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Author Topic: Lively Case Discussion #605 4/27 - 4/27/2007PM  (Read 147933 times)
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yapperz1
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« Reply #160 on: April 27, 2007, 12:37:40 PM »

Hiya Monkeys

Sounds like there is finally some real investigating going on in Natalee's case.
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I STAND WITH THE GIRL, NATALEE HOLLOWAY

ARUBA
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« Reply #161 on: April 27, 2007, 12:38:50 PM »

Quote from: "friend of monkeys"
i gotta go......i am sooooooo glad i went to the library today...just to be here w/ all u monkeys for this moment....

Prayers for Natalee and her family.
I hope they get justice and answers soon


Good to see you FOM.
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NM
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« Reply #162 on: April 27, 2007, 12:38:58 PM »

Quote from: "BTgirl"
You know that quote I used to have in my sig line - "What you think about is what expands in your life." Well, I really believe that - that we help create what happens by what we think.

Let's all think that there will finally be justice for Natalee and that it will be now.  Smile


Great idea BT
I'm going to keep visualizing what I want.
b/c in the past I let all the mixed info get my hopes and images down before the actual bad news

pvds, jurin and all others question, imprisoned, prosecuted, and imprissoned.
And mostly Natalee returned home.
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Glenda wrote: "aruba's job was not to babysit Beth's daughter. Beth sent her daughter to swim with the sharks, she is responsible for what ever happened to Natalee." = there is no homicide in aruba, only SUICIDE.  Don't go to aruba if you value your life.
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« Reply #163 on: April 27, 2007, 12:39:08 PM »

Quote from: "AZSunny"
Quote from: "Rob"
still searching around the house of VDS for Natalee.... thats what he said...

for natalee!!!!


Are you sure??  that is so huge!!  Check that cement work and the cistern!!!


Yes, and while they are at it,  remove that lil ole shed look under the floor!
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Maine, born and raised!
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« Reply #164 on: April 27, 2007, 12:39:54 PM »

Quote from: "LilPuma"
Just got an e-mail with the news and stopped in to say

YIPPPEEEEEEEEEEE

I think my deceased grandparents, who came here from Holland, have been watching over me as I follow this case.  I hope they bopped a few Dutchmen on the head to encourage them to do the right thing and not embarrass the Dutch any further.  I'm getting a craving for some Edam and Amstel Light.



Yes, Lil Puma, we Amercian Dutchies have taken a beating over this and handled it pretty good natured ly.  I may still have to send the Vanderslice cousins to visit DAYHIKER and explain to him how not all Dutch are stupid, "Dutch ugly" as someone called them or any of the other mean things said about them ALL and as a WHOLE constantly.  Wink  (just kidding, Dayhiker!) I could be a poster child for them and look more Dutch than most in the homeland.  When you have relatives with a name that means the same as van der Sloot, it feels personal sometimes.

My grandparents were much like yours sound and would be spinning in their graves if they could see Holland right now.  Had a grandfather who read the Bible four hours a day after he retired.  

Some Dutch have not only intelligence but morals as well.  Let's hope the KLPD has some of those in Aruba right now.

I continue to hope they will do the right thing in this but like those who bash the Dutch, I am disappointed in what they seem to have become with the drugs and prostitution both of which I vehemently oppose.  I have that same trait of not ever wanting to tell another person what to do so I understand how they got into this big mess as a nation but hope there are enough left to pull the whole country out of the morass it has sunk to.  It is one of the few countries in Old Europe at least trying to stand up to the Muslims taking over there.

They ARE excellent business people even globally, big leader economically for such a tiny, tiny country.  I am hoping if nothing else the Almighty Dollar will make them do the right thing.  It would be nice for it to come from a moral perspective, too.

Hang in there.  You are not alone in being an American Dutchie.  We may not be much but at least we're Dutch can be our slogan!   Wink

Please, Please Dear God, let them do the right thing in this!  We need to let them know we are watching, too.  Never hurts to let folks know it will be a global embarrassment if they fail.
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All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
Atlmetroguy
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« Reply #165 on: April 27, 2007, 12:40:27 PM »

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msmarple
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« Reply #166 on: April 27, 2007, 12:41:06 PM »

I'm sorry, this is mundane compared to what's going on, but I started this on the previous thread (and lost the subsequent post, the Pap translation, in the thread change  Crying or Very sad  ... not easy - the online Pap translator doesn't maintain the paragraph breaks. Nor the capitalization.)

Emphasis added by me.

http://www.diario-aruba.com/2007/4/27/

Quote
Si autoridad Mericano no worde poni na haltura
CASO NAMDAR POR DESTRUI ARUBA
*Ministerio Publico mester evita segundo Holloway
*Carta Namdar cu ta contene delito skirbi na Merca


ORANJESTAD(AAN)— Manera DIARIO a demostra ayera cu su relato exclusivo entorno e elementonan basico cu mester sostene e investigacion di Namdar/Royal Caribbean, experticio ta worde presenta. Informacionnan cu DIARIO a ricibi awor ta mustra cu si autoridad Mericano no worde poni na haltura awor di e investigacionnan cu ta tuma lugar y Ministerio Publico no involucra instancianan Mericano pa yuda den e investigacion, e caso Namdar por destrui Aruba. “Ministerio Publico mester evita cu den vista di Merca Caso Namdar ta bira un segundo Holloway,” informantenan a indica na DIARIO.

E Leynan na Merca cu ta regla e relacionnan entre comerciantenan y mundo politico ta sumamente estricto. Internacionalmente instancianan di persecucion legal ta coopera cu otro den casonan di investigacion, cu ta traspasa frontera.

Manera expertonan a mustra cu Holloway tabata tin erornan grandi cometi. Por ehempel a permiti testigonan clave bandona Aruba sin bon interogacion. Esey a haci cu te awe e caso no tin conclusion y cu e imagen di Aruba a worde seriamente afecta na Merca. Esaki no pa motibo cu un caso te awor aparente di criminalidad a keda registra, pero pa e hecho cu no por a yega na un conclusion te awe.

Si awor resulta cu caso Namdar tambe ta bira un fracaso pa loke ta trata investigacion, e reputacion di Aruba como un estado di derecho por worde destrui definitivamente, manera a worde adverti door di e expertonan.

Aunke ainda no por bisa con Ministerio Publico realmente ta atende cu e caso Namdar, e advertencia mester worde lanza cu ya e instancianan hudicial federal, di estadonan y condadonan Mericano, caminda e companianan Mericano en cuestion ta legalmente estableci, oficialmente mester a worde poni na haltura cu tin un investigacion andando na Aruba. Mester a habri e caminda pa autoridad Mericano asumi su responsabilidad den e caso aki.

“E contenido di e carta di Namdar cu ta ofrece placa di campaña na un partido politico (sea cual sea) ta un violacion di Ley. E carta a worde skirbi ariba teritorio Mericano y manda Aruba. Negociacionnan y encuentronan a tuma lugar na Merca. Si tin algo ilegal den e asunto aki, e ta nifica cu e delitonan a tuma lugar parcialmente ariba teritorio Mericano,” manera informantenan a mustra.

Na Merca, Leynan sumamente estricto ta worde manteni pa loke ta trata corupcion. Un persona cu ofrece un empleado publico Cinco Dollar pa usa baño, ya por worde culpa di a trata di cumpra e empleado publico. Ministerio Publico y Gobierno di un pais ta worde suponi di ta conciente di Leynan vigente na otro pais, especialmente un pais cu cual tin cooperacion hudicial a base di tratadonan.

Si resulta cu autoridad Mericano no a worde poni oficialmente na haltura di e sucesonan, cu lo conduci na investigacionnan confidencial na Merca, e relacion entre Merca y Reino por worde afecta y Aruba por sufri daño irreparabel. E cooperacion entre Merca y Aruba ta manifesta su mes den e presencia di Inmigracion Mericano na Aruba, cu ta algo sumamente importante pa Aruba ya cu e ta duna muestra cu ora Merca a alcanza e acuerdo aki cu Aruba, e tabata tin confianza den Aruba. E presencia di Inmigracion Mericano na Aruba tabata sumamente importante pa turismo, ya cu no solamente e ta un facilidad pa Mericanonan cu hasta di transito ta bini Aruba pa scapa di filanan largo na Merca, pero tambe ta duna credibilidad na Aruba.

E hecho cu autoridad hudicial na Aruba ta capaz pa atende cu criminalidad, a worde cuestiona aña pasa den e caso Holloway. Seguridad ta un asunto sumamente importante na Merca.

“Cooperacion hudicial entre paisnan ta algo sumamente normal na paisnan democratico. Si e caso Namdar oficialmente no a worde presenta na instancianan hudicial Mericano, cu tambe mester participa den e investigacion, e por tin consecuencia serio pa Aruba,” expertonan a adverti.

Un reaccion Mericano lo bay pa medio di Reino ya cu ariba tereno diplimatico e relacion entre e paisnan ta un asunto di Reino. No Aruba so, pero Reino Hulandes lo por ta den un problema serio si den e investigacion di un supuesto acto sumamente grave segun Leynan Mericano, autoridad Mericano no ta inclui.

Ta costumber cu autoridad local no ta duna apertura na desaroyo di investigacionnan cu e frecuencia cu esey ta socede na otro paisnan, caminda Ministerio Publico ta tene comunidad na haltura di e investigacion cu e ta realiza y con e progreso ta sin stroba su continuacion. Esey ta haci cu ta dificil bisa, si Merca ta na haltura di e investigacion, cu mester inclui reunionnan, actonan y hasta acuerdonan cu a worde alcanza ariba teritorio Mericano.

E carta di Namdar, firma na Merca, mester a bay pa autoridadnan Mericano menciona. Manera e experto a apunta, especialmente na Estado di New York, caminda e oficinanan di Namdar ta estableci, hopi accion contra criminalidad a tuma lugar pa demostra mundo cu New York no ta tolera criminalidad.

Mester tene e asuntonan aki bon na vista, segun expertonan, cu a indica cu Namdar por resulta peor cu Holloway pa Aruba y por ta destructivo pa e pais.


Online Pap translation:

if autoridad mericano not worde poni at height
caso namdar can destrui aruba
*ministerio publico have to evita second holloway
*carta namdar cu is contene delito write at merca


oranjestad(aan)— as daily paper owing to demostra yesterday cu his relato exclusivo entorno the elementonan basico cu have to sostene the investigacion of namdar/royal caribbean, experticio is worde present. informacionnan cu daily paper owing to ricibi now is show cu if autoridad mericano not worde poni at height now of the investigacionnan cu is take lugar y ministerio publico not involucra instancianan mericano for help in the investigacion, the caso namdar can destrui aruba. “ministerio publico have to evita cu in vista of merca caso namdar is become one second holloway,” informantenan owing to indica at daily paper.

the leynan at merca cu is regulation the relacionnan among comerciantenan y world politico is extremely estricto. internacionalmente instancianan of persecucion legal is coopera cu another in casonan of investigacion, cu is traspasa boundary.

as expertonan owing to show cu holloway was have erornan big cometi. for example owing to permiti testigonan clave bandona aruba without good interogacion. esey owing to haci cu till today the caso not have conclusion y cu the imagen of aruba owing to worde seriamente afecta at merca. this not for motibo cu one caso till now aparente of criminalidad owing to stay registra, but for her mature cu not can owing to arrive at one conclusion till today.

if now resulta cu caso namdar also is become one fracaso for thing is deal investigacion, the reputacion of aruba because; one estado of derecho can worde destrui definitely, as owing to worde adverti door of the expertonan.

although still not can tell con ministerio publico genuinely is atende cu the caso namdar, the advertencia have to worde lanza cu already the instancianan hudicial federal, of estadonan y condadonan mericano, caminda the companianan mericano provided that cuestion is legalmente estableci, oficialmente have to owing to worde poni at height cu have one investigacion andando at aruba. have to owing to open the caminda for autoridad mericano asumi his responsabilidad in the caso here.

“e contenido of the carta of namdar cu is ofrece coin of campaña at one faction politico (sea cual sea) is one violacion of ley. the carta owing to worde write upstairs territory mericano y send aruba. negociacionnan y encuentronan did take lugar at merca. if have algo ilegal in the asunto here, the is nifica cu the delitonan did take lugar parcialmente upstairs territory mericano,” as informantenan owing to show.

at merca, leynan extremely estricto is worde manteni for thing is deal corupcion. one person cu ofrece one employee publico cinco dollar for using bathroom {??}, already can worde culpa of owing to deal of cumpra the employee publico. ministerio publico y gobierno of one country is worde suponi of is conciente of leynan vigente at another country, especialmente one country cu cual have cooperacion hudicial owing to base of tratadonan.

if resulta cu autoridad mericano not owing to worde poni oficialmente at height of the sucesonan, cu will conduci at investigacionnan confidencial at merca, the relacion among merca y kingdom can worde afecta y aruba can abide damage irreparabel. the cooperacion among merca y aruba is manifesta his self in the presencia of inmigracion mericano at aruba, cu is algo extremely important for aruba already cu the is give sample cu hour merca owing to alcanza the acuerdo here cu aruba, the was have confianza in aruba. the presencia of inmigracion mericano at aruba was extremely important for turism, already cu not only the is one facilidad for mericanonan cu even of transito is come aruba for scapa of filanan largo at merca, but also is give credibilidad at aruba.

the mature cu autoridad hudicial at aruba is capaz for atende cu criminalidad, owing to worde cuestiona year happen in the caso holloway. seguridad is one asunto extremely important at merca.

“cooperacion hudicial among paisnan is algo extremely normal at paisnan democratico. if the caso namdar oficialmente not owing to worde present at instancianan hudicial mericano, cu also have to participa in the investigacion, the can have consecuencia earnest for aruba,” expertonan owing to adverti.

one reaccion mericano will bay by kingdom already cu upstairs territory diplimatico the relacion among the paisnan is one asunto of kingdom. not aruba only, but kingdom dutch will can is in one problem earnest if in the investigacion of one supuesto acto extremely important according leynan mericano, autoridad mericano do not inclui.

is costumber cu autoridad local do not give aperture at desaroyo of investigacionnan cu the frecuencia cu esey is socede at another paisnan, caminda ministerio publico is as comunidad at height of the investigacion cu the is realiza y con the advance is without stroba his continuacion. esey is haci cu is dificil tell, if merca is at height of the investigacion, cu have to inclui reunionnan, actonan y even acuerdonan cu owing to worde alcanza upstairs territory mericano.

the carta of namdar, company at merca, have to owing to bay for autoridadnan mericano menciona. as the experto owing to apunta, especialmente pregnant of new york, caminda the oficinanan of namdar is estableci, much accion contra criminalidad did take lugar for demostra world cu new york do not tolera criminalidad.

have to as the asuntonan here good at vista, according expertonan, cu owing to indica cu namdar can resulta worse cu holloway for aruba y can is destructivo for her country.

***
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Why did they have to disappear her body?

Murder & Crime on  Aruba Summary - http://tinyurl.com/2lhukn

My usual avatar is an orchis simia (monkey orchid) plant.
BTgirl
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« Reply #167 on: April 27, 2007, 12:43:22 PM »

Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy
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I Stand With The Girl
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« Reply #168 on: April 27, 2007, 12:44:01 PM »

Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy

*****************
I was surprised I found it again..it was like 3 hard drives ago...lol..
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« Reply #169 on: April 27, 2007, 12:44:58 PM »

Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy

*****************
I was surprised I found it again..it was like 3 hard drives ago...lol..


After I read what I wrote, I could picture my smart-mouthed hubby saying, "Okay, you're a holiday avatar."  Rolling Eyes  Laughing
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Atlmetroguy
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« Reply #170 on: April 27, 2007, 12:46:50 PM »

Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy

*****************
I was surprised I found it again..it was like 3 hard drives ago...lol..


After I read what I wrote, I could picture my smart-mouthed hubby saying, "Okay, you're a holiday avatar."  Rolling Eyes  Laughing

*******************
heh..heh...A man after my own heart!!! I was thinking the same thing!!
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klaasend
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WWW
« Reply #171 on: April 27, 2007, 12:47:08 PM »

Nothing new being reported at FOB or RU.
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LilPuma
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« Reply #172 on: April 27, 2007, 12:48:19 PM »

Thanks, Anna, for the encouraging words!   Unlike many immigrants today, my grandparents wanted their children to be American.  Speak English, become American.  Which is why I couldn't find any relatives who speak Dutch.  They grew up learning only a little and probably remember almost nothing.  But the Dutch did fight the Nazi's (waves to France) and they could (and I think are) helping our Army Corps of Engineers with the whole dike thing.  They can open and close theirs when needed, developed after the 1953 deadly flood, something which allows their rivers and farmlands and wetlands to remain, while preventing the sea from retaking the country when the North Sea surges.  

I was googling for something on Joran in The Netherlands from TODAY.  Didn't find anything, but here is a crime site from NL.  There IS a story dated today about Joran's recent interviews.  Thought Klaas or someone might like to save the link and check it periodically.  


http://www.crimesite.nl/index.php
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msmarple
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« Reply #173 on: April 27, 2007, 12:48:49 PM »

For what it's worth - Blood lingers for decades, and it's harder to remove than most people think. It's there, even if you can't see it, or it's washed and painted over. Really hard to remove from most surfaces.

If anyone reads/hears anything covering all the windows etc. - they're looking for blood with luminol. (sp?)

Do we know if they're searching INSIDE AND OUTSIDE?

If they find a spec - a hair, anything - that puts her in that house or yard, that's all she wrote.
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Why did they have to disappear her body?

Murder & Crime on  Aruba Summary - http://tinyurl.com/2lhukn

My usual avatar is an orchis simia (monkey orchid) plant.
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« Reply #174 on: April 27, 2007, 12:50:51 PM »

Quote from: "msmarple"
For what it's worth - Blood lingers for decades, and it's harder to remove than most people think. It's there, even if you can't see it, or it's washed and painted over. Really hard to remove from most surfaces.

If anyone reads/hears anything covering all the windows etc. - they're looking for blood with luminol. (sp?)

Do we know if they're searching INSIDE AND OUTSIDE?

If they find a spec - a hair, anything - that puts her in that house or yard, that's all she wrote.


Yep, I love that story on TV they've shown a few times where they recently used luminol to show blood on the floor boards and "dry well" in the Lizzie Borden house. And that's been over 100 years ago.
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crazybabyborg
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« Reply #175 on: April 27, 2007, 12:52:03 PM »

Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy

*****************
I was surprised I found it again..it was like 3 hard drives ago...lol..

 Laughing Gotcha saved and you'll have something in the lounge tomorrow!  Wink
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msmarple
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« Reply #176 on: April 27, 2007, 12:52:47 PM »

Anna, Puma - I may be wrong about this, but my perception is that Amsterdam is not like most of The Netherlands.

In much the same way that NYC or LA are not like most of the USA. Cities (anywhere) of that size don't accurately reflect their countries.
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Why did they have to disappear her body?

Murder & Crime on  Aruba Summary - http://tinyurl.com/2lhukn

My usual avatar is an orchis simia (monkey orchid) plant.
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« Reply #177 on: April 27, 2007, 12:53:39 PM »

Quote from: "BTgirl"
The latest:

Mike, this is what I've found out officially: When the investigators were about to go to Paulus's house, they picked him up at the Courthouse (remember he is a practicing lawyer now) to inform him of what they were going to do and for him to go to his house. He went there, saw what was happening and then left the premises. If he was arrested afterwards is not known, but up to that point he had not been taken in for questioning. Soon, we will have a lot more information on this very important move by the Dutch investigators.


It is a small island and Paulus is connected. He knew this search was coming before they started. The search was delayed several hours.
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« Reply #178 on: April 27, 2007, 12:53:58 PM »

Quote from: "crazybabyborg"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Quote from: "BTgirl"
Quote from: "Atlmetroguy"
Testing...testing...is thing on? Checking to see if the avatar loaded...


Now CBB can make you a holiday avatar!  Very Happy

*****************
I was surprised I found it again..it was like 3 hard drives ago...lol..

 Laughing Gotcha saved and you'll have something in the lounge tomorrow!  Wink

************************
Awwww Thanks CBB!!
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« Reply #179 on: April 27, 2007, 12:54:38 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
Quote from: "LilPuma"
Just got an e-mail with the news and stopped in to say

YIPPPEEEEEEEEEEE

I think my deceased grandparents, who came here from Holland, have been watching over me as I follow this case.  I hope they bopped a few Dutchmen on the head to encourage them to do the right thing and not embarrass the Dutch any further.  I'm getting a craving for some Edam and Amstel Light.



Yes, Lil Puma, we Amercian Dutchies have taken a beating over this and handled it pretty good natured ly.  I may still have to send the Vanderslice cousins to visit DAYHIKER and explain to him how not all Dutch are stupid, "Dutch ugly" as someone called them or any of the other mean things said about them ALL and as a WHOLE constantly.  Wink  (just kidding, Dayhiker!) I could be a poster child for them and look more Dutch than most in the homeland.  When you have relatives with a name that means the same as van der Sloot, it feels personal sometimes.



I'm mention again that it was a Dutchman who found a way to press the cocoa nut and make chocolate affordable and available to the masses.  Before that, it was so expensive to process that only Royalty could afford it.  Yes, folks, we owe the Dutch for CHOCKI.
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