Madeleine McCann Missing-Praia Da Luz, Portugal 3/05/07 #1

[robots]

Realistically, it is not as though the McCanns had dinner, went home and then didn't report their daughter missing until the next morning. I just don't think it likely they hid her
body and yet still called the police right away. I think if this had been the case, PLE would have focused on the parents from the start. JMO

the child may have been taken by the parents BEFORE they went to dinner

perhaps 

[MuffyBee]

Missing Girl's Parents Named Suspects
snipped
Under Portuguese law, formal suspects gain certain legal protections, but police also have more latitude to question them. Police also have to show suspects any evidence against them.

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/09/07/ap4095407.html

I think this is interesting.

[BlueKYGirl]

Realistically, it is not as though the McCanns had dinner, went home and then didn't report their daughter missing until the next morning. I just don't think it likely they hid her
body and yet still called the police right away. I think if this had been the case, PLE would have focused on the parents from the start. JMO

That's true, but what if everything happened before dinner? And then there's the matter of the friend who left for a period of time during dinner to check on his sick daughter.

I don't want it to be true; I'm just saying there are reasons to be suspicious.

[Tamikosmom]

Two things from Jack B:  One: Look into the child's eyes.  I do not see happiness.

No. Two:  Would you leave a 100 carat diamond exposed alone in a room on a bed?  I would not.   The child is more valuable.  I cannot get past the parents.  Never could.  Jack b.       

Jack ... I am not qualified to comment on #1 but ... I do not perceived from photos that Maddie was abused.

However ... I agree with you on #2.

My daughter has four children between the ages of 4 and 9 and ... as overwhelmed as she becomes sometimes ... each one of those kids are never beyond earshot of Mom, Dad or a responsible adult.

The McCann's precious children were 100 yards away from their parents.  Tonight Nancy Grace defined that distance as the size of one large football field.  I find this so difficult to comprehend ... those precious little babes were left unprotected ... were left defenseless in the face of unforeseen dangers.

In Canada ... it is illegal to leave a child in a vehicle for any length of time ... even to run in and out of a store.

This action was planned by the McCanns on the night Maddie disappearance and ... they admitted they had done the same thing on previous evenings at the resort.  In other words ... it was not a spur of the moment indiscretion.

Enough said.

Janet

[jackb]

Two things from Jack B:  One: Look into the child's eyes.  I do not see happiness.

No. Two:  Would you leave a 100 carat diamond exposed alone in a room on a bed?  I would not.   The child is more valuable.  I cannot get past the parents.  Never could.  Jack b.       

I do not know you. I will say this... people who go on vacations seem to think that nothing bad will happen to them and they do all kinds of stupid stuff. For some reason they are lulled into a false sense of security.

We have seen reports of all of the stupid things that you can mention in a lifetime posted here on SM. If your goal is to bring up the McCann's neglect you made your point...

next item please!

Who are you to critique my work?   Who are you to say to anyone:  Next point to anyone.  I made a point for whatever reason I made it and my point was not to be put down by you.          jackb

I didn't know you were known for your work... where might I read it when I have time ????

Then, I guess you was not invited.        jack b

[mrs. red]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

[BlueKYGirl]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

[mrs. red]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

right... but anything is possible...

[robots]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

a bunch of priests, if they had the chance probably would have lied their TAILS off
to the Pope

if you know what i mean

[Angiex911dsptchr]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

a bunch of priests, if they had the chance probably would have lied their TAILS off
to the Pope

if you know what i mean

  Oh,, I know what you mean.. SAD to say...   

 Rob,, TY for being so ON TOP of this case too.. What would we all do without you?   

[robots]

Well I think they went too high profile for it to be them...

I mean THE POPE??? Coming here in the US???

I know--the Pope thing makes me believe them. Who's going to lie to the Pope?

a bunch of priests, if they had the chance probably would have lied their TAILS off
to the Pope

if you know what i mean

  Oh,, I know what you mean.. SAD to say...   

 Rob,, TY for being so ON TOP of this case too.. What would we all do without you?   

 

[Anna]

I just got home a bit ago and was hoping someone had an update.  Was this story covered on Greta tonight and if so does anybody know what was said?

[Anna]

Several links from this article:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20070907/McCann_mother_070907/20070907?hub=CTVNewsAt11

Nothing much new, however, that I see.  So is it not illegal to leave children under the age of 12 unattended?  Here that might well result in the younger children being removed from the home.

[yapperz1]

I do not know what the polis in Spain have on the parents, if anything.
I feel a child predator would take only one child. Lots easier to get away with one versus 3 or 4.
In Europe, people leave their babies in a carriage on the sidewalk while they dine or have a drink. I don't think we can judge the parents for the lifestyle they have always known.
I agree the parents need to be questioned. BUT To me this reeks of Aruba. If Beth or Dave had been in Aruba when Natalee went missing they would be in the same boat. We have seen where they tried to blame the Mountainbrook students for Natalee's disappearance/demise.
IMO these parents are being railroaded due to the negligence of the Spain ALE. I will maintain this opinion until I see further proof the Spain ALE are not on a fishing expedition.

[Anna]

Greta was a re-run?  The nerve of that woman when there is news, she does a re-run?

[vms]

The three crucial hours before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing
By NEIL SEARS

The three hours before Madeleine was reported missing at 10pm
on May 3 are now at the heart of the police inquiry.


Kate and Gerry McCann have never publicly revealed their exact
movements over that evening, saying this is barred by Portugal's
strict laws of judicial secrecy.


For the same reason, the Portuguese police have disclosed virtually
nothing about their understanding of what happened - whereas British
detectives would probably have publicised any details likely to encourage
witnesses to come forward.


But based on reports and statements from other parties, it is possible to say
with some accuracy what seems to have happened in those fateful hours before
Madeleine went missing.

Doctors Gerry and Kate McCann were nearing the end of their Mark Warner holiday
in Praia da Luz.


As had become their custom, they had put their three children to bed in their flat at
7pm before going to a nearby tapas bar half an hour later.

They did not use a listening device to monitor their twins Sean and Amelie, two, and
Madeleine, three.


But as they were sitting no more than 70 yards from the rear door of their ground-floor
flat, they felt confident that their established childcare arrangements were sufficient.


With them at dinner were the seven friends from England who had gone on holiday with
them. Three of them are also doctors and one is a top medical research fellow.


Each couple were responsible for checking their own children, but other members of the
group occasionally took turns to check all the children were sleeping soundly.


It is unclear what happened between 7.30pm and and 9pm, but Mr McCann has said
that he went on a checking trip at 9.05pm - and noticed a door which he thought had
been left shut in the flat was ajar.


He thought nothing of it, however, as his children were fast asleep.


Another member of the group, Jane Tanner, took a turn around ten minutes later.
She has told police that as she returned to the bar she saw a dark-haired man aged
around 35 carrying a child. Again, she thought nothing of it.


Then, at 9.45pm, Dr Matthew Oldfield went on a checking trip.


It has been speculated some of the checks did not involve the group actually
seeing the sleeping children, but that they simply listened from outside.


There have been claims that Dr Oldfield either simply listened at the McCann
children's bedroom door or that he looked into the room and believed he saw
Madeleine there.

According to the latter claim, he is also said to have reported that light was coming
in as if the shutters had been opened.


Finally, at 10pm Mrs McCann went to check - and within seconds had emerged
screaming that her daughter had gone.


She is understood to have been certain that Madeleine had been taken, rather than
that she had wandered off, or hidden, because her favourite soft toy, Cuddle Cat,
which had been with her in bed, had been placed on a high ledge.


That is as close to the McCann group's statements to the police as it is possible to get.


And it is clear that by this account there are a number of windows of opportunity in
which Madeleine could have been whisked away - either by an abductor, or, according
to the theory Portuguese police are seemingly exploring, by her own family after a
terrible accident.


It has already been suggested that other statements have clashed with the accounts
of the McCanns and their friends.


One tapas bar worker suggested that only one man in the group left their table all evening.
And a teacher who went to chat with the McCanns that night claimed that no one left the
table between 9.30 and 10pm.


A further detail from the evening is that the McCanns' friend Dr Russell O'Brien, 36, is
understood to have left the table at some time after 9pm, to attend to his own ill daughter.


It has been widely assumed the McCanns had either been stalked by a kidnapper who observed
their behaviour and knew when to strike, or that a chance attacker saw an opportunity and seized it.


But the Portuguese police now evidently believe that clarifying exactly what happened in the
hours before Madeleine disappeared could offer a startlingly different solution.

Link

[festa]

vms, excellent article - a lot of info I was not aware of - after reading this, here are the thoughts I come away with, Initially I questioned the McCanns' judgement in leaving Madeleine and the twins alone no matter how far they were and how often they checked, especially given they are both physicians, NOW to learn that many people they were dining with were physicians ALSO leaving their children alone is even more disturbing, AND that one's child was also ill that evening, HUH? IDK, what they were thinking, but regardless - I have a hard time believing they harmed, before the thought that perhaps it was an accident was possible, but now - now it seems you have to involve all these people in a conspiracy to cover up - I just don't see at this time, with this info, how they could have taken Maddie and disposed of her body and went back to dinner - does not make sense, they were not alone - and there is no reason for these people to lie and jeopardize their careers and lives - IF there were an accident, someone in that group must have wanted to do the right thing and notify the police - not create a huge conspiracy amongst all of them - AND the accidental overdose with splatters of blood does not make sense - neither does finding blood in a car they rented 25 days after the disappearance - The fact that they went after the mother first suggests (to me at least) that they were hoping to break her, perhaps they felt the female would give into extreme questioning and confess (even if she was not guilty) and they could close this case and have the world stop breathing down their backs...

[San]

I do not know what the polis in Spain have on the parents, if anything.
I feel a child predator would take only one child. Lots easier to get away with one versus 3 or 4.
In Europe, people leave their babies in a carriage on the sidewalk while they dine or have a drink. I don't think we can judge the parents for the lifestyle they have always known.
I agree the parents need to be questioned. BUT To me this reeks of Aruba. If Beth or Dave had been in Aruba when Natalee went missing they would be in the same boat. We have seen where they tried to blame the Mountainbrook students for Natalee's disappearance/demise.
IMO these parents are being railroaded due to the negligence of the Spain ALE. I will maintain this opinion until I see further proof the Spain ALE are not on a fishing expedition.

Yap I agree with everything you said.  I too will wait and see what happens.  I will not pass judgement on these parents.

[Tamikosmom]

The three crucial hours before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing
By NEIL SEARS

<snipped>


Another member of the group, Jane Tanner, took a turn around ten minutes later.  She has told police that as she returned to the bar she saw a dark-haired man aged around 35 carrying a child. Again, she thought nothing of it.

<snipped>

A further detail from the evening is that the McCanns' friend Dr Russell O'Brien, 36, is understood to have left the table at some time after 9pm, to attend to his own ill daughter.

<snipped>

Link

The Jane Tanner and Russell O'Brien connection is very interesting ...

Janet

++++++++++++++++++++

Madeleine McCann's parents told not to leave
By Richard Edwards in Praia da Luz
Last Updated: 3:10am BST 24/08/2007

<snipped>

Dr O’Brien was dining with the McCanns on the night Madeleine disappeared and spent part of the evening away from the table looking after his own daughter, who was sick. It is understood he shared duties with his partner Jane Tanner ...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmaddy221.xml

[robots]

it seems like that LAST time anyone saw the girl was at 2 30 in the afternoon


at least that is what i read somewhere.... there is a picture of her by the pool

but even that is in doubt

hmmmmmmmm.....  something aint right