Caylee Marie Anthony-MURDER TRIAL-DAY 4 - 5/27/2011

[KCJackie]

Won't KC have to take the stand at some point to explain the allegations against George and Lee?   

I would love to see Linda cross examine her!!

[KittyMom]

I believe that one of the reasons that Dr. G can't say for certain how Caylee died is because she didn't have any tissues left to run tox tests on.  It may very well be that the duct tape killed Caylee, but it is also possible that KC was drugging her and that is what really killed her.  Personally, I hope she did die from drugs first and never saw her mommy killing her with the duct tape. 

[loca]

http://www.wftv.com/video/28053386/index.html
bill shaeffer on todays trial

[wreck]

Won't KC have to take the stand at some point to explain the allegations against George and Lee?   

I would love to see Linda cross examine her!!

Gosh, I can't see Casey taking the stand at al,l UNLESS at the very end of the trial she HAS to make a "mea culpa" to try to avoid the death penalty.

[loca]

I wanted to believe that George had manned up.  Now, I cannot shake the niggling feeling that this may have been in the works and it was known.  With the way they have been acting and thinking this whole time, George may very well have decided to fall on the sword to save Casey's life.  I remember at some point one of the Anthony's  said that they had lost their grand daughter and could not lose their daughter too.  Remember that George was asked by Baez(wasn't it just within the last couple of weeks?), would he do ANYTHING for his daughter????  Was that a sign from Baez that this was a go, and the plan was in place? 

I wish I wasn't thinking this.....

You're not alone with these suspicions. I can't just throw away years of suspicion of George and his antics and covering up. This may be about creating reasonable doubt in the eyes of the jury. JB will agree to come on like the bad guy thus creating sympathy for George in the public eye (not the jury's which supposedly doesn't know much about the case), actually rehabilitating him as a sympathetic character which might help his future career as a missing children's advocate. Instead of being considered a child molester, he'll be the victimized father. I don't know that I completely buy the George/Jose antagonist act. This might be just that--an act.Remember how we felt when listening to him take on Morgan? The jurors might be getting the same impression right now. Remember also the visit that Lippman said the As recently had with Baez? It had to have been discussed. I'm also a little leary of Lippmans threats on the A's behalf of going after Baez. It just doesn't ring true. He ought to know that Baez can pretty much do what he pleases with an opening statement.

Something's not right with this whole scenario.

scatty
I am suspicious of this too its plausable.. they worked together.. good catch on the visit with baez.

[KittyMom]

I'm certainly poking where I don't have any knowledge -- but, it seems the mouth is not the only orifice you would have to tape. I would guess that the duct tape is either the "murder weapon" or an attempt to make it look like a kidnapping.

Could it be that two days following the death of Caylee ... the mouth was the only opening that was obviously excreting body fluids?

Janet

Not probable. If Caylee was in a postion that allowed the fluids to escape through the mouth easier than any other place, they would also have been leaking from her nose and ears. (sorry for the graphic)

The body expels wastes and her pull-up would've absorbed some of that but not all.  I just don't think the duct tape had anything to do with fluids and much to do with the evilness of KC.  That heart sticker is the worst.

On another topic, is it permissible to send a prisoner stickers?  I just might have to purchase some to send to KC on the anniversary of Caylee's death for the rest of her miserable life.  She could plaster her cell with them and remember what a hateful person she is.

[loca]

::snipping2::

I don't trust him either - he had a meeting with Mason and bozo not too long before this trial as NG posted a letter talking about it. He made the remark about them asking him some questions.

I am sorry, but I put NOTHING past anyone in this family and as for his appearing sincere, he did way back when he was claiming to be searching for Caylee and he was at his girlfriend's house ripping her off for money.

KC does have all the symptoms of someone abused, but a sociopath will manipulate people to make it appear as if she has them. I have very mixed emotions about the sexual abuse allegation. He is a classic sociopath as is KC. I don't believe that would be why she had no emotions over Caylee. That is a hell of a leap to get from sexual abuse to killing your baby and exhibiting no emotions. Even an accidental death would provoke emotions, not gang banging guys. She did not think they would ever find Caylee & if the truth is known she put that log you see so often in pictures over her to keep her from being seen. The deep water most likely dislodged the bags with the body when it rose so rapidly in the hurricane.

I have never thought she "accidentally" killed her with chloroform. I have always felt like she killed her in a fit of rage. She may have been trying to use the chloroform and Caylee fought her which provoked her into that same type of rage, or little Caylee may have been crying for her grandmother and the hate for Cindy and the baby crying for her kicked her off. I also think she was into meth. When she first went to jail she slept for 3 days solid they said. That is usually a good indicator of coming off some type of speed.

If you look at that jail tape where she would drawing up her fists and screaming at her parents it would be easy to imagine her doing that to little Caylee and slamming her down or hitting her. I think LE thought that too because they took sheet rock out of that house. I think they were looking for blood on it.

I've thought the same.   

Thoughts of little Caylee crying for Cindy being related to the duct tape cross my mind a lot.   

yes that has crossed my mind too.. so many different scenarios... but this one realy has bothered me... she hated cindy... maybe cindy threatened that night to take caylee away from her and casey lost it.. and killed caylee.

[Puzzler]

All those videos that were played today, they were videos that were stipulated to by both the defense and the prosecution.  Those videos were just put into evidence today.  They weren't "attached" to any testimony, etc. today.

That will come out later, when certain folks are testifying and then a video that is already in evidence can be played.

[KittyMom]

I don't get Mallory's testimony today.  I wish the pros had asked her to give examples of how 'amazing' the relationship between KC and Caylee was.  She did nothing for the state and seemed supportive of KC, imo.

[Gypsy DD]

It "appears" that Blowhole "believes" there were several notices left by the postal service, (certified letter from Johnson's Towing) but George & Cindy admit to only one.

It makes me wonder........did KC destroy the 1st, 2nd, & 3rd notices????
We know she was going in & out of her house repeatedly when C & G weren't home.
We know from Cindy's deposition KC was intercepting the mail to keep Cindy from getting her statements for her Visa Card. Cindy had paid the balance & thought she closed the account. KC in turn charged roughly $4000.00 before she got a call from the bank. She knew KC was intercepting the mail because the bank must have informed her statements were being mailed to her every month.

KC did not want them to know her car was towed....no way, no how.
She was on a mission to avoid her parents for as long as possible. She knew the longer Cindy didn't find her, the less evidence would be found of Caylee, with Caylee & in her car. She knew d@mn well it would be towed. There were posted signs in the amscot parking lot.

I've just about convinced myself of this theory.....Blowhole was so sure of himself in court today regarding the  "several" notices being left by the USPS for the certified letter from Johnson's. Wayyyyy tooooo sure, IMO!

  Great post Seemeatthebeach!!

ITA Seeme.

I beleive she was getting ready to skip the State entirely.. She really wanted to get to Cali to see Mark Hawkins..and he was a friend who happened to live the furthest away from home.  I think had she stayed at Tony's anylonger she would have stolen money from the guys living there and made her secape..

She used everyone..and that is why she is so pizzed at these hearings..she can not understand how they feel now, nor why they will not let her and her attorney manipulate them into agreeing with her lies.  She and her attorney are using gaslighting on them all right in court..Helter Skelter at it's finest.  Only this time no one is confused and she looks like the lying manipulator is has always been.  It's all out in the open now..and it ain't pretty.

Of course she stole those notices from the towing company before anyone else got to them. 

[TURBOTHINK]

I'm certainly poking where I don't have any knowledge -- but, it seems the mouth is not the only orifice you would have to tape. I would guess that the duct tape is either the "murder weapon" or an attempt to make it look like a kidnapping.

I wonder if she broke her neck and then because in baby like that there would be no muscle tissue to support the head, that her head kept flopping over she put duct tape on it because she was afraid her head was going to fall off.

[Puzzler]

I don't get Mallory's testimony today.  I wish the pros had asked her to give examples of how 'amazing' the relationship between KC and Caylee was.  She did nothing for the state and seemed supportive of KC, imo.

I don't get her testimony either.  She was a prosecution witness.  "What" did she do for the prosecution; "why" did they call her?

[Gypsy DD]

I don't get Mallory's testimony today.  I wish the pros had asked her to give examples of how 'amazing' the relationship between KC and Caylee was.  She did nothing for the state and seemed supportive of KC, imo.

I really didn't understand the purpose of Mallory's testimony today either..other then to introduce her into the court.

I think Mallory is a very nice girl, who loves Lee, bearly knew Casey, played with Caylee when she saw her at Cindy's and who does not want to be mixed up in this mess..and truly knows very little.

I think her best testimony will come  in  about when she was at the house the night Casey was bailed out.  She will be able to testify that Casey did not speak about Caylee and was in a jovial glad to be home mood.

Goodnight Monkeys..past Midnight here on the East Coast..see everyone tomorrow.

[KittyMom]

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2011/05/casey-anthony-did-george-anthony-help-or-hurt-defense.html/comment-page-2

Casey Anthony: Did George Anthony help or hurt defense? 

WOFL-Channel 35 reporter Holly Bristow said the exchanges between Baez and George Anthony were closely studied by jurors. “I did notice that one juror was at the edge of his seat, kind of looking back and forth almost like he was watching a ping-pong game,” she said. She noticed that three other jurors were intent on taking good notes.

WKMG’s Tony Pipitone contrasted several contradictions in the testimony between Birch and George Anthony. Birch said George talked of Caylee being missing; George denied that. Birch said George mentioned that Casey’s car had been at Amscot for three days before it was towed; George denied that.  But Pipitone ended his segment with prosecutor Ashton’s withering question to George about dumping Caylee’s body.

[Tamikosmom]

I do not trust George Anthony.  His revealed character is not above reproach.

Could there have been a defence strategy ... a defence strategy that implied that George was a willing participant in a desperate effort to save Casey?  Could the allegations of George's participation in a coverup in his granddaughter's death as well as the sexual abuse of Casey be all about planting a seed of doubt/confusion in the minds of jury members?  It only takes one holdout in deliberations and ... justice for Caylee would not prevail.

George is not on trial.  It was a given that he would deny Baez's allegations when questioned as a witness in the trial but ... those allegation could be considered the foundation for "reasonable doubt" by some jurors.

IMO

Janet

I don't trust him either - he had a meeting with Mason and bozo not too long before this trial as NG posted a letter talking about it. He made the remark about them asking him some questions.

I am sorry, but I put NOTHING past anyone in this family and as for his appearing sincere, he did way back when he was claiming to be searching for Caylee and he was at his girlfriend's house ripping her off for money.

KC does have all the symptoms of someone abused, but a sociopath will manipulate people to make it appear as if she has them. I have very mixed emotions about the sexual abuse allegation. He is a classic sociopath as is KC. I don't believe that would be why she had no emotions over Caylee. That is a hell of a leap to get from sexual abuse to killing your baby and exhibiting no emotions. Even an accidental death would provoke emotions, not gang banging guys. She did not think they would ever find Caylee & if the truth is known she put that log you see so often in pictures over her to keep her from being seen. The deep water most likely dislodged the bags with the body when it rose so rapidly in the hurricane.

I have never thought she "accidentally" killed her with chloroform. I have always felt like she killed her in a fit of rage. She may have been trying to use the chloroform and Caylee fought her which provoked her into that same type of rage, or little Caylee may have been crying for her grandmother and the hate for Cindy and the baby crying for her kicked her off. I also think she was into meth. When she first went to jail she slept for 3 days solid they said. That is usually a good indicator of coming off some type of speed.

If you look at that jail tape where she would drawing up her fists and screaming at her parents it would be easy to imagine her doing that to little Caylee and slamming her down or hitting her. I think LE thought that too because they took sheet rock out of that house. I think they were looking for blood on it.

Thanks TURBOTHINK

I'm thinking.  An unintended death as a result of overdosing on chloroforum I can grasp ... not justisfy.  However ... the suffocation of a child using duct tape is so difficult to comprehend.

Why was there such a high level of chloroforum detected in the trunk of Casey's vehicle?

Janet

[Puzzler]

I'm certainly poking where I don't have any knowledge -- but, it seems the mouth is not the only orifice you would have to tape. I would guess that the duct tape is either the "murder weapon" or an attempt to make it look like a kidnapping.

Could it be that two days following the death of Caylee ... the mouth was the only opening that was obviously excreting body fluids?

Janet

Not probable. If Caylee was in a postion that allowed the fluids to escape through the mouth easier than any other place, they would also have been leaking from her nose and ears. (sorry for the graphic)

The body expels wastes and her pull-up would've absorbed some of that but not all.  I just don't think the duct tape had anything to do with fluids and much to do with the evilness of KC.  That heart sticker is the worst.

On another topic, is it permissible to send a prisoner stickers?  I just might have to purchase some to send to KC on the anniversary of Caylee's death for the rest of her miserable life.  She could plaster her cell with them and remember what a hateful person she is.

Nose, ears, eyes, mouth - just on the head alone.

[KittyMom]

http://www.cityjournalistdirectory.com/event/is_george_anthony_telling_the_truth_or_lying_14303/

Is George Anthony telling the Truth or Lying

Back to Jose Baez he has shown the ability of a trapeze artist but as all the millions who are watching know one slip and you fall off on any ’high wire act’!

The Quote of the Week
“The court of public opinion is the most uneducated court in the whole country,” said lead defense attorney Jose Baez.

[Cappuccino]

Won't KC have to take the stand at some point to explain the allegations against George and Lee?   

I would love to see Linda cross examine her!!

Gosh, I can't see Casey taking the stand at al,l UNLESS at the very end of the trial she HAS to make a "mea culpa" to try to avoid the death penalty.

IMO, the defense better get real & realize that all this will amount to is a huge smoke screen.  Tony L said nothing about sexual abuse was told to him by Casey regarding her father.  What Casey told Tony L about Lee was minimal at best, well compared to what it could have been not how I personally gauge it.  Casey made an accusation against Lee to Jesse but her anger or resentment was never toward Lee...not in anything that we have witnessed or read in discovery, quite the opposite.  Even if Lee did touch her inappropriately (not excusing it), its no excuse for her behavior nor rises to the level of explanation why she murdered Caylee. 

I fully anticipate that Bozo will attempt to "go there" when Jesse takes the stand as well but the same thing will happen, he will be stopped & a proffer will be made outside the presence of the jury.  When Lee takes the stand he will be asked by the State & he will put on the record that he did or did not sexually abuse his sister, despite whether he supports her on everything else or not.  The defense will badger him but will have no way to corroborate any of it, much like George.  Bottom line, pretty much the only way any of Tony L or Jesse's testimony on this trial within a trial allegation is coming in is if Casey takes the stand & she will not be believed no matter how hysterical she gets.   She will get crucified on cross & she'll be putting the needle in her own arm.

[Cappuccino]

Won't KC have to take the stand at some point to explain the allegations against George and Lee?   

I would love to see Linda cross examine her!!

Gosh, I can't see Casey taking the stand at al,l UNLESS at the very end of the trial she HAS to make a "mea culpa" to try to avoid the death penalty.

IMO, the defense better get real & realize that all this will amount to is a huge smoke screen, not reasonable doubt.  Tony L said nothing about sexual abuse was told to him by Casey regarding her father.  What Casey told Tony L about Lee was minimal at best, well compared to what it could have been not how I personally gauge it.  Casey made an accusation against Lee to Jesse but her anger or resentment was never toward Lee...not in anything that we have witnessed or read in discovery, quite the opposite.  Even if Lee did touch her inappropriately (not excusing it by any means), its no excuse for her behavior nor rises to the level of explanation why she murdered Caylee. 

I fully anticipate that Bozo will attempt to "go there" when Jesse takes the stand as well but the same thing will happen, he will be stopped & a proffer will be made outside the presence of the jury.  When Lee takes the stand he will be asked by the State & he will put on the record that he did or did not sexually abuse his sister, despite whether he supports her on everything else or not.  The defense will badger him but will have no way to corroborate any of it, much like George.  Bottom line, pretty much the only way any of Tony L or Jesse's testimony on this trial within a trial allegation is coming in is if Casey takes the stand & she will not be believed no matter how hysterical she gets.   She will get crucified on cross & she'll be putting the needle in her own arm.

[islandmonkey]

I'm certainly poking where I don't have any knowledge -- but, it seems the mouth is not the only orifice you would have to tape. I would guess that the duct tape is either the "murder weapon" or an attempt to make it look like a kidnapping.

Could it be that two days following the death of Caylee ... the mouth was the only opening that was obviously excreting body fluids?

Janet

Not probable. If Caylee was in a postion that allowed the fluids to escape through the mouth easier than any other place, they would also have been leaking from her nose and ears. (sorry for the graphic)

The body expels wastes and her pull-up would've absorbed some of that but not all.  I just don't think the duct tape had anything to do with fluids and much to do with the evilness of KC.  That heart sticker is the worst.

On another topic, is it permissible to send a prisoner stickers?  I just might have to purchase some to send to KC on the anniversary of Caylee's death for the rest of her miserable life.  She could plaster her cell with them and remember what a hateful person she is.

Nose, ears, eyes, mouth - just on the head alone.

Ok, I have so not wanted to go here but I will just to clarify....I know from personal experience that there is no fluid leakage immediately unless it's a release from the bladder or rectum (a diaper would contain it I believe), I held my GS for hours afterhe passed and this is norm in NICU, families are allowed to go in a special room that is very soothing with a rocking chair and a day bed and other chairs and they allow you to stay quite a long time as many other members who weren't present at the time of death are still on their way to the hospital, no leaking from nose, eyes, ears or mouth period.....possibly in the diaper (I didn't look) but nothing leaked from the diaper. Granted a baby might be different from a toddler, also no rigor in those hours either nor lividity.