Lively Case Discussion #611 5/1 - 5/2/2007

[Kimmy53]

Okay--just watched the newsclip posted (Fox/Birmingham, I think)

The reporter couldn't get anyone from the Aruban Prosecutor's Office on camera to talk--

good sign/bad sign/no sign?

What do you think?

JFN - I am taking it as a good sign.  I HOPE the Dutch investigators do keep close lipped about what is going on.  I take this as they are actually SERIOUS about what they are doing.

[Dihannah1]

I am sorry to be so upfront about it...No offense, just asking for people to be a little more respectful...Sometimes, when we intend to slam someone, we dont know how many people that are our friends that are sitting on the other end of the screen going, "WTF"??

Yes..I have two kiddos by two different dads..So, that is my point...we never know who we may offend.....

I consider them both blessings from God..Both have unique talents, etc....
I am not a one to condone murder, cover it up, associate with those who are..and if I am not mistaken, Beth Twitty has two different fathers for her kids...At least the young one....I highly respect her..

So, lets lay that to rest, shall we?

<sorry..Nikki cannot forget her prior mod status..lol>

  I have 2 kids with different fathers with good reason....
 Thanks Nikki

[Dihannah1]

Any comments can be made to me directly..nikkibnurse@aol.com...same AIM addy...
Other than that, Lets drop this .....

Oops, hadn't read this far yet.  

[robots]

NO talking is GOOD

 

[klaasend]

Klass, do you remember the list of young people that died?

Rob - I remember it but didn't save the list.  I think it was posted on the front page of SM, maybe by Grande.  I can check.

[Rob]

[Rob]

Klass, do you remember the list of young people that died?

Rob - I remember it but didn't save the list.  I think it was posted on the front page of SM, maybe by Grande.  I can check.

I don't need it, I just needed to know that you remembered it..

I have a suspicion.. wanna hear it?

[klaasend]

Klass, do you remember the list of young people that died?

Rob - I remember it but didn't save the list.  I think it was posted on the front page of SM, maybe by Grande.  I can check.

ROB

Grande Says:


SOURCE: MEMETOMORI FUNERAL HOME - ARUBA

EDMOND FERMIN WERLEMAN DIED JUNE 4, 2005 - AGE 35

KERWIN ANTHONY ORVILLE GOIJLA DIED JUNE 4, 2005 - AGE 17

GISELA SULAIKA LOEFSTOP DIED JUNE 15, 2005 - AGE 30

SAUL ARNOLD RAS DIED JUNE 28, 2005 - AGE 29

JASON EUGENE TIN SOENG WONG DIED JULY 10, 2005 - AGE 19

FRANCIS JAMIE NEMENCIO RASMIJN DIED JULY 20, 2005 - AGE 22

ALBERT RICHARD MARQUEZ BUSTAMANTE DIED AUGUST 25, 2005 - AGE 26

ANGELO SATURNINO GERLY DIED SEPTEMBER 14, 2005 - AGE 30

MOISES ALBERTO ROMERO GASIABURU (SP?) DIED OCTOBER 19, 2005 - AGE 34

LYSANDRA ZAHAYRA THIEL DIED NOVEMBER 1, 2005 - AGE 32

ARCADIO SABINO AMADO ROSINA DIED NOVEMBER, 19 2005 - AGE 21

JOSE FERNANDO SANCHEZ DIED NOVEMBER 26, 2005 - AGE 23

SHAILESKOEMAR BHAWEN DIED DECEMBER 25, 2005 - AGE 23

MICHALANGELO GIOVANNI CROES DIED DECEMBER 31, 2005 - AGE 33

MICHELL ANDRE HAGE ALSO DIED DECEMBER 31, 2005 - AGE 33

THINGS THAT MAKE YOU SAY HMMM…….

I AM IN THE PROCESS OF SOURCING MORE INFORMATION REGARDING THE DETAILS OF THESE INDIVIDUALS SUDDEN DEATHS.

I FIND IT QUITE DISTURBING MYSELF, CONSIDERING IT HAS BEEN SUGGESTED THAT THERE IS LITTLE CRIME ON ARUBA. HOW DID THESE 15! INDIVIDUALS ALL UNDER THE AGE OF 35 ALL COME TO SUDDEN DEATHS SHORTLY THERE AFTER THE INITIAL SURGE OF ATTENTION TO NATALEE’S CASE? MORE IMPORTANTLY PERHAPS IS WHY?
Grande.

[klaasend]

Klass, do you remember the list of young people that died?

Rob - I remember it but didn't save the list.  I think it was posted on the front page of SM, maybe by Grande.  I can check.

I don't need it, I just needed to know that you remembered it..

I have a suspicion.. wanna hear it?

Sure

[IndyDan]

I think I remember reading that TES is going back out in june...Can anyone tell me why June and not now? Just curious if there is a reason, other than them being incredibly busy, for them to wait......

I imagine it has something to do with getting everything ready.  It's a deep water search, so they have to have the ship and the equipment.

with the amount of missing people in the States, I doubt Tim is going to Aruba based on a whim... I hope he finds Natalee.

Rob,
On one of Dana’s interviews, might have even been last year, Tim said he thought Natalee’s body was in the ocean and is recoverable.  And at that time TES was about $100K short in funds to do the search.
I agree, I doubt Tim and TES are going to do a deep sea search based on a whim.  I think he knows something that’s not been made common knowledge to the general public.

Indy, This is one of those areas that we will not know until we know. I feel safe in saying that if Tim does not find Natalee it will not be for lack of effort or technology. It will only be because she is no longer recoverable or the ocean is so vast and she could have moved over the last two years.. underwater currents are pretty strong and they drive the weather patterns.

You know, trying to guess what these animals did with Natalee is disgusting and repulsive.  Just look at the options we are considering, buried under concrete, crammed in a fishtrap and dumped in the ocean, cremated.  The VanDerSloots aren’t even worthy of being called animals.  They’re just a waste of life.

[IndyDan]

If Julia RenHO is so concerned about the thousands of dollars being spent on searching for justice for Natalee and her family, I have an idea that might help,

2 Bullets – I’ll buy!

[San]

I think I remember reading that TES is going back out in june...Can anyone tell me why June and not now? Just curious if there is a reason, other than them being incredibly busy, for them to wait......

I imagine it has something to do with getting everything ready.  It's a deep water search, so they have to have the ship and the equipment.

with the amount of missing people in the States, I doubt Tim is going to Aruba based on a whim... I hope he finds Natalee.

Rob,
On one of Dana’s interviews, might have even been last year, Tim said he thought Natalee’s body was in the ocean and is recoverable.  And at that time TES was about $100K short in funds to do the search.
I agree, I doubt Tim and TES are going to do a deep sea search based on a whim.  I think he knows something that’s not been made common knowledge to the general public.

Indy, This is one of those areas that we will not know until we know. I feel safe in saying that if Tim does not find Natalee it will not be for lack of effort or technology. It will only be because she is no longer recoverable or the ocean is so vast and she could have moved over the last two years.. underwater currents are pretty strong and they drive the weather patterns.

You know, trying to guess what these animals did with Natalee is disgusting and repulsive.  Just look at the options we are considering, buried under concrete, crammed in a fishtrap and dumped in the ocean, cremated.  The VanDerSloots aren’t even worthy of being called animals.  They’re just a waste of life.

I agree Indy.

[San]

If Julia RenHO is so concerned about the thousands of dollars being spent on searching for justice for Natalee and her family, I have an idea that might help,

2 Bullets – I’ll buy!

We think too much alike.

[IndyDan]

If Julia RenHO is so concerned about the thousands of dollars being spent on searching for justice for Natalee and her family, I have an idea that might help,

2 Bullets – I’ll buy!

We think too much alike.

   Yea I know, I've said that in the past - kinda scarey isn't it  

[Nut44x4]

VMS - thanks for posting, it had not been posted here yet.

   and   .......ty 4 posting. God, ya know we all want answers.....I hope the next few weeks will give peace to family and friends and to all of us.

[Dayhiker]

It is not the Dutch law that is the problem but the way in which Aruba applies it and creates its own "policies" to suit the occasion.

If a law doesn't suit what their agenda is, they just ignore it or change it.  Example is the law on a person who disappears being considered to have been kidnapped.  Another is an adult who disappears without money or transportation, etc. qualifies as an emergency and yet they told Dave to go to a bar and she would show up.

I just must not have expressed myself well.

.

That certainly is the case in Aruba. They ignored laws and used them to the advantage of the Van der Sloots and Kalpoes consistently throughout the investigation.

The only time we have seen the winds change was in Paulus award damages being reversed. Ironically, this was after many resignations/retirements in the police department, a new infusion of judges to Aruba, and the takeover of the case by the Dutch. Let's hope this means something.

[Dayhiker]

Thought this was some good information to acquaint ourselves more with the KLPD. This is an amalgam from several sources. Didn't know the NRI produces ‘Opsporing Verzocht’.
 
The Dutch police consists of 25 regional police forces and the National Police Services Agency (KLPD).

 Each of the Netherlands' 25 police regions is headed by a regional police board, consisting of mayors and a chief public prosecutor. The KLPD is headed by the Minister of the Interior and Kingdom Relations. He is responsible (with the Minister of Justice) for the overall quality of policing in the Netherlands. He also heads each of the regional police forces 'at arm's length' - meaning that he limits his interventions in principle to what is strictly necessary. The KLPD carries out national and specialist police tasks. It collects, files, processes, manages, analyses and distributes information, and carries out other support tasks. It guards the Royal Family and other important persons. And it procures police weaponry, uniforms, and other equipment.


Korps landelijke politiediensten- KLPD
 
Provides twelve operational services, including:

National Criminal Investigation Service- The National Criminal Investigation Service (Dienst Nationale Recherche, DNR) has a staff of approximately 800 employees and a number of units located around the Netherlands. It investigates organized and other serious crime extending across regional or national boundaries. The service pays particular attention to preventive measures based on intelligence gathering, investigation and the provision of advice.

National Criminal Intelligence Service- The National Criminal Intelligence Service (Dienst Nationale Recherche Informatie, NRI) supplies criminal intelligence and expertise to the police forces. By maintaining databases containing data on crimes, criminal modes of operation and other information, the NRI helps to provide information on organized crime and serious forms of supra-regional crime. The NRI has several regional intelligence branch offices and criminal intelligence information desks which support the regional forces and core teams. The NRI develops new criminal investigation technologies and supports investigative teams by providing advice and expertise. Edison (the image storage system for firearms and forged documents) was developed by the NRI. It also specializes in fingerprint identification. Finally, the NRI is responsible for production of the weekly TV crime-watch program ‘Opsporing Verzocht’.


International Police Cooperation Service- The International Police Cooperation Service (Dienst Internationale Politiesamenwerking) is responsible for cooperation with foreign criminal investigation agencies playing a major role in tackling serious cross-border crime. It is contacted by Dutch and foreign police forces for information on foreign and Dutch investigations respectively. The service manages the Dutch branches of Interpol, Europol and the Schengen Information System (SIS); at national level, the Sirene office of the SIS; the KLPD’s liaison officers abroad and foreign liaison officers in the Netherlands.

Specialist Investigation Applications Service- The Specialist Investigation Applications Service ensures that the technological and tactical products, services and equipment used to combat organized crime are reliable and professional. For this purpose it devises innovative ways in which ultramodern technology can be used in police investigations.

[Rob]

Klass, do you remember the list of young people that died?

Rob - I remember it but didn't save the list.  I think it was posted on the front page of SM, maybe by Grande.  I can check.

I don't need it, I just needed to know that you remembered it..

I have a suspicion.. wanna hear it?

Sure

NATALEE HOLLOWAY MISSING SINCE 5-30-5-31-2005 -  AGE 18

JALITZA MARIE WEVER DIED JUNE 2, 2005 - AGE 33

EDMOND FERMIN WERLEMAN DIED JUNE 4, 2005 - AGE 35

KERWIN ANTHONY ORVILLE GOIJLA DIED JUNE 4, 2005 - AGE 17

JALITZA MARIE WEVER DIED JUNE 5 2005 AGE 33

GISELA SULAIKA LOEFSTOP DIED JUNE 15, 2005 - AGE 30

SAUL ARNOLD RAS DIED JUNE 28, 2005 - AGE 29

JASON EUGENE TIN SOENG WONG DIED JULY 10, 2005 - AGE 19

FRANCIS JAMIE NEMENCIO RASMIJN DIED JULY 20, 2005 - AGE 22

ALBERT RICHARD MARQUEZ BUSTAMANTE DIED AUGUST 25, 2005 - AGE 26

OK, there are the ones I'm suspicious of... I think there was some real bad MDMA going around and it hit a bunch of people off guard and before Aruba knew what hit it, they had a bunch of dead kids and one that didn't take it on her own.

Do you remember when I made a post about the X from Holland and Belgium? I said that stuff is sometimes lethal. I think right here is the evidence that 'something bad happened' and they know it. They even know exactly what drug was involved. This is why they were looking at Lorenzo. It has to be. His nickname is Xtacy. He has the raves, he is a known hell raiser. He has a connection to this case I believe, and a real one.

He might just be someone involved with the X trade and he supplies others... among which could be Steve Croes and / or GVC.

This is the 'something bad happened'. IMO... and Joran and the rape crew didn't have someone OD on X before...so enter Paulus and the cover-up of  the bad drugs going around and the fact they there are some dead kids and last but not least, they crimes against Natalee, which would expose a good deal of what was going on. And if you have some kids from prominent families involved, like we all suspect, it's not a stretch of the imagination to get from A to B.

[Rob]

You know, trying to guess what these animals did with Natalee is disgusting and repulsive.  Just look at the options we are considering, buried under concrete, crammed in a fishtrap and dumped in the ocean, cremated.  The VanDerSloots aren’t even worthy of being called animals.  They’re just a waste of life.

yep.

[BTgirl]

Rob - what is MDMA? I mean, I know it's a drug, but what kind?