reading Obama's books and speeches, (and yes, as i always say - in full, not just the out of context (mis)quotes) i can't see anything resembling black liberation theology in that. to the contrary, he wants to unite all Americans - and he seems to be succeeding in that.

i read your 'wolf in sheep's clothing theory.
i can understand that, but only if you cherrypick all kinds of statements by people very loosely associated with Obama.
there isn't anything in Obama's statements that is corroborating with those statements.

of course one can say that this means that Obama's sheep's clothing is working very well.
but i think that is just a bit of unwarranted paranoia.
and even if it were true that he is a wolf, to comfort you a bit, still there is a Congress when he is President.
Congress will impeach the wolf then. and in 2010 there are new Congressional elections, so Obama will loose then big if he is not what he is portraying to be.

for the Christian vote. i am wondering where that vote is going to go.
i don't think one can assume that it is a done deal that this is for McCain.

EXACTLY!!!  PAST TENSE!!!

caesu ... the Japanese American citizens were rounded up and interned in the Second War World ... First Nations were forced onto reservations ... Women were treated like second class citizen in the work place and in the election process ... Legal immigration from China and India required a head tax that was not imposed on immgrants of White decent ...

However ... lessons have been learned from the injustices of the past and these groups as well as many African Americans have moved on.  While honoring their respective cultures and heritages ... are American first and foremost.

Churches that have a foundation based on the racist, anti-American, Anti-Israel and Marxist writings of James Cones has no justification for it existence except to cause division and further an ideology based on Karl Marx.

Barack Obama's relationship with the Jeremiah Wright for over twenty years and ... his membership with TUCC for over twenty years implies ... an adherence to the racist, anti-American, anti-Isreal rantings from the pulpit and ... the applause of affirmation from the thousands in the congregation.

Read carefully the perspective of Armstrong Williams ... it conforms perfectly with mine.

By the way ... Mr. Williams is African American.

Janet

++++++++++

"Armstrong Williams is a widely-syndicated columnist, CEO of the Graham Williams Group, and hosts the Armstrong Williams Show."

Sunday's Dirty Secret
By Armstrong Williams
Monday, March 17, 2008

Arriving in Washington DC during the 80's, my most difficult challenge was finding a church home. Having grown up in the Pentecostal and Methodist faith Sunday worship was a staple of my weekly routine. For almost 10 years I canvassed the nation's capitol seeking a church that would nourish my fleshly failings and remind me of what our creator expects of us as human beings. What was consistent in going from pulpit to pulpit was that ministers were more interested in political rhetoric, the endorsement of political candidates, and the denouncing of some government or community proposal, than the gospel. It was quite disheartening for many years knowing that ministers were not teaching or preaching the word of God, but that their sermons were becoming political rallies. I was stunned at the blame cast upon the White man, the racial divisive, and all the things that seemed to divide and separate us from our neighbor. Then in 1995 I attended First Baptist Church in DC where the Rev. Frank Tucker presided and my spirit finally found what it was seeking. I will never forget meeting with the Pastor prior to joining and expressing my feelings about what I was looking for in a church. I made it clear that my interest was in the word of God and not political rallies, condemnation of America, and various politicians occupying the pulpit on Sunday. He shared my concerns and promised that this wasn't the case at his church. Since being a member of Pastor Tucker's church for about 13 years, he's never disappointed my spiritual yearning. Throughout the years I've taken Whites, Muslims, Jews, and people of all walks of life to worship with me and they all have left feeling that they could join the pastor's congregation.

There are still pockets of so called black churches and mosque today that can identify with the Rev. Wright‘s lace-filled, anti-American, hypocritical sermons. During the 50's, 60's and 70's the black church was a place where blacks could gather and unite away from the harshness and brutality of racism and vicious hatred. It was a place where ministers could help their congregation express their anger, frustration, and America’s ungodliness towards their brethren. Many ministers during those tumultuous times were considered heroes and pillars of the community for they were preaching against an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. People like Jeremiah Wright are still preaching as though we’re in the 50’s or 60’s and are locked in this time warp. They refuse to elevate and celebrate the progress of America and how Presidential candidate Barack Obama’s campaign is evidence of that amazing paradigm shift.  

It is impossible for Senator Barack Obama and his wife to have patterned Rev. Wright's church and not have embraced his teachings and vision of America. My minister does and has always had a profound impact on my outlook about life and strengthening my spirit to forgive the transgressions of this world and not to induce more hate and separation. I find it difficult to believe Senator Obama when he tells us that he was unaware of his Pastor's vicious message from the pulpit and that had he known there would have been condemnation.

Many black intellectuals are still angry for what they perceive as the continuous crippling effect of racism and slavery in America on their careers. The irony is that many of their children have embraced this country, finding success and prosperity, while their parents continue to allow their wounds to be nurtured in this hopeless mindset preached from the pulpit. Michelle Obama’s expression of how for the first time she was proud of America was indicative of the influence of her Pastor.

Senator Obama should admit to the fact that since campaigning he’s seen a different America. He must show that he rejects and repudiates this school of thinking.  Furthermore that no one should be a member of congregations and mosque that preach this hatred and conspiratorial thinking, which continuously emphasize the worst in our country and not the phenomenal progress made.

This past week was not an exemplary moment for the man who prided himself on integrity and honesty throughout this campaign.  The fact is the Senator has no plausible excuse for why he remained a member of Rev. Jeremiah's church. He and his family should have immediately left his congregation for the embrace of a church that teaches the bible rather than the alienation, lunacy, and outright mockery of Christian teachings.

It was impossible for my spirit to endure these churches, as can be evidenced by my negative descriptions of them. It makes no sense for someone in search of America’s promise and potential to worship in a place where a doctrine of hatred is the central theme. I was taught that church was a place of escape and rest, but I didn’t want someone who is supposed to be a religious leader feeding me poisonous information.

My reason for going to church has always been for a spiritual recharge, not more of the same; I deal with politics 24/6, and one day a week I get a chance to take a break from all that. I believe this to be healthy, and think it sad that I had to try so hard for so long to find a church that was able to provide the rest or Sabbath, mentioned in the Bible.

The day must come when churches (Black or otherwise that preach this hate speech) will return to the Word. No one should ever be forced to search for such a lengthy duration or give up and settle in a church that is unacceptable and pay the price that will eventually implode Senator Obama’s to date well run campaign.

http://krla870.townhall.com/columnists/ArmstrongWilliams/2008/03/17/sundays_dirty_secret

+++++++++++

let me add that not only the Japanese were internned at these camps, so were Italians and Germans...

we never hear about that though....

mrs. red ... I did not realize that.  The Germans and Italians were not interned on the West Coast of British Columbia.  This is why the government's claim of "homeland security" in regards to the internment of Japanese did not wash.  It did appear to be a decision based on race.

On the the West Coast of British Columbia ... many Japanese CANADIAN CITIZENS were move to the interior of the province ... placed in internment camps until the end of the war.  They were not cruelly treated ... food, clothing, medical and education was provided but ... they were held against their will nevertheless.

My husband's immediate family made the decision to return to Japan and were fortunate that they were able to sell their property for a fair price prior to the move.  However ... many relatives and friends who chose to go to the camps rather than return to Japan ... did not sell their property.  Good neighbours and friends in the fishing communities they resided were willing to look out for their property until they were allowed to return.  However ... the government eventually conficated their property during the internment because of unpaid taxes.

Anyways ... my hubby and younger sister were born during this period and ... his family returned to Canada following the war.  His Father, Mother and four eldest sisters were CANADIAN CITIZENS but they were required to reapply for entry into the Country.  The years in Japan were not easy for the family.  They were CANADIAN CTIZENS but ... were suspected by many Japanese to be spies for the Americans.

Anyways ... despite this bleak period in Canadian history ... the Japanese Canadians are proud Canadians and ... intergrate into the mainstream of society.  Many in the Japanese community have worked hard in the creation of legislation to insure these injustices never again occur but ... they have moved on.  There are no organizations akin to the Black churches that embrace the racist, anti-American, anti-Israel, Marxits writings of James Cone.

Janet   

caesu ... I do not believe that Evangelicals are thrilled with McCain but ... I do not agree with Mark DeMoss (an acquaintance of my daughter's BTW) that up to 40% are about to cast their ballots for Obama.  McCain's pro-life position and military experience are two issues that Evangelicals would appreciate and ... the far-left company that Obama has associated with throughout the past twenty years will be a major consideration prior to casting their ballots.

I guess we will have to wait and see.

Janet

++++++++++

Thursday June 5, 2008
Exclusive: Interview with Mark DeMoss

With clients like Focus on the Family, Franklin Graham, and Campus Crusade for Christ, Mark DeMoss may be the most prominent public relations executive in the evangelical world. A former chief of staff to Jerry Falwell, DeMoss became then-presidential candidate Mitt Romney’s chief liaison to evangelical leaders. God-o-Meter caught up with him this week to ask how John McCain—and Barack Obama—are doing among evangelical opinion shapers and voters.

Interview ...

http://blog.beliefnet.com/godometer/2008/06/exclusive-interview-with-mark.html

Obama is doing quite well in the latest polls now.
7 or 8% lead for Obama.

Barack Obama has a 48% to 41% lead in the latest Gallup Poll Daily tracking presidential election trial heat, based on June 7-9 polling.

(http://media.gallup.com/poll/graphs/080610DailyUpdateGraph1_hjntrdf.gif)

The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Tuesday shows Barack Obama attracts 48% of the vote while John McCain earns 40%.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

 ::MonkeyShocked::

Barack Obama ... when you form a committee for the purpose of bestowing upon the respective members the task of selecting a potential Vice-president of the United States of America ... there needs to be back-ground check to assure there are not any underlying motives in regards to the selection.  Character in regards to trust has to be a high priority.  The Vice-President will become the unelected President of one of the greatest democracies on the face of the earth if something should deem the elected President not compentent of fulfilling his duties as Commander and Chief.

cbb ... I am back in the twilight zone.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Janet

+++++++

Obama Rejects Criticism Over Adviser’s Ties to Home Lender
by FOXNews.com
Tuesday, June 10, 2008

Barack Obama defended one of the men vetting his running-mate prospects Tuesday after the adviser came under fire for receiving favorable loan terms from a sub-prime lending company Obama has criticized.

The Illinois senator kept the adviser — former Fannie Mae CEO Jim Johnson — at an arm’s length, but heartily rejected the suggestion that he should do background checks for unpaid members of a search committee, no matter how influential their task may be.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/06/10/obama-controversy-over-advisers-ties-to-home-lender-is-a-game/

high on my dream ticket list would be
Obama + the republican senator from nebraska:
Chuck Hagel

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4c/Chuck_Hagel_official_photo.jpg/160px-Chuck_Hagel_official_photo.jpg)

Charles Timothy "Chuck" Hagel (born October 4, 1946) is the senior United States Senator from Nebraska. A member of the Republican Party, he was first elected in 1996 and was reelected in 2002. After considering running in the 2008 presidential election, Hagel announced on September 10, 2007 that he will retire from the Senate at the end of his present term and will not seek the presidency.

Born in North Platte, Nebraska, to Betty and Charles Hagel, who had German and Polish ancestry ... graduated from St. Bonaventure High School (now Scotus Central Catholic High School) in Columbus, Nebraska, and the Brown Institute for Radio and Television in 1966 and from the University of Nebraska at Omaha in 1972. Hagel is a Vietnam War veteran, having served in the United States Army infantry, attaining the rank of Sergeant (E-5) from 1967–1968. While serving during the Vietnam War, he received the Vietnamese Cross of Gallantry, Purple Heart, Army Commendation Medal, and the Combat Infantryman Badge. After returning from Vietnam, Hagel worked as a bartender and radio newscaster while finishing college.

Hagel married Lilibet Ziller in April, 1985. The couple lives with their daughter, Allyn, and son, Ziller, in McLean, Virginia ... Hagel's brother, Thomas, also a veteran of the Vietnam War, is a professor at the University of Dayton School of Law.

In 1971, Hagel was hired as a staffer for Congressman John Y. McCollister (R-NE), serving until 1977. For the next four years, he worked as a lobbyist for Firestone Tire and Rubber Company, and, in 1980, he served as an organizer for the successful presidential campaign of former California Governor Ronald Reagan.

After Reagan's inauguration as President, Hagel was named deputy administrator of the Veterans Administration. In 1982, however, he resigned his post over a disagreement with V.A. Administrator Robert P. Nimmo, who was intent on cutting funding for V.A. programs ...

After leaving government employment, Hagel co-founded Vanguard Cellular, a mobile phone manufacturer that made him a millionaire several times over. While working with Vanguard, he served as president and chief executive officer of the United Service Organizations and the Private Sector Council, as deputy director and chief operating officer of the 1990 G7 Summit, and on the board of directors or advisory committee of the American Red Cross, the Eisenhower World Affairs Institute, Bread for the World, and the Ripon Society. He also served as Chairman of the Agent Orange Settlement Fund and is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations.

Since his election to the Senate in 1996, Hagel has served as deputy whip for the Republican Caucus. He has been chair of both the Senate Global Climate Change ******* Group and the Senate Oversight Task Force. He serves as co-chairman of the Congressional-Executive Commission on China. He also serves on the NATO ******* Group. Hagel is a member of four Senate committees: Foreign Relations; Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs; the Select Committee on Intelligence and the Committee on Rules and Administration.

In October 2002, Hagel voted in favor of authorizing the use of military force against Iraq.

On immigration, Senator Hagel supports a "pathway to citizenship" and a "guest worker program" for illegal immigrants. On May 25, 2006 he voted for S. 2611, the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2006, which passed the Senate before reaching a stalemate in the House in late 2006.

On June 26, 2007, Hagel joined with Senator Ted Kennedy to support the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2007 (S. 1639).

Committee assignments:
Committee on Foreign Relations
Subcommittee on Near Eastern and South and Central Asian Affairs
Subcommittee on African Affairs
Subcommittee on East Asian and Pacific Affairs
Subcommittee on International Development and Foreign Assistance, Economic Affairs, and International Environmental Protection (Ranking Member)
Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs
Subcommittee on Securities, Insurance and Investment
Subcommittee on Financial Institutions (Ranking Member)
Subcommittee on Housing, Transportation, and Community Development
Select Committee on Intelligence
Committee on Rules and Administration

On August 18, 2005, Hagel compared the Iraq War to Vietnam and openly mocked Vice President Dick Cheney's assertion that the Iraqi insurgency was in its "last throes."

In November 2005, Hagel made a much-publicized statement: "To question your government is not unpatriotic — to not question your government is unpatriotic." This was in reference to the lack of open debate in Congress regarding the Iraq War, and in defense of his assertion that the United States should withdraw its troops.

In December 2005, in reference to Bush, the GOP, and the PATRIOT Act, Hagel made a much-publicized statement: "I took an oath of office to the Constitution, I didn't take an oath of office to my party or my president."

In November 2007, he rated the Bush administration "the lowest in capacity, in capability, in policy, in consensus -- almost every area" of any presidency in the last forty years. He also revealed he is open to running as vice-president with the 2008 Democratic nominee. In the same month, he said, "I have to say this is one of the most arrogant, incompetent administrations I've ever seen or ever read about."

On its website The Times reported that the Senator is a possible candidate in the Barack Obama administration for the cabinet position of Secretary of Defense:

Obama is hoping to appoint cross-party figures to his cabinet such as Chuck Hagel, the Republican senator for Nebraska and an opponent of the Iraq war. Senior advisers confirmed that Hagel, a highly decorated Vietnam war veteran and one of McCain’s closest friends in the Senate, was considered an ideal candidate for defense secretary.

Senator Obama was quoted in the same article, when asked about Hagel as a potential cabinet member: "Chuck Hagel is a great friend of mine and I respect him very much." Hagel is also rumored to be a possible Obama pick for the Vice-Presidential candidacy in his 2008 presidential election ticket.

Hagel has a tradition of wearing costumes to work on Halloween, usually masquerading as colleagues or other notable political figures. He has arrived at work dressed as Joe Biden, John McCain, Colin Powell, and Pat Roberts in past years.

(http://masbury.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/hagel-chuck-and-bro-tom-vietnam-lcongress-1.jpg)

Hagel was a “grunt,” a regular soldier, during some of the most brutal combat of the Vietnam war. Above is a photo of him with his brother Tom, atop a personnel carrier.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Hagel

http://hagel.senate.gov/public/

Chuck Hagel would indeed be a great choice!

that would compensate the military background of McCain a bit.
and of course because he is Republican it would attract a great deal more voters.

also Jim Webb would be a good one i think.

.... another flip flop.  However ... I believe the issue is Obama's judgement regarding background checks of committee members who are in charge of selecting who may be the next VP of the United States of America.  Logic dictates that there are no underlying motives or conflicts of interest in the selection processs.

Janet

+++++++++++
 
June 11, 2008
Obama's VP vetter steps aside
From CNN's Richard Allen Greene

Jim Johnson is no longer involved in Obama's VP search.
WASHINGTON (CNN) — A key member of Barack Obama's vice-presidential search team, James Johnson, is stepping down after criticism over a mortgage he received, the Obama campaign said.

"Jim did not want to distract in any way from the very important task of gathering information about my vice presidential nominee, so he has made a decision to step aside that I accept," the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee said in a statement.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/11/obamas-vp-vetter-steps-aside/

"Political forecasting has one essential function, which is to make astrology look respectable."
~~ Argus Hamilton
 
 ''And Obama's estimated 90,000 caucus votes this year almost equaled the combined 118,167 won by Mike Huckabee, Mitt Romney, Fred Thompson, McCain, Ron Paul and Rudy Giuliani, who finished in that order. '' - Obama spent a lot of effort busing in people to participate in caucuses which is why he so convincingly beat Hillary in them. All those caucus votes from the cumulative and respective Republicans will go to McCain in addition to most of Hillary's supporters.  Get over it, the golden boy is a toadie.

Howard Dean, trying to figure out how to get his golden boy elected, has now tried to implement the fairness doctrine so no one has a voice in the election except the DNC.  Touche, Scream.

Another Bad Day for the affirmative action golden boy, whose ability to stump does not equal his ability to equivocate.

By Rick Moran 6/11/08
On Tuesday, Barack Obama faced the glare of the cameras and tried to deal with what was rapidly becoming one of those "distractions" he so despises.

It turns out that the man he chose to head up the steering committee to help him choose a vice president, Jim Johnson, had a past that was making Obama out to be a hypocrite on the sub-prime mortgage crisis. After skewering John McCain for his connections with sub-prime lenders, it turns out that Mr. Johnson made McCain's connections look positively innocent by comparison.

Johnson, Fannie Mae chief from 1991 through 1998, received more than $7 million in real estate loans from a program open only to "friends of Angelo." The "Angelo" in question is none other than Angelo Mozilo, CEO of Countrywide Financial Corporation. Obama, who has heavily criticized Mozilo for accepting hefty bonuses despite the sub-prime crisis, evidently didn't vet Mr. Johnson thoroughly and failed to discover the sweetheart connection.

It should also be noted that according to the Chicago Tribune, the practitioner of "new politics" accepted $1.9 million from sub prime lenders, which only goes to show that when it comes to a decision between engaging in the "new politics" and old fashioned money grubbing, "new politics" gets the shaft.

The revelations about Johnson led to an incredible exchange with ABC News reporter Sunlen Miller, who grilled Obama on why the information hadn't been discovered by the campaign before he hired him. The ensuing explanation by Obama is a jaw dropper.

So without further adieu, I give you, ladies and gentlemen, Barack H. Obama -- Columbia University graduate, Harvard Law, President of the Harvard Law Review, and noted American orator:

    "Now look, the, the, ah, ah, ah, I mean the uh first of all uh I, I, I am not vetting my VP search committee for their mortgages so you're going have to uh d-direct... Well, nah I mean becomes sort of a... um... I mean this is a game that can be played everybody... It who is tangentially related to our campaign I think is going to have a whole host of relationships. I would have to hire the vetter to uh vet the vetter."


Huh?

It gets murkier -- or more bizarrely incoherent. The following was cleaned up by the ABC website and made into something printable:

    "Jim Johnson has a very discrete task," Obama continued, "as does Eric Holder, and that is simply to gather up information about potential vice presidential candidates. They are performing that job well, it's a volunteer, unpaid position. And they are giving me information and I will then exercise judgment in terms of who I want to select as a vice presidential candidate.

    "So this - you know, these aren't folks who are working for me," Obama said. "They're not people you know who I have assigned to a job in a future administration and, you know, ultimately my assumption is that, you know, this is a discrete task that they're going to performing for me over the next two months."


Whassat? What'd he say? Johnson doesn't really "work" for him because he's a "volunteer" in an "unpaid position." And after all, he hasn't promised him a cabinet post so it's really OK that he didn't vet him and besides this is just a "distraction" so can we please get back to your slavish worship of my awe inspiring talents?

Well, on Wednesday, Johnson "unvolunteered" himself from the campaign:

    I believe Barack Obama's candidacy for president of the United States is the most exciting and important of my lifetime," he said, according to a Bloomberg report. "I would not dream of being a party to distracting attention from that historic effort."


We all know how much Obama doesn't like "distractions." Obama himself cried a few crocodile tears in giving him the heave ho:

    "Jim did not want to distract in any way from the very important task of gathering information about my vice presidential nominee, so he has made a decision to step aside that I accept. We have a very good selection process underway, and I am confident that it will produce a number of highly qualified candidates for me to choose from in the weeks ahead. I remain grateful to Jim for his service and his efforts in this process," Obama said in a statement.


So, another Obama associate is thrown under the bus. One might begin to wonder if there are more people riding on the Obama express or underneath it. Think of all this guy's friends, staffers, spiritual advisors, and assorted far left radicals who have been given the equivalent of a pair of cement galoshes and thrown into the Chicago River. A partial list:

1, Samantha Power, foreign policy advisor, who ended up being just a little bit too frank about some of Obama's less than mainstream plans for Israel and other places if the candidate were to win office.

2. Austan Goolsbee, economic advisor, who whispered to the Canadian government sweet nothings about his boss's NAFTA switcheroo in Ohio -- Obama running around the state, breathing fire about the evils of NAFTA and how he would renegotiate the treaty while Goolsbee was telling the Canadians that the candidate was just politicking and had no intention of touching the treaty.

3. Reverend Jeremiah Wright, friend and spiritual advisor for whom the candidate bravely stood up -- at first -- until Wright's performance at the National Press Club caused the candidate to open the door himself and push the old man under the wheels.

4. Father Michael Pfleger, friend and spiritual advisor, whose spittle flecked rant at Trinity Church against Hillary, America and white people forced the candidate to leave his boot print on the good father's rear end as he too was impelled from behind under the Obama Greyhound.

5. William Ayers, terrorist and future Secretary of Education in an Obama Administration. Well, probably not. But Obama's dismissal of his former boss and friend as "just a neighbor" no doubt hurt the terrorist's feelings but became necessary when the press started to get curious about what a candidate for president was doing associating with someone who doesn't regret blowing people to smithereens.

There are more -- the undercarriage of that bus is bloody indeed. There's the entire congregation of Trinity United Church who now must practice their Black Liberation Theology and "anti-middleclassness" without the man who apparently spent many a pleasant Sunday sleeping through sermons -- or so he would have us believe.

But there is a monumental difference between Obama's previous actions in washing his hands of wayward staffers, bigots, and radicals and having to toss Jim Johnson out the window.

The others were handled when he was simply a candidate for the Democratic nomination for president. But his choice of Johnson to head up the most important job he has between now and the election -- choosing a vice president -- was made as the presumptive nominee.

In short, Obama's first major decision as the nominee for president of his party was an unmitigated disaster.

Not only did he choose someone who opened him up to charges of being a rank hypocrite. But the way he handled himself in off the cuff remarks in trying to defend Johnson was shockingly incoherent and stupid. Trying to pass Johnson off as someone who didn't work for him? That's childish in its attempt to avoid responsibility. One might expect a 7 year old to deny breaking a dinner plate by saying something like "I didn't drop it mom, it fell." But when the potential next president of the United States tries to run away from his mistakes, we can ask legitimate questions on how this man will perform if he reaches the oval office.

Craig Crawford brings up another point:

    Obama's cavalier response utterly contradicted his campaign's supposed crusade for reform. Not only did those words come across as tone deaf to the very ethical issues that he has raised in this election, but his remarks sounded like the ethical relativism we so often hear from the Washington business-as-usual crowd that Obama claims to be running against.


Chris Cillizza recognizes the danger Obama exposes himself to by latching on to people like Johnson:

    For Obama, any questions in voters' minds about whether he truly is a change agent or is legitimately committed to breaking the alleged stranglehold lobbyists and other power brokers have over the political system is potentially disastrous. Because of the peril involved, it's not terribly surprising that Obama moved quickly to "fix the glitch" once he realized questions about Johnson weren't going away.

    Seen another way, however, this episode could forebode poorly for how Obama handles the various slings and arrows sent his way by Republicans and their famed -- and effective -- noise machine.


This is where the national press has done a heroic job in keeping a well kept secret of Obama's associations and actions in his past that would expose him as the hypocrite he is. No real attempt has been made to ferret out the truth of what his career was like as a Chicago politician. The Obama campaign would blow up if the press ever read some back issues of the Chicago Tribune or Sun Times.

Instead, it is as if Obama sprang fully formed into the world of national politics, unsullied by grubby special interests and lobbyists who afflict everyone else in Washington. His holy throat and golden tongue will lead a revolution that will make America a paradise of unity and happiness.

All I can say is we better snap out of it before we elect the most incompetent, the most naive, and perhaps the most dangerous man ever to run for the office of the president.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/11/poll-shows-obama-picking-up-clinton-voters/

TYLERGAL!!!!

 ::cartwheel::

Where have you been?

I have missed you and ... Monkeys on the Natalee Holloway forum have missed you.

Janet

Hi, Janet, how are you>

Caesu, do you expect me to believe that George Bush is the evil demon you portray him as, when there is probably no family in this nation who loves this country more and done more, sacrificed and given for this country than the Bush family.  Look at the sacrifices throughout the generations and then you tell me that this long-legged poseur is going to save this country from all the evil Bushes. 

When that militant amazon woman that Obambi is married to says she has never loved her country before, she is only projecting his feelings on the little kiddies who fall in line and how do you think they are raising millions of dollars per day?  You think about it, it's coming from the internet, and that internet includes George Soros (who has said he wants to take the USA down and make China the greatest nation in the world), Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, Venezuela, and on and on and all they do is take large swaths of money and put names from their ghetto voters onto the money.

You need to think more and quit reading the junk sites.  I am stunned by your total ignorance of history you try to discuss but have not the background to do honestly.

Although I believe that McCain is the candidate of choice by default ... I do believe that his position too far to the left on most issues to be considered a "real" Republican.

Voting for an independent who represent the founding principles and values of the Republican Party ... limited government ... free-enterprise system ... would be a disadvantage to McCain and ...  serve to benefit Barack Obama.

To assure that Obama is not elected President of the United States of American ... votes must be cast for the left-wing right-wing candidate ... John McCain.
 
Janet

+++++++++

June 12, 2008
Paul: 'People will have a chance' with Barr

(CNN)— Rep. Ron Paul had some words of praise for recently declared Libertarian presidential nominee Bob Barr Thursday, calling him a ‘very positive’ influence on the presidential race.

Paul, who never officially ended his own Republican presidential bid, told American Morning Anchor John Roberts, “[Barr] talks our language, so I do really believe that he can have a very positive effect in this campaign and let the people know that limited government is a very, very important message.”

Echoing the principals he based his own presidential run on, the Texas congressman said Americans’ voices will be heard with Barr, and he “gives everybody a choice in the matter.”

Barr, who was a former four-term Republican congressman from Georgia, left the GOP to join the Libertarian Party in 2006 and officially won the its presidential nomination late last month.

Asked of speculation surrounding the creation of his own convention in September, Paul said he and his supporters won’t be there to cause problems for the Republican Party.

“We’re not going to disrupt them,” he said. “We’re not going to demonstrate as much as present a positive case for values that we believe should be the Republican values.”

Paul, who has made it clear in past interviews he will not support John McCain because of their differing views, said again Thursday he disagrees with the Arizona senator on foreign policy and economic relief.

“I would say [McCain] does not represent limited government values, and the republicans deserve to hear the other side of the story.”

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/12/paul-people-will-have-a-chance-with-barr/#more-7827

++++++++++++++++

A talented young lady with an incredible talent...




Paintings and poetry here -

http://www.artakiane.com/akiane_art.htm#

I believe the winner of the campaign will be a surprise, in many ways.  I can't wait!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

please tell me what the Bush family has done for the country.

i am not getting my information from junk sites.
lately i am reading a lot from sites were the same junk you come up with is posted.
that's were i find total ignorance of history.

for example you wrote yesterday that the USA also didn't have a post-invasion plan for WWII.
i don't know were you got that junk from but it is not from a history book.

No, there was no definite plan.  FDR was dragged into the war kicking and screaming by Churchill and the plans were made from day-to-day as to the postwar outcome which looked like in some of the worst days that there might not be an allied victory. 

Caseu, regards your ad hominem attacks, the weapon of choice of the intellectually inferior… the intellectually vanquished.

fur sure there was a plan between UK,US and USSR how europe was going to get divided.
where the areas of influence were for the three powers.
only the USSR promised to held free election in their occupied zones, what they didn't do.

bush went into iraq with no plan whatsoever.
worse thing is that they KNEW that it wasn't going to be easy occupying that country.
(read cheney's interviews in the 90s about why in the 1st gulf war they didn't go all the way to bagdad)
but they didn't plan for it.
very bad way of supporting the troops to send them in a country without a plan.

http://www.achievement.org/autodoc/page/bus0int-3

that's about bush senior.
that administration asked the shia population to rise up against saddam and promised their backing in overthrowing saddam.
but they didn't keep their promise and saddam struck the uprising down killing a great part of the shia population.
for that reason most of the shia population don't trust bush jr.

they didn't keep their promise because cheney knew that going all the way to baghdad and occupying iraq would cost a lot of american lives. so they didn't.

but in 2003 they did go to bagdad. cheney KNEW they weren't all going to be greeted as liberators and installing a new (shia) government would lead to an insurgence or civil war.
why didn't they send to troops in with a plan? why disband the iraq army? they al switched to the insurgency.

but this fits more in another topic i think.

What does GHW Bush have to do with this topic? This topic is an Obama thread.

Title of thread "And The Winner* Is"

From Posted by: caesu  Posted on: June 12, 2008, 07:31:00 PM

"please tell me what the Bush family has done for the country."

I consider the ADA an important piece of legislation.  jmho

I recall reading that Obama has some interest in Pakistan-


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Barack_Obama#Pakistan

Would the U.S. be welcome in Pakistan?  Maybe the Pakistani have invited the U.S. and nobody told me?

Will someone in the future be discussing how information was used to mislead the public about Pakistan?

and that was my response to Tylergal, who brought up GWB out of the blue:  ::MonkeyWink::

http://www.newsweek.com/id/142465

I think Scared Monkeys has become a "527" for Obama led by Caseu and Louise.

you can't handle opposing views and resort to smearing?

I am not here to discuss your point of view.  I am here to try to set the facts straight.  You obviously have a point of view that is warped and believe in a chaotic society where there is nothing but anarchy as your points of view come straight from ACORN.  If I could tell Barack one thing after hearing his wing-nut speech in Florida yesterday, in which he lumped the people of this country who oppose him, in one category, I would advise him not to believe all the Newsweek polls. 

Barack, you perfected stoking racial fear in your ACORN "community activist" days. With your race-baiting speech here in Jacksonville, what you're doing here is projecting your own festering racism which you learned at Rev. Wright's side onto people who despise you because of what you believe, not because of your race, which matters not in the least to me. If you believed what Dr. Tom Sowell believes, I'd pounding the pavement for you, but you don't believe what he believes, do you.

P.S.  Newsweek has always done great polling.  In fact, at this point in the races in the past, they had Presidents Mondale, Gore and Kerry leading by the same margins.   ::MonkeyWink::

Now, I bid you ado and wish you a happy life (for you) in which you find a loaded misery index each and everyday, inasmuch as that is what makes you happy.  You are a fringe person who has no purpose in life but to find misery in its every aspect and every venue. 

Just this morning I was reading an article from a New York paper regarding what a great first lady Cindy McCain would make because her accomplishments are vast and her outreach to those very unfortunate in society has been unequaled by any first lady in modern-day history.  But we know that first ladies are not graded by their value but by their ability to spend large amounts of money on clothing, make a good photo opportunity and cowtow to the Hollywood elites and that is something Cindy will not do.  She does not have to prove herself to them.  She wants to prove herself to the children of the world who need her help and that which she has done since she received her master's, oh those many years ago.

Unfortunately, Cindy (and therefore her husband) are at a serious disadvantage. Look at the NBA,NFL. They didn't become the popular success stories they are today by showcasing their white players via the media. Cindy just isn't hip, and there are millions of American consumers (who call themselves voters) who will vote for the angry black woman's husband for no other reason than the pretty packaging shown on 'the view' this week, which transformed her from the radical militant hate-mongering Naomi Campbell type to the female version of Bill Clinton discussing her pantyhose and stating that her husband stinks so bad the children will not get in the bed with them.  This is reminiscent of boxers or briefs statement by Bill Clinton.  It's about time we Americans quit trying to mimic the lowest common denominators of society and started trying to become that great shining city on the hill once more.

This once was a great place to visit.  Alas, it is dominated by Caseu, the lone commie pensioner. 

you are doing a great job together with the other smearers spreading copy-pasting mostly misinformation.
you must be fuming by now as it is apparently not working looking at Obama's 15% lead bounce in the polls.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/06/21/obama-eyes-fundraising-boost-from-clinton-donors/

Public funding was a discussion yesterday while visiting with friends.

I recall that when Ross Perot ran for president, people voiced concerns that the presidence could be bought by the wealthy. 

I have to wonder how much all the contributions to both candidates will end of being?

Not the political smartie, I wonder how much all this fundraising for Obama will be?  Above and beyond what McCain has bound himself to by taking the public money, and I imagine a smaller budget?  What happens to any leftover money?

Would the country be better off if money were not donated to political campaigns?  Perhaps donated to relief efforts?  Education?  Services for the needy?

WhiskyGirl you nailed it, yes it's an abomination that Obama will now spend 300 MILLION DOLLARs to buy the presidency.

A small nation could eliminate hunger and make a serious dent in healthcare needs with 300 Million dollars.

I find nothing admirable about going on The View to discuss your pantyhose, Michelle is just trying to downplay that ambitious in-your-face she does so well, now that she's outted herself.

Caseu where do you live, what is your vocation, and what qualifies you as an expert within the US political landscape? FYI, my late husband served in the first Gulf War and I only wish he were here to refute and dispute the reams of inaccuracies you post regarding the middle east and conflict.

After some thinking, a few things come to mind.

I think there was discussion a long time ago, that public funding was an attempt to level the playing field between wealthy candidates (I will buy the presidencey) and those that are of average/common means.

I don't know where any concern about the public financing system being flawed come from.  Perhaps it's just a point of view.  There are often questions regarding the influence campaign contributions have on politicians.  As example, "influence peddling" and people trying to link post election contract awards to campaign contributions comes to mind.  I believe contributions are public record (not my area of expertise).  It's an issue that just doesn't seem to go away.  imho

So, is it better to have the the limit (don't really understand this)?  Are there no restrictions on how much and from who Obama can collect? 

McCain restrictions?

Restrictions on asking?  Accepting?  Refusing contributions?

For the ignorant, perhaps the candidates could provide some review of these basics.  It might help level the playing field and eliminate some misconceptions.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-poll25-2008jun25,0,5763707.story

long awaited bounce.
and Obama and Hillary haven't even started campaigning together yet.

Newsweek poll also gives him 15% lead.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/142469

(http://i29.tinypic.com/2lxe1pz.jpg)

http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/news/politics/broward/blog/2008/07/new_poll_shows_mccain_leading_in_florida.html

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

(http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/7962/presidentialpollqh2.jpg)

About the same that President Kerry was at this point in 2004.

who is President Kerry again?

One of those people who counted his eggs before the chicken cackled.

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::