Scared Monkeys Discussion Forum

From the previous thread:

Isn't she saying the same thing we have been?  That ALE took the entire contents of the trap or what they chose to take and no one else had access?  I don't get it!

Well.What can you say?I want Hotshot to do a front page spread on Arrest week featuring CapsLockWizard! ::MonkeyDance::

KTF....You're a Hoot.....And I mean that in a good way!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Klaas,

Thank you for bringing that over.

OS

Anna - yes, that is exactly what we and Kermit have been saying and that Kyle didn't tell everything he knew to the family.

YW - I didn't want people to miss it  ::MonkeyWink::

 ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyRoll::

 ::MonkeyNoNo::

  ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyShocked::

Got kicked off.

OS, do you know what she meant about looking for a deal?

I posted before that Kyle,as well as CapsLockWizard are taking the road of least resistance!Why?Truth finds it's way through the lies!Semantics aside.You either believe Kyle or think he's a liar.You can use semantics all you want.Kyle's words.Are just that.His word's!Same as CapsLockWizard.We're still waiting for the arrest of a Major Player.2 weeks later.I believe CapsLockWizard to be a disinformation specialist.Just like AHATA.Maybe he goes to work in there offices?

On another note i find it almost comical,as well as childlike to watch these adult's that come and go from ChatnGrumble.Are you serious?Why are you here?Are you not recieving what you want from ChatnGrumble?These are questions i have.Seems like all those from that website are Closetposter's so to speak.They're embarrased to admit it?If you're not embarrased you'd gladly bring forth your a memeber there.But they don't!Again.These are all just my opinions and you know what they say....

KEEPTHEFAITH

A deal for a ticket to Aruba at the Boston Travel Show..

They were at the Boston Travel show boycotting Aruba.  Hotshot (or her friend) went over to the Aruba booth looking for a deal on a ticket to Aruba.  Some of those that were at the boycott took issue with her doing that at that moment while they were boycotting.

 ::MonkeyCool:: had to get rid of that awful number!

And co-starring Steve Croes and filmed on location at the Kalpoes parents motel, lol.

 ::MonkeyDance::

Well, I wonder why! I think I would have done more than take issue with her.

I agree with what You are saying....The only thing that I like about Them coming over here is that it seems to bring Kermit out and Kermit always gives Us alittle more information each time She post.....See what I mean?......I can ignore most of what the CnG posters say...its like when You were little and someone was picking on You and Your parents would tell You....to tell them....Sticks and Stones will break My bones but words will never hurt Me..... ::MonkeyWink::  I hope this makes sense.....  ::MonkeyCool::

WHICH IS IT?

(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o100/klaasen3/Sub5/moderator%20pics/hotshot.jpg)

OMG..I can see it now....how funny!  ::MonkeyHaHa::

It makes complete sense Hotping.It also seems that they come on in and take us away from what kermit has posted.Why Is my question?Anyone from ChatnGrumble feel free to answer.Have a feeling i'll be waiting awhile! ::MonkeyCool::

If people don't have something nice to say . . . .


I guess her recent attack on me was something nice?  I'd call it a bold faced lie. 

Guess different people have different concepts on what is nice.

That's exactly right...I think that if We ignore them then they will stop trying to disrupt the forum....Its funny but the last few times....the disrupters have appeared the Rawhide song comes to mind and I'm sitting hear thinking "Scrolling Scrolling Scrolling Rawhide" like just scroll on by and ignore Them.... ::MonkeyWink:: And No I'm not really drinking Crown and Coke.... ::MonkeyNoNo::

Hotping!    ::MonkeyLaugh::  ::MonkeyDance::

I disagree HotPing! ::MonkeyLaugh:: Just kidding ::MonkeyTongue::

Exactly San, WHICH IS IT?   
My head is now going around in circles.  Going to bed. Don't get too far ahead of me. I do read every post.  Goodnight everyone.

Kermit says she will tell more when the time is right.  Red says the moons are getting in alignment or something like that.

Is something really happening behind the scenes?

Greta still has not released those tapes of the Colombians.

Was JQK actually in Aruba with Furman in tow?

What was that about?

I don't know anything any more.



.

Janet?You OK?Hubby didn't have to give you CPR after you laughing so hard did he? ::MonkeyLaugh::

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Nite

OS

Goodnight SuzieQ ::MonkeyDance::

Good night SuzieQ...Thanks again for the link.....and come back soon and post with Us!..... ::MonkeyCool::

Goonight SuzieQ

Goodnight SuzieQ!   ::MonkeyCool::

::MonkeyWaa:: ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

  ::MonkeyShocked::

Good questions for Hotshot !!!

I've got a question myself for Hotshot, I have tried to stay out of the arguments but despite this, I am sent a link to Hotshot's site and she has someone impersonating me on her chat room list? I mean really.......get a grip.

Hotshot please remove my username from your site.

She was spittin water in the sink last i heard! ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet...Please say something and let Us know You are Ok..... ::MonkeyWaa::

No!!  However ... I think he has had it with me and my computer.  He warned me once  again ... if Cindy Crawford gave him "the look" I was history.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet's OK! ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

Good Evening, None!

Being on that list is a frightening thought  ::MonkeyConfused::

DID you happen to notice the DATE you supposedly joined her chat list? That may prove interesting.

::MonkeyLaugh::

I'm hoping Janet's just fine, but my monitor's dripping and you owe me a coke, Hotping!!!!   ::MonkeyLaugh::

I've read through the Natalee Case so long, that I have often sang, "scrollin' scrollin' scrollin', Gee my azz is swollen"

but you just choked me up, Hotping!!!

I didn't see a way to check the date, it's possible only Hotshot can see that.  We were able to tell what link to Nonesuche this person used. 

Sorry...Would You like alittle Crown with that Coke.... ::MonkeyShocked::

That was hilarious HotPing!Rawhide.... ::MonkeyDance::

Oh, okay, thanks Klaas.

I think you know where I am going with this  ::cartwheel::

 ::MonkeyConfused::

I left about 10-12 pages ago - everything was calm. What happened??!!  ::MonkeyEek::

Tamikosmom logged in and the cage went wild.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

::MonkeyCool::

When you leave, Wreck, it always goes all to heck!  ::MonkeyWink::
Hotping got "rowdy", and started scrollin, scrollin, scrollin. I'm sure all will be well now that you're back.

Is there any way for Nonesy to get her name off of that chat roster without someone just agreeing to take her off?

1.Have you checked out Hotshots website Wreck!
2.Janet is spitting water in the sink!
3.Hotping is relivin Rawhide memories.Rollin,rollin,rollin
4.Monkey's.Anything else for wreck?

 ::MonkeyLaugh::

What fun!   ::MonkeyDance::

My cheeks ache from the smiling and laughing tonight.  ::MonkeyLaugh::  ::MonkeyLaugh::

Long overdue laughing. ::MonkeyHaHa::   ::MonkeyHaHa::

But....OH MY! 

 ::cartwheel::   ::cartwheel::   ::cartwheel::

Did You see what CBB said.....That made it even funnier...  ::MonkeyLaugh:: Geez My Azz Swollen.... ::MonkeyLaugh:: Gotta Love It!

It's funny to YOU hotping, becase you aren't constantly looking back to see what's following you...  :smt103 :roll:

Wreck

Hotshot's site:

http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/

Wreck ... Hotshot has her feet planted firmly on both sides of the cage/trap issue.  On one hand ... she supports John Silvetti's contention that the cage/trap contents was not Natalee Holloway related and undermines Monkeys who think otherwise but on the other hand ...

Janet

Take a look at Hotshot's website.  You remember Hotshot, the one who gets mad when we talk about Kyle and the trap and what was in it.

http://arubassilence.bravehost.com/

AZZZZZ SWOLLEN FROM SCROLLIN,SCROLLIN,SCROLLIN.. ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

Only if Janet had a picture of herself spitten water in the sink from laughin so hard!OK Janet.We'll let it pass this time! ::MonkeyDance::

Pot/Kettle

5.  CBB is singing "Scrolling ... Scrolling" as she catches up.

::MonkeyLaugh:: But I might Be!  ::MonkeyWink::

Yep, that wild woman Janet showed up, if her husband only knew....he better keep her happy...as much time at the computer as she likes....he would be totally bored with Cindy Crawford; nothing can compare to Janet!!!!

 ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::cartwheel::

 ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked:: ::MonkeyShocked::

Whaaa???

Agreed!

I tell him that all that time.  The grass is not greener on the ....

Janet

Hey ... you just clued in!!!  CBB ... you scanned the last thread too fast while you were singing "Scrolling ... Scrolling"

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

HotPing.You haven't posted in a minute.Are you making a Crown  and Coke? ::MonkeyLaugh::

Nope....Just watching these two crazy cats of mine...chasing each other through the house...... ::MonkeyWink:: ::MonkeyTongue::

You're right, Janet! That eye popper was worthy of my swollen azz!

Will the REAL hotshot, please shut stand up?

Laughter is good LifeSong!Scrollin,Rollin,Azz Swollen,Spitten water in the sink,Crown and cokes,as well as Janet taking all the credit(Just kidding Janet) and wreck opening the door to this big party goin on.... ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: WRECK BUSTED US ALL!! ::MonkeyEek::

 ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyConfused:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyRoll:: ::MonkeyConfused:: ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyShocked::

OK.All the rest of the Monkey Wallflowers need to join the party.Hotpings got the drinks...... ::MonkeyDance::

Go figure huh?  ::MonkeyConfused::

Playing both sides of the coin
Pot/Kettle

All the other Monkey's made me do it Klaas.I'm back on topic.I swear!No Really Klaas.. ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

My opinion only, BUt having watched some posters from the very beginning , I think they started off doing some very good things in regard to trying to find the truth for Natalee and her family.

However, at some point, I believe this concern became an obsession and they lost touch with reality and began making rash decisions. When they reached that point, all common sense appeared to go out the window.
When people would question them or their theories, they would lash out at them rather than discuss intelligently as they had previously done.


I have noticed a marked change over these few years and I don't think its a very good change. It has caused some to form "splinter" groups for "those in the know" (read those that support some pretty wild theories) mumbo jumbo theories, etc and its grown into a mess. Recently its become,  "if you don't support what I say, YOU hate me , or YOU are ATTACKING me, etc."
All this is just a symptom of total obsession, imo.
And of course, there are just those that are your random, basic Trolls also.

Again, this is my opinion only.
I just wish everyone could get back on track and begin to think rationally again and leave the BS behind.

From what I've also observed, here at Scared Monkeys things are consistent. Discussions take place WITHOUT power plays or back stabbing. Its quite refreshing for me.

I guess some just can't stand that. They need upheaval to survive.

Okay, I am off my soapbox.

Busted Busted Busted Rawhide or (Swollen AZZ)! ::MonkeyTongue::

No need to be so long winded, Wreck! This one says it all:   (http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/express/crazy.gif)

Hey ... Ducky and I are outta here.  I have a feeling Hotshot is going to log in and ... Ducky is going to get his feathers ruffled in all the commotion and ... take off over the magnificent American landscape heading straight for the Canadian border without me riding on his back.  It is too much to comprehend.

  ::MonkeyWaa::

GOOD NIGHT MONKEYS!!!  GOOD NIGHT ZOOKEEPERS!!!

Janet
9:15 PM PT

I agree.

Janet

Your Ducky is a chicken, Janet!     ::MonkeyCool::

Goodnight Janet.God Bless and Justice for Natalee!

In my opinion this is a very good summary of things Artcolley!  ::MonkeyCool::

Goodnight Janet!   ::MonkeyCool::

The sad thing is after reading some of her site, it seems there is only one side of the coin. If everyone is on the same page, this should be easy. Unless those people are out for personal gains or glory(which she has also accused Kermit of). I haven't seen anyone refute Kermit directly, nor anyone accuse her of booking a trip to Aruba while on a boycott mission. Interesting...

Good synopsis, Artcolley. Well said.

THanks, TM
Scared Monkey is always  a nice place to be. Monkeys Rock. The Mods are super, The Admins are the Best.
Yep, its all here!
(Bet that kills the a**holes)

Heh heh.  Both sides of the coin....

Don't forget about the ridges   ::MonkeyHaHa::  ::MonkeyHaHa::  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Playing the ridges on the diameter  ::MonkeyHaHa::   ::MonkeyHaHa::   ::MonkeyHaHa::  ::MonkeyHaHa::

::MonkeyHaHa::

All true, that's why they CAN'T STAY AWAY!!!!   ::MonkeyCool::

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::

That's why they keep coming back!I appreciate your thoughts ArtColley.The thing is.We're all Human,wrong at times,and make mistakes.You know someone's true character when one is able to admit fault!I for one,wish that i'm wrong about the happenings of the Persistence.No one can dispute Kyle's own word's,and or Kermit's finding's with anyhthing factual with any basis.JUSTICE FOR NATALEE.That's it!

KEEPTHEFAITH

Art ... you are very perceptive and ... you articulated that perception perfectly.

Thank you.

Janet

I agree with you Art.

OH, cause see, I think part of "initiation" is fly-by relay races, Yep, gotta see how often and how fast one can post and run to disrupt things (or try) . That way they get their points tallied to see who gains admittance to the hidey hole (dungeon) next!
Makes perfect sense to me,  ::MonkeyDance::
See, that Hidey hole is very very important. All the Important research is kept there. Comic book research, mumbo jumbo translations, visions, all sorts of good stuff, doncha know. VERY important Stuff.

YOu are welcome , Janet

Nite Janet

Thanks Artcolley

THanks, San

Many of us have had a wrong opinion or theory that we've changed over time in this case. I've said it before, but I was just sure that the blonde hair on the duct tape would prove to be Natalee's. I allowed myself to initially trust Hans Mos, too!

Most of us manage to tease out our opinions and objectively weigh them against new information and other opinions. This with Kyle and the persistence, has a whole other flavor to it because of a few posters and the venom of the opposition. JMO.

Nor have i Bc73.I think the booking of a ticket to Aruba at the Aruba boycott says it all for me.You think?

Klaas, you are very welcome,
How you do it, I don't know. I admire you!

TX, CBB

So last Sunday night I walked out on the deck.  It was a beautiful St. Louis night.  Full moon.  Crisp cool air.  Stars so bright.

So I'm looking up to the sky.  Clouds look like you could reach up and just pull one right out of the air.

We live south of St. Louis, and it's not uncommon for planes to be in a holding pattern for Lambert Airport. 

So I'm looking up and I notice that there are planes everywhere.  And many are in patterns of 2.  So I'm turning in circles and I notice all these planes in holding patterns.  I holler in the house for Mikey to come see this.  It's the darndest thing.  Never seen this before.  Some of the planes looked awful close to each other.

So hubby comes out on the deck, and I tell him to look at all the planes and sumpin must be going on at Lambert and he should get the news on right now.

Hubby looks up for a few seconds and says "snoopy are you serious" and I say "well yes fool don't see them" and he says................."snoopy those are stars ya idiot. lord don't tell the kids they'll put you in the home".  I said "well you crazy man them ain't stars go back in the house".

So after 27 years of marriage I call him one of my many favorite names and tell him to go mind his own gosh darn business. lol  Hateful thang.

So I keep staring up until my necks hurts and finally have to admit that crap they are stars. lol  Man I hate when I'm wrong.  The clouds moving made it look like the stars/planes were moving.........well you had to be there. lol   And of course he had to tell the kids.......son in law........mom in law........sister.........employees........

Jerk. lol

Just a little humor at my expense.  Don't tell anyone. lol

Do they use the Donkey-bone for there GrandPoohbah meetings?Juss asking! ::MonkeyCool::

Great post AC.

Yep, and you wait and watch and see if this doesn't happen.  Some that aren't making the drive bys will pop back in here one day like nothing ever happened....they had been taking a break from the case it was just too much for them....sigh..... ::MonkeyRoll::  When all the while they've been over there stirrin' the pot!  Although I'm sure the catalyst to most of the problems are those who won't be allowed back here, they have nothing to lose.
 ::MonkeyNoNo::

OH yes, I have change my mind on several things as new information became available.
Regarding Mos, I think a lot of us were so hoping this would be a "GOOD GUY". Finally. So disappointing to so many of us.

I agree with you , there should be no venom when discussing this from opposing viewpoints. Just present the argument and the proof of the conviction.

Did somebody say Hidey Hole?? Lord, I didn't think anyone would EVER ask again!!!!  ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance::

HIDEY HOLE
      l
      l
     \/

(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/crazybabyborgs/express/hidyhole.jpg)
     

Um...as incense? oh, they may have carved a donkey bone wand?  ::MonkeyShocked::

Not sure Art.  Right now I'm uploading a video for the Caylee case to photobucket, LOL.

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: I won't say a word.

 ::cartwheel:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyDance:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

YIKES! YOu need a few extra hands! lol

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Aw, Snoopy, you made a memory.  ::MonkeyWink::

JMO - I don't really make a huge deal out of Hotshot's booking a discount trip to Aruba. If you HAVE to go -- you might as well book it cheap! That said, I think she got a little "tunnel vision" along the way. I still think her heart is in the right place - just trusting the wrong people. (same as LDSTLU)

Snoopy, your secret is safe with me!  Great story, thanks for sharing it!

You said exactly what I've been wanting to say. I remember this Hotshot/Kath person from way back in the day. I remember her being crazy. There I said it. Wasn't she banned from SMs like 3 years ago? She caused just as much trouble as those Bondias if I remember correctly. I was dissapointed when she was allowed to come back to SM. Artcolley what you said is exactly right. Obsession way past the point of clarity.
The entire time she's been back she has been sending us in circles IMO.
Hello everyone, BTW. Hope all is well.

(LDSTSLOU)

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Um, CBB
I took another look at that Rat. Sure looks familiar. I KNOW I've MET that RAT.  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I do want to pause for a moment and really say thanks for the laughs when it seems the frustration has boiled-up.For me personally.I won't speak for other's.I think it would be fair to say that we've all been right,as well as wrong.I truly believe in my heart that if one's true convictions are for JUSTICE FOR NATALEE.The Cage is home.For me.The only promise you have to keep.Is to one girl.Natalee Holloway!I thank SCARED MONKEY's,as well as the Monkey's who never give up Hope,or Faith in the face of such adversity.To Beth,as well as Dave.God Bless you!

KEEPTHEFAITH

Good to see you Spooky.  Hope you're doing well.

Hello spooky nice to see you.

::MonkeyConfused::
(LDSTLOU) ?

SNoopy, now THAT is funny, lol

I'm giving up!  ( can't spell or think!) Night!  ::MonkeyConfused::

You too Snoop. I'm sick with a dang cold at the moment.

Hugs

Janet

Snoopy - lolol  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Back atcha Janet! ::MonkeyWink::

Awwww wreck it's ok...did you see how I spelled alcohol earlier?    ::MonkeyEek:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

and then it kept getting quoted and quoted and quoted...and I just had to keep scrollin' scrollin' scrollin'...cause it kills me when I spell something wrong!  I'm almost as desperate for an edit key as Janet! 

But if you must....goodnight wreck! 

Lovely to see you too Dear San. I hope the new year is treating you well.

Hi Spooky!  Good to see you!   ::MonkeyCool::

wreck I don't know if this is for me since I said I'm from St. Louis and so is ldstlou.  We are friends.  Well we were.  I don't think she is too happy with me right now because we don't agree at all about the Kyle subject.  I can tell you that she truly is a good person and cares about justice for Natalee.  Maybe I've lost a friend.  I hope that is not the case.

I stand with the girl

I stand with the Monkeys

I stand with the frog

So Wrecks goin to bed?Comes to the party late and leaves early. ::MonkeyLaugh:: I wish i had your discipline Wreck! ::MonkeyDance::

Funny Story Snoopy...Thanks for Sharing it with Us! We all have Our Moments!

Thanks ArtColley!

Good Night Wreck!

And Thanks to All the Monkeys here tonight for the Laugh a Thon...It was Great Fun!

Janet...HotShot is not to be Feared!

Love Too All And Good Night!
 ::MonkeyCool::
 

I swear I was a good speller in my youth! ( never a good typer! )  ::MonkeyTongue::

Hope you get to feeling better real soon sweetpea.

Well, here goes. I have refrained from saying this because I felt it was important to know what I was talking about before I opened up my trap. I'm more comfortable now, so........

It had been a while since I had regularly kept up with Natalee's thread. When there was news, I was here, but on a day to day basis, I had been caught up in other threads. When I found my way here to catch up, I was dumbfounded. I don't think it's possible to realize how different things were if you had been here daily. Posters were confrontive with each other and I saw and felt a rancor among posters I felt I knew, that I simply couldn't accept. I had to keep checking to see if I was really on this thread! And folks, I had been regularly on the POLITICAL forum!!

I learned some things. I learned that there was a "private" (ha-ha) forum wth SM posters. I also learned that there were long posters at SM that were being influenced, and allowing themselves to be influenced. I also learned, gratefully, that Klaas and Red and other Mods weren't just letting it happen, but were closely watching. That was a relief to me because at first, I didn't understand why there wasn't a major seperation of the wheat and chaff going on.

It's so nice to see the contentions, not the opposing views, becoming clearly seen for what they are in reality. Yeah, it's nice to be "home".   ::MonkeyWink::

As much as i don't agree with LdStlou.If you've been in contact with her personally and she is a friend.Give it some time and extend an olive branch.You'll know when the time is right. Snoopy!

  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Good night Hotping

I'm standing in the same spots, Snoopy. It's nice to have your company!  ::MonkeyWink::

Me too wreck...but my fingers just don't always cooperate with my brain!   ::MonkeyTongue:: ::MonkeyHaHa::

Goodnight Hotping!Drink lot's of water before bed.Just make sure you don't wet it! ::MonkeyLaugh:: ::MonkeyLaugh::Just Kidding!

Goodnight Hotping!   ::MonkeyCool::

CBB...Thanks for having such a Great Way of Putting Things! Good Night!   ::MonkeyWink::

Snoopy,
Just my opinion and I don't know ldstlou besides being here in the cage.  But I don't think you've lost a friend.  You were a friend to her and she knows that.  You tried to help, she knows that.  It will be o.k.  And we're all standing right there with you!   ::MonkeyCool::

Time for me to hit the hay.

Nite all and sweet dreams!   

Goodnight Art and thanx for your words!

Goodnight Artcolley!  Sweet dreams to you too, and thanks for your great post that said it all!   ::MonkeyCool::

Nite Artcolley, sleep well!

Well obviously as ya'll know I can be naive sometimes. lol  But the last months have been enlightning and disheartning.  Some of it I could see coming, but most of it hit me pretty hard.  People lose their way for one reason or another. 

The main thing is that  Scared Monkeys is the best place to be.   I have in the past belonged to a few other places tho never stayed when the gossip and such started.  Never had much use for that. 

Private forums such as Natalees Freebirds are to be commended, but they are the exception to the rule.  God Bless those birds.

Can't get that dang rawhide song outta my head. lol

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Yours too buddy.

That is funny!

On another note.Send a message to Jossy TM and let him know there has got to be some news in Aruba about anyhting other then the same stuff from weeks ago.You think? ::MonkeyHaHa::

whooops

nighty nite AC

Goodnight Snoopy!

I don't wanna go to bed yet!!   wwwaaaa.  AC's going to bed.  lol

I know...I can't believe they are just letting the website go like that!  But I won't be emailing them... ::MonkeyHaHa::

I'll just keep reading the other papers.  I've got a few things to post later.  Nothing about Natalee's case so far.

I sure wish Red or anyone else we can count on would give us some words of encouragement.

I have a secret Snoopy!AC will be back on tomorrow! ::MonkeyLaugh::

Goodnight to all!I will be waiting to see what the Antilles has to offer tomorrow TM!

KTF  you're too funny! lol   

Goodnight KTF!   ::MonkeyCool::

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Front Page

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaFP.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:
can some choller is steal car of police diabierna night for 9.30, polisnan at keep in centro of husticia at santa cruz, is hear alarma of car of police bay, y is see one muher sit in one of the autonan. also police is see cu the car was bek. one police owing to fly window y owing to descend the muher for of the car. after owing to bay sit behind the stuur, for stop the car cu was bek. but all the time, the muher v.v. naci at aruba of 42 year owing to ranca careda y owing to core bay. another polisnan at keep owing to core his slow y owing to succeed detene. past owing to stay close.

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Front Page

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaFP2.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:
booshi wever like or lag’i like we is follow cuestiona the abusonan of paul moore y fred gillman contra we arubianonan come across

Rest of the story Page 3
(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaPg3.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:
awemainta owing to achieve informacion cu minister booshi wever will owing to reacciona on the articulo cu we owing to publica week happen tocante paul moore y fred gillman, caminda is cuestiona maneho of the minister provided that cuestion. in the articulo can owing to read cu the two personanan here owing to resulta of is two boef very big self, y is just the two personanan here owing to amarga life of several employee at the aruban resort & casino, hotel cu they owing to cumpra bao of the name kli resort development. near of this can owing to read also cu moore y gillman owing to send various aruban cas y owing to place mericanonan at they lugar, as the.o. in departamento of throw of timeshare. because; if fuera some during meeting of the bond-holdernan of the aruban resort & casino, the inversionistanan new here owing to tell cu they not can pay nothing n’e momentonan ey y for give they one period of 5 year for work cu the coin y after of this will pay bek, but without none type of interest. according can owing to compronde the bondholdernan here among cual have some fundacion aruban will owing to lose very much coin self. mirando the desaroyo regrettable here, awemainta cu all razon owing to cuestiona maneho of minister wever, but also of minister rudy croes, banco central y of the curator, for miss of screening y mihor evaluacion of the personanan here. according awemainta can owing to compronde, minister booshi wever will owing to tell the personanan here not have permission, cu they're enter aruba because; tourist for look at con they inversionnan is canando. if esey t’e caso, the cuestionamento is become more big, because con can is cu is let two person enter aruba because; tourist y place person for abusa of we own yiunan of ground, cu is let they core cu aruban for of trabao y place mericano at they lugar, cu is let we fundacionnan lose coin, because they have to of the coin that know pakico, because the trabaonan of renovacion n’e hotel y casino ey is seems of is tranca for much time end. various trip booshi wever is complain cu not have derecho of replica, cu awemainta have one agenda scondi, cu we is atake for motibonan politico. alas we have to decepciona sr. booshi wever. at none instant awemainta owing to close door p’e give his near of medaya, al contrario, at various ocasion past owing to achieve oportunidad for reacciona on articulonan publica for we medio of comunicacion. the trip here assure not will was one excepcion, but past owing to prefera of not owing to haci this. for thing is the agenda scondi, awemainta can is proud of calling his self one corant independant, cu do not mara at none faction or entidad politico. we corant is apoya all esnan cu of one or another form is present y ehecuta cosnan good for desaroyo of aruba, because so we all is bay fast. but same we is critica hour cosnan bay robez, independant of cual faction owing to haci’e. we corant is uno cu not owe none faction fabornan, we owing to know of struggle during 5 year end, majority of the time contando cu one boycot of part of gobierno y various of his instancianan, caminda is deny we corant avisonan. despite of this, y thanks n’e sosten of we lectornan, cu owing to look at cu awemainta is one opcion various for all the another corantnan cu have eyfor, in cuadro of celebracion of we of 5 aniversario, we owing to dicidi of follow the direction of several corant rond world y cuminsa part we ehemplarnan gratuitamente, algo cu without doubt some owing to cause one impacto big in we comunidad cu day for day is pidiendo more y more of we corant, lagando we become so the of two corant more big of aruba. finalizando awemainta wanted tell minister booshi wever, cu door of we corant always is y will stay open for cualkier comentario, critica or replica, but cu never y never we will stay without publica the abusonan cu is take lugar on we island, specialmente contra we hendenan. more still if of form directo or indirecto, mandatario or instancianan is involucra in the abusonan here. stay pendiente, because we is hayando more informacion of thing is pasando at the aruban resort & casino, for cual have much asunto for investiga y merece clarificacion.

http://awemainta.com/home/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=207:arte-di-aruba-y-antiyas-promociona-na-new-york-city&catid=15:social&Itemid=58

Papiamentu translation:

art of aruba y antiyas promociona at new york city


sunday, 18 january 2009 21:20 organizadornan of the “2nd international caribbean art fair” at new york city recientemente owing to invita the artist y educador aruban stan kuiperi for give one lectura tocante “dutch caribbean art”. the presentacion was form part of the declaration of policy educativo of the art fair, cual owing to being teni in the area conoci because; chelsea, one district cu much gallery of art. this is first trip cu one artist aruban is as one semehante presentacion at new york city, one town cu is being considera because; the capital mundial of art. one publico cu was consisti of artist, galerista, appraisers of art, publicista, organisador y invitadonan of tanto merca because; caribe owing to atende the presentacion of stan kuiperi. the presentacion owing to haci one impacto much positive serca the publico. two aspecto owing to come fast in the reaccionnan of the publico. at first lugar, cu is first trip cu majority of the publico owing to see y hear algo tocante art of aruba y antiyas. at of two lugar, the calidad artistico y the variedad conceptual of the work owing to surprise everybody positivamente. stan kuiperi owing to present one view general of art visual of aruba y antiyas. after of one introduccion of history of art local owing to sigi one serie extenso of imagennan of art of aruba, corsow y another islands of antiyas. all genero of art was inclui, for of exercise y tecnicanan tradicional till cu the ultimo instalacionnan conceptual. is of compronde cu unicamente some (uno or dos) of the artistanan was conoci p’e publico internacional. tony monsanto (pintura) y tirzo martha (instalacionnan), both of corsow, was esun they cu the publico owing to arrive of see in exposicionnan internacional or at new york. besides, stan kuiperi owing to organisa one encuesta among artistanan of aruba y antiyas, cu also owing to being present during the presentacion. the aim of the encuesta was for enfoca on the “consiencia caribense” of the artistanan of aruba y antiyas. cu another word, con consciente the artistanan of we comunidadnan is of is form part of caribe, y con they're expresa this? for of the feedback of the respondentenan of the encuesta can saca several conclucion interesting. one ehempel of the conclucionnan is cu majority of the artistanan encuesta is considera they self “caribense” in first lugar. at of two lugar they're considera they self because; “caribense hulandes”, y at of three lugar because; local, then as of aruba, corsow, etc. unicamente some artist is considera they self because; artist neutral without is relaciona cu they country of origen or of residencia. provided that general can conclui cu the lectura “art from the dutch caribbean” was much exitoso y cu the presentacion here owing to completa the declaration of policy of lectura of art of the several paisnan in we region. owing to haci palabracionnan for participacion in the next international caribbean art fair, although do not conoci still at cua town this will take lugar. is of wait for cu aruba y antiyas will can organisa one presencia more big, incluyendo gallery, work of art y artistanan self also. stan kuiperi y aruba international arts foundation sinceramente is gradici all artist y also fundacion unoca cu owing to coopera so positivamente cu the evento important here y cu the esfuersonan for promove art of aruba, antiyas y caribe. come across

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Page 3

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaPg3_2.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:

man detene at dakota cu drugs y enough coin police of oranjestad is achieve informacion cu near of dakota bar have 4 man owing to arrive, y cu they're dress cu camisa black y have indicacion cu they're arm. police owing to bay cu very cautela, y good prepara. was more or less 9.30, of night, cu fast dakota bar, at come across cu the 4 hobennan as describi, esta caminsa black y cu short. at once owing to place all esnan in becindario sleep plat, for listra they enbusca of arm of candela. have to tell cu hour cu police owing to arrive n’e sitio, they owing to constata cu the bar owing to close his portanan end. but if police owing to come across cu the 4 hobennan as the denunciante owing to tell. is deal of 4 young of cual 3 had short dress. police owing to listra they their curpa, after of owing to ponenan sleep abao, but not owing to achieve arm of candela. if t’asina cu on curpa of r.q, naci at aruba of 36 year, police owing to achieve one saco in cual had grass of marihuana. also the had one can of mention in cual had 7 package cu cocaina. also the had 325 guilder y 20 dollar. drugs y coin owing to stay confisca y r.q owing to wordo take away keep, where past stay close.

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Page 4

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaPg4.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:

police is detene choler cu owing to atraca tourist at rancho saturday the tourist therefore., is ask asistencia for 12.20 of afternoon in ranchostraat, y the is tell cu two man owing to atrake. past owing to tell police for bay cune, y the is show police where the accion of atraco did take lugar. police is bay cune in avenida alo tromp y eynan they're come across cu one witness, that is tell police cu t’e cholernan j.j.b. of 27 year, mihor conoci because; tracy y andy rastra owing to atraca the tourist. police owing to busca y owing to come across cu tracy. police owing to detene at once y owing to listra at his curpa. police owing to achieve in his jockey one tubo of crazy glue, in cual the had some stone of cocaine. police owing to detene for atraco also for have drugs in his power.

Sad story....poor baby... ::MonkeyNoNo::

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Page 4

http://awemainta.com/home/

(http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b258/texasmom55/Misc%20News%204/01192009AweMaintaPg4_2.jpg)

Papiamentu translation:

baby of 11 month in bad estado interna in hospital asistencia of police owing to wordo ask saturday nightfall for 4.10 at one cas at rooi afo, where police is talk cu he the.r., naci at aruba of 46 year, that is tell police cu one day first, for 7.30 night, one muher owing to come his cas y owing to puntre p’e see one rato for his baby, p’e bay cumpra milk y sigaria. for of the instant ey, the mother not owing to go back more. the.r. is tell cu the baby not owing to come for of hour cu the mother owing to lague y the child is seems bad. hour cu police owing to arrive they're constata cu the child was much dirt y in one situation much deplorable y miss of nutricion. at once police owing to calling ambulance y owing to place voogdijraad at height of the caso y they owing to bay cu the child keep of police. at keep they owing to bath the criatura y owing to dune of come. while cu they're wardando on ambulance y voogdijraad, one colega of they owing to tell cu past owing to hear cu he w.l. naci at aruba of 42 year owing to bay keep y owing to tell cu the is busca his baby of 11 month, cu the mother d.h.r. naci at aruba of 24 year owing to bay cune. police owing to calling the father w.l., that owing to come keep y owing to reconoce his child. ambulance owing to arrive y owing to tell police cu the baby have to of cuido pura, because; cu his situation is much deplorable. at once they owing to hibe hospital, where past owing to stay interna. voogdijraad is follow cu the caso.

1/19/2009 Awe Mainta Page 5

http://awemainta.com/home/

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Papiamentu translation:

recientemente, gobierno of chairman hugo chavez of venezuela owing to anuncia cu very fanfaria cu together cu they partner strategico, esta rusia will cuminsa explota y explora for achieve gas y eventualmente more crudo in sea fast of venezuela. the exploración here owing to stay anuncia p’e own chairman hugo chavez, that owing to tell cu this is one acto of soberania for cu the "imperialismo yanki", y is wordo realisa in sea in golfo of venezuela, cu is arrive t’e at boundary cu aruba. of the 28 blokenan for explora, the consorcio russian owing to inclui the gazprom, y they owing to achieve 5 bloke asigna. one of they're denomina cardón 3, cu is at because; 14 mile of aruba. the proyecto here, según the publicacionnan, is causando preocupación at aruba y assure at the netherlands, because; country cu is responsible p’e relacionnan exterior of aruba, cu is form part still of the netherlands. recientemente in washington post, owing to leave even one interview cu periodistanan of dicho corant owing to haci cu minister plenipotenciario of aruba, staciona at embassy of kingdom dutch at washington, esta joyceline croes, that owing to confirma also cu gobierno venezolano owing to viola the protocol cu venezuela have company cu the netherlands, for cu hour of exploracion of cualkier producto in sub-suelo cu they will notifica the netherlands, thing in the caso here not did take lugar. what problem this can trece cune, none person does not comenta, because of part of aruba, they do not give the caso here mucho importancia, because gobierno actual of aruba also have very interest for achieve the.o. gas for cual owing to company even one convenio cu one compania french for haci the trabao of exploracion.

Goodnight lifesong, anna & two guests!   ::MonkeyCool::

and spooky!   ::MonkeyCool::

This is good to hear. My power cord on my laptop went out about 6 months ago or so. So I wasn't on here reading and lurking like normal. I finally get back here and I felt like I was in a twilight zone! So good to know I wasn't alone CBB!

Aruba
 invasion New Havana Beach Bar
17 Jan, 2009, 13:40 (GMT -04:00)
(http://www.amigoe.com/artman/uploads/17-aruba-inval-havana_001.gif)

ORANGE CITY - The Coast Guard, warda Nos. Costa, yesterday at half past five noon raid done by the New Havana Beach Bar & Restaurant. Here are twelve people arrested. By the end of the afternoon was the area around the beach bar sold, making it impossible for the field to leave unseen. People at that time wanted to leave were summoned to return. The warda Nos Costa took the staff standing. Staff who do not have the correct papers had been taken immediately. This was also the case for the son of the new manager of the New Havana Beach Bar & Restaurant. He had also not have the right papers and was during this raid by the authorities included. Because the raid was to close the restaurant by staff. The warda Nos. Costa was unavailable for comment on the raid.

bastibro
Scared Monkey

 Offline

Posts: 553

         Re: Natalee Case Discussion #793 1/13/09
« Reply #880 on: January 18, 2009, 08:40:55 PM »   Quote Modify Remove Split Topic



Can you back up your negative posts toward Kermit with something that is worthy of thinking about?   

Yes! I think its time for her to stop bashing Kyle the whole time.
Kyle has chose to not defend himself here at SM and thats his right.
Everything here seems to be about the Kyle and the Persistence issue, thats what irritates me.
I`m convinced this will lead to . . nothing!
I`m sorry, that`s my opinion

bastibro  
Are you still posting at BNH?
Is kyle posting there again?
Just Asking

Morning Monkeys!

I am way behind, but trying to catch up.  (still in the last lively thread).

I wanted to respond to casa's assertions from last Friday however.

John SIlvetti himself posted at BFN that he had disregarded the fishing cage and its contents - so no, Kyle is not the only one we've heard from about this.

John's own admission of this, in the face of what Kyle has presented to us is very powerful corroberation of Kyle's words.


#457 on: January 16, 2009, 11:33:27 PM   casa

San and keepthefaith, I have no proof of that.  Just my opinon.  That is the vibe I got from reading what he was posting.  I'm not sure what we can believe of what he said.  Of course, I could be all wrong, but that is the feeling I got from him.  You notice he was the only one we heard from
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4371.msg630810#msg630810 


Kyle:After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains

 jdsurveyor1 Newbie Posts: 11
John Silvetti, the Persistence and the Search for Natalee «
Reply #13 on: April 03, 2008, 07:52:13 PM »

The important thing is to raise funds. It will require corporate support as well as private donations. Dave and Beth have been doing a great job getting the word out and while I was on the island, Dave put me in contact with the head of the Hotel Association who is working on raising a sizeable amount. So many on the island are supporting our efforts as well as people from all over the world. The media really blew the cage out of proportion. Although the cage initially provided some moments of "what is in there", I warned all on board that none of this information was to leave the boat. It was very suspect that a cage of this size was found where it was on the seafloor relative to the coast. My feelings were this was highly unusual and probably had something to do with something, but not what we were after.  It was decided that the cage would be investigated further by divers, however, it was designated as only a target of interest. The crew moved onto other targets. Unfortunately, inexperience and frustration led to premature statements, including that we had found her. I don't think anyone was more upset than I that this information came off the boat and caused the Holloway family more grief!
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4371.msg625934#msg625934

Good morning everyone!! 

Jen3560 is it your opinion that the Gottenbos boat was used to take Natalee out to sea as stated on the Freebird blog?  TIA

Good morning monkeys! 

Muffy, I left you a note in musings.

Morning snoopy.

Yes - I am of that opinion.

Are you referring to our "In the Face of Evil" series?

I know it's a long one - but I feel it is well worth the read, and points out when and how the deed could have been done with the facts available to us at the time.

It was surreal and terribly sad to see some of that supported by the location of the cage and remains, and also with Hodge's confirmation the Gottenbos' boat WAS moored at that particular dock on May 30th.

Ok Monkeys, on moving forward:

With the new administration stepping in, perhaps we could focus for a bit on how and when would be the most effective way to make our case and win this new administration and  State Department to our cause?

It seems our progress at this point must necessarily include a political strategy, as well as the legal/diplomatic channels.

How do we win a Hilary Clinton led state department over to the cause of Justice for Natalee?  How do we get the new administration's attention?  I think we're going to have to sharpen our own diplomatic skills.  Are we starting from scratch here?  Do any of the State Dept players stay the same?

Good Morning Monkeys!Another Marvelous day.Sun is shining. ::MonkeyDance:: What a wonderful night in the cage... ::MonkeyHaHa::

GOOD MORNING MONKEYS!!  GOOD MORNING ZOOKEEPERS!!

Just got back from Vancouver International.  Hubby and I drove with daughter and family to see them off to Disneyworld in Orlando Florida and ... then drove back in their van after breakfast at the home of hubby's sister.

We are considering purchasing tickets this week and joining the gang for one week of their two week vacation in a time-share condo.  We will let youngest son do some internet shopping for a good deal on those plane tickets.

I have a fear of flying so ... declined an invitation back in October when plans were being made but ... I think we better go for it.  Grandkids are growing up sooo quickly  and ... Hubby reminded me on the drive home that apparently we are not getting any younger so ...

I have been up since 4:30 AM.  I just may take a nap shortly.

Janet
9:20 AM PT


 

Keepthefaith ... the fog is back.

 ::MonkeyWaa::

The weather in the Fraser Valley for over one month .... snow ... rain ... more snow ... fog ... 1 day of sunshine ... fog.

Janet

Sorry Janet!Not a cloud in the Sky down here! ::MonkeyDance::

I asked the question regarding Paulus and Antonio Carlo's connection,as well as partnering together in the Law firm.Kermit's response is very interesting,as well as intriguing to say the least. ::MonkeyEek::

Kermit

"How else would you protect money laundering, heroin....

Mark Purcell's wife, Marlene Purcell along with Antonio Carlos are involved in the AHATAboard as well.
Antonio Carlos worked for Johan Paul Sjiem Fat, Sjiem Fat & Sjiem Fat, Aruba

 Paulus Van der Sloot participated on a panel which agreed to extradite two relatives of the Mansurs to the US under serious charges some years back

Antonio Carlos worked for the gov't and banks in Aruba.

Thank you jen3560.

Snoopy ... how is "Snoopy" doing.

Janet

Meant to say also that yes it was The Faces of Evil segment.  I just wanted to see if you still felt that way today about the Gottenbos boat.  Thanks.

O/T

Snoopy is hanging in there.  Some days he acts like a puppy.  Sleeps alot.  Can only handle hamburger/rice food.  He trys to wonder away.  He knows what he is doing too. lol  He can't hear so when we want him to come in we have to physically go get him or wait for him to look at us so we can give him a visual wave.  So we go after him and pat him on the back when he starts wondering too far away.  He just wags his tail like whoops they caught me. lol.

Thanks for asking.

Kyle said: "He [John Silvetti] did make several comments about trying to land some work through contacts he met while in Aruba.


Kyle said: "John will be in Aruba tomorrow and will report soon. This is a different issue. He knows nothing of what we're about to do with the footage. "

(http://forum.chowchow.org/images/avatars/gallery/Chows/Chow_Chow.gif)
Caps favorite dog

Snoopy ... thank you for sharing.

Janet

 ::MonkeyCool::

YW snoopy.

And yes, I do still feel the same way.......in addition to what we compiled in that series, along with what I posted above - and also another logistical factoid have just reconfirmed my opinion.

One of our members has/had a boat similar in size and configuration to the Gottenbos' boat. 

Taking the measurements Kyle gave us of the cage found - we did a graphic overlay of that boat, and that cage would have fit on it just fine.

snoopy, I apologize.

I read it as though it was how you were, not your doogie. So I went back and re-read. Sorry.
I'll bet just the touch of your love is what makes him the happiest.

EDIT

What was significant about this particular "target of interest" that deemed important enough for Aruban divers to make a dive ... to make a second dive ... sample contents and ... recover contents?

Considering the interest in the trap/cage by the ALE ... the enemy ... why did John Silvetti ... in the name of accountability to the donors who sacrificially gave to the Persistence endeavor ... not take any responsibility to insure that the chain of recovery was at the very least a mutally effort.

Janet

+++++


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. 05/08/08

Kyle: He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that. (06/10/08)

Excellent.   We've had quite a few boats over the years, and I thought it would fit.  It was the weight that I wondered about 2 or 3 men being able to lift up on the boat with a lifeless body in it.  There's one thing about it.  There is no way they pulled this off without leaving evidence on that boat.  No way at all.  Whether it be scratches in the paint / fiberglass / metal, or decomposing body.

Now weren't we told that Julia bought the boat?  I wonder if that is true. Am I remembering that right?

Good afternoon, Monkeys,

Michael Dompig told Dave that PAULUS took out the Gottenbos boat on the Monday of Natalee's disappearance.  It is in Dave's book but I don't have the exact page at hand.

Just FYI.

 It's all good Kermit.  Oh and just FYI I ain't old......well the big one is coming up in a few months lol and I have never been called a dog. lol

Just teasin ya buddy   ::MonkeyWink::

Note my last post.  I can share information even on theories with which I am not in much agreement.

Deep down, I still kind of think Natalee was or still is buried or hidden somewhere in Sloot compound.

When a person is not locked into a theory, they do not have anything to defend and do not become so irrational about proving a point as some have who just couldn't stand it if others didn't share their theory.

I just want the truth no matter what it is or who is right.  When people start wanting whatever they think to be endorsed by all, that's when the trouble begins IMO.

Hi Anna and thank you.  I had forgotten that.   

Snoopy,
Good afternoon.  I think it was scubajap who was buying boats.  Not sure if she bought that one or the one being sold by Vader van Loon's family.  Or both.

She does have scuba as part of her name so guess is into boats.

Not sure about Julia.  Old windsurfer, isn't she?  Must be tough on the complexion, lol.

Well.....being the lady that I am I won't comment on my true feeling of her.  Well what the heck she's a POS.  Whoops.

For those who don't read there and may not know, I have posted at Refugees under another name.  But it was certainly not to participate in any Beth bashing, etc, but the opposite.  To offer support for those who had converted after Joran's confession.  It was like doing hand-to-hand combat and finally I couldn't take it any more, too much negativity.  And goofy theories.

Anyway, there are a group of people who post there who attempt to counter the ridiculous accusations, etc.  Foremost among them is Resigned/pathenry for whom I have great respect for hanging in there among the thorns.

lin, GMBW, all19 suspects, etc. support Natalee and her family and take a pounding there all the time as you can imagine.  But I did see an opportunity with Joran's confession and many have changed their tune about him after that.  I haven't even read there in a while but did hear CharlieRat was banned, lol.  The admin said the older posters got a "longer leash" than new ones so it was sometimes difficult to defend without getting time out, etc.  But resigned can handle them well and constantly douses them with reality checks.  He has sense of humor and can really put things in perspective. 

So not all who post there are against justice for Natalee and this family.

I think the hardcore went to BHN where they could carry on with more privacy/secrecy, etc.

I'm so sorry. I came off as insensitive and I didn't mean too.
Wanted to make sure you knew.

You are only as old as you think you are.
Age is only a number
What's the other one?
Oh yeah, you're the new 30!

 ::MonkeyDance::

She's an American traitor plain and simple.

didn't gottenbros boat have some kind of problem to the motor blade or something?
could that be an indication of carelessness near the land trying to retrieve a cage?
I remember Kyle asking about this or something. ::MonkeyRoll::

I don't think the weight would have been an issue - provided there was more than one person on the boat (which I believe there was)

OE posted here:
 #682 on: March 18, 2008, 09:28:45 AM I learned from a source that there is only one place/person(?) on Aruba where a large commercial fish trap would have originated.  This should make it a reasonable venture figuring out who's trap we found.  The next logical move would be after finding them, asking them to explain their missing trap.  1) How did they lose it  2) why was it lost where it was 3) what were it's contents when it was "lost" and 3) what boat was used to transport the trap.

Any ideas of who may have possessed such a trap?
Approx. 7.5 x 7.5 x 2.5ft, and 200-300lbs, hundreds of feet of rope complete with 4-point rigginghttp://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366260#msg366260
-------------

And it was Rosalie Klein aka scubajap and her (now) ex husband who bought the boat from the Gottenbos.

I agree with you - there would have been something on that boat to indicate its use in this disposal.  Natalee's family could never ascertain whether or not it was searched - and from the case file documents we've seen, there was no forensic testing of it.

okay gotta run. snoops, again, my apologies.

A lot of people appear to "go native" when they go to Aruba, both American and Dutch people.  They seem to lose touch with reality and take on the local mindset, etc.  Become completely bonkers in some case but think of all the people who underwent a personality change before our very eyes.  Hans Mos comes to mind first.  I really thought he was going to do something.  Pfffft!

Must be some sort of island fever that overtakes them or something.  Our Dept of State says one in four uses cocaine.  Who knows.

But many seem to subscribe to that us against them/the world/reality mentality once there.

Sort of strange to me.  Or maybe they were just crackpots to begin with and that is why they found such a place attractive?  Dunno. . . .



.

The prop.

It was being stated at the reject site that it had a broken prop.

Of course, this was the excuse being given as to why it couldn't have been used for this.

Those stating this as fact didn't know at the time that Sander had invited Joran out on it May 29th (thus, no broken prop), and that it was docked right there near the Mariott.

Couldn't agree with you more on the part I highlighted Kerm  ::MonkeyWink::

No apology needed Kermit.  I didn't take it bad at all.  And you are right about the age thing.  There truly aren't many 20 or 30 year olds that could keep up with me. lol  I out work them on a daily basis.  Well Advil doesn't hurt either. lol

And yes she is a traitor.  JMHO but I think she knows exactly what happened to Natalee and knows who was involved.

Yes you can mess up a prop. real quick.  Not that I would know or anything like that. lol  Hubby did not think that little mishap was funny at all. That's a whole nuther story.  Poor man. lol

 ::MonkeyHaHa::  That's the one I'm going with!

KOEN GOTTENBOS

CORRUPTION IN PARADISE - DAVE HOLLOWAY

Page 118 - Sometime in early July 2005, Robin and I saw Deputy Police Comissioner Gerold Dompig's son and another young man who appeared to have similar descriptive features of Steve Croes, the Tattoo party boat disc jockey who had been arrested and released, trying to pick up a girl in the Holiday Inn lobby hallway and get her to go to Carlos and Charlie's. The girl was offering resistance and trying to distance herself from these two. As the guys were walking by, young Dompig noticed me and immediately discontinued his activity. The other kid realized he was getting nowhere with the girl and started in on another set of women. I walked up to Dompig, and he seemed a little embarrassed that we had witnessed his actions. He then started talking about the case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had heard that Paulus van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat on either the night of Natalee's disappearance or the next day  and that he was allegedly involved with Natalee's murder. That brought to mind one of Joran's statements. He referred to a friend by the name of Koen Gottenbos. Apparently, this friend's father owned a boat. The message was that this boat was used to take Natalee out to sea. Another boat that was also mentioned by him was the Pair A Dice, which is a local boat from Aruba.

Page 181 - Art and I talked to Ms. Flanagan about all the red flags that we were seeing and that we thought Koen, Joran, and Deepak took Natalee out in the boat. She agreed with that theory. She added that the reason she had left the case was because she thought Koen was lying, and when she asked the police to reinterview him, they refused. We told her that we were going to talk to the prime minister the next day to lay it all out.

Page 177 - After Dompig heard we had found the boat, he indicated that he was going to bring Koen in for questioning in a day or so. I told him that if they interviewed Koen, they might solve the case.

Page 181 - She added that the reason she had left the case was because she though Koen was lying, and when she asked the police to reinterview him, they refused.

Page 182 - I asked Dompig to do the interview of Koen instead of having Jacobs do it. I became concerned because he said he would have to discuss it with Jacobs first. Several weeks later, I heard that Koens father had been interviewed, but Koen had not been questioned yet.

++++++++

Hope for the Holloways?
Thursday, November 17, 2005

VAN SUSTEREN: And are you satisfied that this assistant prosecutor was as candid as could be with you?

DAVE HOLLOWAY: She was very candid. And in fact, I made sure that the prime minister understood our position. You know, I had been holding off on this boycott as long as I could, and I told him, I said, you know, The big wave is coming, and if you guys are not going to listen, I can't help you anymore.

Well, I left the prime minister's office. I even gave them the name of the witness that they needed to interview. And I said, you know, If you don't do anything about it, I can't help you anymore.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,175925,00.html


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for December 1
updated 7:37 a.m. PT, Fri., Dec. 2, 2005

ART WOOD: ... Dave Holloway and I begged the police down there to bring him Coon in and question him. And they haven't done it yet. And he lied the first time that he talked to the police. To solve these cases, just follow the lies, Rita.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10295536/


SANDER GOTTENBOS
Witness Statement
June 17, 2005

On your question if I had contact with Joran on May 29, 2005, I tell you the following;
 
I had telephone contact with Joran on May 29, 2005, this was around 11.00.

On your question about how the conversation went, I will tell you the following;
 
The conversation went that I asked him if he wanted to go out on my fathers boat.

He said that he could not go because he was going to play poker at the Holiday Inn. There is tournament each Sunday in aforementioned hotel and Joran participates almost each week in that tournament.

On your question what kind of boat my father has, I will explain to you the following:
It is a speedboat, of the make "Sea Pro".

On your question if Joran had been on our boat before, I will explain to you the following:
Joran has never been on our boat and has also never with our dangers. (?)

Your memory is correct, Anna.

From Dave's book:

I walked up to Dompig, and he seemed a little embarrassed

that we had witnessed his actions.  He then started talking about the

case, and during this conversation he mentioned that he had

heard that Paulus Van der Sloot had borrowed a friend's boat

on either the night of Natalie's disappearance or the next day and

that he was allegedly involved with Natalie's murder.   That brought

to mind one of Jurons statements.  He had referred to a friend

by the name of Koen Gottenbos.  Apparently, this friend's father

owned a boat.  The message was that this boat was used to take

Natalie out to sea.  Another boat that was also mentioned by him

was the Pair a Dice,, which is a local boat from Aruba

Aruba by Dave Holloway - pages 118 and 119
-----------------

Art and I talked to Ms. Flanagan about all of the red flags
that we were seeing and that we thought Koen, Juran, and Deepak
took Natalie out in the boat.  She agreed with that theory.
She added that the reason she had left the case was because she thought
Koen was lying, and when she asked the police to re-interview him,
they refused.

Dave Holloway    Aruba   page 181

 ::MonkeyCool::  Janet!!!

Your memory and archives are fabulous!

jen,
If you can say, was a determination ever made on where the trap most likely came from?  TIA

I agree!   ::MonkeyDance::

My memory is going.

I put Brandi ... our 15 year old Golden Retriever ... out to do her thing last night (10:00 PM) and ... at 1:00 AM I woke up and suddenly remembered.   BRANDI!!!!  I had forgot to call her in.

 ::MonkeyShocked::

I am fortunate that Brandi loves me unconditionally.

Janet

tx mom,

I think that Kyle was being fed some bad information at that point.  That is just my personal opinion though.

And no - he never did share with us who this "one person" might have been - or if he ever received any further information about it.

If I look at the progression of the missing fish cage, combined with what Kyle shared with us, and what Hodges found out - I can see a pattern.

First - the fish cage was stolen, but not reported to ALE (fear?) and had been there since March 2005, and was gone the day of May 30/May 31.

Then (3 years later)- the fish cage was never stolen, the fisherman had it at his house (fear and a payoff?)

Sizing.....

When it hit the media that a fish cage had been stolen - it was noted to be a "large" cage.

By the time Hodges and the Persistence arrived, it had gone from a "large" cage to something roughly 5'x4'.

Yet - if you look at the graphic overlay that was done of the dimensions of the cage found, inside the cut away brush at the fisherman's huts where the cage had sat from March thru the end of May - it would have fit there perfectly.

Thanks jen!   ::MonkeyCool::

THE DIMENSIONS

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle:  The trap was symmetrical in width and length at approximately 7.5 ft. It was approximately 2.25-2.5 ft high.  You're correct about the ROV video lens distorting perspective due to the paralax view lens.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2668.msg360072;topicseen#msg360072


Kyle:  The trap in question is significantly larger than Dr. Hodges reported dimensions from the fishermen huts owner.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2662.msg358604;topicseen#msg358604

Good Afternoon Monkeys!

Just wondering...Has anyone heard anything more about where Joran is suppose to be?...Laos...Thailand....Netherlands...???

Howdy hotping.  I haven't heard where Joran is.  I think we heard last week that he was in The Netherlands, but I don't know if that was confirmed. 

I wonder if Joran is in Den Dolder?  I hope I spelled that right.  That seems to be the one place he's supposed to be over time, and perhaps he really went.

Alternatively, follow the money.  Where would JVDS go for easy money?  What after Thailand?  Australia?  U.S.?  Fiji?

KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO KERMIT

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 -
« Reply #540 on: December 19, 2008, 06:15:18 PM »

Kyle sent me this today

Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.
 
I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.  I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.  I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".
So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 Kyle

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg592482;topicseen#msg592482


TAMIKOSMOM - RESPONSE

Kyle ... I understand perfectly why Kermit's postings would have an effect on your personal and professional relationship with John Silvetti.  However ... you are forgetting that the words in those posts submitted by Kermit to SM site are your own.

What I fail to understand is why you would want a personal or professional relationship with someone who is not trustworthy ... somebody who put his own self-interests above those who he is morally and financially accountable to?

Think about it Kyle.  Your own words imply that Natalee Holloway's remains could have been in that trap.  A family who was waiting in American had a right to know.

Kyle ... please answer honestly.  Would you desire a continued personal or professional relationship with John Silvetti if you believed there was a strong possibility that the remains of your beloved was in that trap/cage. 

Sincerely, Janet

++++++++

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle:  I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.

Kyle:  I get done in the survey room backing up the ROV dive and head to the back deck to talk to the Polis divers and see what they sampled and see the Polis boat way in the distance heading away fast. John doesn't seem concerned at all, but I am very dissapointed, concerned, and burning inside because I have a feeling that I/we will never know what they took from the trap. That evening I talked to John asking when we plan on recovering the trap. Previously this was part of the talks and plan, but this time he doesn't seem concerned about ever looking into the trap further. After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains.

Kyle:   John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. (05/08/08)

Kyle: He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that. (06/10/08)

For you klaas!

"It's elementary, my dear Watson.” ::MonkeyEek::

Janet,

I asked Kyle the same question.

But you worded it much more civilly and politely than I did.  ::MonkeyTongue::

Oh - he never did answer me either......at least not with anything significant that I can remember.

KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO KERMIT

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 -
« Reply #540 on: December 19, 2008, 06:15:18 PM »

Kyle sent me this today

Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.
 
I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.

I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.  I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".
So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 Kyle

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg592482;topicseen#msg592482


TAMIKOSMOM - RESPONSE #2

Kyle ... according to your own words in posts to the Natalee's Freebirds' site ... as far as you knew Beth Holloway had never received any info regarding the ROV images and ... your perception of the Persistence undertaking.

Logic dictates you would not have posted accordingly if in February you had confirmation that Beth Holloway was in the know.

Nevertheless ... according to Jen ... Former Natalee's Freebirds' Administrator ... Beth Holloway was uninformed.

Sincerely, Janet

+++++++

IN YOUR OWN WORDS

Kyle:  I havn't spoken to Beth and don't plan to personally.

Kyle:  I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th. Remember, 6 of the pics from the 29th I sent to the FBI ended up on the Internet thanks to the FBI leaking them to Dave and therefore Robin H.

Kyle:  Oh, no one has possession of any footage except Tim Trahan, an archived copy on the Persistence, and myself."

Kyle:  Unless the FBI already knew the Dutch were on site doing a sweep.. I doubt they know it was done, if it were. I did not give the information to the FBI and I'm unaware of anyone relaying the possibility to them. I tried to confirm or disprove the Dutch coast guard having been on site twice but I could do neither.

Kyle:  I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th. Remember, 6 of the pics from the 29th I sent to the FBI ended up on the Internet thanks to the FBI leaking them to Dave and therefore Robin H.

Kyle:  On the contrary, neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge.

Kyle:  None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th.


FORMER NATALEE'S FREEBIRDS' ADMINISTRATOR (JEN)

klassend
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #787 12/24/08 -
« Reply #411 on: December 30, 2008, 06:53:44 PM »

Sent to me by Natalee's Freebirds:

<snipped>

Approximately May 2008 Kyle began dodging questions for details (we had asked for names of Aruban police and divers to be included in our documentation of these events), hedging on moving forward with this, and then he completely disappeared from our board.
 
During that time, we learned Kyle had never contacted Beth, or Dave, or the FBI with this information.
 
We put our original plan into motion - that of presenting this information in a clear and concise manner, and we sent it to Beth Holloway.
 
Beth was disturbed, needed time to digest the information, and wanted to share it with someone she trusts.
 
When Tim Miller was returning to Aruba this past fall, Beth gave us permission to release this information publicly.

<snipped>

Nothing that was posted at SM by kermit was incorrect, out of context, or in any way false.
 
Regards,
 
Former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator

Natalee and her family deserve justice - and we will not let up until they have it!

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.msg603349#msg603349


jen3560
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #788 12/31/08 -
« Reply #54 on: December 31, 2008, 04:36:13 PM  

After we discovered this information had been withheld from US authorities, we contacted legal counsel, and were advised to keep our distance from Persistence crew members and benefactors - that is when and why Kyle was banned.

That occurred the end of September.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4328.msg605250#msg605250

Jen ... when was Beth Holloway, FBI and John Kelly informed by the Natalee's Freebirds.

Thanks

Janet

IN KYLE KINGMAN OWN WORDS

Kyle:  No one else has access or copies of the photos or footage. All fingers point back to me when this leaks.

Beth was made aware on 3 different occasions.

Once in March from PI (preliminary only, pictures with little background or supplemental from Kyle)

Once in ?????? from Kermit (pics and some of Kyle's posts)

Once in September (with our final document) by me

JQK - September by Wingnut

FBI - September by me

It's funny after all the accusations by Michael Dompig, that Koen would be in his top friends at Facebook. How in hell does Gottenbos not have people put pressure on him regarding this investigation, when he is right in front of us? (Gainesville???)

Thank Jen.

Janet

Hi to all of our Monkeys, now and before...

It's been a long time and many miles... A lot has happened recently and I have been VERY busy...

But I just wanted to say that I think so much of all of you and am trying to keep track of things as best I can. I am still getting a very complicated move sorted out so I will not be seen much, but I wanted to give you all a shout and let you know that I'm OK.

I do HATE to see now that the Persistence crew has apparently had a break with our Cage. I still think they might have found something.

Anyway, hang in there! 

Jen ... it would appear that Kyle did get in touch with the FBI following yours submission to the FBI in September.  However ... I do Kermit posted that the FBI attempted to contact Kyle following your submission and ... it was only then that Kyle contacted the FBI.  Do I recollect correctly.

Janet

+++++++++++

KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO KERMIT

Sunday, November 23, 2008 1:38 PM
From:"Kyle Kingman"

I have recently been in contact with the FBI (within the last two weeks). They do know what I know in full. This is in their hands and in the hands of Beth. I pulled out of SM because I don't want to cause any more problems, not because of you. I respect all that you have done thus far and don't want that to be jeopardized now. There's a lot of people who respect your opinions. Let's leave that intact.

All the best,

~K

 ::MonkeyTongue::

Tamikosmom is sooooo nice.  She is soooo compromising.  She is a real team player.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

Good to see you sb.  I've been wondering about you.  Hope you are well.

Janet,

I believe those words of Kyle's were a bit self serving, and it was the FBI who contacted Kyle 

Either that, or the birdie who was consorting with the "Caps in the know" crowd whispered a little secret into Kyle's ear that the FBI had now been contacted..............and Kyle decided to contact them in an effort to appear cooperative.  Finally.  After 11 months.  ::MonkeyNoNo::

I'm going with the bolded option, however.  ::MonkeyWink::

All is well... battling the flu right now... just MANY, MANY changes over the last few months.

Good to talk to y'all again!

 ::MonkeyShocked::

Hi sb.  Welcome back.

Janet

Good to see you sb!   ::MonkeyCool::

I'm glad you're o.k., and hope you can spend some time here with us soon!   

I believe that is Kermit's understanding too.

Nevertheless ... I do hope that Kyle Kingman confirmed all that he had posted in his own words regarding the deception encompassing the Persistence endeavor.

Thanks

Janet

SB - good to see you!

Klaas,
Please look at the Amigoe article about the tourist death and see if there's anything different in it.

I tried, but the little trick doesn't work for me; makes me have an error and closes IE down.

 ::MonkeyEek::

TIA

Life outside the cage beckons.

Keepthefaith ... the fog has lifted and it is a beautiful sunny crisp day in The Valley.

Later Monkeys.

Janet
2:25 PM PT

Go enjoy the sunshine!It is marvelous!

See ya later Janet!   ::MonkeyCool::

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/printer_51706.php

Aruba
Tourist deceased
19 Jan, 2009, 15:37 (GMT -04:00)

ORANGE CITY - The American tourist, on New Year of his hotel balcony on the first floor fell, deceased in the hospital. The 36-year-old man suspected of wrong under the influence of alcohol when he fell from the balcony. After the fall, he had yet to be trommelde officers and ambulance staff spoken. The aid workers noted that the left arm of the tourist was crushed and transported him to the hospital for treatment. The American was later included as a matter of urgency (ICU?),  however, still in the intensive care unit. On the day of his death, the patient was still on this section. The body was transferred to Curacao to be cremated.  Why not sent home before cremation?

texasmom ... are you referring to the artcle regarding the tourist who died in an Aruban hospital from a broken arm.

 ::MonkeyShocked::

Special thanks to you texasmom and all Monkeys who bring over the Aruban articles ... articles that attests to our contentions that Aruba is not a safe destination to travel as well as that corrupt Island is not worthy of our tourist dollars.

Justice for Natalee Holloway!!!

Janet

Thanks Klaas!  Interesting, the last article I found had him on the third floor.  I'm wondering why he wasn't sent home too.  I hope he had family there with him.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I'm too embarrased to say what I was doing wrong...... :oops:  ::MonkeyHaHa::

I have placed the directions on my desktop for future reference.   ::MonkeyWink::

Yes, Janet...I still have a lot of questions about that one.  So I am interested in anything I can read about that case. 

You're welcome!  I enjoy doing it, just wish I could understand the language better.

It is not a safe place...period.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

And yet when we opened the Murder and Crime thread it was in response to a group of travel agents being told there was only one murder in the last twenty years.

Then remember we were all told that the reason ALE did not follow standard procedures accepted worldwide in their investigative techniques was because crime was so low they had too little experience!

What whoppers!  Upon looking more closely, we found the highest murder rate in the Caribbean basin on the planet.  Aruba's is at least as high as it is in this country, something they still try to deny but the facts speak for themselves.

Wish we had also made a suspicious deaths and strange accidents thread as well.  Too many of those for such a small place, IMO.

By suspicious deaths, I mean suicides with left hand in pockets, bodies that just wash ashore, this last tourist's death and quick cremation with no report of autopsy, etc.

And I have to wonder how many crimes don't make the papers at all.    ::MonkeyEek::

TXMoM, I would guess quite a few because the politicians/tourististas/PTB are forever chiding the reporting
of crime or anything at all that would make for negative impression.

Yes, exactly. 

Was good to see SB posting!  I miss the old Late Nite crew!

And he didn't say one word about Gators or TEE Bow!     ::MonkeyHaHa::

That is a real class act not to do that.

So nice to see you, SB!!! I'm with you, Anna. I miss a lot of folks, and it's so nice to see the original crew!!

Don't be a stranger, SB!!    ::MonkeyWink::

There is no crime on Aruba :roll: And even if there was crime, they have no time to investigate crime or report it at all because they are too busy eating Frosted Flakes and running to all the auto accidents :roll:

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

I'm stunned by the number of traffic accidents!   ::MonkeyShocked::  ::MonkeyNoNo::

Brought over from the Beth's Book thread.  Wasn't there somebody else involved from Michigan?

Paul Brough (aka Mr. Pink) and a troll front page poster by the name of Johnm (aka Gretamal, katymal, etc) that has since been banned. 

KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO KERMIT

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 -
« Reply #540 on: December 19, 2008, 06:15:18 PM »

Kyle sent me this today

Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly.  You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.

I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.

I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.  I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".

So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 Kyle

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg592482;topicseen#msg592482


TAMIKOSMOM - RESPONSE #2

Kyle ... the Former Natalee's Freebirds' Administrator (Jen) claims that your accusation against Kermit which implies that he/she has manipulated your words to imply a story that does not reflect the truth.  I believe Jen and .... when all is said an done so many quotes of your own words can only be taken one way no matter if and where they were taken out of context.

I know the Natalee's Freebirds and ... I believe with all my heart that there is no way any Freebird would have went along with a non-disclosure agreement if for one minute it was thought that crucial information/evidence encompassing a possible John Silvetti coverup regarding Natalee Holloway's remains was to be withheld from the FBI and family while you persue self-serving interests.  Kyle ... that would be abetting an obstruction of justice against an American citizen.

Irregardless ... in the name for justice for Natalee Holloway and ... in the name closure for her family ... causes that Kermit and each of the Natalee's Freebirds have firmly stood behind for almost four years ...  Kermit took a possible legal risk.  After being afforded permission by Beth Holloway's to expose your own words which appear to reveal John Silvetti's participant in the finale' to the great Aruban coverup ... Kermit flew the Freebirds' coop and made the choice to shared on the SM site.

Kyle ... I sincerely believe if you are going to accuse Kermit of wrongdoing in regards to the manipulation of your own words ... you must morally provide backup.

In actuality ... I believe that your grievance is the exposure of your own words ... words that will muddy the waters encompassing a documentary deal with major networds by Tim T., Louis S. and yourself ... words that will exclude you from future John Silvetti endeavors ... words that Louis S. could use in a lawsuit against you.

IMO.

Sincerely, Janet

+++++++

NETWORKS AND COPYRIGHTS

Kyle:  I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal.
 
Kyle:  It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs).

Kyle:  Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money.
 
Kyle:  Right before the Dateline special aired Tim and Louis asked if I could go to ABC to try to sell the footage in an attempt to recoup some of the money invested in the search efforts. ABC was very interested, but decided to wait until the Dateline special aired. After the show they came back to me and declined to purchase it because they felt too much of the story was already told by Dateline. That ended any communication with ABC. About 6 executive producers saw the footage, but none were allowed copies or any pictures. Everything remained in my possesion.
 
Kyle:  We believe the trap footage may be the missing piece which will raise a BIG question in the minds of the public everywhere. We're in the process of figuring out how to produce and spin the story most accurately and most effectively. Also, and completely independant and unrelated, John will be in Aruba tomorrow and will report soon. This is a different issue. He knows nothing of what we're about to do with the footage.
 
Kyle:  I prefer moving forward with the evidence I have access and knowledge about and using that as a can opener. Once the can is open, the worms are revealed.
 
Kyle:  I should clarify that the footage proceeds (if sold) wouldn't even have covered the cost of the project, but it would have helped.
 
Kyle:  Louis does have legal rights to the footage regardless of Underwater Expeditions status. Louis personally signed the checks for the search.
 
Kyle:  I prefer moving forward with the evidence I have access and knowledge about and using that as a can opener. Once the can is open, the worms are revealed.

Kyle:  I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed.
 
Kyle:  She [BETH] needs to know exactly what we found in the proper timing. The way to do that would be through Tim Trahan and I. I can arrange any meeting with him. He represents the owner and the rights to the data, in this case, Louis S. I have everything but I don't want to go around him for chain of custody reasons, professional courtesy, and friendship.
 
Kyle:  On the other hand, those differences has also caused a rift between Tim Trahan/Louis and myself with John (although John and I remain close friends and colleagues). The result is Tim, Louis and I are moving forward and John is left out of the loop.

Kyle:  Schafer is sue crazy.

I wonder how different the life of Natalee Holloway would have been if JVDS had stayed home that night.  I have to wonder how different the lives of 20 others would have been if the Kalpoes had stayed home.

I wonder how different life would be for many folks if some on Aruba had focused on finding Natalee the first 48 hours after her disappearance.

Didn't anyone acknowledge the conflicing interests of LE, prosecutors office, judiciary, and the VDS family?

Anyone willing to step up to the plate those first 48 hours?

Why are some above the law?  Isn't one life worth saving on Aruba?

Kyle ... your own words reflect my position 100% in regards to faith.

Janet

++++++++ 


oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #703 12/8/2007
« Reply #166 on: December 09, 2007, 01:18:35 AM »

I say this with absolute conviction... I do not have enough faith to be an atheist in times like this.  It is examples such as these that remind humanity that people still go out of their way for others. About 2000 years ago there was the perfect example of a loving sacrifice.  So do I expect a miracle?  Perhaps a better question is... what are our expectations of that miracle?

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2432.msg315649;topicseen#msg315649

What about SandraK?

'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
April 3, 2006

COSBY … John, first of all, is there a possibility that Paulus might have been talking to Natalee the night that she disappeared?

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY: Well, if you look at the surveillance video footage, it appears that he’s the one sitting directly next to her and tries to engage her in conversation a couple of times. And it’s sort of ironic that it’s his father who brought his underage son to a casino and left him there after he left, with access to his line of credit, to put this unfortunate chain of events in process.

Good memory!

For people who are out for the good of other people, I think you should all take a look at the way you have been acting.  Not just the stuff you have been talking about me, but the whole scenario last night was very hurtful, and hateful.  To call one "crazy", in itself is degrading.  Stop bringing up things that happened in the past that degrades people.  You don't know the whole story, you were not there, so don't speak of it as being actual.  You hear it from one person and hold that to being true?  No, there are 3 sides.  Mine, yours, and the truth.  Even if I were to talk about what happened, would you believe me?  "NO".  So why even try, I know it's not worth the time.  But to state some of the other things like my website has "who evers" name in the chat box is just ludicrist.  I had not even been there for the last few weeks, so to think I put "who evers" name in there is just plain silly.  I personally am not here for any of you, I am here for Natalee, to help get to the bottom of things.  If it means going back to do things I needed to do, then so be it.  Don't make fun of it, at least I was doing something.  Yes, I am one of those people who truely do think she was in that trap.  Why are you poking at that?  I never said I didn't think it to be true.  I also believe in CAPS, even though you want to burn him at the stakes.  NO Klaas, I don't want to be the "show", nor do I want to MAKE you believe what I believe.  To be at SM used to be something to strive for to be with others in the know, and help to find Natalee.  Recently, it has become a repeatative source of info about Kyle/Silvetti/Schafer.  Kermit, if you have something to say, SAY IT.  You always have more coming, well SPIT IT OUT!  You all poke fun at that when someone else states something like that, what makes her so different?  People are clinging on to your every word, like your some kind of God, so tell them what you know.  You all (4) quit the Freebirds to come here, do something.  Speaking about the Freebirds, theres yet another time you all took for granted you knew what was going on when you saw the picture of me and Croes.  You didn't even ask of why I was there, just stuck me down from out of no-where. Threw me out!  But Thanks to that I have met one of the finest people I could ever meet, Stephanie Good.  She is still a dear friend to me today.   Dave knew why I was there, thats all that counts.  Beth knew all that happened also, after the fact, and still applauds it.  They needed new faces down there and still do.  I had been talking to some of the perps since day 3.  To get just one piece of info was of the utmost importance.  Did you all take that into consideration?  You talk about how I have the Kalpoes on my site, and how they took over my identity, yes not only did they do that on Zorpia, but one of them did it to me right here on SM one night.  Go ahead and call me "crazy" again.  But they had my name, my sign in, we were both on at the same time, however he was one step ahead of me.  Talking about Venezuela, and chasing the car.  How would I even know anything about that?  It was being talked about as it was happening.  No-one here chose to believe that, and thats fine.  I know what happened, again I don't have to explain.  Yes, at one point I too was a FreeBird, was asked to go to the meeting in Alabama.  I chose not to go.  I chose to stay with SM and do my part here.  Go to the Boycotts, and help where ever I could.  Again don't poke fun at that, I was out there doing something.  The Boston (5) didn't come from No where, and we are the ones who originated them.  No Klaas I don't want to be the first person to come up with things.  It's nice to know that I did though.  Did those week-ends help?  Yes they did.

I've now copied his posts and Red will forward to Beth. 

 ::MonkeyShocked::

JEEEEEN!!!

 ::MonkeyNoNo:: ::MonkeyNoNo::  I feel left out again.  I was never invited to Freebirds and I've never taken my photo with Steve Croes.  I'm most certainly a failure.

I'd really like to know, other than Peter de Vries and his undercover camera that at least got the case back in the news, what good has it done ANYONE to talk with or buddy up the the peripheral suspects/witnesses in this case?

Does the bolded mean that your side and our side is not the truth?  It's not in paragraph format, so I have go to line by line.  I did gather that 'you' is plural.

excuse me hotshot, it's spelled ludicrous

It is your website, you are therefore the webmaster. Even if you've been very busy chasing your "truth" you still have a responsibility for what is on your site. To even place an open chat on the frontpage of a poorly monitored site is irresponsible. That aside, you are responsible for what is on your site and I will make my request to you again- Please remove my username from your site.

KYLE KINGSMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS - REFUGEE UNLIMITED

klaasen
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #702 12/7/2007
« Reply #281 on: December 07, 2007, 04:58:53 PM »

Quote from: jenna (RU)

... I believe that you are doing geophysical surveys for a commercial purpose. Morally, you must be justifying to yourself that Dave can use this for publicity purposes because you just by some fluke may possibly find the body of Natalee. I find your deception disgusting because certain people are using this as a fundraiser ...

Quote from: oceanexploration (RU)

... This search is funded by generosity and driven only by the desire to bring closure to the family ...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2429.280

+++++++++


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS - NATALEE'S FREEBIRDS

Kyle:  I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.

Kyle:  I get done in the survey room backing up the ROV dive and head to the back deck to talk to the Polis divers and see what they sampled and see the Polis boat way in the distance heading away fast. John doesn't seem concerned at all, but I am very dissapointed, concerned, and burning inside because I have a feeling that I/we will never know what they took from the trap. That evening I talked to John asking when we plan on recovering the trap. Previously this was part of the talks and plan, but this time he doesn't seem concerned about ever looking into the trap further. After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains.

Kyle:   John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days. (05/08/08)

Kyle: He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that. (06/10/08)

My personal opinion only---I do believe it has complicated the case and probably alienated people in Aruba and has given ALE reasons to use that excuse for not solving this case.  Just my opinion. 

It's after 10pm on the east coast.  Do you know where your children are? 

Same sh*t another day.   ::MonkeyNoNo::

I find the observations that people appear to have taken sides interresting but not unusual.  What I find extremely unusual that so many people would still care about a young girl who was last seen with JK2 in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005 in Aruba.  That in itself is amazing to me. 

Justice for Natalee


(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e82/klaasend2/InHonorofNatalee.jpg)

What part of the 24 hours a day would you set aside from your position of administrator of the Scared Monkey's site to devote to Natalee causes outside the cage?  Who would you assign to flip from the Natalee Thread to the Caylee Marie thread to make sure Tamikomom is not starting a riot?  Think about Red and your mods if they did not have you to assist in  overseeing all the happenings in the Monkey cage ... especially when Tamikosmom gets in a  religious or political mood.   It would not be a pretty site to see them have a meltdown.

As far as a photo taken with Steve Croes.  EEEEEW!!

Love ya Klaas.

Janet

Well said Klaas, we have to bring the focus back on Natalee and what we (as a community of blogs) can do to help her family bring Justice for her.  She deserves it.  Her family deserves it.

Hear Hear Klaas! Justice for Natalee! 

Hotshot!

1.You believe CapsLockWizard?I've posed the question to you.Ask him when the MAJOR player will be arrested.I think that was SUPPOSED to happen about a week and a half ago.Major player hasn't been arrested YET,but you still believe CapsLockWizard.Heed your own words in regards to Kermit SPITTING it out and send CapsLockWizard an email,and or call him and tell the RIDDLER to SPIT IT OUT!

2.CapsLockWizard has done absolutely NOTHING that i can see or read!

3.In regards to Kermit.Put on your seat-belt cause there's more to come.

4.Kermit isn't a GOD.Kermit is a Muppet and a FABULOUS one at that!

KEEPTHEFAITH

 ::MonkeyHaHa::  Thanks Janet, I needed that laugh  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Four of my five grandchildren are in Orlando, Florida and ... it is almost 11:00 PM there.  Daddy (sil) just phoned ... they arrived safe and sound 3 hours ago.

I miss them already.

 ::MonkeyWaa::

Janet

I'm ready.

(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d118/Sanddrops/Seatbelt.gif)

We know that, Janet.  Too bad you made the choice not to be with them.  I am not a good flyer, but I go.  Life is too short.

The commercial came to mind after the posts that had counter responses with no answers....it just seemed as though we often have this type of thing happen at night. 

Klaas is right.  Despite all the differences, we still are here for Natalee, and you are right about her.  She's here nearly around the clock serving many missing person's families.  No one can say she has not done anything and that is one thing that gets under my skin.

 ::MonkeyLaugh:: Kermit is telling us in due time and for a good reason i'm sure!HotShot needs to tell CapsLockWizard to spit it out!

Agreed 110%.I'd be crazy by now headed to the Cuckoo's nest with Nurse Ratchet. ::MonkeyEek::

snipped from Hotshot's post tonight:


What exactly does this mean?  I really wanted an answer. 

I think I will call it a night.  Have sat at this laptop since I came home from work working on genealogy.  Have put together a book on this family and am now trying to tie up loose ends.  Proud of myself, have documented back to 1770 and the loose ends are 1650 - 1770. Once completed it's on to dear ole England for the finals. 

Justice for Natalee.

I agree, BlueMoon.  Hasn't helped at all but does give more reason not to do what is right.

Also I was minding my own business and hadn't made one post to Hotshot when she came into the cage and posted a list of lies about me.  Yes, I call that crazy behavior especially given that she wants all manner of consideration given to herself.  She certainly didn't do that to me and not one thing she posted about me had a grain of truth in it at all.

And that was an attack on the poster and not the post, BTW.

What kind of behavior is that? 

I have to wonder why certain people tend to target me so much.  I have not done anything others have not done and nothing they have said is true.  I must be doing something RIGHT considering the type of person who lies about me and attacks me.
CharlieRat, MI6, Reality and that gang in the hidey hole.

 ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa:: ::MonkeyHaHa::


At least no one has had to change their phone number to get away from me, either, lol.

 ::MonkeyTongue::

It is always better if people do not insert themselves into a situation that they can make worse instead of better. 

GoodNight Blue Moon..

Well I'm not HotShot but to me it means that HotShot is saying she is not telling the truth and neither are we.  Now it's nice of her to admit that she isn't telling the truth but I didn't give her permission to speak for me.

San always tells the truth.

Good work, Blue Moon.  G'nite.  I think I might be following right behind you.

 ::MonkeyWink::

I agree with you 100% about Klaas, Janet.  I know why she wasn't invited to be a Freebird.  She has her hands full with all of us, and all the other causes SM is here for.  There's no one else like her, she's the best!

Great accomplishment Blue Moon!   ::MonkeyDance::

Goodnight, sleep well! 

 ::MonkeyWink::        G'nite, all.

Goodnight 2NJSons.

Goodnight 2NJ!  Thanks for saying what I was thinking tonight.   ::MonkeyWink::

Good Night Blue Moon.

GOOD NIGHT MONKEYS!!  GOOD NIGHT ZOOKEEPERS!!

Janet
8:30 PM PT

Goodnight Janet.

Nite Janet and 2NJ

Goodnight Janet!  ::MonkeyCool::

I love this Klaas, thanks!

.


Do we all need to go to Aruba and hug Steve Croes before it is counted as "doing something"?  All the hours of research so many of us have done and the sacrifice Klaas has made to keep things going don't count for anything?

It's all a matter of perspective I suppose.  Personally, I would never physically insert myself into a situation without being asked explicitly to do so by the family or LE.


.

If anyone catches me anywhere near Steve Croes, I've been seriously drugged, taken from my home, and transported to a place I would never go.  I can't think of any good thing that could come from talking to him...period.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

Janet

We still have the tapes given to Greta by TJ Ward to hear from so all is not at a halt. 

I do hope we will hear something is happening soon.  We are still here but have waited so very long.

Justice for Natalee.

If people feel we have done nothing why come back to a site that has done nothing for Natalee Holloway and keep spewing their crap.

Why are some people copying posts and saving them at another site(s) when they were orginally posted at this site.  They are even afraid they will magically disappear  ::MonkeyHaHa::

Get a grip.

 ::MonkeyHaHa::

It appears that they each have shifts here at Scared Monkey's to insure that the Hidey-hole group has the information!JMOO

Wow!  Finally Aruba files a report but calls it just suspected.  Have no other tests been submitted before the woman died?  I think there should have been.

Anyway, here is the report again:


Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 22:21:26 -0500 (EST)
From: ProMED-mail <promed@promed.isid.harvard.edu>
Subject: PRO/EDR> Dengue/DHF update 2009 (03)

DENGUE/DHF UPDATE 2009 (03)
**************************
A ProMED-mail post
<http://www.promedmail.org>
ProMED-mail is a program of the
International Society for Infectious Diseases
<http://www.isid.org>

[1] Aruba, suspected
[2] Mexico (Tamaulipas), suspected
[3] Peru (Lambayeque region)
[4] Brazil (Bahia)
[5] Bolivia (tropical lowlands)
[6] Paraguay (Concepcion)
[7] Indonesia (South Sulawesi)
[8] Taiwan
[9] New Caledonia

******
[1] Aruba, suspected
Date: Wed 14 Jan 2009
Source: Amigoe.com [Dutch, machine trans., edited]
<http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_51497.php>


Department of Health has called an urgent press conference on Tuesday
[13 Jan 2009] to issue a dengue update. The department has done this
following the hundreds of calls that have come into Health, after
media reports of a 53-year-old woman who died of dengue [virus infection].

According to Trevor Gellecum, Director of Health, it is still not
clear that this woman indeed died of dengue. "First, certain tests
can be carried out, and it will be 3 weeks before the results could
be known," says Van Gellecum. "These tests should be carried out in a
laboratory abroad."

According to Wilmer Salazar, microbiologist at Health, the woman had
a fever at the weekend, but on Monday [12 Jan 2009] she felt better
and she went to work. "Later that day, she was admitted to the
hospital in shock. At night she died, "said Salazar. "Until now,
there is no confirmed diagnosis of the cause of death, but dengue is
suspected. Today [14 Jan 2009], an autopsy was performed so that the
tests to be done abroad can take place."

Maribel Tromp, manager at the department of epidemiology and research
of the Infectious Disease Service, has indicated that so far 612
suspected cases of dengue have been registered. "Of these, 218 cases
[have been] confirmed as positive by the laboratory, and 394 are
still under investigation, reports Tromp. "This does not mean that
they are negative" [The dates over which these cases occurred are not
specified. - Mod.TY].

 From the moment the news of a potentially fatal dengue victim arose
lately, Charline Koolma, director of the Yellow Fever Fight Unit
(GKMB), indicated that they have been overwhelmed with calls from
people reporting family members possibly with dengue-like symptoms or
who want information about the disease. "It is good that we now
receive phone calls, although it also had previously been possible.
These kinds of extreme cases can be avoided," according Koolman.

"From November last year [2008], the GKMB made several visits to
monitor presence of [the dengue virus vector mosquito _Aedes_]
breeding sites and adult mosquitoes. Often, the residents are not
home, and then a letter was left with an invitation to make contact
with the GKMB for the transmission of important information. But
there is never a return call until something bad happens, and then it
is often too late."

The more information and reports the GKMB gets, the better the
service and their work, said Tromp. Finally, all speakers [at the
press conference] called on the population and general practitioners
to join forces against breeding of the _Aedes_ dengue vector
mosquito. Health officials indicated that is the only way to avoid
[virus] infection and prevent dengue.

- --
Communicated by:
ProMED-mail <promed@promedmail.org>

[A map showing the location of Aruba in the Caribbean can be accessed
at <http://www.aruba-travelguide.com/map/index.html>. - Mod.TY]

translation of Amigoe article as promised, Amigoe didn't publish this article in English:


http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_51581.php

Thank you caesu!   ::MonkeyCool::

about this NLAT(-treaty.)

i think Amigoe means MLAT
http://travel.state.gov/law/info/judicial/judicial_690.html

Yes, thanks for the translation, caesu. I wish the article had been more encouraging, but you can't shoot the messenger!  ::MonkeyWink::

Hi All!

Since we are coming back around to the use of Koen's dads boat....some posts from mar 08 come to mind....


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Quote from: Bladerunner on March 06, 2008, 08:59:06 PM
The trap still intrigues me. It is possible that the one found could have been the one that was stolen, but based on what we know thus far, it likely did not contain remains related to this case. However, I think its possible it COULD have contained other items of evidence.

Then again, if that is true, one has to ask the question why go through so much trouble to dispose of clothes, shoes, etc., in such a manner.

THe bottom lines is I don't think the cage we are looking for has been found yet.

Quote from: billb on March 06, 2008, 09:23:54 PM
Bladerunner...what you say makes sense, but I can't stop thinking the knife/machete rope, etc and maybe other evidence (tennis shoe(s) any other evidence) may have been hastily disposed of in the trap and taken out that night. Natalee may have also been buried near the fish hut and later moved (landfill, water, incinerated??). I guess in this order: they buried Natalee first, then realized they needed to dispose of evidence-thats where the trap comes into play. They probably wouldn't think to take it too far out that night, thus the 90 ft depth. JMO

Quote from: Dayhiker on March 06, 2008, 09:44:07 PM
I'm liking it. But have to wonder why such a large trap for such a few items. Why not bury them, too? Just playing the devil's advocate here, Billb, anything is possible in this case.

Quote from: billb: Re: Natalee Case Discussion #740 3/5 -
« Reply #597 on: March 06, 2008, 10:20:17 PM »
Burying evidence is also plausible, but I think they were in panic mode when "something bad happened" They buried Natalee in haste, then thought of evidence. The trap was there (and a fishing boat), maybe called for help (koen, K2, SC??) to handle trap. I have heard alot about possible Koen and his boat used for disposal, and that may have been the case. But if Koen's boat was too small, they more than likely use the fishing boat moored, since it was probably better suited to handle the trap. They used the boat to move the trap, then placed it back at its mooring. The purpose of using the trap for the evidence is to distance the evidence from the body. Could have been Paulus idea to do that initially, with Paulus then planning to move her body later, with or without letting the others know of his plan.

Anna? I was able to resolve the problem we discussed. You might want to check that thread.

Sorry for the O/T.

Moving forward to what Kermit and the FBs have exposed...it is very likely that Natalee was placed in the cage from the fisherman's hut the second/third night....it would be interesting to know the cage contents wrt whether there were other items missing from the fisherman's hut in the cage. (evidence such as clothes/machette/etc could even have been placed in the cage later by a scuba diver - urine's bothe valentine was a scuba diver) .
If Koen's boat was used, or the fisherman's boat....maybe paulass atm withdrawals paid for fuel for either, and/or payoff for helpers (Geoffrey vc/Steve croes....

Back to lurking....Thanks for reading my posts.....
Goodnight CBB, texasmom, hotping, klaasend, KYcat, Anna, Lifesong and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.
billb.... ::MonkeyCool::

Night, Billb. Thank you for your posts, they are always enlightening!!!

You're Welcome Bllb!

Good Night Monkeys!


Justice for Natalee and Her Family!