Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

Natalee Holloway => LCD Archive => Topic started by: Blonde on July 21, 2008, 10:38:53 PM



Title: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22 - 8/5/08
Post by: Blonde on July 21, 2008, 10:38:53 PM
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/Natalee2.swf



JUSTICE FOR NATALEE


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: bleachedblack on July 22, 2008, 08:07:30 PM
 ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: BTgirl on July 22, 2008, 08:22:58 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: bleachedblack on July 22, 2008, 08:27:28 PM
Speaking of LVR.......(last thread), when I read this portion of jorans conversation with Patrick, I immediately thought he was talking about LVR. I mean here he is in the midst of telling how horrified he was and sorry for HIMSELF...yet he has such admiration for LVR...that he just had to stop and brag to Patrick about this persons coolness because of how poorly he treats women. This portion sounds truthful to me, and he is certainly not speaking about his father who he thinks is an idiot, nor do I think it is merely fabricated due to the timing/placement in jorans retelling of the events. JMO See what you think......


J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.

P: Yeah, yeah.

J: Always. That’s the way it should be he says.

P: Yeah.

J: So then he came there and he told me: ‘Joraaan, what have you done man? She looks sweet, you know?

P: She’s just lying there?

J: She’s just lying there. She not doing anything. So he says: ‘Yeah, what happened?’ I said: ‘I don’t know man. I think she had too much to drink.’

P: But did you not try to resuscitate her?

J: Of course, Patrick, I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her, I was shaking her, I was shaking that bitch like ‘What's wrong with you?’ I almost wanted to cry.  ‘Why does this shit…..have to happen to me?

P: Of course, man, of course.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: bleachedblack on July 22, 2008, 08:29:25 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::

Looks like someone might have spiked your drink there little Sockmonkey...and you dozed off.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: BTgirl on July 22, 2008, 08:36:20 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::

Looks like someone might have spiked your drink there little Sockmonkey...and you dozed off.

I'm a sockmonkey. I have no bones. How can you tell if I've dozed off or not?  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: LilPuma on July 22, 2008, 08:39:59 PM
Speaking of LVR.......(last thread), when I read this portion of jorans conversation with Patrick, I immediately thought he was talking about LVR. I mean here he is in the midst of telling how horrified he was and sorry for HIMSELF...yet he has such admiration for LVR...that he just had to stop and brag to Patrick about this persons coolness because of how poorly he treats women. This portion sounds truthful to me, and he is certainly not speaking about his father who he thinks is an idiot, nor do I think it is merely fabricated due to the timing/placement in jorans retelling of the events. JMO See what you think......


J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.

P: Yeah, yeah.

J: Always. That’s the way it should be he says.

P: Yeah.

J: So then he came there and he told me: ‘Joraaan, what have you done man? She looks sweet, you know?

P: She’s just lying there?

J: She’s just lying there. She not doing anything. So he says: ‘Yeah, what happened?’ I said: ‘I don’t know man. I think she had too much to drink.’

P: But did you not try to resuscitate her?

J: Of course, Patrick, I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her, I was shaking her, I was shaking that bitch like ‘What's wrong with you?’ I almost wanted to cry.  ‘Why does this shit…..have to happen to me?

P: Of course, man, of course.

Lorenzo is the only one we know who lives/lived alone.  Also, as I mentioned in the last thread, Joran is NOT getting approval for what he's done from Patrick.  He's getting yeah, yeah.  Even this guy who comes to help him says "what did you do?  She looks sweet."   If a good undercover cop had been doing this, they might have played up disrespect for women in some way and Joran would have admitted to more of what he did.  Remember, "Joran is crazy."  "Joran is a devil."  And Jan van der Straaten wanting to put him in a mental ward.  They all KNOW what this guy did, dammit. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: LilPuma on July 22, 2008, 08:41:43 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::

Looks like someone might have spiked your drink there little Sockmonkey...and you dozed off.

I'm a sockmonkey. I have no bones. How can you tell if I've dozed off or not?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

You were snoring.   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 22, 2008, 08:49:30 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::

You were here as well?  And she managed to post first?   ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: BTgirl on July 22, 2008, 09:05:25 PM
BB Cheated! Cheater, Cheater!

I saw her in here at least 5 minutes before the old thread locked!  ::cartwheel::

Looks like someone might have spiked your drink there little Sockmonkey...and you dozed off.

I'm a sockmonkey. I have no bones. How can you tell if I've dozed off or not?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

You were snoring.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/
Post by: Noly on July 22, 2008, 10:28:11 PM
Speaking of LVR.......(last thread), when I read this portion of jorans conversation with Patrick, I immediately thought he was talking about LVR. I mean here he is in the midst of telling how horrified he was and sorry for HIMSELF...yet he has such admiration for LVR...that he just had to stop and brag to Patrick about this persons coolness because of how poorly he treats women. This portion sounds truthful to me, and he is certainly not speaking about his father who he thinks is an idiot, nor do I think it is merely fabricated due to the timing/placement in jorans retelling of the events. JMO See what you think......


J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.

P: Yeah, yeah.

J: Always. That’s the way it should be he says.

P: Yeah.

J: So then he came there and he told me: ‘Joraaan, what have you done man? She looks sweet, you know?

P: She’s just lying there?

J: She’s just lying there. She not doing anything. So he says: ‘Yeah, what happened?’ I said: ‘I don’t know man. I think she had too much to drink.’

P: But did you not try to resuscitate her?

J: Of course, Patrick, I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her, I was shaking her, I was shaking that bitch like ‘What's wrong with you?’ I almost wanted to cry.  ‘Why does this shit…..have to happen to me?

P: Of course, man, of course.

hi all!!

this is the part that always gets me....

I almost wanted to cry

  :twisted:


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 22, 2008, 10:43:53 PM
Hi Noly - actually it's this whole part that gets me:

J: Of course, Patrick, I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her, I was shaking her, I was shaking that bitch like ‘What's wrong with you?’ I almost wanted to cry.  ‘Why does this shit…..have to happen to me?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Noly on July 22, 2008, 11:02:58 PM
yes klaas...i agree!!

maybe he should've stayed home that night...ya know, it's all Anita's fault for not being home  :roll:


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 22, 2008, 11:09:01 PM
yes klaas...i agree!!

maybe he should've stayed home that night...ya know, it's all Anita's fault for not being home  :roll:

I wished he had  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: SS on July 22, 2008, 11:18:32 PM
Hi Everyone - I haven't disappeared, I'm just up to my chin in house renovations.  It's all that I can do to keep up with the reading.  I've had a few thoughts over the past few days while I was reading everything that has been discussed.

I thought that this statement by Urine was very interesting as to who helped him with Natalee's body....

J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.

If he is telling the truth, it does give some insight as to who this person could and couldn't be.  LVR comes to mind right away, but there is one more person who could also fit this description. John Chemaly, Jr. lives alone and is gay.  Urine uses the word "bitch" but he doesn't specify male or female.  Could "bitch" be a description for JC's male partners?  We were told that he and Renfro were both involved that night.  If Urine is even telling the truth here, his description of the helper living alone would eliminate Steve Croes, the Alpo brothers, Koen, and even Freddy.

My other thought has to do with land or sea.  I am starting to agree that Natalee was probably moved to two or more locations.  At this point, I'm not sure where she is.  Why has TES not returned to check those 150 sites?  If a body is in the ocean, it continues to deteriorate.  Wouldn't they want to retrieve her remains as soon as possible?  Did someone finally tell TES that she isn't in the ocean?  Was she in the trap that they found?  Tim was pretty certain when he placed that phone call to Dave.  OE watched as ALE took the evidence away.  Why hasn't TES been back, even when they were there to search for the missing Tromp man?

I have pretty much decided that if I had to get rid of something that I didn't want found, I don't think that I would put it in the ocean.  Once the object is dropped into the water, I would have absolutely no control over what would happen to it in the future.  It could be eaten by sharks, it could be found on the ocean floor by divers, or it could wash back up on the shore.  The ocean doesn't seem like a very safe hiding place to me.  I think that I would hide the object on land where I could watch and know for certain that my secret was safe.  Just a thought.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 22, 2008, 11:22:45 PM
Hi SS.  Thats what Ive always said.  Put it where you know it will stay and live by it the rest of your life.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 22, 2008, 11:38:55 PM
Of course the only safe way would be cremation, but there would be two many people to hush.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: SS on July 22, 2008, 11:40:41 PM
I have a question and I don't even know if anyone would know the answer.  Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer and they obvioulsy didn't return her to Beth and Dave.  Is there a pauper's cemetery or a Potter's Field in Aruba where ALE could bury someone and it wouldn't be noticed?  I have to think that ALE would be involving a minimal number of people in this coverup because they wouldn't want anyone to talk.  If it wasn't a Potter's Field, it would have to be in someone else's plot or a cremation.  Just a few more thoughts.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: SS on July 22, 2008, 11:46:49 PM
Always 1 - I just wanted to say hello before I collapse into bed.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 22, 2008, 11:48:16 PM
Good nite SS Sleep tight!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 22, 2008, 11:52:17 PM
Everything about this tragedy indicates to me that THIS WAS PLANNED, a CONSPIRACY & MANY were involved.  Why else did the VonCromvoit & Gottenboes abandon running businesses, lovely homes POST HASTE.

IMO they are all VERY VERY GUILTY, that's why.  The Stoolscums were probably the ORGANIZERS but they were all participants & each was just as guilty but the Stoolscums had the connections & primary responsibilty of running with the unaccountable consequences as JVDStoolscum (a minor so still able to see parents)would be well taken care of if the KIA became involved due to (Voc)King's past running of KIA so staff loyalties would be ensured.  The punk was getting high & having a grand old time while under the protection.  They ran their game knowing what the outcome would be, Vanderstratten took care of ALE, any evidence that would be found would be destroyed & it has been.

If it wasn't then I really believe that somebody would have called Natalee's family & told them the whole story if they themselves didn't have something to hide to protect themselves.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 12:14:04 AM
One of the advertisements of Aruba says "you cant get lost on Aruba".


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 12:14:32 AM
Everything about this tragedy indicates to me that THIS WAS PLANNED, a CONSPIRACY & MANY were involved.  Why else did the VonCromvoit & Gottenboes abandon running businesses, lovely homes POST HASTE.

IMO they are all VERY VERY GUILTY, that's why.  The Stoolscums were probably the ORGANIZERS but they were all participants & each was just as guilty but the Stoolscums had the connections & primary responsibilty of running with the unaccountable consequences as JVDStoolscum (a minor so still able to see parents)would be well taken care of if the KIA became involved due to (Voc)King's past running of KIA so staff loyalties would be ensured.  The punk was getting high & having a grand old time while under the protection.  They ran their game knowing what the outcome would be, Vanderstratten took care of ALE, any evidence that would be found would be destroyed & it has been.

If it wasn't then I really believe that somebody would have called Natalee's family & told them the whole story if they themselves didn't have something to hide to protect themselves.
You are 100% right. Natalee was recovered June 10th. It has been covered up ever since and the highest levels of Goverment are well aware. Where she is now is anyone's guess as she was moved SEVERAL times. I still bet the ocean was the final place -- but nothing would surprise me.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 12:20:42 AM
The 10th, is that when they found her in the rocks?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 12:24:46 AM
The 10th, is that when they found her in the rocks?
I believe so. It was when they announced to the world that one of the boys confessed and was leading them to the body.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:29:11 AM
One of the advertisements of Aruba says "you cant get lost on Aruba".

Until...they want you to be lost....I'm really sick if their shit....

Altruist...yep following the same ole' plan...but, they didn't count on Beth, Friends and Family...*this*time...

Someone sent me all the chit posted on another forum very recently re: Some Monkeys..including me....here is what I have to say to those posters....***Many*** of you were born with great gifts...please...I pray...don't continue to let them whither away***...and to some others like *Reality*....F*** YOU...YOU PERV....if you don't back off...I swear...I'll post a *feelings reading* on you!!!....and you KNOW...it will be VERY BAD....go wash your soul....and stop trolling for women on *all* the forums you post on!...

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 12:35:41 AM
Well I DO NOT BELIEVE that the JUSTICE DEPARTMENT in the NETHERLANDS WAS HELPLESS AT ALL, THEY CHOSE TO SIT BACK. 

Our prayers would be well directed to those in the NETHERLANDS who are decent & want to END THE CORRUPTION that is CURRENTLY PROTECTED by the NETHERLAND BUREAUCRATS INVOLVED IN THIS COVERUP.

& you can bet your ass that if something like this happened to one of the daughters of the illustrious waste of breath GWB our country & it's AGENCIES WOULD HAVE ACTED.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:36:53 AM
OOPS!...Did I really post that....sorry just *my* feelings...

Destiny ;-)....Reality....you haven't a clue...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:43:40 AM
Well I DO NOT BELIEVE that the JUSTICE DEPARTMENT in the NETHERLANDS WAS HELPLESS AT ALL, THEY CHOSE TO SIT BACK. 

Our prayers would be well directed to those in the NETHERLANDS who are decent & want to END THE CORRUPTION that is CURRENTLY PROTECTED by the NETHERLAND BUREAUCRATS INVOLVED IN THIS COVERUP.

& you can bet your ass that if something like this happened to one of the daughters of the illustrious waste of breath GWB our country & it's AGENCIES WOULD HAVE ACTED.

Altruist...Right On...do you have any suggestions...of how we can make more of an impact...where it counts?   TIA

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 12:46:51 AM
Long ago posters at Scared Monkeys knew why the whole crew of the youngsters of these sicko groups were hauled in as "suspects" IT WAS TO PROTECT THE PERVERTS.

NO AMERICANS SHOULD TRAVEL THERE AT ALL.  NOT ONE DIME SHOULD BE WASTED ON SUCH A CORRUPT PLACE FOR NOBODY IS SAFE.

NO LIVING BEING ACCEPT PERVERTS, THAT IS WHAT WILL FOREVER BE IN MY MIND IF THEY TELL ME THEY TRAVELLED TO THAT HELL HOLE, THEY WILL BE PERVERTS, END OF STORY.

THIS IS WHAT SHOULD BE ON ANY BILLBOARD OR FLYER:

ONLY PERVERTS TRAVEL TO ARUBA


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 12:50:30 AM
Altruist, thats a very strong statement.  Are you saying Natalee's group shouldnt have gone to Aruba? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:51:21 AM
Long ago posters at Scared Monkeys knew why the whole crew of the youngsters of these sicko groups were hauled in as "suspects" IT WAS TO PROTECT THE PERVERTS.

NO AMERICANS SHOULD TRAVEL THERE AT ALL.  NOT ONE DIME SHOULD BE WASTED ON SUCH A CORRUPT PLACE FOR NOBODY IS SAFE.

NO LIVING BEING ACCEPT PERVERTS, THAT IS WHAT WILL FOREVER BE IN MY MIND IF THEY TELL ME THEY TRAVELLED TO THAT HELL HOLE, THEY WILL BE PERVERTS, END OF STORY.

THIS IS WHAT SHOULD BE ON ANY BILLBOARD OR FLYER:

ONLY PERVERTS TRAVEL TO ARUBA

Hi Chuckie -rat..Ya feel at home?...

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 12:52:28 AM
Well Destiny, I think only positive thoughts & prayers for those in the Netherlands working hard to communicate with the decent citizens of the Netherlands to STOP SUPPORTING PERVERTS WITH THEIR TAX DOLLARS.

That is exactly what is happening THE PERVERTED NETHERLAND BUREAUCRATS & POLITICANS ARE STEALING FROM THE HONEST CITIZENS OF THE NETHERLANDS TO OPERATE THE PERVERTED ISLAND OF ARUBA, THEIR PERVERT PLAYGROUND WHERE THEY PREY ON THE INNOCENTS.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 12:53:36 AM
Ok, Im confused........again.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:53:37 AM
Altruist, thats a very strong statement.  Are you saying Natalee's group shouldnt have gone to Aruba? 

Always...not speaking for Altruist...but, I think he's saying that no one is safe in Aruba...please correct me if I'm off base.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 12:55:37 AM
Altruist, thats a very strong statement.  Are you saying Natalee's group shouldnt have gone to Aruba? 

No, that is not what I am saying, it is after Natalee's group came back without Natalee & this CORRUPTION became UNVEILED.  By the end of June 2005, coverup was in plain view & still is.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 12:56:13 AM
oh ok Destiny, thank you, Im really tired.  Wish I had one of your free puppies to curl up with and go to sleep.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:56:53 AM
Well Destiny, I think only positive thoughts & prayers for those in the Netherlands working hard to communicate with the decent citizens of the Netherlands to STOP SUPPORTING PERVERTS WITH THEIR TAX DOLLARS.

That is exactly what is happening THE PERVERTED NETHERLAND BUREAUCRATS & POLITICANS ARE STEALING FROM THE HONEST CITIZENS OF THE NETHERLANDS TO OPERATE THE PERVERTED ISLAND OF ARUBA, THEIR PERVERT PLAYGROUND WHERE THEY PREY ON THE INNOCENTS.

Altruist...you *know* more than you post...BLESS YOU for what you do post...and I agree with you 100%...

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 12:59:16 AM
Altruist, thats a very strong statement.  Are you saying Natalee's group shouldnt have gone to Aruba? 

No, that is not what I am saying, it is after Natalee's group came back without Natalee & this CORRUPTION became UNVEILED.  By the end of June 2005, coverup was in plain view & still is.

Could one of the moderator's either correct post #35 to read WITHOUT NATALEE or delete #35, whichever is the most convenient.  TYIA


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 01:02:30 AM
oh ok Destiny, thank you, Im really tired.  Wish I had one of your free puppies to curl up with and go to sleep.

Honey Bunch...I've worked the past 11 years here with a dog and cat rescue organization...do you *really* want a puppy?...can do Sweetie..if so...need to set you up with the adoption agency...it's like adopting a child....but I can facilitate the process...if you want...You Need a Dog...I can bypass the process and get you a dog/puppy...you need a puppy..not a full grown dog....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 01:04:07 AM
AMIGOE NEWS:

More traffic fatalities, brawling & shootings in Aruba.



http://tinyurl.com/5srm9n



Aruba
"There is little communication between government departments'
July 21, 2008, 16:41 (GMT -04:00)


http://tinyurl.com/5tgy9e


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:05:02 AM
No, you're not offbase at all Destiny.

I have a nephew who is 29 years old & 2 months ago he was SHOCKED to hear that the worthless pervert PVDStoolscum was free & at large.

I told him well you never ever better travel to that hell hole of Aruba or anybody that you tell will put you in the category of a PERVERT & you are only as good as your reputation.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:05:06 AM
Oh, Destiny, I cant have one.  I travel too much, but tonight I wish I had one to cuddle with.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:06:35 AM
Carpe, I sent you an email.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:08:10 AM
Altruist, you have my attention.  Will you share what you think happened to Natalee?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:16:57 AM
Gosh Destiny, you rescue puppies and kittens too, does God know youre missing from Heaven?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 01:17:03 AM
No, you're not offbase at all Destiny.

I have a nephew who is 29 years old & 2 months ago he was SHOCKED to hear that the worthless pervert PVDStoolscum was free & at large.

I told him well you never ever better travel to that hell hole of Aruba or anybody that you tell will put you in the category of a PERVERT & you are only as good as your reputation.

Thank you for Your reply Altruist...you are a good Uncle...and what what you told him...is becomming so true for Aruba...they can lie about the tourist stats....but...anyone can check online...and *see* their lies.......It's all coming down ....Aruba will now show NO econonmic growth in the next 16 months....then the rioting....it will really begin....

(((((((((((((((((((Altruist))))))))))))))))))))))))

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 01:17:48 AM
I have a question and I don't even know if anyone would know the answer.  Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer and they obvioulsy didn't return her to Beth and Dave.  Is there a pauper's cemetery or a Potter's Field in Aruba where ALE could bury someone and it wouldn't be noticed?  I have to think that ALE would be involving a minimal number of people in this coverup because they wouldn't want anyone to talk.  If it wasn't a Potter's Field, it would have to be in someone else's plot or a cremation.  Just a few more thoughts.
1.  J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. 11And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.near those

2. MARRIOTT BASIN tHE BODY IN THE BAG FRESH DEAD GIRL SECOND MOVE  EARLY HOURS they were being followed by camera man JMO Aruba Bay Video 24

3.Tim Miller
RED - SCARED MONKEYS
July 24, 2005

RED: There have been reports that a shallow grave was discovered in the area of Boca Tortuga, on the eastern part of the island. There are also reports that cell-phone calls made by Joran early in the morning came from a location on the eastern side of the island. It seems plausible that thisarea could yield more clues

TIM MILLER: We found a site that we feel as though was a possible gravesite. Our thoughts are that Natalee may have been buried in that hole for 1 or 2 days then moved. We have information that the cell phones were possibly being used in that area
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/07/24/interview-transcript-with-tim-miller-july-24th-2005/

4.or5 Art Wood interviewed a "Fransisco" twice as he was adamant that he helped bury Natalee with two others using a white PU. One of his friends worked at the Marriott and as you know there are other witnesses who say they saw Natalee placed in a tarp in a white pu at the Marriott. There is also that Fisherman that tells a very similar story and the details match up with Junior and what he saw a day later at the dump. The Fisherman mentioned something about only getting to that location in a ATV.

As you know this Fransisco was locked up almost immediately in a mental hospital after telling the ALE what he did,when Art Interviewed this man his friends said he was not crazy. Looking at all the witnesses this is the only Fransisco I see and a June 10th interview is interesting to say the least.

4 or5 Name: Elgen Fransisco Kock
Date: 10 June 2005
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Fleur Tromp
Description: witness statement


Thursday, the GPR team scanned an area in the Arikok National Park where a shallow grave and duct tape with blonde hair were found. I picked up the first dog team at the airport and took them to the hotel. A new witness came forward who said he saw a female being dumped in the Aruba landfill two days after Natalee disappeared. Kevin went to the landfill and listened to what the witness had to say. The information was credible enough for us to search the landfill tomorrow. I appeared on MSNBC's ABRAMS REPORT tonight. They asked me questions about the GPR and Natalee's search. I also explained Rachel's disappearance.

Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer
Yes, on a metal table with something white on her like a sheet.






Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:19:36 AM
I actually think I already did Always 1.

I think there was a pervert party for all ages & sexes of the pervert group, which appears to be a very large group & it was determined that when they were done with her she was to be done away with.  I don't think this was the first time this has happened nor do I think it will be the last I think this time the victim's family was/is large & have many friends who were supportive & they weren't going to believe the bunch of BS the perverts & their agent's were feeding them.

This is how the perversion came to light & that is why they hate them so much.  It put a damper on their pervert parties.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 01:19:49 AM
Gosh Destiny, you rescue puppies and kittens too, does God know youre missing from Heaven?

Always...God stuck me here to make sure I learned my lessons from last time....Yeah...Its' worth it....

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:23:42 AM
Altruist, I dont remember seeing anything you wrote about that before. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:25:34 AM
Destiny, youre the second scared monkey today that has told me they have been here before.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:30:46 AM
I have written some before, I have been here since 2005 but am not a frequent poster but I would venture to say that I have read about 80% of the information on this case.  I was naive but no longer this is very clear to me now that it wasn't only this incident they are hiding it is the island modus operandi, they are perverts, they have a large group of them feeding on tourists & immigrants where they thought they would always have a never ending supply to satisfy their filthy pervert appetites.  How else does it make sense, if it is your son that you are trying to protect you just ship him off to a safer place which is what PVDStoolscum did but grown men left their businesses, their homes, sold boat one kid sold his car that he had only bought less than 30 days before.  To me that is a big indicator, who would do that if they were innocent??????


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:33:32 AM
Altruist, I agree with you completly that that is what happpend. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 23, 2008, 01:34:53 AM
Blonde Wrote:
Thursday, the GPR team scanned an area in the Arikok National Park where a shallow grave and duct tape with blonde hair were found. I picked up the first dog team at the airport and took them to the hotel. A new witness came forward who said he saw a female being dumped in the Aruba landfill two days after Natalee disappeared. Kevin went to the landfill and listened to what the witness had to say. The information was credible enough for us to search the landfill tomorrow. I appeared on MSNBC's ABRAMS REPORT tonight. They asked me questions about the GPR and Natalee's search. I also explained Rachel's disappearance.

Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer
Yes, on a metal table with something white on her like a sheet.



If I'm not mistaken, this is the same area that the fishet/Natalee's shirt fabric, was found.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 01:35:08 AM
Got to sleep now, Destiny, I think more of you every day. Good nite.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:36:57 AM
PVDStoolscum had to stay behind with his corrupt buddies to take care of things as there were witnesses to him & his pervert offspring being seen with her, they bought off the Kalpoe pigs & here we are with no logical solutions from that hell hole nothing but a campaign to further harm Natalee's family & friends, a big charade of nothing while uttering the nonsense "we did everything we could, spent all kinds of money, blah, blah, blah. 

Bunch of crap from a bunch of perverts & their enablers.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:42:31 AM
Gee just had a thought.  What about a campaign of bumper stickers stating:  "PERVERTS TRAVEL TO ARUBA", one in English & one in Dutch.  Would that be an effective way to communicate?

The decent people of the Netherlands I don't believe knew they were SUBSIDIZING THE PERVERTS WITH THEIR TAX MONEY, but the INDECENT ones KNEW ALL ALONG.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 23, 2008, 01:45:38 AM
PVDStoolscum had to stay behind with his corrupt buddies to take care of things as there were witnesses to him & his pervert offspring being seen with her, they bought off the Kalpoe pigs & here we are with no logical solutions from that hell hole nothing but a campaign to further harm Natalee's family & friends, a big charade of nothing while uttering the nonsense "we did everything we could, spent all kinds of money, blah, blah, blah. 
Bunch of crap from a bunch of perverts & their enablers.

Boy! Did you just hit the nail on the head! Not just a murder, not just a cover-up that was a joint effort with the perpetrators and Authorities, but a well orchestrated smear campaign to tear down the victim's family in the public's eye!

But, that "vacation paradise" marketing strategy just keeps on rolling along while they scratch their azzez and wonder what happened to the tourists! DUH!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 23, 2008, 01:48:14 AM
How about a Bumper Sticker that says:

Perverts train in Aruba and graduate to Thailand?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 23, 2008, 01:50:34 AM
How about a Bumper Sticker that says:

Perverts train in Aruba and graduate to Thailand?

That's a good one too, but too many letters, want them readable from afar, LARGE LETTERS THAT CAN'T BE MISSED.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 23, 2008, 01:55:20 AM
How about a Bumper Sticker that says:

Perverts train in Aruba and graduate to Thailand?

That's a good one too, but too many letters, want them readable from afar, LARGE LETTERS THAT CAN'T BE MISSED.

Agreed, Altuist. Go with your version!  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 03:15:46 AM
PVDStoolscum had to stay behind with his corrupt buddies to take care of things as there were witnesses to him & his pervert offspring being seen with her, they bought off the Kalpoe pigs & here we are with no logical solutions from that hell hole nothing but a campaign to further harm Natalee's family & friends, a big charade of nothing while uttering the nonsense "we did everything we could, spent all kinds of money, blah, blah, blah. 
Bunch of crap from a bunch of perverts & their enablers.

Boy! Did you just hit the nail on the head! Not just a murder, not just a cover-up that was a joint effort with the perpetrators and Authorities, but a well orchestrated smear campaign to tear down the victim's family in the public's eye!

But, that "vacation paradise" marketing strategy just keeps on rolling along while they scratch their azzez and wonder what happened to the tourists! DUH!

Exactly.


...and like we needed more proof of that... but it is good to refresh the memory
anyway. You can really start to piece the global view of what was happening
looking back on everything after so much time has passed.


ALE SATISH KALPOE STATEMENTS


GIVE US A BREAK, ALE!


--------



SATISH - 6/10/2005 STATEMENT #2



I had awoken at approximately 06.30 hours on Tuesday. (May 31, 2005)

Was Deepak home at that time?

Deepak had just come home. I had asked Deepak where he had been. Deepak then told me he came from the police station. Deepak told me that he had to go to the police station because of the girl that had been with us on Sunday May 29th 2005.

What did you say to Deepak when he had informed/told you that the girl from Sunday went missing?

I had told my brother that this was impossible because we had dropped her off at the hotel.

Deepak said that he too did not know how the girl went/was missing.


---------

THE VERY NEXT DAY

---------


SATISH - 6/11/2005 STATEMENT




On Tuesday May 31st 2005 at approximately 02.45 hours I was sleeping in bed. At that moment I was awakened by my brother Deepak. Deepak had called me on my mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak said to me that the girl that had been with us on Sunday had gone missing. Deepak then told me that we should not say that we dropped Joran and the girl off near the Marriot Hotel but that we left her at the Holiday Inn Hotel. My brother had also told me that we should say that we had dropped off Joran at his place.


When Deepak called me he was together with Joran. I heard Joran instruct my brother what we had to say. My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house. Before the police could come and pick me up I was called by my brother to tell me what I had to say if the police came to my house. The police did not come to my house that night. After I had heard that message I could not sleep.


---------

2 and 1/2 Weeks Later

---------


SATISH KALPOE 06/30/2005 STATEMENT


So far I have only told the truth. I have already told to you everything.



7/4/2005

Kalpoes are free to go.



ANOTHER DAY, ANOTHER STORY. ALE knew all along.

The entire thing was one big game with Natalee Ann's life.

It was one big raping, murdering ARUBA production.



I hope they all burn in hell, and the island blows sky high, I could care less.

It could not happen fast enough for this Monkey.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 03:32:08 AM
If this lucky little girl right here...

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/11743033e78b52-1.jpg)


...did not have as strong character traits as she did, ALL OF IT

WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY SWEPT UNDER THE ARUBA RUG...


If she didn't have so many friends that loved her dearly...

If she didn't have a family that loved her to bits & would stop at nothing for answers...


We would have never heard another word about it.

ARUBA is a nightmare.




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: msmarple on July 23, 2008, 07:28:43 AM
How about a Bumper Sticker that says:

Perverts train in Aruba and graduate to Thailand?

That's a good one too, but too many letters, want them readable from afar, LARGE LETTERS THAT CAN'T BE MISSED.

ARUBA WELCOMES PERVERTS


... and time to mention this one again:

FUBARUBA!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: msmarple on July 23, 2008, 07:35:54 AM
AMIGOE NEWS:

More traffic fatalities, brawling & shootings in Aruba.



http://tinyurl.com/5srm9n



Aruba
"There is little communication between government departments'
July 21, 2008, 16:41 (GMT -04:00)


http://tinyurl.com/5tgy9e

Above article also includes this --

Quote
Also winkeliersvereniging Mambo complains about the way the Police Corps Aruba and Public Works' in silence "certain activities.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 23, 2008, 08:33:22 AM
Koen Gottenbos is up to his neck in this. If he was visiting friends in Florida that weekend there was no need for him to be questioned 3 times. JMO, but so is Jaime. Those questioned and rumored to be brought in August 30th., were there the night that Natalee disappeared.

Strange how Jaime and Koen’s statements for August show up on the Dr. Phil Log, but not our friend, Freddy, who was the one actually arrested?? Had to have something to do with the Kalpoe’s otherwise the other pimp's statements would not have shown up on the Log either???  So where are Freddy’s statements??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 08:46:28 AM
Koen Gottenbos is up to his neck in this. If he was visiting friends in Florida that weekend there was no need for him to be questioned 3 times. JMO, but so is Jaime. Those questioned and rumored to be brought in August 30th., were there the night that Natalee disappeared.

Strange how Jaime and Koen’s statements for August show up on the Dr. Phil Log, but not our friend, Freddy, who was the one actually arrested?? Had to have something to do with the Kalpoe’s otherwise the other pimp's statements would not have shown up on the Log either???  So where are Freddy’s statements??
Mum I never saw, or knew that Koen made a statement.
 I thought Daddy said no to the ALE . Can you PLEASE point me to where I can read this ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 23, 2008, 09:26:54 AM
Koen Gottenbos is up to his neck in this. If he was visiting friends in Florida that weekend there was no need for him to be questioned 3 times. JMO, but so is Jaime. Those questioned and rumored to be brought in August 30th., were there the night that Natalee disappeared.

Strange how Jaime and Koen’s statements for August show up on the Dr. Phil Log, but not our friend, Freddy, who was the one actually arrested?? Had to have something to do with the Kalpoe’s otherwise the other pimp's statements would not have shown up on the Log either???  So where are Freddy’s statements??
Mum I never saw, or knew that Koen made a statement.
 I thought Daddy said no to the ALE . Can you PLEASE point me to where I can read this ::MonkeyEek::



Blonde…Here are the pimps' statements for the dates I mentioned…Koen was there... ::MonkeyWink::

Name: Freddy Alexander Arambatzis
Date: 16 June 2005115:30
Pages: 8
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs & Marcelino Ras
Description: witness statement

Name: Sander Gottenbos
Date: 16 June 2005 / 17:10
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Shaniro Kelly & Clyde Burke
Description: witness statement (brother of Koen Gottenbos)

Name: Koen Gottenbos
Date: 16 June 2005 / 17:15
Pages: 10
Writer/Initiator: Luigi Croes & Juan Boezem
Description: witness statement of a friend of the Kalpoe's and Van der Sloot


Name: Koen Gottenbos
Date: 17 June 2005 111:15
Pages: 9
Writer/Initiator: Johny Erasmus & Juan Boezem
Description: witness statement


Name: Sander Gottenbos
Date: 16 June 2005 / 17:10
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Shaniro Kelly & Clyde Burke
Description: witness statement (brother of Koen Gottenbos)



Name: Leonardo Lopez Rivera (second statement)
Date: 29 August 2005
Pages: 3
Writer/initiator: Dennis Jacobs/ Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement

Name: Carmen Aurora Pacheco
Date: 29 August 2005
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs/ Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement

Name: Steve Croes
Date: 29 August 2005 / 9:15
Pages: 6
Writer/Initiator: A.R De Ruiter/ CJM Burgwal
Description: interrogation of a suspect

Name: Jaime Alberto Carrasquilla
Date:30 August 2005
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs/ Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement

Name: Koen Gottenbos
Date: 30 August 2005 / 18:30
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Dennis Jacobs /Eric Soemers
Description: witness statement


http://www.hollowaycase.com/archive/civil_court_docs/arubancounselfile.htm


HO HO...It's off to Cincy I go...John Mellencamp... ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on July 23, 2008, 09:30:17 AM
If this lucky little girl right here...

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/11743033e78b52-1.jpg)


...did not have as strong character traits as she did, ALL OF IT

WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY SWEPT UNDER THE ARUBA RUG...


If she didn't have so many friends that loved her dearly...

If she didn't have a family that loved her to bits & would stop at nothing for answers...


We would have never heard another word about it.

ARUBA is a nightmare.





Oh, Carpe I almost cried when I read this.  It is so true.  God bless Natalee and her family and friends.  She was a special spirit, full of life and honor.  How dare they do this to her.  Rot in hell Aruba. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 09:32:27 AM
Koen Gottenbos is up to his neck in this. If he was visiting friends in Florida that weekend there was no need for him to be questioned 3 times. JMO, but so is Jaime. Those questioned and rumored to be brought in August 30th., were there the night that Natalee disappeared.

Strange how Jaime and Koen’s statements for August show up on the Dr. Phil Log, but not our friend, Freddy, who was the one actually arrested?? Had to have something to do with the Kalpoe’s otherwise the other pimp's statements would not have shown up on the Log either???  So where are Freddy’s statements??
Mum I never saw, or knew that Koen made a statement.
 I thought Daddy said no to the ALE . Can you PLEASE point me to where I can read this ::MonkeyEek::


Blonde - I'm really not awake yet but I wanted to tell you...it's in the Dr. Phil motion to compel the number of statements Dr. Phil's people are requesting and I think there were actually 4.

 
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/KoenGStatements.jpg)

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/fun-images/nhcase-statements.xls
    


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 23, 2008, 09:39:21 AM
Maybe the Sloots were so adept at manipulating things they made ALE believe that Koen had supplied a boat for Joran's use that night.  Maybe the Gottenbos boat was used without anyone in their family knowing it by someone such as Lorenzo.  Once Joran hinted that a boat was used, maybe the logical assumption was Koen's boat, since Sander had used it the night before. I guess what I am saying is just because someone indicates it was the Gottenbos boat does not make it so.  The way they twist things in Aruba it could have been anyone's boat. Yet, they allowed it to remain the Gottenbos as a means to throw everyone off the trail.  JMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 10:20:13 AM
Klaas
Dr. Phil motion to compel the number of statements Dr. Phil's people are requesting


 OH Ok but he has not yet?
Is this what you are saying?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 10:36:54 AM
Klaas
Dr. Phil motion to compel the number of statements Dr. Phil's people are requesting


 OH Ok but he has not yet?
Is this what you are saying?


No, what I'm saying is that the Dr. Phil people have information leading them to believe that the statements were given.  I believe they were given.  I think when Dave says no statements from Koen were taken it was after Dave got the information regarding Koen's boat.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 10:38:51 AM
Thank You, got it.
We just have not seen it yet.  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 10:43:31 AM
Thank You, got it.
We just have not seen it yet.  ::MonkeyCool::


Right, there are many we haven't seen


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 11:41:31 AM
Quote from: carpe noctem


SATISH - 6/10/2005 STATEMENT #2



I had awoken at approximately 06.30 hours on Tuesday. (May 31, 2005)

Was Deepak home at that time?

Deepak had just come home. I had asked Deepak where he had been. Deepak then told me he came from the police station. Deepak told me that he had to go to the police station because of the girl that had been with us on Sunday May 29th 2005.

What did you say to Deepak when he had informed/told you that the girl from Sunday went missing?

I had told my brother that this was impossible because we had dropped her off at the hotel.

Deepak said that he too did not know how the girl went/was missing.


---------

THE VERY NEXT DAY

---------


SATISH - 6/11/2005 STATEMENT




On Tuesday May 31st 2005 at approximately 02.45  hours I was sleeping in bed. At that moment I was awakened by my brother Deepak. Deepak had called me on my mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak said to me that the girl that had been with us on Sunday had gone missing. Deepak then told me that we should not say that we dropped Joran and the girl off near the Marriot Hotel but that we left her at the Holiday Inn Hotel. My brother had also told me that we should say that we had dropped off Joran at his place.


When Deepak called me he was together with Joran. I heard Joran instruct my brother what we had to say. My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house. Before the police could come and pick me up I was called by my brother to tell me what I had to say if the police came to my house. The police did not come to my house that night. After I had heard that message I could not sleep.


---------

2 and 1/2 Weeks Later

---------


SATISH KALPOE 06/30/2005 STATEMENT


So far I have only told the truth. I have already told to you everything.



7/4/2005

Kalpoes are free to go.



ANOTHER DAY, ANOTHER STORY. ALE knew all along.

The entire thing was one big game with Natalee Ann's life.

It was one big raping, murdering ARUBA production.



I hope they all burn in hell, and the island blows sky high, I could care less.

It could not happen fast enough for this Monkey.



The words in red caused me to jump down from the guest balcony once again:

On Tuesday May 31st 2005 at approximately 02.45

My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house.

Proof of conspiracy, and early stages of coverup--

Beth's group did not arrive at the VDS compound until close to 3 am, the early morning hours of May 31, 2005.  By 2:45 am, PvdS had notified JvdS about the arrival of the police; JvdS told Deepak; Deepak called Satish.  I do not believe PvdS is clairvoyant.

ETA of Family group arrival at police parking lot (where there was an approx. 15 min. delay) . . . 2:40 am.

ALE knew; the Prosecutor knew; Everybody knew!



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: marebear on July 23, 2008, 12:04:51 PM
Agree Slogger... I had noted that early on also.  An obvious mistake on their part to allow that to get through. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 12:14:05 PM
Yes Mare, agreed.  It had been noted.

The Theory is:  Shortly after the Family Group arrived in the parking lot, vdS' were notified.  MO, the "Meeting" broke up.  There was no need to tell JvdS and DK . . . they were on the spot; the participants of the "Meeting" scattered.  SK was not at the "Meeting;" therefore, he had to be contacted and told what to say.

MO:  It's more confirmation that a meeting took place, that what to say was discussed, because approximately 5 minutes they scattered, called SK and told him what to say.  The story had been concocted before they scattered.

Time is everything.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 23, 2008, 12:34:44 PM
Yes Mare, agreed.  It had been noted.

The Theory is:  Shortly after the Family Group arrived in the parking lot, vdS' were notified.  MO, the "Meeting" broke up.  There was no need to tell JvdS and DK . . . they were on the spot; the participants of the "Meeting" scattered.  SK was not at the "Meeting;" therefore, he had to be contacted and told what to say.

MO:  It's more confirmation that a meeting took place, that what to say was discussed, because approximately 5 minutes they scattered, called SK and told him what to say.  The story had been concocted before they scattered.

Time is everything.


Slogger...how right you are!

They are such sorry excuses for human beings.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 12:43:10 PM
Additional proof could be the desperate attempt to change time, to push back the arrival of the Family Group to an earlier time.  It would be necessary to do this if there were proof of the 2:45 am call to SK.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: marebear on July 23, 2008, 12:54:58 PM
Additional proof could be the desperate attempt to change time, to push back the arrival of the Family Group to an earlier time.  It would be necessary to do this if there were proof of the 2:45 am call to SK.



I can understand doing this when you are crunched for time and in a "panic" but they must have seen how foolish it was later... but that's what lies do to you, they create a need for more and more until one is buried in them. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 01:06:27 PM
Yes, I think they did panic; but, were able to cover up, later.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 01:27:31 PM
"My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house. " (SK)


The father had told Joran.  He must have been talking in his sleep.  When PvdS came into view, it's reported that he had a phone with him. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 01:34:32 PM
"The officers sount their horns and sirens for about five minutes before a man answers the door.  He is Joran's father, Paulus van der Sloot.  He has his cell phone in his hand."

[LOVING NATALEE, page 45]


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on July 23, 2008, 01:57:35 PM
I have a question and I don't even know if anyone would know the answer.  Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer and they obvioulsy didn't return her to Beth and Dave.  Is there a pauper's cemetery or a Potter's Field in Aruba where ALE could bury someone and it wouldn't be noticed?  I have to think that ALE would be involving a minimal number of people in this coverup because they wouldn't want anyone to talk.  If it wasn't a Potter's Field, it would have to be in someone else's plot or a cremation.  Just a few more thoughts.
1.  J: Yes, that’s what I mean. So yeah, I got her and put her a bit near those mangroves. 11And I told him: ‘I’m sitting here. You have to come over here.’ And he lives alone, he! He does not like that shit. Sometimes he has a bitch. He fucks them, but he lives alone.near those

2. MARRIOTT BASIN tHE BODY IN THE BAG FRESH DEAD GIRL SECOND MOVE  EARLY HOURS they were being followed by camera man JMO Aruba Bay Video 24

3.Tim Miller
RED - SCARED MONKEYS
July 24, 2005

RED: There have been reports that a shallow grave was discovered in the area of Boca Tortuga, on the eastern part of the island. There are also reports that cell-phone calls made by Joran early in the morning came from a location on the eastern side of the island. It seems plausible that thisarea could yield more clues

TIM MILLER: We found a site that we feel as though was a possible gravesite. Our thoughts are that Natalee may have been buried in that hole for 1 or 2 days then moved. We have information that the cell phones were possibly being used in that area
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2005/07/24/interview-transcript-with-tim-miller-july-24th-2005/

4.or5 Art Wood interviewed a "Fransisco" twice as he was adamant that he helped bury Natalee with two others using a white PU. One of his friends worked at the Marriott and as you know there are other witnesses who say they saw Natalee placed in a tarp in a white pu at the Marriott. There is also that Fisherman that tells a very similar story and the details match up with Junior and what he saw a day later at the dump. The Fisherman mentioned something about only getting to that location in a ATV.

As you know this Fransisco was locked up almost immediately in a mental hospital after telling the ALE what he did,when Art Interviewed this man his friends said he was not crazy. Looking at all the witnesses this is the only Fransisco I see and a June 10th interview is interesting to say the least.

4 or5 Name: Elgen Fransisco Kock
Date: 10 June 2005
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Fleur Tromp
Description: witness statement


Thursday, the GPR team scanned an area in the Arikok National Park where a shallow grave and duct tape with blonde hair were found. I picked up the first dog team at the airport and took them to the hotel. A new witness came forward who said he saw a female being dumped in the Aruba landfill two days after Natalee disappeared. Kevin went to the landfill and listened to what the witness had to say. The information was credible enough for us to search the landfill tomorrow. I appeared on MSNBC's ABRAMS REPORT tonight. They asked me questions about the GPR and Natalee's search. I also explained Rachel's disappearance.

Suppose that ALE did recover Natalee's body that day at the rocks.  Where is it?  They couldn't keep her all of this time in a coroner's drawer
Yes, on a metal table with something white on her like a sheet.





Who's Rachel?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: mrskub on July 23, 2008, 02:06:51 PM
Rachel Cooke maybe?

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/11/10/michael-keith-moore-has-been-charged-with-the-murder-of-raclel-cooke/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on July 23, 2008, 02:11:48 PM

4.or5 Art Wood interviewed a "Fransisco" twice as he was adamant that he helped bury Natalee with two others using a white PU. One of his friends worked at the Marriott and as you know there are other witnesses who say they saw Natalee placed in a tarp in a white pu at the Marriott. There is also that Fisherman that tells a very similar story and the details match up with Junior and what he saw a day later at the dump. The Fisherman mentioned something about only getting to that location in a ATV.

As you know this Fransisco was locked up almost immediately in a mental hospital after telling the ALE what he did,when Art Interviewed this man his friends said he was not crazy. Looking at all the witnesses this is the only Fransisco I see and a June 10th interview is interesting to say the least.

4 or5 Name: Elgen Fransisco Kock
Date: 10 June 2005
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Fleur Tromp
Description: witness statement







Hello Blonde,

I don't mean to be argumentative, but I believe you may have the wrong "Fransisco" listed here.  The one you have listed was associated with VCS Carribean N.V. which is a security company.

The one I think you are referring to is Francisco Remigio Thiel who is listed as a fisherman and shows up on Grande's spreadsheet twice.  Once on June 5th, 2005 where he was interviewed on the same day as the two security guards.  As a matter of fact, he was interviewed in between the times the two SG's were interviewed. 

Mickey John at 10:30 interviewed by Clyde Burke
Abraham Jones at 10:55 interviewed by Clyde Burke
Francisco Remigio Thiel at 13:55 interviewed by Clyde Burke / Johny Erasmus
Abraham Jones again at 15:45 interviewed by Clyde Burke

I find that a little odd, but... 

He shows up on the spreadsheet a second time on June 8th and was interviewed by Dennis Jacobs and Juan Enrique Boezem.  I do not see a specific time for this interview.  The spreadsheet shows "indication of an area" as the association of this interview.

I think the "fisherman" and Francisco Remigio Thiel are one and the same.  I don't think there were two different people making that claim.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 02:19:43 PM
YES www.rachelcookesearch.org/arubasearch.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 23, 2008, 02:30:42 PM

4.or5 Art Wood interviewed a "Fransisco" twice as he was adamant that he helped bury Natalee with two others using a white PU. One of his friends worked at the Marriott and as you know there are other witnesses who say they saw Natalee placed in a tarp in a white pu at the Marriott. There is also that Fisherman that tells a very similar story and the details match up with Junior and what he saw a day later at the dump. The Fisherman mentioned something about only getting to that location in a ATV.

As you know this Fransisco was locked up almost immediately in a mental hospital after telling the ALE what he did,when Art Interviewed this man his friends said he was not crazy. Looking at all the witnesses this is the only Fransisco I see and a June 10th interview is interesting to say the least.

4 or5 Name: Elgen Fransisco Kock
Date: 10 June 2005
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Fleur Tromp
Description: witness statement







Hello Blonde,

I don't mean to be argumentative, but I believe you may have the wrong "Fransisco" listed here.  The one you have listed was associated with VCS Carribean N.V. which is a security company.

The one I think you are referring to is Francisco Remigio Thiel who is listed as a fisherman and shows up on Grande's spreadsheet twice.  Once on June 5th, 2005 where he was interviewed on the same day as the two security guards.  As a matter of fact, he was interviewed in between the times the two SG's were interviewed. 

Mickey John at 10:30 interviewed by Clyde Burke
Abraham Jones at 10:55 interviewed by Clyde Burke
Francisco Remigio Thiel at 13:55 interviewed by Clyde Burke / Johny Erasmus
Abraham Jones again at 15:45 interviewed by Clyde Burke

I find that a little odd, but... 

He shows up on the spreadsheet a second time on June 8th and was interviewed by Dennis Jacobs and Juan Enrique Boezem.  I do not see a specific time for this interview.  The spreadsheet shows "indication of an area" as the association of this interview.

I think the "fisherman" and Francisco Remigio Thiel are one and the same.  I don't think there were two different people making that claim.


Sorry I may ,I'm looking in my notes now 

I have it saved in my notes just like that with no link ::MonkeyConfused::
Name: Francisco Remigio Thiel
Date: 05 June 2005 / 13:55
Pages: 5
Writer/Initiator: Clyde Burke & Johny Erasmus
Description: witness statement by a fisherman

Name: Elgen Fransisco Kock
Date: 10 June 2005
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Fleur Tromp
Description: witness statement




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 23, 2008, 02:58:20 PM
If this lucky little girl right here...

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/11743033e78b52-1.jpg)


...did not have as strong character traits as she did, ALL OF IT

WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY SWEPT UNDER THE ARUBA RUG...


If she didn't have so many friends that loved her dearly...

If she didn't have a family that loved her to bits & would stop at nothing for answers...


We would have never heard another word about it.

ARUBA is a nightmare.




you are exactly right, sir.  that's why aruba supporters are working so hard to stain natalee and her family's name.  it's an exercise in futility, but their "blame the victim" strategy is the only thing they have.  eventually the truth will win.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 23, 2008, 03:07:35 PM
OT just one more example that illustrates many in Aruba don't know right from wrong. Is this so cool you want to put it on youtube for all the world to see the  cruel and seedy side? Next we will see the brothels on you tube...... ::MonkeyNoNo::

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TFYGF-vNIQ


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 23, 2008, 03:09:30 PM
OT just one more example that illustrates many in Aruba don't know right from wrong. Is this so cool you want to put it on youtube for all the world to see the  cruel and seedy side? Next we will see the brothels on you tube...... ::MonkeyNoNo::

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TFYGF-vNIQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaHLYM4HLdE ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on July 23, 2008, 03:18:05 PM
OT just one more example that illustrates many in Aruba don't know right from wrong. Is this so cool you want to put it on youtube for all the world to see the  cruel and seedy side? Next we will see the brothels on you tube...... ::MonkeyNoNo::

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TFYGF-vNIQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaHLYM4HLdE ::MonkeyNoNo::

Disgusting place.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 23, 2008, 03:36:45 PM
More that you won't see in the AHATA videos from Aruba:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9vFggJU3kE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-KGW3UUE6E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGG4Lv_eG7w


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 23, 2008, 03:44:26 PM
The 10th, is that when they found her in the rocks?
I believe so. It was when they announced to the world that one of the boys confessed and was leading them to the body.

That's also when Beth said she "buried Natalee in her heart".... :(


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 04:11:00 PM
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


AMIGOE NEWS:

ARUBA



Nelson Oduber of Aruba says EVERYTHING IS

JUST GOING FINE IN ARUBA. Other people say cover-up?

http://tinyurl.com/5srm9n


Are you insured in Aruba?

http://tinyurl.com/5a35yz


OM of Aruba jails people for not paying fines.

Rape and murder is still okay, though.

http://tinyurl.com/64tej2


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 04:38:43 PM
DANA PRETZER TONIGHT

www.scaredmonkeysradio.com


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/Pretzer072308.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 23, 2008, 04:44:11 PM
Mother Joran: Our live goes on

ORANJESTAD - The parents of Joran van der Sloot want to pick up the thread again. It says the mother, Anita van der Sloot,  We try life as good and as evil as it comes just as possible to tackle. We have more children, you know''
(http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00142/bibu04_1102JoranOud_142074h.jpg)

Anita van der Sloot looks excited. When pruning in the garden to retrieve them from the media that last week ample attention to the broadcast of Peter R. de Vries.

They told their son under the eye of hidden cameras in almost three years ago with the missing American girl Natalee Holloway on the beach in Aruba would have happened.


,, The media distort the facts and only one side of the story ever told. It is better not too much to say. Everything is still against our intentions explained,''says the mother of Joran.

Anita van der Sloot described the broadcast of De Vries in which her son told his father that an illegal mobile phone smuggled into the cell had, as "terrible." She regrets that she, her husband and Joran in the talk of Pauw and Witteman had taken their seats. ,, That was very stupid. That we should not do.''

After the broadcast Joran threw a glass of red wine in the face of Peter R. de Vries. Images of this came soon outwards.


'Bon gang'

It is a house that anyone on the Aruban island is content to have. The cheerful yellow-blue-red of the walls of Montanja 19 is under the burning hot tropical Sunday no sorrow, as it seems.

In the cosy quarter-messy lives Van der Sloot's family for almost 20 years. Among locals, other Dutch and Americans. None patserige enclave full of expats. No, the family is properly known as socially involved. They learned the native language: Papiamento, participates in everything. Joran brother was even be admired by an exuberant carnival. ,, Life goes on.''

The 'confession' of Joran van der Sloot in crime reporter Peter R. de Vries about the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and the subsequent questioning by police last Friday appears to have had little effect on the reputation of the family.

The parents of Joran his' gang bon "(good people) says L. da Silva for a Chinese-run supermarket. The men around him lurks in the local 'Balashi' and nodding assent.


,, Here in Aruba the people know the story of course, already much longer and better than in the Netherlands.''Friendly Anita van der Sloot is still on this Sunday afternoon convinced them that the people in any case nothing bad.

,, In the Netherlands, the story only much later a real role to play and that gives a distorted picture.''Perhaps they would still turn out to explain it all. ,, But so far we even say nothing because everything unilaterally by the media is told.''


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 04:52:30 PM
Johan - have you taken any recent trips to Den Doulder?   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 23, 2008, 05:06:45 PM
Johan - have you taken any recent trips to Den Doulder?   ::MonkeyHaHa::

SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSStttttttttttttt ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 05:21:21 PM
Posted at RU:

Black-Tulip wrote:
UPDATE

Patrick's book Overboord

week 1 - #25
week 2 - #25
week 3 - #51
week 4 - dropped off the top60 list


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 05:30:45 PM
FU ANITA VAN DER SLOOT OF ARUBA,

YOU LYING BAG. GO MULCH

YOUR GARDEN OF DEATH!


Hey,

Did you turn your serial lying, psychotic, gang-raping, murdering son's

room into the sewing room while he is away at BFU in Thailand????


Inquiring minds WANNA KNOWWWW, HO!!!!!

 ::MonkeyCool::



(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/DSFDFS.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 05:43:19 PM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/jkjjkjkkBBVVB.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 05:45:51 PM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/uhuuhhhhhuhuh.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 05:46:45 PM
 ::MonkeyWink::

(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/erereeresss.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 23, 2008, 05:51:27 PM
Posted at RU:

Black-Tulip wrote:
UPDATE

Patrick's book Overboord

week 1 - #25
week 2 - #25
week 3 - #51
week 4 - dropped off the top60 list


Oh that book  ::MonkeyConfused::

Joran was in Arnhem in the the Netherlands
How was his contact with his parents?
He must have told them that he has a "new" friend there, named Patrick v Eem
I think that it is easy for Paul vd Sloot to find out who this Patric is
His past etc .And maybe he knows that Patrick had contacted the police here in the Netherlands  to work for them as a infiltrator !Maybe is the police here so corrupt that they told PvdS about Patrick's plans
Paul vd Sloot has contact with several Judges (Bob Wit) Karin Janssen and  corrupt policemen .
And why was Joran for a short time in Aruba  during that infiltration ?


 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 06:13:37 PM
GOOGLE TRANSLATOR


ANITA VAN DER SLOOT  TO ENGLISH




Anita van der Sloot looks excited. When pruning in the garden


she needs to prune that nasty growth she has coming out of her neck!


The media distort the facts and only one side of the story ever told. It is better not too much to say. Everything is still against our intentions explained,''says the mother of Joran.


joran pretty much said he did everything but kill the b**** on tape.


Anita van der Sloot described the broadcast of De Vries in which her son told his father that an illegal mobile phone smuggled into the cell had, as "terrible." She regrets that she, her husband and Joran in the talk of Pauw and Witteman had taken their seats


rather than hear about what my psychotic husband did, i wish i hadn't gone on the tv show altogether and planted by big fat bohunkus in a chair. it gave me a
wedgie.


After the broadcast Joran threw a glass of red wine in the face of Peter R. de Vries.


what wine? i didn't see any wine!!!!



Joran brother was even be admired by an exuberant carnival. ,, Life goes on


but Natalee's doesn't because my son and husband killed her and got rid of her.


The 'confession' of Joran van der Sloot in crime reporter Peter R. de Vries about the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and the subsequent questioning by police last Friday appears to have had little effect on the reputation of the family.


Arubans don't care about gang-rapists and murderers. what is a reputation?


Here in Aruba the people know the story of course, already much longer and better than in the Netherlands


here in Aruba we continue to lie about the Holloway case.



In the Netherlands, the story only much later a real role to play and that gives a distorted picture.


in the Netherlands, Peter De Vries continues to broadcast the truth about what happened, that my son & my husband are brutal, soul-less killers. hey, anybody up for a trip to the supermarket???


 ::MonkeyRoll::





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 23, 2008, 06:21:26 PM
Maybe the Sloots were so adept at manipulating things they made ALE believe that Koen had supplied a boat for Joran's use that night.  Maybe the Gottenbos boat was used without anyone in their family knowing it by someone such as Lorenzo.  Once Joran hinted that a boat was used, maybe the logical assumption was Koen's boat, since Sander had used it the night before. I guess what I am saying is just because someone indicates it was the Gottenbos boat does not make it so.  The way they twist things in Aruba it could have been anyone's boat. Yet, they allowed it to remain the Gottenbos as a means to throw everyone off the trail.   JMO

Exactly.

And just because they said boat doesn't mean it was so.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 23, 2008, 06:30:45 PM
Yes Mare, agreed.  It had been noted.

The Theory is:  Shortly after the Family Group arrived in the parking lot, vdS' were notified.  MO, the "Meeting" broke up.  There was no need to tell JvdS and DK . . . they were on the spot; the participants of the "Meeting" scattered.  SK was not at the "Meeting;" therefore, he had to be contacted and told what to say.

MO:  It's more confirmation that a meeting took place, that what to say was discussed, because approximately 5 minutes they scattered, called SK and told him what to say.  The story had been concocted before they scattered.

Time is everything.


I agree.  I always said there was a meeting at the Sloot dump.  Paulus' own words were I believe how did you get here so fast when Beth arrived.  Joran was hiding in the house with Deepak.  Freddy ran home to his house with Jaime.  Van der Straaten was there too but he took off once they got the call.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 06:36:59 PM
Maybe the Sloots were so adept at manipulating things they made ALE believe that Koen had supplied a boat for Joran's use that night.  Maybe the Gottenbos boat was used without anyone in their family knowing it by someone such as Lorenzo.  Once Joran hinted that a boat was used, maybe the logical assumption was Koen's boat, since Sander had used it the night before. I guess what I am saying is just because someone indicates it was the Gottenbos boat does not make it so.  The way they twist things in Aruba it could have been anyone's boat. Yet, they allowed it to remain the Gottenbos as a means to throw everyone off the trail.   JMO

Exactly.

And just because they said boat doesn't mean it was so.

PATRICK VAN DER EEM'S - OVERBOARD

Page 274 - 280

Joran:


J: Yeah, ok, but the most important thing for us is that….the most important thing is just the misinformation,  you know?




Yes, he is REALLLLLLY innocent, Anita.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 23, 2008, 08:17:36 PM
Yes Mare, agreed.  It had been noted.

The Theory is:  Shortly after the Family Group arrived in the parking lot, vdS' were notified.  MO, the "Meeting" broke up.  There was no need to tell JvdS and DK . . . they were on the spot; the participants of the "Meeting" scattered.  SK was not at the "Meeting;" therefore, he had to be contacted and told what to say.

MO:  It's more confirmation that a meeting took place, that what to say was discussed, because approximately 5 minutes they scattered, called SK and told him what to say.  The story had been concocted before they scattered.

Time is everything.


I agree.  I always said there was a meeting at the Sloot dump.  Paulus' own words were I believe how did you get here so fast when Beth arrived.  Joran was hiding in the house with Deepak.  Freddy ran home to his house with Jaime.  Van der Straaten was there too but he took off once they got the call.

John and Jones gave us the "pool meeting."  Deepak's license plate # says that he was there.  The 2:45 phonecall to Satish confirms that Paulus was up and alert before the Family Group got to the house.

Freddy knew on Monday--which means he probably was there.

At the moment, I don't think Jaime was there.  Jaime is the one who announced that Joran had called him to go to CnC's to meet the American girls before Joran claims he decided to go there.  It was a statement against Joran's interest.  Jaime did attend one of the "meetings"--he says on Friday or Saturday with Koen and Sander.

I don't think Jaime received the "full memo." 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on July 23, 2008, 08:46:17 PM
So I saw a thread Titled"questions for Art"and saw it had a new post on it.I don't remember seeing this thread before so I started on page one(there are only 2 pages total)and found questions to Art that Monkeys had posted back in the summer of 2006.Then I ran into Blondes post(posted today)and just want to say thank you Blonde for bringing that over!
VERY interesting reading,Blonde has posted all the answers from the questions asked of Art back in 2006.I'm only half way thru reading your post Blonde....will finish it tomorrow.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on July 23, 2008, 08:53:18 PM
Rachel Cooke maybe?

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/11/10/michael-keith-moore-has-been-charged-with-the-murder-of-raclel-cooke/
Aahh,thank you MrsKub,I think so.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 23, 2008, 08:58:00 PM
PVDStoolscum had to stay behind with his corrupt buddies to take care of things as there were witnesses to him & his pervert offspring being seen with her, they bought off the Kalpoe pigs & here we are with no logical solutions from that hell hole nothing but a campaign to further harm Natalee's family & friends, a big charade of nothing while uttering the nonsense "we did everything we could, spent all kinds of money, blah, blah, blah. 
Bunch of crap from a bunch of perverts & their enablers.

Boy! Did you just hit the nail on the head! Not just a murder, not just a cover-up that was a joint effort with the perpetrators and Authorities, but a well orchestrated smear campaign to tear down the victim's family in the public's eye!

But, that "vacation paradise" marketing strategy just keeps on rolling along while they scratch their azzez and wonder what happened to the tourists! DUH!

 And I will never, ever forgive them or forget them for that smear. As for the Aruban people, I am not angry at them as a group, but I am angry to those who sat back and did nothing, those who intentially misinformed, those who did not have the strength of character or backbone to speak up.
Rant over, I feel somewhat better now.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:02:49 PM
Where is everyone?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:06:25 PM
Was GVC's uniform the black one?  If he were to come out of the dark, would Joran be afraid enough to hand Natalee over to him?  Is his father important enough for the isalnd elite to sacrifice the welfare of the entire people for three years or longer???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:08:55 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 10:24:04 PM
Klaas,

"Current government begrotingsgat digs for the next '
July 22, 2008, 18:52 (GMT -04:00)

Didja catch this one from Amigoe yet???


http://tinyurl.com/6zob87


It may be good enough for an FP post?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:24:30 PM
Ok, Im just talking to myself.  But this has really been bugging me.  I thought if the 3 boys didnt rape, kill Natalee alone, if some of the elders were involved, then why, when they were all alone, didnt they discuss it.  I kept asking an older monkey this and he said he felt their talk was scripted.  I never thought of that.  That would mean the elders told them what to say when they were being taped at the very beginning.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 10:26:30 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 10:28:02 PM
Klaas,

"Current government begrotingsgat digs for the next '
July 22, 2008, 18:52 (GMT -04:00)

Didja catch this one from Amigoe yet???


http://tinyurl.com/6zob87


It may be good enough for an FP post?

Maybe we can get a better translation from Jossy or one of the Dutch posters on this.  I agree, would make a good front page but we need to clean up the translation.  I can clean it up some.

Thanks!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:31:27 PM
No Wreck, if they left her there alive and someone else got her, they would make sense.  Then Joran would have made up his Joran to Patrick for drugs.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 10:34:51 PM
No Wreck, if they left her there alive and someone else got her, they would make sense.  Then Joran would have made up his Joran to Patrick for drugs.
I guess I'm not following you.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 10:36:37 PM
Ok, Im just talking to myself.  But this has really been bugging me.  I thought if the 3 boys didnt rape, kill Natalee alone, if some of the elders were involved, then why, when they were all alone, didnt they discuss it.  I kept asking an older monkey this and he said he felt their talk was scripted.  I never thought of that.  That would mean the elders told them what to say when they were being taped at the very beginning.


I think it is a stretch imo to think that these losers could memorize entire scripts

of what to say. Especially when you consider, a large part of why the case

has been able to be picked apart so well... is because of their hasty mistakes,

and Joran's big fat lying mouth. A lot of it is Bs... because as you read Joran

tell Patrick, the most important thing is the MISINFORMATION. Mixed in what that disinfo,

are nuggets of truth, where their brains have betrayed them. That's my take on it,

anyway.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 10:43:09 PM
No Wreck, if they left her there alive and someone else got her, they would make sense.  Then Joran would have made up his Joran to Patrick for drugs.

That is exactly what many in Aruba would like us to think but this is BS. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:43:18 PM
Then Carpe, if it was just the 3 boys involved, why would the elders let everyone else suffer???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 10:43:49 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


After seeing how many times the boys have backtracked and lied

about what happened to Natalee... as many times as they have been

caught each and everytime in those lies.


That is getting into MAYBE MY DOG DID IT territory, for me.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 10:45:18 PM
Then Carpe, if it was just the 3 boys involved, why would the elders let everyone else suffer???


I do not do the ELDERS bit.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:51:14 PM
But Carpe and Wreck, if they did it alone, and Im sure not saying they didnt, why are they so darn important?  And important is not the word Im looking for.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 10:55:45 PM
Did they go to a Rave first, or just take Natalee to the beach or to Jorans house?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 10:56:13 PM
They did it, Paulus and his very tight circle of Dutch friends

with the power to help him destroy & sabotage anything that

could resemble evidence, helped him cover it up.

Once that harm to a case has been done, it has been done.

If anyone knows that, it is Paulus.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 11:03:35 PM
Ill go back and read their conversation again, from your point of view.  Nite Carpe.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Magnolia on July 23, 2008, 11:04:52 PM
Before his "I wanna be a judge training" Paulus was in charge of
government contracts.  He knew where all of the bodies were
buries so to speak.  We are not sure that he had mafia contacts
but assume that he helped with the contract for the mafia owned
casinos.  He called in his favors in a blackmail fashion.
Once the coverup started, it snowballed and there was no turning
back.....all to cover for his wothless son.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 11:09:34 PM
Always 1 - here's what I think.  Joran and his friends, "the pimps", play a game of picking up tourist girls and having their way with them.  They most likely slip a drug in their drink but in their minds it's OK because they all are asking for it anyway.  This is the mindset of the Aruban male.  So Joran and whatever friends he's with end up with Natalee this time.  They do what they always do but this time either Natalee says NO and they get rough, or Natalee OD's because of the drugs they have given her.  Normally, they would just leave her on the beach but Natalee's family (Beth and Jug) showed up too quick so they lied.  When they were caught in their lies they lied again. 

I believe they couldn't let Natalee's body be found because it would show evidence of being drugged and raped.  They made the decision early on to cover it up to protect the tourist industry.  Once they decided they had to stick with it at all costs.  Paul van der Sloot may not be the richest person in Aruba but he has info on people and leverage with ALE/Judiciary and Government.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 11:11:29 PM
Before his "I wanna be a judge training" Paulus was in charge of
government contracts.  He knew where all of the bodies were
buries so to speak.  We are not sure that he had mafia contacts
but assume that he helped with the contract for the mafia owned
casinos.  He called in his favors in a blackmail fashion.
Once the coverup started, it snowballed and there was no turning
back.....all to cover for his wothless son
.


Yep


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 11:15:51 PM
Wreck, Carpe and Klaasend.  I am just thinking out loud.  You all know the case far better than I do and I respect and admire all of you.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 11:16:19 PM
Joran even is so bold as to give us insight as to

the formula of how it goes down.

Satish tells you in statements, they are doing this every weekend.


......



PATRICK VAN DER EEM'S - OVERBOARD


Pages 240 - 251 from 16-01……..
 
P: Tell me exactly, ok. Carlos ‘n Charlies. You left there with her with those two or..?

J: I went there…ok, this is how it happened. I was at the casino, ok? I went and sat at the blackjacktable. Bit of blackjack, a little big money. There are a lot of girls at that table. I’m flirting with them, talk a bit with them, smooth. Then they tell me... We perfectioned this, Patrick. We made up a whole story of ‘we come from the Netherlands, also on holiday here’. We had perfectioned that playershit for those girls, you know? Because when you say: ‘I’m not a local’ then they immediately only want to f***, you know? They know, that’s how they play it: go high-roller a bit. Those bitches are going crazy there, Patrick, you know this. The will, they can’t do anything. So yeah those bitches just ask me: ‘will you go out with us tonight? Will you go to Carlos 'n Charlie's, that bar, tonight?’ And I said, ‘Yeah, that's fine’. They'd already been drinking the entire time, he?



Joran's Book



P 46

My friends and I lied many times that we were on holidays ourselves as well. Girls are a little suspicious about the local boys, the so-called ‘beach bums’. They believe that these boys only try to get them into bed, but if you say you’re on holiday as well, you’ve already taken that hurdle. The more often you do it, the better you know what exactly the best manner is to do it. Most of the time I did say that I had lived on Aruba when I was young and that we still had a house on the island. This immediately explained why we were so familiar with the best clubs and bars.



 
P 49

We occasionally rented a hotel room. Once, three of us guys all had sex with girls at the same time. An American girl gave me a blowjob on the balcony, Deepak was in the bathroom together with a girl, and Freddy with an American girl in the room itself. We’ve never shared a girl with all of us and never did threesomes. That’s just a step too far for me. We did once make topless photos of a girl at our hotel room.



....


I am King of the Ocean, except when I am seasick because I don't like boats much.

 -Joran Van der sloot





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 11:16:59 PM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 11:17:43 PM
Wreck, Carpe and Klaasend.  I am just thinking out loud.  You all know the case far better than I do and I respect and admire all of you.

None of us know with certainty, we can only give you our opinion on the subject.   ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Magnolia on July 23, 2008, 11:18:22 PM
Always 1 - here's what I think.  Joran and his friends, "the pimps", play a game of picking up tourist girls and having their way with them.  They most likely slip a drug in their drink but in their minds it's OK because they all are asking for it anyway.  This is the mindset of the Aruban male.  So Joran and whatever friends he's with end up with Natalee this time.  They do what they always do but this time either Natalee says NO and they get rough, or Natalee OD's because of the drugs they have given her.  Normally, they would just leave her on the beach but Natalee's family (Beth and Jug) showed up too quick so they lied.  When they were caught in their lies they lied again. 

I believe they couldn't let Natalee's body be found because it would show evidence of being drugged and raped.  They made the decision early on to cover it up to protect the tourist industry.  Once they decided they had to stick with it at all costs.  Paul van der Sloot may not be the richest person in Aruba but he has info on people and leverage with ALE/Judiciary and Government.

Yep  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 11:18:36 PM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!

Exactly!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 23, 2008, 11:19:40 PM
Posted at RU:

Black-Tulip wrote:
UPDATE

Patrick's book Overboord

week 1 - #25
week 2 - #25
week 3 - #51
week 4 - dropped off the top60 list


Oh that book  ::MonkeyConfused::

Joran was in Arnhem in the the Netherlands
How was his contact with his parents?
He must have told them that he has a "new" friend there, named Patrick v Eem
I think that it is easy for Paul vd Sloot to find out who this Patric is
His past etc .And maybe he knows that Patrick had contacted the police here in the Netherlands  to work for them as a infiltrator !Maybe is the police here so corrupt that they told PvdS about Patrick's plans
Paul vd Sloot has contact with several Judges (Bob Wit) Karin Janssen and  corrupt policemen .
And why was Joran for a short time in Aruba  during that infiltration ?


 


I do not know the timeframe of Patrick's infiltration....what was it?

I've caught up reading but came back to this because it stood out for me, personally.  Having a lot of stormy weather here in the northeast.





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 23, 2008, 11:25:00 PM
2NJ - I don't know off the top of my head either.  I want to say that he befriended Joran for months from the middle of 2007 to early 2008.  I don't have exact dates handy though.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 11:25:33 PM
Wreck, Carpe and Klaasend.  I am just thinking out loud.  You all know the case far better than I do and I respect and admire all of you.


That's cool, and I didn't mean to be brusk. I hope you did not take it that way. ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 11:26:40 PM
Wreck, Carpe and Klaasend.  I am just thinking out loud.  You all know the case far better than I do and I respect and admire all of you.


That's cool, and I didn't mean to be brusk. I hope you did not take it that way. ::MonkeyWink::
me either! ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 23, 2008, 11:29:15 PM
Nope, love you both, nite nite.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 23, 2008, 11:30:45 PM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!


That is it in a nutshell, Wreck. That is also why I think people are still so furious

about it. It is just so completely and utterly senseless to do to a human life.

Especially, someone as decent as Natalee. She was a sweetheart, she wouldn't

have hurt anybody!!!! Not a soul.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 23, 2008, 11:44:44 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


After seeing how many times the boys have backtracked and lied

about what happened to Natalee... as many times as they have been

caught each and everytime in those lies.


That is getting into MAYBE MY DOG DID IT territory, for me.

The backtracking and lies are what keep me scratching my head. That very thing is what busts many criminals in this country. The fact they got away with it is what I can't understand. It's as if, they could have a video of the crime, and still not prosecute. JMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 23, 2008, 11:49:47 PM
Always 1 - here's what I think.  Joran and his friends, "the pimps", play a game of picking up tourist girls and having their way with them.  They most likely slip a drug in their drink but in their minds it's OK because they all are asking for it anyway.  This is the mindset of the Aruban male.  So Joran and whatever friends he's with end up with Natalee this time.  They do what they always do but this time either Natalee says NO and they get rough, or Natalee OD's because of the drugs they have given her.  Normally, they would just leave her on the beach but Natalee's family (Beth and Jug) showed up too quick so they lied.  When they were caught in their lies they lied again. 

I believe they couldn't let Natalee's body be found because it would show evidence of being drugged and raped.  They made the decision early on to cover it up to protect the tourist industry.  Once they decided they had to stick with it at all costs.  Paul van der Sloot may not be the richest person in Aruba but he has info on people and leverage with ALE/Judiciary and Government.

Yep  ::MonkeyCool::

Do you mean that "leverage" that Arubagirl denied? I say this with a dose of sarcasm.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 23, 2008, 11:51:48 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


After seeing how many times the boys have backtracked and lied

about what happened to Natalee... as many times as they have been

caught each and everytime in those lies.


That is getting into MAYBE MY DOG DID IT territory, for me.

The backtracking and lies are what keep me scratching my head. That very thing is what busts many criminals in this country. The fact they got away with it is what I can't understand. It's as if, they could have a video of the crime, and still not prosecute. JMO
That is why Joran is so emboldened. He has CONFESSED to the crime SEVERAL times and yet NOTHING happens to him. He KNOWS that too many "higher ups" are not going to go down with him. He is safe.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Magnolia on July 23, 2008, 11:59:09 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


After seeing how many times the boys have backtracked and lied

about what happened to Natalee... as many times as they have been

caught each and everytime in those lies.


That is getting into MAYBE MY DOG DID IT territory, for me.

The backtracking and lies are what keep me scratching my head. That very thing is what busts many criminals in this country. The fact they got away with it is what I can't understand. It's as if, they could have a video of the crime, and still not prosecute. JMO
That is why Joran is so emboldened. He has CONFESSED to the crime SEVERAL times and yet NOTHING happens to him. He KNOWS that too many "higher ups" are not going to go down with him. He is safe.

It is that old snowball...complete with psychics


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 24, 2008, 12:12:45 AM
If vander S was really boinking his hired help, then I bet there was plenty held over his head to entice him to help out wonderboy and friends.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 24, 2008, 12:16:22 AM
or was it oduber, no matter, they are all creeps.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 12:21:19 AM
or was it oduber, no matter, they are all creeps.
Rudy Croes, Oduber, Briesden(sp?)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 24, 2008, 12:26:42 AM
or was it oduber, no matter, they are all creeps.
Rudy Croes, Oduber, Briesden(sp?)
well dang, was I that far off? Know it was one of those old fa***


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 12:33:35 AM
or was it oduber, no matter, they are all creeps.
Rudy Croes, Oduber, Briesden(sp?)
well dang, was I that far off? Know it was one of those old fa***
Nope, you are right on! There's a bunch of 'em!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 24, 2008, 01:11:15 AM
But Carpe and Wreck, if they did it alone, and Im sure not saying they didnt, why are they so darn important?  And important is not the word Im looking for.

Always 1...You need to review...your thoughts...and feelings....on this case...

(((((((((((Always)))))))))))))))))

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 24, 2008, 01:16:00 AM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!

Wreck...Good Spirit Dude.......Des.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 24, 2008, 02:50:49 AM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/karin-installatie-log.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 24, 2008, 02:55:35 AM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/karin-installatie-log.png)

CARPE! You found her eHarmony.com entry!   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 24, 2008, 02:58:34 AM
 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on July 24, 2008, 04:51:26 AM
Quote from: carpe noctem


SATISH - 6/10/2005 STATEMENT #2



I had awoken at approximately 06.30 hours on Tuesday. (May 31, 2005)

Was Deepak home at that time?

Deepak had just come home. I had asked Deepak where he had been. Deepak then told me he came from the police station. Deepak told me that he had to go to the police station because of the girl that had been with us on Sunday May 29th 2005.

What did you say to Deepak when he had informed/told you that the girl from Sunday went missing?

I had told my brother that this was impossible because we had dropped her off at the hotel.

Deepak said that he too did not know how the girl went/was missing.


---------

THE VERY NEXT DAY

---------


SATISH - 6/11/2005 STATEMENT




On Tuesday May 31st 2005 at approximately 02.45  hours I was sleeping in bed. At that moment I was awakened by my brother Deepak. Deepak had called me on my mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak had called me with his mobile phone 568xxxx. Deepak said to me that the girl that had been with us on Sunday had gone missing. Deepak then told me that we should not say that we dropped Joran and the girl off near the Marriot Hotel but that we left her at the Holiday Inn Hotel. My brother had also told me that we should say that we had dropped off Joran at his place.


When Deepak called me he was together with Joran. I heard Joran instruct my brother what we had to say. My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house. Before the police could come and pick me up I was called by my brother to tell me what I had to say if the police came to my house. The police did not come to my house that night. After I had heard that message I could not sleep.


---------

2 and 1/2 Weeks Later

---------


SATISH KALPOE 06/30/2005 STATEMENT


So far I have only told the truth. I have already told to you everything.



7/4/2005

Kalpoes are free to go.



ANOTHER DAY, ANOTHER STORY. ALE knew all along.

The entire thing was one big game with Natalee Ann's life.

It was one big raping, murdering ARUBA production.



I hope they all burn in hell, and the island blows sky high, I could care less.

It could not happen fast enough for this Monkey.



The words in red caused me to jump down from the guest balcony once again:

On Tuesday May 31st 2005 at approximately 02.45

My brother had told me that the father of Joran had told Joran that the police had come to their house.

Proof of conspiracy, and early stages of coverup--

Beth's group did not arrive at the VDS compound until close to 3 am, the early morning hours of May 31, 2005.  By 2:45 am, PvdS had notified JvdS about the arrival of the police; JvdS told Deepak; Deepak called Satish.  I do not believe PvdS is clairvoyant.

ETA of Family group arrival at police parking lot (where there was an approx. 15 min. delay) . . . 2:40 am.

ALE knew; the Prosecutor knew; Everybody knew!



It's easy to stay one step ahead of ALE if ALE lets you know what that next step is.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 24, 2008, 05:40:26 AM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/karin-installatie-log.png)

CARPE! You found her eHarmony.com entry!   ::MonkeyCool::

she can't write her own name  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 24, 2008, 08:52:50 AM
So I saw a thread Titled"questions for Art"and saw it had a new post on it.I don't remember seeing this thread before so I started on page one(there are only 2 pages total)and found questions to Art that Monkeys had posted back in the summer of 2006.Then I ran into Blondes post(posted today)and just want to say thank you Blonde for bringing that over!
VERY interesting reading,Blonde has posted all the answers from the questions asked of Art back in 2006.I'm only half way thru reading your post Blonde....will finish it tomorrow.

 I saw that Too... so I posted it in that thread so we could see it better.
 Klaas I hope that was OK I just never saw it before.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 24, 2008, 09:00:09 AM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
This could have happened this way. Will we ever know?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 24, 2008, 09:21:33 AM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
If they "merely" drugged, raped, hurt her and left her in the bushes then they are 100% guilty of murder. Who cares if they don't know what happened to her afterwards???? What's your point?


After seeing how many times the boys have backtracked and lied

about what happened to Natalee... as many times as they have been

caught each and everytime in those lies.


That is getting into MAYBE MY DOG DID IT territory, for me.

The backtracking and lies are what keep me scratching my head. That very thing is what busts many criminals in this country. The fact they got away with it is what I can't understand. It's as if, they could have a video of the crime, and still not prosecute. JMO
That is why Joran is so emboldened. He has CONFESSED to the crime SEVERAL times and yet NOTHING happens to him. He KNOWS that too many "higher ups" are not going to go down with him. He is safe.

I Agree


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 24, 2008, 09:35:27 AM
Then Carpe, if it was just the 3 boys involved, why would the elders let everyone else suffer???

I know I am day late in getting to this post, but I fell it incumbent of me to point out that when discussing this case there is no actual proof that the situation with the "elders" exists.  Unfortunately, it's simply a statement made by a poster on the FP that began that story.  Shango mentions elders and as of this moment in time there is little, if any, proof that such a situation exists at all.  This is why there is a separate thread for Shango.  Not everyone thinks he had anything legitimate to say when he posted.  However, in the past 3 years we have come to find out that there is a type of "network" that operates on Aruba that does indeed have some ability to keep a, then 17 year old, kid and his buddies out of jail and living the high life while justice goes into the ocean. So I would say it's a matter of opinion as whether you believe in "elders" or not.  Those "aiding and abetting" Joran's escape from justice would certainly have to be older than Joran and posses the power to make it happen. MOO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on July 24, 2008, 10:48:40 AM
Always 1 - here's what I think.  Joran and his friends, "the pimps", play a game of picking up tourist girls and having their way with them.  They most likely slip a drug in their drink but in their minds it's OK because they all are asking for it anyway.  This is the mindset of the Aruban male.  So Joran and whatever friends he's with end up with Natalee this time.  They do what they always do but this time either Natalee says NO and they get rough, or Natalee OD's because of the drugs they have given her.  Normally, they would just leave her on the beach but Natalee's family (Beth and Jug) showed up too quick so they lied.  When they were caught in their lies they lied again. 

I believe they couldn't let Natalee's body be found because it would show evidence of being drugged and raped.  They made the decision early on to cover it up to protect the tourist industry.  Once they decided they had to stick with it at all costs.  Paul van der Sloot may not be the richest person in Aruba but he has info on people and leverage with ALE/Judiciary and Government.

Yep  ::MonkeyCool::

When we think of "they" here I think not only of Wee Winky and company.  I think this is a common practice understanding on Aruba.  (Max DeVries, Buddy Larson, etc.)  I think the body was located by ALE based on the original confession around June 10/11.  ALE then disposed of the body themselves.  That is why Joran does not know where she is and is also very confident that she will not be found.  He knows ALE will never let that happen because if they do hand and sweaty running man will tell the world how Dirty Hand and company took charge of the disposal.  I think Van Der Straaten (Dirty Hand) needs to be hauled in and ripped a new one until he tells what ALE REALLY did.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 24, 2008, 12:29:51 PM

July 18, 2008
Navy News

ABOARD USS DE WERT - While on patrol in the Eastern Pacific Ocean, USS De Wert (FFG 45) with embarked detachments, Helicopter Anti-Submarine Squadron Light 46 Det. 1 (HSL-46 Det. 1), Coast Guard Law Enforcement Detachment (LEDET) 103, and Colombian Navy ship Buenaventura interdicted two go-fast vessels July 11, each carrying over one ton of cocaine.

The two suspect vessels were tracked and interdicted by the joint efforts of De Wert, HSL-46 Det. 1, LEDET 103, and Buenaventura. De Wert recovered several jettisoned bales from one of the suspect vessels. These bales were later confirmed to be cocaine. Five alleged traffickers from the second go-fast were detained on board De Wert by the crew and LEDET 103. The suspects were later transferred to another U.S. Naval vessel in the vicinity.

The six alleged traffickers from the first go-fast vessel, two tons of contraband, and both go-fast vessels were transferred to the Colombian Navy.

The coordinated actions of the U.S. Navy, U.S. Coast Guard, Joint Interagency Task Force-South (JIATF-S) in partnership with the Colombian Navy were instrumental to the successful interdiction of over two tons of narcotics.

De Wert, homeported in Mayport, Fla., is currently deployed in Latin America under the operational control of U.S. Naval Forces Southern Command (NAVSO)/U.S. 4th Fleet, conducting counter illicit trafficking operations in support of JIATF-South, U.S. law enforcement and U.S. and participating nations drug control policy.

De Wert is also supporting the U.S. Maritime Strategy by conducting Theater Security Cooperation events, such as community relations projects and Project Handclasp distributions, in the Caribbean and Latin America.
 
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Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 24, 2008, 01:29:09 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
This could have happened this way. Will we ever know?

Early rumor:

But the biggest rumor is this; Joran did get out of the car with Ms Natalee(at the lighthouse/arashi beach)...Accidentaly she stumbled at the beach..She fell on rocks where she hit her head pretty hard.And since then passed out.THey dropped her off a far distance from the Holiday Inn.BUt as guilty as they felt came back a few minutes later to check on her.She was still in the same position as when she was dropped off.Then they discovered she still had no pulse and supposed she turned ice cold and purple.SO they all panicked , took her back in the car , and started to plan what to do.
That is how much i know of this 'rumor'.
This is sooo sickening.These guys SHOULD be pressured MUCH harder ..Make them soob so hard they can't even think straight ,so they confess to this.
I believe the rumor.This is a shame , as for I am born and raised on this lovely island. And it makes me sick ! This is unfair , no matter how drunk this girl was.It's utter and completely wrong.
May god rest Natalee's soul..
58. Posted by AuA82 | June 13, 2005 4:44 PM



http://tinyurl.com/2mn82l


The underlines are mine.  No accident, no guilt and I believe Joran came back with dad and Val.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 24, 2008, 01:42:15 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
This could have happened this way. Will we ever know?

Early rumor:

But the biggest rumor is this; Joran did get out of the car with Ms Natalee(at the lighthouse/arashi beach)...Accidentaly she stumbled at the beach..She fell on rocks where she hit her head pretty hard.And since then passed out.THey dropped her off a far distance from the Holiday Inn.BUt as guilty as they felt came back a few minutes later to check on her.She was still in the same position as when she was dropped off.Then they discovered she still had no pulse and supposed she turned ice cold and purple.SO they all panicked , took her back in the car , and started to plan what to do.
That is how much i know of this 'rumor'.
This is sooo sickening.These guys SHOULD be pressured MUCH harder ..Make them soob so hard they can't even think straight ,so they confess to this.
I believe the rumor.This is a shame , as for I am born and raised on this lovely island. And it makes me sick ! This is unfair , no matter how drunk this girl was.It's utter and completely wrong.
May god rest Natalee's soul..
58. Posted by AuA82 | June 13, 2005 4:44 PM



http://tinyurl.com/2mn82l


The underlines are mine.  No accident, no guilt and I believe Joran came back with dad and Val.


and jvds, the student of criminal law, and his father, the failed judge-in-training, decided that although abslutely no crime had been committed, and an accidental death was all they had to contend with, decided to destroy the child's body?  for what possible reason?
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 24, 2008, 01:54:47 PM
and his best friend Vock-King decided to take off work to show support to the acting-as-a judge and his innocent son. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 24, 2008, 02:31:48 PM
What if Joran and the Kalpoe brothers drugged, raped, and hurt Natalee but left her in the bushes near the Fishermens Shacks, had to go home to make things right, but intended to come back later.  Then she was gone.  They didnt know what happened to her.
This could have happened this way. Will we ever know?

Early rumor:

But the biggest rumor is this; Joran did get out of the car with Ms Natalee(at the lighthouse/arashi beach)...Accidentaly she stumbled at the beach..She fell on rocks where she hit her head pretty hard.And since then passed out.THey dropped her off a far distance from the Holiday Inn.BUt as guilty as they felt came back a few minutes later to check on her.She was still in the same position as when she was dropped off.Then they discovered she still had no pulse and supposed she turned ice cold and purple.SO they all panicked , took her back in the car , and started to plan what to do.
That is how much i know of this 'rumor'.
This is sooo sickening.These guys SHOULD be pressured MUCH harder ..Make them soob so hard they can't even think straight ,so they confess to this.
I believe the rumor.This is a shame , as for I am born and raised on this lovely island. And it makes me sick ! This is unfair , no matter how drunk this girl was.It's utter and completely wrong.
May god rest Natalee's soul..
58. Posted by AuA82 | June 13, 2005 4:44 PM



http://tinyurl.com/2mn82l


The underlines are mine.  No accident, no guilt and I believe Joran came back with dad and Val.


and jvds, the student of criminal law, and his father, the failed judge-in-training, decided that although abslutely no crime had been committed, and an accidental death was all they had to contend with, decided to destroy the child's body?  for what possible reason?
dennisintn

Dennis, I think physical damage is the reason.  We've heard "hit head" too many times.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 04:02:08 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 04:11:29 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.

????? I'm too dense to decide what is meant here. Is the "lamp" the "light of truth"?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 24, 2008, 04:25:47 PM


RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.
[/quote]

????? I'm too dense to decide what is meant here. Is the "lamp" the "light of truth"?
[/quote]

i had the visual image of someone running carelessly down the street and into the lamppost.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 24, 2008, 04:25:49 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.

????? I'm too dense to decide what is meant here. Is the "lamp" the "light of truth"?

I don't think you are dense at all....you hit the nail on the head....Wreck!  You're a translater now ;-)

Des


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 04:41:41 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.

????? I'm too dense to decide what is meant here. Is the "lamp" the "light of truth"?

I don't think you are dense at all....you hit the nail on the head....Wreck!  You're a translater now ;-)

Des
Well, thanks -- but, I knid of like dennisintn's interpretation better!! ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 04:47:43 PM
Scripture maybe?  Something about the lamp being the light of the world?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 04:52:13 PM
I don't think it is anything "deep meaning" -- just kind of a slang phrase from The Netherlands when translated to English.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 24, 2008, 04:55:39 PM
Klaas sorry , OT here when you have a moment Missing Persons: George Gilbreath FOUND SAFE  TIA


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 24, 2008, 05:23:30 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.


So now they've moved the big surprise from September to the end of the year? They must be taking their cues from Van der Straten, Dompig and Jannsen. If they actually did one one-tenth of what they have said they were going to do this case would be solved and JVDS would be in prison. Where are the spines of these people, or were they born without them?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 24, 2008, 05:28:01 PM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!


That is it in a nutshell, Wreck. That is also why I think people are still so furious

about it. It is just so completely and utterly senseless to do to a human life.

Especially, someone as decent as Natalee. She was a sweetheart, she wouldn't

have hurt anybody!!!! Not a soul.


I like your  summation too, Wreck. Might I offer a title?

Scumbags helping Scumbags.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 05:28:24 PM
http://patrickvandereem.nl/stories/derde-week-in-bestsellers-lijst/#comments

One of the comments through the translator:

July 23rd, 2008 at 8:51 am

Mark said:


What a book; incredible. And what a story, but rather anyone who doubts should do themselves a favour and read this book. What then of his confession which may include: Joran was Natalee when her what did and therefore 100% involved in her disappearance.

I heard you say that you have a hard head in that case (legally) is resolved…. And what later hear / I read that you think that there is still a spectacular twist at the end of this year is to come.

How do you think about it now?

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.


So now they've moved the big surprise from September to the end of the year? They must be taking their cues from Van der Straten, Dompig and Jannsen. If they actually did one one-tenth of what they have said they were going to do this case would be solved and JVDS would be in prison. Where are the spines of these people, or were they born without them?
Just like Lisa Lubner's dad from SNL (born without a spine) ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 24, 2008, 05:33:24 PM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/karin-installatie-log.png)


Love it Carpe! She is a sack of shit.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 24, 2008, 05:34:40 PM

So now they've moved the big surprise from September to the end of the year? They must be taking their cues from Van der Straten, Dompig and Jannsen. If they actually did one one-tenth of what they have said they were going to do this case would be solved and JVDS would be in prison. Where are the spines of these people, or were they born without them?

Just like Lisa Lubner's dad from SNL (born without a spine) ::MonkeyCool::


There ya go Wreck!  ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 05:38:47 PM
Ok, Wreck, do you think it could like in the old days when they used a lamp (kerosene) so running againt the lamp would mean running againt time???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 24, 2008, 05:40:04 PM
[

RESPONSE PATRICK

The same. The probability that Joran runs against the lamp is larger than the other way around.
[/quote]

????? I'm too dense to decide what is meant here. Is the "lamp" the "light of truth"?
[/quote]

I don't think you are dense at all....you hit the nail on the head....Wreck!  You're a translater now ;-)

Des
[/quote]
Well, thanks -- but, I knid of like dennisintn's interpretation better!! ::MonkeyHaHa::
[/quote]

roflmfao, you only like mine better because of the pain involved. 
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 24, 2008, 05:46:52 PM

That is why Joran is so emboldened. He has CONFESSED to the crime SEVERAL times and yet NOTHING happens to him. He KNOWS that too many "higher ups" are not going to go down with him. He is safe.
[/quote]


With all the judges being friends of Pustus, what should we expect? What were the judiciary leaders in Holland thinking when they let this miscarriage of justice begin and carry on for three years? Those are their boys. PVDS is one of them. We have heard this goes all the way to the Hague? Of course it does. They're all one big network of friends.

Did it ever cross anyone's mind in Holland that there might be some huge conflicts of interest when one of their judge in training's son was arrested for murder? Did it ever cross their minds that PVDS worked with all of their judges and knew them personally? Hell no, they still have Rick Smid running the show two and a half years later. They did nothing but sit on their butts in Holland and let injustice run rampant among the people they sent there to deliver it.

Same goes for their Prosecutors sent from Holland. They worked with Paulus. One of his best friends worked for Karin Jannsen. He even took off work to help Pustus in his time of need, openly. This was public knowledge. Here again, did it ever occur to anyone in Holland they might have some serious conflicts of interest on their hands? Hell no. This is what you get when you allow friendships to override justice and integrity in a legal and judicial system.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 24, 2008, 05:56:25 PM
Hi Monkey's!
I Have Been reading This Forum For Sometime Now. I Have Been Waiting For My "Approval" So I Could Tell Everyone What A Great Job You All Are Doing For Natalee. I Am More Of An "*******" As I Have Been Keeping A Close watch On This case from the Beginning. I Have Learned A lot By Reading Forum's. And I Just wanted To Thank You For Allowing Me to Join And Thank You For Being Here. It's All About Natalee. ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 24, 2008, 05:57:00 PM
Ok, Wreck, do you think it could like in the old days when they used a lamp (kerosene) so running againt the lamp would mean running againt time???

Like running into the fire? comparable to our saying 'out of the frying pan and into the fire? just a guess.....like running into more trouble?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 06:10:06 PM
Welcome Echo......


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 06:12:50 PM
Ok, Wreck, do you think it could like in the old days when they used a lamp (kerosene) so running againt the lamp would mean running againt time???

Like running into the fire? comparable to our saying 'out of the frying pan and into the fire? just a guess.....like running into more trouble?
I don't think there is anything cryptic here -- just a very "everyday phrase" that doesn't translate well to English. For example, we might say something like "he saw the light." It would translate from Dutch to English something like "he envisioned floor lamp".


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 24, 2008, 06:14:47 PM
My thinking is that this was a fairly simple crime by the son/sons of a few prominant people on the island . The fathers called in some early "favors"- namely by Van der Stratten. The crime was about to be exposed on June 10th when the REAL power brokers on the island decided that a grizzely murder committed by "locals" would be devestating for tourism. The deception snowballed until there was no turning back. By then -- too many people would go down for corruption for covering up. They never banked on a mother like Beth or people like those at SM to be intently focused on them forever!


That is it in a nutshell, Wreck. That is also why I think people are still so furious

about it. It is just so completely and utterly senseless to do to a human life.

Especially, someone as decent as Natalee. She was a sweetheart, she wouldn't

have hurt anybody!!!! Not a soul.


I like your  summation too, Wreck. Might I offer a title?

Scumbags helping Scumbags.

i totally agree with all three of you.  it all deserves repeating.  even putting on billboards.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 06:19:18 PM
Thats so funny Wreck.  Seriously, Im laying here, looking at my laptop, laughing all by myself.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 24, 2008, 06:25:08 PM
Welcome Echo......


Thank You, Always 1


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 06:40:55 PM
Welcome Echos - I've been very slow about approving new members but just got to approving a few today.  Nice to have you with us!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 24, 2008, 06:40:56 PM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomepink.gif)
echosofangels


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 24, 2008, 06:47:20 PM
Welcome Echos - I've been very slow about approving new members but just got to approving a few today.  Nice to have you with us!
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomepink.gif)
echosofangels

Thank You! I'm Happy To Be Here


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 07:16:24 PM
Blonde - not our Mr Pink......  http://goodtimes.webshot.com/photo/435320587072055610qyyTec


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 07:31:03 PM
Looks like another traffic fatality:

(http://www.24ora.com/images/stories/news/breaking%20news.gif)

Accidente cu morto na Washington       
Thursday, 24 July 2008 - 19:19 
Algo promer cu 7 or di anochi ta sosode un accidente na Washington. Algun rato despues ta drenta e informe di esnan promer na e sitio cu un di e personanan no ta duna senjal di bida. Aki nos tin di menciona cu despues di e tristo noticia cu diabierna ultimo y diadomingo ultimo Aruba a conoce caso di morto den trafico, awe diaranson Aruba ta di luto pa un otro morto den trafico. Reporteronan di 24ora.com ta na e sitio pa ricibi mas informacion y imagen. Keda pendiente pa esakinan.
 

Through translator:

accidente cu dead at washington
 thursday, 24 july 2008 - 19:19

 algo before 7 or of night is sosode one accidente at washington. some rato after is enter the informe of esnan previous to at the sitio cu one of the personanan do not give senjal of life. here we have of menciona cu after of the tristo news cu diabierna ultimo y diadomingo ultimo aruba owing to conoce caso of dead in trafico, today diaranson aruba is of luto for one another dead in trafico. reporteronan of 24ora.com is at the sitio for ricibi more informacion y imagen. stay pendiente for esakinan. come across

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5558/1/#jc_allComments


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 07:32:40 PM
Blonde - not our Mr Pink......  http://goodtimes.webshot.com/photo/435320587072055610qyyTec

Always - tried to fix your link but it still doesn't work. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 24, 2008, 07:43:10 PM
Aruba is in no position to layoff health care workers(as we have recently read)...if anything they should be recruiting workers.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 24, 2008, 07:47:18 PM
(http://www.24ora.com/images/stories/news/2008/juli2008/juli21/front-sleeping-police.jpg)

Polemica tocante di e sleeping policenan

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

http://www.24ora.com/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 07:51:41 PM
I am working on the link Klassend.  I am pretty good at finding things, cruddy at relaying them.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 24, 2008, 07:57:37 PM
I do like these cartoons at Diario...

(http://news.diario-aruba.com//images/stories/2008N/juli/24/car.jpg)

What does this mean?  Did someone ask about elections in Aruba earlier in this thread?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 07:57:41 PM
(http://www.24ora.com/images/stories/news/2008/juli2008/juli21/front-sleeping-police.jpg)

Polemica tocante di e sleeping policenan

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

http://www.24ora.com/

Yeah I think they were counting on the speed bumps to slow cars down and they aren't working.   ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 24, 2008, 08:05:50 PM
Aruba is in no position to layoff health care workers(as we have recently read)...if anything they should be recruiting workers.

i think i read a couple of weeks ago that aruba had sent a delegation to aruba to court health care workers.  i don't remember whether they told what specialties they were looking for.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 08:31:09 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 08:41:32 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.
Is this what you are looking for? (you were missing the "s" in webshots.com)

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435318429072055610iqNtJz

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/365649721ZfllRc

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 08:47:34 PM
Thanks Wreck,  there are some other pictures in that same group on Aruba June 10th.  Maybe helpful....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 08:53:55 PM
These pics were from June 10th?? There was a story early on about GVC taking a tourist back to a hotel --- he got a frantic phone call and left post haste. Many here will remember better than I!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 08:54:33 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.
Is this what you are looking for? (you were missing the "s" in webshots.com)

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435318429072055610iqNtJz

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/365649721ZfllRc

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD

A pic of GVC but that's no big surprise

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 09:02:01 PM
is that other young guy Jamie??/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 09:07:50 PM
The one that says random cutie from Aruba - is that Jamie


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 09:11:12 PM
The one that says random cutie from Aruba - is that Jamie

No it's Geoffrey von Cromvoirt - the one who's father used to own the VBC Security company.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 24, 2008, 09:25:59 PM
These pics were from June 10th?? There was a story early on about GVC taking a tourist back to a hotel --- he got a frantic phone call and left post haste. Many here will remember better than I!

Hi wreck...Is this the one...

Interview With Cromvoirt Acquaintance

Though currently studying abroad, I was able to establish contact and do a brief phone interview with a young American girl acquainted with current detainee in the Natalee Holloway investigation, Geoffrey van Cromvoirt.

She is still somewhat shaken by news of his arrest, particularly as it was June 9th, 2005, the night Joran Van der Sloot and the two Kalpoe brothers were arrested, when she met GVC at Carlos and Charlies. She was able to provide the day of the week, Thursday, which matches with the night of the three boys arrests. After speaking with her, I've no reason to doubt her veracity.

GVC was alone at Carlos and Charlies that night keeping mostly to himself. She could only remember him saying hello to one other person passing by that night in the club. After some initial eye contact, it was she who approached GVC. He immediately appeared to open up.

One item of possible interest, he told her that he worked during the day taking tourists out on a Catamaran. While I have no way of ascertaining it was the same catamaran, I do recall photos taken by the Mountain Brook students showing that they did take such a trip.

GVC struck her as something of a self promoter, constantly talking about himself, his many connections and his family's supposed wealth. She also recalled seeing images of some famous individuals he had stored in his cell phone, noting that GVC did not appear with those people in said pictures. Still, he insisted they were friends.

On another night, she may have been less receptive to the seemingly brash young man, but she found him attractive, she was on vacation and the two eventually danced. She indicated that there were no drugs involved, though both were drinking. At some point, GVC offered her a ride to her hotel and a male friend of the young woman went along.

GVC did apparently brag about being involved with security, trying to exert some pressure on a hotel guard to acknowledge who he was. The guard apparently failed to acknowledge him in any significant manner. She believes he was driving a jeep at the time, possibly blue and that he also mentioned a recent or pending purchase of a truck, color unknown.

Back at her hotel, it was decided that he would leave behind his ID and possibly some other wallet contents with her friends as security before the two went back out alone together. They spent approximately a half an hour or so together, primarily on the beach. The only potentially unusual thing she noticed during their time on the beach was that he might have been a bit nervous, looking about - at one point claiming he saw a security guard coming. She could not see a guard.

After some time on the beach his cell phone started ringing but he did not answer it. She believes it rang several times in succession, possibly as many as seven times. When she inquired about the calls, he stated that it was his Mother and that he had to get home. He kept reiterating, he had to go. She was puzzled at this as she believed him to be 19 years old at the time.

After a night of being extremely talkative, mostly about himself, she did eventually ask him in a casual way about the Natalee Holloway case. She feels very strongly that it was at that point his demeanor significantly changed. He almost completely stopped talking while the two were walking, swiftly now, back to her hotel.

She asked a few different questions ... if he knew of the case, of those involved, what was it that he thought. But he did not answer any of those questions, or change the topic. He mostly just stopped talking at all. They returned to her hotel, a friend brought down his things and that was the last she saw of him until his recent arrest. She felt he all but took off running, likely related to the phone calls, as he left.

Later after leaving the island, the interaction did leave her with a strange feeling, mostly because of his sudden silence when the topic of Natalee Holloway came up. Unsure if it meant anything, or not, eventually she did call the FBI. She gave them what information she could as regards the encounter, much of which I have now relayed here.

It remains unclear what, if any connection GVC has to the Holloway case. But at least one individual who spent some time with the boy soon after the disappearance was troubled enough about his demeanor simply talking about the case to make a call to the FBI.

I have agreed to keep her identity secret.




Tuesday, April 18, 2006 at 07:37 PM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2006/04/interview_with_.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 24, 2008, 09:27:43 PM
Ok, Wreck, do you think it could like in the old days when they used a lamp (kerosene) so running againt the lamp would mean running againt time???

Like running into the fire? comparable to our saying 'out of the frying pan and into the fire? just a guess.....like running into more trouble?
I don't think there is anything cryptic here -- just a very "everyday phrase" that doesn't translate well to English. For example, we might say something like "he saw the light." It would translate from Dutch to English something like "he envisioned floor lamp".

MO....I don't think Joran will ever "see the light" as we understand it...if this goes on for a few more years or so I believe he will get in deeper and tick off the wrong person and they will take him out....he doesn't really know how to play the game...MO...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 24, 2008, 09:29:07 PM
Oops...Sorry...Welcome Echo and the other new posters...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 24, 2008, 09:36:52 PM
These pics were from June 10th?? There was a story early on about GVC taking a tourist back to a hotel --- he got a frantic phone call and left post haste. Many here will remember better than I!

Hi wreck...Is this the one...

Interview With Cromvoirt Acquaintance

Though currently studying abroad, I was able to establish contact and do a brief phone interview with a young American girl acquainted with current detainee in the Natalee Holloway investigation, Geoffrey van Cromvoirt.

She is still somewhat shaken by news of his arrest, particularly as it was June 9th, 2005, the night Joran Van der Sloot and the two Kalpoe brothers were arrested, when she met GVC at Carlos and Charlies. She was able to provide the day of the week, Thursday, which matches with the night of the three boys arrests. After speaking with her, I've no reason to doubt her veracity.

GVC was alone at Carlos and Charlies that night keeping mostly to himself. She could only remember him saying hello to one other person passing by that night in the club. After some initial eye contact, it was she who approached GVC. He immediately appeared to open up.

One item of possible interest, he told her that he worked during the day taking tourists out on a Catamaran. While I have no way of ascertaining it was the same catamaran, I do recall photos taken by the Mountain Brook students showing that they did take such a trip.

GVC struck her as something of a self promoter, constantly talking about himself, his many connections and his family's supposed wealth. She also recalled seeing images of some famous individuals he had stored in his cell phone, noting that GVC did not appear with those people in said pictures. Still, he insisted they were friends.

On another night, she may have been less receptive to the seemingly brash young man, but she found him attractive, she was on vacation and the two eventually danced. She indicated that there were no drugs involved, though both were drinking. At some point, GVC offered her a ride to her hotel and a male friend of the young woman went along.

GVC did apparently brag about being involved with security, trying to exert some pressure on a hotel guard to acknowledge who he was. The guard apparently failed to acknowledge him in any significant manner. She believes he was driving a jeep at the time, possibly blue and that he also mentioned a recent or pending purchase of a truck, color unknown.

Back at her hotel, it was decided that he would leave behind his ID and possibly some other wallet contents with her friends as security before the two went back out alone together. They spent approximately a half an hour or so together, primarily on the beach. The only potentially unusual thing she noticed during their time on the beach was that he might have been a bit nervous, looking about - at one point claiming he saw a security guard coming. She could not see a guard.

After some time on the beach his cell phone started ringing but he did not answer it. She believes it rang several times in succession, possibly as many as seven times. When she inquired about the calls, he stated that it was his Mother and that he had to get home. He kept reiterating, he had to go. She was puzzled at this as she believed him to be 19 years old at the time.

After a night of being extremely talkative, mostly about himself, she did eventually ask him in a casual way about the Natalee Holloway case. She feels very strongly that it was at that point his demeanor significantly changed. He almost completely stopped talking while the two were walking, swiftly now, back to her hotel.

She asked a few different questions ... if he knew of the case, of those involved, what was it that he thought. But he did not answer any of those questions, or change the topic. He mostly just stopped talking at all. They returned to her hotel, a friend brought down his things and that was the last she saw of him until his recent arrest. She felt he all but took off running, likely related to the phone calls, as he left.

Later after leaving the island, the interaction did leave her with a strange feeling, mostly because of his sudden silence when the topic of Natalee Holloway came up. Unsure if it meant anything, or not, eventually she did call the FBI. She gave them what information she could as regards the encounter, much of which I have now relayed here.

It remains unclear what, if any connection GVC has to the Holloway case. But at least one individual who spent some time with the boy soon after the disappearance was troubled enough about his demeanor simply talking about the case to make a call to the FBI.

I have agreed to keep her identity secret.




Tuesday, April 18, 2006 at 07:37 PM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2006/04/interview_with_.html

yup!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 24, 2008, 09:47:46 PM
TY MumInOhio!  And I agree With LoRain. JVS Isn't Gonna Skate By Forever. He Is Too Cocky And that Will Be His Downfall. IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 24, 2008, 09:50:47 PM
These pics were from June 10th?? There was a story early on about GVC taking a tourist back to a hotel --- he got a frantic phone call and left post haste. Many here will remember better than I!

Hi wreck...Is this the one...

Interview With Cromvoirt Acquaintance

Though currently studying abroad, I was able to establish contact and do a brief phone interview with a young American girl acquainted with current detainee in the Natalee Holloway investigation, Geoffrey van Cromvoirt.

She is still somewhat shaken by news of his arrest, particularly as it was June 9th, 2005, the night Joran Van der Sloot and the two Kalpoe brothers were arrested, when she met GVC at Carlos and Charlies. She was able to provide the day of the week, Thursday, which matches with the night of the three boys arrests. After speaking with her, I've no reason to doubt her veracity.

GVC was alone at Carlos and Charlies that night keeping mostly to himself. She could only remember him saying hello to one other person passing by that night in the club. After some initial eye contact, it was she who approached GVC. He immediately appeared to open up.

One item of possible interest, he told her that he worked during the day taking tourists out on a Catamaran. While I have no way of ascertaining it was the same catamaran, I do recall photos taken by the Mountain Brook students showing that they did take such a trip.

GVC struck her as something of a self promoter, constantly talking about himself, his many connections and his family's supposed wealth. She also recalled seeing images of some famous individuals he had stored in his cell phone, noting that GVC did not appear with those people in said pictures. Still, he insisted they were friends.

On another night, she may have been less receptive to the seemingly brash young man, but she found him attractive, she was on vacation and the two eventually danced. She indicated that there were no drugs involved, though both were drinking. At some point, GVC offered her a ride to her hotel and a male friend of the young woman went along.

GVC did apparently brag about being involved with security, trying to exert some pressure on a hotel guard to acknowledge who he was. The guard apparently failed to acknowledge him in any significant manner. She believes he was driving a jeep at the time, possibly blue and that he also mentioned a recent or pending purchase of a truck, color unknown.

Back at her hotel, it was decided that he would leave behind his ID and possibly some other wallet contents with her friends as security before the two went back out alone together. They spent approximately a half an hour or so together, primarily on the beach. The only potentially unusual thing she noticed during their time on the beach was that he might have been a bit nervous, looking about - at one point claiming he saw a security guard coming. She could not see a guard.

After some time on the beach his cell phone started ringing but he did not answer it. She believes it rang several times in succession, possibly as many as seven times. When she inquired about the calls, he stated that it was his Mother and that he had to get home. He kept reiterating, he had to go. She was puzzled at this as she believed him to be 19 years old at the time.

After a night of being extremely talkative, mostly about himself, she did eventually ask him in a casual way about the Natalee Holloway case. She feels very strongly that it was at that point his demeanor significantly changed. He almost completely stopped talking while the two were walking, swiftly now, back to her hotel.

She asked a few different questions ... if he knew of the case, of those involved, what was it that he thought. But he did not answer any of those questions, or change the topic. He mostly just stopped talking at all. They returned to her hotel, a friend brought down his things and that was the last she saw of him until his recent arrest. She felt he all but took off running, likely related to the phone calls, as he left.

Later after leaving the island, the interaction did leave her with a strange feeling, mostly because of his sudden silence when the topic of Natalee Holloway came up. Unsure if it meant anything, or not, eventually she did call the FBI. She gave them what information she could as regards the encounter, much of which I have now relayed here.

It remains unclear what, if any connection GVC has to the Holloway case. But at least one individual who spent some time with the boy soon after the disappearance was troubled enough about his demeanor simply talking about the case to make a call to the FBI.

I have agreed to keep her identity secret.




Tuesday, April 18, 2006 at 07:37 PM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2006/04/interview_with_.html

yup!


Thanks For The story. I Have Not read This Before.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 24, 2008, 10:07:07 PM
You are welcome Echo…GVC and his parents took off to the Netherlands, put their house up for sale immediately after his release and threatened to sue ALE around May 9th. 2006 IIRC



From yesterday….Regarding the suspect’s conversations of May 30th. 2005, before the family arrived.

From Joran’s Book Translation….Note: Interrogation of May 30th.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1097.0

P224
August 8th 2005

During interrogation Joran is asked to take off his shoes. "Why are you now wearing size 10.5, while you stated that on May 30th  you were wearing size 14?", they asked him. Joran says, "that's because of the difference between English and American shoes sizes, but i don't tell them."[/b]

Hopefully Tamikosmom can add to this when she returns from her vacation. Pretty sure she has more… ::MonkeyWink::




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 10:45:46 PM
O/T NEW FRONT PAGE POST:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/07/24/some-times-we-just-need-to-some-bizarre-monkey-humor/

Some times We just Need to Some Bizarre Monkey Humor


 ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 11:12:18 PM
When I try to go back to page 11, there is nothing there.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 24, 2008, 11:42:35 PM
When I try to go back to page 11, there is nothing there.

Wierd - I just tried it and it's there for me  ::MonkeyConfused::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 24, 2008, 11:48:07 PM
Me too now!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 25, 2008, 12:02:02 AM
(http://www.24ora.com/images/stories/news/2008/juli2008/juli21/front-sleeping-police.jpg)

Polemica tocante di e sleeping policenan

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

http://www.24ora.com/


You think with all this terrible Aruban driving one of the Van der sloot kids

or one of them thar Kalpoos would get run over, and they could get Boe-tie

and Jerry Jerry Dingleberry to bury 'em like a dead dog on the side of the

road.


ARUBA - A LAND OF MISSED OPPORTUNITIES


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 25, 2008, 12:04:49 AM
 ::MonkeyConfused::


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/dgdfgdgf.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 25, 2008, 12:28:28 AM
THE GIRL COMES FIRST. SHE ALWAYS HAS!
HER NAME WAS NATALEE.

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/yttyytj.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 12:28:48 AM
haha Carpe.  good one ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 25, 2008, 12:32:12 AM
haha Carpe.  good one ::MonkeyLaugh::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Welcome to SM echosofangels!!!

Nice to have you here.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 12:39:28 AM
TY!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 25, 2008, 03:11:38 AM
Hi Monkey's!
I Have Been reading This Forum For Sometime Now. I Have Been Waiting For My "Approval" So I Could Tell Everyone What A Great Job You All Are Doing For Natalee. I Am More Of An "*******" As I Have Been Keeping A Close watch On This case from the Beginning. I Have Learned A lot By Reading Forum's. And I Just wanted To Thank You For Allowing Me to Join And Thank You For Being Here. It's All About Natalee. ::MonkeyWink::

Welcome to the Cage Echo!

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 25, 2008, 08:20:33 AM
AMIGOE NEWS:

...but I thought they kept telling us Americans are still flocking to the island???

 ::MonkeyNoNo::



Americans sell second home in Aruba

24 Jul, 2008, 18:41 (GMT -04:00)




http://tinyurl.com/5qmofe


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 08:25:44 AM
Maybe the Sloots were so adept at manipulating things they made ALE believe that Koen had supplied a boat for Joran's use that night.  Maybe the Gottenbos boat was used without anyone in their family knowing it by someone such as Lorenzo.  Once Joran hinted that a boat was used, maybe the logical assumption was Koen's boat, since Sander had used it the night before. I guess what I am saying is just because someone indicates it was the Gottenbos boat does not make it so.  The way they twist things in Aruba it could have been anyone's boat. Yet, they allowed it to remain the Gottenbos as a means to throw everyone off the trail.  JMO

 Lala’s and San…IMO, it appears that this interview below concerning the security guards backs up your posts. Some-one was pointing us towards the Gottenbos brothers or at least letting us think they may have been involved... Even Jossy said Koen needed to be looked at more?

I feel pretty sure that the family would not have been allowed to move to the US if the FBI believed the brothers were involved in this case.

Then Simian/Mirian pointed us to Freddy. Who were they all leading us away from? Who left for the Netherlands 2 days after Natalee disappeared? Who is the mystery guy with the scratches?

Hmmm…It was Jossy who said that Guido didn’t have scratches, helped point us to Koen and the family boat, and didn’t tell us about Freddy’s earlier arrest. So was Jossy misinformed as well as the US media?

From the archives…

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #717 1/31 - 2/01/08

« Reply #929 on: February 01, 2008, 03:43:35 PM »

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2560.msg336012#msg336012


From June 8th 2005 Nancy Grace....they do not appear to be talking about the Kalpoes.

 IMO  Maybe Koen and Sander

GRACE: OK, let me quickly go to defense attorney Daniel Horowitz standing by. Daniel Horowitz, this is basically bass-ackwards from the way that it works in America. Because you don`t arrest somebody and put them in a cell of an administration building by the jail unless you`ve got a case against them. You don`t get arrested while the state, while the prosecutor, tries to put together a case.

DANIEL HOROWITZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Exactly, Nancy. And there`s a problem with this, also. It focuses on these two men so much, and it doesn`t give them the freedom to be out and prove their innocence or gather evidence on their own behalf. You know, Nancy, these guys could be patsies. I`m concerned about those three rich kids who were with this young lady and supposedly dropped her off at a hotel and then she just vanishes. I don`t like the idea of the focus on these two guys alone.

GRACE: Let me go back to Karl Penhaul on that very issue. Karl Penhaul, CNN correspondent, is with us in Aruba. Karl, there are murmurings to that exact issue, that these two security guards are being targeted while the actual guys that were with her, that took her away from the restaurant, have been set free. Explain. Why are these two being held? Did they run into the girl after the other three let her go? I mean, why are they being held and the other three have been let go? Is it true they are from rich or influential families, while these two are not?

PENHAUL: That`s the question on a lot of people`s lips right now, Nancy. We`ve been talking around. We`ve also been talking to the suspects` families. A number of answers to that. The three young men last seen in the company of Natalee Holloway outside Carlos and Charlie`s, we understand, were never arrested, were never detained by police. Yes, they were interviewed. But the police in a press conference earlier this week have said that no evidence in terms of the car that they all drove away in was confiscated at any stage. Meanwhile, the two suspects, three of their vehicles have been confiscated. One of the suspect`s mother`s cars, a cousin`s car, I believe, and one of the cars belonging to one of the suspects. Those are being looked at, even though there`s nothing, apparently, according to the defense attorneys, in any witness statement to suggest that Natalee Holloway was ever seen in the company of these two suspects, let alone got in their cars.

As far as the identities of the three people, the young men that are being named or were named as persons of interest, indeed, they do seem to be from influential families, certainly middle-class families, a little difficult in this context to spell out exactly whom they are.

But what the mother of Mickey John -- Antonius John, but Mickey his mother calls him -- what she says is that here what is at stake, or one part of the problem is, is that there`s a race issue here, because the people, the three young men are of influential, middle-class, largely white families, descendents of the Dutch colonizers that once came here, whereas the two suspects are from black immigrant families who maybe have been here for many years but nevertheless are still regarded as immigrants.

 
 





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 08:42:56 AM
Hi Monkey's!
I Have Been reading This Forum For Sometime Now. I Have Been Waiting For My "Approval" So I Could Tell Everyone What A Great Job You All Are Doing For Natalee. I Am More Of An "*******" As I Have Been Keeping A Close watch On This case from the Beginning. I Have Learned A lot By Reading Forum's. And I Just wanted To Thank You For Allowing Me to Join And Thank You For Being Here. It's All About Natalee. ::MonkeyWink::

Welcome to the Cage Echo!




TY Destiny ::MonkeyWink::

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 08:45:02 AM
Hi Monkey's!
I Have Been reading This Forum For Sometime Now. I Have Been Waiting For My "Approval" So I Could Tell Everyone What A Great Job You All Are Doing For Natalee. I Am More Of An "*******" As I Have Been Keeping A Close watch On This case from the Beginning. I Have Learned A lot By Reading Forum's. And I Just wanted To Thank You For Allowing Me to Join And Thank You For Being Here. It's All About Natalee. ::MonkeyWink::

Welcome to the Cage Echo!




TY Destiny ::MonkeyWink::

Destiny





oop's Didnt mean To Reply Inside The Quote Box


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 25, 2008, 09:33:25 AM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 25, 2008, 09:49:39 AM
Didn't Sander's PV also state that his cell phone was lost/stolen 5/30/2005?  Just adding to your thoughts, Lala's.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 09:50:59 AM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Morning Lala's....Another question or two...LOL...why did Sander say his phone was stolen? What does all the confusion with cell phones have to do with this? Paulus using Anita's phone, Val's phone showing up recently by the lighthouse?  More diversions?

There is very little I believe out of Aruba...but you knew that already! ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 09:53:27 AM
IIRC, Dave said that he met Michael Dumpig in the hall.  Michael appeared to be trying a female tourist con.  I believe Michael told Dave about the boat, at that time.

Does anyone else remember this?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 09:53:35 AM
Didn't Sander's PV also state that his cell phone was lost/stolen 5/30/2005?  Just adding to your thoughts, Lala's.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Morning 2NJSons....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 09:57:11 AM
IIRC, Dave said that he met Michael Dumpig in the hall.  Michael appeared to be trying a female tourist con.  I believe Michael told Dave about the boat, at that time.

Does anyone else remember this?


Morning Slogger...vague on this...Michael and a buddy were trying to pick up tourists and when he saw Dave he went up to him and said something about Paulus using the boat that night. Sorry, best I can do.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:06:25 AM
http://www.tctubantia.nl/regio/enschede/3465766/Enschedeer-schildert-Natalee-voor-moeder-Beth.ece

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/NatPainting.jpg)



Posted at RU:

Speaking of Beth...

It's a newspaper article about a man that made a painting of Natalee. It says that Beth will be coming to the Netherlands this August & he will be able to give it to her then.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 25, 2008, 10:06:47 AM
Didn't Sander's PV also state that his cell phone was lost/stolen 5/30/2005?  Just adding to your thoughts, Lala's.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Morning 2NJSons....

Great minds.....I just went back to Sander's PV of 6/16/05 to refresh my memory and, of course, the line of questioning leaves a lot to be desired....he didn't go to the Raquet Club, cell was stolen 5/30, he didn't report it because he hadn't gone to Setar to buy a new one in order to keep the same number.....he's a better friend to Joran than Deepak & Satish (who are ordinary friends)....blah, blah.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 25, 2008, 10:12:30 AM
http://www.tctubantia.nl/regio/enschede/3465766/Enschedeer-schildert-Natalee-voor-moeder-Beth.ece

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/NatPainting.jpg)



Posted at RU:

Speaking of Beth...

It's a newspaper article about a man that made a painting of Natalee. It says that Beth will be coming to the Netherlands this August & he will be able to give it to her then.


The original says Netherlands, but the screen shot in English says Canada...just an observation.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 10:14:16 AM
Morning, Mum; Morning Everyone; Welcome to Echo.

Good 'nuf, Mum.  I don't believe the information was in Dave's book.  It might have come from a subsequent interview, or questions on the Chat.  I do believe one boat clue came from Michael Dumpig.

We were warned that Gerold was talking out of both sides of his mouth.  At the time, I still held hope that this wasn't true.  We hadn't heard the rumor about the relationship with 2K.  Once that was heard, all things Dompig are suspect.

The only real clue I have is the information from Dave that Koen jumped behind the couch to avoid Dave's seeing him.  So, I'm not sure it was the Gottenboes' boat, but Koen does know something.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 25, 2008, 10:15:50 AM
Whoever told Dave about the boat is a good question.  If it was Dompig's son then my BS antennas go up even more.  Very little in this case is as it appears.  After spending 3 years in the Shango thread and reading and rereading all the posts and PVs and whatever else I can find or that is sent my way, there is one definite conclusion I can draw and that is that there is a motive for everything that was said or done those first few weeks.  When corruption is so prevalent there is a small sliver of truth in each word, but much more BS around the truth that has to be sorted.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:22:18 AM
2NJ - wow, that's wierd:

Net afgelopen week heeft hij via via te horen gekregen dat de moeder van Natalee in augustus naar Nederland komt en dan het portret in ontvangst zal nemen.


Now it says Ireland, LOL    ::MonkeyHaHa::


Net past week messages via told the mother of Natalee August to Ireland, and the portrait receive will.




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 25, 2008, 10:54:25 AM
Well, I suppose it's quiet in here today.  Oh well. I guess I can go over to Shango and read a while.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 10:59:18 AM
Whoever told Dave about the boat is a good question.  If it was Dompig's son then my BS antennas go up even more.  Very little in this case is as it appears.  After spending 3 years in the Shango thread and reading and rereading all the posts and PVs and whatever else I can find or that is sent my way, there is one definite conclusion I can draw and that is that there is a motive for everything that was said or done those first few weeks.  When corruption is so prevalent there is a small sliver of truth in each word, but much more BS around the truth that has to be sorted.

Remember the discussion in Shango about Joran giving Michael a ride, on one of Joran's return trips to Aruba, and getting mad at him about what he said about GVC. The whole episode didn't make much sense...Well it would if Joran was mad about what Michael told Dave about Paulus and a boat...



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 11:08:03 AM
Whoever told Dave about the boat is a good question.  If it was Dompig's son then my BS antennas go up even more.  Very little in this case is as it appears.  After spending 3 years in the Shango thread and reading and rereading all the posts and PVs and whatever else I can find or that is sent my way, there is one definite conclusion I can draw and that is that there is a motive for everything that was said or done those first few weeks.  When corruption is so prevalent there is a small sliver of truth in each word, but much more BS around the truth that has to be sorted.

I agree on the boat.  It's a good question and if it was Dompig's son, the possibility of the Gottenboes' boat used decline greatly.

Yes, there seems to have been a "motive for everything that was said or done those first few weeks."  I do think some truths escaped, but were quickly covered by propaganda.  I'd say there was a sliver of truth in (maybe) half; and, would include that there were times when we were led off into unrelated areas having nothing to do with the case.  It's still difficult to know fact from fiction.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 25, 2008, 11:38:43 AM
Good morning everyone, and WELCOME to our new monkeys!

ARUBA - Dave Holloway
Pages 118-119

snip
There are several people in the equation to consider besides the three boys and the father.  There are also seemingly well-connected people who have been passing on leads and dropping hints.  Sometime in early July 2005, Robin and I saw Deputy Police Commissioner Gerald Dompig's son and another young man who appeared to have similar descriptive features of Steve Croes, the Tattoo party boat disc jockey who had been arrested and released, trying to pick up a girl in the Holiday Inn lobby hallway and get her to go to Carlos'n Charlie's.  The girl was offering resistance and trying to distance herself from those two.  As the guys were walking by, young Dompig noticed me and immediately discontinued his activity.  The other kid realized he was getting nowhere with the girl and started in on another set of young women.  I walked up to Dompig, and he seemed a little embarrassed that we had witnessed his actions.  He then started talking about the case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had heard that Paulus van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat on either the night of Natalee's disappearance or the next day and that he was allegedly involved with Natalee's murder.  That brought to mind one of Joran's statements.  He had referred to a friend by the name of Koen Gottenbos.  Apparently, this friend's father owned a boat.  The message was that this boat was used to take Natalee out to sea.  Another boat that was also mentioned by him was the Pair A Dice, which is a local boat from Aruba.
snip


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 25, 2008, 11:44:45 AM
Thanks texasmom....I knew it was in the book, as I have read it many, many times and now I do not have to look it up...hehe. Thanks!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 25, 2008, 11:50:55 AM

You're welcome Nut!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 12:04:29 PM
Thanks, texasmom.  I didn't think it was in the book.  Glad you posted that.

So, Michael mentions Paulus/boat, and Joran states about Gottenboes/boat. 

Now, there are two credible sources!   ::MonkeyNoNo::   ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 12:20:10 PM
Thanks, texasmom.  I didn't think it was in the book.  Glad you posted that.

So, Michael mentions Paulus/boat, and Joran states about Gottenboes/boat. 

Now, there are two credible sources!   ::MonkeyNoNo::   ::MonkeyLaugh::

And Sander mentioned boat...Probably means no boat at all. So where were they when the family arrived? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 12:23:53 PM
Boat, or no boat, they were most likely on burial detail the night the family arrived.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 12:39:00 PM
Good morning everyone, and WELCOME to our new monkeys!

ARUBA - Dave Holloway
Pages 118-119

snip
There are several people in the equation to consider besides the three boys and the father.  There are also seemingly well-connected people who have been passing on leads and dropping hints.  Sometime in early July 2005, Robin and I saw Deputy Police Commissioner Gerald Dompig's son and another young man who appeared to have similar descriptive features of Steve Croes, the Tattoo party boat disc jockey who had been arrested and released, trying to pick up a girl in the Holiday Inn lobby hallway and get her to go to Carlos'n Charlie's.  The girl was offering resistance and trying to distance herself from those two.  As the guys were walking by, young Dompig noticed me and immediately discontinued his activity.  The other kid realized he was getting nowhere with the girl and started in on another set of young women.  I walked up to Dompig, and he seemed a little embarrassed that we had witnessed his actions.  He then started talking about the case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had heard that Paulus van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat on either the night of Natalee's disappearance or the next day and that he was allegedly involved with Natalee's murder.  That brought to mind one of Joran's statements.  He had referred to a friend by the name of Koen Gottenbos.  Apparently, this friend's father owned a boat.  The message was that this boat was used to take Natalee out to sea.  Another boat that was also mentioned by him was the Pair A Dice, which is a local boat from Aruba.
snip

We talked a lot about the gym bag and Joran not playing tennis and who he did or did not play with, and him walking to the beach to look for his shoes and on and on.  Did we ever pursue what Paulus was doing during this time that Joran says he wanted to be on camera in the casino?   He says he dropped his son off at the Racquet Club and then......................................What?  Nothing until the Twittys show up? 



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 12:42:09 PM
As I finished posting about Paulus's whereabouts, I realize that this case was so solveable back then.  Cell and home phone records of Paulus, e-mails, following up with those he and Joran spoke to.  Along with grabbing the Kalpoe car and the clothes of J2K in the first 24 hours, you'd definitely have a case.  No need for secret police car tapes and all that.  Makes  me so mad.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 25, 2008, 12:50:11 PM
Boat, or no boat, they were most likely on burial detail the night the family arrived.

In Deepaks car, IIRC before the carpet and other stuff was replaced at the shop. 

Wonder what they would have found if they'd checked that car when the MB group/ALE arrived early in the morning?

Maybe she left a note or something behind?

Also, if she was in the car, the body would have been stored somewhere before disposal.  I wonder why PVDS didn't allow a search of the grounds?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 12:54:38 PM
A current theory is:

That it was an uncomplicated crime of kidnap, rape, which became more complicated in the coverup.

On the night of Monday, May 30th, there was a meeting around the pool to inform of the plan.  Simple plan: deny, (if that doesn't work) then use the HI story.

During the meeting, the group was tipped off that the family was on their way.  The burial detail took Natalee out to the dunes.  [4 sweaty boys and a shovel]

They couldn't (safely) bury her prior to the evening/night of Mon/Tues because of rigor and daylight.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 01:05:15 PM
If the sighting of the 4 boys with a shovel corresponds with the location of the cop putting something in the trunk (seen by Dave) then, (mo) the theory is more workable.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 01:16:39 PM
I think that ALE didn't know initially that Joran and one or more others had actually done harm.  No doubt Joran lied about it to them also.  As the truth started to unfold --injuries to Natalee, blood in the Kalpoe car, bruises or other physical evidence of a struggle on J2K, the gardener who saw them near the pond -- van der Straaten and Jacobs realized they'd have to disappear Natalee and say there was no evidence of a crime.  I do think that as Paulus advised Joran of what ALE, the FBI or P.I's were finding, the story had to keep changing to take that evidence into account.  Which is another reason for so many stories, slightly altered as circumstances dictated.  I used to get a little emotional, if you will, when I saw repeated posts of THERE'S ABSOLUTELY  NO EVIDENCE.   To those who still say that, I say bulldoodie.  There's plenty of evidence; we just don't know what they did with it.  Maybe it was burned, maybe it's in the trunk of someone's car or a storage locker, kept for leverage when needed later.  If the media hadn't been there to see what was happening, the cries of a coverup would have fallen on deaf ears. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 25, 2008, 01:18:06 PM
O/T

For those following the Caylee Anthony case, there's a new 9-1-1 (the third) tape being released. Coming up on Fox. They've played the first portion.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 01:21:30 PM
If the sighting of the 4 boys with a shovel corresponds with the location of the cop putting something in the trunk (seen by Dave) then, (mo) the theory is more workable.


In the same early report where van der Straaten tells a Dutch reporter that he believes Natalee is dead because "I know mo:re about the case than you [the reporter] do" (or something to that effect), one or more Aruban detectives told that Dutch reporter that they thought it was a rape gone bad at the Lighthouse.  That's why I don't discount the Kalpoes sticking with their story of going to the Lighthouse, even though we have Joran saying they went to his house at 1:40 a.m.  Could be Joran didn't want anyone looking at the area of he Lighthouse.  In fact, the family was discouraged from searching around the Lighthouse -- bad for tourism. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 01:22:54 PM
O/T

For those following the Caylee Anthony case, there's a new 9-1-1 (the third) tape being released. Coming up on Fox. They've played the first portion.

Thanks, I was just going to log off and eat lunch.  I'll turn the tube on. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: marebear on July 25, 2008, 01:32:48 PM
A current theory is:

That it was an uncomplicated crime of kidnap, rape, which became more complicated in the coverup.

On the night of Monday, May 30th, there was a meeting around the pool to inform of the plan.  Simple plan: deny, (if that doesn't work) then use the HI story.

During the meeting, the group was tipped off that the family was on their way.  The burial detail took Natalee out to the dunes.  [4 sweaty boys and a shovel]

They couldn't (safely) bury her prior to the evening/night of Mon/Tues because of rigor and daylight.

An old theory that has resurfaced.   Simple is usually the way it is, until people start lying.  Back to Occam's Razor... "entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity" or "All other things being equal, the simplest solution is the best."


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 01:39:47 PM
Puma, I agree that there is evidence and there would truthful tidbits. 

[Loving Natalee, page 59]
"Jug, Jodi, and I arrive at Bubali at eight o'clock sharp.  One of the first things I notice is Deepak Kalpoe's silver-gray car parked in the back."

Tuesday morning, they had DK's car; by Wednesday night they had changed Beth's statement.

I don't think the gardner made a statement until the middle of July.  The gardner statement we have refers to an earlier one that I didn't see.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 02:00:56 PM
If the sighting of the 4 boys with a shovel corresponds with the location of the cop putting something in the trunk (seen by Dave) then, (mo) the theory is more workable.


In the same early report where van der Straaten tells a Dutch reporter that he believes Natalee is dead because "I know mo:re about the case than you [the reporter] do" (or something to that effect), one or more Aruban detectives told that Dutch reporter that they thought it was a rape gone bad at the Lighthouse.  That's why I don't discount the Kalpoes sticking with their story of going to the Lighthouse, even though we have Joran saying they went to his house at 1:40 a.m.  Could be Joran didn't want anyone looking at the area of he Lighthouse.  In fact, the family was discouraged from searching around the Lighthouse -- bad for tourism. 

[Loving Natalee, page 49]

". . .Joran resumes his story.  He says he and Natalee were in the backseat of Deepak's car and that she asked to go see the sharks.  He says he told her that they don't have sharks here, but she insisted.  So he says they took her to the lighthouse, . . ."

The above was while the Family Group was in front of the Sloots during the early morning hours of Tues., May 31st--only a short time after the Family Group arrived on the island.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 25, 2008, 02:08:23 PM
Has anyone heard anymore of the supposed "new" confession on tape of Joran??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 02:18:53 PM
The Honda, seen at Bubali on Tues. morning, makes me wonder where DK was.  Satish thinks DK got home around 6 am.

A little while later, Beth is outside and Jan makes her go back into the police station.

Jan didn't want Beth to see someone, or something?  Was it only the car, or was there more to it?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 02:19:06 PM
Has anyone heard anymore of the supposed "new" confession on tape of Joran??

You mean the one that Bondia spoke of yesterday or the day before?  NO..haven't heard anything else about it.  Hopefully if true there will be something in the Dutch papers about it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 25, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
Boat, or no boat, they were most likely on burial detail the night the family arrived.

In Deepaks car, IIRC before the carpet and other stuff was replaced at the shop. 

Wonder what they would have found if they'd checked that car when the MB group/ALE arrived early in the morning?

Maybe she left a note or something behind?

Also, if she was in the car, the body would have been stored somewhere before disposal.  I wonder why PVDS didn't allow a search of the grounds?

IMO, Natalee didn't have much time or many resources.  It's said she had the keycard, $50, and an ID/driver's license.  Looks like she had earrings, the blue bracelet, and another bracelet; but, I couldn't see a watch.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: kkate on July 25, 2008, 03:07:08 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.
Is this what you are looking for? (you were missing the "s" in webshots.com)

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435318429072055610iqNtJz

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/365649721ZfllRc

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD

This one is very interesting     
http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 25, 2008, 03:27:23 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.
Is this what you are looking for? (you were missing the "s" in webshots.com)

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435318429072055610iqNtJz

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/365649721ZfllRc

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD

This one is very interesting     
http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU)

Yes, that photo has been viewed and posted here several times.  GVC - center, Cheremy & Steve Croes on the right, if I'm not mistaken.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 03:35:32 PM
Wreck - I still cant get that link to work if you have time will you do this for me - go to Webshots - click on good times - type in abscompton and then go down to crystal and danille at Carlos and Charlies ----Thanks so much.
Is this what you are looking for? (you were missing the "s" in webshots.com)

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435318429072055610iqNtJz

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/365649721ZfllRc

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1365662025072055610uWVhVD

This one is very interesting     
http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/1435321057072055610iqzPDU)

As I Look Through The Photo's And See They're in C&C...I Can't Help But Think Of How Lucky They were Not To Have Left With j2k.....I Wish Natalee Never Had. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 25, 2008, 04:09:49 PM
Am really, really, really hoping that Mr. Peter DeVries KNOWS that such a large group of PERVERTED DUTCHMEN & DUTCHWOMEN are involved in this cover-up & the complicity of kidnapping, rape & murder.  From the Dutch wannabe's involved from the Government Offices of LieRuba, the Netherland placed Justice Officials, attorney's & parents.

Am really, really, really hoping the whole worthless rotten group of them go down here on this earth cuz I KNOW they are going down, down, down when their souls are for eternity damned.

This kind of evil, if not stopped, increases.  It really is in the best interest of any community, regardless what country to actively oppose such evil as it encourage tribal hate, which leads to horrific circumstances & is then much more difficult to contain & put to a stop.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 25, 2008, 04:37:32 PM
Boat, or no boat, they were most likely on burial detail the night the family arrived.

In Deepaks car, IIRC before the carpet and other stuff was replaced at the shop. 

Wonder what they would have found if they'd checked that car when the MB group/ALE arrived early in the morning?

Maybe she left a note or something behind?

Also, if she was in the car, the body would have been stored somewhere before disposal.  I wonder why PVDS didn't allow a search of the grounds?

IMO, Natalee didn't have much time or many resources.  It's said she had the keycard, $50, and an ID/driver's license.  Looks like she had earrings, the blue bracelet, and another bracelet; but, I couldn't see a watch.

If they had checked the car earlier, it is possible she may have lost or misplaced something.  They chose not to look.  People leave things in taxis all the time, that 's what I was thinking.  Ex., they would know she didn't have her drivers license after that because it lost in the seat cushions of the Kalpoe vehicle.  Same with money and the other stuff.  I would have thought they would have checked to ensure that there weren't any clues, but they didn't.

If she had left behind her keycard, she may not have been able to get into her hotel.  Or, someone could have gotten into the hotel with the lost card.

Just random thoughts.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 05:47:56 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 25, 2008, 05:50:17 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.

Hi,

I don't get the *arrow* part of your post...

Destiny


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 05:51:43 PM
I have always thought the Racquet Club was a key element in this case. All the sightings, meetings and the many references to the Racquet Club in the PVs., including employees being questioned. There was construction going on at the Club and Joran, Guido, Freddy, Andre and Sander all had ties to tennis. Even Satish and Deepak had a connection to a drowned tennis coach!…(we tried to work out which one in the Shango thread, but it depended which article you read…LOL)

Was all this Racquet Club reference a diversion as well? Why believe this part of the PVs and not other parts. Then how credible was “gardener witness”? Just who is Jorge Porras Sanches, mentioned in the Dr Phil Log? Is this the Holiday Inn/Racquet Club tennis pro, Sanchez, or the kid that Caps alluded to, Sanches? IIRC there was a Rodriguez connection to that kid. What of his did he request ALE return to him? And why did ALE have something of his? If the Racquet Club was a diversion, why even have a record of Jorge’s request?

More questions…More reading….


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 25, 2008, 05:57:37 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.

Hi,

I don't get the *arrow* part of your post...

Destiny
(the arrow points to igs' avatar)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 25, 2008, 06:02:01 PM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Well, if not involved, it was pretty "in your face" of Sander to be at Joran's prison release, holding a sign.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 06:07:53 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.

Hi,

I don't get the *arrow* part of your post...

Destiny

Igsigs is saying that PVDS is Daury  ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 06:18:07 PM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Well, if not involved, it was pretty "in your face" of Sander to be at Joran's prison release, holding a sign.


Good point, Buckeye...had forgotten that.  Thanks!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 06:27:02 PM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Well, if not involved, it was pretty "in your face" of Sander to be at Joran's prison release, holding a sign.

I remember Dave saying that Koen was very nervous when being asked about Joran and Natalee.  That's why he wanted Dompig to talk to Koen himself.  he didn't want it messed up.  The assistant D.A. that resigned from the case and talked to Dave might have been the source of the boat and Koen.  I believe she wanted ALE to talk with him again and they refused.  Hard to remember that far back, but maybe this will job another monkey memory.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 25, 2008, 06:28:07 PM
Uh, that's supposed to be JOG another monkey's memory


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on July 25, 2008, 06:35:43 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.

Hi,

I don't get the *arrow* part of your post...

Destiny

Igsigs is saying that PVDS is Daury  ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thanks Klaas...excuse me while I find my *dunce* hat......

Des


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 25, 2008, 06:41:19 PM
Nancy Grace for July 26, 2005, CNNHN

Aired July 26, 2005 - 20:00:00 

Quote
...But first to WBMA reporter, Anastasiya Bolton. Anastasiya, bring us up-to-date, friend.

ANASTASIYA BOLTON, WBMA REPORTER COVERING STORY: Nancy, investigators in Aruba are draining the pond of a racket club as we speak. That just started moments ago. That information came from a gardener at the racket club who gave sworn statements to police over the weekend saying that he saw Joran Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers in that car near the racket club at 2:30 in the morning the night Natalee Holloway disappeared.

Why they`re draining the pond, what they hope to find there? Sources tell us they may find a body there. They`re looking for a body there. That`s the latest from here.

GRACE: I want to quickly go to David Wohl. David, I`ve had cases where bodies were found in water, where we looked for evidence, for clues in water. Very, very difficult. You and I watched it in court in the Laci Peterson case, how difficult that is to find evidence in water.

Have you ever observed a body of water actually being drained or dredged?

DAVID WOHL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, Nancy, I haven`t. But I mean, you know what happens to bodies. We know what happened to Laci Peterson after she was in the water of San Francisco Bay for a while. There generally isn`t much left. That`s why DNA evidence is so critical here. I`m sure it will be here.

However, I don`t hold out a lot of hope. That gardener said he saw a car resembling the car that the boys were driving. And I don`t think the identification has been overly particular in this case.

So I got my fingers crossed for Natalee`s family, but I don`t know at this point. We`ll have to wait and see. It doesn`t seem to be certain.

GRACE: Well, I don`t know about you, but when he said -- when this gardener said -- correct me if I`m wrong and just jump in -- he saw not only the car parked over to the side of the road, because he nearly ran into it, but also, when he looked at the car, and the lights came around, Joran Van Der Sloot tried to hide his face, and the two Kalpoe brothers ducked down in the back of the seat.

Now, I don`t know about you, Anastasiya, but when I see people in a car all ducking down, that makes me look even more.

BOLTON: Nancy, all I can say that he gave sworn statements to police that he saw the three men that looked like the Kalpoe brothers and Joran Van Der Sloot in that car. So far, police tell us that his story is checking out, unlike Joran Van Der Sloot who, at this point, they say has given them 22 different accounts of what happened the night that Natalee Holloway disappeared.


Quote
GRACE: So we`re going to give people a gold star, extra credit for hiding the body?

Hold on, very quickly to the editor of "Diario," joining us from Aruba, Jossy Mansur. Sir, thank you for being with us. I want to find out more about this gardener. What do you think of his story?

JOSSY MANSUR, EDITOR, "DIARIO": I`m totally convinced he`s telling the truth. He has no reason to invent a story. He`s not after money. The reward posts don`t say -- do not specify any reward for just any information of the three suspects.

I mean, the information is for Natalee being found alive, $1 million, or any information leading to the location -- or, in other words, to finding this girl in whatever shape she`s in, that`s $100,000. So he`s not after money.


Quote
...Back to Anastasiya Bolton. I want to go back to this gardener, because this is the first real lead we`ve gotten, other than Natalee was last seen with a judge`s son -- all we see of this judge, as I said many times, is his back side whenever we try to ask him questions -- and these other two, the Kalpoe brothers.

This is the first real lead we`ve gotten. And I want to ask you, Anastasiya, isn`t it true that, with the new arrangement with the FBI, the FBI got to sit in during his interrogation of this gardener?

BOLTON: My understanding is that the FBI is, indeed, now able to sit in on the interrogations. And, more importantly, as I understand it, they will be able to sit in on the interrogations of Joran Van Der Sloot.

They`re not able to ask questions, but the FBI is able to take a more active role in the investigation.

GRACE: And very quickly, Jossy, before we go break -- everyone, Jossy Mansur is with us. He is the editor of "Diario" there in Aruba. You say this guy, this gardener, has no reason to lie. And also, the circumstances of the way he saw these three, allegedly, how they all ducked down in the back of the car, and tried to hide their faces, why, Jossy, would they feel they had to hide their faces and hide, that they were parked there near that racket club?

MANSUR: Because they were trying to hide their faces at that the hour, because we have to remember that the two Kalpoe brothers and Joran held on to the statement that they dropped Joran off at the beach and then went home. But here we have someone that says categorically that they did not go home, they were in the car with Joran. Joran was sitting in the driver`s seat.

GRACE: And very quickly, as we go to break, Dr. Patricia Saunders, the fact that they were trying to hide from somebody they didn`t even know, I find highly, highly probative.

DR. PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, it screams to consciousness of guilt, as does Mr. Joran changing his stories 22-plus times.


Quote
I want to go straight back to the editor of "Diario." He is with us from Aruba tonight, Jossy Mansur.

Now, Mr. Mansur, it`s my understanding that you actually found the gardener and had him go to authorities with his story.

MANSUR: That is correct, because we were searching for him for three- and-a-half weeks after we heard the rumor about the domino game in prison. And then we wanted to know his identity. And we searched and searched with a team that we have investigating this, Eduardo Mansur (ph) and (INAUDIBLE) and they finally found him last Friday.

And they did a lot of talking to him and reassured him that the paper will stand behind him, as well as nothing the police -- the police aren`t going to do anything to him. So he was finally convinced to go to the police.

He went at 7:00 at night. And he laid off his sworn testimony and signed it that same night.

GRACE: Now, what domino game behind bars?

MANSUR: That there was a domino game behind bars in which one of the Kalpoe brothers participated. And one other player in there yelled at him, "Listen, my gardener saw you at the racket club that early morning that Natalee disappeared."

He got very white. He threw the dominoes on the table and walked away. So that rumor started to filter out, because there were many other people present around that domino table. We found out about it. And we started a search for this gardener.


GRACE: Well, Jossy Mansur, that is a heck of a story. And apparently he is believable because, as we speak, the pond near where the gardener says he saw Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers parked around 2:30 a.m. near this racket club is being drained.

Back to Jossy Mansur with "Diario." Tell me about the gardener. Who did he work for? Why did he happen to be there that night at 2:30 a.m.? And how close was the car to this pond?

MANSUR: You know, he`s a gardener of a friend of ours that we know very well. And that night, it was very hot in his apartment, as it has been hot all this week in Aruba. And he left his own apartment to go this house where he works as a gardener, where he has an air-conditioned room.

And when he passed by the racket club, there was a car blocking the road. It`s a dirt road that goes around where the water is being drained now. And for him to be able to pass this car, he had to climb a little mount that was by the car.

He was very close to it, less than a yard away. And when he looked inside the car, he saw these three people that he identified was the many folders that have come out in the "Diario."

GRACE: And when he saw the three of them, what, if anything, did they do?

MANSUR: One of them -- the one that was sitting behind the driver`s seat, which was Joran, threw his hands across his face to hide from him. And the other two ducked.

GRACE: The other two were in the back seat?

MANSUR: One in the back seat, one in the front seat. Both ducked, so as not to be seen by him.

GRACE: And how close was this car to this pond that is being drained as we speak?

MANSUR: Very close. Very close. A few yards away.

GRACE: I want to go back to that domino game you told us about. We`re showing video right now, Mr. Mansur, of the pond. It is being drained right now, based largely on what this gardener has told police there in Aruba. It`s going down right now.

Back to this domino game. Who was playing dominoes with the Kalpoe brother, and how did you find out about it?

MANSUR: Because his gardener told him through his father. He`s a young fellow. His father visits him in jail. He`s there for the possession of some kind of illegal arm, nothing serious. And then they were playing there with four people, four people play domino. And some onlookers around them.

And then this happened when he confronted Kalpoe, one of the Kalpoe brothers with this fact. Then the guy got mad. He became pale, threw the dominoes, and walked away. So it`s an abnormal reaction to some kind of finger-pointing at him.


Quote
GRACE: Jossy, question about the pond. What in the gardener`s statement has led police to drain this pond?

MANSUR: The fact that he identified these three suspects in the Kalpoe`s car at that hour, between 2:30 and 3:00, at that particular place. We have to remember that Joran is a member of the racket clubs. He knows that area very well, from the palm of his hand.

And we have to remember also that Joran confessed to the police on the 13th of June that, at 2:00 that same morning, he went to the beach to the north of the Marriott Hotel with Natalee.

GRACE: So he is a member, his family is a member, of the racket club. And we`ve caught him in another lie, bottom line.

MANSUR: Of course, we caught him in a lie, because, not only him, but the Kalpoe brothers also, because they claim they dropped him off there at 2:00 and then went home.

But they were with him, because in a further statement to the police on the 13th of June, Joran said that Deepak Kalpoe walked back to the beach where he had left Natalee asleep and then he didn`t hear anything more. Then, at the end, when the police asked him what he thought happened between Deepak and Natalee, he said, "I think he raped her and then murdered her."

This is from the police records.

GRACE: Joran Van Der Sloot said a Kalpoe brother raped her and murdered her?

MANSUR: Yes, he said that of Deepak. He mentioned Deepak in that statement.


Quote
GRACE: Well, you have been saying that from the get-go, along with the rest of Natalee`s family.

Back to Jossy Mansur, the editor of "Diario." We understand tonight that Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, has changed his story up to 22 times. What are the different stories, Jossy, that he has given?

MANSUR: From what I understand, he gives varied answers to the same questions, but not with too much of a difference, but he keeps changing. For example, on one time, he says to the police that he left the girl on the beach and went away because she wanted to walk back to the hotel, the Holiday Inn. On another occasion, he said that he left her asleep there. Then on another occasion, he said that she got sick and he left her on the beach. So it keeps changing, but not with a variation that is very noticeable.

GRACE: Jossy, didn`t at one point he said he left her at the Holiday Inn and she was walking in and stumbled, and two -- a security guard tried to help her? Then later, he said he left her at the Marriott out on the beach?

MANSUR: Oh, the story goes on and on and on. Sure. He said that -- the first time that they spoke about this was that they left her at the Holiday Inn. She got out of the car and she stumbled. Two security guards came over. He even described the uniforms that they had. That`s why these two people were picked up by the police for questioning and then released, because they were innocent. But he keeps changing his story all the time, with some variations.

Quote
GRACE: This is what I don`t understand, Jossy Mansur. With an allegation like that by Joran Van Der Sloot, even though he`s a liar, why did they let the Deepak -- the Kalpoe brothers go?

MANSUR: Oh, that`s the $64,000 question. It`s been going on and on in my mind also. I don`t think they should have let them go. I`ve said that many times before. I think should have been held -- at least Deepak should have been held in custody and questioned and questioned all over again.

And I can confirm that Joran said this about Deepak. I can confirm it because there are police records that have it. It`s signed -- these records are signed by four officers present when he made that statement, under oath.

GRACE: And Jossy, how have you learned what is the content of the police records? I thought prosecutors were keeping them so secret.


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/26/ng.01.html

a few notes about the pond and gardener


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 06:42:05 PM
<---------------------------------- "Daury"




Guido and Joran returned to Sloot house monday evening - after Paulus bag drop off. Or during bag drop. You decide. They haven't.

Hi,

I don't get the *arrow* part of your post...

Destiny

Igsigs is saying that PVDS is Daury  ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thanks Klaas...excuse me while I find my *dunce* hat......

Des


I didn't get it either Destiny... ::MonkeyHaHa::



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 25, 2008, 06:47:21 PM
Am really, really, really hoping that Mr. Peter DeVries KNOWS that such a large group of PERVERTED DUTCHMEN & DUTCHWOMEN are involved in this cover-up & the complicity of kidnapping, rape & murder.  From the Dutch wannabe's involved from the Government Offices of LieRuba, the Netherland placed Justice Officials, attorney's & parents.

Am really, really, really hoping the whole worthless rotten group of them go down here on this earth cuz I KNOW they are going down, down, down when their souls are for eternity damned.

This kind of evil, if not stopped, increases.  It really is in the best interest of any community, regardless what country to actively oppose such evil as it encourage tribal hate, which leads to horrific circumstances & is then much more difficult to contain & put to a stop.

i wouldn't exclude the possibility that there are also american expats. included in this group you're describing.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 25, 2008, 06:51:03 PM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Well, if not involved, it was pretty "in your face" of Sander to be at Joran's prison release, holding a sign.

I remember Dave saying that Koen was very nervous when being asked about Joran and Natalee.  That's why he wanted Dompig to talk to Koen himself.  he didn't want it messed up.  The assistant D.A. that resigned from the case and talked to Dave might have been the source of the boat and Koen.  I believe she wanted ALE to talk with him again and they refused.  Hard to remember that far back, but maybe this will job another monkey memory.

FROM DAVE'S BOOK:

While still in Aruba, I found out that there was a prosecutor named Amalin Flanegan who had resigned from Natalee's case about a month into it.  She had worked along with Karin Janssen, and she has to report to Theresa Crose Vernandez-Pedra, the attorney general.  I wanted to know why she had residend.  Art and I met with Ms. Flanegan at a local restaurant, and she seemed very apprehensive.  We told her how we felt about the way the investigation was going, how the evidence had been dealt with, Dennis Jacob's handling of the interviews, and that there were important things missing.  We explained how we were first told that there was blood in Deepak's car.  Then, there was no blood in the car. The seat had been cut out of  the  car, and it tested positive for Blood.  Ten, is supposedly tested positive for chocolate syrup and c leaning fluid.   But the prime minister had said that it was definitely blood, and a police officer that Art talked to said it tested positive for blood.  Art also told Ms. Flanegan about how the police disregarded the evidence of the belt that was found that was similar to the one Joran had used on his Web site nad the pieces of plastic dovered near the same area.

{Skipping part}

I also had to give some serious thought to Karin Janssen, the prosecutor.  She has been in charge of the prosecution on Natalee's case and, to date, not one of her efforts have been successful.

Art and I talked to Ms. Flanegan about all of the red flags that we were seeing and that we thought that Koen, Joran, and Deepak took Natalee out in the boat.  She agreed with that theory. She added that the reason she had left the case was because she thought Koen was lying, and when she asked the police to reinterview him, they refused.  We told her that we were going to talk to the prime minister the next day to lay it all out.

I then contacted Dompig to talk to him about my thoughts on Dennis Jacobs, but he was very supportive of him. I asked Dompig to do the interview of Koen instead of having Jacobs do it. I became concerned because he said he would have to discuss it with Jacobs first. Several weeks later, I heard that Koen's father had been interviewed, but Koen had not been questioned yet. I wondered if they were prepping the father to prep his son for questioning. That was something that seemed all to familiar.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 07:02:00 PM
Am really, really, really hoping that Mr. Peter DeVries KNOWS that such a large group of PERVERTED DUTCHMEN & DUTCHWOMEN are involved in this cover-up & the complicity of kidnapping, rape & murder.  From the Dutch wannabe's involved from the Government Offices of LieRuba, the Netherland placed Justice Officials, attorney's & parents.

Am really, really, really hoping the whole worthless rotten group of them go down here on this earth cuz I KNOW they are going down, down, down when their souls are for eternity damned.

This kind of evil, if not stopped, increases.  It really is in the best interest of any community, regardless what country to actively oppose such evil as it encourage tribal hate, which leads to horrific circumstances & is then much more difficult to contain & put to a stop.

i wouldn't exclude the possibility that there are also american expats. included in this group you're describing.
dennisintn

I would have thought that the FBI would have been able to question the expats without the OK of ALE, after all they are American citizens. The ones that come to mind are the Zeollas...were you looking after Sebastian, while his mother was in the Netherlands? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 07:12:52 PM
Am really, really, really hoping that Mr. Peter DeVries KNOWS that such a large group of PERVERTED DUTCHMEN & DUTCHWOMEN are involved in this cover-up & the complicity of kidnapping, rape & murder.  From the Dutch wannabe's involved from the Government Offices of LieRuba, the Netherland placed Justice Officials, attorney's & parents.

Am really, really, really hoping the whole worthless rotten group of them go down here on this earth cuz I KNOW they are going down, down, down when their souls are for eternity damned.

This kind of evil, if not stopped, increases.  It really is in the best interest of any community, regardless what country to actively oppose such evil as it encourage tribal hate, which leads to horrific circumstances & is then much more difficult to contain & put to a stop.


I Couldn't Agree More. I Am Hoping that Peter DeVries Will Keep On His Mission And Bring Justice For Natalee. Whoever Were Involved Has Gotten away With it For Far too long.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 25, 2008, 07:21:39 PM
Hi Mum
About time you got back in the cage!  I think the Gottenbos were way too smart to get caught in the middle of this mess.  Just because the Sloots knew them doesn't mean they ran in the same circles. Sander admits he invited Joran on the boat that day...so that places Sander and not Koen in contact with Joran.  Dave was led to Koen in some way, of which I have forgotten by now, concerning the boat.  Who told him that?  Was it another diversion? Was the daddy Gottenbos angry that Sander left the boat there and Joran used it?  There is a reason that PV has the story of Joran being seasick and not going on the boat.  There is also a reason Sander said what he did about Joran going or not going on the boat.  There are too many details that lead me to think another diversion of some sort.  But then again I am skeptical of most anything that comes out of Aruba by now. Thoughts anyone?

Well, if not involved, it was pretty "in your face" of Sander to be at Joran's prison release, holding a sign.

I remember Dave saying that Koen was very nervous when being asked about Joran and Natalee.  That's why he wanted Dompig to talk to Koen himself.  he didn't want it messed up.  The assistant D.A. that resigned from the case and talked to Dave might have been the source of the boat and Koen.  I believe she wanted ALE to talk with him again and they refused.  Hard to remember that far back, but maybe this will job another monkey memory.

I don't remember Koen ever talking to anyone, I think he still hiding in Mommy bed. (spelling)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 25, 2008, 07:23:59 PM
From an old RWV thread -

Sunday, July 24, 2005
Natalee Holloway Discussion 69

Quote
Greetings, Forum Participants!

Contrary to what the Aruba PM said, some officials on Aruba have already made it perfectly clear that the USA FBI will not get "to look at everything," as they did the last time the PM pledged "cooperation" with the FBI.

American governmental agencies have to be sensitive to the wishes of other nation's authorities, especially when they are working out of country in their jurisdiction and need their cooperation.

T. J. Ward and his people do not have to be as "sensitive," and they seem to be adequately covered by the PM's very carefully worded statement, apparently giving them legal protection from the Aruba Polis.

It's going to be a long, hot Summer on Aruba.

:)

Posted by: AbleAdvocateDAN | July 24, 2005 09:27 AM

Quote
Billy,

that could work

However the part that gets me, why would JVDS father get involved?

If she died in Deepak's car, then its Deepak's burden to bear.

I dont see PVDS sweating for her dying in Deepak's car (whether accidental or murder)

Deepak's dad or even stepfather hasnt been in the limelight only PVDS


I dont see even the Aruba Police dragging their feet on this case unless someone of porminence is involved. Enter judgetobe PVDS

Rape is less than death of unknown cause

People with nothing to hide hide nothing

Posted by: seedyrum | July 24, 2005 09:32 AM

Quote
popa was involved with her at the house....

why haven't sloots killed the monkey yet?

popa knows what jurine did and dpak can prove it, maybe with his cam pics?
not hard to hide a memory stick from a forensics team...hid in moms feminine napkins. Dpak wont go down w/o taking all involved. think logical, think simple, none of these guys are going to be working for Nasa or Arbitron.

Posted by: billy | July 24, 2005 09:37 AM



I wonder if they took any memory sticks as evidence?  Anyone remember?  It seems like young people use these all the time.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 25, 2008, 07:28:42 PM
Nancy Grace for July 26, 2005, CNNHN

Aired July 26, 2005 - 20:00:00 

Quote
...But first to WBMA reporter, Anastasiya Bolton. Anastasiya, bring us up-to-date, friend.

ANASTASIYA BOLTON, WBMA REPORTER COVERING STORY: Nancy, investigators in Aruba are draining the pond of a racket club as we speak. That just started moments ago. That information came from a gardener at the racket club who gave sworn statements to police over the weekend saying that he saw Joran Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers in that car near the racket club at 2:30 in the morning the night Natalee Holloway disappeared.

Why they`re draining the pond, what they hope to find there? Sources tell us they may find a body there. They`re looking for a body there. That`s the latest from here.

GRACE: I want to quickly go to David Wohl. David, I`ve had cases where bodies were found in water, where we looked for evidence, for clues in water. Very, very difficult. You and I watched it in court in the Laci Peterson case, how difficult that is to find evidence in water.

Have you ever observed a body of water actually being drained or dredged?

DAVID WOHL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, Nancy, I haven`t. But I mean, you know what happens to bodies. We know what happened to Laci Peterson after she was in the water of San Francisco Bay for a while. There generally isn`t much left. That`s why DNA evidence is so critical here. I`m sure it will be here.

However, I don`t hold out a lot of hope. That gardener said he saw a car resembling the car that the boys were driving. And I don`t think the identification has been overly particular in this case.

So I got my fingers crossed for Natalee`s family, but I don`t know at this point. We`ll have to wait and see. It doesn`t seem to be certain.

GRACE: Well, I don`t know about you, but when he said -- when this gardener said -- correct me if I`m wrong and just jump in -- he saw not only the car parked over to the side of the road, because he nearly ran into it, but also, when he looked at the car, and the lights came around, Joran Van Der Sloot tried to hide his face, and the two Kalpoe brothers ducked down in the back of the seat.

Now, I don`t know about you, Anastasiya, but when I see people in a car all ducking down, that makes me look even more.

BOLTON: Nancy, all I can say that he gave sworn statements to police that he saw the three men that looked like the Kalpoe brothers and Joran Van Der Sloot in that car. So far, police tell us that his story is checking out, unlike Joran Van Der Sloot who, at this point, they say has given them 22 different accounts of what happened the night that Natalee Holloway disappeared.


Quote
GRACE: So we`re going to give people a gold star, extra credit for hiding the body?

Hold on, very quickly to the editor of "Diario," joining us from Aruba, Jossy Mansur. Sir, thank you for being with us. I want to find out more about this gardener. What do you think of his story?

JOSSY MANSUR, EDITOR, "DIARIO": I`m totally convinced he`s telling the truth. He has no reason to invent a story. He`s not after money. The reward posts don`t say -- do not specify any reward for just any information of the three suspects.

I mean, the information is for Natalee being found alive, $1 million, or any information leading to the location -- or, in other words, to finding this girl in whatever shape she`s in, that`s $100,000. So he`s not after money.


Quote
...Back to Anastasiya Bolton. I want to go back to this gardener, because this is the first real lead we`ve gotten, other than Natalee was last seen with a judge`s son -- all we see of this judge, as I said many times, is his back side whenever we try to ask him questions -- and these other two, the Kalpoe brothers.

This is the first real lead we`ve gotten. And I want to ask you, Anastasiya, isn`t it true that, with the new arrangement with the FBI, the FBI got to sit in during his interrogation of this gardener?

BOLTON: My understanding is that the FBI is, indeed, now able to sit in on the interrogations. And, more importantly, as I understand it, they will be able to sit in on the interrogations of Joran Van Der Sloot.

They`re not able to ask questions, but the FBI is able to take a more active role in the investigation.

GRACE: And very quickly, Jossy, before we go break -- everyone, Jossy Mansur is with us. He is the editor of "Diario" there in Aruba. You say this guy, this gardener, has no reason to lie. And also, the circumstances of the way he saw these three, allegedly, how they all ducked down in the back of the car, and tried to hide their faces, why, Jossy, would they feel they had to hide their faces and hide, that they were parked there near that racket club?

MANSUR: Because they were trying to hide their faces at that the hour, because we have to remember that the two Kalpoe brothers and Joran held on to the statement that they dropped Joran off at the beach and then went home. But here we have someone that says categorically that they did not go home, they were in the car with Joran. Joran was sitting in the driver`s seat.

GRACE: And very quickly, as we go to break, Dr. Patricia Saunders, the fact that they were trying to hide from somebody they didn`t even know, I find highly, highly probative.

DR. PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, it screams to consciousness of guilt, as does Mr. Joran changing his stories 22-plus times.


Quote
I want to go straight back to the editor of "Diario." He is with us from Aruba tonight, Jossy Mansur.

Now, Mr. Mansur, it`s my understanding that you actually found the gardener and had him go to authorities with his story.

MANSUR: That is correct, because we were searching for him for three- and-a-half weeks after we heard the rumor about the domino game in prison. And then we wanted to know his identity. And we searched and searched with a team that we have investigating this, Eduardo Mansur (ph) and (INAUDIBLE) and they finally found him last Friday.

And they did a lot of talking to him and reassured him that the paper will stand behind him, as well as nothing the police -- the police aren`t going to do anything to him. So he was finally convinced to go to the police.

He went at 7:00 at night. And he laid off his sworn testimony and signed it that same night.

GRACE: Now, what domino game behind bars?

MANSUR: That there was a domino game behind bars in which one of the Kalpoe brothers participated. And one other player in there yelled at him, "Listen, my gardener saw you at the racket club that early morning that Natalee disappeared."

He got very white. He threw the dominoes on the table and walked away. So that rumor started to filter out, because there were many other people present around that domino table. We found out about it. And we started a search for this gardener.


GRACE: Well, Jossy Mansur, that is a heck of a story. And apparently he is believable because, as we speak, the pond near where the gardener says he saw Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers parked around 2:30 a.m. near this racket club is being drained.

Back to Jossy Mansur with "Diario." Tell me about the gardener. Who did he work for? Why did he happen to be there that night at 2:30 a.m.? And how close was the car to this pond?

MANSUR: You know, he`s a gardener of a friend of ours that we know very well. And that night, it was very hot in his apartment, as it has been hot all this week in Aruba. And he left his own apartment to go this house where he works as a gardener, where he has an air-conditioned room.

And when he passed by the racket club, there was a car blocking the road. It`s a dirt road that goes around where the water is being drained now. And for him to be able to pass this car, he had to climb a little mount that was by the car.

He was very close to it, less than a yard away. And when he looked inside the car, he saw these three people that he identified was the many folders that have come out in the "Diario."

GRACE: And when he saw the three of them, what, if anything, did they do?

MANSUR: One of them -- the one that was sitting behind the driver`s seat, which was Joran, threw his hands across his face to hide from him. And the other two ducked.

GRACE: The other two were in the back seat?

MANSUR: One in the back seat, one in the front seat. Both ducked, so as not to be seen by him.

GRACE: And how close was this car to this pond that is being drained as we speak?

MANSUR: Very close. Very close. A few yards away.

GRACE: I want to go back to that domino game you told us about. We`re showing video right now, Mr. Mansur, of the pond. It is being drained right now, based largely on what this gardener has told police there in Aruba. It`s going down right now.

Back to this domino game. Who was playing dominoes with the Kalpoe brother, and how did you find out about it?

MANSUR: Because his gardener told him through his father. He`s a young fellow. His father visits him in jail. He`s there for the possession of some kind of illegal arm, nothing serious. And then they were playing there with four people, four people play domino. And some onlookers around them.

And then this happened when he confronted Kalpoe, one of the Kalpoe brothers with this fact. Then the guy got mad. He became pale, threw the dominoes, and walked away. So it`s an abnormal reaction to some kind of finger-pointing at him.


Quote
GRACE: Jossy, question about the pond. What in the gardener`s statement has led police to drain this pond?

MANSUR: The fact that he identified these three suspects in the Kalpoe`s car at that hour, between 2:30 and 3:00, at that particular place. We have to remember that Joran is a member of the racket clubs. He knows that area very well, from the palm of his hand.

And we have to remember also that Joran confessed to the police on the 13th of June that, at 2:00 that same morning, he went to the beach to the north of the Marriott Hotel with Natalee.

GRACE: So he is a member, his family is a member, of the racket club. And we`ve caught him in another lie, bottom line.

MANSUR: Of course, we caught him in a lie, because, not only him, but the Kalpoe brothers also, because they claim they dropped him off there at 2:00 and then went home.

But they were with him, because in a further statement to the police on the 13th of June, Joran said that Deepak Kalpoe walked back to the beach where he had left Natalee asleep and then he didn`t hear anything more. Then, at the end, when the police asked him what he thought happened between Deepak and Natalee, he said, "I think he raped her and then murdered her."

This is from the police records.

GRACE: Joran Van Der Sloot said a Kalpoe brother raped her and murdered her?

MANSUR: Yes, he said that of Deepak. He mentioned Deepak in that statement.


Quote
GRACE: Well, you have been saying that from the get-go, along with the rest of Natalee`s family.

Back to Jossy Mansur, the editor of "Diario." We understand tonight that Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, has changed his story up to 22 times. What are the different stories, Jossy, that he has given?

MANSUR: From what I understand, he gives varied answers to the same questions, but not with too much of a difference, but he keeps changing. For example, on one time, he says to the police that he left the girl on the beach and went away because she wanted to walk back to the hotel, the Holiday Inn. On another occasion, he said that he left her asleep there. Then on another occasion, he said that she got sick and he left her on the beach. So it keeps changing, but not with a variation that is very noticeable.

GRACE: Jossy, didn`t at one point he said he left her at the Holiday Inn and she was walking in and stumbled, and two -- a security guard tried to help her? Then later, he said he left her at the Marriott out on the beach?

MANSUR: Oh, the story goes on and on and on. Sure. He said that -- the first time that they spoke about this was that they left her at the Holiday Inn. She got out of the car and she stumbled. Two security guards came over. He even described the uniforms that they had. That`s why these two people were picked up by the police for questioning and then released, because they were innocent. But he keeps changing his story all the time, with some variations.

Quote
GRACE: This is what I don`t understand, Jossy Mansur. With an allegation like that by Joran Van Der Sloot, even though he`s a liar, why did they let the Deepak -- the Kalpoe brothers go?

MANSUR: Oh, that`s the $64,000 question. It`s been going on and on in my mind also. I don`t think they should have let them go. I`ve said that many times before. I think should have been held -- at least Deepak should have been held in custody and questioned and questioned all over again.

And I can confirm that Joran said this about Deepak. I can confirm it because there are police records that have it. It`s signed -- these records are signed by four officers present when he made that statement, under oath.

GRACE: And Jossy, how have you learned what is the content of the police records? I thought prosecutors were keeping them so secret.


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/26/ng.01.html

a few notes about the pond and gardener


Thanks WhiskeyGirl...Need to reread all my notes on the Racquet Club and find the discussion from a little while back in Shango about the gardener and his credibility.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 25, 2008, 07:28:44 PM
Am really, really, really hoping that Mr. Peter DeVries KNOWS that such a large group of PERVERTED DUTCHMEN & DUTCHWOMEN are involved in this cover-up & the complicity of kidnapping, rape & murder.  From the Dutch wannabe's involved from the Government Offices of LieRuba, the Netherland placed Justice Officials, attorney's & parents.

Am really, really, really hoping the whole worthless rotten group of them go down here on this earth cuz I KNOW they are going down, down, down when their souls are for eternity damned.

This kind of evil, if not stopped, increases.  It really is in the best interest of any community, regardless what country to actively oppose such evil as it encourage tribal hate, which leads to horrific circumstances & is then much more difficult to contain & put to a stop.

i wouldn't exclude the possibility that there are also american expats. included in this group you're describing.
dennisintn

I would have thought that the FBI would have been able to question the expats without the OK of ALE, after all they are American citizens. The ones that come to mind are the Zeollas...were you looking after Sebastian, while his mother was in the Netherlands? 

Not sure.  There may have been no need.  Paulus on video at casino...statement from ALE and Aruban escort that Paulus said he picked up Joran at 4am....wiretaps?...the initial report that two of the MB kids saw Paulus, Joran and Natalee at the ATM by McDonals at about 4am.....they may not have needed to question anyone about where Paulus was....although I am sure the expats were lined up to give a statement to the ALE...or at least approve the statement written for them to sign...or not....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 25, 2008, 07:49:22 PM
Quote
Hey, I want to just remind everyone of some things:
1. The D_utch sent F-16s to search. Typically, a government doesn't employ the military's multi-million dollar aircraft for runaways or accident victims. They at least thought somethng bigger was going on.

2.The FBI has been present in Aruba from the beginning, assisting and monitoring--they initially went at the request of the local authorities. The FBI has battled in Court for 2 months to gain access to documents. I don't believe the FBI would expend such effort for a runaway or accident victim.

Posted by: res_ipsa_loquitor | August 14, 2005 05:55 PM


I found this on that same thread. I made a lot of sense even back then. Back to basics!

Posted by: ViVi | Sunday, June 11, 2006 at 08:10 PM


http://www.riehlworldview.com/test_blog/2006/06/24.html

Quote
Don't forget this article from Rick Leventhal

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159664,00.html

June 15, 2005

I don't even know where to begin. This is one of the most difficult, intense, and confounding stories I've covered. Information is hard to come by, false leads, and "reportable news" from actual government officials of "confessions" and "confirmed grave sites" (identified and detailed) are quickly amended or completely retracted.

[snip]

The next day, another official spoke to one of our producers. Edward Croues, a spokesman for the minister of justice, told Craig Rivera he had "official information" that Natalee was "confirmed dead," and told Craig her father had asked police to take him to the body and to do it before the press found out where it was.

[snip]

The article has more details. Something happened there on Aruba. "detailed grave descriptions"????

People can bash Beth (and now and have been bashing Natalee, Dave, MB, BHM, AL, South, ..... etc.), but something happened, and no one is being held accountable for anything.

Posted by: Wayne | Wednesday, June 14, 2006 at 08:39 PM

http://www.riehlworldview.com/test_blog/2006/06/25.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 25, 2008, 08:02:45 PM
Whiskeygirl quotes:

Hey, I want to just remind everyone of some things:
1. The D_utch sent F-16s to search. Typically, a government doesn't employ the military's multi-million dollar aircraft for runaways or accident victims. They at least thought somethng bigger was going on.

2.The FBI has been present in Aruba from the beginning, assisting and monitoring--they initially went at the request of the local authorities. The FBI has battled in Court for 2 months to gain access to documents. I don't believe the FBI would expend such effort for a runaway or accident victim.

Posted by: res_ipsa_loquitor | August 14, 2005 05:55 PM


 :smt045 :smt045 :smt045


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 09:51:21 PM
<-------------------------- Yes -------------------- Paulus is Daury.


At minimum, a part of the amalgam know as Daury. All those that enabled the suspects, and assisted them in their efforts to deny justice. Paulus and v/d Straten and Jacobs and Janssen, for starters, are ALL Daury. The list is long, and it had to be for a compulsive confessor to remain free, a confessor who feels "lucky" despite being known as the most notorious, pathetic loser on multiple continents. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:14:39 PM
http://www.awe24.com/

TEMPO YA A DEMOSTRA CU NOS TABATA TIN RAZON, E CALIDAD BARATA NO TA SIRBI

YA CABA UN DI E SLEEPING POLICE A KIBRA Y E BOLTS A KEDA SALI ESKI POR BIRA PELIGER PA TRAFICO


Looks like even their "sleeping police" are malfunctioning   ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://www.awe24.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/jul_2008/25_jul_polis_drumi__4___Small_.JPG)
(http://www.awe24.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/jul_2008/25_jul_polis_drumi__5___Small_.JPG)
 
   
 



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 10:24:24 PM
Hey, don't laugh. That speed bump just got promoted. The ALE hierarchy is now...De Witte, speed bump, then Jacobs. And there is a no-jaywalking sign breathing down Tubby's neck. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 25, 2008, 10:27:21 PM
Maybe why Tina the taxi driver is looking for cash on the side:


....
We usually use the same taxi driver, Bully, throughout our entire trip. During our stay in Aruba he was off island on vacation with his family. He is honest, dependable and knowledgeable about the island. We have been using him for over two years now. This trip without Bully, our experiences with the 8 random taxi drivers we used, were, with the exception of 2 drivers, disgraceful to the Aruban people and very disheartening for us. In every instance but two, the drivers tried to overcharge us. With no increase in fares since 2002, paying a 12% tax and not being able to pass it on, and the high price of gas, we were faced with a large percentage of drivers with the attitude "let's screw the tourists". Not to say that there are not other honest taxi drivers, but we met 6 out of 8 who were NOT.

Loving Aruba and her people as much as we do, we were very saddened by their behavior to say the least. Having traveled to Aruba before, at least we know some of their unjustified, in my opinion, reasoning in this situation. I cannot imagine a first time visitor to the island who knows what the fares are "supposed" to be, being charged whatever fare the driver makes up. The Aruban government sets the taxi fares; they need to give these drivers a raise. Hopefully the raise in fares will once again make the drivers honest. Again, to their credit, we did have two very nice and honest drivers, one a woman on Father's Day night and another nice gentleman the night we went to the Promenade.

Our worst "taxi" incident came outside the Holiday Inn returning back to the Tamarijn from Palm Beach following our day aboard the Jolly Pirates. We walked outside of the lobby at the Holiday Inn and there were 4 taxi drivers seated on benches hanging out. Since our friends were with us we were 7 people total and needed 2 taxis anyway, so this was perfect. Dh asked them what the fare was to the Tamarijn and they eyed up one another and one of the drivers said "$10". Knowing what we were up against, before we even left the Tamarijn in the morning, dh confirmed with our favorite concierge Iris that the fair should be $8.

Dh politely but forcefully asked to see their fare sheet where it showed the fare was $10. Well don't you know all of a sudden they acted like they could even barely understand English.  ::MonkeyHaHa:: Dh did not back down and again asked to see it in writing. Finally one of the drivers got up and went to his taxi to get the fare sheet. He came back with it, but then walked away from us to be by himself to eye up the chart. He then came over to us saying indeed it was $10, still not showing us the chart. Dh told all 4 drivers point blank that we would pay the $10, since obviously we had no choice, but we were also going to take the taxi's numbers and report the drivers to the Aruba Tourism Authority.

Well gosh, don't you know, all of a sudden the taxi driver who had the sheet in his hand, stumbles over to me and points to Oranjestad ($10). Yeah, right, we told them all right from the start that we were all going to the Tamarijn! They do not even come close to sounding alike and I have only been to Oranjestad twice in the past 5 years. SO, clarifying that we were going to the Tamarijn, I showed the driver it was $8. Normally we would have paid him the $8 for the fare and a $2 tip for a total of $10 anyway. Needless to say, we did not tip him and he only got his $8 so he lost out for his foolish behavior. Our friends also did not tip their driver and would have under better circumstances.

Our final taxi ride of our Aruba vacation began with Bully picking us up to take us to the Tamarijn at 12:15 p.m. He had returned home to the island the day before and called us first thing that morning to confirm our pick up.


http://www.aruba-bb.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=60618


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 10:36:04 PM
We will never see Gielen's doc, unless she puts it all on youtube.

Boeti best make space in his treehouse - Renee is taking a bath on this one.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:36:32 PM
Hey, don't laugh. That speed bump just got promoted. The ALE hierarchy is now...De Witte, speed bump, then Jacobs. And there is a no-jaywalking sign breathing down Tubby's neck. 

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 10:40:03 PM
FOB2 can't help Gielen. They sunk all their money into Jorenstein's coffeehouse.  : )


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:43:48 PM
Hey, don't laugh. That speed bump just got promoted. The ALE hierarchy is now...De Witte, speed bump, then Jacobs. And there is a no-jaywalking sign breathing down Tubby's neck. 

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/CuracaoOfficer.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 10:46:53 PM
The Casino Picture That Looks Like Paulus Sitting Next To Natalee, Has Any Of The Other MB Kids At The Table Identify him As Paulus?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 10:52:18 PM
The Casino Picture That Looks Like Paulus Sitting Next To Natalee, Has Any Of The Other MB Kids At The Table Identify him As Paulus?

Not that i know of echo. One of their FBI statements says "older man"...or something similar.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 10:53:12 PM
The Casino Picture That Looks Like Paulus Sitting Next To Natalee, Has Any Of The Other MB Kids At The Table Identify him As Paulus?

I don't know.  It might be hard for them to really remember.  They may not have been paying any attention to him.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 25, 2008, 10:58:23 PM
That's Too Bad. It Sure does Look Like him!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:04:14 PM
Quote
Hey, I want to just remind everyone of some things:
1. The D_utch sent F-16s to search. Typically, a government doesn't employ the military's multi-million dollar aircraft for runaways or accident victims. They at least thought somethng bigger was going on.

2.The FBI has been present in Aruba from the beginning, assisting and monitoring--they initially went at the request of the local authorities. The FBI has battled in Court for 2 months to gain access to documents. I don't believe the FBI would expend such effort for a runaway or accident victim.

Posted by: res_ipsa_loquitor | August 14, 2005 05:55 PM


I found this on that same thread. I made a lot of sense even back then. Back to basics!

Posted by: ViVi | Sunday, June 11, 2006 at 08:10 PM


res_ipsa_loquitor & ViVi are the same person.  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 11:08:45 PM
Quote
Hey, I want to just remind everyone of some things:
1. The D_utch sent F-16s to search. Typically, a government doesn't employ the military's multi-million dollar aircraft for runaways or accident victims. They at least thought somethng bigger was going on.

2.The FBI has been present in Aruba from the beginning, assisting and monitoring--they initially went at the request of the local authorities. The FBI has battled in Court for 2 months to gain access to documents. I don't believe the FBI would expend such effort for a runaway or accident victim.

Posted by: res_ipsa_loquitor | August 14, 2005 05:55 PM


I found this on that same thread. I made a lot of sense even back then. Back to basics!

Posted by: ViVi | Sunday, June 11, 2006 at 08:10 PM


res_ipsa_loquitor & ViVi are the same person.  ::MonkeyCool::

How is ViVi these days is she still around?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:09:05 PM
Nevermind, i see that is what vivi is saying.

Anyway - The release of Joran's 5/31 statement was interesting. Joran, Paulus, Straten and Jacobs all sitting around witnessing sporty blow story #1. Then they wait 10 days before asking why. Unbelievable.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:12:49 PM
How is ViVi these days is she still around?

Not posting much at all. She is defending somebody in that Texas cult case. Has been on Nancy Grace a few times. Funny.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 11:14:15 PM
How is ViVi these days is she still around?

Not posting much at all. She is defending somebody in that Texas cult case. Has been on Nancy Grace a few times. Funny.

Still?  I thought it was over, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:17:42 PM
Still?  I thought it was over, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Representing", my bad. Once a lawyer sinks their claws into you - it's never over!  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 11:34:12 PM
Still?  I thought it was over, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

"Representing", my bad. Once a lawyer sinks their claws into you - it's never over!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Funny  ::MonkeyHaHa::  So she's pretty much done with the NH case?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:34:38 PM
It's been slow. Reminds me of the dead period leading up to the Sloot search. Something always does seem to pop up, though, to keep it going. I'll keep following.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 11:39:24 PM
It's been slow. Reminds me of the dead period leading up to the Sloot search. Something always does seem to pop up, though, to keep it going. I'll keep following.

I agree, something always seems to come up.  Joran always seems to open his mouth again, lol.  Maybe someone will air this supposed new confession in Thailand?  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:43:54 PM
Something hinky about that confession Klaas. A Bon Dia exclusive?

Do you know Gielen's cameraman...Dolphe something? Pics?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 25, 2008, 11:49:24 PM
Something hinky about that confession Klaas. A Bon Dia exclusive?

Do you know Gielen's cameraman...Dolphe something? Pics?

I think Johan has posted a pic of someone that might be Gielen's cameraman.  Not sure of the name.  I'll look, hold on.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:52:29 PM
Because...i saw a pic somewhere. Thought it kinda looked like the "guy" in Thailand with Joran. IIRC, the one Glenfro said was JR_Dutch_Atty.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 25, 2008, 11:59:05 PM
Hey Slogger! Long time.  ^5


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on July 26, 2008, 12:01:47 AM
That's Too Bad. It Sure does Look Like him!

Welcome Echo       Echo       Echo       Echo        Echo

 :smt051                   :smt051                        :smt051                               :smt051                           :smt051
                   
               :smt051                       :smt051                              :smt051                          :smt051

                                :smt051                            :smt051                             :smt051                   

                                                  :smt051                              :smt051

                                                                       :smt051


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Slogger on July 26, 2008, 12:01:51 AM
Hi Igs,  hope all is well with you!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 12:03:23 AM
Because...i saw a pic somewhere. Thought it kinda looked like the "guy" in Thailand with Joran. IIRC, the one Glenfro said was JR_Dutch_Atty.

Ah, that pic...here's a pic of a cameraman that Johan posted.  I'll find the one you are talking about, give me a couple min.



Maybe that was miss Gielen herself under different nics :D
I'm curious about the documentary though. Because of her reputation I wonder why Dave gave her an interview? The strangest thing about this is Peter Ranzijn for me....I know that cameraman and wouldn't figure him for being such a fool....maybe he needed the work :D

I did check Prive today; the article suggests that Peter R. de Vries is working on the case and has gotten some more proof when it comes to daddy Paulus helping out....it states that Peter has been on Aruba a couple of times recently to talk to the ALE.

It's a tabloid....but this isn't the first I've heard this...that Peter found more proof on Paulus. I'm just hoping it's true and that this will actually lead to something positive for the case.

 (http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/gnion3.gif?t=1213891848)

This Camera man GBMW ?
they use a handycam  ::MonkeyHaHa::
[/quote]


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 12:10:53 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 12:12:37 AM
That's Too Bad. It Sure does Look Like him!

Welcome Echo       Echo       Echo       Echo        Echo

 :smt051                   :smt051                        :smt051                               :smt051                           :smt051
                   
               :smt051                       :smt051                              :smt051                          :smt051

                                :smt051                            :smt051                             :smt051                   

                                                  :smt051                              :smt051

                                                                       :smt051

Bearly - lolol  ::MonkeyHaHa:: 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: igsigs on July 26, 2008, 12:13:19 AM
Yes Klaas. Same guy maybe? I'm looking for the other Dolphe pic i saw...somewhere.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 26, 2008, 12:20:05 AM
That's Too Bad. It Sure does Look Like him!

Welcome Echo       Echo       Echo       Echo        Echo

 :smt051                   :smt051                        :smt051                               :smt051                           :smt051
                   
               :smt051                       :smt051                              :smt051                          :smt051

                                :smt051                            :smt051                             :smt051                   

                                                  :smt051                              :smt051

                                                                       :smt051


TY  ....Cute LOL


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 26, 2008, 12:23:18 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)



Is Joran Traveling alone or With Someone? Seems Like Hes conversing With Someone..hmmm


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 12:23:56 AM
Yes Klaas. Same guy maybe? I'm looking for the other Dolphe pic i saw...somewhere.

Maybe, I'm not sure  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 12:24:55 AM
Echos - probably traveling with someone.  This was a couple months ago in Thailand.  We don't even know for sure where he is right now. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 26, 2008, 02:13:18 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)



Is Joran Traveling alone or With Someone? Seems Like Hes conversing With Someone..hmmm


Why does he always have that goofy azz smile on???


It makes him look even more stupid than he already IS!!!!


He looks like friggin' GOMER PYLE.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on July 26, 2008, 02:42:25 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)



Is Joran Traveling alone or With Someone? Seems Like Hes conversing With Someone..hmmm


Why does he always have that goofy azz smile on???


It makes him look even more stupid than he already IS!!!!


He looks like friggin' GOMER PYLE.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::



This picture of Joran.  It looks like Rudy Croes wearing a Joran mask.  Weird.  Are we sure this is Joran, or is it his look alike?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 26, 2008, 07:04:01 AM
Well, golly!! -- Surprise, surprise, surprise!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 26, 2008, 07:54:45 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)



Is Joran Traveling alone or With Someone? Seems Like Hes conversing With Someone..hmmm


Why does he always have that goofy azz smile on???


It makes him look even more stupid than he already IS!!!!


He looks like friggin' GOMER PYLE.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::



This picture of Joran.  It looks like Rudy Croes wearing a Joran mask.  Weird.  Are we sure this is Joran, or is it his look alike?

 ::MonkeyLaugh::  @ Carpe....Gollllllyyyyy




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 26, 2008, 08:30:49 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 09:17:09 AM
Igsigs - I think this is the picture you are talking about.  The guy on the left :

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub3/JoranThailand.jpg)



Is Joran Traveling alone or With Someone? Seems Like Hes conversing With Someone..hmmm


Why does he always have that goofy azz smile on???


It makes him look even more stupid than he already IS!!!!


He looks like friggin' GOMER PYLE.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::



This picture of Joran.  It looks like Rudy Croes wearing a Joran mask.  Weird.  Are we sure this is Joran, or is it his look alike?

 ::MonkeyLaugh::  @ Carpe....Gollllllyyyyy




SHAZZAM!  

We've seen that hat before, I think. The bill is long.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 09:21:16 AM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/gomer.jpg) There's that guy from Arubee!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 09:32:22 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html

I'm unable to access the site for some reason..will keep trying.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 26, 2008, 09:41:24 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html

I'm unable to access the site for some reason..will keep trying.

Is this the one:

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph4.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph3.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 26, 2008, 09:50:48 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/People%20of%20Intrest/rg.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 26, 2008, 09:58:39 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html

I'm unable to access the site for some reason..will keep trying.

Is this the one:

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph4.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph3.jpg)

Yes, thanks San.  There was a pic of Joran at a McDonalds (?in Thailand?), the friend with him may have resembled  this guy.  igsigs is usually pretty on.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 26, 2008, 10:12:44 AM
Most pics removed.  Top left looping picture has a shot of Dolph van Stapele, Gielen photographer.  Doesn't look like red haired Julia/JR person, but does look like guy at McDonalds.  Sorry can't grab it.:

http://www.regiecuracao.com/makingoff.html

I'm unable to access the site for some reason..will keep trying.

Is this the one:

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph4.jpg)
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Dolph3.jpg)

Yes, thanks San.  There was a pic of Joran at a McDonalds (?in Thailand?), the friend with him may have resembled  this guy.  igsigs is usually pretty on.

Renee Gielen use the 15 $ supermarket Handy cam  ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 26, 2008, 10:45:29 AM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/gomer.jpg) There's that guy from Arubee!


 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

You sssssaid ARUBEE!!!  LOL!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 26, 2008, 12:37:15 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/gomer.jpg) There's that guy from Arubee!


 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

You sssssaid ARUBEE!!!  LOL!


haha....I loved that show!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 26, 2008, 02:08:25 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44910.php
Google Translation

Netherlands concerned about corruption Aruba
July 25, 2008, 17:58 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD / THE HAGUE - The Dutch Justice Minister Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) in talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP) expressed his concerns about corruption in the government. This is evidenced by its response to Kamervragen who PVV-parliamentarian Hero Brinkman on June 26 to the Minister and State Secretary Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA).

The questions are about the political climate in Aruba and the Dutch Antilles. This response to the interview with former Deputy Attorney-General (PG) Nico Jörg in the Volkskrant that the climate as "naargeestig 'described. Brinkman asked, among other things whether the Dutch Minister of the day was aware of "the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as interest, cronyism and nepotism, which speaks of Aruba PG" and what the bewindspersoon then it has done.

Hirsch Ballin replied that the Aruban public prosecutor (OM) several cases of corruption before the courts and has brought a number of them have resulted in a conviction. "In talks with, among other things, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I expressed my concern and talked about improvements in the system, which can prevent corruption."

Brinkman also asked how much money the past five years with this corruption was involved. The minister says not to know, because tackling corruption a landsaangelegenheid. Hirsch Ballin said in respect of procurement by the Aruban government, which he also does not understand, because this is a matter for our country. The PVV member suggested in his question that contracts are not always transparent, as in the newspaper was told.

The Justice Minister says also to be aware of the backlog of legislation. "The Netherlands provides technical assistance to Aruba in the legislative support and backwardness as soon as possible way to work," says Hirsch Ballin.

Brinkman would also like to know how the assumption of Jörg reflected that the PPS in Aruba 'encounters resistance when it does more than combating street crime. " Again, this the minister replied that the PPS a landsaangelegenheid and he is not in a position to judge "what steps the Public Ministry in whatever situation has undertaken or should undertake." Bewindspersoon believes that his work for the "independent, within the regular authority "must be able to perform.

Finally, the Dutch parliamentarian also know whether the Minister believes that anyone who through cronyism or nepotism to a job, standing on foot should be dismissed. This Hirsch Ballin replied: "When recruiting staff, the suitability for the post first. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. Ga I assume that Aruba the importance of these criteria endorses. The staff is however an autonomous Aruban matter. I have no insight into the human changes in the Aruban government. "


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on July 26, 2008, 02:32:46 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44910.php
Google Translation

Netherlands concerned about corruption Aruba
July 25, 2008, 17:58 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD / THE HAGUE - The Dutch Justice Minister Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) in talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP) expressed his concerns about corruption in the government. This is evidenced by its response to Kamervragen who PVV-parliamentarian Hero Brinkman on June 26 to the Minister and State Secretary Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA).

The questions are about the political climate in Aruba and the Dutch Antilles. This response to the interview with former Deputy Attorney-General (PG) Nico Jörg in the Volkskrant that the climate as "naargeestig 'described. Brinkman asked, among other things whether the Dutch Minister of the day was aware of "the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as interest, cronyism and nepotism, which speaks of Aruba PG" and what the bewindspersoon then it has done.

Hirsch Ballin replied that the Aruban public prosecutor (OM) several cases of corruption before the courts and has brought a number of them have resulted in a conviction. "In talks with, among other things, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I expressed my concern and talked about improvements in the system, which can prevent corruption."

Brinkman also asked how much money the past five years with this corruption was involved. The minister says not to know, because tackling corruption a landsaangelegenheid. Hirsch Ballin said in respect of procurement by the Aruban government, which he also does not understand, because this is a matter for our country. The PVV member suggested in his question that contracts are not always transparent, as in the newspaper was told.

The Justice Minister says also to be aware of the backlog of legislation. "The Netherlands provides technical assistance to Aruba in the legislative support and backwardness as soon as possible way to work," says Hirsch Ballin.

Brinkman would also like to know how the assumption of Jörg reflected that the PPS in Aruba 'encounters resistance when it does more than combating street crime. " Again, this the minister replied that the PPS a landsaangelegenheid and he is not in a position to judge "what steps the Public Ministry in whatever situation has undertaken or should undertake." Bewindspersoon believes that his work for the "independent, within the regular authority "must be able to perform.

Finally, the Dutch parliamentarian also know whether the Minister believes that anyone who through cronyism or nepotism to a job, standing on foot should be dismissed. This Hirsch Ballin replied: "When recruiting staff, the suitability for the post first. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important.  Ga I assume that Aruba the importance of these criteria endorses. The staff is however an autonomous Aruban matter. I have no insight into the human changes in the Aruban government. "


That cracks me up!  Aruba IS cronyism and nepotism.  And the Dutch are just now realizing it?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 26, 2008, 02:34:21 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44910.php
Google Translation

Netherlands concerned about corruption Aruba
July 25, 2008, 17:58 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD / THE HAGUE - The Dutch Justice Minister Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) in talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP) expressed his concerns about corruption in the government. This is evidenced by its response to Kamervragen who PVV-parliamentarian Hero Brinkman on June 26 to the Minister and State Secretary Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA).

The questions are about the political climate in Aruba and the Dutch Antilles. This response to the interview with former Deputy Attorney-General (PG) Nico Jörg in the Volkskrant that the climate as "naargeestig 'described. Brinkman asked, among other things whether the Dutch Minister of the day was aware of "the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as interest, cronyism and nepotism, which speaks of Aruba PG" and what the bewindspersoon then it has done.

Hirsch Ballin replied that the Aruban public prosecutor (OM) several cases of corruption before the courts and has brought a number of them have resulted in a conviction. "In talks with, among other things, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I expressed my concern and talked about improvements in the system, which can prevent corruption."

Brinkman also asked how much money the past five years with this corruption was involved. The minister says not to know, because tackling corruption a landsaangelegenheid. Hirsch Ballin said in respect of procurement by the Aruban government, which he also does not understand, because this is a matter for our country. The PVV member suggested in his question that contracts are not always transparent, as in the newspaper was told.

The Justice Minister says also to be aware of the backlog of legislation. "The Netherlands provides technical assistance to Aruba in the legislative support and backwardness as soon as possible way to work," says Hirsch Ballin.

Brinkman would also like to know how the assumption of Jörg reflected that the PPS in Aruba 'encounters resistance when it does more than combating street crime. " Again, this the minister replied that the PPS a landsaangelegenheid and he is not in a position to judge "what steps the Public Ministry in whatever situation has undertaken or should undertake." Bewindspersoon believes that his work for the "independent, within the regular authority "must be able to perform.

Finally, the Dutch parliamentarian also know whether the Minister believes that anyone who through cronyism or nepotism to a job, standing on foot should be dismissed. This Hirsch Ballin replied: "When recruiting staff, the suitability for the post first. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. Ga I assume that Aruba the importance of these criteria endorses. The staff is however an autonomous Aruban matter. I have no insight into the human changes in the Aruban government. "

I suspect there will be little government left if this happened. LOL


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 03:01:25 PM
Looks like a busy night, crime wise in Aruba:  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.awe24.com/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: cajun miracle on July 26, 2008, 03:23:17 PM
Has anyone had problems on this site with their computer getting hacked? I was just informed by my spysweeper program that LDPinch Trojan was quarantined. It said that LDPinch Trojan is a remote access Trojan that may allow a hacker to gain access to your computer when you are online.
Thanks for any info, from all of you,

Cajun Miracle


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:25:28 PM
No, no problems here.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 03:27:35 PM
Looks like a busy night, crime wise in Aruba:  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.awe24.com/
Busy? nah..... average at best! Iwas quite impressed that there didn't appear to be any grizzley car wrecks last night....... only a few paltry shooting episodes!  ::MonkeyRoll::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: cajun miracle on July 26, 2008, 03:28:53 PM
No, no problems here.

Thanks Always. They did quarantine it. Have a great day!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 26, 2008, 03:29:07 PM
Looks like a busy night, crime wise in Aruba:  ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.awe24.com/

Guess that's where all of the action is..... ::MonkeyHaHa::

(http://www.bucuticam.com/zoom1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:30:59 PM
Hello Wreck  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 03:35:28 PM
No, no problems here.

Thanks Always. They did quarantine it. Have a great day!
There was a trojan going around a year or so called "postcard.exe". I noticed SEVERAL spam e-mails (both at home and work) the last few days from "Hallmark" -- these are trojans/viruses -- DO NOT OPEN THEM!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 03:36:34 PM
Hey A-1!  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:38:33 PM
A 1 huh, that would make me saucy!! ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 03:40:24 PM
A 1 huh, that would make me saucy!! ::MonkeyCool::
I guess that is prefferable to being called a "Heinz 57"!  ::MonkeyRoll::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 03:41:15 PM
A 1 huh, that would make me saucy!! ::MonkeyCool::

I know a nickname when I see one, and I think you've just been dubbed!

HIYA. A-1 from CBB!  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:42:02 PM
Oh if you saw me Wreck, you would never call me that ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:44:50 PM
Hi CBB!!! Im bored, its so hot here, the sidewalks are smooooooooookkking.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 03:51:01 PM
Your serve, Wreck...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 04:05:06 PM
Aruba could fill up that Web Cam shot if they would just do the right thing. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 04:09:39 PM
Your serve, Wreck...
I think "saucy" is just fine!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 04:10:49 PM
Full confession from all involved, body returned, restituion to family, apology for all coverup and delay and punishment.  Right???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 04:14:50 PM
Did I leave anything out???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 26, 2008, 04:17:01 PM
Full confession from all involved, body returned, restituion to family, apology for all coverup and delay and punishment.  Right???
That would only be a "start" for me. I tack on 10 years of boycott for every 1 year delay in doing the right thing. If they did ALL of the things you mentioned by tomorrow -- we are looking at 2038 before I "consider" ending the boycott. (that is only "consider" mind you)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 04:19:22 PM
YEAH!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 04:20:44 PM
Gotta run, luv ya Wreck!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 04:23:51 PM
Has anyone had problems on this site with their computer getting hacked? I was just informed by my spysweeper program that LDPinch Trojan was quarantined. It said that LDPinch Trojan is a remote access Trojan that may allow a hacker to gain access to your computer when you are online.
Thanks for any info, from all of you,

Cajun Miracle

More likely a virus you already have on your computer than something linked to SM but I'll forward your post to Dugga and he can look into it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 04:27:35 PM
No, no problems here.

Thanks Always. They did quarantine it. Have a great day!
There was a trojan going around a year or so called "postcard.exe". I noticed SEVERAL spam e-mails (both at home and work) the last few days from "Hallmark" -- these are trojans/viruses -- DO NOT OPEN THEM!!

I did get a spam email to my hotmail account, something like a postcard from Hallmark that was a zip file.  Needless to say I didn't open it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 05:38:56 PM
You know the loss of a child must be a horrible thing.  But when there's an accident and a child is killed, you know the facts, you have the funeral, your friends and loved ones comfort you.  You deal with it.  But when you put your child on a airplane, kiss her goodbye, tell her to call home, no matter what time it is, and then she's just gone.  How do you deal with that?  I can't even imagine what they would be like.  And I may cut up some times, but my thoughts are never far away from what Natalles parents must be going through...In my prayers.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 26, 2008, 05:51:53 PM
Has anyone had problems on this site with their computer getting hacked? I was just informed by my spysweeper program that LDPinch Trojan was quarantined. It said that LDPinch Trojan is a remote access Trojan that may allow a hacker to gain access to your computer when you are online.
Thanks for any info, from all of you,

Cajun Miracle

More likely a virus you already have on your computer than something linked to SM but I'll forward your post to Dugga and he can look into it.

I come here almost every day to read and/or post and my computer scan yesterday did not show any problems. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 26, 2008, 09:13:22 PM
New Natalee post on front page - thank you Klaasend!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 26, 2008, 09:27:48 PM
Whoever got the idea to split out the perps statements in the documents thread, I luv ya.  Sifting through the names and dates was cumbersome. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 09:30:02 PM
Whoever got the idea to split out the perps statements in the documents thread, I luv ya.  Sifting through the names and dates was cumbersome. 

Thanks  ::MonkeyWink::  Yes, I think it's much better too!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 09:32:22 PM
NEW FRONT PAGE POST:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/07/26/natalee-holloway-remember-when-the-media-had-announced-that-suspect-who-took-natalee-killed-her/

Natalee Holloway: Remember When the Media Had Announced that Suspect who Took Natalee, Killed her.


FYI - I think Red plans on doing a few posts as it's been just about 3 years since he was there searching the landfill  


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 09:45:52 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 26, 2008, 09:54:28 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)

Perfect CBB!   ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 10:03:02 PM
O/T

For those following the Caylee Anthony case........Geraldo is on it now.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 26, 2008, 10:26:07 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/thumb_hammer.gif)
Good job CBB!!!  ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 26, 2008, 10:44:28 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)

amen, c.b., amen.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 26, 2008, 10:54:52 PM
You know the loss of a child must be a horrible thing.  But when there's an accident and a child is killed, you know the facts, you have the funeral, your friends and loved ones comfort you.  You deal with it.  But when you put your child on a airplane, kiss her goodbye, tell her to call home, no matter what time it is, and then she's just gone.  How do you deal with that?  I can't even imagine what they would be like.  And I may cut up some times, but my thoughts are never far away from what Natalles parents must be going through...In my prayers.....

My sentiments too, A1. I do believe, sincerely, that we will see another day when things aren't as they are right now. There are too many people that have knowledge of a piece of this story. Joran, himself, has an innate case of diarrhea mouth that he's had to release more than once and eventually the economy of Aruba will weigh in as well. In the meantime, a Big Monkey's keeping the flame of hope lit!

Revised:

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoTour.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 26, 2008, 11:14:03 PM
You know the loss of a child must be a horrible thing.  But when there's an accident and a child is killed, you know the facts, you have the funeral, your friends and loved ones comfort you.  You deal with it.  But when you put your child on a airplane, kiss her goodbye, tell her to call home, no matter what time it is, and then she's just gone.  How do you deal with that?  I can't even imagine what they would be like.  And I may cut up some times, but my thoughts are never far away from what Natalles parents must be going through...In my prayers.....

My sentiments too, A1. I do believe, sincerely, that we will see another day when things aren't as they are right now. There are too many people that have knowledge of a piece of this story. Joran, himself, has an innate case of diarrhea mouth that he's had to release more than once and eventually the economy of Aruba will weigh in as well. In the meantime, a Big Monkey's keeping the flame of hope lit!

Revised:

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoTour.gif)

Great job CBB.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 26, 2008, 11:51:46 PM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)



exactly!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: cajun miracle on July 27, 2008, 12:12:56 AM
No, no problems here.

Thanks Always. They did quarantine it. Have a great day!
There was a trojan going around a year or so called "postcard.exe". I noticed SEVERAL spam e-mails (both at home and work) the last few days from "Hallmark" -- these are trojans/viruses -- DO NOT OPEN THEM!!

Thanks for the warnings Wreck.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: cajun miracle on July 27, 2008, 12:16:09 AM
Has anyone had problems on this site with their computer getting hacked? I was just informed by my spysweeper program that LDPinch Trojan was quarantined. It said that LDPinch Trojan is a remote access Trojan that may allow a hacker to gain access to your computer when you are online.
Thanks for any info, from all of you,

Cajun Miracle

More likely a virus you already have on your computer than something linked to SM but I'll forward your post to Dugga and he can look into it.

Thanks Klaas. You're so kind.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: cajun miracle on July 27, 2008, 12:20:29 AM
Has anyone had problems on this site with their computer getting hacked? I was just informed by my spysweeper program that LDPinch Trojan was quarantined. It said that LDPinch Trojan is a remote access Trojan that may allow a hacker to gain access to your computer when you are online.
Thanks for any info, from all of you,

Cajun Miracle

More likely a virus you already have on your computer than something linked to SM but I'll forward your post to Dugga and he can look into it.

I come here almost every day to read and/or post and my computer scan yesterday did not show any problems. 


LilPuma,
I also read here everyday and this is the first time that this has happened. At least my spyware must be a good one.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Shell on July 27, 2008, 12:34:40 AM
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoNat.gif)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/thumb_hammer.gif)
Good job CBB!!!  ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel::


CBB, good job!

Texasmom, love the nail on the head too!

you all are great


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 27, 2008, 09:03:12 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44910.php
Google Translation

Netherlands concerned about corruption Aruba
July 25, 2008, 17:58 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD / THE HAGUE - snip

Finally, the Dutch parliamentarian also know whether the Minister believes that anyone who through cronyism or nepotism to a job, standing on foot should be dismissed. This Hirsch Ballin replied: "When recruiting staff, the suitability for the post first. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. Ga I assume that Aruba the importance of these criteria endorses. The staff is however an autonomous Aruban matter. I have no insight into the human changes in the Aruban government. "

I suspect there will be little government left if this happened. LOL


First off, the Dutch would have to get rid of a whole slew of their own judges and prosecutor/justice ministry staff. These are people they have sent to work on Aruba who have set up a good ole boy network to protect each other. Very few true Arubans have been involved in this fiasco that one Dutch boy and his well-connected father have caused for Aruba.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 27, 2008, 09:07:56 AM

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoTour.gif)


Great graphic CBB! It is amazing that over three years later you can't do an internet search about Aruba without the island being associated with words like "murder" "drugging" "corruption" and "boycott". We can all pat ourselves on the back for keeping Natalee's story alive. The Arubans tried to make this case go away, but it's not going away and never will go away until they prosecute and imprison their criminals!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 27, 2008, 09:46:06 AM
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

Otro morto den trafico diadomingo mainta
       
Sunday, 27 July 2008 - 06:40 
Diadomingo ta habri scur pa motibo di un otro accidente cu consequencia fatal. Ta trata aki di e 4 morto den trafico den apenas un siman. E accidente aki a sosode na e cruzada di Juliana Straat/Irene Straat algo promer cu 5 or di mainta. E persona cu a fayece ta di inicial S.F naci na 1981. E persona ta biba na Caya Butishi 109. Ta trata aki di un station wagen corra Ford Escortc u a accidente cu un Chevrolet Celta. E dama tabata ocupante di un di e autonan. Ambos chauffeur di e autonan envolvi a wordo deteni pa sospecho di ta bow influencia di alcohol. Despues di a hibanan warda di polis pa e test a sali na cla cu un berdad nan ta riba e nivel legal. CLICK READ MORE PA E IMAGENAN!

Positivo said:

  Wel si, condolencia nan a efamiliaresnan di esun cu a fallece. Mirando con e autonan a keda, mi ta casi sigur cu VELOCIDAD tambe a hunga un rol den e accident aki! Ta parce cu nos mester cambia e dicho ariba nos numbernan di auto: enbes di One Happy Island pa "One Speedy Island" Shonnan ban poko poko y core normal y segun reglanan di trafico. Aruba ta asina chikito! Corda cu trafico ta concerni tur hende cu ta mobilisa ariba caminda. Ban suave! pa no lamenta despues y sigur pa no costa bida di hendenan inocente. 

Through pap translator:

another dead in trafico diadomingo morning

 sunday, 27 july 2008 - 06:40

 diadomingo is open dark for motibo of one another accidente cu consequencia fateful. is deal here of the 4 dead in trafico in barely one week. the accidente here owing to sosode at the cruzada of juliana straat/irene straat algo before 5 or of morning. the person cu owing to fayece is of inicial s.f naci at 1981. the person live at caya butishi 109. is deal here of one station wagen corra ford escortc u owing to accidente cu one chevrolet celta. the lady was ocupante of one of the autonan. both chauffeur of the autonan envolvi owing to wordo deteni for suspicion of is bow influencia of alcohol. after of owing to hibanan keep of police for her test owing to leave at cla cu one berdad they're on the level legal. click read more for her imagenan!

positive said:

 wel if, condolencia they owing to efamiliaresnan of esun cu owing to fallece. mirando con the autonan owing to stay, i am casi assure cu velocidad also owing to play one rol in the accident here! is seems cu we have to change the dicho upstairs we numbernan of auto: enbes of one happy island for "one speedy island" shonnan as few little bit y core normal y according reglanan of trafico. aruba is so diminutive! corda cu trafico is concerni everybody cu is mobilisa upstairs caminda. as suave! for not lamenta after y assure for not costa life of hendenan inocente. come across

 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 27, 2008, 10:28:40 AM
I don't understand all these traffic deaths on Aruba.  It's only about 18 miles to drive around and even given the crowded conditions there and the numerous streets and alleys and by-roads, why does someone have to die there almost everyday?  Do people get in their cars and just put the pedal to the metal and never even look around until they get to their destination?  What do they do?  How can they afford to drive like total idiots down there risking every person's life that dares to operate a vehicle?  Seems to me they need some speed limit enforcement.  If you are driving less than 35 miles an hour, how hard it is to stop at an intersection?  The MEP needs to act like a governing body and actually govern.  What are the speed limits in Aruba, anyway?  :roll:


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: echosofangels on July 27, 2008, 10:51:06 AM
OT - 4 swimmers dead, 3 missing in N.Y. ocean waters

sad news


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080727/ap_on_re_us/swimmers_swept_away;_ylt=Ao62M9j64BJ6JcyZnAdjTJis0NUE


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on July 27, 2008, 11:14:42 AM
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

Otro morto den trafico diadomingo mainta
       
Sunday, 27 July 2008 - 06:40 
Diadomingo ta habri scur pa motibo di un otro accidente cu consequencia fatal. Ta trata aki di e 4 morto den trafico den apenas un siman. E accidente aki a sosode na e cruzada di Juliana Straat/Irene Straat algo promer cu 5 or di mainta. E persona cu a fayece ta di inicial S.F naci na 1981. E persona ta biba na Caya Butishi 109. Ta trata aki di un station wagen corra Ford Escortc u a accidente cu un Chevrolet Celta. E dama tabata ocupante di un di e autonan. Ambos chauffeur di e autonan envolvi a wordo deteni pa sospecho di ta bow influencia di alcohol. Despues di a hibanan warda di polis pa e test a sali na cla cu un berdad nan ta riba e nivel legal. CLICK READ MORE PA E IMAGENAN!

Positivo said:

  Wel si, condolencia nan a efamiliaresnan di esun cu a fallece. Mirando con e autonan a keda, mi ta casi sigur cu VELOCIDAD tambe a hunga un rol den e accident aki! Ta parce cu nos mester cambia e dicho ariba nos numbernan di auto: enbes di One Happy Island pa "One Speedy Island" Shonnan ban poko poko y core normal y segun reglanan di trafico. Aruba ta asina chikito! Corda cu trafico ta concerni tur hende cu ta mobilisa ariba caminda. Ban suave! pa no lamenta despues y sigur pa no costa bida di hendenan inocente. 

Through pap translator:

another dead in trafico diadomingo morning

 sunday, 27 july 2008 - 06:40

 diadomingo is open dark for motibo of one another accidente cu consequencia fateful. is deal here of the 4 dead in trafico in barely one week. the accidente here owing to sosode at the cruzada of juliana straat/irene straat algo before 5 or of morning. the person cu owing to fayece is of inicial s.f naci at 1981. the person live at caya butishi 109. is deal here of one station wagen corra ford escortc u owing to accidente cu one chevrolet celta. the lady was ocupante of one of the autonan. both chauffeur of the autonan envolvi owing to wordo deteni for suspicion of is bow influencia of alcohol. after of owing to hibanan keep of police for her test owing to leave at cla cu one berdad they're on the level legal. click read more for her imagenan!

positive said:

 wel if, condolencia they owing to efamiliaresnan of esun cu owing to fallece. mirando con the autonan owing to stay, i am casi assure cu velocidad also owing to play one rol in the accident here! is seems cu we have to change the dicho upstairs we numbernan of auto: enbes of one happy island for "one speedy island" shonnan as few little bit y core normal y according reglanan of trafico. aruba is so diminutive! corda cu trafico is concerni everybody cu is mobilisa upstairs caminda. as suave! for not lamenta after y assure for not costa life of hendenan inocente. come across

 


I think I am going to open up a car dealership there and clean up.  :smt028

Maybe all of their cars should come with breathalizers.   :smt011 :drunken:

I can't understand this with all those smart people speaking 20 languages and all, how can they miss the word STOP in any language?   :roll:


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on July 27, 2008, 11:18:55 AM
I don't understand all these traffic deaths on Aruba.  It's only about 18 miles to drive around and even given the crowded conditions there and the numerous streets and alleys and by-roads, why does someone have to die there almost everyday?  Do people get in their cars and just put the pedal to the metal and never even look around until they get to their destination?  What do they do?  How can they afford to drive like total idiots down there risking every person's life that dares to operate a vehicle?  Seems to me they need some speed limit enforcement.  If you are driving less than 35 miles an hour, how hard it is to stop at an intersection?  The MEP needs to act like a governing body and actually govern.  What are the speed limits in Aruba, anyway?  :roll:

Maybe they should confiscate their porn videos so they don't peek and drive.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 27, 2008, 11:22:15 AM
I don't understand all these traffic deaths on Aruba.  It's only about 18 miles to drive around and even given the crowded conditions there and the numerous streets and alleys and by-roads, why does someone have to die there almost everyday?  Do people get in their cars and just put the pedal to the metal and never even look around until they get to their destination?  What do they do?  How can they afford to drive like total idiots down there risking every person's life that dares to operate a vehicle?  Seems to me they need some speed limit enforcement.  If you are driving less than 35 miles an hour, how hard it is to stop at an intersection?  The MEP needs to act like a governing body and actually govern.  What are the speed limits in Aruba, anyway?  :roll:

Maybe they should confiscate their porn videos so they don't peek and drive.

I think it's as simple as too much drugs and alcohol and party atmosphere. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 27, 2008, 11:43:06 AM
I believe the google translated version of this was posted yesterday:

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44899.php

The Netherlands worried about corruption Aruba
25 Jul, 2008, 16:07 (GMT -04:00)

 
ORANJESTAD/ THE HAGUE – The Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) has expressed his concern about government corruption during talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP). This is evident from his answer to Chamber questions which PVV Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman asked the Minister and the Secretary of State Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA) on the 26th of June.

The questions are about the political climate on Aruba and the Netherlands Antilles as a result of the interview in the Volkskrant newspaper with former deputy Attorney General (PG) Nico Jörg, who described the climate as being ‘dismal’. Brinkman asked whether the Dutch Minister was aware of ‘the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as confusion of interests, lobbying for political reasons and nepotism in Aruba” and what the Minister has subsequently done with this information.
Hirsch Ballin responds that the Aruban Public Prosecution has taken various such cases of corruption to court whereby a few resulted in a conviction. “During talks with, amongst others, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I have expressed my concern and have spoken about improvements in the system, which can prevent corruption.”

Brinkman also asked how much money was at stake in the last five years of this corruption. The Minister says not to know, seeing as corruption is a matter of the central government. And with regard to the tenders by the Aruban government, Hirsch Ballin says also not to have any insight in that area seeing as this matter belongs to Aruba. The PVV-member brought forward in his question that tenders are not always transparent, as was stated in the newspaper interview. The Justice Minister also claims to be aware of the shortcomings in legislation. “The Netherlands delivers technical aid in order to support Aruba in its legislation process and to rid them of these shortcomings as soon as possible”, says Hirsch Ballin.
Brinkman also wants to know how Jörg’s presumption that the Public Prosecution on Aruba is met with resistance when it does more than just combating crime, came about. Also to this question the Minister replies that the Public Prosecution is matter for the central government and that he is not in the position to judge the ‘steps which the Public Prosecution has taken or should have taken in whichever situation.” The Minister furthermore finds that the Public Prosecution should be able to execute its work “independently, and through the regular authorities”.

Finally the Dutch Member of Parliament would also like to know if the Minister thinks that everyone which got his/her job through nepotism should be fired on the spot. To this Hirsch Ballin replies: “When hiring personnel the suitability of the candidate for the function should be the first priority. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. I take it that Aruba stands behind the importance of this criteria. I also don’t have insight into the exchange of personnel with the Aruban government organ.”

 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 27, 2008, 11:59:17 AM
I believe the google translated version of this was posted yesterday:

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44899.php

The Netherlands worried about corruption Aruba
25 Jul, 2008, 16:07 (GMT -04:00)

 
ORANJESTAD/ THE HAGUE – The Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) has expressed his concern about government corruption during talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP). This is evident from his answer to Chamber questions which PVV Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman asked the Minister and the Secretary of State Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA) on the 26th of June.

The questions are about the political climate on Aruba and the Netherlands Antilles as a result of the interview in the Volkskrant newspaper with former deputy Attorney General (PG) Nico Jörg, who described the climate as being ‘dismal’. Brinkman asked whether the Dutch Minister was aware of ‘the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as confusion of interests, lobbying for political reasons and nepotism in Aruba” and what the Minister has subsequently done with this information.
Hirsch Ballin responds that the Aruban Public Prosecution has taken various such cases of corruption to court whereby a few resulted in a conviction. “During talks with, amongst others, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I have expressed my concern and have spoken about improvements in the system, which can prevent corruption.”

Brinkman also asked how much money was at stake in the last five years of this corruption. The Minister says not to know, seeing as corruption is a matter of the central government. And with regard to the tenders by the Aruban government, Hirsch Ballin says also not to have any insight in that area seeing as this matter belongs to Aruba. The PVV-member brought forward in his question that tenders are not always transparent, as was stated in the newspaper interview. The Justice Minister also claims to be aware of the shortcomings in legislation. “The Netherlands delivers technical aid in order to support Aruba in its legislation process and to rid them of these shortcomings as soon as possible”, says Hirsch Ballin.
Brinkman also wants to know how Jörg’s presumption that the Public Prosecution on Aruba is met with resistance when it does more than just combating crime, came about. Also to this question the Minister replies that the Public Prosecution is matter for the central government and that he is not in the position to judge the ‘steps which the Public Prosecution has taken or should have taken in whichever situation.” The Minister furthermore finds that the Public Prosecution should be able to execute its work “independently, and through the regular authorities”.

Finally the Dutch Member of Parliament would also like to know if the Minister thinks that everyone which got his/her job through nepotism should be fired on the spot. To this Hirsch Ballin replies: “When hiring personnel the suitability of the candidate for the function should be the first priority. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. I take it that Aruba stands behind the importance of this criteria. I also don’t have insight into the exchange of personnel with the Aruban government organ.”

 


typical aruban responses to accusations.  the central govt. (holland) is responsible for the problems.  until the dutch actually try to correct problems, then the response is that it's up


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 12:19:51 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44910.php
Google Translation

Netherlands concerned about corruption Aruba
July 25, 2008, 17:58 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD / THE HAGUE - snip

Finally, the Dutch parliamentarian also know whether the Minister believes that anyone who through cronyism or nepotism to a job, standing on foot should be dismissed. This Hirsch Ballin replied: "When recruiting staff, the suitability for the post first. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. Ga I assume that Aruba the importance of these criteria endorses. The staff is however an autonomous Aruban matter. I have no insight into the human changes in the Aruban government. "

I suspect there will be little government left if this happened. LOL


First off, the Dutch would have to get rid of a whole slew of their own judges and prosecutor/justice ministry staff. These are people they have sent to work on Aruba who have set up a good ole boy network to protect each other. Very few true Arubans have been involved in this fiasco that one Dutch boy and his well-connected father have caused for Aruba.
Very true Dayhiker!  This system has been in place for many years now.  The true Arubans know that those in the "good ole boy network" are protected regardless of the crime, regardless of the cost.  That's why they won't come forward as witnesses to any crime commited by this group of heartless lowlifes.  If they dare to do so, they become the accused of some trumped up crime, or suddenly develop mental disorders that send them away...to be silenced.  It's a "no win" situation for them, such as in this case.  I believe many KNOW about the activities that have kept the truth hidden in Natalee's case, they are afraid to tell what they know; and sadly they are the ones that are most affected by the loss of tourism.  I hope that those that are trying to expose the corruption, nepotism, and cronyism in the Aruban government will be successful in bringing change, but I'm not holding my breath.  If things continue as they are, I believe it will get a lot worse for the Aruban people before it gets better.  With next years elections, hopefully they will have had enough and will let their voices be heard at the polls.  But then again, who controls the elections?????  Could it be the same ones that aren't above orchestrating certain traffic fatalities to gain or retain power?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 12:36:53 PM
I don't understand all these traffic deaths on Aruba.  It's only about 18 miles to drive around and even given the crowded conditions there and the numerous streets and alleys and by-roads, why does someone have to die there almost everyday?  Do people get in their cars and just put the pedal to the metal and never even look around until they get to their destination?  What do they do?  How can they afford to drive like total idiots down there risking every person's life that dares to operate a vehicle?  Seems to me they need some speed limit enforcement.  If you are driving less than 35 miles an hour, how hard it is to stop at an intersection?  The MEP needs to act like a governing body and actually govern.  What are the speed limits in Aruba, anyway?  :roll:

Maybe they should confiscate their porn videos so they don't peek and drive.

I think it's as simple as too much drugs and alcohol and party atmosphere. 
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/thstoned.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/djsmile.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/16.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/crossfingers.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/image008MA15364474-0114.gif)          ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 27, 2008, 12:59:57 PM
I don't understand all these traffic deaths on Aruba.  It's only about 18 miles to drive around and even given the crowded conditions there and the numerous streets and alleys and by-roads, why does someone have to die there almost everyday?  Do people get in their cars and just put the pedal to the metal and never even look around until they get to their destination?  What do they do?  How can they afford to drive like total idiots down there risking every person's life that dares to operate a vehicle?  Seems to me they need some speed limit enforcement.  If you are driving less than 35 miles an hour, how hard it is to stop at an intersection?  The MEP needs to act like a governing body and actually govern.  What are the speed limits in Aruba, anyway?  :roll:

Maybe they should confiscate their porn videos so they don't peek and drive.

I think it's as simple as too much drugs and alcohol and party atmosphere. 
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/thstoned.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/djsmile.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/16.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/crossfingers.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/image008MA15364474-0114.gif)          ::MonkeyWink::
::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 27, 2008, 01:06:56 PM
Klaasend wrote;
Quote
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

True there are a whole lot of auto accidents and fatalities there. But I have to admit this one looks strange. The cars look in strange proximity to one another. They look like they crashed at a construction site yet one is hardly damaged. I can see a body outside one car, laying on what appear to be concrete blocks in a rectangular pattern. Even if the person were dead in the car and removed by someone, who would place them on blocks in such a manner? I wonder if all auto accidents are what we are lead to believe? Just as are all
hanging suicides what we are lead to believe. We all know the answer to that one.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 27, 2008, 01:43:03 PM
D J Diablo.....at Mambo Jambo 7/25
http://www.coolaruba.com/component/option,com_gallery2/Itemid,28/?g2_itemId=438537


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 27, 2008, 01:58:35 PM
D J Diablo.....at Mambo Jambo 7/25
http://www.coolaruba.com/component/option,com_gallery2/Itemid,28/?g2_itemId=438537

Puff ee Daddy


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 27, 2008, 02:22:22 PM
Looking for more info but ALERT:

Missing Persons: Cedrika Provencher FOUND SAFE

No this is false please remove post , also if you can remove post in missing persons.....sorry for extra work any MOD   TIA

Edited by San:  I deleted your post


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on July 27, 2008, 02:29:04 PM
Klaasend wrote;
Quote
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

True there are a whole lot of auto accidents and fatalities there. But I have to admit this one looks strange. The cars look in strange proximity to one another. They look like they crashed at a construction site yet one is hardly damaged. I can see a body outside one car, laying on what appear to be concrete blocks in a rectangular pattern. Even if the person were dead in the car and removed by someone, who would place them on blocks in such a manner? I wonder if all auto accidents are what we are lead to believe? Just as are all
hanging suicides what we are lead to believe. We all know the answer to that one.


If you read the comments under the pictures, looks like people are not happy they gave the police money for overtime, but they are not preventing accidents.  That is what I can get from it.  I don't blame them.  Aruba is ridiculous.  The traffic fatalities vs. population of Aruba must be astronomical.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 27, 2008, 03:33:33 PM
D J Diablo.....at Mambo Jambo 7/25
http://www.coolaruba.com/component/option,com_gallery2/Itemid,28/?g2_itemId=438537

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/djdiabloCroes072508.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 27, 2008, 03:42:23 PM
Thank-you San, I was so happy when I first thought it was Cedrika it made me delirious.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 04:40:27 PM
Klaasend wrote;
Quote
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

True there are a whole lot of auto accidents and fatalities there. But I have to admit this one looks strange. The cars look in strange proximity to one another. They look like they crashed at a construction site yet one is hardly damaged. I can see a body outside one car, laying on what appear to be concrete blocks in a rectangular pattern. Even if the person were dead in the car and removed by someone, who would place them on blocks in such a manner? I wonder if all auto accidents are what we are lead to believe? Just as are all
hanging suicides what we are lead to believe. We all know the answer to that one.
In my opinion some of them are more than likely just as suspicious as the "hand in the pocket" hanging suicides.
 ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 27, 2008, 05:57:35 PM
Wednesday June 22, 2005

While being transferred from police station to KIA, Deepak and Satish are secretly recorded in a 40min conversation:

D: And I also trusted Freddy like a brother.

S: Yes.

D: But he also talked shit, that's why we've been arrested.

S: What did he say?

D: He keeps information behind. You know that Van der Sloot trusts Freddy with his life. Freddy knows what has happened.
Freddy knows the truth.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 27, 2008, 06:48:18 PM
Klaasend wrote;
Quote
Geez, yet another traffic fatality in Aruba:

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/5583/8/

True there are a whole lot of auto accidents and fatalities there. But I have to admit this one looks strange. The cars look in strange proximity to one another. They look like they crashed at a construction site yet one is hardly damaged. I can see a body outside one car, laying on what appear to be concrete blocks in a rectangular pattern. Even if the person were dead in the car and removed by someone, who would place them on blocks in such a manner? I wonder if all auto accidents are what we are lead to believe? Just as are all
hanging suicides what we are lead to believe. We all know the answer to that one.

That's very odd.  Maybe it's a kind of insurance fraud?  I hate to even use that phrase...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 27, 2008, 06:48:30 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/thstoned.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/djsmile.gif)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/16.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/crossfingers.gif)  (http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/image008MA15364474-0114.gif)          ::MonkeyWink::

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: omg texasmom  ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 08:07:15 PM

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/NoTour.gif)


Great graphic CBB! It is amazing that over three years later you can't do an internet search about Aruba without the island being associated with words like "murder" "drugging" "corruption" and "boycott". We can all pat ourselves on the back for keeping Natalee's story alive. The Arubans tried to make this case go away, but it's not going away and never will go away until they prosecute and imprison their criminals!
IT'S NOT GOING AWAY, ARUBA!!!!!! ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 27, 2008, 08:14:48 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 08:42:20 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php
I'm not sure you'll gain much more than you'd already deciphered but here's a version after the Papiamento translator.
 ::MonkeyConfused::

tuesday morning during of they patrol some agent policial owing to dicidi of as one control on de la sallestraat where cu week happen where without more ministro of husticia, rudy croes, contra of all conseho y even can tell contra of ley, owing to dicidi on his self of place the police sleep fast imelda kleuterschool cu the unique intencion for autonan descend they velocidad fast of scol. but yesterday owing to stay comproba cu without control of police, majority mortorist is desvia the sleeping police, for not dañanan car. hour cu police owing to stop eynan yesterday morning, they self owing to constata cu this without more owing to stop become obstruccion for trafico. on the fotonan can see con the trafico owing to stagna completamente, y this is without, cu have scol awendia, because the children is cu vakantie. the police sleep here, tey bao for 24 hour, y are you ask about do you self, cu de la sallestraat is one ruta principal of ambulance. the ambulance have cu happen on the sleeping policenan here, cu can cause damage n’e paciente? questions clave cu is stay is, if this is necesario, dicon owing to busca the police sleep then? is cuanto coin esakinan is costa? is cual compania is sell esakinan? is cual compania owing to come stick they? that is owner of the companianan here? as we of awemainta owing to señala end, owing to give one compania the trabao here, without owing to as one destaho publico. then here is one partimento of cake have for friends & family. after cu polisnan owing to end of controla fast of the scol y they owing to bay for of the sitio can owing to see claramente cu all car owing to follow happen at near, then this is one onbegonnen werk. coin throw afo punt uit. before after


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 27, 2008, 08:42:41 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php

For all the good they do down in Aruba, they would be better off to

just save their money, and let them run over real ALE sleeping policemen!!!!



I mean, they aren't doing much anyway.


OMG!!!! Did I just say that???


I really need to be a better person.

>Elmo workin' on it! ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on July 27, 2008, 09:04:54 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php


'(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HairSpray.jpg)(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Rudy.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 09:21:22 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php


'(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HairSpray.jpg)(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Rudy.jpg)
::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 09:39:27 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php

For all the good they do down in Aruba, they would be better off to

just save their money, and let them run over real ALE sleeping policemen!!!!



I mean, they aren't doing much anyway.


OMG!!!! Did I just say that???


I really need to be a better person.

>Elmo workin' on it! ::MonkeyTongue::
Elmo's just fine...it's those big dummies that make Elmo (and texasmom) say mean things...they're the ones that need to change!
 ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 27, 2008, 09:46:08 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/DJ_Diablo___Mambo_Jambo-2-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/zhendrikcroeswq7-1-1-1-2.jpg)(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/RudygoatAruba52-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 27, 2008, 09:59:36 PM
I like Elmo just the way he is. ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 27, 2008, 10:43:15 PM
 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

Kimberly Guilford just made an analogy of Drew Peterson's taped conversations to those of Joran Van Der Sloot's. She made the point, "Well we all saw where that one went, so we'll hope for better with this one!"

I'm paraphrasing, but that was the gest gist of it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 27, 2008, 11:12:55 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php


'(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HairSpray.jpg)(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Rudy.jpg)
::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

ROFLMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

hahahahahahahahaha


Love it!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 27, 2008, 11:18:15 PM
I like Elmo just the way he is. ::MonkeyTongue::


Thank you!

Elmo like you too.

 ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 27, 2008, 11:20:56 PM
::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

Kimberly Guilford just made an analogy of Drew Peterson's taped conversations to those of Joran Van Der Sloot's. She made the point, "Well we all saw where that one went, so we'll hope for better with this one!"

I'm paraphrasing, but that was the gest gist of it.


Kim always seems to say what I am thinking.

That is why I like to watch her!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 27, 2008, 11:56:29 PM
Is there anyone in the house who might be able to translate this for me? It seems Rudy Croes has instituted the sleeping policemen in the roads to slow traffic? LOL 

http://www.awemainta.com/4.php


'(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/HairSpray.jpg)(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Rudy.jpg)
::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

ROFLMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

hahahahahahahahaha


Love it!
Aruba = sham-WOW!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 28, 2008, 12:45:08 AM
LOL@WRECK!!  ::MonkeyLaugh::

But you are all mistaken about the hair. It's not hair at all. It's a helmet!

                 (http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/leather-helmet.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 28, 2008, 07:28:53 AM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/DFDGFGD.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 08:32:26 AM
This is very strange !

JUDGE ROBERT WIT OBSTRUCTS THE GATHERING OF EVIDENCE

Joran van der Sloot was arrested on June 9, 2005 and a search warrant was issued for a complete search of the Van der Sloot residence and property five days later on June 14th. When the prosecution and police teams arrived to search the home they were met at the door by Dutch judge Robert Wit who summarily change the search warrant on the spot to exclude the Van der Sloot main residence and grounds, limiting the search only to Joran’s small apartment in the back of the house.

Judge Wit blocked the search of the van der Sloot residence even though he knew through Joran's police statements that he said he was in the main house in the early morning hours when he returned home after supposedly dropping Ms. Holloway off. In other words, Judge Wit ignored testimony by a key suspect to obstruct the collection of evidence from the suspect's residence.

Joran was arrested twice and his father was arrested once in the first month of the investigation. The main residence of the Van der Sloot home was never searched after either of these arrests.
(http://s252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/th_wit.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 09:11:11 AM
 joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 09:24:44 AM
Johann, Is that a new picture?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 09:38:04 AM
Johann, Is that a new picture?

yes i think so ! ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 28, 2008, 09:51:10 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 10:15:45 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

yes 17 may 2008


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 28, 2008, 10:39:20 AM
Hi and Good Morning everyone. I hope everyone is doing well!

I was away for a little bit and had some time to think about a few aspects of the case.

I guess for me it's always been a government sanctioned murdered, and I went back to some of my original thinking while I was away. I think the jury is in on that. The Sloots and Kalpoes DID make something bad happen to Natalee and the government covered it all up to protect tourism.

Here's where I'm at currently, and I think this is where I will probably be remain.

Natalee was indeed "disappeared" due to her injuries. Those injuries caused Natalee's death, not any drugs she was slipped. A combination could certainly exist, but in my opinion, Natalee was not going home with those injuries, dead or alive. The motivating factor was rape. Every crime needs a motivation. I've seen a few stories recently that have a person murdered and the authorities saying that there does not need to be a motivational factor to commit a crime. That's dead wrong and always has been. Sex crimes are usually brutal and leaves the victim scarred for life, should he / she survive. Classic case is the woman that was raped and tortured for 19 hours and miraculously survived. The motivation was a rape / power / control / sex. It always is in a case such as Natalee's.

I got caught up in the hopes that the Persistence would locate Natalee. I really wished it would happen, however, I think the only chance that she will be recovered by any search vessel will be by shear luck. I believe Natalee was recovered by the ALE in the first 10 days and according to Zandaam she could have been recovered as early as day two. This seems much more likely to me.

Aruba has been covering up crimes against tourists for so long it's old hat to them. Instead of coming clean, they immediately resort to their known modus operadi. That's how they roll. Now their caught. They just can't up and admit they did what so many have accused them of since day two. A government as insecure as Aruba will never admit what they did here, and the next administration will most likely keep the cover up on going. That's how third world governments work. Always have and always will. The next election in 2009 is almost meaningless. No one is going to open the vault to the real docs and lay the blame at the feet of any one person or describe in detail what they know or what went down here. That would have happened already.

So, where is Natalee? - it will be the question so many Americans will ask for a generation, if not longer. This isn't going away any time soon, if ever. Too many people care about Natalee, even if it is only in passing conversation.

I guess in my opinion, there are only two probabilities left.

1. Natalee is gone and will never be found. She was found by the Aruban Authorities early on and they incinerated her. She will not ever be located. The AAs had 3 years to get the mess over with and if they could give Natalee back and get this over, they would. They have been hammered by us and so many others (more on that shortly). They made a decision early on and have to live but it. They can't undo what has been done. They wish they could, but it's too late.

2. The Aruban Authorities found Natalee early on and decided to cover the crimes to protect tourism. While the investigation was on going the Aruban Authorities need to get this over and came up with another idea. This scenario involves the recovery of Natalee and the placement of Natalee in the ocean. In a sense, they want Natalee found, but can not appear to have had anything to do with it. So credible tips come in and that leads to a search. That search reveals 170+ targets on the ocean floor, and the Aruban Authorities wait for the next search to sort it all out and through attrition Natalee is found.

In my opinion, scenario number two is remote. And scenario one is the most plausible.

Scenario two is very remote for several reasons, the first would be that the Dutch have their own navy with all the advance equipment the Persistence uses and there have been no known searches for Natalee to my knowledge. The Dutch could have found Natalee more than two years ago if they really wanted to and she was located in the ocean. Secondly, as related by OE, the Persistence got out the ROV when a target looked like it could meet the description of a container Natalee was placed in. I don't recall how many targets were identified as looking like a match, but we all now that at least one target was interesting enough to check it out further. We will probably never hear an official report on what was really found there.

"Higher Powers" = it's out the Sloots hands. They just go with he flow and have mentally absolved themselves of the crimes they themselves have committed against Natalee and her family. Joran tells us all that the the Patrick tapes. That equals the propaganda campaign. The Sloots need rehabilitated and Natalee needs to be furthered tarnished. There is no need for the propaganda campaign if Natalee was everything that the haters described her as. People like Gielen would not touch this third rail if this was not all about the Sloot and not Natalee. So, it's all about the rehabilitation of the murdering raping Sloot Family. Interesting that the Aruban Government is not seeking a rehabilitation make over. Those brave enough in Holland are saying just that. They are what they are and always will be. The Sloots are confined to Aruba. They are in jail so to say. They are not coming to the US. They know what that would entail. They would last about 2 seconds. The lovers here want them dead.

~~~~~~~~~~

break

~~~~~~~~~~

while I was away, I had a chance to speak to a lot of people and some were in the tourism industry. Not one person I spoke to thought Natalee simply disappeared. 100% agreed that Joran and the Kalpoes killed Natalee and not one would ever consider going to Rooba or ever going back. We met quite a few that had been to Aruba many times and just simply mentioning the name Aruba made people want to yak. Every single person knew who Natalee was. There was no need to explain any of the circumstances that encompass the case, everyone knew the details. One woman in particular knew all about TES and the Persistence and the bloggers and posters.

Aruba is destroyed. They made their bed and now must live with it. They know that. We know that. It's a valuable lesson for other governments.

The Aruba Brand will never ever be the same. Actually it is the same as it ever was, it's just now exposed. Aruba will not be coming back from what they created for themselves. I'm quite sure that it's all over for Aruba. They may say in the future that things are improving, but the reality is the only people still going there are those that have time-shares and are stuck.

~~~~

break

~~~~

the mayhem currently happening on Aruba is extremely repulsive. I actually saw the Black Squad on AWE24 for the first time in a few years, and they seem to be trying to put a lid on the violence and mayhem. Then there was the mob scene in downtown Oranjestad the other night. That was a tourist brochure scene if I've ever seen one!

Not to mention all of the vehicular homicides over the last few weeks. Aruba should be a golf cart community. Those people can not handle a real motorized vehicle.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 10:39:36 AM
It's a kind of a party bus for heavy boozers and they had a stop at a local bar
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/P_BUS.jpg?t=1217255614)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 11:12:21 AM
The legal drinking age is 18 on Aruba

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJorankopie.jpg?t=1217257843)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 28, 2008, 11:30:01 AM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 28, 2008, 11:37:41 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

looks like he's following right along in big brothers footsteps. heartwarming, isn't it?  i'm sure anita and paulus are just thrilled to death for him.
dennisintn




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 28, 2008, 11:38:41 AM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::



Thank you Klaas, good to be back!!! ::MonkeyCool::

here's a new one - hot off Fox!

British Newlywed Murdered While on Honeymoon in Antigua

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392101,00.html

- let's see how Antigua deals with this one.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 28, 2008, 11:40:38 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

yes 17 may 2008

they have a party bus that tours all the different bars on the island.  is it this one?
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 28, 2008, 11:43:28 AM
It's a kind of a party bus for heavy boozers and they had a stop at a local bar
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/P_BUS.jpg?t=1217255614)

this bus is the

Kukoo Kunuku
    Dinner & Bar-Hopping Bus
    Tel: (297) 586-2010
    www.kukookunuku.com

I've been on that thing once... last stop was CnC


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 11:55:23 AM
Interesting post Rob, glad your back..


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 28, 2008, 12:06:28 PM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::




Rob....agreed! Welcome back.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 12:06:57 PM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Animation1-4.gif?t=1217261045)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 28, 2008, 12:07:37 PM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::



Thank you Klaas, good to be back!!! ::MonkeyCool::

here's a new one - hot off Fox!

British Newlywed Murdered While on Honeymoon in Antigua

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392101,00.html

- let's see how Antigua deals with this one.

according to tourist minister, eddie briesen, aruba's handling of the natalee holloway case is now the model to be used by cari. tourist centers in the death/disappearances of tourists.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on July 28, 2008, 12:13:46 PM
Rob,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.  I sense a touch of the inevitable in your writing.  I also understand why that is.  Many of us who have posted in support of justice for Natalee at this site have always had a very difficult time accepting that a government would assist in such a deplorable act as what we know happened on Aruba.  The individuals involved in the death of this young woman you would expect to lie their way through this...but to have the very individuals responsible for law and order join in and approve the cover-up defies our sense common decency.  To rob a person of their life, to rob a family of the chance to even have that loved one returned to them and to actually make a concerted effort to 'destroy' the victims of this cruel and inhumane act sickens us to no end.

I hope you are not giving up on finding the answers as I think many will continue to search in their own ways.  You have dedicated so many hours to finding justice for Natalee and her family and I know you were hopeful, as we all were, that these answers would come.  I think they will come.  It's just a matter of time.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: BTgirl on July 28, 2008, 12:46:34 PM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::



Thank you Klaas, good to be back!!! ::MonkeyCool::

here's a new one - hot off Fox!

British Newlywed Murdered While on Honeymoon in Antigua

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392101,00.html

- let's see how Antigua deals with this one.

Hi Rob,

I visited Antigua once and thought it was a cut above most of the places in the Caribbean. I'll bet they hop on this crime and try to solve it as quickly as possible so as to not scare off any of their well-heeled tourists/residents. Below is a list from Wikipedia of a few of the famous people who own property there:

Oprah Winfrey, American television/entertainment icon and entrepreneur; owns a home near Galley Bay
Eric Clapton, established an Antiguan drug treatment centre; has a home on the south of the island
Giorgio Armani, Italian fashion designer; owns a home near Galley Bay
Calvin Ayre, billionaire founder of internet gambling company Bodog Entertainment Group
Allen Stanford, Texan billionaire, and business tycoon.
Robin Leach. of Lifestyles of the rich and famous fame.
Larry Flynt, US-based Publisher.
Silvio Berlusconi, Italian Prime Minister
Timothy Dalton, Actor of James Bond fame
Richard Branson, Virgin Atlantic mogul


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 28, 2008, 04:15:53 PM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/aboriginepipe.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 28, 2008, 04:18:15 PM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 28, 2008, 04:29:02 PM
Yikes just tell me WTH is going on? Is this a bar IN aRUBA or a night at the senior citIzen circus? Only makes me scratch my head and ask once again WTH?
(http://mangodesignstudio.com/gallery/albums/26-07-2008%20CLASSICKATA/normal_11CLASSIC_11.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 28, 2008, 04:41:04 PM
 ::MonkeyCool::

Rob, good to see you ole friend! I enjoyed your post. I have been pobering the case this afternoon and something hit me.

HAS NELSON ODUBER EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS RUDY CROES EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS KARIN JANNSEN EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS BEN VOCKING EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS JAN VAN DER STRATEN EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS GEROLD DOMPIG EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS JUDGE BOB WIT EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?

HAS JUDGE RICK SMID EVER DENIED A COVER-UP?


The Aruban government and judiciary have been accused over and over again in the media and internet of covering up the crimes against Natalee and none of them have ever denied it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 28, 2008, 04:41:27 PM
OMG  IS THE WHOLE COUNTRY ON DRUGS DOWN THERE? LOL

http://www.mifmaruba.com/gallery.html

http://www.mifmaruba.com/gallery.html

http://www.mifmaruba.com/gallery.html

http://www.mifmaruba.com/gallery.html

http://www.mifmaruba.com/gallery.html





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 28, 2008, 04:43:19 PM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.


She looks like she just saw Joran's teenie weenie, or lack of one thereof.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 28, 2008, 04:47:13 PM
Rob - I agree and great to see you back.  ::MonkeyWink::



Thank you Klaas, good to be back!!! ::MonkeyCool::

here's a new one - hot off Fox!

British Newlywed Murdered While on Honeymoon in Antigua

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392101,00.html

- let's see how Antigua deals with this one.


A British doctor was killed and her newlywed husband critically wounded in an apparent robbery at a beach hotel in Antigua, officials in the Caribbean island said Monday.

At least one gunman entered their cottage at Coco's Hotel before dawn Sunday and shot Catherine Bowen and Benjamin Mullany, Police Commissioner Gary Nelson said.


Authorities have questioned several people but have not made any arrests, Nelson said.

A special task force that includes police and members of the military set up checkpoints in the area of the attack and searched cars and people's backpacks for any leads, he said.

Mullany was in critical condition at Holberton General Hospital in the Antiguan capital of St. John's, with a gunshot wound.

The couple, both 31, came to Antigua for a two-week honeymoon following their July 12 marriage, police said.

Mullany was a doctor from the Pontardawe area of south Wales, the British Broadcasting Corp. reported.

Harold Lovell, tourism minister of the two-island nation of Antigua and Barbuda, met with guests at the hotel, in the island's southwest, and said security would be increased in the area. The government offered to relocate any guests who wanted to leave.

"We were able to get the guests together in the dining room and to reassure them that this is an isolated incident and that Antigua remains a safe destination," Lovell said.

Bowen was the 10th person slain so far this year in Antigua.


DOES THIS SOUND FAMILIAR?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 28, 2008, 04:51:25 PM
This is very strange !

JUDGE ROBERT WIT OBSTRUCTS THE GATHERING OF EVIDENCE

Joran van der Sloot was arrested on June 9, 2005 and a search warrant was issued for a complete search of the Van der Sloot residence and property five days later on June 14th. When the prosecution and police teams arrived to search the home they were met at the door by Dutch judge Robert Wit who summarily change the search warrant on the spot to exclude the Van der Sloot main residence and grounds, limiting the search only to Joran’s small apartment in the back of the house.

Judge Wit blocked the search of the van der Sloot residence even though he knew through Joran's police statements that he said he was in the main house in the early morning hours when he returned home after supposedly dropping Ms. Holloway off. In other words, Judge Wit ignored testimony by a key suspect to obstruct the collection of evidence from the suspect's residence.

Joran was arrested twice and his father was arrested once in the first month of the investigation. The main residence of the Van der Sloot home was never searched after either of these arrests.
(http://s252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/th_wit.jpg)



Then he waits 2 1/2 years to defend himself, calling Dompig a liar. I choose to believe Judge Bob Wit is the liar, otherwise he'd have made his decision clear in December 2005 when Dompig first revealed he had blocked both searches.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Quisp on July 28, 2008, 04:52:32 PM
Has this been discussd? Here is a long article explaining how Aruba was bought by the mafia.

http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm (http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm)

..a snippet..."The Croes Family has been accused of ties with Cuntrera-Caruana. The Sicilian mafiosi payed for a trip of another brother, Rudy Croes (who succeeded Hendrik as Minister of Justice in a previous MEP government) as party secretary to a meeting of the Socialist International in Turkey. This has not been denied."



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 04:53:30 PM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.

yes this is in a bar
the touristic bus stops sometimes ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Quisp on July 28, 2008, 04:58:29 PM
Another snip..."The Cuntrera-Caruana clan had links with another Aruban bank: the Interbank. The bank granted a credit to the Cuntrera company "Investeringen Tweehonderd en Tien" for 1.8 million Aruban guilders (approximately one million dollars). Why the Cuntreras who own several investment companies in Venezuela needed the loan is unknown.

One could speculate, however, this was a 'loan-back' operation to launder money. An amount of money is deposited cash at a bank and the bank lends the money back: now there is a clean and legitimate source of earnings.
                                         ****
The Interbank is owned by the Mansur Family. If anybody owns 60 per cent of the island, it is this powerful family.
                                          ****
Jossy Mansur is the owner and chief editor of the biggest newspaper on the island, "Diario". "When I read an article in Diario, I know what will be the next action of the government,"says Hendrik Croes, adding that the Mansurs create a climate of fear and intimidation on Aruba."


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 05:00:26 PM
Thats a girl in that picture??? Well, where, pray tell is her blouse??  Maybe Carpe should draw one on her as well. ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Quisp on July 28, 2008, 05:04:04 PM
"The Intercon Financial Bank on Aruba is represented by the law-firm Croes & Wever. One of the partners is former Minister of Justice Hendrik Croes. The firm's trust-company Arulex was implicated in setting up the bank. "Yes, we are involved with that bank," says Croes. "We still handle all their legal affairs, but we don't know anything of their financial accounts."

unreal...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: mrskub on July 28, 2008, 05:19:12 PM
Former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba Wever died
28 Jul, 2008, 17:52 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD/AMSTERDAM – The former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Roy Wever died unexpectedly on Sunday at the age of 58.

Up until this time, Wever had been head of the Legal Affairs department of the Aruba house in the Netherlands. The funeral ceremony will be held coming Wednesday in The Hague, after which his remains will be flown over to Aruba to be buried. Apart from having been the Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Wever was also Advisor for Crime and Terrorism Prevention, Representative for Aruba in the Financial Action Task Force and Managing Director of CB-JAZ.

 http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44969.php


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 05:24:15 PM
Thats a girl in that picture??? Well, where, pray tell is her blouse??  Maybe Carpe should draw one on her as well. ::MonkeyNoNo::
she used some partydrugs ?

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 05:24:42 PM
Former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba Wever died
28 Jul, 2008, 17:52 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD/AMSTERDAM – The former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Roy Wever died unexpectedly on Sunday at the age of 58.

Up until this time, Wever had been head of the Legal Affairs department of the Aruba house in the Netherlands. The funeral ceremony will be held coming Wednesday in The Hague, after which his remains will be flown over to Aruba to be buried. Apart from having been the Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Wever was also Advisor for Crime and Terrorism Prevention, Representative for Aruba in the Financial Action Task Force and Managing Director of CB-JAZ
 http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44969.php

...and what a bang-up job he did in that capacity! ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyRoll::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 28, 2008, 05:26:13 PM
Has this been discussd? Here is a long article explaining how Aruba was bought by the mafia.

http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm (http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm)

..a snippet..."The Croes Family has been accused of ties with Cuntrera-Caruana. The Sicilian mafiosi payed for a trip of another brother, Rudy Croes (who succeeded Hendrik as Minister of Justice in a previous MEP government) as party secretary to a meeting of the Socialist International in Turkey. This has not been denied."



Quisp, when I click on your link above, it's redirecting me to : http://www.routledgestrategicstudies.com/

I'm getting lost. ::MonkeyHaHa::

The topic, however, has been discussed, but another link was used...I have it somewhere, just not handy right now.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 28, 2008, 05:26:34 PM
"The Intercon Financial Bank on Aruba is represented by the law-firm Croes & Wever. One of the partners is former Minister of Justice Hendrik Croes. The firm's trust-company Arulex was implicated in setting up the bank. "Yes, we are involved with that bank," says Croes. "We still handle all their legal affairs, but we don't know anything of their financial accounts."

unreal...

I don't know how Hendrik Croes could make a statement about now knowing anything about financial accounts when Arulex, among others, is listed as a corporate body of Intercon Financial Bank.  Hendrik Croes is a Managing Director of Arulex N.V.


INTERCON FINANCIAL BANK N.V.  
Business address PUNTA BRABO Z/N, ORANJESTAD WEST 
Legal form  LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY 
Name of the company  INTERCON FINANCIAL BANK N.V. 
Statutory seat  ARUBA 
Date of incorporation  8 DECEMBER 1989 

 
DIRECTORS - AUTHORIZED PERSONS AND CORPORATE BODIES - SUPERVISORY BOARD: 
 
ARULEX N.V.  
Established at  ARULEX CENTER, PUNTA BRABO Z/N, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Since  8 DECEMBER 1989 

****************************************************************

ARULEX N.V. 
 
Business address PUNTA BRABO Z/N, ORANJESTAD WEST 
Legal form  LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY 
Name of the company  ARULEX N.V. 
Statutory seat  ARUBA 
Date of incorporation  28 MARCH 1973 
Last amendment in the articles  20 JULY 1988 
     
DIRECTORS - AUTHORIZED PERSONS AND CORPORATE BODIES - SUPERVISORY BOARD: 
 
CROES, HENDRIK SEFERINO
Residing in  SEROE PITA 22, PARADERA, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 8 JANUARY 1942 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Effective  19 SEPTEMBER 1975 
Authority  FULL 
   
TCHONG, PETRUS JOANNES; 
Residing in  BYRONSTRAAT 13, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 26 DECEMBER 1944 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Effective  26 OCTOBER 1995 
Authority  FULL 
   
WEVER, IRIS; 
Residing in  ESMERALDA 37, NOORD, ARUBA 
Born in  THE NETHERLANDS, NIJMEGEN on 8 FEBRUARY 1965 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Effective  1 SEPTEMBER 1997 
Authority  FULL 
   
WEVER-CROES, EVELYN CHRISTINA; 
Residing in  SEROE BLANCO 245, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 5 DECEMBER 1966 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Effective  11 MARCH 2004 
Authority  FULL 
   
PASSCHIER, DAVID MARTIN; 
Residing in  SEROE BIENTO 15-A, SANTA CRUZ, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 14 OCTOBER 1973 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  MANAGING DIRECTOR 
Effective  11 MARCH 2004 
Authority  FULL 


   


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 28, 2008, 05:31:11 PM
Thats a girl in that picture??? Well, where, pray tell is her blouse??  Maybe Carpe should draw one on her as well. ::MonkeyNoNo::


It looks like one of those androgynous mixes Joran hangs out with,

where you can't tell if it is a setter or a pointer...

Don't tell me Valentijn is batting out of both sides

of home plate, as well? They are all so gay. ::MonkeyHaHa::

It has to be in the water!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 28, 2008, 05:34:19 PM
Welcome back Rob.

I agree with what you said except the Sloots and US.  Val will be going to school in Boston (or maybe the Netherlands' branch). It was unclear.  I am sure the family will accompany him to school and assist in the settling.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 28, 2008, 05:38:52 PM
Thats a girl in that picture??? Well, where, pray tell is her blouse??  Maybe Carpe should draw one on her as well. ::MonkeyNoNo::


It looks like one of those androgynous mixes Joran hangs out with,

where you can't tell if it is a setter or a pointer...

Don't tell me Valentijn is batting out of both sides

of home plate, as well? They are all so gay. ::MonkeyHaHa::

It has to be in the water!

Now guuuyyyyys she looks very cute you are being kinda harsh. Her pupils look a tad dilated ...but cute none-the-less. ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 28, 2008, 05:46:25 PM
Were exactly is choose a Name on this pic ?

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/ChooseaName.jpg?t=1217281378)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 05:47:25 PM
Thats a girl in that picture??? Well, where, pray tell is her blouse??  Maybe Carpe should draw one on her as well. ::MonkeyNoNo::
she used some partydrugs ?

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)
I have seen that face before!

(http://bp0.blogger.com/_29_shKT4Elw/RkHisWW8dOI/AAAAAAAAAwo/gicC8keyg-o/s400/spicoli.bmp)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 28, 2008, 05:47:57 PM
Welcome back Rob.

I agree with what you said except the Sloots and US.  Val will be going to school in Boston (or maybe the Netherlands' branch). It was unclear.  I am sure the family will accompany him to school and assist in the settling.   ::MonkeyNoNo::


Sloots will be dead in 1 day if they come to the US.

Give me a break!!!


I don't give them even 1 full day. Forget it!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 05:49:45 PM
Wreck ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 05:56:41 PM
Bad Girl - NO SHOES- NO SHIRT- NO SERVICE!! ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 06:37:16 PM
Ok, this old, but I dont know if you have seen it.  http://judicial-inc.biz/j-o_ran_aruba_crime.htm    if that doesnt work, go to aruba.crime in Yahoo and go down to the article aruba crime syndicates.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 28, 2008, 06:45:21 PM
This article showed up in a google search I did yesterday for something totally unrelated, it caught my eye.  It is a lengthy article, so I snipped it...those that are interested can follow the link to read the rest. 

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/WestinArubaAdamCHochfelderMichaelBe.jpg)
Adam C. Hochfelder, left, is trying to buy the Peaks Resort. Michael Belfonti worked with him on the Westin Aruba Resort.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/09/realestate/commercial/09hotel.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

April 9, 2008
At Age 17, Ski Resort Has a Troubled Past (and Present)
By PATRICK O'GILFOIL HEALY and TERRY PRISTIN
Correction Appended

TELLURIDE, Colo. — Ever since it sprouted in the San Juan Mountains of southwestern Colorado 17 years ago, the Peaks Resort has loomed large over this tiny ski town. With about 170 rooms, the Peaks is the region’s largest hotel, a major employer and a crucial asset in luring the conventions and wealthy tourists who fuel the economy.

But behind its sunset-colored facade is a tangled tale of the hotel that couldn’t shoot straight. It has been bombarded by lawsuits and has stymied owner after owner in their struggles to turn a profit in Telluride’s seasonal economy.

The Blackstone Group, the once high-and-mighty private equity company that has watched its profits decline because of the credit squeeze, acquired the Peaks when it bought Wyndham Properties in 2005 and has tried to sell it for about $45 million. But since the hotel went on the market last June, two potential buyers, including Fairmont Hotels and Resorts, have signed contracts only to walk away without closing the deal.

In recent months, the once-hot investment market for luxury hotels has evaporated. Not a single top-tier hotel traded during the last quarter, said Patrick Ford, the president of Lodging Econometrics, a research company in Portsmouth, N.H. Hotel prices have declined about 15 percent since the summer.

Last month, Blackstone entered into yet another contract, with a team led by Adam C. Hochfelder, a New York real estate investor, now 36, who made a big splash at a tender age as an owner and manager of a large portfolio of Midtown Manhattan office towers, including the Helmsley Building, which straddles Park Avenue. But Mr. Hochfelder’s track record is as problem-plagued as the Peaks is.

Beginning in 2004, Mr. Hochfelder’s reputation began to plummet, as he defaulted on millions of dollars worth of loans and became mired in litigation with business associates and relatives. The Manhattan district attorney’s office began an investigation into his borrowing practices that is still active, a spokeswoman, Barbara Thompson, said last week.

Despite these setbacks and more recent difficulties, Mr. Hochfelder has continued to try to stake out a role as a major real estate player.

In 2006, Michael Belfonti of Hamden, Conn., bought a hotel now known as the Westin Aruba Resort and brought in Mr. Hochfelder as a noncontrolling minority partner. The hotel failed when the new owners tried to keep it open while doing a complete renovation. Last year, the owners defaulted on their loans, putting the mezzanine lender, Petra Capital Management, in control of the 478-room hotel, according to court documents.
Mr. Hochfelder, who is described even by people who are no longer speaking to him as a bright and engaging man with a winning smile, has been distributing a flier for his new company, HP Hotel Partners, that is made up of photographs of “selected projects” that include the Westin Aruba Resort and other properties that he no longer owns or never did
snip


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 28, 2008, 06:48:51 PM
Ok, this old, but I dont know if you have seen it.  http://judicial-inc.biz/j-o_ran_aruba_crime.htm    if that doesnt work, go to aruba.crime in Yahoo and go down to the article aruba crime syndicates.

The link doesn't work but that's just as well.  That particular website, although it does have some good photos and some good information, also has alot of bad information.  ALSO, it is a a very antisemitic website overall so I don't normally allow direct links to the site anyway.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 06:49:58 PM
Ok, this old, but I dont know if you have seen it.  http://judicial-inc.biz/j-o_ran_aruba_crime.htm    if that doesnt work, go to aruba.crime in Yahoo and go down to the article aruba crime syndicates.

http://judicial-inc.biz/  j_0_ran_aruba_crime.htm

Edited to break up the direct link


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 06:52:56 PM
Really, Klaasend, I didnt know that.  It doesnt have a titile at the top of it, just the information.  So sorry.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 06:54:24 PM
Ok, this old, but I dont know if you have seen it.  http://judicial-inc.biz/j-o_ran_aruba_crime.htm    if that doesnt work, go to aruba.crime in Yahoo and go down to the article aruba crime syndicates.

The link doesn't work but that's just as well.  That particular website, although it does have some good photos and some good information, also has alot of bad information.  ALSO, it is a a very antisemitic website overall so I don't normally allow direct links to the site anyway.
Please eradicate my link, please!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 28, 2008, 06:56:10 PM
Sorry Wreck!!!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 06:57:49 PM
Sorry Wreck!!!!!
No problem -- I didn't even read it (though I vaguley remember seeing it before)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 28, 2008, 07:00:39 PM
I know it's just the camera angle on that picture but at first, I thought that Hochfelder guy was a ventriloquist and the Belfonti guy his "dummy"
Shees...good thing jack and WOW aren't around.   ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 28, 2008, 08:14:05 PM
This article showed up in a google search I did yesterday for something totally unrelated, it caught my eye.  It is a lengthy article, so I snipped it...those that are interested can follow the link to read the rest. 

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/WestinArubaAdamCHochfelderMichaelBe.jpg)
Adam C. Hochfelder, left, is trying to buy the Peaks Resort. Michael Belfonti worked with him on the Westin Aruba Resort.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/09/realestate/commercial/09hotel.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

April 9, 2008
At Age 17, Ski Resort Has a Troubled Past (and Present)
By PATRICK O'GILFOIL HEALY and TERRY PRISTIN
Correction Appended

TELLURIDE, Colo. — Ever since it sprouted in the San Juan Mountains of southwestern Colorado 17 years ago, the Peaks Resort has loomed large over this tiny ski town. With about 170 rooms, the Peaks is the region’s largest hotel, a major employer and a crucial asset in luring the conventions and wealthy tourists who fuel the economy.

But behind its sunset-colored facade is a tangled tale of the hotel that couldn’t shoot straight. It has been bombarded by lawsuits and has stymied owner after owner in their struggles to turn a profit in Telluride’s seasonal economy.

The Blackstone Group, the once high-and-mighty private equity company that has watched its profits decline because of the credit squeeze, acquired the Peaks when it bought Wyndham Properties in 2005 and has tried to sell it for about $45 million. But since the hotel went on the market last June, two potential buyers, including Fairmont Hotels and Resorts, have signed contracts only to walk away without closing the deal.

In recent months, the once-hot investment market for luxury hotels has evaporated. Not a single top-tier hotel traded during the last quarter, said Patrick Ford, the president of Lodging Econometrics, a research company in Portsmouth, N.H. Hotel prices have declined about 15 percent since the summer.

Last month, Blackstone entered into yet another contract, with a team led by Adam C. Hochfelder, a New York real estate investor, now 36, who made a big splash at a tender age as an owner and manager of a large portfolio of Midtown Manhattan office towers, including the Helmsley Building, which straddles Park Avenue. But Mr. Hochfelder’s track record is as problem-plagued as the Peaks is.

Beginning in 2004, Mr. Hochfelder’s reputation began to plummet, as he defaulted on millions of dollars worth of loans and became mired in litigation with business associates and relatives. The Manhattan district attorney’s office began an investigation into his borrowing practices that is still active, a spokeswoman, Barbara Thompson, said last week.

Despite these setbacks and more recent difficulties, Mr. Hochfelder has continued to try to stake out a role as a major real estate player.

In 2006, Michael Belfonti of Hamden, Conn., bought a hotel now known as the Westin Aruba Resort and brought in Mr. Hochfelder as a noncontrolling minority partner. The hotel failed when the new owners tried to keep it open while doing a complete renovation. Last year, the owners defaulted on their loans, putting the mezzanine lender, Petra Capital Management, in control of the 478-room hotel, according to court documents.
Mr. Hochfelder, who is described even by people who are no longer speaking to him as a bright and engaging man with a winning smile, has been distributing a flier for his new company, HP Hotel Partners, that is made up of photographs of “selected projects” that include the Westin Aruba Resort and other properties that he no longer owns or never did
snip


WESTIN ARUBA HOTEL MANAGEMENT LLC 
 
Business address J.E. IRAUSQUIN BLVD. 77, NOORD 
Legal form  FOREIGN FORMED CORPORATION 
Name of the WESTIN ARUBA HOTEL MANAGEMENT LLC 
company/foundation/association:
Statutory seat  U.S.A. 
Date of 24 MAY 2006 
incorporation/commencement:
     
   
BOARD MEMBERS/AUTHORIZED PERSONS 
 
CARLO, ANTONIO AMADEO DIOMEDES AMANO
Residing in  CONSTANTIJN HUYGENSTRAAT 5, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA 
Born in  NETHERLANDS ANTILLES, CURACAO on 26 JULY 1957 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  PROXY 
Effective  13 MARCH 2007 
Authority  FULL 
   
 
Established at   
Position  PROXY 
Since  13 MARCH 2008 
Authority  FULL 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 28, 2008, 08:16:14 PM
I know it's just the camera angle on that picture but at first, I thought that Hochfelder guy was a ventriloquist and the Belfonti guy his "dummy"
Shees...good thing jack and WOW aren't around.   ::MonkeyCool::

roflmao  ::MonkeyHaHa::


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/WestinArubaAdamCHochfelderMichaelBe.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 28, 2008, 08:56:20 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_44969.php

Former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba Wever died
28 Jul, 2008, 17:52 (GMT -04:00)

 Email dit artikel 
 Print dit artikel 
 
ORANJESTAD/AMSTERDAM – The former Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Roy Wever died unexpectedly on Sunday at the age of 58.

Up until this time, Wever had been head of the Legal Affairs department of the Aruba house in the Netherlands. The funeral ceremony will be held coming Wednesday in The Hague, after which his remains will be flown over to Aruba to be buried. Apart from having been the Minister Plenipotentiary for Aruba in the United States, Wever was also Advisor for Crime and Terrorism Prevention, Representative for Aruba in the Financial Action Task Force and Managing Director of CB-JAZ.

 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 28, 2008, 09:35:42 PM
I saw this today -remind you of anyone?

Quote
Here is a list of ways to identify a sociopath. This list is from "Profile of a Sociopath". Is is a pretty good list of sociopathic indicators.


Glibness/Superficial Charm
Manipulative and Conning
Grandiose Sense of Self
Pathological Lying
Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
Shallow Emotions
Incapacity for Love
Need for Stimulation
Callousness/Lack of Empathy
Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
Irresponsibility/Unreliability
Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them
Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them
Authoritarian
Secretive
Paranoid
Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired
Conventional appearance
Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)
Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life
Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)
Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim
Incapable of real human attachment to another
Unable to feel remorse or guilt
Narcissism, grandiosity (self-importance not based on achievments)
May state readily that their goal is to rule the world


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 28, 2008, 09:52:42 PM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.

OK...call me blind or whatever but....is this blonde in this pic a guy or a girl?....(don't laugh too hard)...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 28, 2008, 10:00:52 PM

I think I see the earrings now....YIKES...I think it's a girl.... ::MonkeyConfused::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Quisp on July 28, 2008, 10:07:51 PM
Has this been discussd? Here is a long article explaining how Aruba was bought by the mafia.

http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm (http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm)

..a snippet..."The Croes Family has been accused of ties with Cuntrera-Caruana. The Sicilian mafiosi payed for a trip of another brother, Rudy Croes (who succeeded Hendrik as Minister of Justice in a previous MEP government) as party secretary to a meeting of the Socialist International in Turkey. This has not been denied."



Quisp, when I click on your link above, it's redirecting me to : http://www.routledgestrategicstudies.com/

I'm getting lost. ::MonkeyHaHa::

The topic, however, has been discussed, but another link was used...I have it somewhere, just not handy right now.

sorry..try this one http://www.tni.org/archives/tblick/aruba.htm

 (http://www.tni.org/archives/tblick/aruba.htm)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 28, 2008, 10:34:09 PM
Has this been discussd? Here is a long article explaining how Aruba was bought by the mafia.

http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm (http://www.frankcass.com/jnls/toc.htm)

..a snippet..."The Croes Family has been accused of ties with Cuntrera-Caruana. The Sicilian mafiosi payed for a trip of another brother, Rudy Croes (who succeeded Hendrik as Minister of Justice in a previous MEP government) as party secretary to a meeting of the Socialist International in Turkey. This has not been denied."



Quisp, when I click on your link above, it's redirecting me to : http://www.routledgestrategicstudies.com/

I'm getting lost. ::MonkeyHaHa::

The topic, however, has been discussed, but another link was used...I have it somewhere, just not handy right now.

sorry..try this one http://www.tni.org/archives/tblick/aruba.htm

 (http://www.tni.org/archives/tblick/aruba.htm)

Thanks, Quisp...and yes, this is the same information posted here long ago & referenced by many SM members. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 28, 2008, 11:04:55 PM
I know it's just the camera angle on that picture but at first, I thought that Hochfelder guy was a ventriloquist and the Belfonti guy his "dummy"
Shees...good thing jack and WOW aren't around.   ::MonkeyCool::

::MonkeyLaugh::
I had a very long...rough....Monday, read this earlier and it didn't "dawn" on me what you were referring to... ::MonkeyConfused:: that makes it even funnier now!  Looking at the pic now, I can see it! ::MonkeyHaHa::
 



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 29, 2008, 12:09:22 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.

OK...call me blind or whatever but....is this blonde in this pic a guy or a girl?....(don't laugh too hard)...


She needs to be closing that mouth...

that's how ya get buggies in it!!!! ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 29, 2008, 12:36:45 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.

OK...call me blind or whatever but....is this blonde in this pic a guy or a girl?....(don't laugh too hard)...


She needs to be closing that mouth...

that's how ya get buggies in it!!!! ::MonkeyShocked::

Somebody should have had the decency to remove the magazine (with the naked Joran pics in it) from off of the coffee table. I think after seeing those pics she's having second thoughts about her Sloot date!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 29, 2008, 12:52:28 AM
Poochy -  roflmao  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Port Valerie on July 29, 2008, 01:00:12 AM
Hi, all. Checking in after many weeks. Finally changed out of my Valentine's Day clothes. It's beach time here in Florida. I saw a story today about a shooting in Antigua. Immediately thought of Aruba. What's with the Caribbean? Never mind. I know.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 05:05:42 AM
1 Happy Island
the past half week claimed four lives in traffic

July 28, 2008, 19:09 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD - in circulation again this weekend many cases victims including a 26-year-old woman who died on her injuries. It is the fourteenth fatality this year. Over the past half week claimed four lives in traffic.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Arubakopie-1.jpg?t=1217322007)

At the intersection of the Julianastraat with the Irenestraat came about five hours yesterday morning the 26-year-old Charisa Flanders in a car accident along the way. The woman occupant was one of the two cars involved in the accident were involved. The accident happened probably because there was no precedence. In addition, agents suspected that the two drivers were drunk. They took the men into the police station for inspection, where they indeed too much alcohol in the blood appeared to have. The men were arrested.

The Aruba Police Corps was Saturday already know that they went preventive searches for weapons. For the number of incidents where weapons are involved, reduce, it became public in various crowded uitgaansplaatsen verified. For the high number of accidents to reduce the movement was also sharper under constant surveillance. The weekend was again full of accidents.

So Sunday was something for 12 am on the road to the Reina Beatrix airport geschept a pedestrian by a racing car. According to witnesses were the drivers of two cars together on the challenge at the traffic light. When the traffic on green jump, the two drivers gave full gas. It happened one of the two not in time to brake and the pedestrian crossing evasion. The victim was geschept and knalde through the bonnet against the windshield. The man, who works at the airport, was seriously injured and is subject to various other fractures transported to the hospital.

A car accident at the height of supermarket Mundo Nobo in Santa Cruz is the occasion for a quarrel between two groups of young people. The accident was one of the drivers slightly injured and had to be cared for by monitor ambulance. Agents spot then had their hands full for two groups of young people from each other. It was reported was a quarrel between the gangs of Madiki and Santa Cruz. The youth showed no respect for the police and wanted after exchanging verbal insults with each other in the fist. The present agents could just prevent the incident walked out of hand.

The 34-year-old K.E.R.F. Saturday night was arrested after a hit and run. He rode, at the height of the National Field North, with his car in two pedestrians and then drove by. A witness saw it happen and rode behind the car of the offender. This person called the police and even later was a description of the car. Even those that told the accused against his car was aangereden. Agents found the car a little later on conscious Westpunt. The suspect had hidden in the vicinity but could after a short search ingerekend. He was brought to the police station for questioning. One of the two pedestrians was seriously injured in the accident. He walked several fractures. Both victims were in the ambulance transported to the hospital.

Like last year, reducing the number of road accidents one of the priorities of the police force. Last year there were a total of 18 fatalities.
   


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 05:23:37 AM
 speculation in Aruba

A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut

spokesman Trappenberg said :there is a special committee!!!
The internet TROLL"S ?
(http://judicial-inc.biz/Joran_14.jpg)

The internet TROLL"S ? Trappenberg ??
By Stieven Ramdharie
published on 22 november 2005

ORANJESTAD - The investigation into the missing teenager in Aruba Natalee Holloway is deadlocked. Her mother calls for intervention by the Netherlands. Aruba meanwhile fears for his tourist industry.

The experienced diver from Texas stands ready to return to travel, ready for rooting in a dustbin on "One Happy Island." Or to enter the sea water diving, pal for the Marriott Hotel. There, at about three to five miles into the sea, said a tip to the Aruban police, the corpse of Natalee would be dumped. Verzwaard with stones, so they would sink to the seabed.

Perfect murder
Around one hundred quests includes the track record Joe Huston, director of investigations of the rescue team Texas EquuSearch. He stood face to face with the misery after the devastating tsunami and Katrina's attack on New Orleans. And Joe Huston must admit: If Natalee Holloway has indeed been murdered, then have her killers' a hell of a job '.

"We are now five months and nobody has even a trace of her can find," says Huston, who in the summer the first Texan investigation teams led by Aruba. "The perfect murder? How can you prove a murder, if you know nothing about Natalee can find? If she is dumped into the sea and carried by the waves, is the least chance that we ever will find something from her. "

Million dollar
Dumped into the sea, sold into sexual slavery, drained to the sea floor, buried in a dustbin or just hiding somewhere in the world: 175 days, the students from Mountain Brook, Alabama, lost, and there are always plenty of speculation. Jug Twitty, Natalee's stepfather, has one million dollars awarded to the person who is the world's most famous missing teenager alive and return it. So speculating about her death he would prefer not.

But nevertheless: "In my analysis, she drank by the three main defendants conducted in the bar where she was last seen carried away, beaten and raped. Then they are panicking and they have touched her body dumped somewhere. It is a shame that these boys Aruba so many problems have worried. And still, by their silence and denials, deliver. "

Publicity
A small vermissingszaken hundred thousand are now at the FBI in research, but none in recent months has received so much publicity as the Natalee Holloway case. Five months after the 17-year old blonde scholiere during school holidays on the island disappeared, the missing feelings in the U.S. and in Aruba still busy.

What has happened to Natalee happened and why the police have not yet step closer to a solution? On Aruba, that these days a massive U.S. toeristenboycot fears after the call this the state of Alabama, they can not wait until the end in sight of what has become a PR nightmare. In 175 days, the carefully constructed image of safe and friendly toeristenparadijs in the Caribbean knock caused by Natalee's family who makes use of every opportunity to criticize the Aruban investigation. Last Friday called Beth Twitty, Natalee's mother, even for a Dutch intervene in the investigation. Dave Holloway, Natalee's father: "It looks like a cover up and smells like a cover up!"

Ruben Trappenberg, until recently government spokesman, on the call for a boycott of Aruba: "Even if those three boys are guilty, why should an entire island suffer? In Alabama, every day over fifty violent. Why do you hear the families of those victims? "

Intriguingly
The Holloway case is intriguing because they all ingredië «nten contains the perfect murder. Because how is it that a tourist from one to another of whom go on a day are considered safe island of some 180 square kilometres?

No hair or no clothing, provided that Natalee has indeed been murdered, was found during the numerous searches for which marines, F-16's, citizens, police and volunteers from Texas EquuSearch are deployed. Despite the high pay for the golden tip nobody reported.

Hoofdverdachte Joran van der S. (18), who has admitted Natalee at night only to have abandoned on the beach, if the disqualification of the U.S. media and Natalee's family even travel to Arnhem to go and study. His father Paul, judge in training, there is no longer the three suspected to have helped, and now demanding compensation.

Friday as a bird, the two friends with whom he met Natalee that 30th May, already allowed the Surinamese brothers Deepak (21) and Satish (19) Aruba provisionally not leave because an investigation is still against them. Father Dave Holloway brought three of the last five months on Aruba, driftig looking for answers. But actually, says the verzekeringsman from Meridian, Mississippi, had he been on his first visit to bevroeden that nothing would be.

Corrupt
Holloway: "My first experience with the Aruban police were two days when Natalee was missing. ''How much money do you have?''Asked an agent at the police station when I came asking for help. What can we expect of a police force that until recently was headed by a chief who is friends with Joran father? Is it coincidence that the ten days before he was interrogated? The key to the solution of this case is still in Aruba. Only they must do to search. "

The 'mistakes' that police and judiciary in the beginning made, the family and part of the American media encouraged in their belief that something is not fluff. Huston: "They have eleven days have done to the car of the brothers seize. Those boys had enough time to thoroughly clean up any evidence and eliminate it. "

Stiefvader Jug: "The house of Joran and his father is also not immediately investigated. The prosecutor said they allowed us not allow it. But then you still care that can be immediately investigated? Those boys are so guilty if I do not know what. It is only to produce evidence to get around. "

No rail
When Huston immediately after Natalee's missing with his team descended on Aruba, he was still remarkably optimistic. "I was really convinced that we are within a few days would find," says the rescue workers. They dock in sea, the island was out with dogs and a landfill where a witness was examined three men would have seen that something weggooiden. But no trace of Natalee - the bones that aanspoelden on the beach, or the piece of tape with a blonde her that was found in a national park, the students were found not to be.

The draining of a pond where a witness that night would have seen something suspicious, was unsuccessful. Huston: "On land you'll find nothing more. The F-16-photo reconnaissance would have discovered her body a long time. But Aruba has many caves and wells. If they have dumped her body somewhere, then that could have happened in such a borehole into the sea, or in the dustbin, which is not fully explored. In a pit or on the dustbin continue its bones still intact. "

The sea option from the beginning, because the island is ideally suited to you get rid of a body. Discard anything from the right coast in the water and floats, direction Panama. The 'seksslavin' theory appears regularly. Thus bore the famous American talk show presenter Dr. Phil, after an investigation in cooperation with Beth Twitty, this month sensation with his remark that the beautiful blonde Natalee is still alive and that they would have been possible had traded as sex slaves.

Jug: "I think nothing of it. Oh, there are so many claims. " Huston: "I attach little faith in what Dr. Phil says. " Natalee's father put these days hope a new hearing, soon, an Aruban witness who may have crucial information. A month back when he called the Aruban Prime Minister Oduber for a quick interrogation of the man who has already been interrogated and would have lied. "He can resolve the matter, I am not saying," he says.

Bandje
His ex-wife has her hopes on the new quest of the Texan team. And for a band that recently appeared in which Deepak would recognize that the three boys would have sex with Natalee. Something that so far they have always denied. Beth: "It does not look good for those boys and their accomplices, because they must have had help from adults to leave the disappearance of Natalee. Nobody can commit the perfect murder on such a small island without help. Arresters that boys again, and this case is resolved. But it does not happen. "

Former government spokesman Trappenberg sigh. All these criticisms of his beloved Aruba, he can not really there. A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut. Trappenberg: "The criticism is unjustified. We have done everything for the family. Even the FBI in the investigation. Who should we turn even more? We can do nothing more. "


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:03:33 AM
 ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:13:49 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.

Kinda looks like a bar/restaurant to me just by the way the wine glasses are suspended in the background along the ceiling.

OK...call me blind or whatever but....is this blonde in this pic a guy or a girl?....(don't laugh too hard)...


She needs to be closing that mouth...

that's how ya get buggies in it!!!! ::MonkeyShocked::

ok...is there a full moon??!! lol ::MonkeyConfused::
Had this big ass post to this pic and it disappeared??!! ::MonkeyNoNo::
Not sure where it went???...only thing left was my Monkey nono's above....hahahahahaha

OK...so said something like...it is definitely a persons house...great colors by the way....like mine....reds!!! lol

And...something to the effect that we thought MAYBE the gene that determines sociopaths may have skipped Val...but I think unfortunately we can't be so sure anymore!!!!

History DOES tend to repeat itself...so do we want Val in the US with our daughters????!!!!

What can we do to stop Val using our tax dollars and our daughters to his own advantage??
NO REFUGEES!!! this is NOT a death threat!! But CERTAINLY a serious concern we should take action against!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:21:08 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.


She looks like she just saw Joran's teenie weenie, or lack of one thereof.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

ok...PLEEEEAAASSSE Don't take this the wrong way!!! God made us all beautiful!!! I Believe that hreat and soul!!!! But HEEEEELLLLOOOO!!! If God made you with teenie weenie....ANYTHING!!!! whether it be "jewels" or "boobs", do ya have to get naked and show the world???!!!! I was always taught to put your best traits first!!!

Do first impressions not mean anything anymore? What am I doing wrong?

Yes I have them!!! lol Quite "endowed"....but I keep them well hidden!!! Why don't "they"? lol


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:32:24 AM
joran's brother  hunting in the Party Bus
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoran.jpg?t=1217250574)

Looks like that photo is taken at someone's home.  I'll see if I can figure out what it is from.  It is fairly recent though, within the last 6 months I'd guess.


She looks like she just saw Joran's teenie weenie, or lack of one thereof.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

ok...PLEEEEAAASSSE Don't take this the wrong way!!! God made us all beautiful!!! I Believe that heart and soul!!!! But HEEEEELLLLOOOO!!! If God made you with teenie weenie....ANYTHING!!!! whether it be "jewels" or "boobs", do ya have to get naked and show the world???!!!! I was always taught to put your best traits first!!!

Do first impressions not mean anything anymore? What am I doing wrong?

Yes I have them!!! lol Quite "endowed"....but I keep them well hidden!!! Why don't "they"? lol

OK...too much info, so sorry!!! lol
No I have not been drinking like renho does before she posts!! lol
My stepsister and I have been up all night cleaning and then talking...I am a bit slap happy due to lack of sleep!! lol
STILL!!!! Not ready to get naked let alone post a naked pic!!!
OK 43 years old and never married!!! I "had my days"...and yet still..you'll never find a naked pic of me ANYWHERE!!!!
I don't understand it...nor will I ever!!!

There's something wrong with the whole scenario to me!!!  Am I just a prude?
Is it me or are you NOT supposed to show your self naked in front of the rest of the whole damned world???!!
I don't care HOW hot you are...leave SOMETHING to the imagination dammit!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:42:40 AM
K Monkeys,
Gotta get to the Monkey Bunkey!! Did I mention how slap happy I am feeling!!! lol
STILL!!! Don't understand the exhibitionists!!! CRAZY TO ME!!

So my conclusion is...THEY AIN'T RIGHT!!!

The girl next to Val "ain't right" and neither is Val, imho!!!!

Is it me...or does it disturb you all he will be going to school here in the US???!!!

I don't want to physically hurt him, don't want to hurt ANYONE!!! I am even opposed to the death penalty!!! But can't handle my tax dollars going to subsidize a Sloot's education!!! Am I paying for him to hurt our daughters???!!! If so...we are to blame...imho.

I think it is time to make our voices heard...imho.
Can we get the info on the college he will be attending and begin yet another peaceful protest?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: ldstlou on July 29, 2008, 06:47:44 AM
Night Monkeys!!!
Sweet dreams all!!!
As you all are waking up to your coffee pots brewing, I am just getting a few hours of shut eye!!!
Did I tell you how spotless my house is? B_E_A_U_T_I_F_U_L!!! lol
And my stepsister and I had some great talks tonight!!!
God bless her!!!
She is 20 and on the "dean's list" and about to start her Junior year. She has SO MUCH more energy than I!!! lol
But I hung tough...can you all tell??!! lol

OK>>>bed.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 06:50:38 AM
I am not sure if it is a boy or a girl  or a she male or a he female ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoranXXXXXXXXXXXkopie.jpg?t=1217328529)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 29, 2008, 08:32:01 AM
speculation in Aruba

A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut

spokesman Trappenberg said :there is a special committee!!!
The internet TROLL"S ?
(http://judicial-inc.biz/Joran_14.jpg)

The internet TROLL"S ? Trappenberg ??
By Stieven Ramdharie
published on 22 november 2005

ORANJESTAD - The investigation into the missing teenager in Aruba Natalee Holloway is deadlocked. Her mother calls for intervention by the Netherlands. Aruba meanwhile fears for his tourist industry.

The experienced diver from Texas stands ready to return to travel, ready for rooting in a dustbin on "One Happy Island." Or to enter the sea water diving, pal for the Marriott Hotel. There, at about three to five miles into the sea, said a tip to the Aruban police, the corpse of Natalee would be dumped. Verzwaard with stones, so they would sink to the seabed.

As soon as I read about the stones, I immediately thought that's where Joran's sneakers went! He stuck large rocks in his sneakers and used the shoelaces as ties...he carried her in his arms on the beach...called his friend w/a boat...grabbed the lobster trap...if they find the girl, they will see the sh*t. It's his sh*t sneakers and rocks they will find. Saying he left them on the beach, then walked 'near the water' -was a way to explain away his sneakers surfacing on the beach.  His belt surfaced on the beach, but ALE said it was 'too old' and they tossed out that vital piece of evidence.

I think the 'other' lobster trap they found was the 'pimps' handiwork. Didn't they find a rock or something in that one?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 29, 2008, 08:32:43 AM
I am not sure if it is a boy or a girl  or a she male or a he female ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoranXXXXXXXXXXXkopie.jpg?t=1217328529)
http://www.pauldavidson.net/wp-content/themes/wfme/images/entries/ericmask.jpg


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 29, 2008, 08:33:13 AM
Quote
http://www.pauldavidson.net/wp-content/themes/wfme/images/entries/ericmask.jpg


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 29, 2008, 08:34:13 AM
nevermind -- need more coffee  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on July 29, 2008, 08:40:52 AM
1 Happy Island
the past half week claimed four lives in traffic

July 28, 2008, 19:09 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD - in circulation again this weekend many cases victims including a 26-year-old woman who died on her injuries. It is the fourteenth fatality this year. Over the past half week claimed four lives in traffic.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Arubakopie-1.jpg?t=1217322007)

At the intersection of the Julianastraat with the Irenestraat came about five hours yesterday morning the 26-year-old Charisa Flanders in a car accident along the way. The woman occupant was one of the two cars involved in the accident were involved. The accident happened probably because there was no precedence. In addition, agents suspected that the two drivers were drunk. They took the men into the police station for inspection, where they indeed too much alcohol in the blood appeared to have. The men were arrested.

The Aruba Police Corps was Saturday already know that they went preventive searches for weapons. For the number of incidents where weapons are involved, reduce, it became public in various crowded uitgaansplaatsen verified. For the high number of accidents to reduce the movement was also sharper under constant surveillance. The weekend was again full of accidents.

So Sunday was something for 12 am on the road to the Reina Beatrix airport geschept a pedestrian by a racing car. According to witnesses were the drivers of two cars together on the challenge at the traffic light. When the traffic on green jump, the two drivers gave full gas. It happened one of the two not in time to brake and the pedestrian crossing evasion. The victim was geschept and knalde through the bonnet against the windshield. The man, who works at the airport, was seriously injured and is subject to various other fractures transported to the hospital.

A car accident at the height of supermarket Mundo Nobo in Santa Cruz is the occasion for a quarrel between two groups of young people. The accident was one of the drivers slightly injured and had to be cared for by monitor ambulance. Agents spot then had their hands full for two groups of young people from each other. It was reported was a quarrel between the gangs of Madiki and Santa Cruz. The youth showed no respect for the police and wanted after exchanging verbal insults with each other in the fist. The present agents could just prevent the incident walked out of hand.

The 34-year-old K.E.R.F. Saturday night was arrested after a hit and run. He rode, at the height of the National Field North, with his car in two pedestrians and then drove by. A witness saw it happen and rode behind the car of the offender. This person called the police and even later was a description of the car. Even those that told the accused against his car was aangereden. Agents found the car a little later on conscious Westpunt. The suspect had hidden in the vicinity but could after a short search ingerekend. He was brought to the police station for questioning. One of the two pedestrians was seriously injured in the accident. He walked several fractures. Both victims were in the ambulance transported to the hospital.

Like last year, reducing the number of road accidents one of the priorities of the police force. Last year there were a total of 18 fatalities.
   
Good morning Monkey's
With all of these accidents on aruba,do we ever hear that a tourist was in any of the accidents or do they somehow just not run down tourists on the streets or in cars?Maybe they are all trying to kill themselves.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Magnolia on July 29, 2008, 10:03:41 AM
Almost every report that I have heard on the murder of the tourist
in Antigua has mentioned the "still unsolved disappearence of American
teeneager, Natalee Holloway, on Aruba."
Good Morning America even had a warning about travel to unsafe
Caribbean locations.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 29, 2008, 10:10:21 AM
After seeing that pic of Val's bar fly...


I just thought this place could use a pic

of a pretty girl with class up in here...  ;)



(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/FdGGFGF7111m-1.png)


Natalee Holloway


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 29, 2008, 12:26:48 PM
>>>>>>>>snipped<<<<<<<<< Johann's post on previous page:

Former government spokesman Trappenberg sigh. All these criticisms of his beloved Aruba, he can not really there. A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut. Trappenberg: "The criticism is unjustified. We have done everything for the family. Even the FBI in the investigation. Who should we turn even more? We can do nothing more. "


I think I know several of these committee members. They began their campaign on the front page of SM and continued it to the forum and are still working the forums and blogs to this very day.  A few pointed to others than the Sloots. Some pointed to a group of people as being responsible. Some blamed the mother of the victim.  Others blamed the media.  Can you say Bondia, Simian, Shango, Jake, Native Lingo, Checkme, SandraK...just to name a few?  Yes, and old rubberlegs was right in there with them...distracting and confusing us all.  Lorenzo who?  Yep, it was a magnificent piece of work from the get go, Aruba. Too bad it didn't work and still you can't admit it. Such a shame.  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 12:44:27 PM
>>>>>>>>snipped<<<<<<<<< Johann's post on previous page:

Former government spokesman Trappenberg sigh. All these criticisms of his beloved Aruba, he can not really there. A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut. Trappenberg: "The criticism is unjustified. We have done everything for the family. Even the FBI in the investigation. Who should we turn even more? We can do nothing more. "


I think I know several of these committee members. They began their campaign on the front page of SM and continued it to the forum and are still working the forums and blogs to this very day.  A few pointed to others than the Sloots. Some pointed to a group of people as being responsible. Some blamed the mother of the victim.  Others blamed the media.  Can you say Bondia, Simian, Shango, Jake, Native Lingo, Checkme, SandraK...just to name a few?  Yes, and old rubberlegs was right in there with them...distracting and confusing us all.  Lorenzo who?  Yep, it was a magnificent piece of work from the get go, Aruba. Too bad it didn't work and still you can't admit it. Such a shame.  ::MonkeyNoNo::

yes Lala's mum but who pay the troll's ?
In my Opinion is not Gielen of Jullia (jullietje) the biggest troll (they are not smart enough)
but Zvezdana Vukojevic she is the she-devil herself !!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 12:47:42 PM
And i am looking for Pics  of these Girl Zvezdana Vukojevic !
Who is she and does she exist !
Or is it a Ghostwriter !


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 29, 2008, 01:14:45 PM
And i am looking for Pics  of these Girl Zvezdana Vukojevic !
Who is she and does she exist !
Or is it a Ghostwriter !

Johan - does this say the only book she's done is Joran's?

http://www.boekmeter.nl/author/2807


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 29, 2008, 01:15:48 PM
I am not sure if it is a boy or a girl  or a she male or a he female ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/BroerJoranXXXXXXXXXXXkopie.jpg?t=1217328529)

ROFL....."I'm melting....I'm melting".....(shame on me)..... ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 29, 2008, 01:18:32 PM
I think the trolls were paid by those with the most to lose. 

It's all about the money...they don't care about Joran.  If it had not been for Joran's family, he would be sitting in KIA right now.  They had him the first week and the Kalpoes would be there with him.  It was the money that took over and provided the out these 3 perps needed.  Once they found out that Joran and his pals had murdered a tourist and the evidence was overwhelming they decided that the almighty American dollar was worth more. Paulus knew enough to slow things down. He had a few connections and if he sings then the world finds out about the corruption.  If he stays quiet the trolls can handle the blogs and the media will just go away after time. They did not count on Beth and the tenaciousness of a mother's resolve to find justice for her child. They never counted on the disappearance of a young girl touching so many lives.   It was a deal with the devil and we all know it never goes well for the deal maker because the devil will best them every time. The devil has always underestimated the power of GOOD on this earth.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 29, 2008, 01:18:43 PM
After seeing that pic of Val's bar fly...


I just thought this place could use a pic

of a pretty girl with class up in here...  ;)



(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/FdGGFGF7111m-1.png)

Much nicer carpe...she's real......


Natalee Holloway


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 02:23:24 PM
And i am looking for Pics  of these Girl Zvezdana Vukojevic !
Who is she and does she exist !
Or is it a Ghostwriter !

Johan - does this say the only book she's done is Joran's?

http://www.boekmeter.nl/author/2807

Yes Klaas
I can't any info or pics  about this woman/man
she (?) works sometimes for The Nieuwe Revu  it's a dutch magazine and is not really serious stuff more sensation
She did the School for Journalism  in Utrecht but i can't find her back in the yearbooks
So Who is this mysterious writer ? ::MonkeyConfused::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 02:42:33 PM
The biggest nightmare for Joran ,his father ,Koen ,Freddy the 2 K's is Peter r de Vries .
He is a fighter and pit bull and he never give up any case .
He did 40 broadcasting's about the Puttense murder case ,with success!
He and his team have all the time and (!) money to do investigation in this case .
They can be everywhere and they don't like that at all.
Their spotlight is now on Paul vd Sloot & friends  ,what did he(they) in the past as a lawyer and Judge (for the government Aruba .


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 04:19:35 PM
And i am looking for Pics  of these Girl Zvezdana Vukojevic !
Who is she and does she exist !
Or is it a Ghostwriter !

Johan - does this say the only book she's done is Joran's?

http://www.boekmeter.nl/author/2807

Yes Klaas
I can't any info or pics  about this woman/man
she (?) works sometimes for The Nieuwe Revu  it's a dutch magazine and is not really serious stuff more sensation
She did the School for Journalism  in Utrecht but i can't find her back in the yearbooks
So Who is this mysterious writer ? ::MonkeyConfused::


********************************************************************************
Every "Normal" write has a website but only this woman NOT !


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 04:30:50 PM
ARUBA -2006

And it seemed such a nice man
ORANJESTAD - 17/11/2006
Ramond Lee
(http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/images/assets/13101871)

An unknown woman in the forty, has made declarations against Minister Ramon Lee (MEP) for rape. The declaration against the Minister of Labour, Culture and Sport is beginning this week. The Public Prosecutor (OM) has confirmed that declaration is made against a minister, but would not say what the Minister. Amigoe has, however, a reliable source that received the confirmation to the Minister Lee.

Spokesman Arends-Mariaine Croes of the PPS know that the prosecutor is still considering whether the declaration of a case. At this moment is still an investigation. The woman who has made the declaration, an ex-wife of a member of Lee. The rape would be in the house of the minister have taken place.

Lee is currently staying abroad for a holiday. He is back again next Monday.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 29, 2008, 04:30:56 PM
>>>>>>>>snipped<<<<<<<<< Johann's post on previous page:

Former government spokesman Trappenberg sigh. All these criticisms of his beloved Aruba, he can not really there. A special committee is working daily to the daily criticism of the family and the American media to rebut. Trappenberg: "The criticism is unjustified. We have done everything for the family. Even the FBI in the investigation. Who should we turn even more? We can do nothing more. "


I think I know several of these committee members. They began their campaign on the front page of SM and continued it to the forum and are still working the forums and blogs to this very day.  A few pointed to others than the Sloots. Some pointed to a group of people as being responsible. Some blamed the mother of the victim.  Others blamed the media.  Can you say Bondia, Simian, Shango, Jake, Native Lingo, Checkme, SandraK...just to name a few?  Yes, and old rubberlegs was right in there with them...distracting and confusing us all.  Lorenzo who?  Yep, it was a magnificent piece of work from the get go, Aruba. Too bad it didn't work and still you can't admit it. Such a shame.  ::MonkeyNoNo::


Just started rereading the Front Page posts, and I am only now starting June 9th., so far I have read at least 4 different “Aruban” posters say “ it is pretty hard to find some-one that doesn’t want to be found”. These “Aruban” posters on the FP are an Aruban married to an American, Americans living in Aruba, Gabe Leo and friends, as well as the real Arubans. Natalee ran away to Costa Rica, her family is connected to George Bush, she dressed trashy, compared to the local girls(what a joke), and of course she was willing.

The anti-American sentiment comes over loud and clear…and I am probably not as biased as many here in that regard. IMO the paid posters were there to protect Aruba’s tourism industry. Trash the victim, confuse, mislead and discredit any US news media and of course hide the truth. Save their tourism image at all costs.

Apparently I am not the only one that saw it that way!

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 4:16 pm
So much anger at Americans by the Aruban posters.
It makes me wonder what they think after they shake our hand, smile, and turn away.
Is it all a facade?

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 5:15 pm
Iara,
I see mostly hostility toward Americans from the Aruban posters.
Take a look at past posts from Mona, Susan, Gabriel Leo, John, others.
They want to blame Natalee and say it is the promiscous Americans who are the problem. Or she ran away and is causing Aruba to spend too much money on her.
As Mona from Aruba put it…..:”she has to DEAL with Americans every day” in her job.
And what about the comments from others who said America deserved 9/11.
I had no thoughts about Aruba one way or the other until I starting reading these posts. The America bashing is pretty blatant.
Personally I think Arubans need to realize they just stepped into the 21st century and take security seriously.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 29, 2008, 05:01:04 PM

Just started rereading the Front Page posts, and I am only now starting June 9th., so far I have read at least 4 different “Aruban” posters say “ it is pretty hard to find some-one that doesn’t want to be found”. These “Aruban” posters on the FP are an Aruban married to an American, Americans living in Aruba, Gabe Leo and friends, as well as the real Arubans. Natalee ran away to Costa Rica, her family is connected to George Bush, she dressed trashy, compared to the local girls(what a joke), and of course she was willing.

The anti-American sentiment comes over loud and clear…and I am probably not as biased as many here in that regard. IMO the paid posters were there to protect Aruba’s tourism industry. Trash the victim, confuse, mislead and discredit any US news media and of course hide the truth. Save their tourism image at all costs.

Apparently I am not the only one that saw it that way!

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 4:16 pm
So much anger at Americans by the Aruban posters.
It makes me wonder what they think after they shake our hand, smile, and turn away.
Is it all a facade?

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 5:15 pm
Iara,
I see mostly hostility toward Americans from the Aruban posters.
Take a look at past posts from Mona, Susan, Gabriel Leo, John, others.
They want to blame Natalee and say it is the promiscous Americans who are the problem. Or she ran away and is causing Aruba to spend too much money on her.
As Mona from Aruba put it…..:”she has to DEAL with Americans every day” in her job.
And what about the comments from others who said America deserved 9/11.
I had no thoughts about Aruba one way or the other until I starting reading these posts. The America bashing is pretty blatant.
Personally I think Arubans need to realize they just stepped into the 21st century and take security seriously.



Great finds there Mum! Look how fast they were in place. Those posts were from June 6th after the Aruban/American ExPats had already been posting for days. Aruba had their Disinformation Machine in place almost immediately after Natalee disappeared. One day maybe we'll be privy to the ATA/AHATA budget and we'll see how much they spent on their end to cover up the crime with their Sloot lawyer buddy/board of director Antonio Carlo at the helm.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 29, 2008, 05:02:29 PM
Correction, those posts were from June 8th.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 29, 2008, 05:04:20 PM
ARUBA -2006

And it seemed such a nice man
ORANJESTAD - 17/11/2006
Ramond Lee
(http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/images/assets/13101871)

An unknown woman in the forty, has made declarations against Minister Ramon Lee (MEP) for rape. The declaration against the Minister of Labour, Culture and Sport is beginning this week. The Public Prosecutor (OM) has confirmed that declaration is made against a minister, but would not say what the Minister. Amigoe has, however, a reliable source that received the confirmation to the Minister Lee.

Spokesman Arends-Mariaine Croes of the PPS know that the prosecutor is still considering whether the declaration of a case. At this moment is still an investigation. The woman who has made the declaration, an ex-wife of a member of Lee. The rape would be in the house of the minister have taken place.

Lee is currently staying abroad for a holiday. He is back again next Monday.


Have we ever seen a rape prosecuted in Aruba? I can't remember a single one in the 3 years we've been following the case? Anyone have any information?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 29, 2008, 05:07:29 PM
The biggest nightmare for Joran ,his father ,Koen ,Freddy the 2 K's is Peter r de Vries .
He is a fighter and pit bull and he never give up any case .
He did 40 broadcasting's about the Puttense murder case ,with success!
He and his team have all the time and (!) money to do investigation in this case .
They can be everywhere and they don't like that at all.
Their spotlight is now on Paul vd Sloot & friends  ,what did he(they) in the past as a lawyer and Judge (for the government Aruba .



The biggest threat damn sure isn't Hans Mos or Dop Kruimel. Those two jake-legged prosecutors couldn't find their asses with a good roadmap. You are 100% correct Johan, if this case is broken it will be Peter DeVries who does it!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 05:09:08 PM
The question is : Is Aruba a safe Island now ? No
There are so many traffic accidents  every week and  the bars are the same ! drunk young people,rapes etc  !
I live in Amsterdam but a Bar like C&C was already  closed  years and years ago
Senor Frogs is the same bar only another name !
Who wants to send his son or daughter to this island ?
Not only the Aruba's touristic industry send misinformation but also the US & Holland  an all the other countries ,
they all wants to sell tickets  !
I don't understand the Dutch government ,they send incompetent judges etc. and we bring there a lot of money every year. This must stop ,we pay taxes for a corrupt Island
And ! i don't understand the anti US people !    
The American liberate us & Aruba , otherwise we were still under Hitler.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Aruba and the Second World War

The small Aruba has a very important role in the Second World War. The Lago was at this time in terms of production one of the largest refineries in the world. The process of Lago refined petrol was used for allied planes and thus the island was a vital point on the Western Hemisphere: for the Americans to defend and for the Germans to fall



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 29, 2008, 05:19:36 PM
The question is : Is Aruba a safe Island now ? No
There are so many traffic accidents  every week and  the bars are the same ! drunk young people,rapes etc  !
I live in Amsterdam but a Bar like C&C was already  closed  years and years ago
Senor Frogs is the same bar only another name !
Who wants to send his son or daughter to this island ?
Not only the Aruba's touristic industry send misinformation but also the US & Holland  an all the other countries ,
they all wants to sell tickets  !
I don't understand the Dutch government ,they send incompetent judges etc. and we bring there a lot of money every year. This must stop ,we pay taxes for a corrupt Island
And ! i don't understand the anti US people !    
The American liberate us & Aruba , otherwise we were still under Hitler.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Aruba and the Second World War

The small Aruba has a very important role in the Second World War. The Lago was at this time in terms of production one of the largest refineries in the world. The process of Lago refined petrol was used for allied planes and thus the island was a vital point on the Western Hemisphere: for the Americans to defend and for the Germans to fall



 :smt038 :smt038 :smt038  Very nice, Johan.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 05:43:45 PM
Here some stories About Aruba in 2001 > ARUBA is a horrible place!!!!!!


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Author: amber
Date: 07/07/2001, 09:49 pm

Chas- I am a little bored so I'll respond to your little copy/paste. No greenery means NO GREENERY. That means no grass, no shrubs, no trees, etc. I think you said it was because it was the dry season & someone else said hurricanes. When was the last hurricane? They way the island looked, it must have been the month before we got there.
High crime- Never said I experienced any crime personally. I have read an awful lot of posts about gang rapes, murders, etc on this small island. I think people should be forewarned.

You must either be really lonely or really boring to constantly monitor these forums for anyone dogging your nasty little island. The whole point to this forum is to give people info. Not to harass people who don't agree with you. I did not like St. Martin at all & I'm sure there are people who agree with me. You love it & so does many other people. It's all the matter of personal opinion. I personally prefer to spend my money on a prettier island without trash on the beaches, lot's of greenery, & friendly people.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Author: bianca
Date: 07/08/2001, 08:58 am

Just for reference - we have been to at least 11 caribbean islands and ARUBA was the worse and yes i researched for months but for some reason pwople do not like to say negative things about ARUBA. As far as the resort how would you like to pay for a beachfront room and then have 20 workmen outside your room morning, noon and night - open trenches, broken pipes and then be told by the front desk that you are crazy there is not work going on!!!! I have pictures and they did get the hurricane i do not care if the center did not pass over they did get it!!!! I have pictures - the rudest people i have ever met anywhere in the world not just the Caribbean. We were so shook that we alost never went back to the Caribbean but we went to Jamaica and met nice, wonderful people that have a great culture and proud of it. I know this is hard to beleive but we felt safer in Jamiaca than Aruba. While we were there a gang of men broke into one of the rooms at the far end of the resort and robbed the peoples room so much for one happy island. They have a great press corp - so keep lying!!!! ARUBA is a horrible place!!!!!!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Author: christiegr
Date: 04/11/2005, 01:13 pm
I did not like Aruba because it is a flat,ugly island,that never sleeps..like Las Vegas.I personally prefer mountainous islands with lush vegetation,lots of birds and flowers..also great beaches for snorkeling..Aruba did not offer ANY of that.I also like culture Aruba did have a little of that, but over all did not offer much compared to other places I've been.Everyone is different and that is great..some like to be the beach bum and not explore much..I think that those are the type people that might enjoy Aruba..if they don't go when the beaches are overcrowded.For the people that like to explore..they would get bored quick.Be glad we don't all LOVE Aruba, as it would be more crowded than it already is!!!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 29, 2008, 05:56:59 PM

Aruba tourism takes a deep dive as Holloway case drags on

One of the suspects, Joran Van Der Sloot, had a personal web site that promoted gang culture and violence including gang rapes. The web site was removed from the internet, allegedly by Van Der Sloot's father, within hours after he was arrested.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/bd989a5927da62ed14c4045eac66670f.jpg?t=1217368530)

Powered by CDNN - CYBER DIVER News Network
by CARMEN SANCHEZ - CDNN Travel Editor

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (16 June 2005) -- Tourists returning from Aruba have told CDNN that much of the island looks like a ghost town as the investigation into the disappearance of American teen Natalee Holloway drags on.

According to reports from travel agents, thousands of North American and European tourists have switched to other holiday destinations that are untainted by what many are calling a botched police investigation and a deliberate cover up.

On June 10, Aruban Minister of Justice Rudy Croes told reporters that one of the three suspects had confessed to murdering Holloway and would lead them to the body.

But a few hours later, Croes backed away from the statement saying that he had been the victim of a "misinformation campaign".

Meanwhile, several organizations including an Alabama radio station and an Oregon consumer group have launched tourism boycotts of Aruba.

According to several media reports, one of the suspects, Joran Van Der Sloot, had a personal web site that promoted gang culture and violence including gang rapes. The web site was removed from the internet, allegedly by Van Der Sloot's father, within hours after he was arrested.

All three suspects told police they took Holloway back to her hotel and implicated security guards who worked there.  Later they changed their stories saying they took Holloway to a lighthouse in a remote part of the island.

Police have searched the home of Joran Van Der Sloot, however, no one has been charged in the case and lawyers for all of the suspects say their clients are innocent.



"The only appropriate response for the US to make to Aruban authorities is to impose a stringent tourism boycott until a more competent, informative, cooperative investigation into the disappearance, and probable homicide, of Natalee Holloway is instituted," said the Oregon group.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 29, 2008, 06:00:17 PM
Johan555,

Where did you find those posts about Aruba?  Do you have the link?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 29, 2008, 06:30:59 PM
Johan555,

Where did you find those posts about Aruba?  Do you have the link?

I should have asked Johan a little earlier....he's probably asleep, now. ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 29, 2008, 06:39:51 PM
The biggest nightmare for Joran ,his father ,Koen ,Freddy the 2 K's is Peter r de Vries .
He is a fighter and pit bull and he never give up any case .
He did 40 broadcasting's about the Puttense murder case ,with success!
He and his team have all the time and (!) money to do investigation in this case .
They can be everywhere and they don't like that at all.
Their spotlight is now on Paul vd Sloot & friends  ,what did he(they) in the past as a lawyer and Judge (for the government Aruba .


 ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 29, 2008, 06:42:47 PM
Johan555,

Where did you find those posts about Aruba?  Do you have the link?

Here's one of them 2NJSons_Mom!

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050616a.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 29, 2008, 06:49:14 PM
Johan555,

Where did you find those posts about Aruba?  Do you have the link?

Here's one of them 2NJSons_Mom!

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050616a.html

Thanks, texasmom.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 29, 2008, 07:07:38 PM
The biggest nightmare for Joran ,his father ,Koen ,Freddy the 2 K's is Peter r de Vries .
He is a fighter and pit bull and he never give up any case .
He did 40 broadcasting's about the Puttense murder case ,with success!
He and his team have all the time and (!) money to do investigation in this case .
They can be everywhere and they don't like that at all.
Their spotlight is now on Paul vd Sloot & friends  ,what did he(they) in the past as a lawyer and Judge (for the government Aruba .



The biggest threat damn sure isn't Hans Mos or Dop Kruimel. Those two jake-legged prosecutors couldn't find their asses with a good roadmap. You are 100% correct Johan, if this case is broken it will be Peter DeVries who does it!

I await that day....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 29, 2008, 07:08:26 PM
Johan555,

Where did you find those posts about Aruba?  Do you have the link?

Here's one of them 2NJSons_Mom!

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050616a.html

Thanks, texasmom.  ::MonkeyWink::
You're welcome!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 29, 2008, 07:15:45 PM
For Johan555, no picture...yet ::MonkeyWink:: but she has apparently been accused of questionable journalistic practices before.....

http://www.nieuwsbank.nl/inp/2004/08/26/F002.htm
google translation:
SESSIONS
This we would like to draw your attention to the next public meeting of the Council for Journalism. The session will be held at the premises of the NVJ, Johannes Vermeerstraat 22 in Amsterdam. Thursday, August 26, 2004
Complaint of Buitendijk cs against EO-Two Today newspaper and against the North on a broadcast and a number of articles on the woongemeenschappen of complainants. According to the complainants is incorrect, suggestive messages and they are wrongly accused of child abuse among others.

14.30 pm
Complaint of Alizonne B.V. against Z. Vukojevic and New Revu on the article "Total failed - Misleading and life practices in the plastic surgery". The publication is the complainant in a list of 'worst clinics in the Netherlands. " The complainant claims that the defendants have made insufficient facts and wrongly failed hearing to apply. In addition, the publication is false and tendentious, said the complainant.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 29, 2008, 07:16:57 PM


Very interesting posts Johan...thank you.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 29, 2008, 07:28:13 PM
The biggest nightmare for Joran ,his father ,Koen ,Freddy the 2 K's is Peter r de Vries .
He is a fighter and pit bull and he never give up any case .
He did 40 broadcasting's about the Puttense murder case ,with success!
He and his team have all the time and (!) money to do investigation in this case .
They can be everywhere and they don't like that at all.
Their spotlight is now on Paul vd Sloot & friends  ,what did he(they) in the past as a lawyer and Judge (for the government Aruba .


And he's intelligent and good looking.  DeVries rocks.   ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LilPuma on July 29, 2008, 07:39:54 PM
ARUBA -2006

And it seemed such a nice man
ORANJESTAD - 17/11/2006
Ramond Lee
(http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/images/assets/13101871)

An unknown woman in the forty, has made declarations against Minister Ramon Lee (MEP) for rape. The declaration against the Minister of Labour, Culture and Sport is beginning this week. The Public Prosecutor (OM) has confirmed that declaration is made against a minister, but would not say what the Minister. Amigoe has, however, a reliable source that received the confirmation to the Minister Lee.

Spokesman Arends-Mariaine Croes of the PPS know that the prosecutor is still considering whether the declaration of a case. At this moment is still an investigation. The woman who has made the declaration, an ex-wife of a member of Lee. The rape would be in the house of the minister have taken place.

Lee is currently staying abroad for a holiday. He is back again next Monday.


Have we ever seen a rape prosecuted in Aruba? I can't remember a single one in the 3 years we've been following the case? Anyone have any information?

What a great question.  Not just for the 3  years since Natalee was (most likely) drugged, raped, murdered and disappeared, but ever.  EVER.  Is it just Americans who drink and party on vacation (how appalling!) or is it women of any nationality? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on July 29, 2008, 08:11:58 PM
After seeing that pic of Val's bar fly...


I just thought this place could use a pic

of a pretty girl with class up in here...  ;)



(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/FdGGFGF7111m-1.png)


Natalee Holloway

I agree - beautiful and classy.

It's sad that after three years, she has not returned to her family.

My mother used to say things like "I just want to live long enough to see you kids get married and have children.  I want at least one from each of you." 

Natalee's family will never see her graduate, marry, and have children. 

They will never look into the faces of Natalee's young ones and recognize a nose or perhaps a set of distinctive ears. 

They will never know where their child rests each night.

I think they will also wonder "what if"...what if I had done this or that differently?  What if I didn't let her go at all?  Why did I think it was so safe?

Do the parents of her family and friends thank the Lord daily that their children got off the plane and returned home?

How many 'what ifs' are part of their lives?

There is no [Ctrl] [Alt] [Del] for anyone. 


In life, love should be the base.

We must cherish every face.

~ Natalee Holloway ~


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 29, 2008, 08:20:54 PM


:(

I just don't understand it....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 03:06:01 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 03:22:55 AM
For Johan555, no picture...yet ::MonkeyWink:: but she has apparently been accused of questionable journalistic practices before.....

http://www.nieuwsbank.nl/inp/2004/08/26/F002.htm
google translation:
SESSIONS
This we would like to draw your attention to the next public meeting of the Council for Journalism. The session will be held at the premises of the NVJ, Johannes Vermeerstraat 22 in Amsterdam. Thursday, August 26, 2004
Complaint of Buitendijk cs against EO-Two Today newspaper and against the North on a broadcast and a number of articles on the woongemeenschappen of complainants. According to the complainants is incorrect, suggestive messages and they are wrongly accused of child abuse among others.

14.30 pm
Complaint of Alizonne B.V. against Z. Vukojevic and New Revu on the article "Total failed - Misleading and life practices in the plastic surgery". The publication is the complainant in a list of 'worst clinics in the Netherlands. " The complainant claims that the defendants have made insufficient facts and wrongly failed hearing to apply. In addition, the publication is false and tendentious, said the complainant.

Yes this Z. Vukojevic (Nieuwe Revu) was in court and she lost ,the the publications were false and tendentious


So why did Joran and his Fam Choose this second hand writer with a Bad Name ?
Or were they  looking for a writer with this reputation ?  ( false and tendentious )

http://www.rvdj.nl/2004/80

Uitspraakweergave

De directe link voor deze uitspraak is:
http://www.rvdj.nl/2004/80


P.M.J. Beckers en drs. C.I.M. van der Lugt (Alizonne B.V.) tegen P. de Wit, J. van der Bijl en Z. Vukojevic (Nieuwe Revu)
Nummer    2004/80
Zittingsdatum    
Datum    2004-10-12
klagers    P.M.J. Beckers en drs. C.I.M. van der Lugt (Alizonne B.V.)
betrokkenen    P. de Wit, J. van der Bijl en Z. Vukojevic (Nieuwe Revu)
medium    Nieuwe Revu
beslissing    gegrond
journalistieke werkwijze   bronnen, hoor en wederhoor
feitenweergave   tendentieuze berichtgeving
rectificatie/ weerwoord   rectificatie
aard van het medium   publiekstijdschrift
casus

Beslissing van de Raad voor de Journalistiek
inzake de klacht van

P.M.J. Beckers en drs. C.I.M. van der Lugt (Alizonne B.V.)

tegen

P. de Wit, J. van der Bijl en Z. Vukojevic (Nieuwe Revu)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 04:28:06 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


were can i find this movie caps  ?????????


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 30, 2008, 05:44:04 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


were can i find this movie caps  ?????????

Caps,

Yooooo... we need to acquire those, Batman!!! Please, more info soon.


Sincerely Yours,

Signed: Alfred Thaddeus Crane Pennyworth


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 06:18:38 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


were can i find this movie caps  ?????????

Caps,

Yooooo... we need to acquire those, Batman!!! Please, more info soon.


Sincerely Yours,

Signed: Alfred Thaddeus Crane Pennyworth


LOL Carpe…more comic book characters…Yes we need more info…Would love to see them both…


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 06:34:00 AM

Just started rereading the Front Page posts, and I am only now starting June 9th., so far I have read at least 4 different “Aruban” posters say “ it is pretty hard to find some-one that doesn’t want to be found”. These “Aruban” posters on the FP are an Aruban married to an American, Americans living in Aruba, Gabe Leo and friends, as well as the real Arubans. Natalee ran away to Costa Rica, her family is connected to George Bush, she dressed trashy, compared to the local girls(what a joke), and of course she was willing.

The anti-American sentiment comes over loud and clear…and I am probably not as biased as many here in that regard. IMO the paid posters were there to protect Aruba’s tourism industry. Trash the victim, confuse, mislead and discredit any US news media and of course hide the truth. Save their tourism image at all costs.

Apparently I am not the only one that saw it that way!

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 4:16 pm
So much anger at Americans by the Aruban posters.
It makes me wonder what they think after they shake our hand, smile, and turn away.
Is it all a facade?

Just Wondering on June 8th, 2005 5:15 pm
Iara,
I see mostly hostility toward Americans from the Aruban posters.
Take a look at past posts from Mona, Susan, Gabriel Leo, John, others.
They want to blame Natalee and say it is the promiscous Americans who are the problem. Or she ran away and is causing Aruba to spend too much money on her.
As Mona from Aruba put it…..:”she has to DEAL with Americans every day” in her job.
And what about the comments from others who said America deserved 9/11.
I had no thoughts about Aruba one way or the other until I starting reading these posts. The America bashing is pretty blatant.
Personally I think Arubans need to realize they just stepped into the 21st century and take security seriously.



Great finds there Mum! Look how fast they were in place. Those posts were from June 6th after the Aruban/American ExPats had already been posting for days. Aruba had their Disinformation Machine in place almost immediately after Natalee disappeared. One day maybe we'll be privy to the ATA/AHATA budget and we'll see how much they spent on their end to cover up the crime with their Sloot lawyer buddy/board of director Antonio Carlo at the helm.


Thanks Dayhiker…even more disturbing is that the Front Page posts only started on June 2nd., most was around 50, lots of Arubans, and some of those were added later…very few comments until June 7th.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 07:08:59 AM
(http://www.thedailyherald.com/tdhonline/images/yootheme/logo_tdh.png)
Dutch worried about corruption in Aruba

30-july-2008

ARUBA--Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) expressed concern about government corruption in Aruba during talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP).

  This is evident from his answer to the Second Chamber of Parliament on questions which PVV Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman asked the minister and State Secretary of Kingdom Relations Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA) on the June 26.
(http://xs224.xs.to/xs224/08074/herobrinkman_jpg_146644i724.jpg)
HERO BRINKMAN

  The questions are about the political climate on Aruba and the Netherlands Antilles as a result of the interview in the Volkskrant newspaper with former deputy Aruba Solicitor General Nico Jörg, who described the climate as “dismal.”

  Brinkman asked whether the Dutch Minister was aware of “the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as conflicts of interest, lobbying for political reasons and nepotism in Aruba” and what the minister has subsequently done with this information.

  Hirsch Ballin responded that Aruba’s Public Prosecution has taken various such cases of corruption to court and a few resulted in a conviction. “During talks with, among others, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I have expressed my concern and have spoken about improvements in the system which can prevent corruption.”

  Brinkman also asked how much money was at stake in the last five years of this corruption. The Minister said he did not know because it was a matter for the Aruba Government.

  Regarding tenders by the Aruba Government, Hirsch Ballin also said he did not have any insight in that area as this matter falls under the Aruba Government.

  The PVV-member brought forward in his question that tenders were not always transparent, as was stated in the newspaper interview. The Justice Minister claimed to be aware of shortcomings in legislation.

  “The Netherlands delivers technical aid in order to support Aruba in its legislation process and to rid the island of these shortcomings as soon as possible,” said Hirsch Ballin.

  Brinkman also wanted to know how Jörg’s presumption that the Public Prosecution on Aruba is met with resistance when it does more than just combat crime, came about. To this question as well the minister replied that Public Prosecution was a matter for the Aruba Government and that he was not in the position to judge the “steps which the Public Prosecution has taken or should have taken in whichever situation.”

  Furthermore, the minister considers that the Public Prosecution should be able to execute its work “independently, and through the regular authorities.”

  Finally the Dutch Member of Parliament also wanted to know whether the minister thought that everyone who got his/her job through nepotism should be fired on the spot.

  To this Hirsch Ballin replied: “When hiring personnel the suitability of the candidate for the function should be the first priority. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. I take it that Aruba stands behind the importance of this criterion. I don’t have insight into the exchange of personnel with the Aruban government apparatus.”
(http://www.enkeling.nl/beeld/ernst_hirsch_ballin.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 07:24:48 AM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/AANkomstschipholkopie.jpg?t=1217417021)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 07:48:21 AM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/AANkomstschipholkopie.jpg?t=1217417021)

I have often wondered who the tall blond is.  I believe she was also in the lobby of the NY Hotel pic of PVDS, when he was served papers.  We have a pic, somewhere.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 07:50:13 AM
Good catch on the possible Dolph.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 07:58:38 AM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/gnion3.gif?t=1217418981)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/AANkomstschipholkopie.jpg?t=1217419079)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 30, 2008, 08:01:57 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


Holy bat cam, Carp!

You saw the actual footage discussed in this youtube vid?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjgJTSM9WWI



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 30, 2008, 08:40:11 AM
Hi Monkeys,

Today I saw 2 movies about Natalee that was never been showed in the USA nor in Aruba.

These DVD are very interesting and where produced in holland.

I that we all forgot to see that there was a missing person in the plot and I have found it. It is the Lawyer Antonio Carlo himself.  He was interview with hidden cam. Never showned. how he is admitting talking to the Chief Prosecuter about Joran Confesion.

the first movie was about the whole confesion without cuts that peter de-vries produces and what Poentje castro tried to show in Aruba and was not allowed to aired.

the Second is called the Secret of Aruba. This video have a lot of hidden cam investigation on aruba that was never showned to the world.

Specialy how Bob the Wit change the search of the sloot home.

In the Movie there is a complete view of the inside of Joran Apartment.

These films are in Dutch and never showned. What was showned were peaces to the media.

Back to my bat-tunnel


Holy bat cam, Carp!

You saw the actual footage discussed in this youtube vid?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjgJTSM9WWI



Wow!! Sham - wow!!  ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 08:46:46 AM
Caps
Are you talking about the you tube videos that have been in circulation on the internet for a while now or is this something completely different?  I have seen several that were sent to me before that had these same things in them.  I am wondering if this is a new set or the same ones as before? TIA

BTW glad you are doing well in the bat cave.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on July 30, 2008, 08:58:08 AM
PTI:

Mod squad:

Clean up needed in aisle 11.

Starting here:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=3116.msg402630#msg402630

Thank you.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 08:59:07 AM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/gnion3.gif?t=1217418981)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/AANkomstschipholkopie.jpg?t=1217419079)


Yep 2 times dolph(DOLF?) Stapele
I Think This Dolph Stapele travels together with Joran and  send the Misinformation to the Media
Was he also with Joran in thailland on the market ? the guy with blond hair ?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 10:36:44 AM
johan

Picture of Zvezdana Vukojevic on page 10.  Sorry, I cannot capture.

((edit))


((edit))


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 11:04:36 AM
Thanks Pita.  Any idea who the blond is?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on July 30, 2008, 11:27:54 AM
(http://www.thedailyherald.com/tdhonline/images/yootheme/logo_tdh.png)
Dutch worried about corruption in Aruba

30-july-2008

ARUBA--Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin (CDA) expressed concern about government corruption in Aruba during talks with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP).

  This is evident from his answer to the Second Chamber of Parliament on questions which PVV Member of Parliament Hero Brinkman asked the minister and State Secretary of Kingdom Relations Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (CDA) on the June 26.
(http://xs224.xs.to/xs224/08074/herobrinkman_jpg_146644i724.jpg)
HERO BRINKMAN

  The questions are about the political climate on Aruba and the Netherlands Antilles as a result of the interview in the Volkskrant newspaper with former deputy Aruba Solicitor General Nico Jörg, who described the climate as “dismal.”

  Brinkman asked whether the Dutch Minister was aware of “the serious allegations of examples of corruption, such as conflicts of interest, lobbying for political reasons and nepotism in Aruba” and what the minister has subsequently done with this information.

  Hirsch Ballin responded that Aruba’s Public Prosecution has taken various such cases of corruption to court and a few resulted in a conviction. “During talks with, among others, the Prime Minister of Aruba, I have expressed my concern and have spoken about improvements in the system which can prevent corruption.”

  Brinkman also asked how much money was at stake in the last five years of this corruption. The Minister said he did not know because it was a matter for the Aruba Government.

  Regarding tenders by the Aruba Government, Hirsch Ballin also said he did not have any insight in that area as this matter falls under the Aruba Government.

  The PVV-member brought forward in his question that tenders were not always transparent, as was stated in the newspaper interview. The Justice Minister claimed to be aware of shortcomings in legislation.

  “The Netherlands delivers technical aid in order to support Aruba in its legislation process and to rid the island of these shortcomings as soon as possible,” said Hirsch Ballin.

  Brinkman also wanted to know how Jörg’s presumption that the Public Prosecution on Aruba is met with resistance when it does more than just combat crime, came about. To this question as well the minister replied that Public Prosecution was a matter for the Aruba Government and that he was not in the position to judge the “steps which the Public Prosecution has taken or should have taken in whichever situation.”

  Furthermore, the minister considers that the Public Prosecution should be able to execute its work “independently, and through the regular authorities.”

  Finally the Dutch Member of Parliament also wanted to know whether the minister thought that everyone who got his/her job through nepotism should be fired on the spot.

  To this Hirsch Ballin replied: “When hiring personnel the suitability of the candidate for the function should be the first priority. Objectivity and transparency in the process are important. I take it that Aruba stands behind the importance of this criterion. I don’t have insight into the exchange of personnel with the Aruban government apparatus.”
(http://www.enkeling.nl/beeld/ernst_hirsch_ballin.jpg)

correct me if i'm wrong.  there is corruption, collusion, and many other infractions happening within the govt. of aruba, including resistance from high powers in the govt. to dismiss any actions to prevent this, or to prosecute those doing it.  but that's o.k. with ballin because it's aruba's job to correct this IF THEY WANT TO?
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 11:47:49 AM
so this is the "writer " ::MonkeyHaHa::
((edit))

AND NOW Who was on that pic with Joran in Thailand ? (that blonde Guy )
i don't have that pic here



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 11:57:04 AM
johan

Picture of Zvezdana Vukojevic on page 10.  Sorry, I cannot capture.

(((edit))

Thanks Buckeye !!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 12:47:44 PM
Thanks Pita.  Any idea who the blond is?

No, no clue.    :smt102


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 01:28:22 PM
At one time I thought the blonde in that picture resembled Renee Gielen.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 01:34:44 PM
Caps
Are you talking about the you tube videos that have been in circulation on the internet for a while now or is this something completely different?  I have seen several that were sent to me before that had these same things in them.  I am wondering if this is a new set or the same ones as before? TIA

BTW glad you are doing well in the bat cave.  ::MonkeyWink::
[/quote

You see, these videos are the real thing before what has been cut to show the world. Things that de Vries never shared to the world. these DVD are 2 hrs lonf and contain the whole process of the undercover operation, what joran said and where he show Hans Mos he eveidance and where Hans MOS aware of this conffesion.

Joran sate that he met natalee that night, he know the girl for about 3 hours and that she died on her and where he has caled his friend to despose of it. It is all in Dutch.

How did I got my hand on....don't ask...

But I have some question but it also let me have a clear inside who the Arawak is.  The Lawyer Carlo and Ben King.

Ben King work for the Chief Prosecuter and Live with Paules Van der Sloot. Mantana 19, that is why I can not find an adress for him in any registry.

I will see if I can load them up...but will check...these are the videos where the things were cut out that no one have seem

The on on you tube is just an extract and not the video it self.

The on called "Het Geheim van Aruba" is 2 hours long very good work. Tranlation "The Secret of Aruba"

This movie I have not see on the Internet. Will have to put my streaming server on

and the one from where Joran confess that Pater show was just a bit and not the whole thing.

CAPS.





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 01:45:19 PM
Thanks Caps for answering me. I didn't want there to be any confusion as what you were talking about.  Can't wait to see it all. Let me know if you need any help.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 02:27:13 PM
Caps
Are you talking about the you tube videos that have been in circulation on the internet for a while now or is this something completely different?  I have seen several that were sent to me before that had these same things in them.  I am wondering if this is a new set or the same ones as before? TIA

BTW glad you are doing well in the bat cave.  ::MonkeyWink::
[/quote

You see, these videos are the real thing before what has been cut to show the world. Things that de Vries never shared to the world. these DVD are 2 hrs lonf and contain the whole process of the undercover operation, what joran said and where he show Hans Mos he eveidance and where Hans MOS aware of this conffesion.

Joran sate that he met natalee that night, he know the girl for about 3 hours and that she died on her and where he has caled his friend to despose of it. It is all in Dutch.

How did I got my hand on....don't ask...

But I have some question but it also let me have a clear inside who the Arawak is.  The Lawyer Carlo and Ben King.

Ben King work for the Chief Prosecuter and Live with Paules Van der Sloot. Mantana 19, that is why I can not find an adress for him in any registry.

I will see if I can load them up...but will check...these are the videos where the things were cut out that no one have seem

The on on you tube is just an extract and not the video it self.

The on called "Het Geheim van Aruba" is 2 hours long very good work. Tranlation "The Secret of Aruba"

This movie I have not see on the Internet. Will have to put my streaming server on

and the one from where Joran confess that Pater show was just a bit and not the whole thing.

CAPS.






SORRY...CAN'T FIX THE QUOTES.

Caps…You did find an address for Ben Vocking…or is there two?   ::MonkeyWink::

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2787.820
 
Re: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #3

« Reply #823 on: April 24, 2008, 02:03:34 PM »Caps

ok
now we are talking

Vocking   Bernardus FC               1/14/1948   Nijmegen   De La Sallestraat 14
Vocking, geb. de Droog   Anna MJ   6/3/1959             Amsterdam   De La Sallestraat 14

The man and the wife.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 02:45:34 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 02:53:18 PM
Im here!  Worried about Destiny, has anyone heard from her??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 02:56:03 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 03:03:45 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 03:34:28 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


According to the Video he Lives at the premises of the Vander Sloot. Even though there is an address for him register, but with the video and with someone info on him, in 2005 he was living at the sloots home. not visiting.

You see the person that helped Joran that nigth is his Padrino. "The God Father"



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 03:41:35 PM
CAPS, are you saying his real father, or a Godfather or a Grandfather?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 03:43:44 PM
Or are you Ben King is the Godfather???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 03:48:04 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


According to the Video he Lives at the premises of the Vander Sloot. Even though there is an address for him register, but with the video and with someone info on him, in 2005 he was living at the sloots home. not visiting.

You see the person that helped Joran that nigth is his Padrino. "The God Father"




Hmmm!...I will need to do some research on the archives. IIRC, the van der Sloots went to stay with the Vockings for a while. Also thought I read that van der Straten was Joran's Godfather. I may be mistaken on this and will post what I can find.

If anyone can remember, please post as I am not sure I will get to it today...

Thanks Caps.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 04:01:14 PM
I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 04:07:22 PM
Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:32 pm
The sacrifice is the correct food to appease the gods, arawaks, and cowboys
but the foundations of the house of babylon will shake
even harder if Arawak Dirty Hand is revealed.
(http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p149/Morgan2112_2006/CommenciaPapito.jpg)
EDWIN 'PAPITO' COMEMENCIA - DIRTY HAND

COMEMENCIA WAS AT THE VAN DER SLOOT HOUSE:
Two police officers walked through the Van Der Sloot family's one-story, yellow-beige home, while others guarded the entranceway. A blue sport utility vehicle and a red Jeep were also towed from the property.

Officers on the scene would not comment, and police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said he had no information.

MORE COMEMENCIA WAS AT THE VAN DER SLOOT HOUSE:

Updated Wed. Jun. 15, 2005 10:37 PM ET

Associated Press

NOORD, Aruba -- Aruban police Wednesday searched the home of a high-ranking Dutch judicial official whose son was with an Alabama honors student the night she disappeared, carrying out plastic garbage bags full of items and towing away two vehicles.

snip

Wednesday's search of the van der Sloot home lasted about four hours. Two white-uniformed investigators from Holland carried suitcases into the one-story, yellow-beige home, which includes an attached apartment where the young man lives. They later returned the suitcases to their white, unmarked car.

Investigators also emerged from the house carrying two white plastic garbage bags full of unidentified items. A German Shepherd also sniffed around the property outside the capital, Oranjestad.

Authorities towed a blue sport utility vehicle and a red Jeep away from the house, which is surrounded by a low stone wall and fronted by an expanse of trees and cacti.

"The search is part of the investigation," said Mariaine Croes, a spokeswoman for Attorney General Caren Janssen.

Croes said both cars belonged to the family, but she did not say why they were taken away.

Janssen, who also went into the house, declined to comment as investigators wrapped up their search at about 4 p.m. Six police officers guarded the entrance to the property.

"We are just looking for evidence at the house but have nothing yet," police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said during the search.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 04:12:07 PM
I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?

Interesting!...I can dig for posts all I like, but that is all they are...posts. Need some reliable sources...Otherwise we are all just speculating!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 04:16:37 PM
I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?

Interesting!...I can dig for posts all I like, but that is all they are...posts. Need some reliable sources...Otherwise we are all just speculating!

I was told that guy was a godfather too. LOL  Sorry, I know i heard van der Straten at first. Then another source told me I had it wrong and it was Papi the Butterfly Comemcia.  I guess I have it wrong again.  Darn it!  I just hate it when I am wrong....which of course isn't very often.  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 04:29:03 PM
CAPS, are you saying his real father, or a Godfather or a Grandfather?

it is his godfather and Ben king

His godfather is Antonio Carlo who he called. to take care of the problem...who came to help.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 30, 2008, 04:31:56 PM
I recall in the early days of the case it was alleged that it was van der Straaten who was the Godfather. Then that was denied by some from Aruba.....IMO it came out early enough to lend credibility to the idea...and then the mis-informants kicked into high-gear.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 04:37:53 PM
CAPS, are you saying his real father, or a Godfather or a Grandfather?

it is his godfather and Ben king

His godfather is Antonio Carlo who he called. to take care of the problem...who came to help.


Let me get this straight...you are now saying that Joran's godfather that he called the night in question to help him was none other than Antonio Carlo.  Paulus's business partner and attorney?? Is that what you are saying?   Joran's real godfather is Antonio Carlo the lawyer? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 04:40:06 PM
I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?

Interesting!...I can dig for posts all I like, but that is all they are...posts. Need some reliable sources...Otherwise we are all just speculating!

I was told that guy was a godfather too. LOL  Sorry, I know i heard van der Straten at first. Then another source told me I had it wrong and it was Papi the Butterfly Comemcia.  I guess I have it wrong again.  Darn it!  I just hate it when I am wrong....which of course isn't very often.  ::MonkeyWink::


Well some-one agrees with you...there are others, including Vocking,  but the only thing "official" is van der Straten and that is from Fox.  We all know how misinformed they were. ::MonkeyWink::

I will check on the Fox info…

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1781.msg241527#msg241527

Reply #883 on: June 28, 2005, 08:48:32 PM »Nancy Drew   
 
Quote from: "iquitos"
so it is true that van der straaten is joran's godfather?


No, we don't know this to be true.


Post that said fox said van der Straten

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1763.msg240530#msg240530


Reply #166 on: June 28, 2005, 10:12:11 PM » Itawamba   
 
arubagirl -- Is Van Straaten the person whose son you know?  How is it that he is also a Nederlander, possibly from Arnehm or Boxtel, to be Joran's godfather?  And Lorenzo's mother, too?  Is Aruba full of people from that one area of The Netherlands?

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1794.msg241716#msg241716


Lively Case Discussion #529 10/2 - 10/7/2006  Yapperz« Reply #192 on: October 02, 2006, 10:58:47 PM »   
 
Quote from: "SunFreak2"
Can someone please clear this up for me too?

Joran's alleged GodFather;

Van der Straaten?  or Papito Commencia?


I believe Papito. Here is a post by STom from a ways back:

STom
Joined: 13 Sep 2005

 Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:10 pm    Post subject:     


 
igsigs:

At the beginning of the investigation Papito Comemencia was very active as
police spokesperson. I understand he is the officer that Joran considers his
Godfather and uncle, not van der Straaten. He is -or at least was- very close
to the van der Sloots.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=397.msg56024#msg56024

Re: Plain View Hermetic Code Masons Kat Gram
« Reply #408 on: January 03, 2007, 12:53:10 AM »

snipped
If so,  why did we get this lack of evidence?

but if their hands were tied by cronyism, elitism, favors of payback, perhaps Jacobs not getting the evidence or evidence not getting to the Judges, opps then again, the judges were friends and the Chief of Police is Joran's godfather on and on

plus it seems tourism and the system 'we don't understand' rules there also.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=681.msg99680#msg99680











Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 04:46:15 PM
CAPS, are you saying his real father, or a Godfather or a Grandfather?

it is his godfather and Ben king

His godfather is Antonio Carlo who he called. to take care of the problem...who came to help.



That would be the same Antonio Carlo that sat on the Board Selection Committee for AHATA at the time Natalee went missing and during the investigation I assume? The same Antonio Carlo that served as Joran's attorney, and later allowed Paulus Van der Sloot into his firm as a business partner? I believe this  would be the same Antonio Carlo.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 04:47:40 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 04:51:30 PM
OK. I am totally confused again.   ::MonkeyConfused::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 04:51:34 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"

Ben king is the second perp


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 04:52:18 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"


Thanks ... always1...that is what i thought Caps said as well... ::MonkeyConfused::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 04:53:03 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


According to the Video he Lives at the premises of the Vander Sloot. Even though there is an address for him register, but with the video and with someone info on him, in 2005 he was living at the sloots home. not visiting.

You see the person that helped Joran that nigth is his Padrino. "The God Father"




It is understood that Ben Vocking did go live with the Van der Sloots right after Natalee disappeared and took a leave of absence from his job in Prosecutor Karin Jannsen's office in order to help Paulus. It is a known fact that he was at the Van der Sloot house with Dutch Judge Bob Wit when the Prosecutor and Aruban Police were blocked by the judges order from searching the main residence and surrounding property, limiting the search to Joran's apartment only.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 04:58:12 PM
Before Joran went to holland, He requested that his PC Hard disk to be erased and the computer reset to the original factory state.

He did not wanted a backup of the disk.

This is was found on the disk that was request by Joran to someone call Hackers_rule@hotmail.com

The Request wast to make a photo of him and Natalee in Natalee home in The USA,

This was to make believe that they know each other. He paid 200 euro for the job.

IMO he wanted to do some more damage to the famaly

See for your self...these are on the Video





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 04:58:16 PM
Ok, so Ben King alis Ben Vocking and Antonio Carlo (born in the Netherlands) and attorney with Paulus were the ones who helped Joran get rid of the body that night, is that right everyone????


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 04:58:40 PM
Wait just a minute!  I think I understand.  The person that helped Joran is known by the term "Godfather".  That is not saying he is really Joran's godfather?  Do I have that right?  Oh, Please Caps tell me that is what you meant.  I am so confused right now my eyes are about to pop out of my head.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:00:13 PM
Blond:

Could you group these picture together

caps


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 05:00:57 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"


I am not sure what Caps is saying as far as Antonio Carlo's involvement the night Natalee disappeared. That goes against the grain somewhat of the supposed confession (according to P DeVries) Carlo made to Jannsen that he thought Joran was guilty and it was up her to prove it. If he were involved in the disposal and cover-up that does not jive.

I am not sure Caps is saying whether Ben King was involved that night either. What I do know is that both of these men played a pivotal role in helping Joran, Paulus Van der Sloot and the government of Aruba cover-up the crime, and we know from Carlo sitting on the board of AHATA had to have a direct influence on AHATA's nedia and internet campaign to trash Natalee and Beth.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:01:39 PM
last picture


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 05:08:28 PM
last picture

Caps...Thanks...This has already been posted and hashed over...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 05:09:40 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"

Ben king is the second perp



Caps, I would be very interest in knowing if these are the "higher ups" who helped Joran cover up the crime (as per what he told Patrick) and whether they were involved the night Natalee disappeared. Is there direct information linking them to this on the DVDs you have seen? TIA.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:10:14 PM
Wait just a minute!  I think I understand.  The person that helped Joran is known by the term "Godfather".  That is not saying he is really Joran's godfather?  Do I have that right?  Oh, Please Caps tell me that is what you meant.  I am so confused right now my eyes are about to pop out of my head.

It is his real godfather.

When you are born, baptise, the famaly will select a godfather when baptised. Then and First Comunion again they will select a godfather. This is called also the trusted godfather some one that will be with you for ever, someone that will help you when needed.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 05:10:40 PM

Before Joran went to holland, He requested that his PC Hard disk to be erased and the computer reset to the original factory state.

He did not wanted a backup of the disk.

This is was found on the disk that was request by Joran to someone call Hackers_rule@hotmail.com

this is why he wants to erase his hard disk :

One of the suspects, Joran Van Der Sloot, had a personal web site that promoted gang culture and violence including gang rapes. The web site was removed from the internet, allegedly by Van Der Sloot's father, within hours after he was arrested.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 05:18:51 PM
And let us not forget that Frans van Deutekom was there, something about another car...Have a great evening everyone! ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 30, 2008, 05:31:01 PM
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/CARLOkopie.jpg?t=1217453395)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:38:24 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 05:38:32 PM
WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT ANTONIO CARLO:

1- He is, and always has been, Joran's main attorney.
2- He sat on the Board Selection Committee for AHATA at the time Natalee went missing and during the investigation
3- He would have had an influential position with AHATA and another board selection committee member, Marlene Purcell.
4- Marlene Purcell was AHATA's internet expert.
5- His position on AHATA's board could have influenced AHATA's media and internet campaign to trash Natalee's reputation and accuse Beth of things such as insurance fraud.
6- He is Paulus Van der Sloot's business partner.


WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT BEN VOCKING:

1- He is by his own admission a very close friend of the Van der Sloot family, particularly Paulus.
2- He worked in Prosecutor Karin Jannsen's office at the time Natalee went missing.
3- He took a leave of absence from his job in the Prosecutor's right after Natalee went missing.
4- He took his leave of absence by his own admission to help his friend Paulus in his time of need, a clear conflict of interest in any case, particularly bad in a murder case where his friend's son was known to be involved.
5- He was at the Van der Sloot house with Dutch Judge Bob Wit when the Prosecutor and Aruban Police were blocked by the judge's order from searching the main residence and surrounding property.
6- He was verbally reprimanded for his obvious conflict of interest by Karin Jannsen but no penalties were ever given for his indisgressions.
7- He had worked in other powerful Aruba government offices, including KIA.


FEEL FREE TO ADD.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Dayhiker on July 30, 2008, 05:41:33 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.



Thanks for that info Caps!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 05:47:37 PM
CAPS, thanks for answering my questions too!  How can I watch that video you are talking about???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:48:21 PM
Then Dayhiker, why did CAPS  say "and Ben King"


I am not sure what Caps is saying as far as Antonio Carlo's involvement the night Natalee disappeared. That goes against the grain somewhat of the supposed confession (according to P DeVries) Carlo made to Jannsen that he thought Joran was guilty and it was up her to prove it. If he were involved in the disposal and cover-up that does not jive.

I am not sure Caps is saying whether Ben King was involved that night either. What I do know is that both of these men played a pivotal role in helping Joran, Paulus Van der Sloot and the government of Aruba cover-up the crime, and we know from Carlo sitting on the board of AHATA had to have a direct influence on AHATA's nedia and internet campaign to trash Natalee and Beth.



Yes I thought about it also, but here is where they played the Jansen. Their plan was to make get a fall guy, A scape goat. so that everyone will be happy. To defuse the whole thing, someone needed to go to jail, He know that Joran was innocent and he played to Karen that he know that Joran did it and so force an incarceration even the person is innocent.
by the lawyer breaking the client / lawyer confidential rule, he can force them to concentrate on the innocent.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 05:55:02 PM
CAPS, you mean that Joran is innocent of killing Natalee, but why did she die then?  And why did they have to get rid of her body?  Do you know where the body is now?  Can it be recovered??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 05:58:38 PM
Robert, on the front page, explained the Dutch "naming" order.  I think he said the fourth name, before the surname, is the godfather.  Made me think that Joran perhaps was not baptized because I never saw a fourth name.  Maybe there is no "official" godfather.  :smt102


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 05:59:29 PM
WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT ANTONIO CARLO:

1- He is, and always has been, Joran's main attorney.
2- He sat on the Board Selection Committee for AHATA at the time Natalee went missing and during the investigation
3- He would have had an influential position with AHATA and another board selection committee member, Marlene Purcell.
4- Marlene Purcell was AHATA's internet expert.
5- His position on AHATA's board could have influenced AHATA's media and internet campaign to trash Natalee's reputation and accuse Beth of things such as insurance fraud.
6- He is Paulus Van der Sloot's business partner.


WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT BEN VOCKING:

1- He is by his own admission a very close friend of the Van der Sloot family, particularly Paulus.
2- He worked in Prosecutor Karin Jannsen's office at the time Natalee went missing.
3- He took a leave of absence from his job in the Prosecutor's right after Natalee went missing.
4- He took his leave of absence by his own admission to help his friend Paulus in his time of need, a clear conflict of interest in any case, particularly bad in a murder case where his friend's son was known to be involved.
5- He was at the Van der Sloot house with Dutch Judge Bob Wit when the Prosecutor and Aruban Police were blocked by the judge's order from searching the main residence and surrounding property.
6- He was verbally reprimanded for his obvious conflict of interest by Karin Jannsen but no penalties were ever given for his indisgressions.
7- He had worked in other powerful Aruba government offices, including KIA.


FEEL FREE TO ADD.


all of them worked for the interest of the governent. The Real Proseucter that has a lot to say in youth issue is Frans Duetekom.
Frans Duetekom is the real person that had what to say in the case. and this is a fact from internal source.


 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 06:04:43 PM
I am open to anyone covering up or disposing of Natalee.  What I want to know is why they felt they needed to do that.  What did they do to her that would have such repercussions that they would dispose of her?  Accident and/or innocence does not equate with the action.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 06:04:57 PM
CAPS how can we watch that movie, and can Natalee's body be recovered in  your opinion??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 06:07:08 PM
CAPS, you mean that Joran is innocent of killing Natalee, but why did she die then?  And why did they have to get rid of her body?  Do you know where the body is now?  Can it be recovered??

Yes the body is recoverable but the Maze has many walkways. Trying to figure out which one.

I hope I have not open my self for problems.... I know we are beeing watched by HM.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 06:09:29 PM
Thank you CAPS, please be careful!!! Have to go now.  Thanks for your replys.  A-1


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 06:19:13 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts… ::MonkeyWink::

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 06:43:21 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts… ::MonkeyWink::

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...



The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 30, 2008, 06:46:34 PM
CAPS, I dont know the answer to your question, can I ask you one more??  An older monkey feels her body could be under a building, am I close???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 30, 2008, 06:48:21 PM


I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 30, 2008, 06:51:02 PM
Somewhere here we have a list of the dead after Natalee went missing...not sure where to locate that, will look.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 30, 2008, 06:51:20 PM
I think Caps is on to that "damning evidence" we have all thought/hoped is really out there. That said, I still believe that Joran is THE responsible perp of Natalee's demise (although Carlo et al won't ever come out and say it in these "filmed" revelations.)

If these filmed revelations exist and Caps has seen them -- I still have the gut feeling our FBI has seen them as well  -- they know!

I will repeat again.................. it has been awfully, eerily quiet from all involved since about March. JMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 30, 2008, 06:53:01 PM
This may help.... http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2805.0


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 30, 2008, 06:57:28 PM
There may be more in our Murder and Crime on Aruba thread, but I seemed to have forgotten where that is.....ughh.  ::MonkeyWaa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 06:58:08 PM


I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....

As far as I know he was not questioned.  I know for a fact information regarding Clive was sent to the family investigators so hopefully someone has tracked him down by now.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 30, 2008, 07:00:45 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=188.0
Topic: Murder and Crime Rate In Aruba  (Read 76178 times)
There it is....the thread is huge  ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 07:15:07 PM
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    * Drew Peterson (husband of missing Stacy Ann Peterson) and his
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    * Robin Sax, LA County District Attorney, will join us to analyze the
discussion immediately afterwards.

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Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 30, 2008, 07:39:28 PM
I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?


STom:
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 4:13 pm Post subject:

Most likely since years back, private and public tourism authorities and law enforcement officials had an underlying agreement not to report crimes against tourists because they were detrimental to their image of pure, safe and uncorrupted island paradise. This unwritten law was easy to implement because incidents were so infrequent, that they could report them as missing persons. From 1996 through 2002, they had three disappearances reported. Not bad. An average of one disappearance every 24 months.

When Natalee’s incident occurred, Joran told Paulus about the “accident” and Paulus immediately thought of the island team in charge of “missing” people cases. Paulus had worked a few years back for the prosecutors office, as Antonio Carlo’s subordinate and had learned how Arubian authorities initiated these patriotic techniques, to preserve both, the island's economic sovereignty and the aspirational image of its criminals, which are portrayed as selective for going after illegal immigrants and locals only, not tourists.

Paulus was not totally frank about the incident. He just called his compadre Edwin -Papito- Commemencia and reported the case. Papito called the “missing” squad and they got rid of Natalee. They assumed this was just going to be one more case where Police authorities give the family of the victim the runaround; they give up and go home to light candles. They weren’t counting on Beth’s obsessive, unrelentless, persistent, annoying character.

The media started coming to Aruba and the news began spreading. What to do … that was the big question. The police, ATA and AHATA met. They agreed that they were going to show the family and the US that they care and are willing to do everything to find their missing daughter. “ Hey”, they said, “Maybe this will be good for us. All these cameras will put our island in the forefront”. The craziness begins and Arubian arrivistes show their faces in front of the spotlight.

When one week later the authorities figured out that the threesome was responsible for the crime and they envisioned the consequences of having an international coverage of the case and the investigation, it’s already too late. They can’t go back and undo what they have done, because the “missing” scheme would be revealed and that would mean the definite end of existence of the thriving Arubian tourism industry. Since then on, the madness and the lies have not stopped.

As Dompig stated in the Vanity Fair interview, they thought they were dealing with a normal family. By that he meant families like those of Richard Henríquez, Gary Makings and Willard Larson, all missing in Aruba never to be found.

Igsigs:
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:02 pm Post subject:

STom

Edwin Commemencia

That is a name that is rarely brought up in this case. What do you know about him

STom
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:10 pm Post subject:

igsigs

At the beginning of the investigation Papito Comemencia was very active as police spokesperson. I understand he is the officer that Joran considers his Godfather and uncle, not van der Straaten. He is -or at least was- very close to the van der Sloots.

Dompig was in charge of the interrogations back then. If you recall, he is the one that got the “confession” out of Joran on the 10th or 11th of June 2005, but it could not be admitted because the time duration of the interrogation exceeded the limit allowed for a minor.

A few weeks into the case, both Comemencia and Dompig sort of vanished and all focus turn to Jan van der Straaten. Most likely this was an Arubian strategy to point the finger at the Dutch, and steer the blame away from them.

Some of Comemencia’s key moments include reporting the different and dive searches, reporting beforehand that Paulus would request the court to allow permission to see Joran in jail, informing that nothing was found on the van der Sloot’s property search, telling Beth that blood had been found on the Kalpoe’s car, insinuating that more people were involved and in general, creating confusion and false expectations.

He is supposed to be Papi the Butterfly, the person that Simian/Merian Webster supposedly stated could unravel this whole mess. This is what I recall reading, but I guess an SM T&S lover could confirm this or not.

More by STom:

Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:31 am Post subject:

Rocky:

Comemencia could have bvery well alerted ahead of time about searches, but I don't know if he did or not. What matters is that he is the one that has the personal relationship with the van der Sloots and not van der Straaten, he is the one that Joran considers his uncle and Godfather, he is the one that was very present until they passed the ball to the Chief of Police, and he is the one that distorted information to confuse the public opinion as far as the investigation was concerned.

One example is telling Beth about blood in the Kalpoe’s car. Most likely he did it to handle Beth, in order to shift her vision of primary responsibility from Joran to the brothers. Just guessing, though.

Also, Comemencia often stated or implied that the FBI was involved in the investigative process, when that was not the case.

Quote:
Police and FBI agents searched for Holloway for a ninth day today, but a lack of any solid leads was hindering progress, they said. The FBI was asked to bring in dogs trained to search for people, police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said.

Quote:
Two divers among the eight FBI agents in Aruba have been searching the waters surrounding the island, police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said.

I believe Comemencia's comments about FBI’s participation was part of a predefined strategy to imply that the FBI was involved, so ALE probably used the FBI initially to fit its purposes.




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: mrskub on July 30, 2008, 07:41:36 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts… ::MonkeyWink::

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...



The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.



Caps, are you alluding to the fact that there may be more than 1 body in a burial container or that bodies were switched?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 30, 2008, 07:46:15 PM


I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....

As far as I know he was not questioned.  I know for a fact information regarding Clive was sent to the family investigators so hopefully someone has tracked him down by now.

Thanks Klaasend...sure wish they would let us in on some of their "little" secrets....it would be interesting to read what he had to say....thanks again....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 07:46:36 PM
Let me try this one more time....

Antonio Carlo is Joran's real godfather.  He was called to help with the body of Natalee Holloway the night Joran said she died by a drug overdose or accident.

Deutekom is the one and only original Dirty Hand. He was pulling all the strings behind the scenes according to Shango...who most likley was posting from Florida.

Ben King was one of those that also helped Carlo and Paulus with the body that night. We already know he was at the Sloots and most likely helped to prevent any evidence from being found.

Now, I have more questions....sorry...I thought Caps said Deutekom was in another car that night.  I think I have that point confused...oh well. 

van der Straten is not involved at all. He is not Dirty Hand as Babalu had guessed.  He is not the godfather of Joran as Geraldo claimed.  Maybe I have that confused too.  We heard that from somewhere. Oh well.

Papi the Butterfly Comemcia is not involved and is not the godfather either.  Oh well...back to the bat cave for me.  I need further research.

I hope Caps will tell me which of these statements I have messed up this time. Can anyone see me rolling my eyes?  I am so confused...again.  :roll:


Does this mean that Antonio Carlo...the lawyer is the REAL Daury?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: LoRain on July 30, 2008, 07:47:03 PM


Is the one pic that's posted here the only one that was ever found of him?...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 30, 2008, 07:48:00 PM
Rob

Thanks for the STom's posts.....some of my favorites.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 30, 2008, 07:54:58 PM


The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 30, 2008, 08:02:46 PM
Rob

Thanks for the STom's posts.....some of my favorites.

Buckeye, when you logically look back at it all - isn't that what most likely happened? It makes all the sense in the world. Annnnndd, from everything that we have learned since Stom's post, it seems to confirm it even more.

The ATA, ALE, and AHATA all had a motive - clearly! The motive was to keep the shine on the peel of the apple all the while knowing the apple was rotten to the core. They thought they were going to some how be heroes in all of this and still play their games, not solve the case and have American's throwing even more money at them.

Looks like their plan back fired...BIGTIME.

Confucius wish them 1000 years of misery.  ::MonkeyHaHa::



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 08:07:31 PM
Let me try this one more time....

Antonio Carlo is Joran's real godfather.  He was called to help with the body of Natalee Holloway the night Joran said she died by a drug overdose or accident.

Deutekom is the one and only original Dirty Hand. He was pulling all the strings behind the scenes according to Shango...who most likley was posting from Florida.

Ben King was one of those that also helped Carlo and Paulus with the body that night. We already know he was at the Sloots and most likely helped to prevent any evidence from being found.

Now, I have more questions....sorry...I thought Caps said Deutekom was in another car that night.  I think I have that point confused...oh well. 

van der Straten is not involved at all. He is not Dirty Hand as Babalu had guessed.  He is not the godfather of Joran as Geraldo claimed.  Maybe I have that confused too.  We heard that from somewhere. Oh well.

Papi the Butterfly Comemcia is not involved and is not the godfather either.  Oh well...back to the bat cave for me.  I need further research.

I hope Caps will tell me which of these statements I have messed up this time. Can anyone see me rolling my eyes?  I am so confused...again.  :roll:


Does this mean that Antonio Carlo...the lawyer is the REAL Daury?



« Reply #1664 on: February 03, 2008, 07:58:40 PM »Stom   
 
Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:09 pm
 You can’t remember answering a phone call at 2:00 in the morning? When the next day your son was picked up?

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:10 pm
 Father is a suspect of the disappearance.

Daury is Paulus's codename.  He must have disposed of the body.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1952.msg339056#msg339056




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 08:15:44 PM
Let me try this one more time....

Antonio Carlo is Joran's real godfather.  He was called to help with the body of Natalee Holloway the night Joran said she died by a drug overdose or accident.

Deutekom is the one and only original Dirty Hand. He was pulling all the strings behind the scenes according to Shango...who most likley was posting from Florida.

Ben King was one of those that also helped Carlo and Paulus with the body that night. We already know he was at the Sloots and most likely helped to prevent any evidence from being found.

Now, I have more questions....sorry...I thought Caps said Deutekom was in another car that night.  I think I have that point confused...oh well. 

van der Straten is not involved at all. He is not Dirty Hand as Babalu had guessed.  He is not the godfather of Joran as Geraldo claimed.  Maybe I have that confused too.  We heard that from somewhere. Oh well.

Papi the Butterfly Comemcia is not involved and is not the godfather either.  Oh well...back to the bat cave for me.  I need further research.

I hope Caps will tell me which of these statements I have messed up this time. Can anyone see me rolling my eyes?  I am so confused...again.  :roll:


Does this mean that Antonio Carlo...the lawyer is the REAL Daury?



« Reply #1664 on: February 03, 2008, 07:58:40 PM »Stom   
 
Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:09 pm
 You can’t remember answering a phone call at 2:00 in the morning? When the next day your son was picked up?

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 3:10 pm
 Father is a suspect of the disappearance.

Daury is Paulus's codename.  He must have disposed of the body.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1952.msg339056#msg339056




I agree


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 30, 2008, 08:20:26 PM
in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts… ::MonkeyWink::

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...



The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.



Caps, are you alluding to the fact that there may be more than 1 body in a burial container or that bodies were switched?


The question to asked is what is the function of The Sumerians

“The Sumerians looked after the dead. Funerary rituals were of great significance because they believed if the dead were not buried properly their souls will return and haunt the living relatives,”

So in the case of Natalee there was a "Game in the house" but the meaning is not a game but a Funeral that needed to be burried by the Sumerians. The Sumerians did not like the Idea present by Paules v der Sloot and associates. but went along with it in the end.

I went to a funeral and I was amazed how the the children play in the grave yard. but I had to look at it in a more serious way to see the Whole Maze and I can say for sure it is a maze.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 30, 2008, 08:24:55 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


According to the Video he Lives at the premises of the Vander Sloot. Even though there is an address for him register, but with the video and with someone info on him, in 2005 he was living at the sloots home. not visiting.

You see the person that helped Joran that nigth is his Padrino. "The God Father"




Hmmm!...I will need to do some research on the archives. IIRC, the van der Sloots went to stay with the Vockings for a while. Also thought I read that van der Straten was Joran's Godfather. I may be mistaken on this and will post what I can find.

If anyone can remember, please post as I am not sure I will get to it today...

Thanks Caps.

This code was violated by Wit as seen by his presence at the van der Sloot home prior to the searchers arriving. Both Ben (Voc)King and Paulus van der Sloot are members of the legal profession.

1.3 A judge shall avoid close personal association with individual members of the legal profession, particularly those who practice in the judge’s court, where such association might reasonably give rise to the suspicion or appearance of favoritism or partiality.

Justice Wit used not his home, but that of a suspect in a criminal investigation as a meeting place for himself, said suspect, and a prosecution official.

1.4 A judge shall avoid the use of the judge’s residence by a member of the legal profession to receive clients or other members of the legal profession in circumstances that might reasonably give rise to the suspicion or appearance of impropriety on the part of the judge.

Was there any official reason given, in writing, for Wit’s verbal order at the van der Sloot home for curbing the areas of the search? Or did he merely do this to help his friend Paulus?

1.9 A judge shall not allow the judge’s family, social or other relationships improperly to influence the judge’s judicial conduct and judgment as a judge.

Was the mere presence of Justice Wit at the van der Sloot property enough to dissuade Karin Janssen from arguing the merits of her search warrant granted by the Joint Court? Did Wit use the prestige of his office to intimidate the searchers?

1.10 A judge shall not use or lend the prestige of the judicial office to advance the private interests of the judge, a member of the judge’s family or of anyone else, nor shall a judge permit others to convey the impression that anyone is in a special position improperly to influence the judge in the performance of judicial duties.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 30, 2008, 08:28:56 PM
CAPS, are you saying his real father, or a Godfather or a Grandfather?

it is his godfather and Ben king

His godfather is Antonio Carlo who he called. to take care of the problem...who came to help.



Let me get this straight...you are now saying that Joran's godfather that he called the night in question to help him was none other than Antonio Carlo.  Paulus's business partner and attorney?? Is that what you are saying?   Joran's real godfather is Antonio Carlo the lawyer? 



NEWSWEEK: When did you first become involved in the Natalee Holloway case?
Peter de Vries: We started receiving a lot of e-mails from all over about the case. At one point we decided to go to Aruba and have a look. We spoke with lots of people, including former law enforcement, and we were able to find out quite a lot. We found out that Joran had lied about a couple of things. We heard that there was a secret meeting between Joran's lawyer, Antonio Carlo, and the prosecutor, Karin Janseen, where the lawyer says he wants to clear his own conscience and that Joran is very much involved, that he played a major part in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway—but that Carlo is leaving it to the police to find the evidence. [Another van der Sloot attorney has denied that this happened.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 08:34:03 PM


IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA

Klaas or Blonde, could you remove my first post?  I messed up and included my info within the quote box.  Thank you!

IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 08:34:50 PM


The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA


Thanks Texasmom…I knew exactly whom Caps was referring to.

It is his friend Ben Vonking that I am still confused over.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 08:37:00 PM
Pita - deleted it  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 30, 2008, 08:40:21 PM
Somewhere here we have a list of the dead after Natalee went missing...not sure where to locate that, will look.

Yes I thought Carpe posted a picture od a girl in the Feelings thread


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 08:40:46 PM
Did everyone go on vacation and not tell me?  Where the heck are you guys?  Don't leave me in here alone.  ::MonkeyShocked::

I'm here but I've been hanging out over at the Caylee Anthony thread.  I haven't forgotten about Natalee though.  If Caylee is where I'm affraid she is, I'm hoping Natalee is keeping an eye on her. 

I fear you are right. 


According to the Video he Lives at the premises of the Vander Sloot. Even though there is an address for him register, but with the video and with someone info on him, in 2005 he was living at the sloots home. not visiting.

You see the person that helped Joran that nigth is his Padrino. "The God Father"




Hmmm!...I will need to do some research on the archives. IIRC, the van der Sloots went to stay with the Vockings for a while. Also thought I read that van der Straten was Joran's Godfather. I may be mistaken on this and will post what I can find.

If anyone can remember, please post as I am not sure I will get to it today...

Thanks Caps.

This code was violated by Wit as seen by his presence at the van der Sloot home prior to the searchers arriving. Both Ben (Voc)King and Paulus van der Sloot are members of the legal profession.

1.3 A judge shall avoid close personal association with individual members of the legal profession, particularly those who practice in the judge’s court, where such association might reasonably give rise to the suspicion or appearance of favoritism or partiality.

Justice Wit used not his home, but that of a suspect in a criminal investigation as a meeting place for himself, said suspect, and a prosecution official.

1.4 A judge shall avoid the use of the judge’s residence by a member of the legal profession to receive clients or other members of the legal profession in circumstances that might reasonably give rise to the suspicion or appearance of impropriety on the part of the judge.

Was there any official reason given, in writing, for Wit’s verbal order at the van der Sloot home for curbing the areas of the search? Or did he merely do this to help his friend Paulus?

1.9 A judge shall not allow the judge’s family, social or other relationships improperly to influence the judge’s judicial conduct and judgment as a judge.

Was the mere presence of Justice Wit at the van der Sloot property enough to dissuade Karin Janssen from arguing the merits of her search warrant granted by the Joint Court? Did Wit use the prestige of his office to intimidate the searchers?

1.10 A judge shall not use or lend the prestige of the judicial office to advance the private interests of the judge, a member of the judge’s family or of anyone else, nor shall a judge permit others to convey the impression that anyone is in a special position improperly to influence the judge in the performance of judicial duties.


Thanks Blonde...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on July 30, 2008, 08:41:04 PM
Just thinking out loud here......likely the night that Natalee was allegedly found and the family was told they had found Natalee's body what actually happened is Natalee was found. Before her body could be handed over to her family someone made the executive decision that for her to remain missing would be what was in the best interest of those last seen with her, and for Aruba. Thus began the plan to hide the truth at all costs. Then the story of having found Natalee's body was recanted. And despite what commonsense tells us the truth to be.......that Natalee's body was found,  so deeply wishing it to be an error, we believed it was a miss communication? Now who was it in ALE that initially released that info and then recanted it....have to go look.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 30, 2008, 08:41:32 PM


IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA

Klaas or Blonde, could you remove my first post?  I messed up and included my info within the quote box.  Thank you!

IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

I remember looking at the pictures on someone's website...was it Hotshot's? Someone was there on the island when it happened and took pictures and posted them.  I have too many links....to everything you can imagine....can't locate the pics right now.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 08:43:54 PM
Yes, it was Hotshot's but they're no longer there.    :smt102


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 08:45:47 PM
From FP:

98.    More

Defiling of 4 Oduber and 1 Wever crypt.
It has to be a message. Ties them together

Comment by allan,k / July 25, 2006 10:51pm


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 30, 2008, 08:48:42 PM
Yes, it was Hotshot's but they're no longer there.    :smt102
Thanks Pita!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 08:52:36 PM
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Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 08:59:03 PM
Yes, it was Hotshot's but they're no longer there.    :smt102
Thanks Pita!  ::MonkeyCool::

Here are some of the photos from Hotshots site:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/gummy_2006/odubergravescollage.jpg

Link to Hotshots new site - direct link to her trip to Aruba and what she found January 2006:

http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/TriptoAruba.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on July 30, 2008, 08:59:33 PM
This is the first post, I think from Caps...Klaas copied it from the FP.

Reply #721 on: December 21, 2007, 05:07:08 PM » 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote from: klaasend on December 21, 2007, 04:52:52 PM
Posted on the front page of SM (this person appears to be posting from Aruba):

CapslockWizard wrote:

I do think that we all got it wrong..

If the Investigators cannot find Nathalie is because they are searching and looking in the wrong places.
If you ask yourself this question: “Where would I hide a body so that nobody will find it?”
The answers are a lot of places can be used, but for a logic thinker there is only one answer.
And form all the articles that I have read, nobody have suggested and even mention this place.
Lets test the Logic:
In Aruba in when someone dies, they can be put to rest in two forms.
1. In the grounds
2. In a Kelder with 4 or 6 rooms constructed out of brick and mortar above ground in public eye site in the cemetary. These Kelders belong to a Family and they buy these plots form the church in the cemetery and build the Kelders on it and leave it open for when the moment arrived you have a place to rest.
Both types of method funerals will take place only in a CEMETARY.
There are a lot of CEMETARY in Aruba and most of them have KELDERS and a lot are left OPEN for when he or she dies will be buried close in the Family plot.
My logic:
The reason that no one can find her is that she must be among all the dead in the cemetery and who is going to search a cemetery for a body where there is already a lot of body in the place.
Logic test: You will never find an open grave in the ground because when someone dies in Aruba and need to be buried in the ground, the Funeral home in charge of the body will give orders to dig a grave for this person in a district in accordance with the family wishes.
To dig a grave 6 feet deep and wide enough for a body will take a lot of time by hand. Beside the ground will look disturb by the cemetery keeper. So I believe that these 4 perps would not have the time to dig a grave.
But
If you have a dead body on your hand and you need to hide it fast, the only way is to put it in an open Kelder and with only five to 6 bricks and and a bucket of cement and you are done. And if you want to make it look professional, can even give it a coat of paint color white which is the mostly use.
This last process is very easy done with 3 or 4 person.
a. Move dead body to a cemetery,
b. Cemetry door closed, then jump the fence with the body.
c. Inside the cemetery fined an open Kelder or break one open.
d. Put body in it
e. Go and get 6 pieces of bricks or use bricks that are in the cemetery already.
f. Make cement in a bucket
g. Use the bricks to close the small walls of the Kelder.
h. Paint the wall
And you are done.
Now nobody can’t find her because we are looking outside the box, we have been looking too much outside the realm of logic. The Logic is, nobody is going to look in a cemetery and if you are going to search a cemetery, it will be difficult to search without disturbing the graves. And another drawback is that you need permission of the families to open all the Kelders.
And this is my theory on this case and my logic thinking.

CapslockWizard

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2463.720



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 30, 2008, 09:00:33 PM
Yes, it was Hotshot's but they're no longer there.    :smt102
Thanks Pita!  ::MonkeyCool::

Here are some of the photos from Hotshots site:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/gummy_2006/odubergravescollage.jpg

Link to Hotshots new site - direct link to her trip to Aruba and what she found January 2006:

http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/TriptoAruba.html

Thank you, Klaas!    ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 30, 2008, 09:00:57 PM
Yes, it was Hotshot's but they're no longer there.    :smt102
Thanks Pita!  ::MonkeyCool::

Here are some of the photos from Hotshots site:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/gummy_2006/odubergravescollage.jpg

Link to Hotshots new site - direct link to her trip to Aruba and what she found January 2006:

http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/TriptoAruba.html
Thanks Klaas! ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: crazybabyborg on July 30, 2008, 09:09:53 PM
Klaas? If we want to comment about the show, where would that be appropriate?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 30, 2008, 09:23:03 PM
Wait just a minute!  I think I understand.  The person that helped Joran is known by the term "Godfather".  That is not saying he is really Joran's godfather?  Do I have that right?  Oh, Please Caps tell me that is what you meant.  I am so confused right now my eyes are about to pop out of my head.

It is his real godfather.

When you are born, baptise, the famaly will select a godfather when baptised. Then and First Comunion again they will select a godfather. This is called also the trusted godfather some one that will be with you for ever, someone that will help you when needed.

Sorry but I'm a few pages behind in my reading tonight.  When I read CAPS post about the GODFATHER I was reminded of the codetalkers mention of 'cafone' (or as they say in NYC GAVONE).  A Cafone is a snitch in the 'Italian mob where the 'GODFATHER' is the head of the clan.

Now I get it CAPS!!! All this talk and assumptions about the 'mob' was not really about them but about Joran's real GODFATHER - the GODFATHER present at his baptism! And if King (the ARAWAK KING) was staying at the Sloot home during that time, then it makes sense when Kalpoe said to Joran "...your own father...".   

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:24 pm
The boy is no Ajax. He is too afraid of the consequences. He doesn’t want to be made a cafone. The third act needs to be played and the cowboys will be heroes. This is all a “lugubrious game” to them. They were all at the party and all of them are turning their heads. One of them needs to be pinched.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on July 30, 2008, 09:27:20 PM
Caps
Are you talking about the you tube videos that have been in circulation on the internet for a while now or is this something completely different?  I have seen several that were sent to me before that had these same things in them.  I am wondering if this is a new set or the same ones as before? TIA

BTW glad you are doing well in the bat cave.  ::MonkeyWink::
[/quote

You see, these videos are the real thing before what has been cut to show the world. Things that de Vries never shared to the world. these DVD are 2 hrs lonf and contain the whole process of the undercover operation, what joran said and where he show Hans Mos he eveidance and where Hans MOS aware of this conffesion.

Joran sate that he met natalee that night, he know the girl for about 3 hours and that she died on her and where he has caled his friend to despose of it. It is all in Dutch.

How did I got my hand on....don't ask...

But I have some question but it also let me have a clear inside who the Arawak is.  The Lawyer Carlo and Ben King.

Ben King work for the Chief Prosecuter and Live with Paules Van der Sloot. Mantana 19, that is why I can not find an adress for him in any registry.

I will see if I can load them up...but will check...these are the videos where the things were cut out that no one have seem

The on on you tube is just an extract and not the video it self.

The on called "Het Geheim van Aruba" is 2 hours long very good work. Tranlation "The Secret of Aruba"

This movie I have not see on the Internet. Will have to put my streaming server on

and the one from where Joran confess that Pater show was just a bit and not the whole thing.

CAPS.






Caps,

If you can stream them, I can get them captured.


Or if you find a way to compress them, and get them where I can

download them... that'll work too!

Just say when and where. Thank you!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 30, 2008, 09:32:40 PM
When Caps gets his videos on here who is going to translate them?  Maybe Johan? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 09:42:54 PM
O/T

DANA PRETZER is going to have Cindy Anthony on the show before it's over tonight.  LIVE

http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/radio.m3u


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 09:43:44 PM
When Caps gets his videos on here who is going to translate them?  Maybe Johan? 

Johan can only translate if they are in Dutch.  If they are in papiamentu then Caps will have to translate


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 30, 2008, 10:23:28 PM
When Caps gets his videos on here who is going to translate them?  Maybe Johan? 

Johan can only translate if they are in Dutch.  If they are in papiamentu then Caps will have to translate
from Caps post about at least one of the videos
Quote
snip:  It is all in Dutch.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 30, 2008, 10:25:32 PM
When Caps gets his videos on here who is going to translate them?  Maybe Johan? 

Johan can only translate if they are in Dutch.  If they are in papiamentu then Caps will have to translate
from Caps post about at least one of the videos
Quote
snip:  It is all in Dutch.


Cool, then hopefully Johan or Caesu or one of our Dutch posters can translate for us.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Hotshot on July 30, 2008, 11:03:04 PM


IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA

Klaas or Blonde, could you remove my first post?  I messed up and included my info within the quote box.  Thank you!

IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

I can answer that.  It was when I was on the plane to Aruba....... Jan 12th 2006       Sorry if someone already posted this, I havent read foward yet.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 12:05:23 AM


IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA

Klaas or Blonde, could you remove my first post?  I messed up and included my info within the quote box.  Thank you!

IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

I can answer that.  It was when I was on the plane to Aruba....... Jan 12th 2006       Sorry if someone already posted this, I havent read foward yet.

now here we have a a true doppleganger. What coincidance. on the same week we have a look a like.

lets examine her datas

Profet, born. Wever Jalitza M
DOB=3/21/1962
Location=Aruba
Address=   Hooiberg Kavel 2D   
Town=Santa Cruz

If she is dead, she must be burried in Santa Cruz. and not Oranjestad

Which plot, thats eazy.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 31, 2008, 12:13:40 AM
Funeral Oranjestad but could be buried elsewhere?


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/WeverJune.jpg)

http://www.mementomori.net/05137.html


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 12:36:35 AM
Funeral Oranjestad but could be buried elsewhere?


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/WeverJune.jpg)

http://www.mementomori.net/05137.html


Well this is odd, no famaly mention but she was born Wever but married to a Profet. That means where is the Relatives names, bother and sisters etc.

This does not Compute.

Well if this lady is dead I can get the plot number. will check. but someting is odd. No Mother and father.

let me check her roots




Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 12:40:39 AM
Funeral Oranjestad but could be buried elsewhere?


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub4/WeverJune.jpg)

http://www.mementomori.net/05137.html


Well this is odd, no famaly mention but she was born Wever but married to a Profet. That means where is the Relatives names, bother and sisters etc.

This does not Compute.

Well if this lady is dead I can get the plot number. will check. but someting is odd. No Mother and father.

let me check her roots




Profet   Michel A                 11/10/1958   Curacao   Hooiberg Kavel 2D
Profet, geb. Wever   Jalitza M      3/21/1962   Aruba   Hooiberg Kavel 2D

Michel Profet ??? hmmm


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 31, 2008, 12:55:22 AM
http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/backissues/newsletter59.html

ARUBAN TOUR OPERATORS RECEIVE TOP HONORS FROM PRINCESS CRUISES

The magnificent Dawn Princess cruise ship awarded two of Aruba’s finest Tour Operators top honors in a ceremony held on board. Both operators received the greatest amount of customer compliments during the busy high-season of 2001/2002. Aruba’s De Palm Tours was recognized for “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “4-Wheel Drive Safari, ” and Peclican Watersports Adventures earned “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “Catamaran Snorkel & Beach Cruise.” On hand to receive the awards Ezmeralda Schotman, Ivan Gordijk and Loinel Henriquez for De Palm Tours, Michel Profet, Carlos Ramos and Augusto Montbrun for Pelican Watersports Adventures.

http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/images/p_princesscruises.jpg


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 01:00:35 AM
http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/backissues/newsletter59.html

ARUBAN TOUR OPERATORS RECEIVE TOP HONORS FROM PRINCESS CRUISES

The magnificent Dawn Princess cruise ship awarded two of Aruba’s finest Tour Operators top honors in a ceremony held on board. Both operators received the greatest amount of customer compliments during the busy high-season of 2001/2002. Aruba’s De Palm Tours was recognized for “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “4-Wheel Drive Safari, ” and Peclican Watersports Adventures earned “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “Catamaran Snorkel & Beach Cruise.” On hand to receive the awards Ezmeralda Schotman, Ivan Gordijk and Loinel Henriquez for De Palm Tours, Michel Profet, Carlos Ramos and Augusto Montbrun for Pelican Watersports Adventures.

http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/images/p_princesscruises.jpg

Now this will top it all

Look in what news paper and search for Michel Profet

http://www.voiceofalabama.com/am21jun05-1.pdf


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 01:16:54 AM
http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/backissues/newsletter59.html

ARUBAN TOUR OPERATORS RECEIVE TOP HONORS FROM PRINCESS CRUISES

The magnificent Dawn Princess cruise ship awarded two of Aruba’s finest Tour Operators top honors in a ceremony held on board. Both operators received the greatest amount of customer compliments during the busy high-season of 2001/2002. Aruba’s De Palm Tours was recognized for “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “4-Wheel Drive Safari, ” and Peclican Watersports Adventures earned “Shore Excursion of the Season” in the class of “Catamaran Snorkel & Beach Cruise.” On hand to receive the awards Ezmeralda Schotman, Ivan Gordijk and Loinel Henriquez for De Palm Tours, Michel Profet, Carlos Ramos and Augusto Montbrun for Pelican Watersports Adventures.

http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/images/p_princesscruises.jpg

Now this will top it all

Look in what news paper and search for Michel Profet

http://www.voiceofalabama.com/am21jun05-1.pdf


The first time I saw this name Carlos Ramos was in 2004 case of illegal permit. then in 2005 there is the name again in a case similair but this time it is related to the money that went from Excelcior Casino to Hong Kong. Till today it was never mention of beeing solved.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 31, 2008, 01:26:39 AM
Caps - yes, I saw that too.

Also, Carlos Ramos...we have been told there are at least 2 with the same name.  Carlos the condom witness and Carlos the gardner witness.  So now we have a Carlos Ramos with Pelican Water Sports? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 31, 2008, 01:28:20 AM
http://www.extrabon.com/edishon/edishon2003/extra2003-09-30.pdf

Page 2

Señor ta mi salbashon di ken lo mi tin miedu!
A muri kristianamente
Sra.vda. Petronilia
Andrea Janga - Vlijt
nasé 4-2-1922 +27-9-2003
Na nòmber di
su yunan: Dianne i Nel Fernandes
Ina Profet
Alfred i Corry Profet
Marjorie Profet
Carlos i Millie Profet
Michael i Jalitza Profet
Alvin i Suzette Profet
Maricela i Omar Lesire
Marcelo Profet
su nietunan: Puccio, Ivo, Rosi,Ramses, Jean Paul, Thaïs,
Maikito, Talia, Ixchelle, Xena, Ty, Seth, Carlito, Sciandri i Sid.
Bisanietu: Kyle Jose, Ivo, Ruben i Vincent Wijnheijmer, Lilian
Heidweiler, Claudia i Erika Fernandes.
Demas famia: Profet, Fernandes, Jansen, Wever, Goilo,
Romero, Antonette, Pellicer i Boulet.
Na nòmber di Juja i Julisa Swartjes, Sùr Crispina, Roosje i
Freddy Velasques i yunan, Doey Vlijt i famia.
Su tanta: Maria Trappenbergh i Beby Sellie
Su primunan: Clive Marchena, Evy Booi i rumannan, Tecla
Piar i famia, Selma Paulette i famia, Silvio Paulette, Laura
Kroon i yunan na Hulanda, Paulina Vlijt i yunan na Hulanda i
Kòrsou, Agrepina Cicilia i rumannan, Selsio Martijn i
rumannan, Cornelia Janga i famia, Leonie Cicilia i famia.
Demas famia: Vlijt, Janga, Profet, Swartjes, Koeks, Booi,
Marchena, Cecilia, Martijn Paulette, Sellie, Hart, van
Arneman, Velasques i Sesline Winklaar.
Ihanan, komader- i kompadernan, konosínan na Boneiru,
Aruba i Kòrsou.
Akto di entiero ta tuma lugá djarason 1 òktober. Pa 13.30
ta risibí bishita di kondolensia na misa San Luis Bertran na
Rincon. Pa 4’or tin un santu sakrifisio despues pa santana
katóliko.
Despues no ta risibí bishita di kondolensia


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 31, 2008, 02:18:27 AM
Has anyone heard from Destiny?  I'm getting worried....it's been days.  Did I miss something?  I hope everything is o.k.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 31, 2008, 02:47:04 AM


IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.


(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/fdggfdgd56.png)

With deep sympathy we announce the death of:

Jalitza Marie Wever

21 Mar 1962 - 02 Jun 2005.

Funeral took place: 06 Jun 2005, Oranjestad, ARUBA

Klaas or Blonde, could you remove my first post?  I messed up and included my info within the quote box.  Thank you!

IIRC, Wever and Obuber crypts were broken into.  Anybody know when this happened?

I can answer that.  It was when I was on the plane to Aruba....... Jan 12th 2006       Sorry if someone already posted this, I havent read foward yet.

now here we have a a true doppleganger. What coincidance. on the same week we have a look a like.

lets examine her datas

Profet, born. Wever Jalitza M
DOB=3/21/1962
Location=Aruba
Address=   Hooiberg Kavel 2D   
Town=Santa Cruz

If she is dead, she must be burried in Santa Cruz. and not Oranjestad

Which plot, thats eazy.



Yes she is dead :

Dear Johan,
We must inform you that we normally do not give information to third parties not directly have a relationship with concerned, we can pass on aleen notify that person is deceased. More information, we can not provide.
Sincerely,
Civil Status Office Aruba
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Beste Johan,
We moeten u mededelen dat wij normal geen informatie geven aan derden die niet direkt een relatie hebben met betrokkene, we kunnen u aleen op de hoogte stellen dat betrokkene is overleden. Meer informatie kunnen wij niet verstrekken.
Met vriendelijke groeten,
Bureau Burgerlijke Stand Aruba


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 31, 2008, 06:59:29 AM
(http://bestsmileys.com/frustrated/7.gif)   (http://deephousepage.com/smilies/deadhorse.gif)

not the exact graphic I was looking for, but same idea...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 31, 2008, 09:16:31 AM
I put almost nothing into dreams...but I had one way way back in the beginning of the case, and posted about it. This dream was extremely vivid and I still remember all of the details. Remarkable that everything was in rich color.

It involved an above ground cemetery on Aruba and a maze-like pathways of tombs.

These were all white and Natalee was buried in one of the crypts. The crypt next to her says "Johanson" or "Johansen". I have not seen this name regularly associate with Aruba and it seems possibly Swedish to me and not Dutch.

The crypt itself is located near the entrance of the cemetery and is with in 75 feet of the entrance. I remember that the crypt that Natalee is in is not the top crypt, but the middle crypt, with one crypt below. She is in the center crypt in a stack of three.

The entrance to the cemetery has rather high white walls and a rather wide entrance way. I would estimate that the entrance is about 7-8 feet wide. The entry path leads almost directly to the crypt Natalee is in. You do not need to venture all around the cemetery to find this crypt.

As I said, I put nothing into this.... but who knows. I think just about everyone here has has some type of dream related to this case.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on July 31, 2008, 09:27:48 AM
 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Bureau Burgerlijke Stand Aruba =


Bureau (http://www.2beachbums.com/images/nov99/hamburger_stand.jpg) Aruba


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: can on July 31, 2008, 09:36:20 AM
IF a crypt was used:
it would have to be one that belongs to the owner, with owner's knowledge
or
IF a stolen crypt, it would have to have a space available and known to be an old crypt of an old family with no surviving ancestors - or a family that no longer lives on the island - or ?????
in other words
not a crypt that is likely to be re-opened for a future death.

Can you imagine preparing to place a loved one in a crypt and finding an additional unknown person resting there?!

Just thinking out loud not sure if I'm making any sense - any comments? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 31, 2008, 09:59:32 AM
I put almost nothing into dreams...but I had one way way back in the beginning of the case, and posted about it. This dream was extremely vivid and I still remember all of the details. Remarkable that everything was in rich color.

It involved an above ground cemetery on Aruba and a maze-like pathways of tombs.

These were all white and Natalee was buried in one of the crypts. The crypt next to her says "Johanson" or "Johansen". I have not seen this name regularly associate with Aruba and it seems possibly Swedish to me and not Dutch.

The crypt itself is located near the entrance of the cemetery and is with in 75 feet of the entrance. I remember that the crypt that Natalee is in is not the top crypt, but the middle crypt, with one crypt below. She is in the center crypt in a stack of three.

The entrance to the cemetery has rather high white walls and a rather wide entrance way. I would estimate that the entrance is about 7-8 feet wide. The entry path leads almost directly to the crypt Natalee is in. You do not need to venture all around the cemetery to find this crypt.

As I said, I put nothing into this.... but who knows. I think just about everyone here has has some type of dream related to this case.


I'll post a few of my old dreams (and other poster dreams I saved) on the FEELINGS thread.

One dream I had in November 2007 could easily have described the crypt stacking. Many "sensed" that wherever Natalee is, others are with her. Back in June '05 many "sensed " something wrong with her head and also "sensed" boats.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 31, 2008, 10:12:50 AM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: can on July 31, 2008, 10:20:23 AM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 
That does seem doubtful doesn't it?
Who does Paulus trust?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Rob on July 31, 2008, 10:36:31 AM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 

I say no also. Too risky in my opinion.

I do think if Natalee is found, Buddy, Gary and a few others might be found also. There is probably a bone yard somewhere.

I'm not sure Max will be found due to where David Stacey Sr was located when Max disappeared.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 10:43:31 AM
Yesterday, CAPS said HM was watching us, who is that??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 10:44:34 AM
I sent Destiny an email yesterday - she did not respond.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 10:52:46 AM
My Mother in Law and Father in Law are buried together here.  His casket is on the bottom, then a layer of concrete, then her coffin.  Do you think they could have done it that way??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on July 31, 2008, 10:56:02 AM
My Mother in Law and Father in Law are buried together here.  His casket is on the bottom, then a layer of concrete, then her coffin.  Do you think they could have done it that way??
Good morning Monkey's
I think they could have put Natalee's body in a crypt with another body....easily.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 31, 2008, 11:18:03 AM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 

I recall hearing that Paulus was on some hospital board/committee. Not sure where I got that info -can't back it up but just heard it. If he was on this 'board', can he get access to hospital records - like if the doppleganger was sick in the hosp prior to her death?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on July 31, 2008, 11:20:52 AM
My Mother in Law and Father in Law are buried together here.  His casket is on the bottom, then a layer of concrete, then her coffin.  Do you think they could have done it that way??
Good morning Monkey's
I think they could have put Natalee's body in a crypt with another body....easily.

That would explain the crypt destruction - antsy drug dealers letting 'someone' know how badkly they want the case to be solved so there wouldn't be so much focus on the island...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 31, 2008, 11:28:38 AM
But....knowing how very important the outcome of NOT finding that body would be to your entire family....would you risk putting it in a crypt where people from all over the world can just walk up and leave flowers and pay their respects?  Would you really risk that knowing that as long as you are the only person that knows where that body is no one else can get to it?  Would Paulus allow that chance to be taken on Joran's behalf?  Would you?

Dead men tell no tales and neither does a body that can't be found.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on July 31, 2008, 11:39:33 AM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 

I recall hearing that Paulus was on some hospital board/committee. Not sure where I got that info -can't back it up but just heard it. If he was on this 'board', can he get access to hospital records - like if the doppleganger was sick in the hosp prior to her death?

From the FP of SM.....

Natalee Holloway: Comments Form Jossy Mansur Regarding New Developments in Aruba and Joran Van der Sloot
February 9, 2008


The following are comments that I received today from Jossy Mansur, Managing Editor of Diario. It would seem that Aruba has grown sick and tired of Joran Van der Sloot and his actions. Although they are late to the game, they now do not believe Joran Van der Sloot’s story or his excuses. Joran is no longer welcome in Aruba. It’s about time that Aruba stopped running cover for Joran. Then there is the following confirmation regarding a man who claims he found a telephone behind the lighthouse in 2005. The walls are caving in around Joran Van der Sloot and his family.

Everything is happening in Holland. The Dutch government is now interested in the case and plans to do something about it, we were informed from Holland. Joran was interrogated for more than two hours by the dutch national police and three policemen from Aruba. We still have to hear what came out of that.
 
The Minister of Justice declared Joran ‘persona non grata’ (unwelcome) in Aruba. He also said he is kicking Paulus off every government committee in which he has a seat (hospital, prison, etc.). Late, but proof of the change of attitude noticeable everywhere on the island. Most people here are convinced Joran is responsible for Natalee’s death.

con't....

http://scaredmonkeys.com/category/jossy-mansur/



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:51:48 AM
Always 1  I took Caps reference to HM watching as Hans Mos....not sure I was correct, however.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on July 31, 2008, 12:24:02 PM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 

No...I have never gone along with that theory. I had thought at one time possibly the pet cemetery...but naaaaa, doubtful too.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 02:42:19 PM
Hello CAPS, I was wondering, if I were on Aruba, which end of it should I search for the crypts maze???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 03:02:01 PM
CAPS - just reading???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 03:48:20 PM
Hello CAPS, I was wondering, if I were on Aruba, which end of it should I search for the crypts maze???

Well, My research has put me in three posibility, and these are the goverment cemetary in Zijweik San Nicolaas.

and the other would Oranjestad.

the Last one will be the protestant Cemetary, Mostly dutch domination. and they have their own cemetary

the Catholic Churrch has more stringent rules and famaly members has to be involved to do it in a Catholic fashon.

CAPS


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on July 31, 2008, 03:54:09 PM
Hello CAPS, I was wondering, if I were on Aruba, which end of it should I search for the crypts maze???

Well, My research has put me in three posibility, and these are the goverment cemetary in Zijweik San Nicolaas.

and the other would Oranjestad.

the Last one will be the protestant Cemetary, Mostly dutch domination. and they have their own cemetary

the Catholic Churrch has more stringent rules and famaly members has to be involved to do it in a Catholic fashon.

CAPS


Caps and do you know were the dogs grave´s Reef is ?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 04:02:44 PM
Hello CAPS, I was wondering, if I were on Aruba, which end of it should I search for the crypts maze???

Well, My research has put me in three posibility, and these are the goverment cemetary in Zijweik San Nicolaas.

and the other would Oranjestad.

the Last one will be the protestant Cemetary, Mostly dutch domination. and they have their own cemetary

the Catholic Churrch has more stringent rules and famaly members has to be involved to do it in a Catholic fashon.

CAPS


Caps and do you know were the dogs grave´s Reef is ?

Yes in San Nicholaas. but it is not in there.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 04:13:05 PM
there is only one place and I just need one confirmation and we have it.

patient is esence here.

Question was there a vigil held for Natalee in Aruba and if so who did organised it?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 04:24:37 PM
By vigal, do you mean a prayer service???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 04:28:11 PM
I dont know the answer, but it looks like Lala's mom is here, she might know.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: can on July 31, 2008, 04:30:19 PM
there is only one place and I just need one confirmation and we have it.

patient is esence here.

Question was there a vigil held for Natalee in Aruba and if so who did organised it?
There was a prayer vigil at the Emmanuel Church in Oranjestad two weeks after Natalee's disappearance.  per photo Beth's book. Will see if I can find out who organized it.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on July 31, 2008, 04:34:23 PM
Caps
Let's say you know for a fact that Natalee was placed in a crypt at one time.  What can be done about it?  How would you go about getting all those crypts searched and how upsetting to the families would that be?  I would think you would need some definite proof in order to cross that line and get it done.  I still say Paulus would be an idiot to dare to place her remains in a crypt that he had no control over.  Does the family have a crypt on Aruba? Do you have a plan to find the right one?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 05:16:47 PM
CAPS, do you know who the BIFRONS (Shango and Simion) are??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: CapsLockWizard on July 31, 2008, 05:28:53 PM
Caps
Let's say you know for a fact that Natalee was placed in a crypt at one time.  What can be done about it?  How would you go about getting all those crypts searched and how upsetting to the families would that be?  I would think you would need some definite proof in order to cross that line and get it done.  I still say Paulus would be an idiot to dare to place her remains in a crypt that he had no control over.  Does the family have a crypt on Aruba? Do you have a plan to find the right one?


The Answer lies inside these lines

Simian, why was the key (Money) from the Babylons Palace (Dutch Lodge) not used to open the Sumerians Door ?

In Aruba an undertaker can not never open a cemetary but there is a special cemetary that only those that belongs to the LIONS go and only a Grand Master can open it. That is the Lodge Cemetary in Aruba.

We do not need to look far....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 31, 2008, 05:30:21 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 05:35:52 PM
But CAPS, wer'e not talking about an ordinary Lions Club are we???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 05:36:02 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 31, 2008, 06:02:55 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Dave's book pg. 178:

Dave with Art Wood after the cross was found between Marriott and Fisherman Huts:

....Art and I went to a Catholic Church to speak with the priest to see if he could tell us anything.  We talked to his secretary, and she told us that the priest was in mass and we should come back the next day.  We made an appointment to come back the following afternoon, while we were eating, a group from America's Most Wanted came and interviewed us.  Art and I were about to leave to meet with the priest when we received a phone call from Dompig saying that he had been contacted by the priest asking about why we wanted to meet with him. After that, the priest said he would not be available for the next three days. I would gone by then.  I did not think that to be a coincidence.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 31, 2008, 06:17:11 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Dave's book pg. 178:

Dave with Art Wood after the cross was found between Marriott and Fisherman Huts:

....Art and I went to a Catholic Church to speak with the priest to see if he could tell us anything.  We talked to his secretary, and she told us that the priest was in mass and we should come back the next day.  We made an appointment to come back the following afternoon, while we were eating, a group from America's Most Wanted came and interviewed us.  Art and I were about to leave to meet with the priest when we received a phone call from Dompig saying that he had been contacted by the priest asking about why we wanted to meet with him. After that, the priest said he would not be available for the next three days. I would gone by then.  I did not think that to be a coincidence.
Thanks Buckeye! 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 06:28:46 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Dave's book pg. 178:

Dave with Art Wood after the cross was found between Marriott and Fisherman Huts:

....Art and I went to a Catholic Church to speak with the priest to see if he could tell us anything.  We talked to his secretary, and she told us that the priest was in mass and we should come back the next day.  We made an appointment to come back the following afternoon, while we were eating, a group from America's Most Wanted came and interviewed us.  Art and I were about to leave to meet with the priest when we received a phone call from Dompig saying that he had been contacted by the priest asking about why we wanted to meet with him. After that, the priest said he would not be available for the next three days. I would gone by then.  I did not think that to be a coincidence.

Thanks, Buckeye.....didn't Art Wood speak of this, as well?  I forgot the Dompig detail, too.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 31, 2008, 06:33:16 PM
You're both welcome.  There may be a comment by Art in one of the threads.  I am not sure.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on July 31, 2008, 07:36:33 PM
This was posted, on another site, on an unrelated topic:

(Amigoe: Aug 18, 2006) Peter de Witte new chief of police Aruba

ARUBA — Peter de Witte, acting director of the Coastguard of the Neth.Antilles and Aruba will become the new chief of police. Effective January 1st, 2007 he will formally succeed chief of police Ronny Bernadina, but he will start working on November 1st.

His assignment is for a maximum of three years. He will have to make a clean sweep in the police organization. His appointment developed from a cooperation between the Police Corps of Aruba (KPA) and the Corps of national police service (KPLD) in the Netherlands. A protocol was created for this that Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP), Justice-minister Rudy Croes (MEP) and the Dutch ministers of Home Affairs and Governmental Renewal and Kingdom Relations will sign in the Netherlands late September. De Witte will temporarily take service with KPLD and is assigned to the Aruban police corps. After the three years, he will be replaced by a new local chief of police. He will be assisted by three local experts, including a district attorney, an expert in the field of personnel, and a person from the police corps.


My question is, who are the three local "experts"?  Is one (either the DA or expert in field of personnel) Deutekom (sp?) ?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Altruist on July 31, 2008, 07:40:46 PM
Would like to take this opportunity to THANK CAPS for all of the information that has been provided to us here at SM & all of the hard research work behind the scenes in order for it to be presented.

THANK YOU CAPS!!!!!!

THANK YOU MONKEYS FOR ALL OF YOUR INPUT & organization of resources, as well.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 31, 2008, 07:49:17 PM
This was posted, on another site, on an unrelated topic:

(Amigoe: Aug 18, 2006) Peter de Witte new chief of police Aruba

ARUBA — Peter de Witte, acting director of the Coastguard of the Neth.Antilles and Aruba will become the new chief of police. Effective January 1st, 2007 he will formally succeed chief of police Ronny Bernadina, but he will start working on November 1st.

His assignment is for a maximum of three years. He will have to make a clean sweep in the police organization. His appointment developed from a cooperation between the Police Corps of Aruba (KPA) and the Corps of national police service (KPLD) in the Netherlands. A protocol was created for this that Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (MEP), Justice-minister Rudy Croes (MEP) and the Dutch ministers of Home Affairs and Governmental Renewal and Kingdom Relations will sign in the Netherlands late September. De Witte will temporarily take service with KPLD and is assigned to the Aruban police corps. After the three years, he will be replaced by a new local chief of police. He will be assisted by three local experts, including a district attorney, an expert in the field of personnel, and a person from the police corps.


My question is, who are the three local "experts"?  Is one (either the DA or expert in field of personnel) Deutekom (sp?) ?  

Good question Buckeye!  My opinion is that it is very likely and that his involvement in the case didn't just begin at this time, but from the beginning. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on July 31, 2008, 07:53:41 PM
Would like to take this opportunity to THANK CAPS for all of the information that has been provided to us here at SM & all of the hard research work behind the scenes in order for it to be presented.

THANK YOU CAPS!!!!!!

THANK YOU MONKEYS FOR ALL OF YOUR INPUT & organization of resources, as well.

DITTO   ::MonkeyDance::  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 31, 2008, 08:19:04 PM
Would Paulus take the chance that Natalee was placed in someone's crypt? 

What is this
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Aruba/Cemetery.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Blonde on July 31, 2008, 08:26:31 PM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomeblue-1.gif)

 Bearlyhere to our  group of Global Moderators

 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 10:56:42 PM
Hi, where is everyone?  Has football already started???


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:00:01 PM
Its supposed to be a total eclipse of the moon tonight but you can only see it in Siberia or Russia, I guess thats where everyone is.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:02:29 PM
Hey Wreck, OSU practiced today.  Isnt that your team?   O         S         U ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:12:25 PM
Hey Wreck, OSU practiced today.  Isnt that your team?   O         S         U ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance::
Hi A-1! (we don'y NEED practice  ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyWink::)

While I think it was VERY possible a crypt was a "temporary" burial spot -- I don't think it was the "last" site. Once the "power brokers" got involved , I think it moved to something more "permanent." (I still think ocean.)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:12:26 PM
 ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel::Rally for Natalee-  ::MonkeyDance:: ::Mon
keyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:14:59 PM
Hi Wreck.  Seriously I would be so afraid to put a body in the ocean.  I could never walk on the beach without thinking about it, worrying.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:16:33 PM
Hi Wreck.  Seriously I would be so afraid to put a body in the ocean.  I could never walk on the beach without thinking about it, worrying.
Not if you put it inside a cage so that it would never float back to shore). JMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:18:21 PM
I suppose so, just wouldnt take that chance.  I would keep it close. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:19:17 PM
Why is there no effort to continue the Persistence target searching? Is it because they already "know" it is not needed now?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:20:41 PM
I dont know how they would "know" that.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:22:09 PM
I dont know how they would "know" that.
The FBI "knows".


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:27:01 PM
Did you read earlier, Wreck, when I was talking to CAPS and he said HM was watching??? Who is that??


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:27:16 PM
Why is there no effort to continue the Persistence target searching? Is it because they already "know" it is not needed now?

Last we heard, I believe it was related to finances....maybe I'm wrong.....but, you may be right about already knowing...good question...don't know.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:28:55 PM
Why is there no effort to continue the Persistence target searching? Is it because they already "know" it is not needed now?

Last we heard, I believe it was related to finances....maybe I'm wrong.....but, you may be right about already knowing...good question...don't know.


If it was "finances" -- why is there NO effort to raise funds?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:29:15 PM
Did you read earlier, Wreck, when I was talking to CAPS and he said HM was watching??? Who is that??

I'm not Wreck or Caps, but I answered you...I thought it was Hans Mos....but I can't swear on that!....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:30:48 PM
Thank you!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:31:58 PM
Why is there no effort to continue the Persistence target searching? Is it because they already "know" it is not needed now?

Last we heard, I believe it was related to finances....maybe I'm wrong.....but, you may be right about already knowing...good question...don't know.


If it was "finances" -- why is there NO effort to raise funds?

I thought there was a brief mention, but then nothing....Oceanexploration hasn't posted in a while to my knowledge...last I read was of the birth of his daughter....I don't have anything else...sorry.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:32:04 PM
I think someone suggested raising funds on the front page, but I dont know what happened to the idea.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on July 31, 2008, 11:33:46 PM
Well, Im going to sleep now, Goodnite youall.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on July 31, 2008, 11:36:55 PM
Maybe it is wishful thinking -- but maybe they are at a point where "money" is not the obstacle in bringing EVERYONE involved to justice.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:37:19 PM
Goodnight, Always 1.....see you tomorrow.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on July 31, 2008, 11:41:49 PM
Maybe it is wishful thinking -- but maybe they are at a point where "money" is not the obstacle in bringing EVERYONE involved to justice.

Maybe...wishful thinking has been a favorite for us for 3 years, now....justice just hasn't on any invoice we've found.

Going to head out, soon, so I'm hoping this conversation continues...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: can on August 01, 2008, 09:42:42 AM
Maybe it is wishful thinking -- but maybe they are at a point where "money" is not the obstacle in bringing EVERYONE involved to justice.
Good morning Monkeys!
I have been perplexed about this too Wreck.  Heard Texas Eq. is in charge of raising funds to complete what Persistence started.
Wishful thinking is good Wreck.  It keeps hope alive. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 01, 2008, 09:49:05 AM
Do we have a list of all the political parties on Aruba and their leaders?  TIA


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: MumInOhio on August 01, 2008, 10:22:39 AM
Do we have a list of all the political parties on Aruba and their leaders?  TIA


Lala's...this is current...not sure if you are after this or 2005...

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2118.html

This page was last updated on 24 July 2008

Aruba    

Aliansa/Aruban Social Movement or MSA [Robert WEVER];
Aruban Liberal Organization or OLA [Glenbert CROES];
Aruban Patriotic Movement or MPA [Monica ARENDS-KOCK];
Aruban Patriotic Party or PPA [Benny NISBET];
Aruban People's Party or AVP [Mike EMAN];
People's Electoral Movement Party or MEP [Nelson O. ODUBER];
Real Democracy or PDR [Andin BIKKER];
RED [Rudy LAMPE];
Workers Political Platform or PTT [Gregorio WOLFF]


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 01, 2008, 10:25:02 AM
Thanks Mum.  That is just what I wanted.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 01, 2008, 10:27:33 AM
Do we have a list of all the political parties on Aruba and their leaders?  TIA


Lala's...this is current...not sure if you are after this or 2005...

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2118.html

This page was last updated on 24 July 2008

Aruba    

Aliansa/Aruban Social Movement or MSA [Robert WEVER];
Aruban Liberal Organization or OLA [Glenbert CROES];
Aruban Patriotic Movement or MPA [Monica ARENDS-KOCK];
Aruban Patriotic Party or PPA [Benny NISBET];
Aruban People's Party or AVP [Mike EMAN];
People's Electoral Movement Party or MEP [Nelson O. ODUBER];
Real Democracy or PDR [Andin BIKKER];
RED [Rudy LAMPE];
Workers Political Platform or PTT [Gregorio WOLFF]


Could someone refresh my memory about Andin Bikker?  Why does that name ring a bell? Also, I hope Arends-Kock isn't related to Freddy and his family. LOL


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on August 01, 2008, 11:43:10 AM
Andin Bikker

Gomez & Bikker, Law Offices
50 L.G. Smith Boulevard
P.O. Box 1300
Oranjestad
ARUBA

Phone: (297) 588 7355
Fax: (297) 588 7533

Email: andin@gobiklaw.com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/2006/04/andin-bikker.html
photo
~~~~~~~~~~~
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Andin+Bikker&btnG=Google+Search


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on August 01, 2008, 11:44:20 AM
Arubanese: Andin Bikker (supposedly) was interrogated for six hours Saturday and released. His picture is at arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com. I think it was said he is a suspect.

Posted by: punkingale | Saturday, April 29, 2006 at 01:36 PM
I'm still curious why he was questioned, Punk. I'm really starting to think they are about done with the investigation. With no answers. Sucks!!

Posted by: windy city | Saturday, April 29, 2006 at 02:14 PM

Then why in the hell does nobody in family know about this. Andin is my cousin!

Posted by:Arubaanse | Saturday, April 29, 2006 at 05:01 PM

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2006/04/quick_holloway_/comments/page/1/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 01, 2008, 12:27:17 PM
HMMM. So they were talking to a leader in one of Aruba's political parties.  What a big mess. I guess I didn't realize how all of them seem to play the others to get what they want.  There is truly no loyalty among thieves is there? 

Natalee was caught in the middle of it all.  They would have been better off to have disposed of the Sloots and gone on with their lives.  Alas, they have made their beds now...each one of those parties now must live with the consequences.  Money and politics...it's always the same story. No good ever comes from it...never.

So who else on that list, besides Oduber, was questioned?  Or mentioned or suspected to be involved in the cover up and corruption?  I forget...maybe no one else.  IMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on August 01, 2008, 01:44:34 PM
I'm sure this is nothing, but two things struck me: MOKO and the "cages":

   Ref#: KEY005

   Click Here to Enlarge!
This completely renovated cunucu house with an extended enormous cocktail lounge/ bar, 5 apartments, several storage facilities and a pool is located in a very quiete area in the center of Aruba. This property has potential for a privat bar, restaurant or just your tranquil place surrounded with a tropical garden. This property is owned by a animal lover, so plenty of cages with birds etc. are still on the premises. Owner will accept offers.

Location: MOKO         Price: US$560,000.00

Bedrooms: 2    Bathrooms: 2    Airconditioned: Yes

Furnished: No    Swimming Pool: Yes    Garage: 1-car


http://www.liverighthere.com/aruba-real-estate-great-island-homes-in-aruba-5/
 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 01, 2008, 02:27:19 PM
I'm sure this is nothing, but two things struck me: MOKO and the "cages":

   Ref#: KEY005

   Click Here to Enlarge!
This completely renovated cunucu house with an extended enormous cocktail lounge/ bar, 5 apartments, several storage facilities and a pool is located in a very quiete area in the center of Aruba. This property has potential for a privat bar, restaurant or just your tranquil place surrounded with a tropical garden. This property is owned by a animal lover, so plenty of cages with birds etc. are still on the premises. Owner will accept offers.

Location: MOKO         Price: US$560,000.00

Bedrooms: 2    Bathrooms: 2    Airconditioned: Yes

Furnished: No    Swimming Pool: Yes    Garage: 1-car


http://www.liverighthere.com/aruba-real-estate-great-island-homes-in-aruba-5/
 

(http://www.arubarealestate.com/images/properties/l_key005.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 01, 2008, 02:54:27 PM
Hi, would one of the Mods please change my avator to that black kitty with his tail sweeping???  Thank you.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on August 01, 2008, 03:08:06 PM
Hi, would one of the Mods please change my avator to that black kitty with his tail sweeping???  Thank you.

I think only Admins, namely Klaas, can do that, Always 1.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 01, 2008, 03:28:46 PM
Ok, thank you I will wait for her to return.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on August 01, 2008, 04:32:16 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Wasn't there a priest who died shortly after Natalee.  I can't remember where I read that.  I think he was found in his bed?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on August 01, 2008, 04:36:43 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Wasn't there a priest who died shortly after Natalee.  I can't remember where I read that.  I think he was found in his bed?

You may be right....I don't recall at the moment.  There's been so much in 3 + years to remember.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: 2NJSons_Mom on August 01, 2008, 04:55:33 PM
Hi, would one of the Mods please change my avator to that black kitty with his tail sweeping???  Thank you.

OT....if you go to the link below, where you found the kitty you liked, you can try the directions CBB posted just below it.  The worst that can happen will be that it doesn't work out right...then, maybe it can be fixed by Klaas...just a thought.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2619.msg403546;boardseen#new


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 01, 2008, 05:12:06 PM
O/T too - I tried 2 son and it didnt work Im still a chimp and I swear his eyes just blinked.....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 06:47:27 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Wasn't there a priest who died shortly after Natalee.  I can't remember where I read that.  I think he was found in his bed?

You may be right....I don't recall at the moment.  There's been so much in 3 + years to remember.

I remember this priest being discussed, Father Alejandro Montoya (59).  He'd lived in Curacao for 20 years...originally from Colombia and was found dead on 8/23/06 from what I've read. 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?action=printpage;topic=188.0

http://www.thedailyherald.com/news/daily/j083/Pr083.html

Priest dies after robbery,
community in total shock

WILLEMSTAD--The Catholic community in the Netherlands Antilles was in shock yesterday when it became known that Father Alejandro Montoya (59) had died after being robbed at the Bonam parish house in Curaçao.

Justice Minister David Dick, Lt. Governor Lisa Richards-Dindial and the police management met yesterday at 11:00am to analyse the latest outburst of senseless violence.

Police found Montoya’s lifeless body in the parish house. There were signs of breaking and entering. The place had been searched. The priest’s hands were tied together and his mouth reportedly was taped.

The robbers took money out of the parish register, a fax machine, a computer and Montoya’s car. The car was found shortly after Montoya’s body was discovered in Seru Cocori.

Maria de Lannooy, one of the women who had been helping Montoya count the money the parish had collected during Mass, was the one who called the police. When she arrived at the parish house at 7:15am she noted that people had broken in. She called Montoya, but received no response. She contacted the police, who found Montoya’s body in the parish house covered with a blanket after they had arrived.

Dick, Richards-Dindial and members of the police management held a press briefing yesterday at 5:00pm. Police Commissioner Marlon Wernet said that indications were that more than one robber was involved in the case and that it had happened in the night of Monday to Tuesday. He declined to go into any further details because the investigation was still ongoing.

For Richards-Dindial, Montoya’s death was an example of the need for the Curaçao community to return to its values. “It seems like there are certain people in the community that have lost value for other people’s lives. For someone to break into a parish house and take the life of another person is an unscrupulous act.”

Dick said he was very disappointed to see that once more that the crime problems had been dealt with by building more cells. “We have 530 prison cells and 240 more will be built. This will cost the community a lot of money, money that could better be spent on preventing these crimes from happening,” he said.

All parishes in the Netherlands Antilles held Mass yesterday between noon and 1:00pm in memory of Montoya and all other victims of crime and injustice. Father Thomas Krosnicki told The Daily Herald he had been called at 9:00am by Bishop Luis Secco, who told him about Father Montoya’s death.

“The Bishop asked all parishes in the Netherlands Antilles to commemorate Montoya during a noon Mass,” Krosnicki said. According to him, there were a few more people at Mass than normally would have been the case, but many people hadn’t heard the news yet at that moment.

The Diocese of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba, in a press release issued yesterday, called Montoya a good shepherd for his parishioners. “We make a dramatic appeal to all parents, teachers, reporters and authorities, now more than ever, to stimulate and demonstrate with concrete acts those positive values of which we are in such great need,” the Diocese stated.

Secco was also present yesterday morning at the church in Bonam. In a first reaction he called on all present to remain calm. Besides Secco, Prime Minister Emily de Jongh-Elhage, Finance Minister Ersilia de Lannooy, Richards-Dindial and Attorney General Dick Piar were also present at the scene.

Montoya originated from Colombia and had been living in Curaçao for 20 years. He served at the church in Tera Kora and later at the church in Janwe. Three years ago he was placed at Bonam.





Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 01, 2008, 07:07:20 PM
Oh, look at me, arent i just PUrrrrrrfect?  Thank you Klaasend.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 01, 2008, 07:26:42 PM


does anyone know what rudy croes is preaching about on 24ora today?
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 01, 2008, 07:32:19 PM


does anyone know what rudy croes is preaching about on 24ora today?
dennisintn

Here is the pap translation.  Might have to do with the speed bumps "sleeping policemen" that have been in the news lately.  Maybe Rudy is saying whether or not the speed bumps will stay??


min. croes is comenta tocante polemica
 local friday, 01 august 2008 - 14:00

 in one interview minister of husticia sr. rudy croes owing to wordo ask about what is his reaccion for thing is deal all the polemica rondo of the polisnan sleep y also what is bay happen cu esakinan if they will wordo less or they will stay. click play for so listen thing the mandatario had of bisa: come across


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 01, 2008, 10:39:17 PM
Elaine, sent me this info today.  Does anyone remember the discussions about who the man was that Joran was with in Thailand? You need to scroll all the way down to the poster named Johnny.  We are not sure if his name is reversed or not in the post, as in Daniel Solahain or the other way. This could be him.  Kudos to Elaine!



 johnny
May 7, 2008 at 9:33 am

7th May 2008
Re. The Disappearance/ Murder of Natalee Holloway.
Hello, my name is Johnny.
I live on a small island in the Gulf of Thailand called, Koh Tao.
As recently as yesterday afternoon, Goran Van Der Sloot left this island. Myself and friends (Tony & Phil) confronted him two nights ago, re. his present situation.
I run a small bike shop from which Goran and his travel companion, Solahian Daniel rented their scooters during the 4 day holiday visit to the island.
We have information that Gorans’ passport was lost locally here, so now he will have to go to his embassy in Bangkok to apply for a new passport.
We have already contacted the Thai national press and made them aware of the situation.
Best Regards,
Johnny, Tony & Phil.



http://www.mycrimespace.com/2007/11/23/joran-van-der-sloot/#comment-52224



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 11:07:18 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45149.php
Google translation:

Inflation 8.4 percent
July 31, 2008, 18:23 (GMT -04:00)
   
ORANJESTAD - Inflation over the past twaald months - from June - rose to 8.4 percent. That is 2.4 percent more compared with the same period last year (June 2006 - June 2007) and the largest increase in the past five years.

The consumer price (cpi) rose again last month by 1.5 percent compared with the month of May. Like last month, this increase was caused by the increased huishoudkosten. This indicates the Central Bureau of Statistics (CBS).

Since January, the relative prices by 4.6 percent. The largest increase during this period to June took place in prices for transport and communication (7.9 percent). This was mainly due to petrol and diesel which were considerably more expensive. In June increased costs for the household the strongest (3.3 percent) compared with the month before. These costs increased over the past 12 months, moreover, with 13.3 percent and combine with the rising prices in the transport and communications (9.7 percent) and clothing and footwear (9.8 percent) for the most part to the upside effects of inflation.

The greatly increased costs for household and transport and communication are mainly due to the record high growth of international oil prices and the prices for water and electricity. Last month was 5.5 percent more expensive electricity and water 8.6 percent (at an average consumption of 22.4 cubic meters) compared with the month of May. These price increases provide an upward effect of 0.7 percent of the total cpi in June.

Regarding the cost of electricity, CBS reported that the rate increases by the brandstofclausule motivated. This last month rose by 8.7 percent to 30.43 cents per kwh compared with the month before.

The CBS report to conclude that the government is a part of petrol and diesel prices since May last year has "absorbed" by reducing the excise by ten cents or five cents. The selling price of petrol rose by 6.8 percent in June compared with the previous month. Diesel was 8.8 percent more expensive.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 11:21:18 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45077.php
Google translation:

"Gold is not sold"
July 30, 2008, 19:55 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD - The government is under no circumstance intends to transfer part of the gold to sell. This she says in response to the statements of group Rudy Lampe (RED).

This suggests that consideration be given to a part of the gold to sell for as a miljoenenschuld of the Land to be repaid as a result of a contract that was completed in 1999. The opposition party refers to the 2007 annual report of the Central Bank Aruba (CBA). It says the Bank will soon take a decision on the so-called gold collar option contract. This last year for a loss of 89.8 million ensured florin (compared with 55.2 million in 2006) because of soaring gold price. The contract expires on 28 april next year. The Bank is considering to sign the contract (in part) to terminate or for a certain period of time.

Should the contract be terminated then the debt of almost 90 million cash florin be repaid or (partly) the gold be sold, according to the Bank. "Once a decision has been taken by CBA and the financial implications are known, they are included in the financial report."

Prime Minister Nelson Oduber has been in the media know that Aruba has absolutely no intention to sell the gold. Oduber said this after he and Finance Minister Nilo Swaen recently with CBA president Hassanali Mehran have consulted.

It is not yet known whether this means that the Bank as a result of this decision to renew the contract or terminate it. In the latter case, nearly 90 million florin cash paid to Barclays Capital Bank.

Oduber late at least know that Aruba still expect money from the Netherlands of the proceeds from the Plant-hotel and also 90 million florin of Valero should be given due bbo overdue payments.

According Swaen the Bank really has no other option than to terminate the contract. "The current situation is very different than in the 90s (when the contract was completed, ed) The gold prices have meanwhile risen drastically, and this probably remain so, given the financial situation worldwide. According to the contractual price, CBA gets 367 dollars a troy ounce (31.1 grams, ed) to the sale of our gold. "The annual report of the Bank reports that on 31 december last year the gold price 635.70 dollars per troy ounce. The price of gold is now about 900 dollars per ounce.

Contract

Swaen expressed earlier this week in a press release sharp criticism Lampe that the problems in trying to move the shoes of the MEP government. "Lampe would give the impression that the MEP government is responsible, and I in particular. He plays a political game with our gold in the CBA. "The minister believes that a political leader who has aspirations to govern the country, 'seriousness' must show at the time that he or she is making policy. "With manipulation and the truth to bend over so as to win sympathy at the expense of others, I do not think you follow the right path to meet the power needs."

The Minister further explains that the gold collar option contract was signed during the Cabinet-Eman. "This contract is a crazy decision that Cabinet has taken Eman, and now it appears disastrous for our island." The contract with the banker Rothschild (the contract was taken over by Barclays, eds.) was afsloten time because the strong gold prices in the fall were. The then president of the Central Bank then proposed to Minister of Finance, Tico Croes (ASF) to the gold sales, said Swaen, so to prevent the country even more so suffer losses. There was a fixed price agreed to allow CBA to a further decline in gold price does not need to collect more loss. It also meant that if the gold price above the agreed price of 367 dollars a troy ounce would come true, those profits went to the banker. "The purpose of this contract was clear to our gold selling", said Swaen. "As Minister of Finance I do not think that our gold may be sold." Moreover, the financial consequences of the contract by CBA never mentioned in the annual reports, said the minister. "This began only after the MEP government demanded this."

Autonomy

On February 25, 2004 extended the CBA contract, according to Lampe something that should never have done, because then there was a significant loss. "The Bank Saturday to determine the contract and had no other option. The bank then had to extend it. "Also Mehran's predecessor Rob Henriquez, who is adored as by Lampe," has done nothing in the contract, accuses the Swaen RED-parliamentarian.

Because the contract expires next year, the Bank once a decision.

Swaen: "I have the directors of the bank asked for me as soon as possible to inform them of the solution that will be remembered for this, and so far I am still waiting for response". If the contract is renewed, it remains Aruba in any case until the gold price remains high millions florin wrong, said the minister. The decision remains the responsibility of CBA.

The minister says to the strange conclusion that he believes that the RED group resulting wants to change the law allowing the authority and independence of the Central Bank will be affected. Lampe would legally define that in exceptional circumstances and only after approval of a two-thirds majority in Parliament the gold can be sold. Swaen: "Lampe has always been in favour of an autonomous Central Bank and now he wants autonomy mitigate this!"


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on August 01, 2008, 11:27:30 PM
I have wondered about the continued water search for Natalee and here are my thoughts, from memory -

- The Persistence searched a wider area than anticipated, and stopped when complete and at the start of the storm season.

- Out of money. 

- For the next part of the search, they would need different equipment.  What comes to mind is a different ship and an ROV the size of a Yugo.

My opinions as of the past few months are based on the comment I read somewhere attributed to Hans Mos that they (Persistence) left and WOULD NOT be returning.  This makes it sound like there is something sinister going on, MO.

I really do feel that the Persistence crew wanted to continue, but circumstance forced them to leave without Natalee.

I'm not sure what all those circumstances were, but they do not reflect positively on Aruba.  MO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sirensong on August 01, 2008, 11:31:18 PM
I always found it very odd that the priest, on Aruba, wouldn't keep an appointment with Dave...and avoided him.....

I remember that, too....he made an appointment and then rescheduled, then cancelled and made himself scarce, iirc.

Wasn't there a priest who died shortly after Natalee.  I can't remember where I read that.  I think he was found in his bed?

You may be right....I don't recall at the moment.  There's been so much in 3 + years to remember.

I remember this priest being discussed, Father Alejandro Montoya (59).  He'd lived in Curacao for 20 years...originally from Colombia and was found dead on 8/23/06 from what I've read. 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?action=printpage;topic=188.0

http://www.thedailyherald.com/news/daily/j083/Pr083.html

Priest dies after robbery,
community in total shock

WILLEMSTAD--The Catholic community in the Netherlands Antilles was in shock yesterday when it became known that Father Alejandro Montoya (59) had died after being robbed at the Bonam parish house in Curaçao.

Justice Minister David Dick, Lt. Governor Lisa Richards-Dindial and the police management met yesterday at 11:00am to analyse the latest outburst of senseless violence.

Police found Montoya’s lifeless body in the parish house. There were signs of breaking and entering. The place had been searched. The priest’s hands were tied together and his mouth reportedly was taped.

The robbers took money out of the parish register, a fax machine, a computer and Montoya’s car. The car was found shortly after Montoya’s body was discovered in Seru Cocori.

Maria de Lannooy, one of the women who had been helping Montoya count the money the parish had collected during Mass, was the one who called the police. When she arrived at the parish house at 7:15am she noted that people had broken in. She called Montoya, but received no response. She contacted the police, who found Montoya’s body in the parish house covered with a blanket after they had arrived.

Dick, Richards-Dindial and members of the police management held a press briefing yesterday at 5:00pm. Police Commissioner Marlon Wernet said that indications were that more than one robber was involved in the case and that it had happened in the night of Monday to Tuesday. He declined to go into any further details because the investigation was still ongoing.

For Richards-Dindial, Montoya’s death was an example of the need for the Curaçao community to return to its values. “It seems like there are certain people in the community that have lost value for other people’s lives. For someone to break into a parish house and take the life of another person is an unscrupulous act.”

Dick said he was very disappointed to see that once more that the crime problems had been dealt with by building more cells. “We have 530 prison cells and 240 more will be built. This will cost the community a lot of money, money that could better be spent on preventing these crimes from happening,” he said.

All parishes in the Netherlands Antilles held Mass yesterday between noon and 1:00pm in memory of Montoya and all other victims of crime and injustice. Father Thomas Krosnicki told The Daily Herald he had been called at 9:00am by Bishop Luis Secco, who told him about Father Montoya’s death.

“The Bishop asked all parishes in the Netherlands Antilles to commemorate Montoya during a noon Mass,” Krosnicki said. According to him, there were a few more people at Mass than normally would have been the case, but many people hadn’t heard the news yet at that moment.

The Diocese of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba, in a press release issued yesterday, called Montoya a good shepherd for his parishioners. “We make a dramatic appeal to all parents, teachers, reporters and authorities, now more than ever, to stimulate and demonstrate with concrete acts those positive values of which we are in such great need,” the Diocese stated.

Secco was also present yesterday morning at the church in Bonam. In a first reaction he called on all present to remain calm. Besides Secco, Prime Minister Emily de Jongh-Elhage, Finance Minister Ersilia de Lannooy, Richards-Dindial and Attorney General Dick Piar were also present at the scene.

Montoya originated from Colombia and had been living in Curaçao for 20 years. He served at the church in Tera Kora and later at the church in Janwe. Three years ago he was placed at Bonam.






Thanks Texasmom!  I could have sworn it was in Aruba!  My memory is toast.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 11:31:57 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45210.php
Google translation:

Third arrest in drugsvondst KLM
August 1, 2008, 18:58 (GMT -04:00)
   
KRALENDIJK - In connection with the discovery of several kilos of cocaine in a plane of the KLM is Wednesday third arrest. These are the 22-year-old man J.C.A.J.S. who are still stuck. This confirms a spokesman for the police. Last week, two employees of Flamingo Airport arrested for their involvement. The drug was two weeks ago in a KLM device found at a stopover. The coke should be providing as Justice ingestopt when the aircraft was on its way from Amsterdam to Quito and at night made a stopover on Bonaire. When the plane was returned to the stopover were searched and the drugs appear.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 11:35:23 PM
You're welcome Sirensong.  I was thinking Aruba too!  The story was as I remembered so I hoped Father Montoya was the one you were asking about.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 01, 2008, 11:47:31 PM
Hi Peaches!  It's so good to see you!  I hope you're feeling good this weekend!    

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Greetings/DancingBananas.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 01:30:54 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 02, 2008, 04:43:18 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45077.php
Google translation:

"Gold is not sold"
July 30, 2008, 19:55 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD - The government is under no circumstance intends to transfer part of the gold to sell. This she says in response to the statements of group Rudy Lampe (RED).

This suggests that consideration be given to a part of the gold to sell for as a miljoenenschuld of the Land to be repaid as a result of a contract that was completed in 1999. The opposition party refers to the 2007 annual report of the Central Bank Aruba (CBA). It says the Bank will soon take a decision on the so-called gold collar option contract. This last year for a loss of 89.8 million ensured florin (compared with 55.2 million in 2006) because of soaring gold price. The contract expires on 28 april next year. The Bank is considering to sign the contract (in part) to terminate or for a certain period of time.

Should the contract be terminated then the debt of almost 90 million cash florin be repaid or (partly) the gold be sold, according to the Bank. "Once a decision has been taken by CBA and the financial implications are known, they are included in the financial report."

Prime Minister Nelson Oduber has been in the media know that Aruba has absolutely no intention to sell the gold. Oduber said this after he and Finance Minister Nilo Swaen recently with CBA president Hassanali Mehran have consulted.

It is not yet known whether this means that the Bank as a result of this decision to renew the contract or terminate it. In the latter case, nearly 90 million florin cash paid to Barclays Capital Bank.

Oduber late at least know that Aruba still expect money from the Netherlands of the proceeds from the Plant-hotel and also 90 million florin of Valero should be given due bbo overdue payments.

According Swaen the Bank really has no other option than to terminate the contract. "The current situation is very different than in the 90s (when the contract was completed, ed) The gold prices have meanwhile risen drastically, and this probably remain so, given the financial situation worldwide. According to the contractual price, CBA gets 367 dollars a troy ounce (31.1 grams, ed) to the sale of our gold. "The annual report of the Bank reports that on 31 december last year the gold price 635.70 dollars per troy ounce. The price of gold is now about 900 dollars per ounce.

Contract

Swaen expressed earlier this week in a press release sharp criticism Lampe that the problems in trying to move the shoes of the MEP government. "Lampe would give the impression that the MEP government is responsible, and I in particular. He plays a political game with our gold in the CBA. "The minister believes that a political leader who has aspirations to govern the country, 'seriousness' must show at the time that he or she is making policy. "With manipulation and the truth to bend over so as to win sympathy at the expense of others, I do not think you follow the right path to meet the power needs."

The Minister further explains that the gold collar option contract was signed during the Cabinet-Eman. "This contract is a crazy decision that Cabinet has taken Eman, and now it appears disastrous for our island." The contract with the banker Rothschild (the contract was taken over by Barclays, eds.) was afsloten time because the strong gold prices in the fall were. The then president of the Central Bank then proposed to Minister of Finance, Tico Croes (ASF) to the gold sales, said Swaen, so to prevent the country even more so suffer losses. There was a fixed price agreed to allow CBA to a further decline in gold price does not need to collect more loss. It also meant that if the gold price above the agreed price of 367 dollars a troy ounce would come true, those profits went to the banker. "The purpose of this contract was clear to our gold selling", said Swaen. "As Minister of Finance I do not think that our gold may be sold." Moreover, the financial consequences of the contract by CBA never mentioned in the annual reports, said the minister. "This began only after the MEP government demanded this."

Autonomy

On February 25, 2004 extended the CBA contract, according to Lampe something that should never have done, because then there was a significant loss. "The Bank Saturday to determine the contract and had no other option. The bank then had to extend it. "Also Mehran's predecessor Rob Henriquez, who is adored as by Lampe," has done nothing in the contract, accuses the Swaen RED-parliamentarian.

Because the contract expires next year, the Bank once a decision.

Swaen: "I have the directors of the bank asked for me as soon as possible to inform them of the solution that will be remembered for this, and so far I am still waiting for response". If the contract is renewed, it remains Aruba in any case until the gold price remains high millions florin wrong, said the minister. The decision remains the responsibility of CBA.

The minister says to the strange conclusion that he believes that the RED group resulting wants to change the law allowing the authority and independence of the Central Bank will be affected. Lampe would legally define that in exceptional circumstances and only after approval of a two-thirds majority in Parliament the gold can be sold. Swaen: "Lampe has always been in favour of an autonomous Central Bank and now he wants autonomy mitigate this!"


After this War de Natalee is over... O'Douchebag will be selling turns with

his mother for $50 a trick. HOW DOES IT FEEEEEEL, Nelsey?  -Deepak Kalpoe

 ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 02, 2008, 04:45:47 AM
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/aroobaBELLTOLL.png)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 02, 2008, 06:25:34 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 02, 2008, 06:31:06 AM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 02, 2008, 07:45:47 AM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomeblue-1.gif)

 Bearlyhere to our  group of Global Moderators

 


Thanks, Blonde.  That's beautiful!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 02, 2008, 08:10:13 AM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.

Just think...The Kalpoes are still partying it up in Aruba while Joran is having to run around in Thailand with the really weirdos and find his niche again.  They can still play the "game" but Joran can't.  Joran can't come home to see his parents and the Kalpoes can.  Joran is not welcome in Aruba and Papa Sloot can't move. LOLOLOL!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: mrskub on August 02, 2008, 09:35:01 AM
Bearly, I'm so sorry. I've been so consumed with Caylee that I didn't even notice.

(http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e354/tkubi7/HB%20congrat%20and%20Pray/a-congrats6.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: johan555 on August 02, 2008, 09:38:48 AM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.

Just think...The Kalpoes are still partying it up in Aruba while Joran is having to run around in Thailand with the really weirdos and find his niche again.  They can still play the "game" but Joran can't.  Joran can't come home to see his parents and the Kalpoes can.  Joran is not welcome in Aruba and Papa Sloot can't move. LOLOLOL!!

The situation is still the same ,C&C is Senor Frog's  now
Why don't they close bar's like that ?
unbelievable !!!!

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Senorfrogsnow.jpg?t=1217684029)



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 10:28:18 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 10:30:08 AM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomeblue-1.gif)

 Bearlyhere to our  group of Global Moderators

 


Thanks, Blonde.  That's beautiful!
Congrats to you Global Mod Bearly. ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 02, 2008, 10:35:10 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 10:35:21 AM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.

Just think...The Kalpoes are still partying it up in Aruba while Joran is having to run around in Thailand with the really weirdos and find his niche again.  They can still play the "game" but Joran can't.  Joran can't come home to see his parents and the Kalpoes can.  Joran is not welcome in Aruba and Papa Sloot can't move. LOLOLOL!!

The situation is still the same ,C&C is Senor Frog's  now
Why don't they close bar's like that ?
unbelievable !!!!

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Senorfrogsnow.jpg?t=1217684029)


Because there will always be females stupid enough to get up on the stage and dance while males in the audience take pics up thier dresses.Is the girl in blue missing her panties? ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 02, 2008, 11:30:38 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.


He still looks just as stupid as the first day I saw him!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 02, 2008, 11:33:02 AM
Ditto!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 11:35:49 AM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.

Just think...The Kalpoes are still partying it up in Aruba while Joran is having to run around in Thailand with the really weirdos and find his niche again.  They can still play the "game" but Joran can't.  Joran can't come home to see his parents and the Kalpoes can.  Joran is not welcome in Aruba and Papa Sloot can't move. LOLOLOL!!

The situation is still the same ,C&C is Senor Frog's  now
Why don't they close bar's like that ?
unbelievable !!!!

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Senorfrogsnow.jpg?t=1217684029)


Because there will always be females stupid enough to get up on the stage and dance while males in the audience take pics up thier dresses.Is the girl in blue missing her panties? ::MonkeyEek::
Tequilla's is more or less the same too....this guy takes it all off (almost!)  And changes from his striped underwear to white ones sometime....or maybe he had two pair of underwear on!  ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/strippernormal_201TEQUILA_055.jpg)
http://www.mifm1075.com/
All It Takes To Go Out And Have Fun, Drink & Dance Is A Night @ Tequila...30/07
Pages 3-7


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 11:38:12 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.


He still looks just as stupid as the first day I saw him!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::
Ain't that the truth!  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 02, 2008, 11:55:23 AM
It seems to be the bars there now put on strip/circus combo shows all to entice the audience to join the wild behavior all the while squirting booze down their throats. Guess sleazy DK couldn't resist the good fun.



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 11:59:17 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/UncapherSisters.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/hnormal_266TEQUILA_120.jpg)
More familiar faces....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 02, 2008, 12:02:55 PM
OT here but another tourist incident recently in Antigua. Mod feel free to remove if this has already been posted.I feel unspeakably sorry for the victims in this case, but i also feel it is important to be aware of just how much crime really does occur in paradise.

+++++++++++
(http://afp.google.com/media/ALeqM5gPgkQqjdBG9OrmU2yIWb9cYNcngA?size=s)
Briton shot on honeymoon heading home from Antigua

August 1, 2008
ST JOHN'S, Antigua and Barbuda (AFP) — A British doctor, still in a coma from an attack that left his newly wed wife dead, left Antigua early Friday for Wales aboard an air ambulance.

A police escort and a five-person medical team helped Benjamin Mullany's brother transfer the injured man from hospital to a waiting Learjet 35.

Officials shielded Mullany from the view of gathered media with white sheets and he was boarded onto the plane, which will stop in the United States en route to Britain.

The body of his murdered wife, Catherine, will also be flown home to Wales via a commercial flight to London later Friday.

Catherine Mullany, 31, was shot dead Sunday and Benjamin, also 31, was left in a coma after assailants entered their room at a luxury resort here in what police are treating a robbery "gone bad."

Police spokesman Cornelium Charles earlier told AFP that Benjamin Mullany's family had decided to transfer him to Britain for medical care.

The move came after Antigua's prime minister asked British police to help investigate several unsolved murders there in the wake of the brutal shooting.

In a national broadcast Wednesday, Prime Minister Baldwin Spencer said his government had made a "formal request of Scotland Yard for its assistance in cracking the number of unsolved murders still on the books." Scotland Yard refers to London's Metropolitan Police.

A team of detectives from Wales, where the couple lived, is already expected on the Carribean island to help investigate the brutal weekend attack, said Antiguan police.

Antigua hotels and businesses have offered a 130,000 dollar reward for information leading to the arrest of those responsible for the shooting.

No arrests have been made, although police are pursuing several leads and had been questioning people about the murder.

Antigua Hotels and Tourist Association chairman Ted Isaac said his group has planned a march and memorial service on Sunday in Mullany's honor to show how seriously hoteliers were taking the issue.

"We want the world to understand that we abhor this despicable crime," Isaac said.

The Mullanys, from Pontardawe, in South Wales, were nearing the end of a two-week honeymoon on the island when they were attacked.

The parents of both victims arrived in Antigua on Tuesday and issued a statement distributed by the Foreign Office in London, asking for privacy.

"We have found some of the stories reported in certain areas of the press insensitive, untrue, and have added to our distress," read the statement.

"While we understand that media interest in this tragic incident is inevitable, we feel that our privacy has been invaded at an extremely upsetting time for us all."


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 12:08:40 PM
Yes, I'd read about that BB...so heartbreaking; and you're right about crimes in paradise.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 12:13:52 PM
Jossy mentioned in several articles...wish I knew what they said!

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Jossy073120082.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/jossy073120083.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/jossy073120084.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 02, 2008, 12:17:12 PM
I have a question......does anyone know what happened to the site meter that used to be at the bottom of the page?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 02, 2008, 12:22:51 PM
I have a question......does anyone know what happened to the site meter that used to be at the bottom of the page?

Yes, as a matter of fact I do know, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yesterday something changed on the Sitemeter site that caused a problem with IE.  Due to the changes made by Sitemeter, people using IE as a browser could not access either SM.com or SM.net.   This was not limited to SM but all BLOGS that use Sitemeter.  The temporary fix is to remove the Sitemeter.  I'm sure things will be back to normal once Sitemeter fixes there problem.

The problem doesn't affect people using Firefox as a browser, only IE (which includes most users).  Because most users use IE, Dugga removed the Sitemeter until the Sitemeter people resolve their issue with IE.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 02, 2008, 12:36:26 PM
Thank-you Klaas.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 02, 2008, 01:03:14 PM


"We have found some of the stories reported in certain areas of the press insensitive, untrue, and have added to our distress," read the statement.

"While we understand that media interest in this tragic incident is inevitable, we feel that our privacy has been invaded at an extremely upsetting time for us all."
[/quote]

like aruba, they don't won't their dirty linen aired in public.  when you spend millions enticing people to visit and promise them a safe trip, you lose all expectations of "privacy" when something bad happens.  hopefully antigua will see the stupidity involved in trying to hide the truth and somehow blame the victims.  if ed briesen's bragging happened to be true about aruba being the model carib. tourist locations would use in cases such as natalee's, that will be their next step.  "murder, attempted suicide" would be aruba's take on it.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Poochy on August 02, 2008, 01:37:37 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.

He still looks just as stupid as the first day I saw him!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::
Ain't that the truth!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hey, who's the girl in the pink next to Dompig? Look at her eyes! Is she related to Joran?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

A picture says a thousand words...and the 'debil sign' in front of Deepak's mouth says much to me!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: WhiskeyGirl on August 02, 2008, 01:53:57 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.

I was thinking it looks like he got a down payment on his eight billion from Dr. Phil.  Any updates?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 02:17:05 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.

He still looks just as stupid as the first day I saw him!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::
Ain't that the truth!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hey, who's the girl in the pink next to Dompig? Look at her eyes! Is she related to Joran?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

A picture says a thousand words...and the 'debil sign' in front of Deepak's mouth says much to me!
yep, so true!  And birds of a feather.....flock together.... ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__93_.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 02:20:24 PM
I'm sure Dr. Phil is going to love that photo.

Just think...The Kalpoes are still partying it up in Aruba while Joran is having to run around in Thailand with the really weirdos and find his niche again.  They can still play the "game" but Joran can't.  Joran can't come home to see his parents and the Kalpoes can.  Joran is not welcome in Aruba and Papa Sloot can't move. LOLOLOL!!

The situation is still the same ,C&C is Senor Frog's  now
Why don't they close bar's like that ?
unbelievable !!!!

(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh25/johan555/Senorfrogsnow.jpg?t=1217684029)


Because there will always be females stupid enough to get up on the stage and dance while males in the audience take pics up thier dresses.Is the girl in blue missing her panties? ::MonkeyEek::
Tequilla's is more or less the same too....this guy takes it all off (almost!)  And changes from his striped underwear to white ones sometime....or maybe he had two pair of underwear on!  ::MonkeyHaHa::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/strippernormal_201TEQUILA_055.jpg)
http://www.mifm1075.com/
All It Takes To Go Out And Have Fun, Drink & Dance Is A Night @ Tequila...30/07
Pages 3-7

Eeeewwww....blah! :smt078
I think they pay people to get on stage and act like sleeze balls.I thought I saw the group Y M C A on stage in tight white pants dancing at Frogs lol


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 02:26:36 PM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 02:32:27 PM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)
Poor little heartbroken kalpoe boys :smt062
Isn't there a court update on the 5th or 8th of this month about the kalpoe riches?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Patriot on August 02, 2008, 02:51:41 PM
The Bauder college blog was updated on July 28. Here's the link.

Here's a little bit. I guess they had Hodges as a guest speaker and he talked about his book etc.

"We all had copies of some e-mails from a suspect in the Natalee Holloway case and we went through the e-mails to see if we could understand what was being said, word by word.

It is an interesting concept on how the mind works, how we process stories along and how we can tell the truth and not even know that we are doing it. He said that not everyone can pick it up and understand it, but women tend to pick it up faster.

I think everyone who is interested in the Holloway case and enjoys learning something new should read his book "Into the Deep." Listening to him, reading his book and learning about his process made me want to learn more about "decoding" who the finger is pointing at and how to prove it.

It's just amazing all the opportunities that have been given to us and just how hard we all work to make sure we don't waste them. We know we are getting closer to finding the one key to unlocking this whole case. I see it sometimes as a big game of Clue -- the only difference is we could help an entire family and community by solving a case."



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Patriot on August 02, 2008, 02:55:22 PM
Sorry, forgot the link.

 ::MonkeyConfused::
http://search.cnn.com/search.jsp?query=Bauder%20College&type=news&sortBy=date&intl=true


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 02:56:15 PM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)
Poor little heartbroken kalpoe boys :smt062
Isn't there a court update on the 5th or 8th of this month about the kalpoe riches?
I hope Dr. Phil and his lawyers turn the tables on those lieing, scheming, murdering little pimpwannabe-punks and THEY have to pay for his time, trouble, mental anguish, and court costs!  Go get 'em Dr. Phil!
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/pancake.gif)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 03:00:19 PM
The Bauder college blog was updated on July 28. Here's the link.
http://search.cnn.com/search.jsp?query=Bauder%20College&type=news&sortBy=date&intl=true

Here's a little bit. I guess they had Hodges as a guest speaker and he talked about his book etc.

"We all had copies of some e-mails from a suspect in the Natalee Holloway case and we went through the e-mails to see if we could understand what was being said, word by word.

It is an interesting concept on how the mind works, how we process stories along and how we can tell the truth and not even know that we are doing it. He said that not everyone can pick it up and understand it, but women tend to pick it up faster.

I think everyone who is interested in the Holloway case and enjoys learning something new should read his book "Into the Deep." Listening to him, reading his book and learning about his process made me want to learn more about "decoding" who the finger is pointing at and how to prove it.

It's just amazing all the opportunities that have been given to us and just how hard we all work to make sure we don't waste them. We know we are getting closer to finding the one key to unlocking this whole case. I see it sometimes as a big game of Clue -- the only difference is we could help an entire family and community by solving a case."
Thanks Patriot!  Great info!  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 02, 2008, 04:20:50 PM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45077.php
Google translation:

"Gold is not sold"
July 30, 2008, 19:55 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD - The government is under no circumstance intends to transfer part of the gold to sell. This she says in response to the statements of group Rudy Lampe (RED).

This suggests that consideration be given to a part of the gold to sell for as a miljoenenschuld of the Land to be repaid as a result of a contract that was completed in 1999. The opposition party refers to the 2007 annual report of the Central Bank Aruba (CBA). It says the Bank will soon take a decision on the so-called gold collar option contract. This last year for a loss of 89.8 million ensured florin (compared with 55.2 million in 2006) because of soaring gold price. The contract expires on 28 april next year. The Bank is considering to sign the contract (in part) to terminate or for a certain period of time.

Should the contract be terminated then the debt of almost 90 million cash florin be repaid or (partly) the gold be sold, according to the Bank. "Once a decision has been taken by CBA and the financial implications are known, they are included in the financial report."

Prime Minister Nelson Oduber has been in the media know that Aruba has absolutely no intention to sell the gold. Oduber said this after he and Finance Minister Nilo Swaen recently with CBA president Hassanali Mehran have consulted.

It is not yet known whether this means that the Bank as a result of this decision to renew the contract or terminate it. In the latter case, nearly 90 million florin cash paid to Barclays Capital Bank.

Oduber late at least know that Aruba still expect money from the Netherlands of the proceeds from the Plant-hotel and also 90 million florin of Valero should be given due bbo overdue payments.

According Swaen the Bank really has no other option than to terminate the contract. "The current situation is very different than in the 90s (when the contract was completed, ed) The gold prices have meanwhile risen drastically, and this probably remain so, given the financial situation worldwide. According to the contractual price, CBA gets 367 dollars a troy ounce (31.1 grams, ed) to the sale of our gold. "The annual report of the Bank reports that on 31 december last year the gold price 635.70 dollars per troy ounce. The price of gold is now about 900 dollars per ounce.

Contract

Swaen expressed earlier this week in a press release sharp criticism Lampe that the problems in trying to move the shoes of the MEP government. "Lampe would give the impression that the MEP government is responsible, and I in particular. He plays a political game with our gold in the CBA. "The minister believes that a political leader who has aspirations to govern the country, 'seriousness' must show at the time that he or she is making policy. "With manipulation and the truth to bend over so as to win sympathy at the expense of others, I do not think you follow the right path to meet the power needs."

The Minister further explains that the gold collar option contract was signed during the Cabinet-Eman. "This contract is a crazy decision that Cabinet has taken Eman, and now it appears disastrous for our island." The contract with the banker Rothschild (the contract was taken over by Barclays, eds.) was afsloten time because the strong gold prices in the fall were. The then president of the Central Bank then proposed to Minister of Finance, Tico Croes (ASF) to the gold sales, said Swaen, so to prevent the country even more so suffer losses. There was a fixed price agreed to allow CBA to a further decline in gold price does not need to collect more loss. It also meant that if the gold price above the agreed price of 367 dollars a troy ounce would come true, those profits went to the banker. "The purpose of this contract was clear to our gold selling", said Swaen. "As Minister of Finance I do not think that our gold may be sold." Moreover, the financial consequences of the contract by CBA never mentioned in the annual reports, said the minister. "This began only after the MEP government demanded this."

Autonomy

On February 25, 2004 extended the CBA contract, according to Lampe something that should never have done, because then there was a significant loss. "The Bank Saturday to determine the contract and had no other option. The bank then had to extend it. "Also Mehran's predecessor Rob Henriquez, who is adored as by Lampe," has done nothing in the contract, accuses the Swaen RED-parliamentarian.

Because the contract expires next year, the Bank once a decision.

Swaen: "I have the directors of the bank asked for me as soon as possible to inform them of the solution that will be remembered for this, and so far I am still waiting for response". If the contract is renewed, it remains Aruba in any case until the gold price remains high millions florin wrong, said the minister. The decision remains the responsibility of CBA.

The minister says to the strange conclusion that he believes that the RED group resulting wants to change the law allowing the authority and independence of the Central Bank will be affected. Lampe would legally define that in exceptional circumstances and only after approval of a two-thirds majority in Parliament the gold can be sold. Swaen: "Lampe has always been in favour of an autonomous Central Bank and now he wants autonomy mitigate this!"

I have read this several times and my ability to understand must be compromised by the wording.  Does this mean that Swaen wants to sell the gold that is in the bank for the better profit and Lampe does not?  Does this also mean that CBA is controlled by the gov't of Aruba and Lampe wants it to be independent of political influence in it's business dealings?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: martini on August 02, 2008, 05:06:33 PM
Hi Monkeys~
I did not want to be a lurker so I am posting to say hello!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 02, 2008, 05:29:45 PM
Hi Monkeys~
I did not want to be a lurker so I am posting to say hello!

Hi Martini 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: mrskub on August 02, 2008, 05:56:43 PM
Do ya think the Kalpoes know they shouldn't mix booze with all the anti-depressants they have to take for the Post Traumatic Stress Disorder they have now?  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 02, 2008, 06:20:00 PM

ot, here.  in case it hasn't been posted.  rockefeller has been captured in baltimore.  the child is safe and momma's on her way there now.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 02, 2008, 06:31:06 PM
Do ya think the Kalpoes know they shouldn't mix booze with all the anti-depressants they have to take for the Post Traumatic Stress Disorder they have now?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 02, 2008, 06:52:39 PM
Do ya think the Kalpoes know they shouldn't mix booze with all the anti-depressants they have to take for the Post Traumatic Stress Disorder they have now?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

lol, that's a cheerful thought, san, but i don't think there's all that much up there to hurt.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 07:03:22 PM
Do ya think the Kalpoes know they shouldn't mix booze with all the anti-depressants they have to take for the Post Traumatic Stress Disorder they have now?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on August 02, 2008, 07:14:46 PM
Is it too soon for this??>>>>>

(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Scard%20Monkeys%20Mod/LOCK2.gif)

 ::cartwheel::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 02, 2008, 07:29:32 PM
Nut  ::MonkeyHaHa::  Not too soon but at the slow pace this thread is going you may have to remind people again when it reaches page 45  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on August 02, 2008, 07:37:10 PM
 :2saywhaa:   ooooo, yeah. Okay ... if I am here  ::cartwheel::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 08:08:15 PM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)
Poor little heartbroken kalpoe boys :smt062
Isn't there a court update on the 5th or 8th of this month about the kalpoe riches?
I hope Dr. Phil and his lawyers turn the tables on those lieing, scheming, murdering little pimpwannabe-punks and THEY have to pay for his time, trouble, mental anguish, and court costs!  Go get 'em Dr. Phil!
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/pancake.gif)
::MonkeyHaHa::LOVE the pancake smiley!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 02, 2008, 08:13:42 PM
Hi Monkeys~
I did not want to be a lurker so I am posting to say hello!

Hi Martini any news about Leta?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 02, 2008, 08:16:24 PM
Do ya think the Kalpoes know they shouldn't mix booze with all the anti-depressants they have to take for the Post Traumatic Stress Disorder they have now?  ::MonkeyHaHa::
::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 02, 2008, 09:33:28 PM
Hi Monkeys~
I did not want to be a lurker so I am posting to say hello!

Hi Martini ;-)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 02, 2008, 09:46:52 PM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)
Poor little heartbroken kalpoe boys :smt062
Isn't there a court update on the 5th or 8th of this month about the kalpoe riches?
I hope Dr. Phil and his lawyers turn the tables on those lieing, scheming, murdering little pimpwannabe-punks and THEY have to pay for his time, trouble, mental anguish, and court costs!  Go get 'em Dr. Phil!
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/pancake.gif)
::MonkeyHaHa::LOVE the pancake smiley!

Is that a tie...or one of those neck thingies the pimps wear around his neck...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 02, 2008, 09:51:26 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: wreck on August 02, 2008, 09:57:59 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!
Welcome back! Hope all is well!!  ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 02, 2008, 10:08:36 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!

Hi Destiny - good to see you!  Some of us have been hanging out in the Caylee Anthony thread.  Geraldo is covering that case in a few minutes. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 02, 2008, 10:09:24 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!
Welcome back! Hope all is well!!  ::MonkeyTongue::

Thanks....things could be better....but I am patient...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 02, 2008, 10:10:21 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!

Hi Destiny - good to see you!  Some of us have been hanging out in the Caylee Anthony thread.  Geraldo is covering that case in a few minutes. 

Thanks Klaas....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 02, 2008, 10:31:09 PM

[/quote]

Is that a tie...or one of those neck thingies the pimps wear around his neck...
[/quote]

it reminds me of that thing jvds has around his neck in the pic. of him walking in the street. he had on a green shirt with little white horizontal stripes.  i thought it might be a thumb drive for his computer. 
dennisintn



Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 02, 2008, 10:41:57 PM
Hello Destiny, I missed you too, a lot...


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 02, 2008, 10:46:51 PM
Martini High!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 02, 2008, 11:34:00 PM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!

Woooohooooo! Destiny's back!  ::MonkeyDance::  ::cartwheel::
Hey girl, we missed ya!  And we've been keeping you in our thoughts and prayers....will continue to do so!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 03, 2008, 12:07:30 AM
tip-toes into almost empty cage...puts fresh flowers in all the vases...and new bananas in the baskets....sweeps cobwebs from corners on ceiling....lights a new batch of candles....puts out platter of steenkie cheese under bridge to keep the trolls occupied.....Hi Monkeys!

Destiny...missed Ya All!

Woooohooooo! Destiny's back!  ::MonkeyDance::  ::cartwheel::
Hey girl, we missed ya!  And we've been keeping you in our thoughts and prayers....will continue to do so!

TY Tex...it's been a roller coaster week....still have many dragons to slay.....Thanks for the Prayers Girl!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 03, 2008, 12:10:44 AM


Is that a tie...or one of those neck thingies the pimps wear around his neck...
[/quote]

it reminds me of that thing jvds has around his neck in the pic. of him walking in the street. he had on a green shirt with little white horizontal stripes.  i thought it might be a thumb drive for his computer. 
dennisintn


[/quote]

Yep....wonder how many secrets he's keeping to *earn* that pass on a neck....Looks the same as the one Joran wore...it's gotta mean something...I'm gonna try to find out what it means....


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Destiny on August 03, 2008, 12:14:50 AM
Cord on Neck reminds me of an old song....

I've got a brand new pair of roller skates...You've got a brand new key....

Anyone remember that old blast from the past...LOL...I always used to wear my rollar skate key around my neck on a cord.....Oh Chit...dating myself here....

Destiny ;-)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 02:49:40 AM
http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_45260.php
Netherlands is uninvolved in salariskwestie OM
August 2, 2008, 17:36 (GMT -04:00)
Google translation:
 
ORANJESTAD - Netherlands does not intend to intervene in the Aruban decision to the salaries of the prosecutors should be reduced. The former acting Attorney-General Nico Jörg had in april to a destruction of the decision by the Rijksministerraad asked for an end to the protracted undermanning at the Public Prosecutor (OM). The Rijksministerraad has rejected this request. State Secretary Ank Bijleveld-Schouten (Koninkrijksrelaties, CDA) is confident now that Aruba itself solve the problem.

This is evidenced by reports of the World Service. The reduction in salaries during an application for two new prosecutors to appoint the candidates withdrew withdrew. Thus, there is now a structural deficit to two officers to the PPS, that six posts. Bijleveld Secretary of State calls it a worrisome situation, but she is confident after a conversation with Prime Minister Nelson Oduber of Aruba that the problem will resolve itself.

The issue of the salaries of the OM members and also the Common Court of Justice, has been running for a long time. The salaries of judicial staff have been known for years higher than officially recorded. This situation was all that time tolerated by the government, especially since the wages were always equated with those of the Dutch Antilles. Since the industrial dispute between Attorney General Theresa Croes Fernandes and Justice Minister Rudy Croes and the increase in salaries by the West Indies last year, the minister wants the situation 'straightening'. Croes believes that nobody should earn more than the Prime Minister, similar to the standard Balkenende in the Netherlands and relies on a decision by the Ministerial Council in which it would be governed.

The OM had during the application process, however, advertised with the usual salary. Minister Croes stuck there and then pulled the two candidate haakten officers because they were offered 14 scale, four cups lower than was promised. It asked for such a destruction of the salarisbesluit that the Ministerial Council would have taken, because otherwise it was almost impossible for the job.

"Nobody, not even an Aruban lawyer stands ready to against such a comparatively low salary as an officer to get started. The OM remains understaffed and the many criminal cases shall not thereby be down again, "said the then acting PG Jorge. For him, this decision again a proof that the government is a well-functioning judiciary is not high on the agenda.

The request for annulment of the salarisbesluit during the Rijksministerraad. Premier Oduber then know that there was really nothing salarisbesluit and that he has no objection to that the OM members earn more than he. Indeed it has always been, says Oduber, and it is important for Aruba that the PPS his work properly can use.

The absence salarisbesluit exists, is denied by the Ministry of Justice. Jörg left field for his farewell in June he know that the relevant documents of the meeting of the Ministerial Council has requested, but that he was informed that these are not there.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 03:29:49 AM
Bearly, I'm so sorry. I've been so consumed with Caylee that I didn't even notice.

(http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e354/tkubi7/HB%20congrat%20and%20Pray/a-congrats6.gif)

Thanks Mrs. Kub, that is really cute.  It's okay, I'm still in training.

              (http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j120/Bearlyhere/beartraining.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 03:31:59 AM
(http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b104/Blondeonahd/Fun%20stuff/welcomeblue-1.gif)

 Bearlyhere to our  group of Global Moderators

 


Thanks, Blonde.  That's beautiful!
Congrats to you Global Mod Bearly. ::MonkeyCool::

Thanks Karma.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 03:52:52 AM
It seems to be the bars there now put on strip/circus combo shows all to entice the audience to join the wild behavior all the while squirting booze down their throats. Guess sleazy DK couldn't resist the good fun.



They have to squirt booze down their throats, BB, how else can they make a sweaty dancing man with whitey tighties look good?  Notice they keep the lights off.  It is extremely sexist.  Notice how the girls are almost naked with the lights on.  The men get paid in money, the girls get paid in cheap liquor which keeps the predators circling around.

         


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 03:55:30 AM
I have a question......does anyone know what happened to the site meter that used to be at the bottom of the page?

Yes, as a matter of fact I do know, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yesterday something changed on the Sitemeter site that caused a problem with IE.  Due to the changes made by Sitemeter, people using IE as a browser could not access either SM.com or SM.net.   This was not limited to SM but all BLOGS that use Sitemeter.  The temporary fix is to remove the Sitemeter.  I'm sure things will be back to normal once Sitemeter fixes there problem.

The problem doesn't affect people using Firefox as a browser, only IE (which includes most users).  Because most users use IE, Dugga removed the Sitemeter until the Sitemeter people resolve their issue with IE.

Oh, is that what happened yesterday.  For a while, I thought I was banned!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 03, 2008, 03:58:59 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)
Poor little heartbroken kalpoe boys :smt062
Isn't there a court update on the 5th or 8th of this month about the kalpoe riches?
I hope Dr. Phil and his lawyers turn the tables on those lieing, scheming, murdering little pimpwannabe-punks and THEY have to pay for his time, trouble, mental anguish, and court costs!  Go get 'em Dr. Phil!
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Smileys/pancake.gif)
::MonkeyHaHa::LOVE the pancake smiley!


 ::MonkeyShocked::


holy crappppp, that is one fugly beyotch!!!

... and the girl he is with is another story.


He is definitely NOT getting better with time.


BOYCOTT ARUBA

Justice for Natalee Holloway!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 04:02:46 AM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight30SENORFROGS_0-1.jpg)
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Dompig/MDompigLadiesNight07302008SenorFrog.jpg)
Ladies Night Jam Packed @ Senor Frogs 7/30
http://www.mifm1075.com/

Michael Dompig and Deepak Kalpoe hanging out at the place where he kidnapped Natalee.  What two worthless POS.
Yeah,deepak's life is just so ruined!Look at how depressed and down in the dumps he looks. :smt072

Exactly.

He still looks just as stupid as the first day I saw him!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::
Ain't that the truth!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hey, who's the girl in the pink next to Dompig? Look at her eyes! Is she related to Joran?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

A picture says a thousand words...and the 'debil sign' in front of Deepak's mouth says much to me!

No, she is not related to Joran, I can see how you could make that mistake, what with Michael Dompig coming up the rear.

...of the picture, I mean.   ::MonkeyRoll::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Bearlyhere on August 03, 2008, 04:04:37 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)

That's such a shame that he has to bring his nurse with him everywhere he goes, poor thing.
              ::MonkeyNoNo::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: sharon on August 03, 2008, 07:31:07 AM
I have a question......does anyone know what happened to the site meter that used to be at the bottom of the page?

Yes, as a matter of fact I do know, lol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yesterday something changed on the Sitemeter site that caused a problem with IE.  Due to the changes made by Sitemeter, people using IE as a browser could not access either SM.com or SM.net.   This was not limited to SM but all BLOGS that use Sitemeter.  The temporary fix is to remove the Sitemeter.  I'm sure things will be back to normal once Sitemeter fixes there problem.

The problem doesn't affect people using Firefox as a browser, only IE (which includes most users).  Because most users use IE, Dugga removed the Sitemeter until the Sitemeter people resolve their issue with IE.

Thanks for that! I thought my laptop had flipped out  ::MonkeyLaugh::

When I tried to access the site -- the screen would quickly display and then turn into 'page cannot be displayed' or 'can not access'.

I tried thru AOL and then thru IE. then suddenly! it worked!   ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 03, 2008, 08:28:23 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)

That's such a shame that he has to bring his nurse with him everywhere he goes, poor thing.
              ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: That will be his defense when Dr. Phil see this picture.  She is not my GF she is my nurse  ::MonkeyHaHa::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 03, 2008, 09:27:26 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)

That's such a shame that he has to bring his nurse with him everywhere he goes, poor thing.
              ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: That will be his defense when Dr. Phil see this picture.  She is not my GF she is my nurse  ::MonkeyHaHa::


I guess some people tolerate guilt better than others.  Satish is subdude and Deepak is partying away.  Wonder why Deepak doesn't have a girlfriend?  He has to hang out with the pimps in order to find companionship? Who was driving that night? 

Hey Joran!  The Kalpoes are living their lives on Aruba and where are you?  Hiding in Thailand?  LMAO!! 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: San on August 03, 2008, 09:40:07 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)

That's such a shame that he has to bring his nurse with him everywhere he goes, poor thing.
              ::MonkeyNoNo::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: That will be his defense when Dr. Phil see this picture.  She is not my GF she is my nurse  ::MonkeyHaHa::


I guess some people tolerate guilt better than others.  Satish is subdude and Deepak is partying away.  Wonder why Deepak doesn't have a girlfriend?   He has to hang out with the pimps in order to find companionship? Who was driving that night? 

Hey Joran!  The Kalpoes are living their lives on Aruba and where are you?  Hiding in Thailand?  LMAO!! 


Have you looked at Deepak  ::MonkeyHaHa::  He's a skank.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 10:25:09 AM
I guess Satish is feeling better now too!  ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyNoNo::
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mexican_Night___Senor_Frogs__97_.jpg)

That's such a shame that he has to bring his nurse with him everywhere he goes, poor thing.
              ::MonkeyNoNo::
I thought it's probably a cousin!   ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 03, 2008, 10:35:22 AM
Glad the sitemeter is back.

   
Bangkok, Krung Thep in the house  :smt039


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 03, 2008, 11:38:40 AM
Is that Armin with a new band?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn6hk0kFxw4


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 03, 2008, 11:47:44 AM
Hi BB.  I bet Jorans really getting lonely by now.  Everyone needs a home base.  I bet he would give anything to be back in his own room on Aruba.  I know he must miss his brothers.  He probably puts on a good show for his new found friends, but when the lights go out and he is all alone with his thoughts, you know he must be terrified. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 03, 2008, 11:56:48 AM
Hi BB.  I bet Jorans really getting lonely by now.  Everyone needs a home base.  I bet he would give anything to be back in his own room on Aruba.  I know he must miss his brothers.  He probably puts on a good show for his new found friends, but when the lights go out and he is all alone with his thoughts, you know he must be terrified. 

.......we can only hope. But I am glad to see the the K's out partying and drinking(DK seemed to have one of those "yard" glasses in his hand). What is it they say about loose lips......they will be their own demise.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 03, 2008, 12:08:44 PM
Yes, Im amazed they havenet talked after all this time. 


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on August 03, 2008, 01:06:12 PM
Yes, Im amazed they havenet talked after all this time. 

I think the fact that no one has talked sums up the attitude of Aruba.  I believe there are many people that know what happened, but they are never going to tell the truth.  I think that is the "culture" of Aruba.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Buckeye on August 03, 2008, 01:06:26 PM
Update on K2/Phil case:

07/29/2008 Stipulation (to Continue the Hearing on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

07/29/2008 Order (Re: Stipulation of the Parties to Continue the Ruling on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

Future Hearings

08/05/2008 at 08:30 am in department 69 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Motion to Dismiss (2) Case Management Conference3) Motion to Strike ComplaintCONTINUED TO 8-28-08 PURSUANT TOSTIP & ORDER FILED ON 7-29-08)


Not sure what the Stipulation and Order from 7/29 state.   :smt102


http://www.lasuperiorcourt.org/civilCaseSummary/index.asp?CaseType=Civil


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 03, 2008, 01:20:04 PM
Update on K2/Phil case:

07/29/2008 Stipulation (to Continue the Hearing on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

07/29/2008 Order (Re: Stipulation of the Parties to Continue the Ruling on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

Future Hearings

08/05/2008 at 08:30 am in department 69 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Motion to Dismiss (2) Case Management Conference3) Motion to Strike ComplaintCONTINUED TO 8-28-08 PURSUANT TOSTIP & ORDER FILED ON 7-29-08)


Not sure what the Stipulation and Order from 7/29 state.   :smt102


http://www.lasuperiorcourt.org/civilCaseSummary/index.asp?CaseType=Civil


They're still gonna lose. They just wasted more money, and put

the final F. BOMB off for 30 more days!

Keep wasting that money losers!!!!!!

I love watching your raping murdering family go bankrupt faster.

It makes me all warm and fuzzy!


(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/FGHFHGFHFGH.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 03, 2008, 01:24:10 PM
(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/F1EREW.png)

 ::MonkeyTongue::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 03, 2008, 01:26:58 PM
Carpe, dont mince words, sweetie, just come out and say whats on your mind (two XXXX heads) hahahahahahahahahahahahaha


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 01:50:30 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mambo_13.jpg)
Looks like somebody got the wrong drink!  ::MonkeyWink::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Pita on August 03, 2008, 01:56:42 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mambo_13.jpg)
Looks like somebody got the wrong drink!  ::MonkeyWink::

 ::MonkeyLaugh::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 03, 2008, 02:01:18 PM
Carpe, dont mince words, sweetie, just come out and say whats on your mind (two XXXX heads) hahahahahahahahahahahahaha


Hi Always 1!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 02:07:39 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Frog_42.jpg)
Anybody know who the blonde is?  I have a thought...but not sure.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 03, 2008, 02:07:52 PM
Hello, Carpe!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 02:15:49 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesFrog_101.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesnormal_1792TEQUILLLAA1_.jpg)


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: truthseeker2 on August 03, 2008, 02:20:03 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesFrog_101.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesnormal_1792TEQUILLLAA1_.jpg)

Who is this guy?


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: carpe noctem on August 03, 2008, 02:26:27 PM
 ::MonkeyDance::


Jerry Jerry Dingleberry IN DA HOWWWWWWZEEEEE!!!



Heyyyyy!      Hoooooooo!


Everybody say:   S-P-E-C-I-A-L !!!!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Nut44x4 on August 03, 2008, 02:28:08 PM
Cheremy Croes/Jerry Strawberry


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 02:28:54 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesFrog_101.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesnormal_1792TEQUILLLAA1_.jpg)

Who is this guy?
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/QMPD97235/CheremySteveSketch.jpg)
Cheremy Croes aka Jerry Strawberry or something like that, lol....possible suspect in an attack on a tourist by the fisherman's huts in 2005 (sketch released at that time); also believed to be a relative of Steve Croes.  JMO


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: texasmom on August 03, 2008, 02:32:01 PM
::MonkeyDance::


Jerry Jerry Dingleberry IN DA HOWWWWWWZEEEEE!!!



Heyyyyy!      Hoooooooo!


Everybody say:   S-P-E-C-I-A-L !!!!
::MonkeyHaHa:: Yeah he's special alright!  I can't imagine having tequilla poured down my throat knowing he's around!  ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: Lala'sMom on August 03, 2008, 03:53:44 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesFrog_101.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesnormal_1792TEQUILLLAA1_.jpg)

Who is this guy?
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/QMPD97235/CheremySteveSketch.jpg)
Cheremy Croes aka Jerry Strawberry or something like that, lol....possible suspect in an attack on a tourist by the fisherman's huts in 2005 (sketch released at that time); also believed to be a relative of Steve Croes.  JMO

Well their noses look similar.  ::MonkeyCool::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: bleachedblack on August 03, 2008, 04:32:31 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mambo_13.jpg)
Looks like somebody got the wrong drink!  ::MonkeyWink::

OMG  His tongue is turning purple, quick someone check for a pulse........no pulse.......no respirations.........starting CPR.....one and two and three


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 03, 2008, 04:40:59 PM
Yes, Im amazed they havenet talked after all this time. 

I think the fact that no one has talked sums up the attitude of Aruba.  I believe there are many people that know what happened, but they are never going to tell the truth.  I think that is the "culture" of Aruba.

the standard excuse for cowardice on the island is "we have to live here." 
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 03, 2008, 04:42:38 PM
Update on K2/Phil case:

07/29/2008 Stipulation (to Continue the Hearing on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

07/29/2008 Order (Re: Stipulation of the Parties to Continue the Ruling on Defendants' Second Motion to Dismiss and Motion to Compel and Hearing on Defendant's Motion to Strike )
Filed by Attorney for Plaintiff/Petitioner

Future Hearings

08/05/2008 at 08:30 am in department 69 at 111 North Hill Street, Los Angeles, CA 90012
Motion to Dismiss (2) Case Management Conference3) Motion to Strike ComplaintCONTINUED TO 8-28-08 PURSUANT TOSTIP & ORDER FILED ON 7-29-08)


Not sure what the Stipulation and Order from 7/29 state.   :smt102


http://www.lasuperiorcourt.org/civilCaseSummary/index.asp?CaseType=Civil
Thanks Buckeye,looks like more continuationssssssss.
Welcome back Destiny!


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 03, 2008, 04:43:22 PM



(http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w214/iliketoN0KTEM/FGHFHGFHFGH.jpg)
[/quote]

what was it jvds called them in the tapes?
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 03, 2008, 04:45:39 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mambo_13.jpg)
Looks like somebody got the wrong drink!  ::MonkeyWink::

 :smt078 :smt030 :smt021 :gaah:


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: KarmaRoundUp on August 03, 2008, 04:48:25 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesFrog_101.jpg)

(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/CheremyCroesnormal_1792TEQUILLLAA1_.jpg)
Good Lord!This is the strangest,creepyest guy....my eyes....my EYES! ::MonkeyEek::


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: dennisintn on August 03, 2008, 04:50:30 PM
(http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/texasmom_55/Mambo_13.jpg)
Looks like somebody got the wrong drink!  ::MonkeyWink::

OMG  His tongue is turning purple, quick someone check for a pulse........no pulse.......no respirations.........starting CPR.....one and two and three

bb, don't you know that the proper thing to do on aruba is "shake the b----", jvds got away with using that method so it must be standards first aid.
dennisintn


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: klaasend on August 03, 2008, 04:53:56 PM
Been hanging out over in the Caylee thread and missed all these new photos.  I see Cheromy is back on the party scene  ::MonkeyWink::

Not sure who the blonde is, she doen't resemble anyone I know of.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22
Post by: always 1 on August 03, 2008, 04:58:17 PM
WE miss you over here Klaasend.


Title: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22