Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

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photoshop courtesy of 'Mia's myspace 427249817  

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Wow, a trifecta!!!

Wah hoo!  This was way cool! 

I feel like I just had my house cleaned and my closets reorganized.  What a fresh feeling!!!

 ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel::

YAY.................Im outta there!

How come seasearcher is always first???   ::MonkeyEek::

WHEW!  boy was I glad to see that key  ::MonkeyEek::

I see you up there, don't spill that coffee on my head!!!

 ::MonkeyTongue::

He cheats!

Where did everybody go?

Baby, you got the key, I got the lock!!!    ::MonkeyWink::

Uuuuuuhhhhhhh   HHHuuuuuhhhh! 

Now....  What can we talk about NEXT!???

(http://bestsmileys.com/animals/11.gif)

cause I'm sober  ::MonkeyTongue:: and Bearly gave me a backstage pass  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Muffy, I like your pretty balloon for Valentines day!~

There was an article posted last thread that stated that LE had got an additional subpoena and took a bunch of Caylee's clothes, shoes and personal items, then they raided KC's closet. I know it's not funny but it struck me funny that they worded it that way. Makes me think of LE trying on dresses and squirting each other with perfume. Sorry, just took another dose of meds and just thought it sounded strange to me... raided KC's closet, like trying on shoes or something!!  ::MonkeyWink::

I think he cheats  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

OK.  How did you get to be first again???       ::MonkeyTongue::

Not me.  You made too many backstage passes on New Year's Eve, you still have some kissing up to do.   ::MonkeyTongue::

You're so funny, Boo!  What a visual!   ::MonkeyTongue::

LOL  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yes, that happened the minute they completed their investigation of the crime scene where Caylee was found.  They released it then immediately got a subpoena and searched the Anthony's (Casey's closet, etc).

Just recently?

I hope they sprayed them with raid first!    ::MonkeyEek::

 ::MonkeyShocked::  and I've tried so hard to stay sorta kinda on topic  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I only stop now and the to pet the kittys...I can't help it...it's a weakness  ::MonkeyRoll::

you know, they keep saying that this case is a circumstantial case.  But how can they say that with all the evidence WE have seen, not counting what we haven't?  Just because KC was not caught on film at Target actually killing her baby?  Call me stupid but how can they keep saying that? 

Thank you.  They were compliments of CBB from last year.  It's amazing.  They are still full of helium.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

A circumstantial case is still a good case.

(http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr165/Sea_Searcher/thumbnail.jpg)

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

I will not state the obvious!

Exactly, especially with the evidence in her trunk and a phantom nanny.

That is just fabulous.  I love it!

hello everyone  ::MonkeyCool::

Casey's Closet, Caylee's Room Searched

Monday, December 22, 2008 – updated: 9:29 am EST January 1, 2009
ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- WFTV has learned crime scene investigators stripped Caylee Anthony's room and then raided Casey's closet during a recent search of the home.

Crime scene investigators have confiscated boxes of items from the Anthony home two times in the past week.

Sources tell Eyewitness News last Thursday, investigators were focused on Caylee Anthony. They took her clothes, shoes and her toys.

Over the weekend, another search warrant was executed and investigators came back for Casey Anthony's belongings. They took more of Caylee's clothes, five to eight pairs of Casey's shoes and her clothes as well.

That's a start.   ::MonkeyCool::

HI Lucinda!  ::MonkeyDance::

(http://www.33smiley.com/smiley2/communicate/everyday/16.gif)

uh, yeah.  I can think of a couple of reasons...

I can't believe I made..I have the flu so I have been mostly lurking today,it hurts to type. (I don't care what my mom says, it's the FLU) Anyhow, does anyone know about the sunshine laws that can help me. They are by far the most liberal I have ever seen. How do they distinguish what can be released under that law vrs what is held until trial? If they have to have everything to the defense before trial, surely that doesn't mean that everyone sees everything they (LE) has before trial, does it?

Hi there!

Yes.  I have also heard that they can't actually connect her with anything in relation to the killing.  THE CAR????!!!????  And the fact that she was the last person seen with her daughter.

I am sure I saw this on JVM.  Say what you want, I think I could host that show. 
1.  I have much better hair.  (sorry but it is true)

and drum roll please.....

2.  I actually kow about the case   ::MonkeyLaugh::

Probably because "they" don't know the evidence that LE has.  This is not a circumstantial case; there is a lot of hard evidence.  LE has done their job well and not released this yet.  We'll hear it at trial.  I think those that are calling this a circumstantial case are simply trying to entice viewers to their media.

G'day Lucinda!!! I just missed you this morning!!!  ::MonkeyWink::

Hi Adoraboo! Yes I see what you're thinking about the "raiding the closet". It does sound kind of funny. I didn't actually think of it that way till you said it though. You are a silly Monkey sometimes!
 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hey Cutie,

GREAT QUESTION!!!

i wish i had the answer....

Amen,  we will be surprised when the trial starts at what cards LE is holding...........

Circumstantial evidence is a collection of facts that, when considered together, can be used to infer a conclusion about something unknown. Circumstantial evidence is usually a theory, supported by a significant quantity of corroborating evidence. Corroboration is normally supplied by one or more expert witnesses who provide forensic evidence.

Compared to direct evidence

If a witness testifies that the defendant was seen entering a house, then screaming was heard, then the defendant was seen leaving, carrying a bloody knife, that is circumstantial evidence; if a witness testifies that he/she actually saw the defendant stabbing the victim, that is direct evidence. Similarly, if a videotape is entered into evidence showing the defendant entering the house, stabbing the victim, and leaving the house, that too is circumstantial evidence.

Applications of circumstantial evidence

The two areas of importance are criminal and civil cases where direct evidence is lacking. Forensic evidence is often crucial in establishing the truth of a matter, especially when corroborated by independent tests. Expert evidence is usually needed to prove forensic conclusions.

Criminal Law

Circumstantial evidence is used in criminal courts to establish guilt or innocence through reasoning.

The distinction between direct and circumstantial evidence is important because, with the obvious exceptions (the immature, incompetent, or mentally ill), nearly all criminals are careful to not generate direct evidence[clarification needed], and try to avoid demonstrating criminal intent. Therefore, to prove the mens rea levels of "purposely" or "knowingly," the prosecution must usually resort to circumstantial evidence. The same goes for tortfeasors in tort law, if one needs to prove a high level of mens rea to obtain punitive damages. In addition, circumstantial evidence -- such as fingerprint evdience -- is usually the best available evidence to support an inference as to the facts of the case.

One example of circumstantial evidence is the behavior of a person around the time of an alleged offense. If someone was charged with theft of money, and was then seen in a shopping spree purchasing expensive items, the shopping spree might be regarded as circumstantial evidence of the individual's guilt.

Forensic evidence

Other examples of circumstantial evidence are fingerprint, blood analysis or DNA analysis of the evidence found at the scene of a crime. These types of evidence may strongly point to a certain conclusion when taken into consideration with other facts, but if not directly witnessed by someone when the crime was committed, they are still considered to be circumstantial in nature. However, when proved by expert witnesses, they are usually sufficient to decide a case especially in the absence of any direct evidence. Owing to the development in forensic methods, old undecided case (or cold cases) are frequently resolved.

A popular misconception is that circumstantial evidence is less valid or less important than direct evidence. This is only partly true: direct evidence is popularly, but mistakenly, considered more powerful, while in fact many successful criminal prosecutions often rely largely or entirely on circumstantial evidence, and civil charges are frequently based on circumstantial or indirect evidence. Indeed, the common metaphor for the strongest possible evidence in any case -- the 'smoking gun' -- is in fact an example of proof based on circumstantial evidence. Similarly, fingerprint evidence, videotapes, sound recordings, photographrs, and many other examples of physical evidence that support the drawing of an inference, i.e., circumstantial evidence, are considered the strongest possible evidence.

In practice, circumstantial evidence has an advantage over direct evidence in that it is more difficult to suppress or fabricate. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously inaccurate at times, and many persons have been convicted on the basis of perjured or otherwise mistaken testimony. Good strong circumstantial evidence can be a far more reliable basis on which to make a determination of guilt. It should be noted that circumstantial evidence normally requires a witness, such as the police officer who found the evidence, or an expert who examined it, to lay the foundation for its admission. This witness, sometimes known as the sponsor or the authenticating witness, is giving direct (eye-witness) testimony, and could present credibility problems in the same way that any eye witness does.

Much of the evidence against Timothy McVeigh was circumstantial, for example. Speaking about McVeigh's trial, University of Michigan law professor Robert Precht said, "Circumstantial evidence can be, and often is much more powerful than direct evidence". [1] The recent Scott Peterson trial was based heavily on circumstantial evidence.

However, there is sometimes more than one logical conclusion inferable from the same set of circumstances. In cases where one conclusion implies a defendant's guilt and another their innocence, the 'benefit of the doubt' principle would apply. Indeed, if the circumstantial evidence suggests a possibility of innocence, the prosecution has the burden of disproving that possibility.

Civil law

Circumstantial evidence is also used in civil courts to establish or deny liability. It is usually the most common form of evidence, especially in product liability cases, and road traffic accidents for example. Forensic analysis of skid marks can frequently allow a reconstruction of the accident to be made. By measuring the length of such marks and using dynamic analysis of the car and road conditions at the time of the accident, it is usually found that drivers under-estimate the speed at which they were travelling. Forensic science and forensic engineering are both common methods used in civil cases, just as much as in criminal cases.

aww  ::MonkeyWink::  thanks everyone for the hellos back.  I have windows open in here trying to keep up still  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Agreed.  I can't stand the show I heard it on.  Blech

Welcome back!  You left this morning before I had a chance to say hi!

Good luck with that. I've spent hours trying to catch up sometimes. Sometimes it's just impossible and I skip ahead.  ::MonkeyConfused::

Actually, many people are cashing in on this case, from Nancy Grace to Clint House (who knows nothing significant) to the PI's and anyone else who can sell an interview or media article.  Why did the newspaper say that LE "raided" Casey's closet?  Because that is a word full of connotative meaning and will attract more attention than using a word like "searched."  For the same reason they printed that LE "stripped" Caylee's room.  We know that LE can only remove items specifically stated in the search warrant.  However, these words might arouse more interest, so the paper loads their articles and hopes to sell more papers.  Follow the money.

Hey Quiet, you are quiet sparklie yourself!!  ::MonkeyWink::

i still think someone was trying awfully hard to find Caylee by her 3rd b-day.
Aug 8th-Casey refuses to see her brother on a previousley scheduled jail visit
Aug 9th-Caylee's 3rd b-day
Aug 10th-Casey refuses to see parents
Aug 11th-Casey's brother, Lee cancels a scheduled visit-1st CALL FROM METER READER
Aug 12th-2nd CALL FROM METER READER
Aug 13th-3rd CALL FROM METER READER
Aug 14th-Casey accepts visit from parents
Aug 15th-A dect. with the osco tells Fox news that all future jailhouse visits will be withheld "due to a criminal investigative excemption"

Thanks for the great info Boo!  I am hoping the the forensics evidence in combo with this circumstantial evidence makes for a in and out jury! 

Here is a start:

http://myfloridalegal.com/sunshine

In Florida, every person has been granted the Constitutional right to inspect or copy any public record with some exemptions, and the Sunshine Law provides a right of access to government proceedings at both the state and local levels. These essential laws afford citizens of our state the ability to see behind the curtain of government and remain involved in the processes that affect their lives. Without this access there is little accountability, and accountability is vital for good government.

About the Sunshine Law and Public Records Law
Frequently Asked Questions About Florida's Open Government Laws
View and Search Government-in-the-Sunshine Manual
Download an abridged version of the Government-in-the-Sunshine Manual
How to obtain a published copy of Government-in-the-Sunshine Manual
The Attorney General's Office plays a key role in keeping Florida's government open to all Floridians. The office is charged with mediating disputes involving access to public records and provides a mediation program to that effect - a resource which can be requested by any member of the public and was put into action more than 75 times in 2007. The mediation program involves an impartial individual who encourages and facilitates the resolution of a dispute involving access to public records. The mediators assist the participants in fostering joint problem-solving and exploring settlement alternatives. By allowing parties to resolve issues in an informal mediation process, we prevent expensive and time-consuming litigation which is often not an option for a citizen who is merely trying to hold his or her government accountable and responsible for its actions.

Members of local government entities or law enforcement agencies seeking to resolve public records issues may contact the Attorney General's Office at 850-245-0197.
Consumers seeking mediation may contact the Attorney General's Office at 850-245-0204.
More information about the Attorney General's Open Government Mediation Program
Public Records Law Guide for Law Enforcement Agencies
Request Public Records from the Attorney General's Office
Anyone seeking public records may also call 850-245-0140.
Attorney General McCollum has also launched the Government Accountability Project (GAP) whose objective is to encourage state and local government entities to be proactive in providing Florida's citizens the information and records they need to hold government accountable. The first phase of the GAP study involved a content analysis of the web sites of the 67 counties and school districts in Florida to determine the types of public records currently available online. Phase Two, now underway, includes collaborating with local government entities to increase access to records not readily available, and exploring new technologies to reach out to the people of Florida to find out what they want their government to have available to them.

Learn more about the Government Accountability Project here.


Additional Information:
First Amendment Foundation
Brechner Center for Freedom of Information
Governor's Office of Open Government
Florida Statutes - Chapter 119
Florida Statutes - Chapter 286

Very true. Same as that stupid article that accused Jesse Grund of being Caylee's killer then said nothing in the body of the article about it.  ::MonkeyNoNo::

Bearly ~  Please check the un-sticky link to this thread  ::MonkeyHaHa::   

Hi Bearly, and you are right QM  ::MonkeyHaHa::
off topic, i just heard the news about John travoltas son, how sad  ::MonkeyNoNo::

That was a great post on circumstantial evidence Boo and really appreciated. Are you still taking meds that give you a false sense of well being? I am. It is the only good thing about this FLU!! Are reading this mom, it's the FLU..Given the information you have provided, I am confused why every lawyer says the same thing!!! It had be believing that according to American law, circumstantial evidence was almost as weak as hearsay! Your post helps a great deal.

I know it's a lot to read this late at night (or day in Lucinda's case) but it does go to show that very few criminal cases would have "direct" evidence and most are based on very good circumstantial evidence. It's a tough job, I give LE full kudos on this case especially!!

even though I've been accused...falsely I might add..of cheating by the second in command, I shall kick the dirt off my boots and move forward  ::MonkeyTongue::

I was waiting for the new thread (since it was a little *cough* tense in there) to let my monkey friends know that I took the bold step tonight and jumped into my car, drove across the state line (so as not to be recognized) found a convenience store and purchased the new edition of the Globe...
I asked the nice lady (very nice lady  ::MonkeyWink:: ) behind the counter if she would kindly put it in a paper bag for me, and I snuck it out of the store under my jacket..  ::MonkeyCool::

now..

as soon as my wife goes to bed..i shall read it, and let you know what it says..

::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

From what I understand, the media and public can request access to public records under the Sunshine Law.  The trick is in defining what is a public record.  When a case is under investigation, the information uncovered during an ongoing investigation is not considered public record.  In fact, much information in an ongoing case will be considered "ongoing" right up to the day of trial. 

Awww, thanks you Adoraboo! CBB sparkled me up. You probably missed my post at the end of the last thread. CBB sparkled me up for Valentines too, but I'm not putting up my Valentines decorations till next week. Am going to celebrate New Years through the weekend. Actually I still have my Christmas tree up at home, will be taking that down Sunday.

Well Monkeys,

I am off to bed before the hubby gets home and tried to wink at me.  Yuck!   ::MonkeyWink::

I am glad you all stayed and had a great ON topic chat!!!

Good night!

 

THANKS ISLAND MONKEY!!! I did not want to repost everything but I am speaking of the post in regards to the Sunshine laws...I love this place..I learn so much

Good night perriwinkle (http://bestsmileys.com/sleeping/2.gif)

yes that is great info Boo.  I admit I get worried about lack of direct evidence, but I go back to the hair in the trunk, thats pretty well damning evidence in this case imo. 

Night Perriwinkle, I'm not too far behind you!

Well Monkeys,

I am off to bed before the hubby gets home and tries to wink at me.  Yuck!   ::MonkeyWink::

I am glad you all stayed and had a great ON topic chat!!!

Good night!

edit mine

Goodnight Perri  ::MonkeyWink::

Yeah, I just took the last dose for today. But I have to read everything twice in order for it to sink in. I'm waiting for my daughter to return home within the next 1/2 hour, then I'm going to bed!! Hopefully JSM will get her wish tomorrow!

Wow, I just caught up!!   ::MonkeyEek::

Hi AZLady - Haven't seen you in a while!  And yes I am still here!!  ::MonkeyWink::

Muffy - I think we may to change your avitar to a pitbull next!  LOL  That picture is just too cute to give a hiney shame!!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hi Bearly - I am waiting!!!!  ::MonkeyTongue::

Last but not least  - Hi Klaas - bet you have missed me - haven't you?   ::MonkeyWink::

Aww, I'm waiting for my daughter to come home soon too boo! Than I'll be going off to bed too!  ::MonkeyRoll::

So do I ::MonkeyCool::

Hi wendi~my old neighbor ::MonkeyDance:: My daughter wanted to know if you'd go to the barn and give Dewey, her favorite horse a big hug for her ::MonkeyRoll::

Hi Lucinda~haven't seen you lately-how are you doing??

Hi Mytime.  I've been busy but on Christmas break now, so I have a bit more time to poke around in here.  What's the local news about this case?  Anything interesting?

Don't let the little Bee-Baby' outward appearaece fool you fool ya'.  (http://bestsmileys.com/animals/11.gif)


Hi Mytime! ::MonkeyCool::

Goodnight, all.

I finally caught up, and now must go!

Yeah.  It sure seems that way.   Interesting.

Good night to you - and to all the monkeys going to bed.   I'm outta here, too!

I know what you mean QM....I left for a couple of hours, and considering that NG and Greta were just rehashing old news, I couldn't believe I had 18 pages to catch up on  ::MonkeyConfused::

Hi Lucinda..or should i say Good Morning  ::MonkeyHaHa:: Would you like some coffee ?
I just bought Pumpkin Spice coffee and also Eggnog coffee tonight..but I still have some
Rain Forest Nut if you prefer...

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Hi Island, doing good thank you.  Had a few busy days with my friends funeral on new years eve.  And work got busy. 

I'm sure you can be like a pitbull Muffybee, but looking at your BeeBaby and reading a chastising in the post is a bit like being stoned with popcorn!!  ::MonkeyWink::  But I will NEVER test that theory!! Promise!!!

Good night Janetruth

Good night Jane

LOL  ::MonkeyHaHa::  Thanks Sea Searcher  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Gidday SS, it is actually 3.15 pm here right now.  Id love some eggnog coffee,  please, that sounds different and yum  ::MonkeyCool::  ::MonkeyWink::

Thanks Monkeys, time to head to the bunky! Night all! See you tomorrow, back in the cage!

 ::MonkeyDance::

Oops, I was all thumbs changing into a new cage when I discovered there wasn't one!

They found us though, damn it!   ::MonkeyTongue::

I may be thick-headed, but I fail to see how this series of events indicates someone was trying to find Caylee by her 3rd birthday.  Of course, LE was trying to find Caylee, and many others were searching, but I think you need to explain a bit more to convince me of some relevance in this list of events.

goodnight all monkeys leavin  ::cartwheel::

From what I am told, the locals are so sick of this case!!  As for the news, same ole same ole!!

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

of course, my niece will be here tomorrow so we have to take all the horses a treat! i will give Dewey an extra carrot & peppermint. btw, i had c-3 from Royal Panda! yum!!!!
wendi
sorry o/t

Yeah, really. How is decomp evidence and death-band hair that had to be Caylee's in the trunk of Casey's car "circumstantial"??? And now they have Caylee's actual body and who knows what other kinds of evidence? I hate when I hear "circumstantial" with this case.

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

Second in command?  Who is second after me?   ::MonkeyTongue::

I may not have the BIG RED BUTTON in my possession, but I am in close contact with the one who does.  So, I'm not too worried...Klaas takes care of things around here.

I don't blame them.  It's a foregone conclusion that Casey is responsible for Caylee's death, and I think everyone is just ready to take this to trial and put it to bed.  I don't think we will hear any more significant information until the trial.  Then, it will be interesting.

Oh, I am so sorry~I had no idea about your friend. ::MonkeyWaa::

Thanks, AZ.  Good to see you!

SeaSearcher reminds me of an old cheater robot way back when, ALWAYS 1ST LOL :)

Waiting...for...Hi Honeybee!!!

Perhaps Casey did say something incriminating to a visitor.  We won't know until the trial.  Perhaps the opposite is true--maybe a family member said something that incriminated him or her.  That might be more likely.

Does anyone remember the meter reader giving LE the GPS position on one of his calls?

If so, perhaps they can prove that the things he spotted then didn't move.

Yep! But I can still imagine your little hands on your hips, stamping your tiny feet with those pudgy cheeks flushed! You are way too cute!!

If the locals in Orlando are sick of this case after only 6 months you can imagine how Aruba feels about the NH case.

Ahhhh, what a sweet monkey you are-but my daughter will be jealous about the Royal Panda visit........at least you didn't go to the grasshopper. ::MonkeyTongue::

i am not trying to convince anybody of anything. i only posted a timeline of events. not mine. i only know that the A's said that Caylee would be home for her 3rd b-day, i hope the meter reader is not involved but those 3 calls bother me. if i were convinced that i saw something to call 3 days in a row i would have called the 4th day, 5th day etc. jmo.

And.................???   :smt039

       :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat: :cat:

Wow Az you can think clearly tonight, I'm impressed!  ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyWink::

Thank you Boo.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

Bearly, the media and the government have sort of a co-dependent relationship.  The media is the "watchdog" keeping the government honest and open, while the government knows they need the media to report on their activities honestly and openly.  All the while, the media searches for the "breaking news" and "big story" to sell advertising, and the government attempts to do their job openly without violating privacy and other laws.  Interesting relationship there.

tomorrow is a new day! live music! i love it when they sing the "pina colada song" they don't know the words only the music!!!! my hubby gets so embarrassed cause they come to our table & sing it! lol
sorry last o/t.

thanks, he passed away suddenly two days before Christmas.  he had a good send off tho, he woulda loved it. 

I don't remember a GPS position given, but he did have a time conveying the street names on one call!  From what the meter reader said, it didn't sound like he spotted the bag with Caylee's bones in it.  He said he saw a white board and something round underneath it.  My impression was that he was not very specific as to what he saw, just that he felt it "didn't belong there."

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: Muffy~I was considering banning myself I was so *frustrated*, but boo promised she'd share the painpills from MoM earlier, so I feel better now. thanks ::MonkeyTongue::

Boo ~  Did you bring enough to share with everyone (said in teacher - voice)  ?   ::MonkeyHaHa::

And I always keep my promises!!  ::MonkeyCool::  We are going to have a KC is found guilty on all charges party on the beach!!

My first post......... ::MonkeyDance::

I have the utmost respect for TM and his organization.

Oh.....and I love my Dyson.  The BEST vacuum, ever!

(http://www.millan.net/minimations/smileys/wavesmile.gif) (http://www.millan.net)

(bowing) Thank you, my dear Boo.  Sometimes I even surprise myself.

That is one fertile cat!!!   ::MonkeyRoll::

Most murder prosecution cases rely heavily on circumstantial evidence.  Few murderers commit their crimes in broad daylight in front of dozens of witnesses and leave the smoking gun in plain view.  To the contrary, murderers usually choose the dark of night or a very private place in which to do the crime and they try to cover up afterward to leave no direct evidence at all.  Many murderers are convicted on mainly circumstantial evidence.  Sometimes murderers are convicted without a body being found and sometimes without the means in which the murder was committed being known.  Scott Peterson was convicted of murdering Laci and their unborn child, but nobody knows for sure how he killed her.  Anne Marie Fahey's killer was convicted without her body ever being found.  Boo, that was a very good post about what circumstantial evidence is and why it is so important.  Now we need a good post about hearsay.  I think some people, including me, often misunderstand what constitutes hearsay evidence.

yes, i think it was the 2nd call the dispach couldn't figure out where he was & he used his gps, BUT the dispach did say they would send someone out to look at the white bag. i listened to the calls several times & am pretty sure But i have been wrong before & will again.

Alllllright !  Par-tay!  I hope KC is found guilty on all charges!

Absolutely!!  I know better than to come short handed!!! During this trial we will all need a "Mommy's little helper"

Sounds like sleeping with a diva if you ask me.   ::MonkeyWink::

This may sound like a dumb question, but Im wondering where they will pick the jury from.  Will they be from Florida?  I just about think every person in USA has heard of this case, and hates caseys guts. 

She is one smart cookie - when we hide the bottle!!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hi Pin and glad you could join us!

(http://bestsmileys.com/welcome/9.gif)

WELCOME PIN!!!  Have you been told about the Kahlua rule?? Come sit next to me!! Have you been in any accidents lately? How ya feeling?? What is your feelings on LP?..... NO! Don't answer that one!!
 ::MonkeyHaHa::  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Sounds good me~ I was out around 8om tonight running the St. Bernard on the beach (shhhh-it's illegal to have dogs on the beach, so we sneak out at dark). I worry if they do move the trial to Escambia county that I may very well lose my job, but I could probably rent out rooms to watch the execution trial ::MonkeyDance::

Some were mentioning the Sugar Bowl earlier.  My husband went to Bama but Bama got creamed tonight.  Utah really deserved that win.  We are unhappy, but Utah fans have every reason to celebrate.  And since this is the Caylee forum, we understand that it is just a game, and not nearly as important in the grand scheme of things as a life, but it still hurts.  Saban was cussing like a sailor on the sidelines.  So, congrats to Utah fans, and Bama fans...there is always next year.

Ah, yes.  Both the media and the government act like divas at times.  I agree.  However, I think they have come to an understood truce with the Sunshine Laws.  As long as government feeds media enough material for them to do their jobs, then the media allows the government to go about its business.  The LE and the media in Florida seem to have figured this out pretty well.

Did you get the impression that those calls were edited?  It was like they were having a continued conversation but parts were missing?

And IIRC he couldn't tell them the streets...but he said "let me go get my GPS"  (paraphrasing).

welcome pin, glad you dropped in....pin drop get it  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Thank you for that. One of those people would be me!!

Ha, ha, ha.  So true.  Those late nights imbibing can set my imagination to full tilt.

Great point~Tad Diabase has a PDF of every no body murder cases, around 300 convictions with IIRC 25 overturned, that gices me great faith that this case is a no-brainer.

If tourisism is really down, I hope they make the VDS pay!!   ::MonkeyCool::

Actually, I've talked to a number of people in the US that haven't heard of this case.  The ones that  have said things like, "oh, you mean the mother that partied like crazy after her daughter died".  Or "those poor grandparents..." But often times, the people I've talked to don't know about the case.  Casey's lawyers will probably try to use the excessive publicity as a point to say Casey can't get a fair trial, or try to move the trial elsewhere.  And by the way, there are no dumb questions.   ::MonkeyCool::

Try every person in North America!! I live in AB. Canada and you couldn't pick a jury from here!!! Everyone I know, knows about this case and just from reading what has been released so far and listening to the interviews( We don't have ongoing media coverage here) they all hate KC and believe she is guilty!!

I don't know where to begin... ::MonkeyNoNo::

Yes.  Actually, I thought that only portions of the calls were released.  It was never stated that what we heard was the full call.  I figured that LE released only what was safe for public hearing at this time.

I am really surprised that so much stuff continues to come out about the Caylee case, even over the holidays.  I thought it would dry up for a while.  Are the Anthonys getting out at all now or saying anything directly?  And is it true Lee moved?

Boo ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: just remember to share ::MonkeyTongue::

Thanks to you and MuffyBee for the welcome.  I am ignorant on the Kahlua rule....lol, but am intrigued.
My feelings about LP.........wait, which camera should I speak to? 

Good night fellow monkeys!!

well, I suppose what media outlets they have, like cable, internet etc. Im quite surprised that there are people in USA that havent heard of this case.  Not many Australians have, its not on our news here that I have seen.  Wish I could be on the jury  ::MonkeyCool::

Pin ~  You are welcome here at SM, but please let's drop LP for a while.  We just started a new thread.  (http://bestsmileys.com/butterfly/1.gif)

I think you fit in just perfectly ::MonkeyHaHa:: Welcome aboard Pin ::MonkeyTongue::

Hudsunn, I think the media is milking this case as far as they can.  Since Caylee's body has been found and identified, not much new has come out.  I did hear that Lee moved.  The Anthony's have been very quiet.  I do think that LE is getting serious with all of them, making it clear that if they do not testify honestly, they may be charged themselves.  That would make a person become very quiet.

goodnight cutey  ::MonkeyWink::

i like you already!!!
1-you respect TM
2-YOU LOVE YOUR DYSON!

Good night cuteascanbe (http://bestsmileys.com/sleeping/12.gif)

((edit - but inappropriate for the Caylee thread))




I hope I dont get in trouble for posting this, but someone wrote this poem, and I kinda liked it!!!!!!!

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: I don't know how many will be here, but I'm scanning it and will try to post...if everyone is gone by then, at least it will give Lucinda something to read while she waits for us to wake up in the morning  ::MonkeyTongue::

Last I heard the Anthony's want immunity before they will talk.  Yes it appears to be true that Lee has moved out of his rented house.

As for evidence, even eyewitnesses do not always agree on what they saw, and sometimes they are completely wrong!  That just amazes me.  Three people can see a traffic accident, for example, and give three different descriptions of what happened.  I suppose that's why our system says that direct evidence and circumstantial are important, and it is the entire Body of Evidence that the jury should consider.

Hearsay
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hearsay literally means information gathered by the first person from a second person concerning some event, condition, or thing of which the first person had no direct experience. When submitted as evidence, such statements are called hearsay evidence. As a legal term, "hearsay" can also have the narrower meaning of the use of such information as evidence to prove the truth of what is asserted. Such use of "hearsay evidence" in court is generally not allowed. This prohibition is called the hearsay rule.

For example, a witness says "Susan told me she was cold". Since the witness did not themselves experience Susan's coldness, the statement would be hearsay evidence to the fact that Susan was cold, and not admissible. However, it would be admissable as evidence that Susan claimed to be cold, and that she was capable of speaking at that time.

There are a number of significant exceptions to the hearsay rule.

United States

Main article: Hearsay in United States law

Unless one of the many exceptions applies, hearsay is not allowed as evidence in the United States.

 ::MonkeyShocked::
There is way too much on hearsay so here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hearsay_in_United_States_law

Hey Sea searcher,   I got one too, and hurry and read it sitting in my car before anyone could see me with it.

Thanks, Klaas.  Suddenly Cindy is no longer seeking the limelight.  No big interviews with Greta or Larry. 

Because the crime was committed in Florida, it will be tried in Florida.  The jury will be residents of the state of Florida.  Baez may request a change of venue from Orange County to another area of Florida, but he has not done so yet.  I wondered why, but I figure he's probably waiting until the first of March and will make his request then.  Most likely both sides are now presenting their cases to mock juries to create a profile of the jurors they would like to choose.

It seems secondhand information, which may be hearsay, could play a role in this investigation.  Thank the Lord for taped conversations.  I have read some things about hearsay and it is still confusing.  For instance, will Amy be able to say that Cindy told her Casey was a sociopath?

I do think Cindy and George and Lee are now between a rock and a hard place.  They will have to testify honestly if subpoenaed.  If they do not, they may face charges against them--any number of charges.  I think the reality of this has finally dawned upon them.

Hi Red  :smt006  You got any news or tidbits for us tonight?

Whoops.  I don't see him now.  Hope he comes back.

yep!!!!!  Judge Judy doesnt account for hearsay  ::MonkeyHaHa::
thanks for posting this Boo

The old saying goes. Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear..I think that's how it goes.. ::MonkeyTongue::

Welcome to the cage Pin!  I see you have a sense of humor, you are going to fit right in!

Karen

Well, Amy can testify to what Cindy told her, as that is not hearsay.  However, Cindy will need to testify as to her own opinion or statements to others as to Casey's behavior.  This is why Cindy is now silent.  She is caught.

Welcome Pin!

I doubt it as they could argue specualtion (although we know that beyond a shadow of any doubt)........however an excited utterance gets you around the heresay rules.

Hi Pin!  Welcome to the cage!!!

(Hope you see this, I feel like SS now).

Hi ya' Spark  ::MonkeyDance::

Thanks SS cant wait  ::MonkeyDance::

I agree, AZLady.  I think the Anthonys have gone into protection mode now.  And they probably are grieving, too.  It took long enough for reality to penetrate, but now it must be unbearable.  The whole truth is going to be even worse, if it is ever found out.

Now, back to hearsay---I think that Amy can testify that Cindy told her Casey was a sociopath.  But Tony cannot testify that Amy told him that Cindy told her that Casey was a sociopath.  Right?  Or wrong?

Isn't there a difference between beyond shadow of doubt vs beyond reasonable doubt? ::MonkeyTongue::

I bet that most of the cases that have been overturned have been because of eye witnesses and because of DNA people are able to be exonerated.  IMO circumstantial and forensics are much better.  They don't lie or forget or get confused.

Whenever anyone says...Where are they going to pick a jury from...I always think about OJ.  EVERYONE heard about his case and KNEW him and had an opinion.  They don't qualify a juror because they didn't hear about the case.  It depends if they honestly say if they can set aside any conclusions they have and judge it honestly based on the evidence.

When Baez says he can't get a fair jury blah blah blah.  It only makes me think that he is setting us up for a plea deal and for him to save face when that happens.

Hiya Muffy you are sooooo cute with that balloon . . . good thing we closed the last cage cause there was so much hot air you might be taking off by now!

BTW, my new nickname for you:  Buffy the Off Topic Slayer.

Hee hee.

Sorry, got up late and drank too much coffee!!!

Karen

I believe your right Hudsuun... ::MonkeyTongue::

You guys are reminding me of a joke Conan O'Brien told not long ago.

"Did you hear about the guy who worked for a cleaning agency?  He got fired for having sex with a vacuum cleaner.  When asked why he did it, he said 'I felt sorry for the old bag.'"

Thank You Sparky!!

Muffy - may I please ask one question about LP and the lie detector test? 

AZLady thanks for that.  Its the same as here in Australia then. 

I think the more credible testimony comes from the original source.  Anyone can testify that someone told them something, but I doubt it would be entered into the court record unless the fact that the two people were talking together was trying to be established.  The content of the second-source conversation is hearsay.

wasn't me..wasn't me... I is innocent...until proven otherwise  ::MonkeyTongue::

Correct! What Cindy said to Amy was direct, Tony repeating it is 3rd party.  ::MonkeyCool::

No one answered my question from earlier:  Hence I will repeat it.   Animals are not interested in dry bones, but Caylee's bones were scattered.  Does this mean that she couldnt have been in the trunk of the car for 11 days and therefore her body would have been more or less intact??????

mytime~ don't bait me.  Of course you can.  What I don't want is what I saw toward the end of the last thread. 

Ummm, you know I have a Black Belt in Sarcasm and that I wasn't serious, right?  Go to the last "cage" and check out the last few pages, we were getting into it about the usual stuff.  Glad we moved on.  Before you go back, take some aspirin.  Or don't go at all!

Make sure you leave a trail of m & m's so you can find your way back here . . .

Karen

I have no idea . . . but I'm not ignoring you. I even know you got up the same time as I did today (at 1).  Are we going to be up late tonight?

Karen

OK mytime

WHERE IS DUCKY!!!

I was about to leave the cage for the night.  I called Ducky and ... I called Ducky.  My best friend in the whole wide world did not respond.  He did not come waddling up to me as fast as his little webbed feet would go.

mytime ... if you do not give him up ... I will be forced to spend the night in the cage.  If I am fored to spend the night in the cage ... I will not sleep and ... will be in a very bad mood tomorrow.  I will attack your every post.

RIGHT NOW!!!  ONE!  TWO!  THREE! ...

Janet

Yes, reasonable doubt is different than no doubt........


REASONABLE DOUBT - The level of certainty a juror must have to find a defendant guilty of a crime. A real doubt, based upon reason and common sense after careful and impartial consideration of all the evidence, or lack of evidence, in a case.

Proof beyond a reasonable doubt, therefore, is proof of such a convincing character that you would be willing to rely and act upon it without hesitation in the most important of your own affairs. However, it does not mean an absolute certainty.

I remember in the Van Damm case, Brenda van Damm said on the stand that she had spoken to Westerfield and what they talked about and what he said to her, etc. 

When you say that animals are not interested in dry bones, we have to suppose that Caylee's bones were "dry" and that animals are not interested in such.  However, we did hear several forensics experts on NG and Greta state that animals will scatter small bones over an area.  I am not sure how you can conclude the length of time in the car trunk from this.

And then, it was said, Caylee's body, in the bag, had to have been there for quite some time because the leaves under it were brown.  I wonder how long that would take in the damp hot soil of Florida???

Always1, I think that LE considers that the body was in the car trunk for about 2 to 2 1/2 days, not eleven.  But there was a rumor about it being there for 11 days, and that always seemed pretty impossible.

Not at sure what that means Muffy!  I just wondered if LP took lie detector test yet.  I have missed NG lately - that is all!!!

Thanks..

A-1 ~  Sorry, didn't see your earlier post.   IMO If Caylee's remains were in a plastic bag in a trunk for 11 days, there would still be tissue and etc.  The bones wouldn't be dry in the amount of time.  When she was dumped, the bones probably weren't dry, and the animals may have gotten to the remains and scattered them. 
jmho

Yes, because I just ate a dry bowl of corn pops, then I drank a glasss of milk, now Im going to walk around like Casey to see if I can mix them up, then stay up late with you.

The decomp in the car was about 2 1/2 days old.  However, if the body were removed from the car after 2 1/2 days, wrapped in a covering, and then returned to the car, the decomp in the car would be 2 1/2 days old even if the body were there longer, in a bag or something. 

I don't know about evidence showing how long the body and bag were in the woods.  If the area was submerged, would the leaves be yellow?  I'm sure LE knows.

Nobody said LP could not be discussed.  All I said is no bashing TES.

I haven't heard if LP took the lie detector test yet or not. 

Ah, Az Lady, I have missed you!!!  I love the way you think.

If you think you can come and go as you please without even so much as a hello - You were wrong.  Please show some proper manners and perhaps Duckie will want to come home with you!  TIA   ::MonkeyWink::

Gotta go now, but it was nice catching up, Monkeys.  See you soon.

Good night monkeys, dear daughter just pulled up!!

Hi A1, I was wondering along those lines the other day.  Do you think the forensics team would recreate the conditions, to be able to determine just exactly how long the bag was there.  Also, Im sure they can tell exactly how long, just by the type of dead undergrowth, bugs etc. 

Oh my what a visual!  Well in a backwards sort of way maybe tonight will be our morning!  Absolutely!  I'll make an effort to reach out if I can't sleep . . . but in my gut I know sleep is close, somewhere, yea, absolutely!

Mytime - I have no idea if LP took that lie detector test, there has been no mention of it that I'm aware of.

Goodnight Boo and Az

Right, there was a rumor that she could have been in the trunk for 11 days, and then we dont know how long the body was where it was found.  Thats why I was trying to figure out why the animals would be interested in the bag.

Night boo and don't forget a promise is a promise ::MonkeyTongue::

Thank you Klaas!  That was my only question!!

GOOD NIGHT MONKEYS!!!  GOOD NIGHT ZOOKEEPERS!!!

Janet
9:45 PM PT

You just read my mind.  If you put a plastic bag on the ground, the grass and stuff underneath would probably be yellowed, even the new growth, and there would be rolly poly bugs.

I didn't answer because I couldn't follow...trying Boo's tea and honey.  

If I am following...there still should have been "tissue" after 11 days in the trunk..so no dry bones at that time.  Especially inside of a bag. Now how long would it take to stay "intact" after dumping in the woods ...I wouldn't think very long.

OMG!  I can't breathe... 

Pin said:


and I said:


Klaas, I didn't say we couldn't mention LP "anymore" as mytime said.   I just wanted to give the thing a rest. I didn't want to start the cycle with LP/Tim Miller again. 

I saw your question earlier...I just don't know the answer...

(( Scratching the pretty kitty behind the ears )))  ::MonkeyWink::

Over more to the left, you know the way I like it.

Must have been the larger Dyson model . . .

Also, at certain times of the season, trees drop spores, pollen etc, and if any of that was located under the bag, it is quite possible to determine exactly when the bag was placed there. 

All of this being so true what compelled Casey to murder when she has to know she will not get away with it. The more info we get this becomes more clear. She watches enough  crime TV, movies etc. It seems like she was tired of living a lie and wanted relief, even if it means going to jail. She must have thought about it constantly. A poster recently wrote Casey hated her mom more then she loved Caylee. But I think she hated Caylee more then she loved her mom. What did Caylee represent to her that she had to be permanently removed?

Why would you say animals are not interested in dry bones?

I think a dog might be interested in dry bones to chew on, but not a raccoon or a possum, or an animal that would be in the woods.

Good night Janet!  Good night little Duckie - we will talk later!!  ::MonkeyWink::

Good point Muffy  ::MonkeyHaHa::

a coyote will.

 ::MonkeyEek:: OOPS~I was just trying to refresh and I accidentally reported Bearly to herself ::MonkeyConfused:: My bad, I've been up too long obviously.

and Tim Miller sid that the grass was brown and dead under the bag and it had  left and indention in the ground from being there and the weeds had grown up around the imprint of the bag!

Oh dear... *looks worriedly back at cages from many moons ago*... the last duckie I saw was the one duct-taped to the wall.. surely that wasn't... oh dear..

 ::MonkeyTongue::

Really.  I don't know very much about coyotes.  I guess they are related to dogs though arent they???  Good point.  We dont have them around here.  When I was little, and I stayed on my Grandpa's farm, I could hear them at night and I would hide under the bed.

I saw on one of the forensic shows that a botanist can tell time by the roots and such growing through the remains.  Also, they took plants out of there...wonder is they can get human DNA out of a plant.

Hi Pin!  Welcome to the cage!  (http://i439.photobucket.com/albums/qq117/Wyks_/Smilies/wavehi.gif)

It was not far into the woods. 

I hope I did something real bad...

I don't know Bluesy, but that's an interesting question. 

 ::MonkeyHaHa::   ::MonkeyHaHa::

yes and also foxes.  They have both in Florida Im pretty sure.  I just asked my hubby, as he is from Georgia USA and he said a coyote would do it.

I seriously must have missed something.  Maybe I should read more closely and not hurry to catch up!

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek::

Can you even imagine what that girl (Casey) must be made of to set in that house all that time while her baby was laying that close out in the woods???  And every time it stormed and there was lighting and thunder, she had to think about it.  But in my mind, I picture her in the black shorts with the back pack on and one shoe almost skipping to the car, and I ask myself,  HOW COULD SHE?????

mytime ~  Bearly brought out the air freshener because the last thread was getting so stinky.  So that should tell you something ::MonkeyHaHa::

Not sure BluesyGram.  But they did have a botanist on the expert team out at the crime scene.  So they seem to be paying attention to every little detail. 

I don't know.

In reality, that is not the worst part.

Where did Sea Searcher go?   Can't you just imagine him in his little blue and white striped Ralph Loren pjs, under the covers with a flashlight, trying to read The Globe??? 

Good New Day all the Monkeys that are still up.  I just finally made it to the new CLEAN cage.  It's Wonderfully "refreshing"!!!
I have 13 pages before I really catch up but am making great progress.

I wasn't able to answer your note HH because you had all left me behind in the dirty cage.  Oooooohhh what a messy cage it was at the end ::MonkeyEek::.  Anyway, I got your nanners and replied to you.  A BIG HUG for you!!!

I'm so very happy to be here though I am always behind.  Just Thank You to everyone for all you offer here.  

PJ (Paula) :flower:

ahahaha A1 !!!  I had pictured SS locked in the bathroom with a flashlight.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

I think he is in the bathroom with his scanner.  Hope he copies the right thing!!!   ::MonkeyShocked::

I read that when a body decomposes it kinda melts into a waxy like substance and it would soak into the ground underneith the body and that is how they tell how long a body has beem there, and also the roots of a tree can soak up some of the decomp into their roots,   they can also see if any drugs or poisens show up in the decomp from the ground!

yep HH, I remember him saying that now.  Also, the tiniest spore of pollen from certain plants, even the same species, all carry different dna.  If any of caseys clothing, shoes etc had any trace of the same pollen that was at the site where Caylee was found, that will be damning evidence against her.  Hope I made sense, not good at splainin meself  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hey PJ  glad you made it here!  I will be sending you more nanners tomorrow, and yes,  the other cage was messy!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::

Hi PJ  :smt006  I'm glad you could join us.   ::MonkeyDance:: 

Perfect sense, monkey mate.

Yep  I understand this also, very good!

Think he wears that hat to bed????

that is sickening and amazing at the same time!

Hello PJ  ::MonkeyWink::

Hmmm... Do you think this could be one reason it seems investigators chopped part of one or more trees/branches etc to take with them? 

A lot of what she did has blown my mind.  

How could she take the life out her child that she carried for 9 mos.. and gave birth to, and raised for 2 1/2 yrs.?
How could she have handled her little lifeless body?  
Put her in a garbage bag?
Drive around with her in the trunk?
Drive around with that smell and know what it was from?
Carried her as far as she could and dropped her in those woods?
Then pretended to everyone that Caylee was having a ball touring all the fun spots in FL?
 
And then left her there hoping that by the time she was found there would be nothing left to determine cause of death.

I don't know how a human being did this...but she did.

It would be so much easier if everyone realized that the A's have used and abused Tim, LP and all the rest of us. Instead of infighting about anything we need to us our time and energies seeing that some of the biggest scammers since the carpetbaggers don't get away with shoving this down our throats and getting their lil darlin of scot free

He is scanning the article for us...shhh...don't make a sound or you will wake up his wife...

George Anthony: ‘There is a hole in my heart' 
 
Last Edited: Saturday, 03 Jan 2009, 12:36 AM EST 
Created: Friday, 02 Jan 2009, 11:58 PM EST 
 
George Anthony taped interview conducted at the Orange County Sheriff's Office on July 24, 2008.  SideBar


Related Items
Stories
Timeline, Documents and Photos related to the Casey Anthony Case



Related Content

 


By Holly Bristow
FOX 35 NEWS


ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35, Orlando) -- The Anthony family has made it clear that they will do any on camera interviews until after Caylee Marie is laid to rest.



The toddler was missing from June of last year until December when her remains were found near the East Orange County home where she lived with her grandparents George and Cindy and her mother Casey who is in jail charged with her murder.

Friday George Anthony spoke off camera with FOX 35 about a few things he said we could share.   


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VIDEO: George Anthony speaks out
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anthony said he can't drive down Suburban Drive, where the remains were found, because he's not ready to see the makeshift memorial left for his granddaughter.  He doesn't know if he'll ever be able to drive further down Suburban drive near the area where a meter reader found Caylee Marie's remains.

Anthony said he is doing all right, at least as well as could be expected under the circumstances.

Lee, the Anthony’s son and brother to Casey, has moved back home to be with his parents. 

George Anthony says his family has not yet made funeral arrangements for Caylee.  They are still waiting for Casey Anthony's defense team to wrap up their second autopsy. 

Does Anthony think the family will find any closure once they are able to have a funeral service for their granddaughter?

 "There is a hole in my heart big enough for a truck to drive through,” Anthony said. “I don't think I'll ever have closure. At this point I'm just hoping to someday be able to accept that Caylee is gone."

Anthony also said he misses his daughter Casey as well.  He would like be able to visit Casey in jail, even if it’s just to say hello and hear her voice and see how she is doing.
 

phew thanks  ::MonkeyHaHa::
You know something else.  The pollen (I will keep saying pollen) can get into fabric and stay there even after washing.  It gets into the fibres and gets stuck.  Even in cuffs etc.  Cindy washing them pants may not have got rid of evidence at all.  Same as what they find in the car in the carpet of the home etc. 

Yes, and Casey could never have reasoned out all of that.  There is no perfect crime is there???

Ok... I hope this works..

and fibers from her clothes ....the hair from the dogs.......fibers from her car.....hair from herself......all of this can be found inside that bag.     

Yes, you would think so!   ::MonkeyWink::  I am tired tonight and must be a little slow!!  I saw that too and didn't put it together.  ::MonkeyConfused::  Sorry about that.  I just wanted to know if or why not LP has taken the lie dector test.  I have been wondering why know one brings it up to him!  I seriously had my doubts that he would take one.  I am not his biggest fan and can't understand why NG still has him on and why she hasn't mentioned it!  Or maybe she had, I have missed a couple nights so I wasn't sure!!  Consider the subject dropped!!

Hey Klaas  is that the same Globe that you posted for us a few nights ago, or am I crazy, or is this new!

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyShocked::

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::
 ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel:: ::cartwheel::

No there sure isn't! 

Sooooo... this to Casey...

 ::MonkeyTongue::  neener neener neener!   ::MonkeyTongue::

Good job Sea Searcher, I like the way you tested it for size first.

 ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyCool::

(http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr165/Sea_Searcher/Notsayingit.gif)

I think Klaasend went nite nite.  Speaking of nite nite, remember when Rob ate his buttons on his jammies and replaced then with tater chips???? 

I agree and am thrilled Nancy Grace, LP and Tim with whatever they can share during this "downtime" pretrial. Except for some azz kissing by Geraldo to Baez. But he's just setting himself with a ringside seat and entry for the trial. Geraldo been around the block once or ninety times.

How would we know if he had taken the lie detector test or not?  I don't know.  Unless someone asks him outright.  I don't think the LE would just release something like that, especially with a trial coming up and etc.  It would be interesting to know if he has taken one or not, that's for sure.  Maybe it was saber rattling or maybe LP and LE got together and talked and it all got sorted out.  The main thing to me is the focus stays on Caylee and not a lot of the side issues. 

Thanks N2WISHN! 

Sooooo.. seems Lee moved back to the A's home, eh?  Interesting... Very interesting...

Wonder how that's gonna work out for them?   ::MonkeyHaHa::

PJ  are u still here?

What an EXCELLENT thought BluesyGram !

PJ (Paula) :flower:

You mean you think SS is going to get caught with his hand in the scanner???   ::MonkeyShocked::

 ::MonkeyShocked::

Thank you Sea Searcher, for posting that article!  And FTLOG, and for the future of your marriage, I hope you used rubber gloves so you didn't leave prints on the mag!

THANKS AGAIN!!!

Karen

It's new to me...but with the amount of time if takes me to do these things..it might be out of date..  ::MonkeyTongue::

It's the latest edition? I didn't see Klaas post it..if it's a repeat, please delete Klaas.. at least I know how to do it now  ::MonkeyCool::

Thank you Sea searcher for scanning and posting for us  ::MonkeyWink::

Wow.  He's brave, eh ? or... something...

No, I posted the National Enquirer.  The Globe is new to me.

Thanks Sea Searcher - now I'm going to go back and read it!

Oh Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! Don't delete Klaas!!!

Nice job, seasearcher (http://bestsmileys.com/friendly/2.gif)

Wyks

Maybe he can't afford rent since the Ant's can't hold out their tin cup for "find Caylee alive" anymore. I hope money is getting scarce for the whole rotten crew and now they can all sink in the same ship.

Oh ok......then I am crazy... ::MonkeyLaugh::   Thanks seasearcher...............

Ya know, what really gets to me is that some media still report that Caylee's remains were found in the black bag, which had been duct-taped shut.  At the same time, it's being reported that remains were found double-bagged.  As well as that the remains were found scattered over a mile radius.  Sigh.  All the above?

Sea Searcher - I didn't post that one and hadn't seen it.  Thanks for scanning and posting it!

(http://bestsmileys.com/silly/5.gif)(http://bestsmileys.com/silly/5.gif)(http://bestsmileys.com/silly/5.gif)

Sea Searcher does that mean all hands report to the poop deck??

What hasn't been reported (as far as I know) is the condition of the bag.  So if it was rotten and torn, even though it was duct taped and/or it was a double bag, it doesn't make a difference and the bones would have escaped.

I guess since it has been reported that the skull fell out, the bag was probably not in good condition.

Well  if you think about it they mean that when the remains were discarded they were doneso in a black plastic bag that was duct taped shut, and then of course over time and with the help of animals the bag was torn open and the remains scattered.

Notice question 5....Cindy washed Caylee's pants ?? misprint ??  ::MonkeyEek::

Im am going to say one more thing then I am going to sleep.  Part of me thinks the Anthonys are everything everyone says about them, but the Grandmother in me says maybe all of that was just their defense mechinism to avoid having to face the fact that Caylee is gone forever.  The only thing that doesnt fit is the money stuff.  Ok. now you all can throw stuff at me because I will be unconcious and wont know what you are doing.

I understand Muffy, but I truly think LP - whether we like it or not - interjected himself and has become part of this case!  I am not part of the last thread so I would appreciate if you would not include me in that discussion.  Thank you!!

I don't feel that way, but I hope your right!

Goodnight A1

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

It must not have been a Monkey that penned it because it doesn't contain the word "SLORE" ::MonkeyHaHa::

PJ (Paula) :flower:

TY SS for the article.  Hope you hid the evidence!!   ::MonkeyWink::  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I really like these little stomping things................ ::MonkeyHaHa::

Nice job, sweetie.  Can you scan the pictures between the pages?  I would like to see them better.  Pretty please (batting eye lashes)?

 :smt058

Good Night..

((( Scratching the pretty kitty behind the ears... a little to the left )))  ::MonkeyWink::

Or are they doing a river dance?

Only because you asked me ... give me a minute or 10  ::MonkeyTongue::

Thanks for posting that article, SS!!   ::MonkeyDance::

Saves me a trip to the border, incognito.   ::MonkeyHaHa::

I think so... somone just didn't proofread good enough.  In the media and everywhere, everyone is always typing or saying Caylee when they mean Casey & vice versa.  Which is probably why a lot of the forums used KC.

TY Paula...so nice to see you again.  Have missed you.  Hope your Holidays were great.  Did you get carded at the liquor store since your procedure?  J/K  LOL

Anyone that cuddles with a bear is okay in my book...

And inside the bag some clothes or something to wrap the baby. A sarcastic "how nice"

I may be wrong, but I could have sworn I read that Nick Savage (FBI) had discussed the polygraph-I only recall this because LP wanted them to pay for his expenses since it meant staying on Orlando~they said no way, we'll do it when the polygrapher is back and even if we have to come to CA to do it ::MonkeyConfused:: I just read that today so I will try and find the link. ::MonkeyTongue::

I also noticed she sent the wrong toothbrush--wasn't it a hairbrush?

Are you feeling okay, sleepyhead?

oh oh oh I pick ---> something!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

Well, OUR SPIES aren't doing such a good job for us, are they?  They told us he moved to Mallory's!  Guess we'll have to hire Hoover and D. Casey!


BTW   Bud's Girl I was looking at your avi and at first I thought that you were exhausted from jumping on the bed and just breathing hard...but now that I look closer, I don't think it's your chest moving up and down, is it?

Goodnight A1, I wont throw nuffin at ya for having an opinion. 

Awww   I can see we are 2 peas in a pod!!!!!!!! ::MonkeyHaHa::

HA!!  Bet so!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

Muffy~ I found it, it was Nick Savage:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0811/17/ng.01.html

GRACE: So back to you, Leonard Padilla, when are you set for your polygraph everybody is talking about?

LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER, SEARCHING FOR CAYLEE ANTHONY: Well, Friday, I spoke to the agent there, Nick Savage, and he said that his polygrapher was on vacation or something this week.

GRACE: Well, there`s more than one, FYI.

PADILLA: Well, no -- I don`t know. I mean he told me that the guy that does the -- the polygraph test there was gone and would be back either Tuesday or Wednesday. And I hinted that maybe he wants to cover my expenses while I stayed past the weekend. And then he said no, well, we can go out to California, and do them out there.

And the thought came to my mind that I`d call Don King and maybe have the polygraph test done on pay-per-view and make some money to go back and resume the hunt.

 :smt055

Islandmonkey~  That would be dandy if you could find the link. 

Here ya go !!  ::MonkeyDance::

There was a mistake in the other article here, I think.  It said the Anthony's were going to give interviews until they had the service for Caylee.  I think they meant were not.

Interesting.  Thank you islandmonkey  ::MonkeyCool::

  ::MonkeyShocked::   ::MonkeyHaHa::   It better be just exhaustion !!   CBB did that, I'll have to double-check w/her!!

Thank you - I do remember this one!  But didn't he come back to Florida after Caylee was found?  He could have taken it then......wonder why no one mentions this???  I would think someone on NG, at least would!!

Yeh, Im good.  Its just that I just got new pictures today of my Grandbabies, and I cant believe how beautiful they are, and that they are mine..  When I had my son, and I was alone by Achoice (I divorced when he was two) things were hard.  I was working the midnight shift and weekends and going to school.  Now, I have the time to appreciate my Grandbabies and I cant tell you how much I love them.  And for someone to kill a baby is just so unbelievable to me.  Night.

You're Welcome  ::MonkeyDance:: saves ya four bucks anyway..unless you want to read about how Michelle Obama caused Oprah's weight problem  ::MonkeyConfused::

 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :smt058 :2blove:

I would have certainly thought it would have been brought up by now, surely someone will ask~but then again it's already such a *fiasco* ::MonkeyConfused::

Bearlyhere
Wyks
MuffyBee

I found you!!

O/T  Response for you in Donna Jou Thread. Will post more over weekend.

No, I think that was when Cindy washed caseys pants that were really evidence from the back of the car

Thank you so much MuffyBee.  I always feel so sorry when you and Klaas are made to work so hard.  Forgive me but I know there are more mods too but don't remember names well.  Just THANK YOU!!!! for all you do.

PJ (Paula) :flower:

(http://bestsmileys.com/thankyou/1.gif)

 ::MonkeyWaa::  Night!!!

Hi Lucinda...You are just ADORABLE.  I just love the bubbles.  See, I'm slowly catching up ::MonkeyDance::.[/color]

PJ (Paula) :flower:

Thanks, IBE!!

IBE ~ I will go take a look, and I look forward to your posts.  This is a very sad case that hasn't had the resources and attention I believe it deserves.

((hugs))

thank you!!!  CBB dressed me up for new year.  I love your avi too.  Im still not even caught up  ::MonkeyHaHa::

 :smt045 :smt045

 ::MonkeyCool:: Night all, this monkey is heading for the bunkey before I pass out over the keyboard.

I have to say Good Night now..

As hard as I prayed for an ice storm...it didn't come so I have to go visit my inlaws tomorrow ... (http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr165/Sea_Searcher/th4_14_6.gif)

Hopefully I'll be back early.. Good Night All !!

I will miss my morning coffe with ya'll  ::MonkeyWaa::

At least Trimm won't have to cook in the morning...and she can sleep in  ::MonkeyWink::

Night Island, im going to cook dinner and then walk my dog.  I will be back later  ::MonkeyDance::

Hello Adorable Muffy, my friend!  Where can I find the posts on this case?  (I did a search with no luck.)

Good night SS and thanks for the yummy coffee  ::MonkeyWink::

OH I am telling now for sure!!   ::MonkeyWink::

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1337.0

Ahhhh yes, good points by both of you, and makes sense.  Thanks! 

I hope we get a Doc dump soon. I was thinking when they give Baez something we get it within 2 weeks so maybe soon. Nite monkeys.

You should be an editor/proof reader!!   ::MonkeyWink::

Good night to all the monkeys headed for the bunkey  (http://bestsmileys.com/sleeping/8.gif)

Always1, I know what you mean. I feel the same way.

Thank You Sea Searcher.  I really appreciate your posting this Globe article.  I know how difficult it was for you to sneak out to acquire it.  Then you had to read under the covers with a flashlight ::MonkeyHaHa::.  You still found it in your big Heart to post it for all of us Monkeys ::MonkeyDance::.  Thank You again!!!

PJ (Paula) :flower:

Hi all, I just got caught up on this thread and it seems like a good idea to not go back to the last one  ::MonkeyNoNo::  so is there anything there that I need to know?

Hey there Dottie (http://bestsmileys.com/hello/2.gif)

good eye, SS!!  an oooopsy!   ::MonkeyHaHa::

one thing i was noticing, maybe based on earlier convos, were the words used to describe casey and others.  perhaps emphasis by the media, to make it even more sensational... or? 

(example:  when saying what padilla had said to them,  the article says, ".... demented casey......")  demented?  did padilla use that word, or did the media simply spice things up a bit?   ::MonkeyEek::   ::MonkeyWink::

I am and not too far behind.  I took time to read the Globe article that Sea Searcher posted for us.

PJ :flower:

Hey Muffy, Hope you are having a great night! Thanks for all you, Klass and all the other Mods do!  ::MonkeyWink::

Oh Darn, Sorry for the typo KLAAS!  ::MonkeyWaa:: 

Thank you, I found it.  So appreciate you sticking up with the victim.  You're a good person, muffybee!!!

I honestly don't know how a mother can be so heartless, so cold.  I can think of many other effective ways to get back at Cindy, none of which include harming that precious child.  ::MonkeyNoNo::
 

Thank you Dottie.. It's my pleasure to help out in the cage  (http://bestsmileys.com/cleaning/9.gif)

Oh but you are a Doll BluesyGram!!
I went for my 2 week update yesterday.  All is well and I can start wearing make-up.  Still a bit of swelling that should diminish in time.  If I don't get carded, I will come home and cry ::MonkeyHaHa::.  Then again I still have bags under my eyes and YES I mean bags the size of luggage sacks ::MonkeyWaa::.
I'm back on topic now...Promise!

PJ (Paula) :flower:

 ::MonkeyEek::   ::MonkeyShocked::   ::MonkeyHaHa:: 

She's used to her name being spelled wrong and it easy going about that.  Maybe it's because she is a CLASS-y woman and we spell is that way!

I'm with you Wyks!! So hard to understand that kind of evil exists!!

Yes, she is.....CLASS-Y!  ::MonkeyWink::

Nite!!!

 :smt052

Good Night IslandMonkey and any other Monkeys calling it a day.  Sleep Peacefully!

PJ (Paula) :flower:

Oh so now you acknowledge me??   ::MonkeyHaHa::

SOOOOOOOOO...........Lee flew back to the hen house...OH MY!! Is he A) broke B) crazy C) guilty D) crazy, broke and guilty.  ::MonkeyConfused::

I chose C!  Does he still have a job?  Is he still with Mallory?  Just thinking out loud!  How could he move back there!  I would rather be homeless than live back there!!

All of the above.

Plus, no point in paying next month's rent when he will prolly be going to jail.

oops - had to edit my post!!

ty IBE! 

In one interview george said he was traveling and cindy said he was working...so who knows. There was a picture of him and mallory the day caylee was found someone stated...I never saw it. You are absolutely right.....I would live in the gutter before going back to that nut house!!  ::MonkeyNoNo::

Cute monkey MYTIME...Sooo....Whats this about Lee??? When did this happen?details

TY!!  LOL Trying to find article!  It said that Lee moved home with his parents!   ::MonkeyNoNo:: 

  ::MonkeyDance::  ::MonkeyDance::  ::MonkeyDance::

Fog brain time... Tim Miller of TES must be on the show also? Sorry O/T Night night

WHOOOA> TIA. Must be saving up that bail money...ooooOOoOOo ::MonkeyHaHa::

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
George Anthony: ‘There is a hole in my heart' 
 
Last Edited: Saturday, 03 Jan 2009, 12:36 AM EST 
Created: Friday, 02 Jan 2009, 11:58 PM EST 
 
George Anthony taped interview conducted at the Orange County Sheriff's Office on July 24, 2008.  SideBar


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By Holly Bristow
FOX 35 NEWS


ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35, Orlando) -- The Anthony family has made it clear that they will do any on camera interviews until after Caylee Marie is laid to rest.



The toddler was missing from June of last year until December when her remains were found near the East Orange County home where she lived with her grandparents George and Cindy and her mother Casey who is in jail charged with her murder.

Friday George Anthony spoke off camera with FOX 35 about a few things he said we could share.   


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VIDEO: George Anthony speaks out
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anthony said he can't drive down Suburban Drive, where the remains were found, because he's not ready to see the makeshift memorial left for his granddaughter.  He doesn't know if he'll ever be able to drive further down Suburban drive near the area where a meter reader found Caylee Marie's remains.

Anthony said he is doing all right, at least as well as could be expected under the circumstances.

Lee, the Anthony’s son and brother to Casey, has moved back home to be with his parents.   
George Anthony says his family has not yet made funeral arrangements for Caylee.  They are still waiting for Casey Anthony's defense team to wrap up their second autopsy. 

Does Anthony think the family will find any closure once they are able to have a funeral service for their granddaughter?

 "There is a hole in my heart big enough for a truck to drive through,” Anthony said. “I don't think I'll ever have closure. At this point I'm just hoping to someday be able to accept that Caylee is gone."

Anthony also said he misses his daughter Casey as well.  He would like be able to visit Casey in jail, even if it’s just to say hello and hear her voice and see how she is doing

Anthony also said he misses his daughter Casey as well.  He would like be able to visit Casey in jail, even if it’s just to say hello and hear her voice and see how she is doing.

What is keeping him from going to see Casey?  IMO, it's that he can't stand to see the face of his daughter knowing she killed his granddaughter.  If it were me and I knew she was innocent, you couldn't keep me away!

Well, it's 3:25 my time so I guess I need to try to sleeep (incurable insominac) haha so good night to the 6 hardcore monkeys and 17 guest...oldhippychik, dottie, Mags, Mary, NO1ZLADIE, jennywong and 17 Guests....guess I counted my self in that so goodnight dottie  ::MonkeyConfused::

Boy am I behind.

Katiekatie2u, I agree about Trenton.  The whole story upsets me, and I wish Melinda would have made a different choice.  The family and others who care would benefit from some closure, and I shudder to think how alone she felt in her final moments here.

OK, it seems a few of you slipped in while I was trying to copy and paste (takes me a while) so i'll just say GOODNIGHT ALL so as not to offend anyone.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

GOODNIGHT< THANKS FOR THE LAUGHS AND INFO

Did you miss my honeybee post??

I might have!!   ::MonkeyRoll::