Caylee Marie Anthony- MURDER TRIAL- DAY 22- 6/18 - 6/19/11

[flamom]

Besides his info at the bottom, which is found all over the net, I found that he helped identify 184 out of 189 victims from the 9/11 attack on the Pentagon. Maybe he left UT to work for the government.

http://www.theabfa.org/diplomates.html

Office of the Armed Force Medical Examiner
1413 Research Boulevard, Bldg. 102
Rockville, MD 20850
E-mail: william.c.rodriguez1@us.army.mil
(301) 319-0000

thank you for looking Titch

Anytime! I'm worried but I know the Prosecution can handle it.

I have no proof, but you know that feeling when you know something just aint right?
and it wasnt his dyed hair or his looks.. something isnt right

[Aurelia7]

got some "technical" questions if someone would be kind enough to help me

So the jurors are not allowed to talk amongst themselves about the case - even at night & on Sundays?

Do they mingle with each other at night & on Sundays or stay in a secluded room by themselves?

I understand if they need a transcript during deliberation they can ask for it but if they're not taking notes how in the heck are they going to remember dates & pertinent points.  After awhile it all has to run together.  I always thought ALL of the transcripts were there in the deliberation room & they just kind went over everything again.

thx for helping me - I just don't have time these days to spend hours researching - figure you smart monkeys could answer it in about 30 seconds!

Beth, I think this didn't get answered because you posted right in the middle of the Super Saturday Smackdown.  I'm no expert, but I'll take a stab at it:  It is my understanding that jurors are never allowed to talk about the case amongst themselves prior to deliberations.  I don't know at all if they mingle beyond lunch breaks but do believe that they are secluded at the hotel from outsiders with exception of family members visiting.  The jurors are allowed to take notes during the trial, but the notebooks have to remain on their court room seats while court is in recess.

I hope that helped.  And hopefully another monkey here can provide better insight.

OMG, I finally figured out why they like to "sidebar" so much. there's a hookah over there, and Bozo will do anything for another hit. And today, Judge is not in a good mood. He should have a ruler out for hand smackin'.

   LOL...I was sure you were kidding, but when they went to sidebar I found myself looking for said hookah.  Hee.

[islandmonkey]

The other thing that stood out for me when Spitz was testifying is when Jeff asked him if he knew about the events before death and he said "you mean about giving her to the Nanny?".

The dufense has not even shared with him the new molested, drowning,Vasco,  Kronkafied theory that they are using.  Spitz is still spinning the tale of the Nanny who applied duct tape to Caylee rather than V2 of what happened according to the dufense.

My daughter walked by my computer when Mumbles was on and her reaction was "who is Mumbledore"?

Except the drowning theory. They must have mentioned that, because he said he "saw a pool and realized there could have been a drowning" or something to that effect. I mean, this is like saying "I saw a dog and thought maybe it mauled her." IT COULD HAVE BEEN ANYTHING. But he (the witness) also said "All pieces of the puzzle must fit". Well, how does the duct tape fit with drowning, or mauling, or even choking on food?!" He contridicted himself with that, and I hope the jury caught it!

OMG~Can't believe you picked that as one of something he would state. I lived in Memphis when the West Memphis Three case happend and it was a horrific crime, I remember Spitz theory about dogs and the 3 boys and thought it was insanity, the boys were not missing but about 18 hrs before found, hot tied with their own shoe laces and dumped in a creek in Robin Hood Park, yet Spitz thought their injuried were consistent with a dog mauling...no chit!

 ::snipping2::

I am copying and pasting her transcribed notes below so you can read about how Spitz believes a large dog was responsible for inflicting the injuries on the boys, including fractures to their skulls.

 ::snipping2::


ME.....but then the dogs put the 3 boys back in the creek? Wonder if the dog hog tied them too

 ::snipping2::

this, Defense then presented a number of photos of the boys and the injuries they sustained. . Per Spitz, all of the wounds were attributed to animal predation. He said it was the work of a large animal, most likely a dog. He even said that some injuries were consistent with having been made by minnows [such as injuries to the lips, eyelids, and ears of the boys]. When asked if injuries found on the ears could be attributed to having been forced to perform oral sex, Spitz disagreed with this as he said injuries would have had to have been found on both ears, not just one. Other injuries, such as indentations on the skulls and extension fractures, were caused by an animal shaking a victim in its mouth, causing them to strike nearby objects [trees, rocks, the ditch itself]. There were also puncture wounds attributed to the 'lake knife,' which Spitz said were made by the incisors of a large animal. He was asked repeatedly if any of the injuries were made by other 'mechanisms' such as a knife, tree limb, fist, etc., and he steadfastly kept with the theory that all injuries were consistent with animal predation. Burnett and the state also kept asking Spitz to name the 'large animal' he kept referring to, and again, he stated it was a dog or other type of animal like a dog [coyote]. Spitz said he was not certain what animal had done it, but he was certain it wasn't a knife or other weapon. The injuries to Christopher Byers' genital area as well as those to Stevie Branch's lip were also shown consistent with a dog or dog-like animal. There were also injuries to the scalp that Spitz said held tooth marks. Death, according to Peretti, occurred as a result of the injuries sustained by physical injuries. However, Spitz insisted that death occurred due to all three victims drowning. He also stated that the bites attributed to dogs could 'pass' as knife wounds. Burnett asked if Spitz would have considered the deaths 'homicides,' and if he would note thusly on the death certificates. To this, Spitz answered that he would have noted death was 'undetermined.' Other wounds attributed to animals were the injuries to Stevie Branch's face. Spitz determined these were caused by the rough tongue of an animal 'licking' the face. Spitz was asked about Fogleman's 'grapefruit' exercise during the original hearing. He was then asked if this was something he would do. To which he responded that he would not. He said it would have and should have been appropriate to use the skin or bones of a pig [which, he said, were closest in skin consistency to humans].

 ::snipping2::

What trash, UNDETERMINED DEATH???? They were hog tied, naked and tossed in a creek or ditch that was flooded IIRC along with their bikes, how on earth is tha not a MURDER???


http://paradiselost3.com/index.php?action=printpage;topic=1865.0

Funny you say this bc I followed this case closely. DNA testing wasn't intricate like it's become now compared to back then. None of the DNA from the crime scene is linked to any of the 3 men (were teens at the time) that have been in prison for about 20 years. The Innocense Project supplied testing and alot of famous people got on board to get all 3 of these now men new trials for exhonoration. You see, some DNA found in a sperm sample taken off of one of the young boy victims was traced to that young boy's stepfather. Because of the notoriety associated with the case, several media outlets jumped onboard with bring anti dp. Remember back when Dawson's Creek was on tv? Well, they wore tshirts asking for their exhonorations. They were the WB. Warner owns alot. They merged with CBS. I believe they are all affiliated with each other: TRUtv, CNN, etc. Most are anti dp. This is why I jeep harping about anti dp groups. They stick together & the money can't be compared. If Casey ends up getting the dp, the Innocense Project will pay for her appeal. They honestly believe that if just 1 person is sentenced to death and that person ends up being exhonorated due to better technology, but that person has already died, then they shouldn't be sentenced to death at all...if there's even an inkling of a question.

I think of something happening to my children & it scares me that I know I believe in vengence.

I did too, I had a young child and worked downtown and from the 27th floor we could see West Memphis and all the kerfluffle, I know the celebrities are all over exonerating these boys, but I had a friend send me Jesse Miskelly's 4rd confession and have to say I think the 3 in jail are guilty. I know they found DNA (although unsure it was from sperm since the boys were in found in a creek) of one of the boy's stefather, but I believe it was in a shoelace the boys were hog tied with, and as a parent I am sure my DNA would be on my kids shoelaces and many other items, add to that all of Damien Echols past problems and trouble, his stays in the mental wards not just in Ar, but in Oregon (going from memory here, but it was either OR ar CA), and I could see how he couls do something this heinous...his family history etc., even the fact his mother was afriad of him and though he coulde harm the other kids makes me confident they are all guilty. I do know about all the issues raised about the man in the fast food restaurant with blood all over him, but that park wasn't a place IMO a drifter would just wander into, more of a hangout for locals.

If the innocence project jumps in to try and save Casey I will spit nails across the room....

ITA with you about that feeling of vengance, been there and done that and my son wasn't murdered just sexually abused, but the idea of driving over his monster, backing up and smashing his brain un between two cars crossed my mind once when I saw him in a parking lot.....obviously I didn't do it, but the fact I considered it scared me, and I had my kids in the car. My son was 4 and asked if we could throw eggs at him and I said no, then he asked why can't he just die or be killed", all I could think of was crap....he was reading my mind. I knew I had to move so I'd never see that monster again and my son would never accidentally run into him (literally and metaphorically)

[klaasend]

Caylees body was found 8905 Suburban Dr.....Caylees birthday 8/9/05 coincidence ?

 

Wonder how far back the computer forensics people went?  Casey would have had to look up the lot number.  And if I remember correctly, computer forensics went back to March.  This is either a coincidence ... or more proof of premeditation ... and premeditated way before anyone thought? ...

Didn't you dedicated monkeys also have a discussion way back when about 2 properties right there containing the names Zenaida and Gonzalez?  Seems to me I remember some talk about that but maybe I am confused???

Diabolical and premeditated for sure.

Yes, SM front page but there was more to that theory than the 8905.

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/10/could-zenaida-gonzalez-have-been-code-for-caylee-anthonys-location-and-not-just-a-nannys-name/

[pharlap]

Besides his info at the bottom, which is found all over the net, I found that he helped identify 184 out of 189 victims from the 9/11 attack on the Pentagon. Maybe he left UT to work for the government.

http://www.theabfa.org/diplomates.html

Office of the Armed Force Medical Examiner
1413 Research Boulevard, Bldg. 102
Rockville, MD 20850
E-mail: william.c.rodriguez1@us.army.mil
(301) 319-0000

  Bless Dr Rodriguez for identifying victims of the 9/11 attack.

My question is though, why would the military let him become a (non paid) witness for the prosecution of a baby killer? If I were Mr Rodriguez I would run faster than a rabbit being chased by a whippet because that is what he will become when Mr Ashton gets to him.

I am very dumb about the military, but I just don't see them letting their experts become witnesses in a non military/war trial.


JMSO JSM

Could be that's why he's not getting paid.  Maybe taking vacation days for this.
Your right thou, why would he even get involved.
 

[alagary]

Caylees body was found 8905 Suburban Dr.....Caylees birthday 8/9/05 coincidence ?

 

Wonder how far back the computer forensics people went?  Casey would have had to look up the lot number.  And if I remember correctly, computer forensics went back to March.  This is either a coincidence ... or more proof of premeditation ... and premeditated way before anyone thought? ...

Didn't you dedicated monkeys also have a discussion way back when about 2 properties right there containing the names Zenaida and Gonzalez?  Seems to me I remember some talk about that but maybe I am confused???

Diabolical and premeditated for sure.

Here's the article;http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/10/could-zenaida-gonzalez-have-been-code-for-caylee-anthonys-location-and-not-just-a-nannys-name/

[flamom]

https://thejbmission.wordpress.com/
Monkeys recieve a mention from this pro Bobo site   

[Cappuccino]

KBelichWFTV Kathi Belich, WFTV
Dr. Werner Spitz complimented Jeff Ashton on his cross examination afterward.. Baez pushed me out of his way as I interviewed Spitz unhappy

http://twitter.com/#!/KBelichWFTV

Legally isn't a "push" an assault?

Wow just wow   Well, yea it could be considered as one

[Titch]

I feel the same way IM. The feeling raises the little hairs on the back of my neck. He is part of a select group of forensic pathologists/anthropologists/examiners that firmly believes evidence needs to be completely proven 100% or the dp shouldn't be on the table. What some people may not realize is that if the State wasn't putting the dp on the table, these famous experts woulda stayed home & declined coming on board. That's my very honest opinion. You see, I don't think any care if Casey is sentenced to multiple years in prison, it's obvious she's guilty, but the Defense still wins even if she's sentenced to lwop...bc in that case they'd have spared her life.

[Cappuccino]

someone else feels the same way


http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139916&page=6
Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysgirl 
Maybe it was the way he started. It just really rubbed me the wrong way. to start out saying "I'm an unpaid consultant" just said to me that he was going to go against what Dr. Vass/Dr. Bass said. What I want to know is why he left the body farm. something is just not right about this guy, IMO.

ITA   an axe to grind for certain & he better rethink how much he wants to lie after this deposition.   His intent has nothing to do with the evidence in this case & he lied his bum off on the stand.

[islandmonkey]

I feel the same way IM. The feeling raises the little hairs on the back of my neck. He is part of a select group of forensic pathologists/anthropologists/examiners that firmly believes evidence needs to be completely proven 100% or the dp shouldn't be on the table. What some people may not realize is that if the State wasn't putting the dp on the table, these famous experts woulda stayed home & declined coming on board. That's my very honest opinion. You see, I don't think any care if Casey is sentenced to multiple years in prison, it's obvious she's guilty, but the Defense still wins even if she's sentenced to lwop...bc in that case they'd have spared her life.

I agree that is part of it, but also think they are all about fame and money....not a doubt in my mind they sold their soul to the devil and wondering how they sleep at night. FGS, he broke Caylee's skull and acted like , hell I don't remember that but oh well. I wanted to jump thru that screen and chew him up and spit him out, he had NO respect for her little body that had already been desecrated enough. 

[Titch]

Omg IM, (((hugs))) to you & your son.

For some reason, I'm remembering something about the stepfather's DNA found in sperm on a victim. Maybe I'm confusing it with another case? It'll bug me now... I just remember the new results that came out about the DNA. I must be wrong.

[Aurelia7]

 ::snipping2:: (TAQS)

Here's the article;http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/10/could-zenaida-gonzalez-have-been-code-for-caylee-anthonys-location-and-not-just-a-nannys-name/

Woah!  That's so bizarre.  So whatever came of this theory?  Is it just an odd coincedence?

[alagary]

::snipping2:: (TAQS)

Here's the article;http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/10/could-zenaida-gonzalez-have-been-code-for-caylee-anthonys-location-and-not-just-a-nannys-name/

Woah!  That's so bizarre.  So whatever came of this theory?  Is it just an odd coincedence?

Don't remember who I'm quoting but it goes something like this;
"One person knows and the bitch ain't talking"

[Titch]

Oooooh, I'm remembering something else. Caylee's skull was very white, right? It was underwater & tossed around in garbage bags, so it should be discolored somewhat. But didn't an examiner comment on how white her skull was? Usually that can happen if a skull and/or bones are left in direct sunlight for a prolonged period of time. However, Caylee's skull was in shaded brush that was underwater. So how in the world can any so called expert discount chloroform? If it was injected, it could gave bleached her skull...or no?

[Cappuccino]

Reminder:  FWIW   Judge Jeannie is having a 2 hour special right now on Foxnews cable & it repeats later

Holly Bristow from Orlando just gave a run down of what transpired today.   Now Jeanine is talking about the defense's wild accusations

[Cappuccino]

Oooooh, I'm remembering something else. Caylee's skull was very white, right? It was underwater & tossed around in garbage bags, so it should be discolored somewhat. But didn't an examiner comment on how white her skull was? Usually that can happen if a skull and/or bones are left in direct sunlight for a prolonged period of time. However, Caylee's skull was in shaded brush that was underwater. So how in the world can any so called expert discount chloroform? If it was injected, it could gave bleached her skull...or no?

If she wasnt in a blanket & then three bags it would have been stained with dirt all over it.   The plant life grew thru the bags.  Excellent point for the fools that are testifying for the defense.

[islandmonkey]

Omg IM, (((hugs))) to you & your son.

For some reason, I'm remembering something about the stepfather's DNA found in sperm on a victim. Maybe I'm confusing it with another case? It'll bug me now... I just remember the new results that came out about the DNA. I must be wrong.

Thanks

You could be right about that, it's just I know about the other DNA found, but it's possible that something else has been found.....but since they were in water I'd think sperm would wash off, but I could be wrong on that too...

In 2007, DNA collected from the crime scene was tested. None was found to match DNA from Echols, Baldwin, nor Misskelley.[41] In addition, a hair "not inconsistent with" Terry Hobbs, stepfather to Stevie Branch, was found tied into the knots used to bind one of the victims.[42][43] The prosecutors, while conceding that no DNA evidence ties the accused to the crime scene, has said that, "The State stands behind its convictions of Echols and his codefendants."[44]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Memphis_Three#DNA_testing_and_new_physical_evidence_.282007-2010.29

[Curly]

Oooooh, I'm remembering something else. Caylee's skull was very white, right? It was underwater & tossed around in garbage bags, so it should be discolored somewhat. But didn't an examiner comment on how white her skull was? Usually that can happen if a skull and/or bones are left in direct sunlight for a prolonged period of time. However, Caylee's skull was in shaded brush that was underwater. So how in the world can any so called expert discount chloroform? If it was injected, it could gave bleached her skull...or no?

I've never heard that chloroform could whiten a skull. Not saying it's impossible, but as far as I know, only things like bleach whiten a skull, after it's found.

[flamom]

Reminder:  FWIW   Judge Jeannie is having a 2 hour special right now on Foxnews cable & it repeats later

Holly Bristow from Orlando just gave a run down of what transpired today.   Now Jeanine is talking about the defense's wild accusations

Thanks for the heads up.. I was watching HLN recap bugobys testimony from yesterday..as I scour the internet for Dr Rodriquez