Lively Case Discussion #612 5/2 - 5/4/2007

[San]

I believe there was a party at the Sloot home that night. This is why the neighbor came out and asked Joran to lower the music. Deepak claims that it was the following night but it wasn't. It was the night Natalee was kidnapped and there were people waiting there for her. There is a witness that saw what went on at the Sloots and that was the neighbor.

Also, we have always heard that the other neighbor was away. I sometimes think that the night Beth arrived they could have temporarily per her in their yard until they could figure out what to do. Paulus leads them away and Joran, Deepak and possibly one other moves her.


San..I really feel this is true that they were all at the VDS house after the bar. After this it's hard to make out what exactly happened. Somebody saw something that night at that house that led to the KLPD 2 day search at that residence.

Right.  Someone saw Paulus on the move.  This is why they have Natalee all over the island that night except the Sloots where the crime actually happened.  They are trying desperately to removed Paulus from what happened and it is not working.

In my opinion if there are records that the other two boys were with Anita in Holland game over.

[MuffyBee]

The mother of the sporter is preparing her book for fall publication.

  Are you kidding me?  You are kidding, right Tyler?

And if she did prepare a book, what would that be?  Fashion?  How to paint your house yellow, yellow and yellow?

[Tamikosmom]

Satish was home at 1:45?  Can you get from Joran's to Kalpoe in that approximate time.  Times are probably not going to be exact, but can this be done.  Did Deepak return to the Sloot hut at 2:00 a.m. as was reported.  Why did he return?  Did he pick up the Sporter and Natalee?  Was it at this time that Paulus entered the picture.  (Your own father?  Unbelievable).

Tylergal ... I believe that after the "something bad" happened at the VDS residence ... Natalee was taken to the Marriot Beach.  But on the way Satish was dropped off at home ... he was to establish an alibi on the computer.  Remember .... the gardener was able to identify Joran and Deepak in Deepak's parked vehicle across the street from the Marriot at 2:30 am the morning Natalee went missing ... not Satish.

Janet


Beth Twitty
CNN LARRY KING LIVE
February 23, 2006

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... Deepak panicked. He panicked when the gardener gave that testimony. That very afternoon, he called an Aruban girl to help him establish an alibi. She, in turn, panicked. She called FBI. She dialed the 1-877-NATALEE number and told them that she did not want to be involved in this.


Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
August 17, 2005

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": I don`t know what`s happening, but the gardener, the witness, did stand by his story. He did confirm in front of the judge, in front of the defense attorneys, in front of the suspects, that he recognized, and he even recognized two of the three suspects that were there. He hasn`t changed his story one bit.


Susan Candiotti
NANCY GRACE
August 15, 2005

SUSAN CANDIOTTI-How did it go? Well, according to a defense attorney, because they`re allowed to be present, someone who was there, we are told that the questioning lasted for about four hours. And it happened early today. Now, he said that he did see Joran for sure and was able to pick him out from a photo line-up, was also able to identify Deepak from a photo line- up, but not Satish Kalpoe.

[Rob]

I believe there was a party at the Sloot home that night. This is why the neighbor came out and asked Joran to lower the music. Deepak claims that it was the following night but it wasn't. It was the night Natalee was kidnapped and there were people waiting there for her. There is a witness that saw what went on at the Sloots and that was the neighbor.

Also, we have always heard that the other neighbor was away. I sometimes think that the night Beth arrived they could have temporarily per her in their yard until they could figure out what to do. Paulus leads them away and Joran, Deepak and possibly one other moves her.


San..I really feel this is true that they were all at the VDS house after the bar. After this it's hard to make out what exactly happened. Somebody saw something that night at that house that led to the KLPD 2 day search at that residence.

*******- add in the fact or lie (depends on your prospective) that Joran 'snuck out' at 11: 00 pm, he is not picked up til 12:15 12-:25 am by the Kalpoes and the other fact that the person that sat in on the Greta interview was his music teacher.....and another Buddhist.. Claudius Phillips.. brother of former SM poster 'Thaddius Mighty "T" Phillips...who also lives in the Montanja neighborhood.. you have the makings of where he was before he was picked up and persons that know there was a party at his house.

I seriously believe this is all correct.

[Observer]

The timeline is really starting to bother me. They left C&C about 1 am and one of the Kalpoe brothers (presumably DK) was on the computer by about 2:15. It is at least 15 min from C&C to any of the locations they might have gone to. That means, at best they arrived somewhere as early as 1:15 am and at least of the Kalpoe brothers (or both) had to be leaving by about 2 am. If the records are correct, that leaves only 45 min at most for the four of them being together. Joran makes his call to DK from the beach area (presumably) at 2:35, he is home by 3:20 and on the computer until about 4:20. This is a very tight timeline, it seems to me it could have all happened in those 45 minutes. It might only have been 30 minutes for all four of them together. I have a hunch the K2 brothers did go home and the 2:35 call was one saying "she won't come to, what do we do"? This is when a second group became involved.

This is just opinion of a very tight timeline. The key is the computer and cell phone records.

The timeline bothers me tremendously and I spent many hours tryin to figure it out. I decided not to waste any more time on it and focus on other aspects of the case. It just doesnt make any sense at the moment. What does make sense is that NH and Joran were at the VDS house at 1:40AM. I suppose it is possible PVDS picked up Joran and NH at 4am maybee because NH was in bad shape. We know PVDS was researching drugs and alcohol on the computer the next day.

[BTgirl]

*******- add in the fact or lie (depends on your prospective) that Joran 'snuck out' at 11: 00 pm, he is not picked up til 12:15 12-:25 am by the Kalpoes and the other fact that the person that sat in on the Greta interview was his music teacher.....and another Buddhist.. Claudius Phillips.. brother of former SM poster 'Thaddius Mighty "T" Phillips...who also lives in the Montanja neighborhood.. you have the makings of where he was before he was picked up and persons that know there was a party at his house.

I seriously believe this is all correct.

Hey - don't be bad-mouthin' Buddhists. I have a major crush on the Dalai Lama.  

[Observer]

I believe there was a party at the Sloot home that night. This is why the neighbor came out and asked Joran to lower the music. Deepak claims that it was the following night but it wasn't. It was the night Natalee was kidnapped and there were people waiting there for her. There is a witness that saw what went on at the Sloots and that was the neighbor.

Also, we have always heard that the other neighbor was away. I sometimes think that the night Beth arrived they could have temporarily per her in their yard until they could figure out what to do. Paulus leads them away and Joran, Deepak and possibly one other moves her.


San..I really feel this is true that they were all at the VDS house after the bar. After this it's hard to make out what exactly happened. Somebody saw something that night at that house that led to the KLPD 2 day search at that residence.

*******- add in the fact or lie (depends on your prospective) that Joran 'snuck out' at 11: 00 pm, he is not picked up til 12:15 12-:25 am by the Kalpoes and the other fact that the person that sat in on the Greta interview was his music teacher.....and another Buddhist.. Claudius Phillips.. brother of former SM poster 'Thaddius Mighty "T" Phillips...who also lives in the Montanja neighborhood.. you have the makings of where he was before he was picked up and persons that know there was a party at his house.

I seriously believe this is all correct.

Could be..We know freddy plays a role as well in all of this. He lives in that same neighberhood. Not sure if he was working at the time though.

[sb]

I am not 100% sure that Satish was around when Natalee went into the final stages of the ordeal. I think he left early and was at home. Whether that is before or after he was able to assault Natalee, I have no idea.

Spock is 100% CORRECT that the cellphone and Internet records are the keys to this case. They establish WHERE people are, and WHEN. I put nothing whatsoever into any of the perps' statements after all this.

IF we have an incontrovertible proof that the K2 home computer was used to send or receive at any given time that night, we can begin to (maybe) eliminate Satish from the loop. I think Deepak was at the party though.

[BTgirl]

Could be..We know freddy plays a role as well in all of this. He lives in that same neighberhood. Not sure if he was working at the time though.

Every ounce of common sense and knowledge of human character that I have tells me that Freddy is evil.

[crazybabyborg]

I admit I'm not all caught up so this thought may have holes in it, but would it have been possible for a party to be going on at Jorans, and K2 left early, went home and got on the computer? Joran called them after things "went bad" for help and to establish a story other than what really happened?

Would that fit the timeline?

[Leslie]

I'm not sure this is the right guy.  He seems really young.  Unless he snapped a pic by accident showing a plane landing in Costa Rica with Natalee on it, I'm not sure this is the person interviewed a whole year later.

Tend to agree....

I do see an Andres Meneses who is a Latin Music producer and publisher out of Chicago.  I wonder if he had any of his clients performing at the Soul Beach Festival?  Do you know if there is a list of the performers who were at that event?

I was wondering if the Andres Meneses who is a  record business bigshot - is the father of  the photographer.  It would explain how AM junior gets around.

[Observer]

Could be..We know freddy plays a role as well in all of this. He lives in that same neighberhood. Not sure if he was working at the time though.

Every ounce of common sense and knowledge of human character that I have tells me that Freddy is evil.

Out of all the people in this case..Your right about freddy...He certainly does look evil...He must be close to Deepak as well as they both were spotted at C&C after all this happened.

[Spock]

I have a hunch the K2 brothers did go home and the 2:35 call was one saying "she won't come to, what do we do"? This is when a second group became involved.

After this 2:35 call, it's likely the coverup began. I wouldn't completely trust the computer records after this time. The gardeners testimony was not found to be credible by the Judge, he did refuse to come forward on three occasions. My read is that the gardener did witness two of the boys but he was running late and misrepresented the time. He likely saw them in the car closer to 2:50 in response to jorans call to DK.  This is about the time, it is possible a second group became involved. IMO.

[Observer]

Freddy and others were already being Investigated for drugging/raping and taking pictures of girls before NH stepped foot on Aruba. Last we heard about freddy was taking nude pics nude pics of a underage girl and sec with a unconscious female. This was reported to the ALE and they did jack s***.

All we heard was Freddy spent the night at the VDS house that night and he was leaving the country. Few months later low and behold he was back at C&C with Deepak.

[Observer]

I have a hunch the K2 brothers did go home and the 2:35 call was one saying "she won't come to, what do we do"? This is when a second group became involved.

After this 2:35 call, it's likely the coverup began. I wouldn't completely trust the computer records after this time. The gardeners testimony was not found to be credible by the Judge, he did refuse to come forward on three occasions. My read is that the gardener did witness two of the boys but he was running late and misrepresented the time. He likely saw them in the car closer to 2:50 in response to jorans call to DK.  This is about the time, it is possible a second group became involved. IMO.

I'M tellin ya..Somethin is messed up in this timeline!! The VDS computer was tampered with big time!! The phone records will tell us a great deal. I beleave you are right that they were spotted closer to 3am. Dont forget about the reported phone call from NH after 3AM if you beleave that was from her.

[Tylergal]

The timeline is really starting to bother me. They left C&C about 1 am and one of the Kalpoe brothers (presumably DK) was on the computer by about 2:15. It is at least 15 min from C&C to any of the locations they might have gone to. That means, at best they arrived somewhere as early as 1:15 am and at least of the Kalpoe brothers (or both) had to be leaving by about 2 am. If the records are correct, that leaves only 45 min at most for the four of them being together. Joran makes his call to DK from the beach area (presumably) at 2:35, he is home by 3:20 and on the computer until about 4:20. This is a very tight timeline, it seems to me it could have all happened in those 45 minutes. It might only have been 30 minutes for all four of them together. I have a hunch the K2 brothers did go home and the 2:35 call was one saying "she won't come to, what do we do"? This is when a second group became involved.

This is just opinion of a very tight timeline. The key is the computer and cell phone records.

[sb]

I am thinking the second group was at VDS home along with Joran. I think the roaches scattered when the something bad happened. I am not sure if Deepak was in that grouping or not, I suspect that Satish wasn't.

I am exceedingly troubled by the fact that K2 home computer was used by someone before 3 AM. This shortens the available timeframe unless either Deepak or Satish left early.

[Rob]

You guys are very smart. For myself, I don't even believe the time-line. I think it was released to fit the computer records.

I believe its all bullshit.

The real time-line is the Holy Grail.

[Tylergal]

Satish was home at 1:45?  Can you get from Joran's to Kalpoe in that approximate time.  Times are probably not going to be exact, but can this be done.  Did Deepak return to the Sloot hut at 2:00 a.m. as was reported.  Why did he return?  Did he pick up the Sporter and Natalee?  Was it at this time that Paulus entered the picture.  (Your own father?  Unbelievable).

Tylergal ... I believe that after the "something bad" happened at the VDS residence ... Natalee was taken to the Marriot Beach.  But on the way Satish was dropped off at home ... he was to establish an alibi on the computer.  Remember .... the gardener was able to identify Joran and Deepak in Deepak's parked vehicle across the street from the Marriot at 2:30 am the morning Natalee went missing ... not Satish.

Janet


Beth Twitty
CNN LARRY KING LIVE
February 23, 2006

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: ... Deepak panicked. He panicked when the gardener gave that testimony. That very afternoon, he called an Aruban girl to help him establish an alibi. She, in turn, panicked. She called FBI. She dialed the 1-877-NATALEE number and told them that she did not want to be involved in this.


Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
August 17, 2005

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": I don`t know what`s happening, but the gardener, the witness, did stand by his story. He did confirm in front of the judge, in front of the defense attorneys, in front of the suspects, that he recognized, and he even recognized two of the three suspects that were there. He hasn`t changed his story one bit.


Susan Candiotti
NANCY GRACE
August 15, 2005

SUSAN CANDIOTTI-How did it go? Well, according to a defense attorney, because they`re allowed to be present, someone who was there, we are told that the questioning lasted for about four hours. And it happened early today. Now, he said that he did see Joran for sure and was able to pick him out from a photo line-up, was also able to identify Deepak from a photo line- up, but not Satish Kalpoe.

Yes, whatever happened, happened very quickly and one of them was at home.  You know, one may never have gone anywhere.

[San]

Could be..We know freddy plays a role as well in all of this. He lives in that same neighberhood. Not sure if he was working at the time though.

Every ounce of common sense and knowledge of human character that I have tells me that Freddy is evil.

I couldn't agree with you more BT.