Caylee Marie Anthony-MURDER TRIAL - DAY 10 - 6/4/11

[flamom]

YAY Blonde.. Thats the picture..btw. I see you all the time too 

[ISpy]

Akmom and Zoomomology and anybody else who wonders if you're invisible: Just so you know, I pretty much read every post- unless it's has a lot of   ***@***@@ words.   LOL! Probably like most posters, I'm reading between other necessities of life or catching up before bed. By the time I usually get here, I'm either silently agreeing, don't have enough facts to comment, or it's already been established one way or the other.   If I don't know about something, I'm either researching it or I don't comment.  No need to muddy the waters further, IMO.  Sometimes my posts go undiscussed too.  There's just so much to wade through, so many lies, so many depos, so many players to keep track of (many imaginary), so many court hours (and side bars and recesses ), so much commentary (Bill Schaeffer, Dr. Lillian Glass, Peter Hyatt, Blink on Clime, etc.), tons of video/pics, and literally, thousands of posts each day. Believe me, you're not invisible by any means. 

[Gypsy DD]

Didn't they find the remnants of the sticker near Caylee's remains?
It has been so long now....................

No, 2 different stickers.  All that was on that piece of duct tape was RESIDUE.  If I had time I would go looking for it, but I have to weed the garden and shear sheep, unless I want to miss the trial this next week......

Sheer sheep ? I just have a ton of laundry to do.
..
I will also take whatever Dr. G says as the gospel. There are some things she can't state to for certainty as to COD, but the manner was homicide, not George found the baby drowned and Cindy helped and George tried to pin it on Casey and Kronk stole the body and hid it and retrieved it when he did because he needed to pay a car repair bill.

ITA

Can't wait to see and hear Dr G on the stand.

I loved it in her depo when Morgan asked her: and how did the mandible get there on that position?

Dr G: God put it there. 

That shut the old fool up.

[flamom]

Well said ISpy
Fox has a replay of Judge Pirro's show from last night on right now

[flamom]

Dr Baden should hang it up..ditto for Dr Spitz

[Blonde]

I don't know, but according to the below, there was no chloroform found in the hair or bones, or any other drug.

http://www.wesh.com/download/2009/0619/19802034.pdf

Page 36.

Thanks Zoo Monkey

Something is hinky.

Janet

+++++

Jurors may hear chloroform evidence
6:26 p.m. EDT, April 27, 2011

In another setback to Casey Anthony's defense team, a judge ruled Wednesday that evidence about elevated chloroform levels detected in her car may be admissible at her trial.

Orange-Osceola Chief Judge Belvin Perry denied a defense team's request to block evidence about chloroform, which is a potentially deadly chemical that can be used to render a person unconscious.

<snipped>

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/caylee-anthony/os-casey-anthony-trial-chloroform-rul20110427,0,7305325.story

Is chloroform an agent used in cleaning products?  Could it be that the "elevated levels" of chloroform detected in the trunk be a result of Cindy's cleaning spree prior to LE seizing Casey's vehicle?

Janet

NO
Janet
Casey looked up how to make chloroform on her computer i had all of this saved

Along with instructions on how to make chloroform at home, also listed are some important considerations to bear in mind while handling this compound and laboratory chemicals. Here's how to make chloroform at
home.

((edit to remove recipe for making it - I'd hate to think someone wanting to kill someone googled and found it at SM))

SEE BBM....hmmmm  You can get pure acetone nail polish remover

Pure Acetone Polish Remover, 16 Oz
http://www.massagewarehouse.com/products/pure-acetone-polish-remover/283-0626-08/?sourcecode=MWNEXTAG

I'm a licensed hairdresser you can also buy pure acetone at walmart way cheaper then our beauty supply house I do it all of the time.

[Blonde]

Thanks Blonde.

The sticker in the pic is from parts of a photo mat found at the recovery site of Caylee's little body.

I know earlier you posted stickers they found from the home that are heart shaped..just not exactly like these..but goes to show she went through a phase of using all sorts of heart shaped stickers.

Somewhere in the past I have seen another photo of evidence gathered at the house and it included a sheet of the exact same heart shaped stickers...with several missing from the sheet.

Does anyone have that phot of those stickers?

Just these found at the Anthony home

[klaasend]

I buy acetone at the grocery store in the nail polish remover section.

I have no doubt Casey made her own chloroform , or at least tried.

[ISpy]

One last post and I'm outta here for the day. Several pages back a kind monkey posted Dr. G's summary report.  She stated tape affixed to the maxible (the upper bone of the jaw set, running from ear to ear, holds the top set of teeth).  On this adult, that definitely covers the nose.  We've already established from the stages of decomp that the skin tightens, bloats, and then breaks down...yet the duct tape remained wound tightly enough to essentially cement the mandible in place, as well as capture the hair mass throughout insect and animal activity, bone dispersal, and flooding.  Cause of death?  Not a problem. BBL

[Blonde]

One last post and I'm outta here for the day. Several pages back a kind monkey posted Dr. G's summary report.  She stated tape affixed to the maxible (the upper bone of the jaw set, running from ear to ear, holds the top set of teeth).  On this adult, that definitely covers the nose.  We've already established from the stages of decomp that the skin tightens, bloats, and then breaks down...yet the duct tape remained wound tightly enough to essentially cement the mandible in place, as well as capture the hair mass throughout insect and animal activity, bone dispersal, and flooding.  Cause of death?  Not a problem. BBL

This?
Page 1 of the autopsy report



Page 2 of the autopsy report

[darla]

Good Afternoon Monkeys and Guests.

I am way back on page 51 but am going to jump ahead. I can explain a little about the death band on the hair. The death band is mostly formed of the outerlayer of skin on the scalp. As that tissue starts to decompose and a hair is either pulled out or falls out that little bit of skin is left around the hair. From what I understand that is what disentigrates to form the death band. The hair mat that was attached to the duct tape had been out in the elements for almost 6 months. From Dr. G's autopsy report there was absolutely no soft tissue left left anywhere on the remains. The tissue around the hair roots would have been completely eaten away or disentigrated by the time the remains were found. My understanding is the band would be gone in that amount of time. If I am wrong please correct me. Also the autopsy report states that the tape was applied before Decomp started, nothing about it being placed before death, just before decomp.

[flamom]

Dr G writes the duct tape was applied prior to decompostion.. not prior to death. Anything written about the duct tape applied antemortem? Even though I believe she may have suffocated her with the duct tape, it will be hard to prove.

[flamom]

Thank you Darla!

[Mom of Five]

It will be interesting to see if Casey Anthony's conference room interrogation at Universal will be discussed on HLN and elsewhere on Monday.

As most of you know the door was unlocked during the intense interrogation. So in some ways her freedom of movement was not as limited as it would have been in a locked police car.

Should she have been Mirandized? This issue is beginning to gain a little traction as a possible appellate issue.

In other words could a case be made on appeal that this met the standard of custodial interrogation and Casey should have been Mirandized. In United States criminal law, a custodial interrogation (or, generally, custodial situation) is a situation in which the suspect's freedom of movement is restrained, even if she is not under arrest.

It could be argued that the ultimate inquiry is whether a normal, reasonable person (not just Casey) would feel free to end the encounter with law enforcement and leave the scene.

IMO it seems like a close call and that is why I would like to hear some attorneys weigh in. One very successful appellate attorney already has. Alan Dershowitz was on Fox News on Saturday stating that the chances for a successful appeal appear to be very good. Hmmm.

More on custodial interrogation at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Custodial_interrogation

And, IMO, appelate lawyers are just like ambulance chasers. 
[/quote

When law enforcement was questioning Casey at Universal it was regarding her missing child. She was not at the time under suspicion of a crime, technically. She should have been helping to locate her child and she kept telling LE that was what she was doing. They also continually asked her if she was there helping because she wanted to be and she said that she was. At no time did she say that she no longer wanted to speak to them or help them anymore. I don't think there is any way an appeals lawyer will be able to prove that she should have been mirandized sooner. They would have to prove that she was under suspicion of a crime and being questioned against her will as well as not feeling free to leave the scene.

[TURBOTHINK]

When this first started, I wondered if Caylee could have drowned & Casey acted the way she did due to post trauma. Then I thought about it deeper after tge duct tape was found on her skull. If Caylee drowned, that duct tape would have had to be wrapped completely around her head in order for the tape to stick, it would have had to overlap bc it wouldn't stick to wet hair. Then I thought well maybe her body dried out first before it was applied but that didn't make sense bc rigor would set in and a partial time of stiffness. After 24-48 hours it would have become more pliable but the tape wouldn't have been able to stick due to the natural larvae & acids erroding the cadaver. Therefore, I deduce, the tape had to be applied before she died or else she couldn't have drowned & maybe the tape was applied right after death to prevent insect activity...which is stupid bc it would happen anyway. Now there is no way I believe Caylee drowned...not unless she had duct tape placed over her mouth & then drowned. Remember the tape didn't go all the way around her head but it had to be on tight enough to stick & leave a tooth impression. Hmmm...something to think about.

I do not remember reading/hearing anything about a tooth impression, but I may have missed that, it has been a very long 3 years.

I remember when reading that about a tooth depression, it made me sick because that meant she tried to chew her way out of the duct tape.

[Jesse]

what if kronk really did hear where the body was from his girlfriend who worked at the jail what if she overheard on purpose a private conversation casey had with bozo, could that blow the whole case?

[Titch]

This defense shill (Baden) is annoying and the blond woman doesn't know what she's talking about.

Scatty ... what network is this panel discussion taking place.  The hockey game (Stanley Cup) is where it is at in our home tonight but ... maybe a transcript will be posted that I could read later.

Janet

Fox News Channel

We do not get the Fox News Channel ... she I don't feel torn.  I will search for a transcript on the Fox website later.

Imagine!  This so-called "expert" has no clue in that there is no way that hair strand could belong to Lee.

Thanks again Scatty.

Janet

He is a "tainted expert," his wife is Linda K Baden who is still a consultant for the defense, reason she left was because she wasnt going to get paid  when Casey was declared indigent yet she is....hmmm   They are both full of crap, period.

BBM

I still say that in private the Baden's do buy into this new science evidence of the deathband..not on TV ..but in private. 

My reason:  Money or no money..If LKB thought for one minute she could win the point of disputing the deathband she would be there in a NY minute...this is groundbreaking science that will be used in trials going forward.  Since this is the first trial it has been used in it will set a precedant.  If she thought she could win objections to the science and credibility of that sceince against this deathband she would have been front and center.  Think of the publicity she would gain as the person that was able to show this was junk science.

Not showing her face, being on the phone in the background tells me she believes in this science and knows they have no leg to stand on in disputing the deathband theory.  It only appears in the hair of dead people..not all dead people..but only dead people.  Certainly Dr Baden is fully aware of this....but with wifey still being paid as a consultant one must not mess with the defense theroy of ...well what..the child's dead.. they know that.   Decomp in the trunk ..they know that.  They just don't like someone pointing out there was a dead body in Casey's car trunk..that's just too little too late. 

 

I thought it was just the first trial in "Florida" but that it's been used before? No? Btw, this is absolutely not junk science fir any of those out there that don't understand it. Think of it like this: technology changes everyday, for tge better, not for tge worse. Everything being learned is extra, going forward, not backward. When I was a kid, I thought it was a big deal to have a cordless phone with a 9 inch antenna on it lol! Now my kids all have cell phones, iTouch, computers, etc. Does technology ever go backward? No. Everything being done now is amazing. Genetics, DNA splicing & mapping, virus identification & treatments as well as bacterial diseases, yep forensics is damn interesting! 

Gypsy, I just found a link to the ruling you were referring to. Judge Perry is the first judge in our whole COUNTRY, not just Florida, to allow this method of evidence finding to be entered into trial. I think is has to do with the level of chloroform, not the postmortem banding?

 http://www.cayleedaily.com/2011/04/major-casey-anthony-case-rulings-expected-anytime/

Quote
According to WFTV News, ”a research scientist, considered a pioneer in decomposition odor analysis, ran tests on air and carpeting in Casey Anthony’s car trunk. He found evidence of human decomposition and a massive amount of potentially deadly chloroform, more than could be caused by decomposition alone. 

Prosecutors say it’s further proof that Caylee’s body was in her mother’s trunk, but also evidence that could show how Caylee was murdered. If Judge Perry allows that evidence in, he would be the first judge in the country to do it.”

(There is also a link to the PDF doc at the site. I just love Judge Perry! I wanna smash a kiss right in the center of his sweet little forehead!)

[pharlap]

When this first started, I wondered if Caylee could have drowned & Casey acted the way she did due to post trauma. Then I thought about it deeper after tge duct tape was found on her skull. If Caylee drowned, that duct tape would have had to be wrapped completely around her head in order for the tape to stick, it would have had to overlap bc it wouldn't stick to wet hair. Then I thought well maybe her body dried out first before it was applied but that didn't make sense bc rigor would set in and a partial time of stiffness. After 24-48 hours it would have become more pliable but the tape wouldn't have been able to stick due to the natural larvae & acids erroding the cadaver. Therefore, I deduce, the tape had to be applied before she died or else she couldn't have drowned & maybe the tape was applied right after death to prevent insect activity...which is stupid bc it would happen anyway. Now there is no way I believe Caylee drowned...not unless she had duct tape placed over her mouth & then drowned. Remember the tape didn't go all the way around her head but it had to be on tight enough to stick & leave a tooth impression. Hmmm...something to think about.

I do not remember reading/hearing anything about a tooth impression, but I may have missed that, it has been a very long 3 years.

I remember when reading that about a tooth depression, it made me sick because that meant she tried to chew her way out of the duct tape.

Another piece of the puzzle that I didn't know of.
Wonder if Dr. G. will address this on the stand.
 

[TURBOTHINK]

When do you guys think Baez found out Casey was really dead?

oops wishful thinking - meant CAYLEE when did he find out Caylee was dead?

In the beginning............I think that is why he isolated KC from her parents as soon as he could. I don't believe she didn't want to see her parents, because she enjoyed watching her mother in pain so much. I believe he knew it all along and knew what he was dealing with (psychopath) but also knew there was a lot of money to be made in this "game" and he wanted to be the recipient of it.

[flamom]

I have been hunting around and the only mention I can find of a tooth impression refers to Ms horsetooth and perhaps using her teeth to rip it.. anyone have a link saying it was in the duct tape as Caylees?? It is frustrsting when things are thrown out there as facts with no link to back it up. We went around the track with the duct tape, hair, stickers and arm and hammer 'baking soda' that was detergent