Caylee Marie Anthony- MURDER TRIAL- DAY 16 - 6/11 - 6/12/2011

[SunnyinTX]

ITA...

There are so many inaccurate accounts and details out there now.  So many things to muddy the waters for people watching..but not for the jury.

You have to look at this the way the jury does..what they are presented with by the prosecution..and then what the defense is trying to discredit.  Innuendo about the rest of the family is just that ..not fact, not proven, not tested.

George and Lee have nothing to prove or disprove in this case..they are not on trial. 

The defense accusing them in the manner they have is despicable, but the defense can say and does say whatever it wants ..it does not have to present proof.

Had Jose left it at just the accident theory..no inclusion of the family or disparaging of the family..the jury may have believed this story..or at-least had doubt.

But the story from the defense has become to fantastical ...and the State was completely right to ignore this story..and get on with the prosecution of Casey using the facts and evidence they have.  The State does not need to disprove the defense theory..they need to prove their own theory. 

Baez was hoping the State would bite and they did not..they remained on course and true to their initial case.

GDD, my husband and I were talking about this at dinner last night. My DH brought up a good point.....they had to have some outrageous story because she sat in jail for almost 3 years...had it been an accident they could have gone to the State L O N G ago....she sat in jail for 3 years because they had no defense...until they came up with this ridiculous story....they are as crazy as KC...not only was it an accident, but GA is now a sexual abuser and Roy Kronk was in possession of Caylee's remains from August to December....HOW?  because he knew he found her in August (forget that he reported it...that doesn't fit in the story) and didn't retrieve her until Dec...and how did Caylee's little body wind up in the trash bags and laundry bag with duct tape over her mouth...well Daddy-O told KC he would take care of everything after he found her drowned in the pool and not calling 911 or trying CPR.....are these people as fricking stupid as they appear to be????

[carpe noctem]

Jean Couty depo - the neighbor that heard the Anthony fight.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5688720/Casey-Anthony-Neighbor-Jean-Couty-transcript

[Monkey King]

Rather than kill Caylee to spite Cindy, perhaps this was Casey's way of literally cutting the cord with Cindy so she could live her life unincumbered, by a child and family. 

She found a lifestyle that she loved- thinking she was a big shot at Fusion, with people looking up to her as the girlfriend of Tony, figuring herself to be the "Shot Girl" manager.

[SunnyinTX]

I have always felt that George was LYING about seeing them both that morning. I have always believed she killed Caylee that night after she left the house angry with Cindy. How she covered that up with George I don't know. She could have told him she already took her to the nanny, or carried her out in that laundry bag. I really can't think of any other reason to use a laundry bag to put her in except to cover up what was in it.

You could be right TURBOTHINK.

George's inconsistencies when comparing his statements in interviews with LE and testimony on the stand imply that his word cannot be trusted.

Then there is Cindy.  Lee Anthony shared with Tony that there had been a terrible fight between Cindy and Casey on the evening of June 15, 2008.  However ... Cindy testified under oath that it was a special evening ... a time of bonding.

Cindy and George are on a mission and ... the mission is not justice for Caylee.

IMO

Janet

Jesse Grund was also told there was a terrible fight between KC and Cindy. KC called him or texted him and told him all about it. He has not testified yet, so he may be asked about that.

Afternoon all..
I also wonder if Jesses text will come in showing this fight happened the 15th. If so I hope they make they jury see the lies from the 15th. Will they ask Cindy, if she lies she can get in trouble for lying on stand.
Why didn't LE get Cindy and George for obstruction? I wondered this long time ago... sympathy?

she has already lied about.....last week on the stand when she said the 3 of them had a wonderful evening at home...wonderful might not be the word she used...but you get the idea....she didn't mention the fight or the reason for the fight.....SHE LIED AGAIN

[Slogger]

Good Morning, Monkeys!

IMO, Baez wants to keep Casey's room out because of the broken picture frames.  Were those frames in Casey's room prior to June, 2008?

I am thinking they matched the frame and the matting on the picture at the remains scene.

Exactly what I was thinking!  Further, if they can show the frames and photos in Casey's room before and not after . . . it clearly connects Casey with the scene.  No one else would toss out those photos.  MO, Cindy to the rescue, replacing the photos in Casey's room.

Spot on!     

I only have a vague memory of what might have been frames at the Suburban site.  It's been too long ago to count on a vague memory.  Are there any photos of the frames at the Suburban scene?

George, Cindy, and Lee display honest emotion (mo) when talking about Caylee.  Casey has displayed some resentment--particularly in her "what about me" rantings.  MO, Casey really thought Caylee was "Big Trouble."

[TURBOTHINK]

carpe,The Anthony's can't handle the truth!!!!!!

Oh, they can handle the truth - they just have many ulterior motives for it not coming out. Money for one.............

[Cappuccino]

http://video.foxnews.com/v/989180517001

Body Language of Casey Anthony's Family (Tonya Reiman)

Thank you Seeme, this is precisely the segment of Judge Jeanine Sunny & I were referring to.   IMHO, she is spot on & that isnt just an observers opinion but also a work experience one.

[Monkey King]

 Her gig was up with all the lies about work and her next plan had not kicked in like she had envisioned, so she was caught between a rock and a hard spot with not only her parents but Tony. Poor little Caylee got the brunt of her rage.

Who was that guy, I want to say Mark something or another.

He b/s'ed the wife about school, and they were going to move and he shot her- bought a new mattress.  They searched the dump looking for her.  I think she worked in a bank.

It was Mark Hacking.

[Monkey King]

 Her gig was up with all the lies about work and her next plan had not kicked in like she had envisioned, so she was caught between a rock and a hard spot with not only her parents but Tony. Poor little Caylee got the brunt of her rage.

Who was that guy, I want to say Mark something or another.

He b/s'ed the wife about school, and they were going to move and he shot her- bought a new mattress.  They searched the dump looking for her.  I think she worked in a bank.

It was Mark Hacking.

6 years to life he received.  Some justice.

[ISpy]

**SNIPPED**
Even if one is a "Public figure," one may sue if libeled or slandered out of malice.  IMO George has indeed been slandered out of malice. I don't agree that George is a public figure, but perhaps a "Limited public figure."

As to whether or not one can "spot" a molester as a result of their own molestation, again I wish to disagree.  While I certainly sympathize with those who have been victimized by  this heinous crime, it does not make them an expert on the subject.  It makes them an expert only on their own experience.  It does not give them the ability to spot a molester a mile away.  When one trusts their "vibes" as a result of some past experience they have themselves had, and uses that feeling to accuse others, I feel it is very unfair.  There is no such ability.  I have seen no evidence whatsoever that George Anthony molested his daughter.  The mere fact that she, a proven liar, says so tends to make me lean the other way.

Being molested as a young child is I am sure one of the most terrifying experiences a child can go through, but it does not give them special psychic abilities.  Also, I hope they can live happy lives despite this experience and they don't let it define their entire lives.

Respectfully, I disagree.  Having known an inordinate amount of victims, they tend to be very perceptive. IMO, because of their experiences, they unconsciously pick up body language/voice inflection/same or similar verbal phrasing/etc. that are familiar because they are reminiscent of their own abuser.  In my experience with victims, this has been a common occurrence and they are usually correct.  Speculating here, scientifically  speaking, the trauma causes an acute awareness of the situation and the abuser and the resulting chemical changes imprint the memory with body language/voice inflection/particular verbal cues or words, along with a strong sense of danger (fight or flight). Just my two cents.

Need to run!  Have a good Sunday everyone and take care!

[cherjers]

Janet - I'm not giving Cindy, George or Lee a pass, I still believe they all obstructed justice for Caylee but I don't believe Cindy, George or Lee harmed Caylee. 

We are on the same page.

Janet

  As far as giving Cindy and George a pass-I will give them a pass-they have a truly evil daughter--they loved Caylee-and their life is over-they will never have another peaceful day-everyday of their life their hearts will break (just thinking of Caylee)-so i iwll give them a pass-now kc if she gets off ---she will never give Caylee another thought what she did to her mother and father-who tried to protect her-and put themselves in harm way by all their lies to the police--she is evil and rotten to the core--George and Cindy were wrong I agree-but they have paid  the worst price any parent or grand parent could pay-But having said that if they lie now to get her off-the should be prosecuted

[cherjers]

Janet - I'm not giving Cindy, George or Lee a pass, I still believe they all obstructed justice for Caylee but I don't believe Cindy, George or Lee harmed Caylee. 

Again, ITA with you Klaas & Ill go further to say that the angst I have for the rest of the Anthonys was their attempt to protect Casey afterwards.   I've contemplated that they were willing to protect her & tamper with evidence because they prayed it was some sort of "accident" versus Casey murdering Caylee but their thank you for this from the "spiteful B" was for her to make horrendous allegations to destroy them in any manner she further could & take them down with her.   To me, Casey's allegations ONLY make her heinous crime of murdering Caylee even more heinous.   It is also my personal belief that Casey's previous computer searches reveal an even more sinister plot, she drugged Caylee so she could go out when otherwise she couldnt & planned to murder her parents...she wanted that house & the only way to get it is if they were dead.

   I agree great post

[cherjers]

Rather than kill Caylee to spite Cindy, perhaps this was Casey's way of literally cutting the cord with Cindy so she could live her life unincumbered, by a child and family. 

She found a lifestyle that she loved- thinking she was a big shot at Fusion, with people looking up to her as the girlfriend of Tony, figuring herself to be the "Shot Girl" manager.

  She coould have giving Caylee to Cindy and George -got a job-got an apartment-Oh to much work for her--easier to kill her parents and her daughter-  question  do u think she was born evil-or became that way becuase she  got away with everytthing-just curious--I think she was born evil

[pharlap]

SunnyinTX
 ::snipping2::
GDD, my husband and I were talking about this at dinner last night. My DH brought up a good point.....they had to have some outrageous story because she sat in jail for almost 3 years...had it been an accident they could have gone to the State L O N G ago....she sat in jail for 3 years because they had no defense...until they came up with this ridiculous story....they are as crazy as KC...not only was it an accident, but GA is now a sexual abuser and Roy Kronk was in possession of Caylee's remains from August to December....HOW?  because he knew he found her in August (forget that he reported it...that doesn't fit in the story) and didn't retrieve her until Dec...and how did Caylee's little body wind up in the trash bags and laundry bag with duct tape over her mouth...well Daddy-O told KC he would take care of everything after he found her drowned in the pool and not calling 911 or trying CPR.....are these people as fricking stupid as they appear to be????

Well said....Amen!

 

[carpe noctem]

**SNIPPED**
Even if one is a "Public figure," one may sue if libeled or slandered out of malice.  IMO George has indeed been slandered out of malice. I don't agree that George is a public figure, but perhaps a "Limited public figure."

----
George put his man satchel out on the public barbecue grill to be the next John Walsh. (You Tube has more information)

Doo-dads burn hot on the grill and you frequently need a spritzer bottle to put out flare-ups!

George's house of cards has been imploding ever since.... because he built that house on a bog of quick sand of lies.

BOO FRICKETY HOO   This is what happens. It's to be expected.

I don't think he'll ever sue. If he does. He is an even bigger idiot than I ever imagined.

It would be like saying my toe hurts and immediately hitting it with a hammer.

[trimmonthelake]

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2011/06/casey-anthony-geraldo-rivera-shows-caylees-skull-photo.html
Casey Anthony: Geraldo Rivera shows Caylee’s skull photo
Caylee and Casey Anthony, Fox News Channel — posted by halboedeker on June, 12 2011 11:46 AM

Nobody does it like Geraldo Rivera, and we can be grateful there is only one of him.   

Consider that graphic animation of Caylee Anthony’s face turning into a skull. Before the state showed the animation Friday, Chief Judge Belvin Perry reminded everyone that the media were aware of restrictions on showing the images by Dr. Michael Warren, a prosecution witness.

The two media pools — the Orlando Sentinel and “In Session” — understood they were to pixelate and blur the images, Perry said. And the judge noted there was ”an absolute prohibition” on the public as well.

But Rivera showed the Caylee skull image on his Fox News Channel show, “Geraldo at Large,” last night. And the animation didn’t look pixelated or blurred.
 ::snipping2::

[can]

We know that Cindy has vigorously defended her daughter.  George has as well.  To a lesser extent.  Probably because if you don't follow Cindy's lead, there would be no living with her.  But, I think from some of George's statements, there has been some ambivalence.  I would love to know what he said in the Grand Jury testimony, but that's beside the point.

I believe the Anthony's have covered up for ICA.

With that in mind, I would like to put something forward that I have been chewing on for a long time and have not had the courage to mention. It concerns George's statement recalling when he last saw Caylee for the last time leaving the house with ICA on June l6th.

Could it be possible he was also covering up for ICA on June l6th?
He said he gave them both the usual hug and kiss.  I believe Caylee said something to him.  In other words, he saw a live Caylee leave the house, in ICA'S arms.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Is it possible that Caylee had already died when ICA carried her out of the house that morning and that it was a rushed exit with ICA telling George she was sleepy, or sleeping?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
George embellishes his words, well, all the A's do.  Seemingly they think this makes their words more believable. 

I'm not saying in this scenario that George would have known Caylee died.  Only that he has been cuckolded by ICA once again.  Or, perhaps he didn't see them leave at all that morning.  But, he made the statement, and he is stuck with it.

Both Cindy and George were eager to show that ICA left the house with an alive Caylee on June l6th and at the time they were trying to demonstrate I think, that Caylee was alive on June l6th and left their home which allowed for the Nanny tale that Casey was spewing at the time.

Good morning, all! Can, Ive been thinking along those same lines myself.  George's specificity months later, in describing Caylee's outfit that day, bothered me. Casey could have easily swept by him in a rush or called "Gotta leave for work. Caylee's still sleeping." on her way to the garage with a "sleeping" Caylee.  The thing that may help nail Casey though is that both George and Casey agreed, saying Caylee was wearing a pink shirt when they last saw her...and she was found with the remains of a pink shirt. Casey's propensity for detailed lying is going to bite her here.  BTW (by the way), no one is going to buy that Casey was looking for the nanny because every mother would call 911 immediately and then park herself outside of the nanny's hose/apt. complex day after day and evening after evening...every mother, except Casey, that is. Didn't you know you can search for missing children from the stage, while you're shakin' your booty in a Hot Body contest? The crowd can see you better you can see over the crowd much better when you're gyrating into the girl beside you. 

Personally, I doubt she was even home the night of June 15th.  We've seen her on video in a rage and no one was threatening to kick her out and take her most effective weapon. I believe the fight scenario because the neighbors had no need to lie-it wasn't like they were seeking a media interview and they haven't even been publicly identified. After a fight of that magnitude and finality, there's no way Casey would stay in that house with Cindy, IMO.  Two volatile tempers, too volatile of a situation.  Casey's good at throwing tantrums and jerking Cindy around, but she's not used to Cindy being physically hands-on confrontational and in her face. I think Cindy really caught her by surprise. IMO, that's when Casey decided to kill Caylee first. If (big "if"), they both went to neutral corners and Casey spent the night there, I'd be surprised if Caylee made it through the night.  I think Cindy did withhold info on the fight because something precipitated Casey killing Caylee on a Monday.  Statistically speaking, most murders and domestic violence events happen Friday- Sunday evening. Casey wasn't home much that weekend. Logically, something occurred toward the close of the weekend, something big. A Sunday evening spent snuggled up on the bed watching sentimental family videos, followed by murdering a family member on Monday, doesn't make sense. I can see Casey leaving with or without Caylee, driving down the road and parking/going to the abandoned house for the night, and maybe sneaking back in early morning.  I'd be surprised if Caylee lived to see morning.  By the same token though, as manipulative and spiteful as Casey is, I can see her waking Caylee, getting her breakfast, dressing her in the Big Trouble t-shirt...gleeful at her plan for the day. I see here https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p6Pnw95vqOo-MgZ7Vsp9pYg&gid=0 , that Tony called Casey at 11:47 a.m. and again at 1:00 p.m..  Making plans for the day or checking up on her after the fight.  From her phone records, we know that she basically talking with Tony late night June 15th into early morning June 16th.  Assuming Tony has classes, she doesn't talk to him again until she's driving at 4:19 p.m..  I wonder how her daily cell phone records compare to this day.  Is she normally in the habit of making calls all day long?  How can she do that from work?  LOL  How can she do that watching a toddler?  IF so, where was Caylee?  All of the mothers we know can rarely manage one uninterrupted phone conversation a day, much less 25 and a few text messages. Someone should have heard Caylee in the background or interrupting her mother in more than one of those calls.    Just sayin'  I wonder if her friends were questioned about that- How often would you say you heard Caylee in the background or interrupting when you talked to Casey?  Did Casey ever put Caylee on the phone during your conversations?  I regularly hear my nephews or friends' children in the background on the phone.  Often the parent has to referee or give instruction/correction. Many times a smaller child has begged to talk to me and I've gladly obliged.  So, where was Caylee during all those calls?

All of the above JMO.  BBL           

ISpy. Your thinking along the same lines, (ICA rushing past Geo. with "sleeping" Caylee) allows me to think I haven't moved too far into fantasy land. ty.

My Grandkids can always be heard in the background when I speak with my daughter on the phone (unless they are in their beds asleep) and often
want to speak with me, which of course, I welcome. 
It would be interesting if same happened with Caylee>  I would think so, though perhaps not so much with ICA'S friends since they were not long time friends.  But, perhaps with GreatGrandma Plesea. 

We only know how ICA presented as a Mother in the presence of others, according to court testimony from young adults.  We will never know how she was when she and Caylee were alone.  Given that Caylee is gone, I shudder to think about it.

I think Cindy's story about snuggling and watching video or some such that night is bogus.  I think when she took video at the nursing home, her intention was to have it recorded in time for tender viewing moments later.  Perhaps someday to show Caylee with her Great Grandpa. 

I must look at the witness list to see if there is anyone on the States list that could be a neighbor that might have heard the fight between C & ICA that night.  It's my recollection that Burner the shovel guy, did not hear it, ICBW but of course that doesn't mean another didn't.

   

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.wmbfnews.com/Global/story.asp?S=14889205
Dozens jockey for coveted Anthony trial seats
Posted: Jun 12, 2011 9:25 AM CDT Updated: Jun 12, 2011 12:55 PM CDT
National News More>>
By MIKE SCHNEIDER
Associated Press

ORLANDO, Fla. (AP) - Spectators trying to get one of the 60 courtroom seats available to the public in the Casey Anthony trial have created scenes reminiscent of the running of the bulls in Spain or a Walmart on the Friday after Thanksgiving.

Those who have arrived as early as 1 a.m. to wait for a seat in the trial of the Florida mother charged with killing her 2-year-old daughter Caylee have been jostled, elbowed and pushed aside by fellow spectators while running from the sidewalk to the Orange County Courthouse entrance before dawn. They aren't allowed to camp out on courthouse property, so they hang out on the sidewalk in front of the 23-story building until they are allowed to line up at the entrance at 5:30 a.m.
 ::snipping2::

[StarMonkey]

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=10200.0

Was going over timeline here .. link above.
I guess I missed somewhere down the line or forgot..
Casey made a MySpace for zenaida on June 16 afternoon. This makes me think she killed her the 15th.
Drove her around while going to stay with tony, Caylee was in trunk. She threw her out a few days after.
The fluids in car built up to the smell casey txts Amy the 26 to complain about smell.

[trimmonthelake]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-06-11-casey-anthony-trial_n.htm
Investigator: Caylee's remains found near road Updated 3m ago
ORLANDO, Fla. (AP) — Caylee Anthony's skull and most of the rest of her remains were 19 feet from the road when they were found, a crime scene investigator testified Saturday.
Stretching a tape measure across the courtroom, defense attorney Jose Baez demonstrated the remains were virtually steps from the road, nearly the same distance as the jury from the defense table. The testimony that the scene was easily accessible from the road could be significant because defense attorneys claim the meter reader who found the remains tampered with them.

The defense has said that the 2-year-old girl accidentally drowned in her grandparents' swimming pool.
 ::snipping2::