Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

(http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/photo/2008-07/41057127.jpg)

Maybe I will be first this morning?

I shall return later. Please carry on and try to stay on topic. We DEMAND JUSTICE 4 CAYLEE!!!

(http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w25/jjh4/Monkey/MonkeyJumpingonBed.gif)

Repost from last thread:

I honestly don't think KC will be allowed at the funeral no matter what. They may stream it in for her to watch, but to allow her to attend would be a huge security risk to say the least. Even Kc understands this, she mentioned before that she feels safer in jail than she did when she was staying at her parents home.

With Christmas right around the corner, I really hope this hits Cindy and George hard that their granddaughter will not be coming home. Not to be evil, but I want them to fully understand what KC took away from them all, it's because her her that Caylee's stocking will go unfilled, no presents under the tree, no going to see Santa, no silly Christmas movies for her to dance around to. I want them to come clean about their killer daughter, not lie, not exaggerate, just tell the truth. KC needs to understand that she no longer has their support for murdering Caylee, she is no longer the center of their universe and removing Caylee from the equation didn't work

 ::MonkeyDance:: WOOHOOOOOO ANNA! WTG! lol.

RePost

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I'm off to do other things as well.  Thanks again to those posting updated news articles this morning.  You might want to put them in this thread for others joining later this morning?


.

Gosh, this thread change happened so fast!!!   ::MonkeyShocked::

Boo, i hope you caught my last post! AND ONE MORE TIME, GOOD MORNING ALL!!!!!



"Anna, you changed clothes"  ::MonkeyTongue::

Caylee's Skeletal Remains Don't Offer Many Clues to Her Homicide

 (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,469785,00.html)

Saturday, December 20, 2008
The skull and bones found last week in a wooded lot outside Orlando, Fla., were identified as Caylee Anthony's on Friday, and Orange County officials declared the little girl was the victim of a homicide.

How the 2-year-old girl was killed remains a mystery. Orange County medical examiner Dr. Jan Garavaglia reported that the skeletal remains were Caylee's, but the only clue to her death was that her bones didn't suffer trauma.

"They are not intact. They are all disarticulated. They are completely skeletonized," Dr. Garavaglia said. She said some of the bones were "tiny."

Caylee was two months shy of her third birthday when she vanished in June.

Garavaglia said Caylee's remains, which were found not far from the home where she lived with her mother and maternal grandparents, were identified through nuclear DNA analysis.

The news caps a five-month search for the girl, who was last seen in mid-June but wasn't reported missing by her mother until a month later. The mother, 22-year-old Casey Anthony, is behind bars without bond and charged with her daughter's murder.

Who's Who in the Caylee Anthony Homicide Case

The child's next of kin, including her mother; grandparents George and Cindy Anthony; and other relatives were notified of the findings before they were made public, according to Garavaglia.

"The bottom line is, no child should have to go through this," said Orange County Sheriff Kevin Beary, his voice breaking. He called it a police chief's "nightmare case."

The case has garnered intense national attention and media scrutiny. Federal authorities have assisted in the investigation.

As to the question of whether someone might have taken Caylee out of the Orlando area where she lived, the FBI said there wasn't any indication that was the case.

"At no time did we find any evidence that this young child left this location," said Tampa FBI Special Agent Steven Ibison.

Casey Anthony's lead attorney Jose Baez said he is "disappointed" with the way the investigation has been handled.

"It’s not a professional way of doing things. I’m extremely disappointed in the way that all this has been carried out," Baez told reporters.

He declined to comment on how his client reacted to the news that her daughter was found dead.

"This is her private moment. This is her life," he said. "It’s not my place as her attorney to disclose her private moments to the public. I’m sure that’s what she would want."

Cindy and George Anthony were "grieving deeply" in private, their attorney Brad Conway said, according to the Orlando Sentinel.

"This is a tragic moment in the lives of good and honorable people," Conway said.

Ahead of the announcement, Florida police released evidence photos from the scene where the remains were found. One showed a book discovered in the woods that the child had been photographed reading before she vanished.

The pictures were among several cops publicized before the afternoon news briefing.

The book is among numerous pieces of evidence Orange County Sheriff's deputies say they found in the wooded area where Caylee's remains turned up.

Also Friday, police re-interviewed a county water meter reader who earlier this month discovered a bag with the child's skull and bones inside.

Detectives said the worker is not a suspect in her death.

The worker who found the bones on Dec. 11 had called in a tip to police on three consecutive days in August, telling them to look in the same area for the remains.

"Back in August of this year, I had previously reported … that I had spotted something suspicious, a bag, in the same area," said the meter reader, Roy Kronk, reading from a prepared statement Friday.

He wouldn't elaborate.

"I will continue to cooperate fully with the investigation," Kronk told reporters. "I respectively decline to get into the details of what I saw at the crime scene."

His attorney, David Evans, called Kronk a "concerned citizen" and lambasted media speculation that suggested otherwise.

"He has no connection whatsoever to this case or to the Anthony family," Evans said.

Orange County Sheriff's officials say they believe he was in the area on Dec. 11 following up on his own lead when he discovered the bones and skull.

Capt. Angelo Nieves said police questioned the worker again, as well as the sheriff's deputy who took the original call. They want to know more about what prompted him to contact authorities and how they handled the tips.

The meter reader first called on Aug. 11 to report a bag by the side of the road, MyFOXOrlando.com reported. A deputy wasn't able to locate Kronk.

On Aug. 12, the meter reader called a crime hotline. The information was passed on to the Orange County Sheriff's criminal investigation division.

And on Aug. 13, the utility worker called cops a third time, MyFOXOrlando.com reported. He met with police, and a deputy went into the wooded area to investigate the Kronk's claims, but didn't find anything, the station said. The scene was then cleared as a possible place of interest in the case.

There is now an internal probe under way within the police department into how the matter was handled.

"There are a lot of questions about the thoroughness of that response," Nieves told MyFOXOrlando.com.
Investigators were at the wooded crime scene all week in an exhaustive dig for evidence. They said late Thursday they found additional bones that also appear to be from a child.

Caylee vanished on or around June 16, less than two months before her third birthday. Her family reported her missing in mid-July. Her mother has pleaded not guilty to first-degree murder, aggravated manslaughter and other charges.

A spokesman for Baez accused police of lying to the press and suggested they could be tampering with evidence at the site.

"Some of their comments are blatant lies," Todd Black told FOXNews.com. "History has shown that in some cases authorities have been caught tampering with evidence. That is something we hope is not happening. We're not accusing anyone of anything."

Anthony and her defense team have maintained that she last saw Caylee when she left her with a baby sitter named Zenaida Gonzalez in an apartment complex parking lot. Anthony's lawyers say Gonzalez and another woman drove away with the child.

Police claim that story and the sitter are fictitious and Anthony has lied to them repeatedly.

Black suggested last weekend that the defense would argue Caylee was killed by her purported kidnapper if the remains were identified as hers.

FOXNews.com's Catherine Donaldson-Evans and FOX News' Phil Keating contributed to this report.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

And I even changed my avatar in the meanwhile!

.

Yes, I did, Monken.  I do that from time to time.  Have lots and lots of dollz.  But today changes sigs with every post.  Can't figure out how she does that!

ORLANDO, Fla. (AP) � Remains found in the woods are the Florida 3-year-old who has been missing since June, and her death is considered a homicide, a county medical examiner said Friday.

DNA tests confirm that the remains match Caylee Anthony's genetic profile, said the medical examiner, Dr. Jan Garavaglia. A utility worker stumbled upon the remains last week, less than a half-mile from where the girl lived.

Caylee's mother, 22-year-old Casey Anthony, was indicted in October on first-degree murder and other charges, even though no body was found. She has insisted that she left the girl with a baby sitter in June, but she didn't report her missing until July.

A search team said they did not check the wooded area sooner because it was submerged in water.

http://www.legacy.com/OrlandoSentinel/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonId=121581033

You can also sign the legacy guestbook here....

http://www.legacy.com/GB2/ListViewPage.aspx?bookId=652956610025

me neither! I'm not that experienced yet!  ::MonkeyRoll::

This post Boo makes me think about something.In a small town just up the road from me,there was a murder several years ago.A man and wife and three kids.The kids were outside playing and the couple inside got into it.The man grabbed a plastic baseball bat and went to beating his wife with it.When it didn't do the damage he wanted he went and got a wooden one.He killed her while his children were playing outside.Her family decided it would be a good thing to let him see what he had done to her so right before the funeral,she was carried to the jail.He was brought out to have a look and all he did was smile,turn around and walk back into the jail.No response at all except for a smile.So sick!!!! I do not think Casey will be allowed to attend but stranger things have happened...

I use this site for my signature rotation (random images)
http://www.cgispy.com

goodnight everyone, I better get to bed.
Praying for Caylee and justice.  Nite monkeys, have a good day, and hug your kids and love them. 

'Nite Lucinda.  ::MonkeyCool::

Hey, Thanks, Today!!!  ::MonkeyWink::

Good Night, Lucinda!!!

http://www.cfnews13.com/
Corrections Dept Reacts To Baez Comments

Jail spokesman Allan Moore says Jose's comments and this type of behavior wins him no favors from the jail ::MonkeyHaHa::

Allan Moore also said he will ask the court to deny Casey's request to attend Caylee's funeral.

Medical Examiner Says Caylee Anthony Was Murdered.
http://www.wftv.com/news/18318370/detail.html

Sweetest dreams Lucinda!!!

Okay everyone! Now that we know for a fact where Casey dumped Caylee's body; what in the hell was she doing in all those remote locations we tracked on all the cellphone pings maps!!! Does anyone have any ideas of what she was doing out there in the middle of the night? Looking for alternate dump spots? Meeting clients? Drug transactions? WHAT, WHAT, WHAT??????!!!!!!  ::MonkeyNoNo::

Nighty nite friend, sweet dreams and be warm. It is 8 degrees here, snow is falling and wind is blowing.

Baez is such a putz.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

HELL YEAH!!!!!  ::MonkeyDance::

So much time and effort was put into the cell phone pings and our little princess was found almost in her backyard.

KC hated being home and around her family. I think she just drove around to get away....no wonder she always ran out of gas!

Also, I was thinking last night that KC may have "stored" Caylee's body elsewhere before dumping it.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Good Morning Monkeys!

I know that reality has to be setting in for George and Cindy after the positive ID of Caylee's remains.  I would hope that they are accepting the fact that Casey did in fact murder Caylee. 

Lisa

I have not completely ruled out that Caylee might have been moved from where she was dumped the first time.

All the above..jmo

I was thinking that as well, but if not in the backyard, how will LE ever know for sure if it was one of those far out locations!!???  ::MonkeyNoNo::

(http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/Images/myclerk-details-pg2.jpg)

Case Number:     08-CF-0013331-O           Filing Date:     7/8/2008
Case Type:    Criminal
Case Status:    TRIAL
Status Date:    1/5/2009
Current Judge:    STRICKLAND, S A

List of all counts and trial details.

http://www.myorangeclerk.com/myclerk/Details.aspx?SessionID=37271e28-4631-47d0-a590-1b779a6a0813&CaseID=6020985

Is she going to trial first on the theft charges?

Lisa

boomonkey, i think your hope will be truth. The holidays is always the hardest time of year for people suffering from depression, and unfortunately C&A Anthony will feel the blow from KC's actions. One of the three lasting family members is bound to crack n just say, "why did casey do this?" The Ants are now going to support KC to keep up the front that they have been holding up since Caylee disapeared. Its kind of like they really want to avoid the "We told ya so"

My wish for XMAS is that Casey gets life in prison with no parole. I want her to have lots of time for self reflection. And she seems to be one of those inmates that as soon as they have a celly, they give away their entire story. So im waiting for the day her confession comes to light. 

Sorry but I am still of the opinion that ONLY a former policeman could help KC blur this whole situation by sending them all over the place to place pings that they know will be checked out.  I still believe that George helped her by placing Caylee's body in those woods and then sending KC all over the place with her cell phone planting pings. Only a former policeman could advise someone in a horrible situation about what to do to plant reasonable doubt.

Also last night Greta played a jail house visit from the parents to KC. It was really telling to me.  KC was crying and saying when Caylee came home she was going to devote all her time to her.  She also said that Caylee was her baby but she was also Cindys, George and Lee's baby also and all of them would divide their time with Caylee and take care of her so she would never be without someone to be with.  I find this very telling that she is telling them it was their fault she had no help from them taking care of Caylee.  She is saying if they had helped care for Caylee she wouldn't be in this mess right now.  So in a way she is telling them THEY caused what happened to Caylee.

Thanks Wreck & Tater, i hope LE knows more about this than we do. Can't wait for the bitch's trial, sorry!  ::MonkeyTongue::

Got so much to do today, I'll be in & out!! BBL!! Love you all!!!  ::MonkeyRoll::

Well we know she stored it in the trunk for atleast a few days! Maybe the driving around was to throw LE off. We know she watched CSI type shows, she had to know they would look at those cell phone pings! And they did! She probably enjoyed watching all these searches on tv (when she was home) knowing they were no where near the right area! She's just sick!!!

Tater I totally agree. She knew what happened to Caylee, she knew what she did and where she was. Now remember her smirking, laughing, high-fiving, dancing, and just overall having fun. Wouldn't matter to her to attend the funeral, why would she go when Caylee will be the center of attention? She wants her trial where she will be the star!

12/10/2008     A     SUPPLEMENTAL STATE WITNESS LIST FILED

Was this witness list released to the public?

I would not get my hopes up that any of this is likely to happen. I will be mighty surprised if anything changes with the Anthonys' thinking...or at least what they say in public about what they are thinking. The only thing likely to change is that they will be unable to promote searches and sightings of a live Caylee, and they now have someone new, the meter reader, to concentrate on ripping apart and trying to turn him into a pervert. They will also now concentrate their efforts on condemning the police for never having conducted a proper investigation since day # 1. Just my cynical opinion having watched the Anthonys since this all began.

OMG,Blue Moon, that's right and of course she was blaming them, she will never tell what she did, it will always be someone elses fault!  ::MonkeyNoNo::

And we don't know who in LE responded to the scene with the meter reader either! That is going to be very interesting1 I hope we know that before the trial, though! I still think she slept with the LE guys to get them "on her side" so to speak. She uses sex as manipulation to get what she wants! And it works alot of the time! Sometimes men are so stupid!!  ::MonkeyNoNo:: Sorry guy monkeys!  ::MonkeyTongue::

If they decide to try and pin this on Mr. Kronk, I hope they have very, very deep pockets.  Somehow, I can see Cindy slandering this man.

Lisa

Yes, the sandbox and possibly the playhouse? Jesse really talked about that playhouse; almost too much!  ::MonkeyEek::

I can't get onboard with this being George as the helper.It would seem that if he was,Caylee would never ever be found instead of almost being put in their own backyard where eventually she'd be found..It just doesn't male sense to me.Last night on NG,Tim Miller said he had no doubt that her little body was there all along because of the depression in the soil..I wonder sometimes if we will ever know the whole truth as to what really happened.
  I have a question..I've heard that this may not go to trial if Casey was to plea bargain.How does this work?What bargaining chip does she have?Admit she killed Caylee and not get the death penalty?Is that all there is to it?

Off topic, but sometimes we all need a little inspiration. And after the sad news yesterday this seemed a fitting place.


Are You Going to Finish Strong?

http://www.maniacworld.com/are-you-going-to-finish-strong.html

I hope the prosecution doesn't bargain with her at this point! She had her chance before Caylee was found & Baez blew it then!! All these defense experts seem to think they know so much about what LE has and that now murder 1 could be off the table!! I just hope LE has all they need to securely put the bitch behind bars for the rest of her life. I'm praying that they do.

I will be surprised if it is only Cindy. My guess is the defense will try to turn him into the "kidnapper" or spin some story where he had something to do with her disappearance and murder. Before the body was discovered, the defense was flailing around trying to find a defense. Now, they've been supplied with something to spin a yarn around. Cindy has been hammering the police as conducting a conspiracy to railroad her innocent daughter. Unfortunately, now, she and the defense have been given some material to work with. I hope it doesn't sell, but you can bet that when Casey goes to trial for murder, the cops will be on trial too.

Yeah Jesse was right on track, he knew Casey would only put Cayee where she was most familiar with. She kept saying Caylee was safe, she was safe only in terms of not being found immediately. I guess what was safe for KC was not so safe for Caylee. I had a big contemplation between the sandbox and the playhouse. But the sandbox is more plausible to me. I know when i have hid something from my parents in their own home, it was in or near something i knew they had no interest in. Also her little house was moved while Caylee was missing, during Cindys vacation (the first week caylee went missing) she and george paved a cement slab under her playhouse. So that also led me to my sandbox theory

You have to remember that the A's have two dogs.  There are no leashes out front, so you have to assume the dogs are let out back to do their business.  If there was a body in the back yard those dogs would have gone to check it out.  I cannot imagine any dog that would be lured by the smell of death, its in their genes.  They may not alert like a trained dog, but they would check it out.

Personally, I don't believe a deceased Caylee was ever in the backyard of the A's.  I believe articles from the trunk where placed in the back yard, before they were washed or disposed of. 

 ::MonkeyShocked::  ::MonkeyNoNo::


 ::MonkeyLaugh::

I agree with Jody. I am sad to say that they have already made-up (or made-it-up, rather) in their minds Casey did not do this. I do not see them backing down on that, even if somewhere in their hearts they know it's the truth. They can't allow themselves to believe it. Then, they might have to start wondering things such as, "Where did I go wrong as a parent?" et cetera. I also think Cindy would truly have a real breakdown if the allowed herself to think for a minute Casey did it. I think this is a coping mechanism, in a way.

Again, what an a**clown Baez is:

Corrections Department Responds To Baez's Comments
The Orange County Corrections Department responded to Baez's comments after he claimed the sheriff's office was "unprofessional" in the way they informed Casey about her daughter's death, and the way they handled the situation.

Allen Moore, spokesman for the Orange County Jail, said he was surprised Baez would say anything like that, since all their interactions have been cordial up to this point.

Moore said that type of behavior would win Baez no favors with the jail.

"I can understand Mr. Baez being agitated, but in every case, we have followed policy and protocol with Casey Anthony. We have given her no special treatment," Moore said. "For Mr. Baez to say that we were unprofessional, we find that very offensive."

Moore said the way in which they informed Casey is standard procedure. When the jail receives notice that an inmate needs to be told of a death, the jail chaplain is one who informs the inmate.

According to Moore, Baez has always been aware of this procedure. Baez requested that he be notified so he could be the one to tell Casey, but his request was denied.

Ooops. I forgot to say, "Good morning Monkeys!"

Why is it so unreasonable to think KC did this on her own? It's not like she took a lot of effort in the disposal of the body! It doesn't take much strength to kill a little 2 1/2 year old, chloroform her, wrap her head in duct tape, put her in a garbage bag, pull over to the side of the road and toss everything out the door. Pull away and go party with her boyfriend. Problem solved.

I don't believe for a minute that she had help, she wants everyone to think she's the greatest. In fact she goes to extremes to make sure everyone likes her, until she is done with them. It would take tremendous trust for her to confide in someone that she killed her baby, then hope they keep their mouths shut. Her mother may have spun some lies to make her family appear to be a Norman Rockwell painting, but no one, except a person who has the heart of a killer would help her hide this tiny body!!

I can't get onboard with this being George as the helper.It would seem that if he was,Caylee would never ever be found instead of almost being put in their own backyard where eventually she'd be found..It just

I hope the prosecution doesn't bargain with her at this point! She had her chance before Caylee was found & Baez blew it then!! All these defense experts seem to think they know so much about what LE has and that now murder 1 could be off the table!! I just hope LE has all they need to securely put the bitch behind bars for the rest of her life. I'm praying that they do.
[/quote]

There was a former LE on HLN that said LE should NOT talk to KC at this point. Then a psych said they should because she may talk. 

I wouldn't have a problem with a deal as long as that #$^%(# is in prison!

BTW, I cannot imagine ANY jury finding her NOT guilty of obstruction of justice. I think that is a gimme. JMHO

Hey ladie monkeys! Like NG said I hope they go after this theory, I HOPE THEY DO, because they will be shot down and embarrased so quick. I hope they try to pin it on this innocent man, so atleast someone can be proven innocent in this case! KC is going down, she indicted herself with one single hair strand. Now we have a full head of hair.. im sure they are going to get some for of finger print from the tape or inside of the bags (2). KC's telltale heart will give it away. Not to mention i know the slor isnt going to testify. Only to make her look more pitiful!

A good old fashion clownstomp is what comes to mind.  I have a picture in my mind of what it would look like; wish I had some artistic talent to portray it in pixels.

============================================================================


There was a former LE on HLN that said LE should NOT talk to KC at this point. Then a psych said they should because she may talk. 

I wouldn't have a problem with a deal as long as that #$^%(# is in prison!

BTW, I cannot imagine ANY jury finding her NOT guilty of obstruction of justice. I think that is a gimme. JMHO

[
You know, I was thinking...I think she did drive by the airport location, as well as other places. I think she was thinking of where she could put Caylee. I think she was trying to think about where Caylee wouldn't be found, and drove to various locations--maybe even the sighting on the side of the road...who knows. Anyway, just rambling.

What was Casey doing between June 16 -June 19?  Thanks to KCJackie for her maps:

June 14-16


http://www.youtube.com/v/cWYQEyqWLUs&hl=en&fs=1

June 16-19

http://www.youtube.com/v/MBXNG_aePGA&hl=en&fs=1

With what I can infer from the documents I think she had her in the back yard for a short time.  Here is my timeline.

1. Killed Caylee June15-16
2. Drove around with her for 2.6 days.
3. She backed her car into the garage and borrowed a shovel.  This is when she put her in the yard and in a bag.
4. The next day she backed her car into the garage again.  This is when she realized the dogs would give her away.
5. She drove around the corner and put the bag off the road.


Remember, Casey is about as lazy as they come.

You are so on a roll this morning Boo! For instance,my hubby last night said exactly the same thing.Almost word for word and he hasn't been keeping up with this case like me.He did call me yesterday after hearing on the radio she was identified for sure.He wanted to see if I had heard the news.It touched me deeply for some reason.Last night he even sat down and watched NG with me which is something he has never done.At the end when they were showing the pictures of Caylee,I said outloud,"I love you Caylee" and he said,"She was the perfect child and so beautiful"..I was told once that one never knows what goes on in the quiet place of a mans heart and so now for sure,I know it's true.....

Agreed again boomonkey. She did not put effort into the disposal of her baby at all! if her father had helped her, you better believe caylee would still be unfound. But she has been found and the disposal was just as wreckless as the killing and disapearance theory. we have to remember that this girl has hidden major secrets before. I mean which female at 17 can get pregnant and hide it for 7 months, and then when everyone knows, NEVER tell the truth about who the dad is. She is used to steering away from the truth.

I think this is a reasonable timeline. I also think that during the 2.6 days, she was looking for alternate dumping spots (hence being by the airport wooded area, et cetera). Just my thinking on this.

I think you're correct. I suspect that once the body started to smell, she got fairly agitated when she was alone and drove around trying to think where she could get rid of it without someone seeing her and someone later finding it. I don't know if something panicked her and made her decide to get rid of Caylee where she did, or if she at some point decided to go with what was probably her first instinct, to put her in the "neighborhood pet cemetery."

I have not seen any law enforcement or medical examiner say they have found duct tape or hair strands.  I have only heard reporters and commentators state that and I did hear the medical examiner say that nothing would be obtained from what little hair strands there were.  I think they had very little to work with after finding that bag.  It had been there for too long for much to be left.

That was beautiful. Thank you so much!

In light of where the body was found and how it was disposed of I have changed my mind that she had any accomplices.  This proves just how lazy she was and if she had help it would not have ever been placed down the street from her house.  I had thought because George lied about the chase that perhaps he lied about a lot of things.  Perhaps he did lie, but nevertheless I doubt he had anything to do with the disposal.  The only thing I thought was that they found the body in the car when they brought it home from the tow yard perhaps or that George saw the body and helped her around the time of the gas can story.  Since I think he would have been wise enough to not dump the body behind the house I think she did this alone.

Casey was a lazy whore.  Lazy being the most important word.

agreed. Also i have yet to leak this from my head. hehe. but i think that casey used the Spot Bot that they removed from the house to clean that "mysterious stain" and when they removed it the other day it still had liquid in it...a greyish liquid, unlike the green liquid usually used in it...It is imo that after chloroform sets, it becomes a different gas, thus would have a new chemical reaction explaining its change in colors

Good question. I think it might be a little of both her being paniked that she had to get rid of the smell. She needed the smell to be gone by the time someone came to rescue her from being out of gas again or such... And since she couldn't find another spot in her drivings, she felt safer dumping there, because of the familiarity.

Remember KC telling Lee to look in familiar places for Caylee. If this place was stomping grounds for KC during her youth you know it was to Lee also.  She was telling Lee where the body was and Lee knew it too.

Good morning Monkey's.
Boo,I totally agree with your post.The whole Anthony family needs to open their eyes and see the injustice in what Casey did.
Caylee,sweet child,is resting and playing peacefully with God's Angel's now.

Good Morning...I need to know more about these three calls Mr. Kronk made in August. After the third call and the deputy came, I'm wondering what exactly he said to the deputy. I'm going to go out on a limb here and take a guess at what happened. I have a feeling the deputy upon hearing this was the third call thought he was a little crazy and humored him by walking into the woods, to look for this bag. I'll bet the deputy did not take him seriously. I had an incident years ago, when I was in the house with my daughters, I heard noises downstairs, and was convinced someone broke in. I called the police, they looked around, and tried hard to not look at me like I was crazy and just humored me. I really hope this did not happen.

They had to have found some hair strands--at least enough to do toxicology, because Dr. G said they are running toxicology on hair. They had to use hair from the scene, because there is proof that is Caylee's hair without a doubt.

agreed. But yet they made their first physical attribute to caylee because of the length of the skulls hair, letting me know that there indeed is hair left on the skull. they are also going over the area with that special blue light to find additional fibers and/or hairs. its JMO that now that they have more hair they will be able to find the same death band as the one found in the trunk. Its JMO that she used chloroform, since it was used for too little time with inhalation it neever made it to her hair follicle. Also chloroform evaporates with time. Any choloroform found can be the same as the type a body produces while decomposing. If any other drug was present during her time of death the hair will show because after someone dies their body no long metabolizes, thus leaving any drugs in her marrow and hair. **if it had time to make it to her blood stream**

Your very welcome

I just found his website

http://www.lifewithoutlimbs.org/

You might be onto something. I had considered they didn't take him seriously, either. Though, if this is the case, it's still something the defense will use to try to spin reasonable doubt. I just hope the evidence stays in and isn't thrown out on some technicality or such. If the evidence stays in, then I think--regardless of LE's mistakes--the prosection will have victory.

I keep pondering about something LP said on NG recently and can't get it out of my mind.  His opinion is that after KC decided to go with the Nanny story, she actually wanted to have Caylee's body found quickly so that things would be tied together at that point and no other questions asked, or something along those lines (I'm not good at quoting).  Things started going haywire when cin cin called 911.

There is no doubt in my mind that cin cin and GA have known Caylee was dead since the time they each smelled "a dead body" in the car, and knew that KC was up to no good.  They knew their daughter and her reactions well.  Even prior to this, it IMO, they were most always just trying to be her buddy by covering for her, rather than doing their job as responsible parents.     ::MonkeyNoNo::

MORNING MONKEYS~~ Rose, I agree with your thinking.  Plus remember this was in August and imagine the tips pouring in.  I'm sure that the deputy was thinking this tipster is getting tip happy.  Not making excuses for the deputy, just looking at what his possible mind set may have been.

I don't believe Casey had any help from Lee or George in disposing of Caylee, but I do believe that ALL the Anthonys knew what happened to Caylee because they KNOW what Casey is capable of doing since they've all lived with her since she was born. I think Cindy and George probably discussed what they figured Casey had done from the moment that they got their car back. I think they made a decision to cover for her anyway they could without being so flagrant they would be arrested. I believe they are concerned that they may be charged for some of their actions and would have made a deal if they could have in that period between when the remains were found and they learned about the meter reader's earlier calls. I think the defense has convinced them that Casey has a defense now (blaming the police for mishandling the investigation) and if they keep quiet and refuse to testify to anything they know, she may get off with a minimal sentence at worst.

The door from the garage leads into the side yard, not the back yard.  There is a gate at this door into the back yard.  This means she either had to open the back yard gate on the side of the house, or she had to carry Caylee through the house to get to the backyard.  If she carried her while opening the gate or even after opening the gate, then there was a chance she would have been seen, since the body would have still been in rigor it would not appear that she was carrying a sleeping child.  If she carried her through the house, there are all kinds of things that could have happened, things knocked over, etc. (and don't forget those dogs) since the body would have still be in partial rigor.

Full rigor occurs at about 12 hours after death. After the 12 hour mark the rigor slowly ceases and at around 72 hours rigor disappears. So at 2 1/2 days the body would still be in partial rigor making any kind of transport or bagging difficult.

Oh Please!!! Casey already knew Caylee was dead, she didn't need to be freakin notified! And Baez is a pr!ck with eyes! JMO of course!!  ::MonkeyTongue::

I agree with this theory.  I'm still tying to figure out if it was a "Heat of the moment" crime or indeed premeditated.  The chloroform is what is throwing off my belief.  I still think Casey may have struck out at Caylee because Caylee could have been crying for Cindy.  But if there is indeed tape wrapped around the skull and chloroform found in Caylees system, that shoots the heck out of my theory.

But the experts have stated that decomp was in the early stages,2.6 days and I don't think the dogs hit on the sandbox....they hit on Caylee's little play house?

Jody~

Agree with your thinking.  Cindy & George even told LE that they had thought Caylee could have drowned in the pool.  I can't rem the exact conversation, but that was the point.  I don't think ANYONE helped Casey kill Caylee.  I do think that the parents helped cover up what they thought could possibly be incriminating to Casey.

I agree also Casey killed and dumped Caylee all on her own. I am beyond curious what Dr G all saw at the scene, and in the bag, to say this was a homicide by means unknown.

Yep, Cindy and George deliberately messed up the investigation anyway they could without being arrested for it, and now, the defense is going to be that the police conducted a messed up investigation and a deliberate conspiracy to nail their sweet innocent child for murder. What irony!

There is a statement in the article on page 1 of this thread that I found interesting in light of all of the questioning of Lee being Caylee's father.  Just thought it was interesting that they named the grandparents and "other relatives" rather than saying "uncle"... (perhaps father?)

The child's next of kin, including her mother; grandparents George and Cindy Anthony; and other relatives were notified of the findings before they were made public, according to Garavaglia.

Me, too, Charliegirl. I have been along the lines of what LP is saying, that she was using it to keep Caylee quiet. I had even considered that maybe the duct tape (if true) was used to keep her quiet in case she woke up too soon. Anyway, I am at a loss on whether it was truly premeditated....though the searches on the computer sure are good circumstantial evidence.

My theory needs work, but im just trying to put myself in her shoes. im her age, same mindset *party*, i dont have a child but i have had to hide things from my parents and the sandbox just catches my attention 100%. Not to mention when i watched Gretas interview at the anthony house it looked in the sandbox as if there was an indent in the middle, and the toys were scattered around it..looks like something heavy had been in there..hmm

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!

Didn't the dogs hit in both places Karma? I know when they were walking around in the backyard with Greta,Cindy said the dogs hit by the sandbox.She pointed there and Greta even said,"This is a sandbox"? Maybe Casey was laying her in both places not knowing what to do.In a state of panic maybe?I dunno...

i think it says something for LE that they did check three times, I mean they still had that ongoing search for Zanny!

Hmmm, I assumed that this meant the great grandparents.

Did they actually check all three times? I didn't think they did. Maybe I am misunderstanding. Either way, you are totally right about that search for Zanny--LOL!!!  ::MonkeyDance::

She probably dragged her all over the yard before she settled on a place to hide her for awhile. From the pic just posted, what is usually in the corner of the yard? If it's mulch & bamboo; she probably picked that back corner, dug it out a little & then covered her with dirt & mulch! The flags in the picture look like they found evidence back there!

Phonecall!! BBL!!!!!!  ::MonkeyTongue::

Maybe if some of the loonies who called in with their 'psychic' tips had stayed off the phone the police might have had time to really look at the more realistic tips.

So what is your theory as to why she backed the car into the garage two times and borrowed a shovel one of the times?  How do you account for 2.6 days of decomp in the car suggested?  I am curious and I was unaware that the only door into and out of the garage is the side door beside the inner door into the house.  I doubt she was cleaning the car only and what was the need for the shovel and why the cadaver dog hits in the back yard?

Does anyone honestly think we will ever know the answers to these questions?  I mean outside of LE coming up with theories from evidence, some of these questions may never be answered.  I don't see Casey ever saying anything that sheds her in a bad light.

whatever she did, i hope she pays for it

I couldn't agree more, Western.

Wow, very cool, Thanks for sharing sleddogs

The defense is going to dig up everything they possibly can on the meter reader, by the time they are done ruining his reputation, this man I'm sure will be thinking I should not have gotten involved with any of this, I bet he already is thinking that.

I don't know, I guess with all of the focus on Lee throughout the investigation, I am surprised that they didn't name him specifically. 

Again, Charliegirl, a good question. I don't think she will break. I consider that MAYBE if the death penalty was on the table she MIGHT say something...whether it's true or not might be another story, because lack of evidence to cooberate it would keep us from truly knowing. I do think she cares about her own life and fears death herself. I think (just my opinion) that if she thought she might get the death penalty, she might say something to get a lesser charge (maybe agree to manslaughter or something.) However, since Baez is obviously feeding her a line of crap, she might think she's going to get off all together and not make any deals....this is the more likely scenario, I think.

It does seem odd, he must just be one of the other relatives.

[/quote]


Oh Please!!! Casey already knew Caylee was dead, she didn't need to be freakin notified! And Baez is a pr!ck with eyes! JMO of course!!  ::MonkeyTongue::


LMAO @ A PR!CK WITH EYES! VERY FUNNY CUZ IT'S TRUE AND THAT'D MAKE A GREAT PIC!  ::MonkeyLaugh::[/quote]
[/quote]

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 

or perhaps they didn't want to say "Caylee's uncle" if he is more like "Caylee's father"

Thankyou Today! Indeed the dogs hit in both places..

Oh Please!!! Casey already knew Caylee was dead, she didn't need to be freakin notified! And Baez is a pr!ck with eyes! JMO of course!!  ::MonkeyTongue::


LMAO @ A PR!CK WITH EYES! VERY FUNNY CUZ IT'S TRUE AND THAT'D MAKE A GREAT PIC!  ::MonkeyLaugh::[/quote]
[/quote]

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 
[/quote]Is that a hamster?

I would guess that this kind of thing happens in every high profile case in regard to tips. Kronk called 3 different places with his tip. All kinds of nuts and loonies who had thoughts about the case probably called them in at the same time. With hindsight, it's easy to say because it was in her neighborhood, the police should have responded swiftly to a tip that there was a garbage bag in the woods. I wonder how many tips they responded to previously about garbage bags? Remember until she was returned to jail, there were people from all over the area at the Anthony house picketing, etc. every nite. The press said the traffic picked up in the evenings, but it was there during the day too. Wonder how many of those people left their garbage (drinks, food containers, signs, etc.) where they parked their car when they went home? Just a thought...

[/quote]

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 
[/quote]Is that a hamster?
[/quote]

Nah - it is a naked mole rat - but you must admit it does look like a d**k with eyes!!!!

I think Cindy hosed down items that were in the car, could be why the dogs hit in the backyard. You can just imagine what she all hauled out of the car and cleaned.

I think the cadaver dogs hit because articles from the trunk were place in the backyard, either before they were washed or disposed of by Cindy.  I never said I didn't think Caylee was in the trunk (2.6 days of decomp).  I do think she was put in bag at the time of death and there was rip in bag that accounts for the decomp in the trunk (I don't know when the bag ripped), she could have been in trunk longer than 2.6 days if bag ripped later (the 2.6 days refers to when decomp was exposed to oxygen).  If Caylee was doubled bagged, when did that happen?  I don't think Casey cleaned the car, I think Cindy did after it was picked up from tow yard.  It is possible that the borrowing of the shovel has nothing to do with Caylee's death, I don't have a theory on the shovel.  Backing into the garage is something the neighbors stated was not usual, how often did the neighbors watch her come and go?  No theory on this one either.

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 
[/quote]Is that a hamster?
[/quote]

Nah - it is a naked mole rat - but you must admit it does look like a d**k with eyes!!!!
[/quote]It sure does. ::MonkeyEek::

It could just be something they do...I mean, how often do they really include aunts and uncles in naming "the next of kin have notified" in such things. I don't hear it often. Plus, if they do know who Caylee's dad is--alive or dead and if he's not Lee--then Caylee could have aunts and uncles on his side, too; because he could have (or have had) sisters and brothers, too. Then, it would make too many to name, or not naming any certain ones out of courtesy for privacy. Too many possibilites here, methinks, to speculate on paternity based solely on this.

Oh Please!!! Casey already knew Caylee was dead, she didn't need to be freakin notified! And Baez is a pr!ck with eyes! JMO of course!!  ::MonkeyTongue::


LMAO @ A PR!CK WITH EYES! VERY FUNNY CUZ IT'S TRUE AND THAT'D MAKE A GREAT PIC!  ::MonkeyLaugh::[/quote]
[/quote]

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 

ROTLMAO!!!!!!! GREAT JOB!!!!!!!![/quote]

Ok.  Previous info from Car: 
-air samples of chloroform
- air samples of decomp
-hair of Caylee's that possibly showed choroform in hair, banding of decomp

NEW Possible info

-Body has been recovered.  It does have some hair.  We may not be able to get toxicology from the hair NOW but we do have a hair that is a match from the car.  That hair, which matches, now becomes mores relevant as it may be better preserved, having been recovered earlier in the process.  THe link and the match is very important.  What can that 1 hair from the car tell us?  We may not know until the new DOCUMENT DUMPS which will be coming again soon....  Since the defense is privy to all forensic info .

Russ there are pictures that show the side door out of the garage, IIRC they are in the last group of pictures from the house search.  I've got to run and don't have time to grab, but I remember that there was a picture of LE going to the back to secure and the door was visible in that picture.

Thank you tater!! i wonder how well LE looked into this? i know they are working their tails off and Jose Baez the ((edit)) says they are being unproffesional, wait till people know he really is a prick. Anywho, i wonder if they even sifter thru this sand, or looked at it with that UV light. hmm. The indent still pops to me, anyone else see it?

I know after the third 911 call, the whole family seemed to change but mostly Cindy.  George seemed honest in the interviews with the FBI and the OCSO, but I later came to find out that he lied about the chase which stunned me.  You may be right about washing stuff in the back yard, and it was clear they did a lot of work in the back yard as they said that they rifled through the back yard on the 16th of July looking for a dead Caylee presumably.  They said they moved the playhouse, etc. 

I hadn't thought of this before. You might very well be right. Someone could have hosed stuff off. Interesting theory.

She did launder clothing and a utensil from the car and that was admitted to.

Mommy~

I have wondered numerous times if Casey wasn't close to taking and Baez has kept her from it.  Most recently being after the last arrest when detectives gave her the option of turning right or left.  She called Baez, they took her to jail.  And not to forget about Casey asking to see George alone.  I'm wondering if she wasnt' going to spill to him?  I don't know, but I think you're right on about her loving her own life and not wanting to get the DP.   Everyone keeps talking about Baez being such a lousy lawyer but so far he's managed to keep her from talking

I think the hair from the trunk, compared to the ones on the scene could tell that the death band was real and perhaps tell how long the body was there? I am not sure about this, but surely it could reveal something? I agree the match is important. I wonder if the hair they found in the trunk was enough to do toxicology on, and they already know it will be inconclusive based on that? Again, I don't understand this type of science, so I am spurting thoughts here.

Oh yes, I have agreed all along Cindy knew what she was doing in this. I just didn't think of "hosing" things off, mainly because I have a Honda Element, and I don't have to take anything out of my car to hose it off. I had forgotten all about having done this in the past with different cars I've had without rubber interior. It's a good theory, and one that is highly possible.

You know, that is an excellent point. Even the A's attorneys haven't been able to keep them from talking, but Casey isn't even talking to her family since intimately. So, hummmm....interesting. I definitely agree he has her thinking she will get off. I think he is so egotistical that he is telling her "he's got it covered" or such.

Going by your timeline Russ,Caylee's body was in the trunk for 2.6 days to get that early decomp in the trunk.....then George must have smelled that decomp smell on the 24th when Casey supposedly gave him back his gas cans.Also,with Casey backing her car twice in the garage and I'm assuming she wanted to close the garage door to hide what she was doing.....wouldn't that smell have taken over the garage?Remember Lee said the smell hit him like waves in the garage on July 16th?Wouldn't that smell had to be even stronger 3 weeks or so earlier?

So either George(and Cindy)lied about the car smelling of death or Caylee didn't die as early as we think.

Hello monkeys, I have a question for some of you legal eagles.  Let's say she confesses, does she have to tell exactly how she did it?  I mean, does she have to give all the gory details or can she just say I did it and that is all and say no more????

In re the meter reader:  Is he a psychic and what was his first tip?  How did he come about this information?  Sounds very odd to me.  I am so happy he found Caylee but there is more here than meets the eye or ear. 

We will learn more once the LE gives up all the information.

Lastly, I would have liked to see the face of Casey when informed the remains were that of her daughter.  Oh, I believe she already knew, that is why she had to be sedated.

The defense will NOT be mythical nannies and sinister dark plots to frame Casey.  It can't be and it won't be.  He can say anything he wants at this point to foster doubt in the public but he will have a problem with reasonable doubt in a trial.

Baez said "We will all understand in his opening statement".  His defense, IF it goes to trial, will be more puritanical and will be to lessen the sentencing phase.   No way in hell he uses the defense involving fabled make believe characters that the only person that can attest to is his client.  No way he lets her take the stand.

He is going to attempt to plea out, but not until he has milked this for every ounce of publicity he can.  I just hope the prosecution doesn't accept any plea.  I want this to go to trial.

I don't think the gas can story ever happened as told by the only witness to it, George.  I think they were trying to create a case where Caylee might be alive by making the assumption nothing was in the trunk.  I say this because the chase happened roughly the same time according to his interviews.  THAT chase never happened according to the latest document dump upon investigation.

Mariloo- Obviously they cant get this broad to say anything, and they day she wanted to talk her lawyer hushed her up, but in case she ever does tell, she will have to recant her new story, and give it in writing, she doesnt have to answer anything, she can basically start her lie all over again *it will be used in court*..but she could confess now, i hope she doesnt, so she can be embarrassed during those months of court proceedings

Unless.....maybe someone like George or Lee just got fed up with Cindy's blindness when it came to Casey and helped justice along by putting Caylee's body where she was sure to be found.

When Cindy called the police the first time on July 15, it started off as a threat to Casey.
Let's go get Caylee or she would get the police involved. She ( Cindy ) did not fathom that it would get as far as it did.
When Casey was arrested on the 16 th, it might have started to dawn on her that there was more to this. I watched and read the visit tapes and although it was not Cindy who invented the Zanny story she was the one who provided all of the embellishments. The ANTS wanted her out on bail so she could tell them what she couldn't tell them from the jail. Enter Padilla. In hindsight it might have been better if he hadn't inserted himself into this. But he did and the one thing we learned was that she didn't provide the FBI, LE or her family with any information.
If she was afraid that he child might be harmed if she spoke, well the child has been harmed and there is nothing stopping Casey from tellng the entire story now. 
The fact that she isn't and didn't is going to be a huge bonus for her prosecution. Doesn't she want the people who did this to her child identified and brought to justice intead of her sitting in jail ? No, she has Baez telling her that he has the world's best experts to attack any evidence and she has a chance of getting off. Instead of hiring defense experts, why doesn't Baez hire some former FBI and get them on the case to find the " real " guilty persons. He seems to have pockets that are deep enough. 
It's her silence that is going to convict her.   

I hope she doesn't either.  I think someone was helping her.  I cannot imagine she did this all by herself.  I even wondered at first if she was buried alive so to speak, woke up and suffocated.  If she ever goes to general population of the prison, I believe someone will make her talk.  This bitch ought to be very afraid.  That is one place her lawyer cannot help her.

Remember that Cindy said Caylee's father is Eric N..

Found this collage on another forum, it's of Eric and Caylee.  Interesting to say the least. 

(http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Caylee/Caylee-Erik-Collage.jpg)

   If she were offered a deal at this point I would hope the DA would ask for a polygraph first then hear what she says.  I would make the deal contingent on her truthfulness.  If she is convicted (when) she will not be considered for parole unless she admits to her quilt.

Do you really think he will attempt to plea out? I don't see it; but perhaps. They all keep saying, "Oh, it will make sense when [such and such happens]." We all know that is just a plot to put-off coming up with a working theory that will match with the evidence--which they don't know all of yet, so Baez has to wait to come-up with something to spin.

regarding the jailhouse tapes, i dont know why, but one thing she said really stuck out to me. Shes playing the grieving mother who "feels that shes still okay and close to home" complete with tears and then she says something about how theyre going to get her back and she will be "just like she was". To me thats her guilty brain churning and letting something slip that shes not "like she was". Am I making sense?

Cheeky- I sure hope they dont offer her a deal, but even if they did, a polygraph wouldnt do anything for them because it is not admissable in court, also if she receives murder1 there is no parole whatsoever

YOU ARE ON THE MONEY MY MONKEY FRIEND. thats the same line i am convinced by "she wll be just as she was"...WTF. Or once they find her she is going to tell where she was....well duh

What is bothering me most is the fact they may not come up with a cause of death.  With Dr G saying what she did about no trauma to the bones, she has to believe the little girl may have been poisoned.  If she was suffocated, you cannot prove this with the remains, can you???

Baez better start calling himself Charlotte because all of this webbing has to hold up in court against this GREAT concrete evidence the prosecution has.. like i said, he better be getting sketches, sightings, everything

No, aphyxiation can only be found in the lungs *broken blood vessels* and in the eyes.

The only problem is that I don't see the info that she said that (If she was afraid that he child might be harmed if she spoke, well the child has been harmed and there is nothing stopping Casey from tellng the entire story now.  ) will even be allowed to be considered as evidence. I see that easily being thown-out or not included as evidence...meaning, even though the jury might truly be aware it happened (from media, etc) they most likely won't be able to consider it as evidence. Just a thought.

With all the activity in the area by media and tourists and all the awareness of their vehicles and their persons, I doubt they would have chanced doing anything.

He is enjoying all the media sensationalism!!!!!!

Wow wykes. he is a dead ringer to me in my book of possible sperm donors....the nose is dead on

Exactly.  This house has been watched from the beginning if not by LE, by many, many monkeys and monkeylikes.  How on earth did they do anything without someone noticing??

True,I'm not sure if the dogs hit on the house area and the sandbox but LE were using the sandbox lid to hold dirt in it and I don't think they would do that with something that may be evidence.Actually from the yard image someone just posted.....it looks like most of the hits or areas of interest were in the corner of the yard by the playhouse.

Eyebrows too!!!!!!!

If Eric is the dad, why haven't we heard from any of his relatives?

Yes, you are making sense. In hindsight, it sure does seem it could indicate that. Wonder what a behavior professional would say?

GOOD MORNING MONKEYS! ::MonkeyWink::

I had always thought it was JO, KC had a crush on him in high school. BUT.....WOW is right. But why in the world would CA tell the truth???

I agree. I also tend to think he actually has himself fooled into thinking he is going to win this case and become the newest host on truTV or such...blech!

They're probably scared of all the media attention.  I'm sure they may be wondering if he really is the dad.  Is Eric still alive?

What is Eric's last name anyone know?

Even if he doesn't win, he will be famous.  I don't think he will ever let Casey talk if he is smart and I think he is a smart defense attorney.

Maybe they don't want to be hounded by media--unlike Baez and the A's who seem to love the media attention.

The only official statment she gave is the one we read with the mythical Zanny and the rest of the lies. She told the LE at that time that she didn't call the police to report her missing because she had read or saw movies where the child was harmed. In her visit tapes with Cindy and Lee she says several times that she can't help them any more from jail.
Baez might not want to play it that way, but you can bet the prosecution will. 

I know it wouldn't be admissable in court but if they were to agree to any sort of deal where she tells what happened they could ask for a polygraph to help ensure she is telling the truth.  The other point was if there is no deal and she is convicted and get life w/ parole she will not be considered unless she admists her quilt - goes to rehabilitation.

I think if he fails big-time, he will be famous in a bad light--Just my opinion.

He won't have a chance in court with all the evidence, remembering that they had enough for murder 1 prior to the body being even found.  No way he takes this to court with mythical nannies and fantastical stories of mayhem and intrigue from sinister characters within Casey's imagination.  I think he milks this and then attempts to plea out.

I'm sure Jesus Ortiz's family didn't want to be hounded by media either... however, some media did attempt to make contact with them, to ask questions about his relationship with Casey. We have not heard one thing either way with this guy.. I've never heard of any reporters trying to find Eric's family- not his widow, but his family.

All we've heard from day one was about the nanny.  And after this body was found, it was still about the nanny. And now that it's actually Caylee? Well what nanny? Now it's the friggin' meter reader!  ::MonkeyNoNo::

Oh, how many times she says in those tapes things that refer to "not being able to help from here" and "if I were home." From the get-go, I picked up she was not sincere about anything but getting out of jail...as I am sure all of us monkeys picked that up, too. Really disgusting.

This is one of the things that bother me the most, in thinking about the length of time before 911 was called.  Plenty of time to ensure that vital organs would no longer be there to help fix the cause of death.  This smacks of *someone* smarter than Casey seems to be, helping dispose of Caylee's body.  In a weird sense, wouldn't matter where or how the body was disposed, cuz the cause of death would be hard to be determined.  But then, going with that thought, it's hard to explain why identifying things were included with Caylee body's.  Mind boggling at best.  It's as if part of it was thought out, part of it wasn't.  And that kind of thinking leads me back to Casey acting alone.  ::MonkeyConfused::

   

I hope you're right. I hope the prosecutuion doesn't agree to it--but I hope Baez does try. Because I just want some sort of admission from the defense that she is guilty. I know, I might in a fantasy world regarding this, but a monkey can dream, eh?

Somebody, refresh my memory please. Is Eric the childhood friend of Casey's who was going to college in Jacksonville (I think it was) and came home infrequently?

Defending Caylee's mom a challenge, experts say

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/20/caylee.anthony.next/



CNN) -- Now that Caylee Anthony's remains have been identified, the search for the Florida toddler turns into a prosecution of her mother.

 
Casey Anthony, 22, is accused of killing her daughter. Investigators say her alibi didn't check out.

 1 of 3  Although Orange County, Florida, Medical Examiner Jan Garavaglia said Friday she could not determine how Caylee died, she concluded the death was a homicide.

The child's mother, Casey Anthony, 22, faces charges including murder in the disappearance and death of Caylee, who was 2 when she vanished last summer.

The remains were found last week in woods about a half-mile from Anthony's parents' house and identified through DNA testing.  See where Caylee's skeleton was found »

The mother's defense team had claimed since her October indictment that the child might still be alive, even claiming witnesses spotted Caylee since her disappearance.

The finding of the body "has really cut the legs out of the defense," Stacey Honowitz, an assistant Florida state's attorney, said Friday night on CNN's "Larry King Live."  Watch experts size up the legal case »

The lack of a cause of death and the absence of any soft tissue on the toddler's skeletal remains poses a challenge for prosecutors, forensic expert Lawrence Kobilinsky, a defense consultant for Casey Anthony, told Larry King.

Don't Miss
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Casey Anthony's indictment (PDF)
Find Caylee Blog
"If you don't have a cause of death, isn't it possible that it might have been an accident?" Kobilinsky said.

A murder conviction would require proof the victim was killed intentionally. Duct tape reportedly found on the body could convince a judge or jury that Caylee's death was not an accident.

Perhaps of greater significance, though, is Casey Anthony's behavior since -- and even before -- her child went missing.

According to earlier reports, Caylee was the result of an unintended pregnancy, and Anthony made an attempt to give her up after birth. She referred to Caylee as "the little snot nose" and continued to maintain an active social life.  Follow a timeline of the case »

When Caylee went missing, Anthony did not tell her family for a month. It was the child's grandmother who called police. Anthony told conflicting stories at the beginning of the investigation, including a tale that Caylee was with a nanny. The name and address turned out to be bogus. Anthony's active social life continued as police searched for Caylee -- including one memorable entry in a "Hot Body Contest" at an Orlando bar.

Investigators said they found the scent of decomposing flesh and a trace of chloroform, a powerful knockout agent, in the trunk of a car Anthony drove at the time. Anthony's family offered various explanations, including a rotting pizza and a dead squirrel.  Watch a tribute to the little girl »

On the Anthonys' home computer, police found there had been searches for chloroform, missing children and "neck-breaking," although Garavaglia said Friday that she did not find evidence of trauma to the bones.

"The prosecution is going to have a great deal of circumstantial evidence, and this is a physical evidence case," Kobilinsky said. "This is not a question about credibility, although obviously a jury looks at credibility and contradictions, but the physical evidence will either include her or exclude Casey. It's an uphill battle for the defense."

Nevertheless, forensic expert Kathy Reichs, who also is working with Anthony's defense team, sees an opening.

"Given that there's no evidence as to the cause of death, ... you could have an accidental death and a mother that panics," she told King. "There are alternative explanations."

Perhaps not enough to save Anthony, said famed defense attorney Mark Geragos, who is not associated with the case.

"The defense will try to focus, I'm sure, on all of the forensic evidence and whatever else they can do," he told King. "But they're always going to be up against it with the 'She didn't act right' evidence, and that's the hardest thing to combat in this case."


Prosecutors don't need to show what killed Caylee, Geragos said. The defense needs to overcome Casey Anthony's statements and behavior.

"Somebody is going to have to give an explanation at some point as to when she last saw the child, who she gave the child to," he said. "And until that is done, I don't care what they put together, it's not going to carry any weight."
E-mail to a friend

Eric James Baker

Zabasearch show 5 possible listings in Ky

http://www.zabasearch.com/query1_zaba.php?sname=ERIC%20JAMES%20BAKER&state=KY&ref=&se=&doby=&city=&name_style=1&tm=&tmr=

Good morning monkeys,  kudos on this post, as we actually had a local so called physic come here, 4 months after the abduction, and tell us that our missing loved one, had been calling her in her sleep. She told us she could make her own holy water, as she had a three minute course on line to gain her ministor license.

She then had us drive and follow her to a wooded area, and showed us a hidden water hole, sort of a spring. She then told us, the man shot Judith Osteen, dead and threw her into the water.
It did terrible things to us.  IT added something to the equation that was not true. It opened wounds that were attempting to subside a bit.

This so called physic was cold and callous in her statements to us. WE then asked her to see if anyone had an underwater camera, so she could get them to search there. ( we had not heard of tim miller then)
 She backed out quickly, and made many excuses. Finally, attempting to blackball me on her my space, telling people that I was trying to take her ghost customers!!!!  OMG   (like I have time to chase ghosts, I have been too busy looking for real missing people, I have walked the miles, so, I am allowed to have an opinion)  Even my opinions, I have not bothered le with, as they are in fact only my opinion.

 ..... so, maybe these "so calleds", no matter how many times they have had a vision, will just hold their tongue unless they have remains in sight. The le laugh at them behind their backs, and they do nothing more than separate all the clues that are real.

Maybe they will start a site, for clues  just for  the physics.  Then, if on a cold case, they can give their opinions.. If le is stumped, then maybe they can have a look at the thoughts, visions, or what ever they want to call it.  Aw heck, lets just make it illegal to tie up le lines with crap>>!! 

It seems every time someone is missing, a whole slew of people  come out of the wood work, seeking their instant fame, which usually backfires on them, as it did with gale st john.
I for one , will not give credit to one who claims to know where our missing loved one is.

Thanks for letting me finally tell someone about this happening to us.  mio

I would like one of the talking heads on the TV to ask Baez why she is silent now ?
The worst has happened, the child is harmed, why is she still silent on the identity and the circumstances of when she passed the kiddo off to some mystery nanny ? Why is she sitting in jail charged with killing her own daughter when only she has the information to bring the real killers to justice. Why does she want to let those people off the hook ? 

I think she is stunned that the body had not been found. I figure she thought it would be found in due course, but as time went on she got stronger with the realization that she might never be found.  She was probably perplexed and amused that the body was right down the street, how in the world was she not found.  Maybe she even thought a garbage pickup crew threw the bag in the back of a truck and whisked her to the dump.  This is why I think Cindy went on a mission to drive Tim out because they all knew the body was somewhere close.

She turned red in jail and needed a sedative when it was said a body was found near the home on the 11th.  I think everything crumbled at that point.  She turned red because of embarrassment, since I think she may run around in a woman' body but she is merely a child and childlike in her brain.  She is more worried about how her family will react.  This is why after notification she turned down the visit from her family clergy and ran right to the man in her life now, Baez.

Cheeky- ya i understood what u meant, IMO the prosecution doesnt need her. **im watching when caylee vanished**... Also if she does get convicted, she WILL NOT get parole. there is no murder 1 in florida with parole. its either DP or L w/out Parole

I agree!  There's a pic near the middle where their eyes and mouth look very similiar too, and in the bottom right corner (have to scroll right a bit), their mouths are very similiar.  It's crazy-making to see this, and remember how similiar to JP that Caylee's looks as well.  (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/smiley-gahh.gif)

Mioyshi, first let me just say how sorry I am you had such an experience that just added salt to an open wound.

As for your idea, I think it's wonderful! I think having a separate tip line (web page or else) for psychics, or those who have dreams, etc, is an excellent idea!

Do you know when she put this together? It would seem perhaps this is the father, why else put a collage like this together?

That's true Tater,I remember now the dogs hit at both places and around the pool.

Is everyone getting the vibes I am getting from the Conway statement?  It seems to me that the Anthonys are now waiting for the truth and they do not care which direction it goes.  If it is their daughter who did this, so be it.  I hope this is their reaction.  They need the truth, not lies.  I am sure that the recognition that their little granddaughter was tossed in a trash bag and then into the woods for bugs and animals to tear at is haunting to them.  They should want the person who did this punished, even if it is their own daughter, and I hope they do. 

RUSS ur on it!! thats why i think they drove out tim miller and leonard padilla. I think Tim Miller is going to be a wonderful credible character witness on behalf of the prosecution. THANK GOD FOR HIM. He has seen so many families *900* with missing children, and he felt akward at there home..thats interesting. And yes she is more interested in what her family is going to say, " i know my mom will never forgive me, and ill never forgive myself, because there is that possibility that i may never see my daughter again:"

  ALL OF THE ABOVE ::MonkeyHaHa::

Mornig Hudd. I didn't get that vibe, but I hope you're right. What do you think makes you get the vibe?

Mioyshi...I also would like to say how sorry I am. I would imagine in situations like this a family would want to do anything possible to find their loved one. I can just imagine how many people saying they are wanting to help, but are frauds taking advantage of families in these situations.

Russ is on a roll. you are absolutely 1000% right, they are going to be laughed out of court. I can see them buckling under cross defense right now!!

  He will be famouse allright-evryone will say  DONT GO TO JOSE-becuse he is going to lose big time-he should have cute a deal

And then he'll just be another person whose life was ruined by Casey.

I don't think the A's were watched all that carefully in the beginning tho.  Remember even with the mobile cam on the house, George stormed out and 'went for a walk' to clear his head or some such, and Lee went after him.  Not so sure that George was followed by LE then, or any other time he left the house.  And then another time, Cindy supposedly went out of town to hand out flyers.  Not so sure that she actually went out of town or was even followed when she left the house either.  Lee was 'missing in action' so to speak for quite some time.  Wonder if anyone was watching him during that whole time?  Then there's Mallory, doubt that LE has been watching her at all.  Plus the fact that it seems the A's have surrounded themselves with unsavory-type folks, who may 'do a favor' in a heartbeat.   

It just seems very very odd that Caylee's body would surface so very close to home, and the defense is jumping all over that.  In a sense, this almost seems planned out to confuse, mislead, throw a wrench into everything.  *If you cannot convince them, confuse them* 

Could Casey or the A's have folks willing to move Caylee's body around for them?  Dunno.  I suppose it's a possibility. 

who's that girl in the upper right corner?  Not Casey or Caylee... ::MonkeyConfused::

Let's talk about the A's lives from this point forward. They're too young to retire. What will they do for money? Is George working that security job? What about Cindy? They've claimed to have "had inconsistencies". Who would want to hire an untruthful person. I just wonder if they have considered the rest of their lives?

My latest thinking (and it could change) is that the searches about home weapons and neck breaking were more about Casey's plans to do away with her parents than about Caylee.  Even the chloroform may have been a means of rendering them unconscious so she could kill them.  I know it is a dark, dark thought, but it is not that hard for an adult to kill a child.  It would have been harder to kill the parents.

I think Casey lashed out at Caylee after the big fight with Cindy and the dramatic exit from the home.  Part of the punishment of Cindy was to deprive her of visits with Caylee, and since Caylee probably begged to go home to grandma, Casey killed her in a fit of rage.  She did not beat her or break bones.  She may have suffocated her with a pillow or duct tape. 

As for the driving around, I think Casey was looking for places to dump the body and perhaps just driving and talking on her cellphone sometimes because she had nowhere else to go or was trying to clear her head and figure out what to do next.  Casey seems to go in and out of reality, if you know what I mean.  I think she was almost as attached to driving as she was to yapping on the phone.  I am sure that after you have a big blowup with your family and possibly get kicked out and then kill your child, you are a bit restless.  Casey was always kind of fidgety and on the move.

I don't think that she really planned much after dumping the body.  She just went on with her life and pretended it had not happened, though now and then reality would break through, as in those night sweats that Tony talked about.  Otherwise, she was going to party hearty until the cops came to get her.

If Cindy had not pushed the issue and insisted on phoning 911 and knowing what happened to Caylee or where she was, Casey would still be partying, shopping and saying that Caylee was with the sitter.  Remember, Casey never called 911.  Cindy did that and forced Casey to talk to them. 

I saw that in his face too HUddsun, it maybe that they are playing memory

Good question! 

Sorry to bother, but who is Eric James Baker? Eric N in the collage? Can't place the name in all the young men who have been interviewed, associated with Casey, etc. Is Eric the same childhood friend of Casey's that was going to college in Jacksonville or someplace out of town who came home to Orlando infrequently? HELP PLEASE!

Jose keeps saying at trial everyone will know the truth-  If they stay with the Nanny story --for it to get into the trila KC will have to take the stand.  JOSE is stupid but he cant be that stupid to put her on the stand.  If he doesnt put her on the stand -every jurior is gong to wonder why-a mother who clams her daughter was kidnapped wont tell the dtails of the kidnapping.  She is going down ::MonkeyDance::

I see a move coming soon!  ::MonkeyLaugh::

We've found more and more that Casey is similiar to Cindy in a number of ways.  And we know that with Casey, there's a bit of truth in her lies.  Maybe the same is true for Cindy, to some extent?  Dunno...
 

Well he followed that up at night with some nonsense about the body being so close so it couldn't have been Casey that put her there or some such nonsense.  I thought the statement was good and it might be that they have distanced themselves from her.  Still no visits.  Maybe they are coming around while asking for immunity. 

I doubt it though.  Absence makes the heart grow fonder.  I think Caylee has always been an afterthought and the true bond is with the evil woman-child they raised for 22 years.

Thanks for the refresher - there must be significance in the timing of when Cindy puts her hand on George.  Is she controlling his story ?  Not only is it embarrassing - it must be her way of directing his script?  She does this a lot whenever they appear on TV.  I do not see how he stands her.

Stayhomemommy, I hope Cindy and George have come to their senses.  I used to wonder what they planned to do if they managed to get Casey out of jail and she got off on these charges.  Did they really expect to live happily ever after with their obviously twisted daughter knowing that she probably killed Caylee?

I think that now they must be facing some very tough realities.  Hopefully they will cooperate fully and not try to protect Casey any further.  Casey has a team of people to represent her.  They should want the truth about what happened and justice for Caylee.

Time and time again, Baez has promised us a story that will make everything make sense in the end.  Hmmm....something there tells me that there was no accident...
I think Baez is gonna play up that Casey was abused and thus, somehow, she has the mentality of young child--that way he can justify hugging her in jail and such.  He is gonna make her look used and abused by her family, and possibly Caylee's dad...whomever he may be...thus, Jose thinks he's gonna convince us that mentally unstable Casey thought she had no other way out, etc.  Just thinkin out loud...its finally nice to post in here, now that the mania has died out a bit, doesn't take my computer a million years to move about in the forum ::MonkeyDance::

  I think you are right on the money.  She told Amy she was going to get the house.  What she didnt tell her --was she was getting the house after she killed george and cindy

I think CA wishes she had finished the job when she choked KC! I thnk in their statement that they will satand together as a family means CA,GA & LA. NOT KC! jmo

Eric is not the same person, I'm thinking this Eric died in a car accident. Jeff Hopkins is the Jacksonville person I believe  ::MonkeyConfused::.

Caylee - Check!
Parent - Ooops ran out of time!

I am not getting that vibe either. The vibe I am getting with the ANT family is : CYA for YOUR
actions. Why else would they need immunity ? Immunity from prosection for WHAT ?
I don't see anyone from the family tossing Caylee in the woods like that. I do see them lying and cleaning and giving false information to the detectives and encouraging persons to have " sightings "     

My comfort is that he seems to have a very competent attorney - just as Ms. Gonzalez has in Mr. Morgan. 

First, sorry about the typo of your name before. As for your thoughts, I hope you're right that they are facing reality. Because, you are right, if somehow Casey did get off, then they will all be stuck together (with the A's knowing the truth deep in their hearts) and all of them having trouble finding jobs, etc. Their futures are already looking dim without Casey getting off, because they have supported her all this time. Their behavior may not be evidence at trial, but will certainly be judged among the public (which is where these people have to live, eat, etc). I hope they do come to their senses. In the end, they might be able to recover some of their respect in public opinion.

I've gotten all of Casey's men mixed up, it's so dang confusing.  Am thinking tho that Eric is one who supposedly died, that he was married soon after Caylee's birth or something like that, that he has a widow and another child, who (if true) would be Caylee's half-sibling. 

I could be mixing this Eric up with someone else tho.   ::MonkeyConfused::

Still doesn't answer, if this is the one who died, why his family (even the widow), hasn't stepped forward and claimed paternity.  Guess if it were my family, I might be staying back in the shadows too, just for the reason you said, SS.. scared of the media attention.  Heck, I dunno.  His family may actually have contacted LE, asked for privacy, and we just aren't privy to that info. 

I'm with ya Russ.  Dont think it ever happened.  IMO, George was creating a scenero where Caseys car was parked at the A's home toward the end of June.  Thinking that by saying this, someone would have smelled decomp.  Don't think for a minute this happened.  Just more BS imo.

Yes it does seem that way. I just fear with all the accusations that will be thrown around about this man, he can stay strong, because I read he recently lost his wife to cancer.

Klaas, are you here?

*edited for quoting to the wrong person.  sorry..

They gave sworn statements to LE and testified under oath at the bond hearing.  I really wonder if there was something found with the body that directly contradicts what they've already said.  For example, what if there was a nightgown found with her.  That would go to showing Casey took Caylee on the night of the 15th and George and Cindy both lied about it.

That in itself, is obstruction of justice.  George and Cindy should have called the police at the towyard - that would have been anybody's natural response - especially since they had not seen Caylee in 31 days !  Their failure to call immediately is a large red flag that something is not kosher with those two grandparents, imo.  I still have questions about them.

Yup she looked up self-defense, she talked about having the master bedroom, she told people she had 15,000 dollars...((motive? Cindy has life insurance))

I think Baez is just going to attack LE and everything they try to bring in.
If he goes with the someone else, he better have a story about who the someone else is. Maybe Cindy will be the someone else. If the book found at the sight was Caylee's from the visit with the GrandPapa , I could be swayed into that idea if it was presented properly. I don't really believe that right now, but if I was an impartial jury person who hadn't read all of the police statments and read here and watch NG, I could go there.

Am with you on that stayhomemommy! 

Are you saying you think there is a possibility the defense will turn on the A's and accuse them? If so, interesting...gotta think on that a bit.

The guy in the collage is NOT the same person as Eric James Baker? There are 2 different Eric's? Now I'm really confused. I'm sure that some Eric who was a childhood friend gave a statement to police that I read so he can't be dead. Maybe talked to Cindy too after Caylee was missing? I thought the guy with the Hispanic name that Casey went to high school with was who was killed in auto accident. Jeff Hopkins is the person that Casey claimed introduced her to Zanny, his nanny, isn't he?

Morning monkeys. Still recovering from yesterday. We all expected the news but somehow it still hit hard. And like Beary said -- we care. seems like everyone cares except her damn mother.

FWIW my theory is keeping it simple. Casey killed Caylee with chloroform or by suffocation around Jan. 16. Wrapped the body in a crib sheet and kept the body in her trunk for 2 to 3 days. Surprised by the decomposition, Casey sprayed the body and trunk with pesticide. The duct tape came into play somehow at this time and the body was bagged and maybe later double bagged. At some point before the car was left at Amscot, Caylee was dumped close to the side of the road, treated like trash by her own mother. Casey did her best to clean and deodorize the car. Giving up and leaving it at Amscot. The body remained in this wooded area from sometime in late June until its discovery Dec. 11 by the meter reader, who had been interested in the case like we all are. The August tips may or may not have been fumbled by LE.

No conspiracy. No accomplice. Just Casey. JMHO of course. Not saying there wasn't covering up after the fact by the family. I believe there was and I'm not sure that will end even now that the body has been id'd.

Just another sad, sad story about a child who was in the way and a mother too selfish to do what was best for Caylee. See, giving Caylee to Cindy and George or would have been an act of love. Casey killed Caylee rather than choosing an act of love. And for the final insult, she dumped her daughter like trash and went on with her life while Caylee lay decomposing "close to home." She deprived her daughter of a proper funeral for six long months. She deprived the grandparents of the chance to at least see her sweet face one last time and kiss her goodbye. Now what's left is bones.   

  ::MonkeyShocked:: do you have a link?  WOW.

I waited a few pages to comment on this.  I wanted to see what everyone thought also.  The nose is dead on, imo

Thanks for that article, littletxlady! 

The part I snipped above, and bolded.... (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/smiley-gahh.gif)  (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/smiley-gahh.gif)  (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/smiley-gahh.gif)

Surely this will not work in court????? 

Jesus Ortez, was the guy that got killed in a auto accident , or at least one of them...

okies, i forgot to bold that quote.. lol   ::MonkeyConfused::  need more coffee here!   ::MonkeyWaa::

Maybe she was placed in the sandbox overnight and GA let the dogs out the morning he said he saw them leave.  Maybe the dogs went to the sandbox and he followed when they wouldn't come in.  Then the cover up began.  This is just a theory.  I don't know that I personally think GA may be involved but a theory none the less. 

Okay, maybe I am being a Pollyanna in hoping Cindy and George and Lee start to fully cooperate and stop being hacks for Casey.  I just think that at other times Cindy was right on any news release, trying to knock it down, saying that it was not true, etc.  And she has not come out and said that Casey would never do this or that or that Casey is innocent and a good mom and that Zanny the Nanny killed Caylee.  Maybe I am hopeful, too hopeful.  But if she loved Caylee at all, she must realize that all the evidence points to Casey.  We will see.  The longer the Anthonys are silent, the more I think they are likely to say the truth, even if it hurts Casey.  Maybe they just don't want to go down the drain with her, but maybe they are starting to realize this daughter-from-Hell has ruined their lives and killed their granddaughter.

NP! ::MonkeyWink::  Talking heads on FOX  UGH!

No worries--bolded it for you. Yes, I think they will try to use it in court. And, it might work. But they will also include the computer searches as circumstantial evidence for premediation--methinks anyway.

Oh gosh mio, I'm so sorry all this has happened.  Sound like it only made the waking nightmare even worse.  (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/hug.gif)

Since LA was at the anthony's home, it makes me go hmmmmmmmmmmmmm~ that they didn't name him or even say "uncle".  I would think that they would leave it up to george and cindy to notify their other relatives.  What exactly does "next of kin" mean?  Is it considered mom and dad (kc + (?), then siblings(none known) and grandparents (ca & ga + (unknown? other grandparents)?  I wouldn't think it extended past that to george or cindy's parents/siblings.

Apparently so

Posted: Oct 25, 2008 11:11:55
Quote
finaljustice

So… there are TWO Bakers? One named Eric (with a “c” and one named Erik . And they both have some links to Casey?

The Eric Baker with a “c” died in a car wreck, and the Erik Baker with a “k” is in the Navy?

I did note that Erik with a “k” had a close friend (Adam Moser) die a few years ago (2002). Perhaps, Casey heard about that and conveniently applied the death to Erik.

Erik has a tatoo dedicated to Adam on the back of his neck (picture is on facebook). Perhaps that is where Casey got the idea of getting the tatoo as a “memorial” of sorts to Caylee?

Sure doesn’t look like the Anthonys ever look very deeply at ANYTHING - which is why Casey was able to get away with SO MUCH!

http://cayleeanthony.wordpress.com/2008/11/06/george-anthony-told-investigators-he-had-bad-vibes/

Also, there was that bush that george relocated, and they did admit they looked for Caylee in the backyard (which makes one pause, if they believed for one second the nanny had her, why check the backyard for her?)

I hope you're right...I am just not convinced the had anything to do with the statement. I think their attorney (or someone working with and/or for him) wrote it. They were even referred to in third person. So, I am not sure they have had any realization or revelation. However, it could be, and I pray it is. I don't think you're being a Pollyanna. I think you're just being normal...I think we all wish they would come to their senses.

That's what I thought. Now who is the Eric in the collage? And is he different from Eric James Baker in KY? And who is he?

I have so many questions about them, I could fill up pages. The one thing that stands out to me is why did they not do more to find Casey during that month? It was obvious with Cindy's myspace on July 3, she was scared about Caylee, why did they not call police about Casey's car. The car was in Cindy's name, if you are so worried she should have called police and say her car was stolen, anything to find her. And all those crazy stories Casey gave her during that month, nobody would have believed that, nobody. She knew very well what her daughter was capable of and that's my opinion.

Definitely. Which is one of the reasons why I fully believe CA knew what she was doing when she washed those pants!

One thing the prosecution seems to have in spades is motive, motive, motive where Casey is concerned.  Cindy herself wrote online and told people that Casey was jealous of her relationship with Caylee.  Cindy admitted that she might try to get custody and said so on one of the 911 tapes.  And Casey wanted to party with guys who probably preferred a single gal unburdened by a baby.  That is motive.

Casey also had the other vital component in a case: Opportunity.  She left the house with Caylee and Caylee disappeared.

As in the Laci Peterson case, the behavior is highly suspect from not reporting the child as missing to lying about the address of the nanny, to partying while the child was missing, etc.

And also like the Peterson case, although there is no cause of death that can be known, the manner of death is homicide.

Dr. G. is a very experienced, reputable and well-known ME.  Her words are gold in court.

And now that Kobi has said it could be an accident, well, one of her own team is admitting that she killed Caylee, but maybe by accident.

That would make a great pic!!! LMAO!!!
[/quote]

I found it. 
[/quote]Is that a hamster?
[/quote]

Nah - it is a naked mole rat - but you must admit it does look like a d**k with eyes!!!!
[/quote] ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked::
a little toooo much.  I thought someone was posting porno.  Don't do that to me this early in the morning.  ::MonkeyCool:: ::MonkeyWink::

I'll bet money one of the A's will be thrown under the bus.

SNIPPED>>>>

"If you don't have a cause of death, isn't it possible that it might have been an accident?" Kobilinsky said.

I believe they have a good idea what the COD is and after all the forensics come back they can comfirm.
jmo

I'm here now.  Wont' be here this afternoon.  What can I do for you?

You monkeys have probably alread discussed this ... but I'm wondering.
Baez keeps saying 'when it all comes out you will understand' ... all of the Anthonys keep intimating that KC is protecting them from bad people ...

Now we all know that Caylee is dead.  No reason to keep the secret  ... no reason to protect the family ...

I for one am ready to hear the story.

Aruba perhaps ?

Good Morning, yesterday Old Fart wanted someone to put JB's face on BOZO. I don't know if anyone did so I did. Now I don't know where to put it. Can you help me?

Newfie, I am of the opinion that they keep saying we will understand when [insert something here] and it NEVER comes to pass. It won't in this case, either. Baez can't spin his yarn yet, because he doesn't have enough info of the evidence. He has to wait to make-up his story so he can refute all the evidence. Which, I doubt any such story would hold water. JMO.

Well, if they do go that route, then the A's might very well turn on Casey, too. That might be exactly what it takes for them to say, "Wait a minute now." What does anyone else think?

ROTFL - That could be Aruba's new slogan, eh? "What can't stay in Vegas is welcome here."

LOL, I did it yesterday too!  Click on ADDITIONAL OPTIONS and you and upload your pic from your PC.

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/Bozobopbigbaez.jpg)

Very true KatGram.  Her silence is deafening.

I hadn't even thought about him waiting to develop his tale to fit the evidence.  Good call.  Smart monkey!

I agree with all of this, Russ.  Well said!! 

yep, just like Geragross!

That's too funny! Guess everyone can punch him!

This has been bothering me for a couple of days now...

"Casey also had the other vital component in a case: Opportunity.  She left the house with Caylee and Caylee disappeared."

Didn't Cindy say in one of her statements to the police that Casey and Caylee spent the nite of the 15th at home? She heard them before leaving for work, but didn't see them in the morning? Didn't George say in his statement he saw them on the morning or afternoon of the 16th while he was watching some cooking show? Didn't Tony say Casey did not spent the nite of the 15th - 16th at his place? Pedilla says Casey was seen walking around a hotel parking lot on the same nite? (Maybe we can disregard that since it wasn't under oath and he has not exactly been a fount of credible info IMO.) Did Casey leave with Caylee after a big argument that the neighbors heard on the evening of the 15th, OR did she spend the nite at home? I think the cops thought she left the 16th and were operating under the premise that Casey killed Caylee somewhere other than in the home. After finding the remains, I think they needed another search warrant because from whatever articles were found with Caylee, they realized that Casey killed her at home on the 15th.

thank you rose and stayathome for kind words.  "Salt in an open wound ", as you said, is most appropriate way of describing how we felt. I think that  could be the name of their web site.  hmm, maybe a better title for the book I have been writting about this.. May I use it??

  Yes, even skepticism will not stop one from looking into that path, when it is YOU who have the missing loved one.  We were willing to try other means than le, as statistics show most body finds are from the individual, and not the le department itself.

For the last year, we have tried  several avenues of "different" ways of locating Judith....Each one seems to make me  just "sigh" afterwards and say, "what was I thinking"?...We all assumed here, that le really had searched the most logical place first for Caylee, the immediate neighborhood ..Yet, now it is appearing as if they did not, for what ever reason.

This very morning, I heard on the local radio talk show, a man is having a moving out sale on the road we think Judith may have met her demise. Yet, I am scared to death to go there and take a look at this guy, to see if he matches the description of the person who took Judith.

I am not scared of the snakes, I am afraid of how people can turn on you, as this meter guy has found out. That in itself should be a crime, that makes a loved one not search for fear of finding what le can not. then being accused.  After all, who more should want to look than the missing persons family?

The Anthony's did not act at all like we did. WE were telling the sheriff ALL the things we had found on our local searches.  But, le has their own way of doing things, and they do not like help from the family members.

My family has been in Florida since 1600's  that I can trace back. When I was a kid here, if someone was missing, ALL the neighbors near and far would come out to search , as a tribe, or an extended family, all feeling the remorse and sadness as if they too were family.  It took all my wits, not to take the Anthony's food, as that would only be the right thing to do.  Besides the day we went to the Anthony's house, they were not home.

I still hope many wrongs will be made right form Caylees death. I just have to believe there is Devinne purpose to all the things we do not understand. Truth has a way of comming out of the deepest woods, sooner or later.   I am sad for the entire family, and all of us that have been eternally touched by Caylee"s short lived life.. mio

Well, if they do go that route, then the A's might very well turn on Casey, too. That might be exactly what it takes for them to say, "Wait a minute now." What does anyone else think?
....
I think that is why they have a lawyer and they want to give consistent statments now.
Baez is Casey's lawyer. Not Cindy's. We heard of a terrific fight, maybe the kiddo was harmed during that fight.
I really think this might be a defense option. Slime like Baez is not interested in the truth, he is interested in what can be proven in a court of law. Hey, if Cindy or George's prints are on even one portion of the duct tape, they are done. 
Do you think Casey would throw Cindy and George under the bus ? I do. There seemed to be bad relations and she hated both of them.

I'm not sure who put this collage together.  I found this pic at WS, someone had originally posted in a forum there that isn't available to the public, someone else linked it out to their thread 'Caylee's father id'd as Eric N, according to Cindy', no explanation at the time who made the collage. 

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72017 (http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72017)

OOPS ::MonkeyConfused:: I forgot to say Thank You!
We put the same face on....LOL

You sure can use it. And if you write a book, email me stayhomemommy (at) ymail.com. I have a story of a very famous psychic (one featured on Psychic Detectives) who missed it regarding something for me, as well--and charged a large fee. You can add it to all your other evidence in your book.

I encourage you to go to the sale. It might not be easy, but I suspect you will not forgive yourself if you don't go at least see. Best wishes to you and a great big monkey hug!

My thoughts exactly.  That is why I have wondered for so long if Caylee actually perished in a family fight [ all or some family members were present that evening ? it was Father's Day ] - and then we have seen it demonstrated that neither, George, Cindy, or Lee have any self-control over their tempers.  This is a very volatile family, imo.  Have they all been covering for each other ?   When George and Cindy both realized that the towyard man [ not a family member ] was fully aware of the smell of a corspe in the car .... was that when they decided they had better call authorities/911 ?  Just my opinion, but worrisome to me.

I don't know, sorry.  Also wonder who is in the pic in the upper left corner. 

You're making sense. I will be focused more closely on the defense's statement from now on. I want to see if they are going to even hint at taking this route. Like I said before, it is certainly a better defense than the nanny. Very intriguing.

Who says she left the house on the 16 th  ? George ? Padilla wasn't there, he knows as much as I do. Cindy says they spent the night and everything was " a wonderful evening " Who has done the majority of the lying ? Casey ... no a peep except for the first statement on the 16 th.   What IF Casey was trying to leave with Caylee and Cindy went crazy and the child was accidentally killed ?

I would like to see a picture of Baez with Bozo clown shoes clownstomping him.

Speaking of LP....did he ever take that Poly? I was offline while my kiddo was sick and missed that. If so, were the results made public? Thanks.

OMG, you mean to tell me that Websleuths has a "hidey hole" too?  Unreal.

In case some missed in the last thread..  a Klaasend Creation !


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/Bozobopbigbaez.jpg)

What is skeery to me is that this BOZO  may get her off on the murder charge.   It will come down to the forensics and what they can tell.

It will also be interesting to see what side stories can now be developed.. Like who was the people the PI was tracking that were moving a live Caylee from place to place?

anyways   the circus and all the crazy up/down & turn/twist rides is still down the road.
 

 ::MonkeyHaHa::  That's great !

LOL   
Maybe I should re- read before hitting the post button ::MonkeyLaugh::

I am sorry... Edit from about!  My words not SAHM's!

Casey may not have a choice about what her lawyer says.  He can throw CA under the bus.  Her job is to let HIM make her defense.  You can bet he will say things that will make her family look bad all in the name of keeping her out of jail. 

All of the above possible EXCEPT ----- do you believe that Casey would sit in jail one nite let alone however many she's been there on what? 3 trips? IF she could implicate ANYONE else, including someone in her family, in having a hand in killing Caylee? I don't.

I have to run for now. Going to play in the snow with my little guy. Someone suggested yesterday we make snow angels in memory of Caylee. We are going to do that today and take some pics. Will be back later.

Old Fart- I need to re-read my posts too!  I am not typing well today.

I TA with you.  I think if she had anyone else to rat on she would not have had to make somebody up....  It all about HER

   I just want to say that, I doubt anything happened to Caylee on the night that Cindy and Caylee came home from the nursing home, I know that the Anthony's have given conflicting statements, but up until the night that Cindy went and picked up Amy to show here where Casey was, they were in the dark about what happened to their Grandchild, I fully believe this, I have studied the original 911 calls......the texts from Cindy to Casey during the time she was gone and I believe they knew nothing until the night that Cindy went and got Casey and brought her home....After Casey got out of jail that first time, its hard to say what she did tell the Anthony's but, until that time, I really believe that Casey acted alone with whatever happened....

I think they are engaging in a game of "chess".  The anthony's know it's likely kc will throw them under the bus, or even more assuredly, jb will.  Conway doesn't want to come out too strong against her but he has to not appear to be too sympathetic to kc either.  It's strategy and if this weren't about a dead little girl it would be funny to watch both sides squirm.

Very interesting thoughts, never quite looked at it from that angle, I will not be surprised at anything anymore in this case, nothing at this point will shock me.

I would like to know where LP came up with that statement about KC being in the hotel parking lot the night of June 15 - after the fight.   I heard him say that twice, now - and no one has asked him where he got that info.   Her cell phone pings show her close to the home that entire night.  Is there a hotel near the A home?    I wish I knew where LP gets this stuff.

I said it before and I will say it again, we need to remember there is a lot of forensic evidence we haven't seen.  The body can only help to complete the puzzle.  It certainly can't hurt it.

Well said Kio, and i hope you and your family have a merry christmas, and might i add the carving you made of caylee and her real angel babysitter is beyond words. Lovely, thoughtful, insightful of what kind of love Caylee could have received had she been born into the correct family. god bless everyone who loves this little girl. Its as if all the monkeys in here lost her, we are certainly looking for her a lot more than her own mother!

Mio - I'm really sorry for what you've gone through.  My heart goes out to you.

And the prosecution will methodically lay out their case, and hopefully the jury will come to the logical conclusion.

Wyks... Thanks for the info about the collage, can't figure out why one would put this together if this person isn't the father, but with Casey who knows what thought went through her mind.

Thanks!  If they do use it in court, sure am hoping the jury looks a bit deeper. 

And about the computer searches.. think the defense will say something like, yeah those searches were there, with three adults living in the house, prove that it was casey who made those searches.   ::MonkeyConfused:: 

I guess that's one of the problems with circumstantial evidence?  Sure am hoping that an over-abundance of circumstantial evidence will give it all greater weight. 

We'll get all the answers to all the questions when Casey decides to write her version of OJ's "IF I Did It" book in a few years.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

All they need now is KC's fingerprints on the duct tape or the inside of that bag and it's all over.... the defense can spin till eternity in ever increasing circles and no one will be listening.

" I doubt anything happened to Caylee on the night that Cindy and Caylee came home from the nursing home..."

I don't think they knew until they got the car back. I think they were worried about why Casey wouldn't bring Caylee home or let her talk to Cindy, but I believe Casey killed her at home on the nite of the 15th and neither George nor Cindy knew until they reclaimed that car. I'm not certain George intentionally lied about seeing a live Caylee on the 16th, but I'm not sure it was not an attempt to make the police think that something happened to Caylee somewhere outside the home. No reason to think the Anthonys hadn't made a careful investigation of the premises in minute detail and cleaned up anything they found as they admit digging and moving stuff in the backyard...

Sorry,I can't seem to figure out how to shorten the quote stacks.*****************************
Russ posted:
With what I can infer from the documents I think she had her in the back yard for a short time.  Here is my timeline.

1. Killed Caylee June15-16
2. Drove around with her for 2.6 days.
3. She backed her car into the garage and borrowed a shovel.  This is when she put her in the yard and in a bag.
4. The next day she backed her car into the garage again.  This is when she realized the dogs would give her away.
5. She drove around the corner and put the bag off the road.


Remember, Casey is about as lazy as they come.
******************************
Karma posted:
Going by your timeline Russ,Caylee's body was in the trunk for 2.6 days to get that early decomp in the trunk.....then George must have smelled that decomp smell on the 24th when Casey supposedly gave him back his gas cans.Also,with Casey backing her car twice in the garage and I'm assuming she wanted to close the garage door to hide what she was doing.....wouldn't that smell have taken over the garage?Remember Lee said the smell hit him like waves in the garage on July 16th?Wouldn't that smell had to be even stronger 3 weeks or so earlier?

So either George(and Cindy)lied about the car smelling of death or Caylee didn't die as early as we think.
*****************************************

Russ posted:
I don't think the gas can story ever happened as told by the only witness to it, George.  I think they were trying to create a case where Caylee might be alive by making the assumption nothing was in the trunk.  I say this because the chase happened roughly the same time according to his interviews.  THAT chase never happened according to the latest document dump upon investigation.
******************************************
Karma posted:
Ahhhh,yes,good thinking.The whole gas can story was made up because we know the chase story was made up for sure.Should get George for filing a false police report.

I love NG's attention to detail.... Each time there has been some "difficult news" to deliver to Casey she has obtained a list of the goodies that KC has ordered from the Commissary on the evening of those days.....  nothing spoils her appetite it seems. When she was told of the skull being found her Commissary bill came to over  $300 -  so despite having a "panic attack" she managed to work up a hefty appetite...
That information will surely be presented in court as to her REAL state of mind. 

how? the ME said no trauma to the bones

not exactly sure on that, O4Bull.  Am thinking it's the immediate family, such as in the absence of the father, mom & dad would be next of kin.  Am kind of surprised that 'other relatives' were contacted, yet no mention of Lee.  Would think that it would be up to the next of kin, who to notify next.  I can't remember hearing of another time that LE contacted more than just the other parent or grandparents, so am quite surprised at this.  Just wish I knew what exactly their regular protocol is. 
 

Exactly,I agree.Nothing stopping her from fully telling her whole kidnapping story now.Caylee is dead and now no harm will come to her family.
:*(

Thank you so much for the compliment of my carving I titled "Caylee's Babysitter"..
I believe it is my most inspired piece, as I wanted a figure showing love to this child, to be forever held, to give notice to tes and equa search with many white horses, as  well the railroad tracks we personally searched for Caylee that lead  her now up to the heavens. 

Oddly enough I found this piece of wood, while we were searching for Jennifer Kesse. I felt it a befitting piece of wood for all the missing people.

I agree, all the monkeys here, even the lurkers give this site a great energy of love, even when we are mad or angry at the happenings around us.  It is the most comming together of people , with all intentions of lending help and support where needed.

All the posts and theories here today have great relevance.  I admire all who spend a moment worrying over someone else's missing loved one. Thank you all. 
I sincerely wish you all a happy holiday.  a humble mio said this.....

Don't forget KC 's her worst fear is "My mother will never forgive me"

I bet they will live off the money they make by selling the exclusive rights to the funeral to some media outlet.   If they are not charged with anything associated with this case, I'm sure they won't have to worry about money.  jmo.

I had the same thoughts kcrn,when I heard and watched that video.Sounds like she knew Caylee would never be how she was :*(

Good aerial view.  I estimated where the Anthony home was:

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/bodyfound2.jpg)

I don't believe the accidental death explanation will work... I look at it this way- if you asked 100 people what would they do if their child died accidentally- how many would say  "I would cover it up, lie to the police, and the worst thing that could happen would be that I would get in trouble" .....  most of us would say the opposite, you would try to get help for your child and never mind what the consequences were, if it truly was an accident.
Giving your child illegal substances is not accidental.

Well gosh, this throws an even bigger monkey wrench into the mix for me then.  Cuz it seems that the Eric/Erik who died is the one referenced by Casey etc., but... in that collage pic of an Eric/Erik, he is wearing a sailor's hat.  So the sailor Eric/Erik is a different Eric/Erik than the one who died?   ::MonkeyConfused::

 

Good afternoon Monkeys!

Someone said last night that they were confused about Casey being notified about the official identification results by the chaplain and seemingly contradictory reports of her turning down a visit from a chaplain.

As I understand it, the jail chaplain did notify Casey (per protocol) and then her lawyer, Jose Baez came to visit her when he heard the results. During this visit with Baez, her church's pastor (Shane Stutzman) arrived to visit Casey, and because she already had a visitor, she had to turn down the pastor's visit. (Note: I refrain from commenting on her priorities here.)

She apparently did not turn down the jail chaplain's visit when he came to notify her about the positive ID of the remains.

I hope this clears it up for the monkey who asked. (I think it was CBB who asked; not sure.)

I would also like to thank the many monkeys who showed me so much love last night when I felt a need to depart rather abruptly. You guys are the best!

I made this little animation to show my appreciation for you guys! Thank you, thank you, thank you!

(http://i380.photobucket.com/albums/oo242/Brandi-Monkey/Thank%20You/thankslove-1.gif)

HAH!  Good point!! 

Maybe July 15th or 16th?Lee did take a long time going to Tony's that night.Casey could have told him where her body was.

Looking at this picture; how in the world would a meter reader pick this spot to go to the bathroom?  Does anyone know how what his first tip was and how he arrived at this spot?  What else did he know that made him go here?

I am not sure the reports of his relieving himself are correct. I read that he had just gotten this route again recently and probably was curious about his earlier siting and went to investigate.

Good shot, Klaas. I think you are maybe 5 houses too far away though ;-)

I think that YES, the Anthony's did hide some things, maybe even tried to paint their daughter in a better light then what she actually lived in, but I dont think we realize just how hard it is to have a daughter like Casey....Not that Im excusing her in any way for what she has done, and I hope that she is locked away for the rest of her life, so she will never inflict harm on another human being!
   I can relate to the Anthony's a little, because I have seen first hand the way people like Casey, manipulize and traumatize  every one in their lives...........These people can make you think they are the best people in the world, and if you dont know them and have just met them, it might take awhile to figure them out, but if you Love them, as Im sure the Anthonys did Casey,  they can lay the blame on you, and rationalize it in such a way that you would think they were telling the truth.................................The only way to se things clearly is to get away from the person, and I think with this time away from Casey...The Anthony's are beginning to see her for what she is!!!!!!!!!

The thing that makes me believe that George was involved after the fact is that I think he lied about seeing Casey and Caylee on the 16th.  His description was too involved, down to how Caylee's hair was in a ponytail and the backpack with monkeys, etc.  I believe Casey left on the night of the 15th after a big fight with Cindy and took Caylee with her,  If there is a swimsuit in the bag found in the woods, Caylee wasn't even dressed after having taken a swim with Cindy.  Also, the book which LE found was probably in Caylee's backpack and it is possible that other things, including the backpack, were found in the woods, too.  George isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer and if he put the body so close to home, maybe it's because he's just plain dumb.

Avatars if anyone wants them.

(http://i44.tinypic.com/2us77g4.jpg)

(http://i39.tinypic.com/119xbtt.jpg)

lol, it would seem so, since some members there reference areas at times that cannot be found on the forum index, even incl a link here and there, that when followed, gives the sign-up page instead.   ::MonkeyWink::

I think George told that story about seeing KC and Caylee on the 16th because Cindy told him to say that.   

Hey, it would make a great song!!!!