Caylee Marie Anthony- MURDER TRIAL- DAY 17- 6/13/2011

[flamom]

I have a question.. if Bobo gives an expert witness an interstate subpena, does that mean they have to get here and stay in a hotel on their own dime?

I am not sure a judge in the State of Florida has the power to issue a summons in Tennessee. It has to go through the Secretary of State's office. They may willingly agree to the summon but if the ORNL attorneys feel that it is not a good idea, they will squelch it in Tennessee Courts.

I found this.. dont know if it applies   
http://www.serve-now.com/resources/process-serving-laws/florida#48194personalserviceoutsidestate

•Out-of-state service is permitted under law of Florida if it is made in the same manner as in-state service and is made by an officer authorized to serve process in the state where the process is served. Thompson v. King, D.C. 523 F.Supp. 180 (1981

[KCJackie]

  Does anyone know when the last time someone actually seen KC with her car?

What was the time frame that she used Amy's car? 

[flamom]

Sorry Mr. Kronk, I called you Mr. Krock. You are not a krock but IMO a fine gentleman who knew the area, the rumors there and looked and looked. I would too. Never give up finding Caylee. Don't let the ex wife and estranged son get to you. The ex is an ex and the son, in time, will probably get back with you. They say that time heals but IMO it is God's time and not mine. Sometimes, mine would be faster ((smiles))

[Puzzler]

I can envision Jesse Grund being "the one" that the defense pins thier assertions on - KC's ugly coping - Jesse Grund said words to the effect that if something accidentally happened to Caylee that KC would not be able to deal with it and would lie and handle it badly.

Yep...the defense will call Jessee...

[islandmonkey]

I just thought I'd share what my dad thinks about the case.  Some of you know he's sick (cancer) and I only mention that because I am very gentle with him because of his condition.  If he were not ill, I'd go head to head with him because that's how I roll.   

So, he's been watching this with me, and it's so hard to listen to his side because I know soooo much more than he does.  It does give me another insight to consider, so all is not lost.  I decided dad would be my "acid test" for the juror or jurors who were honest and hadn't heard much of the evidence prior to trial.  My dad only knew what he'd seen on Nancy Grace, JVM, or InSessions.  We all know how wrong they can be! (um, hello Wendy?? get a clue or two).

He started off very angry that Baez would say such inflammatory things about GA in his opening statement.  He started off thinking it was an accident and stupid, immature kc panicked.  He goes back and forth on whether or not she had help / GA or LA in his opinion.  He thinks the only way GA would have helped kc is if she Blackmailed him and there was something inappropriate going on between them.

Today he told me he's pretty sure she meant to kill her.  What changed his mind?  The computer searches, the duct tape, and dragging GA and Kronk into the story.

I love my dad and he is trying my patience, but when he said that today I was really happy.  I think the State is doing a great job, and they've changed my dad's original opinion so that's definitely a mountain they've climbed.  He takes mega steroids on the weekend as part of his treatment so Sun. Mon. & Tuesday are hard days to deal with him.  He got mad at me yesterday and called me an asshole because I told him he was drinking the koolaid when he was repeating what the stupid talking heads were saying about that video and grounds for an appeal!!.    He apologized after I told my mom on him.    I love him so much and I forgave him before he even asked.  It was the steroids talking!!!

I'm so fortunate I didn't get a "George" for a dad.  And, he didn't get a "Casey" for a daughter either. 

What a sweet story O4B  reminds me of my dad and the way we debate going head to head....

[Kat_Gram]

Stupid Leonard Padilla fanned the flames of incest.  He claimed to have overheard that the DNA markers of Caylee's weren't different enough from Kc.  He inferred that the reason would be either GA or LA was the father of Caylee.

the secretiveness
the lies, they all lie so much
the mob mentality / everyone is out to get them, so they'll get everyone else first
the stealing, cheating (both CA and GA)
the sheer lack of any moral compass is ASTOUNDING

is it any wonder they bred a psychopath?

I remember reading about the markers not being different enough. They did the paternity testing on George and Lee for a reason and it wasn't because they read SM or listened to LP.
LE had the paternity tests, the full ones from Jesse. What if it was a relative, a cousin or someone in the family who isn't George or Lee or Gramps in the home?

[flamom]

Even the dogs now have a FB page 

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Highly-Trained-Police-Cadaver-Dogs/121462011271859

[Puzzler]

I don't know if anyone is watching HLN but they made a good point about the duct tape making it look like a kidnapping. that is a great point. I really do not think the duct tape was the murder weapon

WHY would a kidnapper put duct tape on a 25 lb child's face and hands? WHY would the kidnapping even be brought up since bozo has already said she was NOT kidnapped but drowned.

Um probably because in the beginning that is what Casey was saying, that it was a kidnapping. The duct tape would coincide with a kidnapping. This whole drowning thing is new. The defense was saying she was kidnapped for quite sometime. This also would coincide with Casey's 55 day theory. But she got locked up and was unable to finish the so called kidnapping story.

I think Cindy confronted KC on stealing money from her grandfather's account and a fight happened.  During the fight it was brought up by Cindy that she would take Caylee away cause she was an unfit mother.  I think that KC took Caylee and maybe Caylee was crying and upset she duct taped her mouth out of anger, hence the 3 pieces.  Caylee was keeping her from partying, taking all the attention from everyone and she was getting old enough to tell what KC was doing to her (thinking the chloroform or drugs) to put her to sleep.   Just my opinion.

Grandma, I think that's exactly what happened. 

Ditto....that has been my feeling since the beginning
On the kidnapping/duct tape issue, I can't see a kidnapper using duct tape being used on their victim all the way into their hair, maybe wrist and ankles or maybe over the mouth but not into the hair, but that is just my opinion.

It's bee my opinion from the beginning, too.

I guess in closing argument, the State will bring together Amy's comments about how KC wasn't getting along with Cindy and wanted her "freedom".  I didn't see a lot about the problems with "mom".  Maybe more will come out in the defense case. I think that KC's "main" driving factor was trying to spite mom.

Until recently, I took KC's partying and dancing and having fun as a sign of her freedom without Caylee; however, recently, I've come to think that KC's partying and dancing on the grave of Caylee was more KC's euphoria of having dealt the ultimate blow to Cindy.  Always the battle betweeen Cindy and KC for who's on top - KC's killing of Caylee got rid of the little snot head, got rid of the one person that KC was jealous of the most, got rid of the person that everyone doted on more that KC, and.....most of all....dealt a hurt beyond all hurts to her foe - Cindy.

[beth1970]

reading vs watching Cindy / Morgan deposition wow - now I get why you guys are skeptical!

Going back & reviewing some info/videos etc about the case.  I just want to say for anyone who hasn't watched the Cindy /Morgan deposition "Watch it".  I have heard about the lies she told but the only Cindy I have ever seen on tv (except initially when Caylee first reported missing) was during the trial.  Wow you guys are right to be skeptical about her.  Reading the transcript is one thing but actually watching her defiance, anger, evasiveness, disrespect and hostility man oh man I get it now!  I swear it is like two different people (deposition vs trial)!

[flamom]

I agree with all of you....... Goodnight Monkey friends!!
Justice for Caylee  ::justice2NJ:: 

[beth1970]

I don't know if anyone is watching HLN but they made a good point about the duct tape making it look like a kidnapping. that is a great point. I really do not think the duct tape was the murder weapon

WHY would a kidnapper put duct tape on a 25 lb child's face and hands? WHY would the kidnapping even be brought up since bozo has already said she was NOT kidnapped but drowned.

Um probably because in the beginning that is what Casey was saying, that it was a kidnapping. The duct tape would coincide with a kidnapping. This whole drowning thing is new. The defense was saying she was kidnapped for quite sometime. This also would coincide with Casey's 55 day theory. But she got locked up and was unable to finish the so called kidnapping story.

I think Cindy confronted KC on stealing money from her grandfather's account and a fight happened.  During the fight it was brought up by Cindy that she would take Caylee away cause she was an unfit mother.  I think that KC took Caylee and maybe Caylee was crying and upset she duct taped her mouth out of anger, hence the 3 pieces.  Caylee was keeping her from partying, taking all the attention from everyone and she was getting old enough to tell what KC was doing to her (thinking the chloroform or drugs) to put her to sleep.   Just my opinion.

Grandma, I think that's exactly what happened. 

Ditto....that has been my feeling since the beginning
On the kidnapping/duct tape issue, I can't see a kidnapper using duct tape being used on their victim all the way into their hair, maybe wrist and ankles or maybe over the mouth but not into the hair, but that is just my opinion.

It's bee my opinion from the beginning, too.

I guess in closing argument, the State will bring together Amy's comments about how KC wasn't getting along with Cindy and wanted her "freedom".  I didn't see a lot about the problems with "mom".  Maybe more will come out in the defense case. I think that KC's "main" driving factor was trying to spite mom.

Until recently, I took KC's partying and dancing and having fun as a sign of her freedom without Caylee; however, recently, I've come to think that KC's partying and dancing on the grave of Caylee was more KC's euphoria of having dealt the ultimate blow to Cindy.  Always the battle betweeen Cindy and KC for who's on top - KC's killing of Caylee got rid of the little snot head, got rid of the one person that KC was jealous of the most, got rid of the person that everyone doted on more that KC, and.....most of all....dealt a hurt beyond all hurts to her foe - Cindy.

Did she act any differently towards Cindy after killing Caylee?  If so you could definitely be on to something!

[TURBOTHINK]

If he were Caylee's father, his ass would be in jail right now.  IMO

Exactly. 

I am not so sure about that. She was of legal age so although it would be incest,it would not be illegal.

[islandmonkey]

I don't know if anyone is watching HLN but they made a good point about the duct tape making it look like a kidnapping. that is a great point. I really do not think the duct tape was the murder weapon

WHY would a kidnapper put duct tape on a 25 lb child's face and hands? WHY would the kidnapping even be brought up since bozo has already said she was NOT kidnapped but drowned.

Um probably because in the beginning that is what Casey was saying, that it was a kidnapping. The duct tape would coincide with a kidnapping. This whole drowning thing is new. The defense was saying she was kidnapped for quite sometime. This also would coincide with Casey's 55 day theory. But she got locked up and was unable to finish the so called kidnapping story.

I think Cindy confronted KC on stealing money from her grandfather's account and a fight happened.  During the fight it was brought up by Cindy that she would take Caylee away cause she was an unfit mother.  I think that KC took Caylee and maybe Caylee was crying and upset she duct taped her mouth out of anger, hence the 3 pieces.  Caylee was keeping her from partying, taking all the attention from everyone and she was getting old enough to tell what KC was doing to her (thinking the chloroform or drugs) to put her to sleep.   Just my opinion.

Grandma, I think that's exactly what happened. 

Ditto....that has been my feeling since the beginning
On the kidnapping/duct tape issue, I can't see a kidnapper using duct tape being used on their victim all the way into their hair, maybe wrist and ankles or maybe over the mouth but not into the hair, but that is just my opinion.

It's bee my opinion from the beginning, too.

I guess in closing argument, the State will bring together Amy's comments about how KC wasn't getting along with Cindy and wanted her "freedom".  I didn't see a lot about the problems with "mom".  Maybe more will come out in the defense case. I think that KC's "main" driving factor was trying to spite mom.

Until recently, I took KC's partying and dancing and having fun as a sign of her freedom without Caylee; however, recently, I've come to think that KC's partying and dancing on the grave of Caylee was more KC's euphoria of having dealt the ultimate blow to Cindy.  Always the battle betweeen Cindy and KC for who's on top - KC's killing of Caylee got rid of the little snot head, got rid of the one person that KC was jealous of the most, got rid of the person that everyone doted on more that KC, and.....most of all....dealt a hurt beyond all hurts to her foe - Cindy.

  My thoughts exactly on the intensive partying after....another slap in the face

[Tamikosmom]

If Baez is going to use Krystal Holloway's words in her February 17, 2010 interview with investigators are the foundation of his "accidental death" allegations ... he as some explaining to do in regards to his witness' words in the same transcript that reveals George's frustration of not knowing the whereabouts of his granddaughter's remains ... frustration that implies George was not a participant in the disposal process..

Janet

++++++

Krystal Holloway aka River Cruz

TRANSCRIPT OF TAPED INTERVIEW OF KRYSTAL HOLLOWAY
OCSO CASE NUMBER 08-74777
CONDUCTED BY CORPORAL ERIC EDWARDS
RECORDED FEBRUARY 17, 2010
TYPED FEBRUARY 19, 2010
SA SERGEANT JOHN ALLEN
CE— CORPORAL ERIC EDWARDS
KH KRYSTAL HOLLOWAY

<snipped>

SA Urn, did he ever tell you what they talked about when Casey was home from jail?

KH Urn, you know what? Ah, as a matter of fact there was one time that he was
really pissed and he.. he threw her up against the wall and choked her.

SA Okay do you know why he threw her up against the wall and choked her?

KH Because he said, I know you killed her. What did you do with her? And he
choked her. And Cindy had to get George off of.. off of Casey.

SA How do you know this?

KH He told me.

26 - 27
Krystal Holloway/Case #08-74777/GB

<snipped>

SA Okay. Did he ever say to you that Casey had told him it was an accident? Or.. or did he just think it...

KH No. No, he wasn't thinking. He knew what he was saying. He said it. I caught him on a bad moment and he was crying. And he said it, look it was an accident.  It just snowballed out of control.

SA Okay. But he never., but he never said to you how he knew that? How he knew it was an accident?

KH I.. no and I didn't want to ask.

29
Krystal Holloway/Case #08-74777/GB

<snipped>

CE Who witnessed that did he tell you?

KH I don't.. you know ...

SA We went through that. But um...

KH I just I can't remember. I just know like details.. I know because I know we sat and talked about it. And I just couldn't see him doing that. But I know Cindy was there and if I'm not mistaken I'm not really sure. But I think Padilla was there.

SA Well earlier you said that Cindy had pulled him off her.

KH Yeah.

CE Hm.

KH She had to pull him off. And he said, I want her out of here. I want her out I want her gone.

CE And so George has thought since the beginning that she had some involvement, but wouldn't help?

KH He, he's known. He's known the whole time.

31
Krystal Holloway/Case #08-74777/

<snipped>

http://www.wftv.com/pdf/23070163/detail.html

http://www.thehinkymeter.com/Library/CMA/interviews/kholloway021710.pdf

[TexasBarMom]

If he were Caylee's father, his ass would be in jail right now.  IMO

Exactly. 

I am not so sure about that. She was of legal age so although it would be incest,it would not be illegal.

If it is not illegal, why was LE so determined to do the paternity testing on Lee and George in particular?  (not being sarcastic or anything, just would like to know).  If George were the father, that would explain ALOT! 

[beth1970]

If he were Caylee's father, his ass would be in jail right now.  IMO

Exactly. 

I am not so sure about that. She was of legal age so although it would be incest,it would not be illegal.

No, but wouldn't Jose be screaming that from the rafters?  If that's their big "ah ha" moment to come then the state would know about it by now and we'd see some sort of "plan" to diffuse or dispute it - but then again they could just ignore it.  Seems like both sides have been doing that!

[Grandma2Maddie]

Carpe, just for the heck of it.... what if KC and Bobo are lying about George?
Dont get me wrong.. he is a barnacle and pretty spineless, but to accuse someone of pedophilia and incest before the world? Do you honestly think they can back that type of accusation? It smacks of Bobo wanting to be the hot shot attorney he is jealous of. I dont buy that crap for 1 minute

hi flamom - 

I have based my theory on George's actions (and the entire family's). I was posting about it long before Casey ever wrote her first
letter about it. So, Baez and Casey did not influence me.

- the family hiding the pregnancy for 7 months
- they didn't even ask who the father was
- george cutting the cord
- casey making up imaginary fathers / killing the father off in her fantasies.
- george getting his ears pierced for casey (abnormal devotion)
- constantly calling her beautiful and gorgeous in jail (inappropriate setting)
- cindy saying on greta caylee never had a father ( of course she did - that loon )

It gets to a point where it's not just weird... it's too much to ignore.

I don't know if Baez can back it up. Probably not. George will always be a inappropriate weirdo though, I am sure of this.

It sure does blow my mind how he charms everybody with his dopey sweet paw paw act, though. He is a TOAD.

May I add...
kc never received any type of assistance from the State / either SS(if the father was deceased) or Welfare
as much as she stole, that would have been some cold hard cash she didn't have to work for
the only thing that ever made since to me about that whole situation was either incest (GA or LA) or a cousin.  Something that would humiliate the Anthony's and ruin the picture perfect image Cindy always tries to portray.

JMO (I used to be pretty certain LA or GA fathered Caylee for the reasons above.  Now, I'm not so sure and she's such a liar there's no way I'd just take her word for AnyThing!!... I'd have to have proof.)

For what it's worth I believe that if GA or LA fathered Caylee then they would be in jail.  I think that Casey had so many boyfriends/or flings that she had no idea who the father was.

[BabsKats]

Does anyone know when the last time someone actually seen KC with her car?

What was the time frame that she used Amy's car? 

The last time she was seen with her car would have been the morn of June 27th, when she parked car next to the dumpster in the Amscot lot and called Tony to pick her up as she'd run out of gas, again....

She also had bags of groceries with her, presumed to have come from the Anthony house.....

[beth1970]

Does anyone know when the last time someone actually seen KC with her car?

What was the time frame that she used Amy's car? 

The last time she was seen with her car would have been the morn of June 27th, when she parked car next to the dumpster in the Amscot lot and called Tony to pick her up as she'd run out of gas, again....

She also had bags of groceries with her, presumed to have come from the Anthony house.....

I wonder why no one noticed her pulled off on the side of the road carrying a garbage bag? (when she threw away the baby)  Is that what happened?

[IBE]

O4bull

Thank you for your story. I sincerely hope your Dad gets well!