Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

(http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/photo/2008-07/41057127.jpg)

Welcome!!!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

 ::cartwheel::

Is it a time warp?

smooooth landing!

I got here just in time!!!!!!

LOL Bearly~I have alot of support that doesn't mind spreading the word. It's amazing how people reach out to you when you tell your story and offer in any way ( and I mean that very literally) to help. He's clueless, thank God. I used to get a phone call if he ever even crossed this city limit where he was living, I would take my son out of school, stay home from work and then  wait until I heard back. People hate these scumbags so it actaully makes it much easier on me. Also, the school has him red-flagged and they have photos, but I don't worry too much about the school because there are always 2 cop cars out at pick-up and drop off EVERY day for only 130 students. If he stepped onto this Island, he'd be a marked man. I am a very protective mamma bear when it comes to this issue and keep up with him big time, he's had to move 4 times already.

Perfect timing, HH!

Is that you in your avi?

You get strength that you never thought you had to take part in something that you never wanted to be a part of.  It's so sad and scary to think that at any moment, it could be anyone.

No.  Just a warped monkey.   ::MonkeyTongue::

Nice and Smooth, Bearly!  ::MonkeyWink::


Jane Wrote just before the change:

The problem seems to me to be that they act on their desires.  Until we have thought police, what people think about is their own business.  The tricky part comes in teaching children not to do things that are wrong.  And, it makes sense that, once they have actually laid hands on a child, the damage is done and there is no cure.  If, as the grandfather I mentioned earlier said, it makes them that excited, it isn't going to be changeable through counselling.

******************************************************************************

You've hit a very important point. What is it that causes someone to "get stuck" at a given emotional developmental level? Not always, but often, it's sexual trauma. If the trauma is never known by a caring parent, then there is no chance to compensate, and it can be a cycle that just repeats.

A knowing, caring parent, present to address what has to be done at the time, is so very important to a victim of that kind of abuse!!! All of that concern, action, and repair is what is almost impossible to replicate for an adult. There are so many layers by the time adulthood has been reached. Sexual arousal is already patterned, fantasy and discovery already set, and on and on.

That is really sweet, but I can only give credit where it is due-God. And, I would bet anything I have that you or any other monkey would do exactly the same thing in my position - no doubt! What is scarier is that he's not registered because they never followed thru with the charges because of my son's age, so just think how many unregistered offenders are out there, I just treat everybody very suspiciously always, but he (my son) has almost a sixth sense for knowing when someone is lurking around-2 or 3 yrs ago we were on vacation and a man commented on his hair-he yelled fire at the top of his lungs because this man touched his hair. He was gone in a second flat.

Can anyone tell me, was Geraldo on tonight and did he discuss the case? Thanks. I have to go to work in 8 hours but I'd rather stay up all night and sleep til noon.

Thanks, CBB!

This is true for any kind of behavioral therapy and treatment.  I am thinking of Joran, Casey, and those whose behavior deviates from the acceptable.  It takes not only therapy (counseling, change of thought patterns) but also medication or some kind of medical intervention until the new behavior takes place.

Why  of course it is ....cant you tell  LOL!

Great point, especially with boys because even at a very young age they are ashamed, and many never tell, some decades later. ::MonkeyNoNo::

Hi Carolyn!! I hope the dog is ok?

I haven't seen Geraldo tonight, sorry!

He was on but nothing about the case. 

Vigilance is the name of the game.

God does deserve the credit, I understand that, but you needed to make the moves and do the praying.

Really?  You are really pretty.

Thanks, it doesn't hurt that I'm a class A Biatch when you mess with my kids.

Ill be glad when we ALL know who Caylee's father is,  Also I wish the A's would hurry up and make arrangements for Caylee to be laid to rest.......whats wrong with these people, what are they waiting for.......this poor baby has been through enough hell, she needs to be laid to rest, and then   the monster that killed her needs to be shot!!!!!!!

Thanks for the reply.dog.

Thanks for asking, but we lost the dog.  Details in musings.

LOL    thank you.......

My first typo!

Amen, and now for the A's to put her thru another Autopsy?? How do you autopsy bones??? Give her a proper burial and move to Aruba ASAP!

Thanks for bringing that over, and answering...I thought it got lost! ::MonkeyHaHa::

Goodnight!

Goodnight Mammy

Night mammy, have a good one!

It's not a popular thing to say, and TRUST ME, I'm not homophobic, but similarly, if you look at the medical statistics regarding adult male homosexuality, the incidents of same sex childhood sexual trauma is over 50 times that in the straight population. It's very difficult to obtain reliable statistics because it's dependent upon the willingness to tell. You can't trust religious statistics regarding the topic, or gay activist's statistics; both have an agenda. The stats I've referenced are from a rather famous, large study published in the Journal of American Medical Association (JAMA), and in the conclusions they felt the incidence was higher than they could document.

Absolutely~pedophiles who prefer boys average arounf 150-200 victims versus pedophiles that yarget girls, around 15. I didn't want to go there either, bit my son's psychologist stated that even at age 3 boys are homophobic and that is what causes the shame that prevents then from talking. It is very hard to document because more victims than not don't tell.

I never told.  There was only the one instance, but the guy pursued me somewhat.  He was an acquaintance of my parents, and worked at the school I attended.  It never occurred to me to tell my parents.  I just did my best to avoid the guy, and was never alone with him again.

So, girls don't tell, either.  I don't know if it was due to embarrassment, or my upbringing, which emphasized doing what I was told.

OHHHHHHH JaneTruth, I am so sorry to here you had to endure this also ::MonkeyNoNo:: It breaks my heart to hear just how many victims are out there  ::MonkeyWaa:: God bless you for what you went thru.

Sorry I messed up the quotes!  ...and I meant to say, 30% to 40% of adults were approached while children...

ITA~I have yet to tell someone when I didn't hear those tragic words come right back to me that it indeed happened to them also, and it's usually a member or friend of the family. I think civil commitment after they serve every day of their sentence would be better than registering them and dumping them back into our communities, especially when you consider that the offender is responsible for registering themselves???? That's absurd. I did finally meet with William D. Murphy, MD in Memphis, TN to try to figure out WHY these monsters molest children, and the scary part is there is really not a definitive answer, yet many.

I mess up mine all the time, but I knew what you meant.

I just wanted to remind everyone because the anniversary of a special childs death is coming up..............................................If you know of anyone who might have a Ferret in their home and also a child, tell them this is very dangerous.......some people dont know that a ferret is a danger to young children and I try to warn people often.....

Thank you, HH! People should be aware!   ::MonkeyNoNo::

Thanks for the heads up~is it germ related or something else???

Pretty easy for them to fall through a crack and start over somewhere with a new name.

I have a friend who thought a neighbour was behaving suspiciously around her kids...offering them way too much money for yard work, etc.  She ran his name through the register, and there was nothing.  Then she got a friend in the PD to check (she lived in a small town), and, sure enough, the guy was supposed to be registered under a different name. 

That guy wound up back in court, bue I haven't heard what happened after that.

I hope they lock him up, stamp child molester on his forehead and throw away the key. Thank God she followed her instincts and was proactive or God knows she'd be in the same battle we live thru.

Good night, y'all...

good night janetruth and thanks for all your encouraging words... hugs for you from me and my little beach bum!

I saw that study on AFA, but not on JAMA. I agree that you can't trust religious stats or the ones gay organizations conduct, necessarily. Actually, from studying the abuse victims themselves, the APA concluded that homosexuals are LESS likely to molest children, because the overwhelming majority of abuse victims are GIRLS. 93% of child molesters are male. According to studies conducted by APA, the LA Times, and the Clarke Institute, same-sex molestation accounts for about a third or less of all pedophile cases. 2/3 of pedophiles are men sexually molesting little girls, but nobody ever says a little girl shouldn't have a male math or science teacher, male priest, male therapist, male doctor, etc...

Moreover, the majority of pedophiles molest their own children or stepchildren. It's easier to control the victim and keep it secret that way. It's a lot riskier for the pedophile to approach and molest strange children, so this is much rarer. Many male pedophiles actually marry to get access to the woman's children.

Pretty consistently 1/5-1/3 of pedophiles target boys. The rest target girls. So girls are actually in a LOT more danger. Girls are just as ashamed of sexual molestation as boys are, too. The pedophiles themselves are all ashamed, as well, yet study after study, year after year, has the same 1/5-1/3 reporting that their victims were all boys, while the rest only want little girls.

A few experts have suggested that the pedophile doesn't care which gender the child is, but statistics and interviews really don't bear this out.   

No,  not germ related.................A ferret will actually ingest the flesh of a infant if given the chance....very dangerous.....I want everyone to be aware!

I'm glad she was paying attention. A lot of people wouldn't even notice. Of course it's different now, than it was when we were growing up. Adults are a lot more aware of that sort of thing, and more concerned about it. And good for you btw for going the distance to keep your son safe. There are women out there who turn a blind eye because they'd rather do that, than be single, believe it or not!

I disagree from my own research that went on over a yr and an interview with one of the top MD's in this field. I have lost a bulk of that material due to my computer crashing, but male predators who prefer boys average around 150-200 victims, here are some stats I do have on male victims and failure to disclose:

http://www.child-abuse-effects.com/male-victims-of-sexual-abuse.html

Male victims of sexual abuse constitute an extremely under-identified, under-served and frequently misunderstood population. Prevalence rates for males ranged from 3% - 29% (as cited in Barnett et al., 1997, p. 761).

Though sexual abuse is under-reported by both males and females, males are in a unique position. They are far less likely to disclose sexual abuse due to the issues identified in the table below.


Why Males Don't Disclose
 
  A cultural bias maintains that males cannot be victims. Males are expected to be confident, knowledgeable, and aggressive. To be a victim means one is an inadequate male.

  If the boy's body has responded sexually, he feels he is somehow responsible for the sexual abuse.

  Male victims of sexual abuse struggle with issues of homosexuality as most offenders are male. Their homophobia plus their confusion and fear encourage silence. Not to mention the social stigma attached to homosexuality.

  If a boy receives money for sex, he is less likely to be perceived as a victim.

  If a boy has a homosexual orientation, he is often blamed for the "seduction" of the older male, instead of being acknowledged as a legitimate victim of sexual abuse.

  Molestation by an older female is often viewed positively as a kind of "initiation rite" into manhood. Cultural pressure encourages participation while denying feelings.

  Male victims of sexual abuse, more than female victims, may fear loss of freedom and independence if the sexual abuse should be made public.

  Fear of reprisals from the offender plays a role in under-reporting.

  When boys are victimized, they tend to be blamed more for their abuse and are viewed as less in need of care and support.

  Boys fear negative judgment by family and friends.

  Embarrassment and/or confusion prevent male victims of sexual abuse from disclosing.

 





Some Statistics on Male Victims of Sexual Abuse:


  Within the past few years, North American researchers have found that one out of six boys is a victim of sexual abuse (Dorais, 2002, p. 162).

  Researchers surveyed 1,213 grade 6 - 8 students at Toronto area schools on whether they had been a victim of unwanted sex behaviours in the previous 6 weeks: 22% of males reported having been victimized (Blackwell, 20023).

  Canadian estimates have shown that there are close to five million male victims of sexual abuse, most of which are unwanted sexual touching (Matthews, 1996, p. 154).

  In a Los Angeles Times poll conducted in 1990 with 2,626 men and women over 18 years of age, Finkelhor and Associates (19905) discovered that 16% of the men recalled a history of sexual abuse. The median age for these male victims was 9.9 years of age (as cited in Wiehe, 1998, p. 216).

  According to Dorais (2002, p. 177) two trends are evident in the existing statistics on male victims of sexual abuse:
  ¤  the more recent the research, the higher the incidence of abuse
  ¤  with growing awareness, more men seem willing to disclose

  In one study of 30 male victims of sexual abuse, the average age at the first time of abuse was 8 years, 4 months (Dorais, 2002, p. 1848).

  32% of (or an estimated 4,519) child sexual abuse investigations conducted with Social Services Agencies in Canada in 1998 involved males. 16% of these investigations involved boys in the 4 - 7 age group (Trocme et al., 2001, p. 659).

I couldn't verify your JAMA study--you have to register with them & give credit card # to get in. But the American Psychological Association, and their counterpart in Britain, and APA studies over the years from 1980's to the present, keep returning the same results. For every 3 males who report being molested by a man, there are 9 or ten females. Some of the men who molest boys are waaaay more prolific than their heterosexual counterparts, and yet the number of victims still comes out to 1/3 boys, 2/3 girls on average, and the convictions still come out to 1/5-1/3 gay, 2/3 or more straight.

This is very consistent whether the study as APA or a university study.  I think people just are more outraged when it's male same-sex, and so it gets a great deal more stress.

Thanks, I did also learn that during my yr of trying to make sense of what doesn't make sense. The rape crisis center told me that many women turn a blind eye, IMO, they should lose their kids if you choose a monster over your child.

Did I hear that it has come out that one of the things that LE found when doing the search on Caseys comp.  was that she had made a missing persons poster even before Caylee had come up missing?

I heard that too, but not sure if it was a rumor or not.......weird!

Good night, need to hit the monkey bunkey  ::MonkeyConfused::

Good night.........Ill be right behind you!

Sorry, Fuzzball! I wasn't ignoring you, I was in the Monkey Lounge working on avis!

Yeah, I agree with what you are saying! The results of the study I was referring to were specifically to determine what % of adult homosexual males were victims of same sex childhood sexual trauma vs the same control group among straight male adults.

There were no comparisons made or sought to determine frequency of incidents among male vs female. Only males were looked at in the study.

Janetrue, I think it's about respect for authority and the kind of obedience that children have to be trained in. Kids often just do what an adult tells them to do, and if he says don't tell you don't tell. Children feel ashamed after, and they don't really feel like they can stand up to an adult and say no.

Most sexually abused kids don't tell. Gender doesn't make a difference. Little girls are just as much ashamed of it as little boys.

I'm amazed at how many incidences of childhood sexual abuse come up anytime any group of people feel comfortable enough to talk.

I really do think that the frequency of it is far greater than any study shows.

Cool. I get it. Yeah, I'd read that study too. I don't know what to think of it. I know several very hetero guys who were molested as children. The molestation doesn't seem to have changed their orientation at all.  I know one gay guy who was molested, but he was already gay before then. He was planning to marry Batman by the time he was 4--the molestation didn't happen til he was 7. And I know lots of gay guys who never were molested. So who knows. I can't tell if there's a connection at all.

I'm going to take a shower. If I don't get back, have a great night, Monkeys!!!   ::MonkeyWink::

29-32% is still only 1/3. If 29% of victims are boys, that means 71% are girls. If 32% are boys, then 68% are girls. It's still way more girls than boys. Both are under-reporting. I'm not saying boys shouldn't be protected-they should. But just because 30 boys are molested doesn't mean suddenly you figure the 70 molested girls are over-reported or don't count.

I'm just glad that you research all this stuff and that you protect your son, and don't make him feel that he has to hide it from you. He knows you're on his side, and that's the most important thing.

 

Goodnight MT!!!!!

Hey Monkeys. So i had never heard that casey had made a missing poster before caylee went missing, we should look into that.

Good morning Today and all Monkeys -- for those waking up, I hope you slept well, for those closing out their day, I hope you had a great day.  So, what can we discuss this morning?

You look marvelous darling Today... Simply marvelous!!

Good Morning Monkeys. The weather is still foggy but the satellite signal is getting through for a second. Hope it holds.

Sorry Pookybear..I did not see you there. Hi there.  I am still wondering why LE would be after Lee. All we can really do is speculate but if it has to do with money and using the donations in searching for Caylee, I say what is the problem??

When you make a donation I was not aware you could put stipulations on it. In fact I think one should give with a warm heart and as long as the money is used for search purposes I see no need for anyone to explain.

 I am one of those that thinks if you are truly searching and grieving and your life has become impossible to live as it was before the tragedy, then the money can be used to pay for housing, utilities etc. and if you don't like how the monies is being used ; don't donate to it.

So, if Lee was looking for Caylee, and I believe in the beginning he was pounding the pavement trying to find his niece, I feel he could use the money for expenses. In the end,we see Lee drop off the radar and I suspect he has come to know the truth. And he found out that the puke sister of his had accused him of sexual abuse to 2 different people in 2 different circles of friends. He must of been horrified!! And since Casey lies and lies and lies,I do NOT believe a thing she says. I for one will give Lee the benifit of the doubt until we learn more. JMO

Good morning to you Scarlett:  I don't have a clue what Lee may or may not have done but one thing about what his lawyer said has bothered me and led me to believe that there could be real goods on him.  His lawyer said, "that the State Attorney's Office could seek to charge Lee with obstruction of justice or aiding and abetting, even if was not Lee's intention to do so."  This statement is a preemptive strike of some sort --

I agree that we should give him the benefit of the doubt so I will wait and see like you.   

Does anyone know if Annie Downing's statement exists? Apparently she was Casey's best friend and since they questioned everyone and their brother, why haven't we seen this??

I am sure they saw her. I wonder what she says???

That statement has not been released as yet.

Morning Sweet Scarrlett!

As I look at the Ant family, Lee is the one I can't wrap my mind around. I do tend to cut him some slack so far b/c I see him as the only normal one in that family. I am a single mother who raised 2 boys and a girl. My boys had it tough and grew up with a tremendous compassion for women in distress. They both have that White Knight syndrome, saving damsels. It sounds to me like he didn't really have a strong father figure in George and the women (Cindy and KC) turned to him, when they should have turned to George. In his interviews with LE I saw someone who was really trying to find his niece, someone who didn't want it to be KC who did this, but was getting the truth slowly. His last visit with KC was strange, he wasn't playing games with her, he was all business and didn't look happy about it. Then he does what everyone is screaming he should do, drop out of sight. But when he does this, everyone is screaming where is he? Why isn't he out there behaving like his parents? Why get a lawyer? If I were the family dog, I would have gotten a lawyer! Here he thinks he's handling the situation, that none of us have been in, then hears that his sister, whom he thought loved him, trusted him, has accused him of sexual abuse. The straw that broke the camels back.

Maybe he did do something wrong but didn't fully understand what he did was against the law. He's what? 25? That's a lot of responsibility to be on a kids shoulder. I'm glad he lawyered up, his parents are all about KC and show no inkling of protecting their son, I'm sure this is a pattern he has seen all his life. If it comes out he knew about the body or moved it I'll be extremely disappointed and shake my head. Right now, I can't imagine what his life is like with his sister being a complete psycho, his niece dead at her hands, his mother a manic nutjob and his father a whipped puppy. KC herself has single handedly destroyed this family, with a smirk on her face and her head held high. She has the nations attention and is loving every minute of it, even at the expense of her family. She doesn't give a damn, it's all about her and that's all she needs, the rest are on their own.

New to posting here,have been lurking for months. I didn't know if you all had found the guy that Jesse mentions in an LE interview that dated Casey before him. He is from Colonial High and has a myspace, his name is Kenneth Drupiewski, he is in the alumni right under Annie, I saw his myspace and when viewing his list of friends annie is there in a pic with Caylee. I also saw that he plays golf and in the pic of Casey sitting in a chair with a cigar IIRC there is a golf bag to her left. I hope I have not broken any rules by posting this info, just found it interesting and wanted to share.

Good Morning Monkeys!!   ::MonkeyDance:: 

WELCOM LUCYLUI, glad you have arrived. 

Welcome Lucylui! You broke no rules! That is what we are about, collecting the information and ripping it apart to look at it from all angles. I think that is interesting since when she met Jesse she was 2 months pregnant. Maybe this Kenneth Drupiewski is Caylee's Dad?

Welcome Lucylui, glad you are here.  Thanks for the information. 

Thanks for the Welcome, after looking at other photos of potential fathers this guy is there as well.

Good morning Boo -- I like your description of Lee -- I believe that he has been the glue that has held the family together in troubled times, which is a typical role of a parent.  I am a little more suspicious of him, I think but time will tell. 

Lucylui, do you have a link to his myspace or some pictures?

Great Day to you Boo..Love the new year look. I gotta take Sam's decorations down but .I'm one that leaves the tree up into January!!

ITA with lawyering up but this guy would not be my choice. With the profile of this case I would think Lee could pick and choose from top lawyers and this "new" clown in the circus has already misspoke in his first statement to the public. An inexcusable slip if you ask me!! Yes mistakes do happen but in this situation a lawyer with media experience is a must. A Lot of people associated with this case are nut-jobs. Where do they find them?

And I like your observation that he really is only 25 and his own Mom and Dad do not stand up for him in the least!! I wonder why? Maybe because he had the nerve to speak the truth. We see what happened to ole Rick. Does he still post anywhere?

BooMonkey I do, will have to wait for hubby to rise for sleep LOL for I am puter illiterate.

Lucylui....Welcome from me as well!! This place is kind of quite now but most times I am a trillion pages behind.

I would also like to see the site of this new guy you found. Good job. Remember,Monkey's are a curious bunch!  ::MonkeyDance::

I hope you all have a blessed day.  I am signing off for now. 

Scarrlett, am waiting for the computer whiz to wake up, and will have him post what I have. I can bookmark and that is it LOL

Boo, once again we agree. I don't know why, but I can't help cutting Lee some slack.

My opinion, and as another very wise poster says, subject to change.

Welcome to the cage, Lucylui!

 :2waver:

Only a trillion?

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

Hi Frijole!  It's good to see you!

Good morning, Monkeys and Lurkers!

Coffee is brewing!!!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=13436517
Kenneth's myspace.

Sorry,Forgeot to say Good Morning Monkeys. I'll be popping in and out.Got the Grandson.....the playstation2 calls!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

That's it, go to view all and you will see annie with Caylee

10Q!!!

Interesting ....

OOOOPPPSSSS....hate quoting myself, but forgot to add that his hobby is photography, Jesse said that Casey wanted to be a photographer...

Thank you, Trimmonthelake.  There is always someone here that can help Lucylui! These monkey are really smart too.

I'm like you. The one time I attempted to post a picture, it took up half the darn page. ::MonkeyConfused::

The fog is settling and the signal is slow. Have to take a break before I break something else.

Like your name Bearlyhere...that's what I am. Good Morning. What is your opinion of Lee? I haven't heard your ideas as of yet. Do tell.

I agree that pedophiles that are male on male have many more victims. The shame that keeps kids from telling is part. The other part is the fact that although boys are homophobic, they are also curious and admire older boys. It is easy to talk a little boy into doing what the "cool" older boy wants.

The pedophiles that really scare me are the ones that have no preference. I know one that would molest anyone that gave him a chance - he really did not care if they were little boys or girls. At least ones with a preference are somewhat easier to predict. some think treatment will change him - I think he is a psychopath and a danger to all.

Forgot to say WELCOME Lucylui.  ::MonkeyWink::

Morning all ~  ::MonkeyTongue::

Did ya'll see Annie's MS page?  RIP CAYLEE MARIE [meet my friend karma.  shes a bitch] ...

Makes me wonder if that's a message to Casey? ...

Welcome Lucylui!  Yes, it looks like he is part of the Colonial High group of friends:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=13436517

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/KennethDrup.jpg)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses, see Karma (disambiguation).
"Kamma" redirects here. For other uses, see Kamma (disambiguation).
 Spirituality portal
Karma (Sanskrit: कर्म kárma (help·info), kárman- "act, action, performance"[1]; Pali: kamma) is the concept of "action" or "deed" in Indian religions understood as that which causes the entire cycle of cause and effect (i.e., the cycle called saṃsāra) originating in ancient India and treated in Hindu, Jain, Sikh and Buddhist philosophies.

The philosophical explanation of karma can differ slightly between traditions, but the general concept is basically the same. Through the law of karma, the effects of all deeds actively create past, present, and future experiences, thus making one responsible for one's own life, and the pain and joy it brings to him/her and others. The results or 'fruits' of actions are called karma-phala. In religions that incorporate reincarnation, karma extends through one's present life and all past and future lives as well.

Very odd thing she says there..Hmmmmm..Makes me think of that saying" what goes around comes around"too...

Good Morning...WELCOME LUCYLUI.... Thank you for the info, this kid is good looking, I couldn't see the pic of Annie and Caylee, I don't have a myspace, and it said the pics were private.

It is this pic.....

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=39760803


Wonder if one of those deleted friends was Casey?

Thanks, I thought Annie had blonde hair, maybe she goes back and forth with different hair colors.

Annie's myspace pic:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=39760803

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/m_2c28a410d01ea57a19ac9a88a6bd03e3.jpg)

Morning Monkeys, I see we are in a new cage. Did I miss anything interesting after I went to bed last night? TIA JSM  ::MonkeyWink::

Amy has the blonde hair  ::MonkeyWink::

I don't know about hair color, but that is the Annie. I can tell by her pencil thin eyebrows.

Or, "As you sew, so shall you reap."  ::MonkeyWink::

I'll blame the error on not enough coffee, there is way to many people to remember. ::MonkeyConfused::

This is what has been bothering me, can't they do the second autopsy, and then look at the xrays and whatever else that was done. Or do they need the xrays to do the second autopsy?

Amy

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/c4.jpg)

I don't know but did you see under messages that the Find Caylee blog was listed as leaving a message about a tracker program for who was looking at your profile?  Paranoia?

This statement bothered my the other day when I read it and didn't have time to look, but here it is, Cindy and George are on the witness list, as is Lee.  So what do you think Luka means?

Article (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail;jsessionid=05474D29A8189C4388571B0D6FFEDDE7?contentId=8150793&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1&sflg=1)


Witness List (http://www.wesh.com/news/17601789/detail.html)

You would think he knows that they are on the witness list, how could he not know this?

I would think that they would want the 2nd autopsy to be unbiased, so you would do it yourself from the beginning, x-rays and all.

Almost everyone that has a website, forum or blog tracks who comes and who goes.

I thought all along this is Caylee's dad. Mark Hawkins-JMO

2NJ - message to you in Fashion Forum.

Most Memorable 2008: Case against Casey Anthony.
http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/12/22/most_memorable_2008_the_case_against_casey_anthony.html

Good Afternoon monkey Friends!  ::MonkeyDance::
I have just finished catching up and I must comment on several things
1.Way too much personal info given out including pics.. If I was in hiding it wouldnt seem prudent to post pics, location and so much personal info.
2.Way off topic with pages of personal and social commentary.
3.I am not gay, but resent the implication by armchair experts that gay men are the majority of molesters.. It is uninformed and wrong, gays have enough social stigmas to overcome without being labelled for more.
4.Isn't this thread about Caylee????????
You can throw whatever you want at me, but I felt I had to say this..

Latest events
1. A dog pooped on the Anthonys curb
2. Lee is the baby daddy (collective concensus)
3. Casey has a weirdo chattering support group out there, probably her old druggie friends
4. Shamrocks and other tattoos are symbols of drug use and sicknesses
5. The Anthony's should be banished to Gitmo
6. Many of us monkeys are obsessed and stay up to wee hours because we have morbid fascination behavior
7. Some monkeys are victims and come here and get hugs and love. Bless them.
8. The forum mods rock!!!
9. LP is sexy.
10. I ate too much over the holidays.

Heh. That's funny that we both did the number thing about the same time.
Yes, I agree with your numbers.

I agree but this was posted on MAY !!, 2007 from CAYLEE IS MISSING
 

Hello All, Flamom, I'm not meaning to be impudent by any means but Klaas already posted the other day why she is allowing everyone to stray off topic, maybe you missed her post and she can re-post it. There is not much going on with the Holidays here and even Red has allowed us to stray as well. Since this is HIS site, I guess he can allow what he wants! Red even had a poster respond to him the other day with a somewhat obnoxious tone! I believe the mods know what they're doing and I'm thankful for them. It won't be long before we'll be back in the groove HOT & HEAVY! Happy New Year!!!  ::MonkeyTongue::

The page was retitled after Caylee was reported missing.

to the part I've highlighted in red, what I completely agree with.   ::MonkeyCool::

Monken, I am not offended  ::MonkeyWink:: , besides, you only responded to the comment I made about OT stuff..
JJ, you are a funny monkey.. I numbered it so I could keep my thoughts in order   ::MonkeyHaHa::
I know each monkey has something of value to offer, but I suppose there ought to be some sort self censor..
The info provided by someone who has been thru a trauma would allow a wily perpertrator to find them, thats all I am sayin...  ::MonkeyEek::

So when is the trial suppose to take place?

Someone on another site, happened to be sitting next to a person on a plane, who lives real close to the Anthony home. She was saying the area where Caylee was found, is a dumping ground for all sorts of garbage, and that particular area she has never known it to be a teenage hangout. For what it's worth. Also it was awful living on that block with all the media, and circus like atmosphere, day in and day out, I can just imagine.

March 2009, but I am sure it will not be then, the defense will never be ready. imo

I think maybe Klaas has posted more recently about it
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4283.msg599898#msg599898
December 27, 2008
"PLEASE - let's try to cut down on the late night off topic."

------------------------------------------

I agree some mornings I come and there are pages of stuff that are not Caylee related.  I think many of the posters do not realize that there is a Monkey Musings (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?board=26.0) and The Monkey Lounge (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?board=4.0). 

What is so great about the Lounge is you can start a thread about a subject.  I remember a poster was looking for someone and there were pages of stuff mixed in with Caylee stuff.  I would have loved to help but did not have time when first posted.  By the time I was ready to dig in, all the posts with information were gone.  If there had been a thread started in the Lounge all the information would have been in one place.

Anyways, I love it here and I like a little OT, but not pages of it please.
(http://i37.tinypic.com/dxeog4.jpg)

Whew! Good, cause I really didn't mean it in a bad way!  ::MonkeyTongue::
I swear, we're off again for Sunday dinner at Mom's & Walmart! I haven't had time to post much at all, just speed read! I have to keep up!  ::MonkeyTongue:: Besides, I have people calling me all the time for updates!  ::MonkeyEek:: I hate that there's no nightly updates on NG or Greta, I always look forward to that. I guess that's not going to happen until after New Year's. I'll be back in later, hope eveyone has a great day, and love you all!!  ::MonkeyRoll::

It's always difficult to keep these threads free from all off topic and even more difficult around the holidays.  There is less news about the case and those involved.

That said......


(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/Rules09.jpg)

What's a geeper??????????????  (http://i33.tinypic.com/noy1jl.jpg)

Klaas, which monkey is the psychologist?

luckycharmsprincess

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4283.msg600272#msg600272

O/T - Is anyone else having trouble getting in to SM or just me????

I seem to remember someone posting a date of Jan 15...is that a pre-trial thing? I know some were wondering if KC would be there and what she might look like after months in a cell...eating junk food  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Not today Always...Yet that is... ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thanks San!
I found what she had to say to be very interesting indeed.. I want to know more.. She suggested that perhaps Crazy molested the baby prior to or after her death and labelled Crazy as some sort of sexual aggressor. It reminded me of one of her ex boyfriends stating that after sex she got up, got dressed and he laid there and felt like the girl.... so odd

Thomas Luka ... Lee Anthony's attorney ... states that Cindy, George and Lee are not prosecution witnesses but ... the state witness list implies otherwise.

 ::MonkeyConfused::

Janet

++++++++


Could Lee Anthony face charges? 
Last Edited: Friday, 26 Dec 2008, 10:59 PM EST 
Created: Friday, 26 Dec 2008, 10:09 PM EST    

ORLANDO, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35) --  Casey Anthony sits behind bars, charged with the murder of her daughter, Caylee Marie.  Now, the attorney representing Casey's brother, tells MyFoxOrlando.com that Lee Anthony may also face charges.

"Not because he has done anything wrong," said Thomas Luka.   As a former prosecutor, Luka said that the  State Attorney's Office could seek to charge Lee with obstruction of justice or aiding and abetting, even if was not Lee's intention to do so. 

"It's an ongoing investigation, so no one really knows where it's going to lead.  Mr. Anthony, obviously wants his civil rights protected.  Everyone involved in the case should have their rights covered when determining what the police can and can not do or should and should not expect from the witnesses involved in this case," said Luka.

Luka adds that neither Lee, nor George and Cindy Anthony, have been called as witnesses in the case, but they are preparing for just such a scenario.

For months, Lee Anthony has been conducting his own investigation into the disappearance of Caylee, looking into leads for other suspects, Luka told MyFoxOrlando.com.   

Luka contends that Lee has cooperated with detectives, even handing over a DNA sample.  Luka describes his role an advisor to Lee, in determining what he should and should not say to investigators.

"For that reason,  he feels at this point, now that the police are focusing completely on Casey, he wants to make sure that his own civil rights are protected," said Luka.

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=8150793&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1


Witness List In Casey Anthony Case
POSTED: 6:02 pm EDT October 1, 2008
UPDATED: 6:09 pm EDT October 1, 2008

Below are the names from the state witness list in the Casey Anthony case.

Sgt. John Allen, Orange County Sheriff’s Office

Karen Angel, Dora Nursing and Rehabilitation Center, Mount Dora, where Casey Anthony’s grandfather lived

Cynthia Anthony, Casey Anthony’s mother, Caylee Anthony’s grandmother

George Anthony, Casey Anthony’s father, Caylee Anthony’s grandfather.

Lee Anthony, Casey Anthony’s brother.

Deputy Charity R. Beasley, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Gerardo Bloise, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Rosanna Bonilla

Simon Burch, works at wrecker company that towed Casey Anthony’s car.

Brian Burner, neighbor of Cindy and George Anthony who loaned shovel to Casey Anthony.

Deputy Sandra G. Cawn, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Ann Marie Chase

Kristina Chester, friend of Casey Anthony.

David D. Clarke, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Danny Colamarino, works at tattoo parlor that Casey Anthony visited.

Dee Crawford, Event Imaging Solutions Group.

Matthew Crisp

Kiomarie Cruz

Jonathan Daly, Works at tattoo parlor that Casey Antony visited.

Kelly Deguzman, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Tanya DePalmo, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Annie Dowling

Deputy Ryan Eberlin, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Eric Edwards, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Rendon Fletcher, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Jason Forgey, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Thomas Galaida, Tom’s Auto Repair.

Harry Garcia, Sawgrass Apartments, where Casey Anthony said Caylee’s nanny lived.

Rich Garrad, Carlson Restaurants, Texas.

Zenaida Gonzalez, woman whose name Casey Anthony used as Caylee’s nanny.

Jessie Grund, Casey Anthony’s ex-boyfriend.

Mark Hawkins, friend of Casey Anthony.

Deputy Susan Hempfield, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Jeffrey Hopkins II, identified in police report as former high school classmate of Casey Anthony who ran into her in late June.

Jeffrey and Melissa Hopkins, Jeffrey II’s parents.

Reginald Hosey, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Roy House

Amy Huizenga, friend of Casey Anthony.

Sgt. Matthew Irwin, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Michael Kispert, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Maria Kissh

Anthony Lazzaro, recently Casey Anthony’s boyfriend.

Ricardo Lee, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Anne Lennington, from nursing home where Casey Anthony’s father was.

Nicole Lett, from wrecker company that towed Casey Anthony’s car.

Dannielle Lucey-Austin

Amanda Macklin, Sawgrass Apartments, where Casey Anthony said Caylee’s nanny lived.

Tom Manderville, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Peter Marino, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Awilda McBryde, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Joy McCabe, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

William McCoy, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Samara Melich, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Yuri Melich, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Officer William Moore, Orlando Police Department.

Ricardo Morales, dated Casey Anthony.

Custodian of 911 Calls, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Custodian of Records of Johnson’s Wrecker Service, which towed Casey Anthony’s car.

Custodian of Records of AT&T Wireless.

Ryan Pasley

Shirley Plesea

Melissa Remy, FDLE

Gary Ridgeway, Johnson’s Wrecker, which towed Casey Anthony’s car.

Pedro Rivera, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Kari Roderick, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Dante Salah

Deputy Michael Salamat, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Katherine Sanchez, Amscot

Nicole Schieber, Johnson’s Wrecker, which towed Casey Anthony’s car.

Deputy Michael Seagraves, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Renee Simpson, Valencia Community College.

Dianne Tighe, Colorvision

Dave Turner, Sawgrass Apartments, where Casey Anthony said Caylee’s nanny lived.

Leonard Turtora, where Casey Anthony said she worked.

Michael Vincent, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Appling Wells, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Deputy Jerold White, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

Lance White

Bobby Lee Williams

Deputy Ryan Williams, Orange County Sheriff’s Office.

http://www.wesh.com/news/17601789/detail.html


State Will Not Seek Death Penalty In Casey Anthony Murder Case
Woman's 3-Year-Old Daughter Last Seen In June
POSTED: Friday, December 5, 2008
UPDATED: 7:49 pm EST December 5, 2008

Meanwhile, prosecutors have added several new names to its witness list, Local 6 News reported.

The new names include photographers who took pictures of Anthony partying days after Caylee vanished. Also, several members of the FBI lab and the Oak Ridge National Laboratory may be called upon to testify about evidence found in Anthony's car, which was found abandoned at an Orange County Amscot and reeked of death, according to detectives.

The mother and brother of Cindy Anthony, Casey Anthony's mother, were also added as potential witnesses. In e-mails to Cindy Anthony, those family members said they think Casey Anthony may have harmed Caylee, released documents show.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/18213779/detail.html?rss=orlpn&psp=news

Yes the pre-trial is Jan 15th.

Just those who have a Size 1 figure and ... wear black silk Philip Lim blouse, Lucky Brand Jeans and boots.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Have a good day A1.  Have a good day Monkeys.

I am off.

Janet
10:25 AM PT

During the early days of the Natalee Holloway case, there was a very strange poster who had to be banned fairly early on for some of the posts that were made. At one point, after being reprimanded for a post, that particular poster asked, "Did I do something wrong again zoogeeper?"

At the time we were pretty sure that English was NOT the poster's first language.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I hope she is at the hearing.
And yes,I wonder what she looks like now. Can't help it,I'm curious.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: size zero is the new size one
I notice that after I posted it said done ..and booted me.. I figgered I was kicked  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I think it was Wendy Murphy who brought the molestation and child porn to the table. It was the drug Xanax and the chloroform which is used in the child porn industry I think that was what started this. I haven't seen any evidence of this, however, it might or might not be.
..............
I have a different view of the how and why. I think Casey needed a babysitter and when Cindy was not available Casey got the idea that she could make Caylee go to sleep and not be a bother while she lived her life.
..........
I can be corrected when the evidence that was collected by the LE and sent to the FBI labs is made public. Until then, we are all just speculating and trying to solve a puzzle when we don't have all the pieces. She could have put Caylee in the woods on June 16th ( alive ) , sedated her and left her there, tied up with a leash or some other object. She wanted to see Tony, she made calls to ppl, they didn't answer and her sex addiction or whatever is wrong with Casey took over her brain. Just my way of thinking at the moment given what I have read. Too many ppl said that she would never harm the baby. Maybe in her warped mind she wasn't going to harm the baby. She sure put her needs first as if seeing Tony or whoever else was a matter of life or death for her. Casey did live in the moment and
couldn't seem to formulate a plan to balance out Caylee's needs ( have the child properly cared for ) and her needs to do whatever whenever.

Yes, I had a problem.  Looks like the front page was updated, that could have been the problem. 

Tater, go look here:  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2619.msg600874#msg600874

Thanks for posting that.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I tried to refresh and the wheels spun and spun and spun and POOF .. I was zapped  ::MonkeyWaa::

"Thomas Luka ... Lee Anthony's attorney ... states that Cindy, George and Lee are not prosecution witnesses but ... the state witness list implies otherwise."

Janet..Snow in Seattle is going away. ::MonkeyDance::

In response to these attorney's.I find it telling that more experienced high-profile attorney's are not representing Casey,G & C,or Lee.These Attorney's are straight from the Barnum & Bailey Circus..

The only way I can get in is to go through my bookmark????  Is Yahoo having a problem maybe????  Beware of my laptop being flung across the room !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NG calls Casey TOT MOM. Over at Fox Orlando, someone gave her the nik TART MOM. LOL

(http://i34.tinypic.com/25u00vt.jpg)
Leonard called NeJame, Tom Thumb, on Nancy Grace
(http://i33.tinypic.com/noy1jl.jpg)

I kind of like Conway ... at least he's been able to muzzle them.  What I find interesting is that GA & CA don't have separate lawyers.

They would only need different lawyers if they were not innocent or guilty, whatever the case may be, of the same thing.

I agree with the Muzzle!I think the prosecution is gonna work diligently to wrap up any loose ends they may have concerning Casey,then will turn their attention to the rest of the Anthony's and the potential for obstruction,as well as any other charges!

Sorry, ran out for a bit and put gas in my car and picked up a new coffee maker.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

The term "zoo geeper" was used back in the beginning of the Natalee Holloway case by a poster (troll) with the nickname Scandi-Nor.  She might have been related to the Sloots.  In any case one night she was calling people names and "zoo geeper" and the sentance in my signature line was said by her that night.  We laughed pretty hard that night until she was finally banned.

I totally agree with all of this and I am throwing you a trophy, lol. (http://bestsmileys.com/tropheys/3.gif)

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

I bet Conway sat the both of them down, and just told them there is a possibility of the both of you being charged with obstruction and who knows what else, they shut up real fast. ::MonkeyEek::

I don't mind Conway, he seems intelligent and he has been able to shut them up.
As for the rest of the gaggle of lawyers, looks like they are way out of their league.. they should be in DUI court or repping misdemeanor offenses.

They seem like "throw the other guy under the bus" kind of people to me.  IMO that's exactly what they've done to Caylee.  Thrown her right under the bus to save their precious Casey.

All that snow is melting in our area too but ... not fast enough.

The main roads and freeways are clear and wet.  We are driving into Vancouver after church today today to attend a wedding and ... not returning until late.  I hope the temperature remains above freezing.

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

Keepthefaith ... I agree with ya about both Cindy and George's attorney and ... Lee's attorney.  Statements to the media imply they are do not have an indepth knowledge of the Casey Anthony case.  It appears that they are taking advantage of their 15 minutes of fame.  I question their professionalism.

Janet.

Thanks Nut.. I say what I feel, it usually gets me in trouble although I have learned as I got older to phrase things slightly better

One would think their lawyers would be a little more on the ball with facts, otherwise maybe they should not talk to the press. Have a fun, safe trip today.

From Richard Grunds Myspace blog:

Sunday, December 28, 2008

December a time to remember two innocents I loved
Current mood: thoughtful
Category: Life

Today is the second anniversary of my beloved dog Samson leaving us and crossing the Rainbow Bridge.  The loss of Caylee and her confirmed departure to Heaven happening this month makes December a time to remember two innocents that we loved and who loved each other.

Samson was 170 lbs of pure love, innocence and happiness.  He lived to be loved and to love in return.  He was the product of inbreeding so he was a prennial puppy whose body matured but his mind didn't.  He would chase butterflies and run from Florida Lizards.  I would chastise him for being a poor excuse for a Rottweiler when a Florida Lizard would startle him and he would run away from them.  He would never come back in from outside unless you patted his head and told him he was okay.  He would smile and express his love for you with the wagging of his curled tail and that toothy grin of his.

He played a practical joke on me where he would make me think he wanted to go out and when I walked over to the sliding glass door he would jump into my seat on the sofa.  His body would shake as he waited for me to lovingly chastise him and jump on top of him.

Whenever I appear on Nancy Grace they show pictures of Caylee and Sammy together, which is so cool because now everyone knows about my Sammy.  He LOVED little Caylee.  She had this blue chair that would bounce when she got excited and she always got excited when Sammy was around.  He would lay right near her and she would get so excited that her arms would flap in excitement and she would be slapping the sides of his face and he loved it.  He would lick her face raw if you didn't make him stop. She loved every minute of it and loved him.  As this picture shows, where ever Caylee was Sammy wasn't too far behind.

When we heard about Caylee being missing I wrote a similar story about them. Many of you told me about dreams or visions of seeing them playing together in Heaven.  At the time I could not comment on whether Caylee was here or had gone Home.  But, in my heart I knew where she was and knew that Sammy was there waiting for her.  They were running together in the fields of Heaven playing and loving on each other.  She is safe and they are together.  I know that I will see them again someday and when that day comes I will run with them and roll on the ground and once again be able to shower them with kisses.  I will let them know how much I missed them but will never be sad about it again.  There are no tears in Heaven!

They are safe.  They are pure.  And, they are Home.

Thank-you for posting this, he really does seem to be a very nice man.

http://www.vuvox.com/collage_express/collage.swf?collageID=0927bb714




I like this........It helps with different dates and shows what has happened from beginning to where we are now!!!!!!!!!!

Keep posting Richard Grund's writings.I have said some things about him which I retract. It had more to do with me than him. And my suspicious eye which fell on everyone who was not the same religion as me or who brought a different perspective to the table than I.
Caylee was a blessed child to have the Grunds in her short life. 

That's the vision I will keep of Caylee.  How nice of Mr. Grund to share that.

Scar,

Sorry, I just saw this.

Thanks.

Lee reminds me of Jethro Bodine.

Thanks for posting Mr. Grunds posts. To bad they weren't Caylee's real grandparents. At least they seem to really love her. She would have had a much better life with them.
I finally sat down and listened to the tapes of Casey's interviews with LE. It was chilling to listen to her. She showed no emotion what-so-ever. Even with the LE telling her she was lying, she came up with something else just as stupid or even more so than what she had already told. What caught my attention was that she kept saying she "dropped" Caylee off at the stairs. She said this several times. She did not say with Zanny or with someone else, just I "dropped" her at the stairs. Does anyone else have an idea on this??

Lee=Jethro Bodine, that will work. ::MonkeyHaHa::

Remember when Rob said Caylee would be found not hidden, out in the open???

I don't remember that one, can you refresh my memory a little more?

No, I wish I could.  He didn't say it like that, but I cannot talk like he does.  Maybe he will drop in and tell us.

I am behind JJ, what kind of drugs and/or sickness do Shamrocks symbolise?

SHAMROCKS ROCK! I love them. My drug of choice is Advil and I guess my sickness is my obsession with SM!  ::MonkeyDance:: Although if the could bottle up something that would make me vacuum, that would be my drug of choice.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Kat, I don't believe I ever said or posted anything in regard to Richard Grund, but I admit I thought he was a bit strange, maybe even a charlatan, because of some of the religious beliefs I read that he held. I feel bad for even thinking that after hearing him and reading how he and his family felt about Caylee, and yes, she was very fortunate to have had the Grunds to love and care for her, however briefly.

Fat and pasty pale white. No makeup and I hope her hair looks like crap!

That's too funny.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Just to refresh our memories:

July 31, 2008
ID Exclusive: Criminal Profiler Calls Casey Anthony "Dark Damsel"

Dr_deborah_schurmankauflinIn an effort to understand the psyche of Casey Anthony, Investigation Discovery enrolled the help of Dr. Deborah Schurman-Kauflin, a renowned criminal profiler who has over 20 years experience in profiling everything from serial murders to aberrant sex crimes. In 1999, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin profiled the BTK serial killer. Years later, when Dennis Rader was arrested for the crimes, the profile proved to be a shockingly accurate reflection of the killer.

According to Dr. Schurman-Kauflin, Casey Anthony is a "dark damsel" who is seemingly ignoring the disappearance of her 2-year-old child, Caylee Anthony.

"The hallmark of a good predator is that she constantly tells lies. If you clutter the truth with enough of what's false, no one can tell what is real," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "This is why the female offender keeps everyone guessing with deception. Keep people chasing their tails, and they don't have the time to fight you. You will often find female offenders are remarkably good at making people do what they want. They are especially skilled at manipulating men. Women know there is more than one way to make a man wild. She can seduce him. She can lead him in circles. When that fails, she can kill.  Seduce-circle-kill."

By examining Anthony's behavioral patterns, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said that her true self will become visible and it will become easier to predict her actions.

"In her eyes, those close to her are mere things that can be tossed in the trash when they get in the way. Follow her men, and you will follow her thinking. What that means is female predators are especially driven by their need to feel sexual and appealing. They need their men more than they need their families. Male attention is exciting, while family is judgmental. Men build her ego, but their children tear it down. What feeds her ego? If you figure this out, you figure her out. Seduce-circle-kill."

In regards to the trail of lies surrounding the case, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said that they suggest Anthony is desperate for attention.

"She went toward excitement and lied when it suited her," she said, adding, "Lies surround her.  Truth looks very hard to find here."

Unfortunately, determining what happened to Caylee is not as clear-cut.

"It is unclear at this point what happened to Caylee. However, what is clear is that Ms. Anthony did not put Caylee first when the child disappeared," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "She did not do her best to help police find the responsibility [child] that had taken so much of her life.   There have been rumors that she partied while her child faded into the night. Finally, she comes across as angry that people care more for her missing child than her. Her pattern comes across very clear. She put herself first, at least when it came to her disappearing baby."

In summary, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said that if Anthony's patter of behaviors is followed, the truth behind Caylee's disappearance will be revealed.

Visit Dr. Deborah Schurman-Kauflin's Website at: www.drdsk.com

 ::MonkeyDance::  ::cartwheel::

Her next article:

August 03, 2008
Criminal Profiler Shares More Thoughts on Caylee Anthony Case

Dr_deborah_schurmankauflinLast week, Investigation Discovery enrolled the help of criminal profiler Dr. Deborah Schurman-Kauflin, President of the Violent Crimes Institute, LLC, to help us better understand the psyche of Casey Anthony. Since that time, both ID and Dr. Schurman-Kauflin have been inudated with hundreds of emails about her profile of Anthony. As a result, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin has agreed to revisit the case and to give her professional opinion on why women murder their children.

"Women who kill their children tend to be very needy. They need attention and an outlet for their frustrations," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "Being self absorbed is common. Over time, the responsibility of raising children becomes frightening to them. They do not feel mature enough to handle their own lives, let alone the lives of little ones. So they begin to revert as a form of saying 'I can't take this.' In other words, they become child-like. Prior to killing, they begin slipping into increasingly outlandish behaviors. It is a twisted form of a cry for help. So, instead of staying home with the children and working on becoming more emotionally stable, they engage in teenager type behaviors. They have affairs and quit their jobs. Going out at a moment's notice becomes routine and they withdraw from their children."

Once they start withdrawing, Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said, they begin to lose themselves in fantasy - thinking about what their lives were like before they had children.

"I coined a term in 1999, when I interviewed female serial killers and mass murderers. This term is a White Picket Fence Fantasy. Women who kill tend to long for a knight to come to their rescue and take care of them. This fantasy plays repeatedly in their minds. When they have to break from their fantasies and actually tend to their children, the burdens of being mothers become overwhelming, and they just want out. It is here that Instead of feeling love for their flesh and blood, they feel anger. Everything that has gone wrong becomes the fault of the child."

    * "If only that child had not been born"
    * "If only she had the freedom to live her life"
    * "If only..."

According to Dr. Schurman-Kauflin, those questions eventually turn into an obsession and in time the mother will only think of what she wants.

"These thoughts haunt her until one day, something stressful happens," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "Usually, it involves the breakup of a relationship or the introduction of a new lover who finds children unappealing. Females who kill their children tend to see themselves as being very sensual and attractive, and being discarded is too much for them to bear. It does not match with the idealized self that they have created in their minds. So they begin to think of ways to have the lover. They cannot allow a threat to their self image, so they take steps to quell the increasing internal discord. The females project the rejection onto the children and come to believe that if the children were not there, then life would be good. This is the point where plans are made to murder the little obstacles."

Casey_anthony_all_smilesDr. Schurman-Kauflin said there are many red flags in the Casey Anthony case and she finds it disturbing that Anthony has done little to help investigators find her missing 2-year-old daughter, Caylee Anthony.

"I have volunteered to help parents of murdered children, and I can say unequivocally that every parent I have ever worked with cooperated fully with police," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "There were no lies to authorities. Innocent parents are desperate to find a missing child. They make themselves sick with worry. Ms. Anthony comes across as being more worried about herself than Caylee. She is flat emotionally when it comes to her missing child. There were lies from the beginning and an attempt to mislead police. Her actions are terribly abnormal and inconsistent with those of a grieving parent."

However, there is, according to Dr. Schurman-Kauflin, a way to break her.

"The strain of the current situation will wear on those around her and pressure her to explain her behavior. Because she cannot explain her lies, she will blame everyone else. She will want to flee. She may even reach for religion as a means to cope, and depression is likely to follow. Then police will be able to talk with her to find out what she really knows. Detectives will be able to get information from her. The key for officers is to know her patterns and approach her the right way. If they key in on her personality, they will be able to get her to tell what really happened."

Visit Dr. Deborah Schurman-Kauflin's Website at: www.drdsk.com

Thanks for postin that Boo.  ::MonkeyCool::

Thank you for that Boo, why are the bubbles coming out of your mouth??? ::MonkeyEek::

Congratulations Casey Anthony!!! You made the Top Five Sociopaths of 2008!!
 ::cartwheel::   ::cartwheel::

Most "Fascinating" Sociopaths of 2008 : Guest Blog by Michelle Simonsen

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/most-fascinatin.html

Your parents must be so proud!!  ::MonkeyEek::

It will be our luck, since she is so pocessed about her looks, that she will be able to purchase some self tanning stuff from the jail store,lol    and will exercise in her cell, and her hair will look even better longer, and then I think I will scream!!!!!!!!!!!I HATE HER...............................

I mistook the pretty bottle of bubblebath for the Asti Spumonti! It's all good, I'm not picky!  ::MonkeyLaugh::

 :smt045 :smt045

If I wanted to know the truth and I trusted my team enough, I would want to do it from scratch.

If I wanted to defend my client at all costs, I would want the autopsy done by LE, then defend my client by making up lies saying all sorts of crazy stuff to make it look like there is reasonable doubt. 

That is, of course,  only if I was her defense team a dishonest person.

Hi A1, I missed your post to me last night, I responded, but only after you were gone.  Sorry!

I saw it, could not sleep -  hugs,,,,,,,,

Oh silly Boo. You know George and Cindy are pleased as punch that Casey finally won a major award!  ::MonkeyTongue::

Well she won't look near as good as you HH

December 12, 2008
Criminal Profiler Pat Brown Discusses the Casey Anthony Case

Pat BrownInvestigation Discovery contacted top criminal profiler Pat Brown today and asked her to share her thoughts on how yesterday's discovery of child skeletal remains will affect Casey Anthony's cooperation in the case, if those remains are identified as that of Anthony's missing two-year-old daughter, Caylee.

"Casey Anthony, since she exhibits psychopathological behaviors and has a history of pathological lying, can be expected to change her story as is necessary to be of fullest benefit to her own survival," Brown said. "The original story of the babysitter/kidnapper served as a distraction to the more likely scenario that Casey had done something to Caylee and that Caylee was no longer alive. If she could get people to believe that Caylee was a missing child case, then the searches for Caylee would allow time for the body to decompose, the evidence to vanish, and the witnesses' memories to dwindle and become less credible. Then when the believability factor of that story began to slide, especially when evidence from the trunk indicated Caylee was dead, Casey still could hope the body wouldn’t be found, so she stuck to the story."

According to Brown, Casey will most likely meet with her attorney to determine which story she should move forward with, so as to get the least amount of time behind bars.

"If no evidence points to the house, then likely Casey will still claim someone else did it, but when the police were closing in, killed Caylee and tried to frame her (by placing the body close to her house)," Brown said. "If on the other hand, there is evidence that clearly implicates the Anthony home, then Casey will likely change the story to one of accidental death followed by an anguished and terrified mother trying to deal with a horrific situation. Of course, Casey’s behaviors of partying and such will not make her very lovable in the eyes of a jury. The lawyers may then go for the old line, ‘Yes, Casey is a disturbed woman, maybe even narcissistic, but she is not a coldblooded killer; she is merely a young, foolish girl who made a poor choice by --------fill in the blank -----leaving Caylee alone in the pool where she accidentally drowned, etc. etc."

Casey AnthonyBrown said that the strongest evidence against Anthony is the Internet searches for chloroform, neckbreaking and missing children. Those, Brown said, will show "clear premeditation."

"As to what might have been found with the child’s remains at the dump site in the woods, the most likely possibility would be the duct tape. I doubt the trash bag will be of much use because too much time has passed. If the body had been found quickly, then the bag might have been proven to belong to the same roll found in the house as the striations in the plastic are unique to each set of bags. However, so much time has passed I doubt the same set of bags would still be in the home; maybe the same brand, but not the exact same roll. The duct tape, however, could be more useful if some was torn off and the roll tossed back onto a shelf. If it hasn’t been used since, the actual location where it was torn off may match exactly to one of the ends found with the body."

In regards to other possible evidence, Brown had this to say:

"It is also always possible that some other item that actually belongs to Casey or the Anthony's was found at the site or in the bag. Casey doesn’t appear to be the brightest criminal (for if she killed Caylee and dumped her body she shouldn’t have chosen a location so close to home and at a spot where she has been known to frequent in the past). She could have accidentally left a piece of evidence at the dump site which unquestionably came from the home. She might have been in a rush and been careless or she might simply have been so arrogant she thought no one would ever find the dump site."

And where does the case go from here?

"I think Casey Anthony will finally get what’s coming to her, but she might not get as much as everyone wishes," Brown said. "We will have to see how all that pans out in court."

For more information on Pat Brown, please visit The Pat Brown Criminal Profiling Agency at: www.patbrownprofiling.com and The Sexual Homicide Exchange at: www.sheprofilers.com.

#3  Is that what was said or was it just the opposite?  Are they victims or perps?

Awww   Thank you.............and I doubt she could hold her own against you either.......(((((((((hugs)))))))))))

#2 and #4  Yes, it is about Caylee but some people think she was the victim of sexual abuse.  In that case talk about pedophilia is on topic, imo.

#1  I addressed that with the poster but she felt safe in posting what she did and also wanted to post it as an advocate for victims.  Maybe you want to address it with the person you are singling out.

Also, isn't there a thread started by Blonde that has just news and no posting replies whatsoever?  Maybe this can help those who are coming for news only.

Just trying to help.

They can put it in a trophy case right next to the picture of Crazy trying to revive the ... y'know.. she did get a lifesaver award for it, didnt she?  ::MonkeyEek::

That's sweet HH! I just hope when she goes to prison, she has gained as much weight as I have just following her case.

I keep ordering pizza just hoping that Sheriff Beary will arrest George and Cindy before I go back to work. I asked him nicely everyday since Christmas but he just hasn't seen my posts on SM.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I forgot about that award. Ewwwww before it is all said and done, they may need a bigger trophy case.

It only took me 10 minutes to figure out that award, I'm sitting here going what are they talking about? I'm more  ::MonkeyConfused:: than usual.

Im starting to get the feeling that maybe she taped the babys mouth and dropped in her the pool. Both GA and CA reported the pool steps were left out and the gate left open. I cant recall the day they thought it happened.

Well, if past trials are any indication, they will spiff her up for her camera close ups. Maybe get her another pair of Brains R Us glasses and a nice little school marm outfit to show what a good girl she is!

I know that has to figure in somehow. I believe they said that was the 16th afternoon. I can't help but think that those flurry of phone calls KC made to her pissed off parents were a set up for Caylee's death. GA & CA just messed it up by not answering.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

Oh No Rose I feel so bad. It took me 10 seconds to figure this one out.

I keep ordering pizza just hoping that Sheriff Beary will arrest George and Cindy before I go back to work. I asked him nicely everyday since Christmas but he just hasn't seen my posts on SM.  ::MonkeyHaHa::
[/quote]


 ::MonkeyHaHa::. I know what you mean.

Same here No Rose..  ::MonkeyLaugh:: I'm sitting here thinking, What other Award? Then it hit me, OOOOooo THAT one!! LOL!  ::MonkeyLaugh::

That's fine, they could dress her up in a nun's habit. She would still look like a nasty skank to me.

What's sad is when I first saw her before I knew anything about this case. I really thought she was a pretty girl. NOT NOW! Pretty is as Pretty does and she is nothing but a low down ugly dog horse faced skank. Also, I hope she gains as much weight as Cindy has lost.

I've been wondering what clothes they are going to put on her, they could dress her up like on Little House On The Prairie, but that is going to make no difference.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::. I know what you mean.
[/quote] Trimm and All monkeys. IF the kind Sheriff Beary would arrest the Anthonys before I go back to work, I Joesamas Mama do solemnly swear I will send him the biggest pizza he has ever seen.

Monkey's honor!
JSM

So maybe the fight on the 15th cause Kc to leave with Caylee. They return on the 16th after GA goes to work ( GAs story of seeing KC and caylee before the 16th doesent add up per his last description of what caylee was wearing). Kc calls her parents desparetley to try and make up but her parents are ticked and dont answer her calls.  Kc has no money or no place to go, so she offs Caylee cause she cant take care of her on own or out of anger.

I thought that could have been the case, but have since changed my mind. I believe Cindy told George to say that he saw them that morning. He said he saw them coming out of the bedroom at I believe around 1ish. Caylee is a little kid, she would've wanted breakfast, time for lunch, lets watch cartoons, etc. You can't keep a 3 yo in a bedroom half the day and not see her til one. That is why I think George's story is made up. Plus it was too detailed. JMO, plus I have had 1 Miller lite waiting on the Cowboy's game that was supposed to start at noon.  ::MonkeyWaa::

The part about his religion is what I had an issue with one night. I have no idea why because
the religion that my daughter converted to and where I go is a very odd one. It is an Orthodox Ukrainian one where nothing has changed since the second century. Their ceremonies actually cast out the devil. WOW, and I found his religion odd ! Like I should talk. 
My Granddaughters baptism took two hours and was full of these castings out. It is a good church with a good community and I get something out of going there.  I was brought up Anglican, but for some reason, I have no issue with the Orthodox Church. Any church where the teachings and principles of how to live your life with love and compassion at the forefront is ok, and that includes Solomon's Porch ( Richard's church ).   

I agree JSM, there is no way, over a month later, that George could remember such details. He was told what to say and memorized his part. Anyone who has had or watched a nearly 3 yr old know that they need constant attention and feeding them is a big part of that! The only way Caylee was kept quiet that morning is if she were dead already.

Does anyone know the Jeanmarie Geis link that Wyks gave me last night? Thanks so much if you can help me. JSM

You are a good KatGram God Bless.

That is what I think, just didn't want to say it. Too depressing.

so caylee would of died sometime between when she swam in the pool with grandma on the 15th and 12:50 ish on the 16th. Hope they can tighten this timeline.

I can't even picture TART MOM sitting beside Jose & Linda K-Baden and having to listen to what her ex-boyfriends and ex-girlfriends say about her. How does a person prepare for that mentally ? Do some sort of mantra to pretend that it isn't you and you are not sitting there on trial for murder ? If Jose figures she can't take it they could always admit the truth and go for a plea.

I know the Grund family has taken hits b/c of his religion, and I'm sure that is OK with him. He doesn't hold that against anyone. Different people need different approaches and what works for them is their own business, like your own. All that matters is that you found something that works for you.  He has set himself and his family above the Anthony's strictly by their actions. Jesse cared about Caylee even though he knew she wasn't his biological daughter. He held her and loved her and played Santa to make her happy. The Grunds were there accepting her into their family and babysitting the best they could. They have happy memories of her and they have shed many tears for her too. I'm glad Caylee at least had the Grunds for a little while in her short life!

If the rumor that LE tore up the mattress during their search warrant of the A house, then maybe this is a possibility.  Maybe Caylee was killed that night after the fight between KC and Cindy, in the bedroom.   

Yes, I believe so. Probably happened that night the 15th after Cindy and Casey's fight. Also, don't know how true this is, but I believe LP said there is video of Casey in a hotel parking lot minus Caylee. I think it is the 15th I may be mistaken.

Yes a mantra, the same one Casey has used for years. Ohm I LOVE CASEY ABOVE ALL OTHERS Ohm, ...

I can't either Kat Gram.    After listening to the way she talked to her mom during the jail phone conversations, I doubt KC will be able to hold her tongue in court. 

God bless the Grunds, they have publicly shed tears for Caylee. I haven't seen that out of her own flesh and blood.

I'm sorry I prayed at Mass that God would help me lighten up on the Anthonys. Maybe I need to go back tomorrow and the next day and the next ... ::MonkeyWaa::

LP did mention that KC was in a hotel parking lot, twice.   I wonder where he got that info from.   I also wonder if the hotel is near her house since the cell phone pings show that she was close to home on the night of the 15th/early morn 16th.

Yes, they'll need room for the "Mother Of The Year" award Cindy said Casey had coming to her, once Caylee was found. Well, she's been found, Cindy!   :roll:

And wait until the prosecution brings up all the compromising pics of Casey, oh that will be interesting.

I agree with George not giving the right date or information. He probably saw them and was describing June 9. Can't imagine everything being " normal" around that house and more so than on the 16th. Didn't someone say that there was a call to Casey's cell from the house early on the mornng of the 16th ? I didn't see that when I was looking thru the call records, but I was not looking for that one. 
Oh Oh, I gotta go and look after a sick little kiddo for a while so Daddy can get an errand done...see ya later.

That Mother Of The Year award statement was probably the most ignorant thing Cindy has said. ::MonkeyRoll::

I can't ge over Casey's calm, cool, and collected demanor that we heard on the tape at Universal Studios! My God, she had just taken the police on a WILD goose chase, right up to the door! I don't think she thinks or feels like you and I would. She may just view what's going on at trial as a challenge to fit lies around. Who knows?

Good afternoon ALL Wonderful Monkeys!!! 

I'm so Happy to be back.  Much trouble was had after installing service pack 3 for Windows.  Was off the net until son came over yesterday.  He had to get into my PC through the back door.  Don't have a clue what that means in PC terms.  His degree is in Computer Science so I don't really question him about his fixes.  He did say I should get Firefox 3 ::MonkeyRoll::   I now have it but am still using IE without the service pack 3 which he had to un-install.  Now everything is back to normal.  I think MOM knows best...If it isn't broken don't fix it ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyHaHa::!!!

I've been out shopping and was finally able to locate my lovely  "Shirtless Sleeves" in the sexy, fuscia (sp?) net variety.  I hope I'm looking GOOD! ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyTongue::

I'll be away until I catch up on the last link and also the 13 pages I'm behind on this link.  I look forward to catching up again.

Happy New Year!
Hugs,
PJ (Paula) :flower:

That's a long list, no rose, but while we're handing out awards, I'd agree with you. The "Mother Of The Year" prediction tops the stuck on stupid list for Cindy!

I have always thought she was killed at home in the bedroom once Cindy and/or George was in bed asleep. I didn't know that they had torn up the mattress. That makes loads of sense. She strangled her on the bed, there would be body fluids that would seep into the mattress and/or bedsheets. So horrible to think but I have always believe she strangled or suffocated her while she was asleep or in a drug induced sleep. Casey was smart, she knew that if she strangled her the hyoid bone would show strangulation, but suffocation would not show petechiae after the soft tissues and eyes decomposed. So if Caylee were drugged up, she put the pillow over her head there would be no struggle. I hope this makes sense, my brain is in overdrive but my fingers are slow.

I don't know where he got the info from. Just read about it here on SM

Happy to see you back, hope you had a good Christmas. I love the color fuscia, I'm sure you are looking good. ::MonkeyDance::

When LP stated that KC was in a hotel parking lot on the night of the 15th - I wish NG had asked him to explain himself.  I would love to know where he got that info and what he thinks KC was doing there.   Both times, she just dropped it.

Just shows how dilusional Cindy is to say such a thing. She really wanted everyone to think there was a white picket fence around the Anthony home. ::MonkeyRoll::

Oh CBB "mother of the year" I forgot that is a MAJOR AWARD. They may need to have a trophy ROOM added to the house for that prize.

Any nominations for the top of the "STUCK ON STUPID" list for:

1. GEORGE
2. LP
3. CASEY
4. LEE
5. BAEZ

???????????

I can think of a few for consideration.......

George: The body in the trunk of that car was not my Granddaugher's!

LP: I believe when she gets her nails done, she'll talk...

That makes sense, CSI would not have torn up the mattress for no reason. I also believe George made up that whole story for the 16th of June, or I should say, Cindy made up that story and told him to say it.

She's mistaking the pickets for men in white coats.

http://celebgalz.com/jeanmarie-geis-matthew-geis-sydney-geis-found-killed-photos/

I did not see Boo's link but this talks about it also.  ::MonkeyCool::

Welcome back PJ

I know, I wonder what hotel it was.

Thanks Sassy, I didn't know where his comment originated. I don't have cable therefore don't have NG. Wouldn't watch her if I had it. She grates on my nerves.  ::MonkeyTongue::

Good one, up above you had your list, I can't believe I missed the one where LP said Casey will talk after she has her nails done. ::MonkeyConfused::

The lawyers she has on her show make me go crazy, Nancy not so much, that is why I follow her show via SM, it's easier for one's sanity.

I know what you mean.  She can be very rude to her guests.   After this case is over, I plan to stay away from her for awhile!

That's true.  I find myself screaming at the defense lawyers all the time!

That will be interesting...to see how she speaks.She's had plenty of time to practice making conversation without all the profanity.
But I think she'll lose it if she is questioned for very long.  ::MonkeyCool::

Yes Cindy made up the story, you could see when George was talking to Greta she kept shaking her head with his every word. Like when a kid is reciting memorization homework and the mom nods yes with every word to keep the kid on track.

Thanks Trimm, Wyks posted what I thought was a link on SM. I just wanted to make sure I didn't offend anyone with a question I asked. I will check this one out.

heres a great video showing her pings and what times known she was at home.

http://video.aol.com/video-detail/casey-anthony-june-14-16-cell-pings/789882747

I don't like how she screams. Its like she is screaming at me and she makes Joe jump if I listen through Willen's tv online. She skeers my baby with her screaming.

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

I'm sure there is a sign outside the studio "Check your dignity at the door. Your balls will be returned to you after the show is done."

LOL, that is my video I created off of KCJackie's ping map, LOLOL

I'm voting for LP's getting her nails done comment. Everyone knows a woman will feel much better about the crime she has committed and willing to tell all once she's had a manny and a peddie!  ::MonkeyWink::

its great ! you did an awesome job!

I was overwhelmed by all the people who put all her cell phone pings together, would the cell phone pings that showed she was at home, could it also mean she was close to home. Like say she was at Lee's, or somewhere close by. All those weird places she was at all hours, I though maybe she was doing that to throw off LE. But the more I think about it, she is so lazy, maybe that was not what she was doing.

I would have thought she would have calmed down a little since she had the twins, but in a horrible case like this, it has her more worked up, I can't blame her I guess, I just wish she wasn't so rude. Poor Joe, I know Zoe gets like that with screaming and loud noises. Poor babies.

IMO, Casey learned to lie from Cindy.  Both lie in the same way.  Both try to disarm people with lots of little details, and indeed, many will fall for that ploy.  The more details, the more likely the story is true.  They also embellish with various dramatic flourishes and go off on tangents to avoid things that might incriminate them.  I could give a dozen examples from Casey's known lies and the ones that we feel certain Cindy told to LE and the FBI.  With most people, a flood of words indicates deception and a cunning attempt to snow the listener. They also borrow facts and names and figures from stories, books, tv, things that happen to others.  I honestly think that Casey thought if she claimed that she worked at Universal Studios, gave a few details and dropped a few made-up names, the cops would never check to see that she really worked there.  That is what worked for her with her parents, her friends, etc.  But Cindy is where she learned to do that, probably by the example. 

Good Afternoon Monks old and new! I asked about those statements on several occasions. LP is the only person I ever heard mention a hotel or hotel parking lot. I also question the choking incident...I might be wrong but didn't that come from casey to lee to jesse? Anything that comes from casey mouth is IMO not believable.......and lee way back probably believed her. Bet if we asked him now...he might change his story. I also would LOVE to know what casey was doing that we don't know about that made cin-cin go for counseling......and that counselor told her to try to get custody of Caylee.  Casey has been spinning out of control for a long time......her parents are major contributors to her actions as it seems they have never made her take responsibility for her actions.....stealing, lying, and who knows what else....she must have been neglecting Caylee...that is the only thing I think would make cin-cin even consider trying to gain custody.........and sadly perhaps if she had, Caylee would still be alive. They have to live with that knowledge for the rest of their lives. When I listen to the jail tapes at how both G & A handle her with kid gloves it's obvious to me that that is how she has been handled all her life....

:smt038 :smt038 ::MonkeyWink::

You would think she would calm down, I watched her years ago I think during Natalee. She got on my nerves then as much as she does now. I'm glad Joe isn't the only one afraid of loud noises, its just that when he hears NG, he hides in the bathroom. He only hides there during tornados. When he cowers by the toilet, you bet your butt I grab the keys, my ice skates, a mattres and throw him in the tub. Then I go on the balcony to be the nosy Nelly and watch what is going on.

Sorry off topic, just a few more days to go and I will be on topic for all posts! PROMISE  ::MonkeyCool::

Some of the cell pings that show she was in the Anthony home area could have been her sitting in the Woods where she disposed of caylees body. Im not sure what the range of the cell towers encompass.

KCJackie did the awesome job of putting the ping maps together.  All I did was download them into the 3D map and upload to Youtube.  So kudos to KCJackie!

I totally agree with you, I don't think for a second Casey thought LE was going to investigate like they did. Everybody in the past either believed her, or knew she was lying, but let her get away with it, it was just easier that way.

That makes sense, CSI would not have torn up the mattress for no reason. I also believe George made up that whole story for the 16th of June, or I should say, Cindy made up that story and told him to say it.
[/quote]

All I can imagine is after the nasty fight KC had with her mother, she drags little Caylee off to her bedroom. KC is pissed and feeling like she is going to loose everything. Cindy has drawn a line in the sand that she has never done before. I believe that Cindy told KC she was an unfit mother, maybe even had evidence on her, and told her that she was going for custody of Caylee.

Now KC is panicking, she truly has lost this fight, she will have no place to go, no one to pay her bills and her family is putting the well being of Caylee before her. They are telling her that they love Caylee more than her. Now she is faced with RESPONSIBILITY of her own life. How dare they love little snot head more than her!!?? KC is angry and sitting next to her, crying her little heart out for Grandma is her Nemesis, the object of her troubles and pain.  She yells at her to shut up, doesn't work, so she grabs a pillow and holds it over her head to quiet her crys. Feels good, just shut up, shut up, shut up!!! By the time the rage subsides and says Caylee isn't moving. KC then starts to put her previous plan into action.

If what LP says is true, she could have left that night, put Caylee in the trunk and made her way over to the hotel. I don't know, just talking here, it's hard to understand the mind of a killer.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I believe that Casey never thought Cindy would call the cops. She had believed Casey's bs for so long, it was old hat. Only thing is, Casey didn't realize that Cindy loved Caylee more than Casey or her bs.

Thanks, that would make sense, I have no idea about cell towers and there range, but she could have been in the woods, Lee's house, and maybe the hotel if that story is true.

Several people have mentioned her being in the woods with Caylee's body. I don't beleeive that for one second. That place is snake filled.....IMO no way would she be out there, especially at night. I don't really think she gave much thought about Caylee being out there....

It would be hard to imagine her sitting in those woods, very creepy and then add snakes to that. ::MonkeyEek::

All I can imagine is after the nasty fight KC had with her mother, she drags little Caylee off to her bedroom. KC is pissed and feeling like she is going to loose everything. Cindy has drawn a line in the sand that she has never done before. I believe that Cindy told KC she was an unfit mother, maybe even had evidence on her, and told her that she was going for custody of Caylee.

Now KC is panicking, she truly has lost this fight, she will have no place to go, no one to pay her bills and her family is putting the well being of Caylee before her. They are telling her that they love Caylee more than her. Now she is faced with RESPONSIBILITY of her own life. How dare they love little snot head more than her!!?? KC is angry and sitting next to her, crying her little heart out for Grandma is her Nemesis, the object of her troubles and pain.  She yells at her to shut up, doesn't work, so she grabs a pillow and holds it over her head to quiet her crys. Feels good, just shut up, shut up, shut up!!! By the time the rage subsides and says Caylee isn't moving. KC then starts to put her previous plan into action.

If what LP says is true, she could have left that night, put Caylee in the trunk and made her way over to the hotel. I don't know, just talking here, it's hard to understand the mind of a killer.   ::MonkeyNoNo::
[/quote] ITA, except for the Caylee crying part. If Caylee were crying loud enough, Cindy would have been in that room in a second flat. I think she was crying for Cindy earlier, then Casey gave her a pill, shot of benadryl, chloroform or whatever. When Caylee was out, she smothered her. She didn't want to hear her cry for Cindy ever again. That put an end to the crying for Cindy. If the little snot head isn't gonna cry for me, then she ain't gonna cry again. Same hear, hard to think in the mind of a killer.

Agree Sunny. She might break a nail, get bit by a snake or worse! She might break a sweat. She didn't care where Caylee was as long as she was out of sight. Out of sight out of mind is Casey's mantra.

ITA, except for the Caylee crying part. If Caylee were crying loud enough, Cindy would have been in that room in a second flat. I think she was crying for Cindy earlier, then Casey gave her a pill, shot of benadryl, chloroform or whatever. When Caylee was out, she smothered her. She didn't want to hear her cry for Cindy ever again. That put an end to the crying for Cindy. If the little snot head isn't gonna cry for me, then she ain't gonna cry again. Same hear here, hard to think in the mind of a killer.
[/quote] BIG FAT EDIT I cannot believe I spelled here hear! Sorry monkeys.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::     I wonder how much her experts get paid to put up with her attitude.

She might not of gone back to the body per say. But i think she  drove in the vicinity to see if there was any action in the area. She was so scared the body might of been discovered that she would know longer physically talk to Cindy on the phone. She began only texting acording to Cindy-yet on the other hand Cindy gave really elaborate testimony to LE about her and KC pones calls. Did anyone else catch that too?

Not enough! ::MonkeyTongue::  I really loved the night Nejame put her in her place ::MonkeyWink::

That was good!! I was bouncing and yelling You Go Nejame!!! I loved it and I'm sure 1/2 of America did too!
 ::MonkeyDance::

You might be right...however, I don't think she was worried about Caylee being found and I'd bet she never drove buy there. Casey thought she was smarter than anyone else.....including the police. Yes, I remember cin-cin saying they talked nearly everyday and casey always has a legitimate reason for not coming home. When she told those lies she already knew Caylee was deceased and Casey was responsible. She had already made Caylee disposable and her concentration was on saving Casey.

hahahaha..on the other hand one night when she was so rude to Tim I could have crawled through the screen and bitch slapped her. I know WHY he continues to go on...and wish he didn't feel that he had to...but we know Tim will do whatever it takes to help find a lost soul....Bless his heart!

Yeah Sunny, but why? Why would her granddaughter be expendible? Whad does Casey have on Cindy that Cindy would sell her soul for Casey? Could it be Cindy was the one that gave Casey the xanax to keep Caylee quiet and Casey was going to rat out Cindy? Cindy could lose her RN license. Could that be it?

Just another stupid question from JSM.

I agree with you. I just wonder how the lying and manipulating turned into the ability to murder.
I am also waiting to see what transpires as Spindy and George get on the witness stand and testify..what will Crazy do? I predict she will definitely cry for herself.. I think Spindy will be the most interesting testimony aside from Tony

And another misspelled word from JSM.  ::MonkeyWaa::

But I thought she in that area with her car,when she ran out of gas and her and Tony got the gas from the shed. It seems he took her to her car near chickasaw trail. Cant remember the date they stole the gas cans.  Cant wait till the trial to get more of the specifics.

I agree Cindy knew the truth about Caylee very early on.

I wish one of the news media could get to one of casey's jailers and they would tell what really goes on....what does she do, how does she act? who does she talk to....I remember in one of the jail interviews with Lee she had something set up with him so she could call him.....how many calls does she get a day, a week? Are the calls monitored? Since it's a pay phone and she has to call collect is there anyway to monitor the calls. I want to know the real reason the A's haven't been to see her? IT is not because they are feared of being taped......they love it....If it were me I would certainly use those tapes to be proclaiming my daughter innocence and let the public see how much pain she is in.....but they can't do that....so is casey punishing them or are they punishing her.........OR is BJ pulling the strings......is he afraid they might ask her to tell the truth OR actually confront her?

Me too, me too, I wanna know all of that.

JSM, stop beating yourself up! we all misspell and your questions are valid...  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Oh Thank you for sharing this with us Boo Monkey!!!!!
Bless Richard Grunds Beautiful Heart...

Hugs,
PJ (Paula) :flower:

Good Evening Monkey's

I found this helpful on google -  Casey Cell pings for June 16th..

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=103915041605280294744.00045939495d21e691a46&ll=28.558592,-81.309128&spn=0.265966,0.43396&t=h&z=11 (http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=103915041605280294744.00045939495d21e691a46&ll=28.558592,-81.309128&spn=0.265966,0.43396&t=h&z=11)

JSM no question is stupid.....don't think that. JMO....but she knew she had lost Caylee....and she believed it to be an accident (how does one ever come to believe their child is a murderer?) she knows she can't bring Caylee back and doesn't want to lose her daughter as well.  OR as you said...perhaps it was her Xanex.....but I can't see cin-cin giving it to casey to quiet Caylee...but perhaps it was hers, her prescription.....and casey admitted to her she gave some to Caylee and Caylee never woke up....that could be too much for cin-cin weak mind to absorb.....that HER meds killed Caylee

Is this what you are looking for? 

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4275.msg600656#msg600656 (http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4275.msg600656#msg600656)

Thanks Flamom. Sometimes I feel like my questions have no relevance to the case and I don't have spell check. So I feel quite stupid as I do type for a living.  ::MonkeyWaa::

So many people would gladly help girls like Crazy and take their kids in. This happened here where I live..on Christmas day
http://www.tcpalm.com/news/2008/dec/27/police-port-st-lucie-woman-kills-son-8-christmas/?feedback=1

Or . . . Ohmmmmmmm DANG I'M HOT Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!   ::cartwheel::

If the baby was there in person he could give her a little bite and quieten her down.  ::MonkeyDance::  ::cartwheel::

And how interesting that LE took pictures of Cindy's medicine cabinet during the last search warrant!    hmmmm

You Can spellcheck what you type here. At the bottom of the box it says Post Preview and Spellcheck  ::MonkeyHaHa::
Sometimes I am just too lazy to use it  ::MonkeyHaHa::

You're good Klaas,what can you say?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Sorry Sunny I didn't mean to say Cindy gave Casey the pills to keep Caylee quiet. I meant that Casey took Cindy's pills to give to Caylee. I don't know if Casey confessed to nicking Cindy's pills or Cindy did a count after the fact and I don't believe in a million years Cindy thought it was an accident if she was missing pills. If she thought it were an accident, she would have told the police from the beginning, not made George give that cock and bull story about the pool ladder being left out. Poor George, even has to tell a lie on national tv that his wife calls and yells at him about the ladder. He is so PW'd it is pathetic.

I think if you add jealousy and anger and hurt with the lying and manipulating you will see....I was shocked when Jesse said the reason Casey broke up with him was that she said he loved Caylee more than he loved her. That was the first time I had heard that....so her parents loved Caylee more than her and now Jesse too...ummmmmm

I think BJ will try for a plea bargain before it goes to trial. He is graping at straws now.....establishing a tip line to prove Casey didn't kill Caylee.....gee I thought he already could prove that. ::MonkeyWink:: He has been posturing all along....remember the tips...ooopsss never picked them up, the crime scene...ooopsss sorry we don't need to go now....where is the picture of Zanny......if he had anything that was even near to proving Casey was innocent he would not have asked for a continuance or a change of venue...he would have been like a cowboy....bring it on!!! However if it does go to trial I think G will tell the truth and cin-cin will lie.

Thanks Wyks, I wanted to make sure I could find it. I wanted to clarify a post I made last night and make sure I didn't offend anyone. Thanks again.

OMG how awful. Glad she lived though she can go through hell on earth for what she did.

Baez was talking about the Casey is innocent tip line, but he never gave a number to call, if there now is a number I have not seen it. ::MonkeyRoll::

Quick I'm on my way to Atlanta right now. Josef get in the car, I have a little, sorry big snack for you in the morning.  ::cartwheel::

They did? I didn't know that. Hmmm I may make sense after all.  ::MonkeyWaa::

Silly girl....every question relating to the case is relevent....and my dear you will never catch up with me as far as typos go.... ::MonkeyTongue::  There is spell check here on the reply page.....bottom right..... It might work for you....LOL...it hates me!! ::MonkeyWink::

And JSM your posts have been especially interesting today.
Besides, I don't know whad word you spelled wrong . . .  ::MonkeyCool::

I don't think Casey will let him plea. She has the mind of OJ. She didn't do anything wrong, so why would she cop a plea? OJ could have gotten a slap on the wrist in Nevada, but he didn't plea because he in his mind was justified for what he did. They stole stuff that belonged to the Brown's, me and my kids. WTF ever!

That i really terribly sad......another innocent taken away too soon

No Rose if you get the number let me have it. I have a tip for Baez and it aint about a horse.

Thanks Jerseygirl!!   ::MonkeyDance::

I didn't even know there was one, maybe I should put my glasses on while I post or better yet lay off the Miller Lite while the Cowboys are on TV.

  ::MonkeyLaugh:: Whad wort?  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Something they found either at the crime scene or perhaps in a toxicology report made them look at the medicine cabinet ::MonkeyWink::

Sorry - OT    -   The Eagles are beating those cowboys good....   You might need that Miller Lite!

You're welcome!   ::MonkeyWink::

neither have I...more posturing on BJs part.  Just like him screaming for a second autopsy....as one of the experts explained on some show...you can't do an autopsy on skeletal remains.....there was no soft tissue or organs to autopsy.....

I think it's definitely the infamous assclown, Baez.  I'm sure that not many agree with me, but I think he's afraid Casey will eventually break down and spill something and it will be on tape for all to see.

JSM, you crack me up!!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

I don't think Casey will let him plea. She has the mind of OJ. She didn't do anything wrong, so why would she cop a plea? OJ could have gotten a slap on the wrist in Nevada, but he didn't plea because he in his mind was justified for what he did. They stole stuff that belonged to the Brown's, me and my kids. WTF ever!
[/quote]

I do hope you are right! I think she will get life if it goes to trial. UNLESS there was indeed duct tape wrapped around her skull and IF casey's prints are on it....then they will go for the DP....not so with a plea.

hahahahaha....don't give up the Miller lite unless it's for Bud Light!! ::MonkeyTongue::

  ::cartwheel:: Cowboys are losing, I get another beer  ::cartwheel:: Born and raised here and still hate the Cowboys! Fridge here I come  ::cartwheel::

I tend to agree about BJ ::MonkeyWink::  and about JSM ::MonkeyWink::

Supposedly last night on an Orlando news channel there was mention of a connection of a plant from the Anthony's yard, to the crime scene, a hibiscus plant. I saw this on another site, I have been looking all around to verify this, and I wondered if anyone local had seen this on the news. I remember there was much talk about a hibiscus plant in the Anthony's yard.

Hi Wyks, I posted on that link. It probably isn't much info than you already know. Just my thoughts on Eric Hansen's dad.

That's interesting.   Hibiscus plants like a lot of sun.   What kind of plant did the A's move in the back yard - by the pool?   Anyone remember?   

I have always thought that Flossy. I'm sure JB knows that given a chance KC will blurt something out that she shouldn't and thus blow what little work he has done. All he has to do is whisper in her ear how her parents are going to blow it for her, her brother doesn't really care, he's going to testify too, you better not talk to them! They did you wrong, they are not on your side, only I believe you. If he plays to her ego, she will go along with anything he says. They are both in it for the infamy.

I remember Cindy making a big deal about moving a plant in the back yard durring her Greta interview early on.

Whad I to Flossy to crak you up?  ::MonkeyTongue:: 

I hate the Cowboys, too.   Cause I'm a Redskins fan  (or should I say "deadskins").    Mic Ultra Light, here!

Exactly!!     ::MonkeyHaHa::

Pretty sure it was a Hibiscus tree in a container.

WOW.  Isn't that interesting!    And, now I wonder if maybe this plant has something to do with KC borrowing the shovel.

I'm pretty sure it was also, I think Cindy was talking about it when Greta was at their house.

Does anyone know or remember when it was that BJ filed a motion to allow casey out of jail to search in secret for caylee???

IIRC, it was just before Tim Miller returned in Early November.  So probably around Oct 30 or so?   

(quote)
I am not gay, but resent the implication by armchair experts that gay men are the majority of molesters.. It is uninformed and wrong, gays have enough social stigmas to overcome without being labelled for more.

I posted a reply in Monkey Musings (post #148)

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4248.msg601145#msg601145

Homosexuality and child molestation: the link, the likelihood, the lasting effects

Hibiscus plant? not sure, but; medicine cabinet, bedding, toys, insectiside, piping and who knows what else.   Seems a wealth of evidence could be building connecting Casey to the crime against her daughter.  Listening to the jail tape I couldn't help but notice Casey's comment about the family getting Caylee back "the way she was."   Why would she say that?  Slip of the tongue?  How did she know the way she is? 

Some of the calls have been released, so we can assume that they are all recorded.  Here are two, there were others.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/nationworld/orl-casey-anthony-july30-mp3,0,2509150.mp3file
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/nationworld/orl-casey-anthony-jail-full-mp3,0,5422703.mp3file

I read that too on other sites a yellow hibiscus planted near Caylee's body maybe a connection from the Anthony's back yard. Nothing concrete yet. ::MonkeyNoNo::

Where did this info come from Sassycat... Has the warrant info been released?

(congrats on being a Grandma  ::MonkeyDance:: )

Thanks SS!

I believe NG mentioned the medicine cabinet, and I think it was talked about on Geraldo, too.    I've heard about it from  several different places!

Results from hearing 10/10
Posted on October 10, 2008 by yourturntohelp
1. Motion to seal
No ruling yet, will be heard at a future court date

2. Motion for production of favorable evidence
Ruled in favor of defense

3. Demand for discovery and inspection relating to digital forensic evidence
Ruled in favor of defense

4. Motion to inspect, test and photograph evidence held by the state of Florida

Ruled in favor of defense

5. Motion to compel department of children and family records
Denied, Baez has to retile

6. demand for discovery and inspection related to polygraphs
Ruled in favor of defense

7. Motion to compel: release of records about investigation into Senoia Gonzalez
Ruled in favor of defense

8.  Motion for allowing defendant to travel to places of interest
No ruling yet, will be heard at a future court date

9. Motion to compel flight manifest
Ruled in favor of defense

10. Motion to compel results of forensic testing
Ruled in favor of defense

11. Defendants motion to preserve forensic evidence and for court to consider additional testing
No ruling yet, will be heard at a future court date

Oh thank-you I've been looking and looking for more info on this, I am going crazy. ::MonkeyConfused::

I do hope you are right! I think she will get life if it goes to trial. UNLESS there was indeed duct tape wrapped around her skull and IF casey's prints are on it....then they will go for the DP....not so with a plea.
[/quote] I hope I am right too. Something was in that bag that led LE to the house. They found what they are looking for, therefore the State's Attorney will not allow a plea. If that happens I will again look like a money's bottom. She will be convicted of 1st degree murder.

Thanks...thought I'd missed something. I hope the last two warrants will be public info soon.
Perhaps LE found an empty prescription bottle from the A's house with Caylee's remains ?

NEVAH give up the Miller Lite, I like the name reminds me of a good guy named Tim.  ::MonkeyTongue::

http://www.foxnews.com/video-search/m/21706580/barrage_of_suffering.htm

Sorry Sassy I told Klaas I will not post off topic, but I believe Casey is a murderer and George and Cindy covered.

Now O/T.. I am an sAIN'Ts fan. Gotta love New Orleans!

Good Nite Monkeys. I can't keep up.I'm being attacked with a light sabre.  ::MonkeyShocked:: It's on now.I'm out of here.  ::MonkeyHaHa::
Hopefully we will get some news tommorrow.

 ::MonkeyDance::

Thanks Sassy, I was looking for this!

Am thinking we've had plenty of discussion on these pings already, I've been under a rock or something... sorry.  I do have some questions tho. 

Am looking at the above ping map, and notice that for several hours into the early morning of June 16th, the pings go back and forth and back and forth between 2 locations. 

Both locations seem to be parking lots.  One is near "Johnson's Wrecker" and the other isn't named, but you can see the that location at the above map, ping #'s 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, and 21.  (pings in between were at the place near Johnsons Wrecker).  Anyone local or otherwise know what that unnamed location is?

At around 3:30 a.m. she stops near Johnson's Wrecker and maybe went to sleep.  (?)  The pings pick up again around 7:45 a.m. and continue going back and forth between those same two locations until around 4:15 p.m. in the afternoon.  And then she leaves those locations and drives to other places until about 11:17 pm. 

Why on earth would she just drive back and forth between these two places, for hours!   WTF?   ::MonkeyHaHa::

Nite Trim, best of luck on the light saber attack!!  ::MonkeyConfused::

Either that, or they have the tox report back or maybe part of it.

Good Night!!

I'm sorry I cannot stand to look at JB anymore. He is the spitting image of Hugo Chavez and that Keney Baden lady looks like the guy in my apartments when he goes out for his evening on the town. Can I have a synopsis or transcript of what they said please?

You look cute by the way boo.

eeek...that's Geraldo tho...his credibility is 0% for me..is he on the defence team now?? he sure sounds like it..

Do you have the NG link for this? This is hard for me to say but I'll give her some credibility.. maybe 10%  ::MonkeyTongue::

that always made me wonder too...

Planted?? Honestly can't see KC caring enough to actually dig in the dirt and plant a memorial to her daughter. No, I see her as a Here's your Hat, What's your Hurry kinda girl. She dumped Caylee out, cleaned out the car and was on her way. Maybe the plant got stuck to her shoe as she tramped on by.

I wonder if there are any motels in that area? ::MonkeyEek::

She had just killed her baby that is in her back seat. She had no where else to go, nervous energy. It is a Sunday night. All her peeps are nursing a hangover or in bed getting ready to go to work like normal folks do. Casey isn't normal so she drives around with her daughters corpse in the car because she is bored. Sorry Wyks, that's the way I see it. Also, I have tried to look at Klaas' ping video, but I got motion sick and had to stop.  ::MonkeyWaa::

I remember hearing the first call....but not the one with Lee...and I can't get any audio on the links you provide...but thanks for the reply

LOL!  ::MonkeyLaugh:: you are way too funny! Thanks for the compliment, CBB fixed me up!!