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Author Topic: Lively Case Discussion #614 5/5 - 5/6/2007  (Read 139102 times)
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #820 on: May 07, 2007, 11:07:49 AM »

Quote from: "Rob"
MsMarple- I realize that there has been an attempt to straighten out the record regarding the calls.

And that is why I asked if there was any validity to them.. because I'm not even sure.

In the beginning of the case...there seems to be a record of Beth saying she was speeding to get home...I don't think I imagined that. I also recall she gave the trooper the phone to listen to it... now maybe things have changed and I do not have all the correct info. That is possible.

If there wasn't a call, how did Beth or the trooper get the info that Natalee was kidnapped? I doubt a trooper would give an escort to the state line based on nothing but someone's word. They hear every story in the book from people trying to avoid a ticket.

I obviously do not mean to bring up something that is settled or distract anyone from something else.


I don't know for certain, but I seem to remember Beth saying on television that she knew Natalee had been kidnapped.  I can't say or don't remember if she said how she was certain.  I, like you, remember it all happened during that frantic trip from Arkansas to Alabama.  IIRC she was informed that Natalee did not return to her group and had missed her flight. Beth related this story on one of the news shows.
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Easywriter
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« Reply #821 on: May 07, 2007, 11:08:23 AM »

Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Easywriter"
Did anyone ever figure out the urine sample business with the American woman?  Is there anyway to logically connect that to anything we know?


Easy this is the first I'm hearing about any of this...


There is reference to the woman in that 171 pdf file and that was the first I heard of such a thing.  I think she lived in the north east and should be in her late 30's or early 40's.  I couldn't get the connection.
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #822 on: May 07, 2007, 11:10:06 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
A quick question...where is the info that states that Joran picked up Paulus at the airport on May 29th?  Is it in one of the statements?  Having a senior moment here. TIA

I don't think it's in any statement.  I think it was something we were told in the beginning of the case, probably by Bondia  Rolling Eyes


So we can put that notion to rest also.
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Rob
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« Reply #823 on: May 07, 2007, 11:10:56 AM »

I'm sure that everyone has noticed, but there are more questions each and every day and no one on Aruba to set the record straight. I guess that is the plan.. what else could it be.

The KLPD is prolly not going to set it all completely straight.. they seem interested in physical evidence.. and if they find some, we might see an arrest or two, but they are probably not going to get into the small details of what is what unless there is a trial...

So we are left to sort out what we know and try to figure out the rest...but that is near impossible as we have more questions arising each day, and don't seem to have the answers to yesterday's questions.

Maybe it's just me, but this is one screwed up case, and it doesn't have to be this way...

There should be someone who has all the facts and presents them as known facts...
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #824 on: May 07, 2007, 11:11:29 AM »

The urine sample reference can mean only one thing...they were checking for drugs.  Was this person in Aruba at the same time?  How did I miss this?   Rolling Eyes
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Rob
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« Reply #825 on: May 07, 2007, 11:12:49 AM »

Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
Quote from: "Rob"
MsMarple- I realize that there has been an attempt to straighten out the record regarding the calls.

And that is why I asked if there was any validity to them.. because I'm not even sure.

In the beginning of the case...there seems to be a record of Beth saying she was speeding to get home...I don't think I imagined that. I also recall she gave the trooper the phone to listen to it... now maybe things have changed and I do not have all the correct info. That is possible.

If there wasn't a call, how did Beth or the trooper get the info that Natalee was kidnapped? I doubt a trooper would give an escort to the state line based on nothing but someone's word. They hear every story in the book from people trying to avoid a ticket.

I obviously do not mean to bring up something that is settled or distract anyone from something else.


I don't know for certain, but I seem to remember Beth saying on television that she knew Natalee had been kidnapped.  I can't say or don't remember if she said how she was certain.  I, like you, remember it all happened during that frantic trip from Arkansas to Alabama.  IIRC she was informed that Natalee did not return to her group and had missed her flight. Beth related this story on one of the news shows.


yep, LaLa's.. that's how I remember it also.
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« Reply #826 on: May 07, 2007, 11:13:57 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Easywriter"
Did anyone ever figure out the urine sample business with the American woman?  Is there anyway to logically connect that to anything we know?


Easy this is the first I'm hearing about any of this...


In the Dr. Phil motion to compel there is a woman by the name of Haley Segona:





Sorry Rob, I now see that was Easywriter's question - working/lurking = faulty speed reading Rolling Eyes

Easywriter - the only thought I would have on this urine test would be to check for date rape drugs. Maybe she was at C&C's that night and was given a drink by joran, but who knows.

Ado
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Rob
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« Reply #827 on: May 07, 2007, 11:14:35 AM »

Thanks you Klaas, could she have been drugged?
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« Reply #828 on: May 07, 2007, 11:15:08 AM »

Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
The urine sample reference can mean only one thing...they were checking for drugs.  Was this person in Aruba at the same time?  How did I miss this?   Rolling Eyes


Lala's, I have no idea.  I suppose she must have been.  Seems to me though people have checked and she's not Natalee's age.  Maybe she was one of the Chaperones?  I really don't know.
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #829 on: May 07, 2007, 11:15:11 AM »

Another question...exactly what ages were Joran's two brothers in May 2005?
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Easywriter
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« Reply #830 on: May 07, 2007, 11:15:18 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Rob"
Quote from: "Easywriter"
Did anyone ever figure out the urine sample business with the American woman?  Is there anyway to logically connect that to anything we know?


Easy this is the first I'm hearing about any of this...


In the Dr. Phil motion to compel there is a woman by the name of Haley Segona:





It looks like she was questioned one day and sent for the urine test the next.  This happened a year later, so maybe she was a tourist that thought she had been drugged while in Aruba.  How long do those type drugs show up in the system?
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klaasend
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« Reply #831 on: May 07, 2007, 11:16:02 AM »

Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
Another question...exactly what ages were Joran's two brothers in May 2005?


11/12 and 14/15 I think.  Val was definately at the pimp in training age.
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #832 on: May 07, 2007, 11:16:23 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
The urine sample reference can mean only one thing...they were checking for drugs.  Was this person in Aruba at the same time?  How did I miss this?   Rolling Eyes


Lala's, I have no idea.  I suppose she must have been.  Seems to me though people have checked and she's not Natalee's age.  Maybe she was one of the Chaperones?  I really don't know.


She lived in New York?  I don't think she was a chaperone.
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adoronron
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« Reply #833 on: May 07, 2007, 11:16:24 AM »

Quote from: "Lala'sMom"
The urine sample reference can mean only one thing...they were checking for drugs.  Was this person in Aruba at the same time?  How did I miss this?   Rolling Eyes


Lalas,
I wasn't quick enough, But, at least so far the theory of checking for drugs is winning. Cool

Ado
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klaasend
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« Reply #834 on: May 07, 2007, 11:17:00 AM »

EASY - a year later?
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Easywriter
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« Reply #835 on: May 07, 2007, 11:17:07 AM »

I see that her test was indeed taken in June 2005.  Very interesting.....
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Easywriter
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« Reply #836 on: May 07, 2007, 11:18:49 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
EASY - a year later?


I was wrong.  I first thought it said 06/06/06, but now I see it was in 2005 only days after Natalee disappeared.
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #837 on: May 07, 2007, 11:18:55 AM »

Date rape drugs are quickly metabolized in the body...traces in urine would only be found within a few hours after ingestion.   That is why it's such a good choice for said purpose.  Now, I am not sure about other drugs.  My question would be what is the comparison being made with should any be found?  Anyone get my drift?
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msmarple
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« Reply #838 on: May 07, 2007, 11:22:29 AM »

Rob - I'll see if I can find what Beth said about the call she received that Monday, and whether she said anything about the trooper.

Matt reached Beth on her cell phone; that is how she heard.

For the trooper, Beth probably retrieved the home voice mail box. That is what I *think* I remember. (The chaperone likely called more than one number, but I don't think was able to reach anyone directly.)

klaas - did we post the Q&A session from that meeting? It was on BFN? (I can't access BFN from work.)

I am not trying to suggest that I *know* all about this telephone business, but it was something that I had watched for carefully from the beginning, and I asked several questions about it at that meeting -  including the phrases "I don't know these people" and "Are you calling home?" At the meeting, that is when Beth reminded us of her occupation (speech therapist) and that she is trained to recognize human vocalization attempts ...

No one seems to know how those phrases got into this case ...

There were several possibilities re. calls, but none of them panned out at all.
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2NJSons_Mom
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« Reply #839 on: May 07, 2007, 11:25:18 AM »

Could this Hayley Sagona be the woman who posted that she and her husband or companion were drugged and brought to some remote location while in Aruba?  

As was mentioned, the only Hayley that comes up in search in NY was born 1968.
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