THEORIES - THE NATALEE HOLLOWAY CASE

[vms]

Lala's that's as of 2002 but he could still be living at the same location.

This was the address listed in 2005:

http://remax-itraruba.com/listings/index.php?action=listingview&listingID=10

http://www.wwdestates.com/Aruba/Savaneta%20356/Savaneta%20356.htm

The chamber listing has a Noord address listed now...

[klaasend]

SAVANETA # 356 (U.S.$ 535,000.) SOLD!!!

[Lala'sMom]

SAVANETA # 356 (U.S.$ 535,000.) SOLD!!!

Now, this is the only place I have seen in Aruba I would like to live.  Close to the water and yet away from the rest of the island. 

[steve]

The white Toyota pickup theory


At police station/Both vds cars impounded.
 

Gabe Leo at beach. (rt.)
 

Mortem Crew at Balashi
 

Savaneta 356-Chuck Di Perri

[the big hammer]

Closing The Ring

From Dutch Newspaper De Telegraaf, November 25, 2007: "... The preliminary investigation also showed that Joran van der Sloot previously abused girls against their will. “We came into contact with an ex-girlfriend that had confessed to a therapist that she was raped by Joran. Naturally, we tried to let her press charges against Joran, but unfortunately she didn’t want to do that...Now we have listened to a number of interviews again, we see - in combination with the new research - indeed new suspicions rise up, “says a Dutch detective. Police and Attorney General in Aruba are convinced Joran and his friends Deepak and Satish have picked up girls many times befor, drugged them and had sex with them!!!."

And they begin to see with their eyes, and listen with their ears.  And they begin to perceive what has evidently been known for a long time around here, right here on this thread.

That jvds, the kalpoes, and their friends are serial rapists.

And now that puts us half way home.  So are they raping for succor and need?  Have their girlfriends refused their manly desires and wishes?  Are they starved for satisfaction?  Was the serial raping a product of deprivation? 

Or something else?

Could we be realistically expected to believe that the pimps were sexually shunned and routinely rejected by the armies or tourist girls, and even their girlfirends and classmates,etc?

No.

It was something else.

Like status and peer group empowerment?  And that they were engaged in a disgusting and criminal game of one-upsmanship?

And that of course to prove their exploits, to ensure their raised status among their deviant peers, they had to memorialize their episodes.  And how better to do that, in the digital age, than to use the ever-present camera available now on nearly every cellphone, or handy digi-cam, the size of cigarette pack capable of holding 250 pictures (or even thousands depending on the memory stick installed), or a video cam, or a web cam, or...you know, like the picture of Loco Stefy, topless, in bed, at the Mill Resort. 

Who took that picture?  And why?  And she was "Smileee" on the jvds photo album posted on the web on the joran blogspot site.

So who took that picture of that topless girl in a bed at the Mill Resort -- and why did "he" take it?

We are getting closer and closer now.

.

[sirensong]

   "It's a huge maze of thousands of sites and its hard to tell who is involved ".

Shango?  Things that make you go hmmmm....

[Kiwi]

MumInOhio- Yesterdays talk about the bloody mattress could you check the days and or times for the
1- furniture truck, 2- when did they find the mattress, 3- searches of the dump (may have stopped the disposal at the dump) 4-The search of Joran's  apartment (not the main house). Just want to see it lines up at all.

[Observer]

Hi Kiwi,

Not MUM,But maybe I can help with a few of your requests. The Bloody Mattress was found a few hours after the arrests of the security guards on June 5th 2005. I believe Junior called the ALE on June 1st 2005 to report what he saw at the dump and two days later his brother again called the ALE. They searched the dump I think in late July 2005/early aug. The search of Jorans Apt took place june 16th 2005. No idea when that Furniture truck arrived at the VDS residence. Strange that the someone took a picture of it though 

In this Video they report finding a bloody mattress and a pair of sandles.


http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/?p=1035

[Kiwi]

******* thanks very much, I'll map that out but it was not the direction I was considering.

[Observer]

******* thanks very much, I'll map that out but it was not the direction I was considering.

YW..I still think there may be a link between Fransisco who said he helped bury Natalee and Junior the Landfill witness. Not that they know each other,but they both saw a white truck,other details are similar and the timeline adds up. Unfortunately one of them was put into a mental institution and the other is a drug addict. I know Art wood interviewed both of them and would be interesting to hear his thoughts on all of this.

Fransisco,the guy who was put into a mental institution after he said he helped bury Natalee, his friends told Art he was not crazy. Junior the Landfill witness had many people fooled if inded he was lying or hallucinating. He even said in his statement he saw Jorans Father directing them inside of the dump and described all the vehicles. One of Dompigs statements was that he thought Natalee may have been moved around. Is it possible one or both of these people did see the same white truck? Is it possible that she was moved to a shallow grave like this witness says and moved elsewhere,possibly to the dump or the ocean? If they did take Natalee out to sea was it after these supposed events,the very next day or not at all? 

[Observer]

Just one more thing,since we were talking about that Mattress. This statement from Deepak's PV still bothers me. Was it a slip or does it mean nothing?

Deepak Statement of 6/13/05

snipped...
We then went to Joran's room because Joran's dad
wanted to talk to us so we sat down on the floor,
because Joran's mattresses were on the floor in his
room.

[Magnolia]

Just one more thing,since we were talking about that Mattress. This statement from Deepak's PV still bothers me. Was it a slip or does it mean nothing?

We then went to Joran's room because Joran's dad
wanted to talk to us so we sat down on the floor,
because Joran's mattresses were on the floor in his
room.

I always thought it was a slip and a quick try to cover>

[texasmom]

*******
Regarding the landfill witnesses:  I remember that Jossy among others including Art Wood, if I remember correctly, were convinced that they had seen something.  The details of the witness accounts were impressive and did not change...details about different vehicles that at the time could be connected to suspects...among other things were convincing enough for Dave to go out there and search himself.  I'll never forget that.....so sad...., I think Red even went and helped at the landfill.  All of the obstacles that they encountered also made it very suspicious.  If she had been placed there and moved were they afraid they'd left something behind?  I have often wondered about this whole scenario.  It seemed that definate efforts were made to stop the landfill search. 

Regarding JVDS' mattresses on the floor:  I have to wonder if they were "new" mattresses, and if his mattresses had always been on the floor...  I remember when the pictures of the furniture truck were posted but have no idea of the date...

I'm still stuck on why in the world PVDS, AVDS, and the two younger sons went to the "family gathering" and left JVDS home alone.  School was still in session but AVDS did not return with PVDS and sons on Sunday afternoon, but returned on Wednesday missing three days of school?  This seems odd to me in that I work for a school district and this would be frowned on in the last weeks of school unless it was a family emergency.  Why did they not take the "sporter" that they are so proud of to the family gathering?  Did the family in Holland already know what we have all come to know about him?......Was it planned in advance for PVDS and sons to return without AVDS...Was the tournament he was in at the casino that important?   Did the parents communicate with their home alone son while they were gone?.....As a parent if the reports of JVDS problems/behavior were true, he would have never been left alone while the rest of the family went to Holland.  I have so many questions about all of this that just make me believe that AVDS is involved in all of her little "sporters" bad behavior.  I will never believe that JVDS didn't know of or meet Natalee until that Sunday afternoon in the casino.

[Observer]

Texasmom:

You bet they all believed him,I just saw a old video the other day of Dave and he said all those things but also that Junior knew other information that made him seem even more credible. Seeing Dave in that Dump I think makes all of us furious and is something we will never ever forget. It got me up and to Boston on day 2 of that travel show in the snow,I used that as my inspiration to make the drive. I bet Dave never wants to think about that hellhole ever again,but in chat he said he doesnt think she was there. It's possible Janets theory is correct and she was moved after the witness's brother called the ALE the second time about what he saw.

I agree about all you said,including the Aruban Govt making it as difficult as possible to search that Dump,they even stopped it to say they needed permits,blamed a fire on them and then filled up all the holes ending weeks of hard work. Junior described everything,the only thing not familiar to me was a yellow vehicle,I think a stationwagon.

[MumInOhio]

Kiwi…I guess it showed I was on, but am having a terrible time with my dish and it’s taking me forever to load a page. Will check on those for you. I remember a couple of weeks ago that there was a picture of the truck in the main forum and I distinctly recall seeing August on it. As I thought that was a long time later, but it may not have been the date that the truck was there. It may have been something to do with the pic being put on the computer. This is what I found from Nancy Grace from Feb. 23rd.2006:
       ---------------------------------------------------------

GERAGOS: Dave, did they ever -- did they ever do any kind of search or DNA or find any kind of forensic evidence in the apartment? You said that you believe that that's where, if something happened, that that's where it took place. Do you know, or did they disclose to you whether or not they did any kind of a search there and developed any kind of forensic evidence?

HOLLOWAY: Well, they say they did a search of Joran's apartment. I have got a photograph somewhere taken approximately two, three weeks, maybe a month afterwards, with a moving van in front of the house. And you know, it kind of strikes me, why someone would buy new furniture -- if that's what they were doing -- while their son is in jail? You know, and it kind of leads me to believe -- I'm only speculating -- that maybe they went furniture shopping to swap some of this furniture out to get rid of evidence. That's only speculation, but you know, there's a lot of clues out there.
         --------------------------------------------------------

Another thing…there was a lot of discussion and research done a few months back on the main thread about the blood on the mattress. IIRC, the results were that on June 5th there was no way the ALE could tell if that was Human or Dogs blood just by looking. The mattress would have had to be tested. If I can stay logged on today I’ll ask over there.

******* the search of the Sloots was on June 15th.

Will get back to you when I can find anything else. There was a rumor or speculation that the mattress could have come from the HI, but I think it was found too far away. Maybe ******* has more idea on just where Grapefield Beach is. And if the Visibility T-shirt was found the same day or in the same area. It was reported to have some sort of forensics.

[MumInOhio]

Found this from August....

Aruba 08/06/05
Searchers Continue Combing Landfill
 
 
 
 
 
A judge has ruled that Aruban police can share information with the FBI about Natalee Holloway. The ruling strikes down a motion that sought to prevent the American agency from gaining access to investigation files.

Meanwhile, searchers continued combing a landfill in the area for anything that might shed light on the Clinton native's disappearance. A witness claims he saw three men dump what appeared to be a body shortly after 18-year-old Holloway vanished. One member of the Texas-based group Equusearch says he believes the witness' claim because he has been taking part in search efforts at the landfill every day along with other volunteers.

"You figure if someone is lying about it, why would they continue to come out there and dig and dig and dig? They wouldn't have any reason to. He's right alongside us, breathing the same stuff and digging as hard as he can. He's getting down in the holes and digging through stuff that we don't wanna do," said John Huston of Equusearch.

[Observer]

******* the search of the Sloots was on June 15th. Wink

Will get back to you when I can find anything else. There was a rumor or speculation that the mattress could have come from the HI, but I think it was found too far away. Maybe ******* has more idea on just where Grapefield Beach is. And if the Visibility T-shirt was found the same day or in the same area. It was reported to have some sort of forensics.
------------------------------
Your right,the 15th 

They arrested the 2 guards in the AM a few hours later they found the Blood soaked Mattress,Dead Dog and Sandles,then a few hours later they held a press conference sayin the Mattress is unrelated to the case as it was dogs blood.

Grapefield Beach is on the very southern part of the island not to far from the VCB Shirt and other items found the next day on June 6th 2005. "Another search took place near Weg Fontein Rd. Here Volunteers,Police and Warda Nos Costa members started searching intensely after police received a suspicious phone call. According to officials,an anxious sounding person told them to focus on the area of Weg Fontein"
After talking with Aruban authorities, Tacopina says his investigators believe the suspect, identified only as "G-V-C," was picked up because of a T-shirt with "relevant forensic information."

[MumInOhio]

Kiwi...the articles I found on the landfill are dated 7/31 and 8/2 IIRC. the one above said continuing.

Did find that the mattress was posted about at noon on the Front page and by 3PM it was determined to be dog's blood. I didn't think Aruba could move that fast.

Will put a post on the main thread to see if any Monkeys bite, but I'm still scanning the FP about the landfill searches.

[Observer]

On June 7th 2005,The Newspaper Awemainta said Natalee was dead. The next day they said they made a mistake and it was actually a 16 year old boy who died.

[MumInOhio]

Hi *******……looks like you and I have been reading the same things.

Found this scanning the Front Page posts in date order:

June 5th
                  1. Mattress found at around noon and not related to Natalee
                  2. Dompig says hold your breath  for 24 hours-there are developements

June 7th…     1. local boy found dead … Not Natalee
             …    2. accidental death not ruled out by authorities
                   3. rumor that search called off

June 9th…..J2Ks arrested

June 10th…    1. press briefing cancelled - no reason given
                   2. sightings of Natalee