Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

You all know the rules

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/InHonorofNatalee.jpg)

Klaas, hope we didn't ruin dinner.

Klaas you snuck that one in there :lol:

Carried over my response to NM.

NM wrote:
Sorry Klaas. Let me help out now.


Hi SAN,
http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?t=2823&start=940
Chicago_510
I found a record of the death of a Paul van Rijn on October 20, 2001. His wife's name was listed as Astrid van Rijn-Traskel. I then found an Astrid Louise van Rijn-Traskel who was registered to vote in Aruba for 2005-2006. I have her address, it is in Savaneta.

I believe someone verified that Lorenzo's father was Paul van Rijn.

San wrote:

Thank you NM.

I remember reading that Lorenzo's real father was Paulus Van der Sloot. Paulus probably has kids all over that island.

This is going to sound mean but I am questioning how his father died.
_________________

Got my tail caught in the door again  :lol:

Hi San,
me too, now that we know there really isn't anything such as homoside in aruba, they are all considered suicide.
wonder what Klaas is making us for dinner? I'm hungry. 8)

Thanks Klaasend...

Now It's time I try the home style chicken & noodle  with corn bread
(NO... Not from a can  either :wink: )

SeeYaLater

I know. The door hit my fosted flakes and I'm still trying to put them back together :lol:

something strange to the process of taking A.Jones statement, they don't appear to ask him what/where he was May 30 midnight-AM?

I guess this futher explains why the real suspects give no information in their statements.

Hi Monkeys,

Hope your cornbread and chicken noodles are good Old Fart.

I did not bother reading the last few pages of the last LCD thread but from what we heard early on was that Lorenzo's father committed suicide and that Lorenzo went off the deep end after that.

It does sound like there is an awful lot of suicide on One Happy Island.

Maybe that is why Jacobs(?) was busy with them instead of talking to Beth?  He got his tail caught in something???

Evening monkeys.  I see we are still discussing the elusive Lorenzo.  That is one of my favorite subjects too.  So what have we decided?  Has anyone seen Tylergal lately?  She could contribute to this discussion.

Hi Sam..

You missed my joke then  :cry:   You ready for the cooler weather ?

I just hope Garrison has managed to come up with someone / something with substance.

Good eve. Monkeys,

 I asked this earlier, but no response.  Any idea if Jossy might know of the 3 suspects?  I would just be curious if he knows and/or gave info. to Larry.   Just thinking....

Well Old Fart, I liked your joke.
I also heard about that picture taken that night. heard, not seen.
Where was Steve Croes that night ?
.
The elusive mysterious Lorenzo Van R. is rumored to be friends with Max Arendns. My rumors from ages ago were that there are two Max Arends / Max Arendz. One is older and one is younger. One does racing for a hobby and is friends with the elusive Mr. Van R. There is a younger one who graduated from ISA a year before the notorious Mr. Van Der Sloot and he went to Florida. To go to school. His father's name is Booshi. Not to be confused with any other Booshis we have met. One of the Lorenzo's nicknames is Renzo. But don't ask which one, because I do not know.
.
Problem : Too many people with the same names or versions of the same names.
The source for some of the above is the trustworthy Scubajap person who always knows all and tells all.  
.
I would not be surprised if the elusive L. Van R. got pulled into this because of his association with the awful looking Steve Croes. Although Steve Croes shares the name with Rudy, they are not to be confused with Marianne Croes who alos works in Rudy's office or something like that, even thought it is rumored that Ms. Marianne Croes had a dolly named Lorenzo.
Hope this is helpful.

I found Abraham Jones statement very interesting. Especially the part where he said Mickey Johns hangs out at the casinos  hoping to meet the tourist.

 Now I want to see Mickey Johns statement. Do we have that one on hand Klaas?  I know you can only do so much translating. I just wanted to know if it is available.

NM I seem to remember someone saying recently that the Van Rijn residence is for sale. The moms home.

Well I'm going to come right out and say this the only way I know how.  Might he gone off the deep end because he had something to do with his death.  Is this another crime covered up for one of Paulus' sons.

Shoot, all single male Arubans hang out at the hotels looking to hook up with tourists.

That is because Astrid remarried.
Jeeze, I am the gossip monger tonight aren't I ?

I doubt if Jossy is the source.

Who actually told us about Lorenzo being Paulus son?  Does anyone remember?  Did one of our monkeys not ask Jossy one night on Dana's show about Lorenzo?  Does anyone remember the answer he gave?

Do you think he knows anything about these new developments?

Or I should say know anything more specific than the rest of us.

Hi Dihannah,

I'm not sure if Jossy knows or not.  I would love for Jossy to be the one to crack this case just to stuff it down Joe Tacopina's throat.

Kat_Gram
Picture... what Picture... and
Helpful..  Yes..  I think... You want to help put the corn flake puzzle together?  That is what this case i like...

No true picture of what happened to work to wards..
No defining edges to work in from ..
A few extra pieces that do not belong..
A a lot where their shape has been kinda changed ..
And of course the missing parts  :wink: [/b]

Jossy said that that was the rumor. See, on Aruba there are no facts.
And it wasn't ME who started that rumor about Lorenzo being the son of Paulus.

Old Fart, No I am not ready for cooler weather I want summer to last a few more months, maybe until December 20th. LOL

Kat Gram, I remember being online here at SM the day Max Arends was taken in for questioning and it was reported on here. Aruba girl was on at the same time and she said something like "Oh my God, My brother. I am out of here" Later she came back and said it was a different Max.

And, Lorenzo would have been born before Paulus arrived in Aruba. ( 1991 ).

Yes, that would be awesome!  Icing on the cake!

IIRC  Jossy said something like "We have heard that he may be the son of Paulis"   ie.. we have heard the RUMOR

Where it came from.. ???

I just pray this isn't another 2 weeks of waiting for another let down. I've been a way for awhile, only to come back to some hope.  Please let this be it!

Arubagirl said her mother told her it was rumored Lorenzo was Paulus's illegitimate son.

Lalasmom, I originally heard the lorenzo, Paulus rumor on RWV. Very early in the case. Then on here when it was brought up Aruba girl asked her Mom and her Mom said yes the rumor was true.

Well I believe it.

Hmmm. it is all very confusing, isn't it and that was the point I was making. But I did read the ISA thing naming a Max Arend ? who graduated in 2004. That was before they took the 2005 schedule away because it did not show that there were any tests that critical first week.
It would be easier to make a tiger out of frosted flakes at this point.

Me, too.

What if..... Jacobs is Renfro's spouse/significant other?

Lorenzo is said to have been born in Holland

(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a306/klaasend/aglorenzorumor.gif)

Then, there was a guy with dark blonde dreads whose picture was posted as being Lorenzo Van R. He was also in a picture of the opening of the Sextacy Shop.

I guess I should have said Arubagirl said her Mom had said that had always been the rumor.

Wouln't it be great if we could phone them and just ask them ?
 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Old Fart :
And of course the missing parts  [/b]
OMG, those are the ones Dennis Jacobs ate ! !

Oh my did our own dear Klaas blow the margins bringing that old post in here? Oh well she will fix it I am sure.

I did not see BLOWN margins...  pooched out a little...yes
How long has she been taking & saving screen shots ??


and if your read DJTALOR'S post there is nothing there to indicate (sorry to say this) that Natalee was alive.  Only moved from house to house.

Which very well may have happened.  More time to get the Ducks lined up and things taken care of.
JMO of course

For some reason I don't want to picture this :lol:

There was a poster here a while ago nik " Tony " . He seemed to know these people... in the flesh. But I don't know what ever happened to him.

I do remember hearing the rumor about some of Natalees belongings being found in LVR's house. I wish we knew if any of the rumors are true.

Tony was posting on the front page of SM mostly.  This was his first post as far as I know back on April 28, 2006:

Tony wrote:

I am the one who sold the pictures to the daily news of SC and FA, I am

the former cruise ship waiter who knows the seaports as well as anyone, I

worked for 5 years onboard in the caribbean. I have rented the hookers and

gone to the underbelly for drugs many times. I have many dutch friends

and many island friends. Here are some things that stick out to me:
Drunk drivers never get caught on the first trip home, pedophiles have the

worst recitvism of any criiminal, prostitution and drugs are run and owned

by people with GREAT wealth it is never the poor.
Joran is the epitome of a spoiled, lying, drinking ,gambling adult by his own

admission.
Where are your shoes Joran from that night? Nobody walks home barefoot

in Aruba!
I saw you enjoying the choking you gave your brother with your belt.
I saw you humping at least 5 girls at C&Cs, all foreigners.
You are addicted to the 4 vices all of us are offered in life, Drinking

,gambling, drugs and Porn/sex.
You know FA made that tape and was trying to launch his own porn label.

You were there.
She told you she was a virgin, you had to pass her on because of that didn’t you? That made you mad. You never should have told.
Did the K2 boys get mad when she asked if they were your slaves?
How is your soccer buddy (K)? Do you miss him?
SC, K2, FA and MD are your pals along with the BL gang, and kj , big D and vs are the protectors, we will never meet the owners, they dont live like us.
I have all the pictures from the early days.
Where is your mom now? She knows about you and your dads vices
I dont see the hugs and kisses anymore.
I know you like biting and choking and you are not a lover, you are a user , you use them up like toothpaste and then you spit them out.

Come get me Joe T, I am already in NY waiting.

You are now alone in this world.

Here is a picture of both Max's
http://i5.tinypic.com/40dkifl.jpg

Tickle Sites:
Max Arends
http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=CNa5zSTuHtklx-cL
Max Arendsz
http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=H48F2zphZoS1Kyen

Jossy doesn't know who they are talking about.  And the person who told us first about Lorenzo and Paulus was Arubagirl.  She starts the post off with, "don't flame me" but.......This is what I heard.  And yes, his moms house is for sale.  Sorry if anyone answered this all yet.

O/T

What ever happened to Beachwego?

The one that was brought in for questioning was Max Arends.  He took off for Florida for school right after.

So we were told by AG that her mom said Lorenzo was rumored to be Paulus son.  If he was born in Holland, then could all this have happened before Paulus came to Aruba?

Yes Klaas show the post on page 2.

Lorenzo's mom had an affair with Paulus before he was married to Anita.  This would be 26 years ago.  Paulus' moves to Aruba with his new family and so does Lorenzo and his mom I guess.

Lorenzo, his Mom and Dad. Remember he was raised by Paul Van Rijn.

Klaasend
And the rest of the Monkeys
Sorry for being more Off Topic tonight than I should be..  One of those days.  will make into LaLa's book again..  Sigh..   BUT

Could you, Red Or Tom  (Where the heck has ScaredTom been) give baby a burp.  It is like it had Banya Calda(?) tonight.
Which IIRC is  something close to this:

"Put 1 stick of butter and about 8-10  cloves of minced garlic in a pan & lightly brown (DO NOT BURN the garlic!)  add small can or just or part of can  of anchovies (NOT paste). Stir...Stir...Stir till they dissolve.
Add about 1 pint to 1 quart of half and half or even better i~~ "CREAM" . Simmer and Stir...Stir...Stir to  Let thicken...thicken...thicken..  

Put in a bowl and dip Italian bread or raw vegies.. esp. cabbage leaves
into"  

Breath mints / mouth wash will NOT help... Only time will :wink:

Off to find a blanket for tonight...

Klaas are you absolutley positive? I thought it was the older one. The race car driver who was a friend of Lorenzo and did his alibi for him.

I know that Sam but I find it strange that he winds up on the same island as Paulus.  Wouldn't you want to distance yourself from him.  Especially if this kid thinks this other guy is his father.  I guess Paulus wanted to keep his Killer Klan together.

Just dashing in here for a moment ... I never trusted Arubagirl. Didn't you Monkeys say that she was one of those paid by the government to join boards and promote Aruba?  

I never trusted Rob either, by the way.

I'm sad.  I've been gone awhile, but I come back and the cage is echoing with emptiness....  I see some faithful monkeys who never leave, God Bless 'em.  But it's too quiet, even with the new developments.  

I miss the full cage...   :cry:

I'm going to bed now.  I pray for good news in the next couple weeks and all the monkeys back!

I miss everybody!  Good night and sweet dreams! xoxoxo

From the poster from BFN:
"They are afaird of these 3 mystery suspects being a flight risk because they are no longer living in Dutch territory."


Could the 3 mystery suspects be Koen, Sander & their Father who are rumored to have left Aruba and moved to the USA (Atlanta, GA)?  Maybe there is truth to the before dawn boat ride.

oldfart said (on the last thread - before I could react  :? ):



Showoff.  :wink:

Dihannah1. I too, just recently checked into the cage after being away a long time. I echo your sentiments.

Dihannah1, we all miss the full cage.  I have been here daily but do not always log in...just read, especially if I don't have anything to contribute.  

Louise, as for AG, I always respected her posts....Red may know more, since he was with her when he helped in Aruba....I cannot judge.  As for Rob, we didn't bond here, and I just observed.

San

I could be completley wrong on this. I have no proof at all but I think the Van Rijns could be the ones who moved to one crappy Island first. The business opportunity of maybe being the first Volkswagon dealer in the area. They were the ones who seem to have more money, judging by her house and Lorenzos .

Old Fart you deserve to sleep , Maybe outside. Especially for smelling up the house with the anchovies.

Nite Dihannah

Dihannah
The case is about ineptness  which leads to emptiness at times..
keep the faith that we will get or make a break and then it will be back to
 (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/Mmonkey-pile-_10770.gif)

JMO of course

Interesting cast of characters:
K=Koen
SC=Steve Croes
K2=Deepak & Satish
FA= Freddy Arambatzis
MD=Michael Dompig
BL gang=Biba Lekker gang
KJ=Karin Jannsen
Big D=Dompig
VS=van Straaten

Hmmmmm.....I've wondered about Dompig.  He seemed to be a friend and a foe to the investigation.  Like a chameleon, he changed when the situation warranted it.  I think Dompig was actually a hindrance to the investigation b/c he was trying to protect his nephews as well as his own son.

Thank you Sam.

Well, what I'm absolutely sure about is that Max Arends, the younger one is friends with Joran, Koen, Freddy, Jaime etc.

We were also told by Peeps from the race car place that it was not Max Arendz.  Now it's very possible that the older one "Arendz" knows Lorenzo.  I do not think he was the one who was brought in for questioning though.  Admittedly, I'm not positive of anything.  :wink:

Abraham Jones  6/5

"I was not threatened, maltreated or anyhow promised something or given to me to give this statement."

 :?: ALE being a little defensive here. I don't recall similar wording being in any of the other statements. Does ALE have a history of threats, maltreatment and bribes? Or false arrests?

Sun, interesting interpretation of the initials.  You know, the first thing I thought of for the "Big D" was "Big Daddy" referring to Paulus van der Sloot.  Maybe he does mean Dompig, but my first thought was "Big Daddy" being Paulus.

Louise
Good to see ya.. even for just a moment.
As far as your comments about  former posters....
I still carry this into ever site (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/6e101d32.jpg)

Posters sometimes seem to change over time for what ever reason.
Those that do I look hard at when they said something.. not the last few things that they said..

Just because I have people in my life that try not to be in the same room with.. does not mean it was always that way.

I hope this make since..

Take care.. and pop in more often..
OldF

2NJSons_ Mom,
 I also liked and trusted arubagirl. She was a little on the sensitive side when she thought we were badmouthing her country. When we were really just critisizing some of the players in her country.

We get the same way when we are thought of as Ugly Americans.

I did check the civil and criminal records on both Max Arendsz and Max Arends for both Dade and Broward Counties ( Miami / Plantation / Ft. Lauderdale )

Nothing of interest.   There was more to the story with this younger Arends.  I will see what I can find, something regarding a hotel room?  or provided an alibi for Lorenzo that night.

Also something that should be noted is neither Max nor Lorenzo or Guido are on the list of 21 character witnesses presented by Tacopina in the NY civil suit.

I find it hard to believe Tacopina would call Freddy, Koen, Sander, the Santos brothers or the rest if in fact there was any potential they may have been involved in the physical crime and kidnapping that was the basis for the Civil suit.  Perhaps I should not assume that...

Very smart, OF.  I wish we had the old archives from the summer of 05 as they would be very revealing.  People said things the first two weeks that were quite revealing, but I can't recall all of it.  I do remember a poster at Trip Advisor who talked about a boat ride that Natalee took at 3:15 AM, but I can't remember the exact wording and I don't have it anymore.  Very sadly, much early stuff was lost.

What I found interesting is that Michael Dompig was on Joran's character witness list.  I thought the Kalpoes were Dompigs cousins through his wife's side.

I had heard Lorenzo was in the Netherlands?  The Van Rijn's also had an import export business as well as the VW dealership.  I also noticed there was a Van Rijn Go Karts in the Aruba or Curacao Commerce registries.  

Astrid Van Rijn Van Traksel is Lorenzo's mother.

Wasn't it something like why don't you ask Joran about the boat ride he took that night.

I am guessing ALE insisted on collecting that promise before AJ could pass Go ...

I'm off to bed, too.  I do check in and read here daily, even if I don't post.  I want you all to know that I and many others are still keeping the faith.  I feel like we are in a holding pattern--waiting and watching.  Aruba needs to know we won't go away, and we won't stop searching.  We're here--watching and waiting.  We will have justice for Natalee.  See ya, Monkeys.

AZLady, Nice to see you.

Now I wondered if big D could be Dennis Jacobs. We certainly know he fits the description of big plus he seems to be the one doing all the interviews.

Now with that I am calling it a night.

Just kind of stands out as a red flag, doesn't it.

San, if I recall, it was why don't you ask her about the drink she had at 3:15 and the 2 1/2 mile boat ride.  But as I said, I don't have the exact wording anymore (maybe Klaas has it).

Goodnight all you sleepy monkeys...sweet dreams.

Yep, I also noted that.  I did exchange 1 email with Michael.  My instincts are that he was not involved atleast that night.  If anything him or more likely his father is deep throat, although I don't necessary believe that.  I really am not counting on anything or anyone breaking this case open so to speak.  Whether that be the Dutch team who will likely never arrive, or this deep throat character.   I will hope for the best and in the meantime remain diligent in my personal pursuit of truth along with all you wonderful people!

I wonder if Osman Osman knows the older Max and Lorenzo.

I said interviews but meant witness statements. Night all.

For some odd reason, that post has haunted me ever since the summer of 05.  It was an Aruban who posted it, I feel sure, and it had a belligerant, challenging tone to it.  I think he/she was trying to say something important, and it always seemed very odd to me.

SunFreak2 - If you're still here - I posted a question for you on the Murder & Crime thread. I imagine it's on Page 4 I. When you think of it, go over there and see if you know the answer!

(Off hand I don't remember what it was, but think it has to do with one or two assaults on women ...)

Monkeys - If you haven't read this Murder & Crime thread - see my sig line. An impressive collection of mayhem on the happy island.

Thanks AZLady.  Have a good night.

Yea, the Gardener was worried about "passing Go" also. Avoiding ALE, no matter the situation, appears a priority on the island.

Astrids Import/Export area.  I believe about 10 feet tall.... It's huge when you look in

OOPS here it is
(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h294/gummy_2006/astridwallw.jpg)

Yo, Hotshot. Don't think we've crossed threads lately ...

Hotshot - what the heck is that? a fence? gate? optical illusion?

How ya been?  Yes I have a few minutes tonight....Hey Larry Garrison is  on showbiz next.

AZ
I remember what you are talking about ... I put into the REUMOR class / one of the possilbe things that may have happend. (SALT applied 1st)

As far the rest.. of my post..
WE cannot look each other in the eye when talking ..(sometimes we do not want to).  Trust  comes very slowly at times.
If and when that trust becomes doubted does not mean  things were NOT true earlier? It's not a given.. you need to look back.
Not sure if this make since..  but I hope it does.

Astrids import/Export business

With your rental rear-view mirror in the pix? Seriously, I was imagining a shop/store. Is it an outdoor thing? it looks like a fence rather than a building. (Sorry, maybe I'm not "seeing" right ... )

oldfart - you're showing off again. First it's mathematical gymnastics, then it's philosophy. (Guess that's why you get to be oldfart  :wink:  )

(http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h191/Kat_Gram/lorenzo.jpg)
Who is this ?
Is this Brandon ? Is this Lorenzo ? Is this a Nobody ?

No I don't but that sounds about right to me.  It's probably copied somewhere though.  Back in early June I didn't think to copy things unfortunately.  That post was deleted very soon that same day from the TripAdvisor site it was posted on.  I was there when it was posted though.

Brandon Piertze (sp)

I would have thought that tthe BIG D was Dennis Jacobs...

The sign says:

prohibited access for unauthorized persons

Thank you Klaasend ! !

Larry Garrison didn't mentioned anything on Showbiz Tonight about the NH case.

Is this the one referring to something like who gave her the poison wine at 3:15 and something about the boat ride?  I may be combining it with one of the riddlers on the drink of Bacchus.  That is what some of us took to possibly be absinthe and were pounded for saying, etc. in spite of one of the junior Pimps posing holding a fifth of the stuff which is illegal in this country.

But I may be combining two different posts with this.

.

.

Good evening, Igs,

Well most certainly they have such a history and also an embarrassing ruling AGAINST them in the World Court for their flagrant abuse of Alex Matthews who was also a black prisoner.  They built the state of the art KIA to off-set the fact he was kept for months in a cell with only a part of a roof and in solitary I forget for how long but was unconscionable amount of time.

He alleged they drugged him and then beat him putting him in a wheelchair much of the time he was jailed.  Supposedly he was skilled at kick boxing and had inflicted some sort of injury to Ben Vocking was their reason for doing so.  

Perhaps they now require this disclaimer from all black people or it may well be a requirement of the court that they have it as well.  

But there is no racism on One Happy Island,  8)

MsMarple
I get to be an Oldfart by feeling like one  :wink:

San, what channel is Showbiz Tonight on?

Hi Anna. How goes Murder & Mayhem? I'm working on something for Dr. Rice. I'm mad as H.

MsMarple - Hadicurari is the name of the beach where the fisherman's huts are located just north of the Marriott Resort. That incident would be the same as the Tracy Allen incident.

Thats why we were getting looks from the neighbors....LOL

I, too, remember this....it was either copied here in the forum....or front page.  I know I read it more than once, especially the boat ride part.  It's archived in captivity... :(

Klaas, it says Headline Prime Channel 37 in NY.  It's the same channel Nancy Grace is on.

Thanks SunFreak.

Well, hopefully we'll be getting some of that archived stuff back.   :wink:

Thanks, Red was asking  :lol:

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

Count me in as someone who reads this board daily but does not always log in or say anything. I think many of us have been and continue to be here for the long haul.

.
MsMarple,
Yes and daily the crimes mount on crime-free Aruba.  Notice they no longer say that as they did in the past but say it is one of the safest in the area.  Considering the area has one of the highest crime rates in the world, that is not nearly as impressive as their former claims of no crime at all.

I have not had time to write anybody lately but have not forgotten.  Not going to just let it rest.  They lied and lied badly and they know they lied and they know we now know they lied because they are lying liars.   :evil:

Yet they have the nerve to fault parents for allowing their children to go to a place where the government has assured us is totally crime free.  It would make me think my children would be safer than here at home in the U.S. where we have the reputation for having a much higher crime rate than we actually do.  We are very quick to 'fess up to crime and we also count as a crime things many countries do not consider a crime or it is not one there, not being illegal.

When you factor in that more things are a crime here (prostitution, porn of certain types, gambling in most areas, certain drugs that are not illegal elsewhere, on and on) for sure we are going to have higher number of crimes.  When very little is illegal, makes for almost no crime but when much is regulated, naturally the count will be higher.  Anti-Americans love to pounce on this non-argument and cite it being totally ignorant of the counting methods.

But claiming no crime does lure parents into thinking their children safe.  If nothing bad ever happens to anybody then they would think their own child safe as well.  That is just so wrong and then to turn on the parents AFTER the fact should not be allowed.

We will do what we can to call attention to this fact.  Perhaps someone will listen to use eventually especially if all the monkeys help us as they are doing.

.

I know Shell, sometimes it's hard when there's really nothing new.  Plus it's just been so long.   :cry:

But I'm not ready to give up yet!!!!

Me too Shell.  I'm here until the end.

Nite San

Nite San

Anna - Here's a challenge for you: Compose a sentence that uses a form of the verb "lie" as every other word.  :lol:

How did you miss ending with " ... known lying liars" ???

Where are the lyin' eyes?

Seriously - I think even with their own arrogance, claiming "no crime" would be a shot in their foot. (feet?)

.
 8)  8)  8)

Sometimes I post things to (http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/stirthepot.gif) and see what the reaction is.

.

.
Well, that claim of one murder in the last twenty years came from somewhere and I would think just maybe ATA or AHATA?  Whomever has been giving out the false crime stats should be held accountable in some way.

.
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a360/AnnaBlueSkies/21bsq4z_th.gif)

But there again, in some cultures, lying is considered clever and there is no moral stigma attached to doing it.  So they lied then when something bad happens to our Natalee say she should have known better.  Go figure?  Should she have known they were lying?

And as for some commenting on our former posters from Aruba, I think some were more truthful than others but all had the agenda of defending Aruba and promoting it first and foremost and that includes before finding justice for Natalee.  Some of the things we were told were not truthful while others seem to have been.  

Just my opinion on that.

.

I recall it being something like; "Ask Joran Van Der Sloot about the drink he gave her at 3:15 and the boat ride they took...."

LOL Anna

Regarding Alex Matthews, et al...

Can you imagine Carlos the Gardener going up against Carlo, Swaen, Paulus and his judge buddies? No wonder he kept on having to relieve himself.

Anna - You think Mr. Grossman (USAToday) would cough up where he got that "1 in 20 years" notion?

That's OK, Klaas, I get plenty of those in my email, unsolicited I might add.   :?

MisGivings - About your Location:



... but do the men?  8)  

(Sorry, I just now noticed it.) One of my daughters just got back from a physicians' confab somewhere in Ohio ... for some reason, a big-time hospital/medical industry there?

We are currently getting major rain here.
We have Ohio State Medical Hospitals and Clinics, which have great reputations, and there is The Cleveland Clinic which is nationally known.

msmarple is going off to read a bit of Dame Agatha Christie's Murder at the Vicarage - one of Miss Marple's finest hours ...

(Although my favorite Christie story is The Murder of Roger Akroyd, which features Hercule Poirot.)

.
MsMarple,
He cites it in the original USAToday article as being:

>Which city is more dangerous: Baghdad or Caracas, Venezuela? If your answer is Caracas, you are correct according to Dr. Peter E. Tarlow, an expert in crime, terrorism, and risk management in the travel industry. Though similar in population, Baghdad is on pace to have 7,000 murders this year, while 15,000 will be killed in Caracas.<

So perhaps we need to locate this Dr. Tarlow and proceed with his edification on the subject.  Grossman claims he is the expert the FBI and others within our own government reply upon for such information.

.

Anna - Ok, I'm going to put Dr. Peter E. Tarlow on my list of things to do. We need somebody like that - but he may have an agenda of his own.

Anna
 You sometimes stir the POT to see what sinks or floats !!
:shock: (http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c314/OldF/db212351.gif) :shock:

Headed under the blankets now (duckin & runnnin)

SeeeYaaaByeeeee

G'nite Monkeys

Okay, I've got him:

http://www.nhgsa.com/vpn/privatecenterinfo/TM'sTourismTidbits.htm

<end of this article:>
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Dr. Peter Tarlow
1218 Merry Oaks,
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Telephone: +1 (979) 764-8402.