Natalee Case Discussion #743 3/14 - 3/19/08

[MumInOhio]

I have to leave for work.  This is a current as I could get the genealogy tree, so far.  I'll do some more searching this evening.  Have a good day everyone.

SS...Thanks for your work on this...

...http://www.hollowaycase.com/archive/civil_court_docs/arubancounselfile.htm


I tried to tie Rafael to Rufo, Steve’s uncle, without any luck a while back. I am not sure if the Socorro is a spelling error not.


Name: Rafael Solognier
Date: 30 June 2005 / 16:45
Pages: 1
Writer/Initiator: Omar Kelly
Description: Car search

Name: Socorro Bermudez Solagnier
Date: 9 July 2005
Pages: 5
WriteriInitiator: Johny Erasmus, Zoraida De Cuba
Description: witness statement

[Tater]

I have to leave for work.  This is a current as I could get the genealogy tree, so far.  I'll do some more searching this evening.  Have a good day everyone.

I hope you have a super good day SS...Looking forward to your return...

[Nut44x4]

What day was Paulus and Anita observed on the beach watching the Persistence?  Was that the same day the big Dutch ship was in port?  Makes you wonder who alerted them that they felt they needed to do their own observation at the beach.

That was the first question that popped into my head, as well.

2ndly...anything turned over to the Aruban authorities labled as potential evidence is long gone now. It probably took them a while to substitute the evidence given to them w/ bogus evidence to send to the FBI. I can't believe after all this time that anything so valuable would be put into the hands of the Arubans.  I am going to take some time today and re-read Kyle's posts from yesterday to see if I have this right.

[GBMW]

Just saw this post at RU:

Quote:
Obscuregawdess wrote:

FWIW. Joran is not in Holland or Aruba. 


And we all know Obscuregawdess is an online friend of Joran that has been in contact with him a lot recently through Myspace.....

So my guess: he is in Germany...

[Blonde]

From oceanexploraton:

As of the 2nd week of Feb, this is what I had learned from the FBI:

The contents of the trap were being actively investigated.  The forensic results of a fabric sample showed the fabric sample was not a match to Natalee's blouse and that no DNA match to Natalee was found within that fabric sample.  Human remains were found, but the FBI was not and would not comment on the case.  The FBI did not comment on the remains, but rather the fabric sample.

Kyle also mentions a Dutch "recovery" boat in the area of the trap site.

Human remains were found, but a thumbs down sign was given by the divers.

OK ,"Natalee's blouse and that no DNA match to Natalee was found within that fabric sample " why would it they said it wasn't the origianl shirt that Natalee had on. It was a copy of that shirt. Human remains were found I'm not getting this.[/b]

[vms]

Solagnier + genaruba

108.   Nicolaas Croes, born 1732 in Curaçao103.  He was the son of 216. Lourens Croes and 217. Susanna van der Westen.  He married 109. Maria Elizabeth van der Biest 01 november 1770103.
109.  Maria Elizabeth van der Biest  She was the daughter of 218. Harmen van der Biest and 219. Suzanna van der Woestijne.

Children of Nicolaas Croes and Maria Biest are:
  i. Hendrik Croes, born 15 oktober 1769104; died 09 oktober 1854 in Aruba104; married Anna Clara Poppe 16 augustus 1826 in Aruba105; born 25 februari 1773106; died 26 september 1841 in Aruba106.
  ii. Lourens Croes, born 08 januari 1777107; died 12 augustus 1850 in Aruba108; married Magdalena Specht 1801109; died Bef. 1850110.
  iii. Regina Jacomina Croes, born 14 oktober 1781111; died Bef. 1831111; married Michel Benoit Solagnier; born 09 juni 1754 in Marseille, France112; died 28 april 1831 in Aruba112.
54 iv. Jan van der Biest Croes, born 12 november 1783; died 20 juni 1859 in Aruba; married Maria Elizabeth Specht 27 augustus 1834 in Aruba.

27 in Aruba80; born 10 september 1798 in Aruba81; died 08 november 1881 in Aruba81.
  ii. Jan Pieter Croes, born 15 februari 1812 in Aruba82; died 28 december 1904 in Aruba82; married Sarah Zagaria Castro 11 november 1857 in Aruba83; born Abt. 1823 in Aruba84; died 01 november 1908 in Aruba84.
28 iii. Casper Theodorus Croes, born 17 mei 1825 in Aruba; died 13 juli 1889 in Aruba; married Regina Jacomina Ravine 11 augustus 1847 in Aruba.


58.  Paulus Ravine, born 06 april 1794 in Aruba85; died 13 juli 1841 in Aruba85.  He married 59. Maria Margaretha Solagnier 16 augustus 1826 in Aruba86.
59.  Maria Margaretha Solagnier, born 25 mei 180487; died 29 oktober 1861 in Aruba87.  She was the daughter of 118. Michel Benoit Solagnier and 119. Regina Jacomina Croes.

Child of Paulus Ravine and Maria Solagnier is:
29 i. Regina Jacomina Ravine, born Abt. 1824 in Aruba; died 18 oktober 1897 in Aruba; married Casper Theodorus Croes 11 augustus 1847 in Aruba.

SS...Thank You...I am not very good at this ancestry thing so are Rufo Solognier, Steve Croes and THE Croes (Betico, Hendrick and Rudy) related or can't we tell.

Sorry, it's all a list of names to me...

LOL at Tib...I needed to lighten up!

Good Morning all!

arubagirl. Remember Fin thinks she is/was Simian.

[Buckeye]

I am totally trying to read between the lines on this...

Is the Aruban Coast Guard part of ALE? 

Who is the commanding officer over the Coast Guard?

Is that an elected Official?

Antilles and Aruban Coast Guard is part of Royal Netherlands Navy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Netherlands_Navy

commanding officer (CZMCARIB) is P. W. Lenselink, a Dutchie.
http://www.marine.nl/overdemarine/admiraliteitsraad/c-carib/

he is commander of the Navy in the Caribbean area and also director of the Coast Guard of the Dutch Antilles and Aruba.

in june 2007 he took over from F. Sijtsma.
http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/antillen/car20070629_afscheid_CZM
http://www.marine.nl/overdemarine/admiraliteitsraad/czmcarib/index.html
[/quote]


Is Peter de Witte still involved with the Aruban Coastguard??  OE said he saw the Dutch ship, so if there was further recovery, it was probably by the Dutch ship (Panter)? But I'm still curious if the Aruban Coastguard has the same lead as the KPA (aruban police).

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/08/18/peter-de-witte-acting-director-of-aruban-na-coast-guard-named-new-chief-of-police-aruba/

Peter de Witte, acting Director of Aruban & NA Coast Guard named new chief of police of Aruba
 
Peter de Witte has been named the new Police Chief of Aruba following the departure of Ronny Bernadina. Peter de Witte is the acting Director of the Coast Guard for the Netherland Antilles and Aruba. Wonder if Peter de Witte will do anything that differs in the investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway or will it be different chief, same old story?
 
(Amigoe: Aug 18, 2006) Peter de Witte new chief of police Aruba

[Blonde]

Rufo Solagnier - Retired Police Chief/Uncle to Steve Croes/Lives Next Door to Steve Croes who lives with his grandparents or did as of his arrest in 2005

Is Steve Croes the one we needed to shake from the tree? 
I vote yes

Is Steve Croes the ex/monkey?
guessing: no

Or is Rufo the one we needed to shake from the tree?
fin ... where'd ya go?

Is Rufo the ex/monkey?
guessing: no

these ring some bells:

"...Frenchman...."
"Blue blood...."
"Insurance"
"ALE"
"Ex-monkey"

... simian?

fiiiiiiiinbar, where are you?

"Insurance"
"ALE"
"Ex-monkey"

... simian?
Ding Ding Ding I get it AG

[Rob]

Peter DeWitte on Coast Guard cutter

[Tamikosmom]

I am totally trying to read between the lines on this...

Is the Aruban Coast Guard part of ALE? 

Who is the commanding officer over the Coast Guard?

Is that an elected Official?

Antilles and Aruban Coast Guard is part of Royal Netherlands Navy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Netherlands_Navy

commanding officer (CZMCARIB) is P. W. Lenselink, a Dutchie.
http://www.marine.nl/overdemarine/admiraliteitsraad/c-carib/

he is commander of the Navy in the Caribbean area and also director of the Coast Guard of the Dutch Antilles and Aruba.

in june 2007 he took over from F. Sijtsma.
http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/antillen/car20070629_afscheid_CZM
http://www.marine.nl/overdemarine/admiraliteitsraad/czmcarib/index.html

Is Peter de Witte still involved with the Aruban Coastguard??  OE said he saw the Dutch ship, so if there was further recovery, it was probably by the Dutch ship (Panter)? But I'm still curious if the Aruban Coastguard has the same lead as the KPA (aruban police).

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/08/18/peter-de-witte-acting-director-of-aruban-na-coast-guard-named-new-chief-of-police-aruba/

Peter de Witte, acting Director of Aruban & NA Coast Guard named new chief of police of Aruba
 
Peter de Witte has been named the new Police Chief of Aruba following the departure of Ronny Bernadina. Peter de Witte is the acting Director of the Coast Guard for the Netherland Antilles and Aruba. Wonder if Peter de Witte will do anything that differs in the investigation into the disappearance of Natalee Holloway or will it be different chief, same old story?
 
(Amigoe: Aug 18, 2006) Peter de Witte new chief of police Aruba

[/quote]

Thank you Buckeye.

This is very interesting.

Janet

[Rob]

on left - Rudy Croes - center Peter De Witte - on right Ronnie Bernadina.

Sorry this photo is so small. I tried to enlarge it and it just comes out blurry. This image is from when de Witte became polis chief.

[Starr]

Goodnight everyone.  I am wiped out after Kyle's information about the cage and Fin's cryptic messages.

It's wiping me out as well  So many possibilities but so little information I can't help but think of Buddy Larson,Max De Vries and Gary Makings and wonder where they vainshed to also?

Theres a post on January 2nd at BFN from someone who was in Aruba and said PVDS and AVDS were walking the beach that week. I wonder if they were scoping out the persistence then also? I think it was visible from shore much of that week.

*******
that may have been me posting that I saw Anita and Paul on the beach.
I have seen them many times walking on the beach on Sat mornings.
The persistence was not visible from shore without binoculars  most of the time

[Rob]

question - how does someone in the coast guard become polis chief?

I would think that job would go to someone ranked as deputy - like Dompig, or a First Class Lieutenant, or commissioner.

The coast guard has nothing to do with the polis corps - in my opinion. So why did that happen? and has it happened before?

If you look at the photo I posted above, de Witte is sandwiched between the two people most likely denying Natalee her Justice.

as they say -  a picture is worth a thousand words.

[Observer]

Please move to NCD# 744 You caring,loving dedicated Monkeys! 

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.0