Lively Case Discussion #604 4/25 - 4/27/2007

[BTgirl]

O/T
Report: Tainted Hogs Enter Food Supply
 
 http://apnews.excite.com/article/20070426/D8OOGLSG0.html
Email this Story

Apr 26, 4:25 PM (ET)

By ANDREW BRIDGES
 

WASHINGTON (AP) - Several hundred of the 6,000 hogs that may have eaten contaminated pet food are believed to have entered the food supply for humans, the government said Thursday.
(snipped)

Hmmm....sounds like it's a good time to become a vegetarian.

[Anna]

Interesting post from dugo on RU in response to question if Joran had sex on beach...

If we go judicial technical on this, in the Netherlands rape is defined as unwanted /sexually penetrating/ .. fingers count.

We know from Dompig's statement on US television that Joran said she was going in and out of consciousness and that is in one of his statements.

We know from Joran's statements that he penetrated her with his fingers.

Sounds like rape.

Yes, rape can even be committed with foreign objects and has been.  I am talking inanimate objects.  That is why castration does not work well for sex criminals.  

This has been Beth's point all along, that Joran confessed that first night and yet no one seems to notice.  Then he gave that lurid PV and yet again said basically the same thing--that he did things while she was going in and out of consciousness.

I think that this is a crime is very hard for some to wrap their minds around.  Makes me wonder about them.  

Dugo was one of those old RWV posters, if you will recall.  Not sure where he is coming from but at least he doesn't put up the brick wall of alleged innocence on the part of Joran no matter what Joran says or does as do so many.

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[Sam]

I just hope that if they do not close the case that Beth and Dave will still get access to all the info.

Ok this will be completley off topic but wondering if anyone will know the answers.

It has always been said Natalee did not have International calling on her cell phone. So this is hypothetical or something. Could she still have called her classmates who were there?

A couple of years ago a friend and I were disagreeing on one of his birthday parties. So he picks up my phone to prove it to me and calls his SIL. It turns out we were both right but while were talking I remembered his sil is on vacation in Hawaii. So I panic and tell him to get off my phone. He was calling her cell phone which had the same area code as us.
Now I realise Hawaii is still in the US but it is along ways off.

Does anyone understand what I am saying? or asking?

[NM]

Is Robert on the FP by any chance the Robert that used to post in the forum...with the doggy avatar looking left & right like a sailor?  Probably not....just recalling his informative posts with maps, etc.

I don't think they are the same but I could be wrong.  The Robert posting on the front page is in the Netherlands.  I don't think the Robert that posted in the forum was.

It doesn't matter, really, so I guess I shouldn't have asked...maybe the Robert who posted on the forum is reading...might be nice to know he's remembered, at the very least.   Thanks.

2NJ,
I have been wondering then same.  I miss Robert J.  Hi RobertJ <waving>

Anna,
love your Devries catching the chicken-jurin emoticon.

Hi all Monkeys.
Praying that Elizabeth on FP is correct.


JURIN, you're looking pretty weak being afraid to talk to Peter DeVries

[2NJSons_Mom]

NM, You're right...it was RobertJ....

[NM]

Sam,
IIRC Natalee could not place a call at all on her phone. Kind of like her cell phone company could not work with the local cell phone towers.


RE the O/T Tainted Hogs Enter Food Supply
Anyone see the a or pvds lately

[Dayhiker]

Interesting post from dugo on RU in response to question if Joran had sex on beach...

If we go judicial technical on this, in the Netherlands rape is defined as unwanted /sexually penetrating/ .. fingers count.

We know from Dompig's statement on US television that Joran said she was going in and out of consciousness and that is in one of his statements.

We know from Joran's statements that he penetrated her with his fingers.

Sounds like rape.

Yes, rape can even be committed with foreign objects and has been.  I am talking inanimate objects.  That is why castration does not work well for sex criminals.  

This has been Beth's point all along, that Joran confessed that first night and yet no one seems to notice.  Then he gave that lurid PV and yet again said basically the same thing--that he did things while she was going in and out of consciousness.

I think that this is a crime is very hard for some to wrap their minds around.  Makes me wonder about them.  

Dugo was one of those old RWV posters, if you will recall.  Not sure where he is coming from but at least he doesn't put up the brick wall of alleged innocence on the part of Joran no matter what Joran says or does as do so many.
.

If Dugo is right here, and as you point out in his early statements Anna,  they've had a slam dunk rape case against Joran since day one. They also have a law concerning kidnapping being charged to those last seen with an impaired person. That would apply here, too.

So what are they waiting for?

[Sam]

O/T
Report: Tainted Hogs Enter Food Supply
 
 http://apnews.excite.com/article/20070426/D8OOGLSG0.html
Email this Story

Apr 26, 4:25 PM (ET)

By ANDREW BRIDGES
 

WASHINGTON (AP) - Several hundred of the 6,000 hogs that may have eaten contaminated pet food are believed to have entered the food supply for humans, the government said Thursday.
(snipped)

Hmmm....sounds like it's a good time to become a vegetarian.

Hey Carnut, are you listening? Sounds like this could get serious for humans also.

I love meat almost as much as chocolate. LOL I could get by on vegetables though.

[Dayhiker]

I just hope that if they do not close the case that Beth and Dave will still get access to all the info.
 

Only perps and their authors get full access to the files, Sam. That's Dutch law.      

[NM]

2NJ,
I forgot about his looking sailor dog.

bbl.
keep the faith Monkeys.
Justice for Natalee

Jail for jurin

[Sam]

Sam,
IIRC Natalee could not place a call at all on her phone. Kind of like her cell phone company could not work with the local cell phone towers.


RE the O/T Tainted Hogs Enter Food Supply
Anyone see the a or pvds lately

Thanks NM.

It was just a thought. I can't get past the early phone calls. I get stuck on something and can't let it go.

[Sam]

I just hope that if they do not close the case that Beth and Dave will still get access to all the info.
 

Only perps and their authors get full access to the files, Sam. That's Dutch law.      

Then lets write a book or do we have to commit a crime first?
     

[klaasend]

Just posted on the front page of SM by Angelone (also from the NL):

yes it’s true the local and dutch authorities have announced that the case will remain open and will not be closed in 2 weeks like the van der sloot’s wanted it too, and yes a lot of new things on the case will be brought out very soon, the newspaper will publish it one of this day’s.they say the detectives sleep very little,and work long hours.

but let me comment also on the book: Joran said on Dutch tv jes he wrote the book, and that’s a lie (was to be expected right) an writter for the Revu magazine wrote the book, joran didn’t even put one word on paper or typed one and he says he wrote it for therapy, another lie…

and finally one day if he is found guilty as hell, have him send to the U.S. to be procecuted there, because if by Dutch laws he must be sentenced he will only get 20 years max for murder, that’s Dutch law for you.

[klaasend]

   

[Observer]

Interesting post from dugo on RU in response to question if Joran had sex on beach...

If we go judicial technical on this, in the Netherlands rape is defined as unwanted /sexually penetrating/ .. fingers count.

We know from Dompig's statement on US television that Joran said she was going in and out of consciousness and that is in one of his statements.

We know from Joran's statements that he penetrated her with his fingers.

Sounds like rape.

Yes, rape can even be committed with foreign objects and has been.  I am talking inanimate objects.  That is why castration does not work well for sex criminals.  

This has been Beth's point all along, that Joran confessed that first night and yet no one seems to notice.  Then he gave that lurid PV and yet again said basically the same thing--that he did things while she was going in and out of consciousness.

I think that this is a crime is very hard for some to wrap their minds around.  Makes me wonder about them.  

Dugo was one of those old RWV posters, if you will recall.  Not sure where he is coming from but at least he doesn't put up the brick wall of alleged innocence on the part of Joran no matter what Joran says or does as do so many.
.

If Dugo is right here, and as you point out in his early statements Anna,  they've had a slam dunk rape case against Joran since day one. They also have a law concerning kidnapping being charged to those last seen with an impaired person. That would apply here, too.

So what are they waiting for?

They should have already faced charges on these two accounts. Too bad people like dompig threw in evidence that Natalee was using Cocaine and that the family ruined the Investigation. Blows my mind that anyone would think that anything Dompig has to say is credible.

[klaasend]

Breaking news posted by Tjeerd at FOB:

Breaking news:  Joran remains main suspect now new clues have been found....

http://www.nrc.nl/binnenland/article700840.ece/Van_der_Sloot_blijft_hoofdverdachte

[Observer]

Sam,
IIRC Natalee could not place a call at all on her phone. Kind of like her cell phone company could not work with the local cell phone towers.


RE the O/T Tainted Hogs Enter Food Supply
Anyone see the a or pvds lately

Thanks NM.

It was just a thought. I can't get past the early phone calls. I get stuck on something and can't let it go.

Me too!! But we have a Sander Gottenboes who had his cell phone stolen that same day

[Rob]

Anna- I can confirm what Klaas said, I don't think the Families have had any contact for quite some time. There has been no communication what-so ever.

[Anna]

Interesting post from dugo on RU in response to question if Joran had sex on beach...

If we go judicial technical on this, in the Netherlands rape is defined as unwanted /sexually penetrating/ .. fingers count.

We know from Dompig's statement on US television that Joran said she was going in and out of consciousness and that is in one of his statements.

We know from Joran's statements that he penetrated her with his fingers.

Sounds like rape.

Yes, rape can even be committed with foreign objects and has been.  I am talking inanimate objects.  That is why castration does not work well for sex criminals.  

This has been Beth's point all along, that Joran confessed that first night and yet no one seems to notice.  Then he gave that lurid PV and yet again said basically the same thing--that he did things while she was going in and out of consciousness.

I think that this is a crime is very hard for some to wrap their minds around.  Makes me wonder about them.  

Dugo was one of those old RWV posters, if you will recall.  Not sure where he is coming from but at least he doesn't put up the brick wall of alleged innocence on the part of Joran no matter what Joran says or does as do so many.
.

If Dugo is right here, and as you point out in his early statements Anna,  they've had a slam dunk rape case against Joran since day one. They also have a law concerning kidnapping being charged to those last seen with an impaired person. That would apply here, too.

So what are they waiting for?

I, too, have read those Dutch laws concerning the last seen with a person who disappears, etc. and just never understood why nothing applied in the case of Joran.  Also in instances of an adult disappearing with no money, clothing, transportation, etc. there is no waiting period as Aruba claimed for the person to be declared in an emergency kidnapped or at the least missing and start action immediately.

I don't care how many tourists decide to extend their vacation, when they vanish without means of support, not speaking the language, etc. they should have acted instantly.

And as you say, what are they waiting for with Joran?  I have to think it is because ALE and KJ just don't consider what he did as illegal even though it obviously is.  You can't go poking anything into an unconscious person anywhere in the civilized world without violating some law or other.

Even touching an unconscious person in an inappropriate manner is an assault at the least if done in an intrusive or abusive manner.  Anything other than to render first aid, for example.  Even kissing an unconscious person is what I mean for example.

Who would want some jerk mauling them if they were passed out?  I also think people who can't understand why this is wrong probably do things like that themselves.  That's why they don't want to call it wrong but it is and it is also illegal.

.

[Sam]

*******,

 I was under the impression the ALE were trying to get more info on a murder because of Dutch law saying if they tried them for rape they could not upgrade the charges later.